Lesley Mitchell-Clarke - in Canada...talks about the use of "hypnotherapeutic regression" and people who believe they have had contact with aliens, ETs or other strange phenomena...
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| Across the UK, across continental North America, and around the world on the internet, by webcast and by podcast, my name is Howard Hughes, and this is The Unexplained. | |
| It's a very dramatic unexplained. | |
| I didn't mean it to be quite so dramatic there, but you know what I'm saying? | |
| I hope that everything is okay with you and you're getting by in the midst of everything that is going on in this crazy, mad world of ours. | |
| I think I've said it before on this show. | |
| If I haven't, then I needed to. | |
| You wonder when we're going to get back to what we knew as normality, if ever there was such a thing. | |
| I wonder when we're going to reset the clocks and the dials and get back to life like we knew it, without war and disease to worry about. | |
| You know, just the routine mundane things like making a living, how the boss is treating you at the moment, where you're going to go on holiday, remember those? | |
| That would be nice, wouldn't it, really? | |
| God, holidays. | |
| I can't remember. | |
| When did I last have a holiday that you could call a holiday? | |
| Four years ago, I think. | |
| Yeah, four years ago. | |
| I've had a couple of small days away in the last two years. | |
| I think I had three days away. | |
| And that's about it. | |
| So just think about, maybe it's sustaining to think about it too. | |
| Think about what life was like before all of these things happened. | |
| Because there's no doubt about it. | |
| The way of life and the way of the world is that things eventually do return to the way that they were. | |
| You know, we've been through all sorts of things as the human race, but we've always come back to equilibrium in the end. | |
| Just takes a bit of time and a little bit of collective positive effort, I think. | |
| What do you think? | |
| Thank you very much to my webmaster, Adam, for his hard work on the show. | |
| Keep those podcasts coming out there, Adam. | |
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| Now, on this edition of the show, Toronto-based Leslie Mitchell Clark is going to be here talking about the use of skilled hypnotherapeutic regression when she works with individuals who believe that they've had extra or ultra-terrestrial contact or other experiences of high strangeness. | |
| Most of this fascinating work, as well as metaphysical therapies like past and interlife regression, takes place at Leslie's Toronto Hypnosis Clinic, Light Work Hypnosis. | |
| She will be here in just moments from now with a conversation that you may well find enlightening. | |
| You know, we like to explore a lot of different things here, but like I say, show's always guided by you, so let me know what you want to hear. | |
| Obviously, I can't do a show that is absolutely tailor-made to every individual person, because in some cases they have to be all ghosts or all aliens and UFOs or all cryptozoology or all scientific topics. | |
| And I want to cover a lot of different things here. | |
| Basically, I think the principal reason for it is a very selfish one. | |
| Like a lot of people in this world, and certainly a lot of people in the media, I've got what Paul Simon called a short little span of attention in one of his songs. | |
| What song was that? | |
| I've got a short little span of attention. | |
| It'll come to me. | |
| You'll tell me anyway. | |
| I think it was Call Me Owl. | |
| I think it was You Can Call Me Owl from Paul Simon. | |
| But I've got a short little span of attention. | |
| And so, as you might have noticed, so I like to cover a lot of different topics. | |
| It's also part of the Gemini mind because we're like, you know, butterflies flying everywhere. | |
| So I think I would get bored if I only did the one thing. | |
| Plus, of course, I think if you only talk about one topic, then you're going to be really hard-pressed to find quality guests on that one topic all the time. | |
| You know, that's just a little logistical practical thing. | |
| Speaking now as somebody who's booking these podcasts as well as actually producing them, you know, that becomes very difficult. | |
| But overlying that and overriding that is the fact that I just love to talk about a lot of different things because I love to learn stuff. | |
| Maybe you're the same too. | |
| Maybe that's why we found each other, hey? | |
| Okay, I think I've said everything that has to be said. | |
| Time for me to shut up and we'll talk with Toronto-based Leslie Mitchell Clark about hypnotherapeutic regression and people who believe that they have had contact with aliens, ETs, or other strange phenomena. | |
| Leslie Mitchell Clark, thank you very much for coming on my show. | |
| I am absolutely delighted to be here, Howard. | |
| Thank you so much for asking me. | |
| And it's always such a joy to touch base with our British cousins from here in Canada. | |
| Well, of course, we share a queen, don't we? | |
| So we're. | |
| Yes, we do. | |
| And, you know, God bless her. | |
| I saw a picture of her today greeting Trudeau, our wonderful prime minister. | |
| And there she was. | |
| And she, you know, although she can't say political things really, she had a huge floral display in the colors of the Ukraine. | |
| And she was wearing a dress that was blue and yellow. | |
| And she manages to, when all around her are going off the path, she always manages to stay dignified and on message. | |
| And listen, I'm not a royalist or anything. | |
| I don't have any views about our royal family at all. | |
| I don't wave flags for them and I'm not against them. | |
| I just don't think about them. | |
| But I have to say that she manages to strike the right note. | |
| But listen, we're not here to talk about Her Majesty the Queen, who is now resident in Windsor Castle, not too far away from where I am. | |
| Now, let's talk about you then. | |
| Toronto-based Leslie Mitchell Clark, the biography starts with, so we've got that part right, we know. | |
| According to your Biography. | |
| You've done an awful lot of things, including acting and dancing and singing. | |
| Yes, yes. | |
| What brings you here? | |
| What brings you to the stuff that we are going to discuss when you've been an actor, singer? | |
| I mean, you've been a lot of things, let's face it. | |
| Yes, well, you know, this, it sounds exhausting when we look at it that way. | |
| I feel like the goddess Shiva or something with all those arms, but no, no, no. | |
| Well, what actually, I still work as an actor. | |
| It's just, you know, now I'm an old lady, so there are less parts. | |
| I still sing in jazz clubs here. | |
| So I still do the creative things that I love. | |
| But my primary focus, my raison d'être, my thing is being the best possible hypnotherapist that I can be with a specialty in working in regression. | |
| Now, the way this all came about, just very briefly, is I had a kind of a midlife crisis, I guess you would call it, and women have them too. | |
| I didn't get a mistress in a red sports car, but a red sports car. | |
| Can I just say neither did I? | |
| But there we go. | |
| You showed remarkable restraint. | |
| But anyway, what did happen is I was looking for a deeper meaning. | |
| Now, I had in my life and in my work, and I had had, I should say, you know, experiences that fall into the realm of high strangeness a number of times in my life. | |
