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Aug. 22, 2001 - Art Bell
02:53:12
Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell - John Gribbin - Science Topics. Linda Howe, Lucy Pringle - Crop Circles
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Welcome to Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from August 22, 2001.
From the high desert and the great American Southwest, I bid you all good evening, good morning, good afternoon, wherever you may be across the great cosmos, I'm Art Bell and this It's Coast to Coast AM.
Good morning, everybody, and welcome to yet another new affiliate, WVGB in Great Bend, Kansas.
$15.90 on the dial in Great Bend, Kansas.
Glad to have you on board.
Got a lot of information this hour, and I've got a couple of special guests for you this hour as well.
Linda Bolton Howe and Lucy Pringle from Great Britain, from Hampshire, England.
So, as a matter of fact, is she from Hampshire?
I'm not sure.
Anyway, she's from England.
I know that for sure.
And we've got her on the line.
So they'll be coming up shortly.
I've got several things that I want to get out to you very, very quickly.
Number one, yes, obviously, the great malingerer.
Here I am back on the air once again.
And here's what's happened.
I'm going to give you the straight poop as my two doctors have given it to me.
And they gave me some pretty straight stuff, believe me.
I couldn't stand, I couldn't sit, I couldn't lie down.
It was, believe me, as awful as it gets.
My back wasn't just out, it was toast.
I mean it was really, really honestly toast.
And I thought I was toast too.
And so I went to doctor number one, my local doctor.
And he had an MRI done in Las Vegas.
I actually had to go do it.
Thank you very much.
And the MRI came back and he said, basically, cutting through it all, he said, look, you can't sit anymore.
I do not recommend under any circumstances whatsoever that you have an operation.
He said, of those patients that I've had that have had operations, it's turned out more times than not, or as many times as not, poorly.
With at least limited mobility on the good side and the possibility of paralysis on the bad side.
So that wasn't too cool, as you can imagine.
And here I am again, unable to sit, stand.
Even lying down was nearly impossible in any position that you can imagine.
So all of that didn't work.
So what to do?
I finally went to a specialist in Los Angeles, a sports injury type specialist doctor in Los Angeles.
And the news there was awfully grim as well.
He said, look, in the end, you've got two choices.
One, you can live with it, which really obviously I can't.
Or two, you can get a disc fusion operation.
And that's a very serious operation, as those of you who have had it know.
Those of you who have not, it's chancy at best, and again, the options are kind of like this.
You know, on the good side, you'll be able to walk again, but with limited mobility.
On the bad side, you could end up paralyzed or whatever.
So I decided, no operation, not going to do it.
He gave me, as I left the door, a prescription for some anti-inflammatory drugs, which I am now taking.
Lo and behold, they put me back on my feet.
Anti-inflammatory drug.
And, uh, a very strong anti-inflammatory drug.
And so the swelling went down, because the only thing that ever helped me was ice.
And so, uh, it figures that I had swelling, and the anti-inflammatory drug apparently is working.
And, uh, so here I am tonight.
Thank God.
And that's been, uh, that's kind of the saga up to date.
There's been a lot more, actually, but that's the long and short of it.
I don't want to bore anybody to death with anybody else's illness, particularly mine.
So I wanted to give you an update.
There you have it.
Poor choices and good luck so far with the drug.
Now, there are two things that are going to blow you away on my website tonight.
And I've been squirreling this one away.
The first one is a ghost, folks.
You have never in your life seen anything like this.
It, uh, it comes from, uh, Lord Ways, Nova Scotia.
And the man's wife on vacation, uh, with a new video camera was taking pictures out of her car.
And you're not gonna believe it.
She, with a video camera, caught a ghost crossing the road.
That's right.
And we've turned it into, he turned it into for me, an MPEG file.
And ladies and gentlemen, on my website right now there's an MPEG file if you've got a computer that's a moving video picture of a ghost crossing the street it will flat blow your mind it's all at artbell.com a moving picture first one I've ever had ever of a ghost in movement crossing a street in front of a car the video taken from inside car it's a blow away we've got the email and
The motion video on my website right now.
That's item number one.
Item number two, there has been, as you know, I'm sure, there's been a new crop circle in England.
CNN ran an extensive story on it the other night.
Really a great story.
Thank you very much, CNN.
And I went, oh my god, it's the biggest crop circle ever formed in the world.
And we've got a photograph of that on my website right now as well.
And so you're going to want to look at that as you listen to my guests tonight.
I mean this is just a flat blow away.
The biggest one ever formed, the greatest crop circle formed, was formed in Wiltshire.
And we've got a link to it right now.
It's just, it's 409 circles, it's obviously fractal, it's obviously not in a million years done by human beings, and it's going to be the subject of this first hour tonight.
So you're going to want to see that at artbell.com right now.
We've got a high-resolution, even if you saw the CNN story, we've got a high-resolution aerial photograph of this mind-blowing crop circle.
So that's a little bit of what we're up to tonight.
All of that coming up if you'll stay right where you are.
You're listening to Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from August 22, 2001.
Alright, two oh my god items on my website.
One is the picture, the moving video of a ghost crossing a street in front of a car in Nova Scotia.
It's a mind-blower, believe me.
The second is what's being called the Melkill Crop Circle Formation.
And if you will go to, when you get to my website, just in case, so you don't get jammed up, go to Program Tonight's Guest Info, and when you get there, just under Linda Moulton Howe's name, There will be a link that will take you directly to the crop circle formation.
These are two absolutes on my website.
Ladies and gentlemen from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, here is Linda Bolton Howe.
Good evening, Linda.
It's wonderful to hear that you're feeling better and that we have exciting news in this world.
I want to start with a little introduction on Lucy Pringle.
She is from Hampshire, England, and she is author of an excellent book called Crop Circles, The Greatest Mystery of Modern Times.
It is featured in the bookstore at my website www.earthfiles.com.
It is a beautiful book, and also her beautiful new 2002 Crop Circle calendar is now available, and for more information about that, You can visit earthfiles.com and the top story in my Real X-Files section is about this milk hill formation and my interviews with Lucy Pringle with a German surveyor and with a United States land surveyor who will make some comments from his professional point of view about this amazing formation.
It was like last Tuesday, right?
That it formed?
It was found on the morning of Sunday, the 12th of August, and you will be hearing from a German guy in the second half also about the fact that there was definitely no formation from a witness there on that Saturday afternoon going into the evening.
That's very interesting, Lynn, because CNN reported it was a Tuesday.
Well, there was a lot of discrepancies about the discovery in the beginning, but now as things evolve and things become more clear, it is and was discovered on Sunday, August 12th.
And Lucy, who has been flying over crop formations to take aerial photographs and to investigate the plants and soils of English crop formations, Since going back all the way to about 1989, when all of these patterns began evolving from simple circles and rings, she has been in hundreds of formations, but this one that was discovered in the Ron Reed Wheatfield on a high plateau of Millkill Wiltshire on Sunday, August 12th, overwhelmed her.
And after measurements have been made in the last few days, the official count is 409 circles of varying sizes divided into six curved arms that are not fractals, Art.
This is circle geometry, and you will hear comments about that from the German surveyor Andreas Muller in the second half.
These six curved arms stretch over 787 feet.
That's 240 meters from one side to the other.
feet, that's 240 meters, from one side to the other. The largest central circle was
72 feet in diameter and the smallest little circles that dotted along the
large arms were no more than 40 inches in diameter.
And, Lucy, could you describe for the Dreamland or the Coast audience your first impressions going into this amazing formation last week?
Hi, Lucy.
Hello.
Good morning, Art.
It's quarter past six in Hampshire, in England.
Quarter past six in the morning at the moment.
I'm delighted to hear that you're feeling so much better on those anti-inflammatories.
Long may it continue and get better and better.
Thank you.
And Linda, good morning to you.
Hi.
Yes, my first impression, when I actually went in on the ground, I went in with a friend, Denny Clark, who also comes over.
She comes over from America every year as a researcher.
And she's been into many, many crop circles, just as I have.
And we made our way up, all the way up the Wandsdyke, which is a very, very steep slope.
And it's quite a rutted road, and you get as far as you can, and you have to park your car.
And then it's really quite a trek.
You can't see anything at this point, because the crop formation lies right at the top of a plateau, as Linda was saying.
In fact, it is the highest point in the whole of Wiltshire.
And then you get out of your car and you have really quite a trek along and you suddenly find yourself going into this field and as you go in you look around you and everywhere you see is just nothing but circles and it is the most extraordinary feeling.
I've never quite experienced anything like it and we made our way in, further in, examining the circles as we went We couldn't find the center.
Where on earth was the center?
And I'd flown over it before, so I had a very, very good idea of the general layout and the geometry and the shape and everything.
But for the life of me, I simply couldn't find the center.
People don't understand that from the air you go, oh, there's a center.
But down on the ground, in something this large, it's like a maze.
It is absolutely just exactly like a maze.
And there were people All the way.
You wouldn't be able to see the perimeter at all if you didn't see people actually right on the perimeter.
And then you couldn't see them all.
You only saw them from about waist upwards.
Lucy Andreas emphasized that this is an undulating field.
He was shocked to find how many ditches, rises, Low part, he said it was such a rough field for such an extraordinary formation.
Excuse me, our photograph is a higher resolution than CNN had, but what they did do is their video showed the depth of the circles because they flew in at a lower angle and these circles are rather deep, aren't they?
Well, the height of the crop It's really at its greatest height that it's going to be this summer because it is very, very ripe.
It won't grow any longer, won't grow any further or longer.
I would say it's no more than about a meter, just over a meter.
So that really gives you the depth, so to speak.
But one woman who was very bright, she said she was on the perimeter.
And she'd seen my photograph and she said, right, there are 13 circles to every arm, 13 large circles to every arm.
And she said, I'm going to go on this spiral and count around.
Well, as she did say, she sort of disappeared from sight.
And I thought, good Lord, where on earth has she gone?
Eventually she sort of jumped up and down in the distance and she shouted, I am in the center!
So off we went and joined her in the center.
But I mean, I've never experienced anything like that.
It is the enormity and the obvious complexity and huge imposition is something that we've never seen before.
And what is so absolutely fascinating is the worldwide interest Well, that may be because CNN, for example, was quoting this as the largest crop circle in the world's history.
Do the two of you agree with that?
It is, in a sense of having the most circles, Art, in terms of the diameter size.
The Windmill Hill of 1996, the Triple Julius set, It was said to be a thousand feet in diameter.
Andreas Mueller thinks it was probably closer to 800 feet.
This one is coming in at his measurement at 787.
That would mean that the diameter on this one and Windmill Hill of 1996 might be very close.
Nothing has had 409 circles.
might be very close yet nothing has had four hundred and nine circle
uh... what was the closest hundred wet and let me what it be the hundred and ninety
four circles in windmill hill in nineteen ninety six
uh... yes i had no i think it wouldn't be i think it was the the lovely double
healing that compounded i was in nineteen nine
nineteen nine ninety m nineteen ninety seven i think it was
OK, that had 100.
168 circles, I think.
Well, there was 194 in Windmill Hill.
All right, so at 409... 409 is by a long shot the most numerous we've ever, ever had, yes.
It is beautiful.
And it is not fractal, and we all assumed that it was.
And now, as the people who are measuring things mathematically are getting into it, and you'll hear more in the second half hour, these are the arcs of That's very interesting because I've heard a great many rumors going around.
Lucy, one of the rumors batting around in the United States is that this may have been made for this science movie that
Knight Shemalian in the United States is working on on the East Coast.
Yes, that's very interesting because I've heard a great many rumors going around. I think once you get such an
absolutely daunting circle as this one, you get people who are...
uh... want to jump on the bandwagon and and destroy it as as being man-made all right let's examine that very very quickly lucy is there any way uh... in your opinion this was formed i understand it correctly if i'm wrong overnight uh... between what saturday and sunday i guess overnight and that if we have to make seven hours are seven hours and that it was raining it was spotted sunday from the air but do either one of you let's just cut right to it believe there's any way that man Could have done this.
No, personally, I don't.
And I've got a denial from the circle makers who say that they were not.
Meaning the guy involved in the creation of Milk Hill Formation, nor were any of the circle makers with whom they are in contact.
Now, they know all of them.
But quite apart from that, one doesn't even need to have a denial because it just humanly would not be possible to create something so enormous And with that number of circles, and with the precision, which I think Andreas will be talking about later.
Yes, he will.
And Lucy, what did the farmer, Ron Reed, say to you about being paid for anything?
Oh no.
Nothing?
No, no.
He's absolutely denied that, and he's also denied that to Polly Carson.
Well, CNN was saying, you two, that in order for a man to have made this, they would have had to make one circle every 30 seconds or something like that, which obviously is totally, completely impossible.
That's absolutely correct, yes.
And you will hear from the professional land surveyor that with the most sophisticated GPS satellite system, to find the center points and the radiuses of these 409 circles, the most rapid that he thinks it could occur, would be approximately every two to three minutes and even at that you are way beyond seven hours and he said the most likely though is 45 minutes per circle.
If that were the case with a GPS system that would take days.
What we know also Art is in the genuine formations they occur between in a time scale of between four and seven seconds.
four and seven seconds on seven seconds in my book i've written up a couple of
incidents where people quite independently
have seen these things form now when i was writing my book i interviewed hundreds of
people and i had to discount most of the stories
but i was left with two which i could not disprove in any way
Well, I bet you've got three now.
Lucy, we've got a break here at the bottom of the hour.
Everybody hold on for a moment.
This thing is astounding.
It's astounding.
And, you know, as she pointed out, it was like walking through a maze.
There's no way anybody could have...
This is Premiere Networks.
That was Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM.
symmetrical beauty and and and preciseness there's no way I mean go look at photograph yourself this and the
The ghosts are on my website right now at art bell calm to real
Wowser type things this is premier networks that was art bell hosting coast to coast am on this
somewhere in time No crime
You're wrong I
you you
You need direction, yeah, you need a name.
When you're standing at the crossroads, we hide, we look the same.
After a while you get to recognize the signs So if you get it wrong, you'll get it right next time
Next time You're listening to Art Bell, somewhere in time
Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM, from August 22nd, 2001.
The world has never seen anything like either one of the things that I've got tonight.
One, a picture of a ghost crossing the road.
This is not just a picture, but motion video of a ghost crossing the road in Nova Scotia, along with the email that came with it.
The gentleman and his wife who took it in Nova Scotia.
