All Episodes
Previous Next
Jan. 21, 1996 - Art Bell
01:40:38
Dreamland with Art Bell - Linda Moulton Howe - 1700 Missing Cattle - How to Survive an Alien Abduction - Michelle LaVigne
| Copy link to current segment

Time Text
Welcome to Dreamland, a program dedicated to an examination of areas in the human experience
not easily nor neatly put in a box.
Things seen at the edge of vision, awakening a part of the mind as yet not mapped.
And yet things every bit as real as the air we breathe but don't see.
This is Dreamland.
Another Sunday evening and another Dreamland underway.
Hi everybody, I'm Art Bell.
Should be a good one.
Linda Howe leads off as usual.
Uh, tonight with her regular report.
Last week, a full three hours.
Followed then by Michelle Lean, who's written a book called The Alien Abduction Survival Guide.
That should be interesting.
And, uh, as a matter of fact, she was regressed, uh, I believe by... Well, let me see... John Mack!
John Mack regressed her.
And, uh, she'll have a lot to tell us about how to survive, if you are one of those, or worry you might be.
We'll be snatched up, and anyway, we'll get her story.
So, that will comprise Dreamland this evening.
Fine.
Now, with all of that out of the way, all the way to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, and here she is, Linda Howe.
Hello, Linda.
Well, hi, Art.
Hi.
Can you hear me fine on this phone now?
Just fine, yes.
Okay, good.
Well, remember that town called Waurika, Oklahoma, and the strange story in August 1994 about 1,700 cows and calves that disappeared from the A.D.
Richardson farm?
I recall well, yes.
I've had a lot of people who listen to our program write and say whatever happened to those cows, whatever happened to the mystery.
Good.
You know, because Linda, we talked about this, I think, last week.
A lot of these stories break, and they're gigantic stories, and everybody's waiting with bated breath for some follow-up, and there's nothing.
Right.
It's sort of like keeping 12 plates going on those sticks in the carnival.
Exactly.
That's what I always think that I'm trying to do, and one's wobbling down, and then I finally try to get to it.
And tonight, I talked with Mrs. Richardson, who she's in her late 60s, and she speaks very, very faintly on the phone.
A very dear woman.
And you would not be able to hear her, but I can report this.
First, the good news is that the insurance company finally settled their claim on the missing cattle.
So, that's good for the Richardsons, but they are as puzzled as the rest of us.
About what did happen to the cows.
And it is a fact that law enforcement never did find any of the Richardson's cows or calves.
And if it was a rustling operation, no one to date has been arrested and arraigned for the crime.
Mrs. Richardson told me that she and her husband, who was born and raised in Waureka and who has ranched there since 1949, And that reinforces what the bank president told me, that he had known Mr. Richardson all of his life, that they had their pastures next to each other, that he knew that Mr. Richardson had never done anything that would be suggestive of, like, for example, getting some operation to take his cow so he could get insurance.
It just doesn't add up into this story.
And after talking with Mrs. Richardson, it's even, I think, an impossible hypothesis.
She and her husband came to the conclusion that the only thing they could figure out was that somebody came in the night with many semi-trailers and took the cattle all at once, and that would suggest something organized, even though no one has ever been found guilty of this.
And when I asked her if anyone had talked about the possibility of UFOs taking the cattle, she said very quietly, I've never heard of such a thing.
So, it is still a mystery, but it went at least to the point of the Richardsons not being heard as badly as it appeared that they were going to be.
At one point, there was even discussion that they might have to declare bankruptcy because there were so many cows and so much money involved.
And maybe we will never, ever know what happened in Hualeaka in August of 1994.
Well, that's sad.
It's sad that it concludes that way.
Well, I mean, you would think 1,700 cattle, I mean, absolutely on this earth, couldn't disappear.
I mean, they just couldn't.
That's right.
And we've had eyewitnesses who have described beams of light coming down around animals, single animals, and taking them up.
And of course, we're way out on the end of speculation to suggest this.
Even though it did come up, did something beam these animals up, but perhaps What the Richardson's are suggesting is that there was some kind of organized and professional rustling operation that was able to get in there with semi-trucks and get the animals out of the pasture and then onto the road, maybe to a slaughterhouse, is the reason why they've never been found.
But so everyone knows, it is a mystery that it appears now perhaps will never be solved.
Well, I guess for insurance purposes and their livelihood, it had to get solved more or less in this way.
Yep.
And after talking with her, she is a dear person and I don't think people realize how They are elderly and they have been there all of their lives and this was something that was shocking to her.
She said, I just don't want anything like this to happen ever again and I don't want to have to talk with people about what happened to our cows because we feel that rustlers did it.
That was kind of her bottom line.
But, you know, there's another thing, as Greenland listeners know, Disappearing animals have long been part of the strange reports associated with glowing lights in the sky, especially when the lights have been glowing orange spheres.
And in the past two weeks, slow-moving orange glowing spheres have been seen by several people in Kashmir and Wenatchee, Washington, about 80 miles east of Seattle in the Cascade Mountain Range.
Last Monday night, on January 16th, Mabel and Bill Block were driving to their Kashmir home around 10.30 p.m.
on a road near the Wenatchee River when they were so startled by three orange glowing lights in the sky that they pulled over to the side of the road.
All of a sudden we saw these lights, three of them, right in a row over the river.
And I said to Bill, did you ever see those before?
And he said, no.
I said, well, maybe they strung some lights across there to keep the aircraft from Coming down to low or something and then we saw them moving and there was no noise.
And we stopped the car pulled off the highway and when we pulled off the highway we got out of the car vehicle and watched them and they were about four to five hundred feet above the river glowing they were a bright orange glowing object and blind actually see the flickering of the glow you know yeah like it sparkles yeah you could actually see like it was Burning or something, you know, it was sparkling underneath and they were just gliding along.
No noise.
It was kind of weird.
Yeah.
Not a sound.
As they proceeded to go up above, over the hills, we watched them.
As we turned around, here come three more.
Two in the front and one kind of in behind in sort of a triangular formation.
And they proceeded the same way up above the river and just glowing very silently, not a noise at all.
Did anybody else driving along the road stop and pull over like you did?
Yes, on the opposite side of the road they were stopped and looking at them also.
The ones that were going towards Wenatchee, there was two cars that stopped.
and watched them. So these lights caught the attention of at least three different drivers
and three different cars including yourself to the point that three cars stopped on the side
of the road to watch this. Yes, yes. And they got out and you know I would have went across to talk
to them but you know it's not all that safe anymore and um I should have probably. And also
just about a week or so before one of the KPQ radio stations, one of the announcers saw these
three bright orange glowing objects also.
Chris Lundgren is KPQ Radio's afternoon newsman in Wenatchee, Washington.
The week before, on January 8th, not far from Mr. and Mrs. Block's sighting, Mr. Lundgren saw orange glowing lights and reported them on the news.
And in the sky, probably 300 to 400 feet up, under the cloud cover, were three gold Uh, orange balls of light traveling very slowly north to south.
And they reminded me, they were in a formation that reminded me of Orion's belt.
A kind of a 1-2-3 formation.
Meaning like a slanted line?
Yeah, at a bit of an angle.
So, as they were traveling, um, as I said, very slowly north to south.
Now you dive under the cloud cover.
Any sound?
Uh, no sound.
Not at all.
Fairly brightly, and unfortunately I didn't have a camera or binoculars or anything of that nature with me.
So I stood there probably six or seven minutes and watched these things float towards me much, much slower than an aircraft would have, and stood there long enough to try to discount what they were.
Well, I never could.
They remained glowing orange-yellow balls of light, and after I determined that they were separate because the one in the center of the three They seem to move a bit to the right and they would move a bit to the left, so they identify themselves as being individual objects.
After probably a good six or seven minutes, they just simply floated up into the cloud cover one at a time.
Now, the local Sheriff's Office was contacted and so was the National Weather Service, but so far those authorities have no explanation for these slow-moving, orange-glowing spheres in the night skies over Wenatchee and Cashmere, Washington.
And Art, I am reminded of a statement made to me by a deputy sheriff out in Elizabeth, Colorado back in around 1980.
He said that he made the association that when these red-orange glowing spheres of light showed up in the pastures and that he and other deputies were ordered to go out to try to track whatever these phenomena were, that that's when they had animal mutilation.
And he said when the orange glowing balls Went away, so did the mutilation.
I don't know if there's going to be a link this time, but I'm certainly hoping that our
Dreamland listeners up in the Midwest will keep an ear and eye out for any reports locally
of any unusual phenomena, whether it's animal mutilations or anything else, because these
clearly fall into the category of these very odd red-orange or orange-gold spheres that
were reported definitely back in the 60s and the 70s when there were so many flaps back
then too.
All right.
Well, this is going to seem weird to a lot of people, but I think the reason a lot of
UFOs are not seen by people is because of a laughably simple reason.
They don't look up.
I'm really serious.
You know, at night, if there's a light moving, then that might get your attention.
But during the day, we mostly, if you think about it, Linda, look straight ahead.
Yeah.
You know, or the object of our attention.
But rarely is it the sky.
I mean, unless there's a big jet sound or you look up.
You don't look up.
So a lot of people don't see them because they don't look.
Well, what is intriguing is whatever the blocks actually seem to be in formation.
Three in a sort of triangular pattern.
Yes.
