#752: Ye Took A Dip In The Pool dissects Tim Poole’s chaotic dinner with Trump, Kanye West, Nick Fuentes, and Milo Yiannopoulos—where Ye’s anti-Semitic rants and conspiracy theories (like "MKUltra Canadian intelligence") dominated, Fuentes defended him with performative vagueness, and Poole’s inept moderation backfired. Kanye’s exit left no meaningful pushback, while Fuentes’ "free speech" arguments masked accelerationist white nationalism, from dismissing Charlottesville’s risks to pushing eugenicist policies like women bearing 10–15 children. Their selective grievances—like Google’s alleged bias toward Black inventors—reveal propagandist tactics, exposing Poole’s platform as a vehicle for extremism rather than debate. [Automatically generated summary]
Because let's face it, you know, I can't have a good or bad episode on our show because you can enjoy or not enjoy the episode, but my job is to just be me.
For a long time, I've been of the mind that there is a type of right-wing figure that I feel drawn to cover and a type that I don't want to use my limited amount of time focusing on.
Some of the folks in that second category are there because I feel like other people are competently covering them.
And there may be little more that I could add to the conversation if we did engage.
For example, I think that Dave Rubin is a subject that I don't really want to cover because he gets some good mockery from Sam Cedar.
And Timba on Toast made an incredible in-depth takedown of his rhetorical techniques and the show itself, which you can find on YouTube.
Covering his actual show would likely just involve me repeating critiques that are already well articulated.
Others are in that category because I feel like their primary game involves comedy.
Joe Rogan generally falls into this category.
And I could probably cover any episode of his show for our podcast, but it would end up drifting into territory where we would just be over-analyzing idiots making edgy, offensive jokes.
These are the sort of figures that I might cover, but it's kind of a case-by-case situation.
So I believe that the time has come for me to change how I approach these things a little bit.
I'm not going to abandon focusing on Alex.
Don't get that impression in your head.
But I feel a calling to branch out a little bit more as some trends appear to be growing in our country.
And other people who are Alex adjacent could probably use a bit more of the focused attention that we use to help bring a larger understanding of what they're all about and how they misinform audiences for similar purposes that InfoWars does.
Is this going to be a particularly funny big news story that's resulted in a continued news cycle, which is now going on for over a week, which is in many ways unheard of.
But right now, because Donald Trump went to dinner with Ye and Nick Fuentes, among others, he is now being denounced by Mike Pence, several Republican senators.
And for whatever reason, this story, for many reasons, I suppose people have made, this story has persisted till today.
And we are able to actually sit down with several of the individuals involved in that story, notably Ye, Nick Fuentes, and Malianopoulos, of course, who made the dinner happen.
It's pretty cute that Tim is pretending to not understand why it's a completely fucked up thing for the former president and candidate to be president again is having a meeting with these kinds of fucked up figures.
I guess he's been away from the spotlight for long enough to people to forget what an embarrassing loser Milo is, but here he is.
I wonder how he feels about his book's title now that his brand is that he's a former homosexual.
Probably not thrilled about that choice.
Leaving that nonsense aside, even when he was a trolling gay MAGA scam guy, Milo was a Catholic fascist.
He said as much in an interview with Nick Fuentes years back, and his views haven't gotten better over time.
Nick Fuentes is, in the most generous description, a literal white identity extremist who has a history of Holocaust denial and spreading anti-Semitic conspiracy theories.
He attended the Unite the Right rally in 2017 when he was just 18, marching side by side with Nazis, chanting blood and soil and Jews won't replace us.
And then we've seen what's happened with Ye lately.
He's having a very intense public meltdown and he's fallen in with Fuentes and Milo, which I guess is forming the brain trust for his 2024 presidential campaign/slash publicity stunt.
There may be a mental health component to this, but ultimately, I'm not in the business of infantilizing Ye, and he's entered a space where, manic episode or not, what he's doing is going to get people killed.
Ye is one of the biggest rappers of the past couple decades and has a gigantic fan base.
When he does something like endorse Nick Fuentes or Milo and publicly associate with them and take them along to meet with Trump, that sends a message to his fans.
It's really depressing to imagine the number of people who would never have heard of Nick lest for this association.
Well, I think that there is an element of this that you think about it as we go along.
Sure.
As we go along, consider this thought that you're having, because I think that there are tactical aims and things that are a little bit deeper below the surface and maybe two or three stages removed from the immediate.
So I've said this many times, and I'm going to say it again.
Nick is a little bit of a scam type character, but he's not like the other people that we cover.
He is an ideologue.
He is a gifted speaker.
He's an attractive young man, and he studied debate in high school, which has developed in him the ability to sound convincing to people who aren't listening to him critically, even if what he's saying is complete bullshit.
He understands the optical value of appearance over substance.
By the time someone can realize he's wrong about something, he's already on to the next point, and that's pretty typical.
Nick is involved in a political project, and he's using Ye to push that further.
That project involves many abhorrent goals, like the removal of immigrants from the country, the hardening of our borders, and a requirement that people in government be Christian.
Milo on his own is a complete embarrassment and loser who's relegated to Christian QVC type appearances.
On his own, he's meaningless, but he's not on his own.
He's apparently still a decent networker, and through him, the combination of Ye and Nick is now connected to Marjorie Taylor Green, for whom Milo was recently an aide, apparently.
And who knows what other connections Milo does or doesn't have.
He's the sort of shithead who no one wanted to associate with publicly after, you know, that whole Rogan thing and him talking about pedophilia is pretty great.
I mean, let's not forget that he's only a few years removed from receiving Mercer money.
So it's not like, it's not like they would be like, oh, you're burned forever as opposed to being like, oh, lay low for a few years and then we'll catch you back up.
This trio is interesting as a group because they all have things that the others need.
Ye is famous as shit and he's a lightning rod for attention, but has no real experience in the political spaces.
Milo has that experience and connections, but he's become a bit of a laughingstock that nobody is really going to take seriously.
Nick is savvy and media ready, but no one really wants to associate with him because his public image is that he's a Nazi who was at the Unite the Right rally on January 6th, but people can't ignore him if he's attached to someone like Ye.
And the thing they all have in common is Christian fascist ideology.
I guess I don't think I was saying we're going to discuss his policy prescriptions necessarily.
I don't know what you're pushing back on.
I'm just saying.
Okay.
Then that's the other thing that they have in common, though, that you bring up is that they have pretty fucked up and outfront views about hating Jewish people.
So it's a little insincere for Tim Poole to pretend that it's weird that this meeting was in the news.
The former president and a candidate for the next election was meeting with a trio of Christian fascist ideologues who have a rich history of anti-Semitism.
It's so weird to see everybody talking about a totally innocuous meeting between a former musical genius, incredibly weird loser-fascist white dude, and his incredibly weird loser-fascist white dude friend.
The former incredibly weird white dude fascist president.
I might be reading a little bit into things, but it's my sense that Tim is trying to get people to go sign up for the website to get the bonus members-only video with the implication that this was where there was going to be a conversation about the Jew stuff.
That was where that was going to happen.
If you listen to this episode, you get the sense that Tim had a structure in mind of how this was going to go, where they would talk about the Trump dinner, and he would pat himself on the back for being a great journalist and getting these primary sources in there.
