Roblox ICE Raids, God and Country, and the Epstein–Israel Connection — SF680
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The line between politics and culture keeps dissolving, from children reenacting ICE raids inside Roblox to declarations of national identity and unresolved questions that continue to surface around Epstein. We’re also joined by Sam O’Brien from True Gold Republic to talk about trust, value, and why confidence in systems — financial and otherwise — keeps eroding. The show then moves into Crack On, our recovery segment, grounded in lived experience, responsibility, and the steady work of staying sober in a chaotic world.
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Ladies and gentlemen, Russell Brand trying to bring real journalism to the American people.
Hello there, you awakening wonders.
Thanks for joining me for Stay Free with Russell Brand and what a spectacular and special day it is.
While all around the world seems to be in despair and disruption, we have found a line that we can follow.
Confidence means with faithfulness, con fidelity.
And we are confident because we follow a righteous path.
Narrow is the gateway though, so watch out.
If you're watching us anywhere other than Rumble or Rumble Premium, get on over here to Rumble.
Yes, X is a fine platform, but they don't pay us.
Rumble payers.
Get over here so we can fund the war.
Kaja Ka Kang, we're in a holy war.
That's the noise guns making it.
Kaja Ka Kang.
Joining me, as always, is beloved Jake Smith.
Nice hat.
Hey, thank you.
It's good to hear you say something kind.
Well, there you go.
It's once in a while.
It's going to happen once in a while.
Dave Fields is with us, you great field of wonder and glory.
How are you today?
I'm doing great.
Happy birthday for the other day.
Thank you.
Few people having birthdays.
Just go on and on.
Birthdays.
I'll tell you this.
If Joe and Massey, my beloved friends in the United Kingdom, right, one time I was with Fiddy Sent and it was my birthday, right?
And I was interviewing Fiddy Scent and I sort of go to him, it's funny interviewing you because it's my birthday.
And like, he was just like, yeah.
I said it a couple more times, see if I could get a tune out of him.
Couldn't.
It's my birthday, though, Sean.
Like, not Sean, that's the other one.
That's the one he's making a film about.
But Fiddy's got a proper name.
I know, innit?
What's Fiddy's real life name?
They've always got a name, rappers, that sort of undermines them.
Like Clarence or Claude.
Curtis.
Curtis.
That's it.
Curtis, well done, Joe.
Well done.
Joe, I like it.
What I liked it for.
There was this brief moment in our friendship when you would send me like rappers that were still making their stuff in jail and like using like, my microphone was a phone hanging out of.
Like you're like oh, that's the thing they give you for the bathroom in jail, from a bedsheet.
Uh, Masrell 20, Mazarell 20 yeah, Mazarel 20, and a kiddie called Marnes Malone was the other one.
Shout out to them, lads doing the hard yards behind bars, out on the landing, finding new and unique understanding, our brothers that are incarcerated.
We send love to you, we pray for your freedom, particularly those of you that are jailed injustly because of corrupt and disgusting systems.
We tell you there is a way out.
We will help to forge ahead the pathways for you and, come the day of the glorious revolution, you will be freed freed to fight the only battle that matters.
Over the course of the show today, we're going to be talking about the ice raids in Roblox.
My word, I let my kids play those Roblox.
I hope they're conducting those ice raids responsibly.
We're talking about the rise in Christianity, thank the lord, and we're also sort of this is my question and i'd like to put it to all of you.
Let me know what you think in the comments and chat.
Do you think the Epstein Epstein files are serving as a kind of revelation that's bringing about the kind of beast mentality of the end times?
Like when you read even in Matthew or Daniel or Ezekiel and of course the book of Revelation, what the end times will be like, you get the idea that we're being primed for a time of false prophets, false idolatry, the beast will come, nation will fight nation, there's going to be earthquakes, there's going to be famines.
Let me know in the comments and chat if the Epstein files and these kind of icky, disgusting, insidious, underbelly, upward ooze-like venom, a percolating funk coming up from the soil itself, kind of is a signal to you that the world is changing and it's changing fast.
If you know, and if you're listening to me now, you can tell I'm a person who's got the Lord with me.
Thank you, God, for being with me.
Come see me in Florida in the Panhandle doing my show, A Funny Thing Happened on My Way to Church.
There's a link in description.
You can get tickets there.
I'm doing some shows on the 16th, 17th of Feb, March 2nd and 3rd, around that kind of time.
Come see me.
It's good stuff.
Okay, let's get straight into the content without any more what I would call wanking around.
If you're watching us in the UK, we're very interested in the disruption and despair in the UK.
If you're watching us in the United States of America on Rumble, welcome, welcome.
Thanks for watching us.
We're talking about your country where people are turning into Christ in record numbers, perhaps because of the Epstein files and perhaps just because everyone's sick and tired of a disgusting society.
Now, Roblox is a new sensation.
And in the same way that when I was growing up, people would say, don't listen to NWA.
People are now saying, don't play Roblox.
Is Roblox a tool of the devil?
Or is it just harmless fun?
Certainly kids are doing ice raids in it.
tough times tough times for the Mexicans in roadblocks there or actually we're more likely Venezuelans I suppose in roadblocks um
Here is RFK, friend of the show, friend in general, who I've noted posts at the moment on an almost daily basis, something of practical help to you, like, don't drink oat milk.
Do you remember when they were telling us to drink oat milk?
I was sloshing that stuff like it was whiskey or champagne or something viable and trustworthy.
I was sloshing it down my neck.
I'd have been better off drinking monkeys cum.
It says here, does RFK, that God talks to human beings through many vectors.
Let's have a look at that.
What does he mean?
God talks to human beings through many vectors, through each other, through organized religions, through the great books of those religions, through wise people and the prophets and through nature.
Nowhere with such texture and grace and joy as through other human beings.
And when we cut off our relationships with other human beings, we lose that access to the divine.
And that is a healing power.
We are in a spiritual malaise in this country.
And we need to give people access to all different ways of reconnecting with something that is higher than themselves.
Certainly that seems to be a fundamental problem and challenge.
And why I feel doubly blessed is because as a person in 12-step recovery, I've been shown through the obvious metric of dependency on a chemical, in my case, heroin and crack, old school drugs.
That's like, you know, someone using a Nokia phone these days.
I know you have like fancy new fentanyl and meth that you can make at home and fentanyl that can kill you if you shake its hand.
In my day, you had to take heroin properly, like a grown-up.
You had to queue up, line up, you had to stand under a bridge, you had to go to a phone box.
Well, nevertheless, those things serve as very identifiable and recognizable false idols.
Even when you're off drugs, off off drugs, way off of drugs, and looking instead for a spiritual solution to what was always a spiritual problem, you recognize incrementally that you're probably attached to your identity, to your job, to things that might not at first look seem to be particularly negative, like food or sex or pornography or whatever.
So, what do you think of RFK's announcement that in fact there is a spiritual malaise across the United States of America?
Can you see that almost in every issue underneath it, there is a spiritual problem?
Whether it's the ICE raids and the crisis associated with those ICE raids, i.e., compassion unrooted from orthodoxy, or you could see that authority doesn't seem like it's connected to the people that are being impacted by that authority.
I'm aware that I need to clear my throat.
I can hear that.
I'm going to do it right now.
Out you come, you glorious thing.
That's probably caused by oat milk or one of the other alternatives.
There are worse white substances you could be sloshing down your neck hole.
Let me tell you that.
What do you think about the spiritual crisis in the United States of America, Dave?
Can you feel it?
Do you feel that in the last show we had, you talked about how the principles of recovery could be useful in forming new democracies?
And in our show in a minute, crack on, that's the name of it, crack on with Joe, Dave, and Russell.
We'll be talking about selfishness, the root of these problems.
Do you see your country, America, as a place that's in spiritual malaise, as described by Secretary Kennedy there?
Yeah, for sure.
I don't, maybe it has, maybe it has been for a long time, though, and we're just seeing it, we're just seeing it come out more.
I mean, I think probably most countries, most people just in general, are spiritual malaise.
Yeah, people are switched off, people have been sort of dialed down.
Yeah, actually, we're pretty blessed where we live because this part of the world where we live, people are switched on spiritually.
It's by and large a Christian community.
I've noticed the problem that you get there is where you have default Christianity, people probably don't investigate.
That's just my assessment based on living here for a year.
What I would call the darkness.
Whereas if you live in a secular culture, you may reify and even worship the darkness.
You may be trying to make an identity out of your sexuality.
You may be trying to make an identity out of your status.
And I don't say that those things aren't occurring within Christianity, but if you are a church-going Bible-reading Christian, you will at least be aware that those things are explicitly anathema and outside of the covenant.
We're living in a time of sort of radical, radical change.
But at least, I suppose, in the United States of America, loathed though he may be by the left, who, you know, for the left, for the establishment left, I mean, because I still hold a candle for the people of the left that are true radicals that are willing to sacrifice and suffer for what they believe in.
I don't mean when I say the left, I don't mean people that are really, really rich that go to fancy galas and wring their hands and bleed their hearts.
That's not the left.
The left when I was a kid was like fucking people like armed with Kalashnikovs going around Latin America starting revolutions as nature intended.
No, what I mean by the left these days is people that just will say things that are of the left.
Well, our president, your president, Donald Trump, says there's going to be a day of Christian worship on the 17th of May.
We will rededicate America as one nation under God.
Let me know what you think about that in the comments and chat, particularly if you're not a Christian.
We are going to do something that everyone said, like that's tough.
We're going to rededicate America as one nation under God.
You know, a lot of people.
I mean, maybe that's part of the reason that we're doing so well.
There's great, such great spirit.
It's all spirit and it includes religion.
I've always said you just can't have a great country if you don't have religion.
You have to believe in something.
You have to believe that what we're doing, there's a reason for it.
There has to be a reason for it.
We're all working and we're doing we're behaving.
I mean, I behave because I'm afraid not to, okay?
Because I don't want to get in trouble.
I think this geezer's authentic.
Every time, like, I drift sometimes into thinking, don't get into the false idolatry of liking Trump.
And also because I still watch a lot of content generated by people from the liberal establishment left.
