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June 12, 2002 - Art Bell

02:49:09

Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell - Dr. Carl Edward Baugh - Creation Evidence

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Speaker	Time	Text
unidentified		Welcome to Art Bell Somewhere in Time.
unidentified		Tonight featuring coast to coast a.m. from June 12th, 2002.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		From the high desert in the great American Southwest.
		I bid you good evening, good afternoon, good morning, whatever the case may be, wherever you are in all of the Earth's time zones, which one way or the other we cover.
		We are literally everywhere.
		And now we're in Auburn, New York, welcoming another new affiliate.
		They just keep coming.
		WAUB in Auburn, New York.
		That's a nice one.
		Auburn, New York.
		$15.90 on the dial there.
		DM is Alan Bishop, and the TV is Doug Finch.
		Thank you both.
		I would say to you, Ellen and Doug, take a deep breath tonight.
		Every night.
		But especially early on.
		When your listeners begin, you know, hearing things that they haven't heard before.
		It will cause a disturbance in the sports.
		Well, I was going to lead off with regular news this morning, but a good ham friend of mine across town said, oh my god, have you seen Drudge?
		Breaking news on the Drudge Report.
		Attention keeps rolling.
		I want to get a link up.
unidentified		The story is too incredible.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Matt Drudge does well in finding this stuff, and Matt got it from The Guardian.
		Got it quickly from The Guardian, you know, in Great Britain.
		And I just don't get it.
		I don't get it.
		I don't get it.
		I've never gotten it.
		I still don't get it today.
		I mean, we have the big free press in this country, right?
		Great Britain has actually clamps on their press, but they keep writing these stories that we don't get.
		Headline is, now showing on satellite TV, secret American spy photos.
		This is a lead story on Drudge from The Guardian.
		European satellite TV viewers, brace yourself, folks, can watch live broadcasts of peacekeeping and anti-terrorist operations being conducted by the U.S. spy planes over the Balkans.
		Normally secret video links from the American spies in the sky have a serious security problem, a problem that will make it easier for terrorists to tune in to live video of U.S. intelligence activity than to get Disney cartoons or new release movies.
		For more than six months, six months, live pictures from manned spy aircraft and drones have been broadcast through a satellite over Brazil.
		The satellite Telstar 11 is a commercial TV relay.
		The U.S. spy plane broadcasts are not encrypted, meaning that anyone in the region with a normal satellite TV receiver can watch surveillance operations as they happen.
		The satellite feeds also have been connected to the internet, potentially allowing the missions to be watched from anywhere around the globe.
		NATO officials, I'm jumping ahead, whose forces in the former Yugoslavia depend on the U.S. missions for intelligence, at first expressed disbelief at the reports.
		After inquiring, a NATO spokesman confirmed, quote, we're aware that this imagery is put on a communications satellite.
		The distribution of this material is handled by the United States, and we're content that they're following appropriate levels of security, end quote.
		This lapse in U.S. security was discovered last year by a British engineer and satellite enthusiast, John Locker, and he went nuts.
		You know, he thought the U.S. had committed a deadly error, and he tried to tell everybody about it, and they didn't want to listen.
		They just didn't want to listen.
		The flights conducted by U.S. Army and Navy units in AirScan Inc., a Florida-based private military company, are used to monitor terrorists and smugglers trying to cross borders to track down arms caches, keep watches on suspect premises.
		The aircraft are equipped to watch at night using infrared.
		And we, quote, we seem to be transmitting this information potentially straight to our enemies, said one U.S. military intelligence official who was alerted to the leak, adding, quote, I'd be worried that using this information, the people we are tracking will see what we are looking at and much more worryingly, what we are not looking at.
		This could let people see where our forces are and what they're doing.
		That's putting our boys at risk.
		So in other words, it boils down to the fact that for six months, all the secret spy operations there have been on open satellite TV washing over Europe.
		Holy mackerel.
		Yeah, I know it's unbelievable.
		But it's from The Guardian in Great Britain, well respected, and it's the number one item on Matt Drudge's site, and I caught it just before airtime, thanks to a good ham friend of mine.
		Unblinking believable.
		Oh, man.
		U.S. Air Force MC-138 transport plane carrying 10 people crashed on takeoff in Afghanistan Wednesday.
		Now we have three Americans dead.
		Seven others escaped with rather minor injuries.
		The crash, the deadliest in the Afghan campaign, since seven Marines were killed in January, did not appear to have been caused by hostile fire.
		The jury, in its seventh day of deliberating Arthur Anderson's obstruction of justice trial, said it was deadlocked.
		But the judge told them, get back to work.
		Anyway, don't care if you're deadlocked, really.
		Go back to work.
		And they said, we're not able to reach a unanimous decision, but the judge said, try harder, I guess.
		In Colorado, hundreds Of firefighters now attacking the huge wildfires outside Denver, putting themselves between the southwestern suburbs and the flames that have sent smoke across the region, actually, indeed the region, state after state.
		The fire has burned now 90,000 acres in the foothills southwest of Denver since it began on Saturday.
		But it has not, good news, it has not grown much since yesterday, giving the fire cruiser a chance to go on the offensive for the first time in about 24 hours.
		The tracking of Jose Padilla's alleged dirty bomb plot to Pakistan adds to growing evidence that some members of Al-Qaeda have begun using Pakistan as a base plan in international terrorist operations.
		Jose Padilla, the American citizen, being held by the military as the enemy combatant is accused of being part of the plot or a plot to detonate a radiological weapon here in the U.S. Here's kind of an interesting example.
		This really is interesting, and it's one of those things that I thought you might like to know.
		Again, you've got to wonder, but this is all common knowledge.
		There is now a website, apparently, that you can go to, and it's under What's New on my website, and then it'll link you over there, and it says, Nuclear Waste Route Maps.
		I repeat, nuclear waste route maps.
		Now, these maps have been compiled, show the roads that will be closest to you, or how close on the various routes nuclear waste will get to you on a road.
		So all you do is you go there and put in your zip code or information about where you are.
		And it shows you exactly what road will come closest, how close the nuclear waste is going to come to your house.
		So if you're interested in that, if you're curious about how close this stuff that has to be kept well for tens of thousands of years, lest it kill us, how close that's going to come to you, then go ahead up and enter your information.
		Now, one might also speculate that information like this would be of help to anybody with a handheld missile or something like that, helping the enemy, you know, because it's going to be really dangerous transporting this stuff, much more than storing it, actually.
		Transportation is very dangerous.
		But it's up on the internet, so there you go.
		Go take a look.
		If you want to know how close this poison will come to you, that will tell you right now.
		Then there's a second item on the website, which is entitled Canada Leading.
		And you might want to take a look at that, both north and south of the Canadian border.
		Both of those are under what's new at my website, artbuild.com, right now.
	Okay, in a moment, I've got a couple of other items for you.
	Oh, yes, coming up tonight, in the second hour, is somebody who's really been a big hit here, Carl Edward Baugh.
	So he's a, who is Carl Edward Baugh?
	Dr. Carl Baugh, actually, is a creationist.
	He's doing some really, really interesting things that I really want to ask about.
	He's putting together this biosphere.
	And what he's, I think, I believe he's attempting to do is create the conditions that were on Earth when life emerged, supposedly, all those many years ago, however many years ago life emerged.
	We argue a lot about that on this program.
	You know, how did we emerge and when did we emerge and all the rest of that?
	Well, anyway, he's a creationist and he's a bright guy.
	Now, I think what will make the program really interesting is if a lot of you who are not creationists, but a lot of you who are evolutionists, call in and we have a spirited debate.
	Oh, speaking of spirited debates, next week, I forget which day, but next week, we're going to have a representative from SETI, the search for extraterrestrial intelligence, not my frequent guest and good friend, but another representative of SETI.
	And my good friend up there in the northern time zones, time zones away, Stanton Friedman.
	And that should be a rather interesting debate.
	They know each other, apparently.
	So we shouldn't expect the blows to be too hard.
	But it will certainly be interesting.
	That's coming up next week.
	More in a moment.
unidentified		More in a moment.
		Now we take you back to the night of June 12, 2002, on Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
		Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Here is what I consider to be a very legit email that I just received.
		And if this gentleman would like to contact me and pursue the matter on the radio with me, I would very much enjoy that.
		If you do not wish to do that, I understand.
		On April 14th, 2002, he says, I was operating a disc in a field near Hagerman, Idaho.
		I happened upon six dead calves.
		These calves do not belong to me, nor have I been able to locate any other rancher in the area who knew a thing about them.
		This is highly unusual since everyone knows each Other here in these parts.
		What is more unusual is that each animal had its skin removed from the hawks on the front legs down to the hawks on the hind legs.
		The sex organs were also removed, and there was no blood in or around any of these animals.
		I initially dismissed this as kids getting out of control until three men arrived in a white van without plates.
		The men asked me some questions.
		I had taken some photos, and one of them confiscated my film.
		They removed the animals, placing a white substance which appeared to be some sort of bleach or lye mixture and left.
		I called the State Department of Agriculture to complain, and he said they had no record of any such activity and for me to stick to farming.
		Now, I'm not some dim-witted or crazy old man.
		I know what I saw.
		Anyhow, I got on the internet and read about other incidents.
		I saw a picture of a guy examining a mutilated calf in Oregon, and he was the same guy I saw in my field.
		I've listened to your show at night, and you seem to know people involved in this sort of thing.
		Can you give me any idea what it's all about?
		I don't want my family involved in some crazy big deal, but I would like someone to tell me what might be going on here and why these men can come on to my outfit and leave without any proper papers.
		Now, I'm going to withhold the man's name, but I am going to request, sir, that you contact me privately and that we proceed in an appropriate manner.
		And maybe it's that I should have you on the air.
		That's usually what I do.
		I would prefer really sharing it with everybody.
		And then if some investigators, and I know many of those, would like to pick up on this, they're welcome to take it from there if he wants it.
		If not, I'll protect your privacy.
		You can just come on the air, or you can just, and I don't prefer this, talk to me privately because I'd just soon, I really like sharing with the audience whatever it is that's going on.
		In fact, I'll tell most of my guests, don't talk to me about the subject we're about to talk about now.
		Wait until we're on the air because I want to hear it when everybody else does it.
		It's the only way I can react properly, in my opinion, is to hear it when you all hear it.
		And then there's one more here.
		It's kind of interesting.
		The other day, my wife and I went out for an ice cream.
		It's been warm here, and so we went to the local Dairy Queen drive-through, stopped the auto in front of the drive-thru and placed an order.
		I noticed there was nobody behind the wheel of the car in front of me.
		I was amazed, absolutely amazed, and I watched to see what would happen.
		Bear in mind, this is the car in front of the guy, right?
		So when the car's order was passed to the driver from the pickup window, I saw, get this, I saw the bag go into the car, but then I watched as a driverless car drove away.
		In other words, here he is at the Dairy Queen, right?
		And the car in front of him is, you know, ready to pick up the order, just sitting there waiting, and you're behind him, right?
		And he's seeing there's nobody there.
		There's nobody in the car.
		Next thing he's seeing, the bag is floating through the air and grabbed up by something in the car, lowered, and the car drives away.
		The driverless car just drove away.
		I asked my wife if she saw it, and she said, saw what?
		I swear, Art, I'm not making any of this up.
		It was an invisible person.
		Well, we have done some shows on invisibility, and it's a very, very, very interesting subject, more interesting than you know.
		Somebody last night mentioned the Inuit, and there's a very long article about scientists heeding Inuit warnings of climate change in Arctic, and it starts out like this.
		And so it has come to be, the elders say, a time when icebergs are melting, tides have changed, polar bears have thinned, and there is no meaning left in a ring around the moon.
		Scattered clouds blowing in a wind no longer speak to elders and hunters.
		Daily weather markers are becoming less predictable in the fragile Arctic as its climate changes.
		Inuit leaders and hunters who depend on the land say they are disturbed by what they are seeing, swept in by the changes that we're experiencing.
		Deformed fish, caribou with bad livers, baby seals left by their mothers to starve.
		Just the other year, a robin appeared where no robin had been ever seen before.
		There is no word for robin in the Inuit language.
		Elders say they're afraid of the changes.
		Quote, when I was a child, if there was a ring around the sun or the moon, it meant the change of weather in the next few days.
		Better or worse, it was nature's message for the hunter.
		Said one native, he is walking on a thick layer of ice frozen over the Arctic waters.
		The hills behind him should still be covered in snow, but they're mostly bare now.
		As this winter ends, he says, it has been warmer than past winters.
		The bald spots showing in the tundra are very disturbing.
	This native grew up in an igloo, says there are more signs.
	Land, sea, and animals are in turmoil.
	The weather pattern has changed so much from my childhood, he says.
	We have more accidents because the ice conditions change.
	We're living in one of the most unforgiving climates in The entire world, and it is becoming more dangerous every year.
	So, you know, that's something for you to think about.
	Well, anyway, half an hour of open lines coming up directly.
	I'm Art Bell.
unidentified		You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time.
		Tonight featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from June 12th, 2002.
		I'm never frightened or worried.
		I know I always get by.
		I love it.
		I'm cool down.
		Something gets in my way.
		I know we're let life get me down.
		Don't let it wave up my ticket.
		You take it back.
		Music, man.
		Yeah.
		Here, but now they're gone.
		Seasons don't feel the reaper.
		Nor do the wind, the sun, and the rain.
		We could be like they are.
		Come on, baby.
		Don't feel the reaper.
		Baby, take my hand.
		Don't feel the reaper.
		We'll be able to fly.
		No, baby.
		No, baby.
		I'm no, baby.
		La, la, la, la, la, la, la.
		La, la, la, la, la, la.
		Paladine is done.
