Piers Morgan, Adam Boulton, and guests dissect Queen Elizabeth II's faultless state funeral, a 70-year reign defined by stoicism that united the UK against toxic tribalism. The segment details ceremonial specifics like the Royal Navy gun carriage, the breaking of the Lord Chamberlain's wand, and the emotional lowering of the coffin beside Prince Philip after 96 bell tolls. While addressing the Harry rift and King Charles III's daunting transition, historians argue the monarchy acts as a stabilizing chair amidst political chaos, leaving viewers to ponder if this peaceful succession marks the end of an era or a resilient future for British institutions. [Automatically generated summary]
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A Service Fit For A Queen00:07:55
Well good evening, welcome to a very special extended two-hour edition of Piers Morgan Uncensored.
Well that was magic wasn't it?
I mean I've been to all of events in my time.
I've never been to anything like what happened in London today at the Queen's funeral.
It was the single most spine-tingling, extraordinary extravaganza of pomp and pageantry and remembrance, commemoration and celebration of this unique woman.
London felt like the center of the world.
Emperors, presidents, kings and queens, hundreds of thousands of mourners, pilgrims lining the streets, billions watching around the world.
We all stopped.
We all came together.
We all said goodbye.
Goodbye to an exceptional lady whose service, duty and majesty will forever be unrivalled.
A rock of stability in a tumultuous world that changes fast and so often feels fractured, even fragile.
We also say goodbye to an era, to an age, and we did it in the most extraordinary style.
Every boot polished, every jewel glistening, not a foot or a feather out of place.
The monarchy and our military and the face that Britain shows to the world.
And to the thousands of servicemen and women who carried out today's ceremonies with such electrifying precision, it was utterly faultless.
I pay tribute to all of you.
You carry the weight of history on your shoulders.
You were perfect.
It was a service and a ceremony and a procession, not only fit for a queen, but for our queen, in my opinion, the queen.
And that's no small feat.
Amid the grief and gratitude, there was gravitas.
There's probably nobody else who could bring together such an extraordinary assembly of world leaders.
Probably won't ever be this again.
Queen Elizabeth II wasn't just a historic figure herself.
She transcended history.
And it's history that makes Britain and these state occasions unique in the world.
Take the funeral service itself at Westminster Abbey.
30 kings and queens are buried there.
Almost every monarch since William the Conqueror had their coronation there.
It's where the late Queen herself was married and crowned, where she marked the death of her own husband, a memorial this year.
The state gun carriage carrying her coffin was pulled by Royal Navy sailors, not horses, because the great Queen Victoria's horses were spooked by the cold at her funeral.
Now the tradition remains.
There's a remarkable story and history behind almost every detail of what we saw today.
Through 15 prime ministers and 14 US presidents, through social revolution, through good times and bad, there's no story that's more remarkable than Queen Elizabeth's.
I think we all felt the weight of that history today.
We shared it with a historic gathering of world leaders, with all these people watching from every corner of the world.
But somehow it still felt personal, didn't it?
Like we were saying goodbye to somebody we all knew, even though very few of us had much connection with the Queen.
Her life belonged to all of us.
Now it belongs to history.
The monarchy will go on in the age of King Charles.
Any questions of that have surely been vanquished by the outpourings of emotion and respect in these days of national mourning because politicians come and go.
They fight elections by cutting deals and dividing us, telling lies sometimes.
But the royal family holds us together.
They're the glue of Great Britain.
They keep our sense of nation and identity separate from the fray.
Nobody has ever, or I suspect will ever, do it better than this Queen, Elizabeth II.
Born as the only niece to an unmarried heir, she was ever supposed to be a monarch.
By quirk of fate, she ultimately became our greatest ever monarch and the greatest Britain.
And how lucky we are that she did.
Tonight, we say a final solemn goodbye to Her Majesty, who has been buried at a private service with her family in a few minutes' time.
And we get one last chance after 10 extraordinary days to say these simple words.
Thank you, Your Majesty.
Well, John, I was talking TV contributor Adam Bowl, former newspaper editor Emily Sheffield, and talk TV presenter Richard Seiss.
Welcome.
Emily, what a day.
I was at the palace all day, anchoring the coverage for Fox in America, where they're just as enthralled by all this as we are.
And I got there at 4.45 in the morning.
There's no one around here other than journalists.
And it was dark and it was eerie, but it was completely still.
I looked at the palace all lit up in lights and immediately I felt moved.
And then as the day progressed, I felt more and more moved.
And funny enough, it wasn't even the funeral service itself, which didn't seem to me particularly extraordinary.
It was everything around it.
It was this procession showing off the very best of our country and this monarch.
It was magical.
I mean, we were just discussing it.
I think the day got increasingly poignant.
I mean, I found so much.
There was this such incredible precision.
Every movement, every beat of a drum, every flag, every shiny button, there was nothing out of place.
But somehow within all that precision and that majesty and that pomp and that performance was this incredible room for emotion and beauty.
And it just kept carrying us through the day.
And I thought when I saw that movement, that incredible music, the bagpipes, the drum beats, the gong of the church bells when they went into Westminster Abbey.
But then actually, as the day progressed, for me, it became more moving, increasingly moving, and very emotional, actually, when she was doing the last stretch up to Windsor.
And they'd laid all the flowers pointing upwards towards the hill.
And actually, the crowds at that point had melted away.
So you could really focus on the coffin and the people around her and those she had served and were serving her in that final moment.
And then again, the bagpipes come, the drums, the gonging of the bell.
And I think that was more moving than earlier in the day.
Because at that point, I was just thinking to myself, this is it.
Well, I don't know.
This is the last of the bar.
Yeah, I mean, I felt that.
And actually, when they lowered the coffin, I felt profoundly moved by that moment.
And the breaking of the wand.
And the breaking of the wand, which has a sort of hilariously like, what's the relevance of this?
Where you check it's the Lord Chamberlain.
And historically, the wand was used to administer reproach, you know, administer, you know, telling people off.
We've been misbehaving in the royal household.
Lord Chamberlain's head.
Yes, literally like an old school game.
And then they break it symbolically and they put it down with the coffin.
They don't really explain why, but it's extraordinary moment.
And also the removal of the crown, because I don't know about anyone else sitting here.
We all know about the jewels.
We've seen them in the pictures.
But we've looked at them in great detail.
And that moment when they finally remove her.
Well, the symbolism.
And she starts lowering into the ground.
The symbolism of that.
Richard, you see.
I just want to tee you up, really, for what your most moving moments were, because I had a moment when the procession went past the palace, where I was all day.
And by now it was bright sunshine.
It was a beautiful day, wasn't it, as the day went on.
And we'd had a huge procession for like 20 minutes before the hearse actually got there.
And then the hearse went past Buckingham Palace, went round the side and right in front of the palace.
And all the Queen's staff were lined up to just pay their last respects.
And as they said goodbye, I realized I was saying goodbye, that that was the last time I'd ever see our Queen.
Prince Charles Shows His Feelings00:11:55
And I got quite choked up, actually.
And I was on air and had to make sure I wasn't doing it on air because it was just, I don't know, that weird moment when she's not a family member, but it felt like she was to all of us, right?
You did well.
I was in bits the moment the coffin came out of Westminster Hall.
and was put on the gun carriage by those incredible pullbearers.
I mean, you know, their job was the hardest of all.
First Battalion Grenadier Guards, and apparently five of them had actually flown back from operational duty in Iraq the moment the Queen died.
They were on the list of, I think, 30.
You said to me earlier, 30, I think.
But the enormity of that part of the procession and the sound, the drums, the bagpipes, going to the Abbey, that for me, that was actually sort of the greatest point and the lowest point in a sense, personally.
It was just so remarkable.
It was a bittersweet day, wasn't it?
Because on one level, it was desperately sad.
And I really felt that time and again, so many poignant moments where you just sort of held your breath.
And then other moments where you felt really celebratory about what all this was showing the world about what our country still is.
Completely.
We feel like we've lost so much in our country.
I mean, it seems like forever ago, but when I came back on September the 5th and Liz Truss had just been made prime minister that day, and I did this kind of tub-thumping, you know, tirade to Liz Truss to sort this broken country.
And you think, here we are, 10 days later.
But what we've done, actually, Piers, is we've shown that there are still things that we are the best in the world at, that we are brilliant at, and no one can do it like others.
And I think as we look forward, we've got to try and somehow draw confidence from it.
It's actually, we can do this stuff.
We can overcome the challenges on which there are many.
Well, if we can be the best in the world at something like this, we can continue to be the best in the world at many other things.
Great Britain, for all the people that try and rubbish the past of his country, we've produced so many world-beating people and things.
We just did.
And that's what made us Great Britain.
I feel that we spend all our time talking down the country.
And today was a chance to go, you know what?
Actually, we may be small geographically, but look at this.
And you tell me anyone else in the world that could do it like we could.
Adam, let me bring you in.
You've covered, I mean, every event since William the Conqueror.
No, to be serious, where did this rank for you as an event that you have witnessed?
I think, oddly, the most striking thing for me about it was that it was kind of less is more, by which I don't mean that the ceremonial wasn't executed absolutely perfectly.
It was.
But the whole day, at an emotional level, was restrained.
I mean, for me, I kept on thinking of the contrast and the similarities with the funeral of Princess Diana in 1997.
