Charles Cagle, a physicist-turned-helicopter pilot, links ball lightning—a neutron-generating plasma phenomenon documented since Aristotle—to Earth’s magnetic field, proposing it as a magnetotoroid. During Solar Cycle 23 (1996–2008), he warns that successive coronal mass ejections (CMEs) could destabilize the planet’s shield, triggering Richter 10+ quakes, mile-high tsunamis, and atmospheric "boiling" events like Hawaii’s volcanic islands collapsing in hours. Historical reversals, occurring at least 171 times since the Jurassic, may repeat within days, not millennia, with no human defense possible—suggesting solar activity could rewrite Earth’s geophysical fate. [Automatically generated summary]
From the high desert in the great American Southwest, I bid you all good evening, or good morning as the case may be across this great land of ours.
And welcome to another night of Coast to Coast AM.
That would be live talk radio from the Tahitian and Hawaiian Island chains in the west, all the way eastward to the Caribbean and the Virgin Islands, U.S. Virgin Islands, south into South America, north to the Pole, and worldwide on the internet.
This is Coast to Coast AM.
I'm Mark Bell, and we've got a very interesting guest tonight.
As a matter of fact, in a moment, I'll fill you in on the rest of the week.
He doesn't have a bachelor's, master's, nor Ph.D., high school, of course, and then a commercial fisherman on the west coast, fished salmon up a fortune off the Oregon and Washington, California coast, then came crab out of Kodiak, Alaska.
Drafted then in 1966 from Kodiak, joined the U.S. Army, went to basic training at Fort Ward, California, then on Officer Candidate School at Fort Knox, Kentucky.
Graduated a green second lieutenant.
Went on to helicopter school at Fort Walters, Texas, then Hunter Army Airfield, Savannah, Georgia.
Graduated, got his wings, and went to Vietnam.
Was promoted to captain at age 22.
And I could give you so very much more because he gave me so very much more.
But Charles Kagle is a self-educated physicist.
And what he has to say to you tonight ultimately may concern you, though it's nothing that you have not heard before.
Charles Kagle began investigating ball lightning, I would guess almost as a passion.
And from his investigation into ball lightning, if my understanding is basically accurate, he developed a thesis with regard to the way our sun works as it relates to our earth and what is coming as a result of that.
And what is coming apparently fairly soon as a result of that.
So we'll get to Charles Kagle in a moment.
The Russians think that they have an Iraqi solution.
The Iraqis are beginning to say they're going to let the American inspectors back in just so long as they don't dominate the inspections.
So it's beginning to sound an awful lot like the Iraqis are beginning to cave in as more and more forces, B-52s, F-117 stealths, and you name it, it's on the way.
And the Iraqis apparently concluded we were very serious.
And so the investigation, or the UN investigation of their biological chemical program may be back on again shortly.
U-2s have flown.
Nothing has shot at them.
And that's kind of where that stands.
The FBI is out of the TWA-800 investigation, declaring it to be, they believe, a mechanical problem, not a criminal problem.
Well, all right, here we go, I believe, to the state of Oregon, where I suspect it's rather rainy.
Well, I think on the coast of Oregon, they're getting slammed pretty well.
Power was out.
They had a lot of high winds and a bunch of rain earlier in the day, and yet another West Coast storm passes.
Anyway, Charles, it's great to have you.
I understand that your Odyssey, your quest, began with an investigation of ball lightning, and I've always been myself very, very interested in ball lightning.
I think it was December 14th issue of New Scientist, which was a British publication.
And the title of it was The Enigma of Ball Lightning.
I read it, and the thing that was sort of amazing was that there were 40 different theories, which automatically told me that there wasn't a great deal of consensus in the scientific world about a really important issue.
And a lot of people didn't even believe it existed, yet it actually has been written about since the time of Aristotle.
Well, I'm not a meteorologist, so I barely even know what lightning is, but it's my understanding that regular lightning, contrary to popular belief, does not go from the cloud to the ground, but rather from the ground to the cloud.
There was a fellow by the name of Ritchie who was reproducing one of Franklin's experiments.
Not Richie, but Richman.
And he was in Paris.
There's a real neat woodcut, and it shows this ball coming off his apparatus and hitting him in the head.
It killed him.
I should send you a copy of this woodcut because it's pretty, you know, here it comes from the 1700s.
But it does a lot of bizarre things.
I think one of the most bizarre things is it'll, you know, it's been known to come aboard an aircraft, come down the aisle, pass right through the plexiglass window in front of the pilots, and then go down the aisle and about the size of a soccer ball, and then do a sudden exit stage left, right, through the skin of the aircraft.
Passengers look out, see it bouncing along the wing until it comes within, then drops off into space.
I've had enough rough flights without ball lightning on a flight.
Oh, my God.
What is, here I guess we'll start to dip in, but I mean, I just, I can't, in my own mind's eye, I'm not a physicist, of course, but I can't understand what ball lightning is.
I imagine lightning as a differential or a delta between two points that is then equalized by a strike of lightning.
And so it doesn't seem like there's any relationship between that and what you're describing, down the aisle of an aircraft, as a ball.
And I think that was one that troubled me for quite a few years.
And so we just had to look at the phenomenon and what was common about all the phenomena.
But eventually, if I could just cut straight to the chase, the fact is that there's a new unrecognized rotation of a current vector.
