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Aug. 5, 2022 - Timcast IRL - Tim Pool
02:04:22
Timcast IRL - Lawyers Asks Jury To DESTROY Alex Jones Company, Jones Ordered To Pay 45M w/Tucker Max
Participants
Main voices
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hannah claire brimelow
07:50
i
ian crossland
10:41
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tim pool
55:25
t
tucker max
46:46
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Speaker Time Text
unidentified
you you
tim pool
the jury in the Alex Jones defamation monetary damages hearing has awarded the
families $45 million.
Now, my understanding, we've got a couple articles, there's punitive damages that they're capped at two times the damages plus $750,000, which means Alex Jones with compensatory damages is on the hook for about $13 million.
I don't know how much that's going to impact him.
He says that's devastating, but the crazy thing about the story is that the lawyer asked the jury to destroy InfoWars.
That's what he said.
He said, destroy his platform, and I'm paraphrasing by the way, destroy his platform and make sure he cannot rebuild it.
Considering the rare circumstance where a default ruling was presented, Jones never had a jury trial, the right to defend himself, a lot of people are saying this is The whole thing was just an attempt to destroy Infowars because, well, Alex Jones backed Trump, uses his platform to call out things like Epstein, and, uh, well, that's what they're saying it's about.
I think it's fair to point out that Alex Jones was wrong about what he said about the Sandy Hook families, and even his own employees brought it up, but this seems to be This is get it's just absolutely it's a crazy story, so we'll talk about that and then man We got to talk about this other story too because it's just it's going crazy in the media I talked about at 4 p.m.
It's video out of Vegas of an Asian store clerk at a smoke shop and Some guy jumps the counter and then the clerk just knifes him and it looks like the dude gets killed so We're going to talk about all of that.
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Joining us tonight to talk about this news and more is Tucker Max.
tucker max
What's up?
tim pool
Do you want to introduce yourself for those who may not know who you are?
tucker max
Let's see.
I've written four New York Times bestsellers.
Hope They Serve Beer in Hell is the famous one.
But right now I'm pretty boring, man.
I live on a ranch outside of Austin with four kids and a bunch of animals.
It's not boring on a day-to-day basis, but there's not like that funny stories anymore.
It's not like, oh, my sheep did something so funny today.
No, they didn't.
They're just sheep.
tim pool
People were chatting that you were like the OG guy of the blogosphere, writing this stuff online and stuff back in the day.
Right on.
Thanks for coming.
We got a lot to talk about, so I'm glad you're here.
We got Hannah-Claire Brimelow, of course.
hannah claire brimelow
Hi, I'm Hannah-Claire Brimelow.
I'm a writer for TimCast.com.
unidentified
Right on.
ian crossland
Ian Crossland over here.
Hello, everyone.
Good to see you.
Good to meet.
Let's keep it rolling.
We got Chris Poole on the mic.
Hey, what's up everyone?
I'm Chris.
tim pool
Alright, we're gonna jump into that first story.
These intros used to go so much quicker these days.
Alright, first story off the New York Post.
Alex Jones ordered to pay $45.2 million in punitive damages to Sandy Hook parents.
Let's get some important context here real quick though.
This is from AboveTheLaw.com.
Texas damages cap looms over Alex Jones' Sandy Hook defamation case.
They basically lay it out.
The family wants $150 million.
They've awarded $45.
But this is where it's interesting.
They say here, others have pointed out that Texas law caps punitive damages at twice the compensatory damage award plus $750,000.
Moreover, an exemplary damage award requires a unanimous jury, and only 10 of the 12 jurors agreed on the original $4.1 million compensatory award.
And if the jury's original award was for non-economic damages, i.e.
to compensate for the pain and suffering, they may only get the $750,000 in this phase of the trial, which is perhaps why Plaintiff's Counsel tried to anchor the jury at $150 million in the first place.
So it looks like All in all, Alex Jones will end up being on the hook for about $13 million.
They say, Texas law prohibits telling the jury about the cap, so it may well return a massive verdict, which will then be reduced to comply with the statute, sending a signal about Jones' moral culpability, but allowing him to walk away with a slap on the wrist in light of the company's annual revenues in the neighborhood of $65 million.
The interesting thing here is, this is what, let me read here, let me read you what the lawyer said.
Quote, I ask that with your verdict, you not only take Alex Jones's platform that he talks about away, I ask that you make sure that he can't rebuild the platform.
That's what matters.
Lawyer Wesley Ball said.
That is punishment.
That is deterrence.
No, that's execution.
Punishment is like, we're going to make you pay a lot of money and you're going to learn how to do this again.
What he's talking about is completely destroying Alex Jones and everybody who works for him.
So, that's it.
There it is.
This is what everybody assumed this was all about.
Alex Jones was a default judgment.
He wasn't allowed to defend himself.
They claim, and may be correct, that he did not comply with Discovery.
Alex Jones claims he did.
It's a crazy story, man.
What freaks me out is that they just nuked his company.
I mean, I think, in my opinion, Jones probably has a ton of cash because he's been doing this for a long time.
And I'd be willing to bet he hid a lot of it.
Why wouldn't he have?
But it looks like they're just trying to destroy as much of this company as possible, especially with 2024 coming up and Trump probably running again.
hannah claire brimelow
Yeah, I feel like when you're as financially successful as Alex Jones is, you know well in advance to set up systems that will protect your money.
I mean, it's not like he's just sticking... I mean, maybe he is, but he's probably not sticking the cash in the walls of his house.
It's hidden under tax shelters or in trusts.
I mean, not that I could fault him or anyone else for doing that.
Why would you leave that much cash vulnerable?
tim pool
This is why people set up LLCs for, like, everything.
You ever notice this?
For people who are renting, you may notice you're paying rent to, like, your address.
Like, if you live at 123 Fake Street, you write a rent check to 123 Fake Street, LLC, and then you mail it in because they want to limit the liability.
You slip and fall in that house, you sue them, they only got that one house in that company.
But the people who own that house, they probably own 50 houses all under their own LLCs.
tucker max
Or basic things.
You put your money in a trust or a series of protected trusts or blind trusts and then they're not... Even if you get this damage, you can't seize those trusts.
tim pool
How would that work?
Can you explain how a trust would work?
tucker max
Look, just because I went to law school doesn't mean I know anything.
hannah claire brimelow
He's trying to distance himself from his past.
tucker max
All right, so basically what a trust is is it's like it's almost imagine like a corporation But it doesn't have a job to do other than be a vehicle for money.
So like I have a trust in my we have a max family trust and like most of my assets are in the max family trust and My wife and I are the executors of the trust and our children are their beneficiaries, right?
so if I were to like Get drunk and drive like an idiot and do something stupid and hurt somebody and they sue me and win.
They can't seize the trust, right?
They can only seize my personal assets.
You know, I have a few cars, whatever, we have some nonsense, but there's not a whole lot you can take.
And it's a way of protecting assets from, basically from seizure.
unidentified
Is there a risk?
tucker max
I mean, yeah, there's a few, but not really.
What's a risk?
A risk is my wife and I could get divorced and the way we have our trust set up is not super well situated for that possibility.
I mean, if I live a long time, there's certain things I can't do with the assets in that trust because they're in a trust.
I can't unilaterally decide I'm going to sell my property because my wife is an executor as well.
So we both have to decide.
Yeah, well then it depends on the trust, right?
You can't just say, okay, my stuff's in a trust and so no one can sue me.
There's certain legal structures you have to go through.
There's so many different trusts.
Blind trusts, irrevocable trusts, spendthrift trusts.
It just depends on what you're doing.
And certain ones are protected from certain legal liabilities.
Some are not.
Some are protected from almost all.
It really just depends.
tim pool
That seems crazy, though.
I mean, if that's the case, then why wouldn't Alex Jones just be like, here's $300 million and put it in trust?
tucker max
So, I don't... Alex seems kind of crazy to me, so maybe he has or hasn't, but most people I know who have serious money, like you get into the eight figures and above, Then you start protecting your assets and things like that.
unidentified
Yeah.
hannah claire brimelow
Yeah, isn't there some wasn't there?
I don't he's been in a couple lawsuits related to Sandy Hook and if I'm remembering correctly at one point they were arguing that he financially benefited off of the suffering that he put like the family and parents through by Promoting conspiracy theory or whatever the claim was so part of it is like I remember and I hate to quote this because I don't have something in front of me to reference but he he had they had wanted him to say basically how much money he had made during that time period because it gained him he was well known but it was one of the things that really uh gave him a certain amount of notoriety and that turned into financial benefit and so therefore the argument would be and i believe is that the family is actually entitled to this profit because he made it unfairly off of that right right right so he in some ways he wants to hide i'm not saying he does but like he would want to hide his money if that were true
tim pool
I'm not, and I don't want to imply you're a financial expert, but if you had a trust like this, could there be like a bank account with just cash in it?
You could pull money out whenever you wanted?
tucker max
You can set up trust like that, totally.
Yeah, it's not that hard.
tim pool
Because I, you know, first when I heard that they were getting going after him for four million dollars, I was like, Alex Jones is worth a lot.
He can easily cover four million.
tucker max
Well, I know he has at least two kids, right?
Yeah.
I know he has kids, so if he has any sense at all, or anyone around him has sense, he has trusts set up, probably individually for the kids, and then family trusts.
And that's just one way to shelter money.
There's a lot of other ways.
Like Panama.
Well, yeah, Panama Papers is a great...
Right.
I don't think he's operating at that level.
Those tended to be serious, serious wealth.
But there's plenty of places you can buy property.
Dude, just the state of Texas, it's really hard to seize assets in a bankruptcy or from a legal judgment.
There's a lot of weird rules in Texas.
It's really hard.
tim pool
This is why I see this and they're like, you know, the lawyer says, make sure he can't rebuild his company.
I'm like, there's literally nothing you can do.
tucker max
That's just posturing, I'm pretty sure.
tim pool
I think, you know, some people have claimed, I saw people tweeting that they're filming a documentary about it or whatever, so everything's really hammed up.
But I'm like, even if Alex Jones, every last penny was taken from him, some random guy will walk up on the street with a cell phone and film Alex Jones ranting and it'll get millions of views.
You can't take that away from somebody.
ian crossland
Social capital.
Invaluable.
tim pool
And just the ability that he has, whatever it may be.
The dude yells and people watch.
hannah claire brimelow
He's already an established name.
I mean, people know him.
Maybe if you had cut him off years and years and years ago, he wouldn't have the kind of influence that he has today.
But that's just really not the case.
He's an established brand with or without the company.
tim pool
Yeah, and I also don't know if you could ever have cut him off.
It's just like the kind of guy he is.
He's a bull charging through.
tucker max
My understanding from people who know him, he was like that in high school.
No, really, he used to walk around the halls yelling about injustice or whatever was the thing at the time.
Yeah, he's just one of those dudes.
tim pool
Yeah, they clearly don't like him.
So I guess the conspiracy theory, as it were, I don't even know if you can call it a theory or a conspiracy or whatever, but the idea is that all of this is just to find the vulnerability in InfoWars to knock the whole thing down.
People have left the company because of stuff like this.
But I think, to be fair, I mean, the dude defamed private individuals, and this is what happens.
tucker max
I mean, I remember when he was talking about that.
I'm like, dude, what are you, like, there's things that you can make the false flag claim on.
I don't think this is it, dude.
This is not a hill to plant your flag.
tim pool
I guess, you know what?
I guess the argument they're making is that it was working for them.
It was getting the clicks and people were eating it up.
And there were people at the company telling them to stop because it wasn't worth it.
Now apparently there's like two more defamation suits that are coming up.
tucker max
Yeah, from the Sandy Hook family.
tim pool
I don't think it's gonna stop.
tucker max
I mean, look, I understand why the families would be pissed, you know?
tim pool
Was that some fall over?
tucker max
I totally just kicked the trash can.
hannah claire brimelow
He's throwing stuff at me?
It's very aggressive.
tim pool
Beyond pissed.
Like I don't, you know, with Kyle Rittenhouse, I said this, I'm like, look man, you know, I'm going to give anybody the same benefit of the doubt initially.
I don't care if you're Walter Cronkite or if you're Alex Jones or whatever.
And then, you know, I'll, when you say something, I'll fact check it.
And that's all that matters.
I'm not here to play these, these like, who do I like?
Who do I don't like games?
But, uh, Yeah, I don't know, man.
It's very clear that when you look at, I'll be careful how I say this, what people are saying about the court case, they don't care whether Alex Jones is telling the truth, whether he's lying.
They just hate him.
They want him gone.
hannah claire brimelow
I think he's like a mythical figure at this point to a lot of people like he is this symbol of all the horrible dark corners of the internet that they're afraid of and supposed to stay away from and you know that may not be exactly who Alex is but they see it as sort of this righteous victory over him because he is a representation of a larger problem with society.
tim pool
We got a cult.
Let me pull this next story in this saga.
Daily Mail says Alex Jones is worth $270 million.
Forensic accountant tells court true worth of InfoWars founder.
I'm wondering how much of this is just bluster nonsense, and they're saying this so they can rip the, you know, just gut the company.
Because if you come out and you say he makes $800,000 a day, which was like one day, it was like two days or something like that, and then you claim he's worth $270 million, you justify a massive Settlement, right, of course.
tucker max
Or judgment, yeah.
tim pool
And then what if it turns out he actually just doesn't have anything?
I mean, because I wouldn't be surprised.
I guess he's divorced, you know?
He has an ex-wife or something like that.
hannah claire brimelow
Well, and like, why would he keep $270 million sitting in his bank account?
tucker max
Well, I mean, when a forensic accountant says something is worth something, what they mean is the sale price.
Like, the best market price.
Like, I mean, I just built a company that's worth, you know, I don't know in detail.
Actually, I know exactly what it's worth.
It's worth a lot.
Not $270 million.
But like, let's say the company is worth, I don't know, $60 million, right?
That means that's the sale price.
We're not making $60,000,000 a year even top line, right?
Like it's $60,000,000 is the cost of the asset, not what the value it produces.
I'd love to see the financials.
I'd be shocked if he... Someone said he's doing $60,000,000 a year now.
He's doing $180,000 pre-ban from YouTube and everything, right?
Pre-deplatforming.
So $60,000 would make sense.
That's 60% down.
tim pool
The guy apparently says that Jones, he says records show that Jones withdrew $62 million for himself in 2021 when default judgments were issued in lawsuits against him.
They said he was also funneling $11,000 a day into one of his shell companies after he was alleged to have defamed parents and victims of Sandy Hook.
I don't know, man.
They say, apparently, this guy is saying that he rakes in about $70 million a year from InfoWars.
The question is, is that revenue or profit?
tucker max
It's gotta be top line.
There's no way that's profit.
They're going for the bigger number.
tim pool
Right, of course.
tucker max
Yeah, so if 70 is the top line, and it depends how he structures his company, right?
And most of that money is on supplements, right?
That's the presumption is that the vast majority of that is supplement sales.
Well, so the question is how... Now, if he has some deal with an external company, he may only be taking 20-30% of that, you know?
And so if it's... I'm going to totally make up numbers.
If it's $50 million from supplement sales, his cut may only be 20%.
tim pool
They brought this up in the trial.
They said that... Jones testified his profit margin was 20-40%.
Makes sense.
And then they said in a text message, someone said a 70% profit.
He's like, well, that's not correct.
tucker max
Well, on the media company, though, maybe.
You run a media company.
You could run a media company.
