David Rogers Webb has deep experience with investigation and analysis within challenging and deceptive environments, including the mergers and acquisitions boom of the 80’s, venture investing, and the public financial markets.
He is the author of ‘The Great Taking’ which outlines the taking of collateral (all of it), the end game of the current globally synchronous debt accumulation super cycle. This scheme is being executed by long-planned, intelligent design, the audacity and scope of which is difficult for the mind to encompass.
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The official website of James Delingpole:https://jamesdelingpole.co.uk
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Welcome to The Deling Pod with me, James Delingpole, and I know I always say I'm excited about this week's special guest, but look who I've got.
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The details will be below this podcast.
David, welcome to the Dellingpot!
Thank you so much, James.
People have been buzzing on the sort of places I frequent, the sort of alternative channels I frequent, talking about your book, The Great Taking, and saying, have you heard this guy?
You've got to get him on the show.
It's, you know, what do we do?
What do we do?
So, before I sort of ask you all the more interesting questions that I want to ask you, just tell me a bit about yourself.
I love reading your book, by the way, and I particularly love the section where you describe how you became a very successful financial person.
And it sounds like you really had to work for it.
I mean, it didn't just drop into your lap, did it?
Of course not!
Pretty crazy stuff to go through.
So, you're American, we've gathered that.
Take us from the beginning.
Oh gosh.
How far back are we talking?
Well, just give us the potted history that led you to writing this extraordinary book.
Well, I mean, very simply, I think I mentioned my grandmother, you know, was, I think, very important in my early childhood formation.
She was Canadian.
She, I mean, it might be interesting for this audience, she considered herself to be a British citizen.
She had come across the lake, was from the Canadian Ontario side of the lake, had come to Cleveland to train as a nurse, and she was at a hospital where they were approached to form a medical unit to be the first, literally the first Americans into World War I.
She went along in part because my grandfather was a surgeon and he was going.
So they were not married yet.
So they had the romance of being in something like Dr. Zhivago or Gone with the Wind through the through the war.
And it was Like scenes from that, the scale of the carnage that they were dealing with.
They were in a facility with 3,000 beds in Rouen, but they had more casualties than that on a daily basis.
You know, through the worst periods.
So even the cooks were tending the wounded.
And she became, I mean, she was in it for quite a long time.
My grandfather was in it for the duration.
My grandmother became very ill and was shipped down to Nice to recover.
And so after the war, they were These were they were in their mid 30s when they did this.
So they probably both thought they were washed up that they never get married.
They never have a family and to have survived the war and it was it was serious stuff to have survived the war.
They got married.
Honeymooned in Quebec City.
They both spoke fluent French by that time.
And they, my mother was born when my grand, they were both 42.
They were the same age.
So they had their first child at 42.
So this is kind of the triumph of hope.
And she was a very strong person, and I spent a lot of time with her.
And she was someone who, she was, as I say, she was a Montessori school.
She taught me to, I was very independent, so I was washing windows and making tea when, you know, running with scissors and building fires when I was three years old.
So, and she she sat by my bedside every night, and she told me stories about her childhood and the war and.
As I write in the book, I realized only as an adult that these were really warnings to me.
She didn't make me fearful, but she let me know that life was not going to be sunshine and cotton candy.
And that life was about something more than making money.
I think she somehow put that across to me as a small child.
So that, I think, gave me, I think that early formation is very important.
And then, you know, I grew up in the 60s.
It was generally good times, but, you know, the world changed a lot from 1960 to 1970 in Cleveland.
1960 to 1970 in Cleveland.
And by the end of the decade, things were really going bad.
And we lost a lot of people in our family, including my father's older brother, who died of a heart attack at 51.
And he had been the guy who really would have led the family.
And I think it was really stress that killed him, because it was already that bad.
And then that piled more stress on my father.
He had lost his father, his older brother, and going into a period that was absolutely awful with riots and teamsters, you know, violent actions and So, I grew up in that.
As an older child, that was what I was dealing with.
So, it was like all hell breaking loose and the Great Depression happening where, you know, growing up in that and seeing the places I knew as a boy literally destroyed.
So, of course, that layered on, you know, more in terms of Knowing that, well, I developed a need to understand what was going on, why it was happening, and there was no one to show me how to do that.
I just had to go into it.
By the end of high school, I was, you know, my father didn't thought I should be an engineer.
I would have been a medical doctor based on my experience with my grandmother, but I started getting business books out of the library.
Trying to understand business because I knew it had something to do with that.
And my father didn't want me to study business, but I went to a business school.
I took a minor in computer, basically computer science systems analysis to beef it up a bit and went started with computer services company as my point of entry chose to be a technical rep.
Because it was harder to do that.
It was to be the guy that was actually doing the programming.
It was called CompuServe, which some people may remember.
It was kind of like a forerunner of the internet in a lot of ways.
They had dozens of offices around the country, but I chose to go to the Wall Street office.
And no one else wanted to go there.
That was not going to be fun.
They wanted to go to San Francisco, which would have taken my life in a whole different direction.
But going to Wall Street, the office was at 44 Wall, right down the street from the Wall and Broad Street, where the Stock Exchange was.
You know, the, the statue of George Washington and Trinity Church where Alexander Hamilton is buried is all right there.
And in this 1st year, so I'm just out of school, but in this 1st year, because I was part of that Wall Street office, and I was the technical guy.
I went out with the sales teams every day into basically every bank, every bond house, every brokerage firm, every investment banking department.
So the value of that is, as I say, People and situations that you have not met before are intimidating.
But once you have met them, the spell is broken.
You realize, yeah, I can still breathe here.
These are just people.
And it begins there.
So I think that was very important to have done that as a young guy right off.
Right.
Before we go on to how you made your money, just take me back to Cleveland.
What was the reason for its decline?
Well, Cleveland had been maybe the most important industrial centre for quite a long time.
All industry, I'm not exaggerating, all industries began there.
So, Rockefeller's first refinery was there, and the reason for this was the canal system was extended west from New York.
There was a lot of communication there to the banking center in New York, and a lot of connection of the families.
So, when the trains came in, people would Go to the, in Cleveland they had the Terminal Tower, what was called the Terminal Tower, a huge, huge building with a train station beneath it, and you go there and
Get on the train, have dinner in the dining car, go to your room and sleep, and get up in the morning in New York and put in a day of business, and then do the same thing on the way back.
So this was, you know, before airplanes, there was that kind of communication.
And then it's also at the southern part of the Great Lakes on the shore.
All the rail lines went through there going to Chicago and westward.
All the communication went through there.
And the limestone and iron ore would be brought down through the Great Lakes to that point, and the coal would be brought up from the south, so that's where they made steel.
