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March 14, 2022 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes
01:01:40
Edition 621 - EXCLUSIVE! - Paul Sinclair
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Across the UK, across continental North America and around the world on the internet, by webcast and by podcast.
My name is Howard Hughes and this is The Unexplained.
Very many thanks for all of your emails.
If your email required a response and you haven't had one yet, please let me know.
I'm getting slightly behind on that stuff, but please know that every morning I get up and I go meticulously through the collection of emails that have come in and take on board all of the points that you make.
Thank you for all of your support.
All of the new people who are listening to this show, please let me know how you use the show.
You know, is it something that you use when you go jogging or you kind of take a break at work or something like that?
It's just nice to know the different slices of people's lives that I have managed to work my way into with this podcast.
There was a clumsy analogy, Howie.
I'm going to resist any temptation to comment on the state that the world finds itself in at the moment because I really don't think there's any point.
By the time you hear this, and I'm recording this on the Saturday morning, the 12th of March, things will have changed.
And so any comment that I might make on it now will be out of date and probably irrelevant by then.
So that's why I'm not going to, only that I despair of a lot of it, and I completely chime with you when you send me emails to say, you know, please don't talk about all of this on your radio show because it just brings people down and we need to be able to take some kind of break from this.
And, you know, within reason, I will adhere to that.
But there are occasions where, for example, you know, Russia hints that it may somehow affect the International Space Station by pulling out of it.
Then that impinges on the unexplained.
So we have to talk about that.
But the actual nuts and bolts of the conflict, the personality of Putin and all of those things, then I understand you don't want to be hearing about that because you hear about that on mainstream news.
So I'm going to try and keep this in proportion and in balance in respect of what you've said about it, because I understand that, you know, you use this show, a lot of you use this show, as a way of removing yourself from the horror of the headlines, you know, the burden of personal debt that a lot of people are facing.
I mean, at the moment, for example, I'm trying to keep my heating off as much as possible.
I'm switching a lot of my supermarket shopping to own brands because the major brands are becoming unaffordable for me.
And as you know, my budgets, my living is a very tight one.
So I'm having to make those changes.
Maybe you're having to make those changes too.
But these are the most worrying of times for a whole variety of reasons.
So anything that allows us to look at life from a bigger perspective, I think is pretty useful, isn't it?
And sometimes we remind ourselves here on this show that there is indeed more to life than the here and now and the today.
There is a bigger picture.
However you choose to paint that bigger picture is a matter for you.
But there is more to this life that we see and experience every day than a lot of the news media allows for.
So, you know, I understand that this show has its place, as indeed do all things.
I'm going to stop rabbiting on that.
But thank you very much for all of your emails.
Please keep them coming.
Go to my website, theunexplained.tv.
That's theunexplained.tv.
And you can send me an email through there.
There's a link there.
And thank you very much if you've participated in the website.
And thank you if you've been part of my Facebook page.
Please do become part of my Facebook page.
Just go to the official Facebook page of the Unexplained with Howard Hughes.
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It's the only one with the official logo on it.
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So if you need to know exactly what's happening with things, if anything happens for any reason, then you will know via my Facebook page, the official Facebook page of The Unexplained with Howard Hughes.
This edition of The Unexplained is a very special one.
It is my great pleasure, as it always is, to welcome back my friend Paul Sinclair in Yorkshire.
Paul Sinclair has been a massive supporter of this show.
I'm delighted that Paul started his career doing these things with me with an interview.
He was a little trepidatious about it.
Turned out to be the natural that I knew that he was, and now is doing all sorts of things, five books out and video presentations, a lot of other things that Paul is doing now.
So massively proud of being a tiny little part of Paul's story.
You know, I've always believed, and I'm hoping it's going to be true, hoping it's going to be true in the long term for me.
You know, I've been through all sorts of vicissitudes, I think is the word, knockbacks, some horrible experiences.
But I've carried on because I've always believed, as people around me used to say, that quality will always rise to the top.
So no matter how many knockdowns you get, to quote the song, you get back up again, I think is the truth of it all.
But Paul was always going to get there.
And I was just a tiny, tiny little part of the beginning of his story.
Do check out his website.
Details of it, I'll give next.
All right, I think that's, or rather, towards the end of the show, I think, is what I'm saying.
So I think that's all I have to say for now.
Thank you very much for all of your support.
Thank you for being there for me.
And yeah.
Oh, Adam, the webmaster.
The man without whom you would not be hearing this.
Thank you very much to Adam, of course, as ever for his ongoing work on this show.
All right.
This was originally produced for my radio show.
It is a slightly longer version of my conversation, an update with the great Paul Sinclair.
He is a man, of course, who's given a goodly part of his life to investigating the strange and anomalous, mostly in the East Yorkshire sort of area, but increasingly spreading above and beyond that.
He's written, I think, five books now, including the four truth-proof books where it all started.
Let's get him on.
Paul Sinclair, how are you?
I'm very good.
Thank you, Howard.
And as usual, it's great to be talking to yourself and Looking forward to the questions you're going to ask me over the next hour.
Well, I've fallen down a bit, Paul, because normally we're recording this on Friday for logistical reasons.
Normally, I ask my listener in advance for some of their questions, and I have to say, I got swept away by the week and haven't actually done that.
So they're going to be my questions that you hear.
So, you know, spare a thought for me.
And if I need to be steered in the right direction, please do that.
No, it's all good.
You just would fire a weight at me in whatever direction you want to go.
We last spoke in November.
Is it five books up to now?
It is five books.
And already, Howard, there's enough information for another one.
But I won't be doing that for a few years.
Maybe I shouldn't say that, but I don't think I will.
I've just got so many things to look into.
And while I'm still able, I don't plan on having any bad health or anything, but while I'm still able to get into forests and in these remote locations, reasonably fit, I'm going to make the most of it.
There's plenty of time to write books.
