Aug. 12, 2022 - Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux
01:44:52
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| Yeah, yeah, yeah! Hey everybody, it's Stefan von Molyneux Head from Freedomain Radio-ish, and I hope you're having a lovely... | |
| Oh, look at that! It's evening for my fine feathered friends in England and Europe and so on, so I hope you're having... | |
| A great day. I hope that this will prevent you from whining. | |
| Oh, I don't want to stay up until 3 o'clock in the morning to do philosophy, man. | |
| Suck it up. Philosophy is tough. | |
| This boot camp for you. Sleep deprivation is essential for bonding with irrational internet leaders. | |
| So, yeah, I hope you're having a great day, and I'll try and do this sort of Sunday. | |
| 11am, which is, I think, 4pm London time kind of thing, but just for you, because there have been some complaints, requests, and perfectly reasonable, of course, for me to satisfy the Europeans, who were notoriously difficult to satisfy, much like Prince's mom. So, yeah, I hope you're having a great day, and if you have questions, issues, comments, criticisms, you name it, please feel free. | |
| We already have someone, I mean, I got topics, don't get me wrong. | |
| But Joseph, you have something you wanted to talk about. | |
| If you can just unmute, I'm all ears. | |
| Hello, Stefan. Great to be speaking to you. | |
| Well, thanks. Nice to speak with you too. | |
| What's on your mind? So I get that you're a philosopher, not a relationship guru, but I've had quite a powerful experience recently. | |
| I met a young lady my own age. | |
| I've been single for a long time. | |
| I'm mid-twenties. | |
| She's from abroad. | |
| She's visiting the country. I met her through a friend. | |
| Recently, we spent a week together. | |
| I had the best time of my life with her. | |
| We had so much fun. | |
| We had the same values. | |
| We clicked. We connected. | |
| So much in common. But sadly, she's gone back to her country. | |
| She studied in the UK, visiting friends. | |
| She knew people. That's how I got to meet her. | |
| She said herself it was the most fun she'd had all year with me. | |
| But I think for a relationship, she made it clear it wasn't reciprocal. | |
| Sorry, was it reciprocal? | |
| Wanting a relationship, really, with her. | |
| Oh, so she stayed with you. | |
| I'm sorry, remind me, for how long? | |
| Well, it was four days. | |
| We spent four full days together. | |
| The city she was visiting in, well, she first visited me near where I live, and then she'd arranged a trip. | |
| To one of the large cities and invited me over, having just met me. | |
| And so I didn't have anything on. | |
| I booked a youth hostel. | |
| I went over and we had just a great time together. | |
| But very sadly, I broached on the sort of... | |
| I made it clear that I liked it, and she sort of made it quite clear that that wasn't really reciprocal, and that kind of got friend-zoned a bit. | |
| I've been a bit heartbroken about it. | |
| I don't want to be lamenting over this, because it's not healthy, obviously. | |
| But at the same time, it's like, I don't know what to do, really, about it. | |
| Right, right, right. | |
| Okay. Can you tell me, you don't have to give me your exact age, but just your age range and how you met the woman originally? | |
| Sure. I'm mid-twenties and through a friend. | |
| She's a friend of a friend and the two of them were visiting near where I live. | |
| And he said, I'm going and visiting with a friend. | |
| Do you want to hang out? | |
| We go to the beach together and we did. | |
| It was great. And we hit it off immediately and that's when she invited me To spend time with her this following week to travel up to the city that went there she was then visiting. | |
| Which I then obviously did. | |
| Right, okay. And she's a similar age, mid-twenties, yeah. | |
| Right. Now, I'm old Fogieville, so I haven't been in the dating market for over 20 years. | |
| Is it unusual for a woman you've just met... | |
| To hop on over and spend four days straight with you? | |
| Very. It's never happened before. | |
| Okay. With me, at least. | |
| So, what do you think? | |
| I mean, okay, I'm sorry to be so blunt. | |
| You don't have to answer anything you don't want to, but it could be helpful and you're not identified. | |
| Did you have sex with the woman? | |
| No. No. | |
| Okay. Did you sleep in separate rooms or separate environments? | |
| No. Yes, she was staying with a friend who she knew, and I was staying at a hospital. | |
| Got it. Okay. So, this level of enthusiasm... | |
| Look, I'm sure you're a wonderful fellow. | |
| You're listening to this show. | |
| So, top tier, top shelf, high quality guy and all that. | |
| But I suppose my question is... | |
| Does it seem healthy for a woman to hop over for a four-day... | |
| I mean, I guess it wasn't sexual, but it was a romantic extravaganza, so to speak. | |
| Lots of laughs and great times and all of that. | |
| That's really putting yourself out there as far as entering a relationship goes, right? | |
| Like she just comes and boom, four days, right? | |
| Yeah, well, I don't think it was, because, well, she's quite a devout Christian, and she knows I, it was clear that I was as well, so I don't think that was really, like, an issue, that it was kind of clear that it wouldn't go and, | |
| you know, it wasn't, the sexual thing wasn't really, like, a big, because obviously, like, most people, that's, yeah, that's, if you invite someone to come I think as well she was going to this place where she only knew one friend there who she knew from the time when she lived here. | |
| Well, she studied in this country previously and that's how she knew people. | |
| So she only knew this one friend who, and so I think she, part of it might have been that she needed some male company there to feel protected, to just, and she knew I was a little loose and I didn't have anything. | |
| Well, how did she know, sorry, how did she know that you weren't a psycho? | |
| I mean, you're not, I get that, but you know, for a woman to put herself in the company of a man, I guess you stayed in pretty public places and all of that, but Women can be a little jumpy about this kind of stuff, and I'm not saying totally unreasonably so. | |
| I mean, it is vulnerable to be a woman, particularly traveling. | |
| So how long did you know each other before, or how many times had you conversed before? | |
| I guess she wasn't coming to spend the four days with you, but she was going to see her friend, and you spent time in the same vicinity in the hostel. | |
| Is that right? Yeah, yeah. | |
| How did she know you weren't crazy or dangerous or a stalker or you could have lied in your presentation or your photos? | |
| I guess that kind of stuff. Well, yes, she didn't know. | |
| So she took a risk. Now, if you have a daughter, right? | |
| Sorry, let's say you have a daughter. | |
| Yeah, let's say you have a daughter. | |
| And she says, I just met a guy online and I want to go and spend four days with him. | |
| I wouldn't be too pleased. Well, I think you'd be like, no. | |
| I mean, obviously you can't order your kids, particularly when they're adults, but I mean, I think you'd say, I mean, for heaven's sake, get to know the guy a little more, right? | |
| That's famine to feast all at once. | |
| Yeah, yeah. Yeah. | |
| Well, I'd at least say, well, you need to take more precautions. | |
| Someone you've just met, you know, you don't know this person. | |
| Yeah, I'd at least ask questions and say, well, this seems a bit... | |
| Yeah, for sure. | |
| Yeah, meet him. | |
| Now, you guys, what's your geographical distance like? | |
| Sorry, I cut off. | |
| Sorry. What's your geographical distance like? | |
| How far apart are you? Oh, well, I'm England. | |
| She's Canada. | |
| Oh, God. Okay. So this is quite a big thing, right? | |
| I mean, they call it the pond, but it ain't the pond, right? | |
| It's the second biggest ocean on the planet, right? | |
| Right, yeah. So you met her. | |
| She was traveling in Canada. | |
| You flew to Canada. | |
| No, I'm sorry. She was traveling in the UK, so she studied in the UK for a short time. | |
| Okay, sorry, sorry. So she knows people in the UK, and one of the people she knows is my friend who I met her through. | |
| Right, so she was traveling in the UK already, and then you... | |
| Now, when you were spending the four days together, was it just you two, or were there other people around? | |
| Well, the first day, we went to quite a big church where there's lots of young people, and her friend goes there that she was staying with. | |
| So we both met a lot of new people that first day, and then we went out to the pub as a big group, spent most of the day as a big group, and we were both mingling, socialising with everyone else. | |
| But because we'd come up together, It was only her friend. | |
| And her friend very kindly introduced me as his friend as well. | |
| So everyone thought we both knew him. | |
| Because otherwise I literally didn't know anyone. | |
| And I'd only met her like a day before, two days before. | |
| So it was nice. So everyone thought we were just two mutual friends of this gentleman. | |
| So I think people kind of thought we were a couple. | |
| No one really said that, but you could see like... | |
| So that was quite nice because it was like people didn't... | |
| She wasn't getting all the... | |
| They weren't hitting on her as much as she was with me. | |
| It's quite funny. So the first day we were together, no, sorry, we were in a group for most of the day. | |
| Then we spent the evening together on the first day. | |
| So the whole day, from the morning till night, we were a lot of the time in a group. | |
| And then the day after, We just really all day together, just the two of us, from morning till, like pretty much just the two of us together all day. | |
| Like you said earlier, we were in public space, went shopping, went, you know, explored the city. | |
| But you do the sort of things couples do, kind of thing. | |
| And it was actually, and I thought on that second day that, oh, this is, I know that the geographical problem This is an issue, but this is going really well and I think I could see this working out. | |
| But then towards the end of that second day she sort of started saying things like, oh well, we'll keep in touch, won't we? | |
| Sort of, you know, little things like implying that it's... | |
| So I felt like that was sort of goodbye on that second day. | |
| Sorry, so the second day we were together. | |
| Oh no, details are good. | |
| Please tell me what happened. | |
| The first day we were together in the city, we'd met before near where I lived through my mutual friend. | |
| My mutual friend who used works, he couldn't come with us to the city, so it was just the two of us. | |
| But during that first day when we were in a group, it was really great meeting people our age and it was nice. | |
| But throughout that whole day, I was kind of very zany, very joking, because we were in a group. | |
| But then towards the evening, when we were together, we actually went to the beach. | |
| And I realised, when it was just the two of us, it was a completely different dynamic. | |
| And that was actually the first time, really, that just the two of us had been together. | |
| Because on the other day when we met, my friend was there, so it was the three of us on that day and that day. | |
| And then on this day, there was a big group. | |
| So the first time we were really together, just the two of us, This is on the second day? | |
| Sorry? Yeah, well, yeah, the second day of knowing it, yeah, the first day in this city that we went to. | |
| Right, but this is the first day. | |
| Sorry to interrupt. And listen, I mean, I get that you sound kind of nervous. | |
| Just relax, take a deep breath. | |
| I've got all the time in the world. | |
| This is a fascinating topic. | |
| I really think that I can help. | |
| I hope that I can help. And, oh, and I just noticed. | |
| Oh, that's interesting. I thought there was a little stick on the ground, but it's moving. | |
| It's a caterpillar. Anyway, in the house. | |