Then they'd get to the anti-Semitism stuff later in a way that he could maximize his benefit from.
People like Tim Poole no business, and you don't want to give away the main event on free TV to use wrestling lingo.
It's interesting how that works, considering you never saw HBO do like nine episodes of Game of Thrones and then like season finale, you got to pay extra for it, bro.
You know, like that's that's an interesting model that somehow works.
So after that happens, Tim and his crew of co-hosts sit around and talk about how well Tim handled himself and how he hates people who subscribe to identity politics because I guess that's how Tim decided to avoid saying anti-Semitism.
This is the long and short of what happens, but we'll go through a little bit more of this because it's really interesting to see how these dynamics play out in action, like in front of you.
It does have the feeling of like if the Ayatollah and a conservative, like prosperity gospel pastor got together, they'd be like, listen, I don't agree with you, and I want you to die.
But actually, everything we want the world to be is pretty much identical.
I know that some somewhat left-leaning people were suckered into supporting Ron Paul because of his opposition to war and support for weed, but people who were starting organizations to promote him weren't that naive about how extremely far to the right his actual politics were.
I find that to be a level of naivety that I'm not willing to accept.
And he isn't some kind of a bit player in the history of conspiracy bullshit either.
Like, he's prominently featured in the 2009 documentary New World Order alongside Alex Jones and his drunk, Bilderberg-obsessed Holocaust-denying friend Jim Tucker.
Honestly, this is a bad look for Poole with his whole game of trying to play like he's in the center and he's a really critical thinking type media figure, like palling around with 9-11 conspiracy theorist Alex Jones castoffs.
I think maybe people who like him view him that way, but I don't think anybody who would look at this with a critical eye would come away with that impression.
You remember how Dave Rubin was like, I'm leaving the left.
I'm the last kind of true liberal.
That kind of branding is really powerful, I think, for people who want to push right-wing ideas, but try and avoid any kind of the like, I don't know, negative associations that come along with that.
We had scheduled the dinner in October, and then he announced for president.
He pushed the dinner back to November.
And I've been pulling together a campaign.
And after I put up the DEF CON tweet, a bunch of people that have been canceled, like Alex Jones, I started getting contact with other people that were now on the, you know, the inside of the Matrix.
And Alex Jones' producer said that Milo wanted to contact me.
This could be Daria, I suppose, but it could also be one of the other figures around InfoWars, like Rob Dew or the IT guy, Michael Zimmerman, who has a bunch of connections to really extreme fringe figures.
So that could be sort of a natural person he would call a producer.
I mean, the problem I have with Kanye and Milo and Nick Fuentes, aside from all their views, is just like, what the fuck do you talk about when you're not being anti-Semitic?
You know, like, Kanye can't be like, listen, I know you think that you want to go with 110, but if you go with 105 beats per minute, it's going to give you a little extra idiosyncrasy that's going to bring out some special juice, you know?
So whoever it was at InfoWars, they saw the tweet where Ye said that he was going to go DEF CON 3 on the Jews, and they knew that this was exactly what they had been waiting for.
A huge celebrity ruining their public image in a way that it would be, you know, they'd be relegated to hanging out with dipshits like Milo and Nick.
This reveals another interesting thing, and that is that Alex's producer has been in touch with Ye and Ye hasn't come on the show yet.
That has to be a choice.
This tends to point towards my theory that Alex actually doesn't want to have Ye on because of the possibility of exactly how this Tim Poole interview went.
Say what you like about this interview.
No one comes out looking good.
Milo, Nick, and Ye already look like shit, so it's a push for them.
But Tim really looks like a complete craven dick for engaging in this interview for attention and being so ineffectual.
I got to say, though, he's not so ineffectual once they storm out because at that point he's trying to self-soothe and he's pretty.
I think that there is a possibility for that, but I also think that there's, I think that there's a possibility that Nick can engage in this kind of stuff and engage fairly unscathed.
Because I think that he is smart enough to let Milo get embarrassed.
I mean, he went up against Turning Point USA and only grew through it.
And look at what they're certainly diminished in their he thinks he's invincible.
Well, I mean, you could say there's some hubris, but I also think that, you know, times when you would have thought, like, oh, this isn't going to be a good idea.
And we sat there, and it was like when Trump came in, we were, I said, do you want to sit alone?
He's like, no, bring your friends in.
So a big thing is like Trump had no idea who Nick Fuentes was.
But this whole, I just, I just got to go right to the heart of this anti-Semite claim that's happening.
This is something, if you read the definition, it says you can't claim that there's multiple people inside of banks or in media that are all Jewish or you're anti-Semitic.
It's cute that he's trying to play a game where he has some definition he's decided to use for anti-Semitism so he can pretend it's absurd for him to be labeled as such a thing.
That's dumb, and I don't really want to take the time to humor that shit.
But this clip is important because I think you can see Tim's uselessness here.
He's trying to ask a question about the dinner and very much doesn't want the anti-Semitism talk to come this early.
It's too volatile a topic, and that's gonna, if that's gonna come at all, it needs to be eased into a little bit.
Ye, on the other hand, is all too eager to talk about his feelings about Jewish people at any time when someone puts a mic in front of him.
And because Tim can't control the conversation at all, this is where we are.
In fairness to Tim, there's no way to control this conversation.
Ye isn't interested in playing Tim Poole's games because he's super famous and he doesn't give a shit about Tim's crypto extremist audience.
Ye's already past that.
He's already extreme.
He's hanging out with Nick and Milo.
And if anything, they were doing Tim a favor by showing up.
I know that Poole's show is big and all, but it's not Ye level.
There's no way to control this conversation because Ye doesn't give a shit.
And even if he kind of gave a shit, he has two bigot friends there to embolden him and egg him on.
So honestly, if I were Tim, I never would have done a show like this.
It's great for getting attention, but the consequences are really bad.
Even leaving aside how bad it is for the public discourse to have this guest line up on the show, it's really bad for Tim.
He comes off looking like a really limp noodle.
And because they left with Ye, Nick and Milo kind of have achieved something of an elevated status over Tim.
Because get this, without Milo, there's no way Ye was showing up on Poole's show.
From the perspective of Milo, and presumably Nick and Ye too, Tim fucked this up.
And in general, America has been left ignorant and history has been changed.
So when we start questioning things that question the indoctrination, then you immediately get, you know, you said debanked or what did you say happened to you?
I was hoping to go for the news first before we got into all of this stuff.
I think the issue is one way to put it is you're expounding upon a localization issue that you've witnessed, right?
Let me clarify.
There are a handful of people that you see are Jewish in a certain place, and then you associate Judaism with the power, whereas I view that as not relevant to it.
Like, yeah, you're substantially more powerful than I am, but I don't view what you're doing as an issue of black people.
Yeah, but have you ever heard the term the black vote?
So it's okay to put us in one net, but it's not okay for me to put them in one net.
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Yeah, but I mean, that's the basis of the hypocrisy that people have been thinking about and knowing about and realizing for decades.
We were all wondering how this damn was everybody in the country was wondering what is the root of this hypocrisy?
Why can people talk about white people a certain way?
Why can't they talk about that group a certain way?
And the wretched and wicked and oppressive, prevailing orthodoxy of cancel culture.
