GabCast Bellgab.com - 22 November, 2015

Nov. 22, 2015 - GabCast Bellgab.com

01:50:54

22 November, 2015

22 November, 2015 ---------- We mark the 52nd anniversary of JFK's assassination by talking about Richard C. Hoagland's demise, Leo Ashcraft's continued implosion, and gun control in Paris. Oh, and UFO suicide cultist Michael Horn calls the show. What a hoot.

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	This is the Gabcast, a podcast about BellGab.com.
	Call the show now at 623-242-CAST.
	That's 623-242-2278.
	Now, shut up, sit down, and listen to the damn show.
	Oh, my.
	Sorry, Paperboy.
	You may recall in the Gabcast thread on Bellgab.
	Paperboy said that that intro with the shut up, sit down, man, bling, blah, blah, blah, is getting a little bit old.
	And now that he said that, I'm all self-conscious about it.
	I'm going to have to get new liners.
	Thanks, Paperboy.
	I call him P-Boy, but the rest of you can call him Paperboy.
	This is the Gabcast.
	It's a podcast about BellGab.com.
	If you want to be on the show tonight, we have a phone number you can dial in order to do that.
	That phone number, 623-242-CAST.
	That is 623-242-2278.
	Anything you boys and girls want to talk about out there.
	And we already had somebody who tried to call in just before the show, but you see, that's not how it works.
	Usually you'll want to wait until the show is airing and then call the show.
	You know, in the 90s, like the early 90s, when I was about 13 or 14, I was such a creepy, douchey little kid.
	And I was so heavy into talk radio.
	Like, I would call these talk shows like 15 minutes before they even aired, just hoping to God that I get on the air.
	And now I know how those people at the studio felt.
	I understand what they're going through as a result of their audience and what the audience does to them.
	Isn't some people calling?
	I mean, it's a strange kind of subset of humanity, isn't it?
	Phoning callers.
	There are people.
	There is an argument to be made for that, that they are a different breed of human, a different subset, as you said.
	Because I've heard Howard Stern talking about it.
	He says, you know, don't confuse the callers with the audience.
	That's right.
	The people that call in are completely different to the actual.
	You know, you'll get sort of doctors and solicitors and things will listen to Stern, but you won't get them calling in usually.
	You know, it'll be freaks and weirdos usually pretty much.
	That's all you'll get calling in.
	And I think that's probably the case for most people.
	I mean, I think it's because they don't get anyone else to listen to them, do they?
	So they're desperate to.
	Maybe there is, you know, there may be some of that in their personal life.
	Here, let's start the show by insulting all of our callers and explaining to people the psychoanalysis behind why they call us.
	We love our callers, Jimmy.
	No, we don't.
	We were talking just before the show about how much we loathe them.
	By the way, that's Sredney Vashtar talking.
	Hey, buddy.
	Hello.
	Also, we have Hedgehog Norman.
	Hello, hello.
	Hey, buddy, I'm glad you're, you know what?
	You are the perfect example of what it is.
	Like, you have like 100 and something posts on Belgab.
	I didn't even know you were a Belgab user until you asked to host the show today.
	Isn't that awesome?
	That is exactly the type of person we want hosting the show.
	And Sci-Fi author.
	Hello, everybody.
	Listen to his dull tones, his mellifluous voice.
	Thank you.
	That's great.
	I would suspect that sci-fi author probably sounds just nothing like anybody expected.
	I told him before the show, I thought he would sound much nerdier than he does.
	Nerdier or Hick or something like that.
	Much nerdier, which implies there is a level of nerdishness, but it just would have been much higher if expectations had been met.
	And I'm MV.
	I'm just a big poof from Belgab.
	So we got a lot of crap to talk about, and I have to thank Sheffist for putting these show notes together for us.
	That's quite nice of him.
	And again, some of the stuff, I sit here looking at these things and I say to myself, Jesus Christ in a car seat.
	I own the forum and I am, what?
	This?
	I have no idea this is even happening.
	There are things on here that I can't even begin to tell you where you could read about on the forum.
	It's amazing.
	How Chefist finds time to know about all of this, put this list together for us, and still have a job.
	I do think he's gainfully employed.
	How he manages to do that, that's in itself quite impressive.
	Hi, you're on the air.
	Hello.
	We have a caller.
	Hi, you're on the air.
	Go ahead.
	I think we have a caller.
	Don't we have a caller?
	Well, maybe there is a possibility that I could be using the wrong sound card for our caller at the moment.
	Let me check that.
	Stay there, caller.
	Yes, I am.
	I am using the wrong sound card for you.
	I'm sorry.
	Okay, caller, you're on the air now.
	Hi.
	Yeah, this is Mr. Spock.
	Hi, Mr. Spock.
	Well, I'm going to give you a Falki update.
	Falky still sucks.
	Well, in what regard?
	That's such a general statement to make about him.
	Well, he's still on welfare, so he's taking cash for his money, so he still sucks.
	Are you calling from the Latrine in a submarine, sir?
	No, no, I'm not.
	Okay.
	He was very matter of fact about that.
	No, sir, I am not.
	This is not a submarine.
	It's the way it's up.
	You got kidnapping cool.
	You know, he said you were in your trunk underneath the bridge somewhere.
	Release your daughter.
	Yeah, if she gives you a million dollars or something, it's got that kind of sound to it or we may hear Aloha Akbar!
	Aloha Akbar!
	Well, I don't know if you guys go.
	Hello, it's Dazmuda out there in the chat room.
	So, good night.
	You too, buddy.
	Thanks for calling in.
	Thanks for that.
	Have a good one.
	He waited on hold for four days to say that.
	I just want to put that out there.
	Well, I mean, it does mirror his contributions.
	I mean, he just does that every time, doesn't he?
	I don't think he posts anywhere else except the focus ridges just to tell him how useless he is, which is fair comment, but it's a bit monotonous after a while.
	So, Hedgehog Norman, how'd you find Bellgab?
	What's the story there?
	I believe it was looking for old Art Bell episodes.
	So, you were engaging in piracy.
	Great.
	Continue.
	Looking the high seas, yes.
	And I forget which one it was, but I was looking for a specific one and found the forums on Google or Bing or whatever.
	And Bing signed up.
	If you found the forum through Bing, I'm sorry.
	We may have to look at downgrading your account.
	I'm not sure about that.
	Do you actually use Bing?
	Are you actually a Bing user?
	For the rewards part, yes.
	What is that comprised of?
	You do like a certain number of searches a day, and there's bonus offers, and you get the points, and then get free Xbox credit.
	Xbox credit that you can use to buy games and what have you?
	Games or movies or music or whatever.
	So what have you actually gotten out of that?
	I mean, like, at the end of it all, the net gain for you, what have you gotten?
	Oh, just free Xbox credit for games.
	Well, I mean, like, how many games?
	What would you say might be the dollar equivalent if you were to actually purchase what you got?
	You could also get different gift cards like Amazon or GameStop or something like that.
	But what would you say might be the monetary value of what they've actually given you?
	$25 so far.
	Over what period of time?
	Maybe a year, but I think it's a good idea.
	Oh my god.
	I haven't maxed it out every day like some people do.
	I quit my job.
	I told my family to bug off.
	And I've just been searching on Bing, bringing in those points.
	Yeah, I've seen this.
	I've seen references to this rewards program they have.
	And I don't know.
	It always looked rather fishy to me.
	I mean, yeah, I guess if you can get free stuff, great, but and not knocking you.
	I mean, if you can get free stuff, awesome.
	But to knock Bing, I mean, that is indicative of what a failure Bing is.
	You know it?
	That they have to give free stuff away.
	Just getting people to search, giving stuff away in order to boost their numbers.
	Google never had to do that.
	They just put a search engine together and people used it.
	That was that.
	Well, they do have lovely pictures.
	Give them that.
	They do, actually.
	Yeah, the homepage pictures are quite nice.
	I don't know what the rest of it's like, but I mean, you get nice pictures of Reykjavik and stuff like that on there.
	I think that's about the only thing I've ever used that page for.
	The problem is they slap all the pictures up with the stupid Bing logo down in the bottom corner.
	I mean, if they could just get rid of that, then it would be great photography.
	But, you know, when I'm looking at a beautiful sunset on a beach, I don't really want to see a Bing logo at the bottom of that.
	It just sort of sucks some of the mystique out of the photo, some of the enjoyability.
	I mean, pretty much everyone uses Google, don't they, for searches?
	I mean, there are all these other ones, but I'm pretty sure most people just use Google, don't they?
	Lycos, we're a Lycos family at the Vandevin house.
	They're still going on there.
	Yes, I've relegated the entire family to using Netscape Navigator.
	And if I find that anybody's using anything else, I lock them outside the back of the house for a few hours.
	You know, you have to look at the web history to determine how long to lock them out.
	You need to know to what extent they've violated the rules.
	And then you let them back in.
	When you see them shivering or maybe the chat lips are starting to set in, okay, come in.
	Just don't do it again.
	That's how you deal with that.
	That's good.
	So let's just go down.
	Let's just go down Chef's list here.
	We have the suicide thread.
	That's the first item on the list.
	And he asks, was it real?
	Yeah, it was real.
	I think it was real.
	I mean, real defined how.
	Was he really going to kill himself?
	I don't think so.
	I mean, I think most people, I mean, if he were really going to kill himself, and this applies to everybody, I think, people who are going to kill themselves, they've already made that determination, and they don't tell anybody because they don't want to give anybody the opportunity to talk them out of it.
	People just do it.
	Yeah.
	But people who are, they're having suicidal ideations, but they intellectually know that they don't want to die.
	Those are the people that will announce to others that they have intent to do so because they want to be talked out of it.
	They want to be snapped out of that state of mind.
	So from that perspective, yeah, I would say it was real, but do I think he was actually going to ultimately kill himself?
	No.
	But, I mean, and I don't begrudge anybody what the mean things they said to him in that thread.
	I mean, because someone who, and I like Nefarious Banana, and the, I think it was Friday night I called him up and we talked for about a half hour and I kind of gave him a verbal lashing because sometimes people need to be verbally slapped around a little bit and I think it was a very good productive conversation.
	I think he felt a lot better and cleared some cobwebs out of his head by the end of that phone call.
	I think that he also has to understand where he was when he said the things he has to understand the audience, you know?
	And so if you go on Belgab and Belgab, holy Christ, and you bellgab, and you're going to tell everybody that you're considering suicide, stand back and wait for the incoming because it will commence.
	And so, and I don't begrudge anybody that because the person, Austin should know the audience at this point.
	He should know what's going to happen when he goes on Belgab.
	I mean, he's only a young guy, wasn't he, from what he said he'd be like 20.
	Yeah, I mean, when you're that age, everything seems much more important than it is, doesn't it?
	And you take everything much too seriously.
	You do.
	So, I mean, it's just, you know, as you get older, you realize that things matter less than they did at the time.
	But it's just, yeah, I mean, you know, I mean, when he gets 10, 15, 20 years down the line, he's going to find a lot more things to worry about than this.
	And you just, I suppose that's probably the most encouraging thing to him to say.
	You think it's bad now, you wait.
	It was going to get a lot worse.
	But it's just, yeah, it's just when you're that age, perhaps if you don't know people to talk to, it just, it comes down.
	So maybe that's the reason he went to Belgab to say this stuff.
	I mean, it's obviously completely the wrong decision.
	And, you know, I got the impression he typed something out and then went away just to see what response he got.