And then followed by three more in that area up there.
That Cascade Mountain range that has the It's really wilderness in between areas that I've gotten reports of everything from Bigfoot to mutilations to lights on either side of that mountain range.
Who knows what all is up there, but I sure would welcome hearing from any of our listeners who may have seen anything else either like this report or the triangles or the rectangles or the disks or boomerangs or whatever else might be Strange out there in the sky.
All right, and to do that they can get hold of you and or one of your publications.
All right, well let's start with my address is post office box 538 and that's in Huntingdon Valley, Pennsylvania and the zip code is 19006.
My fax number is area code 215-491-9840.
And the email address is lmh333 at aol.com.
For those of you, that means that's America Online and it's lmh333 at aol.com.
And finally, a toll-free 800 number for information about my books and documentaries and possibly
to leave a very brief message is 800-707-9993.
Again, that's 800-707-9993.
And I will look forward to hearing from you all, and also to let the Northwest people, well everybody actually in the United States, to know that the 24-hour UFO hotline in Seattle, run by Peter Davenport, is taking these reports and trying to collate and tabulate, and they are at area code 206.
722-3000.
I think they are really one of the few places trying to keep track of everything that's going on.
They're very active.
Very active.
All right, Linda, as always, thank you.
You're a sweetheart.
We'll see you next week with another report, I presume, from home.
Okay.
All right, take care, Linda.
That's Linda Howe, who is an investigative journalist, actually, an Emmy Award-winning producer.
I never knew what happened after that.
I only remember falling to my knees, covering my eyes, and praying.
I've never forgotten all that.
That was 24 years ago.
From Elizabeth.
Now, coming up in a moment, the author of the Alien Abduction Survival Guide, with a clear implication that she was abducted, and we'll find out in just a moment, Michelle Levine.
Michelle was, uh, I guess regressed by Professor John Mack.
The foreword to her book is written by Mark Davenport.
It should be a fascinating interview.
It's coming up in just a moment.
You're listening to, of course, Dreamland on a Sunday evening.
I'm Art Bell.
Glad to have you here.
We'll be right back.
You've heard me talk about Microtech, the dining ravine.
Michelle, are you there?
Let's see, there now.
You should be there now.
Oh, hi, Alex.
Hi, Michelle.
How are you?
Oh, I'm pretty good.
How about yourself?
I'm fine.
Let's see, where are you?
I'm up in New Hampshire.
Oh, New Hampshire.
And it's cold.
I'll bet it is.
And it's also very late.
So thank you for getting up to join us.
Oh, I wouldn't have missed it.
All right.
I guess we should begin at the beginning.
I know your history with John Mack.
You have many friends who are in the ufology field.
But how did all this begin for you personally?
Well, I'm a lifelong abduction experiencer, and my experiences go back to when I was very, very young.
I think the first one that I really have any recall of I was lying in a crib looking through the bars of this yellow crib at a being standing in the room staring at me.
So it's really kind of hard to pinpoint the very beginning of it.
Are you the first in your family?
No, my family has a long line of abductions, so I really hate to point out the different family members because they have a right to their privacy.
Yes, of course.
Yeah, but my family does go generationally back.
Most people who have abduction experiences find that that runs for them also.
It tends to be generational and run in families.
Alright, that would lend some credence to the theory that there's some sort of genetic reason for these abductions.
In other words, they would be following a family genetically.
It appears that way.
How much are you able to recall of specifics regarding Who abducted you, what kind of surroundings you were in, how it occurred, how they got you out, how they got you back, what you saw during the course of the abduction, that kind of thing.
Well actually I was really surprised to find out when I started making connections with other abductees that I had more conscious recall than a lot of people.
I'm not sure why that is.
Maybe it's because I've been keeping journals of this type of stuff since I was about 16.
I know.
It really is like remembering a dream when you wake up.
If you don't write it down, it's gone in an hour or less.
It really can be that way.
So if you get in the habit of writing things down, you tend to remember them better.
Also, details tend to fill in as you start writing.
You say, wait a minute, I remember this led to that.
Alright, so give me your best recollection and as much detail because that's what everybody
craves.
How does it happen?
How do they get you out?
What do they do to you?
What are your surroundings like?
In other words, give me your most vivid recollection.
Oh, gee, that is really a stuffed question, if you will, because a lot of my recollections deal with things that aren't considered standard.
When you look at the average UFO story, the average abduction story... Yeah, but I'm not after that.
I'm after your story.
Okay, let me think.
In general, I'm usually picked up from my home, usually in my bedroom.
Generally, I'm woken up somehow.
Sometimes they like to pull my hair.
Are you married, Michele?
Yes, I am.
This is a lot to be going on.
Where is your husband?
Well, generally, sometimes he is taking part in this, but most of the time he's lying there on the bed and he's totally oblivious to what's going on.
Yes I am.
This is a lot to be going on.
Where is your husband?
Well, generally, sometimes he is taking part in this, but most of the time he is lying
there on the bed and he is totally oblivious to what is going on.
He is put in a very deep state of sleep.
And that is very common actually for people who have abduction experiences to have a loved
one or a roommate or whatever to be totally oblivious to what is happening to the person,
Well, I'll tell you, if I woke up and somebody was pulling my hair to wake me up and it wasn't the one next to me, I just don't know what I'd do.
I guess because it began early for you, you could tolerate it.
But I don't see how the average person could maintain sanity.
Well, you know, the thing is, at one point, it sounds... where I am now, in my understanding and in my experiences, it makes it sound like it was always easy, but it really wasn't.
I went through periods of being terrified of what's going on, of not understanding why this is happening to me, or how this is happening to me.
I had periods in my life where I was so terrified to even open my eyes at night, because if I woke up in the middle of the night, I thought to myself, my God, they're here, they're here, and I would close my eyes really tight and hope that nothing happens.
I have run the gambit of emotions right now in my life.
I'm not afraid of my encounters and I'm not afraid of my visitors, if you will.
So when I'm woken up by them, it's almost like I expect it.
After it happens to you so long, there are methods to learn to get over that startle reflex.
Once you practice those methods and you conquer the startle reflex, Then, when they come to you, it's not as threatening.
You're prepared for it.
Alright.
I remember how Peter Pan got out his window.
How'd you get out?
I mean, how do they get you from point A, your bedroom, to point B, I presume, their craft?
Well, generally, there's usually a beam of light coming from the craft, and I can't say that I remember this every single time I'm picked up, but I do remember it quite often.
The craft is usually somewhere around the area.
The beam of light that comes into the room attaches to the craft and when you step into
the beam of light, you just sort of float towards it.
And you float relatively quickly.
You pass through solid objects.
I know that's hard to believe, but you just pass right through walls and windows and you
appear in the craft standing on a piece of the floating to close up underneath you.
You know, you listened to Linda Howe, I'm sure, who was on the air prior to yourself.
Right.
And there have been a million reports of cattle mutilations, ductions.
And in almost every case, I mean, there have literally been hundreds of witnesses to cows going up in beams of light.
So, maybe whether it's a person or a cow or whatever else they want, those reports seem fairly consistent.
You know, the beam of light for transportation.
Right.
Interesting.
So there you are.
You arrive at their craft.
And then what?
Well, then usually I'm brought into a small room, an examination-like room.
First off, there are no corners on these crafts.
They're all rounded.
All rounded.
Yeah, they're all rounded.
The doors seem to be like pocket doors.
They sort of slide into the wall.
Um, kind of like on Star Trek.
That's a bad analogy because people say, well, you've seen it on Star Trek, but not really because the doorway is even around it.
In other words, it's a seamless kind of, um, architecture.
Right.
It's almost like a, uh, it just always reminded me of a hot tub, kind of like all molded, like in one big piece.
That's good.
That's good.
And even the benches, like in this waiting room that sometimes people are in, um, even the benches are just molded in one piece off the wall.
And, um, But usually I'm brought into an examination room right away.
The examination room that I go into most of the time is probably, oh, I would say it's probably maybe 9 by 15.
It's longer than it is wider.
It has a catwalk around the top with a black railing.
The room is very, very white, very brightly lit.
There's a table in the middle of the room.
There's a panel on at least one wall.
There's a smaller panel on another wall.
Um, on the bigger paneled wall, there seems to be writing and symbols on it.
They're gold and, not gold, silver type, look, silver metallic looking instruments on a tray that comes molding off of this panel.
When you say symbols, uh, have you seen the I-beams, Michelle, from the, uh, the, uh, Socorro crash?
Yeah, I have seen them.
Those kinds of symbols?
Uh, not exactly.
Uh, those symbols are much more simple.
The symbols on the beam, I'm much more simple than the symbols that I've seen.
All right.
Have you seen what are called, well, you've seen Chinese characters.
Right.
Would that be closer?
Closer in complexity, but not necessarily in form.
All right.
Well, this is good.
I asked for detail and you're giving me exactly what I wanted, a lot of detail.
And your recollections seem very sharp.
So there you are.
They get you on an examination table, or do you hop up there by yourself?
Well, it depends on what kind of a mood I'm in, actually.
Usually, though, I know that if I just go along with it and get it over with, it's a lot easier than fighting it and ending up with a headache.
So, generally, I'll walk into the room and I'll sit on the table.
Lots of times there's a memory lapse.
I'll be in my bedroom, I'll know they're in the room, they'll wake me up, I'll see the light, next thing you know I'm on the table.
