In Knowledge Fight #259, Dan Friesen and Jordan Holmes dissect Alex Jones’ January 27–29, 2019 broadcasts, where he dismissed Roger Stone’s indictment as trivial while blaming "globalists" for Trump’s legal woes—despite conflating Democrats with Bush family ties. Jones falsely linked vaccines to brain-altering viruses, scapegoated immigrants for disease outbreaks, and revived debunked claims like HAARP’s earthquake weapons, citing misquoted officials like William Cohen (1997) and discredited figures like General Stubblebein. His pivot away from Trump, highlighted by a 2019 ALIPAC critic’s rejection of Trump’s failures, signals a strategic shift amid funding crises, though his audience’s perception remains tied to past conspiracy narratives. Jones’ temporary show reduction and promotion of KnowledgeFight.com underscore his desperate rebranding efforts. [Automatically generated summary]
Like, I think a lot of people have a real, like, even if you watch a movie at home, it still sort of triggers the same parts of your brain where it's like you're going into the movie theater.
You're a kid.
You don't understand.
There's a projectionist getting paid $4 an hour up there who's probably high.
It actually makes you mad because the period that I lived through in movie theaters, too, was the time when it was transitioning from actual film to digital.
And so what they did was essentially get rid of an entire job.
You know, you get rid of projectionists who are experts in dealing with this film and threading it through projectors and troubleshooting problems.
And then all of a sudden, all you have to do is hit a button.
And so I even have that resentment inside me when I think about movies.
But there is a projectionists union, but generally speaking, those are people who work in different sort of, like not, they generally aren't at commercial movie theaters.
So they'll be the people who are like the projectionists for IMAX theaters and stuff like that.
Like much more specialized projectors and things like that.
And we sort of flirted with the idea of trying to get into that union and just it never got off the ground.
My excuse is that they take up so much time, but then here I am sitting here listening to fucking countless hours of this dickhole Alex Jones screaming.
But if you watch a movie, you don't learn that much.
But from what I've done, I know a lot about Alex Jones.
Guys, if you're out there, folks, listening, you want to support the show, you like what we do, you can do that by going to our website, knowledgefight.com, clicking that button, says support the show, and we'd appreciate it.
And we saw on the day that Alex discovered that Roger Stone had been indicted, a pretty standard response from him in terms of pretty low-key, just like, as bullshit, kind of thing.
As we covered on our Monday episode of this week, his response to it immediately was that, and then sort of got fucking weird by the end of the show and was rambling about God.
Now, I don't know if these are actual murders or anything, or he's just making this up or trying to conflate things.
I don't know.
I don't really care.
I mean, I care on some level, but in terms of tracing this down, I don't care about us covering it necessarily outside of just saying that, oh, that's a clear demonstration of Alex being like, hey, people I politically disagree with are getting murdered, and I'm fucking pumped about it.
So in this, Alex is citing a Breitbart article that's really just a collection of screenshotted tweets from people reacting to an article in BuzzFeed about the possibility of Pelosi becoming president.
Even the article that Alex is talking about, and every right-thinking person doesn't really think that Washington politicians have much interest in an impeachment trial, especially one of Pence, when 2020 is fast approaching.
It's not like they can't be tried when they're out of office.
It's not like there's a deadline on it.
There's crimes.
Also, according to the 25th Amendment, it is true that Pelosi would become president if Trump and Pence were kicked out of office or resigned at the same time.
But odds are that would never happen.
If they're both convicted of impeachment at the same time, that's one possibility.
But there's no chance that those trials could be carried out before the 2020 election.
There's also zero chance that they would ever resign at the same time for this reason.
If Trump resigns, Pence becomes president.
But Pelosi doesn't become vice president.
Pence appoints his new vice president, who then enters the presidential succession grid right at the top.
If they were going to both resign, they would stagger it.
So Pence's new VP would then ascend to the presidency, thus being able to pardon both of them.
There's zero gain in resigning simultaneously, and they would never, ever do it.
Sure, the new president gets to appoint their vice president, but here's the rub: that person has to be approved by majority votes in both houses of Congress.
You're never going to get Vice President Hillary Clinton through the Senate.
And I would be shocked if it was even an easy path through the House, quite frankly.
This just isn't possible as a real-world scenario.
Alex just doesn't understand civics, and he's trying to bring up his old favorite enemy to make her relevant again.
Because I think that Alex Jones is starting to miss the days of yore.
Unelected God Emperor, who himself helped cover up the crimes of the Clintons and others with the Russians and other foreign governments, and who himself helped deliver uranium to the Russians on the Stockholm Sweet.
And who himself first made his bones using Whitey Bulger as a hitman in Boston, and who then went on to just be the absolute mafia teeth of the white shoeboy, Robert Mueller.
I don't really care about his complaints about Mueller because they all seem to sort of rotate and gravitate around the idea that he gave the Russians uranium on the tarmac, and that's such hot bullshit.
Yep.
So, like, I hear that, and all I hear is Alex starting to be like, fucking Trump, you're not doing it.
You're not doing it.
And it's interesting.
It's interesting to hear that.
I know we've heard sort of similar things in the past, but I wonder if that's going to develop.
But every single time he associates someone with the globalists, it's almost a one-to-one parallel with people who are sort of more on the liberal side.
And in this clip, he just basically says that every Republican who is part of the globalists are secretly Democrats.
I know the audience knows this, but we have to get this out of the president and everybody else.
The president's like, I just want to turn the economy back on, secure the border, increase the defense budget, but not the Middle East, but have superior weapons, strength your peace, makes sense.
All these things that are classic John Wayne Americana that anybody that's pro-America should be for.
I mean, yeah, it's got a little bit of fascist icing to it.
It's not the communism and the globalism they're trying to get.
Like the people who are his spiritual predecessors, they would be fine with Americana fascism as opposed to the communist menace that they've built up because American fascism would still be a ruthless capitalist system.
The difference is you haven't spent three years every day deflecting every criticism of Obama.
Then once your best friend, who used to be Obama's chief advisor for 20 fucking years, gets indicted, you start saying, you know what, Obama was real fucked up with the drones.
For me, it's the hypocrisy that you've done nothing wrong, and these people are up with their eyeballs trying to overthrow an election, and then Trump sits there and doesn't do anything about it, Roger.
All I can do is do exactly what we've already said he's going to do, which is use Alex and his audience for money, which they get to in this next clip.
Because if we all just say, hey, stone defensefund.com, and I say, hey, folks, buy some products for your support.
If people don't support you and understand that you're a lynchpin to their whole system and that they're trying to break your will to make you bear false witness, if people don't back you, then they're backing the globalist.
So stonefensefund.com, if they don't go to infowarstore.com and get great products and great films and great books and great supplements and things they need, then the globalists will be able to shut us down.
It's been a beautiful thing that we've withstood this long, but it shows that there aren't many men out there that were willing to actually stand up and put a fight up against Hillary.
We're being punished for Hillary being defeated.
We're being punished for being loyal Americans and helping kickstart the heart of America with a defibrillator.
And we've done that.
And the globalists are trying to put the genie back in the bottle.
And a frustration with Roger not defending or just defending himself as opposed to going on the attack, although his version of going on the attack is just doing exactly what they've been doing all the time.
And I knew something was up as soon as we jump into the episode and he gets back to trying to cover the topics, trying to cover issues that are important to him.
There's so many things bouncing around in my head before I go live that I haven't really decided what I was going to cover first.
But I thought before I got here today, I said, you know what?
I'm going to print up some autism statistics and I'm going to print up some numbers about how they've gone from five vaccines to over 100 they want you to take.
And I'm going to get into the fact that it's third world populations coming in that are spreading disease in this country.
And then they point at anti-vaxxers.
Even though if you do the research, it's not anti-vaxxers that are spreading.
So this thing that he's saying, he's so full of shit trying to blame immigrants for disease outbreaks.
This is quite literally just white nationalist propaganda.
And it's a narrative that's been used since time immemorial to demonize non-white populations as dangerous.
From a recent article in NBC News, quote, there's no evidence to show that migrants are spreading disease, said Dr. Paul Spiegel, who directs the Center for Humanitarian Health at Johns Hopkins School of Public Health.
Quote, that is a false argument that's used to keep migrants out.
The article goes on to discuss the tragic irony that the right wing attacks immigrants over health issues when the reality is that our healthcare system deeply relies on immigrants to run.
