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June 13, 2020 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes
55:00
Edition 461 - Robert Schoch & Preston Dennett

Ancient history researcher Robert Schoch returns on new discoveries at the ancient Gobekli Tepi site - And Preston Dennett on his new book on the people taken aboard alien craft...

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Across the UK, across continental North America, and around the world on the internet, my name is Howard Hughes and this is The Unexplained.
And I think, if my notation is correct, this is edition 461.
A recent emailer said to me he thought that I was going to make 500 by the end of the year.
By the looks of it we might, if I get a bit of a move on.
So thank you.
And thank you very much for all of your feedback and your support for this show.
You can always contact me through the website theunexplained.tv designed by Adam Cornwell.
Thank you Adam for your hard work on this.
You can make contact with me and let me know what you think of the show.
Make guest suggestions.
Tell me your stories or just share your experience of lockdown wherever you happen to be in the world with me.
It's always gratefully received, especially as, like a lot of people, I'm living and working completely alone during all of this.
And, you know, I'm pretty good at doing those things, as I've said before.
But sometimes, I'm sure you will appreciate and resonate with this.
Sometimes you feel like climbing the walls.
So it's nice to get communication, you know?
So thank you very much for all of your contacts.
Okay, on this edition of the show, a couple of items from my recent radio show.
Number one, ancient civilization and Egyptology expert Robert Schock will be here for a short contribution to the show about one very specific story that I will tell you about.
And then in the second part of this edition, we're going to speak with Preston Dennett, UFO author and author about paranormality in Los Angeles, California.
So we'll catch up with him second.
That's the way that basically this edition is going to hang.
Thank you very much for being part of it all.
Don't forget, please communicate with me.
Go to the website, theunexplained.tv.
And when you get in touch, please tell me who you are, where you are, and how you use the show.
Okay, first up then, Robert Schock is going to talk about this.
This was a story that I saw on livescience.com.
Basically about the temple that is being explored at Gobekli Tepi.
It's a very, very, very ancient site in Turkey.
It's now said that the site's T-shaped pillars, which are carved with mystic drawings of animals and symbols and human hands, are arranged in giant circles and ovals, made up of two large central pillars surrounded by smaller inward-facing pillars.
And they're now saying that basically all of this was planned on a geometric pattern, something that you wouldn't have thought that people long, long, long ago, longer ago than we thought we existed, would have had the knowledge to do.
So first up then, Egyptology and ancient civilizations researcher Robert Schock to talk about Gobekli Tepe.
So Robert, Gobekli Tepe, we know the excitement that this discovery, this ancient site has generated.
What did you make of this report that a temple there had apparently been built on geometric lines?
And you wouldn't have expected you tell me how old this site is thought to be, but we wouldn't have thought that the people at that time would have had that ability.
Well, actually, put it this way, I've suspected this for a very long time.
To give everyone the background information, Gabekli Tepe goes back about 12,000 years.
So this is about 6,000 or more years older than anyone, until Gabekli Tepe was discovered, anyone expected civilization or sophisticated culture or anything like that.
And the initial finds, as you just mentioned, with the huge megalithic pillars arranged in circles, were astounding enough.
But what we have at Gabekli Tepe is not just one or two megalithic circles with pillars around the edge, with pairs of pillars in the center.
That would be amazing unto itself.
But these new studies suggest that these pillars and these different enclosures were actually arranged relative to each other, that there was a larger ground plan suggested for all of the pillars together.
So it wasn't just piecemeal, oh, we'll stick up a few pillars here, then later we'll stick up a few pillars there.
They actually had a plan that they were following over numerous years.
I'm thinking even numerous generations.
So this is one more level of sophistication of what was already an incredibly sophisticated site by any accounts, not even speaking about 12,000 years ago where it's totally out of place according to the standard paradigm.
And this, of course, is once again, as you rightly say, challenging our knowledge of our history.
And it prompts the questions, who were these people?
What did they know?
And how did they get that intelligence?
Exactly, exactly.
Because as I was saying, they are much older than anyone expected.
This is actually end of the last ice age.
As you mentioned, everyone considers them hunter-gatherers, and with that, they have the connotation that they were these primitive sort of cavemen-type people.
But not at all.
I mean, this is incredibly sophisticated technology and geometry and mathematics that must have been going into this.
You mentioned the symbols on the pillars.
One of something I've been working on, actually, with a colleague of mine, Manu Saif Saday, is that those symbols are not just abstract art, not just sort of decoration, but that they were probably literate.
And I mean that seriously, that they had some kind of writing, some kind of method of recording things, as well as doing mathematics.
And this new study simply ties in with that, or very much, I would say, confirms that that has to be considered a real possibility.
So just another level of sophistication, which is mind-boggling.
It is.
You've championed the whole idea, along with people like Graham Hancock and others, but you've championed the idea that our history goes back far further than we've been taught in school.
And that those people who were back there 12,000 years ago and maybe before that knew far more than we have given them credit for.
That all speaks to us, doesn't it, Really, because we've made this point together before on various podcasts and things, but that all says to us that we are not nearly as smart as we think we are today.
That's exactly it.
We're not quite as smart as we are today.
And we have to take into account that they were incredibly intelligent back then.
