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June 25, 1997 - Art Bell

02:52:35

Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell - Richard Hoagland - Mir and Pathfinder. Lan Lamphere - UFO in Storm Chaser Video

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01:16:53

richard c hoagland

19:51

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Speaker	Time	Text
unidentified		Welcome to Art Bell Somewhere in Time.
unidentified		Tonight, featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 25th, 1997.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		From the high deserts of great American Southwest, I bid you all good evening or good morning as the case may be across all these time zones.
		Stretching from the Hawaiian and Taishan Island chains in the west, eastward to the Caribbean and the U.S. Virgin Islands, south into South America, north to the Pole, and worldwide on the internet, this is Coast Coast AM, and I'm Mark Bell.
		Well, an extremely interesting day in more ways than one.
		Most of you by now must be well aware of the Russian Mir space station's collision with a cargo craft during a manual docking exercise, underline manual.
		The man was doing it.
		It slammed into one of the solar arrays and actually opened a hole in the main hull, at which point the astronauts and cosmonauts, astronaut and cosmonauts, began to hear a hissing sound and had to close off a whole section of mirror.
		There's been a rather sharp, severe fall in electrical supply, and we're not exactly sure what the status is of Mir right now.
		I can probably tell you more than you're hearing on CNN.
		I can tell you that the gyrodines that keep the mirror in the proper attitude are only apparently functioning during the period of time that Mir is in light and has quite a bit of electrical input from what they do have remaining of the solar arrays.
		I can also tell you that you can hear Mir if you want to.
		I listened to them during two earlier passes today, and my wife, incredibly, heard a third pass after 6 o'clock Pacific time tonight.
		Mir can be heard on VHF at 143.625.
		That's 143.625.
		Now it may be that the farther reaches of my voice out in the islands may yet hear a pass tonight or two.
		And while generally what I heard earlier today on two passes and my wife on a third was all in Russian, as the afternoon wore on, it became apparent that they were extremely tired and stressed, and that's what you could hear in their voice.
		My guess is that we are not being told the whole truth.
		Now, why, for example, do you think I might believe that?
		Do you remember the fire they had on Mir?
		Do you remember how the officials insisted at the time that the Mir fire was minor, easily controlled, short-lived, all that?
		Do you remember that?
		And I told you then that you were not getting the straight poop.
		And I don't think you are now.
		As a matter of fact, the New York Times in breaking news, which I think we pulled off MSNBC, said, only now, this is Associated Press, folks, only now with astronaut Jerry Leineger's recent return from Mir is another terrifying story emerging about the fire last February.
		The fire raged, he said, raged for 14 minutes.
		Flames shot out two feet, smoke choked passageways, and chunks of molten metal spewed from a burning canister blocking one of two routes to the Soyuz escape ship.
		Six men and one lifeboat capable of evacuating no more than three, the situation had seemed too far-fetched for flight controllers to consider seriously until it happened February 23rd on the world's only space station, 250 miles above the Earth.
		Actually, I think it's closer to 300.
		The fire is receiving new scrutiny in light of Wednesday's collision between Mir and a docking cargo ship.
		Both incidents highlight the increasingly precarious condition of the 11-year-old space station, designed, of course, to last only five.
		But I told you then during that fire that it was very serious.
		And in fact, I've got the actual wording here of the well, let me read you some of it.
		Late that Sunday evening, Laniger was working at the computer when the master alarm sounded.
		He'd heard countless alarms during his month aboard Mir, most set off by minor equipment failures.
		Then came the cry, it's serious.
		In the central passageway, Laniger saw dense smoke pouring from the X Vant module.
		That's where a solid-fuel oxygen generating canister was ablaze.
		Smoke began filling the entire station.
		The four Russians, one German and Leineger, swiftly donned oxygen masks.
		Laniger and two cosmonauts fought that fire.
		The three others prepared a Soyuz for evacuation.
		The second Soyuz was out of reach, beyond the fire.
		Now, listen, remember back to when this occurred, and they said there was nothing to it, and I said there was, and people were sending me faxes saying, oh, you're just rolling this up out of control.
		There's nothing serious going on.
		It was a little tiny fire.
		They got it out quickly.
		Bull.
		Continuing, quote, the flame was maybe two feet flying out of this thing.
		It looked like sparklers going off and molten metal flying.
		Laniger said, It almost looked like SRBs, solid rocket boosters on the space shuttle.
		You almost can't look at them.
		They're so bright.
		It was a hot fire.
		Mir's fire extinguishers were useless against the burning lithium.
		The crew could only let the fire burn itself out.
		They turned the extinguishers on the module's walls instead.
		They knew if Mir's aluminum hull ignited and burned through, the station would decompress.
		A quick get into your Soyuz vehicle situation at best.
		Mir was out of contact with Russian mission control when that fire erupted, and Leineber was ready to use a ham radio to alert the Russians through the Johnson Space Center that, quote, an evacuation is a possibility.
		Get ready for it, end quote.
		He never made the call.
		He had no time.
		We needed, he said, another fire extinguisher, so I went for it.
		The flames finally died down, but ten more minutes passed before the smoke began to clear.
		Vapor from the fire extinguishers had condensed on pipes.
	Ash was everywhere.
	Miraculously, damage was minimal, and the crew suffered no serious injury.
	But it was close.
	Very close.
	So I must tell you that the reason I read all that to you is because I warn when these things are occurring every time as I now warn you that this is more serious than they are telling you right now.
	Now, if you monitor tomorrow, tomorrow morning, the signal on 143.625, you can listen to Mir directly.
	They're broadcasting on VHF directly.
	And you can listen to them.
	143.625.
	I want you to pay attention to something for me.
	You will notice, as I noticed, and friends of mine have noticed, that I'm in contact with quite a number of people who are monitoring as well.
	You will see a very sharp fluctuation in their signal strength, going from, at times, if you've got a near pass, 60 over 9, down to 0.
	Now, what that means is they are tumbling.
	This is not being reported in the press, but there can be no question about it.
	I watched the signal strength myself, and it went from pegging the needle, as the phrase goes, in other words, as strong as you can get, to zero.
	And it would do that cyclically.
	Now, that indicates the space station is tumbling, and they're not telling you that.
	Now, what does that mean?
	Well, certainly it means that they would have a difficult time and may not be able to get control of that spacecraft, and nothing, of course, could dock to it.
	Why they tried to dock with this cargo craft is in itself a mystery, because Mir at the time was not safe, and the docking control was done manually.
	So, and we've got legislators trying to get Dan Golden, in the meantime, to certify in writing, and Dan Golden is not one of my favorite guys, but this is nuts, to certify in writing that it's safe.
	In other words, they're saying, in effect to Dan Golden, here, put your name here and tell us it's safe.
	And if something happens, it's your career butt.
	And I don't think Dan Golden can do that at best.
	Space is not a safe place to be.
	For man, it's tentative.
	And we do the best we can, but it's not safe.
	And if I was Dan Golden, I'll be damned if I'd put my name on a piece of paper saying I guarantee they're going to be safe.
	Because in my opinion, they are not at all safe in Mir right now.
	Nor are they going to be.
	It was designed the last five years, and it's a rickety, falling apart rattle trap.
	So I think they're not at all safe.
	And if you have the means to monitor, I suggest you do and listen to their somewhat over-deviated, very serious tones.
	And if you're used to listening to them, you'll note the very stressful nature of their voices from Mir.
	Anyway, in a moment, we'll get a bit of an update from Richard C. Hoagland.
	Then I've got a number of other things for you and we will move into open lines.
unidentified		Groan
		You're listening to Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
		Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 25, 1997.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Here, let us go to Manhattan and see what update and information we can pull from the, no doubt, somewhat tired but nevertheless awake Richard C. Hoagland, Ingstrom Science Award winner, Visor de NASA, and Walter Cronkite at one time.
		Richard, good morning.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		And you're right, it is a little tiring this year.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		It's about 99 degrees.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		The humidity is 95%.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, my.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		And the phone never stops ringing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that could cause a person to eventually begin throwing things.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		Or maybe move.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Anyway, serious occurrences on Mir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Very serious.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		Very serious.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		I woke up this morning and I couldn't believe my ears, and John Holloman was on, and I was about to do a two-hour program with a friend of ours, Mike Murphy, in Kansas City.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		And Mike sends his kind regards.
		He keeps asking me, he says, don't you love me anymore?
		He says, you keep doing art show and you never do my show anymore.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I mean, you're awake during my show.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		That's what I told him.
		No, Mike and I have gone back about 10 years.
		I've known Mike and done probably, oh, maybe 500 shows on the update of the investigation as we've gone forward.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		So I figured this morning I needed to spend two hours, and it was one heck of a two hours because I knew what was going on before I could get to you because, of course, you have different hours than Michael, and I had to wait until you were maybe conscious.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		And then you told me that you had, just before you had gone to bed yesterday morning, as you were ending your show, you had heard the first flash that something was going on upstairs.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Actually, that's not totally accurate.
		I got off the air and I was doing an interview at WGST in Atlanta, and I heard the news as I was waiting to begin the interview myself.
		So that's how late it came through.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		Well, I must say when I saw Holloman doing his report, and I have not really even tried to reach him today because I know that he's totally overwhelmed by this.
		The only thing I could think of instantly, my first reaction was, what astonishing coincidence.
		Because this accident happened at the same time, exactly, as the one-day delayed Mars Pathfinder burned.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, maybe this will help break the ice for you.
		Let me read a short fact.
		One has heard of diversionary tactics, of course, but side-swiping a space station does reflect a certain rheumatic flair.
		Question, who's going to notice a little glitch in the firing of a rocket on Pathfinder when the lives of three men are at stake in such gripping circumstances?
		That's from somebody who signs himself CloudSifter.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		I concur.
		This is, again, a tragedy because there are three men who are up there, I think, under very serious circumstances tonight.
		I think I concur with you that their conditions are much more extreme than the media are being permitted to relate to us.
		Not because someone's putting a hold on it, but because most of the people who are reporting the story, John accepted, just don't understand what it is like to live and maybe die in space.
		I mean, they really don't understand the severity.
		When you told me that you personally knew from your own data, from the short wave, that that signal is going up and down and in and out, that means the whole thing is tumbling, very gradually tumbling end over end.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Actually, not that gradually.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And that's the other problem.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		That severe then.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I know.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		What are the rates?
		What's the frequency?
		What's the total period between loss of signal and regaining it?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		About 10 seconds, 12 seconds.
unidentified		What?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		That means you're going either in and out of an antenna pattern off the solar panels very rapidly, or the whole thing could not be rotating in 10 seconds.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There could be additional reflections causing it.
		But it is a zero-to-full-scale change when you hear it, Richard.
		It's quite serious.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		In 1960, I'm going to reach back into ancient history here.
		In 1965 or 1996, Neil Armstrong was in command of Gemini 8.
		And they had launched successfully.
		It was supposed to be the first docking with the Agena spacecraft, the upper stage that would be sent up a day before on the Atlas.
		And it was a practice for the ultimate rendezvous and docking en route to the moon in Apollo many years later.
		Over the Pacific, they successfully tracked and caught up with and docked with the Agena.
		And then something happened, as you all now know, and one of the thrusters stuck open on the nose of the Gemini.
		And the rates built up to something like 10 revs per second so fast that they were in danger of losing consciousness because of blood being forced away from their outer extremities, including their heads, their brains.
		And Houston, of course, did not know what was going on.
		They were out of communication range.
		In those days, we didn't have Teedra satellites.
		We had widely spaced ground tracking and chips.
		So Armstrong very coolly, ultimately decided that the mission was lost unless they disengaged, and he fired his retro, his emergency RCS reaction control system, and then SEPT separated from the Agena and it went spinning off into the darkness.
		Well, we almost lost two astronauts on that mission because of rapid rotation.
		If what you're telling me is accurate, and of course I have no reason to believe it's not, the rates on Mir are very high to the point where I would begin to wonder about structural integrity because those panels, this thing is an incredible fragile butterfly.
		It is not meant to rotate or tumble or spin.
		It's meant to sit motionless, locked on the sun.
		The other problem is if it has any significant rotation rates, if they're not able to control it with the rate gyros and the massive reaction wheels that were used similar to what we have in Skylab.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, well let me stop you there.
		They've got something called gyrodines on board.
		Now these have to be powered up and my understanding is that while Mira's in sunlight they are powering the gyrodines but while it's in the darkness without the battery reserve they are not powering the gyrodines and that's what keeps them in a stable attitude.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		Except they're not stable.
unidentified		Exactly.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		And it sounds to me like they're doing a very delicate and dangerous pirouette between control and total loss of control.
		The problem is really very simple.
		It's power.
		Panels are facing the sun.
		They're able to charge the batteries.
		If they turn off the sun by even 20, 30 degrees, the efficiency of the solar conversion is way down.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Way down, sure.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		Which means they're doing this delicate dance between powering up the reaction control system, which is these spinning disks of matter, which basically, with action and reaction, cause the station to rotate opposite the direction of the spin of the wheels.
		And they're trying to keep those panels facing the sun, but they don't have enough power on the night side pass from the batteries to do it, nor can they afford to do it.
		So they're going back and forth, back and forth.
		And it sounds very hairy, Art.
		It really sounds like if I were projecting the fate of this mission, I would say in the next day or so, they're going to make the decision to bring them home.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I would agree with you.
		I mean, it may not happen.
		And then I heard one other thing privately today.
		I heard that there's a possibility that even if they decide to scuttle the mission, they might leave the commander or the commander of the mirror may choose to remain on board while the science officer and our American astronaut use Soyuz to escape.
		Do you think they would do that?
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		No.
		No.
		I mean, there's the tradition of the sea.
		The commander stays with the ship.
		But space is a little different, and they would bring them all home because there'd be nothing that one man could do.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, we'll talk about Soyuz in a moment.
		We're at the bottom of the hour.
		Richard C. Hogland is with us for a bit.
unidentified		This is Premier Networks.
		That was Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM on this Somewhere in Time.
		Why don't you ask him what's going on?
		Why don't you ask him what's going on?
		Don't say that you love me.
		Just tell me that you love me.
		Why don't you ask him what's going on?
		Why men sing, only fools are the cheap.
		But I'm getting in the day, falling in love with you.
		Now, we take you back to the past on Art Bell Somewhere in Time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Can you tell my wife this?
		Good morning, everybody.
		Wise men rush in.
unidentified		Or only fools rush in.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And maybe wise men, too.
		It depends on how much knowledge you have.
		I'm talking about investing here.
		Pretty tricky little segway, huh?
unidentified		sad music
		You're listening to Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
		Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 25, 1997.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Back now to Richard C. Hoagland.
		Richard.