Do you know, I've ever asked you this, and we'll get into this as we talk.
But you go to various places, like, for example, the forested area north of where you are, which is a fascinating area because of the creature or creatures that may inhabit it.
Do you have to ever ask permission to go to any of these places?
There's usually public footpaths and rights of way through all of them, Howard.
You know, so there's not really a problem.
You know, I've not seen anything that's said restricted access or strictly no trespassing.
Obviously, because we would avoid them.
We wouldn't go into those areas.
So, you know, you obviously keep within the public areas.
And, you know, we've got to say that we're lucky in the United Kingdom that we have many areas that are easily accessible by the public.
And the amount of land that is private that you might be interested in is actually pretty minimal.
Well, that's correct.
But, I mean, I think some of these forests are privately owned, even if they're maintained by Forestry Commission or they have a part in it.
But there's usually public walkways through them.
And, you know, they're so remote.
You don't have to go far out of Scarborough to get to places like Langdale and Silpho and Broxer.
And when you look at those forests, and they extend for miles and miles, and they're absolutely, and Derby Forest, they're very remote places when you kind of get off the beaten track.
You know, I don't think people realise that.
I mean, when the gamekeeper who's helped us quite a lot with Wolflands, he said most people, himself included, and people who are in the farming community, just stay to the logging roads and just stay to the paths.
So very rarely do you actually step into the forest.
Because I won't dwell on his sighting because we've done it before or his encounter.
But he'd worked there several years before he stepped into this area of forest and there was a clearing and there's an abandoned farmhouse.
He didn't know it was there.
God.
He didn't know it was there.
There were mature trees up to either side of it and then in front of the house up to about 40, 35, 40 feet in front of it.
And at the back of it, they were within 20 feet of it.
Everything had grown round it.
It says it were last occupied in 1956.
And I say, a few years before he even realized that there was a property there.
He said it was bizarre because the doors were just swinging wide in the wind.
And he went in and there's just a table and chairs, no beds or anything.
He said it was just eerie, strange place to walk into, knowing that it's been left unattended all those years.
So when people say to you, which I'm sure they do, this is a very packed island.
We've got how many people have we got now?
66, 68 million, whatever it is inhabitants, pushing 70 million.
There are few places that are not observed and inhabited and explored.
I guess your message to them would be, well, in fact, it would be possible for so-called cryptozoological creatures to hide in some places like that because there are places that really are not accessible or not accessed, let's put it that way.
If that's the sort of direction that a person wants to go and think that these things are some kind of flesh and blood creature that's somehow evading detection, then we've got to think at North Yorkshire Moors National Park and imagine we've got 520 odd 25 miles, square miles of forest, moor and woodland, you know, interspersed with towns and farms.
But when you actually get to these high points and actually look at the expanse of woodland, then yeah, I suppose something could remain evasive to mankind.
I'm not sure it is.
I don't know what it is we're dealing with.
And I'm not all for taking everything into the supernatural realms, the sort of the woo.
But there's something other to these things.
I do believe.
I think it's a combination of the right people, the right, maybe even weather conditions.
But these things are occurring and they're not so regular that you would think, yeah, there is a pocket of these things living in that area.
I just don't understand the mechanisms of anything that we're dealing with.
And I don't think anybody else does.
I realize there's a lot of experts out there, Howard, who will tell us, but I haven't got the answers.
And I've thought and I've looked deep, I've spoke to the witnesses.
And everything about what we're looking at and dealing with strikes me as being something other than normal flesh and blood creatures.
I mean, the guys, particularly on the edge of Broxa, who said that this thing's eyes lit up, self-illuminating, in the forest, just lit up on their own, no torches on them.
Which of course is the characteristic of a wolf.
It is, but usually you would get, You know, and then you can jump back into folklore.
And in the same areas, we've got all these stories of the huge hounds with glowing red eyes.
And you think to yourself, are we dealing with the same thing that's just passed down through the ages or just come through the ages?
And I don't know, maybe suburbia and we've moved away from foraging off the land and living in these places into towns and into cities, and we've left it behind, but it's still there.
The phenomena, whatever the phenomena may be, is still lingering in isolated pockets around the UK.
Because whatever it might be, of course, is not going to be living to the kind of time scales that you and I are living through.
For it, eternity is normal existence.
I'm putting that badly, but you know what I mean.
Well, no, you might have put that in a perfectly, you know, eternity could be a normal way of existing for these things.
Obviously, we're just speculating.
But like I said, jumping back to it, with most strange encounters, not just the cryptids, we've got this overwhelming silence that descends, this lower silence.
We've got almost been pushed out of our reality.
And I don't know whether it's the altered reality that enters ours or we've inadvertently stepped into a zone, a thin area within the earth that allows these things to happen.
It's very difficult because there'll be people listening and thinking, what is he talking about?
And I really don't know.
All I know is that the witnesses who come forward report similar things time and time again and the change in the reality and the differences in time, the perception that people have lost hours and hours of time after being immersed in these altered realities.
It's interesting.
The big question for us, Howard, is what happens in the time between the time?
Well, indeed.
And also from what you've just said there, it suggests to me, and I know we've talked about this before, but new information is coming in all the time about it, but it suggests to me that whatever it is, if it is something, is not necessarily entering your reality, there is a possibility from some of those accounts that it's actually taking you into their reality, if you know what I mean.
It's not entering your reality, it's bringing you into theirs.
I do know what you mean, and I think certain locations produce more of this phenomena than others.
And within the area that we're looking at, eastern North Yorkshire, you know, I talk about the area of Bempton and spend a bit of time up there, but there's a concentrated area within that area.
And it weren't evident straight away, but it's become ever increasingly evident.
When I get these reports, we've got the report from a guy called David Ellis, who he did live in Bempton.
I don't know if he still does, walking his dogs through the nature reserve, looks from this, overlooks the fields, and there's a hill that he's looking at, and he sees a blue sphere of almost gaseous cloud on the cliff path, hanging out over the sea and extending towards the hill.
