Oct. 25, 2016 - The Joe Rogan Experience
02:19:56
Participants
| 
| Speaker | Time | Text |
|---|---|---|
| Christine, we're live. | ||
| Alright, I'm ready. | ||
| How you doing? | ||
| We talked a lot before this podcast. | ||
| We even said we weren't going to talk. | ||
| We were like, I don't want to talk to you too much. | ||
| A lot of stuff to talk about. | ||
| But damn, we got into everything. | ||
| Christy Brinkley, Fibonacci sequence. | ||
| Tony Robbins. | ||
| Tony Robbins. | ||
| We covered a lot of ground. | ||
| Crime. | ||
| Crime. | ||
| Boyfriends as dogs, as protective dogs. | ||
| Yes, protective dogs. | ||
| How did you get to become a life coach? | ||
| Oh, gosh. | ||
| Was that the worst? | ||
| No, no, no. | ||
| I never planned on it. | ||
| And I don't really even like that title. | ||
| What's a good name? | ||
| I haven't come up with a better name for it. | ||
| Let's come up with one. | ||
| But maybe by the end of the show, we'll come up with something better. | ||
| So that's your job, Joe. | ||
| Okay. | ||
| To figure out my new title by the end of the show. | ||
|
unidentified
|
So... | |
| I started out in Hollywood, actually. | ||
| I moved out after college to LA because, mainly because growing up I was teased a lot. | ||
| I was massively insecure. | ||
| And if you've got something to prove, Hollywood's a great place to come do it. | ||
| So you came out here to like, I'll fucking show you people. | ||
| Yeah, I'll show you. | ||
| Yeah, since I didn't fit in, I didn't have a lot of friends and boys didn't really ever like me unless they wanted to cheat off my paper. | ||
| I became addicted to achieving. | ||
| And I was like, what can I be? | ||
| I want to be somebody. | ||
| Like, if only I was somebody. | ||
| How old were you? | ||
| How old was I? Yeah. | ||
| Oh gosh, when it started, 10, 8, something like that. | ||
| That's when you started wanting to prove yourself? | ||
| Well, that's when the teasing started happening. | ||
| And that's when I started to feel like I didn't really fit in and I needed to find a way to feel worth something. | ||
| So overachieving kind of became my way to do that. | ||
| And then at 10, I was diagnosed with depression and put on Prozac at 10. What? | ||
| I know. | ||
| We'll bookmark that. | ||
| Come back. | ||
| And so from a very early age, I really thought something was wrong with me. | ||
| I didn't fit in. | ||
| And so I had to come up with these compensatory strategies to feel worthy, to feel validated, to feel like I mattered. | ||
| And so I just became like straight A student, addicted to achieving. | ||
| Went out to college. | ||
| I grew up in Texas. | ||
| Went to Northwestern. | ||
| Graduated early. | ||
| And was just committed to moving to Hollywood and working my way out. | ||
| As an actor... | ||
| I mean, as a kid, I was an actor. | ||
| I tried that for a little bit. | ||
| And then I was like, whoa, this is way too much rejection. | ||
| I can't deal with this. | ||
| I want to go on the other side of the camera and pursue this career in Hollywood. | ||
| And I didn't know what exactly I was going to do. | ||
| I thought I was going to be a producer or something like that. | ||
| But I came out. | ||
| I was 20 years old. | ||
| And I applied at the William Morris Agency to... | ||
| You know, be an assistant. | ||
| They're like, you have to go through the training program, which is like pushing mail carts around. | ||
| And I did not want to do that. | ||
| So somehow I got a desk like really early and started working for the head of TV packaging and quickly learned I did not want to be an agent. | ||
| Like I just didn't like it. | ||
| It was crazy long hours. | ||
| I was treated poorly. | ||
| It was just a hellish job. | ||
| And it was a lot of selling. | ||
| I didn't really like that either. | ||
| I left and actually went and worked on The Man Show. | ||
| You did? | ||
| I did. | ||
| I thought, maybe I'll like production. | ||
| So first season of The Man Show, I was there, which was kind of a blast and also just crazy. | ||
| It was a crazy show to work on. | ||
| I mean, Jimmy and Adam were always super awesome to me. | ||
| But I was a young girl, PA, running around. | ||
| Juggy dancers were everywhere. | ||
| I was like, what am I What are you doing here? | ||
| So I quickly got out of production and then started in comedy development at Paramount. | ||
| Started scouting comedians and going to comedy clubs and finding people that I could represent and bring in, maybe get deals for them. | ||
| And that quickly transitioned to moving to another company where I was doing comedy development. | ||
| And then I quickly fell back into being an agent. | ||
| So that was like my first career, was like going to comedy clubs late at night. | ||
| Eddie Ift, who I think you know, was my first client. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| That was your first client? | ||
| That's fine. | ||
| I know Eddie very well. | ||
| Yeah, he was my very first client. | ||
| We still keep in touch. | ||
| He says hi. | ||
| And that was like my life. | ||
| So here I am now, 24, 25, working at a big agency, representing clients. | ||
| I was the youngest female agent in the department, maybe even in... | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| I was really young, got promoted really, really super young. | ||
| And I was dating the head of a movie studio and I was living this amazing Hollywood life, like making a lot of money, going to the Oscars and Golden Globes, private jets, hanging out with celebrities. | ||
| Like I totally had it all. | ||
| But I still wasn't happy. | ||
| It was like I'd achieve one thing and then there had to be the next thing. | ||
| And then I'd achieve this and then there had to be the next thing. | ||
| You know, I'd get the guy. | ||
| I still wouldn't be happy. | ||
| I'd get the promotion still. | ||
| I was on that constant chase and nothing ever was like doing it. | ||
| So about two years I did this job. | ||
| I'm still on antidepressants. | ||
| I'm also taking anti-anxiety pills at the time and just like trying to like manage my life. | ||
| And I was one of those people that I could really look good from the outside. | ||
| I could seem like I had it all together. | ||
| And the inside was a totally different story. | ||
| It's kind of like a duck on water. | ||
| It looks smooth, but underneath it's like... | ||
| That was what I was like. | ||
| And a lot of people ask me about how to achieve all this and still suffer from depression. | ||
| And I was a very functional, depressed person. | ||
| A lot of people think if you're depressed, you just lay in bed all day. | ||
| And watch, you know, soap operas or something. | ||
| But that's not the, that doesn't, you know, summarize all depression. | ||
| Like there's different ways it shows up. | ||
| And so I was able to live my life, but I always felt like something was missing. | ||
| I always felt like I wasn't enough. | ||
| And I just had this heavy, heavy energy and nothing I could achieve was ever filling that gap. | ||
| So let me keep going. | ||
| Yeah, yeah, yeah. | ||
| So, one day I was riding up in the elevator to work and I had basically a mini panic attack. | ||
| I just, I couldn't breathe. | ||
| I got off the elevator and I just couldn't catch my breath and was looking at, there was a lot of weird painting and art in our office and I was looking at the weird photos and the one outside of my desk was this woman in a negligee who was nine months pregnant in this huge yard sale with a UFO light shining down on her about to take her up. | ||
| And I'm looking at this painting and I'm like, I feel like that's me. | ||
| How did I get here? | ||
| And I just, I went back down the elevator, walked around Beverly Hills and then came back upstairs and I just wanted to quit. | ||
| All I wanted to do was quit. | ||
| I thought that was the answer. | ||
| It was just I could quit my job and reinvent myself and start over. | ||
| But I needed someone to give me permission. | ||
| And so I called my dad. | ||
| Because, you know, my dad has always been there for me. | ||
| And I'm like, Dad, I really want to quit this job. | ||
| Can I? And he did a really good dad thing. | ||
| Really pissed me off at the time. | ||
| But it was a good dad move. | ||
| You want to guess what he did? | ||
| He told you to get your shit together? | ||
| That's what I would do. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Close. | |
| No. | ||
| He said, I love you, but I can't make this decision for you. | ||
| That is a good dad thing. | ||
| Very good dad thing. | ||
| And he hung up, and I quit the next day, and that was the first really big risk I ever took. | ||
| Why did you feel like you were the pregnant woman with a UFO about to take you off in a flying saucer? | ||
|
unidentified
|
That... | |
| I just felt confused and lost and like I didn't fit in and like chaos and it's all wrong and how did I get here and what is happening? | ||
| Isn't it crazy that Hollywood has so many stories I mean not obviously not exactly like yours but so many stories of people who were rejected and who have decided they're gonna come here to prove something or to get the love that they need and what do they run into? | ||
| They're in the business of rejection. | ||
| Exactly. | ||
| Most people don't really think about it because most people don't act. | ||
| But if you try to act, you have to audition. | ||
| And if you audition, you're going to audition with hundreds of other people that are all trying to get the same job. | ||
| And they treat you like hundreds of other people are trying to get the same job. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yep. | |
| It's the weirdest thing. | ||
| And people leave and they're just devastated. | ||
| They're so confused. | ||
| They get nervous before the thing. | ||
| And then they leave the thing and they feel so helpless. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| It's a strange, strange business. | ||
| It really is. | ||
| And it's so often not based on talent. | ||
| No. | ||
| It's so often not based on who's the best person for the job. | ||
| And that's what frustrated me as an agent. | ||
| And also, one of the reasons I left, I had a deal that I put together. | ||
| Eddie was actually involved in it. | ||
| And my boss made me attach a showrunner who nobody wanted, but he needed to please that client. | ||
| And it killed the show. | ||
| And it killed these guys' opportunity. | ||
| That happens all the time. | ||
| It happens all the time. | ||
| That happened to us when I took over the Man Show. | ||
| There was a showrunner that... | ||
| There's this weird, incestuous sort of fucking business in Hollywood of connecting people. | ||
| It's almost more about being social than it is about anything else. | ||
| It's about making these relationships almost like politics. | ||
| You become beholden to these people and you get them jobs and they get you jobs and you all just feed off of each other and you all suck. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| It really happens a lot. | ||
| It happens a lot with comedy writers. | ||
| There's a lot of comedy writers that are just, you know, they might have even been on Seinfeld or something, like a great show. | ||
| And there's a few brilliant writers, and there's a few that are like, what in the fuck is this guy doing here? | ||
| Well, his agent is this guy's agent, and that guy's agent forced this guy in. | ||
| If you get that guy, you get this guy too, and they make these deals. | ||
| Exactly. | ||
| And that's what was so frustrating for me is I'd have these really talented people and I couldn't get them jobs. | ||
| Why did they put you on Prozac at 10? | ||
| Were you an only child? | ||
| No, no, no. | ||
| I was the oldest. | ||
| You're the oldest. | ||
| How many kids? | ||
| Just two. | ||
| And I think, you know, my parents loved me a lot and they just were doing the best they could and they were listening to doctors. | ||
| You know, it was a time when if a doctor tells you something, you listen. | ||
| What was bumming you out? | ||
| Like, what was it the point where they were willing to put you on medication? | ||
| Well, I think I went from when I was little, I was really outgoing and talkative and happy. | ||
| And then when the teasing and bullying started to happen, I completely just shut down. | ||
| Was it a particular group of people that did it to you? | ||
| Or one girl? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Where is that bitch? | |
| Well, she's the one I wanted to mention when I won my Oscar. | ||
| That was the whole thing. | ||
| Oh, you wanted to get up there and say that in a speech? | ||
| I wanted to get up there and say, this is for you! | ||
| No, that's fine. | ||
| Eventually I got over that. | ||
| But I just, I really just shut down and withdrew and... | ||
| So it was just like, did you move to a different school or was it just one particular kid? | ||
| They wanted me. | ||
| My parents were like, go to a different school, honey. | ||
| And I just wouldn't. | ||
| I was stubborn and I wanted to stay and I think I was just scared. | ||
| You know, that's the thing, like... | ||
| Oftentimes what we know that's bad is safer, feels safer than what we don't know that might be better. | ||
| I had a comfort zone in where I was. | ||
| Even though I wasn't really happy, I knew that school. | ||
| I was afraid that if I went to new school, I would just have to deal with the same thing. | ||
| So I was just like, I'll stay where I am. | ||
| Isn't it crazy that you could run into the wrong person when you're 10 years old and it could fuck you up for a decade or two? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| But I think we, I mean, I don't know any human who hasn't had something in childhood or adulthood or whatever that is we can call bad. | ||
| Jamie, look at him. | ||
| It's perfect. | ||
| Nothing's ever went wrong. | ||
| Nothing's ever gone wrong with you. | ||
| Just wait. | ||
| It's coming. | ||
| Kids, smooth and calm. | ||
| Young Jamie's collected. | ||
| Yeah, no, everybody's had difficulties. | ||
| It's unavoidable. | ||
| But the bullying thing is very strange how prevalent it is and how it seems to be a part of human nature. | ||
| That people have some strange desire to find someone who's weak or who's insecure or who is... | ||
| And then literally go after them and put yourself in front of them and fuck with them and ruin their life. | ||
| There she is. | ||
| Let's go get her. | ||
| That kind of shit is... | ||
| It's a weird, natural pattern. | ||
| That human beings follow. | ||
| And I've always wondered like, we need to talk to Gad Saad about this, like what is the evolutionary basis for that? | ||
| Like what is it about people that makes them want to do that, especially young people? | ||
| You know, and I think it's different with the way girls do it and the way boys do it. | ||
| How do girls do it? | ||
| Girls, it's a little more sneaky. | ||
| And I think a lot of times it's based more on jealousy. | ||
| And that might have like, I don't know, that might have some... | ||
| Was this girl unattractive? | ||
| No, I think that I was smart. | ||
| School came easy for me. | ||
| The teachers really liked me. | ||
| Parents liked me. | ||
| And so I think that that might have had something to do with it. | ||
| And again, I don't know. | ||
| You know, I was 10. Like, I have no idea why they did what they did. | ||
| But it was more... | ||
| Sneaky, like, passing around notes saying, I joined the I Hate Christine Club and, like, having everyone sign it. | ||
| And just kind of quietly doing it behind my back and pulling all my friends away, where I think boys are just more aggressive. | ||
| Like, they'll beat you up, they'll put you in lockers, they'll do that kind of thing. | ||
| But I think it's just a power thing, and, you know, within every bully is a scared little boy or a little girl. | ||
| So it's just, I think, how we're always... | ||
| Not always, but so much of the time we're trying to compensate for something, you know, where we feel less than, where we feel insecure. | ||
| We think if we can just have power over something or somebody else, that's going to make us feel better. | ||
| There's also a thing that happens when, like, the I Hate Christine Club thing, where the other girls are probably like, I don't want to be on the end of that, so I'm going to join in. | ||
| You get scared that they're gonna go after you next and you want to be on the mean team. | ||
| I think that's what's going on with Donald Trump. | ||
| I really do. | ||
| I think that's a lot of the reason why people are with him and for him. | ||
| He's so vindictive and mean and the way he goes after people. | ||
| I think you see a lot of people support him and sort of like cower to him. | ||
| Like, even that Megyn Kelly chick, who's a super brassy, badass ice princess, she did that interview with him after they had their little thing, when she sat down with him, and she was so, like, submissive. | ||
| It was weird. | ||
| I mean, maybe she was trying to keep her job, maybe Fox News were out of the riot act. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| But it was really bizarre to watch her tone down. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Did you ever see it? | |
| I didn't see the follow-up interview. | ||
| She didn't call him out on anything. | ||
| She just backed off. | ||
| Not really. | ||
| No. | ||
| She was really submissive. | ||
| It was not what I expected. | ||
| It was very orchestrated. | ||
| I mean, I think it was kind of obvious at that point. | ||
| I don't know if he was the nominee or he was on his way. | ||
| It looked like all the other nominees were falling apart. | ||
| And she did this interview where her and him sat in some office room, like sat across from a table. | ||
| It was like, people are scared. | ||
| People are scared of, you know, the strong man or the strong woman, you know, the person who's going to go after you. | ||
| Or the unpredictable. | ||
| Like, I think Donald is so unpredictable, you never know what he's going to throw at you. | ||
| And he will go to whatever lengths he needs to go to to humiliate, to make you feel less than, to throw you off your game. | ||
| You know, so she probably was just like, I better just... | ||
| Well, he just, he sues so many people and so many people sue him. | ||
| He's, that's his world. | ||
| You know, that's, that's like a normal thing for him. | ||
| If he doesn't have a bunch of lawsuits floating around the world, he probably feels like nothing's even happening today. | ||
| You know, I gotta get something going. | ||
| I gotta sue somebody. | ||
| It's just crazy. | ||
| But I think that that, that is one of the reasons why people like are attracted to him because they don't want to be on his bad side. | ||
| I think people are terrified of him, you know, super billionaire, very famous, big, powerful guy. | ||
| I think there's a bunch of people that, like with this I Hate Christine club, if there was this one mean bitch that just wanted to go after you, there's probably a bunch of people that would want to side with her just because they're scared that she's going to turn on them and start going after them next. | ||
| I think that's probably right. | ||
| Yeah, for sure. | ||
| It's a tribal thing. | ||
| It becomes this weird, like, that's our leader now. | ||
| A lot of leaders are the most vicious, mean, nasty, terrifying people. | ||
| You know, look at the dictators in Russia, or Putin, or Kim Jong-un, or what are they known for? | ||
| The dictators in a lot of these Middle Eastern countries. | ||
| They're fucking ruthless, ruthless people. | ||
| And everyone's scared of them, so they all go behind them, you know? | ||
| Yep. | ||
| Better to be behind them than go up against them. | ||
| To feel the wrath. | ||
| Yep. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| I think fear is a big motivator, unfortunately. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| And it, I think, impacts our ability to really think clearly about something because we're just so scared and so threatened that we stop questioning. | ||
| Wait a second. | ||
| Like, what is he really saying? | ||