But what happened to them, and you and I have talked about this before, I believe, that there was a huge disaster at the end of the last ice age, basically set them back to a much more primitive state.
And there was essentially what I call dark age for about 6,000 years.
And we have to be very careful today because my work, and I believe we've talked about this before on the show, my work suggests that, in fact, indicates very strongly that it was a solar outburst.
It was solar activity that brought the last ice age to an end, causing credible destruction.
2,000 years after Gabekli Tepe, what do we find?
We find people living in essentially mud-brick huts and buildings, no indication anywhere of megalithic structures or sophistication like we have.
So there's ups and downs of civilization.
So the idea, which is the intriguing one about this, is that there was a sophisticated civilization, or maybe a number of them, that were brought to their knees by a global or widespread catastrophe and then had to rebuild, but some remnants of what they knew before, it is thought, survived.
That's a really intriguing idea.
Exactly, exactly.
And the best way for many people to understand this or to grasp this is if you think about our recent history.
And when I say recent, I'm a geologist, so I'm talking in the last few thousand years where you had ancient Egypt, you had ancient Greece, ancient Rome, and then you had the collapse of the Roman Empire in a dark age, and it was 1,000 years later before we had the true Renaissance.
So, you know, there are ups and downs, shall we say, to technology or knowledge of technology, high culture, high civilization.
And you've been investigating this and other things over the years.
How do we take this research forward then?
I think that we have to be very open to the possibility that there were these earlier cycles, as I call it, cycles of civilization.
And when I say we, I'm thinking of my academic colleagues who cannot just dismiss this, cannot just dismiss the evidence.
What I've seen, Kebekoli Tepe was first discovered in the late 1990s by the late Klaus Schmidt.
And so many people wanted to, when I say people, I'm talking again my academic colleagues, sort of dismiss it as an anomaly, sort of as a cliché goes, sweep it under the carpet.
But now more and more evidence is coming out that, yes, this is absolutely real.
It ties in with my early work on the Sphinx, pushing that back, that there was this earlier cycle of civilization.
So one is to acknowledge that there's something to study, that there's something to look into, at least among academics.
And then once you do that, you can start gathering more information.
So two aspects.
One, I think we have to continue to study before the end of the last Ice Age what civilization was like and how far back it goes because we don't know how far back it goes.
And then the second point I want to make, for those who aren't that interested in ancient civilization per se, we need to learn lessons from them because this was a sophisticated civilization that was brought to its proverbial knees by natural catastrophes.
And I hate to say this, but we've talked about it before, I believe.
Our civilization today is very, very vulnerable to the same types of catastrophes.
And so we may think we're smart, but there are lessons from history here.
And one of the ways, just very, very quickly, we've only got a minute, but the way that we do this, isn't it, is that we have to keep digging down further than we thought we had to go.
And the further down, you were telling me once, the further down you go, the more revelations you may find.
That's exactly it.
That's exactly it.
And I may have told you once before, and I'll say it again because I think it's an important story.
When I was a graduate student, when I was an undergraduate student, there was basically this dogma that if you dug down before certain levels, lower than certain levels, you were wasting your time because everyone knew civilization began, say, about 5,000, 6,000 BC.
So why go any deeper?
You're just wasting time and money.
Well, in fact, if you have that attitude, you'll never find anything earlier.
And now we're finding that there's a lot to learn from a much earlier period.
So we need to put that effort into it.
Wow.
Not only in space are there surprises, but also very definitely here on Earth.
Robert, if people want to check out your website, do you want to give its address?
Oh, absolutely.
It's Robert Schock, and that's spelled R-O-B-E-R-T-S-C-H-O-C-H dot com.
R-O-B-E-R-T-S-C-H-O-C-H altogether.com.
Robert, lovely to talk with you.
We must do something longer soon.
Take care.
Thank you.
Thank you.
The always interesting Robert Schock will do a full show with him to catch up very, very soon here on the podcast edition of The Unexplained.
Coming next, Preston Dennett.
He's been on the show before a number of times.
He is based in Los Angeles, California.
He has an amazing biography.
He's done such a lot of jobs and things in his life.
In his time, he's worked as a carpet cleaner, landscaper, fast food cook, data entry park, bookkeeper, teacher, lecturer, actor, writer, singer, TV consultant, ghostwriter, out-of-body explorer, and UFO investigator.
I think probably some more things on top of that.
He's very prolific.
I think he's written 26 books or so, mostly about UFOs.
And his latest book is about the experiences of people who say that they've been taken aboard craft and essentially abducted and maybe experimented on.
So I spoke with Preston Bennett on the recent edition of my radio show, and here he is.
So Preston, what's going on with you at the moment?
I mean, the world has been in lockdown.
I think you may be less in lockdown than we are, but how are things?
Oh, no, I'm in full lockdown.
There's riots that have been occurring the past week, not far from where I live.
So it's been a pretty crazy time for sure.
And does that make your research and your writing easier because you've got peace and quiet, presumably locked down, or more difficult because you can't get out to places?
Well, both.
I'd say I've got a lot more time for sure.
So that's exciting.
And yeah, being laid off from work, I'm devoting a lot more time to my research and enjoying it a lot, actually.
You very kindly sent me your list of books, and I made a mental estimate of how many books you've written.
I thought there were about 40, but I think there are about 26 or so, maybe 30 now.