And inside it, there's all lights punching about inside it.
But the common factor here is this hill.
Myself and Lee Hayward, we went up there in 2019.
I know the exact date.
It was November the 14th.
Lee wanted to go up and disprove what I was looking at.
In a nice way, he's sceptic, but he comes across these things.
He looks into things deep and he thought it were aircraft and he thought he was going to explain it to me.
But we turn around, there's a huge sphere just below the hill.
And Lee's description is looking at it, it was as big as a Volkswagen Beetle.
It's the best thing I've ever seen up there.
And when we were looking at it, I'd got the camera swinging it round.
And as it's decreasing in size, it's kind of imploding.
But he said it looked like lava.
And I have to agree, it looked like molten lava turning.
So, but what is the common thing with the sighting?
The hill.
You know, we went up a few years ago, this was 2019 again, myself, Bob Brown, and one of my daughters who were staying with us for a week or two.
And Bob and Gemma saw a white glowing square of light on the hill when they put a torch onto it.
Gemma put it on at first.
And she asked Bob what it was.
Bob said he thought it was a sign on a post.
Then realized it wasn't, obviously because we're up there all the time.
And he put his torch onto it.
And they both say this.
I didn't see it.
I was looking out to see.
I can hear them discussing something.
It just dropped to the floor and vanished.
But what's interesting is the hills there in the background.
It's where the rock angler said the spaceship landed in 1998.
So what's special about that particular area?
You know, so we've got like concentrated areas within the affected area.
I guess that's what I'm saying, Howard.
And you've, I think, since we started having these conversations, and of course people are now in their droves buying the books and enjoying them rightly.
I think you've started a little bit of a tourist industry.
A lot of people going, especially to that Benton area.
It's springtime now.
They're going to be going back to enjoy the beautiful views.
I mean, it is quite breathtaking there.
It is, you know, nature absolutely in the roar.
You're standing on the cliffs there.
You've got to mind yourself a bit, and you've got this beautiful takeoff across the North Sea and the most beautiful sunsets and sunrises, but there is this otherworldliness about it.
Of those people who've been inspired by you, some of whom have contacted me, but I'm sure a lot have contacted you, what sorts of things at the moment are people telling you that they experience?
Because if you've been experiencing them and people that you know directly have been experiencing them, these people who've been encouraged to go there because of you must also be seeing them and experiencing.
Well, that's correct.
And like you said, people are coming actually in droves.
There's a party of people from a group coming today.
They asked if they could meet up with me, but I've got too much on.
I'll try and meet up with them tomorrow.
And yesterday, only yesterday, I met a guy, an academic, I'll not say what university he's at, but he spent a bit of time in the area.
And he messaged me yesterday morning to tell me he'd seen something interesting whilst walking back from The RSPB, the Bempton Nature Reserve, down Cliff Lane towards the village of Bempton.
He was going to get a train back into Bridlington.
And he told me this story.
I said, Would you meet up with me?
So I met him in Brid and we drove to the location.
He wouldn't let me film him, which is fine, but he's allowed me to record him.
And I put it onto Facebook.
If anybody wants to have a look on the truth proof page, I think that's where it'll have ended up.
I put it on my personal page, but it will get on there.
Just, I don't know, two minutes of him describing what he'd seen.
And basically, this is about in between five and ten past five on the tenth, he's walking down, forgive me, on the ninth, he's walking down, he told me yesterday, he's walking down Cliff Lane and he sees two, what he said looked great to red lights in the sky in front of him that had come out, come from over the sea.
And because, you know, we've got a big ark, like big kind of horseshoe, and you can see all around.
And he's observing these.
He's not stopped.
He's not gone looking for UFOs, I need to add.
He's gone for a bit of a break and to look at the seabirds and the great surroundings.
So he watches these things.
He said, and they come together.
He said, at first, I thought they were fighter jets.
He said, and then they started to glow yellow and they joined.
And there was a flash of light.
Now, his description is on the Facebook page, the Paul Sinclair.
But for anybody that listens to it afterwards, it will be on the truth proof so everybody can access it.
There's public access to that.
They joined and then they became a bar of gold light.
His description's fairly detailed, and I haven't got it in front of me, but he said then they seem to rotate.
There's another flash of light which were quite bright and brilliant to look at and they separate and go their separate ways.
But when they merged, they stayed merged for between two and four seconds.
And then there were a flash of light and this thing, whatever it was, separated.
He said when they'd gone the separate ways, there was a black dot left in the sky.
What he didn't say on, or what I haven't picked up on on the recording, but I'll probably add to it because I recorded him for five minutes telling me, just under, and I've only put two minutes on.
He says the dot could have been diamond-shaped, but he's not certain.
He said, but it appeared to be stationary for a while and then he realised it's coming towards him, coming towards Cliff Lane.
Not close, not frighteningly close or anything.
But when it got come a certain way, a certain distance, it became lost behind trees and then he'd lost sight of it.
So that's his unusual sighting.
And that's the kind of thing we wouldn't say we get in every day, but we get in quite often.
And incidentally, where he was on Cliff Lane, it's interesting because there's a lady called Deborah Singleton who visited, I think in 2020, it could have been late 2019 with her friend.
I think they were coming from West Yorkshire.
They'd been up to Bempton during the daytime.
And she contacted me and met up with me later.
She drove back through from her home to show me where she'd seen this.
She said it looked like an animated, what's the word?
Ball of twigs and grass, but it wasn't a ball of twigs and grass.
She said it looked animated and turning within itself.
As she's driving a car down Cliff Lane, she stopped the car.
A friend was in with her.
And she said it came over the hedgerow in a controlled manner, followed the line of the hedge, went across the road in front of a tumbleweed.
That's what she said.
She said, but it wasn't.
It was all kind of animated and moving within itself.
And there was a hole in the middle of it, about the size of a baseball.
