On this episode of the PBD Podcast, Ann Coulter joins the show. Ann is an American conservative media pundit, author, syndicated columnist, and lawyer. She became known as a media pundit in the late 1990s, appearing in print and on cable news as an outspoken critic of the Clinton administration.
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Patrick Bet-David is the founder and CEO of Valuetainment Media. He is the author of the #1 Wall Street Journal Bestseller Your Next Five Moves (Simon & Schuster) and a father of 2 boys and 2 girls. He currently resides in Ft. Lauderdale, Florida.
Then think about writing a book that becomes a New York Times bestseller.
Okay.
That's hard to do.
Then think about writing a book bashing philosophy supported by the New York Times newspaper and you still win the New York Times bestseller.
Then imagine doing that 13 times and your name is Ann Coulter and you're invited to all these shows and you have relationships with people who like you, hate you, love you, complicated.
She's able to befriend people that don't agree with her philosophies.
Not an easy thing to do.
She gets under people's skin within seconds if she chooses to.
Just recently, we'll talk about this one here with a man you may recognize, Donald J. Trump.
You guys have an exchange on Twitter and Truth Social.
She is a conservative political commentator, author, legal analyst, a writer, columnist for New York Times.
And, you know, Coulter's first book, High Crimes and Misdemeanors, The Case Against Bill Clinton.
She wrote a book called In Trump We Trust, slightly changed recently.
She sold over 5 million copies, and her columns are read by millions and more.
Ann Coulter, how are you?
Great.
Great to be here.
It's great to have you here.
It's very good to have you here.
Also, you forgot my substack.
That's my newest thing.
Okay.
I got sick of the censorship on Twitter.
So now you can read all my columns, see my podcast videos, all at anncoulter.substack.com.
Are there still?
Yeah, thanks, Elon.
Yeah.
Oh, wow.
Elon hasn't done anything to help you?
No, and I mean, this kind of annoys me about, I mean, he's wrecked it in like 17 different ways.
But one of them is he makes this big show of there's going to be no censorship, and then he brings back like Nazis.
Gee, thanks.
Good favor for us.
What's wrong with Nazis?
Look, I believe in free speech, but he won't bring back, I'll just start in with the most outrageous things, but people like, what is it, Jared Taylor, who he was raised in Japan, so he speaks.
He's very gentlemanly, very, I mean, he's the opposite of a Nazi in that way, but he only writes about race.
That's the issue.
And he writes about it, honestly.
I mean, it was reviewed.
His book, I forget what it was, his red book, was reviewed in the National Review favorably when it came out years ago.
But because he writes only about race, he's still banned from Twitter.
And I am 100% still shadow banned.
I've got more than two.
Well, what happened was, and sorry, and then I'll end it.
I had 2.1 million followers 2018 or 19.
This is before Elon.
Suddenly, one overnight, I lost 200,000 followers.
And for the next, from seven years, I went from zero to 2.1 million.
From that moment on, I've never gotten another Twitter follower.
That's what I'm doing.
No, they took me down by a couple of hundred thousand.
So who else within the new Twitter that Elon's running?
What else are you not happy with what he's doing since that's what you started off?
Changing the name.
That is the most moronic.
I mean, you're the entrepreneur.
It's like changing the name of Kleenex.
What on earth?
And we all still call it Twitter.
X is stupid.
I always feel like I'm closing it down when I click on the X to get it to reload.
It looks like the button, shut the screen down.
Interesting.
But besides the fact that it's known worldwide, you wouldn't change the name of Google.
You wouldn't change the name of Facebook.
You complete moron.
And the other biggest thing he did, which is utterly retarded, is he didn't understand what the blue check mark was.
That was so, and I did it just this week.
And I thought, oh, crap, is this really Matt Gates?
Because I wanted to tweet something to Matt Gates.
And so I started to put in at Matt Gates.
And it used to be, well, there's a blue check mark.
Yep, that's really Matt Gates.
And I just thought, oh, screw it.
I'm not even checking.
Screw you, Elon, because you don't know.
You pay $10.
The point of the blue check mark, I had to, to get my Twitter account, I'm really not shutting up.
By the way, to be fair, what I liked about the blue check mark on what he did, he wanted to eliminate bots.
That was his way of getting rid of bots and not wanting to rely on advertisers to get money so he doesn't have to go get all the advertising money that Twitter used to rely on.
Okay, we'll get back to the bots thing in one sentence.
To get my Twitter account, they had to throw off a fake Ann Coulter.
That's the purpose of the blue check mark.
Am I responding to the real Chelsea handler, the real Bob Dole?
Or is this a fraud?
Now we don't know.
And who cares about bots?
And how does a bot get a blue check mark?
Actually, that would be a good thing.
A bot isn't going to get a blue check mark.
Are you ready to start your account on Truth Social?
When does that start?
I've thought about, what is it?
Zuckerberg's thing.
You don't even know the name.
It's how irrelevant.
And the other one is that, what's that, semaphore or something?
I don't know what it is.
But you see, this is the problem.
And this is why I don't even care.
You probably know about the major free speech case recently where they found the discovery was unbelievable how the Biden administration was putting pressure on Twitter, Facebook, the rest of them to shut down, well, you know, these brilliant virologists and epidemiologists, the great Barrington Declaration guys, and wouldn't let them tell the truth about vaccines.
And by the way, they're not anti-vaccine, about shutdowns, et cetera, et cetera.
And it was really unbelievable how the Biden administration was directly saying it wasn't like a subtle Oma mafia thing.
No, it was, what the F are you doing?
Take this down right away, including a Jill Biden parody account that made them take down.
I don't think you need the government pushing these private companies for this to be a First Amendment violation because why am I not going to go to semaphore or whatever that other thing is?
Because this is the public square.
Now it's a public utility.
No, you shouldn't have the right to censor anyone.
You shouldn't have the right to censor anyone with Twitter.
Okay, so go back to it.
So you said the blue check mark, the bots says, who cares about the bots, right?
Well, the bots were a big part of manipulating and propaganda because, you know, there were companies you can hire that has a million bots to get a tweet to get 100,000 tweets to create momentum, but it's fake and what makes it look like it's so much more interesting.
So to eliminate that, well, you're like, yeah, this is probably a bot versus, no, this is an account because a person's paying for it.
I guess what he could do.
Bots could pay for it.
Bots could pay for it, but not times 100,000 accounts, if you think about that.
Also, I don't think the blue check mark does anything about the bot, but I'll come back to whether I care about bots, which I really don't.
But the blue check mark, if somebody doesn't already have a million followers, they shouldn't be getting a blue check mark.
You have to be Bob Dole, Bill Maher.
You have to be somebody we've heard of.
That's the point.
So different colors.
So maybe keep it different colors.
If you pay for it, you could do that, right?
If you're paying for it, it's maybe yellow check mark, whatever.
And I know they're doing right now, nonprofit, whatever, government organization, and keep the blue check mark protected.
So you know that is the account.
Because it's true, because you can look at Ann Coulter parody account, right?
Such and such parody count, and it almost looks real.
Like the AOC's parody count went viral and blew up.
So, what have you been doing lately?
Obviously, it's been a lot of changes that happened since you went on Bill Maher and you told Bill Maher that you were the first person that's like, yeah, who's going to win today?
I think who was to your right?
She said who was Joyanne Reed.
Yeah, and she was there.
And then another fellow with a weird-looking shirt that was supporting Marco Rubio and Gutierrez, who was supporting, I want to say he was talking about Jeb Bush, even though he's a Democrat himself.
And you said, yeah, this is the one.
Can you just play this from the beginning?
You're the first, right?
Yeah, this is just how it started.
Watch this.
Okay, here we are.
And which Republican candidate has the best chance of winning the general election?
Of the declared ones right now, Donald Trump.
Look at that.
Look, you knew it.
Look.
So of all the I told you so, does this rank at the highest for you?
Or it's pretty good.
I just remember thinking at the time and days afterwards, liberals always think that derisive laughter, ha, we proved you wrong.
And I was thinking, well, we don't know what's happened yet.
Yeah, you saw that Joy Reed, who's one of the talking heads on MSNBC, probably the most liberal of all the liberals on MSNBC, literally lost her mind.
She couldn't even think for a second.
Well, she looked at it like she was nuts, like you're crazy.
And Bill Maher, you've seen him, you know, sort of stay centered, if you want to kind of call it.
You'll notice he doesn't laugh.
He knows me.
Yeah, he knows.
Exactly.
But you just laugh and you don't wait for facts when you don't care about facts anyway.
Right.
Well, one of the things I respect about Bill Maher is he's famously said, it's okay for you to hate Trump.
You can't hate the people that have voted for Trump.
Oh, good for him.
I agree with you.
Where do you stand on that?
I'm starting to hate him now.
Trump or Bill Maher?
Both of you have been a little bit of a human.
No, both.
The people who still support him.
Well, it's funny because I used to say, I didn't know he had said that, but I used to say that when Trump was president and not building the wall, not deporting illegal aliens and doing, well, it was the presidency of Jared Kushner and Paul Ryan.
He governed exactly like Jeb Bush.
I still would write in Trump We Trust because he was the first candidate saying the things I wanted a candidate to say.
And I keep, I mean, I've given it to Republicans saying this was the greatest campaign in United States history.
Do what's in this book.
It's a great book because it describes, sorry, I guess I shouldn't say that, but it describes what was so great about Trump, not listening to the political consultants, not giving us the stupid clichés, not bringing his wife up on stage, not talking about Reagan, Reagan, Reagan, Reagan.
It was, I will build a wall.
He was the only one who directly went to policy.
Trade, wall, no more stupid wars.
That's what I've been waiting to vote for my entire life.
Now, if he had come out at 2 a.m. the night he won and Hillary people are all crying, crying.
That was so great.
I sometimes just watch that over again.
And he said, woohoo, we won, and then had a heart attack and died.
That would have been the best thing that could have happened in this country.
Because he had proved he had done everything good he was ever going to do with that campaign.
And Pence would have been afraid to betray his supporters.
No, Trump.
No, I'm not going to build the wall.
We'll move the embassy, though.
You guys should be happy with that.
So speaking of Bill Maher.
So you write this book in Trump We Trust, right?
So you start off, you go on Bill Maher.
You say Trump's going to win.
Everybody loses their minds.
There's a book he wrote that.
I was introducing him at rallies before.
Yeah.
Or you were everywhere.
He was banned.
He was banned from.
No, he wasn't banned from Fox.
I was banned from Fox for supporting Trump.
But sometimes they'd be forced to put me on when they were covering a Trump rally because I'd be speaking before him.
That's how much I was for him.
Yeah, and then you even write this book, In Trump We Trust, right?
So, okay, so you're fully on the camp.
This is August 2023, which is what, three months before, you know, 10 weeks before election time that's coming up.
And then he wins, and then you're right.
And everybody says, she knew something we didn't know.
Then slowly but surely, you're not happy with what he's doing.
The comment you just made right now, the best thing could have been he would have had a heart attack, and that was it because that was the highest milestone.
He didn't build a wall.
He did, you know, Tel Aviv to Jerusalem.
He didn't, you know, how about us?
How about us?
How about us?
At what point did you start turning and saying, wait a minute, what happened to all the promises you made?
10% tariff, Mexico, 20 billion.
You could have gotten that money, et cetera.
At what point did you say, wait a minute, what is going on here?
Before he was sworn in, I was getting nervous.
We all were, but still, you know, you want to be constructive.
And so I was gentle, gentle, gentle.
I famously, though I told no one, I'm a vault.
I can talk to politicians and they never have to worry about, I won't even tell my friends because this has to be, you know, private.
And I used to talk to him a lot during the campaign.
He hung on my every word.
I could text something to Corey and it would be coming out of his mouth 30 seconds later.
But I showed up in Washington.
In fact, I had lunch with Michael Issakoff, that very good, but liberal reporter, Washington Post and Newsweek.
And I went straight from lunch to the White House and I never sat down.
I just stood right at the edge of the resolute desk and yelled at him for 15 minutes, saying exactly what you just said.
You are not doing what you promised.
You got elected on the wall.
You're doing nothing on the wall.
You're doing nothing on anchor babies.
You're doing nothing on trade with Mexico.