| So, Take a deep breath. | |
| You've got all the time in the world. | |
| It's a really, really interesting and challenging problem. | |
| It's a good thing to call in. | |
| And yeah, I'm not a relationship advice guy, but philosophy is about happiness, and relationships are half of our component of happiness. | |
| So any philosophy that doesn't touch relationships ain't philosophy at all. | |
| So we've got all the time. | |
| But I just want to be clear. So on the second day, you met her face-to-face, and on the... | |
| First time you were together, alone, you opened up the bomb base about your life and childhood and issues and problems, right? | |
| Yeah, that's correct, yeah. | |
| And did she reciprocate in that way as well? | |
| Yes, she did. She started telling me about her previous relationship. | |
| Ah, okay. So let's hear a little bit about her previous relationship. | |
| Well, she's actually in love with a meth addict. | |
| What? Oh, come on! | |
| What do you mean she was in love with a meth addict? | |
| Dude! Oh, my God! | |
| No! Are you trolling me? | |
| Are you trolling me? No, I swear to God, no. | |
| No, please. Please do not swear on the God you worship that you're confused about a woman and her response to you... | |
| When her previous love interest was a math addict. | |
| Yeah. Okay, what was her childhood like? | |
| Her childhood. Sorry, Steph. | |
| Yes, sir, no problem. What was her childhood like? | |
| She's an only child. | |
| Older parents. | |
| Seemed quite nice, quite standard from what she said. | |
| She didn't really... | |
| Delve into that too much. | |
| Yeah, well, she didn't actually go on about her childhood that much, really. | |
| Okay, did you get any glimmers other than only child of all the parents? | |
| My God, you're dating my daughter. | |
| But no, did she give you any other clues or hints or anything? | |
| No, no, no. | |
| Well, because we didn't... | |
| It was a matter of three days I was with her, so I didn't really get to delve into it that much. | |
| I'm sure there's lots she didn't tell me, but no, no, she didn't really talk about it. | |
| Really? You're going to try and sell this story to me? | |
| Hang on, hang on. | |
| Listen, it's very noble of you to try and sell this story to me, and I appreciate the effort, but have you listened to any of my call-in shows? | |
| Yes. Okay, does it take me three days? | |
| Are there like 72-hour call-in shows? | |
| I mean, what are we talking here? | |
| How long does it take for me to get to the childhood issues of someone? | |
| Yes, but I'm not as blunt as you, Stefan. | |
| Well, no, but you're asking questions, right? | |
| I mean, you're asking questions about her childhood, right? | |
| And she either answers them directly, or she doesn't answer them, or she changes the subject, or she doesn't give you much of anything, which is all fine. | |
| It's not like the first day you know someone, you've got to go through all of their childhood dungeons and entanglements, but it wasn't a time limit, because it doesn't take long to answer questions about your childhood. | |
| So it's not, well, we only had three days, right? | |
| Right, of course. Okay, I just wanted to check that. | |
| So what was the story of, I don't know, let's call her Mary, right? | |
| What was the story of Mary and the meth addict? | |
| Boy, that sounds like the worst children special ever, but what was the story? | |
| See, now you've said that, I wish I'd asked more questions about that. | |
| I didn't ask enough questions, because I suppose my thought process was, I don't want to... | |
| But I see that I'm wrong now, because she brought it up, so clearly she was willing to divulge. | |
| But I didn't pressure on it too much. | |
| I know they met online, through actually a Christian group, of all things. | |
| Why she fell for him, I don't know. | |
| She just fell for him, she says. | |
| And she said it was just very sad and tragic. | |
| She's very aware of that. | |
| She's aware of how crazy it sounds. | |
| So he wasn't like a former meth addict. | |
| He was like a raging, current, back-alley, ghetto meth addict in the present, right? | |
| Right, yeah, yeah. | |
| Because I asked her, is he clean now? | |
| And I think it didn't sound good from what she said. | |
| And how long had she gone out with him and when did the relationship end? | |
| See, that's something I didn't ask. | |
| I didn't say, how long were you with him for? | |
| How long did you... I don't know. | |
| I don't know. But it was over? | |
| Yes, yes. It was totally over, yeah. | |
| Right. Did she mention any other boyfriends? | |
| Was there a human trafficker? | |
| Was there somebody who colors in the letters in library books? | |
| Was there anybody who laundered money for the mob? | |
| Did she have any other boyfriends that she'd mentioned? | |
| Not that she told me. | |
| No, it was just him that she said. | |
| Only him. Yeah, just the meth addict. | |
| Okay. No, that's fair. | |
| That's fair. I mean, it could have been others. | |
| Okay, so let me ask you a theoretical question. | |
| So let's say that this woman, I know she's not a meth addict, but let's say this woman on your third day together woke up and said, you know, I really want some meth for breakfast. | |
| Do you know where we can get some? | |
| Do you have any contacts? Do we just... | |
| Hang around bad sections of town until people offer us stuff. | |
| But meth is the way that I want to start my day. | |
| Would you like to come along and do that with me? | |
| I'd say you must be having a laugh. | |
| Okay, well, let's say you don't have to come along and do it with me. | |
| Just come along with me. You know, some comfort, some company, some security, you know, these meth... | |
| Deals can be pretty bad. | |
| So why don't you just come with me? | |
| You don't have to do it. I mean, I actually probably kind of strongly recommend you don't do it because it's, you know, it's pretty intense and it's hugely addictive. | |
| Here I am on the third day and demanding that you come with me to a meth deal. | |
| But can you just accompany me, watch my back, make sure nobody stabs me, and maybe just watch over me while I do the drug? | |
| Can we handle that? | |
| Will you do that? Well, absolutely not. | |
| What? Maybe we go to the arcade. | |
| Wait, wait, wait, hang on, hang on, hang on. | |
| Are you saying to me, straight up, are you saying to me that you would not date a meth addict? | |
| Yeah. Okay, okay. | |
| Please tell me where these shared values are, because she'll date a meth addict, but you won't. | |
| That seems to me a little bit of a divergence in value. | |
| So please help me understand all these shared values you were talking about before. | |
| Because when you said shared values, I'm like, oh, nice Christian girl, doesn't have sex, blah, blah, blah, saves herself to marriage maybe. | |
| Oh, and dates a meth addict. | |
| Okay. A meth addict is hard to conceive of anything further from God, except perhaps Satan, who's still in the paradigm as an opposite. | |
| So... What are the shared values? | |
| If you wouldn't date a meth addict but she would, in fact, if you would recoil and find yourself horrified at dating a meth addict but she pursues and maybe even has sex with a meth addict, help me understand these shared values of which you have spoken. | |
| Well, she's... You know, she's a practicing Christian. | |
| She's against... | |
| I know being against something isn't necessarily a value. | |
| As you said, it's just an absence of the negative. | |
| But she's against a lot of the shit that's being pushed today in the media. | |
| And she's very... In terms of her sort of political worldview, very conservative. | |
| You know, she's not bitchy. | |
| She doesn't put people down. She's fun. | |
| She's kind. She's... | |
| Sweet, compassionate, feel like she's got time for you. | |
| She feels like she's not just... | |
| At no point did I think she wants to just have sex with me or... | |
| So, you know, we read similar books, both into music, into the same hobbies, similar interests. | |
| But, yeah, I never put two and two together, what you just said about the whole... | |
| I wouldn't say that, but she would. | |
| Yeah, that's a good point. | |
| I mean, I would say that conservatives, particularly Christians, tend to be anti-drug. | |
| Because God made you perfect the way that you are, and to substitute some biochemical high for the embrace and love of Jesus is pretty satanic, in a way, right? | |
| Do I have that theology vaguely correct? | |
| Well, of course, but I would say that on an individual level, you can only... | |
| Yeah, of course, but... | |
| Meeting someone as an individual who happens to be a drug addict, you've got to then have compassion and you've got to see that person, you've got to see what's behind that drug addiction. | |
| So if I meet someone who is, say, a meth addict, I don't just want to see them as a meth addict, I want to see Jim or Fred, you know, the wounded, broken person that's behind that. | |
| And, you know, I sort of thought, well, I know this isn't in the spirit of your philosophy, but I thought, well, if you fall for someone, you fall for someone. | |
| Not love is love, obviously, but who's to say if you really fall in love with someone, then you fall in love with the individual, aren't you? | |
| Oh, so this is like the lightning strike theory of love, right? | |
| That you just drift through life and you meet people and then at some point lightning strikes you like Sonny Corleone or one of the Corleone kids in The Godfather. | |
| Lightning just strikes you and then you just, you know, you're just in love and there's no causality, there's no explanation, it's Well, a lightning strike, I guess, has some predictability. | |
| It's almost like possession, like demonic possession by the giant ventricle heart of love. | |
| So you meet someone, and you just fall in love with them, and then, boy, it's a real hiccup if they happen to be a meth addict, but, hey, man, the lightning struck, and there you are. | |
| Is that sort of the general thing? I don't mean to mock it too much, but is that the general idea? | |
| No. Yeah, and I agree, but then, obviously, afterwards, you sort of gain your reason a bit, and like she did, she's not with him anymore, so clearly she did come to her senses, because otherwise she'd still be with him. | |
| Well, not necessarily. | |
| She might have dropped him because he was in prison. | |
| She might have dropped him because he died. | |
| She might have dropped him because he moved to Canada or to England or wherever she's not, right? | |
| So, but yeah, okay, let's give her the benefit of the doubt and say that she dated a meth addict for a while and then realized it was a bad idea and decided to stop dating the meth addict, right? | |
| So, but the question is, of course, okay, the question is not necessarily the individual here, right? | |
| So I said this before, when a woman looks at you, a man, she sees a whole ecosystem, right? | |
| She sees siblings, parents, extended family that she has to try and find a way to get into, to feel comfortable with, that she's going to spend the next 50 or 60 years of her life deeply enmeshed in, right? | |
| So she views you as part of a system and she will judge you relative to your system, not relative to you as an individual. | |
| Whereas a man looks at a woman and he sees an individual. | |
| Do I love her? Whereas she's like, can I love everyone around him and him? | |
| Which is why if you want to go a courting for a quality woman, you really have to have quality people around you. | |
| Because even if you're a quality person, if you have trashy or dysfunctional people around you, the quality woman will say, yeah, he's a nice guy, but I can't get enmeshed in this. | |
| So women see you as part of a system. | |
| You see a woman as an individual, right? | |
| But I'm inviting you to see the woman as part of a system. | |
| It's not that she dated a meth addict. | |
| It's that everyone in her life allowed it, permitted it, encouraged it, looked over it, supported it. | |
| How did she end up dating? | |
| Like, women don't act, we don't act in isolation. | |