| What is he really leading me? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah, because that's the thing with Donald when I talk to people who support him. | ||
| I'm like, but you do you do you understand like he would have more money if he would have just like taken the money his father left him and invested it versus all the bankrupting he's done. | ||
| And I mean, he's there's just so much that doesn't make sense about him. | ||
| Yeah, I'm just like, okay, well, there's never been a man alive that needs mushrooms more than Donald Trump. | ||
| If there is, I haven't heard of him. | ||
| I mean, I'm sure there probably has been, but he needs them. | ||
| I think he needs to go straight to the Amazon. | ||
| Yeah, he might need to go right there. | ||
| But he needs something. | ||
| It's just, he's almost like this super impulsive hubris character. | ||
| You know, everything is like when Hillary Clinton says, you know, he doesn't pay taxes, it's because I'm smart. | ||
| Like, you can't help, like, you're on a fucking debate on TV. You said you're smart because you don't pay taxes. | ||
| Right. | ||
| But it really reflects, I mean, it's not just him. | ||
| It really reflects where we are as a society that enough people support him to get him to the place that he is. | ||
| I think we're so polarized right now. | ||
| And look, I don't really love either candidate, to be honest. | ||
| I just don't. | ||
| But I think that, I hope that, maybe this is just wishful thinking, that we'll have four years of whoever it is. | ||
| I think it'll be Hillary. | ||
| And then in the next election, we'll have people run that we're actually excited about supporting and voting for. | ||
| Maybe, but I don't see those people anywhere to be found. | ||
| No one wants the job. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Exactly. | |
| No one wants the job. | ||
| That's the problem. | ||
| It's a crazy job. | ||
| And it's a job where they try to destroy you if you run for it. | ||
| And you're seeing that with Trump, and you're seeing that with Hillary, and they're pulling out all the stops. | ||
| And by the time it's over, the opinion of the commander-in-chief It's going to be terrible, no matter who wins. | ||
| I mean, that Crooked Hillary thing is going to stick forever. | ||
| Hashtag Crooked Hillary. | ||
| It's going to stick forever. | ||
| And people's opinion of him is horrible. | ||
| No matter who wins, and she's going to win, most likely. | ||
| It's not good. | ||
| It's not good for any of us. | ||
| Nope. | ||
| It doesn't represent what we think of the United States as. | ||
| We think of the United States as being this unbelievable place of creativity and innovation and the greatest superpower the world's ever known and this This really progressive force for good in the world. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| Maybe we need to go through this time, though, to shake it up a little bit. | ||
| Maybe things need to get bad to get better. | ||
| I see that in human psychology so much. | ||
| You need to hit rock bottom. | ||
| You need to go through these hard times to have something better emerge. | ||
| But maybe that's just wishful thinking. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I don't know. | |
| I think you're probably right. | ||
| I think we also needed to understand, because of the WikiLeaks revelations, how exactly politics is run, even with the people we think that are the good folks. | ||
| It's all fucking gross and dirty. | ||
| And all the stuff with the Clinton Foundation and all the stuff they did to Bernie Sanders and They conspired to keep that guy out. | ||
| I mean, he's a Democrat, too. | ||
| The whole thing was supposed to be about who is the person that best represents the people, what the people choose. | ||
| But no, the Democratic National Committee was fucking working to make sure that Bernie Sanders wasn't the guy. | ||
| And they were all conspiring with Hillary, and they're all pulling favors. | ||
| It's just like we were talking about before with producers and... | ||
| Networks. | ||
| It's the same shit. | ||
| It's just using your power and your influence and all the friends that you've made and all the years and all the favors and pulling it together. | ||
| But now we're being exposed to it in a way that we haven't really since Watergate. | ||
| Watergate gave us a little window, a tiny little window. | ||
| But the access to information was so minuscule back then. | ||
| We clung to those 15 minutes of whatever Watergate tapes, whatever it was, and we were like, look at this! | ||
| I'm not a crook! | ||
| He was doing what they were all doing. | ||
| He just got caught. | ||
| And we got a sense of it now. | ||
| But now, when you read these emails about how they really feel about each other and all the fucking grossness that goes on... | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| I try to not engage too much in the grossness because it's just like, what's the point? | ||
| I guess the point is to understand what the world really is about, what the structure of the government that looms over us is really all about. | ||
| Why are certain things legal? | ||
| Why are certain things illegal? | ||
| Why are certain loopholes in place? | ||
| How did they get in place? | ||
| Who benefits from them? | ||
| What is a charity? | ||
| And if it is a charity, how come you get paid so much? | ||
| How come you get paid $250,000 to speak, and then all this money goes to your charity, but that $250,000 goes to you? | ||
| You just talked for an hour. | ||
| This is a scam. | ||
| But that's the thing. | ||
| You're being curious. | ||
| You're asking questions, and I think that's helpful. | ||
| I think what so many people are doing are just getting mad and just trash-talking America and the candidates, and that doesn't do any good for anybody. | ||
| If you want to ask questions and get involved and start to get curious, that's awesome. | ||
| That's how we change things. | ||
| But I think too much of this has just been so emotionally driven that people are just getting upset and not really going, huh, what can I do? | ||
| What can I learn? | ||
| How can I shift this in some way? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| It's also people who are super psyched to get behind their candidate, their team. | ||
| I gotta tell you, there's a lot of grossness on both sides, for sure. | ||
| There's a lot of grossness on the Trump side. | ||
| There's a lot of mean assholes that have finally found another mean asshole that's running for president, and they're pumped like he's one of them. | ||
| But then there's a lot of men who are using hashtag I'm with her They're the grossest little fucking white knights. | ||
| Oh my god, I've run across a few of them on Twitter. | ||
| What's a white knight? | ||
| You don't know what a white knight is? | ||
| How dare you? | ||
| You really don't know? | ||
| Like a knight in shining armor? | ||
| Yes, a man who comes along and positions himself as the superior, morally superior, what Michael Shermer calls virtue signaling. | ||
| Someone who would say, you know, hashtag I'm with her, hashtag male feminist. | ||
| Ew, male feminist? | ||
| Yeah, that's real. | ||
| Oh, no. | ||
| Yeah, there's a lot of those out there. | ||
| Yeah, they're trying hard. | ||
| They couldn't get laid any other way, and this is the strategy. | ||
| This is the way. | ||
| The strategy is to position themselves as the super progressive. | ||
| Oh, God. | ||
| Yeah, it's like people who don't want you to think that they're a racist, so they go out of their way to discriminate against white people, other white people, when they're white. | ||
| I read this thing where this woman was saying, if you are a white person, and you are up for a job, and you are up against a person of color, do, period, not, period, take that job. | ||
| You don't deserve it. | ||
| Examine white privilege. | ||
| I was like, oh my god, what liberal arts college do you belong to? | ||
| What fucking crazy shit is in your head? | ||
| Like, what? | ||
| I don't get it at all. | ||
| Do, period. | ||
| Not, period. | ||
| Take that job. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Well, you don't have to get it. | ||
| We went on a tangent. | ||
| We went off. | ||
| We were trying to find out how you become a life coach and all of a sudden we're talking politics and white knights. | ||
| I love it. | ||
| I love tangents. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Fuckers. | ||
| Now I know. | ||
| A whole new understanding of white knights. | ||
| I always understood it as, you know, the man who's going to come in and rescue me. | ||
| That's that. | ||
| But they're positioning themselves as that. | ||
| But that, you know. | ||
| I think we're a couple decades away from all this going away. | ||
| Because I think technology is going- Like public government going away? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Or what? | |
| All bullshit. | ||
| All bullshit and lies. | ||
| I hope so. | ||
| I really believe this. | ||
| I think technology is going to enable, just like no one anticipated, you know, if you can go back to the first days of cameras, if you went back to the 1800s and they first had a camera, no one would have ever thought that in the lifespan of just, I mean, what was the first camera, Jamie? | ||
| Like 1860? | ||
| Something like that? | ||
| Like Civil War era was like the first cameras? | ||
| No one would have ever thought that in two lifespans, which is essentially what it is from then to now, you would be able to send video to Australia instantaneously from something that slips into your pocket. | ||
| It's pretty mind-blowing when you stop to think about how much we've seen in our lifetime. | ||
| Yeah, I think we're just so used to it. | ||
| We're so used to Google and the internet. | ||
| When Hillary Clinton was telling, like, Donald Trump said something, and she's like, Google it. | ||
| Google what he said. | ||
| It's not true. | ||
| And I was like, how hilarious is that? | ||
| Hillary Clinton is telling people to Google Donald Trump. | ||
| Like, that's how beautiful access to information is today. | ||
| I think we are a couple decades, maybe a little bit more, away from a completely new paradigm, a completely new way of accessing information. | ||
| I think we're going to submit to something, whether it's a neural implant or some sort of augmented reality, and we're going to be able to read intention and thoughts. | ||
| There's not going to be any lying in a hundred years. | ||
| I really believe that. | ||
| I totally think you're right, and I think that's why we're seeing so many of these systems break down. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| Like the presidential election, which used to be this coveted, amazing thing. | ||
| Now we're kind of looking at it as like it's a reality TV show, is what it seems like now. | ||
| It's all pussy grabbing. | ||
| Craziness. | ||
| I mean, I just couldn't believe that in the first 20 minutes of the second debate, I had been out of the country for a month, which was so refreshing, and to come back and I watched it, and the first 20 minutes was just character slams. | ||
| It was nothing about the issues or anything, and I was just like, what's happening? | ||
| That doesn't make me happy like it doesn't make me feel like if he shits on her she shits on him and she she tears him down it doesn't make me feel like she's better I liked her in one of the debates because I didn't tune into it until the last like hour and he was saying a bunch of crazy shit and she would start laughing I was like that's how she should handle him yeah she should handle him like he's a child yeah like if she did that but she's fucking crazy too so another tangent Lots | ||
| of tangents. | ||
| Life coaching. | ||
| Oh yeah, back to that. | ||
| How do you get from... | ||
|
unidentified
|
All right, so where was I? People right now are mad at both of us, by the way. | |
| I'm sorry, people. | ||
|
unidentified
|
You don't know shit about politics. | |
| Yeah. | ||
|
unidentified
|
How about you just shut the fuck up? | |
| I will totally own that. | ||
| That's not my area of expertise. | ||
| Guess what? | ||
| Nobody knows shit about politics. | ||
| Even the people doing it. | ||
| That's why Donald Trump's running for fucking president. | ||
| Nobody saw that coming. | ||
| Nobody understands this stupid system. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| But you understand life coaching. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| We're going to come up with a better name in the next hour. | ||
| A better name for life coaching, yes. | ||
| So the way it happened is, all right, so I quit my job, which threw me into an even worse depression because that was my whole identity. | ||
| It was my success in being an agent. | ||
| And so then in a period of, I don't know, like six to eight months, a bunch of things happened. | ||
| I went into lots of debt because I tried to keep up with this lifestyle. | ||
| I was estranged from my family for a bit because I made a choice that they didn't really like. | ||
| And I got diagnosed with another autoimmune disorder on top of everything else. | ||
| And then I was engaged and thought, oh, I'm going to be a wife. | ||
| Like, that's my next role. | ||
| I'll be fine. | ||
| And then six months before my wedding, he dumped me cold turkey. | ||
| So in that, you know, I know people listening have been through worse, but in that, like, span at 26 years old, losing my career and money and family and health and love, it was kind of like, this sucks. | ||
| I really didn't know what to do. | ||
| And I had... | ||
| Honestly, a moment on my bathroom floor, which I don't know why I was on my bathroom floor, it was disgusting, but I was just laying there. | ||
| It's a good spot to cry. | ||
| The tiles are nice and cold, you know? | ||
| It feels very dramatic. | ||
|
unidentified
|
And I had this, like... | |
| Kind of insight, I guess you could say, of how much I was relating to everything as a total victim, as like everything was happening to me. | ||
| And then it dawned on me, I'm the common denominator in like all of these situations. | ||
| So either I have just really bad luck or I have some influence over this. | ||
| And, again, like, it was just a teeny bit of an insight, but it was enough of a new perspective on my life that kind of got me off the bathroom floor and started to give me some kind of hope and started to make me realize I needed help and, like, the way I was doing my life wasn't going to work anymore. | ||
| And so I found—I thought I was having a quarter-life crisis. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| And I found a book by that name and I read it and it was fine, but it wasn't going deep enough for me. | ||
| So I decided to write a book about like my experience and everything I was learning and how I like was getting myself off my bathroom floor, I guess. | ||
| And I was interviewing people for the book and they kept saying things to me like, can I set up a session with you? | ||
| And I'd say, why? | ||
| I got all the information. | ||
| And they said, well, aren't you a coach or a counselor or something? | ||
| And I'd say, no. | ||
| And they said, you should be. | ||
| You should be. | ||
| And I kept hearing this over and over and over again. | ||
| So I went to my coach and kind of my first teacher, who I met when I was 22, and I was still seen. | ||
| And she had a major impact on my life. | ||
| And I said, Mona, you know, everybody's telling me I should do this. | ||
| And I've been looking for my career for, you know, years. | ||
| And maybe this is what I'm supposed to do. | ||
| She's like, yeah. | ||
| Yep, that's what you're supposed to do. | ||
| And I go, I've been coming for five years. | ||
| Like, why didn't you tell me this? | ||
| And she said, you know, you had to figure it out. | ||
| You had to find it. | ||
| And so that's how it just started. | ||
| Like, people kept reflecting back to me, hey, you're good at this. | ||
| You should do this. | ||
| And I didn't really know how or what. | ||
| And so then I just became, I started studying it. | ||
| I apprenticed with her. | ||
| I got training. | ||
| I got a master's degree. | ||
| I wrote more books. | ||
| And it just sort of happened out of my own life and out of just Creating things that I thought would help people and people going, actually, this is really helping me and can I talk to you more? | ||
| And that was, you know, a good 10, 11 years ago. | ||
| If you push the mic forward a little bit more, it'll make the sound a little bit more consistent. | ||
| It sounds good in your ear. | ||
| Just the recording will be weird. | ||
| Got it. | ||
| Isn't that an interesting thing that it's oftentimes small choices that people make that dictate what happens to them in their life, but if you just decide that things are happening to you, you don't take any responsibility for any of the choices. | ||
| That's, to me, the biggest difference from people who are able to change their life and people who don't. | ||
| Is ownership. | ||
| Is realizing that, yes, things happen, but we're not victims. | ||
| And anything can happen, but the same exact thing can happen to you and I. And we can make different choices about what we make it mean and how we respond to it. | ||
| And we're going to create different results based on that. | ||
| So it's not what happens to people. | ||
| It's not just luck. | ||
| It's truly, what are you going to choose to believe about it? | ||
| And that's, to me, the key differentiator between Staying where you are and kind of regressing as you get older and just repeating your familiar patterns and more stubborn and all those things and you know just looking for those short-term bursts of happiness and like a trip or a bottle of wine or whatever versus like really getting clear about how you can change your life, what your purpose is, what brings you joy and like who you really are. | ||
| There's a thing about life coaching, too, or any but—I mean, just forget that word—but the idea that you're dispensing advice or giving out inspiration or, you know, writing things down that have affected and helped and enhanced you, people want to dismiss that stuff. | ||
| Like, oh, I don't need that. | ||
| Oh, that's nothing. | ||
| Right. | ||
| One of the best things about being a part of a community or being a part of a culture is that you get to look at all of the things that people have done that have benefited them and all of the positive choices that someone has made and you can learn and experience those without having to go through all their bullshit. | ||
| You know, and there's a lot of things that I've learned from people, whether I've read things that they've said or listened to speeches that they've given about mistakes that they've made where I've come across a similar moment in my life. | ||
| I'm like, I know what this is. | ||
| I know what that is. | ||
| I think it's one of the best tools that we have. | ||
| When it comes to improving and enhancing your own life, your own individual experience, is looking at all the different shit that other people have done. | ||
| And it's a weird one because people dismiss it so easily. | ||
| First of all, there's a certain amount of hubris and a certain amount of ego attached to it where they don't want to admit they have an issue. | ||
| Or they don't want to admit they need help, or they don't want to admit that they need to be inspired, or they need some sort of motivation. | ||
| I think it's fear. | ||
| Back to that whole, this life that I know is comfortable, I may not like it, but I'm so scared of uncertainty that I don't want to make the changes. | ||
| People are terrified of the unknown. | ||
| There's also a lot of fuckery afoot when it comes to life coaches and motivational speakers. | ||
| And there's a lot of hosers, like we were talking about before the podcast about a couple of hosers we know. | ||
| There's hosers out there. | ||
| But it's like everything else. | ||
| There's bad car mechanics. | ||
| They'll put a used part in your car and fuck you over. | ||
| There's bad doctors. | ||
| There's bad everything. | ||
| Everything in this world has someone who's half-assing it. | ||