She said, and then when it got to the other side of the road, there's some tall trees.
They'll be about 30 feet tall.
And she said it went up the trunk of the tree, then on the outside of the tree and followed it, and then just went into the distance.
I think you'll agree, Awen, these aren't conventional, what people would describe as UFO sightings.
They're just, I mean, that could be some unusual weather phenomena.
I've no idea.
But it's a strange one.
It could have been a swarm of bees.
Do you know what?
We've got to look for the kind of logical possibilities.
She's adamant it wasn't any of those things.
And because I did put these things to her, but interesting.
You know, the bizarreness of the things that are being reported and the strange sounds.
You know, we're not only, you know, we're getting strange rumbling sounds below ground as well that people are picking up on.
And some people, of course, and we've said this before, but some people have said over the years that this may be some kind of LF, low-frequency radar that's being used.
Because don't forget, and especially now, we'll talk about this in our next segment, but especially now that eastern coast is very strategic.
You know, you stand on Bempton Cliffs.
And if I've got this right with your back to the cliffs, you're looking effectively, if you could see that far at the Baltic.
Yeah, yeah, you would be.
Yeah, it's quite an open place, let's put it that way.
You know, in view of what's going on now, it's quite frightening to think about.
But there you go.
We've got Paul Sinclair here.
We catch up with him a few times a year.
Glad to be doing it now.
Springtime catch-up.
Author of the Truth Proofbooks, many other things.
We'll let you know how to contact him and how to access his material at the back end of this hour.
All right, Paul.
We talked about that location, which seems to be the springboard for so much of this, the cliffs at Bempton.
I'm wondering, at the moment, we know that there is heightened tension because of what Putin is doing in Ukraine.
It seems to me that all of Europe is on standby in one way and another.
I'm getting constant reports from people who are seeing military aircraft taking off, apparently, I don't know, on exercise, testing themselves out, whatever.
Does that mean that people are seeing more things in that area now?
It's not been reported, but, you know, I suppose that people could mistake the lights from military aircraft, craft after burners, the lights from seeking helicopter, search and rescue, military, you know, that could be mistaken for UFOs.
I suppose what I'm saying is, And we've touched on this before, neither of us can know what kind of military equipment, advanced military equipment that we wouldn't want an enemy to know about, an adversary to know about, might be being tested.
And that's the kind of place where you might test that stuff.
But as we get into more of the conversation about the latest thing that you sent me, we'll see that the behavior of what is being reported is like nothing that we're aware of.
Well, that's true.
And whilst I do believe that a lot of the sightings could be explained away by conventional aircraft, military aircraft and things, maybe just the right weather conditions creating the illusion that it's something else, there's also a lot of instances where it couldn't be.
You know, these spheres of light, they're nothing new.
I haven't invented them.
They've been reported and reported for decades and decades.
And just before we get to that, Howard, I wonder about the huge black triangles that have been reported since before the 1990s.
I know the 1990s was when they were more prevalent.
But if these are ours and people describe them as being size of a football pitch, imagine how many people they could carry and they're silent and they can hover stationary in the sky.
Why would we not be using such pieces of technology to not necessarily settle conflict, but to aid?
And to prevent it, maybe.
I don't know.
I mean, it's a very good point, and it's one I know that a lot of top ufologists have made over the years.
If we have this stuff, then why aren't we deploying it more sensibly?
Or the alternative explanation is, if such things exist and they're not of this earth, then clearly we know about it.
I say we.
I'm talking about the establishment, the military-industrial complex, whatever you want to call it, the government.
We know about it, and we're either working in league with it or we're monitoring it on some kind of basis that neither of us can understand.
I would agree.
And, you know, I don't want to go too deep into the abduction scenario because I haven't got enough knowledge of what they call the MyLab, the military abductions.
But if these people who research this particular part of the subject believe that it's real, why are we not using the military-type abduction scenario?
Why are they only taking people from the rooms on whatever street in Leeds and somewhere else in Newcastle?
Why are they going to all the depth of doing something like that?
I hope I'm making sense here, people, and not doing it in other parts of the world where people really could have been removed.
Well, that's an interesting philosophical question.
I think it's probably above both our pay grades here.
It's definitely worth thinking about, I would say.
Which brings us to the video that you sent me recently.
What a fascinating video.
Now, I want you to talk to me about this, but I'll just say, if you'll allow me, I'll put a still from that video on my Facebook page.
Yeah, put what you want on, Howard.
You know, don't put the actual recording on.
I would appreciate it because I will be using that at the Awakening Conference.
That's fine, but a still is okay?
You're fine.
Right.
Absolutely.
So check my Facebook page for now.
That's the official Facebook page of the Unexplained with Howard Us.
You'll see a still from this.
It is a video of a light that appears from, well, appears to just be there, having popped up, and I mean it quite literally popped up from underwater.
Then flies in a way that you might say, well, that's a drone, but remember this thing is illuminated, flies in a somewhat erratic, but somewhat not erratic way, if you know what I'm saying, and then pops under the water again.
Now, this is an illuminated sphere, and it is in a place where I can't see any other light.
I don't know where that might be coming from.
If you say, that's reflected off something, well, I can't understand how that would happen.
But Paul, you would describe this video much better than I would.
First of all, where was it shot?
We were on the cliff tops near that hill, believe it or not, at a place called The Lookout.
And I was with a very good friend, a former police officer called Dave Barnes.
He'll not mind me mentioning his name.
And listeners, we're never ready for this.
I always have my cameras out should something occur, but they're not switched on recording.
For this particular bit of film, I'm pleased it was in focus for I would have thought 85-90% of the duration because I didn't have my glasses on.
And anybody that knows me, I'm pretty useless.
I need them for reading and close-ups things.
So I've got the camcorder in hand.
It was on night shot, and it's getting towards dusk.
And me and Dave are walking back towards the RSPB.