You are prolific as a writer.
How do you get time for all this?
I tell you, it cuts into my TV time for sure.
I enjoy it.
I really do.
And I think that's why it's, you know, I don't want to say it's easy.
I mean, I definitely spend a lot of energy doing this.
I work full-time, you know, or I did.
Right.
And when you were working, Preston, of all of those things that I listed there, you know, what is your full-time job?
Bookkeeping right now.
Okay.
No, that's bad.
You do both ends of it then.
Well, I hope it changes for the better and soon.
But you do both ends of it, the bookkeeping and the book writing.
It's always good to have another string to your bow and another skill.
But you are known internationally, and I've heard you on the big American shows, talking a lot about UFOs.
So before we get into the specifics here, how did you get involved in UFO research?
What was it that brought you to this?
Kicking and screaming.
It was not voluntary.
I can tell you that.
I was very skeptical.
I've been doing this for almost 35 years now.
It was 1986.
I heard a report on the news.
I remember the day exactly.
It was like November 16th.
Around there, there was a sighting over Alaska by a major commercial airliner.
I thought, well, this pilot's crazy.
He's on drugs.
He's hallucinating.
There's no way aliens are invading our planet.
But I started asking people, and I got to tell you, I got hit by a ton of bricks when I found out a lot of people I knew, my brother, my sister-in-law, a couple of people I'd worked with for years, several friends, had had major encounters.
And I'm talking like face-to-face encounters.
Okay, sorry, I interrupted there, and you were about to tell me face-to-face encounters.
Yeah, with gray type ETs, missing time even, UFOs landing.
Yeah, it shook me up.
It was not good news as far as I was concerned.
I don't know.
I've always believed, and maybe I'm naive and wrong about this, that this sort of paranormality is actually around pretty much everybody, apart from those who completely close their minds to it.
If I tell you that, and I've told my listener before, I had a really tough, but really gentle and wonderful, marvelous, wise Liverpool grandmother.
And, you know, her name was Edna, and she's still much missed.
We lost her 20 years ago now.
But she was a great source of inspiration to me, and she was no one's fool, nobody's pushover.
And Edna, when I was a little kid, told me of the night that she was sleeping, you know, her husband had died, so she was always alone.
And she looked behind her bedhead, there was a window, and she looked over the railway in Waterloo near Liverpool, and there was a classic silver wedding cake-shaped UFO.
And she swore to her dying day that she'd seen this thing, and she even drew a picture of it.
And she was not into science fiction, and she was not into anything like that, but she was baffled by what she saw.
So I'm going to stop talking in a second, Preston.
Don't worry.
But what we're saying here is that these experiences are more common than a lot of people would actually think.
Oh, absolutely.
That's something I always challenge skeptics to do is ask everyone you know.
Most people know 20 people, I would say.
And I can pretty much guarantee you, if you're willing to ask all 20 people you love and trust, you know who won't lie to you, you will get some amazing accounts.
I heard a quote from J. Allen Hynek.
He's sort of the pioneering UFO researcher here in the United States.
He was the man behind Project Blue Book, wasn't he?
Right.
Yeah, exactly.
He was quoted as saying one in 40 people have had an onboard UFO encounter.
And I thought to myself, well, no, I mean, that's just impossible.
I know 40 people.
And that's kind of what kicked my research into high gear.
And yeah.
Okay, I mean, in the 40 people that you know, did you prove that statistic right then?
Did you find somebody who'd been on board a spaceship?
Yeah, I found like three.
So I did not have to ask 40 people.
We'll talk in depth about the research after we've taken some commercials here because like any radio station anywhere, that's what we have to do.
That's our lifeblood.
But of those three people of the 40, are you convinced in your own mind that what they experienced wasn't in their mind?
Oh, yeah, absolutely.
I mean, in some cases, people have physical symptoms.
They're not where they're supposed to be.
They come back with scars or even healings.
I've investigated a number of cases of that.
So I believe it's absolutely a physical phenomenon.
I mean, these objects leave landing traces.
They can be photographed.
They're seen on radar.
It's all continuum.
And definitely people are being taken on board.
Okay, the book that you've written, the latest one of all these books that you have put out, is called Onboard UFO Encounters.
We will talk about that next.
Just one thing in the next couple of minutes, though, to deal with, and thank you for agreeing to do this.
I've had so many emails from people who've been reading these reports as I've been reading them of a claimed, quotes, UFO crash in Brazil that has claimed, quotes, been covered up.
Do you know any?
Because the detail of this is pretty sketchy, but it seems to be all over the internet.
What do you know about this, Preston?
Yeah, I'm following it for sure.
As far as I know, a group Of orb-like lights were seen over this small town outside of Rio de Janeiro in Brazil, and one of them allegedly crashed into the jungle there.
Police were kept away while the army showed up.
So there's some video of this.
There's some first-hand eyewitness accounts.
It looks legit.
It's hard to say, you know, from my own personal perspective, but I'm certainly following it closely.
It's not the first UFO crash that's been reported in Brazil.
There was another.
I mean, Brazil, you know, up here, people don't know a lot about what goes on in Brazil, but there's a guy called, you may know him, Tiago Tucheti, who wrote a whole book about UFO encounters in Brazil.
