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July 10, 2025 - Uncensored - Piers Morgan
37:45
20250710_utter-disrespect-gaza-ceasefire-trump-slams-putin-
Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Open Investigations and Genocide Claims 00:07:11
What they're doing is so repellent and morally obnoxious and atrocious to the world that they want to hide it.
But there are a lot of pieces of evidence that this is genocide.
That's not true.
Like many of us that you just said, it's not true.
They want the Palestinians in Gaza either out or concentrated in tiny little concentration camps.
If you look at it on its face, this isn't actually an attempt at ethnic cleansing.
It's an attempt to protect civilian lives.
We get a lot of bullshit thrown at us by Putin.
For you want to know the truth.
Finally, that President Trump's patience with Putin has been exhausted.
The world has changed.
You're not the superpower that dictates to the rest of the world.
People told Trump that, and I guess he needed six months for him to figure out on his own.
He has launched like the most massive attack on Ukraine, showing like he really doesn't care.
This like public slap on the face should be something that would tip the scale for President Trump.
President Trump again finds himself at the center of the geopolitical universe and he's certainly on a winning streak.
The U.S. strike on Iran's nuclear facilities divided his base, decisively ended Israel's 12-day war.
You can also point to NATO's historic spending commitment and peace deals between India and Pakistan, Rwanda and Congo as feathers in his presidential cap.
A ceasefire in Gaza looks set to possibly be next.
Well, the U.S. is guaranteed it won't allow Israel to unilaterally restart the war at the end of the 60-day agreement.
A third party backed by neither Israel nor Hamas will distribute aid, which should end the horrific incidents of desperate Gazans being killed as they try to get basic supplies.
Whether the IDF can remain in Gaza is a fundamental issue.
Some Israelis feel this deal will be a dangerous sellout if Hamas is allowed to regroup and if any hostages remain in their captivity.
And sellout is a word also being used liberally by the anti-war flank of Trump's mega base on the issue of Ukraine.
Last week, the Pentagon paused a weapon shipment to Ukraine, which is under record levels of bombardment from Russian drones and missiles.
The president says he didn't sanction that decision and the weapons are now on their way.
Last week, the Pentagon paused some shipments of weapons to Ukraine.
Did you approve of that pause?
We wanted to put defensive weapons because Putin is not treating human beings right.
He's killing too many people.
So we're sending some defensive weapons to Ukraine and I've approved that.
So who ordered the pause last week?
I don't know.
What did you tell me?
Well, Trump is clearly rapidly losing patience with Putin, who's rejected U.S. attempts to broke a peace.
We get a lot of bullshit thrown at us by Putin for you want to know the truth.
He's very nice all the time, but it turns out to be meaningless.
So big developments in two of the world's deadliest wars, but are either of them anywhere near to finally ending.
The debate I'm joined by Glenn Greenwald, co-host of System Update, by Kira Ruddick, who's the member of the Ukrainian parliament, and Emily Schrader, the Israeli-American journalist and broadcaster.
Welcome to all of you.
Glenn, welcome back to Uncensored.
We're going to come to Ukraine in a few minutes, but let's talk first of all about Israel.
Do you feel like another ceasefire is imminent?
And do you feel there's now momentum to actually bring this war to an end?
I mean, those are very different questions.
Let's remember that President Trump, with the very adept, skillful negotiating of Steve Woodkoff, did engineer what was proclaimed to be a kind of ceasefire that ought to lead to the end of hostilities the day before he was inaugurated on January 19.
And at the time, President Trump was assuring everybody that he succeeded in ending the hostilities.
But Benjamin Netanyahu, from the start, was telling his right flank, telling his country, telling the media, don't worry, this is a fake ceasefire.
We're going to observe it, get as many hostages back as we can, and then we're going to start bombing and invading even further.
That's the deal I reached with President Trump.
So I think anybody who looks at the series of ceasefires that have happened, but particularly that one engineered by President Trump, which was touted in the U.S. as a path to ending the war, but in Israel was openly talked about as a farce, I think has to be pretty pessimistic.
And then there's the added question of what are the terms of this ceasefire going to look like if it's going to be enduring, given that the Israeli government has said they want the Palestinians in Gaza either out, meaning ethnic cleansing, or concentrated in tiny little areas that they control with fences, what we once called concentration camps, and it's hard to see the world or the Palestinians accepting that.