| You know, when someone says, oh, I got married to a crazy woman, it's like, okay, then you have people around you who aren't ferociously watching your back as we kind of need to, especially in the modern world where there's lots of crazy people out there and they can camouflage and chameleon themselves pretty well. | |
| So what I do is I look at this woman and I say, okay, so your entire family and friend system and your church and everyone colluded to some degree in you dating a meth addict. | |
| So either you lied to everyone around you and said, he's not a meth addict. | |
| He's a perfectly wonderful fellow with no substance addiction problems whatsoever. | |
| So she's a complete liar. | |
| And not only is she a complete liar to everyone around her, but they're not even smart enough to figure out that she's lying to them. | |
| Right? So either she's a pathological liar to everyone around her, or she told them the truth. | |
| Yeah, I'm interested in a guy who's a meth addict. | |
| And they were like, No, this can't happen. | |
| Listen, this is a word out there. | |
| No disrespect to the people who are addicts, right? | |
| I mean, I get it. It's a very tough thing to get out of and meth is one of the worst things, right? | |
| So, if you have a kid and your kid wants to date a meth addict, who is a criminal, a criminal, right? | |
| And is involved in a criminal underworld because they have to get their meth, right? | |
| So they have to go to drug dealers. | |
| They have to go to criminals. They get into debt to feed their habit. | |
| They steal. They lie. | |
| They corrupt everyone around them. | |
| They steal from those around them. They might steal from stores. | |
| They have to constantly feed this multi-hundred-quid-a-day habit. | |
| So they're involved in this criminal underworld. | |
| And, you know, what happens if the meth addict boyfriend takes out a loan from a loan shark from some criminal enterprise and then can't pay it back? | |
| What happens? | |
| Well, they attack him or they attack his girlfriend or both, right? | |
| Because they need him able to go and steal. | |
| So they don't want to break his legs, right? | |
| So maybe they go and attack. | |
| So if you're going to get involved, and I'm not for the criminalization of drugs, but we're just talking about the world that is. | |
| So if you have a kid or a sister or an aunt or a friend who's being drawn towards dating and getting romantically and perhaps sexually involved with a meth addict, you do absolutely everything in your power to make that not happen. | |
| Of course. And that's something I should have said. | |
| I should have said, well... Where were your parents in all this? | |
| Weren't they fighting tooth and nail to stop you being involved with this meth addict? | |
| That's something I didn't ask. | |
| Yes, of course. So, this tells you a lot about her life. | |
| She didn't date a meth addict. | |
| Her entire church, family, extended family, friend structure, you name it, It allowed her, in a sense, to date a meth addict. | |
| Now, of course, you can say, well, what could they do to stop her? | |
| Well, there's a lot that you could do to stop people who are dating criminals. | |
| There's a lot that you could do to stop people. | |
| You can cut them off financially. | |
| I don't know if she's going to school. | |
| I'm not paying for a penny of travel. | |
| I'm not subsidizing your rent. | |
| I'm not paying for your school. I am not giving you one thin dime if you're going to date a criminal element of society. | |
| You can beg. You can plead. | |
| You can bribe. You can do so much. | |
| You can talk. You can figure out what family dysfunction led her to this dangerous place in life. | |
| There's so much that you can do so that this doesn't happen. | |
| And what do they just let her sail on down the river? | |
| Just, yeah, yeah, go on down. | |
| Go on down to the meth addict criminal underworld. | |
| Sure. Best of luck. | |
| God be with you. Let Jesus take the wheel and drive you into a ditch. | |
| So either... But this sounds... | |
| No, go ahead, sorry. I've talked a lot, so go ahead. | |
| Yes, that's okay. | |
| This sounds bad, but like you said, it's different with a man and a woman because, I mean... | |
| Is it so bad that you meet a brilliant young woman and she doesn't have support around her? | |
| Because really, when you meet her, you're then her support. | |
| And then she does. She doesn't really... | |
| Oh, no, no. I love it when I hear a man's penis talking. | |
| It's really quite remarkable. | |
| This is your trouser snake telling me a story so that it can get what it wants. | |
| Okay. So here's the thing. | |
| A couple of logical possibilities. | |
| Here we do the philosophy part, right? | |
| A couple of logical possibilities with this woman, right? | |
| So first of all, how the hell does she meet a meth addict, right? | |
| I don't know how to meet a meth addict. | |
| I have no clue. | |
| I don't know any addicts. | |
| I wouldn't let addicts in my life. | |
| I might give them money to go to rehab, but I wouldn't let them in my life. | |
| She's got to be in some environment where she meets a meth addict and at some point she knows he's a meth addict. | |
| So if she tells her family and they're just like, yeah, go with you. | |
| I'm sure God will give you the right path. | |
| It's like, no, no, no, but Satan tempts you too, right? | |
| You can't just let whatever happens happen and gaslight yourself like it's God's plan because Satan has his own plan, which doesn't involve God. | |
| So she either lies to everyone around, says he's not a meth addict, or she tells them the truth. | |
| Now, if she tells them the truth, either they fight for her like hell to not date the meth addict or they don't, right? | |
| Now, if they don't, it means that she's grown up with zero sense of self-protection and nobody who cares about her, right? | |
| Now, if she tells the truth, I'm dating a meth addict and everyone around her says, yeah, go, fine, who cares, right? | |
| Then she has never been loved, never been taken care of, never been protected in her entire life. | |
| Which is probably one reason why she just comes on a three-day or four-day extravaganza with some guy she doesn't even know because she's got no sense of self-protection. | |
| She's like the dodo bird when the people first come and they've never seen people and they just would reach over and strangle them because she's got no sense of self-protection. | |
| Now, if she's got no sense of self-protection and she's never been loved, then how on earth is she going to know what love is? | |
| I mean, you wouldn't go to Japan if you don't speak Japanese and just start dating some woman who didn't speak English and assumed this was going to work out because you don't speak the same language. | |
| How on earth is she going to know what it means to be loved, to be cared for, if nobody in her life cares for her? | |
| Enough to say, don't date the meth addict and I'll do whatever it takes to make that not happen. | |
| So, there's another possibility though, and the other possibility speaks to your last point. | |
| The other possibility is That she didn't lie to those around her. | |
| She said, I'm dating a math addict. | |
| And her parents, her friends, her extended family, her church all fell on their knees and begged and pleaded and threatened and bribed and whatever. | |
| Don't date a math addict, right? | |
| And you know what she said? I don't care. | |
| I'm doing it anyway. Right now, what does it mean if she's like, I don't care what you say, I'm dating the meth addict. | |
| Well, she is ungovernable. | |
| Now, that sounds kind of mean, like you've got to rule over her or something. | |
| No, but it means she doesn't take any good advice. | |
| She just does whatever she wants, no matter how self-destructive, even though there are good people in her life begging and pleading for her to not do that thing, right? | |
| Good luck dating someone like that, right? | |
| They'll just chew you up, right? Whoa, here she comes. | |
| She's a man-eater, right? | |
| So, yeah, that's dangerous as hell, right? | |
| And listen, if there's other possibilities, I mean, there may be, but you give me a possibility where she's not just incredibly dangerous to you. | |
| Possibility where she's not. | |
| Either she's a pathological liar, right, didn't tell anyone she was dating a meth addict, thus exposing them to grave danger, right? | |
| You date a criminal, your whole social circle's at risk. | |
| So either she didn't tell anyone, she told people and they don't care about her, which means she has no experience of being loved, which means you can't love her because she won't recognize her, she won't recognize any love you have for her, or she told everyone they really cared about her, they tried to stop her and she basically said, screw you, I'm going to do what I want, in which case she doesn't ever take any good advice, she does whatever she wants to help with the feelings and security of other people, which means she's incredibly dangerous. | |
| I'm happy to hear... I mean, there's another scenario. | |
| I don't think it happened in what you said, but I'm happy to hear a scenario in which this story does not make her like a landmine you're going to lose your balls to. | |
| No, those are the three really only possible scenarios, aren't they? | |
| Like you say. Well, there's one more. | |
| There's one more. And I don't think this happened, so I'll keep it brief. | |
| So the other one is that she says something like this. | |
| Oh, man. I come from a messed up family. | |
| We don't look out for each other. | |
| Everyone's kind of self-absorbed. | |
| We don't really care for each other. | |
| And partly as a result of this, and of course partly as a result of my own bad decisions, I ended up dating a meth addict and things got really kind of crazy. | |
| And I ended up going into therapy. | |
| My whole family went into therapy and the therapist helped us work through all of the dysfunctional issues of neglect and avoidance and lack of love and lack of caring so that I could finally figure out why I ended up dating a meth addict, which is a cry for help if ever I've heard one. | |
| And so now I am much wiser. | |
| I am much more sensible. | |
| My family is so much better off and we've dealt with a lot of prior trauma and I'm not going to be doing that again. | |
| Which wasn't what she said. | |
| No, and if she had done that, she would have learned proper boundaries and she wouldn't jump into a four-day, quote, fling. | |
| I know it wasn't sexual, but a four-day, quote, fling with a guy she just met. | |
| Yeah. I think you're right. | |
| I think the most likely scenario is she told the truth to the people around her and they just don't care about her enough to lift a finger to help her or save her. | |
| So if she doesn't know what it's like to be loved, if she doesn't know what it's like to have people care for her and try to actually help her and protect her in some practical fashion, then she has no capacity to bond with anyone. | |
| So then when she's with you, it feels like there's a bond. | |
| Why? Because you're right in front of her. | |
| She's got nothing else to do. | |
| She's happy for the attention. | |
| She likes having a man desire her, of course, as all women do, as all men like it when women desire them. | |
| So then she goes back to Canada, but she's no capacity to bond with anyone because nobody ever cared for her or took care of her or protected her or loved her when she was growing up. | |
| So she goes back to Canada, and then what happens? | |
| You're not in front of her anymore, then what? | |
| Well, exactly what happened? | |
| She contacts you and she says, I'm not really looking for a relationship right now. | |
| Isn't that what she did? Yes, but it was just like the next, well, sort of the next day and sort of while I was with her. | |
| Oh, I'm sorry. So you guys were still together and she basically broke up with you, although I know it wasn't a formal relationship, but she basically said after three or four wonderful days together, she basically said, I don't want to go any further, right? Well, she said little things like, I'm sorry, you're breaking up. | |
