Kkatamina and TinaKitten confront gender bias in gaming, citing Kkatamina's harassment in Counter-Strike and 100 Thieves' treatment of her knife-spamming clips as evidence of women facing higher scrutiny than men. They debate Riot Games' controversial commentator selection for Worlds, criticizing the exclusion of OG player Saikuno and arguing that slots should favor pros like Faker over entertainment-focused hosts. While reflecting on their shared history with Dota and Warcraft, they highlight how toxic online spaces silence female voices, ultimately questioning whether esports truly balances competitive integrity with inclusive storytelling. [Automatically generated summary]
Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Messing Around with Miyung00:13:29
Okay, we're rolling.
Wait, we are?
Yeah, I really wanted to wait till yesterday because I broke out like really bad.
Okay, you got to talk closer into the microphone.
That's just like we're oh wait.
Yeah, like one.
Joe Rogan says it's like the one fist rule, basically.
I mean, but you don't have to.
You can just like get up.
You can get up close and personal with it.
Yeah, that one, you need to crank it, I think.
You can just hold it down.
No, no.
You need to like, it's one of those things where you need like a screw.
Yeah, you need an Allen key.
Thank you.
An Allen key.
That's why we pay Marsh the big bucks.
And it will like redistribute the weight, I guess.
It's weird.
I don't know.
Some science, some science stuff.
So you said you were afraid because you were breaking out.
Me too.
Wait.
I don't see anything.
No, because I have a zip patch on.
Oh, okay.
I was going to put some on.
I have some like in the shape of like stars and Christmas keys and stuff.
I love that.
My young is playing Hearthstone.
My Young, we are literally recording right now.
Are you really?
Yes, that is insane.
Wait, hold on.
Okay, in all of them.
Listen, I actually cut pieces of hair in hopes that I could cover my breakout.
And it's just.
In all of my years of podcasting, this has never happened.
Where one of my guests just straight still, by the way, she's looking at me, but underneath the desk, she's still, but what are you playing?
Heartstone?
Yeah, Heartstone Battleground.
Let's go.
Oh, God.
No, it's not.
No, but I am also really good at multitasking.
No, I'm not.
I'm sorry.
I lied.
She didn't know.
You're a liar, too.
Maybe we can restart.
Yeah, maybe we can be restarted.
No, no, no.
This is great.
This is great.
She does this everywhere.
Okay, well, ladies and gentlemen, boys, girls, Zambies, this is a very special episode of Fear and Will is, of course, as always, not here because he had to go to a wedding or something.
I don't know.
Oh, it happens.
But it's a special episode because it's a ladies episode.
We heard a lot of you were like, yo, Hassan, why are there no ladies on the show?
And I was like, this is it.
Start.
You had ladies.
It's a joke.
I've seen like good clips of the Leslie one.
Leslie has been on.
I've had the second episode or third episode we had.
First episode we had Pokemon on.
We've had a lot of girls on.
Why am I defending this position?
This is what happens, right?
Like whenever someone asks you a direct question, even if it is quite literally just so far away from the truth, you end up defending yourself and then it looks suspicious.
Like it looks like I hate women now.
That's true.
It's like, no, no, no.
I have them on the podcast all the time, I swear.
And then anyone could just go like, oh, yeah.
Oh, I have a woman friend.
Like, oh, got it, dude.
Yeah.
It's messed up.
Anyway, Miyung, look up at the camera or just away from your phone.
There's cameras everywhere.
I'll concede.
You know, I just want you to know this is a big deal because I never concede when I'm winning.
He was like hot ones.
That's crazy.
Are you playing as other people?
How does that work?
Yeah, I am killing other people.
Now I got eighth place and I lost a lot of MMR for that, but that's okay.
But you lost?
She conceded.
You sabotaged the podcast.
Oh, I was about to say.
Okay, I didn't realize you could have just kept playing.
Honestly, I was just messing around.
Oh, my God.
I can't believe you were playing ranked when we had to go.
There's no option to play unranked.
That's crazy.
Okay, I've never played Hardstone.
But as I was saying, we got the ladies here.
We got the wonderful, lovely Miyung, also known as K Katamina, which I'll be asking you about with the reasoning behind that.
Okay.
And we have Tina, Tina Kitten.
Hi.
Yes.
Okay.
So I'm very excited to do this episode.
I had to basically beg Tina and also apply pressure on top of that from like multiple avenues to be able to get her on.
You guys don't understand.
You guys don't understand.
Tina is like...
Like we I feel like I have Bernie Sanders easier than Tina.
She's a busy gal.
It's not I was just like listen Okay, first of all you said Friday as if on a Thursday night and I was like tomorrow I don't like when people do that they're like like oh are you coming Friday?
I'm like hustle Friday's tomorrow like just say tomorrow.
That's like a little blanket statement so that you know it makes it seem like you're planning.
Yeah, I was I was planning very I was planning 24 hours ahead of time.
Yeah.
Which is a lot a many hours.
48 hours.
Like 23.
Well, okay.
Well, regardless, that was one thing that definitely made it a little bit more difficult to put this together.
But, you know, I'm only gassing this up.
I'm only juicing this so that they understand like how valuable this episode is.
Okay.
So without further ado, let me just get this out of the way.
You've been on podcasts before.
I have, but I think I'm like pretty bad at talking.
No, you're not.
That's crazy.
Everyone I ever meet that's like a Twitch streamer doesn't realize that like Twitch streaming literally is just podcasting for eight hours.
But it's a lot of stuttering when I speak.
You don't stutter?
I feel like I do.
I stutter.
It's in your head.
Yeah.
I use the word like a lot.
It doesn't matter.
I suck at speaking.
When I first started speaking, I was really, really disastrously bad.
And part of the reason why I actually started on Twitch was so that I could get better.
Really?