As a recent study published in the Journal of the American Medical Association points out, quote, 16% of healthcare workers in the U.S. were born somewhere else, including 29% of physicians, 16% of registered nurses, 20% of pharmacists, 24% of dentists, and 23% of nursing, psychiatric, and home health care aides.
Yep, that checks out.
This type of demonizing rhetoric is an essential piece of establishing an authoritarian system.
The scapegoating of the other is key.
And it's crucial that the argument be made that your brutality and your cruelty are being done as defensive measures.
The Nazis created tons of propaganda about Jews being lice who spread typhus, which was something they were trying to protect the German people from.
Even prior to that, Jews were consistently and baselessly blamed for spreading the bubonic plague.
But even outside of authoritarian concerns, there's a serious trend in Western history to blame disease on something external, as if somehow admitting that we're all susceptible to illness would be admitting weakness or sin.
In the 1830s, Irish immigrants were scapegoated for causing cholera outbreaks.
During the Renaissance period, the British called syphilis the French disease, although the French thought it was the Italians' fault, and the Italians pointed the finger at the French.
Bigotries are confirmed by blaming others in this way.
And that's been done countless times throughout our history, from African Americans and syphilis to the homosexual community and HIV and AIDS.
This mentality at best is useless and a deterrent to progress, and at worst, is a tool employed by authoritarian rulers to define in-groups and out-groups and make certain that the in-group has a built-in fear of the out-group.
At the same time, you're demonizing immigrants for spreading disease, you're spreading anti-vaxxer bullshit, which by your own, you know, you're only hurting the people that you think are immune from disease by virtue of white.
A Milbank quarterly paper from 2002 discusses the quote persistent association of immigrants and disease in American society, and it features the headline, The Foreignness of Germs, which Alex likes headlines, so I just wanted to throw that out there.
That's nice.
They studied the period from the late 1800s to the present day and found, quote, anti-immigrant rhetoric and policy have often been framed by an explicitly medical language, one in which the line between perceived and actual threat is slippery and prone to hysteria and hyperbole.
They found that throughout our country's wonderful history, quote, policymakers have employed strikingly protein medical labels of exclusion, end quote, in order to use exaggerated medical concerns to exclude the people that they deemed objectionable.
This is the driving force behind this rhetoric and explains why the rhetoric persists, even long after improved health care all but eliminates the need to be concerned about the underlying diseases.
It's all a function of nativist tendencies towards exclusion.
Now, in the real world, the Journal of the American Medical Association has done a very series of very in-depth studies about the connection between willful non-vaccination and outbreaks of vaccine-preventable diseases.
In one instance, they discussed 12 recent outbreaks of pertussis, for which they had access to detailed vaccination records for people involved in nine of the outbreaks.
In eight out of the nine outbreaks they had information about the incidence of intentionally unvaccinated individuals was never lower than 59% and in cases was as high as 93%.
And another, they discussed findings from 18 measles outbreaks, where they found that of the cases they had vaccination records for, 70.6% of individuals involved had non-medical exemptions to vaccination, which is what Alex promotes.
Put very simply, what they found by tracing the epidemiology of transmission was that, quote, children with vaccine exemptions have a substantially greater risk for acquiring measles than fully vaccinated children.
In one study, the risk was 35 times that of the vaccinated population.
And, quote, higher rates of vaccination exemption in a community are associated with greater measles incidences in that community.
They found literally the same thing about pertussis.
In another peer-reviewed study published in the Public Library of Science Journal, they examined the areas of high rates of non-medical exemptions to vaccination.
Part of their findings involved discussion of the 2014 measles outbreak that originated at Disneyland, which led to 111 cases of the disease, and how Oakland, California is suspiciously a city with a high rate of non-medical exemptions to vaccination.
There are trends that you can track, and people have done it, and they found that places with higher incidence of these non-medical exemptions always have more incidences of these preventable diseases.
It's nonsense.
There are definitely tons of studies that back this up, although there is no data to suggest that immigrants who are coming into the country are infecting people.
That is purely white nationalist nativist propaganda that Alex Jones is putting out into the world.
I think it has so much to do, again, with movies and shit like that.
Because the movie narrative of those infectious diseases is always, you know, somebody got on a plane from blah, and then they showed up in your town and they just started spreading it around.
So, yeah, you say, oh, sure, 60% of non-vaccinated children are 60% of the people who are hit by this measles outbreak are non-vaccinated children, but they wouldn't have been hit by that measles outbreak if patient zero wasn't blah from blah.
The other ones, not the Journal of American Medicine one, but those ones that were looking into history, the idea of the foreignness of germs, there is an obsession on our part to deem something external as giving things to us.
And I think part of that is based in some sort of religious tradition where there's the idea that illness means that you did something bad and God is punishing you.
I think that there is some vestigial part of our brains that that's screwed up that still affects some people that makes them think that in the same way as so many dumb people think that poverty means you're bad.
The same thing here with illness means you're bad.
He's not really talking about them vis-a-vis Trump.
He's talking about them in reference to his globalist enemies, not defending Trump by attacking them, attacking them for the sake of attacking them because they're giving you dirty vaccines.
Because both of them are speaking out of the room of all the incredible stuff going on around the world.
Iran on the edge of war with Israel, what's happening in Venezuela, what's Soros saying, get ready for China to collapse, which I agree with, but that's like Soros is jumping on the bandwagon.
A lot of listeners love the show, but they also say, Alex, we want you to get back to secret society some and the globalist and the esoteric and weather modification because the last three years it's been all Trump all the time.
Now Roger isn't in his ear every step of the way, or at the very least, he's not listening to Roger as much about what narratives he should or should not cover.
But I didn't think, and I believe that by the end of that episode that we did, I still was like, I don't think that he's going to stick to this.
I'm listening to this, and I think he's done.
You think this is the Trump?
This is the soft beginning of him getting off the Trump bandwagon.
Because listen to this next clip.
He's starting to realize that if they go down, he's going to go down unless something changes.
He realizes that his identity is intertwined with Roger Stone and Donald Trump.
And that is not a good position to be in right now because I think by Monday, he's read the fucking indictment and he realizes, uh-oh, Roger Stone is going to prison.
So in this next clip, he tries to disentangle himself, and it's very pathetic.
Because, you know, I've been trying to weigh all the good things that Trump has done versus the bad things that Trump has done.
Because Trump really is seen by the globalist as a mandate or a figurehead of nationalism and populism and capitalism reinsurgence.
And if Trump can be destroyed, if Trump can be discredited, they believe that will start the process of retaking all these other countries that they've been controlling and putting into poverty and exploiting.
So it's important to defend Trump when he's doing the right thing.
It's important to keep his feet to the fire when he's not.
But there is the fact that letting everything be about Trump makes it to where if they are able to destroy him or cripple him, then somehow it cripples us.
And my identity is not President Trump.
My identity is not Roger Stone.
Because I support Roger.
I know he's being railroaded.
I support President Trump.
I think he's doing a great job overall.
Get frustrated with him.
But at the same time, my destiny is not bound to Trump, and it's not bound to Roger Stone.
Wayne Madsen, the guy who brought us the Call Larry Nichols story, won't talk to Alex anymore because of the same concerns, because of his support of Trump.
He's lost employees.
Jakari Jackson apparently left over the trend there.
Some of his long-term employees didn't like the direction of him getting into Trump, and they left.
Like Leanne McAdoo doesn't seem to be interested in this bullshit anymore.
Like, he's lost everything by following Roger Stone's advice to the point he's at.
And now he realizes, where am I?
What have I given up everything for?
I got David Knight and Owen fucking Schroyer hanging around.
We launched the global nationalist movement and the belief that globalism would become so obviously oppressive and authoritarian that we should promote its nationalistic counterpart to it.
I mean, the only other way to do it would be to betray all of the principles that you've already betrayed, revealing that you actually believed the principles that you betrayed for Trump and Stone.
And he's still going to have to do a controlled burn, but I think you get away a lot easier when you're like, oh, no, we were the real thing all along, and Trump, you know, he's doing the same thing he did with the Tea Party.
And that's exactly where we got the idea that he might do this from.
But, you know, in this next clip, Alex says that he doesn't think that Trump is going down, but the way he's saying it makes me think that he thinks Trump is going down.
And so my statement now that this isn't all about Trump is not because I think he's about to be brought down for sure.