Well, it turned out that the one thing that was going to break the dam was the biggest star in the world, and it took the biggest star in the world to do it.
How does this theory even work if you're going to take it seriously?
No one wanted Jared to have any official role and he wouldn't have if he wasn't Trump's son-in-law.
That wasn't a Jewishness issue.
It was a nepotism hire.
And what about the fact that Rahm was Obama's chief of staff from the time of his election until October 2010 when he ran for Chicago mayor?
He was only in that position for like a year and a half and then was replaced by Bill Daly, relative of former Chicago Mayor Richard Daly, who isn't Jewish.
But then, oh no, Daly was replaced by Jack Lou, who is Jewish and was the chief of staff for about a year, and then he was replaced by Dennis Montague, who is an Irish Catholic.
This isn't a localization issue.
That's a euphemism that Poole is using, so he doesn't have to call this what it is.
This is a person who has an anti-Semitic conclusion that he's justifying by pointing at various Jewish people and then pretending a point is being made.
This shit is paper thin, and Poole can't even handle that.
And because he's tried to frame this as a localization issue, he's walked into a trap that he can't get out of.
Ye is able to respond back to him that people talk about the black vote, which actually doesn't even relate to what Tim was saying.
But Tim's point is so weak that I don't think he even has the energy to think it's worth standing on it.
He would lose that battle of ideas, and that is a real risk.
So the reality is that Tim wants nothing more than to not really push back on this issue and definitely not call it what it is because I don't think he wants the consequences that come along with that.
I mean, it's hard pressed to say, ladies and gentlemen, after talking with Kanye, Milo Yiannopoulos and Nick Fuentes, I have to agree, all Jews are bad.
It's funny in some ways just because so many of these people are from a distance like watching Ye pull his bullshit going like, yeah, pumping their fists.
But when you're in a situation where you have to have a professional conversation with Ye, he doesn't give a shit.
You're the loser here.
Ye is, yay, yeah.
I mean, it's a question of you can watch him say anti-Semitic things on other shows and be like, that's what I want on my show.
Right.
But I want him to say it and then walk away from it, back away like so many other people do.
You know, we're so used to seeing people step over the line and then go on a show the next day and be like, well, I didn't mean to step over the line.
You want if my, or he, Tim wants there to be some sense of like, on my show, we'll get the like, what I was actually trying to say is some, yeah, but he did mean what he said.
But I think that what Tim would have liked is the attention and gigantic amount of people putting their eyes on him because of getting this interview and the controversialness of it.
He hates identitarianism, which as far as I can tell from listening to him is just a smarter sounding word than if you were to complain about identity politics.
That would make you sound like a Reddit user from 2016, and that is not what Tim is.
The problem is that Tim isn't consistent about this thinking about things in terms of identity, and Ye essentially destroys that whole attempt at an argument.
Tim is trying to reframe Ye's anti-Semitism as an instance of identitarianism and then runs right into a brick wall of Ye bringing up that he'd said that Ye would do well with the black vote.
It's important to also understand that when Tim says identitarian, he's not talking about the actual thing, identitarianism, because that is a thing.
Tim and most of his friends actually are pretty solidly identitarian in terms of the actual political philosophy that that word describes.
They're nationalists.
They're highly concerned about ideas like the great replacement.
They hate globalism and they're into traditionalism.
It's pretty clear that this is right in line with the show based on all their video titles and guests.
By the way, I clearly don't know enough about Tim Pool's crew at his show, but looking through their guest list, I found that one of his producers guessed it on an episode.
Producers/slash co-hosts, quite frankly.
And she's one of the people who steps in when Ye leaves to fill in one of the chairs.
One of the people who takes over and is clearly part of the show is a woman named Hannah Claire Brimlow, who is the daughter of Peter Brimlow, the founder of VDARE, the outlet that's known for promoting white nationalists and anti-Semitic writers.
It's like, I just wish it wasn't so easy to see through them.
Because when it's so easy, and it makes you feel bad about the rest of the people who don't see through it, you know?
Because it's like when you, if you're doing the like fucking simple edition worksheet, you know, where you're like nine plus three and you see somebody struggling with, you know, like five plus seven.
Because I get it.
You know, you think it's going to be 14.
I do all the time.
And you're like, oh, you're so close, man.
And it makes you feel bad.
And this makes me feel bad.
It makes me feel bad to know that these people are allowed.
I think the construct of race has really been forced upon us as just something for us to be woke about and just constantly talk about and use it as these like walls.
Well, let's look at the facts of what I'm saying, though.
If you say in this neighborhood where they gerrymander this amount of time.
So, hey, I wasn't doing that.
I was just gerrymandering the lawyers and the Hollywood executives and the people at the bank that de-banked me and then froze my accounts.
You know, it's like we want to jump into protecting the idea that we can't put a net around something, right?
But that's been my job as a producer to take, you know, a Roy Ayer sample and put a James Brown drum and put it within a two-minute, three-minute song.
That's the way I actually think and that's the way I talk.
And now this morning, I found out that they were trying to put me in prison because what they did was I moved $140 million into JP Morgan.
And I said, I want to talk to Jamie Dimon.
Like, look at me.
I'm just going a naive, you know, multi-billionaire.
Like, maybe Jamie Dimon will let me in on some deal flow wrong.
He just references and I start complaining online and then they de-bank me for complaining.
And so I'm about to get de-banked.
They're like, you need to go to Trump's, the bank, AXO, whatever.
You got to go.
And I'm like, I've been trying to buy my own bank for the longest.
And then we figured out how to get my own bank.
It's like 50 million, 75 million.
So I'm about to buy my own bank.
But then as they're about to take the money out, here comes Adidas with a $270, $75 million bill for marketing funds that they agreed upon.
Because I said to them, hey, I'm the marketing.
Give me the marketing fund, which proves by the response they got when they stole the designs and said, we're going to not call them Yeezys anymore.
So this is what I was already fighting Adidas for.
So I'm fighting Gap, get out of Gap, fighting Adidas.
And then I deal with this little bit of noise from, you know, Zionism from the fashion world where they use this plant named Gabby, who's obviously like some kind of CIA agent, knows nothing about fashion.
This is a certain thing.
When someone can't dress, you know that they're not like a fashion person.
They're just there as like the society, like the control that they try to use with celebrities, which has now been broken, right?
Because you know where it broke.
Okay, I want to get on like LeBron in a second, but I'm going to come back to this and just talk about this morning where, you know, I'm not going to mention her name because she's a nice lady, but someone at Cohen Resnick tells me, and I've tell my, all of my finance people never use the term a lot, but they said, okay, you're going to have to pay a lot of taxes.
And that made me feel like they're just like waiting, like, we finally got him.
We finally can put him in jail.
And I was like, can I still run for president in jail?
And like this kind of a rambling thing going on this long tells you that Tim has lost control.
He is not in control of this.
He has given up essentially on in any way trying to be a host on this show.
Luke Radowski is the one who has to try and jump in and he brings up fucking Epstein for some reason and then gets shut down by Ye saying, I need to finish my thought.
This is tough to listen to because it does feel like what needs to happen is the Solquarians need to kidnap Kanye and take him to a fucking ayahuasca retreat together and then they'll be fine.