| And so this was always, this kind of work was always of tremendous interest to me. | |
| So I was just, you know, I was just mucking about and moping. | |
| And my husband said, God bless him. | |
| He said, you know what, I think you need some direction here. | |
| I'm going to get you a past life regression. | |
| And I thought, great, I've never been undergone hypnosis. | |
| This sounds fantastic. | |
| So he did. | |
| And I went to see a lovely lady. | |
| And yes, the experience of the past life regression was incredibly insightful and encouraging and fascinating. | |
| But the biggest part that I took away from that is I realized, I can do this. | |
| This is exactly what I have been looking for. | |
| I know how to do this. | |
| Maybe I did it in the past life. | |
| But at any rate, not too long after that, I took the necessary additional training to become certified actually globally. | |
| And within a few short weeks, I have to say, of being really legally able to practice, people began reaching out to me who had had experiences of high strangeness, most particularly to do with ET encounters or interdimensional encounters, encounters of some sort. | |
| So these individuals, either they were being referred by other practitioners or, you know, they started just coming to me. | |
| And by that time, I had already, you know, been certified in past life regressions and inter-life regressions. | |
| Now, I didn't, you know, reinvent the wheel. | |
| I want to give all the credit of my particular process to my wonderful teacher, Dr. Georgina Cannon, who is a foremost, not to be confused with the late, great Dolores Cannon, but Georgina Cannon is a worldwide known expert in past life regression, the author of many books. | |
| So she was my teacher and mentor, not only for my basic hypnosis certification, but also for my, you know, my specified training, my specific training in past life regression. | |
| So when these wonderful people, these marvelous experiencers began to sort of seek me out, I simply adapted correct regression protocol to adapt to this specific type of exploration, I would have to say. | |
| Okay, now we talked on this show, you won't know this, but we talked with a man called Jim Alexander about hypnotic regression a lot a few weeks ago. | |
| So I don't really want to dwell too much about that because we did examine that pretty intensively. | |
| Okay. | |
| But I think the connection between regressing people and then people, you say, contacting you and saying, look, I've had an experience, I was taken aboard a spacecraft or whatever it might be, or I've been in contact with beings that I can't adequately describe and I need to be able to explore this more deeply. | |
| How did that happen for you? | |
| Why do you think they were coming to you? | |
| I think everything is vibration. | |
| I really, really do, Howard. | |
| I think everything is vibration. | |
| And I think that I have finally found the thing that was my calling, in a sense. | |
| You know, I refer to people like myself, whether they're male or female. | |
| You know, I call us midwives of disclosure. | |
| We are here to assist the disclosure movement one person at a time by helping them to integrate their memories and experiences into this, you know, into the third density, into the timeline that we're all accepting here. | |
| So that, in fact, is my, you know, complete focus, doing that kind of work. | |
| I just want to ask you one quick thing, and it's nothing to do with any of your work. | |
| Do you have a fan or something like that running in the background? | |
| Because there's a buzzing noise like Main's hum. | |
| Nothing what. | |
| It is absolutely silent in here. | |
| There is no sound that I can hear at all. | |
| Oh, maybe it's the aliens. | |
| I don't know whether they're... | |
| In fact, there are a few people that every time I get on the media with them, Every time we jump onto the interweb, some kind of bizarre thing occurs that interrupts transmission, so to speak. | |
| So, you know, I'm not a paranoid person at all. | |
| My life is an open book, but I do think that people like yourself and myself are of interest. | |
| Now, we have to be responsible when we talk about these things. | |
| I wouldn't want to do it any other way. | |
| And just as I've spoken with people who do exorcisms in the past, many of them, and some of the details of those are fascinating and chilling, one of the main things that you have to do, one of the prerequisites for being able to do that, and I suspect it may be the same for what you do, is that you have to be very, very circumspect, that you're sure the person coming to you does not have other issues that they really need to be seeing their medical doctor about. | |
| In other words, you need to be sure that they don't have mental issues going on that are making them think that they're having these experiences. | |
| How can you know that? | |
| Well, for one thing, I'm quite blessed in the fact that in my very early life, I put myself through university by working on the graveyard shift in a state mental hospital. | |
| And I became a psychiatric aide and then a psychiatric technician. | |
| So I do have a lot of experience in dealing with what I would call, you know, severe mental illness, witnessing it, seeing it. | |
| And in those days, we didn't really even have proper medications. | |
| You know, antidepressants were a little ways off. | |
| So these people were largely unmedicated, which is often when someone does come to me for this type of process, I go through a very lengthy intake. | |
| I will, first of all, I will talk to them on the phone for a good long time and I ask them a lot of questions. | |
| And 99.9% of the time, if the person is struggling with mental health issues as opposed to just an esoteric experience that hasn't come into focus, most of the time I am able to determine that very early on. | |
| Most of the time. | |
| So most of the time, and I'll tell you about two times I screwed up in just a second. | |
| But so in a circumstance like that, where someone has contacted me and clearly needs more help than I can provide in the scope of my practice, I have a whole list of colleagues who are psychotherapists, psychologists, psychiatrists who have an interest in this type of subject matter and will see these people and treat them in whatever way they need to be treated medically. | |
| So I don't just leave the poor person hanging there. | |
| But there have been two times when I was completely fooled. | |
| And one of them happened maybe only about five years ago. | |
| Of course, I've been doing this kind of work for years by then. | |
| So a gentleman met me. | |
| We didn't meet each other purposefully, but he was at a experiencers group in Toronto that I was attending to speak. | |
| I think I was speaking for them or at them or with them. | |
| I don't know. | |
| Anyway, he expressed to me that he wanted to, you know, he wanted to come and see me for a regression. | |
| And in this case, I believe it was supposed to be more of a past life regression. | |
| But again, he believed that he had had ET encounters in this life and other lives. | |
| So I did do a long phone intake, and he was very glib. | |
| And I now know, you know, he said all the right things. | |
| There are very mentally ill people who are called test proof. | |
| And that means that they have such, they're able to hold it together so effectively for a short period of time that they can mimic, you know, sane behavior for isolated periods of time. | |