I see their rage.
You know, if you watched the Grammys and then saw Trump acting like that, how do you reconcile that with their fierce vehemence and certain condemnation of him as a sort of an antichrist figure when he's personable?
When you sort of see in scripture the idea of false prophets and antichrists, you know they're going to be very sophisticated.
And like, I'm not saying that Trump isn't advanced intellectually in a variety of ways that make him effective as a president.
Plainly he is.
But he lacks a certain type of sophistication.
Do you know what I mean by that?
He's like, like, sort of going, I behave because, you know, like, look at that.
It's very sort of natural and like a normal guy in a weird way.
Like he lacks deception.
Like he eats that, you know, false pretense.
That's right.
I mean, he's too messy for it almost.
Yeah, there's an authenticity to him that he leans into that's been present with him presumably prior to his presidential campaigns, but I wasn't paying attention to him in that sort of way.
I was just, you know, he's in Omalone too.
There he is, you know, being mentioned in a rap lyric.
Like, I weren't paying it, oh, he's always wrote that book out of the deal.
I didn't really, you know, I wasn't interested like most people, I suppose.
But from the moment that he's been campaigning, right at the beginning, I'd love to watch again, Massey, we should do this actually.
We made a video, like, when I was still doing the trues, when Trump first announced and he said the thing like, like, you know, we've got rapists and racists and very bad people coming over here.
Like, when he did that, hey, my impression's improving.
Like, when like he, we did a video, like, sort of going, Trump can't be president, he's an idiot, and all that kind of stuff.
I'd like to watch that again, as a matter of fact, because what I think now is that the problems you have with Trump are the problems you have that are endemic and embedded in the system.
And even things that might be considered ghouling, like with his first term, the Muslim ban, the Muslim travel ban, right?
Or this term, the ICE stuff.
Both of those things are to do with nationhood.
But a nation is, and as a concept, includes exclusivity.
So those of you that think that those two issues in particular, the Muslim travel ban and the migration issue, are appalling.
And I speak as someone who has a great deal of compassion for people of different faiths and colors.
And I do believe in the possibility of people with different ideological and religious beliefs harmoniously living together if there is some kind of consensus, like you were saying yesterday, Jake.
As long as there is some sort of belief that this is what we're doing, like as you said, Jake was saying about 12-step programs.
Well, if you're in a 12-step program, you're there consenting that no matter what, you're not going to drink or take drugs.
Well, no matter what, you could say we love America.
But that's such a diffuse idea and you can break down every term in it.
can break down America because that's what's happening right now.
Some people are saying, no, America is a nation of immigrants and it's run by a migrant and you should have no...
And I can sort of see that and I can scripturally back that idea.
But what I suppose I'm always enchanted by in Trump is a level of authenticity that was mimicked ineffectively by Biden.
He was trying to be, I'm like a lovely old guy.
And even when Jim Kerry did him on SNL, they were trying to make it like Joe Biden's a folksy old dude, like that's like on a stoop somewhere or on a porch pontificating.
Rape Gangs and Economic Indicators00:14:29
But that's not what Joe Biden is.
Joe Biden was, you know, I don't rest his soul.
I mean, he's sort of essentially dead, but like, no, he's living.
I don't mean to be mean.
Like, he's a product of Washington.
And Trump is a product of commerce, isn't he, in marketing?
But he's not a product of the swamp.
So whatever flaws he has, they're not the same sorts of flaws that you're going to get from with a Gavin Newsome, a Kamala Harris, even an AOC who seems to have become quickly embedded and mind-venomed into the system.
Anyway, there's a lot there.
Let me know what you think about that in the comments and the chat.
And let me know.
And also what he's saying is, I would surrender a God and I'm afraid of God.
And that's the very kind of thing that I want to hear from people.
And to tell you the truth, we could do with in the UK, particularly in this time of crisis.
And that's what we're asking today.
Are the Epstein files and the revelations of the Epstein files showing us that we need to return to Christ?
That our models of nation are broken.
In the United States, you can see that from its peculiar and broken culture.
And in the UK, you can see it from systems that are crumbling and falling apart.
You only need to look at Keir Starmer, hands shaking as he stands in parliament, trembling.
Look at those clips.
In fact, look at it now.
That clip of Keir Starmer, he's hand shaking as he apologises for Peter Mandelson and recognize that what's required is radical change.
And it's not just the Epstein files, is it?
Because Britain is a country that has, it seems, seeded to all sorts of corruption, among them sexual corruption.
I'm of course referring to the rape gang scandal.
Now, our old friends at Polymarket, who you know, they'll let you gamble on near enough anything, or at least Pontifica on anything, are saying that overnight, the odds of Christ returning have doubled.
I mean, it's still only a 4% chance, and frankly, how would Polymarket know or anyone using Polymarket from whom the aggregated data is accrued?
But whether he's likely to return or not, one thing that seems certain is that we bloody well need him.
We need him in the United States of America and we need him in the United Kingdom.
Look at this story, for example.
This is the testimony of a rape gang survivor.
And in fact, for the documentary, we should locate and find this person.
This is the testimony of a rape gang survivor.
Let's have a look.
There's a very big network in Derby, Birmingham, there's Sheffield, there's Newcastle, there's Leeds, there's Barnsley.
You get taken to say Burton.
Oh my god, I've been there quite a lot of times, like in the Midlands.
And then he'd take you to a house and then they'd send men in like a conveyor belt.
What's going on?
What is happening?
Let me know in the comments and chat if you see these things as indications of the end times and see if you can kind of make the connection between, on one level, there are these low-level proletariat rape gangs and then there are these esoteric, upper-echelon sex trafficking, essentially rape gangs still, rape gangs that have as their members some of the most important and powerful people in the world who nevertheless are compromised and controlled by forces more powerful yet.
Again, in the reckoning of former MP and...
free speech hero, Andrew Bridgen, former member of parliament, that's like he was a congressman got kicked out for telling the truth.
Andrew Bridgen pointing out that some of the documentation in this recent set of releases confirmed that Epstein was a Mossad trained spy.
And then he goes on to say, bet the BBC won't report this.
They'll be sticking with the Russia-Russia narrative.
UK MSM is actually laughable.
So I suppose Epstein was close to former Prime Minister of Israel, Ehud Barak.
Barak trained as a spy under him.
Netanyahu was a criminal.
Interesting information, the kind of information that gets people killed.
So let me know if you agree with me that what the Epstein files ultimately represent is a kind of satanic power.
It's a revelation that your life and everything in it is downstream of spiritual warfare.
You are participating in it every time you make a choice, whether you reach for the candy or the pornography or for foul language and profanity, as I frequently do.
You've seen the show a bit I've cursed a bunch of times already today.
You are a participant.
You are a combatant in the spiritual war.
The environment you live in is not neutral.
It's a charged environment that wants you on low frequency activity, distracted and hypnotized continually.
The Epstein Files has brought it to the forefront and thankfully many, many people are turning to Christ.
Now I happen to believe that I've met in my own life, and this is something I'm still trying to work out, people that are not in Christ that are nevertheless holy.
To give you one specific example, Amma.
So I know there are saintly and brilliant people that are not Christian and yet I know for certain that we need Christ more than ever.
The Epstein Files shows us that.
But that's just what I think.
Let me know what you think in the comments and the chat.
We're going to have a quick message now from one of our partners and after that we'll be back with crack on with Joe and Dave, our recovery podcast where we talk about matters connected to recovery.
And if you're not recovering from drugs, well you must be recovering from something.
And if you're living in the UK or the USA right now, sometimes it seems like drugs wouldn't be a bad alternative.
Let's have a look at this message.
Here's what separates speculation from pattern recognition.
Gold and silver didn't surge last year by accident.
They moved because confidence in the system is thinning and history has seen this movie already.
Debt expands, currency weakens and people who were told everything was under control suddenly discover it isn't.
Venezuela didn't fall apart overnight.
It eroded, then collapsed.
That's why True Gold Republic exists, not to sell fear, but to explain reality.
True Gold Republic has released a 2026 expert guide that breaks down why gold and silver are rising, what those moves signal heading into 2026 and how physical metals can help restore a measure of financial independence.
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Welcome back.
Thank you for the support.
Surely you've noticed these days that we're on some periphery of Armageddon.
You might want to start investing in cryptocurrencies and maybe even precious metals of yesteryear.
We had a conversation with one of the sponsors of our show, Sam O'Brien, happens to be English from Stay Free Gold.
He'll explain to you why you should use actual lumps of real precious metals.
And to tell you the truth, he gave me a couple of lumps of actual precious metal.
I keep worrying because they are pieces of silver.
So I've got like real fear around Judas vibes.
But these are just two pieces of actual silver what he gave me that I'm going to give my daughters.
So have a look at this.
We'll be back in a second.
Sam O'Brien, thank you so much for joining me today.
Thank you for having me.
I have in my hand some actual tell me and the audience what these are that I'm holding in my hand.
These are silver American Eagle coins.
Oh, sir.
These are a rare commodity these days.
These have gone up a lot.
Today, these are about $85, $90 a piece.
Would they once have been a dollar?
They have legal tender value for a dollar.
Yeah, but worth that.
You know, they haven't been worth a dollar in a long time.
But if you bought them like a year ago, they probably would have been about $20, $25 a piece.
Is it actually made of silver?
Yeah.
I really like holding this.
interesting like the way that everything's become so ethereal and abstract and digital that it makes you feel like just holding even i mean unfortunately it's not 30 pieces of silver because that's what that judas What were you thinking?
What were you thinking, Judas?
And even the Lord would have forgiven him, I understand.
Father Mike Schwitz said in the podcast I had the other day.
Anyway, so like an actual piece of silver, a silver dollar is worth $85.
So that's an interesting indication of how inflation operates and that the government does literally have a license to print money and banks print money.
And I learned that from a very reliable source, Jeffrey Epstein.
He's not a personal friend, but I did see him say it in a video.
I was on a flight with him one time.
He said, like, we were going to go to a party.
He's got an island.
I've never been to Epstein Island, Sam.
But Jeffrey Epstein is actually good on finance.