| If you could just repeat that. Sorry. | |
| She said little things like, oh, well, we'll keep in touch. | |
| Meaning, you know, that's... | |
| And I got quite sad to say goodbye. | |
| I said to her, I'm sad to leave you. | |
| And she said, it's kind of like that, what's... | |
| It was Han Solo's Lea in Star Wars. | |
| She said, I love you. | |
| He says, I know. | |
| She said, I know. We had a lot of fun together, haven't we? | |
| Very dismissive. | |
| Which made it quite hard. | |
| How long ago was this vague parting? | |
| It was two weeks ago. | |
| Have you heard from her since? | |
| Yeah, a fair bit. | |
| I've had two phone calls since. | |
| She's asked a lot how I'm doing. | |
| I told her about a possible job that I'll be doing soon. | |
| She's mainly showing more of an interest in me, actually. | |
| I'm sorry, can you say again? | |
| I don't know if you can get any closer to your router, but you're crackling up quite a bit. | |
| Oh, yes. | |
| So she said... | |
| Did you get that? | |
| So I've had two phone calls since. | |
| She's messaged a fair bit, but mainly asking how I'm doing, sort of, because... | |
| She's been asking a lot about my living situation. | |
| She hasn't gone back to Canada yet. | |
| She's still traveling for a bit. | |
| I've asked her how her travels are going and she's not even really told me about how I'm doing. | |
| Do you know when she's heading back to Canada? | |
| In September. Yeah. | |
| Okay, so you've got like almost a month. | |
| And has she indicated any desire to circle back and spend more time with you? | |
| Or any plans to you? | |
| Well, she's actually visiting Europe, traveling Europe at the moment. | |
| She has some friends in Europe that she met. | |
| I think she got one of them, and then she might be coming back to the UK. She might be coming back to the UK just for a few days or so, and she suggested we should meet up again. | |
| Actually, she said to me... | |
| We should get the gang back together, and she meant just me, her, and my friend who introduced us. | |
| They're not involved. She said, the three of us who we initially met, we should go travel such and such a place together. | |
| I said to her, I made it clear, I said, well, just you and me could go. | |
| Maybe just the two of us could go. | |
| And then she wrote back and said, I think it would be fun if all three of us went. | |
| So, you know, made it very clear. | |
| Oh yeah, so that's the friend zone thing you were talking about, right? | |
| Exactly, exactly. Okay, so I'm sorry, I just have to give a bit of a speech here because your audio is really hard to catch, so I'll sort of give you what I think is a useful approach to this kind of stuff. | |
| So it seems to me most likely that she ended up dating a meth addict because she was not taken care of or protected by the people in her life. | |
| Now, if she doesn't have a significant bond, right, so what is a human bond? | |
| What is it for? | |
| What is the human bond for? | |
| What does it entail? | |
| Well, I mean, we have to look at the mammals as a whole, right? | |
| So what is the bond in a wolf pack for? | |
| The bond in a wolf pack is for survival, because wolves hunt like lions and other big creatures. | |
| They hunt better in packs than they do individually. | |
| Because you've got to herd and then jump or you're going to chase. | |
| So it's for survival and it's also for protection. | |
| Now, the bond is necessary in a wolf pack because the wolf pack has to transmit how to hunt. | |
| The wolves are case-selected. | |
| So they have to transmit, as lions and dogs do, they have to transmit to the offspring how to hunt and how to bond, how to work together. | |
| So there's a big knowledge transfer that's necessary. | |
| So the bond is for survival, for knowledge transfer, and for protection. | |
| Now, if you look at this woman, is she being given the tools for flourishing and survival? | |
| She is not. She is not. | |
| If she goes around insta-bonding with people and then just kind of brushing them off, you're a nice guy and you'll handle it, I'm sure, but at some point she's going to come across a guy who won't take no for an answer. | |
| Like if you go around, you know, there's a lot of lonely people in the world. | |
| I'm not saying you're one of them, but there's a lot of lonely people in the world. | |
| And if you love-bomb them for a couple of days, so to speak, oh, this is wonderful. | |
| We've got to stay in touch. This is the best time ever, blah, blah, blah. | |
| And then you just pull away from them. | |
| Again, it's disorienting and upsetting to you. | |
| You'll be able to handle it. You're a nice, mature guy. | |
| But at some point, that's not going to be the case. | |
| And then she's going to claim to be a victim. | |
| And she will be a victim in terms of violence or stalking or something like that. | |
| But This is, you know, prevention is better than cure. | |
| So is she being protected? | |
| No, she is not. Is she going to survive in terms of genetics, right? | |
| Because the bonding is for the survival of the next generation in genetics. | |
| Well, it seems quite unlikely. Because people who seem to bond very quickly unbond very quickly too. | |
| This is a fundamental fact to know about life and dating. | |
| So people who just like, yeah, we're going to spend four days together, they bond very quickly. | |
| They don't seem to have anything else to do. | |
| You become their world. They will unbond like that. | |
| People who are slow to bond are slow to unbond. | |
| People who are quick to bond are quick to unbond. | |
| Somebody who's suddenly your best friend will ghost you in a week. | |
| Somebody who gets to know you over time and slowly begins to appreciate your values and so on, that's the friend who's going to stick around. | |
| In other words, she's trying to turn you into a meth addict because she's giving you this instant high like a meth and then you've got to deal with the withdrawal that comes afterwards. | |
| So is she going to be a good and solidly bonded partner to her husband? | |
| Is she going to have a lot of wisdom and knowledge and protection to transfer to To her kids? | |
| No. So as far as survival, companionship, protection, knowledge transfer, she doesn't have that stuff. | |
| She doesn't have that stuff. | |
| Now, here's the problem. | |
| So if for some reason or through some miracle this woman was able to truly bond with you and you won her out of her foggy castle of savage indifference, And you were able to get her to bond with you. | |
| Then her family of origin, her friends, her extended family, her church, whoever, would view you as extremely dangerous and someone to be attacked and driven out of her life. | |
| For the simple reason that if she really bonds with you, the shallowness, the emptiness and the lack of caring and concern and love in her other relationships will become blindingly clear to her. | |
| So the moment she starts to bond with someone, all of the people who have no real relationship with her but claim that they love her, all of those people in her head and maybe even in her environment, all of those people move very quickly in to detach and cut the bond that she's growing. | |
| All those people will move in, in her head or maybe even in her life, will move in to cut the bond. | |
| Now, if she has a terrible bond, they're fine with that because that's just the same as them. | |
| So there's no big difference, there's no big comparison. | |
| So if she ends up bonding with a meth addict, they're like, oh, yeah, that's fine. | |
| But if she bonds with someone of real quality, first of all, that person of real quality is going to ask about her childhood, ask about her friends, her family, her church. | |
| And is going to know that something seriously went wrong with her life. | |
| She ended up dating a meth addict. | |
| And is going to be critical of those relationships. | |
| And then she faces a challenge. | |
| There's one new guy and there's like 50 people she grew up with. | |
| Now, for most people, it's a democracy of time. | |
| The more people and the longer they've been around, they vote, they win, you're out. | |
| For the rare person, a quality bond is worth sacrificing all prior relationships for if those relationships are shallow and useless and pointless. | |
| So what she's doing right now is she got her ego gratification. | |
| Right? She's got a Simon the Boxer thing where bonds get broken because children naturally bond with their parents and if she has indifferent parents or neglectful parents or abusive parents, then the bond is continually broken. | |
| So she's got a Simon the Boxer repetition compulsion, I would imagine, I don't know, I'm just guessing, right? | |
| But she's got a Simon the Boxer repetition compulsion where you make a bond and you break a bond. | |
| You make a bond and you break a bond. | |
| So she's probably going to have, right? | |
| And I assume she's attractive and charming and intelligent and funny and all of that. | |
| So she's got that whole charm thing going on. | |
| Yeah, all of the above. Yeah, all of the above, right? | |
| So she can do this very easily. | |
| Why? Because she's young. | |
| Because she's in her 20s. | |
| So she can charm, not the pants off guys, but she can charm guys into falling for her. | |
| And then she just betrays that bond. | |
| She's distant for no reason whatsoever. | |
| No reason that could be comprehended. | |
| But that's because any genuine bond with you is going to threaten two things. | |
| One, it's going to threaten her existing non-bonded relationships, quote relationships, number one. | |
| And number two, it's going to make her feel bad. | |
| Because if she's done this to a whole bunch of guys, been super charming, super available, hinted about potential relationships, dangled the possible future in front of them and then ripped it away with no explanation, if she's done that, Well, that's a terrible thing to do. | |
| It's a terrible thing to bounce into some guy's life, be all pretty and charming and wonderful, with no intention or no capacity or no knowledge of how to have any kind of possible relationship. | |
| And then when you've aroused this guy's hopes for a possible future, To then break his heart by not explaining anything. | |
| Like if she sat you down and she said, listen, you know, you really gave me a lot of information on the second day and that means that you're kind of isolated. | |
| You kind of gave me a brain dump of your whole life and that has me kind of concerned about, you know, long-term questions. | |
| If she'd given you some kind of explanation, or you're really attractive, but I can't figure out the distance thing. | |
| We're 3,000 miles apart. | |
| If she'd given you some kind of explanation, as opposed to just, oh no, we should hang out with you and your friend. | |
| Yeah, that would be more fun. There's no explanation. | |
| That's what hurts. If she'd give you some explanation, it would hurt, but it wouldn't be agonizing. | |
| It wouldn't be torture. The torture is What the hell happened? | |
| We had the very best time that you could have together. | |
| Why on earth wouldn't you want to continue exploring that? | |
| I'm not saying let's get married, but why wouldn't you want to continue exploring that? | |
| You had fun. I had fun. | |
| What's up with that? And I'm sort of trying to give you a framework of how that might come about. | |
| And sorry, if that makes sense. | |
| Go ahead. Yeah, it makes total sense, because just, you know, there was no explanation with it, it was just like a sort of flippant, it'd be fun to all go, we're all friends, we're all, like it's sort of just ignoring the fact that, well, we spent two days together, we had the best, like you said, the best time, and it's just, oh, it's just like sugarcoating it, it's, yeah, and that hurts, doesn't it? | |
| Like you say, had there been a, like, any sort of in-depth sort of, I understand that, you know, you want to continue that, but I, there was nothing like that, no, no. | |
| Okay, so now we need to talk about the warning signs, right? | |
