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July 18, 2025 - Jim Bakker Show
28:22
The Jim Bakker Show with Rick Joyner Part 2
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Understanding Spiritual Growth 00:13:39
Welcome to the Jim Baker Family Show.
Today, our special guest is the founder of Morningstar Ministries, Rick Joyner.
Our co-host today is Reverend Mondo de la Vega.
And now, here is your host, Pastor Ricky Baker.
Hello, welcome to the PTL Television Network.
Welcome back.
We want to say to our special guest, Rick, Joyner, as he returns to explore how to tune our hearts to God and growing in the prophetic and growing in hearing the Lord.
Obviously, Mondo, and growing in the spiritual gifts, but also in being able to grow the fruit of the spirit.
Because outside of the vine, outside of being in a relationship with God, we cannot grow the fruit of the spirit.
We must abide in the vine.
Pastor Jim Baker preached a message at Morningstar many years ago.
What year was that, Mondo?
Probably early 2000s at least, where he talks about abiding in the vine.
And that is what we need to do during this time period.
I know Rick has really forwarded and pioneered an incredible school of ministry where they teach people to abide in the vine, then go out and show the world what it's like to be a true Christian.
I attended that school and Rick, thank you for allowing me to attend the school.
You provided the means for me to be part of the school.
And I always say, Rick, why did you do that?
Why did you invest in me when you hardly even knew me, yet you believed in me?
How's the school doing?
School's doing great.
I think it's really doing better than ever.
And I don't just say that.
I don't want to lie about things like that.
It really is.
I think our head of the school now is Michael Fickus, a very prophetic person, very disciplined.
He's also a veteran, served in Iraq, and he has that discipline, which is hard to get.
You know, if you haven't been in the military, there's some things you can learn in the military.
There's very few other places other than maybe professional sports that you can get that kind of training and discipline.
But no, that school's doing good.
We started about four years ago, what was called School of the Prophets, where people come in on Thursday and stay through Saturday.
Some of them stay through Sunday on one weekend a month.
It's an intense course on the prophetic, the prophetic gifts, hearing God.
And that thing has just gone up a level every single year.
But this coming year, I think we're going to jump several levels.
The Lord's given us a strategy for making that just much more.
But there's a binding that that whole class becomes a community.
They build teams.
They do stuff together in prophetic teams and all.
But it's one of my favorite things to do.
But I'm very excited about where we're going next year.
And it's an online school too.
If you can't make it and come there, you can go to it online.
And all the information is on our website for people.
But yeah, I'm very excited about that.
And that's one thing I was thinking in our little break here.
What are some other things that we can do to hear his voice better, to know his voice?
And one thing, we've got to first know who we are.
Now, I do believe one of the most Overemphasized and distracting teachings in the body of Christ is an overemphasis of who we are in him rather than who he is in us.
And he said that to me years ago, and I think it's still true, but we do need to know who we are.
We need to know who we are, especially as the new creation that we're called to be.
We're called to be far more spiritual than we are natural.
Our default, you know, is not the natural, it's to be spiritual and to be at home in the spirit.
I believe more at home in the spiritual realm, more at home with the supernatural than we are in the natural realm with things going on here.
Somebody's going to walk in that.
I believe a whole company is going to walk in that.
And that is the reason we do these schools and everything else we're doing.
We're trying to help prepare a generation that we believe is going to be on the earth at the end of this age that's going to be like no other that's ever been.
It's going to be a supernatural people.
And we're going to understand what it really means to be a new creation and to be more spiritual than physical.
Someone, one of the ancients said, we're not called to be natural people that have occasional supernatural experiences.
We're called to be supernatural people that have occasional natural experiences.
Yeah, we have to eat hamburgers every now and then.
Some we got to take care of ourselves or physically and all.
But how much better off would we be if we just spent more time cleaning up our inner person than we did our outer person?
And I'm, I mean, it's a good thing to stay clean and et cetera.
But I mean, what if we, you know, all the time we spend building up this body that is going to pass away?
Now, that's a good thing.
You know, we're told in scripture, bodily exercise does profit.
There is profit in it, but not nearly as much as spiritual exercise.
This focus on our spiritual self, who we are in our inner man.
And are we feeding that the healthy food that we should be?
Are we filling it full of junk food?
I'm just saying.
So these are things I think just to understand that we are a new creation.
When we get that as a revelation, it's really transforming, but it's even more transforming when we start to walk in it.
Amen.
So with that being said, what spiritual disciplines can help the everyday believer to discern God's voice?
Because I believe to accomplish any of that, you need to be able to hear the voice of God.
Yeah.
