Aug. 8, 2022 - Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux
10:53
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| So one thing that's always kind of blown my mind is the prevalence of this argument or this idea that If you gain any benefit out of a charitable action, it's no longer moral. | |
| It's no longer good. It's no longer virtuous. | |
| Hardcore altruism, Kantian style of altruism. | |
| So the argument is that if you have any self-interest, if you gain any benefit from being nice, then it's no longer nice. | |
| If you give to a guy on the street, a homeless guy on the street, because then you feel good about that, then it's selfish. | |
| It's about your benefit, not his benefit. | |
| And the only way... That you can be moral, truly moral, is not only to have no benefit, but maybe even to take a hit. | |
| So if it's unpleasant or difficult or negative for you, then it's a good thing. | |
| It's such a strange idea, the idea that we should operate without any self-interest, that we should be motive-less. | |
| We should be without motive, without any... | |
| Like, we should follow duty, right? | |
| Like, it's a duty to help someone. | |
| We don't like it. | |
| Maybe it's even more moral if we hate it, because that way it's definitely not confused with our self-interest. | |
| But it's a pretty wild notion. | |
| So why... Would this notion exist? | |
| That's something I always wonder. | |
| Like, there's no reason, substantially, for this notion to exist. | |
| So why does it exist? | |
| It's a big-ass question, right? | |
| Why does it exist? Well, I'm going to just put out a brief hypothesis here, and you guys can let me know what you think. | |
| So I think that it exists because... | |
| People can be so vampiric so predatory, so exploitive that even the idea that they have to offer gratitude is anathema to them. | |
| Even the idea that they have to be grateful, that they have to give thanks, that you're now owning them, you bully them because they have to give you thanks for the kindness, that there's any kind of reciprocity, any kind of go back. | |
| Reciprocity is really tough, really tough for people. | |
| It's a form of self-erasure, of course, to say, well, you can't gain any benefit out of this in any way, shape, or form. | |
| It's just not allowed. You can't get any benefit. | |
| That's saying you don't exist, and you're just like this machine. | |
| You have to have as much incentive as a machine that's programmed by a programmer called duty or obligation or whatever it is, right? | |
| You can't even say, I'm a better person, I'm a good person, I'm an honorable person, because that's going to give you some sense of vanity or some sense of pride or some sense of self-satisfaction. | |
| So none of that is allowed. None of that is allowed. | |
| So I think it's so you can be a machine, right? | |
| So, you know, if you've got a good waiter, you say, I mean, I do at least because I was a waiter in my teens. | |
| So I say, hey, you're a really good waiter and I really appreciate it. | |
| I kind of know what I'm talking about because I was a waiter for years. | |
| I leave a really good tip. | |
| Whereas if it's a machine waiter, like a programmed waiter, if it's a machine waiter, then you don't have to... | |
| Give thanks, you don't have to be anything, right? | |
| If a drone delivers your package, you don't thank the drone. | |
| If a driver comes, you thank the driver, right? | |
| So if you can turn people into machines programmed by duty who can gain no personal satisfaction or positive motive, then your need is what they have to follow. | |
| So if you portray yourself as needy, you can stretch this out into perpetuity, into eternity, really. | |
| Because the way it works in charity, right? | |
| The way it used to work in charity is if a woman got pregnant outside a wedlock, a charity might help her out the first time. | |
| But if she kept getting pregnant, they wouldn't help her out anymore. | |
| That would be the punishment, right? | |
| So they have to receive some satisfaction that they're helping her, right? | |
| Because if all they're doing is paying for her to have babies, she keeps having more babies, well, they're not really helping her, right? | |
| They're just enabling... Bad behavior, right? | |
| So the charity has to get some level of satisfaction and if that satisfaction doesn't occur, then they will be less likely to be charitable. | |
| But if you want to keep exploiting a charity, you should try to give them the idea that they should never gain any satisfaction out of helping you, that it's... | |
| It's irrelevant. It's immaterial. | |
| And that way they are obligated to keep helping you regardless of whether you change your ways, regardless of whether you show them thanks, regardless of whether you reform. | |
| So if you have someone you know and that person keeps getting drunk and getting into serious trouble... | |
| Then, let's say they're broke and they're a really good friend of yours, best man at your wedding, whatever. | |
| And then you say, okay, well, I'll pay for you to go rehab. | |
| I'll pay for you to go to rehab, right? | |
| Now, the reason you do that is you hope to turn their life around, that you're going to get the satisfaction of really helping them get better and their life's going to change and all these wonderful things are going to happen. | |
| And then you're going to feel some satisfaction, some pleasure. | |
| And your pleasure is you're helping, right? | |
| Now, if the person just keeps crying on your lawn and gets drunk and you pay for them to go to rehab or you pay off their gambling debts or you bail them out of jail or if they pay for a lawyer, if they got a DUI or something, like if the person just keeps screwing up and keeps coming back to you, at some point... Your pleasure in helping them will turn to anger and frustration. | |