It's so that people understand that if Trump is destroyed, it should not be a demoralizing effect because we're on the march and the globalists are on the run.
He turned on Coursey because he thought that was a way that he could maintain Roger and everything.
But then once Roger got in trouble, it's like, fuck it.
I got to change everything.
So I don't know.
We'll see.
Think that he'll maintain all the shithead positions that he has in defense of Trump, but they'll no longer be used in service of defending Trump.
So, all the white nationalism, all the anti-immigrant stuff, all of the transphobia, all that shit, that will all still be there, but it'll be attacking the globalists as opposed to, you know, this is what Trump is fighting against.
It's not just pathogens or attenuized viruses or dead bacteria that your body then learns how to fight.
That's a known technology.
No one's debating that it exists and has some attributes.
It's the whole precedent, setting the precedent to put things into your body that change the very chemistry of not just your autoimmune system, but your brain and your organs itself.
And now the big push on every major channel is arrest people that don't vaccinate.
And they're claiming that there are increased pathogenic diseases and illnesses like measles and areas because of anti-vaccine.
When the studies don't really show that, it's the illegal alien influxes.
But the push that people are making is not so much about arresting people who are anti-vaccination.
I believe the conversations are more about, you know, charging people with malpractice who advocate for not vaccinating children who then end up like the kid gets measles or, you know, God forbid, some other condition that's worse.
Like, so very often in the development of medications, like in the research and trial phases, scientists find dual uses for what they're developing.
One big example of that is when they were developing the Zika vaccine, researchers found that the vaccine they were working on also showed a bunch of promise in the treatment of glioblastoma, a deadly brain cancer.
And so they started to pursue the possibility that this vaccine could be used to fight brain cancer.
I'm not a scientist.
I don't really know if I can speak to a lot of the in-depth in the weeds aspects of that.
But from everything I've been able to look into, I think that that's what Alex is misrepresenting.
The idea that some vaccines end up having dual purpose.
It's kind of like subconsciously he's saying he subconsciously wants to quit, because subconsciously he kind of wants to quit and subconsciously still further, he thinks he's already done well, he wants to quit.
Talking about Trump all the time, for sure right, and I think that we've felt that for quite a while.
We felt like an almost fatalistic element of his, his performance over the last months, like it, just like he doesn't seem to want to do it, and so if you take what he's saying there literally, it is kind of a.
I don't want to do the show i've been doing yeah, but i'm more than willing to do a show where I talk about vaccines for a fucking two hours uh, because he spoiler alert he pivots the narrative at hour two uh, but still talks about vaccines right, but in a different way.
Maybe could shave that stupid beard and uh, like really be alive again, really feel like he's fighting these fake enemies that he's got yeah, as opposed to just playing defense for a dick that doesn't probably even talk to him anymore oh, absolutely doesn't talk so that that is probably like a leftover feeling that he has from the last months, the idea of like, I don't want to do this show anymore.
Like, maybe subconsciously, I haven't been super into it because I wake up every morning and i've got a lie for the president yeah, and the president's friend and i'm no, Sarah Huckabee Sanders no, I can't pull that shit off not getting paid that much.
If he is listening to our show, then maybe he's just heard your intro to every present day episode we've done for the past three months where you're like I didn't want to do this, this is really boring.
Then he said earlier, you finally wore him down dan, maybe when he said earlier that like, a lot of listeners want me to go back, maybe he's just talking about could be, could be um, so the vaccines, you know they're evil uh, and they have.
There's a plan in play right, there's a plan, and you might think that the plan is just get you sick with these various things.
They're going to shoot in you.
But no no, no.
The plan that the globalists have is much deeper and in this next clip it's 40 seconds long and Alex bats for the bigotry cycle.
It's cool, But don't worry, they'll have runs for life and runs for autism.
And, you know, you'll go run a 10K and donate money.
And then as they build giant autism centers all over the country, and we just get used to half of our boys not being able to talk.
That's the soft kill.
But boys are bad.
Boys start wars.
So if you can't get them to cut their genitals off or can't get them to take hormone blockers, can't get them to wear a dress, you just abort them or you kill them.
Robert Mueller and Rod Rosenstein do not take vaccines.
And believe me, those two-star generals, they don't take them either.
But you know what?
Your son or daughter in the military does.
You know what?
They're going to try to force your kid to because they like to walk around and see your lower IQ and know all those cancer viruses have been implanted in you.
That soft kill.
And that's Rod Rosenstein.
When he walks into Congress smiling like a little demon, he's like, have I stunned him enough?
Like a spider.
Have I stunned my enemy enough for them to not be able to get me?
He's like, ha, ha, ha, ha, all dead.
That's why he's always smiling like that, looking side to side, because he's like a snake slippery in.
Do you see what's going on, the subtle difference in that clip?
As opposed to it being using his narratives that he has built up over the years to help defend Trump, he's using this investigation of Trump to inform and enforce his vaccine narrative.
Right.
It's taking the path, it's the same street, but going the opposite direction down it, which is, I think, important.
And I know it's a fine point, but I think it's important when considered in the larger context of the things that he's saying and the slight but important variations of his narratives and language.
I think it's something that would be very easy to miss if you didn't spend all of your time studying Alex Jones, which I accept and understand is my bad.
Have liability protection unless it's being done fraudulently, and then the liability protection and the sovereign immunity is stripped.
So, the sovereign immunity of the U.S. government is saying we're going to make you go to a secret court that you've got to go through for years, and then we decide, once you've waived your rights, if you're going to be paid any damages.
Alex is playing super fast and loose here, trying to present the idea that Rod Rosenstein's sister, Dr. Nancy Massonnier, that's probably Massoni or something like that, but it appears to be Franz.
Massonier, that she's in charge of or has anything to do with these vaccine courts.
Alex tried to present that image?
She does not.
In that clip we just heard, Alex is just reading a tweet posted by Wayne Allen Root, which links to a CDC website about the Vaccines for Children program, which is a part of the CDC's mission to provide free vaccines for children in low-income families.
This page in no way proves that Rosenstein's sister is in charge of this program, although maybe she is involved.
It's entirely possible.
But, however, it's important to point out that the Vaccines for Children program has literally nothing to do with the vaccine court.
Also, fun fact, Wayne Allen Root is a con man who wrote a book in 1989 about how to make money betting on sports and followed it up with books in 2004 and 2008 about how to win money and all sorts of gambling.
After Obama was elected, he took his griff to the political world and started writing about how Obama wasn't a citizen, didn't go to Columbia, and was a secret Marxist Muslim.
He's since endorsed every horseshit conspiracy from the Seth Rich bullshit to the Nazis at Charlottesville being paid actors and all that stuff.
He also recently claimed that Mueller's investigation into Trump is only happening because Mueller has a small dick and he's jealous of Trump's very large dick.
So what Alex is reading off of here in his whole information is this Wayne Allen Root tweet that links to the CDC page for the Vaccines for Children program, which isn't the vaccine court issue at all.
So Dr. Massonier is the director for the National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases, which is a branch of the Centers for Disease Control.
In her time there, she's provided support and leadership towards a lot of initiatives to take care of preventable diseases in the third world and has recently been on the forefront of working on the rising incidence of acute flaccid myelitis or ATF, the condition that's similar to polio but isn't polio, that Alex claims with no evidence is secretly polio and is being given to you by vaccines.
The vaccine court that Alex is talking about, or the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program, was created under the umbrella of the Department of Health and Human Services, the same department that contains the CDC, but isn't run by the CDC.
Government departments are often pretty rangy in terms of their operations.
And just because two things are in the same department and both have to do with vaccines, doesn't mean they're run by the same people.
I can find zero evidence that Dr. Massonier's involvement in the vaccine court is real.
And even if she were involved, I can find zero reason to care.
As we've discussed already, the vaccine courts were not established to be a secret way to sweep dangers of vaccines under the rug and hide them from public scrutiny.
They were set up to be better equipped to help the subset of people who do unfortunately suffer from the potential side effects of very important medicines.
They did this.
They made it simpler for them to get payments for these side effects that they suffer from because these families did deserve some consideration and payout, but they'd never be able to get them in a real courtroom.
To a certain extent, side effects are inevitable in pretty much every medication imaginable.
Human biology is infinitely complex, so the prospect of ever releasing a perfectly safe, no-risk medicine is impossible.