Well, first, you know, I shared in our last program, you know, it's learned to wait upon him, learn to be patient.
When he showed me that impatience was my worst flaw, he showed me how much I had missed him, how much I'd missed having divine encounters with people or with even angels or him, because I'd been so impatient at times.
How many times I had missed seeing major miracles or receiving major revelation because I was headstrong wanting to go and do something, whatever, but I wasn't, you know, listening for him.
But I think maybe all that 40 years of Moses in the wilderness was just to deal with some stuff in him so that when the Lord appeared in that burning bush, he would have the patience and the ability to just turn aside from his normal life and go see this thing.
And I've heard speculation that if he had not turned aside, he would not have received that calling.
I honestly think that is possible.
I think many people, I know, they get words from the Lord.
They don't do anything about them.
They get words about their calling and do nothing.
You know, Paul, when he knew he was called as an apostle, he made his calling and election sure.
He went out and spent years in the wilderness, as he said.
I mean, just an incredible amount of time seeking the Lord and understanding his message and his purpose.
Almost nobody does that today, and they go run around, get one word after another.
They never have done anything with the first words they got.
And we do think, we do tend to think, well, if it's God, he'll make it happen.
That's true if we'll do our part.
You know, the Holy Spirit is called the helper, not the doer.
He won't do his part until we do ours.
And I believe that's biblical too.
But how many of us are really making our calling and election sure?
Some of that exercise would be study, study of the scriptures.
With me, it was to devote a large amount of time studying history and other things.
He said, I would need to know, and they've come in really handy lately.
And then there's prayer, you know, and there are other just basic Christian disciplines like witnessing, fellowship, not forsaking the gathering of ourselves together with God's body, his people, finding your place in his body and functioning there.
All these things are basic, but we want to jump over them.
You know, every major discipline in the world or every major position in the world, the most successful at those are those who do the basics best.
And the basics for us are prayer, study, the scriptures, loving one another.
And you know what that means?
It means when you get in church, you don't quit on that church.
When you get in church and you get hurt, you don't quit on it for anything.
Love never quits.
You know, that's how it should have been translated in 1 Corinthians 13:8, where it says love never fails.
That same thing could have been translated, love never quits.
I'm not going to quit on the body of Christ.
Everybody gets hurt in church.
It's got people in it.
People hurt each other.
They do clumsy things.
They step on your toes all the time.
And I do that to people.
Everybody does.
But you don't want to quit on these things, but that's something we can't forsake.
We have to do.
And most of what we need to know the Lord and to grow in who we're called to be, the ministries he's given us and the gifts and all he's given us, is going to be found in a local body.
You can't get it any other way.
That is so basic.
You know, we're told in 1 John 1:7, if we abide in the light as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus will cleanse us from all sin.
Well, that word fellowship is the Greek word kina nia.
In the south, we pronounce it koinonia, but it's where it's a fellowship or a bonding together that eclipses anything you, any bonding you could even have in your natural family.
That's how close we're supposed to be to a body of believers.
And you know, any body of believers that ever gets close to that is going to go through a lot of forgiving each other, repenting.
You know, who does he seek to be his habitation?
We're told in Isaiah 66, the humble and the contrite.
And, you know, he gives his grace to the humble.
He resists the proud.
But all of these are just basics that we should be doing.
And if we're not doing them, don't expect him to give us the really good stuff.
The Importance of Basics 00:14:16
He can't trust us with it.
And the best golfers in the world today are practicing their grip, their stance, basic things about a golf swing.
People in every sport and in every discipline, the ones who do the basics best, are the most successful in every field.
And until you've got the basics down and are practicing them continually, you can't try the really tough shots.
You can't do that.
You can't do the things that we see as the really remarkable plays and all.
These are the ones who have spent years and years practicing.
And, you know, I wish I could go on about that, but I'd take up the whole program.
But I think these are where most people are missing and why they're not hearing from God.
Wow.
This is so good.
And I hope you can go back and rewatch this program to listen to just that advice because you're so right on.
Help us understand what red flags should people watch for when evaluating prophetic voices or messages.
Well, when you mature and knowing his voice, it's, you know, it's like I couldn't describe to you my wife's voice.
I might say she's a tenor or something like that, but I could be, I could explain her voice to you in perfect scientific terms and be absolutely accurate.
That doesn't mean you would ever recognize her voice if you heard her.
But if you heard her and you knew her, because you've heard her, that's how you're going to discern her voice.
And I read many books, you know, on hearing the voice of God, knowing the voice of God.
To me, most of them miss the most important thing.
You got to just be with the Lord.
If you're with the Lord and He will start speaking to you, his name is the Word.
He is the Word of God.
He communicates.