So, Rockefeller, you know, oil was discovered in western Pennsylvania.
That was nearby.
Rockefeller's first refinery was there.
It was said that There is a billion barrels of oil just spilled in the Cuyahoga Valley from that refinery.
And then iron making, iron, steel, aluminum, of course, all of the petrochemicals, paints, Sherwin Williams, you know, is there.
And then Alt Aerospace as well.
There was the Cleveland Air Show, which was the showcase for, you know, the fastest planes and what was becoming military aviation.
So it was basically all of California in one place before, you know, this is pre-war.
But after World War II, it had passed its zenith.
It was also, of course, in a very important area for agriculture and invention.
But all of that was steadily destroyed in the post-war period.
Period.
So it was it was still much of the industry still existed in 1960.
But by by the early 70s, it was clear that, well, I think people like my family expected that somehow there would be a recovery at some point.
Yeah, there was.
Yeah.
People, people, those who don't know your name and haven't read your book are going to be wondering, where is this going?
But it's going somewhere.
I think this background is all relevant because it's like in In England, in Europe, I think we have this idea that America was pretty much a perpetual boom after the Great Depression, and everyone was living the American dream all across America.
But it wasn't so, was it?
Cleveland sounds like it was the bellwether for what would later to happen to places like Detroit, This sort of process of, well, boom and bust.
And I think you're going to tell me more about where this all comes from.
So let's fast forward now to your stellar career in finance.
I mean, you worked your ass off and made a reasonable amount of money, I think?
Yeah.
Well, I mean, oddly enough, I never really Cared about making money.
I think that is something that just kind of is a byproduct, should be a byproduct of what you're doing.
So, that was never really my purpose, but I'd say that I really cut my teeth on doing mergers and acquisitions work, starting as an analyst.
And that's where you really learn the nuts and bolts.
And this was the incredible stress, often working for literally days without sleep, around the clock, and having to somehow function, be able to think, be able to focus and having to somehow function, be able to think, be able to So,
You develop a lot of experience about yourself and other people through that kind of situation.
That was transformative for me.
Then I was able to move.
I did that for five years.
You know, that makes you old pretty fast.
I was going to say, yeah, I mean, how do you deal with the physical side of it, actually?
Because this seems to be, are we really designed for that kind of thing?
To go days without sleep?
We can do much more than we know.
Basically, I was doing fasting without even knowing that that was what I was doing.
So, you know, fasting unlocks something like a medicine, you know, a miracle medicine chest when you fast.
So, your body eventually is producing Growth hormone and stem cells.
And I guess I was doing that because I was under such stress.
I just drank black coffee and I didn't eat.
And so I think maybe that could help to explain how I was able to.
My body was in a sense regenerating due to not eating.
And but I was, I was incredibly thin.
There is no fat on my body, just from from doing that.
So I mean, I'm, I'm, I'm a bit over six feet tall, and I was under 150 pounds, you know, at that point.
You look like a pretty lean guy too, so maybe that's... Yeah, I am pretty skinny.
It's true.
It's true.
But I've never gone for days without sleeping.
I mean, I have family in your line of business, or have done it, and I'm just amazed by the stamina.
And it just seems like... I mean, how much of it is just needless machismo, and how much of this... I mean, is it really necessary to work around the clock?
I think it is.
I think a lot of it is needless machismo.
I think that it's part of the drive and excitement of the whole thing.
I mean, they do it in medicine as well.
Why do residents and interns kept up, you know, on 48-hour, 36-hour shifts?
You know, it's a similar kind of... To kill patients, presumably.
Mainly.
That's right!
I mean, duh!
It really packs, it does something because it changes your ability to deal with stress once you've been through that.
So, you know, the older guys, when I was doing that, the old guys were like 35, 40, you know, those were the old guys.
And of course, they were rarely working all night.
You know, it was But the way it would work is the senior guys would come by my desk after their day of meetings and they would drop off, you know, a pile of stuff and say, I'd like a merger analysis on this for a meeting tomorrow.
So you worked all night to do that.
And then when you were on an actual live deal, it was a big thing.
You're right.
It was the kind of thing that you just did not leave.
You did not leave the office.
So, essentially, by the time you'd finished your time in finance, you knew the industry inside out and you were at the top of your game.
Is this a fair summary?
What the M&A does is you really know, if you've been an analyst and you've built models, you really know how to tear something apart and put it together in different ways and to go through enormous amounts of information very quickly and find exactly what you need to read legal documents to, you know, none of that is intimidating to do that.
So it's a tremendous Way into it.
It's the hardest way to come into it, but then you can really do anything.
And what I found when I went to this private equity group after that was because I had had this M&A background, I could do things that other people couldn't do.
They were lawyers.
They had no experience with something like this.
Yeah.
It seems that everyone in America is a lawyer.
I'm astonished by how much law, sort of, your system is steeped in lawyers and law and lawsuits and... I mean, it must take up a huge amount of your economy.
Yeah, it's... I suppose so.
I find... I mean, I'm I can handle that stuff because I had to.
So I actually managed teams of lawyers and there's a kind of positional advantage because I knew what was important and what was not important.
The lawyers didn't really know that.
They're mired in the detail.
I think we're kind of set up now, unless there's anything else I've missed that you think you should mention, but we're kind of set up now for you to tell us about your book, about your discovery, and how this shocking discovery came about.
Okay, so eventually I was managing hedge funds.
And these were, it was, so this was very intense as well.
And this was after the Asian financial crisis, what I'm going to describe here.
I was, you know, I became a trader.
I didn't, I didn't, this is something I ended up going into to understand things and I ended up doing trading very intensively so ultimately I developed this strategy where I had three or four hundred positions on at the same time and it was something where I was following things
Sometimes it was important to do that.
Well, I mean, every day it was minute by minute, you know, following what was happening.
Well, with 300 positions, yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
And of course, there are ways to manage that.
But a big part of that is to have a mental model.
that has to be a functional, not a dysfunctional, mental model of what is happening, so that when something comes up, the way I would think of it, I would hold it up to my understanding, and if it fit with my understanding, I didn't pay any attention to and if it fit with my understanding, I didn't pay any If it doesn't fit with your understanding, that you have to pay attention to immediately, 'cause it could be like a heart attack.
So most people don't operate that way.
If something does not fit their thinking, that's what they ignore, is something that doesn't fit their thinking.
Can you give me an example of that?
Well, okay, so I'll describe what, how, so in this period in the late 90s, I would see that sometimes, so we've, we're, we're in this crisis, a global financial crisis and the aftermath of that, and I would see that at some points the market would go straight up on, let's say, bad news.
