Knowledge Fight - #93: 2015 Investigation Last Looks

Oct. 19, 2017 - Knowledge Fight

02:52:13

#93: 2015 Investigation Last Looks

# turkish_national_police turkey syria 2016_election 45_group alex_jones al_qaeda bashar_al_assad betsy_devos breitbart cambridge_analytica conspiracy_theory dan_friesen defense_intelligence_agency disinformation donald_trump dr_ahmet_s_yala geopolitics haran_university harvey_weinstein hillary_clinton ideology infowars iran isis jared_kushner jordan_holmes kevin_booth knowledge_fight las_vegas_shooting media_influence mercers michael_flynn oleg_deripaska paul_joseph_watson paul_manafort pjw political_manipulation qatar recep_tayyip_erdoğan roger_stone russia sandy_hook saudi_arabia steve_pieczenik

Knowledge Fight revisits Alex Jones’ 2015 pivot to Trump, dissecting Steve Pieczenik’s false-flag claims—like Sandy Hook being staged—and Roger Stone’s alleged role in feeding Jones narratives (e.g., Obama as a "false president") tied to financial motives like Russian sanctions relief. Jones dismissed Dr. Ahmet Yayla’s credible ISIS defectors’ testimony on Assad-ISIS collusion, abruptly shifting topics, while hosts debate whether his associates strategically manipulate him or opportunistically exploit his platform. The episode suggests Jones became a pawn in profit-driven disinformation, amplifying fringe theories to destabilize politics and distract from deeper systemic failures. [Automatically generated summary]
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Participants

