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Nov. 23, 2017 - Get Off My Lawn - Gavin McInnes
40:48
Get Off My Lawn #35 | I'm With The Perv
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Oh, live from New York.
It's Get Off My Lawn with Gavin McInnes.
Set an open course for the fire to see'Cause I...
I know you wanted to wait for the money shot of the but it takes too long.
But don't worry, you'll get it, and it'll be in a fun way.
It'll be bass stickman bringing you the beats today.
We've got bass stickman on the show.
Just checking in with him.
I haven't talked to him in a while.
He's going to prison for hitting someone with a stick and being bassed.
You'll notice that when people hit us with sticks, they seem to do fine.
But when we fight back, no.
No, no, no, no, no.
Don't you dare punch back.
We punch Nazis, and anyone who likes Trump is a Nazi, so we punch 50% of the country.
Nice plan, guys.
Hope it lasts.
But yeah, come sail away was that jam.
That would stick.
These guys from Chicago.
Two twins, I think.
Two other brothers and their neighbor.
Used to tool around when they were 14.
One of them went to seminary school, and then he said, I want to keep playing that music.
And they did a weird operatic sort of high-pitched songs.
And then they did a synthesizer.
The neighbor, it was two brothers and a neighbor, and the neighbor was really into keyboards.
So keyboards were an integral part of their stuff.
And in the 70s and 80s, it went into synth rock.
And ol renarrigato, Mr. Robato, Domo, Domo.
A lot of people hate that stuff.
A lot of people call it dinosaur rock and say it begat punk.
I don't know.
I shunned it for so long.
All mainstream sort of rock, I shunned.
And then I became an old man and went, I'm going to check out this Bruce Springsteen character.
And listen to it.
And I went, this is good.
Rosalita, come sit by my fire.
I'm with the Perv.
Roy Moore, from what little I've heard about it, sounds like he just liked young girls.
Anthony Cumia likes young girls.
My friend Peter Brimelow, his daughter's 40 years younger than him, you know, as long as it's legal, it's none of my beeswax.
They're calling him a pedophile.
Yeah.
And you know what?
To be totally frank, I like seeing Al Franken get fried, but it doesn't look like he did anything that bad.
I enjoy seeing the left be exposed as the disgusting reprobates they are.
But I also don't want this to kill sexuality and joking and being a normal guy.
I feel like there's going to be a lot of collateral damage on this war.
But I still want to be crystal clear here.
If you did something illegal, you go to the cops, you go to jail, you get arrested.
Touching a woman against her will is assault.
And those guys need to be punished.
But today on the show, we're going to talk to a woman who used to be a man.
Her name is Alyssa.
I'm not going to give her a full name because she has a lot of porn out there.
And I don't want to be responsible for you bumping into that.
So we'll just use first names with her.
And she used to be in the military, used to be out there ready to die for a country.
And then he came back and said, I'm a chick now.
And now he's growing breasts and posing nude.
And he's still married to his wife, and he has two kids.
And as you'll see on the show, he just looks like a tomboy.
And I'm going to ask him, why bother?
I mean, I understand if you're like, I'm a lady and I need big breasts and just chop everything off.
Okay, well, you really are committed.
But if they're just like, nah, I'm kind of a chick, kind of a tomboy, well, he's kind of.
We agree with everything politically, so it's going to be fun talking to him.
And also, Ron Coleman, buddy of mine, lawyer, he's been fighting for the past six years for a rock band called the Slants, I almost said the Slopes, for the Slants to be able to trademark their name.
And the Redskins have been helping them out with this because they realize how important it is to trademark a word that someone has recently deemed offensive.
Clearly, the Slants are just kidding, but that doesn't matter.
You can have the worst racial epithet on earth.
And it should be trademarked.
That's what this country's law states.
So they finally got it passed just a few days ago after six years of fighting.
So we'll talk to all three of those dudes.
And that's going to leave us with zero time for anything else.
All right, so the Slants are a band, four Asian dudes, and they're rocking away, playing their music, and they go, we would like to trademark our name.
We don't want anyone to steal.
We're about to make t-shirts and everything.
Asians like us.
Some Asians hate us because they think we're racist because that's the world we're living in.
And they go to trademark their name, and the answer is no.
You can't trademark that name because it's a racial slur.
And they go, that's not in the books.
I can trademark anything I want as long as I'm using it.
