Andrew Schulz and Akaash Singh dissect Michael Jordan's "Last Dance" episodes, debunking the food poisoning myth as suspicious and analyzing Jerry Sloan's press conference sarcasm. They critique Phil Jackson's memoir excuses regarding player injuries versus ego management while examining Steve Kerr's Game 6 strategy against Brian Russell. The hosts contrast Jordan's fearless, single-moment dominance with LeBron James' calculated approach, arguing Jordan's bottomless competitive drive sacrificed happiness for seven titles. Ultimately, the discussion highlights how Jordan's relentless fire required immense teammate sacrifice, contrasting his parenting style with Steve Kerr's positivity to reveal the heavy cost of winning. [Automatically generated summary]
Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Food Poisoning Doubts00:15:01
There's one thing about the documentary I find absolutely unbelievable.
Which is there's a lot of things probably, but go ahead.
No, no, there's one specific thing that I do not believe.
Food poisoning?
I do not believe it's not about food poisoning.
I don't believe that five guys can be in a room at two in the morning and only one of them orders pizza and nobody else has a bite of the pizza.
Crazy.
Just heard an excerpt from the director about this.
He was on another podcast and he was saying the story is apparently everybody ordered dinner without Michael Jordan earlier.
And so like they didn't wait on him and he got there late or something.
They all ate without him.
So he was pissed off at everybody.
So he's like, find, let's find food.
I got to eat.
Pizza is the only thing that's open.
They're not in Salt Lake City in downtown.
For some reason, their hotel is like on the outskirts.
It's believable that pizza is the only thing.
So the pizza comes in.
MJ says, none of you guys are eating this.
I'm going to eat on it.
And then he spits on the pizza so nobody else can eat it.
Sounds like MJ.
Doesn't sound like MJ.
So here's the thing.
I believe that he wanted a pizza to himself.
I also believe you're a 6'6 athletic machine.
You could eat a whole pizza to yourself.
I could eat a whole pizza to myself.
It's not that hard.
I don't believe that you would order only one pizza.
I think if there's five guys, five people or five guys are in a room or however many guys are hanging out, but it seems like there's a few.
You really think five dudes are going to share one pizza?
If we order right now, four of us are about to order pizza.
We're going to order one single pizza.
MJ knew he was eating that pizza by himself.
Nobody else ordered pizza.
Yeah.
I don't buy it.
I think that is the only fictitious thing going on here.
I don't know what got him sick.
I don't know if it was partying, drugs, who the fuck knows, but I do not buy that a pizza was ordered and nobody else was like, yeah, just get two.
Why not?
It's a life of luxury.
You just buy bottles.
You're just frivolous.
I also put a stupid license plate on my range.
I'm a little skeptical.
I'm a little skeptical that five dudes come and deliver a pizza and then my personal trainer, who I've been with for over a decade now, says, hey, man, something about this doesn't seem right.
I'm going to be like, yeah, you know what?
Let me eat the whole thing before the finals of game five.
Can I be honest with you?
Five dudes delivering the pizza makes the most sense to me, especially if they're not poisoning it.
Think about it.
If you were going to poison Michael Jordan, why would more of you go and wave your hand and be like, hey, look who gave you the food poisoning?
To me, it's like, oh shit, we're delivering a pizza to the hotel where the bulls are staying.
Everybody at that pizza store and their friends are going, it might be Michael Jordan.
Let's just all go.
Right.
Maybe it's Sky Pivot.
Maybe it's Robin.
Right.
Still, cool.
Fuck it.
Luke Longley.
We'll take it.
It's going to the hotel where the Bulls are.
It's got to be the Bulls, right?
They're all showing up.
They're admitting guilt if they all show up.
The second there were like five guys came to the hotel.
I was like, nope, not food poisoning.
No way in fucking hell.
It cannot be.
That makes sense.
Right.
You're admitting it.
It's like only a rapper would be so dumb to like say they did the crime.
That's what these guys are doing.
I need a real doctor, not just an Indian, to verify this, but my understanding is food poisoning takes like 36 hours to really take hold.
I can push back on that from personal experience and Jameel can attest to it.
What happened?
We both had the same sandwich, but his metabolism is way quicker than mine, I guess.
He got sick quicker while we were living together and he was thrown up in the bathroom and I was like, you stupid fucking idiot.
You can't eat lettuce, you bitch.
And then literally two hours later, I was like, huh?
So after he recovered, I'm in the bathroom just shitting and throwing up.
And he's just going, you stupid fucking idiot with just slow metabolism.
It's funny.
Okay, fair enough.
But yeah, I don't know.
It's a little sketchy, right?
But Tim Grover has always thought it was food poisoning.
I remember I read his book and he said, I think it was food poisoning.
Five guys delivered it.
I felt weird about it to this day.
Okay, let me throw something at you.
Also, real quick, if you're Jordan, a guy who believes what he believes and you can't convince him differently, if he thinks it was food poisoning, nothing will change his mind.
That's the story he's going to stick with forever.
If he thinks it's food poisoning.
I think it was food poisoning, but I don't think it was intentional.
Okay, it's late.
It's the last place open.
I'm pretty sure they just have shit sitting out.
It probably went a little bad or whatever the case is.
Like, there's just a there's a chance.
There's a chance.
There is a chance.
I've worked at a pizza place.
Yeah.
I spent my childhood working at a pizza place.
Dude, the pizzas would be out for fucking days and we would eat them.
Nothing goes bad.
Like the cheese is so processed.
Like everything is so fucking.
What about the meats?
Like you have the pepperonis and all that shit sitting out.
Pepperoni's dried, right?
So it's like it's already pre-cooked.
You can leave pepperoni out for what?
I know your thing is interesting and sometimes coincidence happened and when they happen to like great people, we're like, uh-uh, something's going on here.
But like if you and I can get food poisoning, so can Michael Jordan.
But when it happens to them, they're like, there's an attack, right?
So I think that could be it.
Or what I thought was really interesting, did you guys pick up on they left a scene with Jerry Sloan in the press conference where he goes, was Michael sick?
I didn't know he was sick.
Yeah.
Why leave that in?
I'm almost like, I know this is Jordan's people.
I think Jordan thinks Jerry Sloan did some shit to him, yo.
I deadass think so, man.
I didn't take it that way.
I take it as they were just showing his humor.
Oh, so he was being sarcastic.
It was like, oh, I thought he was saying like everybody's talking about Jordan being sick.
We're still fucking talking.
Okay, I get it.
Jordan was sick.
Was Jordan sick?
I hadn't heard that.
I'm off it.
Because I first saw it and he had me convincing.
I guess I wasn't looking at Sloan through that like, like sarcastic comedy, like a coach lens.
You know, you see a lot of people.
In the other game, he was like, oh, this was the actual final scene.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
I feel like maybe Jordan likes Sloan.
So he shows him in like, hey, look at his light moments.
Like, he's still got a sense.
Like, kind of like Popovich being funny in a press conference.
Yep.
When Jerry Sloan is just kind of like a sense of humor about getting blown out.
Like, this is it, huh?
That's true.
If Popovich said that, I'd be like, oh, he's being sarcastic.
I just didn't.
I wasn't familiar with Sloan enough.
Fair, complete.
Or something that just hit me.
Black people are sensitive to lactose, but some people are more like once you hit a threshold, then it bothers you.
So say, I can have one slice of pizza, but if I have eight slices of pizza, then I'm shitting for days.
Maybe his selfishness is like nobody else is having this pizza but me.
And because he ate too much pizza, that could have been it.
But is he throwing up?
You ever throwing up from lactose?
I'd be getting diarrhea sometimes.
I never throw up.
I can't fathom that Michael Jordan is lactose intolerant.
I just can't fathom that something that bitch ass would be part of Michael Jordan.
You see him?
He looks like death.
Amin still believes it's a hangover.
Michael Jordan.
Yeah, it's a fucking hangover.
I've never been hungover, obviously, so I don't know what it looks like.
I just, the fucking look in his, there's that, I think he like dunks it and then he just kind of like touches his wrist like just looks mad, exhausted and like pathetic almost at him.
That's a hangover.
That's a hangover?
Yeah.
I don't know.
To me, it looks like dehydration, man.
What is a hangover?
What is the definition of an hangover?
If you have a hangover, you get the IV, which you got before the game, and that's like the hangover cure.
Now, that's true.
Getting an IV will snap you out of the hangover because I think a hangover, all it is, is your body reacting to dehydration.
Yeah.
Right.
So then you get those fluids in your body and you should be fucking good to go.
So maybe it is something bigger than the hangover.
Or maybe they just exaggerated it.
Who fucking knows?
I just didn't believe the pizza thing.
I don't want to take too much time on that.
I just didn't buy the pizza excuse.
And he really like stomped his foot about it.
You know, like it was weird.
It was like, it was almost like he was on the stand.
He was like, I ate the pizza.
No one else ate the pizza.
Like, what's going on, bro?
Like, why are you so pointed about that?
Point, I do think something's fishy about it because when you try to give too many details, that's usually a sign you're lie.
Exactly.
It's like with your girl, like, what'd you do last night?
We were at our coaches and then I texted you right now.
Get out of here.
You have to point out I'm the only one who ate the pizza.
Like, everybody has, for some reason, felt the need to point that out.
It's like, he's the only person who ate the pizza.
That pizza came.
Five people showing up.
He is a psychopath enough, though, to be upset at people for ordering without him and then saying, I'm going to eat this whole pizza myself.
There's somebody in this room who would probably do something like that.
What's that?
And that's the shit you would do.
I can't fucking believe you guys.
Order the pizza.
None of you motherfuckers are touching this.
And then when we were all like, nah, we got a pizza.
Oh, really?
Nah, what's up?
What's up?
I do be doing shit by myself, like paying for this studio.
You're right, bro.
I do be doing shit by myself.
That's a good point, bro.
Hey, hey, that is a good point.
That's so Michael Jordan.
So Michael Jordan.
He's a good ass fucking point.
I'd be doing a lot too much shit by myself, huh?
I gotta break that habit, huh?
I just think you should.
I shouldn't have spit all over that fucking check that I had.
Now you got offended on a hypothetical.
My man got sensitive about a hypothetical.
Son, it's a grudge now.
You're dead.
You're dead to me, dude.