	And then he got this, yeah, this just shower of crap on him, didn't he?
	I mean, is this a very American reaction to get angry with people who complain about suicide?
	Because I've noticed that a few times when sort of a certain sort of American, they do get very angry about people who think the cultural difference is that causes that revulsion over here at the notion of suicide that perhaps people don't have where you are.
	I think it's maybe just not talking about it so much.
	It's just I've heard from sort of, I don't know if we say sort of like blue-collar kind of American reaction that, you know, if somebody's committed suicide, I was like, oh, fuck that guy.
	You know, he's a loser.
	You know, he's just opted out.
	I don't want anything to do with that kind of thing.
	It's just that you can't let you can't let a certain sort of thought in because it might grow or something.
	It's just, you know, it's a very kind of defensive reaction.
	Over here, we probably would just, yeah, we would just try and pretend it didn't well, not didn't happen, but just not get angry about it and just deal with it as quietly as possible.
	That would be probably the difference, I think.
	It wouldn't be polite to talk about it.
	In a way, yeah, just to kind of, yeah, just to sort of avoid it as much as possible.
	We wouldn't go in for a lot of emoting, certainly.
	Not the Brits, usually.
	No.
	Yeah.
	Whereas here we're very emotional.
	I don't know why, but we just seem to throw everything out there in American society.
	That's funny what our culture is.
	Right.
	So everybody is always telling everybody else how they feel.
	And I, I mean, I don't, but I think everybody else does.
	I mean, kind of like finding out who's a vegan.
	You find out within two minutes of meeting them.
	That's right, exactly.
	Yeah.
	Because over here they'll say this all the rots.
	Because actually they'll say people tend to be a lot more emotional about things.
	And they'll blame this on Diana when Diana was killed.
	They'll say, oh, this is the Diana effect.
	People are crying in public.
	And, you know, it's not the stiff upper lip that it used to be.
	But I think we're basically still pretty reserved about things.
	It's just occasionally been perhaps with public things, people will, you know, if somebody very famous dies or something, you'll get some kind of public reaction.
	It's still family things.
	And I'm sure with like suicide and things like that, it is a very quiet thing and and people will yeah tend not to to get into stuff like that.
	Because I mean you think over here you know that in the sort of a couple of generations people were having bombs dropped on them and things and um you know they couldn't lose lose their minds and and cry and everything.
	So I think that's a lot where a lot of the sort of stiff upper lip mentality came from.
	You know, you can't, you couldn't lose your mind in the blitz.
	You had to keep control of things.
	So I think people, at least my parents and people, grew up in that kind of environment.
	So they would have a very different sort of attitude to stress and things that perhaps people do now.
	Just brought up to be more reserved.
	Yeah, just not let things get to you, really.
	Just keep on, just sort of march on.
	Just don't dwell on it too much.
	I think that's the, because there's, I can't remember what it comes, son, there's a sort of a sort of slogan you find over here on mugs and things and teachers just.
	Keep calm thing.
	Yeah, keep calm and carry on.
	Yeah, that's very generic.
	Somehow that got co-opted by the American... Meme generators.
	Yeah.
	Yes.
	Jeffist has on the list here underneath the suicide thread heading, he says, Belgab not the best therapeutic option as one of the bullet points.
	I don't know about that.
	I don't know if that might or might not be true.
	I mean, at the end of it all, I mean, he hasn't killed himself and he seems to have had some realizations.
	So maybe that is a better therapy.
	A bunch of people telling you that you're a cunt could possibly be a better therapeutic option than going to a therapist who sits there and tells you that nothing's your fault and that you're a wonderful person.
	It is that the we would just ask that in the course of receiving this therapy that you disable your ad blocker, please.
	How is this institute supposed to make a revenue of any sort?
	It was interesting the way it started though, wasn't it?
	Because it started with people not believing what was going on.
	And then such two or three pages, people started to think, well, perhaps there is something in it.
	And then there was just this divide.
	There's a few people who don't care, even if it is, you know, you're a loser, you're lame.
	Fuck you.
	And then everyone else was kind of getting behind him a bit more.
	Yeah, at a certain point to me, it's like, okay, we get it.
	You don't like him.
	You know, like watching the Eddie Coyle thing go back and forth.
	At a certain point, it's like, you know what?
	We got it.
	It reminded me.
	The thread reminded me of that scene from the movie Airplane where everybody was just lining up in front of the screaming woman, punching her and hitting her with wrenches and everything.
	That's what it reminded me of.
	But it was almost as if, I think someone commented that as if there was some kind of bad energy had been released and people were just, or at least two in particular, were getting caught up in it.
	And it was just this back and forth, back and forth, back and forth of swapping insults at each other.
	And, you know, as if it was, you know, the guy that started it had got off from whatever.
	And there was just this kind of unpleasant atmosphere that was sort of hanging around.
	And people were getting caught up in it.
	It was a very weird.
	I don't know how it lasted, how long it lasted.
	That thread really was what two or three days or maybe less than that.
	And, you know, it just seemed like it could go on forever.
	But I hadn't sort of spotted, you know, I hadn't looked at it for a while.
	I hadn't been on for about a day.
	And I just happened to just go back and read the thread.
	Yeah, and then, you know, it's these two back and forth, back and forth.
	And occasionally somebody else would post with a slightly bemused reaction about what was going on.
	I mean, it was weird.
	Attacks in Paris.
	Let's move on.
	I guess the first question we should ask is, should the Syrian refugees be allowed onto Belgab?
	I say no.
	What do the rest of you have to say about that?
	Absolutely not.
	Well, they have to prove they're Christians first.
	I mean, this is a strictly Christian website, isn't it?
	No, not even then.
	Have to eat some bacon first.
	Yeah, I think they should all be required to take a bite of bacon and show one of their boobs.
	That's it.
	Just show us one of your boobs and eat a piece of bacon, and then we'll accept that you can respect our system of jurisprudence.
	Art's comments on Paris attacks.
	He says sheet of glass references.
	I did not hear that.
	What were these, you know, the whole it's I would go over there.
	I would bomb the shit out of them.
	I would turn that place into a sheet of glass.
	It would be a parking lot, okay?
	That's the extent of some people's approach to foreign policy.
	Were those references being bandied about on Art's show with a straight face by anybody?
	I think Art was doing it.
	I think he was actually wanting to nuke Syria.
	Really?
	Come on.
	Well, I thought it was, you know, it's an emotional, immediate reaction to the Paris attack, you know, but it's obviously not how you solve it.
	I mean, he's a terrific broker, isn't he?
	But when it comes to certainly some aspects of policy, you think he's very unsophisticated in the things he says.
	And it's just, I mean, literally, again, it's just shoot everyone.
	Just keep on just bomb everyone.
	And it's, you know, fair enough.
	I mean, it's supposed to be.
	A lot of people would agree with him, but it's not going to get you very far, is it?
	I don't think Art really knows what he believes, because if you listen to the Art Bell of the 90s, he was...
	And this was a guy who, by that point, was already in his late 40s, right?
	So and he was extremely right-wing in a lot of ways, very anti-Clinton.
	And then just fast forward a few years and he's voting for Obama, I think twice.
	And then going back, he moves back in the other direction a few years later and he's using sheet of glass references on his show.
	I think that politically, Art really vacillates back and forth a lot.
	I don't really know that he necessarily has any core beliefs politically.
	I mean, wouldn't he identify himself as a libertarian, whether he means he votes for a libertarian candidate or not.
	I've heard him call himself that before, yeah.
	I think that's probably more to do with taxation and things, isn't it?
	I mean, obviously not everyone else, he doesn't want to pay any more tax than he has to, and libertarians tend not to be all that fond of a big government and everything.
	So I think that's the thing that appeals to him there.
	But I mean, when it comes to geopolitics and things, it's just he says, Sheffis says two UK bell gabbers, Yorkshire Pud and Sredny Vashtar, claim the best policy with terrorists is to play dead or run, not to use a gun to fight back.
	What did you say, Sredney, that has prompted him to put this in our show notes for tonight?
	Yeah, he was getting mad, actually, a few days ago.
	Well, because he's a big, he's a big gun guy, isn't he?
	Don't take my gun.
	So he was typing these notes in anger, largely.
	I mean, I think a lot of it is all sort of forum stuff, you know, people exaggerating things.
	But, you know, Yorkshire Pud is somebody who isn't in favor of gun.
	I mean, he's totally sort of anti-gun.
	I'm one of those people who thinks, well, I know, I don't live there.
	I don't know.
	I mean, maybe there are situations if you're in a, you know, some places in more remote.
	I mean, over here, you guys are over in the UK, though.
	You can't have them.
	No, we can't.
	You know, we don't have guns and we haven't had, you know, we don't know what it's like.
	So, you know, I'm a bit more reasonable about these.
	I think there are situations when people probably do need guns.
	Oh, my.
	You should just be.
	You really should be deported from your country.
	I can't believe you're able to maintain British citizenship after saying that.
	We have the British to thank for our right to have guns.
	If you go back to why it's in the Constitution.
	It really is.
	I mean, at its foundation is the premise that the government could eventually become oppressive and tyrannical and that the population.
	The British were.
	Yes.
	And that the population may need to protect themselves.
	I forget which amendment that is always talking about.
	The Second Amendment.
	I thought it was the 33rd.
	You know what?
	What do I know?
	I would say that I do find it interesting that whenever we have mass shootings over here, we see Barack Obama on TV talking about the need for more gun control and the failure of our lax, with quotation marks, gun control policies.
	But then when a theater gets shot up in a nation, in a city that has some of the strictest gun control laws in the world, suddenly there's no talk about problems with gun control.
	I mean, what is it?
	Which way is it?
	I mean, I would say, I would submit to you that situations like the Paris shooting are indicative of the inherent failure of gun control laws.
	People who are going to follow gun control laws are law-abiding people to begin with.
	They're not the people who are going to.
	If you're going in to shoot up a school, you're not going to say to yourself as you're walking in the door to march into the kindergarten class, you're not going to say to yourself, oh, you know what?
	This clip holds too many rounds.
	That's not legal in this state.
	You know, I'll be back.
	I have to go back.
	This is not a legal clip I'm walking into the school with.
	Because you're inherently not a law follower anyway.
	You're there to kill people.
	So who gives a shit what laws are in place?
	Well, even if we have laws like France's really draconian gun laws, even when you have those in place, it obviously didn't stop these terrorists from getting fully automatic weapons.
	No, I would venture a guess they were probably from the Russian former Soviet bloc countries.
	The weapons, that is.
	Yeah, I think they were.
	I think they were all like the Kalashnikovs or AK-47.
	But the thing is, is that if you asked me to go get a fully automatic weapon here in the United States, there's no way I could do it.
	I have no idea where you would go and get such a thing other than going through like a class three government thing to get a hold of it.
	But they were able to get them easily in Europe and move them around.
	And apparently, I mean, what good are gun laws if they're not effective?
	And beyond that, when you're a part of the part of the EU and a part of the Schengen zone that allows free travel between EU states, that just exponentially increases the ease with which you can move guns from border to border.
	So what good are the gun laws?
	I just don't understand it.
	And I'm sorry if it makes me sound like a monkey idiot to say, yeah, I do think that if some of the civilians in that theater that night had been armed, that thing probably would have been quelled a lot more rapidly than it was.
	Sorry, you don't like that opinion?
	Eat my ass.
	Thank you.
	Well, it's the question, isn't it, whether it's just going to, you know, they're all going to be shooting at each other because there's, say, the lights, maybe the light's very dim.