Once you get some scale, you can run that pretty profitably.
tim pool
YouTube's a crazy business, man.
If you spend money one time on a camera and then start working, it can be 95-100% profit.
100% profit.
Exactly.
tucker max
Exactly, right.
So it depends.
He could be 70% on his subscription model, right?
But then the supplements, it all depends.
I doubt he's running a supplement company.
He's probably got, like, partners.
In fact, I could probably figure out who his partners are.
tim pool
I'm pretty sure he has, like, three companies.
I could be wrong.
And, like, one of them does supplements, and then he contracts them.
tucker max
Yeah, to other people who do the fulfillment and everything, I'm sure.
tim pool
Oh yeah, like he doesn't, yeah, he said that the stuff he gets is the same stuff as like GNC and Whole Foods or something.
tucker max
Right, exactly.
So he's probably making, it's almost like an affiliate deal.
tim pool
Right.
tucker max
So he's probably making 20% on that.
So like, you look at a blended average, I could totally see it, 25-30% on the whole company.
70 on media.
tim pool
When the news came out, I got a whole bunch of messages and people tweeting at me being like, Alex Jones, $200,000 to $800,000 per day.
People just sent me a message being like $160,000,000.
Just like, that dude is making an insane amount of money.
But here's what I think.
If it's true, my question is, why wouldn't he be spending it on crazier things?
tucker max
He has a nice house in Austin.
I know that it's expensive.
tim pool
Yeah, but I mean, if you're making that much money, if he really took $62 million for himself, I mean, there's a certain point, there's like, you can buy anything, you know?
hannah claire brimelow
I mean, he could buy stuff, or he can, we've already said he has two children, he can use it to create generational wealth.
I mean, theoretically, if he managed it correctly, they could really support generations to come.
tim pool
I'm just saying, if it's true that he made that much money, where's the shenanigans from Alex Jones, you know?
Like, we put a 96-foot billboard of our rooster, Roberto Jr., up in Times Square, and they banned James Lindsay, so I'm like, do I gotta put up a James Lindsay billboard?
That's my thing now.
I think so.
So, we're gonna look into it.
Because I'll totally do it.
And we don't make nearly that much money.
Like, we have enough to do these funny things with.
tucker max
Yeah, but that's not who Alex is.
tim pool
And it's not who anybody is.
That's the problem.
hannah claire brimelow
Nah.
tucker max
Just you two.
tim pool
Yeah, just me, I guess.
Where's Elon to just like, I'm gonna buy every billboard in Times Square and put a picture of me.
tucker max
Do you want the real answer on why?
I'll tell you, this is gonna sound super weird, because when I first started writing and I was the OG on the internet and I was making a little bit of money, I was just making no money, and a lot to me was like, oh, dude, I made 10 grand this month.
I'm like, this is amazing.
This is more than I could ever spend.
That's why I was single.
And so I did dumb ass shit with my money, too.
Here's what happens, though, man.
I'm 46 now.
I was 26 when I started writing.
As you accrue wealth and power and relationships, the more time you spend doing dumbass shit that draws attention to yourself, unless that's your business model.
the weaker it gets.
Real power wants to be invisible, right?
And real wealth wants to be unseen.
You know, like, I have a decent ranch in Dripping Springs, like 50 acres, you know, it's fine, right?
One of my good friends has a 350 acre ranch on Barton Creek.
unidentified
It, dude, this ranch was so expensive.
tucker max
It's so nice.
And if you saw the gate to it, you would think it was some ranch shackle meth lab around here.
unidentified
He doesn't want anyone to know that he has this insane ranch.
tucker max
I found it's happened to me too.
I've gotten more experienced or more conservative and less like, oh, let's do cool, ridiculous stuff just because I've gotten older and richer.
tim pool
But it's I get that for sure.
But the question is, like, Alex Jones is the culture warrior.
tucker max
Yeah, but what he cares about... You know Alex pretty well.
He's one of those dudes I think he actually believes he's doing the right thing, and he actually cares about truth.
That dude's been ringing the Epstein bell for 15 years!
tim pool
I agree, which is why I'm like, if he actually had this money, wouldn't he be doing substantially more to push this stuff?
See, this is what I don't get.
And look, it really does come down to my personal worldview versus what other people think or see, right?
It's just that simple.
Some people make $62 million and then they're like, better put that in my trust for my kids or something like that.
Me, I'm like, we got Michael Malice, Luke Rutkowski up on billboards in Times Square because they've been on this show, I respect them, but I also think it's important to have their presence be expanded.
And I gotta tell you, One of the things I'm most excited for was that we got Luke Rydkowski.
Do you know Luke of We Are Change?
I'm most excited about getting him up in Times Square on multiple billboards because he's the guy who, only a couple years ago, walks up to Donald Rumsfeld and starts questioning him.
One of the few people who's gotten in the face of these CEOs and these big corporations.
And I was like, it's going to be the funniest thing in the world when his face is looking down on Times Square.
And then this guy who actually had the balls to go and question all these people is going to be of significant influence.
That's what I want to see.
It benefits us because it's a Tim Cast ad.
tucker max
Right, of course.
tim pool
But I'm looking at this like, if we make enough money, how can we have a bigger impact on just making things better?
tucker max
Dude, that's awesome.
And I'm with you.
And I'm not arguing this is right.
No, I hear you.
I know a lot of people who are pretty well known.
I've come up with them and I've seen the change in them.
When people have something to lose, Right?
Like when someone's young and just starting off or just got momentum and you don't have anything to lose, man, it's easy to do risky shit.
As you have more, have more people dependent on you, as you accrue more, most people become more risk averse.
And quite frankly, like when you start having a lot of money and you're able to turn, let's call it a youthful idealism into reality, you start being an actual threat to people in power.
unidentified
Oh yeah.
tucker max
And then when that lens turns on you, and I've had it turned on me, not quite the way Alex did, but it's a lot, dude.
It's a lot.
And so like, again, not saying he should or shouldn't be a certain way, I'm just saying there's a reason that very few people retain their idealism through wealth and power.
tim pool
Yeah, you know, I'm not trying to single out Alex on this one.
There's a ton of wealthy people who speak up and then seemingly don't do all that much.
But, you know, there are a lot of people you'd think should do more, but do a lot.
I'm not going to name anybody, but they're powerful individuals who fund stuff.
And then I just, you know, but my question is, We've got cultural problems in this country.
We've got cultural stagnation, cultural decay.
We've got a culture war.
And that's because there is no forward facing, no brazen, no adventurous, no heroic, no challenge, no figurative threat to the, you know, no one ruffling the feathers up or anything like that.
I think we need to get more people to figuratively throw a pie.
That's what I keep saying to people.
I'm like, dude, what did you do?
You made, how much money did you make this year?
And then you put it, you bought what?
Like you did nothing with it.
So, I don't know, man.
unidentified
That's just me, I guess.
tim pool
I'm with you.
I would be happy living in a van down by the river.
And everybody knows that's true.
And that's why I'm like, okay, let's put up these billboards and just keep doing this crazy stuff.
Because I want to see things get better.
I want to see a positive impact.
I want to see positive cultural change.
I don't see a benefit or a point to just having $60 million in a trust sitting somewhere.
tucker max
I totally agree with you.
I'm on board.
Let me tell you two things.
One, I don't mean this in a negative way.
I've seen it happen to me.
Just wait until you have a wife and kids and you have like real money and that'll happen soon enough.
It might take 10 years or whatever but like it'll happen.
tim pool
What is real money?
tucker max
I mean like whatever you consider real money to be, you're like you have that plus a zero.
tim pool
So you mean like there comes a point where you're like, I thought I was rich, but now, wow.
unidentified
Yeah.
tucker max
But, um, no, I'm just, I, your views are going, I don't mean this like, Oh, you're going to learn about the real world.
And then I'll do, you might still be super idealistic and doing all kinds of cool stuff.
I hope you are.
That's awesome.
Just understand like, it's, it's very easy from a certain position to say, well, that person in that position should be doing that.
They have all kinds of forces working on them that are almost impossible to imagine until you get there.
I'm telling you as someone who started with nothing and went through all these phases.
tim pool
I just kind of feel like it's, at every step of the way, you know, I'll tell you this story.
I remember watching a video about climate change activists or something.
They went to like an oil executive's house.
and then they were protesting and then he comes out and he sits down with him and he
unidentified
Right.
tim pool
was like say it all and then they started yelling at him and he just sat and listened
and then they were like what do you have to say for yourself and he's like I completely
agree with everything you said like we're trying to figure this out and then he rebutted
with hundreds of hundred plus million people 200 million people driving cars every day
and they're telling us we have to do this and so we're trying to figure out how do we
be better stewards of the earth.
When you have 200 million people who are making demands and if you stop producing the oil Then the government comes in says why did you stop people are screaming at us and demanding you do it?
So you can't just the point was this dude at the highest level was like supposedly the villain and he's like, but I agree with you the problem is the machine is controlling you and So my thing is like, then you gotta just one day wake up and be like, I don't care for the machine.
So, you know, look, my- I'm saying...
tucker max
That's easy to say.
tim pool
Yeah, but 60 million dollars?
Come on, somebody can do it.
unidentified
Hold on.
tucker max
How did you get me defending the machine?
I hate them.
I am the anti-machine.
Here's the thing.
I fundamentally agree with your premises.
The one thing I would... I want to go back to what you said before, for a second, when you were like, people need to do this and do that.
You know why I think so many people are so black-pilled right now?
tim pool
Because I think the old American story broke.
tucker max
Whenever it broke and however it broke, it's broken.
It's shattered.
So many other people like, because I think the old American story broke, right?
Whenever it broke and however it broke, it's broken.
It's shattered.
No one believes it anymore.
And no one has replaced that story, right?
And so that most people are followers, you know, not good or bad, they just are.
And right now, the dominant narrative in America is a very toxic, destructive death cult, like CRT or wokeism or that whole conglomeration of narratives.
are horribly anti-human and depressing and toxic, and there has been no narrative to replace it.
And we're not going back to old school American exceptionalism.
That's not going to work.
That story, right or wrong, it's broken.
And no one believes it anymore.
So what's the next story?
What's going to replace that?
I don't have the answer.
ian crossland
Yeah. Transhumanism.
I mean, the metaverse.
People becoming cyborgs.
We've already got our phones.
Look what we're doing now with zero money.
We're displaying to a hundred million people.
tim pool
I think your point is, simply put, I think most people are looking at the culture right now and thinking, I have nothing in common with these people, so I won't do anything for them.
What's the point?
And so, you know, I describe it as, like, our government, for instance.
The Titanic hit the iceberg.
They saw it happen.
Everyone else is clueless.
tucker max
They're abandoning ship.
tim pool
But they're stealing the silverware as they do it.
They're stealing everything they can as they do it, yes.
They got their vests loaded up with silverware and they're in the lifeboat lowering it down.
Just a routine test, just gonna go talk, we'll be right back.
And you're like, where are you going with all that really expensive stuff in that boat?
That's what I see happening in this country.
But I think that's a good explanation for why we don't see more people.
I think a simple explanation for Alex Jones is probably that that's top line.
They're claiming he has more money than he really does.
Because Alex, I've seen his tank.
I've seen the stuff he does when he drives that armored vehicle around.
He does spend a lot of money on this stuff.
But I'm just wondering, For how many culture warriors there are?
I shouldn't say I'm wondering, I get exactly what you're saying.
I think most people have a large self-interest and then a smaller, altruistic interest.
tucker max
But with no... A lot of people will put resources behind a great movement.
There's no great movement right now.
I know a ton of people with stupid, stupid money.
Private plane, private island money.
Not like me, like way more than me.
And they're all sitting on it.
unidentified
That's boring.
tucker max
You know why?
They don't know what to do with it.
And I don't just mean they don't know how to invest it.
Or they don't know how to make money.
Because there's plenty that just care about making money right.
But the ones who want to do the right thing.
Who would love to back the next thing or help.
They don't know what to do.
tim pool
I know you are correct because I have seen very wealthy people talk about these issues and they are clueless as to what's causing it.
unidentified
Utterly.
hannah claire brimelow
And I used to be a fundraiser.
Like, I remember when you would get people who would come in and say, like, I just, I want to do something.
I'm not sure.
And they are very susceptible to whoever messages them.
I mean, that's what a major gift officer for a nonprofit or a school does.
They court people who need direction how to donate their money.
tim pool
A really good example, I think, is look at all of the Twitter alternatives that exist.
Like, okay, you've got Gab, you've got Getter, you've got Truth Social, you've got Parler.
This is a really good example of, I think, what the issue is, is that people are like, hey, Twitter's banning conservatives and people who are challenging the establishment, so let's make a new Twitter.
And the actual reality is the technology and the platform is not the problem.
The problem is culture, the cultural dominance, and the issue that the people who run these companies, like Twitter, They are ideologically driven.
tucker max
A hundred percent.
tim pool
So when you have a group of people who are well off, not particularly ideologically driven, except they support free speech, they don't know how to solve the problem.
They say, let's make a new Twitter.
Congratulations.
Nobody uses it.
There's already a place people are fighting with each other and arguing.
What you need is like an Elon Musk to buy the Twitter.
That's a clever move.
But what I said to some of these people when I'm sitting in these meetings, I'm like, you guys, you really don't get it.
It's a cultural problem.
You need someone like Michael Malice.
You need a masterful troll to create a cultural shift through a large cultural shock, which is why, you know, I mention my view on things is maybe where I'm getting things wrong is people absolutely are spending money, but they just don't, they're not addressing the culture problems.
tucker max
No, they're not.
tim pool
They're spending money on technology, they're spending money on new companies or new buildings
unidentified
Yes.
tim pool
or things like that.
Or stuff.
Or stuff.
But thinking this is a positive move to change things, meanwhile the culture keeps churning
in the woke cult direction.
tucker max
Yes.
Yeah.
About two years ago, two and a half years ago, I really kind of started to figure this
And I'll tell you what I'm doing now.
And I don't talk about it a whole lot publicly, just because I'm kind of at the beginning stages.
But I've, you know, I moved to a, like, bought a land, moved to a ranch, right?
But not just like, I'm gonna go be a prepper or a homesteader.
Like, we're definitely homesteading.
But I bought in a place that a bunch of other people I knew were there.
And then a bunch of other people came.
We started our own school.
And now like almost everything I do now is I do one of two things either I think very very locally Like where am I buying my stuff right?
Like where am I getting water power food, etc?
Like who am I?
Who am I buying from right?
Are they in my community?
How am I supporting my community?
Who am I bringing into my community?
How are we connecting?
How are we interfacing with each other?
Not to like have some, you know, some island or some cult somewhere.
I mean, we live in Texas.
We're a town in Texas.
There's a bunch, but like I want to think as much as possible locally.
I don't, I think that if there's gonna be a thread that is a true counterculture thread, it's gonna be around Think about how disconnected and detached everyone is from each other.
The opposite of that is not just interpersonal, it's as much as possible local.
I mean, obviously, I can't get my oysters locally.
I live in, you know, the desert.
but as much as I can, I wanna know my neighbors and interact with them and buy from them
and sell to them and create our own economy.
We have our own school.
We literally just started a school.
We got 80 families and 100 something kids in it.
I mean, public schools are a disaster.
Who wants to send their kids to, I don't even wanna get you blocked on YouTube,
but to public schools now.
And so I, the.
That idea has just started with a lot of people.
I think that's going to be one of the main ideas, but not the only one.
You know?