Yeah, at communicating off the cuff because everything I had done prior to Twitch was I said Twitter.
I meant Twitch.
Everything I had done prior to Twitch was actually scripted.
I would write my own scripts and I would do a green screen show.
So I had never talked about scripted.
I never talked about political stuff off the cuff.
And I'd done a couple debates.
I wasn't very good at public speaking.
So I was like, I think if I go live, have a place that I can call my own, like a community that I go live at every day, I'll be able to get better at speaking off the cuff, which I think I have.
Now I can't shut the fuck up.
That's a problem.
Wait, I think that's a good idea.
It's good ambiance.
Yeah.
It's better to speak too much than too little.
I think so too.
I disagree.
Or Twitch streaming?
But you guys are women.
That's actually what we're going to be talking about.
Oh.
Yeah.
The difference is in perception when you do something versus when I, a guy, does something.
But before we get into that.
Oh, yes.
This is the first ever podcast that Me Young's ever been on.
Is that true?
Yeah.
Wait, really?
You've never been on like even like an offline TV?
No, not a podcast.
What?
What?
I am a wedding a little bit.
Whoa.
That's crazy.
I am nervous.
I've never done this in my life.
Yeah.
I can tell because you refuse to speak into the microphone.
Is that a normal?
This actually makes so much more sense because whenever we play Valorant, it's like My Young's microphone is inconsistent.
Like, I don't know if she's going to have a microphone.
Her setup is the most egregious setup I've ever seen.
Let's rip into Miyung.
Talk about that first.
Your desk is this wide?
No, it's not.
It is.
And your mouse pad is almost bigger than your entire desk.
Half of it is like flipped over off the edge.
If you use the mouse, it's ramming into the monitor arm.
What?
It's like, it's so bad.
I literally started crying once when I had a power setup because the sun was beaming into my eyes.
She literally plays Valorant.
How are you so good?
I don't know.
I'm not.
You could be so, you could be goddamn.
Is this woman or my getting roasted?
It's a bit of both.
That's insane.
You are, you're like one of my designated carries when I'm like, I need to rank up.
Like, I got to hit up Miyung.
Because I know she's always going to, she's so, she's so consistent.
You just, you're very good.
Valorant is a video game that I like to play.
For those of you who are watching the podcast, we're like, why aren't you talking about politics?
We don't talk about the politics on the show.
You actually do?
No.
Oh, okay.
I never talk about politics on the show.
I'm just memeing.
But yeah, I've been playing a lot of Valorant.
As you guys know, I'm deeply addicted.
My Young is very good.
You're about to rank up higher than me, though.
That's not true.
I already D-ranked.
I literally D-ranked.
I'm Bronze 3 again.
Wait, really?
I keep playing without you.
That's what happened.
Oh, God.
You must have been devastated.
Yeah.
I keep saying, like, Miyung, let's play.
And then you just don't respond.
And then I play by myself.
Okay, that is.
That's also down.
I am tolerant.
That's true.
But now that I know you play, like, how big is this debt?
Like, is it as big from like here to there or smaller than that?
No, it's like it's like, no, no, it's like from there, there.
It's also like on little pegs.
Like, it's not sturdy.
Like, you could literally like rattle it.
Okay, Tina, tell me to stop, okay?
I'm going to start from that corner.
Tell me what you're doing.
It is smaller than your wingspan for sure.
I think it's like, it stops here.
From that corner?
Dude, okay, wait, wait, wait.
From the corner.
From this corner?
Yeah, like that's insane.
What are you in?
You're using the monitor arms.
The mouse rams into it.
Like there.
Well, you don't have to move the mouse that far.
If your sensitivity is like cranked up really hard.
Yeah, so she's like, I'll just jack up the sensitivity super high so I only need to move it a centimeter.
Like that's crazy.
Okay, that's insane.
I love hearing about setups.
What is yours like?
I need lots of space.
I use like the Carlby setup, which is like that walnut countertop thing that you buy from IKEA.
And then the two white drawers.
I like the way that looks.
It's also, you know, big, thick piece of wood, nice and sturdy.
And then all you rage and you death slam.
It sounds like it's got a lot of base to it.
Yours sounds like cardboard or like plastic.
I cannot comprehend why you still, you know, operate off of such small confined spaces.
No, no, no, no.
It's not as bad as she's making.
Her stream setup, she doesn't properly name anything.
It's all Mike 1, Mike 1, Mike 111, Mike 2.
I'm like, I was like trying to stream from her set.
I was like, Miyung, I can't do this without you.
Like, I need you here.
Wait, why?
I don't know.
Because I'm lazy.
That's so wild.
Yeah, I remember it.
Like, how many different things?
I just can't believe you thought I could do that by myself.
My young's like, Tina, I don't get it.
It's as of a three.
Like, what the fuck?
Streaming is good as that.
It's too much.
Mine's properly named all my files.
I'm like, this particular JPEG PNG, whatever.
I'm like, this file from this thing.
I can't.
I don't know.
You're too much for me.
What were your feelings before coming on the podcast today?
Especially as you've never been on a podcast, Miyung.
Let's start with you first.
Nervous, scared, anxiety.
Even now, I feel anxiety.
Tina's reaching out to offer a helping hand.
They're holding hands underneath the table.
It's very cool.
You needed that.
And now, how do I feel?
Nervous, scared, and anxious, but I'm holding Tina's hands a little better.
What about you, Tina?
Um, I guess I'm first of all, I just don't feel like I have anything insightful to say.
It doesn't have to be insightful.
This is part of the-podcasts to be, though.
You know what I mean?
90% of the time we're just talking about dicks and stuff and butts.
You do?
Yes.
Almost every episode, there's a mention of penises that we have to, we just have to put it in there.
Oh, why?
I don't know.
It's just how it is.
It's just how it works out every time.
Penis.
Oh, not like that.
