Valentina Schevchenko, a three-language-speaking MMA legend trained by Pavel since age five, credits immersion and adaptability over brute strength, rejecting weights for sparring. At 125 lbs—her optimal division—she dismisses drastic weight cuts, citing long-term health over short-term gains, while praising fighters like Ioana for endurance. Comparing women’s MMA to the Olympics, she defends its current structure, highlighting evolution from 1993’s raw beginnings to elite matchups like Rose Namajunas vs. Zhang Weili. Rogan calls her fight "beautiful," underscoring her tactical mastery and fearless versatility as a defining force in modern combat sports. [Automatically generated summary]
I was, uh, starting my training when I was very young age, five years old.
And definitely, uh, um, like, through all the years what I practiced in martial arts, I compete a lot.
Every competition, a lot of martial arts.
And, um, so, um, I started to compete in Kyrgyzstan.
Then there was not any competition, like any opponents, and it was hard to compete already.
Then we started to travel.
My coach, Pavel, who I trained since the beginning, he decided to explore something new.
We moved to Russia for a couple of years, and then there was also no opponents to fight with.
And we decided to move next and to see how to explore.
And definitely, I think, for martial arts, for MMA, for anything in South America, it's a good place.
And mostly it's interesting to explore, interesting culture from Russia, Kyrgyzstan, it's very far.
It's kind of like a totally different culture.
And we decided to explore over there.
We come to South America, and people there just wanted to learn a lot Muay Thai.
We started to train, give classes, and they were asking for the seminars, and we stayed a little bit more, a little bit more, and then we decided, okay, why we not stay here and live here?
I just like, it was, it is a huge part of my life.
It's everything about me.
And I think it's kind of like the best school, the best education what one can get.
Because definitely when you're in school, you can learn something.
But this is like a real school.
And the travel, it puts you in different life situations.
And you have to know how to react.
You have to learn how to communicate with other people.
For example, I can say, in your city, in your street, in your country, you can be the superstar.
You travel somewhere else And like, for example, if you are a local star, and you go to the other country, and it kind of like they are okay, that's okay, but what?
And you have to know how to deal, how to communicate with other people.
And it's put you on the ground every time.
And it's kind of like good, even for the, especially for the fighters.
So if you talk me through the progression of your career, when you moved to Peru first, that's where you moved, were you already a world Muay Thai champion?
First, I'm never worried about to find the right training partner because I know this is the world.
It's like so many good training partners, so many different people, so many like you can find anyone.
No matter if it's a small place, big place, you can find a good level for your training.
The most important, I think one of the most important ones is to have a right coach.
Because no matter how good a fighter can be, if it's going to be not the right approach, If it's going to be the right approach, he can rise or she can rise.
If it's going to be super much talent but not the right approach, he will fall.
And this is the worst thing I think would happen.
That's why the most important thing I was worried about was to have the right coach with me.
At a certain point, when everything comes in one, like in something, one complete, it's not a question if they don't want, if like something happened differently, because everything happened as it has to happen.
And you never think what it would be if it would be different way.
It just happened how it happened.
And I know that this passion for travel, it's not just my passion.
You know, it's kind of like when we moved there, firstly, we started to train and to teach Muay Thai and give different seminars because before it was mostly kickboxing.
So Muay Thai, it's more deeper martial arts.
It's more complete martial arts because kickboxing is just hands and kicks.
Muay Thai, it's everything.
It's elbow, knee...
And clinching so you can wrestle till the ground.
So it's kind of like more complete and it has different fight character rather than kickboxing.
And this is what we're starting to do.
Every time he was traveling, even we were like living in Peru, we spend it for three, four months in Thailand.
And definitely to train in Thailand, you have to enjoy everything.
But I'm not a fanatic of people who just come in there and train in three sessions a day.
And they don't explore...
Thailand, what is that?
They explore the culture, explore the food, explore what's around.
They just spend all their time in the gym without seeing what's happening outside.
To understand the full picture, you have experienced everything.
That's why I say every time, if you want to put yourself on the next level, you have to train but also speak with the people and see what's happening around.
So there is no, for example, I would put this example.
I started to learn, so I speak English, I speak Spanish, right?
And when I speak, when I started to learn new language, it was helping me to improve my first language.
So it's kind of like, yes, it's totally different language, but it's helping me to put on the better level something what I have already.
That's why it's very hard to say if you do something, it doesn't help to put on the next level what already you have.
So it's interchange.
It's something that influence on each other.
That's why for me it's every time Yes, to have better skills in sport, no matter what sport, mixed martial arts, just martial arts or like whatever, definitely you have to spend enough time on your technique.
You have to spend enough time on your skills.
But sometimes it's just not enough.
Sometimes you have to go and see something else.
I mean like the character of the fight of different fighter.
To get this experience, to try it on yourself, not only just like, okay, this is my technique and I will perform it the best way that I can.
Yes.
But sometimes you have to add yourself, your spirit in this technique to modify it, especially how it will work for you.
And this is only way how you know this technique will work.
If you are just like doing it because someone told you that is right, it's one thing.
But when you started to actually feel the technique, then it became your like so natural thing that it's kind of like dangerous for everyone.
Is this something that you learned, too, that things all help other things, like whatever you do, the more you experience, the broader your understanding of things, the better it helps all the things you do?
It's a combination of what my mother told me, what my coach, what Pavel told me, and definitely my own experience.
Because I see it works.
First, I hear from them it works.
It's one thing.
When actually I see it works, it's kind of like put...
Stronger impact on you.
And definitely for the experience what I have through all years what I practice in martial arts, I see this is the only way to put your game on the next level.