You know, he really understood that stuff.
Not so good on morality, it turned out.
Not so good on that.
But, you know, you can't have everything, can you?
So is it that you feel that our audience should be investing in silver and gold because it's a more effective way to invest, save, grow?
Why should 100%?
I think that most Americans right now sit in a position where they might have like money in the stock market or money in just paper dollars, right?
And since we've come off the gold standard, dollars have just kind of gone down and down in value because we just have money used to be backed by something, right?
It used to be backed by the gold standard.
We all kind of remember that.
And that was where the central banks and governments held gold and they said, look, this dollar is exchangeable for gold or silver as well in some circumstances.
Then in the 70s, we came off the gold standard.
And from that point, it's just, you know, at that point, gold was $45 an ounce.
Today it's at $5,000 an ounce.
So that's just like a real case scenario where dollars now are backed by absolutely nothing.
So it's what we call fiat currency now.
So it's just a currency, right?
What you're holding in your hand is money.
That's like real, what we've always used.
In the Bible, they use gold and silver for money.
Before that, it's always been evergreen.
It's always lasted.
So currencies kind of come and go.
The dollar, the pound, the yen, whatever it may be, they've come and go.
Cryptocurrencies have fallen a little bit today as well.
So these are all things that aren't really backed by anything.
But I'm holding.
I'm going to push back on two things, even though I like I fundamentally, do you know what I'm reminded of?
You know, at Christmas, when you get like gold coins, always good, wouldn't it?
It's a good stocking filler, that everything else in the stocking, what a lot of bollocks.
A tangerine, do me a favor.
Soap on a rope, fuck off.
But them gold coins, like you can actually pick his little edges and there's chocolate in there, magnificent.
Now, there's two things I want to remark on.
You know, render unto Caesar what is Caesar's, as in something that bears the image of the empire or Babylon clearly belongs to that domain and that realm.
This here, you can almost sort of feel its weight and its value.
This is what I sense we might be on the edge of, Sam O'Brien, is I think we're on the edge of some seismic financial rupture.
Now, when it comes more to the sort of matters of currency exchange and value that you're discussing from your position of an expert, an entrepreneur, because your business is True Gold Republic, and you're one of the sponsors of this show, right?
You're saying that silver and gold are reliable because they're actual and they have a measurable, and I suppose to some degree, finite value.
Now, there's two people who I know would push back.
One is Max Kaiser, cryptocurrency guy, high priest.
Oh, no, cryptocurrency.
That's what he'd say like that.
Right now, I can see him.
Oh, yeah, so even silver and go, yeah, like that.
That's how you'd go.
I don't know what he'd actually say, but I know he'd say the cryptocurrency is the perfect currency because of the way that it can be communicated.
And here on Rumble now, we have a Bitcoin wallet.
And if you want to make a donation to me, do.
If you don't want to, don't.
It'll be the same to me.
I've totally detached from that kind of thing.
I've detached from it entirely.
The other thing is, my mate, Nick, Wright, self-made man, trains dogs for the government, right?
Imagine that.
Trains dogs for the government.
The government needs dogs now.
Now, he started off just as a dog trainer.
Then he ended up training.
He's a Marine, so he's double-arched.
You can't mess with him.
I do jiu-jitsu with him.
He's a right bastard.
The only thing that's surprising is how neat he keeps his beard.
Like someone that keeps their beard that neat, you think, well, he's got to care about something other than just being brutal.
Anyway, he says that Warren Buffett says, and all them high-level dudes say, just invest in the indexes.
The indexes, if you invest in the indexes.
So is this, do you, how, is this better than investing in the indexes like the S ⁇ P or whatever?
Gold has outperformed the S ⁇ P for the last 25 years, you know, substantially.
And if you look at even inflated adjustments of like how many ounces of gold it would take to buy, you know, say one chair in the SP 500, even that's massively outperformed over the last 20 years.
So yeah, if you want dividends and you want cash flow and stuff like that, then you might want to invest into the stock market.
But I think everyone can kind of see right now that the stock market is massively overinflated.
There's a lot of new money going into AI, into tech, and it's all kind of on promised future returns, right?
All these AI companies are promising the world, but in terms of like actual profit, like not that many of them have actually been proven.
So really, you know, if you want to make a million bucks overnight and you want a high-risk investment, then for sure you can do AI stocks and cryptos and whatever you may want.
But this is something which is more stable and secure.
And it's really an insurance policy is that if all else fails, then you have what you're holding in your hand, right?
And no one's going to take that away from you unless you're good at jujitsu.
Yeah, good at jiu-jitsu or they're fully armed.
And I've been learning these new techniques.
I'm learning these techniques from this guy, right, who he's a martial arts, he's a former undercover cop and martial arts expert.
And when he was one time undercover in a drug deal, the drug dealer tried to stab him and kill him.
And he realized that all of his training up to that point was of minimal value.
And he realized that what you really needed, it turns out, is how to be able to kill someone in the car with like, and he learned that and he's teaching me it.
It's actually quite hard, actually, and difficult.
And a lot of it involves pushing your head in people's faces and stuff that's quite counterintuitive.
Anyway, look, the thing is, Sam, I'm into this.
Remember, when I used to be a stand-up comedian, like, you know, for hire, I would turn up a stand-up show, do like a gig.
When someone gave you 500 quid in cash, even though that was filthy fiat currency, not worth the paper it was written on, even though there was them big brown tennis with her majesty on the queen, her majesty on them back in them days, not Charles peeping out.
Used Car Subscription Scheme00:02:49
Sorry, it's not worked out.
You know, proper money, right?
Back in them days, I loved it getting paid in real money.
Now, will you, oh, will you pay me for this interview in these?
We could definitely do that.
Yeah.
Yeah, Alex, I'd rather have this.
Like, then you feel like you've got something.
But I know Mike Walton, my house, my kid, if I put this in ashtray or somewhere, it says, well, my kids will nick this, but they're going to get it anyway down the line.
I can't live forever.
So, like.
But you raise a good point, though, because back then, to say that was, what, 15, 20 years ago, you would have got paid 500 pounds like in cash.
If you just put that in a safe, right?
Then £500 20 years ago was like a decent chunk of change, right?
You could maybe buy a car.
A used car.
I could get a used car.
I did.
I got a used car.
I got a used car for £400.
Exactly.
Yeah.
I mean, my first car was a VW polo, £1999.
I paid £1,000 for it.
A bag of sand, get yourself a polo.
Little grand.
But now, you know, £500 would get you absolutely nothing.
You could maybe fill up your truck like twice.
So if you was paid in silver or gold 20 years ago, today, I mean, that would have gone up maybe 1,000%.
So it would have been relative.
and that's really the power of gold and silver is not getting today out tomorrow even though recently it has been moving in in crazy ways but it's about you mean crazy ways Oh, escalating.
So yeah, silver is up 180% in the last 12 months.
Gold is up 70%.
So they've both increased dramatically.
But really, you know, we don't want to preach that.
We would rather say, look, you know, think of this on a three to five year hold as a minimum, ideally more of like a 10, 15 year hold.
And that's where it's just preserving the value of your dollars because they're going to keep printing more and more money.
So, you know, put it away, forget about it.
And in 10, 15 years, it will just be relative.
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Carrying Gold Bullion Bar00:12:36
Let's think about this for a moment.
Like I'm trying to teach my children.
Like I'm teaching them when you're like when you're doing that Spanish lesson, kids, a little bit later, I'm going to want to see you talking some Spanish at me.
And like when you're doing that basketball lesson, next time you're on the court, I'm going to want to see that you aim at that top right corner or that you're able to keep your eyes up when you're dribbling, right?
Don't see everything as just some sort of irrelevant participatory exercise.
Now, imagine this.
In 10 or 15 years, think of how the world was 10, 15 years ago.
10, 15 years' time down the line.
I'm terrified to think what might be going on.
I reckon there will have been, I reckon there's going to have been wars, serious, significant wars that might have involved conscription.
I reckon there'll be the introduction of authoritarian measures and the use of technology in ways that we would consider invasive now.
And in order to bring about that invasive use of technology, I'm talking about, say, digital ID and biometrics and that sort of stuff.
They're going to use various methods of crisis.
And even if you don't believe in conspiracy theories, they'll just will by coincidence be some pandemics and wars and climate change and various crises events that are used, whether by design or by happy accident for the authorities to legitimize power.
If you've got a wealth base that's only in like banks, that shit's going to get shut down.
In a sense, so like wouldn't a party isn't a necessary partner then to holding silver or gold that it's held in a way that's inaccessible to some sort of confiscatory centralized force.
Like say me, for example, enemy of the state.
Like if I've got a bunch of silver and gold, aren't they going to go, oh, we've got to take that?
You're a pedo or something.
Well, who knows that?
You're a terrorist.
Who knows that they have that silver and gold?
That's the beauty of silver and gold, which I think is what was great about cryptocurrencies in Bitcoin when it first came out, right?
Was that it was meant to be this, this can't be controlled by governments.
This is going to be off the grid and you can make a transaction and the government don't really know what you're doing about it, which is, you know, obviously for the wrong people, that was great.
But also for ordinary citizens that don't really just want, you know, just want a degree of privacy.
Yeah.
That was a great tool.
But now you have, you know, Bitcoin ETFs and people can seem to track like wallet addresses.
And, you know, this isn't my wheelhouse on cryptos, but I know that it's become a bit more transparent than what it was initially intended to be.
However, with gold and silver, you know, they're not going to confiscate it because it's not backed by the dollar's not backed by gold and silver anymore.
So you still have gold and silver in your possession in your house and no one knows that you got it and no one can take it away from you.
So you're kind of taking yourself on your own little gold standard.
And that's that's very powerful.
You know, I think that should be comfortable for a lot of people.
In some post-apocalyptic world, like one of them Denzel Washington films where he's mooching about and everything's all messed up now.
You know, Denzel Washington is mooching about.
It's all gone wrong.
You might need this in a sort of a direct way.
You might need silver and gold to train in the trade in the post-apocalyptic world.
I'm not assuming that within the next 10, 15 years, nuclear apocalypse.
