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Sept. 18, 1994 - Art Bell
02:12:19
Dreamland with Art Bell - The Nature of Souls and Spirits - David Scott
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Broadcast program.
Welcome to Dreamland.
This is a pre-recorded, previously broadcast program.
Human experience not easily nor neatly put in a box.
Things seen at the edge of vision, awakening a part of the mind as yet not mapped.
And yet things every bit as real as the air we breathe but don't see.
This is Dreamland.
Good evening everybody!
It's Sunday evening.
Welcome to another Dreamland.
I'm Art Bell and there's a bunch of news to catch you up on and a couple of programming notes and we'll launch as usual with Linda Howe this evening parked in Denver, Colorado.
First of all, I would like to welcome to the Dreamland Group, KTUC-AM in Tucson, Arizona.
KTUC, one of the regular affiliates on the syndicated program, now joining Dreamland.
Welcome, Tucson.
And the person who had most to do with that, I guess, Mike Gabrielson, who is the program director at KTUC.
Good to be in Tucson now with Dreamland.
Also, W-A-I-V-F-M, the station manager there, Richard Parker in Peru, Illinois.
So, Richard, thank you for getting us on in Peru, Illinois.
Welcome to those two of its, now totaling 75, as Dreamland continues to grow, racing toward kind of a catch-up, I guess, in the number of affiliates with our regular syndicated program.
Now, I guess, moving away from our usual topic for just a moment, for those of you that have not heard it, I would like to announce there has been an apparent agreement of some sort with regard to Haiti.
Colin Powell, Jimmy Carter, and Sam Nunn, as you know, were in Haiti trying some last-minute bargaining with the military dictators there.
This has apparently been successful.
And an invasion, which actually had already been ordered with airplanes in the air and all the rest of it, averted at the last minute.
U.S.
troops will enter Haiti tomorrow at about noontime Under the auspices of UN Resolution 940, 9-4-0, and hopefully there will be a peaceful entry into Haiti.
Now, that is problematic.
The dictators have agreed to step down, but apparently do not necessarily, though they may, leave Haiti.
Uh, if there is to be violence in Haiti, uh, there may be violence at the announcement of the dictators giving up power.
So, all of this is news we will continue to monitor, but there will not be an immediate invasion.
There will, rather, be an orderly entry, they say, of US troops into Haiti, uh, later on Uh, tomorrow, beginning at about noontime, most of the national news will be covering that event.
That would be noontime, I suppose, East Coast time.
So, that is the status.
We will not be going on, uh, live at the 11 o'clock hour because of this, and we will be catching you up on it on a syndicated program tomorrow.
That is breaking news, and I wanted all of you to get it.
Now, for Dreamland, let us go all the way to Denver, Colorado.
Actually, not as far as we usually go, to find Linda Howe, who's doing who knows what in Denver, but has a report for us.
So, Linda Howe, good evening to you.
Hi, Eric.
Hi.
I'm glad to hear that a non-violent solution appears to be in the works for Haiti.
That is good news.
So it would seem, Linda, yes.
I spoke at the International Forum on New Science in Fort Collins this weekend.
Subjects range from healing and free energy research to unexplained phenomena including cross circles, animal mutilations, and the human abduction syndrome.
Many people were talking about the question, what evidence is there that human abduction involves physical non-human entities from some unknown origin instead of mental hallucinations?
The fact is and has been reported by several human abduction research in the last two or three years is that one out of four people in the abduction syndrome remember full conscious encounters with non-human beings.
One such abductee is a Colorado woman that I interviewed today who has seen non-human creatures in her apartment.
She desires to remain anonymous, but has agreed to share her experience with our Dreamland listeners, and I'd like to play an excerpt from that interview now.
It was about 1993.
It was in spring, March or April.
I was getting ready to go to bed.
Turned out all the lights, except for one that always goes in the foyer right by the entrance to my apartment.
And from where my bed is, I can see into the living room and to the kind of light that comes through.
And I was startled because right as I looked up, there was these three real short little things.
There was a door to my bedroom that was open.
And these scenes were so small, the top of their heads just went to like the door handle.
About three feet.
It was that.
They looked like babies.
And I'm thinking, my God, these look like little white babies.
And I didn't see the eyes or the face.
The minute I saw them, I couldn't move.
You know, I can't stand by my bed and everything.
I couldn't even reach, put my arm outside the bed to grab it.
I mean, I was just startled.
If my mom had been in my bedroom, I still would have been startled that time of night.
And I remember I couldn't move and I was telling myself, you will remember, you will remember.
And I was trying to, I was looking at their torso and I was trying like, okay, I cannot move.
But I'm going to remember everything about you or whoever you are.
And their skin was like onion skin.
I mean, it's almost like if you see someone's fingerprint, you can see the lines in there.
You could actually see the texture.
And their skin was so thin.
It reminded me of a fingerprint or onion skin.
And it was so white.
It was almost like there was a light inside.
It was so bright.
From the three.
And that's all I remembered at all.
They must have gotten close to you for you to see something like this happen.
Oh, they were coming.
They were coming straight towards me.
When I saw them at the door, and I could see the height right there, I mean, they just kept coming.
And when I was shocked when I saw them, I tried to move to grab my gun because I was startled, like, what is this or who's in my room?
And immediately, as I had visual contact, I immediately could not move.
And that's why I told myself, OK, you've done something to me where I can't move.
But it's kind of like trying to remember someone who's mugging you, trying to get a good description.
Except, I didn't look up and saw the eyes or the face.
I only could concentrate on their tussles, because it was just a matter of seconds.
They were coming so fast.
And I remember little, tiny, tiny, thin, long arms.
Now, to listeners listening to this, they may think, this is a scary story.
But you're still here.
Now what would you say to the listeners now?
You've had multiple encounters.
With something that you would consider to be non-human, right?
Right, definitely.
And it's happened since you were a child.
And you are still here.
What is your sort of residue now from a life of interaction with something we're all trying to understand that's not human?
What do you feel that they want from you?
I feel like I'm being studied by not one but several different groups.
It's almost like, okay, what did this group do?
Let's go see.
I feel like, what kind?
Like a loud mouth.
With no say-so, no clear answers, but some groups, it seems like they're more interested in human emotions, how people react to certain situations.
Do you think that this is anything to be actually afraid of?
I guess it's a human thing.
It must be because spiritually I feel like I'm tied into God and things like that, but each time you're abducted, You don't get self-assured.
It's not like, okay, I've been abducted several times.
I'm coming back.
I'm going to be okay.
Each time they take you, you wonder if you're ever coming back.
Because there's nothing you can guarantee.
They don't talk to you.
They don't tell you, it's okay.
We're just taking you for this and this and we'll bring you back.
It's the most isolated, loneliest feeling any person can experience because You're in an environment that is somewhere else that you can't do anything about.
You don't even know where you're at or how it works.
You just know one minute you see something, they're kicking you through the doors, kicking you through the walls, through the windows.
You feel relief when you return, but you're traumatized when you return.
Usually with missing time, right?
Not always.
Not always.
It depends if you're looking at a clock or what, you know, if you can keep track of it.
Now, in terms of people who are hearing about the abduction syndrome and conferences in which there are discussions with abductees and with researchers and investigators, if you were personally, on the basis of multiple interactions with whatever this non-human intelligence or non-human intelligences are, were to Just speculate on how things might unfold in the future about whether we're going to have some kind of public interaction.
What would you speculate?
I think this is going to continue to increase.
Leading up to?
I think one day they will make themselves known.
I think one day you're going to look outside and the sky is going to be filled with cracks.
And one of the values of conferences like this is being able to talk with people as this woman has described a conscious encounter and others feel that they can discuss encounters like this with investigators totally off the record and confident And then all of us are gaining, I think, more insight to the fact that this is not simply a mental experience.
There are too many people who are reporting absolutely concrete something that they're interacting with, and that is part of, I think, why we all continue to try to monitor the abduction syndrome, because if she's right, if someday the skies are going to be filled with disks, as many abductees have said, The world better be a little more up to speed than it is now on the fact that we're not alone in the universe.
Well, it seems as though most UFO investigators are now beginning to follow the abductions as the best path to trying to figure out what's going on here.
Right.
And I thought that she was especially honest and especially summarizing in so many of the other of people's experiences that I've had conversations with so
many people, even anonymously, they still don't want to discuss anything in public.
Sure.
Linda, where will you be next week?
Next weekend I should be back in Philadelphia.
Ah, back home finally.
Right.
Alright, wonderful.
Well, thank you for the report.
She was emotional.
She did sound very straight to me, Linda.
It was a good report.
I appreciate it.
Yeah, and next week we'll go on to some other topics, and I'm sure glad we're not going into some military situation in Haiti.
Cross our fingers.
Thank you, Linda.
Thank you, Art.
Take care.
I don't know that we're not going into called a situation we are going into one but uh... it is
not going to be as at least at the very uh... moment they hit the shores as
contentious as it might have been
so of will be examining this whole uh... question of what's going on with haiti
over the next twenty four hours no doubt talking about it on the syndicated
program in a moment
david scott i think you'll find him a fascinating guy will be talking about
life after death um... i think mike would be is uh... david's uh... mentor
and uh... helped bring him here and i think you're going to enjoy it and we'll
get to uh... david scott in just a moment I want all of you to listen to me very closely if you've got any savings, money kicking around, extra money.
A sense of humor and perspective are what is needed to get through this life, according to David.
He's a musician, songwriter, author, philosopher, student of quantum physics, and seeker after spiritual truth.
All these things and more are parts that make David who and what he is, a human being like any other, trying to get through life and make some sense out of it all besides.
Author of the soon to be released book, Way of the Ultimate Warrior, David stresses the importance of creating a solid spiritual foundation in one's life as a way to battle many obstacles and challenges that one faces as they sojourn upon the earth.
Understanding the varying degrees of spirituality and beliefs of others, David focuses on principles that will surely assist anyone desiring to create their own heaven on earth while all around them there is chaos.
David has studied all his adult life, the many and varied religious beliefs of the world, in his search for the truth.
He has learned there is a common link between all of them, the reality of the spirit of man.
He has learned, too, that spirituality and science are now beginning to merge together in quantum physics.
His studies in the field have confirmed his belief the universe is not an accident, that there is an intelligent design behind it, His studies at Brigham Young University were heavy on music, philosophy, and religion.
Not content with the rigid environment found within a university setting, David set off on his own to explore this life, to discover the truth to be found in it.
He was not disappointed in his search.
He said, quote, I haven't found or learned all there is to know and learned concerning the spirit and its relationship
to eternity.
But I have learned, for sure, that we continue to live after this life.