I don't know what it's... If I knew, I'd be shouting it from the rooftops.
tim pool
I want to jump to this next story, because I think it hits at the heart of a lot of what we're talking about.
This story has been going viral.
I covered it a bit in 4PM.
Employee wards off three robbers with a knife.
Stabs one multiple times at Las Vegas Smoke Shop.
Of course, we've got to censor these images, because these are brutal images.
But I'll tell you the gist of the story.
Guys working at a smoke shop in Vegas, dudes come in, one guy immediately robs them, the next guy jumps the counter, and the clerk just says, okay, with a knife in his hand, and just starts going at the dude who jumped the counter.
Now a lot of people are saying that it's, was it a legal use of force, because he gets this guy in the neck a couple times, and the guy says, I'm dead, I'm dead.
The reason I think this is, you know, in the previous segment, we're talking about, you know, why are people keeping their money, hoarding it, not really investing in their communities and stuff like that.
And I think there's a really good example.
This guy was attacked.
And what people are worried about is that he will go to prison.
For defending himself.
tucker max
Defending, I know.
tim pool
And so it's things like this, when people say, I'm out.
If we're sitting here looking at the story, thinking that you could be minding your own business, someone can jump the counter wearing a ski mask, and you are legally required to back up and wait for them to draw on you before you have a chance to actually defend yourself, that's the reality of this country in many states.
At that point, a lot of people are just like, don't care anymore.
I'm gonna watch out for myself because you will get boot stomped by the machine if you try and defend yourself.
tucker max
In New York, California, totally.
That's why Austin is so expensive now.
It's because of this.
Stuff like this.
It's a huge part of it, yeah.
I mean, if you're in Florida... Well, you saw the dude in New York, Jose Alba, right?
tim pool
The guy who's got the shotgun?
tucker max
Yeah, like the old dude who...
It was in New York, the bodega guy.
Remember the guy who cut the... he killed the... the guy was beating him up.
Like, beating his ass.
And he stabbed him, killed him.
I mean, couldn't have been a more clear-cut self-defense.
tim pool
The girlfriend stabbed the store clerk.
tucker max
Yeah, she tried to or something.
tim pool
No, she did.
She got him in the arm.
tucker max
Oh, she did.
tim pool
I'm pretty sure she got him in the arm.
unidentified
Okay, alright.
tim pool
I could be wrong.
tucker max
So it was the most clear-cut self-defense I've ever seen.
ian crossland
This Jose Alba?
tucker max
Yeah, that guy.
ian crossland
He's leaving and going to the Dominican Republic.
tim pool
I would too if I was here!
ian crossland
That was two hours ago from New York Post, yeah.
tucker max
Yeah!
ian crossland
They dropped the murder charge and he's out.
tucker max
The only reason the prosecutor dropped the charge is because everyone in the country was in a total uproar.
And the mayor, Eric Adams, was like, alright, just let the dude go.
tim pool
Yeah.
tucker max
Like, it's exactly what you're talking about.
tim pool
Kyle Rittenhouse.
tucker max
Exactly.
tim pool
The fact that there were people in this country that had no idea what happened, and wanted him to go to prison.
The fact that he spent two months, or it wasn't two months, it was almost three months, in jail, and then they were like, oh yeah, I mean, it was self-defense.
It's remarkable that anybody who watched that, just unquestionably, it was self-defense.
tucker max
Of course it was, just watch the video!
hannah claire brimelow
But most people didn't watch the video, because that one is the wrong narrative.
tucker max
But they believe Jesse Smollett Well, the same people that believe Jussie Smollett are the ones who, when they watched the Rittenhouse trial, were like, wait a minute, he didn't shoot a bunch of black people?
No, like, do you remember how many people were like, wait a minute, he shot three white guys who had one of them had a gun?
tim pool
And he's on the ground and the guy runs up with the gun?
And the guy... They were shocked!
The guy's accused of saying that he regrets not killing him?
They had no idea.
And then you saw some of these people came out and they're like, I was wrong about that.
tucker max
A minority did admit it.
hannah claire brimelow
But most people didn't.
They kept going with, well, this is wrong.
This is like injustice.
Our system is so biased.
It's an example of systemic racism that, you know, they never tried to fact check themselves at all.
They never really looked at the case, again, because they're not really interested in it.
They're interested in their own narrative.
tim pool
I'm sure all of these really wealthy media people are watching shows like this and they're hearing me talk about stuff and they're laughing like, what an idiot.
The fact that I would say I would rather invest in the company than hoard the money and hide it somewhere.
They're like, when it all comes crashing down, and it is because they all see it coming, Taiwan, China, Russia, whatever it is, I'm going to be left holding an empty bag and they've been stocking their money up in Panama and El Salvador and crypto and wherever else.
tucker max
Their money might not be worth much.
tim pool
Yeah, but if you spread it around.
tucker max
If things go really sideways, you're in a way better spot than they are.
Well, think about it.
You're on land.
You have guns.
You have friends.
You have food.
tim pool
Yeah, but they do too.
These people have been buying up in Idaho and Wyoming and building compounds and fortresses.
tucker max
So, I'm going to tell you a quick story.
So, you're right.
That definitely exists.
But you know what's going to happen.
If things go really sideways, not like a little COVID-y, but like sideways sideways.
Civil war.
It can be short of Civil War, but sideways.
Bro, how many people do you think that work on those compounds in Idaho are going to give their lives for rich out-of-staters?
Yeah, it's not going to happen.
Let's go a step further.
Let's say you're a super billionaire who has a huge estate outside of Sun Valley.
That head of security, that guy who, you know, he was former SF, and he's got his family there, and he hired the whole crew, and there's like four dudes that all report to him.
tim pool
He's the billionaire now.
tucker max
He's the boss now.
tim pool
That's right.
ian crossland
That's what happened with the Roman Empire, I mean, the head of the Praetorian Guard would just kill the emperor and become the new emperor.
That happened multiple times.
tim pool
This is the thing people need to understand too, like, Your point is absolutely spot on.
You own land?
So like, I mean rhetorically, obviously, because you talked about it, but I'm saying like, you think you own land in a rhetorical sense.
What does that mean?
tucker max
You're running it from the government.
tim pool
You've got a piece of paper that says, on this date, so-and-so owns the land.
What do you think's going to happen when it hits the fan?
You're going to walk onto your land and there's going to be a dude with a gun and he's going to be like, it's my land.
And you're going to be like, but I have the paper.
And he's going to be like, and I have the gun.
hannah claire brimelow
It's going to be like the land grab when people are going west.
tucker max
They're just going to sprint.
There's a reason why a lot of smart people are focusing a lot of time on community.
When I first got into this, a lot of people were like, oh, defense, defense, have guns.
And I'm like, okay, guns are cool.
I'm into defense, but I'm one dude.
If a gang of dudes come, I need neighbors.
I need friends.
I need other people with guns.
hannah claire brimelow
This is like an old-timey Western thing, but if you're not home and your family's home, you need the rest of your community to be like, we're gonna head over there.
They seem to be in trouble.
tucker max
Yes.
One dude with a gun is useless against a gang.
But a neighborhood?
Gonna win.
Gonna make it.
tim pool
Yeah, this is what people need to understand, too.
The left likes to talk about how 2A, they're like, you know, what did Joe Biden say?
unidentified
You're gonna need nukes to go up against the government.
tucker max
Like the Afghanis?
unidentified
You mean?
tim pool
Yeah, like the Viet Cong.
They had a hard time.
But the thing is, it's really simply put, A drone can't occupy a street corner.
unidentified
Nope.
tim pool
So if you really want to seize assets, resources, and control a city, a civilization, you need boots on the ground instructing the people what to do.
tucker max
Well, my favorite about that is there was someone, I can't remember, it was one of like Max Boot or one of those lunatics who was like, blah, blah, blah, what are your stupid AR-15s gonna do against drones and, you know, like predator drones and all that stuff.
And, uh, I think it was Clay Martin, who's a total badass.
He just responded to Max and he said, Hey, the people operating those drones, they got addresses and families?
Okay.
You know, like it's same thing, man.
Like people don't realize like... Do you remember the Space Force thing?
tim pool
I got to bring it up again.
Which what?
The uniforms.
The Space Force uniforms were like jungle camo or whatever.
Desert camo.
So when they announced Space Force, they showed a photo of someone wearing a uniform and it was like, what is it called, Chris?
The green camo they wear?
unidentified
They have different names for it, but it's like ACUs were the ones I wore.
tim pool
But is that a reference to the color?
ian crossland
It's just the design.
tim pool
Yeah.
So everybody was laughing.
ian crossland
They're like, it's the Space Force, but they're like for the dream camo.
unidentified
Yeah.
tim pool
So then they started, people started making photos of uniforms that looked like outer space.
And there was like, immediately someone said, where do you think the Space Force is fighting?
And they were like, They're on the ground running satellites.
Secondly, if they were in space, they would be in spaceships, not floating around.
And even if they were, why would you want them to be invisible?
hannah claire brimelow
You're floating in space.
You want someone to notice.
tucker max
So you can set up an ambush in space, obviously.
unidentified
Right.
tim pool
But my point is, all of these people who are making fun of the idea, They're extremely ignorant.
They have no idea how reality works.
It's funny because we started doing sales for emergency food supplies.
There have been how many disastrous floods where people get locked out of resources?
unidentified
All kinds!
tucker max
There's one just happened in Kentucky.
unidentified
A horrible one.
tim pool
And when you get your supply lines shut down and you spent 70 bucks on like a food bucket so you know you've got freeze-dried food to eat, that's not about the apocalypse.
No.
But they're all laughing.
And now they're like, food shortage is coming.
So my point is just, man, You've got a group of people in this country, people who watch shows like this, who are interested and looking for nuanced context.
And then you've got people who are just like, tell me what to do and how to do it and who to make fun of.
tucker max
Yeah.
Oh, yeah.
And they all live in douche cubes in cities.
And they're all going to be in trouble if there's any, if all the policies that they love, like, let's have green energy.
unidentified
Cool.
tucker max
Where's that coming from?
unidentified
Naturally, yes.
tim pool
Well, do you see that there was a wind turbine that was spraying oil?
And then everyone went, huh?
There's a ton of oil.
How do you it's got to spin.
It's got to lubricate.
Yeah, exactly.
I mean, fair point.
It's not burning the oil.
Right. But they're still they still require a lot of oil.
tucker max
Do you know how much like ungreen energy it takes
to manufacture one of those?
It's insane, man.
Those things have to run for like 18 years to break even, I think.
And don't they have a lifespan of like 20 or 25 years, a lot of them?
It's insane.
tim pool
But people don't realize that.
It's like, dude, please read about energy, okay?
Like fossil fuel energy.
We're talking about crude petroleum.
We're talking about natural gas.
It is ready to be converted.
Green energy is you have to convert all these materials into a system that can then convert other energy.
So it's like a second layer system.
I'm a fan of solar for one reason.
Not that it's more energy efficient or more green, but that it can give you your own circuit.
So all the energy that goes into the production of the panels, you can then have an isolated circuit.
You can be off the grid.
That's great.
But you need sun during a storm.
You don't got it.
So now you need batteries.
You need a supply chain with solar. I'll put it, I'll just simply put, it's just, it's scary
when you realize the majority of people, or I should say at least Democrat voters, but you
know, probably a lot of conservative voters too, they don't know what they're voting for.
They don't understand layer two of an issue.
The left is just like, Greta Thunberg, we gotta ban fossil fuels now.
It's like, okay, 60 million people dead in three days.
tucker max
At least.
tim pool
Yeah.
And I think there's estimates of like a billion people dead in a year if you cut off fossil fuels.
tucker max
No, the carrying capacity of the Earth is somewhere between half a billion to a billion without fossil fuels.
tim pool
Yeah.
tucker max
That's it.
Like, that's just the reality.
So, okay.
Put a room full of people.
One out of eight get to live without fossil fuels.
That's it.
That's the reality.
I mean, it's crazy to me.
It's not really even debatable.
You look at the math on that, especially if you want a quick transition.
If you're talking about a 50-year transition, okay, maybe it's a little different.
But if you're talking about a quick transition, no.
ian crossland
I'm thinking about tapping the vacuum for energy, like the vacuum fluctuations and stuff.
There's so much technology.
Fusion, for instance.
I don't think that the power structure wants people to have unlimited energy.
They want them attached to a grid so that they can monitor it and make sure no one person has too much power.
What does that mean?
tim pool
Let me pull up this next story here from Blaze.
This is crazy.
CEO says two-thirds of ammunition deliveries have gone missing with UPS.
That's a lot of ammo, so where is it now?
Alright.
Maybe this is just one company.
Patrick Kahn, CEO of thegunfood.com says he's lost thousands of dollars worth of ammo because customers' orders don't always seem to make it to their doors, especially when delivering with UPS.
He says about 18,000 rounds of ammo shipped through UPS, only a third were actually delivered, so where is it going?
Okay, now hold on.
tucker max
One company, First off, 18,000 rounds of ammo is not very much.
tim pool
So my first thought when I see this story is particularly sensational, also kind of alarming if it is part of something greater.
And I think that's kind of what they're hinting at, that things are starting to break down.
So you've got now, they're going to be hiring 87,000 IRS agents and they're giving them hollow points.
Right?
They bought hollow points for the IRS.
hannah claire brimelow
And the Gates introduced the legislation that was like, no, we're not going to give them ammunition.
I don't know what you're talking about.
unidentified
Yeah.
tim pool
So, so it's just the reason I bring this story up is not to insinuate that one company seeing their ammo go missing is indicative of a collapse, but just like it's another grain of sand in this heap with IRS agents being armed with Taiwan that maybe the fourth turning is upon us.
You're familiar with Strassel.
What do you think?
And do you think this plays anything into it?
tucker max
I mean, there's a lot of people.
I'm not sure what I think about cycles.
Generational cycles.
I mean, I know enough about physics to know all energy moves in waves and cycles, so it's almost certainly... They seem to make a lot of sense, right?
I don't know.
And then fourth turning is just one of many different historical cycle-type things.
I don't think you have to know anything about cycles to just look around and be like, a lot of shit is hitting a lot of fans right now.
tim pool
What do you think happens to a city like New York if the supply chain just was halted?
tucker max
Not this past winter, but two winters ago, I can tell you what happens to a city like Austin when the supply chain breaks.
Because I was there for the winter apocalypse.
Do you guys remember this?
Okay, so I grew up driving.
I spent seven years in Chicago.
I know how to drive in snow.
And no one in Texas did, because it's all Texans and Californians.
hannah claire brimelow
My first year in Dallas, I remember having to drive everyone around because they couldn't do it.
tucker max
They have no idea.
And so it snowed a lot.
And so for seven days, basically, everyone was locked in.
But really, for four days, everything was truly down.
By the end of the, by the beginning of the fourth day, one of the people who worked, I was still at my company, who worked for my company, she was, she lived like eight blocks from the office, was walking into the office, right?
Because we were all remote, so like we could keep working.
She had people trying to rob her, but like these are clearly not professionals.
It was like a dude who was hungry, right?
I mean, my company was 75 people full-time in Austin at that point, and they were all like millennials who were like, LOL, I have Cheetos in my freezer.
I don't know what to, that's all I have.
Like I had to drive, I had just gotten a cow slaughtered, and so I literally drove like 200 pounds of meat in to the office, and then a bunch of them walked in to get it.
Dude, shit went nuts there.
There was five and six hour lines to get like A bag of pasta?
Yeah.
Like, it was bad, man.
