Knowledge Fight Interactive Search Tool

All Episodes

Previous Next

Oct. 23, 1996 - Art Bell

01:56:58

Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell - Joyce Riley - Gulf War Syndrome

Large

Audio Only |

Scroll

Time	Text
	From the high desert and the great American southwest, I bid you all good evening and
	good morning as the case may be across all these many, many time zones.
	From the Tahitian Hawaiian island chain in the west, all the way to the U.S.
	Virgin Islands in the Caribbean.
	Eastward, down south, into South America, north to Santa Country, worldwide on the internet.
	This is Coast to Coast AM.
	Morning everybody, I'm Mark Bell and I've got something kind of special coming up for you here shortly.
	But I want to lay down a little caveat here at the beginning of the program.
	Last night in the final hour of the program, I had to bail out a little bit early.
	My wife suffers from asthma, and she is in the middle of a very difficult time, and if I need to go, I need to go.
	So, if you suddenly get a repeat program, that'll be the cause of it.
	Hopefully, everything will be alright.
	In a moment, we are going to talk about something that we have not talked about before, or at least in great detail on this program.
	The Gulf War Syndrome.
	Of course, we've had a number of stories about it recently, but you're going to hear Probably more than you want to hear about it this morning.
	There are some really frightening things going on that may affect more than just the men and women who were involved in Desert Storm.
	And that's why you're going to want to keep your radio where it is.
	Because while it directly affects them, it could affect you and your loved ones.
	All right.
	This comes from a listener and it will serve to introduce my guest.
	Art, I heard your first news story tonight, referring to last night, about the newly increased figures for chemical exposure of Gulf War troops, and your very appropriate comment about how the government lied to us.
	It seems there was also extensive biological exposure and contamination of troops, and it is contagious, now spreading to military families, and soon The rest of the population.
	You should contact Joyce Riley.
	Registered nurse, BSN captain, USAF inactive reserve.
	She flew medevac from the Gulf, started feeling sick shortly after returning home, was hospitalized six months later, and took over a year to recover.
	Then she started trying to find out what had made her so sick.
	What she's put together is a very disturbing story of government hypocrisy, duplicity, corruption, and cover-up.
	In other words, business as usual.
	But that's not new or news.
	What is news here is that if what she says is true, and she has some pretty good documentation, this time the government lies could very well end up exposing most Americans to a deadly disease and allowing them to become debilitated, even die.
	All the while, the government continues to deny the disease, and a simple treatment does exist, because the government created the disease, and sold it to Iraq, violating Nuremberg and Geneva safety conventions.
	So, following that good advice, I contacted Joyce Riley, and from Houston, Texas, here she is.
	Joyce, welcome to the program.
	Good morning, Art.
	It's my pleasure.
	Really good to have you.
	I know it's late in Houston, after 1 o'clock or something in the morning.
	Is that email that I got, actual email, is that roughly accurate?
	Yes, it is.
	It is probably more tragic than what has been read on the air just now.
	I do thank whatever listener sent that to you.
	I have no idea who it was.
	But the story that you're going to hear tonight, and your listeners are going to hear, is probably the most tragic, not of the 20th century, but of America's history.
	That's quite a statement.
	All right.
	Let's deal first with what the people are seeing on television.
	Whether it was the 60 Minutes program that aired, or it was NBC, not tonight but last night, they showed the detonation of the chemical warfare facility in Iraq.
	And originally they said, well, a few hundred might be affected.
	Then it was a few thousand.
	Then it was 20,000.
	And I hear people talking about as many as 100,000.
	But even that is nothing.
	Is that correct?
	I think what you're going to find is there are upwards of 400,000, even more than that possibly, 400,000 plus that have been exposed to not just chemicals, which you're hearing on the news media, but biologicals.
	And the biologicals are the real issue that we want America to hear about, we want America to be aware of, because this is the disease that can affect all people, not just the Gulf War veterans.
	Um, they had, uh, alarms, Joyce, in the field.
	Uh, and they would go off, and I remember there's a big argument about, well, they're false alarms and all the rest.
	Uh, that would detect the presence of chemical, uh, weapons or exposure to chemical weapons, the alarms.
	Would they, uh, alarm for a virus?
	No, they would not.
	Now, let's differ here when we're talking between chemical and biological weapons.
	Right.
	The United States had in its arsenal both chemical and biological weapons.
	The United States provided both to Saddam Hussein.
	There is evidence of that.
	For those who say, oh, the United States would never do that, well, I'm sorry.
	They did.
	It is fully documented in the Regal Report, and I can give you the sites on those that were presented to the Senate.
	Why did we give these things to Iraq?
	That's a good question and I cannot answer that.
	That is one I do not know.
	The chemical and biological weapons, the chemical specific, were provided in my evidence from 1983 through 1989.
	I do have evidence coming that shows that they were provided through 1990 and possibly 1992.
	Now here is where the rub is.
	The problem is that we violated Geneva Convention regulations of 1972.
	Not only the United States, but Iraq was a signatory to this agreement.
	The United States provided to an unstable third world country biological weapons that had the ability, literally, to annihilate our military, or to make them sick, to give them a time-release disease that they would bring home and share with their families.
	Now the biological weapons are not addressed by the media right now.
	You did not hear about biological weapons on 60 Minutes last night.
	You're not hearing about them on Nightline tonight as we spoke.
	The problem with biological weapons, to tell all your listeners, is that it is a communicable disease.
	Can we back up a little bit?
	Joyce, what is our status?
	Forget Iraq for a second, we'll go back to that.
	What is the U.S.
	status regarding biologicals?
	Are we even supposed to have them now?
	We had agreed in the 1972 Geneva Convention Regulations not to stockpile, experiment, or sell weapons of mass destruction.
	And that would be weapons such as biological weapons, anthrax, botulinum, to name just two of them.
	So we agreed.
	The problem is now, we have done it.
	Now just previously, you mentioned the chemical alarms, and I want to address that because that's incredibly important.
	There were 14,000 chemical alarms that went off during the Gulf War.
	You would be surprised to know how many of those the United States government said were malfunctions.
	Would you like to make a guess?
	14,000.
	They said they were all falses.
	That's correct.
	Now here's an interesting thought.
	I was trained as a flight nurse to take care of any type of victims of biological or chemical warfare, and we did not know this fact.
	I was shocked to find out after the war, and I did not find out until three years later, that the United States Our military did not have one biological detection monitoring system in the entire Persian Gulf.
	Not one.
	Our troops were sent into the theater of operations totally unprotected and totally unmonitored with respect to biological weapons.
	Is there an alarm for biological weapons in the field?
	I know there is for chemicals, that's fairly easy, but biologicals are kind of different, aren't they?
	That's correct.
	I understand that there is one that exists.
	But the truth to this issue, though, is that we thought we were protected.
	We thought we were going to be exposed to anthrax, but we believed that there was some system of monitoring to protect us.
	We did not know that there was not.
	All right, what about those shots that were given to our troops?
	Experimental, they said, before the troops went over.
	What were those for?
	The anthrax that was given to our troops has now been shown to be of questionable, if no, effectiveness.
	Because there is only one type of anthrax vaccine that is made in Michigan.
	Now, they have never proven that the anthrax vaccine that we received was effective when there is aerosolized anthrax at stake.
	And that was what Saddam Hussein had.
	So, it has never been proven.
	And those of you who are students, I would encourage you to get Senate Report 103-97.
	This is a Senate report that tells of the ineffectiveness of the anthrax, of the botulinum, and whether or not it should have been given in the first place.
	Whether or not our troops are sicker because they received it.
	I don't know, Art, that we will ever know just how much the biological versus the anthrax vaccine, versus the PB pills, the white
	pills that everyone talks about, I don't think we will ever know. And I really don't think
	that it is important at this point in time.
	The important thing is our troops are sick. They need treatment,
	and they do not need to be given psychiatric diagnoses as they are right now.
	Well, it's only important if those shots contributed to the present condition or would be even the cause of it.
	Is that possible?
	Oh, I don't think there's any question.
	There's no question in my mind that those vaccines posed a problem.
	There are too many reports of Gulf War veterans Let me get your story.
	afterwards and i'm not talking from a needle i'm talking about from some
	adverse reaction uh... there is too much illness that is reported directly
	after that uh... yet it does play a part i don't know how much
	uh... but you're correct it does play a part in it certainly need to be looked
	into uh... let me get your story
	you were there right i would not have been a operation
	No, but you were transporting people who were.
	That is correct.
	So you were exposed.
	That is correct.
	When did you get sick and what kind of illness did you contract?
	From January to July of 1991, I served as a flight nurse in a reserve unit, Kelly Air Force Base.
	It's the 32nd Air Evacuation Squadron at Kelly Air Force Base, Texas.
	I know it.
	I was an Air Force medic also, Joyce.
	Oh, really?
	Oh, yes.
	Okay.
	Well, then you understand the degree of treatment, or understand the degree of training that goes into what we do.
	Of course.
	Well, I've served from January to July, and from July to December, I deteriorated terribly.
	I came back with a disease we had never seen before.
	I had symptoms we had never heard of before, and I was a heart transplant nurse here in Houston where we had seen almost every opportunistic disease.
	What kind of symptoms?
	A very strange paresthesia.
	Numbness in which you lose feeling and use of a portion of your body.
	This would come on at intervals, it would go away.
	It was very difficult to explain, and when you did explain it, people said, oh gee, that sounds pretty crazy.
	Well, it wasn't crazy, and I would not accept the fact that, oh, it must be stress, it must be this or that.
	I knew this was a very bizarre symptom.
	I would lose use of one extremity or the other, paresthesia, numbness, incredible pain, muscle pain.
	Now let me say here briefly that when I talk about muscle pain, we're not talking about a charley horse.
	We're not talking about some simple problem that we might experience and it goes away and we're just wanting to complain or get some type of compensation.
	We're talking about something that is incredibly severe.
	It is a bizarre type of pain.
	It gets worse.
	And worse and worse.
	And that was what happened to me until I was in the hospital, had practically lost the use of my legs, had incredible excruciating pain, and at the time they finally did some MRIs and found that I had demyelination over seven spots in my brain and spinal cord.
	Demyelination being that of which the myelin sheath comes off of the nerve endings and it's similar to multiple sclerosis.
	I found out that I was no different than what Gulf War veterans are being affected with right now.
	Were they able to identify a cause of invasion?
	No.
	In fact, my diagnosis from discharge from the hospital is multifocal central nervous system disease, etiology unknown.
	Meaning that there is no cause or they do not know what the cause is.
	Gotcha.
	Now, right now we are seeing incredible numbers of multiple sclerosis diagnoses among 27, 29, to 31 year old young men and women.
	I just last week I got three letters from Gulf War veterans who have been diagnosed with MS.
	There are many others that were being diagnosed with Guillain-Barre and ALS, amyolateral sclerosis, which is Lou Gehrig's disease.
	This almost sounds opportunistic.
	I mean there are so many diseases that it's leading to.
	Well, you see, the reason that I believe, and I have to say at this point, I don't have all the answers.
	My God, I wish I did.
	I wish I could just pull it out of the hat and say, hey DOD, Pentagon, here's the answer, now treat our troops.
	But we have had to search, we've had to sacrifice everything that we have to try and find out what we have now.
	And we're finding this.
	The evidence shows that biologicals and chemicals were shipped to Saddam Hussein at least 18 to 20 Biological agents were shipped to Saddam Hussein from 1983, like I said, through 1989.
	Now, these biological agents were used in something called a Soviet doctrine.
	The Soviet doctrine of multiple chemicals and multiple biologicals.
	They were mixed in the scuds.
	When the scuds went over at 200 feet, our patriots went after them, obviously, and we saw the fireworks on TV.
	Right.
	There were biologicals and chemicals that rained down on our troops.