Next year, I was supposed to make $500 million in royalties.
And like, no one needs this amount of money.
But when I would work on homeless shelters and ideas, I'd have a contractor.
We won't say what race.
And, you know, they'd be tearing down the contracts.
It's all about, you know, position.
It's not about the amount of money that you have.
And, you know, to come in here, I feel like as a setup to be like defending, I'm not going to go through another, like, I'm literally going to walk the F off the show if I'm sitting up here having to, you know, talk about you can't say that it was Jewish people that did it when every sensible person knows that.
I mean, Jon Stewart knows what happened to me and they took it too far.
It was like American History X. Like my head was on the side of the curve and the exact people that I called out kicked my head.
We found out that my trainer was a MKUltra Canadian intelligence.
So this has been legitimately like five minutes straight of Ye rambling about entirely, like almost entirely uninterrupted about a wide selection of topics with only the thinnest connective tissue existing between them.
And now he's getting defensive about the whole thing about how he's anti-Semitic when he was the one who brought it up to begin with.
Tim would have loved to save that for the part of the show that's behind a paywall or at very least the end of the show.
But Ye did not let that happen.
Harley Pasternak is a personal trainer for celebrities, but one of his previous gigs was working with the Canadian Department of National Defense.
One of the things there that he did was running studies on drugs and how they affected various aspects of soldiers' performance, like things that could keep people up for a long period of time that weren't stimulants, etc.
There's no indication that he's MK Ultra, but he's Jewish, so that explains Ye's preoccupation with him.
Ye posted a couple of alleged screenshots of messages Pastor Nak sent him where Pastor Nak was threatening to, quote, have you institutionalized again where they medicate the crap out of you and you go back to zombie land forever.
I have no idea if these are real texts.
And honestly, if this guy's some big-time Hollywood celebrity handler, there's no way he would make a threat like that in texts.
If the evil cabal was that sloppy, they'd be getting busted all over the place.
It would fall apart so fast.
Anyway, larger point, Tim is doing nothing here.
He has not been able to come up with any decent rebuttals to this shit.
And the things that he does say end up getting him in traps.
And now he's just let Ye monologue for what feels like a lifetime, and that's not even good enough.
Ye still managed to somehow feel like he's being put on trial for rambling about a topic that he brought up himself.
If I were Poole, I just wouldn't have done this interview.
Listen, listen, all I'm going to say is I don't want to get caught up in one of these things where we talk about how I'm an anti-Semite or I want to constantly make jokes and implications that all Jews are bad.
And I don't want you to push back.
I want you to laugh at my funny, I hate Jew jokes like these two white nationalists do right over here.
I'm going to get, I'm going to order with the last of my money that's available in a different account.
I'm going to order a PJ before I sit and have another lecture setup conversation when I'm literally trying, they're trying to put me in jail for my opinion.
It's like, I would have never wanted to do anything that hurt Trump.
I'm on Trump's side.
Trump said things that hurt me.
He lied about me.
But I mean, he's known for lying.
And when people used to tell me that, you know, he's a liar, it's like, you know, I went into the trenches for Trump.
That's another conversation.
There was no one in my position that wore that hat.
And all of my surroundings exhausted me.
It was like deaf by a thousand questions.
I know I'm jumping to another thing.
But what I'm saying is, I know you got a rep for your people online, but it's like you got a person in real life that, all right, I'm not with it, bro.
I lost the money for the freedom of speech.
And that's what makes me the only American that we know that really deserves to run the country because everyone else, your boy DeSantis, Trump, whoever they raise in a petri dish over on the Democrat side, is going to play the game.
Well, I mean, these are all far-right people who live under this guise of I say whatever I want because the censors have, you know, like I will be uncensored.
And so if you turn me off or whatever, I'll keep saying whatever I want.
But they don't understand what it actually means to not give a fuck about what anybody says.
Like they all live on this pretend, we put on this cape of like, oh, the mainstream media hates us.
And they still pretend that they don't have a complete and utter obligation to say whatever it is that their audience wants.
You know, like you guys just say whatever your audience wants the same way that you think other people are containing your speech or whatever.
Kanye really does not give a fuck.
He is going to say whatever the fuck he wants, and it really doesn't matter to him.
That's what they don't understand.
They don't understand a person who truly does not care.
The contract for the next four years, if I hadn't done anything, would have been $500 million a year for four years.
What I was fighting for was the IP so my children could, you know.
I'm sorry, just sometimes I think about seven thoughts at one time because anything I see, I come up with like seven answers to it and then just choose what it is.
But the thing is, when I said my children, the reason why my brain kind of blocked, because it's like God is saying, you know, your children are going to be okay.
You know, baby mama's got money, right?
God is using me.
He's breaking me down, removing all of the, you know, riches person, all of this, so I can serve him.
And the more and more those things are taken away from me, the more I can be empty and be a vessel and be able to be used.
And right now, it's like, you're not going to take, if we can't, you're not going to take my pain away, right?
The Jewish people say, it's the Holocaust, this happened, and you can't say anything about it.
We can't take their pain away.
No one's going to denounce the fact that they tried to lock me up.
That's what, because every time I'm just holding stride, and it's like, I didn't, I thought I was more Malcolm X, but I find out I'm more MLK because as I'm getting hosed down every day by the press and financially I'm just standing there.
And when I found out that they tried to put me in jail, it was like a dog was biting my arm and I almost shed a tear, almost, but I still walked in stride through it.
I would say that if you put the camera on him and didn't have Tim or anyone else there, then eventually, if he were talking for 20 minutes, he would have stood up and left, anyways.
He would start talking, he'd get to a hundred different topics, eventually complain about some Jewish people.
And then it'd be like, I'm going to be like, I'm not in a position where I need to defend myself to myself, and I'm out of here.
Yeah, I mean, honestly, what's fun about it is that they clearly are not recognizing that they are so meaningless and empty compared to like they just and I think that if Tim wants the credit for what he's giving himself credit for, he should have given far more concrete pushback to the very ridiculous things that were being said.
He would have maybe tried to get some clarity on some of the rambling points that went nowhere and didn't get finished.
Like there, there's a completely different set of behaviors that you would have expected if he was going to be like, I can't be expected to just let Ye show up and say these things and expect that I'm not going to, you know, like, no, you didn't do that.
Right.
That's a fiction that you're painting now that he has left the room.
I think that there's a certain world where if it's just Ye, you could potentially provide pushback.
You know, he'd probably end up leaving anyway, just like this.
But when you have the three of them there, there's no win.
Like, you're either going to end up in this situation or, worst case scenario, they respond and you can't handle the three-on-one that's going on of the Milo, Nick, and Ye.
And you just end up looking like an idiot getting dunked on by anti-Semites.
I would say the problem I have is I don't, one, there's no reason to have Ye on even by himself because what are you going to, if what are you going to push back on if the thought is going to be completely different two seconds later?
What are you going to convince him of that won't then be different two seconds later?
What thought is he going to follow you all the way through to the conclusion?
It's just identity politics.
No, it's not even that.
You're just having them on there as a fucking freak.
I mean, it's the same thing that you can expect a lot of these folks on the right to be doing, which is trying to chase whatever attention they can get by proximity to a giant celebrity.