And Dave said, wow, look.
He said, there's a light just come up out of Filey Bay.
Anybody that knows Filey Brig, if you don't, do a bit of Google search.
It's about six miles away from where we were at Bempton.
Dave said he saw the light come out of the water.
I'd got the camera in position and flicked on when it was, I don't know, I'm estimating it to be about 150, 200 feet in the air.
It stopped momentarily and then started moving across the sea towards us in a direct line, not making a beeline for Paul and Dave.
Now, the time it took, you'll have to forgive me, you watch the footage, whatever that time is, obviously, is what it is.
And we have estimated it to be traveling to about 325 miles an hour to cover the six miles approximate.
Now, like I said, it's traveling in a direct line and then it appears to go low and enter the sea.
Now, well, it does enter the sea.
So, in the I don't know how long the footage lasts for, Howard, I can't remember now, but it definitely enters the sea and it seems to be taking a bit of a curve and coming towards us.
And I think it disproves military aircraft.
It's flying against the wind, As Dave correctly points out, and anybody that wants any more audio footage, I can put it on.
I've just left what was said on the film, but we did speak about it afterwards quite extensively.
But I've got to say, on the video, you both sound genuinely surprised.
I don't think, you know, people have all sorts of things.
Everybody wants to have their two cents worth, but I don't think you could fake that.
You are genuinely surprised at what you are seeing.
We just never expected to see it.
And I'm surprised is all you can be because I don't...
Well, I don't know what speed a drone flies at for starters, but we're talking to cover that six miles, 325 miles an hour.
I don't know what speed drones fly at.
Maybe a military drone can fly 800 miles an hour.
But what I'm saying is that unless it's got the capability to travel underwater and come out and then travel six miles and then re-enter the water, it's a brilliant piece of kit if we've made it.
And it's certainly not something that we could buy off the shelf to fake.
Bearing in mind, Howard, I filmed this in 2019.
So I talk about these things and I've got lots of footage, not necessarily identical to that, but lots of footage of these spheres of light that I've never shown.
I was kind of prompted to put that one up because there's been a few comments that, well, maybe Paul's just filming the aviation aircraft.
And I thought, well, maybe Paul isn't.
Well, the problem with it is, and I've been lucky enough to see this video footage, and like I say, I will put a still from it if that helps on my Facebook page.
But it is not behaving like an aircraft that I've seen.
What aircraft that we know is illuminated sphere-like literally pops up from the water.
It doesn't, there's no effort involved in this.
It's like it's just going from one state to another.
I mean, it is kind of reminiscent of those descriptions of the Tic-Tac UFOs.
It's not the same.
It's not a Tic-Tac shape.
That's not what it is.
But it's behaving that way.
Well, you know, there could be rational explanation, and no doubt somebody will suggest some things.
Bearing in mind that when you do see the object, it's when I've fired the camera into action.
So there were only myself and Dave, and Dave primarily said it's left the sea and it will rising when I set eyes on it.
But it definitely enters the sea at the other end.
So I don't know.
I'm at a loss as to what it could be.
It's an interesting bit of footage, and it's not your usual blurry white light on a black background.
You know, it's green in colour because the camcorder was on night shot, which aided it.
I did momentarily for a few seconds, I flick it back to daylight and you can see how grainy it is, and then I put it back.
That's just me seeing whether we can get a better view of it.
But yeah, Howard, interesting bit of footage.
And you know, I've been filming stuff like that when the farmers up on the wolds back in, I don't know, 2004, 2006 were telling me that they're seeing these unusual spheres of light in groups of threes and fours.
I mean, one particular farmer said he was driving his tractor evening time, still light, and there's a formation of three lights.
Obviously, they're going to form a triangle, but it said it looked equilateral triangle, just traveling alongside of him in his tractor.
They're not that close that he could reach out and touch them.
They're up in the sky, maybe a thousand foot up, but they travel while he's working the field.
He says, and then they just banked off in one and drifted away.
Could that be military?
Why not?
You know, I think we've got to remain feet firmly on the ground that, yeah, it could be some military technology.
I'm not going to deny that.
But it's highly unusual.
It's not what you see flying over your house or when you're walking down road and you hear the roar of a jet.
Bearing in mind that in most instances, 95% of the time, there's no sound to these things, which kind of rules out military jets.
Well, you would think because sound carries across large open spaces and sound is also conducted to an extent across water, as indeed are radio frequencies better conducted across water, it would make you think that if it was something mechanical, you would hear it, at least to an extent.
But you don't.
This is silent.
It's weird.
Do you have...
Yeah, there's a submarine training ground.
I don't know how many miles out, probably about 18 to 20 miles out between Flamborough and Bempton.
And there'll be restrictions.
I'm not going to pretend I've got the terminology or the knowledge of what restrictions, but there'll be restrictions on fishing around it, I would think.
Okay, but again, if there was a submarine in that area, and if that had emanated from a submarine, then you would probably see some signs of the submarine.
But also, where it went back into the water is not where it came out of the water.
Well, it had travelled six miles, Howard, and when it came back, it were literally about where we were stood.
And I don't think we were the reason it decided to enter the water near us.
It just keep going down, and one minute it's above the surface, and then it's gone.
Well, you say that, but in the past, when we've talked about these things, that you have witnessed similar before.
When we've talked about these things before, you've hinted that some of them almost give you the impression, although this sounds crazy, that you're almost not summoning them, but they're aware that you're there.
It does seem like there's awareness.
Jumping back to Lee Haywood on November the 14th, 2019, Lee had done some preparation before we set off, and he knew what aircraft were in the civilian and military.
Obviously, if there's anything covert, it's not going to get to know that.
He knew even the names of the boats that were fishing out at sea.
So, you know, he'd gone on all these various things and found this information out.
And as we're driving down Cliff Lane to the nature reserve, and this is the truth, whether you believe me or not, he said, What do these lights look like then, Paul?