	Now, I have to tell you, I even have the transfer information of the batch numbers that were shipped to Saddam Hussein, as well as the companies that provided the biologicals to Saddam Hussein.
	This information can be obtained, one can study it and determine it.
	But the problem is, the Pentagon has known this since 1991.
	This information has been available.
	It has been withheld from the American public.
	George Bush said, if during the course of the Gulf War, and this was just prior to the beginning of it, they were to use biologicals or chemicals, we would respond with nuclear weapons.
	Do you recall that?
	I recall that.
	I believe that that is exactly what Israel said.
	Now, Israel, I do know for a fact, did tell Saddam Hussein that.
	They stated, if you send us biologicals, you will get nuclear.
	Oh, I believe we told them that as well.
	Well, that's right.
	I understand that, but I know that for sure I can document that Israel did it.
	I'm sure Israel did.
	Look, let me ask you this.
	Again, a lot of the symptoms are non-specific.
	A lot of the diseases that you talked about are You know, that's what's making this hard, is that there is no exact disease.
	And that makes me wonder, some of the symptoms that are talked about, you talked about numbness, night sweats, typical, right?
	Loss of appetite, swollen lymph nodes, all of these symptoms, it occurs to me, Joyce, are also found in AIDS.
	And with an apparent opportunistic A sort of disease hitting a lot of these Gulf War vets now.
	Isn't it possible that we have some form of autoimmune deficiency here?
	I don't think it's possible.
	I think it is probable.
	I think that when we are looking at the Gulf War illness, what we are talking about, according to Dr. Garth Nicholson of the MD Anderson Cancer Center, is we are seeing a disease that mimics AIDS.
	It cannot be detected on the western blot or the illicit test.
	Right.
	One does not seroconvert positive to AIDS.
	However, according to Dr. Nicholson, and he is a Nobel Prize nominee, I am not, obviously, and I am referring to his science, he states that 40% of the HIV envelope gene has been inserted into the nucleus of the mycoplasma, thus giving us something called mycoplasma incognitus.
	He has written a paper about it.
	It has appeared in the Journal of the American Medical Association.
	This does mimic AIDS.
	Thus, the pictures that I have seen of many of the Gulf War veterans that are dying look like an AIDS-related disease.
	There is weight loss, night sweats, headaches, rash, joint pain, lymph node swelling.
	Yes, they do mimic AIDS.
	But we are talking about death here.
	I'm not talking about just some lymph node swelling and some rashes.
	I'm talking about the deaths of approximately 15,000 Gulf War veterans, of which the Department of Defense now admits to 6,500 deaths.
	We are talking about deaths of Gulf War veterans.
	What do all these death certificates say?
	Joyce, hold on.
	We've got a break here at the bottom of the hour, alright?
	And we'll be right back to you.
	My guest is Joyce Riley.
	She's an RN.
	She treated Gulf War vets.
	And I would suggest you actually turn the volume on your radio up a little bit and listen just a little more closely.
	Because what might have been thousands of miles away and not affecting you is now at home.
	Here, and may indeed affect us.
	I'm Art Bell, and this is CBC.
	Back now to Houston, and Joyce Riley.
	Joyce?
	Yes, sir.
	Welcome back.
	Thank you.
	No, you were the sir.
	I was just enlisted.
	You were a captain, I understand.
	You were a captain.
	Yes, if you're the talk show host.
	Yeah, well, that doesn't make me a sir, believe me.
	Anyway, Joyce, I'm recalling a long time ago, back when we began talking about the AIDS epidemic, there was testimony of a Senate hearing in which it was discussed how would one construct a virus that would attack the immune system.
	They worked on this.
	There's absolutely no question about it.
	They worked on this.
	And I'm wondering if what we're dealing with today might not be the fruit of that labor.
	Well, I would tend to agree with you.
	And I would like to quote from that.
	And by the way, I want you to know, and everyone that is listening, that I utilize documentation.
	Part of my objective has been to bring forward the story of the Gulf War illness with documentation.
	I did not use opinion.
	I do not use my own conjecture because it is of no value.
	But there is something called House Bill 15090 or Public Law 91-171.
	Now this is very important.
	You just mentioned it and I think we need to discuss this because I believe this plays a very big cornerstone, a very big foundation, part of the foundation in this whole thing.
	This is an appropriation bill of 1969 for the year 1970.
	Right.
	It was the subcommittee of that Committee on Appropriations, the House of Representatives, 91st Congress.
	Now, George Mahon of Texas was chairman of this, and I would encourage your listeners to get a copy of Public Law 91-171, but more importantly, you will need to get the congressional hearings that go along with it.
	Let me read just a couple of sentences from this.
	It is entitled Synthetic Biological Agents.
	Within a period of five to ten years, it would be possible to produce a synthetic biological agent, an agent that does not naturally exist, and for which no natural immunity could have been acquired.
	Ladies and gentlemen, I would ask you, does the name Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome ring a bell?
	Now, I am again, I am quoting from a congressional hearing, where it says, This would differ in certain important aspects from any known disease-causing organisms.
	Most important of these is that it might be refractory or damaging to the immunological and therapeutic processes upon which we depend to maintain our relative freedom from infectious disease.
	Now in this particular document they stated it would take five years to produce it and ten million dollars.
	A FOIA request was done.
	It was determined that a virus was made It was produced in 1975 and that it did take 10 million dollars.
	However, they would not disclose the name of the virus.
	I would simply remind you that the first evidence of the gay wasting disease in New York and San Francisco was in 1975.
	This art is a Department of Defense appropriation for a synthetic biological agent.
	Do I think it plays into this?
	Absolutely.
	There's not a doubt in my mind.
	I was afraid you were going to say that.
	Of course, we have no way to know whether batches of that went anywhere or even existed.
	It's all Black Project stuff.
	But you do know, don't you, that certain batches, in fact, did go to Iraq.
	Now, I want to ask you something about that.
	It is this.
	The United States had a great deal of interest in seeing to it that Iraq kept Iran in place, particularly during the early years that you talked about.
	And, no doubt, we provided them with weapons.
	We provided them with, um, probably all kinds of stuff.
	And, I guess that, um, I guess we might have provided them with some of this stuff.
	Could it have been for that reason?
	I mean, after all, they are now, obviously, our enemy.
	And, I don't think, God, I hope we're not sending it over there now.
	Um, but then we might have done it with Iran as the reason.
	Uh, what do you think?
	Well, I don't really care what the reason was.
	I don't care if it was defensive posture.
	I don't care if it was offensive.
	The issue is, we both violated Geneva Convention regulations.
	Now, whether or not we were trying to beef up Iraq in support of Iran, well, the issue is, the truth is, we sold it to both countries.
	We sold it to many other third world countries.
	I have a document here in which the Sigma Aldrich Corporation of St.
	Louis has been fined $400,000 this past July for the sale of biologicals to third world countries without a license.
	You see, they have been violating the export license requirements here in the United States with these biologicals.
	There are several companies that have done this, and I would submit to you that there is now a class action suit on behalf of Gulf War veterans that has been filed.
	Now, I am not a party to this suit, and I choose not to become a party to it, because I don't want anyone to misunderstand or misinterpret my being on your radio show or promoting the issue of the Gulf War veterans.
	But there is a company that has been identified, the American Type Culture Collection out of Maryland, out of Rockland, Maryland, that has sold biologicals to Saddam Hussein.
	Alright, this is a non-profit government contractor?
	It is essentially a government contractor, I guess you would say, yes.
	It is the American Type Culture Collection out of Maryland.
	They are non-profit.
	Now they sold biologicals to Saddam Hussein with Full recognition of the U.S.
	Government, of the Department of Commerce, and the Communicable Disease Center in Atlanta.
	During what years?
	My evidence, like I said, is 82 through 89.
	However, I have evidence coming to me that shows 90 through 92.
	So that these biologicals have been sold to Saddam Hussein in a time period, and I believe, without any hesitation, I can say that they were sold Through May of 1990.
	Now, you will understand that war was essentially declared in August of 1990.
	Right.
	Why we were doing this, I cannot answer that question.
	The issue is we were doing it.
	We did it.
	The issue is that we sold anthrax, we sold Clostridium botulinum, we sold Staph, we sold Strep, we sold E. coli, and we have a list of those Class III pathogens that were sold to Saddam Hussein.
	Well, let's say that we even sold him something more horrible concocted after that Senate hearing.
	This is the end of Side 1.
	Please leave the cassette exactly where it is.
	I mean, you're talking about a disease that's now back in this country, and it is my understanding that whatever in the hell it is, other people are now beginning to get it.
	People who were not there.
	Relatives.
	Loved ones.
	Correct?
	Yes.
	Alright, here's my question, Joyce.
	If we concocted something like this, knew that he had it, and knew that he would use it, For us to sell it to him is absolutely nothing short of suicidal.
	Why would we do that?
	Well, I think there's another term that applies here, and that is the term treason.
	I am very clear on what I am saying, and I am not afraid, nor do I hesitate in using the term treason.
	For whatever reason that we sold it to Saddam Hussein, and I cannot say why, But I will say this, we can only look at the facts.
	The facts are, we sold it.
	The facts are, we sent our troops into harm's way.
	They did not have appropriate chemical protection.
	The chemical alarms were denied.
	They were told they were malfunctioned.
	And the troops were told, do not go to MOP-4.
	MOP-4 being the protective element, including helmet.
	They were told, do not go to MOP-4.
	Do not don your mask and your protective equipment.
	I cannot answer why.
	I've been told several reasons, but they were told essentially don't do it.
	So we put our troops in harm's way.
	We had no biological monitoring systems, as we mentioned.
	Why do you imagine they might have been... I'm curious.
	Why do you imagine they might have been told that?
	I don't know.
	Honestly, I do not know the answer to that question.
	It is beyond me.
	It is beyond any training.
	It is beyond any health care information or education I could possibly have consumed in my past that I could even project the reason why.
	Here is what I have a problem with.
	We brought these troops back here, and even before they came back, they were complaining of symptoms of gastrointestinal problems, severe problems.
	I'm not talking about just throwing up once in a while.
	I'm talking about severe problems.
	Many of them were air-vacced out to Rhein-Main, Germany, and they were not treated.
	They were given Pepto-Bismol-like drugs.
	They were given Motrin for the joint pain.
	They were not treated.
	They were brought back to the United States, and now, Art, At least, according to the people that I have talked with, 90% of our military has now been given a psychiatric diagnosis.
	A diagnosis of some type of mental disorder that is putting them out of the category of a physical illness, so that the VA can say, gee, we don't see any Gulf War illness.
	80% of the British Gulf War veterans, because we had coalition troops that served, 80% of the British Gulf War veterans have been labeled psychiatric problems, and 90% recently in the New York Times, just this week, of the Czech troops have been given a diagnosis of a psychiatric problem.
	Recent news on the Czechs was, the Czechs did don the gear, according to the 60 Minutes piece, correct?
	That we did not don?
	Yes.
	Um, did it not protect them?
	I believe that it did to a certain extent.
	I do not believe that it totally protected them because there are sick and dying Gulf War veterans in the Czech Republic.
	Now, we need to talk about the Czech issue because this plays a very, very big part in this.
	All right.
	The alarms that went off during the Gulf War, the United States alarms, the American military, the colonels, et cetera, the commanders of the unit said, oh, disregard.
	Uh, those alarms, uh, they're malfunctioning, our equipment is not good.
	However, the Czechs had the state-of-the-art equipment.
	When the Czech alarms went off, it was fully known by all the NBC NCOs, and I say NBC meaning the Nuclear Biological and Chemical NCOs, that the Czech alarms were the gold standard.
	Czech alarms went off.
	The Czechs told the Americans that is registered on the NBC logs, the nuclear, biological, and chemical logs of Schwarzkopf.