I'm on the list.
Son, did I?
I wore my heart when he told me he had a list.
You remember my list, right?
Yeah.
I used to carry around a list of all the comedians that I was going to bury.
I was Arya Stark.
Literally, they were dicks to me growing up or coming out of the comedy, and I would add them to this list.
And it was a little white line piece of paper that I would fold and put in my wall.
And it was just great.
And I'd check each one off.
Check.
Check.
Psycho.
But it was motivation.
It was like, I'd go home, I'd rewrite my set every single night, and I'd just look at the list.
I'd be like, all right, I'm going to bury that guy tomorrow.
I'm going to bury him.
Psycho.
Yeah.
I mean, it works.
It did work.
That's weird.
Okay.
So, obviously, amazing fucking documentary.
I mean, just such a great look at Michael Jordan, I think, really solidifies him as the greatest of all time and just so superior to like anybody he was competing against that when he really wanted to lock down, he could win no matter what.
It was just his decision, a decision that he had to make.
I loved how they added this folklore of if you piss him off, the boogeyman is coming.
Yeah.
And I thought it was really interesting that there was one person in the whole documentary that didn't believe in that.
John Stockton.
The only everybody else in the dock, even Reggie Millier is, oh, you don't talk shit to Black Jesus.
Oh, you can't do it.
He's the black cat.
You don't talk shit.
Oh, whatever you do, you don't talk shit.
They talk to John Stockton, who looks like a fucking state farm agent.
He's just sitting there, right?
And they're like, so what do you think about that?
He says, they could never look at the Bulls or Jordan as anything special.
How could you compete against someone?
Yeah, I'm so dope.
So dope.
That's so dope.
John Stockton is a nasty motherfucker.
I got to give Charlamagne credit because he was trolling hard.
He was going to John Stockton the best point guard of all time.
Like he was just trolling with him.
I thought about that.
During this documentary.
Son, after this.
That's the goat type shit, right?
You're like, well, how do I compete against a guy that thinks that I'm afraid of like, no, I'm just not going to do that.
You're true.
I'm looking forward to competing with you.
That's true.
I'm looking forward to it.
Can you guys explain what would happen?
You saw it several times.
I think it was when they would play at home.
The opposing team, or you saw Larry Bird do it.
You saw Carl Malone and John Stockton.
Like certain guys would wait for Jordan outside the locker room to like say good game.
Was that just.
I think you're waiting to go up for the press conference.
That's how I interpreted that.
But they would go separately, right?
So like Larry Bird came by just to say goodbye to Jordan, then walked off.
Jordan was hanging out.
And then Carl, when he walked out of the room, Carl Malone and John Stockton were there.
I thought it was after series, maybe.
After the series is over, you're just like.
After the series moved.
I know Larry Bird said it after the series, like, hey, good game.
And then Jordan said, you motherfucker, you bitch or whatever.
No, we'll get to that, but Reggie Miller came after the first two games and they were like Jordan was there and Reggie Miller walked by.
They exchanged.
I see again.
I thought that was press conference shit.
Yeah.
I thought it was waiting.
It looks like it's right outside of that press conference room.
Because they're all sitting there.
Yeah, but it was weird when you saw Malone and Stockton sitting there and then leave after saying goodbye.
I don't know.
I thought it was like a respect thing that they all have, but maybe it was just.
I also remember some trash talk around that time, like after Jordan retired, Patrick Ewing missed a, it was Pacers Knicks.
Patrick Ewing missed a game-winning lab against the papers.
And then Reggie said some shit like, yeah, I know I struggled all game, but I hit the shot when it counts.
Right, Pat?
And then Patrick Ewing is waiting to go up next.
And that's Reggie Miller's last question.
And then he gets off.
People forget what a savage Reggie Miller is.
I was rooting for the Pacers in that series.
Fuck you.
Yeah, I was.
I love Reggie Miller.
Get the fuck out of it.
You know what?
Couldn't do it.
I'm going to be honest.
Part of me still watches and wishes.
This is probably for later, but wishes they won because then Jordan goes out the way he wants to go out.
He didn't want to go out a window.
Wait, what?
Jordan said that.
I wanted to defend this until I lost it.
I didn't want to retire having a championship.
Sorry, there's two things I don't believe in the documentary.
Yeah, yeah.
Fair enough.
I do not believe that Jordan, this unstoppable force, there's literally nothing that can get in his way.
He will do whatever it takes, whenever it takes.
It does not matter.
I do not believe that a short, fat egg of a human being could just be like, no, and he'd be like, yes, sir.
If Jordan really wanted that seventh try, I think that he could have went right to Reinsdorf and be like, bring back Phil, bring back Scotty, pay him, do one year, like short money, then give him long term, something like that.
You can trade him.
He has trade value.
Rodman, give me one more year.
I think Jordan could have made that happen, but he didn't try to make it happen.
And that's on fucking Jordan.
I watched that and I was skeptical.
And now we're hopping very far ahead.
But I was like, yeah, I don't know that I fully buy your explanation that you want it more than anybody on earth has ever wanted it.
Jordan is a fucking singular human being, maybe in history.
Yeah.
And you're not willing to go over Jerry Krauss' head and go straight to Reinsdorf and say, look, let me try to get Phil.
Let me try to get Scotty.
Let me try to work this out.
You didn't want to.
Fuck everybody else talking.
Fuck them having a one-on-one.
I'll make this happen.
And if Reinsworth would have listened, there are so many hundreds of millions of dollars you can make off of that dynasty.
So that's the other thing about Reinsdorf.
It's like one more year, you're making so much money.
It justifies whatever luxury tax that you have to pay.
There was no luxury tax back then.
There was a hard cap, maybe?
No, yeah, but they had the soft cap.
They had the Larry Bird exception.
So you could have signed.
The luxury tax was like a year or two later, I think.
And there might have been some strike shit.
Also, it's a fucking strike shortened season.
But back up, back up to the bird rules, right?
Larry Bird exception.
If a player has played on your team for more than three years, I think, you can sign them and then it doesn't count against your salary cap.
And how many players can you do that with?
I don't know if there's a limit.
I think you did it with Jordan and Pippen.
And maybe Rodman.
Scotty Pippen Heart Defense00:15:31
He could have done it.
Yeah.
Again, we don't know for certain.
And maybe we should look that up.
I think that I just think that the main reason that we're, I think that he made it look like he was so furious that they didn't have a seventh shot.
And maybe he's furious now because he didn't put his foot down about it.
But Jordan was the single most powerful person in sports.
And if he wanted, he could have switched that up.
Now, I've spoken to my buddies around the league and he goes, and they say that like, there's a weird thing that happens with players, even like the most elite players, they fall in line.
And his take was you're so used to having coaches that you listen to what they say throughout your entire life.
It's just part of the dynamics in sports that you just kind of respect authority.
And I'm like, no, that's not true.
Think about, you know, guys like Kobe, guys like Braun, this, that, the other.
He goes, yeah, they don't, but they do.
So it's like a guy like LeBron didn't even know that certain guys were getting signed, right?
Like, I think Braun found out that who's the big bum seven-footer who's always getting texts and shit that the Lakers signed?
Always getting texts?
Techs, tech, technical fouls.
Oh, oh, Dwight Howard?
No.
He just tore his Achilles.
Oh, Boogie Cousins.
Boogie, yeah, yeah.
Like, I think he didn't even know certain people got signed.
And he has maybe the most control of a franchise for most people.
So it's like, he's like, they just kind of fall in line.
Granted, they are like the kings of the castle, but it doesn't exactly affect upper management.
That's what he was saying.
I didn't personally buy it.
To his point, though, that's now it still happens a little bit.
And 25 years ago, maybe it happened more.
We didn't, there was no real precedent for giving players all the power.
Yeah.
I just, yeah, I was looking at him like, you could have got a seventh if you.
So publicly, all you got to do is say once publicly, you go one interview, you know, the news guy, somebody comes up to you with a microphone, just like, you know what?
I want to come back for another year.
The only way I'll do it is if we get all these players back as well, Bulls make it happen.
The franchise would implode if you did not make it.
How simple is that?
I take I put all the blame on Phil.
100% of the blame on Phil.
Okay.
When Jordan was watching that clip of the owner saying, like, go into Phil, it's like we can run it back one more time.
And Phil actually turns it down.
He's like, and they don't think it's fair to Jerry if we do this.
And they don't play Jordan a clip of Phil saying, Jerry came to me and I said, I don't, I don't think it's fair.
That looked like Jordan was seeing that for the first time.
Yeah.
And I bet you if Phil would have been like, okay, let's do it one more time, Jordan would have came back.
Everybody would have came back.
I really, and like you said, I think Jordan fell in line.
And if my leader's not coming back, then I'm not coming back.
But he got the leader to come back one more year.
Like Phil wasn't supposed to come back.
No, no, I know, but I'm saying before to run him back for the seventh.
I don't think Phil told anybody else that, hey, they gave me the option to come back again.
I think Phil wanted a break.
And I think this is really interesting looking to Phil because you can see how much of a hip he is, like even when they celebrate.
Like everybody's going crazy and he's just kind of like, whoa, we did it, dude.
I didn't even know you were going to make it happen.
He's like, fucking Scooby-Doo, man.
It's really crazy.
I loved everything he said to Jordan in that moment.
It was awesome.
It was beautiful to watch.
That was all you.
Like, that's why he's Phil.
But didn't he seem so?
And I hate to use the word Zen, but like, didn't he seem so Zen even in that moment?
Like, he was smiling like a Buddha would smile at the championship.
He's not jumping up and down, screaming, doing backflips like everybody else.
He's like, what a cool.
He looks like he's on an acid trip.
Like, he's just looking around like, fuck, dude, we won him, bro.
Like, he's a unique fit.
He's a unique figure.
I think that it's Jerry Krauss' job to get Phil to want to come back.
Clearly, Krauss' ego gets the best of him here, right?
That's fair.
I'll even push back on what I said earlier, which was he was the great blah, blah, blah.
I still think he's incredibly talented in constructing that team, but his ego got in the way.
That being said, he's justified it after the fact, Krauss, by breaking up a team by saying that everybody got old.
Yeah.
And he put out this article that's on NBC Sports.
It's an excerpt from his memoir that's still not published.
