Chris Moneymaker, a 2003 WSOP Main Event winner with a $40 internet stake, reveals his adaptable, aggressive poker strategy—using "tells" like flared nostrils to exploit opponents—and how his accounting background led to a high-stakes gambling career. Meanwhile, Timothy Good, a ufologist and former session musician (Phil Collins, George Harrison), discusses classified UFO encounters, including 3,400 pilot sightings since 1920, alleged alien bases in the Pacific and Caribbean, and conflicting claims about benevolent or hostile extraterrestrials. His skepticism toward embedded chips in abductees and genetic ties to aliens clashes with callers’ fringe theories, yet he insists some cases—like the 1976 USS Forrestal incident—remain credible despite government secrecy. The episode blends poker psychology with ufology’s unresolved mysteries, leaving both fields open to interpretation. [Automatically generated summary]
I bid you all good evening, good morning, good afternoon, wherever you may be in the world's time zone.
Every single one of them covered like a blanket by this program.
Post post a.m.
I'm Martell here for the weekend edition.
You may have noticed I took last weekend off.
Little story behind that.
And Ramona and I wanted to get away, so we set it all up to...
So what do you say?
We've looked at the forecast, and as far as the eye can see, there's no rain in the forecast, so I'd like to have the weekend off.
Sure enough.
Gave me the weekend off.
We got into the RV.
It took off.
Got up to a place called Mesquite, Nevada.
Woke up the next morning to flash flood warnings for alerts and warnings and so forth for a perump.
And in fact, the whole, in fact, actually how I found out was the RV has satellite television, so I rolled CNN the morning I got up after arriving in Mesquite, and it said flood warnings for the American Southwest.
And I went and looked at our forecast, and there it was.
So we came home and took care of what broadcast information we had to very quickly.
And then, and still, the American Southwest, as you've seen in the news, with the flooding in California, it's day after day after day of rain.
I'm telling you, folks, the desert here is turning into it's all green.
You drive around the desert, it's all green.
Maybe this is the great climate shift that everybody talked about.
Everything out there is green.
It's February, but it's green.
It's really weird day after day.
And if you look at the forecast now, we've got another five or seven days of rain ahead of us as far as the eye can see.
Nothing but rain.
All right.
In the next hour comes Timothy Goode on the subject of UFOs, also the subject, of course, of a tremendous special by ABC coming up this Thursday.
You mark it down right now, this coming Thursday.
ABC was here at my home filming for two days.
That'll earn me about 30 seconds on the show.
So somewhere or another, you'll see my shiny face and perhaps that of Ramona in that special coming up on ABC 8 to 10 o'clock, 7 Central, I think, on Thursday.
A prime time UFO special.
Hooda Kunk, huh?
All right, coming up in a moment, Chris Moneymaker.
You know, I'm a fan, a big fan of Texas Holdham.
We watch the Travel Channel and ESPN, and like so many other millions of Americans, we have become enthralled with Texas Holdham.
Well, Chris Moneymaker is the 2003 winner of the World Series of Poker.
And he came out of nowhere.
And here is this guy up there on the final table with these incredible poker players who get there time after time after time for a reason because they're good.
And Moneymaker whips their butts.
So in a moment, we're going to explore.
Remember we had Amarillo Slim on not too long ago, and now we will explore the mind of a man who made it all the way, won the World Series.
Now, one of the greats, Chris Moneymaker, is the Tennessee accountant who turned a $40 poker bid into a $2.5 million purse in the nation's biggest game of cards.
Chris is currently a professional poker player, spends his time now traveling the country, promoting his new gaming company.
But in the last couple of years, with the Travel Channel and ESPN, you know, showing the whole cards and showing all of us, there's been this explosion, this incredible explosion of poker.
How come?
unidentified
Well, I think it's two things.
One, the whole cards are the biggest thing.
I mean, when you can really get into the mind of the player and see what they're doing on TV and sort of play along with them, I mean, that's probably the main thing that's driving this poker phenomenon.
And also, when you look at it, I think if you look on TV now, all the reality TV shows that you see on, poker is probably the purest form of reality TV you'll see out there.
I mean, it's nothing scripted.
It's all real life, and it's people going up for more money than what you would see at any other game show.
And we're playing for millions of dollars where they're giving away $50,000 in some of these game shows.
So I guess the appropriate thing for me to do would be to ask you about, you know, the big win.
I mean, your book is very descriptive.
It sort of starts out and takes us through.
I mean, you had to borrow money to even get there, right?
unidentified
Yeah, I mean, I wasn't the best poker player when I went out there.
I was decent, but I had a blackjack where I played blackjack, and I sports gambled a lot, and I didn't make a ton of money, so I didn't have exactly a ton of money going out there.
I won my seat, but getting out there is expensive, and then I felt like I needed at least a week to learn how to play with other people in a casino environment, tournament environment, which I hadn't had previous.
I played in a live casino before, playing ring games, but never in a tournament environment.
Did you get to sit with any, I mean, short of the final table, as you approach the final table, and the way it works, folks, is you just keep playing table after table, and if you keep beating, I guess if you keep winning these tables, you will finally arrive at the final table, but that's a long journey, right?
Yeah, I mean, Gus doesn't just have the reputation.
I've watched the guy.
He will bet just virtually on anything.
Is that a strategy in itself?
In other words, everything else aside, if you are aggressive enough, if you're willing to keep throwing the bigger part of the money out there on the table, is that a strategy in itself to win poker?
unidentified
Oh, definitely.
I mean, first of all, people fear you.
I mean, they don't want to get mixed up in a potch with you because they really don't know where you are.
I mean, the good thing about poker is if you know where your opponent is, which he can somewhat narrow down by the how he bets, but you don't know where he is, he has an advantage over you in the long run.
I mean, is each player sort of required to show his cards so the camera can get a look at them?
unidentified
You're not required.
You sign a contract in the beginning of the tournament to play in the tournament that says that you'll show your cards and you can't wear advertisements or whatever the case may be for this particular tournament.
And it's not until you make it to the final table or what's called the TV table throughout the World Series where they put you one specific table.
It's the only time you have to show your whole card.
So, you know, for six days, I didn't even show a whole card one.
So it just depends on what table you get and how the look of the draw comes up.
Another thing that I've seen poker players do is for a certain period of time, they'll be extremely aggressive, and then they'll totally switch gears and start throwing away cards, and you gasp when you see what they throw away.
They're getting so conservative, it's crazy.
unidentified
Yeah, when you're playing real aggressive, it's called changing gears.
And when you get really crazy, you start raising a bunch of hands, people will start to believe that you're just doing nothing but stealing the whole time, and they'll start calling you with a bunch of stuff, and you really don't want to be in, like, Gus, he changes gears, you just don't see it as much.
He does change gears, and he backs it down.
But, you know, when people start calling you with anything, it can get sort of scary.
So to turn that off, you start playing more solid hands without them sort of knowing.
You're still giving off the impression that you're stealing a lot and that you're raising and you're being aggressive, but you're really not.
You don't think there's anything about the emotional aspect of a woman's personality that would tend to bring on more tells or, I don't know, something?
unidentified
Well, they can be as crafty as we can, if not craftier.
So, you know, that's sort of tough.
The only difference I can see with the women I've played with versus the men is just men in general are more aggressive.
They'll bet with play more aggressive poker in general.
And some women will, but most of them that I've played with, I'm not saying all, but they'll tend to sit back more and wait for the hands a little bit more.