So sometimes I'm not given the choice.
Let me think, let me think.
So then when I'm put on the table, generally the taller being, a lot of people have a taller being in events, just the little greys, they have the taller grey also.
Okay, I was going to ask you to describe the beings, but I kind of want to know... Back to the room?
Yeah, what do they do to you?
Well, depending on the typical abduction that happens with me, I generally get sort of an examination from head to toe.
And I know this sounds kind of silly, but they hold this thing over my body that looks very much like a tiny miniature model of the Sydney Opera House.
You know, kind of like shells inside of shells.
Really?
Yeah, I know it sounds really strange, but that's pretty much the best description.
Unfortunately, I don't have all the right words for some of these things that they have.
Sure, I know.
But they pass that over my body, and I don't exactly know what it does.
I was told once that it's aligning the energies of my body.
Whether or not that's what it's really doing or not, I would have to trust that they're telling me the truth.
Do you, by the way?
For the most part, I've learned that a lot of the things that they've told me do seem to be the truth, so I do tend to trust them.
There are people who say, They lie.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, and you know that they do play head games on people.
And so I know that sometimes people who are experiencing things that seem like lies, when they get these partial memories and everything, as they start to fill them in, they realize that there was some sort of past.
Or that they were some sort of event.
And also, the E.T.' 's have this really silly sense of humor that some people just don't get.
So, when the E.T.' 's play a joke on them... I know I'm going to get mail on this one.
Wait, this is very interesting.
Describe their sense of humor.
You said silly.
Do you mean silly as in dry or just silly as in...
Camp?
Well, let's just put it this way.
One of the favorite things that they like to do to people is they like to return you
to your home and put you in your bed, cover you with your blankets and then push your
blankets and tuck them in underneath your mattress so tight that you can't barely breathe,
that you can't move.
If you have a spouse or even a dog living with you, they'll put the spouse or the dog
on top of the blankets to make them even tighter.
And then they'll look at you and say, sleep tight.
Now they think it's a riot, okay?
Maybe they think that's human bed etiquette.
Who knows, you know?
But the people who it's happening to, if they don't realize that it's a joke, you know,
they wake up the next morning like, my God, what did they do that to me for?
Sure.
All right, Michelle.
They have this wonderful thing they like to do with me.
They wake me up in the middle of the night and I find out I have my head in a pillowcase.
All right, Michelle, hold tight.
When we come back, I want you to describe the beings themselves.
That's very valuable.
And as descriptive as you can be about them.
You've heard our GMX ads for about a year and a half now, so what are you waiting for?
GMX is the way to treat your hard water problems, and without salt.
Not only can you eliminate dealing with salt, you can also forget maintenance, extra electricity bills, or other hidden ongoing costs, aren't you?
Well, I would say that the small ones average probably about the height of a doorknob, that's like three feet or so to Okay.
close, maybe a little bit up to four feet or so around there. And the taller ones
who are noticeably thinner, thinner and I think they're even a little
bit longer than the shorter ones, tend to maybe go from like four and a half feet.
I've seen them probably up to about five feet. I'm 5'4", so I'm just sort of
judging by my own height. Okay, gosh, so they come in all kinds of varieties and sizes.
Well, they come in an assortment.
I mean, it's like, I think the same question if somebody said, so what does the average human look like?
Well, alright, my question is, would you think that you are seeing different species or varieties of the same species?
The same species.
Different, maybe different sides of the same species.
I've seen also, to call them grays is really not the best thing either, because though the ones that I usually see are sort of an ashen, pallor type to them, like sort of a grayish color, I have seen them that have been sort of blue, have sort of a bluish hue to their skin, yellow hue.
I've had people tell me about golden colored ones, even about ones that seem sort of red colored, and someone even told me about bright purple ones.
But this is one of the things I address in my book.
You know, just because I'm calling them greys, if someone else was having an encounter seeing them primarily as tan, it doesn't mean that they are different.
Well, the way things go these days, they'd probably want to be known as Pleiadian greys.
Politically correct, are we?
So, you know, the bottom line is, Michelle, you have been abducted all your life.
And you've written a book which tells people how to survive the experience, and that's really what I want to get to, and I'm sure it's really what you want to get to, because there are a lot of people out there, Michelle, they call me all the time, they claim they're abducted, and a lot of them are absolutely terrified.
I take it that you can relieve some of that fear.
I would hope so.
Or help them be comfortable with it.
Or maybe even help them prevent it.
That's a question I don't want you to answer just yet.
I'll ask it when we come back.
Stay right there and rest.
We'll be back to you after the news.
Which comes next on most of these affiliates.
And then more of Michelle Levine and how to survive an alien abduction.
Stay right there.
Okay.
Again, all your life you've been abducted.
How many times would you guess?
Would you put a number to it?
Oh, it would be really hard to put a number to it.
Probably in the hundreds.
Oh, that's a lot.
Yeah.
My abductions, different times in my life, I went through periods of having very intense, very close abductions to having abductions that were sparser.
When I was in my early 20s my abductions seemed to be maybe four or five times a year and then towards my late 20s they started speeding up.
So sometimes it's night after night after night after night and other times I might not have encounters for months.
What do you know about what they want with you?
Well that's a really difficult question because there seems to be an awful lot.
One part of the abduction phenomenon that very few people touch on and that you seldom ever see in the media is that there is a part of the abduction phenomenon that is beyond the medical testing.
There's actually a community set up in the ET environment where abductees interact with other abductees in sometimes their classes, lectures.
You mean like abductee support groups?
Kind of like that, only also sort of like a UFO high is the way I kind of put it, where people are taught things, they interact with other humans and other ETs and so a lot of my abductions have a lot to do with this experience beyond the medical experiences.
A lot of times when I'm picked up, I'm asked to teach classes where I, you know, have a group of people and I'm Teaching them one concept or another.
Other times, after a medical exam, I may be asked to attend a lecture or something.
So, there seems to be an awful lot of learning going on and an awful lot of teaching going on.
The ETs seem to... Okay, hold it.
If there's a lot of learning and a lot of teaching, then you ought to be able to more or less answer my question, and that is, what do they want with us?
Well, it seems that somehow, if you believe everything that's going on, if you believe, and I want to qualify this by saying I know some abductees who are even experiencing this and think it's all some sort of head game.
Personally, I don't.
Personally, I think there's something to it.
It seems that the ETs somehow are here because the Earth is going to go through some changes.
We're talking some sort of consciousness raising and they are somehow going to take part in this and are assisting us in order to prepare us for this.
You know, that's about the last thing I wanted to hear you say.
Well, you know, that is one of the things that's coming up in a lot of these classes.
A lot of these classes are being taught about You know, the nature of eternity and things like that.
There also seems to be some sort of, like you mentioned before, some sort of genetic purpose in all of this.
I know people who really believe that somehow the ETs are going to conquer our world and replace our human race with the ET race.
I don't think that they're going to do that, if they are, in the way these people believe they are, because they could have done it very efficiently.
A lot earlier than they are, but it could be, and I do have a feeling that maybe there is some sort of intermixing going on that is eventually going to create a race that isn't exactly us, but isn't exactly them.
Well, the traditional theory, I believe, is that they have weakened themselves genetically, their entire genetic pool, and they need us to strengthen that.
Right.
Is that the one you tend to believe?
Well, I think that that's a piece of it.
I think that there are so many pieces to this puzzle that none of us are getting all the pieces.
Because if any one of us had all the pieces, we would have put this together already.
That's a good point.
And so a lot of us are getting different pieces of this puzzle.
And some people are so covenant of their own piece that they don't want to look at anyone else's piece.
So they're ignoring the other information that they're getting.
As a matter of fact, this was an issue for me recently when I took over as editor of Contact Forum Magazine.
The contact and contact form was an issue for me.
What is contact?
What denotes contact?
Being a physical abductee, being a person who has had physical interaction with non-human intelligence, not just race, but with other, or seemingly other races, I can qualify that one too, having these contacts, it's easy for me to say contact is Walking on a spaceship, touching an alien, talking to an alien.
This is contact, okay?
That's right.
Oh, yes.
But there are other pieces to this puzzle.
Pieces that I have no concept of understanding and that I could not explain to you.
Pieces that I haven't even heard of yet.
I mean, they're phenomenal.
Look at Linda with the cattle mutilation.
There's a piece of the puzzle nobody likes to look at.
I know.
Okay?
Especially abductees.
They say, God, if they're doing that to cattle, could they do that to me?
Okay?
Have they ever?
According to Linda, and I just interviewed her for contact form last month.
No, no, no, no.
I meant you.
Have they ever physically hurt you?
Physically?
They have done things to me that have caused me pain, but I have not had any long-lasting effects.
You sound like my dentist.
No, no.
How much pain?
Enough pain that I've been in tears.
Often though, I've found that when I'm doing something that hurts me, if I tell them they're doing something that hurts me, if I tell them it hurts, they stop the pain.
They might not stop the procedure.
But they do something to numb me from not feeling the pain.
Well, that's better than my dentist most times.
All right.
Actually, I'm cool to her.
She's very nice.
She's a pain-free dentist and a very nice lady.
It's always good to be nice to your dentist because you're going to have to go back.
Well, that's well said.
Yes.
All right.