Something that That clearly should not have sent things up and it would be reported later in the news that the market had gone up on opportunistic buying.
Now that would only make sense if the market had fallen and then buying came in.
Well, what I saw happening was they skipped the first step.
Things hadn't fallen.
They would just go straight up on the bad news.
Now, that started me thinking, you know, this is not normal.
And there's something else happening here that is driving the markets.
So this is an example of going after what you don't understand, what does not fit.
So I started thinking about money coming into the market.
Where is this money coming from?
And I noticed the reporting about these bond, you know, treasury purchases by the Bank of Japan.
And I noticed these are very big numbers.
And they reported in the news that they, well, this had to happen because they had to recycle trade surpluses into these treasuries.
So it's just mechanical.
So I decided to look at that and I found that the scale of the treasury purchases, if you annualize them, was basically an order of magnitude larger than whatever a trade surplus could be.
So we were already at this point where the financialization, what the central banks were doing, was 10 times the size of what ever was happening in the real economy.
Then I started figuring out how to look at what the Fed was doing.
So again, it's based on this initial impetus of trying to understand What is happening that does not fit here?
And so I started looking at the money supply figures, which were then published by the New York Fed.
And there was something called M3 at that point, which is no longer published, which was the broadest aggregate of money supply.
And I could see those figures week by week.
And began tracking, so it's always growing, but I could see when it was, well, the first thing was, what is the increment from week to week?
And I started seeing that in some weeks, the increment was over 1% of U.S.
gross domestic product.
Just the new money in one week was over 1% of GDP.
And then I realized Something is happening here to the velocity of money.
You know, I had done a money and banking course in about around 1980.
And at that point, and I had been interested in these phenomena, I think, because of what I knew about the Great Depression, even as a boy.
And I knew that the Well, in this textbook, it said that the incremental money, the new money created, it's not the total money supply, but new money created has a very high velocity of six, seven, eight times.
So, if a new dollar is created, it gets that, you know, that kind of velocity in the economy.
So, what I was witnessing in the late 90s was an inversion of that, was that the new money creating Create being created was there clearly wasn't a, you know, the money created was now much, much larger than any growth being created.
Whereas it for decades, it had been the opposite that the growth created was multiples of the new money created.
So this was beginning.
This was inverting at that point.
So that's an example of focusing on something that doesn't fit and figuring out, well, what's really happening here?
It must make it quite dispiriting if you're a trader and you're trying to respond to hard data like bad news that might take the markets down and instead you're finding that the market's going up funded by people you can't compete with them on spending.
You must lose a lot on your positions if you're not careful.
Yeah, but it helps to understand that it's happening, first of all.
Yes!
This was considered a conspiracy theory at the time.
No one around me wanted to hear about this.
But couldn't they not see it in the figures?
I mean, you're trying to trade and you're saying, let's short the market now, and the market I mean, how could you not?
At that point, so this is over 20 years ago, 25 years ago, that was conspiracy theory, that the central banks were affecting the financial markets.
I mean, it's hard for people to understand how anyone could think that then, but it was so.
And for quite a while after that, I don't think people started to acknowledge the The massive involvement of the central banks until the great financial crisis 2008-2000.
It had to become so apparent no one could miss it.
But, you know, I'm saying if you're more sensitive and you're observing things closely, you can detect that something must exist and then you go looking for it.
So I was able to use it.
It was a tool because I found that I could buy.
See, this growth in the money supply was being affected by what was called the Federal Open Market Committee.
The open market operations in the New York Fed, they would, if they intended to grow the money supply, they would make a very attractive offer to buy treasuries from the banks.
It's a reverse repurchase agreement.
It's basically a cheap way of financing.
They could make it very attractive so the banks would receive created money from the Fed for these treasuries that they would transfer.
And so the Fed was basically loading the banking system with money.
I could see that show up in the figures, and I knew I had maybe two or three days to get positioned before there would be a reaction in the markets.
And then when they were slowing, when this was decelerating, I knew the market was about to roll over.
And could sell long positions, add to short positions.
So I was able to do this actually flawlessly through this whole period of the inflation of the bubble, and more importantly, the bust, when it broke.
You know, even in a collapsing market, you get very sharp upward moves as well.
Some of the sharpest upward moves are in a declining market.
So it's, it was important to be able to navigate that.
And so there were people coming from all over the world flying into Cleveland to try to understand how I was doing this.
And I could even explain it to people and they really didn't Believe it, or they didn't know how to apply it.
That's really... I was going to ask you that.
Did nobody notice what you were doing?
And did they not try and copy you?
But you're saying... It's a weird thing, because to my knowledge, they couldn't somehow figure it out or bring themselves to do it, to my knowledge.
I don't think there was a lot of imitation.
Do you think it was cognitive dissonance?
Okay, they could see the evidence in front of them, but they weren't prepared to believe that central banks were having such an impact on what they thought was an area that central banks would be involved in.
It was that in a big way.
Yeah, absolutely.
People just can't believe it.
We see what's happening now with things that are going on that most people can't possibly accept.
What is happening?
I don't want to sort of preempt what you're going to say, but it's very interesting.
I showed your book to somebody in the financial sector who's very, very, very good.
And I was thinking he was going to read it and go, whoa!
This is a game changer.
And instead he said, you know, nah, it's rubbish.
Not buying it.
Despite the fact that you provide links and you reprint the documents that demonstrate that this is happening.
But people don't want to believe it, do they?
Yeah, the reaction of your Your friend there is, you know, there's a certain subset of people that are in the industry, you know, lawyers, people, people that, and that's just a given that that is their first reaction.
So I've been, I've been through this for years.
So it's, For example, the top securities lawyer at one of the biggest banks in Sweden, I met with him about this.
This was during my period of trying to prevent all this from being implemented in Europe.
And he knew nothing about it, and later confirmed that, well, yes, this is true.
And that's what happens.
Even securities lawyers, bankruptcy lawyers, do not know this.
They're not aware of it.
And they have to go away.
They have to struggle with it and then come back.
But I can tell you at this point, I'll give you an example.
Just this this weekend, I had a call from a guy in Switzerland who is, I think, very wealthy.
And he told me that he confronted his banks, his attorney, he has a family office, the people in his family office with this.
And their first response was, as you say, no, this couldn't be true.
And they then confirmed that it was all true.
He went into the documents himself for Euroclear, where Which is the International Central Securities Depository, or one of the two in Europe.
And he said on the face of it, you're led to believe that you have, you know, property that is secure.
But he said you go into the 200 pages of fine print, and you find that what I've laid out is absolutely true.