It's a world's first, as far as I know.
Item 2.
Picture of the world's latest and most complex crop circle.
409 circles.
It is beautiful.
All at my website right now at artbell.com.
That's www.artbell.com.
We'll get back to Linda Moulton Howe and my other guest, all the way from England, Lucy Pringle, in just a moment.
Stay right where you are.
You're listening to Art Bell, somewhere in time.
Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM.
from August 22nd 2001 back now to a couple of experts in the world on the world's
most complex crop circle that you can see on my website right now at www.artbell.com
Linda Moulton Howe and from Great Britain Lucy Pringle.
You two are back on the air again.
Have at it.
Lucy, Art was making an important point before the break about scientific evidence that crop formations are created really quite rapidly, maybe in less than 30 seconds.
This comes from Both Lucy's work, biophysicist WC Levengood's work in the United States, there have been several tests having to do with microwave energy and plants not being cooked that suggest whatever is happening is an energy system and that it's happening rapidly, which again is a whole different order of scientific evidence
than people talking about dragging around rope, springs and boards.
That's absolutely correct.
What we do know is that when this force hits, there's an electrical discharge of probably some hundreds of thousands of volts per meter, just for a nanosecond.
It is a very, very complex energy system that we're dealing with.
And when the force hits, it softens the plants at the base, allowing them to fall And then it travels up the stem of the plant, breaking down the molecular structure as it goes.
But that doesn't explain the complexity of the formations.
And in my opinion, there is an intelligence, there has to be an intelligence behind this phenomenon.
And to me, it makes abundant sense.
How is he going to make these formations?
Right.
He uses all the forces of nature available to him.
Right, and Lucy, I really want to share with the Coast audience these comments from this professional land surveyor and want you to hear it too.
Yes, I'd like to hear that.
And before we do that, could you please give listeners out your website where you have so many good photos?
I would be delighted.
It's h-t-t-p colon two forward slashes home, h-o-m-e dot Clara dot net forward slash Lucy Pringle, l-u-c-y Pringle,
all one word and it's all lowercase.
And you'll see quite a lot of different pictures about this fantastic formation we're talking about.
You'll see it in its own setting.
And with the hills and the surrounding countryside, it's just mind-blowing.
Yes, and you can see some of your photographs and make a direct link to your website by going also to earthfiles.com to this top story in the ReelXFiles section about tonight's interviews.
And at the bottom of the report are hot links to Lucy's website.
So with that, Let's go on since there is such an immense size in this Milk Hill 2001 formation and these 409 circles, more than anything ever discovered like this in the world.
I asked a professional land surveyor in the state of New Jersey to study photographs of this pattern and estimate how long it would take his survey team to mark out this formation.
To stake something out like this in the field from a surveying perspective is probably going to take the better part of a day and a half to two days work.
Because you've got 400 points you'd have to lay out the radius point of every circle in that formation to get it perfectly symmetrical.
And the office calculations that you'd need for something like that would probably take also the better part of a half a day with a computer.
The way that this would be laid out would probably be with an electronic distance meter and a data collector that would already have the coordinates of all the points stored into it.
So that's how it would be laid out in the field.
And a two-man team working with those conditions with the most advanced surveying computer knowledge would take maybe up to two days in order to even lay it out.
That's correct.
It certainly would be a difficult task to lay this thing out, and a costly one.
I mean, in the United States, your survey crews generally run anywhere from $800 to $1,000 a day.
And I showed this to a couple of my colleagues at work, and I said, yeah, it would be a big, big job.
And also, I'm speaking of doing this work in the daytime.
It would be very, very difficult to do this surveying work at nighttime.
Would it be almost impossible to lay this 409 circles out at night?
It would be extremely difficult.
You'd have to have some type of surveying equipment with an optical laser sight on board.
That does exist, but it's pretty expensive and most people aren't using it because it's not necessary for a lot of the current construction layout work.
Another possibility would be laying it out with With GPS equipment, global positioning, once again, that's even more costly equipment, but that works by utilizing satellites to determine your position on Earth.
And you would have to have the time to lay out those using satellite positioning.
Do you know how long it might take?
Could you just give us...
Estimated guess of how long using GPS it would take to lay out that 409 circle formation.
It would probably take, and I'm making kind of a guess here, probably with the very best
equipment available, you might be able to lay out each point in about two to three minutes.
And with some of the less expensive equipment, it would probably be about 45 minutes per
point.
And you can do the math yourself, take 409 circles times 45 minutes for the most common,
and you're talking about way more time than seven hours between sunset and sunrise between
the 11th and the 12th of August.
Besides that, Linda, I've looked.
Anybody who looks at this knows that humans did not do this.
They simply could not have maintained this kind of accuracy and complexity, the preciseness with which they did it, without an incredible team.
And even then, I don't believe, no.
Humans do.
And it's flawless, isn't it?
Yes.
If you look at those circles, and what's interesting, if you count out Seven from the center.
You'll find that on the seventh circle at the end, the two little outriders actually share their circle with another spiral going around as it tapers towards the end.
Now that is absolutely precise on every single one of the arms and to do something of that amazing exactitude is, well, I'm speechless.
Everybody who has ever measured and surveyed says the longest part of geometry whether you are going to build a house on ground or in this case bringing geometry onto the crops The longest effort is laying out the centers of what it is that you are doing in the geometry and you've already heard now a land surveyor who has worked doing this for years say it would take really two days
For them to simply find all of the points for 409 circles.
All right, may I ask both of you a question?
It is as follows.
I really need, and everybody wants to know the answer to this, what in God's name has done this?
I see only two possibilities.
A, our military with satellites, or B, them.
Anybody have any other guesses?
Andreas, he has some interesting comments about this from the standpoint of a force of nature that has intelligence and consciousness that we really, we may have called various names as civilization has evolved and that he is, and so is the teenager in Holland.
They both have very similar perspectives that we are dealing with intelligence that is almost a hyper force a hyper intelligence behind nature and
that the point of view of people who have spent a lot of time in
the uh... formation would that be the earth itself linda
no i think from their perspective
that that there are other frequencies other dimensions there's something that
we don't understand all that there is in nature with a capital and all right
you know you have another report i believe that's not the problem
That's how I go along, too.
I believe there is this consciousness in everything.
There are degrees and levels of intelligence, just as there are degrees and levels of other dimensions, if you like.
And I think the greatest mathematicians have all agreed That it would be absolutely impossible for us to be the only intelligence.
But what is that intelligence?
And yet it's unquantifiable.
Some sort of disincarnate intelligence, right?
I would say it would be a disincarnate intelligence.
It certainly isn't little green men that people like to put around.
We've grown long beyond that.
Just like to start with the math, the primary school math.
Now they're university school math.
We've grown beyond that too.
In our understanding, I think, of this phenomenon and understanding of the energy that we're talking about, energy or intelligence, frequency, consciousness, whatever you like to call it.
All right, Lucy.
Lucy, Andreas would agree with you 100%.
Andreas Mueller is a crop circle researcher who has measured and drawn detailed diagrams of dozens of crop formations the past three years.
He's from Saarbrücken, Germany.
He had been in southern England traveling from formation to formation for about a month this summer of 2001.
And Saturday night, August 11th, was his last night, ironically, and he and his friends left early the next morning for Germany.
When he arrived at his home, he already had a message from England about the huge Milk Hill pattern discovered that same day, August 12th.
He turned right around in his car and drove all the way back to England to experience it for himself and measure as much as he could.
Here is Andreas Muller.
You look for symmetry and this is what we have in this formation.
Of course I didn't measure all 409 circles.
It's 409 in total.
By entering it The only thing I can explain is the idea you got.
I mean, the basic idea.
You were surrounded by circles.
This was unbelievable.
I mean, you made a 360 degree turn and circles were just all over you.
And without an aerial picture, you simply wouldn't know what's up there.
The thing is, what was a very impressive detail of this formation, that it was placed in a field that was very sloping.
There were many ditches and bumps in the field.
And those ditches, for example, they were that deep.
I was once standing in an outer circle of one of the arms, looking in the direction of the very center.
And I saw some people who I thought they were sitting in a circle because their heads were just showing out of the standing crop.
And when I approached them, I realized they were actually standing in a circle which was in the lowest part of the ditch.
So you can imagine how bumpy the whole area was.
And this was very impressive for me because those irregularities in the crown and in the topography Did not cause any distortion or irregularity in the formation itself, which is basically a major problem for architecture.
Because what they have to do if they make the foundation for a house, they have to create a flat and right angular platform where they can start on.
Or they had to do a very detailed topographical survey of the whole ground to be able to put down a building.
And this is similar to, because architecture makes the same what crop circles do, they bring geometry on the ground, basically.
And so, something was able to avoid all of these known problems by creating this amazing The biggest formation we ever had, not the longest, but the biggest we ever had on such a hard terrain.
It is something one really has to experience in the field, you know?
This sheer scale, this sheer large scale, it's, yeah, mind-blowing.
And to say it with an experienced human circle maker's word, Who was baffled by and just kicked away by this formation.
He said, with his last words, by giving a quote on this formation, he said, my brain hurts.
This is a guy who has made crop formations, said to you about Mill Kiln, this makes my brain hurt.
Yeah, the basic thing I want to tell is, The night was covered with rain and people who were first in the formation say that the lay was nice and clean and with no footprints on it and everybody who knows what it is to walk in a wet field, I mean you know this from England, it's not possible to avoid that your feet and your shoes get clumpy with tons of earth and with mud and you spread this all over in the formation.
Nothing was there.
Are you at this point left with any sense inside yourself of what could be behind something like Milk Hill 2001?
I think it is... Yeah, a good word that explains what I feel is it is consciousness and intelligence but not fixing those two words to to aliens from outer space. I see the consciousness and the
intelligence even in nature, but not in simple nature as we are used to experiencing each day.
It is some things hidden in nature.
Probably it can be explained with hyper-natural nature. I don't know. I don't want to exclude
aliens but it's simply not what I personally feel the first time.
I feel after all these years that we are facing a phenomenon that teaches us again the basic teachings on ourselves, on our environment, on our nature, and so I see more hints for linking the phenomenon with a consciousness and intelligence which is in nature
itself.
Close to the mind of God, so to speak?
So to speak, but this brings crop circles in a religious aspect and I don't feel that
the crop circles are for me something religious.
I mean, yeah, I mean in the same way as I feel when I look at a flower and suddenly
realize what a wonder it is, you know?
What big and complex geometry it includes and this is something we have to wonder again about and I think this is also what the crop circles teach us.
And there you have it from I'm a fellow that all of us have come to know.
He has spent probably more time, wouldn't you say, Lucy?
I would consider Andreas to be the leading surveyor.
He has done inestimable help and a terrific contribution towards recording this phenomenon.
Faithfully, from the geometric point of view.
All right, you two, we've got about a minute to wrap it up.
The world's most complex crop circle just formed.
We've got a photograph.
I agree with that man.
To look at that and try and imagine that we did it, man did it, will make your brain hurt.
It is exciting about next summer, isn't it?
It's always exciting, and no matter how we try and imagine what's going to happen, we're always several steps behind the phenomenon.
That's true.
Yes.
And everybody keeps wanting more and bigger, and you know what I like about this, Lucy?
It is back to the six-fold geometry, the sacred geometry, the sixes and the sevens of our most ancient and sacred knowledge, and that may be fundamental to whatever the intent is of this intelligence.
Do the two of you think this is an environmental warning?
That's about all we've got time for.
A sort of a yes or no for both of you.
Well, I think it's trying to bring our awareness into the problems of our everyday life and our environment.
I would say yes.
So, both of you say yes.
Alright.
Linda Moulton-Howe, as always, thank you very much.
Lucy Pringle, all the way from Great Britain, thank you.
Thank you, Art.
Thank you.
And good night, all.
Alright, well, there you have it.
Now go take a look at the photograph.
It'll make your brain hurt.
I guarantee that, and the ghost going across the street, the opaque moving video that you have got to see at Artbell.com.
Both of them at Artbell.com right now.
They're both oh my god items and we'll keep them there and keep telling you all about them tonight.
The trip back in time continues with Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM.
More somewhere in time coming up.
I love to love you and about you there's no other.
We'll go walking out while others shout Of what disaster
Oh, before giving less volition Be it sight, sound, smell or touch
of something inside that we need so much.
The sight of a touch, or the scent of a sound, or the strength of an oak when it moves deep in the ground.
The wonder of flowers to be covered and then to burst up through tarmac to the sun again.
Or to fly to the sun without burning a wing.
To lie in a meadow and hear the grass sing.
To have all these things in our memories.
And then you will send the cowards to die Why?
Why does your soul take its place on this trip?
Just come on in Why?
Take a free ride, take a rest Out by the sea, it's heartbreak
I've been waiting to say it for years It's been so hard just to admit my fears
Had to end my life before I left But by now, by now, I should have cried
Premier Networks presents Art Bell, Somewhere in Time Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM
From August 22, 2001 I don't care if you've got to crawl to a computer
Make your way to a computer somehow and see what we've got tonight.
It's a blow away.
I'm telling you right now, we've got two things.
One, this man in Nova Scotia whose wife was taking some video with her new camera on vacation in Nova Scotia.
And they caught a ghost, that's right, a ghost crossing the street.
And we've got the MPEG moving video file you can download up there tonight, courtesy of this man in Nova Scotia who I want to thank very much.
And we've also got the world's most complex crop circle that just formed in Great Britain.
By the way, we're going back to Great Britain in a moment to speak with Professor John Gribben.
Not about crop circles, but about time travel and other delicious topics like that.
So that's what's coming up immediately.
However, I'm telling you, get to artbell.com.
That's artbell.com.
And actually sample both of those things.
Download the moving video.
It's a classic.
I've never in my life seen moving video of a ghost before.
And the second item, of course, the world's most complex crop circle.
There's a lot going on right now out there and we're here to cover it all.
You're listening to Art Bell, somewhere in time.
Tonight, featuring Coast to Coast AM, from August 22nd, 2001.
Alright, we're going all the way back to Great Britain now.
Back again to Great... In fact, this is going to be the invasion of British Week, I think, tomorrow night as well.
John Griven was born in 1946 in Maidstone, Kent.
He studied physics at the University of Sussex.
1966, BSC went on to complete an MSC in astronomy at the same university.
1967, awarded with a very special merit award before moving to the Institute of Astronomy in Cambridge
and under the directorship of Fred Hoyle to work for his PhD.