And that this life really isn't what it appears to be.
There is definitely something going on bigger than we can possibly imagine.
Because of David's understanding regarding the spiritual nature of life, Mike Rigby, publisher of the popular book, Life in the Unseen World, and a guest here, asked that he share the story behind his newest release, Heavenly Ways of Earth's Graduates, the true story of three Allied soldiers killed in World War I, who were actually permitted to return and report their experiences and share their insights Wow.
As to most of those living still on Earth, he says it's an exciting opportunity.
I'm sure it is.
There's a lot to find out about a man named David Scott, so let's go find it out.
Shall we?
David, welcome to the program.
Thank you, Lloyd.
I'm happy to be here.
That's quite an introduction.
I'm glad you sent that to me.
I was kind of curious about what approach you were going to take, David.
You are convinced, are you not, There is a life that follows this one, some sort of consciousness?
Oh yes, there's most certainly a life after this existence here on Earth.
Most certainly.
Well, I know that you concur with others that I have interviewed that the life after this one will occur Yes, it is correct.
You see what happens Art is that we come to this earth to learn as much as we can.
pretty much to understand how to live by faith, how to create, how to use our thoughts and
everything like that. Depending on what we do in this life will determine the quality
of life that we have after we leave this life.
Interesting. David, did you see a movie called Defending Your Life?
That's a wonderful movie. A wonderful movie. Is it anything like that
do you suppose? Well, Defending Your Life, Alvin and the Albert Brooks was great in that movie.
In that movie, Albert Brooks is killed and he is brought to Judgment City and he is forced to sit there in what he felt was a judgment session reviewing areas of his life.
In that movie he was seen nine or ten days of his life where they determined the amount of fear that he demonstrated throughout his life.
In the course of the movie, certain principles came out that much in your life has to do with how you relate to fear, how you react to certain situations, and what you do to overcome that fear.
and that in a certain way is true.
In other ways there are other things in there that are purely theatrical.
You could almost describe where he was in that movie as a spiritual plane or a middle ground of some kind.
Is that what you feature we will go to?
When you die, for instance, I guess everyone is now familiar with Eddie's book, Embraced
by the Light.
Absolutely.
And she experienced the opportunity to go to a plane of existence that is far higher
than what others have described in their experiences.
She says she actually met Christ and was permitted to tour around the universe, so to speak,
and see all the creations of God.
In that setting there, she was able to, as she called it, a life review.
This is the interesting thing that I thought was fascinating because it's just not her
that was relating this story about the life review.
It was many others where she said that not only did she have the opportunity to see her life, but she had the opportunity to view it from the perspective of the individual that she was relating with at the time.
For instance, if you hurt someone's feelings, not only were you able to see you hurting that person's feelings, But you are also able to feel how that person felt when their feelings were hurt.
So we will be exposed to ourselves.
That is, it's going to be some sort of mirror of review of what we have done.
It's going to be called to our attention everything we've ever said, everything we've ever thought.
Everything we ever did in life, there are no secrets hidden.
Wow.
All right, David, we're at the bottom of the hour, so rest for a moment.
We'll come back and get much deeper into this.
Okay.
All right, David, Scott is my guest from, I believe, probably, well, I guess up in the Salt Lake City area.
And we're talking about life after death, what it's going to be like, what's up there,
what we can expect.
This is a pre-recorded, previously broadcast program.
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It certainly is.
Hi everybody, I'm Art Bell.
Engrossed right up until program time here.
It was a little confusing with the situation going on in Haiti, but again there is a tentative Perhaps tentative is the wrong word to use, an agreement with regard to what's going on in Haiti.
Back now to David Scott, and David, I would say that life after death, or the possibility of it, has been an abiding, deep interest of mine.
It's one of the things that provoked this program, and I would ask you how you know You apparently know, so how do you know, what proof would you cite, the best proof that exists, that there is life after death, that there are these planes of existence that we do come back again?
Well, you know, aside from the fact of the many accounts, For instance, Dr. Raymond Moody's in-depth studies in his book Life After Life and More Life After Life and other credible people such as Dr. George Ritchie who in his book Return From Tomorrow.
My own personal experiences, I have to say right at the beginning, I myself have never had a near-death experience.
I've had many experiences dealing with the spirit, personal experiences of the nature of you can't deny them.
As for myself, I know that there is a life after death.
Something far more greater waiting for the human being than people can ever possibly imagine in their hearts or minds.
In the movie we mentioned a little while ago, one of the questions he asked was, is there a hell?
And the answer was, no, not really, but L.A.
is getting pretty close.
And so I would ask you very much the same sort of question.
Is there, in your view, a hell?
Well, you know, as you're probably well aware, there are millions of people throughout the world who believe that there is, and that they believe that if you don't do certain things in this life, you won't go to heaven, but you'll go to hell.
Now, I personally believe, after countless years and hours of study on the subject, yes, there is a hell, but let me explain that.
There are different spheres of existence in the spiritual realm.
Many people have said, who have gone there and seen them, suggest that there are seven spheres of existence.
There are three below and four up higher.
And the lower spheres, or the darker realms, constitute what is hell.
Now, I just finished reading a book Yes, they're not very widely publicized, David, but I was going to bring that up.
ways, an account of an individual from Italy who died and was permitted to return and he
had a hell experience.
Yes, they are not very widely publicized, David, but I was going to bring that up.
There are a number of people who have had NDEs and claim quietly, as you can imagine
they would, they went instead to a hell.
Yes, I just completed a book a friend of mine suggested to me.
It's called To Hell and Back by a man who actually died and went to hell called Dr. Maurice S. Rawlings.
In his book I would really highly recommend it.
It doesn't go into the depth that you would think it would.
It has an agenda to it and his agenda in the book is to literally scare the hell out of you.
But he describes several instances when people died and instead of waking up in a brilliant paradise pasture, they were in hell.
And their experience so terrified them that they wouldn't talk about it.
When they got back in their bodies, there was one instance where on the operating table
the guy was resuscitated and he begged the doctors, don't let me die, don't let me die,
I am in hell.
That sort of experience lets you understand that what we do here is so much the more important.
Well, it does put that slant on it, yes.
What is the best description you've heard of what hell may be?
I mean, surely people have told us, have they not?
Well, from what I've been able to gather, was that hell is a very dark land.
And just as there are several levels of the upper realms, there are several levels of the darker realms.
And the book I just mentioned, Wandering Spirit Lands, He describes having gone to the darker realms, but there were still realms below him.
He said there was literally a ring of fire around the lowest realm.
This isn't the traditional lake of fire in Brimstone he's referring to.
It's a barrier.
where ones from higher realms can pass through to it, but those on the other side of it can't pass beyond that
barrier.
Alright, where do spirits fit into this? And by that I mean spirits, for example,
I've got some photographs, David, of what I believe to be ghosts.
Right.
Now, where do ghosts fit in?
Are ghosts people that simply have not gone to any spirit realm at all, and are somehow trapped here?
Or is, in fact, this Earth a spirit realm?
Yes, that's very true.
This Earth itself is...
As it is described, if you remember when Mike was on your radio show he talked about Life
in the World and seeing where Hugh Benson described that in concentric circles around
the earth are realms of spirituality.
That's right.
And that the ones closest to the earth were the darker realms.
People who have seen ghosts, yes I believe that there are spirits trapped here on earth
and what traps them here is their unwillingness to give up the temporal cravings, the appetites
that we are all endowed with.
That they are still attached to the things of this earth.
Okay, well that implies some kind of choice.
Yes.
And a lot of ghost stories and spirit stories seem connected to people who die violently, or people who die at a very bad moment and have unrequited love, or some tremendously emotionally important thing that was going on when they died.
Right.
And this is very true.
Many people who do die of a violent nature, let's say they were murdered, they're so full of rage that someone would actually take their life, that their entire being is filled with revenge.
Let me say here, Art, it's very possible for a spirit to interfere with your life.
A spirit from the darker realms is quite capable of interfering with your life.
Without your ongoing knowledge that that is occurring?
I mean, you're just sitting there saying, God, I've really had some bad luck here in life.
And it's very possible.
Now, you see, again, though, I have to say here that if you are being challenged by a spirit from a dark realm, it's because of your choices that you've made.
If you're so focused on spiritual matters and if you pursue a spiritual path you're protected from these things yourself by your own will.
You see, and that most people they seem to live their lives in such a way as to negate
any possibility of a hereafter or a life after death or any consequences thereafter or any
blessings thereafter and we merrily go along with the flow.
David, let me ask you about the nature of the soul since it is apparently the thing
that traverses from one existence to another, is it?
Yes, it is.
There were some very early studies that I just can't shake from my mind, David, regarding
people who died and were actually measured with regard to weight.
and actually were measured to have had their weight changed at the very moment of death.
Right.
And there was no other explanation anybody could give other than, you know, that it was the soul.
Yes. The spirit. People have... it's essential to understand that spirit is matter.
It's a refined form of matter, but matter nevertheless.
Is matter in the sense that it is energy?
Well, energy is matter, matter is energy.
But the thing is that the soul, the spirit, is actually a refined matter, and it vibrates at a higher frequency than your physical body.
If you consider everything around you is one huge vibration.
Everything in the universe vibrates at some sort of level.
As I've discovered and as I've related in Life in the World Unseen and Heavenly Ways of Earth's Graduates, they talk a great deal about the vibrational level of an individual.
So yes, when a spirit leaves the body, you're actually losing matter.
That's remarkable.
Hold that thought, David.
there could be measured. That's remarkable. Hold that thought David, I'll come right back to you.
That's one. David? Back now to David Scott and we were discussing the nature of the soul
and you're saying it is matter in effect and it vibrates.
Oh, yeah.
At what frequency?
If I knew that, I wouldn't be talking to you right now.
Well, there you are.
I was going to say, like Dan Rather, people are going to be stopping you on the street saying, what's the frequency?
This is true.
So we don't really know, but you believe that at some level it vibrates at a frequency.
Well, you see what happens is that when you come here to Earth, you come here with a certain agenda.
It's personal for each individual who has ever lived, who is living now, who will live in the future.
You come here with a certain agenda and that agenda primarily is to create your own spirituality, to progress spiritually and as you progress spiritually you raise your vibrational level just a little bit and just a little bit more and just a little bit more and then eventually you're going to be able to see around you So it is possible then, as you progress, to actually talk to the spirits that have gone before?
receive direct communication from your spiritual servers or your heavenly father and you are
going to be a clear conduit in that regard.
Yes, everything vibrates that way.
So it is possible then as you progress to actually talk to the spirits that have gone
before?
Oh yes, yes.