I'm not assuming that.
But I am assuming significant civil unrest.
Really, what you probably want to do is get a good gold and silver basis.
You want to get some land.
You want to be heavily armed.
You want your own generators.
You probably need good skills when it comes to agriculture.
That's what I'm thinking.
That's what I'm probably going to do.
Like, I'm probably going to look to get somewhere where you can defend it and where you have some resources.
Thing is, if you're doing anything worthwhile, they're going to kill you anyway.
But the truth is, at least you want to put up a good fight.
And not all of you are going to be frontline global holy war.
Are you?
I don't know.
Maybe you should.
But you don't have to.
It's voluntary.
So if you're going to try and mooch about surviving for a bit, you know, get yourself some, I'd say, why not get some of the silver and gold?
Let me make sure I've covered everything so that you know what I'm talking about.
Physical silver.
Oh, it's physical.
What?
But didn't you bring no bars, Sam?
You could have bought some bullion, mate.
Why you got no bullying?
No, I'd have loved that.
I could only travel lightly.
How much with a guy?
Where have you come from?
Have you flown over from Croydon?
No, no, I flew from Durray Beach, Florida.
What are we doing there?
That's where I live.
You live?
Where is that, mate?
It's kind of between Palm Beach and Fort Lauderdale.
Yeah, yeah, I know around there.
I'm up and down there all the time.
Sometimes I go down to, you know, like Palm Beach is absolutely alive, innit?
You go down the breakers and them kind of places.
I like it down there.
I've been going down there because I've got, luckily now, thanks to the Holy Father.
I've got friends in the government, so I've like bowled down there.
Check them a lot out.
Got to keep, you know, when you've got the UK government trying to destroy you, you need a few allies in case it gets tasty.
All right, so listen, gold bullion.
How much for a whole right now, as of today, via True Gold Republic, mate?
What if I wanted a lump of gold bullion, like a proper gold bar?
It depends on how big, but if you wanted like a market bar, then that's a market bar is like what you see in the movie.
Yeah, movie one.
I want that.
12 and a half kilos.
I want a tobacco.
I want a tobacco gold.
That is 180,000 a kilo times 12 and a half.
So that's...
A million, about a million and a half.
Yeah.
Yeah, so that's going to be dollars.
Dollary-do's, Yankee Doodle dollary-do's.
Yeah, so most people are buying like smaller quantities.
They're buying like one ounce coins, one ounce is about $5,000 today.
But imagine you lose that fucker.
Imagine you spent 1.5 on a great gold bullion bar and you're carrying it around like it's your baby to be friends with it.
Like, you know, when they make kids at school carry out a bag of flour so they don't get pregnant.
They go, listen, you're not ready for a baby.
Carry this bag of flour about and then by the end of the work school day, that bag of flour is all covered in juice from school in Essex where I would have grown up, where I did grow up, as far as I grew up.
Anyway, like, imagine if you decided to carry that gold bullion about as a better proxy for a child for life itself is more precious than anything conceivable.
The most precious metals, the most glorious thing.
And all of us are carrying that around.
Our mate, Rob, where are you, Rob?
What are you doing, son?
Like, our mate Rob had his grill smashed out, his Nashes from the meth.
He replaced them.
I think it was 30, 40 grand.
That's just for teeth.
So imagine what your arms and legs are worth and your kidneys.
You are a billion-dollar machine made in the image of the Holy One.
So anyway, imagine if I was carrying around gold bullion bars, like my baby.
The other actual actual babies are quite well practiced now.
I've never yet left them anywhere.
Have you?
Have you got kids yet?
No, you don't look like you've under that sort of pressure.
You're too young.
I can tell from your face.
I can tell from your face.
You've not had the shit kicked out of you.
Next year.
Good idea.
Happen next year.
Well, in the meantime, you should get yourself a gold bullion bar, right?
Carry about with you as practice, all like done up like in a nativity play and like a towel and that.
Carry it around, see how many things happen to it.
But as it's a gold bullion bar, you'll look after it well.
Then when actual children come, it'll seem like less pressure.
I've got another point on that, actually.
I've got another point on that.
What was my other point about gold bullion bars?
Oh, yeah.
Like, what about brink mats robbery and that?
Yeah, I mean, most people, like some people, if you've got a lot of money, then obviously you might not want to keep it like in your house.
So you can vault it.
Where would you vote it?
I mean, I vault my personal vault.
You're a big file with gold.
You're a sultan.
And then we have vaults across the US.
So we have them in Nevada, brings facilities all across.
What if the government starts trying to get to the vaults?
Then that's a civil war situation.
Civil war.
It's a civil war.
But what happened?
And I think the reason why gold and silver have gone up so much in the last year is that when Russia increased, Russia invaded Ukraine.
Yeah.
So a lot of Russian assets were in dollars.
So you remember when you saw the oligarchs, the guy that owned Chelsea, they took his yacht.
No Bromovich.
We'll have that.
Yeah.
That's what was happening.
And they were seizing assets that belonged to the US because they were in dollars, right?
So that created kind of a global unrest because a lot of the other countries were like, well, if they can seize dollars just because they're dollars, they're not really property of the US.
They bought them, right?
So all these other countries are looking at China, Brazil, Russia, BRICS nations.
We're all concerned about it.
I think, well, if we do something to upset the US, then they're just going to take our dollars that we paid for, right?
So that's why they stopped buying as much US treasuries and instead they started buying physical gold.
Okay.
And that way, the only way that they can come and confiscate their wealth as a sovereign nation is by marching into Moscow and saying, hey, we want to take out all that gold.
And they're not going to do that without an extra war.
So that's why central banks have been buying more gold than they've ever bought before.
And that's why you've seen prices can keep going up.
And I don't think those tables are going to turn anytime soon.
You know, Brazil, Russia, India, China, they're still looking at a gold-backed currency, 40% gold, 20% silver.
So all these things are kind of on the horizon, which is which is going to unfold.
Sam, you're probably right, I reckon, mate, that in times of seismic unrest and change and flux, things that are abstractions in themselves, like fiat currencies, which are dependent on our collective faith for their value, as our faith experience a sort of collective spasm of people like, I'm not sure I trust the government anymore.
Britain's falling apart, like our country of the UK, it's crazy, innit?
Yeah, it is.
It's gone double, double mental.
So if you actually don't trust the government, you are actually demonstrating a faith in them every time you use their units of currency in exchange.
And I suppose what this is is a way of bypassing it.
See when Sherlock Holmes goes to Watson, elementary, my dear Watson, what he's referring to.
You got it, Nikki.
We're rapping.
Like, what he's referring to is elements.
Elements are that which precedes expressions, more fundamental, more elaborate expressions.
So gold and silver, it's been around for a long while, innit?
And people that have got in the gold and silver game for the longest, those people, you can tell they're, you know, they're all caked up to the nines, aren't they?
Everyone's there all laughing.
I don't want to get into controversial territory about whether there's any particular ethnic groups that have been historically connected to gold and silver because that is not our gig.
I don't believe in that kind of, what do I want to say, an analytic.
But what I will say is, why don't you get involved?
Me, I'm going to get involved in cryptos because I feel like I like the mobility of it.
And I want my payments in this gear.
And I reckon we should invest some, let's get some nice, good chunk of it.
What my aim is, I'll tell you now, is to have a nice bullying bar.
But you're right, I'd lose it.
I'm clumsy.
So I'm going to vote it up.
And if anyone nicks it, Sam O'Brien, that's civil war, innit?
Someone comes for our vault, civil war.
Civil war.
Civil war.
Anything else you want to have, mate, before we wrap it up?
No, head over to stayfreegold.com and give us a call.
We can help you out.
If you have funds in a retirement account or if you have cash savings, you want to speak to us, you want some education on it, then we're here to help.
You provide chat and education.
And do I get, say if someone is going to buy some gold and then they buy it via you, do I get a little piece?
We can help you out.
Come on.
We'll give you a silver coin each time.
A little silver coin.
Oh, Russ, if you want to help old Russ, who's in trials and fighting the government, every time you buy one, 80 quid, but still it's better though, because it's like a little nugget.
I'm aiming at a gold bullion bar to carry around.
I'm going to dress it up.
I'm going to draw eyes on it.
You know, like, I'm going to sort of make it like a puppet from what they call it, that care bear station, what they call it, build a bear.
I'm going to get my bullion bear.
I'm going to get my bullion bar and I'm going to build a bear it up.
You know, so I'm going to have a little woolly one, make it look like a wookie.
I'm going to treasure it, literally treasure it.
Anyway, so listen, you know that this is in a sense a blend of humor, commerce and marketing.
But what Sam O'Brien's business does is facilitates brokers and advisors on the purchase of precious metals in order to mitigate and navigate the likely forthcoming economic crises brought about by governments you don't trust and globalist imperatives and incentives that don't consider your welfare.
So the information's at the bottom now.
Click the link in the description.
You've just heard every time one of you does a deal, old Russ moves a little closer to his Build-A-Bear bullion bar.
Blending Humor and Commerce00:07:13
So yeah, stay free.
Sam, thank you.
You explained that very well.
Thanks, mate.
Thank you.
I appreciate your time.
No trouble.
I appreciate yours too.
Thank you.
There you go.
So, hey, prepare for the apocalypse.
Get yourself tooled up with precious metals.
We're going to be back in a second with Crack On with Dave, Russell and Joe.
No, Dave, Joe, and Russell, put yourself last, Russell.
See how hard it is.
Ironically, the subject is selfishness, a subject I know a little about.
We'll be back after this message with Crack On with Dave, Joe, and Russell.
There, see, I can do it.
Hey, we made some, sometimes we're just mucking around, we're making content all the time.
And this is this brilliant clip of me.
I accidentally, by mistake, crashed this car.
See, I admit it readily when I've actually done something wrong.
So, what we've done is we had to call up the insurance firm Geico.
And if you're familiar with Geico, they, in my view, racistly, use a British lizard to sort of be their spokesman.
Oh, hello, I'm a little British lizard or whatever.
Reptilians, gotta be careful of those fuckers.
Anyway, so I got that.