		Yes, sir.
		I've got a number of other things I want to ask you about, but the obvious is, again, by facts, I'm getting a lot of facts, so obviously people are thinking about it.
		If Mr. Hoagland's grand scheme is coming to fruition, then it may be possible the accident was not an accident, that in fact it was intended to remove any human presence from Earth orbit such that they, in quotes, could perform certain operations unseen.
		Now, that's really a leap, in my opinion.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I mean, we're into the area of obvious, I mean, it's understandable that people would be speculating because, again, this is so stunningly coincidental.
		We have been, I mean, I've been involved in space operations in one way or another, you know, at NASA or at CBS for 30, 30-some years.
		And I can literally count on one hand, a couple of fingers on one hand, a dramatic moment in space history equivalent to what is going on upstairs tonight.
		The Apollo, I'm sorry, the Gemini 8 mission, which I just recounted back in the mid-60s.
		Sitting with an old friend of mine, Mark Kramer, at CBS.
		We were the only folks on the floor because the mission was so boring, Apollo 13.
		We're sitting there with our feet up.
		We just ordered dinner in from one of New York's great restaurants, and we're watching the TV from Houston closed circuit.
		CBS was not carrying the TV that night because people were bored with, oh-hum, going to the moon again.
		And I watched Jim Lovell spin his tape recorder in Zero Gravity in the Lunar Module and play 2001 while the camera showed behind him the moon and out the other window the Earth in color.
		An eerie, wondrous moment.
		But I was one of the only ones seeing it because nobody was relaying it over the network, either our network or NBC or ABC, which were the only networks we had in those days.
		And then, of course, that fateful, chilling call, Houston, we've had a problem.
		But those were moments when people would leap to all kinds of possible speculations, yet they were very rare.
		They were few and far between.
		In the whole history of the space program, we've only had a couple of other moments where men trying to conquer the last frontier really were in danger, serious danger.
		Tonight, we have another.
		What strikes me as so remarkable about what's going on tonight Is that simultaneous with this very now visible manned drama playing out in the skies overhead, we have an unmanned drama taking place millions and millions of miles away, a few million miles away from the planet Mars.
		We have a modern spacecraft, Pathfinder, which today, coincidentally, was supposed to carry out a very small but vital maneuver.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Have you heard anything about that?
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		I am on the computer right now.
		I have the NASA AIMS, I'm sorry, NASA Pathfinder website up.
		I am plugged into something called the ground data system.
		And I am reading data from June 23, 1997, day 174, at 447 GMT.
		I am looking at uplink data, downlink data, whatever.
		there is nothing in any other nassau website in any place that i or any of my colleagues am able to find all day long on the status of this crucial mars pathfinder burn no wonder why that would be and it's been twelve hours the the spacecraft was commanded your time this morning when they told us about the upload for the burn that certainly made a new city to go there so why not uh...
		the results of it or at the fact that it you might not know the results because to know the results meaning how effective the engine firing work you have to have tracking have to have time to literally track it and see whether the course deviates from the plan course but the fact that there's no update you know burn successfully completed spacecraft turns back to earth lock that kind of thing and it's been over thirteen hours now since the burn was completed.
		And the last data we can find anywhere on the net is from the 23rd, two days ago, I find just a tad suspicious.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Strange.
		Very strange, Richard.
		I want to read you something, and I want to get your reaction to it.
		So that's where Pathfinder is, folks.
		In other words, we don't know a damn thing about the burn, one way or the other.
		The data on the NASA website has simply stopped.
		And from any source, we can gather nothing.
		That is the status of Pathfinder.
		Curious.
		Despite enormous danger, huge expense, and a clear alternative solar power supply, the U.S. government is pushing ahead with the deployment of nuclear technology in space in October of 1997.
		NASA plans, get this folks, to launch the Cassini probe to Saturn, carrying with it 72.3 pounds of plutonium-238 fuel, the largest amount of plutonium ever used in space.
		The probe will sit atop a Lockheed Martin Belt Titan IV rocket.
		The same kind of rocket has undergone a series of mishaps, including a 1993 explosion in California soon after takeoff that destroyed a $1 billion satellite system and sent its fragments falling into the Pacific Ocean.
		Space News, the industry trade newspaper, reported that, quote, the high risk and cost of Cassini mission to Saturn troubled NASA Administrator Daniel Golden so much that he would cancel the program if it were not so important to planetary science, end quote.
		Richard, just a question for you.
		If 72.3 pounds of plutonium-238 were to somehow get scattered into the ocean or onto the Earth or both, what would the result be?
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		Well, there would be an increase in the cancer deaths due to the inhalation of plutonium oxide.
		That's the primary concern.
		That's a horrible worst-case scenario.
		Now, let me tell you why that's not really, very realistic.
		When I was with Gronkite, one of the things that we dealt with was the fact that during every Apollo mission, NASA launched on a Saturn V, which was the equivalent of a tactical atomic bomb in terms of 3,000 tons of fuel lifting off from Cape Canaveral.
		The ALSEP experiments powered by radioactive plutonium, radioisotope thermoelectric generators, hung on the outside of the lunar module up under the, or inside the shroud below the command module as the rocket lifted off from the Cape.
		And there obviously was, at that point, a concern that if the worst case scenario occurred, meaning an explosion, or if the spacecraft somehow inadvertently re-entered before leaving for the moon, that plutonium in those casks would somehow suffer the fate of the article that you just read.
		And to seek to prevent that from happening, the Atomic Energy Commission, which is what the agency was then in charge of nuclear regulatory materials in this country, together with NASA conducted an exhaustive series of tests, many of which we saw in excruciating detail on slow-motion film and all kinds of other things.
		They would take these casks and they would literally put them between two 70-ton diesel locomotives racing at 70, 80 miles an hour at each other.
		And they would smash these locomotives into each other with the casks in between.
		And nothing fractured.
		Nothing broke.
		Nothing was spilled.
		So they have designed these fuel casks to handle this plutonium in a way that is so close to foolproof, given the actual experimental evidence, that I really don't think that's a serious problem.
		And in counterpoint, I might remind everyone that during Apollo 13, because the astronauts looped around the moon in the lunar module and came home in it as a lifeboat, that ALCEP nuclear fuel cask on the outside stayed exactly where it was.
		And it re-entered the Earth's atmosphere somewhere, I believe, southwest of New Zealand.
		And NASA sent up Sniffer aircraft, which of course we were concerned with, looking for radiation after the entry.
		And they found nothing.
		They were very sensitive.
		So to me, this is not a serious concern.
		It is much more of another mechanism of attacking an agency that I think needs scrutiny and needs critique.
		But on this issue, I do not think that the concern is valid given that we have a tremendous database and decades of proven performance, and the risk is so small as to be as close to zero as I can.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, Dan Golden himself, though, was saying that if it was not so important, planetary issues.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		Well, when did he say that?
		I'd like to know, because you see, on the Cassini mission, there is no other option.
		You can't go to solar power.
		You can see now in near, in Earth orbit, which is 20 times, 30 times closer to the Sun, no, no, I'm sorry, 10 times closer to the Sun than Saturn is, that you need massive amounts of power and solar cells, solar arrays just won't even hack it if you have a small problem.
		Cassini, which is being launched as a compact spacecraft, could not unfurl enough solar panels to power it in any useful mission at Saturn's distance from the Sun.
		So you're really limited to nuclear power unless, and this is a very important unless, unless you bring online hyperdimensional technologies such as were demonstrated on Good Morning America.
		So I would prefer, if Dan Golden is really serious, to have him sit down with us or with you or with Gene Maloff or whatever and discuss real space power, which is non-contaminating, which is infinite, which could power any number of missions and do all kinds of neat things.
		And I don't think that's going to happen in a short period of time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, let me just continue a little bit with what I've got here and see how you react to it.
		Let's see.
		I'm trying to get the.
		Here we go.
		Chief Scientist Francis Cordova acknowledges that the Titan IV does not have a 100% success rate and admits that using it for Cassini is, quote, truly putting all your eggs in one basket, your 18 instruments on one firecracker, she says.
		Quote, we can't fail with that mission.
		It would be very, very damaging for the agency, to say nothing of the Earth and the life on it if something goes wrong.
		Plutonium has long been described by scientists as the most toxic substance known.
		It is so toxic, according to Dr. Helen Cannecott, founder of Physicians for Social Responsibility, that less than one millionth of a gram is a carcinogenic dose.
		One pound, if uniformly distributed, could hypothetically induce lung cancer in every person on earth.
		That would be one pound.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		Well, of course, it would not be uniformly distributed.
		It would be focused at the site of the disaster.
		And most of the concerns that I have seen are not concerns expressed during the launch.
		They are concerns expressed because of the trajectory which is being designed by the spacecraft engineers to bring Cassini back around near the Earth for a kind of a powered swing-by out to Saturn, a kind of a gravity assist maneuver.
		And concern has been raised that NASA may miss, that they may target it too close to the Earth, and instead of missing the Earth and making a kind of a screaming left-hand turn and being tossed into the outer solar system, it may re-enter.
		That's been the concern that I have seen.
		In which case, if that were to take place and the fuel cask were to rupture or burn through or any of the other scenarios, you would, yes, have plutonium in a streak across the skies of wherever the entry point was located.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		73 pounds of it.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		73 pounds.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		The fact of the matter is that we have had comparable amounts on the most catastrophic disaster we've experienced in the space age, which is Apollo 13, when that plutonium on that lunar module re-entered at 25,000 miles per hour over the Pacific and nothing was found.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		No matter what we believe about what's going on with respect to Mir right now, there is one truth.
		And I'm not suggesting that there was anything intentional about this terrible Mir situation.
		But certainly the news of it has completely swallowed even the Roswell fiasco of the other day that was front and center in the news.
		And of course, as you point out, any Pathfinder questions or news at all, it has consumed all of that.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		Well, what I was trying to say earlier is that we had actual human beings calling NASA headquarters and Ames and JPL on the phone trying to get press representatives, public affairs officers, to answer the simple question, did it work?
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		And no one could be reached by phone.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Nobody could talk.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		And the fact that people like John Holloman and others are totally tied up and now preoccupied by forthrightly, I mean, they definitely should have their concerns is the safety of these three men.
		The fact that, I mean, I didn't even feel in good conscience I could call Holloman and say, why don't you give JPL a call and find him a Pathfinder?
		Because I know as a news person that his priority had to be with the lives of those three men, and frankly, I would not, we could find that out ourselves, except nobody was answering the phones.
		And what I think is going on in the most non-conspiratorial light is that when space is like a family, you know, even in the good old days during the Cold War, we and the Russians and the other space programs were much closer than was publicly acknowledged.
		There is a camaraderie of spirit.
		There is a respect for people who risk their lives for knowledge.
		And the cosmonauts and the astronauts have always had tremendous respect for each other.
		That percolates down through the whole system.
		So all of NASA is grappling with, in whatever function that they can grapple, with the problem potentially of bringing Mike Foley home and the other guys home and potentially solving this.
		And I can see an awful lot of talent that normally would have been available to, let's say, run the numbers on Pathfinder's Burn suddenly and logically and naturally being co-opted to this more pressing problem just because they want to help.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Gee, you know, I looked at Leineger go down into the Soyuz.
		They had some film of that before he left the station, demonstrating what it would be like to have to use the Soyuz.
		And he said, well, actually, when he got down here and he was all humped over, he said, it's quite comfortable.
		I can only imagine three fully suited astronauts, cosmonauts, and one astronaut, all cramped up inside this little Soyuz returning to Earth.
		It didn't look comfortable at all to me.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		When I was at the Cape during the launch of Paula Soyuz, which was the 1975 mission after Skylab, where Deke Slayton was in command and we went up and rendezvoused for the first time with the Russians, I was at Cape Canaveral and I got an extraordinary opportunity to meet the Russian poet Yeftoshenko and to see the actual spacecraft that the Russians had brought over to Cape Canaveral.
		And the thing that struck me were two things.
		One is the rivets on the outside.
		And two, it was so cramped inside with valves and plumbing and pipes and all that that one of our guys, Tom Stafford, said, look, he says, I'll rendezvous with it, but I'll be damned if I'll go up in it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Really?
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		And that was back in 1975.
		The Russian technology is boilerplate.
		It is much more primitive.
		Now, it's also sturdy.
		Lou Friedman from the Planetary Society was on CNN as you were coming on the air on radio tonight, and he was being interviewed, and he made some very appropriate remarks about It is a testimony to the backups and the brute force nature of the Russian space technology.
		You know, it's almost like one of those John Cameron Swayze commercials takes a licking and keeps on ticking.
unidentified		Sure.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		I mean, our spacecraft can't be banged around and hit on the side and bounced from one end of the cosmos to the other and still function, just keep people alive.
		This thing is sturdy, it's robust.
		If it fails, it won't be because the Russians haven't been brilliant in designing and over-designing and over and over and over-designing.
		It's because it's old, it's aging, and it's being put to a punishment it was never designed for.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, one last question.
		Dan Golden is being urged by certain legislative leaders to sign a statement, Richard, certifying that Mir is safe for an American astronaut.
		And as much as I may disagree with Dan Golden at times, to sign such a statement would be insane, wouldn't it?
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		I think so.
		And I think that we have to view this as part of a larger possibility.
		All right.
		And I'll leave everyone on this thought.
		It is conceivable, in fact, it is something we have to think about, that the accident today was not anything internally directed, but in fact something that happened for external reasons.
		That in fact we are not being given the straight story on the accident, that maybe something else occurred up there.
unidentified		Well, I know where you're going with that.
richard c hoagland ▲ ● ▼		In which case, the space program as a whole is under attack.
		And what I saw from Sensenbrenner is a simultaneous ground attack on NASA, together with the very hard story that we're seeing overhead.
		If that all happens, I will remind everyone that on the reverse speech of Savage and Billard, there is a strange statement on your website, on our website regarding NASA being killed, NASA under attack.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
		Yes, indeed.
		And if you think that's something, I'm going to have David on Friday with the reversals of the Colonel who did the Roswell news conference.
		So that'll be Friday night.
		Richard, thank you, my friend.
unidentified		We will keep you updated.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, indeed.
		Thank you.
		And good night.
		Get some good sleep.
		Richard C. Hoagland from Manhattan.
unidentified		The trip back in time continues with Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM.
		More Somewhere in Time coming up.
		It's alright, it's coming up.
		We gotta get right back to where we started going Love is good, love can be strong We gotta get right back to where we started going It started wrong Oh, oh, oh Oh, oh, oh The day it showed me, when you first came my way, I said no one could take your place.
		Get hurt.
		Premier Networks presents Art Bell somewhere in time tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 25th, 1997.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Alright, we are covering at once many stories.