To break something like, for example, you're trying to learn something new and you go for it and you go for it and you try it's like and you have like barrier you cannot like break this barrier and you try and you try and you try.
Sometimes you have to put there a little bit more pressure to break the barrier.
And it doesn't consist with anything like feeling or something like intuition or something like that.
But once you break it, then it's like different level.
And then when you have to start to learn how to feel it from inside to perform it a better way.
Pavel, every time, was thinking about universal fighter, about, like, fighter who doesn't have any, like, problem, for example.
If you are speaking about striker, striker every time would feel something weird and like uncomfortable when someone other start to wrestle him, right?
And wrestler, definitely he will feel not the best, strange when he's fighting.
So the idea, every time, was to be, like, universal.
To create from his students universal fighters.
That's why he put us in different competitions.
Kyrgyzstan, it's a little country.
And there is so many martial arts, so many like schools and Pavel have friends like presidents of Federation of Karate, of like different styles, Taekwondo, Wushu Sanda, so like different competition we would have.
And we competed in different ones, like in my childhood it was like thousand different competitions.
And this is what, like, helped me to feel the different style of fighting, different technique, and I never had, like, problem to fight in different style.
It was kind of like how good you can transform yourself, like, switch the chip for the different martial artists.
That's why I cannot say there was like, okay, this day I switch, stand up for the crowd, or like I start to train like Muay Thai since this day.
Because it just never happened.
It was everything like, so naturally, development, like going from one style to another style.
And more, first speaking about Taekwondo, there is like Taekwondo professional style, pro Taekwondo.
It's the same like fighting, similar to Muay Thai, but they wrestle with more like throws.
I mean like judo throws or freestyle wrestling throws.
So it's more like wide variety of throws.
So it's kind of like also help for my competition in Muay Thai.
Yeah, but when I started to compete more frequently in Muay Thai, it's I would say since 2003. And then you became just much more Muay Thai focused?
Much more, it started about 2005-06, because before it was like, we already started to fight Muay Thai, MMA, and at that time it was less competition for female fighters in mixed martial arts.
It was very hard to find frequent fights.
If you want to keep, like, busy and fight every time, you would fight, like, more, like, in stand-up, because there is more opportunities for you.
And this is how it started that I started to focus more in Muay Thai, because it was more opportunities in Muay Thai.
But in 2010, when female MMA started to, like, just, like, pooh, explode, yeah, we definitely was, like, thinking to come back, do the same, and we started to compete And Muay Thai and MMA. So it's interesting that the beginning of your journey in martial arts coincides with the beginning of the UFC. So if we go back 28 years, we're talking about like 1993, right?
Because one of the things that we've always said as this sport has grown is that it's really interesting to watch these young kids growing up with martial arts, with mixed martial arts, as opposed to, you know, they would be 30 years old with a lifetime of wrestling and then learn how to strike and then enter the UFC. We're seeing people Like yourself, that when you started your martial arts journey was the beginning of the UFC, which is pretty crazy.
Well, you're not just a UFC champion, you're one of the best champions.
It's very unique to watch you fight, because you're one of those people, like Anderson Silva in his prime, where you've kind of cleaned out your division.
And there's no disrespect to your opponents, but some of your opponents, when I'm watching you fight them, I'm not thinking, are they going to beat you?
I'm thinking, what are you going to do to them?
It's a strange position to be in where you're almost like competing.
You're competing against these women, but your level is so much higher than everyone else in this 125-pound division that there's just not much there for you in terms of like Valentina has to fight this woman.
I think that definitely this is one of my goals in my performance, in my training.
And definitely this is like the idea of my fight style to be able to...
Win the fight, made the fight very beautiful from the technical side, very intensive, very, like, just high-level martial arts.
But in the same time, without doing, like, dirty fight, like, street fight, just, like, different level, when you can finish your opponent without them touching you.
Well, it's very clear that you have a very well-rounded skill set, but it's also clear that when you're faced with particular challenges, your preparation for those particular challenges almost puts you in a situation where you want to try, like the Juliana Pena fight is a good example of that, right?
Like you shocked the world when you armbarred her, because everybody felt like if she had a chance to beat you, it would be grappling, and you as a Muay Thai champion, if you had a chance to beat her, it would be your striking.
Holy shit!
Like, that was a wake-up call for a lot of people, that you're not just well-rounded, but you're capable of finishing everywhere, that you're lethal everywhere.
Yeah, this is what every time was in my training, my goals for the competition.
Not just go there and compete, but go there and win.
Doesn't matter what I have to do to win the fight, I have to find the solution.
I have to find the way to win the fight.
And every time it was like my mindset.
I don't like like this idea just go and have fun in the fight.
I don't like idea just be there and like just to experience the feeling.
I think for someone it's good, but if you have like higher goals for yourself, you have to put higher goals, like higher like things what you're thinking for.
This is in my head.
This is what I had since the beginning, that no matter what happening, I have to find solution to turn the fight to my side and win the fight.
And definitely I was like, I understood fighting in mixed martial arts.
I have to have more arms.
I have to have more advantages, like if we are comparing with other fighters.
Because the more advantage you have, it's kind of like in the war, right?
You have a handgun, you have a certain percentage to win.
You have more arms in your position, you have more percentages.
So I want to have 100% to win the fight.
That's why I was training everything.
And training not just pretend to do technique, But know how to make people tap after this technique.
And as a, like, regular child, normal child, like, I doubt that anyone at this age would clearly know what they want, what they want to do in the future.
For the children, like, it's like, what they want to do, just have fun, play, play around with the same children, like, around.
And this is, I was no exception, so it was the same.