		You're listening to Art Bell Somewhere in Time on Premier Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from June 12, 2002.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Bob in Fort Lauderdale, Fast Blast Me AR.
		Would you rather be able to fly or be invisible?
		That's easy.
		Fly.
		Invisible?
		Eh.
		I can see small possible advantages and things, but fly?
		Oh, listen.
		Build me those wings.
		You remember talking to a geneticist who said that you might actually be able to build wings on a human being?
		Hey, put me down right at the top of the list.
		Boy, would I love to be able to fly.
		Maybe I was a bird in some previous incarnation, or maybe I'll be one in some future incarnation, if in fact that's what happens.
		I doubt Dr. Ball, who's on in a little while, is going to think that's true at all.
unidentified		Shhhhhh.
		Oh.
		Oh.
		you you Now we take you back to the night of June 12, 2002, on Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I want to remind my audience that something's coming up, and very happily so, and I hope so if my back does not intervene.
		I'm going on vacation from July 20th, June 20th rather, through July 1st.
		And I know with the time off I've had with the wicked disease in the back and all the rest of it, it seems strange, but I actually haven't had a vacation.
		Believe me, those weren't vacations.
		And so I'm going to take a vacation.
		It's a unique time in the taking of ratings when there's one break.
		If there's one break in the entire year, that's when it is.
		And we don't know what we're going to do.
		We're probably going to get in the RV and go short trips, you know, short trips.
		Now, vacations for me have always been problematic because usually the world falls apart.
		I mean, something really awful happens.
		And we're going to hope this is the exception year.
		Nothing gigantic happens.
		If something too monstrous happens, I'll just come back.
		Because I'll be around.
		I'm not going that far.
		We're going to stay on the road, which is what a lot of Americans are doing.
		But if you hadn't heard that, I announced it a week or so ago or something.
		I thought I would mention it.
		All right, into the night we go.
		On the first time, call our line.
		You're on the air.
		Good morning.
		Hello.
unidentified		Good morning.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		All right.
unidentified		This is John from Fraser, Michigan, CKLW.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
unidentified		I was listening to your program yesterday, and very interesting as usual.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Nancy Leader, Planet X. Isn't that something?
unidentified		You know, I was wondering, I heard about the effects and everything coming for our planet here and what could happen to us and all, but was there anything mentioned about what might happen to our moon or maybe Mercury or Venus seeing?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's really, you know, especially our moon.
		Now, there's a really good question.
		It'll be millions of miles away, but between the sun and the earth.
		Planet X coming in.
		So, yeah, I didn't ask her about the moon.
		That's a pretty interesting question.
		Boy, what if it took the moon away?
		Then on top of all our other troubles, we wouldn't have any more tides.
unidentified		Or even to flex the moon towards us.
unidentified		I mean, you know, that could cause some kind of pretty big collision.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You want to be able to see those craters close up, but not that close.
		That's for sure.
		All right, sir.
		Well, listen, I'll tell you.
		I'm planning Friday night, this Friday night, Saturday morning, I'm going to do a show predicated on the belief that Planet X is real and that we have about a year to go.
		Now, my question for you is going to, I haven't concocted it totally, but it's going to roughly be, if you found out you had that Planet X was coming, nine out of ten Americans, and in fact, the world's population are going to bite the dust,
		if what she said is true, and you always have to bear in mind that she could easily be wrong, but just predicated on the possibility that all will end soon, you know, We get three or four months' warning or something like that.
		I'd like to know what you would do with that time.
		Would you begin digging a hole?
		Would you become a survivalist?
		Would you walk out with open arms, welcome it?
		Would you party down?
		There are a million different reactions, I think, that people would have.
		And so we'll draw out that scenario and we'll see what people say if this Planet X thing is real.
		And I've had several guests now on the subject.
		And, you know, just because I have guests on the subject doesn't mean it's real.
		There are things suggesting there could be certainly a kernel of something to it.
		That ABC news story was something, huh?
		So you never know.
		And I think it would make an extremely interesting open line show.
		And so I'm kind of half planning that in my head right now.
		Wildcard Line, you are on the air.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning, Mr. Bell.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Where are you, sir?
unidentified		I am in San Antonio, WOXI.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		W-O-A-I.
unidentified		That's correct.
unidentified		I'm sorry.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you're $1,200 on the day.
		I'll tell you something.
		You know, like when you go down to Mazatlan or somewhere like that down in Mexico, and you get a good AM radio, which I always take.
		I used to take a lot of vacations down there.
		W-O-A-I is like the only American thing just pounding in like a local state.
unidentified		Oh, yeah.
unidentified		I believe that's your flagship.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, it's incredible.
unidentified		Right.
unidentified		They like you a lot.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They're good people.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Anyway, what's up?
unidentified		Well, on the Drudge Report?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, the Drudge Report, yeah.
unidentified		Mr. Bell, for the last six months, I have been trying desperately to let you know that existed.
		That satellite is the satellite that, believe it or not, is not a black hole.
		That satellite is captured in a legal battle maneuvering.
		And I am the one that is having that legal battle maneuvering.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, look, if it's in the clear, I would imagine maybe from San Antonio, if you've got a pretty good C-bandish, you could probably capture a satellite from Brazil, and you could be watching this stuff.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is what's happening.
unidentified		You know, the satellite that that is using is that when the Map 3 Delta went out and they changed the configuration to look for a beam of light, that beam of light is a beam of light of the coordinates that I gave them.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, all I can say is we must have lost our minds.
		You've got to wonder who would make the decision to take classified real-time U.S. Intel satellite photographs and aircraft photographs of ongoing military operations and put it on a satellite, put it on a satellite in the clear, and for six months at that.
		And so, you know, if the average person knows, then you can be pretty damn sure the enemy knows, and they're probably sitting there with their big screen on watching what we're watching.
		And as it was pointed out in the article, if they know what we're watching, then they know where not to be.
		You know, I mean, that's the mildest form of trouble it would cause.
		They would know where not to be.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Morning, Art.
unidentified		How are you doing?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, sir.
unidentified		This is Willie from San Antonio.
unidentified		Two calls in a row.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, no kidding.
		How about that?
		All right.
unidentified		Looks like Hoagland's right, possibly about a manned mission to Mars.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh.
unidentified		Just received my latest issue of, let's just say it's an astronomy magazine.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		And inside is an ad from NASA.
		They're looking for some people, just like me and you, go down there and volunteer, or I guess they're going to pay, for a long-duration testing on their centrifuge.
		They want to test people up to 2Gs for as long as 22 hours non-stop.
		Now, why would they need to do that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I mean, for sure.
		That's a tremendous point you're making.
		I'm not so sure that I'd do that, though, but I'm sure there are a lot of people who will.
unidentified		Oh, I certainly wouldn't.
unidentified		I mean, I'd love to ride on the centrifuge, but not for 22 hours straight and have them poking and prodding on me.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's what I'm saying.
		You know, you're going to have a million things connected up to you.
		You know that.
unidentified		Right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And you're going to weigh twice what you normally weigh for that many hours, right?
unidentified		Yep, doesn't sound like a comfortable ride.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I hope they pay well.
unidentified		But I'm just thinking, you know, why would they need to do that?
		You know, long duration, high Gs.
		What do we have that necessitates that kind of research?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sounds like Mars to me.
unidentified		Same here.
unidentified		Well, I'll be interested to hear Hoakland comment on that next time he's on the show.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And now, you're maintaining this is an ad in a paper down there.
unidentified		It's in Astronomy Magazine.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In Astronomy Magazine.
		Would you do me a favor and if you're able to, well, if you're not, somebody will scan it and send it to me.
		I want to see that.
unidentified		I'm not able to, but it's in the July issue, page 31.
		Can't miss it.
		They've got their email addresses and the whole nine yards on there, so evidently they're serious about it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I appreciate the call, sir.
unidentified		Sure thing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, isn't that intriguing?
		Isn't that intriguing?
		So NASA wants to look at the effects of 2Gs for that long.
		Now, why would they want to do that?
		Sounds like Mars to me.
		He's got a very, very good point.
		Very good point.
		I bet Richard just sat straight up in his chair.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Good morning.
unidentified		How are you?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, sir.
unidentified		Yes, this is Brian from Las Vegas, Nevada.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, Brian.
unidentified		How are you today?
		Fine.
		Well, I'm calling because I talked to you a couple of days ago.
		I asked you if you had read the Urantia book.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
unidentified		And the reason I asked about that was because I have, since I've been listening to your show about the mid-part of 1998, I have also been reading the Urantia book.
		And I couldn't help but notice that there was a lot of similarities between your show And the book itself.
		I suppose that's true, yes.
		Although I don't know exactly what you thought of the book or if you felt that if it had any credence or if it was baloney.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I thought, if you want to know the truth, I thought both.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, some of it I thought baloney, some of it I give some credence to.
unidentified		Well, the biggest question of all is, do you believe what it says about its authors?
unidentified		That they are celestial beings that wrote the book and presented it to some people here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, the way I'm going to answer that is the way I'm going to answer, for example, what Nancy Leder presented last night on the program.
		I don't know.
		I'm sorry, I honestly don't know.
		Stanton Friedman would say and will say next week in the debate, I'm sure, you know, that goes in the gray box.
		I just don't know.
		What I try to do on this program is to get a guest on the air and then allow them to make their best case.
		I try to help them highlight their best case.
		And that's because I want to hear their whole story.
		I really want to hear it.
		And because I present it, it would be presumptuous of anybody out there to think that I endorse it, unless I say so.
		Occasionally I will do that.
		I'll say, oh, I absolutely believe that.
		Otherwise, you should assume that I, like you, I'm listening to it and absorbing it and not necessarily believing it, but just sort of putting it in, you know, filing it away in a place where it's one of those things that I wonder about.
		People automatically assume I believe all this stuff.
		That's dangerously incorrect.
		I don't.
		I very much enjoy hearing about it.
		Some of what has happened to me on this program has led me to certain belief systems, but very little of it.
		With regard to mass consciousness, for example, I have definitely turned a corner on that one.
		The power of mass consciousness.
		I'm in awe of that, and I definitely believe that is absolutely real.
		But, you know, when you're talking about Planet X, for example, and 9 out of 10 humans dying and all the rest of it, I don't know.
		It's concerning, worrisome, but I don't necessarily believe it, nor do I necessarily disbelieve it.
		Wildcard line, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
		Yeah, hi, Art.
		This is Raymond.
		I'm calling from Michigan.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, Raymond.
unidentified		I heard you speaking about that guy in line at the Dairy Queen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Who saw no one in the car in front of him?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Even better, he saw the bag passed to an apparently invisible hand.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And then he saw the car with the invisible driver pull away with the aforementioned goodies and just go away.
unidentified		Now, if it was you, when you pulled up, wouldn't you have asked the person at the window if there was anyone in the car?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I would have.
unidentified		And he didn't mention that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, he didn't.
unidentified		If it was me, I would have said, hey, was anyone in that car, you know?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I mean, if you were some poor schmook working at Dairy Queen and handed a bag out and an invisible hand grabbed it, you'd probably want to be off for the rest of the day, wouldn't you?
unidentified		Sure, I'd think so.
unidentified		And by the way, put me down for being able to fly over invisibility.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I think so.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In fact, actually, it would be kind of fun to demonstrate flight so others could see it.
unidentified		Sure.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right?
unidentified		I think the novelty of invisibility would wear off, but the advantages of flight would stay with you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Very good, sir.
		You're exactly right.
		Now, if you could be invisible at will and then visible again, it would get a little closer, but it still wouldn't approach flight.
unidentified		No, I agree.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, thanks for the call.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Take care.
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Being able to fly.
		Oh, my, would I love to be able to fly.
		I've always wanted to.
		I keep talking about an ultra-light aircraft.
		I would love to get an ultra-light aircraft, and I can afford to, but nobody will let me.
		Wife veto power, you know, and all that sort of stuff.
		We've had some discussions.
		Hello, they're on the first time.
		Caller line, you're on the air.
		Hello?
unidentified		Hello?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, you're on the air, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Bingo, your time.
unidentified		This is Morris from Utah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Morris from Utah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What's up?
unidentified		I heard you talking about the guy that had the six mutilated calves in Idaho or whatever.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Somewhere I've got a picture of one that I had.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Did you get a visit from anybody?
unidentified		No.
		No visit at all.
		In the area, there's been quite a lot of strange stuff like that going on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm well aware of where you are, and yes, I'm aware of what's been going on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You live in a pretty strange area, as do I, sir.
unidentified		And somewhere I have a picture of it, the cuts were like a laser.
		I mean, no blood, no nothing.
		It took the, off my calf, it took the over the nose and on the cheek, the height, and then where the udder would be.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If you have any way to scan that photograph and send it to me, I would really like that.
unidentified		Okay, where would I send it to?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You would send it to me, artbell, A-R-T-B-E-L-L, at mindspring.com.
unidentified		MindSpring?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yep, mind.
		M-I-N-D-S-P-R-I-N-G.com.
		Artbell at mindspring.com.
		Or failing that, artbell at A-O-L.com also.
		So one way or the other, send it to me.
unidentified		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Well, that's your heart.
		Thank you.
		The more documentation we can get of that, maybe, maybe eventually we can get to the bottom of it.
unidentified		It just doesn't make sense.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Six cows mutilated.
		People from the government, ostensibly, I guess, show up, take the carcasses, put down lie or something, and leave.
		After confiscating the film, I might add.
		I don't know, it just doesn't make sense.
		What the hell would our government need with cows?
		They could get all the cows they want.
		Now, granted, they might not be able to get cows.
		Well, you know what?
		They could even get cows and put them in areas that they would want to put them to observe environmental effects, just in case you think that's what it's all about.
		And I've frequently thought that.
		I don't know, it's a sincere mystery, and in all the mutilations, there's never been an arrest.