Like, we're just straight up.
Like, one of the episodes, we looked at Keemstar's uncensored boofing video where he like puts...
What is he puts like a car exhaust in his ass when you put something in your butt?
Yeah.
We looked at that.
I think he had like a dildo strapped to a railroad and he was just like bouncing on it pretty hard.
One episode, we looked at Antonio Brown's dick when he whipped it out in a Dubai pool, which was crazy.
Are these real?
Last episode.
Yeah, these are real.
Except for the Keemstar thing.
Allegedly, maybe not real.
Allegedly.
All legal intents and purposes.
And then last episode that we had with BB No Money, we looked at Eneli Chapa's missile.
He posted a photo of himself in a boxer with his penis.
You could just visibly see the outline.
Young is like, why the fuck did I agree with this podcast?
This is the worst thing I've ever good visuals.
Good visuals.
You're really descriptive about it.
Yeah, no, he has my man has a WMD for sure.
A WMD.
A weapon of mass destruction.
Oh, yeah.
Okay, you guys are learning a lot.
You guys are learning a lot.
You're picking up the lingo.
So that's basically what we talk about.
We talk about embarrassing stories, you know, what we've done, how our weeks have been, and what we're looking forward to.
But on this episode, it's a ladies episode.
Expectations for Female Gamers00:09:21
So I wanted to ask you guys.
So I wanted to ask you guys, like, what are some of your gaming moments?
Because you're both gamers.
What are some of why is that debatable?
Because I feel like I play all games at like a leisurely pace, you know.
That's insane.
You played stage the other day and you were cracked after not even playing.
Oh, just a little.
Okay, I was top frag for the first, what, five minutes?
And I was like, yeah, when it counts, when it counts, and it counts.
Does it?
It does.
Okay.
All right.
Don't sell yourself short.
I think you're selling yourself short because, and I think you do this too.
Partially because I think there's a different expectation.
Like, do you ever feel like you have to be above and beyond?
Really good at gaming as a girl, whereas like guys can just suck and automatically and automatically they're considered to be like, you know, probably decent above average.
I am one of the very few, very rare exceptions, because I'm not like a gamer first, where I'm a political commentator, so everyone expects me to suck.
But usually I feel like, especially with Valorant, which has a pretty high percentage of female players in comparison to other games online, other competitive FPSs, especially, that problem comes up more frequently.
Yeah, because I don't know.
I feel like if I perform bad, it's because all girls suck.
And it's not just because I, as an individual, you know, suck.
And so I'm like, oh, like, you know.
So I always try to like down, I always try to emphasize the fact that I like do not play the game at all because I'm like, oh my God, I don't want to like represent everybody poorly, even though I shouldn't feel that expectation, right?
But I remember like 100 Thieves, they posted, they're like, yo, can we like post this clip of you playing Jet for the first time?
And I was like, okay, sure.
And it was just me spamming all my knives into a wall and then killing the state.
Were there for that right, but they were like, you know, obviously I was joking and I was just like playing around and like throwing stuff, but like all the comments were like woman moment, woman moment, i'm like woman moment, really like okay, because like I feel like if a guy did that, it would be like lol, that's so cruel, lol.
So, you know, like it's it's, I do that all the time and that's what I was saying.
So I was like oh, like it kind of just sucks that like that's the expectation.
You know that it's like if also, I just feel like there's always um, I don't know, like I feel like women aren't allowed to joke about certain things because they're always how like well, just like trying to think.
I think men are often given the benefit of the doubt in terms like like when you see a guy and he does something really dumb, he's obviously joking, but like a girl could do the same exact dumb thing and it's presented like oh, she must be serious.
She's so stupid when she's also just joking, and I feel like that happens a lot.
What is a dumb thing that you've done that people have misconstrued and thought was genuine?
Um, it might be like a lot.
It's.
I can't think of like a particular scenario, especially because I feel a lot more cautious these days but, like you know, when you just like throw silly jokes or like pretend to like not know something, people like take you very seriously and you're like wait a second.
I can't reference a specific time, but I just know like generally that's something that happens a lot, not just to me, but like a lot of other girls.
I don't know what about you myung, do you feel pressure meang's, like I don't give a fuck, i'm just cracked.
I don't even care, i'm not cracked.
No one ever says i'm bad because i'm just all the time.
Yeah, she's like, uh Tina, have you thought about getting better to?
I have to defend, to defend women better on the internet.
I'm not even not me.
She said that.
No, look at me.
No, last night I was going against Hardbox Mega 15.
That's actually really good.
Yeah, that's really really good.
I was watching cartoons on the second monitor.
Maybe that's why it's like Better Will claim he has porn on his second monitor.
That helps him actually like focus more on the game increases testosterone levels.
No no, just like it.
I think he says he, like laser, focuses on the game and then sometimes it's like a little treat, like if he, if he gets killed, instead of tilting he just looks at porn for a second and then he's back in.
I don't know if I believe it, but that's what he's.
I don't know if I would reward bad performance with a treat.
Well, instead of oh, that's good, you're right Tina, 100 thieves Valorant coach.
We're outing her right now.
Actually 100 thieves.
New Valorant coach is Tina Kid.
Wait, actually wait, didn't 100 these Valorant coach recently, like leave or something I have, I I have.
No, he did because I remember joking about it, because I was like yo, 100 thieves, like it's okay, like hit me up, like I got you guys, um.
So I remember something like that happening and that's because Tina is the new coach.
That's it first ever exclusive.
I don't think i'm like oh, my god, in tune with anything Valorant related, I will say I.
I think I'm like, more so the token Minecrafter, which is also an interesting, let's talk about that.
Why is it interesting?
Why is it interesting?
Negative connotation sometimes, depending on what community you're from.
Like what?
I guess like people, before we start on this, just remember.
A lot of people that are watching this are fans of mine.