And this is just... This wasn't even like... The grid didn't go... Grid kind of went down a little bit.
But, like, it was bad.
tim pool
This is what I'm talking about.
When I tell people, like, when I do a pitch for emergency food, I'm talking about this.
tucker max
Yes.
tim pool
And, like, sometimes it rains.
unidentified
Yes.
tim pool
But you get all these leftists that are, like, mocking the idea.
And then when it actually happens... Yeah.
They're hungry.
This is why I think they're gonna eat each other.
Like, it's gonna be... And it's like... Bro.
Do you see the New York Times already saying the time for cannibalism or whatever they're writing about it?
tucker max
Listen, go ahead.
Have fun.
You're in New York.
Go eat your neighbor.
I don't care.
No, seriously, I don't.
Eat your neighbor.
No, if you want to belong to a death cult, then you get to reap the consequences.
I don't.
I don't belong to that.
I've prepared.
I'm around a bunch of great people who are all ready to... I don't need to worry about it.
tim pool
That's their problem.
It's like zombies.
But I mean literally.
If you have people who live in New York City, they've prepared for nothing.
There's clearly signs indicating something is hitting us right now.
The food supply, we've been told over and over again since the start of the year.
tucker max
The president said it in a press conference like three months ago.
tim pool
And they're still mocking the idea that they would do any kind of preparation.
And so I'm just like, it's a zombie horde.
They don't think for themselves.
They don't care to solve problems.
They are just standing there in the crowd, mindless, and then quite literally, yo, If the supply chain collapses and you got 2.5 million people on Manhattan Island alone, let alone Central Brooklyn, how do you get out of Central Brooklyn?
tucker max
You don't.
unidentified
No.
You stay there.
tim pool
But no, no, but I mean like, stay there, you're gonna have to try to get out.
There's not gonna be food and people are gonna be, it's gonna be, it's gonna be nightmarish.
tucker max
Yeah, no, I mean like you, like it's, it'll get, it'll get abandoned prison camp bad.
tim pool
Yep.
tucker max
Like, maybe five days?
tim pool
I wouldn't be surprised if you see slavery.
tucker max
Oh, way past that.
tim pool
Yeah.
tucker max
I mean, roving gangs, warlords, like, it doesn't take long to get there in a true grid-down situation.
tim pool
What do they say?
You're three meals away from a revolution?
Something like that?
tucker max
No, 12 missed meals?
tim pool
Well, it's like a saying.
tucker max
It's like... I think it's 96 hours and 12 missed meals.
tim pool
Is that what it is?
tucker max
I think.
tim pool
And then people just start losing it.
unidentified
Yep.
tim pool
And then also, where do you get your water from?
See, out here, there's a river.
And we also, we have a creek as well.
And then, so we can go out.
tucker max
You're great.
unidentified
You're good to go.
tim pool
And then I've got emergency filters and I've got other stuff.
But we also have a well.
We got a well.
And so if everything went south and the grid shut down or whatever, I'd be like, just another old day, I guess.
We've got tons of backup batteries.
We've got a massive solar backup system at the new facility we're building.
But people in these cities, When COVID happened, they're locked in their apartments, they have no food, and they're losing their minds.
It's crazy.
It's like a stress test.
tucker max
Well, we just saw it in Shanghai.
tim pool
Yeah.
tucker max
Like, they went on a hard, hard lockdown, and no one knows how many people died there.
You know, the Chinese are real sketchy about that, but all those videos coming out, people were like... You see the pictures of people taking the refrigerator?
tim pool
The guy takes the refrigerator, pushes it onto his balcony, it's open and empty.
Because they had no food.
People were losing it.
I remember when it was Sandy, Hurricane Sandy in New York.
tucker max
That was bad.
tim pool
I was in New York and it was crazy to see how high the floodwaters got.
Windows were smashed out from the surge.
They're the coolest thing I saw was when the downed bus stops skateboarders were grinding on them So they were having a blast but then you go to the bodegas.
There's no electricity nothing So all the perishables have expired within a couple days and I went in there were two guys outside holding like two by fours a big line and And they were like one person at a time.
I walked in, cash only obviously, and the guy was just like, he's like, don't touch the perishables, like the milk, everything's bad, you don't eat it, but anything that's not perishable, like the high fructose corn juice and like the canned stuff is good.
And so I went and I was like, I got like a Coke, and I was like, it's warm, you know, but it's all you get.
Yo.
And the other thing too is people don't realize how quickly it's going to go to like, To the 1800s.
No more cold drinks, no more ice, no more ice cream, no more flushing the toilet.
Nope.
You're going back in time real quick.
tucker max
Yeah, and then the question becomes, how long does it last?
tim pool
Oh, for them, that... So, I put it this way.
New York gets supply chain disruption.
Like, the whole system just fails for some reason.
You get a couple days where it's guys with 2x4s guarding the bodegas, and people going in.
Three days after that, the food's gone.
And now it's people fighting in the streets for the last can of beans.
Three days after that, people have already started to leave, they're gonna be eating fish out of the Hudson, and they're gonna be barfing and sick the entire time.
hannah claire brimelow
But I think the other thing that happens, and we saw this during COVID, is those who can, like wealthy people who can afford to move more quickly, will move into upstate New York, Connecticut, parts of New Jersey, and then continue to put pressure on those systems that don't normally have that many people there.
So those grocery stores will start to feel the effect.
tucker max
You know what you're missing?
The rich people might go fast.
But then what happens, you know, you hit days 5 to 10, when all the stores are empty, if nothing's coming in, what happens is people start moving out.
And not the rich people.
The people walking out.
And not a few of them.
tim pool
Tens or hundreds of thousands.
So you've got a few bridges and tunnels.
tucker max
Right, that's it.
tim pool
Bottlenecking the whole thing.
tucker max
I know, did you see how they put, it's so weird you're talking about this, because they just put those massive metal doors on the tunnels, on the Lincoln Tunnel.
unidentified
No way!
They called them flood tunnels, but they're not flood tunnels.
tim pool
They're getting ready to lock everybody in, dude.
tucker max
I think so.
I know it sounds crazy to even talk about this.
This sounds lunacy.
But they just, like I saw this like a month ago, wasn't it?
Yeah, Lincoln Tunnel has one, and I think the Midtown Tunnel.
I think all of them, maybe.
tim pool
What do I search for?
Flood doors?
tucker max
Yeah, flood doors, Lincoln Tunnel.
tim pool
But what about, how do they stop the bridges, you know?
Oh yeah, look at this.
tucker max
I'm not sure.
These things?
tim pool
This is a couple years ago, actually.
unidentified
No, one of them, like, I know just one of them.
tim pool
44,600 pound floodgates installed in NYC tunnels to protect from super storms.
Maybe it's because of Sandy.
They were like, okay.
tucker max
It's not unthinkable, yeah.
It's not.
ian crossland
It does both.
unidentified
Yeah.
ian crossland
Stops the water and the people.
tucker max
And the people, yeah.
ian crossland
You can go north out of Manhattan.
I mean, there's still rivers to the west, but you can walk north.
There's no, it just goes up into the north.
hannah claire brimelow
You can walk, but like, if things are in that much chaos, how far are you really gonna get on foot?
tim pool
Oh man.
A leak in the Lincoln Tunnel in 2020.
People were freaking out.
So it could be why.
But I do think it's funny that they put up these big barriers.
tucker max
I know, dude.
tim pool
Bottlenecks.
It's gonna be like, you know, you see the Batman movie where the cops block all the bridges and like nobody leaves the city.
unidentified
Yeah.
tim pool
I don't know.
You know, look.
When we were talking about World War I the other day, the crazy thing is people don't realize
how quickly things fall apart.
And it was just like, grass, was it gradually then suddenly?
hannah claire brimelow
Yeah.
I think that people underestimate how quickly things can fall apart
because they're told to sort of live for now and live for impulsively.
I think this is a lot of like left-leaning culture that you wouldn't think ahead.
Like when you say like people make fun of people who are acquiring food because they're like,
oh, what do you think?
It's gonna be a doomsday.
It's gonna be a purge all at once.
Like, no, not necessarily, but also you can't think past the two days in front of you
because the impulsivity culture and the self-indulgence culture tells you
that it's not worth dealing with.
tucker max
Well that and then also I mean like in 2019 I made fun of preppers and I didn't really I had a couple guns but they're like hunting like I wasn't.
tim pool
You've converted.
tucker max
Oh to 100% of course.
How could you not after the last two and a half years right?
But I think it's also that like We've grown up in arguably the richest, most abundant, safest period in world history, in the safest country in the world.
So it's like, who alive has had to deal with anything truly catastrophic?
Like we don't, I don't know, you know?
And so like the idea that this could happen is just not, it's not in the living memory of anybody.
tim pool
Yeah, we've had a golden age of sorts.
At least from our perspective, the security's been fat and happy.
I know we've had problems.
I know there's been a recession.
I know there's been 9-11, things like that.
tucker max
Come on, man.
We've been fat as a culture and as a country.
We've been as fat and happy as it gets.
tim pool
And growing fatter by the day.
You know where body positivity comes from?
Yeah, of course.
It's because too many people... Because everyone's fat.
So they're all now agreeing with each other that we're okay to do this.
Well, this looks good, yeah.
Exactly.
tucker max
Okay, go ahead.
See how that works for you.
tim pool
They've got that store that... Morbid?
Morbid?
unidentified
Torrid?
hannah claire brimelow
Oh, yeah, Torrid.
tim pool
No, I call it Morbid on purpose.
tucker max
I was gonna say, do they really call it Morbid?
tim pool
It's called Torrid.
I call it Morbid.
Close enough.
hannah claire brimelow
Tim's gonna buy it, call it that, and be like, still shop there, see what happens.
tim pool
No, I was thinking of opening a store and calling it Morbid.
And it would just be like, huge clothes.
unidentified
Chonkers?
tim pool
Chonkers.
But that's a meme, so that's okay, right?
But that's America.
That's America.
So I guess my question, my next question is like, how many days until people are eating each other in New York?
Like the tunnels are closed and they're banging on the door and they can't get out?
There's no food?
tucker max
There is... I can't remember.
I read a book about survival that had like a chart.
I think it's under... It's way faster than I thought.
It's under two weeks.
I can't remember the exact... Three days?
No.
Not three days they started to eat each other.
That's a pretty big taboo to cross.
That would have to be, I think that's in week two, but not by the end of week two.
tim pool
That's why I don't, I feel like week two, I mean, you can go a month without food, right?
tucker max
Most people can't.
unidentified
When your muscles start breaking down, you're just... And there's going to be so much panic.
hannah claire brimelow
People are going to feel the desperation sooner than if they were intentionally.
tim pool
You know what would happen, though?
I bet the first person to get eaten, it's not going to be like some dude just goes, I'm sorry, I'm hungry, and like hits somebody.
It's going to be like somebody falls down and gets trampled and then they're like, well, let's eat.
Yeah, let's eat.
tucker max
It's like Lord of the Rings.
Meat's on the menu, boys.
tim pool
It's nightmarish to think about this stuff.
That's why we got like 50 chickens.
tucker max
No, that's why I have two cows and a flock of sheep, 24 sheep and chickens.
tim pool
I was reading about bugs.
And what is the protein called?
Chittin?
Is that what it's called?
tucker max
I don't know.
I'm not going to eat the bugs, Tim.
ian crossland
That's their carapace.
It's made of that stuff.
tim pool
Yeah.
I was reading you can't digest it.
It's like chitin or whatever.
Yeah.
You can't digest it.
And so that's why you let the chickens eat it.
unidentified
Yes.
tucker max
And then you eat the chickens.
Or the eggs.
tim pool
You eat the eggs, and then one time comes, you eat the chicken.
unidentified
Yeah.
tim pool
And then, it's amazing.
Here's the best part.
Chickens, they make more of themselves.
tucker max
Yes, yes.
unidentified
It's crazy.
tucker max
They replicate.
tim pool
They replicate, and then they just eat the grass, and you just gotta make sure nothing else eats them, and then you get to eat them.
unidentified
Yep.
tim pool
And they taste good.
unidentified
Yep.
ian crossland
You were talking about, like, how our society doesn't have a story right now.
Yeah.
I'm kind of obsessive about talking about new technology, like, You know, graphing industry and iron fertilization of the oceans, regrowing the coral reefs and things like that.
tucker max
Yeah.
ian crossland
Sometimes it's really about how you introduce the ideas, because like if we're in the moment of all like blackmailing each other, like what we did.
tucker max
It's not tech.
I promise you that's not the story.
Tech might be amazing and it might help us in a million ways, but the general feeling from most people is that that God has failed.
ian crossland
Then the other idea is monotheism and God and the unification of the consciousness, but I almost feel like I'm selling out when I do that.
tucker max
Yeah, you know, there's something to be said for that, man.
I've been an atheist my whole life, and then I did psychedelic medicine as a therapy, and I was like, oh shit, I'm totally wrong.
Of course God exists, it's just not in the way that religious dogma talks about it.
It's more of an all things whatever.
That might be, but that story might be a little airy-fairy for at least right now.
I think generally, revivals generally happen after people have suffered a lot.
We're going into the suffering phase, not the revival phase.
tim pool
2028 should be fun though.
Six more years.
I'll be in my 40s.
tucker max
I don't know.
I think we got at least a decade.
There's a lot of unraveling to happen.
tim pool
I kind of, what's the worst case scenario for someone who lives out in the middle of nowhere?
ian crossland
Asteroid strike.
tim pool
No, no, I mean like with society collapsing.
No, no, no, hold on, hold on.
I'm not going to invoke a meteor strike.
tucker max
This is really important.
Living out in the middle of nowhere by yourself, you're actually not, you're better off than in a city.
Not a great spot.
Being in the country with a community, that's the better spot.
Way off by yourself, you're actually an easy target.
And you don't have anyone around to help, you know?
Whereas if it's like us and like eight neighbors or you kind of know your neighbors, that's a different situation.
Build a fortress around your... Doesn't necessarily have to have a fortress.
Like it doesn't have to be a castle, right?
You just have to kind of know.
tim pool
Dude, I joke about like one day we'll be hanging out, we'll be doing the show and we'll hear like a noise and then we'll like run outside and there'll be some hipster guy in like flannel with a beanie on and a handlebar mustache trying to steal a chicken and he's like, I'm just hungry!
And we're like, stop him!
Chase him down.
He fled Brooklyn.
tucker max
Dude, in Texas, you paint your fence posts purple and you put no trespassing sign because that's basically the, you know, if you come on land, we're going to shoot you.
tim pool
Purple?
tucker max
Yeah, purple.
tim pool
That's like the color for the purple heart.
unidentified
Why is that?
tucker max
I don't know.
They just picked that.
That's the color.
That's deoxygenated blood.
No, dude.
One of the weird things about Texas, like animal wrestling, you just shoot.
If you have animals in a field and you've posted and whatever and someone's in there, you can shoot them in the back.
It doesn't matter.
You're not going to prison.
You don't steal animals in Texas.
You get shot.
It's bad.
tim pool
Yeah, I'm sure those laws go way back.
ian crossland
Yeah.
Do you think that I, that we, cause I think we are building the story for the future right now.
Maybe nothing we say today is going to cause it to change tomorrow, but in a 20 years when people are like, I've had enough, they'll look at this video and that will be what inspires them.
unidentified
Right.
ian crossland
What do you think?
Like psychedelics, God, consciousness.
tucker max
Psychedelics are just a tool.