Main

alex jones

infowars 12:39

dan friesen

01:26:51

jordan holmes

53:54

kevin booth

05:03

steve pieczenik

08:46

Appearances

david knight

infowars 00:34

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Show episode speakers

Speaker	Time	Text
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Andy in Kansas, you're on the air.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Thanks for holding.
unidentified		Hello, Alex.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		I'm a first-time caller.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		I'm a huge fan.
unidentified		I love your work.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I love you.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Hey, everybody.
		Welcome back to Knowledge Fight.
		I'm Dan.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I'm Jordan.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		We're a couple dudes.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Like to sit around, drink novelty beverages, and talk a little bit about Alex Jones.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But today we have returned to our roots, my friend, and we are drinking the reddest of red blends.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Sure, 14 hands.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		14 hands because it's all 14 hands on deck.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Oh, you know what?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You're not wrong.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You might have just bought that randomly, but today.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I did not.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Today it is all hands on deck.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		We got some serious business to go through.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		Let's do it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		As I described to you a little bit before the show, oh, this is also a podcast where I know a lot about Alex Jones.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		How much do I know about him?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Almost nothing.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Good call.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But I did get a tweet from a listener whose name escapes me at this point, and I apologize.
		But they made a good point that at this point, we're almost a year into this.
		You don't know almost nothing about Alex Jones.
		And that's an unfair way for us to open the show.
		It's kind of bullshit.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I think they're highly overestimating my ability to remember anything that you tell me.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Okay, maybe I know a lot about Alex Jones, and you have forgotten a lot about Alex Jones.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's probably not.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Maybe that's a more accurate way for us to start the show.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But be that as it may.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that suggests that I have ever listened to you.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I think I really just talk.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Unfair.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Rude.
		I don't appreciate it.
		So, last week, on Monday, we put out an episode where...
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Because I think the thing you hate about me is that I interrupt you all.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's not that I hate it.
		It's frustrating.
		It's conversationally difficult.
unidentified		I know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I had to do it there.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So last week, we put out an episode where we essentially ended the 2015 investigation into why Alex Jones joined up with Team Trump.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Indeed.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I declared it dead.
		We know pretty much for a fact that he joined up because Roger Stone is lying to him on a massive scale.
		And on top of that, Russia.
		Right.
		So that was where we left off.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And he got a gold star from Trump and went home to his mother.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He did.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He got a gold star from our friend Steve Pieczenik, who's going to factor heavily into this episode, actually.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
unidentified		All right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But I realized, I sat down and I did some thinking.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I thought about it a bit, and I realized that we might have been a little bit capricious in ending the investigation or in declaring case closed.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right, absolutely.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And one thing triggered that in my mind.
		There was something that happened the other day on Alex's show that I covered on an episode while we were alone.
		I was alone.
		You weren't on the show for that.
		There was an instance.
		There was something.
		I'm sorry.
		I had to go grab the clip because I forgot to load it up.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Take your time.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But here it is.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		This triggered something in my brain and made me realize we need to double back.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You know, sitting and thinking and having something triggering your brain, that's how Gautama invented Buddhism, Dan.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So I think you're about to really crack the case.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think we may.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Now, of course, that also led to the genocide in Myanmar right now.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So there's that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
		Not great.
		Not great.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		What I'm saying is let's go back in time and kill Gautama rather than Hitler because that would solve the real problem.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Oh, sure.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Great.
		Great.
		I don't stand behind that, but I do want to play this clip for you and discuss it because I'm not sure if you've even listened to the episode in question of this.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I did.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		All right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Prove it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I don't remember a goddamn thing.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, good.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You were just talking to Cthulhu.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		What am I going to pay attention to?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		This is going to be fresh for you and maybe a r repetition for people who listen, but it still will set the stage for what we're going to be going over.
unidentified		Okay.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Paul, we're going to go to Georgia and talk to Paul.
		Paul, thanks for calling.
		You're on the air worldwide.
		Hello?
unidentified		Go ahead.
		Yeah.
		I just want to bring up a point.
		Steve Pieczenik came on yesterday on David Knight's show and said this whole thing didn't happen.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Are you aware of that?
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I think it's preposterous.
		I've watched the raw footage.
		I've talked to folks that were there.
		You can't fake people dying and bleeding out.
		And I just, he can have his opinion.
		I can have mine.
		But I don't buy into that.
unidentified		Well, it's almost like a disinformation campaign.
		Is he still working for the CIA here?
		I mean, this whole thing.
		Well, I think that's safe to say.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		All right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If anybody disagrees with Alex, who he has had on the show in the past, that person is now a federal agent.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Doing a disinformation campaign.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's how that works.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Again, don't get in bed with psych warfare people.
		Don't do it.
		So I heard that.
		He just figured it out.
		I heard that clip and it blew my mind.
		Because, first of all, that was news to me that Steve Pieczenik doesn't believe the Las Vegas shooting happened.
		Second, it's crazy to me.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He doesn't even believe the hurricane happened.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He lived through it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He doesn't believe that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He was there, and he was like, this is a false flag hurricane.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The lesson that he took from that hurricane was, mind your manners.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But he does believe it happened.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's the best lesson to take from a hurricane.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No doubt.
		Yeah.
		So I heard that clip, and I was like, I need to think about Steve Pieczenik a little bit more.
		I need to explore him and where he was in the game at the end of 2015.
		Okay.
		And before I did that, I decided, hey, I never listened to David Knight's show.
		Why don't I go back and listen to Steve Pieczenik actually say that Las Vegas didn't happen?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You poor man.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So now you're going to have to listen to that too.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Fuck, David.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Here are a couple clips from the October 4th, 2017 show, The Real News with David Knight, where Steve Pieczenik comes on and says that the Las Vegas attack did not happen.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Naturally.
david knight ▲ ● ▼		Dr. Pachenek, let's go straight to the shooting in Vegas.
david knight ▲ ● ▼		Your comments.
unidentified		All right.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Let me tell you, number one, why I can't get on the internet.
		The reason is very simple.
		I'm being hacked.
		The reason why you're hearing me now is another person's phone call.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		This is part of 9-11.
		They can call it conspiracy, but everything you said, David, is the same thing I said within 24 hours of 9-11.
		My CIA operatives admitted that they did it.
		I had the names of the people in my life.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		If you have the fucking name.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's because of 9-11.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's a continuation.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's the same thing as 9-11.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right, but he says he has the names of all these people.
		Then I implore you, sir.
		Let's get on with it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Let's get some snicks going on here.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Quote Barry Manilow.
		Let's get on with it.
		Because we need, I believe that the entire world's security is contingent on you producing these fucking names, Steve.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, and who the fuck did 9-11, Steve, huh?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He knows.
unidentified		Huh?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He knows.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Who did it?
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		They indicted Bush, Cheney, Cherdoff, Giuliani, the Mossad operatives who blew up the building in Ben Condi, and as well as Colin Powell.
		And this is what happened.
		So what's happening now is a continuation.
		Sandy Hook, false flag.
		St. Bernardino, false flag.
		Yesterday in Las Vegas, a complete false flag.
		It was absolute nonsense.
		You could hear the verbiage.
		You could hear the same setup as we had in Sandy Hook.
		The narrative is so predictable that no one was killed.
		There was no shooting.
		And in fact, what happened in the giveaway was this was the greatest killing at all time of America.
		That's distinctive with Trump.
		He has to have the most and the best.
		But yet, the sad part is that Trump fell into this system and he's co-opted by the Department of HS, CIA, and FBI.
		What we need to do in America now is demand the indictment of presidents, indictment of officials.
		I don't know if it'll happen, but this is enough reason to start a revolution.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Holy shit!
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's crazy.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He is the most right ever for the wrongest reason in the history of the world.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The idea of indicting the president.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it needs to happen.
		And so many of these people.
		Look, fucking, it starts with what?
		Reagan in the Iran-Contra scenario?
		Every president since then should have been put in jail.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And Larry Nichols in the Iran Conference.
unidentified		Exactly.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But fucking Christ is he right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, right, but let's not.
		I love it.
		Let's not dally around with the idea that he's right because the part that he's wrong about is more important.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You know what?
		The thing is, he puts it forward so confidently that while he was talking, there was a part of me that was trying to figure out a way that all of these things could be false flags.
		There is not.
		He is fucking stupid.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It seems prohibitive in terms of difficulty.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		A lot of work would go into all of this stuff.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, there's no doubt.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But it is fascinating that his line on it is that Trump has gone south and he started doing false flags.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, and now it's time for a revolution.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Which is wild.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It is time for a revolution against Trump because he faked the Las Vegas shooting.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And he had to in order to have the largest mass shooting faked in the history.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		At what point?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I now love Steve Pieczenik because that is the craziest bullshit I've ever heard.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I like to keep in my head sort of a power ranking of my favorite crazies on Alex's show.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And Steve Pieczenik is not even in the top five for me.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I know that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		We got Hamamoto up top.
		We're going to meet number two on our next episode.
		Of course.
		I'm going to do a deep dive into this next crazy on our episode that will air at the end of the week.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But come on.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Steve is no, he is just.
		All right.
		Save your praise until we get through all this.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay, before we even go any further, do you think he's deliberately lying or do you think he's lost his mind?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think he's deliberately lying.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Do you think he's deliberately lying?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think this is psych warfare.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He's blaming it on Trump.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Okay.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think this is psych warfare, quite frankly.
unidentified		All right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I also think he's a little bit crazy.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There's no doubt about that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's absolutely insane.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		But even so, I mean, even in that clip, you heard him still in 2017 Sandy Hook was fake.
		Of course.
		And Alex, by virtue of David Knight, is allowing this to be broadcast on his show unquestioned.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Here's my theory: operating theory with zero information.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		And I want to get this out up front.
		That way the rest of the episode can prove me wrong, but I had a good time.
		Sure.
		I think that when Steve Pieczenik lived through the hurricane, he realized climate change is real.
		And when that happened, it broke his brain.
		Because he spent all of his time denying it, and now for the first time, he's confronted with reality and his entire worldview breaks down.
		So there's two ways to go.
		You can either change everything you think or you can double down on your conspiracies.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Let me pitch a continuation of your theory, but a slightly different version.
unidentified		All right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So he realizes the climate change is real in the hurricane and decides he's got to do his part to get Trump out of there so someone responsible will take over.
		Okay, okay.
		But he knows that the only place he has influence is with a bunch of crazies.
		Right.
		And so the only way he's going to be able to affect change is by making an even more insane theory for them to get on board with, and that is Las Vegas didn't happen.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Unfortunately, it backfires because the next day, Alex Jones disavows him and says he's still working for the CIA on his broadcast.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I don't think that's a bad idea at all.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So here's Steve talking more about how it was fake.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Is still from the real news with David Knight.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
		There was no death, no killings, no shooter, absolutely nothing.
		And the reason.
david knight ▲ ● ▼		Wait a minute.
david knight ▲ ● ▼		You're saying there was nobody killed in Las Vegas?
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		No, nobody.
		Nothing.
		It was basically a total false flag.
		It was a total Sandy Hook.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I do not like it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		False flag operations things still happen.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I also don't like the expression, it was a total Sandy Hook.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's grim.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Look, we live in a world now that is so beyond insane that I can't help but laugh.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Guys, it was classic Sandy Hook.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The fucking most lunatic, like, it's monstrous.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's a real thing that somebody said.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And there's a number of people who are listening who are probably like, fuck yeah.
unidentified		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No.
		Look, if I did that on stage as a bit, that would be so beyond.
		People would see that as the most ridiculous thing that you can possibly say.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He might get some press.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And he means it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That would be great.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I would be on Jezebel as the.
unidentified		This comedian thinks that it's okay to go too far.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		So that whole thing.
		In the next clip I have here from the David Knight thing.
		I believe this is the last clip.
		I want to be clear because I'm saying that David Knight's being a dick and allowing Steve Pieczenik to say that Sandy Hook didn't happen as evidence that the Las Vegas attack didn't happen.
		And in this clip, it becomes clear that David Knight also doesn't believe Sandy Hook happened.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		I mean, look, they intimidated Alex Jones into thinking that people really died in Sandy Hook.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Now explain how that happened.
david knight ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I understand.
david knight ▲ ● ▼		I still have.
unidentified		The man who was intimidated that nobody was killed.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		None.
david knight ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I wouldn't disagree with you on Sandy Hook, but I certainly think that people were killed here.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		absolutely that's also insane that's an even more insane thing to think that is an even more insane thing to think that Look, if you believe both were fake, at least that makes a certain logic.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But if you're like, well, obviously this one is real, but Sandy Hook was fake, that's insane.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, actually, that actually works towards your theory that Steve Pieczenik is just crazy, because then at least his sort of mental illness schizophrenic break that he's having has clearly delineated lines.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And that is, everything is fake.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		Right, right, right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Whereas David Knight is clearly not crazy.
		He's a liar because he's being like, well, I don't think we can use this one.
		I think that if we say this is fake, we're going to look real bad.
		People have started to pay attention to us.
unidentified		Right, right, right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		We used to fly onto the radar and just antagonize people and make them scared.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Now, people, like, late-night shows make fun of us.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't want the world to find out who I am.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right, right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I saw what happened when they.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		David Knight!
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I learned what happened when people realized Owen Schroer exists when he got made fun of by a little girl.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Do you know what's crazy?
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		What?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I finally saw his name in print.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I swear to God, I have thought you have been saying Owen Shroyer this whole time.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And it's Schroyer.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It is.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So fucking figure out how to speak English, Dan.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		One of the best tweets that I think I've ever put out was that Owen Schroyer is dangerously close to people knowing who he is.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		When he got made fun of by that little girl, everyone just laughed, but they don't realize he's an integral part of Alex Jones' operation.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And he's also a monster.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, he has his own fucking show.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Anyway, let's get through the end of this clip.
david knight ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't think that he was intimidated.
		I think he's looking at this.
		I think he backed off of it a bit because when you look at these events, it's very hard to determine exactly what happened.
		But I certainly believe that Sandy Hook was a full-blown false flag.
		But I believe that people died here based on what I've seen.
		I think there's a lot of witnesses to this event.
		But thank you for joining us, Steve Pachetek.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So he just shuts it down.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I personally think Sandy Hook was a false flag.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But there were a lot of witnesses who saw this going on.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That doesn't make a goddamn lick of sense.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's fucking insane.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's not good.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		How many witnesses is enough witnesses?
unidentified		About a grip of them.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He's got a grip of witnesses there.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		A key grip or a best boy of them?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, just, you know, a stack of witnesses.
		Who knows?
		It's a stupid line to draw, and everyone's dumb.
		And anyway, I went back and I listened to this, and I was like, Steve is crazy.
		He's lying and crazy.
		That's why we can't find the line between which one it is.
		It's because he's both.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I think he's gone.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I think this is a more stringent.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Completely off the reservation.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, this one's out there.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, we know that Steve Pieczenik is a really important part of Alex Jones' worldview and his support for Trump.
		We know that.
		But I don't think we've done a good enough job of exploring that.
		So now, in the afterglow of Alex Jones realizing that Steve Pieczenik has probably been misleading him this entire time, I don't think he's doing that kind of work, actually.
		Alex isn't wrestling with that.
		But him saying that Steve Pieczenik is running a disinformation campaign on David Knight's show, I thought it would be at everyone's best interests for us to go back and explore the last two appearances of Steve Pieczenik in December of 2015 when Alex Jones made the change.
		Now, on our last episode from 2015, we talked about how Alex had become fully convinced to go with Trump by the last Republican debate on December 15th.
		And I think that we had our date off a tiny bit.
		I think he was already fairly on board by then, but he was presenting it as, now I have no reservations about him.
		Because I went back to a day that will live in infamy, December 7th, 2015.
		The anniversary of Pearl Harbor, which is very fitting.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, no.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Because Steve Pieczenik.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, no.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Steve Pieczenik makes an appearance on the December 7th, 2015 show.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And this is like the kind of stuff that Alex, you get to watch him throughout the rest of this episode getting fooled in real time.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Do you know what's crazy?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What's that?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Pearl Harbor did not happen.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Oh, my God.
unidentified		False flag.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Not enough witnesses.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Do they not realize that false flags still happen?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, people still die.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The term comes from ships that would put different flags on to make the people where you were going think that it was someone else.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And then they would kill everybody.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's from privateers.
unidentified		Yes.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Back whenever it was state-sponsored pirates.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Essentially.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So if it, like, if 9-11 was a false flag, the tower still did go down.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, we didn't all get fucking mesmerized and turned into people.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, this isn't fucking Men in Black.
unidentified		Okay.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, no, no, no.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You're not putting a giant on the, okay, it's Men in Black 2.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I apologize.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And to make the argument that Alex does about the Las Vegas attack, one of the things he's saying, his mantra now is the target is the motive.
		That's something he keeps repeating over and over again, saying that these white Christian conservatives, because he's stereotyping country music fans, they are the ones who are the target.
		Obviously, the motive was he wanted to kill white Christian conservative types.
		So that's what he's saying.
		And he's making the argument that that must mean that it's liberals and globalists who are behind, you know, the Antifa were behind it because they would be the ones who would want to kill conservative Christian white people.
		And to that end, I would make the argument if you had a crazy conservative type, and I'm not saying that this is the case, but if you had a crazy militia type of guy, maybe someone who listens to Alex Jones and loves the idea of false flags and understands who gets blamed for certain things, wouldn't it make sense for that person then to target their own people?
		He says that the Democrats are going to do that to gain sympathy.
		He says that the Democrats are going to start false flagging each other in order to blame the Patriots.
		So using that same logic, doesn't it make sense that he should consider the possibility that some unhinged militia person attacked some group that would appear to be white Christian conservatives in order to pin it on Antifa?
		I'm not saying that's the case, but using Alex Jones' stupid logic, that makes as much sense as anything he's saying.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It drives me nuts.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Here's the problem.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's crazy.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's bat shit.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But also, we live in a comic book now, so that might as well possibly be a lot of fun.
		I'm far more possible.
		No, I know.
		I know.
		Because that's fucking insane.
		However, in the world that we live in, I'm at a place where it's like, a year ago, that's fucking crazy, Dan.
		Now it's like, there's a 12% possibility that did happen exactly the way you described it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think it's lower than that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But, like, the only point I'm trying to make is that Alex is, like, you know, he ascribes all sorts of nefarious motives to one side and then doesn't think that, oh, the people listening to me might think, oh, that's a good idea, and then go do it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But that's the entire point of, so the reason that...
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Again, I'm not saying that's what happened.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Again, I'm not saying that's what happened.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But look, we're getting – also, that would be a delight if you were like, this is obviously the truth.
		Like, if we just go if we just start going conspiracy theory beyond Alex Jones, that would be a delight.