| Because here's the thing. If the woman is incomprehensibly close and then incomprehensibly distant, part of the goal of that is to replicate a wounded defensiveness on the part of your own heart, right? | |
| So we have to make sure in this conversation that your heart remains open to a quality woman. | |
| Now, if you don't know the red flags... | |
| So imagine you're playing hide-and-go-seek in a house and you're blindfolded. | |
| Well, you're going to bump into everything. | |
| You're going to move really slowly and really tentatively because you can't see whatever's coming. | |
| You can't see the wall. You can't see the coffee table. | |
| You can't see the counter edge. | |
| You can't see the steps. | |
| So you've got to go super slow and super careful. | |
| And that's called being defensive. | |
| So if you don't know, if you can't scan for the red flags, your heart remains guarded. | |
| And you can't fall in love if your heart remains guarded. | |
| Does that make sense? You can't fall in love if your heart remains guarded. | |
| I'm not sure. Well, so if you're going to meet some other woman, right? | |
| And some other woman you're going to have a great time with. | |
| And what we need to do is we need to have part of the conversation where we say, the next time you fall for a woman, you're going to be more guarded than you were this time, right? | |
| I see what you mean. | |
| Yes, yes. But if you fall for a woman and she's the right woman, you just give her your heart. | |
| Here, I'm wide open, man. | |
| I'm taking off. I'm giving you the soft underbelly of the porcupine. | |
| Here's my heart. Love like you've never been hurt. | |
| Dance like no one's watching. Sing like no one's listening. | |
| Whatever you want to do. You've got to keep your heart open, and part of the unconscious goal of this kind of pathology is to make you guarded so that you can't fall in love in the same way that she can't fall in love. | |
| This is how the virus of lovelessness transmits through the population. | |
| You just give people real great closeness and then incomprehensible distance, and then you make them guarded and fearful of their next relationship, and then they can't fall in love. | |
| I'm not saying that's the case for you because of one four-day thing, but that's the general pattern, if that makes sense. | |
| Sorry, I just had to... | |
| Yes, that makes total sense, yeah. | |
| Now, if you got distracted, that's totally fine. | |
| It happens. I can repeat it if you need. | |
| No, no. Sorry, I just interrupted and I had to explain I was on the phone. | |
| No, no, that's totally fine. Sorry, maybe just repeat the last part. | |
| Yeah, no problem. So, there's a virus called distance and lovelessness, loneliness, isolation. | |
| And the way it transmits is it draws people into a bonding scenario, and then it incomprehensibly breaks the bond, which makes people more and more cautious as they go along, more and more frightened, more and more guarded, and less able to be vulnerable and open with their own heart. | |
| And that's how, you know, the bonding is kind of like a virus that spreads through love, and the distance is kind of like a virus that spreads through incomprehensible acceptance and then rejection. | |
| So, I want to make sure that we can figure out how to keep your heart open for the next woman who comes along, the quality woman. | |
| Like, I believe, this is not an act of God, but I believe in general, statistically, at least one quality person will come into your life at some point. | |
| At least one quality romantic partner. | |
| A good man, a good woman, solid, reliable, honest, open, clear, Don't play games, not defensive, not weird. | |
| Statistically, this happens to everyone. | |
| And the whole point, it's like Hamlet. | |
| The readiness is all. | |
| Just be ready for it when that one great person comes into your life. | |
| And so at some point, this wasn't the one right person, but at some point in your life, and it could be more than one. | |
| With me, it was just one. | |
| That one right person is going to come into your life and you have to be ready for it. | |
| Now that means you have to be open and unguarded. | |
| But how on earth are you open and unguarded? | |
| Well, you take the blindfolds off. | |
| You figure out what the red flags are. | |
| If there aren't any red flags, your heart is open. | |
| But I don't think that you've seen enough of the red flags. | |
| Like you didn't even... Sorry, this sounds like kind of scornful or anything. | |
| I don't mean it that way. But you weren't even... | |
| Wow, the meth addict boyfriend is a real red flag, right? | |
| But it is, right? Well, of course, yeah. | |
| Okay. So somebody who just wants to spend four days straight with you, when they've just met you, total red flag. | |
| Right. Because they're taking you out of reality. | |
| They're taking you out of, I have a life, I have a distinct personality, I have other things. | |
| I mean, my wife and I, after we met, we spent just about every day together, but I was writing books. | |
| She had a career and all that, so we had other things going on. | |
| Now, is there anything else when you sort of look back on Meeting her and socializing with her and asking her questions, was there anything else that might stand out as something to be cautious about or something that could be a red flag? | |
| No, actually, and I didn't even really think that the things you mentioned were too much of a red flag. | |
| I was sort of a bit blinded by it all, and it all happened so quick that I didn't really have time to really go through it. | |
| Now, you said that she was, hang on, so let me ask you this, while you're thinking of that. | |
| So you said that she was kind and honest and this, that, and the other, right? | |
| Yeah. That's a lie. | |
| I don't mean you're lying. | |
| I mean that the statement is false, and it's easily false. | |
| It's provably false. | |
| Do you know how I know that she's not kind and honest? | |
| How? Because she's not telling you why she's withdrawing. | |
| Right. She's provoking this torture in you by having this fusion, this mass merging, and then this separation without explanation. | |
| Is that kind? Oh, no. | |
| Is it honest to say, oh, this is the best time ever, we've got to stay in touch, blah, blah, blah, and then just being comprehensively distant and not want to spend one-on-one time together again? | |
| Is that honest, nice, generous, kind, thoughtful, considerate, caring? | |
| No. No, but if she was, you know, in touch every day and without the intention of sort of starting a relationship, it would be sort of leading me on, wouldn't it? | |
| Well, she is in touch. | |
| She's calling you. | |
| She's asking you how your new job thing is going. | |
| She is in touch. So she is leading you on, right? | |
| Well, yeah. So she's using your attention, your obvious desire for her, I mean, look, women know when you like them romantically. | |
| They know. There's never any guess, right? | |
| So any woman who knows that you like her romantically, who puts you in the friend zone without explanation, is cruel. | |
| Yeah. Especially when she's done a huge amount to lead you on, like spending four days with you and saying, it's the best time ever, we've got to stay in touch, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, right? | |
| Right. Okay, so she's kind of cruel. | |
| So... This is your red flag, okay? | |
| You make up virtues because women are pretty. | |
| In other words, welcome to being a man. | |
| Welcome to having a penis. | |
| We make up virtues because women are pretty. | |
| That's the deal. That's what we do. | |
| That's life. That's our big giant red flag. | |
| You know, there's these... | |
| Have you ever heard of dousing? | |
| I... I haven't heard of it. | |
| I'm not sure what it is. So, you want water and you just make up a virtue in the stick called dousing rather than doing the hard work of just doing a bunch of digging. | |
| You wander around wasting energy because, you know, you're trying to take a shortcut. | |
| You want water and you just imagine there's some magical way to get it. | |
| So, you want a girlfriend, so you find a woman who's attractive and then you make up all these virtues that she has that she doesn't have. | |
| In fact, she has kind of the opposite, but she's pretty. | |
| And she's charming and she's smart and she's funny. | |
| And you're like, oh, well, no. | |
| Well, clearly, because I want to inseminate her, we must share the same values. | |
| Right? Because remember, your body doesn't care that much about values. | |
| Now, your mind, your heart, your soul, your higher consciousness, whatever, your philosophical side, yeah, that cares. | |
| But your balls just want to make another round of balls. | |
| Your toes just want to make more toes. | |
| Your liver just wants to make another liver. | |
| Blind photocopying of mammalian structures, right? | |
| That's our inheritance. And this war between the higher self that wants values and the lower self that just wants a squirt and a new baby, we've got to be aware of that as men, right? | |
| I mean, listen, as a Christian, I'm not telling you anything you don't know. | |
| But to the girdle do the gods inherit. | |
| Below is all the fiends, right? | |
| In other words, waist down is all the devils, right? | |
| Yeah. So you want a girlfriend. | |
| She's pretty. She's charming. | |
| She's funny. She's available. | |
| And you just... | |
| Your mammal self is like, reproduce, photocopy, photocopy, photocopy. | |
| And then your conscious self, your upper mind says, well, but you know, values are really important to us. | |
| And then your balls are like, oh, yeah, she's kind, man. | |
| Yeah, she's nice. | |
| She's kind. She's sweet. | |
| We believe in the same things. | |
| We share the same friend groups. | |
| We share the same religion. | |
| Do it! And then your higher conscious is like, Meth addict? | |
| No, no, no, no! She was, as Jesus among the lepers, she was moving among the downtrodden with Christly love, and it's like, just for God's sake, let me ejaculate near an egg. | |
| Please, God above, what do I have to say? | |
| What virtues do I have to imagine so that we can dump near an egg? | |
| And listen, you face it, I face it, every single man, and women have their own thing, right? | |
| But we're just man to man here, right? | |
| Every single man faces this challenge. | |
| Faces this challenge. | |
| This is all the way back to when I was, I don't know, 14. | |
| I still remember the woman's name, girl's name. | |
| I wanted to ask her to the dance. | |
| Why? Why? Because she was real pretty. | |
| Was she a nice person? | |
| No. Was she smart? | |
| Absolutely not. Was she pretty? | |
| Oh yeah. And I remember a word got out that I wanted to ask some girl to the dance. | |
| And half the class cornered me out of fascination to just ask me, who are you going to ask? | |
| Who are you going to ask, man? Who are you going to ask? | |
| And eventually I said this girl's name. | |
| And everybody laughed at me. | |
| Of course they did! They recognize the difference in our characters. | |
| And I said the girl's name. | |
| Everyone kind of, not laughed exactly, but just kind of rolled their eyes, particularly the girls, right? | |
| Because the girls all knew what it was about, right? | |
| And then people said, why? | |
| And I said, her personality. | |
| Her personalities. Wait, her personality. | |
| Singular, singular. You're deceiving yourself. | |
| Well, and then she laughed like, ha, ha, ha. | |
| Like, from across the room, just this braying laugh like a donkey being machine-gunned. | |
| And it was just perfect. | |
| It was at that moment, I was like, yeah, I'm just making up a virtue called personality, because she's pretty! | |
| She wasn't a particularly nice person. | |
| She wasn't smart. I mean, she was fine, I suppose, right? | |
| But not someone I could have any kind of life with in any kind of long-term scenario. | |
| But, you know, I was young, dumb, and full of something or other. | |
| So... You get turned on, and I don't mean that's just physical, right? | |
| It's the cuddling of the girlfriend, the personality, maybe the wife. | |