		We're covering the collision on Mirror, which appears to be more serious than the media, CNN, and others are telling you right now.
		If you wish to monitor Mirror for yourself, 143.625 megahertz will enable you to do so.
		So if you have a scanner, even with a short antenna, tomorrow beginning at about 10 o'clock through, oh, I don't know, 2 or so, 3 in the afternoon, you will hear a pass.
		Listen closely during that pass.
		They'll be speaking Russian.
		What you want to be listening for is a rapid increase and decrease in signal strength, which I observed today along with others.
		Now that would indicate that the Mir space station is tumbling, which is not being reported in the news.
		The situation is probably far more serious than they're actually reporting.
		But you never know.
		You really never know.
		What we do know, though, is that that minor fire that was reported on Mir some time ago was not, in fact, minor at all, raged for 14 minutes and actually burned until it burned out.
		And the damn fire nearly caught the hull on fire.
		It was extremely serious.
		And at the time, of course, they did not tell us about it.
		So we will simply continue to monitor this story.
		They do have the Soyuz spacecraft, and they can, if they have to, I guess, return to Earth.
		We hope.
		Now, John Holloman earlier in the day briefly mentioned that because of the power problems, they might have actual trouble powering up Soyuz.
		Could we get a spacecraft in place to do a rescue if we had to?
		Yes, but it would take days.
		They'd probably have to bring Atlantis out and prepare it for launch.
		So all day long, I have been carefully monitoring and talking to a lot of people about what's going on at Mir.
		And we are not, as you might imagine, we are not getting the entire story.
		In a moment, I've got kind of an unusual story for you, and I'll give you a brief description of the outline of how I got on to this fellow in a second.
unidentified		Gunshot
		You're listening to Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
		Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 25th, 1997.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Coast to Coast AM I got a fact from a fellow broadcaster who wishes not to be named this morning with regard to a company called Wind Chaser.
		Wind Chaser.
		Yes, that's it.
		A Storm Chaser.
		Now, this man apparently, according to my facts, taped a storm a few weeks ago, and later in examining the tape in slow motion and freeze frame, he discovered an unknown object in the sky.
		The ABC-TV affiliate in Oklahoma City, KLCO Television, showed the tape on Tuesday night.
		The object is cylindrical, traveling at an estimated speed of 9,000 miles an hour.
		It traveled more than seven miles in less than two seconds.
		The Storm Chaser is Lan, I'm going to take a shot at this.
		Lamphir.
		Lan Lamphir.
		And as a matter of fact, I'm hoping that my webmaster is listening.
		Keith, are you?
		There is apparently a still rendition of this photograph at www.windchaser.com.
		Now, I'll confirm that with Lan here in a moment.
		www.windchaser.com.
		So I'd like to get a link into that if I could, Keith, if you happen to be up and listening.
		Let us go to Lan.
		Is it Lamphere?
unidentified		Yes, it's Lamphere, L-A-M-P-H-E-R-E.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
		I'll be darned.
		That was just a wild guess on my part.
unidentified		Very good, very good.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Lan, back in the 60s at Amarillo Air Force Base in Texas, when that base existed, a very good friend of mine, now a weatherman down in Lake Charles, Louisiana, Lynn Whitlake and myself, used to chase tornadoes, many of them right all the way up into Oklahoma, you know, severe thunder cells, waiting for tornadoes, and we caught many.
		And at that time, took 8mm stuff that we sold to local TV stations, and we did this in a Volkswagen.
		How we ever lived through that, I'll never know, but it was a great passion of mine.
		You are a storm chaser?
unidentified		Yes, that's correct.
		I am a storm chaser.
		It's a crazy breed.
		Yeah, we are.
		The camaraderie among us is very intense.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		To say the least.
		It's a compulsion.
		It's a passion.
		And there's no way that you can see cells building to 55 or 60,000 feet without getting in a vehicle and moving.
unidentified		I have to agree with that.
		That's correct.
		It really is.
		It is a passion.
		It's something that I really enjoy doing.
		As a matter of fact, Build Magazine about a month and a half ago quoted me as saying that I would rather have a good storm than a woman.
		I don't know how true that is, but they did say that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you stand by that, Tim?
unidentified		Yeah, sometimes I do.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I hate to say it, but I understand exactly what you're saying.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How long have you been chasing storms?
unidentified		I've been chasing storms for about seven years now, off and on.
		We've just in and out of Alabama, where I'm originally from, actually where my mother lives, we put it that way.
		And she has a disease called lupus erythematosus.
		And I've been with her for a long time.
		And we decided to, my family, I have four children and my wife, Melissa, who I love dearly, decided to move to Norman for Wind Chaser, the company based out of Gatsden, Alabama.
		We moved out here to catch our own video, actually, for a movie that we're putting together based on Storm Chasers.
		It'll be released in about two months.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That sounds interesting.
unidentified		Very well.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What were you doing when you caught this object on tape?
unidentified		I was arguing with Tom Filiagi, to be honest with you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you guys had video just rolling.
unidentified		Right.
		We had set up a film camera on the storm.
		It was a very nice, very tight RFD coming into this storm where it's a rear-flanking downdraft.
		It was punching into this mezzo.
		And we were on Highway 53, about five miles west of Loco, Oklahoma.
		Clear as a bell, real nice.
		We had a really nice queue or cumulus going up in front of us.
		The RFD was kicking in, so I decided to set the still camera up and the time-lapse camera up on it.
		And so we did.
		You'll have to excuse me.
		I'm a little sleepy.
		I've had phone call after phone call after phone call after this is aired.
		Anyway, we set the film camera up on it.
		We were doing time-lapse photography on it.
		And I decided we had just purchased a brand new Panasonic AGEC1.
		This is basically a mini camcorder.
		It shoots a DV60 film.
		It's above broadcast quality.
		It's basically a beta SP is what it is.
		Set it up on it.
		We just started rolling in real time on it.
		Had a 0.5mm lens on the front of a 60mm lens, which kind of brought it up to the wide-angle lens.
		I zoomed in a little bit.
		I was Just filming this mezzo, I was actually arguing with Tom Filiagi, Matt Moreland, and Jared Bostic, a dear friend of mine, as to what the storm was going to do.
		During the process of me arguing with them, it just dawned on me, as you'll hear on the video when this is released, that they have not seen the tornado forming to the right into the front of the mezzo as of yet.
		And it dawned on me that once it had dawned on me, I looked at them and I said, what are you talking about?
		And he's like, I'm talking about that mezzo.
		And I said, well, I'm talking about that tornado.
		And what you hear in the background is Matt Moreland, who is a very educated storm chaser.
		He's a trained meteorologist.
		He used to work at National Severe Storms Lab.
		He screams, oh my God, and he runs and he grabs his camera.
		And we just continue to talk about this and let the cameras roll.
		Two weeks later, I'm helping a friend of mine named Charles Edwards, who owns and runs Cloud9 Tours here based out of Norman.
		And I had helped him with a Japanese film crew that had come in and booked the last two weeks of his tour season and was shooting a documentary for Japanese television on Tokyo based on the movie Twister.
		They were kind of doing a parody of the movie Twister.
		So they actually rented helicopters and did flyby.
		So it was rather interesting.
		We got a taste of Hollywood doing that.
		Anyway, they had taken off to the Gerald, Texas, which I felt very bad about.
		There was a very massive tornado.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		A very, very devastating tornado.
		I saw the damage.
		And they had taken off down there to go get some damage footage, which is, you know, media.
		Sure.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
unidentified		Yeah, it's what makes the headlines.
		So they took off down there to get it.
		And they had really missed the good storms that we had run on.
		Matt Moreland, excuse me, not Matt Moreland, Matt Biddle, the rap Matt Biddle, and myself and Charles had been assisting.
		We had been assisting Charles with this entire thing.
		He had had a fellow Chaser quit him in the middle of the season that was involved with Cloud9 Tours.
		So we were all lending a hand to Charles.
		We basically got this cheese NATO down south of the Mesa, and it was really, really bad.
		I mean, it was the only thing the Japanese had to star in their film, so we kind of felt bad about that.
		When we got back to Norman, I had about two days' worth of rest, and Charles called me up about 9 o'clock in the morning.
		He's telling me that the Japanese would like to get some of the footage that we had shot Memorial Day weekend.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
unidentified		The Blanchard Tornado, Purcell, Duncan Tornadoes.
		So I and Matt Morland sat down in front of our editing machine, and we threw this video together.
		And his off High 8, mine off digital.
		And we took it up to the Hampton Inn and Norman, just off I-35.
		We went into the conference room.
		We all sat down.
		There's about 12, 13 of us in there, the Japanese crew, the producers, the directors, the cameramen, the gophers, the whole nine yards.
		I'm sitting back talking with Matt, who's sitting to my left, who had brought a friend along with him, and I had just met him.
		And the producer, not excuse me, producer, the director, Mike, who's based out of New York, turned to me and said, so Land, what are we looking at?
		And I said, well, I looked up at the screen and said, well, we're looking at a wall cloud and informing tornado to the right.
		And he says, no, that's not what I'm talking about.
		So he ran it back.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		And what appeared to be a baseball at first had, you know, looked like something had been thrown in front of the camera lens flashed across the screen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let me be clear.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This was Memorial Day?
unidentified		No, not Memorial Day.
		This was the Sunday, the 25th.
		All right, all right.
		This is when it was taken.
		Okay.
		I was on this one shot.
		This is like two weeks later.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, I'm okay.
unidentified		Okay.
		Anyway, he looks at me and this white object appeared to be white at the time, flashed from right to left, and it went into the hell core.
		I'm thinking, what in the world is this?
		And I said, well, rewind that, Mike.
		And he rewound it.
		And we looked at it about two more times.
		Well, right off the bat, I was offered a very large sum of money for this tape, and I declined.
		And I got up, for personal reasons, I declined.
		I got up and I ejected the tape out of the TV, which was, you know, it's one of these VCR TV combination things.
		Sure.
		And the tape popped out.
		I grabbed it.
		I turned around and I thanked everyone for inviting me and that I was not interested in selling my video at the time.
		And I politely left and went home.
		I looked at the tape on my VTR and ran it back frame by frame by frame by frame and noticed what this thing was doing and realized that it wasn't a piece of debris.
		It wasn't a baseball.
		It wasn't a cowl.
		It wasn't a desk.
		It wasn't a deep freezer.
		It wasn't a lot of things.
		And I looked at it.
		I finally come to the conclusion that I didn't know what it was.
		And I threw my hand in my face and my hands.
		It just kind of rolled off on my right side and fell on the floor and said, oh my God.
		And since then, my life has kind of changed.
		It really has.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You've never been a ufologist type person.
unidentified		Absolutely not.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I've never coined.
unidentified		No, I am a storm chaser.
		That is what we do.
		Wind Chaser Films specializes in chasing severe weather worldwide.
		That's what we do.
		My executive producer, Sharon Ramsey, she's based out of Gadston, Alabama.
		She has put a lot of money out for us to go out here and form a new company in a new direction.
		What Wind Chaser does is if you are a scientist, if you are, and I'm not plugging in the company, I'm just trying to explain.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, that's fine.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You can go right ahead and plug in your company.
unidentified		Okay, I'm not plugging you.
		I really am not.
		What Wind Chaser does, if a scientific research group or an independent research group or a corporation needs to do any type of research on weather for any private type of industry, for example, a remote sensing unit for tornado, Things like that.
		We go out, we can be contracted to go out and film with a trained meteorologist to gather data, to gather the information that the company needs.
		At the same time, Wind Chaser films this information, compacts it, puts it together in a presentable package, and then we give it to the company.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, your life is really exciting enough without UFOs.
unidentified		Yeah, I really had no idea.
		I have never given the thought UFOs.
		A UFO is defined as an unidentified flying object.
		I have never even called, and this is on the record, I've never called this object a UFO simply because I do not know if it's flying or if it's falling.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, you heard the facts I read.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Were the estimated speeds probably correct?
unidentified		No.
		I just received the facts from an OU student, Oklahoma University student here, who has really put a lot of time and energy into this.
		I'm not going to say his name.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's fine.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What does it conclude?
unidentified		He concludes that this object, during the 49 frames that this object exists.
		Okay, now let me back up here.
		When I say 49 frames, there are 30 frames per second in video.
		They run left to right.
		Now there are 49 frames.
		That puts it just over a minute.
		I mean, a second.
		A second and a half.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		By two frames.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		Okay.
unidentified		This object travels right to left over a distance of a 75 degree angle, wide angle lens, in a second and a half.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Which would mean an estimated speed of 18,900 miles an hour.
unidentified		My, my.
		Mach 25.
		Yes, it's very impressive.
		I had a meteorologist with KOCO tonight.
		I don't have a beef with him, but I really have to disagree with him.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Space ice.
unidentified		Space ice.
unidentified		I can see, he called it cosmic ice, to quote him correctly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Cosmic ice.
unidentified		Can you imagine a piece of ice entering our atmosphere with all the tiles that the shuttle has on it, okay, to protect it from heat and protect it from all the velocity stresses that's placed on the object, I mean, the space shuttle itself.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It would have dissolved before you could have ever dissolved it.
unidentified		Way long before we saw it.
unidentified		This is not 500 feet above the ground.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We're coming to the bottom of the air.
		I want to be sure of something.
		Is there a still photograph at www.windchaser.com?
unidentified		There sure is.
		There's actually two photographs, and if you click on the photographs, it will give you an enlargement and a detailed display of what happens in the video, which is not released at this time.
		The reason it's not released, and I'll hurry this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, you don't have to.
		I'll tell you what.
		Instead, hold on, and I'm going to confirm we've got a link up from our website and come back to you after the bottom of the hour.
unidentified		That'd be great.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Lan Lamphere is on the line with me, and you can hear what he's talking about.
		Pretty interesting stuff.
		We will confirm the link for you in a moment as we come back from the bottom of the hour or send you directly there and you can have a look.
		I tell you, folks, we have been cursed, I believe, to live in very interesting times.
		We'll be back.
unidentified		This is Premier Networks.
		That was Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM.
		on this Somewhere in Time.
		Music
		Music Music Music Music Music Music Music Music
		Music Ooh, see that girl, watch that sea, dig it's a dancing queen.
		Friday night and the night's all low, looking out for a place to go.
		You're listening to Art Bell, somewhere in time, tonight featuring coast to coast a.m. from June 25th, 1997.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, I'm Art Bell.
		Lan Lamp here is my guest.
		He's a storm chaser who caught on by photography an object traveling, estimated to be traveling at about 18,000 miles per hour.
		They've got it clearly on tape.
		They've got a couple of still photographs up at a World Wide Web site, which I will give you.
