Former Governor of Virginia, Bob McDonnell, knows what it is to be wrongly prosecuted and persecuted by the blood thirsty, Jack Smith. McDonnell has a background as an attorney, serving as a JAG officer in the Army Reserve and will speak to just how wrong and corrupt Smith’s office is run. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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You know, when you get involved in the legal system, it is not a fun thing.
And I know people who have been involved.
One of the things that bothers me about a lot of prosecutors is I think over time, many of them, for them, it becomes a battle of will.
It becomes about winning and losing when really lady justice ought to be the goal.
In other words, if there's enough evidence that suggests, that's exculpatory, that suggests that somebody is not involved in any real criminal activity or doesn't meet the statute level or what we were talking about in the last hour with Bill O'Reilly, of the 41 crimes brought by Fannie Willis down in Georgia.
You know, most of these require various forms of what's known as the criminal state of mind.
In other words, that a perpetrator would need to be aware that they're doing something unlawful.
Well, how do you get inside somebody's mind and find their true intentions?
Now, sometimes there might be damning evidence that would prove that.
I am doing this because I'm taking this election whether I won or lost.
Okay, that would be pretty damning evidence.
One such case, and it did involve the special counsel Jack Smith, and this was former Virginia Governor Bob McDonald.
And anyway, he was charged with 14 counts relating to what prosecutors at the time alleged was the acceptance of $135,000 in gifts.
Now, he was found guilty on 11 corruption counts.
Now, the case made it all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court, Jay Seculo arguing on behalf of former Governor McDonnell.
And the Supreme Court, by nine to zero, vacated the lower court's conviction, the whole thing.
Anyway, former Virginia Governor Bob McDonnell is with us.
Sir, how are you?
Hey, Sean, thank you for having me on again.
I appreciate it being on the show last night.
Really grateful to tell a little bit of the.
Sorry, just one quick footnote, and I didn't bring this before.
Jay Sekholo was a very important strategist and part of our case.
The Supreme Court case was actually argued by the great Noel Francisca, former Solicitor General of the United States under Donald Trump.
I'm sorry.
I knew Jay had some involvement in it.
That's all.
I apologize.
Great strategist.
And that $28 million, that was the sticker price of the legal fees.
But, Sean, you know, I've been a public servant for 38 years.
I had a legal defense fund that raised a little over a million, but there's no way a person like me or any average person can pay those kind of fees.
So that'll be a long time paying that back.
How many years do you think this took off your life?
I guess, you know, for four years, maybe if you figured out how to compartmentalize all this and deal with the stress that inevitably would come with this, what were those four years like?
Well, it was almost three and a half to the day, but another year before that, that there was an investigation.
Course, I didn't know much about it until there's an Easter Sunday front page above the story fold in the Washington Post, which followed about another 18 months of literally almost laughable regular leaks by the government of the Washington Post, including grand jury information, all to kind of tank the jury pool and I think try to weaken my resolve, Sean.
But I mean, we told him from the very beginning, there's no violation of the law here.
You know, there's no plea agreement.
We're going to fight this tooth and nail.
And, you know, I was really fortunate.
I had to do the top firms in the country, Jones Day, Holland, and Knight, that said, there's no crime here.
We're going to fight this for you.
But the poll on not just me, Sean, but my wife, my kids, four of the five hauled in front of a grand jury, essentially in insinuation that if they cooperated with their parents and worked with their parents, you know, my own kids, that there could be obstruction charges similar with some of my staff members.
And then the impact on the Commonwealth.
You know, I'm still trying to govern my last 11 months in office and do good things for the people.
And I've got, you know, this battle.
But you know what?
I can just say, just looking down the road now, the last seven years since the case has been over, you know, God is in the restoration business.
I'm back practicing law, consulting, teaching, on a number of boards.
And I've had a lot of redemption in my life.
And so many people came to my aid, Democrats and Republicans around the country during that time with amicus briefs being filed, Sean, to help me get vindicated.
How many DAs around the country wrote on this particular case and stood up for you?
It was astounding.
There were 13 amicus briefs filed.