Well, in the old poker, it was all about the cards you had.
I mean, yeah, there was some bluffing.
But in the new poker, it seems like it's all about aggressiveness and how much you can scare the other guys.
unidentified
Yeah, with ring game and, you know, playing for cash money, it's all about playing, you know, it's playing the person, but it's also getting cards and playing the correct way.
In poker, tournament poker, it's just a totally different game.
You have to play it exactly opposite what you would play a ring game.
You have to be aggressive.
You have to be crazy.
You have to take some chances.
You have to get lucky a few times, and you have to be able to really read your opponent real quickly.
If there are people out there, and there are millions of fans now of all these poker tournaments, they can either take, what, $10,000 or sometimes less and get in, or they can get in the way you did starting on the Internet in poker games.
Most of them are probably dead money.
How would you advise these people?
unidentified
Play in smaller tournaments.
Keep cracking at it.
I mean, it took me a good seven months to really do well in any kind of tournament online.
Are you going to well you won $2.5 million everybody always wants to know this when somebody when a gambler wins $2.5 million does he go out and invest it in stocks and bonds and do all the things that most people would do or does he gamble it?
unidentified
Well that's a good question.
I gambled some of it and then I put a lot of it away in stocks and bonds.
I was an accountant going into it and I went back to work.
My intention was to not play poker and just be at work.
But then the whole poker boom took place and you started getting invitations and stuff like that, right?
unidentified
Exactly.
I got some endorsements and some appearance money and things started taking off and it just didn't make much sense to work at what I was making, what I could make in basically a week playing poker.
There's a big controversy about showing whole cards.
Plenty of people think that you never, ever, ever show your cards at the end of a hand.
Some other people do it.
It seems like just for well, I don't know.
What's your view on that?
Do you show sometimes or not?
Not ever.
unidentified
I show, but usually I show for a reason.
If I'm showing you my hand, I'm trying to either upset you and get you on what's called tilt, put you to where you want to come at me, or to show you that I'm raising with only quality hands to show you that I'm not just trying to steal.
So in a big game, you might not have that opportunity.
unidentified
In a big game, you still have that opportunity.
Usually the big games, the blinds are not overly, I mean, some of the bigger games are 25, 50, no limit, where you might lose 75 bucks or 150 bucks, which is, in that game, is not that huge of a game, huge amount to lose.
Sometimes there will be one person who will just talk your ear off.
I mean, you're trying to concentrate and do whatever you do mentally, and some guy is just rattling away talking about everything that happens at the table and a lot that doesn't.
How do you feel about that?
unidentified
It depends on the game.
If it's a lower game or not such a serious game, I'll sit there and I'll rattle back with Mike talking to people anyway, so I enjoy the conversation.
But if it's a really big tournament or a really big cash game, I'll usually just sort of tune the mountains and stare at trying to pick up my tails and play the game.
And most of the time they get the head that you're watching the game, and they usually go quiet.
Al, I've seen, I mean, you've been called by those, you know, I did a little internet search on you, and a number of people have written stories about you, and they all seem impressed with how much of a gentleman you are after the game.
Now, of course, I don't see that a lot on television, but when you get up from the table, you shake hands with everybody.
I might add, not everybody does.
There are some pretty poor losers, aren't there?
unidentified
I mean, there are some sore losers, and there's some very good gentlemen in the game.
It's a great game, because I think more and more now you're seeing a lot more gentlemen in the game.
But in the end, Stu was definitely beaten by his own demons.
And I wonder if you feel any of those demons, or can you just play poker to make a living?
unidentified
Well, as you read my book, you'll see that I had enough crutches, enough demons before I won the World Series.
Now that I've won, I've really centered myself, and I'm happy to play poker whenever the time calls, and I don't usually play, like I'm sitting at home now.
I'm not playing.
I don't play on the Internet much.
I don't really do much of anything other than just enjoy life.
And by aggressive, folks, we mean even if you're sitting there with, you know, seven and a two or something, you still come roaring out with $100,000 or something crazy that makes everybody gulp five times.
Did you stay that were you that aggressive straight through, or did a lot of switch-up?
unidentified
Oh, tons of switch-up.
The very beginning, the first two days, actually, I was probably the least aggressive of anybody in the whole tournament.
I just wanted to last as long as I could.
That was my sole purpose, was to stay in there as long as I could.
And I didn't really mix it up very much.
For the first two days, I kept making money because I had good hands.
It's not until the third day that I really start being aggressive.
And I didn't change gears much until the third day.
Then I started going real fast and then real slow, then back fast again.
It must be, well, let me ask, is it just a way to make a living?
Or is it like when you win, whether it's just on a daily basis or even the big one that you won, is it like a high, you know, like almost like a drug high or something when you win?
There must be some of that.
unidentified
Oh, there's definitely an adrenaline flow, A high when you win.
I mean, even today, when you win a big tournament or you win even a small tournament, there's definitely a big high, just a sense of accomplishment.
But then again, it's a job now, so the high is not what it was when I won the World Series.
My adrenaline was running so hard I didn't even know what I did, but now it's more controlled.
Yeah, but man, of all people, I mean, you were an accountant, and an accountant works with numbers.
It's kind of a I guess it wasn't boring for you, but you're working with numbers all the time, so you sort of understand numbers, right?
That's your business.
You're into numbers, you're an accountant, and I don't know how in the hell you get from an accountant to wagering hundreds of thousands at a poker table.
It just somehow that doesn't translate.
Or if it does, how does it translate?
unidentified
Well, you were right in the first part.
My accounting job was pretty boring.
Most accountants don't have a propensity or a desire to gamble.
Does that take the edge off it a little bit for you, do you think?
unidentified
A little bit.
I'm trying to get the last couple of tournaments I've done well, and I'm sort of getting back to taking a few more chances.
What people would consider bad play is not exactly, you know, it's what I'm starting to do again a little bit more and take some more chances and push the action a little bit.
Haven't read it yet, Chris, but let me ask you this.
If somebody who's sort of interested in all of this right now and they're watching on TV and maybe they played a little internet Texas Hold them, could they buy this book, Chris, and after reading it, maybe would it teach them enough to go make a stab at it themselves?
It'll help.
unidentified
I mean, basically what it is, it just tells my story and it sort of gives a play-by-play throughout the main event that I won, sort of what I was thinking in certain key hands, and basically where I came from and how I got into the World Series and a little bit of what I've done since.
So in the thinking process of what was going through my mind during some of these hands, it will help some of you.
Coming this Thursday, the ABC Television Network will do a two-hour special with Peter Jennings that'll begin at 8 o'clock.
And all of you out there who have DVRs, you want to enter that very quickly so that you don't miss it.
Tapes set and all the rest of it.
Two hours on UFOs on ABC nationwide prime time.
It's about time, don't you think?
That is the subject we will engage in now on Coast.
Timothy Good has conducted worldwide research on the UFO phenomenon, including interviewing key witnesses and discussing the subject with astronauts, military and intelligence specialists, pilots, politicians, scientists, has lectured at universities, schools, at many organizations, and has even been invited for discussions at the Pentagon in 1998 and at the headquarters of the French Air Force in 2002.
He has acted as consultant for several U.S. congressional investigations.
He's born in London.
In fact, he's in London now.
Timothy Good gained a scholarship as a violinist to the Royal Academy of Music, where he won prizes for solo, chamber, and orchestral playing.
He played for 14 years with the London Symphony Orchestra.