		My webmaster, Keith, is returning from dinner, and when he gets back, we'll have a link up for you.
		In the meantime, it's www.windchaser.com.
		For those of you who want to take a look, and I hope that site can stand the traffic.
unidentified		Now, we take you back to the past on Art Bell Somewhere in Time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Art Bell I would like to thank my fellow unnamed broadcaster for telling me about Lan Lamphere and what he has done.
		He is a storm chaser, and he has taken a picture of this very bizarre object, apparently actually a series video, 30 frames as he points out per second, about 49 frames, something over one second, with then an estimated speed of the object of about 18,000 miles an hour crossing the screen.
		And so you did want a couple of grabs for video or for stills?
unidentified		Yeah, yeah.
unidentified		I have a 166 Cyrix, I believe that's how you pronounce it, Cyrix computer that we load a day, or we have a video card in.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		And we could just take the digital information, put it right into, and using an asymmetrix 40 DVT Pro program, we can just capture that video.
		And we just FTP'd it over to our website.
		I heard you mention earlier, our website can't handle this.
		It's no problem.
		I just looked at the counter on our website.
		It is really shot up.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I'm sure it has.
unidentified		That's really very good.
		I'm glad.
		I want everybody in the world to know this.
		And I would like everyone in the world to know that from day one of this investigation, from the day that I saw this, I got on the website.
		I've contacted Jeff Sanyo.
		I've contacted John Lewis at the University of Arizona, Dr. Hubbard, excuse me, Hubble, Dr. Hubble, which I'm still waiting for them to reply to, but I'm sure they're probably going to look at this.
		I'd like to determine whether or not it was a meteor, which I really don't think it was, because at this speed, at Mach 25, this thing, at the estimated distance that we were from it, and I have some very exciting news for you that was brought to my attention earlier tonight.
		I'd like to pass that along to you just a moment.
		We're estimating a mile from us, a mile to maybe two miles at the very most.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, my.
unidentified		Okay, this thing passed in front of my camera lens.
		I never saw it with the naked eye.
		Like I said, I was arguing with Tom Filiagi.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		May I ask you about what degree above the horizon it was?
unidentified		Okay, the camera is looking just about due northeast into this wall cloud and this mezzo, the RFD and the tornado that's forming in front of us.
		I would say the degree is, well, let's do it this way.
		I can't really clock off the degrees because I really don't know what that would be, and I really hate to screw the investigation up or muddy the water in any way.
		Let's say three-quarters of the way up from the ground, this object appears on the screen.
		It appears, the first frame that it appears in is actually just half of the object.
		So you can actually see it coming onto the screen.
		And then it travels, it becomes occluded behind a scud cloud very near the meso, mesocyclone that is.
		And it seems or appears to take a left-hand bank.
		Now, I'm not an expert on this, but looking at the video frame by frame by frame, which I did for about four days before I even talked with anybody about this, it appears to take a left-hand turn.
		It appears to take a left-hand turn, nosedive slightly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		At Mach 18.
unidentified		Yeah.
unidentified		No, Mach 25.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Mach 25.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm sorry.
unidentified		Right, not Mach 18.
unidentified		Mach 25.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		18,000 miles an hour, yo.
unidentified		18,900 miles an hour.
		Now, that's just an estimate.
		That was from a particular OU student that he figured all the numbers out and sent me an email, and I mailed him back.
		And I was very appreciative.
		I've been very appreciative of every email that I have received because it has led me in the direction to really go there to find out what this is about.
		There's something when NASA contacted me about this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		NASA contacted you?
unidentified		Yeah, but let's go there in just a minute.
		Because that's really a story in itself.
		Anyway, the thing takes a left-hand turn and it nosedives and then it travels a little bit and then it seems to wrap itself around.
		It seems to be taking a right-hand bank at about a five-degree pitch at 25 Mach.
		And then penetrating a core, a hill core, known to have baseball-size hill.
		And it actually becomes occluded as it goes into the core and then it re-emerges slightly.
		You can see its definition a little bit more and then as it travels on in the next couple of frames it totally disappears.
		No sound.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You have really got something on your hands.
unidentified		Well I tell you what's really really cool about this okay I mean this is totally awesome.
		The reason I can't speak very well tonight is because I am celebrating.
		I have to admit that.
		I've got into some absolute vodka that we had put up.
		I'm not joking.
		I'm not trying to embarrass anyone or embarrass you or myself even.
		So try not to let me do that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's all right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're just relaxed.
unidentified		Yeah, I'm trying to.
		I really appreciate you having me on.
		I really look forward to this.
		I actually thought about contacting you about this, but I didn't know where to begin.
		But tonight, KOCO, Channel 5 in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, Cherokee and Cherokee Ballard, who is an anchor for their station, as well as Scotty Travis, who I have become very good friends with, they are the most fantastic people in the whole world.
		They have allowed this thing to go and allowed me to take it in the direction that I wanted to take it in without mudding the water, so to speak, on the video, because I really did not know what we had.
		I really just wanted to find out what we had here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Did they present it on television without snickering?
unidentified		No, yeah, absolutely they did.
		Man, they have been the greatest people in the whole world.
		KOCO is the most fantastic group of people I've ever met in my life.
		They are just absolutely wonderful.
		Cherokee and Scotty have gone to major, major extents, almost to the point where they're actually getting fired from their jobs to go to bat for me on this and what I believe to be the truth.
		And now let me back up here and say something about the truth.
		I wanted to present this in the light that because I didn't really know what I had.
		I never wanted to say it was a UFO because of the stigmatism and the stereotypical bullcrap that goes along with it.
		No, I know.
		I mean, you have people who are a scientist, and then you have people who are a semi-scientist, and you have people who are total quacks.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
unidentified		And just in the UFO field.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
unidentified		And I did not want to address the quacks at all or even the semi-scientist.
		People of interest, yes, but not anyone else but the scientist.
		I wanted them to look at this video and say, hey, look, look what we have here.
		I was very fortunate in catching this on video.
		I really didn't know anything about it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So NASA contacted you.
unidentified		Yes, they did, and I'm fixing to go there.
		But I want to tell you about the truth about this.
		Since day one, I was on two radio broadcasts this morning, about 7.30.
		I went to bed at 5 o'clock this morning, so I'm very tired.
		And they called me at 7.30, and they were like, hey, Land, can you do this?
		I'm like, no problem.
		I'll sit back and talk with you about this.
		And I told them, and I'm telling you and telling the rest of your viewing or listening audience, that since day one, I have dedicated myself 100% to finding out the truth about this matter.
		To the point, here's where we go to NASA.
		After NASA contacted me, after another government affiliation contacted me, which I can't go there, I have given my word on it, and I'm just not going to go there.
		NASA contacted me and I told NASA that I would deliver this tape to them for evaluation.
		They were just right off the bat, just thrilled.
		And I'm not blasting NASA.
		I'm not at all.
		But NASA is a government-funded organization.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
unidentified		So to hell with them.
unidentified		Let's just forget about that at this point and say, I'm not going to give this thing to NASA until the private market, until the $2,000 that I have spent has gone out there and we've gotten documents and paperwork and we have got letters and reports back with people's names and signatures on them, which I'm going to post on my web, by the way.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, I don't need a name, but what level of NASA contacted you?
unidentified		High level.
unidentified		I will say again, high level.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Very interesting because, you know, the Air Force, of course, just did this silly Roswell news conference the other day.
unidentified		It was pretty stupid.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, went way out of their way to suggest they don't investigate that kind of stuff anymore.
unidentified		Well, that's cool because I happen to know for a fact they do because they contacted me about it.
		Okay, that's the bottom line.
		I know for a fact they do.
		I don't know why they contacted me.
		I don't even know how they got my cell phone number because there's only like six people on this planet that have it.
		Okay, and that's the truth of the matter.
		And I'm being very liberal.
		I'm actually probably putting myself in a lot of danger of even talking about this.
		But I mean, I'm just saying it.
		There, there it is.
		The people need to know.
		The bottom line is I told NASA that I would give this video to them after the private review was done, after I have spent my money, and KOCO has helped me.
		They're actually helping me with video analysis, so forth and so on, into this subject.
		Because, you see, at first we didn't have the one tape with this object on there.
		As of tonight, right before airing time of KOCO's 10 o'clock news, another Storm Chaser came forward and said, hey, I've got that image on my tape.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, my.
unidentified		He was north.
		Actually, he was east from where we were by two to two and a half miles.
		I'm going to take an estimate here, okay?
		Looking northwest.
		Now, I'm west of him looking northeast, and the object passes right between us.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And he's got the image.
unidentified		He's got the same image I have.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, that begins to get to be very serious then.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Very serious.
unidentified		What's really cool is that I got better video than he does.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I hear you.
		All right.
		You said another agency contacted you, which you can't Talk about?
unidentified		Yeah, that's correct.
unidentified		I don't want to go there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, we won't go there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But again, I go back to my statement about the Roswell News Conference where they said no government agency is interested in this kind of thing anymore, especially the Air Force.
unidentified		That's an absolute bull.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Absolute bull.
unidentified		In my opinion, yes.
unidentified		That's my opinion, and I'm entitled to it under the Constitution.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you certainly are.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And moreover, you're giving me first-person testimony here.
unidentified		Yeah, and I'm about lit while I'm doing it.
		But, you know, I'm telling the truth about it.
		I don't have any reason to lie.
		I've been absolutely dedicated 100% to giving the public.
		There's some guy out in the middle of Texas, on the other side of La Mesa, okay, Texas, out in the middle of nowhere, near the New Mexican border, that doesn't know me from Adam's house cat and has an interest in this thing, okay?
		And since day one, I have felt a deep obligation to give whoever it is, whether they're a rapist or a murderist in prison, which is very unfortunate, to someone around the world, whoever it is, wherever, whatever circumstance, give them the truth.
		I have worked very hard in making sure the truth is there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, let me back away from the object and the stuff you've got on film for just one second and ask you a more general question.
		Since you're a storm chaser, you obviously pay a lot of attention to the weather.
		There is a general perception, and I certainly have it, Land, that we're undergoing some sort of basic or profound or cyclical change in our weather patterns.
		And I wonder if you would agree with that or disagree with that or how you feel about that as somebody who studies the weather.
unidentified		Well, that's a very difficult question to answer.
		I mean, you can go back into the Almanacs and find bad times.
		Yeah.
		I mean, you know, the dinosaurs have bad times.
		I think my personal opinion, I'll give you my personal opinion, okay, Arc.
		Sure.
		My personal opinion is that the planet can only take so much.
		I'm not a UFOologist.
		I don't study UFOs.
		I've never even given consideration to UFOs.
		I don't deal in this.
		This is not my area of specialties.
		I'm a storm chaser and a director for a film crew.
		That's what I do.
		I pull up the SBC, the Severe Storms Prediction Center, every day, their website, and I look at their daily broadcast.
		They do a fantastic job, but nobody's perfect.
		I look at the National Severe Storms Lounge data.
		Nobody's perfect.
		They all are doing their very, very best to do their jobs correctly.
		These are trained scientists and colleagues as far as I'm concerned.
		I mean, I'm not even near, nowhere near the scale they are as far as intelligence and their knowledge.
		But as being self-taught to read models, self-taught to find the storms, there's a lot of those guys that are sitting up there who haven't got a clue as to where a storm's going to form, and I can go find it before they can.
		That's my job.
		And then to shoot it correctly, to make sure I got the correct backlighting.
		The weather lately has been kind of screwy.
		I have to agree with that.
		I don't know why.
		I'm not a climatologist.
		I'm not a geologist.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Nor am I, but we've got a big Il Nino forming.
		We've got hot ocean temperatures.
		We've got a hurricane season that threatens to be one of the worst.
		It seems to get worse every year now.
unidentified		I didn't know that, but that's pretty cool for me.
unidentified		It's kind of morbid, but it's cool for me.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		Anyway, there does seem to be a sort of a basic change in the weather.
		Out here in the desert, it's finally beginning to warm up a little bit, but we should be at 110-plus now.
		And we've been in the 80s.
		I mean, it's weird everywhere.
		Of course, you know about what's going on down in Texas.
unidentified		Yeah.
		Yeah.
		Texas is there should have been a lot more activity as far as the storm season in Texas than there was.
		I've been to Texas about seven to eight, maybe nine times this year.
		And most of the days that I were there were big bus days, which is very unusual because the Cape Woods on those days was very strong.
		The lifting index was very strong, and nothing happened, which is, I mean, I'm not trying to start any type of panic or anything.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How close to a tornado have you been?
unidentified		The last tornado I was on was on Highway 9, about 9 miles south of Norman, actually.
		And it was moving towards Norman.
		As a matter of fact, I talked with my wife on the cell phone, and the sirens were going off while I was talking with her.
		And I was telling her that I was behind this tornado, and it was the tornado that hit Purcell.
		At this time, it was forming near Blanchard, and it was a great big long white tube, and I was right in the back of it, less than a quarter mile from it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If it was a white tube, it probably had to be.
unidentified		It's on the website.
		It's on the website.
		It's the first photograph that you'll see on the gallery photograph.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I take it it had not hit ground yet then.
unidentified		Yes, it was on the ground.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It was on the ground and white, huh?
unidentified		Yeah, it's white.
		Well, see, the reason it's white is because most tornadoes that you see that are black is because the person is usually in front of them.
		Therefore, you have the contrast of the sun coming through and the density of the molecules in the atmosphere and the tornado, the wind velocity is the whole nine yards.
		It darkens everything.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I was guessing that debris picked up and dirt would begin to darken it, too.
unidentified		Yes, it will.
		Yes, it will.
		And then you have like monster wedges, you know, who are they're going to be dark anyway.
		There's so much debris, dirt, and just all kinds of stuff, rock, you know, tree limbs, all kinds of stuff, and it just makes them really dark.
		Big wedges usually form because of the moisture content in the air is so high.
		The dew point is so high that it condenses the air to begin with and just, you know, condenses it all real fast.
		So these really wide tornadoes are basically, there's a core and then there's the windfields, and those windfields are usually an indication that that's where the windfield is, what I'm trying to say, that's where the windfield is, but the air condenses so rapidly that it forms these scud clouds.
		Basically, it's just scud trash, and it makes this big tornado.
		It's really monstrous.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Really, really admire what you do.
		I did a few years of it just, you know, as a hobby and for fun.
		And so I know what you do.
		I know how crazy you've got to be to do it.
		Now, what you captured on tape is amazing.
		We're going to get a link in.
		In the meantime, watch your counter because it's going to go nuts.
unidentified		It went to 3,162, and we reset it at zero at around 12 o'clock.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, there you are.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There you are.
unidentified		You have a very wide viewing audience.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, we do.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We have a listening audience in my case, but yes, we do.
unidentified		Well, excuse me, listening audience.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm sorry.