Perhaps the two lead ones that were quoted by Justice Roberts in his unanimous opinion.
By the way, it's eight to nothing.
Justice Scalia, as you may recall, died two months literally before the oral argument.
I stand corrected, but with all due respect, I know Justice Scalia, I think I understand his judicial philosophy.
He would have been number nine.
Well, he was the one that had written most of the key opinions before that, basically saying all these statutes were unconstitutionally vague, regardless of the facts.
So there's no question it would have been 9-0.
But, you know, it was a battle.
Just one footnote.
You know, Eric Holder was attorney general of the United States at the time.
We asked to meet with Eric Holder.
He would not meet with him.
But the Deputy Attorney General and other lead prosecutors met with my attorneys.
We gave them about a 38-page brief outlining all the law of the land on this, the case law, the statutes, why their boundless theories, as John Roberts called it, of interpreting this law with their novel theories,
their two transactional immunity deals for the CEO businessman who was doing some other stuff that we didn't know about that was wrong, why his testimony wouldn't be believable, and yet they persisted, pulled the trigger.
And ironically, John Roberts' opinion three years later looked a lot like that brief we gave them.
And I just think they were much more interested, I think, to the point you made at the top of the show, in winning than getting it right.
But the amicus briefs, here's two.
One, every former White House counsel, now think about this, from Ronald Reagan to Barack Obama, the Barack Obama administration's prosecuting me, and yet one of their previous White House counsel joins the brief along with three other Attorneys General of the United States and spells out in very strong detail why this is wrong and his theory of the law could not stand.
And then Attorneys General of the states, 46 separate states, Democrats and Republicans.
In fact, actually more Democrats slightly than Republicans, but 83 filed a brief on my behalf as well.
And then many other Harvard law professors, et cetera.
So it was an outpouring, some of which we asked for, some of which just happened, Sean, because people saw the case for what it was, thought Jack Smith was wrong, and filed these briefs, and they were very instructive to the judges.
You know, I'm just looking at where we are now, and it seems like we've completely criminalized political differences here.
You know, I ran through the criminal intent bar that needs to be reached when it comes to Fulton County in the case that was charged Donald Trump this week, and I think that's a very high bar to reach.
You know, if you ask me if Donald Trump could pass a lie detector test that he thinks there was fraud in Georgia in the 2020 election, he'd pass that lie detector test.
I believe that with all my heart, having interviewed him as many times as I have.
And on the other side of this, then you look at Florida.
And, okay, they have the document case.
They raid Mar-a-Lago.
It's about top-secret classified documents.
And yet Hillary Clinton had more of them in 2016.
And James Comey has the infamous press conference and says, yeah, we found all of these top secret classified documents on her server.
And yeah, we believe it was hacked, but no reasonable prosecutor would prosecute.
When they talk about the potential of the destruction of surveillance video, well, Hillary Clinton destroyed 33,000 subpoenaed emails and devices that might have had copies of them with hammers, and nothing happened to her.
So I'm great.
And Joe Biden had top secret classified documents at four separate locations.
No rate against him.
So I'm very concerned about unequal justice under the law, dual justice system, you know, or we don't have equal application of our laws, and we've weaponized the justice system that is the executive branch that is Joe Biden's.
You know, that last comment is the greatest concern that I have, as we discussed last night, Sean, when you have a prosecutor who I believe, and my takeaways from my own case, like Jack Smith, you know, who's obviously Harvard law guy, had a good career prosecuting international crimes, et cetera, for the United States.
But over the five years that he was head of the public integrity section, you know, it was advising Lois Lerner that it was okay to go after conservatives for basically free speech issues.
It's not tax-exempt organizations.
It was the Bob Menendez case, which ended in a hung jury, the mistrial with John Edwards, and then my case.
You know, he was, he may be partisan in his own philosophy, but he has a penchant for going after high-profile cases of Democrat and Republican and stretching the law beyond the breaking point.
John Roberts called a boundless interpretation, which makes it essentially a fake statute.
And even Justice Breyer had strong comments and voted in your favor and voted to vacate this.