		There's never been signs of human activity.
		You know, it's a genuine, serious mystery.
		Wildcard line, you're on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hi.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
		Wait a minute, dear.
		Start by turning off your radio.
		Okay, I'll wait while you do that.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, your name, first name only.
unidentified		Jeanette.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Jeanette.
unidentified		Okay.
unidentified		I was wondering, my brother listens to your show a lot, and he mentioned something about a Native American guy.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		And I'm guessing kind of thing either from Montana or Wyoming area.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		And I was wondering what his name was, because I haven't been able, I looked on your website and I can't figure out.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm afraid I'm not going to be able to help you.
		I've interviewed many, many, many Native American elders, Native Americans, and so I'm sorry, and I can't help you.
		Without knowing more than that, just a Native American who was on your show from somewhere in the West isn't close enough.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
		Yes.
		Hello, Art.
		Hello.
		This is Mike in the Music City.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Nashville.
unidentified		At the LAC, 50 City.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		50,000, 50,000 watts all over everywhere.
unidentified		Right.
		Hey, Art, I wanted to ask you something.
		On this channel sometimes, and I don't know if it's coming from your end or our end, and maybe some of the other people that are listening can call in and see if they do it.
		But there's an awful hum that comes in over the broadcast.
		It's not doing it right at this time.
		But last night I was listening.
		I've been listening to you for 10 years.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, well, let me pass this on to you.
		Usually it's on your end.
		Usually a hum.
		Not always, but 90% of the time at least, it's something local.
		It's some sort of AC hum being picked up by your radio by some device operating somewhere there.
unidentified		Okay.
unidentified		Well, I just, I had talked with one other friend of mine that listens to you too that I introduced you to or introduced him to.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And they humbly.
unidentified		And he said the same thing, and he lives up in a little town called Laverne, not far from Nashville, where I live.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, well, my suggestion is begin turning off devices one at a time.
		If the hum finally doesn't go away when you get everything off, then it's probably on the station.
		I'm Art Bell.
		This is Coast.
unidentified		You're listening to Art Bell Somewhere in Time on Premier Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from June 12, 2002.
		But he left me much too soon, his ladybird.
		He left his ladybird.
		Ladybird, come on down.
		I'm here waiting on the ground.
		Once upon a time, once when you were in your life,
		As I wonder where you are I wonder if you think about me Once upon a time In your wildest dreams Once the world was new Our bodies but the morning dew That greets the brand new day We
		couldn't tear ourselves away I wonder if you came I wonder if you still remember Once upon a time In your wildest dreams Premier Radio Networks presents Art Bell Somewhere in Time.
		Tonight's program originally aired June 12th, 2002.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, this should be very interesting.
		And let me tell you what I'm hoping for to begin with.
		i'm hoping for some form of a intelligent debate that means that uh...
		He's the creationist creationist, I guess.
		And therefore, I think it would be very interesting to hear from those of you out there who are not creationists, who are evolutionists, and, you know, that'll make it zippy and interesting.
		The guest certainly is zippy and interesting, Dr. Carl Ball.
		Aball has been invited as a guest lecturer at NASA headquarters in Greenbelt, Maryland, as a result of his independent research on the world's first hyperbaric biosphere.
		This biosphere is a simulation of the original ecospheric conditions of planet Earth.
		In his pioneering role as an independent researcher in this field, he is president and CEO of Creation Research Systems Inc.
		More than 30 years of his life have been spent researching Earth's atmospheric conditions before the Genesis flood.
		From this research, he has synthesized the creation in Symphony model.
		Dr. Ball is also director of the Creation Evidence Museum.
		He began his excavation project on the P-A-L-U-X-Y, Luxey River, I guess, In Glenrose, Texas, back in March of 82.
		Since that time, Ball, along with teams of volunteers, have uncovered over 400 dinosaur tracks and over 80 human footprints in Cretaceous limestone.
		He is the discoverer and excavation director of two major dinosaurs, one in Texas, one in Colorado.
		I will not attempt to pronounce them.
		Several NASA scientists have recognized the scientific significance of the Colorado dinosaur excavation under Baugh's direction and have participated in four such excavations under his auspice.
		Dr. Baugh is co-director of a research team along with Dr. Don Shockley, who've been searching for Noah's Ark on Mount Ararat in Turkey.
		As a matter of fact, he personally negotiated a 49-year lease of Mount Ararat with the Turkish government during the administration of one of the presidents there.
		Other expeditions include excavating an Indian princess for the archaeology department of the University of Texas in a radio broadcast from atop Chiop's pyramid in Egypt.
		Do you wonder what time of year he did that?
		I was there, and it was really hot.
		He's also led three scientific expeditions into the rainforests of Pueblo, New Guinea, in search of living paraductiles.
		Dr. Baugh is the author of three books, Why Do Men Believe Evolution Against All Odds, Against All Odds, Dinosaur Scientific Evidence That Man and Dinosaurs Walk Together, and Panorama of Creation, and the host of a weekly television program, Creation in the 21st Century, on Trinity Broadcast Network.
		So this is going to be a very, very, very, very interesting program if you'll simply remain seated.
		Ah, you could stand.
unidentified		Ah!
		The End Now we take you back to the night of June 12, 2002, on Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
		Art Bell Well, well, well, Dr. Maul, welcome back to the program.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Art, it's a pleasure to be with you.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		As I lecture across the country, I often travel until late in the night or early in the morning, and I've found that you have a varied, extensive, and faithful audience coast to coast.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm curious, in some of the places that you speak, Doctor, do you run into some of my listeners?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
		Yes, quite frequently.
		In fact, people listen to you in the mountains.
		I excavate dinosaurs, as you know.
		I dig dinosaurs.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And the data that my office sent to you is a bit old.
		It's now 11 different dinosaurs that my team has excavated.
		And I find people in remote areas especially enjoying your program.
		It adds some variety to their life.
		And then in urban areas, people often come up and say, have you been on the Art Bell show?
		Yes, but it's been a while.
		And they say, well, we listen regularly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you, well, what I was really curious about, if you speak in front of groups, do you ever get people who listen to this program asking you about the possibility of alien intervention?
		I mean, it's obviously a question we deal with here from time to time.
		And I was just wondering if you ever get an Ark Bell person out in the audience raising their hand, isn't it possible, Doctor?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, normally they come up to me privately, and they do ask the question.
		And my answer to that is that's beyond my area of expertise.
		And as you read a moment ago, the biographical sketch, I've lived a pretty busy life, and I've hardly had time to search for aliens.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Well, listen, I want to ask you a little bit about the first hyperbaric biosphere.
		I'm taking it that this was an attempt to create or recreate conditions that you have probably figured out one way or the other existed on Earth at the time that life began or during that period.
		Was that the idea?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I think you've got it right.
		And I think rather than a recreation, since I was not there nor my colleagues, none of my colleagues were there, to monitor the context, we take a lot of this by inference, but it is all documentable.
		Hopefully there will be time to discuss the parameters.
		When life was much more luxuriant than we enjoy today, when longevity was the principle of life from reptiles all the way to man, the original context of planet Earth.
		In fact, that's the reason NASA had me there to lecture to their scientists and engineers.
		And I've received three overtures since lecturing there that there is interest in some areas of NASA's research in using these data and in using this technology in deep space exploration.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's obvious why.
		NASA would be interested.
		I mean, if you can understand how life began here on Earth, then you can understand how it might begin elsewhere.
		So, of course, they'd be interested.
		But what I want to know is there was actually a biosphere created.
		What happened?
		What were the conditions that were set up inside this biosphere?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Okay, and again, this is an academic research project.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I understand.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And NASA's interest to art is actually more direct than examining the issues of whether life can evolve or develop on foreign soil.
		The basic idea is the survival of our astronauts in deep space.
		You see, there are problems with the loss of brain mass, there are problems with the loss of musculature.
		But there is a greater problem in renewable food supply.
		You just can hardly build a space rocket big enough, a capsule big enough to include all of the food that would Be necessary to get them there, get them to thrive while they colonize or explore, and to get them back.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You'd have to grow your own.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But again, Doctor, what I'm asking about is this biosphere that was created, right?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		That's correct.
		Yes, we have over 50 scientists, educators, and engineers involved in the research project.
		Yes, and we have a workable biosphere online, and now we're building a very large one, 62 feet long, 11 feet in diameter.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And exactly what are the conditions inside?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		The conditions are those that we find that geophysicists and environmentalists have found to have been current in the past when Earth was young.
		Now, we might discuss when Earth was young on the program, but that's not the issue at the moment.
		In direct answer to your question, number one, we know that the Earth's diameter was smaller in the past, and geophysicists have recognized that for some time.
		The Earth has expanded in diameter.
		If you diminish the size of the globe, maintaining the same mass but shrinking the volume, you automatically invoke the universal law of gravitation, which means that if you diminish the diameter 10 to 12 percent, you automatically double the atmospheric pressure by gravitational attraction.
		Do you follow what I'm saying?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely, yes.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Now, what this gives you is a hyperbaric context.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So, in other words, the amount of oxygen, for example, would have been double the density.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's better than that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Better.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		By increasing the oxygen only slightly, the ratio of oxygen only slightly, but doubling the atmospheric pressure.
		At Texas A ⁇ M University, they found that if you double the atmospheric pressure and slightly enrich the oxygen, you triple the assimilation of available oxygen.
		Now, that's incredible.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wait a minute.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You triple the assimilation of available oxygen.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		That's correct.
		But it requires the pressure to do so.
		For instance, the hemoglobin in the blood is saturated with four oxygen molecules.
		And you can't improve on that.
		No matter how much oxygen you run through the respiratory system, you can't improve on four oxygen molecules being assimilated.
		But if you nearly double the atmospheric pressure, then the additional pressure drives the oxygen into the blood plasma.
		That's the secret.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, well, what happens when either humans or plant life or whatever is in this early creation of the way it used to be?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What happens?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, first of all, the oxygen assimilation is driven through the blood system to the deep cell tissue, and that solves the problem of the dinosaurs.
		You see, dinosaurs have very small lung capacities.
		I've directed the excavation of 11 of these creatures.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Small lungs.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Small lungs.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And in today's atmospheric context, they couldn't get enough oxygen to feed the deep cell tissue of their bodies.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Ah, ha ha.
		So with double the density or double the pressure, then they could have smaller lungs and get enough oxygen.
		But today, a dinosaur would get dizzy and fall over and die.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Oh, it would be very lethargic, to say the least.
		So when we double the atmospheric pressure and slightly enrich the oxygen, only slightly, most people say, oh, well, let's double the atmospheric pressure.
		You can't do that because you build up oxygen toxicity, especially if you're simultaneously doubling the atmospheric pressure.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But in Jurassic Park, they were running fast.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yes, but they were under a...
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		But I think, Doctor, that's what I intrigued.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you think, Doctor, excuse me, that if, I mean, you're out there digging up dinosaurs.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yes, and searching for living dinosaurs, as you read.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I know, but that one seems more of a stretch, although you never know.
		You remember that photograph?
		Did I show that to you, the one in New York, Paraducto?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I don't think so.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Really?
		Really?
		Keith, you're listening.
		Please, once again, put that up for my...
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Not in this room.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		The computer's in my office, but I visualize quite readily.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Well, this was a photograph taken during the 9-11 crisis.
		And this giant paraductile, apparently, you'd have to see the photograph.
		And maybe during a break, you'll have like 15 minutes.
		I mean, you can go in and take a look, right?
		Well, it's across the county to my office.
		That's too bad.
		All right.
		So you're searching for live ones.
		But what I was going to ask is, with regard to the dead ones, would it be possible if you got something fresh enough to extract DNA to clone it?
		Well, that's where I was ultimately going.
		But I mean, can you get the DNA?
		Or is it too damaged?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		The DNA is damaged if it is in fossilized form.
		Now, I have heard some reports, unverified reports, that unfossilized dinosaur bone and unfossilized blood has been found in some context, dinosaur context, but I've never seen that firsthand.
		You just get reports like they found this or that, but it's quite elusive.
		I would like to see that.
		If we had unfossilized, relatively fresh dinosaur bone, and with the extraction of DNA, we still run up against a real problem.
		You see, Jurassic Park I was an intriguing idea, and I was extremely intrigued.
		But nature and life are so specific that you can't use a frog egg in which to place the DNA of a dinosaur because they are very distinctive.
		It aborts.
		It self-destructs.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Would there be any living animal in the world right now with which you might be able to do something like that?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Probably an elephant to a mastodon or a mammoth, because they are the same proboscity classification.
		They're essentially the same.
		And I think the Siberian experiment to clone and revive a living mammoth or mastodon, and a big mastodon was larger still, I think is a viable project.
		Yes.
		But dinosaurs, no, unless we can find a living one.
unidentified		Do you think it's a good idea?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		You mean the mammoth or dinosaurs?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, no, I mean to bring back something that nature has caused to go.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, well, caused to go extinct.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		If we are prepared to take care of those creatures, I think it would be an intriguing idea.
		For instance, I've led three expeditions into the jungles of Papua New Guinea.
		We have over two dozen eyewitness accounts of living pterodactyls.
		I had some friends there within the last few weeks searching for them.
		They did not make a sighting, but when we were there in 97, when our team was there working in conjunction with the government, and it was a scientific expedition, we made five sightings of creatures after dark that could not be explained by natural means and were consistent with the reports of the nationals.
		And the following morning, we found two webbed footprints on a sandy beach with depression of a tail.
		The footprints were about 14 inches apart.
		Depression of a tail with a flange on the end.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Really?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Now, in biological nature, the only creatures other than marine creatures that have ever been discovered scientifically or catalogued scientifically with a flange on the tail were raporhynchid pterodactyls.
		So we're on to something.