| So the guy came to my office and got in my chair and I put him into trance and all of a sudden he starts groaning and writhing and screaming and carrying on. | |
| And of course I'm completely startled. | |
| You know, my thing is not for people to experience pain. | |
| And if he's experiencing pain, I have to turn him into an observer. | |
| I have to get him out of that. | |
| He wasn't responding to my suggestions. | |
| Again, suspicious. | |
| And so this kind of thing went on for a while. | |
| And then he started speaking in some kind of a nonsense language, Longolalia, you know, not unlike those, what do they call them, those evangelical Christians who get themselves all hyped up on adrenaline and start babbling. | |
| You know what I mean? | |
| It was like that. | |
| It was not a, I'm familiar enough with Middle Eastern languages. | |
| I speak a few languages. | |
| There was not anything recognizable to me. | |
| So that went on for a while. | |
| Then more writhing and screaming. | |
| And at that point, I just gave up. | |
| And I let him come out of his, whatever it was, when he was ready to. | |
| And he did come out of his state, and he explained to me that he gave birth to a dragon in my office. | |
| So that was his explanation for the experience. | |
| But I'm not sure what his motive. | |
| He was obviously unstable. | |
| I'm not sure what his motivation was. | |
| Were you able to get him helped? | |
| You know, having discovered what you discovered, were you able to get that man helped? | |
| This man was resistant to anything like that that I offered. | |
| And he, in fact, I'm not revealing his name. | |
| He, in fact, runs workshops. | |
| Well, let's not. | |
| Yeah, I don't think we want to say anything that would identify Roger. | |
| No, no, no, you won't be able to. | |
| I was going to say in a certain area of the United States, he's doing something that is probably not very kosher. | |
| And so that was one of the times that that happened. | |
| I had Another time where I did not actually do the intake for this particular client. | |
| I was working in a clinic and I was just assigned her. | |
| And this poor girl was very ill, some type of schizophrenia, I believe. | |
| And I didn't actually put her in hypnosis because that would be illegal. | |
| That's part of the thing here with the scope of my treatment. | |
| If I were to treat someone who had been diagnosed with a mental illness, that's the key, diagnosed, then I would be doing something highly illegal. | |
| But I guess, I mean, we don't want to belabor this point because it's not what we're here to talk about principally, but I guess it's always going to be hard for you to know, isn't it, if they don't bring their medical records with them? | |
| How can you know anything? | |
| Well, you know, I do know an awful lot about psychotropic medication. | |
| So one thing that I insist upon is, well, people conceal, they will conceal their psychiatric history. | |
| And so in that sense, you have a very clear point. | |
| I don't always have verifiable information. | |
| So I would have to say that aside from all the efforts I go to, the main factor here is my intuition, my experience, the subtleties. | |
| I also work in NLP. | |
| I'm a neuro-linguistic programmer. | |
| So if I have to meet someone face to face, they tell me a million things with their facial expressions. | |
| So I do rely on my own experience and gut instinct. | |
| And if I have one shred of a doubt, I do not take them on. | |
| How many of these cases of contactees or abductees or experiences, how many of those do you think you've handled? | |
| Oh, it has to be thousands now. | |
| It has to be. | |
| I have been working in this area for very close to 20 years, and I am also within the United States. | |
| I am also part of Kathleen Martin's Experiencer Research Project, which is operated under the auspices of MUFON, MUFON U.S. So I am referred, not only do I have my own clients coming in, but I am referred clients who have already made a report to MUFON. | |
| And that MUFON investigator has decided that it would be a good thing to pursue a regression. | |
| So also in that case, I'm almost always assured that the people coming to me have been properly vetted and I'll be able to work with them. | |
| Right. | |
| So there's a kind of pre-screening process. | |
| I mean, I know Catherine and Martin very well. | |
| We've spoken many, many times over the years. | |
| And of course, the Betty and Barney Hill story is the story to end all stories. | |
| And of course, as you know, both of them had hypnotic regression to try and understand the experience that they went through. | |
| In your case, when you get a client, when you get somebody get in touch with you and say, look, I think I've had this. | |
| It's bugging me. | |
| I've only got partial recall and I want to know exactly what happened for the obvious reason that it is said that if you re-experience it, if you go into it, then maybe you can transcend it, I guess. | |
| Talk to me about the stages. | |
| What happens? | |
| So they come into your practice room or whatever it is, and you put them under the fluence. | |
| What happens in the case of somebody who's had an experience of something that they think might be extraterrestrial? | |
| What are the stages? | |
| What happens? | |
| Well, this can work in several different ways. | |
| Now, like Kathy Martin, a thing I didn't mention, somebody has to have at least partial memory of an experience for me to take them on. | |
| Okay, so it can go one of two ways. | |
| Now, sometimes we will go directly to the experience for which the individual has come to see me and explore that together. | |
| More commonly, and part of inducting someone into a regression state is, you know, before we move into any other lifetimes or suppressed experiences, I move someone around in their own life. | |
| It's kind of a way of oiling the machine in a sense to get that kind of memory working and allowable. | |
| So I move them around in their own life. | |
| And sometimes if I'm seeing evidence or if I have suspicions that this person, individual, may be a lifelong experiencer, I may initially induct them into the first experience that they ever had with something that was unusual or different or frightening. | |
| And I leave it open. | |
| You know, I have to be very vanilla. | |
| I can't put anything in anybody's mind because, you know, hypnotists don't like to talk about this, but the client always wants to please you. | |
| So, you know, we must be very, very careful and completely vanilla about what we say. | |
| So I will either, you know, direct someone back towards their earliest experience and then move them forward in their timeline, or I may go directly to the experience of concern and then after that, move them back in the timeline to find out when these experiencers, when these experiences rather, begin. | |
| And I will, I'll tell you, Howard, I don't really believe there is such a thing as someone who has had only one experience. | |
| If experiencers remember something like boarding a craft, the odds are very, very high that they have been involved with this phenomena since possibly the age of three. | |
| And do you think that goes for some of the memorable and most famous cases like Travis Walton, who I've spoken with many times, and Calvin Parker, who is back in the news, who seems to me to be a very sincere man? | |
| Do you think that in those cases that are famous and well-known, those people may have had Experiences perhaps through their lives? | |
| I actually do. | |
| Well, in the case of Travis Walton, we actually had a chat about that. | |