His memoir is going to come out.
And it's really cool of his wife, who's still alive.
She's been asked about this documentary, The Last Antacoman.
She's like, he has a book coming out.
I'm going to let him have the final word.
I'm not going to say anything.
That's pretty dope.
That's dope.
And he basically goes through all the decisions that were made, right?
They did like these intense medical evaluations of all the players.
And obviously they thought Michael could still play.
But they're like, Luke Longley's about to break down.
Rodman, we don't think has any more in him.
Pippin's back is fucked up and he's going to ask for too much money.
Steve Kerr and Judd Bushler are going to get bigger offers.
So we just couldn't afford to bring the team back together.
Now, who cares if you could afford to look.
He justifies it by saying, look what happened to Luke Longley.
He went to Phoenix.
He kind of struggled with his ankles.
He ended up on the Knicks, but he just fell apart.
Then they go.
He says we did Scotty a favor, basically.
He really did.
He goes, We did a sign-in trade for Scotty so he could make more money.
So he made 20 million more.
And I think the reason you can make more is because of the Larry Bird exception, which proves they could have signed.
Because what they do is they sign Scotty Pippen to a big deal.
It doesn't fuck with the cat because you can sign him to more or whatever.
I think it's the Larry Bird exception.
And then you trade him.
I think that's right.
Maybe.
Yeah, maybe.
Or maybe it was one of those like you can sign a longer extension for a team later on to incentivize players to say.
But then, you know, he's like, everybody worried Rodman's parting and caught up to him.
Rodman played 35 more games of the Lakers.
Yeah.
That was it.
And then, so, so he has, and then he, they say he says about Michael, he's like, Michael like severed a tendon in his shooting, his pointer fingers of a shooting hand, and he wouldn't have been able to play the entire season because of that.
Yeah, now he did that in the summer with like some cigar cutter or some shit.
So he's he's basically going, look, we made the right decision.
All the players fell apart.
Michael couldn't even play.
What the fuck do you want from us?
That being said, everything could have completely changed if they knew they were coming back to do a seventh season.
Maybe Luke Longley takes care of his body in the offseason.
Maybe Rodman goes, I'm actually going to play because these aren't going to be meaningless games.
And if it's the right decision and you're a good GM, you would think you would have made the playoffs in the next 10 years or five years.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
How long did it go?
Probably until like Derek was there, right?
Yeah.
I mean, I don't, I'm sure they, I don't remember a competitive team from them until Derek Rose.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That was the gap.
And that's not Jerry Krauss's rebuild that did that.
It's just so interesting.
Like, it's so, it's so interesting.
Like, do you think Phil thought this just came to me?
Do you think Phil after six was like, I'm exhausted?
Also, I don't know how to motivate them anymore.
I used everything I had on the last dance.
What do I say?
The last dance part two?
What's the fucking, what's the motivation here?
I don't have an angle.
I think Phil was exhausted.
Yeah.
I think this is like, it was really difficult for Phil.
Like emotionally difficult holding all this together.
Like, think about it.
Excuse me.
Phil's, and Michael says it in the documentary.
I mean, everybody says it about Phil, but Phil's ability to manage egos is what made him so great and get everybody to be part of the team and like sacrifice for the team.
I think Michael says that in the documentary, right?
Handling all those players, and these are a lot of egos, like handling Pippen's ego, handling Jordan, handling the way Jordan treated the players.
Like, Jordan's going to berate you.
Phil's got to build you back up so you don't lose all your confidence.
Yeah.
Like, handling that fucking situation, dude, that has got to be exhausting.
It's like, I haven't experienced this.
I've been very fucking lucky, but like, you know, there are sometimes kids that play like this kind of almost referee role with their parents.
Yeah.
They're like, parents are fighting all the time, and they're kind of like managing that relationship in real time.
Sometimes they're even divorced and they're constantly managing that relationship.
And like, you see the fucking cost that that has on like on a kid.
It's like emotionally taxing.
So like, have your mom crying or your dad like furious or what's certain.
Imagine doing that for fucking six championships with Michael Jordan.
Oh, my God.
And his, I mean, the greatest player of all time is ego.
And not knowing every practice is he going to punch somebody?
What the fuck is going to happen?
That takes some fucking time, dude.
That's a great point.
I think he was truly exhausted.
Yeah.
I think Jordan could have convinced him to come back because Jordan can convince anybody, but I don't think that he was upset in the least.
Yeah.
He doesn't sound like he said, I didn't want to come back.
I thought it wouldn't be fair to Jerry.
I don't believe you really fuck about Jerry Cross.
I think he blamed Jerry to be honest because he didn't want it.
I think he used that as hell.
I think he didn't think they could win again.
That's what I think.
And I think that celebration at the last one was shock because he didn't think they were a good one.
And you saw the breakdown.
Like Scotty's back is starting to fall apart.
Yeah.
Like, Phil.
And that thought hit me too.
This is actually crazy.
MJ, when he came back the second time, didn't miss a single game those three years, which is insane.
But like, unbelievable.
You think about their run, and there's no playoff series where they're like, yo, we had a big injury to this guy we had to overcome.
And you see that all the time now.
The Warriors last year, Kevin Durant goes down in the finals.
LeBron a few years ago, Kyrie and Kevin Lover out for the playoffs.
Like that just happens.
It happens almost every year.
Never happened to the Bulls.
This is the first time I was like, oh, he's hobbled.
And then before that, the last time was Scotty Pippen got migraines in game seven against Detroit.
Yo, can we talk about that a little bit?
Like Pippin's legacy took a fucking hit.
Like, if Pippin, his entire career, has sacrificed for Jordan to achieve what he needed to achieve, that continued in this document.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Right?
Like, because in order for Jordan's greatness to show game five, Pippin needs to be this focal point with another back injury, or I'm going to sit out in the playoffs because I didn't get to take the last shot.
Or I'm going to have a contract dispute and get my ankle surgery in the fall.
Like, he got destroyed in this game.
They tried to help him out.
I was noticing in this portrayal of game six, where they had the trainer, because Jordan probably didn't say shit, but they had the trainer being like, anybody who questions Scotty Pippen's heart is out of his mind.
And the trainer physically, like, medically knows what's going on with this guy.
So he's like, anybody who questions Scotty Pippen's heart, they don't know what they're talking about.
That helped.
And then there was a moment when they're doing the mic-dubb shit.
And I guess it's cool that Jordan left this in.
But before the last play, after Jordan makes a shot, Scotty Pippen's like, nothing easy.
I'll take a charge if I need you.
Don't worry about it.
And that's him saying, like, we're going to win.
I'll put my body on the line.
I don't give a fuck.
That's fine.
You got a bad back taking a charge.
Yeah.
That's trauma.
So you think that they were trying to protect him a little bit?
A little bit.
Because it is a balance, right?
It's like, how do we make Jordan look heroic?
Yeah.
Without giving him adversity to overcome.
And you can't say the adversity is scoring on Brian Russell.
Yeah.
It has to be more than that, right?
Something happens.
One of your guys has to go down.
Like in any Marvel movie or whatever, right?
All hope is lost.
I think that's part of the hero's journey.
All hope is lost.
All hope is lost.
The all-hope is lost moment is when your second best player, Scotty Pippen.
And if we lose this game seven in you.
And game seven at home.
Yeah.
I've always said this.
Game seven at home is a huge deal.
And then when I watch that Pacers thing and Reggie Miller is talking about that one three that Steve Kerr hit, that if they get the rebound or whatever, and we score it's a five-point game, Steve Kerr hits it, ties the game.
And then he's like, that shot changed everything.
I was like, what are you talking about?
It's one three.
And then he said, the building got energized in a way that we couldn't handle.
And that's what happens in a game seven.
That one shot, if you're in front of your home fans, it's different.
It charges you up.
There's a God.
It's so interesting to see my own bias, especially as a young kid.
Because I remember watching all these things in real time as a kid.
Do you guys remember seeing these actually happen?
I remember where I was sitting.
Like these, the last two championships are the only ones I remember.
Exactly, because we're too young for the other ones.
But these ones, you're probably watching with your fam.
Like, I remember being in the living room.
I remember watching Reggie Miller hit that three.
Remember the three that gets him to win, right?
And I remember Reggie Miller pushing off.
And I remember being so furious.
And I'm like, that was a push.
He fucking shoved him.
Whatever, like this, right?
And then I remember later when Jordan gives a little nudge to Brian Russell going, that's not even a push.
It was just, I was so in love with Jordan.
I was completely biased by what was happening.
That being said, that Brian Russell thing was not even close to a push.
One of the guys said it best.
It was like, it was like a Matri D walking you to your table.
Like Bob Costas, and that's such a possible way to play.
Beautiful.
That's such a rich white guy way to put it.
It's a matri D. Sometimes people go, Matri D. Matri D. What was you talking about, Bobby?
But Matri D puts his hand on my wife's back and lets you know what's going to happen.
Yeah, but it was delicate.
Yeah, it was barely a good thing.
It was delicate.
His momentum was going that way.
Yeah.
I think that was just Jordan helping himself keep balance.
Ooh.
That's how he shifted his energy a little bit.
He had to shift his energy a little bit because he was going full speed to the right.
And then stopped.
That's why he got snatched.
And then this is just a little bit, okay, back.
I'm over here.
I mean, boom.
And to the fact that he hit a game-winning three against Russell, I think it was the year before.
Yeah.
I completely forgot about that.
Yeah, I think it was a jumper game one the year before.
Just sucked.
But you know what?
This is actually...
So I was getting kind of worn out on the grudge against this guy, grudge against that guy.
And then he's doing the Russell.
You're on the list.
I wasn't.
I love this.
Hey.
I'm dusting out my pen this week and I'm not going to lie.
I need to put some more motherfuckers on the list, bro.
I need to put them on the list.
Yo.
And I get that.
And I think everybody kind of does this.
I'm fucking.
I remember this guy, but it's just, you're just going, we're just going to it so many times.
But the Brian, the Byron, Brian Russell.
Brian, I always thought it was Byron.
Me too.
Brian Russell thing, when he was like, he's on the list.
And then he says, I studied him.
I knew he played defense on his toes.
Yeah.
That's how he got him.
And I think that's how he got him the next year in game six.