As long as I can prove that I didn't just say I want to trademark this, as long as I can show experience with it.
And they said, well, sorry, the answer is no.
And this guy, the singer, I believe, Tam, Simon Tam, yeah, the guy with the vest there, he says, no, we're fighting this.
And he accrues an army.
The Redskins, yes, the football team gets on board.
And I don't know, I'm going to say like a dozen lawyers, putting in hundreds of hours.
It takes six years of them battling, going to court.
Most of the lawyers did everything pro bono, and that would have cost millions, I'm going to say.
The Redskins spent millions on this case.
And eventually they won.
They won.
And I love this case because it's so easy to say, oh, fine, we'll change the name.
But someone stood up for themselves and said, no, you're not going to tell me what jokes I can or can't make or what I'm going to trademark in my country.
So let's talk to one of the lawyers involved in all this, Mr. Ron Coleman.
Ron Coleman is on the show.
How are you, sir?
Pretty good, thanks.
And you?
I am fantastic.
I notice you're not wearing your yarmulke.
Well, it's always handy.
I need to make a benediction before eating, after eating, after using the bathroom.
But it's not part of my MO or my public image as an attorney.
Different people do different things.
There are different sort of generational things within the Orthodox community about the way people do that.
But when you do litigation as I do, you go in front of judges, you go in front of juries, you go in front of adversaries.
It's a little bit complicated.
There are many opinions on the matter.
That's how I've come out over the years.
Now, most people would just say, what is Gavin talking about?
That's just a Jewish hat that they wear.
But you actually have said some, you've written some great essays about it.
But that's not what you're known for.
No, no.
Well, some actually, it's interesting that you point that out.
I was once known for that.
But these days, people tend to be talking more about this Lance case, which was the first amendment case that we went to the Supreme Court on in January, and which resulted in June in a ruling that the Lanham Act, which is the trademark statute, was unconstitutional to the extent that it prohibited registration of trademarks that disparaged people.
So that's no longer the law.
I want to make something crystal clear here.
When you say the slants case, you're talking about the name of the band.
You're not using a racial epithet there, right?
Well, some people think I am.
But it's capital S when you say it.
You don't mean that thing I did with those slants.
No, I would never use words like that.
Those are not nice words, although that's a fairly obscure expression.
Some people, on the other hand, were very offended by it.
But the Supreme Court says you are absolutely entitled to be offended by it.
You just can't tell the government to prevent other people or yourself from being offended by its registration as a trademark, because trademarks are not allowed to be granted or denied based on viewpoint.
Good news for the Washington Redskins.
Yes, yes.
Well, this doesn't apply to the Washington Redskins, but I was going to say the problem with sort of censorship and fascism in general is you don't get the philosophical nuance of a lot of these words, like slant and slope and rice ball.
Those words are so antiquated that they're a parody, really, of racism.
I think they're funny.
Well, exactly.
I mean, Heb magazine was one of the many people who have been affected by this.
They had a trademark registration that was granted to them years ago.
Then they went back for another one to cover different goods and services.
And this time around, before our case, they were told, no, you can't do that.
It's offensive.
Heb is a really old-fashioned word for something.
Right.
There's always a new word for Jews.
The hatred that keeps on giving.
So I think part of the reason the Jewish hipsters of Heb magazine chose Heb was precisely because it's so antique that its status as a parody, or in this case, what they call reappropriation, is pretty obvious.
Right.
Well, it's sort of like when you say something's gay.
You're not saying, I don't like this thing because it is a homosexual.
You're sort of making fun of the way you talked when you're in eighth grade.
However, Ron, is there a limit to this?
Could you call a store?
You know the word I'm indicating.
I can't say it.
The N-word.
Yes.
Yeah, the N-shop.
Answer, you could call it that now.
You could call it that now, but you're going to get a brick through the window the second that sign goes up.
And that's the way it's always been.
That's the way it's always going to be.
The market, social pressures, commercial pressures, personal relationships are what prevents us from jumping over those lines or stops us from jumping over those lines.
Whether or not you have established trademark rights in that word are inevitably going to depend on how those forces affect your use, because you don't get a trademark unless you use the mark.
You have to show use of the mark in commerce.
And if you show use of the mark in interstate commerce, which is essentially the same thing, because as we know, lunch counters located hundreds of miles away from any state border are considered to be interstate commerce under the Commerce Clause because of the civil rights decisions of the 1950s.