Remember, it took him like two years to do that, even to end that.
And I didn't start using the F word first.
But once it started, oh, they heard it through, I mean, I don't know how the press found out.
I don't know, like a month later, and it was published.
And I thought it actually could have been anyone in the West Wing because we were yelling at one another so much.
Oh, wow.
This is how much after?
I think it was February.
Oh, shit.
Or March.
17?
Yeah.
So it did.
Okay.
So now when he's putting his team together, were you and him directly talking or was it mainly through Corey during the election?
No, oh, after he was elected, actually every once in a while I'd speak to him directly during the campaign.
But when he was standing up giving a speech, that was when I'd tell him, you're in New Hampshire, talk about immigration.
They're opioids, opioids, huge, huge issue.
And then he'd be saying it.
And by the way, I don't think I've ever told anyone that before, but screw him.
Wow.
I'll tell the truth now.
And then I talked to him a fair bit on the phone, basically for the first year in office.
And, you know, the way he tries to win you over, I met with him immediately after the speech where he was bragging about the size of his hands.
And I said to him, I happen to be in Florida.
I drove to Mar-a-Lago.
I was waiting for him.
It's him, Corey, Hope, come in.
And they're eating dinner.
Hicks.
And I said, look, I'm the only person losing money trying to put you in the White House.
You're going to listen to me.
No more bragging about the size of your penis at debates.
And what he does is he tries to win you over by charming you and giving you the, oh, you're losing money here.
I'm going to give you something worth $200,000, a membership to Mar-a-Lago.
As if I'd ever set foot unless I am yelling at the president or president to be.
Well, in that case, it might come in handy.
Yeah.
Right, right, right.
Good at it.
You're right through the front door, no waiting.
So sorry.
So that was quick.
So, okay, so from you're saying the so the last time you and him actually had a phone call was when?
Was it in 2017?
No, no, no.
We kept talking.
Then he called me and bragged about, he bragged about how even the liberal media, remember when he bombed Syria and it turned out it wasn't chemical weapons?
Oh man, what happened to no more wars?
So, you know, Ivanka cried, kids died.
So he starts bombing Syria.
And remember, the liberal media loved it.
Oh, they love when we bomb foreign countries.
And he called me and told me how, oh, can you see all the great press I'm getting?
And I said, this isn't what you want on, sir.
This isn't, it was supposed to be the wall.
It was supposed to be our country.
Why are you getting us more involved in the Middle East now?
And throughout that time, when he was picking his team, he'd try to win me over because I didn't like some of his picks.
They weren't consistent with what he ran on.
And I was pretty gentle about it.
But he'd always like offer me something.
Well, I could do something.
Oh, you're not on Fox.
You know, Rupert calls me four times a day.
And I distinctly remember I said to him, I don't care about Fox.
I don't care about my career.
Just hire Chris Kobe for Homeland Security.
That's all I want you to do.
And he didn't.
And by the way, the wall would have gotten built and we would be done with anchor babies and dreamers and the rest of it if he had hired Chris Shelby.
So, Anne, this is your world.
You've been in it for a while.
You've been relevant for a long time with the issues you talk about.
When it comes down to picking your team, okay, when you become a president, it's different if you're in the world, right?
So for example, if your name is Bush, you know, Stephen Schmidt was here last week and he said a very interesting thing about the fact that when he sat down in a meeting with President Bush and Carl Rove and all those guys are there and president asked him and says, who's the best political strategist in this room?
And Stephen looks at the president and says, hey, president, I would say Karl Rove.
He says, wrong.
It's me.
This is my entire family.
I've been in politics.
I've been this, my dad, grandpapa.
So he made a point, said, I know what's going on.
He says, I don't think John Kerry is going to win.
It's because he's an asshole.
But at the same time, we have to be thinking about all these things he's saying, right?
It's okay.
So Bush puts a team together, but he's been in that world.
He kind of knows who to hire, right?
You know, if your name is Obama, maybe you don't know everybody because you're only a one-term senator.
So the best comparison I can make to Trump would be an Obama because, again, you're not in it, right?
Everybody else prior to him, director of CIA Senior, you know, Ronald Reagan, two-time governor, you know, he can kind of go to if he gets re-elected, okay?
Because he's right now ahead by 40, 50, 60 points.
It'll never happen.
So you're saying it'll never happen.
Okay.
But go back to it when he did.
What should he have done with his team?
Okay.
In an ideal situation?
Should it be, let me bring somebody from the mainstream side to see what you think about it.
Let me bring some people from the political side.
But who do you trust when you're in a position like that that you've never been in that environment?
Right.
Well, first of all, I want to say those words have never been used in combination before.
Stephen Schmidt said an interesting thing.
You've made a very good argument for, and I've heard people make variations of it.
And you do it very well better than I've heard before that, well, he doesn't know.
This isn't his world.
He's in real estate.
But no, I'm sorry.
He knew who to trust when he was campaigning.
He knew if I listen to these people, I'm going to be popular.
Chris Kobe is the one who was advising him on how you get Mexico to pay for it.
You tax remittances.
That was another thing that I yelled at him in the Oval Office about.
It's very easy to get Mexico to pay for the wall.
Maybe he didn't understand it.
Hire Chris Kobe.
So, you know, for 16 months during the campaign, he knows if I listen to these 5,500 people, I'm going to be huge.
I'm going to be so popular.
Now I'm president.
I know I'll hire my son-in-law, a liberal Democrat from New York.
And Cashman question, because one of my biggest questions.
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Go ahead, Vinny.
So, and so with the border, which is one of our big things, and you can see, you know, what's happening right now.
It's blatantly obvious what the left is doing.
How hard was it that he made those promises, but the left from the beginning was doing, you know, a coordination with the media.
Racist, you're racist, Mexico, this, that, that.
How hard was it for him to make that promise?
And I think he actually did believe in it.
But how hard did the left make it for him to keep that?
Because everything was about race.
And how much did that affect that?
Well, I write about that in Trump We Trust.
I think it actually helped Trump.
What you want to do, and I think DeSantis is doing this a little bit.
There are some other things he could do it on.
What you want to do is take an issue that's like 80% popular with voters, but 90% unpopular with the media.
That's immigration.
I've never seen an issue like this where the public is way on one side and all of the elites, politicians and the media on the other side.
So he takes the position and then the media end up amplifying it for him.
He looks brave when in fact, he's like pandering by coming out for the wall.
It actually really, really helped him to be called a racist.
I mean, that Mexican rapist thing, I didn't actually support him when I said that on Bill Maher because I thought he was going to back down.
He always struck me as, you know, kind of a chowderhead O'Reilly type and whichever way the elites want me to go.
And amazingly, two weeks later, he didn't back down.
And I thought, well, okay, he may be an utter Vulgarian, but this is what I've been waiting to vote for.
And he never backed down.
And I think the media hating him for that and calling him a racist for that just made his supporters.
It was like tensile steel.
And we started off the segment talking about your viral clip on Bill Maher.
I'll give you the utmost credit.
You nailed it.
Boom.
You know, you were on Bill Maher recently again.
This is within the last couple of years.
That first clip was obviously in 2015.
He said, look, you voted for him.
You convinced.
You called it.
You called your shop, Babe Ruth Style.
He said, obviously, jokingly, but now you're finding out, it turns out he's just some big fat lying con man, right?
What was your first clue?
So break that down.
What was your first clue that he actually, in your words, lied to you in the American Public Shop?
In my defense, I always knew that was a possibility.
I grew up in Connecticut, so I've been watching this guy Trump since I was a kid.
And he is an utter R of East Vulgarian, really wants the, I mean, just every bad adjective you can imagine.
So that was possible.
But again, he was the only one saying the right things.
You know what?
The mayor of New York right now, Mayor Eric Adams, he is basically the same thing.
Who else would you vote for?
He was talking about crime.
At least he talked about it when he was running.
You have to vote for him.
You have to.
Is he doing anything about it?
No.
No.
I mean, I think in his case, it's more incompetence.
It was basically once it was clear Trump got the nomination, he very quickly started moving away from, as I said, all the people who advised him to help him get the nomination to Jared's put in charge of everything.
So, okay, let's go back to the team, of putting the team together.
Who were you fully against?
Who was okay?
Who was a good hire of the people he chose?
And by the way, that could include the VP, because I know the VP was who?
It was supposed to be Gingrich.
It was Christie.
It was Christy, Gingrich, himself, and one other, right, that were possibilities of being the VP.
Who did he do where you're like, what are you doing?
And who did he do where you're like, okay, that's a good hire?
It was more, it was mostly, I'm trying to think right now, it was mostly lower-level people.
I don't think there's, oh, well, I guess, but it's not my field.
For Wilbur Ross, I know.
I think he was probably a good hire.
Wilbur Ross was 98 years old.
I know, but it's not in my area, so I shouldn't even talk about that.
I think he may have been.
So are half the senators, by the way.
That's true.
Betsy DeVos was great.
It turned out.
She was very good.
And I think that's about it for the cabinet.
Oh, and I liked Jeff Sessions, but who was the one lonely voice in the woods saying, don't make him attorney general?
Are you tough to please?
No, no.
It would have been so easy.
It would be so easy.
I mean, for one thing, I'd keep Sessions in the Senate.
But if you're going to put him someplace, put him someplace, you know, in homeland and then have Kobe, if he's not head of homeland, put him in charge of immigration.
But I don't know.
I'd keep Sessions in the Senate.
And the argument that was made to me was, oh, he's always wanted to be Attorney General.
And I love Jeff Sessions, but I said, this isn't like make a wish foundation.
You're president now.
This is really important.
But no, and I don't think Sessions did anything wrong.
It was horrible how Trump humiliated him, but I wouldn't have put him there.
I would have kept him in the Senate.
And look, Trump ended up losing a Senate seat for us.
But are you tough to please?
And what I mean by tough to please is, okay, so for example, you know, what president in the last, you know, however many years, who has done a job where you're like, okay, this guy came through and did his part.
Like, who has been someone where you've said, that's my guy?
I'm sticking with him.
He did great.
He came through.
He kept his war, da-da-da-da-da.
Who was the person dead?
Well, I mean, I'm with Reagan on the point.
Sorry, I'm not one of these nut Republicans who can only cite Reagan.
Drives me crazy.
But I think he was the one who said, with politicians, if they're 80% with me and 20% against me, that's enough.
That's enough.
That's fine for me.
And so I'd say that's true with a lot of them.
I think you have to be kind of, I think it's hard to be a normal person and run for president.
You have to be a little bit of a narcissist or something.
But I'd say more than 80% satisfied with Governor DeSantis.
You're 80% satisfied with that.
More than.
There's very little I would criticize about DeSantis.
I mean, the COVID response were down to him and the president of Sweden.
I had him on my podcast right before the first debate.
And I said, I considered it like debate prep.
And I said, okay, now you're absolutely the best, head and shoulders.
No one can compare to you on immigration, crime, and COVID response.
So we're going to do a little test on this.
No matter what I ask you, you start to answer and then turn it right back around to immigration, crime, or your COVID response.
And on COVID, I said, look, nobody, nobody compares to you when you were taking all the slings in the arrow.
So unless the president of Sweden is running in next year's presidential election, you are way ahead of the rest of them on that.
This is with DeSantis.
So how do you think he's doing today?
I wish he had read in Trump We Trust.
I gave him a copy.
I said, well, you have to actually do it.
You think he read it?
I don't know.
I think he's, I still, I still don't think Trump is going to be the nominee, though I wouldn't put money on it.
I've put many steak bets on it.
That may be a mistake.
I have a feeling I'm jinxing myself.
I'm not going to be the nominee.
And in what way?
Well, I wrote about this.
It's on my sub-sack.
It was about two months ago because I remembered this.
I looked back and saw who was leading the polls for the Republicans' nominee for like 20 years.
It was never the guy who turned out to be the nominee.
A year before the election, it's always name recognition.
So, you know, we can go visit the Rudy Giuliani Presidential Museum after this, or the Newt Gingrich Presidential Museum, or the Fred Thompson Presidential Museum.
Or the Huckabee?
Huckabee, Liddy Dole.
Liddy Dole was neck and neck with Bush.
Liddy Dole.
Why?
Because she was the wife of the guy who had just run for president.