| It's not just sexual, but you get turned on to a woman, and then because you have this requirement called values, shared values, your brain is just like, oh yeah, we can make up these shared values. | |
| Hey, if making up shared values is how we get, perhaps, to reproduce, sure, we'll do that. | |
| Because you understand that women, sorry, men in the past who didn't make up those shared values rarely got to reproduce, right? | |
| Right? Right. | |
| Oh, she's got to be kind! | |
| Oh yeah, no, I saw her pet a cat once. | |
| She's totally kind. Let's do it. | |
| As opposed to, she's got to be kind, so I'm going to explore her capacity for kindness over a span of more than four days of shopping. | |
| I'm going to really, truly find out that she has these values. | |
| I'm really going to not just say them, not just write, but I'm going to actually find out if she has these values. | |
| Right, so I might say, you know, things are moving kind of fast here. | |
| Is this unusual for you? Or I might say, what was it in your life that had you dating a meth addict? | |
| That's a pretty wild story. | |
| I'm not some big harsh judgment thing, but, you know, I'd like to sort of understand the mechanics by which that came about because I've never known anyone who's had that experience and how did that come about and how long did it go on for and what happened and is he clean and all this kind of stuff, right? | |
| Find out if she really is going to be honest when it's difficult because, you know, The whole point of virtues is when it's difficult, right? | |
| You don't need to diet when you're on a desert island, right? | |
| You need to diet when you're on a cruise ship with a buffet of 60 billion calories staring down your pancreas, right? | |
| Yeah, right. So you, and this is why I said, remember I said earlier, we've got all the time in the world, right? | |
| We've been over an hour now, right? All the time in the world, and it's a huge topic. | |
| Because lying yourself into imagined virtues... | |
| Is a bear trap for the balls for men. | |
| Because you imagine these virtues and then you bond not with the girl. | |
| You don't bond. You've not bonded with her. | |
| You've bonded with your imagination about her. | |
| You've bonded with your fantasy about her. | |
| You've bonded not with her values, which don't seem to exist. | |
| In fact, quite the opposite seem to exist. | |
| You've not bonded with her values. | |
| You've bonded with your projection of your values onto her. | |
| Right, yeah. | |
| Now that's a different situation. | |
| So she's not rejecting you. | |
| By putting your values onto her, you're rejecting her. | |
| If you have to make up values for her, which don't empirically exist in her actions, if you have to make up values for her, you're rejecting her. | |
| She's just rejecting you back because you feel like a victim. | |
| I don't think that's true. This is how I want to keep you empowered, so I want to keep your heart open so that you can genuinely fall in love with a truly good woman. | |
| If I say to my girlfriend, I need you to wear a Kim Kardashian latex mask, right? | |
| Right. What am I saying about her level of attractiveness to me in her natural state? | |
| Well, you're not attractive enough for me. | |
| I need a Kim Kardashian. | |
| Right, right, right. | |
| So, if you have to project all of these values onto her, she unconsciously gets that you don't believe she has them. | |
| And frankly, you're right. | |
| You're right. She doesn't have that. I'm not saying she's a bad person or a terrible person. | |
| I'm just saying that for all of the positive values that you espouse, there's no evidence for them and there's evidence for the direct opposite. | |
| Right? So, here's the thing. | |
| With the girl when I was 14... | |
| Why did I have to say her personality? | |
| Because she didn't have a personality that was attractive. | |
| And she didn't, in fact. | |
| So I was rejecting her. | |
| I had to make up something that she didn't have called a pleasant or positive personality because I didn't like her. | |
| But my balls wanted me to like her. | |
| Of course, this was long before I'd had any sex. | |
| I'm just talking about, in general, the reproductive aspect of things, right? | |
| So my genetics wanted me to superimpose a good personality on a bad personality because she had fertility markers that I found attractive, right? | |
| So that's a rejection of her. | |
| Anytime you are attracted to a woman for things that are not quality of character, You are rejecting her. | |
| If you're attracted to a woman because she's pretty, you are rejecting her personality, if she doesn't have a nice personality. | |
| So you feel like she's rejected you and you're just reaching for her and you want, right? | |
| But understand that in those four days, she absolutely saw you making up all these virtues and values and then putting them on her. | |
| Why? Because you knew she didn't possess them herself. | |
| Now, she tested you. | |
| She gave you a test to see if you had any capacity to see a flaw in her. | |
| I failed the test. | |
| Right. It's called a shit test. | |
| I'm sure you've heard of this before, right? | |
| Now, you know what her test was, right? | |
| Well, the things we've mentioned, yeah. | |
| Yeah. I dated a meth addict. | |
| Okay, let's see if he's going to have any skepticism about the quality of my character and see me for who I actually am, or is he just going to be so besotted by me and so in lust with me that he's just going to gloss over that and pretend it didn't happen and still call me a wonderful person? | |
| Am I talking to his brain or his balls? | |
| Am I talking to his heart and his soul or his DNA and his genetics? | |
| Am I talking to a man or nature's photocopier? | |
| I'm not saying this is conscious. She wanted to be challenged. | |
| She wanted to be challenged on it. | |
| She wanted to be called up on it. | |
| Of course she did. Yeah. Of course she did. | |
| Yeah. A woman cannot love a man who defers to her. | |
| Right. Now, I think the same thing is true for men as well, but we notice it less because nobody defers to us. | |
| So, you know, it doesn't really happen, but I'm talking about practical things. | |
| If you just head over heels and everything she says is right and you worship her and she can't do any wrong and everything she's done is explainable and she's got all these great qualities, if she doesn't feel that way herself, she knows she's got issues. | |
| She knows she's got problems, even if it's just unconscious. | |
| And if you're glossing over all of those problems, it's just lust that's driving you. | |
| And listen, lust is a great thing. | |
| I don't mind lust. I think lust is wonderful. | |
| Lust is why we're all here. Lust is a great driving force in life. | |
| But it's got to be tempered by values. | |
| Otherwise, we're just animals. | |
| Except we can't be animals. | |
| We're just corrupted people. | |
| Devils, so to speak, right? | |
| So you had a wonderful encounter with the devil. | |
| I mean this in all seriousness. | |
| Right, yeah. Foundational commandment, thou shalt not bear false witness. | |
| When you project values and virtues onto a woman that she does not possess, are you lying? | |
| Maybe not intentionally, but... | |
| No, but... Again, I agree, not intentionally, but now that you're aware of it, and now that everyone who's listening to this is aware of it, you know. | |
| You know. And you would end up rejecting her. | |
| Because once your lust was satisfied, and I don't just mean sexually, but whatever possession might be the case, then you would find it increasingly difficult to project all these imaginary virtues onto the woman, and then you would dump her. | |
| Or you would make things more difficult. | |
| Or you'd have an affair, right? | |
| Or be unhappy for the next 40 years. | |
| I'm sorry? Or be unhappy for the next 40 years. | |
| Or be unhappy for the next 40 years, right? | |
| So, the devil came along and you know how the devil operates, right? | |
| The devil is pretty. The devil gives you lust. | |
| The devil gives you temptation, right? | |
| Yeah, right. And you did not look for her soul. | |
| You merely looked at her flesh and her charm. | |
| Now, the devil is, of course, charming. | |
| We know that for a fact, right? | |
| Of course, I'm not saying that the girl is the devil, just so everyone knows. | |
| I'm not saying the girl is the devil. | |
| I'm just talking about the mechanics by which these... | |
| Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no. | |
| But this is the temptation paradigm. | |
| Right? That we're tempted to betray our values. | |
| We're tempted to betray ourselves for momentary gain. | |
| And I do it. | |
| I have betrayed my... | |
| Values for the sake of momentary gain. | |
| I have done it. I'm sure I will do it again in the future. | |
| It's something that we just have to keep an eye on. | |
| Now, sometimes that's fine. | |
| Honestly, sometimes that's fine. | |
| It's not a huge deal. | |
| I've done it in some fairly significant ways, which I can talk about perhaps some other time. | |
| And I'm at peace with that. | |
| And the reason I'm saying this is not to draw your attention to me, but just so you don't think I'm some guy on a mountaintop who's never made a mistake. | |
| I've done all of the things that you have done, and I did them much older than you with much less excuse. | |
| So I'm right down in there with you about these devilish temptations. | |
| The temptation is to lie to satisfy the baser impulses. | |
| Right? This is why the most important commandment to me is thou shalt not bear false witness. | |
| False witness. Now, false witness, I talk about this in my novel, false witness is an interesting phrase. | |
| It doesn't say thou shalt not lie. | |
| It says thou shalt not bear false witness. | |
| False witness is like in a trial. | |
| Right? It's like perjury. | |
| It's like about really important things. | |
| It's not about, oh yeah, that dress looks really nice when you don't think it looks really nice. | |
| That's not what they're talking about. | |
| Little white lies. I don't care. | |
| But in matters of deep conscience, in matters of great importance, you must tell the truth. | |
| Now, even if you only tell the truth to yourself, that's really important. | |
| So then you have to look. You're drawn to a woman. | |
| She's charming. She's pretty. | |
| She's available. She's fun. | |
| Could solve all of your life's problems, could get the girlfriend, you think of a future together, a life together, a family together, kids, grandkids, right? | |
| Perfectly understandable, right? | |
| That's the temptation. | |
| And then you have to say, for every value you ascribe, you need proof. | |
| Right? Because it's easy to say, so-and-so, this girl is very kind. | |
| Why? Because she seems nice. | |
| Well, you can fake anything for four days. | |
| Hell, with enough toothpaste, I could probably fake an orgasm for four days. | |
| Some tantric fluoride situation with a swamp at the end, right? | |
| So, you have to be rigorous with yourself and say, faking virtues, listen, does faking virtues get you into heaven? | |
| Does God know? Of course not, no. | |
| Well, God knows. And faking virtues... | |
| Sorry, I asked that question in a bizarre way. | |
| So God knows. Faking virtues doesn't get you into heaven. | |
| You have to genuinely pursue them, right? | |
| Has God given you the ability to interrupt your base desires with moral judgment? | |
| After this conversation, I'm beginning to think maybe not. | |
| Oh no, he gave you the ability. | |
| No, he has. | |
| Yeah, of course. Culture and society have stripped that stuff away, like sandblasting on a sandcastle. | |
| I mean, this is the whole point of Christianity, right? | |
| It's that you have the baser impulses, and you have the higher self to question them and to... | |
| Block them if necessary, right? | |
| I mean, we all have that. Like, everybody wants to... | |
| I love carrot cake. Carrot cake is my big thing, right? | |
| And I will have carrot cake maybe once a year. | |