| And the problem with that whole, the idea of being a life coach or being a motivational speaker is that there's not really like, you don't have to get a PhD to do it. | ||
| You don't have to, you know, you don't have to like prove yourself. | ||
| Like Mike has opened up 15 different businesses, so he's going to show you how to do a business. | ||
| Like this guy's a successful businessman. | ||
| That makes sense. | ||
| But there's a lot of people out there that are doing life coaching that are fucking failures. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And maybe that's not the worst thing in the world to be a failure because you've learned from those failures and maybe your achievement or your contribution is expressing those failures and your revelations from those failures and that could help somebody else not make those same mistakes. | ||
| Yeah, I mean I think I've had a lot of so-called failures and mistakes. | ||
| Me too. | ||
| Did you ever have one of those like bathroom floor moments, those like life pivots? | ||
| I'm a man, first of all. | ||
| I don't cry like a chick on the floor. | ||
| What's the man's worth? | ||
| Yeah, I mean, all bullshit aside, yeah, there's always... | ||
| For a comic, the big one is bombing. | ||
| Like, bombing on stage is devastating. | ||
| And you start thinking, like, I can't do this. | ||
| Like, you can only take so many of those bombings in your life. | ||
| It's like getting beaten up. | ||
| You can only get beaten up so many times. | ||
| Before your brain stops working right. | ||
| There's that. | ||
| Relationship breakups for sure. | ||
| Devastations, I think, are always the best for a rebirth. | ||
| And at the time, they don't feel like it. | ||
| No. | ||
| And devastations, anything devastating that happens to you in your life, while it's happening, you feel like, I don't know if I can take this. | ||
| But then you get through it and you have this sort of enhanced perspective. | ||
| We live in an amazing time where you can see, not that you should revel in other people's failures, but most of your failure is nothing in comparison to what's going on in Syria or a million different parts of the world that are just filled with fucking chaos. | ||
| Most people can't see that because you see your life and your life is all you know and your life is falling apart. | ||
| Right. | ||
| Well, and I think, too, you know, we get so kind of narcissistic in our problems that we forget the bigger perspective. | ||
| And we don't... | ||
| A lot of people talk about being happy all the time. | ||
| And I just don't think that that's real. | ||
| I've grown through contrasts. | ||
| I think I really understand happiness and joy because I've really understood depression and sadness. | ||
| That polarity, I think, is such a big part of what we're here for. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I mean, you could read a book about different parts of the world and what's going on. | ||
| If you're still happy after you read that book, there's something wrong with you. | ||
| Right. | ||
| Probably shouldn't be happy all the time. | ||
| There was actually, I think it was Scientific America or something like that, that had an article recently saying you're not going to be happy all the time and you shouldn't be. | ||
| And there's a reason for it. | ||
| Exactly. | ||
| There's peaks and valleys in everything in life. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| And that, you know, for people listening that might be in one of those valleys, it's like, don't try to just get through it. | ||
| Mm-hmm. | ||
| Really ask, you know, what can I learn from this? | ||
| That was my biggest thing is I stopped asking, why is this happening to me? | ||
| And started asking, what can I learn? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| So instead of painting yourself as a victim, you paint yourself as someone who's present in the moment and just, okay, I don't want to do this anymore. | ||
| Right. | ||
| Let's figure out what's going on. | ||
| Exactly. | ||
| And we don't, a lot of times we don't have the tools. | ||
| And that's where things like life coaching and personal development come in handy. | ||
| So we can go and get those tools instead of using our old coping mechanisms by like being strong or overing, overworking, over drinking, over, you know, jumping into a relationship, like whatever it may be. | ||
| We don't really learn how to deal with disappointment, failure, anger, shame, any of those things. | ||
| And so we're kind of left to these quick fix devices that, and I think that's a big reason addiction is such a problem, is because we don't really learn how to How to manage emotion and how to manage disappointment. | ||
| And so we go for that thing that makes us feel better in the moment. | ||
| But the problem is we have to keep upping the ante. | ||
| At first, that one glass of wine does the trick, but then you need two, then you need three, then you need vodka, then you need whatever it may be. | ||
| And so, I mean, why I'm so passionate about what I do is, first of all, I never thought I could be happy. | ||
| Like, I really didn't. | ||
| I thought that this, you know, I was going to be depressed and I just was going to constantly be looking for something to fix me. | ||
| I never really truly thought this life that I'm living now was possible. | ||
| Again, externally things look fine, but internally I'm talking about a totally different kind of experience. | ||
| And it's only because of those really awful moments, I call them expectation hangovers, that I was kind of desperate enough to let go of my normal coping mechanisms and my trying to control everything. | ||
| It was like the ultimate in surrender, truly, of going, okay, I don't know. | ||
| I need to find a different way to deal with this. | ||
| And that's really what has led me down the path that I am today. | ||
| So, you know, I think that life coaching and the personal transformation industry and all that, like you said, there's a lot of, what do you call them? | ||
| Hokies? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Something? | |
| Hosers. | ||
| Hosers. | ||
| Like Bob and Doug McKenzie. | ||
| I don't even know who that is. | ||
| They're a fucking 1980s silent live character. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Oh, jeez. | |
| They call each other Hosers. | ||
| They're from Canada. | ||
| Oh, my God. | ||
| Hey, Hosers. | ||
| Remember those guys? | ||
| I don't know why I came up with why hosers. | ||
| I'm learning all these words. | ||
| This is great. | ||
| I don't know why hoser. | ||
| This is great. | ||
| I hardly ever use that. | ||
| I don't know why it popped up. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I love it. | |
| I want to go back to the Prozac thing. | ||
| Yeah, yeah, yeah. | ||
| I'm super passionate about that. | ||
| So your parents put you on that stuff when you were 10 years old. | ||
| Well, I think it was more the doctors. | ||
| Okay, your doctors. | ||
| I'm sorry. | ||
| Your doctors put you on that stuff when you were 10 years old. | ||
| Yeah, like ink block tests. | ||
| Ink block tests? | ||
| Yeah, you know. | ||
| What do you see? | ||
| A demon. | ||
| Yeah, exactly. | ||
| What do you see? | ||
| Death. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| What do you see? | ||
| A skull. | ||
| I know. | ||
| I probably said things like a butterfly. | ||
| That bitch I hate from school with a fucking axe in her head. | ||
| So the doctor puts you on Prozac. | ||
| What kind of an effect does that have on you? | ||
| I mean, it actually helped. | ||
| I think it really helped. | ||
| I think it helped me... | ||
| Gosh, it's so hard to remember, too. | ||
| I mean, I was 10. But when I talked to my parents about it, they're like, you know, it did help. | ||
| Because I really do think that because of everything that happened, you know, my brain chemistry did shift. | ||
| You know, I do think that we can shift our brain chemistry with repetitive thoughts. | ||
| And, you know, I had enough thoughts about... | ||
| You know, I'm not likable. | ||
| I had just an intense inner critic in my head. | ||
| And I do think that shifted my brain chemistry. | ||
| And I do think that the medicine helped me at least get to a point where, you know, I was like, kind of awake again. | ||
| How long did that take? | ||
| I don't remember, but I know that, you know, especially in my 20s, like... | ||
| You were still on it? | ||
| Oh, gosh. | ||
| I was on it until 30. Yeah. | ||
| I was on every... | ||
| I was on Prozac, Wellbutrin. | ||
| For 20 years? | ||
| 20 years. | ||
| From the time you were 10? | ||
| So all through high school you were on that stuff? | ||
| Yep. | ||
| Wow. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yep. | |
| I believed that I needed it. | ||
| Just like a diabetic would take insulin. | ||
| So how long ago did you get off of it? | ||
| Seven and a half years ago. | ||
| I never have any regression or dips, but I was super intentional about getting off of it. | ||
| I didn't just stop, especially after 20 years. | ||
| It took me a while. | ||
| It took a lot of the emotional work that I was doing with my coach, Mona, because so much of depression is suppression. | ||
| When all that stuff was happening, I think I was pretty angry about it, but I had no outlet for that, especially as a girl. | ||
| Like, boys, again, can go out and get stuff out. | ||
| But a lot of times, and this is why I think so many women get irritable and bitchy and all those kind of things, is because women, we don't have, like, that outlet for anger. | ||
| And so we internalize a lot of that. | ||
| Like, we can do sadness, but anger a lot of times gets suppressed. | ||
| And so a lot of, like, me getting off my medicine and not feeling depressed was not being suppressed. | ||
| What about exercise? | ||
| Well, see, exercise is okay, but until you go back and actually process the emotion... | ||
| I mean, exercise is good in terms of moving the energy, but a lot of times you have to attach the feeling with the movement, right? | ||
| So a lot of my retreats that I do where I just bring women, I facilitate an anger burn for them. | ||
| An anger burn? | ||
| An anger burn. | ||
| What is that? | ||
| It's like a safe place for women to get their anger out. | ||
| And it's not just catharsis. | ||
| There's a whole kind of process I put them through. | ||
| So they kind of reconnect maybe earlier life experiences where they didn't feel protected or they felt unsafe or they felt abused or whatever that is. | ||
| Because again, this all comes from my own life experience and working with, gosh, thousands of people at this point. | ||
| I see over and over again people that are depressed, shut down, have a lot of anxiety, not happy with their life, have... | ||
| Some unprocessed thing from their past that just needs to move. | ||
| And when I create this space for people to start to move that energy, it's like underneath there is creativity and passion and peace and freedom from anxiety and all that kind of stuff. | ||
| So when... | ||
| You're looking at me like... | ||
| No, no, not at all. | ||
| I'm just listening. | ||
| He's looking at me like, who is this girl? | ||
| So when people have that space to unleash that and to let the energy move through them, because I think there's a difference between emotion and feeling. | ||
| So feelings to me are physiological responses to thoughts. | ||
| So if I sit here and think about the future that I'm scared about, I'm going to feel anxiety. | ||
| If I have like, oh my gosh, what if someone breaks into my house tonight? | ||
| I'm going to feel fear. | ||
| I can feel regret because of a thought or guilt. | ||
| But emotion, like energy in motion. | ||
| If someone hurts one of your kids, you're going to experience anger. | ||
| It's a natural response. | ||
| Someone close to us dies or we have a heartbreak, it's natural to feel the emotion of sadness. | ||
| And I think that there's a lot of kind of misleading information about like, oh, we create all our feelings with our thoughts and we can just like affirm our way out of things and think our way out of things. | ||
| And to some degree, that's true. | ||
| Changing our thinking does a lot. | ||
| But with some core emotions like anger, shame, sadness, I think we've got to feel them. | ||
| And I think that that's what people are really scared of is actually kind of opening that box, opening that can of worms and going back and actually feeling those feelings. | ||
| But the thing is, they're in there. | ||
| And so if you don't get them up and out in a healthy way, then... | ||
| I think that's what creates a lot of suppression, a lot of depression, perhaps maybe even disease, things like that, because they just get stored in our body somewhere. | ||
| Make sense? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| So what do you do to these gals? | ||
| What do I do to these gals? | ||
| It's just creating the space. | ||
| Do they just scream? | ||
| Pillow fight? | ||
|
unidentified
|
What do they do? | |
| No, it's not a pillow fight. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Give them a punching bag? | |
| No, it's not that. | ||
| I definitely give them something to hit with, like those foam noodles. | ||
| You give them foam noodles? | ||
| I do. | ||
| I do. | ||
| Oh gosh, the comments to this are going to be crazy. | ||
| I can't believe this, but here we go. | ||
| So I... And I put on some pretty intense music. | ||
| Like Slayer? | ||
| I don't even know. | ||
| Not Slayer. | ||
| You don't even know? | ||
| Not Slayer. | ||
| Not Slayer. | ||
| Not that intense? | ||
| Metallica? | ||
| It's more like... | ||
| Enter Sandman? | ||
| Really? | ||
| Yeah, Metallica's on my playlist. | ||
| I can pull up my playlist later if you really want to see it. | ||
| You have a beat the shit out of a foam roller playlist? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Oh, for sure. | |
| Oh, yeah. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Okay. | ||
| Yeah, yeah. | ||
| It's called my anger burn playlist. | ||
| Your anger burn playlist. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah, yeah, yeah. | |
| Yeah, yeah, yeah. | ||
| Well, I'm telling you. | ||
| Actually, so one time I was doing this. | ||
| I rented a house actually out near here, Agora. | ||
| And people were doing this process. | ||
| And again, like, I prepped them. | ||
| Like, you know, I... They bring to mind things that they've maybe, like I said, were angry about, things from their childhood. | ||
| It's not just like I throw them in a room with loud music and say, go after it. | ||
| There's a lot of processes I put them through to get them to this point. | ||
| But anyway, so we're doing this one time in this house and there's like, you know, 20 women, loud music yelling and the cops show up. | ||
| And the guy's like, what do you like? | ||
| What's going on here? | ||
| And I step out. | ||
| I step out and I explain. | ||
| I said, you know, a lot of times this is a women's, you know, workshop. | ||
| And a lot of times, you know, we hold back our emotions and, you know, we end up getting irritable. | ||
| And this is just a healthy way for, you know, people to heal and work on their emotions. | ||
| And the cop looks at me and he's like, can I have your card I want to send my wife? | ||
| No kidding. | ||
| That's what the cop said to me. | ||
| So there's, I've gotten lots of calls from husbands and boyfriends and even kids and like, thank you. | ||
| Because there's something about, it's like pulling off our armor. | ||
| Honestly. | ||
| And there's something about doing like the deeper work and kind of going to those scary places that takes a layer off of us. | ||
| I think, I mean, it's, it's similar to plant medicine in a lot of ways of like going to those places where, that are kind of like, where you come out the other side and you have a deeper understanding of, of yourself. | ||
| Um, So by doing something completely ridiculous and crazy and just letting loose and all the madness involved with it, it's almost like a reset for you. | ||
| Yeah, and it's not, again, like, it's facilitated. | ||
| It's not this crazy, you know, people going, you know, screaming. | ||
| It's not Fight Club. | ||
| It's not, because there's a difference between catharsis and, like, actual processing stuff. | ||
| But it's just, and again, I think we don't really understand emotion to a certain level, and we think that big emotion is crazy. | ||
| And it's not necessarily. | ||
| I think what is crazy is What makes people crazy is suppressing it their whole life and trying to manage it through their mind or through doing things or through whatever else versus actually like being willing to look at those parts of ourself. | ||
| Because we're, you know, we're humans. | ||
| We have a mind. | ||
| We have emotions. | ||
| We have actions. | ||
| We have, you know, our spiritual self, whatever you want to call that, like something that's connected to something bigger than us. | ||
| And I think we need a holistic approach to really change. | ||
| Now, from the time that you decided to get off of the antidepressants, did you follow a protocol? | ||
| Did you go to a doctor to discuss it with them? | ||
| Did you read anything about how to do that? | ||
| And what advice would you give to anybody out there that might be listening that also is going through that same sort of situation? | ||
| Doctors told me I couldn't do it, so I stopped going to doctors. | ||
| Ever. | ||
| Stay on it. | ||
| I'm getting paid. | ||
| Exactly. | ||
| So I had, you know, my coach at the time, who was really helpful, who's more than, again, my coach is such like a, I don't even know what to call her, she was... | ||
| How did you find her? | ||
| I was dating a guy who was an addict and complaining about him to a girlfriend at lunch for like the 80th time. | ||
| What kind of addict? | ||
| Pills? | ||
| No, drugs, like coke, alcohol, maybe pills, pills too. | ||
| Fun times? | ||
| Good times. | ||
|
unidentified
|
My Hollywood life. | |
| Yeah, it was super great. | ||
| Yeah, I was popping Xanax while he was doing all that. | ||
| So, anyway, I've totally lost my train of thought. | ||
| How'd you find your coach? | ||
| Oh, yeah, yeah. | ||
| How'd I find my coach? | ||
| So, we're sitting at lunch. | ||
| I'm talking about this for like the 80th time. | ||
| And she goes, I can't listen to this anymore. | ||
| I went and saw this kind of kooky woman. | ||
| Go see her. | ||
| So, and I had been like to shrinks my whole life. | ||
| And I had never been to like a coach. | ||
| I had always been to therapists and psychiatrists. | ||
| And so, nothing against therapists and psychiatrists. | ||
| They do good work. | ||
| But I had kind of like reached my limit with it. | ||
| And so I go to this woman's house and she's like totally stuck in 1985. Like her decor, her fashion, everything. | ||
| And I sit down and I sit across from her and she didn't even see me in her normal office. | ||
| I think she knew she needed to like totally get me out of my comfort zone. | ||
| So she put me in her son's bedroom with like these race car bunk beds. | ||
| And I'm sitting there on this race car bunk bed going, where am I? Like, how did I get here? | ||
| And she walks in, she sits in front of me, and it was the first time in my life, and I felt loved by my parents, but this was the first time in my life I felt really seen. | ||
| Like, it was almost uncomfortable. | ||
| Like, this woman could almost see through me. | ||
| She could see me. | ||
| She could really see me. | ||
| And I felt zero judgment from her. | ||
| Like, zero. | ||
| And although it was scary a little bit because I felt very vulnerable, there was something so reassuring about it because she was the first practitioner I had seen that didn't see me as broken. | ||
| She really just saw me. | ||
| And she was the one that in so many ways helped me over the years get off the medication by teaching me how to release my emotions, by helping me understand that bad feelings aren't necessarily bad. | ||
| I also got very clear about my diet. | ||
| I got off gluten because a lot of times gluten can impact brain chemistry. | ||
| I stopped drinking. | ||