Liam here, he filmed me while I was on the phone to the lady, the elaborately and outrageously named, she's called her like Mary Antoinette.
She sounded like the wife of a French king from the Middle Ages or Renaissance.
I don't know.
I'm not good with that sort of stuff.
So let's have a look at that right now.
I crashed my car.
Not even crashed.
Dragged is a better word.
I dragged it along the side of another car.
Now, Geico, who have a look at this moment from the Geico ad.
Go to Geico, get a quote, and you could save $900 with your phone.
What do you notice about the way that new talks?
Got an English accent, hasn't he?
Racist.
Now that is racist.
Now, I've got to talk to Geico because we all know that when you actually make an insurance claim, you know what the subtext is.
We're not giving you that money.
We'll do anything.
We'll say anything to not give you that money.
Oh, we'd love to give you the money, but the thing is, your insurance only works on a Wednesday.
Oh, we'd have to give you that money, but your policy doesn't da-da-da-da-da.
So Jake's doing all the bit where you have to chew through the agony of bureaucracy that they put in your way.
Do you remember when they established free market economies?
Do you know what they say about communism or communism?
Too much bureaucracy.
Well, have a look at free market capitalism action.
Bureaucracy.
So much bureaucracy that thankfully Jake's willing to take the bully himself.
But at some point, I'm going to have to get on there and do it.
And this is me dealing with Geico for a very simple scratch.
You can see it on the side of my beloved truck, along with the Joe Biden as Mount C tongue and the bully holes put there by my friend Carl.
The truck nuts we have removed.
Good afternoon.
It is afternoon and good afternoon to you.
And let's start this by acknowledging we're two human beings lit up by the Holy Spirit of the Heavenly Father.
Amen.
Now, one of us, I'm not pointing the finger, is not a very good driver.
I am pointing the finger, but I'm pointing it at myself.
Now, you've made a mistake.
You've insured me, and now you're going to have to deal with the consequences.
So what happened was, I was driving along in a car park or parking lot in your accent, and I accidentally, by mistake, scratched the side of this lady's car.
She was very kind about it.
I told her I'd sort out the insurance.
I've not done that.
Now I look like a liar.
Fortunately, where she goes in church, she sits right behind Jake, who you were just on the phone to.
So the Lord has got us on this one.
But I've got to make sure Geico's got us as well as the Lord.
What's your name anyway?
It's Camille.
All right, Camille.
I don't want you.
Camille, I understand the name Camille, because of Camilla Parker Bowles in my country.
She's queen now.
But in our hearts, Diana forever.
So it's Claudine Camille Antoinette.
That is a beautiful name.
Claudine Camille Antoinette.
That's a lot of pressure, that name, actually.
You've got to basically, your life, if your life's anything short of a poem, you've, I'd say, let your mother down.
They've gotten their estimate before.
So everything.
Expensive, weren't it?
I thought it was too much, Claudine, Camille Antoinette.
I thought it was too much.
They've got big price in it.
Do you think I think people take advantage?
I think they get a scratch on the side of their car.
And even this, I know this woman's a churchgoer and a good woman and a follower of Christ Jesus.
I reckon she thought, I'm going to get the car jazzed right up now.
I won't be surprised the next time I see that car, I bet it's got speed stripes up here, like T, about one in one tool's got limousines with a jacuzzi in the back.
I bet it'll be like that now.
Sorry, father.
Yes.
Yes, ask for forgiveness.
Forgive me, Lord.
You know, yes, do not speak ill of people.
No, no, all right.
Sorry.
I do do that a lot.
I've done that a lot.
I've got to work on that.
But if it makes you feel any better, we too think that it is a bit much, so we're going to set off our own appointment and get it looked at.
Put her through the ringer, I say.
She's trying to rip us off.
She's the new Bernie Madoff.
You know, remember him, Bernie Madoff.
He nicked all those pensions.
I do.
I guess she's starting with a scratch.
Yeah, starts with a scratch.
Now, where are we?
I want him to come back.
I can't wait till the Lord comes back and renews us all.
That's what I'm looking forward to anyway.
Well, somebody has to save us from all this foolishness.
We can't do it ourselves.
Righteousness only granted by grace.
Can't save ourselves.
I've tried.
I've tried every single way, Claudine, Camille, Antoinette.
I've tried every single way to save myself.
I'll give you a list.
Drugs, alcohol, other stuff.
Now I'm clean.
23 years.
23 years.
Oh, congratulations.
I'm proud of you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
You should be proud of yourself, too.
I have to watch Pride because false pride, it gets out of control, then it turns into vanity.
All is vanity.
So I just try and stay grateful.
Can't save yourself.
Can't be done.
So we are in the process of getting that taken care of.
There were just some logistical type issues.
Oh, these are my weak spots.
These are my weak spots.
I can do it.
I can do it.
Claudine, Camille, Antoinette.
I've liked it talking to you.
It's one of my favourite bits of today.
And I've had a good day.
You know, Jesus is our Lord, our King, our Saviour, and our Master.
And as long as we never forget that, we're probably going to be okay.
Not probably.
He is our Master.
We are okay.
Yeah.
We are okay.
Thank you for your certainty.
Thank you for your certainty.
Praise the Lord.
All right, I will.
From now on, that's it.
I'm taking that instruction.
That's because I couldn't have predicted that you were going to say that, could I?
So that's straight from the Lord.
That's from the Lord.
More certainty from now on.
I'm going to be who He wants me to be.
In your conversation.
Yes.
All right.
Because He is the truth.
So you take care of yourself and everybody else.
Yes.
Michael will get this situation taken care of.
Thank you for your excellent work and for your time today.
Camille, Claudine, Antoinette.
That's what we're here for.
God bless you.
Yes, ma'am.
God bless you.
God bless you.
Bye-bye now.
Take care of yourself.
Bye now.
Bye.
Wrong number.
Wrong number.
Confronting Self-Motives00:08:40
Waste of time.
Funny.
It'll be good if she gets fired from Geico.
We can do it.
Sorry, we have to give her a job here.
And I know what she's going to look like.
She's going to look like that in the movie Sing.
The koala got like a chameleon as its assistant.
Oh, that kind of must die.
It's strange.
This podcast is not allied with nor endorsed by any particular 12-step fellowship.
Although we may reference their literature, we do not represent these organizations.
The primary purpose of this podcast is to provide additional support to men and women who walk the path of recovery.
We share our personal experience of the 12 steps in the hope that others can benefit.
Take what is useful, disregard what isn't.
Apologies in advance for any offense caused.
Any other problems, take them to your God and to your sponsor.
Very good.
Beautifully rendered.
Nice.
And sorry that I stepped in on that vocalizing because that was exceptional.
We're talking about selfishness today.
Joe, you've chose this subject and you've chosen us a reading.
So what is it?
Do you want to do the reading?
Yeah.
Selfishness and self-centeredness.
That we think is the root of our troubles, driven by a hundred forms of fear, self-delusion, self-seeking, and self-pity.
We step on the toes of our fellows and they retaliate.
Sometimes they hurt us, seemingly without provocation, but we invariably find that sometime in the past we have made a decision based on self, which later placed us in a position to be harmed.
I can remember that bit without even reading it.
I think you've told me to read it a fair few times when I've been selfish.
Or that has been the root of my trouble.
I love that reading.
Why did you make a decision based on self-will?
Is that a bit that you like?
What is it that brought it to your attention?
So what I find with this in particular is when I am in some sort of distress, usually, pretty much always, I've made a decision previously, which has placed me in a position to be armed, a decision which I made out of self.
Selfish or self-seeking motives.
And it's always after the fact.
And you think, oh, fuck, I've done it again.
And you know, after a while, you just know that's what it is.
Yeah, but it's still like, I love it.
I remember like the first person that drew that bit of writing to my attention, whenever we are disturbed, we usually find that at some point in the past, we've made a decision based on self that's put us in a position to be hurt.
It was someone that I do the program with.
And he's someone that I sponsor, actually.
So when he said that to me, I felt like, oh, I didn't like having that sort of thrown in my face very much.
And like, and also in that confronting.
So like, if you're not a person in recovery, think about this.
Is there anything?
This is the process.
Is anything bothering you right now or are you all right?
Right.
Either it's like, no, I'm all right.
Nothing's bothering me.
That's cool.
Proceed to the next part of life, increasing your conscious contact with God and serving others.
Right?
But if it's like, no, I am bothered.
Something's bothering me.
Right.
Then you do this trick.
You go, well, at some point in the past, you have, not someone else, you're not in jail.
You're not in the Holocaust.
You have made a decision made on based on self that's put you in a position to be hurt.
And like, that's very, very confronting in a way, isn't it?
Yeah, and freeing.
When you go through it, I think is after you've done that summit first, I mean, I don't know if it ever doesn't suck.
But when you look at it, it allows you not to be a victim.
You know, it allows you to not stay in that where you're going, okay, what?
I mean, we went through it two weeks ago with you.
I mean, you walked through an inventory with it and we're just looking at, okay, did I place myself in this position in some sort of way?
You know?
Yeah, we did, didn't we?
We did do it.
Yeah.
And so I was angry about something.
Yeah, and I think it's that you don't really see this until you do it with something.
It's a practical, but when you look at it and you go, okay, well, you know, someone treated me a certain said something to me or treated me a certain sort of way or whatever.
It's like, I've placed, I've made decisions, a lot of times multiple decisions in the past that place me in this position for that to happen.
But what I like is that caveated subclause based on self.
I love that.
It's like, you know, like you confront someone with like, see that, there's two things I want to say.
One is people these days seem to cover and cherish a victim identity and a victim mentality.
It's been promoted because in a sense, we want to be a victim of Christ.
We want to be his victim.
We want God.
We want to be his quarry.
We're here for God, only God.
If you put it into step 11, conscious contact with God would mean that you're so consciously in contact with God that you ain't got nothing else but God left, right?
Like John the Baptist said, I must become less, he must become greater, right?
But these days, victimhood is still attached to your personal identity.
This happened to me.
That happened to me.
Now, if you say to someone who's in that mindset and we are all capable of it, have you made a decision, a selfish decision in the past that's generated this dilemma that you're in?