So you have a current flowing from point A to point B, and if the current density reaches a critical current density, and it does this, you know, it has to do it fast, then there is a rotation of the current vector 90 degrees.
And what that generates then is basically a ring current.
In other words, if you're producing a really dense current, you know, a very tremendous discharge like a lightning discharge, sometimes portions of that channel can become constricted.
But the process of constriction really deals with the fact that the charges are all attractively interacting one another.
Now, this goes against what people have been saying, you know, because, you know, you have a ham operator's license, and you had to study a certain amount of electronic theory.
And underlying the fundamental stone that underlies most of modern physics is Coulomb's Law.
Well, it turns out that Coulomb's law isn't actually a general case.
It's a special case.
And it only deals with charges that have lots of relative motion.
And the rate of change of that field is directly proportional to the electric field that gets induced.
So, a very large electric field suddenly builds up and immediately causes a spark over.
Well, typically what would happen, it would burn out the windings.
So, the Navy, seeing this problem, designed a special spark gap.
And off of that particular spark gap, as soon as the spark would begin to develop, then a magnetic coil would push the spark out onto the tip of these two electrodes.
And very frequently, a ball about the size of a large orange would form.
Float around inside the submarine and then explode, go off like a 22.
And so when the voltage builds up to a critical value, that means a very large, when it breaks down, when the breakdown begins to occur, it means a large current's going to flow.
And when that large current begins to flow, it can self-constrict.
And when it self-constricts to a critical density, and this density was discovered by two fellows, Hans Alphane, who was a Nobel Prize winner in 1970, and another fellow by the name of J.D. Lawson, independently back in the late 30s.
And it was called the Alphen-Lawson limit.
And so there is a maximum current density in a current in a plasma.
And when that current density is reached, the current begins to self-constrict.
It's called a pinch effect.
But what actually drives the pinch effect and what occurs during the pinch effect is what actually causes or creates ball lightning.
And basically, what is generated then is a ring current.
In other words, there's a current mode where the current flows around the ring, and that's called a toroidal current mode.
And then there's another current mode, which, when the current is very strong around the ring, then at every point across the ring is an anti-parallel current.
In other words, if you're standing at point A on the ring, and then you look across, and there's point B on the other side of the ring, the current is going the opposite direction right there.
Wow.
Okay, so that, I mean, in other words, because it takes, you know, it's going, if you're standing on the ring and the ring, you know, it goes in the direction of your right hand, and as it gets clear around the ring, far direction from you, it's going the opposite direction.
Right.
So what happens?
That means that everywhere opposite on a ring is an anti-parallel current.
And according to standard physics, parallel currents attract one another, anti-parallel currents repel.
So the ring tends to expand rapidly.
As soon as it expands, it reaches the critical current density everywhere in the ring.
And immediately, the current vector rotates 90 degrees.
Now you've got that same rotation characteristics if you had a tornado and joined its ends.
Now you basically have, now what happens, as soon as that happens, then it tends to contract.
And as soon as it contracts, then now the type of flow that's going on, the current direction at that time is called a poloidal current because the current is going down the hole, you know, out the back, coming up over the surface, and then back down the hole again.
Sort of like you took a trip into the North Pole, went clear down through the middle of the Earth, and came out the South Pole, and then came up past the equator, and that's the circuit.
In other words, here you have this self-sustaining, at least for a period of time, current in an atmosphere, which must be rapidly attempting to dissipate it.
In other words, the atmosphere is going to work on it because normally a current is carried, for example, through something that is conductive, a wire.
And generally, the atmosphere is not a conductive thing.
So this is some sort of self-sustaining thing.
But even at that, the atmosphere around it is going to work at dissipating it, or trying to, isn't it?
Number one, it went sailing over 7 million hits since the first of the year.
I wonder who number 7 million was.
Did you save it on your screen?
We got to start marking those who hit the million marks.
Anyway, over 7 million hits.
And for a good reason, there's a lot of good stuff up there.
Take my guest tonight, Charles Cagle.
He has an extensive presentation on tonight's website.
So I suggest you go take a look.
And as you try to understand what he's saying, we're discussing ball lightning, and we soon will be discussing our own son.
We're sort of building up to it.
I would suggest that you go up to my website and take a look.
And under the new news area, you'll see the Kegel presentation.
Just click on that, and you've got quite a bit to read and study there for what you're going to hear that is going to support what you're going to hear.
Okay, well, the simple answer really is that ball lightning is the reason it has escaped everyone in the sense of people knowing what it was and why there are 40 different theories is because it, you know, as I said, is as soon as it passes through a piece of sheet metal, 99% of what we understand about physics falls off on this side of the sheet metal.
And yet it keeps going.
And the reason is because what we know about physics, or what we have known, a lot of it has just been wrong.
Well, you know, that's always Tesla's always a mysterious figure in the sense that, you know, he's got quite a cult following right now.
And I think I was once in his cult, you know, but he was a remarkable fellow.
And what he understood, he claimed that he could produce ball lightning.
In fact, he wrote, I have never seen ball lightning, but I have been rewarded because I determined its mode of production and was able to produce it with my coil.
Somebody just sent this to me from the Tesla website.
Corum and Coram reproduce Nicola Tesla's ball lightning production technique.
This type of ball lightning arises when RF arcs with impulsive envelopes of vaporize carbon, and the Corums believe the phenomena to be a sort of stable combustion process with carbon or copper and ozone with a diffusion limited something or another that I can't read here, which somehow allows the combustion process.