	Those are in the property or the responsibility of Central Command.
	He was the Commander-in-Chief of Central Command.
	We have logs showing, and these were previously classified and have been declassified, logs showing that the Czech alarms were sounding.
	The American troops were told, do not go to MOP-4, don't worry about it, it's all a mistake.
	So the Czechs did go to MOPFOR.
	Now the New York Times, Phil Sheenan in his excellent article that just appeared stated that the Czechs were in MOPFOR and they looked over and saw the military troops unprotected.
	They asked the question of what is going on and the American commander said we don't want to panic our troops.
	Now think about this America.
	I'm thinking.
	That just appeared in the New York Times.
	We're talking about men's lives.
	We're talking about their future.
	We're talking about the health now of a country, and we were told, don't worry about it, we don't want to scare you.
	So they didn't go to MOP4.
	Now, the problem is, we have Gulf War veterans that did don their MOP4 gear, and that didn't don their MOP4 gear, that are sick.
	But you see, they didn't realize they were exposed to biologicals.
	Now here's the problem.
	Biologicals, when you take your suit off, they get all over you, but they stay alive.
	Right.
	So just so you take your suit off and your mask off, doesn't mean the biologicals have gone away.
	They're in the equipment.
	They're in your tent.
	They were in the Scud missiles, so they're exploded everywhere.
	They're in the sand.
	And we now know that the silica binds to the... the biologicals bind to the silica in the sand for at least 10 years.
	Ten years.
	It may even be up to 40 years.
	Really?
	Yes.
	So, that explains why Gulf War veterans are now coming back from three-month rotations.
	The 34th Tactical Fighter Wing out of Florida, at Fort Walton Beach, Pensacola area, the Fort Hood troops are going over now on three-month rotations, or have been prior to the recent upgrade in the war.
	You see, we have been sending over troops on a three-month basis to Kuwait and Saudi Arabia ever since the war.
	Correct.
	Those troops are coming back, and they are not ill.
	They're sick.
	They have the rash, they have the joint pain, and it gets worse.
	And they're calling me, and they're telling me, they're saying, gee, I was only there three months, why am I sick?
	Because of the equipment.
	Because of the biological... Alright, Joyce, here's a question for you.
	Um, what about the indigenous population?
	If our troops are going over there and getting sick, then the indigenous population should be certainly getting sick.
	Full-time exposure.
	Excellent point.
	According to Dr. Nicholson, and I have not personally talked to any of the emissaries from the countries that Dr. Nicholson has, and he has found that in the Persian Gulf Theater, and I say the Theater of Operations, meaning Saudi Arabia, Iran, Iraq, United Arab Emirates, Oman, every country over there surrounding the Theater of Operations, excluding Syria, we have no figures on Syria, He tells me that 20% of the people in the Persian Gulf area are now ill.
	Oh my God.
	I have had no one that has been able to combat that or to deny that figure.
	I received a call from the Beirut Times, who attended one of the programs that I did showing the documentation, who agreed with this.
	I have even so much as gone to taxi drivers in New York and asked them, those from Iran and Iraq, what are you seeing over there?
	It has been verified again.
	In fact, I have been told That in Iran, there are more babies being born deformed than there are being born normal.
	Oh my God.
	So, I have also been told by Dr. Nicholson that an emissary from Iraq has stated that 500,000 Iraqi individual citizens have already died of the Gulf War illness and another million are sick.
	I have no personal way of documenting that other than the reporter from the Beirut Times did tell me that she believes that that is appropriate.
	So we're talking about a problem, not just in the United States, we're talking about a global problem.
	Apparently.
	Alright, let me stop you there and now ask you this, because there are going to be a lot of people sitting out there saying, well, yeah, I'm really sorry about all the Gulf War vets, but, you know, it doesn't affect me.
	That's not necessarily true, is it?
	In other words, whatever it is, is back here now in nearly every part of our geography, because the Gulf War vets came home and went home to all parts of the U.S., Canada, Hawaii, Alaska, everywhere, right?
	And so, what evidence is there that whatever the hell this is, it is now beginning to spread here?
	Well, first of all, of course, we have to look at a Senate document.
	103-900, and I would encourage everyone to get these documents I speak about.
	103-900 is a report by Senator Riegel, in which, on February 9th of 1994, he went to the Senate and he stated the following, and this is very important.
	He stated, our troops are sick and dying.
	He didn't talk about joint pains and rash.
	He said, our troops are sick and dying.
	Biologicals and chemicals were used on our troops.
	They were sold by the United States.
	And, he said, this is a communicable illness.
	It is a communicable illness and it is a public health hazard.
	Already, he stated, 75% of the troops have affected one other person in their family with this disease.
	Wow.
	It is now spreading.
	The wives by the hundreds are calling.
	The children of the Gulf War veterans.
	I talked to several veterans today, one who had one son that had the disease.
	He had already lost one son to the disease, and his wife was sick.
	And he said, I cannot tell you how angry it makes me feel to know that my country has abandoned me.
	They tell me this is all in my head.
	I am just imagining it.
	America, this is what we've done to our military, and it is a tragedy.
	Do we know anything about how it is spread?
	Yes, we do.
	And we have asked.
	That the American Association of Blood Banks stopped taking donations of blood from Gulf War veterans.
	However, they have not done this.
	After the war, there was a brief moratorium on the taking of Gulf War veterans' blood.
	Right.
	However, and I would submit to you that on February 9th of 1994, this information was passed to the Senate.
	It was told to the Senate Majority Leader, Bob Dole.
	Bob Dole's wife, Elizabeth, Controls over 50% of the blood donations in this country.
	Right.
	There has been no stop to the taking of Gulf War veterans' blood.
	The blood is going into the mainstream.
	It is transferred via blood.
	It is transferred via sex.
	And a new way that we have been unfamiliar with in the past, it is transferred via perspiration.
	Perspiration?
	Yes.
	So we're getting reports now from gyms and from tanning beds And from, uh, I just got a call about a daughter that died who was an aerobics instructor, 27 years old.
	She did not serve in the Persian Gulf, but she had all the symptoms and she had the disease, essentially what the Gulf War veterans have.
	So we're seeing an incredible transfer of this disease, the Mycoplasma incognitus, which is the first biological agent that has been identified, uh, that is causing the transfer.
	Now, I have received a phone call from California, in Southern California, The very western side in which a physician called me and said, I have 100 patients that have the Gulf War Illness.
	I've done specimens.
	I've sent them to the county.
	I've sent them to the state.
	He said, Joyce, I'm telling you, we have a communicable disease here.
	And I said, I know, sir.
	He said, I saw your video the other night.
	He said, it explains exactly the disease we're looking at.
	And he said, for the first time in 17 years of practicing medicine, he said, I am scared.
	And I said, sir, You have reason to be scared, because there is no means to treat this disease, there is no means to stop this disease, other than the doxycycline, which is only effective if it's used early on.
	So we have a communicable disease that is passing throughout the population.
	And Art, I would have to ask you, why are we all of a sudden hearing about fibromyalgia?
	Why are we all of a sudden hearing about this incredible amount of chronic fatigue?
	All of these types of diseases, uh, uh, hantavirus, Why did we never have Hantavirus before 1991?
	I would like the answers to these questions, too, Joyce.
	Listen, we're at the top of the hour, so I'm going to ask you to sit back, relax, and we'll be back to you in about, well, in a few moments.
	All right?
	You got it.
	Stay right there.
	Yikes.
	And that does not do it justice.
	You can't say on the radio what you ought to say at a moment like this, I suppose, huh?
	We're going to break.
	Top of the hour and we'll be right back with Joyce Riley.
	This is CBC.
	It's time to get ready To realize just what I have found
	I have been on the path of what I am This is the CBC Radio Network.
	It absolutely is.
	Good morning.
	My guest is Joyce Reiling.
	She is a registered nurse.
	She's here to talk to you about the Gulf War Syndrome, disease, whatever it is.
	We're not sure.
	But before you touch that dial, you might want to know that what was there is now here and spreading.
	A disease that we concocted may have sold to Iraq.
	Now coming home to roost in more ways than one, our Gulf War vets, of course, have come back, and they aren't dying.
	And people around them are beginning to die.
	Here once again is Joyce Riley.
	Joyce, you know, there's a lot of controversy about this, and you hear statements from the Pentagon, and they slowly admit this and that.
	How sure are you of what you're saying?
	I, at this point, of everything that I have said to you thus far tonight, I am 100% sure of what I have said.
	The sad part is, literally, Art, every morning I wake up, I pray to God that what I know is not true.
	But I have studied it, I have learned it, and I have probably talked to over 500 very sick and dying Gulf War veterans.
	There's no doubt in my mind this is true.
	Whether America wants to admit to it or not, or whether the Pentagon wants to admit to it or not, is not going to make it any less significant.
	The truth is the truth.
	You know there can be a million lies.
	There is only one truth.
	And the fact that the Pentagon has been coming out on a daily basis, altering and changing their facts and figures, is only more evidence of what we know has been happening.
	Well, the world saw what Saddam Hussein did to the Kurds.
	He gasped.
	We saw the bodies.
	It was a big, big story, and then it just sort of went away.
	But to me, that clearly demonstrates capability and intent and willingness to use those kinds of weapons.
	I mean, obviously, he did it.
	He would do it again.
	He was facing the big war.
	So I always thought he would have used those weapons, and I was surprised at the time.
	Uh, that a lot of what came down in Israel, a lot of what came down over, uh, the heads of our GIs, didn't, we didn't get any news of biologicals or chemicals.
	None at all.
	Not when the war was going on.
	No, we didn't.
	And you know, the sad part is that there has been evidence since 1991 that chemicals were used.
	Uh, back into February, I have you in, or I have, I'm sorry, um, documents that are the NBC logs.
	Now, I want to go back to focus on these NBC logs because they were so critical.
	Well, of course.
	Central Command kept a running log of everything that happened in the war with regard to nuclear and biological chemical incidents.
	Right.
	They have reported several incidents, one of which that I utilized in the program of documentation that I show, which is the use of mustard gas.
	One individual had mustard gas burned.
	This is important because Along with that, I received many reports from the Arovac personnel, that Arovac individuals to Rhein-Main, that had chemical burns.
	There were also many individuals who told me of autopsies that were done at Fort Dix, I'm sorry, at Dover, that had chemical burns as the cause of death.
	Those autopsies are now missing.
	There is not one report of any chemical death, but we have a number of people that attended those autopsies.
	So we know that chemicals were used.
	We know that biologicals were used.
	There are several incidents of where 50 camels were found dead in one particular place.
	The significance of that being that they had dead flies.
	Anytime you find all dead animals in one area, you need to get out of it and immediately suspect that it is chemical or biological.
	I have individuals that have called me and told me about the agricultural sprayers of anthrax.
	This is something you have not heard about in the news, but you will be hearing about it.
	The agricultural sprayers that transmitted the anthrax to our troops, of which the government has full knowledge of this and have been withholding.
	So, obviously, there is no question biologicals and chemicals were used.
	Alright, what are you talking about when you're talking about agricultural spraying?
	What do you mean?
	During the war?
	During the war.
	These are sprayers that can be loaded onto a truck, onto an aircraft, that can disperse anthrax via an agricultural sprayer.
	Right.
	These were utilized on several different occasions.
	Which appear to have provided the transmission of the anthrax, along with the fuel-air bombs, which we know the fuel-air explosives were provided by the United States also.
	We have the names of the corporations that have provided that.
	Excuse me, let me stop you again, Cold.
	I had somebody tell me recently, Joyce, that we didn't know it, but that quite a number of fuel-air explosives were used in the war.
	Do you have information about that?
	Yes, I do.
	I've had many reports about fuel-air explosives, um, that they were used by Saddam Hussein and possibly, and I won't go any farther than that right now, by the United States.