And there are
I remember I had, after I first had the PDF version of the book out in July, I had a call from someone in New Zealand with a similar kind of situation, a very wealthy person, and he has a network of several dozen people globally, and they were all reading the book and sharing it within their network, and these are all people who are
We're getting ahead of ourselves, of course, because that was the question I meant to ask you later.
So, are we ready yet for you to tell us what?
How it works.
What your discovery was.
what your discovery was.
Okay.
Okay, so for 400 years, stocks and bonds were property, personal property.
And I would submit that's why they were called securities.
They were secure as personal property.
Now, the very sophisticated subterfuge has been put in place over more than 50 years.
And the key piece of this is that a new legal concept was created of a security entitlement that that had never existed in 400 years of securities law.
And what that what that does is to supplant your property rights, personal property rights, with something that is a contractual claim.
And so you see enter into the documents the term beneficial ownership, which is a new construct.
It is an appearance of ownership.
The legal owner is the entity that controls the security as collateral, which you don't hear anything about.
It's completely opaque to you.
So the beneficial ownership is that you receive the dividends.
You receive a proxy statement.
You can, of course, decide when to buy and sell something and have the profit or the loss.
So people believe that they have ownership and this is really hidden from them.
And then beyond that, these security.
So the key thing about an entitlement is it is a contractual claim.
And in an insolvency, that means you're an unsecured creditor.
to To get your own assets back, you are an unsecured creditor, and there are secured creditors that have priority ahead of you to your assets.
This is the key thing.
Now, how is this affected?
The securities are all held in a pooled form.
So you'll hear the term electronic book entry system, a modern electronic book entry system.
The securities are all pooled.
That means they're held in fungible bulk.
There's no specific identification of any customer with the assets.
So The appearance of ownership is in the books and records at the lowest level in the chain here at the custodian or broker level.
But the collateral is pooled at a higher level, is passed up to a higher level.
So, in Europe, it goes from the Central Securities Depository, where you just have the records of ownership at the national level, but the collateral is passed to an International Central Securities Depository, where it's pooled.
The imperative in all these documents around this is that there must be absolutely no restriction that these securities can be used on an unlimited basis and transferred cross-border and used as collateral by others and free of payment, FOP.
And that this will occur.
Well, it's always going on.
It's always going on.
But they we so let me let me go into how do we know this?
Because of course, this sounds insane.
And it is insane.
Yeah, never been done.
It never should have been done.
But there's a reason it was done.
So how do we know this?
So it was done first in the US by changing what is called the Uniform Commercial Code, which is law at the state level.
And it's something that doesn't get any examination, really.
This could be done without any involvement at the federal level.
No one in Congress would know about it.
It would never come up.
So it was quietly implemented in all 50 states after 1994, over a period of maybe five years or so.
And then In the mid-2000s, there was a change to what's called Safe Harbor, which sounds nice, but Safe Harbor is about assuring that the secured creditors can take client assets out of these pools.
Uh, even on the eve of a bankruptcy and with no consideration given.
So a kind of collateral grab and totally out and out of proportion with any claims they even have.
Um, so that change was made just in time for the, uh, the great financial crisis where all this was tested in case law and confirmed.
And I go, go into that in the book, in the case of Lehman Brothers, But then following this, and through the 2000s, Europe was being pressured to get on board and conform to this model.
I'm not sure when it happened in Britain.
But whether it had started earlier in Britain, but I'll say there was this group, the Legal Certainty Group, formed by the EU.
And again, what they meant by legal certainty is making it legally certain that the secured creditors Can take the client assets in a bankruptcy and it can't be challenged that they have there.
It needs no judicial review.
They so the legal certainty group was charged with figuring out how to literally subvert national law to make this happen.
And they sent a questionnaire to the New York Fed to ask for direction as to how to do this.
How does your system work?
How should this be done?
This is what is so startling about this and maybe difficult for people to accept.
It's irrefutable because the explanation is directly from lawyers for the New York Fed.
It's very explicit as to how this works.
There's no No speculation, no conjecture.
So what's explained is the pooled nature of the securities, and that even segregated, quote unquote, segregated accounts, Are subject to this.
So, think pension funds, sophisticated institutional investors that are told that their assets are segregated.
That is only in the books and records at the lowest level.
What that means is they make a big to do with this of saying, well, the assets of the firm, of course, cannot be commingled with the client assets.
You know, so client assets are segregated from the firm's own assets.
It's a misdirection.
What they're not telling you is they're all then pooled.
And so the segregation is basically a lie.
Practically speaking, nothing is protected through segregation.
It's very difficult, especially your sophisticated investor friends that have clients and a business.
They will not want to acknowledge this.
It's bad for business.
Well, I can see that.
So just let me sort of try and explain it for people who aren't that familiar with how this thing works.
In the old days, when you bought shares, you were given a share certificate, weren't you?
And those shares would be hypothecated.
They would be numbered.
Say a company had a million shares, you might have one, two, a hundred, or something like that.
So you'd know which portion of those shares were yours.
Is that right?
Well, yeah.
Paper certificates were very safe.
And that was the beginning of the subversion was dematerialization.
And I show in the book that it's clear that that was a CIA project.
The guy that ran that was literally a career CIA operative who had no background in finance at all.
It was a very strange chain of things that happened.
So there was some purpose behind this.
But dematerialization alone does not sever the property rights.
So they were pushing that the G30 was pushing that all G30 countries had to dematerialize.
Because of the paper wastage or something?
Some environmental excuse?
They did that and of course Sweden did that.
Sweden dematerialized.
And they tend to pride themselves on doing things the best, the fastest, and they did.
But they maintained proper records.
This is why I moved to Sweden.
They made sure, and of course electronically, you can know who owns what and you can give them property rights electronically.
But the dematerialization was a necessary precondition for subverting the property rights.
As you're saying, if you had a paper certificate, it couldn't be done.
But then the next step was creating the entitlement and the pooled nature.
So that you you had no right to a specific security see when I came to Sweden I could hold You know Swedish government bonds, and I had a specific numbered bond That's no longer possible Right and so the next big question is Who are these people that have the real rights to these shares?
Where did they where do they?
Where does it go?
Where does the money go?
Yeah, well, there is this Bank for International Settlements document that I reference in the book, and I show this chart, which is quite remarkable, showing the flow of collateral at the top from equity training desks, custodians, down to a collateral management system.
And then ultimately on to what are called central clearing counterparties.
And the chart is labeled with at the top collateral givers and at the bottom collateral takers.
So it is flowing from You know, the hopper at the top of all securities globally, and they discussed this in the document that the objective was to have a global view and to utilize all collateral, and especially in a time of crisis, and that it would be done on an automated basis.