		I would enjoy that just as much.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I was starting to flirt with the idea of pretending.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Like, my dad went to Harvard for his dissertation, his doctorate.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, anyways.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		When I was growing up, when I was super young, we lived in Cambridge and in Boston because he was going to get his doctorate in religious studies.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And one of the things I was thinking about was trying to create an alternate fake reality wherein we were actually there because they were doing tests on me in order to create someone who could take down Alex Jones one day.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Jesus.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I was thinking about trying to do something like that, and the idea of you saying we should go crazy with just lies.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I was like, I mean, that's an idea.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But did you succeed?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Not yet.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I mean, it's entirely possible you did.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Who knows?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, who did?
		Look, all time exists in one moment.
		But space-time.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Anyway, of course.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, but you're discounting the fact that if Alex did know that that's what could have happened and would have happened, then his job then is to pretend that it's not what happened.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And it couldn't be what happened.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Do you see what's going on there?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, I know.
		The more layers we dig J.Com nesting doll.
		It's impossible to get anywhere because you're just walking in circles.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		See, the thing with that is, were that to be true, we only make Alex smarter and smarter and smarter.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Whereas we should be going the exact opposite direction.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think we are.
		And these clips will play that out.
		He's not a very smart man.
		But the first thing that I want to do is I want to play this clip.
		This is from the December 7th, 2015 show.
		Because Alex always talks about how it's come out that the United States funds ISIS.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And I didn't realize exactly where he was getting this from.
		And he makes it clear in this clip.
		And it's a problem.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I started seeing the last few years, though, this whole Islamic State thing and more really being allowed to recruit, being allowed to build up, being funded by Saudi Arabia.
		We and others exposed it.
		Now it's blown up, and I have trouble even knowing where it's all going.
		I don't think the establishment knows.
		I think it's out of control.
		That's why the former head of defense intelligence has come out three times now on television in the last two months and said, we were ordered to fund ISIS and Al-Qaeda consciously.
		It's a horrible idea.
		I don't know what the president's thinking.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Do you know who that is?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Steele?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Michael Flynn.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
		Naturally.
		Naturally.
		Do you know what?
		Here's the interesting thing.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And by the way, I listened to that interview that he's talking about.
		It was on Al Jazeera.
		He doesn't actually say that.
		This is Alex Jones embellishing on lies that Mike Flynn, the guy who got fired from the director of national intelligence position, made.
		So it's not good.
		And he was currently working for Erdogan at that point when he's making these claims.
		He's actively an agent for a foreign power who is hostile and a dictatorship.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But I don't necessarily think that discounts his points.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Interesting.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, I mean.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		We did fund al-Qaeda.
		So it is not beyond the realm of possibility to imagine that in its early stages, we funded ISIS.
		That's entirely possible.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Furthermore, regardless of the Islamic state.
		Right.
		Before they were an entity that was actively international terrorizing.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The Saudis almost certainly fund ISIS.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Probably.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		There is no doubt in my mind about that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Most likely.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Furthermore.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But the bullshit about us funding Al-Qaeda and stuff like that is it's a completely different generation.
		It's a different time.
		It's not like we funded Al-Qaeda in 99 or 2000.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, but that's.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		We funded them when they were fighting the Russians.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Again, that doesn't necessarily discount what he's saying, though.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I'm dealing more with that.
		Or perhaps more with what Alex says he's saying.
		Right.
		And then there's also just the fact that we are constantly making ISIS stronger simply by having our dumbass president.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, that's true.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They are recruiting entirely based off that.
		And it's not like they needed it.
		Obama drone-striked the hell out of enough people where they're like, fuck it, we'll join.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's a perfect recruitment plan.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, exactly.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		All of our foreign policy decisions, in effect, end up helping ISIS.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But that does not mean that we created ISIS intentionally.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It just means that maybe in the same way that when a car or even a pill to some extent, there is a negative side effect that's found out that's going to cause X amount of trouble.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And you could either recall it or pay people off who it happens to.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Businesses.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Capitalism.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They just decide that, hey, we're going to bite the bullet on this and just get sued.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's cheaper to settle out of court than it is to change it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
		In the same way, I think there's probably a foreign policy equivalent of this that's like, we're going to kill a bunch of terrorists, but we're also going to create a ton more.
		I think there's probably an equation that people do, and I disagree with their math probably, but that's probably the decision.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I think it's exactly what they want.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Look, nothing makes the gun companies more money than whenever a mass shooting happens.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So stocks got sold out immediately.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Immediately.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		In the same way, it makes perfect sense that nothing makes military contractors more money than more terrorists.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And nothing makes our GOP congressmen more electable than pretending that they're fighting against terrorists.
		So they have to create them.
		America creates its own enemies by being fucking stupid.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That is a big part of it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's what we are.
		So again, I don't necessarily discount what Michael Flynn says in that regard because, first off, who gives a shit?
		He's going to jail.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Probably.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He knows that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He has to know that at this point.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Seems about that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So, his goal is either to be pardoned or to fucking go all out, right?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So, why not?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And this is in December 2015, though, that he's saying these things.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		We've got to remember that we're back in the past.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		This is before he's even been named Trump's national security guy or anything like that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He had to have known he was going to be able to do it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There was backroom dealings.
		There's undoubtedly connections that have already been forming.
		Roger Stone and him have been talking and shit like that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		There had to have been a point where he was like, ooh, I'm doing a lot of illegal shit right now, and I am not doing a good job covering it up.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It is crazy I've gotten away with it this far.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, exactly.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You ever have those moments where you sit down and you're like, fuck, I should be in prison.
		Even in 2015.
		International for Hawaii.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, he's playing with house money and the fact that he's not in jail at this point.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		But be that as it may, let's put a pin in all that.
		I get what you're saying.
		I don't disagree, but I don't wholly agree either.
		But it's immaterial to what we need to get through today.
		Fair.
		We're going to talk a lot about Steve Pieczenik.
		He comes in in this December 7th, 2015 episode to shit on Obama.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		But I have asked repeatedly our intelligence community to stand up and stop the president of the United States, be it Bush, Keney, Clinton, or Obama.
		Obama has been a disaster from day one.
		His history has been nothing but a contrived absurdity about a CIA operative born of a CIA grandmother and mother and grandfather who had no background, no experience whatsoever, and was voted in without any vetting by the Secret Service, the National Security, or any organization in the United States.
		You and I could not have become president of the United States the way Obama did.
		And what did he do?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, well, he would have to be elected to the state senator.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		He created a false flag and a stand-down issue with the killing of Osama bin Laden, which never occurred.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So, another thing that was...
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So that's also.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So literally Steve Pieczenik does not believe anything is real.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He might be a nihilist.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		We believe in nothing.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I mean, or just like a solipsist.
		Like, he wasn't there.
		Yeah.
		What didn't happen?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Well, in 2015, he has to know that he's full of complete bullshit on that one.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, there's no way that he could even pull up any evidence to support those dumb bullshit claims.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, the idea that Obama wasn't vetted at all is nonsense.
		Insane.
		That's complete nonsense.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He was already.
		He's been in government.
		And not only that, like, look, Obama was a not good president.
		He was a.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Could have been worse.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, absolutely.
		But it's not like he was.
		It's not like he was up there with FDR or nothing like that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And you could make a very compelling argument that his response and his indecision in regards to so many things is the reason that we have Trump.
		You know, he was a huge proponent of neoliberalism, which has destroyed the world.
		So the idea that he is a CIA operative and Pachenek wants our intelligence community to have more control over who becomes president is not good.
		Yeah, that's very not good.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And the fact that he's saying these things and Alex is just sort of like, you're a genius, is kind of troubling because they don't really unpack that idea that these deep state people should have control over that.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Which seems like something Alex would be against.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Furthermore, the idea that we want our intelligence community doing anything is very scary when you start to consider how utterly incompetent and stupid they all are.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If you think about, look, we should have probably killed Fidel Castro 60 times, and they failed every single time.
		Like with cartoonish bond villain plans where they're like, we're going to put poison in his drink.
		And like, what are you guys doing?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It was a better time, though.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That was our intelligence community.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's more fun.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It is our intelligence community.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's more fun.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But look, all I'm saying is if Putin can kill people in the UK easily, our intelligence community is terrible at this.
unidentified		But it's fine.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		I don't have a rebuttal to that.
		I was just thinking it's probably easy to kill anybody anywhere, quite frankly.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But they are bad at it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So the idea that they're all of a sudden successfully pulling off Las Vegas, the biggest mass shooting in history, there's a difference between a dissident who's in a different country and a head of state.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Do you mean an ambassador?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There's a difference between an ambassador and the president or whatever position Fidel Castro had.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I mean, if you're killing people, you're killing people in a different country.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, but still, an ambassador doesn't have as much security as, say, Fidel Castro.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I understand, but I don't know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I still think it could be done.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There's shades of it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And if you're trying to bring in the idea of Las Vegas stuff, that would be not that hard to pull off if you were a secret clandestine organization.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Really?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, look, I'm not saying that that was the case because I don't believe it was, but if you were some sort of secret organization that has unlimited funding, the idea of a lone wolf killing type of thing like that doesn't seem like it would be too hard to pull off.
unidentified		Okay.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So you're a JFK truther.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Back.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It was Bush.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And to the left.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It was Bush.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It was Bush.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It was Bush who killed JFK?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Go watch Dark Legacy.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Now, that's my favorite conspiracy theory yet.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It was H.W. Bush, who wouldn't become vice president for 20 more years.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But he was in charge of the CIA at the time.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's true, but come on.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't believe that's necessarily true, but it's an interesting theory.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Anyway.
unidentified		All right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Speaking of interesting theories, we've heard that Steve Pieczenik doesn't believe Sandy Hook.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I mean, fuck it.
		It might as well have been Hoover.
		He probably could have pulled it off.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Probably.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Although he couldn't even get MLK to kill himself, so then maybe he was incompetent too.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You're so frustrated with me.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Sandy Hook.
unidentified		You love Cthulhu because you just get to talk.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I like a balance.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I like having you here to have conversation with, but I don't fucking like every single sentence interrupted.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I mean, look, I've got to get a word in edgewise.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You've got plenty of words in edgewise.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Hey, take any edgewise word you want, but when I say in this next clip, generally that's a cue that I'm about to say something.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I'm sorry, you're just moving along pretty quick.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		We're fucking 35 minutes in already.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I'm not moving along.
unidentified		We're four clips in.
unidentified		All right, all right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I apologize.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So in this next clip, we found out earlier that Steve Pieczenik does not believe that Sandy Hook happened in 2017.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		See what he said in 2015.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		President of the United States was created false issues not only in Benghazi, not only in Osama bin Laden, but in Sandy Hook.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The way he says Osama bin Laden there is kind of like a political Don DeMello.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Anyway.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Sandy Hook was par excellence.
		The description of a non-existent killing of a so-called Asperger's individual who supposedly killed 22 kids and several adults with a lot of machinery and a lot of heavy equipment.
		It was nonsense.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So he's pretty consistent.
		He's said that Sandy Hook is fake for a long time.
		And Alex didn't push back on that at all, just sort of accepted it.
		And they're like, yeah, moving along.
		So the reason that I'm pulling this episode and then one other one where we're talking about Steve Pieczenik's role in this whole thing is because it becomes abundantly clear when you listen to this December 7th appearance, and then we're going to listen to the December 29th appearance.
		You really start to get all the pieces come into play about Steve manipulating Alex.
		And there's a couple moments where Alex, I think he sees through it a little bit.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And then he just squashes those fears or like, I'm being fucked with.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay, now.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There's a couple moments that'll be very clear to you.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		What is the end game, though, for Prochenek to go full on with Sandy Hook trutherism?
		You know, he's manipulating Alex.
		We got that.
		That's all he's just sowing chaos.
		Well, he's just a fucking horseman of the apocalypse.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think that populations are much easier to control when they're scared and when they are distrustful of authority and that sort of thing.
		And so if you want to.
		I mean, Steve Pieczenik writes books and stuff like that that he sells.
		I'm sure there's some interest in that.
		But then also just pushing through.
		You know what?
		I don't know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Couldn't it be?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's a good question.
		I don't know, because it doesn't seem like it's a purely financial motive.
		It doesn't seem like it's not clear.
		He has a vested interest in Trump getting in, but he doesn't seem like he's not as much of a bigot as a lot of Alex's other cronies.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, but what is he getting?
		Like, so Trump did get elected.
		What is he getting now that he would have gotten stolen valor a little bit?
		So this is just him wanting to get a hand job?
		Like, what are we talking about?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, but I mean, if you're going to make the argument that you think he's crazy, then the idea that he's crazy enough to just want everyone to think that he's changed the world, it could be just ego.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's entirely possible.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't know.
		The endgame isn't as clear as it is about people like Larry Nichols.
		Like, Larry Nichols is really easy to see through.
		He wants to destroy the Clintons.
		That's basically.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's the primary motivation for him.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's kind of boring in that regard.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's not boring in terms of the witch stuff.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, that's true.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But then there's other people who it's clear that, like, okay, Trump needs to get in because it will aid a rollback of civil rights.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It will aid a rollback of taxes on the rich and stuff like that.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Steve is not as clear.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think he's playing a really interesting game, but yeah, I don't know why.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The why is not clear.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Is it really just he wants?
		So, regardless of financial gain, which I mean, he's going to get some the more he appears on these shows, I imagine.
		Is it really just he wants attention?
		Like, is he just another narcissist?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's possible, but I think also he might also be being manipulated in some ways.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Like, I don't think that he's as manipulated as Alex, but over the course of this, I think you'll start to see little indications that it's possible that other characters we know are working a lot of angles.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		By whom?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What are you talking about?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If Steve Pieczenik is getting manipulated by who?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Roger Stone.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Now we're giving Roger Stone that much credit?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Let's listen to a few more clips and see where we land.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		All right, all right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I agree that it's very difficult to say exactly what the motivation or the end game is.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think it might be possible that we could sum it up as a drastic change in U.S. foreign policy.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And I think that he might have some softness towards Russia.
		He might be a pro-Russia guy.
		So it's entirely possible that that's a piece of it.
		I don't know.
		Let's listen to these clips and see if it develops.
unidentified		Okay.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		All right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So in this next clip, we see just the classic Steve Pieczenik-style flattery that is indicative that he's about to get Alex into a narrative.
		It's like, hey, you need to listen.
		I'm going to lull you into a sense of security with this ass licking.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		For me, it signifies.
		Let me get to the point for the American public.
		You are important because basically you have been the game changer in the entire business of the media.
		Now, I've known the media very well from the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, all of them, Rodreo.
		Basically, their job is to get ratings and to get money for whatever content they produce.
		Your job, which I really didn't know from the beginning, was to assess the facts that were out there.
		And thanks to your own intuitive knowledge and sense of righteousness, you went on to say, okay, let me hear what the alternatives are.
		And you've continued with it.
		And in that sense, to me, you represented the American public, the public I knew.
		The people who worked hard, the people who had to earn a living, the people who went to jobs on a daily basis, not the politicians like Hillary.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So in that clip, he's saying that you have changed the game.
		You are responsible for a change in the game because you're not like these assholes.
		You're the voice of the underheard people.
		You are the voice of true America, which is exactly what Alex wants to hear.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's exactly the sort of thing that gets him hard.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, he's a patriot.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So you're taking some notes there.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What do you got?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I just, like, is he, in a certain sense, actually a game changer in that regard?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Alex?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Unfortunately.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, right?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, in the same way that Breitbart and Drudge and all of those guys, and of course, after the BuzzFeed article that once again proved Milo is a Nazi, which fucking suck all the dicks, guys.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, we got some real blowback.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You fucking nailed it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Got some real blowback for calling that one early.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Trust me when I say somebody's a Nazi.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Jordan screamed about it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He didn't even know that one of Milo Yiannopoulos' email passwords was crystal knocked or the other one was Knight of Long Knives 1920.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Now that one could have been ironic.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I bet.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I bet.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's a long password.
		So if we are going to pull that direction, I don't understand why it is.
		Or I suppose, absolutely.
		Pieczenik has to tell him that it is everybody else is looking for money.
		He has to tell him that because Alex has to believe that he is getting this money under duress.
		Like, it always has to be to keep the doors open.
		It can't be because Alex is a multi-millionaire.
		It can't be because of that.
		It has to be because he's a patriot because that will fulfill his narrative.
		Right.
		Now, if Pachenek is doing that on purpose, as opposed to believing that, the next thing that he says has to be fucking insane, right?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Somewhat.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I mean, you want to hear it?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		And what happened is you allowed a Trump to come in thanks to Mr. Roger Stone, whom I've known about since the Reagan administration.
		And he was brilliant enough to say, you know what?
		We're going to legitimize the people who've been out there called the Truthers and the Wackos, the 20 million of us, who basically are saying, Bush, Cheney, Obama, you're wrong.
		Not only are you wrong, you're criminal.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Well, to show you're inside baseball, I didn't know you knew Stone.
		I knew of Stone.
		I didn't know how much high-level stuff he was involved in.
		I mean, elections of third world folks put two plus two together.
		But he's really a really great guy.
		I'm trying to get him back into town next week.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		We're going to get back to the clip, but did you notice where he's like, I didn't know that you knew Stone.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And immediately after this clip, Steve is like, no, I don't know him personally.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Because I think he's starting.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He's known him since the Reagan administration.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He's known of him in that regard.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, but I think that Steve is starting to, in this clip, he's starting to realize that Alex is starting to put some pieces together and he needs to distance himself from Roger Stone because the two of them are playing Alex from different angles.
		That's clearly what's happening.
		Okay.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But they're not working in concert yet?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yes, they are.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Do you think they're working in concert?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But Alex can't suspect that because if he does, then he'll realize that they're fucking with him.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That they're using him as a media puppet.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But so you're saying both Stone and Pachenek are coordinating.
unidentified		Yes.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
unidentified		I know that to be they've admitted it since then.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They have a group called the 45 Group.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, but that was that sounds like a silly, dumb thing, though.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It probably is, but it's real.
		It's a thing that Roger Stone and Steve Pieczenik, who knows what other people are a part of, they get together and they strategize and did so during the campaign.
		So obviously, Roger Stone and Steve Pieczenik do know each other at this point.
		Of course.
		I refuse to believe that that's possible, that that's not the case.
		I'm making some assertions that are based on some of the later clips, too.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So don't like, you know, don't push back too hard.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But at the same time, I understand your critiques.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And they're fair.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But you, you.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Well, you know, I'm always going to come at this from the Occam's Razor perspective simply because it's a simpler explanation than the two of them know each other.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Wait, I'm talking more about the coordinating together.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Let's finish this clip.
unidentified		Okay.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		And the behind-the-scenes stuff I learned, Trump knows a lot more, obviously, than the public knows.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		And Stone was basically talking about how many really good people in the government are basically saying what you're saying, that none of them were ever perfect, but they now realize this country is going to be brought down if we don't turn things around and stop this hijacking of the government by select groups at the top.
unidentified		I agree with you.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I don't think Pachenek heard a word of that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He was just like, I agree with you.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The only thing he's concerned about, because immediately what he says after that is, I don't know Roger Stone.