| I wasn't ever a big drinker, but I stopped drinking for about two years because alcohol is a depressant. | ||
| I'd always been into exercise and fitness and eating healthy and everything like that. | ||
| And then I also started meditating and finding some kind of connection to a higher power. | ||
| I didn't really have a name for it at the time, but something... | ||
| Where I didn't feel like I was so alone. | ||
| Because that was kind of one of the scary things about depression. | ||
| You feel alone a lot of the time. | ||
| And so it was a combination of all of those things that over time and the belief that I could. | ||
| I really had to change my belief that I could get off of them. | ||
| So for people that are considering it, don't just stop. | ||
| Like it's dangerous just to stop because that can really mess with your brain chemistry. | ||
| Find somebody who knows something about this and can put you on a plan, can help you. | ||
| I'm not a doctor. | ||
| I'm not here to give medical advice, so consult a doctor. | ||
| But for me, it was number one, the belief that I could, and number two, finding the people that could really support me, and number three, making the lifestyle changes that I needed to make to support it and being willing to go to that dark scary place that I was afraid to go to. | ||
| What do you mean by when you say that she was the first person who didn't see you as broken? | ||
| What do you mean by they all saw you as broken? | ||
| Well, I think when, you know, for me, when I would go to one of these doctors or therapists, I mean, they'd see that I was on medication since I was 10. And they kind of relate to me in that way. | ||
| Like dismissive? | ||
| No, just more like I had a label. | ||
| Like this is it. | ||
| You're depressed. | ||
| And so that's why they weren't willing to consider you getting off of the medication. | ||
| They felt like the medication is a part of who you are. | ||
| You got to accept it. | ||
| It's a daily thing. | ||
| It's like brushing your teeth. | ||
| You're not going to stop. | ||
| Yeah, maybe. | ||
| I mean, I don't even know what they were thinking. | ||
| I just know how I felt. | ||
| And I just did it. | ||
| And maybe it was because like at the time I didn't believe it yet either. | ||
| Maybe I needed someone who believed in it more than I Do you think that also the people that deal with people every day, whether you're a psychologist or a psychiatrist or whatever, that you're so inundated with people and their fucking problems that after a while you just become overwhelmed and it's very difficult to see people and have a fresh reset every time you see someone like, this is a new person, her name's Christine, hey Christine, what's going on with you? | ||
| Yeah, I think you're right. | ||
| I think it's therapists, psychiatrists, they have hard jobs. | ||
| Imagine your whole day is person after person talking about what's wrong with their life. | ||
| That can be very draining. | ||
| Even when I first started as a life coach and I saw person after person after person, I really had to learn not to take that on and not to let it drain me. | ||
| So again, I have a lot of respect for... | ||
| My mom's a therapist, so I have a lot of respect for therapists and psychiatrists who are very helpful to me. | ||
| I just think for me, in my life journey and what I wanted, I just... | ||
| I didn't want to spend the rest of my life medicated. | ||
| I just really didn't. | ||
| So what is the difference between life on medication and life off medication? | ||
| And how long is the process of weaning yourself? | ||
| I mean, I think it took me... | ||
| It took me a good two years to feel like it was finally kind of out of my system. | ||
| Two years? | ||
| How long was it before you were actually stopping taking it? | ||
| Well, gosh, I can't remember exactly. | ||
| But I think I probably weaned for a good six months and then it was like a year and a half until I felt like it was like cleared out of my system. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Wow. | |
| So for six months, you slowly weaned yourself off of it. | ||
| And then at the end of six months, you're not taking the medication anymore, but you still feel foggy? | ||
| Like, what do you feel? | ||
| Yeah, it was like my system was recalibrating. | ||
| You know, all my brain chemistry was recalibrating. | ||
| And, you know, because that stuff affects your brain chemistry. | ||
| It affected my hormones. | ||
| Like it just, you know, it affected a lot. | ||
| So did you take like one pill and then cut it down to three-quarters of a pill and then to a half a pill? | ||
| I did consult a psychiatrist and they gave me like a weaning plan. | ||
| So yeah, whatever. | ||
| Different people, like it's not a standard thing. | ||
| Like different psychiatrists will tell you different things. | ||
| So it depends on what dosage you're on, how long you've been on it, which medication you're on, what the side effects for it are, those kind of things. | ||
| What does it feel like when you're first day, no pills? | ||
| Do you remember that day? | ||
| I remember the first day I woke up and I felt clear. | ||
| Like I felt like it was like... | ||
| Like Scientology clear? | ||
| No. | ||
| No, I don't want to get kicked out of here. | ||
| No, like it was like out of me. | ||
| Right. | ||
| And I was like, oh my gosh. | ||
| Like it just felt like a fog and a heaviness had lifted. | ||
| And I also felt like... | ||
| I had deeper access to my creativity, my intuition, And all those things were present, but there was just sort of like some white noise there. | ||
| And I also like, for me, depression manifested as being incredibly self-critical, like super self-critical, like this very, very, very loud inner critic. | ||
| And so that started to lift too. | ||
| But again, I was doing all kinds of other work at the same time. | ||
| I was studying with my life coach. | ||
| I was getting a master's degree in spiritual psychology. | ||
| I was What is spiritual psychology? | ||
| Yes, good question. | ||
| So it's a place called the University of Santa Monica, and I didn't know anything about this place, but I had been a life coach, and I thought, okay, if I'm helping people with their life, I've got to know how to help them deal with their past. | ||
| Like, I can't just... | ||
| Work on present and future without like having some skills for dealing with your past. | ||
| And so I was researching schools. | ||
| I thought if I could get a master's degree in psychology that would help me and that would be good for my career and all those things to have like some credentials. | ||
| So I researched and I find this school and I didn't really know anything about it. | ||
| I'm like this is great and the spiritual part didn't have anything to do with any religion or anything like that. | ||
| It was more of the premise of you know That traditional psychology is kind of a little bit more about like labels and spiritual psychology is more people have the inner resources they need to heal. | ||
| And I didn't, again, didn't know much about it. | ||
| Show up at this school with my laptop thinking I'm going to like take notes and there's going to be lectures. | ||
| But there were no deaths. | ||
| It was a highly experiential school. | ||
| It's, like I said, a two-year program. | ||
| And in that, I really learned how to change my belief systems, heal stuff from my past, connect to a part of me. | ||
| Because we all have like our basic self, like our conscious part. | ||
| But I believe we also have something deeper. | ||
| We can call it our intuition. | ||
| We can call it our gut feeling. | ||
| We can call it our authentic self. | ||
| But there's some kind of inner wisdom that I think all of us have access to. | ||
| And this program really helped me get more access to that part of me so that I could start listening to that more than my old conditioning, my old belief systems, my old fears. | ||
| Because when we're born, we're kind of this blank slate. | ||
| And then stuff happens and we form these stories about our lives and who we are and how we get love and how we get validation and how we get acceptance and How life works and who we are and our identity. | ||
| And it's kind of just a story. | ||
| And we can change that story, but it takes work going back and deconstructing that story and letting go of some old beliefs that maybe we've hung on to to create a different one. | ||
| So that's what so much of my journey has been about is kind of looking at what's the story I've created about my life and how can I change it? | ||
| Because the story that I had was I'm depressed. | ||
| I have to be achieving all the time. | ||
| Being hard on myself is how I motivate myself, so on and so forth. | ||
| I'm constantly rejected, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. | ||
| And by believing that story, it was creating results in my life that aligned with that. | ||
| And so to create different results, I had to have a different story to tell. | ||
| And so there's this shift that has to take place. | ||
| And it's like turning a battleship, right? | ||
| It's not a quick thing. | ||
| It takes a long time. | ||
| No, it's not. | ||
| And I think that's another kind of letdowns people have when they go to a seminar or read one book. | ||
| They expect to change overnight. | ||
| And it's a process. | ||
| Do you remember The Secret? | ||
| I do. | ||
| There was a girl, I've told this story before, but she was so nice. | ||
| She's friends with my friend Kelly. | ||
| Kelly Kirsten. | ||
| You know Kelly Kirsten? | ||
| Comedian. | ||
| Funny girl. | ||
| Anyway, she was at the Comedy Store one night, and she was talking to Kelly, and I was talking to her, and she started going on about her future, all the things that she was going to do. | ||
| She was going to be married within a year. | ||
| She was going to have the career that she wants. | ||
| She was going to do this and that and that and this. | ||
| And I was so confused. | ||
| And she was like, I found the secret. | ||
| Do you know about the secret? | ||
| I go, oh, the power of positive thinking, that kind of thing. | ||
| She's like, it's not just that. | ||
| It's not just positive thinking. | ||
| It's like you do create your own future. | ||
| You create your own identity. | ||
| You create reality. | ||
| I was like, okay. | ||
| Mm-hmm. | ||
| Like, you sure? | ||
| And she's like, yeah, I'm sure. | ||
| You know, I'm positive. | ||
| Okay, good luck. | ||
| I'm like, boy. | ||
| The problem with all that stuff, of course, if you've never heard of it, is what is the term for it that they're trying to achieve? | ||
| Law of attraction? | ||
| Law of attraction, yeah. | ||
| What they're trying to achieve is they're trying to, like, you take a photo of your dream house, you pin it on your wall, you take a photo of a Ferrari, you pin that on your wall. | ||
| You're going to get those things. | ||
| The problem is when you watch those videos, when they say, you know, I had this photo of my home on the wall. | ||
| I had the Ferrari that I wanted. | ||
| I had my dream wife. | ||
| Now I have those things. | ||
| I made those things happen with intention and with thought. | ||
| Do you know how many fucking people have a photo of a beautiful house on their wall and a Ferrari and they got no fucking house and they got no Ferrari and they never will? | ||
| Like you're taking it from a biased pool of successful people who will tell you that this happened to them. | ||
| But there are literally millions of people who think positive and nothing ever happens to them. | ||
| So this girl... | ||
| Who um... | ||
| It's a very nice person. | ||
| She came to one of my shows like a year later. | ||
| And we're hanging out outside. | ||
| And I go, how's everything? | ||
| What are you doing? | ||
| She's like, well, it's really a drag. | ||
| You know, because I was convinced that by this time I would have all these things. | ||
| But, you know, my dad, he's still, you know, fuck up and this and that. | ||
| And I've got this problem, that problem. | ||
| And I just don't understand it. | ||
| I don't understand it. | ||
| I believe that I was so sure. | ||
| And we had this like... | ||
| It was really interesting because she was like two different people. | ||
| Like I'd met her twice, right? | ||
| So I meet her this one time and she's just aglow with this delusion that now she's got it. | ||
| And she thought also that talking about it all the time was part of how you affirm it. | ||
| So she was saying, you know, I'm going to be married in a year. | ||
| I'm going to do this. | ||
| I'm following the secret. | ||
| She kept saying it. | ||
| And then a year later, she was just, I don't get it. | ||
| It didn't work. | ||
| And so we had this sort of heart-to-heart about it. | ||
| I haven't talked to her again, and I don't know what the hell happened to her. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| But I'll never forget it. | ||
| Because the two different people, the girl who was kind of crazy, like all wide-eyed and... | ||
| Believing. | ||
| And then a year later, a year and a half, I think, just wasn't happening. | ||
| And life was still kind of shitty. | ||
| And she couldn't understand why the career didn't happen and life didn't happen. | ||
| It's a slow shift. | ||
| It's a slow shift. | ||
| And I think... | ||
| The law of attraction can be misleading because it's... | ||
| You know, change takes more than I put a picture up and I do some positive affirmations. | ||
| If, like, down deep you don't feel like you're worthy or you're not going to be able to attract those things. | ||
| You've got to, like, kind of go back and deal with core issues and core belief systems in order to shift things in your life. | ||
| I mean, if it was as easy as putting pictures up on our wall... | ||
| Everybody would have, you know, Lamborghinis and hot wives and husbands. | ||
| But it takes more than that. | ||
| It takes being willing to, like, do some work and take some responsibility rather than just thinking the universe is Santa Claus and just was going to pop something into your life. | ||
| I equate it to people that are morbidly obese that want a six-pack. | ||
| Like, it can be done. | ||
| Can be done. | ||
| But goddamn. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| You got a long road. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| You know, if you want to climb Mount Everest and you're starting in Santa Monica, you got to fucking get to Mount Everest. | ||
| Absolutely. | ||
| Right? | ||
| Absolutely. | ||
| And then that's when people ask me, how did you get off antidepressants? | ||
| I'm not like, oh, I just did this and then I did this and then I did this. | ||
| It was... | ||
| It was years of like, you know, deciding I was going to and having the right people around. | ||
| It wasn't an easy thing. | ||
| It's probably the hardest thing I've done, you know? | ||
| Now, what is the difference between antidepressants and like Xanax? | ||
| Like when you're taking, you said you were taking both. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Why do you need the Xanax if you're already pilled up on the antidepressants? | ||
| I mean, again, not an MD, so not my territory. | ||
| But for me, like I, the antidepressants just kind of kept me steady. | ||
| My boyfriend at the time in my crazy Hollywood life, I just had so much anxiety. | ||
| And, you know, you go to a doctor and you're like, I have so much anxiety. | ||
| How do you define anxiety? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Are you worried about the future? | |
| Worried a lot. | ||
| Worried a lot. | ||
| Kind of high-strung. | ||
| Not able to calm down. | ||
| Yeah, just that. | ||
| Just normal anxiety. | ||
| But I didn't have tools then. | ||
| My tools then were medicine. | ||
| Okay. | ||
| Now I have better tools. | ||
| So now, do you take anything? | ||
| No. | ||
| I mean supplements. | ||
| Supplements. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| Just vitamins and stuff. | ||
| Vitamins. | ||
| Yeah, I'm super like, I love human hacking and human optimization. | ||
| I love exercising. | ||
| I love meditation. | ||
| I take AlphaBrain, like all that stuff. | ||
| And do you ever miss it? | ||
| Is there ever a time where you're like, God damn, I just want to pop a Xanax and fucking drink a glass of wine? | ||
|
unidentified
|
No. | |
| No. | ||
| I will say this, though. | ||
| I had my eyes Lasix, you know, the Lasix, and they gave me Valium. | ||
| And I was like, whoa. | ||
| I see why people get addicted to this. | ||
| This is incredible. | ||
| But I'm glad they did, because I was super freaked out about them cutting my eyeball open. | ||
| And Valium just relaxes you, right? | ||
| Is that what it does? | ||
| It felt great. | ||
| I mean, the only time I ever did it. | ||
| But no, I don't miss that because what I have now is I feel clear and alive and I don't feel happy all the time. | ||
| I definitely have my days, but I don't relate to it as I'm depressed. | ||
| It's just like, oh, I'm having a normal human experience and not having the best day. | ||
| I think stories like this are very inspiring to people. | ||
| I think it's very important. | ||
| We don't want... | ||
| It's hard for people to look at people who aren't doing well and talk to them and just go, Oh, I don't know what to tell you. | ||
| Good luck. | ||
| Let me get the fuck away from this bitch. | ||
| That's how people think. | ||
| I don't want to deal with her problems or his problems. | ||
| I want to separate and concentrate on myself. | ||
| So I think when someone like you... | ||
| Can sort of express how you were in this really bad state. | ||
| And yours is a very bizarre situation because you're talking about being on these pills from the time you're 10. Right. | ||
| That's really unique. | ||
| But then having almost a decade off of them, seven years off of them is... | ||
| Yeah, almost eight. | ||
| Yeah, and it's... | ||
| I honestly think... | ||
| It helps me help people. | ||
| It really does. | ||
| I've had lots of training as a life coach, but my own life experiences have been the thing that's really given me the most credentials, I guess you could say. | ||
| Well, your credentials are that you're actually happy. | ||
| Yeah, I'm actually happy. | ||
| I've been able to create a life and a career and friendships and connection that, you know, I thought I no longer live that story of I hate Christine Club, I have great friends, great women friends, like all of that, you know, and that's, I'm no like different or more special than anybody. | ||
| It's just, again, choices. | ||
| And I made choices that led me to this point. | ||
| And everybody has that. | ||
| Everybody has that freedom. | ||
| What's the book? | ||
| Man's Search for Meaning. | ||
| Have you ever read that book? | ||
| No. | ||
| By Viktor Frankl. | ||
| I've heard of it. | ||
| Yeah, he was in concentration camps. | ||
| And he was actually a psychiatrist, I think. | ||
| But he talked about, you know, he kept himself sane and he kept himself free through his mind. | ||
| And he says in between stimulus and response, basically what happens and how we respond is a choice. | ||
| And in that choice lies our ultimate freedom. | ||
| And I think that that's true. | ||
| We all have that freedom. | ||
| No matter what your circumstances. | ||
| Now, when someone comes to you and they're like, Christine, I'm all fucked up. | ||
| I need to get my shit together. | ||
| How do you start with somebody? | ||
| Everybody's different, you know? | ||
| Everybody's different. | ||
| But is there anything that people universally could benefit from? | ||
| Is there... | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| The number one thing where I start with people is having them really look at their relationship with themselves. | ||
| Because when they come, they're like, oh, I'm fucked up or I need help. | ||
| They're relating to themselves as if something's wrong with them and they're being really hard on themselves and they've kind of lost hope and lost belief in themselves. | ||
| So the first thing is just like acceptance. | ||
| Accepting where you are. | ||