It's all name recognition.
We've never had somebody with so much name recognition as Donald Trump.
Name another human on the face of the earth who's that recognizable and everybody knows that name.
And DeSantis, I think, put it well, but very briefly, what he said is presidential elections aren't decided by polls.
They're decided by voters.
And look, you can have me back and laugh at me because I could be totally wrong.
And I'm a little bit more.
You're one for one, Anne.
So I want to hear this.
I want to bet.
I don't feel as confident as I did.
Real quick, Andrew.
You don't want to feel as confidence with DeSantis as you did with Trump.
No, it's not DeSantis.
No, I don't feel as much confidence saying Trump won't be the nominee if I am.
You want to put a steak dinner on it?
I already have too many of you.
I'm going to bankrupt myself.
And is there your reason for saying that he won't, is it because of everything that they're doing right now, legally, illegally, in my mind, to completely destroy him?
Because if you think about it, mentally, politically, financially, it's an all-out assault.
It's completely, like, if you don't see it, I'm saying as the public, you're dumb.
Is that your reason for saying it?
It's exactly the opposite.
The Democrats know exactly what they're doing.
And I wrote about this the day of the, again, on anncoulter.subsac.com, the day after the Alvin Bragg absurd indictment in New York.
Trump was dead in the water before that.
Nobody showed up at his announcement speech.
Fox cut away from it.
It was a bore.
He was collapsing in the polls.
But the smart Democrats, I mean, okay, I'll admit, on MSNBC, they genuinely hate him.
Yeah, big time.
But that dovetails with the smart Democrats like David Axelrod sitting back and saying, okay, here's our reelection plan for Joe Biden.
Trick Republicans into nominating Donald Trump.
And man, did Republicans fall for it?
Oh, they're easy to roll.
And they keep doing this because every time they do it, I mean, this was the theme of my last book, Resistance is Futile.
I kept finding myself at cocktail parties arguing with New York Times reporters, telling them, drop the Russia stuff.
It's stupid.
This is what you should be attacking him for.
There's loads to attack him for.
Why are you doing things that you force me to defend him?
And that's what they do.
They force people like me, and I don't want to defend the man to defend him by these utterly preposterous indictments.
The only one that's at all legit, and it's legit, but should he go to prison for it, is the Florida Mar-a-Laga one.
If somebody, and a little word to the wise, if you get a subpoena from a DA's office or federal prosecutor's office, you have to comply.
Of course.
Of course.
So what are you thinking?
What are you thinking here?
Okay, well, here's my thing.
Well, with that, I'm thinking with it's completely, it's all BS.
And I think you nailed it, actually, Andy.
So the left doesn't let a crisis ever go to waste.
Yes.
You know that, right?
So for instance, with COVID, and they're brilliant.
Say what you want about the left.
They are geniuses because they do capitalize.
70% of voters didn't vote on election day the last election.
You know that, right?
I'm sorry, they didn't vote on election day.
It was, it used to be the absentee ballots.
It used to be 30% to 70% because of COVID.
Everybody's saying, oh, it was 70 to 30.
Okay.
It was a coordinated effort.
Zuckerberg donated, what, $420 million.
They had NT fund the streets.
They were, you know, suppressing the vote, suppressing, like you mentioned earlier, too, Twitter had how many FBI agents there?
They had $3.5 million.
FBI gave to stay there, censor all the stories, all the Biden stuff.
So my question to you is, and people thought that they cheated, and what, are you concerned that they're going to manufacture another crisis to keep, you know, to do that same thing?
Or is it the pieces of the game already set up for them to win?
If it's Trump, it's Easy Street for the Democrats.
I mean, also, you have to remember, they do control the media.
Of course.
And whenever Republicans have some great idea, our conservatives are pushing on me and I say why it won't work and they say, yeah, but that's not fair because that's not how the media treated Democrats.
And I say, as with January 6th, but the media is being unfair to us.
If you are so stupid not to know that the media is far left and you're not going to get any help from them, you shouldn't be running into the Capitol.
You are too dumb to even remember to go to the bathroom.
So if it's, they can mostly sit back on Easy Street if their whole reelection plan for Biden is trick Republicans into renominating Trump.
If it's not Trump, and if Biden, if Biden has to debate with Ron DeSantis, what they're going to do is, my suspicion is they'll pretend, we've got a new variant.
And mind you, they tried testing it and where people, we were just tired of it.
But I just have a feeling because do you genuinely think that's going to be Biden?
Biden's going to make it to this, to the actual, he's going to be the guy.
I don't know.
I don't know.
Who else would you do you think?
Because, you know, Newsome, I'm not running.
I'm kind of running.
He's debating DeSantis.
We're still baffled.
Who do you think, if it's not going to be Biden, who do you think is going to be that slippery snake that just comes in?
And by the way, this may be one way the Democrats, although they're conning Republicans, trying to get them to renominate Trump, they could also be conning too many of themselves that they think, oh, yeah, it's definitely going to be Trump.
We don't have to worry about anything.
We'll do weekend at Bernie's.
This will be fine.
If it turns out that when voters go to vote, they do not vote for Trump, then they really are going to be in so much trouble.
But I think they have to, I don't know that much about like election law, but I think they have to decide pretty fast because there are state laws, I believe, that prevent you from being on the ballot if you're not nominated in time.
And I think they have like another month to make a decision.
So you think they're doing all of this stuff to give Trump momentum and help him out to be the nominee and beat DeSantis?
I think the smart ones are.
The dumb ones just hate Trump.
And that's basically the entire MSNBC staff.
So you're saying they are scared that DeSantis is going to come and beat Biden.
That's what they fear.
I think almost.
DeSantis is having a hard time beating Nikki Haley.
DeSantis is getting, you know, first one, he had a hard time with Vivek.
He's getting other people that are coming up.
Because, you know, and by the way, again, I'd love to hear that part.
The follow-up would be, you got the most popular president of all time, okay?
Not, you know, Joe Biden, you know, Tony Robbins status type of motivational speaker, but the most popular president of all time that we have, 81 million votes, whatever the number is, right?
Okay.
Trump on the other side, the most fanatical supporters Republicans have had in how long?
Maybe since Reagan?
Fanatical, fanatical?
I don't think George Bush had fanatical.
I don't think Senior had fanatical.
That doesn't get you more votes.
Okay, but it's fanatical.
That comes down to the middle, which is the independent libertarians.
It's really four or five different.
Yeah.
Republicans.
To win yours.
Okay.
Fair.
But when it comes down to it, you're saying a DeSantis who has a hard time with the stage when you watch him, he's not necessarily one that's winning it.
If you look at this right here, this is not us, Shona.
This is the poll shown from how close he was to Trump and how separated it gets more and more and more.
And you see, Haley is not coming up to the point where somebody called him a bird brain.
You know, Haley, who called Tony Haley a bird brain?
Somebody you may recognize, your friend, called him a bird brain.
Maybe that's because she's a threat now, that she's coming up.
She's getting too much attention.
You've always hated her.
So you actually agree that she is a bird brain?
Hey, were you the one that sent her the bird cage and the food?
Somebody sent her.
They said Donald Trump's can't send her a bird.
So you think DeSantis stands a shot at beating Biden?
Yeah, on the, I mean, yes, I'm worried for the reasons you say.
Okay, he's not a showman on the debate stage.
And this could be, you know, wishful thinking.
But one thing I've noticed about presidents is we tend to go back and forth.
I mean, it's like me going back and forth on boyfriends, the smart, ugly one and the good-looking, stupid one.
And you just keep going back and forth and back and forth.
Who won?
Who's won so far?
It's actually a very good case study.
What you ought to do is have like two at the same time talk to you.
Now you're talking.
Yes, and let's go.
Throughout the day, I talked to Bob, but I'm not.
Jose.
The workout friend tennis friend.
And the voters similarly seem to go back and forth between highly articulate presidents and marbles in their mouth presidents.
So Reagan, unbelievably articulate.
I mean, it drove Democrats crazy.
I know Hollywood, Hollywood.
Okay, then we get marbles in his mouth, George Bush won.
Then we get Mr. Smooth, Bill Clinton, and oh, you melts in your mouth.
Literally.
You know, it's really sexy when you say that.
And then we go from there from another marbles in your mouth bush to, oh my gosh, the most articulate president we've probably ever had, Barack Obama, to Trump, who has a vocabulary of about 50 words.
What do you mean?
He has the best words.
Chidin.
His Asta.
He knows the best words.
And they're the strongest.
And what would you say to the people?
Strongest words.
Since you're speaking of your love life and multiple guys, that you sound almost like a scorn lover.
You sound like you're someone that was in love.
You guys are fighting and literally cursing each other out in the White House.
You guys have this text message relationship.
You guys are so close.
You literally selectionist.
Very sexist.
Very sexist.
It reminds me of that.
And I don't know if you've seen this, the Seinfeld episode where Elaine is going crazy because every time she's angry at a woman, cat fight, cat fight, cat fight.
And not smart people who want to attack me always do.
I mean, look, I don't know if you guys were paying attention to politics then, but when Chris Christie, governor of New Jersey, took on the teachers' unions, oh my gosh, that was the most beautiful thing to behold.
And the public sector.
Many viral clips with him on that.
And the public sector unions are a huge, huge problem for this country and for state after state after state.
So I was a huge Chris Christie fan.
Oh, and by the way, met with him too, privately and harangued him for two hours about immigration as the most important issue.
But no, he decides he's going to listen to the Wall Street Journal and collapses.
So then I didn't like him.
But when I was supporting Chris Christie, because you got to admit, even when you hate what he's saying, he is funny.
He is articulate.
He is everything you're saying.
DeSantis isn't.
He's a little awkward on stage, which I think is fine.
I think people will get over that and just look at his record.
At least that's what I'm hoping.
You don't sound convinced, though.
You're not convinced you're not.
Well, it's a long time in advance.
I generally don't like to make predictions.
They made me on politically incorrect.
Real time.
Real time.
Sorry, real time.
They're still politically incorrect, but still.
So let's go to the exchange you guys had a month ago.
Can you pull this up, Rob?
Let's just show the exchange you guys had a month ago.
This isn't exactly the exchange.
So if you want to go to truth first, yeah.
So Ann Coulther, the washed-up political pundit who predicted my win in 2016, then went unbearably crazy with her demands and wanting to be part of everything to the Constitution of all, has gone hostile and angry with every bit of her very nervous energy like many others.
I just don't want her around.
She wasn't worth the trouble.
And part two, he says, page two, he says, has Ann Coulter has been Ann Coulter is a stone-cold loser.
And then you respond, if you want to zoom in here, Trump begged me to go to Bedminster this week.
I said only if I could record a substack with him.
But the gigantic pussycat is too afraid of me.
So instead, he did this.
Pat, there was no cat in there.
It was all in capital letters, all in caps.
Leave the cats alone.
So what happened here?
What happened here with the small little public feud you guys had?
A friend of mine who owns a restaurant in New York where a lot of journalists go went out.
It was written up in a newspaper and he had the newspaper on the wall.
And I happened to be at the restaurant that night.
So I was in the article.
So he got everybody in the article to sign this blown up article.
So he wanted to get among the people who go there are Trumps.
None of the one names you know, but still in the neighborhood.
And so he wanted to get Trump to sign it.
So he goes with Trump's sister out to Bedminster.
And Trump is signing it.
And he sees my name there.
And my friend calls me.
I'm out in the Hamptons and he's desperately calling me.
I have to talk to you.
I can't put this in a text.
I got to call.
I got to call.
Okay.
He said, you know her?
You know her?
You got to get her out to Bedminster.
And he said, he circled around me three different times.
He said, You got to get her to Bedminster.
You got to get her to Bedminster.
And I'm thinking, well, I don't want to hurt the restaurateur's feelings, but there's no effing way I'm going to Bedminster.
And then as soon as I said, I'll think about it, but you know, probably not.
And then I hang up and think, oh my gosh, I have a sub-stack.
And so I text him back and say, no, I won't go to Bedminster, but I want him to do a Substack video with me, which I do all the time, about once a week.
And I have big, important people on not as big as you, but pretty big.
And I know he's not going to do it.
So first he comes back and says, oh, he doesn't do Zoom.