	Now, I know from the reports that I have received from the pilots that transferred the biological agents aboard their aircraft to Kuwait, that they were transferred, that they know that they were used.
	You know, the issue is not, was it fuel-air bombs, was it scuds, was it immunizations?
	The issue is we have dying troops.
	The problem is we have a disparity here between what the Pentagon is saying and what we're seeing among our military.
	They are dying!
	You have not heard about one report of a dying Gulf War veteran yet on the major news networks, and one has to ask the question, why?
	You're saying 15,000 have died, is that correct?
	That's correct.
	15,000, that's a lot of deaths!
	And just as we were coming to the top there, I said, well, what does it say on all of these 15,000 death certificates?
	Some of them cite cardiomyopathy or enlarged heart.
	The title, idiopathic cardiomyopathy, meaning the heart enlarged, we don't know why.
	And the lay term for that is now being called the exploding heart syndrome.
	We believe and have seen that when the mycoplasma incognitus attacks the heart, it causes the heart to enlarge, they have a very fast pulse rate, and they end up getting a heart essentially the size of their chest cavity.
	Upon death, an autopsy is done and a very large heart is found.
	Well, obviously that is not a quote-unquote Gulf War illness, that is simply cardiomyopathy.
	However, it really is a byproduct of the Gulf War because we're seeing these 27-year-old men that are dying of this, and also 27-year-old men that are on transplant lists to receive heart transplant.
	And I have received phone calls from many of them.
	The other thing that we are seeing is severe staph and strep infection.
	I have in front of me pictures of a young man who went to the Persian Gulf as a very healthy, robust paratrooper, and when he returned, he had an incredible staph infection.
	The family was told by the VA We will have to remove his entire skin.
	It was done.
	I literally have those pictures in front of me.
	Excuse me.
	Excuse me.
	His entire skin?
	That is correct.
	Anyone who wants to see the story about this can see the American Legion Magazine of August 6th, in which they removed every inch of this man's skin and said that they would transplant him with pig skin.
	What?
	They did.
	Yes, sir, they did.
	It did not work.
	And he died about three weeks later.
	Two weeks later, his child was born.
	Now here is the insult of all insults.
	The family applied for compensation for this young child that was born, who is now three years of age.
	And I don't mind telling you, it's the Raleigh and Arleigh Seepkin family of Plainfield, Iowa.
	They have given me permission to use his name.
	Their young son, Scott, was 27 at the time of the war.
	Yes, he died a horrible, incredibly torturous death.
	But this is the Insult of all insults, when he returned, the VA told the family that he was a healthy young 27-year-old man.
	When he went to the Persian Gulf, he must have wanted to think himself into a home.
	They literally put that in a letter.
	This is the tragedy.
	These men have been brought back here and told the following.
	You have PTSD, post-traumatic stress disorder.
	You must have had a cocaine problem, which many of these troops absolutely were staunch about the fact they don't even drink and don't even smoke.
	But because they were bleeding, and here again we have hemorrhagic disorders... The military is tested for drugs.
	Yes, absolutely.
	And the hemorrhagic disorders are something that we are seeing among Gulf War veterans right now.
	We can go into that a little bit later, but the troops are now told, well, you must do cocaine, and that's why you're bleeding.
	Well, these men don't do cocaine.
	And yes, they were tested, but they put it in their official record.
	The VA now is placing our troops on the following drugs, and I wish that Gulf War veterans would call in and confirm this.
	Prozac.
	Prozac?
	Halcyon.
	Yes, sir.
	Prozac.
	Halcyon.
	Bus bar.
	Zoloft, Ativan, and Paxil.
	Okay, uh, Prozac and Halcyon, these are, uh, psycho, um... Psychotropic drugs.
	Psychotropic drugs.
	What about the other ones you named?
	I'm not familiar with them.
	Are they also in the same class?
	Yes, they are.
	Those are the drugs of choice now for Gulf War veterans.
	And Motrin.
	So that when they go in and complain of this incredible, incredible joint pain, and we're not talking about a sore joint here, I've had it, I know what it is.
	It is a tendency to almost be unable to even move the joint, period, let alone walk.
	And they're giving them Motrin.
	Now, most of the troops come down with an immense chronic fatigue at first, and they are placed on caffeine pills for the chronic fatigue.
	This is the manner in which Dr. Steven Joseph said tonight on Nightline, we are treating the Gulf War veterans.
	I would submit to you, Art, I do not know of one Gulf War veteran That has been treated.
	In fact, on the CBS News tonight, there were some Gulf War veterans at the Houston VA.
	I was with them last week.
	They are angry, they are bitter, and they have not been treated.
	Joy, slow down for a second.
	There was a Nightline show tonight, and who was on it, please?
	Dr. Steven Joseph, who is the point man for the Pentagon to cover up the Gulf War illness.
	Alright, Dr. Stephen Joseph.
	I didn't get to see Nightline.
	It just went off here a little while ago here on the West Coast.
	What essentially did he say?
	Dr. Stephen Joseph came on to tell America that we are treating all the symptoms of the Gulf War veterans.
	Now understand what he just said.
	He told you the truth.
	They are treating symptoms.
	They are not treating diseases.
	Prozac, Halcyon.
	Exactly.
	So forth.
	They also said, or he also said, and he, by the way, is the Assistant Secretary of Health Affairs for the Pentagon.
	He also said there is no single illness in the Gulf War.
	That is true.
	That may be true, yes.
	That's right.
	There were multiple biologicals and multiple chemicals that were used.
	So we have a multiple of symptoms and diseases.
	He basically said, we have done everything we can, and that is not true.
	I am sorry, but I would like to go on record as saying, Dr. Stephen Joseph should be removed from that position, and he literally should lose his license to practice medicine.
	Alright, let's say that you had your way, and you could order what would happen right now with regard to this whole thing.
	What would you do at this point?
	If I had my way right now, I would somehow get the Pentagon, Uh, the Department of Health and Human Services to admit to what happened during the Gulf War and begin immediate, immediate treatment of the Gulf War veterans, of their children, and of their spouses.
	But you said it earlier, they would then be admitting treason, wouldn't they?
	Well, I think, you know, the terms that we're using, yes, it is treason.
	Because, I don't know if you're aware of this or not, but we have been in a state of war with Saddam Hussein since 1991.
	The war never ended.
	Right.
	Um, the war has officially been on this entire time.
	In fact, I received a document from Veterans Administration, and they confirmed it, that we are still at war with Saddam Hussein.
	It is my opinion that we are aiding and abetting the enemy by not treating our military.
	Therefore, You are correct.
	It is treasonous activity.
	Well, it's worse than that.
	If they understood these weapons were being used, and they refused to issue orders to protect the troops, there's a treasonous act right there, a very serious one.
	That is correct.
	And that would then continue today, right through today.
	I don't think we're going to admit that, do you?
	I don't know if they admit it.
	I really don't care if they admit it.
	I want to get these men and women treatment.
	That's my main issue as a nurse.
	How do you treat them?
	How would you treat them?
	First of all, there is an antibiotic that has been proven effective.
	It is called doxycycline.
	If it is used early on, it does tend to abate the symptoms and treat the disease.
	Now, unfortunately, we have waited too long.
	I know Dr. Edward Heinlein went before the Presidential Advisory Commission that Clinton has initiated Which essentially is a delaying tactic to uncover the information with the Gulf War, which is my opinion.
	I have testified before them and I certainly believe that.
	But he stated, there are many troops that would have been alive today that we could have treated had the treatment been told to them early.
	Now Doxa Cycling, this is very serious what I'm going to say, Art.
	Doxa Cycling is very cheap.
	It's about $5 per week to treat a Gulf War veteran.
	The Veterans Administration and the Department of Defense facilities have denied, openly denied Gulf War veterans the use of doxycycline to treat this disease.
	Alright Joyce, let me stop you because I need to understand something here.
	Doxycycline, an antibiotic, I could understand that could be used to treat symptoms of some sort of chemical agent, but it would not be used to treat a virus, would it?
	Well, it treats the biological agent.
	In effect, it will treat the mycoplasma incognitus.
	Now, the mycoplasma incognitus we find to be the biggest offender.
	Is it the cure-all?
	No.
	Is it a treatment for everything?
	Absolutely no.
	But, it appears that about 65% of all Gulf War veterans are positive for mycoplasma incognitus.
	Which, by the way, the test can only be done outside the DOD facilities.
	They are not allowing that test to be done.
	So we are finding Gulf War veterans that are positive for Mycoplasma incognitus that could have been treated by doxycycline.
	I just learned tonight, in talking with a sergeant from Phoenix, that they are now allowing Gulf War veterans to be treated with doxycycline if they demand it.
	And I've been getting out a lot of information.
	We've been passing out from the American Gulf War Veterans Association the information on the treatment of the disease to where Gulf War veterans all over the country are demanding this antibiotic be given.
	How late is too late?
	I don't know.
	I know that there is a husband and wife team that are both quite ill.
	They have not been able to work for the last three months.
	They have been totally debilitated, almost in bed all the time, have lost about 50 pounds, at least the husband has.
	And they told me last week, I'm sorry, a month ago, they called me and told me that after taking three months of doxycycline, they are now able to return to work.
	Now, this is five years later, so I can't tell you whether or not it's too late.
	I am not a physician.
	I am not practicing medicine right now, but again, I would refer you to the February 22nd Journal of the American Medical Association for your information on this.
	And I would encourage, go for veterans, To go to their doctor and find out about doxycycline.
	But what happens if you go to your doctor?
	Yes.
	You go to your doctor and you say, I've got the Gulf War disease, I need doxycycline, I got this information from the American Gulf War Veterans Association.
	The doctor says, hey, I watch Dan Rather, I watch CNN, there is no Gulf War illness.
	The Pentagon told us that.
	I cannot treat you for a disease that does not exist.
	Here is something that troubles me more than I can tell you.
	Gulf War veterans.
	have gone to feed stores to get tetracycline to treat themselves and their family.
	I do not recommend it.
	I do not want to see Gulf War Veterans forced to do this.
	But I know of many Gulf War Veterans that either do not have the money or cannot get the prescription that have gone to feed stores to purchase Vibramycin for cattle or tetracycline for fish.
	So you're definitely not officially recommending that.
	You're just informing us that some have done that.
	That is correct.
	And I would hate to think that our military will have to stoop so low as to be treated less than an animal.
	Joyce, I want to take some calls.
	We're at the bottom of the hour.
	Hold tight.
	We'll come right back to you, alright?
	Certainly.
	Alright, we'll be right back.
	My guest is Joyce Riley.
	Good morning.
	I see trees of green Red roses too I've seen them bloom For me and you And I think to myself What a wonderful world
	I see skies so blue, and clouds so white, the bright blessed day, the dark sacred night, and I think to myself, Back now to Joyce Riley.
	Joyce, you're back on the air.
	Thank you.
	So, if you wouldn't mind, I would like to begin to take some calls about all of this.
	I know there are a million people with questions.
	And every day, there are more revelations from our government about the number of people exposed, what they were exposed to.
	I've got an article in front of me right now from The Nation entitled, Golf War Vets Questioned About Nerve Gas.
	Nerve gas.
	So, are they beginning to wonder now if nerve gas was used?
	Well, we know that nerve gas was used because they've admitted to sarin gas having exploded at Camasea.
	The bunker that was exploded at Camasea was quite, quite large.
	It was, uh, the one bunker they're referring to was the size of a Walmart.
	It contained, uh, at least, we know, 25,000 pounds of sarin gas, a nerve agent.
	So there are some Gulf War veterans who believe that they were exposed as many as 40 times to the release of sarin gas.
	Now these are not just people who are thinking that, they're NBC NCOs, Nuclear Biological and Chemical NCOs, who are in charge of that particular arena that knew that they were exposed to sarin gas.