Emily Schrader, I mean, there's no doubt if you listen to people in the Israeli government like Smodrich and Ben Gavir, they've been talking, not even hiding it, talking in a very clear way that they want all the Palestinians, Smodrich said, cleared out.
They want what most people would describe as ethnic cleansing.
Well, I don't think that the comments of Ben Ver and Smodric are representative of the general Israeli public, although they are certainly a problem.
And I oppose those statements in full.
I want to just clarify something about what Glenn said in terms of concentrating Palestinians in specific areas.
We're talking about in the midst of a war while there is operational activity going on by the IDF.
And obviously, it's preferable to have them out of harm's way in whatever way possible, the maximum number of people.
So if you look at it on its face, this isn't actually an attempt at ethnic cleansing.
It's an attempt to protect civilian lives, something that's been an ongoing problem since the beginning of the war.
In regards to what you said about the ceasefire, however, I do think the general public from right to left is optimistic.
They are very much looking forward to seeing some kind of agreement made.
I'm hopeful that that can be the case.
As we've seen, Hamas themselves stated that 80% of their capabilities and their territory, what they control has been reduced.
I do think that we do have potential that we haven't had since October 7th to actually see a change on the ground.
And I'm hopeful that that can be the case.
But when it comes to the distribution of humanitarian aid, I think it's very telling that one of the sticking points is Hamas insisting that the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation isn't the one who's distributing the aid when they've already distributed successfully 66 million meals.
And yet, why does Hamas want the UN to be the sole distributor or the Red Crescent?
What is it that they gain from that?
I think we need to ask ourselves that question because it points to the obvious answer, and that is that the UN and UNRWA has been corrupted.
They are in the back pocket of Hamas.
And that's not something that anyone, especially people who care about the Palestinian citizens, should allow.
But we've also had Emily Herat's newspaper have IDF soldiers talking to them and saying that actually they've been killing Palestinians who've been lining up desperately for food.
That has been now widely reported and disseminated.
And many people view that as a war crime.
Yeah, there are actually several open investigations, at least three of them that the IDF is currently investigating, and they very well should.
And if someone acted out of what was responsible under the IDF, what they're allowed to do, then they should be prosecuted and they should serve time.
ExpressVPN Defense Amidst War Crimes 00:03:24
Absolutely.
I have no problem with that.
That being said, the article in question has a lot of questionable claims that were being made, including a completely different translation from English to Hebrew in terms of what they were aiming at and what they were instructed to do.
However, even if they were instructed by someone that is a low-level commander, that's very different than something that's an operational command coming from above.
It needs to be investigated, and I trust that it will.
Kira Roddick, we're going to come specifically to Ukraine, like I said, in a few minutes, but just on Israel for now.
Do people in Ukraine, politicians, members of the public and others, do they feel like their own situation has been overtaken, if you like, overshadowed by what's happening in Israel and that Vladimir Putin has used the situation in Gaza as a cover to really accelerate the bombardment of Ukraine?
Absolutely.
This is what we have seen since October 7th, when the eyes of the leaders of the world were turned to Israel.
And of course, it allowed Putin to push us at the front line.
It allowed him to try to get back from this being political pariah.
And what we remember that basically Israel and Ukraine, we have one same enemy, which is Iran.
All Ukrainians know that Iran hates us because we are being attacked by Iranian drones, checkads, almost every single night.
And this is why obviously we are cheering for US attacks or for Israeli attacks on Iran, because we know that our physical survival depends on the success of these attacks.
If Iran will be also distracted from supporting Russia to defending themselves, then there will be less drones sent to Russia, less support to Russia, and there will be less attacks on Ukraine.
But of course, on the other hand, Israel and Ukraine, we are kind of playing at the same field when we are trying to get as much Western weapons as possible.
And we know that we need to get it again for our own survival.
And of course, every time the situation in Israel escalates, it decreases our chances to get enough weapons that we desperately need.
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Journalists Killed by Temporary Blockade 00:09:37
Glenn, this whole issue of whether Israel's been committing genocide in Gaza, there's no doubt to my mind that people like Smodric and Ben Gavir have been speaking in a genocidal way.
And that lends succor to this belief that there is genocide being waged.
The one thing that stops me from saying it definitely is, is the journalists have been banned from going into Gaza and can't independently report.
And so we're not entirely sure what is going on on the ground because the people that everyone's relying on are Palestinian journalists, over 200 of whom have been killed.