Some of your fans are also going to be tuning in, but just always over-communicate because it'll be helpful because a lot of people don't know the context, the background.
Can I listen to this before it goes out?
Oh, whoa.
Absolutely not.
Oh, God, that's terrifying.
I feel like I have bad opinions.
You can't fuck up.
No, I'm kidding.
Of course.
I really have to like, my words are.
If there's anything.
No, no, no, no.
If there's anything you don't like, we can cut it out.
Plus the second part is going to be behind a paywall anyway, which is why like you can just, you know, fuck up as much as you want.
Hey wall.
But having said that, we can, we can cut whatever you don't want on here, but you're not coming across bad or mean in any way.
I would stop you.
Okay.
Okay, what were you going to say?
I also don't want to talk too much because I, I mean, oh, no, no.
She loves it.
Yeah, I love it.
I just, I talked way too much.
Okay, I will say, like, I feel like there is a negative connotation sometimes with like Minecrafters just because the audience generally is made up of like a lot of young, passionate girls.
You know what I mean?
And I think sometimes they are too scrutinized as a fan base just because like there are plenty of other obsessive men as well.
XQC fans, juicers.
Yeah.
Or, I mean, I don't like, I don't want to say any names, obviously, because I don't get it.
Say some names.
I can't do it.
No, every, every content creator, especially in our field, has a standem.
Okay.
Myself included.
And we definitely do have a different way of viewing people that are like Tyler Oneheads or XQC fans, even though they're quite literally stands, almost identical in every, in every sense of the word.
They have avatars on Twitter that are, you know, Felix.
There are photos of Felix.
They reply to everything that he says.
They're constantly monitoring his activities, behavior in the exact same way that stands do of other communities.
But because it's Felix, like people don't see that in the same way.
There's a different perspective on how, for example, K-pop stands are viewed and how Minecraft stands are viewed.
Because I think that a big chunk of those stand communities are predominantly LGBTQ and women, you know, women of color.
No, I agree.
I feel like whenever there's a large audience of women that enjoy something, it gets absolutely shat on.
Like you could take Starbucks, for example.
Starbies.
Yeah, like Starbies with the gals.
Like as soon as it became like a thing that a bunch of girls, like a bunch of teens, like all of a sudden it was like a music wasn't, yeah, you know, yeah, exactly.
It was like basic culture.
Or like, was, I feel like the Beatles had a very large like women fan base audience, but then like as decades went by, like more men started to like it and then they became cool again because it was more like, you know, I don't know, or any like major male celebrity with like one direction.
I feel like they had like anyone was, I don't know, they had like a large female audience as well.
Like just stuff like that, you know?
Women kind of run the show though in that regard.
Like when you have a large and cute.
When you have a very large active female fan base, they are they're zealots almost like they're diehard fans, which can get a little problematic from time to time.
But I think that that is what makes a lot of young artists.
Justin Bieber, One Direction, Harry Styles.
These are all people.
Well, I guess One Direction is Harry Styles, right?
Isn't Harry Styles from One Direction?
He was a part of One Director.
Resentment from Bullying00:04:05
I don't know anything about this sort of stuff.
Yeah, that was years ago in high school.
I don't remember.
Who were you a stan of when you were young?
I don't know if I was ever a stan of anything.
I think I was kind of...
I liked Faker when I was younger.
What about you, Mion?
We're going to get back to that in a second.
No, I didn't have one.
That's a lie.
No, it's actually no, no one.
You didn't like...
There was no artist that you were like, man.
Oh, man.
I wish that one.
I said faker.
Music or video gaming.
You didn't have like a favorite video game player, esports guy?
Not really.
Like, I could say there's like a team I liked.
Who'd you like?
For esports?
Like, SKT?
Yeah, but that's just like, you know, there wasn't like ever a specific player that I'd follow and be like, oh my God, he's the coolest person ever.
I have no idea what that means.
What's SKT?
What is that?
That's kind of crazy.
They're like, is it weird that I don't know that one of them is one of the best league teams ever?
Okay.
Oh, I don't watch any League of Legends.
World is happening right now in San Francisco, and I don't know anything.
Oh, SKT is also a phone company in Korea.
That's one of the major phone companies.
But also, unsurprising.
Yeah, that company also would sponsor one of our big wooden roller coasters at our Korean theme park.
But you lived in...
Okay, so you lived in Korea.
Really long time.
What was, how was that?
It was great.
I loved it.
And it made going back to the States really difficult.
I think I lived there for an accumulative 50.
God damn, that was a long ass.
I was 16.
You speak Korean?
No.
Okay, you know what had happened to me, though?
I was born there.
I was raised there till I was six.
Then went to the States.
So I spoke Korean when I was six years old.
There's like videos of me playing like hide and seek and I'm speaking like fluent Korean.
I'm like, wow, I can't believe that's me.
And then I went to the States and I moved to like Colorado.
I was the only like somewhat Asian person there at my school.
And then there was like a lot of micro macro aggressions, you know, like for being even a little bit different.
So I was like, okay, maybe I don't want to be Korean.
Like, you know, I was just like, that's it.
It's kind of like a lot of, it's a lot for me.
Like when you make, when they make fun of your like lunch, you know, I'm like, oh, this smells kind of weird.
It's not like a gorilla.
Oh, damn, you were busting out the kimchi?
I was, well, seaweed.
Like, you know, like little cumin rice.
I was like, ooh, scrumptious.
It's like kind of weird, though, because like now I feel like you do.
It's so trendy.
Yeah.
They'd be like, oh my God.
It would make me a little bit resentful because I just remember being like.
Yeah, now shit's popping.
People are like, K-pop.
I love K-pop.
Oh, my God.
You're eating Korean food.
Like, they almost fetishize it.
Yeah, which is another thing.