		So listen, I'm going to check back with you.
		Sure.
unidentified		I'm more than happy to.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I really appreciate that.
		And we're going to follow this story because you've got something very, very important to a continuing investigation.
		And I know it's hard to say the word UFO, but it's really fair to say it.
		Unidentified flying object is certainly what you've got.
unidentified		Well, I'm not necessarily sure of that.
unidentified		When I have someone who tells me that that's what it is, yeah, when they crunch the numbers down to show me on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, let's put it this way.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Until it's identified.
unidentified		I can say it's an identified.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, there you are.
		All right, Lan, get some sleep and relax, and we'll get back in touch with you and keep track of this story.
		Absolutely fascinating.
unidentified		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Lan, thank you.
unidentified		Okay, anytime.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good night.
		Good night.
		That's Lan Lamphere, folks.
		And I thought you'd want to hear about that.
		He chases storms for a living.
		And for fun.
		And because, like all storm chasers, he's kind of crazy.
		But he caught something very special on videotape.
		Watch for the link.
unidentified		Coming up shortly, the trip back in time continues.
		With Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM.
		More Somewhere in Time coming up.
		Now, we take you back to the past on Art Bell Somewhere in Time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good morning from the high desert.
		We're about to move into open lines.
		The first two hours of the program have been consumed in order with a discussion of Mir and the collision on Mir and a comparison of the information we're getting now about Mir's condition with a short-term recollection of the fire on Mir that at the time they insisted was minor and was not minor at all.
		Do not, I repeat, do not trust the information you're getting from the major media on the condition of Mir.
		If you wish to monitor Mir yourself and you have the ability, it's on 143.625 megahertz.
		143.625 megahertz.
		And you can listen to the Russians.
		And you can also listen very carefully for a changing signal strength.
		Earlier in the day, today, it was varying between 0 and complete saturation, or 60 over 9.
		And that would indicate the spacecraft is tumbling.
		Something they have not been reporting.
		So we're keeping a very careful eye on what's going on with Mir.
		And we discussed that and other items with Richard Hoagland in the first hour.
		In the second hour, Lan Lamp Fear, who is a professional storm chaser, told us a story, quite a remarkable story, I must say, of something he captured on video while he was filming a tornado.
		He captured something traveling across the sky at Mach 25.
		Now, there are still photographs available of this object, thankfully.
		He's put them on his website.
		I'm still unable to reach Keith to get a link up, but we will do that.
		It is www.windchaser.com.
		That's www.windchaser.com if you would like to get a look.
		So the past hour was consumed with a discussion of that and what land does, which is kind of crazy.
		Anybody who chases storms has got to be a little bit crazy, but it's a compulsive kind of thing.
		And as you know, I did it for some years.
		Compulsively.
		All right, we're going to get to open lines and a reaction to some of that and whatever else you want to talk about shortly.
unidentified		And...
		You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time.
		Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 25, 1997.
		Coast to Coast AM from June 25, 1997.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, all right.
		Once again, here we are, and I think I'm going to simply Go to the phone lines.
		I've got a lot of material here, and I'll kind of drop it in as we go.
		I've got finally a good hard report on the lights that appeared over Las Vegas, and I will try to get that report to you.
		I've got a whole lot of information on a whole lot of subjects, so just bear with me this morning, and I'll kind of drop it in as we go.
		West of the Rockies, you are on the air.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Yes, hello, Art.
unidentified		Richard from San Jose, how are you?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Just fine.
unidentified		Good.
unidentified		Did you get the photos I sent you?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of what?
unidentified		The Hubble?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of the Hubble.
unidentified		Hubble, yeah.
		I sent you some photos and things.
		Priority mail.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, I guess not yet.
unidentified		Okay, it should be there.
unidentified		But anyway, really something about the space station there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, we're not being told the whole truth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You can depend on that.
unidentified		Right, right.
unidentified		And also, you know, my brother moved to Texas, Austin, Texas.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		And you can almost imagine what I bought him from Crane Company.
unidentified		Yeah, I got one and one for myself, too.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, you did?
unidentified		have a radio with that that you'll be able to use without batteries um all you got a Yeah, the crank, yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, of course.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, he'll do well with that in Austin because we've got a very powerful affiliate, KJFK, there.
unidentified		Right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And 90, 8.9 on the FM dial, and so he will do very well with the free play radio indeed.
unidentified		Right.
		Okay, Art.
		Well, that's all I wanted to say, and look forward to getting those pictures priority mail.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, thank you.
		I'll look forward to them.
		I'm backed up a little bit on scanning photographs.
		I've got a number of extremely interesting photographs that have been sent to me that are going to be shortly on the web.
		But I've been so busy lately that I haven't had time to sit down and do the scanning, perhaps tomorrow.
		Busy life, folks.
		Followed the mirror thing all day today and talked to a whole bunch of people.
		First time caller line, you're on the air.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hi.
unidentified		Have you heard about the experiment that our government has been doing with high aerial radio frequencies?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, it's called HAARP in Alaska, yes.
unidentified		Yeah.
unidentified		Well, it went off for the second time on June 17th.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		And ever since then, we've had all this weird weather.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, there are a lot of people who feel that HAARP is contributing to the weather difficulties.
		I tend to doubt that they are presently.
		They're not at power levels that but you never know.
		They intend to go to 100 billion watts eventually.
		And that nearly everybody agrees.
		No, many people agree.
		Let me modify that.
		May have an effect on our weather or could.
unidentified		Also, I think that they're trying to confuse us with the Roswell situation.
unidentified		Every time they go to talk about what happened over Arizona, they bring up the Roswell incident and they're giving the false stories of how it was the weather balloons and the dummies.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I talked to a very interesting young lady yesterday on KERN radio.
		I did an interview at about 12.30 or so in the afternoon.
		And we were discussing Roswell, and she was saying, of course, she had not seen the entire news conference, but only the network reporting of it that night.
		And she said, I buy it straight out.
		I buy what the Air Force says.
		I said, how can you buy it?
		She said, well, I accept things on face value, I believe was her phrase.
		And a very nice young lady, but I said, I can't believe that anybody who really saw any substantial portion of that news conference could buy it on face value.
		How could you possibly do that?
		The film and the evidence that they showed to substantiate the fact that its case closed on Roswell did not even begin until six years after 1947.
		I mean, nobody should be buying that on face value.
		And again, as I said yesterday, and I really mean it, I felt so sorry for that Colonel who had to go out and face people and tell them the impossible and then try to stand there and defend it.
		And basically it boiled down to, well, read the book.
		Read the book.
		Well, Colonel, can you account for the six-year difference here?
		Well, actually, no, I can't.
		It was time compression.
		Time compression.
		Going to remember that answer for the rest of my natural life.
		East of the Rockies, you're on air.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
		Great to talk to you.
		This is Brenda from Beloit, Kansas.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Brenda.
unidentified		Hi.
		I just wanted to let you know that on CNN earlier today, I did hear them mention that the mirror was rotating at one degree per so many seconds.
		I don't remember how many seconds it was, but they did mention that earlier.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They've had all kinds of statements that at one time or another were made.
		For example, they said that if they could not get these gyros going again, that would force the astronaut and cosmonauts to abandon Mir because they could not keep it in a stable condition and presumably then would not be able to get resupplied or repaired.
		So I'm not really sure what's going on.
		The only thing I know for sure is that we're not likely getting the whole story.
unidentified		No, I believe we're not either.
unidentified		Also, I had a comment about the gentleman that you spoke to that saw the object in the storm.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, no, no, no, no.
		Correction.
		Photographed.
unidentified		Photographed the object, that's right.
		Last night we had a terrible storm here in Kansas.
		We had wind gusts of up to 70 miles an hour.
		And the strange thing was right before the storm hit, and I didn't really pay attention to it until I heard him speaking tonight.
		I had seen, I had just went to bed right before the storm hit, and I was looking out my window, and I noticed that there were three blowing, I guess, I don't know what you call them, objects.
		They were about the size of a softball.
		And at first I thought that they were fireflies, and I thought, no, they're too close to the house and too large to be fireflies.
		And they were right in front of a tree in my front yard.
		About 15 minutes later, a limb came down off this tree and nearly hit my house, missed it by about four feet.
		And I mean, this limb was probably 15 feet long and just huge, as big around as my body was.
		But it just really shocked me when I heard him talking about an object in a storm.
		And I wonder if anyone else has ever seen any objects associated with storm activity.
		Well, that would be pretty interesting to see.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It certainly would.
		Thank you very much for the call.
		And it is apparently another path that we're going to have to follow as we investigate the mysterious objects that seem to be near storms.
		I received this fact earlier from Wendy in Auburn, Washington.
		Art, the state of Washington, just had a very unusual hail storm.
		The hail was one and a half inches in diameter, and get this.
		They were triangular in shape.
		It hailed for 12 minutes.
		The hail cut the fruit on the trees like razors.
		Apples, pears, cherries are ruined.
		An estimated $40 million worth of damage.
		This was on today's Channel 5 News from Wendy in Auburn, Washington.
		Excuse me.
		Triangular hail.
		Now, that would take a meteorologist to explain to us how that could form.
		Triangular hail.
		Okay.
		West of the Rockies, you're on air.
unidentified		Good morning.
unidentified		I'm very surprised.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I can barely hear you get into that phone and yell at us.
unidentified		Hello, Art.
unidentified		This is your friend from Fairbanks, Alaska, Colleen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi there.
unidentified		How are you this evening?
		Hi.
		Art, I've been listening to you these last couple weeks, and I'm talking as a mother now or as a parent.
		You know, when I saw the part of the news conference that I did see, you know what I'm beginning to feel?
		I'm beginning to feel like the government is the parent that doesn't want to accept the children have grown up, the citizens have grown up.
		You, on the other hand, are the parent that accepts the adulthood of the child.
		And you treat them as young adults, and you let us think for ourselves, and you let us feel what we need to feel.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You are exactly correct.
		That is my way of doing things.
		I assume, even with all the risks attendant with the assumption, that my audience is basically mature, can stand to hear something that they have to digest and decide for themselves whether it's bull or real.
		And so I present things that way.
		And I guess that accounts for one reason that the program has done as well as it has.
unidentified		Yes, I agree.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There's no magical solution here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And if more people in the media would begin to do it, the American people would begin to appreciate them more.
unidentified		Okay, and the other thing I wanted to say was I'd like your opinion on my thought because it's really bothered me, is because of what I've just said, you know, people are saying, well, why does the government do this?
unidentified		Why do they keep, you know, not giving us the truth?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Where I'm coming from with, you know, I don't think it's all the government fault, it's all the government fault on not producing the real McCoy on what's going on as far as the UFOs and extraterrestrial life.
		I honestly think a big majority of the problem is the religious aspect.
		If, in fact, religiously, they have to face the fact that we are not alone, it could change the whole concept of religion on the whole planet.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, of course it would.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And worse yet, if there was even a hint that those people who would prove we're not alone might have had something to do with our getting here in the first place, there would be a real rebellion.
unidentified		Right.
		And where I come from is at the time of Jesus, there was the Roman gods.
		And after the time of Jesus and after like a hundred-year period or a couple hundred years, the collapse of the gods of that time happened.
		And in my mind's eye, I honestly believe that what's happening now is the religious aspects is actually holding the government aspects in check.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't rule out a religious occurrence.
		We're headed toward an event.
		It may be spiritual.
		It may be religious.
		It may be environmental.
		It may even be social.
		I don't know.
		But we are building toward an event that will not end all life as we know it, but it is going to change things.
unidentified		Yes, it is.
unidentified		Thank you for talking to me, and I'm so anxious to see you in August.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, thank you very much.
		And I don't know for sure that I'm going to make it all the way to Fairbanks yet.
		I don't know what part of the schedule I've got with regard to Alaska.
		I'm going to be finding out about that shortly.
		I'm going to be on one leg of the trip, and I'm not sure altogether yet which leg that is going to be.
		But I sure am looking forward to seeing Alaska again.
		It has been altogether too long for me.
		And once you've been to Alaska, as they say, I guess you can take an Alaskan out of Alaska, but you cannot take Alaska out of an Alaskan, and that's an absolutely true statement.
		First time caller line, you're on the air.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
		How you doing?
		Okay.
		Well, I've been listening to your program here for, well, about the last three, four days.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
unidentified		And, well, it's kind of a crazy subject, and I got some crazy ideas about it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, this is the home of both.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So go right ahead.
unidentified		Okay, well, the Roswell thing in 1947, who's to say when that craft crashed, that our government might be rebuilding these crafts and using them for whatever, you know.
unidentified		It has 50 years to do it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I wouldn't deny it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's absolutely possible.
unidentified		And who's to say, now here's the crazy part, the cloning.
unidentified		Who's to say that maybe they're not cloning pilots, training pilots?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, look, I think human cloning is going on.
		As a matter of fact, there was a story on the news this last hour about the same company that cloned Dolly already being asked to clone.
		And you just know damn well that it's going on.
unidentified		Yeah, sure it is.
		You know, our government's into a lot of things they shouldn't be into.
		Yep.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And probably far ahead of the private sector.
		But even if you just look at the private sector, you can depend on the fact it's going on.
		Right now, for $200,000, you can be cloned in the Bahamas.
		So this genie is out of the bag.
		It's not going back.
		The only question is where it's going.
unidentified		You take a spacecraft or any kind of craft that flies at the speed of light or 18,000 miles per hour.
		People like you and me don't have the response to maneuver one of these craft, split-second decisions.
		Our mind is on something else.
		You can't fly a craft like that.
		You have to have a trained human robot, basically, that knows nothing but how to operate that craft.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Couldn't agree with you more, sir.
		And thank you very much for the call.
		Somebody, Bob, sent me this.
		This backs up everything we've been saying from today's, well now yesterday's, USA Today.
		It's entitled End of Story.
		Hardly.
		With unwarranted optimism, the U.S. Air Force titled its latest report on claims that aliens crash-landed in New Mexico in 1947.
		Quote, the Roswell Report, case closed, end quote.
		Case closed, they wish, italicized in wish.
		This case is about as closed as a vast desert where it must be admitted some pretty strange things occurred.
		Lights seen, bodies viewed, wreckage inspected.
		Ironically, because it was meant to lay the matter to rest, the Air Force report released Wednesday gives Roswell more pizzazz than ever.
		The Pentagon's latest and most final conclusion is that witnesses saw dummies that have been dropped from balloons.
		But get this, the dummies were dropped six to twelve years after the witnesses say they saw the corpses of small creatures, to which officials merely shrug that memories from the 1940s and 50s have, quote, consolidated.
