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July 15, 2015 - The Unexplained - Howard Hughes
01:04:02
Edition 213 - Rev. Michael J Carter

This time - the man who connects ufology and religion...

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Across the UK, across continental North America and around the world, on the internet, by webcast and by podcast, my name is Howard Hughes and this is The Return of the Unexplained.
Thank you very much for your communications.
I'm going to be doing some shout-outs in just a moment.
And if you've made a donation to the show, many, many thanks.
As I said last time, the number of donations seems to be dropping off a little.
If you are able to make a donation to the unexplained and the work we do here, that would be fantastic.
All you have to do is go to the website, theunexplained.tv, and follow a PayPal link there.
And the same thing, another link provides you a way to make comments about the show and guest suggestions.
You can send me an email through the websites.
It's a one-stop shop.
And it was all designed and maintained by Adam Cornwell from Creative Hotspot in Liverpool, who's my webmaster and a vital part of what we do here.
It's been a busy period, this.
Very busy period.
So I'm just catching up with emails and all sorts of stuff.
I've got to thank Roger Sanders in California for his hard work helping me to set up the guest on this edition.
Thanks, Roger.
The man I'm going to be talking to is the Reverend Michael J. Carter.
And he does something that is pretty rare in this world or any other world.
He connects religion with ufology.
Now, you don't see many people doing that.
Certainly not doing that and talking about it, which this man does.
I'm going to go through his details, his credentials very soon.
Just to tell you one important thing that you probably know anyway if you're listening to this.
I've been a big fan for nearly 20 years of Art Bell and his work.
And I followed his ups and downs in his career, followed him getting his big award and being recognized in the Hall of Fame, listened to him through some of the great broadcasts that he did, the one with the man flying over Area 51 and supposedly talking live to Art.
I've laughed along with JC.
I've listened to Richard C. Hoagland, and he became a friend as well.
And various other guests who Art introduced me to have also become my radio friends now.
So, you know, Art Bell is somebody who I believe is the gold standard in what we do.
Now, as you may be aware, you probably are if you're hearing this, he is coming back to broadcasting very soon.
So look out for him.
Just do a search and the details you need will become apparent.
But as you hear this, his return to the airwaves and to the online community is imminent.
And all of us who do what I do are very grateful and very happy about that.
Shout outs now before we get to the guest, the Reverend Michael J. Carter.
Dot in Vancouver, liked Carmen Bolter and sent me a very kind email.
And Dot, I will take you up on that offer of guidance around Vancouver if I ever go there.
I'd love to see Vancouver.
Cameron, also in Vancouver, thank you for the clipping that you sent me from the local paper from 42 years ago.
That was very good of you.
Nick in the US, hello.
Christopher Sims, thanks for your email.
Charser in Shropshire, thank you for your email.
Maladdin thought that Garnet Schulhauser was having a midlife crisis.
Quite a few emailers said this, and it was a point that I put to him and was something that he denied.
We'll try and have him back on one of these days, because I think there are one or two points that you would like me to put to him.
Keith in High Wickham, good to hear from you again, my friend.
I'm sorry to hear that you're having some health problems.
Please take care.
Brad in Kansas, thank you for the email.
Jason Peterson, good to hear from you.
Michael in Florida.
Michael, I promise you that I will read the document that you sent me.
Just don't seem to have enough minutes in the day at the moment, but I will do it.
Martin has followed me and what I do since I was on national radio in the UK.
Martin, that's very kind of you.
Thank you.
David, some good questions about Garnet Schulhauser.
And like I said, I will put those to him if he appears on this show again.
Alex in Albuquerque, New Mexico, thinks that Garnet Schulhauser was amazing.
Vitali, literally the next email to arrive in my inbox after Alex's, said that he was not a fan of Garnet Schulhauser at all.
So two different people, Alex and Vitali, two completely polarized different views.
Mark Delano, very kind words, thank you.
And Kieran, you sent me a long email about something that you saw repeatedly in the UK skies.
Two bits of advice, not really advice, but thoughts to you.
Number one, I think you should contact Air Traffic Control if you can make a contact there and see if they registered anything on that night and if they would tell you.
But perhaps more importantly, bear in mind this is summertime and we used to call it the silly season here.
That is when newspaper journalists are looking for big stories.
Now, of course, we have the situation in Greece, IS and all the rest of it, but newspapers at this time of year are still looking for stories.
And I'm sure that if you got in touch with your local paper, you would start off a procedure there that might even find you in the national news.
So get in touch with your local paper first and tell me how it goes, okay, Kieran?
I'd be very keen to hear how that develops if you do it.
More about the guest now.
The Reverend Michael J. Carter, originally from Baltimore, Maryland, moved to New York, lived there for 25 years from 1980, is an ordained interfaith minister with a BA degree and a master's in divinity from Union Theological Seminary in New York City.
He's got a pretty impressive curriculum vitae, we call it here, CV, resume, you call it in the States.
So he's the real deal.
He's a minister with a flock.
But he's also somebody who links the worlds of religion and ufology in a way that I haven't really seen anybody else do.
So the person who suggested that he comes on this show, good call.
Thank you very much indeed.
Let's get to the United States now, to the Carolinas and speak with the Reverend Michael J. Carter.
Michael, thank you very much for coming on The Unexplained.
It's my pleasure, Howard.
I've heard a lot about you and this is going to be a kind of introduction to you for listeners in Europe and the United Kingdom.
I know American listeners will have heard of you and probably seen you in various things.
I think probably in UK and anywhere looking east of here, you might be new to them.
So we have to build it from the ground up.
Before anything though, I want to ask a couple of basic questions about you.
First of all, and I don't normally do this, but the place that you're in, Asheville, I'm just intrigued by that name.
What kind of place is that?
Oh my God, it's Howard.
It's right here in the heart of the Appalachian Mountains.
It's a tourist Town.
About 80,000, 90,000 people, a lot of hiking, water sports, a lot of retirees, even though that demographic may be changing in the not too distant future.