So, it is flowing to the central clearing counterparties.
Now, this is the Yeah, the average person does not know about this, but central clearing counterparties were being created and pushed.
As they say, never let a good crisis go to waste.
So, this is where all the derivative instruments are centrally cleared.
Now, For the audience, I'll explain.
People are confused about the term derivative.
What a derivative is, it simply means it's derived from something else.
It is not a thing itself.
It is a financial contract.
written about something else, the behavior of something else.
And based on the behavior of that thing, payments will be received, or there will be an obligation to make payments.
So the way derivatives started, there was a there was a beneficial purpose.
It was in agriculture, and farmers use did this was a contract to sell their crop forward at The point when it was ready to harvest harvest time.
So the farmer was happy to lock in the price and presumably the person the entity on the other side of the contract was happy to buy at that price.
So everybody was happy there was, you know, it's a negotiated contract.
And you knew who the parties were on both sides of this.
Then it was used in finance for dealing with things like interest rate exposure.
So if you had a floating rate debt, you could swap that into a fixed rate through a financial contract.
And presumably the party on the other side was willing to accept a floating rate.
You know, it's so these these made sense, but something happened in the 90s that allowed an explosion.
In derivatives contracts, so I started becoming concerned about this in the aftermath of the dot com bust when derivatives were going straight up in terms of the the growth in this.
So at that point, it was about derivatives outstanding.
We're about twice the size of global GDP besides the global economy.
Five years later, by 2007, it was 10 times the size of global GDP.
The estimates now are that it might be on the order of $2 quadrillion value, which would put it at about 20 times the size of global GDP.
Now, how does that happen?
It is because they are using free collateral from the public Behind this derivatives complex.
So that is where the collateral is going and the central clearing counterparty.
So what they did in the last financial crisis was they said, well, it's far too risky to have counterparties that could fail.
So we're going to have central counterparties.
that we will consolidate all of the clearing.
So you are not exposed to the failure of Lehman Brothers or some other entity.
All the trades are centrally cleared and your counterparty is the central clearing counterparty.
So they did that in the name of reducing risk.
What they did not tell you is these central clearing counterparties have essentially no capital underpinning them.
And the discussions over the last number of years are that they can fail and that they're preparing for the failure of these things.
Now, what does... so these are the geniuses that... and, you know, again, this is not a bug.
This is a feature.
This has been done deliberately.
Blowing the whole bubble, using the Publix collateral, creating the whole derivatives complex, Then concentrating all the exposure in these entities that are set up to fail and they're planning to fail.
And what that means is if you go back to this response of the Fed to the legal certainty group in Europe, one of the statements is that the secured creditors of a clearing entity always have super priority.
The Secured Creditors of the Clearing Firm.
So that means the client, so what they have done here, this is the end game.
The clients that had property, now the way things had been, For centuries was if your custodian failed, your broker failed, if they took your property, that was theft.
That was criminal theft.
They were free to go out of business, but they had to return.
If they took your property, someone had stolen it.
It was criminal.
Now it's not criminal.
Now you have a contractual.
We're all fine here.
You had a contractual claim.
You're unsecured.
So they took what was solid.
made that a contractual claim.
Then they take contracts that never would have had a standing, never would have had a priority claim in the insolvency.
And they've given the secured creditors behind those super priority to take all the public's assets.
Right.
So basically, anyone who's got shares in any, is it just publicly quoted companies?
Yeah, it's public.
I mean, it would be government debt.
It would be bonds, corporate bonds, equities.
So private, private companies are a separate matter.
And, you know, the other thing I talk about in the book is You know, the good old fashioned way of taking everything is through debt.
So, if you have a bust as occurred in the Great Depression, price levels stay down for years, and it's not possible to service debts.
So, that is That is what was done in the Great Taking 1.0.
It was done based on debt, which is something that's been used for centuries.
So, people are unable to meet their repayments, so their property gets confiscated?
Yes.
Yes.
Yeah.
Okay.
So, all the people watching, listening to the show, who've got shares in publicly quoted companies or in bonds or whatever, The money is not theirs.
Actually, it can be taken at the drop of a hat by persons unknown, but we can kind of guess the sort of people we're talking about.
I mean, they must be we're talking about a very, very, very, very narrow section of the world population.
Think JP Morgan Chase.
JP Morgan Chase is behind all of these entities.
Even Euroclear was formed by Morgan Guarantee, which was the forerunner of J.P.
Morgan, or before the name change.
So the roots are deep with J.P.
Morgan.
Okay.
And so J.P.
Morgan, who presumably there's a What, three or four people, five people, a family, who own the bulk of the shares or the control in J.P.
Morgan?
Are they called still Morgan or are they called something else?
You know, I have to be honest, I don't go that far.
People often ask me, well, who are they?
Who are the people that actually control this?
I don't know.
I don't think we have to know who they are, specifically.
I'm not sure, but I do talk about this.
I think that it's, I don't think we have to know who they are specifically.
Yeah.
I'm not sure.
I'm not sure.
But I do talk about this that, I mean, it is the tiny group of people behind the central banks, you know.
It is really the central banking power.
I think how these Entities are controlled and who is actually in the control group.
You're not going to actually know So I don't trouble myself with that, you know, I think about how this can be resolved and We'll come to that in a moment.
Just one more question before we go there.
What are the circumstances which would trigger the event which causes the money to go from the beneficial owners to the secured creditors?
Well, I think that will be very deliberate.
You know, I don't think it's not a black swan.
I think this idea of black swans is, again, a kind of misdirection that has... Oh, it's just made-up shit, yeah.
Yeah, made-up shit.
These are very low probability things.
No one could have known they could have happened.
What I'm describing here is this is all absolutely deliberate.
All this stuff is made to happen.
It's not going to be accidental.
You know, they're still trying to put out this messaging, like this Obama film, about all hell breaking loose.
The idea that no one's in control, no one's making this happen.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Apparently it's got loads of Luciferian and Satanic and occult symbolism in it.
I'll see it up.
Well, it just happened and no one is to blame.
So they did that with the financial system as well.
And so I think when this happens, basically the conditions are already in place and all the all the this is well advanced, all the plumbing to do this that that Bank for International Settlements documented about the collateral management systems and the automation that that's 10 years old.
So this has been on for quite a long time.
The Bank Resolution Authority in Europe, their documents would indicate that they have everything in place.
And we know with the backup with interest rates having gone from 0 to over 5%, that the scale of insolvencies out there is Mind-blowing the size of this but very oddly you don't hear about any insolvencies.
It's it's all being It's all being masked right now.
It's all being propped up You know when you look at the scale of the escalating hybrid war and the The the amount of money that is Sustaining this global hybrid war and propping up the financial system right now, the only source of that, that is not your tax dollars.