It's very, very hard to get proper information out of Gaza other than stuff that is posted on social media.
Do you believe that when this media ban inevitably at some stage is lifted, that we're going to find evidence not just of war crimes committed by the IDF, which may be why they've not wanted media in there, but also clear, clear evidence and proof that there has been a form of genocide waged.
Yeah, I think the scope of the atrocities that the IDF, obviously backed, armed, financed, and diplomatically protected by two successive American administrations, is nowhere near known to the world.
Obviously, the party that has blocked the media from actually being able to report on it, the independent media or international media that's not invested in the conflict, is the Israeli government.
I think generally, when one country is blocking the entire world media from seeing what it is they're doing, there's a presumption that that's because they don't want the world to know what they're doing, because what they're doing is so repellent and morally obnoxious and atrocious to the world that they want to hide it.
But there are a lot of pieces of evidence that this is genocide, including the reporting of Palestinian journalists, which I don't think should be inherently distrusted more so than, say, like a British journalist or an American journalist, especially since it's well documented with video, with film, with witness accounts.
But on top of that, Pierre, I just want to say, you know, this idea that, oh, there's a couple of Ben Gavir and Stroke, you know, are not representative.
Yov Golant, who was kind of considered one of the more centrist members of Netanyahu's cabinet before he was fired as defense minister, said when this war broke out that they intend to block all food, water, and medicine from entering Gaza, that they will do a blockade.
Cindy McCain, who's the head of the World Hunger Program, who comes from a family known for being extremely pro-Israel, extremely pro-Israel, watched this blockade that Israel imposed, not at the beginning of the war when Golant promised it, but also in the last six months, and said that it is not Hamas that's depriving the Palestinian people of food.
They cannot get their trucks in because the IDF and West Bank settlers and other people are physically blocking them pursuant to the policies of the Israeli government.
This is a starvation that has been imposed on the population.
The reason no one trusts Israel to administer this aid is because they've shown an utter disregard for innocent human life that the entire world has watched.
And there are massacres routinely happening at these aid centers.
That's why nobody trusts the Israelis or some new group that the Israelis approve of to distribute this aid.
And the evidence, Pierce, even without the media entering, you have Israeli genocide experts.
You have human rights groups from all over the world.
You have UN bodies.
And you have entire governments and countries.
You have the ICC.
And I realize any institution or media outlet that speaks negatively Israel is dismissed as anti-Semitic.
But there's a huge body of evidence and very competent experts and jurisdictions and tribunals, all of whom have concluded that what Israel is doing is at least ethnic cleansing and probably genocide as well.
And that's before we really even get to get in there and see the full scope of the proof.
Right.
I mean, Emily Schrader, you know, I've been really struck in the last few weeks by the number of Israelis and Jewish people that I know or don't know, who've just contacted me on social media, who I've met at socially at events and so on, who all basically have said to me, you know, none of us are comfortable about what is now being done in our name in Gaza.
This has gone on too long.
It's been too devastating on civilian loss of life.
The end goals of hostages released, of Hamas being completely wiped out, et cetera, have not been achieved.
And they feel increasingly uncomfortable.
And you've got Netanyahu, who's reliant on the likes of Smodrich and Ben Gavir for power, who've been sort of lent on and dictated to by these guys.
So when people say they're not that important, they're there.
You know, Smodrich is the finance minister.
He's one of the most powerful people in that government.
And he is saying, we want to kick all the Palestinians out.
And so I don't think it can just be.
The MP is polling.
Polling shows that a huge number of Israelis, a majority larger, share that goal as well.
They don't care about what happens to the people in Gaza.
They think that land belongs to Israel.
They want the Palestinians out, not just the people.
That's not true.
Like many other things that you just said, it's not true.
You mentioned it is true, and we'll show you the pause.
Israel not being trusted.
It's not Israel who's not being trusted.
It's not Israel who's distributing the aid.
You understand that the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation is not the IDF, correct?
You understand that exactly zero.
I answer that I said they were collaborating with that guy that were sent to the UN.
That were sent to the UN.
The UN was unable to distribute a single truck of aid.
Why?
Because Hamas raided and looted them before it was able to be distributed.
You've got to be kidding.
It was because the Israelis blockade.
Emily, Emily, Emily, just about the fact that we're not going to be able to do that.
That is not true.
It was waiting.