He has also freelanced as a session player for television, dramas, commercials, feature films, and recordings with pop musicians.
For example, Phil Collins, George Harrison, Elton John, Paul McCartney, and Rod Stewart, and even you too.
So, my God, what a background for somebody into ufology.
Coming up in a moment, Timothy Good.
Radio The who's who of ufology definitely was visited by ABC Television for this forthcoming documentary.
And certainly the name Timothy Goode is smack dab in the middle of all of that.
So I suspect they probably reached out to you, Timothy, one way or the other.
I know nothing other than their press release art, I'm afraid.
But who knows?
If you recall, way back in the late 1980s, do you remember UFO Cover Up Live, which was, I think, a two-hour production airing in Moscow and Washington simultaneously?
And there was quite a bit of material forthcoming from some retired military guys, if you recall.
And we had the Condor and Falcon episodes and everything.
So who knows?
I suspect, however, it'll be far more conventional than that and a serious, for once, journalistic attempt to get at the facts.
Well, I've always been passionate about aircraft and space travel art.
So it was a natural progression, particularly when in 1955, that's 50 years ago, I was given the book, The Flying Saucers Are Real, written by Major Donald Kehoe, of course.
And this was given to me by an American cousin who said, Timothy, you know, you like airplanes and stuff.
It's time you learned about flying saucers.
So that is really where the interest was stimulated, and I haven't looked back since.
Well, according to Dr. Dick Haynes, Richard Haynes, who runs the reporting center for anomalous phenomena, NARCAP, he thinks there's been about 3,400, and that might have increased by now since 1920.
And I think there have probably been a great deal more because many pilots do not report their sightings.
Civilian pilots don't report them for fear.
It's a bad career move, particularly if they're in a major airline.
We found that out.
And there are, in fact, regulation orders, procedure orders.
They were published in America way back in the 1950s for the reporting of these things, and the press was to be avoided.
But as far as the military concerned, of course, there are strict regulations, and many, many encounters remain classified at an above-top-secret level in the interest of national security.
And I can understand that because, as General Chidlaw said many years ago, and he was head of Air Defense Command at one time, we've lost many men and planes trying to intercept these objects.
And that is a fact.
And I think that's quite disturbing.
There have also been disturbing near collisions with airliners as well as military aircraft.
And this would be disturbing if all the facts were known.
If these things are so super technologically advanced, and they've got presumably very adequate means of protecting themselves, why do we continue to send jets up chasing them?
My answer to that is that we require as much data from these craft as possible.
We need gun camera film.
We need radar signatures.
We need communication signatures.
We need all sorts of things across the spectrum to check and double-check against previous experiences, just how near we can get to these things, what the effects are, and we can learn a great deal more about their technologies.
I spoke to a senior official in the Ministry of Defense.
This is before Nick Pope, by the way, one of Nick Pope's predecessors.
Nick headed the UFO desk at the Ministry of Defense from 1991 to 1994,
back 20 years prior to that Ralph Noyes headed the same department and he told me that part of his briefing was to be shown military gun camera clips of UFOs and he saw them he said they weren't absolutely sensational by any means but these are things that you know have either been lost conveniently or destroyed or just completely withheld in the interests of security.
Generally speaking, records are withheld, certain military records and others are withheld typically for 30 years, but often to 50 years, sometimes 100 years, and sometimes some things never get released at all.
A classic example is that in the last few years, we've had some top secret documents relating to Britain's, the British government's Flying Saucer Working Party, as it was called, which was established in 1950 under Prime Minister Clement Attlee.
And those were only released in 2002, because they date back to the early 1950s.
Well, this was passed by Act of Parliament, and it's now in place as of January 1st, 2005.
And the Ministry of Defense, anticipating that the cranky ufologists would be bombarding them with requests for all the UFO data spent months, if not years, actually weeding out tons of stuff and dishing it out so that this would sort of preempt all the inquiries from us guys.
And a lot of stuff has been released.
Nick Pope tells me that most of it's innocuous, but it has actually generated a tremendous amount of interest in the press more than any other aspect of the Freedom of Information Act.
And just last month, there were huge articles in the Times, the Telegraph, the Financial Times, the Independent.
Those are our main newspapers and some of the smaller papers, local papers.
But tremendous interest.
And there was a huge article by Nick on the release of these things.
And interestingly, those who are determined still to debunk everything, such as The Times, they had an editorial.
First of all, there was an article in The Times which ignored all the really good reports by RAF people, the good reports, impressive reports by pilots and other military officers, which really are quite startling cases.
It ignored those and concentrated on the lights in the sky and the balloons and the kites and said how Britain's ex-files said that UFOs were just a waste of time.
That was the headline.
And the editorial actually said, pie in the sky, flying saucers are close encounters with the human imagination.
Well, I really, you know, that really got me going, and I fired off an email to the Times editorial, but it was never published, of course.
What I think happened is that since the late 1940s, the CIA came across to Britain and chatted with intelligence counterparts over here, Air Force people as well, and they, I think, suggested that we play down the really good sightings.
I'm sure of this because the Flying Saucer Working Party seems to have had a remit to debunk, especially the best sightings.
Like in 1950, in August 1950, there was a low-level sighting at the Farnborough air base where a lot of test pilots were based.
And this thing came over at low-level, an actual craft accompanied by hissing and crackling sounds.
It was seen by one of their top pilots and other personnel.
And the thing was repeated at a further distance about three weeks later, seen by many test pilots.
And those that were interviewed were told not to discuss it with anyone, not even among themselves.
And the whole thing was debunked.
And you can see that in the reports where they say, you know, the poor chap, obviously they were just seeing conventional aircraft.
I mean, you know, and they were absolutely outraged when these reports came out a few years ago.
If you were to look around at the various countries of the world, including Brazil, Japan, I mean, just all around the world, South Africa, what country do you think is the most open about UFO incidents?
Yeah, there's a great deal of stuff has come out there from, you know, high-ranking generals have come forward.
They've appeared in several documentaries, including in The Excellent Out of the Blue and other documentaries that I've been involved with.
And it's quite amazing some of these people have come forward.
And Gorbachev, as you know, has come out with several statements acknowledging that he discussed the extraterrestrial threat with President Reagan at the Geneva Summit in 1985.
He said the United States President and I discussed the question of an extraterrestrial threat and agreed that in the event of an invasion, the Soviet Union and the United States would join forces to repel such an invasion.
And he went on to add, you know, I don't dispute the hypothesis, but I think it's too early yet to worry about such a possibility.
Well, of course, his interest goes back to 1974, if not earlier, when he was governor of California, because there was a UFO sighting while he was flying in the governor's plane, and he ordered the pilot to chase it.
Of course, they couldn't get anywhere near it, but it created a lot of excitement.
And there was actually a Wall Street journalist on board the plane, and Reagan was all excited, because I think he's had a previous sighting, and he talked about his great interest in the subject and so forth.
And I think in that very important speech before the United Nations General Assembly in 1987, I think it was September 1987, he says, you know, I occasionally think how quickly our differences worldwide would vanish if we were facing an alien threat.
And yet I ask, is not an alien force among us?
And then he went on quickly to add, you know, what could be more alien than war and the threat of nuclear war and so on.
I don't know all the reasons for the cover-up, Art, but I suspect that some of the reasons would be disturbing to the body politic, as it's often been said, and to society in general.
It's much better just to let the facts leak out gradually.
Timothy Good just suggested that it's a trickle-down sort of slow release policy regarding this information that absolutely couldn't be released en masse.