There are countless instances of that ever since recorded history.
Of course, many people put it down as a myth.
Well, they sure do.
One way it's done, it is said, is with Ouija.
I do believe that the Ouija board can receive communication from spirits, but you've got to understand, what spirits are you talking with?
Well, I don't know if it's the Ouija board or just the fact that people are sitting down and actually trying to communicate with spirits.
Right.
And so you think they do?
Well, maybe.
It all depends.
Is it through the course of their own will?
Are they moving that little triangle around the board?
Or is it to such a degree that a spirit is actually communicating through you?
I can tell you this, my own personal belief is that anybody communicating through a Ouija board isn't someone you would want to listen to anyway.
A lot of people say that such an attempt to communicate is inherently dangerous, that you might call up things you might not be so happy about.
Do you agree with that?
It's very possible.
Part of the thing that you need to understand is that the spirits that live nearer the earth, in the darker realms, are constantly roaming the earth, roaming around in their
own misery and they want everyone else to be miserable and they will attempt to influence you
to think in a certain way.
Well I would think then that somebody sitting down and playing about with a Ouija board
would be just inviting these spirits who are kind of looking for trouble anyway.
Well I would think so too, yes.
To come in and cause trouble.
So you would say to anybody considering playing in such areas, don't do it.
Yes, don't do it.
You see the thing is you have to remember that the spirit is tied to this earth.
His vibrational rate is just a little bit higher than yours which means it is easier
to bridge the gap.
When you're trying to communicate or when you're trying to receive revelation from a higher source, their vibrational rate or their spiritual plane is so much higher that they have to lower their vibrational rate to talk to you.
It's a lot more difficult, specifically when you're kind of caught up in the everyday goings-on of life.
You don't listen.
Alright, well, what you're telling us about what happens after we die, David, is markedly different than is described, or most people would say, is described in the Bible.
How do you reconcile these differences?
Well, you know, I truly believe the Bible to be an inspired work of our Father in Heaven.
There's no question about it.
But think about this for a moment.
The Bible is only a couple thousand pages long.
And much has been written after the fact, and much has been left out.
And there has been much taken out, for instance, the Apocrypha.
And so there's much spiritual truth that is out there, that isn't dealing with the Bible, which isn't dealt with
in the Bible.
Now, also, too, the Bible was specifically written for one purpose, and that was to teach the gospel of Jesus Christ.
That's right.
You see, and the Bible is specifically designed to put people on the path of spirituality and to find the truth themselves.
Anything I'm telling you, you can find out for yourself.
There's nothing I'm saying that you can't go out and find out for yourself.
Would you describe what you believe and the avenues you pursue as kind of a New Wave-y sort of thing?
A New Age type of thing?
New Age, yeah.
Ah, jeez, I have a real problem with that.
Yes, New Age philosophy and New Age thought is truly the popular thing now.
Specifically, it's popular for people.
I want to justify, I'm trying to say this in a nice way, trying to justify their current lifestyle.
Instead of calling on their Heavenly Father, they call on the Universal Intelligence.
Instead of following after one perfect man, they say, It's interesting that you accept some New Age philosophy, but you don't embrace it to the exclusion of more traditional beliefs.
You mix them together, sort of.
Well, see, the thing is that there is some truth in New Age philosophy.
There is no question about it.
There is a life after death.
There is spiritual planes of existence of all those avenues.
There are people on this earth that can communicate with spirit who have passed on.
There is active communication going on between the spirit world and people.
There are thousands if not millions of people throughout the world who have had some spiritual experience with someone from beyond our current existence.
I'll tell you what I believe right now, so there's absolutely no confusion in the minds of anyone.
The God is the God of the Bible?
That's right, and Jesus is the Christ, the only way to the Father.
Alright.
Well then, back to the mechanics, because that's what I find absolutely fascinating, these different spiritual planes.
Is there any way that a person can know what spiritual plane Yes, and I don't know.
Yes, you can know what you can expect when you die, and you can know at this very instant.
What are your thoughts right now?
What's your true desire in your heart at this very moment?
And if you know what that is, then you pretty much have a good idea of what kind of plane of existence you can experience if you were to die at this moment.
Boy, I don't know, David.
If I do that, I'm going to be honest with you, I've done things in my life that I'm not proud of, that I worry may be held against me in some judgment city-like place, if I'm forced to even review all of my own actions.
I'm not so sure.
You know, I have my doubts.
I've been okay, but then again, maybe I haven't.
Well, did you learn from your experiences?
Did they make you a better person?
That's the question that needs to be asked.
Also, too, and this is something that I find absolutely astonishing to me, people seem to think that fathers sitting up there with a baseball bat just waiting for it to screw up one time and he's going to bop you one time.
That's right.
You know?
And they live, they worship fathers not because They love him but because they fear what's going to happen if they don't.
And the thing is here is that everything that happens in this life, every minor detail, is for your own benefit.
You see, Father doesn't see the sin.
He sees what the benefit of the sin is going to create.
You see, he also sees that there is going to be an opportunity for you to grow from it.
Everything is good in the sense that you're going to learn from it eventually and progress higher.
When you put your hand on a hot stove, that was a bonehead thing to do, but you're never going to do it again.
Well, right.
But you said this on the one hand, but on the other hand, you say, well, there are planes that equate to hell.
Right.
So it's as though, on the one hand, there's forgiveness, but maybe there isn't.
I mean, maybe in a sense, if you've not been good, You're headed to a lower plane.
But what if I told you Father had absolutely nothing to do with that choice?
Well, then I'd wonder.
I'd wonder, wonder, David.
I really would, because I would think that that would be the realm of, you know, the person that does see over those things.
See, the wonderful thing is that he's given us free choice.
He's given us the right to choose whatever it is we want to do with our lives here.
If we choose to do unwise things, if we choose to be a mass murderer or to live in an immoral way of life, we essentially will become such a person that we'll only feel comfortable and only be able to exist in a certain realm.
On the other hand, if we live our life in forgiveness and we continually strive to serve and we continually seek to know the truth, Well, there are a lot of people who would say that what you're doing, the areas you're investigating, you should not be investigating.
The things you're looking into, you should not be looking into.
Oh, absolutely.
I've gotten that a lot.
I'm sure you have.
Specifically around where I live.
So how do you answer that?
Ah, it's my choice.
I want to know the truth.
I'm unwilling to accept any man's word for anything.
I too am a big believer in the pursuit of truth, and so we go ahead, David, perhaps at our own peril.
Who knows?
Stay right where you are.
We're at the top of the hour, and we'll be back.
David Scott is my guest, and we're exploring the unknown.
We'll be back.
That that's even a remote possibility.
All right.
One, you have to recognize that when one gets started searching for something, you run into, for example, mountain rangers.
I searched for 35 years, and I went to geologists, I went to all kinds of people to get some kind of an indication of what caused mountain rangers.
God caused mountain rangers.
That's the answer you got?
Okay?
Okay.
Now, fine!
Okay, then who is God?
Alright?
If you want to go that route, that's wonderful.
The, uh, unfortunate thing about that type of thing is there's a long history in our, uh, past where misinformation has become a burden.
And that's what I've become concerned about.
Alright, well, I'm a big boy.
I can face up to facts the way they really are.
You tell me.
I mean, you don't believe in the Big Bang.
You, in essence, tell me that everything always has and always will be here, and the only constant is change.
That's a very difficult concept for most people, me included.
Always has been and always will be.
Okay, let's take one more step into what we mean by change.
Alright.
We know for a fact now the Hubble...
From the Kingdom of Nine, we continue with your calls on Greenland with Art Bell.
1-800-618-TALK.
1-800-618-8255 1-800-618-TALK
First time callers, area code 702-727-1222 702-727-1222
Or the wildcard line at area code 702-727-1295 727-1295
In the 702 area code Now again, here's our panel
From Provo, Utah, my guest is David H. Scott And he's here talking about
The world unseen, I guess World on scene, I guess.
It's another book title, but indeed it is The World Unseen.
But I guess you can know about it, and we're talking about it, and we'll talk more about it with David in just a moment.
First, going back now to our guest, David Scott.
And I think, David, you will be interested in this fax that just arrived for the two of us.
A statement for you and Mr. Scott.
This comes from Eric in San Francisco.
My mother recently passed away with cancer.
And she was definitely conscious right up until the last minute.
Was not on any medications.
And she kept saying, quote, they're trying to get me to come across the ridge.
And she would say, quote, but I'm not ready yet, end quote.
She left this world so peacefully with a smile on her face that I definitely believe she saw something much better beyond our plane of reality.
What do you think of that one, David?
Well, you know, that is something that happens quite often.
Let me tell you a short story of what happened to me last year.
My very closest friend I've ever had on earth passed away last year.
He was the epitome of a Greek god, a picture of hell.
He graduated BYU in exercise physiology, had the body to prove it and all that stuff.
He was diagnosed not only with one form of cancer, renal carcinoma, When they did the MRI, they discovered that it spread to his lymph system and his bones.
Oh boy.
And he lingered on for about seven months after the diagnosis.
Well, towards the end, I was sitting in his room, and I was holding his hand, and his father was in the room with us, and he opened his eyes and looked up in the corner of the room.
He says, Dad, they're here.
Yeah, dad, they're here.
And his dad would say, who's here, Roger?
Who's there?
And all Roger would say is, they're there.
They're here now.
And he closed his eyes and went back to sleep.
And shortly thereafter, he died.
So yes, I do know that, see, as one becomes closer to dissolution or to death, the thinner the veil becomes and the more that you are
going to be able to, you see your spirit is partly here and it is partly there and
sooner or later it is just going to float out of the body and be taken on to wherever it
goes after it has died or after death.
Let's explore for a second near death experiences, which I guess we are doing.
There was a show on that I can't shake from my mind and now I can't even recall what program it was.
It may have been 60 Minutes or, you know, 20-20 or a program like that.
And they interviewed a doctor who had for years been getting near-death experiences in the operating room.
I don't know whether you saw this program or not.
Is that the Angels program?
With Patty Duke?
No, I don't know.
At any rate, this doctor took a neon sign and put it up above the operating room on a high cabinet where nobody could see it except somebody who would actually literally float up to the ceiling, as so many people have said they do.
And I forget, the neon sign could be programmed to say different things.
And it said something stupid like when the popsicles bloom in August or something or another.
I can't remember what it was.
But something that only somebody who had been up to the ceiling in the operating room would be able to see.
Nobody has ever come back able to describe what that sign says.
I saw the program that you're referring to.
Good.
I have no answer for you.
On the one hand, you could say, well, maybe nothing happened.