I feel like Korea is like pretty misrepresented and overglorified sometimes, but they do a lot of stuff, right?
Oh, I'm here for the Korea slander.
I will start.
Yeah, well, I just feel like a lot of, I don't know, a lot of, there's a lot of misogynistic problems in Korea.
Yeah, the current big boss is an incel.
Yeah, he really is.
I don't know too much about him, but I know it's just not good.
Yeah.
It's bad.
What do you think about Korean politics?
Korean politics?
Yeah.
I don't really keep up with any politics.
How was your upbringing?
Normal.
Okay.
What do you mean by that?
Did you get bullied?
Yeah, but who doesn't get bullied?
Kids are mean.
Yeah.
Never got bullied.
No way.
Lame.
I was a sign of getting bullied.
No, I'm kidding.
I was fucking bullied relentlessly and mercilessly.
It was terrible.
What happened?
Growing Up in New York00:03:28
What's the one thing that you can remember?
Do you ever get like racially charged things or no?
I don't have to talk about it.
Really?
I think if anything, I feel like girls are just super petty, especially when it comes to like middle school and like puberty and stuff like that.
School's hard.
I know.
It was so hard.
I would just hide away in my next period if there was like lunch or brunch.
Brunch?
Your school had brunch?
Yeah.
That's a fancy ass school.
What the fuck?
Is that like a private school?
No.
It's like 10 a.m.
You know, at 10 a.m., they give you like a 10, 15 minute break.
Where are you from originally?
Originally.
Wait.
Just call that break.
You called it brunch?
They called it 15 minutes.
That's weird.
That's not, that's not enough time to brunch.
As someone who brunches, no, I'm kidding.
That is not enough time to brunch.
Grew up in the Bay Area.
Woo.
Oh, damn.
That's why they have brunch.
Fancy.
That's the most of the time, everybody.
Yeah, they're making little kids drink mimosas at school.
That's right.
Okay, so you grew up in a Bay Area.
That's cool.
I mean, so you just have not left California.
Yeah, sucks.
Where have you traveled outside of the Bay Area in California that you liked?
New York.
I want to live in New York one day, eventually, at least for a little bit.
Why?
Because I want to experience all the seasons.
That's the whackest reason.
No, so whack.
That's so California.
It's an aggressive version of that.
Those winters are harsh.
Yes, and I'm there for it.
I want to experience the whole stuff too.
I cannot comprehend.
That is, I've heard this.
I've heard this from my aunt's sister.
They're Taiwanese.
They came to California and they lived in California for a very long time.
Right.
So she basically grew up here.
She moved to fucking Chicago.
And I was like, what are you doing?
Like, why are you moving to Chicago?
She's like, I want to experience the seasons.
I was like, that's stupid.
Is it going to be a good one?
That's crazy.
Yeah, she loves it.
She's like, oh, it's snow.
I'm like, that sucks.
Especially because I came to California for the exact opposite reason where I was like, yo, I saw all the seasons and I decided like one is good.
I get a really bad season of depression.
Yeah, because if you've already experienced it, then it's like you kind of want the opposite.
Like that's me.
Like I've experienced all the good weather.
Now I kind of want to experience crazy weather.
That's just low lows to experience how good it is over here.
Yeah.
But I do feel like people that grow up in California actually end up loving that shit.
And I just, I mean, hey, more good weather for me.
Okay.
You guys move away.
Okay.
You go, you go live in New York for a little bit.
I will.
See how you like it.
I like New York a lot.
I like New York too.
It's fine.
I love New York.
I like cities.
I hate how wide open LA is.
Yeah.
I'm a city boy.
I grew up in cities my whole life.
Istanbul, Ankara.
And then I came to America.
I lived in Miami.
And then I went to New Jersey.
And New Jersey was like the first time where I was like, this is just straight up not a city.
And I did not like it, but it was still college town, New Brunswick.
So that doesn't count.
It was still like, it was still walkable.
Right.
And when I came to Los Angeles, I was just in awe.
First CS:GO Experience00:15:16
Devastating.
Like a plaza to me is a plaza, not like a little circle of like Who says plaza?
It's the American Plaza.
I don't know.
It's like, it's like, I was so shocked.
It's just like a little small thing with like two lanes of parking and then like a couple stores that aren't even two stories.
Yeah, that's wow.
You have to drive everywhere here.
I miss clean public transportation.
You can't get that in America anywhere, though.
You're not going to get that in any city.
It's so heartbreaking.
I used to use, I mean, that's why I don't know how to drive.
I'm 24.
It's because like even when I turned 18, 19, I was like, there's no point in me learning how to drive because then I have to park when I can just take a taxi for $3 that's already parked in front of my house or take the bus for $1.20 and it's like pretty clean.
And I have a cute little subway card that had Snorlax on it because they just, you know, they...
This is in Korea?
Yeah.
They have like Korea goes through like phases.
You know, they have their phases.
Right now it's croissant waffles and I don't know what else, but they had like a really big Pokemon phase.
So all they had Pokemon subway cards and like Pokemon plushies and all the crane machines.
Korea is capitalism on overdrive.
I know we're not going to talk about politics, but I do feel like Korean culture is, South Korean culture is impossible to remove from like, you know, American capitalist culture where they true.
Like being there, it was surprising.
I went back recently after not going for like three years to visit family and it was shocking to see stores that were still there.
Like everything felt so different in a three-year span because as soon as a store isn't trendy anymore, as soon as like there's a particular like all the clothing items change, like drinks will get phased out.
Like right now it's Einspanners, which is like this coffee with a thick foam on it.
I hear it was like a coachman's drink where like the coffee wouldn't spill because it had like the thickest froth at the top.
That's like a popular, but like as soon as something's not popular anymore, the entire building gets like bought out and changed.
That's crazy.
It happens fast.
Yeah.
I mean that makes sense.