It just couldn't.
It would upset the whole world would go on tilt.
And so I've wondered a little bit over the years, and I've been doing this for a lot of years now, folks, whether I could actually be part of that process, an unwitting dupe, as it were, trickling out information that the government wants trickled out.
Of course, that would make many other people, including the ABC Television Network, part of that process.
Timothy, have you ever wondered if you were part of that process?
In the last chapter, which is entitled Resident Aliens, I disclose information which has come to me via a high-ranking source who worked at the Pentagon and the U.S. Air Force Air Staff and Joint Staff.
And this information was given to a friend of mine, an ex-Army intelligence guy, who's a journalist in the aerospace world.
Between 1986 and 1989, he was given a great deal of information about what was actually going on.
And I'm quite sure this was part of an official leak.
I asked you the question about the President for a reason, you know, whether he could demand everything that we know about UFOs and get it.
Of course, we can't know the answer to that, but I guess the bigger question is, Timothy, is it your opinion that there's a group outside of elected government, government's knowledge, that sort of a majestic 12 or its equivalent.
But of course, what I was told that, for example, at least 100 people in OSI, which is the Air Force Intelligence Office of Special Investigations, there are at least 100 people,
I'm going back again to 1986, 1989, because that's when this information was given, there were at least 100 people in OSI who had knowledge in varying degrees about the extraterrestrial presence and were actually dealing with it.
When I was in the Pentagon in 1998, at the invitation of General Kenneth Israel, who was then director of the Defense Airborne Reconnaissance Office, as it was then called, they at that time handled the unmanned spy planes, the UAVs, unmanned aerial vehicles.
He indicated to me that, in his opinion, this was more a policing task as opposed to national security.
And he therefore suggested to me or hinted that OSI was much more likely to be in charge of the investigations.
Well, OSI has all sorts of tasks, you know, other than some of the more obvious ones.
I mean, they're into counterintelligence, they're into investigations, they're into problems with people violating their national security odes and things like that.
So I think it's interesting from that point of view.
But I was given a great deal of information, really, and you'll learn that in that last chapter.
And there are concerns about what the aliens are doing.
It's not a question.
I'm told of one species coming here.
There are several.
And more important, there appears to be a conflict of interest between some of these beings regarding our planet.
I mean, goodness knows, I wouldn't put a number on it as to who's been coming here and for what purpose over the years, because it's been going on for thousands of years.
But from what I gather, some of them definitely have a vested interest in this planet and its resources.
And there is concern about the abduction process, which it is believed by them that it is definitely related to some sort of hybridization program.
They appear to need animal materials as well, some of them.
I do think there could be an interest in some of our materials and minerals here.
Some of them have suggested that.
Some people who've established communication with humans have established that they need stuff here.
And there appear to be a number of very large undersea bases which are causing disturbances.
Now, as it was put to me, you know, they're concerned that the fact that some of the aliens are, quote, messing around with tectonic plates in the Pacific Ocean.
Now, that opens all sorts of cans of worms, as I think recent events might suggest.
I'm not suggesting for one moment that the tsunami had anything to do with aliens, but I'm just saying that apparently, according to this source, some aliens are messing around with tectonic plates, and they have some large undersea bases.
Yes, Timothy, but a natural inference from that statement would be that there could be a connection between the tsunami and messing around with the Pacific's tectonic plates.
Or they might even be messing around with the tectonic plates for their own purposes, to protect their bases or to protect the Earth.
You know, that's the good news.
I mean, there's always good news and bad news.
It's like whatever threat is posed by aliens, we have to look at the positive side of things, the fact that they've shown their ability to paralyze our nuclear missile bases at the drop of a hat.
Well, you know, last year, and continuing now, I've been investigating an extraordinary case reported, goes back to August of 1945, when in San Antonio, not Texas, San Antonio, New Mexico,
which is not that far from the White Sands missile range, two boys encountered an apparent crashed craft on one of the boys' father's ranches.
Jose Padilla was one of the boys, and it was his father's ranch.
And the other witness was Remichio Baca, Rimi Baca.
And I went out to meet them in June.
At least I met Rimi.
I have not met Jose yet, but we've been in communication.
It's an extraordinary story.
They were quite alarmed by the incident.
They claimed to have seen a large area where in this canyon where this craft had come down and a gouge in the earth as long as a football field.
It was vaguely circular with a sort of type of fin on top, but nothing like an aircraft fin.
They've made a model of it.
I've seen it.
And they headed back, worried about casualties and so forth, because they'd seen, when they got as close as they dared, some sort of strange-looking creatures moving around inside it, like children.
And they had no hair on.
They couldn't see much more detail than that.
And they went back and told Padilla Sr., who told the police.
And they all drove toward the crash site two days later, but the wreckage was nowhere to be seen.
But suddenly, it reappeared.
It had been, apparently someone had made an attempt to cover it up with dirt and debris.
And then later on, the craft, I'm cutting a long story short here, the craft was apparently recovered.
And the boys at several stages got a chance to witness these things from a hidden area.
And this thing was loaded onto a tall boy.
And as I say, they were watching from this secluded position.
And soldiers were throwing bits down a crevice so they wouldn't have to carry them all the way down.
It rings true, in a way.
A lot of information forthcoming.
One of the boys, the older boy, Padia, at one stage when the craft was unguarded, clambered inside a gouge in the opening.
And on a sort of area there, he managed to extract a device.
Now, I have seen that device and handled it and photographed it.
The unfortunate thing is, and it's, as I refer to as the fly in the ointment, is that it does look very, very conventional.
It looks like some kind of bracket with space provisions for fasteners or screws or whatever.
It's about 11 inches long.
It has been analyzed, and it does appear to be conventional aluminum.
So that's a problem.
But on the other hand, we have the testimony of these two witnesses, and they are absolutely adamant that this thing did event.
So there is this contradiction which I'm left with, and it is a stumbling block for me, I have to say.
I mean, all the testimony, sworn affidavits from all those high-ranking people.
You know, we have Dubose, who's often overlooked, General Dubose, who said that the cover-up was ordered by General Clements McMullen at the time, and there were very, very good reasons.
They said, look, you know, we've just been through a world war with atomic bombs on Japan, firebombing of great cities, destruction on an unprecedented worldwide scale.
Then came this flying saucer business, and it was simply too much for the public to have to deal with.
I don't know about a deal, but I think we certainly, there was an exchange of information.
There was a survivor, by all accounts.
I'm not the only person to.
Dr. Edgar Mitchell, Sixth Man to Walk on the Moon, has also established very good contacts in the military and intelligence communities.
And he's also been told that there was a survivor who lasted a certain number of years.
And I believe that.
I think official interest began well before Oswell, certainly during World War II, because all these pilots were reporting these things, not just foo fighters.
When you look at the Earth, and you talk about minerals or you talk about what's here that's not on Mars and Venus and all the other planets that we're now discovering with Hubble and other telescopes, all these planets around all these suns.
But the unusual thing about Earth that really stands out would be us.
Yes, but before I exploded with my coughing fit, I was about to tell you of Air Marshal Sir Peter Horsley, who was an air quality, like a kind of military attaché to the Queen and Prince Philip for seven years, back in 1954.
And he was also Deputy Chief of Stripe Command and a decorated war hero, flown 90 different types of aircraft.
And he claims that in 1954, he had a two-hour meeting with an extraterrestrial being arranged via a British Army general.
And this took place in the middle of London in the presence of a witness.