Maybe they didn't throw it out of their bodies.
On the other hand, maybe they did throw it out of their bodies and came back and it was such an interesting experience to them or such a scary experience to them, they didn't want to say anything to anybody.
Well, maybe.
The other thing that was very important, I thought, in that program There was a doctor who said, look, what these people see when they die is to be expected.
If you look at the way the brain dies, it dies from the outside moving inward.
They see a bright light that gets brighter.
That would be expected as the neurons in the brain stop firing and they continue firing inside the bright center, the bright light and all the rest of it.
It's a normal physical reaction.
Right, and that's what some doctors say.
They, on the other hand, in that same program, they interviewed doctors of the same field, psychiatrists, who have died themselves, who have experienced that near-death experience and refute that.
They said that was the most real experience they've ever had in their entire lives.
It is true.
It could have been a hallucination of a dying brain.
So we're back to square one.
On the one hand, you have people saying, well, yes, this is a true event.
On the other hand, you have physicians, doctors, people in society we highly respect saying, well, this is a hallucination of the brain.
That's right.
And so I guess it boils all down to if it happens, it has to happen to you for you to really know for sure or you live your life by faith.
I choose to live my life by faith.
Yes, but I choose, and you apparently do as well, to try to pursue the truth.
And I wonder, what do you think will be the best avenue, David, to try to prove, though we may never be able to, that there is an existence beyond this one?
If you were to choose a single avenue, or even multiple avenues of research, to try to decide for sure whether or not it's true, how would you pursue it?
Well, as I have pursued it, which is empirical, relating everything to myself.
Of course, you have to gather evidence from other people's experience, but then you have to compare it with what your experience has been in life.
If you choose to live your life in such a way as to be open to the possibility that there is a spiritual level of mankind, evidence will be presented to you throughout your lifetime that You are a spiritual being.
On the other hand, if you don't believe those things, you're not going to find evidence for it.
It's sort of like when a physicist tries to determine whether or not light is a wave or a particle.
They have experiments that show that light is both a wave and a particle.
But now what they're discovering is that when you go into the experiment, you'll find precisely what it is that you're looking for.
So, one scientist who feels it's a wave will prove that it's a wave.
And one scientist who thinks it's a particle will prove that it's a particle.
You see?
It's just a matter of what you are going into with your personal prejudices or your personal bias.
That's the best I can do.
All right.
Let's go to the telephone, if you wouldn't mind, David, and let's begin to take some questions.
This is, if anything, certainly a fascinating, absolutely a fascinating topic.
So are you up for that?
I'm ready.
All right, David, here it comes.
On the toll-free line, good evening.
You're on the air with David Scott.
Hello there.
Hi.
Hi.
You're on the air, sir.
Turn your radio off.
Okay.
Yeah, hi.
I just tuned in from San Francisco.
Yes, sir.
I caught a little bit of the show before, just making sure you're talking about spiritual things, basically.
Yes, we are.
Right.
I've been a Christian for seven years, and I found that Jesus is the only one who claimed, I am the truth.
He said, I am the way and the truth.
I heard a message today.
Which was very interesting.
The pastor spoke about how Satan, the god of this age, has blinded the eyes of unbelievers.
He said that according to scripture he took a third of the demons with him.
Also that a third of Jesus' ministry was dealing with the demonic realm.
The demonic realm is a very mortality and the Bible says there are powers and principalities which influence our lives.
Alright, let's address that.
The demonic realm, the devil, there is in essence a kind of hell you said.
Is this a domain?
Yes, it is actually.
The domain of the dark realms are presided over by spirits who possess great forces of will or thought and are able to subject lesser beings to their will.
The information that was just provided to us concerning the host of heaven, the third
of the host of heaven, these beings that were cast out of heaven were at one time angels
of light and they chose to rebel against our father in heaven and his plan of salvation
and they were cast down to the earth where they will remain to the end of time.
That would imply that after death, David, free will or some form of free will in the
spirit realm continues?
Yes, absolutely.
See, we will never ever be denied our free will or our free choice.
That is one of the absolute truths that our Father in Heaven has laid down.
Even after Christ returns to the earth again, Yes sir, I just have one question.
earth and all that stuff, men and women will still have a choice as to whether or not to
choose to follow after Christ or choose to follow after their own path.
People will always have an opportunity to choose wherever they are at.
On the first time caller line, you are on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Yes sir, I just have one question.
I am calling from Fairbanks, Alaska.
Fairbanks, Alaska.
All right.
I sort of believe the way he does, but I have a question that has bothered me for eons that
I need to answer to.
That is, if this is true about we have afterlife and that we come here to learn, how is it
that today there are more people who are going to be in the afterlife?
Thank you.
A lot more than there was 500 years ago.
All right, that's a very good question.
Thank you.
It's one everybody asks, and I should have asked it myself.
The population continues to grow, David.
The forecasts are that shortly after the turn of the century, the Earth's population will double.
Right.
How can this be?
Well, you have to understand, Father has a lot of children.
There's a lot of people still waiting to come down to this earth for their mortal probation and their time here to grow.
It will be that, even more so, as time draws nearer to the second coming of Christ.
Well, are these, in essence, fresh souls?
I don't know if that's the right term or not, but... Well, are you referring to reincarnation?
There's a lot of debate to that.
Well, in effect, you have been referring to reincarnation, or if not, by that name, then a rose that smells just like it.
You have been talking about coming back and proceeding with one's spiritual life and becoming more perfect, and that is, in fact, reincarnation, is it not?
Well, I guess from one perspective it is.
My definition of reincarnation is where a spirit has lived a life on this earth before, who has died before, and who has been brought back in a rebirth in another body on this earth.
Reincarnation seems to sound like it to me.
Yeah, that's what it sounds like to me, too.
As far as reincarnation is concerned, now there are... Well, I want to circle back to the Fairbanks man's question.
In other words, if that is the ensuing process, and you seem to confirm that it is, then are these, in essence, fresh souls, souls that have not been on the earth plane previously?
Well, you know, I...
I hesitate to answer that question specifically, but I'll attempt to do so in a way that will satisfy the company's interest.
I have a personal belief that we have opportunities to continue to experience to the degree where we have accomplished what we came here for.
The books that I've mentioned, Life in the World Unseen and Heavenly Ways of Earth's Graduates, they both say that Reincarnation is in fact a legitimate way of growth.
We do have multiple opportunities to come back here, but it's through the grace of God to determine whether or not that spirit will have the opportunity to do so.
For instance, if they were deprived of their full existence here in a murder or a bad accident or whatever.
Okay, well that says we come back.
It doesn't address the question of the ballooning population.
In other words, are these new souls, are these souls that have been elsewhere, been on standby, been in other lives, other civilizations prior to this one?
Where are they all coming from is the question.
Well, we all have existed before we even came to this earth, long before this earth was even created.
We have existed with our Heavenly Father in His kingdom long before this earth was created.
So yes, there are souls still waiting to come to this earth.
Some have been reserved to come to this earth in this day and time because they are such powerful spirits and that they will be used to guide others to the truth.
Alright, on the wild card line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Good evening.
How are you doing?
Maybe if I got through in some ways, but then again, I didn't.
My name is Michael, and I'm calling because I could be Jesus Christ reincarnated, but I'm not putting the world on my shoulders, people.
It's your responsibility.
Basically, anything you want to ask, the guy put it very, very good to you, you know, on your show.
That was excellent.
A-1 plus for that.
Through God, okay, and the understanding of Jesus Christ and his belief in everlasting life.
You can go anywhere in the universe you want.
Do you have a specific question, sir?
Basically, I don't have any kind of question, but your talker tonight is Right in there.
All right, glad you're enjoying it.
His name is David Scott.
On the first-time caller line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Hi, Art.
Hello, where are you?
I'm in San Diego.
Okay.
My name's Scott.
Hi, Scott.
I'm sorry, I forgot the fellow's name.
David Scott.
David Scott, okay.
All right, David, the question you just got posed to you?
Yes, Scott.
I think, when I think about that, I think that perhaps we have concurrent, you know, If it keeps going like it is, there will be an unlimited number of souls on the planet.
I think there are concurrent lives here.
Well, one right after the other.
No, no, he said concurrent.
Concurrent.
When I meet somebody, it could be a male, it could be a female, it could be another race.
We have a lot in common.
I think people get married to each other like that and they don't even know the fact that they're having the same soul in different bodies.
Does that make sense?
It does make sense.
I'm not convinced that that's a true doctrine.
Then again though, let me say this.
I don't know everything there is to know.
I know a little bit of the truth, but there's a whole mess of truth out there to learn.
And anyone who says with finality that one thing or another is true or not true, Well, they demonstrate a great deal of arrogance in thinking that they know everything.
My father has a whole mess of mistransactions for people to learn and understand and this is one of them that I confess that I'm in the dark on.
Well, I am too, David, but I continue to explore, and as I said earlier, a lot of people get angry about that.
They say you shouldn't be exploring anything.
It is all written in that book, and while I don't want to turn this into a religious show on this topic, it's impossible not to brush up against religion.
And they get angry, they get frustrated, they say you're going in areas you shouldn't be going into.
You should stay away from this for your own good, but nevertheless, David, here we are, and we'll do more of it in a moment.
Stay right there.
This is a pre-recorded, previously broadcast program.
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You're hearing Dreamland with Art Bell.
To participate in the program, call to...
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It is.
Good evening.
I'm Art Bell.
My guest is David Scott.
And we're talking about life after death.
If there is one.
Kind of exploring what it might be like.
And what it's really all about, and it's one of the central questions, I guess, most humans strive to answer.
And we are going to get back to David in just a moment, and I'll tell you outside the body
and exactly what it is.
North American trading sells gold.
Some people have the gift of being able to leave their body consciously and explore on
their own the temporal realms of existence, going from place to place on earth.
the flicker of a thought.
Well, what realm are we in when we so travel?
I mean, I've heard people talk about traveling in space.
traveling away from the earth?
Shirley MacLaine, others have described that kind of travel.
Right.
When you leave your body and don't arrive, you're still in this sphere of spiritual existence.
Now in the scriptures, in the Bible, there are many instances where Paul discusses leaving
his body and being caught up to the third heaven and such like that.
And that does happen too, where you are lifted out of your body by the Spirit of God and taken to a higher spiritual plane for whatever reason.
When you leave your body here as far as I am any impression in the belief
And I have the belief that you experience things on this level of existence deal
So it's in this in other words. It's confined to this what we call this spiritual realm right?
Now there is an interesting story of a trying to remember the book. I read on it
about a man who learned how to leave his body and
explore different spiritual realm.