		And if and when we are able to capture these or retrieve some eggs, I hold a permit from the U.S. Department of Agriculture to bring these into the United States.
		I say if and when because the logistics are very complicated, and I've had overtures from Texas A ⁇ M that they would like to innovate and house these.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I can just see you coming through customs trying to explain that one.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, if you have the permit in advance, it shouldn't be a real problem.
		But a greater problem is dealing with the microbes in these ecological contexts.
		You know, we're dealing with a lot of bugs.
		By bugs, I mean microbes that can be rather harmful and lethal.
		So we have to be very, very careful.
		This project may never be realized, but at least it's underway.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Again, even with a permit these days, we live in pretty strange times.
		And if you talk about eggs of something prehistoric and little bugs and things that might be very dangerous for humans, you wouldn't want to say all that as you came through.
		You just want to hand them the permit and say, listen, try not to drop that egg.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		You're right.
		When I was obtaining the permit through the U.S. Department of Agriculture, the supervisor said, well, these are not on the endangered species list.
		So I did acquire the permit.
		But whether or not it'll ever be realized is another question.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, at least you've got the permit.
		Hold on, Doctor.
		We're at the bottom of the hour.
		Dr. Carl Ball is my guest.
		His website is creationevidence.org, and we've got a link up on my website right now under Program Tonight's Guest Info.
		If you want to read more about all of this, I'm Art Bell, and you're listening to Coast to Coast AM.
unidentified		You're listening to Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
		Tonight featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from June 12, 2002.
		To Coast AM from June
		12, 2002.
		To Coast AM from June 12, 2002.
		Be it silent, sand, smell, or touch, the something inside that we need so much.
		The sight of a touch or the scent of a sand, or the strength of an oak leaves deep in the ground.
		The wonder of flowers to be covered and then to burst up through tarmac to the sun again.
		Or to fly to the sun without burning a wing.
		To lie in a meadow and hear the grass sing, have all these things in our memories all.
		And they use them to help us Why, why was she so wrong?
		Take this place on this trip Just go, yeah Ride, take a free ride Take my place of my sleep in my fear.
		I will take the fear to hide to do it my fear.
		I'm doing my life.
		But by now, by now, why should I cry?
		I'm sorry.
		You're listening to Art Bell Somewhere in Time, tonight featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from June 12, 2002.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Dr. Carl Edward Baugh is my guest, and he is a creationist.
		I've got a bunch of rapid-fire questions for him coming up in a moment.
		And there is going to be an opportunity for you tonight to engage Dr. Baugh.
		I think it'd be very, very interesting to do so.
		So that coming up, it may have started just about like this.
unidentified		The End.
		The End.
		You're listening to Arkbell Somewhere in Time on Premier Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from June 12, 2002.
		Coast to Coast AM from June 12, 2002.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, what I'd like to do, Dr. Ball, is ask you some fairly rapid-fire questions.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Would that be all right?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Oh, certainly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		When did man, in your estimation and or with the best scientific evidence you have, first walk on the earth?
		How many years ago?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		If we're speaking scientifically, not with a preconceived idea in mind, and in the past, as I've been on your program before, you know that I was an evolutionist, believe and taught the theory of evolution.
		But that is absolute speculation.
		If we go to actual scientific data, we must include the data regarding the decay of Earth's magnetic field.
		In my opinion, man appeared full-blown on planet Earth approximately 6,000 years ago, along with all the other systems.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Aye, yeah, yeah, yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		6,000 years ago.
unidentified		six thousand years ago well uh...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		oh gosh and doctor then what are Well, I'll let everybody else ask you about that, and they surely will.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Describe to me what our world looked like, what our world was like before the big flood.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		I'm intrigued with your sound effects, the crashing thunder, the strike of lightning.
		I like that.
		But that was a result.
		That was not the incipient beginning.
		The data regarding a technical research term called pleochroic halos shows an instantaneous creation.
		So what was the Earth like before that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		it was pristine instantaneous as in uh...
unidentified		a matter of man was Oh, no, no, no, not like that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		In a matter of six literal days, we have interrelated systems being created.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, okay.
		As in the Bible.
		Six.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		As in the Bible.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Six earth days.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Six literal days.
		They had to be earth days because of the interrelationship of all these living systems.
		For instance, according to evolutionary theory, we have plants appearing about 240 million years ago, but we don't have some of the insects and birds procreating those appearing for another 100 to 120 million years.
		That won't work.
		Those plants, 98% of the plants, are procreated by insects and birds.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it might work if a day in the life of God was right, you know.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		However, those plants require biorhythms that are those plants have biorhythms that are affected by planetary schedule, by the constellary schedules.
		So the entire system was an intact system originally.
		And now microbiologists are really blazing a new horizonary research project.
		They have found that the living systems at the molecular level had to be totally intact to function at all.
		There is no scenario, and that's admitted in the technical literature, whereby they can even imagine the development of living systems to produce a living cell.
		Aren't in one living cell, you have over 60,000 proteins of 100 different configurations, each literally assigned a task.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		and if you have a small percentage of those malfunctioning the cell aborts the chance the mathematical scientific chance that that living cell could have evolved and that those systems The weak ones, the bad ones, didn't continue and evolution, the theory of, ensured that the right ones eventually survived.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, that's the theory.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Evolution or natural selection only preserves the living systems.
		It does not explain how the systems got here.
		They had to be here, had to be intact and functional in order for natural selection to preserve them.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, Doctor.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Before the six days began, what was here?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Okay, now I wasn't here, but I do have an opinion.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Before the six days began, since we know that living systems and the universal structure, I hope we have time to get into universal physics and the universal structure, all require design.
		And the second law of thermodynamics called entropy means everything's running downhill, so it was better in the past.
		Since everything is explained within the six days of literal creation, prior to that, only the Creator existed.
		We know scientifically...
		No, so we don't have the lightning strokes and the crescendo of thunder.
		everything had to be created intact in fact Astrophysicists now recognize that space, time, and matter are all interrelated.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But I mean, prior to creation itself, as we understand it, we have a limited perspective of these things, but space, time, planets, suns, everything did not exist.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Could not have existed.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Absolute nihility.
		Nothing.
		Only the Creator was capable of forming the space-time dimension.
		And matter, space, and time are all interrelated.
		With the formation of one, you affect the other.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you know, Dr. I, you know, of course, about the Big Bang theory, right?
		I once had a caller recall the show said something I'll never forget.
		He said, I believe that the Creator, God, in effect, blew himself up and that that created all that is.
		And that's sort of stuck with me, and I don't know why.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Okay, let me give a variation of that.
		If he blew himself up, he would not be here, would not be currently existing to maintain the universe, and would not have been here to orchestrate the living systems which require an incredible futuristic knowledge of all the capacities and all the adaptable potential of the living systems.
		I think we can better state it like this.
		It was not a big bang.
		It was a big word.
		God said, let there be light.
		Astrophysicists now recognize that the absolute essentials for all the matter, everything that we experience, is latent within the vibratory cycles of light.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, the single word light, okay.
		So then there was what was created, and there was a world, and this world was populated by, you say, dinosaurs and man at the same time, and then I'm trying to get a concept of what was like pre-flood.
		Was it all tropical?
		Was the climate different?
		Certainly, you said and demonstrated, I think, that the pressure, the atmospheric pressure was different, but what was the world like?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, first of all, the dinosaurs in that world were absolutely necessary.
		When you take the increments, the parameters of that world, we know that we had additional atmospheric pressure, but when it was something else, NASA admits readily in their technical data that we're losing the Earth's electromagnetic field, the intensity of that field.
		So that field was much more powerful.
		It is today 0.5 Gauss, 1.5 Gauss.
		It was approximately 10 times that, or 5 Gauss.
		That's what we're working with in the hyperbaric biosphere.
		Under those conditions, communication between cells and the fabric necessary, the energy fabric necessary for living systems, was superior.
		And we have found that in our experimentation.
		For instance, fruit flies, and if you have academicians in the audience, they'll recognize Drosophila melanogaster, standard fruit fly experiments that Harvard runs.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And they do fruit fly experiments because they multiply quickly.
		The generations come and go by our standards very, very quickly.
		So you can see changes very, very quickly.
		That's the idea, right?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Right.
		Egg to larva to pupa, 14 days, 14 days in the phase, the living phase.
		In the second generation art, we tripled by putting them in this context.
		You ask, what was it like with doubling the atmospheric pressure, with increasing the electromagnetic field, not in an AC current, but a DC current that is vitally important.
		By increasing that field, in the second generation, we tripled the adult lifespan of these fruit flies.
		Now, that's never been done before without genetic manipulation.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you believe, Dr. Ball, that were you to simulate these conditions for a human being, it would be, of course, a very long-term experiment that you could never do ethically.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But, I mean, if you could do it, is it your belief that you would end up with humans, second generation, that would extend life period by half or even by double or whatever?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, yes.
		Take the number given to these fruit flies, and that's the equivalent, even with their damaged DNA, and correspondingly our damaged DNA, even with their damaged DNA, their adult lifespan was tripled in the second generation.
		That's the equivalent of our living to be 200 years of age under these conditions, even with our damaged DNA.
		I'm not sure I want to live 200 years, but I'd like the potential to live a little longer and with better health than some of us have experienced.
		So in this large biosphere, we are not running experiments with human beings.
		We're not licensed to do so, even though we have a number of medical scholars.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But it is nevertheless your belief that if you could, that would be the result.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And you ask about dinosaurs.
		Dinosaurs are a vital part of the creation.
		We may never be able to retrieve a living pterodactyl or Michelium Bimbi from the third world countries, but we can run experiments with a Tuatar lizard.
		Now that lizard is technically a dinosaur.
		Reptiles today have two foramen, two holes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is that found in Papua New Guinea?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		It's found in New Zealand.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		New Zealand, okay.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And this Tuatar lizard has four foramen holes in his head, so technically he's a dinosaur.
		Dinosaurs were different from modern reptiles, except for this creature.
		So we do plan to run some experiments with these creatures in the biosphere, and thus we would be recreating a dinosaur.
		The enzymatic control of the egg of a frog with DNA, dinosaur DNA inserted, I think would self-abort.
		But here we have living dinosaurs with which we can do experimentation.
		Now back to the human beings.
		In this context, with the pre-flood world having greater atmospheric pressure, Having stronger electromagnetic energy.
		This not only affects the system of mammals and reptiles, but it affects the plant life as well.
		In fact, a Japanese scholar, Dr. Kim Mori, simulated these conditions with a cherry tomato plant.
		And before he died, that cherry tomato plant was 16 feet tall, had 903 tomatoes on it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let me tell you an interesting story.
unidentified		It's interesting you should mention that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		My wife is a gardener here in the desert.
		It's a dark honest thing.
		We grow artichokes and tomatoes and, you know, a lot of things you wouldn't think you can grow in the desert.
		She grows.
		One year, doctor, I swear to you, what I'm going to tell you is true.
		We planted the usual, I love, you know, those little tomatoes.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And so we had a whole bunch of tomato plants going.
		One of them, one of them, went completely berserk.
		I mean, it became a tomato tree.
		This thing was monstrous.
		had nine hundred tomatoes on it we we we saw it was some sort of It just, you know, next to its brothers and sisters, it were all normal size, this thing grew into a monster, and it produced more tomatoes than we could have had in a million years.
		And most of them died on the vine.
		It was incredible.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		How long did it live?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It lived that season.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Okay, now.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		That's all.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's all.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Just that season.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And you don't know what variant parameter you used to use that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Not even a clue.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It was just, you know, one of the bunch.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Okay, now that's very interesting because a friend of mine used symphonic sound, which is one of the parameters of the pre-flood world.
		You asked me what it was like.
		With the denser atmospheric conditions, sound would carry much better.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And you would have a more pristine context with the sands.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		You wouldn't have the alluvial.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Just the way in the very, very, very, very thick water, by comparison to air, whales communicate halfway around the world.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Oh, it's absolutely incredible.
		So under these conditions, a friend of mine used sound and the appropriate nutrients, but the sound was the determining factor because he used those nutrients in a control context and didn't produce this.
		He produced a passion plant over 200 feet long.
		It ran through his home, wound around some of the walls in the home.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Really?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		But now back to Dr. Morey's tomato plant.
		He used this context with additional atmospheric pressure, and he supplied additional carbon dioxide.
		And what happened was that cherry tomato plant outlived him.
		Now, that doesn't mean it was alive all his life, but it lived for more than a decade.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's interesting.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Now, yours died after one season.
		That's rather normal.
		But the fact that you had fantastic growth indicates the genetic potential is there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Actually, Doctor, it wasn't 900.
		It was probably more like thousands of tomatoes.
		I could bring my wife in right now to verify it's true.
		It's true.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, I believe you because you have really hit a secret, Art.
		And I'm very serious.
		The genetic potential is there.
		If we can tap the genetic potential, we can reproduce what we find in the fossil record.
		Everything was larger in the fossil record.
		Reptiles continue to grow as long as they live.
		Mammals do not.
		Man was large, but he was not 14, 16 feet tall.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How large?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, about 10 years ago on a national broadcast, a secular broadcast, I heard of a girl in Mozambique who was 13 years of age, showed up at a mission station to get her inoculations.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		She was 13 years of age and was already 10 feet 4 inches tall.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Holy smokes.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Now, that demonstrates the genetic potential.
		Max Palmer was a friend of mine until he died.
		Yes, big girl.
		And she had not even reached her growth spurt yet at age 13, you know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wow.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Max Palmer was 8 feet 2 inches tall.
		His mother was 5'2 ⁇ .
		His father was maybe 5'6.
		That was aberrant, but the genetic potential is there.
		Now, there is a secondary, you ask, how tall was man?
		How big could man get?
		Mammals, including man, have a secondary genetic ossification process.