So be that as it may, you still have to use the mark to get the registration.
If you can get away with using that mark, that's not the PTO's problem.
That's a problem in your neighborhood.
Okay, so people can tolerate having a school like that.
You can name a band any offensive word you want and have it trademarked.
Oh, and have a trademark.
Thanks for adding.
Yeah, you can actually have the trademark registered.
Yes.
I mean, having a trademark and having a trademark registration are not identical, but for purposes of this conversation, right, we're talking about where the government gives you a registration, which enhances your ability to protect a trademark.
Thanks to me, thanks to the team that I worked with, my partners at Archer, of course my client who kept schlepping along with us through this process, and of course the UCLA Supreme Court clinic, Stuart Banner and Eugene Vola, who helped us with a brief would be a mild understatement, and all the people who helped us practice and get this right, the Heritage Foundation, the Chamber of Commerce, Washington Redskins.
The Washington Redskins helped.
They helped.
They helped.
Not every single moment with them was tension-free, but they knew that this was the case that was going to preserve their trademark rights.
So once they got on board, and they were tremendously helpful.
You know, it's incredible.
George Orwell said, within every joke is a tiny revolution.
And it's amazing how these Asian kids want to make a joke that parodies racism, and it takes an army of lawyers and money and paperwork for them to have that right in America.
Well, that's a fantastic point.
If it weren't for the fact that the ACLU and we and UCLA did this work pro bono, we would not have reached this result, or it would have been a much rockier process because the only trademark I'm aware of that is adequate, that was funded well enough to take this all the way to the Supreme Court, well, no, there are a lot, but the Redskins spent millions of dollars on this.
As a general rule, if you don't have the ability to fund legal services for non-criminal matters, you lose.
It doesn't really matter what side the law is on.
Essentially, it's a practical matter under the American rule, which has many advantages.
The American rule is you pay for your own fees.
Of course, when you're suing the government, you pay for your own fees pretty much no matter what.
Big wins, small loses.
That's unfortunately the truth.
Well, you won, and let's celebrate our victory.
Let's get drunk.
All right.
Well, oh, yeah, let's get drunk.
But I can't invite you into the studio this time.
So how are we going to do that on Skype?
We just watch each other drink beers.
It sounds fun to me.
That's how it's going to be in the year 2050, anyway.
Thanks for coming on the show, Ron.
My pleasure.
Great talking to you.
Appreciate it.
Hey guys, do you know who Based Stick Man is?
Kyle Chapman?
I assume you do.
Berkeley rallies where conservatives get constantly pummeled, where the mayor is Facebook friends with Yvette Falarka, who's a member of an anti-fug group called By Any Means Necessary.
It's a place where the alt left is mainstream.
They are in politics.
They are in schools.
And if you are a conservative in that town, you're dead meat.
But at this one rally, Kyle shows up and he has a shield and a stick.
And he says, no, the police aren't taking care of it.
I'll take care of it myself.
And he defends himself.
Now, when we get attacked with bats, the staff of the restaurant says, sorry, you had it coming.
But when we fight back with bats, we face prison time.
Well, he'll happily do time because he stands up for what he believes in.
And this is why it became a meme.
I mean, you must have seen this picture a million times.
It's here and here and here and here and here.
And he's not going to be here for a little while, but he's going to be back with a vengeance after he gets out.
And his spirit will never die.
That fire has been lit.
Let's talk to him about it.
Kyle Chapman, bass Stickman, how you doing?
Gavin, I'm doing great.
Thanks for having me on the show, brother.
Thank you for coming by.
Now, I was talking to some people last night, and they said, you know, Stickman's going to prison, right?
And I said, no, I think that's still up for grabs.
And they go, no, he's definitely, the only question is how long?
So I can't figure out, am I going to prison or am I working for the feds to get a deal to get the whole case thrown out so I can walk and skate?
You know, what's going on here?
You know, so I am facing a good chunk of time.
For what?
For the Stickman incident?
Yeah, man.
They charged me with possession of a billy club.
You know, they took me back into custody.
They raised my bail to $135,000.
Oh, my God.
Billy Club, which is probably the highest bail amount ever assessed for a Billy Club in probably the history of the state of California.
And so, yeah, with my priors and everything and all the enhancements, I'm looking at about eight years.
Will I get eight years?
Probably not, but they're probably looking at some time.
Unbelievable.