And in that sense, I think the whole day was a kind of embodiment of what Queen Elizabeth was.
Did you feel moved by it?
She was also stoical.
She was also disciplined.
And, you know, they didn't see a lot of people crying in either of the churches.
And, you know, she didn't cry either kind of thing.
I mean, that was the point.
I mean, the most sort of sentimental moments are probably when she walked past her favourite horse and the coffin was taken past the favourite horse.
And the Corgis and the Corgis and all that.
And for me, the most sort of heart-wrenching moment was at the end, the face of Prince Charles sitting in the pew after his mother had been taken down.
There was quite a long period where the camera stayed on him.
Because one realised, as you said at the beginning, that this was an end of a era.
There was certainty in terms of style and achievement about Queen Elizabeth.
And with Prince Charles, there's uncertainty now, not just about him, but where the country goes as well.
I mean, Emily, I looked at Charles and I saw a man who's probably utterly exhausted, emotionally and physically.
He's not only been mourning the loss of his mother, but he lost his father last, you know, a year and a half ago, whatever it was.
He is a man who's had to spend these 10 days showing us he can be king, touring the country, probably taking endless calls for world leaders and emperors and kings and so on.
This guy must be on his knees, and yet right to the end, I thought he was incredibly dignified, very regal, and very how I would like our monarch to behave in his life.
One would hope he would have taken some strength from his mother, because of course she became queen after the shock news of her father dying.
And she was 25.
She had not prepared really for the royalty.
She hadn't been all her life expecting to be queen.
Exactly.
So I think I would hope that, yes, I do think these 10 days would have been draining for a lot of people and emotionally.
But when you think what she went through, it was much more shocking, which would have been a lot of fun.
There was a lot of emotion, you know, from family members, most of which wasn't shown really much.
Andrew broke down when he was walking at one stage in the procession.
And you probably thought in his case, he's been through this terrible scandal.
We know his mother.
Apparently, he was the favoured son.
She was supporting him and she stood by him massively.
She never stopped supporting him.
He felt the loss, you know, particularly sharply, given that she's been this great rock of support to him.
You saw little Charlotte, Princess Charlotte, crying at one stage.
It may just be she was exhausted.
She's a young kid having this extraordinary day in front of the world.
Who knows what was provoking that?
I saw Edward and Sophie were quite tearful at one stage.
I saw King Charles at one stage was quite tearful.
And what it reminded me was that this is a real family.
And I keep stressing this to people.
We often treat them like a soap opera, myself included.
You write about them almost as if they don't really exist, that we're covering the shenanigans of Coronation Street stars on a higher level.
But actually, they're real people mourning the loss of their matriarch, this great figure.
But the message today was they're not real people in the sense that they're an institution.
Right.
And it's an ingenious thing.
Yeah, but I think there are two things.
I think it's Queen Elizabeth's message.
Very much so.
And she always put the institution even before personal interest.
But you saw the real people.
You saw that grief for all of them in their own different ways.
And I think in a sense, that's a good thing.
I mean, they have to grieve.
They have to be allowed to grieve.
They're obviously going to be mourning privately for the next few days.
And Charles must be utterly exhausted.
And actually, he needs looking after because what he's been through.
And I'm glad you've got Camilla, because I think she could be very good for him in a moment like this.
She's been going through this with a broken toe, I read in the Telegraph yesterday.
You can imagine, but this is their thing, isn't it?
This is the duty and selflessness.
You just get on with it.
The Queen's famous line, I think Jacinda Ardern, the New Zealand Prime Minister, was on BBC, the morning show on Sunday, saying that the Queen had said to her, she asked the Queen, how did you have children and still reign in the country?
And she went, well, you just get on with it.
Which was a classic Queen response, but it is the mantra of the people.
I think to Adam's point, that's why this does, why she did draw global attention, and this did as well, because you saw those pallbearers.
And when we were watching that last procession up towards Windsor, you saw all the people in front of that coffin.
Not a single one of them, their face didn't flinch.
It was utter discipline.
And I think in an age where everyone says everything, emotions are everywhere.
Prime Ministers talk about having babies and this, that, and the other.
This was a reminder of a sort of backbone.
And we, I mean, we do need a bit of backbone.
But actually, it's a great message.
Just get on with it.
You know, don't complain.
Just get on with stuff.
Just make it happen.
It's what the Archbishop of Canterbury picked up on his service.
Yes, she did.
You know, quite often at sermons, even for very important people, people attempt a bit of humour or to tell an anecdote, whatever.
And he didn't.
He just went straight in on this woman was 21.
She said she was going to serve the nation and that's what she did.
But he went on to say that if you do what she did and you serve others, then you win respect and love.
But if, as I think you then went on to say, and I'm not sure who he was talking to, but people like Boris Johnson were sitting there listening to this, you know, he went on to say that actually, if it's all about clutching onto power and privilege, then you quickly get forgotten.
And I don't know who he was alluding to in particular, but there were quite a few suspects in the room who might have had an awkward moment of self-reflection about what the Archbishop was getting at.
And of course, he was so right, because the thing about the Queen that, you know, I've been saying in the last 10 days, that she never chased celebrity, but was the greatest celebrity of them all.
She never chased love and adoration, but became the most beloved and adored figure of the country because actually she never clung on to power or showed off about the privilege.
But I do think they were, sorry.
I do think there was a particular thing that was very special about her is that she became our queen when she was very young.
So we have got these incredible films and pictures of this young woman then becoming the 96-year-old grandmother of the nation.
And that is a problem.
I think you're not going to get that with Prince of War.
Well, this is a problem.
King Charles, we're not going to get that with a Prince of Wales.
She was, I think part of the gravitash she gained was because of the length of her reign.
No, no, I totally agree.
That's why I don't think we're going to see anyone do 70 years again.
We might, but it's unlikely because she was so young when she began.
But I mean, Adam, I think Charles has an age and an aesthetics problem compared to his mother.
She comes in as a beautiful 26-year-old woman.
It's a dazzling coronation.
And she has plenty of time to grow into her role and become this great beloved monarch.
He has a clock ticking.
He's 75 years old.
He looks quite old.
There's no getting away from that.
I don't have a problem with an experienced, older monarch.
However, for him to make his mark as a monarch, like his mother, he's got to move quite quickly.
Well, I think he already has.
I mean, he's already shown himself to be different from his mother.
He has shown his feelings more.
He has gone out and seen people more.
I mean, my feeling is that because of his age and because everyone is very familiar with him, I mean, don't forget we are extremely familiar with Prince Charles.
That actually, for his reign, I think there'll be quite a lot of respect for him.
And unless things go wrong and they can always go wrong, I don't think public sentiment is going to change against the monarchy.
I think possibly it's actually the next generational shift without criticising William, because in a sense, kind of Prince Charles is sort of the coder to Queen Elizabeth.
And it's when there's a change after Prince Charles that people will be really thinking.
You don't think there's some glamour coming with those two?
Yeah, I do.
I do.
And actually, the politics...
I really wanted Prince, sorry, Prince, the Prince of Wales, Prince William.
I know it wasn't part of the service, but I thought that first church service was really missing him standing up and saying something.
William has not been present.
Because he's not been present.
I agree there's a lot of glamour, but will there be so much glamour in 20 years' time?
I'm not sure.
The thing about the Queen is that she just quietly delivered and performed consistently decade after decade after decade.
I think he will be much more accessible, more visible.
I think we've seen that just literally in the last few days.
And I think that will be key.
Because we think we know him because we knew him as Prince Charles, but actually, we actually want him to be different as King Charles, because it's a very, very different role.
Yeah.
The Biggest Event Ever Seen00:04:52
But overall, what a day.
I mean, really, what a day.
I just, I found it breathtaking.
Breathtaking.
The whole thing and the logistics that were involved in making it so faultless.
It's just made me burst with pride about what this country can do when it really puts its mind to it.
And also the civil service, got to give them credit, you know, for getting all those leaders in and out without incident.
Well, the Foreign Office, I've say, pulled it off, didn't they?
We're going to see some of our star panelists a little later.
Thank you for being with me.
Music was as much a part of today's ceremonies as the servicemen and women who made it a world-class spectacle from the rousing choral hymns to national anthem played repeatedly and the muffled drums and mournful bagpipes that send shivers down our spine.
Let's take a listen.
Joining me now is retired Lieutenant Colonel Graham Jones, who was responsible for the music at all state ceremonial events, including the Queen Mother's Funeral, former Royal Protection Officer for Princess Diana and Princess William and Harry, Ken Worf, and the former Black Rod in Parliament, David Leakey.
Well, welcome to all of you.
Let me start with you, Ken, if I may, because you were with me, it turned out.
I just discovered you were down there by the palace all day.
What was your feeling as you watched it all unfurl?
Well, I mean, so much has been said, Piers, about it, but what I admired was the sort of the order and this word solemnity that people keep talking about.
But it was an extraordinary feeling to be there and watching it.
But mindful because of my past involved in security and having been involved in operations similar to this, I was impressed actually with the timing and the efficiency of the operation that this event actually brought.
And I mean, it has to be said, no security incidents that I'm aware of at all throughout the entire day when they were clearly pretty concerned about the number of world leaders in one place.
There's been a lot of stuff going on, war in Europe and so on that could have triggered any kind of protest or attack, but nothing happened on the day.