Their fireballs range in size up to five centimeters, last several seconds, change color with time, sometimes terminate existence with a bang.
Numerous photos and video still frames of the phenomena are available.
And the machine that they used was pretty low power.
I think they said something like 80 watts, but they might have built a little bigger one.
So it could actually be done very easily.
So I owe a lot to those guys.
And I thank them because seeing their photos and they did video frame analysis.
They took videos of this and then frame by frame they took them apart and saw that they rotated, that they had phenomena that were just like little stars.
They produced loop phenomena, darkening of limbs, looked like they had little sunspots on them.
They rotated.
They went through what they described as a main sequence of stars that would progress through different color stages and you know, but then when it came down to it, they analyzed it differently than I did.
And you know, on one hand, I thank'em.
On the other hand, I think they're wrong about what it was.
And, you know, now, if you took a look at that, you know, if people would look at your website, there was a particular picture up there which said the archetype form on it, or neutral macro particle structure.
Right at that interface, that interface itself, which I call a conjugate surface, is actually a surface of total time dilation.
And what that means is that this thing, you know, ball lightning, in fact, you know, you have to understand what the potential is, but I'll skip past some of this.
And the fact is, is that if you had a little particle and shot it at this, as soon as that particle begins to approach that surface, at the very surface at that interface, its velocity begins to approach zero.
Now what that means is it means that this thing is impenetrable.
Well, no, not always, but typically it's always produced by the scenario that I talked about before, which was the generation of a ring current from a very dense current element.
Yeah, and they did actually a study at Oak Ridge National Laboratories among 17, I think it was 17,018,000 workers that they had there a few years back.
And they found that just a survey, who had seen ball lightning and actually found out like 3% of the people had seen it.
So it's not as uncommon as people might think.
In fact, it's as common as being very near a lightning strike.
In other words, typically people are not 100 yards away from a lightning strike.
I mean, it happens, certainly.
Sure.
But typically, I've never been that close to one, and thank heavens.
Yeah, I had a short, and apparently it produced, and this little ball came out and didn't last but a second or two and was gone.
And that's interesting.
You know, one of the first guys that I was up in the mountains of Boulder, you know, above Boulder, Colorado years ago, and I was interviewing whoever I could who I thought might have seen ball lightning.
And I ran across this old miner, and he was running it, you know, he's putting a shaft down.
And I thought, now this guy's surely seen ball lightning up in the mountains here.
And so I said, have you ever seen ball lightning?
And he says, no.
He says, but a matter of fact, I own a restaurant down in Pueblo.
I was thinking, what's that got to do with it?
And he had one of these great big five-horsepower Hobart mixers.
And he said, you'd dump in a whole bunch of boiled potatoes in this and turn it on.
It would lug down and a ball about the size of a ping-pong ball would come out of the socket where it was plugged in and shoot across the room and then explode and go off like a little 22 shot.
And, you know, so, you know, it can come from a variety of sources, but typically, wherever there's a very super dense current element that reaches that Alpha-Laussen limit and produces a little wing current, this thing immediately begins to oscillate and produces, you know, typically a ball lightning incident.
Ball lightning, when it does dissipate, I don't know if there are even any real studies, but what percentage of the time does it just simply sort of dissipate as a tornado might dissipate versus the explosion?
I mean, we have all these descriptions of a ball lightning exploding.
Yeah, they do explode quite a lot, but I couldn't tell you what the percentage is, but they do have been noted to just fade away.
But they can contain prodigious amounts of energy.
A good example is one that occurred in the Soviet Union.
And a ball came down through the roof of a house, went out the door, then went 50 meters from the building, and exploded and knocked the building down.
It was about the size of a basketball.
The Russian engineers came in and surveyed the damage.
And their calculations, they came up and said that the ball had, per unit volume, seven times the exposing force of TNT to pump that type of structure down.
Well, that's an interesting question, but it turns out that when it's in the toroidal current mode, you actually cannot measure, and it has to do with because it's a certain mathematical function of a curl function.
The divergence of any curl function is zero.
And so it turns out that you can have this ring current, and you actually can't measure it.
There are times when you can't measure it because it's an infinitely conducting current loop.
Well, and of course, that was part of, you know, because when you blow ball lightning up to a large scale, then you end up having the same thing as the Earth's magnetic field.
It's the same structure.
And, of course, the Earth goes through dipole reversals.
I had a guest on recently who suggested to me that he has measured the Earth's magnetic field and that in the last 100 or 200 years, if 200 years ago we were at a strength of 10, we're now at about a 1.5.
And it is his position that our magnetic field has weakened that far.
And so the reason shortly that we've been discussing ball lightning is going to be apparent because it is your theory, or would you say it's more than a theory?
Have you proven it?
that the toradal nature of ball lightning is very much like, in fact, our Earth's electromagnetic field, yes?
In fact, I would say it's no longer a theory in the sense that I think it's a theory.
I think that this is the physics that I believe that people are going to be eventually teaching for the next thousand years.
I don't consider it a theory.
I've got so much evidence.
I've spent 25 years on the trail of this.
Now, that doesn't mean, you know, just because I spent a lot of time that I would necessarily be successful, but I think there's no question on my mind that I've come up with some solutions that have solved some very long-standing problems in physics.
It's the same structure in the Sun, in other stars, and stellar jets.
And it's a ubiquitous structure, and it exists all over the universe.