I'm not, like, I like psychedelics, I use them as medicine, like, they've been transformative for me, but I'm not like, you know, uh, bless his heart, like, I love Aubrey Marcus, but I'm not like, oh, you gotta, everyone's gotta do ayahuasca!
No, everyone doesn't, you know, like, they're just a tool to achieve a goal, they're not the thing.
Like, imagine if I was super into hammers, like, what, what, why?
But if I'm like, I want to build a lot of houses for people to live in, you're like, oh, okay, that makes sense.
So I just look at psychedelics as the hammer, right?
tim pool
I kind of, I've always kind of felt that there's a lot of people who really need some kind of hammer experience.
Hammer, as one way to put it, because I don't want to.
tucker max
Hammers are important.
tim pool
But, but, but I don't want to, I don't mean just like one thing like DMT or something like that.
But I think a lot of people are like locked in their minds.
They can't, they can't see outside the box.
ian crossland
It really shocked me awake with the first time I took mushrooms.
I was walking around Manhattan Beach and looking at it was trash night.
And I was like, where does this trash go?
What have we done as a species?
tucker max
You needed mushrooms?
ian crossland
Yeah, we're just like, no, that's the point.
It changed my core, like it changed my DNA and the way I was perceiving it.
tim pool
This is exactly what I mean.
For me, I remember I would talk to my friends and they would start asking these crazy philosophical questions or when they were stoned or something and I was like, I don't need whatever it is you're doing to ask these questions, but clearly you do.
Maybe there are some people who are like mindless cogs, but then they have an experience, like Ian was saying, and all of a sudden they start asking themselves, where's that garbage going?
Then they realize, hey, wait a minute, probably not somewhere good.
ian crossland
Just like so many problems, they're just put in on an island and waiting for it to go away.
tim pool
They put on a garbage barge, kick it out, and forget about it.
ian crossland
Of course, now we find there's mushrooms and bacteria that'll digest it and turn it into sugar.
There's lots of cool stuff.
hannah claire brimelow
I think some of it is with substances.
It takes away the inhibition.
People may think about these things on some level, but they don't want to ask because they don't want to be the only one.
unidentified
They want to blend in and not... But Ian asked himself.
hannah claire brimelow
Right, but you were saying your friends are posing these questions to you while you're hanging out.
ian crossland
There's like a desensitization without the psychedelics, like right now you're kind of blending into the wall.
I see like the scene, but when I'm on psilocybin, you stand out.
Life is very different than non-life.
It becomes very apparent that we have created this thing or someone before me built this freaking set that we're on.
tim pool
And now you just wake up one day and you're here.
And you're like, look at all this stuff that exists.
ian crossland
It creates a value for life, I think.
At least psilocybin did for me.
tim pool
I think a big problem, one of the big problems we've had is that millennials, and to an extent every generation before it, but growing in scale, don't understand that other people did work to make things exist that you have.
So, like, for example, I remember I was riding my bike across the Williamsburg Bridge in New York, and I just thought to myself, like, man, Some people worked really, really hard to make this bridge happen.
And I don't think twice when I ride my bike over it.
I don't pay for it.
I have no idea.
I mean, I got city taxes cover the costs, but it's just there.
Well, one day there was some dude or some lady and they were just like, yo, we need a bridge.
And then all of these humans were like, let's work really, really hard and sweat and tears.
And probably a lot of people died in the construction.
And now all these people are just like, what do you mean?
The bridge is just there.
And it's like, you don't understand the value of what was gifted to you.
And the thing about the bridge is you could be a tourist and you get free use of it.
Like you're not paying anything for this.
It's just there and you get it.
I think that is like the generational wealth of Millennials and now Gen Z. They don't understand how much blood, sweat, and tears went into making the world so comfortable.
tucker max
I don't think any young people do.
I didn't understand when I was 25.
I'm not sure if it's that generation specifically.
I'm more Gen X, I guess.
And, like, how's a fucking idiot 25?
What the hell did I know?
Yeah, right.
And I know my parents were, because they're still idiots.
In their 70s, right?
So, like, yeah.
ian crossland
Have you taken ayahuasca?
tucker max
No.
ian crossland
Yeah, I'd love it if my parents took ayahuasca.
tim pool
We need people to get access to their ancestral knowledge.
ian crossland
This is what I'm talking about.
You mentioned earlier you don't think the technology is the story, but, like, In the past the story was told through new technology like the printing press allowed us to proliferate the story or writing allowed us to proliferate the idea of God to the masses so maybe that the metaverse or that the internet is the vessel that the story will be told.
tucker max
So the post-World War II story in America was that progress solves all and progress is the goal.
Where has that gotten us?
ian crossland
Modern monetary theory.
unidentified
What is progress?
tucker max
The story coming out of World War II was that progress, the American story is a story of progress, right?
It's just progress.
But like, it's like the concept of growth for the sake of growth
is the philosophy of cancer, right?
Progress just to make progress because it's technological progress is serving a different God.
It is not serving humans, right?
Whereas like I would contrast that to Like, an idea that could, and I mean a meta-idea that could replace that would be prosperity.
What does prosperity for humans look like?
Because it does not always, in fact, rarely does it mean more technology.
In fact, more technology is usually antithetical to prosperity for humans.
It might be great for owners.
God, I sound like a goddamn Marxist right now.
And I'm not at all.
I really am not.
I can't stand the Marxists.
ian crossland
Interesting philosophy.
tucker max
But honestly, if there was one thing Karl Marx got right, it was at least the beginning of a critique of understanding that there is a relationship between a human and the value they create that matters that's not captured in the normal way you calculate capital, right?
What is wrong with your show?
You're getting me to defend the system at Marks.
I'm going crazy.
I know.
This is nuts.
I'm a big believer now in the way to measure anything is how does this benefit humans?
Humans, not stakeholder capitalism.
And that's all nonsense.
That's all a scam to screw people.
But like, how am I better?
How is my neighbors better?
How's my family better?
How are my kids better?
How are my animals better?
Right?
And like, I like technology when it serves humans and prosperity, but like...
A lot of it doesn't, man.
hannah claire brimelow
Can I ask a question?
Sorry to interrupt.
How does this prosperity doctrine fit in with like your past?
Because I feel like in some ways you had a very different mindset when you were 20s when you were like the pickup artist and you were like... Don't you ever... You can call me anything but not pickup artist.
tucker max
Do you want to call me a scientist?
I actually would not be upset if you called me a Marxist based on what I just said because I kind of sound like one.
But not pickup artist.
hannah claire brimelow
That's... Sorry, what's the technical term for the industry that you were sort of the head of?
tucker max
I was a writer.
hannah claire brimelow
Uh-huh.
tucker max
Yes.
hannah claire brimelow
That's what we're gonna call it?
ian crossland
Oh, were you teaching people how to hook up?
tucker max
No.
No, I never did that.
hannah claire brimelow
Sorry, he was writing?
unidentified
No.
tucker max
No, no, no.
Don't put me... Look, I like Neil Strauss.
I know him and that crew.
I was never one of them.
I was never in that world.
I wrote... If you want to put me in a category... The New York Times said I invented my own literary genre, which, like, it's the New York Times, so whatever.
But, like, you don't put me in a category.
Put, like, Bukowski or Hunter S. Thompson or that sort of stuff.
No.
Like, writing about women is not, like, that has a long history.
hannah claire brimelow
Yeah, I get that.
But what I'm saying is your books, and I'm not critiquing you at all.
Like, it's just part of your story.
tucker max
No, no, no.
You can critique me.
Just don't call me a pick up artist.
That's a different thing.
hannah claire brimelow
What is the word?
You're a writer who specialized in a very specific... Writing about my life.
tucker max
Writing about your life, which had a lot to do with I was like a 20-something year old dude who got drunk and hooked up and act like an idiot.
hannah claire brimelow
And now you're someone who's saying, and I think it's cool, but we need to think about how we are affecting the humans around us, how we're affecting change, how we're affecting humanity.
Where did you come from?
How did this transition happen for you?
tucker max
That's a very different question than how did you go from pick-up artist to this.
Honestly, it's a great question though.
It really is.
Look, I could say it's simple as well.
I grew up and matured, but it's more than that.
Honestly, I had to do my emotional work.
I had to face all the stuff I didn't want to face, all my trauma, all my issues, all the baggage that we all carry around.
I carry around just as much as anyone.
And I can just carry it around if I want, and that's what most people do.
But at some point I realized, and it was actually after a lot of success, way more success than I thought I needed to be happy.
And I was like 10% happier, right?
It's way better to be rich than to be poor.
Like, it's much nicer.
But it's like only that much better.
And I was like, well, okay.
And so I fixed everything in my life externally, and I was still unhappy.
I'm like, the only thing left is me.
That's it.
That was not an easy pill to swallow.
That was into my mid-30s.
I started therapy.
Therapy was a talk therapy.
It's like a serious in-depth psychoanalysis.
It was fine.
It was good.
It helped me a lot.
But it didn't really connect me to myself and my emotions.
There's a lot of ways to do that.
For me, the thing that cracked me open was MDMA therapy.
Like, that was just mind-blowing to me.
And that was when I was like, oh my god, I can feel love and sadness.
And then that's like I started about four years ago and that's really what I kind of knew all this intellectually, and I believed it, but I didn't get it, really, until I started to connect with myself.
And once you connect with yourself, then you connect with nature.
And that's when I was like, Oh, like, of course, God exists.
And I'm like, literally, I'll never forget, I did a session with MDMA and LSD.
And like, I had the experience of like, it sounds crazy if you've never done Psychedelics, but like the experience, I didn't talk to God, but the experience of God, and I remember I called my friend who's Mormon, and I'm like, dude, I thought you were just an idiot who was fooled.
And he's like, no, I'm like, I get it now.
God is an experience.
You're not actually, he's like, yes!
And I'm like, ah, fuck, dude, I'm so sorry.
I just thought you were stupid.
Really?
And I'm like, which a lot of religious people can be like, there's, oh, I'm gonna believe this because my mom said so.
But he's like one of those who really like has a relation, what he calls a relationship with God.
And I understand what it means now, right?
I don't frame it the way he does, but I get it.
And so once you start walking down that path, then I think, There's two ways.
There's multiple ways to go down that path.
A lot of what I'm saying, you can get kooky ESG clowns who are like, we need to kill a bunch of humans to save the planet.
No, I am not on that path.
But once you start connecting to yourself and you connect everything around you, I think it just... I don't think anything I'm saying is all that revolutionary.
It's just like, oh, of course.
You know, this just feels right.
This seems right.
This connects with what I have experienced, right?
I don't know.
unidentified
Am I rambling or does this make sense?
tucker max
Short answer is MDMA.
It has been the most important thing I've ever done in my life.
ian crossland
It's incredible.
tucker max
Number one.
ian crossland
Incredible substance.
I've never used it in a therapy session, but they do that for soldiers that have returned that are suffering PTSD and things like that.
tucker max
Yeah.
No, right now it's in stage three clinical trials to be legalized in 2023.
So it's not legal.
Like I had to find underground guides and all that.
I mean, you can do it on your own.
I like to have a guide and whatever, but they don't really do much.
They're just kind of there.
I've probably done 15 sessions in the last four years, and it is the most important thing I've ever done in my life.
And I'm married.
And I have four kids.
And people are like, not your kids and your wife?
I'm like, I wouldn't be married and I'd be a terrible father.
Like if I had not found this.
unidentified
Seriously.
tucker max
Like truly.
ian crossland
It's amazing when you cry.
Being able to cry.
tucker max
Dude, the first time I ever felt love, really, I thought I felt love.
I was married with two kids when I first did MDMA therapy.
And almost as soon as it really hit, I'm like, oh my god, I had never felt... nothing remotely that deep ever in my life until I did that.
I didn't realize how traumatized and how emotionally constipated I was, you know?
And I had no idea.
I had no idea.
And then as I got deeper, man, Man, I got into the grief.
God, that was about two, three, two and a half years in.
It was nothing but grief, man, for like a year.
It didn't matter what I did.
I had so much grief in me that I had to feel that I'd pushed away my whole life.
I just wouldn't feel.
ian crossland
How did you stay sane between sessions while you were processing?
tucker max
That's a great question.
I had some really, really good mentors around who had walked this path decades before and kind of knew and helped me, but it's basically called integration, right?
So, you know, I had a talk therapist, a different one from before, you know, and I actually had to really learn self-care, truly, deep, like, okay, I can't be working 15 hours a day anymore.
I can't this, I can't that's not going to work.
And so, journaling every day, which I've been doing for a while anyway, but I got serious about it.
You know, like got very serious about nutrition, very serious about sleep, all this sort of stuff.
And I, I mean, I changed.
It's crazy for me to think about what I was like, even six or seven years ago, but especially like 10 or 15 years ago.
In a lot of ways, I was the same person, but it's almost like I don't even know that dude from 15 years ago.
I almost just feel sad for him.
ian crossland
Do you ever want to change your name?
tucker max
No, not at all.
No, no.
I don't mean this in a way like repudiate my past or I was a bad person.
No, I did some terrible stuff I shouldn't have done.
But I don't mean it like that.
I just mean I don't have any connection to that dude.
ian crossland
So your diet, you were talking earlier that you source most of your meat from your farm and a lot of stuff locally.
What did it used to be?
What did you change?
tucker max
I've been eating healthy for about 15 years, meaning kind of like a paleo-ancestral diet, not a lot of carbs, no seed oils.
I knew that, but it was like, oh yeah, I go to Whole Foods, that chicken's got to be healthy.
Man, have you seen how chickens are raised and he doesn't?
Well, I'm sure you get that.
ian crossland
It's horrible, right?
tim pool
They don't even walk, they get stuffed in cages.
tucker max
Oh, dude, it's the worst.
And so, like, once you kind of understand that, it's like, okay, you eat what the animals eat, right?
So, if they're, even if they're healthy chickens, organic, and they're raised in these horrible, you know, massive pens where they, you know, they don't walk on the ground, they walk on dead chickens or whatever.
It's like, that's terrible.
That's unhealthy.
tim pool
We got farms all over the place out here.
You drive five minutes, you get fresh farm tenderloins, you get fresh eggs, fresh butter.
Man, we've been cooking with real farm butter.
It's amazing.
You can't compare it.
So we've got salted and unsalted and you taste it and you're like, what is this?
And then you take the store bought butter and you're like, this is not food.
tucker max
No, it's not.
tim pool
It really is crazy.
tucker max
It's actually not in a lot of cases.
ian crossland
Yeah, it was interesting.
You were talking about like the story of our time.
And it sounds like it's kind of a personal thing for the individual needs to realize their own story.
Like what you did with MDMA therapy and talk therapy basically was the talking the MDMA is the tool that you use during the talking.
tucker max
Well, one's about the intellect and one's about the emotions.
You gotta go both.
Like, you can't just do... I know plenty of people who've done a ton of emotional work but are flighty as hell and have dumb ideas in their head, right?
And then I know plenty of people who've thought their way as far as they can but won't feel anything, right?
Both are important.
Both are relevant.
And you can't just do one.
You know, like if you want to be balanced and kind of whole, you kind of have to, you have to feel and think.
That's why we got different parts of our brain.
It's not just one or the other.
ian crossland
When you like come up on a situation that makes you want to cry or that makes you want to like, what, at what point do you stop yourself from crying?
And at what point do you let yourself cry?
tucker max
I try not to stop myself.
I mean, unless like it's inappropriate or weird or I'm at like some, I don't know.
hannah claire brimelow
You don't want to cry right now?
tucker max
If you guys gave me a reason to cry, I would cry.