Nothing at all.
I mean, you know, the operation itself involving, you know, thousands of police and we've drawn in police from the constabularies.
But, you know, people were talking about the Churchill state funeral in 1965.
I mean, this eclipse that, Piers, it was by far a huge ceremonial operation, a state funeral here.
Was this the biggest event you've ever seen of this kind?
Well, I think it's the biggest event that everybody's ever seen.
We're never going to see this again.
It's not in most people's lives.
And, you know, I think that the cooperation between the police, Parliament, and all the services, I think, pulled off a piece of magic, Piers, quite frankly.
Yeah, no, I agree.
Lieutenant Colonel Graham Jones, you were the former senior director of music for the household division.
You're in charge of all the music for all major state ceremonial events, including state funerals like the Queen Mother's, Queen's Birthday Parade, the Armistice Cenota Parade, the Festival of Remembers had a huge collection of massive events.
When you watched today's funeral and the whole day actually taken in totality, what did you feel about it from a musical perspective?
Well, I mean, the first thing, Piers, is I actually thought that this is what an incredible way to honour our much loved late monarch.
That was the first thing I thought.
The second thing, when I'm watching the parade, I actually started to think about the individuals within who were taking part.
This is a life-changing moment from them.
They'll be telling their grandparents all about this.
And I'm looking at the band and the musicians are playing.
They've been working really, really hard.
But just go back.
Could they have imagined when they were in school and school was helping them to become a musician, play the clarinet, go to community bands and do that, then join the military and take part in this massive, massive parade that is the biggest that we will ever see in our lifetime.
And in terms of the choice of music, how involved would Her Majesty the Queen have been in choosing the music throughout the day for her own funeral?
The Piper Plays A Lament00:02:36
Piers, she will have signed it off at the end of the day.
However, this all comes through a rich vein of heritage and tradition.
And of course, we have to go back to 1901, which is Queen Victoria's funeral.
And she had the Beethoven March and the Chopin march.
Those two marches were played.
Then we moved forward through the Three Kings.
And those marches are then added to, and they're added to by two more Beethoven marches, the Mendelssohn march.
These are all added to create the backbone of the funereal music that's played on the funeral procession.
One of the most moving moments for me actually came with the piper, the piper from Balmoral, who apparently is the only person outside of the royal family who's allowed to wear the Balmoral tartan.
And when he played that little piece, let's take a listen actually to the bit of the pipe.
Okay.
Absolutely stunning performance there of a famous Scottish lament called Sleep, Deary, Sleep.
It is a lament.
Yes, and it's.
Absolutely.
And for those, Grand Jose, who don't know about that lament, what does it signify and why would that have been important to the Queen?
Well, it's important because, of course, her Piper, the Queen's Piper, every morning at nine o'clock would play for 15 minutes outside below her bedroom window.
And of course, the Queen's Piper would go with her when they go to Balmoral.
She absolutely adored pipes and drums.
Now, if you remember looking at the parade away from the single piper for the moment, and we look at the mass pipes and drums, and what an incredible image that was and most powerful of sounds, the beat there was 75 beats per minute.
Pipers don't naturally march and play at 75 beats per minute.
Organizing The Lying In State00:07:00
They had to work really hard to get that tempo exactly right and they nailed it.
They absolutely did.
And for you personally, taking the day in totality, what was your favourite piece of music in the whole day?
It's the Chopin funeral march that was played on the procession, both the procession here in London and the procession at Windsor.
It was actually written by Chopin, the Polish composer, in 1840 when he lived outside of Paris.
It was then orchestrated for an orchestra and then it was reworked for the military band and first performed at Her Majesty Queen Victoria's request at her funeral along with a Beethoven funeral march.
Thank you very much indeed.
Thank Colonel Graham.
Joseph, we want to bring in now Lieutenant General David Leakey, the former Black Rod, the Queen's representative in Parliament for seven years.
One of the Black Rod roles is to organise the Lying in State in Westminster Hall.
And I believe that you were in charge of the planning, logistics and execution of Operation London Bridge, which was, of course, the code name for the passing of the Queen.
Yeah, London Bridge is the code name for the overall operation, of which Operation Marquis is a subset.
And Operation Marquis is the Lying in State of the monarch in Westminster Hall.
And Black Rod, as you've rightly said, is responsible for that.
And if you like, is the sort of chief of operations for Op Marquis in the Palace of Westminster.
And I thought Sarah Clark, who took over from me four years ago, has done a great job with the team.
Of course, it's not a one-man band.
Organising these things is a huge team effort of coordination and collaboration, not just within Parliament, because obviously the parliamentary are state staff and all the administrative staff and clerks, everybody turns to when something like a state event like this happens, whether it's the state opening of parliament or a lying in state.
But there are a lot of other players as well.
The police, of course, on the security side, but contractors, a lot of contractors involved in coming in with special machinery to take out all those steel blockers, security blockers outside and taking down lampposts and traffic lights and things like that.
It is a huge, huge team effort.
And full marks to the team that, as you say, nailed it.
Well, I would imagine there's a long list of black rods who will have had input into what we finally saw in the last 10 days, including yourself, I'd imagine, quite significantly, given how recently you had a job.
How much did it change every few years?
How much was this reviewed and then things tinkered with?
The answer is not a lot.
The outline of the lying in state and the funeral, the outline, the general plan for it did not change a lot.
Within it, a huge amount of detail.
We've just been hearing about the music, for example.
That will, I've no doubt, the detail and the choice of music will have changed.
But every, almost every week, and I'm now just talking about the lying in state in the Palace of Westminster, almost every week we had to get the plans out, contingency plans out, and change them, either because someone said this isn't going to work or this doesn't look right in the modern era or there are new members of the royal family.
So there are always things changing.
And one of the major problems with these plans is that the geography changes.
The fabric of Westminster Hall changes.
So, for example, there was a period of more than two years when we had huge areas of Westminster Hall covered in scaffolding, including a suspended scaffolding from the roof.
And of course, you couldn't have that in there if you were going to have a line in state.
So the building works had to be done with a clause in the contract that required the contractors to be on site with all the relevant scaffolders, heavy cranes, moving equipment and transport to take it all down.
And they had to be on site within six hours of a phone call.
And we rehearsed it.
I mean, I remember we rang them up at two o'clock in the morning one morning and said, we're pressing the starter button on a rehearsal.
Did they make it?
Yep, they did.
They were there.
It was a phenomenal exercise.
Everybody who needed to be there to take that scaffolding down was there and they were ready to go.
The riggers, the ropes, the cranes, the machinery, the transport.
So that's the sort of detail thing that goes on.
And of course, every time you have that, then all the timings change because you can't stick to the timings if you know you've got to get, it's going to take you 24, 28 hours to get scaffolding down.
You can't start building other things.
So all the time there are changes.
I mean, it struck me today that there were two things which could have completely changed the day.
One would have been torrential rain, which could easily have happened at this stage of the year in Britain.
Instead, we got glorious sunshine for most of the day.
And the other, of course, had this happened two years ago at the height of the pandemic, you wouldn't have had these crowds.
We wouldn't have had the procession.
I mean, it would have been a completely different thing.
So in a way, I guess when you're planning all this, you can plan as much as you want.
What you can't plan for sometimes is nature.
And that's one of the things that certainly we did for Otmar Key was every year we would run an exercise, a tabletop exercise.
Well, we rehearsed the build of the fabric routinely, but we also ran a tabletop exercise to go through all those sorts of contingencies.
What would happen if it was raining?
What would happen if there was a fire somewhere or a security incident?
So yes, there are lots of variations of the plan to cope with all those sorts of contingencies.
But can I just make one point, which I think is relevant to what you were saying with your panel earlier?
And that was what the relevance of all this pageantry is.
Of course, it shows us all fits very glitzy.
It's a great advertising for the UK.
More tourists are likely to come to London and so on and so on.
But the international broadcasters have been asking me what's the point of the pageantry.
And I think some people in this country wonder that as well.
And I think one of the major points of the pageantry is that rather like Westminster Hall that was built a thousand years ago, our monarchy has been going for a thousand years.
Pageantry Transcends Family Rifts00:15:16
And these traditions, customs, uniforms, archaic ways of doing things are part of our heritage.
And I think there are two key things that they demonstrate.
One is they are part of the fibers that make up the fabric of the nation that we are, the national identity that we have.
And I think the second thing is that it reminds us of the heritage of our very stable democracy compared to some of the regimes as head of states that you see in other countries, even around Europe.
Well, some of the regimes that were in the Abbey today.
Thank you very much indeed, Attorney General David Lee.
Congratulations on your role in helping it all go so swimmingly.
I know every black role would have put a lot of backbone into this.
And it was certainly a magnificent success.
So thank you very much.
Ken, just coming back to you, I want to talk to you just personally.
You know, you've been around the royal family for a very long time, obviously protecting them, and they were very well protected today.
When you look at William, Harry, who you've known since they were tiny boys, and they're in the procession, but there's no real contact between them that we've seen even in the 10 days.
Very little eye contact, no apparent talking.
It seems to be a temporary truce to put their grandmother first, but underneath it, this rift that continues to rage.
What do you make of that?
And what do you think Charles could possibly do to try and get through all this?
Piers, you're absolutely right.
There is clearly a rift, but this is very much ceremonial there on duty.