	They don't know who they're firing at.
	They're not trained.
	It's different, I mean, if you're talking about people who actually have some kind of training, are used to firing guns in a...
	But the alternative is just nobody has guns?
	That's the only alternative.
	It's one or the other.
	Even if there is friendly fire, there's still going to be less people dead and dead.
	I mean, you walk up behind one of those guys, boom, right in the back of the head.
	He didn't see it coming.
	Problems.
	Neutralized.
	If you have a firefight going on with terrorists, that means they're not shooting at the people that are trying to run out of the theater.
	So even if it is a complete mess with people pulling guns everywhere, the terrorists are occupied with the people that are shooting at them instead of the innocent people that are trying to get out.
	So I think that it looked to me like this Paris bombing shooting was as worse as it could as bad as it gets.
	It couldn't have been any worse.
	Would they have had the opportunity to, in an organized fashion, tell people, you, come here.
	They walk up, boom, dead.
	Now you, come here, walk up to me.
	Boom.
	There would not have been the opportunity to, in that sort of an organized, systematic fashion, just engage in wholesale murder.
	Right.
	Chaos is good in this situation.
	Yes.
	Right.
	I think everybody should be required from the age of two to carry a gun.
	Hey, noropathy, how are you?
	Very good.
	How's it going, buddy?
	Go back to the 1800s.
	Everybody had a gun.
	Were there terrorists back then?
	I don't think so.
	Or those damn Amish.
	What?
	I don't quite understand your point.
	Well, the point is, if everybody had a gun, there wouldn't be anything like you just heard about or saw evidence of in Paris.
	I mean, to me, it's just such a logical thing to say.
	It's so easy to wrap my brain around to say that if, you know, if I were in that theater and I ran into a side room and locked the door huddled with a bunch of people in there with me, and I know that I have a gun, I at least know that if the wrong guy opens that door, I have a chance.
	I have a chance.
	It's not a guarantee, but I have a chance.
	I'm not going to be slaughtered like a goddamn sheep.
	Why do we want people to do that?
	And the very people implementing these laws on people all have massive security details.
	You know what's hilarious is I used to work at a radio station in southern Illinois.
	And one day I interviewed the Illinois Secretary of State, a guy named Jesse White, just a typical Chicago shitbag of a politician.
	So he comes down to southern Illinois, which may as well, relative to northern Illinois, southern Illinois may as well just be Siberia.
	It really is just amazing how all of the resources of that state fail to make their way south of I-70 for some reason.
	I don't know why that is, but that's neither here nor there.
	Jesse White shows up, the Secretary of State of the state of Illinois, and this is one of the most anti-gun states in the country.
	As a matter of fact, I had a, at the time I was living there, I had a 20-gauge shotgun single shot.
	You bust it open, and the shell pops out, and you have to put another one in, close the chamber again, pull the hammer back, and pull the...
	It's like the most inefficient.
	This may as...
	I may as well have owned a musket rifle from the Revolutionary War.
	That's what an inefficient weapon this thing is.
	And I had to go to the police department, the local police department, and pick up some papers and fill out some forms and register this gun in order not to be a convicted felon in the state of Illinois for having this gun in the privacy of my own home.
	So this is one of the most anti-gun states in the Union.
	This Jesse White dirtbag comes to the radio station to sit down with me for an interview.
	And as he gets there, he has these two, he gets out of this armored SUV with tinted glass, and he has two Asian security guys with, I say Asian, I mentioned their race just because it really did look like something out of a movie.
	I mean, why are they both Asian?
	What are the odds that two guys who secured security jobs with the state of Illinois to protect Jesse White just happen to both be Asian?
	They could be brothers.
	I mean, is that, do they pair up the employees?
	Okay, these are brothers.
	We'll have them both work together protecting Mr. White.
	I can't believe that's how that works.
	But anyway, these two Asian guys get out, and I swear to God, I am not bullshitting you.
	They both had what appeared to me to be Uzis in their hands, holding them close to their chests as they got out of this SUV with Jesse White, both of them looking back and forth, back and forth.
	And I'll guarantee you that this Jesse White bag of shit will be one of the first people in line to tell everyone why we shouldn't be allowed to have guns.
	Guaranteed.
	I've actually never tried to ever kill anyone in my life.
	Well, we were worried.
	We wanted clarification in that regard from you.
	All those people that think you automatically, if you have a gun, you're pointing it at somebody is just crazy.
	I think the overwhelming majority of people who own guns are people who are not a problem, particularly if they are taking the time to register those weapons.
	If they are concealed carry permit holders, as I am, and they've taken the time to go to the courses and they've been fingerprinted and they've had their background researched by the FBI.
	I had to go through an extensive background check in order to get that.
	I am not a threat.
	Hi, you're on the air.
	Hello.
	Hi, you're on the air.
	Hello, caller.
	Go ahead.
	It's you, yes.
	Yeah, it's you.
	Hi, how are you?
	How are you?
	I think this woman was transported into the future from the year 1739.
	She has no idea how to use a phone, whoever that is.
	Anyway, if you want to be on the show, the number to call 623-242 CAST is 623-242-2278 if you want to be on the show.
	Let's try another call.
	Hi, you're on the.
	Go ahead.
	Go ahead.
	For your CCW, did you have to take a class before the safety and stuff?
	Yeah, the class was taught by a retired FBI agent and a sheriff's deputy.
	Okay, that's the way they do it here.
	Some states, though, they don't make you take a class.
	Well, that's wrong.
	They should.
	Michigan may be that way.
	They absolutely should require you to take a class because, I mean, a gun is not something you just hand to somebody.
	People sometimes fail to understand the magnitude of the responsibility that comes along with toting a gun around.
	I mean, that's not something to take lightly.
	There's a lot of responsibility that goes along with that.
	So I think everyone should be required to take a class.
	I mean, I'm not any sort of an extremist when it comes to the abolition of gun laws.
	I do believe in gun laws, as I think most gun owners do.
	They just don't like this slow, steady encroachment that ultimately leads to confiscation.
	That is what ultimately gun control people want, whether they would admit that or not.
	And it's a slow, incremental approach.
	Hi, Star Mountain.
	Hi.
	Sorry about that.
	Was that you who failed to use the phone properly a moment ago?
	Yes.
	Oh, my.
	That's very disappointing to learn that was you.
	Well.
	You really do feel shamed at the moment.
	I can tell that you're actually, you really do hate yourself slightly as a result.
	No, just a bit annoyed.
	Oh, my.
	I post on what annoys you threads, and I go, sometimes me.
	And every time I annoy myself, I go, me again.
	I can't believe anyone's ever been annoyed by you for any reason whatsoever, but I digress.
	Okay.
	All I wanted to mention was when we were talking earlier about ISIS, what is the one thing they fear the most?
	ISIS?
	Yes.
	What do they fear the most?
	They're women appearing in porno.
	Close.
	Oh, my.
	Bacon.
	Yeah.
	Bacon porn.
	They're being banged by kill bosses.
	In war, when they're shot by men, they go to heaven to have the virgins.
	If they're shot by a woman, they go straight to hell.
	Really?
	Yes.
	I was not aware of this rule.
	Okay.
	And Curtis, there are armies of just women in the Kurdish armies.
	What if we just send all the women troops, the fighter, the fighter jets, the whole nine yards, Army, Navy, Marines, all women.
	You watch those puppies run scared or just give up whatever they do.
	They don't want to be killed by women because he'll go straight to hell.
	Hades, I call it.
	Well, I have never heard that.
	I call it Hades.
	I've never heard that.
	I've never heard that, but it does make some level of sense.
	I got no problem with women in combat, but I think as long as it's like an entirely female regiment, they shouldn't cohabitate the men and women.
	If you see a bunch of soldiers coming at you over the hill and they get close enough and you see one of them is a woman, they should all be women.
	That's how I feel.
	Yeah.
	Anyway, God, Laura Kinch in the chess room.
	What you'd ask.
	Chess room?
	That sounds kind of fun.
	Welcome to my chess room.
	About what a fluffer is.
	Oh, my God.
	I've never so humiliated in my life.
	There was some talk on Belgab about.
	And by the way, Star Mountain, your Skype connection really sucks ass.
	I just want to put that out there.
	Oh, well, crap.
	Okay, well, I'll hop off here.
	I thought a fluffer was like a little kind of a blanket you use for a nap.
	Or maybe at the fluffing pole, one fold, one's a folder, one's a fluffer.
	Who knew?
	Well, it's funny.
	You've lived all these years, and you finally learned what a fluffer is as a result of your interactions on Belgab.
	At least the forms have some value for you.
	But I'm not into porn.
	I never knew that.
	Why wouldn't you be?
	Okay, thank you, Star Mountain.
	Now that I'm getting old, maybe I'll think about it.
	Well, you know, we all need something to spice things up a little bit after the years go by.
	You know what I mean?
	This is true.
	This is true.
	Okay, I'm going to jump off of my crappy Skype.
	It's awful.
	It's awful.
	I'm very displeased by it.
	But thank you.
	I'm glad you called.
	Bye, Sugar.
	Okay.
	Bye-bye.
	Okay, that was Star Mountain.
	Let's take another call.
	And hi, you're on the air.
	Hello.
	This is White Crow.
	I don't know if it really is or not.
	This is the real one.
	I think it might be.
	I don't know.
	I just don't know.
	I just don't know anymore.
	I don't know anymore either.
	I can't figure it out.
	How's it going, buddy?
	Concealed carry.
	I have a permit.
	It's a freaking hassle to carry a gun around.
	It takes a lot of discipline.
	And I just dropped it.
	What do you mean it's a hassle?
	Well, I can't find my wallet in the morning or my glasses would take carry that tug.
	You don't want anybody finding it.
	You don't got to make sure it's safe all the time.
	And it's a real burden trying to carry a gun around.
	It depends on the gun, I think.
	Well, I have a nice little revolver, super lightweight.
	It could fit in its pocket revolver.
	I think we need to start a database of all of the armed bellgabbers and track them.
	There you go.
	Starting with white carry.
	We'll start reverse alphabetically.
	What's your experience?
	You said you made it to have a concealed carry.
	Don't you find it difficult to drag one of those things around?
	Not at all.
	Really?
	Yeah, why would it be?
	I still don't understand your point in that regard.
	You sound like you're trying to carry around a desert eagle or something.
	Yeah, it sounds like you're carrying a 50-cal mounted on the back of a pickup truck.
	I just can't get it in my pocket.
	It's like having another possession.
	You got your cell phone, you have your wallet, you have your checkbook or whatever, and you have a gun.
	It's just another thing you have to deal with, another hassle.
	And then what do you do?
	You go into a bank or something.
	There's a sign there that says no guns allowed.
	Okay, march back to the car, put it in.
	Yeah, but you know what?
	You know what?
	In the state of Missouri, if you walk into a public establishment that has that sign and you are found to have a gun, all they can do is ask you to leave.
	And then if you come back with it again, then you could be convicted of trespassing, but you are not convicted of a gun charge.
	Wow, they actually are smart about it.
	Yeah.
	Then when you cross state lines, what do you mean by the laws?
	You don't cross state lines with your gun.
	You may as well be entering another country.
	You literally, I mean, the law is sort of like I can remember when I was driving a truck and you would the rear wheels on a trailer, a 53-foot trailer that you're pulling around on a semi-those rear wheels slide forward and they slide backward.
	And in doing so, you're adjusting the amount of weight that's being applied to those tires.