| Because I haven't liked everything that's happened to me, but one of the main ways I've been able to move through it is because I stopped fighting it. | ||
| Isn't that like in martial arts? | ||
| If a punch comes at you, you're not supposed to resist it. | ||
| You're supposed to kind of move with it. | ||
| Yeah, move away from it or roll with it. | ||
| Roll with it, right. | ||
| You don't like... | ||
| Bite your teeth and take it on the jaw. | ||
| Exactly. | ||
| And in life, we kind of do that. | ||
| We're like, oh, I don't want this breakup. | ||
| I don't want this layoff. | ||
| We resist it. | ||
| We fight it. | ||
| And so it's like, can we just get to acceptance of where you are, who you are, and what's happening right now? | ||
| And perspective, right? | ||
| And perspective, yeah. | ||
| And when you can get to that neutral place, that's when you can start doing the work. | ||
| And that's when you can start doing different things. | ||
| And then the second thing is, I ask people, do you believe you can shift? | ||
| Do you believe that you have the power to make different choices and change? | ||
| And you don't have to know how. | ||
| That's my job. | ||
| I'll help you with the how. | ||
| But you've got to believe you can. | ||
| Because if we don't believe it's possible for us, then it's really hard to make any kind of change in our life. | ||
| Yeah, that is giant. | ||
| But how does someone believe? | ||
| How do you get someone to believe that they can make change? | ||
| Do they have to see evidence in themselves? | ||
| Do you recommend attempting things or tasks or hobbies? | ||
| Right. | ||
| Well, a lot of times it's going back to a time in your life where you did take a chance or you did do something that was a stretch in some way. | ||
| Like, everybody has times in their life where they've done something they weren't completely sure they could do, even if it's just a little thing. | ||
| And everybody has that reference point they can go back to. | ||
| But a lot of this show, like, honestly, a lot of it is taking a leap of faith. | ||
| And I... I've taken a lot of those and I've wanted to know the answer and I've wanted to know like 100% that this would be guaranteed. | ||
| Like if I take this leap of faith everything will work out and they haven't always been 100% guarantees. | ||
| But it was in taking that leap and taking that chance and having a little faith that things started showing up and things started shifting and that's what started to create the evidence. | ||
| And it's a tricky thing because I think people want evidence before they make change, but you have to start making these little changes to start having the evidence show up. | ||
| I don't know if I answered your question. | ||
| No, that does make sense. | ||
| I've often said that very difficult tasks... | ||
| Like anything that's difficult that you do, it gives you the confidence that you can overcome adversity. | ||
| Whether it's a martial art thing or something along those lines or marathon running or anything, when you do something like that, these incremental changes happen where you push yourself through things, especially if you can achieve a goal. | ||
| If you could set out to do something, you achieve that goal, like, I'm going to run a marathon by the end of this year. | ||
| I don't know why I keep saying marathon, but you know what I'm saying. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Doing things along those lines, they can be motivating factors or they can help push you. | ||
| They can be the engine that starts to push things in a positive direction. | ||
| And you start to believe in yourself and you start to believe, oh, wow, I can do this. | ||
| I can take this step. | ||
| I often tell people that show up or come to workshop, I'm like, just that fact that you're here is proof that you believe you can change. | ||
| Because you wouldn't have shown up if some part of you wasn't kind of Certain that you could. | ||
| Have you ever had someone come to you and you're like, I can't even help this dude or girl? | ||
| Not yet, no. | ||
| Do you get mostly dudes or girls? | ||
| Well, I only coach a few people now. | ||
| My retreats are mostly women. | ||
| My private clients both. | ||
| And then like courses and stuff. | ||
| How come you have retreats that are all women and not... | ||
| Well, I know, I know. | ||
| I'm going to do one that will be both men and women soon. | ||
| That sounds like a recipe for danger, too. | ||
| A bunch of depressed people humping in the woods or wherever you're going. | ||
| Well, first of all, not everybody's depressed. | ||
| Some people come just to grow. | ||
|
unidentified
|
And we're not out in the woods. | |
| I love that you think my retreats are out in the woods. | ||
| I'm just making it fun. | ||
| I don't know what you're doing. | ||
| Oh my god, that's amazing. | ||
| No, I like to do it in places like Bali and Costa Rica. | ||
| Oh, okay. | ||
| The jungle. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Fuck the woods. | |
| Let's get there with the bugs and the crocodiles and shit. | ||
| Oh my gosh. | ||
| I finally, for people, this might be helpful to some people, so whenever I go to anywhere tropical, I get eaten alive. | ||
| Like, eaten alive, no matter what. | ||
| Other people have three bites, I'll have 400. I finally figured out B1, vitamin B1, just totally stopped it. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Really? | |
| You have to find it, like, you can't take a B-complex. | ||
| It's vitamin B1. Huh. | ||
| And it, for some reason, stops the mosquitoes and bug bites. | ||
| I gotta write that down. | ||
| Why B1? I have no idea. | ||
| I just know it worked for me. | ||
| Does something to change your smell? | ||
| I don't know. | ||
|
unidentified
|
It just worked. | |
| It was my salvation. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I was so happy. | |
| So they don't bite you at all? | ||
| A little bit. | ||
| But again, it went from being eaten alive to just getting a few. | ||
| Did you ever try Thermacell? | ||
| No, what's that? | ||
| Thermacell is a device that a lot of people take when they go camping, things along those lines. | ||
| It looks almost like a radio, and it has these little pads, and you slide these pads into this heating element, and this very fine mist comes out of this heating element. | ||
| You can put it on the ground near you, and the bugs won't come within an 18-foot circle. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Really? | |
| Yeah. | ||
| Use it when you're hunting and you're in the woods because if you're in the woods, especially in Alaska or Alberta, I don't know if you've ever been to Alaska in the summer. | ||
| No. | ||
| The mosquitoes are insane because they're only alive for a month. | ||
| Oh, so they just go to town. | ||
| They're like, ah! | ||
| They're like, this is it! | ||
| Like, rabid, barbarian mosquitoes. | ||
| Like, me and my friend Ari went fishing in Alaska, and it was so crazy that you would get out of the car. | ||
| We pulled up to this stream. | ||
| You get out of the car, you open the door, and then, whoomp! | ||
| You're hit with a cloud of mosquitoes. | ||
| We jumped back in the car and shut the door, and we were in the car with like 50 mosquitoes. | ||
| We were like, what in the fuck is going on? | ||
| So then we're spraying ourselves with all this spray, all these toxic chemicals. | ||
| Hell, hell. | ||
| Then I found out about thermocells. | ||
| Thermocells just, it cleans it out totally. | ||
| And they're easy to travel with? | ||
| Yeah, they're really light. | ||
| It doesn't even smell. | ||
| I mean, it barely smells. | ||
| But bugs don't want to have anything to do with it. | ||
| Mosquitoes don't want to have anything to do with it. | ||
| Without thermocels, like, hanging out in the woods, like, sitting in a spot, it's almost unbearable, unless you have mosquito netting, and you don't want to wear, like, all that mosquito bug spray stuff. | ||
| Your skin is an organ. | ||
| You know, all that stuff that you're putting on your skin, it is just not good for you. | ||
| It's not. | ||
| I was using DEET my first couple days on my last trip, and I started getting sick, and I was like, I can't. | ||
| This is, like, what am I doing? | ||
| You're processing it with your liver. | ||
| It's going through your skin. | ||
| It gets in your bloodstream. | ||
| Terrible. | ||
| Yeah, I mean, I'm sure there's probably some non-toxic alternatives, but they probably don't work that good. | ||
|
unidentified
|
No. | |
| Except B1, huh? | ||
| It worked for me. | ||
| Hey. | ||
| B1. Yeah. | ||
| You hear it, folks. | ||
|
unidentified
|
It's a plug. | |
| I've heard that before. | ||
| A friend of mine was telling me that about Africa. | ||
| That they went to Africa and they took a bunch of B vitamins and that did it. | ||
| But B1 in particular. | ||
| Did it for me. | ||
| Find anything on that, Jamie? | ||
| I found something that said that studies are inconclusive, but it may make mosquitoes think you stink. | ||
| Good. | ||
| Perfect. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Good. | |
| It's fine for me. | ||
| Stink it up. | ||
| I wonder if it's like a vitamin that makes people think you smell good. | ||
| People or mosquitoes? | ||
| People. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Don't eat bananas. | |
| Don't eat bananas. | ||
|
unidentified
|
For mosquito season, don't eat bananas. | |
| That makes sense. | ||
| But I would think that like... | ||
| There's probably weird smells that you're not even sure you detect. | ||
| You know how some people just give off a weird odor to people? | ||
| Yes. | ||
| Maybe not an odor odor, but they just feel weird. | ||
| They said that... | ||
| Chris Ryan, my friend, he's an author. | ||
| He wrote Sex at Dawn. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Oh, yeah, yeah. | |
| I met him. | ||
| He's great. | ||
| Super smart guy. | ||
| Yeah, super smart guy. | ||
| He was telling me that there's certain odors that human beings have, and those odors enable people to understand whether or not they're genetically compatible with each other. | ||
| There used to be, when we were kids, I used to always hear about couples taking blood tests to make sure that they could have babies together. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Really? | |
| Yeah, that was a thing. | ||
| That was a thing. | ||
| They would make sure that they were compatible. | ||
| I don't even know if there was real science behind it, but they would take blood tests to find out if they were compatible. | ||
| I remember it being really common to discuss. | ||
| I mean, this is the 80s or the 90s or whatever the fuck it was. | ||
| The dark ages of science. | ||
| If only it was that easy to see blood tests. | ||
| Right. | ||
| But not compatible, obviously, personality-wise and all the other things that come into play. | ||
| But Chris Ryan was saying that women can smell a man's clothes. | ||
| You could literally smell their clothes and they would know whether or not they would be attracted to that person based on the smell that a person's getting. | ||
| Not like, oh my god, this guy stinks. | ||
| But literally, your body knows what's repulsive and what's not repulsive in terms of genetics based on someone's odor that they give off on their clothes. | ||
| But what it didn't work is when they put women on the pill. | ||
| Huh. | ||
| So when they put women on the pill, they were no longer able to differentiate whether or not someone was genetically compatible by smelling them. | ||
| It fogged up your natural senses. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| Because I think when you're on the pill, you don't actually ovulate. | ||
| Right. | ||
| Right. | ||
| So you're not in the natural rhythm of biology. | ||
| Yeah, I think there's a natural feeling that women have when they're around a guy that they would breed with or a guy they wouldn't breed with. | ||
| They're like, okay, gotta go! | ||
| And that is probably a good thing. | ||
| People that are on the pill might be making really shitty genetic choices, literally genetic choices. | ||
| You can blame your last bad ex-boyfriend on being on the pill and not being able to smell him accurately. | ||
| I really think you can. | ||
| I mean, it totally makes sense. | ||
| Chris is probably listening to this right now going, you fucked it up! | ||
| I probably did. | ||
| But I think there's probably something to instinctual reactions to people. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| I mean, have you ever met someone and you're like, for whatever reason, I just don't want to be around this person. | ||
| And then you find out years later that that person's fucking crazy or this or that. | ||
| I think people give off indetectable in terms of what we classify as smells, but maybe these pheromones have some sort of a weird reaction to you. | ||
| Birth control pills affect women's taste in men. | ||
| BAM! Wow! | ||
| How synthetic hormones change desires in women and their choice of a mate. | ||
| In a mate. | ||
| Yeah, totally makes sense. | ||
| Interesting. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Well, it just makes sense. | ||
| I mean, it just can't be normal. | ||
| Your body must be so confused. | ||
| Like, this bitch is pregnant all the time. | ||
| I know. | ||
|
unidentified
|
All the time. | |
| I know. | ||
| And that's what it thinks. | ||
| Your body thinks you're pregnant all the time. | ||
| I know. | ||
| That's, yeah, the pill scares me, too. | ||
| Just synthetic hormones pumping through your system. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Can't be all that good to never get off. | ||
| But a lot of women never get off it, right? | ||
| They're on it forever. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I don't like it. | ||
| It makes my hair oily when I'm off it. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| Here's stuff like that. | ||
| There's other ways to balance your hormones. | ||
| You know, I'm not a hormone specialist, but... | ||
| Why does hormones make a girl's hair oily? | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| I have no idea. | ||
| How do we get on the subject? | ||
| Smells. | ||
| Retreats. | ||
| You don't take dudes. | ||
| Dudes on retreats. | ||
| Yeah, I would think that getting a bunch of people that are trying to get their life together and then having them all together, male and female, you run into these weird issues where they're trying to hook up. | ||
| You can get really distracted. | ||
| Yeah, exactly. | ||
| You can get really distracted and you can get, like, if there's some kind of attraction, you can forget what you're there for and get obsessed with someone and it can kind of throw off a thing. | ||
| And there's something to... | ||
| About, you know, women coming together with women and men coming together with men that I think is important. | ||
| And I think kind of back to that tribal conversation we need. | ||
| A lot of women, including myself, have like beef with other women, you know, and they don't like being around just a bunch of other women. | ||
| Like there's competition that comes up. | ||
| You get that? | ||
| Well, I used to because I was scared of other women because I had all that stuff happen. | ||
| I didn't really trust it. | ||
| And so when you get a group of women together, a lot of times there is that comparison and judgment, and I can't trust, and da-da-da-da. | ||
| And so it's important for women, I think, to gather together and kind of do work separately from when there's men there because there's something that is very healing just in that. | ||
| And then there's a level of vulnerability that's possible when there aren't men there. | ||
| Not to say that you can't be vulnerable with men there, but it's just a different dynamic. | ||
| And I think the same goes for men. | ||
| Like I know men who do men's groups and men's work and there's great value in that. | ||
| And that's important. | ||
| And I think one of the problems I see a lot in intimate relationships is that in a heterosexual relationship is that you expect this one person to be your everything. | ||
| And you're not, you don't have a tribe and you don't have a community. | ||
| You don't have friends of the opposite sex and the same sex that are fulfilling kind of these needs. | ||
| That we all have. | ||
| We just project like this, my one person has to be my everything, my soulmate. | ||
| And so, you know, having your community, whatever it may be, and having different friends, I think is super, super important to having a healthy relationship. | ||
| Having friends, period, is super important. | ||
| There's something that I tweeted today that I was reading about. | ||
| They were talking about the role that genetics and family have in creating a personality and how much of an impact your peers have. | ||
| And they think that your peers and the friends you choose have a bigger impact than anything in your life. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And it was really fascinating. | ||
| I tweeted this morning, but it's one of those articles where you read it and you go, oh, that completely makes sense. | ||
| A researcher argues that peers are much more important than parents, that psychologists underestimate the power of genetics, and that we have a lot to learn from Asian classrooms. | ||
| Interesting. | ||
| What about Asian classrooms? | ||
| I have to go down and scroll. | ||
| I forgot what that was about. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| Probably too long of an article to really get into it. | ||
| But we'd have to read it. | ||
| But peers in general, I think choosing like-minded folks and choosing people that are on a good path, it helps support you and it supports them and you feed off of each other. | ||
| And when the tribe does well, you do well. | ||
| Exactly. | ||
| It's very critical. | ||
| Everybody wants to be the person that's accomplishing things. | ||
| Everybody wants to be the one that's out there. | ||
| Go getting it and fuck the world. | ||
| It's all about me. | ||
| But if you do that, you're going to mess up the whole happiness thing. | ||
| The happiness thing comes with all the people that you're around having a good time. | ||
| Absolutely. | ||
| Yeah, and then it's just like... | ||
| It's endless. | ||
| You have to keep upping the ante. | ||
| And I think what we want more than anything is connection. | ||
| We want connection. | ||
| We want love. | ||
| We want to feel like we belong. | ||
| I think belonging is a huge, huge, huge thing. | ||
| And I think as adults, we think we belong by, you know, achieving things. | ||
| But really, it's finding those people that you can just be yourself with and to have that tribe. | ||
| And also let go of the people that are bringing you down. | ||
| Like I've outgrown some people in my life and some friends. | ||
| Not that I'm better than, but I'm just on like a different path and a different route. | ||
| And it's important, I think, to kind of know like who's the sort of dead weight in your life. | ||
| And what are some friendships that might have reached their expiration date that, you know, like I love you. | ||
| It's been great. | ||
| But, you know. | ||
| And a lot of those friendships, you're not helping them either. | ||
| No. | ||
| And a matter of fact, sometimes when someone cuts you loose, you go, what the fuck is wrong with me? | ||
| Maybe I need to look at myself, right? | ||
| I mean, sometimes when you enable a friend, not only are you not doing yourself any good, you're not doing them any good either. | ||
| Exactly. | ||
| That was a big aha for me when my fiance broke up with me. | ||
| Because I very much wanted to be the victim in that. | ||
| But I had to look at, gosh, what did I... What did I do? | ||
| Because everybody's like, oh, he's such a jerk. | ||
| But I really had to look at how was I showing up in that relationship that was impacting his decision? | ||
| Because he wasn't a bad guy. | ||
| Like he wasn't just a jerk who decided, you know, I'm going to break up with this girl. | ||
| Like there were ways I was showing up that were that. | ||
| Like made him make the decision that he makes. | ||