I think a lot of people don't like it.
People don't like to be told, you're not a victim, you're selfish.
You're selfish.
Now, think of all of us, right?
That come in.
We all come in via the chemicals and the booze, say, not all of us, but most of us.
And then you start to look at codependency, that what you're addicted to is what other people think of you, your ability to control the people in your life.
Then, like, you start, I feel the charge in the air, man, when you hit, because then you're talking to people that haven't bottomed out on drugs and alcohol, so haven't got that baseline of teachability.
Like, luckily, all of us that have bottomed out on drugs and alcohol, we're like, okay, I know how this can get.
I know how this can get.
I get suicidal.
I suffer from suicidalism.
So if I feel the edge of that quiver on me, I become kind of teachable, obviously, and still, even with abstinence from substances.
But like, so how do you, Dave, in relationship and even in sponsorship, guide people through that?
And have you got an example of how it can be surprising?
You too, Joe, I'll come to you after if you want, mate.
Like, when people are being selfish and they would never think that that's what they're doing.
Well, yeah, there's a lot there.
I think one thing is, is I know with me, when it comes to me, it's almost Jahari's window or whatever.
It's that where there's parts of me that I can't see that other people can outside of me.
And I watch Jahari's window.
I don't know what that means.
It's like a quadrant where it's like, okay, there's things in me that I see that other people can.
There's things in me that I see that other people can't.
There's things I see in other people that they can't.
And I think that's the four.
And yourself, there's stuff you can't see it, but other people can't.
That I don't, I'm, I'm in, like, I'm too close, right?
It's, it's, it's having someone that's removed from it looking outside.
Like Joe, I tell, if I told 10 steps something with Joe and tell him, hey, you know, I'm mad at this person and so forth, Joe will probably be able to see, especially just being in recovery and knowing himself for so long, he'll probably be able to see some things that I just, it's almost, I just can't quite get there.
So I think sponsorship and other people is a key part of that with myself.
And it's a key part of humbling myself because if I just try and deal with it myself, then in a way I could be playing God and still be, you know, living in so, oh, I'm going to take care of my own problem.
I'm not going to let anyone else see my mistakes and see where I'm at fault.
And so inviting someone else in, which is part of the problem, which is self, inviting someone else in to look at it and go, okay, Dave, it sounds like, did you start asking questions?
Because a lot of it comes down to motives.
Motives.
Yeah.
Based on self.
Based on self means your motive was selfish, right?
100%.
Motive Matters00:09:03
And my motive, even it can be a normal action, but my motive was to get praise from someone or to manipulate someone in some sort of way, or I do something nice so that I can get it.
And then I have expectations.
There's going to be all sorts of motives in it.
And so having someone that understands themselves that's been in recovery, when you tell them things and as a sponsor doing it with sponsees, usually just asking some questions right, you can't get to it without the details of some sort.
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This is the gear, baby.
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If not, we will be back on Wednesday.
Not for more of the same, but for more of the different.
Until then, if you can, stay free.
That's right, though, isn't it?
In the Great Divorce, the C.S. Lewis book, it depicts a journey from purgatory to heaven, and each of the characters accompanying the protagonist have encounters with heavenly beings, sometimes people that they knew in life.
And always the encounters lead to this kind of confrontation where the people that are visiting heaven from purgatory are forced to assess whether or not they're willing to let go of some cherished belief or they're like, nah.
For example, it's like someone who's like lost a kid, right?
And like they meet someone on the other side.
I don't think it is the kid.
I think it's their former spouse or whatever.
And like the person's like, hey, up here, that don't matter because we're all united.
And the person's like, but it shouldn't have happened.
It shouldn't have happened.
They're completely unwilling to relinquish the false God of their own emotion.
And what I've got from what you were saying there, Dave, is about masked agendas.
And that exists in family dynamics always.
Always, it seems.
So like you, some of the people that are raising you and love you, like if you go to them, no, but you were doing that for yourself, they'd be like, no, I wasn't like that's the worst thing you could say to them.
They will not want to hear that.
They'll say, that's because I loved you and I was trying to protect you or whatever.
There was something like that.
And you'll go, no, actually, you were doing that for yourself.
They don't want to hear it.
And maybe it's not our job to tell them.
Joe, what are you thinking, mate?
Yeah, I was just thinking on what Dave said there.
You know, like, if I'm disturbed, right?
Really disturbed.
I'm at a place now where I'll have to ring.
I'll have to ring someone, right?
I'd have to speak to like yourself or Dave.
And I know that I'm wrong, right?
Fundamentally, I'm wrong because I'm disturbed.
But I know I can't see it, but I know I'm wrong.
If I wasn't wrong, I wouldn't be disturbed because it's still something external.
I need to speak to someone else to see how I'm looking at this wrong, how I've made mistakes.
Because although in my head, it's that person or that thing, I've chosen it to be that person or that thing, and I'm the one suffering, right?
And I think previous to doing a step four and five, like your inventory in that, you don't know that stuff, right?
And you've lived your whole life drinking and drugging or whatever, like a lifetime of it, living with these set of beliefs that you're wronged by them, the state, this, that, and everything else, a victim of circumstance.
Although, like, it's so liberating doing an end column with your step four and five.
It's like it don't just change.
It don't just shift straight away.
Like, it's, I think it takes years and years and years of repeating the same mistakes and running it through the same process again to see that it's just pure selfishness still.
And like, I think when you start sponsoring people, you get to recognize that because you see the same mistakes that you're making or the same mistakes that you made, you know.
But it's a lifetime's work, innit?
I think I'm a lot better at it now.
It's safe if I do.
You're doing really good, actually.
I'm like, what I'm trying to do, right, is in prayer in the morning, I'm really trying to sincerely invite Christ as deeply as I can conceive of into myself and go like, I know this too is search me.
Like there's a psalm that says that.
In fact, you found it the other day, Dave, when we were working out that inventory process for how to convert into Christian terminology, 12-step recovery.
Many psalms talk about search me, Lord, like shine the light right in me and find what it is in me I'm doing wrong.
A lot of people like that are almost adjacent to that cosmic order in what you might call woo-woo BS are all about almost saying, and I think there's truth in this to tell you, if I'm honest, that when you have learned the lesson that a problem is trying to teach you, the problem will go.
Like if you have continual economic trouble, there's something in there that you're not learning.
Because part of you, don't you know that money is abundant?
It's abundant.
It's everywhere.
People are making so much money out of so much stuff.
So what is it in you that you're not doing?
And when you were talking to Ed Joe about inventorying, you said something like it's all happening in your own head.
And like one of the things I learned off that Tim M, who we talk about a lot, was I said something like, I said something like this.
Sometimes I feel like all the people in my life are kind of concoctions, characters, just figures that I'm almost creating to teach me something.
Like they're almost not even there at all.
A bit like when you're a kid and you think that you're in some sort of synthetic reality and even your parents are automatons being played out by some sort of diabolical synthetic entity.
You know, so like in that state, egos Tim M did.
Have you been reading Course in Miracles?
And at that point I hadn't been, but now I have been.
And sort of what it shows you is that it is always you.
It is always you.
Like you do an inventory and you recognize, oh, that problem I had when I was seven or twelve or twenty or twenty-five has been playing out in new environments, just sort of spiraling around, pulling in new data, new magnetism.
And like I'm because I'm refusing to change.
Now, one of the answers that might suggest itself is a kind of monasticism.
Like you might go, I'm out, man.
I'm just going to go live somewhere and not interface with this anymore.
I'm just going to be in solitude and prayer.
Like in the stillness with Christ is the only place where I might be absolved and where I might be sanctified and therefore receive salvation.
But I do believe the path like for us, you know, it's the one we're walking, you know, innit?
It's the one we're walking.
It's not fucking mysterious.
If you are in the Florida panhandle presenting an online TV show while awaiting trial in the UK and you know in your heart of hearts you're not a rapist, but you were a right little womanizer.
That's your path.
That is it.
It's not like...
Hypothetically.
I don't know who that would apply to.
I was speaking.
Yeah, that is me.
Wait a minute.
This is all adding together.
But like, so like, anyway, I thought it might be helpful, right?
Just so that we don't jargonize this.
Remember, but can I just say we should tell people, first column, who did something to you?
Was it mum, dad, bloke in the street?
Second column, what did they do?
Third column, what area of self is affected?
Fourth column, eight questions.
In that third column, is it your pride?
Is it your self-esteem?
Is it your personal relations?
Is it your sexual relations?
Is it your ambitions?
Is it your finances?
Is it your security?
One, two, three, four, five, six, seven.
Dave, what were we going to say?
And you said finances.
Yeah.
Yeah, I changed it from pocketbooks because it's not the old days.
Hand me old pocketbooks.
Oh, like pocketbook.
Have you ever done an inventory with someone that they just couldn't get free of it?
Like, there was no part that they could find that was their selfishness or their fault in it, and they just could not get free.
Have you?
Answer is: I've had guys that choose not to, but it becomes apparent, right?
And I've had guys, I mean, you can be a true victim in something.
Unraveling Molecular Tolerance00:08:53
Yeah.
Like where it's, man, I was a kid.
I was a baby, you know, and I mean, something happened, but then it's, you know, there's a place in it.
It's like, okay, but now you're a grown man.
So you're talking about something when you're a baby, but now you're a grown man, still angry about this and doing it.
And then also, what does that resentment do for you?
What is that?
Oh, well, it allows you to stay a victim.
This is how you play God.
Sometimes we're not aware of how sophisticated and obscure the currency of victimhood might be.
For example, when I was a baby, not a baby, seven or eight, this fellow, he put his hand down the back of my pants, touched my a-hole and my balls and my dick, right?
That's called sexual abuse.
Now, like, but that ain't happening now.
It ain't happening now.
I wish it would.
That's a joke.
That's a joke.
Not of him, filthy old bastard.
Like, right?
So, but, like, I've used that in a variety of ways.
Well, not even directly him.
I remember the jarringness.
Sexual abuse is really, really bad, particularly against children, because I can really remember the jangle of the reality thread.