I'm not sure what it would be.
I'm sure we could talk about something.
I don't really worry about that anymore.
I've never been worried about, well, what does someone else think about my emotion?
That's never been a problem for me.
For me, it's been feeling the emotion.
I didn't have that bad of a childhood in certain ways, like no one sexually abused me or beat me or thank god, none of that.
I just had narcissistic parents who didn't care about me and I was essentially abandoned as a kid.
You know, not literally, like I had food and shelter, but like emotionally, there was no one there for me.
It's called relational trauma.
That sort of a relational trauma is actually, it's hard to understand because there's not a great narrative around it and most people don't understand.
The closest person I've ever heard who understood was someone who actually helped, they were in Romania after the fall of the wall and there were all these abandoned kids and they worked in orphanage there and they would tell me like, The Romanian orphanages are crazy.
Right, so my life wasn't that bad.
But imagine like someone like that who had parents and were there but still kind of ignored you.
So it's like on the scale of relational trauma they're like a 10 and I'm like a 5, right?
But it's still anywhere on that scale is not good.
And so like, just accepting that, right?
That, okay, I wasn't sexually abused or physically abused.
I've never been to war.
You know, no one's raped me.
Most people think of trauma as some horrible physical event, and that is trauma.
But that's not the only type of trauma, and that's not the only way to have deep emotional impacts from things, you know?
And it's not like... Dude, some people will do this and like all kinds of repressed trauma will come up.
Like, oh my dad or my stepdad raped me and I pushed... That happens all the time.
None of that happened with me.
Like, I knew exactly what happened to me.
It was just like I had never felt any of my grief from my mom never spending any time with me.
Like, I just pushed that away.
Because when you're four, it's overwhelming.
You know, but now when you're 40 and you're taking MDMA and you're laying on this sofa and you know New York wherever and like it comes up and it's like oh and you like safe and whatever you can feel it then you feel it you know but then it's like it's like you're free now.
hannah claire brimelow
Does this impact how you parent I'm assuming?
Do you make different choices?
tucker max
In fact, if you want me to start crying, if I think about what I was like as a parent seven years ago with my first bishop, my oldest, who just turned eight, versus now.
On the scale of parents, I was a very good parent compared to most parents seven years ago.
I am a fundamentally different parent now.
I'm a hundred times better.
I'm so much more present, more emotionally connected, more attached.
I meet my children's needs so much better.
tim pool
You got them learning like Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu.
tucker max
He does go to Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, actually.
My eight-year-old does, yeah.
tim pool
Oh, yeah, yeah.
tucker max
That's a good idea.
But, okay, funny you bring that up, when he was four, I pushed him into it,
because I'm big into that, I really want, and he liked it, but he kind of didn't really want it,
and I was pushing a little too hard, and I just was wise enough to realize,
all right, I'm pushing him, I'm not gonna do that.
And so then I backed off and he quit.
Okay, I was disappointed, which is silly, because it's his life, not mine.
And I stopped.
I let go of all that.
And then two years, three years later, he's like, Dad, I want to start going again.
tim pool
You know what kids need for this stuff?
They need to have other kids around them.
tucker max
Yeah.
tim pool
So the issue is when you bring your kids, say like Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, and it's a bunch of adults.
tucker max
Yeah.
And he went to kids classes.
tim pool
So, all right, well, typically what I find... I think I was just pushing him.
tucker max
Like, he was... Pushing him too hard?
Yeah, he didn't want me looming over him.
tim pool
Right.
tucker max
You know?
tim pool
He wanted to hang out with their friends.
That's kind of the point I was getting to.
unidentified
Right.
tim pool
So, like, I've had friends who, one example is skateboarding.
A friend of mine said they wanted to skate, got a skateboard, and then eventually didn't want to do it anymore, but their parents were like, you have to.
We bought you a board, you're using it!
But then, when you have all of these other skateboarders all cheering you on, and then you have your own group of friends, all of a sudden you're like, this is my community, you get into it.
And so, you know.
tucker max
Yeah, but there's also, I think, an intrinsic versus extrinsic, right?
And so, my son's pretty independent, and thankfully.
And I was pushing him, and I think he was naturally rebelling against that, and so when I stopped pushing and let go, then he was able to find it on his own, and his own desire for it, as opposed to mine.
ian crossland
So pushing a little is probably a good thing, just so he knows... Introducing is a good thing.
tucker max
Pushing is different.
tim pool
And you also should have him play Magic the Gathering.
tucker max
100%.
Well, make him a good poker player.
tim pool
Exactly.
ian crossland
And mathematician.
tim pool
So a lot of people don't understand Magic the Gathering is chess and poker combined, and a lot of the top Magic players were actually top poker players.
There's a famous quote from one of these guys, and they said, you play Magic the Gathering and poker, is being a top poker player harder?
And he's like, one game has 13,000 cards you're trying to guess.
Yeah, right.
to. He's like, so, you know, poker is a bit easier for us.
But it was a good point. And I remember when I was younger trying to explain it to people. People often hear Magic the
Gathering and they assume you dress like a wizard. And then you're like, well. Like Dungeons and Dragons. Yeah, it's
like you go to a local game shop and there's like, you know, I would be skateboarding and then afterwards I'd go to the
game shop There'd be comics, there'd be art.
We'd play Marvel vs. Capcom.
And then people would play, you know, Magic or whatever.
And none of these people were into D&D.
Not a single one played D&D.
It was just like... Really?
tucker max
There's no overlap between those two communities?
tim pool
There probably is.
I assume there is.
tucker max
Oh yeah, right.
tim pool
But at my comic shop, there was none.
There was no D&D.
tucker max
Oh, wow.
tim pool
It was comic books.
It was Marvel.
It was, you know...
Playing arcades, it was skateboarding.
It was just like another thing where we were tired, where bodies were racked.
I just started out a backside tailslide.
It's like, let's just draft or something so we can sit down and still do something.
And so then you're getting strategic development after your physical development.
tucker max
Yeah.
No, it makes sense.
unidentified
Yeah.
ian crossland
Now the same company owns Dungeons and Dragons and Magic.
The same company owns them both.
So you might start to see overlap, but it's like completely different.
One's like, do you ever play D&D?
It's like an acting exercise, basically.
And the other game is like a math exercise.
tim pool
We really got to do that modern political war game thing that the Clintons, or was it Clinton?
It was like Podesta did.
Do you hear about that?
In 2020, they basically played D&D, but it was like modern politics.
And then, like, one of the Democrats was like, if Trump wins, we're seceding from the Union, and, like, they would roll die to see what would happen.
tucker max
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
tim pool
That would be funny.
We really gotta do that.
We could film it.
It'd be hilarious.
tucker max
That would be funny.
You get a bunch of people in who are super into that, that could be fun.
tim pool
Look, Ian, you're Hillary.
You're running in 2024.
ian crossland
Alright.
tim pool
Let's go!
What do you say?
Roll to see if you get the votes.
ian crossland
Yeah, roll to see if people actually like you this time.
tim pool
No, no, no, you don't, well, you do your base stats, but like, I'm pretty sure her charisma would be like minus, yeah, it'd be like a minus one.
ian crossland
Oh, Hillary.
tim pool
It goes down.
ian crossland
It wasn't always that bad.
tim pool
What would Trump have in terms of like, you know, charisma?
ian crossland
15 or 16.
tim pool
Really high.
tucker max
Very high.
tim pool
Yeah, very high.
ian crossland
But his intelligence would be lower.
He's got more charisma than intelligence.
tucker max
Intelligence would be high too.
What's like a negative?
ian crossland
Wisdom.
He'd have low wisdom.
tucker max
Yeah, a negative charisma.
ian crossland
Because he pisses people off with his statements.
tim pool
We gotta do this.
ian crossland
They're like, why did he say that?
He's like, I don't even know why I said that.
Because of my low wisdom.
You're right, he isn't.
He is very intelligent.
tim pool
He's a calculating guy.
Yeah, this would be hilarious.
Map out.
We should literally do it.
We should do it live.
War game out what 2024 would look like based on modern politics today to see what it would be.
I love this.
tucker max
This is great.
There's all kinds of wild cards too.
tim pool
We would do a primary and then you gotta roll to see if you get the votes or something.
ian crossland
I'm liking Rhonda Santos more and more.
Hey, did you guys see Carrie Lake won?
She won every county.
tucker max
She was great.
I was in favor of her when she called out that CNN woman.
She's obviously amazing.
ian crossland
She's accessible, at least to me so far.
I've been on the show, we interviewed her twice, and we talked about a local voting app that you could use.
where like you could set your slider for like, I wanna put 7% of my taxes towards this local thing, 4% towards this, and it'd be like a Tinder app kind of where you could, I could say like, okay, hey everyone, I wanna put a fountain on Main Street.
And then if people are going through the app, they see it, they swipe right, it goes into their little slide bar thing, and then they can allocate like 2% of their taxes to the thing.
And she loved the idea.
That's, I think, it's really like, things are becoming very real with the governors.
tucker max
That's an example of technology that could be amazing.
That's very cool, yeah.
ian crossland
You into the convention of states?
I keep hearing it get tossed around.
tucker max
I mean, I don't know, like, I don't, it wouldn't shock, there's almost nothing you could tell me about the future of America that would shock me now, like a complete chaotic civil war, a federalist, you know, kind of quasi-breakup but not really, I don't know, something.
tim pool
Woke communist gulags?
tucker max
Of course that wouldn't shock me.
They already have those in Australia.
ian crossland
Yeah.
I was saying yesterday that it seems like all the cultures on earth now have come together and they're all forcing each other on themselves.
And so that's this chaos.
It's not like an accident or like, oops, we fucked up.
It's like, no, this is like, this is what happens when you blend all the cultures.
tim pool
He got Ian swearing.
ian crossland
Yeah, I'm back to my old self.
tucker max
Nothing would make me happier than just like local rule for everyone.
You know, like, okay, you take care of yourself.
We'll take care of ourselves.
Let's just like, I got no problem.
You want to inject hormones into your kids and eat each other?
Okay, cool.
Go to New York.
That's why they do that.
tim pool
Except they want rules over you.
tucker max
Oh, of course.
unidentified
Right.
tucker max
No, I get that.
ian crossland
And we got to mediate the atmosphere and the rivers and the oceans.
tucker max
Well, that's the control thing.
That's like, okay, if I can find a lever of control where you are responsible for something I want, I'm convinced.
I've been skeptical of climate stuff for a long time for two reasons.
One is because the people who are pushing it are always the same people who are pushing whatever authoritarian bullshit that comes up, right?
So it's never like, so someone I'm like, okay, well this person's really smart and they know their stuff.
It's always like, you know, Al Gore, right?
Who's like, it's that type.
But then the other thing is, it's like, hold on a minute.
You want to make me responsible for something that you get you can't really measure you can't attribute to me But it's gonna have to fundamentally alter my behavior and my output, but you get to decide what that is and No, that's not going to work.
Right?
And like, whenever someone's like, you know, trying to make other people responsible for something and it means they get to control them, that's the reddest of red flags.
Even if, like, yeah, I mean, you can look at the data.
It's gotten hotter in most parts of the world last couple of years or whatever, et cetera, et cetera.
Like, even if there's some truth to it.
ian crossland
The more tangible example would be like poisoning the waterway inadvertently upriver, like dumping chemicals in and then the other community that you're not related to.
tucker max
That's measurable.
Like, you could be like, okay, you dumped DDT up here, all these fish died, like, okay, like, you can figure that out, you know?
Like, that's like, that's tort law can handle that, you know?
unidentified
You are a lawyer after all, before you said... No, no, no.
tucker max
I did not take the bar.
tim pool
Let's go to, we're gonna go to Super Chats.
unidentified
Okay.
tim pool
If you haven't already, would you kindly smash that like button, subscribe to this channel, and share the show with your friends.
And head over to TimCast.com, become a member to check out our new shows, Tales from the Inverted World, a new episode Sundays at 10 a.m.
The next episode is really amazing.
It's what got me thinking about the Great Filter and the apocalypse and stuff.
But this is Shane Cashman exploring the mystery of the lost Confederate gold.
There's a bunch of weird stuff in there, death threats, someone threatened to kill him.
But also the uncensored TimCats show, which are Monday through Thursday at 11 p.m.
So we got a full, we got four of those up for you right now from this week.
But let's read these superchats!
All right, let's jump over and see if I can read this.
It's a lot harder to read because YouTube crashed out on us again.
So I'm gonna, I'm gonna try and read.
I have to, like, lean forward.
All right.
Let's see.
Oh, actually we can't read them.
That's amazing.
Oh, okay.
We can read some.
Cade Schreiner.
First super chat ever.
I just wanted to say one thing.
Love y'all.
Guy Ian is the best though.
ian crossland
Well, hey, we're all equal.
Nah, you know, I'm just doing what I do.
unidentified
Hey dude.
hannah claire brimelow
Ian's like, I am the best.
Thank you for noticing.
ian crossland
I'm the best at what I do.
hannah claire brimelow
It's a very diplomatic answer.
tim pool
All right, Scott Wood says, thank you for the heads up on food shortages, gas shortages.
I got 70 gallons of gas on hand, never paid over $4 a gallon, freezer full of food.
What do you do when you stock up on gas?
tucker max
Well, gas depreciates quickly.
He's got to cycle that stuff through.
Diesel lasts about a year.
Gas won't usually last more than three months or six months.
ian crossland
Because of evaporation?
tucker max
No, no, because the way it's processed, like propane will last essentially, kerosene lasts forever effectively, diesel I think is about a year to 18 months, and I think gas has to turn over quick.
ian crossland
Oh, so you can cycle it without destroying it?
tucker max
No, no, you've got to use it.
Like it won't last.
I think there might be additives you can put in, but I don't think they extend it beyond six months.
tim pool
Raymond G Stanley jr.
Says Tim seeing death in real life is exactly why veterans are some of the biggest adversaries of war Once you see life drain from someone's eyes you get it.
Yep Yeah, when I saw that video today of the guy in the store, it just brought like memories back and feelings man, and I always I always say like I'm not like a war- I'm not like a soldier or anything, I didn't do any of that stuff, but I've been places where people have died and I've- I remember the first time I saw someone die and the feeling I got was something I had never experienced in 27 years of life.
Seeing it actually happen was just- it was like, I don't know, it felt like getting- having like, just water submerge my brain like it was a- like a- And then there's like this gut-wrenching feeling like someone was squeezing my heart.
And I watched them carry that body off the street.
It's crazy, man.
tucker max
Yeah.
tim pool
And watching the stuff earlier today, I'm just, man, the crime that's skyrocketing, these woke Soros-backed DAs, Soros writes an op-ed saying he's doubling down on all of this.
We're watching people get slashed in the street.
There was a guy just in New York, I think it was today, he was going around, or the other day he was just punching people in the face.
It's just it's absolutely bonkers.
hannah claire brimelow
Violent crime is up all over the country.
And it's been on the rise since COVID probably before that.
tim pool
And then you start seeing these stories like The shop owner who fires a shotgun at the dude with the rifle and it's like, man, this is not going in a good way.
And people are going to get a rude awakening when they like, there's so many people that think they want to live in like a zombie apocalypse horror movie and they think it'd be fun and exciting.
tucker max
No.
tim pool
And then they're sitting there shaking with more stress they've ever experienced in their lives.
And they're throwing up just because of the anxiety.
It's crazy days, man.