And that's a very important word for those of the royal family because it's all about a sense of duty.
I mean, Harry had no choice.
He had to be there.
You know, the fact that he was in uniform today was on the assistance of his father.
But, you know, the ER initials were removed from...
I thought that was churlish.
If you're going to let Prince Andrew have ER on his shoulder, then why wouldn't you let Harry put it on his?
I don't disagree with you.
I do think it was a bit churlish because this is a state event.
And let's be honest, Harry himself is the only member of the royal family recently that has actually fought a campaign in Afghanistan.
And he alone should, I think, been allowed to do that with all the incidents.
You seemed a bit churlish.
I mean, I've got no truck for Harry's behaviour in the recent years, but this was his grandmother.
He did serve his country with great valour, two tours of Afghanistan.
And we've already had the row about the uniform to start with, where Andrew was given dispensation to wear his, and then eventually Harry was allowed to wear his.
To then remove the ER and have it sent to him without the initials of his own grandmother.
I just thought, don't be churlish, and actually don't fuel his own innate sense of victimhood.
Just don't give him an excuse to moan again.
But I'm not, I don't know exactly what the protocol of that was.
But what's clearly to me, I mean, what I do know is that, you know, the Prince of Wales, when he was told that, you know, some five years ago to take on greater responsibility, given the state of the health of the Duke of Edinburgh then and the Queen herself, you know, he was already planning his kingship and wants very much, wanted at that point, very much Harry and William to be part of that move towards a new monarchy.
I actually think that he still believes in that, Piers.
How he can actually bring that about, I don't know.
I don't think anybody.
No, it'll be fascinating what happens.
I mean, if Harry brings this book out and it spray guns the royal family all over again, as he did with the Oprah interview, I mean, all hell's going to break loose.
And I think it would be very disloyal towards his father, who, from what I'm told, is completely bemused about why his son has turned rogue on him.
Well, listen, we had this discussion a few days ago, and I sort of hesitated on a decision.
I said there should be reflection.
And I himself had a reflection, Piers.
I do think that now, given all that's happened in the last 10 days, I think Harry really should be considered about actually sort of ending this story and saying, look, this book isn't the right idea.
Because what's it going to do?
It's going to cause a great deal of hurt, a great deal of doubt.
I just think they should stop talking about the royals.
They've left the country.
They've left royal duty.
They apparently wanted freedom and privacy.
And yet all they do is constantly give interviews or public statements or podcasts or books, whatever it may be, in which they trash their family and the monarchy.
And at some point, you've got to think, why are you doing this?
How are you getting happiness or freedom by continuing to do it?
I mean, you know, they made the Queen's life more difficult in her last two years.
You know, Philip had died and she was in ill health.
She must have been hating what they were doing to the brand of the royal family.
So I just don't get what they think their end game is, other than enriching themselves, but at what cost of their happiness?
But I think a lot of people share your view, Piers.
And I'm actually moving that way.
The one thing that Harry and Megan lack is a good advisor, is someone who's sort of really spoken about.
Well, they've got American Los Angeles public assists.
Well, that's not good enough, because they're in it for their own ends.
I mean, but it needs an advisor, someone with a real knowledge and understanding of what the king himself now does.
The real shame of it is, if they had just carried on in the same vein they did up to their wedding, where they were very popular in this country, and they represented a very different, more diverse couple in the royal family, and they were getting great credit and praise for that.
If they carried on just being as they were then, I think they'd have been very popular and quite beloved members of the family and could now be real weapons for King Charles to take the monarchy forward with a slightly more youthful and diverse way.
As it is, they're sort of running this rival royal family over in California and it's causing constant friction.
Anyway, we'll see how that all washes up.
Ken, great to see you.
I often think about you with these things because you were around them all when they were all kids and I think that you know, and I know Diana would have hated the fact the boys aren't talking.
She would have been, I think, really distraught by it.
Yeah, well, I mean, I sort of have fond memories of working at that time.
And, you know, I'm coming more around to your view on this, Piers, but I do think that Harry is unhappy with his situation.
I do think now, particularly, because he's been here, and I think he realises that this is where he should be.
And I know deep down that his father wants him to be part of this new move in this new monarchy.
But it's a two-way story.
It's a two-way street.
Well, King Charles III and other members of the royal family are in St. George's Chapel in Windsor for a private family service right now.
Details of the service have not been disclosed, with Buckingham Palace calling it a deeply personal family occasion.
What we do know is that the Queen will be buried with Prince Philip next to his coffin.
And I think that's one ray of happiness for all of us, that they've been reunited on this otherwise very sad day.
Well, after the state funeral at Westminster Abbey, thousands lie in the streets, to see Her Majesty's very final journey to St. George's Chapel in Windsor.
Two of her beloved Corgis were there to greet her, and a more intimate gathering awaited inside the chapel that she knew from childhood.
The crown jeweler removed the instruments of state, the imperial state crown, the orb and scepter from the coffin, before they were placed on the altar, symbolising very poignantly the end of the Queen's reign.
And for the first time ever, the breaking of the wand was televised, a ritual marking the end of a Lord Chamberlain's service to a monarch.
The Queen's coffin was then lowered into the royal vault alongside the coffins of 25 previous royals.
And right now, the late Queen is being laid to rest, as I said, beside her late husband, the Duke of Edinburgh.
After a life lived and mourned in public, this moment, and it feels right, will belong only to her closest family.
Really was a stunning day, wasn't it?
With so many extraordinary moments and visuals of this country really at its very best.
There's a live shot we just took a few minutes ago of Westminster Bridge tonight looking absolutely magnificent.
The bridge, of course, that leads into Parliament and, of course, to Buckingham Palace.
What a sight that is.
What a sight the whole capital city has been today.
And here's Windsor Castle tonight.
Darkness has, of course, fallen, but you can see there the flickering light and flag.
An amazing final resting place for most of the Queen, of course.
Well, joining me now from Windsor is Jeremy Kyle, my talk TV colleague.
He's been in Windsor all day.
Jeremy, what's it been like down there?
I mean, I was at Buckingham Palace where there were huge crowds all day long and there was a mixture of emotions, I would say.
Very quiet and respectful for large periods, breaking into applause at certain points, some tears, some laughter.
I mean, it was a sort of range of emotions, really.
Was it like that at Windsor?
Exactly, Piers, to be fair.
It was extraordinary.
I mean, I live in Windsor, as you know, and I've never seen so many people.
And I said earlier, the Queen transcended, I think, almost every different part of our population.
And people teamed into Windsor today, mate.
I would say 250,000 minimum.
And when that hearse came down the long walk, there was this incredible hush.
There was like this sort of serenity, this sort of acceptance that this was the final goodbye and she was passing on and King Charles would be acceding to the throne, etc., etc.
But you're right, a sort of way of emotions.
People crying, people cheering, clapping as she went past, people throwing flowers.
But it felt very...
I was very proud to be part of it, mate, to be honest.
It was very emotional, but it was also very, very historical.
You know, a moment that you'll go, I was there.
I saw her 70 years on the throne.
Yeah, I felt that very strongly at Buckingham Palace.
While we've been talking, the Prince and Princess of Wales, William and Kate, have tweeted goodbye to a queen, a mother, a grandmother, and a great-grandmother, which I think says it all from the family point of view, is that she was our queen.
She was their queen, of course, too.
But essentially, for them, this was the matriarch of their family.
Absolutely, the sort of fulcrum by which it all, you know, succeeded.
And of course, no doubt you and I, you know, are cut from the same cloth.
There will be people who say, well, the monarchy survive, of course, it will survive.
When you look at who came today, when you look at how the world, four billion people, watched us do what we do best in the most incredible way.
Of course, we'll never see the like of a lady.
I mean, 70 years on the throne.
Somebody said to me the other day, Piers, that everybody under 70, whatever, has never known anything else.
It will be a change, and King Charles will not reign for as long as her by any stretch of the imagination.
And the monarchy will, yes, be slimmed down, and we've heard about all the problems.
But for me, today is about remembering this incredible woman who, what, at 24, 25 said, however long I've got, I will serve you, the British people.
And she did that in the most incredible way.
Just what, two days before she passed, there she was accepting Liz Truss, saying, you know, make a new government.
And she was about selfless service.
And I think that we as a country could learn so much.
And actually, also, I was thinking today, you know, with all that's going on in the world, in our world, the United Kingdom, why is it that we can come together so brilliantly at these times?
Why can't we bottle that, Piers, and use that going forward?
Because that would have been, I think, exactly what she'd have wanted.
I completely agree.
And it is a real problem that we're becoming ever more divided as a country.
It's not just a problem here, it's the same in America.
I think toxic tribalism on social media has made people angry, it's made people constantly confrontational.
I think that it's a real problem.
Facts don't seem to matter anymore.
People just take a position with a tribe aside and then they scream at each other morning, noon, and night.
And you know, it was a real moment of unity today, but in a way, probably because the Queen actually was completely non-partisan.
We never knew what she thought about any big issue.
So she never instantly polarized people.
If she'd come out and said, actually, I think Brexit's a bad idea, half the country would have hurled abuse at her on Twitter.
That's where we've got to.
And it's a completely ridiculous state of affairs.
You know, there were another part of today, Jeremy, I thought was great with the armed forces, just in all their magnificent splendor.