And then I'm saying, okay, I'll come out there.
And I'm talking to all my techie friends saying, I need every one of you wearing a GoPro because I'm going to go out there.
And he's going to say, no, I won't be interviewed.
He wouldn't do it on camera.
I knew he wouldn't.
So all I get back is, oh, yes, maybe we'll set it up.
You know, people are going back to Florida now.
This was a month ago.
Nobody's back in Florida in Sept August.
He's not going back to Florida.
So some of my journalist friends said, so is this happening?
Is this happening?
Are you going?
And before this even happened, I texted the exact same thing to him.
And I said, it's not happening.
He's a gigantic pussy.
He's too scared of me.
He won't do it.
And then, you know, I'm just going about my day a few days later and I start getting all these emails.
Why is Trump attacking you out of the blue on Truth Social?
Well, this is his chicken way of saying that.
So how much after the exchange did this attack on truth come out?
Oh, it happened like two days after they were giving me BS excuses about when we're going to do the substance.
So why do you think he wanted to meet with you in Bedminster?
What do you think his outcome was or motive was?
Take a picture with me to and put it up on Truth Social and say, look, who's supporting me again?
Oh, wow.
He wouldn't do that.
Oh, he totally would.
You know, I don't think he would do that.
You know, I don't think he would do that because within seconds you would deny it.
Okay, but I deny that I explained what happened with that attack.
He doesn't care.
No, no, but it would be a very bad look for him to do that.
For example, Little Bow Wow posts a picture like six years ago.
I don't know if you know this guy.
He's a big time.
He was a big rapper.
Many years ago.
Bow Wow.
Oh, him.
Yeah.
So he posts a picture that, hey, jet flying, you know, stuff like this.
Oh, yeah.
And then a guy responds back and says, he's not jet flying.
He was on a commercial airplane.
What was this all about?
It was the most embarrassing thing.
I don't know if you remember this or not when this took place.
So for Trump to post a picture of you to say who supported me, within seconds you would trash that.
I don't know if you're going to be able to do that.
He has a much bigger megaphone.
No, I don't think he's an ex-president.
No, he no, but but are you kidding me?
Mainstream media hates him.
They would you would be center state story invited to every single CNN, MSNBC to trash him.
You would get that.
And I don't think that would be.
They will only invite people on.
I mean, isn't that curious that they haven't invited me on to trash him?
Why?
Because I trash him for not keeping his promises.
This is how much they want open borders and they want to destroy this country.
If you attack him from the right, as I'm doing, oh no, you're kryptonite to the networks.
Only if you come on and say, we almost lost our democracy.
So your biggest issue with Trump essentially is he's not Trumpy enough.
He didn't keep his promises.
You nailed the nail on the head.
You're not attacking him from the left.
Everyone else is.
You're attacking him from the right.
And your biggest critique of him is straight up the open borders, immigration, not building the wall policy, right?
Yes.
And you live in, you know, you're as conservative and as right-leaning as you are, you spend your time with the East Coast elite.
You're in L.A., San Francisco, what have you, and you're in New York.
Here's my question.
New York, we see what's going on with Europe, Adams.
We've seen what the governor, Kathy Holcomb, is saying.
When are New Yorkers going to wake up and realize, all right, maybe this Sanctuary City thing ain't what the cat pajamas is all about?
What do you say?
They're waking up and God bless Governor DeSantis.
He started it.
He said it first.
And then that Martha's Vineyard thing is what set it off.
And I mean, Abbott has more illegal aliens.
It's an open border.
This is why we need a wall.
And I think more and more Americans are seeing this is the problem with not having a wall.
And I just want to point out anyone who talks about border security and does not say we need a wall is a liar.
Nothing will work but a wall.
And by the way, I don't know if you saw today, Joe Biden is saying he's going to start building a wall and blow off environmental regulations, proving my point.
That would be the Biden work.
Nothing works but a wall.
And the only one who I think is trustworthy enough, I mean, Vivek.
I was just going to ask you.
I love Vivek.
I hate to say this.
I don't trust him as far as I can throw him.
His best ideas are all coming from DeSantis.
But oh my gosh, that kid is articulate.
So the only one I really trust to build a wall is DeSantis.
So not Trump.
So of all the people, you're saying that Trump wouldn't be the most likely person to go.
He had four years.
He had a Republican House and the Senate.
No, he does not give two shits.
And I'm about to defend Trump right now.
Oh, my God.
He actually wanted to build the wall?
No, he wouldn't.
Why would he lie about the wall?
Didn't they start?
He got him the presidency.
So you don't think he actually generally in his bones wants to build the wall, genuinely?
I don't know.
Something that you easily could have done at any point.
I'll even give you year two or three and four.
And by the way, he didn't need Congress.
But if you have it in your head that you need Congress, you have a Republican House and a Republican Senate.
And what did he do?
He passed Paul Ryan's tax cuts.
Well, he wanted to go to health care first.
And what do you say to like somebody?
Yeah, he did a lot on healthcare, didn't he?
Yeah, obviously he didn't.
And what do you say about, because Vivek's attitude, he was interviewed.
Well, he just stopped somebody.
He was doing grassroots, going to like coffee shops.
And somebody's like, how are you going to fix the border?
And he said, I would deploy our military and literally put them at the southern border.
DeSantis said that first and he said it better.
And I wish I could just make him our president.
He wears high-heel boots.
You can't give him Riz, though, Ann.
I don't think he may not need it.
How do you not need charisma and personality and Riz to be the president?
George.
Other than Joe Biden.
H.W. Bush, George W. Bush.
That's a different name.
Social media, Ann.
You know how this works.
No.
It's showmanship.
It's entertainment.
Politics pre-2000 wasn't showmanship.
I don't know.
Maybe you're right.
I'm right on this one.
I might be losing a lot of steabs, but I just think that before people vote, what they do is they look at the candidates.
There's generally, I'm trying to remember, do they have a debate in every state, at least the early states, before each primary or caucus?
They definitely have one in Iowa.
They will have one in New Hampshire.
They will have one in South Carolina.
And I mean, I always find it weird how many people there are who don't care about politics at all.
They know as much about politics as I know about football.
Serum.
But before they're going to vote, they know a presidential election is important.
They're civic-minded.
They're just, you know, I don't know, they have lives.
And before that primary comes, they look up the candidates, and that's why we didn't have President Fred Thompson.
And oh, and as for Haley, there was one thing I was going to say about why I think she's going up in the polls.
There was one thing that I will admit, so far I've been wrong about, because every four years, my entire life, at some point during the Republican presidential nomination process or a primary process, the black Republican is polling at number one or number two.
And I mean, many of them I've actually genuinely liked, like Herman Cain and his 999.
I liked Alan Keyes, lots of them.
But it's just so pathetic that Republicans are so desperate not to be called racist.
I like Colin Powell for president.
Oh, good for you.
And so I predicted that at some point, Tim Scott.
Yes, there it is.
Tim Scott would be polling first or second.
At some point, first or second.
So far, I have been wrong, but now I think Haley's taking the place.
No, I'm for a woman.
You can't call me sexist.
Because I think she's been an absolute disaster in the debates.
Are you saying it's all just optics?
Or they're actually Steve Schmidt, your old buddy, who was McCain's campaign manager, actually was like, oh, I didn't realize how racist the Republican Party really is.
So what are you exactly saying about the black nominees and the racism?
No, nobody's racist.
Nobody.
Well, actually, there's a lot of anti-white racism.
The number of white people who are racist, we couldn't fill up this room.
So no, but Republicans are so, I mean, your average Republican, obviously I'm not, are so afraid of the mainstream media calling them racist.
No, let's prove them wrong.
Let's prove them wrong.
It's the weirdest thing.
I don't know.
White people have a suicidal gene.
White guilt is what it's called.
You brought something up and there's something to be said.
You know, the national polls are national polls.
And then we go to New Hampshire.
Right.
We go to Iowa.
And people still don't understand, even though it's explained at length, that Iowa's not an election.
It's an elimination caucus.
It goes like this, like this, like this, like this.
And so all the national polls do this because they have to sell ads and have something to say.
You know, all the people on TV that, you know, don't make jobs, they make noise.
So you've got the national polls saying, oh, what about this?
What about this?
That's why Fred Thompson was up after he goes on Johnny Carson and he talks about that.
I remember that.
And that's why, you know, Mike Huckabee, Huckaboom, the headline was on Drudge in the early days of Drudge, and everybody was like, is this really a newspaper?
What's going on?
How is he influencing us?
And then you go down to the micro polls.
So the question is, within these micro polls, they always surprise everybody.
So do you think, and I'm kind of circling back, that in New Hampshire and Iowa and South Carolina, the first three that matters, because then a bunch of PAC money follows you, almost like the vortex, right?
That they're going to find a way basically to keep Trump off the ballot.
Because that's the only way he loses those primaries in what, 110 days?
Oh, I don't think so.
Do you think that he can lose on the ballot and lose?
Yes.
Wow, that's surprising because you look at the...
I'm not saying it'll happen.
I'm not confident.
But I think it can happen.
How?
I just think people start paying attention.
And I think the real Trump cultists, the ones who say, we don't care what he does.
We don't care.
We don't care if he doesn't build a wall.
We don't care if he gives amnesty to DREAMers.
I think the number of Republicans who think that is not that big.
I think there is that cult and that you think that that's 40% of Republicans.
I'm thinking it's more like 10% and they'll come along.
Who don't care?
Who don't care about any of the issues.
It's a cult of personality.
And you see them on Twitter.
Of Republicans.
Right.
Of Republicans.
Because it's, I don't know, maybe Republicans are dumber than I thought.
Well, the math is sort of proven you wrong.
I mean, if you look at his approval ratings within the Republican Party, I mean, it's no longer the Republicans.
If you don't agree with Donald Trump, you are now officially a rhino.
You're a rhino.
I don't know what the hell you're a stegosaurus at this point.
It's MAGA or nothing or nothing.
I am worried that that crowd, the personality Celton, may be bigger than I think.
But I just think most of those people, when they are asked, because it's always been a popularity contest the year before, there's no reason to think this year is different.
I think when they say Trump, what they mean is, screw you, media.
I hate you, Democrats.
I hate Biden.
I hate what's going on.
And the first name they can think of, I mean, ask me to name a football player.
What's his name?
Tom Brady.
Okay, I'm out now.
Tara Switzer.
She's the biggest football player in the world now.
I got no more names for you.
So I think a lot of people are like that.
I mean, not caring about politics has utterly forms me, but you do meet such people.
And when they say Trump, I think it means something different.
And to that extent, I agree with Maher that I love Trump supporters.
I mean, even when I hated him when he was president, and, you know, you'd see these huge Trump flags.
It would always warm my heart, the big signs.
I thought, oh, I'm sure I would like these people because I think they like him because of all that wall stuff, because of how he was going to put us first, how he was going to bring jobs back, how he was going to, you know, strike better trade deals.
Well, didn't do any of that, but he moved the embassy.
What do you think now, voter?
Now, those people, I think we win back, the percentage of the ones where they literally wouldn't care if he were governing exactly like Biden.
They're just slobbering over Trump, Yeah, we're not going to win them back.
And Anne, you said you travel a lot, right?
I assume in 2015, 2016, when you nailed the Trump thing, you had the MAGA Republicans taking pictures with you, shaking your hand, giving you hugs.
When you travel now, I assume the liberals still hate you, no doubt.
What's the Republican MAGA people say to you when they see you?
Well, it's probably not representative because of where the places I'm going to end up.
But actually, after the 2020, I don't know if it was after 2020 or if it was after January 6th.
I've had so many Republicans come up to me and say, I hated you when you were attacking Trump during the presidency, and now I see you were right.
So that's all I've gotten from Republicans.
Now, I don't think that's representative.
I haven't gone to, I don't know where these Trump cultists live.
I mean, when I saw January 6th, I think I tweeted this, I thought to myself, I've been wondering who still supports this guy.
Okay, there they are.
And they're not exactly masters of the universe.
The shaman.
The shaman, exactly.
Those are the people.
So I'm not in a place where I want to believe you.
I want to believe you.
But.
But the numbers don't support what you're saying.
So it makes you look bitter and it makes you look angry and it makes you look that no one can please you.