But the largest employer here is a place called Mission Health System.
It's a hospital.
Usually, if you are either in health care or you're in hospitality, you know, restaurants, that kind of thing, that's where the main income is here for now.
We are a pretty progressive southern state.
We had a lot to do with Obama being president in 2008.
We had an African-American police chief, and now we have a gay woman who is our new police chief.
Well, this all sounds very good from where I'm sitting.
How's it play over there?
It's excellent.
Well, listen, I mean, we're here, and people, I mean, they accept it.
You know, let me describe Asheville for you.
It's Berkeley, California.
Okay, you know, the bastion of liberalism.
Surrounded by Mayberry, which is Andy Griffith, you know what I mean?
Surrounded by Jesse Helms.
So we can quite happily say that all human life is there.
Oh, and non-human, probably.
Well, I'm glad that might be the case because that's kind of what we're going to be talking about.
Well, listen, you sound like a great guest, and I'm really looking forward to having this conversation.
Just let's clear one thing up.
We often hear about America and how a lot of people do it in this country, how you can send off $50 and in the seamail, in a tube, will come a doctorate of divinity back by return of post.
You're not one of those, are you?
No, no, no, no.
I hope you read my book.
No, I spent, yeah, I did three years in one of the top seminaries in the country.
I went to Union Theological Seminary in New York.
So how come you're talking about aliens?
Well, I've had experiences with seeing them.
Of course, I went to a psychiatrist because I feared for my sanity.
And the way they phrased it was, you can take it as good news or bad news, but the good news is you're not crazy.
And you can decide whether it's good or bad news.
Yeah.
Wow.
But I mean, it took me a while.
I mean, I was afraid.
It was a great, obviously lots and lots of fear, which is still there to a degree.
But I went to Dr. Gene Mundy, who was passed on, but she was a psychologist who dealt with these type of encounters.
I was regressed by the late Bud Hopkins.
We did a conference together.
And so that's what got me on this.
Howard, I'm not a real technological person, so I'm not really into propulsion systems and back and back engineering, those types of things.
But what I was interested in, like the late John Mack, was the spiritual transformation that could occur once you looked one of these brothers and sisters in the eyes.
You call them brothers and sisters.
Well, they're part of creation, man.
They're like us.
Now, isn't that funny?
Because was it this pope or was it the, I think it was the previous pope?
Didn't the pope say that not that long ago?
It was quite groundbreaking that, you know, they, if there were creatures out there, then there are brothers and sisters too.
Yeah, yeah.
And it was this pope.
It was Pope Francis.
And see, that's the thing.
You know, they're part of creation like we are.
But I will say this, just because you may be more advanced technologically doesn't mean you're more advanced spiritually.
But the beings that I've come in contact with have been very benevolent.
They've been bizarre looking, but they're human beings that are bizarre looking.
I think we have, because we're building this from the ground up, we've got to talk about your encounters.
I heard you talk on one of the videos that I saw online about an encounter with greys, but from what you've just said, you've had encounters with various aliens.
So talk to me about those.
Yes, with, well, they were more chalk-colored, but they look like a species of gray.
You know, there's so many species of grays.
But yeah, grays, reptilians, and Nordics who are like blonde-haired, blue-eyed people.
We could get in an elevator with one of them and not know.
Now, that's a little bit of hyperbole.
Their energy is so intense that even if they didn't look like us, you would definitely feel that you're in the presence of greatness or, but definitely of an advanced individual.
And you're talking about multiple contacts.
Talk to me about the first one.
What happened?
Did the doorbell go?
No.
I wish I wouldn't have gone to a therapist.
No, what had happened was I got back from the pyramids in Chitsunitsa and Tulum on the Yucatan Peninsula.
And at that time, I was my girlfriend at the time, but it was my first wife.
And on the way back, we were living in New York in the Excelsior Hotel, which is still there.
And it was a residential hotel.
And what I did was I was invited to a party, Howard.
And, you know, I wanted to show off how dark I had gotten.
It was 85, 90 degrees.
And I come back to New York.
And of course, it was freezing.
So I went.
I went.
So it was the old ego and driving me.
And so I went.
And I had some finger food, lovely deviled eggs, things like that.
No adult beverages were consumed.
I was there for about 90 minutes.
I made my appearance and I got back on the subway in Times Square and I headed back uptown.
That night, well, that morning, I don't know to this day why, but I woke up.
And maybe I sensed a presence in the room.
Maybe I had to go to the bathroom, which I don't remember doing.
But when I turned over, I was sleeping on my stomach.
There was a being, there was a brother at the edge of my bed who was Surrounded in this cobalt blue light, but there seemed to emanate from him this kind of white light.
And so the room was lit up like Christmas.
And so he had on, I'm assuming it was a he, he had on a jumpsuit, tight fitting, that looked like aluminum foil.
He was chalk white, but his head was bulbous, and he had those kind of wraparound Ray-Ban sunglasses eyes.
Classic, classic, classic alien, don't you think?
Yeah, no more than four feet tall, if that, but very thin.
And I thought I was going to have a heart attack.
My heart was pounding so hard.
And I did what any other red-blooded American man would do.
I pulled the covers up over my head and hoped it would go away.
And you're absolutely sure, Michael, you're absolutely sure that that party you went to, you know, somebody hadn't tampered with the Volivants.
Oh, I'm sure.
I'm sure.
I'm sure of it.
I'm sure of it.
And so, because see, what happens is this kept going on.
I kept seeing these beings every full and new moon for at least six to eight months, probably a little longer.
And when I pulled the cover up over my head, I felt, I heard this, like this wind, like a whooshing sound.
And the temperature changed.
You know, my mind was trying to wrap my mind around this reality.
And it felt like I was outside.
Now, remember, I'm on the 15th floor of a residential hotel.
So if you're outside, you're dead.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, at least.
And so I pull the cover down and nobody's there.