But his wanderings were limited to just the first three or four spheres and nothing more.
Is this, in your view, a dangerous thing to do?
Or is it a good idea?
Well, I would kind of say that I think it's a good exercise caution if this is a pursuit
that you're endeavoring to pursue.
All right, let me go back to the phones.
On the toll-free line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Good evening.
Where are you calling from?
From Los Angeles.
Hi, Art.
Hello.
David.
Hi, Art.
I've spent a little time in this experience, and it seems like whoever created us put us
in a realm of either having faith or living in fear or gradations thereof.
And the other one was truth or dishonesty or denial.
And I think we're experiencing a society today that lives very much in denial and dishonesty.
And we have to make some choices as to which direction we're going to go because we have some very bad problems on our hands.
I have my doubts and you know Art was talking about previous experiences well St. Augustine
I guess had some pretty bad experiences and he came out of that life and changed it but
one of the scriptures writings that I kind of was confused about was Christ said not
to pour new wine into old wine sacks pour new wine into new wine sacks because the old
one before the fermentation process is over would crack and you'd lose it.
I often wondered what the heck does this mean?
Well what the Lord is speaking of when he refers to that is that if you're going to receive new truth into your life If you're going to receive power ordinances of the gospel of Jesus Christ, you yourself have to become a new vessel.
You have to become purified in your own existence as you are now.
You have to re-alter the way that you think, the way that you look at life, the way that you happen to judge things in your life.
And in essence, you have to become a person to receive that new truth.
If you were to try to understand much of what the Lord tried to teach us and remain at the level of spirituality that you're at now, you would not be able to understand nor contain the truth that the Lord is trying to give to you.
So when he says that you can't pour new wine into old wineskins lest they burst, he's referring to you being the wineskin.
You have to become a new wineskin to receive the new truth that he's trying to teach you.
More or less saying that you can teach an old dog new tricks.
Well, I don't know.
Sorry.
Sorry, I couldn't resist.
On the wild card line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Yes, sir.
Mr. Scott, how are you doing tonight?
Just fine, thank you.
Joe D. in Albuquerque.
Hi, Jody.
I've got two questions, and I hate to dwell on religion.
Okay.
But just exactly, who is Jesus?
Was he an insurrectionist?
Was he a teacher?
A philosopher?
Or was he really God?
Also, how exactly do you live your life?
Do you stay out of hell?
Sounds like a scary place.
Okay.
Yeah, it does.
Well, let me address who Jesus was and is.
Jesus came to this earth for a specific reason, and that is to show the way to all people who have ever lived on this earth, the way back to the Father, the way back to our Father in Heaven.
Not only did he have to endure every trial and every temptation that we have endured, but he had to overcome them in such a way as to never have succumbed to those temptations.
So not only was he a man, but he was also a perfect man who lived on this earth.
His teachings have been only to point to the Father in a way of understanding what we need to do to get back to our Father.
So he is the Savior of the world in that sense when you say Savior.
He is the only one by which you can reach the Father.
Alright, I want to return to these different spheres of existence or levels of spirit existence.
Okay.
What can you tell me about them? Do we know anything about them? In other words, what's where?
Well, we do know that there are different levels of existence.
The highest level being where a father lives.
The lowest one being where there is no light.
It's just a dark realm.
Yes, well I think most of us imagine that we're going to fit into something in between those two and so that's where my curiosity has peaked.
What kind of existence is a spirit, our spirit, going to have in one of these middle levels? What do we
have to look forward to?
Well, again, like I said earlier, it all depends on what you decide to do with your life in this
world. And if you choose to do what everything the Savior told you to do, to point out the right path,
you'll end up in the higher realms.
If you choose to follow after your own lust, your own greed, your own desire for power at the expense of other people, you're going to find yourself in a dark realm.
Well, okay, again, I guess I should be more specific about what I'm asking, David.
I'm not answering your question.
No, you're not.
What I'm asking is, actually, what's there?
Let's say we go to one of these middle realms.
Okay.
What's there?
I got you now.
I understand.
Yeah, what has been described in heavenly ways, the first graduate, Let's just take a realm in the middle spheres.
I think it is a pretty much a realm, let's just take a realm in the middle spheres, okay?
That realm is pretty much described as one that has halls of learning.
It is a realm of light.
It's sort of like, let's say you live in this world here, but it's continual light.
Everything is in perfect order.
There's no sadness, there's no despair, there's no depression.
You're free to choose the path of learning that you want to learn.
The halls of learning are fascinating to me.
Uh, where Betty Edie describes him a little bit, um, in her book.
Uh, Mannion Brinkley in his book, uh, Saved by the Light, describes him a little bit.
Uh, and what you find is, is that it's pretty much the same way here, only there's, there, it's, uh, it's perfection.
It's continual, uh, um, summertime.
Does that get close to answering your question?
It sounds a little like you're going to a, uh, You're going to a realm of existence where everything is set in order and you have all of eternity to progress.
Your whole life is centered around your progression there, to serve others as best you can, to learn the higher ordinances, to reach higher spheres.
That's what the halls of learning are for.
Is it individualized, David, do you think?
Look, I understand you may not be able to answer some of these questions, but Heaven for David Scott and Heaven for Art Bell might be, if we were to try and describe them right now, very different sorts of things.
I'm not altogether sure that I would be happy going to a place of light where I could learn.
For me, Heaven might be an entirely different concept.
In fact, it is.
So what do you say about that?
I agree with that.
I agree that this is the fascinating thing about it and I'll answer that by posing a question in this way.
What if your beliefs or your thoughts literally create what you receive in this life and the life after?
What if that literally your thoughts create your heaven or your hell?
Well, y'all, I mean, we can play all kinds of games.
I'm very interested in what actually is.
Now, I understand you have no way of knowing that.
Well, you see, the point I was just making there is that your thoughts, your beliefs, everything that is you is what will create, what will make up what you receive in the next life.
Do you follow my meaning?
Yes.
And that's exactly what I'm saying.
Who you are, what you are, what you're comfortable with, what your thoughts are concerning life after death will determine what you do in this life, will determine what you endeavor to accomplish.
So in effect we are all busily on this earth creating our own heaven or hell.
That's correct.
Yes.
On the toll-free line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi, where are you calling from, please?
This is Fritz from Phoenix.
Hi, Fritz.
As man progresses in his evolution and grows up, it becomes now easy and easier to grasp the old question, David.
Who am I?
Where do I come from?
And where do I go?
David, at a show like this that educates the public, keep up the good work.
Thank you.
Art, to you, too.
Thanks, Fitz.
And have a good evening.
Just a little praise there, David, on the wild card line.
You're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Yeah, hi.
Art, Bob in Vegas.
I have a bad signal on 780, but at least I can barely get to you.
Well, glad you're hearing it, Bob.
You know, I had a very strong experience when I was 12.
I later found out I had the experience of the white light, which was really a spiritual experience.
I had to go through finding, finding, finding, later in life.
Then I found through Gurudev and then through a thing called Subud.
David, have you ever heard of Subud?
S-U-B-U-D.
Can you repeat your question, please?
S-U-B-U-D.
S-U-B-U-D.
Subud is Sushili Buddhidharma, a man from Indonesia.
It's spontaneous spiritual letting go or I don't know.
I'm sorry, Bob.
I don't understand what you mean.
Yeah, I'm having trouble grasping what you're asking me.
What are you asking, Bob?
Well, I wanted to be a part of Subhood because we found Subhood in England and bought it all over the world.
It's a simple way of letting people experience the union with life force or spirit.
Alright, well, I guess we both don't know what you mean.
Sorry, Bob.
On the toll-free line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Hi Art.
Hi.
I had a, this is Colin from Eugene.
Eugene.
1120 KPMW.
Yes sir.
And I kind of had a point I guess to make about, well this is what I was thinking about when the caller asked about the past lives, about the population explosion.
Yes.
I kind of think that everyone that was ever around for all time is kind of coming back now.
I think he said something about when the coming of the second Christ gets closer, more people will be coming.
And I kind of believe that everybody that was ever around is coming back to this plane now for whatever.
People talk about Armageddon or whatever you want to call it.
I kind of think maybe that might be an idea.
All right.
Certainly a possibility.
That they're going to get everybody back in the pool for the big event?
Yeah, it's certainly a possibility, but that's, again, out of my realm of understanding.
Mm-hmm.
All right, David, fair enough.
First-time caller line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Yeah, Art, this is Bob in Everett, Washington.
Hello, Bob.
We have a problem up here.
Oh?
KVI is not carrying Dreamland.
Oh, what are they doing?
They have somebody else on.
I see.
You know what the story is?
I have no idea.
I'm listening to you on, I think, 1120.
Oh, that'd be KPNW.
Is that Spokane?
Uh, no.
1120 would be KPNW Eugene, Oregon.
Oh, it's coming in pretty good, but not, it's not like having you here with us.
I understand.
So there's life, there's no life after Art Bell in KVI land tonight.
Okay, well, these things occur from time to time.
I had a great time in Vegas.
I'm glad.
Okay, thank you.
Right, bye-bye.
And on the toll-free line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hello.
Yeah, hi.
Peter from Quincy, California.
Hello, Peter.
Got a couple of simple ones here.
Well, actually, not really simple, since we're diving in and out of the Bible.
I'm not real familiar with nitpicking out of the Bible, but I do know that there's one passage in the Bible that says that even those who do not find Christ We'll still be able to find the way.
And I wonder how you can sit there and say that Christ is the only way.
And what about those of us, and this is where this comes out of, I was born a telepath, empath, high level of psychic abilities, and I've always been that way.
And most of the Christian religions have made me very leery of any religion, so I don't I don't get in with any of them.
I am walking my own path in a spiritual level and stuff like that.
Well, that's a very good question.
Those who, in effect, walk their own path, can they find the correct path?
Absolutely.
You see, it's similar to having many tributaries and many streams flowing into a great river.
For each individual that's on earth, there's a separate path one must walk to find the one true path.
There's only one way to the Father, and that's through Jesus Christ.
Now, whether you have to find your way to Christ your own way, that's your life.
That's the way you need to travel.
For someone to come to an individual and say, listen, either you believe the way I believe, or you're going to hell, is not of God.
That is someone who doesn't understand the gospel of Jesus Christ.
Alright, uh, good enough.
Uh, let's keep moving on the wildcard line.
You're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Uh, yes, my name is, uh, Robin.
I'm calling from St.
Louis.
Okay, Robin, speak up good and loud.
Uh, you're kind of hard to hear.
Alright, uh, yes, this is, uh, something that happened to, uh, me and my brothers, uh, just about 15 years ago, back when we were about 13 or 14 years old.