And, you know, in South America generally, all the way down from Panama, which is like Central America, I know, all the way down to Argentina.
There are many reports of these kinds of things.
But this is the biggest flap about all of these things, as we say here.
It's the biggest flurry that I've seen for a while about this.
But there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of detail.
Yeah, it's very interesting because we've seen a lot of these videos being taken off of the internet, off Reddit and other online websites, which to me always sort of smacks of a cover-up.
I know videos can be removed if they're allegedly false information, but there's quite a bit of buzz about this incident.
And where there's smoke, there's usually fire.
I'm looking forward to see what rolls out with this and if it survives scrutiny and hoping some serious researchers really look into it because it does appear to have some legitimacy to it.
Whatever.
And of course, with the world in various states of lockdown, it becomes more difficult to actually get out to a place and investigate.
But it also becomes, I mean, if you were conspiratorially minded, because there are not people around in the same numbers as there were before lockdown, then it becomes, if something did happen, it would become, and here I am with my tinfoil hat on here.
It would be easier to, but it would be very easy to cover it up, wouldn't it?
If there aren't people around, then there's no one to see.
Yeah, and traditionally, UFO crash incidents are very difficult to investigate.
They often rely on just a small handful of witnesses.
And people, if they have a hold of perhaps great footage or something, it can be dangerous.
Leonard Stringfield, who was a real pioneer in this field, received several death threats.
So it's definitely a difficult field to investigate because there is an active cover-up of UFOs.
It's not speculation.
It's demonstrable.
Certainly.
Have you ever been warned off, Preston?
I've gotten a threat once.
Did you?
I did.
Yeah, it was during a very intense UFO wave in Topanga Canyon in the early 1990s, and someone called me up, claiming to be from the military with a top secret clearance, and was going on and on about his resume and basically asked me if I was the UFO guy looking into these sightings.
And I said, yeah.
He says, well, you're barking up the wrong tree.
What you're doing is dangerous.
You don't realize what you're getting into.
Dangerous to who?
It's kind of what I asked.
He's like, to you.
And I'm like, well, how is it dangerous?
He says, you're barking up the wrong tree.
You don't know what you're getting into.
It's not what you think it is.
And I'm like, well, what is it?
And he said, there's no pay dirt in it.
And I'm like, well, what does that mean?
I mean, is it dangerous or is there no pay dirt in this?
What are you talking about?
He's kind of given me a bit of the runaround and just seemed to try to warn me off his subject.
Right.
And by saying to you, there's no pay dirt in this, he's basically telling you in a phrase that they used to use in the Westerns on TV.
He's basically saying, if you think that you're going to make any money out of this story, forget it.
Yeah, or find any legitimate information.
It's never been about the money.
I'm just trying to find out about this mystery.
And he seemed to want to warn me off, which I found ultimately flattering more than frightening.
And clearly the warning did not work.
Right.
But I've had problems with my mail coming back open.
I'm sending out a lot of UFO manuscripts.
I've had email problems, phone problems.
Nothing I can really point to and say, ah, you know, I'm on the radar, but I wonder.
Well, I had, I won't tell it again on this radio show.
I'll tell you another time, Preston, but I had my own MIB Men in Black encounter.
Some years ago, when I was doing this show on our sister station Talk Spot, there was a black limo in the dead of night parked outside the radio station.
Two guys wearing black jackets.
They looked like the Blues brothers.
There was a camera on the dashboard.
They were following me all the way down the street.
And there wasn't another soul in that street in London at that time on a Saturday night.
And I'm convinced to this day that they were taking an interest or they wanted me to know that they were there.
Stranger things have happened.
Preston Dennett, stay right there.
We'll talk more about the new book, which is about the experiences of those who say that they have been on board UFOs and met their occupants and experienced what goes on therein.
And I think also.
We talked about the Brazil UFO crash.
Let's get on to the new book then, Onboard UFO Encounters.
What gave you the idea of doing a book about that?
Onboard UFO Experience is the ultimate UFO encounter.
It's got a lot more information than perhaps just a sighting or even landing cases.
So going onboard a UFO and seeing ETs face to face, I think it's really the cutting edge of UFO research.
And that's where we're going to find our answers.
So that's what I was really excited to focus on.
Yeah.
And was it that statistic that you told me a few minutes ago, that one person who's, you know, one person in 40 can actually say that they've been on board?
Yes.
Yes.
That's been actually verified by other surveys like the Roper poll, which found one in 50.
But certainly most UFO researchers will tell you that abductions are a lot more common than most people think.
I've got some bullet points of cases that you go through in the book, but let me just ask you, is there a general way then that this happens?
Are they people who've been interested in these things and then suddenly find themselves being the subject of the interest of the aliens if the aliens exist?
I mean, look, I have been begging for years for aliens, if they're out there, to come and take me, because I would love to do it.
I could talk about it on the radio.
I would be world famous, but they never show up for me.
So I suppose what I'm saying is, who do they show up for?
And what's the common way for it to happen?
What's the most common way for it to happen?
Well, there definitely are patterns.
When someone tells me they've had an onboard UFO experience, there's a certain amount I can predict about what they're going to say, particularly like what the interior of the object looks like.
People generally describe being physically examined, laid out on a table, or perhaps a dentist-like chair.