It's just this eerie quiet.
My girlfriend at the time would not wake up, could not wake up.
And when I told her what had happened, she seemed more accepting of it because she was open to these kinds of things.
But, you know, what I had to do, I needed to see some type of mental health professional because my whole reality had been shattered.
That's a very wise thing to do.
Look, I've had a number of people, one quite recently, telling sort of similar stories in different ways, but similar.
And I've suggested to them that maybe they should have just, for their own sake, get themselves a mental health checkup as a first step.
And that would be a rational thing to do.
And most of those people didn't do it.
And you did.
No, I had to, Howard.
I had to because this was getting, it was out of hand because it was happening twice a month.
And I think by the second time I had gone, and I talk about it in my book, but I felt like a kid buying condoms for the first time or something.
I went to a bookstore called The Strand, which is on, I'm sure you have one in London.
We probably got it from you.
A wonderful bookstore in the East Village.
And I was looking, I was grabbing everything I could find on the phenomenon.
And I picked up a book called Encounters by Dr. Edith Fiore.
And in the back of the book, it had a list of mental health professionals all across the nation who would help someone like me.
So presumably at that point, you started thinking, okay, well, you know, maybe I've got a bit of a thunderstorm going on in my brain.
But by the looks of this book, other people are going through stuff like this.
So maybe what I've experienced is what it appeared to be.
Yes.
Now, remember, we're talking about someone who was raised in the African-American Baptist tradition, you know, pretty literal, pretty much a literalist, no Star Trek stuff, none of that.
So I was in the box.
And this, believe me, this got me out of the box.
And so I go up to the cashier and I put every, you know, I can't look him in the face.
And he looks at me and he says, is this for real or is this a hobby?
Of course, I started to lie and say it was a hobby.
See how easily it came to a clergy person?
I started to lie.
I started to say, what are you talking about?
But I said, it's for real.
He said, you look like you're in, he didn't say bad shape.
You don't look like you're in good shape.
And so he said, look, he wrote down a support group.
He said, call this number.
There may be some people there to help you.
So I called and a young lady by the name of Christine Morsiglio, a lovely young lady, interviewed me, I guess screened me because I wouldn't come in and shoot the place up or make a stink.
And that's how I started getting some help.
I was a mess.
So you tied yourself into a whole network.
I mean, it's almost like calling ghostbusters, isn't it?
But these people really exist who can help yourself and others like you who had had experience like that.
Yeah.
And what did you think you were getting into?
Well, I just want, I guess it was like AA or something.
You wanted to see other people who were struggling with what you were struggling with.
That's all I wanted to hear.
Now, I have to admit, a guy by the name of Howard Engelin, who still has the group, a brother in Brooklyn, we stay in touch.
I just needed to hear other stories and have people come up to me and say, hey, man, I'm not judging you.
I've been through it.
And that was tremendously healing.
I did wind up leaving because, you know, it was great and I don't want to knock that.
But there were a lot of people there who were stuck.
And I realized, and by that I mean that, yes, outside of the birth of my daughter, this was Probably the most significant thing that had happened to me in this lifetime.
But I had to get up and brush my teeth and go to work the next day.
And I have other interests.
And there were a lot of brothers and sisters there who that was their whole world, extraterrestrial contact.
And I have other interests.
And I realize that when the only tool you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
But I just, I got the healing I needed.
I blessed them and I moved on.
So literally, I mean, I don't want to trivialize this at all, but it kind of puts me in mind of what Casey Kasim used to say on that American Top 40 radio show at the end of it.
He used to say, you know, keep your feet on the ground, but keep reaching for the stars.
You had to do that.
You have to.
I believe everybody has to, whether you've had these contacts or not.
And we're both showing our age because I remember Casey.
But yeah, yeah.
And even now, you know, that's what I try and tell people.
I'm one of many people.
I'm a clergy person.
So, okay, it gives me a little celebrity or notoriety.
But whether you are on, whether you've been visited or not, we have to be the change that we want to see in the world.
If you want more love in the world, then you have to be more loving.
If you want more forgiveness in the world, then you have to, like Gandhi said, you have to be the change.
And so we can create the world that we want.
You've got to put it out there to get it back.
Yes.
I couldn't have said it better.
And so we are part of the problem, but part of the solution.
And I'm a human being.
And I get up every morning.
You know, I got my own issues and what have you.
But I try to tell people or suggest to people, because you can't tell people anything, that this happened to me.
This is the lesson that I've learned from it.
But you have to glean your own lessons from it.
So when you went to the help group and you stood there with people who've been through this and you stood up and you said, you know, just like an Alcoholics Anonymous, I'm an experiencer.
My name's Michael.
Yeah, I'm an experiencer.
I can imagine it.
Did you at that stage understand what the encounters you had were for?
Had you been told, had they told you?
Okay.
Yes and no.
Down the line, I was told by pictures because they don't, these, the brothers I'm talking to you about, well, most of them, they didn't really talk except through either pictures or I would hear their voice in my head.
Their mouth wouldn't move.
It's telepathy.
But all I know is I started growing.
I started reading Andre Malraux.
I started reading Existentialist.
I started reading Kierkegaard.
I started expanding my horizons from the little colored boy who was just, Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life.
Yes, that's true for some people, but there were other things.
And so I started broadening my horizons and reading philosophy, studying metaphysics, quantum physics.
And so I got a broader Weltanschung, a broader perspective that I was not separate from creation, that I am part of it, and that there was no Santa Claus God up in the sky judging me if I was naughty or nice,
that I was part of all that is, and that I was responsible for my reality, that I needed, I couldn't control what happened to me, but I could control, and I put both of those times, I put them in quotations, I could control my reactions.
That's all I was responsible for.
I started really getting it, that there's a law of oneness, and what I do to you or the planet, I also do to me.
I also started getting by on less sleep.
I also started knowing that my hair and nails and stuff like that grew much faster than usually.
And I was just more open.
I started looking.