Well, I'm glad you brought that up because, you know, we thought Justice Scalia, of course, would be the champion.
And then as fate would have it, he passed away.
But the champion at the oral argument in April 2016 was Stephen Breyer.
I mean, he spent, he probably dominated half the argument with the government.
And from the very beginning, he and John Roberts just completely discrediting the theory.
And I get, you know, this is the quote of Stephen Breyer, and he asked the Solicitor General this question.
He said, for me, looking at the facts of this case and looking at giving this kind of power to a federal prosecutor who is virtually uncontrollable to determine what the bounds of the law are is as big a separation of powers problem as I've ever seen.
This is liberal justice, you know, liberal justice Stephen Breyer.
And I think he was exactly right in why the statutes have to be narrowly constrained and why prosecutors who would rather win than get it right, who don't call balls and strikes, but find a target and then go and find the fact that they can make up the theory of the law, why that's just dangerous for America.
And that's what leads to this weaponization of the system where you target people with the tremendous resources of the government.
You target them because they're high profile.
You stretch the law and hopefully you paint them in front of a jury so you can find 12 citizens that'll convict them.
That's the danger.
And thank God that's why we have a Supreme Court of the United States that's got it right in so many of these cases and reversed Jack Smith.
Is it fair to say that one loses four years of their life?
Now, I've interviewed Roger Stone.
I've interviewed Paul Manafort.
I mean, you look at their particular cases, all based on this phony Russia collusion hoax.
You know, the John Durham report, Operation Crossfire Hurricane never should have been opened.
The Durham report in great detail.
There wasn't a single point or fact of fact in the dirty dossier that Hillary paid for.
But yet that dossier, even though the FBI early October 2016 offered the author, Chris Steele, a million plus dollars if he could corroborate any part of it, he couldn't collect a penny.
But by the end of the month, they were using it as the basis of that VISA application, which at the top says verified, and nobody's held accountable.
I mean, what are Americans to think at this moment in time?
They can get away with that type of lying to a court.
If I ever lied to a court, Governor, they'd throw me away.
They'd lock me up, throw away the key, and I'd never be seen or heard from again.
I'd be talking to myself, doing my show for myself, to myself every day.
Well, felonies are perjury under American law.
But you ask the key question.
What are they going to think?
And that's the question in every one of these four cases.
What are 12 citizens sitting in judgment based on the facts of the case?
You know, as you pointed out last night, you're going to dictate a ham sandwich, but what's the evidence that's going to come in?
And then will a jury to try to interpret the law based on the jury instructions, will they find a violation?
And you put together this.
You've got the John Durham report.
It's pretty scathing against even having the special counsel.
You've got Robert Mueller, who was criticized as a partisan.
But look, at the end of the day, he called balls and strikes and he said there's no crime here.
You've had two failed impeachments.
You've had this Russian collusion since before the president actually got sworn in.
And now you've got four cases that are all set for trial, going to be set for trial likely in the first six months of an election year when he's the leading candidate for the president of the United States.
I think, Sean, even independent voters, which control every election, the nonpartisans look at that and say, there's just something not right here.
The justice system, which I believe, Sean, is a former prosecutor and former attorney general myself is the best in the world.
It's not perfect.
And in high-profile cases like this, we get it wrong when there's prosecutors that would rather win than get it right.
And I think a jury, at least one jury member, is likely to think this is way over the top.
They haven't proved it.
It's been a longstanding trial to try to get this gentleman.
We're going to let him go.
I'm not sure Donald Trump can get a fair trial in New York City, Washington, D.C., or Fulton County.
And that concerns, that should be concerning, obviously, to him, but concern every American as well, because justice should be blind, and we should have equal justice under the law and equal application of our laws.
Governor, I know you've got an event you've got to run to.
Thank you for sharing your story.
And I hope some of these prosecutors pull back.
It's not about winning or losing.
It's about, okay, what's right?
You know, justice.
What is, you know, what's right, fair for everybody.
I don't want Republican AGs going after people just because they disagree with them politically.
We don't want that.
Hey there, I'm Mary Catherine Hamm.