		When we reach maturity, the ends of our bones close off, and that keeps us from growing the rest of our lives.
		That's good.
		You don't want a man 20 feet tall.
		He's going to live to be 200 years of age.
		So we've excavated some footprints, and there's a general ratio of 7 to 1 in height to length of the foot, but that's average.
		You can get aberrant details that would skew those results.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But on average.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, on average.
		I think Adam and his male colleagues were probably 7 to 7.5 feet tall.
		I think Eve and her female colleagues were probably 6 to 6.5 feet tall on average.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So it was really easy for her to pick the apple.
		Yes.
		Listen, hold on.
		We're here at the top of the hour.
		Hold on, Dr. Ball.
		Dr. Carl Edward Baugh is my guest.
		He's a creationist.
		How about you?
		Fascinating self.
		I'm Art Bell from the High Desert.
unidentified		This is Coast to Coast A.M. You're listening to Art Bell Somewhere in Time on Premiere Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from June 12, 2002.
		Come walk me.
		Gonna die on the dead way.
		Jenny will sleep.
		She always smile for the people she needs.
		On trouble's drive.
		She had another way of looking at life.
		You're open to music blue.
		I'm going to go.
		I used to be a rolling stone and go if the cause is right.
		I need to find an answer on the road.
		I used to be a heartbeat for someone for the time to take.
		The less I say, the more my work gets done.
		Cause I'm here to free this feeling freedom.
		On the day that I was born, I went blind Then I got the feeling too many hearts to a man Give me a peace all night, but I'm glad it never has
		I'm glad it never has I'm glad it never has I'm glad it never has I'm glad it never has I'm glad it never has I'm glad it never has I'm glad it never has You're listening to Art Bell Somewhere in Time on Premier Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from June 12, 2002.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		My guest is Dr. Carl Edward Baugh.
		He's a creationist big time.
		Man, popped here along with the Earth and everything else that is 6,000 years ago.
		Hardcore, huh?
		So obviously, I'm going to want a lot of you on the other side, and I have too, and I'm going to have a hard time getting that.
		We'll get tone lines open as soon as possible because I think it's going to be very interesting.
		Very interesting.
unidentified		The End.
		The End.
		Thank you.
		Now we take you back to the night of June 12, 2002, on Art Bell's Somewhere in Time.
		Music All right, once again, Dr. Carl Edward Baugh.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Dr. Baugh, we have now a revived Hubble telescope.
		And it's our deep space version that we have in orbit that is able to look back in time.
		You mentioned light and God and light and the word light and all that.
		They can look back, they say, 15 billion years.
		And maybe a little better than that right now with the newly revived telescope.
		At least that far.
		15 billion years.
		Now, you're maintaining that everything was created 6,000 years ago, and they're saying they can look back 15 billion years.
		That's a big, big difference.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yes, very interesting.
		Let's explore that.
		I received communication from Dr. David Otway Ray, Senior Academician, Academy of Sciences, USSR.
		He also was at that time a member of four other academies of science in the Eastern Bloc countries.
		His specialty is quantum algebra.
		He saw a satellite program I was doing on television, and he contacted me and said, I want you to be aware of the research that I've done.
		He took the parameters, the Einsteinian parameters, or all the physical parameters of the universe at our disposal, including the Einsteinian equations.
		Now, this is very important in answer to that question in the light of recent creation or the light of creation at all.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, try to make it so the average person can understand now.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Gotcha.
		The Einsteinian equations essentially deal with the fact that matter, space, and time are all interrelated.
		If you alter matter, you alter space and time.
		If you alter space, you alter matter and time.
		If you alter time, you alter space and matter.
		Got the idea?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, so Dr. Ray ran some quantum algebraic equations, and he found that the further back in time he explored with these equations, the more refined the universe became.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		NASA with a Hubble telescope.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What do you mean refined?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Refined, became more orchestrated, more attuned.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I don't know what that means.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Were things closer together?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yes, closer together, more symphonic.
		In fact, what I saw when I was at NASA, I saw some of the hardware that now is in existence out in space, or now is placed in space.
		It was in existence at NASA headquarters in Greenbelt, Maryland at that time.
		What Dr. Ray found was, the further back in time we went, the more orchestra, further back in time he went in the calculations, the more orchestrated the entire universe became.
		What NASA is now finding is a result of explosion.
		In fact, they admit on their website, things are decaying.
		Entropy, the second law of thermodynamics, is really being fulfilled.
		We have galaxies.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But all that's consistent with the Big Bang, though.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		No, just the opposite.
		The Big Bang begins with chaos and attempts to explain that out of chaos comes order.
		You never get The reader's digest published from an explosion in a print shop.
		You have to begin with information and orchestration.
		The explosion doesn't work.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, then you're going to have to find a more elegant way to describe this orchestration.
		What are you talking about?
		Are you saying things were.
		How are they different?
		As you go back with his algebra, how are things different?
		Are they closer together?
		What?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Much closer together because with the dilation, with the expansion of the space fabric, you have dilation of time.
		So we ran that backward as only algebraic, quantum algebraic equations can do.
		I mean, it's light years beyond standard math.
		And there are only a handful of people proficient.
		We only have two, Dr. Frank Tipler and someone else in the U.S. proficient in this, but they have a handful in the Eastern Bloc countries.
		So what we see today is chaos.
		If we reverse the order, everything is running away from us.
		It is expanding from us in every direction.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's consistent with Big Bang, too.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		well if you reverse the order yes it comes closer more rapidly all you mean uh...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		not in a linear It would be non-linear.
		If there was an explosion, when there's any explosion, even here on Earth, you have an explosion, boom, things, nails, a nail bomb, for example, the nails are traveling at an extreme speed in seconds, with milliseconds after the explosion.
		But then they begin immediately decaying in speed and velocity.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		But what we find in the universe is just the opposite.
		The most distant objects are receding from us at an accelerating rate.
		So when you reverse this, put it back together, so we have not only the expansion of space fabric, but the dilation of time.
		What this gives us is a scenario where on planet Earth, an Earth is at or near the center of this universe because we have Dr. Margaret Geller of Harvard and NASA demonstrated.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, wait a minute.
		I've seen pictures, and Earth is way on the outskirts of the Milky Way galaxy.
		Right.
		I mean, we're really in the ruled territory here from that point of view.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		But not the universe as a whole.
		We're on the arm of Orion, of the Milky Way galaxy, a very fortunate position.
		Again, this was designed.
		If we were nearer the center of the galaxy, or nearer the beginning of the arm, there would be so many stars around us we would have no idea where we were.
		But being in this position, we can actually map the universe.
		And that is what Dr. Margaret Keller has done.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So we're the center of it.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		We're at or near the center of the universe as a whole.
		What she has found is, and published in the technical literature, that there are seven concentric shells of galactic star bodies surrounding us in all directions.
		You go out in space, very few star bodies.
		Then you come up against a wall, an extreme wall of galaxies and star bodies.
		Then in space, very few stars, another wall.
		Seven of these concentric shells or rings or spheres altogether.
		Now, back to your original question.
		With the Einsteinian equations showing that if the space fabric is expanding and it's expanding at an accelerated rate, you reverse that and as it expands currently, time is dilated.
		So at or near the center, very little is happening in time.
		But the further out in space you go, or the farther out in space you go, the more the fabric is expanding.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Time is stretching.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Time is stretching.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's an easy way to put it so people can understand.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		So there probably are, at the outer edges of galactic areas of the universe, 15 billion years of time elapsed because the space fabric stretched and time dilated.
		But all of that within a 6,000 year period framework.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wow.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't know if it's okay.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		But it is consistent with the data.
		And that's what Dr. William Ray found.
		It's consistent with the data.
		But there is attendant data.
		If we're consistent with our academic research, we must add to that the decay of Earth's magnetic field.
		Art, this is very important.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But remember, the dinosaurs died.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, universally, science says 60-some odd million years ago, right?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		64 million, according to standard theory.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There you are.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		However, if you will visit the Kachina Bridge at Natural Bridges National Monument just out of Blanding, Utah, I was there three and a half weeks ago for the eighth time, taking a group of scholars to see.
		There is a panel placed there by the Anasasi Indians.
		The Anasasis appeared 300 B.C. on the North American continent, disappeared 1299 AD in a terrible drought.
		We know the exact year they disappeared.
		So they were only on the North American continent some 1,600 years.
		On this panel, with desert varnish covering all the panel, desert varnish accumulates over centuries.
		It requires long centuries to accumulate.
		Pollen, charged dust accumulates over there.
		You can't do it in a matter of decades.
		On this panel, etched into the rock by the Anasases, is a warrior.
		And the warrior has, to his lower left, a tonantosaurus dinosaur being observed.
		It has the bulk body, the long bulk tail, the long neck, The face, the mouth, and the eye.
		We can even identify the dinosaur.
		Most of the people in the audience would say that's a brontosaurus.
		Well, brontosaurus is a misnomer, but that's the type dinosaur.
		Brontosaurus, but due to the bulk of his tail, we know he was a tenantosaurus dinosaur.
		In order to represent him so faithfully, those Anasases had to see such a creature.
		And we have at the museum in safety deposit, we're building our permanent facility, so we have to keep much of our treasures in safety deposit for security purposes.
		We have some of the original stones retrieved from the graves of the Peruvian plains, the Nazca's, Icas, and Tijuanaca practiced memorializing their nobles by etching onto rock their exploits and their deeds.
		We have three of these stones that have dinosaurs that are so specific.
		The critics said when these were first uncovered, well, we don't know how they represented a Triceratops dinosaur, don't know how they represented pterodactyls, and an Allosaurus or T-rex, and an ankylosaurus, and a Stegosaurus.
		But they did.
		But they did down to the rosette patterns and the dermal frills.
		Now, the critics said, oh, these are stylized because they have dermal frills up their spinal column and they have rosette patterns on their skin.
		But in 1992, in Europe, a cache of dinosaurs was discovered, and they found an extension protruding up the spinal column.
		It's called a process, technically, up the spinal column of these sauropod dinosaurs to hold the dermal frills, and they also had skin impressions.
		We have some actual skin and safety deposit from Bolivia extended to us through official sources that has the rosette patterns in the dinosaur skin.
		These individuals had to actually see these creatures in relatively recent times.
		Now back to the Earth's magnetic field and the age of all this.
		Dr. Thomas Barnes, who died just a few months ago, at the time he did this research, was head of physics department, University of Texas at El Paso.
		In 1829, Carl Gauss of Germany first began to measure the Earth's magnetic field.
		And after he died, others took over the job, and it's been measured.
		And the data that I'm going to relate to you are in the records in Washington, D.C., in the geophysical records.
		So the Earth's magnetic field has been examined since 1829.
		Dr. Thomas Barnes measured it and calculated that we are losing the field at an exponential rate, and every 1,400 years we lose one half the energy.
		What this means to the practical layman is, 1,400 years ago, this field was twice as powerful as it is today.
		1,400 years before that, four times as powerful as it is today.
		1,400 years before that, eight times as powerful as it is today.
		Art, if we go back anything approaching 20,000 years ago, that field at this rate measured, and this is empirical science, let's take the data, let it speak for itself, that field would have had the intensity of a magnetic star.
		Not only could molecules necessary for life not have held together, but many of the atoms necessary for living systems could not have held together in that context.
		So while we have a mindset of antiquity in extreme ages, when we deal with the facts, we have recency in all of this.
		And on the universal scale with the expansion of the stretching of the space fabric and the dilation of time, even those 15.5 billion years that are probably there in deep space got there because of the accelerated rate of the stretching of space fabric and the accelerated rate of dilation of time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Try and explain this for me.
		Our early space probes, which are now leaving our area, you know, they're just way out there now, are all of a sudden experiencing a slowing.
		Something that the scientists cannot explain appears to be actually slowing them down.
		Now, how would that fit into your picture?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		That's very interesting because inertia can't explain that.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		A friction cannot explain that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They talk about dark matter.
		Something like that might explain it.
		Who knows?
		But they are slowing.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Dark matter is still speculation.
		It's needed if we're going to explain the universe in evolutionary terms, but no one has ever found the dark matter.
		So that probably doesn't explain it yet.
		But again, that's speculation.
		So, in my opinion, it appears that the expansion of the universe, the entire universe, is slowing.
		It accelerated in the past, but the slowing of our space probes is a near-Earth verification that probably on a universal scale, the acceleration is slowing.
		Now, we see the acceleration through the Hubble telescopes for this reason.
		We're not seeing the objects.
		We're seeing the image of those objects.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The light.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		The light.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And the signals coming back could have been generated thousands of years ago at the time of the flood and due to the expansion of space fabric would actually have tired or matured into billions of years of time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, Doctor, and I understand what you're saying, but aren't you required to walk out on a shorter scientific plank than the evolutionists?
		To get where you need to go to try and prove that, you know, we've only been here 6,000 years?
		I mean, you're on a much shorter plank than they are, really.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, if these were all the data we had, it would be a shorter plank, and you're off into the deep blue.
		But there is a tremendous body of data.
		For instance, I published a book, Against All Odds.
		Why do men believe evolution?
		You mentioned that at the top of the program.
unidentified		Yes.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Why do men believe evolution against all odds?
		Because in the past, I believed and taught the theory of evolution.
		When we look at the physical data, now, my degrees are not in geology or paleontology, but I do dig dinosaurs in the Earth and direct a very scientific program.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Obviously, you do.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		The biosphere.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		So as we explore the Earth, we come up with incredible objects.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm sorry, I've got to hold it here.
		We're at the bottom of the hour.
		Dr. Carl Edward Baugh is with me.
		I'm Art Bell.
		This, of course, is Coast Roaring Through the Nighttime.
		And by the way, we're about to call.