Yeah, and my dad and my spiritual growth was accelerated.
And let's just slip this into your chronology.
Let's relate it to the rest of it.
At this stage, were you preaching?
Yeah.
But I wasn't telling anybody.
Look, I was like my government.
I didn't tell them everything.
Didn't you feel like a hypocrite?
No, because, you know, you meet people at their map of the world.
It didn't change what I believed on a basic level, that love is the glue that holds us together.
That never changed.
What it did open me up to was that there were other paths than the one I was on.
Wonderful position to be in, but were you relating in that period where you were finding it a little difficult, perhaps, at times, were you relating what you'd experienced to your faith?
Yeah.
Or the other way around, was your faith kind of reaching out to them?
No, I'm sorry, Howard.
I'm talking over you.
I'm sorry.
No, I'm sorry.
It's me.
I'm talking over you.
I'm sorry.
I'm just, I'm so really enthralled by what you're saying.
So forgive me if I rab it away.
No, no.
What happened, brother, was that I couldn't put old wine into new wineskins to quote a famous rabbi from 2,000 years ago.
I couldn't fit myself into the old paradigm.
I could accept the old paradigm.
I could see how that paradigm would work for other brothers and sisters, but it no longer worked for me.
And on the other hand, I was realizing that mine wasn't a better way.
Mine is only a different way.
And so, but what a difference 20, 25 years makes.
Because I say this now, and people don't bat an eye.
I mean, some do.
But at that time, I couldn't talk about my own experiences.
I could talk about the people whose shoulders I'm standing on.
People like Eric Van Donegan, people like Dr. Barry Downing, who's a retired Presbyterian minister, people like Reverend Virginia Brazington, a woman who lived in this part of the country back in the 50s and 60s, Brother Morris K. Jessup, who died under mysterious circumstances, they all wrote about Christianity and religion and UFOs.
So I stand on their shoulders.
I would not be here if not for them.
So I stand on their shoulders, but I just, I try to meet people at their map of the world.
And so, and I have nothing to prove.
If people want to talk about it, I'm not trying to convince anyone.
I'm just telling people about what happened to me.
And then if they want to research it and take the ball and run with it, I say great.
Here comes a question that I've asked more times than I can even calculate on this show.
Why do you think they picked you?
Well, I didn't know at first until I went to a friend of mine who was a very, very talented psychic.
He's long since passed on.
This is before we had the pharmaceuticals to treat AIDS.
So he died from AIDS.
Very talented brother.
And his name was Eugene Michael Ashley.
I mean, gifted psychic.
And one day I went to his home up in Harlem.
And, oh, you're going to see how quick I was getting ready to lie.
This is when I was really trying to process all this stuff.
And he says, sit down, Michael.
He says, I see you brought some friends with you.
I said, what are you talking about?
He said, come on, man.
I said, no, what are you talking about?
He said, there's some people here.
They remind me of elves.
They're four feet tall.
And he described them.
He said, are you telling me you don't know these people?
They're friends of yours.
And what did I do?
I said, I have no idea who or what you're talking about.
And he said, well, that's interesting because I'm not going to do this reading unless you come clean.
And he said, they're here.
They told me that they've known you from Atlantis and Egypt.
They said that you are very fear-based, but you have potential like most of the planet.
And I finally broke down.
I said, yeah, I met these people in December.
He said, yeah, what are you afraid of?
And that's how, and he said, they told him.
Now, they also showed me, but they told him that Michael has been involved with us since Atlantis and Egypt and beyond.
And he gave me a whole bunch of information.
But several months later, one of them came into my room and I was paralyzed because they used to do that at the beginning.
And he showed me a picture of me as a monk in the Catholic Church with a high-ranking monk with the little haircut that leaves the bald head at the top.
And I forget what you call it.
I had on a robe with the rope belt.
And then he had me right next to it in a three-piece suit talking to a congregation, which did happen several months later.
Almost the exact words I was using.
So the implication here being that you were always an intermediary between them and us?
Not only that, which is exactly, but that's why I'm so comfortable in the church.
I mean, I just, it was, I knew as a kid that I was going to be in the church.
Now, that I was going to be a priest.
It could have been a secular priest, like a therapist or whatever, but I knew as a kid that I was going to be giving messages in front of large groups of people.
And I just knew it.
But with that background, why not use the talents that you have?
And so I'm very comfortable in houses of worship.
And why not?
I've been doing this for many, many lifetimes.
And you have a church now?
I do.
I serve a Unitarian Universalist congregation here in Black Mountain, North Carolina.
And when you say Unitarian Universalist, does that particular branch of the faith embrace the stuff that you've been through?
Presumably it does.
Well, no, no, no.
Well, yes and no.
First of all, it's a very progressive, we don't believe in the Trinity.
We're a very progressive branch of the Protestant Reformation.
When I go to church on Sunday and speak, I speak to atheists, Buddhists, Christians.
I mean, it's everybody is in the congregation.
They are very rational people, but no one's asked me to leave.
There was one woman there who was very upset that her minister was on ancient aliens and talking about UFOs and what have you.
And my board said, what's the big deal?
He's not preaching this from the pulpit.
It's not a big deal.
So that was kind of nice to hear.
But I have people who come to the church who come because they've seen the TV show.
They come because they've read the book.
And I tell them, you know, I'm glad you came, but I don't preach a UFO theology.
And I presume there are many places within scripture that you can point to and say, this is all perfectly acceptable.
And we start from in God's house, there are many mansions.
Well, yes, yes.
Jesus said that.
I mean, and he said, in my father's house, and there are many mansions.
Now, that can be interpreted many ways.
I interpret it as there are other people who follow this path, but they don't have to be Christian.
Jesus wasn't a Christian.
You know, but when he says my father, okay, I believe he meant that.
If your father's not human, and your mother is, and we assume that Miriam was human, Mary in the Greek, then Jesus is not fully human.
It accounts for his miracles.
It accounts for his healing ability.