The only source of that is the private central banks that are controlling this whole thing.
So the implosion of this will come when they decide to have that happen.
What's the global hybrid war?
Well, let's say global hybrid war is... I would say the COVID and the authoritarian measures globally, all around that, going right into Ukraine with now the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians,
Completely, needlessly, deliberately.
Extraordinary, isn't it?
A generation just wiped out and we're still being told we must send more weapons in so that more young men in Ukraine can die fighting for a completely pointless cause that we invented.
The sabotage of the Nord Stream pipelines, cutting off power supply to Europe, Then the Houthis, the the what the very strange occurrences around the attack in Israel that has led to the destruction of Gaza.
Be careful, you'll get counseled for that.
I've seen people being counseled left, right and centre just for saying, isn't it funny that the most heavily guarded border in the world with all these kind of spy cameras and listening devices and the best security forces in the world, the best intelligence can yet be surprised.
And if you ask those questions, you are treated like a kind of pariah.
Well, as I understand from, you know, I've been told that the vast majority of people in Israel also question that.
So it's not just people outside Israel, it's the people inside Israel that see... It's a lot like the September 11th attacks.
It's something that's used to justify an escalating... So this is what I mean by the global hybrid war.
Okay, I'm with you.
Yeah, and it's full spectrum.
So Sweden has now, I guess it was maybe upwards of a month ago, all of the riksdag, the parliament, were called together in front of the military and told to prepare for war and that this will be who you will take your orders from and very serious.
Then they went out with public facing Basically, threats against the public of Sweden saying you were behind the curve in preparing for war and to the point that children in Sweden have been caught calling emotional support hotlines.
You know, the children are.
Terrorized now in Sweden.
So this is insane.
Something different is happening because this is full spectrum.
It's global.
It's not stopping.
One thing has rolled into the next.
It's expanding.
So this, what I'm talking about financially is part of a piece with that.
Before we move on to what the hell we can do about this stuff, I've got to ask you, I can't imagine you've made yourself popular with certain dark forces, let's say, by revealing this information.
Have you had any kind of backlash, any threats or anything like that?
I did over 10 years ago when I was trying to prevent this from being in, you know, essentially the Central Securities Depository Regulation, CSDR.
I didn't know it was going to be called that, but I knew it was coming.
So, I was threatened then in no uncertain terms.
I did not stop.
Well, I mentioned the vignette in the book.
I had gone back to the U.S.
I spoke about this for the first time at a conference in the U.S., and there was an uproar in the room.
The reaction of the people was astounding.
And so it got a lot of attention.
And three weeks, I came back to Sweden.
I was contacted almost immediately by someone who wanted to meet me in Stockholm.
And he, so this meeting occurred three weeks, just three weeks after I spoke about it.
And he explained to me who he was, and I'm not going to say his name, but he is someone who is a high-level mathematician who's worked in the U.S.
defense industry and has been a high, high, high figure in a political party as well.
So this unusual intersection and in, you know, the Washington D.C.
area, I presume he's probably with the NSA.
And he, so he arranged to Uh, meet and, uh, he asked me to tell him what I had talked about and I explained all of this to him as I'm explaining it to you.
Now, here's the, here's the very interesting thing.
He took a moment.
He, he did not ask any questions.
He fixed me in the eye and he said, does your family know you were doing this?
And I paid for the meal and left That is creepy Yeah.
That is so creepy.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's that's hard to miss when when someone to explain this to someone and they don't want it.
They don't have no questions.
They don't want to know any more about it.
That's all.
That's the only sentence he was there to deliver that message.
And so I have to say when I when I wrote this, I mean, I was concerned about being able to write it and get it out.
I wrote it secretly.
There were only two people that knew I was writing it, and I wrote it on an old computer that I never connected to the Internet.
And I would even go to the point of, you know, turning off anything that was connected to the Internet.
And when I was done, And it was ready to go.
The manuscript, I connected it and I emailed it to several hundred people.
And that was the manuscript.
And then one Dr. Michael Palmer, who is a brilliant man, acted as my editor and helped me to, to make sure, you know, he would, he's published, he's, you know, he's a scientist, he's published things before.
So he went through my sources and he would find that, well, this source doesn't exist anymore.
Fortunately, I had them all on my computer.
So if he couldn't find the source, I then provided the document and he put it up on an archive on the internet.
So he went through it thoroughly and made sure that it was all bulletproof.
And he's the one that actually selected the cover image.
That is just brilliant.
I'm very, very, very grateful for that.
So then we had the PDF out in July.
And then it, I think it was still, probably there was not much attention to it, but I knew it had gotten out.
And then in early September, through kind of a miraculous chain of connections, it started being mentioned by people on YouTube.
So most of this expansion of it has occurred in 90 to 120 days.
90 to 120 days, it's happened very, very quickly.
And, you know, initially it was other people, I was not ready to talk about it yet.
And other people picked it up and were doing pieces on it.
How many is it sold?
Well, I'm not, I, I, you know, the book, I actually don't know what the book sales are there.
They're, you know, the proceeds are directed to someone else.
They're not going to me.
So I don't really know.
I think it is probably, you know, it's in the tens of thousands of books, but most of it, I made the decision that this, you know, the way the globalists work, the way you make something go global is with zero friction.
So that's what I decided to do.
So the PDF, you know, it has to be free.
It has to be easily transferable.
So the, the PDF has been able to spread essentially virally globally.
And, um, now the, the documentary on the heels of that, but, but the book spread that way.
And I had, I had someone that came, actually came to Sweden to do an interview and, um, He was asking me, well, how do you think this has gone?
I guess this was in November.
And I said, well, I think there are hundreds of thousands of people that have it now.
Because I can see how many have come to the website.
He shook his head and he said, no, it's much bigger than that.
He said that at that point maybe 20 people had sent it to him already and something like that had never happened.
And I've had other people that said initially maybe some people were contacting them about the book and then it got to the point that it was multiple people every day contacting them about the book.
So, it's... Well, this is what you want, isn't it?
So, I'm interested to know what the... You've sort of given us a hint of it, but what has been the reaction in particularly, I suppose, in...
The tier just below the the beneficial, sorry not the beneficial owners, the what do they call the people who get all the money in the end?
The secure creditors.
The counterparties.
So just below that you've given an example of people with family offices who are clearly not in on this scam.
Yeah, well that's very interesting because these people are billionaires and multi-billionaires.
And for them to realize that they will not have a seat at the table, that they are out, that is very, very important because, you know, as I've taken this saying, we know divide and rule has worked well through history, but it will not work now because they've taken this insane logic of totalitarian control
To the point of injuring everyone, everywhere, all the way to the top of the system and at the same time.