And I was on air for Fox and America, and I said, you know, you've got to remember, these are not just ceremonial people.
They're not just doing this to show off their uniform.
These are our fighting forces, the very elite, from the Royal Marines to the Gurkhas to the RAF to the Royal Navy.
And actually, I got a tweet, a wonderful tweet, in the middle of it from a woman called Lisa Moyer, who said, My son is part of the gun carriage crew.
He's directly behind the coffin, seconding on our right.
We are unbelievably proud parents.
And I responded to saying, so you should be.
He's done the nation proud.
And I was delighted to see just she was bombarded with messages of gratitude from the public.
And I think there must be so many little stories of these armed forces today-from the young sailors by the gun carriage to the most experienced people in the Queen's Guards, you know, the Grenadier Guards, the Cold Stream Guards.
All of them, to a man and woman, were just absolutely perfect, both in the way that they looked and the way they conducted themselves.
I think that's right.
And actually, we've done an interview for you later.
A lady, a squadron leader in the RAF Pierce, 31 years' service.
She'd been to the Falklands, she'd been to Afghanistan, and I interviewed her.
She was here with a mother who had just recovered and her two kids, and the pride.
She said, I've come here today for the boss.
It wasn't a job, it was an honor and a privilege.
And she was so humble.
And every one of those 31 days I did for her, and you're right, there will be stories the length and breadth of this country.
Rallied By Her Majesty's Life00:15:50
And I go back to what I said: why can't we come together as we did today?
Because old and young, where I've been today, Piers, from 14 and 15-year-olds to 80 and 90-year-olds, everybody of the same opinion that this incredible woman, incredible woman, gave us all so much.
And maybe in her memory, actually, what we can give her back is to be, as we've both said, just to try and get on with our lives and get.
I mean, we've all heard about the Duke of York and Harry and that Liming woman and all that, but actually, what happened today was she transcended all those arguments.
She transcended every single part of divisiveness we have in this country.
And that's why everybody came together.
And if we could bottle that, it would be amazing, wouldn't it?
Yeah, I completely agree.
Well said, Jeremy, good to talk to you.
Thanks, mate.
Her Majesty took place inside the historic Westminster Abbey.
World leaders, world royalty, and every living British Prime Minister looked on, as well as an estimated audience of billions on television worldwide.
Well, quite a moment for my next guest, Ian Greenshields, moderator of the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland, who read a prayer in the service.
Let us give thanks to God for Queen Elizabeth's long life and reign, recalling with gratitude her gifts of wisdom, diligence, and service.
Oh God, From whom cometh everything that is upright and true.
Accept our thanks for the gifts of heart and mind that thou didst bestow upon thy daughter Elizabeth and which she showed forth among us in her words and deeds.
I'm delighted to say that the Right Reverend Dr. Ian Greenshields is with me now along with former newspaper editor Emily Sheffield and talking to the presenter Richard Tice.
Thank you so much for coming to the show tonight.
What a day you must have had.
I mean it was extraordinary enough for us to watch it but to be actually participating in the historic occasion of this Queen's funeral must have been even for you who've done a lot of stuff quite an amazing moment.
Yes I think it was.
I mean I think it was a culmination of so many historic moments beginning with the Queen's death in Scotland and the service in St Giles and now the service in Westminster and of course the further service that followed that.
It just was that very profound sense of history that was there in the making in that moment.
And you spent the last weekend with Her Majesty up in Scotland and you had this remarkable time with her not knowing of course it would be the last time you'd see her.
To go from that to reading at her funeral I mean that's an extraordinary two weeks you've had in your life.
I know.
And there was no sense in which you would have said that she was frail, she was 96, but there was no sense that you would have thought that this was somebody who was imminently going to die.
Quite the opposite.
She was very engaged, very articulate, memory was great.
What did you talk about?
If you don't mind me asking, presumably you can now say because the Queen is sadly no longer here.
But I mean, what were the conversations like?
Because they were some of the last conversations she ever had with anybody.
Her love of Barmoro.
That was something that she spoke of more than once.
Talked about her mother, her father being there, her being there, the joy that it brought her as a place, the peace that it brought her as a place as well.
That was something she spoke about.
She spoke about the church that I belong to.
That's one of the reasons that I was there, and that she valued as well.
You know, she was quite a character.
She knew her stuff.
That was one of the things that was quite remarkable about her.
I interviewed actually the former Prime Minister of Canada, Stephen Harper, today.
And he was saying the thing about meeting the Queen, he met her a few times, got to know her quite well, was that because she'd met almost every interesting person who's ever lived in the last 70 years, including every world leader, every scientist, every expert, everyone, she had extraordinary wisdom and knowledge which she just amassed over time, where she basically knew a lot.
Yes, I mean, I asked her who the most interesting person was that she'd met, and she refused to answer that question.
Really?
Really?
Oh, yeah, yeah.
I asked her what her favourite hymn was, she refused to answer that.
You see, even to the end, he wouldn't give controversial opinions.
That's right, that's right.
Which was a great side to her.
I mean, I was quite interested to read one of Nelson Mandela's relatives because we were trying to think of other world events in my lifetime, certainly, which could be even close to this.
One would have been Mandela's funeral, no question.
The funeral of John Paul, the Pope II, was huge.
Kennedy's funeral after he was assassinated, and so on.
I don't think any of them came close to what we saw today.
But her relationship with Mandela was quite interesting because apparently his family always used to tease him because whenever he spoke to the Queen, he'd call her Elizabeth.
And they'd say, you cannot call the Queen Elizabeth.
And he would reply, well, why not?
She calls me Nelson.
They found a commonality together, which she was so good at that.
She would never have taken offence at him calling her Elizabeth.
She'd totally understand that he didn't mean that in any derogatory way.
And there was obviously great warmth between them.
When you were having these last conversations, I don't want to labour the point, because I'd imagine it's also probably quite painful memories to you, given what happened after.
But given you were in this sort of moment of history, did she look back at all and reflect on her life, on her reign?
She spoke about her faith.
But then she would do that to somebody who's a minister, I suppose.
But it was hugely important to her.
And it was.
And she spoke about having no regrets about the faith that she had.
She spoke about how important it was to her.
Some of the unique characters that she'd met as well, Billy Graham being one of them.
Who she asked to meet, I think.
Yes.
It was at her request.
Yeah.
I think she had a.
Did she have a sense that maybe something was going to happen?
That's what I wondered.
That's what I wondered.
Looking back, do you think maybe she did?
Well, you know how sometimes, subconsciously, when you look back, somebody has said something to you and then you think, I wonder why they said that?
Because it materialized.
My own mother did that in the night before she died.
Really?
She's just talking about death and what happens when you die.
And I wonder whether there was something of that.
Did the queen dying at all or death?
No, she didn't.
But she was prepared.
You could tell that very clearly.
And her faith, I guess, consequentially would have been that much more important in that moment of realizing that her life might be coming to an end because it would be then the next stage of her life and her faith.
Yes, I gave her a gift before I left.
I had crosses made by folks in Glenoco prison.
And I said to her, What can you give to the person who has everything?
And she kind of smiled at me then and I presented her with a cross and explained it to her.
And she very graciously took it from me and then just wished me the best, all the best, and left the room.
And that was the last I saw of her.
When you stood up to speak today, did you feel the weight of history on your shoulders?
Because four billion people apparently may have been watching.
Yeah, I didn't try to think of it that too much.
I felt more in Edinburgh.
That was the case when I was preaching in Edinburgh and took the sermon there.
I felt less so here.
I felt I was part of something bigger in that sense.
Did the new king speak to you afterwards?
Did you get a chance?
I guess everything was moving on so fast.
I mean, I don't know.
I find this completely fascinating.
Absolutely fascinating.
And the fact that she said that Balmoral was her place of peace, I think is really interesting.
I think maybe I only knew that from the Crown, but honestly, I feel like that Balmoral, that Scotland, I mean, it may have been the film The Queen with Helen Mirren when she's going up through the grounds of Balmoral and she sees the big stag and everything and just the beauty, the wildness, but also the privacy that she had there, I think.
But I think she would have known her own health.
And I think it was her final act of duty to the United Kingdom.
I think she knew that her time was near and that Scotland Balmoral was where she was.
My favourite Balmoral story was the guy, I think it was on Sky or something, and he worked with the Queen at Balmoral, one of her pages or valets or something.
And he was asked to reminisce, and he said that he'd been walking with her in the Balmoral Estate.
And they come across two American tourists who didn't recognise the Queen.
And so they start talking and they say to the Queen, oh, you know, do you have a holiday home here?
She went, actually, I do, yes, just over the hill, moral.
And they said, oh, wow, really?
So you come here often?
I do, yeah.
Oh, you must have met the Queen.
And she said, well, I haven't, but he has, pointing to the valet or the page, whatever he was, or security guy, whatever he was.
And he chuckled.
And then the American couple says, well, what's she like?
And I think he says something like, I think she could be a bit cantankerous, you know.
With the Queen roaring with laughter.
And then they asked the Queen to take a picture of them with this famous guy who knew the Queen, who met the Queen.
And then they did do one with the Queen as well, all four of them.
And the Queen apparently chuckled afterwards and went, I just can't wait to hear.
She said, I wish I could be a fly on the wall when he gets home, those two.
And they show their family the holiday snap.