A study in 2017 showed that taking an aspirin daily was linked to more than 3,000 deaths a year, mostly due to the blood-thinning side effect.
This is the case for a whole bunch of medications, but they serve important purposes.
In the case of aspirin, dramatically reducing the risk of heart attack in older people, so the goal is to mitigate the risk of the side effect while preserving the benefit of the main purpose of the medication.
This is how sane people look at vaccines.
No one is saying that they're completely safe, just that the incidence of side effects are not commensurate with the benefit of us not having to deal with extinction-level threats from preventable diseases anymore.
So they realized it's inevitable that, of course, this is going to happen.
These people do deserve some sort of compensation for it.
So there's either we can completely abandon them to the court system where they will get nothing, or we can discontinue these drugs, which will lead to infinitely more problems, or we could create a special thing where it's like, we get it.
It sucks.
I hate that it happened to you.
I hate that some people get struck by lightning, but we're here to help in some way.
The vaccine court was set up knowing damn well that the people who bring cases to it would never be able to prove that the vaccine in question definitively caused their child's illness or death.
So they've adjusted the standard of evidence required to successfully petition your case.
All the people who bring cases to the vaccine court, all they're required to do is present a theory connecting the vaccine to the consequence, show an appropriate, an approximate timeline that links the two, and show that there's not another plausible biological reason the injury or death happened.
It's a very low standard of proof, and it's intentionally that way because they want to support the people who experience any possible side effects without forcing them to actually prove any scientific causation, which they could never do.
The only other important thing here to point out is that even in this court, where the burden of proof is super low, they don't generally accept cases where petitioners claim that vaccines caused autism in their children and have ruled that the theory that makes a causal connection between vaccines and autism is not proven and not appropriate in their courts.
Even in this world, designed to provide relief to people who have been hurt by vaccines, the argument Alex puts forth doesn't meet their burden of proof, the easy burden of proof.
And Rod Rosenstein's sister has nothing to do with that court.
The court is overseen by nine members of the Advisory Commission on Childhood Vaccines.
Three of those members are from the general public, with the requirement that two be legal parents or guardians of children who have been affected by vaccine side effects.
Last three are health professionals appointed by the Secretary of Health and Human Services who are specifically required not to be previous to being on this advisory board, employees of the U.S. government.
A requirement that Dr. Massonier definitely would fail to achieve.
These are the only voting members of the committee that oversees the vaccine courts, but the director of the National Institutes of Health, the Assistant Secretary of Health and Human Services, the Director of the CDC, and the Commissioner of the FDA are non-voting observational members of the committee.
They can't affect what happens, but they can be a part of the discussion.
Dr. Massonier is none of those things.
Alex is profoundly lazy, super dumb, and reporting this based entirely on a tweet from Wayne Allen Root.
Also, fun fact: if you fit any of the qualifications, like if you're a lawyer who has medical experience, if you're a parent of somebody who has the child has been affected by vaccines, or if you are a healthcare professional who doesn't work for the government, you can apply to be on the advisory commission.
Like you can.
I found the application in two minutes.
It's super easy.
Commissioners serve three-year terms, so there might be a little bit of a wait, but it's super easy for you to do.
And I do notice that the people who complained the most about vaccines never seem to talk about that, and I don't think that they're applying.
But I think they'd probably be rejected based on their views.
They sneak around, they capture you in a web, they come in, they inject you, they liquefy you while you're tortured, then they suck you dry, and they sing a song to you while they do it.
Like anytime a scientist, a spider scientist starts talking about how there's that, oh, because of the rising flood levels, all these spiders create a super web in this tree.
And we've studied the frequency vibrations they make whenever they make a kill and start to eat.
The idea that such a thing exists has been pushed for one explicit reason to imply that other vaccines are dirty and intentionally dirty.
The concept of a clean vaccine was heavily promoted by bot armies traced to Russian operations, according to Reuters, citing a tweet that read, quote, apparently only the elite get clean vaccines.
And what do we normal people get?
The accounts posting both pro and anti-vax messages, such as those talking about clean vaccines, designed to agitate people on both sides of the issue, were run by individuals at the Internet Research Agency, which was indicted by Mueller's investigation in February 2018.
These messages that they were putting out from these bot accounts in order to agitate people on both sides of the vaccine, quote-unquote, debate.
They were during the timeframe that Alex is talking about.
Do you remember when they were talking about clean vaccines?
It's almost certain that it was a result of this bot influence.
Because clean vaccines aren't real.
So an article about vaccines from the vaccine reaction blog, they had a blog post about Mark Zuckerberg getting his kids vaccinated in February 2016 provoked this response from a commenter.
Quote, what did happen to Paul Walker?
The Darknet says he found out critical information about the differences between dirty and clean vaccines.
One of the intrinsic issues we're going to run into here is that Alex intentionally doesn't ever really say what he thinks a clean vaccine actually is.
And it can mean a whole bunch of different things depending on who you ask.
The term clean vaccine was used in 2011 to describe a vaccine that was being studied by researchers at the Biodesign Institute at Arizona State University.
They used that term not to differentiate it from other unclean vaccines, but because they were attempting a new procedure to create this vaccine.
They were trying to use salmonella as a quote cargo ship to deliver the vaccine to the entirety of a person's immune system.
Since Salmonella stimulates a response from the entire body, different systems that other cargo ships wouldn't stimulate.
I mean, it was referred to in an article about this research as a clean vaccine because they had to clean or detoxify the salmonella that was being used in order to achieve the desired results.
I'm not sure where this research ended up or even if it made it through the further testing phases, but it's irrelevant because it's the exact opposite of what Alex is trying to present is what a clean vaccine means.
He's specifically using the term in a way that really only lines up with the idea pushed and promoted by these Russian troll farms, which is probably a sign that Alex doesn't do very deep research into the things he believes.
A lot of these fears trace back to the 1800s when vaccines were new and people were rightfully concerned about them because science hadn't evolved past the level of the late 1800s.
Paid advertisements lombasted vaccines in the newspaper, such as this ad from Nebraska's publication, The Commoner, from 1919.
Quote, what profiteth your babies if the God-made blood is periodically tainted with pus vaccine?
These concerns were legitimate in the late 1800s and early 1900s because many vaccines back then were unsafe and regulating their production was nearly impossible.
So there were way more instances of contamination.
But taking that mentality from about 100 years ago and thinking that you're in the same circumstances now is really fucking stupid.
A 2014 study published by the Yale Journal of Biology and Medicine reviewed articles and ads about vaccination in papers from 1915 to 1922 in an attempt to understand the phenomenon of vaccine skepticism.
Whereas many people believe that the discredited and retracted Wakefield study that linked vaccinations and autism, they believe that that's been responsible for igniting the passions of well-meaning but misguided parents and led them into this new movement against vaccines.
The reality is quite different.
The rhetoric and concerns of the anti-vax crowd in our modern society almost entirely mirrors the concerns expressed by their predecessors in the early 1900s.
The difference is that back then, vaccines were a new idea, and everybody intuitively thought it was dumb to give someone a disease to stop them from getting the same disease.
The authors of that study traced down the big commonalities that characterized vaccine skepticism over the course of the last hundred years and found that in both time periods, in 1915 to 1922 and in the modern time, it boiled down to rhetoric about contamination, distrust, compulsion, the idea of being forced to take a vaccine, and locality, the idea that vaccine skepticism tends to occur in pockets geographically.
All of the ideas that had some merit in the early days of vaccines do not anymore.
And it's fascinating and sad to realize that what motivates anti-vaccination rhetoric and movements in the present day is legitimately just ignorance of the fact that we haven't stayed the same over the last hundred years.
You know, and that reminds me so much of the way that people treat any kind of climate science now.
They're like, oh, oh, so they say that all of this high percentage of scientists agree that climate change is happening.
But you know what?
Back in the 1500s, all the scientists agreed that the Earth was flat or blah, blah, blah, blah.
Like the new head of the EPA is a fucking moron.
But that is discounting the fact that our science is also built on the back of that.
Like everything has been built on the back of that.
The reason that the consensus is we're still aware of that.
Like, yes, medical science 150 years ago was less based upon a good consensus because there was no general standardized research level.
There was no general standardized idea of how it is that things are supposed to go.
And as time has moved on, more and more sophisticated things have made a consensus almost unassailable as opposed to being something that should be suspect.