It accounts for, if you want to say, he rose from the dead.
It could account for that.
It accounts for when he goes back up in the sky at the end of the gospel stories in a cloud.
I mean, our ancient ancestors weren't stupid.
They knew that you don't fly on clouds, but that was the vernacular of the day.
And we know that modern UFO sightings, a lot of these ships camouflage themselves in clouds.
A lot of them, when they travel, they look like they're traveling in a crowd, in a cloud.
If we go back to scripture, if we go back to Moses, remember they call the ship the pillar of cloud by day and the pillar of fire by night.
At night, a lot of these ships are encased in a glow and it looks like they're on fire from the glow.
So just like we don't say, we say UFO instead of unidentified flying object, it's too long.
Well, probably in the day of Moses, it was a pillow of cloud by day, pillow of fire by night.
By Jesus' time, several thousand years later, it's the cloud.
Do you get a lot of emails from fundamentalists?
I don't because they've come in, a lot of them, not all, have come into the camp.
And I'm talking about people like what's his last name, Marzuli, L.A. Marzuli.
What they've done is they've come up to speed into the 21st century.
Now they will admit that there is a possibility of extraterrestrial life or that extraterrestrial life exists.
But what they've done is, but now they say, but they're all evil.
They're all the fallen angels.
So to me, that's evolution.
Before, you said they didn't exist.
Now they do exist, but they're evil.
And we know human evolution is slow.
So I'll take anything I can get at this point.
So from what I love that.
From what we read and what we know, some of them are a bit evil.
Well, yeah, but listen, brother, you are right.
Well, I wouldn't use the word evil, but I would say this, but aren't human beings?
I mean, we can't expect all of them to be, we don't expect all human beings to be benevolent.
They want to hold our hands and sing kumbaya.
Well, why would we expect that to other beings in the universe?
Everybody's more evolved and less evolved.
Most of the people I've spoken to who've had alien contact, and some of them I really do believe that they had alien contact and it wasn't an artifact of their imagination.
They came into contact with something, I'm sure.
Most of these people tell me that they have had a message delivered to them, which they have been expected to pass on.
So what's yours?
It's the same probably that they have.
I mean, it's not sexy.
It's probably that we fight too much, that we are too violent, that we are caught up in the illusion of separateness, that love, in the words of Dr. King, love defeated is still more powerful than evil triumphant, if you want to use those words.
And that if we don't wake up from the illusion of separateness, we're going to destroy ourselves.
See, no big message.
We've been hearing this from saints and sages and avatars for years.
But now we really need to start walking our prayers, to walk our talk.
There's a whole world out there.
And that these beings are not here, at least the ones that I've run into, they're not here to conquer.
They're not here to take over.
They're trying to take us to the next stage of human evolution.
But our fear is what keeps us from going to the next phase.
If they want things to improve for us, and presumably they've been involved in our evolution for a very long time, well, we know that.
Why aren't they a bit more proactive?
Why don't they get involved a bit more?
Well, I can't speak for all of them, but there is something to be said, like with children, that you learn lessons best when you experience them themselves.
And you also have to realize that people would fall down and worship them.
And what they're trying to say is, we are what is potential in you.
Same thing Jesus was saying.
Jesus wasn't saying that you need to worship me.
He was just saying that greater works than I do, you can do.
But you know how we are.
We give our power away so easily.
And so Jesus is the great example, not the great exception.
And as are some of these off-world intelligences.
And we are potential, maybe thousands of years behind, but it's about our inner life.
It's about cultivating our inner life.
And because right now we're slaves to technology.
And just because you have technology doesn't mean you have the spiritual maturity to go along with it.
And with the technology we have, instead of working on free energy, we want to make weapons.
We make drones.
We put satellites up that can monitor and have surveillance over people.
We're like three-year-olds playing with a gun.
Have they confirmed to you, the aliens, that things like free energy exists?
Have they told you that those things are there for us, but we've got to take them?
They haven't.
But if you can get here from another planet or another dimension, I think they know how to work with energy in ways that we don't.
And through these encounters, Michael.
Remember, Tesla told us about free energy.
We don't need a space person to tell us.
Tesla told us about it.
But a lot of his discoveries were, from what we understand, disappeared, weren't they?
Yes.
Yes.
Because Exxon and BP don't want you to know about free energy.
I'm sure they could probably have cures for some of our diseases.
But for instance, my mom is a cancer survivor two times.
My ex-wife is a breast cancer survivor.
What would happen if a cure to cancer was introduced tomorrow?
A lot of money would be lost.
I'll leave it at that.
That's something that's very hard to argue with because a lot of people say that, that a lot of these things exist.
But, you know, there's a difference between vested interests and the interests of humanity.
Maybe that's the case.
I don't want to dwell on that too much for obvious reasons, but it's a fascinating thing to ponder, isn't it?
Just by the by.
So there you are having encounters, but there you are standing up there and preaching.
What was the point at which you felt able to go into a church and admit to this?
Well, I didn't.
It was an open secret, if anything.
People started seeing me on TV.
And so even, you know, I get people stop me on the street and say, you know, so that was it.
People started seeing me.
They started buying the book.
I was going to these conferences.
For me, for me, the Bible is many things.
The Quran is many things.
But to me, it still is a transmission from off-world intelligences.
If Jesus, in my opinion, either was a hybrid or hung out with a lot of people from other places, his message is off-world, to love your neighbor.
That's radical.
It's dangerous.
We saw Dr. King and Gandhi lose their life over it.
So whether I throw in a quote from Whitley Striber, which I do every now and then, whether I may throw out a comment like, I don't know how it is on other planets, but on our planet, what you put out comes back to you.
Whether it's throwing out little cryptid things like that, I'm still saying the same thing.
Just a strange thing.
You know, the longer I live, Michael, the more I believe that there's nothing really random about our existence.
And, you know, my life has been strangely guided in weird ways.
I mean, I'm not, you know, I'm sure of my own sanity.