| And he said that now, at this point in his life, he's actually beginning to have some flashes, or he believes that there have been previous incidents. | |
| Now, on the other hand, it's certainly, you know, the Travis Walton experience certainly looks like a wrong place, wrong time type of situation if you look at the facts. | |
| But on the other hand, it's also Travis's opinion, and this is as he expressed to me, that the beings that were, you know, operating the craft that took him aboard were trying to save his life, not to harm him. | |
| And that he had fallen so far in that beam of light, that tractor beam, if you will, that his injuries were severe and he feels he died and that they reanimated him. | |
| So I think in the fullness of time now, also, Kathy Mardin, I asked her that very question, did Betty or Barney ever have previous experiences? | |
| And Kathy said that Betty had, and Kathy herself is an experiencer, which goes in line with the following of the matrilineal lines. | |
| So my opinion would have to be that these people were incredibly truthful. | |
| And although I don't believe Barney did, and he was the one that really suffered, he was like a broken man. | |
| He never got over it. | |
| But Betty, who was, I think that she had had experiencers before in her life that were profound. | |
| So you think that in most cases, certainly in very many cases, the experiences start young, perhaps. | |
| They go throughout life, even if they're not recalled. | |
| And there are familial connections. | |
| In other words, if it's happened to you, then the chances are it's happened to your sister. | |
| Well, yes, and I think this comes down to, you know, maybe one of the big questions. | |
| What are they looking for? | |
| Why have they been taking us? | |
| Aside from, you know, the obvious situation with the post-war Greys taking a lot of DNA material, aside from that, why are they here? | |
| My feeling is that they follow genetic lines to look for psychic ability, which makes it simply easier to communicate with human beings who can bilocate, astroproject, and also communicate telepathically. | |
| Why would they be looking for that kind of person then? | |
| Somebody with psychic ability. | |
| I think everybody has a bit of it. | |
| Some people have more attuned psychic ability. | |
| I think I've got some, but it's not as attuned as it might be. | |
| But they're looking for particular people? | |
| I think it's all about communication, all about ease of communication. | |
| And it may even be about arrangements that we've made in the interlife before we came into this physical lifetime, that we would come in with some strong psychic DNA to do the work we need to do. | |
| So I do think that that largely is what they are looking for. | |
| Now, I mean, imagine this. | |
| Say you're Jane Goodall and you're, you know, down in the subcontinent and she comes across a group of simian beings never before seen. | |
| And three of these beings have developed an epiglottal situation that's humanoid and they can actually make words. | |
| Now, wouldn't you, if you were studying these beings, wouldn't you spend most of your time focused on the beings that had jumped up a little bit on the evolutionary scale and could actually form words? | |
| I think it's a little bit like that. | |
| Okay, so they're selective. | |
| Now, look, we've talked about they, but from what we know, certainly from many of the interviews that I've done, there are many gradations and kinds and species, you know, types and stripes of aliens. | |
| You've got the greys who are sometimes described as being robotic somewhat, and then other creatures and beings. | |
| So what do your explorations into the psyches of various clients, what do they tell you about who's out there? | |
| There are a plethora of beings out there that are engaging regularly, not only with humanoids on this planet, but also engaging with governments. | |
| And in fact, I don't know if you, do you recall ever hearing about Paul Hellier? | |
| He was a wonderful man. | |
| He passed away not too long ago. | |
| Yes, are you Paul Hellier? | |
| Yes. | |
| Oh, okay. | |
| Well, he was, for those not in the know, I mean, he was at one time the Minister of Defense of Canada for some years, and he was also Premier of Ontario. | |
| So he was a politico and a wonderful man. | |
| Now, he told me not long before he passed that to his knowledge, the Canadian government was dealing, had diplomatic relations, I mean, you know, contracts, this, that, and the other, with at least 80 different species is what he told me. | |
| Now he's a very interesting. | |
| I interviewed him many times. | |
| He didn't say anything like that to me. | |
| I mean, he said a lot of fascinating things over the years. | |
| I first spoke with him in 2005 and last spoke with him, I think, a year or so before he sadly left us. | |
| I mean, did he know that because he'd be, and we often had that issue when I spoke with Paul Hellier, did he know that because he'd been told that or read that, or did he know that because he'd actually experienced that in government? | |
| He was talking about his time in government, that he had experienced it and had knowledge of it. | |
| That's what he told me. | |
| And that was probably, it could have been as little as a month before he passed. | |
| He was getting much more, I don't know if bolder is the right word, but I think he was becoming frustrated that, you know, we weren't waking up and taking care of our own planet and fixing our economics. | |
| And he was frustrated about a lot of things. | |
| And so did he Tell you? | |
| I'm sorry to, you know, I mean, we can't dwell on this for too long, but it is interesting. | |
| Did he tell you that Canada was having dealings with extraterrestrial species? | |
| That's exactly what he meant. | |
| He said, Canada, our government, our Canadian government, right now, and I'm talking about just before he died, right now have diplomatic relations and are engaging with at least 80 species. | |
| It's a shame he's not around now because it would have been nice to ask him why some of those 80 species don't intervene in the dreadful, powerless state the world finds it in at the moment. | |
| Well, you know, how do we know they're not in many ways? | |
| How do we know then? | |
| We don't really know. | |
| And I think, you know, I think it's really from what I have heard and gathered from all these many communications from all these different species that are, you know, some of them genetically related to us, some of them not so much. | |
| But the message remains, clean up your own backyard. | |
| You know, this is our responsibility. | |
| We have been given choices to feed the hungry and stop war. | |
| And until more of us are in that vibration than less of us, you know, these things are going to be horrific. | |
| And I think that we are experiencing now some type of a polarization of the unenlightened and the enlightened. | |
| Well, I suspect there might be many people who would agree with you when you say that. | |
| Okay, so many different species of aliens, and presumably they present themselves within the recollections of those people you deal with. | |
| Are they all benign? | |
| Do they all care about us? | |
| Well, you know, we've got a number of things. | |
| I believe that there are a number of different things that are going on simultaneously. | |
| I think there are interdimensional beings that may only communicate through astral projection or sending themselves holographically, if you will. | |