		That's the thing that he's concerned about is pushing back against that.
		Because what you heard there at the end of that clip of Alex talking is something he will revisit later.
		And it is a realization that Roger Stone behind the scenes has been telling him verbatim the same stuff Steve Pieczenik has been telling him.
unidentified		Okay.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That, to me, indicates coordination.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's, yeah, that's much more compelling than what we just saw right there.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So my theory is that Steve Pieczenik, I mean, he's been a longtime guest on Alex Jones' show.
		Roger Stone has not.
		Roger Stone was a part of the Trump campaign and then left in August 2015 in order to try and create a groundswell of supposedly not connected to Trump media attention.
		Yeah, he, well, there's that.
		Yeah.
		I mean, certainly from that Breitbart article, it's tough to get away from that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Hard to say.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So what he does is he has connections with Steve Pieczenik.
		He knows Steve Pieczenik.
		And he's like, you and I need to work together and we're going to flip Alex Jones.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		We're going to get him on board.
		So Steve Pieczenik, months before this, this December episode, he came on and said that me and some other people have convinced Trump to run for president because he is the one who can save the country.
		He planted that seed a couple months ago in Alex's head because of interactions that he's had with Roger Stone.
		The people that he's talking to behind the scenes are Roger Stone and ostensibly other people who are members of this 45 group.
		That is my belief.
		Then a little bit of time goes on, and I imagine, you know, Steve Pieczenik is spitting the narratives that Roger Stone will end up saying once he shows up.
		Roger Stone shows up and he's like, oh, yeah.
		He says the exact same things that trusted Steve Pieczenik say, and Alex Jones immediately is like, well, it must be true.
		You guys can't be connected.
		You say you don't know each other.
		When in the meantime, it's just a perfectly elaborate, perfectly laid-out charade that now in 2017 has collapsed because Steve Pieczenik has said that the Las Vegas shooting, no one died in it.
		And because everyone's paying attention to InfoWars.
		Or they're not.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I just don't, like, I suppose it's just, I see these two guys as being fucking stupid.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So the idea that they can successfully pull off this scam...
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What's stupid about...
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't see anything stupid about them.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Listen to what they say!
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They're fucking stupid people.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, because there's intent behind the things that sound stupid.
		That's the thing that needs to be taken into consideration.
		Like, if you or I said it, or if you walk down the street and you saw some guy in like a, I don't know, a Hillary for Prison shirt and he's saying it, he's stupid.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But the progenitor of the information is not stupid.
		They're doing it for a reason.
		Propagandists and conspiracy theorists very rarely exist in a vacuum.
		No, of course.
		They're not espousing the dumb theories that they espouse for no reason.
		There's something behind all of them.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right, but they're essentially con men.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And con men's motivations tend towards the selfish.
unidentified		Sure.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's not as though they are doing this for some sort of larger good.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, they don't give a fuck about the country.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They don't give a fuck about it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But they know that their rhetoric is very powerful.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So you always present it as I care about the country.
unidentified		But then do they just want power?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Do they want influence?
		Do they want money?
		Probably.
		And how does this help them gain this?
		This is what I don't understand.
		Well, look at.
		So Roger Stone just wants attention.
		No.
		I think all Roger Stone wants is for people to look at him and say, look at he's got a tattoo of Nixon on his fucking back.
		All he wants is attention.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think that that's a big part of it, but you have to consider that, you know, he's been in business with Paul Manafort, or as Alex even slips in there.
		He's been involved in third world country elections.
		He has interests that are not abundantly clear without digging too deep into them.
		I think that probably they all stand to gain an amazing amount of money through Trump being president.
		They all know that they can use him.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But that's such a convoluted Rube Goldberg machine of making money.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, maybe some of them had their backs to the wall.
		Maybe there was no other option.
		People like Mike Flynn probably didn't have another option.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		People like Paul Manafort in over his head probably didn't have another option.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I don't buy that.
		There are so many other options.
		There are so many other.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They already have influence and name recognition within D.C. You owe millions of dollars to a foreign power that wants their money back.
		What do you do?
		You can influence trade in order to get your debt forgiven.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Wait, Stone and Manafort owe.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Manafort does.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Really?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There was an article that came out recently about how the.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I didn't know he owed money.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I thought he just made money off of that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The prevailing theory is because he owed a bunch of money.
		I can't remember the guy's name that he owes a bunch of money to, but it was involved with that Devretka guy.
		I can't remember how to say that Russian name.
		But he's the guy who the emails showed that he was offering private briefings to.
		And the prevailing theory was that money is super easy to trace.
		And so he was offering these things in exchange for debt forgiveness because that would be impossible to trace.
		So there are situations like that.
		I don't know the financial status of Steve Pieczenik.
		I don't know what he has his fingers in the pies of.
		But you have to assume with a lot of these people, that is what's going on.
		They're desperate.
unidentified		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I just, it's so hard for me to jump full force into this because, again, it sounds like a fucking comic book.
		Like, this does not sound like it would happen in reality.
		Now, then again, of course, Trump is the president, so fucking who knows what could happen.
		But it seems just so insane to me that that would actually happen in real life.
		Just because at the same time, these guys seem so I don't know.
		Either they're amazing at their jobs or they're terrible at their jobs.
		There's no middle ground with these fucking idiots.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		So here's the article about Paul Manafort.
		A very effective way to conceal payment.
		We now know more about why Manafort offered private briefings to a Russian oligarch.
		Paul Manafort offered private briefings on the Trump campaign to a Russian oligarch in hopes of resolving a business dispute, a new report says.
		The dispute erupted as a result of a failed 2008 business deal.
		Manafort's representatives say the offer of private briefings never materialized, which is irrelevant in terms of motivation.
		Former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort offered private briefings about the campaign to Russian oligarch Oleg Deripaska in hopes of resolving a years-long business dispute, sources told Bloomberg on Wednesday.
		The dispute stemmed from a failed business deal the two pursued in 2008 involving a Ukrainian TV company called Black Sea Cable, according to Bloomberg.
		Legal complaints filed by Deripaska's representatives in the Cayman Islands in 2014 say he gave Paul Manafort $19 million to invest in the company, but the project fell through and Manafort all but disappeared without paying back Deripaska.
		Deripasca's representatives were openly accusing Paul Manafort of fraud and pledging to recover the money from him as recently as early 2016, according to the Associated Press.
		But they reportedly backed off on accusations shortly after Manafort joined the campaign in the spring.
		So you have situations like this.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That seems pretty open and shut, then.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Or at least it's fucking, you need a good excuse if it's not the truth.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, that's obvious.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's obviously what happened.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Any other conclusion is outside of the pale.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It would be baffling, another conclusion.
unidentified		Yeah, yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So what I'm saying is that we have these things that are starting to come up.
		And who knows?
		Like I said, I don't know Steve Pieczenik's game in it as a whole.
		I don't know exactly what Roger Stone's hand is in it.
		Right.
		But there are the lifting of sanctions on Russia and oil would have netted billions of dollars.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So on that end, they could have had a piece of that.
		That's possible.
		Or just, I mean, it's pretty clear to me, based on Steve Pieczenik's things that he's said, he...
		He has a soft spot for Russia and likes them.
		So the idea of being able to work with them more, it not being illegal, that might be his motivation.
		I don't know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I just can't jump on board with a global conspiracy whenever we're fighting against a global conspiracy.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't think it's globalists.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Somebody who believes in globalists.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think it's very localized.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The whole thing is just part of another larger chain, though.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, if you're going to say that Stone and Pieczenik are both manipulating Alex in coordination with each other, then you have to get into the larger group of 45.
unidentified		Do they all know about 45 group?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There's not 45 members because group of 45 makes it sound like there's 45 members.
		I have no idea how many people are in it.
		But they've talked about it in the middle of the day.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No Bill Volume 1, the crazy 88 situation.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It talked better be 88 members.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They've talked about it openly.
unidentified		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So then you have to say that, well, that entire group is probably, at the very least, had a conversation about it, or they've reported on it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You've got to assume Flynn and Sessions are probably in there, too.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So now you have Flynn and Sessions who are both coordinating also with multiple different governments.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, they have been.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, exactly.
unidentified		They have been.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So now we're dealing with a global conspiracy.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But you really need to get it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And I just don't see how they can successfully pull that out.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They're not in the same way as the globalist conspiracy that Alex projects because that involves, you know, like poisoning the water and trying to take away our virility and stuff like that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's the stuff that's bullshit.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And this is making a shit ton of money.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		All of these things, the motivation is very clearly just selfishness and self-empowerment.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And that is a global conspiracy that's based entirely on that makes more sense than otherwise.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It still doesn't make a lot of sense, but it makes more sense.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Is it really that easy?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's very frustrating to me.
		Is that what you can do?
		Can you actually just do a global conspiracy?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What are you doing?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If you get enough connections, is it all of a sudden like, hey, let's make a billion dollars off of sanctions lifting by electing the worst president in the history of the world that takes forever that we couldn't possibly have done.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That barely happened in the first place.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And a couple of us are flaming bigots, so we'll just distract everybody with all sorts of weird taking away birth control and outlawing 20-week abortions and shit like that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		We'll get everyone hot and bothered and distracted with that while we rake in millions.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And then the desperate.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Or have our millions forgiven in debt.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It has to be, like, if you're going to put that motive in there, it has to be desperation because their percentage of success had to have been astronomical.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Well, like, imagine if our media actually functioned even slightly.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But that's part of your calculations.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		But even a little bit.
		If they had given Trump a billion in free advertising instead of two billion in free advertising, would we still be in the same place?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Do you know?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't know.
		Probably.
		I think so.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Do you think it was inevitable?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think so.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You think so?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Probably.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Do you think the Trump thing from start to finish was inevitable?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Maybe.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's entirely.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I can see a situation where that's correct as well.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think we'll know more as time goes on, but I think it's entirely possible.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I mean, in terms of Gambridge Analytica, in terms of the micro-targeting of people, in terms of these Russian companies buying weird ads that seem to have to do with our domestic issues.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Who would have guessed?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Trying to cause people to be racist.
		Right, right.
		Or try to inflame people's racism towards Trump or to get them towards Trump by inflaming it.
		I think that a lot of those things do make it much more inevitable.
		I think that there certainly was a way that people could have fought back against it more effectively, but everyone was too busy fighting.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I just don't like I don't like that narrative because that is that is the people with information defeating the people without it.
		And I just don't like that worldview.
		Or in this case, it's the people the insanely rich defeating the poor, which makes more sense, but the way that they did it was such an effective targeted propaganda campaign that I just don't want to believe that people are that good at something like that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think a lot of people are.
		And you've got to consider that Roger Stone is one of the sleaziest players in the game.
		He's the Ric Flair of politics.
		So, like, he's dirty as hell.
		And why would you not think that that would be his modus operandi?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Why would you not think that pulling off something really fucked up and sleazy is exactly what he's all about?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Like, I know that he and Trump have been friends for a long time and all that, and that explains sort of his proximity, but his involvement implies much worse.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Like, the idea that he was actively involved in stuff.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If I'm going to do an autopsy, my first kill as far, not kill, I mean, my first suspect or the prime mover, so to speak, is Mercer.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And I think this will go down in history as the first time that artificial intelligence beat humanity.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's what I think.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Didn't Blue beat Kasparov?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's not artificial intelligence.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It couldn't improvise in that regard.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Fine.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But I do think that Cambridge Analytica is the secret.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think that's one of the biggest pieces.
		And the Mercers are behind all sorts of shit like this.
		But at the same time, I think that I would not put it past the idea that the 45 group might even be affiliated with him in some way.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, Roger Mercer.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I mean, if we're going to go against a guy who thinks Soros is behind everything, I'm not going to insist that Mercer is behind everything.
unidentified		No.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		However, I do have the inklings of an episode of Doctor Who, wherein they go back in time and they realize that Mercer is actually just a robot who is being controlled by the silence or whatever.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, I mean, go, everyone, if you haven't at this point, go read that BuzzFeed article about the emails that leaked from Breitbart about Milo Yiannopoulos and his connection and whitewashing of Nazi and white supremacist sources.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And then go read the Guardian article about Cambridge Analytica and their intense, intense campaign.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And put those two together and realize that they're the same people.
		Yep.
		And consider that they are working in allegiance and in concert with Alex Jones and InfoWars.
		It's just slightly disconnected.
		Because, I mean, look at it.
		Milo's come on Alex's show.
		They're friends.
		They're buddies.
		He loves Bannon.
		He thinks Bannon's a genius.
		On a recent episode, he's talking about how the fourth turn is coming.
		That's a big piece of Bannon's ideology.
		So, like, all of this is connected.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		See, I started off with the whole global conspiracies are dumb, and now I'm right in a place where it's like all of these outlets, all of these media outlets are connected and creating this loop, and they're all funded by rich old white billionaires and Betsy Devos, who can go fucking hang herself.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I hope she dies.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I really hope she dies.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, I have some good news.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like Scalise.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So in that last clip, one of the things that we lost track of that was really important is that Steve Pieczenik knows that Alex Jones got information from Roger Stone and Roger Stone.
		Absolutely.
		And that Roger Stone got him the appearance with Trump.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There's no indication that he should know that.
		Alex has never said that on air.
		And the fact that Steve knows it means that he knows.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So that suggests that Roger has told someone.
		Or at least somebody in the there is a middleman.
		There is a connection between the two.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So now we've had Steve butter up Alex.
		He's flattered him a bit, and now he flatters him a little bit more.
		And in this clip, he does something very intentional, and we'll talk about it on the other end.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		This cannot continue.
		We do not have a Congress, a president, or a military and intelligence that is viable and concerned about our national security.
		And that's where America has to have the American Revolution in a way that's productive and constructive.
		Why you are important and why Trump was important is you are the game changer.
		You are the expression of that American revolution in the 21st century.
		To allow the truth to come out, St. Augustine said, don't worry about the truth.
		Let it do what it does best to destroy those who distort the truth.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So what he does there is, first of all, it's interesting that he says that why you are important and Trump was important, using the past tense for Trump is very strange.
		I think it might have been an accident.
		But the other thing is that he inexorably ties Alex and Trump together as being the forces of this new revolution.
		So at this point, Alex is still not really, like, he hasn't come out gung-ho for Trump.
		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But if Pieczenik is putting the two of them together as being proponents of this American Revolution, this 1776 2.0, that puts into Alex's brain, we are of the same ilk.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah.
		We're bras.
		So, I mean, like, December 1st of 2015 is when Trump came on his show.
		And that is, you know, seven days before, oh, I'm sorry.
		December 2nd is when he came on.
		He knew on December 1st.
		On the show, he's talking about how I got a big guest for tomorrow.
		It's going to be big.
		I don't want to tell you who it is.
		Wink.
		But then on the 3rd, he goes so far as to still say that he loves Rand Paul, he supports Rand Paul, but that Trump is okay.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And it was cool that he came on his show.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So four days before.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, that's a false flag.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Four days before this, he is still saying the same stuff that we'd already heard.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And even after Trump had been on, he didn't go full on.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I don't think that was actually Trump.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I think that was a crisis actor.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It could have been.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Check his earlobes.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, exactly.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So Steve is needing to connect them even further in order for this point to get home.
		And that's the job he's doing on this December 7th episode.
		He's tying them together.
		Your fates are entwined.
		You are the game changer that will help bring the American Revolution to pass.
		That's fucked up.
		That's really hard to like, I can't do it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		What's really interesting to me about that is it seems as though everybody, or not everybody, but everybody who's trying to influence things and everybody who is looking at things from a I don't know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If you want to say that Pieczenik is rational, he is making the same point that I would be making from a different perspective, but the system is utterly and completely broken.
unidentified		Yes.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It is destroying everything.
		So his point is we need to destroy the system and rebuild it.
		So if we're going to go with that as his motive, then the only difference between he and I is spectrum.
		I think the system needs to be broken down and rebuilt in order to benefit the poorest.
		And he disagrees.
		He thinks it needs to be broken down and rebuilt to benefit the wealthy only.
		But what boggles my mind about those people is that it is already done.
		So what is it that he wants to how is it that you can break down and rebuild the system to benefit the rich even more other than creating a new feudal society?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think that might be it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He wants to be protectorate in Florida, is what you're saying?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Larry Nichols said, you know, if you're in the Senate, you become a duke.
		He was actually bluffing.
		It's just if you're rich, you become a duke.
unidentified		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He wants to become a vassal.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Interesting.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't know.
		It's tough to say.
		In this next clip, the last one we've got from December 7th, again, a day that will live in infamy.
		Alex almost realizes that he's being fucked with.
		He almost realizes.
		See if you can give me the high sign if you can tell where Alex almost gets it.
		And then he's like, nah, you're great, Steve.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		And I just wanted to send it out to Pieczenik briefly and get his brief response.
		He's got to go and we've got to go.
		He was on a few months ago, and he said, you know, at the CFR and all the rest of it, I fed the line that Jeb Bush should run, knowing that once he got back in, we used 9-11 on him.
		And then I see Trump start using 9-11 on him, and then I have some discussions.
		I'll just leave it at that.
		And that's indeed what they're doing is basically baiting the media in to attack him as a 9-11 truther.
		And then he's going to destroy the Clintons and the Bushes with it.
		But they were smart enough.
		It got real big.
		And then crickets, no stories.
		2,000-plus stories, and then no stories.
		The word went out, shut that down.
		So now, obviously, I can let everybody in on the hat trick because, you know, now this particular cast of the fishing rod lure was somewhat successful, but not fully successful.
		Plus, it's good to let them know that they're not the only ones that play games.
		Okay, so I'll just leave it at that.
		And again, I'm not here with some agency.
		I'm not being advised by people.
		I'm just here common sense.
		And then I talk to a Pachenek, and then I talk to some other people, and they're on the same page, and I wonder if they know each other.
		Pieczenik says they don't.
		But it's just people that get what's going on and know how to respond to it.
		But that is pretty exciting, Pieczenik.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		They say the stuff, and it's like, do they know each other?
		And I'm like, oh, they probably.
		He said it.
		This noted psych warfare master.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And the world's greatest dirty trickster.
		The two of them say they don't know each other, but they're suspiciously telling all the same things that deny credibility.
		Right, right.
		Like beyond the pale of reality.
		Like, legitimately, Steve Pieczenik ends up saying that Donald Trump just wants to become president to straighten things out, and then he's going to disappear.
		He's going to be president.
		He might even step down after he fixes everything.
		He doesn't really want to be president.
		He doesn't want to be president.
		He just knows that they need to fix this.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Loki and the Oracle are together fighting.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Fighting against everything.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's nonsense.
		It's complete bullshit.
		And that moment right there where Alex is like, I got other people telling me the same things, and I think they know each other, but they don't.
		It's like, dude, come on.
		Do better.
		You're right there.
		I'm watching his face, too, and he's like, he's like making a face like he's processing it and he just can't finish the job.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I mean, Pieczenik's on the show.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If Pieczenik weren't on at that moment, do you think he could have made the connection?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, he's got to starfuck Pachenek.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So if Pachenek's not there.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Not if he's being rude during a hurricane.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But that's after the opportunity.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		We're saying that Las Vegas isn't real.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But that's after the operation in quotes is complete.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I mean, at a certain point, like at this point, Pachenek might as well say that Las Vegas, the city, isn't even real.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I've never been there.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I can't prove it's real.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I was there once, but that could have been a false flag.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Could have been race money.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They could have built it just so when I showed up, they were like, oh, look how real it is.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I've heard of that happening to a lot of people.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, absolutely.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It happened at Sandy Hook.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Totally.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I don't even think it's a real city.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So we're going to talk now about December 29th, where Steve Pieczenik comes back.
		There's going to be two things that happen on the 29th, because we talked about the 29th already.
		But we missed some things.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Christmas.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Certainly it's coming up.
		Or just happened.
		Whoops.
		Just happened.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Do they do a Christmas episode?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
		There's a war on Christmas.
		You think they're not going to do a Christmas episode?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, I mean on Christmas.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't think so.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But they did do a New Year's Eve episode, which we're going to cover later.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I would give anything to hear them try and do a merry-grant.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I know!
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		or like or like do a time out what i want more than anything right now yeah is the muppets christmas album but replace john denver with alex jones That would be amazing.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I want them to do a live reading of a Christmas carol, but just rewrite it as they see how that would work.
		Like, Scrooge is a fucking maker, and this motherfucker is just trying to get a day off?
		What is this?