And there's something that's there's a tension to where at least it's like, is something going to break?
What's going to happen here?
Whereas afterwards, it's just him sitting there with the daughter of the guy who made V-Dare, Luke Radowski, and some other lady talking about how great a job Tim did and how he's a big boy.
I've seen a lot of response to this be things like, how does Ye think he can run for president if he can't stand a little pushback in the interview?
And I think that that misses some important points.
The first is that to people inclined to like Ye and respond to the message that he's putting out, leaving this interview doesn't actually signal weakness.
The second thing is that if you just watch the minute prior to the storming out, it kind of does appear like Tim is giving some pushback to Ye, but I don't think that's necessarily a fair way to characterize the rest of the interview.
If anything, Ye entered this interview having just said a bunch of comically anti-Semitic stuff, proceeded to say anti-Semitic nonsense, and Tim did his best to sanitize it so the audience could see it as something other than anti-Semitism.
It was a localization issue or an instance of identitarianism, but it wasn't the thing that it obviously was.
This wasn't an episode of Tim giving pushback to Ye's ideas and Ye not being able to handle it.
It was a case of Tim failing in an effort to whitewash the things Ye was saying.
Whether or not that was his conscious intent, that's exactly what Tim achieved or failed to achieve.
And no shade on Tim for failing on that effort.
Ye clearly had no interest in participating in a sanitization of his shit.
That's like Tim wasn't going to be able to pull that off.
The problem, as I see it, is that this happened in the first place, as you said, basically.
The way it went down and all that is pretty much what you'd expect considering the players involved.
It's flashy and kind of funny to see a show go off the rails, but it wasn't even good in that world.
R.I.P. Unfortunately, there are some things here that can't be ignored.
The fact is that Trump has announced that he's running in 2024.
The fact is that Ye has claimed that he's running in 2024 in the middle of a series of public appearances where he seems to be becoming increasingly comfortable in his place as a public anti-Semite.
Amidst that, he's attached himself to Nick Fuentes and Milo Yiannopoulos, who are only going to push him further down that road to serve their own purposes.
And Trump had dinner with Ye, who brought his crew along.
I don't think that dinner is something that should be ignored, but I think that the least meaningful way to cover it is to have a freewheeling interview with Ye, Milo, and Nick, like Tim Poole decided he was going to do.
If you're trying to get to the bottom of what happened, do some reporting on it.
Maybe try to find a source in the staff in Mar-a-Lago who was there and maybe could tell you an unbiased outsider opinion.
Nick and Milo are not reliable sources, particularly about things that have to do with themselves.
And I think Tim knew full well what he was getting with Ye.
As we've said a number of times about people like Rogan, booking guests is an editorial decision in and of itself.
When you're inviting on people like this and you're not fully prepared to have a very confrontational interview, you're having them on to promote them.
Think about this.
One of the only things that Tim even said about Fuentes was defending him from accusations of being a white supremacist because he's working with Ye.
There was no acknowledgement that within the like the last month, Nick has called for the expulsion of Jews from the country.
And that wasn't a like what he was doing was like a how could you be racist if you have a black friend level defense of Nick.
Like it's ridiculous.
That is a choice.
And it's Tim showing deference to these creeps because his goal never was to provide meaningful pushback to the toxic ideas that they're responsible for for spreading.
We do have to acknowledge that this is happening whether we like it or not.
It very well may end up being the case that Ye doesn't actually make it to running for president.
And even if he does, it seems like he'd have to run as a third-party candidate.
So he may not even have to appear in debates.
So the idea of him not being able to stand up to a debate might even be fucking irrelevant.
But even if he doesn't make it to primary season, there is a reason to take this seriously.
Many of them are matters for experts in other fields to discuss, but from my standpoint, many of these roads lead back to Nick Fuentes.
Being involved in this will give him a higher profile campaign experience and bring him into even closer contact with whatever political figures end up supporting Ye.
In the same way that vanity candidates use campaigns to sell books, Nick can use this to network and raise his stature within other right-wing spaces.
This isn't a campaign that's destined or even intended to succeed.
This is a design of pure accelerationism, where a gigantic star that the media can't ignore is used to bullhorn the talking points of people who are easy to ignore.
The goal isn't to win.
It isn't even to help a conservative or Republican win.
It's to take over the right wing.
Anyone paying attention saw how easy it was to get the entirety of the GOP power structure to fall in line with Trump, and they have to have realized that that wasn't like an isolated event that wasn't going to happen again.
If someone were able to command a similar amount of cult of personality and promise these GOP leaders the things they want, they will become yay Republicans overnight.
The goal is primarily to move the party, the GOP, further into the extreme right wing.
And as such, I think it's now time that we need to step up to the plate and take on some of this stuff.
I've shied away from covering some folks like this for various reasons that I mentioned at the top of the episode, but I'm going to reconsider that in terms of broadening our Wacky Wednesday crew to include some of these other characters.
And one of the highest priorities, I believe, is Nick Fuentes.
It's very easy just to call Nick a racist and an anti-Semite, and that's all good and well.
And I don't think I would disagree.
But from my taste, I want a fuller picture.
So today, what we're going to do is we're going to jump in and cover an episode of Nick's show, America First, from just before he made his big splash into the Nazi-adjacent big leagues on August 11th, 2017.
This is just before he would attend the Unite the Right rally, after which he dropped out of college and really committed himself to streaming racist shit from his parents' basement.
So at this point, he's on, or his show is being aired on the Rightside Broadcasting Network.
And, you know, he's an 18-year-old boy that is a real shithead.
But even in this nascent state, you can hear basically very much the underpinnings of the ideas that I believe he's still carrying out.
And some of it, I think, applies to his behavior vis-à-vis gay.
As much as I am excited to go and meet people of like mind, people that know what's going on, people that are not dumb and are in the Matrix and on the blue pill, people that we can talk about how we're going to fix the country, fix the demographics.
As excited as I am for all of that, I'm nervous.
And this was a little bit of a shower thought today.
You're going to have all the top guys, the top brass, all the tinpot soldiers, if you will, that are going to be there, all the main guys from the white nationalist, alt-right, fringe right.
I don't know what you'd want to call it, but this new faction that's emerging.
Obviously, there's a lot of factions.
The same old thing that sort of goes with the territory that he's talking about, Unite the Right, that you have all different groups coming together.
And I sort of thought it's kind of like in that movie In Glorious Bastards, which I watched it, I liked it for a long time, and then I hit the red pill, and now I hate it.
And now I really hate it for obvious reasons.
But in Glorious Bastards, the end of the movie, they get all the Nazis in one place, and then they blow them all up, and they shoot them all, and they kill them all.
And I'm thinking, you know, that's sort of like pornography, basically, for the social justice warrior, for the communist, for, you know, people of color, whatever.
I'm thinking, is that not exactly what we're doing with Unite the Right?
Is let's put every important person in our movement in one place and everyone sees us as a threat to civilization.
I mean, isn't that kind of worrisome?
I don't know.
I mean, I hope I'm not concerning people.
I'm still going to go.
You know, you can't live your life in fear.
But you think of it that Kessler, Enoch, Spencer, James Olsa, Baked Alaska.
I mean, like, everyone's going to be there.