Alright, I can barely hear you, my friend.
Alright, I'll try to speak up.
Is that a little better?
Yeah.
Alright, I said, this is something that happened to, uh, me and my brothers about, uh, 15 years ago, back when we were about 13 years old.
But in two separate instances, uh, my two younger brothers were sleeping in the same room together, and me and my older brother, we had a room together.
And on both occasions, uh, something appeared in the room, um, and like I said, only one of us in each room seen it.
And the other one that was there sleeping, uh, more or less couldn't be woken up at the time.
And the, uh, two that did see it said that this thing was, uh, As far as the room, probably eight and a half feet tall, they said that it was a huge muscular, that it was so much darker than the regular, what you would consider, you know, dark, you know, at night, say two in the morning, that you could see it, you know, like, you know, plain as day.
And he said both, and my two brothers said that it was a, you know, huge muscular, and it was, you know, pitch black, and the only thing on it that wasn't Incredibly dark with the eyes.
They said that the eyes were a glowing red, you know, and it, you know, had a big black bald head.
It didn't have any horns or anything like that.
But, uh, they both assumed, you know, obviously that it was some kind of demon and that it stood there, you know, like the foot of the bed staring at him for probably an hour or two.
And like I said, I was in the room at, you know, in one instance, and I remember my brother pushing me, you know, to wake me up.
And as soon as I, I woke up and went to like, you know, roll over and look.
It's like I fell out there.
Alright, thank you for that story.
And David, what about these creatures?
Now, there's a whole area here we can explore, but offhand, what he just described, what would you think he encountered?
Well, there are people who are coming into the earth right now who are very powerful spiritual beings.
That the adversary truly would like to destroy.
The work that they came to do would be the direct opposite of the work that the adversaries want to have happen.
And so it wouldn't surprise me a bit that the adversary would destroy this individual, or in some way intimidate him, scare him, or in some way cause him to fear.
Because fear is the direct opposite of faith.
It's the direct opposite of power.
That's like a discussion we were having a little while ago about choices that you must make, and faith is one, and I guess fear is the result of not making the first choice.
That's correct.
Alright, on the wild card line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi, this is Dan from Santa Barbara and Diane from Queenstown.
Yes.
Is your guest saying that you have to be a Christian in order to go to heaven?
That's a good question.
Is that what you're saying, David?
No, I'm not.
I'm not saying that at all.
There are many people, thousands if not millions of people who have lived on this earth who have never known or accepted Christ as their personal savior.
Now, I know that there's many fundamentalists out there who would disagree with me on this.
But you see the thing is simply this, our father in heaven loved all his children.
Like an atheist or a theosophist?
It doesn't matter.
If that person lived his life in such a way on this earth as to warrant a certain kingdom
or a certain inheritance in this life, he will receive that inheritance no matter what
he believes.
Now let me say this, there are certain ordinances and things like that that will only people
who receive those ordinances will receive the highest kingdom or the highest fear.
But that's beyond the scope of this conversation right now.
One other thing, I have a Ouija board, right?
Alright, sir, I'm sorry, we're not going to have time for that.
We did cover Ouija, but David, we're right up at the top of the hour, so hang loose a few moments, we'll be back to you.
Okay.
This is CBT.
...to her with regard to any Dreamland topic.
And, uh, she's got a documentary called A Strange Harvest, uh, back in 1993 that is available for $35.
A Glimpses of Other Realities, which is a tremendous book with very careful graphic documentation, which costs $45.
If you would like to, uh, correspond with her, or order one of those books, you can, uh, write to her, Linda Moulton Howe, H-O-W-E, Post Office Box 538, Huntingdon, that's H-U-N-T-I-N-G-D-O-N, Huntingdon Valley, Pennsylvania, Zip Code 19-0-0-6.
That's Linda Moulton Howe, Post Office Box 538, Huntingdon Valley, Pennsylvania, Zip Code 19-0-0-6.
Let me talk for a second about fax machines, because they are very much the center of the information superhighway that everybody keeps talking about.
You'll hear me get faxes all the time.
Many of them now are sent by the new Sanyo fax machine that we've been selling for, oh, I don't know, a couple of months, I guess it is.
This is more than just a fax machine.
It will send and receive faxes on the phone line you've got right now.
You don't need to order a second line for it.
It will copy any material, a picture, a photograph, cartoons, newspaper articles, or typewritten pages.
Uh, at the push of a button, you put them in, push a button, it copies them.
So, it's a combination, really, fax machine, copy machine.
The copy mode, by the way, has got enlargement and reduction functions.
It's got all the goodies on it you would expect and more.
We, uh, did as we always do with products.
We went out and tried to find the best we could find.
That's how we settled on Sonya.
If we find something better, or at a better price, We will carry that and show Sanyo to the door.
But right now, if you want the best, this is what we adjudge it to be for the price.
The price is $349.95.
So if you're ready to get into the age of facts, here's the machine to do it with, and Sea Crane is the company to supply it.
If you call them at 7.30 in the morning, They're in fairly short supply right now.
You can get one on the way.
And they will, by the way, hand it to you for that price.
That includes shipping and handling.
The fax machine, the Sanyo, from the Sea Grain Company.
1-800-522-8863.
That's 1-800-522-8863.
The Sea Grain Company.
Do you remember the time when you could take a penny to the corner grocery store and be able to buy a nice piece of candy or maybe even a postcard?
Well, of course, today, the convenience stores keep a bowl of pennies on the counter with a sign that says, take one if you need one.
Can the dollar be far behind?
You really can't buy anything for a penny anymore.
In fact, a dollar bill will only buy what a dime would just a few years ago.
It's true.
The only form of money that still buys everything it used to is gold.
Over a hundred years ago, an ounce of gold traded for $20.
And with it, you could buy a really nice new suit.
Today, you can cash in an ounce of gold almost to anywhere in the world And nearly $400 is put in your pocket.
It still buys a fine wool suit.
Maybe that's why wise, conservative people with well-thought-out financial plans are moving back to the money that has a 6,000-year success record gold.
No other financial holding offers the safety, security, and privacy of genuine gold.
My friends at North American Trading will be happy to show you how you can own gold in privacy and safety.
It's simpler than you might think.
Call 1-800-877-9799 today and ask for their free information.
Investors have always turned to gold during times of inflation and economic uncertainty.
Don't wait till it may be too late.
Call 1-800-877-9799.
You don't have to be rich to own gold.
Just smart.
Back now to R.W.
Woodfield.
R.W.
says civilizations have come and gone.
There has been another one.
In which flying machines, or flight, was obtained.
NRW, what I wanted to ask you was, that may be so, and I don't rule out that possibility, but if that is so, where's any evidence of it?
Any evidence of prior flying machines other than the pyramids?
You talked about those.
But in a large technological civilization, surely even with 800 mile an hour winds and a polar shift, there would be some evidence.
Uh, there is.
Let me clarify a couple of things.
From the Kingdom of Nod, we continue with your calls on Greenland with Art Bell.
Call Art Now, toll free at 1-800-618-8255.
1-800-618-TALK.
First time callers, area code 702-727-1222.
702-727-1222.
Or the wildcard line at area code 702-727-1295.
callers area code 702 727 1222 702 727 1222 or the wildcard line at area code 702 727 1295
727-1295.
727 1295 in the 702 area code now again here's our phone I'm Art Bell, this is Dreamland.
We're discussing what may come next, what may lie beyond.
And as sort of a necessary part of that discussion, there is some religion, without apologies, it is there.
It mixes, it's part of the mix, and so you will continue to hear that.
Just smart.
Back now to my guest, David Scott.
And David, one of the other things that we track carefully on this show is UFOs, aliens, all that sort of thing.
As with what you've been telling us, in that field there's an awful lot of evidence.
that something is here visiting.
Something has been here, something is on earth and continues to visit earth.
Right.
Somebody just sent me a fax which asks the following, were aliens also created by God
or is man God's own unique creation?
Oh no.
Father has created worlds unnumbered.
We can't even begin to count the number of worlds he's created.
And there are other civilizations outside of this world that Father created.
Now, Abraham was told that there are other civilizations, but he was only given an accounting of this world, because it was this world that only pertained to him and us.
Yes, there are advanced civilizations.
What they're composed of or what their purpose is, I don't know.
All right.
This is from Murray.
Asked David, though we may die and live again, what will happen to the earth?
Will the earth live again, and what will the earth become as it progresses through its own path to perfection?
Does the earth, in fact, go through a cycle as man does?
Oh, absolutely.
Oh, really?
Yes.
Everything that the Father has created, he created spiritually first.
Everything that you can ever imagine has always been created spiritually first.
Well, it in itself is going through its own probationary existence.
When it has finished with this particular existence, it will then become cleansed and purified and become the home of all the people who inherit the highest realm.
This, in essence, will become the highest realm for those spirits who inherit that at the final time.
Let me see if I'm getting this right.
Are you suggesting that matter has its own spirituality?
Yes, it does.
Yes.
Oh, that's something new.
And then its own vibration as does our soul, you said.
That's correct.
When you consider that everything is composed of matter, including us, each particle of
matter inherits automatically the light of Christ or the light of our Heavenly Father.
And I always thought there was a delta, a difference between biological matter, which
is a vessel for the soul, and matter-matter, you know, the rock, the desert.
I understand what you're asking.
It's quite a stretch, I guess, for most people to believe that matter such as a rock has a spirituality to it.
But let me say this, it doesn't have the spirituality of a sentient being like you and I, but that it is composed of spiritual matter.
Does that make sense?
Yes, my question is the free will and predestination.
and I'm going to think about that.
On the toll free line you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Hello there.
Yes, hello.
Yes, ma'am.
Yes, my question is, you know, the free will and predestination.
I grew up believing in that also, but now the way technology is we're learning that
we're comprised of electrons and chemicals and like an overabundance of testosterone
can make us violent and aggressive.
You know so chemicals really can I think we're going to find out in the years to come the chemicals are sort of pushing us towards our our own character and if that's the case for instance like
in another thing the environment like if someone was badly abused or neglected as a child
they are going to grow up in a certain manner and possibly tend to be abusive to others
and may be violent.
So where is our free will in this?
Okay well you still have your free will.
I have to be very careful on how I address this question.
Because when you're speaking of someone who has been violently abused in their lives in some way or another, and to place the expectation of living their life in a normal manner as though they were raised in a perfect environment is unreasonable.
On the other hand though, that individual, whoever they may be, came into this world
to learn a certain thing and that thing may have been that the only way they can learn
it is by going through such an experience.
And if they grasp the principle or grasp the understanding of their existence here on earth,
they can turn every negative into a positive in their life and so they have a choice to
make.