That is like, it's, but if you read this study in this research paper, it's so depressing to see, like, that, because you like to imagine that it is all just a movement that's popped up because of this discredited autism study that linked vaccinations and shit.
And it's not.
It's not.
It's something that's been going on since vaccinations came around, and it's just an intuitive ignorance that people reinforce with bad science and terrible arguments.
Now, Alex isn't wrong about the idea that diagnoses of children on the autism spectrum have gone up considerably in the past years.
I would guess he's fudging the numbers a little bit, but I don't really care about that necessarily because what's behind his numbers is far more important, and that's the misuse of statistics.
He's arguing that an increase in the number of autism spectrum diagnoses means that more people are on the autism spectrum, but he has literally nothing to prove that other than claim that vaccinations are to blame.
The problem is he can't prove that, and no one has.
Despite a loud chorus of denialists, the evidence is pretty well settled that vaccines have no causal link to the onset of ASD.
It's just not, no one's proved that.
There's a simple explanation for why the rate is going up.
And Dr. Max Witznitzer, a pediatric neurologist, lays it out very clearly.
Quote, we're getting better at identifying under-identified populations.
So it's not as if the numbers are rising.
It's more that Everyone is going to the number that it should be.
One of the things that experts will tell you is that ASD diagnoses until quite recently were overwhelmingly white children.
This was something that puzzled doctors.
So they studied the demographic patterns and found that, quote, ASD prevalence tends to be higher among residents of neighborhoods where higher socioeconomic status is there.
These residents are more likely to have access to quality health care.
The access to quality health care is a large piece of this, as is the racist way some diagnoses can be made.
Behavior that might be treated as a medical condition in a white child until fairly recently would often be deemed delinquency if the same behavior manifested being done by a black child.
Greater awareness of these invisible biases, as well as attempts to provide quality health care for larger numbers of people, has naturally led to better diagnostic processes.
And along the way, that has led to a jump in the number of diagnoses, but not necessarily a jump of the actual people who exist on that spectrum.
Alex is just taking the beginning of one sentence and attaching it to the end of a different sentence in an effort to paraphrase Bertrand Russell's passage from his book, The Impact of Science on Society to Serve His Purposes.
The full quote is, quote, gradually by selective breeding, the congenital differences between rulers and the ruled will increase until they become almost different species.
The revolt of plebes would become as unthinkable as the organized insurrection of sheep against the practice of eating mutton.
This has nothing to do with diets, injections, and injunctions.
Those words are found two paragraphs earlier.
Alex could have just used the earlier sentence, but he wanted that sheep and mutton thing in there, since it's the only part of the quote he actually remembers.
He could have just used the later sentence, but it didn't include the word injections and injunctions, which is really what he wants to talk about here with his vaccination shit.
Thus, he had to combine the two, which is a little bit dishonest.
All this doesn't matter, though, since he's completely twisting Bertrand Russell's words to a point where this should constitute slander.
As we discussed when Alex brought up this passage in Endgame, this book is based on lectures that Bertrand Russell gave in the early 1950s.
And the chapter Alex is pulling quotes from is a discussion of the horrors that could have befallen the world had the Nazis won World War II, or if some similarly evil government were to operate on a purely scientific basis with no regard for citizens' individual rights.
This is explicitly something he does not want to see come to pass.
The context is very, very clear if you actually read the book.
We already covered this in depth, and so there's no real utility in doing it again past just reminding people of that.
But I made a point of drawing attention to this because it's one of so many signs on this episode.
The old Alex is waking up from his Trump coma.
This is him trying to bring endgame shit back.
It's more real than he's in other ways.
It's more real than he's done in other 2018, 2019 episodes that we've looked at, where there's like a flicker of something from the past or whatever.
of the end conclusions of that book the impact of science on society is like well we can probably pull things off if there's a world government that's benevolent but we're not talking about globalist in the like yes bertrand russell was absolutely globalist He was not a globalist with scare quotes on it.
Also, we're seeing these indications that Alex is kind of sick of Roger and Trump and wants to put them aside.
Then Alex says this.
He's trying to make more arguments about vaccines being bad.
And man, we could have done a six-hour episode just going over all the sort of run-of-the-mill anti-vax arguments, but I don't think there's much use in that.
I would much rather talk about things like this that are shining examples of how fucking stupid Alex Jones is and how badly he makes these arguments.
He formulated some of the theories about hand washing in 1846, and Florence Nightingale and Oliver Wendell Holmes did also a few years later, but their ideas were not popular, mostly because doctors felt like they were being blamed for contaminating patients.
And at that time, they believed that water itself was the source of infections and diseases, along with foul odors called miasmos.
It wasn't until Louis Pasteur performed some formal experiments in the mid-1860s that people began to take germ theory a little bit more seriously.
The CDC didn't even exist until 1946, and according to a retrospective published by the World Health Organization, in the United States, actual hand hygiene guidelines weren't even published or enforced until 1981.
Prior to that point, most of the public discussion about hand washing being sanitary was done in soap advertisements, not because they thought it would protect customers, but because they thought it was a fear-based way that they could move more product.
And not just that, but in the medical community, he was one of the first guys to really start applying double-blind studies and actually treat things scientifically.
Like, one of the big things that he did was just like, guys, we're going directly from an autopsy to a childbirthing center.
All of our midwives are not killing these pregnant women, and all of our doctors are killing these pregnant women.
Let's think about this.
And then later, he died of sepsis, the very disease that he was fighting against so much.
Generally speaking, the Industrial Revolution is considered to be the period between 1760 and 1840, and it was a period of rampant disease and death.
One of the reasons for this was that urbanization outpaced advances in sanitation, and outbreaks of things like cholera were super common.
Because of how easy it was for water to be contaminated in these newly urban areas and how people were living in far greater density than they were before, communicable diseases went absolutely nuts.
It's estimated that tuberculosis killed one-third of everyone who died in the United Kingdom between 1800 and 1850 because of the conditions brought on by the Industrial Revolution.
Serious researchers and historians are pretty uniformly behind the idea that industrialization had been a driver towards diminished health conditions.
One of the things that most devastated newly urbanized areas during the Industrial Revolution was smallpox.
It was so contagious and had a history of completely destroying worlds.
Spanish and Portuguese explorers introduced it to the new world, and that pretty much spelled death for the Aztecs and the Inca.
It's a seriously fucked up dangerous disease.
It's said that in the 18th century, 400,000 people died from it every year in Europe, and the fatality rate for children who contacted it was reported at between 80 and 98 percent, depending on what country in Europe they got it in.
Everyone knew that once you got smallpox and survived, you couldn't get it again.
People knew that going back to approximately 430 BCE, but no one really knew how to treat it.
In the early 1600s, a doctor Snideham advocated patients, quote, allow no fire in the room, leave windows permanently open, draw the bedclothes no higher than the patient's waist, and administer 12 bottles of small beer every 12 every 24 hours.
In 1796, a doctor named Edward Jenner decided to start experimenting with seeing if he could figure out how to prevent smallpox.
Biology had always been of interest to him, and when he was younger, he'd known some milkmaids who believed that because they'd come down with the less severe cowpox, that they would never get smallpox.
This chance interaction that he had when he was younger sparked an idea in his mind, and he began experimenting with cowpox.
This would eventually lead to him inventing vaccination, which he named after cowpox, as the Latin word for cow is vodka.
In 1798, he published his findings, which were literally a prevention for cowpox, but the medical community was not fast to get on board.
In 1799, however, Jenner conducted a study to determine if having survived cowpox and developing an immunity for cowpox had an impact on immunity to smallpox.
He proved his hypothesis, and thus his cowpox vaccine was now, in effect, a smallpox vaccine as well.
The work was far from done.
For instance, at the time, they had no way of knowing how long a vaccine would protect someone for, so refinements had to be made along the way.
But Jenner was responsible for a huge step in medical progress that saved hundreds of thousands of lives.
The last naturally occurring case of smallpox was recorded in Somalia in 1977, and that would not have been possible without Edward Jenner and his cowpox vaccine.
Alex can talk a lot of shit about screen doors all he fucking wants, but he isn't saying anything.
If you look at just the case of measles, according to peer-reviewed studies published in the Journal of the American Medical Association, the measles vaccine was not licensed in the United States until 1964.
Prior to that point, the incidence of measles was 300 cases per 100,000.
After introducing the vaccine, by 1982, the rate fell to 1.3 cases per 100,000.