Suppose I, at my late age, now I'm 50, suppose I were to begin to be abducted.
Could I do anything about it?
First of all, could I prevent it?
Well, the thing is, and this is an answer that not many people are going to like, especially people who are experiencing this, I have yet to find one thing that people say works to prevent an abduction that actually does prevent the abduction.
I've heard of a million things.
Run video recorders all night.
The people I know who've tried that have sleptwalked in the middle of the night and shut off their video recorders.
I know people who, or the video recorder mysteriously unplugs itself or the battery runs dead, you know.
I know people who believe that you leave the TV on, they can't bother you.
You sleep with an amethyst around your neck, they can't touch you.
You put salt on your windowsills, they can't get by it.
I mean, I've heard all of them.
And I've tried several of them.
Oh, you have?
And at some point, I've tried them even just to see if they've worked.
Do you know what I'm saying?
Yes.
Like, I had a dear friend who insisted, absolutely insisted, that she knew how to stop abduction.
That if you hummed on this certain key, I believe it was the A above middle C, and if you hummed on that certain key, there was no way that they could touch you.
Okay?
That somehow it changed the frequency of their bodies and they couldn't get near you.
Well... I tell you, you tried it.
Oh yes, I tried it, and I found that... Did it appeal to their silly sense of humor?
Well, I found that if you hum for a half hour, you get a sore, dry throat.
And it doesn't stop an abduction, but subjectively, in subjective reality, it may have worked for someone in the past.
Say someone has been picked up by aliens, and they're on an examining table, and they start humming on this note, And the ETs are becoming annoyed because this person just won't stop this annoying sound and stun them.
And the person has put out coal.
And so the last thing they remember is lying on this table humming.
The next thing they remember, they're lying in their bed.
They have no conscious memory of what transpired in the middle.
They don't remember... I don't know if that's good or bad.
Maybe the moral of that story is it's good not to annoy an alien.
I don't know.
Maybe it was good to annoy them in his case because he might have been very pleased that the next thing he remembered was being home.
So in his subconscious reality, maybe humming worked.
Alright, I'm going to ask you now a serious question.
I've been joking around a lot.
For somebody who's being abducted, if it can't be prevented, and it sounds like your answer said there's really no way that you found, then what advice do you give to an abductee?
How do they survive the experience?
Well, the first thing they have to realize is that they don't have to be a victim, okay?
Many times when you find out this is happening to you, Especially if you get involved with the media blitz and a lot of the scary stuff that they put on TV and things.
Right away you say to yourself, oh my God, I'm a victim.
I'm being used.
I'm being abused.
How can I stop this?
And that's very natural, okay?
But the next step of feeling victimized is saying, oh, I can't do anything to stop this.
And you start to have a low self-esteem.
First thing you have to do is say, I don't have to be a victim anymore.
Um, the next thing that you have to do is you have to start taking control of your situation.
Um, it's very important, and I know that some people are going to say that sounds silly.
I know, but I've got to stop you already.
You know, that sounds so touchy-feely to say, I don't have to be a victim.
But if you cannot stop the abductions, then you are going to be a continuing victim of abduction.
Well, if you, in one reality, okay, okay, granted that is that, okay?
But you have to take the next step.
The one step alone doesn't work, okay?
And that's why, if it were just that one step, I could have put out a pamphlet, not a book.
Yeah, okay, what is, alright, so, I am not a victim.
Okay, so, and then the next thing you have to do is you have to, first, you have to start understanding that your emotions are going to run in cycles, okay?
And you have to start understanding your cycle.
I'm trying to nutshell this for you very quickly.
Sure.
You have to try to take control of your fear in the times when you're fearful.
Because these things run in cycles, the times when you're not feeling as anxious, you can do yourself some good.
That's the time when you start to work on things.
This might sound silly to some, but you have to resolve in your mind that you're going to talk to the alien.
Okay.
Or to the whatever they are.
I hate to use the word alien in the pure sense of the word because who knows if they're extraterrestrial, extraterrestrial, temporal or whatever.
You want to use the word beings.
It doesn't matter.
So you've got to communicate with them.
This is done.
You obviously have done it.
Is it done mentally or I take it it is done with telepathy?
It can be done either way.
I mean if you talk they can hear you.
You can think to them, obviously it usually starts with celebrity because when you wake
up to find these beings sitting in your room, if you don't startle, which is a common human
response is to startle, and this is pick up anxiety.
Most people actually fear that moment of pick up.
Do you know how many abductees say to me, if they knock on the door, maybe I go, but
why do they have to take me like this?
So when they get you in that position where they startle you, the best thing you're probably
going to be able to do is to think to them, okay, let's talk or use some sort of words
Do they speak back to us aloud?
Well, actually, it's not common, but it does happen.
That's one of the myths, that they only talk with telepathy.
They actually do also make sound.
They do?
I'm not sure that all of them know how to talk English.
I couldn't tell you that.
The ones that I have heard talk English, their voices seem very nasally, and they sound rather mechanical when they speak, like they're having a difficult time pronouncing some of the words.
But I think the myth that they don't talk with sound at all comes from the fact that they do seem to prefer telepathy.
And also, when they do speak verbally, their mouths don't really move.
It's almost like a small quiver on the foot of their mouth.
I thought about that myself at some point.
If you're half asleep in your days and they come walking in the room and they contact you, it's harder.
something in your mind and hearing it with your ear?
I thought about that myself at some point because if you are half asleep in your days
and they come walking in the room and they contact you it is harder.
But if you are in a situation where you have been awake for a little while and you are
more conscious of what is going on it is a lot easier because you hear it inside.
It passes by the ears.
I'm going to ask you a very hard question, Michelle.
Okay.
Don't take offense.
No, I won't.
Okay.
I've had them all, I think.
Well, good.
Then you won't mind this one, I hope.
How do you know you're not crazy as a loon?
Well, you know, I've asked myself that question, too.
I'll be honest with you.
Most people who Let's start exploring this and myself included wished at one point that we were crazy as loons because crazy is something you can go see a doctor for and get treatment for.
In your case I know you went to John Mack and he is a head of the field.
John's a wonderful person.
So you went to him and told him about all of this I'm sure and he did what?
Did he regress you?
Did he Talked to you?
Did he interview you?
How did he handle your case?
Well, actually, I was pre-screened by several people before I even met John.
I was screened by the move-on director of my state.
I was screened by one of John's associates three times, which were off tape and sent to John.
And eventually, I had an interview with John.
And during that interview was when he decided that You should probably work on a regression.
He had asked me to bring a list of maybe three or four questions that I had that he could probably hit on during the regression and I brought him a list of 51.
I was a little anxious at that time.
But I'd like to go back to your question about how do I know that I'm not crazy.
Sure.
There are physical things that happen to me when I wake up in someone else's clothing.
I've had times where I've gone to bed.
It is a joke in my family.
I write my name.
Whenever I have a nice nightgown that I want to keep, I write my name on the tag.
I know it sounds silly, but I have had times where I have gone to bed in my clothing that I've owned and woken up the next morning with something that I've never seen in my life.
It would be very disturbing.
It is very disturbing, and it also is something that you really can't do psychosomatically, I don't believe.
Um, do you have children?
How many?
I have three children.
Are they all yours and your husband's?
Mm-hmm.
In other words, you don't think they ever impregnated you?
I didn't say that.
I have three children here on Earth that are mine and my husband's.
I don't know how many times.
I couldn't give you an exact number of how many times.
I may have been implanted with some sort of, uh... Well, there's a reason for that question, because other abductees have actually been introduced to what they surmised to be their honor.
Just relax, Michelle.
For a lot of people, it's a mystery.
For example, what's going on in Bosnia?
One way to find out is to get a good radio.
Plus, whether it's earthquakes in the West, flooding in the Midwest and East now, Snowstorm ought to have an emergency.
From the Kingdom of Nine, you're hearing Greenland with Art Bell.
To participate in the program, call toll-free 1-800-618-8255.
1-800-618-8255 1-800-618-8255
1st Time Callers Area Code 702-727-1222
727-1222.
Or the wildcard line at 702-727-1295.
This is the CBC Radio Network.
It is, and my guest is veteran abductee Michelle Levine.
I say veteran, it's been going on all her life.
Literally hundreds of times.
And so she finally settled in and wrote the Alien Abduction Survival Guide.
And that's kind of what we're talking about.
I've got a number of interesting questions, many of them coming in by fax.
Kind of, some of them sort of silly, like she said, the alien's humor is on occasion.
At least I consider them that way, but we will nevertheless ask them in a moment.
How many of you remember a time, Elleveen?
You are a veteran, aren't you?
I guess so.
I guess so.
All right.
These are kind of silly questions I wouldn't think to ask, but two of my faxers have.
Michelle, what if you wanted to be abducted?
What if you've never been abducted?
You feel left out.
You want the scientific adventure.
You want the thrill, the scare.
Is there any way to actually go about inviting abduction?
I really couldn't tell you.
I never really I haven't given it much thought, to be honest with you, and I don't really know anyone who has found a way, aside from the occasional people who happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, if you will.
It seems that abductees generally are from genetic lines of abductees, or sometimes people who marry into a genetic line that has abductions going on with it will start being abducted by association.
Has it ever been an official cause for divorce that you know of?
Officially, I don't know if it would be actually officially, but I have seen some marriages break up over it.