I just wanted to...
I don't know, just to be a child.
But my mom, she put myself and my sister Antonina to the gym of Pavel and we started to train there.
So she had vision for us that her children, her daughters, have to do martial arts because she is a martial artist.
And she knew exactly this is something that she want for us To be strong, to be confident, to be like just fearless of anything because martial arts give that all.
And definitely at first, it was not anything deep.
I mean, like knowing that one day I will be the champion or something like that.
No, it was just playing, doing some techniques in form of play and just exercise.
But when I started to grow up and I started to understand actually what I'm doing and what I want to be in the future, it was, I'm saying about age 12. This is the perfect age for the children, for the child, to understand and analyze what they're doing in the life, what they're looking for, what is their expectation from the life.
And this is the age when I... I actually started to train with a lot of sense.
I understood that this is my life.
This is martial arts, what I want to be, what I want to do forever.
This is what I wanted to do.
And I didn't know...
Where is it going to lead me?
I didn't know.
It's just like you start one thing, you never know where it's going to lead.
You can expect something, but you don't know how it's going to end.
And for me, it was just like to have this experience, to have this way in martial arts, just to enjoy the process.
And this is how everything started.
But...
I would say once I start to understand that this is my life, martial arts, then I put my heart to all trainings and I wanted to be better and better.
And there it was, I discovered my talent, what I can do, what is my good side, and I discovered that I can understand technique way faster than other children the same age.
And I can perform it a little bit better.
And so this is how I start to just feel it inside me.
She started in the time when it was like karate, but it was like Soviet Union karate, underground karate, because you know in Soviet Union it was prohibited to do karate.
You know, I cannot tell exactly, but you know, that sport, sport samba and combat samba, it's definitely, every time more it was about the sport samba.
It's just a wrestle.
Yeah, it's every time it was like more, something that more children would do and more like influence.
But with, I would say, when it's, All martial arts, like taekwondo, karate, it started to be more popular.
Then definitely it was more time for the fighting styles, for the martial arts, like combat sports.
You know, I would say that combat samba, it was since the beginning, because it's part like, if I'm not mistaken, it was kind of like what military was training.
So yeah, but if you're speaking about like competition, about what people competing right now, yeah, it's different.
So you start out with Taekwondo, and then you make your way to Muay Thai, and when you are a teenager, you start deciding that this is going to be your life.
Did you have any other dreams or interests or hobbies or passions, or was it just martial arts?
You know, my life, it was so much different things to do.
And I mean, just to learn different things.
That's why I never had this, like, oh, I want to do that, that.
I never had this, like, I have to choose one.
I have to choose, or I'm a martial artist, or I'm, like, I don't know, something else.
I didn't have, and I'm lucky that I didn't have this, like, that I have to choose.
Because, for example, in my opinion, a person can be complete in everything.
It doesn't matter, like, he can be martial artist, but the same way good artists, like, paint, or, like, play some instrument, musical instrument, or singer, or good shooter, or some different profession.
Because if you're singing about, for example, we have life, right?
And To become a professional in something, we are studying.
For example, it takes five years to be professional in certain things, right?
If you're speaking about university or something like that.
So why we don't spend another two, three years to learn something else, another year to learn more?
And it's going to fulfill you as a person to add more knowledge into you.
That's why for me it never was like, okay, you're just a martial artist.
My mom, when I started doing martial arts...
She said like, okay, you're also going to do dance.
So it was like same things that I did since childhood.
I was dancing and doing martial artists because it's kind of like balancing each other.
It's like, you're not going to one side too much and other side, you're going to be in between.
Keeps the perfect balance.
And, for example, then when I discovered the shooting competition, it was another thing that I wanted to learn more, to be there, like, better every day, to just do what I like.
It's interesting that that concept of balance was written about in the 1400s by Miyamoto Musashi when he talked about being a great swordsman.
He talked about balance, that you had to learn poetry and you had to learn calligraphy and art and he was a big believer that you didn't just concentrate on sword fighting, you concentrated on all these things and that they work synergistically, they work together.
And this is true because you're a good martial artist, yes, but you want to be a good person as well, right?
And more you know, it's just you are like a better person.
And I think it's very important.
Your education, it means a lot.
And you have to put...
All money in your education.
And not only just do whatever you like.
For example, when you were growing up, for example, anyone had some dreams or some things that was a huge inspiration for them.
And then for the time pass...
And you're thinking, okay, now it's too late to start to learn something, and it's kind of like you're just wasting time.
But actually, it's never late.
It's never late to learn something you were, like, wanted to do all your life.
You just have to start to make your first step, and this is the hardest, I think, the first step.
But once you do it, and once you understand that this is the hardest, How it should work, how it should be.
Everything is going to be fine and you're going to just love it and just continue to learn, continue to grow, continue to make yourself a better person.
It's so smart that your mother enrolled you also in dance and got you to learn dance as well as martial arts because the two, the skill sets are so interchangeable.
Like you see it like Vasily Lomachenko, perfect example.
He learned dance for years and he has this incredible footwork.
That you see has given him a huge advantage in boxing.
And with you, when you fight, one thing that I've always noticed is you never are flat-footed.
You're always moving.
You're never a stationary target.
You never get lazy.
Your back heel is always off the ground.
And that is not the case with everyone.
People that don't have like the kind of leg dexterity that you have, or the kind of ability to move your footwork.
I would say it helps with more like if you're speaking a balance.
Because in dancing we have a lot of spins, right?
And yeah, different dance have different level, like different movements.
But I'm speaking about like folk dance, what I was doing, like folk dance, Russian dance.