Trust me, like you're somebody that I watched over the years, even until today.
When you talk, there's like, you know, on finance, there's a guy that they think he's cuckoo.
His name is Michael Burry.
Michael Burry is the guy from the movie Big Short.
He's the guy that said the market's going to collapse.
He's out of his mind.
He's crazy.
He just had a $1.6 billion bet against the S ⁇ P 500 six weeks ago.
They're like, what?
So he took $1.6 billion of his client's money and he shorted the S ⁇ P 500.
What's this guy thinking?
No, he doesn't know what he's talking about.
He's an idiot.
He's this.
He's that.
I want to know what he has to say, right?
Okay.
You are a Michael Burry of politics because you said Trump's going to win and he did.
Now, Michael Burry's not 100%, right?
He's not always going to get it, right?
It's impossible, right?
Because it's speculation.
There's a lot of things that came up.
Same with you.
So to be fair to you, you're not going to be 100% right.
This is not a world that you can be 100% right.
But a part of me is listening to you and saying, okay, is she upset with maybe, you know, you wanted something from him?
He didn't give it to you.
That's option number one.
Okay.
Yeah, a wall.
Yeah.
Okay, cool.
Number two, is she upset that maybe he said he was going to do what he was going to do and he didn't?
Okay, fair.
You're right.
The wall and all this other stuff.
Great.
Yeah, you had House, you know, you had Congress, you had Senate, all this.
Fair.
Is she upset that, you know, maybe they had a feud and something went there?
Maybe.
About the wall.
What is she upset about?
Now, your confidence.
I don't think I could be clearer about that.
No, I am with you.
You've been very clear today to understand where you stand with this year.
But the voter is still saying, we want this guy back in on the Republican side than anybody else.
And it ain't even close.
We were at both GOP debates.
I'm not going to lie to you.
Was that the first one, Milwaukee?
Exciting.
Second one, we fell asleep.
Half the audience was asleep.
It was boring.
First one, Vivek showed up.
Second one, Nikki Haley showed up.
Both, DeSantis was number two.
So he can't pull off the first.
Not in the polls.
I know, not in the polls, but when you watch him, he's just the safe guy.
He gives the safe answers.
The first one, he kind of leaned on Christie to go after Vivek and to go after Trump, but he didn't go after Trump.
But on the second one, his campaign guys came back and said, if you're really going for it, you got to go after Trump.
So then he went after Trump.
And then in the conversation with Sean Hannity, I think we should do more of these.
I would love to do a one-on-one.
If we're doing one with Newsom, I'd love to do one with Trump.
Okay, yeah, great.
But then the audience and voters are like, still the same.
No movement.
There is nothing that's exciting.
It's almost like a person you like that you want to see flourish, but they can't win the people over.
So what do you do then?
So let's just kind of go in this scenario with you.
Let's say it is Trump.
Okay.
And let's say it's against Biden.
Maybe Kamala.
Long shot Newsom.
I don't think Newsom could because if Newsom did, they're going to say let the white man fire the black women's job.
And that storyline on the Republicans is going to be phenomenal.
They're not going to let Newsome, even though it should be Newsom.
They're just not going to let it happen here.
He'll happen in 2028.
It's catastrophic for Democrats if he takes it over Kamala.
So let's say it is Biden Trump.
What are you going to do?
Who are you going to support?
Are you going to sit this one out?
Are you going to vote for Joe Jorgensen?
Are you going to be like, I'm going to go libertarian, independent?
Are you going to wait for RFK to do something?
What do you think Coulter going to do?
I am worried that it could be Trump.
But one prediction I'm very confident of is if it is Trump, he's going to lose.
In fact, it'll probably be a 1964 style landslide.
So it'll be a slow-motion airplane crash for me.
And I mean, as you'll see from my sub stack, I don't write that much about, Obviously, as we're heading into an election year, I'm writing a lot more about politics, but it's more about specific things like immigration, like crime, like anti-white racism and the affirmative action cases.
So I figure, and there are people who do that, and I find them very interesting.
If it's Trump, I'm not paying attention.
I don't want to watch the plane crash.
And the one satisfaction I will have is, and it's not satisfaction.
I've done everything I can to save this country from high crimes and misdemeanors through even defending Trump to some extent.
And resistance is futile by attacking the media and writing in Trump, we trust.
I've done everything I can do.
It's over at that point.
And I wouldn't say it's satisfaction, but the people who are going to suffer the most are the ones in the Trump cult, are the 10,000 people or however many thousand ran into that Capitol building.
I'm still going to have a great life.
In fact, my pool boy is going to be a lot cheaper.
And you know who's going to really suffer?
Those people in the cult who just don't care and won't look at the wall and won't look at the issues and won't look at the fact that we're becoming a third world country and they're going to be pushed aside and they'll be living up in the shacks like in Venezuela.
My life is fine in Brazil, in Venezuela.
I'm going to do great.
And I'm doing everything I can to save the lives of people who apparently hate me.
What if you're wrong?
I just told you what my life is going to be like if I'm wrong.
Cleaner is going to be cheaper, all that stuff.
But what if you're wrong?
Which part of that is the wrong?
But no, no.
What I mean is, okay, so I really try to think on why some of the things didn't get done on first term.
Okay.
You know, sometimes a first-term president's biggest fear is what?
To be a one-term president.
It's a fear.
It wasn't his.
But no, it was.
Pre-COVID.
He would have been a two-term president.
No, he would not have.
The economy was good.
There was no wars.
ISIS was gone.
What's the one demographic he lost compared to 2016?
Anyone know?
Anyone know?
What's the one demographic he lost?
The women?
Nope.
White men.
And it was in mostly the industrial Midwest, the states he lost.
That is not because of COVID.
They weren't living in New York City.
He gained a bunch of other things.
You're picking one thing he lost out of all the other things he won.
But here's where I'm going with it.
Well, he lost the election.
What he did.
It's kind of important.
You got to win elections.
But losing the election was a black swan.
I mean, you're smart enough to know it wasn't like a racial.
It wasn't.
I knew he was going to lose the election.
That one I would have bet you a million bucks on that.
In fact, I did make bets on that.
That's why I only make stake bets now because people never pay monetary bets.
And I made a lot of bets on that.
With COVID.
Of course, he was going to lose.
The one thing I underestimated.
With or without COVID?
With or without COVID?
Of course.
Of course.
Based on what premise?
Yeah, I want to know this.
Based on what premise?
Both Democrats and Republicans all say he would have won.
I warned him about this in columns, I think, before he was president, maybe right when he became president.
Think back to the one-term president.
Is this the last time?
Yeah, last time Republicans had a one-term president.
George W. Bush.
And why was that one time at the Republican National Convention?
He said, read my lips, no new taxes.
And the media tricked him into raising taxes.
And his voters said, you betrayed us.
You made a promise and you lied.
He didn't say it at every single rally, every single day, when everything, your entire campaign is I'm going to build the wall and you don't build the wall?
Of course he was going to lose re-election.
So the one thing I underestimated was, did not think he was that stupid.
He is that stupid.
Respectfully, you sound bitter now.
And the reason why.
Respectfully, I wanted a wall like the rest of the world.
I totally get it.
Oh, totally get it.
I did too.
I'm not sitting here saying I didn't want the wall.
I still want the wall.
I'm a guy that left Iran.
I lived in Iran 10 years, two years in a refugee camp.
Trust me, I wanted that as well.
But in my mind, I don't sit there and agree with a lot of things he did.
I'm just sitting there saying what happened to America during his term.
And I think he would have gotten re-elected was it not for COVID?
But let me go back to the question here.
So, what if?
What if?
Let's do the what if.
What if in his mind?
What if in his mind?
You know him better than I do.
You communicated with him.
You've been on calls with him.
You've been in meetings with him.
You've had more interaction with him than I have.
Mine is pure speculation, is what I'm doing.
But I'm a person that's body language.
I'm watching frustrations of people.
That's the world I'm in the last 20-something years.
What if in his mind he's saying, you know, everything that, you know, such and such things I'm going to do second terms, these things I'm going to do first terms on the second term?
I don't give a shit if I get re-elected or not.
I'm done.
So you like me, you don't like me.
I'm going to get all of this stuff done in second term, first term.
Let's make sure we get the economy to be squared away.
Let's make sure we get the job and unemployment to be good for certain communities.
Let's make sure we fix certain things with, you know, Tel Aviv is, you know, Jerusalem.
Let's do ISIS.
Let's do Qassam Salaimani.
Let's do some of these things.
And then second term, we'll do the wall.
We'll do this.
We'll do that.
What if that was part of his strategy?
What if?
That's not saying it's the right strategy.
What if that was part of his strategy?
Well, A, he should have told us that during the campaign.
I'm not going to build the wall first term.
No, when I said I'm going to start day one, when I said I'm deporting Dreamers day one, no, what I meant was day one of my second term.
So A, don't lie to us when you're campaigning and getting our votes.
B, you sound like a battered woman making excuses.
Well, maybe he won't hit me next time.
It's been four years.
He's been beating the crap out of you.
He had four years, Patrick.
Four years, two with a Republican Congress.
Oh, but I know he could have not hit me, but maybe he was thinking he was waiting for our golden anniversary to stop hitting me.
He was just waiting for that perfect time.
No, he had four years.
He didn't build it.
I don't know what other proof you could possibly want.
But didn't they?
I mean, they started, they did start.
He did nothing for two years.
There was zero building of the wall during Trump.
And in the end, he bought built according to his own homeland security about 50 miles.
50 miles across a 2,000-mile border.
And then, how much of all that?
What Will Pat said, the goals and this, and I do disagree.
I think Trump would have won 100% if there wasn't COVID.
But what about everything that was happening during that four years?
Russia, collusion, racists.
It was just over and over and over.
How can you even focus at one thing when every like they were trying to get him out since day one?
Well, if he can't focus, he shouldn't be president.
And it was the same way during the campaign.
You think they were, you know, it was all, you know, wine and roses during the campaign.
It was one thing after another.
The Mexican judge, the Mexican rapist, every little thing he said, they would leap on.
It was headline news.
He was Bozo, the McCain thing.
How about Access Hollywood?
They wait until 11 days before the election.
And yet, he still managed to give those rally speeches saying, I'm going to build the wall day one.
He could stay really focused when he was horn swoggling us.
But then when he has all the power in the world, he's president of the United States.
He can hire whomever he wants to.
He can get the wall built.
Day one, like he said, in anchor babies, day one.
And he totally could have done that.
He kept claiming, hey, let's take anchor babies.
Anchor babies, as I'm sure you all know from my magnificent book, Adios America.
Anchor babies are an invention of one justice on the Supreme Court, Justice Brennan, wrote, It's not even part of the holding.
It's dicta, as we lawyers say.
It's in a footnote that anyone born in the United States, even to an illegal, an absurd concept, is a United States citizen.
And, you know, I always thought, huh, that's odd.
Why would the drafters of the 14th Amendment have thought, okay, everybody, now in case a Mexican runs across the border at eight months pregnant, we've got to make sure that child is a citizen?
And I've ever been saying, oh my gosh, that isn't already in the Constitution.
I mean, it makes no sense.
So I look it up.
I find out it's just from this one case, Justice Brennan drops it.
No Congress has ever passed a law saying the children of illegal aliens are citizens.
No court has ever ruled that.
It is just like a policy that's followed.
In fact, after the 14th Amendment, you know who wasn't a United States citizen?
The children of American Indians born on U.S. soil were not U.S. citizens because they were subject to the tribal law.
It is famous federal judges who don't agree with me on anything.
Richard Posner, most cited federal judge, 7th Circuit, he used to say, would you end this nonsense?
And this was 30 years ago.
He was begging Congress to clarify that the 14th Amendment does not apply to anchor babies.
Okay, having given you that history, what would a president do about it?
Well, I'd push Congress to pass a law.
But in the interim, sign an executive order.
Weirdly, in this one case, you're not overturning a law.
You're not overturning a court case because, haha, there is no law.
There is no court case.
And he kept saying he was going to do it.
He said it during the campaign over and over and over again.
You know, when the next and almost last time he said it was right before the midterm elections, it would have taken him less time to sign his name than to put out a press release saying he was going to issue.
So why do you think he didn't do it?