I can imagine, actually.
And I've also seen some marriages actually make it through the struggle and come out better on the other side.
Alright, could you ask your guest, this is a tough one, if she's ever bothered to document for the rest of it something along the line of, say, proof Proof of alien existence, possibly videotaping the event.
Proof of her abductions, like grabbing some sort of instrument from the examining table.
And, you know, it really, if it's true, is the most important story the human race will ever realize.
So it is a good question.
Have you ever tried to grab something or obtain good, hard proof?
Or do you have it?
Actually, I don't.
I have in the past tried to do things like that.
I never got away with it.
Lots of times I wasn't doing it for proof to the world because I gave up trying to prove things to the world a long time ago.
I found that it's not important that, you know, so-and-so and his brother-in-law believe me.
It's important that I believe me.
But I tried, at times when I was trying for my own verification, for my own, you know, I hope I'm not crazy.
I tried to get my hands on things.
I've tried to do things like when they've taken off my wedding ring, which I cannot take off because I've unfortunately gained some weight since I got married, but they managed to get it off of me.
I tried putting it on the wrong hand, things like that.
They have a wonderful way of playing games with people where they will tell you, you can have this piece of metal or you can have this book or you can have this whatever.
uh... that but the like that metal dot on the computer your planet you can take it
on the earth and you're going to be the one who could approve to the world
that we did uh... you're talking
yet they'll do that to people and uh... but didn't you know the person usually
you know it's so excited i'm going to be the one and i'm gonna show the world
and i finally have proof and then right before they bring you home they tell you i'm
sorry you know plant that change we can't let you do that but i don't want
to let's see you know you see that there you are there there you are a bit
uh... michelle uh...
william sapphire would say that probably makes them a bunch of congenital wires
Yeah, you know, and the interesting thing about this particular scenario is that generally they'll bring the piece back to the person and say to the person, I changed my mind.
You can have it again.
And they'll keep doing this back and forth until the person finally says, forget it.
I don't even want to see that thing.
Get it away from me.
Okay.
And, um, until they really frustrate the person.
And, um, sometimes, I mean, these head games don't always make sense.
I'll admit that.
I know that when I've asked about them, usually I get an answer like, you have to know deception when you see it, or things like that.
Alright.
Whether or not those answers are valid, you know, it's hard to say.
Often we get answers like, you know the answer to that, and that's very frustrating.
That's more frustrating than the games themselves.
Yeah, it really sounds like they do play a lot of games.
Alright, well you asked your guest, and I don't know why after what I just heard, but what exactly the aliens have told her about our future, and what part they will take in it.
Now, that is a very big question, and again, that's another question where I find that either your experiences are such that you believe it, or your experiences are such that you say, well, this is ridiculous and I'm not going to believe it.
And objectives do differ on whether or not they believe the messages that they're given by the ETs.
In general, the ETs do have a habit of showing people...
Reaction test if you will, showing people visions of You know, incredible earth disasters, catastrophes, and recently though, interestingly enough, when I was younger, many, many abductees were shown visions of nuclear war, nuclear war, nuclear war, nuclear war, over and over and over again.
They would make you practice, they would put you in a scenario where you actually thought that you were in this nuclear war, and you were trying to get away, and you were trying to be safe, or they would show you the world blowing up.
And always reminded me of the Gary Larson cartoon with the aliens on the moon going, ooh, because the world's all covered in mushroom clouds.
But they would show you these terrible visions of horrible things happening to the Earth.
And lately, in the last four or five years, the nuclear disaster stuff has sort of shifted from nuclear war to nuclear accidents, sort of like an earthquake happening near a nuclear power plant and there's radiation and fallout and all this stuff.
You know, there's a lot of theories as to why they're showing us this stuff.
I know that different researchers have different theories on it, and different abductees have different theories on it.
It seems that they're preparing us for something.
Either that or trying to show us something that can and should be avoided, or maybe it can somehow be avoided after all, at least up until this moment.
No massive nuclear war.
Right, but then again, if they really wanted to do that, why aren't they showing this to the political leaders?
But we don't know if they're not showing it to the political leaders, because if they were abducted, they're not going to come forward with it.
But still, abductees tend to have what I call the be prepared reaction sort of built into them because of these visions.
Well, anybody who has control over nuclear weapons should have such dreams.
Michelle, let us begin taking a few phone calls.
Sure.
All right, everybody.
For Michelle, the only number not given out is our East of the Rockies number, which is 1-800-825-5033.
1-800-825-5033, East of the Rockies.
Let us proceed.
West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Michelle Levine.
Hi.
Hi, Art.
This is Bonnie from Clear Lake.
Hello, Bonnie.
East of the Rockies. Let us proceed. West of the Rockies, you're on the air with
Michelle Levine. Hi. Hi Art, this is Bonnie from Clear Lake.
Hello Bonnie. I'd like to ask her, when you ask her about her kids, I'd like to know why she doesn't
definitively get some DNA tests and prove, you know, whether they belong to her and her husband.
And if she has a particular type, blood type, I'd like to know.
Alright, alright.
Well, I did ask definitively whether they were the children of yourself and your husband.
You said yes.
I don't feel inclined to probe beyond that.
I don't care whether you've had blood tests or not, but I would like to know what I meant to ask some time ago, and that was whether you have ever seen a child that you believe may have been yours.
In the E.T.
Company, I assume you mean.
That's correct.
Yes, I have been shown children several of different ages.
Often on, I've been told to hold an infant, and I was told that it was mine, and it was clear that the infant wasn't completely human.
Several times I've had a child, I would say probably about four or five years old, let out to me and I was told that the child was mine.
I know that one time when I did ask, because I have memories of having procedures that people call fetal extractions done, I finally asked Hittar, who is one of the great, that's the name I have for him, Hittar.
I asked him how many children I do have in their presence and this was three years ago.
He told me 63.
I don't know.
I can't honestly tell you.
I don't have any memory of 63 children, so I don't know.
Nobody would want a memory of that.
Oh, no.
Not unless you were doing your income taxes.
Good luck on that claim.
Listen, what did Professor John Mack, because he is so well respected, and people are probably sitting out there right now saying, ooh, what a crackpot, but Professor Mack is anything but at Harvard.
And he extensively regressed you and interviewed you.
What did he conclude?
I honestly don't know if John has made any definite conclusions.
I know that he is still looking into the subject.
He's doing some very fascinating work in South Africa right now.
No, I mean about your regressions, your stories.
Did you get the impression he believed you or thought you were a crackpot?
I mean, you got through all his screeners.
Oh yeah, and through the regression and I keep in touch with John to this day.
I attend his support group meetings.
I work with Pierre.
I send him an awful lot of referrals.
I speak to them on the phone often.
I went to their Christmas party.
He really doesn't treat me like I'm a crackpot.
He treats me with respect.
He asks me when he has different things.
As a matter of fact, the film of Some interviews he did in South Africa, he asked me to view them.
I have to qualify that by saying not just me, there were several people there, but I feel that John has always treated me with respect, and that if I were a crackpot in John's eyes, that he probably would have let me go the way of several other people who have come into his company.
I'm sure.
Alright, with that in mind... But I really, honestly at this point, I'm so Beyond the point of worrying if people think I'm a crackpot or not.
I understand.
No, I'm just trying to ask what I know would be in the mind of the people in the audience.
Okay.
And it's been with you all your life.
They're just introduced to you tonight.
Right.
On the wildcard line, you're on the air with Michelle Levine.
Hi.
Hi, this is Mark Honolulu, and I'm online with the IRC people.
And one of the questions we'd like to know is what kind of changes in Michelle's spirituality has occurred from the beginning to now, relevant to your experiences?
Alright, that's a good question, and let's even expand it.
Are you of any specific religion, Michelle?
Not any longer.
I was raised Catholic, and my family had several religious changes into different Christian religions as I was growing up.
None of which I followed very closely.
As I got more and more into the understanding of my own experiences, I started asking harder
questions.
It's not easy to accept the box answers when you've seen outside the box.
You realize that, wait a minute, this is probably not the complete truth that they are selling
me here.
You start to ask the bigger questions.
With regard to your spirituality, would you say it has increased as a result of all this?
Changed, or what?
My spiritual life has grown in incredible dimensions as part of the ongoing experience that I'm having, not only with the E.T.s who I perceive as small and gray, but also with other E.T.s who seem very humanoid.
I think what happens is that when you...
...in this creation, it really kind of gives you a sense of awe,
It kind of, you know, changes your perspective of things.
Michelle, is it your view that the proof, if there ever is to be any, of aliens or beings, whatever they are, will come from the spiritual realm or will it possibly ever come from the scientific community?
I think the scientific, my personal opinion right now is that the scientific community has had some proof for a while and pretty much their hands are tied, I think.
But I think that when the proof does come, it's not going to come in a way that anyone's expecting it.
I really couldn't tell you, I don't think we're ever going to see a UFO land on the White House lawn.
I don't think that they're going to fly over the Super Bowl and knock the blimp down or anything like that.
Well, with the recent experiences of the White House, the lawn, and all the rest of it, I'd say it'd be very inadvisable to land there.
They're not happy about that.
All right, Michelle, hold on just a moment.
We'll be right back to you.
My guest is Michelle Levine.
The book she has written, The Alien Abduction Survival Guide.
And yes, we will tell you how to get it.