		So if you have questions for Dr. Baugh and I just bet you do, then bring it on.
unidentified		You're listening to Art Bell Somewhere in Time, tonight featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from June 12, 2002.
		But nothing hides the lights that shine.
		Let trees that look so fine Look and dry your eyes Music You'd think that people would have had enough a silly love song.
		But look around me and I see it isn't so.
		Some people wanna fill the world with silly love songs.
		And what's wrong with that?
		I'd like to know.
		Cause here I go.
		Again.
		I love you.
		Premier Radio Networks presents Art Bell Somewhere in Time.
		Tonight's program originally aired June 12, 2002.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We have a very serious creationist on our hands here, Dr. Carl Edward Baugh.
		Everything was made everything 6,000 years ago.
		Nothing older than that anywhere.
		Time, space, light, man, dinosaurs, desks, telephones.
		I'm getting carried away.
		But the idea is, everything began 6,000 years ago, all at once.
		Six days, God did it exactly as it is said in the Bible in six earth days.
		Have a problem with that?
		You might want to speak with Dr. Baugh.
unidentified		should be very interesting you Now we take you back to the night of June 12, 2002, on Art Bell's Somewhere in Time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Music In the movie Contact, one of my favorite of all time, of course, one of the lines toward the end of the movie was, you know, as you look up at the night sky, if all that is out there, all those suns, all those planets, and they are there, whether you believe Dr. Baugh's explanation of,
		you know, the length of time they've been there or evolutionists or Big Bang people or whatever, they are, the fact of the matter is they are there.
		So a really good question for Dr. Baugh would be, I think the line was, if there's not life out there, then boy, what an incredible waste of space.
		Now, it's required of me, Doctor, to ask you, is it, I mean, we just got news about Mars.
unidentified		Oh, my God, the water on Mars.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There's tons of water on Mars.
		NASA just found out.
		And where you have water and where you have volcanic action, you probably have some form of very small life, at least.
		Now, as you look out to all the stars, which are actually suns, and all the planets that must be going around them, we're finding more and more planets.
		Isn't it almost inevitable that there are other life forms out there on other planets elsewhere?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Let's address that question.
		I like it.
		First of all, the space and the star bodies are not useless.
		Dr. Michael Denton, a world-class scholar, published recently stating that astrophysicists have found that all of the motion, galactic motion in deep space on all sides of us, is absolutely necessary for the gravitational attraction and the inertial motion.
		All of that is necessary for us to move a little finger or bat an eyelash.
		If those things were not, number one, in motion, number two, in balance, in deep space, then it would require the horsepower of a farm tractor to move a finger.
		Not only that, to stop it would require The same horsepower.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, but the same case could be made for lizard intelligence on Zetta Reticula.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		However, we have no evidence that lizard intelligence is there.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		In fact.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm not saying it is.
		I'm just saying that if there's intelligence elsewhere, you could say the same combination of things in the universe must be true for us to be crawling around on all fours and having a great time of it here on whatever planet we're talking about.
		Right?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		If it were possible for life to evolve, then you have stated probably against all odds.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's not possible for life to evolve.
		Well, is it possible, though, that God plopped some down elsewhere?
		Or is that ruled out?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		He said that he concentrated his energy on planet Earth.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And in fact, there's a new scientific study called equidistant letter sequencing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But if that's true, though, Doctor, it's so sad you can hardly think about it.
		In other words, if we are the only life in all of this, the only intelligent life, or even any kind of life, in all of this, well, that's too sad to contemplate.
		I mean, and I don't even believe it.
		On Mars, where you've got water now, we know, you've got volcanic activity inside the planet, you've got water frozen inside the planet, then probably you have at least microbial life.
		That's probable.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, let's explore that.
		Microbial life in its basic form is bacterial.
		That's the simplest, supposedly the simplest form of life.
		But now, microbiologists are finding what's called irreducible complexity.
		Most of those little microbes, those little bacteria, have a little flagellum.
		That little flagellum is so tiny that 8 million of them would fit in the dimension of a human hair.
		Yet it has a shaft, a universal joint, a rotor, a stator, bushings, and it runs by energy.
		It can reverse itself counterclockwise or clockwise.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's say we go to Mars, which we're getting ready to do, I do believe, and we find at least microbial life.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How is that going to sit with you?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Okay, first of all, we have to find it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, work with me.
		Let's say the ship is back.
		The guys get off.
		They decompress.
		They test what they brought back.
		Oh, my God.
		Microbial life, at least.
		Okay.
		How's that going to set with you?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		No real problem because my colleagues and I have addressed this for a number of years.
		In fact, I was in the Far East when the announcement came that they had found microbial life remains in rocks that were found in the Arctic.
		But it turned out that that was not the case.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's still being argued.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
		But there's some.
		If it is there, if microbial life is there, there's an explanation for that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There is?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		A biblical explanation.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's hear it.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		At the time of the flood, according to the 17th chapter of Psalms, there was a tremendous noise that went out into space.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		In addition to that, according to Genesis chapter 6.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Probably all the people drowning.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, you may have something there.
		But in addition to that, you have the tremendous rupture of the fountains of the Great Deep.
		The velocity would have been such with such a rupture, we've actually calculated that, that the Earth would have had microscopic rippage, and the velocity that we see in the rupture of a boiler would have been realized, and thus you would reach speeds that would exceed the necessary 17,000 miles per hour to lose space, lose gravity.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In other words, put simply, if it's there, it came from here.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		If it's there, it could have been expunged from the Earth itself, and some of it could have survived.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Isn't this an awfully egotistical position?
		I mean, everything revolves around us.
		We're the only life.
		And if there is microbial life elsewhere, it sprang from Earth or got shot off Earth or blasted off Earth or whatever.
		Isn't that awfully egotistical?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, first of all, it makes us very special.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Second, and this is very important.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It makes us very lonely.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, no, because there's angelic life.
		There's the Creator himself embracing us.
		There are scholars who have stated that SETI, you know, the search for extraterrestrial life.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I interview those fellows all the time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In fact, one next week because we're going to have a debate.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		There are major scholars who admit that if intelligent signals had been broadcast, we would have found them by now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No.
		No, no, they don't.
		I interviewed Dr. Seth Shostak.
		He's down at Arecibo, really doing the work.
		And they've examined a very tiny portion of it all so far.
		And there is lots and lots of reasons why we would not have found anything at all yet.
		We've only examined a small part of it.
		Of course, it would take a very long time.
		Not from your point of view, I understand, but it would take a very long...
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, because of the expansion of space fabric and the dilation of time.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		The time really is there in deep space.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, then it would take a very long time for the signals to get here.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, but I'm simply quoting the scholars, a number of scholars themselves.
		In other words, there's controversy in the field.
		An entire book has been published by major astrophysicists called Rare Earth, indicating the very thing we're talking about, that the elemental composition of planet Earth is unique in everything we have found.
		There's no other planet like ours, dealing with empirical science.
		Empirical science is observation, deduction from observation.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, but deduction from observation Absolutely concludes that the numbers really are on the side of many, many, many, many, many Earth-like planets.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		But there never has been found one outside planet Earth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, not yet.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But we're just now discovering planets around suns.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		An inference of planets, a slight wobble.
		Yep.
		And, of course, we could discuss that all night.
		But actually, what we're saying is empirical data has not yet found any.
		I think it's a commendable scientific project to find out what's out there.
		In fact, some of the people involved in some of the advanced studies at NASA have talked to me about using our technology in deep space exploration.
		And I said, well, let's get down serious and consider this.
		And we're talking about an original context prior to the flood, which generated tremendous growth.
		For instance, today the Lycopsid club moss gets only about 16 to 18 inches tall.
		But art in the fossil record, that very same plant, got up to 120 feet in stature.
		So I hold a patent on the world's first hyperbaric biosphere after now.
		It's 40 years of research.
		I need to update some of the data.
		It's not just 30 years, it's 40 years of research.
		And this technology holds tremendous potential in deep space exploration.
		So I commend a deep space exploration, but I think we should guard that exploration with truth, embracement, and data.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So then, from your point of view, then, Doctor, if there are reports of abductions and aliens and craft seen here on Earth, your explanation for them would have to be that they are probably demons of some sort.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, I really have not had time.
		You can see I've lived a very busy life.
		I have not had time to give that area serious consideration.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I know, but there is no other answer according to what you just explained to me.
		In other words, if there's any life that's anywhere else, period, it came from here or got or was seeded from here or something or another.
		So then, therefore, any saucers or alien life or abductions or any of the stuff that you hear about and that people will tell you stories about and even present evidence of would have to be demons because there is no other intelligent life.
		So it would have to be some sort of demon or something like that.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, again, I really have not looked at the evidence.
		Perhaps if I can extend my life as predicted by working in the biosphere, I'll have time to look at the data.
		I'd rather give you an honest, forthright answer based on observation, and I don't have that information, so I'll just have to leave that question.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, all right.
		I'm going to let a few people in here because I promised.
		First time caller line, you're on the air with Dr. Ball.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hello?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello.
unidentified		Yes.
		The question I had was that if all the objects that we're looking at out in space are, I guess, millions of light years away, and if the Earth is only 6,000 years old, then those objects blew up.
		And that never really happened.
		And doesn't that make God a liar then?
		If those things never blew up?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, not at all.
		First of all, light travels, of course, very rapidly, 186,282.0244866 miles per second.
		That's pretty fast.
		And in that travel, it, of course, gives us information.
		The information that we're finding is disarray, that galactic bodies are exploding, that there are tremendous spiral nebulae that have disturbance and warps within them.
		All of this is consistent with the second law of thermodynamics and consistent with the biblical model, doesn't make God a liar at all, that at the time of the flood, according to 2 Samuel 22 and Psalm 18, God expanded the space fabric again out of mercy because the disruptions on planet Earth had compromised near space.
		So you do have explosions that are accounted for in the creation model, the biblical record.
		In fact, we would predict that the star bodies that were originally designed with oscillating vibrations affecting us positively would be in disarray, galactic balance would be in disarray, and that's what we're finding.
		Now, it's possible that the slowing of the spacecraft has to do with our placement in the universe and some of that disruption, or it could have to do with a slowing down of the acceleration of matter and space fabric.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, I want to try another approach with you.
		When you said you hadn't thought much about aliens or abductions or any of the rest of it, I don't know if that's totally right.
		I mean, I understand that you are aware of some research that indicates if the human mind is exposed to a certain frequency, then people begin to experience angelic presences or abduction experiences or all sorts of the things that I talk about a lot on this program.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		It has to do with a limbic system, which is central to the base of the brain.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		So I'm aware of that, certainly.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And it alters consciousness.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Cecilia, I've thought about it a little bit.
		I mean, what are you suggesting?
		If you affect it, in what way it produces these results?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, aberrations of the brain can be stimulated with a number Of basic factors.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		But again, I'm totally honest in that while I'm intrigued with the idea, I really haven't had time to give it an honest appraisal.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And without an honest appraisal, you know, I'd be dishonest if I just shot in the dark and said, Well, that is sort of an answer to this question.
		You're suggesting that a certain portion of the brain, if affected by the right frequency or the right who knows what, can malfunction.
		Can malfunction and begins to have these experiences, which explain away the majority of this sort of thing.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Possibly that's true.
		The human brain is an incredible machine.
		In fact, it is the most complicated structure technical research admits.
		It's the most complicated structure in the entire universe.
		100 billion brain cells, each having an average of 50,000 neuron connections to other brain cells.
		In fact, evolutionary theory really runs amok here because if we learn something new every second and assimilated that with what we already know, it would take over 3 million years to use up our brain capacity.
		Now, according to evolutionary theory, we evolve what we need.
		Well, if we're only going to live to be 105 or 10, why would we evolve a brain that could go on for a minimum of 3 million years?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, they say we only use, what, 10%?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Oh, 8%.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		8%.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's very little.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Very little.
		In fact, it's a lot more incredible than that.
		It goes back to creation.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, how much of the brain were Adam and Eve using before the apple?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Now, now, we're getting down to serious discussion.
		You see, before you're born, you lose half your brain cells.
		Genetically, Art, you and I produced 200 billion brain cells.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But if Adam was so damn smart, why did he take the bite?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Because he had a choice, and he made the wrong choice.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know, but if he was using so much of his brain.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		He wasn't using much of it at that time.
		But it was there for him to use.
		All 200 billion brain cells, each with an average of 50,000 neuron connections to other brain cells.
		So what that actually means is when you add, when you multiply all the factors, that gives you 8 billion quadrillion years to use your brain capacity.
		And now a publishing neurologist at the University of Arizona has found that every one of those neuron connections has the potential, the computing potential of a desktop computer.
		Desktop, not laptop.
		Meaning that that brain that we have, were it not for the rest of the body dying off so early, that brain that we have was designed to go on forever assimilating information and functioning.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Too bad our bodies are not.
		Doctor, hold on, we're at the top of the hour.
		I promise we'll be more into the phones this coming hour.
		From the high desert, I'm Art Bell.
		This is Coast.
unidentified		You're listening to Art Bell Somewhere in Time on Premier Radio Networks.
		tonight an encore presentation of coast to coast am from june 12 2002.
		Your health will disguise Imagine all the people living for today.
		Yeah Imagine there's no country living hard.
		I can't stop this feeling deep inside of me.
		Girl, you just don't realize what you do to me.
		When you hold me in your arms so tight, don't let me know everything's all right.
		I'm hooked on a feeling.
		I'm high on believing.
		But you're in love with me.
		It's as sweet as candy.
		It's tasty, some of mine.
		Girl, you got me thirsty for another cup of wine.
		Got a buck from you, girl.
		But I don't need no cure.
		I should stay up and tend if I can't be so.
		Oh, good one.
		When we're all alone.
		Keep it up, girl.