I'm not saying that from an insane standpoint.
I'm pretty sure that that's the case.
And I've tended to find that in my life, those things that I have wanted for better or worse, and be they professional aims or whatever, usually they've come to me because I've got apparently a powerful mind and that's the way the universe works.
Now, they haven't always been good for me, but they have come to me.
And I think maybe that's how it all works.
It's all part of this circle, isn't it?
It's all part of this.
You put stuff out there, you get stuff back.
But that's a very powerful message, what you're saying, because you're saying a number of things.
You're saying I'm responsible for my life.
You're saying that I co-create.
Now, yes, they're variables.
We don't want to say if someone has cancer, you gave it to them.
They gave it to themselves.
Although on one level, we could argue that, and it doesn't always have to be past lives.
But, you know, and what we've been taught from the church is that your power lies outside of you.
But what they're trying to tell us is you are part of all that is.
And so your power lies within you.
But for many people, that's blasphemous.
Well, indeed, I mean, that's the biggest disconnect of all, isn't it, between where you're at and where the Orthodox churches are, because they say you can absolve yourself, you can get salvation by reaching out to something beyond yourself.
And you're saying, on the basis of what you've experienced, it's the complete reverse.
Right.
And this is not new.
I mean, Jesus got in trouble with the Pharisees and Sadducees.
When he says, I and my father are one, he's saying, yeah, he and his father, because his father, I believe, was an ET.
But he's also saying, I am one with all that is.
Okay, so you got that message going, and then you got the politics of Rome, and it just didn't end well for him.
Do you ever fear for yourself saying some of these things?
I mean, you know, this is the United Kingdom.
You can say that here.
But I do know that there are places on earth where it would be very difficult to hold the standpoints that you do.
Well, more and more people consciousness is being raised.
I mean, I wouldn't go into one of these Baptist churches here in the mountains and say it.
And why?
Why disrupt?
Why, you know, why even do that?
But more and more people are saying it.
And so I just, again, I try to meet people at their map of the world.
I'm not trying to prove or argue with them, but this is something that's happened to me.
So the short answer is no.
I don't fear for it at all.
I mean, listen, people can turn on the television.
They can get on the radio and hear it.
What I will not do is debate it.
Why?
Because I'm not here to change anybody else's mind.
I'm here to put the information out and let people make their own decisions.
And were you told that by them or have you come to that conclusion yourself?
I've come to that conclusion, even if I hadn't had them.
Part of the reason people turn away from religion and part of the reason people are fighting, let me put it this way.
I'll be 58 years old next Thursday.
So I'm speaking on the micro level, but I think it's true on the macro level.
As I get older, it's more important for me to be at peace than to be right.
And I can relate to that.
Yeah, debates just wind up about who's trying to be right.
It just doesn't...
Don't even want to imply that.
But I'm saying I just, it's just not important to me that I'm right.
And the fact of the matter is that, okay, some people do walk a difficult path.
You know, Martin Luther King did, but trying to persuade people of certain realities, Mahatma Gandhi did as well.
Various politicians sometimes have paid the ultimate price for trying to change beliefs.
But at the end of the day, there will be a hardcore of people who simply will not be swayed.
It's almost like, and I don't want to trivialize it again, but it's like that Don McLean song, Vincent, isn't it?
They did not listen.
They did not know how.
Well, always.
And see, they were called for that life.
They were called for that.
King knew he was not going to live to be an old man.
If you're called to that, that's something else.
I'm not called to that.
But what I am called to do is to live the life that I say.
So I can talk about this too.
I'm blue in the face.
But people will say did Michael Carter try to love somebody?
Did Michael Carter, did Reverend Michael Carter try to serve somebody?
Did Michael Carter try to walk the talk?
That's all that's important to me.
I don't know how recent your alien contact has been, what the most recent one might have been, but I wonder what they, and that's a big generalization because there are lots of variations of they, make of the state we're in at the moment.
well, we've got various economies in various appalling states.
We've got IS, whatever you want to call them today, and the ever-present threat to some of our nations that they represent or people who act on their behalf represent.
This world is in a mess, and that is before you even start to think about how we're polluting the place and overpopulating it.
I know.
And so I would venture to say that the brothers and sisters that I've been in contact with are concerned, and that may be an understatement.
But I've also come to something, life is beautiful.
This is a beautiful world.
If you've got some love in your life and maybe some resources in the bank and your health, we've got a lot to be thankful for.
And what I've come to believe, and I'm not saying this is right for everybody, but instead of focusing on what we don't have, if we focus on the world we want, we can co-create that.
A lot of people get overwhelmed.
What can I do?
You know, I can't change Putin's policies.
I can't change Obama's policies.
I can't change the whole big mess of climate change or racism or police brutality, but I can be the person I say I want to be.
So that way I'm part of the solution.
I'm not here to monitor another person's spiritual growth.
I'm here to live as authentically as I can.
And that's enough.
And if we had a nuclear exchange right now, I could go to my grave or wherever I would probably be disintegrated knowing that in my life, I tried to be part of the solution.
That's all we're called to do.
If everybody did just that, instead of worrying about how Howard's living his life and who he's sleeping with or who Obama's sleeping with or who I'm sleeping, if we could just do that, we could raise the vibration of this planet.
Problem is, it seems to me, and maybe I'm listening to the wrong outlets and looking at the wrong things, that there's an awful lot of hate in this world.
You know, I listen to a radio host over there most days because I just want to know what he's going to say next.
But he routinely calls Obama a liar.
And he calls the prime minister here, David Cameron, whether you like this man or whether you don't like this man, he's going to be our prime minister in the UK for the next five years.
Calls him a liar.
And it just seems to me that whatever you feel about this, and I don't know what to think about politics, I don't even go there now, but there's a lot of hate in this world.
It is a lot of hate, but you know what?
We just talked about quantum physics, your mind.
You focus on what you want to create.
If you're broke, you have to retrain yourself not to concentrate on brokenness, but to focus on prosperity.