| There are reptilian species, some of which are benign, some of which aren't. | |
| There are a lot of different agendas that seem to be going on. | |
| But I think an important thing to remember is that the beings in our corner of the galaxy don't seem to be too far out. | |
| I mean, they're bipedal, you know, heads, arms, you know, that kind of thing, and variations within that spectrum. | |
| Many of the people that I work with, I will say many because it is a high number, many of the people that I work with have regular contact with beings that are quite humanoid, which would come from the Liran system. | |
| And that would include, of course, Arcturians and Pleiadians. | |
| And these beings are, in fact, quite genetically related to us, whether it was through panspermia or through the Anunnaki, who were also Lirans, who knows? | |
| But at any rate, that's a big part of the thing. | |
| Now, there are also beings that seem to show up when there are genetics and medical experiments going on. | |
| And in fact, I've worked with many people who, when they were children, not that anything painful happened, when they were children, they will talk about the brown doctors. | |
| And I was later to find out that there is, you know, there is a group of reptilian beings that are known as the master geneticists. | |
| And they often engage with the children. | |
| And they're also very gentle and loving, but they don't let them see them. | |
| They don't want to frighten them. | |
| You know, there's, boy, there's a lot of stories that I could tell you about the experiences that children have when they are taken. | |
| So we have all that going on. | |
| And I'm almost afraid to mention this, but I must because it's such a, there's so much of it going on right now in my practice. | |
| I am now encountering many, many clients who have participated in some form in what we would call the secret space program or the black ops. | |
| I'm glad you got to that because I have spoken with at least two people over the years on this show who absolutely swear me, you know, intelligent people, people you could have a perfectly rational conversation with, people you could, as we say here in the UK, go down the pub with, | |
| you know, have a beer with, who swear absolutely that they've been members of a secret space program that saw them taken as young people, put into service effectively, going to Mars and places like that, serving on freighters, traversing between the planets and all those sorts of things, and then eventually return to Earth and their regular existence, perhaps after a period of 15, 20 years. | |
| But when they get returned, no time has elapsed. | |
| And I always think those people sound very credible the way they tell the story, but the amount of email I get from people saying, how could you put somebody like that on your show? | |
| That account is so crazy. | |
| So what do you have to say about that? | |
| Well, I think we have to open our minds. | |
| First of all, we received a lot of tech from ETs over the years, particularly in the post-Roswell period. | |
| We have had the ability to move about in time and mess about with time for, you know, since the early 60s, the Montauk chair, the Philadelphia experiment. | |
| All of those things were about time travel. | |
| Are we still doing that? | |
| Oh, I think we have it together. | |
| I think we regularly are functioning as chrononauts. | |
| And so what we're talking about is what's referred to as the 20 and back. | |
| And what happens is an individual is focused on or found, if you will, as a young child. | |
| Now, Randy Kramer believes, Captain Randy Kramer believes that he was even, his gestation was even enhanced when he was being carried in utero by his mother. | |
| So he feels that there were already interventions going on before he was even born. | |
| And that may in fact be a reality. | |
| We have that technology. | |
| And I would also want to point out that a very high number of the individuals who have experienced the SSP were from military families. | |
| So there was access, access to them, right? | |
| And who was it who just told me? | |
| One of the experiencers just told me, well, they would, you know, they would sometimes, what would happen in school is like a limo would just pull up and they would be called out of class and get in the limo and go and train and whatever and then they'd be put back right in their class as if as if no time had ever had ever passed. | |
| So fiddling about with time, it's a given. | |
| We have the technology. | |
| We've had it for a long time. | |
| It's unfortunately being utilized primarily for military, what I would call military purposes. | |
| And what do you understand the secret space program to be, Leslie? | |
| Do you believe it's some kind of collaborative effort with the alphabet agencies in the United States? | |
| What exactly is it, do you think, from what you see? | |
| Well, I think we have to kind of take just a very quick look at the beginning of it to really understand how it got so out of control. | |
| You know the Roswell crash, of course. | |
| It wasn't one crash. | |
| It was actually three crashes. | |
| There were survivors. | |
| They were a type of gray. | |
| They were Zeta reticulites, the same beings that kidnapped Betty and Barney Hill. | |
| That's what they were. | |
| There were survivors. | |
| They made a deal with the then Truman White House. | |
| Again, this is the post-war period. | |
| And Truman made an agreement with these particular beings that in exchange for some technology that we could handle, we would allow them to harvest genetic material from a small amount of, you know, Earth citizens, or I guess it was U.S. citizens in that time. | |
| I really can't be sure because I think this is something that has happened in every country. | |
| Are you talking harvesting or interbreeding? | |
| I'm talking about taking all of it, but not usually through sex, as we would know it, by taking OVA and sperm and sometimes inseminating human women with hybrid babies and then removing them. | |
| And, you know, all of this stuff went on, but it's now that kind of thing is no longer happening because that agreement ran out of time and it was honored by the ETs. | |
| Anyway, so with the technology that we were given, it was a kind of a divide and conquer thing where, you know, say, you know, you guys at the Hughes Skunk Work, you know, your Skunk Works that you own. | |
| You guys at the Hughes Skunk Work, you take fiber optics. | |
| You guys over here, you know, you take Velcro. | |
| You guys here, you take integrated circuits. | |
| So that's how it was, and it was all under the newly created governmental, no, military department of foreign technology. | |
| That's what it was called. | |
| And that's how this all began, the decision to make the relations with the ETs secret. | |
| And that is ground zero for what we are dealing with today. | |
| And now we know there are trillions of dollars missing from the United States Treasury that has gone into these programs. | |
| Now, I'm not paranoid. | |
| I just think people are doing what they do. | |
| These people believe, the government believed there was a threat. | |
| Maybe there were threats. | |
| Maybe there weren't. | |
| But that was the thing that I think incited all of this. | |
| And now when we talk about 20 and back, and I don't know if you've ever had Captain Randy Kramer on your program, but you sure should. | |
| Two years ago. | |
| Okay. | |
| So Randy talked about when he first signed up for a stint after his long cadet ship. | |