See you later.
with the choices. You just kept on saying they are brought into this world to learn a certain lesson.
Yeah, I have the same. So therefore they are programmed. I have the same exact problem.
On the one hand, you are saying everything is predestined and they are going to have to learn
this lesson. That's the one hand. But the other hand, you are saying everything is predestined.
No, there is absolutely no predestination at all.
You have certain weaknesses, certain characteristics that you are inherently born with, certain
things that you need to learn and understand.
Those things, certain incidences in your life may be permitted to occur in order for you
to have a greater understanding or learn a greater lesson.
It's not like you come to this earth and it's already planned out, every experience, everything that's going to happen, as though that it was set in motion.
That's astrology.
Well how about the chemical imbalance and so forth like they tested if you have a high dosage of testosterone you know that you do become violent and aggressive and you know if we're all comprised of chemicals and I don't believe we're all the same You know, you have varying degrees from one spectrum to the other.
Some people come into this world with violence already embroidered in them.
Oh, absolutely.
And then where is their free choice?
All right, where are you calling from now?
St.
Louis.
St.
Louis, all right, great.
So where is their free choice?
They are chemically predestined.
Well, we're starting to get into a realm where I haven't the wisdom to address that question.
I appreciate you saying that.
Surely we cannot know it all, but it is a very good question, isn't it?
It's a great question.
It's one that the individual who's experiencing that has to find the answer for themselves.
All right, David.
On the first time caller line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Yes.
I've been reading an interesting book by another local author by the name of James L. Thompson and it's called Aliens and UFOs, Messengers or Deceivers and you've touched on a couple of the issues regarding UFOs and the relationship to the spiritual world.
My personal opinion, I don't deny the fact that we may have visitors from other religions Other places in the universe visiting us.
But I think where you see a lot of the things with abductions and some of the things interfering with free will, I think you may be seeing manifestations of what you've been calling some of the darker realms maybe?
Could be.
I think Paul mentioned Satan as the prince of the power of the air in the book of Ephesians.
James Thompson in the book here talks about a Dr. Frank Salisbury who wrote the Utah UFO display and he talks about an incident that happened back in 1967 in the eastern part of the state where a fourth grade boy announced to his family that a UFO was going to appear over the school the following day at a specific time and when they asked him how he had found that out I've had my own personal experiences with death in the family and so forth, and I believe, as your guest does, that spirit is matter.
Yes it did. I've had my own personal experiences with death in the family and so forth and
I believe as your guest does that spirit is matter, it's more refined but it can manipulate
matter.
Um, I...
I've definitely seen that.
My father passed away and we had some real strange things happen afterwards.
I was about 16 at the time and just things that no one could explain as far as physical things in the house breaking and he did die unexpectedly at a rather young age so those may have been some manifestations of some anger or some rage like you say.
Thanks for your guest.
It's been an interesting show tonight.
Oh, yes, indeed it has.
Thank you.
And while we can't answer all questions, we are here to explore and we certainly are getting that done anyway.
On the wild card line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Good evening.
Yes, good evening, Art.
This is Martin up in Anchorage.
Hi, Martin.
Anchorage, Alaska.
Yeah.
This is a real good show.
You're touching a lot of different subjects and all of them I'm interested in.
First off, we've talked a lot of times.
I'm writing a book on UFOs.
I'm a theologian.
I've studied the Bible and other religions, so we have a lot in common.
I also had a near-death experience.
I don't know if I've described that to you.
No, you're not.
Go right ahead if you'd like.
I actually, it was about 15 years ago, and I won't get into the details, but I actually, I was gone for several minutes.
My wife called the ambulance, the neighbors came, and I was out of my body looking down on them at the time.
I watched my body turn ghost white and them frantically trying to revive me.
and the ambulance pulled up in the front I could hear the ambulance drivers talking as they came
up the steps and I was up hovering I would say about 10 feet above my body around the ceiling
that was my vantage point. To answer your question about why they didn't see the light that the
doctor put up the neon sign yes I would say it's because you're not focused on material things like
that you're you're you've entered into a spiritual realm that's a very good answer yeah you you're
That's so much brighter than any neon sign.
That would be... And yet, though, sir, people have described the operating room, revival efforts... Those are things all focused on what's happening, the people, and what's significant.
I believe these experiences happen for a reason.
The Divine Creator is doing all of this and wants us to...
Do you accept that, David, as an answer, a reason why people might not see a neon sign?
little experiments that we do to try to break it down and figure it out intellectually are
really insignificant and he wants us to focus on the spiritual things.
Alright, that's a very good answer.
A very good answer and it's simply because, do you accept that David, as an answer, a
reason why people might not see a neon sign, it is simply insignificant and not relevant
to what the person is experiencing?
Oh, I wish I had thought of it.
Yeah, very, very good answer.
On the wild card line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Oh, I'm sorry, I've gotten the wrong number.
Alright, very good.
On the toll free line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Good evening.
Good evening.
you Yes, ma'am.
You're on the air.
Go ahead.
Okay.
I've been listening to your program.
I've listened a couple of times before, but I'm not a regular listener.
I think earlier in the show you were talking about is the only way to find God or whatever is through Jesus Christ.
I would like to just say that my own...
I found answers that satisfied me through the educational readings, which was that Jesus was the man and that Christ is the power.
And the power can be reached through any belief, any faith, whether it be Buddhism, Judaism, Christianity, whatever.
That's a very good point.
Calling from Central Point.
Central Point, Oregon.
Alright, KOPE.
Yes, David, the same...
I guess that is, in a way, the way I feel.
In other words, as you pointed out, there may be many paths, and spirituality is a path, and it need not be as precisely described in the Bible, but I certainly have a belief in a larger being, and I guess I'm satisfied in my own mind and comfortable with my belief, and hopefully that will get me where I want to go.
Well, it will eventually get you to where you want to go, as your caller stated.
There are many, many paths to the one straight and narrow path that's referred to.
And each individual is traveling their own path to enlightenment and understanding.
And they're the only ones that could find that path for themselves.
So those of us who keep our own counsel with regard to our spirituality are not necessarily going down the wrong path, only a different road to the eventual same destination.
Is that about right?
That's correct.
Or to the eventual same conclusion.
Yeah, that's correct.
Alright, good.
On the toll-free line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi David, hi Art.
I had a problem with some of the things that David was saying about father, always associating with father.
I know that's a very Christian concept in terms of certain theologies, but there is a concept of mother as being sacred.
Oh yes, and you're absolutely correct.
For God without gender assertion, in fact, higher creative forces really are beyond gender identification.
Well, I don't agree with that.
But you see, that's the wonderful thing.
I don't have to be right.
I'm just interested in the truth.
That doesn't make me wrong.
I feel that there is gender and there is that which is beyond gender.
When you deal with those forces that create universes, galaxies, dimensions, and the infinitesimally small beings that exist on this planet and many planets and the larger beings as well, it's an enormous project.
I think dividing it by gender and alienating and identifying only with one gender Well, you see, I'm limited.
Well, I fully understand and appreciate what you're saying.
I think, though, that it doesn't really matter.
No, that's what I was going to say, too.
Why does it matter?
Father is just a term that you're using.
I'm referring to my God as my Father.
And somehow or another, if this entity is what we all think it's cracked up to be, she wouldn't mind.
Absolutely.
And you're going to discover that things that you once believed aren't true and things that you believed were true are not.
You're going to know everything eventually.
It doesn't matter if you know it all at one time.
All right.
On the first time caller line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Good evening.
Yes.
I am Paul calling from Salt Lake City.
Hello Paul.
Yes, I was just wondering, David are you getting any of your ideas from Mormon theology?
Yes, I get a lot of my ideas from Mormon theology, but I also get a lot of my ideas from studying
the works of Nietzsche and I have read some of the works in teaching for Buddha.
I have read the Koran.
I am wondering, have you identified yourself as a Mormon on the broadcast that just tuned in?
No, he hasn't, but you are welcome to if you would like to.
Are you Mormon, David?
I am Mormon, but it doesn't matter.
It really doesn't matter.
The point being is that what I'm telling you now is hopefully for the purpose of further enlightening the individual person.
I'm not here to push any particular religion.
I understand.
Or dogma.
Because the spiritual experience goes beyond religion.
How though, as a matter of curiosity, do you think the Mormon Church would react to what you're saying?
That answers it very well, David.
Stand by, we're at the bottom of the hour, and we'll be right back.
You're listening to Dreamland on the CBC Radio Network.
We're talking about what may or may not come after.
David Scott says he thinks he knows, and he's been telling us about it, and we'll continue that process.
I'm Art Bell.
Stay right where you are.
It is.
I'm Art Bell, and, uh, this is Greenland.
And I'm about to read a fax in a moment.
I can do that because I have a fax machine that follows, right?
Numbers 1-800-522-8.
and numbers one eight hundred five two two eight awesome which follows up on something i said earlier uh... david
Awesome.
uh... art all be trying to get through on the wild card line but in the event
i can i'd like to give you some specifics on the experiment you alluded
to with regard to weight loss at the time of death Although I remain pragmatic and skeptical on the subject, I continue to keep an open mind for my own insight.
It is interesting that you referenced unexplained weight loss, as I'm quite familiar with the specifics of this alleged phenomenon.
The experiment reportedly was conducted at Massachusetts General Hospital sometime in the 30s or 40s.
I'm unable to recall exactly.
Nevertheless, the procedure was reported, I believe, in a book called The Third Eye.
A terminally ill patient was placed on a balanced beam scale which weighed the bed, mattress, clothing, and bed liner against an opposing weight that kept the assembly in perfect balance throughout the dying process.
In this manner, any fluid losses and or weight of expelled air could be accounted for at the moment of clinical death.
At that precise time, the actual weight loss was calculated at three quarters of an ounce.
In 1960, I called Massachusetts General.
They would neither confirm nor deny the report.
Additionally, there have been numerous reports by nurses who reportedly have observed the appearance of some sort of astral body leaving the physical one at the time of death.
That's the facts, and David, is that familiar to you?
Yes, that's the experiment I was aware of.
Fascinating.
Three quarters of an ounce, a non-trivial amount of weight.
Well, yeah, that's significant, which can't be accounted for, in my opinion, in any other way.
Would you like to see experiments of the same sort repeated, if it could be done in this modern day?
Well you know Art, I look at that and it would be wonderful if you could actually prove through scientific methods the existence of a spirit.
But it wouldn't really matter anyway because people are going to believe what they want to believe.
Well, that's true.
Back to the phones.
A lot of people want to talk to you.
Toll-free line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Where are you calling from, please?