		Don't you like that word?
		Now, instead of a compression, they're talking about consolidation.
		God, these people have contempt for us.
		And that, ladies and gentlemen, is a piece of the article from the USA today commenting on the Air Force's brilliant, absolutely brilliant press conference held the day before.
		Now buried, by the way, with other news beneath what has occurred in space on Mir, a very, very serious collision.
		And you can depend on one thing, we're not getting all the news about this collision.
		We'll be right back.
unidentified		The trip back in time continues with Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM.
		more somewhere in time coming up I can't exist out your miss your tender kiss.
		Don't leave me this way.
		Oh, baby, my heart is full of love at this time for you.
		Now go down and do what you gotta do.
		You started this fire.
		You started this fire.
		Premiere Networks presents Art Bell Somewhere in Time tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 25th, 1997.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good morning from the high desert.
		I interviewed Lan Lamphere, who's a storm chaser and caught an object on tape.
		An object doing mock 25.
		He's got 49 frames of it.
		Two of those frames are on his website.
		You can now go to my website and the link is in.
		Keith has returned.
		That was one of those last-minute interviews.
		It just, you know, one of those things that happened.
		So, if you want to go zipping up to my website, you'll see the link there now.
		Somebody writes, and he's referencing the second Storm Chaser that also captured this on tape.
		Meaning that we've got two different angles.
		Somebody writes, Art, this is fantastic.
		We have the object photographed from two different angles.
		We can determine exact speed, distance, and flight path.
		Let's see the debunkers beat that.
		Lewis in Sioux Falls, South Dakota.
		Listening to WSN.
		Thank you very much, my friend, and you're exactly right.
		This is pretty heavy stuff.
		So, if you want to see the object, or at least At least a still frame, and you will also see a tornado in the frame.
		Zip up to my website right now at www.artbell.com.
		Whatever it was, it was fast and it made turns, and we've got it at two different angles from two different sources.
		Pretty exciting stuff.
		And by the way, Lan indicated he was contacted by an agency he wouldn't relate and by high-level NASA officials.
		So relating back to the news conference of the other day with regard to Roswell, where we don't investigate those kind of things anymore.
		Anyway, back to open line shortly.
unidentified		You're listening to Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
		Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 25, 1997.
		Coast to Coast AM from June 25, 1997.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		From Mark in Milwaukee, Art, could you please repeat the information about the radio frequency and signals being transmitted by Mir?
		Sure.
		If you want to begin listening at about 10 o'clock a.m. Pacific time today and listen throughout the afternoon, you will hear several Mir passes on the following frequency, 143.625.
		The voices you hear will be in Russian and kind of garbled.
		And all I can tell you to do, unless you speak Russian, and I do have some friends that are interpreting Russian for me as best they can, what you want to listen for is the urgency and stress in the voice.
		That's 143.6 or .625 or decimal.
		That's VHF, folks.
		And on the better passes, it does not take much of a radio.
		A scanner will hear them just fine.
		So if you want to participate in a bit of an experiment tomorrow, beginning at about 10 o'clock in the morning Pacific time, park a scanner or a VHF radio of some sort on that frequency.
		And as I did today, you will hear Mir on each pass.
		Now, you may hear them for a period of time ranging from a minute to up to 10 minutes, depending on the pass.
		And there's one more thing I want you to observe for me.
		One indication that Mir is tumbling would be that the signal is not steady.
		In other words, as you have a satellite pass, you will acquire the signal.
		It'll be weak, and it will generally slowly build to its strongest point.
		And then as it heads toward the other horizon, it will begin to weaken.
		That is the nature of satellite signals.
		If the craft is steady, in other words, at a proper attitude.
		Now, if the signal you hear constantly varies in strength from what we call pegging the needle, very strong when it is directly over you, to zero, you're going to want to time the difference between when the signal is strong and when it is weak.
		And that will tell you the rough rotation or tumble of the spacecraft.
		And this is, if now, only now, being reported by CNN.
		It's something I noted earlier today.
		And as I noted earlier in the program, they don't tell you the truth about these things.
		So be very cautious about what you hear on CNN or anywhere else for that matter.
		Because you remember the minor fire they had on Mir?
		It wasn't minor at all.
		It was very serious.
		It was a fire that raged for 14 minutes and nearly caused the abandonment of Mir then.
		They lied.
		They lie.
		So if you want to try and listen yourself, 143.625, West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		This is Glenda in Roswell, where the dummies are trying to convince us that they dropped the dummies.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, hi there, Glenda.
unidentified		How are you doing?
		I'm doing just fine.
		I have two questions that I wanted to ask you first.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		May I ask you one first?
		How are the people of Roswell generally reacting?
		I mean, what's the buzz there in town to the stupid Air Force news conference the other day?
unidentified		Nobody believes it.
		Nobody believes it.
		I was just wondering, for your bumper music, they have a real cute song.
		I don't know if you've heard it or not.
		It's called Johnny Wrote the UFO.
		It's about the UFO in 1947.
		And I was wondering if I can send you the disc of it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You may indeed.
unidentified		And I didn't know if it was lawful to do that or not.
		And also.
		It's lawful.
		Oh, okay.
		Also, another thing I wanted to ask you, several people that I know listened to your show, and the time traveler from 2055.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
unidentified		We had all written down the dates on our calendars, and it was the 27th of June.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's what everybody's saying, yeah.
unidentified		So I just wanted to check on that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And actually, to be accurate, it was not the time traveler from 2055, but from 20, I can't remember, like 2017 or something.
		I've got a way to contact him.
		He was nevertheless awfully close.
		There was that big transportation tragedy down in Texas.
		But I think you're right.
		It was not the 24th.
		I think it was the 27th.
		I'm not sure.
unidentified		Yeah, I was waiting for someone else to call in.
unidentified		We're fixing to have our big UFO festival down here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I know.
unidentified		And Whitley Streeber is going to be here.
unidentified		I guess you knew that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I know.
unidentified		And Loten Howell and all the big ones.
		So we're really excited about it.
		And I really love your show, and congratulations on your awards.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And take care.
		Yes, I was very honored to receive that award.
		Very honored.
		Very nice.
		And I'm up for another one.
		This one even bigger.
		It comes from the National Association of Broadcasters, and it's the Marconi.
		The Marconi.
		Marconi is somebody, of course, that I greatly respect anyway, so I am particularly interested in the Marconi, and I'm very honored to be in the final five.
		So we'll see what happens.
		That won't be until, or at least we won't know until September.
		You know how it goes, voting by program directors and managers and so forth, and then it is tabulated by the accounting firm, the same one that does the Oscars, I suppose.
		And the results are not known until the NAB conference in New Orleans in September.
		But we're probably going to go down there for it.
		And either way, you know, winning or not winning, honestly, and I really do mean this, you know, it's always nice to win, but it's a real honor to be nominated, frankly, for it.
		It's a very high honor.
		National Association of Broadcasters is, as you know, the largest organization representing broadcasters in the country.
		So there you have it.
		Back to the lines we go.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Good morning.
		Hi, Arik.
		Yes, sir.
unidentified		I was wondering if you were planning on opening your timeline ever again.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
unidentified		You are?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of course.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I, you know, never say never, I have learned.
unidentified		Okay.
unidentified		Well, that's all.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's it, huh?
unidentified		Yeah.
unidentified		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, wait a minute.
		If I were to open my timeline, would you be a caller?
		Oh, no.
		So you are not a time traveler?
unidentified		No, I was just interested in.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, thank you.
		I've had every form of line you can imagine.
		The timeline, I've got to admit, was pretty unique.
		Time travelers.
		Boy, and I had a couple of winners, too.
		Hope to hear from them again.
		First time caller line, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hi.
		Hi, Art.
		My name is David.
		I'm in southern Oregon.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
unidentified		And would I be able to tell you quickly about a sighting I saw about 18 years ago?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you can, but that's an awful long time ago.
unidentified		Well, it was on the Hudson River.
		My wife and I were traveling out of New York State on the Palisades Parkway.
		And it was a beautiful clear evening, about 11 o'clock at night.
		And from Yonkers across the Hudson came a flash of light suddenly, and it stopped right at the edge of the Hudson River.
		And the lights dimmed in the front.
		The craft was facing west.
		We were looking at it south.
		We were heading south.
		I saw a side view profile of it.
		I saw it sitting there, motionless, right above the trees, my wife and I. What was the shape?
		It was along, from the side view.
		It was rectangular because I saw the flat black of the side.
		And I couldn't, you know, it was just flat black.
		The bottom of the craft, because of my perspective and where we were, just past the Geological Institute, the Government Institute on the Hudson River there, they were about a quarter of a mile behind us north.
		And the craft, from the tops of the trees that were just below it, it seemed just below it, I thought it was much closer, but it was about a mile away because of the size of it.
		The length of it was about 150 to 200 yards long.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's big.
unidentified		Yes.
		And then it sat there for long enough to where the traffic was light, but it stopped.
		I stopped my car and got out and stood there and watched it.
		My wife kind of held her hands in her face as she was standing, I mean, sitting in the car.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Exactly the way my wife reacts.
unidentified		Yeah, and then I stood there and I watched this thing.
		And it just sat motionless in the front of the lights, which were facing, like I said, west, so it was a side profile.
		I could see like the first three lights.
		So it must have been a curved front or something, or maybe it was maybe facing a little bit north, if you know what I mean.
		And they were oscillating from side to side.
		Then it just went straight up.
		Straight up.
		And then we all stood there and watched it go straight up, and it stopped.
		Then it turned and it shot north up towards past the Tappanzi Bridge.
		And then it stopped past the Tappanzi Bridge because we could watch the light stop it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Where are you now, by the way?
unidentified		I live in Oregon.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oregon.
		Oh, that's right.
		You told me.
unidentified		Yes, we moved.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You moved.
		All right.
		I can still hear the New York, New Jersey, and you.
unidentified		Yes.
		And then the craft stopped, and then it shot back towards us right along the Hudson River and went straight out over the ocean, over Manhattan Island, over Long Island, and then straight out.
		And I'll never forget that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of course not.
		I very much appreciate your report.
		And that is so typical of what so many million Americans have seen.
		And then we have news conferences like the one they had at Roswell the other day.
		It's not going to wash anymore.
		A boomerang-shaped craft appeared north of Las Vegas the other Day.
		In the middle of all this brouhaha about Phoenix and about Roswell, there was a major sighting near me.
		I didn't see it, but many, many Las Vegans did.
		And I must tell you, the number of sightings is increasing dramatically.
		So it seems to me they're not going to be able to keep this at the chuckle point very much longer because there's a lot of people not laughing.
		There's clearly something going on in our skies, and it's being photographed and videotaped by all kinds of people, including the professional we had on last hour, Lan, and others.
		I mean, how long can the evidence be ignored?
		How long will we continue to accept statements like Colonel Haynes made that, you know, we don't investigate those things anymore?
		As Lan said, that's a pile of crap.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Hi.
unidentified		Good morning, Art.
unidentified		I too want to confirm that it was the 27th that I wrote down in my notes for that time travel.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
unidentified		So that was very interesting.
unidentified		I can't wait to see what happens.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		All right.
unidentified		Good morning.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
		Thank you very much.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
unidentified		This is Paula calling from Cape Free Territory.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		KFRE and Fresno.
unidentified		Right.
unidentified		Tuesday night, I was flipping through channels, and I happened to catch the latter part of Tony Brown's journal on PBS.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		He was talking about the Gulf War syndrome.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		It really amazes me as to what the government can do to the people of the United States.
		He read off a law where the Department of Defense can test any U.S. Title 50?
		I believe that's what it was.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, with 30 days notification to some sort of civilian official, they can test biological or chemical agents on the American public.
unidentified		Right.
unidentified		And they have done this to school kids without the parents' consent.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, thank you.
		They've done it to lots of people without consent.
		Adults and children.
		It's a kind of a sad thing when you realize that your government is not so truthful and honest as you one time thought they were.
		It's a kind of a sad process to begin realizing that.
		I still think we've got the best place to live on the planet.
		But there's a lot of sad things going on out there and a lot of behavior by our own government that I sure wouldn't be proud of.
		How about you?
		A first-time caller line, you're on the air.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hi, how are you?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm fine.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Where are you?
unidentified		I'm in Phoenix.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Phoenix.
unidentified		Ground zero, we call it these days, yes.
unidentified		You speculated the other night what was the history of Phoenix, Arizona.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, Richard did, yes.
unidentified		Well, whoever.
		I sent you an email.
		I'm sure you get too many to have seen it.
		But the Ho-Hocom Indians settled the Valley of the Sun.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I did see that.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And dug some of those canals, yes.
unidentified		They dug them all, I believe.
		And using, just digging with clam shells or whatever, were only off by five degrees, and then they disappeared suddenly without a trace.
		And perhaps they were space travelers who needed to set down for a while.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Perhaps.
unidentified		And then took off.
unidentified		So that was just my idea.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it could be.
		Anything could be.
		But Phoenix is a very unusual place.
		There's no question about that.
unidentified		So we have a meteor crater outside of Flagstaff.
		We're going up to see it next week.
		I was wondering, you know, I read one of your really old postings here.
		Let me see.
		I bookmarked it.
		Let's see if I can find it.
		It was, oh, the letters that came from the man whose grandfather had been communicated with.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, with regard to Art's parts.
unidentified		Yes.
		And he mentioned that he couldn't set off his anti-met or whatever to get himself back into orbit because he would take out the entire states of Arizona and California and other words, some sort of hyperdrive, whatever you want to call it.
		Yeah, whatever.
		So I was wondering if perhaps the meteor crater that we have is in fact a blast-off site.
		See, aren't I imaginative?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You are.
		You are, but you are consistent with what he said.
		Thank you.
		He said that were they to turn on the drive that they would normally use only once they were in a vacuum, that you would destroy a significant portion of any landmass below that blast.
		And that's entirely reasonable to conclude if you had something that was operating with that kind of force generated by matter and antimatter, which would certainly be a significant step above nuclear power.
		So you can imagine what the results would be.
		All right, we're going to pause here at the top of the hour, and we're going to come back and continue for the last couple of hours of the show this morning with open lines and anything you want to talk about.
		Listen, I want to warn you, or actually, yeah, warn you, I guess, that we have got David Oates doing reversals on Colonel Haynes.
		David is hard at work at that on my request, and in all likelihood, if he's got them done, we'll have David on for a period of time Friday night with reversals on Colonel Haynes.
		You know, the colonel who did the Roswell press conference?
		That should be Friday night, Saturday morning, right here.
unidentified		You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time.
		tonight featuring coast to coast a.m.
		from june twenty-fifth nineteen ninety seven the the the got a black magic She's coming in twelve thirty flights.