	So this is a whole big issue, plus it brings in the anti-nerve agent pills that they were given, which have turned out to be an absolute fiasco also.
	But yes, in answer to what you're saying, sarin gas was utilized.
	Sarin gas.
	Now, one thing I want to tell you, Art, is that on 60 Minutes, when they played the video that was brought to them by one of the Gulf War veterans that had taken this home video inside the bunker, Yes.
	is they showed sarin gas with yellow canisters on them, or the canisters with yellow bands.
	Right.
	Significant for chemicals.
	I saw them.
	Yes.
	What they did not show you, and what 60 Minutes would not do, the troops wanted them to zoom in and show you The American markings on the sarin gas.
	Oh my God.
	They would not do that.
	So here we have, you know, the media involved in this.
	I will tell you that you are not getting a fair shake.
	You are not getting the truth on this story.
	It is much worse than anyone knows.
	I wonder if it's possible to get some of that video and to computer enhance it and go in and actually see where it does say something about the U.S.
	Is it just that the shot was at a distance, or just that they didn't show enough of it to show that?
	Well, it's that they did not zoom in on it, and the troops asked them to please do that.
	They wanted America to see the U.S.
	markings on the sarin gas, but they failed to do that.
	No, it can be done.
	I've received calls from many of the individuals that were in the 37th Engineering Battalion that did detonate that bunker, and they relayed to me that it was very clear that you could see the U.S.
	markings.
	Are there any photographs or video in existence that show that?
	Yes, there are.
	Do you have that?
	I do not personally have it, but I know where it can be obtained.
	Well, if somebody would be so kind as to send it to me, I'd be glad to publicize it.
	So we've got a wide audience, Joyce.
	If it exists out there, we'll get a copy of it and get it up on a web page and let people take a look.
	How's that?
	Excellent.
	Excellent.
	This is the end of side one.
	This is CBC.
	All right, let's take a few questions from the audience.
	West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Joyce Riley.
	Do the wild thing at 702-727-1295.
	Alex?
	No, no, no, we can't take your last name, dear.
	Okay.
	So one thing you're not allowed to do.
	So your name is?
	Sheila.
	Sheila, and you're calling from Reno.
	Yes.
	All right.
	And I have had this Longer than the Gulf War, and I have gone to the pet store and gotten tetracycline, and I've had all the symptoms, and something's got to be done.
	Well, alright, that's interesting.
	What do you say about that?
	She says, I've had it since before the Gulf War.
	Could this thing, or whatever it is that's out there, have gotten out early?
	Yes, there's several reports of, unfortunately, of veterans that have received this disease through, let's say, inoculations.
	Or for whatever reason they've come down with this disease.
	It is not unusual to hear this story.
	It is not unusual to hear that these individuals have the very same thing that we are seeing right now.
	I will tell you that there has been evidence of the experimentation of this mycoplasma since 1970.
	I can show the first example of it being tested on individuals The liability on the government's part, if this should ever be really proven, is so massive that it can barely be comprehended.
	for veterans and prior to that that have been tested with this or utilized upon them.
	The liability on the government's part, if this should ever be really proven, is so massive
	that it can barely be comprehended.
	So they're not going to admit this easily, are they?
	No, they aren't.
	And in fact, I have before me a document that came from Dr. Erison out of the Pentagon, in which he has written an article, and I make this available to people, I'll make it available to your webpage, it's called The Cover-Up of the Gulf War Syndrome, and it's by Dr. Erison, who is an aide to the Undersecretary of the Air Force, USA, of Pentagon, in which he gives the facts of the Gulf War, then he gives the reason why it was covered up by the government, The official cover-up is because of the fact, number one, they say they didn't want to panic the troops, but he says it is because the cost of providing appropriate medical care would be prohibitive on the part of the government.
	Well, this business about not wanting to panic the troops, that's utter insanity.
	I mean, if there are biological and chemical agents coming down, and you don't have them put on protection so you won't panic them, that's insanity.
	I mean, that's utter, absolute insanity.
	Oh, it's absolute insanity.
	You are right.
	And it is also insanity to bring these troops back here and then give them a psychological diagnosis.
	Could there have been strategic reasons why we didn't tell them, take cover folks, it's incoming?
	In other words, once you have said to the troops, these agents are being used, then a response of the kind that we threatened and the Israelis threatened, would be almost mandated.
	So that's why I say, could there be strategic reasons why they weren't told?
	I would only have to guess that there is, because for no other reason can I imagine why we would put our troops in harm's way in the fashion that they were.
	I have no answer to that particular situation.
	I think it is abominable, I think there is no excuse for it, and I think that it would have to be only of a negative nature that one would do that.
	So, I'm sorry, Art, I have no idea why they would do it.
	All right.
	First time caller on the line, you're on the air with Joyce Riley.
	Where are you, please?
	On the Grand Oregon.
	Okay, you're on the air.
	Hi.
	Hi.
	I'm in La Grande, Oregon.
	Yes.
	A couple years ago, we had a weird disease that's pretty much like what Joyce Riley is describing.
	A lot of us got really sick and we weren't exposed in any way to the Gulf War, except that my best friend was inoculated with the typhoid vaccine because she was a National Guard.
	Our doctors didn't know what to do about it, and they treated us with tranquilizers and so forth.
	Some of us didn't get completely well.
	I still have MS-type symptoms.
	I'm functional.
	It was about a year after receiving Amoxicillin and Paxilin, Klonopin, that I stopped being busy all the time and falling over and having some other problems, and now I've got the MS symptoms back again.
	What is going on?
	Well, caller, I have to tell you that what you're experiencing is what we're getting tremendous numbers of reports from both National Guard, Reservists, and active duty individuals, is that there is some reason, and I cannot say why it is, but these vaccinations and immunizations are creating problems that are very similar to MS.
	Now, again, I am not giving medical advice, but I am seeing large numbers of these individuals And I don't know why, but you see the drug I mentioned earlier, the drug Paxil, and you're being treated with Paxil.
	They are finding that they are chronic fatigue-like symptoms that go into MS symptoms.
	Yes, I believe there's a corollary, and I think it is time that the CDC investigate this and find out why, because there are innocent people all over the country They're being affected with this disease, and I applaud you for your stamina to keep after this, and I can only hope that this will help to bring it out as to what is really going on.
	I contacted our county and state health departments, and they said there were too many symptoms for it to be a disease.
	I wrote to the CDC in Atlanta, and they never wrote back, not even a form letter.
	We had some interesting symptoms, such as the anorexia part of it.
	We felt like we had a gunny sack full of food already stuck down our throats.
	Does that sound familiar?
	That particular symptom I'm not familiar with, no.
	Alright, well, anyway, um, isn't that exactly what they said for years before they discovered the AIDS virus?
	There are just too many different things, uh, opportunistic diseases were killing people and they didn't put it all together until, until they discovered the AIDS virus.
	Whether it was in France or here, a lot of controversy about that, I guess, France.
	Uh, but until then, they dismissed all of it, didn't they?
	They certainly did.
	And the problem with the Gulf War illness is the very same thing.
	Gee, your complaints are too strange.
	We can't identify them.
	That's what I was told.
	And I would not accept that response.
	I would not accept that answer.
	But too many Gulf War veterans did.
	They believed, well, maybe I am under stress.
	Maybe my marriage is a problem since I got back from the Gulf War.
	But now we have the children getting this disease.
	The very same symptoms the parents have.
	And we haven't even touched on the incredible deformities that we are seeing in the Gulf War veterans.
	Well, I want to talk about that.
	I definitely want to talk about that, but tell me something.
	How would a child acquire that disease?
	You're talking about a child born since the Gulf War, for example?
	Well, it is both, because the proximity to the person is really what the factor is.
	Yes, now, let's separate it.
	A lot of the babies, in fact, Nation Magazine I gave a statistic January of 95 that 67% of the babies
	born to affected Desert Shield, Desert Storm veterans have deformities.
	67%?
	Yes.
	You are not hearing that on CNN.
	You are not hearing that they have started a Go For Babies registry because there are
	so many deformed babies.
	These babies are born with no arms, no legs.
	This is called Goldenheart Syndrome.
	You're not even hearing anything about this.
	You're right.
	I haven't heard anything about it.
	How much is it?
	67%?
	That's correct.
	That's what Nation Magazine says.
	Of the sick Gulf War veterans, we're talking about babies born to sick Gulf War veterans.
	67% are deformed.
	Now, that category is for the congenital problems.
	Now, I'm not referring to that right now.
	I'm referring to the babies that acquire the disease.
	Either born after or before.
	They are coming down with the rash, the joint pain, the muscle aches.
	They're coming down with failure to eat, inability to gain weight.
	And one Gulf War veteran who was with the 82nd Airborne told me, he said, you know, he said, I literally lay awake at night with these incredible muscle pains, sharp muscle pains that are so bad.
	And he said, I lay in bed and I wake at night.
	And he said, and then he said, I hear my child down the hall crying and saying, Daddy, Make my legs quit hurting and he's only four years of age and he said it brings me to tears because I know I can't stop my pain and I know I can't stop his.
	So we're finding these symptoms like joint pain.
	I know of a two-year-old now who has acquired a rheumatoid type disease where she can't even open and close her hand just like her parents now.
	They seem to be getting the disease by acquiring it and being around the Gulf War veterans because we're finding adopted children that are getting it All right.
	All right.
	and grandchildren and the way that i believe that they're getting it is
	because the way the familiarity in the family it
	you have been kept each other you play i didn't let together
	uh... you eat and drink after each other and that is about the only explanation that we can come to
	uh... is that that is the transmission out of the city alright alright stop for
	a second choice uh... with aids uh... it requires blood to blood transfer
	usually uh... sexual uh... prolonged contact uh... they're they're
	suggesting now many hundreds of contacts
	uh... may produce uh... infection Um, but not through the air, not through sweat, not through kissing, not through saliva, though they have detected it in saliva.
	The word always was, there was insufficient quantities of the AIDS virus in saliva to affect a transmission of the disease.
	Now, what you're talking about either sounds like it's airborne or it's saliva-related, sweat-related, that sort of thing.
	That would indicate a very, very high concentration Of whatever it is to achieve infection in that manner, wouldn't it?
	Well, one would think so, yes.
	Dr. Nicholson has told me that the disease is found in the dental floss test.
	So, one would have to assume that it is transferred via saliva, kissing, whatever.
	I can't say that it is truly carried by kissing, but he now believes that it is airborne.
	Airborne?
	Yes.
	So, we do have a disease that is Transmitted in a different fashion that we're accustomed to via the perspiration and also one other thing I would admit to you is that we are finding a large group of the animals of the Gulf War veterans that are now becoming ill.
	We believe it causes a species barrier.
	I have had calls from veterinarians that have asked me, is it possible that these animals could have gotten the disease from the Gulf War veterans?
	We believe now that it is.
	Dr. Nicholson himself Uh, became ill with the disease after his stepdaughter returned from Iraq, serving in the 101st Airborne.
	Are you, Joyce, how can you be sure that it's not a species jump going the other way?
	Well, it possibly could, except that we have the larger number of the Gulf War veterans that are ill first, and of course then there are animals becoming sick later.
	Uh, so the disease is predominantly, uh, appears first in the Gulf War veterans.
	And how does it manifest in animals?
	Well, it's interesting.
	What we're seeing in the symptomatology is that the back legs become useless or weak.
	The back legs of the animals, they start to drag them.
	They become weak.
	They have joint pain.
	And coupled with that is the incredible rash that we see in the Gulf War veterans.
	They begin to lose their hair.
	They are not able to feed and they end up losing weight and dying of some type of wasting disease.
	Now, that's the report that I'm getting from most of the veterans.
	It's unbelievable.
	You know, the information I'm telling you right now is a shock to everyone listening.
	I know.
	Yes.