You know, basic quantum physics, what you focus on, you create.
And how have you changed your own life, Michael, by using these principles that you learned?
How would you quantify the difference you made in your own life?
I live my life less fearfully.
Great.
So are you scared of anything?
Oh, yeah.
No, I decided I've got rid of fear, but I live it less fearfully.
And so therefore, I open up myself to possibilities.
And when I don't, like one of the things I had to do, Howard, when I was trying to deal with the fear I have and still have to a degree, much less of waking up in the middle of the night and someone in my home, I looked at where else, Michael, do you have fear of the unknown?
Where else in your, whether it's in relationships, whether it's in your job or whatever?
So I used it.
I took the fear and didn't overcome it.
Remember, courage is not the absence of fear.
Courage is going on despite the fear.
So I embraced it.
And I'm not special.
We can all do this.
It's just that we have to be encouraged to do so.
And so like Yoda says in Star Wars, which I've never seen too many of them, but you have to unlearn what you've learned.
And sometimes it's more difficult to learn something new than it is to unlearn what we've learned.
But every day, we get to choose between love and fear.
Every day.
Some days we choose fear.
But we also have a chance to change that.
I think maybe a lot of hatred is based on fear.
I think it is, because it's the belief of separateness.
It's the belief that you have something I don't.
It's the belief that you're separate from me.
And so whether it's the planet, whether it's race, whether it's sexual orientation, you are different from me.
And that's fear.
And somehow, and it's happening slowly but surely, human evolution can be glacial, but it does happen that we get it, that you are my brother.
You're across the pond from me, but you are my brother.
And what I do and think about you reflects who I am.
What I do to the environment reflects me.
It all comes back to me.
Okay?
And, you know, it's karma.
It's what goes around comes around.
The CIA, our intelligence apparatus, they use the term blowback, which means when our foreign policy or when our policies in other countries come back and blow up in our face.
So even they acknowledge it.
And so it's what you put out comes back to you.
Have they ever communicated with you about the race thing, which is, you know, it's a factor all over the world and was for many years in America and in this country too.
I've never really got, I've never really computed how some people judge other people on factors other than what they are.
But that's the way that it still works in some places, and it's utterly bizarre.
But I wonder if they've ever had an explanation of it for you.
No, it's a great question.
Well, my parents taught me to look at people individually and how they treat us.
But for me, if you read my bio, I was recognized by President Clinton for my anti-racism work.
I'm a diversity consultant.
To me, what I'm doing with them is an extension of diversity work because I've seen three different races and we know they're more.
And I'm embracing that.
And I'm trying to get us to look past the xenophobia and our fears to embrace brothers and sisters not only different from us, but not even from this world.
And when you know that they're all out there, any stupid little differences we might think we've got down here between each other are laughable.
Yes.
They don't even deal with race the way we do.
They don't even see it the way we do.
They don't even look at that.
They're different species.
I've seen a reptilian.
I've seen, I guess we'll call them grays for lack of a better word, even though they weren't gray.
And I've seen the Nordics.
Three different distinct races.
When you read the literature, some people say these races work together.
But they're not looking at, well, he's black and she isn't.
They're looking at who's intelligent and who's not, who's got some depth to their soul, who sees past the illusion of separateness.
That's what they're looking for.
Well, I think they've got it right by the sounds of it.
The reptilians, we're told that they shapeshift and they're among us all the time.
Do you buy that?
I think they all could shape-shift if they wanted to.
I don't know.
I'm sure they could.
You know, listen, we're talking about the topic says anything is possible.
What I will put out there is that this, all reptilians or all so-called grays are not evil and they're all not here to take a, I know David Icke has his, he has his own kind of perspective and bless him, but I'm here to tell you that that's not true.
Whenever people start saying all or they or those folks, whether they're human or non-human, I always get a red or a yellow flag because it's called stereotyping.
And it's based in fear and ignorance.
Okay, so there you are trying to make a difference in a small way, not trying to preach to the world, not trying to bite off more than you can chew.
You're 58.
Did you say next week?
Yeah, July 9th.
Happy birthday.
Okay, Cancerian, good people.
Oh, yeah.
Oh, yeah.
I'm a Gemini, but they're very, very close, you know, very close on the calendar.
In your remaining years, Michael, what kind of a difference do you want to make then?
What do you want to do?
Do you want to have more contact?
Do you want to get clear messages out of them that you can pass on?
What do you want to do with your remaining time?
I want to, well, the contacts are in their ballpark.
I think I will continue with them when they're ready.
When was the last one?
Did we go through that?
When was your last contact?
The last contact I had when they were in my room was July 4th, 2013 at 9.50 a.m.
I've seen them in my meditations, but as far as seeing someone in my room, that was July 4th, 2013 at 10 minutes to 10 p.m. here.
And what do you remember of it?
What was it about?
It was a blonde-haired, blue-eyed brother who looked like he had gone to the gym.
He had on a cowl, you know, with the hoodie.
And he had a rope tied around his robe.
And I had been ill with a very severe blood clot.
It was a rough time in my life.
My wife and I had split up.
My dad had died.
And I had a blood clot, which I'd never had before.
He came into my room.
I saw him.
He just appeared.
He held his hand out and a green light hit me in my stomach as I sat up.
No pain at all.
And then he kind of dissolved, like his molecules went away.
So he came to heal you?
Yeah, because that day, the next day, that blood clot was gone.
I went to the doctor.
I did not tell them what happened.
They could not explain it.
I'm a very thin person.
I mean, I swim, I do yoga, but I'm not a bulked up person.
And my right leg was as big as LeBron James.
I wish I had calf muscles that big.
They went from the clot was from my ankle to my groin area.
The next morning when I got out of bed and looked down at my legs, they were the same size.
I didn't have this self.
I didn't think about a selfie, but I showed my wife and my daughter who had known about my visits and they couldn't believe it.
They were like, oh, my God.