		Bullshit?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		These ghosts are invading his personal trying to make him get rid of private property.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		These ghosts are against prosperity.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		A conservative Christmas carol would have him shoot a ghost.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, a libertarian.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He would pull a shotgun out and be like, intruder, and shoot the ghost, and that would be the end.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's interesting that you think he's conservative, because on this 29th episode, he has something to say about his political leanings.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I just oppose totalitarianism.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I'm not anti-Islam, but I'm against funding radical Islam to take over the world.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And all Islamic people.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		And then using the threat of it to take my freedoms and my family's freedoms.
		I mean, I'm a real liberal, folks.
		I'm a constitutionalist.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Thomas Jefferson was a liberal.
		I'm that kind of liberal.
		Not the modern liberals with political correctness saying, ban.
		I'm dreaming of a white Christmas.
		And they're actually doing that and saying if a white person wants to eat Chinese food, it's cultural appropriation.
		They're actually banning that at universities.
		I mean, you cannot be banned.
		People are resigning on a new blacklist.
		Because they said we're not going to ban Halloween.
		Get over it.
		People being offended by people in cowboy outfits.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's not their favorite tyrant.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Dressed like a Nazi.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		And I'm a real liberal.
		People call me a libertarian, right-winger, whatever, because I'm pro-gun.
		The definitions are all scrambled.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He's a classical liberal.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Classical liberal.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So let's get to it.
		Steve Pieczenik comes back on on this 29th episode.
		And at this point, Alex has transformed, and he has decided he likes Trump.
unidentified		Yes.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		As we saw on December 15th.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And on this episode, it is where I tracked it down.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		This is where the soft coup narrative starts.
unidentified		Okay.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So now let's enjoy watching Alex get lied to in real time and not realize at all how hard he's getting played.
		You'll see it all.
		You'll see the moments.
		This is sad.
		This is really fucking sad.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		We have had a military-to-military Military relationship with the Russians that has been outstanding since 91.
		Now, contrary to the neocons, contrary to the narratives of civilians who would like to say they bombed the Russians, or it's a Russian conspiracy.
		That's absolutely.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		And that's why the political class wants to talk about war with Russia in these debates.
		They're so angry that the U.S. military is defying them.
		And I'm not trying to lionize the U.S. Army especially, but it's exactly what you said here a decade ago.
		They are literally the best patriots we've got.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So at this point, what I think is happening there in code is that Steve Pieczenik knows damn well that a lot of the people in the campaign have connections to Russia, and he is pre-inoculating the idea that, oh, yeah, of course, they're going to be attacking Russia there, but it's secretly because.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Is he picking 2001 because of 9-11?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Is that what he's saying?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He said 91.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, he said 91.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, 91.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		After the Berlin Wall came down, I believe.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I gotcha.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, a few years after that.
		But, yeah, I think that what he's doing is he's putting that into Alex's head, the narrative in advance that, like, look, Russia's great.
		Russia's great.
		Which Alex already is inclined to believe.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That just doesn't make any sense, though.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What do you mean?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I mean, everything.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Point by point, lay it out.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What do you mean?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I mean, if he's saying that there was a military-to-military cooperation, the Russian military and our military and Putin.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's that same thing with Assad.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's the same thing with the idea that Assad had a trilateral agreement with our military.
unidentified		Yeah, yeah, yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You know where that comes from.
		Let's finish this clip.
		You'll see where it comes from.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Holding back so much of this.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Well, you have to understand.
		I mean, when I worked in government, my primary position was always as a military officer.
		When I went into intelligence, was trained in that at MIT.
		And at Harvard, that was a secondary position.
		But I was proud to be in intelligence.
		And of course, then I am a psychiatrist.
		But my loyalty has always been to the Republic, as it has been for Martin Dempsey, as it has been for General Flynn, for many other generals who supported our American positions and understood that our civilian leaders, remember, most of them have not been to war.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So a lot of these ideas are likely coming from people like Michael Flynn.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So he went to MIT.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He was a military officer.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Then he went to MIT and Harvard and was trained in Intel?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I guess so, yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He's a psychiatrist.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And he's a psychiatrist.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Does MIT have a co-intel program?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, what is going on here?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I guess so.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I mean, if you base it on what we're getting from this, yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Is that true?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Can I apply?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I would go to MIT for fucking psych warfare.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That sounds awesome.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think you've got to get recruited.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You think so?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like Alex Jones' dad?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Or it doesn't exist and you pretend you got recruited.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's another good one.
		Is that all you have to do?
		These guys are fucking crazy.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's pretty wild.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If they're successfully pulling this shit off based on all of these lies and all that shit, God, this would make a great movie.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		One day it will be.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		This would make an insanely good movie.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		One day it will, absolutely.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		This is like Tinker Taylor Soldier Spy, except it's real, and we won't let Gary Oldman play any of the characters.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And the biggest mouthpiece of it is often drunk on air.
		He's a notorious bigot who likes the taste of whiskey.
		So in this next clip, we get to a little bit more of the counter-coup narrative.
		Because he mentioned soft coup in that last clip a little bit.
		And that's the soft coup is, I guess, Hillary taking power or something like that.
		And then the counter-coup is what Steve Pieczenik is involved in.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Let me throw this in then.
		How seismic is it that we've had a huge, basically military counter coup against the civilian insane people who are like a compulsive gambler at a slot machine trying to conquer and start wars they can't win.
		I mean, this is such a big deal to have it confirmed that our own military went around Obama and the neocons and gave the Russians and the Syrians all the authorization and info they needed to defeat al-Qaeda and ISIS.
		And I've met with a bunch of special forces people, current duty, you name it.
		They're all completely awake now.
		I mean, the system has a big problem.
		I don't see how they're going to put this back in the bottle.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Well, let me put it this way.
		I would call this, or we call this, a soft coup.
		A soft coup, meaning that we haven't overthrown the president.
		We don't intend to overthrow the president.
		There's not a violence involved.
		There are not going to be guns in the street.
		But, Alex, the same way you change the narrative of the media, what's happening now, thanks to the bravery of these men who've been in our military and our Navy, and also the men who were fired in Benghazi and the stand down in AFRICOM and the naval officers who were involved.
		All these people stood up and had their day in court and continue to have that.
		Some are heard, some aren't.
		But you have to remember, our democracy and our republic is a very fluid entity.
		It's not static.
		It doesn't stay.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		And I agree.
		So the truth is out in the public opinion.
		The military, system-wide, is saying no to the tyranny.
		What is that doing to the more corrupt elements of the establishment?
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Well, they're getting scared.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		And what happened is because of your ability to articulate, and our military willing to stand in the middle of the middle.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Please stop loving me in the credit.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I get 1% of the credit, sir.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Whoa, The platform gets it.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I know.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Alex, we've known each other for too long.
		This is not, you know, we're not bragging here.
		We're basically saying because of that narrative, you have a man like Trump come forward.
		Whatever he may or may not be, he is changing the entire dynamics of the Republic and the way they're getting elected.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Excuse me, Steve.
		You can keep blowing me, but don't stick your finger up my ass, okay?
		That feels too good.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		At least not on air.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Jesus.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He's essentially saying that because of you and your narrative ability.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Hey, Trump can arrive.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You have created Trump.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If you created Trump, well, God damn it, if you don't want to be part of Trump.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		And he's already jumped on board at this point.
		So it's more aggrandizing Alex and compromising him with flattery.
		So you'll believe this soft coup narrative.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, on a day-to-day basis, what does a guy like Steve Pieczenik do?
unidentified		Like, just like as a day-to-day thing.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I bet he likes to read.
		I bet he likes to, I don't know, he lives in Florida.
		Maybe he golfs.
		I don't know.
		He's a retired dude.
		I don't know what he does.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's what schemes.
		I know.
		It has to be him.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's kind of scheming.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It has to be him like in a fucking office just writing out reams upon reams of possible like or he's got a whiteboard like Steve Bannon.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like there's no there's no way that he can just come on these shows and pull off this bullshit.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's one of the I think it's actually pretty easy when you're dealing with Alex.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		If he already likes you and respects you.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So far we aren't having any trouble.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, whenever he likes you and respects you, as long as you keep being like, you're the most important person in the world, you're so amazing.
		Now, let me tell you this.
		He's going to go along with it.
		He's never going to push too hard back on things with a person like Steve.
		And when this falling out about the Las Vegas thing happened, it didn't even happen with Alex.
		It happened with David Knight.
		If he'd said that on Alex's show, I don't know what would have happened.
unidentified		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That would have been fucking awesome.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		Alex can respond to it when a caller asks him about it, but put in the hot seat that David Knight got put in.
		I don't know what Alex would have done.
		He would have been like, that's interesting.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Probably.
		And then hit that fucking commercial button.
		But jamming that button.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like with what you talked about on Thursday.
		Whenever, who was it that brought it up?
		And they went immediately to commercials.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Once Paul Joseph Watson brought up.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		PJW, yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		When he fucking pulled that shit up and Alex Jones was like, yeah, nope, false flag, Mike, Matt.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He's really good at that.
		Yeah.
		So in this.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Two shooters.
		I know PJW said it wasn't two shooters, but there's two shooters.
		Bye.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't want to fire this guy so commercial.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Bye.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So in this next clip, Steve fakes his phone being fucked with, like his tradition on InfoWars.
		They love to do that.
		They love to fake hacks.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He's being hacked.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And at the end of this clip, I think that you can pretty well assume that Roger Stone and Steve Pieczenik are working together.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think it comes out in this clip.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Don't the crooks in the establishment know when they threaten you or me, all that does is make us double down?
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Don't they know our psychology?
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		No, because they have it.
		You see, I'm getting interfered with right now, just while I'm talking to you.
		They're jamming me on this phone.
		And this is a hard line.
		I'm not being paranoid.
		I just know it.
		I think you hear that?
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		No, it's probably just on your side or something.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		It's on my side, but they're jamming me on this side because this is an undisclosed number, my friend.
		The point is, these are obsessional politicians who've never had real-life experience.
		Obama is created, developed, and nurtured by the CIA.
		He doesn't know anything else.
		He's not a man of strategy.
		He's not a conceptual man.
		He's not a great thinker.
		He's a man who's been told what to do.
		He's a fucking offensive state.
		And he lies pathologically in a way that absolutely stuns me.
		He makes Nixon look like he was the most honest man I've ever met.
		Obama has repeatedly lied about it.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Well, let me throw this.
		Got more time, and I skipped the break, and I'm going to quit doing this because it's so important.
		Let me throw this at you, Dr. Pachenek.
		Yes, go.
		Here's an example.
		You brought up Mr. Stone with the Trump camp.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Correct.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I mean, really, he's like the head of the campaign, but he's out of it for other reasons, obviously.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Correct.
unidentified		I mean, this guy obviously has timeout right there.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Steve Pieczenik's response to that is correct.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He's out of it for other reasons.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Steve Pieczenik knows what's going on.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		So that presupposes that Alex has talked to Stone.
		Stone has said he's basically running the campaign.
		He had to leave for other reasons.
		That means that he talked to.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Alex knows the reasons.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right, I can be more effective outside than inside.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Or whatever.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But that could also just be bullshit.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Steve, if he didn't have some awareness, his instinctual response would not be to respond correct.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The fact that he responds correct leads me to believe that he already knew.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But at the same time, okay.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I have to be the worst skeptic here.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		All right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Stone, it's entirely possible Stone left because Stone is the worst person to have affiliated with your actual campaign.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And they wanted him gone.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Possibly.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, that's still a possibility.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And it's entirely possible if that's true.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't buy that at all.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		For Stone to insist that he's still running the campaign because he's Roger fucking Stone.
		He has to, at the very least, imagine that.
		In the same way that somebody who's kicked out of a, like, you know, the fifth Beatle was still like, I'm a big reason the Beatles were successful.
		You know, that fucking guy, whatever his fucking name.
		Yeah, there you go.
		But look, all of those things.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The end result is the same.
		It doesn't matter.
		You're arguing like a little bit of nuanced semantics, but like the end result of whether he was kicked out because he's too hot or something like that, or he left strategically in order to create a propaganda machine.
		The end result is he did create a propaganda machine in service of Trump.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's true.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So whatever the actual reason for it is, is irrelevant.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He still did succeed in doing that.
		I'm so pissed off that Pieczenik said that Obama wasn't a like say whatever you want about Obama.
		That man was a fucking thinker.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, he's substantial.
		Dare you.
		I know, but at the same time, there's a lot of people who come on Alex's show who say stuff like that, and they're like, well, that is code for racism.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't really think that was.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, Pachenek isn't doing that out of race.
		He's creating a false reality wherein a Trump can be considered.
		Trump has lied every day.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Every fucking day about fucking everything.
		And for him to say that Obama is lying and that Obama isn't a great thinker.
		Look, one of the big reasons that Obama wasn't a great president was because he was thinking too much.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Steve addresses this.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, God, what if fuck could he fucking say?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, Christ.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's in the next clip.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Let's finish this one first before we get to that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		All right.
unidentified		Correct.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I mean, really, he's like the head of the campaign, but he's out of it for other reasons, obviously.
unidentified		Correct.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I mean, this guy, obviously, top guy with Nixon, top guy with Bush, Senior, other folks.
		I mean, running major political operations in third world countries and highly respected.
		That's correct.
		It's obvious what the guy is and does.
		He came here before Trump came on, and I'm not going to get into the inside baseball of it, but he briefed me on stuff.
		And then when you came on and talked about him a few weeks later, you laid out everything he said word for word.
		But then went on and said, even though I haven't talked to him, you can see what's happened.
		And that's basically what he told me about this whole Fisher in the system.
		And Trump knows that.
		He was explaining, no, Trump's really for real.
		We're not going to let him break this country and destroy it.
		They're globalists.
		They want to roll us into this thing.
		And they want to have basically a corporate takeover and loot it.
		We're not going to allow it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		By which I mean that's what it is.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		It was just amazing to hear you then basically say what you knew he'd already told me.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		It's just very, very interesting to realize there's all these different camps in these different intelligence agencies.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		Well, the truth of the matter is there are those who believe in the truth.
		We're called truthers.
		And I take it not as an insult, but as a point of pride.
		And I think your entire audience should take that as a point of pride.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So instead of addressing any issues, he just flatters Alex and his audience.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		There are people that know the truth, and we're called truthers.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Mainly because all we believe in is insane.
unidentified		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So, okay, so Alex even fucking maps it out perfectly.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You told me what Roger Stone already told me.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And you knew that he had already told me.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And you knew he had already told me.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He accidentally phrases it that way when that's supposed to not be what he believes.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He's so close to working.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's exactly right on.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He's so close.
		And the whole, like, watching it is painful.
		Like, watching the actual video of it is like, it's like, have you ever seen a video of a dog falling off a dock?
unidentified		Like, like.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So there are videos that you can find.
		I've seen it once in a while in my life where it's a dog who's hanging off a dock and it's scrambling with its paws trying to stay on the dock, but its lower half is falling off.
		It's just, you know, that dog's fallen off the dock, but it's trying so hard.
		That's what it's like to be to watch Alex Jones be lied to by Steve Pieczenik and almost get it.
		There's those moments where he's like, you're telling me the same things Roger Stone told me and you knew that he told me and like, you're not going to get there.
		You're falling off that dock.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		What I see is a cat.
		I see it's one of those videos of the cat where it's like, I know I can get the top of that refrigerator.
		Can jump from this table to the top of that refrigerator.
		And then, right as it's about to go, it's like, uh-oh, my paws are slippery, and it goes right down.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There are similarities.
		There are similarities.
		Yeah.
		It's just sad to me.
		It's really sad because you see the sort of jump-off point of where life could have been entirely different.
		Like, the world could be different.
		If Alex Jones had been against Trump, I don't think he would have won.
		And that's not to say that Alex is the reason that Trump.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, I know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I know.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's enough of a population that had he not.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The margins were razor thin.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And if he had just either been neutral like he was in the Obama-McCain election, or if he had been against Trump because, hey, they tried to run a psyop on me or something like that, it would have made a huge difference.
		And quite frankly, I think Alex Jones is going crazy, and his entire operation has descended into bigot-filled madness since 2015.
		Like before, it was still bigoted.
		Don't get me wrong.
		But the level is so much higher now, and the rhetoric is so dangerous that I think we could have saved everybody a lot of trouble if that dog would have got on that dock.
		Like if some miracle would have happened and he would have realized, fuck, Steve Pacheco and Roger Stone are clearly like, why are they pretending not to know each other?
		Yet they say he even says word for word, verbatim, the same stuff.
		If he would have just put the pieces together, I'm not going to say he could have saved the world.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, I mean, well, if we're working under the operating position of neoliberalism is perhaps the root cause of all of this, then it would be still neoliberalism.
		Well, yeah.
		Well, which is neoliberalism isn't good.
		Neoliberalism is conservative almost as bad as conservatism.
		So, I mean, Hillary as president would have had the same result as Obama as president, wherein we're just pushing these people into more and more of a frenzy.
		So it's entirely possible that this was inevitable, that Trump is the inevitability of a broken Democrat or Republican capitalist, what?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Crypto-kleptocratic nation?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Maybe.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, if we're going to look at this from a tides of history standpoint, which we really have to, because if you dive into the day-to-day, this is all unreal.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, this is unreal.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, in 2017, we might as well be watching fucking gladiatorial combat in the goddamn Coliseum while fucking an emperor puts his thumb up and down on people.
		Like, this is fucking insane.
		So look at it from a tide of history standpoint, and you see all of these little pieces coming together, which perhaps made what is really going on an inevitability.
		And instead of saying that it's Trump or it's Mercer or it's all of these things, you can really point to all of these historical inertia factors that are just pushing us ever closer to complete fucking total collapse.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Can I poke holes in your intellectualizing a tiny bit?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Please.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't think it matters.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Fair.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That is a fair point.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, I mean, it is interesting to, and I think 20 years from now, that's a fun conversation to have.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But the reality is, whatever happened did happen.
		Right.
		And whether Trump and this sort of, you know, like you described, kleptocratic, unhinged, unhinged, meaning in the way I mean.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Unchecked capitalism.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, no, not even that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Like, untethered to ideology, even really.
unidentified		Right, right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's not even, like, it would be easier if he was just a white supremacist.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Because then you'd be like, oh, that's what you believe in.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		As opposed to, like, I'm going to take advantage of some of the, I mean, I have leanings towards white supremacy.
		I'm going to take advantage of that block as best I can.
		Yeah.
		The untethered, ideological, steal everything, gin up and really excite these dangerous, conservative militia types.
		Whether that's inevitable doesn't matter.
		Because the Mercers did do this.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Alex Jones did do this.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Trump is.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Trump is the person.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I am so mad that Barbara 45.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The 5 Club and the 45 Club is in play.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If Barbara Tuchman wasn't like in her 70s, goddammit, she would write the greatest book about this.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Also, I will.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		We're not going to live that long.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I will write it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It takes a while to write a book, Dad.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I will write it if people just fucking donate and not have to have a job.
		I have a lot of thoughts.
		Anyway, we have one more clip of Steve Pieczenik before we get into something that I think is fun and is a little bit of a departure to end the episode.
		But here is the last clip of Steve Pieczenik.
		And again, Alex does not get the picture that he's being played.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Whoever Trump is, he is a force to contend with, and he will not tolerate this kind of non-I'm going to give out some not secret stuff, but I'm going to give out just the facts that is now out.
		I was told months ago that Trump would go after Hillary on the rape stuff with protecting Clinton.
		I was told that they were waiting for them to attack on 9-11 and think Trump was weak on that.
		And then Trump's ready to just absolutely annihilate him with it because they don't know they've lost all credibility.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Also, just fun to remember that on 9-11, Trump's response was, now my building looks bigger.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He said that on air when he was interviewed on the TV news.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Now I have the tallest building in New York.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, and so the idea that he could be like, your brother was president on 9-11.
		Like, well, what did you actually say?
		Like, the idea that that's a good trap, I don't know if it's not.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		There are no traps.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		There is nothing.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, but also, how fucking fun would it have been if Alex Jones' fantasy scenario that Roger Stone has clearly fed him?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They're trying to lure Jeb into this so Trump can be like, what about Building 7?