All right.
We'll grab some more Super Chats.
Alex Maggiore?
Magri?
I see the 4pm story becoming the new norm.
People are tired of the lawlessness, and it's going to result in vigilantism, frontier justice, and maybe mafia-like protection rackets.
tucker max
Yes.
Yes.
Do you see what Brazil did?
They have a huge problem with guys on motorcycles robbing cars and they legalized like you can run over those motor and like there's all kinds of videos now coming out.
unidentified
Just mowing people down with their cars.
Oh yeah!
ian crossland
Like people getting robbed and then a car just comes out of nowhere.
tucker max
Runs right over the bike.
Kills people.
I mean, they're killing robbers, but... Right.
tim pool
But the thing is, there's a point where it's someone robbing you for luxury.
That they just, they want.
Then there's also, like you mentioned, with Austin, with the winterpocalypse, people just have no, they're desperate.
And they're like, you or me.
But then you're gonna see people, like, when it's about luxuries, An armed population, an armed society is a polite society.
If there's some guy who's going to rob a store because he wants to come up on something, and he knows everyone's armed, he's going to think twice.
Somebody who's starving, they don't care.
tucker max
No, you're right.
tim pool
It's like I was telling the story where I saw a fox walking into our backyard.
It's like a yard, it's like a big open acreage of the forest.
But Bucko, Bocus, our cat, was sitting there like a moron, just in a loaf, and looks over at the fox that's slowly creeping up to him.
The fox was gaunt-looking.
I was surprised the fox came onto the property because we have dogs and humans, but this fox looked desperate, didn't care.
So I actually had to stop in the middle of recording, run out and start yelling, and the fox just looked at me and didn't care.
tucker max
He was that hungry?
tim pool
It looked gaunt.
So I had to just jump off and then run up, and then it ran off.
And then I had to yell at my cat, like, what are you doing, you moron?
He's gonna eat you!
hannah claire brimelow
He's still sitting this whole time!
The cat is just like, what?
tim pool
Yeah, and he just looks at me and just looks back and then doesn't move.
hannah claire brimelow
He's too comfortable here.
tim pool
But then I went over and I get back inside.
You moron.
We let him run around and do cat stuff because for the most part they're fine.
I know you can you run the risk of like coyotes and stuff like that, but...
We had a raccoon come on the property because they were getting desperate.
They were getting hungry or something.
And then when they're desperate, they don't care about the threats.
ian crossland
So time to like not wear jewelry out in public, not hold your phone up in front of you on the street in New York if you're walking down the street.
tucker max
Or just not be in New York.
ian crossland
Yeah.
tim pool
Alright, Tim Wolak says, been managing money for four years, for ultra-wealthy.
Trusts are not the best way to shelter money.
Irrevocable trusts give the money to someone else.
You can't be the giver and receiver of cash.
What does that mean?
tucker max
Well, he's right.
That's one type of trust is irrevocable.
Right.
So meaning like if I set up a trust for my son that's irrevocable, so it's gone to him fully, it just makes it more protected.
So I can't be like there's because sometimes you can pierce the veil with trust and like, you know, like in a lawsuit, depending on which trust it is irrevocables.
You can't can't do that.
tim pool
He's someone else's money.
tucker max
Yeah, it's not someone else's money.
Totally.
Right.
tim pool
But you gotta pay taxes on it?
tucker max
Well, you always have to.
There's nothing you're doing where you're not paying taxes.
tim pool
No, but I mean, like, let's say you make a hundred grand.
tucker max
I pay taxes.
Then it goes into the trust.
I don't think the other person has to pay taxes.
tim pool
Once they take the money out, they might have to, right?
tucker max
Uh, no.
I'm not sure.
I don't think so.
It depends.
Well, so it depends.
It depends how it's set up because I know like for kids, I think they're each allowed to get, there's a number, five or ten million from their parents, maybe five million apiece from parents that's tax-free and then after that it's like death tax where it's like 80% or whatever crazy amount and so like I think that if it's somebody else then I'm not sure how that would work.
tim pool
All right.
Jordan Z says, signed up for Timcast a few days ago.
Also, Tim, in response to the line from Fast and Furious, it was from Fast Five when they were in Brazil on that fort.
unidentified
Ah!
tim pool
Fast Five!
tucker max
You're slipping.
hannah claire brimelow
Fact checks are live here.
tim pool
The Fast and the Furious cinematic universe is the best cinematic universe.
hannah claire brimelow
This is the one where there's like ten of them?
tucker max
Hold on, the best for what?
tim pool
I'm just saying, like, race cars?
I mean, how many cinematic universes are there, too?
Marvel?
tucker max
Star Wars?
Lord of the Rings?
There's dozens.
hannah claire brimelow
This is the Vin Diesel one, right?
Vin Diesel where there's like... No, I'm completely opposed to this.
We talk about this on Pop Culture all the time.
It's the best.
No, it's too many.
Just stop.
I mean, it's just like explosion, pretend fake dialogue.
tim pool
They went into space!
hannah claire brimelow
Why would they go to space?
tim pool
Because they had to go to space.
What do you mean?
ian crossland
It was amazing.
tucker max
Ludicrous was in outer space.
tim pool
In a Fiero.
hannah claire brimelow
I'm okay with this being like a gender thing.
unidentified
Like, I maybe just don't get this, but like, this seems stupid to me.
tim pool
That's why it's awesome.
tucker max
It is stupid.
ian crossland
It was about race cars and like races for the first couple.
tim pool
Yeah.
ian crossland
And then it became about an action adventure movie where they were like, we've got to do something.
hannah claire brimelow
We better keep writing the script.
tim pool
No, it's on purpose.
Like they did the movie Hobbs and Shaw, and there's like Idris Elba's got superpowers.
And I'm like, yes!
Then the next movie, they go to outer space.
And I'm like, even better.
I hope, I swear, please, if you're listening to me, please, studio, the next movie, maybe the next one, because you're already working on it.
The one after that, I want there to be like a quantum explosion that gives them all superpowers.
Vin Diesel starts floating.
unidentified
No, no, no.
tucker max
They should be woke epidemiologists.
ian crossland
That's what I'm talking about.
They shrink one guy down, goes into the body of the other guy, and has to fight dudes and organs.
hannah claire brimelow
Like that blue cartoon character that did that?
That movie's already been made.
No, I oppose this vehemently.
Ten is too many, Tim.
tim pool
I want them to get superpowers.
And then like, you know, ludicrous characters.
tucker max
And then they fight the Marvel characters.
tim pool
No, no, no, they gotta make their own villains, you know?
And then, but then, it's just like all of a sudden you've got this cinematic universe, and then Jason Statham can teleport for some reason, and you know, The Rock can like, he gets super strength because he's The Rock.
Vin Diesel can fly.
ian crossland
That's organic superheroes.
That's how they're made, you know?
hannah claire brimelow
You have to talk to Brett about this.
When I told Brett, I was like opposed to this.
He was like, you don't understand.
They make so much money.
Like they can keep going forever.
But why?
Why would we do this?
tucker max
Because people pay.
ian crossland
And we did talk about creating culture and making new things as opposed to rehashing the same crappy Marvel characters.
So maybe that's what this universe has become or is becoming.
tim pool
It needs to.
tucker max
It's new crappy instead of old crappy.
hannah claire brimelow
No, no, no.
tucker max
I agree, it sucks.
ian crossland
But maybe change the name from Fast and Furious, because I still think of Cars and the first guy.
I mean, they call it Hobbs and Shaw.
It was Fast and Furious... Presents.
Presents Hobbs and Shaw.
tim pool
No, Superpowers.
They went to outer space.
They should eventually, like, they're in the multiverse.
Then you put Spider-Man in there for some reason, like you were saying.
ian crossland
Is it a Disney film?
Isn't that Stargate?
unidentified
Stargate.
ian crossland
I was just watching a clip from that earlier.
James Spader.
tim pool
We should do it.
We should totally do a bit somehow where it's like Fast and the Furious 57 and it's like Spider-Man's in it.
They go through a Stargate into the multiverse.
ian crossland
In a 57 Chevy.
tim pool
To fight Klingons in a Chevy.
hannah claire brimelow
This is my nightmare.
tim pool
I would pay to see that movie.
It was totally serious.
tucker max
I don't think I would take money to watch it.
ian crossland
Do you watch movies much these days?
tucker max
No.
I took my kids to see Top Gun 2 and they loved that.
ian crossland
What would you give it on a scale from one to ten?
tucker max
Compared to what?
Like what's the scale?
ian crossland
The best movie of all time?
I don't know.
hannah claire brimelow
Or what did you expect of it?
ian crossland
First Indiana Jones maybe?
tucker max
It's much better than I thought it would be.
I didn't think it was that good, but compared to like other movies, yeah, like recent movies, last few years, yeah, it's fantastic.
ian crossland
It was impressive that he flew the plane himself, Tom Cruise.
From what I've heard, he was actually piloting He does do a lot of his own stunts and he has his pilot's license.
Oh wait, is that not confirmed?
I kind of doubt it, I don't know.
I thought that he was piloting it.
tucker max
I mean, certain scenes I don't feel like they were really... I'm not sure, hold on, because they're flying the F-14s, the two-seaters, they're shooting him from the front, so how the hell is he flying the plane then?
I don't think.
ian crossland
I don't know.
I don't know.
I heard that.
Maybe it wasn't true.
tucker max
I don't know.
ian crossland
I should dig into it.
tim pool
Alright, let's read some more.
We got Jay Chacha.
Says the female who got stomped at the T-Mobile in Arizona with no one to help her.
Horrible security cam.
Oh yeah, that's right.
With her no help.
Yeah.
Beat the shit out of her, yeah.
unidentified
Yeah.
walks in and then he goes, could you and then wham and then just starts wailing on
tim pool
her. This is why that dude in Vegas like, nope, not gonna try and wait to find out.
And I bet if it goes to trial he's gonna be like, the lawyer is gonna be like,
here's 500 videos showing exactly what happens to these people. He watched these
Twitter feeds all day. And stop Asian hate.
tucker max
Yeah, totally!
tim pool
Your Honor, there were people marching in every major city talking about how Asian people were being targeted.
This guy in a ski mask jumps the counter?
Not gonna wait to find out.
Not gonna wait to be the statistic, huh?
All right.
McChilla says wealthy philanthropists should spend every last cent of their fortune and effort to get a convention of states repeal the 19th.
Ha ha ha ha ha.
The 19th.
I'd say the 17th.
Yeah, what do you think about the 19th?
Are you one of those?
unidentified
I don't know.
hannah claire brimelow
What do you mean?
tucker max
I mean, that's like a long conversation.
tim pool
I don't know.
The 19th amendment granted women the right to vote.
unidentified
Yeah.
hannah claire brimelow
Okay.
The thing is, if I could give up my right to vote to a husband who I trusted and thought would make better decisions and it would guarantee something better, I would be open to it, right?
I don't think that Feminism was necessarily the best thing for this country, especially third wave feminism.
But generally, no offense to all of you, but if you're willing to make a 10th Fast and Furious, like, no, I have to vote for myself.
I can't trust your judgment.
ian crossland
Never trust someone else to do it for you.
unidentified
You're wrong.
tim pool
You just exemplified exactly why.
We have to repeal the 19th so we can get a 10th.
I think there are 10.
hannah claire brimelow
There were 10.
So we'll do get out over the 11th.
ian crossland
Uh, confirmed.
Top.
Tom Cruise did.
They did like a bootcamp, a three month Navy approved bootcamp training course for him and his co-stars to learn to fly.
I guess they were flying.
tucker max
Huh?
All right.
There you go.
ian crossland
He's had his pilot's license since 1994.
That's impressive to me.
tim pool
I thought you were going to confirm how many Fast and the Furious movies.
tucker max
Well, dude, listen, I mean, we all used to make fun of Tom Cruise and now it's like, Oh, it turns out he was totally right about antidepressants.
ian crossland
Oh man.
Did you see that clip?
Now it's recirculating where he was talking to Matt Lauer and he was like, dude, the psychiatric industry is for pro- I don't know if he was saying it was for profit, but he was showing like this.
And that was incredible.
I remember how they made him look crazy when he was on there.
Oh, he's a Scientologist.
He's crazy.
He thinks you can heal yourself.
tucker max
Scientologists are crazy about a lot of things.
They're just right about that.
ian crossland
That was fascinating.
unidentified
Yeah.
All right.
tim pool
Kyler Shebb says, do you think New Yorkers will start eating each other or the rats first?
ian crossland
Rats?
Well, probably it'll all happen at once.
tucker max
I don't know, man.
I'd rather eat a person than a rat.
hannah claire brimelow
Yeah, I think so, too.
tucker max
If those are the options, and it's like, okay, well, I'd rather choose neither, but... Plus, like, where's the major rat hunting ground?
hannah claire brimelow
The subway?
And you have to go down there, and do you know what's going to be the subway at the point that we're considering eating humans?
ian crossland
If you see rats eating a body, a human body, would you eat the human body or the rats?
hannah claire brimelow
But they're gonna run as soon as you approach the body.
ian crossland
Or attack, yeah.
tucker max
If you can find a piece that they haven't been nibbling on, I'm with you.
ian crossland
Scavenging.
hannah claire brimelow
It's a strange either-or game.
tucker max
I know.
Right?
ian crossland
Friday night.
tucker max
How about lambs?
Can we eat those instead?
ian crossland
Do you guys slaughter on the farm?
tim pool
All right, Sparky says, real MDMA is awesome, mostly fake stuff out there.
Really?
tucker max
Yes, he's right.
ian crossland
Yeah, a lot of times they'll call it ecstasy.
tucker max
Yeah, like if you do it in a club, it's probably non-MDMA.
It's cut with a lot of things.
Like I go to guides who get very, very good stuff.
ian crossland
And it's methamphetamines.
It's methylenedioxymethamphetamine is what that stands for.
tucker max
I have not met a lot of people who know the chemical signature name for it.
ian crossland
Methamphetamine.
tim pool
Yeah.
All right, Mike Gibson says, I drive for a food warehouse that supplies groceries to major distribution centers.
They are jammed full.
I think U.S.
food shortages are going to be inconveniences, not the zombie apocalypse.
tucker max
I think he's right this fall.
We had a bumper week harvest in North Dakota and some other places.
I was worried this winter was going to be bad.
But no doubt, they've already happened worldwide.
Sri Lanka, Ecuador, Ghana.
So they're coming.
They're already here and there's going to be a lot more.
The only question is how bad does it get in America?
He's right short term.
unidentified
All right.
tim pool
ZenobiaX says, y'all mention transhumanism often enough.
I have to ask if any of you can give a definition for it that doesn't include people with tubes in their ears, prosthetics, or pacemakers.
tucker max
Transhumanism, that's not really the definition of it.
That's all stuff you can get now, like old people have.
tim pool
But that's what their point is.
Their point is that transhumanism is here.
ian crossland
It's kind of a vague term because you could say that because we have a phone that gets us internet we have... People are cyber housing.
But I think like a, you know, like the neural net would be an idea of a piece of transhumanist technology.
tim pool
I think transhumanism is... Look, we're going to be neural linked and we're going to be talking about how transhumanism is coming.
Like, their point is excellent.
People have pacemakers already.
People have insulin pumps.
Like, humans are cyborgs already.
tucker max
I always thought transhumanism was really ultimately the goal was to be uploaded into the digital sphere.
ian crossland
Yeah, Ray Kurzweil talks about the singularity and downloading.
tucker max
Yeah, and EMs and all that stuff.