| Because seriously, I can just go... Especially if it's got that nice cream cheese icing, couple of nuts inside. | |
| I can just mouth through that stuff like it ain't no thing. | |
| So I just can't have it in the house. | |
| I just... Right? Everybody has this. | |
| I don't really feel like exercising. | |
| I had to take a week or two off exercising recently. | |
| And I don't really want to get back into it. | |
| But you just make yourself do it. | |
| Right? So we all have this, you know, base stuff. | |
| And like I want to eat. And I want to drink. | |
| And I want to... | |
| You know, whatever. Math, I guess. | |
| Right? For some people... And we have to say no. | |
| We have to be disciplined with ourselves for the sake of the blah, blah, blah. | |
| Now, so God tells you very clearly, you're going to be tempted. | |
| And that temptation is going to look like a good thing. | |
| That's the whole point of temptation. | |
| It looks like a good thing, right? | |
| And so when you're falling for a really good thing, that's when you need... | |
| I don't need any discipline when it comes to Brussels sprouts. | |
| Because they're just like Satan boogers to me. | |
| I can't stand those things. I don't need any discipline to not eat a bunch of Brussels sprouts. | |
| I need discipline with carrot cake or fruit smoothies or like whatever is my particular weakness, right? | |
| So you need to be at your most alert when you find something the most attractive to be skeptical, to interrogate, to double-check because we know for sure that Satan tempts us with that which is attractive to us, right? | |
| If somebody's gluttonous, Satan will tempt them with food. | |
| If somebody is lustful, Satan will tempt them with sex. | |
| If somebody is ascetic, Satan will tempt them with complete withdrawal from the world, right? | |
| I mean, so... | |
| Yes, C.S. Lewis said, the road to hell has got to be made attractive. | |
| Absolutely. Absolutely. | |
| So, this was your Christian moment. | |
| I think a chance to more deeply appreciate... | |
| The religious instruction that you've gotten. | |
| So this woman came along and kind of love-bombed you, right? | |
| Four days straight, shopping, laughter, fun, dinner, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, right? | |
| Right. And then you bore false witness. | |
| I'm not saying consciously, I'm not calling you a liar, but I'm saying that you bore false witness. | |
| Because you ascribed to her virtues that you did not have, and remind me what you said, and she brought up the meth thing, and you said, I didn't want to pursue it because... | |
| Why? What was that? I didn't want to make her uncomfortable. | |
| I didn't want to seem intrusive. | |
| Maybe having recently met her, I didn't want to seem like I was pestering her. | |
| I can't remember what I said to you about that. | |
| I'm not trying to cross-examine you here, but earlier you said. | |
| But you didn't want to make her uncomfortable or something like that? | |
| Yeah, probably just didn't want to, you know, be intrusive. | |
| Right. She's opened up about something very personal. | |
| I feel like, you know, the last thing... | |
| It's different, you know, obviously when someone calls into a show, it's different. | |
| You've got to be... | |
| Oh no, it's much less important when someone calls into a show. | |
| It's much less important. | |
| Because we're not going to maybe have a life together, I'm not going to give my heart to that person, all that, right? | |
| Okay, so let's revisit this, because I think that there's still a layer or two of bare false witness in what you're saying. | |
| You didn't want to make her uncomfortable. | |
| Is that really the truth? | |
| Maybe I didn't want to make myself uncomfortable. | |
| Okay, what would have made you uncomfortable? | |
| Perhaps hearing about all the details, maybe. | |
| Okay, so you hear about all the details. | |
| And then what? Suddenly maybe she's not so virtuous. | |
| Then you can't project false virtue onto her. | |
| Right. Somebody tears down that movie screen, you're just shining a bunch of light into the darkness, right? | |
| Right. So what's the most honest thing that you could say? | |
| And please, I know you're not dishonest. | |
| I mean, I'm just, you know, in terms of like crazy rigorous standards, right? | |
| What's the most honest thing you could say about why you didn't want to pursue the meth addict boyfriend topic? | |
| I think you summed it up probably pretty well. | |
| I couldn't project virtues then. | |
| I mean, I wouldn't have articulated it like that at the time. | |
| But deep down, I'm sure that's what you were getting, right? | |
| I think you didn't want to... | |
| So, one of two things. | |
| Either she tells you a bunch of gory details that make her unpleasant. | |
| In other words, the pretty mask comes off and you see some of the monster, which we all have underneath. | |
| Or she gets really testy and aggressive, right? | |
| Right, yeah. And that's also kind of unpleasant. | |
| I think the fact that she brought it up, though, I doubt she would have been defensive because, like you said earlier, I think she wanted me to prod her on it. | |
| She was a shit test, as you said. | |
| Right. Okay, so that's one level of honesty. | |
| Okay, here's another level or question of honesty, which is this. | |
| Why did she, and we talked about that test, right, but why did she bring up I mean, this is a pretty wild thing to bring up. | |
| It's not really exactly a first date, but the first time you're really spending any time together. | |
| What was the reason she was bringing this up? | |
| Sorry, what was the reason she was bringing it up? | |
| Yeah, why did she bring up this boyfriend? | |
| Well, I told her some personal things about past relationships. | |
| She was being reciprocal. | |
| She even said, oh, it's not as bad as being in love with a meth addict. | |
| That wasn't the first thing she said. | |
| She said that after she brought it up in a more sensible way. | |
| She said, oh, my ex was a meth addict. | |
| I'd been telling her about dysfunctional Right, now of course we have two layers of things, | |
| right? We have a layer that wants praise and we also have a deeper layer that wants correction. | |
| So, deep down, she saw that you were a sort of very real, honest guy in this way, right? | |
| Yeah. So, deep down, what did she want from you that she couldn't get from anyone else? | |
| Well, yeah, like you say, honestly. | |
| Right. Right. Can you see the real wound under the pretty exterior? | |
| Or are you just like the other guys who get fooled by everything all the time? | |
| Sorry, you cut out then, sorry. | |
| Or are you just like the other guys who get fooled by everything all the time? | |
| Hello? | |
| Hello? | |
| Yes. | |
| Can you hear me? | |
| Oh, I'm back, yeah. You're back. | |
| Okay, yeah. So, or are you just like all the other guys who get fooled by everything all the time? | |
| Are you interested in the real me? | |
| Yeah. Are you interested in the real me, she asks, or are you just dazzled by prettiness and hormones? | |
| Yeah. And again, the reason I'm bringing all this up is you're a super smart fellow who can process it very quickly, but also because you feel rejected when quite the opposite occurs. | |
| I bet you if you had really talked to her honestly and frankly about the revelations she gave to you, I bet that you certainly would have a more real relationship Whether you would have a dating relationship, I don't know. She probably has a whole lot of work to do to figure this kind of stuff out. | |
| But I think that something very real and positive would have occurred. | |
| And I think that the reason that you feel upset or tortured by this... | |
| We generally feel tortured by things we have yet to fully understand. | |
| Right. And so if you understand that you rejected her only as a consequence of rejecting yourself... | |
| Right, so tell me what you felt when you heard Boyfriend Meth Addict. | |
| What was your first thought or feeling about that? | |
| Well, surprise. | |
| The last thing I expected. | |
| Yes. Yeah, and I'd say that's a surprise, maybe disappointment. | |
| Some shock, some disappointment, some oh no. | |
| Yeah, yeah. Now, when you got those feelings, your soul, your heart, your brain wanted to explore them, and your mammal, your balls, your genetics wanted to do what? | |
| Ignore it. Exactly. | |
| Because it might interfere with making another you, right? | |
| Right, yeah. So you rejected her. | |
| So you came in feeling rejected, and I'm giving you two more layers. | |
| One, you rejected her, and B, you only rejected her because you rejected yourself. | |
| You rejected your own thoughts and instincts and feelings about what she was saying. | |
| Right, yeah, that makes sense. | |
| Now, if you don't reject yourself, you will be safe. | |
| You will be able to have an open heart. | |
| You will be emotionally available to others. | |
| You will be able to fall in love with a good woman, but you must, must, must listen to yourself. | |
| If you reject yourself, you will be exploited by others. | |
| If you remain respectful and openly curious towards yourself, then you will be safe in this world and secure in your ability to fall in love. | |
| Could you repeat that last part you said? | |
| If you reject yourself you will always be exploited and you will always feel like a victim when you are in fact victimizing yourself. | |
| If you accept yourself and remain open and curious towards your own feelings and your own instincts and slow down and accept with curiosity what your impulses and questions are you will remain open-hearted and retain the most glorious capacity to fall in love. | |
| But if you reject your own instincts, you are blind to the dangers of this world and will forever be walking into things to the point where you end up completely paralyzed and unable to fall in love, I think. | |
| And that's why I wanted to spend as much time as necessary on this topic. | |
| Thank you very much, Stefan. | |
| I think you nailed it. | |
| Okay, so tell me... | |
| Let's just close it off with this, if you have time. | |
| Okay, so... Let's say I'm Mary. | |
| Yeah. And you were to tell me, as honestly as you could, what our interactions were like and what you experienced. | |
| What would you say if you were able to fulfill the do not bear false witness as much as possible? | |
| So this is when I'm with Mary. | |
| Yes, imagine her face to face. | |
| Is it after she told me about the Methodists? | |
| No, right now. | |
| Because you can still have this conversation with her if you want, right? | |
| Yeah, of course. | |
| I see what you mean. | |
| Yeah. | |
| I don't know what I can immediately say. | |
| I don't know. I mean, I would just, yeah, I would repeat a lot of what we've gone through about, you know, where were the... | |
| I wouldn't... I suppose I wouldn't say this to me. | |
| So where were the people in your life that, you know, supposed to be... | |
| No, no, no, that's asking her questions, and that's not admitting any fault in yourself. | |
| Oh, sorry, I see, yeah, yeah. | |
| Sorry that... I didn't say what was in my gut when you told me about, I think, what was going on then? | |
| Oh no, about myself, I see, yeah. | |
| So, look, I'm probably trying to appease you. | |
| I wasn't honest. | |
| I didn't, you know, I didn't say what I was feeling and what was it. | |
| It would be obvious, really. | |
| I was sugarcoating it, but I should have been direct. | |
| I should have asked you, what's going on with you? | |
| Where does that leave us? | |
| We've only known each other a few days. | |
| What's going on is... | |
| I don't know. I don't know what I would say. | |
| No, that's pretty good, man. | |
| That's pretty good. And look, I don't know what the answer is, but the sort of speech that's floating around in my head, which is not what you should say, but just I think what I would say in that kind of situation is something like, Mary, I really owe you a big apology. | |
| I really owe you a big apology because I find you very attractive. | |
| Your personality and your looks and all of that, and because I'm a little lonely and would like a girlfriend and so on, I was not honest with you. | |