I mean, we'd already done it, but he said it, and we're there.
It's the first time he'd been up.
And I just literally looked out of my window to my right and I said, like that.
I didn't expect to see one.
And He's squinting his neck.
He's a huge guy, is Lee.
In fact, there's a picture of Lee with the description from the other sighting yesterday because I just threw a few pictures with it so I could make a video to put onto Facebook for people to listen to the guy's description.
But so, and there it is in the sky, an orange sphere of light, probably about two times bigger than the biggest star that you would see in the sky.
And it literally came, kind of punched into existence and imploded.
And he admitted afterwards, he says, I thought then, I thought, well, I don't know what I'm looking at then.
I am surprised.
So we got onto the cliff tops.
He's got a notebook with him.
So he noted the times.
And during the time he was there, which would probably be an hour and a half, two hours, we saw these spheres of light out at sea.
I think about six times, six, including the one on Cliff Lane.
And then the final time was when I turned round because I'm in front of him and I've got the cameras looking out to sea.
They're not switched on people because I just cover them up.
There's a lot of salt air and moisture in air.
It's not good for cameras.
So I turned around to speak to him and there it was on the hillside.
And it was spectacular.
As Lee said, the size of a Volkswagen Beetle.
And he estimates, and I like it when the witness, we'll call Lee the witness, because I mean, I know I was there as well, but I talk about these things a lot.
And Lee's allowed us to record him and actually go on film saying what he saw.
He's not doing me no favours.
He's just saying it as he saw it.
He said, 80, 200 yards away.
It was huge.
Sphere of.
I've never seen it like it.
And as I'm pulling the camera around, firing it up, it's just imploded and it's gone.
And it's not just you and your chums at Bempor and that kind of area.
Because I've looked at your, I mean, your website is growing all the time.
You've got a great reports page.
And I had a good old look at it today.
And there are reports of lights and things of this nature in Flamborough, Scarborough, Bridlington, inland to Driffield, Pocklington, and even out of your area, East Anglia, and up towards Tyneside.
Oh, it's growing all the time.
And I'm glad you said it's not just me and my friends, Howard, because me and my friends hardly see anything for the time invested.
You know, I won't get up there tonight, but I'll probably try Saturday.
But I were up there last night and the night before.
It's a bit sad, really, I suppose, people, but once you've been bit by it and once you've seen something that you consider as totally off the scale of anything normal, you want to see more of it.
But what you touched on there, Howard, yeah, the majority of the people don't know me.
You know, and they're coming to me with their own reports.
Interestingly, Howard, jumping from Bempton and Eastern North Yorkshire, I got some interesting little story from Loch Ness the other day, but I don't really want to touch on it.
Oh, no, I'd love to.
No, please.
We love Loch Ness.
You know, the guy who's the curator, Gary Campbell, of the Loch Ness Monster reports page, I think it's got a formal name, but Gary Campbell is a great friend of this show.
We're fascinated by Loch Ness.
Yeah, well, a guy's contacted me to say that, so I need to speak to the first-hand witnesses, so you're going to get a second-hand account, which I don't normally deal with, but I found it fascinating.
So I won't write about it, but I don't mind talking about it until I've spoken to someone closer to the source.
But he said his uncle has lived at Loch Ness for 45 years above the loch, and he's a salmon fisherman.
And he didn't believe in the Loch Ness monster.
He thought it was all a load of rubbish.
Was flagging his drive one day in 2002, looked down onto the loch.
He sent me enough information to believe that he's legit.
This guy, by the way, you know, to tie in with what he was telling me.
He said he looked down onto the lock and saw what he thought was an upturned boat.
And he's looking at it.
And then he said, a neck came out of the water.
Oh, my lord.
Yeah, he said, I thought to myself, it can't be.
It kind of did a double tick, and it was still there.
And apparently, it was there for a few minutes.
He'd got another story, he's seen it since.
And if this guy listens to it, I hope I've got date right, 2008.
And he's describing how, because obviously this guy's lived up there as well and knows his family well, how his uncle can read the water, he can tell you by the movement of the water what fish are, if there's a shoal of fish or the weather conditions.
And there's a wake in the water, and as he looks over, this huge creature is in a 20-foot boat, so I'm told.
Huge body of a creature passed his boat, which he says must have been 40 foot long.
I'm not the creature, not the boat.
The creature, yeah.
Now, so, so listeners, it's just a I don't want to say off the cuff, but it's not something I've looked into.
I'm gonna, I but I am gonna do, and I'm gonna get more details on this because it's fascinating.
Because apparently, there's a few more witnesses because the first thing this guy, when he told the story, the locals are surrounding him and says, don't say a word, because we don't want the press and the public all over it.
So is that why he waited 20 years to tell you?
Well, he hasn't waited.
It's his nephew that's told me, but I shall, you know what I'm like.
I'll not let it go.
You're like a dog with a bone, as my mum used to say.
I will be honest, yeah.
I mean, one person who might be interested in that is, I don't know whether the nephew or the guy himself has reported it to Gary Campbell, who logs all of these Loch Ness monster sightings from around the world.
I don't know whether there would be some mileage in contacting him.
I don't mind, Howard.
Yeah, I'd speak to the witness first because he said I'm the first person to ever hear this.
So, and I've been sort of careful with the details because I don't want to expose the guy.
But you're going to check it out more.
Oh, I'll be looking into it.
We'll be moving from East and North Yorkshire.
If I knew this would happen, you're going to expand your activities.
That's fantastic.
Let's hold that thought.
Paul Sinclair is here.
One of the things that you sent me recently, and I didn't know what to make of it, you sent me a picture, an image of a letter that appears to detail some kind of sighting of something that may be ufological witnessed from a Britain-Norman passenger plane.
That's a turboprop, isn't it?
Flying from Amsterdam to this country in the 1980s?
Yeah, I think we were 1983, Howard.