| So I think in any of those situations, friendship or relationship, you know, you don't want to go too far the other extreme and be like, oh my gosh, I'm a loser and think it's all your fault. | ||
| But it's important to look at, geez, what's my part in this? | ||
| You know, what's my responsibility? | ||
| Because I played a role in this whole thing. | ||
| Yeah, I mean, there's no one-way street when it comes to a relationship. | ||
| And if you're in a relationship with a bad person, like, why? | ||
| Exactly. | ||
| Why did you get in that in the first place? | ||
| Did they trick you? | ||
| You know, if they did trick you, you know, what did you do when you realized it was a trick? | ||
| Did you stick around, try to fix it? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I think that's a really good question because, I mean, how many people do you know that are in bad relationships continue talking about it but aren't doing anything about it? | ||
| Those people are brutal. | ||
| They're not leaving it. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Those people are brutal. | |
| They are. | ||
| You're just like, why? | ||
| But a lot of times it's because it's familiar. | ||
| Somebody said, you know, you get the love you think you deserve. | ||
| And it may be easy for us looking outside going, oh my gosh, it's so easy. | ||
| You should just leave this relationship. | ||
| But a lot of times the person doesn't think they can do better, or maybe this is playing out some dynamic they had with their parent, or you sort of need to understand why you're in it before you can actually make the choice to get out of it. | ||
| By the way, there's a lot of delusional people out there that are like, I deserve a lot more than I'm getting! | ||
| That's true. | ||
| That's not real either. | ||
| That's true. | ||
| What do you do when someone comes to you with unrealistic expectations or they don't want to see themselves like, you know, you tell them what they need to do or what they should consider and they argue with you about it. | ||
| Well, I just really ask, like, is what you're doing working? | ||
| Like, is your way working? | ||
| If you can show me your way's working, then great. | ||
| Like, my way's fine. | ||
| It's just fucking other people. | ||
| Everybody else. | ||
| Everybody else is all messed up. | ||
| I'm good. | ||
| God damn it. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I need you to coach everyone else I know. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| If we could just change other people, it's everybody else's fault. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| Do you ever have to tell people you're not going to work with them? | ||
| I've had one person I had to tell that to. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| Just one. | ||
| And it was, you know, I think it was just not a good fit. | ||
| And she just wasn't ready, willing, was super committed to her story. | ||
| And sort of wanted me just to coddle it, which I wasn't willing to do. | ||
| Yeah, sometimes people just want someone to talk. | ||
| That's what I've always wondered about therapy. | ||
| Like, I have friends that have been to therapy. | ||
| I'm like, okay, what do you do? | ||
| You go there and you talk about your problems. | ||
| And then what happens? | ||
| Well, they give you advice. | ||
| And then what happens? | ||
| You don't do shit, you know? | ||
| Like, there's a lot of people that just want to go somewhere and want someone to listen to them talk. | ||
| Right, right. | ||
| And they'll go three, four times a week, and they're still fucked up. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| I'm like, well, that isn't working. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| It doesn't. | ||
| And I think my intention always is to really give people the tools, not just advice. | ||
| Really help them heal. | ||
| I've had amazing teachers. | ||
| I've been really, really lucky. | ||
| And they haven't just given me advice. | ||
| They haven't just given me motivation. | ||
| They've really given me tools to heal and change. | ||
| And that's what I try to do in my work with people is show them that A, it's possible and that you can do it and give them the tools to do it. | ||
| Because that's going to last longer than any kind of like pep talk. | ||
| It was funny. | ||
| We were talking before the podcast started about going to a seminar and someone asking how many men here feel vulnerable. | ||
| And like no one's putting their hand up. | ||
| How many women here feel vulnerable? | ||
| All the hands went up. | ||
| All the hands went up. | ||
| And I mean part of it I think is a little delusional because I think a lot of men are way more vulnerable than they really think they are. | ||
| But also there's just a different thing going through life I mean, there's that expression, the fair sex, but being a female, being a woman, means you're physically different. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yep. | |
| You're around a bunch of people that most of them could beat you up. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| Yep, it's a different way to walk through the world. | ||
| That vulnerability, though, is that creates another level of anxiety, right? | ||
| Like, walking down a dark street, you see someone, and it's a man, and he's walking down the dark street, too. | ||
| You're like, oh boy, you know? | ||
| Yeah, it's scary. | ||
| And it's something that, you know, I as a woman, like I'm always aware of it. | ||
| Not always, but a lot of the time, you know, because I know that, like you said, I could get beaten up like it's between me and a man, he's probably gonna win. | ||
| I mean, I'm pretty strong, but not that strong. | ||
| And I think what's also beautiful about women and just the feminine in general is that vulnerability. | ||
| But because like it sometimes doesn't feel safe, I think that's why a lot of women like kind of have a protective armor and are guarded and sometimes more in their like masculine energy in the world is because on some level we feel like we have to. | ||
| We have to like protect ourselves. | ||
| And whereas that vulnerability really is the thing that makes us women in so many ways. | ||
| And I think we confuse vulnerability with weakness. | ||
| Because vulnerability to me is being open, being available, being soft, but not weak. | ||
| Weakness to me is more about kind of going into the victim me and going into the poor pitiful me and the feeling sorry for and on all of those kinds of things. | ||
| I think there's beautiful power in vulnerability. | ||
| But when we're talking about just physical strength, yeah, I mean, for the most part, men have the advantage on that one. | ||
| It's just, we need all the pieces. | ||
| Right. | ||
| You need the whole spectrum of human beings. | ||
| Right. | ||
| And I mean, especially in terms of, you know, the traditional way of looking at things, you know, masculine men are attracted to feminine women and feminine women are attracted to masculine men and we both need each other. | ||
| But a lot of times, especially when you're dealing with damaged folks, Mm-hmm. | ||
| Where someone's bullying you. | ||
| And you get it in this relationship then. | ||
| Instead of someone appreciating you for the difference in the softness versus the hard, the yin and the yang. | ||
| Now you have someone who's exploiting that. | ||
| And you see it with women too. | ||
| You see it with aggressive women and weak men. | ||
| That is, to me, one of the saddest things I ever see. | ||
| I know. | ||
| Is when you find the aggressive women and the weak men. | ||
| Probably because I'm terrified of it ever being me. | ||
| You know? | ||
| I don't think it will be. | ||
| But I mean, if it was, nobody wants that. | ||
| Nobody wants the woman who's yelling at you and the guy's like, okay, okay, okay. | ||
| That happens a lot. | ||
| A lot! | ||
| A lot! | ||
| It's kind of crazy to me because... | ||
| You know, I see women emasculate men quite often, you know? | ||
| Not maybe on like a huge scale to the degree you're talking about, but just like the little comments, like I'll be out with a couple and the woman will say something and it's kind of emasculating. | ||
| But if the roles are reversed and the guy said something like that to the woman, I don't know if it would go over. | ||
| You know, guys just kind of take it on sometimes. | ||
| And when I see that, I'm like... | ||
| Well, a lot of men feel emasculated by society in general, just by the roles that they play in the office and just the physical act of going through life, this civilized world, and also constantly needing people's affirmation, needing people's acceptance. | ||
| And you sort of become what people want you to be, even if that's not what you want. | ||
| You get in these relationships, and you see it all the time, where guys sort of accept a little bit, and then they accept more, and then they don't want to mess up. | ||
| I have a bunch of friends that have really domineering, overbearing wives or girlfriends, and it's weird. | ||
| It's weird to be around them. | ||
| Like, dude, you know you can leave. | ||
| This is just a person. | ||
| Why do you think they don't? | ||
| Because they're scared. | ||
| They're scared. | ||
| And it becomes the thing. | ||
| You know, that's the thing. | ||
| This is the thing. | ||
| Oh, the fucking wife. | ||
| We've got to go home to the wife. | ||
| You know, and it's very strange. | ||
| It's very strange when you have someone in your life that's essentially like a parole officer. | ||
| Someone in your life that gets to tell you what to do. | ||
| And you're not allowed to do certain things. | ||
| You're not allowed to watch certain things or like certain things. | ||
| And they control you and they own you. | ||
| I think a lot of these people that are doing that, much like the girl who bullied you or anybody who does that to someone, they do it out of fear, they do it out of insecurity, and they also do it out of this bizarre instinct because they can. | ||
| I used to date this girl. | ||
| She wasn't a bad person, but she used to like to fight. | ||
| And I do not. | ||
| I do not like that kind of conflict. | ||
| I don't like interrelationship conflict. | ||
| I don't like it. | ||
| I don't fight. | ||
| I don't argue. | ||
| I'd just rather leave. | ||
| I'm into discussing things, but when people start yelling and get crazy, I'm like, fuck this. | ||
| I grew up around domestic violence, too. | ||
| I grew up with... | ||
| So I saw it when I was a kid. | ||
| I'm not interested. | ||
| And so we broke up, but we stayed friends. | ||
| And then years later, we went out to coffee. | ||
| I'm like, how's everything? | ||
| What's going on? | ||
| Oh, I'm living with this guy. | ||
| It's not going good. | ||
| I'm like, why? | ||
| She's like... | ||
| She's telling me how she yells at this guy and she can't help it. | ||
| She's like, I can't help it. | ||
| I just fucking yell at him. | ||
| And he doesn't do anything. | ||
| He just takes it. | ||
| And she's like, when he takes it, I just want to fucking smash him. | ||
| She's like, I just can't. | ||
| She goes, I don't want to yell at him, but I can't help doing it. | ||
| And then when he's gone, I'm like, why the fuck did I do that? | ||
| And she had this... | ||
| Weird, almost like a natural impulse to dominate this guy. | ||
| Like, have you ever seen two dogs where one dog has the upper hand on the dog and he'll go near the dog and the other dog... | ||
| And that's just their world! | ||
| It's just their world. | ||
| The other dog never gets a chance. | ||
| And sometimes it's not even a size-based thing. | ||
| They might be the exact same size dog. | ||
| Just one dog just decides it's the bitch, and the other one's the dominator, and that's just how it goes. | ||
| Well, she was in this position with this guy where she just had this compelling desire to fucking yell at him. | ||
| And I go, well, what are you yelling at him for? | ||
| She's like, anything. | ||
| Everything. | ||
| She goes, I just fucking, I want him to tell me to shut the fuck up. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| She wanted him to outman her. | ||
| Yeah, but isn't that crazy? | ||
| What a bizarre instinct to push. | ||
| She was frustrated at herself. | ||
| She was frustrated at him. | ||
| But it's almost like she was compelled. | ||
| She's being drawn to the great magnet. | ||
| It's like, oh, I can't help it. | ||
| I'm going to scream at him. | ||
| Right. | ||
| Well, it's interesting how we project onto other people. | ||
| Something was going on inside of her that was creating that dynamic in him. | ||
| She could have left at any time, but it was like she was so trying to get a reaction out of him, honestly, to probably see if he cared. | ||
| She probably equated, all right, well, him taking it means he doesn't care. | ||
| So how much can I push? | ||
| How much can I push? | ||
| How much can I push so that I can see that he He'll react enough because that may mean he cares. | ||
| Do you think that's what it is? | ||
| That she didn't think he cares? | ||
| Or do you think she just thinks he's weak and it's just frustrating to her that he's weak? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Well, if it was just that, I think she would have left a lot earlier. | |
| There was something she wanted. | ||
| Like, we don't keep doing it over and over and over again unless there's something we're attached to getting. | ||
| Like, you know, when we're like, oh man, this is stupid, we get out of there. | ||
| But when we find ourselves in situations where it's like it's happening over and over and over again and we continue to get frustrated, but we're not leaving. | ||
| There's something we're attached to trying to get from our behavior. | ||
| So there was something she wanted in that. | ||
| There was something in it for her. | ||
| Otherwise, she would have been out of there a lot sooner. | ||
| It was also, she was trying to do the acting thing, and she was constantly frustrated. | ||
| Yeah? | ||
| She was constantly... | ||
| Just taking it out on him? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Well, it would be really interesting. | ||
| I'd watch these almost sort of manic things. | ||
| There would be these moments where she would be preparing for an audition, and she'd be hopeful, yet nervous. | ||
| There was a lot of anxiety, and there was all this... | ||
| Here's the thing, and the thing's going to go, and hopefully if this happens, this guy's connected to this, and that's going to happen with that. | ||
| And then, boom, it didn't happen. | ||
| And so there was this massive letdown. | ||
| There was cigarette smoking and depression and all this angst. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| I got the fuck out of there. | ||
| But this dude got in there and he caught the second wave of angst. | ||
| When I met her, she was just moving here. | ||
| And so she wasn't completely bewildered by the experience and the machine yet. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And... | ||
| It's also, I think, for some people, choosing things that you do for a living that are healthy for you. | ||
| I think there's a lot of people that get involved in careers that require too much of their time. | ||
| You don't really want to do it, but you get caught up in it, whether it's being a lawyer or being a doctor or being something that has a prestigious title, where you feel like there's something great. | ||
| But really, in the back of your mind, there's something else that you probably would be way happy doing. | ||
| I mean, that was me. | ||
| I was going after it for the wrong reasons. | ||
| What do you want to do, though, if you weren't doing a life coach? | ||
| I know you enjoy doing what you're doing. | ||
| Oh, gosh. | ||
| Like, if somehow or another you were independently wealthy and you didn't have to coach all these crazy people anymore. | ||
| Not that they're crazy, but some of them are probably crazy. | ||
| Well, I kind of do it. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I mean, like, I, you know... | |
| I love people and I love personal development. | ||
| Even if I had all the money in the world, I'd still speak. | ||
| I'd still do my podcast. | ||
| I'd still do retreats. | ||
| I love it. | ||
| I love the human experience. | ||
| I love being there for that moment where someone has a major insight where they connect dots and it's like, whoa, a massive perspective shift and all of a sudden they start to kind of move a different direction. | ||
| It's... | ||
| I can't imagine doing anything else. | ||
| I mean, if I could sing, if I had any kind of music ability, I think it'd be awesome to be a rock star, like, just to have that rush. | ||
| But literally, I have no musical ability whatsoever other than, like, listening to it. | ||
| I just do not have those... | ||
| Well, that's great. | ||
| So you found your thing. | ||
| Now, how often is it when you talk to people, when you're trying to coach them and help them, and you realize, like, man, you've got to do something else? | ||
| Like, is that a factor? | ||
| Because I would think that... | ||
| The thing about careers is not only is it eight hours of your time, but it also kind of defines you. | ||
| So every day you're defined by whatever you do. | ||
| And oftentimes, like we were talking about, like men in these workplace environments, they're sort of like they're boxed into this predetermined pattern of behavior that's expected from them. | ||
| You know, they have shoes with tassels on them and ties. | ||
| And they have to talk like, you know, business talk. | ||
| It's like you fall into these weird patterns. | ||
| You do. | ||
| And you lose a lot of your individuality inside those patterns because office life and, you know, human resources demand certain things of you. | ||
| Like there's a certain, your personality, like when you're in an office environment, anytime you're in the corporate world, your personality is stuffed into this form. | ||
| Right. | ||
| Whatever that form is, whatever that mold is, the mold of being a business person. | ||
| You're a woman. | ||
| You're a businesswoman. | ||
| You want to be respected. | ||
| You want to use the right words and say the right things and talk the right lingo. | ||
| A lot of times people are left wondering, who the fuck am I? Right. | ||
| They just get totally lost in a role. | ||
| I go do a lot of corporate speaking and I have a lot of people come up to me afterwards and they're just like, oh my gosh. | ||
| Because I talk about how we lose ourselves in these roles and how a lot of times our adult life becomes sort of just this... | ||
| Checklist, follow Truman Show, one thing after the other, just follow this structure that was set out for us that we never checked in and said, do I want this? | ||
| Do I even want this? | ||
| So to answer your question, yes, a lot of times when people come or I'm working with people, it is looking at, is this career right for you? | ||
| Is this relationship right for you? | ||
| What have you created in your life that just doesn't fit where you are, but you're in it because you're scared to make the change? | ||
| And also, you know, some people really can be happy in corporate America. | ||
| Like some people, that works for them. | ||
|
unidentified
|
A few mutants. | |
| A few strange freaks. | ||
| I firmly really believe that the vast majority of people that are living the American dream, living that life, doing that 9 to 5, the vast majority of them are fucking horrifically miserable. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| I really do believe that. | ||
| I think it's so defining and it's so contrary to the human spirit. | ||
| Right. | ||
| But I think most people don't want to believe that. | ||
| They don't want to believe it's possible that everybody's doing something wrong. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Right. | |
| And they don't believe they can change it. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| There's no other options. | ||
| They don't know what else to do, especially if they have a mortgage and a spouse and kids. | ||
| Student loans. | ||