So there were people in your line of work who would call that a miracle.
Well, you know, I call it a healing.
I think that miracles are laws of nature that we just aren't privy to.
Now, I'm sorry, I interrupted you, and I'm really sorry for that because I'd asked you, hadn't I, how you wanted to spend your remaining time.
Oh, well, being a good father to my daughter, being a good parent, and to continue to grow spiritually, to travel a little more, like to come to London at some point, and just to love, just to continue to open my heart and live less fearfully.
And I think everything else will fall into place.
Well, let me know when you come to London and I'll show you around.
That's a deal.
I will Skype you.
I mean, we've only just really touched the surface here, but what I said this conversation was about was to introduce you to my audience.
You know, the audience that is not only in the United States and Canada, but is in the UK.
And as I said, looking east out towards the Far East and New Zealand and Australia, those people who may never have heard of you unless they've seen you on those TV programs.
Oh, yeah.
That's the deal here.
But my book is available at Amazon UK.
And indelicate question, but, you know, journalistic training, got to ask them.
Are you making money out of this?
No.
No.
It sounds glamorous.
I go to New York to Ancient Aliens.
They give me a couple hundred dollars as a stipend.
They pay for my airfare and my meals, and they fly me back.
And so that's pretty much it.
I just came back from a contact in the desert, one of the largest UFO conferences here a month ago.
They gave me a stipend.
I had to pay for part of my airfare.
They didn't take care of my parking or anything like that.
I sold my books.
Hopefully, people will buy the books from hearing me, but no, I do many things to supplement my income.
I'm not even at the church full-time.
They can't afford a full-time minister.
What happens if I sell my books or someone calls me to speak on a topic, that's how I survive.
And if the books really caught fire, I'm not talking about literally, but, you know, if the books really took off.
You'd be in a bad state.
But if they really took off around the world and you started raking in the money from the Amazon sales and all the rest of it, and you made half a million dollars, say, which is more than most of us can imagine making in a very long time, what would you do with the money?
Probably I give my parents some money.
They're still alive.
I give my ex some money and my daughter.
And I put some money in the bank so I don't outlive it.
And the rest I could really get rid of.
I mean, I could give it to charity.
I could give it to someone on the street.
Yeah, I don't need a lot to live comfortably.
I mean, I live in a little two-bedroom apartment here.
My wife has the house, which is lovely, and I'm glad she has it.
We're still very good friends.
You know, I'm comfortable.
I got my Egyptian statues.
I've got some E.T. statues.
I've got some movies.
I don't need a lot to live.
I stay the same weight.
So if I go speak somewhere and I put on a suit to be presentable, you know, because I swim, I don't really need any clothes.
I mean, my needs are pretty taken care of, pretty much taken care of.
And I think what a lot of people don't get is that you don't need money to be happy.
You need money to subsist and you need a certain level to make sure that you don't fall into poverty.
But beyond that, I've seen countless examples.
Look, in my career, you know, I worked on some big things, but never made any money.
But I know people who've got loads of money and they're not happy.
They're not happy people.
I tell you what I would do, though.
I would definitely come to London because I want to see Europe.
Excuse me.
You guys seem so much civilized, so much more civilized in a lot of ways.
Well, not every way.
Maybe Amsterdam, you know, maybe Italy, places like that.
But I mean, I don't need a lot of money, so I probably give a lot of it away through charity.
I mean, I give money away now, but not as much as I could if I had more money or if I give it to the homeless person on the street or buy a meal.
I'd be cool with that.
These shows are recorded, and that seems to be the way forward for content like this.
People like to be able to download the shows and take them wherever they go.
I get wonderful stories of how people use these shows.
We're recording this on a Sunday.
Did you preach this morning?
No, actually, what I did was I went to someone else's church and let them preach to me.
Sometimes I got to get my batteries recharged.
And the last time you preached, you stood up there in front of the congregation, which you clearly did.
Yeah, last Sunday.
Last Sunday.
All right.
What did you preach about?
Last Sunday, I preached a sermon called Love, Courage, and Possibility.
And basically, I talked about where I think we're headed and that we don't have to get so upset about what we're doing to the planet.
We've been trying to destroy this planet for a long, long time.
I said, but what's hopeful to me is that we're waking up and that we're trying to undo some of the damage.
So it takes courage to make those changes.
It takes love and it also takes the vision of what is possible.
Well, I'll come and listen to you preach any day of the week.
You've just become one of my favorite guests, Michael, and I'm really pleased we had this conversation.
Let's do it again.
God bless you, Howard.
I hope we do it again.
Yeah, no, I hope we do it again.
And if people want to know about you, I know that you've got a website.
What is that?
Yeah, they can go to michaeljscarter.com.
That's my website.
Or just type in Reverend Michael J.S. Carter.
Just Google it and, you know, and everything will come up.
Right.
Well, we've done the introduction.
Next time we'll get stuck into the specifics.
Thank you very much.
Lovely to talk with you.
Many blessings.
Be safe and take good care.
You too.
All right.
Bye-bye.
The Reverend Michael J. Carter, and I will put a link to him and his work on my website, theunexplained.tv.
The website designed, created, and owned by Adam Cornwell at Creative Hotspot.
Thank you very much indeed for staying in touch with me for all of your support.
If you can make a donation to the show, that would be great.
Thank you if you have made one.
And I would love to hear from you.
Tell me where you're emailing from and tell me any details of your life and how you use this show that you'd like to share.
I'd love to get a picture of the people who are listening to this show, this family that we seem to have created over these years.
The one-stop shop to make contact with me or make a donation to the show is to go to the website theunexplained.tv.
So here we are in July and with the return of Art Bell imminent and various other things changing in our world, I think we're stepping into very exciting times one way or another.
Until next, we meet here on The Unexplained.
My name is Howard Hughes.
This has been The Unexplained.
I am in London.
Please stay safe.
Please stay calm and please stay in touch.
Thank you.
Take care.
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