And it's not the smoking gun, but it is interesting, like you said, nevertheless, because this guy's...
A bit of turbulence, but he feels a bump, a distinct bump as he's flying this aircraft.
Checks the controls, and everything seems to be working fine.
And then as he's approaching, as he's going to land, one of the engines sets on fire.
So obviously he's got problems, but he manages to land the plane without any injury to himself and the plane basically intact.
But what's interesting is when they examine the plane afterwards, once it's on the ground, there's lots of holes through its fuselage.
The clean holes.
And inside the plane, there is an unknown metal.
And the letter, it doesn't go into detail, does it, Howard?
But it does say that there's unknown fragments of metal.
I think there's a little bit more information to be gleaned from it.
There might be a bit more accompanying evidence, I'm hoping.
So I shall get that.
But it's an unusual one.
What this guy hit or what he collided with over the sea managed to pepper holes in the plane's fuselage.
Like shrapnel.
Like shrapnel.
And the actual metal, it's not known what it was.
So there's something from the 1980s, 83, I believe.
I mean, that is very fascinating.
And if it is an unknown metal, then my first thought is, where is that metal?
And how was that documented at the time?
That's correct.
Because what we've not said, Howard, is it is an official letter.
It's not something that somebody's written to somebody and they've passed it on to me.
There are a few serial numbers and a few reference.
There's a reference on the letter, but I don't think it's ever hit the public domain.
Okay, so just talk to me about how you got it.
Just an interested party, somebody who's interested in the unexplained who contacted me.
I've spoken to them on the phone, well, several times, and they've got this letter, they're piloted past it.
I mean, it looks very official.
I mean, it's typed in the way that letters were typed.
At that time, I was just a kid, but I had a golf ball electric typewriter.
People listening to this today laugh their socks off about all of this.
But it's typed on a proper office typewriter of the day.
And as you say, it's got reference numbers and all sorts of things in.
So it's interesting that somebody has that letter and wants you to know about it.
Yeah, and I could be, if I did want to run with it, I could be as green as grass and be exposed for a hoax.
But something tells me that it's not.
And I will look deeper into it and just see where we can go with it and if there is any mileage in it, because here we are, if it is the real McCoy, we've got a report of hitting a true unknown over the sea and it's left a large number of holes in the fuselage and a strange unknown alloy or metal within the body of the aircraft.
It's good that he wanted you to know about it, but of course you want to know more about how that happened, how that person came to be in possession of that letter, what was their connection to it.
And there are loads of unanswered questions with it.
Well, he did say a pilot gave it to him.
He did tell me a pilot gave him the letter.
but we shall see.
It's not one that we're, But let's just be clear about it so we, you know, whet people's appetite for it.
This is a passenger plane.
You know, those Britain Norman planes were the mainstay of short-haul flights back in the day.
I remember the Britain Norman Islander, I think, was the one that they used a lot in Scotland between the Scottish Islands.
But, you know, great planes, I'm sure some of them, a lot of them probably are still flying.
So this was a passenger plane that was flying from the Netherlands to here.
Yeah.
Well, I mean, you know, to be continued, as they say.
I hope so, Howard.
And, you know, why did he get in touch?
I probably ought to see.
He did send me his own UFO report with a drawing.
I haven't got the year in front of me.
I wish I had, because he'd also got an accompanying letter from the MOD because he reported this.
And it's not your bog standard letter that you'd send.
It's not thought to be of any defense significance.
Once again, it's not a smoking gun, but it's a little bit different because he reported it and explained that he was sort of traveling home and he saw what he perceived was a chimney fire above some trees, you know, and buildings far into the distance.
And as he got closer, he could see what he said, he didn't say a flying saucer, he said it was saucer-shaped and it was on its side, upturned, you know, just literally flip it on its side in the air.
And he's done a drawing of it and everything.
And he said he's looking at this thing and there's two oblongs of light that look like revolving doors in the side of it that are just turning constantly.
So he's given me this UFO report and we spoke about it on the phone several times.
And then during the course of the conversation, he said, I also have a letter from a pilot, which doesn't, it's not connected to his report.
He said that you might find interesting.
I think it just throws up questions.
I think we all want to know more about this.
I don't think it can be left like that.
No, it won't be left.
I shall be pursuing it, Howard.
For our next conversation, I think, and maybe your next book, even if that is in a couple of years, I think, Paul.
I had on this program a man who deals with a lot of folklore and reports of strangeness in your sort of area, not entirely your area, but it's more down towards the wolds and that sort of thing.
But it's your sort of area.
Charles Christian was on recently, and we discussed the phenomenon that is known in places like Hull and Grimsby, Humberside, and around there, of Old Stinker, this sort of strange wolf-like creature that has been spotted.
I think, if I'm being fair to Charles, he would be the general consensus of the conversation was that this was more kind of mythology.
You and I have talked about Old Stinker and similar creatures that might have been spotted in your area and beyond.
What are your thoughts about that?
I mean, without referencing Charles particularly, but just around that.
I don't know.
I mean, mythology, folklore, I mean, is that what we're dealing with now?
Is that what I'm writing about is going to be...
Tomorrow's folklore, but there's got to be grains of truth in it.
I don't know.
A lot of the stories of old Stinker, I wouldn't say all of them, but a lot of them are actually from the stories of the Flickston werewolf, which is strange really when we're looking at between 35 to 45 miles away from where it originated.
We know that they talk about the Beast of Barmston Drain and Barmston runs out onto the beach about six or seven miles from Riddlington, which is interesting because if this were a flesh and blood type creature, it could follow the drains and the land drains, this, they're not sewage drains, into Hull and then back along the beaches and towards Danesdyke and follow the coast into the forests.
I don't think that's happening, but there's that kind of thing to look at.
But no, I mean, I think the stories are folklore.
I think that's what we're dealing with now.
And there's a reality to them.
The beast of Barmston Drain, the old stinker, as it's called.
I don't know.