And that's why I call it the archetype, because it's an archetype form, meaning that it is a universal form upon which everything else follows that pattern and is derived from that pattern.
So, you know, I consider it to be a pretty significant discovery.
I've taken it to a number of people, but the spectrum of what the responses are ranges all over from they get first got to qualify and you ask if you have a degree.
And if you have no, they don't even listen to you.
To I took it to a fellow who had just quit Los Alamos as a top nuclear weapons designer.
Worldwide, the Russians are saying they have an answer.
Americans may soon be back inspecting Iraqi chemical and biological sites.
And so we'll see how that works out.
Meantime, we're still sending a lot of hardware that direction.
Militants, Islamic ones in Egypt, are taking credit for the killing of 62 near an ancient temple in Egypt.
And, of course, the FBI has ended the investigation of the TWA flight, declaring it was not a criminal act, but rather some sort of mechanical problem.
And that's basically what's going on in the world.
Otherwise, we are speaking tonight with Charles Kagel, a self-educated physicist.
And we've been talking about ball lightning for the last hour.
And basically, to summarize, ball lightning is a really, really weird thing which has all kinds of interesting currents, a toroidal current that goes around the outside, and sometimes a poloidal current on the inside.
Now, all of this may be a little difficult for you to grasp.
And so we have put on my website, thanks to Charles, very good descriptions, pictorial descriptions of exactly what we're talking about.
In other words, what is ball lightning?
And if you want to know, go up there and take a look.
It's at www.artbell.com.
Now, other than the interest side of it, why have we been discussing ball lightning?
We're about to get to that, but first this for you, Charles, a very tangential thought.
In the days when the seas were navigated by sailing vessels, I think those sailors would sometimes see something called St. Elmo's fire.
Was this ball lightning?
And if so, why did it happen?
In other words, was there something in the configuration or composition of the ship's rigging that was conducive to the phenomena?
Yeah, well, the ship is sticking up, and all the electric field for the region typically is concentrated on the mast and the spars, and so you get what's called ionic discharge, which is just a strong electric field is built up around the mast and the spars and the sh in the rigging.
And any air molecules that come within close to that, they basically have their electrons stripped off, and they then will recombine, and that emits light, and so you end up seeing this thing that looks like a light.
It's very much, and the same thing, if you go back, even in the Bible, there was the burning bush.
Okay, no, I read that to you, and I'll give everybody, let me give everybody an idea.
It is, by the way, unsigned.
It is critical of you and suggests that you must not be educated because it has been proven beyond any shadow of a doubt, I'm giving the sort of a paraphrasing the facts here, that lightning goes from the ground to the cloud and never does it do anything else.
The Navy, he says, has proven this with high-speed photography.
And you can go to any research institute and prove it.
Yeah, as soon as they were exposed to it, they said it was very bright and it was humming, which means, you know, it was oscillating between the two current modes.
Well, this began, I began to develop this model, and I began to realize that this was a pretty ubiquitous structure, and I began to see, you know, the sun was actually blowing magneto-toroidal bubbles.
You know, I say magnetotyroidal, and that's a new term.
I hate to coin terms, but it's more descriptive than magnetosphere, because it's really a toroidal structure.
Okay, the sun is beginning to get very, very active all of a sudden.
We've been through now several years of a real lull.
I'm a ham operator.
When the sun is not active, when there are not a lot of sunspots and solar storms going on and all the rest of it, things in ham radio get very boring.
The frequencies are not active.
But all of a sudden, in the last, oh, I don't know, several months, we've been having these great, big eruptions.
As a matter of fact, several months ago, CNN made a big deal out of this ejecta.
More than the normal sun flare.
They said, ejecta, it's a giant ejecta.
And CNN said it's headed right at Earth.
And actually, it sort of missed.
But it was a gigantic ejecta.
And if it had hit Earth, what would have occurred?
Well, typically what happens when a coronal mass ejection hits the Earth, the first thing it does that boosts the Earth's magnetic field acts like a, I don't know, I hate to use this analogy, but it acts like a force field.
It's a natural feedback mechanism That it hits the magneto toroid or magnetosphere of the Earth, and it really boosts the ring current, and the field expands.
And as it expands, then it basically kind of acts like a protection against this big blast of ions, which is typically, if it's a coronal mass ejection that's hung together, then it's magnetically confined itself.
And so it's like, you know, it slams into the Earth.
The Earth's field expands.
And when it expands, there is a ring current associated with the Earth.
And there was a fellow by the name of Sidney Chapman.
He's dead now.
he was probably a really famous scientist he was a very strong advocate of the geophysical year which is really But anyway, it'll boost the ring current up.
Now, the danger is if we get hit by a succession of coronal mass ejections that boost that ring current up so high that it hits the current limit.
A sunflare occurs in 11 or 22-year cycles, depending on how you want to talk about it.
It increases sort of ups and downs and ups and downs.
And we are coming into a very active period.
Now, a sunflare is sort of a, it flares out, and we might get bombarded with some immediate energy, and then there's another group of energy that takes longer to reach us.
What is the difference between a sunflare and this ejecta thing?
Yeah, so this thing comes out, and it can hit the Earth, but a flare is just, this is what happens when a toroidal structure collapses and releases all the energy.
All the energy that's contained in those toroidal structures is quite significant.
And then basically, one is confined, one isn't.
So one is a huge burst of particles that are driven out with considerable energy of the explosion of the flare.