So it's not going to work.
So what happens with these very wealthy people, there's an initial phase where they realize this is actually real.
And then even they panic.
They try to figure out Where can I go?
How can I run away from this?
And my real message is, you can't.
I've reached the conclusion, you cannot run away from this.
So we can only stop it.
It has to be stopped.
There's no alternative.
So it's a moment in human history like nothing we've ever faced, really.
Okay, so you had the Swiss person the other day, you had the New Zealand people, how many other sort of billionaire class people?
I was told this group by the man in New Zealand, they're in, you know, Dubai, Monaco, Buenos Aires, Vancouver, London, you know, Sydney, literally all over the world.
Because they must be talking.
I mean, these guys chat, don't they?
Oh, yes.
Yeah, so they know this is how real it is.
And that is actually our hope, is that You know, we need the adults in the room to realize we are the adults.
There's nobody that's going to handle this for us.
We have to handle it.
I mean, they've got the money to afford lawyers.
What would be the mechanism for undoing this stuff?
Okay, there are two things, two levels.
The first is reverting the local law.
This is where it was subverted.
So in the United States, it's reverting the state law, the Uniform Commercial Code.
It is Easily done.
If people in any one state get focused to do it, to understand this, and then it begins to unravel.
In Europe, it would be people in any one national any one national group that would realize as this is progressing, hey, we have to do something to secure the property rights of the people here.
So it's not going to happen at the EU level.
That is the EU.
No, no.
But so.
So it has to be done at the national level.
What they've done is, I've talked with one European attorney who said, you know, and he's gone into the documents and he has said there is no doubt that this is criminal fraud, is patently criminal fraud.
The documents on one level lead people to believe that they have property.
When you go into the details, they don't.
And it's done deliberately.
They're taking the property of people without their knowledge, free of payment.
You know, a classroom of 12-year-olds would be able to say, that is criminal.
That's theft.
It is theft.
So it's it's up to people to you see the problem is so awareness has to spread now.
People have to know this now because when this goes off it will be in the context of a lot of violence happening globally and people will be absolutely terrified and not able to get their act together To deal with any much of anything and this this is where this is going is to create the conditions where people are.
They've lost everything.
They don't really understand how, but it happens overnight.
And then they're offered central bank digital currency as a way to, you know, so this is where it is going.
And that's very, very well advanced.
And it's essentially what was done in the Great Depression.
It's the same scheme.
Shall I explain that?
Please do.
Go on.
Yeah, yeah.
So, one thing that Ed Griffin... G. Edward Griffin wrote, The Creature from Jekyll Island, which I had not read, but I've read recently.
And he is a great man and that is a very important book and all the reference materials.
So he went into the memoirs of the people that were present at the meeting at which the Federal Reserve was planned.
And their chief concern was that the U.S.
economy was functioning without them.
And actually running away without them.
So the growth in banking was in banks that they did not control.
It was in mainly in the West and in the South.
Further, industry was doing so well that it could finance its expansion internally through cash flow and did not need their credit.
So they were being left out.
So what did they plan?
And this people, it's hard for people to hear this.
They've been given a false story.
Their intention was to literally destroy the U.S.
economy and the world economy, but mainly, mainly the U.S.
economy, which was the epicenter.
So now, now hear me out on that.
What did they do?
Once they created the Fed, they had fiat money now on a big scale.
They created World War I. They financed the Bolsheviks, literally riding around in cars with them.
them.
Then the bubble leading up to the bust in 1929, the early 30s, they created the banking crisis.
And then when the bank holiday came, which was a surprise for people, people didn't know that was coming.
When the bank holiday came, they closed all the banks suddenly and these 9,000 banks were never allowed to reopen.
So they put out of business all their competition.
The only banks that were allowed to reopen were the Federal Reserve System banks, literally.
And then for good measure, they had put into the act that Federal Reserve Act that they had to have a certain ratio of gold backing.
So they created the rationale in the crisis That if they were to expand credit, they would need to confiscate the public's gold to provide more gold backing, which they did.
But the thing that people don't realize is the real reason for that, because they didn't use it to expand credit.
They kept conditions tight for years.
What was the real reason?
It was, again, so that the economy could not function without them.
During the period when they were keeping conditions tight, creating deprivation and driving businesses under, taking them over and bankruptcy.
If the public and businesses had gold, a parallel economy would have developed without them using gold.
So that is the real reason.
So what we are seeing now, they absolutely will collapse and devastate everything.
That's how it's a war.
That is how it is a hybrid war.
Right.
And then they will not allow a parallel system to develop.
Everyone will be dependent on central bank-issued money that is a control system.
So this is their dream.
And you can go into many writings through the mid-century by people like Bertrand Russell and people out of the Fabians.
This has a long beginning in terms of planning.
They believe that individual autonomy cannot be allowed.
Really, literally, individually, you know, autonomous economic.
And not be allowed.
And that popular democracy can't be allowed.
You can have an appearance of it, but it can't be allowed.
That you have to have an elite group that is an aristocracy.
Yeah, that's actually running things.
And that no Nation can be allowed to have personal liberty because it would out-compete the totalitarian countries.
So it's necessary to have one world government if there will be an orderly system.
I'm never going to go and see another George Bernard Shaw play again.
Not that I'm tempted, but these people, they're just... Where are you, by the way, on the ultimate nature of this war?
Do you see it as a clash between good and evil?
Oh, absolutely.
This is...
You know, believing in evil had gone out of fashion.
People didn't want to believe it could exist, but I think it's hard to dismiss that there is, we are in something that is spiritual now.
But as you know, people have said, and I would say, the religions have let us down.
They were all infiltrated, all corrupted.
They haven't helped us.
You know, they've aided and abetted the evil.
But what is growing is a kind of non-branded spiritual awareness because we're dealing with something that is so big and so awful that it has to be approached in Some different way.
And I think this is deep in in our humanity that people have had to pass through just horrible things and horrible times and transcend that somehow.
And that's what we're that's what we have to do.
And you have to accept this.
Gratefully.
That, you know, you would rather know than not know.
And to know that these people are condemning themselves with their own documents, their own words, their own actions, so that they're making it more and more manifest, so that we will be able to pass through this.
Yes, I would, just on a footnote there, I would separate Christianity from the actual sort of religious structures which have accumulated around it over the years.
Yeah, I think that Christ was probably not a bad guy.
I think he, well he didn't have, he took a fairly dim view of money changers for example.
Yes.