unidentified		If that became the debate, holy shit.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That would be amazing.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Then I would have voted for Trump.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I don't know about that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Anyway, let's get through the rest of this clip.
unidentified		Okay.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		And Trump basically has been recruited by Patriots.
		He didn't want to do it, by the way, on a political, what they know could be a suicide mission.
		And people, real statesmen don't tell you all this stuff, folks.
		Okay.
		I mean, most of the people are cowards.
		They can be intimidated.
		Whatever you want to say about it.
		Believe me, they wouldn't let me know some of this stuff if it wasn't the case.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They wouldn't lie to me like this.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		They have recruited him on a suicide mission to try to save America.
		Trump believes the narrative.
		The narrative's real.
		It trumps all these other fake people.
		We've got to bet on it.
		And then you came on when I hadn't even gone, talked about this shit or had Trump on, and you already basically knew all about it.
		But not even though you knew him, you understood the narrative because it was the truth and a way out of it.
steve pieczenik ▲ ● ▼		And I am so fortunate as America is, and you are, to have Trump come forward, spend his time, his energy, his money.
		He doesn't need to do this, but he sees, and this is a very smart individual.
		I'm not talking only book smarts.
		He's incredibly shrewd.
		He understood what happened in 9-11 because he knows Silverstein.
		He knows the World Trade Center better than anybody.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Who cares?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Why would he know the World Trade Center better than everybody?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Anyone.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Other than abject hatred for it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So then again, I mean, you saw that right there.
		He almost got it.
		The dog just fell off the dock.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		See, the thing is, he was told Trump is going to go after 9-11.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Trump is going to go after the rapes.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Obviously, Roger Stone told him.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Obviously, somebody in the campaign told him.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It was Roger.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So, I think that's the only person that he had access to at this point.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, you've sold me on the two of them working together.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No shit.
		It's fucking obvious.
		Why did you fight with me so much at the top of the?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Because we didn't know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I didn't know the rest of the part, and I just don't believe that people are successful.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I would like to tell you that an hour and 20 minutes ago, I said a lot of this is about Clips.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's not the point that I'm going to play.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, but I can't trust you.
		What's the show?
		I wait for an hour and 20 minutes to talk.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's been like 10 months of us doing this.
unidentified		You have to know that I have a plan.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I'm not going to make a bold assertion at the beginning.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I'm not going to back up.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		See, now this is why we have the open of you know a lot about Alex Jones and I don't know anything about Alex Jones.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's my job.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Fair enough.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So I think we can put the baby to bed in terms of Roger Stone and Steve Pieczenik were working together pretty early on.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And I am.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Is there any way that we can prove that concretely?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Without hacking their emails, no.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		See, that's the thing, because if we actually have concrete proof of that, that's a whole different story.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The problem is, it is obvious.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Alex gives amazing circumstantial proof.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, exactly.
		It's obvious that they were working together, but we can't pull up.
		Look, if we're in court, no judge is going to be like, well, obviously Alex Jones' show is a perfect evidence.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, unless I'm the judge.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And then I'll be like, oh, he's guilty.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Or if Judy's the judge, I bet we could crush that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Or if it's Reinhold.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, man.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Imagine if we went on TV with Alex Jones as like a Judge Judy show.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Or Judge Mills Lady.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Knowledge fight is suing InfoWars.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Small claims.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		My small claim is that he's made some big claims.
unidentified		Yeah, we would like a couple of grand.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Anyway, I think we would be the defendants in any sense.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I think we sue the shit out of him.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, absolutely.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think once he realizes that conceivably we are the people who are doing the most potent, dangerous work about his credibility, I do think he might sue us for playing clips.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That would be fascinating.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Can we represent ourselves?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I will.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah, for sure.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Also, I'll be your lawyer.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You'll be mine.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I am going as a sovereign citizen, though.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
		I'd like to say up front: I do not recognize the authority of this court.
		I am showing up here as a representative for Dan Friesen, but I will be writing my name in lowercase letters.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Thank you very much.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, you can capitalize the first letter.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Not all of them.
unidentified		Fair.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Anyway.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And I do not have a signature, and I don't have any fingerprints anymore.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So, Alex Jones, this is a big piece of the 2015 investigation, and I think this is actually where we'll put it to bed.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I think you're right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Steve Pieczenik, Roger Stone in league with the mysterious 45 club, 45 group.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And the extraordinary gentleman.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yep.
		You got Sean Connery.
		Quatermain.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Naturally.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Forgot what's his personal name, yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Dr. Jekyll, of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The guy from 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Really?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Who's the Indian dude?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I don't know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Why would you pay attention to that movie?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I read the graphic novel.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, did you?
		Yeah.
		Never did that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		All right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Anyway, we have a little bit of a bonus.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Tom Cruise from the mummy, I guess now.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Sure, sure.
		We got a bonus here at the end.
		We are done with our 2015 investigation aspect of this episode.
		But in going back through, I re-listened to the December 29th episode.
		And because I did so, I realized that I turned it off too early because Alex Jones has his friend Kevin Booth on, who is the guy who was Bill Hicks' producer.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And the two of them are idiots.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Killed Lincoln.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right, absolutely.
		So the two of them are on because Kevin Booth has a guest, a friend who he had interviewed for an investigative film that he's doing.
		This guy was a gentleman by the name of Dr. Yeyla.
		And he has done a lot of work in terms of interviewing people who've defected from ISIS.
		Okay.
		And I actually have his bio pulled up here.
		Dr. Yeyla's research mainly focuses on terrorism, radicalization, and countering violent extremism.
		He has authored and co-authored several articles and books on the subject of terrorism and violence, including First Responders Guide to Professionally Interacting with Muslim Communities, Law Enforcement, Emergency and Firefighters, Understanding and Responding to Terrorism, a complete model to deal with terrorism and understanding and responding to terrorism.
		Dr. Yeyla over the years has interviewed cadres representing over 20 terrorist organizations.
		The ISIS defector interviews of late are unique in the world as he was one of the first researchers who managed to reach ISIS defectors and persuade them to talk about their stories openly.
		Editorially, in parentheses, I'm going to add this, without torture.
		Most of those were also video recorded for future documentaries.
		Ahmet S. Yala, Ph.D.
		That's a real degree.
		He formerly served as...
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He did get it from Sri Lanka, though.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He formerly served as professor and the chair of sociology department at Haran University in Turkey.
		Dr. Yeyla earned both his master's and PhD degrees in criminal justice and information science from the University of North Texas.
		Dr. Yeyla served as the chief of counterterrorism and operations division for the Turkish National Police.
		He's written multiple books, and at this point he is in hiding for the most part because of the incredibly dangerous work that he does.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, because he's the cultural revolution.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He's Dr. Feng Yulan, essentially.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And ISIS wants to kill him because he has talked to people who have defected from ISIS.
		He knows who those people are, and he's gotten information from them that they do not want to be out.
		Of course.
		So Kevin Booth was on with Alex, and the reason that I didn't get to this interview is because they have terrible tech difficulties, and I thought they just abandoned the interview.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I think it was smart for Kevin Federland to change his name after the whole Britney breakup.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I made a big mistake in not covering this interview, and I'm going to rectify that now.
		This interview is damning in many ways.
		And I'm going to start it with Alex Jones introducing the guest, Dr. Yeyla.
		And this is before he allows the guest to talk.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Wait, so Dr. Yella goes on Alex Jones' show.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Because of his relationship with Kevin Booth.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Kevin Booth has done a documentary where he went to Turkey and done a bunch of research.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So is Dr. Yella an insane person?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It seems so far what you've described to me is somebody who knows what the fuck he's talking about.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Let's see what happens when an actual scholar shows up accidentally on InfoWars.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Oh, but first.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So this is an accidental situation.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeyla did not know what he was getting into.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't think so.
		But also, here's how Alex Jones sets it up.
		It's important to take note of this because I think he would redo this afterwards if he could.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		You have gone into the most dangerous areas in South Central L.A. to Skid Row, to make your films that have aired on, I mean, you name it, Showtime, HBO, so many other channels.
		American Drug War 1 and 2 that I was honored to consult on.
		So folks know who Kevin Booth is.
		But Kevin recently just got back from Turkey.
		He lives in L.A. He's visiting family.
		He's a Texan, visiting family out in Fredericksburg.
		And he said, man, I've got incredible stuff from the Middle East.
		And then I was looking at who he was going to bring on the show in about 30 minutes.
		This particular doctor.
		And I was like, wait a minute, Joe Biggs knows who that is.
		This is the guy that's getting ISIS defectors to defect and expose that the West and the Turkish government and others are funding them.
		This guy's in hiding.
		This guy's really big.
		He's interviewed him and got a three-minute supercut.
		We're going to play here in a moment.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So, Alex Jones has suggested and presented this as he knows who this guy is.
		And he's saying that he's exposing that the U.S. and the he's getting people to defect from ISIS as opposed to interviewing defectors.
		I don't believe that he's getting people to defect.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I don't think he's not convincing people to defect, is he?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, not that I'm aware of.
		I don't know.
		I can't speak to that, but I don't think that's the case.
		I think he's researching terrorism and what causes people.
		They play the supercut, and he goes into some really interesting ideas about what are the biggest identifiers for what puts someone at risk of being joining ISIS.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And generally, it's having a family member who has been killed by U.S. drone strike or something like that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, who would have guessed?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Poverty.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There's the basically a lot of it is, well, you'd kind of expect that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		These are the motivations that end up driving people towards that.
		And he knows that from interviewing the people who have been like, this is too hot.
		I got to get out of here.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The way we reacted after World War I caused World War II.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The way we are reacting after 9-11 caused ISIS.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right, or even Desert Storm.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		If you want to go back even further.
		Absolutely.
		But I mean, then you get into like a chicken egg Chaikon.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Anyways, America created its own enemies.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But Alex Jones is presenting it as this guy is exposing that the West is funding ISIS and created ISIS.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He does not know that that is not what is going to be exposed in this interview.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I have two clips.
		They're a little long, but they're necessary.
		And I don't want to deprive them of context.
		This first one I have just labeled.
		Dr. Yeyla is not an info warrior.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Trying to get started here with your incredible historic interviews with these ISIS people.
		Please continue.
		Give us the big picture.
		In one of the interviews with Kevin, you talked about the fact that it's just unprecedented.
		I believe you said that ISIS is being used to basically take Syria away.
		I mean, what's the geopolitical aim here?
		Who's really behind ISIS, sir?
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		Okay, we had interviewed around 30 ISIS defectors as of now.
		And this question was one of the questions I asked them with Dr. Andre Pecker during our interview.
		I have three answers to this question.
		And most of the time, the defectors answered in similar ways.
		The first, they argue that Syria and Iran is behind ISIS.
		The second, Russia is behind ISIS.
		And the third, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and Turkey behind ISIS.
		The ISIS fighters or the terrorists who have been in the field and fought with ISIS think that those three countries are behind the laser or forcing factors behind ISIS.
		They think Syria, because Syria and Iran are acting together in the region, and they think that Assad is trying to show the whole world that if you do not work with me, you have to work with these animals.
		So here, have a request.
		Agreed.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I don't think there's any evidence that Assad's behind ISIS.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		This is what they say.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		I'm right now talking about the research.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		That was my next question.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		How do you know they haven't defected to you to give you this info?
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		This is through our connection and my past experience because I had interrogated and interviewed over 10,000 terrorists over the 20 years of time.
		It is basically based on our experience and the threat.
		And also, you can see and understand their stories are true through what they are talking through their narrative.
		For example, when I asked about Russia, they said there are Russian generals who are at the age of around 40, 45.
		They claim that they are retired from Russian military as generals.
		They converted to Islam, and right now they are fighting for the ISIS.
		And when they describe those generals, they were the ones who were making the critical decisions on the battlefield.
		And one of the fighters told me that I never trusted them because they were there in the name of Russia.
		I asked them if they were Chechen.
		He said, no.
		He's a real Boulonged Russian.
		And they are the ones who were stealing us towards the war.
		So I was kind of like checking through the interview.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So he's saying, because his accent is a little bit thick.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He's saying that there are 40 to 45-year-old Russian retired military personnel who are directing, who are leading ISIS.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, some parties.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		ISIS groups, ISIS battlefields.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They are making battlefield decisions.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He's saying that that is information that he has gotten from defected ISIS.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Defected ISIS members.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And whether or not you want to deem him credible or not is a decision that you have to make.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Or whether you deem the information that the person is giving him as credible is your decision.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So he is, like, I've looked into it a little bit.
		He does have an incredible track record and a 20-year history of interviewing.
		He said 10,000 terrorists interviewed over the years.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So he's consistently given three answers.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's Syria plus Iran.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It is Russia and it is Turkey.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Not ISIS.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and Turkey.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, those three answers are what he's consistently given by ISIS defectors.
		So you can either accept that as each one of them is getting different information.
		They're in cells as opposed to a unified group.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Or that's a big piece of it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I think that's exactly what's going on.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		ISIS isn't a group.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		ISIS isn't their thing.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		In the same way that, I mean, this is a terrible analogy to make because Alex would love me to make this analogy, but in the same way that Antifa isn't a group.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		ISIS isn't a group where they have like the heads of all the local ISIS chapters.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's not a real country.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's not a real nation.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So that's why we can see ISIS.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It is very likely a piece of it that is swayed by Russia.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Very likely there is a piece that's swayed by Iran.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Well, Syria is absolutely involved.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And we'll get to that in the next clip.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He actually has some really interesting proof of it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's hard.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So then we're talking about if that is possible.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It is.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's entirely possible that all three different types are being accurate.
unidentified		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's entirely possible that what's really going on with ISIS is that it is a loosely connected group of people who are then taking responsibility for so many different terrorist attacks because they are directed by their relative, you know, their battlefield generals, if you will.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And a lot of times they probably end up fighting with each other in ways that are unpredictable.
		Do you remember when the NWO happened in the WCW?
		It was pretty like.
		Remember when he was saying that it was like one big group, but then it ended up turning into the Wolf Pack and then Hollywood, the black and white, and then the Luchador World Order Hispanic group came around.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I gotcha.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There's something of that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Maybe there was a central idea to ISIS at one point, and then it became fractured.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		There's a whole lot of possibilities in terms of maybe it's just different groups of people who were looking for funding and different people came calling.
		It's possible.
		The only way you fight a war on this level is with money.
		And they all need money, and they don't necessarily work or live together.
		So if they don't have a centralized tax plan or whatever it is you want to go to, they all have to have money to support themselves.
		So they all have to find a way to get that money.
		And if their goals temporarily align with Russia, they get Russian money.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's like odd jobs.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They're mercenaries less than they are a cohesive ideology.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Ideologue mercenaries.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's like we want to get a caliphate, but we also will kill tons of people for you if you want us to.
unidentified		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They're the second sons.
		Right.
		So what they really want to do is.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You know, the only possibility that's not true in my mind, the only thing I'm excluding from my mind is that this guest is misrepresenting his research.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's agreed.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He is telling the truth in full blatant disregard for the rules of InfoWars.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Now, there's a couple things that I need you to remember that I think might have slipped your mind.
		This first one, probably not.
		And that is that Alex set it up by saying that America did it.
		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		America did it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And that this guest is great.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He has a great reputation.
unidentified		Of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		All this stuff.
		The second thing you almost certainly have forgotten.
		And that is that on December 29th, we covered this on the last 2015 episode.
		It begins with Alex Jones pretending that Infowars is being hacked.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Being hacked by the, he believes that it is the Turkish Gulen people.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And what have you.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I need you to keep that in your mind for what is going to happen two clips from now.
unidentified		Okay.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But it needs to be in your mind because I have a very strong theory about what is actually happening.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And it turns out I think he might have actually been hacked.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No shit.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I will be godfucking damned.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think he might have been.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So if you have it.
		Oh, my God.
		So he's got the Turkey guy on there.
		The Turkish army is looking for him.
		And they're going to go through that?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No.
unidentified		Okay.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Never mind.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Don't think it was the Gulen.
unidentified		All right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I jumped into it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think the suspect is wrong.
		Okay.
		But let's finish this clip.
unidentified		Sure.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		The only line I've seen on that, Doctor, is that the Russians in Cheshire and other areas basically try to run the radicals out and just say, get out of the country.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Again, he very specifically said he asked these people if they were Chechens.
unidentified		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And they said no.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Free.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		And some of them have then been coming to Syria, but I don't even think the CIA and others who've been caught up to their eyeballs working with ISIS and NATO have said that the Russians, well, that would be full-spectrum dominance if the Russians were running ISIS and countering ISIS.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Like what you accuse the globalists of doing.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Sure would be.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		I don't say running ISIS, but people in ISIS said that those three countries or those three groups that did have faith in it.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		You know, they were at least using ISIS for their own causes.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I was about to say, I don't know how ISIS would follow Russians.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I mean, I.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, boy, do I.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I sure know why they would do that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, now, let's take a step back.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He listed a total of like eight countries.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And the only one that Alex is sticking on is Russia.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right, of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's the only one that he is.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He doesn't even really necessarily fight back too hard on the idea of Syria or any of these other countries, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, obviously.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Saudi Arabia is obviously Saudi Arabia did 9-11.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And Iran probably is not worth fighting about, you know, like in terms of.
unidentified		Yeah, yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But he already hates Iran because of the Iran deal, so that's fine.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But he finds time in his busy schedule to argue that there's no way Russia is.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Well, if there's no way Russia, then there's no way Syria, because that's already his argument: Syria is Syria is part of Russia, essentially.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So now in this next clip, Dr. Yeyla pretty much lays out a very concrete case that Assad and ISIS are working together based on his experience.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And do you know what's awesome about somebody who knows what they're fucking talking about?
		When asked a direct question, he says, My proof is the people that I've talked to.
		He does not say, I know this is true.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He is still saying that he's copping to the idea that, like, I'm just reporting what I found in my research.
unidentified		Exactly.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's entirely possible.
		My data sample is not everybody.
		So it's entirely possible that this is not necessarily true.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Kind of what not liars do.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
		Isn't it weird?
		Alex must have lost.
		Alex must have been like, wait, wait, wait, you don't know 100%?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		His face.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I don't understand.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He's flummoxed throughout this.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Of course, well, he was quiet.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And Kevin Booth is there the entire time, and he knows to shut the fuck up.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah, yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He just brought a chaotic element into Alex's life.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And he's watching to Kevin is probably having the time of his life.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I imagine.
		And so I want to also be clear.
		At this point, that last clip.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I mean, except for when he was dating Britney Spears.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Oh, it was the best.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, so good.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Super ripped.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Papo, sow.
		That last clip was over Skype.
		And then Skype gets hacked.
		And so they have to do this next when they come back from commercial.
		Their Skype isn't working, and they have to use the phone.