This is like some hundred million hydrogen bombs going off.
And the other one is also quite violent, but it is ejected and it is relatively confined.
Now, the interesting thing is that after they leave the sun, you can't see them.
So you just kind of project it.
It looked like it was coming this way.
You can't typically see them.
But if you happen to have a spacecraft out there that has a magnetometer on board, then what they'll see as it passes through is go, you know, the meter goes flip, flip, flip, flip.
I mean, when I look at it, you know, if you imagined one of these things with 800,000 miles in diameter, and you just take a look at the cross-section of that, and then you think about what the cross-section of the surface of the sphere is, 93 million miles with a radius of 93 million miles, the chances, if they just hit on the equatorial plane, it's about 1 in 54,000.
But if they hit anywhere, in other words, if they're ejected in any direction, but they're not, they're typically ejected.
I think they typically pass along the solar equatorial plane.
In other words, if we should not be getting hit as frequently as we do, and yet we do, then either there is a hard scientific explanation or a religious one, or both.
From Florida Online, Space Online, if you will, the following.
Charles is may relate from Paris.
A likely solution to one of the major mysteries of our sun has emerged from recent observations with the European Space Agency slash NASA Solar Observatory, or SOHO, mission.
We now apparently have direct evidence for the upward transfer of magnetic energy from the sun's surface toward the corona above.
There is more than enough energy coming up from the loops of the magnetic magnetic carpet to heat the corona to its known temperature, according to Dr. Alan Title of the Stanford Lockheed Institute for Space Research, Lockheed Martin Advanced Technology Center in Palo Alto.
He said, quote, each one of these loops, haha, loops, carries as much energy as a large hydroelectric plant such as Hoover Dam could generate in a million years, end quote.
Well, poles can reverse more rapidly than people thought.
They thought that they could actually reverse.
It took anywhere from 1,000 to 5,000 years or so to reverse.
But studies at Steens Mountain have shown that the actual field can actually move as much as 6 degrees a day, which means the field could be down in as little as 15 days once it starts to go.
Yeah, we're on the fast ascension phase of cycle 23, which looks so far, if we follow past patterns, cycle 23 looks like it could be the very largest solar maximum ever recorded in the history of the world.
Really?
Yeah.
So it could go the other way, but it's starting off nicely, which means that we've already been hit by some CMEs.
One CME hit the Earth back in January and burned out the AT ⁇ T 401 Telstar satellite.
Yeah, that's because we're talking about having been slammed by the CME, it drives the current the current, the ring current up to the critical limit.
It rotates 90 degrees, and when it does, now we develops a poloidal current, which then collapses toward the core, and we get a really strong current vector right through the core.
Now, we know that this is happening on the sun, though I've never seen it written, because we get these big, gigantic magnetic loop systems that begin to come right out of the sun.
Where do you think these come from if it isn't from a really powerful current element?
And so we should be getting, on the sun then, starting in the mid-latitudes, and there's a butterfly diagram I think I might have posted to you, I'm not sure.
But starting at the mid-latitudes, we get these loops start coming out.
And then they begin to move poleward.
Now, as the solar maximum, if we're talking about the sun, begins to progress over time, then they begin to appear closer and closer and closer to the equator.
So what we're looking for is what happens when these two, on the sun, when two magnetic loop systems collapse, say one is existing and one builds up underneath it, if they have the wrong polarity, they'll both collapse.
And when they collapse, they produce a solar flare, which is a tremendous release of energy.
So if we use the sun as an analog and say what's going to happen on the earth, very large magnetic loop systems will begin to emerge, and when they collide and collapse, they'll release a tremendous amount of energy.
And that amount of energy that they'll release will be so horrific that it'll probably cause Richter 10 plus movements.
But this is a little bit beyond this, because this is a direct change of the magnetic field, which produces those loops.
And when those collapse, you're going to produce...
If it's released all below ground, or if it's released partially up in the air, we're going to get a tremendous atmospheric explosion, or if it mostly happens underneath the ground, subsurface, then we're going to get a tremendous earthquake.
And that earthquake, let's say one happened 50 miles south, epicenter is 50 miles south of where I am.
It probably create ground waves that would throw cars 100 feet into the air, 20, 30 miles away.
So we're talking about levels of earthquakes.
Now, these type of earthquakes, we've actually been hit by them.
In 1799, there was an earthquake in Rio Bamba, which I think is now part of Peru.
And it threw people out of a village 200 feet across the river where their bodies were found.
I dug that out of an old 1872 copy of Popular Science.
And it was an article on earthquakes and their causes.
So, you know, we actually had some pretty tremendous earthquakes in the past.
But typically, we don't have such movements.
So people don't even think that, you know, they're a factor.
Well, when this starts to happen, if the Earth goes through a phenomena that's just like the solar max, and it will, and the geologic record indicates that it has in the past, then we're going to have major earthquakes.
At sea, you'll produce tsunamis that as they move toward shorelines, depending on the shorelines, they could build up a tsunami that hits the shore that could be a mile high.
By the time it moves northward and crosses the shallow shelf outside the Brahmaputra and the Ganges floodplains, then the wave begins to increase in height.
And by the time it comes ashore, it'd probably be about a mile.
It'll go inland.
It'll probably kill everybody in Calcutta.
When I say everybody, you know, almost everybody.
And virtually, you know, that's the most heavily populated area in the world.