	And so you have to slide them back and forth in order to get the weight just right so that it's not overweight.
	But at the same time, if you slide it too far back, then you're violating the law in some states.
	And then in other states, you're not violating the law, depending on how far.
	That's just one example of how, like, when you're driving a truck, just crossing a state line, every role changes.
	Every rule changes.
	You may as well be entering another country.
	It's exactly the same phenomenon with gun laws.
	You just that's why I don't even recommend traveling across state lines with a gun.
	It's just too risky.
	Even states that have reciprocity, like if you have a gun concealed carry permit in one state and then another state supposedly honors concealed carry permits from your state, which would, in effect, allow you free travel through the, I don't trust that.
	I just don't trust that.
	I always take a gun when I'm traveling.
	I think that there should be a federal.
	Once in my life, it was when I felt endangered, it was when I was traveling.
	One time a holup in a gas station, walked right into it.
	Another time a guy approached me at a gas station late at night, and he wanted to jump in my vehicle.
	Luckily, we had some other people in there, and he came right back out again.
	So, whatever.
	I think there should be a federal concealed carry that applies across the union so we don't have all of this confusion and ambiguity.
	There's a good way for Obama to know who has guns and who doesn't.
	Well, they already do because it's a federal requirement as the states employ conceal or put into effect concealed carry laws that everybody be given an FBI background check.
	So they know I have a gun.
	Right.
	Well, I got the coolest gun, I think.
	I have a registered legal Tommy gun.
	That thing is a blast to shoot.
	Well, I can't take that anywhere.
	White Crow, we have gunregistry.bellgab.com.
	If you can just go there and register yourself as an armed bellgabber, we would appreciate that.
	We're just trying to keep track of what's going on.
	We want everybody to be safe, buddy.
	Very good.
	Okay, thank you.
	Good night, boys.
	Have a good night.
	Bye.
	That's White Crow.
	I think we need to keep track of White Crush.
	Also, surveys, not just the gun.
	I'm not quite sure about him.
	I thought that was assumed, but you are right to articulate that specifically, yes.
	So the attacks in Paris, that's a shame.
	You know what I find ironic?
	Watching the French, they are dealing with an Islamic fundamentalist problem inside their own country.
	So their response to that is to go bomb another country 2,000 miles away.
	I cannot even begin to understand that.
	And these people that were involved in this attack in Paris, to my understanding, most or all of them had never even been to Syria.
	The ringleader that was the Belgian guy had been traveling back and forth.
	Well, it's the same way, you know, after 9-11, it was going to going after Saddam Hussein, wasn't it?
	When he didn't really have any, yeah, they're desperately trying to find some connection to it.
	You know, the politician needs some reason to, you know, to have a response to something.
	and he's taking the chance to do something that's going to make him look tough, you know, and it's, unfortunately, it's doing something that's not going to do, I mean, it's, you know, It's not doing anything.
	He's just killing little Syrian babies.
	That's all he's doing.
	Yeah, and he's sowing the seeds for another attacks in 10, 20 years, isn't he?
	When they, you know, if the parents get killed, the kids are going to grow up without parents.
	It's just going to start it all over again.
	But they have to have some to give the press.
	And that's all it is.
	It's, you know, we're going to do all this bombing over here.
	We're going to go over there, I think, early next year and do all this.
	You know, they're talking about that now.
	It's just something that they can do.
	It costs a bloody fortune as well.
	They don't think about all the money it's going to cost.
	And it's going to do nothing.
	It won't have any effect.
	No.
	It's just, yeah, it's just going to go on and on and on.
	You know, it's just, if there is, and I suppose there really is a solution to it, but it's certainly not, you know.
	If there's one thing, it's not going to.
	The only winner is the arms industry with regard to France's reaction to this.
	That's the winner.
	Go watch the video.
	I bet you bet gun sales were through the roof today after the Paris attack in the U.S. Who knows?
	I bet tons of people went out and bought a gun.
	I'll bet you that could be.
	Well, that could be possible.
	I just don't know.
	But, you know, you can go watch the videos of the current bombing campaign that's happening in Syria, and you can see the little babies being pulled out of rubble.
	Some of them are dead.
	It just really, if you have your own kids, you really are able to relate to what those parents are experiencing.
	And the futility of it all.
	There's no gain.
	If there were a very specific gain in going to Syria and carpet bombing the place, if there were a very specific gain in doing so, I would say, hey, you know what?
	Collateral damage.
	Sorry.
	But there's no, I can't see what the gain is here.
	And I can't see what the end game would be.
	I can't see where that would be in sight.
	There can't be an end to this.
	What would be the point at which they say, yeah, we've done enough bombing and the problem is mitigated now?
	The threat's gone.
	I can't see what that point would be.
	The way to do it, really, is what the U.S. did killing their executor.
	Where we tracked him for a couple days and made sure it was him getting in the car and then just droned his ass.
	Killing Jihadi John.
	Jihadi John, yeah.
	But in this case, who would that guy be in this case with the Paris attacks?
	Whoever the Belgian guy was contacting in Syria.
	I think France has an Islamic fundamentalism problem.
	That's what they want.
	That's the problem with having an open society.
	You get people in there you don't want.
	And you get a bunch of people who come in who, my wife is a great example of this.
	Like, when you bring in people who come from an entirely different culture, they don't understand or respect your system of jurisprudence.
	And ultimately, that is a threat to the freedom of the indigenous population.
	And a good example of that, like, if you ask my wife, who is originally from Morocco, she thinks that cops ought to be able to just pull people over for any reason.
	She thinks that the cops ought to be able to just come into your house because they think there's something in there.
	I mean, this is our perceptions of what the police should or shouldn't be allowed to do, our system of jurisprudence.
	This is a very Western idea, and we seem to think and assume that everybody thinks the way we do, and they don't.
	And I think that ultimately, allowing a massive flood of people into your country who don't understand your legal system or why your legal system is the way it is.
	They don't respect the fact that it is the way it is.
	They don't necessarily respect the First Amendment or the Second Amendment.
	It's a problem, I think.
	I mean, there are people that still believe that theocracies should exist in the Middle East where you're led by a religious leader.
	And they'll vehemently present that as a valid form of government, even though in the West we have no idea why anybody would want that.
	One day I went to the mosque with my wife and I met this kid.
	He was 17 at the time.
	And his dad is a wealthy physician around here.
	And this kid was born in the United States.
	He's lived here his entire life.
	He is outwardly entirely Americanized.
	And as I'm talking to him, he's trying to explain to me why it is that Sharia law should be implemented and why it is a superior system of governance.
	That was so eye-opening to me.
	It's like, here's this kid.
	He looks totally Americanized, but he believes in stonings.
	He believes in religious courts.
	He believes in abolishing the Bill of Rights and replacing it with Quranic impositions.
	And it just is very frustrating to me.
	I don't know what the solution is, but I feel like there needs to be some mechanism in place for determining who is an Islamic fundamentalist and dealing with them accordingly.
	That's how I feel.
	And I don't know what that mechanism could be without violating the Constitution in the course of doing so.
	I don't propose that I have all the answers.
	Well, that's the trade-off, isn't it?
	It's like waterboarding and things, isn't it?
	Whether you think it works or not, you're giving away what made you, what got you to that position in democracy in the first place.
	You've got to uphold certain values.
	And unfortunately, those values are going to put you behind when you're dealing with people who don't have any respect for those things.
	They're quite prepared to die for their beliefs.
	And they take them with you.
	So it's a very difficult.
	I mean, I have no idea how to.
	There really is no real solution.
	Anyone offers a solution.
	It's not being serious.
	I think this discussion can be summarized by conceding that my wife should be deported.
	Hi, you're on the air.
	Hello.
	Who's this?
	Hello, this is Lou.
	Can you hear me?
	Hi, Lou.
	How's it going, man?
	Hello?
	Hi.
	I'm hanging in there.
	That's good.
	You sound good.
	There are two points I want to make for you guys.
	On Monday, Americans sent in some bombers and destroyed 116 ISIS ships that normally, excuse me, trucks that normally transport oil.
	So sometimes it can be pretty effective.
	Yeah, well, where were those bombed?
	Why weren't we bomb if we knew?
	That's another question.
	I have the French get blown up in Paris and suddenly they say okay, we're gonna go after all of these Isis targets.
	That what we've known about all this time.
	And nobody was doing anything about those trucks included according to the NEW YORK Times, including according to the NEW YORK Times, that was planned before France.
	So but we've been at this for well over a year now and I just can't.
	And we didn't do it before.
	Yeah yeah, I don't blame I.
	I can't argue with that.
	I'm not running the, i'm not running the show.
	But my point is, sometimes bombing can be having a lot of real life.
	I won't dispute that.
	But I don't think I don't think it's necessarily to our advantage to indiscriminately bomb mud huts in the middle of the desert because oh, I don't know they're I.
	I just don't see the ad, I don't see how that ultimately it makes them angrier.
	If I had my family killed and it just by instantly living in a mud hut, i'd turn into a terrorist too.
	And you know which reminds me, I don't know that we need these super fancy, super expensive jets to be doing these chores when we could use World War ii airplanes probably more effectively, just to more carefully target some of our our activities.
	But that's uh another that would be hilarious if we start using like, Red Baron airplanes to conduct these missions.
	Just people throwing bombs over the side with their hands be a lot less expensive, you know, and you're less likely to be bombing little hospitals here and there everywhere.
	But uh, I don't think easier to shoot down though with an ak.
	Oh, i'm sure you mean if you're talking about a Red Baron airplane.
	Uh, I don't know about regular, I don't know about World War Ii airplanes, but uh, you know you're more like it's more likely to get those armored, that I think you're pretty safe from aka in between War Era jets.
	You know we spend uh a million dollars per missile, so why can't we just spend all of that money better regulating our borders and who we allow into the country?
	I think that would go far better toward protecting people from getting blowed up.
	I think you hit the nail on the head though, earlier when you say it's the arms industry it's, it's a political decision.
	Do we spend money now to be promote humane causes like education, making sure everyone has enough food?
	Not enough people gain from that and you don't get political contributions but you do from the armaments industry.
	I mean, they love it when we buy these big missiles.
	They make a lot of money and so do the retired generals who now work for them and consult for them unfortunately, I mean, I think again.
	I think you hit the nail on the head.
	This is getting pretty political.
	This discussion.
	Is that your intention?
	Well, we're just talking about whatever we feel like talking about.
	We don't.
	Who gives a shit?
	Oh, you know.
	The other chat is what about the chat?
	I just took a glance in there.
	They're debating guns now, completely like there's a.
	There's a 23 minute delay in the stream.
	Versus what real time.
	It's great.
	Okay lou, thank you, go ahead.
	Well, the other side of the coin with with people being armed is when they go out to bars they get drunk, they're more likely to start pulling that trigger.
	I mean, it's good if if you happen to have a gun when a terrorist strikes, but the likelihood Of that is pretty small.
	Whereas if you're at a bar and there are a lot of drunk people and you get into a fight, guns get drawn, or you get angry with your boss, or you get angry with your wife.
	It's as you say, it's more likely might have been better if people had guns when they were at the bar, when a terrorist hit, but the other 355 days of the year when things get a little more problematic.
	When I get angry.
	Hold on.
	When I get angry with my wife, I just sort of like shoot to the side of her body just to let her know, hey, this could get serious.
	Things are real here.
	By the way, in the state of Missouri, it is illegal to take a gun into any establishment that, as its primary form of business, sells alcohol.