| Now that's your emotional sign that you're enabling you're not helping. | |
| Right? So it's always the question if you have a kid, like you run a convenience store, and the kid steals a candy bar. | |
| Some kid steals a candy bar. | |
| What do you do? Do you call the cops, put the fear of God into them so that they veer away from stealing? | |
| Or do you say, well, you know, I'm sure they'll grow out of it. | |
| It's just kid stuff and all that. | |
| So To actually help people, we have pleasure in the anticipation of helping people. | |
| I mean, I remember I sent money to a listener who was going to get evicted, and he got a job with some coaching that I gave him, and then he just stayed up all night playing video games, got fired from his job because he didn't show up for a day or two. | |
| Obviously, the anticipated pleasure I had in helping him was turned to somewhat frustration, a little bit of anger, because he just didn't make the right choices based upon the support that he was getting, which was a shame. | |
| But lots of other people I've helped. | |
| I've paid for therapy. They've gone for therapy. | |
| It's really changed their lives. It's wonderful stuff, right? | |
| It's great stuff. So that satisfaction, that pleasure. | |
| And of course, the letters that I get from people, I posted a meme about me and eggs. | |
| And a woman said, hey, you saved my eggs. | |
| I'm having a baby next week. | |
| It's like, wonderful, congratulations. | |
| That makes it all more than worthwhile. | |
| So I still take enormous pleasure in helping people with philosophy because so many times it works out so wonderfully and so well and all of that. | |
| But if you have, I'm sure, if you've been in your life and you try to help someone, it starts off well, they're very thankful, they're very positive, but then... | |
| It goes bad. They exploit you. | |
| They whine. They complain. | |
| And you realize that giving them more money is just making things worse. | |
| And the way that you know that emotionally is you get exhaustion, frustration, irritation, anger, and so on, and a lack of charitable impulse, right? | |
| I mean, the addicts in particular can be real emotional terrorists when it comes to getting their resources. | |
| So that tipping point, like if you're helping people, you feel good. | |
| If you're enabling their bad behavior by removing from them the consequences of their actions, Right? | |
| Then, boom. | |
| Right? Like, think of Jim Morrison, right? | |
| Jim Morrison was, what is that? | |
| There's a line in Peace Frog. There's blood in the streets in the town of New Haven. | |
| Was it New Haven where he was accused of taking his pants off in a concert? | |
| And he was going to be sent to prison. | |
| I think he fled to France, Polanski style or whatever. | |
| Now, if he'd gone to prison, it would have been unlikely that he would have had whatever woman it was that he was involved in who seems to have, I don't know, enabled his drug addiction. | |
| So he probably would have lived. | |
| Now, of course, the last thing he wanted to do was to go to jail, but it would have kept him alive, at least to some degree, probably. | |
| He wouldn't have been able to have quite that hedonistic a lifestyle. | |
| So... If you've had someone you try to help, you're irritation at them not getting better or maybe getting worse and them continuing to beg and plead and bully and all of that. | |
| So if pleasure is a part of charity, then it tells you when to stop. | |
| Helping someone because you're not helping them, right? | |
| Some guy keeps getting drunk. | |
| You keep paying off his debts and you keep calling in sick for him at work, your roommate or whatever. | |
| Well, you're not helping him. | |
| You're just taking away the negative consequences of bad behavior. | |
| And clearly, he's the kind of guy who's only going to be able to learn from negative consequences of bad behavior. | |
| So you're going to have to let nature teach him consequences, teach him reality, teach him when because he's not listening to you. | |
| So that tipping point from pleasure to anger and frustration is when you stop helping. | |
| Now, if you are the emotional terrorist, you want to take the emotions out of the charity so that you can continue to exploit people, right? | |
| So you have to say, look, if you have a negative experience helping me, that means it's even more moral. | |
| But if you take any pleasure out of it, that's bad. | |
| And that's because it's a vampiric doctrine so that The people who want to exploit the living crap out of you can tell you that any emotional reaction you have to their continued exploitation and their lack of success in fixing whatever problem they claim you're helping them with if they just don't get better or they get worse. | |
| And they say, I have to uncouple all emotions from charity. | |
| Charity can't have any emotions associated with it. | |
| Well, then they just get to keep exploiting you. | |
| you and if you feel angry well that just means that it's even more moral for you to help them so it's a purely predatory ethic designed to widen your wallet to the very skies themselves to leave you absolutely defenseless in the vampiric pillaging of those who just bully and terrorize and victimize their way to resources and i think that's one of the reasons why it's remained so | |
| If you get frustrated and angry when you're helping someone, that's a really, really important sign that you're not helping them anymore. | |
| And if people really want to get helped, they should say, yeah, trust your gut, trust your instincts, trust your feelings. | |
| But the people who just want to pray on you will tell you to do none of those things so their vampirism can continue unabated. | |
| And I think that's why this ethic is put forward so much. | |
| But yeah, that's my thoughts. Let me know what you think. | |
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