	Because this is not coming through your TV set.
	I should say not.
	I should say not.
	I mean, the worst of what we've seen is that there were chemical releases that we didn't know about and we're now beginning to know about, and up to, what are they saying, 20,000 affected, I think at the moment.
	But, my God, you're talking about a disease that's here, back here, and spreading like crazy!
	Well, you know, the sad part is, I have sent out news releases, I have sent out the stories, I have tried to get the major news media outlets to cover this information.
	And what do they say?
	They say it couldn't happen in America.
	And I said, the issue is not could it happen, the issue is, is the evidence there to support it.
	And I would tell you that on the affiliate that you have here in Houston, KTRH Radio, is the only station that has had me on the air.
	The only one in Houston.
	Obviously, George Bush is here, James Baker, Baylor College of Medicine, and Tanox Biosystems, which have been implicated in this whole scenario.
	And by the way, have been sued as a part of the lawsuit on behalf of Gulf War veterans.
	So this is a very tender area to talk about this issue.
	But I commend KTRH for doing this, and I would encourage all your listeners Call your media and ask them, why are you lying to us?
	Why have you not told us about the deaths of Gulf War veterans?
	Joyce, do you have any center for information a number of people can call?
	A webpage?
	Something up on the internet?
	What are the resources for digging into this?
	Well, up until now it has been myself doing this and providing information to Gulf War veterans.
	I provide all information to Gulf War veterans free of charge.
	There is a video A two-hour documented video that we put out to Gulf War veterans to explain to them why they're ill, what happened, and all the government documents that I have to support this.
	You send that free of charge?
	Yes, I do.
	Yes, I do.
	It is free to all Gulf War veterans, and we're now getting phone calls from Gulf War veterans overseas who want to get it.
	Get me a number.
	Get me a number.
	What's the number?
	Okay, I believe it's full right now.
	The voicemail is full right now, but it will be open later.
	It is 713- 587- 5-4-3-7.
	That's 7-1-3.
	5-8-7.
	5-4-3-7.
	I can give my address.
	And what I want Go4Veterans to do is tell me what unit you are with, where you are stationed, your symptoms, and I will send you the 100-page document packet and the video and the song by Dave Riddell that has been dedicated to Go4Veterans called Where Are the Voices That Care?
	How much of a database have you built so far?
	Well, I hesitate to disclose a lot of this because I am concerned that certain people will want to get access to that database, but I will tell you that it's well over 500 individuals that have contacted me that are quite ill.
	Well over 500.
	So then you probably are able to see, because of the fact that nobody will admit this, they really haven't begun to put together a database that an average medical doctor can get his hands on, have they?
	No, they haven't.
	The Pentagon has, but they will not release it.
	The Pentagon has approximately, now every time I call them they give me a different figure, but cumulatively about 160,000 Gulf War veterans have petitioned the VA or the Persian Gulf Registry to tell them that they are ill.
	160,000.
	By the way, as I mentioned before, none of them have been treated by the VA.
	They are simply being examined and evaluated, which is exactly what Dr. Steven Joseph said on TV tonight.
	We examine the troops.
	All right, Joyce, look, I'm going to ask you to stay one more hour and answer calls.
	Can you do that?
	Certainly.
	All right, good.
	Joyce Riley is my guest, and I bet you didn't think it involved all of this, the Gulf War syndrome, did you?
	Just those who were over there.
	Well, it isn't that way at all.
	I suggest you keep listening.
	If you have questions, we'll begin to lay heavily into the phones this next hour.
	You're listening to the CBC Radio Network.
	I'm Art Bell.
	And Now back to the rest of our trail.
	From the Kingdom of Nine, Coast to Coast AM continues with Art Bell.
	Back now to Houston, Texas, and Joyce Riley.
	Joyce, are you there?
	Yes, I am.
	All right.
	I want to move through some calls here if we can.
	On the first time caller line, you're on the air with Joyce Riley.
	Good morning.
	Hi, Joyce.
	My name's Bob, and I'm in Southern Oregon, and I'm a Gulf War vet.
	And since I've been back, my wife's been having some really weird symptoms.
	She's been having incapacitating headaches with numbness of the hands and her feet and ankle joints have been really sore to the point where she could barely walk.
	And I was wondering if I could be asymptomatic and a carrier.
	Well that's a good question.
	That's a terribly good question.
	Joyce?
	I'm afraid the unfortunate answer is yes.
	For whatever reason we are finding A number of Gulf War veterans who essentially appear to be symptom-free themselves, however, their spouses have become ill.
	And there's a whole separate subset of symptoms that the spouses seem to be experiencing.
	Is your wife having any problems with a disease called endometriosis?
	No.
	No, not yet.
	Okay.
	That's one thing we're finding among the females, at least about 50% of them.
	Yes, the swollen, painful joints, yes, that definitely is a symptom of the spouses.
	Alright, Joyce, I hate to bring this up, but I keep seeing these parallels to AIDS, to the HIV virus, because it's now thought that people can carry the HIV virus, infecting others, and yet not come down with AIDS themselves.
	Well, I think at this point I need to tell you something very important, that It probably is very difficult early on for anyone to accept, and especially with all that everyone has heard right now, but according to Dr. Nicholson, the reason we are seeing the similarity between the Mycoplasma incognitus and the AIDS virus is because, according to him, and he is a Nobel Prize nominee, 40% of the HIV envelope gene was injected deep into the nucleus of the Mycoplasma.
	So what we are seeing among Gulf War veterans is an AIDS-related, AIDS-type illness in which they eventually will have the wasting away, but they do not seroconvert with the ELISA test or the Western Blot test to AIDS.
	They do not turn positive for AIDS.
	They get all the symptoms of AIDS.
	So the answer might be they just don't have the right test?
	Absolutely.
	Alright, Wild Card Line, you're on the air with Joyce Riley.
	Hello.
	Hello, Art.
	How are you?
	Well, reasonably well.
	Where are you, sir?
	My name is Mark, and I'm in Fanaway, Washington.
	Hi, Mark.
	I'll try to make this brief.
	I've actually got a question and a comment.
	Alright.
	First, I'd like to say I think your show is a godsend, and Joyce, I commend you on your courage and your tenacity for, you know, getting into this whole thing and getting the word out.
	Thank you.
	I have a question about the voicemail number you gave.
	I have a brother-in-law who served in the armed forces and he was over in the Gulf War there for about a year, I think it was.
	And I'm not sure of his unit or anything, but if he calls that voicemail number, what is it exactly he's going to find out?
	It tells them to please send a letter with where they were stationed and their symptoms.
	Uh, to the address, and I'd like to give that address out real quick so people don't have to call the voicemail.
	Alright, that's fine.
	Caller, you ready to copy?
	Yes, I am.
	Thank you.
	Alright, uh, go ahead, Joyce.
	Gulf War, 3506 Highway 6 South, number 117.
	Sugar, Sugarland.
	S-U-G-A-R-L-A-N-D.
	Sugarland, Texas.
	77478- Alright, you're going to have to do that again slowly.
	Okay, it's Gulf War 3506 Highway 6 South, number 117, Sugar Land, Texas, 77478-4401.
	Alright, and what you want from them, might as well say it right now, is when they were there, you want their symptoms,
	you want to know what unit they were in, anything else?
	Their phone number and address so I can contact them if need be, because a lot of the troops are trying to find each other now.
	But that's basically what I need, just a little bit about their story, and I will send them the video and the information.
	Joyce, how are you financing all this?
	Well, because other people that request the video and the information, the document package, I request a donation for that.
	And I'll be real honest with you, Art.
	I have essentially cast in my life savings to do exactly what I'm doing right now.
	I recently sold my piano, and I'm just a nurse.
	I have been a nurse for 25 years, and this is my mission now.
	I will not let America be misled any longer.
	I want our troops to know why they're sick.
	I may not be able to help them, but at least I can give them some answers so that they don't have to wonder among themselves what happened.
	Has anybody come to see you yet, Joyce?
	Has anyone come to see me?
	Yeah, that's right.
	What do you mean by that?
	Well, somebody who might not like what you're doing.
	Well, I've received some phone calls and been given some messages, but other than that, no, sir.
	Okay.
	East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Joyce Riley.
	Good evening.
	Morning.
	Good evening, Art.
	My name is Fred from McKeesport, Pennsylvania.
	Yes, sir.
	I did not serve in the Gulf War.
	However, I did serve in Vietnam in 1970 as a gunship pilot.
	I suffer from Agent Orange poisoning and some of my symptoms are peripheral neuropathy, extreme pain in joints and muscles, also some PTSD.
	I don't believe that my problems are all associated with Agent Orange.
	I worked for a special group over there, Art, and I know you were in Vietnam.
	Yes.
	I work for MACSOG, Military Assistance Command Special Operations Group, as a gunship pilot.
	And when it was not generally recognized that we were going into Laos and Cambodia, which we were doing, and several occasions our troops on the ground, our mercenaries on the ground, and our special forces on the ground, Would get into a very sticky situation, and we'd go into an area, and you being in the Air Force, I think you might know about a substance, I don't know the technical name, but we used to call it sawdust.
	No, I don't.
	I don't.
	Sawdust, what was it?
	It was a nerve agent, and when we couldn't go in and get our guys on the ground that were, you know, we had to get them out.
	We'd go into that area and dust it.
	They called it dusting an area.
	And... Have you heard of this, Joyce?
	Yes, I have.
	Yes, I have.
	Well, we would go in there, dust an area, and land, pick up our people, and walk, casually walk around and just shoot the bad guys in the head.
	And, uh... Nerve agent.
	It was a nerve agent to put everybody on the ground.
	I mean, you'd be puking and just totally incapacitated.
	And, uh, what I'd like to know... That's a direct violation of the Geneva Convention.
	Oh, yeah.
	You're aware of this, Joyce?
	Yes.
	Yeah, there's so many violations of the Geneva Convention, it's time that it stopped.
	You know, our troops have been used as guinea pigs.
	What this man is talking about is so tragic, because his whole life has been affected by this.
	Not just Agent Orange, but whatever else.
	I mean, there is an unbelievable document that has come out from the government that I would encourage Uh, your listeners to get, Senate Report 103-97, in which they state the following.
	Hundreds of thousands of our military have been experimented upon without their knowledge.
	It goes into not only this, but Operation White Coat, which was the experimentation on 7th Day Adventist.
	That's in the document, it's about a 40 page document, you can get it from your senator.
	You know, this is just one thing he's talking about, the peripheral, uh, neuropathy, But my God, what are we doing to mankind by this?
	That's what we need to look at.
	I don't know.
	It's suicidal.
	I don't understand any of it.
	If we created this, and we sold it, and we knew it was going to be used, and we allowed our troops to be exposed, then we are, in essence, committing suicide.
	It just doesn't make sense.
	It is even worse, Art.
	We are talking about murder now.
	This is not just a cover-up.
	This is not a conspiracy we're talking about, although Dr. Steven Joseph mentioned conspiracy three times as he was trying to deny the Gulf War illness tonight.
	We're talking about intentional neglect and criminal intent here.
	It is time America recognized they have crossed the line in the sand.
	Our troops need treatment.
	They are suffering and they are dying.
	All right.
	Well, West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Joyce Riley.
	Hello.
	Hi, my name is Emily.
	I'm calling from Salt Lake City.
	Hello, Emily.
	Hi, I would like to discuss with Joyce.
	I have an acquaintance who was a nurse in the war, and her job was basically to administer vaccinations to soldiers.
	Oh, yes.
	And she had brought up the idea, or she had told us that from what she understood, There were times when, because so many soldiers had been deployed at, you know, such a small amount of time, they would run out of these human vaccines, and they would use vaccines that were veterinarian vaccines instead, often at times against the soldiers' will.
	They, you know, they would give them the opportunity to have the shot.