There is no evidence.
It was waiting on the Gaza side of the border.
It was the UN who didn't pick up the aid.
It was the UN who had a problem.
So when the Palestinians not received 66%, are you the one who wants Palestinians?
Let me just ask you.
Let me just ask you.
I just want to ask you, the Israeli government announced this blockade.
It wasn't just all these anti-Semites embedded in every organization in the world and the media outlets in the world that were saying that the idea was blockading it.
It was people like Cindy McCain, the World Health Program, multiple countries.
The Trump administration as well said they're very concerned about this.
Why deny what everyone knows is true, which is that the Israeli government blocked filled with water and medicine from getting into Gaza.
Can you deny that?
The fact that there was a temporary blockade, the fact that there was a temporary blockade does not reflect what's happening on the ground today.
You're conflating two different things.
One of them is a temporary blockade that was implemented by the IDF.
And the other one is what's happening several weeks.
The blockade was 12 weeks long, Emily.
12 weeks long.
And it wasn't a long time ago.
I'm sorry.
And I'm sorry.
Listen.
I'm afraid, Emily.
Hang on.
That was the distribution of aid when it comes to the Gaza Humanities.
Hang on, Emily.
Hang on.
It's not the same thing.
Emily, it was the blockade to me that really moved me to be increasingly vocal against what the Israeli government is doing.
Because when you take a war-torn population where half of them are under 18 and they're already dodging bombs night after night, day after day, and 50, 60, 70,000 have been killed, hundreds of thousands more wounded by these bombs.
And their life is terrifying as it is as Israel goes after Hamas.
And I don't dispute that's what they're doing, but in the process, they're killing so many civilians.
But when you then deliberately starve those people of food and aid for three months, that is a war crime.
You are not allowed to do that.
And actually, and actually, just to finish my point, hang on, Emily.
Have a minute.
What it does, it reinforces the belief that many people on the Palestinian side have, which is this has been a sustained occupation of Gaza for many decades, and that Israel has the power and the ability, as it showed early on when the war started, to turn on and off the water, to turn on and off the gas, to turn on and off the food supply, et cetera, et cetera.
When you launch, as Israel did, a blockade for three months earlier this year, you are sending a message to the people of Gaza and the world.
We have control.
We are the occupiers here.
And if we want to do this, we can do it.
And that is bad for Israel.
This cannot go on where you have that power over millions of Gazans, can it?
So let me respond to that.
I think that there's a couple of things that we need to differentiate.
First of all, when we talk about the water and the electricity, this isn't something that Israel entirely controlled.
When we talk about 12-week humanitarian aid blockade, this also is because of two reasons.
One of them is because they were orchestrating a new mechanism in order to actually get aid into the hands of the people.
Second of which is that according to estimates that they had on the ground, that this wasn't against international law on the basis of the fact that they have X amount of calories per person that exists already within the Gaza Strip.
Now, if that's incorrect, they should be held accountable.
And I do think it should be investigated if that's problematic.
But I can't say at this point in time what the actual specifications of that are.
I do know that there are reasons other than how you're framing it that go into this equation and they're important to consider on the ground.
Now, what I was saying about Glenn is talking about the distribution today, because he seems to think that the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation is somehow controlled by the IDF when that's not the case at all.
They're actually the only people on the ground right now that are able to get food into the hands of Palestinians who actually need it.
Okay, let me let me bring Kira back in and let's actually pivot to Ukraine now.
US Pressure on Russia and Ukraine 00:15:07
On Monday, President Trump reversed a hold on weapon shipments to Ukraine.
He told President Zelensky he hadn't ordered the freeze personally, which is a pretty extraordinary turn of events.
The blame is being put on Defense Secretary Pete Hegseph.
A, what do you think has happened here?
B, do you think that when President Trump came out and said that Putin was full of bullshit and so on, and is immediately the response from Putin is to launch the biggest bombardment of Kyiv that we've seen since the war began?
Clearly, those two things are probably linked.
What does this tell you about Donald Trump's patience with Putin?
And what do you in Ukraine hope this now leads to?
We hope, Piers, and we have like cautious hope that is finally that President Trump's patience with Putin has been exhausted and that we can expect some real peace-true strength that he has promised from the very beginning.
And this is why we all hoped that he would deliver on it.
And I think President Trump is allowed to have his time into understanding the situation.
And right now, this time is up.