You know, we just had a proud boy up in Vancouver who goes piss, and while he's in there, these Zantifa, whatever, alt-lefters come in and just beat the crap out of him, rip his proud boy's shirt off.
This was a week ago.
He's still got two black guys.
They'll never face any time.
In fact, the staff refused to call the cops.
There's no crime done.
They killed a Nazi as far as they're concerned.
But the law works differently the other way around.
Yeah, I saw that online, and the sad thing that happened to that young man.
You know, this is how it works, you know, and this is all part of what we have to understand when we're fighting on the front lines, we're fighting in the face of tyranny, we're fighting in these liberal enclaves, is the law is not going to, the law is not going to be enacted and affected against us the same way it's going to be enacted or affected against the other liberal inhabitants.
And sometimes you have to make the sacrifice, brother.
You know, if I got to go do some time for this, you know, I wouldn't have done anything different.
You know, I wouldn't have done anything different.
If I got to do some time, I got to do some time.
The important thing is, is the actions I took that day and the actions other people took and the subsequent actions of when you and I and Faith Goldie, Lauren Southern, we had the Berkeley 3.0 and through the largest conservative rally probably in the history of the city of Berkeley.
What we've done have had lasting ramifications that will most likely go down in history and have inspired people all over the world.
Yeah, that's a good point.
Despite all of this pressure and getting people doxx and getting people fired, you have 15 to 25s being the most conservative they've been since Ronald Reagan.
We've red-pilled an entire generation, as Paul Joseph Watson says.
Yeah, so speaking of the 15 to 25s, I guess what are they calling this?
The Gen Zennials or Generation Z?
Yeah.
Yeah, So these guys, you know, there's a lot of potential there.
And if we get our eight years of Trump, and I think we will, we get a hold of the immigration issue, we could very well have an additional four years of Grand Paul because we will have such a large far-right voting block, voting constituency, with the Gen Zennials all coming into voting age and being more active in politics as they get older.
So, you know, what I think we need to do is we really need to take this fight to the universities, where these Generation Zs, obviously they're going to the university, they're going to school.
Many of these kids are very conservative, like you said, but they're still afraid to openly express their conservative ideology because of the oppression they face at the universities.
So I think the next phase of this battle needs to take place at the universities.
I mean, obviously it's been going on for a while with Milo and what happened in Berkeley with the Milo riots.
That inspired me to, that was part of what inspired me to do what I did.
But I think we need to sort of refocus from having these rallies at the parks or on the streets and refocus these rallies and back up our conservative brothers and sisters that are going to these liberal universities where they're being systematically oppressed.
They're not even liberal.
They're radical.
I mean, we had Marx.
Mark on the show the other day where this Marxist antifa faculty member attacked them, ripped their phone, smashed it on the ground.
You know, we've had college Republicans on the show who have been spat on, violently attacked.
And then they had Ami Horowitz.
He goes there with an American flag, gets screamed at, yelled at.
He goes with an Israeli flag, gets crapped on.
He goes there with an ISIS flag, and he's getting high fives.
So this has to change.
That's got to change.
The universities have been totally taken over, and it's going to be an uphill battle.
But what we at least have to do is normalize the presence of conservatives at these universities to where these university professors and the other radical Marxist students get used to seeing people in MAGA hats, walking with American flags.
We let them know, like, look, we're not stopping.
We're going to keep coming back.
Bay Stickman is going to keep going to the University of Berkeley, backing up Ashton Whitley and Troy Woden of Berkeley, University of Berkeley, or the Berkeley Patriot.
And other people do the same thing at other liberal universities throughout the country.
Let's start working with these kids.
Let's start having a presence on these campuses.
This is where the rallies need to be happening.
Let's take this shit from the streets and from the parks.
Let's take it to the universities.
Sold.
Let's do it, man.
Base, we got to go.
Is there anything else you want to get off your chest?
No, just, you know, I want to thank all the Proud Boys for having my back, you know, and thank my supporters for everything they've done for me.
You know, Proud Boys were supporters from very early on.
And, you know, if it weren't for all the love people showed me, I'd be sitting in a jail cell eating bologna sandwiches right now.
So, you know, just this is thanks to everybody and thanks to you, Gavin, for having my back.
You're one of my earliest supporters.
And you've had my back ever since.
And I thank you for it, brother.
You're a warrior, man.
We need more warriors.
Thanks for coming on the show, buddy.