He doesn't give a crap.
About what?
About anything he said about immigration and the border and anchor babies.
He doesn't care.
He wants to, it's all the apprentice to him.
He wants to be beloved.
He wants to be able to sell stuff.
He wants the crowds cheering for him.
So as long as he says it, I mean, he's as dumb as the media is.
They both seem to think that once the words come out of his mouth, it's as if he's done it.
So he gets attacked as if he's done it.
He feels like, oh, well, that's done.
I said I'm going to do it.
So then you think, you think the big poll lead that he has right now on everybody else, all those guys that support him are dumb?
You're saying that.
No, I'm saying he's.
What did they have?
Think what they're happy about.
Like, why are they doing it again?
I don't know.
I could be wrong.
I could be wrong.
I think a lot of it is hatred for his enemies, and I understand that.
I mean, that's why I think a lot of us really liked Sarah Palin, who had a lot of flaws, and yet it's the enemies of my enemies.
And oh my gosh, are the enemies of Donald Trump easy to handle?
And have you ever been?
Have you ever been married before or no?
Did you ever get close to getting married?
This is getting a little personal.
But I'm going to ask a different, and I'm going to ask you for a minute.
And by the way, again, I think this is sexist.
Oh, the Christie point when I was for Christie.
Yeah, they'd all say, oh, Chubby Chasey, Chubby Chase.
I didn't even know what that meant.
It's like girls who like fat guys to have sex with.
No, this isn't a sexual thing.
I want a wall.
My social life is fine.
No, that's not what I'm asking.
But the part I'm asking is: when you're saying this is getting kind of personal, it's a question.
You don't have to answer it.
You can simply say, I don't want to talk about it.
I'm totally okay with that.
No, I feel certain people are very hard to please.
I'm not hard to please.
Let me make my point.
So, for example, I've had relationships where...
This is the craziest thing I've ever heard.
He runs on building a wall.
40 years, he doesn't build a wall.
Oh, you demand everything.
No, you can't please this woman.
Are you mad?
No, I'm not.
I'm not.
I'm just watching you.
Listen to this question.
So for me, for me, I feel like there are certain people that you have to be very careful because they're either super gung-ko about you and the relate, like I've dated girls where relationship was, it was unfreaking believably high peak.
The peak was so high, it doesn't make any sense right on how high the peak was.
Like, this is going to be freaking insane.
But dude, talk about the low.
The low was painful.
You needed 15 therapists and friends and sponsor by tequila and vodka and whiskey to be able to tolerate the shitty low you would go through with this girl.
I'm like, I can't tolerate this shit.
And I've been around the block.
You know, I like you when you were talking about, first I wanted this girl.
I'm saying, well, I want to.
So, you know, I wasn't the innocent one.
Eventually, I'm like, dude, I'm shutting it down.
This is it.
I want to build a family.
I want to have a different kind of a life.
And I went, I never thought I was going to get married.
I thought I was going to stay single for the rest of my life because no one was going to make me happy.
And then I sat there and I said, is it going to be 100% of everything across the board?
And then that's it?
Is it going to be like, they have to give me, that's it?
And then I'm not going to look at all the other stuff.
You're clinging on one thing that I'm also not happy about.
I wanted the border.
I'm also not happy about that.
By the way, a lot of the things he ran on, he should have done all of that stuff.
He has to answer that question.
A person like you has to give that question to a moderator in the, what do you call it, in the presidential election that's coming up.
Someone has to pose that question.
I want to know what his answer is going to be.
I'd like to see some other people that are his friends ask questions like that, A. Hannity and others, to actually ask those questions because I want to know.
But at the same time, I don't know if any presidential candidate is going to be able to please Ann Colta for eight years.
I don't think that's possible because I think that person is going to have to do everything you want them to do to win your favor.
And it is so attractive to get your support because during the election, there were certain people that are superstars that played a role of Trump winning in 2016.
I think you're one of them.
I think Kellyanne Conlin was one of them.
She didn't support him until two months before the election.
She was Cruz.
But I thought she played her role in those two months.
I think she crushed the winner.
She didn't show up and defend him for excess Hollywood and did.
I understand.
Again, I'm not putting you guys against each other on who's more than the other one.
Your method of going out there and going after the enemy, you're fearless.
You scare the crap out of the enemy.
You're not a person that people sit there and like, you make people on the other side shake.
Okay, so you played a role.
She played a role.
Other people played a role.
Okay.
But then we come to now, you're clinging on one thing.
Okay.
That's more than one thing.
Then unpack it if you're saying it's more than one thing.
If you're saying it's more than just a border winner.
Okay, a couple of things.
The reason I mentioned Kellyanne isn't, and don't pull this, oh, Seinfeld, cat fight, cat fight, isn't to say, no, I was, but I was for Trump a few weeks after he announced.
And what I have noticed.
You were the first to make it clear.
Everybody knows it.
And did you guys know this guy in 2015?
Because I want confirmation on this point.
Adam, you did.
Okay.
You're going to answer this.
Oh, Tom did.
Yeah.
A lot of us who supported every single person I know who supported Trump in 2015 and everyone hated us for it.
But a lot of my friends did.
I mean, after LA, you see what the problem is before a lot of the rest of the country.
I don't know one person who supported Donald Trump in 2015 who supports him now, who isn't betrayed.
The people who support him now are the Johnny Cum Latelys who absolutely opposed him.
They were for Cruz.
They were for Rubio.
They didn't care about anything that Trump was running on.
And then, oh, screw it.
He's the nominee.
Let's see if we can get tax cuts out of him.
They think it's magic that he won because they never understood why he won because they never understand, and it's not just one issue.
It's whether our country continues to exist is the issue.
And as for your ex-girlfriends, you needed therapy and tequila, and Lowe was low, and it would go on and on.
Now I understand why I understand why you're willing to put up with Donald Trump because I hit that and I'm out the door.
Yeah, that sounds good when you're saying that.
It's a good one-liner on what you're saying, but you still sound bitter and frustrated.
Look what happened with a guy named Trump.
That was just an insult.
Oh, it is.
You're not getting me.
This is like being called a racist all day.
No, it's not.
I'm not.
That's not an argument.
I keep making arguments, and you keep saying you sound bitter.
You got to come up with something other than you sound bitter.
Well, you do, though.
So, so, do you know what happened with Trevor Bauer?
Do you know this guy named Trevor Bauer?
Okay.
So, Tom, did you see what happened with Trevor Bauer yesterday?
Wait a second.
I didn't get an answer.
Did he support Trump in 2015?
2015, not 2016.
Whether it's him or him or him, I will say this: you said something actually very shocking that we should address.
You're saying you don't know one person who supported Trump in 2015, 2016 that is still with him today.
I'm in my circle, yeah.
That's a whole different thing.
How big is your circle?
What difference does it make?
What are you going to say?
Ann has a big circle.
It's not a small circle.
She's got contacts from everywhere.
Nobody's denied it.
And we know who Ann Coulter is.
Okay, so let's say it's a couple hundred.
Let's say it's a couple thousand.
Let's say it's 10,000.
Okay, even publicly, I can't think of anyone.
I know there's so many people that were with him in 2016 that are unanimously still with him today.
And don't believe me.
Don't believe me?
I said 2015.
15, 16.
What's the difference?
It's a huge difference.
What do you mean when he was supported him for the issues and what he was saying?
You guys wanted Jeb.
You would have been perfectly happy with Jeb.
I'm saying the people who voted for him.
No, that's not what I do.
I said there's a reason that I'm saying 2015 and not 2016.
Obviously, people who supported him and do this, who else would it be?
The people who voted up against him and do that for 16 years?
So what you're asking about is in 2015, when he declared, and we still had Cruz, Jeb, Rubio, and a cast of thousands.
All of them.
Right.
And some of them hadn't even fully declared yet, right?
All the gold rushes.
2015.
Fox 100% against him.
Murdoch against him.
Maltz Chernel against him.
Did you support him when he declared in 2015 and where you had the slab, the slate?
And to your point about name recognition, everybody thought that Jeb was going to roll.
And at Thanksgiving.
$40 million, they won.
Yep.
Yep.
At Thanksgiving 2015, all the money in the PACs was behind Jeb.
Pledge, not donated, but pledge.
He had it all.
So you're saying, were you behind Trump 2015?
I'll say I wasn't.
I was beginning of 16.
Soon as I saw him picking people off, soon as I saw what he was able to do, I said, that cat, that cat is going to keep picking these people off.
And so could I say, I was early 16, but I see what you mean.
It's like when he declared, were you with him and saying this is my guy?
Not just June 15th.
I'm giving you six months to come around.
He kept talking about immigration.
And I would add that you think he's a good debater because, and I looked this up and wrote about this recently on Sub Sack 2.
It's easy to forget because he did kind of change the whole campaign, sort of change the landscape.
Republicans are afraid to say some of the stuff they used to say.
Everyone on that debate stage with him was open borders.
And they were all attacking him when he came out for the Muslim ban.
Paul Ryan, the rest of them.
That's not who we are.
So he was being attacked specifically the same way DeSantis does the right thing on COVID, and he's being attacked, attacked, attacked, attacked, and he stands strong.
Trump was standing strong.
All the rest of them were attacking him.
That's the 215 landscape for you.
Those of you who didn't support him in 2015 don't give a crap about immigration.
You want a tax cut.
So congratulations, you got your tax cuts.
But those of us who supported him for the issues he ran on that set him apart from every other candidate say he failed.
You're talking about the early adopters.
Well, because six months you have.
And take somebody like me because I'm the average Joe.
Military veteran, you know, family legal immigrants, brother and sister, military veterans as well.
I could honestly have cared less about Trump.
You know, you fired all that.
I could never care less.
The personality when he was on stage, when he started going at people, then I started becoming more attractive because I'm like, okay, he's funny.
He's witty.
I'm a comedian myself.
But then I think once seeing what they did with, you know, the collusion, the Russia, and that he risked, and I got into it with Steve Schmidt big time, where I was like, because he's just Lincoln Project.
It's all BS.
I go, this guy sacrificed everything, wittingly or not wittingly, pulled back the curtain and let us all see what they were doing.
So it's like almost like we want him.
And again, I'm saying for us, because these are the people that you guys were talking about.
It's almost we have to because it's not fair what they did.
And we want him to go again.
The ISIS he destroyed, to me, he tried with the wall.
They wouldn't let him because of, you know, racism.
He's racist, racist, Mexican, he's all that stuff.
I'm that average person that's like, I'm sticking with the guy that I went for for the first time, and I want to see him try to accomplish all those things the second time because from the beginning it wasn't fair.
I'm that average person.
That was with them from 2015 because once I started seeing him, I was like, it's Trump.
I'm from New York.
You're from New York, right?
And I wanted that guy to win.
So it's like, I'm that average person that's still sticking with him to this day.
It's weird.
I'm that guy.
I'm that guy that you guys keep talking about because I'm like, everything, they're cheating.
They're actively cheating right now.
In New York, this case, the judges smiling and laughing in the camera.
It's all political.
It's all to destroy the guy.
I get what you're saying.
And trust me, I'm 100% pro-wall.
I'm 100% pro-military.
I want those, all the soldiers that are just hanging out here and they're not deployed anywhere, put them on the border.
Put them, I want armed people at the border to secure us.
And I mean, and I feel, yeah, in that sense, that they did fail.
But all the other stuff, we can't deny all the other stuff that he did.
He did a lot.
I will tell you this.
That's a problem.
I would like to pursue that one.
I mean, yes, I loved his judges, but it was all the Federalist Society picking them because luckily Jared Kushner didn't care about judges.
So I don't think you give him a lot of credit for the judges because any Republican, these are the ones the Federalist Society was sending up.
And that's who the Republican or Republican presidents listen to.
They happen to get it right this time.
Federalist society has gotten better too.
So other than I'm excluding that, what did he do that you like that Jeb Bush wouldn't have done?
Well, here's how I'll answer that.
Where we are right now today, just look at America.
Compare that to, let's say, 2017.
So it's not compared to a Democrat.
That's easy.
No, Well, that's easy.
But what I'm saying is, though, that's the America that I want to live in.
I want to feel safe.
I want the economy to be booming.
And then all of a sudden, and this virus comes out of a lab that we own from a country that he's holding accountable.