	You're not allowed to do it.
	Yes, I bought a gun in Pennsylvania.
	I didn't have glasses.
	I mean, my background check was super fast, and I bought in a Bass Pro shop.
	There's no difference between buying a gun and having a concealed carry permit, though.
	Yes.
	That's what I'm talking about.
	Even with my concealed carry, I cannot go into a bar with my gun.
	That would be a gun.
	That would be a felony.
	Anyway, okay.
	What else did you want to say about Hoagland?
	Let's move it along.
	Let's go.
	Yeah, well, I actually enjoy some of Hoagland's shows, particularly the ones with the science guests.
	But Boundgab just really seems, or at least some parts of Bell Gab really seem to be whacking on the guy.
	They call in and play strange music and do strange voices.
	It's 12-year teams.
	Hold on, hold on.
	Hold on.
	Somebody just unmuted their microphone, and it sounds like you're next to a box fan inside a wind tunnel.
	Okay, that was sci-fi author.
	Is that better?
	I don't know.
	So my open question is: why are people doing this?
	Why are the bell gabbers calling in and you could almost say harassing the guy, let's be honest?
	So why don't you guys answer that?
	I'll hang up or the chat room can answer that.
	Is that a rhetorical question?
	I mean, are you actually asking?
	I am asking.
	I'd like to hear what people, you know, if they could explain why they are doing that, other than for their own jollies.
	The conventional groupthink mentality has been that since Saucy Rossi left the show, that the whole thing is a bag of shit now.
	What do you think?
	Are you asking me?
	No, I'm not going to say it was.
	I'm not going to say I noticed a huge difference.
	So everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
	Just like with Art Bell, I turn on the guests.
	The quality of a guest is what matters to me more so than Richard or her art.
	So you answered my question.
	I appreciate that.
	So it's really, that's the root of the problem.
	I think there's a lot of groupthink going on in that regard.
	Okay, yeah, that's what I'm asking.
	So I appreciate the answer.
	And have a good evening, you guys.
	MV speaks for all.
	Thank you.
	Okay, have a good night.
	Bye.
	Thanks, buddy.
	I don't know if I would say it's groupthink.
	Well, see, I can't really speak to that because I don't listen to the show.
	What do you think?
	Well, I think what it was was he, you know, initially the show was exactly what everybody would think it was.
	You know, a terrible thing run by Richard Hoagland.
	And, you know, you can't expect much from Richard Hoagland.
	But it turned out that while that show was evolving and, you know, they had brought in Rossi and all that, it actually became very good for a time.
	Hoagland was, you know, holding back, not going crazy and interrupting guests.
	And he was getting really interesting guests, you know, a real wide variety of people that we'd never heard before on Art Show or Nori or whatever.
	And then Hoagland went and blew it, and he blew it in such a way that he did it.
	You know, first of all, there was the problems with Ross, but more so, he started calling his listeners useless eaters of bandwidth and saying that we're just using too much and all of this.
	It just became very toxic.
	And that's why there's such a bad sentiment towards the end of the day.
	I don't understand why Hoaglund says, I saw this mentioned on the forum.
	Hoaglund says that he's paying $1,000 a month for bandwidth.
	I don't understand that.
	Isn't he on DMRN?
	Isn't that all handled by them?
	I don't understand that.
	I have no idea what the story is there.
	All I know is that he said that Keith Rowland is charging him for it.
	I don't understand that.
	And what kind of bandwidth could he be using to pay $1,000 a month?
	I mean, bandwidth is cheap these days.
	To pay that much money, he would have to have such a large audience that the money would just be rolling in to pay.
	And I doubt it is.
	So I don't understand that.
	Maybe it's Keith trying to drive him off the network.
	I don't know.
	Oh, I'm sure there is an effort in that regard going on.
	No doubt about it.
	I can't imagine there's not.
	Well, I don't know.
	I don't listen to Hoagland's show.
	I've never heard a single episode of it.
	I don't even have time to listen to art.
	I mean, Art's show, God love them, but it just doesn't fit into my life.
	You know, I can't stay up to listen to it.
	And then during the day, I just don't have time to listen to the podcast.
	Plus, there are other things that I listen to.
	It's just, it's so much to squeeze in.
	You know, it's been very difficult for me to be a participant in the show.
	For me, it's just a nice way to end the day.
	You know, before going to bed, I listen to art just like I did 20 years ago.
	And so for me, it's kind of a sentimental thing, but also that, you know, I just enjoy that, ending my day that way, you know, having a drink and listening to art.
	And I was liking Hoagland too, but, you know, not anymore.
	Probably easier for people on the West Coast where it's 9 to midnight instead of midnight to 3 a.m. 11 to 2 here central.
	Still somewhat better.
	Somewhat, but right on the cusp.
	Yeah.
	It's difficult.
	A lot of the guests are, it's the same old, same old, you know, it was great back in the late 90s hearing these people for the first time.
	They don't have, once they've said what they've had to say, they don't change it very much.
	So you get the same UFO types who say the same thing.
	They decide they've discovered everything that they're ever going to discover.
	So they just rehash and rehash.
	I think that's a problem with a lot of the powerful guests.
	Excuse me.
	It doesn't change very much.
	So you get Stanton Friedman, you know what Stanton Friedman's going to say.
	And it's probably the times when it's a bit more fun is when it goes wrong.
	So at the beginning, when he came on the show, he had a piece of real business going on about the Rendlesham case.
	And he's one of these embittered UFO researchers who isn't really interested in the case anymore.
	And it's just squabbling with other researchers.
	There was a certain bizarre fun to be had about that.
	But with a lot of them.
	So it's probably more fun listening to him talking with scientists and things.
	I take exception with anybody referring to themselves as a UFO researcher anyway.
	If you're a cancer researcher, fine.
	If you're an AIDS researcher, fine.
	Be an Ebola researcher.
	But you're not a UFO researcher.
	Sorry.
	Or ufologist is even deliberate, isn't it?
	Yeah, if I see the words UFO in a show description, that's one that I'm probably for sure to miss.
	Because it's just the same, it's the same kind of stuff, really.
	I don't know about Cypher, would you have a different view on it?
	But you seem it's just people in flying sources or nothing, really.
	It doesn't seem, or at least art anyway, it doesn't seem to think that there's anything more interesting to it than that.
	It's just a similar, you just get different people saying the same kind of thing.
	And it starts to sort of wear out afterwards.
	I mean, he's just as good as he was.
	I think.
	I mean, you don't feel that he's passed it or anything.
	Speaking of UFOs, speaking of UFOs, how about that Michael Horne over there in the Billy Meyer thread?
	Holy geez, is that guy a hoot or what?
	How could anybody still believe Billy Meyer's claims?
	You know, I said in the thread that I think even if Billy Meyer himself came out and said, yeah, this whole thing is bollocks, as Redney would say, or Yorkshire pud would say, even if he came out and said that, I think that Michael Horne would refuse to believe that the whole thing is not real.
	But then someone pointed out that, well, no, he would continue to try and secure a paycheck for himself.
	Oh, yes, I forgot, actually.
	He probably, at this point, has to intellectually know that this thing is fake.
	But he has just chosen to...
	I mean, who wants to allow the last...
	How long has he been at this shit?
	20 or 30 years?
	Who is going to just throw away that entire chunk of their life's work?
	At a certain point, you're no longer an objective observer.
	You're just shilling for a point of view for the purpose of enriching yourself.
	You have to be.
	This is how he makes a living.
	You think Michael Horn works at a Barnes ⁇ Noble during the day?
	No.
	I mean, this is how he keeps the power bill paid.
	So I can't envision any circumstance where he's going to come out and say, you know what, I just realized the whole thing is bull crap, and I want to apologize to anyone who doubted me.
	That's just not going to happen.
	He claims you've backed out of the debate, doesn't he?
	I never suggested I would debate him.
	How could I debate a guy that has spent 30 on a subject that he has spent 30 years immersing himself in?
	I'm going to look like a total asshat.
	I mean, I can't debate that.
	And furthermore, it's not reality anyway.
	How can I debate fantasy land?
	I said in that thread it would be like attempting to debate somebody on the merits of unicorns.
	Are they brown or are they pink?
	Let's debate that.
	I couldn't debate that because there's no empirical evidence upon which you could base an argument.
	And furthermore, there are so many facets of that whole Billy Meyer thing that are just, I think, so demonstrably, provably phony that once those are proven to be fake, that throws the entire story into the realm of fantasy.
	If anything is shown to be falsified, it's all been falsified.
	And they look so artless, too, don't they?
	I mean, you can quite imagine it's some old guy in his shed putting together something made out of dustbin lids and things.
	They just look incredibly fake to start with.
	Someone made the comment that it's funny how these Pleiadians or whatever the hell they're called just happen to be into 70s art deco.
	I thought that summarized the entire discussion really, really well.
	If he can't adequately explain why Billy Meyer is taking photos of pterodactyls in books or taking photos of women on the Dean Martin show on his television set and purporting those to be alien women, if he can't adequately explain that beyond saying that men in black came in and jacked around with the negatives, then I've got no time for him.
	I really don't.
	His last thing was saying that he's predicted the terror attacks in Paris.
	That was the last thing.
	No, you're not going to be able to do that.
	I saw the excerpt that was supposedly used to justify suggesting that was the prediction.
	And I also saw that someone said this same prediction, so-called prediction, was used in 2005 to supposedly connect to another terrorist attack that already happened.
	So they're wheeling out the same globule of text.
	They were right in Paris, yes, and he was saying it was the same.
	Because to me, that's the thing with these kind of prophecy things.
	They're so vague.
	They don't give specific dates, names, and places.
	You know, he doesn't give, he doesn't say ISIS.
	He doesn't, you know, he doesn't announce Al-Qaeda or anything.
	He just says something vague that's so vague that with a bit of jiggling, you can make it mean almost anything if you choose.
	And it will pertain to something that we all know is going to happen.
	There will be chaos somewhere in the world at some time, and something might catch on fire when that occurs.
	I'm predicting an earthquake in California in the next 10 years.
	I mean, it's just, you know, I'm going to put my money on there.
	There's going to be something going to happen.
	I think you're utterly insane to suggest that.
	Hi, you're on the air.
	Hello.
	Hello, this is Michael Horne.
	You sound exactly like I might have envisioned you'd sound, sir.
	Number one, I want to congratulate you on being the biggest asshole in the universe for not understanding exactly what Billy Meyer had predicted.
	I like it when you talk to me.
	I wanted to ask all your fans, how much are you being paid, sir, to say these things?
	It's been, Google AdSense has been very good to me.
	It's been very lucrative.
	Thank you.
	That's exactly what I'm trying to say.
	Lies upon lies upon lies.
	You can see all the evidence I've given you in the posts and all of the interviews I've given you.
	This is happening.
	I only accept evidence through the mail, sir.
	They knew what's going to happen.
	They deserved that.
	Well, from now on, if you could send all of your evidence to me through the mail, I would appreciate that.
	I will not send you the evidence, sir.
	The reason why is you're not capable of accepting it.
	If you're willing to accept it like I do, I take it every day from in front, from behind.
	I take it.
	I take it hard and long.
	Are you willing to take it as hard and long as I do, sir?
	As long as my wife doesn't find out, I don't need any trouble.
	You know what I'm saying?
	Are you willing to take it?
	Will I be allowed some time to adjust as it's occurring?
	I'm not afraid of everything, sir.
	The reason why is you don't have the information.