That's commonly described.
Usually there's indirect lighting.
It's a small rounded room without corners.
So these sort of things are pretty predictable.
It happens to all kinds of people.
In this book, I've got, you know, 10 men, five women from all over the world, Netherlands, there's a case from England, Canada, mostly the U.S. And usually...
Is that just because of the nature of your research, or does it mean that men are more susceptible to this?
No, it's pretty much evenly, I would say, divided between men and women.
It just kind of fell that way randomly.
I haven't found a lot of patterns as to who's being contacted and why.
One we do know for sure is this phenomena tracks families.
And almost universally, people who describe certainly multiple encounters going on board more than once, their parents, perhaps, their grandparents, someone in the family has a history of encounters as well.
It seems to stretch back and we've tracked it several generations.
And does this suggest then that the aliens, and we'll get into who they might be, that the aliens are interested in particular bloodlines?
Yeah, or genetics, certainly.
There's been a lot of attempts to link this to perhaps certain blood types like RH negative, which hasn't really panned out.
So it seems to, yeah, affect all kinds of people.
We know people all over the world experience this.
The pattern is roughly the same in these cases.
And each case does have unique elements, though, for sure.
And is it always the thin gray guys with the buggy eyes who do the abducting?
Or are there various and varied species?
Definitely varied species.
I have to tell you, grays do dominate, certainly in my own research, and I'd say pretty much across the U.S. It's a little different in other countries, interestingly enough.
There seems to be a less number of greys, but about 60, 70% people describe some variation of the greys, three feet high, five feet high, large dark eyes, huge head, grayish skin.
That's very common.
But also, there are several other categories.
Praying mantis is a pretty large category, which is odd.
I mean, we've got all kinds of insects and animals.
Why people would link an ET type to a particular insect is fascinating to me.
But people usually describe this as being eight feet tall, nine feet tall, various tall, thin, stick-like limbs, large eyes.
That's probably your second most common category.
Perhaps human-looking is also pretty common.
By that I mean figures that look just like us, who are apparently not from here.
Usually described as being very strong, good-looking, handsome, pretty, genetically perfect almost.
Different races, by the way.
Not all like white-skinned and blonde-haired and blue-eyed, but some described South American-looking figures, or one guy told me the human-looking E.T. he saw looked Middle Eastern.
So that would suggest, and I'm no expert, that they might have been interbreeding with us here.
It certainly raises some questions about our relationship to them, our own origins, perhaps.
If there are human-looking ETs going on out there, it raises a lot of questions.
And I have to tell you, there's another huge category that is pretty much indefinable, involving all kinds of short humanoids, tall humanoids, light beings, just sort of unique humanoids that we don't see before or since.
So it's hard to make sense of this.
Yeah, but it's fascinating, and so many people tell these stories.
And you're saying that these things, I tend to think of abductions of being something from the 1960s, 1950s, 1970s.
Are you telling me this stuff is going on now?
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, the guy I interviewed from England, he is still having experiences to this day.
I did include his account in the book, but we're still in contact and he's having abductions.
His started at a very young age.
He was born in 1969.
And as a young kid, he and his family were followed home by a UFO one evening.
They had a number of UFO sightings over the house, and he started having these grays come into his bedroom as a young kid.
And as a young man, age 19 or 20, he woke up on board a UFO, being physically examined.
There was a very tall gray over him sticking a needle into his head.
It was very painful.
Into his head.
Yes.
Yeah.
He thought he was in a hospital at first until he kind of oriented himself and sees not a human, a very tall-looking gray.
He'd never heard, you know, he's heard of UFOs certainly, but never looked into it, never gave any thought to it.
Had pretty much buried his childhood experiences.
And this happens and completely freaks him out.
It was very painful and very an unpleasant experience, certainly.
Did he get a chance to say during any of these encounters, and I don't know how many of them there were, did he get a chance to say, why me and why are you doing this?
He screamed at them to stop, and they did not answer.
They treated him like a lab rat, and he's had some conversations with Them, but very limited because he's had a hard time with this.
He woke up once, he had a gray in his bedroom.
He reached out and smacked this thing in the face.
And he says, They may look no, not the only case like this in the book, by the way.
Another kid in Louisiana did the same thing.
And he said, They may look cute and docile and innocent, but they're not.
This thing hissed at him and knocked him out.
Not the only case.
If you smack them, they smack you back.
That's right.
Yeah, he one time caught another gray wandering through his house, ran up to it and choked it in the neck.
It started screaming out, get off, get off, get off me.
Its little arms were windmilling around, and another one came from behind him and knocked him out.
But they did tell him, you know, that he asked them, why are you abducting me?
And they said, we're not allowed to tell you.
You know, we're not allowed to say.
And he sensed sadness coming from them.
It's always difficult doing these things through a third party because I haven't got him here to talk to.
But you spoke to him extensively for the book.
Was he absolutely sure that it wasn't an artifact of his own mind?
You know, the human mind is an amazing thing and can create all kinds of impressions, can make us think we've had experiences that we haven't, been places that we never went to, can make us forget things.
Are you convinced, is he convinced, that this really happened?
Oh yeah, he's certainly convinced.
You know, that first incident where he had the needle in his head, he woke up immediately and went to the mirror, and sure enough, there was a needle mark in his temple, right, where he had recalled seeing this.