There's no there's no permanence to anything.
I okay, I have I have more questions specifically directed towards Me Young here.
Yay!
First podcast.
How are you feeling so far on the podcast?
As your first podcast experience goes, all you've been doing is picking up lint from a freaking microphone.
Maybe if I had a lint roller and then it wasn't like Tina's is bothering me right now.
I really want to like switch spots with Teenas.
I just think she's like over there.
This is a first ever.
This is the first ever for your end.
Ladies and gentlemen, we've never had the guests switch spots.
Mine is absolutely spotless, though.
Yeah.
No, thank you.
We can switch spots later as well.
You can pick these ones as well.
You're like a cat.
No, I'm not.
Have you heard of this?
This is like bothering me.
Have you ever heard people say this?
That you resemble a cat?
No, no one's ever said that.
They think I resemble more of a lizard.
A lizard?
A lizard person.
What is a gaming experience that you felt like you had where people were undermining you because of your gender?
It's the hot seat.
That's why.
You guys switched over?
You're in the hot seat?
Oh, well, I do think there was this one time, or maybe like two times now, but I genuinely just like to play games for fun.
And there was like a moment when I was playing Battleship with Saikuno.
And I've never played Battleship in my life.
And I obviously like arranged my pieces to be very like silly.
Like I didn't put any effort into it.
I thought I made a cute little like circle shape.
And then I saw like a clip on YouTube where like the entire comment section is like roasting me because like I even emphasized in my stream like I don't know how to play.
I'm just going to play for fun.
And I had a good time.
The comment section was really, really mad that I didn't know how to play.
They're like, she's so dumb.
How could she not pick it up?
But I feel like if I did the exact same thing as a guy, I wouldn't be getting those comments.
Charitability.
You feel like a lot of the gaming space is more charitable to guys being goofy and having fun than they are to girls because when you're a girl and you are goofing off, like you mentioned, people immediately assume, oh, it's because you're a dumb woman.
Yeah.
It's true.
You phrased that way better than I ever could.
It took me like 10 extra sentences.
You're ridiculous.
And you're doing it right now.
You're literally constantly apologizing for your commentary when your commentary was perfectly apt.
It was astute.
It was great.
But you are conditioned into apologizing for it.
Ridiculous.
Don't do it.
I read something that said, oftentimes women say like a lot because they're so used to being cut off that they have to use a lot of filler words like like um, to let people know that they're still talking so that they don't cut them off.
I think it's true.
I cut everybody off unconditionally.
I do it on accident.
I, I do cut people off a lot.
I, I have adhd.
It's like really hard for me to pay attention to something unless i'm like hyper focused on it.
And then when i'm hyper focused on it, when i'm in the zone, then I just, you know, I just channel everything out.
It's really bad, and then people think i'm an asshole for it.
Well, I heard that when people with adhd do that, it's just because they also just feel like they're being engaging in the conversation.
They don't mean to like cut people off, you know.
It just means that they're like really paying attention and they want you to pay attention by also like contributing your experiences to like what they're talking about.
So I feel like when people do that, i'm just like, oh, they're excited, like I kind of do the same thing.
So I don't really I don't really think anyone's like an asshole for it.
What are some upcoming projects you guys are excited about.
You're playing Minecraft.
You're playing Minecraft as well in the tournament.
Oh yeah Mcc, we're on the same team.
There you go.
I'm terrible at minecraft, so bad really.
Yes, because you're a girl.
That's why who else is on the team?
Because it's four players, right?
Yeah, so it's me foolish.
Young Saikudo nice okay, who are you guys going?
Underdogs event?
So everyone in that event has to have never won before.
That's kind of that's crazy.
Okay, because last time it was all stars and I think it was like winners all return and everybody.
So this year it's like underdogs.
That's kind of.
That's kind of fucked up.
They're like, hey, it's awesome though.
Hey lay masses, get in there, get in the piece.
This means I have way more of a chance than before.
I don't think it's canon, though.
How does that work?
For those of you who don't know at home because I totally do i'm a big fan, watch it all the time, play Minecraft every day.
How, how would that work if I didn't know, explain it to me, like i've never heard or played Minecraft, so you could just tune this all out, since you've, like you, already know that.
Yeah yeah, you know.
I feel like you know what Mcc Yeah, extent.
Explain it.
No, no, no.
Tina would be better at it.
No, no, no.
You got this.
No, I'll pass it.
We both want you to do it.
We both want you to explain it.
No, you want to be passing it.
Here, I can help you out a little bit.
Okay.
There's an assortment of games, right?
Like an assortment.
What is it?
Like nine or ten?
Oh, God.
A good chunk of games.
Each game gives you a certain amount of coins.
Poins.
Coins?
I said points at the same time.
Oh, we're going to cut that out.
Cut it out, cut it out.
Please.
I'm articulate, I swear.
Yeah, you get points for every game.
And then basically the team with the most points at the end wins.
So you kind of like the first game has the least amount of points.
And then there's like multipliers as the games progress.
Oh, I didn't know that.
Yeah.
So if I don't want to play your worst games first.
What are the games?
Because Minecraft, if I had only played it like one time and died of lava and then never played it again, if I was like that, which I'm not, of course.
I'm cracked.
I killed.
Yeah, I killed the ender dragon all the time, like in my sleep.
Did I say the name right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Spoiler alert.
That's the end of the game.
And I know how to do it like really good.
People are always, many people are saying, like, you're so the best at it.
Anyway, but if I wasn't like that, how would you describe the games?
Because it's just, you're just kind of like running from creeps, going to a village.
Is it sandbox?
How are the games?
So the version that you played is like survival?
Like vanilla survival worlds where there is there could be an end of the game if you wanted to, but you could also just build houses and farm if you wanted.
But like these games are like they take the you know the building blocks of Minecraft and then they make like mini games out of it.