		Yeah, you turn me on.
		Ah, I'm hooked on a feeling.
		I'm high on believing.
		That you're in love with me.
		Oh, my God.
		You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in Time, tonight featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from June 12th, 2002.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Definitely a hardcore creationist, Carl Edward Ball.
		Dr. Ball is my guest.
		And if you have questions for him, and I bet you do, then come on, let's rock.
unidentified		The End.
		you You're listening to Arc Bell Somewhere in Time on Premier Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an encore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from June 12, 2002.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Coast to Coast AM All right, we're just about to go back to lines, but Steve, I get these questions, Doctor, by computer.
		Steve in Toronto, Canada asks a pretty good one.
		Since Dr. Ball is so literal in his interpretations of the Bible, that if God started us from Adam and Eve, how do you explain the people of Nod that Cain encountered, and how do you explain all these different races?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		The standard interpretation, misinformation, is that Cain went to the land of Nod, found a wife, and married her.
		So did he marry half-gorilla?
		Did he marry a person of another race?
		What's the question?
		Well, the biblical record doesn't say he went to the land of Nod and found a wife.
		The biblical record states that Cain went to the land of Nod and knew his wife.
		The word knew there is the word for family relationship, sexual intercourse.
		In other words, Cain went to the land of Nod and knew her biblically and started a family.
		Now, but that doesn't answer where she came from.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, it sure doesn't.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Okay, let's try to address that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's try.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		The closer to creation we get, the better is the genetic information of humankind and all living systems.
		In fact, the Jewish traditions say that Adam and Eve had 56 children.
		I don't know how many they had, but that's traditional.
		Now, in those days, only the head of a clan or the head of the family was mentioned because of space factor or lack of space in the text.
		The girls were, in general, not mentioned at all, and only the primary boys were mentioned at birth.
		In fact, even Abraham married his half-sister, Sarai.
		He was Abram then, married Sarai, no problem.
		In the United States, you can still marry a first cousin.
		You ultimately will get into difficulty if you continue to practice that as a clan.
		But the closer to creation we were, no problem in marrying a sister or a niece.
		In fact, Cain simply took his wife with him, either a sister or his niece, and there would have been no genetic problem whatsoever.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But you're not explaining how we got all the different races.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, the races came later, and the races are all essentially identical.
		Dr. Gary Parker, a publishing biologist, has found that there are primarily 16 categories in relation to melanin.
		And you can have various combinations.
		You actually, because of the genetic potential within any individual in any clan, can get all of the 16 variations of color.
		And if you limit the marrying capability, that is you limit the gene pool by marrying only those that you basically like, you will get basic characteristics.
		And the biblical record indicates that the three sons of Noah had the basic potentials that have now colonized all of planet Earth after the global flood.
		And there's tremendous scientific evidence supporting a biblical flood.
		So we have the Jephetic races that involves those with philosophy and scientific achievement.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, there's evidence of a flood.
		I don't know.
		You know, I know it's in the Bible.
		All I can say is there is evidence of a flood.
		I mean, I live here in the desert, not far from Death Valley, and, you know, you can sift around and find, you know, fossils from the sea.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yes, well, there's evidence of a global flood, not just a flood or thousands of smaller floods.
		And the basic evidence supporting a global flood is polystrait fossil evidence.
		Now, let me explain that for the audience in general.
		Trying not to be technical here.
		Polystrait means covering many different layers.
		In Cookville County, Tennessee, and this is not a rare exception.
		This is just one illustration that National Geographic happened to use.
		They found a fossil, a tree, a colified tree, standing upright, and it was waterborne.
		That's the reason it was upright, because the roots are heavier.
		And at the base of that, the roots were colified, and there was an entire coal seam.
		Above that, there was sandstone, and the fossil was sandstone, and the entire seam was sandstone.
		Above that, more coal, an entire seam of coal.
		And the tree changed from sandstone to coal, to limestone, back to coal, to sandstone, to coal again, and then to limestone finally.
		It covered what is normally interpreted to be about 20 million years of evolutionary time.
		Now tell me how that tree could remain in place 20 million years.
		It's impossible.
		So what it demonstrates is a context of sedimentation of a major flood.
		How big?
		Well, in our excavations here at Glen Rose along the Piloxy, Nova was filming over my shoulder as we excavated a Lepidodendron on its site.
		Those layers, it extended from one layer to another to another, three separate layers.
		Those layers began in central Texas near Austin, extend 1,600 miles to the eastern seaboard of the United States, pick up again at the White Cliffs of Dover, pick up again in northern Ethiopia.
		Three continents were involved in those sedimentary deposits.
unidentified		We're talking about a global flood.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, I promised to do this.
		I must do it.
		Wild Card Line, you're on the air with Dr. Ball.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hello.
		Hi.
		Hi, Eric.
		Love the show.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Where are you?
unidentified		I am in St. Catharines, Ontario.
unidentified		I'm listening to you on WBN out of Buffalo.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Excellent.
		Go ahead.
unidentified		I'd just like to say, Dr. Ball, is it?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, Ball.
unidentified		Dr. Ball, It sounds to me like what you're saying here is running counter to the last 400 years of science.
		It's very actually similar to what St. Augustine wrote in his book The City of God, whereby he suggested a creation date of about 5000 BC.
		I mean, since that time, we've had so many breakthroughs in scientific discovery that have gotten us to the stage that we're at now.
		Just I have a few points that I wanted to bring up, and then I'll get off and listen to your answer.
		We have, first of all, you were saying that Earth is the center of the universe.
		Now, that is simply because when we observe the universe, it seems relatively uniform in whatever direction we look.
		Right, but therefore, all points, according to Stephen Hawking in his book, A Brief History of Time, all points can be regarded as center.
		Because when we look around, the universe seems relatively the same.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hold that point.
		It's a good one.
		Let's hear the answer.
		He's right.
		In other words, if it's endless, essentially, then from any point, as he just points out, it would appear to be the center because you could look equally distant in all directions.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		I appreciate the question, Carteline.
		First of all, my statement was the Earth is at or near the center, and of course, you admitted that the data indicate that it is at or near the center because the galaxies are receding from us.
		Stephen Hawkins and others have postulated, again, we're speaking of postulation, that if we were at another point in the universe, it would look the same.
		But that's a postulate.
		There is no data supporting that.
		In fact, it could not look the same because we are getting now from the Hubble telescope data indicating the explosion of galaxies, and we see those in reference to each other.
		So while the uniformitarian context, and I don't mean to be technical in that, that's a concept explaining everything with homogeneity in the universe.
		While that's wishful, while it would be nice to have that, it's wishful thinking because we do find in space reference to other galactic bodies.
		We know that we're moving at a rapid rate toward Orion.
		We see a relative motion that we're engaged in.
		So while Stephen Hawkings has postulated that in order to explain away the centrality of planet Earth, it is not supported by empirical data.
		Now, your first question had to do with 400 years of scientific discovery.
		If you've listened to all the program, you know that I direct a scientific project.
		And there is a lot of discovery in the last 400 years that is beneficial.
		But did you realize that every one of the scientific disciplines was established by a creationist?
		And I could read a long list of 30 names, and there's not time to do so on the program, 30-plus names of individuals who established the basic foundations of what is now benefiting us from the barometer to the computer.
		All of these were Bible-believing creationists.
		The creation mindset of cause and effect has benefited the world.
		So while there is the Darwinian intervention, because the secular mindset really doesn't like to give an accountability to a creator, while there is the Darwinian intervention, the pattern of the last 400 years has not been evolutionary information.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Can I point something out to you, Dr. You know, I interview some really strange people, and then I interview some extremely credible scientists, physicists, theoretical physicists, men of science of all kinds and stripes.
		And a lot of times in the course of those interviews, I actually pin them down and I say, do you believe in God?
		And do you know that at least eight out of ten times, the answer is no.
		I say, Doug, do you believe in the God of the Bible?
		And the answer is no, eight out of ten times with scientists.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, I can appreciate that because there was a time I was in that camp.
		I very seriously questioned the existence of a God.
		I think a very interesting guest might be to consider Dr. Michael Behe of Lehigh University, microbiologist.
		And Cardiline was talking about the scientific discoveries.
		This is cutting-edge discovery where they have found at the microscopic level, in fact lower than that, at the microbiological level, an incredible design.
		Cardeline, I think it may be of interest for you to realize that when we're talking about these factors, we're not just saying my grandmother believed it, so I have a religious mindset.
		In fact, I have across the room from me here in my office at home a scientific work, Statistical Science, published by the world's most prestigious mathematical scientific journal.
		And in that, in August 1994 issue, they explored the incredible phenomenon of equidistant letter sequencing in the biblical record, in the Bible itself.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, the Bible code.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		The Bible code.
		In fact, Art, last evening I asked one of my staff members who is extremely proficient in this and has published a new book, September 11 is in the Bible codes.
		I asked him to run.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Did they find that before September 11th or after?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		After because it doesn't volunteer anything.
		You know, you can't fortune tell with it.
		But I asked him to check Art Bell.
		And amazingly, he found in the book of Genesis, in relation to some of the work we're doing, encoded your name, Art Bell, at 879 skip sequence, six letters, Just all running together in the Hebrew.
		And the odds that that could be accidentally programmed there is 113.39 million to one.
		Then I had him check radio and talk and show.
		All of those came in.
		Broadcaster, seven letters, 2.49 billion to one odds.
		Premier, all of those.
		So you are encoded in the book of Genesis.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, I'm going to stop you right there and just ask you another question.
		I'm not even going to respond to that.
		Considering that several species are being driven to extinction every day, and assuming that we have lost perhaps millions of species in the past, why are there so many species today?
		And back then, how did Moses squeeze them all on the ark?
		And if he did get them all on the ark, how did he tend to them during that long period when he had to?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Now we're getting down to serious business.
		First of all, it wasn't Moses.
		That's a different name.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm sorry.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Moses was in a little ark himself as an infant.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		But it was Noah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Noah, Noah, I'm at the end.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		You know, that bothered me for years, and I had to find the answer to that.
unidentified		Okay.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Most of what we call speciation is simply adaptation and variation.
		If you take the basic kinds, and in the Hebrew these are called barimen, if you take the basic kinds, you come up with no more than 15,000 basic kinds.
		You have a horse kind, and from that you have the zebras and the donkeys.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But still, I mean, someone was joking on a previous show and said you couldn't even, no, couldn't even shovel all the poop.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Okay, let's address that.
		John Woodmoraffi, a friend of mine, published an entire book on that.
		He found that if you take those by twos and sevens, you have at the outside 35,000 vertebrate life forms necessary, plus some insects, etc.
		35,000.
		Is there space on the ark for that?
		The ark was 500 feet long, 85 feet wide, 52 feet high, three levels.
		If you take even the great dinosaurs and average those, the seismosaurus was 140 feet long, you know, incredibly big.
		You take two of each of those, you average through the little mice and the smaller creatures, the average comes out to be the size of a sheep.
		Art, there's room on one level of the ark for all 35,000.
		Now to the poop.
		During a storm, normally a lion will not attack a chicken.
		In a storm, there is hibernation potential or ostivation potential.
		Ostivation is simply a stupor.
		Hibernation is when we assume the temperature around us.
		Not all creatures have the ability to hibernate, but most creatures have the ability of going into a stupor.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you're saying they essentially slept through the trip.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Essentially slept through the trip, but I've done research on Noah's Ark.
		Ed Davis, who died recently, saw Noah's Ark in 1943, or claims to have seen it in 1943.
		The description is that actually there were portholes for refuse disposal, and you take three men, four men including Noah, Shem, Ham, and Japheth, his sons, and their abilities to shovel the poop of creatures in a stupor, and the potential is absolutely there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		All right.
		Hold on, Dr. Ball.
		This is incredible stuff, you've got to admit.
		And I guess it's all right back where we started from, and we will be back.
unidentified		You're listening to Ark Bell somewhere in time, tonight featuring a replay of Coast to Coast AM from June 12th, 2002.
		We gotta get right back to where we started from Do you remember that?
		And surely when you first came my way, I said no one could take your face.
		And if you get hurt, if you get hurt, why the little things I say, I can put that smile back on your face.
		And when it's alright and it's coming on, we gotta get right back to where we started from.
		Love is good, love can be strong, we gotta get right back to where we started from.
		I was defeated you, rock and roll.
		Wallaloo, promise you'll love me forevermore.
		Wallaloo, couldn't escape if I wanted you.
		Wallaloo, knowing my fate is to be you.
		Wallaloo, finally crazy, I want you.
		Wallaloo, I tried to hold you back when you were stronger.
		Oh yeah.
		And now it's my only chance, it's given up the fight.
		And how could I ever refuse?
		I knew I got things when I lose.
		Wallaloo, I was defeated you, rock and roll.
		Wallaloo, promise you'll love me forevermore.
		Wallaloo, couldn't escape if I wanted you.
		Wallaloo, knowing my fate is to be you.
		You're listening to Art Bell Somewhere in Time on Premier Radio Networks.
		Tonight, an oncore presentation of Coast to Coast AM from June 12, 2002.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		My guest is Dr. Carl Edward Baugh, a very serious creationist.
		Everything happened 6,000 years ago.
		In six days, that's a pretty serious creationist.
		All right, we'll get right back to him.
unidentified		All right.
		All right.
		Now we take you back to the night of June 12, 2002, on Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
		The End Ah, what a mixture we get in the middle of the night, huh?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Eric in Seattle, Washington asks kind of an interesting question.
		He says, if Earth's magnetic field is decreasing, isn't it possible that it will in turn increase in a future pole shift?
		Now, a lot of my guests talk about the possibility of a pole shift, that the Earth's magnetic field will go to a neutral condition for a period of time, then the poles will shift.