That's what he does.
And, you know, we're supposed to be his bride.
Isn't the quality of any relationship determined by the quality of the communication?
And, you know, I know people that believe he doesn't speak anymore because he gave us the Bible.
That's bizarre to me.
How would you like to be the bride?
And on your wedding day, your bridegroom comes up to you and say, darling, I wrote this book for you so I would never have to speak to you again.
And what kind of marriage would that be?
And so, you know, but we do have to do our part.
You know, why should he speak?
I remember one time I used to dream of so many prophetic dreams, and then I quit having them all of a sudden.
And I went for about a year with none, none whatsoever.
And I finally, I inquired of the Lord.
I said, Lord, why do I not get any more prophetic dreams?
He said, well, you weren't doing anything with the ones I gave you.
You didn't even write them down or remember them.
That's when I got a journal and I said, anytime I get something from the Lord, I'm going to write it down.
I'm going to keep it.
I'm going to review it.
If it's any instructions for me, I'm going to, you know, set up something where I can measure how I'm accomplishing it, how I'm doing what he has said to do.
Because otherwise, why should he speak to us?
Then, you know, he's given us all this that we've done nothing to.
That brings judgment.
So I'm just saying, maybe he's not speaking to you because he doesn't want to make it worse for you in the judgment when you did not do what he told you to do and you didn't even listen to it or care enough to write it down and remember it.
That's deep.
That's incredible.
We were just talking about that.
Wow.
Maybe he doesn't speak to you because he doesn't want to make it worse for you in the judgment because we have not done what he already has told us to do.
That right there, I mean, that should be a reality shocker for a lot of people.
The Lord has told you to do something and you have not done it.
It's funny that we continue to pray for more things to do.
I look back at the last three months.
The Lord spoke to me to act on what he already spoke on.
And I said, yes, Lord.
All of a sudden, one door opened.
And I'm talking about the Mando show.
Now, you have to understand, I've always been scared to step out because I don't want to offend people.
I don't want to make people feel like, you know, you're leaving.
All these fears.
But when the Lord spoke to me to get ready to expand the program, I didn't know how he was going to do it.
I'm just giving you a practical thing.
I'm not talking about super spiritual because then I'll lose you.
I'm talking about practical things that when God speaks to you, can he trust you?
And I heard the Lord and the Lord provided two open doors that I'm stepping into.
I'm scared.
I'm afraid, but I'm also confident to know that I said yes to the Lord because then if he can trust you in the small things, watch what he will do with the big things.
And I'm telling you, a lot of you want God to give you this amazing prophetic word so you can become the prophet of the hour.
But yet when God speaks to you to go and forgive your neighbor, you don't do it.
That simple.
So, how can God give you and entrust you with something big when it's in the small things that he's testing you and you're not stepping into what God has already spoken into?
This is a powerful word for you today.
Listen to it, write it down, make it plain.
So, when others read it, that's straight out of the book, the book of Habakkuk.
Ricky, this is enlightening to know that when you want more from God, God also does expect more from you.
That's right.
You know, there's a phrase I heard a lot in the military.
I transferred it over to my Christian walk, but it was obedience is a muscle that must be exercised.
As much as they attributed our strength to the physical exercise and the training and the rigorous practice of parachuting into a hot zone landing, making sure we can move 12 miles after we've jumped out of a plane, all that stuff would boil back down to the basics.
Like Rick was saying, is obedience is a muscle that must be exercised.
There'd be times and moments in that walk, Wanda, where we know we have, you know, 12 miles to go and they'd say, okay, now stop here and set up an entire base of operation.
So we'd have to stop and we'd have to set the entire thing up.
They say, no, tear it down and continue to walk again.
And they do it over and over.
Now, actually go back a mile back.
Somebody, we think somebody left something.
We'll do it over and over and realize, you know, this 12-mile walk turned into a 25-mile walk.
And we get to the end of it and we say, why in the world do we have to do that?
As a lower enlisted soldier, we'd all be grumbling, saying, why in the world did they do that?
We realized it wasn't because they didn't think we were capable.
They knew we were capable.
That's why they kept giving us tasks.
They were seeing if we would obey the simple instruction.
Wow.
And it was a muscle that must be exercised.
In our Christian walk, it's the same way, friends.
The Lord has the Holy Spirit speaking to you every day, whether it's talking to an individual about Christ, whether it's sharing your testimony, whether it's not saying something on Facebook, whether it's saying something on Facebook.
Obedience is a muscle that must be exercised.
What do they say, Mondo?
What's the old phrase?
Use it or lose it?
Yeah.
I'm telling you, Rick pinpointed it perfectly.