And he wrote up that story in his autobiography, Sounds from Another Room, and he gave me some additional information, which I published in my book, Alien Base.
Oh, yes, when it comes to the details of a two-hour meeting with an alien being, then I have time, we all have time, for some of the good details of that.
coming right up Tomorrow night, in the world of, in the psychic world, the real McCoy is here.
Russell Targ is here.
And believe me when I tell you, he's the real McCoy.
It's going to be an interesting, very interesting Sunday, and certainly is a fascinating Saturday night.
Timothy, welcome back.
A two-hour meeting.
If there was a two-hour meeting, I would like to know the details of that meeting.
I would like to know as much as I could what was said and what was answered and whatever you can tell me.
Well, the first thing that Sir Peter noticed during this meeting was that this guy, whoever he was, was able to read his mind.
And later on, Sir Peter told me, he didn't write about this in his book, but he told me that what disturbed him more than anything else was the fact that this guy knew all Britain's top secret nuclear secrets.
And, well, he began by explaining that man was now striving to sort of break his earthly bonds and travel to the moon and planets beyond.
We were developing that there was a dark age on Earth.
We were prepared to sacrifice almost anything, the natural environment, animals and humans.
And there was a dreadful specter of blowing up our world.
So they were concerned, it seems, about that.
He went on to the origins of life in the universe, stated that most of the UFOs we see are robot-controlled.
Some are manned in order to oversee the whole program and to ensure that the probes do not land or crash by accident.
And they spoke that there have been, since time immemorial, observers of our planet, vessels out of the sky bringing strange visitors, and that contact has been established on a very selective basis where they judge that such contact could not harm either party.
And apparently they say they've studied Earth for a very long time.
They have extraordinary technological abilities, very highly developed mental powers, including extra sensory, thought reading, hypnosis.
And this I find particularly interesting, the ability to use different dimensions.
As a matter of fact, I was going to ask you somewhere down the line that, you know, beings coming from light years and light years away seems incredible.
Maybe it can be done, but it seems incredible.
But if we just, you know, if we had someone come from another dimension, they would appear to us to be as alien as if they had come from another planet.
And of course, you know, you just hop, skip, and a jump from another dimension if you know how to do it.
Well, the implication in this case is that these beings are related.
Some of them at any rate are related to us genetically.
What I've heard from other sources is that some of these highly advanced beings are indeed responsible for upgrading humanity, upgrading the development of human beings going Way back tens of thousands of years.
As to the dimensional aspect, I don't doubt that there are beings who exist solely in other dimensions, but the implication here is that this guy was quite physical, quite solid, but that their races are so advanced that they can manipulate dimensions.
And I think this happens with their spacecraft.
There's a number of intriguing accounts by people claiming contact to say that it is a question not just of linear travel.
I'm sure you've heard all this before, all you listeners, and you, of course, are, that they manipulate space-time, as Einstein called it, by folding it rather than traveling in a linear mode.
So that to manipulate space-time is to manipulate a dimension.
And I think this would account for their extraordinarily rapid disappearances sometimes.
Sometimes maybe they're just going so fast in the blink of an eye, but I think at other times they're just translating into another dimension to get where they want to in maybe split seconds.
If they upgraded us, interesting phrase, then they took us from what was not intelligent life and did the upgrade that made us who we are, making them our creators.
One of the most compelling contacts for me was a lady I knew for many, many, several decades, in fact.
She's passed on now, unfortunately, but she had contact back in 1963 with several human-type extraterrestrials who were engaged in a very delicate operation which involved the use of some of our top scientists, some of whom actually traveled to their bases.
And they had bases, some of these people, for example, in South America.
I think there are probably a number of alien bases in South America and offshore.
There was the extraordinary case of the guy, Ludwig Palman, a German businessman who in the late 60s encountered a group of these beings and actually visited their base, which was in the jungle in the Amazon area.
Well, it depends what the counterintelligence is of the aliens in terms of disguising their technologies and bases.
So I'm quite sure they're capable of dealing with that.
But yes, I'm quite sure, in fact, I'm 100% sure that some governments do actually actively use their spy satellites for trying to detect undersea and other activities on this planet.
I mean, there are reports apparently in the Hindu Vedas and the Brahmin records.
But the Bible is absolutely chock full of extraordinary incidences of strange beings who mated with people, who produced people who lived for many hundreds of years, apparently, if you believe it.
And then, you know, Ezekiel, Elijah and the flying chariot, all these things, descriptions of strange beings.
And then the New Testament, I mean, Jesus, the star of Bethlehem, whatever that was, it wasn't a star.
It was very specific.
It pointed out a particular building.
You have Jesus' phenomenal abilities, telepathy, levitation, healing.
And the resurrection, which even the Catholic Church, I believe, acknowledges to be a bodily, a physical resurrection, accompanied by shining beings, and then the reappearance to Paul on the road to Damascus.
You remember that story, the dazzling light, which blinded the soldiers?
They couldn't hear anything, but Jesus spoke out of this blinding light in the sky, and so on and so forth.
And I think the angel Gabriel might well have been maybe something to do with artificial insemination might explain the so-called Immaculate Conception.
Well, it has to be said that so many of the modern sightings and close contact sightings seem to involve reproduction, a study of reproduction, reproductive organs, when you get stories from people who have been abducted, very frequently.
You know, I was really surprised, Timothy, at the amount of sexual content in abduction stories when you really get down to brass tax with abductees.
So, you know, there are very few researchers in the United States.
I don't know about Great Britain, but you sound like you might be one of them who aren't so absolutely sure these are warm, fuzzy creatures with our best interests in mind.
That would be you, then.
Yep.
So if they don't have our best interests in mind, what do you think their agenda?
Yeah, well, that's, of course, all the big questions just sort of almost can't be answered.
The who, the what, the where, the when.
Almost none of this can be answered.
Now, it'll be interesting to see what sort of conclusion a large network investigation like ABC's will come up with.
I've got little hints that they may be suggesting at the end of it all, and this is just guesstimates from the Internet folks, that there needs to be a more serious investigation into all of this.
It would also explain the concentration of sightings in the New Mexico area as all the testimony from the military and scientific people who were summoned urgently to meetings in the 1940s about all these strange objects hovering over our rocket sites and nuclear sites.
In everything that you've heard, Timothy, about these meetings with the others, how convinced do they seem to be that we're going to blow ourselves up?
Well, I'd always like to keep positive about that, but I like to think that they might prevent us doing so, particularly if they have a vested interest in their own security and our nuclear weapons.
Because it's often been said, and it was certainly said a lot in the late 40s and 50s and 60s with the contactees I've met.
They were told that we don't really know quite what we're doing and that the effects of these explosions continue into the solar system.
Maybe there were other technological civilizations.
I mean, think about it.
If our civilization was utterly destroyed today, how many millions or even billions of years would have to pass before there wouldn't be any trace of us left at all?
My guest is Timothy Good, all the way, by the way, from Great Britain.
So when we do get to the telephone stage of this, I want to remind the audience that even though we've got a superlatively good connection with Great Britain, there is a time differential of a fraction of a second or better where you Can sort of talk on top of each other if you're not very careful.
So, what I would ask, and I know a lot of you are going to have questions for Timothy, what I would ask is that you formulate your question and sort of get it out and then allow him to answer so that we don't get into a situation where we're all interrupting each other.
That's a necessity of the transatlantic connection.