He is married.
He has a child.
Both of them have had experiences as well.
It's not just him.
This is sort of the norm when someone in the family is having these experiences.
It does spread to siblings and loved ones.
And from what you say then, this has been happening to this guy in the UK a lot over his life.
How do you live?
You must have asked him this, I guess.
How do you live with the fact that you could be taken away and messed with at any time?
I would find that scary.
I would find that destabilizing and intrusive.
Yeah, well, initially he did it in denial.
Absolutely refused to talk about it, think about it.
He told nobody.
He's really only told his wife, me, and his best friend to this point.
And he's just sort of come out and dealt with this full on.
So it's been difficult for him.
He tries just not to think about it.
This is sort of a tactic that I've heard a lot of witnesses use.
Others will sort of confront them head on and try and deal with it that way.
Right, or try and smack them, which is not a good idea, as we heard.
And you said that he confronted this head-on.
How's he done?
Apart from talking to you, how's he done that?
Well, there's not a whole lot you can do.
He's physically trying to resist.
He's trying not to live in denial anymore, I guess would be the best way of putting it.
I've encouraged him to write incidents down because there can be memory problems associated with this.
Often he'll be floated out of his bedroom and he blacks out and doesn't remember what happens on board.
That's not unusual.
This happens in a lot of cases, missing time.
But occasionally he does remember.
Once he woke up as they were returning him and he was looking out through the viewport as they were racing along the land, it looked like he said South American, or I mean, I'm sorry, a desert area here in the U.S., he was thinking, but he couldn't really tell.
And he was awake for a good five minutes when finally decided to just shout out, all right, lads, really loudly, causing one of the little greys to jump up and panic and run around the room.
Right, because that was not meant to happen.
That's what they told him.
They stopped the object right before they returned him to his bed and said, you know, this has never happened before.
And that's when he asked them, you know, why are you taking me?
And they said, we're not allowed to tell.
And he said, well, you let me remember this.
And they said, no, we're not allowed to do that either.
But apparently they did because he did remember.
He remembers his experiences consciously.
Most of the people I interviewed.
You said, I'm sorry to interrupt.
You said this guy is married.
When he is taken away, does his partner realize that he's gone?
No.
Generally speaking, the person's spouse is put into a sort of an unconscious state.
Got a lot of cases like this.
One lady, after she was returned, she was running through the house trying to wake up her children and her husband, and none of them would wake up.
It's sort of this weird hypnotic sleep they put people into.
I see it in case after case after case.
It took her 20 minutes to wake her family up, and they were still very groggy.
Luckily, they were supportive.
You know, they believe her, they themselves having had some experiences, certainly her children.
One of the things that I've always wanted to ask somebody who's been through something like this, and I've interviewed a few people over the years, but it's the million-dollar question, really.
And it's the one that the skeptics would most want the answer to.
If you're on a spaceship and maybe you're being taken to some far-off galaxy for experiments to take place, and then you're brought back in the blink of an eye and returned to your bed almost before anybody could notice.
If you're up there, wouldn't you want, so that people when you return wouldn't think you were mad, wouldn't you want to take something?
Wouldn't you want to grab, I don't know, if they've got magazines on board spaceships or an implement, some kind of medical instrument?
Wouldn't you want to nick something, as we say here, steal something and bring it back with you?
And then you have got definitive proof.
But in the whole pantheon of stories like this, nobody's ever done that.
They've tried.
I looked into this because I have the same question.
There's a lot of people who claim to have this experience and what?
No one has recovered anything.
One of the problems is these, someone's taken inside a UFO.
They're generally described as very Clean.
They don't have stuff laying around.
And also, people are usually put into a paralyzed state.
So it's not as if they can just run around and do what they want.
I know the very first reported abduction case, Antonio Villas Boas, he did try to steal an object, and they did not react well.
He thought it looked kind of like a clock.
It obviously wasn't a clock, but it was about that size.
He picked it up, grabbed it, and started to tuck it in his shirt when one of the crew people saw him, took the object away, and pushed him down, and he was immediately escorted from the craft.
And there are a few other cases where pretty much the same sort of thing happens.
People try and lift something, and they're caught.
There are some cases where people have been given objects, though.
Really?
Crystals.
Well, souvenirs.
Yep.
Usually they're like crystals or one case it was a metal bar.
One was like pancakes or something, little wheat crackers.
And some of it has been tested.
It's never panned out as being an honest-to-god ET artifact.
Usually they're made of materials that we could find on our planet, which doesn't preclude it being extraterrestrial.
But we don't have the smoking gun.
The best smoking gun we have is the alien implant removal cases.
Yes, which, you know, Dr. Leah used to be the man who used to take those things out of people, didn't he?
Yeah, absolutely.
And I have to tell you, it's not uncommon when people who are having or reporting onboard experiences to go to, say, the dentist or the doctor and have them inquire about a foreign body type object that shows up on x-rays or MRIs under the jaw or in the head or the foot, anywhere.
Got case after case like that.
Now, we've got to take a break very soon, but one question before we do.
If they are, which all accounts suggest they are, possessed of superior technology to the technology that we know about here, as far as we're aware, how come they still, they want to keep doing this after decades and decades and decades?