And, you know, it's a very real scenario that this will happen, that you'll get a wave in that area and it'll destroy probably everybody in Bangladesh.
It'll probably kill 130, 40 million people in a single day.
Indications right now, and scientists have frequently been wrong about solar cycles.
They say, well, it's going to be a big one or a strong one or a weak one.
And they've been notoriously wrong.
It's like trying to predict the weather.
But so far, with the beginning increase we've had with solar cycle 23, which is now just beginning, is it holding up to be one of the biggest, do you believe?
That's too early to tell, but I think it's got all the earmarks.
We've been hit by a couple of nice CMEs.
And CME, when it hits the atmosphere, typically will expand the atmosphere to a little bit.
And of course, any low-Earth orbit satellites, like spook satellites, typically, it begins to decay to orbit rather rapidly, and they have to either retask them if they can.
So we get hit by a CME, the atmosphere literally expands, and a satellite in a low Earth orbit is suddenly in atmosphere and has drag that it didn't have before and begins to re-enter.
Well, it's going to be quite significant in the sense that now there's no, you're not going to see any continental shifts.
What you are going to see is because at the same time that there's a very large, now if this thing can produce these big magnetic loop systems, which are toroidal structures in the core of the Earth, which come out to the surface, then across vast cross-sections in the core,
on countless micro-domains, there's going to be the production of tremendous, probably 175 billion tons of neutrons per second could be produced in the core.
We're talking about a very large amount of mass being produced that begins to be produced in the core.
Now, what happens is immediately that expresses a lithospheric tension to the surface.
And what happens where there's tension on hot, wherever there's hot rocks or hot basements, let's say of island chains, there's hot basements to the whole Hawaiian island chain.
And rocks yield under tension much more rapidly than they do under compression.
So immediately this tension gets expressed to those.
They'll begin to yield, and immediately you'll see these island chains start to subside.
A CME, and then maybe another CME, coronal mass discharge, slams into the earth.
And then we begin to go into a pole reversal.
Islands sink.
Islands with volcanic activity sink.
And there's more.
And that'll be coming up in a moment.
And again, I say if this sort of material disturbs you, change channels.
But I think what Charles is saying is pretty well documented.
And I would refer you to a webpage that Keith put together for Charles earlier today.
It took about two hours to put together with a rather careful, thought-out presentation of precisely what he is saying.
You will find that on my website now at www.artbell.com.
All right, now, just let me remind my audience, tomorrow night, we've switched things around a little bit.
Tomorrow night, Whitley Streeber is going to be here, author of Communion and so much more.
And what a story he's got for you tomorrow night.
And then the next night, Professor Michio Kaku, who is a physicist and perhaps one of the best known, best respected, and I think probably is going to fill the very large shoes of Carl Sagan.
Well on his way to doing that.
He's a brilliant man.
The following night, Friday night, Saturday morning, Bob Frizzell will be here.
Bob is really something.
He wrote a book called Nothing in This Book is True, but It's Exactly How Things Are.
Now, how's that for a title of a book?
Nothing in this book is true, but it's exactly how things are.
Sounds like a knockoff from Rush Limbaugh or something, huh?
But I understand he's a heck of an interview, and I'm looking forward to it.
So that is the immediate, well, actually, the immediate future is Charles Kagle once again.
Charles, welcome back.
All right, we talked about large tsunamis.
We talked about if this coronal sun discharge should hit us again, be finally the straw that breaks the camel's back and start a pole reversal, which you think could occur from solar cycle 23, which already is starting out with a bang.
And as a matter of fact, there was news during the top of the hour indicating El Niño incredibly is still building.
Not that it may have any relationship whatsoever to what's going on, but the El Niño is becoming quite an incredible story on its own.
At any rate, Solar Cycle 23 is underway, really roaring.
At some point, you're saying we're going to get hit, hit again, and it's going to be the straw that breaks the camel's back.
This pole reversal will begin, which you think will take about 15 days.
Well, actually, it's not a complete reversal that will take place.
It'll go to the poloidal current mode.
And it'll remain at that period for some time before it actually begins to go through the reversal.
But what will occur then, now the fact is, is that when the current generates this poloidal current, there turns out that there's no magnetic field at that time.
And the interesting thing about it is what protects the Earth in the meantime.
Normally, the magnetic field of the Earth protects the Earth from coronal mass ejections, right?
Now, here are these things.
They travel, they contain, say, 10 billion tons of mass.
These are published figures, mostly protons, electrons.
They travel at 623 miles a second.
They contain enough energy to boil away the Mediterranean.
Now, it's true, they're not concentrated necessarily.
But nevertheless, when they hit the atmosphere, they'll directly heat it.
Charles, do you know that about two months ago there was news breaking all over the world about Israeli scientists who said the whole idea of the KT event with regard to the demise of the dinosaurs on Earth is wrong.
And they said what killed the dinosaurs was a fantastic emission from our sun.
I didn't read that, but there's no doubt in my mind that a series of coral mass ejections when the dipole field is down would be devastating and really, really devastating to life on Earth.
I mean, let's assume that the magnetic field you're talking about that normally protects us is down, like your shields are down, and we get a big CME hit.
I'm going to say that we look at the legend of Satan, which is an ancient Greek legend.
And the legend goes like this, that Satan was the offspring of Apollo, the sun god.
Well, Apollo never showed up, and so the kids at school, I guess they were teasing him and saying, you don't have a dad, and he was taking quite a beating.