It's kind of like part of ballet, part of like traditional dance of different countries.
and a lot of spins and definitely it's kind of like help you to do like round kicks or something like that but I would say if the lead man your coach have very right of approach of how to teach the students it's not necessary to do dancing He can just or she can just teach their
students on how to do the footwork, what is the better way to move or something like that.
The other thing, not every coach naturally like teacher because it's also take a lot of knowledge.
Coach has to have this like vision of technique and not only vision of How to teach exactly this technique for every student.
No, also, it's like, he has, for example, five different students.
Five different, like, biometrics, fight style, like, different type of muscles, different, just different.
And he has one technique, one, two, like, two straight, like, two hooks, whatever.
But everyone would hit it differently.
And if the coach see...
And combine specific of each fighter with their like right angle how to turn the fist or something like that and can see this detail and say, okay, this is your thing.
Do it right there.
This will work for you.
Maybe it's not the classical one.
Maybe it's not the right what everyone thinks, like this is the right weight for this punch.
Maybe it's like just a little bit angle, just something like that.
But it's work for the student and the student is winning with this technique.
So this is what a coach has to have, this type of the vision.
But what I see, many coaches, they know their technique and they don't see the specification of each fighter, the biotype of the fighter.
And they try to just break the nature gift, what the fighter have, and put this technique, just like what they're thinking is going to be right.
And this is what I want to say.
This is wrong because it's kind of like it's not helping fighter to win.
And to get the right technique for themselves, what it will work for them.
It's just like what coach, like just he's not naturally teacher.
Yeah, it's about expressing yourself while the other person is trying to express themselves and you both have similar sized bodies, at least they weigh the same, and you're trying to figure out how to impose your skill set and your training and your technique and your mind.
And that I think is one of the more interesting things about you is this approach that you've taken to life to educate yourself, to immerse yourself in different cultures and to achieve balance.
Clearly that is having some sort of effect for you as a champion.
Like you're a different kind of person because of all these experiences and I think that speaks volumes on who you are as a champion.
I think it's one of the reasons why you're such an interesting person to watch fight.
I don't have any idea because I like the lifestyle that I have right now.
I feel myself so strong, so healthy, so good.
That's why I want to experience that feeling as long as I can.
I want to see what my body is capable of.
I want to see my limits.
I want to see where I can go.
Because if you are, like, put in this certain day, certain year, till what time you're gonna compete, it's kind of like, my opinion, it's not good because you're starting to go to your end, slowly but surely.
And if you are just enjoy the time, what you are, and just experience and want to just do the best things what you can without like, okay, this is my limit.
And you just do it the best way you can.
And this is the only way to explore what you're capable of.
And combination when it's physically and mentally, this is what is really hard.
Because I noticed that...
Mentally, what I mean, like mentally, not just your preparation, but when you have to every day train with your training partner or different training partners, and you know it's going to be like mini battle.
And you know that you have to push yourself to the like doing better thing.
It's not just like just running or just any physical exercises to do without too much mental like things to push.
So it's easier.
But in mixed martial arts, in martial arts, it's combination physically and mentally what it's making that hard.
That's why it's kind of like so hard during the training camp, but it's worse.
It's worse when you feel your hands raise up and like everything good.
Even if something happens, sometimes something happens not the way you want it.
Even that one, it gives you so much energy to continue.
That's why, in my opinion, martial arts is the best thing that anyone can have.
When you're talking about your body and your mind and the difficulty, you're now training at the UFC Performance Institute, which is an amazing facility in Las Vegas, which for sure helps the body, right?
I have very different, very unusual approach for my trainings.
For example, physically.
I don't like to train with weights.
I don't like to train with some very popular equipment, like modern fighters working.
I prefer to focus myself on the training in the gym.
For the mental, I work on my mental game during the training as well.
For example, I give this example.
My coach, he said in time, Pavel, he said in time how many minutes One round is going to be.
How long is the training going to be?
So coming into the gym, we don't have like from 10 to 11, this is our training.
From 10 to 12, this is a limit for our training.
No, we have like three, four hours, the window.
And it's decision of Pavel, when's the training going to stop?
So it can go all three hours, sometimes all four hours.
It's all up to him.
And this is like, for example, this is the mental preparation, the mental game that you are dying in the training physically, but your mind is saying continue.
Your coach is saying, continue.
And you are pushing yourself to continue.
This is the best mental preparation you can have for the fight.
When your body already says, I cannot, but your mind says, yes, you can.
It's kind of like opening the second respiration, second respiration.
Yes, because as I said earlier, to be the best version of yourself in anything, in something, in martial arts, for example, you have to do everything what's considering with martial arts.
You cannot do psychology apart, because if you go to...
As a person who doesn't know what is that fighter psychology or never was in the fight, it doesn't know how it feels in the fight, they will give you wrong advices.
They will teach you wrong things.
No, so it's completely you don't want to happen.
It's something that's gonna miss.
They're gonna choke to each other, strike each other, and be completely not...
But it doesn't matter I won't listen to something like what people have right, saying right, or something like exactly that I consider would work for me.
It doesn't mean that I will close the eyes and I won't listen to you.
No, I won't do that, definitely.
I will take it.
But I mean to go to someone and like, okay, share your experience, share your like...
No, no, it's not.
Even like you will listen it for a thousand times, if you are not experienced that, you never will feel it.
It never will work for you.
Backwards, when I feel a person trying to give too much advice, when no one asks them to give that advice, I feel like, okay, maybe I have to get away from that person.
If a person is still learning and still has many things to work on, or teenagers, or children, they have to work twice a day or three times too much.
No, twice a day, that's fine.
They have to work more.