So I think we know what he would think about these guys who are currently Well, and if you go into the words of Christ, as opposed to what other people, you know, what's in scripture, what other people said about things, but his statements were pretty, pretty spot on about things.
Bang on the money, yeah.
I don't know what things are like in the States.
I mean, where do you live now?
You don't live in the States either, do you?
I'm north of Stockholm in Sweden.
We're talking about remedies.
I'm looking at my own country and thinking I'm looking at our current excuse for a government and I'm thinking these people are all grotesquely compromised by the system.
They're all in bed with these with these evil elites the replacement government, which is going to come our way.
I think by by by arrangement.
is headed by a guy called Keir Starmer, who is a member of the Trilateral Commission.
So he is, you know, the bitch of all these families that own JP Morgan and stuff.
So he ain't going to do anything.
I don't see any of the lower tier of ministers in either party, or indeed the backbench MPs, doing anything.
So I don't know who is going to save us because it ain't the politicians and I don't think there's enough awareness among the ordinary populace.
I mean, I'm people like me are quite an exception.
You realize we maybe represent about 5% of the population.
So yeah, it's it's changing though.
And you know, someone use the the analogy of a membrane that, you know, once people pass through this membrane, they don't go back to the other side.
So they, you know, we continue accumulating on the right side of the membrane.
And I've started seeing, I'm seeing shifts in people.
It's becoming hard to miss.
And this is the purpose of the book, is to explain this.
The way I think of it, we've all experienced this through the COVID period.
Fear shuts people down.
Have what I would say is to get out of jail free card that means, you know, if you're trying to talk to me about something, I have this card.
It means I don't need to listen to you.
I've stopped listening and and it if it's it's this phenomena when people are have been confronted with conflicting, you know, unpleasant information.
They just shut down.
It's just leave me alone.
So, Providing more information does not help.
What has to happen is there is something that punches a hole through that.
And it's different for everybody what that will be, just the hole.
And then the information starts going in once the hole is punched.
And that is My purpose with this book is to make it concise enough, really irrefutable, so that people at all levels, but particularly the kind of people you're talking about that are at higher levels in the system, it will punch a hole for them.
Well, let's hope so.
Just tell me before we go, your documentary, what's this?
I haven't seen it.
Oh, okay.
Well, you can also find that on the... you can find links to it on the website.
Anybody can go to thegreattaking.com, find the free PDF.
Different people have jumped in and translated it into other languages, so it's there as well.
The documentary is linked there, but you can just go to YouTube or Rumble.
It's still up on YouTube.
It's got a lot of... How come?
It's... I don't know.
I don't know.
Maybe you're doing their work for them.
Maybe you're a secret.
I don't know.
I think they're studying it, maybe.
They don't want to make me a martyr, at least I hope.
They don't want to make me a martyr, at least I hope.
Yeah.
They don't want to draw attention.
They're probably monitoring to see if it's getting to some kind of critical point.
I don't know.
It is too popular.
We must kill it now.
Yes.
Yeah, that will happen.
Oh, I haven't asked you.
Gold?
No.
I mean, you said nothing.
I mean, surely if people sort of liquidated their shares and bought gold bars, wouldn't that be a Well, I think that can help you to not be the first to fall, so to speak.
You know, the main thing is to get out of debt, pay off debts if you can.
But I also, you know, I have compassion for people that are in so much debt they can't do that.
And, you know, I say to people, if selling your home to pay off all your debt would destroy your marriage and the happiness of your children, You know, don't do that, because the main thing is we have to get through the few years ahead reasonably happy with his well-being.
So don't just do things for financial reasons, because you feel you have to.
But if you can do things like sell your financial assets to pay off all your debts, that would make me rest more easily.
You mean people with debts, why are they particularly vulnerable in these times?
What could the enemy do?
Because the good old-fashioned way of doing this is to have quite a drop in economic activity and price level so that it becomes Very difficult to support your debts.
You know, we talked about that.
So, you know, both sides of my family, the way they got through the depression was they had no debt.
You know, it's the old old fashioned way, and it was still very, very difficult.
But then You know, gold, the case for it is that it isn't the collateral backing now, as it was in the in the 20s and 30s.
It's financial assets that are the collateral backing.
So you must pay attention to that.
But just because it's not the collateral backing, it doesn't.
And I would also say it may be that the The people at a high level behind this are actually hiding in gold using gold.
It may be, but that doesn't mean that the public, the great unwashed will be allowed to keep gold.
So this is the parallel system that they don't want a parallel system.
So I would say it might protect you through a first phase of this, but ultimately, if they are allowed to do a mop-up operation and run unhindered, They don't want people to have any means of conducting commerce outside of the CBDC.
So, their control of the system must end.
Now, I talked about the local level of attacking this and reverting the local law, but ultimately, we have to understand that there's an unholy trinity of the central banks and warfare And totalitarianism.
Direct connection.
The people, the central banks are born in war, literally.
They are created to fund wars, and they do that, they magnify their power through wars, and they always have supported totalitarian movements, which would, because they're not capitalists, The rest of us may be capitalists, but they are not capitalists.
So we have to understand they have funded all of these public-facing operations that are very malevolent, highly malevolent now.
They are bent on population reduction in a not nice way.
And the only way to stop that is to cut off their funding.
The objective is to end the central bank control of everything.
So that people have to start understanding that and talking about that and understanding that if they are gone, things get better right away.
Yes.
I think we're going to end on that optimistic, semi-optimistic note.
David, it's been... I've really enjoyed talking to you.
Tell us where we can find your book.
Yeah, I can go to thegreattaking.com.
So, you can find the free PDF there.
There are print books on Lulu.
L-U-L-U.
There are links from the website, but you can just go to Lulu and search for The Great Taking.
And then the documentary is on YouTube and Rumble.
Yeah, again, the foreign language translations are expanding, and that's nice to see.
I don't know how good they are, because I don't read in those languages, but it's impressive that people... that's the great thing about this, is people have felt personally motivated.
They've picked this up as their... they've made it their own, and that's what makes something powerful.
Well, thank you for blowing the whistle.
I really enjoyed reading your book and I've loved talking to you.
And yeah, this is a great podcast.
I've really enjoyed doing it.
It only remains for me to thank you, dear viewers and listeners, especially those of you who support me.
I mean, I appreciate all of you looking at my stuff.
You know, I want to be seen and I want to be listened to.
But yeah.
Do please keep supporting me, if you can, on Substack.
It's really good.
Locals.
And go to my website, jamesstellingpole.co.uk.
That's another good place to go.
Buy me a coffee, if you can't do any of those.
I appreciate your support.
Please keep doing it.
And definitely check out David's book and his documentary.
I haven't done a documentary yet, but check out the book.