But one day, Apollo showed up and said, yes, indeed, Satan, I am your dad.
I am your father.
And ask anything you want.
After all, I am the sun god.
I can do whatever I want.
And the boy said, let me drive the chariots of the sun.
And Apollo immediately, you know, I can imagine him clapping his hand over his mouth, wishing he had never said anything.
And he said, not that, anything else.
He says, you promise.
So he said, okay, but just be careful.
Keep a steady firm on the reins.
Don't go too high or too low.
And Phaeton, there's no sooner than he had left the stables, supposedly, that the horses felt an unfamiliar hand on the reins, and the chariot of the sun dropped down near the earth and scorched it, and rivers dried up and forests were set on fire, and lakes disappeared from the heat, and men cried out to heaven, went up to heaven, burned heaven, and, you know, it just created tremendous havoc of burning the earth and scorching it.
And I think, supposedly, according to the legend, one of the gods shot him with an arrow and he fell out.
I think it was Apollo the sun god.
But in any case, he died.
And in the Greek legend, the Greek legend of Phaeton, I believe, is the mythologizing of some actual physical events.
People didn't know how to explain.
How did this happen?
Why are this great burnings coming down from the sun and drying up our rivers and scorching our croplands and setting our forests on fire?
And men were crying out in anguish there being destroyed.
And so they make this legend about it.
And they say, well, Faden was driving the chariot of the sun and it went amok.
So we could expect some places, now, because a coronal mass ejection is a toroidal structure, depending on how it hits the Earth, it's not just a big ball, because then you'd get a uniform distribution of energy and it wouldn't necessarily, you know, depending on the size and how big it was, it wouldn't necessarily deliver that much energy.
But in fact, parts of it can actually have a real large current flow, like the core of it.
If the core were to hit the Earth, it could actually melt rocks, you know, for a small area.
I'm not going to say that it's going to do that everywhere, but you'll get a real sudden increase.
I would expect a fast wilting of croplands, something like the Amazon burst into flames.
If Solar Cycle 23 that we're now in continues to build and be the biggest in all recorded history, how long, just a guess, do you think in months or years it might be before such an event could conceivably occur in this solar cycle?
Many, many years ago, I used to be involved in the stereo business and worked with a manufacturer in Germany.
And one thing that made his equipment so fantastic was he used to transformers because that would allow the music impulses to go way beyond its RMS rating, you know, like 80 watts.
It could handle musical impulses of 3 to 4 times the RMS rating.
So if you had a musical impulse, you know, that was demanding 40 watts of RMS or root mean square power, you could actually hit musical impulses up around 360 to 400.
Well, you know, 4 times 4 would be 160 or so.
But it also was extremely efficient, so it enabled to have higher frequencies much easier.
And then also the magnetic field wasn't as strong as a normal.
Okay, what I'm trying to do is to say we've got this twirl effect that's hitting the earth.
And the effects of that on the magnetic field and tying this in with the zero-point concept, you know, of the higher frequency and the lower the magnetic field.
Well, at this time, the magnetic field, there's no dipole field on the Earth when the dipole field is down.
So when the Earth's magnetotoroid is in the poloidal current phase, basically you can't measure a magnetic field.
There's an analog to this in the old memory core chips.
Not chips, but these little iron core memory things of old, really ancient computers.
You just have a soft iron core, just a little ring, basically, and you run a wire through it, send a DC pulse through it, and it sets up a magnetic field.
It stores a locked loop magnetic field that's paroidal.
And as for your guest, Charles, very interesting, very interesting subject.
I have a question about when you said that if this quake should hit, this 10-plus quake should hit in the ocean, it could start off with a 400 or 500-foot wave.
As it comes in land towards, say, the United States, and myself, I live in Worcester, Massachusetts, which is about 53 miles from the coast of Boston.
And you say that it could be a mile high by the time it gets to the shore.
How long would it take a mile-high wave to dissipate?
Well, you know, it really depends on what your shoreline looks like, what the continental shelf off of Massachusetts looks like, and the direction of the wave.
And I really couldn't tell you if it hits the shore.
I'm not going to say that it's going to actually come ashore at a mile high.
I'm saying that there are instances and there are topographies or seafloor topographies that are conducive to producing such waves when they come ashore.
Now, whether that's true off of Massachusetts, I don't know.
So you might be safe along the seashore or you might not be safe 50 miles inland, depending on what altitude you're at.
A person gave me some information about that the sun gives birth to planets and that the sun was supposed to give birth to a new planet soon.
And I didn't know if that was, you know, I don't know much about physics.
I didn't know if that was accurate or not because I know there's many different theories about how planets are formed and I had never heard that before.
Well, and he may very well not know, but God certainly has written it.
I mean, we take a look at what Messiah stated, and, you know, he said great earthquakes in divers places, perplexity, men's hearts failing them for fear, the sea and waves roaring, and then we, and so there we got the earthquakes, we got the tsunamis, and then we get to the last part, which says, then the fourth angel pours out his vial under the sun, and unto him is given power to scorch the earth.
There's an article in there written by two fellows named I think Mike Smeltzor and Michael LeBron.
And they say that about three months ago that they were abducted by aliens, and it's a very, very believable story, and that they got the whole anal probe thing, and the aliens identified themselves as McConnell and Dolan's, and they said that they were called.