And, you know, the fact is that people do keep reporting these things.
And of course, sometimes it's fueled, which came out of that conversation by pieces that local newspapers sometimes do.
So they revive the phenomenon.
But there are things being reported.
Let me just bring you to this.
You and I talked a lot in our early conversations about cattle.
Well, not necessarily cattle, but livestock mutilations that were happening.
And sometimes for quite understandable reasons, the farmers involved didn't want to be identified and didn't want the locations to be known.
Has that gone quiet?
Or are you still getting those reports?
No, it's gone quiet, Howard.
Yeah, it's just not happening.
Ironically, jumping back to Wolfland, there was animal mutilations occurring back in the 1990s when the gamekeeper first started and he had his experience.
And Tony Dodd were looking into them in the surrounding forests where our gamekeeper were looking.
But back to the Flixton werewolf and the old stinker, a lot of these things are just said for publicity.
They're just said so people can get the names in the paper.
And the people, the witnesses we've got for Wolflands who've allowed us to film them and given out their permissions, if I wanted to sensationalize this with what we've been told, because it's incredible.
Some of the stuff's incredible.
Well, I've got people stood in front of us telling us about what happened, the multi-witness accounts when this thing appeared and how it rose up in front of them and giving us vivid descriptions.
Mountain bikers from bikers' clubs in the forests of North Yorkshire describing a certain location where they've seen something and then suddenly been overwhelmed in fear.
Not just one.
It started with one and everybody had kept it to themselves.
But now we're getting more coming forward saying that they've been chased, paralleled out of the forest by these things.
But you get all this other stuff about old stinker and I'm actually researching it and looking into it.
I'm looking for the new stuff that parallels the stories at all.
You know, to obviously these things are going to appear in the newspapers because, you know, they're stories that are passed around.
And I've worked in certainly radio news offices and somebody will say, oh, I remember we did a piece about that a couple of years ago.
It's a quiet day.
Let's wheel something out about that and tie it into whatever story there is.
Now that is not to devalue the reports that you've been getting from people because as you say, Paul, and we both know from previous conversations, people keep reporting strange so-called cryptozoological phenomena to you.
They do, and I'm sure that the guy that you mentioned earlier, Charles Christian, I'm sure he must get reports of such things.
And I think people like Charles Christian and myself and lots of other researchers are invaluable for documenting this stuff.
You know, it's got to be documented.
It's got to be looked into.
All of us will look at it with a slightly different eye.
But it doesn't mean that they're into place for everyone.
No, exactly.
I mean, fair play to Charles, who was a great guest on the show.
Fair play to you and everybody who does this.
Because what people have to remember, just as we come to the end of this conversation poll, is that this is time consuming.
You know, this is not, nobody's, This is time-consuming stuff, as the Americans say, on your own dime.
It's 24-7.
It's literally non-stop.
Like yesterday, somebody had to meet that guy, drive with him, get his story, drive back.
I don't know.
I've got to make enough notes so that it makes sense probably if I start writing about it in 12 months' time.
And then I'm out in the evening hoping to catch a glimpse of this phenomenon, which is as rare as hen's teeth.
All right.
Okay, to conclude then, is there one Is there one case or kind of phenomenon that you haven't looked Into yet, but you're itching to.
I mean, the answer to that may be Loch Ness Monster, but it might be something else.
No, I think there's a few cases that I've looked into that need a lot more research, such as Wilshorpe, because there's now another witness come forward.
Oh, really?
This is the supposed landing of a craft.
It were multiple UFOs over the sea.
Oh, yes, yes, yes.
Wasn't this 2009?
In 2009, September the 15th.
And what I found interesting, and what we haven't touched on, Alan, is that I spoke to Kaz Clark of the Penturk incident earlier in the week, and the MOD response that she got when she looked into the alleged sighting that she had is the exact same, just about word for word, response that I got for Willsthorpe.
And I suppose we can say, well, that's just a standard thing that they sent out, but I've never seen a response like it, like the one that she's got and like the one I've got for any other UFO-related reports.
So I find that's interesting in itself.
And the Willsthorpe thing is interesting because somebody actually witnessed this phenomenon, I think, from their own cottage, from their own home.
That's right, from the 16 isolated flats at Willsthorpe, nothing either side of them.
Well, there's a small boat compound to the left of them.
And this lady and her husband witnessed a circle, as she described it, of glowing blue-to-white boomerang-shaped objects over the sea from her home.
Now, I'm keen to stress when I've spoken about Willsthorpe before.
You go to the bottom of her garden, you can hit the sea with a stone.
So that it is close, and they were close.
And absolutely fascinating story.
And so I'd like to look more into Willsthorpe because I think I'm the only person that has so far.
And I'm welcome other people to get involved.
Well, maybe there's a whole book on that to be done.
I would think so, Howard, yes.
Well, Paul, wow.
You and I, and I never bother making great notes when I talk to you because we'll always go in whatever direction we will and it always works out.
To be continued, Paul.
Thank you.
Congratulations.
Well, you're welcome, Howard, and thank you very much for letting me speak again.
Appreciate it.
No, well, I'm very, very proud of everything that you've done, and it's nice to be name-checked on the covers of a couple of your books, including Truth Proof 4.
That's really great.
What's the website?
Truthproof.uk.
And as you said earlier, there's a great database of sites building up there.
And if anybody's interested in the books, they can be obtained through the website.
Paul Sinclair, there is only one.
We'll talk again.
Paul Sinclair, do check out his books.
Do check out his work.
You will not at all be disappointed.
He is remarkable.
And although it'll be a little while, I think, in the making, I'm looking forward to his next book.
But all of his work really is well worth checking out if you haven't before.
That's it.
More great guests in the pipeline here at the home of the unexplained.
So until next we meet in this uncertain world, please do these things.
Stay safe.
Stay calm.
And above all, please stay in touch.
Thank you very much.
Take care.
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