Because mind you, the main, the establishment love China.
They love that relationship with trade and everything.
Trump came in and said, no, no, no, you guys are going to pay for your shit.
And then all of a sudden, on election year, this virus just comes out, shuts down the whole world, mail-in ballots.
It's almost like it was a plan, but that's my point.
I felt way better.
I could have cared less.
The racism and all that, I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah.
I didn't believe any of that.
But now if you look at what's happening, it's a no-brainer to want that guy to be running.
Well, one of the things besides COVID that was very big in 2020, and you say, and this reminds me, that you want to feel safe.
And boy, we don't feel safe now, especially in New York and LA.
Oh, God.
Philly, all these places.
San Francisco.
I mean, the person like I am.
Where do you go?
Anyway.
And that was the George Floyd, May 25th, 2020, changed the world.
Suddenly, we have to release all the criminals, among other things.
One place you would have been safe in 2020 was in Florida.
Thank you, Ron DeSantis, passing law after law where you can shoot looters, anti-rioting laws.
I mean, there were specific actions he took that made, that meant there were no riots and no police stations were burnt down and you did not have police being assaulted.
What did the commander-in-chief do?
What did Trump do?
He sent out tweets in all caps, law and order.
Point one.
Point two, you know what he said in the first debate with Joe Biden?
And this is after a year of them burning, BLM and Antifa, burning down police stations, ripping down statues.
I mean, anarchy like I've never seen in this country before.
When that police station went down in Minneapolis, I was watching TV crying.
It was so horrible.
They talk about January 6th.
Let's talk about that.
At the first debate, what did Donald Trump say to Joe Biden?
You called them super predators.
I'm releasing people from prison.
How about the First Step Act?
Thank you, Jared.
He's releasing criminals.
You want to feel safe?
Donald Trump ain't your guy.
Okay, so let's go back to Florida.
You said what Ron did during this time for Florida.
That's why we moved here.
By the way, he was here.
Oh, really?
Yeah.
We're here because of DeSantis.
So here's where you're about to be spooked.
We like both.
Where did you come from?
I lived in L.A. for 20-some years.
Lived in the, I was in the Army for three years, 25 years.
I was in Dallas for five years, plano.
And then we moved here.
We kind of wanted the best of both worlds.
If Texas and California had a baby, I think it's Florida.
And then Ron crushed it.
The challenge for me was, I think Ron, with his book launch, campaign, marketing, timing, messaging, selling, to me, he was playing defense, thinking Trump's not going to be there by the end.
And his strategy and Newsom's strategy was Biden's not going to be there at the end.
Trump's not going to be there at the end.
It's going to be you and I.
That was the dream matchup.
Lakers against the Celtics.
The two young guys are going to come up and change politics instead of two 70, 80 year olds.
Now it's going to be two 40-year-olds, right?
That's the look a lot of people wanted.
But unfortunately, DeSantis needs help is what he needs in a completely different area that Trump needs help with.
DeSantis needs help selling policies.
Trump needs help with a complete different gamut of issues that he's got.
Brain transplant.
Yeah, and we'll see.
We'll see, you know, we'll see what's going to happen with this the next three, six months.
I think a lot's going to be, we're going to learn, like you're saying, I'm afraid to make, not afraid, but I don't want to make predictions too early.
We're going to learn a lot.
I think January, February, probably November, we'll learn on what's going on.
December, we'll learn what's going on.
But right now, they're still going at it.
Let me change your subject.
And I know I'm making crazy predictions, by the way.
And you're in that world.
That's why you're 13 times New York Times bestseller because you say outlandish things that people want to go read about who hate or love you.
But think about, what do you think about what happened with McCarthy, Speaker of the House, and Matt Gates?
Oh, I'm so glad you asked me.
Because I'm real, I'm angry about this.
I should say I really like Matt Gates.
He's incredibly articulate.
I agree with him on a lot of issues.
He was utterly, unfairly smeared.
And I tweeted at him the day he was doing this.
Please don't do this.
Please don't do this.
Because there are other Republicans who aren't in like 90% Republican districts, Matt.
They have to get reelected.
Right now, we have narrow, narrow, the narrowest of majorities in the House.
We don't have the Senate at all, and we don't have the presidency at all.
So I want, you know, like Matt Gates and the rest of these rah-rah people to watch that little cartoon they used to have, how a bill becomes law.
You know, okay, McCarthy could have been the most badass you want.
It goes and it dies in the Senate.
It doesn't even get brought up in the Senate.
And if somehow you got the Senate to, you know, I don't know, have them have brain transplants, it goes to Biden and he vetoes it.
So I tweeted it at Gates saying, your number one objective is to increase majorities or get majorities in House, Senate, and win the presidency.
Once you have that, you can do stuff like, oh my gosh, build the wall.
Okay, I'm not going back to that.
And so I was, I'm angry with him for this.
And then this morning at 7 a.m., I sent out to my sub-stack subscribers, okay, be suspicious when the New York Times has an above the fold, this is in today's New York Times, above the fold front page article promoting Steve Bannon.
Oh, God.
Now, let's ask ourselves before we see what it is.
Is this going to be a good idea for Republicans or a bad idea for Republicans?
And it was, I was reading the article, you know, obviously in the middle of the night.
I actually scheduled this to go out at whatever it was, six or seven.
And what he's telling Republicans is, and he's quoted in there, which I put in the sub stack, act crazy.
Come up with the most outrageous amendments you can come up with.
I want total chaos.
We're going to shut down the government.
Shut it down.
I'm going to show people shutdowns are great.
Okay, what's the biggest advantage the Republican Party has right now?
We're not insane.
We have Democrats pushing transgenders, poisoning and mutilating little children.
They are aggressively discriminating against white Americans.
They have unleashed, opened up the border like we have never seen before.
It is creeping into.
Even New Yorkers are fed up with this now.
They're going to, they're never going back to Sanctuary City.
The sanctuary cities are overturning it.
And the Democrats will not stop.
Last night I saw on, and I don't even think this was MSNBC, CNN, this woman was, I mostly watch MSNBC to the extent I watch, because they're really insane.
This woman was interviewing the first transgender legislator who was elected in some tiny little election in Tennessee.
And I'm thinking, you people won't give up on this.
You won't stop.
Boys in girls sports.
Ukraine, I don't think it's very popular right now.
And I think it's going to be less popular next year when people can't pay their bills.
So what's the Republicans' brand right now?
Sane.
And Bannon is saying, act insane.
This will be great.
Woo-hoo, war.
No, please, please, please, Republicans, don't be insane.
That's your pitch to Republicans versus what Bannon is saying?
Yes.
Bannon advises GOP to commit suicide.
Okay, so McCarthy says he's not coming back.
Okay, you said you like Gates.
You like his.
But I didn't like this.
Yeah, you don't like this.
First time ever, right?
This has happened.
Is this what they're doing to the Speaker of the House, right?
Pre-Civil War.
And it was fairly quick.
It's like, fast.
It's like when it got it done.
One, who do you think is going to replace him?
By the way, did you see the way, you know, that was pretty solid.
He said everybody's been working out.
He sent everybody home for a week, too, right?
He sent everybody home.
And they're not going back now, Gates until two.
Who do you think is going to replace him?
You're hearing a bunch of people are talking about, you know, this is an opportunity.
Trump should come and be the Speaker of the House.
And, you know, you don't have to be a member of the Congress to be this.
Who do you think is actually going to end up being chosen and be the Speaker of the House?
Well, oddly, this is actually kind of out of my wheelhouse.
I don't pay attention at that level.
How pointy do you think that position is?
Not very right now because we don't have, again, they have a very, very, very narrow majority.
We're not in one house.
Well, this is what they ought to be doing.
I won't just criticize.
And by the way, I'm advising this to them all the time on Twitter and talk radio and here.
What Republicans ought to be doing in this situation, again, number one objective, win more seats.
Get majorities.
That's all you want to do.
Okay, so we have lots of positions that are 80-20 popular.
The wall, anchor babies, dreamers.
I say Ukraine funding, but I'll give you that's 50-50 still.
Boys in girls sports.
Lots of crime issues they could be doing.
Anyway, they should be passing laws, passing bills rather.
The Republicans can do this that are 80-20 popular.
Okay, I'll give you 60-40 popular.
That is so easy.
That is so easy.
Okay, get the Democrats to vote against it.
Send it to the Senate.
Get the Democrats and the Senate to vote against it.
And a lot of Democrats, every Democrat in the House is up for re-election next year, and one-third of the senators are.
And a lot of them are going to be looking at their reelections.
And they may have to go to their Democrat and, you know, the leader, Schumer or whomever it is in the House, and say, I got to vote for this.
I'm going to lose my election.
So, A, you could actually get some laws through because Democrats would be afraid.
But worst case scenario, you have all these issues to run on.
This guy voted for, I don't know, boys in girls sports.
And I think you were very accurate in saying, like, we have so much going for us if you're the Republican Party right now.
You're up in all metrics across the board.
Who do you want to see run this country if you're talking economy, you're talking immigration, if you're talking the wall that you've been solely pointing out?
All these issues, inflation, gas prices.
Banning gas stoves.
That one.
You have all these metrics that Republicans are polling way ahead of Democrats these days.
Talk about the same versus insane.
But let's actually unpack what's actually happening in the House because it looks insane, right?
So we all remember this was, what, a year ago when Matt Gates, it took 15 different votes.
How many votes, Pat?
15 different times for Kevin McCarthy to become Speaker of the House.
Little did we know that part of the agreement was the fact that McCarthy agreed that just one member of the House, right, would be required to call for a vote to vacate the office at any time.
So part of the agreement that McCarthy made with Gates was, all right, if you vote for me, I'm willing to agree that if only one member of the House comes back.
So this all just came back to bite him in the ass.
What's my point?
The 80% thing, Reagan, we were just in Reagan Library in Simi Valley.
I actually saw that quote.
I'm like, oh, that's how negotiations work.
You're not going to get 100% of what you want.
80% is a perfectly amazing number.
Where does the Republican Party go from here?
You know, like it was eight members of the House that sided with who?
The Democrats.
Democrats, yep.
Okay, so you had eight hardline MAGA Republicans, eight of them.
I think it's important to know their names.
Other than Matt Gates, you have Andy Biggs, Ken Buck, Nancy Mace, Tim Burkett, Eli Crane, Matt Rosendahl, and Bob Good.
Good.
I've literally never heard one of their names other than Matt Gates.
And we talk politics all the time.
You have eight people.
You know, they said the gang of eight in the intelligence committee.
This is the fucking gang of eight in the house that is basically tearing down the Republican Party.
Yes.
You got people like Newt Gingrich.
You have Janine Pirro like going crazy on Fox saying basically the Republicans.
Which side are they on?
That's my question.
Well, Newt, what side is Newt on?
Newton's organization.
But basically, is the Republican Party so invested in their morals and resting on their lawyers?
Are they cutting off their nose despite their face doing this?
Oh, yes.
Oh, yes, yes, yes.
Yes.
All we need to do is get majorities.
And you just remind me of something else.
I don't know the details of this, but someone very smart, part of what has caused this.
Actually, I won't even say it because he'll yell at me because I don't know the name of the man.
I don't know the statistical mistakes he made, but someone very smart.
And I asked him to send, say, write it up, and I'm going to substack this.
I'll tell you who it is.
You know how smart he is.
John Lott, more guns, less crime.
He emailed me last night saying this whole thing in the House is, in fact, Donald Trump's fault because he put an idiot in charge of the census.
He didn't know how to do it.
And we lost just straight out of the chute, seven congressional seats.
If we had seven more congressional seats, this never would have happened.
What's our majority?
Four seats?
Yes, four.
What is it, 221 to 212 with two vacancies?
So yeah, you can't lose these types of things.
So now, does Speaker of the House Donald Trump have a nice ring to it?
What are your thoughts on that?
Okay, I don't want to be the one to break this to Patrick, but you can't be Speaker if you have, if you have been indicted.
Oh, damn.
Is that how it works?
So you're saying that literally he cannot be Speaker of the House because he's literally because of the rules, but I don't think he's.
But can you be president if you've been indicted?
Sure, you can be elected if you've been indicted.
You can be in.