Like, there's like a thread or a field of who you are.
And when someone does that, it goes like it's messes with who you are.
So maybe all that adrenochrome and loose stuff, maybe there's something to it.
But then, like, what, where I've held on to the resentment and utilized the resentment almost in precisely the way that you're describing is in my own depiction of my life and my relationship with my parents.
Like, when I told them, you know, my parents weren't together independently, I goes, hey, that, when I was at that thing there with that man, he touched me up.
And like, no one did anything.
No one did anything.
And I've like from my, obviously, my whole life, almost up to this moment, like I can feel a level of, why not?
Like, because I've got kids now.
And if Mabel or Peggy tells me that happened, like my very next, it will take everything in me that my very next step is to make the distance between that person being dead and the moment I'm in disappear.
I'm going to collapse that distance of that person being dead and the moment I'm in now.
Gone.
That person's dead now.
Whatever needs to be undertaken, the phone calls, the conversations, the consequences, you know, and I know that ain't right.
I know that ain't right.
But where did, you know, in myself, where did that feeling go in my parents?
It's somewhere.
You know, that energy is somewhere.
Yeah, it's not that people, people going to make every, people are sick, like, just like us.
I love how when it says they were sick just like us.
Just a reminder of, you're not putting judgment on them of like, oh, well, you know, like I'm above them.
It's like, no.
Whoever like harmed you or.
I've got no problem with him.
He's dead in the ground.
Who cares?
Yeah.
But I think it's where your part is is you want to find, here's the thing.
If you want to get free of it, you can.
And there's nothing that I want to hold on to me.
Because if you hold on to that, you're going to stay in that pattern of play.
If I hold on to it, I'm going to stay in that pattern of playing God.
And I learned the pattern in step four and five.
I do agree with Joe.
It's hard just picking this up off the cuff if you don't know yourself at that level.
Well, yeah, because precisely, even talking about this now, I can feel a charge in it.
So that means there's a level in me that isn't part of my generalized interactive persona.
Yeah.
There's a level of my, you know, that I've submerged that somewhere molecularly or unconsciously or whatever your preferred refrain and lexicon might be.
Like, but still, there's a charge in it.
So I've not fully gone like how Mooji was.
Mooji's like a spiritual teacher I met once.
Like he, I could see when he was talking about himself, he was like, I have no connection to that person that I was when I was, because I was asking him about stuff in his childhood.
He says, it's not who I was.
I'm dead.
That guy's dead.
But like, see that, Joe, when I'm talking about like sort of essentially, that's like, you know, when people don't know recovery, they would need to know now that what I'm talking about is when you do a step four and five resentment, these are what you call like, these are like pillar resentments.
If you've been sexually abused, if someone's really badly beat you up, or even it doesn't have to be even that dramatic, it can be quite small things or quite generalized things.
It's not a league table.
It's about your own personal what these hooks are that keep you attached, I suppose, to your wounded identity, your Adamic identity, your Earthman, your Dirtman identity.
Mate, what do you think about that?
How do you deal with it in yourself and how do you deal with it in others?
And can you sort of, while that little exchange was taking place, did you feel any charge of it bringing up anything in you?
Yeah, I was just, I was thinking about what Dave said there, you know, although we don't like the symptoms of the other person, is what it says in the big book, right?
So we realized that the people who wronged us were wronged us were perhaps spiritually sick, though we did not like their symptoms and the way they disturbed us, like ourselves, were sick too.
We asked God to help us show them the same tolerance and pity and patience we would cheerfully grant a sick friend.
And I was told that, like, a mate of mine, John Mulloy, told me it's like walking around a psychiatric unit and judging people if you're getting it, you're getting resentments in AA meetings and that.
Do you know what I mean?
I do do that though.
I'd be in a psychiatric unit and an AA meeting.
If I was in a psychiatric unit, I'd go, you're fucking lunatic, you stop wanking.
Like with the example you used there, Russell, that's that's real hard.
That's like, that's top, top level resentment, innit?
And I don't, I personally don't think that'll ever go, but I think when it comes around again, you can always refer back to your end column.
Like, I'm making a mistake, it's not happening to me now, I'm not a victim anymore.
Do you know what I mean?
But like, it says, and some people suggest in the literature that you have to be free of the resentment before doing the end column.
Like, you have to have that bit of tolerance there.
Like, these people are sick.
We're all children of God.
All the fucked up things I've done, who am I to judge?
I don't want to feel like this.
I don't want to feel like this.
I want to be free of it.
Please, God, help me.
Show me how to be tolerant towards these people.
Then you're ready to move on to look at the exact nature of your wrongs.
But it's very difficult, especially with stuff like sexual abuse and that, you know.
Really, that ain't ever going to go, I don't think.
But I think you can stop it damaging you further.
Do you know what I mean?
Or damaging others, isn't it?
Yeah, or damaging others.
Yeah, yeah.
See, forgiveness, I keep learning about forgiveness, right?
I keep not learning about it, being prompted to learn about forgiveness.
I was thinking about, even though we joked about this the other day, and it's a sort of really silly, silly device, the device of breaking down a word on the superficial level to try and discern its meaning.
We were joking about it the other day when we were watching football because the new Chelsea FC manager, Liam Rose Sr., son of the great Lee Roy Ross Sr., uses a lot of David Brentish breakdowns of words, including, he said, I'm a manager.
I manage.
I age men.
I make them more aged.
I manage them.
Like, that's not what manage means at all.
Like, that's not a good version of it, right?
And then, like, Joe was saying, he's getting them all playing Lego, like, you know, and I reckon that's because Beckham was right into Lego, isn't it?
But you know that he'll be giving them Lego sets, the Chelsea squad, and God knows he should give them something, right?
And like, sits them down with a Lego and go, Okay, guys, we're gonna do something unusual today when we're using Lego.
Make something, you know, like we're making a team because a team's got many, many blocks: red ones, blue ones, yellow ones.
But out of it, we must make a construction together, whether that's the lion of Chelsea or the Hermes of West, right?
And then we also go in like Lego, but it would go, Leg, go.
You've got to let go of your problems.
And you're a footballer, so you've got to make your legs go quickly down the right and left to distribute the word.
Like, it's so silly, that stuff, innit?
But I was thinking, like, atonement is one where it works really well because atonement at one moment is nice.
And when I think of Christ's atonement and atoning, you're bringing together disparate, broken, and potentially charged and jarring fractions and fragments into a unity coming from the Godhead.
Forgiveness, though, right, it's a weird word, forgiveness, and it has got in it for give.
Like, it's got these two sounds that we are really commonplace in our language, for give.
Forgiveness and Letting Go00:05:50
So, I suppose the word forgiveness, like we all know what it's meant to be, because we all say forgive us our trespasses, forgive us our sins, and all of that.
And it is by forgiving that we are forgiven in the St. Francis Prayer.
We all know that this concept of forgiveness is meant to mean someone does something and you go, I'll let you off.
I'll let go of my charge of negativity around this transgression, real or imagined.
But I'm wondering if we try to sort of remystify, because people talk about demystifying things as if mystification is a fucking problem when the mystery is fundamental to all reality.
To mystify forgiveness, aren't you kind of saying that forgiveness is a currency that in order to participate in the currency of forgiveness, you have to forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us?
Like, if I need to be forgiven for the many, many wrong things I've done in my own life, that I have to enter into that economy via my forgiveness of all people.
And in so doing, what does that suggest?
Does that suggest that I'm no longer a solid block called Russell?
I am rather a channel and vessel of exchange and transaction.
What do you think, Dave?
I think one I think when you talk about it that way, I think of letting them go, letting them go off the charges.
Almost think of it like in a court way.
And what I'm really saying is, I'm not the judge.
Uh-huh.
Like, I'm not the one to hold them on charges.
I'm not the one.
And in a way, it's when I'm forgiving them, I'm really letting myself out of prison.
I mean, that's the deal.
When I have, if I have a resentment towards Joe and I'm just stewing on it, and I love how, I love how in the big book it talks about fancied or real, because a lot of the hardest ones I've dealt with are all fancied.
Do one, do a fancied one.
Tell us one of your fancied ones.
Let me think like you fancy yourself that you'd been like in a zoo as an exhibit as a Texan.
Was it to do with foster homes?
What are your fancied resentments?
A fancy one would be like me coming home and, you know, Francesca's not feeling good or something.
And then I think, well, in my head, I think, well, she doesn't appreciate me.
She's, in fact, she's downright disrespectful.
And look at everything I've done.
And then I start just rolling it.
Like I've done this.
I've done this, I've tried so hard and I'm pretty soon I have this whole thing up and she's.
And then she'll come to me and say hey, can I talk?
Like, can we talk for just a minute?
I'm just man, I'm worried about this other thing and it had nothing to do with me, but I've fainted.
I've built it up in my head that it was about me self right and I've built this up, and so a lot of things are just like built up in in someone's head or my head.
But I think if forgiveness, I think of I'm, I'm taking that position, I'm in the wrong position.
That's the whole thing is going.
Man, I've been playing God in my life.
I'm not God and I'm not gonna play that role anymore.
I'm backing out as the actor, which this actor comes up right after the passage we just read, hold on, so you're saying that, for in forgiveness is the acknowledgement.
You started off by saying that you're not judge, but you've ended up by saying you're not God, so there's a kind of humility in it, and that in order to withhold forgiveness, you are, unconsciously or otherwise, situating yourself in this position of adjudication that you ain't men of being anyway, you're not meant to be adjudicating.
That ain't your right role, which is good for me too, because I don't want the judgment on me.
You know in, in that sense, if I'm gonna I mean Jesus says it you know if you're gonna judge other people, use the same measure of judgment towards yourself.
But I think also, when you're talking about for and give another thought, is with the program dis disease, dis-ease right, when I am at unease when when, when I'm off, where something's blocking me off, is really what I'm gonna tent step that stuff over and what we're talking about now.
I think that I think, after a while of doing it, it is so freeing that you don't want to stay.
You don't want to keep resentments, you don't want to.
Yes, there's parts of me that always wants to keep it and not look at my stuff and but.