I was working more, so I was training more when I was early ages.
Now it's enough one time a day.
It's more than enough.
And you know, people sometimes do, for example, one hour in the morning, then sparrings in afternoon, and it's kind of like they're tired here, they're tired there, and they cannot do one hard session and show everything put in the sparrings and have this full energy.
It's not here or not there.
It's something in between.
And you don't know, like, do I have to do that or that?
And sometimes you just feel so tired when the time is fight and you're changing room in the fighting room.
Before you fight, you're thinking, oh, I wish it's going to finish soon because I'm so tired.
This is what I don't want to happen.
I want to feel so much energy for my fight.
Because it's good if you are training good, but the most important part to win the fight, right?
Yes.
Some people, they confuse.
They think that they have to train, like, so hard and, like, to prove something like that.
But for the time in the fight, they don't have energy.
If you pay attention to other MMA fighters, they usually break it up to two things a day.
Usually they're doing a strength and conditioning workout or maybe they're doing pads in the morning and then they're doing some sort of sparring, maybe wrestling and jujitsu in the afternoon and then maybe they'll do MMA sparring in the evening.
So sometimes you have these three sessions but you prepare differently.
I just think most people just choose to live this way where they don't have a real good grasp on their body and a good control over it because of exercise.
And I'm not only speaking about training and the training camp.
I'm speaking about everything.
It doesn't matter what we do.
I want to understand what we're gonna do, what is like things we will work.
So it's kind of like Work, teamwork.
And definitely we are speaking about what to expect from the training camp, where we gonna have training camp, because it doesn't mean we are training like at the same location all the time.
We love to travel, to have training camps in different gyms.
In different states, in different countries.
So we plan it in advance.
We're thinking about, like, considering, for example, my fight's gonna be in this type of the climate.
So where it's gonna be better to train?
And we just plan it all together.
This is, I think, the best when everyone knowing what's happening.
Do you take trips specifically, like say if you're gonna face someone who's a great judo expert, do you train specifically, like would you go to a place and train with like a Kayla Harrison or something like that, or someone who was specifically a judo stylist?
First of all, we're considering to have a similar weight class.
This is the number one rule.
Because, for example, if someone is...
I'm not just speaking about Kayla right now.
I'm speaking like a general.
I know.
I'm speaking about general.
Sometimes it's not beneficial.
Even the person, they are skillful, super controlled, and do so good at their things.
their heart full power because they are just bigger and they just stronger it's not good for you because you have to feel this like moment when you're kind of like breaking them or they kind of like have this thing when they are like in their technique you have to feel the moment you have to be able to go hard Exactly.
And this is like the number one rule.
So I like to train and I'm trained with a training partner similar to my weight class.
Do you foresee a possibility of you competing at 135 pounds again?
Because Amanda Nunes is kind of running out of opposition and you're kind of running out of opposition and you both had epic fights against each other.
Like I said, you are in this position that's very similar to, like, many of the great fighters that are dominant champions where you don't have one person who stands out.
If you had a long time out, like if the UFC said, here we are, we are in October, if they said, Valentina, August, next year, we would like you to fight Amanda Nunes.
That's going to be this big, super fight.
Would you try to gain weight?
Would you lift weights?
Would you do anything differently?
Or would you just concentrate on technique and strategy and maintain the same weight you're at now?
It's interesting to see different people's approaches, right?
Like when Israel Adesanya went up to challenge Jan Bohovic for the 205 pound title, he did the same thing that you're saying.
He didn't gain any weight.
He just concentrated on his technique and training.
But there was moments in that fight where the size of Jan Bojovic was evident in the grappling exchanges when he was able to control him on the ground.
Do you think that there's any benefit?
I mean, this is why I'm saying if you have a long time.
I'm not saying if you just have a normal eight-week camp.
I'm saying if they give you eight months, nine months, and they let you know in advance, you still don't think you'd ever try to gain any weight?
Yeah, I wouldn't think that was a good idea either.
I was just curious.
I think that there is a real issue with fighters that lose a lot of weight, and I think the long-term consequences are probably ultimately not worth it.
It's kind of like the same, the opposite way, for example.
They are going down too much.
They are, like, having this extreme cutting weight.
But them, all weight, it has, like...
Tendency come back like double, triple with the friends.
And then it makes it harder to go back and cut the weight again.
So it's kind of like it's going that way once, working once, but then you have to do it harder and harder before you decide that it's not a smart thing to do.
Well, it's really interesting because that level has increased dramatically over the last decade and a half.
When we first saw Ronda Rousey competing in the UFC, some of the earliest female fights in the UFC, the competition that she was facing was just not at the same level as the male competition.
But now, when you see Rose Namajunas versus Zhang Weili, that is a very, very high-level fight.
And it's very exciting because they're both world champion, elite martial artists.
So when they fight, you're seeing two of the best of the best, period, in the sport.
It really is amazing when you think back from when you first started training martial arts as a five-year-old girl in 1993 to today, the UFC is almost unrecognizable.
If you go back and watch any other sport from 1993, say like football or basketball, it looks similar.
I mean, you might have better athletes today and better training today, but it looks pretty similar.
Today, martial arts has expanded so far above and beyond what it was at in those days.
You know, back then, people are more like young generations.
They don't have any idea how it was back then.
To watch some fights, you have to have this VHS cassette.
You have to have not only this tape, but also the whole equipment to watch that.
And it's only special people would have it.
And being here in America, in the United States, it's different than being there.
It's everything way harder over there.
It's so much technology here and not yet over there.
So it's kind of like was very hard to watch fights.
It's only like special people would have this VHS tape.
So it's kind of like, I would say...