You see this trend very clearly as it relates to other vaccine-preventable conditions.
The science is very clear.
Now, when you want to talk about the idea that you introduce the vaccine and rates can also go up, that's a part of the science too, because as we discuss here in this path through Edward Jenner and his smallpox vaccine, as you're creating this, you don't know if it's going to be a permanent immunization or if it's going to wear off and you have to get a booster shot down the road.
could you wouldn't know unless could you Yeah.
Or there are instances where some gets contaminated or something like that.
And then you trigger an outbreak.
And that's not the vaccine's fault.
That's the process's fault.
So there's ways that you can twist statistics all you want, but when you really get down to the bottom of it, hand washing is not responsible for that, although it does help.
Timeline's off.
Screen doors helps not getting malaria and dengue fever.
It never fails to fascinate me that the trend of history winds up going, where it's constantly like, oh, we solved this problem.
Like when you're talking about the Great Depression, when you talk about how they increased the marginal tax rates and they broke down so much of income inequality, and that led to a period of sustained growth.
And then they forgot why the Great Depression happened.
The generation that lived through it died.
And they forgot the lesson.
And so they went right back to all the same shit that in the same way, vaccines, when you talk about getting rid of smallpox, the last recorded case of smallpox.
Naturally occurring.
The last recorded naturally occurring case happened 50 years ago or 40 years ago.
And then we forgot that the only reason that hundreds of thousands of people aren't dying every year is because of vaccines.
So these vaccinator people, I'm sorry.
So these anti-vax people come up because they're like, see, we never had eight of our 12 children die of smallpox.
But then in order to refine the argument, once you realize, like, oh, that is the reality, you then have to attack vaccines as having something in them that's bad, which is where you create the clean vaccine idea.
Listen, I've gotten to the point where I'm so focused on news information that you've noticed I'm not plugging half as much as I used to.
And if I don't plug, we're not going to have a show.
But you know what?
That's just the way it is.
I mean, I don't have to say it's up to you, but if people don't know how great our products are and how amazing they are and how much you need them, and if folks don't want to pile in there and get them, that's the signal to me that you want George Soros and Hillary Clinton and all them to have film control and Rod Rosenstein's sister running the vaccine propaganda bureau and the secret payouts to dead kids.
She's going to have her way with your kids.
Rod Rosenstein's dirtbag, bucktooth, demon sister.
So, you know, that's what it comes down to.
If you want these bucktoothed pieces of crap to have their way with you, then go ahead.
Because we've got the very best products everyone needs are X3.
If you don't donate to Knowledge Fight, if you don't go to our website and click the support the show button, I will tell you what's going to happen right now.
That tells me, that tells me that you want Alex Jones to win.
If you don't tell your friends about Knowledge Fight, that tells me that you want people to like Alex Jones.
And I think it's really, I think, I think these trends continue in a super interesting way.
And it's a lot.
There's a lot of content.
And this is a real pain in my ass preparing this episode, stretching out over these three days, but I think it's worth it because the narrative plays out.
On Sunday, you see the kernels of it, the beginning of Alex being kind of fed up and wanting, yearning for something else.
On Monday, you see him start to talk about my identity isn't fucking Roger Stone and Donald Trump and do an almost entire show where he just goes fucking vaccines and barely defends Trump in any way.
Like really not much Trump defense.
So then we get in on Tuesday, on the 29th.
And Alex has an interview with Roger Stone at the beginning of the show because Roger had just gone and pled not guilty.
Yeah, outside of Inforce, it seems like everybody thinks that guy's an asshole.
Huh, is everybody wrong?
Huh.
So anyway, Alex has this interview, and it's exactly the same thing that we saw in our Monday episode, where Alex is mostly preoccupied with the idea of this being a world exclusive.
Of course.
That seems to be what is really driving him here trying to talk to Roger.
It's hard to square that with the fact that Roger's been on every fucking show that'll have him on.
It's even harder to square that with how earlier in the show, Roger said that earlier that morning on Tuesday, he had been on Man Cow's show and Man Cow says hello.
But before he gets there, we see even more pieces of Alex from the past waking up as if in a slumber, as if out of the twilight, his eyes are flickering open back again.
He starts to talk about these sources that he used to talk about all the time, these pre-Trump era sources that he had that we haven't heard about in a long time.
When I was growing up, and I was hearing people that have been in the military as officers and people that have been FBI and all these other places, not in pencil pushing and paper-pushing areas, but real on-the-ground stuff.
I always heard, and I always thought it was weird and not true.
Because I was a kid, nobody ever tried to sexually touch me.
That the establishment was obsessed with raping and killing children.
And there was a whole secret government worldwide that entering into the club meant you had to kill children, or at least rape them.
And then as I got older, and I'm sitting there having dinner with General Benton K. Parton, former head of Air Force Weapons Development, head of the HARP program, guy that developed super secret space-based weapons.
I mean, it doesn't get more influential than him, the top engineer over huge clandestine programs.
And I've interviewed Stubblebein, head of Black Ops, everybody else, and they've confirmed it all as well.
We've encountered General Stubblebein on this podcast thanks to his 2015 appearance with his wife, Dr. Rima Labo, where the two of them tried to sell $30 laminated cards to get people out of being vaccinated.
This was the result of him reading the first Earth Battalion Operations Manual, a book written by a guy named Jim Channon that was packed to the gills with Project Camelot-style New Age nonsense.
He was advocating for creating a class of warrior monks in our army that had special abilities, which would obviously give us a leg up against the USSR.
In 1984, though he had literally zero success for three years at creating super soldiers, he was not drummed out of the military for that.
It turns out that in order to train these super soldiers, General Stubblebein had been letting civilian psychics into the sensitive compartmentalized information facilities, which is a crazy violation of security protocol.
Especially he was kicked out for that.
There's no way that Alex could have talked to Stubblebein except for after all of that, considering Alex was 10 years old in 1984.
Stubblebein was also never the head of Black Ops.
As for Benton K. Parton, Alex only knows him because that dude was a big Oklahoma City and Waco truther back in the 90s.
Parton did have a long career in the Air Force, serving 31 years before retiring in 1978.
Unfortunately, that makes it pretty much impossible for him to be involved in HAARP, seeing as that project didn't start until 1993.
From 1988 to 1989, he served as a special assistant to the head of the Federal Aviation Association, but his role was mostly about the implementation of the new GPS systems and matters of FAA policy, not with creating a gigantic weather weapon.
Alex knows that now Ben K. Parton is dead, so is Stubblebein.
So why not exaggerate their resumes?
It's kind of a shame because outside of some of the more colorful pieces of their resumes, they both did have long careers that don't need exaggeration.
You don't need to claim that Stubblebein was the head of Black Ops when you could just say he's in the fucking military for 32 years.
You don't need to lie about Ben Parton being a part of HAARP.
You could just talk about his illustrious 31-year career in the Air Force.
Alex Jones here is reporting that William Cohen, not Michael Cohen, legitimate Secretary of Defense under Bill Clinton, held a press conference where he admitted That they had earthquake weapons.
If he's out there admitting that that is what they have, what kind of terrifying shit do they have that they don't talk about at press conferences?
So in reality, what Alex is talking about is a speech that Secretary Cohen gave on April 28th, 1997, which was part of a conference on terrorism, weapons of mass destruction, and U.S. strategy.
In all fairness to Alex, Cohen does bring up earthquake weapons.
In all fairness to reality, Cohen brings them up as an example of something that doesn't exist.
The full context of his quote is that he is asked, quote, let me ask you specifically about last week's scare here in Washington and what we might have learned from how prepared we are to deal with that sort of thing at B'nai Brith, referring to a package that arrived at the Jewish service organization that was initially thought to be a chemical weapon.
Cohen's response was this, quote, well, it points out the nature of the threat.
It turned out to be a false threat under the circumstances.
But as we've learned in the intelligence community, we had something called, and we have James Woolsey here to perhaps even address the question about phantom moles.
The mere fear that there is a mole within an agency can set off a chain reaction and a hunt for that particular mole, which can paralyze the agency for weeks and months and years even in a search.
The same thing is true about the false scares of a threat of someone using some kind of chemical weapon or biological one.
There are some reports, for example, that some countries have been trying to construct something like an Ebola virus, and that would be a very dangerous phenomenon, to say the least.