	As long as you start slow, don't just ram it.
	You know what I'm saying?
	No, no.
	You're going to take it anyway I give it, sir.
	Will I be given a ball gag?
	You will be given that which you deserve.
	A ball gag.
	I've always been told since I was a small child, my grandmother would tell, you deserve a ball gag.
	I've always been told.
	No, you're trying to obfuscate.
	You're trying to confuse people from the fact that they are coming and Billy Meyer predicted it.
	I'm a big fan of, who's the guy that did the OxyClean?
	Billy.
	Billy Mays.
	Yeah, I'm a Billy Mays fan, but not so much Billy Meyer.
	He didn't have all the information, sir.
	He had good Coke.
	Well, let's see your people come up with you.
	What kind of Coke do you think Billy Meyers got out there in the mountains of Switzerland?
	Nothing.
	Well, they had Edelweiss, sir.
	They had to climb into the mountains and abstract it from the mountains and switch Edelweiss.
	Can you imagine what a bore it must be to listen, Mr. Horn?
	I got to ask you, since you've been out to Billy Meyer's place, it must be a real bore out there because really, it's just a bunch of cow milking and watching people go into secluded rooms with Mr. Meyer, is it not?
	One arm.
	So it takes a long time to milk the cows with one arm.
	But it's equally exciting, right?
	No, he is a prophet, sir.
	He is a prophet.
	He is profiteering.
	He is a website the fact that you will not be able to debate me because you don't have the facts.
	Oh, I'll bet you want to debate, don't you?
	I'm willing to meet you wherever you want to meet.
	You told me you wanted to meet in the Castro District in San Francisco.
	I'll meet you there.
	Oh, I don't see how I'm going to take it if we don't meet.
	So, duh.
	Then we're meeting in the Castro District in San Francisco, and I'm looking forward to it, sir.
	As long as we're not meeting somewhere, as long as wherever we meet, we're not going to be violating any local laws, as I take it.
	Yes, well, sir, in order to conform to the law, you have to agree to the law, which means that you don't even accept the prophecies of Billy Meyer.
	Well, and the Palladians.
	And those were not pictures of pterodactyls.
	What are they?
	No, sir.
	They were images that Billy Meyer had from the Palladians that did not.
	The textbook actually came after the images.
	You know, I initially thought I initially thought that the pterodactyl photo was just a photo of a bug that splatted on a windshield, but no.
	When I saw the photo from the book, oh, it all became clear.
	No, I no, sir.
	And then the Palladians, Dean Martin, had those ladies on after Billy Meyer showed those photos.
	Well, I'm sorry for all of my insultations.
	And what's last year in Fountain Hills, Arizona, at the UFO conference that I'm not invited to.
	Well, you can always go there by Skype.
	I have to ask you, I mentioned this in the Billy Meyer thread.
	Why don't these aliens, if they want to spread the word of their good deeds, why don't they just fly you around Gratis?
	Oh, no.
	I pay nothing for my flights.
	So the aliens are flying you around.
	You don't use...
	Why is that necessary?
	It's such a...
	It's such a waste of fossil fuels being pumped into the atmosphere.
	I mean, if the Pleiadians are so worried about the ongoing pollution of our atmosphere and the implications that has for all of us, why would they not teleport you rather than forcing you to use dead dinosaur juice to move from San Francisco to Toronto or wherever the hell it is you're going?
	Because we all have to make sacrifices.
	Well, I'm glad that the Pleiadians are balancing things out.
	They're not just full force in one direction.
	That's a good thing to realize.
	That was Michael Horn making his premiere appearance on our radio show.
	We want to thank him for that.
	That was really him, was it?
	I wasn't sure that it was.
	It sounded a bit like JC to me.
	I know.
	That's why I was trying to remember all the JC memes, like insultation.
	But there was another one that he used to say all the time.
	I can't remember what that was.
	Okay, I'll give that guy, I'll give that guy in his Michael Horn impersonation.
	I'll give him a seven.
	What say the rest of you?
	I've never heard him.
	I've never heard him in an interview before.
	Neither have I. He's convincingly to run.
	2.5 from the East German judge.
	I would say that I did hear the last time and probably the only time I've heard Michael Horn was when he was on with Art, I think, in 2004.
	It was either late 2003 or sometime in 2004.
	And I heard the entire interview.
	And then at the end of the interview, as Arts, Cusco is playing, Art is getting ready to end the show.
	And Michael Horn jumps in with, oh, and by the way, I have a music CD if anybody's interested.
	I mean, imagine four hours of talking about all of this alien, hocus-pocus horseshit.
	And then suddenly, as Cusco is playing, the show is wrapping up.
	Oh, by the way, I'm something of a musical genius.
	If anybody wants to get into my music, there's a CD out there you can purchase.
	Thank you.
	What would that even sound like?
	Well, you can, if you take a look at the Billy Meyer thread, there are links to Michael Horn's music.
	And boy, it's really artsy.
	That's what I'll say about it.
	What's up, Jasmundi?
	Hi.
	How are you?
	How are you, Shiger?
	I'm good.
	How are you?
	I think we need some sexy music.
	You sound like you need to clear your throat.
	You don't sound quite as dulcet as you normally do.
	We need some sexy music.
	Did you get a mixer?
	He starts playing sound effects, and rather than just allowing myself to be immersed in them, no, I need to break that down, the technical nature of how he made that happen.
	Just bust the mood right up.
	I was very jealous of our good friend Eddie for all that he does on our show.
	So, yeah, I thought I would step it up a little bit and bring my game.
	Well, if you're going to be doing a podcast regularly, you do need a mixer.
	At a certain point, it becomes evident that just having a microphone plugged into the USB port doesn't cut it.
	You know what I mean?
	Yeah, and then I wouldn't be able to do things like this.
	It's MV's Fauf.
	Who is that?
	I demand to know who that is.
	Who does it sound like?
	Playman from Martinez.
	Play it again.
	Yes.
	MV's Fauf.
	Oh, my.
	You know what?
	I'll bet you I could pick a hundred random Falke videos and I would be able to find that same excerpt in 50% of them, right?
	I tell you what, you can listen to actually, not that you would want to, but you could listen to any of those videos and pull out a million different sound bites that could be used in a variety of situations.
	There are a lot.
	I understand there to be a lot of people calling Richard Hoagland's show using the Falkey soundboard.
	I have no idea what you're talking about.
	Oh, my.
	I think we've just uncovered something here, haven't we?
	Sounds like plausible deniability.
	So, Jasmunda, what brings you to the show tonight?
	No, how can you follow that last call?
	Do you think that was him?
	No, that's not Michael Horne.
	No.
	I do think that it would be good to have Horn on.
	Maybe it would be better on the Michael Van Diemen's Radio Trainwreck show than on the Gabcast, I think, possibly.
	Does that show even exist anymore?
	It does.
	Once I finally drop out of college, it will exist once again.
	No, it's yes, it does exist.
	It's just that when Evelyn and I started doing that show again, I started school just like a couple of weeks later, and I had no idea how just crazy busy I was going to be.
	And I just didn't have time.
	And then with the gabcast changing and now my presence being required here more than was the case in the past, it just makes it really tough.
	I talked to Evelyn Friday night and I'm like, listen, I'm not dead.
	I still acknowledge your existence.
	We will be doing the show.
	Just bear with me.
	She promptly vomited into her USB headset and all the pain meds that she's on because of her gimpy arm.
	So, yeah, we're going to be doing that.
	I think that, though, rather than just bring Horn on and allow him to filibuster as my eyes glaze for a couple of hours, I think it would be better to bring somebody on who is capable of, who has invested the personal time to be able to refute the things that he says.
	And there is a guy that I saw in the Billy Meyer thread that seems roundly capable of doing so.
	So I think I'm going to bring that guy on along with Michael Horn.
	We'll figure out when that's going to be.
	But his assertion that I ever at any point wanted to, with quotation marks, debate him, that's dead.
	I never used that word.
	I never implied that.
	I think, and as I said to him, a guy with your personality, I'll bet you every conversation feels like a goddamn debate.
	So anytime he winds up on any show, he probably views it as a debate, I would imagine, because he, and, you know, the thing is that bothers me the most about him is the fact that despite the difficulty, rather, despite the extra-worldly nature of the claims that he's making, despite the almost supernatural nature of the information that he is purporting to be factual,
	he is still shocked when he experiences opposition to these ideas.
	In other words, if you're out there telling people that an old farmer in Switzerland is getting information from aliens who fly him around and show things to him and who happen to fly around in spaceships that look like trash can lids, I can't begin to imagine why you find it shocking that some people don't buy it.
	And that's what amazes me the most about Horn is just the fact that he seems shocked when he encounters opposition.
	He seems shocked by that.
	I don't understand it.
	Anyway.
	Can I ask a question?
	No.
	Yes.
	Why is Billy Meyer never interviewed about all this?
	Why does he need proxies to talk on his behalf?
	I don't think he speaks English, does he?
	He just speaks German.
	I think.
	He's Swiss German, isn't he?
	So I think Horn's the, he's represented on Earth, isn't he?
	And, yeah, and also he's a, I think he's particularly bright, is he?
	He's a kind of sort of simple.
	He looks like a dummy, doesn't he?
	Yeah.
	Just like looking at pictures of Billy Meyer, it's just like, God, this guy definitely has sex with goats.
	Look at him.
	He looks like just a mouth-breathing dummy.
	Aliens.
	So he's probably not smart enough.
	You know, he would blow the gas, wouldn't he immediately?
	I think so.
	We've actually interviewed him.
	So he needs someone smooth and so apparently that's Michael Horne.
	Yay.
	Nice choice.
	That's another thing.
	I mean, of all the PR guys to pick, that's your guy.
	You need someone who actually has some level of EQ and is able to relate to the public at large and present himself in a way that isn't so off-putting.
	And as I said in that thread, at least the Church of Scientology puts people on TV that are presentable, that just aren't immediately revolting on a visceral level.
	I mean, you look at Michael Horne, he looks like somebody from a suicide cult.
	He looks like a younger version of that guy from the Heaven's Gate cult, Marshall Applewhite.
	He looks, they all have this same sort of new agey, creepy something about them.
	I can't quite quantify what that is, but there's just maybe it's a smirk of some sort.
	I can't quite wrap my head around what it is.
	It's an air of weirdness.
	Yeah, that really is.
	I think it was you, wasn't it, that pointed out that Michael Horn looks rather like a penis, doesn't he?
	You see a picture of him.
	He does have that.
	Well, somebody else said that.
	I just repeatedly concurred.
	Oh, you just repeatedly concurred.
	There is something disturbing about his appearance and his contributions, really.
	He always comes into looking for a fight or saying something.
	I showed a picture of him to my wife.
	I didn't tell her anything about him.
	Nothing.
	I just showed her a picture of this guy, Michael Horn, and I said, what do you think about this?
	What do you think about him?
	And just she was repulsed.
	Just like she had this visceral instinctive reaction.
	She was just like, ooh, who is that?
	And I said, well, and then I explained to her who he is and what he does.
	And boy, that didn't help matters.
	I can't imagine a worse PR guy.
	I can't believe your wife is still with you, MV.
	Well, I have questioned this myself.
	And I don't quite understand.
	I expect it to end anytime, hence my appeal that she be deported forthwith.
	I mean, you show her photos of Billy Meyer, of Falkie, of Kathy.
	I mean, what do you think?
	You know what?
	You make a great point.
	You know, remember that, remember that Falke video somebody put together where he had music and it showed Falke hitting her.