		And so it sounds a little different, but also it's relevant to my theory.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Now, is he confident he's in the United States hiding?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I'm not confident of anything at this point.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		We have some technical difficulties.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You got to fucking watch out with your hand gesture.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Wherein I knocked over the webcam.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And spilled.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And spilled a shit ton of monster energy drink.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So if anybody would like monster energy drink, it is on Dan's floor.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And leg.
		Yeah, I'm confident that he's in the United States in so much as I don't really care to wrestle with it.
		Like, I don't want to argue with it.
		I don't disbelieve.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's not what I'm saying.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I'm saying more as in if we're talking about this, if we're saying that the Skype was hacked, it is not because he's in some sort of remote area wherein the signal just may have dropped.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, it's possible.
		Look, I don't have a concrete answer on this.
		That's entirely possible.
		Even if he's in the fucking United States, it could have dropped.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But I'm bringing that up mostly to keep it fresh in your eyes.
		That's all right.
		So in this next clip, Dr. Yayla, he, like I mentioned a second ago, he lays out a really convincing argument for why Assad and ISIS are working together.
		And Alex has a very negative reaction to it.
		Of course.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Dr. Ahmet Yala, I-C-S-V-E.org.
		Read more on the site.
		B-I-V-O-L.B-G.
		I got to try to get this guy back.
		Sometime when we're not having Skype problems to really do research and then ask him a bunch of hardcore questions, I mean, I can see the Russians trying to infiltrate ISIS.
		I could see the Russians or something like that.
		But they have these quote ISIS defectors telling him, Russia runs me.
		I mean, I think he's saying he's done so many interrogations.
		He believes these aren't infiltrators or double or triple agents.
		But look what's happened in Guantanamo Bay.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Just basically theorizing what this person is saying when he's made it very clear what he's saying.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah, wild.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I'm not saying he's wrong.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I don't want to spend time that we have a base with the doctor to get off into that.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I mean, I think he's he's telling you what they're telling him.
		I mean, you know, I think my experience over there is that it's chaos and that is very complicated and that you have a lot of people with a lot of agendas trying to get money, trying to dominate, trying to create their own things.
		And it's a very chaotic situation.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Sure, sure.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Well, continuing, sir, the key points you want to make to the public and folks need to know.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, Doctor.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		Okay, now, for example, I always questioned why Assad and ISIS are not fighting each other.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		They claim that they are there to get rid of the Syrian regime.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So just real quick, what he's saying is that they're not fighting each other.
		Well, no, but he's also saying that one of the questions that he runs into when he's interrogating, interviewing these ISIS defectors, is why are we, why is ISIS never fighting Assad?
		Which is an interesting question.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think the obvious answer there is that the rebels are not part of ISIS.
		And so if ISIS is in Syria, then the American and Russian governments both can say that they are fighting against ISIS, when in reality what they're doing is fighting against rebels who are fighting against Assad.
		So there's a very pro-Assad position that both the United States and Russia take in order to maintain some sort of stability there.
		Whereas if the rebels actually got rid of Assad, then Syria is up for grabs at that point.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And we all know that Assad and Russia and the United States military have an arrangement.
unidentified		Absolutely.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But listen to this very, very concrete example that Yayla gives that Alex makes him freak out.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		Right?
		But in their history, ISIS never fought against Beshar.
		For example, when they captured Talabiat, they were running refineries over there.
		And the refineries were broken.
		So they talked to the Syrian government, and Assad sent them engineers to fix those refineries.
		They let Syrian engineers fix the refineries for like a week, and then they started to sell oil to Assad, to Beshar regime.
		And some of their fighters started to question this act.
		And they said, how come we are giving Beshar regime the oil, he turns back and kills our people with that oil?
		In their history, they never really fought against Beshar.
		For example, in Raqqa, when they were going into Raqqa, there were strongholds of Beshar regime.
		They say the soldiers split and Beshar left all the weapons and ammunition to ISIS.
		And same thing happened in several places.
		So there are lots of questions which cannot be answered or understood by even the high-level ISIS members.
		So it's clearly understandable that there are lots of things going on behind the scheme.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Sure, the head of defense intelligence who just quit Michael Flynn a few months ago went on Al Jazeera.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I don't know if you've seen the clip, Doctor, and he said that the U.S. government basically funded and helped ISIS, that that was a direct order of Obama.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		I don't think so, or I have never heard of this.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I love that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I don't like that.
unidentified		Man, Alex wanted a different outcome of this.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The very thing that he presented at the top of the interview is being what this guy is exposing.
		He now asks somebody who's like, I have never heard that.
		That is crazy.
		So he didn't say that it's crazy, but that's the subtext.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So, the doctor's point is that when ISIS took Libyan oil refineries, Bashar sent Syrian engineers to build those or to rebuild those refineries.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, to fix stuff.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The moment that happened, ISIS started selling oil back to Bashar.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The people who defected were like, what the fuck?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's probably a big reason why they defected.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, of course.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You're selling oil to the guy who's killing the people that made me want to join ISIS because they were being killed.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Jesus.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And that's something that he's gotten firsthand from protected soldiers.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And it's something that is obviously provable.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And it's something that's obviously true.
unidentified		Okay.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's not a good sign for Alex.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Alex does not like true things.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, and that's why he switches to like, all right, let's fucking just ask the question.
		Yeah.
		Mike Flynn, who didn't quit, he got fired.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He retired.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He presents it as he quit, and he's come out and said that U.S. created and funds ISIS.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, I've not heard that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I don't know that to be true.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Nope.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That says a lot.
		That's anger.
		That's fucking anger.
		And then he goes to commercial immediately.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah, yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And he's done with this a fucking time.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Of course, of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So after this, here is his take on the interview that he just did.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		We just had Dr. Ahmet S. Yailah on the broadcast who advises Homeland Security and more.
		He said some things I agree with from the analysis in the clip from your film.
		The other stuff he was saying that these quote ISIS defectors tell him no one else is saying that.
		But if the West can't fix intelligence, they will have people defect who will then go give disinfo.
		And the system's been caught doing that.
		I'm not saying he's doing that.
		He seems like a nice enough guy and interesting and has said some of his colleagues killed by ISIS reportedly.
		But the point is that next we're going to hear Russia overthrew Libya.
		I mean, it's on record that the West did that using Al-Qaeda.
		It's on record ISIS is Al-Qaeda.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What would you like to remind people?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Al-Qaeda is fighting ISIS in most parts of the world.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They hate ISIS for obvious reasons.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They're not the same group.
		Would you like to lay out what those obvious reasons are?
		Because some people might not understand that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay, so Al-Qaeda is specifically born out of Afghanistan.
		ISIS is specifically born out of Iraq.
		Iraq is the situation that ISIS capitalized on in order to facilitate what they really want, which is the end of days, the ultimate battle between the West and the Middle East.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Which Bannon and clearly Alex Jones also wanted.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
		Now, Al-Qaeda is there as more of a freedom-fighting organization.
		Like, that's really their goal.
unidentified		Now, they've got off track a little bit as well, of course.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But the point being is that Al-Qaeda is far, far in a way interested in avoiding that kind of caliphate.
		Because that will once again absorb Afghanistan into something that they don't want to be involved in.
		Afghanistan, of all the things that Afghanistan is, it is a country that truly believes in being its own country.
		It does not want to be part of Saudi Arabia.
		It does not want to be part of all of these different places.
		It doesn't want to be absorbed in them.
		All of the wars that have been fought in Afghanistan have been the Afghani people saying, leave us the fuck alone.
		And so ISIS is another one of those invading nations trying to take over Afghanistan.
		Al-Qaeda has no interest in that shit.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They're ideologically opposed, even though they're too dumb-dumb.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It appears that they're not.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Well, if your idea is radical Islam is all radical Islam, as opposed to any number of Sunni, Shiite, Sufi divisions between all of Islam.
		Islam is not a consolidated block.
		It's like if Protestants.
unidentified		No, no, no.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's like if Protestants in the world, I got a better version.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I got a better version.
		Alex would love to school you all day talking about how identity Europa militias are different than the Bundy militias and stuff like that.
		He talked about how like, oh, no, those people are white nationalists, whereas the Bundies are just about property rights.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Sovereignty.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		So he would like to sit down and tell you that all day, but at the same time, he would paint with one brush all of Islam.
		Not even radical Islam.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They're brown.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, all of it.
		It's just up there all the same.
		His argument is just that the globalists decided to change the name from Al-Qaeda to ISIS to confuse people.
		That indicates a lack of reading.
		It indicates a lack of global awareness in any way.
		But you see that you see in that last.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		There are so many different sects of Islam in the same way that Protestantism isn't Protestants.
		It's fucking Lutherans.
		It's fucking Pentecostals.
		It's goddamn Quakers.
		There's so many.
		Yeah, evangelicals.
		Those fucking monsters.
		Like, it's all of those things.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Everything that's not Catholic.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, exactly.
		And even Catholicism has dark popes, if you've ever watched The Order.
		I know about Solomon's Temple.
		No, but Catholicism is in flux in a constant way as well.
		Different fucking.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And you've got Lutherans that are much closer to Catholics than the Church of England is essentially Catholicism, but with divorce.
		You have an acceptance on Alex's part of a wide swath of Christian identities and lack of tolerance in any way for the idea that any Muslim is different.
		I mean, he had Laura Loomer on a couple weeks ago in 2017 saying that there is no moderate Islam that's all radical.
		And that's just fucking that sort of language, it's not going to ruin the world.
		But what it's going to do is it's going to convince some people on the fringe who are close to radical Islam to go all the way.
		And they will hear that and think, hey, white people think that we're all radical.
		I might as well be.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's not necessarily a solid argument.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, it's not.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But what other purpose does it serve other than to make white people afraid of brown people?
unidentified		Right, right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Those two purposes are the only real outcomes out of it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		There's a lot.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I get the specifics that you mean.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What I'm getting at is more there is no positive productive outcome that comes out of it.
unidentified		Right, right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And there's no reality-based outcome that comes out of it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Well, I mean, I think the single best parallel I have for why Christianity and Islam are both stupid and terrible.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Their religions?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's part of it.
		But look at the way that they spread and they destroy things.
		Whenever something, like, for instance, so many different Muslim sects in Indonesia are or were very moderate, very less disinterested really in kind of that kind of evangelicalism.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		A lot of those might have been also tempered with Buddhist influences in the past.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And Saudi Arabian Islamic sects have then sent over different people in Indonesia to turn them, turn that Muslim situation.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They say Christians say that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		In the same way they sent them to Africa and fucking murdered gay people.
		Murdered gay people.
		All of this same shit is happening because these religions are fucking horrific.
		And that is not to say that everybody who believes in Islam is horrific in the same way that everybody who believes in Christianity is not horrific.
		But it is an ideology.
		It is a structure.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Fundamental structure.
		Fundamental adherence to a structure such as any sort of religion such as capitalism.
		Those sorts of adherences are outdated modes of being.
unidentified		Only ever breed horror.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The ultimate end of all of these religions winds up with the apocalypse.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And if your religion winds up in an apocalypse, there's always going to be a certain group of people who think, well, it's my job to bring it about because it's the prophecy.
unidentified		So it's not as if I'm acting as the West has been struggling with for the last 30 years.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's not as if I'm trying to do it.
		It's that I have to do it because God tells me to do it.
		And people will always be fucking fooled by idiots like Alex or like fucking.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You'll have mouthpieces like Alex saying that like, hey, whether revelation is coming true or it's just a coincidence, this is biblical.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If Obama's the Antichrist, then Trump is the Antichrist, then George W. Bush is the anti-like it's always this guy is the apocalypse guy.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		That rhetoric is unnecessary to deal with the actual problems.
		Now, at the same time, everyone accuses everyone of calling people Nazis, and sometimes they are.
		Yeah, I mean, it's that's the converse of that.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Some people are Nazis.
unidentified		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And it turns out a lot of people are Nazis.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So we got one more clip from December 29th.
		And it's more about Alex being real disappointed in this interview.
		He thought it was going to go better.
		He thought he was going to have this guest who confirms all his Michael Flynn-based scholar.
unidentified		No.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Should have gotten a fake degree guy.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And then he talks a little bit about the hack attack.
		And at the end of this, I will explain why I kind of think he might have actually been getting hacked.
		And I'll tell you who I think it was.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		We got to stop because I need a snack attack.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You know what I'm saying?
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Different hack attacks are being launched, some successful, some not successful, against InfoWars right now, with them posting an article that Erdogan had fled to a U.S. military base and been overthrown.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Now, would you say that's because we're exposing Islamic caliphate schools in the U.S. They're trying to overthrow Irgun?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You're not.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Would you say it's because the Syrian electronic army, just pretty much the Russians, keeps posting InfoWars links on hacked sites like the Washington Post, the New York Times, and Barack Obama's personal Twitter?
		I didn't do that two years ago.
		I didn't do that a year ago.
		I'm not asking the Syrians to do that.
		I don't want that type of traffic.
		I don't want presidential Twitter.
		We got our own traffic.
		We're not involved in criminal activity.
		Now, they are attacking these countries, so they've got a right militarily to do what they're doing.
		We're not involved.
		I'm an American.
		I'm not involved in any agencies, nothing.
		But I basically talk to everybody because this is what's going on in the real world.
		And we just had a guest on earlier that, you know, was putting out the most ridiculous stuff.
		I'm nothing against the guy.
		Fuck, you know, the Russians are behind ISIS.
		Yeah, and I'm an Easter bunny from Pluto.
		And we got the former head of defense intelligence coming out.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Flynn.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		And saying two months ago that they were ordered to help create ISIS and protect him, and it's wrong.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He didn't say that even in that interview.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So here's my theory.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		If the Syrian electronic army, as Alex is asserting, was Russia, what?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Fire meets gasoline.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The Syrian electronic army.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The arms hackers are swinging from the chandeliers.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		All of their hair goes directly over their eyes.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Nobody knows what they look like.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		If the Syrian electronic army is Russia, which I don't think necessarily it is, but if it is.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Again, that seems more like a merc situation.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But if it is, let's allow that to be a possibility.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Who knows?
		If that is the case, I would posit that Russia is hacking Alex Jones' show because they're not idiots and they know what this doctor knows.
		Now, here's where it gets fanciful.
		I don't really believe this.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		I was going to say, because I recall now that my, or maybe our explanation for their bullshit hacking was that PJ Dubbs tweeted out some shit that he should not have done.
		Yes.
		So they have to claim that it's a hack.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Occam's razor tells us that it is covering their ass because they got some bad information to put up a bad story and were told to lend credibility to the idea that they have a Turkish person on to talk about ISIS.
unidentified		Or they got some good information.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You think Erdogan actually was at that Air Force base?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, no, because PJW was tweeting about how there was a planned coup and Erdogan was hiding.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right, right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He was just a year off.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Well, it was about six months off.
		Yeah.
		So that's the other possibility.
unidentified		Just then he figured out, or somebody gave him the plan.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Pachenek told him a little bit too early.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
unidentified		Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Any of these things are possible.
		Look, the idea, look, what I want to say is that, like, of course I think that they're faking the hack stuff.
		Of course.
		But if it is real, I don't think it's Turkey.
		Of course not.
		I don't think it's some group trying to pretend to be somebody.
		I think, of course, it's Russia.
		They're at this point hacking everybody.
		This is the end of 2015.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's true.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They're in a hack fever.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They're going crazy with their fucking why not?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They're throwing on the list.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, they got a whole checklist of people to hack.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Their campaigns are going buck wild to a certain extent.
		And so the idea that they would be like, he's going to interview this guy who knows that some of our retired generals are running ISIS cells.
		Why wouldn't they?
		Why wouldn't they try and fuck with that?
		I mean, his Skype does end up going down.
		That's not proof of anything, but it's kind of interesting.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But if their idea is to shut down the Skype, that's a terrible idea.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, what you would want to do is...
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, the attempts to shut down the site were unsuccessful.
		Infowar has got too good a security, apparently.
		Sure.
		It's fake, of course.
		Sure.
		It's all fake.
		It's all fake.
		I was just trying to have fun.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Oh, well.
		Anyway, the bottom line is that Alex Jones accidentally got a smart person on his show.
		Couldn't handle it.
unidentified		No.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I just love, I think that Alex Jones' greatest quote of all time will be, just says volumes.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So much.
		It's so clear.
		So full of shit.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But the only thing about that is that suggests to me that Alex does believe his bullshit, at least in this situation.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Not to me.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Really?
		So you think he's angry because he does not be.
		No, that's not.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's not necessarily anger, I don't think.
		I interpret to be I'm not good enough at this to figure out how we spin out.
		Like, that is frustration as a propagandist, I think.
		That's how I hear it.
		I've hit a brick wall.
		We're two minutes away from a break.
		I don't know what to do.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		See, I.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I thought that this question was going to lead to him saying, well, I did talk to one guy who said that the United States is.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right, right, right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But it turns out, no.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		What I hear in that is I am not getting what I believe to be true to be confirmed by this guy who I have already insisted is an expert.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He's super credible.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So either I have the choice of believing him and saying, oh, that's interesting, or I have the choice of being Alex Jones and being a whiny little bitch about it and kicking you off my show.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Well, I also want to tell you.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So that suggests belief to me.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I also want to tell you one other little piece of information that I've withheld.
		Okay.
		On the 29th, this interview that went really terrible happened before the interview with Steve Pieczenik from the 29th.
		So if he was going to question things and be like, oh, Russia is you're saying that, you know, there are some Russian forces that are behind ISIS.
		I've got to rethink everything.
		Then he's got to dovetail that into an interview with Steve Pieczenik right after that.
		I would posit that those moments where he almost realizes he's getting played are the aftermath of this interview with Dr. Yeyla not going well at all.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And him talking to Steve Pieczenik and the kernel possibly of like, is all of this wrong?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So again, that suggests belief to me.
		His belief has been shaken, not his propaganda.
		And so when he's talking to Pachenek, now he's getting his belief back into it.
		All right, Dan.
		All right, Dan.
		I think I'm shaking your belief that this is bullshit this time.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, it's just such complicated bullshit that it's very difficult to unpack exactly what is being expressed and what the line is.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think it's possible that his belief is being shaken a little bit, and Steve Pieczenik coming on is a little bit of a booster shot in some way.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		See, that's kind of the narrative that I'm getting out of this.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's possible.
		It's possible.
		I don't know.
		Bottom line is that I believe that December 2015 was a month that destroyed our country.
		Right.
		I think that there was a chance for Alex Jones to become an anti-hero, and he fucking blew it.
		He fucking blew it real hard.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He never had a shot.
		It was too late.
		It was too late.
unidentified		No, I think the redemption was possible.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think even a very dumb man who believes that the Civil War was about tariffs.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Going through our investigation has made me believe that he never had a chance.
		Maybe, maybe.
		See, that's what's going on.
		Maybe if Rand Paul had at any point been one of the top three, maybe we'd be in a different situation.
		But since Rand Paul was down at the bottom and stayed down at the bottom, who else was he going to go to?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I'm crossing my arms right now very aggressively at you.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It doesn't seem very aggressive.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		For a couple of reasons.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You're really bad at being aggressive.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I have to hold this mic.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You need to be more assertive with yourself.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The reasons that I'm doing that are like, there have been elections where he's just stayed out of it.
		So even if he's not pitching for Rand because he can't stand, like if Rand falls out, it doesn't necessarily mean that he would just have to choose somebody in an election.
		He's done that in the past.
		So that's one piece why I think he has a chance.
		Second, you haven't experienced what I've experienced in terms of listening to nigh on hundreds of hours of Alex Jones.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, are you trying to say you're some sort of expert or some bullshit and I don't know anything about Alex Jones?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Ask Gladwell.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Is that what you're trying to say?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Are you a 10,000 hour easing me?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I'm close.
		But the reason that I bring that up is that in my investigation, I've listened to a bunch of old stuff too.
		In addition to this 2015 stuff, because every now and again I've been trying to find stuff from 2008, 2009 that would be a good episode.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And you see a different man then.
		You see not, I mean, still deeply, deeply flawed.
		Deeply flawed.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Flawed organization.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		A bit of a bigot.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There's no doubt about that.
		But you see a completely different person.
		Like, there's an episode in 2008 I was listening to the other day where he sings along to the renegades of funk as they come in from commercial break.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Where he's like actually enjoying himself and having a great time.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		On that episode, it's right when Jesse Ventura gets his conspiracy theory show.
unidentified		Yeah, yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They're going to pilot.
		And so Jesse Ventura is a guest on the show.
		And Alex is like, he's so excited and bubbly about the idea that Jesse Ventura, his friend, is going to get a conspiracy theory TV show.
unidentified		And he's like, look, I don't want to be weird, but you should have me as a sidekick.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, yeah, yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There's a cute, bubbly, like, laughing, like, not fake laughing.
		Like, it's real.
		There's a sincere enjoyment of being this guy.
		And I don't feel that anymore.
		I don't feel that in 2015.
		I don't feel that in 2017.
		I feel like he's a broken disaster of a person.
		And I do think there is a chance for redemption in terms of the lead up to this election.
		We see it very clearly in the stuff that we've gone over on this episode as a bubbling point of all the stuff that we've seen in the last fuck 20 episodes of the investigation.
		There are forces that are trying to manipulate him.
		There are forces that are, and I don't want to take his responsibility out of it.