| You know, you're offered some paperwork when you're 17 or whatever. | |
| And he said you come on board with three cloned bodies of yourself to be used for spare parts and one to have your essence or your intelligence or maybe your soul, you know, inserted into that third cloned body for your return, which stays young. | |
| And he described to me the process of removing a kind of a fluid where our soul, if you will, and our intelligence actually is contained. | |
| So you had a conversation with him, you didn't regress him. | |
| Is that right? | |
| No, Randy has undergone quite a bit of regression, but some time before I actually knew him. | |
| Okay. | |
| In a case where somebody that you have dealt with personally says that they've been part of the secret space program, what sorts of things do they tell you? | |
| Is it all very much in accord with what Randy Kramer says? | |
| Well, I would have to say yes and no because people have such very different experiences. | |
| There are so many programs and special task forces and this, that, and the other. | |
| You know, Randy's experience was about being kind of physically superior. | |
| He's a big, I think he's about 6'5. | |
| I can see, and he was like a pilot and was engaged in military conflict. | |
| You know, he'll tell you about all that. | |
| But some of the people that I deal with, in fact, there's this lovely young woman who, of course, you know, has all of the markers of having passed through the training and lifelong experiencer and her job now in because I must say, I must tell you that a lot of What happens after midlife happens through astral projection, if you wish to call her by location. | |
| So now she works, after having fulfilled her stint, she works in a kind of a research lab caring for and researching unusual animals from all over the galaxy and the universe. | |
| So some people are working with children, helping them to develop their psychic abilities by teaching them how to move objects and do all kinds of other things. | |
| There are a lot of very advanced, there's a lot of very advanced training technology that is on these various space stations. | |
| There are quite a few of them where these trainings go on, as I have been told. | |
| And again, I am simply repeating what I hear, what I hear. | |
| Have you ever wondered, though, you know, these days, we have things like the James Webb Space Telescope that is getting into gear at the moment. | |
| You know, they're doing exercises with it. | |
| It's going to be an amazing tool. | |
| But we have a lot of technology that probes the cosmos. | |
| Have you ever wondered why none of these things that people who say that they've been in the secret space program have used and experienced, why we never see any of them? | |
| Well, I think that all of the evolved species are very expert at adjusting their vibrations so that they will pass right out of our field of vision, either our technological field of vision or our human field of vision. | |
| I think that I've actually had worlds described to me. | |
| They say, well, we're in your galaxy, but we're operating under this different operating system, so we can't be perceived in your dense reality. | |
| So I think we have to open up our minds a little bit and kind of put aside for just a moment that our third density, our literal reality, is the only type of operating system that exists in the universe. | |
| What's the strangest story you've ever been told? | |
| The one that, you know, really made your eyebrows, pardon me, your eyebrows stand up. | |
| Oh, boy. | |
| Wow. | |
| There's so many. | |
| I think that one of the strange, well, the most disturbing things, if I can't say the strangest, I'll say one of the most disturbing things that I ever hear about are not things that are being done by ETs on their craft, but things that are happening to individuals in these collaborative ET military programs where the agenda is not quite so clear. | |
| Now, not now, this isn't happening now, but one of my clients, and I'd have to say, this gentleman has come a long way, and it's my job to integrate these experiences into the present day life so that the person can function. | |
| And some of these experiences that this individual has had are so horrifying. | |
| Now, kind of like Randy Kramer, this gentleman was really just trained for pilot, pilot stuff. | |
| Now, I don't know why that was decided. | |
| Those were always the exercises from the time that he was being taken as a little guy on through. | |
| It was always focused on that and learning to fly craft that were really controlled mentally. | |
| That's kind of the key. | |
| There's no steering wheel, there's no gas pedal, there's no calm, you know, like on Star Trek. | |
| You put your hands into a, you know, space for your hands, and then you communicate psychically with the, you interface with the software. | |
| Now, when he was about five or six, they began a torturous process where they were attempting to fracture his personality so that they would have an aspect of him that they could control. | |
| Kind of like a simulated schizophrenia, if that makes any sense, a fractured personality. | |
| So this was done through horrific torture and pain. | |
| And the levels of pain would be so high and the trauma so deep that eventually these little people, these five, six-year-olds, their personalities would fracture and they would start controlling two aspects of one person. | |
| Now, I have no idea how this is really done. | |
| I cannot, because the people that I work with don't really know how it's done, except that it gets done. | |
| And this same individual, as a grown-up, you know, soldier working in the SSP, had the unique ability to separate or astro project that aspect of himself, which had a whole nother name, by the way. | |
| And that aspect of himself would be made to go spy on individuals, possibly cause heart attacks, every kind of funky military thing that you can think of that, you know, every James Bond film, anything you can think of, that's the kind of stuff that was going on. | |
| So they had taken mentally healthy individuals and at the age of five, six, seven, they tortured them and traumatized them into a synthetic personality split. | |
| And then somehow that new identity that had been created was able to be controlled psionically in some way by the military or the powers that be. | |
| Now, I know it sounds fantastic. | |
| I know of nothing that could do that, that's involving hypnosis. | |
| It had to be some type of horrible combination of bizarre stuff. | |
| And this did not happen to Randy Kramer, by the way. | |
| This thing that I'm describing did not happen to him. | |
| But I have heard it described by others that I have been working with. | |
| So what we're saying is that there are many, many levels to these things. | |
| Yes. | |
| Yes. | |
| So it makes you wonder, though, doesn't it? | |
| You must have asked, I don't know whether you can ask these things in a hypnotic state, whether the people who have been involved in this program or series of programs have ever been given an idea of why they were selected, what the final mission might be, what the end game is, that kind of thing. | |
| Well, they all would tell you that they were chosen for their unique abilities. | |
| They would tell you that they were chosen to do that work. | |
| And some of them might tell you that in past life or interlife regressions, they have actually planned to be here and to participate in the uplifting of humanity. | |
| That is mostly what we hear about ET encounters. | |