During this period, he gained an Isaac Newton studentship for research on gravitational problems and the prestigious annual award of the Gravity Research Foundation in the United States.
The only student and the first Englishman working in England ever to receive this award and so, so much more.
He has written books, one about climate change, one called The Sixth Winter in Search of Schroeder's Cat, Uh, in search of the double helix, in search of the Big Bang, in search of the edge of time, being human.
It just goes on and on and on and on, obviously a real heavyweight.
And all the way from Great Britain, uh, here is the professor.
Professor Grimman, welcome.
Thanks, it's nice to be with you.
I've forgotten a lot of that stuff.
It takes me back.
Does it?
Uh, I hardly even know, uh, where to begin with you.
You, uh, have written A book on climate change, and there are many of us, Professor, who believe that our climate is actually in the midst of that change right now.
I wonder how you feel about it now.
Yes, I'm one of the ones who... convinced is perhaps too strong a word in science.
You know, you always want absolute proof before you say something is established for certain.
But I think there's overwhelming evidence, enough to convince a court of law, if you like, that human activities are changing the climate.
And that's responsible for the warming that's been going on for the past few decades.
I'm rather curious, Professor, here in America there are many who when they hear words like the ones you just spoke actually get angry and their anger comes from kind of a political place because they understand That in order to change, what you just said is now beyond any shadow of a doubt, there would have to be changes that would affect the political world out there, indeed affect all of us.
Do you get the same sort of reception when you say that in England?
It's much more acceptable, if you like.
I think people have had longer to get used to the idea.
My understanding from my travel and talking to people in the States is that Over there you've felt as if these things didn't affect you, that technology can solve all problems, whereas in the rest of the world people have perhaps had less faith to start with that we can solve all our problems that way.
And so when we're told that there are problems that are arising and we've got to change our lifestyle to cope with them, it came as less of a shock.
And it's certainly most of the people that I talk to, I mean, there's a general willingness to accept that there is a problem and something needs to be done.
And of course, the debate then is about what needs to be done and how quickly and how much we can spend on it and all those sorts of issues, but not on the underlying facts of the case that something is happening and action does need to be taken.
Professor, can you articulate the range of the change possible, both on the hopeful side and on the on the other side as well.
Well, this is something I haven't looked at for a long time.
It's an area that I worked in about ten years ago, and what happened was that I didn't stop being interested in it.
I stopped working in it when the evidence became compelling, because I was interested in the scientific side.
And once it was clear that there is a problem there, then it becomes a political issue, and I could have spent my life Becoming a politician and doing things in that area, but for various reasons I chose not to and so I haven't been closely involved in the subject for about 10 years or so, but I follow the figures that come out of people like the World Meteorological Organization and the International Climate people and it does seem that we're talking about possible
Range of increases in temperature during the present century of perhaps up to about five degrees Celsius, which would be a bad, the worst case scenario.
And if things go well, then temperatures will rise and weather patterns will change.
Uh, but not so drastically.
If, uh, if things don't go so well and we get a five degrees Celsius change, uh, people say, well, that's not much, uh, so, so what?
It's not much if you compare, you know, summer to winter and, uh, even, you know, day to day you can get changes that sort of size.
But what you have to do is to look at this as a long term change in the average over the whole year, every year, and compare it with things like the changes that warmed the world out of an ice age about 10,000 years ago.
And just, I can't quite remember, I think the figure's about three degrees.
The average rise in temperature worldwide that made the world change from an ice age to the conditions we live in now is certainly less than what we're talking about.
So it's a very big change in terms of the world's natural processes, the ecology, the plants and animals and so on.
What is the likely practical A result.
In other words, what could the world expect if it experienced a 5°C change?
You get changes of all kinds.
Some places will get drier, which is what gets a lot of publicity.
New deserts and so on.
Some places will get wetter, in terms of rainfall, which obviously can be a good or a bad thing, depending on where you start from.
And of course, the rise in sea level that results partly from the Just the thermal expansion of the top layer of the oceans, it's warming up so it's getting bigger and partly from glaciers and ice caps melting it's going to have a dramatic effect on places around the world from Bangladesh to Florida and I think there's been some amusement in some quarters over here in Europe that Florida being the key state that got George W. Bush elected is likely to be the first part of America to suffer detrimental effects from his policy on climate change.
God's work?
Well, who knows?
I guess Jed might have something to say about that.
There will be people living on islands around the world that I suppose will be with the fishes, right?
Yeah, absolutely.
There are some small islands, particularly in the Pacific Ocean where there are a lot of small islands, which are Only a meter or so above sea level, you know.
It's just going to disappear.
Actually, there's one, I believe, in the Pacific that is rather sinking at the moment.
Yeah, well, you've got two problems.
Of course, some of these places are literally sinking because of geological processes.
But what's happening as a result of this global warming is that the sea level is rising.
And I should say, often when I talk to people who haven't got scientific background, Global warming is a reality.
That's something we can measure.
You know, the temperature's going up.
And then this business about the greenhouse effect and human activities is where we say, well, how much of it's caused by human activities?
How much of it's a natural process?
And a lot of people think the word global warming means that human activities are changing the climate.
They're not synonymous.
You know, the world is warming up.
How much of it is due to our activities, we can't quite be sure.
It could mean, though, another ice age.
We don't know exactly what it's going to mean.
Well, all kinds of things could happen.
One of the scenarios that concerns people in our part of the world, in Northwest Europe, is that we're kept warm by the Gulf Stream, which is a current that flows up past Florida and sort of turns right at New York and comes across the Atlantic and brings warm water to us.
our part of the world. That brings warm air which blows past and keeps us a lot warmer
than Alaska and Canada which is the kind of temperatures we ought to have. And it's possible
that the changes in the amount of fresh water getting into that part of the world from the
Arctic Ocean could change this current and Europe could get colder while the rest of
the world gets hotter. So there are all kinds of complications that we just can't calculate
So you could, for example, experience big snowstorms?
Absolutely, yeah.
I mean, anything that brings more moisture into the air is bad if you're in a cold part of the world.
So while these changes are going on, obviously warmer water evaporates more, so you get more clouds, you get more rainfall or snowfall, whatever it might be.
You expect there to be extreme weather events in a warmer world, and more hurricanes, and they would extend further north up the Atlantic seaboard of the States, for example.
Well, yes, as a matter of fact, now I saw on the cable news network here that the meteorologists are beginning to, actually for about the third time, modify their opinion of how strong the hurricanes are going to be this year.
They're really getting worried about, because of the heat, Uh, in the amount of heat in the Atlantic.
Absolutely.
I mean, they, hurricanes are driven entirely by warm water.
That's why they only happen in the tropical regions.
And they need a certain temperature to keep them, uh, going.
And that's why they peter out.
Obviously, if they go over land, they peter out because they run out of water to draw on.
But even over the oceans, as they go away from the equator, where the water gets cooler, they fade away and they become only severe storms.
It's still bad enough by human standards.
So, if the oceans are warmer, you're going to get more of these storms, they're going to be stronger, and they're going to extend further away from the tropics.
Yeah.
Alright, Professor, you sort of ducked out as this became political, obvious to you that it was underway and it became political, and you have concentrated in the world of physics.
There is no thing that I am personally more interested in, in the whole world, than time travel.
I obsess, actually, about the possibility of time travel, and I know that you've written about this, that you know something about it, and so the first question that I would ask you is, in your opinion, is time travel going to be allowed by the laws of physics as we know them now, or as we imagine, some of our theoretical physicists imagine they may be?
Well, the short answer is yes.
And there's nothing in the laws of physics, as we understand them, which prevents, or forbids, if you like, time travel.
Really?
The long answer is that it will be very, very difficult and involve manipulating huge amounts of mass.
I mean, much more than the mass of our sun, for example.
But it's one of the most exciting discoveries to theoretical physicists of the past 20 years or so, is that there is nothing which prevents time travel according to the equations of physics as we understand them.
Nothing that prevents time travel.
That's right.
I mean, it's not saying that time travel is definitely possible, and it may be that we will discover a law which does prevent it later on, but it's the two areas of physics that came out of the 20th century, the two great discoveries are the general theory of relativity from Einstein and quantum physics from a whole load of people who developed that.
And from those two theories, those two sets of mathematical equations, You seem to describe everything in the physical world that we've been able to probe with our experiments.
And it's those two sets of equations that tell us that it's not impossible for certainly for particles to travel in what we call closed time-like loops.
That means loops in time going back to where you start.
And once you start talking about particles being able to do that then It's natural for you and me and everyone else to speculate about human beings or spaceships or whatever.
Would you think, Professor, that travel in time forward would be equally possible with travel in time to the past?
Well, travel in time forward is easy.
I mean, it's something that, in a naive sort of sense, we do.
I mean, we move forward at 24 hours a day, you know, all the time, without even trying.
And it's something that is easy to do within the framework of the theory of relativity by traveling fast.
If you travel close to the speed of light, then in a sense, time slows down for you.
And so you get into the future quicker, and you could go on a journey in a spaceship, you know, and come back, and it would seem like a week had elapsed for you, and maybe a month had elapsed on Earth.
So you would have traveled into the future in that sense.
Getting back has always been the hard problem, and that's what People are excited about and interested in is the possibility of going back in time.
So it would be, in your opinion, far more difficult, technically, to achieve going back?
Absolutely.
That's where you start talking about these huge concentrations of mass and there are things, I think you've probably had people like Michio Kaku talk about this on your program before, these cosmic strings.
That's right.
Where you have tubes of material with fantastic energy density that distort space and time in their vicinity.
And if they exist in the universe, as many people think they do, then they could act as a kind of natural time machine and you could travel back in time by finding one of these objects and flying around it in a circle.
Are you referring to the horizon of a black hole or a wormhole?
It's very similar.
They affect space and time in a similar sort of way.
But the other aspect is this idea that you Could use a black hole as a gateway to a cosmic subway and travel through it and come out somewhere else, which, of course, Carl Sagan described very memorably in his novel and film Contact.
That stuff in that science fiction movie is real science in the sense that it could happen according to the laws of physics, but it's as difficult.
The analogy I always like to make is, you know, you go back to Someone like Leonardo, hundreds of years ago, designing a helicopter.
He could never make it fly.
We're almost in the stage now where we can design a time machine, but it'll take the technology of hundreds of years in the future to make it work.
Actually, Contact, the movie, is one of my favorite movies.
I've watched it again and again.
If you hear the little phone number bumper I've got in the beginning, you'll hear, want to take a ride?
Right.
Well, I listed that right from that movie.
Believe me.
So that movie then, technically, was roughly, hypothetically, accurate.
Yes, it was.
I mean, there's a wonderful story about this, which if you're a fan of the movie, you probably know.
But what happened when Carl Sagan was writing the book was he wanted to use this idea of travelling through this sort of cosmic subway space machine, if you like, to travel from one part of the universe to another.
And he wanted to dress it up properly with some mathematical bits and pieces.
And he's a planetary scientist, he didn't know much about the relativity, and he asked a friend of his, Kip Thorne, to work out some mumbo-jumbo, you know, not real maths, to put in the book, to disguise his lack of knowledge.
And Kip went away and thought about this for a weekend or so, and he came back and he said, well look, Karl, actually this isn't mumbo-jumbo, this is real.
I mean, Einstein's equations say you really can travel through these tunnels in space.
And then a little bit later, the penny dropped.
And I think it was one of the students in Thorne's group who said, well, Einstein taught
us that space and time are the same thing.
And if you can have a tunnel through space, then you can have a tunnel through time as
well.
Indeed.
And that led to, well, I was going to say an explosion.
I mean, it's actually about two dozen people, but it felt like an explosion of interest
in the late 1980s, 1990s in the scientific community.
All right, Professor, I've got to ask you to hold on for a moment.
We're at the bottom of the hour.
We'll be right back.
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That was Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM on this Somewhere in Time.
Where'd a digger digger down about an hour ago Took a look around, they wish they'd made a windblow
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Crawling in the air tonight.
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Now, we take you back to the past on Art Bell Somewhere in Time.
Remember, folks, at artbell.com right now, a moving video of a ghost going across the street in Nova Scotia.
No one's ever seen anything like it.
And, of course, the brand new crop circle in Great Britain.
We'll have to ask Professor Gribben if he's seen it.
409 circles made by man?
I don't think so.
And I think it's proper to say, you look at that, stare at it for a while.
We've got the photograph.
As a matter of fact, go to my website.
Under program, tonight's guest information, under Linda Moulton Howe's name, you'll see a link to the picture.
Just stare at it for a while.
And tell me if your head doesn't hurt trying to imagine how that was done.
I'm Art Bell.
If you'll stay right there, there's much more to come.
Sound of explosion.
Now, we take you back to the past on Arkbell Somewhere in Time.
Music.
Now back to Professor John Gribbon in Great Britain.
Professor, it's way away from your field, but it just happened a week or so ago, this incredible Wiltshire crop circle, 409 circles.
It just does not seem possible that a man could have done this certainly overnight.
Have you had an opportunity to see it yet?
Any comments?
I haven't seen that particular one, no.
I try to keep an open mind on these things.
I think human ingenuity is pretty high and I would be surprised if there wasn't some way that people could make even something as complex as that.
but I've at least a hint of a possibility I think that there is a natural phenomenon which produces
some of them. I know for sure some of them are made by people, I know some of the people who
make them, but you know that maybe they aren't, that doesn't mean they all are, it doesn't mean
they all aren't. And in fact I've, although it's not in my area, I've used crop circles in a novel
that I've written with David Compton but it's not yet published.
We haven't found a publisher for it, so maybe this will stir up interest and we'll get somebody to buy the book.
Well, it looks like most of your series is in search of something or another.
Do you have a working title on the new book?
No, we won't get the word time in because it involves time travel as well, so we're thinking along the lines of time waves or something like that, but that's often the last thing to come when you're writing a novel.
Is there, Professor, work going on that you're aware of now on time travel?
Well, there is, in the sense that people sit down and work out with pencils and papers and computers how things might be done.
I'm not aware of anybody who's trying to build a time machine, to put it in that sort of language, but there are people who work with Changing time, if you like.
You may have seen the stories about slowing down light by passing it through various media and treating it in different ways.
I'm told, actually, Professor, that that is almost a parlor trick, that even though, on the one hand, you do, in effect, slow down light, you really don't.
That's a good way of putting it.