You're playing defense on your toes and you're going one way.
I switch back.
You're done.
Yeah, I didn't really.
I mean, I was really cool how he analyzed that.
I didn't really understand what that meant because they always tell you in camps and stuff like that to play D on your toes.
It's like the most dynamic way to look.
If you're just walking around your fucking heels, I don't think you're going to do a better job stopping Michael.
I didn't see it in the first shot.
In the second shot, I was thinking, if you're just kind of always like, you don't ever really plant and you're just going one way, it's probably easy for you to get caught.
I would feel like it's easier.
I feel like it's easier to defend that or any kind of like movement back.
What is the side to side?
What is that?
What is that called?
Shuffle.
Kind of shut or like agile.
Agility-based movement is easier when you're on your toes.
I mean, that's what they teach you.
Literally, the drill to move back and forth is hop on your toes to the right, to the left.
So it's like when he was saying that, he was like, I saw he always plays D on his toes and I knew I could get him.
And I was like, you mean good D?
Yeah.
I think he meant it in a different way.
I saw how he always followed through in his jump shot and I knew it wasn't going to go in.
I was like, that's what you're doing.
I thought it was meant he always had his weight forward.
Right.
Always just going whatever forward is.
Right.
Right.
But it was interesting.
Like, oh, once he has a grudge, it's like for real personal.
Like, I'm going to take it out on you.
Let's see.
How much of that is real and how much of that is truly effective?
Kerr Grudge Takes Shape00:03:49
And how much of it do you think is just kind of folklore for the documentary?
I think he thinks it's fully real.
And I do think it's real to a degree.
And I think a little chip on your shoulder helps.
And none of us know how exhausting it is to win that much and have to find new motivation.
Yeah.
But I don't know if it's as real.
And that's how I was getting kind of tired of it by that point.
It's like, I don't know if it's as real as Jordan thinks it is as a documentary is making it seem like it is.
But that's the point of the documentary.
I feel like it's not to, obviously it's not to express that Jordan won six championships.
I think how they're trying to solidify him as the GOAT is basically saying he was so amazing that all he needed to do was focus.
And he was so threatening that if he didn't like you, he could destroy you.
And you know what I'm saying?
Because that goes beyond numbers because we'll need another documentary to show if that's how Larry Bird played.
We'll need another documentary to show if that's how Magic or Bill Russell or anybody else in the discussion.
We know for a fact that's not how LeBron plays.
Yeah.
You know?
And maybe we start to have that discussion, like the big difference between the two of them.
One of the great things about LeBron is that he will make the right basketball play.
The great thing about Jordan is he will just score.
Yeah.
Right?
Like people praise LeBron all the time.
Yeah, he was doubled.
So he passed off.
And you know, that guy who makes $1 million a year to shoot from the corner missed the jump shot.
Yeah.
Right?
Jordan is going to score.
Yeah, Paxon's going to hit one.
Yeah, Kerr's going to hit one.
Jordan is going to hit the majority of them.
And you know what else?
Jordan's going to score the 10 to 12 points before Kerr has the opportunity to win.
Reason Kerr is open.
Jordan has been scoring this whole time, so he might as well just double.
Yes.
You can't not double.
Yes.
Matter of fact, they even talk about everybody saying, like, on that last play, game six against the Jazz, everybody knew when Jordan got the rebound.
Get the fuck out of the way.
Robin says it.
I was just like, what were you thinking?
This motherfucker going to shoot.
Get the fuck out of here.
This motherfucker is going to shoot the fucking ball.
Fucking, I don't give a fuck.
It's so true.
And then Kerr hits that shot.
They really laid into the Kerr thing, huh?
They gave him a nice little storyline.
They did.
I mean, that is a.
I remember hearing that about Kerr and being like, really?
This guy's a fucking, this guy's a beast a little bit.
Yeah.
All right, guys, we're going to take a break for a second.
Let's talk about greatness, man.
Greatness is very important.
And being great in basketball, being great in your passion, and being great during passionate moments is key.
And how can you be great?
How can you be the greatest?
How can you be the GOAT?
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I finally can see Leonardo DiCaprio's alpha.
Like I saw it.
Go talk to me.
So this is after they win game six championship.
I don't see anybody else back there.
But they let Leo DiCaprio back.
Seinfeld Ego Clash00:10:26
And then Jordan looked like he's trying to impress him.
Press Leo.
That was legendary.
And now this is a mutual, which is also crazy.
Kind of mutually like, yo, good shit.
Good shit.
Yeah, but who the fuck is that?
And Leo at that time.
I mean, he's like as big as Leo.
That's what I'm trying to say.
That's Titanic Leo.
I'm pretty sure.
So I'm pretty sure that's all Titanic time.
I'm pretty sure.
Can you see, Mark?
Can you see when Titanic came out?
Yeah, he was so comfortable around Jordan.
Leo was like, that was when he was a kid.
December 1997.
97.
So this is post.
Oh, okay.
And he's the fucking, he is the biggest thing.
The biggest movie ever.
The only guy's biggest Jordan is Leo at that moment.
Yeah.
Okay.
I'll give it to you, but it was just weird.
Girls like Titanic the way we like to.
I seen your movie.
He doesn't even get the name right.
Yeah.
He's like, he's like, oh, yeah, I quoted one of the one for all for one.
Three Musketeers?
That's the wrong movie.
Was Leo in Three Musketeers?
Nah, but wasn't there a newspaper?
Nah, I think there was that line also in the movie you said, The Man with the Iron Mask, some shit like that.
They also said it in that.
And that's why he said it before the game.
And he's like, God damn, like, Leo, big dick Leo.
Yeah, Leo nothing.
Big dick Leo.
They kicked Seinfeld's ass the fuck out throughout the day.
Yeah, right.
They rushed him out.
The show is trash.
And Phil understood that.
That's the thing.
So I was watching Seinfeld.
That shit is fire.
You can still watch it.
Really did recognize.
They probably got why do they even make the end of the bread?
If we don't use it, just stop the bread.
That's a good point.
It's a good point.
I wasn't asking you.
You bringing up great points and act like that's a regular Seinfeld break.
I'm like, Seinfeld's whole fucking banger.
Seinfeld's whole act.
I'll write Seinfeld's.
His great points?
Right now.
Just right now, like this.
Boom.
Easily.
100%.
Easily.
They probably got Seinfeld out of the locker room because they were like, man, Jordan's going to be too geeked out.
We need him.
We need to save his energy.
Get him out of here.
Come on, yo.
Come on, man.
We can't have Jordan over here trying to impress this guy with some funny bitches.
It's a big flu game.
Seinfeld's all playing watching Seinfeld.
And he was so laughed out, he was exhausted.
You know why he was thirsty?
Then pretzels.
Yeah, the fuck trash.
Seinfeld's trash.
Why do they call it air?
Air can't jump.
It's not.
That's not even going.
Air just up there.
What's the deal?
What's going on?
Bread was a great fucking point, yo.
Damn, bro.
I thought I had it.
And he said that bread shit.
I was like, that's a good point, yo.
He's really showing me Seinfeld's genius right now.
It's hard to be Seinfeld.
Even Seinfeld said they're not all going to hit.
They're not all going to hit.
Oh, fuck.
Let me see what other notes are.
Why do you warm up?
Not warm down.
Yeah.
Whoa.
Seinfeld a living legend.
Why is it?
That is such a Seinfeld joke.
We call it warm up, but then we call it cool down.
But heat rises.
Oh, that actually makes sense.
Fucking hell.
Yo, the more you talk, the more he talks.
Listen to every Seinfeld joke, though.
The more you talk about the direction of this word.
Let me ask some questions about this.
Now, the more you talk, the more I think we need a last dance documentary on this Seinfeld speaker.
We need to know, man, how'd you do it this whole time?
Go to Seinfeld.
How do you come with this comedic genius time and time again?
I made it that 22 times a year with full episodes.
Son, fuck.
Oh, you know what was interesting about Steve Kerr?
They said one thing.
No, it's about him being a coach where he said, like, because I only took five shots a game, I put way too much pressure on myself for every miss.
And I was wondering how much that impacted his offense moving forward.
And even like, little, I mean, this is Steph, obviously the greatest shooter ever, but he said to Steph, like, hey, you know, what's great about you is you're one for nine right now, and you're going to keep shooting.
And that's what's great about you.
And his offense is just like, yo, shoot.
Just shoot if you got a shot.
Don't fucking worry about it.
Just shoot if you got it.
And I wonder if that is in his mind at all times.
Like, that fucked with me my whole career.
Yeah, maybe his maybe his thinking is that like, I'm going to get the most out of my players if they feel the most confident.
Yeah.
They feel the least pressure from us.
Yeah.
So he's riding confidence.
That being said, I don't know if riding confidence, obviously he's won championships for those teams, so I can't say it's a bad strategy.
But like, I don't know if just riding confidence is what's going to get you there.
I think what Jordan recognized was true alphas are going to shine no matter what.
And I want to put you in these horrible situations so that you can shine when your buttholes get tight or the nuts get squeezed or whatever.
The you know metaphor he was using in the locker room was, Jordan's whole method is, I'm going to get you, I'm going to make you a fighter, whether you want to be or not, or I'm going to destroy you.
Yeah, and that's the cost.
You're going to see if you got it in you or not.
And he even said about Kerry.
He's like Kerr earned his wings.
Yeah like, think about that.
He's not going.
He saved us.
He goes.
He could be part of the team now.
He hit the game when they shot to the finals.
Like, think about Zach bro.
That's crazy, Because the game winning shot in the NBA finals.
He goes, Yeah, he earned his wings now.
He's one of the players.
And Kerr was so excited.
Jordan trusted him on the bench.
Oh, dude.
That was such a funny thing.
Kerr is funny, man.
When he was just like, Jordan whispers to me, like, you know, he literally goes, Yo, can you pass me some Gatorade?
He goes, I'm going to be there for you.
Don't worry.
I got your hydration right here, bro.
I got you.
So I want you to chest, though.
That was my bad.
I'm a little angry.
Jordan knows cameras are on him all the time, so he whispers, and I just yell back, hey, I'm ready.
They're on you.
Like, he's so geek that Jordan's trusting him.
Think how good that would feel.
That was a good thing.
If Jordan is like, yeah, I think that's true.