	And, God, it was so hilarious.
	That was, who put that together?
	It was Coaster who put that together, I think.
	And then he pussed out and removed it like a little puss.
	Coaster, if you're listening, you're a puss.
	I can't believe you.
	It was the funniest thing.
	I have never laughed so hard at something somebody put on Bellgab as I did at that.
	It was absolutely the funniest thing I've ever seen.
	And he removed it.
	I remember showing that to my wife and her just looking at me, just sort of non-plussed.
	She really didn't understand why she's been allowing this man to have sex with her low these many years.
	It was very puzzling to her.
	She really did begin to doubt the path that she's taken in life.
	Well, anyway, let's get back to the show notes.
	Jasmoon, you got anything else, buddy?
	No, that's all.
	Have a good show.
	Thank you.
	Okay, Sugar.
	Nice waiting.
	That was Jasmine.
	If anyone else wants to be on the show, there is a phone number you can call.
	That would be 623-242-CAST.
	It is 623-242-2278 if you want to be on the Gabcast.
	So we have a 12-hour Midnight in the Desert marathon that's going to be airing on KABC in LA.
	That's going to be on Thanksgiving.
	Anyone have any thoughts on that?
	That's really.
	Anybody know what his affiliate count is up to?
	The last I checked, maybe a month ago, I checked it.
	It was at around 42, I think.
	And I'm kind of wondering what it's at now.
	Is it expanding?
	I guess rather than ask for any sort of specific affiliate count, can anybody, do any of you guys know, is it expanding the list of affiliates?
	He added at least a couple in Ohio.
	But the KABC, that is the big one on the list, right?
	That's thus far.
	That's the biggest one.
	The Portland station.
	KXL, I think.
	Oh, wow.
	Isn't that the one that was what's his name's main affiliate?
	Clyde Lewis?
	Oh, I thought you were going to say.
	Yeah, I think it is.
	I think actually Clyde Lewis's show is shorter now because of that.
	Yeah, didn't he shrink his show?
	I think.
	And was that the term he used?
	Ladies and gentlemen, I'm going to shrink my show.
	I'm going to be shrinking this show.
	Stand back and watch it happen.
	Chefus says it seems to be a good mix of paranormal and conventional guests.
	He had Neil deGrasse Tyson on.
	I used to kind of like Neil deGrasse Tyson, but man, could you get off the climate change thing, please?
	He's been getting kind of arrogant lately, but I really enjoyed that.
	I really enjoyed that show, though.
	That was a great interview that Art did with him.
	Yeah, I definitely given the choice.
	Tyson versus Kaku.
	I'll take Tyson a thousand times, please.
	I find Kaku very off-putting.
	I started hating Kaku, and I've said this before, I know.
	But I started disliking him when I heard him on the Opium Anthony show during the BP oil spill in the Gulf.
	And he kept repeatedly refusing to admit that he doesn't know what they should do about it.
	He just kept saying, it is a physics problem.
	The problem they're having at the Deepwater Horizon, it is a physics problem.
	And he just, they kept coming, but what should they do?
	And he would not admit it.
	And the reason he wouldn't admit that he doesn't know what they should do is because he was hoping someone's going to call him up and write him a big fat check to come down there and help out.
	That's exactly why he refused to say that.
	And ever since then, I just thought, you know what?
	Fuck this guy.
	You know, another problem with them, too, with Kaku, is that when he goes around pontificating about futurology or futurism, he's extremely dated and talking about cancer detecting toilets and all that when the entire field of futurology is looking at molecular nanotechnology and things like that.
	He seems to have missed it.
	Cancer detecting toilets?
	Yeah, that's his big thing.
	He goes around talking about a cancer detecting toilet that we're going to have in 20 years.
	As the poop flows into the toilet, if there's any cancer in the poop, it will be detected by the cancer detecting toilet that detects cancer in the poop when you poop if you have cancer that gets detected by the toilet.
	That's his claim.
	Great.
	Yeah.
	Quality of show seems to be very good, only a few duds.
	Have there been any duds that you guys would confirm to be duds per se?
	I don't have any.
	I've enjoyed pretty much most nights lately.
	I would say just the ones that had technical issues.
	I think they often seem to go downhill when the callers start, don't they?
	Because a lot of them don't really have very much to say.
	And I don't like the Skype bit when he's talking to someone on the same.
	I always prefer it when it's someone down a very poor phone.
	I'm in a lot of time.
	It should be, I agree.
	Very off-putting.
	I don't like hearing somebody on, because for some reason, the better the quality of, you know, the actual audio quality, the worse the actual, you know, the less the caller has to say.
	They just...
	They seem to just be surprised that they've got on and just have a chat for a couple of minutes.
	They don't say anything at all.
	And Art just loves the sound of good audio, doesn't he?
	He's carried away with it.
	So he'll keep someone on, even if they're incredibly boring.
	And so he'll just let them ramble on.
	If there's a slight force on the line, he'll just cut them straight off.
	Even if they might be interesting.
	So he's got a real hang-up about audio.
	i don't think we're ever going to get past that with him he's just going to love i just don't i've never felt like the guest in terms of audio fidelity should be on par with the host if they're If they are on the show remotely.
	And I'm sure a lot of this is just inertia in terms of my expectations.
	I listened to arts show for all those years with all of these guests calling in from phone booths in the Mojave Desert.
	And so I just, and for whatever reason, my mind expects to continue hearing that and hearing people calling in on Skype.
	Just, I don't know.
	I want them on just a regular POTS telephone line.
	Thank you, please.
	It's probably the same thing with people with LPs.
	There's people who love their vinyl, and you'll never convince them that CDs or whatever is just a good high-quality compression file.
	It's just the same.
	They love their LPs with the warmth and the scratches and things.
	They don't mind that.
	So I think it's the same with audio.
	I think when you listen to, say, somebody talking about, say somebody's doing a Halloween call or something, when you hear them telling a ghost story on Skype, it's nowhere near as atmospheric, is it?
	Than they're calling in some shitty line from Back and Beyond.
	It just adds something to it, even if the quality, if it's not clear quality, it just adds a bit of atmosphere, I think.
	I do miss that from a lot of the calls.
	Leo Ashcraft, since the initial implosion, we haven't really talked about him on this show.
	I mean, this guy, I have never seen somebody so publicly and just decisively humiliated as I, I mean, what kind of dignity does this guy, what kind of self-respect does this guy have to do all the shit talking he did, to pound his chest as much as he did, and then for everything to fall apart the way it did.
	It just, I cannot believe it.
	I have never seen a man who allegedly has a pair of castanets.
	I have never seen a man so publicly emasculated and humiliated as I saw to be the case with Leo Ashcraft.
	After all the shit he talked about art, after all the threats of how he was going to do a show and do it better and how he was going to steer all of these affiliates away from art.
	And the guy comes on and after not even two weeks, he goes to the hospital and, oh, that's his out.
	We knew right away, by the way, I remember people in that thread when it was announced that he had to go to the hospital and Jay Neil Shulman was going to fill in for him.
	Everyone knew right away, this is the out.
	This is it.
	This is how it ends right here.
	This is going to be his excuse no longer to do this show.
	And it was.
	Wow.
	Did everybody call that or what?
	Just amazing.
	And this Jay Neil Shulman, I don't know anything about him other than he's like he looks like a 45-year-old hipster who, for whatever reason, was brought on to.
	And by the way, Jay Neil Shulman was infinitely more interesting to listen to than Leo Ashcraft ever was.
	That was the irony of the whole thing.
	And Leo Ashcraft was supposed to be, he was supposed to be the get.
	He was supposed to be the draw.
	And then I did tune into the show.
	And if there was anything interesting happening on the show, which there wasn't, but J. Neil Shulman came closer to being interesting on that show than anybody else could ever have dreamt of coming.
	He had this thing called Alongside Night.
	He wrote this, but I don't know if you know this.
	He wrote a book, some kind of libertarian offshoot, some tract.
	And I think he did this back in the 70s.
	And he's just been, you know, he made a film.
	I think he made a record or something.
	And he's just recycling this same idea of his in different ways.
	So, you know, this show was called Alongside Night.
	So he'll just, you know, he'll just do it in different incarnations each time.
	You know, he's had one idea, which he just keeps pimping all the time.
	So, yeah, for some reason, why they called the radio show that I have no idea.
	But these two geniuses just got together and decided to do a radio show, and it fell apart after about three episodes, didn't it?
	And as the show got underway, Leo Ashcraft was so eager to go out and make everyone aware of the terrestrial affiliates that were picking up the show.
	And there were two of them initially, and I did some searching on the first one and found that it's just some crappy low-power FM station in Vegas.
	I didn't even bother searching for information on the other station after that.
	But I will say that I wonder how they have filled that programming gap since Leo stopped doing his show.
	What are they going to do?
	How are they going to fill that two-hour gap?
	Oh, I'm sorry, three-hour gap.
	What are they going to do for programming?
	It's just a shame.
	I can't imagine the panic that must have set in at the programming department for K-R-A-P in Vegas whenever they found out that no longer were they going to have Leo Ashcraft under their wings.
	The most interesting part of the Leo Ashcraft saga was when they went mysteriously off the air the night Arts Compound was shot at.
	I can't say J.
	I think that was just a crazy coincidence.
	J. Neil Shulman does not look like the type of guy who's going to drive down the road firing out his window, yo.
	Oh, no, I'm not saying that.
	I just find that only coincidence.
	But a lot of people literally did believe that.
	And even now are still alluding to the possibility that that was what happened.
	This is silly.
	Yeah.
	No way.
	I don't know.
	I kind of feel bad for that J. Neil Shulman guy because I don't think he had any malice in his heart in pursuing the whole thing.
	I don't think he was necessarily adversarial toward art.
	I'm not aware of anything he said that was negative.
	I think he knew what he was getting into.
	No, I don't think he did know what he was getting into.
	I think he just wanted to do an internet talk show with somebody.
	And so this jizz bagel came along and said, hey, I want to start a show.
	You want to be part?
	Okay, great.
	We got a show.
	Hey, cool.
	I'm going to be on an internet ready.
	And he did it.
	And so I don't.
	There's a lot of hostility toward JNS as I liked it.
	I've always called him JNS.
	The rest of you call him J. Neil Shulman.
	There's a lot of hostility toward him that I don't quite understand, but whatever.
	Groupthink, again, groupthink.
	That's what that is.
	But if you want to see the continued meltdown, which still is ongoing, you can get on Facebook and look up Leo Ashcraft.
	And if things are still as they were just a couple of days ago, his profile picture is that of Art Bell flipping the bird.
	So that way you'll know you're following the right guy.
	It's hilarious when the whole thing was exploding and all of these people, Leo Ashcraft was going batshit on his Facebook.
	And all these people started following him on Facebook because they wanted to watch firsthand this implosion of a man's life take place.
	And he thought it was because there was some modicum of support for him out there.
	That's how he interpreted it.
	And that is why I think with such bravado, he expressed his intent to take art down and to wreck his relationships with any affiliates.
	He really saw all of these people following him on Facebook as some sort of an indicator that validated all the stuff he's saying.
	And I'm taking all these people with me.
	He really thought that he had something to fall back on.
	And in reality, it was just a bunch of people wanting to watch a man implode.
	He had no idea.
	Just so delusional, man.
	I've never seen, again, I have never seen a man so publicly humiliated, so devoid of any dignity or self-respect.
	Did it to himself, though?
	I mean, his meltdown was epic.