Okay, yeah, I just want what I had left to say was I had a little piece of information you might be interested in before you're requesting about a photograph of Mariner 9.
It's in a book titled The Keys of Enoch, put out by the Academy for Future Science.
It shows clearly several pyramids on the surface from 1973 Mariner 9 photograph.
Oh, there's look, there are pyramids all over the globe, not just at Giza, but all over the globe.
And I suppose it bears asking Charles, there are many, Charles, who believe there have been previous civilizations on Earth.
There's a substantial amount of evidence for that.
As a matter of fact, they may have come and gone at points when we had polar reversals.
Who knows?
But the fact is, a lot of people believe that one of these civilizations determined that pyramids have something to do with the human resonance frequency of the Earth itself, and that they were on to some way to try and stop or change what otherwise would occur, which is probably what you've been talking about tonight.
Well, whether you believe it is God, or you believe it is nature, or you believe it is God with his hand in nature, I don't think it makes any difference.
It looks like it may be one of the most active that we have ever recorded.
Now, anytime during this cycle, there could be ejecta that could produce the effect that he has described painstakingly tonight, and you can read about it on the webpage.
He's not saying on such and such date this is going to occur.
He's not a prophet.
He's just saying, here's the effect, and here we are in solar cycle 23.
Yeah, you know, this is a real interesting program.
I've had, well, a rather large tract of land out here, and me and my neighbors have seen these basketball-sized lights that you were talking about earlier.
Well, it certainly is true, Charles, that associated with a lot of UFO sightings have been what appear to be ball lightning.
They have lights that appear on a regular basis and appear to be ball lightning down in Texas in certain areas.
And would it be reasonable to suggest that near large electromagnetic fields produced by whatever, ball lightning would not be as unusual a phenomenon?
No, I don't think that it would be unusual to be produced anytime you've got, if you have a large magnetic field that's changing rapidly, then it induces a large electric field, which then induces a current, which then could produce one.
and more lightning has been known as i said earlier to go down chimneys and come roaring out of our players and go through windows and all the rest of it or there's no question that there's uh...
And I don't think there's actual intelligence involved.
I mean, what do I know?
Maybe there is.
But I think we're just associating this kind of weird action with some sort of intellect.
I actually, you know, really studied that very, very intensely for a while because, you know, there seems to be, yes, that there, I'm not going to rule it out.
And the reason I'm not is because I mentioned what is at the core of these things is a time gradient field, which is the same thing as eternity.
And, you know, we always speak of God who exists in the midst of eternity as a very non-local God is, you know, and that's almost, that's a physical term, non-localism.
And so in fact, so we have a very large structure that's setting around the, that's just like this, a ball lightning type structure that's on the burning bush.
Is there intelligence in that?
You bet.
As you approach that, then you approach eternity.
You come right in basically into the presence of God.
Now, this particular structure also corresponds to a general structure of any intellectual being, I would suspect.
You know, if this archetype form conforms to the structure of, let's say, the general structure of the universe, then you would see that at any different level.
So, you know, could it be?
Certainly.
But it gets off into such a weird area.
But, you know, but I would say, yes, that it could.
Okay, Charles, as we get closer to this possible pull reversal, do you have any expectations about things that just the everyday person might notice that we might be getting closer to it?
And by that, like electrical devices, like computers going on the fritz or any sort of computers.
Ooh, somebody sent a fact saying, did you know, Art, that Aurora Borealis, generally thought to be at a great altitude, has been observed actually near the ground?
I told you now, about three times a year, we've been getting these brief shifts of several degrees, which last anywhere from a day or two to three, and then suddenly it snaps back.
In other words, if, yes, if we are protected by the Earth's magnetic field and it were to collapse, would there be any way to artificially create a field that would give us some temporary protection against more ejecta?
That's beyond our technology and it's beyond our, you know, we don't have that much power.
We couldn't combine all the generating plants in the world and generate spit enough to produce something that would, you know, that could counteract this.
You know, it's a process that's going to happen.
It's not a case of something that, you know, it's kind of like an ant where a wave of the sea comes back.
And the answer is that he began to study ball lightning.
And from the physics of ball lightning, he began to understand the physics of the planet that we live on and the sun that shines in our eyes for X number of hours per day and applied all of that to his conclusions, which, by the way, are readily available on my website to see.
And that is what I recommend that everybody go on up there who can or go to a library and go to my website and just click on the name Charles Cagle and it'll take you immediately to an entire page painstakingly put together by my webmaster from material that Charles sent and you can read about it.
East of the Rockies, you're on there with Charles Kagle.
Well, I know that, you know, it's one of those things that I've read on the websites, you know, and what I've read is that, you know, you've got some big antenna systems that ostensibly could be used to begin oscillating actually the geomagnetic field.
Whether or not, personally, I think it's ill-advised to mess with it.
But, you know, I share that, and of course, Nick Begich, Dr. Begich does, who wrote Angels Don't Play This Harp.
And they are proposing to focus enormous amounts of energy, not widely dispersed on the ionosphere, as you would normally do with the radio transmission, but the other way around, starting as a wide beam and ending as a narrow beam, literally burning a hole in the ionosphere.
And I don't much like the idea myself.
Listen, Charles, what I'm going to do is ask everybody to review my website with all of your material on it.
And I'm going to have you back in a week or so, if you're willing.
And we will cover this more extensively.
It'll give everybody out there about a week to try and absorb what it is you've got on the website.