A lot of these things, they start out like that.
They are parlor tricks, if you like.
But again, sort of making the analogy with flight.
People built paper aeroplanes before they built real aeroplanes.
So you go from the parlor tricks to doing something useful.
And one that I always like is back in the middle of the 19th century, James Clerk Maxwell, who's a great scientist who worked with the color theory of light.
and he was the person who worked out that you could make color photographs by taking three black and white images
through three different colored filters.
And that was a parlor trick. He photographed a piece of tartan and demonstrated it in color at the Royal Society in
London and astonished everybody.
And not much more than a hundred years later, the space probe...
So, what about this?
visited saturn was sending back pictures color pictures of saturn
reading exactly that politics but i think this is politics uh... well
it's not what about this
people say that if time travel is ever
to be possible and uh... we all know how quickly uh...
technology is advancing you know the speed of processors doubling every eighteen
months whatever it is
that uh... if time travel is uh... eventually going to be possible it's
easy to imagine it will be then where pray tell are the time travelers
Peace.
The simple answer is that you can't travel backwards in time, according to these same laws of physics that we've been talking about, to an earlier time than when the time machine was built.
So, if I was to build a time machine in my backyard tomorrow, I could, in principle, travel anywhere in the future, and I could come back to tomorrow.
But I couldn't come back to today because the time machine didn't exist then.
And that seems to be the simplest way around that puzzle.
People like to speculate about these things and there are stranger ideas like that perhaps time travel is possible and the world is full of time travelers and they're just hiding from us for some reason.
So then from the very moment then that a time machine is is invented that would go into the future, then from that moment we could expect to get visitors from the past.
No, only from the future of the machine.
The machine can't open up the past of the machine.
So then we would never experience the visitors, would we?
No, what we need to do is to find a natural time machine, one of these cosmic strings or one of these wormholes, something like that.
And if you find something that's been around for millions of years, then you can use that to go back to all those millions of years in the past.
So there's a better prospect, perhaps, of developing space travel in the hope that we can then find a time machine and use that for time travel.
And again, something that's been explored in many science fiction stories, Rather than building our own, and only being able to travel into the future, if you do think that that's not very exciting.
Very exciting indeed.
But once an individual got there, that individual could not come back, short of finding... They could come back to the time when the machine was built, but they couldn't go back any further.
And of course, one of the interesting things about this is, it means It would be almost impossible to keep something like that secret, because if you had a huge secret government project and you built the first time machine in some dark and secret place and didn't tell anybody, what that does is it opens up the future.
So people in the future who've got better technology than us can then come back to the moment that time machine was built.
So your dark and secret time experiment is successful, you know, in some underground laboratory in the middle of the Rockies, and immediately time travelers can come and Anywhere.
You know, come up to you in the street in New York and say hi.
So you're not going to keep this project secret if it's a success.
So that's a twist that I guess the government researchers ought to be aware of.
And certainly the government, as always, would have an intense interest in such a machine.
What would be the practical applications you could imagine of being able to go to the future?
And wouldn't it mess things up kind of?
Yes, I think we have to turn to the writers of fiction to look at all the problems that could arise, and they're very similar to the problems of making contact with alien civilizations, which is a much more realistic prospect, certainly in our lifetimes.
The culture shock, it's all very well imagining that you could make some kind of contact with the future, even if it's limited contact, and find out wonderful things and have new technology and stuff like that.
But it would be an enormous culture shock and it could destroy our civilization entirely the way that the...
Some of the civilizations of the Pacific were destroyed by contact with what we call Western civilization.
Actually, I think most of these civilizations untouched, or these groups untouched by modern civilization have, in fact, been destroyed by contact, haven't they?
Yes, I think it certainly was something that happened a great deal.
And so it's something that's worth being aware of.
And people, sociologists, psychologists, and people do look into this.
From the point of view of what would happen if we got a message from another civilization in space, just the mere knowledge that we weren't alone.
Would that be a huge religious experience for the world, or would it destroy our faith in human ability if we use it as a superior technology?
Possible people might think, well, why bother?
You know, what's the point of inventing things if it's all been invented by somebody else?
Well, here's something I don't get.
Let's assume that we were able to snatch knowledge, technical knowledge, from 500 years in the future, and it decimates us, decimates our society.
We don't know how to handle it.
We're not socially prepared for it, whatever it is that we could imagine.
What would that do were we to destroy ourselves virtually?
To those who, 500 years in the future, who imparted that knowledge to us.
Right.
Well, you're right there in the realm of all the time travel paradoxes, and the classic one working the other way around.
If you go back in the past and you do something that leads to you not being born, then you can't go back in the past.
And this is where the quantum physics comes into the serious science that's being done to investigate the possibility of time travel, because the quantum physics Allows for the possibility of there being more than one reality, that there are different versions of everything if you take it to the extreme.
But in the simple case that when you have particles like electrons and they're given a choice of doing one thing or another, turning left or right when they come to a particular obstruction, then in some sense the world splits in two as you have one world in which it goes left and one in which it goes right.
And the answer would be that the knowledge from the future that has changed us, has changed our future, but that it came from another future, if you like, the future next door.
And there was a wonderful book called Timescape, it's one word, so it's kind of a pun on time escape as well, by, I think it was Gregory Benford, which looks at this whole problem.
And that's about a project where communication with the future is established, and it does change the world.
and once the world is changed the communication stops because
that's no longer our future, it's somebody else's future.
So there are ways around all these problems if you look at the laws of
physics and you think hard enough about it.
Well, Professor, the way it was explained to me by Professor Kaku was that
at the instant, for example, that you killed your father or grandmother or whatever
there would in effect be a new universe, a new bubble of
There would be an entirely different stream of time and events.
That's right.
I mean, you can think of it, another analogy is like with the branches of a tree, you know, and we're sort of traveling up the trunk of the tree, and at the time we're still in the trunk, then it's possible, if time travel is possible, to get communication from all the branches above us.
But when you do something that makes a decision of the kind you're talking about, That's like turning off into a side branch.
And once you do that, then there are still different possibilities as the branch sort of turns into little branches and tweaks and so on.
So you haven't sort of finally crystallized everything, but you've turned away from one particular path.
And so that path is no longer open and you're heading in a different direction.
Well, Professor, then might it be possible Or would there be any difference, delineation between time travel, as we have discussed it, and the possibility of either communicating with or moving to one of these alternative universes?
No, I mean, this is something that people... There's a guy called David Deutsch at the University of Oxford who looks at these kinds of possibilities.
And if you could travel, if you like, sideways in time, then you could move into these other universes
and you could experience them and perhaps come back or send communications back and get information.
And there's a practical thing, which sounds like the weirdest science fiction,
but people are taking very seriously.
It's a kind of computer which would exist in more than one reality at the same time
because of quantum processes going on inside it.
A quantum computer. A quantum computer, which would, you build one processor in effect
and you get a vast number, I mean, in principle, an infinite number of processors.
Because the computers in all the parallel universes would be working on the same problem that you set your computer.
So they'd solve it very, very quickly and you'd get the answer.
And this is, I assure you, this is being taken seriously by people who understand the mathematics and the quantum physics much better than I do.
How much farther do you suppose our technological ability will have to go to begin experimenting with something like a quantum computer?
Well, it's already happening in a very, very limited way.
Really?
We're used to thinking of, you know, your home PC will have, you know, megabytes of memory in it, and people are doing experiments at the level of a few bits, not bytes, you know, four bits or so.
They're doing experiments to see if they can make this sort of thing work.
And there are people I talk to who say that it could, within 20 years, they could have something working if the equations are correct.
And of course, you don't need very many bits if you're going to have an infinite number of copies in an infinite number of parallel worlds.
So that's all you need, and they are working on it now.
Just wait till our Bill Gates gets hold of that.
At that time, when a quantum computer became possible, would it be possible to have communication with these alternate universes?
Well, that's the big question that nobody's yet been able to answer.
I mean, I think it's something that will only be answered by doing the experiment and finding out.
Because the rules of quantum physics seem to say that you can't communicate from one to the other, that you know they exist.
You'd know they existed because the computer would be able to solve the problems and it would act As if it was a much more powerful computer, but that you can't actually transfer information.
It's related to the famous uncertainty principle, which says that there's a limit to what knowledge you can have about the position of a particle and things like that.
But people are always looking for ways around these rules, and who knows, it might be possible.
If it were possible to travel to one of these alternate universes, would we arrive at a place, perhaps for the most part, Pretty much, you would imagine, similar to the one we're in now, except perhaps where events have unfolded in a different way.
For example, Germany would have won World War II, and we'd all be under Hitler's boot.
Those are possibilities, yes.
I mean, the kind of feeling that people have is that it would be easiest to travel to similar places, if it's possible at all, and that similar places where there have been very small changes.
Maybe not even as extreme as the ones you're talking about.
You know, you'd do the experiment and travel and you might find it very hard to tell the difference.
You know, the difference might be, you know, that a different team had won some football competition, you know, and that was the only difference in the whole world.
So it might be hard to tell whether your experiment had succeeded or not with limited abilities of this kind.
But what you'd expect is that there'd be a whole array of other worlds, if you like, Getting more and more different the further you went, and the harder it was to get to them.
What about the possibility, Professor, that the laws of physics, as we know them in our world, would be not quite the laws of physics in the alternative universe you plop down into?
Yeah, that's a dangerous line of questioning, because if the laws of physics are different, then the whole basis of your, whatever you call it, your sideways time machine, might not work.
So you might have designed something that works and have laws of physics and you'd get into another world
and it didn't work anymore.
Nobody would believe you'd come from another world because your machine didn't work.
I'm not sure about that.
There's another way of looking at all this business about the laws of physics
and whether they could be different in some sense in other parts of the universe or in other universes.
But I don't know of anybody who's seriously trying to deal with this kind of quantum effect
and suggest that there are different laws in the world next door.
But to imagine, for example, you're plopped over there on the other side and you've got a machine.
Imagine it like an automobile.
You get over on the other side, you turn the key, and you don't even hear the starter grinding or the internal combustion engine even beginning to work because internal combustion doesn't work.
That's right, yeah.
All these things, this is a whole other area that fascinates me, is why the laws of physics are the way they are, and there seem to be many, if you like, coincidences in the laws of physics that allow life to exist in the universe, which is obviously the most important thing to us.
And if there were small differences in things like the laws of which electricity and magnetism operate, the strength of electricity and magnetism, compared to things like gravity, then the world would be a very, very different place, and you wouldn't have The kind of chemical reactions that go on, you wouldn't have had the kind of nuclear reactions inside stars that made the elements that we're made of, and all of that.
And so there is a very important question in science as to why the universe should have exactly the laws it does have.
And I suppose from the purely sort of scientific theoretical point of view, one of the main reasons for doing an experiment to communicate with the world next door in this quantum sense will be to find out if it was possible the different rules to exist and to produce intelligent
life or perhaps you would uh... plop down in an alternative universe
and you would land in one in which uh...
a human life uh...
never evolved yeah well you might
you might land in one where where uh... our form of life is impossible and so you
drop dead you know i mean it could be as drastic as that So, if somebody were to develop such an ability to transfer, how would we ever know if it worked?
Well, that's a very, very big question.
You only know if it works, if you get something back.
I mean, if somebody, you know, it's like HG Wells.
I mean, H.G. Wells' story, The Time Machine, the character in there builds what he says
is a time machine, and the story is told from the point of view of his guests, although
obviously his first person story is there.
And at the end of the story, he just disappears.
Now, you know, the story is telling us that he's built a time machine and he's disappeared
into the distant future, but we don't know.
You know, people disappear.
We don't know where they've gone.
You've got to come back.
That's the key to the whole thing.
All right, Professor.
Top of the hour.
I know we've only got you for 30 more minutes.
You've got a big day tomorrow, so stay right where you are.
We'll be right back.
I'm Art Bell.
The trip back in time continues with Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM.
More, somewhere in time, coming up.
He's the name of his latest flame.
He talked and talked, and I heard him say that she had the longest blackest hair, the prettiest...
She doesn't give you time for questions.
As she locks up your arms And you follow to your sense
Of which direction completely disappears On the blue tiled walls
Near the market stalls There's a hidden door she leads you to
These days she says I feel my life Just like a river running through
The air of the castle You're my life
You're listening to Art Bell Somewhere In Time Tonight, featuring Coast to Coast AM, from August 22nd, 2001.
Good Lord, I just got a call from Keith Rowland.
There's another crop circle in England.
We just got the photograph near W-H-E-R-W-E-L-L, Hampshire.
Folks, take a look on my website.
We just got it up there about ten minutes ago, and it's a face.
Let me repeat, this crop circle is a face in Hampshire.
and uh...
if you look carefully it'll be obvious to you that it's definitely not a human
face this just in
I'm not kidding you.
We've got a picture on my website right now, along with everything else.
It's not a human face.
It's a gigantic, precise crop circle in Hampshire.
But it is a face.
Professor John Griffin will be right back.
I'm Art Bell.
This is Coast to Coast AM with breaking news.
Stay right there.
You're listening to Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM, from August 22, 2001.
Stay right there.
Coming to us all the way from Great Britain is Professor John Gribben, and one of the books he wrote is called In Search of the Big Bang!
And I want to take a moment and ask the professor, I've talked to so many people about this and I have yet to be able to grasp the concept, professor, that something apparently smaller than a quark, something we can just barely imagine the size of, became everything that is.
All the stars, all the planets, all the space, all the dark matter, all the whatever it is that's out there, everything we can see and walk and touch and feel, was created in an instant just
like that from nothing and I know that's kind of where most physicists sort of
throw up their hands and say
we don't know do you know yet?
well we don't know in the sense that we have a definite answer to
exactly what happened but the it's one of those examples of progress being made
When I was a student in the 60s, we were told you shouldn't even try to think about this kind of thing because it's beyond science.
And now, nearly 40 years later, it's part of science in that people do try to think about it, and they come up with ideas and models and theories about What could have caused that beginning of our universe?
Really?
Okay, well I'd just love to hear some of the leading contenders.
Okay, well the one is that it literally is something from nothing at all and that you had this nothing in a very complete sense in which a little pinprick of energy containing all the mass and energy of the universe appeared and that's possible because there's a very strange feature about gravity which is that gravity actually has negative energy In the proper scientific sense.
So if you add up all the gravity in the universe, of all the things pulling on each other, that gives you a negative energy which exactly balances out the mass energy, the E equals mc squared that Einstein talked about, of all the particles and stars and planets and people and so on.