First of all, there has not been any single fact since he has been in the administration that would support the idea that Putin really wants to end the war.
None.
And this is why it was all an illusion that President Trump or somebody on his team had to try to figure out something and to get Putin into at least ceasefire.
He was not even able to get Putin into ceasefire.
And so right now, it was a clear, absolutely clear sign of an utter disrespect because he made it publicly right after call.
And President Trump called Putin again.
He has taken him out of being a pariah into being a person that President of the United States is calling to.
And right after that, he has launched like the most massive attack on Ukraine, showing like he really doesn't care.
I think this disrespect, this like public slap on the face, should be something that would tip the scale for President Trump.
At least here we are very hopeful of this because we, Piers, we have done everything by the book.
Since that spat in the Oval Office, we have agreed to a ceasefire unconditionally.
We in parliament have voted for this mineral deal so the United States will have a strategic interest in Ukraine's survival and then further development.
President Zelensky went to Istanbul, even though we all knew that Putin wouldn't show up.
And so right now, again, the ball is not in our court.
We are defending.
It's very clear who can end the war and who should end the war.
And so right now, President Trump has many instruments in his hands to actually pressure Putin, start pressuring Putin, because since the day one, he was only pressuring Ukraine.
And it was pretty successful pressure because we have done everything that we were asked.
And then right now, like it's time to put pressure on Russia.
Yeah, I mean, I completely agree.
Glenn, I know you've got different feelings about this, but it seems to me, just from a political point of view, Trump has been careful not to publicly get into a slanging match with Putin.
But those gloves are off now.
And Putin's response to those gloves coming off has been pretty monstrous.
You know, this massive bombardment of Kyiv almost immediately was a clear slap in the face back at Trump.
What does this tell you about where we are with that relationship between Trump and Putin?
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I think that Trump seems to believe that with the American presidency that he won, somehow accompanying that is some kind of emperor status where he dictates to other countries what they're going to do.
And then if they're respectful, they abide by those orders.
And if they're not, they disobey them.
That's what he just did with BRICS saying to this counter alliance to the G20 meeting in Rio de Janeiro, actually this week where I am.
How dare you meet?
And if you meet, we're going to continue to punish you.
And a lot of the leaders of those countries said, the world has changed.
You're not the superpower that dictates to the rest of the world.
And this has always been what a lot of people raised when Trump was saying, when I get into office, I'm going to tell these people, knock it off.
And within 24 hours, the war is going to end.
Putin is the president of a large country.
It's a very proud country.
It has a big, rich tradition of the Russian civilization, the Russian empire.
And they believe, and I'm not saying it's true, and I'm just telling you what they believe.
And you go to Moscow, you talk to them, and you will hear this from everybody, not just from Putin oilists, but even from anti-Putin liberals, that the presence of NATO in Ukraine, that the encroachments of the West in Ukraine, that they're micromanaging of Ukraine through the 2014 coup, that their commitment to putting Ukraine in NATO are viewed by Russia as an existential threat.
And that is how they see it.
They need a buffer zone between themselves and NATO.
I'm just telling you how they see it.
You can snicker as all you want.
I'm not saying it's true.
I'm telling you that's their perception.
And if you want to try and get two countries to end a war, you have to understand how they think, not just scream at them that one is evil and one is good.
And so the idea that Putin was going to invest billions and billions of dollars into this war, lose tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of young Russian lives, and then simply end the war because President Trump tells him he has to was never realistic.
It was always a joke.
And people told Trump that.
And I guess he needed six months for him to figure out on his own that things just don't work that way.
Emily, you were putting a lot of faces there.
What's your response to that?
I mean, I just think that Trump did his due diligence in giving Putin a chance.
And he clearly has failed that test several times now.
And what I condemned from the very beginning, and I think also people like Kira, was exactly correct, that this is not how you force a dictator's hand in something.
It doesn't mean you have to go to war over it necessarily, but I think that there needs to be a very, very tough approach when you're talking about dealing with these authoritarian dictatorships, whether it be Ayatollah Khamenai or Putin himself or even the leaders of Hamas, that you do need to deal with a strong arm with these type of regimes.
There is no alternative because while Ukraine and even Israel and the Israeli public and even the Iranian people are interested in living in peace with their neighbors, the reality is that when we're talking about dictatorships like Putin, like Ayatollah Khamenai, they're not interested in that.