Sam Hyde, Lauren Southern, people from Rebel Media are going to be there.
And I don't know.
Is that a great idea?
I don't know who thought it'd be a great idea.
Like, hey, let's all go to Lee Park.
Everyone thinks we're Nazis and bigots, and let's just go in the middle of an open field, all the important people.
Look, I understand the importance of rallying the troops, building the morale, uniting the right.
That's why I'm going.
I am a little worried about that part of it, that you might get some nut job, some Travis Bickle LARPer down there with some bad intentions and some bad ideas.
It's interesting his like, oh, then maybe some nut job will, but, but, like, I mean, you don't understand the movie if you think it's just some nut job.
There was a war and Hitler was there.
So.
Hooray!
That was kind of the point.
I mean, if your argument is that this is a lot like that, I think you're saying a lot too much.
We're portrayed in the media as the dangerous ones, the violent ones.
We're the only people in the world that can't advocate for our own interests without it being dangerous.
Like, you go to a Black Lives Matter rally, and you're not in danger of getting killed by white people.
You may be in danger of getting killed by white supremacists or Klansmen.
If you go to a Palestinian rally, there's no danger of you getting killed.
If you go to a pro-Zionist, there's no danger of you getting killed.
Why revokes your permits, deletes your event page on Facebook, denies you service in Airbnb and Uber.
That doesn't happen.
Only happens with white people, right?
Only when we say we don't want to be exterminated, we're the only ones getting denied service, revoked, events canceled on Facebook, and threat of being murdered by people, and that's just fine.
Yeah, it's it's unfortunate in some ways, even for him.
Yeah.
Because I think that a lot of people, when they're 17, 18, 19, even into your 20s, if you are held to that for the rest of your life, it's not necessarily fair.
And then, of course, we're talking about this Google thing.
You know, I didn't talk about this a whole lot because it was very basic.
It was a very basic subject.
It was a very basic topic to talk about.
It was all your usual suspects, your usual free speech warriors.
Google fired someone for saying a contrary opinion.
Oh, that's against free speech.
You know, as much as I like a lot of the personalities on the alt-light, the new right, you know, that faction, it's just boring.
It's so bland to me because there's so many bigger things going on.
You know, like I was saying about the Unite the Right.
When our people, when white people are being killed and discriminated against and we're under the threat of violence for advocating our interest, and, you know, you have people that are in front of maps and things complaining about social media and all that, you know, you just got to think of your priorities.
You can't come out and say, my political objective is to make sure that my race is always in a position where we can assert authority in all situations.
Whereas if you present it this way, it's euphemistic in the same way that like a localization issue, you know, way that Tim can talk about anti-Semitism without like actually being upfront about what this is.
So one of the things that you need to understand about Nick in terms of his prescriptive ideas about policy and about the way society should be ordered is that he is not necessarily somebody who's in the same camp as like Alex, who believes in the Constitution.
For so long, we're told by the right wing that we should be libertarians, right?
That as long as there's no censorship, as long as there's no discrimination, as long as there's like a free market and there's free speech and there's a free and open society, that's good enough, right?
The conservatives say we should have a free press and we should have free enterprise and free speech and free assembly and free everything.
You have all kinds of conservatives that are saying, well, you know, Google fired this guy for speaking out against, you know, speaking out about obvious biological truths about men and women.
But Google's a private company.
They can do what they want, and there's nothing we can do about it.
Right?
Google's a private company, and so they're free to do it.
We may not agree with it, but that's their right.
And God bless the free market.
And I thought to myself, that is true in every institution where we have these dummies on the right, these dummy conservatives, that all they advocate for is free openness, open freedom, whatever, libertine, libertarians.
And we always get screwed every time with everything.
And even the National Labor Board found after an investigation that his firing was completely illegal and appropriate.
He argues that there are innate biological traits that make women less employed in the tech field and at Google, and this had an effect of creating a hostile work environment for folks, and it wasn't protected.
Like, this isn't, I don't know, but you get this revelation through discussing this story that, like, no, fuck, there should be, the government should be controlling the economy.
It should step in and be like, no, fuck this.
But even in hiring and firing decisions about the government should have a choice.
You had all the college kids in Berkeley marching for free speech in the 60s.
Once they got in control of academia, no free speech for white people.
Free enterprise, there's no discrimination allowed by the market because it's costly to a business.
We should open up the free markets.
You can only discriminate against white people in the marketplace now.
Freedom of the press.
We can talk about anything in the press as long as we get a free press.
We can have information and everything.
It's an information revolution with the internet.
Only people that are discriminated against, white people, once they take control of the institutions.
And who controls the institution, folks?
Take a look.
Take a look at who controls them, right?
The globalists.
And I just think it's so funny that you have so many people, young people in particular, it baffles me, that are still championing this hedonistic, ridiculous libertarian cause that only hurts our interests.
So one thing that is important to point out is that every time that Nick says globalists, he's smiling and doing like a little bit of a wink to the audience.
Well, just for the sake of example, black team is there playing soccer.
They wear black jerseys.
They don't play by the rules.
They pick the ball up with their hands and they throw it in the net.
And they only pass to each other.
And they run into the middle of the field.
They pick up the ball and then they throw it in the net.
And then they take it out and they throw it in the net.
And they take it out and then they throw it in the net.
And they're winning.
They're just running up the scoreboard.
One, two.
You know, you don't see high scores in soccer because it's a ridiculous sport, but you're seeing 100, 105, 200 because they're just picking it up and throwing it in the net.
They're not playing by the rules.
They're not playing ethically.
They're not playing fairly.
They're not playing by the rules.
They pick it up, they throw it in the net.
And let's just say, hypothetically, the other team, the white team, they're wearing white jerseys.
They're just getting mad about it.
They're just sitting on the sidelines with their hands on their hips saying, hey, that's not fair.
That's not playing by the rules, black team.
You can't pick it up with your hands and throw it in the net.
That's not by the rules.
Look at our rulebook.
It goes against Article 1, Section Whatever of the rulebook.
And you're not playing by the rules, and we're not going to let this happen.
And they sit there with their hands on their hips, and black team just keeps throwing it in the net, and they're running up the scoreboard, and white team's saying, hey, I don't like that so much.
Except, here's the difference.
In the real world, it doesn't matter how you get the points.
It just matters that you get the points.
And the loser dies.
The loser is exterminated.
Once they get to a point where the black team gets a huge lead, the black team just kills white team.
And that's basically the world we're living in.
I don't have to spell out the analogy, but that's basically it.
Which is you have people on white team that are saying, let's do whatever it takes to win.
And then everyone else on the white team is saying, no, that's not fair.
We have to play by the rules.
We will not play until everyone plays by the rules.
And you understand what happens.
White team may have the rule book.
White team may have played ethically.
They were so fair.
They were so moral.
They were so virtuous.
They talked about the universal brotherhood of soccer players and how it's all just about when they're losing.
It's about playing the game.
But then they all get killed in the parking lot once everyone decides to go home.
But I mean, like, entering the field, like from start that, they've got five people in goal, right?
And then the black team has about 10 people.
All right.
And then the white team steals the black team's parents' balls, takes those away from them, and then their grandparents' balls and takes those away from them.
So they've got all these millions of balls and they're just firing at the goal.