| And, you know, when you told me about, you know, you had a boyfriend who was a meth addict and so on, that's a very big thing. | |
| It's a very big admission. And I skated right over that because I didn't want to interfere with anything that might fulfill this fantasy that, I don't know, we could be boyfriend and girlfriend or, you know, this could be, you could be my partner for life or something. | |
| And so I kind of used you and I skated over something very powerful and vulnerable and honest that you talked about. | |
| I just kind of blew past that. | |
| Which was wrong. It's not treating you as a full human being. | |
| It was not recognizing... | |
| I mean, I'm not saying it was a cry for help, but I think it was a cry for honest feedback. | |
| And I didn't give you that. | |
| And out of lust, you know, for your attractive qualities, which are definitely real. | |
| But I didn't give you... | |
| You know, as a Christian, we're supposed to talk about important and deep and meaningful things and not just go shopping and giggle. | |
| And going shopping and giggling is fine. | |
| But not at the expense of talking about real things. | |
| So I kind of scaled past that because of lust. | |
| And that was a sin. | |
| That was a dehumanization of you, just reducing you to flesh and charm. | |
| And if you do want to talk more about the meth addict boyfriend, which I understand would be difficult, it's totally up to you, I absolutely promise that I will listen very hard and I will not objectify you and I will treat you soul to soul as if You are just another one of God's wounded creatures, as we all are, and not just look at you as a flesh and charm. | |
| So I'm really sorry that I, in a sense, denigrated or dehumanized you or objectified you in that kind of way. | |
| It's kind of a temptation for men, but that's not an excuse. | |
| That's just kind of a causality. | |
| So I'm really sorry that I rejected you in that way and skated past something that was really important. | |
| And I completely understand why You're less interested in one-on-one time for me, because I wasn't honest and direct with you, and blew past all of that stuff, and that was wrong. | |
| And I'm sorry. I'm really sorry. | |
| Yeah, I remember all that. | |
| No, that's perfect. | |
| Yeah, you summed it up very well. | |
| Yeah. Now, listen, that may or may not end up with you guys having any kind of relationship going forward, but I'll tell you one thing, that will totally up what it means to have an interaction with her, for her, right? | |
| She won't be the same after that, right? | |
| So once she experiences that... | |
| Then that will be the new high-water mark. | |
| That will be the new standard for her, whether she likes it or not. | |
| This is why people hate it when you up your game. | |
| This is why we have such anxiety when we up our game, because we raise what it means to have a human conversation with somebody else higher than they've ever had. | |
| It's like if you've lived your whole life on prison food and then you finally get some really decent cooking, you can't go back to prison food, or at least you really know how bad it is now. | |
| So... She will never forget it. | |
| If you have that kind of direct honesty with people, it really changes what they think of in terms of conversation and relationships. | |
| And whether that's with you or with someone else, it's a very powerful thing to do. | |
| I mean, I obviously try to do it in these kinds of conversations, but we can all do it in our lives as a whole. | |
| Thou shalt not bear false witness, man. | |
| It's a tough one to follow, let me tell you, man. | |
| This is a tough commandment to follow. | |
| It's heart-poundingly difficult at times. | |
| But, you know, Satan wants to keep things shallow, right? | |
| Satan wants to keep things on the surface. | |
| Satan wants charm and sex, not depth and connection and love. | |
| Right. Absolutely. | |
| So how was the convo for you? | |
| Did we go to some surprising places? | |
| Yeah, definitely. I think... | |
| Yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head, really. | |
| It's just... I didn't go in even thinking I'd bring that up about the ex methodics and then you asking about that just brought that out and yeah and it's like I haven't even thought about it that much about that aspect I've been like you said so sort of projecting virtues projecting not thinking about the person but thinking about the idealised person really you realise don't you we're all guilty of I don't know Well, | |
| I mean, we have to see the human in each other, not the imaginary angel. | |
| You can't love the imaginary angel. | |
| We can only love the real person. | |
| And the real person means work empirically from their behavior, not from what we want. | |
| Well, if we say to someone, I have to imagine you to be a much better person in order to spend any time with you, that's humiliating to them. | |
| And it's tortuous to them, right? | |
| So now she's just humiliating and torturing you back by not wanting to spend one-on-one time with you. | |
| She's just paying you back at the same coin. | |
| Again, I'm not saying it's conscious, but she's just hitting the ball back that you hit to her, right? | |
| Right, of course, yeah. | |
| But yeah, try it. | |
| Even if you have to do it by phone, it's probably better if you have some eye contact. | |
| But yeah, I would say... It could be volatile. | |
| It could be something that erupts. | |
| It could be something where her inner alter ego is that prefer the non-relationships. | |
| They might come down like a ton of bricks on that, but nobody ever seen being good was easy, right? | |
| I mean, look back at old JC. He didn't find it too easy to tell the truth, did he? | |
| Right. At least we don't get nailed up, at least not yet. | |
| Not yet. Will you keep me posted about how things are going? | |
| Yeah, what's the best way to contact you? | |
| Yeah, you can just send me an email, host at freedomain.com, or you can message me here. | |
| But yeah, I'd really like to know. | |
| And if she wants to talk, I'm happy to talk. | |
| I'd be really quite fascinated to find out about this meth addict boyfriend and how on earth that came about. | |
| And it is, you know, it always is to me really surprising. | |
| And this shows you the difference between the inner and the outer, right? | |
| So we've all known super pretty girls who go for really bad guys. | |
| We've all known super charming girls who go for really bad guys. | |
| And it's a little incomprehensible because, of course, we're looking from the outside in like, oh, this is the alpha female. | |
| She'll get anyone she wants and then she ends up with this wastrel or this layabout or this addict or this mess or this underachiever or whatever it is, right? | |
| But that's because pretty on the outside often means invisible on the inside. | |
| You know, if you had to walk around town As a man dressed in a $4,000 Pierre Cardin suit with a million dollar watch Floyd Mayweather style or whatever on your hand and you had to have a security phalanx of 12 guys and a Lamborghini following you. | |
| Could you ever just have a normal conversation with anyone? | |
| All of this super wealth is completely visible to everyone around you. | |
| Your super importance is completely visible. | |
| Could you ever just have a nice, pleasant chat with someone? | |
| Probably not, no. No? | |
| No, it's like, you know, Freddie Mercury says, you know... | |
| He's just bored and living on tea in hotel rooms because he can't ever go out. | |
| Michael Jackson had his fantasy fulfilled one day when he hired a whole store so that he could go and do his own groceries without anybody. | |
| He got all these actors and hired the whole store just so he could pretend to do his own groceries for once in his life. | |
| So for a beautiful woman, for a very pretty woman, that's life. | |
| The prettiness is radiating everywhere. | |
| It's like, if you're a wealthy man, you can hide your wealth, right? | |
| You can dress down, you can go unshaven, you can not get a haircut, you can hide your wealth, no problem. | |
| But a beautiful woman can't really hide her beauty. | |
| So, just understand, for pretty girls, imagine being in a $6,000 or $10,000 suit with a million dollar watch, a Lamborghini following you, and 12 security guards all around you. | |
| Imagine going through life like that. | |
| You couldn't connect with anyone. | |
| You couldn't have a regular interaction with anyone. | |
| I bet you, you know, there have probably been half a dozen guys she told the meth story, meth addict boyfriend story too, and they've all just like, oh, move on. | |
| Right, yeah. I mean, this is what Nietzsche says. | |
| Truth always distorts around the very rich, the very powerful, the very wealthy, and the very beautiful. | |
| Truth always distorts. | |
| Around them. Connection. | |
| This woman's prettiness gets her a lot of attention and denies her connection. | |
| And if you can connect with her, give her that very powerful experience of bypassing the beauty to connect with her. | |
| And connection generally means contradiction. | |
| Like, I disagreed with you enormously over the course of this conversation. | |
| I think I did it in a positive way with great love and affection, but I enormously disagreed with you. | |
| With your being a victim, with this woman having virtues, with, you know, skating past the meth addict boyfriend story. | |
| I really disagreed with you. | |
| Now, I think we got a great connection out of that because I'm doing it in a very positive way and with great humility that I've made worse mistakes with less excuse. | |
| Sorry, that sounds almost like a humble brag, but you know what I mean, right? | |
| You didn't almost marry the wrong woman like I did when I was way old enough to know better. | |
| But it's very hard to disagree with beauty. | |
| the beautiful women often end up with the trashy guys because the trashy guys are often sociopaths who don't care about her feelings, but at least they won't appease her. | |
| So she feels more real to them than she does to the simps. | |
| And I'm not calling you a simp. | |
| I'm just saying in this particular moment, you could have been more honest, although you weren't conscious of it at the time, which I completely understand. | |
| The whole point of lying is it's supposed to be, Satan wants you to be unconscious of lying so that you don't feel like you're committing a sin, so to speak, right? | |
| So yeah, I hope that that explains a bunch of mysteries in life and I hope that helps people But, you know, really, shed a tear for the pretty people. | |
| Shed a tear for the pretty people. | |
| It's a very isolating phenomenon, which is why, of course, prettiness is not supposed to last that long. | |
| Prettiness is like 18 to 20, and then you're supposed to get married, you're supposed to work hard in the fields, you're supposed to have a bunch of kids, and you're supposed to fatten up like a Thanksgiving turkey to some degree, right? | |
| Right, yeah. But this prettiness just goes on and on and on. | |
| Like women milk it from the age of 18 until the age of 40, right? | |
| That's close to a quarter century of just milking something that's only supposed to last two years. | |
| You say, oh man, they're just eternal adolescence. | |
| They play video games into their 30s. | |
| It's like, yeah, but women are still milking youthful attractiveness without providing babies for decades. | |
| And it's really alien. | |
| And then by the time their beauty fades out, they have no capacity to bond and nobody wants them anymore. | |
| And it's a horrible, horrible life. | |
| So... That's the devil, right? | |
| The devil takes their soul, so to speak. | |
| All right, yeah, keep me posted about how things are going. | |
| I'm sorry we didn't get to more than one call, but this was such a powerful and juicy and deep one that I thought we'd spend the time on it. | |
| So thanks, everyone. | |
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| Lots of love. See you Friday night. |
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