The goals, the agenda are not the same here.
And therefore, yes, they need major international pressure in order to force them to behave in accordance with international law and the international community.
But what does that pressure actually look like that's going to make any material difference?
Because as everybody knows, Russia has over 6,000 nuclear weapons.
United States has a little less than that, but NATO has more collectively.
Nobody wants to see a nuclear conflict triggered here.
What can the United States do that's actually going to put Putin back in his box?
Well, first of all, you know, I'll let Kira answer that.
Yeah, okay.
Well, Kira, yeah, Kirib, you're going to be able to do that.
Yes, well, please, this is my soul.
We are really hoping that the sanction package that Lindsey Graham and I think almost 90 Congress people have submitted on the secondary sanctions would pass the Congress and then will be supported by President Trump.
That would be the first sign, the first reality.
Do they work, Kira?
Do the sanctions work with Russia?
I mean, I was told that the Russian, like the economy is fine, you know, that they can carry on doing this for years if they want to.
We don't know if it is fine.
We see some signs and we have so many experts that are saying different things.
I think before saying, like, do these sanctions work, we need to say that from our side, we have done everything possible and impossible.
And as of right now, it is just not the case because Russia clearly, and by the way, not only Russia, Iran and North Korea, how long have been there under the sanctions?
And they were still able to manufacture whatever they want.
So it means whatever you have in your pocket, you need to put out there.
But the most important thing that needs to happen is not the sanctions, actually.
First is weapons for Ukraine.
Just provide us first with the defensive weapons so we will be able to sleep at night and have a chance to survive to the other day.
And I can tell you, there is one thing that is much worse than sitting with your family in a bomb shelter at night.
The thing is sitting in the bomb shelter and knowing that perhaps your air defense systems do not have enough supply to take down everything that is going your way.
This is so scary, I cannot begin to tell you.
And this is like at least the minimal thing that we need right now.
Secondary, of course, there is a list of weapons that we require.
And this list has been shared with Friedrich Meritz, with our European partners, and with the United States.
And it allows us again to target Russia's factories that are producing the weapons.
And there is a third thing, is Russian money.
As we're talking and everybody's saying, oh, we shouldn't be spending so much on Ukraine or whatever, there are still 300 billion euros that are being stored in the Belgium depository Euro clear.
And this money needs to be confiscated.
And here we are expecting that President Trump will put a pressure on our European allies to go ahead and do that.
And this is something that we can use to buy weapons from the United States, to buy weapons on a scale that will allow us to push Russia back and that will allow us at least have a chance in the survival.
Okay.
Glenn, you know, I'm much more cynical about Putin than I think you are in terms of, I don't dispute for a moment that when you say that's what most people in Russia think.
I think they've absolutely been conditioned to think that is why this has all been done, that this military operation, which was clearly just an illegal invasion of a sovereign European country, was done because they believed there was this existential threat and so on.
But there's a far more cynical interpretation you could put on it, which is that Putin, former KGB guy, didn't think the Soviet Union should ever be broken up.
He had a go at Crimea.
He won.
He took Crimea.
He had a pop at Georgia.
He's now invaded Ukraine itself.
He's likely to end up whatever happens with the territory that he currently occupies in Ukraine, I would think.
Most military experts think that.
But why would he stop there?
Is what I think is like, this is a guy that has shown increasing over the last 20 years aggressive intent with his neighbors.
And there is a belief that this is all a smokescreen, that actually what he would love to do is restore the power of the Soviet Union.
And if he gets away with it in Ukraine, he'll move into other countries.
I think one of the worst problems in Western discourse, and it probably is a problem in discourse of every kind, including non-Western ones, is that we love to imply or suggest that we follow certain rules that we're going to impose on other countries when, in fact, we constantly violate those rules all the time.
It's one of the reasons why there's so much resentment against American hegemony in the world.
They're seeking alternatives and bricks.
So just to give you an example, I heard from Emily, oh, this is a war about confronting brutal dictators, and brutal dictators are the ones who often start wars.
The United States's closest allies in the Middle East and increasingly Israel's as well are all brutal dictatorships, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, the Emiratis, the Egyptians, the Jordans, the Bahrainis, etc.
We love to embrace and prop up dictatorships.
We're not against dictatorships.
We love dictators as long as they serve our interests.
The second thing is this idea that we're going to just sanction Russia.