First, like, fights, female fights, for me, if you're speaking about youth, definitely when I was competing Muay Thai and MMA, I was watching, like, different fighters from, like, their countries and, like, definitely, like, high level from their countries.
And it was my first championship, but I won world champion in mixed martial arts.
It was South Korea in 2003. It was my first MMA. That was your first MMA fight?
Title, what I won.
It was the World Championships in South Korea, in Seoul, against Korean fighters, the best in their response.
So, yeah, but I would say...
Since MMA started, female MMA started to develop through the world a lot, it was probably Gina Karana and Chris Seiberg.
Yeah, that was a big one.
This is when it started, and it was a big push.
But definitely with Rwanda it was kind of like the second wave much powerful and it's like going beyond the limits and it was very important for the female martial arts.
I think also it takes place that it was UFC fights.
Because no matter how talented you are, no matter how beautiful you are, if you're fighting in the smaller league, it's gonna stay in the smaller league.
I never had these, like, things, it could be me, that, or I will compete there.
I just was like, okay, it's happening, it's opportunity, definitely it can be someday, but it wasn't something like, oh, I have to be there, and I was like, do anything to be there.
I just, every time in my life, I don't like to rush things.
I just like do everything for make it happen, to be ready when it happens, but in the same time to not do like some crazy movement towards that one because it's not right, I think.
It's completely like...
Not right, because you're just losing your style yourself.
I just...
Okay, it's happening.
It's a good sign.
But I continue doing my life.
I don't know what it's going to be like through some years.
And for example, I tell you, local fighters born in the United States, five, seven fights, they have a chance to be in the UFC. A fighter who was born far has to make a whole circle around the world,
living in South America for eight years, winning 17 times world titles, and then, only then, being signed for the UFC. Well, that's you!
I had a long way.
I'm not complaining.
I think it's a very good thing.
I think it's a very good way because I am ready for where I am right now.
Because you can see...
Fighters who are mentally not ready for being in the position where they are.
And just they are starting to break.
And they're thinking, oh, it's so much pressure.
I am not ready for that.
I don't want my title.
I want to give up.
I don't want to do it anymore.
So this is not right because they're going to fight.
They're still going to come back and fight.
And I think it's better fight for the title than be a challenger to defend your title.
But in my case, I already was so ready to do what I am doing.
I am ready mentally.
I know that my first fight definitely was huge.
It was big.
It was different to compare to other leagues where I competed because it was just big.
I think you make a very good point because I look at some talented young fighters and I say this person has a lot of potential, but they're in the deep water too quickly.
Whereas some other fighters, maybe they get there too soon and you're seeing them gonna get beat up when they're fighting someone that's too many levels above them where it's not really competitive yet.
Like they're not, they don't have the skills.
Some people can just rise.
Like Jon Jones again, he's another example.
He was in the UFC early in his career.
But he was so talented that he was able to dominate guys like Mauricio Shogun Hua in his first title fight when he was 22 years old, which is crazy, right?
But some people, they're just not ready yet, but they could be.
They could be one day.
And I think that they get into the UFC maybe too soon.
Whereas with you...
You had so much experience.
World Championship Muay Thai fights.
You had MMA fights.
You had all this experience.
You were like a fully developed martial artist by the time you got to the UFC, which I think is the perfect way to do it.
I knew exactly what is my goal, what I have to do to, like, To continue, make my life interesting.
And this is what I'm still doing.
I know exactly what I have to do.
I don't have any doubts how to have my life, how to live my life, to still feel like this interest is for the life, interest for martial arts, this desire to keep training the same hard way as I do.
So I know exactly how to maintain that.
And this is, I think, the best.
Because for me, martial arts, it's not just sport.
It's my, every time I say, it's my lifestyle.
Even my philosophy.
Even, for example, if you come back to the question about the meditation and, like, all these things.
For me, gym.
Place where I train, it's like my temple.
I'm coming there without laughing, joking, or because when you're going to the temple, you have to be respectful for what you're doing, for everything that's around you.
This is, for me, my gym.
I'm very respectful for that place.
And I know exactly if I will be respectful, it will keep me safe from injuries.
Not every time, but most likely.
Because I will...
I will be focused on what I am doing without any distractions.
That's why for me martial arts, it's for me as a person.
It's teach me so much.
I'm so grateful for martial arts because it's like everything what I am right now, it's because of martial arts.
I have the introduction was like gun world from my coach, from Pavel.
He was served in army, in Soviet army.
So yeah, definitely has a lot of knowledge about different arms, guns.
And yeah, it was back in Russia.
But when we moved to Peru, we started to compete in defensive shooting competition like IDPR, IPSC. Here I think it's called IPSC. It's very, I think it's excellent sport, like shooting style, when you are not only just in your position and shooting for the like accuracy, But also you are shooting in different position, moving, standing, laying down, sitting.
So it's like a circuit with different targets, different circuits, different goals, how you have to shoot.
And it's like everything combination about your speed and about your accuracy.
And also about if it's stuck some, like the gun is stuck at some point, you have to be able to resolve the issue and continue your shooting.
So it's very like amazing sport.
What teach you to respect what you are doing, to respect a gun, to respect everything, like considering about the safety and like whatever you have, but also teach you to To not have fear for a gun, but know how to use it for the sport.
So high level competitors in the shooting because they are spending all their lives doing what they're doing and definitely it's like all these tricks about like everything about how they shoot and definitely for now I spend more time in martial arts definitely but I enjoy so much shooting because gun culture it's very strong culture and it's amazing because it's like it's a history it's a human history If you're like
watching a gun from what was made like back then, I have a rifle, Mosin rifle from 1935. Really?