But then the black team scores one goal.
And so the white team goes, fucking apeshit and elects Trump to be president.
But the moral of the story, the teachable moment, is the free speech idea, the free speech spook, is an instrument.
It's not the ends in itself.
We use free speech as an argument, as a tool to further our own interests.
We use free speech to get these guys to play by their own rules, to hold themselves to the same standards.
But we're not after free speech in itself.
We're not after total and absolute freedom in itself.
Of course not.
Because every time that we do get this total and absolute freedom, we get certain groups of people that use it and through unfair advantages and strategies, they climb to the top and use it to their own advantage.
We're talking about the globalists here.
And so that's why we have to play for our own team, finally.
And that's what it comes down to.
With this Google thing, it teaches us that the argument is liberty, but not for liberty for the sake of itself, not in itself, not as an ends in itself, but to further our own interests.
This is a great moment to understand Nick a little bit better.
Don't for a second trust that something he's saying necessarily has to be sincere, because there's a very good chance that something he's pursuing is actually just a red herring and is part of something else entirely, namely advancing his white identity agenda.
What Nick is doing is echoing the ideology of his forefathers, particularly George Lincoln Rockwell, the founder of the American Nazi Party.
Rockwell would go to college campuses and cause a scene and gain free press coverage under the banner of free speech, but the goal was really spreading his Nazi ideas.
The free speech part isn't important to them at all on the basis of it being a principle.
They would gladly crush the speech rights of people they didn't like were they in charge, but they know that they can cry free speech in order to mask what their rallies and ideologies are actually about.
This trend is really consistent on the right wing.
Like, think about how all the anti-lockdown protests that happened over the last few years were really more or less just radicalization points for anti-vaxxers to spread their ideology.
The far right has an internal awareness that their ideas are things that most people hate, so they need to Trojan horse them to people.
Presenting your ideas as they actually exist is a sure path to rejection.
So you use universally approved concepts like free speech as a mask that your actual ideology hides behind.
Conservative women, even, and you try and tell them this.
Like, hey, you know, sweetheart, I know you feel really passionate about this because you want to get the attention of some Chad college Republican in the frat party.
But if you really want to save the country, if you want to fulfill your moral obligation to your country and people, you should be getting married and having 10 or 15 children.
And you will be, by the way, and no, that is no small order either.
You will be the backbone of the country, of the revolution, as a good mother.
But they all want to fight you on this.
Everyone wants to fight you on this and say that's sexist, that's misogynistic.
That's what Nick is hearkening to with this message, and it's pretty clear.
He goes on to talk a bit more about this later, too, just like really strongly about his feelings about like, you need to have seven children, and then they will, then that's seven children who will also give birth to seven children that are all conservative.
I mean, because how many people do we know who have conservative parents who are quite liberal?
You know, there's no guarantee that just because you, even if you have a tightly controlled family system, that doesn't make it any more likely that your children are going to end up having your exact same ideology.
And that's why it would be nice if everybody understood that when you try and implement the things that these right-wing people think will happen, we get crazy, weird, unintended consequences that nobody understood or expected to happen.
Like, for instance, I don't know, say the COVID response being letter fucking rip from half of our goddamn country.
There's a lot of things that are unintended because they have terrible ideas.
And for everyone that doubts me on this, for people like my mom who doubt me on this, who think I'm some sort of racist bigot because I want my people to stay alive, mom, you step in here.
You think that's all fine and well, we just need to have an open press.
Do me a favor right now.
If you're watching the show on YouTube, click on the top right, open a new tab in this window.
Open a new tab, go into Google, and I want you to Google for me American inventors.
If you don't believe me, if you think I'm peddling, if you think I'm peddling fiction, as Barack Obama says, if you think I'm making this up, if you think I'm some white supremacist, some conspiracy.
I have no idea what list he's looking at, but I decided to play along with him.
And according to my Google results, I don't know if they've changed since 2017 or whatever, but the first names that come up are Thomas Edison, Samuel Morse, Robert Fulton, and Alexander Graham Bell, all white dudes.
And then you have George Washington Carver.
I don't know what list he's looking at, so I can't really respond to it specifically, but it seems like bullshit.
A larger issue is his blanket disregard and disrespect for black inventors.
He doesn't know who any of these people are, which makes the opposite argument than what I think Nick is intending.
No one knows about these people, but what did they invent?
Garrett Morgan invented the traffic light and a smoke hood, which allowed firefighters to withstand smoke exposure and still be able to breathe.
Lewis Latimer worked for Edison and actually holds the patent for electric lamps.
He also invented one of the early forms of air conditioning.
Elijah McCoy invented the automatic lubricator for steam engines, essentially revolutionizing railroad travel, both in terms of civilian use as well as for commercial purposes.
Madam Walker is remembered as the first female self-made millionaire in U.S. history and developed hair care systems for black women.
Lonnie Johnson invented the Super Soaker, one of the best-selling toys of all time, and has worked developing tech while working at NASA as an engineer on spaceships.
Granville Woods invented automatic brakes, the steam boiler furnace, and a raft of other railroad-related things.
He is often called the Black Edison, but I guess Nick hasn't heard of him.
Patricia Bath invented things that improved cataract surgeries.
Jan Ernst invented the lasting machine, which allowed for greater and easier production of shoes, which previous to that was a severely complicated process that had to be done by hand.
Sure.
And it basically allowed for, I mean, all sorts of development of footwear.
And it's going to be a showdown in the Pacific, ultimately, between the two great powers, emerging great powers, which are China and the United States.
Yet to be seen how that one will resolve.
This is the first test, I think, in a much broader, more long-term sense for the U.S. and China's relationship going forward, how that power dynamic will work in a world order in the 21st century.
It's a lot of people for me to lay low and infiltrate without going full red pill only because you really can't make the argument without the truth.
And in order to lay low, you can't tell the truth.
So you argue with people about immigration, and at a certain point, you can't argue about culture, right?
At a certain point, it becomes very difficult to say, well, we don't want immigration because of downward pressure on low-wage work, low-skilled work, and their wages.
It gets very difficult at a certain point to not make the whole case, not make the full case with everything we know with the truth that you can't talk about.
So I don't know.
I'm feeling it out.
I think it's a lot of improvisation.
I don't think the long-term grand plan, I don't think that's really feasible.
I don't think that's viable, but I'm trying to feel it out.
And what I'm really trying to do, I think, is ultimately we're going to have to take the red pill.
Ultimately, that will happen.
I'm just trying to, I think, take as many people with me as possible as I go.
So, I mean, I feel like that clip should be played for the American public like constantly, just non-stop, followed by me saying, a teenager figured it out, you idiots.
Navikat asks, Nick, do you think it is wise to go full white nationalism rather than to take it slowly?
Infiltrate the system from within and then promote nationalism when you actually have power.
No, I think it's ill-advised.
And I say that with experience.
I'll tell you a little anecdote.
If you guys weren't here last week, when I went to the job training in D.C., I went to a job training to work for a do tank, a certain dew tank, a think tank.
And I was in the job training for it.
And I was disqualified on my first day.
Disqualified on my first day.
It was like a two-week job training to be a field representative.
Pretty benign, pretty simple position.
And this was a think tank that's pretty much like an umbrella group.