So it is possible, I mean virtually certain, that the total energy of the universe is zero.
So it's not a question of getting something from nothing, it's getting nothing from nothing.
Okay?
So that, I mean, that's something that I go into in the book, but it's hard to explain.
Yeah, that one will make your head hurt a little bit.
But that's good.
There's nothing in the universe at all.
The one that's very popular now is the idea that there is some kind of an infinite sea, if you like, beyond our bubble, our expanding bubble universe, that there is a bigger eternal Cosmos, people sometimes say, just to have a different word, in which different bubbles go off at different places and different times.
Bubbles of nothing?
Of energy, which turns into matter and so on.
And that removes the problem of the beginning by saying there never was one, that the cosmos, to use that word, has always existed.
That's very appropriate.
I mean, you mentioned at the top of the program that I work with Fred Hoyle.
I don't know if people know that he died a couple of days ago.
And this is one of his ideas, the idea of an eternal, expanding, infinite universe within which what we call the Big Bang was just a local event.
So there are real possibilities that people investigate and probe, but of course we'll never, unless we build that time machine, we'll never be able to go to the Big Bang and see for sure which idea is correct.
Professor, again, I'm unable to grasp the concept that it has always been here.
Now, if it's always been here, we sort of understand, I think we understand, don't we, by measuring quasars, how quickly everything is moving away from everything else by now.
Uh, if it's always been here, we should have long ago had nothing but black space about us, shouldn't we?
No, what we're saying is that there's a something that's always been here, but that our Big Bang is a bubble within that something.
It's like if you have a bottle of fizzy drink, you know, and you unscrew the top, and suddenly all the bubbles appear.
I mean, it's in a sense, you know, the fizzy drink has been there forever.
I mean, as long as it's been standing in your fridge anyway.
And then the bubble appears, and that's the Big Bang.
That's our universe appearing.
Within the something that's always been there.
So then maybe we are nothing but a bubble inside a glass?
Well, who knows?
Then you are talking beyond physics.
But that's where we get back to these ideas you mentioned earlier about different laws of physics.
Because if you've got a literally infinite universe in both time and space with no beginning and no end, then within that there are all possible bubble universe is going off and there
will be other universes with different laws of physics and then you that's one answer to this
question about why our universe should seem to be just right for life
and the idea is that there'll be many universes with different laws of physics
and the only ones in which there's going to be people like us
wondering about it are the ones where the laws are just right for people like
us. So it's then much less of a coincidence if you've got a choice of universes
that we should exist in one that's a good one for life.
Okay, but if there are literally, to us at least, an infinite number of these universes, as there appear to be almost an infinite number of stars, suns in the night sky, that have planets no doubt revolving around them, we're proving more and more.
Then, whether we're talking about jumping across to another bubble, or we're talking about going to some star system far away, is it not almost inevitable that in both of these there would be, life would be common, even if it was scarce, it would It would, in essence, be common.
Yeah, I know exactly what you mean.
If you've got, what, in our galaxy there are a couple of hundred billion stars, and there are at least a couple of hundred billion galaxies, and if only 1% of them, you know, which is scarce, have got life, then there's a lot of life by human standards.
Absolutely.
I think that's very much my view.
And I've written about that in my book, Stardust, which I think we talked about a year ago.
I was on the program when it came out originally.
And the materials for life are very common in our galaxy, the raw materials in space, the complex chemicals that are the precursors to life.
And I think it's very, very likely that life is common in the universe.
But the big question is whether intelligent life is common.
And that's much harder to see because there do seem to have been a lot of a chain of events,
a long chain of events which led to us emerging as intelligent life.
And we've been around for, by the most generous estimate, a million years of intelligence
on Earth. And the life on Earth goes back nearly four billion years.
So if it takes all those billions of years of non-intelligent life before you've got
intelligent life, then intelligence might be very rare indeed, even if life is common.
How probable is the hypothesis that there is no other intelligent life out there?
People, rare year...
People rarely talk about that probability, but along with everything else, it's got to have some probability, right?
Yeah, absolutely.
And I think the simple answer is that the numbers we're talking about are so huge that even if the probability is very small, that adds up to a certainty that there is Well, if you believe, Professor, as you do, then would you say that your work supports SETI's continuing search for extraterrestrial intelligence, whether it be by radio, near the hydrogen frequency, or with the new light experiments?
Very much so.
The really exciting thing about the discoveries of planets that you've mentioned is that there are so many.
I mean, every time the technology improves, We find more planets, and the latest ones, the discoveries that have been coming in in the past couple of months or so, are planetary systems that are much more like our solar system.
The first ones that were discovered had big planets, bigger than Jupiter, close to the stars, close to their parents' suns, which are very different from our solar system, but they're the ones that were easy to find.
The techniques have improved, and we're now finding planets about the same size as Jupiter, orbiting about the same distance from their suns, But Jupiter orbits our Sun and in more or less circular orbits and that suggests that we've got planetary systems very much like our own with big planets far out and almost certainly small planets close in and I think the whole SETI program has received a huge boost from this and it's probably the most cost effective science you can imagine doing because it's only got to work once.
You know, and it just transforms everything about human society.
Is it not, Professor, almost inevitable, we've got a little time delay between here and England, almost inevitable that, obviously we're seeing the big ones, because as our technology improves, we see the big ones first.
Absolutely.
Planets are hard to find, but is it not almost inevitably probable I'm not sure that phrase works.
Inevitably probable.
But certainly probable that there are smaller planets, ones very nearly the size of ours, and again, inevitably, at about a point from whatever sun they might be near, that would support conditions and climates similar to that which we have here on Earth.
Yes, I agree entirely.
And there's a very exciting proposal, which is very likely to get funded, I think, for a telescope to be put in space, which would be able to detect other Earths out to quite a reasonable distance.
So we may actually, within 20, 30 years, I mean, well within a human lifetime, we may actually be able to have images of these other planets the size of the Earth orbiting nearby stars.
And if you can do that, then it's a very simple trick using spectroscopy, you know, different colors of light from different elements and so on.
It's a very simple trick to see if those planets have got carbon dioxide,
water, vapor, oxygen in their atmospheres, which would be signs that there is life there.
So we could know in a very short time if there are planets with life elsewhere in the universe.
And from that, obviously, then the next step is to look for intelligence.
Have you considered the impact on our world of contact?
Well, I personally, I sort of shy away from it.
It's rather like the way I shied away from getting involved in the politics of global warming and climate change.
It needs experts to worry about this.
But there are experts, as I mentioned, psychologists, sociologists, there are people who do seriously consider these problems and what the effect would be whether, if a contact is made, It should be announced to the public straight away, or somehow people should be prepared for it.
If, Professor, you were the one to, perhaps with others, make this discovery, you would have thrust upon you the responsibility of deciding what to do with that information.
What would you do?
My instinct would be to tell the world at once, because I've got great faith in human nature, and I think that, although it's correct for people to worry about the problems, I think that people would rise to the occasion and it would be an uplifting experience for everybody to know that we're not alone in the same way that the pictures that came back from the Apollo missions showed us the Earth as a little oasis in space and that was a profound experience which was basically beneficial to humankind.
I think knowing we're not alone would be equally beneficial.
I guess it would depend.
If what we found was a hundred light years away, I think people could handle that news.
If what we found was, for example, much closer, let's say we detected a spacecraft on the way, or something like that, that would be a bit of a different sort of thing to break to the public, wouldn't it?
Sure.
No, I was thinking in terms of making contact with life on the planet orbiting another star, not somebody sort of knocking on the back door of the solar system.
I think in that case, I would gladly hand over the responsibility to the government or the United Nations or whatever the appropriate body was to decide what to do next.
And you'd be comfortable that as you handed it over to the government or the UN, they'd handle it just fine?
I think so.
I mean, maybe I'm a naive optimist, but as I said, I've got pretty good faith in human nature and I think that these You do.
The bodies are run by people who are, to put it at its worst, well-meaning.
They're not going to go out there and try and do something evil and unpleasant with the information.
Well, there are many people who believe that these UFOs that are seen, these strange craft, that we believe, that our military roundly denies, and I suppose yours does too, because we do most stuff in lockstep, That really, we are being visited and we've done some rather nasty things.
Frankly, some people believe shot at these things, which wouldn't seem like the brilliant thing to do, would it?
No, it wouldn't.
Something like that could happen by accident.
I can imagine that an individual pilot of a fighter or something might get carried away and do such a thing.
But I don't think anybody is going to do that on purpose at the level that we're talking about.
And I think, you know, for good or bad, whether you think it's a good thing that we spend so much money on the military that we do, that we do have very efficient military systems with very efficient command structures.
And I think the kind of people who are trained to fly the kind of high performance aircraft that would be involved in such encounters are disciplined enough to obey orders and to not Shoot at people if it's likely to do more harm than good.
And I think that we have nothing to worry about in that sense.
I don't believe there has been a contact.
Well, since you now have an opportunity to address those who would make that decision, should it occur, I wonder how you would advise them.
For example, by that I mean, wouldn't it seem likely that anybody or group of people who got here Would have achieved interstellar travel, and so they would have technology, certainly in our lifetime anyway, that would so eclipse ours that if we did shoot at them, and they were to shoot back, we would really hate what happened.
I'm sure that's true, but I think anybody who's got to the effort of making the travel, the distance across space and stars, is going to not be trigger happy.
They will have Encountered what they would regard as primitive civilizations before.
They'll know how to set about these things and they won't be making that kind of mistake.
It doesn't make sense to imagine that people are going to come here, beings are going to come here, bent on conquest.
The distances involved are too great.
The effort of traveling across space is too great.
What we would get would be some kind of scientific mission that would be interested in information And making contact and exchanging cultural ideas.
Or perhaps only observation.
Or indeed.
I mean, that's the most plausible case, I think.
The people who argue that we may have been visited or are being visited by other beings who merely want to observe us and are perhaps waiting for us to, in a sense, grow up, you know, and stop being so trigger-happy ourselves before they're willing to make contact.
I think that's the strongest case.
Uh, of all the people who do believe that we have had, have been visited already.
And then, uh, that would then be the strongest case for the ufologists who say, look, uh, yes, one has not landed on the White House lawn, and it's not likely to because we are being observed.
So on occasion, When we really do see craft that cannot be explained, and certainly we know that a certain percentage of these sightings absolutely cannot be explained, that it's observation.
That's a pretty strong argument for their case, isn't it?
It's a very good case, yes.
I mean, I don't go along with it myself.
I lean towards the view that these events probably could be explained if we had a little more knowledge than we have.
After all, we've only been scientific society for Couple of hundred years and there's a long way to go yet before we understand all the natural phenomena in the universe.
But I do agree it's a very good case and I wouldn't be overwhelmingly surprised to be proved wrong on that point.
Would you be overwhelmingly surprised that contact would occur during your lifetime?
In one way or the other, whether it be communication or physical contact?
Well, we live in a very interesting time, because we've just started to broadcast to the universe.
For about 50 years, we've been making TV spread out into the universe.
So, in that sense, it would not be surprising.
I mean, I'm lucky to be alive at the time when that's happening, but in terms of human civilization and technology, now is exactly the time when you would expect to be visited, if there are beings out there monitoring the Earth.
Because they've had 50 years to notice that we've reached the level of technology to produce signals that can travel through space.
Professor, we are at the end of our time.
You promised an hour.
Actually, I dragged you out to an hour and a half.
Yes, I have to get into work.
All right.
We've got to do it again.
Professor, we've got to... It'll be a pleasure.
All right.
We'll be calling you.
Thank you, Professor, and good night.
Good night.
There's a face in a crop circle on my website tonight.
As of about an hour ago, we got it up there.
If this isn't a face, I'll eat that crop circle.
And I'm Art Bell, and this, of course, is Coast to Coast AM.
Top o' the morning to you.
You're listening to Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from August 22nd, 2001.
I can't survive, I can't stay alive without your love.
I can't stay alive without your love Oh baby, don't leave me this way
Oh baby, don't leave me this way, no.
I can't exist, I'll surely miss your tender kiss Don't leave me this way
I can't exist, I'll surely miss your tender kiss.
Don't leave me this way.
Oh baby, my heart is full of love at this high for you Now come down and
She's my soul and she knows I'd love to love her But she lets me down every time, can't make her mine
She's no one's lover tonight, with me she'll be so inviting I want her all for myself, oh, temptation eyes
Looking through my, my, my soul Temptation eyes
You gotta love me, gotta love me tonight Gotta love me baby, yeah
Oh well, I guess this is just a game And this is a really holy crap kind of night, I'm not kidding you.
the tonight
from august twenty second this is a really a public
kind of night i'm not kidding with all we've had already
with the uh... the wilshire crop circle the four hundred nine circles circle
which will make your head hurt if you look at it for a long and now what's
come about an hour ago this came from the crop circle
and this will be a little just plain blow your mind that's all i can tell you
Go to my website, Artbell.com, under What's New, You will see Keith has added in the last hour or so, yet another reported crop formation.
And I'm telling you folks, this one near Warewell, Hampshire, it's a face.
It's a face.
Just scroll down a little bit, put it on your screen, move away from the monitor a little bit, and it's obvious it's a face.
I mean, it's obvious it's a face.
It's symmetrical.
Eyes, nose, mouth, and Maybe even a tongue.
I don't know what that is down there.
God knows what that is.
Anyway, it's a face.
And so if you get back from your monitor, it's a face.
It's a face even close up, frankly.
And as you look at it, you go, that's not human.
That's not a human.
Or if it is, it's not what I want to be.
Alright, stay right there.
Their open lines are ahead.
Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM.
from August 22nd, 2001.
You know there are many things that I could bring to the table that I really
ought to hold for I guess, you know, other shows because what's happening
tonight is so unbelievable.
These crop circles are... The first one we had was inexplicable and brain-torturing to even look at.
Obviously, humans didn't do it.
This second one is going to put chills down your spine.
I really mean it, folks.
It's about an hour and a half old now, in terms of our receiving it.
It came from the crop circle connector.
It's on my website right now.
It's a face.
It's obviously a face.
And it's not human.
That's all I can say.
It's not human.
Listen, tomorrow night is going to be very interesting.
I have never interviewed a bishop.
And we are going to interview a bishop tomorrow night.
The Right Reverend Sean Manchester.
And he is a bishop in the Old Catholic Church.