If you suffer from headaches, neck aches, sports itch...
And the time always seems too short.
Michelle, let's go east of the Rockies and say you're on with Michelle.
Hi.
There's one little quick thing I want to say.
Do you recall the spaceships that they were seeing in Korea here about two weeks ago?
Yes, sir, I do.
Remember Stan Dale when you interviewed him?
And one of the things he said, the first spacecraft that he worked with and designed Had a hole in the middle?
I do recall very vividly, and I am dying to get my hands on some of the Korean photos, so... Well, he mentioned that that was the first type of spacecraft that he designed.
Well, I'll tell you what, when we get a photo, we'll talk to Stan, and we'll find out if that's one of them.
Okay, and I have two questions to ask her.
Where are you, by the way?
Albuquerque.
Alright.
She stated that she gave classes, and there were people in the classes that she had taken also.
Number one, I'd like to know the gender makeup of the people, and number two, I'd like to know what ethnic types there were.
Were they from all around the world, or were they from just as general?
Good question.
What about the other humans?
A blend?
A mix?
All white folks?
Well, as far as the gender makeup goes, I've taught classes with mixed genders in the class.
Um, classes, like one class I did recently was all boys who were teenagers.
Um, another class, um, might be all older people.
Generally, though, you usually see the genders a mix.
Um, I've seen, as far as races go, I've seen, um, African American, white, um, I've seen... Alright, that answers it.
When you teach a class, you're teaching, uh, human beings on an alien craft, correct?
Usually, yes.
And I take it that you are teaching them the basics of what's in your book?
In some cases, yes.
The ideas behind coping with their abduction experiences, between getting control of their fear, getting control of their anger, how to maintain the I'm sorry to interrupt, but don't you worry that you're a tool of them?
And that having seen them lie once, I always worry when somebody lies to me once, I never trust them again.
don't you worry that you're a tool of them
and that uh... having seen them live once i was worried when somebody lies to
me wants
i never trust him again and don't you worry that you are a tool for them
in calming people in in getting people to accept this abduction
have you ever given that any thought You know I have thought about that in the past but you know
what I've noticed is that if this was something that were bad for people then you
think that you'd see their lives start to fall apart and they learn to work with this and as they
learn to handle this that it would start taking over them and you'd start to see them
deteriorate physically, mentally, spiritually.
And actually, just the opposite happens.
And they invigorate.
They grow spiritually.
All right, Michelle, hold on.
It's break time.
We'll try to concentrate more on the phones when we come back.
My guest is Michelle Levine.
She has written the Alien Abduction Survival Guide.
And she has the experience to know what she's talking about.
More in a moment Solar power
I'm going to read you something.
I think you'll find this intriguing from Sacramento, California.
Michelle, I've had several experiences with ETs.
One incident that remains unsolved in 1978 is, I had a dream I was being examined by an ET.
Believe it or not, after that, my wife began producing milk.
She went to the doctor.
Two weeks later, only to find that she was not pregnant at that time.
Shortly there afterwards, the melt stopped.
Weird, huh?
Actually, it's pretty common for an abduction experience, or his wife obviously must have had an abduction experience, to find out that they're lactating after an experience.
The theory is that they could have been carrying a fetus for the ETs, and after the fetus was taken, Just like in a normal pregnancy after the baby is born or just before the mother starts lactating to provide sustenance for the baby, it could also be that the hormones after a fetus is delivered are such that the woman starts to lactate for several days after.
It actually happens to many women and many women are sort of embarrassed to talk about it.
Sure.
Well, I can imagine.
Sure.
East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Michelle Levine.
Where are you calling from, please?
Nashville.
Nashville.
All right.
Good.
Yes, I'd like to ask Michelle.
Michelle, how long, were you gone pretty much the same amount of time?
I've got two questions.
All right.
Were you gone pretty much the same amount of time every time or was it a different amount of time?
Well, it really varies from time to time.
It's hard to say when you're sleeping, you know.
I mean, if I go to bed at 10 o'clock or whatever, and I get up at 6 the next morning, and I had an event during the night, I really probably wouldn't be aware of how long I was gone, whether it was one hour, two hours, three hours, whatever.
Or whether the time spent there was relevant to the time spent away.
That's a very good point.
Often the time isn't relevant to the time spent away.
Other times when I was a child, I had missing time.
Where my parents had actually called the police looking for me and a cousin of mine and a cousin's friend who had all gone to play together, the three of us.
We were playing in the backyard with this cousin's friend.
It was morning.
It was about 10 in the morning.
We were playing.
We were playing, rolling around the grass and sitting there.
And I remember hearing silence.
And I know that sounds strange, but it just got so silent that it made your ears feel funny, looking up and seeing this silvery craft coming towards us.
And next thing you know, I'm looking at a dark night sky and it had been, it was past 8.30 that night and we had been gone the whole time.
Alright.
Caller?
Okay, would you do me, uh, would you do me a favor?
Yeah.
Okay, and this is, uh, this is not necessarily a credibility question, but then again, it may be, uh, that's just how everybody takes it, but would you harm me, uh, A above high C?
I probably couldn't hum the A Above High C very well.
When I had been doing it, I have a piano.
When I had been doing it, I practiced for several days against the piano.
As a matter of fact, when I actually was trying it and it didn't work, I changed the key, the pitch of the key a couple of times in case I am stone deaf or something or tone deaf.
told her that i think it's not that they would have to pick up
uh... it's a good point and uh...
it's a good point and i and i guess you wouldn't really have any way of knowing
for sure whether you had a right
Right.
You know, going a half tone up, a half tone down from it.
But really, I did practice with the piano, you know, hitting the piano and listening to the sound of the piano and matching it and everything.
And it was a lot of trouble to go through to test this particular theory, but it's something that you do.
You get obsessed with these little things.
You want to find out, you know.
All right, all right.
Let's go west of the Rockies.
You're on the air with Michelle Levine.
Hello.
Oh, hello.
Good evening, Mr. Bell, and to you and your guest.
Where are you?
I am down here in the San Joaquin Valley, Fresno, California.
OK.
And KMJ via, yeah, Big 580.
You bet.
OK, if I can make a couple of quick comments and a question for your guest.
Yes.
OK, I've had the experience, I wouldn't say it was an abduction.
This is approximately two, two and a half years ago.
I had the experience of being elevated and then turned on my side and examined by somebody
or something with an instrument that was shaped like a gun or thereof and they shot something
through my abdomen and that was the end of that dream.
And then second here last year, Mr. Levine, I saw an object.
It was rather large, triangular shape with elevated wings.
Several lights, streams of lights, and I assure you it wasn't a Jared airliner by virtue of the way the lights were arranged.
Now, prior to this, about a week prior to this, this is during Labor Day weekend or before or after, twice I had the experience in a deep sleep and I was, then all of a sudden I started awake with a sensation I would say you're a candidate for regression.
He's definitely a candidate for more study.
I think he should document these things and write them down.
I opened my eyes and saw a large metallic, not a large but a long slender metallic object
that disappeared in front of me.
I would say you're a candidate for regression.
He's definitely a candidate for more study.
I think he should document these things and write them down.
You know, regression isn't something you should rush into.
You know, that's something you really should...
Well, that brings us to another good point.
Michelle, is it good for all people to know what they've gone through, or would you say in a lot of cases it's frankly better they don't know?
Well, some people don't have the urge to know.
Sometimes you know that there's a person who's an experiencer.
They may have something that leads you to believe that they're an experiencer, but they I don't really have that burning to know.
And it's not really good to push him at that point.
Hypnotherapy isn't a piece of cake.
It isn't easy by any means.
And it isn't something that's a lot of fun.
And it isn't something that's necessary for a lot of people either.
Alright, we'll leave it at that.
First time caller on the line, you're on the air with Michelle Levine.
Hello.
Hello, thank you.
Where are you?
Hello?
Yes, where are you sir?
I'm in Crook Creek in Seminole, Florida.
Alright.
First of all, I have a question, and then I have a comment or a suggestion.
First of all, I should not ask a leading question, therefore I'll ask it this way, Michelle.
What types of physical symptoms or physical phenomena have occurred on you after being told you were pregnant, I guess you were told?
All right, turn your radio off for us while she's answering that.
Go ahead, Michelle.
Sometimes there aren't a lot of physical symptoms.
Generally, I've skipped periods for months at a time.
I've had, not to sound too graphic, but I've had swollen, sore breath.
I've not necessarily had morning sickness or anything like that that I really can recall.
Generally, the symptoms are more bloating, I've felt I've actually, towards the end of this, which generally goes about two to three months only, I've actually felt movement before I knew that this was happening to me, before I knew what this was.
Alright, so otherwise, a lot of women have these feelings every month, but you're telling us you actually experienced what you believe to be a short-term, by our standards, pregnancy, right?
It would really appear to be that.
Comparing it to my normal full-term pregnancies with my three children, The movement was very much the same.
There is a very different feeling between the movement of a separate body moving inside
of you and say like a gas bubble in your intestine popping or something.
I understand.
Collar?
Yes, and also was there anything in the vicinity of your belly button?
No, actually I know that a lot of women do have the needle marks in and around their
belly button.
I don't seem to get those.
Good.
I wouldn't want those and that would make the experience very unpleasant.
Where are you calling from, please?
I'm calling from Madison, Wisconsin.