		He still is to blame for everything.
		But he had a chance to see that Steve Pieczenik and Roger Stone and who knows who else behind the scenes were lying to him in a concerted effort to get him to be their propaganda mouthpiece.
		And if he had turned face on them, if he had hit the bad guy with a chair.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You know, there is that possibility.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If he had given Steve Pieczenik a gold star and sent him to his mom.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Or a stunner.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Maybe I watched too much wrestling.
		And maybe I watched too much wrestling and there is that idea that there is the villain's redemption and the hero's downfall.
		Like all of these things are possible.
		But from everything I can see, he had a chance.
		And it was in December and he fucking blew it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		Now, here's my problem with that argument, and that's from a personal place.
		That suggests to me that my parents had a chance to see through that Republican bullshit.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, they did.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They had a chance.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Of course they did.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		See, I just don't think every person's hinge point is different.
		Like, who knows when it is in your personal journey in your life?
		I think everybody has a moment where they can go super bad or super good.
		And sometimes it's on a small scale.
		Like with your parents, it probably only affects you.
		I mean, and some other people around them in their personal life.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And the rest of my fucking family.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
		It affects that, but that's small scale.
		With Alex Jones, he's a propagandist with millions of listeners.
		He had the it's the difference between with your parents, it's a twig breaking in the big scheme of things.
		And with Alex, it's a glacier falling apart.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		See, I just don't think we ever had a chance.
		Or Alex ever had a chance.
		The moment the nominee was Hillary, they never had a chance.
		Like, Hillary.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But even if it was Bernie, he wouldn't have had a chance either because he's a socialist.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, no, no.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		For him, he could stay out of an election between Bernie and.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, he couldn't.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		His entire worldview is based on socialism leading to totalitarianism.
unidentified		Right, right, right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He would have to fight.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But Bernie said shit.
		And Bernie was a white dude.
		Or at least Bernie was a dude.
		mean he would have gone through he would have gone through the jew thing maybe but but that's something that you know almost certainly 100% he would have gone through.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It would have been coded, but yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		But that's not the same thing as Hillary.
		I think the Republicans never had a chance because of Hillary.
		Like, they were primed for the con man because they were so blinded by their hate for Hillary.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think that there are a lot of people who are like that, and Alex Jones, I think that is a.
		I hesitate to say exactly a large piece of it, but it is a piece of his journey, there is no doubt.
		But I don't, but that to me is wildly simplistic.
		The idea that most of what motivated him was anti-Hillary stuff.
		I think that was a part of it.
		But I don't think that the whispers in the ear from Roger Stone and from Steve Pieczenik were like, Hillary sucks.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's not.
		Hillary sucks, choose Trump.
		That's not what I'm saying.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I understand that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But I'm saying that his motivation partially is negative Hillary, but more of it is pro-Trump based on lies that he's been told about what Trump will do to the fake globalists.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What he's going to do in the world stage.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The idea that he's going to whip everyone in shape and then leave office.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Like so long.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's nonsense.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		See, I disagree entirely.
		I don't think, well, I don't disagree entirely.
		I think my view on it is, of course, not the simplistic, you know, it's just that they hated Hillary.
		My view on it is that because of their hatred for Hillary as a linchpin of their belief system for 20 years, that is something that they could not abandon without great personal destruction.
		So they were primed for the con man.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Now, let me actually tell you, let me help your argument.
		Yes.
		Of the vicious weirdos, the rogues gallery that Alex Jones has, the one that he has never run afoul of and never gotten into any beef with is Larry Nichols.
unidentified		Of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		All these other people, like Steve Pieczenik, is now on the outs.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I don't think that the two of that I mean, we've documented the last like three appearances, the two of them.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yeah, no, it's not gone great.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And then now he's doing this Las Vegas is fake shit, and Alex is like, he's still CIA.
		So I think the two of them are probably not going to be hanging in the near future.
		I'm not entirely sure.
		Ron Paul was on the other day, and they had a fucking fight.
		And I don't know if Ron Paul is like, Alex, you're an idiot.
		I don't think that Ron Paul and him are going to be tight anymore.
		Roger Stone's a different quantity.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Roger Stone's an amorphous blob of whatever the fuck he wants.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He knows where his bread is buttered and he's in too deep.
		He's a part of Infowars now more than he is a part of Trump shit.
		So he's sort of irrelevant.
		Of all these old-time weirdos, really the one who never is the problem is Larry Nichols.
		And he is the Hillary guy.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I mean, it's, and it's not to say, like, it's not to say that's the reason the, I think what I'm trying to get to is it's the most attractive, most universal argument.
		It is that, but I mean more of in the house of cards of their belief system, which is nonsense.
		And any little thing, any little thing can be torn down.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You know, in House of Cards.
		No.
		Kevin Spacey kills the dog.
unidentified		No.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He killed a dog.
unidentified		So did Alex Jones.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Did Kevin Spacey kill Nonk?
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		In that first episode, Kevin Spacey kills Nonk.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's what the British, that's what the British one was about.
		It was about Alex Jones.
		We cracked the case.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, it's like anti-Hillary was the cornerstone.
		If you pull that, then everything falls.
		So they didn't have a chance because they could not pull.
		If you actually get those people to say, well, Hillary would be better than Trump, that means Hillary is better than somebody.
		And they cannot believe that.
		They can't abide by that because that would destroy their she is the worst human being ever narrative.
		And if that takes that down, then that suggests to them that maybe there is a career politician who's better than a non-career politician.
		Any of these people, for them to not vote, the people who hate Hillary so fucking much, for them to not vote against her is insane to them.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that's possible.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's compelling.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Which, again, is why he could not sit out this election.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Now he's been fighting Hillary for 20 fucking years.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, he hasn't.
		His associates have.
		He gets distracted at times.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		Right, right, right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He's fighting the globalists, and granted, Hillary is one of them.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Hillary is one of the chief globalists.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		She's also a witch.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		She and the real housewives of New Jersey.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, no, it was Linda Bloodworth Thomas.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It doesn't matter.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They're all the same fucking thing.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Design and women.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The only rebuttal I would make to that, because I mostly agree with what you're saying, is that even if anti-Hillary stuff is the cornerstone, the other stones, without them, you don't have a Roger.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You don't have a building.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The other Roger Stones.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		You don't have a building without the other stones.
		No, even if there's one that holds everything up, the other ones are necessary for the construction.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Agreed.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And those other ones are, I mean, they're all, I mean, it's all lies, but.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's fascinating to me.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I mean, I want to get back to the episode that we just did.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Because, I mean, this conversation is good and all, but like.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's not as though nobody has ever had the autopsy of people really hated Hillary.
		Right.
		That's a little groundbreaking analysis.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's a little pat.
		Yeah.
		It's been covered.
		Absolutely.
		And I don't discount that at all.
		I think that there is a massive truth to that.
		But the other thing is that what we've just witnessed in this episode is Alex Jones is very willing to be lied to and is so opposed to the idea of someone impugning Russia.
		Like, I want to bring that back here really quick.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		In the sense that that is the only thing he really contests in Dr. Yala's testimony, as it were.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Like, he doesn't even rebut necessarily the idea that there were Syrian oil fields that Bashar al-Assad sent people to fix so they could sell oil to, so ISIS could sell oil to him.
unidentified		Of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He doesn't even respond to that except to say, Mike Flynn says that the U.S. is behind it.
unidentified		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's true.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The only thing he's like, this is stupid is the idea that Russia is involved.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I'm not going to argue that.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But to me, that indicates to like it's much more problematic.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Is it that, or is it that he just doesn't know a goddamn thing about the other things that he said?
		Like, he doesn't know anything about Turkey.
		He doesn't know anything about Syria, really.
		He doesn't know anything about Iran.
		He doesn't know anything about these people.
		Russia is the only thing that he does think he knows anything about.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		The only thing that he does think he has concrete information about.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		People like Steve Kennedy have probably told him things behind the scenes about clandestine agreements that are true.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So he thinks he has that piece of information.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		Which is why he would be confident in fighting back against it on that point alone.
		Because if he starts saying Iran and Syria, he's fucking off the reservation, even for him.
		You know, if he starts going like, here's my theory on Syria, you're done.
		You know, he has no he frankly, he has no idea what Bashara Assad actually does.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No.
		He thinks that he wants to go back to Britain.
		Look, I mean, we're spiraling a lot, and it's just so many different.
		It's fucked up.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's so fucked up.
		And it's not like.
		I mean, we can come back to this a hundred different times, but it's like, okay, I get it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I'm going crazy.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That wasn't my entire point.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But no, like, I get the idea that people think, like, I have friends who are like, what are you doing?
		I run into people I used to do stand-up with, and they're like, what have you been doing?
		Like, I've been studying Alex Jones pretty intensely for the last 10 months.
unidentified		Yeah, yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Like, you're nuts.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		To the exclusion of just about everything else.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Mostly, yeah, absolutely.
		Yeah, yeah.
		But the reason is because I am intensely convinced that this is the thread that is the loosest.
unidentified		Right, right, right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It really is.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Now, granted, a thread that's way looser is like, if we could hack Breitbart's emails.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Like, like, BuzzFeed didn't hack them.
unidentified		No.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They got those emails.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They were linked.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And if we could get a data dump like that, it would be so much easier.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But since we are going on context clues and his actual words, I legitimately think that this is the loosest thread that unravels everything.
		And I think that from experience, from listening to him, from understanding what he's talking about.
		And people even who like, like, there are so many people who discount Alex Jones and they're like, oh, he's just crazy.
		He's just crazy.
		There are people who there are people who think that they know something about Alex Jones that don't know who Steve Pieczenik is.
		There are people who think like, oh, yeah, fuck that guy.
		They don't know Roger Stone's influence.
		Like we were talking about earlier.
		Owen Schuyer, you didn't know how to spell his name, and you do a podcast about InfoWars.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That was more a pronunciation issue, not a spelling issue.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I've always pronounced it Schroyer.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I know, but to me, I hear Troy.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's because Vince Troyer.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's your thing of Mini Me.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
unidentified		All right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But like, they're.
		I'm maybe going crazy a tiny bit, but the only reason is I'm 100% convinced that these circumstantial pieces of evidence build up to a very compelling argument.
		And the compelling argument is that there is a group called the 45 Group that Roger Stone and Steve Pieczenik have admitted to being a part of on Alex Jones' show that are way more interested in Russian interests than they are in American interests.
		And what they have done is concoct a crazy bullshit narrative that they have convinced Alex Jones is true, and they're using him because, I mean, let's go back to our first fucking episode.
		One of the things I made very clear on the first episode is that Alex Jones is incredibly talented.
		He's very good at this propaganda game that he plays.
		And I don't take that back at all a hundred and something episodes into this.
		He's very good, and they recognize that and are using him as a weapon.
		Now, your point that he had no shot and there's no chance that things could have gone better, that is a difference of opinion, and you might be right.
		I might be right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Agree.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It's possible.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I'm not going to try and take down your argument either.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, it's also a glass half full, glass half empty.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But what's not is If you were trying to pull off a massive scam, if you were trying to do something really fucked up, Alex Jones is an amazing person to have on your side.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I mean, why wouldn't they get him on his ultimate so clear?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I think our ultimate disagreement on this is nothing to do with any of the circumstantial evidence that we have put together.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It is that I just have such a hard time accepting that they actually pulled off this Ocean's 11 scam.
unidentified		But that's like that's where Cambridge Analytics is.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I know, I know, that's what I'm saying.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It is such an amazing thing to me that they would actually be able to pull off the heist of the century and steal the presidency.
unidentified		Here's the thing: they didn't.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Cambridge Analytica and the Mercers did.
kevin booth ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They did the actual bank heist.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Alex Jones is distraction.
		Alex Jones is the person who is running the, hey, look over here.
		And the reason that it gives away the bank robbery is because he's so obvious about it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That is the point I'm trying to make, I believe, that we've accidentally stumbled into.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Perfect metaphor for Ocean's 12 or Oceans 11.
		I can't remember which movie is which.
		Right.
		But like the people who are actually cracking the safe are Cambridge Analytica, Jared.
		These folks are the people who are actually the ones who were involved in it.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And Alex Jones is the Casey Affleck.
		And what's his fucking name?
		Yeah.
		Jimmy Khan's family.
		Of course, our analysis winds up being the brother of a famous person and the son of a famous person.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Which makes perfect sense considering the world we live in.
		Right.
		Where the brother of a famous person and the son of a famous person are fucking us over.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		But if we're looking at this in terms of like, you know, a lot of really serious people only want to focus on what happened to the safe.
unidentified		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And I think that's a very valid point of investigation.
		And quite frankly, I think it's a part of investigation that I can't help with.
		And I wish everyone well.
		I wish Mueller well.
		I wish.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Oh, we're fucked.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He's not going to do shit.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Probably not.
		But I wish everyone who's looking at that well.
		I can't help.
		But what I can help with is review the tapes from the casino where there's people acting real weird right at the same time as the fucking bank robbery went down.
		And I can say, huh, interesting.
		Let's listen to what they were doing a couple months before.
		And oh, it turns out they've recorded all the things they were doing a couple months before, and they're basically laying out everything that ends up happening.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		So we're saying PJW is the guy with a bad cockney accent.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Is that what's going on here?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		He's Don Chead.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Don Cheadle.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The demolition Zex.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It's all gone bounty.
		All right.
		Great job, Don.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Look, I don't know.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think we're spiraling way out of control.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I know.
		I'm just so unbelievably fascinated, horrified by all the stuff that we've talked about.
		And it's such a leap to me.
		It's such a jump that I have to be skeptical.
		Otherwise, I feel like I'm going to start getting into a place of magical thinking all the time.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Totally.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You know, skepticism is very healthy.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		So I have to push back against this because it suggests a competency that I am just so unwilling to accept from all of these people.
		If they were actually this competent, if people were actually this competent, it seems as though a lot more would get done.
		But from my understanding of so much of his incompetence.
		Well, they pulled off the heist of the century.
		I mean, you're talking about Pachenek.
		You're talking about Pachenek and Stone.
		No, I know that.
		But you're talking about them being capable of executing this years-long disinformation campaign against Alex Jones without breaking once.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		No, no, no, no.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Without ever breaking characters.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You're misinterpreting some things.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I mean, if Jimmy Fallon can't even go through a single SNL sketch without breaking.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You're misinterpreting a few things.
		Steve Pieczenik's involvement in this scam is probably much more recent than his entire history on InfoWars.
		It's not like he was there years planted in advance.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		We're in 2015.
		I'm still talking about that.
		But we're still talking about the same people being part of InfoWars.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		All they needed to do was like, all they needed to do was hit the NAS right at the right time.
		Yeah.
		It just had to hit that booster at just the right time, and they did.
		That's the entire race.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		They're still going.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, Stone hasn't even given Alex an inkling of, like, hey, by the way, I fucked you over.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That's because Stone has realized this is a better gig.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Well, yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Stone is like, he's realized, I think, that InfoWars is where I fucking belong.
		I'm a dirty, sleazy fucking dude.
		This is much better for me.
		I make money selling supplements out the ass.
		This is great.
		We're conning people.
		Why would I want to be involved in politics?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that's true.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I imagine he's just made the jump.
		That's what it seems to me is what's going on.
		It's much lower stakes.
		It's not going to get him in front of the House fucking intelligence committee again, most likely.
		I think that Steve Pieczenik has gone off the reservation.
		He's going nuts with the, like, he's doing his own game now to the point where he doesn't even give a fuck that Alex believes him.
		Right.
		Screaming at him on the hurricane day.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And now we're like, oh, hey, let's double down on fucking Sandy Hook.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And I'm going to fucking talk to David Knight about how you're a coward because you got intimidated out of Sandy Hook truth.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Pretty hilarious.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I think the entire operation in that sense has deteriorated.
		I don't think it matters anymore.
		They did the job that needed to be done.
		Now Alex is still fighting like a guy behind enemy lines who doesn't know the war has ended.
		He is a guy who's still on Team Trump because he's changed friends.
		And now his friends are these trolls.
		His friends are the Mike Cernoviches.
		His friends are Jack Pasobik.
		These people who, like, they aren't ideological.
		They're not smart.
		They're not strategic in the same way that Roger Stone, Steve Pieczenik, to some extent, Larry Nichols are.
		Alex is just, he's in a new ocean now, but it's the same ocean in as much as he has the same boat.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And the boat is what Roger Stone gave him earlier.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And that is the Trump boat.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And it's a lie.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		That metaphor fell apart.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		It didn't go well at the end.
		No.
		Not proud of it.
		You had a great, great jump.
		You dove perfectly, and then you did a belly flop at the end there.
unidentified		You executed landing?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Terrible.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Not great.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Not great.
		I mean, it's just we have so many cats.
		We have such a cast of characters who all seem pathetic whenever you reveal all of this stuff about them.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		True.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		And it's hard.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		They're not.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No.
		And it's just because you put out a compelling argument.
		You really do.
		Like, I have no real, like, oh, well, I can put a little hole in this here and a little hole in this there that would deflate your balloon entirely.
		I think there are some places where maybe you've gone a step too far or not, but, you know, That is part of the game.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I just have a hard aversion to accepting that these people could actually pull it off.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, it seems as though.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		It seems way easier than you're pretending.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I know, but it seems as though if they could pull this dumb shit off, people could pull up a, I don't know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Maybe, maybe I'm just misreading so much of it.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		You know, a lot of the scams that have been pulled off.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I know.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Now, like, the more I think about it, the more I'm leaning towards what you're saying is true.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		What just came about Harvey Weinstein.
		And what happens with tons of these really powerful dudes.
		Like, that stuff is, I mean, it is a little bit reductive and insulting to call it a scam.
		But on some level, the serial sexual harassment of women who are your subordinates or you're in a power position, that is a scam that you're pulling.
		It's a much more personal scam, but it is.
		And the cover-up of it is another scam.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And that happens all the time.
		The idea that these people, those people aren't really that smart.
		Harvey Weinstein isn't that smart.
		He's offering to masturbate in front of people.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Here is your best defense.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Smart doesn't matter.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Paying people who are good at covering stuff up and manipulating people is what does the work.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		The people who are behind the scenes doing the PR work are the people like Steve Pacheco.
unidentified		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Like Roger Smith.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Here's what I got for you.
		Here is your simplest defense.
		When powerful people are insulated from any consequences of their action, why the fuck wouldn't they do it?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like just like just like when you brought up Weinstein, that's the thought that I had.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		If you are insulated, like even now, his worst consequence is, oh, I retire with my billions of dollars.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Like, if you're insulated from any actual consequences, why the fuck not play this game?
		Right.
		You're bored.
unidentified		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		That's what it really is.
		There are no stakes for you.
		It's like gambling.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And that may be, that may explain some of Trump's motivations.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And then you go into what we already talked about about Manafort.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Right.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		No, these people need to go to jail where nothing's going to.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There's probably some people who are insulated from consequences and some people who are desperate to avoid consequences.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And they're coming together in a terrifying fashion.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Let's wrap this up.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I think that's really the ultimate point of all of this is that whenever people are insulated from consequences, who gives a fuck?
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Perhaps.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Anyway, Jordan's been fun.
unidentified		This is rambled a little time here.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I just love doing this podcast.
		It's fun.
		It's fun, except even when you get angry at me, dude.
		And I'm sorry.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Interrupt me less and will be great.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Hold on one second.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Let me just put Cthulhu right in front of me.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		And now this episode's not going to be a video episode.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		I know, but now we can talk.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		So people can find us at our website, knowledgefight.com.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		You can also follow us on Twitter at knowledge underscore fight.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yes, and we are on Facebook.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Go to iTunes, leave a review.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Also, we will be tonight.
		We'll be live on Twitch.
		But thank you all for listening.
		We appreciate it.
		I would like to do our bit, but gotta be honest, I got a piss really bad.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, no, I understand.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		There's this guy.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		His name's John Rappaport.
unidentified		What's his name?
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		He can go fuck himself.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, you can go fuck him.
jordan holmes ▲ ● ▼		Go fuck yourself, John Rappaport.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Andy in Kansas, you're on the air.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		Thanks for holding.
unidentified		Hello, Alex.
dan friesen ▲ ● ▼		I'm a first-time caller.
unidentified		I'm a huge fan.
alex jones ▲ ● ▼		I love your work.

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