But there's a bigger part of me that goes, man, I got to talk to someone, I got to get, I got to shake this off.
Very good, I can't hold on to this.
You're sort of as, in a way.
I see you Massey, I'll come to you in a second my man, like in a sex, in a in a in a way, you're.
It sounds like you're suggesting that this you're an analyst, analysis of this idea of forgiveness is moving yourself from a position of judge to a position of witness like that in your own life.
Almost you recede from like i'm here in the front line dealing with all this to just i'm sort of just watching this.
I know how it ends, i'm gonna die, everyone I love is gonna die.
It's all over, it's all out.
You know it's gonna end.
Like i'm not gonna sort of stand in the middle of it, like i'm trying to mitigate, manage or control it, like as if there's something I can do, i.e that aspect of Christ that's it is done, it is finished is like right right now, get yourself in alignment to receive the signal you're it's done.
After Adam was breathed into, I have expired, it is finished.
You, all you have to do is receive the gift of the holy spirit, and And in order to receive the Holy Spirit, you can't be all full of rustleness, going, all right, what if we do this?
Understanding Debt and Forgiveness00:04:02
And what about that?
I'd like to have sex.
Like, you know, you'll shoot, you'll drown out.
You're drowning it out, you mad fucker, with all of the sort of shash and cacophony of selfhood.
Whereas in forgiveness, like if you're able to forgive someone for sexually abusing you when you was a kid and also forgive your parents for not knowing how to handle it, your frequency is necessarily moving up above the noise of, yeah, but that shouldn't have happened.
Well, why would you do that?
And if it was my kid, all of that's a lot of racket.
That's a lot of racket and bin.
That's a sort of din of self all bouncing about inside you when you need to be in the flow and openness of witness consciousness.
Massey, do your, what are you saying, mate?
I'm reading this book called Debt the First 5,000 Years that my uncle gave me.
He's trying to make a point about something.
Anyway, you guys probably already know this, but it's worth reiterating.
Forgive comes from the old English forgifan, meaning to give up or allow to go free.
So it actually comes from language of forgiving debts themselves, not forgiving people.
That's where it came from.
And then he started talking about forgiving people themselves for deeds they've done against you.
The whole idea is that when someone's wronged you or you think someone's wronged you they owe you something They've taken a part of you or something like that and by forgiving that there You're basically saying that person is by forgiving that person you saying they're no longer in debt to you for what they've done basically The fundamental Christian idea is that you are unable to repay the debt.
You are unable to.
The debt has been paid for you.
So the concept of monetary debt does not proceed, supersede and provide us with an understanding of spiritual debt.
It comes from that concept.
So it's, you know, we get the chicken before the egg sometimes, or vice versa, difficult to know.
But the point is this.
When Neil Oliver, our beloved friend of the show, talked about the excavation of some tin mine in Cornwall from millennia ago, they found that the miners, presumably Celtic or Druidic, Lord alone knows what their religion was of these people mining tin, you know, thousands of years ago.
But they would leave little bowls and effigies in the mine as an acknowledgement, we have taken this and therefore we leave this.
So on some very deep level, we recognize that there is a transaction or at least relationship taking place and that there is a requirement that sort of somehow matches the concept of debt and credit.
Throughout Old Testament, the idea of sacrifice is reiterated, perhaps reaching some sort of apex in the father of the Judaic faith in many regards, of course, Abraham offering to sacrifice, being willing to offer as sacrifice his son Isaac.
Although he does not have to do it, he is willing to do it.
There is a debt that is accrued when you will not live outside of sin.
To live in sin, our creator God, if you live in sin, you know, we know what that is, worshiping the flesh, being cruel, being mean, succumbing to the sort of somehow inherent fallenness.
If you live in that, God can't come there with you.
You have shut the door in God's face.
For God to come back in, there needs to be some sort of lucid transaction.
There needs to be some sort of charge reversal that humanity are unable to achieve, unable to achieve through effort, through works.
Only it is achieved through the death of God God Self in the form of God the God's Son.
Somehow some charge is released.
Some new frequency is engendered.
I'm trying to find a new semantic, a new lexicon that helps people get beyond the folkish, Abrahamic and Frankly, sacred language of scripture, and to understand, is there a way of looking at charge, debt, credit that we sort of understand.
Meeting Unmet Needs00:07:17
And I'm sort of beginning to feel like I'm at its edge.
Like I'm beginning to understand something that's sort of you know necessarily mythic.
And by mythic, I don't mean false, I mean deeply true in a way that transcends meaning or gives us the concept of meaning, in fact.
Anyway, Joe, my meal pal, meow, butte, meow, mucker.
What do you reckon?
What were you thinking about, mate, while all these exchanges were going on about forgiveness there?
I guess initially what I was thinking on what I used to have a tendency to do is like set someone a specific role in my life and have a standard of them of like what they are, what they have to do and how they serve me in my life.
And I never know I'm doing it until that minute where they fall short and I'm pissed off of them.
But I'm proper pissed off of them.
And then like what Dave was saying there, like if it's a resentment which I ain't processed or dealt with quick, I remember you told me it's called stacking Russell, right?
So like I ain't dealt with the main thing.
That's from Tony Robbins.
Yeah, yeah, I like that Tony Robbins thing.
So it's like I start stacking everything else on top of it and in the end everything's fucked.
Like I don't do it no more, but I used to.
And I can hear that in other people that are sponsoring stuff, you know.
And I think it's just an easier life, innit, if you can forgive quickly.
But sometimes it's hurt pride that makes it very difficult.
Well, hurt pride means you're clinging to the idol of self, of course.
And all of these things.
The reason pride is the primary sin or defect is because that is the idol.
That is the antennae.
That is the hook upon which all else must hang.
Now, a minute ago, Joe, you said that actually you should only do the fourth column.
The fourth column in a 12-step inventory is the eight questions where you ask, how am I involved and participating in this, right?
The first column is, what is my resentment?
My resentment is I was abused as a child.
What actually happened?
He put his hand down my pants and felt my nuts.
What area is it affecting?
Pride, what I think, what I think you think of me is the definition I was given.
Pride.
Does it affect that?
A bit, but not too much.
Self-esteem, what I think of myself.
Yes, it affects that a bit.
Personal relationships.
Now, just now, Joe, you went, I give people a standard.
Now, the description was given to me by Tim M said that personal relations is the script I give others.
So in the script, I give others in the third column, I'm like, my dad's like, he done what?
All right, and he's off, right?
And my mum's like, oh, you know, now that ain't for their own reasons and for which they should be forgiven.
We know that from a million different directions.
Ain't how they reacted.
So that's the key to my re- That's the key to my resentment is personal relations.
That's the one that's gotten me.
Sexual relations is personal relations, but a specific contingency for sex.
So obviously it's there because it's a sexual matter.
Ambitions, my ambition to be absolutely protected.
Finances, no.
Security, yes, because it showed me at a very young age your parents can't protect you and are unable to.
Your earthly parents cannot protect you, right?
So when you look at this, from the, I mean from the perspective that you just invited us to consider, Joe, that when you do the fourth column, you are sort of meant to be somewhat free of the resentment.
I still want to put opinion that because I don't entirely understand it.
And what Dave here, Dave here always says that the third column, which I've just described to you and talked to you through, so you do know what it means, is more important and indicative and a better diagnostic tool than the fourth column.
Now, the fourth column is these eight questions.
What mistakes am I making?
Am I being selfish, self-seeking, or dishonest?
Where am I in fear?
And where have I got defects of character?
And where have I wronged?
Away, you can't even answer those questions unless you've understood to some degree what area of self in the third column has been activated in you.
And I reckon actually that I have just understood that because it's in personal relations is where my resentment there that I just talked us through centers there, don't it?
It's like that's where it is because it's not like I can understand that there's crazy sick people in the world that are paedophiles.
I've seen the fucking news.
I get it.
I've been abused.
Like, you know, like, so, but that's not the problem.
The problem is the personal relations script problem.
And now that I frame it and understand it in those terms, it helps me to see in a way that I couldn't even 15 minutes ago.
Like, God forbid, what if something was to happen to one of my beautiful children?
Well, how do you stop that in this crazy world?
Because every single person in the world that's had a kid that's been abused didn't want that to happen, I'm assuming, except for the ones that did it.
I mean, that's a new sick category.
But like, you know, like, how do we, you know, I suppose the lesson I have to learn is absolute compassion, absolute forgiveness, and a willingness to cancel a debt that's not serving anyone anyway.
What do you think, Dave?
Yeah, I don't, I'm not, it's, I don't think you don't need the fourth column.
I should say that.
Like, I'm not saying I'm not trying to negate fourth column.
I think I don't, I don't presume like I know better than the inventory at all.
Like, I've just seen from my experience how important that third column is because, really, for the third column, if you back up and just take a macro view of it, that third column is saying it's my effects, my, and it's God-given needs or desires, right?
So, God-given, uh, so I've got ambition, right?
You should have some ambition.
Like, if you have no ambition, that's not good, right?
If you've ever done an inventory with someone that is primarily marijuana, like they'll struggle with ambition usually, you know, and so like, like, security, there should you need a level of security.
Like, all these things that were affected in this, well, it when it comes down to it, when you do the whole inventory, you're trying to find out, hey, this is the pattern, this is how I play God.
In my life, is Dave Fields?
This is how, this is my patterns, these are my ways of how I play God, how I manipulate other people and do all these things.
But all those external actions are because I'm trying to meet those needs.
I'm trying to meet that need for ambition, I'm trying to meet that need for security or financial or my sex relations or personal relations.
You know, like I did this because I'm trying to meet my own needs, and that's that's the kicker.
It's it's instead of trusting God that He meets my needs, in fact, met my biggest one 2,000 years ago on a cross.
Like, instead of trusting Him, I'm trying to play His role and meet my own needs.
And so, it just gives me that pattern of this is how I play God.
This is, I play the victim to get my needs met and all this stuff instead of trusting that God meets my needs.
This is how I play God.
So cool.
What a great phrase.
Well, that's all we have time for for Kraken with Dave, Joe, and Russell, except to say that we have a psalm selected here by Jake.