	Like, he had no filter at all.
	I don't know.
	Okay.
	Let's see.
	MV comments on Mizzou activists.
	I don't know that I've really made any comments.
	I think he just wants me to comment on the Mizzou activists.
	Valid points or just whiny snut-nosed kids.
	Outside race baiting groups like BLM, Black Lives Matter, organizing on campus?
	Do all people from Missouri bitch this much?
	I think he's been listening to my broadcasts long enough that that's become a valid question for him to ask.
	Well, I can address it because I live in St. Louis.
	Oh, do you?
	Yeah.
	Holy crap.
	I didn't know that.
	Crap, yeah.
	Well, and yes, we all bitch that much.
	You know, St. Louis is just such a bag of shit.
	Do you really like living up there?
	Well, actually, the truth is, most of the week I live 45 miles north of it, but then I have to come down for family reasons and stay there.
	But I'm not really there.
	I'm way out in the suburbs, you know, so I won't go into St. Louis unless I have to, absolutely have to.
	It just looks like a nuclear bomb has been detonated.
	It's a horrible town.
	Yeah, it's a terrible town.
	Complete shit.
	You've got an arch.
	Come on.
	I mean, yeah.
	Well, it's not even an American arch, though.
	It's from Finland.
	Yeah, so we brought this architect in from Finland to build a thing.
	And yeah, so we couldn't even do that ourselves.
	I just love the foreign perspective.
	But you've got an arch.
	What's the problem with your town?
	I remember actually, there was a plug.
	I don't know if you've heard of Stephen Fry.
	He's a sort of guy.
	Oh, I love Stephen Fry.
	And he did a series of Steam Fry Visits America.
	He was going to every state.
	That was a good show.
	Yeah.
	And then when he went to St. Louis, he just went to this, he just interviewed a homeless guy, and that was it.
	That's the entire bit of St. Louis.
	I was like, okay, off we go.
	That was it.
	Yeah, he didn't even eat anything or do any, you know, no tourism whatsoever.
	He just talked to the homeless people and moved on.
	This is St. Louis.
	Crazy.
	It's a horrible town.
	It was an accurate picture of St. Louis, though.
	And there's always been just this horrible racial tension in St. Louis, which over the last 50 years has accelerated as all the white people moved out of St. Louis into the suburbs and left all the blacks in the city to just live off of the scraps that were left behind.
	Just a bunch of desolate smokestacks.
	And it's just really a horrible place.
	Oh, yeah.
	And you look in North St. Louis from the highway.
	You can see these buildings that are literally collapsing.
	And they've been doing that for 30 years.
	You know, no one has ever cleaned them up.
	You know, there's like piles of brick laying there right next to the buildings and they've never done anything about it.
	People inside, they're just cooking methane.
	Right.
	Is it worse than Detroit?
	That's a tough question to answer, isn't it?
	Well, you know what?
	I'll give Detroit something.
	They at least will bulldoze the buildings when they go abandoned.
	Whereas St. Louis, they don't.
	Did you hear about the initiative in Detroit to potentially take all of the abandoned real estate and turn it into farmland?
	Yeah, I want to eat corn grown on land that was formerly used to produce automobiles.
	Yes, that sounds like some healthy eating.
	We'll just slap a USDA organic label on that, won't we?
	Right.
	I mean, what can you do with land that has had human habitation on it for, you know, decades, and then all of a sudden you want to turn it into a farm?
	It just seems to me that it would take so much to clean it up, you know, because you've got like lead paint and all these concerns.
	PCBs.
	Right.
	And I don't know.
	Those are good places for dumping bodies.
	That's good for that.
	Yeah, I love it when we bring someone on to host the show for the first time and he just right away launches into good places for dumping bodies.
	Well, it's Detroit.
	What do you do there besides shoot people?
	Was that you earlier that said I have never shot anybody?
	I just want to make that or was that no that was not me.
	Although I have never shot anyone.
	Years of drug use.
	My short-term memory just is shit.
	Okay, another note here, Richard C. Hoagland, other side of Midnight Decline.
	I guess we already sort of covered that.
	The Falkey soundboards calling in.
	I don't care.
	I mean, I understand that a lot of the negativity toward Hoagland is wrapped around its groupthink.
	It really is.
	But at the same time, I'm happy to see it because that guy is such an asshole.
	And I am proud that, you know, when Art selected Hoagland to do that show, suddenly everyone sort of seemed to take it easy on Hoagland because he got the Art Bell stamp of approval.
	I'm proud to say that even in the face of Art Bell selecting Hoagland, I still was consistent in saying that I would happily slap Hoagland in the face if he ever were within physical distance of me.
	Yes, he's just got that air about him, hasn't he?
	He's just smart enemy and more together than everyone else.
	He's a lappable man, isn't he?
	Yeah, he's just a...
	Actually, I don't know if I can introduce another topic.
	I was just talking to Cypher about this earlier that when you grow up, I mean, sort of MB, you're a few years younger than me, but you grow up, so I'm about 41, so you grow up with Star Wars and things, you know, and there's this new film coming out, and I just wondered what his opinion was.
	I've got a horrible feeling it's going to be terrible, and it's going to be a colossal waste of time.
	But I don't know what your opinion of it is.
	Well, I've never been a huge Star Wars fan to begin with.
	I do enjoy.
	I will say that the first three Star Wars movies are, at least for me, entirely enjoyable films, but you're not going to catch me collecting action figures or wearing a Chewbacca mask as I pound my wife.
	None of that's going to happen.
	But I have never seen the, what is it, the prequels, the Star 1, 2, and 3.
	I have never seen any of those.
	And I've had a lot of people tell me that I shouldn't watch them.
	I've made a good decision in not doing so.
	And I've had a couple of people tell me that I should watch them, that they're awesome.
	But then again, the people telling me that have a bad history of recommending really horrible movies to me.
	No, I mean, they're terrible.
	I got sucked into watching those, and they're just over.
	It's just like someone playing about with CGI.
	And the trouble with CGI is it looks so old after a couple of years because everything gets more sophisticated.
	And the things that something like Alien, for example, where they did, you know, practical effects and everything, it still looks good now.
	It doesn't age, but the things where it's heavily computer generated, it's all yeah, I mean, it grows old after two or three years.
	It just looks, it just looks ancient.
	But no, it's just.
	And there's a certain soullessness to it as well.
	I like some of the older approaches to go back and watch 2001 A Space Odyssey.
	Look at the modeling techniques used to make that film.
	It looks so beautiful.
	And there's a reality to it that you don't get in CGI.
	There's an analog.
	There's an analog this worldliness to it, I guess I would say.
	But CGI is just so by the numbers and it's so easy to throw together relative to doing good modeling work and making something look real.
	Yeah, sorry, Carry on.
	Okay.
	I would just say that there's a move in Hollywood this year, and this includes Star Wars, to go back to practical effects.
	So Star Wars is being filmed with old school effects and as little CGI as possible.
	Really?
	Oh, yeah.
	And another one that was done that way was Mad Max Fury Road, which is mostly done with practical effects as well.
	So there's a movement in Hollywood to move away from CGI.
	But whether or not Star Wars is going to be good, I think it'll look good.
	But as far as the story with Disney and all of their focus groups and all the crap that they do to, you know, their ideas, I'm not hopeful that it's going to be any good.
	Plus, I don't really like J.J. Abrams.
	No, you get the impression that he's a very kind of competent hack, don't you?
	I mean, those Star Trek films were.
	Those were ho-hum, weren't they?
	Yeah, I mean, they were just forgettable.
	I suppose, in a way, the other films, they had a TV series to kind of build on.
	So you're introduced to these characters, but there was nothing very interesting about it, was it?
	It was just, to us, it was just a ride with all these films.
	There's half an hour at the end of just complete mayhem.
	So you don't know what's going on.
	Obviously, you say the focus groups, they love that at the end.
	But yeah, it's, I mean, we're going to get, they say, don't they, sort of, every year from now on there's going to be a Star Wars film until people get sick of them all.
	And yeah, you get the impression, you know, there's this kind of expectation.
	So, I mean, I've, you know, I watched these things as a kid, but you can't, even though it doesn't really interest me anymore, I'll still probably go and see it, and I'm sort of interested to see how it turns out, but it'll probably be brutal.
	And that's what I expect.
	There's this sort of tradition or this sort of perception of the Star Trek films traditionally missing the mark, particularly the next-gen Star Trek films.
	And I think there was a lot of hope that the Abrams involvement in the franchise was going to put an end to that.
	But those are not films, even the JJ Abrams involvement.
	Those films that he produced directed whatever he did.
	Those I saw once, and there was nothing about them that made me say, yeah, I want to go back and watch them again.
	Yeah, they were just totally forgetful, weren't they?
	You go in there for, say, half the top two hours, and you come out, and you wouldn't remember anything about it at all, would you?
	It's like the, I can't remember, what was the name of that film he did?
	It was very much a kind of a Spielberg homage.
	It's like some alien that, what was the name of it?
	You know, it was, there was, you know, the first half an hour to an hour was actually quite interesting.
	And then the second half, it just fell apart.
	It was some alien.
	Was it AI?
	No, it was, it's a J.J. Abrams one.
	I think it's one of the first, maybe the first film he made.
	It was very much as though he'd watched every, you know, like an early Spielberg thing.
	So it seemed a bit like E.T. or something.
	It sounds like you're describing Full Metal Jacket.
	The first half was just wonderful.
	And then after that, it just falls apart.
	Yes, that wasn't that true.
	Yes, that was the first half of that was great.
	No, I can't remember the name of it now.
	No, that's not eight millimeter.
	That's about snuff films, isn't it?
	I don't think you did that one.
	It was, or, um, anyway, it's one of those.
	It was B.I.
	It was like one of those films that they made on one of those sort of early video camera things.
	It was based on that.
	And yeah, and it would say the first half was actually quite interesting.
	And it just, as though the writers couldn't be bothered to do anything in the second half.
	And yeah, you get the feeling with Star Wars that it's going to be like that.
	Although.
	I enjoyed that he did.
	That was about the only thing he's done that I've enjoyed.
	Well, guys, we've done it.
	We are at the end of the show.
	What do you think about them, apples?
	It certainly has been fun.
	And I'd like to thank everybody who joined us on the show tonight.
	That would be sci-fi author.
	Thanks, buddy.
	You're welcome.
	Sredney Vashtar.
	Thank you.
	Hedgehog Norman.
	Yep, it was fun.
	It was.
	I'm glad you're the perfect example of what we want hosting this show.
	Just some random guy on Belgab with 102 posts.
	That's great.
	I love that.
	That rocks.
	Anyway, thanks, everybody.
	Thanks to everybody in the chat room listening to the show.
	And to all of you downloading the show at ufoship.com.
	Don't forget that if you'd like this show to appear on your mobile device automatically, just install a podcatcher.
	Like I like to use an app called Beyond Pod.
	And you just go to ufoship.com.
	You click on the link to subscribe.
	Even better, just open up the Beyond Pod app and go into the little section there where you add a podcast.
	Search for the Gabcast.
	You'll find it.
	Click subscribe.
	That's it.
	Boom! Show's going to appear on your device automatically on a weekly basis and you don't have to think about it.
	It's perfect that way.
	So that's a little advice from my family to yours about that.
	Thanks, you guys.
	Thanks for being on the show, really.
	Thank you.
	Thank you.
	See you later.
	You're welcome.
	Thanks, everybody.
	Bye.
	See you.

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