You got it, Gavin.
Cheers.
All right, this is a very unusual guest for the show, and I'm not sure this will even make it to air because the Twitter feed that Alyssa Eten Aiten has is pornographic.
So don't go check it out.
It's a man with breasts showing his penis and being very sexual.
But the reason I have this guy on the show is he was in the army.
And he decided that he was a woman after he got back, after he left the army, 2016, and became this model, I guess.
He does erotic photography.
So, you know, my instincts are the same as yours.
I go, ew.
But let's give him the time of day.
He's a state's rightist.
He's a minimal government guy.
He's a libertarian.
We basically have the exact same politics.
I just totally disagree with him on the trans thing.
So this is, I find this an interesting person to talk to because it's someone that I'm right on track with, except something that I'm very, very positive about, which is there's no such thing as trans.
Let's try to get through this.
Hello, Alyssa.
Hi, hi.
Am I pronouncing that wrong?
No, no, you're totally good.
You're 100% on pronunciation.
Now, we come from very different worlds, so I'm going to seem a little flustered here.
I've obviously got a lot of questions.
You used to be a cis man in the Army.
You're still a cisgender.
That's correct.
Yeah, I mean, I guess, I suppose technically I'd always been transgender, but I presented as a cisman.
So yeah, I mean, it's all the same.
And then you came back when?
When did you come back from deployment?
I actually never deployed.
I was part of the 1st Infantry Division.
Just happened to be during a span in which my unit never deployed.
I did a three and a half year tour.
So you never, never deployed.
I was stationed in Kansas.
2016 was when I got out of the Army.
And then when you got out of the Army, you said, I'm going to be a woman?
Kind of.
I mean, it certainly wasn't as accepted by myself or anybody in my immediate circle.
But yeah, I mean, over a process, yes, I decided to live as myself.
Were you gay before that?
No, I mean sexuality is kind of a fluid thing, I suppose, as far as my personal history, but I'm married to a female now, as I was then.
And how does she feel about the transition?
She's always been incredibly supportive.
I'm really one of the lucky few people that was married before and has remained married.
She's incredibly supportive.
We actually work together.
She's a makeup artist.
So she does a lot of my makeup and hair for a lot of my shoots.
And you do pornography?
Yeah, I mean, I've done adult nude shoots as well as artistic and fashion stuff.
I just walked a runway the other week, actually.
Any sexual videos?
No, no explicit videos yet.
Okay, well, I mean, I'm sure that you're used to these questions, that they must come up every time someone meets you.
No, yeah, I mean, shit, I'm an open book at this point.
I just thought, you know, like, I'm in New York City and I see a lot of trans people and most of them look like you right now.
And I think, you're going to be a tomboy.
Why bother?
This is definitely like a holiday thing for me.
It's shit, was it 7 a.m. right now on the West Coast?
I just got up like 20 minutes ago.
Between this and two kids, I'm pretty casual outside of work just because I work often enough, thankfully, that it's kind of a hassle to get ready and everything all the time outside of work.
That's what I'm screaming.
I was just at this drag show with Milo Yiannopoulos and Pamela Geller, and I'm looking at all the drag queens there.
Not that you're a drag queen, but they all have flats on.
And I think, ladies, you're not committing to the bit.
So why bother, you know, making such a drastic move when you're not going to be like that chick from Peewee's Playhouse with the big beehive and the stilettos?
It's, you know, I may not be the best person to ask about that either because I actually do wear flats most of the time because I'm 6'3.
So, yeah, I try to draw as little attention to myself as possible when I'm not working.
So yeah, I wear flats most of the time as well.
Right.
So I just, there's a lot of cons with this.
There's a risk with it making, freaking out the kids.
There's a risk with it affecting your marriage.
There's a risk with you being ostracized in society.
I assume you're out of the army.
Yeah, no, I've been out for, gosh, more than a year now.
No, there's a ton of risks.
And I think that's honestly why it is.
The risks aren't in being transgender.
The risks are societal.
You mean the stigma?
Yeah, no, totally.
It's 100% part of the stigma.
You're on the front of Vanity Fair.
People are bending over backwards to be trans.
People are pretending their kids are trans just so they can be part of the thing that's going on.
It's hot.
Well, I mean, look at my Twitter feed.
You'll see a pretty consistent hashtag about not being a trend because that's exactly what it's being made out to be within the media.