How geek would you be?
Yeah.
And it was cool.
He was just self-aware about it.
Yeah.
Another thing I remembered from old shit is Reggie McClure.
Remember when they kicked Seinfeld out the locker room down there?
Remember they said motherfucker?
Because he's too great, yo.
Isn't crazy.
He's taking out the locker room.
We don't need you analyzing.
Jordan's ego got threatened by Seinfeld.
I need something to be a locker and a room.
Jordan is.
I don't even get it, yo.
Imagine if Kramer.
Imagine if Kramer just busted in the locker room, bro.
Oh, that'd be lit.
I was sick.
Sound, that'd be hysterical.
Yeah, it would be.
Oh, God.
Anyway.
Genius.
Comedic genius.
All right, go.
Go.
Locker, room.
Isn't every room a locker?
What's the difference?
No, how?
I mean, you lock it, and then you're saved.
Don't let him throw it.
Don't dare.
Don't you dare give back to that reason.
Sam.
Give Sam.
Save him.
You put him done in Britain.
Save him with the music.
You could have done it in Britain.
I'd have given it to you at Brent.
Save it with the music, Mark.
Save it with the music.
Every single one.
You need the twig chain, by the way.
Chicken chica is twix, I'm pretty sure.
No, no, no.
That's at the end of.
No, isn't it?
What is it?
You know it.
I don't know what that is.
I'm just making noise over here.
Dude, come on, man.
Come on.
Let's be honest about Seinfeld.
Let's just call it what it is, dude.
Fantastic.
You're going to have to get it.
No, Fresh Prince of Bel Air.
There was no emotion in that shit.
There was nothing that made you cry.
Nothing made you have a little tear jerk.
Fresh Prince did get emotional.
That's all I'm saying.
But that took like five years, too.
Listen, you got to build.
You can't throw out the first four seasons of Fresh Prince.
Nah, you might have cried before that.
I cried at Pinky in the Brain.
Seinfeld couldn't make me cry once.
How are you going to make me cry?
The muffin tops.
Because Seinfeld.
I just like the top of the muffin.
That's a great shit.
Oh, shit.
We all like the fucking top of the muffin.
So why don't they just sell the top of the muffin?
It's not how it works.
It's like your bread point.
See what I'm saying?
It's not how it works.
Seinfeld is the Socrates of our generation.
He's asking the questions.
It's not how it works.
He's asking the questions.
Fuck Socrates.
Real time.
Right?
This is Socrates.
What's the deal with thinking?
Come on, Mark.
Hit me, Mark.
Hit me, Marston.
All you don't do is ask questions, old red pill-ass motherfucker.
Seinfeld's just red pill in everyday life.
He is.
He really is, dude.
Come on, yo.
It's okay to hate Seinfeld, man.
Why you got such a problem with shows named after your own last name?
What's that?
Schultz?
Wait, I like that.
Yeah, so why are you hating on Seinfeld?
That's where you got the idea from.
That's not even his real last name.
What's his real last name?
Not something.
Something not Jewish.
He's not even Jewish.
All the reason to like.
Seinfeld pretends to be Jewish.
You don't know that?
That just makes me love him more.
Seinzo's not actually Jewish.
Sounds familiar.
Hit it, Mark.
I'm like, I'm fucked.
Oh man.
Oh fuck.
It's all good, bro.
Come on, let's go.
Let's get back to this, man.
Oh, yeah.
Why don't you get back to something?
Wow.
You keep me in the trash point.
Imagine hanging on Seinfeld.
Imagine hanging out.
You just got to deal with that all day.
Yo, keep passing the scissors.
Scissors?
What's the deal with the plurality?
I mean, it's just one thing of scissors.
Why is it a pair?
Because it's the two things.
What do you mean it's the two things?
The two pieces of it.
So each one of those things is a scissor.
I'm terrible.
You know how annoying Seinfeld would be to hang out with him.
Can't be as annoying as you trying to do Seinfeld.
This is what Seinfeld does all day.
Yeah, but he doesn't good.
I'm not hanging out with him.
I'm watching the show.
That's the best parts of it.
The bread.
Bro.
You had a banger with bread.
I don't know why you kept tagging me.
I did.
I did kill that bread boy, did I not?
Yo, Angie's going to go home like Bart Simpson and just write Seinfeld over and over.
Scissor Logic Explained00:02:11
He's like, I'm taking this motherfucker out.
I told you my list is growing.
I told y'all this.
Nah, but for real, though.
Let's talk about the B movie.
Come on, Jordan.
Let's get back to you.
Oh, bro.
All right, let's go.
What were we talking about?
Yo, you know, I realized watching this documentary?
Reggie Paul, Reggie Miller looks like RuPaul.
Ever seen RuPaul out of dreg?
Tell me that ain't the same motherfucker, yo.
And I'm a Reggie fan.
Y'all, I love Reggie.
But damn, you see RuPaul not RuPaul?
What his real name is?
Rupert Paulson or whatever?
That motherfucker look like Reggie.
Yeah, they got a similarity.
It's crazy, right?
Yeah.
Holy shit.
I did not know that was RuPaul.
I've seen that.
Son, I respect Reggie Miller for never fixing his teeth, bro.
That motherfucker looks so horrible.
Yo, he don't give a fuck.
He really don't.
He's single out here living.
He just be with hoes all the time, apparently.
Really?
Yeah.
But like never fixing his teeth?
Never.
It's fucking crazy.
He's crazy confident.
He wanted, you know, I remember when he retired, they asked him, what's your biggest regret?
And it wasn't that I didn't win a championship.
He said I only got to play MJ in the playoffs once.
That's my biggest regret.
That was such a competitive, fun series.
I wanted to keep doing that.
I wish that was a rivalry.
Like, that's some, he's not like, he's a confident competitor.
Super.
He wants that shit.
All players are different because Anthony Davis with the Unibrow shit, like, these motherfuckers, they just, they get to a level of, oh, I don't give a fuck.
I get that also because you get so much positive feedback.
And pussy.
So, like, what's the, I'm already frowning and pussy.
I'm fucking any girl I want.
Why would I pluck my Unibrow?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Nah, I think there's a, it's interesting when you get into these documentaries because like, obviously, if you're a journalist, you want a hot take in these documentaries.
You want to be known as the guy who like saw something no one else saw.
Right.
And there's this one guy in the documentary.
I forget who he was, but he says this shit.
Shit made me crack up.
He goes, you want to know what made the difference with MJ?
You want to know what MJ's superpower was?
It wasn't running fast.
It wasn't jumping high.
He could stay in the moment.
Comedy Curse Unveiled00:03:13
Maybe he was a little running fast and jumping high.
Right?
Maybe that had a little bit to do with it, you think, buddy?
Staying in the fucking moment.
How many Hari Krishna's we got in the NBA?
Staying in the moment is the thing that separated him.
Get the fuck out of here, bro.
I think it's the thing that separates him from LeBron.
But at that point, you're talking about two, they got everything else.
I need y'all to explain that to me.
What the fuck does that even mean?
Stayed in the moment.
I think this is what he was trying to say is, is that he's not letting the consequences of his actions or the fear of them dictate his choices.
For example, I just missed my last seven shots.
Should I shoot this?
I'm having a bad game, et cetera.
Every time he shot was a new fresh roll of the dice.
Every time he decided to play D was a new fresh roll of the dice.
Every time he decided to do something, he was in the moment right there.
Whereas a lot of guys, for example, like they say, cornerbacks in football, right?
It's like they get beat a couple times, their confidence is destroyed, and that position is all confidence because you're thinking about the past.
Oh, I got burned.
Oh, what if I get burned again?
Every one of us gets in our head, and it's always some shit that's not about right now.
So, your ability to be in this moment right now, maybe it's just because I'm Hindu and that's like such a big part of meditation.
Yeah, fair.
So, maybe I'm gay, but that's like I understand that's a huge deal at that level.
Now, you have to have everything else.
So, for him to say, like, it's not jumping.
Why would you call it gay?
Oh, god, damn it.
I can't fucking do this anymore.
Mark, stop it.
I'm remotely saving this.
Let him drown in it.
Gay means happy.
If someone put a dick in my ass, I wouldn't be happy at all.
B movie.
It's bad.
I can't do it, y'all.
I can't do it.
I'm just chuckling.
It's all good if y'all love Seinfeld, bro.
It's all good.
But what I'm doing is honestly, according to the creative genius.
Like, that was what I just did with Seinfeld.
Did I mean, he would do it without cursing?
He'd be like, if you slid something in my rectum, Mark, Mark, come on.
Guys, you can't curse.
It's not comedy if you curse.
Did you know that?
You know, it's not comedy if you curse.
Did you guys know?
You know, he loves Chris Rock, though, right?
Does he?
Yeah.
Does he?
I remember on Talking Funny, he said he thinks about some Chris Rock bit once a month, and it was about black porn.
It was the black ones or N-words.
He's like, What do I call my neighbors?
He actually said about Chris Rock's porn joke.
He's like, That's the first time I realized black people have like an entirely different world that they live in, and they're not that happy with it.
And that was a funny way to say it.
Interesting.
He thought black people were happy in the world that they were living in.
The guy grew up in Long Island in the 70s.
He didn't know.
He grew up with white people.
Stay woke, bro.
Stay woke.
Anybody saying Seinfeld is woke?
Say again.
Are you?
Do you not like Seinfeld because he's not woke enough?
Son, I only like woke people.
My favorite comedian is Sean King.
Woke Culture Debate00:14:51
You have any other points?
Come on, bro.
Sean King.
You know who's going to be funny?
Sean King or Umar Johnson?
Who's funnier?
That shit is tough, bro.
Those are two of the greatest social media comics of all time.
It might be Dr. Umar Johnson.
Real talk.
Shout out to the GOAT, the prince of Pan-Africanism or something.
Okay.
Yeah.
This is great.
Did you have any more notes on Jordan?
On Jordan?
Yeah.
No, but I have some Seinfeld stuff if you guys want to hear.
Let me tell you something.
The more that it bothers you guys, the longer we're going to stay in it.
That's just how this works.
Okay.
Oh, I love it.
You're killing it.
There we go.
You're killing his gold.
It's gold.
That gold sucks, yo.
Seinfeld sucks.