Hello.
This is Todd from Seattle.
Hi, Todd.
Hi.
I wasn't sure if I was getting online.
I think they bumped you back an hour in Seattle for the President's speech.
Oh, I see.
Yes, I guess that's what's happened in Seattle.
He went on the air, I believe, at about 6.30 or so.
Oh, okay.
Well, anyway, I might be an hour late in what I'm calling about.
That's quite alright, my friend.
I was calling about your understanding that all religions were leading to the same path.
I was just calling to say that if You can believe that if you want, but then you have to strip out biblical Christianity from that, because it's inconsistent with all the other paths being equal to it.
It's true, it's true.
It does argue with it.
It says it just isn't so, doesn't it?
And David, how do you deal with that?
Well, not all paths are equal, and that isn't what I said.
They all lead to a specific path, or they can lead to a specific path.
There's only one way, I think the specific scripture says, narrows the gate and straightens the way.
Something of that nature that leads to eternal life.
If you're not on the right path, in my opinion, there's only one way to the Father, and that's through Jesus Christ.
However, does that mean everyone who happens to believe in a Buddha or another sort of God, are they going to go to hell because they don't happen to believe in Jesus Christ?
judged on is that which we know. If they've been told of the gospel and they refuse Jesus Christ
and believe in the other and exclude Jesus Christ then yes they will if they've heard the truth and
denied it but Jesus says no one gets to the Father but through me and if they haven't heard that I
don't know what the answer is whether they'll go to hell or not. What you're saying is that if a
missionary went to China and taught people the gospel of Jesus Christ and they refuse to believe
that and cling to their own belief system at that moment then they've had their chance. I come from
the perspective that they have to have a testimony that what they're being taught is true to receive
that sort of condemnation. If they receive the testimony of the Holy Spirit that the gospel of
Jesus Christ is true then they have no argument against having been taught the gospel.
On the other hand, if they don't receive the testimony of the Spirit, I don't see how they can be held accountable for something that they truly didn't believe was true.
Alright.
On the wildcard line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Yes.
The question is for Mr. Scott.
Alright.
Okay.
Mr. Scott, the...
Do you think of planes or realms that you're referring to, do you think of them as the
same as parallel dimensions?
No, well, that's a good question because they do exist on different vibrational levels or
in different dimensions.
Do you get circles within circles on this?
I'm trying to define your concept.
Okay.
Imagine the Earth.
Right.
Okay.
Now imagine concentric circles around the Earth.
That's what I thought, the concentric circles.
Right.
One above the other.
Alright ma'am, where are you?
This is Alaska.
Alaska.
All right, very good.
Thank you.
And so then, concentric circles, different levels of spiritual existence that go outward from Earth?
That's correct.
The lowest ones being near the Earth, the highest spheres being further from the Earth.
All right.
On the first time caller line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Oh hi, this is Lee in Fresno.
David, I hate to tell you, but Jesus said that I am the way, the truth, and the life, and no man comes unto the Father except by me.
Well, yes, he's confirmed that, Caller.
I'm listening to this program, too, and I've heard him confirm that a number of ways.
He simply said that people on other paths will come to the same point eventually, or that they can come to the same point eventually through a different path.
Well, hopefully they'll be still living when that happens, though.
Well, that's not altogether certain.
An individual Well, an individual will have the opportunity to accept the gospel of Jesus Christ.
After all, when Christ did die on the cross, he did go to the spirit world and taught his gospel there.
And so, those spirits who lived in Christ lived on the earth.
I've never had the opportunity in this life to receive the gospel.
And so he not only organized his gospel here on this earth, he also organized it in the spirit world.
Which tells me that if you don't have the opportunity here, you will have the opportunity there.
Well, you know, as for myself, and I believe that most other Christians, though, I think that we're just going to take the safe way and believe them now.
Well, that's fine.
Nobody has said that you should not, sir.
And whatever you're comfortable with is a fine path to be on.
And if you're on the straight and narrow, that described in the Bible, I don't think anybody certainly, David, has no problem with that.
Do you, David?
Oh, absolutely not.
Yeah, this is the place to do it.
This is a place to perfect yourself.
It's a lot easier here than it is in the spirit world, I'll tell you.
All right.
On the toll-free line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Hi.
My name is Deanna, and I'm calling from Kentucky, California.
Hi there.
Hi there.
I want to share with you my experience of when my mother passed away.
Please.
And she was very ill for about 11 months.
She was dying of cancer.
She was in the hospital last few months, and she was in a coma.
And the day of her death, all the family was around.
I was to the side of her bed, holding her hand.
And I started to say a prayer to myself, which I didn't normally do.
And as I was, I looked up through the ceiling, and I saw my grandmother that had passed away the year before she had, and a man that I have no idea who he was.
And as my grandmother and this man came through the ceiling, my grandmother said to my mother, come on, Eileen, we have to go.
That was her name, my mother.
Right.
And my mother said, oh, she didn't respond at that time.
And I'm talking about telepathically, I guess, because my grandmother again said, come on, Eileen, we have to go.
You think that was telepathic communication?
I, oh, spirit, But then I heard my mother say, I'm hurrying as fast as I can.
Not only did I see my grandmother and whoever this other man was, but I also saw my mother's spirit come from the toes, through her body, up through and left through, I guess what you call the third eye, and the three went off into the ceiling.
Boy, that must have been very comforting for you.
It was wonderful.
And I would also imagine, ma'am, I'm sorry, David, that it must have changed your life ever since.
It has.
It has tremendously.
All right.
Thank you very much.
You know, Art, that's a fascinating story, and there's thousands, if not millions, of people all over the world who have had these kind of experiences.
At the end of the program, if it's okay, I'd like to give out an address for people with these kind of stories to contact me with, because I would love to hear from them.
You're more than welcome to, David.
I think that this is very much like the UFO business that we follow.
You get story after story after story to the point that it's just impossible to deny that it may be so, David.
And maybe we're just hearing things that we want to hear.
I don't know.
But there are so many stories, so specific, like that lady that was just on, that sounds so real that I don't think it can be denied.
Right.
To me, it's just a reaffirmation of what I've already believed for many years.
Well, that's what I say when I say we may be just sort of stoking up our own beliefs here, but I really think there's something to it.
That's why I do this program, David.
I think it's an important interchange.
On the toll-free line, you're on the air with David Scott.
How you doing?
Okay, where are you, sir?
Wichita, Kansas.
Wichita, yes, sir.
I just want to give you, I'm a born-again Christian, so I got a little perspective.
The one thing I want to, I just want to make a couple quick points.
One, Hebrews 9.27 says, it says that it's committed to men once to die, then to judgment.
So you can only accept Christ here on this earth.
And after you die, your fate is determined.
And once you die, the Bible says that either your spirit goes into eternal Hades, or eternal waiting place for the final judgment, Or, it goes to be with the Lord in Heaven.
But as far as you're concerned, no negotiating in the spirit world, huh?
No, because Hebrews 9.27 says, Once did I then the judgment, and then your spirit waits for judgment in either Heaven or Hell.
Alright, thank you.
Well, there you are, David.
Here it is again.
Somebody's saying, look, you're not going to do any negotiating, or you're not going to Well, of course.
to modify or change your behavior once you leave this earth everything that is already determined?
Well of course I've said it many times earlier that I know that that's not so.
I think many times people interpret the scriptures to a way that they want it to mean
and it discounts a loving and gracious heavenly father or mother for that matter.
Father loves all his children and he wants all his children to return back to him.
He will provide them every opportunity to do so, however long it may take.
Even in the spirit world?
Even in the spirit world.
Hi.
Mr. Scott, you know, like the manipulation of vibration is like the quintessence of musicianship.
So do you think that maybe this could lead to a heightened, like an ability to hear things in the spiritual and physical realm that others can't?
Absolutely.
Put another way, are musicians closer to God?
Well, yeah, well I'm a musician, so obviously that's true.
I'm just kidding.
Here's the thing, musicians, I don't know if occupation or artistic talent make any difference, but I do know that an individual who has the ability to raise their vibrational level will hear and see things that normal people or people on a lower vibrational level cannot.
Yeah.
Do you have a favorite pre-20th century composer?
A pre-20th century composer?
Like, before the turn of the century?
I love Debussy.
Oh, that is so cool!
Can I ask you, if you have any comments on the Infinite Nature of the Overtone Series, I'd be glad to hear them.
Thank you!
That's something I never studied for, except for this program tonight.
Listen, while we're on the topic, or still near the topic of near-deaf experiences, you said you would like to hear from some people that have had them.
Yes, I would.
How would they contact you, David?
They can contact me at PO Box 10, Provo, Utah, 84603.
Or they can call our book line number at 1-800-846-2233.
I'm sorry, what were the last four?
846-2233.
And that's what they'd like to order in is the two books I was talking about, Life in
the World Unseen and Heavenly Ways of Earth's Graduates.
The book that I've written is called The Way of the Ultimate Warrior.
The Way of the Ultimate Warrior.
That's correct.
Alright.
On the toll-free line, you're on the air with David Scott.
Hi.
Hi.
Yes, ma'am.
Turn your radio off for us, please.
And tell us where you're calling from.
South Carolina.
South Carolina.
Okay.
Go ahead.
I just wanted to...
I've been comforted by some of the things that have been said tonight because I'm Baptist preacher's daughter quote-unquote born again but I've been through hell through trying to live by the Bible word for word literally literally because that's what I was taught to do and finally I just took leave of the whole thing and decided that I really have no control over what I believe, truly believe.
And that's... I just can't accept all that I was taught.
And as a result, I don't know exactly what I do believe.
All I know is I believe that there is another being and I'm doing the very best I can.
I feel very much in tune.
I feel like I'm on the right way.
I can't condemn other believers who are on these other paths for believing what they believe.
And then the gender thing.
That is so silly.
Because God is a spirit and what in the world does he need to be a man or a woman for anyway?
I quite agree.
And so the casual use of the phrase father or mother or whatever, what is the difference?
What difference does it make?
I'm a creator.
The Orthodox Jews refer to the Master of the Universe, I like that.
Or the Great I Am?
Yeah.
You know, it's interesting that some of the things that you were saying, every man or woman on this planet can know the truth for themselves, and I would highly encourage them to seek the truth on their own, and to never ever accept one man or woman's word for it.
You can go to your father or mother or the great I am and find the truth for yourself.
The Spirit of the Lord will reveal to you anything that you want to know.
Well, I found myself standing on the beach in California once and writing in the sand, I am.
And then, just yes, I am.
And I was referring to my own existence and then I looked at it and I thought, oh my God, what have I written?
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