So there's one called like hole in the wall where you just have these like jelly blocks coming at you and you just try to fit your character within the holes as it like passes.
There's literally like a game show, like an in-real life game show that's like that, right?
Where there's a big platform coming towards you and you have to like try to squeeze into the hole.
There's that one.
That's funny.
They have one that's kind of like Fortnite where it's like the circle like gets the BR?
Yeah.
Then the circle gets...
You have guns?
You have Bow and Arrow.
Are you cracked with that?
Are you good?
No.
Yeah.
I feel like she's lying.
Well, she's, I don't think she's played this version before.
So we have to study up.
Yeah, we do scrim tomorrow.
We do?
We can scrim tonight.
We can?
Yeah, we gotta practice dude.
Yeah, I'm down.
Yeah, so they have like a little battle royale format.
They have like games that utilize how well you are at like crafting and building.
Like you try to like remake a build.
There's just a bunch of stuff like that.
So.
Okay.
So you guys are not winning.
That's what's going on.
Well, foolish is good.
Whoa, whoa, whoa.
It's pretty good.
I'm trying to agitate you into like getting excited and being like, no, I'm going to freaking do it.
I'm going to beat everybody.
Well, that's just slander.
We would never, you know, which team are you guys looking to just absolutely stomp?
There's Ray and Ludwig's team.
Oh, they're done.
Okay, there you go.
We're rambling.
They're cooked.
Well, yeah.
Is it like, because I always assume like teams you on that team as well?
Yeah.
I assume that if you're like a known person outside of Minecraft, you're probably the best at Minecraft, but I don't.
But from what I understand, Jack Manifold once told me that that's not the case.
No, it's not.
Some people get surprised that I'm like, some people that don't know anything about Minecraft assume that I'm good at it.
Yeah, me.
I am those people.
Yeah, I'm not.
I'm really incredibly surprised.
just because a lot of my friends are Minecrafters.
I'll never forget 100 Thieves.
Oh my God.
Love them.
But Jesus, they literally said, welcome Tina Kitten and put it in Minecraft font.
And I was like, Minecraft?
I was like, wait a second.
I'm not like, I was like, no, it's fine.
It's like Minecrafter, Dina.
Let's go.
It's true.
I played a few times.
Do you ever feel like you don't use your voice in Valorant or in other competitive games online specifically because people are going to say like, oh, you're a girl?
Yeah.
This is something I've heard a lot from people.
And it was surprising to me when I first heard it because I love talking.
I love yapping.
I'm a big yapper.
Whenever I go on, I'm like, yo, what's up?
Does anybody have a mic?
Let's talk.
I play it anonymously, but people still figure out who I am from my voice sometimes, which sucks.
But other than that, like, I love, you know, seeing what people are up to.
Unless it's little kids and which is specifically why I didn't start playing Valorant for a very long time.
Because comms?
Well, so I tried to play CSGO back in the day.
I remember I tried to like get on and play with friends and I had never played CSGO before.
I had never used voice before.
So literally, this is my first ever experience.
I joined the game and I'm like, it was just Deathmatch 2.
Wasn't even like a real game version.
And then I just go in and then instantly I just start hearing like, is that a girl?
And then like literally like a mouth breather.
I was like, I was like, and then I just stopped talking because I was like mortified.
And then he was all, he was just saying like the most like, he was like, I don't know.
Oh my God.
It just makes me so uncomfortable.
What was he saying?
He was like, he was like, oh, I'm going to lick your asshole.
Like, it just sounded so creepy.
I don't know.
It was creepy, right?
But I was like.
Do you have anything like that?
No, I don't talk ever.
Dude, but I was so mortified.
I was also like, I don't know.
I was like maybe 16 or something.
I was like, all right, I think I'm never going to speak to comms again because that was just like, it was too much.
And I also just never played CSGO again.
I was like, I'm never touching this game.
Like, this was crazy.
This game is full of like nasty ass people.
And then like, I was like, oh, Valorant's similar to CSGO.
So I'm just, you know, not going to use those comms.
And I see clips all the time where it still happens.
I don't think it's as bad as CSGO, though.
Yeah.
There's definitely some games, like some competitors are just like, it's really bad.
I think that the larger the male player base is, the worse it gets overall.
It's hard to deal with.
It's hard to combat from a developer perspective, I think.
You know, people report, but that only goes so far.
And yeah, this is, these are some of the things that I've heard at least from my other friends that see this as like a big hurdle towards making it more accessible and open and available for everyone to play.
What can they do?
What would you fix in gaming?
Man, I really haven't thought about it that far.
Like, that's kind of a hard problem to solve.
Like, cause it's just the culture behind it all, right?
And then it's also like, some of these people were raised in barns.
Like, I don't know.
They're like, sometimes it's like not really what you can do with the game if they're like at home.
They're also saying this stuff, you know?
It's like you can't make people like stop saying bad things.
It's just, I don't know.
I will say Valorant feels a lot more approachable in terms of comms just because there's a lot more women involved, you know?
And they're also, a lot more humanized too.
I think Riot just does a good job at making games that you want to play.
Let's calm down.
Well, wait, wait.
Let's calm down.
Argument though, every time Star Guardian comes out, that skin line, I'm in.
I didn't play that game for like a year, but Star Guardian came out.
Literally, magical girl skinline.
Secrets of the Dota Community00:05:16
I'm in.
I have no idea what that is, but I stay away from MOMA's.
I was deeply addicted to MOMAS when I was in high school.
Yeah, I played Dota when it first came out.
So I was like a like, I was like a pioneer in the MOBA space, I would say.
No, literally, when it first came out, I was in high school.
It was like, I guess, you know, what is that?
It's like 2005, 2006, like around then.
I was eight.
Yeah, I'm 31 years old, right?
So I, that was when, you know, I was playing Warcraft.