Oh, look, we met this really famous guy who met the Queen.
That is the Queen.
But that was her sense of humour.
Yeah.
That sense of mischief.
I mean, you experienced it.
Just going to re-say, just wait here a moment because I think I'd like to continue this conversation.
I'd like to take a short moment now to reflect on Her Majesty's extraordinary life.
Today we mourned, but we also remembered.
We commemorated a famous pledge fulfilled.
I know that your support will be unfailingly given.
God help me to make good my vow.
And God bless all of you who are willing to share in it.
We can all share the Queen's hope, which in life and death inspired her servant leadership.
Service in life, hope in death.
All who follow the Queen's example and inspiration of trust and faith in God can with her say we will meet again.
Well, it's 801.
Welcome to the second hour of a special programme on the day of the funeral of Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, the greatest Britain.
It's been a deeply moving day for all of us, I think, of grief, but also gratitude and celebration of a life extraordinarily well lived.
It's also been spectacular, hasn't it?
Without any question, a moment of great history.
A day I don't think any of us will ever forget.
Well, back with my panel.
Just didn't want to leave it there because I wanted just to get your final recollections, really, or thoughts about the Queen.
As we move now to a new era, a new monarch, a new country in many ways, how do you think history will remember her?
I wonder if she realized how much she was loved.
Yes.
I think she probably realised she was very much respected and admired, but I wonder how much she realized she was loved.
And I think when you listen to everything that's come across in the last 10 days or so, that's come across very, very strongly from people right across the UNA.
I mean, I feel grateful, Richard Tice, that we had the Platinum Jubilee because I was told, I don't know, back in February, March, there were serious concerns about her health and there was a chance she may not make the Jubilee.
And I was told this by somebody who knew, who was hearing this from senior family.
And so they were all incredibly relieved that she did actually hang on long enough to enjoy what turned out to be a fantastic celebration of her reign in her lifetime, where she was still there to understand what we were doing.
But there was a sense actually, Piers, that she rallied.
She rallied for that extraordinary occasion.
In the same way, I think she actually rallied in order to bring in the 15th Prime Minister.
I think that we will always say she was always there.
She was the constant.
And we now know just how much she was admired all over the world.
Yes, I agree.
What are your final thoughts about the Queen?
Oh, gosh, so many.
I mean, I think...
It's hard to crystallize it.
I think it's very hard to crystallize.
I also think it's going to be quite interesting how everybody feels tomorrow and in the coming days, because we've had this huge, you know, first there's the shock, then we've had this nine days.
People have joined that queue, which became like a pilgrimage, which was sort of quite staggering, really.
I spoke to a woman on radio on Saturday who was 70 and had done 12 hours.
And I said, were you tired?
Didn't your feet hurt?
And she said, no, no, no.
The spirit just carried me through.
She adored the Queen so much.
She's from Jamaica.
And I think it's going to be quite interesting how this week goes, because there is going to be, quite understandably, a moment of sort of dip.
Do you know what I thought?
And I think particularly maybe for the royal family, and you wonder what they're going to do.
Well, they're going to have a moment of faith is going to, his faith is going to carry.
But I think they now have a week of private mourning where they just disappear now from sight and they have a chance to mourn as a family.
I mean, I thought that the queue in many ways is quite interesting, actually.
Even Americans on American Television Today were talking about the queue and they never know what the word means.
They say lying, but the queue has become this world-famous thing, this British queue for the British people.
I describe it as the queue of all queues.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
But there were several things about the queue which really moved me.
One was just hearing all the stories from the people being interviewed all the time.
Found it quite mesmerizing.
Secondly, seeing them, how they actually paid the respects.
I found that live stream mesmerizing.
I just used to watch it for like half an hour every now and again.
And you just see people either nodding or muttering thank you or curtsying, whatever it was.
Just so simple, but so respectful and so moving.
And then there was the last person in the queue today who turned out to be a woman who was in the RAF.
We're not quite sure what she did, but I'm sure the papers will tell us tomorrow.
And she had been twice.
So she'd gone through once and then gone straight back to the back of the queue and queued all over again and was actually the last person to come in.
And I thought, well, if that doesn't epitomise the Queen's stoicism, determination, respect, dignity, all those things that the Queen represents, then nothing does.
But don't you rather hope that in the same way when we went out and clapped the NHS, there was a moment of real unity.
And I hope, and I remember keeping that sort of inside me for quite a long time afterwards.
Soldiers And Significant Emotions00:15:16
And I still think back, I do hope that we do take something more profound from that.
And a country we came together and that stays with us in some way.
We don't all just go back where everyone's being horrible on social media and everyone's going, everything's completely awful and this country's awful.
You know, I do think she wanted to leave us something.
Well, I think, Reverend Egrey, just to end this part of the show, I just think if we all just take a moment every now and again and say, well, what would the Queen do in this situation?
What would she say?
What would she feel?
We won't go far wrong because her basic gut instinct for what represented the greatest of British values actually is what made this country great.
And we've deviated way too far from what she stood for.
And I, by the way, include myself.
I'm not claiming to be some virtuous person here.
I think I've been watching it and going, you know, what can we learn?
What can we learn?
And actually, it's going back a bit, actually.
Reset and go back to those great values.
Thank you to my panel.
And what an honor for you and how brilliantly you delivered it and how extraordinary that you were with the Queen and that last weekend.
And you must have just remarkable memories.
You'll never lose them.
Never forget.
Great to see you.
Thank you very much.
And thank you both for coming in.
I want to go now to Rupert Bell, who's our talk radio royal correspondent.
Rupert, your brother was actually at St. George's Chapel there as part of the racing community and Westminster Abbey indeed.
And in fact, I know somebody else who was there purely because of the racing connection as well.
So a lot of racing people seem to have been involved today, which would have been how the Queen would have wanted it.
Absolutely.
It has to be because I know all those trainers, just as you were talking to the person from the church, they were talking to her right to the very end.
And I know from my own brother's experience, he was talking to her last week, and he always relished his conversations with the Queen about horses, not only the horses.
that often ran for him, not particularly well for the Queen, but he put on a brave face and she was very philosophical about it, but she would want to talk about everything.
And I know what it, it's a huge privilege for my family and for my brother that he was able to train for her.
And he had plenty of winners.
He trained the winner that was the first horse trained by the, in the Queen's colours that was ridden by Haley Turner, a lady jockey.
So he had some wonderful memories and I know as a family we do as well.
But I think the important thing was the brain was absolutely still on the money right to the very end, as we've heard from every person, you know, even Liz Truss.
And that's, I think, what has sort of taken everyone by surprise, that she was still able to operate, yet the suddenness of what happened, when you think, Piers, that two weeks ago we were announcing a new prime minister and all that that entailed, and then we fast forward to today, we've just seen the most extraordinary outpouring of affection from this country, both in here in London at Westminster Abbey and then subsequently at St George's Chapel, and all those people in between.
It's been the most extraordinary seismic moment in our country's history.
Yeah, and Rupert the the, the pallbearers uh, the fascinating story behind them all.
From the first battalion of the grenadier guards, I'm told that there were a pool of around 30 who've been basically rehearsing this for quite some time and that five of them actually were flown back from Iraq where they'd been in operational duty.
So these are obviously acting serving soldiers.
And what do you know about these pallbearers?
Because they've become national heroes.
I mean, I think that, particularly when they were going up the steps at St George's Chapel carrying this huge, heavy coffin, tremendous pressure on them.
Yeah well, I'm an ex-grenadier.
So for me, as an ex-grenadier, hugely proud.
Yes, I know, the Queen's Company, as it's still named, it won't be called the King's Company until maybe a week down the line.
So those soldiers from the Queen's Company, the first battalion, it's now the only battalion of the grenadier guards, but of course they were hugely important throughout the ceremonial duties today.
But those eight soldiers who were carrying the, the coffin I mean five of them were in Iraq just no, 10 days ago, and so they've had to rehearse within non-stop since then.
And of course they're rehearsing with a coffin that is weighs exactly the same, and the young ensign who was part of that party was only commissioned last September.
So from a grenadier point of view as I am an ex-grenadier, and a pretty ordinary one at that too, it gets.
It's a huge sense of pride that the grenadiers were at the heart of it again.
And those young men, it was the pressure on them because that is not an easy job to actually carry that up those steps in St. George's Chapel.
But also, it actually shows the commitment of the whole ceremonial aspect of what happened today.
There were soldiers, service, and service women coming from all corners of the globe to take part in that.
6,000 of them having to make sure their part didn't let the bit down.
Clearly, those guardsmen were in the front line, as it were, because they had some serious moments to do into St. George's Chapel, Westminster Abbey, and elder elements.
But you've actually got to give your heart to every single serviceman and woman because they were equally as committed to the cause.
And as an ex-military man, they did this country proud, and they have rightly achieving all the plaudits because it was magical at every step of the way to.
It was.
It was completely magnificent.
Thank you very much, Ruberbel.
Appreciate you joining me.
Well, joining me now is another military man who attended the late Queen's funeral today, the former head of the British Army, Lord Dannett.
Lord Dannett, great to have you because I just can't even imagine what it was like to be actually at the funeral.
We just heard from one of the speakers there, clearly very moved.
What was it like for you?
This was your commander-in-chief, of course, for so long.
Well, Piers, of course, it was a huge privilege to be there.