Let's get out of this.
Let's drew basically spit on your hypothetical pizza right now.
Yeah, that's exactly what he said.
I don't even know what that meant.
I'm on board, though.
Basically, it's the same thing.
All right.
Anything else?
Yeah, there's a few things I noticed.
One, Jasmine Jordan, kind of a joint.
Stop it.
Kind of a joint.
Stop it.
I got to pull her up.
I stop it.
You know, like, I can't wait to see you.
Stop it.
Sal turned it off.
She's on there fleetingly, so I could have been wrong.
And I didn't think she was worth rewinding, but I was like, is she kind of a joint?
Okay.
This is a discussion we should have on the podcast.
I disagree, but you guys can have the discussion.
I disagree.
First of all.
Fine-looking, fine-looking, sweet girl.
I didn't know he had a daughter.
Huh?
I know he had a daughter, so good for him for protection.
We did not hear not even a peep from his wife.
Ex-wife.
Or his current.
Neither of them say a single.
I want to, if you want to talk about a fucking maniac, who knows him more than the wife, right?
Yeah.
Think about that.
Who had or first wife or second wife?
First wife.
First wife, I get, but like, he's gone all the time.
Really?
I mean, yeah, he's on road trips.
You know what I mean?
He's training all the time.
He's gone all the time.
Second wife, this motherfucker, he's playing golf and then he's coming home and then he's playing golf.
And then, you know what I mean?
Like, there's nothing to, there's no road trips.
She was like bitching about shit, wasn't she?
Who?
The first wife?
The first wife.
First wife, apparently, they got married because he got her pregnant.
Ah, so it was kind of a, but then he had more kids with her.
Yeah, which is weird.
Do you think he just compartmentalized?
Maybe I'm wrong, but I think it's just like, ah, we're together.
Let's just keep fucking.
And let's just have more of a family.
And maybe she understood what it was.
She's like, I'll be with this guy.
We get along well enough.
And then when she got divorced, I think she hired a PI and the PI found all kinds of him cheating this and that.
And that's why her settlement was like, basically, what do you want?
Ah, so she basically blackmailed him.
She's like, I can ruin your image with all this information, or you can just give me what I want.
Yeah, I don't know exactly.
We're all speculating, but it was like a couple years after he retired that they were divorced.
And then from what I understand, he got her pregnant and that's why he was.
Low-key, I respect famous people that can get married at a young age, or at least when their wives are young, like 17 or something like Seinfeld.
And then, you know, just carry that all the way through until current day.
That's pretty impressive.
Maybe that's a trick.
You just got to get nice and young.
Yeah, goat shit.
You know what I'm saying?
Oh, she might not know that one.
Play like SpongeBob or something.
Oh, his first wife was kind of.
Juanita?
This is the first wife, right?
I think that's the second wife.
New one, right?
Is she Cuban?
This is her mother, I think.
Uh-huh.
This is Jasmine Jordan, and I think that's a mother right there.
No, that's not Juaniti, yo.
Jasmine, though.
She all right.
Yeah, she's cute.
She's cute.
She's all right.
She's cute.
It is interesting how genetics work, though.
Because both of his kids played college basketball, I believe, or at least one of them.
Yeah.
And they were okay.
Yeah.
I think Marcus played, and he was fine.
He was fine.
But like, you can't, that is the genetic.
When you talk about like the genetic lottery, it really is a lot.
It's a lottery, man.
That's what I'm telling you.
Isn't that amazing?
LeBron's kids, cool.
Could make it to the league.
They're not going to be LeBron.
He won the lotto.
You got the residuals of him winning the lotto.
But how dope is that?
Like, it's refreshing to know that you can't just kind of like breed two athletes and then all of a sudden a super athlete comes out.
Yeah.
There is some, what is it, chance in life.
Yeah.
And that you're dealt this card, these set of cards, and you have to do whatever the fuck you can with that hand.
But it's really nice to know.
Because if we started realizing, oh, shit, all you have to do is have sex with Jordan, kind of like horses, where it's just like Sea Biscuit has a kid and all of a sudden they run and then it's another.
But however the fuck your kids look and whoever the fuck your kids look and my kids and Mark's kids, who knows?
We all know what's going to happen.
And we can raise them and we can educate them and we can get them in the gym and we can make them eat right.
But there are certain things that they were just born with and they're going to have to figure things out with it.
It's really nice to know that.
The one thing is though Jordan married a regular girl.
He didn't marry like an athlete.
It'd be curious.
I'd be interested to know if he married like Jackie Jordan or Kirsty or whatever back in the day.
What would their kids be like?
So now you got two super athletes.
Now you have two super athletes.
There is a couple.
What is the name?
She had a 30 for 30.
She was like an amazing runner, and then she was on steroids.
Marianne Jones, yeah, she married Tim Montgomery, who was an American sprinter, who also I think might have had his own scandal.
They should technically have the fastest kid ever, right?
These are two elite sprinters.
Yeah, Steffi Graft and Andre Agassiz.
That's who I was thinking.
Half kids, yeah.
That kid doesn't even play tennis.
He plays baseball or some shit like that.
I think, but they were both like, you know, I think they were both like, we don't want him to play tennis.
Like, you don't want to play with him.
I mean, there's some societal pressure.
Imagine like every tennis fan waiting to see if you're going to be the truth.
No, I remember her and him and Pete Sambers had a big rivalry.
They both, their wives got pregnant at the same time.
They were already getting offers for like millions and millions of dollars for their kids to play at a certain age.
So it's just like, I'm not doing that, get the fuck out of here.
You're out of your minds.
So I think there's also that.
Bro, wild thing.
I used to play soccer with Pele's kid.
Really?
Yeah.
How sorry was that, motherfucker?
You playing soccer were you?
Yeah.
No, Mark was nice.
Mark was nice, but in America, if you're Pele's kid and you're playing in America, you're probably not crazy nice.
You're probably getting shipped off somewhere to an academy or whatever.
He was a nice kid.
Oh, boy.
Yeah.
That's a term we use in comedy for someone who's not funny.
Yeah.
He's a nice guy.
He's a nice guy.
He was really nice.
Oh, really?
That sucks.
And imagine a pressure that he has to be great.
Yeah.
And he's just fucking trash.
Yeah.
Now, was he objectively bad or was he bad for your expectation of Pele's kid?
I don't know.
I mean, I guess our is a little different, but he just like wasn't super athletic.
He was like, he also moved around a lot as a kid, so he didn't get like training.
How old were you?
Like 14, 15?
Okay, so they would have seen something in him by then.
100%.
You think that's why Pele moved to America?
He's like, I can't have people knowing how to shoot this kid in the soccer.
Let's go to a country there's no pressure on you at all.
He was high.
Be a fucking ballerina.
Who cares, dog?
Nobody expects anything from you.
And he was pretty good.
I think there was like some other things going on.
I don't know if he's like super athletic and like just like kind of privileged and stuff.
I think that played more of a role.
Privilege is tough too because there's no hungry.
It's hard to be hungry when you're not ever hungry.
That's why you got to respect a guy like Steph Curry.
Yeah.
My motherfucker wanted it because he wanted it.
He had every option to do anything else he wanted in life.
But I also think there's not as much pressure if your dad is Del Curry.
If your dad is Michael Jordan, it's like, what's the fucking point even trying?
Without a doubt, but still, like, financially speaking, he was funny.
Yes, 100%.
And he chose to go after that shit and become an elite shooter.
And granted, he had the best coaching and he had access to facilities and access to his father.
Yeah.
Right.
And elite competition.
Like, when you're in high school and you get to practice with the fucking Raptors or whatever team he was on at the time, or maybe he wasn't even on a team at that time.
But still, like, when you're around these guys, you get to shoot around.
I mean, of course, maybe that's why he developed that kind of like quick release.
He's playing against guys.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Playing against guys that are six, eight NBA players.
The only way I could get this shit off if I just hoist it.
That might be the ideal situation because you know who else is a kid of a ball player who wasn't great, but he ended up being fucking great.
Kobe.
Ah, so maybe the goal is you have a mediocre father, not mediocre, but a mediocre professional father.
Kind of like a fringe professional father.
A role player, pretty good, whatever.
That's what Del was.
I don't know what Jelly Bean and whatever he was.
I don't know how good he was.
But like, because here's the thing: I was just thinking about this.
If you're Michael Jordan's kid and you decide to enter the league, Bronny's going to face this too and respect him if he wants to go.
But like, if you're not better than your dad, who is the greatest player of all time or second greatest player of all time, you're a disappointment.
Yeah.
If you're not even that, like, if you're Jordan and you're anything less, if you're Jordan's kid and you're anything less than the greatest player of all time, you're not Jordan.
You're not your dad.
Can we talk about the Braun comparison?
Yeah.
Is there a much bigger gap now?
I think it's gotten skewed the other way.
I think we kind of forgot how great Jordan was, and now we're watching this.
And I saw some poll that I got sent where they polled everybody and who's better at like everything you could be better at.
Jordan won every single category, including better passer.
And that's just absurd.
Jordan is not a better passer than LeBron.
Jordan is better than LeBron.
And I think we remember, oh, yeah, he's definitely better when we watch this, but now it's getting too scooter.
Yeah.
I think there's no denying the fact that Jordan is way more competitive.
Yeah.
And that Jordan has far more control of the game.
And I think that's the knock on LeBron, at least for me, is that, yeah, he can play all the positions and yeah, he can do all this stuff and he's amazing, et cetera.
Amazing passer, facilitator, but he can't control the game the way Jordan can control the game.
Yeah.
And he can control it very well, but he can't do what Jordan does, which is I will just take over in the fourth.
Nobody else will touch the ball.
Nobody else needs to score.
I will make sure that I score.
And if I need to get the stops, I'll do that as well.
Yeah, it's kind of like that BJ Armstrong quote in the first three people where Jordan just kind of figured out how to win.
Yeah.
Well, he wasn't even playing the game to play anymore.
He just was playing to win.
Yeah.
And he just got it and saw the Matrix, basically.
Yeah.
It kind of seemed like that.
And LeBron's not quite there.
Yeah, I don't know if LeBron has the confidence in his offense that Jordan does.
Yeah.
I think LeBron has the confidence in his ability to get the best shot in the moment for his team.