Alvin Toffler has written about in terms of some scientists in their laboratories trying to devise certain types of pathogens that would be ethnic-specific, so they could just eliminate certain ethnic groups and races.
Others are designing some sort of engineering, some kind of insect that could destroy specific crops.
Others are engaging even in an eco-type of terrorism whereby they can alter the climate, set off earthquakes, volcanoes, remotely through the use of electromagnetic waves.
He's talking about potential weapons, but the context of these potential weapons are as examples of false threats that they've received reports about.
It's the sort of thing that you can't not take seriously.
If you're in the intelligence community, you get some sort of report about this sort of thing, but it's not real.
Well, there's so many times where you saw during the Cold War, Russia would be like, we have lasers, and then America would be like, we have buh, and then Russia would be like, well, we have anti-buh, and then America would be like, we have anti-anti-buh, busting anti-buzz.
You can really hurt your enemy by pretending you have a weapon that forces them to spend billions of dollars trying to find a way to protect themselves from that weapon.
This information is necessary for both enemies and allies.
Like, what?
The most famous story I can think of off the top of my head is the British spread that idea of carrots improve eyesight in order to distract from the fact that they were using radar.
You know, like it was that kind of like, oh, it's this.
So he's got to talk about how he'll never sell out.
There's this weird give and there's this push and pull that's going on inside his soul where he's like, I need to make up for having sold out by going back to my roots in some ways.
But at the same time, if I recognize that I've sold out, I can never go back.
I've got all these employees and all this crew, and I've got all my lawsuits I'm fighting that are way more money than Roger's paying.
It's not some competition here, but I'm kind of fighting a two-front war with Roger.
InfoWars has become a platform to sit there and promote fundraising for his issues when I gave Roger a job here, which is great, and he's paid.
And then it also becomes this split where we may not get the funds to fund InfoWars because of the 24-7 Roger Stone fundraising, because people then split it and say, well, we'll just give him a donation instead of InfoWars.
I've got to have a talk with him about that because we can win the battle, lose the war here because of that.
So I hope people do support Roger, but InfoWars has a bill, let's not exaggerate, at least 10 times what Roger Stone's is, okay?
And so, and he's bringing in as much money as we're bringing in right now.
I have all the bandwidth bills and all the equipment, and I sent security up with Roger and reporters up there.
That costs money.
And so I'm not bitching or complaining.
I'm going to have to make some decisions right here on a bunch of fronts about layoffs, laying Paul Watson off, laying Roger Stone off, people that are paid more around here.
I mean, I've just told them, I've told him point blank, too.
I mean, that's where this is headed.
If we don't get the support, and people don't want to support us, that's fine.
Like, if the day that Paul Joseph Watson leaves is the day everything falls apart in terms of Infowars.
And Buckley would never let him fire Paul, no matter what.
So I don't believe that.
But it is, I think that Alex is expressing something sincere, and that is that, like, unless you motherfuckers give me a bunch of money, I'm going to lay, I'm going to have to lay people off.
That's just the reality of this, because we aren't going to be able to do that.
That's what I'm saying is I'm sick of just being associated with Donald Trump and Roger Stone.
He's probably sick of being associated with me.
And by that, it's not bad to be associated with Donald Trump.
It's that that's all I become associated with.
Not being right about screen time, being about 3G and 4G and 5G, being right about how you're being spied on, being right about the world government, being right about everything.
It's like you do everything possible to cement yourself as the guy who's associated with Roger Stone and Donald Trump for three years, and then people think that's all you are.
Set up these false fights where now we're going to spend half our time defending Roger on a fake indictment in a major war for the whole country and our children fighting the pedophiles.
Now everything in Infowars will become this stupid case and the stupid judge and stupid Mueller instead of just warning people, hey, read what's in your tap water, read what's in the vaccines, hey, find out about the New World Order.
And I don't think it says anything really positive about me, but I've put in my time with Alex Jones, and I believe that I have a unique ability to understand him.
Everything I hear being put forth from him in the aftermath of Roger Stone getting indicted when he's had time to actually read the stuff and sleep on it.
All I hear is Alex screaming, I want to go back.
Roger is going to prison.
Jerome Corsi is mixed up in all of it.
He's publicly denounced Steve Pieczenik on his show.
Webster Tarpley and Wayne Madsen hate him now because they saw Trump for the danger that he was.
Jakari Jackson quit.
He lost Rob Jacobson.
He had to fire Joe Biggs over Pizzagate.
Leanne McAdoo doesn't seem to into this anymore.
Roger Stone was the glue holding together a fractured world.
And without him, it's not going to work in this direction anymore.
It's just, it can't.
It's not worth doing it.
And so Alex is trying to retreat to the idyllic pastures of his past, not realizing you can't go home again.
As George Weber learned in Tom Wolf's book of that title, quote, you can't go back home to your family, back to your childhood, back home to a young man's dreams of glory and fame, back home to the places in the country, back home to the old forms and systems of things which once seemed everlasting, but which are changing all the time.
Back home to the escapes of time and memory.
Three years of becoming what he is now has taken a toll on Alex that he'll never be able to undo.
Every day he woke up and came into his studio to tie his name and his reputation to Trump intentionally, and that is not something that goes away just because your friend got arrested and you don't want to play that game anymore.
Alex has every reason to want to go back to his marvelous sunset cities of his better days, but he can't because he's been changed by the journey.
It becomes crystal clear when you hear him trying to do this 2009 style rants that we've seen over the course of this episode, but he's doing it with his 2019 brain.
He can't do it anymore.
He can't weave his I'm above politics bullshit after spending three plus years defending everything Republican members of the government did and literally making Democrat and globalists synonymous.
He was always lying, but he threw away whatever pretense he had a decade ago to ride the big wave with Roger.
Unfortunately, that party is fucking over.
Roger has signaled that he's willing to talk to Mueller, which undercuts literally all of the narratives Alex has pitched about their interactions.
Roger keeps going on Fox shows like Hannity, Tucker Carlson, and Laura Ingram to plead his case because he can now.
He's a hot item, and Alex knows that he's old news.
And Alex cannot go home again, but it's going to be fucking fun to see him try.
But I mean, I think that's what he's struggling with, and I think it's really interesting.
Because I don't think he can make it work.
But whether or not I think he can pull it off, just based on how I don't think anyone could pull it off, that doesn't mean I'm not still super into him trying.
That's more what I'm really interested in, because along the way, he's going to get back to more like actually trying on his show, as opposed to being just a deflection artist, which is always better.
It's always better for me.
And then at the same time, I don't think that we've ever seen like Alex in salvage mode.
And I think that's what he's going to have to be moving forward.
I think it's going to be slow moving.
I definitely think it's going to take a little while for it to really take hold, but it's the same sort of thing that we saw when he came into Trump in the late summer, fall, into the winter of 2015.
It was a really slow burn where there was the introduction of themes, the gradual warming of the water to the point where the listeners didn't realize it was boiling and they were in the pot.
That sort of thing.
I think he's doing sort of a similar thing, but in reverse now.
And because we have such an awareness of Alex and how he works and how he operates, I think you can see from these three days here in January 2019, the de-escalation of that boiling water.
But, like, I don't see him as being someone who's going to be able to mold Alex.
But if he were to get in with, like, let's say those people who do like Red Ice TV or something like that, those are people who could drift Alex strongly towards overt white supremacist white nationalists.
The other possibility is that we could see a marked insurgence of the old guests who seem to have been laying low.
People like Paul Craig Roberts, people like Peter Schiff.
We could see a lot of these guys who were really prominent figures in 2015 start to show back up as Alex tries to refocus on the Federal Reserve, the globalist, as opposed to it being a Trump defense show.
A lot of these guys who used to be his sources, like I said, he can't go back to Webster Tarpley.
He can't go back to Pachenic.
He can't go back to Wayne Madsen, but he has options from his old roster if he apologizes to them and shows that he's not still just on Trump's coattails.
And I think that's one possibility that I'd be interested in seeing, because I think that dynamic would be fascinating, because those people would take a real fucking, we told you so kind of approach, and Alex might get really mad about that.
The other possibility is something I'm more afraid of, but I think would be more interesting, and that is Alex going to the overt Nazi route, which is possible.
I don't know.
But it can't, like, that's the problem with not being able to go home again.
Right.
Because if he tries to go home to his old guests and all of those people that used to make him comfortable back in the day, they've changed and he's changed since then.