It took place in January the 4th of last year when pilots of a British Midland Airbus saw a flashing bright triangular object take off from the ground as they were passing 3,000 feet over the Slane area, which is near Dublin.
And they saw that this UFO, because they were on the landing pattern, they were about five or six miles behind an aircraft in front.
The aircraft in front was approached by this large, flashing, bright triangular object.
And apparently, the crew experienced a power drain.
A purple glow was surrounding this.
It was a Boeing 737400 series jet of Aer Lingus.
It flew in front of the aircraft, forcing the pilots to change course to avoid a collision.
The jet apparently experienced wake turbulence and violent shakes, and the outside temperature rose to 164 degrees centigrade for around 15 seconds.
I'm indebted to the principal investigators, Dermot Butler and Carl Nalley of Dublin.
Carl is a pilot himself, a private pilot.
They were the people that got the information in the first place.
I went to Dublin in November to try and get more information.
I haven't yet met the pilots of the Erlingus plane, and I tried to speak to some Erlingus pilots on this flight over to Dublin, and absolutely there was annoyance on the flight deck that I'd actually tried to get information about the case, and they refused to talk to me.
And this, you know, it also happened to another aircraft, another aircraft a couple of hours later on that same day.
What is peculiar, you know, I talked about a fly in the ointment, there's always a stumbling block in cases, is that I gave an interview in the Irish Star in November, and we are appealing for witnesses to come forward, because there are people on the plane who are very frightened by the incident.
I can't believe they've all been silenced on landing, you know.
I think it's peculiar that someone hasn't come forward, but I don't doubt my sources.
And I don't doubt that such events take place.
And I'd like to mention these triangles briefly.
I think some of the listeners will be aware, those of us who sort of surf the internet, of this extraordinary case of a flying triangle seen by a witness, a musician, in Bristol, Tennessee, on October 2 of last year.
Very good case and a very good illustration of the craft as well.
And he was nearing an intersection near his home and exited his car to see if there was a fire, because it looked like a fire coming from between the trees and some distance away.
And slowly emerged this enormous triangular-shaped craft.
He started to run, but realized there was nowhere to run to, so he just stood in awe and watched.
And it slowly came into full view, estimated at 300 feet at each end sides of the triangle, and only 100 feet or so high, in altitude, in other words, blocking out the entire sky.
And there were large domes, as often these are seen, comparing each dome, he said, to twice the size of a car, illuminating the entire bottom, three of those domes at the apex of each corner of the triangles.
And rib-like structures.
And this has been reported before.
I've spoken to several witnesses, including one in the Midlands in the 1990s, who saw a very, very similar craft with these rib-like structures underneath.
In other words, Timothy, I was coming home with my wife many years ago now, and my wife yelled, what the hell's that?
Or something to that effect.
She was in the passenger seat, and I stopped the car, and we got out.
And a black triangle, not flying, but floating, Timothy, passed not more than 150 feet above our head.
The moon and the stars all went away.
It was as classic as you can possibly imagine.
It didn't make a sound.
You could hear crickets at a quarter mile away.
It floated over our head and then continued floating toward what we call Area 51 that we're not far from here.
But Timothy, this happened to me.
I've done paintings and drawings of exactly what it was like, where our car was, what the geography was like, the whole smear, and what it looked like to us.
I could have thrown a rock at the thing, except Timothy, that I was in shock.
One would wonder why, you know, if they are American devices, why they would want to show themselves overtly, as they obviously have done on many occasions.
But at the same time, I think some, a percentage, don't ask me to put a number to it, but a percentage of these craft could well be our own.
And that applies over here as well, because some of them have been seen near, like British Aerospace, like Wharton, up in the North Country, for example.
So it's possible.
On the other hand, it could be that these bases where we are developing all sorts of new types of aircraft are just being sort of overflown and checked out by the aliens.
And of course, we have endless tales of back-engineering of alien craft at that area near me, Area 51.
I don't know if that's true, but certainly if we laid our hands on technology like that, we'd do our very damn level best to try and figure out how it worked and duplicate it.
We have in Great Britain the Rendlesham Forrest case, December 1980, when many U.S. Air Force security policemen encountered a landed craft, triangular craft.
And events were going on for several days.
The deputy base commander himself, then Lieutenant Colonel Charles Holt at Woodbridge, these were twin Air Force bases of Woodbridge and Bentwaters himself saw some of these things.
There were other craft seen in the skies.
There were traces left.
Nick Pope himself was able to get hold of the radiation readings, which were certainly above normal.
There have been all sorts of explanations and attempts to debunk it.
The most recent one being that it was just some U.S. serviceman going up and down the runway with a red light on top of the vehicle.
And I think one of the most intriguing aspects of it was nothing was ever said at any time while he was on board the craft.
And he had these good-looking men and women show him around, and he would ask questions.
And I think prior to all that, he was playing around with controls on this seat, and he rendered the craft invisible, opaque at one stage, so that he could see out into the universe, which was extraordinary.
But most important, I think, is this connection between these strange, large-eyed, very pasty-colored skin beings.
Do you remember all that who grabbed hold of him and he fought them off?
And, you know, it does appear to me that those were sort of like biological robots who were subservient to these more human-like types.
And since then, he and others have intimated that gradual exposure is the only way forward.
They are concerned about overreaction of the public.
But I think various safety nets have been put into place, one of which is, as I've said, some of the facts have been leaked to a number of journalists, highly placed journalists.
Well, Timothy, maybe it's time that you took the test.
I mean, if you were given the opportunity to reveal to the world the complete truth about alien visitation presence and motives and history, and it was all given to you, and you could release all the information.
And in fact, I have come out with a lot of this stuff, and it's either just disbelieved or ridiculed.
But when somebody in a really prominent position of authority comes up with this stuff, it's much, much more difficult because it's embarrassing above all.
We're not in control.
Nobody likes to look out of control, particularly politicians.
They like to tell us, as you know, how everything's great with the world and so on and so forth.
And to admit that there are outside forces against whom we have little or no control whatsoever is political suicide and military suicide as well.
If they can't control it, then they don't even admit it's there, and that certainly is the course they've been following.
It's just that it seems like eventually it does have to break.
And I guess you were told then that as long as you can remain for another, I don't know, 10, 20, 30 years, whatever, then you're likely to get to experience the great disclosure.
I think what is happening, what I've noticed, and I'm not alone in this, is that there has been an improvement to a certain extent in the media, in the national and international media, with regard to reporting on this subject more seriously.
I mean, certainly in terms of our recent Freedom of Information Act, a lot of reports.
And I've got here from 19th of December last year a huge article in a broadsheet, The Independent on Sunday, an article by a regular columnist, Andy Martin, reporting that in Cambridge in England, you know, where the university is, he and his family saw this giant craft just hovering and going over him, no more than at a height of more than 400 or 500 feet.
No noise, he said.
Dark outside outline of a craft.
It was nothing like an aircraft.
There were no wings poking out the sides.
Definitely jumbo-sized.
It wasn't going up and it wasn't coming down.
And, you know, that's from a good journalist.
And another journalist, the editor of a paper in southern England, the Southern Daily Echo, reported seeing a large triangular craft in the New Forest.
We are at the top of the hour, and we're going to go to tones very shortly.
Hold on, Timothy.
I'll tell you what I told ABC.
I told them that after seeing what I saw, whether it's us, our back-engineered craft, or even our own craft that now defy gravity, or it's theirs, either way, either way, disclosure of this, oh, that'd be a really big story.
unidentified
Right?