		He says, my University of Washington geology instruction suggests this is indeed possible.
		Doctor?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		I asked that very question of the world's leading specialist on the Earth steam magnetic field, Dr. Mario Akuna of NASA.
		Dr. Akuna not only monitors the field, but he has designed the instrumentation that's now in orbit to monitor the field from space.
		I asked him that very question, and he said, no, the Earth is only a whimper of its, the field is only a whimper of its original energy.
		It is far beyond the potential of recharging.
		That's the world's leading expert.
		I'm simply quoting him.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Back to the phone lines.
		I promised, east of the Rockies, you're on there with Dr. Ball.
		Hi.
unidentified		Yes, hi.
		This is Stormy.
		I'm calling from Tunica, Mississippi, listening to you on WREC.
		Okay.
		And the timing, the time factor and the years that Dr. Ball speaks of, I have a problem dealing with that.
		Evolution doesn't make any sense to me.
		Creation does.
		But the time frame that he puts this in, I find untenable.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Why?
unidentified		Well, John Anthony West has a book called Serpent in the Sky.
unidentified		And, of course, he did a lot of research.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Want to talk about the Sphinx?
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, all right, all right, Doctor.
		The Sphinx, they can date the water erosion and all that to, I don't know, 12, 13,000 years, and they're even talking about a lot more years now.
		That would seem to be a problem, Doctor.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Okay, I have read John Anthony West's book.
		I have, his book, have a copy of it, find it very interesting.
		I don't simply exclude myself to those who agree with me totally.
		I want to be a thinker.
		I have seen the Sphinx in person, and I've climbed Cheops Pyramid adjacent to the Sphinx, made a radio broadcast atop Cheops Pyramid.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I didn't do that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It was too hot.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Oh, it's high, almost 600 feet high.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, no, I said hot.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Too hot?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I went up inside the Great Pyramid, and I actually laid there in the sarcophagus and everything, but I did not climb because it was really hot.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Hot and high, and a little precarious to try to climb.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		A number of scholars have indicated that that erosion was not water erosion, but instead erosion of winds.
		Have you ever been in the Sahara or not only the Sahara, but that part of the world where the Sphinx is?
		Have you ever been in a dust storm?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		I was in the dust storm there that cut the paint off facilities, and it certainly made its mark on those priceless artifacts of history, of Keops, Kefrin, and Makaranos, including the Sphinx.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I don't know how to have to leave home to have dust storms like that, believe me.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
		Well, the potential of natural elements over just 2,000 or 3,000 years cannot be ignored.
		So in my opinion, while I respect John Anthony West's opinion, in my personal opinion, I think natural factors can explain what we find there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		Welcome to the Rockies.
		You're on the air with Dr. Carl Ball.
unidentified		Hi.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, no.
		I'm sorry, I didn't push a button.
		Now you're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
unidentified		Hello?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
unidentified		I just have a question for the good doctor, and that's a question about the Hubble telescope and the origins of the universe, which, according to the Hubble, that the universe started from the mass of less than one atom.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, well, we already covered this earlier in the program.
		That is to say, what the Hubble telescope sees out 15 billion years or more, it would seem in the past.
		And if you listen to an earlier part of the program, if you have that ability, it was explained.
		The time dilation was explained by the doctor, or at least what he believes to be the answer for all of that.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		we might add a little fact that since he mentioned uh...
		less than the diameter of one atom according to uh...
		standard astrophysical evolutionary Yeah, smaller than a quark, and in 10 to the minus 50th of a second, that mass, according to this theory, expanded 10 to the 53rd power in dimension, according to that theory.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, that is infinite velocity of light.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it could be creation, though.
		This is where people like yourself and scientists might have a meeting.
		Not you particularly, because you're talking 6,000 years, but people who believe that God, in fact, was the creative force, That there was nothing essentially.
		That's consistent with theoretical physicists who say there was no time, there was no space, there was nothing, and then there was something.
		Now, they don't even try to explain the instant prior to the Big Bang.
		And it seems to me that's where people like you and theoretical physicists might sit down and be able to have a decent conversation because why couldn't God have a hand in that instant?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, I have on staff a degreed physicist, Dr. Larry Mitchum.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And I think we should actually address all primary issues so we're not issuing any of them.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Does he argue that with you?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Oh, he, a few years ago, was a staunch evolutionist, as I had been some decades ago.
		But he has looked into the actual empirical data and has found it consistent with creation and with recent creation.
		For instance, Dr. Barry Sutterfield of Australia did a very interesting piece of work.
		He took the data we're talking about, the infinite velocity of light, and if that tiny quark of material expanded in 10 to the minus 50th of a second to 10 to the 53rd power of dimension in that brief amount of time, that's infinite velocity of light.
		Light does not travel at infinite velocity.
		There are two professors, one at Oxford and one at Harvard, who collaborated on a research project and published in Physical Review, I believe, that's a very prestigious physical scientific journal, published data indicating that light traveled essentially at an infinite velocity in the past.
		And that is not inconsistent with the creation model.
		Dr. Barry Setterfield found evidence that light has decayed at an exponential rate.
		It is now leveled off at this 186,282.0244866 miles per second.
		But it was faster in the past, and that decay matches, I don't want to get technical, but I'll have to use a particular sine curve, an exponentially damped sinusoidal curve.
		It matches that.
		If those data are true, then light would have been traveling at an infinite velocity 6,640 years, plus or minus 20 years.
		Now, that's mind-boggling.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Let's see.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Dr. Ball.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hi.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
unidentified		Me.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, you.
unidentified		Oh, it's not the show that's on right now that I'm listening to.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, it is.
unidentified		Oh, it is.
		Okay, so, oh, it's recorded ahead of time.
		Okay, I'm sorry.
		Okay, I have two questions.
		The first one, I don't understand why Noah used sets of twos, right?
		Because if you were to, like, produce people or, I mean, animals.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Dear, it takes two to tango.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, it's not hard to imagine.
unidentified		But that would mean that everything is created through incest.
		Wouldn't that mean that they would be deformed or have problems?
		like I would see it seem more logical to have used tattoo four or something like that.
		So it wouldn't be, do you know what I'm, do you know, Shall we address that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, you're sure.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Fire away.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Okay, I appreciate the question.
		Now, Noah was much closer to creation than we are.
		We have damage mutation due to cosmic radiation and environmental factors, and it's getting worse.
		But with the closer to creation gene pool that was essentially unlimited within its kind, there's a Hebrew word called bariman there that's used.
		It broadly means kind.
		Our genetic information is limited.
		It's been damaged.
		It's decreased.
		So the genetic information or the gene pool is much larger, so you have no problem with twos.
		In fact, today, in various areas of the world, I've extensively explored in Papua New Guinea.
		You can begin with two individuals under those conditions where they don't have all the ultraviolet radiation that we have.
		Two individuals, I mean two kinds, two birds or two kinds.
		And you don't have the accelerated damage that we have where we're exposed to more cosmic radiation.
		So there really isn't a problem.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Papua New Guinea is not that far from an area where they have more ozone depletion than we have here.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		But, well, Papua New Guinea is quite a distance from the Antarctic area.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, yeah, but it's at least got the amount of depletion we have here, if not more.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		But they also have a tremendous factor in that they have a three-tiered rainforest.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's true.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And the lower level gets triple canopy, yeah, okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Triple canopy.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I got it.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Dr. Ball.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello.
unidentified		Hey, Doctor.
		It's good to speak to you again, Doctor.
		Thank you.
		I came from California, to Texas, to see you.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, fine.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		And what's your name?
unidentified		My name is Maisie.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Maisie, I'm pleased you called in.
unidentified		Yeah, I saw you on a documentary on Dr. Arnold Murray's show.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Pastor Arnold Murray.
		And I just had to come there.
		My girlfriend, since you'd take me in, I visited you and your place and your biosphere.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, was it worth the trip?
unidentified		Oh, yes.
unidentified		And that egg was so unusual.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		I believe that's from China.
		Yes.
		I think she's referring to a double-yoked dinosaur egg that we have.
		As far as we know, the only one in existence.
		What that means is that on occasion, dinosaurs could hatch twins.
		Now, as Macy would test, we are in temporary facilities.
		We're building our permanent facility.
		So, Art, if any of your guests arrive, I hope they're not disappointed with temporary facilities.
unidentified		It's the greatest thing I ever.
		I love it.
		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, there's a good ad for it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you have a question, ma'am?
unidentified		No, I accept, well, not really.
unidentified		I won't take up any more of your time, but I'll call you back, Art, and I've got a fantastic story for you that I'll tell you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You take care and thanks for the endorsement.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		She was very gracious.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		I didn't invite that plug, but I appreciate her calling.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, absolutely.
		First time caller online, you're on the air with Dr. Ball.
		Hello.
unidentified		This is Matthew from Memphis, Tennessee.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hey, Matthew.
unidentified		First, I'd like to preface this question for Dr. Bog by saying, I really like what you do on your show, Mr. Bell, and Dr. Bog's show on TVN.
		I love that.
		I think that's some great stuff.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		You've got about 5 million viewers each week worldwide on that program.
unidentified		Much to Mr. Bell's chagrin, I am do believe in creation and what you're doing, but I have a couple questions.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's fine.
		I don't have a problem with that.
		I never question people's belief systems.
unidentified		Talking this out, I have two things and then one thing about the art.
unidentified		First, how do you know from the fossil record how big the dinosaur's lungs were?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		That's a good straightforward question.
		I have discovered and directed the excavation of 11 dinosaurs at one site, one at another.
		When we get to the rib proportion to the body, if we have enough of the fossil remaining, the rib section containing, of course, the lungs, rib section is considerably small in relation to that of mammals.
		So we know that the lung capacity was quite small.
		In fact, paleontology admits now in the technical footnotes that dinosaurs did have small lungs.
unidentified		And pre-flood, you were talking about the oxygen concentration on Earth.
		Yes.
		Would that be high enough to actually poison us?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, he wasn't saying it was that much higher.
		He was saying the pressure was higher.
		But the oxygen content, I think, slightly higher.
		Is that correct, Doctor?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		That's correct.
		In fact, I mentioned near the top of the program oxygen toxicity.
		If you have too much exposure to oxygen, you build up oxygen poisoning or toxicity.
		Matthew is exactly right.
		So the model, when we compare the ratio of plant life to animal life and this dual atmospheric context, we're able to model that to show that while we have approximately 21% oxygen today, and it's not really that high, we calibrate it by the previous record.
		In some industrialized areas, it's down to 18%.
		But let's take 21 as an optimal high.
		Our model shows it to be about 25% with dual atmospheric pressure, and living systems would metabolically use the oxygen so they would not build up toxicity, so there wouldn't be a problem.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		One more, I think, we'll have time for.
		Wildcard line, you're on the air with Dr. Ball.
		Good morning.
		Good morning.
		Where are you?
unidentified		I'm in Clear Lake, Florida.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
unidentified		Dr. Ball, it's good to meet you.
		You certainly have confused me and gave me an education.
		First of all, I think you just are addressing in a roundabout way, and I think that this is the problem with theology, physiology, mythology, science and technology.
		We're all merging.
		People have got to sit down and just say, hey, you know what?
		Maybe we don't know because, you know what, we could ask the question, what did God do before he did all this?
		And we'd come up with a whole nother set of answers.
		So I agree with what you're doing, but I think that your biosphere is hiding just behind Carkadium rhythms that explain why we are, who we are, what we do.
		The bees, the birds, the golden rabbit, and Goldilocks zone are all Carkadium rhythms.
		That's a bamboo type of why we are, what we are.
		Secondly, I would like to say, and I'm not disputing you, I just don't have a lot of time.
		You talked about finding an object that had art on it and a vase and lace type of drawings on it on an object, correct?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Yes, on a dinosaur.
		Yes.
		On a rock.
unidentified		On a rock.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Depicting species-specific dinosaurs.
		It was about the 8th century B.C.?
		Not that old.
unidentified		Well, the geomagnetic reversals are not caused by the approach of other large bodies.
unidentified		And what's happening is there was an archaeological find that a pottery was simply fired upside down, and you're looking at it thinking it's right side up, which would explain what you're looking at, which would explain that maybe your number isn't right because they were just pottery being upside down, and you're trying to look at it right side up.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Could that be, Doctor?
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Well, we're talking apples to oranges here.
		We're talking about the geomagnetic lines, not the intensity or strength.
		The strength would have been the same, right side up or upside down.
		It's just apples to oranges.
		I appreciate the fact that he's questioning.
		In fact, I think our public school systems on a scientific level, not on a religious level, but on a scientific level, should discuss both models.
		In fact, there are a number of scholars who are avowed evolutionists who believe that our students are being deprived of a real education because they're not given data, whatever data might be available, so that they can discuss both evolutionary and creation.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm afraid my time for data is gone.
		The show's ending.
		Your book, Why Do Men Believe Evolution Against All Odds?
		We've got a link on my website to that if people want to go read more.
		And Panorama of Creation, we've got a link to that.
		And of course, to your creationevidence.org website as well.
		All those links are on my website.
		And I want to thank you once again for another tremendous program.
		It's got to cause people to think out there, Doctor.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		That's what we want.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's what we want is right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So it, again, has been a tremendous pleasure having you on the program, and I'm sure we'll have you back again.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		My pleasure.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Thanks, Arch.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good night, my friend.
dr carl edward baugh ▲ ● ▼		Good night.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Well, that's it, folks.
		That's a serious creationist there.
		Dr. Carl Edward Ball.
		And I think tomorrow night will be equally interesting.
		You're going to find.
		Anyway, for this night, that's it.
		I wish you all a very good remainder of the dark hours.
		And I'll see you tomorrow night about same time.
		Same station, no doubt.
		Good night, Desert.
		Time Mark Bell.

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