He'll come to us tomorrow night from Britain, and this man is a little different, folks.
A bishop, mind you, is a member of all kinds of prestigious organizations in Great Britain, and he's an exorcist.
That's right, he's an exorcist.
Even more, he is, brace yourself, a vampire hunter.
I repeat, a vampire hunter.
And now really brace yourself, he claims, this bishop claims, that he has killed, I repeat, killed a vampire.
That's tomorrow night.
In the second hour.
But tonight, you know, I don't see any point in opening up any other topics.
If there's a topic hotter than this right now, I sure as hell don't know what it is.
We've got a crop circle just now appearing in England that is a face.
It's on my website at artbell.com.
Let's see what's on mine out there, shall we?
Open lines.
First time caller line, you're on the air.
Hello.
Hey Art, how you doing?
I'm doing okay, sir.
Where are you?
Right now, I'm driving through Lincoln, Nebraska.
Lincoln, Nebraska.
Yes, I am.
Alright, what's up?
I love your show.
I listen to it every night.
I just want to know, I don't know when I'm going to be able to get to a computer, but how long are you going to have that posted on your website?
My dear sir, if this is what I think it is, we'll leave it up there, if necessary, until hell freezes over.
Ha ha, that sounds good, because I certainly want to get a look at it.
You know, like I say, it just takes me a while to get to a computer, but I certainly appreciate the answer, and like I say, I enjoy your show.
All right, sir.
I assure you it'll be there, if it's what I think it is now.
I don't know.
I don't know if it is or not, but it sure looks like it to me.
I mean, no, that's a face, and it's not a human face.
It's about an hour and a half old, and, uh, you know, crawl, make your way to a computer somehow.
Artbell.com, breaking news on a early Thursday morning.
Wildcard Line, you're on the air, hello.
Hi, how are you doing?
I'm doing okay, sir, how are you?
Pretty good, I'm calling from Boulder, Colorado.
Yes, sir.
I have two comments to make, one on the crop circle first, and then I want to say something about the ghost video.
I'm sure you remember Philip H. Crapp's book, The Contact Has Begun?
Of course.
In his book he describes, well first of all, what he describes as the aliens, there's a really close resemblance to what we're seeing in that crop circle, and also he said that when the verdants, he calls them, are gonna start making it known that they're out there,
they're gonna start doing these things, big things, big impressive things.
This could just be the beginning of it, these huge epic crop circles and then this picture
of them.
It just could be one of the first steps in there.
Let me stop you.
Have you seen these new crop circles yet?
Yeah, I just took a look at them.
Let me call your attention to the second one.
Is there any way in your estimation that that is not a face?
Oh yeah, absolutely.
It's a face?
Absolutely.
And I'm just saying, it looks kind of like what Philip Craft describes as what the verdants look like.
So, in other words, as a matter of fact, you're right, it is.
So, getting a face like this, if you believe this line of reasoning, would be almost an immediate precursor to some kind of contact.
Right, right.
And he said, you know, he said it would happen slowly, it would start out little things, then get bigger and bigger and bigger.
Yeah, but this is a, if this is real, it's a quantum leap.
Oh, for sure, for sure.
All right.
Can I say something about the ghost video?
Oh, the ghost video, yes.
Go right ahead.
You know, I definitely believe in ghosts and this sort of thing, but I'm sorry to say, I think this one is definitely a fake.
You'll notice that the ghost figure, as it comes into focus and out of focus, all the rest of the little pieces of dirt on the windshield, they come into focus, too.
It stays in the exact same place in relationship to those dots as it moves across the road.
Uh-huh.
Yes, I've heard that from others, but it sure does look like a sort of pseudo-human figure, doesn't it?
True, true.
It seems to change... The thing that impressed me was it seems to change density.
In other words, it's almost translucent, but then at other times it's almost a solid.
But that's what I think is just...
and effectively of the camera going in on focus you that you think so that's
exactly what happens to to the other dot from when she'll be like little
spectator to whatever so it's a kind of a kind of new density and so it might be
a human like smudge on a windshield after i think it is that the right
thank you very much there's going to be a raging argument about that one
believe me does
here should be a human
and it does appear to move from you know i i i i let me put it this way
If you were sitting in the car, it appears this thing comes out of the foliage on the right and crosses the road.
It appears to float across the road and then come to the edge of and or disappear into foliage on the other side.
But the thing that got me is It appears to change density as well.
He explains that as a matter of focus of the camera.
You never know.
East of the Rockies, you are on the air.
Good morning.
Hey Art, how are you doing?
This is Judge Calcon from New York City, listening to you on WABC 77.
Yes sir, and I've got a couple of comments on The Ghost as well as The Face, and you haven't mentioned Mars Face yet, but we'll get into that in a second.
Okay.
With The Ghost video, the gentleman before is spot on.
I am a freelance photographer as well as videographer, and I also do digital video editing.
And if you'll notice, in this clip, the clip duration is 10 seconds, 24 frames long.
Right.
And if you have a pen, you can jot this down.
At frame 26 is when the smudge on the window, which looks like just a bug spatter, if you ask me, comes into direct clear focus, and it stays focused until 1 second and 9 frames, and then goes back out of focus until 8 seconds, 3 frames.
You're what we call a pixel person, by the way.
eight seconds fifteen friends it doesn't have a couple of actually the four times
and you get yourself a quick time player from other and i'd play a right still
friend you can see it and you're what we call pixel person by the way but that's
a right three then that the reason it appears to be cropping the road is
if you'll notice the camera stays fairly stationary but it's pan
slightly to the left as the road is going up a curved so
the natural single spot which is staying still on the windshield
appears to cross because the car Yes, might I pose a question?
Certainly.
Since you thought that it looks like a bug spatter, I believe you said, how were you able to understand what it was that we're all talking about?
What do you mean?
If it didn't look like anything more than a bug spider to you?
Well, because the way that cameras use the autofocus is they use sort of either sonar or infrared.
No, no, no, no, sir.
No, what I'm saying is, if you didn't recognize it when you saw this video yourself as the object of interest versus the other ones, your mind must have said to you, gee, that looks... Oh, absolutely, yeah.
It looks freaky, but being with the professional background that I have, I immediately...
I picked up that it was a fluctuation of the autofocus.
Okay.
I appreciate the call.
There will be, believe me, much debate about this.
Much debate about this.
It's pretty freaky, all right.
On my international line, you are on the air, top of the day to you.
Where are you, please?
Australia.
Australia.
Yes, sir.
Welcome to the program.
I just had a question about the big flip that the guy found in Michigan.
Oh yes, well that absolutely has not panned out in order to answer your question bluntly and that of others who didn't hear the follow-up to that which we did have a couple of weeks ago.
It simply hasn't panned out.
Linda Moulton Howe, I will tell you straight up, was one of the people in contact with this man and we got all kinds of excuses and hemming and hawing and everything else And we just don't... Either one of two things is true, sir.
Either, after the broadcast, the man changed his mind, or he was full of it all the time.
We're not sure which.
Could be either one, I suppose.
But he had no trace of the samples or anything?
None that he's been willing to turn over.
I mean, he claimed... Obviously, he claimed he had hair, you'll recall, and blood.
He's either unwilling to turn them over, or doesn't really have them.
You can imagine either, I suppose.
That's too bad.
Well, thanks for your time.
Hope you're feeling better.
All right.
Thank you very much.
Take care.
West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
Good morning.
Good morning.
Yes, sir.
Good morning.
Where are you?
I'm over here in Corona.
I'm listening to CanX.
OK.
Well, if you're listening to CanX, that's not our affiliate there.
That's a news station.
You're listening to KFI, sir.
Oh, I'm sorry.
KFI.
I'm a little nervous.
First time I ever got to talk to you.
That's quite alright.
Thank you.
you know i'm glad you're better i'll thank you if upper left keep down the
booth on and concerning the the crop circle
i think it is it's a bit part of the game where it was there
you know what people know slowly but surely uh... the sensitizing
uh... there are a lot of that that they're coming
Getting people used to the idea.
Have you seen the new one?
Yes, I have.
Have you now?
Alright, then let me ask you too, sir.
Is there any way in your mind that that is not a face?
Very much so.
so and have a very much like that you know what i think that you think is that
a human do you believe it's a human face well i think
somewhat I think that might be universal.
Wait a minute.
That's like being a little bit pregnant.
There's no somewhat.
In the sense that there are eyes and a nose and a mouth and then some god-awful thing.
By the way, do you get a look at that?
Does that look like a tongue to you or a horn?
Or maybe an extraterrestrial goatee?
That would be interesting.
But I don't think the grains are hairless.
All right, but somewhat human is, I guess, all right.
Are you saying then that it's somewhat human, but not fully human?
No, but I think it's the way of getting people used to their arrival, the watchers.
I believe they're going to soon reveal themselves to everybody, and getting everybody used to the idea of this for the past Well, there's no way this is not some incredible quantum leap in all of this, if that's true.
I mean, it's saying, in effect, okay, here's what we look like.
Yeah.
This is like, you know, like the last chapter.
You know, a little bit at a time now, this, and then there's going to be something even more magnificent after this.
Like what?
Who knows?
I mean, what is going to outdo a face?
I'm not sure.
A face in the sky?
You mean a sort of an identical projection in the sky for the entire world to see?
Yeah.
That would be interesting.
That would outdo it.
And another thing, Art.
Yes?
I think it all ties in with the Great Pyramid and Stonehenge and Atlantis.
I think they're all little pieces of the puzzle.
Well, then the situation for mankind is about to change.
Yes.
I appreciate your call, sir.
Thank you.
First on caller line, you're on the air.
Good morning.
Yes.
Is this our bell?
It is indeed.
Alright, I have a story to tell you.
My name is Daniel and I'm in Santa Barbara.
I can't believe I got through.
You did, Daniel.
Anyway, it's a ghost story.
I work in a hospital and I work the midnight shift from 11 to 7 in the morning.
Is this a recent ghost story?
It is one that happened in 1995.
That's pretty recent.
Alright, what the heck.
Go ahead.
But anyway, it was about 2.30 in the morning.
And it was in November, and I had just first arrived at the hospital in September.
And anyway, I was working on the air conditioning on the fourth floor.
It's kind of a floor that at that time wasn't used at all.
And if you've ever went up to this floor, you'd never really get a good feeling.
You can imagine a long hallway, sort of decrepit, the walls not exactly painted well.
And of course, I came out of the mechanical room, and I was going to go back down to the third floor, which was Third nursing and tell them that, you know, I'd ask them if the temperature was right.
Well, anyway, I tried to get through these double doors on the opposite side of the hallway thinking before I go in the elevator or take a stairwell down, I'll, you know, try to check the opposite mechanical room.
Well, I turned the key and I absolutely could see the lock open.
I'm nervous, so you have to understand.
And yet the door wouldn't open.
I couldn't pull it or push it.
That's kind of strange.
So I went in the priest's office and the priest's office was To my right.
And I thought, well, gee, in these old hospitals they have vault doors and walkways and so forth.
Well, I couldn't find it in there.
So anyway, I opened the elevator and I decided to go downstairs.
And standing in the far corner of the elevator was a man that looked like a priest.
And he was looking into the steel corner toward the direction I came from, which would have been maybe about 100 feet away.
Yes.
I didn't think anything of it at the time, but he looked like he was so surprised I opened the door.
Gee, I guess there was somebody up here.
So I walked into the elevator and the door closed.
I wasn't really looking at his face.
I was kind of looking at his belt and his clothes.
I asked him if he was administering to anyone up in the hospital.
What came out of his voice was a hiss, just like a snake.
I thought, gee.
Then I looked up into his eyes and here he was.
He had his head shaved and his hair and so forth.
Yeah, he had no eyes, and they were black, just as black as you could ever imagine.
No eyes?
Nothing.
Just black holes?
Black holes.
And I looked for a little longer, and I thought, there's got to be some iris or white.
There was nothing, but there was like a shiny covering to his eye.
And then I kind of noticed his lines on his face, and he looked like he was maybe about 52 to 56 years old.
Yes.
And the skin color was a little off, you know?
I was thinking, Jesus, you know?
Off?
What do you mean off?
Well, if you can imagine a little gray with some red in it.
I can imagine it.
I wasn't sure that this was a ghost or what.
I've never seen one.
So I looked up at the numbers on the elevator and he kind of moved over.
Toward the controls on the opposite side of me and I was standing now mind you I'm one foot away from it
We only got about 30 seconds. Okay. Anyway, I Look back into his eyes
He wasn't There was absolutely no eyes. I said something humorous
because I was nervous. I didn't want to let on and Then he smiled in the bottom half of his jaw virtually dishing
it sort of Oh my...
Oh no.
Oh, no eyes were telling me to get the hell out of there immediately and yet the bottom half of his jaw
Smiled in relation to what I was saying so this thing was thinking it was a real entity of some sort
And I can't tell you but sir. We've got to go, okay I appreciate your call. I think that's it. Yes. Thank you
and good night You're listening to art bells somewhere in time tonight
you're listening to art bill somewhere in time tonight featuring coast to coast
featuring coast to coast am from August 22nd 2001
and from august twenty second two thousand one i'd like to know
And what's wrong with that I'd like to know Cuz here I go
the the
Oh Yeah
Oh Oh
Oh appreciate your call i think that yes thank you and uh...
the It happened to me, and it can happen to you
No!
No!
You're here right on top of the world In heaven, suddenly you just had a blast
I saw my three years When I walked away from my heart
And when you lose a precious love You need to guide you up
Something happens inside you The heavenly power
Now I see light Oh, I believe
It's not a dream It's not a bliss
It happens to me I look out of my window
And then it happens And then it happens
Somewhere in Time with Art Bell continues Courtesy of Premier Networks
Let me give a specific instructions because I want some overseas calls right now.
So here's the deal.
You go to my website artbell.com where you can see all of these things that I've been talking about.
Everybody's talking about tonight.
And then you go to Interact.
You go, just click on Interact and call in phone numbers.
All right?
Call in phone numbers will take you to a list, an international list, if you just scroll down.
And no matter where you are in the world, it's got a list of countries there.
I think everything but France.
Yeah, France is still not there.
Come on, folks, get France in there.
So if you're in Germany, it gives you the code.
You dial that code, and then you dial the number.
So just check it.
Whatever country you're in, we'd love to hear from you.
It's a toll-free call.
That's not emphasized enough.
Toll-free.