But, you know, I think the thing that was probably perhaps most significant, my wife and I were sitting in the nave.
We were in the front row of the nave.
But as the late Queen's coffin came by, only two, three, four feet away from one, one thought, ah, this is now really serious.
This is the end of her fantastic reign.
And they just brought it home at that particular moment.
I mean, the service was fantastic.
The singing was wonderful.
The Archbishop spoke well.
The lessons were read well.
But just that moment of the coffin passing by, my wife curtsied, I bowed.
I mean, that's what we should do.
We just suddenly both said afterwards, oh, that's the moment.
Under our noses, as it were, in front of us.
This wonderful 70-year reign has ended.
But now we've got to look forward to the future.
Yeah, it's interesting.
I was at Buckingham Palace all day, and I felt that moment actually when the procession passed by the palace.
And I looked behind me and I saw the hearse coming towards the end of the procession.
So there'd been like a good 15, 20 minutes of procession first.
And then suddenly the crowd went very quiet and you saw the hearse come.
And then I just watched the hearse go round the corner of the big sort of centrepiece there and come right in front of the palace.
I think we're looking at the images now.
And I found that a really moving moment because I suddenly realized that would be my personal, my last glimpse of the Queen that I would ever have.
And I found that very moving actually.
And I think a lot of people have been quite surprised how emotional they felt about all this.
Piers, I think you're absolutely right.
And those who then, whether they were present or watching on television, I think when you saw the shots of the commutal service later on this afternoon and of the new king and the national anthem was sung, you could just see his eyes welling up when he realised that, yes, this was the moment.
His beloved mother, our beloved queen, has now gone.
And all the responsibilities of the kingdom now lie on his shoulders.
And it weighed up.
I think for all of us, at some point during the day, the point really came home that this wasn't just theatre, this wasn't just pageantry, this wasn't just what the UK does best, what Britain does best.
This was real, it was personal, and it was the end of the second Elizabethan era.
But I think we have to be positive.
And I think the Archbishop Sermon was absolutely right.
Hope is a very important part of today.
Fantastic, what Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II has done, the leadership she's shown, the dedication to duty.
But we move on.
And we now have a new king.
We've got a lot of difficulties in the country.
Energy crisis, cost of living crisis, new prime minister.
We've got to move on.
We've got to move forward.
We've got to set our sights ahead of ourselves.
But like this sort of ancient plowmen who were plowing their furrows, they picked something just ahead of them and they drove their horses towards it.
And that's the straight line that they took.
We've got to take a straight line to better places.
And frankly, we've got a new king, we've got a new prime minister.
I'm apolitical, but we've just got to drive this country forward.
There's so much opportunity here.
Let's rejoice in what's happened in the past, but actually fix our energy and our hope on the future.
This is a great country.
It has been a great country.
It is a great country.
And it will continue to be a great country.
We've all got to put our shoulders into the work.
Absolutely, magnificently said.
You're not available to join the cabinet, are you?
Any capacity.
We'll take you as anything, Lord Dannett.
No, I will if I'm asked.
Well, you know what?
We could do an awful lot worse than having someone with your attitude because we need a bit of positivity and can-do mentality.
And you were certainly like that when you ran the British Army.
It's been a great honour to have you tonight on this very special occasion, given that you were there in your capacity as one of our finest soldiers.
So thank you very much.
And Piers, thank you.
Are we still on?
Yes, we are, yeah.
Yep.
One of the lovely things was as all the royal family came past, Prince Harry looked in our direction and said to my wife, hello, Pippa.
Just wonderful that he was back.
I just think Harry is great.
I just hope he's got a role to play in our country in the future.
I mean, it is such a shame, isn't it, what's going on there?
Because there's clearly this huge rift with the two brothers.
There's a rift between King Charles and his son Harry.
And at the moment, it seems quite deep-rooted.
But you do get a sense that Harry, having been immersed back into his former life in the last 10 days, it would take a heart of stone, which I don't think he has, to not be personally affected by it in a way that may make him think, am I going the right way with my new life?
You know, constantly attacking the family, the monarchy and so on.
Is this really helping anybody?
Well, I think the events of the last few days must have had a significant effect on Prince Harry and his wife Meghan.
I don't know what their private thought processes are, what their personal ambitions are.
But what I do know absolutely is that Harry loves this country.
He loved the armed forces.
His time in the army, his two deployments to Afghanistan, and I was quite involved in both of those, were absolutely formative in his life.
I wish him all the best.
I wish Meghan all the best.
But frankly, from my point of view, and I think the British Armed Forces point of view and a veterans point of view, we miss Harry.
We love Harry.
I don't know how the future's going to work out, but I hope he's got a role to play in this country in the future.
Well, I hope he was listening to that, because I think coming from you, that will mean a lot to him.
You know, my brother-in-law actually taught him at Soundhurst and said he spoke very highly of him, said he was an excellent soldier, as indeed William was, very popular with the other guys, and he feels very sad about it too.
Well, I persuaded Harry after his first tour in Afghanistan when he wanted to go back there.
I said, Harry, the only thing you can do is go back within the anonymity of a helicopter cockpit.
And because long story short, he trained to be a helicopter pilot, and he was a good helicopter pilot.
And on his weapons course, he was the top gun.
So he's a top soldier, bless him.
Such a great guy.
And all the soldiers, all the veterans absolutely worship him.
He has a significant role to play in this country.
Somehow, he and Megan have got to find a way to balance their lives between whatever they want to do in the States and California.
But actually, he has a role to play in this country.
I know he can't be a part-time royal, but somehow there's got to be a role for him because actually we need him here.
A lot of people.
Do you know what I think he needs, Lord Dannett?
We miss him, Frank.
It's very interesting listening to you talk, because you know him well and you know what he feels obviously, about a lot of the the military part of his life.
I think maybe he needs a trip from you, maybe get on a plane to California and go and talk some sense into him.
Well um, the weather's nice this time of year um, but it.
But yeah, absolutely right.
Well um yeah, maybe.
Well Piers, thank you for the suggestion.
If you'd like to send me a ticket off, we go and let's see what happens.
But but actually it's not for me to determine his life and his family's life.
He's got his own issues, but all I, all I'd say is that he has played a significant role in this country.
I hope he continues to find a way to play a significant role in this country within the sort of wider environment of the royal family.
But it was just great to see him here today and yeah well, you know, been a fantastic day, a tragic day, a sad day, but we have to move forward.
And King Charles III, God save the king.
Lord Dannett, what a what a pleasure to have you on the show.
Thank you very much indeed.
Thanks Piers, fascinating conversation.
Well, joining me now is talk TV presenter Sharon Osborne, the time political sketch writer Quentin Letz.
Talk TV contributor Esther Kraker.
Heads Of State And Divisive Views00:14:07
Well well, I wasn't expecting that.
Actually Sharon, Lord Dannock giving that kind of take on on Harry and I actually found it quite moving because he knows him from his military time, clearly feels very sad about what's happened.
But, you know try, as part of his positivity call, trying to see if there's a way back for him.
What do you think?
Well, I felt the same when I when I saw him back in this country and I saw him part of the royal family, It made me very sad.
I honestly felt sad that, you know, this is his home, this is where he belongs.
The country loved him so much, and I'm sure they still do, the majority.
And it's just like...
Listen, nobody knows what goes on in any family, let alone the royal family.
But was it so drastic that you had to turn to California to live a life like a celebrity?
Yeah.
Quentin Letz, you're a brilliant sketchwriter.
I don't even know where you start with the daylight today.
Well, I think you start with the fact that it was a state occasion.
It was very, very stately.
And it's been a brilliant success in that respect.
Were you moved personally by it?
I was less moved today than I expected to be until Westminster, until Windsor.
And I thought the Windsor service, perhaps because it had a bit more cranberry to it, a bit more prayer book to it, and was not quite so encumbered by stately majesty.
I thought that Windsor sort of got me going a bit more.
But the silence in the Abbey service between the last post and Ravalli.
That was a very powerful moment for me.
And also the arrival of the coffin being pulled by the naval ratings.
They came on and the music stopped and then they did 15 extra paces and then halted.
And as they marched, they were marching on sand.
It made a strange sound.
It made a sound a bit like shaking brown sugar in a packet.
Very powerful, just the sound of those marching footsteps coming to a halt.
That was a moment that stood out.
Some people are seeing this as a kind of re-energised view to the world of what Britain does best and therefore fantastically positive and forward-looking, re-energizing the monarchy.
Others have said maybe this is the beginning of the end.
This is the top it's ever going to be, that this monarch was as great as we could ever expect, and that actually support for the monarchy will now slowly start to fade away.
What do you think?
Well, I suspect that the poll numbers, if you judge these things by polls, which I don't, by poll ratings, then possibly there will be a little bit of a decline for a bit because that's inevitable after such an enormous peak like this.
But what you saw today and what you've seen the last 10 days is the public saying we are proud of our country, we are proud of our crown, we like things the way that they are, we think this is a pretty good place to live, and the way that that has been asserted by the public will be absorbed by politicians.
And I think perhaps the political class will be less beholden to Twitter in the future.
The problem with the political class, it seems to me, in comparison to, say, this Queen in particular, we never knew what she thought about anything.
And in fact, if anything ever got leaked, it was the biggest story of all time because we just never heard what her thoughts were publicly about anything.