| All that stuff. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| It's really intimidating to go, oh gosh, how do I change this? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I think you have to start small. | ||
| I think you have to start with... | ||
| Okay, I don't have to quit my job tomorrow, but what are some things in my life I can start doing that make me feel alive again? | ||
| Like, is it a hobby? | ||
| Is it like training for a marathon? | ||
| Is it what is going to start making me feel like, you know, I'm creative and I matter and I'm more than just this role as husband, wife, mother, father, corporate, executive, whatever it is. | ||
| So I think that's a good place to start is something small you can do to make you feel alive again because anybody has access to that. | ||
| You don't have to leave your job To start creating some things in your life that can start to shift things. | ||
| And then, like we were talking about, then it's like the gradual change, you know? | ||
| Because I don't think it's possible for most people just to quit their job tomorrow. | ||
| They don't think it's possible. | ||
| Almost no one, right? | ||
| Almost no one can just quit. | ||
| And not everybody's meant to be an entrepreneur either and do their own thing. | ||
| But there are always things we can do in our life to mix it up a little bit. | ||
| And even to show up differently in our job. | ||
| Yeah, I just think that for a huge amount of people, the amount of time that's required of them because of their job is so overwhelming. | ||
| Because most people, let's be honest, are not really just working 9 to 5, particularly most men. | ||
| There's a tremendous amount of overtime involved. | ||
| Tremendous. | ||
| I was looking at something that was talking about, it was an article on the wage gap difference and what it really is about. | ||
| And one of the things that it was about was the amount of, the difference in the amount of hours that men work. | ||
| In their ambition to try to climb up the corporate ladder. | ||
| And you look at the numbers that people work and it's terrifying. | ||
| There's no life. | ||
| If you're working 60 hours a week, you don't have a life. | ||
| There's nothing left. | ||
| I'll do a podcast for three hours and I'll do a bunch of other stuff and I'm trying to fit in things in my day and I have a pretty loose schedule. | ||
| I mean, I do a lot of things, but it's pretty loose, you know? | ||
| Like, today I did UFC stuff for a couple hours this morning, and then I come here for a few hours, then I gotta work out, then I'll tell some jokes. | ||
| But there's a lot of, like, movement in there. | ||
| There's a lot of time where I can get shit done. | ||
| Some people don't have any of that. | ||
| They don't have nothing. | ||
| So what do you think was, like, that made you different? | ||
| Like, back in the day where you could have done that path of the corporate route, why did you make different choices? | ||
| It's a good question. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| I mean, I never felt like I could. | ||
| I never felt like I could have a regular job. | ||
| From the time I got out of high school, I never had a full-time job. | ||
| I had a bunch of part-time jobs. | ||
| I did some full-time jobs where construction companies and stuff, but it didn't last. | ||
| I would do them for like a month or a couple of weeks, and I was like, fuck this. | ||
| Like, whatever it is about... | ||
| And it was all... | ||
| It was the main source... | ||
| Of all my problems in high school, all my problems in high school is I was not willing to do things I didn't want to do. | ||
| So I would barely get by through high school. | ||
| I would take tests, you know, that would register intelligence or measure intelligence. | ||
| That'd be great. | ||
| Everything's fine. | ||
| But I would take actual tests based on what I was supposed to be studying, and I fucking barely paid attention. | ||
| I mean, I squoze through high school with like a C average in most things. | ||
| I barely got by. | ||
| And even when I was going to college, I was only going to college, I went to Boston University, or UMass, rather, in Boston. | ||
| And the only reason why I went is because I didn't want anybody to think I was a loser. | ||
| So I was taking classes at UMass, and I was teaching Taekwondo at Boston University, which was like a really good school. | ||
| I was looking at all these people that were preparing for life, and to me it was like, you're gonna go get eaten by alligators or something. | ||
| I was like, what are you gonna do? | ||
| You're gonna go get a job? | ||
| You're gonna be working nine to five? | ||
| For whatever fucked up thing that was wrong in my head, I would way rather get up in the morning and deliver newspapers for three hours a day, or drive limos at night. | ||
| I had a really unstable childhood. | ||
| So in my mind, anything that you were locked down to was death. | ||
| It was prison. | ||
| Whatever malfunction of my brain, I figured out a way to make it work for me. | ||
| Well, that was a survival skill. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| In some way. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| But also a lack of... | ||
| Like, I'm not very disciplined. | ||
| It looks like I'm disciplined on the outside. | ||
| I'm not disciplined at all. | ||
| I'm obsessed. | ||
| I get obsessed with things. | ||
| I'm disciplined in certain aspects, like with exercise, and I do it when I don't want to do it. | ||
| I force myself to practice, and I force myself to write. | ||
| I force myself to do things. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| But it's more of an obsession thing. | ||
| Like, I get obsessed with... | ||
| Either goals or tasks or things or puzzles or games. | ||
| I have a real problem. | ||
| There's something wrong with me. | ||
| Why do you say that? | ||
| Does it feel draining when you get obsessed with something? | ||
| No, because I'll play pool for 12 hours in a row. | ||
| I'll get obsessed with playing pool and then I think I'm gonna be the world champion. | ||
| I'm gonna practice 12 hours a day for the rest of my life. | ||
| I mean, I'm a sick person. | ||
| Whatever happened to me when I was young, whatever weirdness involved, I figured out a way to manage it. | ||
| But it can get away from me. | ||
| It's gotten away from me before. | ||
| I play video games like 8-10 hours a day. | ||
| It can get away. | ||
| I have to manage whatever craziness that makes me focus on things. | ||
| I see it in my kids, especially my middle daughter. | ||
| She gets obsessed with things. | ||
| And I'm like, wow, this is crazy. | ||
| This is like a genetic thing. | ||
| It's like watching a little female me in a lot of ways. | ||
| She read all eight Harry Potter books in a matter of a couple of months. | ||
| She just gets into stuff. | ||
| And then you've got to go, hey, shut the light out. | ||
| You've got to go to bed. | ||
| One more chapter. | ||
| Come on, you've got to stop. | ||
| But it's not like she's seeing it in me and she's mirroring it. | ||
| Because... | ||
| It's our own little weirdness. | ||
| Obviously, she's got a healthier environment than I grew up in, so it's not a matter of not ever wanting to be connected to anything permanent because nothing is permanent. | ||
| That was part of, I think, the lessons from my childhood. | ||
| No one's here to help you. | ||
| Don't get locked in any fucking job. | ||
| Get ready to move at any time. | ||
| And embracing moving. | ||
| To this day, I'll be like, I've got to get the fuck out of L.A. Everything's here. | ||
| I have to do everything here. | ||
| The comedy store is here. | ||
| My family's here. | ||
| My kids go to school here. | ||
| All my friends live here. | ||
| But I'm like, fuck this. | ||
| I'm going to the mountains. | ||
| I gotta get out of here. | ||
| I have this nomad shit in me that I'm constantly trying to manage. | ||
| As much as people like to take credit for a certain amount of success, I can tell you all the different things that I did that led to me being successful at things, but almost it's like the function of a mental issue. | ||
| A lot of it is a function of learning how to manage a brain that doesn't work like everybody else's brain. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Mm-hmm. | |
| But that's so, I think, common for a lot of successful people, especially. | ||
| And the difference is you're aware of how it works and you've learned how to manage it. | ||
| But that obsessive thing, in so many ways, it has gotten you a certain degree of success. | ||
| And all of those things... | ||
| Survival skills, compensatory strategies, whatever they are, they have their positives, they have ways that they really help us, but then they have the ways that kind of torture us in a lot of ways. | ||
| And I think growth is really about understanding what are the ways that this isn't doing me any good, and how can I be mindful of it? | ||
| And also, like, you know, how do I know now that, like, that now is not then? | ||
| Like, how do I, you know, stop being activated by old experiences in my past And just have peace for where I am now and take those gifts from the obsession that's made you successful but not have the parts that kind of torture you at the same time. | ||
| Well, I don't feel tortured. | ||
| So I think in some ways I've achieved some sort of a victory over my whatever mental issues that I have. | ||
| But I can't do nothing. | ||
| Right. | ||
| That's the reason why I have three jobs. | ||
| Like, you know, I can't do nothing. | ||
| And I have three jobs and a fucking ton of obsessions outside of those jobs. | ||
| Martial arts, archery, reading and writing and all sorts of other stuff on top of podcasting, doing the commentary for the UFC, doing stand-up comedy. | ||
| Like, that's the only way I'm... | ||
| I feel even. | ||
| And I can't have one thing that I count on either. | ||
| If I only had stand-up comedy or only had the UFC, if there's only one thing or only had podcasting, I'd be like, this is my... | ||
| I would want to quit. | ||
| I'm like, I don't want to do this anymore. | ||
| This is my fucking thing. | ||
| I'm just going to be trapped doing this thing, talking into a fucking microphone out into space for the rest of my life. | ||
| I don't even want to hear myself anymore. | ||
| I'm going to quit. | ||
| So, whatever weird malfunction my brain has had, I've figured out a way over all the years of my life to manage it. | ||
| But a lot of it is physical, too. | ||
| Managing my brain, a lot of it requires intense exercise. | ||
| Like, when I intensely exercise, then I can, like, oh... | ||
| Alright. | ||
| It's gonna be alright. | ||
| It's gonna be cool. | ||
| But if I don't... | ||
| It's like pent up. | ||
| It's all built up and then it's hard to enjoy things. | ||
| It's hard to just chill. | ||
| I can't chill unless I earn it. | ||
| It's probably a malfunction, but the illusion is that it's not. | ||
| The illusion is that it's a discipline and that it's all choices, but that's really not the case. | ||
| Maybe it's just you and how you operate, your operating system. | ||
| Are you coaching me now? | ||
| Is that what's going on here? | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| Does it feel like I am? | ||
| Yes, it does. | ||
| Yeah, maybe it is me. | ||
| I mean, I think people... | ||
| And that's not a bad thing. | ||
|
unidentified
|
No. | |
| Like, that's, you know, I think that they're back to the acceptance thing. | ||
| There's a lot of ways I think we're supposed to be. | ||
| We look at other people and how they do their life or whatever, and we think that because we're acting this way, something must be wrong with us. | ||
| But a lot of times there's not. | ||
| This is just the way you operate. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| You know what? | ||
| Another thing that's interesting is when I was a kid, I was not very confident and also didn't like to talk to people. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Really? | |
| I would get anxiety. | ||
| I'd get anxiety if I had to talk, and I'd get anxiety if I had to talk to a bank teller. | ||
| Like, if I had to wait in line to go to the bank teller, I'd start freaking out, like, on my way to the bank teller. | ||
| And, like, if you talk to, like, people who knew me from high school, and they'll go, uh, did you ever think that Joe was going to be a comedian? | ||
| They'd be like, no. | ||
| Like, no fucking way! | ||
| That guy wasn't funny. | ||
| Like, they didn't... | ||
| I figured out a way to be more relaxed socially, and it wasn't an easy process at all. | ||
| It took forever. | ||
| To the point where now... | ||
| I'm extremely relaxed socially. | ||
| Now I can talk to anybody. | ||
| One of the things I love about doing podcasts, I like just having conversations with people. | ||
| I want to know. | ||
| You're another organism. | ||
| You're another person. | ||
| I want to know what's going on in your head. | ||
| I don't understand... | ||
| I want to try to see what connections you've made, what definitions you've fallen on, how you've defined this world, how you've categorized things and how you're managing it, how you're maneuvering through it. | ||
| I'm fascinated by that. | ||
| I'm fascinated by the thoughts that people carry around inside their heads. | ||
| Yeah, me too. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I love it. | ||
| And whether or not they're empowering or whether or not you're a woe is me type person, you know? | ||
| And what are the puzzle pieces that have led to where you are? | ||
| And I love that you're sharing this because I think a lot of people can see you and see your success and everything that you have and think you're always like this and that it's just been easy because this is, you know, you're always like this. | ||
| But to know you had that background and you had the social anxiety and this is like such a stretch. | ||
| I think it's really inspiring because it gives people—it's like, oh, you can't—you can no longer argue that, you know, you're just born a certain way and, like, that's just the way you are. | ||
| Like, you're proof that you actually can change and you can get over things and you can create things that, you know, you probably didn't think were possible when you were 10 or however old you were when you were going through all that stuff. | ||
| People have different starting points. | ||
| It's like I was saying that if you want to climb Mount Everest, good luck if you're starting from Santa Monica. | ||
| You've got to fucking walk all the way to Tibet. | ||
| It's going to take a long ass time. | ||
| Yeah, those oceans are going to be hard to get across. | ||
| But if you're at the base of Tibet, if that's where you live, or the base of the Himalayas, it's way easier. | ||
| To climb that thing. | ||
| You know, it's still not easy, but it's easier. | ||
| And I think there's a lot of people that start, you know, in the metaphoric Santa Monica with their life. | ||
| They're really far away from their goal. | ||
| It doesn't mean it's not possible, but it means there's a bunch of steps, whether they're conscious or unconscious, that you're going to have to make in order to get to a position. | ||
| And I still remember fucking freaking out going to a bank teller. | ||
| It used to happen all the time. | ||
| I just didn't want to talk to people. | ||
| I was just in my own head, and I was super insecure, and I just could barely get through shit. | ||
| And so what changed it? | ||
| Just doing it over and over again? | ||
| Martial arts was a big thing. | ||
| Martial arts was the first thing that I ever did where I was good at it, where I didn't feel like a loser. | ||
| I was pretty good at art. | ||
| Like drawing and painting stuff? | ||
| And I wanted to be a comic book illustrator, and that was a big focus of my life when I was younger. | ||
| And I definitely took some sort of identity in the fact that I was good at that. | ||
| I liked the fact that people would say I was good at it. | ||
| It made me feel good. | ||
| But it was different than martial arts. | ||
| Because with martial arts, it was the first thing that I did where I felt like I could really be exceptional. | ||
| Like I could be really good. | ||
| First of all, I was gifted physically and then also this crazy brain of mine if I could point it to something like I would work out at 3 o'clock in the morning because I knew nobody else would I knew they weren't there so I had keys to the gym so because I was teaching so I would go there I'd wake up and I would drive down to the gym and And I'd open it up in the middle of the night and put in a workout because I knew that no one else was doing that. | ||
| I knew they weren't there. | ||
| And I felt like it gave me an edge, but also I felt like I was getting ahead of them. | ||
| You know, like it was some sort of a crazy race. | ||
| So for between the age of 15 and 21, I was just completely obsessed with fighting. | ||
| And that's all I did. | ||
| I just, I didn't, I didn't know. | ||
| I probably barely knew who was president. | ||
| I didn't know a goddamn thing about the world. | ||
| I wasn't reading shit unless it was like some samurai book on philosophy and combat. | ||
| Like that was all I was obsessed with. | ||
| And that's when I also got into Anthony Robbins, somewhere around that too. | ||
| But I was interested in things that would give me an edge, personal development stuff that would give me an edge. | ||
| And then through doing martial arts, and then also through teaching. | ||
| I think that was a big one, was teaching classes And then teaching at BU was big, too, because when I was teaching at Boston University, I was teaching an actual class. | ||
| What were you teaching? | ||
| Taekwondo. | ||
| At that time, I had won the US Open, I had won a bunch of different tournaments, and I was doing really well as a fighter, as a martial arts competitor. | ||
| So they had a Taekwondo program at BU, and I was teaching it. | ||
| And I'd have to address the whole class, but I would address the whole class as something that I was really good at. | ||
| Like, I knew I could demonstrate to them some movements and stuff like that. | ||
| I'd show some things. | ||
| I'd ask someone to hold something and I'd kick it or something like that, and they'd be like, holy shit! | ||
| And then they would listen. | ||
| Like, I was confident in what I was saying there. | ||
| And it was like the only time in my life that I could remember being confident And telling people something. | ||
| It's like, I would describe how you do it, this is how you do it, and I'll show you how to do it here. | ||
| But this is how it needs to be done, and this is why, and this is what happens when you do it, and this is what's involved in the mechanisms of your body. | ||
| And so that gave me the first... | ||
| That was like the first feeling that I got where there was... | ||
| I knew that there was like a light at the end of the tunnel. | ||
| Or at least I knew, well, at least this. | ||
| Now I don't feel like a loser anymore. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| It gave you something to, like you said, be exceptional at. | ||
| And I think that's what gives us confidence. | ||
| Is feeling like we've somewhat mastered something. | ||
| Like somewhat... | ||
| Really could understand something well enough to teach it. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| And without that, we're just chasing it, I think, and trying to get it through little things we do. | ||
| And I think that's why a lot of people go from career to career, job to job, or whatever, trying to find that little bit of... | ||
| Instead of sticking with something and really focusing in on really studying it. | ||
| And that's where I think the obsession actually served you in a lot of ways. | ||
| I think for sure. | ||
| And there's also an expression that I love to use that martial arts are a vehicle for developing your human potential because it's so difficult and it's so terrifying. | ||
| And then the idea of competing and the physical consequences are so devastating if you get hit that you can't half-ass it. | ||
| You can't slack off. | ||
| You have to really pursue this thing with An insanity, like an incredible intensity. | ||