Yes, it's like it was in the Spain war and yeah, it has a lot of history.
It is fascinating how much the technology has improved and changed.
I was hunting recently and most of the time I bow hunt, but we did some hunting for pigs and we used rifles.
And this rifle had an illuminated reticle.
Like you hit a button and it would show all the different ranges where the rifle, like where you would have to aim at 100, at 200, at 300, and it was all marked off.
For example, this cross rifle from SIG, it has like a brake system of when it's the scope connected via Bluetooth with the binocle, and you can set your range, like seeing the target, you set it, it's connected, and the rifle know where to shoot.
Where their rangefinder connects with apps, their scopes connect with apps, and that all of this works together.
I have a few guns from SIG. I have a few of their pistols, and I have two ARs from them.
They make great stuff, but it's just so incredible how everything is like, when you start studying it and realizing that the ballistics are so accurate and precise that now They have these competitions where people are shooting out to 1,100, 1,200 yards and hitting small steel targets at 1,200 yards.
It's the longest what we had in the competition, yeah.
But...
I would say that I'm really looking forward to the next year when they're going to do the second games because it's a combination of shooting and to be in a good physical condition and it's like The best and you are in the nature.
It's like targets the same like in the shape of animal with the like steel lungs, the shape of the lungs and you have to hit the steel target.
And first you arrive to your stage.
You have to see where's the targets.
And you don't know how many are them before you get into any of the stages.
So it can be two or three different targets.
You have to find it.
Like in the real situation, hundreds of you have to spend some time.
Once you find it, you have to shoot.
You have three shots, and each shot gives you some points.
And then you shoot, you move to the next target, to the next target.
And it was kind of an amazing experience.
One, because of the competition itself.
And the second, because so many amazing people was combining together.
They're very respectful, and they're friendly, and they're welcoming to people that want to participate.
When I go to Taron Tactical when I'm in Los Angeles, there's always someone there that's like some world champion shooter that will give you advice and give you tips and help.
This is what I say that the gun by itself, it's teach you about like respect, be kind, be noble, be like help to each other.
It's like, it's amazing.
It's like, it's just different.
And I would say that those people are like truly care about nature and truly care about Animals, because it sounds like they shoot animals, they hunt animals, but they care.
It's every time like funds, what they are creating, and every time it's like foundation and something like that.
And yeah, I was like, I have friends, hunters, and they are just like one of the best persons ever.
Instead of going to the U.S. Treasury, it is done as the pass.
The money generated by the tax Is instead given to the Secretary of the Interior to distribute to the states.
The Secretary determines how much to give to each state based on the formula that takes into account both the area of the state and the number of licensed hunters.
There's misconceptions about gun culture in terms of recreational gun users.
People want to think that people that own guns are terrible people or bad people or just assholes or bullies or whatever, but it's not.
When you meet these people, There is a certain humility that comes with guns, because you realize anybody could just point that gun at you and kill you.
That is the ultimate balancing act.
If you want balance of power, it doesn't matter how big you are.
A 25-pound child who can squeeze a trigger can kill you.
It sounds terrible, and you don't want a 25-pound child to have a pistol, but if they had one, they could kill you.
This is about, like, I think about this education, right?
I would love to see more programs starting, like, in the school, educate, like, everyone to, how to respect the arms, the safety, and instead of, like, prohibit, like, everything, just teach people, explain people, like, then they have choice what they, like, are Or they want to do that or they don't.
But how they will know the truth if they don't know and everyone, like, try to hide.
I think that if, you know, there's all these discussions about how to decrease bullying in school.
And I think the best option is to teach children how to fight.
Teach children martial arts.
First of all, they won't want to bully anybody.
It's not skilled martial arts for the most part.
There are some exceptions.
But for the most part, it's not the skilled, trained martial arts that are the bullies.
It's people that are insecure and the people that really don't know how to fight.
That's why the best advice about bullies is always to stand up to them.
But if you just taught them martial arts, they wouldn't want to be bullies.
Again, it seems counterintuitive, but I think that really is the correct response, the correct strategies probably to distribute martial arts throughout schools.
I think so, too, because kids, they have so much energy.
They have to spend this energy.
And what is the better place to spend it as a gym, right?
To spend in doing something useful for your life, for whatever.
Not only self-defense, but in general sports, it's good.
And it's kind of like definitely a child has to move.
Has to do a lot of things, has to practice here, there, because they have so much energy, they have to spend it.
And yeah, it's kind of like the only one thing, teach them, explain them, and like make them experience instead of like, I don't know, if...
Every time there is some fight in the school, right?
And like, instead of like do something like to prohibit, put them in the class, put gloves on them.
They would fight each other like a training class and something like that.
And then they will feel good and friends.
Better friends than fighting on the street or something like that.
Because I noticed that, for example, in my trainings, when we do hard sparring with some other training partners, And it makes us better connected to each other, better friends, because we experience the same.
Yes, we hit each other.
Yes, we hit with the full power, but we have so much respect to each other.
What do you think about this debate about sparring?
Because there are some people, including very high-level fighters, that don't spar anymore.
They get to a certain point in their career, like Max Holloway for an example, and you could say, you know, there's a lot of debate about this, but where there's no debate is how good Max Holloway looks.
So to me it's so perplexing, because I think It's undeniable that there's a certain amount of timing and fluidity that's generated from sparring.
But it's also undeniable that sometimes people spar too hard and that you lose some of your resiliency and you're taking away some of the future of your career from these hard sparring sessions.
If you want to prepare yourself for the fight, you have to feel your opponent.