Yeah.
I think he knows how to do that.
I don't think he knows how to get the best shot for himself.
So I think you see a lot of times he defers on these last second shots because that is the best shot.
The best shot is to kick it to whoever the fuck is in the corner, right?
But when you need a bucket, sometimes you got to hoist it.
You got to be the one that puts it up.
And of course, there's been tons of last-second shots that LeBron has hit, and we can go throughout history and find him and make a point for that.
Absolutely.
That being said, I think he's limited in his ability.
I know this sounds crazy, but the amount of moves that he has that are effective moves, I think he is more limited than Jordan.
More limited than Jordan.
He is many more moves than most people, but Jordan was unlimited, or maybe he had eight go-to moves that were all unstoppable.
Yeah.
I just think the gap is much bigger.
And I'm someone who was ready to hand over the keys to LeBron.
A year ago, I was probably saying on this very podcast, yo, it's on.
LeBron is the guy.
Yeah.
I don't see it that way anymore.
And granted, maybe I'm skewed by like this bias, you know, documentary, but I just can't, I can't give it to LeBron.
Do you remember why I said I was taking that conversation off the table?
Like a year ago, LeBron being the GOAT?
It was because LeBron went to L.A.
And we essentially knew this year he's mailing it in.
And I was thinking Jordan would never do that.
In this documentary, I feel so much more confident in that.
Even in his second year when Jordan got injured and they were ready to tank so he could get a lottery player in his second year, he was like, that's not how you play the fucking game.
We play to win.
That's what we do.
Yeah, if you're going to play, you play to win.
And that's like that, to me, that solidified.
And also that quote, as much as it was overblown and that's Jordan's superpower, I think that's the thing that separates Jordan from LeBron a lot also is Jordan has no fear of consequences.
And it's easier when there's no social media and all that.
But like LeBron seems to get in his head a little bit.
He makes the right basketball play, but he's calculating more than Jordan, it seems.
Jordan is, how can I be afraid of a shot I haven't missed yet?
How can I be afraid to miss a shot I haven't taken yet?
That seems crazy to me.
Like he's in the moment.
He's just living there.
Let's shoot.
Whatever happens, happens.
I think he'll go in.
Let's go.
LeBron seems to be thinking things through.
You know what it's like with football?
Peyton Manning and Eli Manning.
Peyton is a definitively better quarterback, but Eli, I would trust more on the last drive of a game.
Eli did it twice in the Super Bowl because to me, when I was watching Eli, he's not thinking.
He's just going out there and playing.
And that only really benefits you there if you're Eli and Peyton and Peyton is a fucking genius.
But Peyton was just always calculating.
And that's why I thought Peyton wasn't as clutch as Eli.
And I think it's a similar thing, but the talent gap is obviously much closer with Jordan and LeBron.
Yeah.
It's funny seeing LeBron's quote in his barbershop show where he's like, oh, yeah, when I beat when I came back from 3-1, that's when I became the GOAT.
Yeah, greatest of all time.
Like, it's just so funny watching him say that while watching these docs.
Yeah.
Like, shut the fuck up, son.
Not close, man.
And I understand because LeBron is how old?
30.
He's 36.
34.
35.
Yeah.
34, 35.
So he barely got to experience Jordan.
Right.
LeBron's watching this right now and learning a lot about Jordan.
Not saying he doesn't know who the fuck Jordan is, but I think he's actually learning about the greatness of Jordan, like a lot of younger people who are watching it.
They're like, oh, wow, I didn't know it was like this.
It's hard for LeBron to truly appreciate Jordan because he's not old enough.
We are barely old enough.
We only got to appreciate second three-pete.
If any of us want to sit in this room right now and be like, no, I knew he was the greatest, the first three-peat, you're lying.
You don't remember it.
You do not remember.
I remember thinking he was the greatest after flu game.
Because at his kid, I thought that was a good time.
Which three-peat was that?
Second three-peat.
No, exactly.
To your point.
Yeah.
So it's like, so LeBron younger than us by at least two years, right?
Yeah.
And these are formative years.
Like, the difference between like seven and nine is big.
Yeah.
You know, the difference between 16, 18?
Nothing.
Yeah.
Like seven and nine?
I could probably appreciate it because I appreciated it during the last two finals.
Yeah.
And how old are you?
I'm younger than LeBron.
How old?
LeBron is 35.
He's about our age.
And I'm 33.
Okay, so he experienced that three Pete.
He understands greatness from that three Pete.
Especially the second three-peat.
Not the first one.
Greatest Ever Sacrifice00:05:09
Yeah.
Because there was two years.
But I think that exposes a difference in mentality where LeBron at that point is like, oh, I'm the greatest ever.
Jordan was never like, oh, I'm the greatest ever.
It's good.
He was just like, I want to do something they haven't done.
And then when he did that, what's the next challenge?
He wasn't like, I'm sure he thought it, but we haven't heard him openly say, that's when I knew I was the greatest player ever.
Son, LeBron has openly said, I don't need to achieve anything more.
I'm good.
That's what you say when you say, I'm the greatest ever already after winning that championship for Cleveland.
But here's the thing.
Jordan to this day is like, it's maddening to me we didn't win seven.
Yeah.
That's the difference.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Jordan, the fact that Jordan will never be satisfied after winning the NBA Finals and hitting the game-winning shot of his final finals, he goes, There's still some daylight out here.
We can get some golf swings in.
Yeah, that was nice.
That's crazy.
Right?
Great point.
LeBron is still in his career going, I've accomplished everything I need.
Yeah.
Jordan hits the game winner.
He's like, let's go compete at something that I am never satisfied.
Bottomless pit.
Keep filling, keep filling, keep filling.
And the fact that LeBron is satisfied means he'll live a much better life.
He'll probably have a much better relationship with his family and his friends and everything.
LeBron and his wife seem happy.
LeBron seems like a great guy.
Got the fucking school.
The I Promise Academy or whatever I can.
It's all that.
This guy's incredible.
Jordan is a more incredible basketball player.
And there's a cost to being that incredible.
There's a cost to winning.
Jordan said it himself.
There's a cost to winning.
It's happiness in a lot of times.
Yeah.
Jordan don't look happy now.
Yeah.
It's maddening to me we didn't win seven.
That don't seem happy.
Yeah.
It's just great.
That shot of him sitting on his whatever that thing is bench.
Yeah.
He's on like the Thanos shot.
Yeah.
Somebody had a meme of Thanos, you know, at the end of, what is it, end game?
Yeah.
Not the end, but like midway through the beginning of the just great.
Yeah.
Just fucking great.
Anyway, anything else before we get out of here?
Let's see if I had any other shit ever.
I saw after the dock was over, like whatever show that comes on after, they had that WNBA player, Diana Taurasi.
Taurasi.
And she also said, like, oh, yeah, when you're that competitive, you're sacrificing your life.
Like she said outright.
Well, I don't know why she's not.
She's the greatest ever.
I guess in W.
Yeah.
She's kind of like a beast.
And so she says, like, oh, yeah, that's just you sacrifice your life.
Your life.
Entire life is sacrificed.
And I wonder.
You have that level of competitiveness.
I wonder if it's easier for them to sacrifice their life because they're sad in their life.
You know, like their life does not fulfill them in the way that basketball does.
So it's not a difficult sacrifice.
Whereas if you enjoy life, if you enjoy spending time with your family, if you enjoy the little things in life, it's hard to sacrifice because you're getting so much joy and the hole is being filled by so many other things.
If there was only one thing that could fill that hole for Jordan, which was competition, of course he's going to compete.
And of course he's going to lean into that far deeper than anybody else, right?
Because that was the only joy that he got.
Yeah, you're sacrificing more, but is it a sacrifice if that's the only thing that makes you happy?
And then you're telling these other guys who get happiness from all these other things, the fuck is wrong with you?
Why aren't you sacrificing?
They're like, fam, you're miserable out here doing this shit.
We love that shit.
You're not sacrificing nothing.
Matter of fact, it's the least sacrifice for you because you're miserable out there and this is the only thing that makes you happy.
We're the ones really sacrificing because we can get happiness out here.
We are taking away our happiness for this thing that makes you happy.
So maybe Jordan sacrificed the least on his team in terms of happiness.
Maybe all those other players sacrificed those years with him so that Jordan could be happy.
He should be grateful for them.
They gave away happiness, man.
In a short life, they gave that shit away so that Jordan could have his.
And was it worth it in the long run?
Absolutely, because you win rings.
But if you really want to talk about sacrifice, I don't know if he sacrificed more.
And I don't know how worth it it was in the long run.
If you could rather, if you could be LeBron or be Jordan, we would all want to be LeBron in terms of like, that guy seems happy.
Yeah.
Jordan, greatest of all time, seems miserable.
I think I'd rather be the second greatest of all time and live a great life because the time you're not playing is way longer than the time you're playing.
Jordan was pro from 20 to 40 with two retirements in between.
So what's that?
15 years?
Yeah.
He's going to live to be 70, 80.
That's 55 years.
You're just sitting there miserable for 15 years.
I don't know if that would make that sacrifice if I could be LeBron.
Three chips, did one for Cleveland, did everything he needed to do.
Bucket list, second greatest ever.
And the guy is think of, I was trying to think of other players who also have like that competitive or championship about them.
And Cristiano Ronaldo, he missed the birth of his twins because he was playing soccer.
I love it.
I love it.
Was it just a regular game, too?
Was it a league game?
I think it wasn't like a big championship, but it was like, just because, nah, the game is, this is where I need to be.
Discipline vs Dad Expectations00:09:24
He missed a birthday twins.
Why you got to be there?
You're not really doing it.
I'm holding our hand.
I kind of push back on guys being there for the birth.
I do.
You're a dick.
I'm not a dick.
What is going to happen?
You don't want to be there to see.
What's going to happen is your son is going to be born.
That's what's going to happen.
Yeah, but your son will be born.
Okay.
And then what?
You want to be there for that?
Okay.
I know.
Look, you got a problem.
No, that's not a problem.
It's not a problem.
It's like, look, it would be dope.
It would be dope.
You know who's not going to remember it?
The son.
My son.
Right?
So why be there the first year?
Say again?
Why be there at all?
You know what I feeling on parenting?