Yes, sir.
I just had a thought that just occurred to me the other day, and I don't know if it's really a brilliant thought or comment, but I just thought I'd ask your guess.
A lot of the scientists say that when they investigate the possibility of alien life on other planets, they just go from a real scientific point of view and check atmospheric conditions to see if the weather, if the climate there is suitable for somebody to live.
And they always seem to compare it to us.
Isn't that kind of an arrogant way to approach things when you may want to consider that there might possibly be alien life that could live in a climate that, say, is 300 below zero or 400 degrees above zero or something like that?
All right.
Fair question.
Scientists the other day announced, Michelle, they found two planets 35 light years from here that they believe can sustain or are capable of sustaining life.
However, these planets are larger than Jupiter.
That would mean the kind of life they would sustain would have to be... Well, it's hard for us to imagine, and should that life ever come here, it would be like Superman coming from Krypton.
In other words, they would be so dense, so strong, probably so short, they'd be horrors.
But you know, you're assuming then, in this question, that these beings that we're encountering are indeed from another planet.
We don't really know that, and they aren't really telling anyone.
I mean, they could be extra-dimensional.
They've alluded to that fact.
There have been abductions that have sort of alluded to that fact.
They could be extra-temporal.
They could be from another time.
They could be from another reality that we don't know, a parallel universe.
They're really, as far as I know, they really haven't sat anyone down and said, hey guys, as far as this question goes, this is where we're from.
I know that they've pointed to stars to people and said, well, you know, this is our star, that's our star.
But as far as that goes, people...
But they won't.
Well, they could be.
And as a matter of fact, in my own personal time that this happened, I was in a room,
there were stars all over the room.
I mean, not just on the walls, these were like little lights hanging in the sky.
It's sort of like a three-dimensional type of effect in this room.
And I said to Hitar, so which place are you from?
And he said to me, well, can you pick out the one that Earth is around?
And, of course, I couldn't.
I'm looking at all these lights, these little blue ones, little orange ones.
I'm not having an astronomy background.
Sure, sure, you wouldn't know.
I'm looking at these things.
They were pretty, but they didn't mean anything to me.
I said, no.
And then he said, so what difference does it make?
I could point to any of these, and it wouldn't make any difference to you because you don't have a starting point.
He had a good point, and we'll be right back to you, Michelle.
Michelle Levine experienced I'm so awake!
Hello Art.
Hi, where are you?
This is Ed.
I'm from San Diego.
Hi Ed.
Hi, nice to get through to you.
I have a couple questions.
Actually, just one major theme for Michelle.
Actually, I think, Michelle, you there?
Yeah, I'm here.
Hi.
You're one of the most amazing abductee people I've interviewed yet.
You seem to have You've described kind of a collegial atmosphere among people, supposedly humans, that you ran into in your experiences, right?
In some cases, yes.
Have you ever met and talked to these people?
Yes, actually.
This is the really neat part that you don't see in the media either.
It's amazing how many people this happens to, and it's not just me.
There's a lot of people that this is happening to, particularly at things like UFO conventions or whatever, where people tend to congregate who are into this subject.
They bump into people and they recognize them.
Often they might not recognize.
How come they recognize them until later?
But on a regular basis, people do bump into people who they recognize.
and they know where they recognize them from. They remember them. They can talk about them.
This is something that you're not going to see very much on TV. As a matter of fact,
I had something recently happen to me just last week where a person who lives in Michigan
and I'm in New Hampshire, who I know through mail, I had an event.
I came home from an event, and I had a very conscious memory of talking to this person there.
And we talked about a relatively silly subject.
It was something that would stick out in your mind, but it's not something that you would normally talk to someone about.
Michelle, and Caller, hold on.
You know, that is so interesting because it seems to me that's the road to proof.
In other words, if people in disparate places who have not known each other in any other way are able to separately cooperate A conversation.
You're approaching some pretty significant proof, it seems to me.
It's outstanding, it really is.
Because generally in the past, if one person has had a memory of an event, and they remember seeing another event, maybe that other person doesn't really have a memory of it.
But what we're seeing more and more recently and I don't know if it's that people are or that the ETs are allowing people to have more control or that people are learning to to control this more or maybe people are reading the book
and they're starting to understand uh plug plug no but seriously we'll get to plug in no worry
uh the caller we don't have much time and i think the caller had another question okay my only
question was i think you covered it pretty much all except um i'm just curious to know if this has
actually happened to you personally you you've actually met people that you have yeah been in a club
dusty with no the answer is yes stunning uh last week like i said last week i had this
particularly odd conversation with this I came home.
I'm in the habit of writing in my journal, so I wrote down what we talked about in my journal, and then I picked up my email.
In my email, I got a letter from this person saying to me, you know, I saw you last night and this is what we talked about.
Do you remember?
I was totally elated by it.
I was so excited by it.
It was a two-way conversation and we came home, both of us went in our separate directions, her to Michigan, me to New Hampshire, and we recalled it.
That is amazing.
Alright, look, we're at the bottom of the hour again, so we'll do your book plug.
The email address is Mickey, M-I-C-K-K-E-E, two K's, two E's, at AOL.com.
Alright, you better do that again, slowly.
M-I-C-K-K-E-E at AOL.com.
And if the mailbox is full there, which happens very occasionally, but I do get an awful lot of mail there.
You will now.
I have a second address.
All right, we'll have to give that out after the break here at the bottom of the hour.
Stay right there.
Good evening, or good morning, as this show airs later.
My guest is Michelle Levine, and she has been abducted all her life.
She has written a book about it.
We're going to get a pencil and paper.
We're going to be repeating An email address for you, and we're going to tell you how you can get a copy of her book in just one moment.
You hear through Michelle Levine, and Michelle, let's get the information kind of stuff out of the way first.
Your other email address is... Okay, the same beginning, Mickey, M-I-C-K-K-E-E at T-I-A-C dot Well, that's hard.
Yeah, the AOL one is the one that gets picked up the most often, but once in a while it does tend to get filled up.
I know about that.
Alright, now, you have written a book.
It is a summation of how to deal with being abducted.
It's called The Alien Abduction Survival Guide by Michelle Levine.
Mm-hmm.
With a foreword by Mark Davenport and all the rest of it.
It's very nice.
It's got drawings in it.
And one of them, as a matter of fact, is going to make me ask a question here in a moment.
But how do they get your book?
Well, it is available in bookstores.
It can be ordered.
But the quickest and most direct way to get it is to order it directly from the publisher.
That's Wildflower Press.
And they have an 800 number, which is 1-800-366- 0264, or you can get it off the internet from Wildflower Press at Blue Water Publishing, or Blue Water P, which is Blue Water Publishing, all one word, B-L-U-E-W-A-T-E-R-P dot com, backslash, what do they call that thing, tilde?
I'll tell you, you're better off not doing this, dear.
Okay.
No one's going to get it.
All right.
The 800 number is the best shot.
Repeat the 800 number.
Okay.
The 800 number is 1-800-366-0264.
All right.
Good.
A lot of, or if not most of the drawings that you have put in your book that depict human beings, depict naked human beings, naked women.
You make it sound like it's really a nasty picture.
No.
As a matter of fact, they're very well-formed naked women.
That wasn't where I was going with this.
I was going even a little further.
You talk of children that have come from you, and certainly other abductees that have the same sort of story to tell.
Is impregnation always, do you think, an antiseptic sort of Medical procedure, or is there ever sex involved?
Well, first off, I'd like to separate the nakedness from the sex, okay?
Because there is sex involved in some of the procedures.
Often, abductees have their clothes removed, but it's not like orgy time, okay?
It doesn't really connect.
I mean, if you're naked and scared, you're not going to be naked and sensual.
Right, exactly.
A lot of times abductees do find clothing or have clothing, I hate to say issue to them, but a lot of times people who are in this environment are wearing sort of these kind of one-piece mood type, long t-shirt type things.
So they don't issue belts and stockings?
No, no, and generally a lot of the sex that... Now that is the question.
Now that is the question.
When you say sex, You mean sex as we understand it?
Well, generally, when the sex act happens in this environment, it usually is not between two humans.
I understand.
Alright, it's usually between a human and an ET.
Sometimes it's forced, other times it's something people don't like to remember.
But other times it's not, okay?
This is going to get into a very sensitive area, Michelle, but I'm going to presume that with all your experiences, and perhaps all your children, this has occurred to you, certainly.
What does your husband say about this?
Well, my husband isn't very pleased about it, to be honest with you.
I mean, I don't see any husband who would be.
Exactly.
And unfortunately, though, it is a fact of my life.
It is something that has happened to me.
I wouldn't be surprised, actually, if it's something that may have happened to him because of his possibly having some sort of encounters per association, but I do not know that.
Have you asked him?
Have I asked him if he's ever had sex with an alien?
Yeah, that's right.
Actually, to be honest with you, no, I haven't.
I suppose maybe I'll ask him this evening now that you've brought it up.
Well, I had to ask.
You know, I just really had to ask that question.
No, it's a valid question.
You see, the sex involved with abductions is very real.
And it is something that people remember.
People are afraid to mention.
They're afraid to be labeled perverts or weirdos or whatever.
Gee, dare I delve further?
Go for it.
What the hell?
Really?
Go for it?
What the hell?
Is sex with an alien good?
Well, it depends on what type... what's going on.