| Now, the military thing is always vague. | |
| And another thing that Paul Hellier did tell me is he said he didn't think that there was a government on the planet that wasn't involved in some way in the secret space program. | |
| So this is a global thing. | |
| It's not just the U.S. or just Canada. | |
| You've got all kinds of stuff going on in the U.K., as I'm sure you well know. | |
| Oh, indeed. | |
| My goodness, you know, from Randall Shimon, I mean, I think there are portals there. | |
| There are vortices there. | |
| The UK is so active. | |
| So, you know, we have a variety, as I said when we first started talking, we have a number of things going on, and sometimes it's not easy for me to untangle it, but eventually I do. | |
| And one thing I wanted to mention, and this is something that I think maybe I kind of discovered in a way, just from the volume of the people that I get to work with, it seems that in midlife, | |
| the experiences that these individuals are having become no longer densely physical, they become by location or astral projection. | |
| So in this way, experiencers are really working 24-7 and they're working on collaborative programs. | |
| And in the ideal sense, there is a kind of a Gene Roddenberry United Federation of Planets. | |
| There is an organization in which we are not yet ready to join. | |
| But these are the beings that have at times disarmed our nukes. | |
| Especially that's happened in the U.S. I'm not sure about anywhere else, but that has happened. | |
| Well, I mean, that's an awful lot to take in, isn't it? | |
| It is. | |
| It also makes you question whether there are bad guys, because we're being told by some people in the ufological field that there is some kind of war in heaven going on, to put it bluntly and crudely, that there are different species who are battling it out over us, and we've got the ones who are protecting us, maybe even sometimes protecting us from ourselves, but certainly protecting us from other species of ETs who perhaps haven't got our best interests at heart. | |
| Do you get any evidence through the recollections of people on the table or in the chair, wherever they might be? | |
| Do you get any evidence that that kind of thing is going on? | |
| Well, I'm not sure that dark-intentioned ETs spend a whole lot of time examining us and wanting to work with us. | |
| You know what I mean? | |
| I think that's probably why, aside from the horrible genetic material harvesting of the 50s, 60s, and 70s, and 80s, I don't think that negative-based entities are that interested in engaging with us in the same way that beings who care about us, who we have a genetic relationship to, might be. | |
| Now, I have a hard time really getting on board with any fear-mongering, and I think that these ideas of good and evil, I mean, they're very cinematic, but I don't think it's quite that simple. | |
| I think life exterior to the earth is very, very similar to life on the earth. | |
| There are good people, there are negative people, there are lazy people, there are hilarious people. | |
| I think that as above, so below. | |
| And what I hear is we are our own worst enemies. | |
| I don't think we need any, you know, any, you know, what was I going to say, any reptilians, you know, who may or may not be the royal family. | |
| Oh, gosh, that's one I love, right? | |
| You know, I think that that is, I think that's fantasy. | |
| I think we're very creative people. | |
| I think human beings are extremely creative, and so many things get enhanced. | |
| But I think we have to just take responsibility. | |
| We need to take responsibility for what we have created, for how we have allowed greed to dominate us. | |
| And there have been many accounts of, for instance, I'm sure you've had people on your program speak about the time of Valiant Thor, who was a gentle Venusian being who came. | |
| Supposedly a UN ambassador, I think. | |
| Yes, yes, and came as a guest and was here for four or five years during the Eisenhower years. | |
| And Valiant Thor did everything he could do to try to make us understand how we had to Fix the economy, we had to get rid of fossil fuels, we had to, you know, all of these advanced concepts that now don't seem really overly advanced at all. | |
| But this was the message, and Valiant Thor just met with so much resistance. | |
| And they just said, no, no, if we do this, the economy will fail. | |
| And it was, no, it won't. | |
| There will be other jobs. | |
| But, you know, it didn't happen. | |
| So I think there have been many, many attempts to help us directly. | |
| But I think to a certain extent, you know, the evolved beings have become frustrated with us. | |
| So my feeling now is that disclosure is a grassroots event and is happening, but it's happening kind of person by person. | |
| But we now estimate that, well, I mean, I think as far as MUFON and active reports, I think we have over 14 million reports of encounters, and that's more than the population of New York City. | |
| But there's a lot of encounters, isn't it? | |
| I know. | |
| But the estimates are even higher. | |
| There are some, I have been told through beings speaking through my clients that as many as three quarters of the people in the world have had some type of contact. | |
| Do you ever ask any of the beings who speak through clients to give you a piece of information that would prove that they exist? | |
| In other words, for them to say, well, look, we left a little piece of our spacecraft. | |
| I know this sounds crazy, but you know, in a park in Washington, D.C., and it's under this tree, and, you know, it's there for us to call on at any time. | |
| You know, do you ever try and do that? | |
| Because you would have the greatest story ever told if you did. | |
| I know, no kidding. | |
| What I do, though, is I set up the person that I'm working with to have open and free communication with the beings they engage with, and I encourage them to do something like that. | |
| But that's all I can do is make us, because it's not really between the beings and myself, you see. | |
| I'm a guide. | |
| I'm an extra. | |
| You know, I'm not the one who has been chosen for these types of tasks and such. | |
| So I feel that something like that, which would be magnificent, I always encourage to the experiencer, but I don't set it up in that way because it doesn't feel appropriate to me. | |
| We're coming to the end of this. | |
| The mind is an amazing thing, isn't it? | |
| The human mind is, what is it? | |
| Unto me, I'm trying to, there was a quote from literature, my mind to me a kingdom is. | |
| And I thought that was a bit of Thomas Hardy, I think. | |
| Yes, yes. | |
| And I've never forgotten that. | |
| My mind to me a kingdom is. | |
| And it is. | |
| You know, we are capable of so many things. | |
| And the reason I say this is that, you know, during this COVID period, a lot of stress everybody's under. | |
| I'm under a lot of stress. | |
| And I'm back to having dreams all the time. | |
| Dreams, dreams, dreams. | |
| I keep having dreams about a place that I didn't work at for very long in Birmingham. | |
| I was only there for three months and then I was poached to work in London. | |
| But it was a radio station called BRMB. | |
| A lot of people listening to this, very big radio station in Birmingham in the Midlands. | |
| I was very happy there. | |
| I wasn't there for very long and then I was snatched away to work in London and the rest is history. | |
| I keep dreaming about it. | |
| But the dreams that I have, I go to buildings that that radio station was never at. | |