Emulations and all that, right?
ian crossland
That's one form of it.
Yeah, it's a vague term, transhumanism.
It just means that we've become more than homo sapien, that we're evolving to another species.
And we're probably going to evolve to multiple species at once that branch out.
tim pool
Robot people who live in the universe.
ian crossland
And then one of them will try and kill all the other ones because humans have been excessively racist through the history of the culture.
tim pool
Do you play video games at all?
tucker max
Some of them, yeah.
tim pool
Have you played The New Horizon for Ben West?
tucker max
No, no.
I played video games when I was a little kid, so we played Mario Kart and stuff.
tim pool
Did you play it yet?
ian crossland
I haven't played Horizon.
tim pool
So, uh, spoiler alert.
I mean, the game's been out for a while now, but the ending is basically, you know, the original story is like humanity gets wiped out by self-replicating robots.
Then there's the Zero Dawn project, which once all the biomass is destroyed, these machines underground kick on at Humans Built to start recreating and re-terraforming the planet.
And then in this new, the second game, there's humans, another operation to save humanity was the Zenith Project, I think it was called Zenith, and they escape Earth.
So these people are super advanced, immortal, can float, and they have advanced technology, and they come back to Earth.
And then it turns out they were actually fleeing from, they uploaded their consciousness replicating themselves and then freaked out when they saw what it was and imprisoned it, enraging the multi-consciousness of all of their minds, which escapes and then seeks to destroy them.
So, anyway.
tucker max
That's funny.
hannah claire brimelow
Tim, you didn't ask me if I play Horizon.
I don't understand.
tim pool
I looked around and said, do you guys play it?
ian crossland
Have you played Horizon?
hannah claire brimelow
Absolutely not.
Sorry.
ian crossland
What's your favorite game?
hannah claire brimelow
Well, the thing is, I have an older brother, so I spent a lot of time sitting next to someone playing video games and who was like, shut up, you can't play, stop.
But we did a lot of Assassin's Creed when I was younger.
tim pool
I just figured because you didn't watch Fast and Furious, you probably just had bad taste in games.
hannah claire brimelow
I have awful taste in games.
tim pool
In fact, nothing.
Ken Long says, love the Tim Castellar podcast.
I relate to everyone on the show, including guests.
You guys take me back to my 70s.
Thank you.
ian crossland
Yes.
tim pool
Well, all right.
tucker max
The 70s or his 70s?
tim pool
To my 70s.
unidentified
Okay.
All right.
tim pool
All right, Ugly Swan says, to my dearest Ian, we should chat sometime.
I love your hungry mind.
I think EU theory is showing itself, showing itself culture.
The eagle eats the serpent, Jupiter strikes Mars.
Interesting.
ian crossland
Some wild, wild information right there.
tim pool
DrDoctor says, Tim just referenced SSBSTS.
Dude is definitely a CKY fan.
Well, of course.
If you know how old I am, you know that I watched CKY when I was... What's that?
It was Bam Margera.
The CKY was the band.
Then he made a video where it was them engaging in shenanigans.
Some skateboarding, some pushing people in shopping carts.
ian crossland
Before Jackass?
unidentified
Yeah.
Oh.
tim pool
And then they made CKY2K, which was a huge viral.
All the skate shops had it.
unidentified
All right.
tim pool
TxPakRat says, TexasPakRat, prepping isn't just about storing food and having guns.
Get handwood working tools, a metal lathe, and a mill.
If a part breaks on my gun, I can make it.
No store needed.
tucker max
He's not wrong.
I didn't talk about everything, but he's not... Community.
ian crossland
I like how you emphasize how prepping also means prepare your community.
tucker max
That's probably the most important part is community.
hannah claire brimelow
It definitely is.
tim pool
Alright, UglySwan says, Damn, you brought up Magic the Gathering.
I have to comment.
Ian, how do you play Magic?
Do you thirst for war?
I brought my Bruna back out and I'm loving it.
ian crossland
I'm pretty utilitarian.
If I'm playing against someone that has a deck that's going to go infinite, I'll kill them as fast as possible.
tim pool
He's talking about me.
ian crossland
If Tim plays blue, he's done.
But I like trickery, and I like to watch what they do and then respond to the enemy, usually.
tim pool
All my decks are blue.
ian crossland
Yeah, Tim plays pretty nasty decks.
This is also pay to win.
I know, that's what I was thinking about.
Decks that are trained to win on turn four, you have no choice.
hannah claire brimelow
You have to go after them first.
They could just be making up words right now.
We would never know.
ian crossland
Oh, we should play magic.
It's great.
hannah claire brimelow
Right now?
Let's do it.
ian crossland
Let's bust them out.
tim pool
Yeah, we bought a whole bunch of these.
tucker max
I've never played.
ian crossland
It's great.
tim pool
I know what it is.
tucker max
I understand the game.
I just don't know anything about it.
ian crossland
I love burn, you know, if you can sustain it.
tim pool
Yeah, we did a draft, and I put together an aggro deck.
And it fell victim to all of the... Ian basically had a midrange.
Well, I couldn't get enough damage in before he got his, you know, creatures out, and then that's how you lose with aggro.
He got me.
ian crossland
I like drawing cards a lot, too.
Cards, like decks where I do like 35 things in one turn.
I love that stuff.
tim pool
All right, GU Knight says, Tim, what are your thoughts on adding a message board to the site?
It would be a good place for members to talk about news, current events, and link sources, a good way to check the pulse of your fans.
Yes!
So the one thing is, we've been trying to develop a new commenting system, and we're trying to do it in a way that promotes other social platforms.
Because like, I don't want to say too much, but how Facebook has the, you know, most websites that have comments will just like put a Facebook comment thing on it, you can embed it.
So we want to do something like that with a different platform.
We might just put back on the original comments.
And we're thinking about doing some kind of messaging system for members so that there's a community building thing happening.
But the issue is we have like one developer.
And so it's an issue of how much we can afford and how fast we can do it.
ian crossland
But yeah, first I was like, screw Facebook.
But at the same time, it's like some comments are better than no comments.
So it might be worth it as a stepping stone.
tim pool
And if we did Facebook comments, you snap your fingers and they're there.
It's, like, really easy to generate, and then it posts on Facebook, and then people can share on Facebook, so... But Facebook is awful!
All right, Waffle Sensei says, Yes, Magic the Gathering is an expensive game.
right? What commanders do you run? My Omnath, Locus of Mana will destroy you. And to the viewers,
teach your kids magic because they won't be able to afford drugs. Yes, Magic the Gathering is an
expensive game. That's what he was saying, pay to win. Yeah, but I mean, honestly, you could just
ian crossland
download pieces of paper that have the images on them, cut them up, put some cardboard on it and
You don't actually need... Proxies.
Yeah, proxies if you really want to play.
tim pool
Not, you can't do it in tournaments, but, you know, typically when we're playing at home, make the deck you want to make to play the best.
ian crossland
Dude, I don't think your Omnath deck can beat Tim's Kiki-Jiki deck.
I mean, that thing is like a net deck just built to slay.
tim pool
It's golden.
ian crossland
Yeah, the cards are golden.
tim pool
All the cards are foil, except for the ones that are like alpha and beta.
unidentified
That's awesome.
tim pool
So that's like an insanely expensive deck.
ian crossland
Kaikar, that one's also kind of ridiculous.
tim pool
That's my favorite deck.
ian crossland
Red, white, and blue.
tim pool
Red, white, and blue, baby.
unidentified
America.
ian crossland
Then your other one is Thassa of the Deep.
tim pool
Oh, that one's... That deck's ridiculous.
ian crossland
It's just, dude, you should play Tim sometime.
It's not fun.
tim pool
Oh, they'd lose.
It's not fun.
ian crossland
No, you've gotta... We roll... Yeah, it's not...
tim pool
No, no.
ian crossland
I mean, it's fun if you like just, like, really fast games.
tim pool
Ian and I got to the point where we would just roll a die and whoever got the highest would be like, oh, good game.
Because whoever goes first wins.
ian crossland
Whoever gets the mana crypt first.
tim pool
Yeah.
I mean, whoever goes first, man.
unidentified
All right.
tim pool
Howard says, Trump's an actor.
DRO contracts.
O-X-R-P to get you by.
unidentified
What?
tim pool
I don't know what that means.
unidentified
All right.
tim pool
Let's see.
Tim Wollack says, don't end the show.
Ian, some love.
Donating to show Ian some love.
Man gets too much hate here.
ian crossland
Oh, thanks homie.
tucker max
Really?
I feel like I could have hated on you way more.
Great conversation.
ian crossland
I'll say stuff I think that provokes people's, you know, insecurities sometimes.
And I just, better to be honest.
tucker max
I'm with you.
ian crossland
Receive, I find.
tim pool
Garhunt says, Trump, level 12 bard, college of lore, strength 11, dexterity 8, constitution 14, intelligence 16, wisdom 8, charisma 20.
Favorite attack?
Cutting words.
Weaknesses.
Cream-filled lard burgers.
Fix your pitch's email if you want to DM.
We have disabled the pitch's email.
Yeah, we had to.
ian crossland
That was a great description, though.
tim pool
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, definitely.
Beastly Devil says, Tim, you son of a gun.
You kept bringing up Battlestar Galactica and decided to watch it.
Best decision I have made and one of my favorite sci-fi shows now.
Adama Sr.
is my character and a great leader.
So say we all.
Dude, that show.
tucker max
The old school Battlestar?
tim pool
New one.
Well, I don't know.
tucker max
The old school one was badass.
ian crossland
In the 70s?
Yeah.
I haven't seen it.
tim pool
You know, what's crazy is, so you know the, I'm assuming the stories are very similar, or you've seen the new one?
No, I haven't.
So, the Cylons destroy the colonies, and then the fleet is just traveling, and all they have left are these fleet of ships, and then there's one plot where there's a ship that's just mining, effectively, coal, so it's all of these people have to work 16 hour days with no breaks, and they're just slaves.
They're like if you stop working we all die and so then there's a revolt and then they're like other people have to
rotate in Because they're gonna just kill themselves or something
shows brutal. Yeah crazy And then in the end they make it to earth and then they're
like the people on earth are compatible with us It's like okay. That's my
unidentified
That's like a weird plot point, but I guess We'll take a look.
tim pool
We actually have a card game in development right now.
Doom? Derm?
Tim and Ian, have you heard of the trading card game Flesh and Blood?
I'd quit competitive magic the Gathering after 15 years for this game.
It's amazing, you'll both love it.
We'll take a look. We actually have a card game in development right now.
Um, about, uh, culture war politics and stuff being developed.
ian crossland
Yeah, I was wor- I built the- Tim and I built the, uh, the database.
And Shamus did the art.
Freedom Tunes did the art.
tim pool
But now we do have, like, a game master who's combing through it and setting it up and fixing things.
ian crossland
Game testing, yeah.
tim pool
Alright, Marshall Mello says, Chris's opinion piece yesterday was one of the most unintelligent and disgusting things I've ever read.
Somebody needs to check his mental health.
Seriously.
unidentified
Wow.
tim pool
Outraged.
I think Chris wrote that he was pro-choice?
Pro-abortion?
hannah claire brimelow
Yeah, he said.
The headline is something like, because I believe in the Bible, I'm pro-choice or pro-abortion.
I have to say, Chris Carr is like the backbone of all of my work.
He can write whatever opinion piece he wants.
I mean, he's a very intelligent guy.
tim pool
Marshall, I'm glad you read it.
I'm glad you've expressed your opinion, disliking it, because that's a good thing.
And I'm glad Chris wrote it.
hannah claire brimelow
If it makes you think, it's worth being there.
I mean, that's the point of effective op-ed pieces.
tim pool
Right, and then Marshall, for your thoughts, it should arm you against... This is the thing, like, read people you disagree with, express your disagreement, and now you're better equipped to argue your ideas.
That's what I'm all about.
So, that's a good thing.
Alright, Sparky says, Star Trek, the original series, is the only good Star Trek.
Next generation.
Next generation.
What about you?
Original series?
tucker max
I mean, I thought, like, it depends.
So if we're talking about captains, I mean, Kirk, far and away better than some fucking Frenchman, right?
But if you're talking about overall series, I can see the argument for next generation.
tim pool
Yeah, they had the opportunity to improve upon it.
tucker max
Yeah, there were a lot of elements that were better.
tim pool
What do you think now?
Do you watch The Orville?
hannah claire brimelow
No.
tim pool
I'm actually really impressed with Seth MacFarlane.
He did a whole episode about detransitioning kids that were forced to transition.
Spoiler alert, I guess, for those that don't want to hear it, because it was a couple weeks ago.
But they did an episode where one of the planets in the Union was ejected because they were forcing kids to transition.
It's like, it's a crazy, I'm like, I can't believe he wrote this stuff.
But like, as long as he's willing to write these stories, maybe some of these people who follow him, because he's very Democrat, might actually be exposed to some other ideas.
Basically the plot was on their planet, they don't allow women.
They forced transition them to male.
And then this kid grows up and is like, this is not what I'm supposed to be.
And then there's like a conflict with the traditions of the planet that wanted to transition kids.
The kid de-transitions and then the planet is trying to stop like their smugglers rescuing these kids from being forced to go undergo sex changes.
It's crazy that he wrote this story and then they've done it two episodes on it.
Yeah.
tucker max
Yeah, but I can promise you, I could totally be wrong.
I'm betting that that's his vision of like, the smugglers were the blue states and the planets the red states.
tim pool
I don't, you know, some people have said like, he's trying to make a story about why kids should transition, but I'm like, I don't know about what you think he's thinking.
All I know is he did a show where they forcefully transition a baby.
Seth MacFarlane literally says, you can't perform a sex change on a baby, that's unethical.
And then they've got several episodes now where they're trying to stop minors from undergoing sex changes.
So I'm like, you'd think you'd be cancelled heavily for getting into that territory.
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Tomorrow, Ian and I, Carter, several other people including Adrian Norman, Pete Parata, we are going to be filming a music video.
I'm really, really excited for this.
It's going to be really, really cool.
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Tucker, you want to shout anything out?
tucker max
No.
unidentified
Nothing?
tim pool
You got social media?
tucker max
I mean, you can TuckerMax.com or whatever.
I'm on social.
tim pool
Right on, man.
Thanks for hanging out.
tucker max
Thanks for having me.
hannah claire brimelow
I'm Hannah Clare.
You can find me on Instagram at HannahClare.B.
And you can find me, of course, on TimCast.com with Chris Carr, the controversial opinion writer and executive editor.
ian crossland
Follow me at iancrossland.net.
Get through to my socials from there.
Hit me up anywhere on any network.
And I was on Pop Culture Crisis earlier today.
If you haven't seen the episode yet, you can watch it on YouTube at Pop Culture Crisis.
Tucker, it's really good to meet you, man.
That was really profound.
Thank you.
Especially just talking about the MDMA and like psychological therapy.
I think it's a huge part of the story moving forward.
tucker max
Thank you.
ian crossland
Thanks for coming, man.
tucker max
Yeah, my pleasure.
ian crossland
Bye, everyone.
tim pool
And Chris is here.
Thanks for watching.
Check out other shows, Pop Culture Crisis, and we'll be back Monday with another episode.
I just want to say this, Monday is going to be one of the best episodes we've ever had.
I'm super excited for who's coming.
We normally don't announce the guest, because we don't want to jinx it, but you guys are going to be so excited.
I am honored.
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