And I'm Carol Markowitz.
We've been in political media for a long time.
Long enough to know that it's gotten, well, a little insane.
That's why we started Normally, a podcast for people who are over the hysteria and just want clarity.
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Catch new episodes of Normally every Tuesday and Thursday.
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Hey there, I'm Mary Catherine Hamm.
And I'm Carol Markowitz.
We've been in political media for a long time.
Long enough to know that it's gotten, well, a little insane.
That's why we started Normally, a podcast for people who are over the hysteria and just want clarity.
We talk about the issues that actually matter to the country without panic, without yelling, and with a healthy dose of humor.
We don't take ourselves too seriously, but we do take the truth seriously.
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Catch new episodes of Normally every Tuesday and Thursday.
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All right.
Joe Biden opens his mouth.
And after he says the word partisan, see if you can ascertain what it is that he's actually saying.
But then, when I sign the bipartisan influx of gamblers, which Ron Johnson is friends with.
Wait a minute, go back.
Let's play it again.
The word after bipartisan.
What is that word?
But then, when I sign the bipartisan influx of gambish me, which Ron Johnson and his friends didn't vote for.
Go back one more time.
I still can't quite make it out.
Let's see if we can decipher this.
But then, when I sign the bipartisan again, Wishman, which Ron Johnson and his friends didn't vote, they all voted against.
Nah, he's not in cognitive decline, Hannity.
It's very mean of you to suggest that.
Okay.
And he's, you know, he's as strong as Arnold Schwarzenegger back in his heyday.
Can't we play the oldie but the goodie, though?
The one that started it all?
Storted it all?
What started it all?
Look, I'll do what he's unable to do.
I'll lead an effective strategy to mobilize true international depression, isolate, and punish China.
Oh, so there's your oldie but goodie.
Are you happy now?
Anyway, we take requests.
All right.
Let me play Joe Biden.
Seems to forget the word Maui as he's speaking about the wildfires.
Now, remember, he said he didn't want to get in the way.
The problem is, is, well, they're still looking for 1,300 people, over 100 confirmed dead, and getting in the way of what is pretty much now a vast wilderness because the place has been decimated.
So I'm not sure how him going there was such a big deal, although they made the, well, I'm going to, what's the name of that place again?
Is it Maui?
Listen.
In the immediate aftermath, the Coast Guard and Navy supported maritime searches and rescue operations.
The Army helicopters helped fire suppression and efforts on the big island because there's still some burning on the big island, not the one where you see on television all the time.
Uh-huh, the big island, not the one you see on television all the time.
That one.
We'll pick that one.
Lori is in Idaho next.
Sean Hannity Show.
Hi, Lori.
How are you?
I'm good.
Thank you.
I appreciate you taking my call, and it's an honor to be able to talk to you today.
Oh, it's an honor to have you.
Glad you could be with us.
Well, you're a good voice for America, and I really appreciate everything you say and the truth that you put forth because it's so crazy the way things we have to listen to.
It's insane.
But I just have kind of a concern.
I voted for Trump in the last election and the one where he became our president.
I think he did a fabulous job.
I'm amazed that anyone can say otherwise.
I think they must have blinders on or be living in another universe.
But I'm just really concerned this time because of what happened in 2020.
I feel like what do we do?
Like, Trump's obviously ahead.
I hope he's our president in 2024.
But what I'm concerned about is that I felt just as confident in 2020.
So I would be devastated if we had another four years of someone like Biden in office.
I think the country and the world would be devastated, to be honest.
And, you know, I'm very worried, very concerned for the country and the world.
I'm worried about the state of the world.
I think every hostile regime is taking full advantage of the fact that the U.S. role in the world is completely diminished.
They know this guy's compromised, and they're going to take full advantage of it.
And that means Russia.
That means China.
That means Iran.
That means North Korea.
Nobody fears Joe Biden.
And that's just a fact.
And that's a scary thing.
And look at the numbers on the economy.
I talked about it earlier.
They're just not good.
Americans' wallets are emptying.
You know, the cost of Biden's inflation, it's been as high as $10,000 a year.