| I talk to colleagues who I've never met before. | |
| Everything goes wrong every time I do this in different ways. | |
| And I'm always driving to get to this place and I'm always late. | |
| And it's really realistic. | |
| So the point that I'm getting to in a roundabout way with my dream experience is how do you know that the psyche, the subconscious, whatever it might be of the people that you deal with are not creating scenarios like the ones that I have that when I'm dreaming them are real enough to make me wake up in a panic? | |
| Well, I would say, first of all, I would say what you are having is the equivalent of what I call the actor's dream. | |
| And it's based probably in just anxieties about life and work and the future. | |
| You know, for example, my dad, who was a very famous musician, he used to have the musician's dream. | |
| And he would have this, and it terrified him. | |
| It would start out where he was trying to find a record date, and he'd be driving around in Brooklyn, and he's late. | |
| And just like you said, one terrible thing after another happens. | |
| He knows he's supposed to show up at the Paramount Theater, which was one of the old theaters that had a rising pit, right? | |
| And he knows he's supposed to be there. | |
| He shows up. | |
| He can't find the basement. | |
| He finds the basement. | |
| He's in the wrong band jacket. | |
| And he just gets on the rising pit when he opens his bass case and his bass is in pieces. | |
| You know, we've all had these sorts of dreams. | |
| I sympathize with him enormously. | |
| But what I'm saying is that the ones that I've been having are so convoluted and they involve people that I don't know and places that I've never been and will never go, I don't think. | |
| So if I've created those from my subconscious, how do you know that those people are not creating the recollections of meeting other species from other places in the galaxy and all the rest of it? | |
| Because it's directed. | |
| What we're doing is very directed. | |
| And they are re-experiencing memories, not confabulations. | |
| And we make a big in the process of inducting these people into trance. | |
| And as I'm sure you've, you know, it's been told to you many times, if we can get the body relaxed enough, if we can get the body relaxed enough, that little membrane that separates the subconscious mind where all the behaviors are formed, all the memories are stored from the conscious mind where, you know, confabulation can occur. | |
| If we can talk directly to the subconscious mind, we're going to get the straight story. | |
| And It answered your question as far as proof of that thing. | |
| Now, there's been an awful lot of work done with wiring up people who have had past life regressions, who are having past life regressions to EEGs and such to study what's happening in the brain. | |
| And what they found with past life regression is that the parts of the brain that are firing are not the creative centers, not the speech centers. | |
| What's firing are the deep memory centers in the amygdala. | |
| So whatever's happening in regression, if a person, if a regressionist is skilled enough, we can guide the person to that very place where everything is stored and where they can have complete free access. | |
| So you're sure that you're accessing the repository of all things real and not the repository of fantasy. | |
| That's fascinating. | |
| I believe that. | |
| I believe that that has been proven by the real-time mapping of the brain. | |
| Last question then. | |
| What can we do about all of this? | |
| Do we need to do something? | |
| I think we need to simply open our minds and treat each other with love and decency and respect and eschew fear, stand up for what we believe in, and clean up our bloody planet. | |
| And by clean up, I mean depose dictators, feed the children, heal the sick. | |
| I think that rather than focusing on esoteric matters, I think we should just let ourselves be the best possible humans that we can. | |
| And our DNA is turning on. | |
| As you said, we have, you know, we had a kind of a DNA situation where a lot of it has been latent. | |
| And it is now starting to turn on. | |
| And as our vibration rises, I believe that as we take care of these social ills, as right now the whole world is showing compassion for the Ukraine and I can feel it. | |
| I don't know about you, but I can feel it. | |
| And these are the kinds of things, these are the kinds of loving things, caring for each other and the world around us that is going to naturally raise the vibration, which will make it easier for our space brothers and sisters to communicate with us. | |
| So you think that they want us to be our best selves? | |
| Yes, I do. | |
| And take responsibility. | |
| That's a nice point to leave it. | |
| I hope we've covered as much ground as we'd have liked to, Leslie Mitchell Clark. | |
| It's quite a topic, isn't it? | |
| If people want to read about you, I know that you have a website. | |
| What is it? | |
| Well, my website right now is having a facelift. | |
| Actually, I need a facelift, but I spent the money on the website first. | |
| It is lightworkhypnosis.com, and that's all one word. | |
| And if you want to reach me, I would love to hear from you, even if you just want to run your experience by me, if you've had one or if you have a question. | |
| Leslie L-E-S-L-E-Y, the female spelling, they have no trouble with that in Britain, by the way. | |
| Leslie L-E-S-L-E-Y at lightworkhypnosis.com. | |
| And I have a fairly new book. | |
| The most recent book is called Intersections, A True Story of Extraterrestrial Contact. | |
| And that is available on Amazon, wherever you Amazon. | |
| I don't have to say anything else. | |
| You've done it all. | |
| Leslie, thank you very much. | |
| Indeed, give my love to Toronto. | |
| I will. | |
| And I hope to see you over there for a ghost hunt or something fabulous. | |
| That would be nice. | |
| I'd love to come to Canada. | |
| When I was a kid, I used to listen to Radio Canada International. | |
| Oh, golly. | |
| Well, you still have to. | |
| World at six, and as it happens, which I think are both still running. | |
| They're still running. | |
| We never cancel anything. | |
| It's just like the beep. | |
| And we got our perfect mid-Atlantic accents going, too. | |
| We're the perfectly realized Christopher Plumbers. | |
| Or Christopher Plumber. | |
| Now, he's very much missed. | |
| What an amazing actor. | |
| We're all at six. | |
| And as it happens, you're going to make me think about that now. | |
| Leslie, thank you very much. | |
| Take care. | |
| My pleasure. | |
| Bye now. | |
| As ever, your thoughts. | |
| Welcome upon the proceeding. | |
| Please go to my website, theunexplained.tv. | |
| You can follow the link and send me an email from there. | |
| Be gratefully received. | |
| Always is. | |
| More great guests in the pipeline here at the Home of the Unexplained. | |
| Please look after yourself because these are difficult times and you've got to look after Numero Uno these days. | |
| First, I think, and then think about everything else that's going on and try and make sense of the whole damn lot. | |
| I think that's the only show in town. | |
| Like I was saying, anyway, more great guests in the pipeline here at the Home of the Unexplained. | |
| So until next, we meet. | |
| My name is Howard Hughes. | |
| This has been the Unexplained. | |
| And please, whatever you do, stay safe, stay calm, and above all, please stay in touch. | |
| Thank you very much. | |
| Take care. |