And I mean, that's a fall on both sides of the line.
Both people that don't like the transgender community and people that do support it but not fully understand it, consider it very trendy and very popular.
But it's not what it should be.
It's not a lifestyle choice.
It's simply who you are.
But wait a minute.
You said that there's a societal stigma and a taboo and that's the only bad thing.
And then you also said everyone just thinks it's trendy and hot.
Isn't that a contradiction?
No, no.
I think people think it's trendy for both good and bad reasons, but I think you're going to get people – And you get people that are soft racists, people that try to think they're doing the right thing or think they're supporting another race community when in reality they're hindering them.
Okay, well, out of those two, the real deal racists are a tiny, tiny, irrelevant fraction, maybe a thousand people scattered across 320 million.
And then in the second one, the soft thing, that's like a microaggression.
So in the actual word, we learn that it's not an issue.
It's soft.
Who cares?
No, I think it's soft.
The soft creates a dangerous perception.
And you're right.
I mean, as far as the hardened, you know, hardline racist or transphobic or anything in this case, it's still a small minority, but it's the minority that when they start to legislate against people's rights and existence, that's when it becomes dangerous.
I'm all for people having the ability for free thought and speech, but when they take it to the point of legislation, that's when you've gone beyond your free thought and speech.
But why did you have to be a woman?
That's certainly not a choice of mine.
Can't you just say to your wife, I want to take some weird pictures of myself?
And she'd say, uh, okay, and snap them away and keep them under the bed?
We have those two, but no, I mean, it's definitely beyond a self-image thing.
I'm really casual now, whereas when I first started, I definitely wanted to be more, I guess, hyper-feminine is a word.
But it's, you know, my whole body is different.
My face is different.
My demeanor is different.
I'm a completely different person than I was before I started hormones.
I don't know, man.
I don't get it.
That's okay.
It's not necessarily like something that needs to be gotten.
Just, I mean, not necessarily even respected, but just accepted and allowed.
Well, here's, I know you're a libertarian, and I consider myself a libertarian.
And people always ask me, why do you care what someone does with their body or whatever?
And I clearly don't want what you do to be illegal.
I'm not Mao.
But here's the two reasons why I think it's dangerous to totally normalize it and pretend it's nothing.
One, they're giving kids hormone blockers to prevent them going through puberty so they won't be traumatized by their pubic hair or whatever.
And I think that is child abuse.
I think that will make them infertile.
There's a whole litany of reasons why that's dangerous.
And then secondly, the trans suicide rate, as Ben Shapiro points out, is worse than Jews in Germany in 1942.
I believe it's about 50%, as far as the suicide rate goes.
So I think that you say, look, cutting your penis off, not that you've done that, but cutting your penis off is a huge deal.
Let's make it a big deal.
So it's not just like a thing you do, woo.
And if it's a thing you do, woo, the next thing you know, I think a lot of these suicides are, they go, hey, my penis is gone.
And my bipolar is still here.
My suicidal depression is still here.
All my other problems are still here.
It wasn't the dink.
Oh, no.
You see, well, if you look at the majority of trans suicide rates, it's either prior to starting hormone replacement therapy or immediately after starting hormone replacement therapy.
We're talking about within the first six months of it.
And I think that's mostly due to a lot of people not getting the proper access to proper mental health.
I have gone through the right channels, went to the VA, saw a therapist, went through a psychiatrist, was properly diagnosed with being transgender before I could take the next step on the hormone therapy.
Where there's quite a few people within the trans community that have never gone through those paths because they're not accessible to them.
There's a lot of people that are within poverty.
They don't have access to proper medical care or, you know, just don't believe that they're going to be given a fair share.
I think it's just being gay.
I think you're gay.
I mean, how do you explain my being married to a female?
I mean, I suppose, as far as I can see, I'm far gayer now than I was before.
Marriage sex, I think my wife's repulsed by me.
She just lies back and thinks of England.
Harvard, your wife's English?
Yeah, well, it's a cliche.
It loses its punch if you change it to America.
So fair.
But when I see these trans people, like the numbers just keep going up and up and up.
And there's, what do they say, like 10,000 trans people in the military?
I go, no, there's 10,000 gays in the military.
And it gets to be homophobic where you go, no, no, you're not a lesbian.
You're a dude.
No, you're a lesbian.
Enjoy it.
That's the thing is that I've never considered my sexuality the same as my gender.