I want to say thank you for that, for being so candid and for also just speaking the truth.
So I have a question for you then.
How can a small groups maybe or believers begin operating in prophetic words and operating in the prophetic gifts?
Obviously, we know you need the fruit of the spirit first.
It makes no sense to have the gifts of the spirit.
So after they've developed their gifts of the spirit, how can one begin to operate in the, or after they have their fruit to the spirit, excuse me, how can one begin to operate in the gifts of the spirit?
Well, what we did, and I felt like we did it under the instruction of the Lord, was I think we may have started the very first school of the spirit.
And I know many call their schools that now, but I don't know of any at that time.
But we started it.
I said, Lord, how do we do this?
What are the first steps?
He said, I want you to provide a place where people can come and make mistakes and not be condemned, but be encouraged and learn.
I said, well, okay.
He gave us the scripture, you know, in Proverbs about where there's no ox in the stall.
The stall is clean.
And if you're going to have strength of an ox, you better get a big shovel.
And so we knew it was going to be messy.
And it was.
And I mean, some of those meetings, the first ones, it was just comical.
And, but the ones who made the biggest mistakes, public mistakes, would call out somebody by their name and it wasn't their name or whatever.
You know, when that happened, it would jolt them.
I didn't get it right.
I missed it.
And many of them were too embarrassed to try again.
I don't think they're walking anything right now.
But the ones who just accepted the embarrassment, God gives his grace to the humble.
So I'm going to use every embarrassment to humble myself.
And when they just kept going, even though they had looked silly, they were the ones within weeks, it seemed, they were walking in something extraordinary.
Still incredible words of knowledge.
But, you know, we would have things and we would learn.
I remember one guy, one friend of mine, I think you know him, Mondo, but I won't embarrass him by using his name here.
But he called out someone.
He said, sir, you're going through a lot of troubles and all this stuff's happening to you and everything.
And I could tell the guy's thinking, none, I really saw, is that word accurate to you?
And he goes, no, I'm doing good.
And I just said, well, I asked to the guy who gave the word, I said, what did you see?
He said, I saw rain coming down on him.
And I just said, sir, are you a teacher?
He said, yes, I'm a teacher.
Because, you know, Moses said in Deuteronomy 32, 2, let my teaching fall upon you as the rain.
And then everybody saw it.
You know, the person had seen accurately, but he had interpreted it wrong.
And that's where the breakdown comes usually.
It's in the interpretation.
But it had really encouraged him that he had seen accurately.
And it gave him a little more humility to not be so confident in his interpretations, maybe.
But anyway, I saw this dramatically happen when John Wember asked me to do this meeting on the prophetic in one of his conferences.
Big conference, thousands of people were there.
And one friend I wanted to use in that was, he had just been a year, a few years before, named the NFL's strongest man.
He was a monster of a guy.
He was a lineman for, I think, the New York Giants.
But he was kind of wild.
He would get prepared for meetings like he used to get prepared for games.
He'd go beat his head up against the lockers to get ready for a game, to get ready for a meeting, he'd go find bookshelves to beat his head.
And he would just, God's going to do miracles and all this stuff.
And Wimber was shocked when he heard I was going to use him in my session.
And then he said, well, go ahead.
You'll just make me look better.
And so I did.
And I asked Ricky Skaggs.
You guys know Ricky.
And Ricky was just starting to move and already getting amazing words of knowledge.
And, well, Ricky got there and started calling out people by their name.
And none of the names were right.
And finally, I said, Ricky, just forget getting names.
Just give them the rest of the word you got.
And the rest of the word was right on target.
And so I told both of them, let's don't do names.
Let's just give words and say, I see this for you.
Point the person out.
And, well, the guy, the big, strong NFL player, he decides he's going to get a name.
And it was a name I think only God could really pronounce right.
Would Love To Have You Back 00:00:55
It was so long.
So, guys, you can't get a David or John, and you're calling out names like this, and then a guy comes up, shows his driver's license, and it's that name.
Hey man, we need to come back and do a couple more hours with Pastor Rick Joyner.
We would love to have you back here.
You know, as time permits, I know you're a busy man, but we'd love to see you here in person in our studios again.
We love having you via Zoom, though.
So, thank you for taking the time to be here.
Friends, if you've watched this today, go back and watch the first episode that we filmed with Pastor Rick Joyner, and I promise you, it will bless your life.
Call that number today.
It's 1-888-988-1-588 and help us continue to spread the gospel of Jesus Christ, the way, the truth, and the life around the world.
I want to say thank you, Pastor Rick Joyner, and thank you for watching today's program.
Remember this: God loves you.
He really does.
Bye-bye for today.
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