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As I said, with the ABC special coming up on Thursday, the 24th, 8 to 10, a major page in ufology gets turned.
Or the major network finally doing a serious investigative report on ufology.
My guest is a ufologist.
I guess that's fair.
Timothy Goode, one of the world's best available for your questions.
If he knows the answer, I'm sure he'll take a stab at it.
Your opportunity with Timothy Good coming up.
Okay, once again, Timothy Good with us this evening, one of the world's best ufologists, a lot of books under his belt.
Alien Update is one, unearthly disclosure, conflicting interests in the control of extraterrestrial intelligence, alien base, Earth's encounters with extraterrestrials, alien liaison, the ultimate secret, beyond top secret, a worldwide UFO security threat, and of course above top secret, the worldwide UFO cover-up.
And, you know, interestingly, I found a photograph of the painting that was done of what Ramona and I experienced.
And it's sideways.
It's the wrong aspect ratio to try and put on, but I'm going to try it.
It's going to squeeze it weirdly, I think, if I try and put it in my webcam slot.
But I'm going to see what I can do about that in the next hour.
And if I can, I'll get it up there on my webcam.
If it looks too silly when it gets squished, I won't do it.
Once again, here's Timothy Goode, and I would like, of course, to get to some calls this hour.
But Timothy, is there anything that we didn't cover in the first couple of hours that we absolutely should?
Now, for example, well, they may be vaguely familiar.
Back in March of 1997, there was a report that a large triangular craft was seen above the house of Michael Howard, who was then Home Secretary, living down in the marshlands of southern Kent.
And the event was witnessed by a journalist who I spoke to.
There were other witnesses involved who subsequently came forward.
This craft alternately hovered right above Michael Howard's house.
He's currently leader of the Conservative Party and he's hoping to win the election, which we're going to have in May.
But I have got an official request has been put in for information about the event and his opinions and so forth.
And I've already had acknowledgement that he will indeed be replying to this.
So stay tuned.
I'll let you know what he says about it.
But interestingly, this craft alternately hovered right above his house and then retreated, you know, like four or five hundred yards.
Then it came back again, and this was going on.
And at one stage, all the alarms were set off because, obviously, being home secretary at the time, a lot of security guards around the place and dogs and so forth.
And there was pandemonium.
And this was witnessed by a number of people, including some firemen.
So something happened.
And I think that's very interesting.
And, you know, talking about, as we were earlier, about politicians and UFOs.
But this is an election year.
And the least likely subject that any politician is going to get involved with is UFOs.
That's for sure.
And as far as your president is concerned, I do know someone who is a friend of his and has on several occasions asked him.
And the last time he asked him was in late 2003, I believe.
And he said, oh, come on, you know, tell me, you know, blah, blah, blah.
And this chap said, ask Cheney.
That is what George Bush replied.
Whether that's helpful to anybody, I don't know, but that's what your president said regarding the UFO subject.
If you have an opportunity to get to the Coast to Coast AM website, I just took a picture of the picture and put it on my webcam up there.
Now, unfortunately, the proportions are not quite right, but they're close.
I had to squish it to get it in there because it only allows a certain size photograph, 320 by 240, and those are not the appropriate, but it'll be up there in the next five or ten minutes.
So I would love you to see that, Timothy.
It's exactly what we saw.
It'll be up there very shortly.
In the meantime, here are some people who want to talk to you.
First time caller line, you're on the air with Timothy.
Good, all your hard work and research into this field because I've conducted 20 years of my life trying to get answers too as well because I worked in defense and I worked in general aviation for about 12 years.
And I have had enough evidence shown me, and I've seen enough stuff to know that there is definitely something going on.
So just know that in this field, if you really do investigate it too far, you will have uncomfortable situations where people will threaten you.
I was just wondering if you've been threatened too as well.
Timothy, indeed, as you begin to probe secrets and get into areas that perhaps the government is not yet ready to be disclosed, are there ever times when you have been, do you feel in danger?
First of all, I appreciate the extraordinary shrieking sounds, howling sounds on the telephone when engaged in interesting conversations, particularly with my American friends.
I've also, on several occasions, had items taken from my room.
I was in, I think it was Virginia, in the 1970s, touring with a London Symphony Orchestra at a motel.
I noticed two government pool cards were outside.
I didn't pay too much attention to it.
And I went to lunch, and when I came back, my room, someone had been in my room and taken my research notes, but left expensive cameras and zoom lenses and stuff in the room.
So I had no research material with me.
Things like that have happened.
I could go into other cases.
There was a case in, I think it was Raleigh, North Carolina, when I was appearing on a local television station.
And this is my own fault.
I thought I'd just test the system.
I noticed that there was a U.S. Army base, headquarters of the U.S. Army Reserve in Raleigh, North Carolina, not all that far from my motel.
So during this television interview, I happened to mention the alleged briefing about the UFO situation, which was given to U.S. Army Reserve officers in Puerto Rico in the late, late 80s.
And I just thought, I wondered whether there would be any repercussions.
Well, when I came, I also advertised the fact that I would be giving a small talk to some invited guests at the motel at lunchtime.
I went back, I gave the talk, I came back to my room, and a lot of stuff had been stolen from my girlfriend as well at the time.
A lot of stuff.
Now, it could have been somebody.
It could have been an inside job.
I must state that at the outset.
At the same time, the police were not that cooperative.
The best I learnt was that the hotels had hardly ever been broken into.
There were about 400 other rooms.
Nobody else's room had been taken.
So do you think that's intimidation?
Do you think that was done by some military guys?
I don't know.
I keep an open mind about it.
But those are some of the things that have happened to me.
The way to initiate contact, my goodness me, some people don't need to initiate contact, apparently, especially if they're abducted out of their bedrooms in the middle of the night.
My feeling is that one should always ask for protection in these cases.
One way to initiate contact, which worked for me on two occasions, which I discussed on this program, I believe back in August when I was last on, is to try telepathy, because these beings are very telepathic.
And I don't know about the current timeframe, but there were a number of these people based on our planet at the time, and they can pick up your thoughts.
And they have interacted with human beings who've sent out telepathic signals.
It certainly worked for me, and I had my own very close encounter through that.
Second part of your question, as far as Billy Meyer is concerned, you might be surprised to learn that I actually discovered Billy Meyer when I was in India in 1964.
I didn't meet him then, but I met his friends.
This was long before the story had come out.
And I then traced him to Switzerland, and I spoke to him, and I thought he sounded sincere.
However, in the 1970s, when Lou Zinstag, who got to know him, because I gave her his address, she spent a lot of time with him and thought he was sincere and everything.
But I became very, very dubious about the photographs that he was promoting for all sorts of reasons, which we probably don't have time to go into now.
And I know many people think they're genuine, but I do not.
But I do think that Billy Meyer did have contact at some time.
And then maybe just to sort of gain more credence in these stories, he produced the photographs.
But he's an interesting character, that's for sure.
And at various times, people come on this program and they virtually shred each other, as if it's not tough enough with the mass media out there and the government and all the institutions laughing and it's not tough enough.
Yes, well, I'm afraid there's always going to be rivalry and politics in any sphere of, in any subject, and ufology is no exception.
I think it's not just people sort of knocking each other that's the problem.
There's also, I think, the people with wild claims, really wild unproven claims, who come forward and get an awful lot of attention.
I'm not going to go into any names, but I think that does a great deal more harm to the subject and it plays into the government's and the media's hands when people make these wild claims.