Now it's down to about $8,500 a year.
That's money that people don't have.
And now gas prices are about to go up again.
Exactly.
You know, and we have 61% of our fellow Americans living paycheck to paycheck.
And the average American owes $54,000, has $54,000 in debt.
And all this Bidenomics, even fake news CNN pointing out, 51% say they think the economy is still in a downturn and getting worse, and it is.
Look at the price of mortgages.
What is that happening?
Americans, Bidenomics, we have more homelessness, according to Zero Hedge.
We're leaving more Americans homeless at a record rate thanks to Bidenomics.
It's a disaster.
Gas prices right back to nearly $4 a gallon again.
Home builder sentiment drops sharply.
Why?
Because nobody can afford a 7% interest rate after years of having 2%, 3, 4% interest rates.
Nobody can afford it.
Nobody's going to sell their home.
You want to build new homes?
Materials cost more.
All this obvious stuff around us.
I mean, it's like right in our faces.
Who is in, I mean, why can't other people see that?
Like, I don't understand how anyone can turn a blind eye to that and think that, oh, things are great right now.
And everything he's saying to us must be true.
It's all such nonsense, and I don't understand why there aren't people who...
It's not good, and...
And look what they're doing to Donald Trump.
You know, if you look at the calendar, and I've gone over it in great specificity and great detail.
You know, you look at what Donald Trump has to do in terms of his schedule.
All right, we have the first primary debate.
What is it?
I believe next week I'm going to be in Wisconsin to do the show after the debate, and I'll have the candidates on.
And then, all right, Donald Trump has to turn himself into Georgia.
Then in October, the civil trial with the New York Attorney General ran on a platform of getting one man, one family, one organization.
Okay, probably the, you know, there's no legal jeopardy there.
There's only a financial jeopardy.
But then January 2nd, special counsel wants a trial in the D.C. case, January 15th, the Iowa caucuses.
That's also the date they have scheduled for the E. Gene Carroll defamation case number two, mid January to early February, the New Hampshire primary will take place.
And now they're talking at the same time, what, the Georgia case is going to be brought, South Carolina at the end of February, almost the same exact time as the Georgia case.
And Super Tuesday is our March 5th.
And then March 25th, Trump, what, now he begins the New York City trial with Alvin Bragg.
How does this man run for president with that schedule?
And then in May, he's scheduled to begin the classified documents case in Florida.
Right.
Yeah, they've made it pretty darn impossible logistically for him to do it.
What are we supposed to do, though?
That's what I'm asking.
As popular as he is and as great as his numbers are, that would be.
Unfortunately, you are at the mercy now of our judicial system, which in and of itself can be dominated by judicial activism and judicial activists.
And that should concern everyone.
I mean, there are people that believe in our Constitution, fundamental fairness, the rule of law, the presumption of innocence, equal justice of the law, equal application of our laws.
And then there are people that are activists and legislate from the bench or have political biases that they carry in with them in these cases.
That should concern everybody.
You know, D.C., I'd rank them this way.
The worst venue for Donald Trump is D.C., New York City, not far behind.
Right behind that is Fulton County, Georgia.
Did he think Donald Trump deserves a change of venue?
Maybe Idaho.
That would be a much better place to have any trial.
But that's not going to happen.
That's my prediction.
They'll try, but it won't work.
Hang in there, Lori.
You know, this is going to play out how it plays out.
I wish we could do more.
Anyway, Ivan is in Florida, the free state of Florida.
What's up, Ivan?
How are you?
Hey, Sean, how you doing, man?
Yeah, Sean, as far as this fourth indictment, first of all, the system is rigged.
The crooks make and break the rules.
The crooks run the system.
And some of the judges are even political or crooked.
Deshaun, if the Democrats get their way and Trump is prosecuted for any of these charges, cheating will have been baked in the cake for all future elections.
Why would you ever contest another election as a Republican for fear of being prosecuted criminally?
Democrats will be able to cheat.
They'll be able to cheat with impunity.
I mean, and that's what they want.
Now, Sean, I heard some of the people asked on some of your interviews.