So trying to go back there is trying to create a future that can't be.
It's a warped version of the past that will only make both parties kind of disappointed by what they're experiencing.
I think that could lead him also towards then going to the bread ice people.
I don't want to disagree with you necessarily because I think your idea is interesting, and I think that's entirely possible.
But from where I'm sitting, I think that Alex has to be more gradual.
And I think Fox News, when they jump, could go much harder, 90-degree angle.
I think that they could take a pivot really fast, and I think people would kind of not see it.
I think that because of the flashiness of their graphics, their production design, their ability to distract, and the fact that they're better at their jobs.
So yeah, I don't think Alex has the same ability to sort of hypnotize and manipulate people.
Like he has just his words mostly to go on.
I don't know.
You could be right, or I could be.
I don't know.
I don't think either of us are staking a strong position on it, but I think something that would be really interesting, but I actually think is impossible, is the idea that Alex could become a voice of like, we lost our way or something like that.
I don't think he'd ever do it.
But I think that there would be some value for propaganda purposes in humility.
Like some sort of like, I don't know how he'd get to the place necessarily, but some sort of like penitence of like, we lost our way.
We had our principles.
Ron Paul is who I always loved and I got seduced away from it.
Could even go with his, you know, sort of hero's journey that he likes to put himself into.
He could do that and be like, look, it seemed like the right thing to do.
It seemed like the best way to attack the globalists.
This guy, Roger Stone, fucked me over.
He's going to prison.
I've seen the error of my ways.
I know he was lying to me the whole time.
I beg of you.
I'm a voice in the wilderness coming to you saying, we fucked up.
Do you remember how great it was when the Tea Party was going on?
Do you remember how much life we felt in those midterms in 2010 when we started to gain seats?
Do you remember what it felt like to have this resurgence and the Fed anti-tax movement going on that got warped?
It got bastardized.
We didn't know what we were doing.
We got led down the wrong road.
And I'm begging you to come back.
Come back.
I don't think it would work, but I think it would be interesting as a character.
It would be sort of logical but unlikely progression for his character.
I think most likely we're going to see severe radicalization because him trying to go home isn't going to work.
I think he's going to have to try and find a new home.
And that new home, in terms of the internet conspiracy sphere and all that world, he's either got to go queue on shit, and that's clearly something he's not into and isn't viable.
The only other world there really is outright white nationalist, white supremacist Nazis.
Yeah, he's outclassed on all fronts, though, because he's still not going to be able to do white nationalism as good as out-and-out white nationalists are doing.
No, but he does have a bigger platform than a lot of them.
So he could elevate them, and they would hero worship him because of that gatekeeper-ish thing where he has these millions of people who listen to him.
Now, we have a couple more clips here from the 29th, which again is Tuesday.
On this show, Alex has clearly indicated that Roger Stone's time is done.
Alex wants to go back.
He wants to be where he felt comfortable before, where his identity wasn't tied to Trump, and he could talk about all the stuff that he's been right about.
He wants to be that again.
And I wouldn't take it all that seriously, probably.
And even the emotional pleas and the sort of things that you think you're seeing in him could sometimes be – you could trick yourself if you're giving like a generous reading of what he's saying or doing.
You could trick yourself into thinking, like, oh, isn't that interesting?
What sealed the deal for me is this interview that he has at the end of the show on the 29th.
But it doesn't mean I really don't want Trump to win reelection, but I think you're saying get Coulter to start talking about running to get Trump back on the straight and narrow.
Well, even if she needs to run, I don't think that it would be harmful for us to have a healthy GOP primary based on the issues and hold Trump accountable.
And there's a wide variation of people who do and do not support what I'm doing right now.
Me personally, I will never vote for Donald Trump again.
I don't care if he's running against the socialist Oscar Cortez or whatever her name is.
I can't vote for him again because I feel very betrayed.
So it felt great during the campaign and at the inauguration to hear things that I've been saying for years echoing off the walls of the White House and to have some hope.
So he feels betrayed by Trump and he'll never vote for him again.
Alex wouldn't let this on his show a month ago.
That's absurd.
That's crazy to think about.
And even the idea that he's starting out this interview by saying, like, you know, maybe it's a good idea to have Ann Coulter run to get Trump back in line or whatever.
If he'd read the article that William Gein had written, that was posted, reposted on InfoWars.
It's exactly what he said the day before, and now Trump has betrayed us.
Alex is allowing this guy to express these opinions on the show because it's what he wants to say but can't yet.
So he wants to introduce it into the rhetoric of his show.
It's very important for him in terms of being able to pivot, being able to transition, have this unhostile conversation with someone who's like, fuck it, Trump abandoned us.
I've always been, you know, I loved it in the campaign to hear stuff I love to hear.
But it's important that Alex is letting this on his show.
That's super important.
And the second thing that's really important is at the end there, he's like, we voted for Trump because I heard these things in the campaign that inspired me.
And a lot of people would like to present the idea.
We did not elect Donald Trump to make DACA permanent.
We elected Donald Trump because he promised us illegal immigrants, including DACA Dreamers, had to leave the country.
Everyone remember this when he told us this.
He said we either have a country or we don't.
He told us the illegals had to leave.
He told us he was going to form a deportation force.
He's doing none of these things.
He's actually doing something 180 degrees different than that.
He promised us recently, read me, just before the midterm elections, where a lot of voters like me did not get excited about things, that he was going to end birthright citizenship through an executive order.
Didn't do it.
He told us recently he was going to declare a state of an emergency to get the wall built.
And the response here is interesting because Alex is kind of like, yeah, you know what?
You're right.
You're right.
Like, there's a part at the end of the interview where Alex is even like, yeah, you know, we're all caught up on the wall, but this amnesty issue is really more important.
Even if they build the wall, you know, there's got to be still immigrants here.
So, not only is this a very jovial, friendly interview with this guy who's denouncing Trump and saying that he needs to be primarily by Ann fucking Coulter in 2020, someone who Alex in the past has been at times embracing of, but at other times also very petty towards.
And I hate Ann Coulter, and I'd still be like, Jesus, man.
So I think what's important here is that I don't think that Alex really necessarily even supports what William Gein is saying.
I think he's using him as a more extreme guest that will allow him to have a moderate position working away from Trump.
So I think I don't know.
At the end here, I just think, like, I can't sum it up better than, like, I hear Alex wanting this not to be real anymore.
What he's done, what he's been involved in, like, he just realizes that he's reached the end of it.
The party's over.
The lights have come on, and it's not fun.
You're there until 5 in the morning, and it's like, hey, baby shark, everything's like fun at 2 in the morning, and then at 5, you still think it's fun.
Lights come on, you realize no one's dancing with you.
Of course, when they go home the next day, the people around him are like, you can't do that.
We got to amend this.
Whereas this turn is more likely to stick because the people around him who otherwise would have said, no, no, no, no, you can't be doing this, are now saying, how do we do this?
Look, I don't know what the future holds, but these days this week have been eye-opening for me.
Like, it really has been.
It's been very difficult to listen to.
And I mean, certainly there's a lot of stuff I had to look into, like, a lot of articles and studies and reports about vaccines, because I wanted to talk about that a little bit as Alex was bringing it up.
The problem with that prediction is that this prediction episode, like the way that your predictions have nailed it this episode, belies our constant truth of we think Alex is going to do this thing.
And to see any kind of resurgence where Alex is feeling like I want to go back to who I used to be.
I'm never going to be against it.
I'm still going to be here to punch you metaphorically, politically, and I'm still going to be there to yell at you and talk about how fucking stupid you are.
But thank you, Alex.
Thank you for indicating that you want to come back.
And it's fucked up, too, because I have so many things that have been in the works, and we have other things that we have been planning that are like big episodes planning.
And they all got thrown off by Roger Stone getting indicted.
The timing of the world just works as it works, and we are servants of it.
We have to accept what we have to accept what comes, and the episodes that we do will be what we do.
We'll talk about it at the beginning of the next episode, but if you're still listening, next week we're only going to have a Monday and a Friday episode.
I will be on vacation.
So please, I don't know, you don't need to forgive us, but just won't be a Wednesday episode.
Yeah, and also, thank you to Robert Evans over at Behind the Bastards.
Earlier this week, he had to announce that he didn't have an episode for the end of the week, and someone got sassy with him, and his response was, why don't you check out Knowledge Fight?