I think it was a black congressman in New York years ago.
I ought to know this.
I didn't go to law school.
But as I recall, he was running for office from prison and won election and went up to the Supreme Court because the Supreme Court tried to expel him or not seat him.
And the Supreme Court said, if that's who the voters vote for, is that him?
No?
No, it was a long time ago.
That is not a black guy.
That is not a black guy.
I think it was before I was born.
And it's a famous black politician that's kind of on the tip of my tongue.
It's not even that important, but the answer is if the voters vote for you, you can serve from prison.
So Donald Trump indicted cannot be Speaker of the House, but could still be President of the United States again.
Except there's no possible way he could.
Yeah, the Texas guys.
The 164-style legislation.
The Texas guys that have nominated Donald Trump for that.
That is just Charlie Wrangell.
Yeah, that's just a window dressing because it's, you know, it's legislatively impossible.
I think Kevin McCarthy got schooled.
I think he got schooled.
All these guys supposedly went to law school, right?
And you would think Kevin McCarthy would know the difference between a performance clause and a unilateral action clause.
He gave Matt Gates a unilateral action clause.
And what a unilateral action clause is basically like saying, your dad makes this thing.
If you get straight A's, we're going on vacation.
If you always clean your room, you're going to get this allowance.
And then he puts a unilateral action clause at the bottom that says, unless I'm really in a bad mood one day and I'll do none of it.
And that's basically what Matt Gates put in.
He had all these things to know that just said, if we're ever in a bad mood one day, we can call a vote and toss you out because we know we'll have the Dems plus eight is 216 to 210.
Yeah, that's all we need.
We can even have Eli Crane, Arizona, good guy, by the way, go the other way, and they thought he was.
And maybe it's only five votes, but we only need one and we're going to get you.
And I feel like McCarthy was so desperate in the middle of what had become a media circus of electing the speaker that he basically did a bad contract.
And there's entrepreneurs out there all the time that Pat and I know this because we're operators.
We don't live in the political sphere.
We live in where we're building jobs and following visions and stuff.
And when you have a contract, if you get too excited at the end, you make mistakes.
You give in at the end because you give in to the emotion at the end of the day.
I don't think he would have been speaker otherwise.
That's the point.
He was so married to be speaker that no wasn't good enough.
And instead, he's not going to be able to do that.
We'd still be voting on that.
I mean, I genuinely hate that.
Number 84.
Welcome, American.
Right.
Matt Gaetz does a lot of great things, but that was Matt Gaetz's fault, too.
It was Matt Gaetz who said, I will only vote president if you put this in.
And if it hadn't been McCarthy, I mean, I kind of liked that they took a while voting for the speaker.
I liked it the first few days, but I would not want to have them still voting on this.
This is why Republicans need large majorities, a four-vote majority, and it's going to be hell.
And who are the winners and losers here?
We'd like to do that here.
This is who won.
This is who lost.
Here's who I got.
I'd love you to build on this list.
The winners are obviously the Democratic Party here.
It just proves that Democrats are real about governing, whether their policies are ridiculous or not.
This is what they want to do.
They want to win.
Whereas Republicans are like, their whole mantra is less government, less governing.
So it's sort of the antithesis of the.
So winning are Biden, Pelosi.
This is a good look for Pelosi.
This never happened under my watch.
Never.
And I got one other person, Matt Gates and the Gang of Eight Freedom Caucus.
Who else are the winners and losers in your book in this situation?
Well, I think it's not always because Republicans are so principled.
I mean, it may be I'm utterly speculating here, but because the media is so left-wing and will promote the smart Democrats and the dumb Republicans, Republicans, I sort of feel like they're kind of desperate for press.
And unless they get on Fox News, they are SOL.
I mean, that's one of the things Bannon said in his, when he's telling them, be crazy.
Just add amendments.
Make sure they're outrageous.
Make them crazy, crazy.
Forget Fox News.
You're going to come on my podcast.
And okay, I mean, it is, it is, it's often a cheap shot.
I don't think it's a cheap shot.
I understand their point in needing to get press and needing to get money to run.
I understand that.
But I think that's part of the reason they are, there is a lure to be crazy.
Two last questions for you before we wrap up.
One, what is your actual thoughts on Fox?
Is Fox what it was before?
Has it lost its sizzle?
What is Fox?
The cable is totally over.
Cable is over or Fox is over?
Both.
I mean, Fox, that Dominion lawsuit.
Okay, how about that?
Everything you and all these Trump supporters are mad at me for saying, really?
How do you feel now that you know that all of your heroes on Fox News, like Tucker, felt the same way, saying he hates Trump with a passion.
This isn't true.
Putting all these people on, knew that Trump had lost the election, saying all that came out in discovery.
Reminder: When you get a subpoena, you have to respond.
Fox did it.
So we have what their texts and what their emails were.
And there's no daylight between what I say about Trump and what they were saying about Trump off camera.
You feel good now, Trump supporters, that you were being lied to?
No, that's how much they respect the audience.
We're just going to lie to you and give you whatever you want.
And all the networks are doing that now.
I'm friends with Lawrence O'Donnell.
We used to have dinner in L.A.
He put me on one time.
He's an MSNBC prime, so people know who he is.
And it was like six months before one of my books was coming out.
And I said, okay, I'll do your show, but I want you to have me on when my book comes out.
You know, talk about unilateral performance clause.
And he said, yes, absolutely.
He had me on.
We had a great time.
He told me, his mother told him it was the only time he looked happy.
I mean, we bickered.
We're friends, but he's smart.
I think I'm okay.
So we had a lot of fun.
And then he wouldn't have me on again.
And why?
Because the audience didn't like it.
Well, if you're going to be driven by your audience, that's why MSNBC is crazy left.
That's why Fox will lie to its viewers, lie to its viewers.
See, that's why we'll have Stephen Schmidt last week, and the audience can get upset.
And next week, we'll have you on, and the other side of the audience can get upset.
And the next week we'll have an athlete on.
And then they're going to be confused half the time.
We just like talking to people.
There's something I want you to do for me.
You've got to get me the clip of him arguing with Steve Schmidt because I can't bear to look at him.
I can't bear to listen to him.
Oh, it's all over Twitter.
But if I can just see the clip of you, that will make me happy.
When we leave here, I'm going to give him.
And last but not least, thoughts on Tucker on Tucker's growth and what he's doing right now and how he's exploding his shows all over the place, given the kind of eyeballs that he's getting.
What do you think about what he's doing?
No, I think he's going to go the way.
I ought to say, I think the only good things he ever said on his show, he stole from me.
And the crazy stuff about UFOs and we're all going to die of COVID.
You probably don't remember that.
Oh, yeah, he was the one who drove to Mar-a-Lago to tell the president, you've got to shut down the country.
Yeah, got a lot of good press for that.
And January 6th was all FBI agents.
Crazy.
So not a fan.
And I think he's going the way of the rest of them.
I mean, it shows you, at least it used to.
I think this is changing.
And thanks to podcasts like yours.
Podcasts are so much bigger now.
People are cutting cable.
No one under the age of 60 owns a television set.
And that is so good for the conservative movement because Fox has had way too much power too long.
And it shows you the power of that media real estate.
Going back to, I forget some of the early ones, Paula Zahn, Glenn Beck, Megan Kelly, Bill O'Reilly, Tucker.
Once they're gone, they're kind of gone.
You mentioned January 6th.
Meaning they're done, done?
No, but you have just been given the most wonderful, you've won a lottery ticket if you get a show.
At least it used to be the case.
I think this is changing on Fox News.
For one thing, I think they're not as interesting or smart anymore.
And January 6th, the only thing, I mean, what I think is stupid is the idea that this was planned by the FBI.
Yes, there were FBI informants.
And I remember going through this with all of the terrorism bust George Bush too used to do after 9-11.
Every time they'd bust, there was that Lockawana 7, and there was the guy who was going to blow up the Brooklyn Bridge.
I forget how many there were.
And there was, yes, there were FBI agents involved, MSNBC.
That doesn't mean that these guys weren't really planning a terrorist attack.
And the idea that all of those people on the mall to hear, to hear Donald Trump, no, I don't think it's legal incitement.
That's dumb.
But that was very, very bad for right-wingers.
I wrote a book about mobs.
It's called Demonic.
Mobs Are Always Demonic.
I go through the history of American Revolution versus French Revolution.
We're the party of the rule of law and the Constitution.
We explain, no, the French Revolution, they're running around, you know, guillotining people and with heads on pipes.
That's the left.
And I could say in that book and since that book, there has never been a right-wing mob in the United States history.
That changed on January 6th.
And mobs are always bad.
I 100%, because these are facts, 100%, because the Capitol, the Chief of Capitol Police, Stephen Son, who was interviewed many times, but they tried to silence him, he said he, as the chief, received the threats, death threats.
They were threatening congressmen.
I'm not saying the FBI planned it.
What the problem with January 6th is he knew what was going down and begged, begged.
He called, I think, 17 different agencies and asked for help, but everybody denied him.
It's almost as if Nancy Pelosi, everybody was like, they didn't have to respond.
Their phone records, no subpoenas, no nothing.
His issue as the chief of Capitol Police, who has a higher clearance than I ever had in the military.
He said he asked for help, but they didn't want to give it to him, which basically seems to me that they were like, okay, we're not planning it, but if it's going to happen, we're going to make these people look like they were really trying to take over, which I think that there's a difference when you see it down there.
In the whomever's defense, and by the way, Trump didn't really rush to send in the National Guard either, but in their defense before it happened, and since it did happen, this may sound, if you had asked me before, is the Capitol going to be attacked, I would have said what I just said.
No, there's never been a right-wing mob.
And the warnings they got, it just sounds like, of course, Nancy Pelosi didn't believe it.
All this, Christopher Wray, the head of the FBI, saying the greatest domestic threat is white supremacy.
They're just, they're lying.
They know it isn't.
They know that I'm sorry, white American men are the most Pacific males who have ever walked the face of the earth.
Rob, can you pull that up?
What was that from PBS you put up?
This is what?
Yes, this is an interview with Stephen Sun done by PBS, where he discusses contacting 17 different law enforcement agencies and 1,700 officers to help battle.
And they're confirming that it was correct, that this happened.
Yes.
No, I believe it.
Yeah, which to me, which to me, and if you really unpack it, for him to beg, begging for help and not to get it tells me that they wanted it to be bad and they wanted because they were asking the National Guard, he was begging and they never brought it to him.
They were asking for what happened.
This is on January 6th.
And on January 6th, according to the National Guard, it was Trump that was holding them back.
They had to get pence to make the phone call because the National Guard wasn't allowed to go.
But this, I thought you were talking about the day before.
And the day before, I would have said, oh, come on.
They're not going to do it.
And then when they did, I mean, that's, you were talking about like a few hours in there.
And I'm sure a lot of people made a lot of mistakes.
Yeah, of course.
So what are you saying exactly?
That this is on Trump or this is on no, I'm saying you can't say it's, I think a lot of people made a lot of mistakes.
You can't hold Trump harmless.
Yeah, because I mean, they call it the end.
It's every time something huge happens, there's always an intelligence failure.
They throw that word intelligence community.
They're not that intelligent, but it was, it wasn't.
Yeah, exactly.
Well, gang, this has been fantastic.
And thank you for coming out.
What we're going to do, folks, if you're watching this, we're going to put the link below to her sub stack for you to go look.
Rob, make sure that's in the comment section, chat, and description.
And as well as the link to Amazon on any of the 13 best-selling books you want to buy, we'll put the link below as well.
And thank you so much for coming out.
Thank you.
I really enjoyed it.
Watched you over the years.
You're amazing at the work that you do.
You know how to get under people's skins.
You're professional.
And I know this, you know, when we're sitting out talking, I challenge you on a couple different things.
This is fun.
Yeah, I enjoyed it.
I had a lot of fun with it.
Hopefully, we'll get to it.
I think we agree.
That's a good one.
Rob, put that as a top.
Okay, gang, I think we're doing Tim Pool.
I think we're doing Tim Poole and Jimmy Door on Saturday.
Correct, not Am Saturday.
May be a surprise podcast tomorrow, and I'll tell you about it.
Nobody else knows you and I will talk about it afterwards.