Now, if you are in a position where there is a female alien who straddles your body, stares at you intensely in the eyes, and is basically telling you you have to... you are in a situation where you're being dominated, and you have to submit to this, That doesn't sound very pleasant to me.
If you are in a situation where you believe you're having sex with an alien and you wake up to find a tube on your genitals collecting your genetic material, that's not going to be all that much fun either, I'm sure.
If you are in a situation where you're having some sort of bonding experience with a particular alien who you have an attachment to, you may find that this is something that is very pleasurable.
Like sex between two humans.
Mm-hmm.
I'm glad I asked.
East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Michelle Levine.
Hello.
All right.
Hi, this is Larry from Abilene.
Abilene.
Kansas.
Yes, indeed, of course.
I'm a single guy looking for a nice Jewish alien girl.
I wanted to know if there's any possibility that I could play guinea pig.
Everybody says that if they were to see a crapper... In other words, you want to be abducted, right?
If Michelle's getting abducted on a regular basis... Seems unfair to you.
Take my name along.
I'll flick any pig.
I can't be hypnotized.
You know, whatever.
All right.
You know, I get it.
I get this.
A lot of that.
Sure, yeah.
I want to go.
I want the experience.
And now that we've added the sex to it, I imagine we're going to have...
Well, anyway.
But generally, I get it for 15-year-old boys who want to play Star Trek.
You know, seriously.
But I really don't know how to get somebody abducted.
I mean, I never really gave it a lot of thought.
Well, I've always thought I'd run the other way.
You never know what you're going to do until it happens.
I mean, people might be saying, I line up, I'm here, I line up, and then that ship lands in front of them and they're gone.
It's true.
It's true.
West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Michelle Levine.
Hello.
Hi, Art.
This is Kurt in Medford.
Medford, Oregon.
Yes, sir.
It's Michelle.
Yes, that's right.
Hi, Michelle.
Hi.
When I was a child, I was abducted several times.
And it seemed that they showed me things that were rather horrifying, like putting up a view screen.
I saw massive tidal waves, fire falling from the sky.
All kinds of scary stuff.
Volcanic eruptions and a series of different events that sort of horrified me.
Earth changes, yeah.
Right, exactly.
And that's one of my questions.
Maybe you could relate to something about that.
And the second one is, are we somewhat asleep?
Like, I don't know if you remember the Twilight Zone that came on several years ago.
It was about mannequins.
And they didn't know that, when they were human, they didn't realize that they were mannequins.
And when they realized toward the end that they were mad at him, they were told, well, why didn't you come back on time?
I remember that one!
Do you remember that?
Oh, that was a great one!
Yes, of course I do.
In other words, Michelle, are we in some sort of altered reality now, and the real... Boy, real reality, that sounds great.
The real thing is somewhere else.
Well, if you believe what they're telling you, if you believe what they're telling a lot of abductees, then the answer to that would be yes.
Um, basically, the way it was laid out to me is that only things that are eternal are real.
And I don't mean just linearly and time-eternal, but I mean things that are, um, that are, well, basically, if it has, even linear sense, if it has an ending in any direction, then it has a beginning in that same direction.
If it's eternal, it isn't real, meaning our physical lives Here on Earth, we're not really part of reality, and we're sort of like a node in a physical existence that was created to be worked, for reality to work some sort of problem out, sort of like a clockwork Earth type of thing.
And it gets actually really complicated from there.
That was complicated enough for me.
Hold on one second, Michelle.
We'll be right back.
My guest is Michelle Levine.
And all mannequins should now listen carefully.
If you suffer from 800-444-1049, Betty and Gleason Luca said the Alien Abductions Survival Guide may be an aid to help one through the journey and psychological maze created by a UFO experience.
I heartily recommend reading this book.
That's pretty good, uh, pretty good testimonial, I should say.
Uh, and it's from Wildflower Press, and I'm gonna let you give the number one more time.
What, uh, what is the number, uh, Michelle?
It's 1-800-366-0264.
Okay, uh, back to the phones.
West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Michelle Levine.
Hi.
Good evening, Arthur.
Good evening to you.
Where are you?
Michelle, this is Mitch, the Magic Christian in Ventura, California.
Uh-huh.
I have a couple of questions, and then I'll take my answer on the air.
All right.
Uh, yes, Michelle.
Have you ever been in contact with anyone from the scientific or medical or military, uh, from the federal government of the United States?
Alright, that's number one.
Alright, Number two, in your conversations with your fellow abductees in what you call the E.T.
environment, have you ever found what you might have perceived to be a Holy Spirit-filled, Bible-believing children of the King, you know, Jesus Christ?
All right, thanks.
That's why he calls himself the magic Christian.
He is indeed a born-again type.
Actually, it's a very interesting question.
Of those in the community, those that you Rub elbows with.
Are there generally many Christians or is the group eventually bereft of them?
Well, I think that there's a very wide assortment of people and many of the people have very strong Christian beliefs.
My beliefs tend to be Christian in nature, but not church religious.
No, I understand.
You know what I mean?
The question, Michelle, went to others.
In other words, Right.
Well, you know, I don't really take surveys when I'm there.
I don't ask people, so do you believe in the Lord Jesus?
I mean, this is not the questions that are coming into my mind when I'm interacting with these people.
I'm with you.
I just thought I'd clarify it, and you did.
East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Michelle Levine.
Hello.
Hello, Art.
This is Mark from Dwight, Illinois, on Zadcom.
Yes, sir.
Yes, Michelle, I have a few quick questions.
Sure.
You mentioned that That you asked these aliens some big questions.
Could you elaborate on that?
I believe it's about our past, our religion, or whatever.
Excuse me, I didn't hear the question.
Okay, he said you asked some big questions about our past, our future, or religion.
Some big questions he asked, would you elaborate?
Well, I'm not exactly sure that I said I asked, but I do get volunteered an awful lot of information about things like the nature of the universe, the nature of God, Um, and it's really hard to elaborate in a, you know, even in a half hour segment, never mind a ten minute segment or something about what this all means.
And to be honest with you, a lot of it, a lot of people would say, well I'm not sure if I'm going to believe that.
It's one of those things that's very hard to explain in short term.
I would say I'm not even sure you should believe it based on some of the rest of what you've told us.
Not because you're fibbing to us, but because they seem to fib.
Caller, you had a second question.
Yes, one more.
Have you ever sensed any real sensitivity during these alien encounters?
Or do they come across like typical HMO physicians?
That's a good one.
Actually, that's one of the big myths out there, one of the biggest myths out there, that they have absolutely no feelings, that they're little robotic little guys that kind of do their own thing and could give a damn if you live or die.
The truth is, if you're lying on a table screaming in horror or they know that if they give you even an inch to move you're going to scratch their eyes out, they're probably going to ignore you and just go about their duties very robotically and just kind of, you know, just kind of do their work.
But once you open a dialogue with them and once you start interacting with them and talking with them, you find that they do have emotions, they do have feelings, Sometimes they express things differently than we would.
Like I mentioned before, they have a sense of humor that I don't think many of us would find incredibly funny.
You know, I mean, it's definitely not Monty Python, but they do have these emotions and there is this side of them that you don't experience until you've broken this fear and opened the dialogue.
Look, if there's somebody out there, and there are many, being abducted, Who have not read your book or, you know, can't catch a book or whatever.
Right.
And in a sentence or paragraph, you had to advise them.
What would you tell them?
In a sentence?
Or a paragraph.
In a sentence or paragraph, I think I would tell them that they have to be true to their own heart.
And as far as anything else that they're exposed to, whether it be my book or someone else's book or a television show or a radio show guest, Um, that they have to learn to be discerning in what they believe and what they don't believe.
Um, that they have to, um, start keeping a log in a journal of what happens to them.
Not only does it help you with your memories, but it also helps you, um, to work out the emotions so that the next time you recall it, these things tend to flash back in your mind.
Um, the emotions won't hit you as hard.
Um, you have to start, um, You have to start taking control.
You have to start saying, okay, I realize this is happening to me and I can't stop it from happening, so how am I going to not only live with it, but I have to learn to cope with it.
I have to try to turn it around and be my own boss here.
Well, as I said to you at the beginning of the program, a lot of that sounds touchy-feely, but if the true fact is that you're going to be abducted and there's nothing you can do about it, you might as well, I suppose, learn to accept it and be psychologically sound with it.
And Michelle, we're out of time.
It went by really fast.
Well, it always does.
Did you mention contact form or ISCNI?
I know, but listen, you've been a sweetheart, and we'll have you back.
And I appreciate your staying up this late and, you know, being with us.
What can I say?
Thank you.
It was a lot of fun, Art.
I'm glad I did it.
Michelle, thank you, and look out for your mailbox.
It's gonna be good.
Yeah, I know.
See you later.
Thank you, Art.
Bye-bye.
Take care.
That's it, folks.
We are out of time.
Again, my special edition book, 1-800-864-7991 from an area near Dreamland in the Pacific Southwest.
I'm Art Bell.
Actually, the high desert.
Good night!
This has been Dreamland, a program dedicated to an examination of areas in the human experience not easily nor neatly put in a box.
Things seen at the edge of vision, awakening a part of the mind as yet not mapped.
Yet things every bit as real as the air we breathe but don't see.
Please join us again next week at this time for Dreamland.
▲
Export Selection