We pay for the call on this end.
So you dial the code and then you just dial 800-893-0903.
I mean, we know there are people out there worldwide in Asia and Europe and South America.
We know, are listening.
So, pick up the phone.
It's a good morning to do it, as a matter of fact.
Get off your duff and give us a call.
Go get that code if you have to.
Or, alternately, you can try calling the AT&T operator.
You know, call your operator and ask for the AT&T operator.
And then have her call the international number.
800-893-0903.
And for you, wherever you are in the world, Quite a gift.
It'll be absolutely toll free.
Let's hear from you.
Somewhere in time with Art Bell continues courtesy of Premier Networks.
Alright here we go and to the international line.
You are on the air.
Where are you calling from, please?
Mexico.
Mexico?
Really?
What part?
Morelia.
Oh, where is that in Mexico?
In between Guadalajara and Mexico City.
Wow.
Way down.
All right, welcome to the program.
Glad to have you.
I just wanted to comment about the crop circle.
Yes, sir.
And the resemblance to the phase on Mars.
Pretty eerie, isn't it?
Yeah, it is kind of strange, but I've always been a believer that possibly Cydonia and the face on Mars are remnants of an ancient colonization by Atlantean space travelers, and possibly maybe they're upon return, and maybe they're signifying that they're coming back.
What do you think Richard Hoagland's going to do when he sees this?
I think he's going to freak.
I think he's going to freak, too.
I think I about freaked out when I saw that.
Oh, you did?
It hits you right between the eyes, doesn't it?
It definitely does.
Makes you think.
What are you doing down there, anyway?
I'm studying language and philosophy.
Well, boy, that's the way to do it, isn't it?
You get down to where the ability to speak English fades a little bit, and you either speak the language or die.
Yeah.
Practice, sir.
Thank you.
Thank you very much.
Oh, wait, wait.
One more thing.
Go ahead.
What do you suppose that means?
The cross circle?
The new one with the big face?
Yes, yes.
I think it means we're probably going to be getting some visitors.
I'm not sure whether they'll be the returning Atlanteans or maybe someone from another alien civilization.
But soon somebody is going to come a knocking.
Yeah, I think so.
Thanks for your call, sir, all the way from Mexico.
Once again, let me emphasize, wherever you are in the world, it would be nice to hear from Asia and Europe.
I think we heard from Australia earlier.
It's really cool.
You hear from all over the world.
First, go to Artbell.com if you have not done so, and look at these photographs.
It would be interesting to get some reaction from around the rest of the world, wouldn't it?
There's a gentleman in Mexico.
Uh, remember that 800 number.
It's toll free for you wherever you are in the world.
I know people are afraid of that.
I'm not calling it.
It's too expensive.
It won't cost you a penny.
It costs my network a lot.
So dial 800-893-0903.
Get your country code first on my website.
Or, uh, just get ahold of the AT&T operator and speak very kindly to her and maybe she'll make the call for you.
First time caller line, you're on the air.
Hello.
Hello, Art.
Hi.
Hi, Art.
This is Stan.
Hello, Stan.
And I'm calling from Kingdom of Nye, Pahrump.
You're in Pahrump?
Yeah, I'm just down the road from you.
Oh, that's excellent.
Well, I was coming home tonight.
I work over in Las Vegas.
I drive bus over there and listening, and boy, you got my attention on this computer thing.
Yes, sir.
And I fired it up, and has anybody commented about over the right eye, it appears that it looks like it's got a couple of Uh, rings pierced in his eyebrow.
Well... That's the first thing that, uh, caught my eye.
Uh, you know, it does kind of look that way, doesn't it?
It does, doesn't it?
Yeah.
And when I walk away from the computer and look at it... I had more concern about what appears to be coming out of the mouth, but... That's what you're talking about.
Yeah.
You know, I mean, is that alien dribble, or is that a tongue?
I hope that's not a tongue.
You know, that's weird.
That is weird down there.
But you know, it's too bad that there's not something that we can see like a tractor or something down there to get an indication of how huge this thing is.
Well, I think one indication of how huge it is is the farmer's lines.
Yeah.
I mean, for example, you can look at the other crop circle with 409 circles.
Yeah.
And we know that's really big.
Here, too, we can look at the lines of plowing.
It's got to be pretty doggone big, sir.
Oh, absolutely it is.
You know, if this is college students doing this, I wish they'd channel their energy into something productive rather than bashing down this poor guy's field.
It's a good point, but I don't think, sir, it's college students.
It isn't.
The more I look at it, I have to agree with you.
It isn't.
Anyway, you know, I wanted to comment on that, but then on the way over, people were talking about ghost stories, and you didn't want to hear any more ghost stories.
Well, I love ghost stories.
So do I. Well, okay, but if you have one, hold it for me, because I'm doing a ghost to ghost.
Great.
That's what I want to do.
The other thing was remote viewing that I wanted to comment to you about.
Fire away.
I have told my wife, every night I come home I listen to you.
Thank God you're back on the radio again.
Thank you.
I hope you're feeling better.
I've had that pain before.
Anyway, I had mentioned to Jennifer that I always listen to you about this remote viewing.
She says, well, I always do that.
I says, what?
She says, yes, it's easy.
And I really didn't believe her, but yet things that she's told me in the past come true.
So I said, well, okay, honey.
She says, tomorrow when you go to work, just think about me.
So I did.
When I went to work, I thought about her, and all of a sudden the number 8 came to mind.
The number 8?
The number 8.
And I just kind of sloughed it off, and I was driving the bus up and down Las Vegas Boulevard, and that doggone number 8 came back to me again.
Yes.
So then, later on in the evening, I start to think about, well, when I get home, I kind of hope she's got that outfit on, you know.
And I didn't think anything of that, you know.
And when I got home, she was up, and unfortunately, she didn't have the outfit on.
And she says, well, and I says, okay, I'm going to write it down.
I wrote the number eight down.
And she pointed on the counter.
There was a piece of paper there, and some writing on it.
I looked at it, and it had five slash eight.
I had handed her my piece of paper, and she opened it up, and we both had a gleam in her eye.
So, definitely it does work.
I suppose you had a little stick figure with a nightie on, huh?
Goodbye, sir.
Thank you very much.
I don't know if that's remote viewing or...
uh... forceful wishful thinking uh... it's not easy remote viewing is delineated from
psychic ability abide this very specific protocols that are used with
remote viewing so a lot of times when people call
and they said i've been doing that all my life it's not exactly remote viewing
it doesn't mean they're not doing it they are doing it's a psychic ability
but that is definitely delineated or should be from specific remote viewing of the various types all based
on very tight and very serious protocols
A wild card line, you're on the air.
Hello.
Good morning, Art.
Good morning, sir.
Where are you?
I'm in Santa Rosa, California, listening to KS Aero 1350, Snowy County's news, weather, and talk station.
That's the way to do a promo.
Howdy.
Thanks.
So, yeah, I'm looking at the face now.
On the Crop Circle Connector page itself, they have a little thumbnail lower down on the page, which makes it easier to see this.
And it's just like, you know, how, you know, on the newspaper, the black and white photos, they have the half-tone kind of for the photograph.
Well, you know, first thing I ought to tell you, sir, is that a lot of people, well, not a lot, but some people are saying, this is not a crop circle at all.
It's baloney.
This is somebody's crocheting.
Well, it's not crocheting, folks.
It's a real crop circle.
Right, sir?
Oh yeah, no, absolutely.
It's clearly, you know, made out of, you know, cramped down grass or whatever.
Yeah.
It's an ingenious bit of work if it was faked.
I mean, it's incredible.
It has to be just, I don't know how anyone could translate, you know, this into something this huge.
But in the small thumbnail version, it actually looks like sort of a, and I can't think of who it is, but like some female actress.
I don't know.
It's a woman's face.
Another victim of the Rorschach test.
We're all going to think it looks like something or somebody or something like that that we know.
So, a rock singer?
A female actor?
Yeah, I think it's kind of a spooky face because her eyes are so dark.
But it's got, you know, even a shadow from the nose it looks like, you know, on the right-hand side of the nose.
As a matter of fact, if you look at the right-hand side in general, and you just wait and see if Richard Hoagland doesn't jump on this one, the face on Mars, when you look at it, the left-hand side is clear, right?
The right-hand side, at least as I have seen it, has erosion, geologic damage.
And this that we're seeing is so incredibly symmetrical, but if you look off to the right side of the nose and the right side of the eye, there would be what we could imagine to be erosion.
Couldn't it?
Well, yeah, there's a possibility, sure.
I see it as shadows in this small thumbnail, you know.
It kind of gives it, you know, what's all the dots kind of come together like, you know.
Well, it is.
It probably is shadowing, actually.
Now that I look at it, it is shadowing.
In other words, To the right of the eye and to the right of the nose, to some smaller degree, there is a darker shadow.
You'd call it a shadow, but I guess it would be... I don't know if that would be from... I don't know.
Fascinating.
Absolutely eerie, isn't it?
Oh, indeed.
Yeah, it's incredible.
Phenomenal, like I say.
I mean, I'd almost wish it was created by humans, because it's a phenomenal feat of art, really.
What's your best guess?
Would you say it's human built or otherwise?
Well, you know, it just seems like, you know, the likely natural or rather supernatural crop circles, you know, tend to have such wonderful geometric forms and just look so nice.
But this looks more down to earth.
You know, like I say, it just looks like somebody figured out a way to take a photograph and translate it into I appreciate the call, and I understand the way you feel.
This is going to scare a lot of people, and they're not going to want to imagine that this has been done by, quote, others.
They're just not going to want to believe that at all.
This is going to cause great controversy.
East of the Rockies, you are on the air.
Good morning.
Yes.
This is Rhonda from New Orleans, Louisiana.
Hey, Rhonda.
How are you?
All right.
I hope everything's going okay.
We're just down here trying to dodge hurricanes.
The reason I'm calling, it's not about the crop circles.
I had talked to you before you went on vacation and before all the trouble you had and everything.
Yes.
With your back.
But anyway, about the little boy, the picture that was on your website with the black mass on the little boy.
Oh, I must tell you, ma'am, I received an email That's what I wanted to know.
From another lady who saw that same photograph.
Okay.
And unfortunately, I've asked her to send me her phone number, but unfortunately she has had an exact duplicate of the experience the lady had, minus the ability to get the photograph.
And she had a battle of wills That she explained to me so articulately in a piece of email.
I'm going to try and get her on the air.
She won the battle and drove out the entity.
But what an amazing story it was.
Oh, that's wonderful.
Because I was worried about that little boy.
I'm still worried about that little boy.
I wish I could tell you I had an update.
I don't.
Okay.
Well, if you hear anything from the mother or anything, you know, let At least let me know.
Say something on the radio where I can at least, you know... Depend on it.
Thank you so much.
Thank you so much and take care.
And I have a feeling we're going to receive a number of other stories very much like that one.
Anybody out there get the feeling things are changing here on Earth?
Radically changing?
And that we are like the boiling frogs Some of us feel it, some of us know it, but most of us just get warmer and don't notice.
Rust of the Rockies, you're on the air.
Hi Art.
Hello.
I'm really glad you're back on the air.
Thank you.
Where are you?
I am in, my name's Tammy.
Tammy.
And I'm in Bellingham, Washington tonight.
Yes, Tammy.
Yes, I want to, yes, I understand what you're talking about, that things are getting a little bit strange on the earth, you know.
But what I wanted to talk about was the clone issue.
Oh yes, that's one of those strange things happening on Earth right now.
I'm not, I don't think that's real kosher, alright?
And I had a thought about it, I was thinking about it the night you were talking about it.
Yes.
And I was thinking, you know, what if those clones, you know, it happened, and a whole bunch of them got cloned of humans, and once they grew up, They all got together and turned on mankind.
And so I was... That's very easy to imagine, Tammy, because I think that clones will be absolutely discriminated against, and inevitably a large or growing group, and they'd be a fast-growing group, by the way, of people getting discriminated against react violently, and so it's not too hard to imagine that could happen.
Because, like, you were talking about, you know, of clones being cloned of humans and, you know, they could come into your home and be your maid.
Well, I imagined, and it is the solid science behind my imaginings, that we could create pretty much a mindless robot that would perhaps fulfill your every want and whim and need.
In effect, being your servant.
Until it got evil.
Until it got...
Evil or old and died.
Yeah.
How many people, Tammy, do you think would turn down the opportunity to have such a personal slave?
Being absolutely brutally honest here.
In today's society?
Yes ma'am.
You really think so?
Oh, sure.
This is a very lazy society we're in.
Oh, you mean 85% would accept?
I said, how many did you think would turn it down?
Oh, turn it down?
You said 15%, obviously.
So 85% of the people would take something like this?
Oh, yeah.
Especially today.
Because everybody's in such a big hurry to go out there and get that dollar, no matter how they've got to do it, their home is lacking.
Oh, that's right.
So, gee, Tammy.
uh... it's not very hard then to imagine eighty five percent that would be a whole lot of clones yeah and you might want to know that about that most revolutions are accomplished by five percent or less of the general population at any given time well that ain't good news possibly not that's right and uh... then there's another thing you've got to imagine that the clones would probably be cloned for in many cases Virtues.
Things we would consider virtuous, like really strong bodies.
Right?
Yeah.
Perhaps even improving on the human breed, to some degree, in some way.
And if we did that, then the chances are, if there was a war, we'd lose.
Right.
Right, we would lose.
The world would go to clones.
Are those clones going to be able to have babies naturally?
And before you know it, Tammy, we'd be doing the dishes for the clones.
That's a scary thought.
It is.
I've got to go.
Good morning, everybody.
It's a breaking news morning.
Check out the crop circle on my website.
This is Premier Networks.
That was Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM on this Somewhere in Time.
I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to get a shot of the next one.
You're listening to Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
Tonight, featuring Coast to Coast AM, from August 22nd, 2001.
The two new crop circles, one of which is a face, in my opinion, it's like a Rorschach test, I suppose, but in my opinion, not a human face.
You take a look for yourself on artbell.com.
It's two hours old now.
To us, anyway, and it's not a human face.
At least, I don't think it is.
A lot of people with a lot to say about what that means.
The ghost video that we've got on the website that you can download and look at for yourself.
I'm watching the, it's kind of intriguing, the fast blast coming in.
Some people think it's a drop of water or something.
Others say absolutely real.
Some people say the face is fake, that it's crocheted or something.