Okay, that sure does make it a tough job, Timothy, a really hard job, because most of these claims, by their very nature, are pretty fantastic, aren't they?
May I mention very briefly, in case it gets forgotten, I am going to be in the States in April and speaking at the Ozark UFO Conference, the annual Ozark UFO conference, which is www.ozarkufo.com, all lowercase, OZARKUFO.com.
And the other speakers include Linda Howe, Grant Cameron, Wendell Stevens, Nancy Talbot, and Scott Ramsey, who will be discussing the Aztec case of 1948.
He's got a lot of new evidence for that.
Bill Hamilton, and David Mahler, who will be discussing flying triangles in particular.
Well, first of all, let me mention that Roger Lear, L-E-I-R, has written a book on his investigations, his extraction of some of these objects from quite a number of patients.
It may be an arm as well, but Whitley Striber, a very good friend of mine, co-author of the book we wrote that became the movie, he had an implant that moved.
They tried to retrieve it from his ear, and the damn thing, the scalpel touched it, and it moved.
Also, the late Dr. John Altschuler, a hematologist, and the first to investigate the animal mutilations, was also the first to excise unknown foreign objects from a few patients, and one of which he thought was just sort of aggregation of human tissue.
It's on my website now, or the website on my webcam.
It says Arts Webcam.
Go to CoastToCoastAM.com.
upper left-hand corner, it says Art's webcam.
I would swear to you on a stack of Bibles, as would my wife, It's actually a much higher resolution picture, so it's squished, but that's exactly what we saw.
The proportion actually is pretty close in terms of the vehicle.
You can judge by how my Geometro is squished a little bit, how the rest of it is squished, but that's it, baby.
That's what we saw, and I'd swear that on a stack of Bibles.
First home caller line, you're on the air with Timothy.
Good.
Good morning.
unidentified
Good morning.
I was wanting to find out from Timothy, how many people do you believe, if you believe, I'm not sure if you do or not, are possibly descendants from an alien race or people from the UFOs and stuff, you know?
think it's quite likely that many many aeons of time ago there were advanced races who'd maybe colonized this planet and they were through some cataclysm were forced to seek other habitation in that connection I'm very interested in He's a scientist, a meteorologist from Brazil.
He's also a former CIA communications specialist, and he's been on numerous Antarctic expeditions as a meteorologist, including many with the United States Navy.
He had a type of contact with ETs and was given proof of their, for example, their ability to change weather because he was a meteorologist, and they certainly proved their existence To him, he saw their craft.
And he said, These cosmic visitors proclaim a genetic origin linked to our own species on Earth, though they inhabit a dying planet where we would have to manipulate time and space dimensions to reach.
And that's what Rubens Villella wrote in a letter to Michael Collins, the Apollo 11 astronaut in 1979.
And remember, he himself acknowledged that there were several species coming here, and in particular, with the species that he was familiar with, he said, they desire an alliance without fear and offer us protection against impending cosmic dangers.
I also learnt and emphasized, Rubens Vilella, certain other alien species are inimical to human beings, so there are dangers.
Have there been mentions, Timothy, of not just bombs that we might do ourselves away with, but our current environmental situation, which seems quite distressing.
The contactee, for example, Enrique Castillo-Rincon, I've written several chapters about him in my last book, Unearthly Disclosure, and he was given a tremendous amount of information about coming cataclysms on this planet.
He actually says, I do not give an account of the calamities announced by the instrument because they had information covering many years as to how the facts will unwind.
And he goes into some detail.
I'm just checking through my book here.
I can't remember everything.
He was taken to several alien bases, one of which was under the Pacific Ocean in the Marianas Trench, which is about 11,500 meters down.
But the base was located in a wall of that area.
And an extraordinary story.
And he was given information about coming events on this planet, including enormous geological cataclysms and the fact that the sun, there would be problems with our sun, which would lead to severe, very severe problems on Earth.
First, let me just say this, and I have the most respect for both of you gentlemen.
I don't believe in any of this UFO stuff.
I never have.
I am a hardcore Bible-believing Christian.
But that being said, I do believe people are seeing things, no doubt about it.
But my question, sir, is if in this day and age we live in, such a new age, such all different things, you know, anything goes, why would the government hide these things?
And if these things exist, just tell us.
I mean, obviously I have my own opinion on what these are, just like most Christians.
And I have another quick question.
Survey true Christians, and if you ever have done that to see exactly what the percentage of their sightings or their abductions would be, I think you'll find that it's almost 0%.
If it turned out that you were entirely wrong, and this really was various other intelligent races visiting Earth for whatever motivation, and that actually turned out to be the case irrefutably, how disturbed by that fact would you be?
Well, honestly.
unidentified
Let me just say this real quick.
When God created the universe, okay, before Satan fell, we don't know what was out there.
When Satan fell, the earth and the universe was corrupt forever.
So yes, there could be, because when God said let there be, the universe is still being.
if it turned out irrefutably that they were our creators, not the way it's in the Bible, that would put you in tilt, wouldn't it?
unidentified
Well, I guess that would...
Okay, I understand it.
If there is a God that is a perfect God, right, and makes no mistakes, then why would he make the horrible mistake of sending his Son to be our Savior?
All right, well, it seemed to me that Timothy seemed to suggest, if you were listening carefully between the lines, that Jesus might have been an alien.
Jesus said in the book of John on two occasions, I am not of this world.
Now, I'm sure Rick will Say, well, of course, that was just metaphorical, which it well might have been.
I wasn't there.
But you can't get away from the star of Bethlehem, the bodily ascension into heaven surrounded by two beings in shining raiment, his remarkable abilities, and so forth, and the appearance to the conversion of Paul on the road to Damascus when Jesus appeared in some kind of brilliant object in the sky.
Things like that, I think, and of course the angel Gabriel, what are angels?
They're not creatures with flapping wings.
An angel simply means a messenger, and they're normally described, even if they come from the heavens, meaning the sky, possibly as human beings, human-type beings.
And that goes into the Old Testament as well, because people who encountered mysterious beings coming from the sky said, and this was their appearance.
Well, would you say that people like Rick, and he sounded like a very nice guy, but he did dance around that question quite a bit, as in not actually answering it.
He would go on tilt for sure if that kind of irrefutable proof was presented to him because it would violate everything he believes and has faith in.
And Brookings Institute, I think, said that for that very reason we couldn't disclose this.
Timothy, a while back, last year when you were in Tucson, Arizona, you interviewed a friend of mine about his encounter when he was back in the 70s when he was in the.
The incident took place not in 1975, as he thought it, but it was 1976 on board the USS Forrestal, when, to cut a long story short, there was a NASA shockwave test, which I have found did definitely take place, because I'm doing a lot of research into that case.
And then these unidentified submarine objects appeared in a completely smooth sea.
The sea suddenly went smooth.
Two circular craft and two triangular craft with all sorts of lights on them came up from the sea and the seam.
And there's a lot, lot more to that story, but I don't want to compromise Bill in any way, and I don't want to compromise my own investigations because I am in touch with some naval people about this case.
He's not on the Internet, of course, and I was going to phone him, but it just slipped my mind at the last time and so forth, because I would have liked him.
The question I have with all of the I too am a Christian.
My name is Patrick from Oklahoma.
And I too am a Christian, but all of this is rather spine-tinkling type of conversation and realization.
But my question is, do you have any stories of times that you've come across aliens or stories of aliens or UFOs that just gave you a sense of evil definitively?