You don't got to be there until like three.
13.
13.
12 or 13.
You can't remember before 13.
Say again?
You remember your life before?
No, no, you remember it, but like, it's not really anything important or valuable.
Like, it's not real parenting for a man until like 12 or 13.
You know, I believe that.
100%.
I truly 100% believe that.
You're just there being a good example as a man, but disciplining and that shit, that's all mom until about 13 or 14, maybe even 15.
I hope you're sure he's listening right now.
100%.
I believe that 100%.
100%.
I'm not disciplining my kids.
I admire you because I think you might got the Jordan mentality.
I also worry about you because I think you might got the Jordan mentality.
So why would I discipline my kids?
My wife could discipline a kid.
We're not talking about discipline.
We're talking about being there.
No, I'm going to be there.
I'm going to be a dope dad.
We're going to go play catch whenever we want to play catch.
But if you do something wrong, your wife is going to...
My wife is going to handle that.
I don't need to be there.
Yeah, you said you're going to be a kid.
I'd be disciplined there.
Discipline my kid.
Yeah, that's fair.
That's a different conversation.
Why would I sacrifice my kid loving me?
But you said you didn't even be there for that first?
No.
Why would I sacrifice my kid loving me?
It's so funny.
You're going to be like, mom's a fucking bitch.
I'm like, that's all I'm saying.
That's what she's saying.
You know what I mean?
That's all it is.
So then we...
I'm telling.
Right?
Right, though, right?
Thank you.
Now, what if your kid does some annoying shit to you?
Like, he smacks you in the face.
No, no, no.
I look at my wife.
Come on, you want to let me know.
You know what that just slides in?
Come on, yo.
What kind of kid are you raising out here?
What kind of kid?
You're really going to be like, hey, hold on.
Let me go get mom.
Yo, go talk to your mom about what you did.
Why would my kid slap me in my face?
Because you're never there.
Yo, I'm there all the time.
Yo, you're all right.
You got a little personal party.
Sometimes you need a father and you're right there.
Wow, dog.
We need to make a phone call, bro.
Call Mr. Media real quick.
Jesus.
I'm going to be there.
I'm going to be around all that.
Right?
That being said, it's more responsibility on wifey for the beginning.
For the beginning.
Your dad really disciplined y'all at a young age?
Yep.
Yeah.
Yep.
Stop it.
My dad was the only one who did that.
Yep.
Stop it.
Bro, you never got spanked?
Say what?
You never got spanked?
No.
Clearly not.
Clearly not.
Do you see this guy?
Who gonna spank me, bro?
Who gonna spank me?
Why?
For what?
For what?
Think about it.
Like, your dad's really came down on you at a young age?
Yeah.
Yep.
You think your kid's gonna respect you when he does some fuck shit to you?
And then you go, let me go get mom.
And then your kid's gonna be like, wait, I can just do anything to dad.
He just doesn't care.
Son, son, this is what you do, what you're doing.
That's how you can teach your kid to be a man is he disrespects you and you say, honey?
This is why I yell crazy right.
You're gonna let him talk to me.
This is why I yell crazy right now.
You think that a kid is gonna do something disrespectful to me?
Yeah.
Nah.
How would he know not to?
Because I'm the dad.
He doesn't even know what that is.
Son, yes, he does.
He's never existed before.
100%.
I come around and you fucking know, Silverback Gorilla.
You know what I'm saying?
He can smell it.
When dad walks into the fucking house, you know what time it is, right?
When dad walks to your room, it's different than when mom little pitter-pat her.
And do you know why I'm afraid of my dad walking in my room?
Why?
Because he beat the shit out of me.
Exactly.
My dad never needed to do that shit to me.
It was easy.
Light work.
Just walk to the room.
But why were you afraid of him?
Because you weren't afraid of your dad, yo.
Say what?
You had afraid of your dad.
Nah, nah, I was afraid of my dad, bro.
Yo.
I was afraid.
I was fearful.
And he stuck fear in my heart.
He struck fear in my heart.
If he never did anything, I never disrespected.
And yo, you know what?
Some real shit?
Not only did I never disrespect my dad ever, not even a single time, not once in my whole life.
Anytime my mom and my dad would fight about some shit, I'd be like, yo, Ma, you need to chill the fuck out.
Like, real talk.
I don't care what it was.
I would take my dad's side a fucking heart.
But you're not as easygoing as your dad either.
Say what?
You're not as easy going.
Yo, can I be honest?
I think I like my dad more than y'all like your dads.
Let's be honest about it.
None of y'all pushing back.
None of y'all pushing back, though.
That's what I'm saying.
Let me tell y'all.
Y'all don't know about daddy strategy.
You can't have my conversation outside of Patreon.
I'm not saying this shit out like Patreon.
I'm just saying, my dad, whatever the fuck you got.
Whatever the fuck y'all dad's dads did and my dad's dad, my dad did in a way where my loyalty is to my dad till we die, bro.
Y'all be questioning your dad's.
No, I think you and Mark probably could tie.
Why fathers?
It's why fathers are.
Nah, nah, nah.
I like my dad more than Mark.
I like my dad way more, bro.
Nah, not even close.
I like my dad more than I like your dad.
My dad, that's true.
That's true.
That's true.
My dad barely remembers me.
I still like him more.
Real time.
Whenever he remembers me, I'm like, yo, it's lit, bro.
Today you're going to be like, let's talk about some shit.
Same because he's defying science.
That's the type of love he got from me.
Hey, bro, it's a different strategy.
It's a different daddy's strategy.
I'm telling you.
Y'all dads are busy disciplining you, and then y'all resented them.
You're like, ah, fuck this motherfucker.
My dad was like, yo, mom gotta handle that.
Y'all want to play cat?
I don't mind the discipline.
Ping pong, I don't want to discipline.
Son, ping pong played me left-handed so I could win.
You know what I mean?
Like, it's you can't.
That's how you dad.
But if your dad never did anything to make you fear him, why'd you fear him?
It's in here.
It's not about fear.
I don't want to let him down.
That's the thing.
You don't have to lead by fear.
My dad didn't lead by fear.
I didn't want to let him down, bro.
That guy, the fucking GOAT, that guy, always there no matter what when I need it.
Man, all right, I can't let that guy down, bro.
So he was your Steve Kerr, and our dads were Michael Jordan.
Oh.
You mean they weren't there for their kids?
Yeah, Harry was there.
Hey, hey, hey.
Hey, Jordan's shocking.
Real talk.
I'm saying, man, don't discipline your kids, bro.
Don't discipline your kids, bro.
What happens at 13 when you're like, all right, Charlie, whatever your kid's dumbass name is.
Every once in a while, you need to fuck some shit up, yo.
But my dad could do it without being like brutal.
Like, this is the thing.
And I realized his strategy.
My dad, anything that we wanted, he would always just go do.
Anything we needed, go do.
Doesn't matter, whatever it was.
And then when you did something that he did not approve of, that's where he closed off.
And he just had to shake his head.
Shaking his head, that's way, I'd rather you punch me in my face because I can heal from you punching me in my face.
I can't heal from me disappointing you.
The idea of like, I remember once we were in Barcelona, my parents came to visit, right?
My mom never visited me once in college.
The second I go to fucking Europe, she's like, we should take a trip.
Enjoy you up a little bit.
Right?
And I remember he was watching me play basketball.
And the idea of losing in basketball in front of my dad was like, I couldn't imagine it.
And I lost.
Guy flew all the way out to Barcelona.
It was a pickup basketball game, but we lost.
The Spanish kids?
The Spanish kids.
I was so fucking embarrassed, dude.
I was so, and my dad didn't care.
He was like, oh, it's just great to watch you play.
I could not believe the fucking levels of embarrassment.
He put that in me somehow.
I don't know how.
But I feel like that's the greatest, that's the greatest motivational technique, if you can do it, is making someone not want to disappoint you.
So, yo, you buying in the Steve Kerr coaching model?
What?
You're buying into the SS Steve Kerr coaching model.
It's positivity.
It's positivity.
Be there.
Do what they want.
Have a good relationship with them.
And then they won't want to disappoint you.
Don't ever compare my father to Steve Kerr.
Don't you ever do that.
That's the most disrespectful thing you've ever said to me.
I'm not comparing you to Steve Kerr's father.
Son.
Okay.
All right.
Let's table this for the flagrant.
Like, this is about tomorrow.
My dad remembered Jamil.
Yeah, we got a couple.
My dad remembered Jamil yesterday.
Like, I went to hang out with him.
So my dad is losing his memory if anybody listening, right?
And losing it.
And he's just having the most fun.
He's a perfect example of like just acceptance of life.
Steve Kerr Coaching Model00:01:55
Yeah.
Like he accepts that this is what it is and this is part of it.
And that's why he doesn't, he's not like frustrated and resentful.
He's like, yeah, it's a part of life.
And we're just hanging out.
And my dad remembered Jamil as my best friend.
And he goes, oh, shit, how is Jamil, man?
We got to have him come over.
And it was the coolest thing because to like forget so many things, but remember somebody that was like, had a profound effect on like my life, but also just like someone that he really cared about and knew about.
Like, what a compliment.
I got to text Jamil about that.
But like, what a cool thing, right?
Like, your brain is only locking into these deep-rooted memories at this point.
There's no short-term memory, no new memories.
It's just the deep-rooted shit that's always been there.
Yeah.
It's like, fuck, what you did something, man.
Jamil, you fucking, you did something.
You affected that guy's, you know, life in a way where like he's just not going to forget about you until there's nothing left.
It's pretty cool.
Yeah.
Very cool.
Oh, my God.
All right, guys.
That's another episode.
That is the last dance.
Thank you for being on this journey with us, man.
That was so much fun.
And what a great series.
And we'll think about, you know, maybe doing more of these.
It's maybe doing more episodes.
It's obviously a very busy week for us.
And then once things start opening back up, we're going to be back out in the road.
But I like doing this more.
I think our chemistry has just improved.
And, you know, the more you do anything, the better you get at it.
So let's keep that as an open discussion.
Maybe we'll look at another documentary.
Maybe we'll look at another movie.
Maybe we'll just have another episode every once in a while.
You guys can be part of this decision as we always include you in our decision.
But we really appreciate you paying attention to this and spreading the word, et cetera.