It's a big tent group where they have a lot of people in there.
I know people in there that agree with me on a lot of things.
I know people that agree with me on a lot of things.
It's a big tent group.
Have people, libertarians, conservatives, paleocons, all kinds of people.
Now, I go there to get the job to be a field representative in Wisconsin, and I was disqualified on day one by this dopey girl named Ivy from Lebanon because I said I wanted to protect my people, because I was against immigration.
Now, immigration is a conservative issue.
To be against illegal and to some extent legal immigration, that's the policy of our president.
And yet I get disqualified from even getting an entry-level job at this conservative Big Ten think tank because I said I was against immigration because I wanted to protect my people.
And you realize two things.
Number one, it's very difficult to hide.
You have to basically go completely dark, completely normie.
And at that point, I think you're doing a lot of harm rather than good.
At the same time, you think you're getting big.
You think you're infiltrating.
You think you're growing your base, you're growing independent.
But the minute that you go a little bit further to the right, the minute that you go off your script, the minute that you go away from what your character that they built you up to be, you lose everything.
You lose your money.
You lose your funding.
You lose your connections.
You lose a lot of your audience.
Like, imagine, for example, imagine if Bill O'Reilly, if he was still on television and he said, I don't know, some kind of white nationalist talking point.
He would be fired.
He would be fired and a lot of people would stop watching him and following him.
And he would stop making money and they would make sure he never had a voice.
He would be blacklisted.
He would be, they would smear his name, run his name through the mud everywhere, and he would be, he'd be like the new David Duke, right?
If you're doing it from the beginning as sort of controversial, as sort of, you know, on the fringe and not totally fitting in the mainstream, that's expected and it grows a little bit more organically.
It's not that much of a shock.
You build your own connections.
You build your own infrastructure.
Beyond that, I think the time is right.
I think the time is right.
The money is there.
The support is there.
The infrastructure is there where we can really give it a shot.
And I'm definitely not a white nationalist because if you're a white nationalist, that's the same thing as a white supremacist.
I think, though, that some of that, some of the ability to articulate some of this stuff and somehow it not be like completely destructive to his ability to exist in any kind of a space.
I think it does speak to a certain amount of savvy on his part.
I do think that he, and that's one of the reasons why I think that he is not like these other people that some of these folks are kind of boring in the sense that they do appear to be out to scam.
Like Tim Poole, I don't think he has any kind of moral center or any ideological absolutely not.
He's doing things that are advantageous and expedient for him to get the most views on Billboard in front of him.
In the same way, that's what he's doing, only he doesn't understand that second part of being beholden to his listeners, to his followers, which I think is where he's starting to get now.
Because from what I've heard, he's starting to get pushback from the whole incel people for being, I don't know, someone who has occasionally thought about sex or not.
I've seen a number of things on Twitter, and I think a lot of people fall for maybe jokes and stuff.
Sure.
He is a figure that you have to take kind of carefully in terms of like you kind of just have to ignore some stuff and be like, all right, whatever, man.
Okay.
Because there is more important things that are being said that maybe aren't as flamboyant or as up, you know, in the same way that I don't spend a whole lot of time concerning myself with Alex talking about gay frogs and shit.
You know, there are other things like in the instance of Nick, this just clear understanding of like a way to launder white nationalism into other spaces.
Navikat asks, Nick, do you think it is wise to go full white nationalism rather than to take it slowly, infiltrate the system from within and then promote nationalism when you actually have power?
And his story that he tells is about himself going to try to get this entry-level position at a think tank where he says that he told this woman from Lebanon that he doesn't like immigration because he's trying to protect his people.
That's my understanding of the story is that he was like, there's no point in even pretending to say that you're not a white nationalist because even when I tried, I'm so white nationalist.
When I thought I was fucking watering it down, it was still overflowing with white nationalism.
And even when you do this, if you succeed within this to bring about some kind of clout or notoriety to yourself, you have the potential for that to be taken away from you once you stray too far from the acceptable path.
So the way to do it is to be upfront about a lot of stuff, be a complete fucking weirdo.
No, but I think that's exactly what is also concerning about only being beholden to your own audience in the same way that Alex was after, you know, after he was kicked off of everything is that like, also, there is no stopping it.
Only the audience can stop him at this point because nobody else can affect his audience.
And, you know, with so many of these folks, the audience also includes like, I don't know, billionaire donors who will send you 8 million in crypto.
Exactly.
That is also an element of this that is a confounding factor of the beholdenness to interestingly on this episode, coincidentally, Nick gets a question about Milo.
I liked him for a long time because I thought he was funny and because you see him like causing happenings and it's cool and it's cool to see Antifa get mad and he makes people mad and I like that.
But he brags about the things he does, some of the more hedonistic alternative things he does and it's very off-putting.
You know, Milo, he may bring people into the movement, which he does, and God bless him for that.
And he may be sharing a message which is a little bit alternative.
And, you know, he does give a fair hearing to certain people on the fringe far right.
But I think it is not wise to hold up someone who lives a lifestyle like that as your main guy.
And there's a lot of things that go into it.
It's not just that he's gay, but he brags about things I can't even talk about on the show because they're so vulgar and other forms of degeneracy.
When the people are ready to receive the red pill, I will go full red pill.
But you have to sort of go with the tempo of time.
I mean, we can't really, we can only set the tempo so much.
We have to work with what's happening in the country.
And, you know, I think the time is definitely right in Europe.
You know, the time is right in the United Kingdom, in Germany, in Poland, in Italy.
When you see the European Union that's suing Italy to take in more migrants, like certain things become definitely more viable for your everyday person.
Whereas in America, where people aren't seeing it, where you have 300 million people and you're not seeing the same kind of culture shock that you are in Europe, I don't think people are as susceptible to that sort of far, far-right message.
So you may have your extremely far-right progenitors of ideas and culture and propaganda, but you have to have people that can sort of be palatable to the mainstream to focus those ideas to make them viable on a mass market scale, to make them appealing for the mass market.
And that's the nature of politics.
I'm sorry, but it's not 1917, okay?
We can't be the Bolsheviks and take over the Capitol. by accident basically with a few thousand people.
Well, but there's also a strategic purpose to the lying, and that is to be somebody who is a little bit more palatable that is getting those seeds out there of this stuff.
And I mean, quite honestly, whether consciously or not, that is also like a fair description of what Tim Poole does.
No, I mean, like, I think that Nick is obviously far more aware and self-actualized about this.
But, you know, it is a description of a lot of people within that sphere of media figures.
And I think that that is also a part of, you know, what makes it kind of disconcerting that he's here with Yay and Milo in this bizarre trio of folks who are pushing anti-Semitism.
It's like, you know, he's only learned more since this point when he was 18.
And it's not like he's expressing some strategy that he decided, I shouldn't pursue this.
This is essentially like, you can see the footprints of this moving forward through his career.
And that makes it, you know, something that I do think that I feel like we should cover more of.
And I think we will.
I think we'll cover some more of this because until this plays its natural course, I do see this trio of weirdos as something that it does not deserve superficial sort of mocking or superficial analysis.
I think it is something that points to a big problem.
And I think that we can look at it and deconstruct stuff as best we can with the tools at our disposal.
But we are still going to talk about Alex and shit.