	And if they refused it, they would have two amputees pull them down and give it to them anyway.
	All right.
	Uh, familiar with that, Joyce?
	Absolutely.
	I would love to get an affidavit from her because this is a story we're hearing from so many people.
	That the veterans were told, you will take this injection or else.
	And yes, many of them refused it or did not want it.
	It was not placed in their shot record.
	The anthrax and botulinum vaccines were not placed in there.
	They were told that it was a matter of national security.
	And many of them received those vaccinations With guards that had side arms that were present there.
	Yes, they were held down.
	Even occasions where individuals were given the injection through their uniforms.
	You know, this is in violation of the Nuremberg Code.
	Caller, are you willing to supply an affidavit?
	I wasn't the one there personally, it's a friend of mine.
	I would like for the nurse too, yes.
	Can you get hold of that person?
	Possibly.
	Another thing, issue two, is we were in a microbiology class together and our teacher said that because the vaccines, if they were once intended for veterinary use, could cause various, you know, mutations, cellular mutations that could result in, you know, illnesses that we, you know.
	Alright, thank you.
	Please get something to us.
	Joyce, at some point are you going to walk in front of a Congressional Investigating Committee?
	I don't know.
	I have asked to testify before the Congressional Committee.
	I have not been allowed thus far.
	I would like to testify.
	Representative Shays of Connecticut is now doing an oversight committee on the Gulf War, and I've requested numbers of times If your listeners would like to call Representative Shays and tell him, I want the truth out, you want Dr. Nicholson and you want Joyce Riley to testify, we are going to tell the truth.
	We will tell it like it is.
	And America needs to hear this.
	They're not going to hear it from the oversight hearings they've got right now.
	Would you hazard a guess, Joyce, about how far knowledge of this goes?
	Or went, I guess I should say.
	Apparently it goes all the way to the top by now, but at the time?
	Well, obviously George Bush had full knowledge of this.
	I will also say that General Schwarzkopf and General Colin Powell had full knowledge of this also.
	In my estimation, they have turned their backs on their troops.
	They are not there for them.
	Of course, General Schwarzkopf i have also had prostate cancer which many of the gulf war
	veterans have been treated for spent the war
	and today have full knowledge i think they could break the gold crop
	i can eat and now we're looking at the new administration george uh...
	uh...
	clinton had had this information as well as john do it
	shelly cash really and william perry now what are you i have a letter that was written to william
	perry the secretary of defense
	on february ninth of nineteen ninety four in which senator don regal stated the following
	secretary of defense william perry our troops are sick and dying it's a communicable disease
	we sold the biological to saddam hussein and it is a communicable illness
	This information I have that went to William Perry.
	It was not addressed, and nothing has been done.
	I will tell you, just as I mentioned earlier, that Bob Dole had this information.
	Every sitting senator in 1994, in February, heard this information.
	You need to hold your senator's feet to the fire.
	What has he done for your troops?
	And again, I want to repeat, Bob Dole's wife is Elizabeth Dole, who controls over 50% of the blood donations in this country.
	And the word is that the blood donated by Gulf War veterans is still in general circulation and is still being taken, yes?
	That is correct.
	At every Guard and Reserve unit on Saturdays now, at those UTA meetings, they are taking blood from Gulf War veterans.
	We have asked the American Association of Blood Banks to stop, and we are asking Gulf War veterans Please voluntarily abstain from donating blood.
	We don't know if it's safe or not, and we believe that it probably is not.
	All right.
	Wildcard Line, you're on the air with Joyce Riley.
	Hello.
	Yeah, this is Joe calling you from East Los Angeles from KABC-AM radio.
	Yes, hi, Joe.
	Yes, hi there.
	Riley, I'm kind of shaking up, so please forgive my voice here, but could you please give us more information on Peter Kowaja's investigation update on Do you know what he's talking about, Joyce?
	I know what he's talking about.
	Dr. Ishan Barbuti is the primary supplier of chemical weapons to Saddam Hussein.
	Dr. Ishan Barbuti hails from Boca Raton, Florida.
	He is an Iraqi national, however.
	We started the Pharma 150 plant in Robbed Olympia for Muammar Gaddafi.
	That plant, that chemical warfare plant, was then cloned in the United States in Boca Raton, Florida.
	There were chemicals that were provided to Saddam Hussein with full recognition of the U.S.
	government.
	I have a newspaper article right here that appeared in the Houston Chronicle in which George Bush was asked to come forward for a deposition, uh, to be questioned about his involvement, George Bush's involvement, with Dr. Eshaan Barboody.
	This is in 1993, the Department of Justice stepped in and said he would not need to testify.
	But yes, Dr. Eshaan Barboody, um, unfortunately has died, he supposedly died in 1990, this is the second time he has died, and he is believed to be alive.
	His son, Heider Barboody, lives in Houston, And there is much information... Wait, wait, wait.
	The second time he died?
	That's correct.
	You want to fill that in for me?
	Well, he seems to die whenever there is a lot of heat on him.
	I see.
	And he's died under eight feet of concrete right now in London for religious purposes.
	So it is said.
	However, there are reports of him being spotted throughout the world.
	But I will say that this is a very important part of this whole story, which we haven't gotten into, because the chemicals are a very real issue, as well as the fact that Ishan Bharbhuti and the United States government had full knowledge of all of this.
	And much more about this is going to be coming out in the near future.
	Joyce, how could it be held secret, or away from the mainstream press, that 67% of the sick Gulf War veterans are beginning to have children with severe deformities?
	How could that be hidden?
	Well, just like 15,000 can die, and no one knows that.
	Because they are told, oh well, people just have birth defects.
	Now, here is the tragedy of this.
	But not at that rate, Joyce.
	Not at that rate.
	And that's easily documentable when you're talking about sick Gulf War vets.
	And 67%, that's over two-thirds, having deformed children.
	That's incredible.
	Now, we're not talking about massive deformities.
	We're talking of some type of a congenital deformity.
	It may be a urinary tract deformity.
	It may be a club foot.
	We're not talking about golden horror in every child.
	Please don't misunderstand that.
	But, Dr. Betty McBeefy...
	Well, that's for sure.
	Alright, hold on Joyce, we'll be right back to you.
	My guest is Joyce Riley.
	There is a 1-800 number that exists.
	You can contact Dr. McBeefy about information on the Go4Babies.
	The tragedy is Dan Rather's not telling you about it, so it doesn't exist to the American
	people.
	Well, that's for sure.
	All right.
	Hold on, Joyce.
	We'll be right back to you.
	My guest is Joyce Riley.
	If this one has not shaken you up, then you are unshakable.
	If you'd like a copy of this program, it's going to be a three-hour show.
	You can get it by calling Beginning Now.
	1-800-917-4278.
	Let me give you that number again.
	1-800-917-4278.
	917-4278. Let me give you that number again. 1-800-917-4278.
	This is CBC.
	Back now to Joyce Riley in Houston, Texas.
	Joyce, still there?
	Yes, I am.
	I know it's getting late.
	We're in the stretch run.
	Here we go again.
	First time caller line, you're on the air with Joyce Riley.
	Hello.
	Hi, my name's Peter.
	I live in east Alabama.
	I'm a Gulf War vet.
	And I spent about a month in Kuwait during and immediately after the war.
	Right.
	Yeah, I might be able to give you some insight with those anthrax vaccinations.
	Yes, sir.
	Yeah, we had those.
	What they did was they told us that the fact that the Iraqis had the availability of anthrax was classified secret and they wouldn't put it in our medical records because of the fact that they said then our medical records would have to be classified secret.
	Oh my!
	Yeah, good cover, huh?
	Well, anyways, they told us we were supposed to be getting a series of three shots.
	We only got two for some odd reason and we were also told that You know, we would be going into an area that could possibly be infected with anthrax, but the shots were voluntary.
	You know, there were armed people, but nobody in my unit refused.
	Another thing I wanted to ask Joyce is, here's an odd thing.
	I've got some good buddies who came down with some really severe symptoms of this.
	I was in the same place at the same time.
	Like I said, I spent A month in Kuwait was all over the country and I was in Riyadh and Tehran for scud missile attacks and other than some mild flu symptoms that last couple months I'm pretty much asymptomatic.
	I wonder if she's run across that.
	Now, another thing I wanted to... Well, one will hold it, one thing at a time.
	Joyce?
	Yes, I have, and probably, and you know, we have to realize that people have different immune systems, and we're different, and we're exposed to probably different types of things at different times.
	Also, if you ever received any course of antibiotics for the flu or whatever from 91 on, that may have helped you.
	Um, so I really can't answer, and I don't know, just thank God not everybody is ill with this disease, but, uh, unfortunately, and by the way, which unit were you attached to?
	Uh, I was part of Special Ops.
	Okay.
	The sickest units, let me just tell you right now, are the 82nd Airborne, the 101st Airborne, the Big Red One, the 3rd AD, and the 1st, uh, Marine Division.
	Boy, you've got that down.
	Uh, those are the sickest units.
	Oh.
	So, um, uh, just for your information.
	This is the end of side one.
	This is the CBC Radio Network.
	Wild Card Line, you're on the air with Joyce Riley in Houston.
	Hello.
	Hello, Joyce.
	Yes.
	Where are you, sir?
	I'm a Gulf War vet.
	Oh, you are?
	Where are you, please?
	Uh, right now?
	Yes, sir.
	Right now.
	Well, I'm in Kentucky.
	Kentucky, all right.
	Uh, I was assigned to the 101st during the Gulf War.
	And, uh, I do not have a lot of the symptoms.
	I got, you know, I get the rashes.
	I do get joint aches.
	My wife and children seem to be getting quite a bit of it.
	Oh boy.
	And I got a three-year-old child, and she's getting these rashes.
	May I please ask a question, caller?
	Yeah, go ahead.
	After you got back, how long was it before your family, any of your family, began to show similar symptoms?
	My wife was, I think, about three to four months.
	She was getting rashes when we were in an intimate type situation.
	And my child was getting them pretty rough.
	Well, within a year after her birth.
	Within a year.
	Joyce?
	That sounds very common.
	I mean, I'm hearing that from everyone.
	In fact, I will tell you that the Big Red One in Fort Riley, Kansas, I got a call from a public health nurse there that the babies on base that were born to Gulf War veterans, many of them got a rash either at birth or very short after that time, and she had called me asking what was the link to this.
	So rashes are very, very common.
	They are rashes that will not go away with any type of cream.
	They come back if they do go away, and they usually get worse.
	I hear that.
	Please send me a letter.
	Tell me about it, and I'll send you the video if you don't already have it.
	Okay.
	I got everything I need to know there.
	Okay.
	All right.
	Thank you very much, caller.
	East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Joyce Riley.
	Hello.
	Hi.
	This is Joel from Minneapolis, Minnesota.
	Yes, sir.
	I just have a couple of questions.
	She claimed that we engineered this bacteria and then we sold it to Hussein and I just have a comment.
	I'm a pre-med student and right now I've got a microbiology class and one of the things
	that we are going over right now is how it's pretty easy to genetically engineer different
	types of bacteria using just basics.
	Bacillus, Staph, Strep and E. coli is like a lab rat that we work on everything.
	And we've even engineered E. coli to produce human insulin.
	And he said that our professor told us that they've got grad students at the university
	who will make these things on their own.
	Or not on their own but they know how to make them.
	And what I'm wondering is if, and they can get the raw products from the same, from a
	company.
	And I'm wondering, couldn't Hussein have just made it himself?
	It's a reasonable question.
	Yeah, sure, it's a reasonable question.
	We know he was trying to, Joyce.
	Well, he got them also from England and some from Germany, too, so he didn't get it all from the United States.
	And I'm talking about documentation.
	I'm not talking about claiming that Saddam Hussein got it from us.
	You've got the batch numbers, don't you?
	Yes, I've got the batch number.