It's never been correlated.
I never had an issue with my sexuality as far as whether I wanted to date men or women.
Coming to terms with my gender is a totally different beast.
But I mean, even psychologically, they're two very separate things within the mental health community.
Okay, last question.
Speaking of mental health, do you think trans should be in the military?
Do you support Trump's trans ban?
No, I mean, 40 years now, transgender people have been serving both openly and then closed for, I think, a little bit more than a year.
Are you counting the guy from MASH?
Because that was a fictional show.
No, that's cross-dressers.
We've been a very close-knit community within the military.
There are open channels that you can access from.
This military guy here, that was a trans person, and you knew other trans people.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I mean, it's an open secret, if you will.
But they don't allow people with flat feet.
They don't allow people with depression.
They don't allow people with flat feet.
What?
Yeah, they've allowed that for a while now.
Okay, well.
You know what I'm saying?
They have very high restrictions.
You know, if someone gets a domestic, they're not going to be serving.
They boot them out for a whole number of reasons.
Having sex while you're deployed gets you AWOLD or whatever it's called.
Booted out.
Yeah, no, you can get chapter out of the military for a number of things, but most of those are mental health related.
You showed that you're unfit.
You don't have your mental faculties aren't in line.
Transgender people have served with honor for about 40 years now.
Who?
Look at Logan Ireland.
Logan Ireland was born a cis female, transitioned in the military through his own money, is married to another transgender service member, who's now a veteran, doesn't serve any longer, but Logan does.
Layla Ireland.
She was in the Army, Logan's in the Air Force.
Both of them have served honorably for more than a decade.
And how are they not just gays?
Have they removed their gender?
It's a lesbian?
What is it?
A chick?
Logan, I'm not sure how far she's gone with her sex reassignment surgery, but as far as I know, Layla, sorry.
It's confusing, right?
No, I don't know what her original name was, but that's moot.
No, I believe that she's had sex reassignment surgery, but either way, I mean, I don't think your genitals dictate your gender.
that's a sex organ.
I understand, but they, you know, it gets to the point where it's, the government is paying for sex changes and there's a lot.
They don't.
They cover simply hormone replacement therapy, which is incredibly cheap as far as medical procedures go.
And that's it.
Anybody who has these surgeries, if they can get them signed off by their command, are paid for out of pocket.
Well, how about this?
Instead of debating it, we just go, man, we're not doing that.
Are you going back into the military?
No, I don't have any plans.
I could be called up.
You're on automatically eight years of inactive reserves.
But aren't you trans-banned?
No, that's under investigation at the moment, but there's no...
As soon as a ban is enacted, the people that are openly transgender will be removed from the military.
They'll be discharged.
Honorably, but they'll be discharged against their will.
What a mess you guys have created.
You've made everything so complicated.
It wasn't a mess until somebody decided to act on their social conservatism as opposed to just reason and logic.
There's been no reason to kick these people out of the military.
Or there's no reason to enact a ban.
Nobody's joined the military in order to get free health care or anything like That you can get it from your state insurance.
You can get better care as far as gender reaffirming care from your state health care.
Every time I have conversations like this, I just end up exhausted.
I mean, everything you're saying sounds pretty reasonable, I guess.
But I don't know.
I just don't like the idea of the guy from MASH going out of the foxhole with a machine gun.
I mean, and it's certainly not like that.
That's kind of the sad perception is that we're still seen as cross-dressers.
We're still seen as this kind of taboo, offshoot, weird community that has mental issues.
And we're not.
The vast majority of us are capable and willing to serve and have to go through the same process as everyone else has served to prove that they have the ability, both physically and mentally.
Well, look, we're out of time.
We're not going to agree on this.
One thing I have noticed, though, is that I can never get liberals on my show, but I have no trouble getting trans people on my show.
From across the spectrum, from Zoe Tour as the liberal to Blair White and Theron Meyer, they always seem ready to debate.
It seems like a rare trait.
I don't get it.
I don't know.
Honestly, I'm not very active within the trans community directly, just because a lot of my political ideas are opposed to, or stand in contrast to what they believe.
So I don't know that many trans people outside of work.
Well, you know me, and if I become trans, I'll become one of your trans friends.
Definitely, definitely.
It's not hanging out in person though.
you'd be hard to look at.
I don't know.
Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.
Stay away, stay away, stay away.
Get off my lawn.
Get off my lawn.
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