		The moonlit wings reflect the stars that guide you towards salvation.
		I stopped an old man along the way, hoping to find some old forgotten words or ancient bellographers.
		He turned to me as if to say, Prave boy, it's waiting there for you.
		Gonna take the light to take me away from you.
		There's something that a hundred men or more could ever do.
		I miss the rain down in Africa.
		Gonna take some time.
		You are listening to Art Bell somewhere in time.
		Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 25th, 1997.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
		When you hear my bumper music, what you're hearing is the music that I love.
		I'm collected.
unidentified		The wild dogs cry out in the night over the years.
		They grow restless longing for some solitary company.
		I know that I must do what's right.
		Asher as Kilimanjaro rises like Olympus above the Savior.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And that's one of them.
		Good morning, everybody.
		The Magellan GPS 2000 Satellite Navigation System.
		Well, as I say, there's an end to everything.
unidentified		You're going to take the life to take me away from you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And tonight is it.
		You better mark my words.
		I really love this song.
unidentified		all of it muscles and and
unidentified		Every boy she's waiting after you You're the king of life to drag me away from you There's nothing that a hundred men or more could ever do I've blessed the rains down in Africa I've blessed the rains down in Africa I've blessed the rains down in
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Africa I've blessed the rains down in Africa I've blessed the rains down in Africa For those of you who may not remember, it's a group called Toto.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Remember that?
unidentified		The End somewhere in time with art bell continues courtesy of premier networks
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Dear Art, my order for your book, The Quickening, somehow got lost in the shuffle.
		And after faxing you about it, was passed on to the publisher.
		Thank you very much.
		Uh, it took a while, but I got it.
		It was worth the wait.
		The Quickening was not the doomsday book that I thought it might be.
		It was well thought out, well researched, and documented.
		Your book was beautifully written, insightful, thought-provoking.
		A must-read for every intelligent human being with the ability to read.
		I pretty much had in my head or had my head in the sand until I read the book.
		And the scary part is, I didn't think that I did.
		Now I realize how much I have not been aware of.
		If everyone read your book, maybe some of the negative trends that we are sliding into at such a rapid pace can be slowed or even stopped.
		Eliminate the ignorance that so many of our leaders and representatives are working to foster in our people.
		And maybe we can make our future brighter than it threatens to be if we keep ourselves in the dark as I once was.
		Thanks again, Dory in Redding, California.
		Thank you, Dory.
		That's exactly right.
		It is not a doomsday book.
		And I guess that's what a lot of people thought it would be.
		No, it is a book.
		It is a chronicling.
		It is a well-documented reading of exactly where we are.
		Now, if nothing is done and we don't have a dramatic course change, there is going to be a big change in society.
		The Earth is not going to stop rotating.
		It will continue.
		Now, more tentatively, whether we're on it or not is another question.
		But I am not so egotistical as to imagine we can destroy the Earth.
		We really can't.
		But our position here is rather tentative, you know.
		And it doesn't take a lot of change to um to change that situation.
		And uh cosmically, we've only really been here for a blink of an eye.
		And there is no assurance we're going to remain.
		About the only sure thing, and that's relatively sure, is that the Earth will continue to turn and revolve about the Sun.
		It is our place in it that is threatened.
		And it is threatened not by some external force, but by us.
		And that is what is documented in this book.
		So yes, I do urge you to read it.
		To get it, if you have an opportunity, whether you get a signed edition or not, there are going to be few signed editions left.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Hi.
unidentified		Hello.
unidentified		Hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Turn your radio off, please.
unidentified		Oh, is that become while the commercial is on?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We have a tape delay, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're on the air.
unidentified		Oh, fantastic.
		First of all, I want to say that bless you.
		It's a blessing that you have a show like this, an open forum for the people.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That is true.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That is a blessing.
unidentified		Now, I want you to tell the people what the word obscurantism means.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Obscurantism?
unidentified		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Did I hear that correctly?
unidentified		Yes, obscurantism.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, well, obscurantism is a philosophy in which the derivation of the word would be obscure, I'm sure, would it not?
unidentified		Well, yes, it's stopping the spread of truth so that certain individuals have the truth and they can use that truth as power over the masses who they misinform purposely.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Otherwise, a synonym would be disinformation.
unidentified		Exactly, but it's a bit more than that.
		It's a bit more than that because, but I won't go into that, into the semantics of it.
		But that's what the government has practiced.
		Now, a lady who called earlier that said that there would be a terrible relash as far as all of the religions of the earth if the extraterrestrials were to display themselves.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Get away from your phone a little.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're kind of distorted, yes.
unidentified		Oh, okay.
		Let me put it down a little bit.
		Is this a little bottom?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Just get away from the mouthpiece a little bit.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's better.
unidentified		How's this?
		Is this okay?
		Because I'm talking too loud.
		I'm like from New York.
		I talk too loud.
		There's several points I wanted to make.
		Not only the religious, all of the major religions would be in jeopardy, but the monetary systems of the world as well, because these individuals would be able to provide gold, diamonds, from other places.
		I also wanted, you just made a comment that the Earth would not be destroyed.
		I haven't read you about the quickening.
		But Nikola Tesla had information on how to tap into the natural vibratory frequency of the Earth and could crack the Earth and literally send it off of its course hurling into the Sun.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, such things no doubt have occurred.
		But they occur over a time span that makes human presence look like the blink of an eye.
		And so the odds are really pretty good, sir, that we would cease being on the Earth rather than the Earth ceasing to support us.
unidentified		Okay.
unidentified		What has been the most catastrophic incident that humanity has ever witnessed since humanity has existed?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Proba, well, let's see.
		the most catastrophic uh...
		if you're referring to earth changes uh...
		Oh, I don't know.
		That's subjective.
		I mean, the crucifixion.
		Yes, it is.
		It is subjective.
unidentified		When a comet crashed into Jupiter two years ago, the second piece of the comet has a magnitude of hundreds of millions of times the magnitude of the bomb that was dropped in Hiroshima and left a mark larger than the planet Earth.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, suppose, though, I were to say to you, what about the crucifixion of Christ?
unidentified		Okay, we can get into that first of all.
		In the scientific aspect, I'm trying to make a point.
		Astronomy is the one that accurately predicted exactly where that comet would hit and at what time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		And had to take into consideration the time-space continuum within those calculations.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The one thing astronomy was unable to predict, though, was that that would break into about 21 pieces, I believe it was.
unidentified		Yeah, 19021.
		And it was the second piece that had the largest impact.
		But the repercussions, it takes light more than a half hour for us to have seen the actual occurrence because the speed of light is 186.2,000 miles per second.
		So it took over half an hour for us to see the light of that.
		Now, Jupiter...
		I'm trying to make a point that the shock waves from that explosion, from that comet attacking Jupiter, not attacking, but exploding now, much of those shockwaves have been entering the Earth's atmosphere for the last couple of months.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, there's no question about it.
		Like a stone thrown into the center of a pond, the ripples extend outward.
		There's no question about that.
		Now, there's certainly lots of room for argument about whether those shock waves, as they hit Earth, you know, there was some speculation about setting off some sort of chain reaction, vibratory response on Earth that would shatter things, but that doesn't seem to have been the case.
		A more interesting argument is what would have occurred had those, had Shoemaker-Levy 9, even one piece of it, crashed instead of into Jupiter, into Earth, you know, we'd be Somebody's future petroleum.
		And maybe that's the way things go.
		Maybe it's a race to see if we can develop enough technology to prevent something like that from occurring before we are turned into petroleum.
		I don't know.
		West of the Rockies, you're on air.
unidentified		Hi, this is Joe from Redding.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Joe.
unidentified		I have a question.
		Well, I got a question, two questions, and a guest, whatever you call it, suggestion.
		Go ahead.
		First question is about the Roswell incident.
		Yes.
		Isn't there a newspaper article from 1947 that indicates about the thing?
		How come nobody's talking about it?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, they are.
		I mean, newspaper, radio broadcasts, of course, all of that.
		And that was roundly ignored by the Air Force in their report the other day, case closed.
		Look, it's an insult to the intelligence of the American people, what was done the other day.
unidentified		Come on, told me about it.
unidentified		I don't believe anything the government said.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And a lot of American people are apparently well prepared to be insulted without any further investigation.
unidentified		I mean, do these people take us for idiots or something?
unidentified		I mean, do they think the American people on a whole are a bunch of dummies?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I was out of play on words.
unidentified		I don't know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The answer must be yes.
		Or we can conclude their behavior was designed to actually cause more people to believe that something occurred in 1947.
		And they are lying.
unidentified		I know, but I've got this feeling.
		I've just got this really intense feeling, and I've had it for a couple of years, that sometime between now and probably 2000 or something, something's going to happen.
		There's going to be undeniable proof, and they can't lie anymore.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		And after that happens, who knows what?
unidentified		The guest suggestion is I have a friend who lives in a town called Chiliquin, Oregon, if you have any idea where that is.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I do not.
unidentified		It's an Indian reservation.
		His name is Phil.
		I don't know if you want his last name.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, not right now.
unidentified		But he's a spirit channeler, Indian medicine man, and prophet.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, the only part of it I don't like is channeler.
		I appreciate the call.
		The only part of it I don't like is channeler.
		I don't trust channeled information.
		That is not to say, and I always catch a lot of flack for this, that channeling, some channeling is not real or that spirits speak through people who are living.
		My only argument against channeling in general is that it affords too much opportunity for fraud.
		That's always been my feeling about channeling.
		I mean, I could sit here and I could give you, and I have done it, a great example of what I might sound like if I were suddenly channeling the Great Orb.
		The Great Orb would begin speaking of prophecy in things to come.
		And I could do that with, believe me, a very convincing voice.
		And if I could do it, then I figure a lot of other people can do it too.
		So it doesn't mean channeling isn't real.
		It just means there's too damn much room for fraud.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hi.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Going once, going twice, gone.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
unidentified		Is this Art Bell?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Hello, Art Bell.
unidentified		What a great show you have.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, thank you.
unidentified		I'm calling from really watching the C-SPAN interview last night with Colonel John Waynes.
unidentified		I mean, Colonel John Haynes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Haynes, yes, yes.
unidentified		Now, that wasn't an example.
		That was not an example of the clicking.
		That was an example of the thickening.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, well, whatever.
unidentified		You know, I mean, this guy really earned himself and the whole Air Force a whole new award.
		I can envision it.
		A parachute in gold, very nice, nice pair of wings, a guy with a fishing pole and a fish, big eyes, kind of bony, and underneath it, something fishy, 47 and 97.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I'll tell you, we've got David Oates' reversals of the Colonel.
		And it will be very interesting.
		You can imagine it might go either way.
		I have no way of knowing right now, but either the Colonel was being honest and did not know and was just out there doing the impossible job he was asked to do, or he knew what the real thing going on was.
unidentified		Well, that is the question, isn't it?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, the question will be answered.
unidentified		As a consumer, as a watcher, I consider myself a fair witness in the Midwest.
		There was something fishy about that.
		Very fishy.
		And, you know, part of the reason I say that is their positioning.
		They had this kind of lack of dasial posturing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, the whole thing was compressed, time compressed.
		Wildguard Line, you're on the air.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Hello, I'd like to ask about Richard Hovan.
		I have something very important to say, something that's never been brought up before.
		But first, I'd like to ask Richard Hoagland's electrogravatics and its occurrence in nature.
		Have you guys reported anything about that?
		Anything on your show about that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		My response immediately is, huh?
unidentified		Electrogravatics.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Electrogravatics.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What about it?
unidentified		Richard Hoagland and Richard Hoagland, yes.
		And its occurrence in nature.
		I'm guessing your response will take as a no.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		My response is, I don't know what you're talking about.
unidentified		Okay, I'll take it as a no.
		Here's what I want to say.
		The Bermuda Triangle and the Devil's Sea off of Japan.
		There are jillions of disappearances there every year that on the average that you never hear about.
		It turns out all eels from Europe and America go to the Devil's Triangle to breed and are never seen again.
		And all the eels of Asia go to the Devil's Sea to that area.
		I checked on the mating areas they go to, and the eel is really a mystery and the fact they go to those two parts.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, had you heard about the ship?
unidentified		The ship?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		Which one?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The ship that, well, was found here recently in the desert.
		it was reported lost originally in the Bermuda Triangle.
		And it showed up just suddenly on its side here in the desert.
unidentified		I think I saw that movie.
		Did you?
		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It was a good movie, too.
unidentified		Hey, I'm digging it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's like the beginning of close encounters of the third kind.
		Remember that?
		The desert airplanes?
unidentified		It was fiction's fun, but reality rules.
		How about this?
		Richard Hoagland has a research paper about electrogravatics and its occurrence in nature.
		He requested it from the author.
		What author?
		The author of the third principle.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, what's the name of the author?
unidentified		His name is Christopher Baer.
unidentified		And he wrote Principles of Flight about electrogravatics and anti-gravity.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, the only principles of flight that I'm familiar with regard aerodynamics, except modern rocketry.
unidentified		There are four principles of flight.
		Aerodynamics being one, there's buoyancy, there's propulsion, and there's an electromagnetic repulsion.
		All four principles of flight are applied science and nature.
		What are you talking about?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We don't understand the exact nature of a gravity period.
unidentified		No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
		I'm not talking about gravity right now.
		I'm talking about the first four principles of flight.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Two of them that you named involve gravity.
unidentified		Well, yes, okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, so we don't fully understand the nature of gravity, is what I said.
unidentified		We understand the nature of buoyancy.
unidentified		We understand the nature of propulsion, aerodynamics, and electromagnetic repulsion in theory.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, we understand that opposite poles push away from each other, but we don't understand what causes gravity.
		Believe me, sir, we don't.
		Talk to the scientists.
		Ask Richard Hoagland.
		We don't understand the exact nature of it.
		Many people, including Richard and others, have theories about what gravity is.
		But we don't really know.
		Is it a push?
		Is it a pull?
		Is it related to mass?
		We think these things are true, but we don't really know because we haven't proven them yet.
		So a couple of those are definitely, at this point, just theories.
unidentified		This is Premier Networks.
		That was Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM on this Somewhere in Time.
		Now, we take it back to the past.
		I are somewhere in time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I must be in an Abba kind of mood this morning.
unidentified		I tried to hold you back when you were stronger.
		Oh, yeah.
		And now it seems my only chance is to give it another fight.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's it.
unidentified		Give it up.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, everybody.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm Art Bell, and this is Coast to Coast AM.
unidentified		Coast to Coast AM.
		You're listening to Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
		Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 25th, 1997.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		David says, David A. FrequentFaxers says, Dear Art, within 96 hours, the Mir mission will be aborted.