Well, it's not.
That's a real crop circle.
Some guy says, my wife says it's crochet, so it has to be.
Always believe the wife, or at least tell her you do.
I'm Art Bell, if you'll stay right there, we'll get into more of all of this breaking news in just a moment.
You're listening to Art Bell, somewhere in time.
Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from August 22, 2001.
Music.
Back into the night of open lines.
On the first time caller line, you're on the air.
Cheerio.
Hello, Art.
Hi there.
I have a question to ask you.
I heard you talk several times over the air about seeing a V-shaped UFO.
Passed right over our heads, my wife and myself.
Well, I saw one that was in a V-shape, and I was looking at it through a pair of binoculars, a 10x50 pair of binoculars, only this This thing stood up on its end.
I mean, it looked like a pyramid in the sky.
Oh, you're kidding.
No, and it had a light on each corner.
And the lights, as I was watching it, the lights rotated.
The top one went to the bottom right.
And where did you see this?
I thought, well, where I live is about midway between Phoenix and Tucson.
Right.
You know, the funny thing about it, the thing was located, it positioned itself pretty close to a substation.
You know, electrical substation?
Well, there's a lot of reports of that, of UFOs near electrical equipment, substations, nuclear facilities of varying sorts, including power plants.
Yeah.
But, you know, I saw, I, you know, when I first seen it, I thought it was maybe a drilling derrick or something.
Uh, because I've worked on drilling derricks in the past and I, and I used to hunt this, I hunted this area a lot.
I mean, I was out there continuously and I thought, you know, what the hell is this?
You know, I thought somebody was putting something up in there, you know, and there was some of my, my hunting territory was gone, but so I took out a pair of binoculars and I had my wife with me and I had a friend with me and I was looking at it probably from the distance of about, oh, Maybe three quarters of a mile to a mile away.
Yes.
And it looked pretty big.
But the lights, like I say, the lights didn't just flash on from corner to corner.
They actually moved from the top down to the right and then back.
Did it stay there, sir?
Yeah, it stayed there.
And I wanted to take a real close look at it.
But my wife, The wiser of the family.
Yeah.
She didn't want me to go, and my buddy that was with me, he didn't want me to get any closer to it.
If I would have been by myself, I might have been abducted by now, because I took a real close look.
And you wouldn't have been making this call, right?
And I probably not.
Not in this manner of voice, anyway.
That's right.
All right, sir.
Thank you very much.
I appreciate the call.
The Wild Card Line, you're on the air.
Hi, this is Iman.
I believe that humans are going to try and evolve ourselves artificially, and have it called the Human Completion Project.
Who would have the ego to call it the Human Completion Project?
That begun by God is finished by the hand of man?
Who would have that kind of ego?
The government.
Well, how about any scientist?
True!
I mean, and then the one that happened, I mean, I think it would be called the third impact, because there were two major impacts that happened before this.
There was the first one where God created Earth and then the second one where God created
man and then the third one would be where man tried to go against God and tried to create
and try to complete its evolution artificially.
Well I have a feeling that if there is God, capital G, that what happened to the money
changers would look like child's play compared to what would happen if we really did that.
And there really is a God.
Oh, the things that could be done.
Have you considered that as you look around the world today and what you see may be just the beginning of that exact process?
East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
Hello, Mark.
Hello there.
This is John from Etheridge, Tennessee.
Hi, John.
I was calling about the crop circles.
Yes, sir.
I think they're probably done by multidimensional beams.
And do you think that that face represents the way these multi-dimensional beings probably live?
Well, I haven't gotten to see it yet.
I'm on guard duty right now and I don't have a computer with me.
That's why you sound so calm.
If you'd already seen this, believe me, you'd be freaked out.
High magnitude.
No matter where you stand, close or even farther away, farther away it gets worse.
Wait till you see it.
And another thing, I wish we could hurry up and make contact because these people or beings have probably examined us in every way possible.
And me being paraplegic for 19 years, I think they could probably do something for me.
Maybe.
Maybe you wouldn't like what you wish for, sir.
I mean, there's at least a 50% possibility, probability even, That, if contact were made, it would be made because we had finally done something we really should not be doing.
Like putting nuclear weapons in space!
You know they're not gonna like that!
You just know they're not gonna like that!
That's gotta be bad, even for an alien.
Even if a nuclear weapon is, by comparison to what they may have, a matchstick.
They're still not gonna like it.
Because even if you're an alien, a thermonuclear device detonating near you probably has serious consequences.
West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
Hello.
Good morning, Art.
Good morning, sir.
I'm in Phoenix, Arizona.
All right.
I'm listening on, it's 550 on the dial.
I'm not sure what their call letters are.
5-K-F-Y-I.
That's it.
I just wanted to, my question has to do with antennas.
Okay.
I guess the way I want to put this to you is, if I had an antenna that was omni-frequency and had limitless gain, would that be special?
Yes, it certainly would.
If you mean it is resonant on all frequencies.
Correct.
That would indeed be revolutionary, yes, of course.
It would be.
Would you care to talk to somebody who's invented such an antenna?
Well, of course I would.
I would love to get you two guys together.
This guy is an elderly gentleman.
First of all I want one because I have other hams I compete with and I would get one of these of course and put them in the dirt.
He has one already.
Then he's already putting people in the dirt.
I would love to get you two guys together and have a I want you to have a conversation.
How would I go about doing that?
You would go about that by emailing me or writing to me or whichever you can accomplish.
Which can you do?
We could do either one.
Which would be best?
Email is always best.
My address is artbell at mindspring.com.
I got that.
I'll look for it then.
And, uh, oh yes.
I mean, you're always trying to best the other guy by a few dB, right?
So if you've got an antenna like that... First time caller in line, you're on the air.
Hello.
Yes, hi.
Hi.
This is Stan.
How are you doing?
I'm doing alright, Stan.
Where are you from?
I'm from West L.A.
and I'm listening to KFI.
Of course.
And I'm on a cell phone.
Yeah, I can tell.
And I've been listening to you since the dawn of the 90s.
Oh, yes.
The first time I called.
Long time ago.
One of your songs, Elvis' song.
Yes.
And the girl's name is Ann Marie.
Uh-huh.
And I heard Elvis sing it live at the International back in 1971.
Unlike any other song, he did.
That's great.
Yeah.
It's great.
Great show.
I'd really like to listen to you very much, about the crop circles.
I was at the Venice Boardwalk a couple weeks ago, and this girl had this t-shirt on, and it had these five aliens.
She was actually wearing it?
Yes, and it was a cartoon-like aliens, and they all had lawnmowers, and they were cutting in the crop circle.
I thought it was so funny.
If I could get a copy of that, I'll send it out to you.
I would appreciate that.
I'm a lover of t-shirts, as you can see from looking at my webcam.
When are you going to have the Ghost to Ghost again?
Well, alright, let's think about that.
This is now the 24th of August, right?
And of course, we'll have one on Halloween.
However, I would say there is enough time between now and Halloween to do at least one Ghost to Ghost.
In fact, really I should schedule it in the next couple of weeks.
So, I'm going to rage for that.
First time caller on the line, you're on the air.
Hi.
Hi there.
Where are you, sir?
I am in Oklahoma City.
Okay.
Welcome.
My name is Steve.
Steve.
I wanted to comment.
I think the crop circle with the 104 circles is absolutely astounding.
That's not 104, sir.
That's 409.
Ah.
409.
Turn your radio off.
I'll do that.
I didn't realize it was loud enough for you.
It is.
I can hear it no matter what.
Completely down.
Yeah, that's 409 circles.
And it's just gigantic.
It's amazing.
Now, regarding the face, though, I wanted to point something out.
What?
If you look closely, the tracks that run that you see in most of these English fields where the crop circles are, they seem, rather than being recessed, to be protruding.
Protruding.
Yeah, if you look closely at the picture.
Oh, I see what you're saying.
And also, they seem to be woven into this pattern.
The whole face, rather than being recessed into the grain, seems to be, what would be the word, it's relief rather than recessed.
I don't get that.
I do see where the lines appear to affect the face.
Particularly two of them that are running right down the middle, almost through the nose.
But the lines seem to be protruding from, they seem to be sticking out from the surface rather than, like tracks would be.
Well, there'd be only one thing you could do to a crop, sir, and that would be to trample it down, or to knock it down.
True.
With high voltage or microwave or whatever.
So...
I was wondering if someone had been fiddling around with Photoshop with this thing.
I'm not trying to throw it under the water.
It's absolutely fascinating.
I think not.
This came from the crop circle connector, so its location and the time, I think, are very precise.
So there are witnesses that have actually seen it?
Oh, absolutely.
The connector has a wonderful reputation for accuracy.
You know, if you will shrink this thing down to about one-tenth or one-twelfth its normal size, you see even more detail.
It's really spooky then.
I appreciate the call, sir.
Thank you.
I realize that would be the first... I mean, this is so eerie and so bizarre that anybody's first reaction to this would be to believe that this was done in Photoshop or something like that.
No, no, no.
Wildcard Line, you're on the air.
Hello.
Yes, hi.
This is Nathan.
I'm calling from Minneapolis.
Hi, Nathan.
A.M.
1500 KSTV.
Yes, sir.
Yeah, I got a couple of general questions.
I'm wondering, and maybe this can be explained to me for other ignorant collars as well, crop circle are limited.
They're not obviously taking place in our country.
Is that correct?
Oh, no, that's not correct at all.
What is fair to say, we've had many of them here.
In fact, most recently, I believe, in Montana, a whole spate of them.
However, Crop circles here tend not to be as complex by a long shot as those in Great Britain and elsewhere.
I've also heard, I don't know if this is just rumor or I read it somewhere, but I've heard of them appearing in snow, like snow circles.
Absolutely.
They've even appeared in dirt.
Wow.
But thank you very much.
It's fair to say that Nowhere in the world have they experienced crop circles as intricate and as impossible to believe that humans could have done them as in Great Britain.
Even though we know there have been some faked in Great Britain, I simply don't believe that, for example, the first Wilshire crop circle could possibly have been done by humans.
Not even remotely possible.
We know it was done overnight.
We know that it was raining overnight.
And all I ask is you go look at that picture, the one with 409 circles, and you tell me if you think it's possible, even remotely possible, that human beings could have done that with that sort of symmetrical accuracy and magnitude of that.
And, you know, your head is going to hurt.
You can't do it.
West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
Hello.
All right, how you doing tonight?
Okay, sir.
Wild night.
This is Steve in Los Angeles, listening to you on KFI.
Yes, sir.
The craft circle you're talking about?
Yes.
You were saying something about the size of it earlier, and I had heard the little brief piece that I saw said that it was estimated to be five acres.
Which one are you referring to?
The one in England, the one with the 400... 409 circles, yes.
Correct, and it said that the larger circles were as big as 70 feet in diameter.
Yeah, big.
And the thing about that is you would need a small army of people
to come in and do something like that overnight.
People did not do this.
No, there's no way.
I mean, it's just too large.
Right.
It's too huge for any...
And I cannot imagine a team of people that could maintain...
I'm going to be near a computer on Saturday.
So I'll be able to... Oh, you haven't seen these yet?
No, I just saw a very brief picture of it on television.
entire area was examined for any footsteps or signs of uh... human activity in the was zip zero
well i'm looking forward to i'm i'm gonna be near a computer on saturday
so i'll be able to... oh you haven't seen these yet? no i just saw a very brief picture of it
on television and i just did a it was just a short piece you couldn't really get a good look at it
It was just, it was there, it was gone.
Oh, CNN, Headline News was running a really long piece when it first happened, when they first got the video, and they did almost a 10 minute piece on it.
Really?
Yeah.
This was like a 30 second at the most.
But what you really have to see is the high definition version that's on my website.
As good as CNN's report was, Well, we've got a much better, if you've got a good computer and monitor, much better picture up there.
Well, I'll look at that Saturday.
I'm looking forward to seeing what it looks like.
All right.
Thank you very much.
It's all at Artbell.com.
What's up there now?
A video, an MPEG, of a ghost, it is said, by some, crossing the street.
You make up your own mind.
A picture of the new Wiltshire Crop Circle, 409 circles, and now, as of about three hours ago, three hours ago, A picture of a crop circle, also in Wilshire, that absolutely obviously has a face, and the resemblance to the face on Mars... It's unreal.
A wild card line, you're on the air.
Two quick things.
Did you get a chance to read about that event that NASA reported on August 16th, where they read the radiation levels around the Earth at a thousand times normal?
Yes.
But there was no... Yes, I'm aware of that.
It is attributed, and this is so unlikely, to an unbelievably large explosion on the other side of the sun.
Now, how that could be Affecting Earth and our radiation levels is unknown to science.
And that's what they're admitting to.
And another thing, there's more to worry about, sir.
Worry about this.
Whatever it is over there on the other side of the sun is going to rotate toward Earth shortly.
In about eight days.
Yeah, that's right.
Did you see the ABC News article?
I said about three times about those Turkish military jet fighters.
It was an ABC News article.
called Strange Skies and uh... it was like a couple weeks ago before you went to your back uh... when your back went out and they were tailed for thirty minutes by uh... UFOs.
Yes.
You see that?
Oh, absolutely.
I just wanted to add in all the strangeness tonight.
Have you managed to be up on my website?
Yeah, I saw the uh... 409 uh... Okay, but forget the 409.
Cool as that is.
Yeah.
What about the one above it?
The one that just came in?
With the face?
Yeah.
I was in... I'm in transit.
I couldn't get... I don't have... I'm not by my computer now.
No, I'll get it tomorrow.
Don't worry.
It looks like a lion's face.
I'm going to fall off my chair.
Well, let's put it this way.
It has definite feline characteristics to it.
Oh, brother.
I'm telling you, Hoagland is going to flip.
I'm going to call him tomorrow.
Now that the news is so big, I'll never be the first to get to him, but I sure would love to be.
Yeah, he's coming to San Jose tonight at the conference.
Hey, Richard, you just go up to my website.
I want you to see something.
I'd love to be the guy who just led him up there.
With a camera on his face.
I mean, what would the other side of the line sound like?
All right, sir, thank you.
Bye-bye.
All right, that's it for tonight, folks.
We've got to get out of here.
Replay this show for your friends during the day.
Make sure and have them go to my website and take a look at all this.
It's artbell.com.
www.artbell.com.
Well, I'm afraid time says that's all, so y'all have a good night from the high desert.
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