I loved RTS games.
And my friends were like, yo, everybody's playing this thing, like this, this mod.
Because Dolta Defense of the Ancients originated as a Warcraft 3 mod.
Wait, really?
Yeah.
I didn't know that.
And League of Legends is basically the entire MOBA system is built off of Dota.
And I think there was another MOBA game, I guess, like around the same time, but it was a map.
Like it literally was just like a random map.
All the characters in Dota are actually Warcraft characters with different names.
And that's how the Tower Defense MOBA started.
Wait, that was really informative.
Thanks, Hassan.
Yeah.
And I used to play it all the time.
And I still remember, like, I would just like I tilted in Valorant.
Like, oh my God, that Dolte is a different demon for me.
So I, I, one day in high school, I decided I'm never going to play it again.
Why?
This is just like ruining my life.
It is, it did ruin me in high school.
I could not stop playing.
League.
Oh, yeah, same.
Yeah.
It ruined me.
Oh, my God.
Speaking of League, Worlds is happening.
I don't know anything about League.
And I always shit on League regularly on purpose.
It's like a meme in this community.
League of Legends, for those of you watching at home.
And Saikuno is the NA commentator.
Yeah.
This was a relatively controversial subject.
Yes.
You guys are both friends of Saikuno, so am I. What do you think about it?
I had some choice words the other day.
I just get pretty mad when people.
First of all, those five slots, they could make as many as they wanted to.
Yeah.
Like, that's like the illusion of scarcity there.
They're like, how dare they give that limited spot?
I'm like, there's the Riot's the one that made it limited.
Yeah.
And they did it specifically so that everyone watches the main account.
So their sponsors, so they can, you know, charge whatever they want, and it's also like I feel like anybody that's like getting really upset or calling him like, does he even play league?
They're self-reporting.
I'm like okay, have you touched the game in the last like two years?
Like Saikuno's, like an OG League Of Legends player.
That's what I said too.
I said I said that he's like not only a league player, that was his original game, even I know this.
And also he was like a league video maker, like he was making video essays about I was watching Saikuno in high school.
That's crazy.
Yeah, so the thing is like yes, I was like I've I've played league since, like God, it must have been like 14 or something, 10 years.
So, like I was like Like, I've known, I've been known, and like, I just feel like, I don't know.
Like, yes, they could have given it to like other people.
And I think, like, maybe they should have, like, you know, you know, maybe like recognize a few, like, notable League of Legends creators, right?
That are, like, currently doing a lot of league content.
Or pros.
Yeah.
I think that was a big argument.
It's like, oh, why aren't they, like, having pros, they should have pros do this.
Like, spectating and commentating.
But again, it's up to Rob.
I also say sometimes that's not what people want to watch, though.
Like, sometimes people want to see like a game that they like in the more like digestible, entertaining joke version, which is what people, like, again, not everybody likes the hyper-competitive version of esports, which kind of sounds ridiculous when you say it like that.
But some people just like, you know, games for more fun approach.
Like, me young and dying.
Yeah, exactly.
But I don't know.
Like, I also think it was just smart of them because why?
I mean, ideally, you want more people to see your game and more people to get excited about it, right?
And I would argue that not everybody that watches Saikuno right now is like really into league.
Like there are a lot of people that watch him because of GTA.
You're opening up into an entirely different market.
Yeah, I feel like that's smarter of them, but also like maybe a little they should also like maybe give a couple slots to pros.
But all I'm saying is like I get upset when just because somebody else gets an opportunity, it doesn't mean that they're the ones that need to be shot on.
Like if you were given that opportunity, you don't think like, oh, me, I'm taking up somebody else's slot.
You just think like, oh, they gave me the chance to do this.
And I don't, he didn't even know that it was going to be announced like that, right?
Like what do you think?
What do you think, My Young?
I mean, I disagree with Tina.
Meang, actually, no, Miyang's like, no, secretly.
Secretly, I agree with all of you.
Should have been double.
Literally.
Should have been Faker.
No, no, no.
Wait, are they playing?
Actually, I don't even know if they play still or not.
They do.
No, no, I meant like, are they playing professionally?
No, I don't.
Faker.
Look it up right now.
It's Faker versus Deft.
And then I don't know if.
Faker's Professional Status00:02:14
Okay, well, we are going to end the free episode of the podcast here.
But behind the paywall, we're going to get more salacious with it.
Also, questions that I need you to think about answers for.
Okay.
Okay.
That I have lined up for you.
What are some content creators that you wanted to meet that you were big fans of beforehand?
That's what your Saikuno interaction reminded me of, or what you said about Saikuno reminding me of.
And then, and who would you like to meet in the space that you haven't yet?
But that's going to be in the paywalled episode.
If you want to access that, you need to go to patreon.com slash fear and that's right, patreon.com slash fear.
And what are you guys up to?
Where can people find you?
Shout yourselves out.
Oh, I'm Tina Kitten Everywhere.
She's like, K Katamina, smiley.
Is it an underscore?
Say your username.
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
And your social media.
And also a potential project that you're doing that's upcoming in this upcoming month that I know you're doing that you haven't mentioned yet.
Huh?
True.
Huh?
Don't hunt.
Stop hunting.
Say it right now.
Say it.
I. What am I saying?
My name?tv slash KKATAMINA.
Two K's.
I know.
The first one was taken.
Everyone always asked me, why is there two K's?
The first one was taken.
It's true.
What is it, project, that you're going to be doing soon?
I have a project.
Do you not have a project?
Not really.
Do I?
We're going to talk about it on the Patreon.
Okay, see you on the other side, everybody.
Probably Schlerp, Schlerp.
I'm coming, I'm still coming.
Yeah, no, it's it's like that on every page.
Is there does this book pass the Beckbel test?
Yeah, that's the this is this episode does it pass the Beckville test.