	So we know what he had, and we knew what he was going to use.
	And this was information that was available prior to the war.
	But let me make one statement.
	That genetic recombinant material that he is talking about is very deadly.
	And yes, we do have labs producing this stuff all over the country.
	There are biotech companies everywhere that are doing this.
	One thing I would mention also, it's extremely dangerous because
	it is now being transferred via Federal Express.
	Oh great.
	Oh great.
	Yes, I have invoices that show the mode of transportation is Federal Express.
	So don't be surprised if we have an incident before long.
	It's pretty frightening stuff, to tell you the truth.
	Well, I guess they carry things as UPS and others.
	I mean, they don't even know what's in it.
	They just carry packages from point A to point B. I get FedEx here, Federal Express all the time.
	That's correct.
	Just about every day at my house.
	So, West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
	Hi.
	Hi, Art.
	This is Pat from Southern Oregon.
	And this is kind of a little bit off the subject in a way, but kind of in the same way, in the same way as what you've been talking about, about what the government's capable of.
	Uh, I was drafted in 1968, and uh, I became really aware when I was in infantry training in AIT, that the people around me were very low on the intelligence scale.
	And so I kind of checked into it, and I found out that these people all had the same prefix, the first two numbers of the prefix, of the U.S.
	number, and it meant that no way, shape, or form could these guys ever join the service or be in it.
	And uh, they drafted these guys by hundreds of thousands, trained them like they was cowboys, they'd just give them a rifle and set them over a log to get their heads blown off.
	And they had a code number on it, and a code name.
	The code name was Operation Clean Sleep, but I can't remember what the code number was.
	But I've had this confirmed twice by two people that were in the intelligence service, and they talked to me, and they told me that that really went off.
	One guy was in the Air Force, and one guy was in the Army.
	You're right.
	You're kind of off the track a little bit here.
	That's interesting information, but a little bit off the track.
	First time caller on the line, you're on the air with Joyce Riley.
	Hello.
	Hi, I'm Laurie, calling from Spring, Texas.
	Yes.
	And I have some questions.
	I just heard the Last caller that you had, a couple callers before, the Vietnam veteran?
	Yes.
	My husband was in Vietnam, and he has all the same problems that this man that called you has.
	And also, we just had a child that, she's 15 months old now, and she only has one lung, and she has pulmonary spinosus in her right lung, and her one lung that is functioning is not functioning normally.
	It's got small airways and stuff.
	And my husband, I was wondering that this disease with the Gulf War veterans sounds to be like, a lot like what the Vietnam veterans are experiencing.
	And if there's anything, anywhere that I could get in touch with anyone, if Joyce knows of anyone that I can get in touch with that could tell me a little more, or my daughter's doctor, a little more about her case, because she is the only child that has been born with this type of deformity in her lungs.
	That they know of.
	They cannot.
	And she was in Texas Children's Hospital.
	She's had the best doctors from Baylor College.
	Okay, I would tell you that you can call this 1-800 number.
	It's the Gulf War Baby Registry.
	1-800-313-2232.
	That's 1-800.
	Is that in Florida?
	Yes.
	Yes, I already did that.
	Okay.
	She's been registered for months, ma'am.
	Okay.
	Well, we are finding, and if you will look in the special investigation that was done by Life Magazine, it tells about the Gulf War babies.
	They have been born deformed.
	It's a color picture on the front that shows a child with no arms, no legs.
	And in there, they discuss the babies that were born with some of their organs in the wrong place and something's missing.
	So, other than that, I really can't say, but, you know, this has got to stop.
	You know, the experimentation that has gone on with our military is costing lives and costing heartache that most Americans know nothing about.
	You're absolutely right, and I commend you for what you're doing.
	thank you uh...
	choice uh... a lot of people are going to sit out there and say
	uh... alright look uh... we're beginning with this is some sort of mass
	psychological uh...
	russian of information everybody's everybody's got a little ill here and
	there is somebody knew somebody was in the gulf war and it's all about bunch psychological mumbo-jumbo
	how do you other than the evidence that you have about what went over
	there absolutely prove conclusively numerically statistically
	that this is not so much psychological mumbo-jumbo well doctor nicole for the head count of the return balcony
	or better and and found about fifty five percent of positive
	With the mycoplasma incognitus.
	This is really our basis of information.
	Getting the letters from the Gulf War veterans.
	And many of them send totally unsolicited letters not knowing anything about the Gulf War.
	Not knowing anybody else that served.
	But their stories are all alike.
	Another thing is that we have a study from the Veterans Administration that was essentially smuggled out to us that shows that there has been a 600% increase In tumors in the active duty military from 91 to 94.
	What?
	Yes, a 600% increase.
	Let's slow down there.
	You have something, you claim this is from inside the Veterans Administration.
	That's correct.
	Showing a 600% increase in tumors in how many years?
	From 91 through 94.
	Yes I do.
	Representative Shays also... Wait a minute, Joyce.
	Can you get me copies of that?
	Yes, I can.
	Because I can get it up on a webpage and available to millions.
	Now, I don't have the full study.
	Representative Shays has been attempting to get it also, and the Pentagon has denied him three times.
	But we do have the figures showing the tumor rates In 91, 92, 93 and 94, which I can provide to you.
	You should do that then.
	In fact, you should send me a package of any relevant information and I'll get it up on our webpage, alright?
	Wonderful, absolutely.
	Alright, West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Joyce Riley, hello.
	Hi Bill, this is Frank and I'm calling from Sacramento, KSTE.
	Yes sir.
	I just want to thank her very much for what she's doing.
	I've never served in the military.
	But it's really sad that these are people that have fought for our country, and this is how our government has treated them.
	I could not agree more.
	It's sad, alright.
	It may be more than sad, though, because it doesn't just involve them, you see, sir.
	It involves all of us, potentially.
	East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Joyce Riley.
	Hi, this is Nick in Treesport.
	Treesport, yes.
	I have kind of an ominous question to ask.
	Sure.
	Since this is a biological weapon, And it was engineered to kill.
	Is it possible that this germ could get into the water supply?
	Well, it has been proposed that Novashok, if you're familiar with what Novashok is, that's a Russian biological agent that has been provided to, we believe, provided to Saddam Hussein.
	Probably a pinhead of that can kill a million people in a water supply, yes.
	Novashok has been documented in scientific articles.
	Uh, yes.
	There's no doubt about it that it can go into water supply.
	And if so, is it possible that mosquitoes could carry it also?
	Yes.
	In fact, one of the Senate reports that I have addresses the fact that it is believed to be transferred via mosquito.
	Uh, so that is addressed in the Senate report.
	I did not say that, but they did.
	And Joyce, uh, if all or even a good portion of what you suspect is true, it's too late.
	Well, I don't want to say that because there are Gulf War veterans out there that are listening right now and hearing this for the first time.
	They're sick, maybe their spouse is sick, their child is sick.
	Right.
	I don't want anyone to believe that it is too late.
	We want to know what caused this.
	We want to know what the treatment is.
	And again, I want to back up just one second.
	I want to say the following.
	America, your troops are sick and dying.
	The Senate was made aware of this in 1994.
	We are still at war according to Public Law 102-25.
	The war has never ended.
	When you aid and abet the enemy, it is treason.
	We are talking about murder.
	I cannot overemphasize what I am saying to you because I talk to approximately 50 sick and dying Gulf War veterans and their families on a daily basis.
	If you were to talk to these people, there would be no doubt in your mind.
	You would wonder, why in the world is the Pentagon doing this?
	And one news release I want to give to you is that the video that I have done made its way to New Zealand.
	The Secretary of Defense, the Secretary for Defense, the spokesperson for Defense in New Zealand called me from the Christian Coalition Party last week.
	He asked me, and his name is Lieutenant Colonel John Bryant of Wellington, and he stated, he said, is your video true?
	He said, it's 1 a.m.
	in New Zealand and we just watched it.
	Is this video true?
	And I said, yes, it is.
	He said, can you fax me the hard documents?
	And I said, yes.
	He said, because if it is true, we are going to, on behalf of the people of New Zealand, demand that our troops be brought home from the Middle East.
	I received a news release from Lieutenant Colonel John Bryant, spokesperson for defense, dated 3 October.
	New Zealand veteran at risk of Gulf War illnesses, and it goes on to say that they are wanting their Gulf War veterans treated.
	America, you may not know about this, but the other countries do.
	This has appeared, by the way, in the British press many times.
	This information is out there.
	We have got to take care of our veterans, and we have got to demand that the United States government, the Pentagon, and the Senators be held accountable for what they have done to our people.
	They are murdering them.
	Is the whole story of this in that videotape?
	Yes, it is.
	All right.
	Here's the deal, folks.
	As I understand it, that videotape is available to Gulf War vets free of charge.
	You can also get that videotape for what, Joyce?
	A donation?
	A specific amount?
	What's the deal?
	Well, we'd like to get $20 to pay for all the shipping and everything of the video.
	If you would care to donate $20, like I said, it's free to Gulf War veterans.
	You can write that address, Gulf War 3506 Highway 6.
	One more time, please.
	Experience tells me.
	and I am so grateful for the opportunity to be here with you. I am so grateful for the
	opportunity to be here with you. I am so grateful for the opportunity to be here with you.
	Highway 6 South, number 117, Sugar Land, Texas, 774-78-4401.
	And the voicemail, which is presently full, and it's going to be completely out of hand tomorrow, Joy, so you better
	get somebody on it.
	We will give out the voicemail number.
	Okay, and let me give out a 1-800 number if you want to order the video.
	With a 1-800 number, 201-7892.
	That's 1-800-201-7892 to get the video or the document package.
	That's 1-800-201-7892 to get the video or the document package.
	The document package is about 100 pages and we ask for a $10 donation.
	And that's the document that I have been telling you about to support the information that
	Okay.
	And you've got all the things you've been talking about this morning, the bill numbers.
	Do you also include evidence like the lot numbers of that stuff that went to Saddam?
	Yes, I do.
	You do?
	Yes, I do.
	I want everyone to have it, and please make plenty of copies of it.
	The issue is to get the story out.
	We are going to demand of the Pentagon that they now treat our Gulf War veterans.
	It is a shame that we have to spend our life savings to prove that they have been lying to us and covering up this disease.
	But we will do it because we've got other lives that are at stake, and this disease is passing into the general population.
	What has this done to your life?
	My life is not like it used to be, I can assure you.
	This is my obsession, this is my passion right now, and it is not easy.
	I will tell you that the phone starts ringing at 6 o'clock in the morning and it doesn't end until the wee hours of the morning.
	There are Gulf War veterans that are sick and have no one to turn to.
	Here's the problem is that they are now learning how sick they are.
	They're learning their families are sick and they are learning that their country has known about this.
	And they are now learning that they have to get treatment themselves and pay for it by themselves.
	One figure I didn't give you, and a government document that I include in this packet, Art, is that out of 700,000 troops that served during the Persian Gulf War, that's in the Theater of Operations, already 550,000 of them have been separated from the military.
	Think about that, Art.
	Four-fifths of our military have now been separated since the war.
	And they're geographically spread out everywhere.
	That's correct.
	But I would submit to you they are being medically separated because I'm receiving phone calls from E4s all the way up to Lieutenant Colonels that are being separated after 18 years of military service with no retirement, no compensation.
	This is not a positive thing to talk about in the military.
	I will warn you, if you're active duty, do not go in and talk to your commander about it tomorrow morning.
	In fact... Or you're going to end up getting separated.
	Joyce, we're out of time.
	You've been wonderful, Joyce, staying awake with us this long.
	And we'll probably end up doing another show.
	Joyce, thank you and good luck.
	Godspeed.
	Godspeed.
	Take care.
	That's it.
	We'll be back with open lines.
	I'm Art Bell.
	And this is CBC.

▲