You would have thought that after abducting a few people and doing the tests they wanted, they would be done with us.
And why does it seem that they are continuingly interested in us?
To me, it suggests an ongoing experiment, perhaps, or agenda with us.
They seem to be monitoring the situation.
These implants, going back to that, people are wondering, what are they?
Are these for mind control?
A number of abductees have been told that these implants are to measure the levels of pollution in their body, or perhaps monitor their vital signs, boost their immune system, one said.
So they're doing active research or some sort of field work of some kind, experimenting with our genetics.
There does seem to be a sort of very strong interest in genetics and the human body.
Just a quick answer to this one, because otherwise my producer will long distance throttle me, as we say.
You said that some people claimed that they had been healed by an encounter.
Yeah, it's surprisingly common.
I've documented some 300 cases stretching back over 100 years, come from virtually every country in the world.
These are cases which have great proof.
I mean, before and after x-rays, doctors' reports, and involve all kinds of illnesses, injuries, minor injuries to colds, infections, flus even, to diabetes, cancer, you name it, tuberculosis, diphtheria, a surprising amount of evidence.
Well, that's interesting.
Preston Dennett is here.
We're talking about his new book.
Now, I promised my listener, Preston, Jonathan, in Worthing in Sussex in the UK, that I would ask you a couple of his questions.
Jonathan, I hope you're hearing these and thank you for them.
He wants to know, and this is good, this is what you should be doing this show, Jonathan, what was the best story that you've ever heard of humans being on board a so-called UFO?
That's not fair.
It's not a fair question.
It's asking for a favorite, isn't it?
I couldn't possibly, I mean, there's some definitely very interesting cases.
I like the ones that are very extensive, and it's hard to tell the whole story because it's so huge.
But one, I'll tell you briefly, happened to a lady from Florida named Pat, who's had a lot of UFO experiences.
I won't go into all of them.
It's a lifetime.
But on November 13th, 1985, she woke up one night and normally inside a UFO.
This time, she was standing next to one.
It was daytime somewhere in South America, it looked like, overlooking this small village.
And there was a human-looking figure standing next to her.
There was a large UFO landed.
It was surrounded by little grays and other human-looking figures in blue jumpsuits.
And she went with one of these human figures into the town and started collecting people and pulling them on board this UFO.
She didn't question what they were doing.
She didn't even think of questioning.
Neither did anyone they took.
They just followed like sheep.
It was all.
So people were being harvested by the sounds of this.
Yeah, it was very strange.
She had the feeling that they were, you know, rescuing them from something that was about to happen.
She wasn't sure.
But suddenly, you know, they had filled this thing up for a couple of hours and perhaps a thousand people.
There was another object landed 200 yards away, which was also picking people up.
Very strange.
This is one of the strangest encounters I've heard, by the way, which is why it's on my list here.
And it lifted up, at which point there was a huge explosion, a volcanic explosion off in the distance, and a wall of mud, known debris and houses and animals and trees and bodies and ice just swept through this town, burying everything.
The UFO dipped down, picked up a few more survivors.
You know, to make a long story much shorter, she was taken to the craft.
Next thing she remembers is being dropped back at her home, waking up the next morning thinking, oh my God, this is one of the weirdest UFO dreams I've ever had.
She sort of refers to them as dreams, even though she kind of knows they're real.
She called her best friend and explained what happened.
And her best friend's like, you better hang up the phone right now, turn on the news, which she did.
Turned out the Nevada Del Ruiz volcano in Colombia had just erupted.
Yeah, just erupted and swept over the town of Armero, burying 27,000 people, killing them.
But apparently they had arrested.
They wanted to save some people.
Apparently, this is what Pat experienced.
It really traumatized her.
By coincidence, I have a book on that volcanic eruption, and she described it exactly how the eyewitnesses did.
And she ended up going to see a therapist.
It was very upsetting for her, very traumatic.
It was corroboration in a way.
Now, this is going to sound like a churlish question, but there's a point behind it.
If they were able to, they, the aliens, were able to step in and save some people from that, why don't they step in and help us more often?
And we sure as hell need help right now.
Yeah, it's a great question.
There's a lot of cases.
I have to tell you in this book alone, a couple of people felt their lives were saved.
There's three or four cases of healings.
I think healings are a lot more common.
A case like I just described is very unusual.
I would call it an outlier.
But there are a lot of cases.
I've heard cases of people being rescued from drowning, car accidents, this sort of thing.
It's usually done on a very limited kind of covert basis, but they're not stepping in and saving us from heart disease and this COVID thing, for example.
It's hard to say.
I think they want us to solve our own problems.
They can't just step in and take over the world.
That would cause more disease.
Some people say that they have a kind of, you know, if they exist, that they have a kind of Star Trek-style prime directive.
In other words, they don't interfere.
And yet you've said that on certain occasions, they do.
There has to be some sort of Star Trek-like quarantine because if this phenomenon is real, and the evidence is showing us that it is, it's here in large numbers, and we're not having any kind of open official contact, which is something these UFO occupants could do easily.
They've certainly made appearances and displays and are, like I said, doing a lot of limited activity, but they're not coming over a major city and staying there.
So there's a question there as to what's going on.
There is.
A whole list of stories here.
We'll never get through them all, but there's one that's shouting to me right now.