They said, why did they wait two and a half years?
It's like Democrats are always two steps ahead of us.
They play a different game.
And it's like if by law, federal election records and data, they have to be preserved for 22 months.
So if the Democrats had brought charges before the 22 months, Trump's team would have been able to get discovery.
And Trump may have been able to prove some of the things that he had been charging.
But after 22 months, Democrats can destroy the data.
So, you know, it's like.
Listen, I know that I read that Donald Trump wants to come out and and speak to the issue of irrefutable evidence in Georgia.
Think it's a mistake myself.
I honestly, it's elections are about the future now.
He's got to focus on the future, but yeah, he's got to defend himself.
I take issue with one thing you said, too, as well.
You know, no, if you're a Democrat, you could call elections illegitimate.
If you're a Democrat, you can talk about other electors.
If you're a Democrat, you know, all of this, you're never going to get in trouble.
And let me play this montage as I say goodbye to you and let you listen.
I believe he knows he's an illegitimate president.
I think it's also critical to understand that as I've been telling candidates who have come to see me, you can run the best campaign.
You can even become the nominee and you can have the election stolen from you.
I think he's an illegitimate president that didn't really win.
So how do you, you know, fight against that in 2020?
You are absolutely right.
The president is an illegitimate racist occupying the White House.
And I do have one very affirmative statement to make.
We won.
That I believe was a stolen election.
And I'm not saying they stole it from me.
They stole it from the voters of Georgia.
I think that pretty much speaks for itself.
We've got one minute left.
Let's give it to Joan in South Carolina.
One minute, Joan.
You got to go fast.
How are you?
Okay, I'm fine.
Just great to talk to you.
This is my point.
Don't you think we're being conned by the Republicans?
I mean, don't get me wrong.
I always vote Republican as a bit of two evils.
But don't you think it's insane that every crook that went after Trump gets no jail time?
Obama, Hillary, Mueller, Comey Brin, Ray Clapper.
They don't even get charged.
Forget about jail time.
They don't get charged.
Yeah, I don't think they want Trump as our president.
I think they want us to have another rhino like McCain or Romney or possibly even Pence.
I just don't think they want things to change.
They know Trump wants to clean things up.
They have a dream job.
What is Congress and the Senate?
What do they work two to three hours a day?
They get stock tips.
They become millionaires, lobbyists, great benefits.
Why would they want Trump to come in and change things on them?
I think most of them are against Trump.
And they don't fool me one bit.
I don't think they're trying hard enough because it doesn't make sense to me.
They haven't been able to put one of these crooks away.
And there's indisputable proof that these people are crooks.
I mean, we just had, I just listened to three different whistleblowers on January 6th that says that that was absolutely set up by Nancy Pelosi, and they told every reason why and how it happened.
So let me just say this.
I mean, we're living in very troubled, very troubled times.
And I know everybody, you know, is very angry, and you should be angry.
I just want simple things like equal justice under the law and application of our laws.
And we don't have that because the people, you know, Hillary got off the hook.
Joe Biden got off the hook.
The people that lied to FISA courts got off the hook.
The 51 Intel experts looks like has all the earmarkings of Russia collusion.
Nobody's held accountable.
They even get to stand by their statements.
And we, the American people, you know, we're the ones that are suffering the consequences of these horrific policies because of the people they want in power.
And now this is what I urge everyone to do.
Vote.
November 2024.
In Virginia, November 2023 for the Senate and both houses.
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Kennedy, tonight, 9 Eastern on the Fox News Channel.
New Fox News poll.
They now have him in double digits at 11 points.
Wow.
Vivek Ramaswamy, we've got a studio audience show.
We're going to give you the news that the mob and the media will never give you because they're obsessed every second, every minute, every hour of every day, every week, every month, every year about Donald Trump.
Yeah, well, Joe Biden has his own little bribery and money laundering allegation scandal going on right now.
And we've got new details.
New news tonight with John Solomon, Nine Eastern.
Set your DVR, Fox News.
We'll see you then back here tomorrow.
Thank you for making this show possible.
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