		Well, I can't know that's true, David, but I would generally, my general sense would be to agree with you that there's a great deal we're not being told and that they have not even discovered yet about the damage to Mir.
		And they are going to have to get out.
		My only comment would be they ought to be preparing the Atlantis shuttle just in case.
		Because should there be difficulty with the Soyuz, there would be dead men in space.
		And so I would say prepare the Atlantis just in case.
		Just in case, Soyuz, which everybody says is a very functional, if somewhat cramped, return craft, if something should go wrong, or for some reason the power should go south and they cannot power up Soyuz or one thing or another, I just think it would be to use a bushism prudent to have the Atlantis ready.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Hi, Art.
unidentified		This is Craig from Southeast Michigan.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How you doing, Craig?
unidentified		Oh, not bad.
		I've been trying to get a hold of you for a long time now.
		I saw the same thing you did, the black silent triangles.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yes.
		Well, many, many, many people have seen triangles or boomerangs.
		The latest sighting, mass sighting, being in Las Vegas a couple of days ago.
unidentified		Well, I think I might know what it is.
		You know, I do want to think that it's not from this world, but I live by Selfridge Air National Guard Base, and four of these were flying from that direction.
		It was like three years ago to the date.
		And they were perfect triangles.
		Three of them were in a triangle formation, and the fourth one was flying from the outside of the triangle to the inside, backwards to the outside.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Were they making any noise?
unidentified		No, none at all.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How high up were they?
unidentified		Well, I thought it was a low ceiling that night because I live off a main thoroughfare, and it's well lit, and it was like an orange sky that night.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		And so I thought that the ceiling was kind of low, and so I estimated that they were the size of a regular military jet.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And how fast did they appear to be going?
unidentified		They appeared to be going slower than a Cessna, than a small single-engine plane.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		The one I saw was doing about 30 miles an hour.
		There's nothing that I know of that will support itself in aerodynamic flight at that speed, way, way, way below the stall speed of just even a hang glider.
unidentified		Yeah.
		Well, I saw a program where two guys described the same thing that I saw, and they said it was called the Black Manta TR-3A.
		I don't know if that...
		Oh, really?
		Okay, I didn't hear that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In other words, something has to push it along, something has to support it.
		It has to be pushed along at a speed that will provide lift.
		That's my understanding of aerodynamic flight.
		And all the airplanes I've been in have one way or the other done that.
		And I've been in everything from hang gliders to the Concord.
		So, you know, what I saw, I can't account for in terms of any sort of conventional explanation at all.
		Not at all.
		And does that mean or guarantee it's from somewhere else?
		No, of course not.
		But if we could follow it, it's a big story, either way.
		That's the way I look at it.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Oh, good morning.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Turn your radio off, please.
unidentified		Oh, sorry about that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sorry.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Where are you?
unidentified		Oh, I'm in Hawaii.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hawaii?
unidentified		Yeah, Oahu.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, Oahu, the main island.
		Right.
		The place where it all happens.
		Turn your radio off, please, sir.
		Second request.
unidentified		Oh.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You got it?
unidentified		Yep.
unidentified		Good.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now proceed.
unidentified		I got a question.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well.
unidentified		Who's the guy who makes the backward speech?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		David Oates.
unidentified		Oh, yeah.
		Oh, yeah.
		If he records it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
unidentified		If we, um, if you, if someone records someone's speech while it's going backwards and you play that speech backwards, will it come to the original when he played it?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In other words, if you turned backward speech around, would it be forward?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, absolutely.
unidentified		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
unidentified		Yep.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I'm glad that answered it for you.
		That was a lot of pain to go through to get all that, but yes.
		What is played forward can be played in reverse.
		What is played in reverse will be indeed what was said forward.
		In other words, put another way, reverse speech is nothing but a precise mirror image of what is said forward, but in reverse.
		I hope that doesn't confuse you.
		Wildcard line, you're on the air.
unidentified		Good morning, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		You had a caller from Phoenix talking about the Hohokam Indians.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		That was just one of three Indian civilizations that dated back to 300 B.C. Yeah, well, Phoenix has a very rich history.
		And the Hohokam built Casa Grande in the 14th century.
		That was before Christopher Columbus.
		And the fourth level of what is now the Casa Grande Ruins National Monument is theorized to have been used for astronomical observation.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I wouldn't doubt it.
		There are many civilizations that I think may have come before ours that observed things in the sky, that observed the way stars moved.
		There are charts and graphs that have been found.
		There are even cave pictures that would indicate that they were studying the heavens long ago.
		There are even glyphs that would indicate that there were visitors, that they saw ships much like the ones we are describing today.
		So yes, oh yes.
		There could be a grand cycle.
		And it could be that we have come and gone many times before.
		I'll say it again.
		Humanity's present stay on Earth, in the grander scheme of things, is but a blink of the eye.
		But a blink.
		And it may be that eye has been blinking before.
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hi.
		Hello.
		Carson, California, Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello there.
unidentified		Haven't talked to you for ages.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Been a while, yes.
unidentified		Yeah, I turned you on at...
		Until after midnight.
		And I'm wondering, is that signal from Mir strong enough to come through a mobile home or would I have to be outside to pick it up on a probably have to be outside?
		I was afraid of that.
		Because I can get some of the repeaters around here with stronger ones, but as far as something that far away, I didn't know if you needed special.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, are you referring to?
		No, wait a minute now.
		Are you referring to the 143 625?
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, that's not going to come through.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, if you're sitting in there with a little stick on a scanner inside a metal trailer, forget it.
unidentified		Yeah, well, I didn't know.
		I was surprised at that, because you said it was coming real strong.
		I didn't know if you had to have a dish type of thing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, if you've got the scanner to a window and you've got a pass directly overhead, which you probably have around sometime between 10 and 1, you'll probably hear it.
unidentified		Yeah, well, I've tried to listen before with a scrutiny of a dynamo kid is just noise and I don't hear much of anything.
unidentified		So I didn't know if it was too weak of a signal to go through a nerves that kind of figured something that far away with.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it depends on the pass.
		I mean, when the mirror is more or less over you, or within degrees of over you, it's an extremely strong signal because there's nothing in the way.
		It's VHF.
		It's like the highest tower in the world.
unidentified		You know, I know that you and Bob, I think over there in San Jose there, were talking about it one time several years ago.
unidentified		I guess it passed over head and he had his...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I talked to Mir about a month and a half ago.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I had a very nice conversation with him.
unidentified		Uh-huh.
		I see.
		Is there any way with Hong Kong going back to, reverting back to China, is there any way you'd be able to get some recordings off of some kind of a website where the ceremony would be taking place and possibly replay them back on your program for the people that you've seen?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, if I want to know what's going on, I'll just call Emily Lau in Hong Kong and she'll tell me.
unidentified		Well, would you think you'd be able to do that on the 30th here would be the first over there, so it would have to be.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I'll see if I can arrange it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I've got Emily's number in Hong Kong, so we'll see.
unidentified		You know, that would be something to do, because I'd sure be interested to get an insider's view of what happens after it changes over, rather than all the pomp and circumstances.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, there's not going to be anything, thank you, very immediate, to even notice.
		What's going to occur in Hong Kong, there will be a few things, but it'll be like the slowly boiling fog syndrome.
		In other words, it has already begun.
		The legislature in Hong Kong has been replaced.
		There have already been dictates that there will be no public demonstrations against the government.
		And in all likelihood, the people of Hong Kong are not going to do that.
		They well remember the Chinese government and how it handles such things.
		And even though they have enjoyed the taste of freedom for a long time, they're probably going to hope for the best.
		You're not going to see much in the way of demonstration.
		Everybody's going to hope the economic situation remains roughly the same, particularly and certainly the residents.
		And so until and unless there becomes economic downturn as a result of the government, you won't see much protest, much to the distress of Emily Lau and people like her.
		East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		No?
		West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
unidentified		Is this Art Bell?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, it is.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Turn your radio off, please.
unidentified		I just did, sir.
		Thank you.
		Okay.
		Last Friday evening, about 11 o'clock in Vegas time, a neighbor and I saw a bright light up in the sky.
		And it just sat in one spot.
		It didn't move.
		It didn't go anyplace.
		And we watched it until 2 o'clock in the morning.
		And it stayed in the same level for over an hour.
		And then it moved up maybe 50 to 100 feet.
		And we saw a circle of red lights above it.
		And then they went off in like an angle, in a straight, you know, a line, but off at an angle.
		Then they disappear.
		And then maybe 10 minutes later, you'd see them back around in a circle.
		So what?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What do you think you saw?
unidentified		I don't know.
		The two of us sat there and watched that thing.
		And we even went outside and watched it.
		And it didn't move.
		I mean, it just sat in one spot for, oh, over an hour.
		And then when it did go up a little higher, that's when we noticed those red lights.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Well, there was, in addition to that, a very serious sighting of what is being called a boomerang kind of object in the Las Vegas area, north of Las Vegas.
		And we're getting more and more of these reports.
		It seems like the southwest is hot.
		Hot, hot, hot.
		Phoenix?
		Las Vegas?
		My area.
		The southwest, for some reason, now experiencing almost, in terms of quantity, what Mexico City had.
		So something's a cooking out there, huh?
		Wild Guard line, you're on the air.
unidentified		KQMS starting California.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, you made it in.
unidentified		I did.
unidentified		Yeah, you know, this time change on your show, it kind of feels like daylight savings time or something.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you can look at it that way if you want to.
		A one-hour change.
		I know, well, I'm going to...
		I'm just about adjusted now.
unidentified		Well, that's good.
		You know, that was really weird.
		I thought science understood gravity.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No.
unidentified		You know, I've always wanted to ask somebody how come the water didn't spin off the earth, but I thought it would be a really stupid question.
		I thought everybody knew something that I didn't.
		No.
		So I never really asked.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, I mean, we observe gravity, but we don't understand fully why it does what it does.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In other words, you know, Newton did it, you know, dropped the apple, remember that?
unidentified		Well, no, I wasn't there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I mean, you remember the story.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They told you that in school, probably.
unidentified		Well, yeah.
unidentified		I thought he was a lot more brilliant than that, though.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I mean, you can do it yourself.
		Drop an apple, inevitably it hits the floor.
		I mean, watch this.
		See, I'll do it with a lighter.
		Boom.
		Hit the floor.
unidentified		Yeah, but I think it's.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So Something is causing it to go from here to there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And we're not flying off the earth, so there is an effect, but we don't exactly understand what it is.
unidentified		I was thinking if it was a pull from within, wouldn't we all be a lot shorter?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		say that again only the immediate was a uh...
unidentified		a poll and I was thinking we'd all be a lot shorter.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm going to give you some thoughts.
unidentified		Me too.
unidentified		You know, I think this time compression thing is cool because if I'm late for work, I can just say, hey, you know, I used to say that, well, I was abducted by AWS.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You got to tell your boss time compression.
unidentified		Yeah, I was accepted by the U.S. military.
unidentified		You know, in fact, the next time that somebody is AWOL, I can come back and go, sir, it was time compression.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Time compression.
unidentified		That's exactly right.
		Or, hey, here's one for you because I know how you feel about taxes.
		You write that in there.
		You say, I'm sorry, time compression, I paid you already.
		You are suffering from time compression.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
unidentified		Well, that's what you should do.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Somehow, I just don't think it's going to work in these cases.
unidentified		No, no, no.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And the next time you voice that one off on your boss, I'll be anxious to hear the result.
unidentified		He likes the abducted by aliens one.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, he knows you well, then.
unidentified		I'm late because I was abducted by aliens.
		Hey, you know what?
		The interview that I think should put in the time capsule, I guess you could put two.
		But the one I want you to put in is Pam the Lizard Lady.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You liked Pam?
unidentified		That was so funny.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You have no idea the trouble that interview caused.
unidentified		I thought I knew.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, man.
		And I don't care either.
		I had more fun with that.
unidentified		Yeah, so you could put that one in and out.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		People get so distressed.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, people have no sense of humor.
unidentified		I guess they have to do that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		None whatsoever.
unidentified		You know, or you could be really funny and just put that one in.
unidentified		Everybody goes, who is this RPL guy?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Or what about that lawyer I had on not long ago?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		She caused a lot of fun, too.
unidentified		Hey, you know, I really liked her.
		So did I. I could tell from your tone of voice that she had no qualifications whatsoever to speak for ugly people.
		No, no, no.
		She tried to voice it off that, well, ugly people have to be beautiful from the inside.
		And let me tell you something.
		The CNN poll said that 56% of men slept with people that they didn't even like.
		So what's inside doesn't mean diddly.
		Think about it.
		Think about it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it is, of course, partially true.
unidentified		It's a lot true.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, no, it's partially true.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, what's inside does count.
unidentified		How much.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You'll realize that as you get older.
unidentified		Yeah, but I don't want to be old and past shelf life and then have some old, you know, wrinkly-up cigar-smoking guy go, oh, honey, you look pretty good to me.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Your view of shelf-life in general will shift as you age.
unidentified		Well, thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Trust me on this.
unidentified		Thank God.
unidentified		I'm already past my half-shelf life.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But there is absolute truth in the fact that, you know, ugly is as ugly does.
unidentified		You know what?
		Statistics don't bear out her theories, though.
		That you can be beautiful and sexy from the inside and still compete and follow my theories and you can be successful in business.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Rosalie Osiris, that's who it was.
unidentified		That's exactly.
		I know who it was.
		Do you forget her name?
		Yeah.
		Well, your shelf life is kind of getting up there in yours, too.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I didn't forget her picture, though.
unidentified		I know you did.
unidentified		I could tell your jaw was like you're tripping over.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Were you able to get up on the web and see her photography?
unidentified		I had to get up on the website and see your picture.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, man.
unidentified		You were tripping over your lips every time you sat down.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely true.
unidentified		You know what?
unidentified		I was almost embarrassed for you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Really?
unidentified		Yeah.
		I was like, oh, my God.
		Everybody's going to think this guy's a real nutcase now.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You want to know the truth?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I actually enjoy doing things that upset people.
unidentified		I know.
		That's why I call my morning show here, and I like vent.
		And I said, you know, if everybody hates me, then just according to the message.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'll tell you the proof of it.
		I upset a lot of morning shows.
		I'm not kidding.
unidentified		well yeah it's just like you say so if you if everybody hates you Well, you know what?
unidentified		If that theory is true, though, then...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Listen, listen.
		Well, that's true.
		That's it.
		We're out of time.
		Say goodnight.
unidentified		Hey, good night, Cosmos, America, Canada, and everybody.
unidentified		Remember, if you're late for work, time compression.

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