Timing and, like, one thing when you hit pads, different when you hit someone and someone hit you back.
But sometimes people, they have a wrong approach to sparrings.
Sometimes they want, like mostly young people not having much experience, they want to show that they're brave, that they are not afraid to receive this hit or something like that.
They said, why I have to put helmet?
What?
I'm professional.
I'm a super fighter.
I don't put a helmet.
And definitely when you absorb strong Strike, like jab or whatever, you're going to feel it.
You're going to feel it.
And if it's before the fight, training camp, you have to have sparrings, a lot of sparrings.
And less protection you have, more damage you have.
Because to get ready for something and know how it's gonna look, you have to do it in full.
It's like, for example, rehearsal for the movie.
You can do it like 50%, but you have to have it 100% like few times just to know what you're gonna do.
And this is the same.
Even, for example, I... It's not happening here because we got our uniform right before the fight.
But before, when I fighted in Muay Thai in different competitions, it was necessary to have one or two trainings in the same uniform, the same gear that I would use for my fight in the competition.
The ties, when they spar, they spend a lot of time...
They play spar, where they touch each other.
They're tapping because they fight so often that they're prepared for fighting because they're fighting on a regular basis, sometimes once a week or once every two weeks.
But when they spar, they spar very lightly.
What are your thoughts on that sort of play sparring?
Like if you watch Sanchai, for example, he's one of the best ever.
And when he spars, he's very light and it's a lot of movement and playful.
The argument against that is that what you're doing in the strength and conditioning is building your reservoir of energy.
So you're making it much bigger because instead of concentrating on the technique, you're only concentrating on the physical performance of your cardiovascular system.
You're only concentrating on your VO2 max.
You're only concentrating on explosive energy and power.
And then in building that, you strengthen the machine that you used to fight with.
Yes, but if you do the same with your training partner, it will work double because machine, it doesn't respond you.
It's like you used to do the certain exercise, the weight what you are doing with the machine, but when you are in the fight, The machine starts to work differently because it's attacking you as well.
And you have to now work differently.
This is what I want to tell you.
You are not focusing on the technique when you are training with a training partner.
You are focusing on both, your resistance and technique.
So it's different.
It's harder.
Yes, I know it's harder.
It's very hard because you have to be perfect in your technique and also have enough resistance, endurance for keep going.
Well, there's other people that had similar strategies like George St. Pierre told me he didn't really.
I mean, I think he varied.
He changed things up at some important time in his career.
And he did have different approaches as time went on.
But at one point in time, he said, I don't do any strength and conditioning.
He goes, I concentrate on efficiency, and I concentrate on my technique, and I concentrate on fight training.
And he had the same philosophy that time spent doing other things would detract from his ability to improve his efficiency and improve his overall technique.
And more I want to add, like, all injuries, they are coming mostly from training.
When you are in the training, and when you are, like, already so tired to defend something, and you're just like, okay, whatever, I will fall down, and you fall down bad, right?
And this is what this energy comes from.
So if you are doing, like, you spend half of energy of running, then already you don't have this Defense level, protection level against injuries.
Like most likely, not training session, but like diet, yeah?
For example, my weight in the morning like that, and this is what I was eating like that.
After training, I felt this, that, that.
I did it like part of my time, but right now, no.
Right now it's like I know exactly how I have to feel and every time I'm sharing my feelings with my team and we are saying, okay, this is right, this is not right, this is okay to feel that during this period of training camp and this is what we have to do to maintain it or something like that.
The team of UC Performance Institute, they are so incredible.
And for example, for like Fight Week, Charles, Nicole and like Clint, they are like working so good to build your like meals and working like excellent.
I cannot complain because it's amazing what Fighter can have someone to worry about their food and you don't have to think about anything.
It's already just eat.
But the rest of the time, I'm just monitoring my food myself.
I know the diet, what has worked for me.
I know exactly what things I have to eat, how to maintain my weight, or I don't have to eat.
But I'm not that strict on the diet when I... Out of the fight, out of the competition, I can eat anything.
And it's the same, the balance and my intuition.
When my body starts to feel heavy and I feel, okay, this is too much water in me, I just put on the suit and go to run.
It's, I don't know, it's in Soviet system, it was, since all boxing, all wrestlers, they had the same, like, no drinking, because it's kind of like, you know, I feel...
When you drink, your liver and your heart start to work more.
And it's like after five minutes after you drink, you feel like more tired than it was before.
If we are speaking about what the weather is right now, it's just perfect.
I like the quality of air and everything.
I never thought that I will be so in love with the desert nature.
I grew up in Kyrgyzstan.
We have four seasons.
We have gorgeous summer, super cold winter, like spring.
It's something like so beautiful, like so many greens, so many trees, so many everything colors.
And I never thought that I gonna miss so much desert.
And I knew it.
We had last summer, our U.S. trip, and we usually, like, when COVID things, all of this starts, and we start to explore United States, like, so deep and, like, just traveling.
We just take our car, our truck, and for two, two and a half months, we're just driving around.
And it's our trip.
It's different.
We are not going, like, from destination to destination.
For example, our navigator saying like, okay, you have two hours drive.
But in reality, it will take like six, seven hours because we are just driving small roads, stopping in every little town.
And like if there is like by the coast marinas and something like that.
And last summer we traveled, we started from Las Vegas, then we went to Lake Tahoe, then San Francisco, and drew all Highway 1, Pacific Coast, all the way up.
And then Seattle, Washington, and all the area by the border with Canada.
So it was an amazing trip, two and a half months.
And then when we were on our way back and we started to drive closer to Nevada, closer to that nature, desert nature, I was like, oh my god, it feels like coming back home.