| And then through that, you realize, oh, I could do that. | ||
| And then from doing that, you kind of realize, well, what if I apply that to writing a book or doing that or learning how to do something else? | ||
| For me, it was stand-up comedy. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Wow. | |
| See, stand-up comedy seems just terrifying to me. | ||
| Not as terrifying as working in a fucking office wearing tassels. | ||
|
unidentified
|
With shiny shoes and those fucking stupid, thin socks. | |
| That's very true. | ||
| Yeah, that was terrifying for me, too. | ||
| God, I remember Sunday nights, I would just get knots in my stomach. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Just like, oh, do I have to go? | |
| And be in awful staff meetings on Monday mornings. | ||
| Draining. | ||
| Sucking the oxygen out of the room. | ||
| Sucking the life out of me. | ||
| That's why a lot of people start taking medication. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| That unhappiness of just what you call quote-unquote real life. | ||
| There's been a structure that's put in place that we've all sort of shuffled into that doesn't serve us. | ||
| And it doesn't serve most people. | ||
| I have Wim Hof on last night. | ||
| You know he is? | ||
| Yeah, you were just telling me about him. | ||
| He's amazing. | ||
| But one of the things he and I were talking about, he gave me this number about, what did he say, like 7% of people or something like that do things that are creative with their life? | ||
| What, 7%? | ||
| Like in the states or the world? | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| Let's get crazy and say it's 15%. | ||
| That's really small. | ||
| It is. | ||
| Well, here's the thing. | ||
| 100% of kids are creative. | ||
| That's true. | ||
| My kids, they're both always, my young kids, they're both always painting or drawing or doing something. | ||
| My older kid does music. | ||
| So there's so much creativity that they feel drawn to it. | ||
| And all that stuff is something that every kid does. | ||
| Every kid draws shit. | ||
| Every kid plays with clay. | ||
| Every kid makes stuff with Legos. | ||
| You all put things together with your mind. | ||
| But somewhere along the line, We're stuffed into this structure that doesn't serve us. | ||
| And we feel like we have to do it because we've been shuffled through school and into college, and then we're in debt, and then we have to take opportunities, and these opportunities is a good opportunity. | ||
| It's a good career. | ||
| It's horrific. | ||
| It is. | ||
| And to go back to what you were saying earlier, these systems that we've built are so antiquated and so outdated from politics to the school system. | ||
| And it all needs to change. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| And we're seeing it start to. | ||
| We're seeing it start to, I think, the way we educate kids, the way we relate to ADD and all these things. | ||
| I think so much of ADD is the current system and the way kids are confined in this classroom and have to follow these rules and sit still all day. | ||
| There's no nurturing of creativity. | ||
| So I think over time, a lot of this is going to start to change. | ||
| I hope so. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I hope so, too. | |
| Because we just can't... | ||
| I see this with kids. | ||
| I have three nephews, and I see the same thing. | ||
| They're so creative, and they're confident. | ||
| They don't care what other people think of them. | ||
| They don't have a lot of fear. | ||
| And when they do do something creative, they don't judge it and go, oh, is it good? | ||
| They just enjoy the process. | ||
| And that starts to phase out as we get older and we get obsessed with other people thinking, is it good enough? | ||
| And is this safe? | ||
| And will this please my parents? | ||
| And like, will I be able to make money this way? | ||
| And we just get so disconnected from that childlike creativity and wonderment and curiosity and kind of no fear and faith in ourselves that we just get stuck in this kind of checklist. | ||
| Tassel-wearing life. | ||
| And I think it's another... | ||
| Tassels. | ||
| Tassels are our enemy. | ||
| I think there's another thing that we need to consider, and this is really important to people that are like, well, this is bullshit dreamer talk. | ||
| Listen to this, because this is real. | ||
| That corporate world's only been around for less than 100 years. | ||
| This is a new thing in modern life, and modern life is new in terms of the length of time human beings have been alive. | ||
| This is a new thing and it doesn't serve us. | ||
| And maybe with technological innovation and robots and automation and all the different shit that's coming down the line, maybe there'll be less and less opportunities for you to work a slave job and you'll have to do something creative. | ||
| It'll be more and more compelling. | ||
| But this world that we've structured that doesn't serve us is incredibly recent. | ||
| And it's not rigid. | ||
| You don't have to do it. | ||
| Right. | ||
| Right. | ||
| But it seems like you do. | ||
| Seems like you do. | ||
| What's actually really cool about millennials, you know, this generation that's now like 20 to 35, 36-ish. | ||
| That's one of the things I talk about is generational diversity in millennials. | ||
| And they're demanding a different kind of workplace. | ||
| They're more likely to take a job where they have more creativity. | ||
| The culture is like less cubicle-based. | ||
| They have more freedom than a job with like the salary and the benefits. | ||
| And they're not relating to work in the same way. | ||
| They're really questioning the old paradigms. | ||
| They don't understand like why do I have to be there from 9 to 5 if I can like get this done at home, you know, at a certain amount of time. | ||
| And a lot more of them are starting their own businesses and doing the more traditional path. | ||
| So I think we're already starting to see it change because we have a generation that's huge. | ||
| I mean, the millennial generation is ginormous. | ||
| And they're demanding different things from work and making different choices already. | ||
| So it's already shifting. | ||
| It's already shifting. | ||
| Yeah, I also think another thing that's bullshit is the amount of time that's required to make a living just to survive. | ||
| I mean, how many people are barely being able to feed themselves and house themselves and they're giving up their entire day and their entire week? | ||
| And you get, if you're lucky, you get that Saturday, Sunday off. | ||
| But most of the time on Saturday and Sunday, if you have an office job, you have some shit that you brought home with you that you have to sort through. | ||
| Yeah, that, it's, the whole payment system's crazy. | ||
| It's insane. | ||
| You see, like, these Insta celebrities making all this money just by posting pictures. | ||
| And you've got somebody going to a job, like, nine to five, day after day after day, barely scraping by. | ||
| It's just... | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| Well, what freaks me out is people that just move money around, and they make billions. | ||
| Like, think about hedge fund people and people that, like, what are you doing? | ||
| You're moving numbers around? | ||
| And you're making numbers? | ||
| How much are you extracting while you're moving stuff around? | ||
| It's... | ||
| I had this conversation with this woman who's like this staunch Republican who was telling me that the minimum wage- That must have been fun. | ||
| Oh, it was so ridiculous. | ||
| She was so adamant that you can't raise the minimum wage. | ||
| I'm like, why not? | ||
| She's like, because $15 an hour, it would crush businesses, it would do this, it would do that. | ||
| I'm like, well, other people disagree. | ||
| Like, you don't know whether or not that is. | ||
| I go, do you want to work for less than $15 an hour? | ||
| She's like, well, these are entry level jobs and this and that. | ||
| I'm like, well, You're still requiring an hour of someone's time. | ||
| If you have a business and your business can't pay someone $15 for an hour of their time, your business is bullshit. | ||
| It's bullshit. | ||
| Or you have too many employees. | ||
| Or, you know, it's not set up right. | ||
| But you're requiring the person who's at the lowest rung of the food chain to take the hit. | ||
| Not the business. | ||
| Like, if you have a business and you can't even pay someone $15 for a whole hour of working, how much money are you generating? | ||
| And why do you need all those business? | ||
| Why do you need all those employees? | ||
| Yeah, do it yourself. | ||
| It's not an efficient business. | ||
| And I wonder what's going to happen with automation and with, you know, they're talking about A tremendous amount of jobs that are being done right now by people that are going to be done by robots. | ||
| And it's just a matter of time. | ||
| Yeah, so it's even more important to nurture your creativity and know what you can do besides rely on the man or the corporation or whatever it is. | ||
| Because I think a lot of people think that safety and economic security is in that, is in working for someone else. | ||
| Of course. | ||
| Working for a corporation, getting a good job, climbing the ladder, shooting your brains out, jumping off a building. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| We don't have that much time. | ||
| I know. | ||
| This is not a long run. | ||
| It's really not. | ||
| It goes by really super fast. | ||
| I'm 49, and I feel like I was 20 yesterday. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| It just happens. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And next thing you know, I'll be 59. And next thing you know, I'll be 69. Yeah. | ||
| You know? | ||
| And then I'll be able to close my eyes and hear the yawning grave. | ||
| It's coming. | ||
| It's coming for all of us. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yep. | |
| It's inevitable. | ||
| You've got to have fun. | ||
| You've got to have fun while you're here, if in any way possible. | ||
| I agree. | ||
| I always say that I think regret is far worse than risk. | ||
| Like, I'd rather take risks in my life than regret playing it safe or staying in situations that I knew weren't, you know, for me. | ||
| I mean, it's scary, yeah, and there's no guarantee, but at least you do it. | ||
| That's where shit comes from, though. | ||
| Yeah, exactly. | ||
| That scary stuff, that's what forces you to move, and that's what gets things done. | ||
| Exactly. | ||
| Every two years, I throw away my act, and I write a new one. | ||
| I do a special, like my Netflix special, I abandon all those jokes, and I have to write a whole new one. | ||
| And it's fucking terrifying. | ||
| It's the worst. | ||
| But, I keep doing it, and every time I do it, it gets better. | ||
| If I keep doing it, and I keep focusing on it, and all that terror and fear of taking that chance, It makes makes me get better at it and that's a pretty minor thing because it's not like that much financial concern and I'll be okay But for someone to take a chance Financially and take a chance their future and they don't really know what what the future holds It's not like they have all these things to fall back on That's when you fucking dig in exactly that's when you make things happen. | ||
| Yeah, like and if you don't you just you just you You just stay soft and lazy. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And you never really discover your true potential if you just stay comfortable. | ||
| Christine, there's people out there right now that are listening. | ||
| They're getting fired up. | ||
| They're listening to this right now. | ||
| They're jogging in place. | ||
| And they're like, God damn it! | ||
| I'm going to listen to Christine! | ||
| I'm going to take a chance! | ||
| It's good, right? | ||
| Yeah, it's really good. | ||
| It's really good. | ||
| But don't just like... | ||
| I think I just broke the lighter. | ||
| You're really into it. | ||
| Don't just feel motivated. | ||
| Actually commit to one thing. | ||
| What's one thing you can do to start shifting your life? | ||
| Is it, like I said, finding that hobby? | ||
| Is it having a conversation with your boss? | ||
| Is it going after that creative endeavor? | ||
| Just start. | ||
| That's the other thing. | ||
| People think... | ||
| They have to know all the steps. | ||
| It's like, I want to get to the second floor, I'm at the bottom of a staircase, and I think I just have to jump to get there. | ||
| No, you go step by step by step, just like you'd walk up a staircase. | ||
| So you don't have to know it all at once. | ||
| It's just taking that first step, and then that leads to another, and that leads to another. | ||
| And like you said, it's those scary moments where you find your grit, and you find your potential, and you find out how you respond to adversity, and you find your true gifts, and you can only do that in uncertainty and when you're uncomfortable. | ||
| Maybe you should be a clarity advisor. | ||
| A clarity advisor? | ||
| Like something like a psychic? | ||
| No, no, no. | ||
| Clarity. | ||
| A psychic wouldn't be a clarity. | ||
| Oh, this is my new charm. | ||
| Oh, gotcha, gotcha. | ||
| A clarity advisor. | ||
| That's good. | ||
| I like that. | ||
| It's a little wordy. | ||
| Yeah? | ||
| It's not perfect. | ||
| We're getting closer. | ||
| It's a step. | ||
| It's a step. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
|
unidentified
|
It's a step. | |
| There's something there. | ||
| You know, one thing that I tell people that I think is really important and it's helped me a lot is write the things down that you need to do. | ||
| Make a checklist. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| As far as your day, the best way to get shit done is to stare at that goddamn list and say, all right, today, did I work out? | ||
| Did I write? | ||
| Did I do this? | ||
| Did I do that? | ||
| Did I take care of that stuff? | ||
| Write all that stuff that you need to do. | ||
| Do it at the beginning of the day or do it when you go to bed at night, sometimes even better. | ||
| Before you go to bed at night, set your intention for the next day. | ||
| Say, I'm going to get all this shit done. | ||
| Write it out. | ||
| Give yourself 15, 20 minutes. | ||
| You have it. | ||
| Everybody's got 15 minutes. | ||
| Everybody does. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| And then write it down, put it on a piece of paper, and the next day, check that shit off. | ||
| Do those things. | ||
| And if you could just get in the habit of doing that, it's so easy to avoid because people love to just be lazy. | ||
| They love the distraction of doing nothing. | ||
| And saying they don't have time. | ||
| Yes, and saying they don't have time. | ||
| But that is one that has been incredibly beneficial to me is writing things down and making a list and forcing myself to check all the shit off that's on that list. | ||
| Yeah, and doing the things you don't always feel like doing. | ||
| And also being accountable to people. | ||
| Like having somebody that's like calling you and being like, did you do it? | ||
| Did you do it? | ||
| Did you show up for yourself? | ||
| Because it takes momentum. | ||
| Making these kind of changes, you have to build momentum. | ||
| And if you have that checklist and you're doing that one thing every day, and maybe the first thing you're going to do is commit to making a list every day. | ||
| That's a great step. | ||
| Once you start showing up for yourself every day and doing that and checking things off the list, you start to build self-trust. | ||
| You start to have more integrity with yourself. | ||
| You start to build momentum. | ||
| And then it's easy to take the next step and do the next thing. | ||
| But without that momentum and without that commitment, I think people just expect their life to change like this. | ||
| And we've talked about this a lot. | ||
| It just doesn't. | ||
| But those little steps, they start to make you feel better too. | ||
| Because you start to feel like, oh my gosh, I'm not doing the same thing over and over. | ||
| Because that really is insanity. | ||
| Wasn't Einstein who said insanity is doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result? | ||
| I think it was. | ||
| That to me is crazy making. | ||
| It is. | ||
| And also, there's a thing that people have to be aware of, and that is the trap of falling back into old patterns because they offer you comfort. | ||
| That happens to a lot of people that want to lose weight. | ||
| Losing weight is a big one. | ||
| They start off good, they start losing weight, they start looking great, and then somewhere along the line, that old pattern calls to them. | ||
| They say, listen, I'm a fucking donut, man. | ||
| You've earned a donut. | ||
| Get a Krispy Kreme. | ||
| Just get a couple of them. | ||
| It's no big deal. | ||
| Tomorrow you get back on the track. | ||
| And you just never do. | ||
| You never get back on track. | ||
| And it's really common for people, whether it's cigarette smoking or fill in the blank, whatever it is, old patterns are really hard. | ||
| They're really hard to avoid because they offer some sort of bizarre comfort. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah, they're like coping strategies in so many ways. | |
| I mean, so many people eat or smoke or whatever for comfort or to self-soothe themselves. | ||
| And so they can make a New Year's resolution and lose the weight. | ||
| And then if they haven't found another way to cope with life when things get hard or... | ||
| Someone upsets them or whatever, they're going to turn to that old coping device because they haven't dealt with the issue underneath what made them overeat or drink or smoke in the first place. | ||
| And it's also when you're filled with angst and all these things are fucked up in your life, there's something about those old patterns that give you a big hug. | ||
| They do. | ||
| Yeah, they do. | ||
| They're like a warm, fuzzy, old blanket, but it's really disgusting. | ||
| I'm covered with bacteria. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| That's a good way to look at it. | ||
| If people want to get a hold of you, how do they do that? | ||
| How do they go about this? | ||
| Oh, well, Expectation Hangover is my last book. | ||
| Christine Hassler, Instagram, Facebook. | ||
| But on Twitter, there's no E in Christine because Twitter's screwed up and they don't let you have... | ||
| That's not even a long name. | ||
| I know. | ||
| It's just too long for Twitter. | ||
| I'll take it up with Twitter. | ||
| So how's it... | ||
| What is the spelling? | ||
| C-H-R-I-S-T-I-N-H-A-S-S-L-E-R. Okay. | ||
| So N-no-E, folks. | ||
| N-no-E. On Twitter. | ||
| And you can find it on my Twitter because of this day. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| If you go to this... | ||
| What is today? | ||
| Today is October 25th. | ||
| Oh, and if you want to listen to me coach people live, I do that on my podcast. | ||
| It's called Over It and On With It. | ||
| People call in. | ||
| I coach them live on the air. | ||
| It's fun. | ||
| Beautiful. | ||
| You coach people live on the air? | ||
| Live on the air. | ||
| I don't know anything about them before they call in. | ||
| Oh, wow. | ||
| Do you see them or do you just hear them? | ||
| Nope. | ||
| Just hear them. | ||
| You're going to get trolled. | ||
| I'm going to get trolled? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Trolled. | |
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Dude's going to call... | ||
| After this show, it's going to happen for sure. | ||
| You've been getting people that really need advice up until now. | ||
| Now you're going to get people that really listen to this podcast. | ||
| But thank you very much. | ||
| I really enjoyed talking to you. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I really appreciate it. | |
| It was a lot of fun. | ||
| Thanks, Joe. | ||
| All right, folks. | ||
| See you next week. | ||
| Lots of good stuff coming. | ||
| See ya. |
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