Quotes, an entertainer takes a road trip across the Canadian Rockies, resulting in an incredible UFO encounter and the realization that he's in contact with extraterrestrials.
I mean, is this somebody we might know?
He was famous in his circles.
I'm not sure how I saw him on TV once.
So he is fairly well known.
Certainly behind the scenes as a makeup artist is where he gained more fame.
But early in life, he was an entertainer, a singer, and was putting on a show in various cities in Canada and had to drive across the Canadian Rockies to meet his next engagement.
He normally flies, but he was convinced by a friend to take a drive.
And no sooner does he get in the car reluctantly with her and starts his trip when she says, I have to warn you, I'm being followed by UFOs.
He's like, great.
He didn't really think much about UFOs, hadn't really thought about it.
But this lady had a lot of idiosyncrasies, and this was just a little bit too much.
And they're driving through the Rockies.
This was a couple days-long trip, but at some point, they're reaching the center there.
It's late at night.
And she says, do you feel this pressure?
And he says, no, I don't feel any pressure.
What are you talking about?
She says, you will.
We're about to see a UFO.
And sure enough, yeah, he's like, okay.
Sure enough, he starts to feel this pressure pressing him down into the seat, a palpable kind of force.
This is something I've heard many witnesses describe.
He described it very lucidly and said it was just sort of energy that held him into the seat and started to get increasingly uncomfortable when, boom, this turquoise sort of blue craft, perfectly round circle of light, appears about 20, maybe 50 feet above their car and starts tracking it, pacing their vehicle right through the Rockies there.
He said it was absolutely beautiful and just lit up the whole road around them in the circle of light.
Scared the living daylights out of the driver, the lady who was being, you know, quote, followed.
She was not happy about it.
I can imagine that would be the case.
What an astonishing story.
There is one here, and I've only got the bullet point about it.
You can tell me more.
And we don't have a whole lot of time, but this is great.
After several fully conscious abductions by grey aliens, a woman learns how to resist being taken.
Now, the guy in England, you told me about at the beginning, has come to terms with the fact that they keep taking him and there's nothing he can do about it.
You say that here's somebody who learned how to resist.
Yes.
You know, the guy in England, Gary, he can feel him coming.
And he described that same pressure as well, which it no longer works on him.
This is why he's able to jump up and sort of resist them.
This other lady, Teresa, is someone I met here in California and sort of let it slip.
I told her I was a UFO investigator.
We were just talking.
And she let it slip.
She had encounters.
And I'm like, oh, you have to let me interview you.
And she described fairly typical encounters with gray type ETs starting in early childhood.
Took her a while to put it together.
But she'd find herself on board this craft, and it was not a pleasant experience.
She was being Physically examined, and she learned to resist it by sort of breaking the paralysis.
And this would cut short the experience a number of times.
So she could sort of feel them coming.
And when they'd come, they'd paralyze her.
She learned how to break the paralysis, and this would stop the experience.
So then I don't imagine.
Sorry, you were saying that.
Heard other people say, I mean, I talked to one lady, she was halfway up out of her house, floating in the sky, 100 feet above her house, and a UFO right above her woke up and said, take me back now.
And they did.
They absolutely did.
So it's not resistant to reasoning, it seems.
Very finally, we've only got about a minute or so.
So I'm sorry for giving you so short a time, but there's the story of a California man invited to leave this earth and go and live with the ETs.
Presumably, since you've spoken with him, he didn't accept the invitation.
What happened was there was a group of six or so teenage, well, not teenage, they're 19, 20, 21 buddies who decided to go up to the high desert here in California and just hang out in one of the cabins that their parents owned, something they have done several times.
Paul, one of them, left the group and was missing for like three hours, finally came back and said he'd come upon a landed UFO.
There were gray, well kind of gray hybrids, human-looking ETs that invited him aboard, said they were studying this area, and invited him to go with them.
He said, no, I don't want to go.
But they said, well, if you want to, you know, we're going to be back here in a year.
Come back here, you know, on this day.
And we can, you know, we'll take you.
Long story short, he did.
He went back a year later.
You know, he told his friends this story.
They're like, wow, oh my God, is this true?
And he's like, yeah, it's to God.
A year later, he gives away his stuff and goes, drives out to the desert.
And his friend, the guy I interviewed, said, are you seriously thinking of going with them?
He says, no, I'm just going to meet them.
We'll see.
Well, he never came back.
So the guy I interviewed, Tony, went out to the desert with Paul's friends and Paul's parents, found his car.
The keys were still in it, but no, they never saw Paul again.
We don't know what happened.
Oh, my Lord.
What a great story.
Preston, that's a good point to leave it.
I'm sorry we're out of time.
If people want to check you out online, just quickly watch your website.
It's prestondennett.weebly.com.
If you Google my name, it should just take you right there.
And yeah, thanks for having me on the show.
I really appreciate it.
The great Preston Dennett.
And before that, you heard Robert Schock, Egyptology and Ancient Civilizations expert.
Your thoughts on this show?
Always welcome.
Please get in touch through my website, theunexplained.tv.
My name is Howard Hughes.
This has been The Unexplained Online.
And please, whatever you do, stay safe, stay calm, and above all, please stay in touch.
Thank you very much.
Take care.
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