We've been sanctioning Cuba, a tiny little island in the middle of the Caribbean for 65 years to try and change their government.
It hasn't worked.
Venezuela hasn't worked.
Iran, it hasn't worked.
And the idea that we're going to choke Russia as a way for them to finally leave this war, I think is preposterous.
The third issue, you know, I think that is really worth noting is when, Piers, you know, you just talked about Crimea, Georgia, et cetera.
When the United States went into what was then Yugoslavia and broke up, the United States broke Kosovo off from Serbia on the grounds that the people of Kosovo didn't want to be part of Serbia.
And at the time, the Russians and a lot of other people in the world, including Putin, were saying, this is a really bad precedent.
Europe is pieced together by all these little provinces.
And a lot of people in those provinces don't have loyalty to the central government.
The people of Crimea, and you can dispute the referendum all you want.
Anyone who knows Crimea understands that overwhelmingly they identify as Russian and not Ukrainian.
Same with people in the eastern provinces in Ukraine.
Same with those two breakaway provinces in Georgia.
So we're the one who goes around the world demanding sovereignty for various provinces and breaking them off on countries on the grounds that they don't want to be part of those central governments anymore and then turn around and act like when Putin incites, invokes the same precedent, somehow that that is an act of evil, even though it's the same mentality.
And the last thing I want to say is, I've been hearing from Ukrainians for four years now.
Oh, just give us more, just give us more.
We're going to go.
We're going to expel the.
The problem with this war is that Russia is a gigantic country and Ukraine is a relatively small country.
The Russians can keep sending people to fight and to fight into the front lines, whereas the Ukrainians are running out of people.
They're expanding the age of the people who go.
They're people with sicknesses and disabilities.
They're not very well trained.
They get dragged off the street.
They don't want to go.
They're fleeing.
They're deserting because they know they're being used as cannon fodder.
This Russia, Europe and the United States have been drowning Ukraine in billions and billions and billions of dollars of weapons into the fourth year now.
And Russia continues to expand how much of Ukraine it controls.
It has 23% and the front line continues to move not toward the east back to Russia, but toward the West as they take more and more cities, more and more strategic territory, and huge numbers of people are dying.
This is what President Trump was saying.
The idea that if we just pour some more weapons, at some point the Ukrainians are going to be able to vanquish Russia is a complete pipe drink, no matter how much people wish that were true.
And at the same time, we're going more into depth, the United States is, and depleting our own stockpiles, feeding Israel, feeding Ukraine, all these foreign countries in their wars.
And the United States can't really afford to do that any longer.
That was the promise of the Trump movement was we're going to focus on our own people instead.
Okay, Kira.
Hang on, hang on, hang on.
Kira, I've literally, you've got a minute to respond, okay?
Morgan Uncensored: We Will Not Capitulate 00:02:23
But I want to give you just a chance to have a final word on what Glenn said.
This is simply not true regarding like where Ukraine stands.
I want to remind you that when the full-scale invasion started, nobody believed for the same reason that you mentioned that we would stand for a couple of days.
And then you see us fighting and we were able to regain some of our territories exactly at the time when we had some of the weapon support.
And we still believe that we can take our territories back because we are fighting for our own land.
But I want to bring a very important point.
Does anybody think that if there is an attempt to pressure Ukraine for peace or something, that Russia, China, North Korea and Iran will magically forfeit their idea of arming themselves, working together, manufacturing weapons, exchanging technologies and threaten the democratic world?
No, that will not happen.
And you will just see yet another precedent of appeasement of the dictatorship.
We are here in Ukraine.
We did not capitulate in 2022.
We do not intend to capitulate right now.
And what we are asking for is to give us the means to fight with.
And this is why here on the ground, I haven't heard like any single person who would ever say, oh, we are ready to forfeit.
We are ready to step down.
Everybody is still very motivated to fight back and to protect our land, protect our freedom.
This is why we are hopeful that President Trump can make America great again because this fact actually means either survival for us or an ability at least to have another chance in this fight.
Okay.
I've got to leave it there.
I mean, I would say that everyone thought that the Russians were going to take Kyiv in the first three days.
And three years later, they still haven't.
And that's just a fact.
I just want to add one thing about NATO really.
I'm really sorry, Emily.
We've run out of time.
I'm really sorry.
We'll get you guys back because I've really enjoyed the debate.
And I really want to thank you all for coming on.
Thank you very much.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you, guys.
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