It didn't mean she didn't have them.
She just didn't express them in public.
She was not disputatious, was she?
She was the opposite of disputious.
She was a completely unifying person.
She was a fount of calm.
Right, so how do politicians who necessarily take strong positions on issues which are necessarily politically polarizing, how can they hope to emulate that kind of unifying spirit?
And the same applies in America, where it's almost impossible now.
Everything is split down the middle.
Half the country believes one thing about most stuff.
Half the country believes the other.
And there's nothing.
But it's not united.
It is no longer United States.
It's not coming back because it is so divisive.
Well, because I think the politicians, I mean, the answer to that is the politicians have to disagree because debate is essential in parliament.
But it's got so toxic.
But at the same time, they need to take their lead much less from that engine of rancor that is social media.
Yes.
And I think that too much of our politics and our political discourse has been guided by the rancor.
The latest pile on from social media.
Yes.
Those things really don't matter.
Right.
Esther, what do young people make of today, of King Charles, of the monarchy, of the future?
You're a young person.
I've actually seen, I was quite surprised.
I saw a lot of posts on social media, you know, obviously bidding farewell to the queen and actually saying, God save the king.
I've actually seen kind of an uptick in patriotism that I wasn't expecting.
I'm very curious, though, how the new prime minister, the relationship she will have with King Charles, because he's obviously very vocal on things like the Rwanda policy, on green policy, and all of that.
I just wonder what some of their weekly meetings will be, because it's a lot harder to.
Well, funny enough, Sharon and I were talking about this on Fox this afternoon, and I took a slight issue because Sharon, you think he's going to continue to be outspoken about issues he cares about because he's been proven right about some of that.
Absolutely.
But I think he has made a decision that now he's monarch, he's not going to do this.
I really think he's decided that the only way to be a popular and long-surviving monarch, beloved by the people like his mother, is just to simply stop making public pronouncements about anything that is remotely political.
And that would include things like climate change, which are dear to his heart.
So I just don't think we're going to see him do that.
The one thing that you did say was absolutely right, that you're never going to please the mob.
It's always going to be half of it that's against you.
Whatever opinion you expect.
Well, you know, I could go on Twitter and say, you know, I love Monday, right, as a day.
And within 10 minutes, there would be the most unbelievable pile of people agreeing with me.
Oh, I love it.
I love Monday.
Favourite day of the year.
And here's why.
Other people are saying, are you mad?
Have you lost your mind?
Monday's the worst day of all time.
In other words, everything has to immediately lead to an extreme reaction.
Everything has to be a toxic debate.
It can't be just a bit of fun.
And that's the way Twitter, in particular, social media, has whipped everyone in a kind of permanent lather.
And I don't divorce myself from part of this, by the way, because I quite often get sucked in and start, you know, having a lot of people.
You're a very consensual figure, right?
I'd like to think that I am somebody who expresses firmly healthy.
I'm not taking divisive lectures from you, Les.
One of the most brilliant and yet pungent writers in the business.
I don't think Charles can possibly become political.
He can't, can he?
He can't.
And if he looks at his mother's record, I mean, he can't continue to be political because he has been.
No, he can't continue to do that.
And I think he accepted that on the first Friday and he said, my role is now going to change.
Yes.
And he has to just pull back from that and be a much more tranquil presence.
And he has to be.
I do hope that, I mean, his is a face that naturally frowns a lot.
I want my king.
I'm proud of King Charles.
I love Charles.
To smile more.
I want him to smile more.
And he's good at laughing.
I mean, to be fair, so far in his reign, he's been mourning his mother.
Of course.
And I think that's easy to do.
He's had to tour the country, probably take 100 phone calls a day from world leaders and stuff.
He's a good person.
Console his family, show us he's king.
I mean, the pressure on the guy is just unbelievable.
He took it out on a pen.
That's how bad things are.
Sharon, what does it say about our country today, do you think?
What did you feel?
When you were watching it, were you getting emotional about a country from the past that we're slightly losing or have lost?
Or did you feel in a way it was a good chance to refocus us on what makes this country great?
A bit of both.
Yeah.
Really, Piers, a bit of both.
I love the way that the whole country was so united and so together and there was so much positivity when you would go into the streets.
And yet there are, you know, certain groups here that are against royalty.
But I think overall, I think the royalty, I hope to God, is safe here.
Yeah.
I mean, I think so.
But I think it would be.
We have a special thing.
There's 40 odd monarchies left in the world, of which 12 are European.
You could take all the European royals outside of ours down Tottenham Court Road and no one would know who they are, right?
So I think that we are in a very unique position with our monarchy.
It is a unique institution in terms of fame and global renown, right?
I think it's in safe hands.
I think one of the things I will say about the younger generation, we're genuinely excited about William and Kate.
And I think what would be really smart for Charles to do is to draw on that, any sort of engagements that he has that, you know, is very near and dear to his heart.
He should actually make sure that William is very present there because it's kind of like handing down the massive...
I'm just going to have an acquaintance with the Commonwealth.
You're seeing Jacinda Arderno from New Zealand saying it's inevitable that in her lifetime New Zealand will go Republic.
Australia is flirting with it.
It has a new leader, Anton Albanese, who is certainly, you know, not being full on Republican, but certainly indicated that he may go that way if the people wanted it.
You're seeing some of the Caribbean countries immediately indicating they want to have referendums within several years.
You know, this could, if he's not careful, King Charles III, you could get a domino effect of countries suddenly thinking the Commonwealth as a concept is over.
I think that there are two slightly different things being conflated there, whether or not Charles is head of state, but whether or not countries are part of the Commonwealth.
It's two slightly different things.
I think you have to let those countries decide for themselves.
And to try to resist that or try to impose our royal family as their heads of state as well would be entirely wrong and counterproductive.
And so you live and let live.
And I also think these countries decide for themselves.
How much is the racism allegation which Meghan Markle, the first biracial member of the royal family, of course, how much has her racism claims, do you think, Esther had an impact, certainly in some of the Caribbean countries?
I do think it's had a negative impact, but not as much as people think because I don't think they're highly respected figures, Harry and Megan.
I think they come across as quite whingy.
And I genuinely think most people that talk about the Commonwealth don't understand it.
You know, there's so many people in the Commonwealth that were glued to their TVs today.
There's so many people from the Commonwealth that actually are very fond of the monarchy and the royal family for various reasons.
I think one thing I have noticed with sort of the Republican wave is it's very cyclical in terms of politics.
So you have a Labour leader in Australia, you have Jacinda Arden, who couldn't be more left-wing if she tried.
You know, they're always more on the Republican side of things.
But again, if the elections swing the other way and you have more right-leaning governments in, they're not probably going to push for.
By the way, Quentin, there was a moment today where, if you've done your sketch for tomorrow.
I've filed.
Because I don't know if you spotted this, but it was an Australian crew.
I think it was.
There's a clip of an Australian connote.
We all had difficulty today identifying public figures, right?
A lot of them were heads of states, which we just didn't recognise and so on.
But you would have thought they'd be able to do it.
That wouldn't be his trust, by the way.
Have you seen this?
Have you seen this?
Look at this.
No, hard to identify.
Maybe minor royals, members of the...
I can't identify them.
I can't spot everyone, unfortunately.
They look like they will be local Peter's.
It's hard to see.
We're looking at the best of their heads.
But I think we are now getting to the pointing end, as they say, of the I'm just told that was Liz Trust, the new Prime Minister in the distance that we could see hopping out of their car.
Come on, Australia.
Down to the dregs.
By the way, did you see the spider?
I recognised your Prime Minister, Anthony Albanese, immediately and announced him on American terms.
You're too ahead of me there, but did you see the spider?
When the coffin came in at the West door and was being carried into the Abbey, there was a spider visible on the wreath.
It was a lovely time.
I thought a lovely moment.
There was a living creature on the coffin.
It was, yeah, I mean, I love moments like that.
Tony Blair, did you see Tony Blair?
Wearing his garter.
He needs a haircut, I thought.
I think he's morphing back to his old rock god days, isn't he?
He's being growing.
I do.
You're getting a bit like a waxwork.
Yeah, I honestly don't know.
It's quite funny watching them all together because what I'm told is, I was asking someone who's connected to one of the prime ministers.
And all the living prime ministers were there.
So you've got John Major, you've got Tony Blair, Gordon Brown, you've got David Cameron, you've got Theresa May and Boris Johnson.
And although here's David Cameron today, although this is all that we're going to see coming past here.
So there's Gordon Brown.
So you have them all, all these incredibly different people, all of whom have been at loggerheads at various stages with each other.
There's the Ron God, Tony.
There's the old waxwork.
But it's an interesting thing that apparently when they all get together, there is a shared commonality of experience of being prime minister.
That actually does bring them together a bit.
Except for Major and Boris.
Is that right?
They will not talk.
Really?
Is that right?
Always kept as far apart as possible.
Only plastic knives when those two are.
Is it really?
Yeah.
But it must be a strange club.
There's only six of them, aren't there, left?
It's quite a lot.
We haven't had so many.
How many surviving?
There's only about five, six U.S. presidents.
These are small clubs that people are in.
Yeah, they've known the codes to the nuclear button.
And that does have a sort of a gelling thing.
And also, they're in probably the same speakers.
I guess there's four American presidents, isn't it?
How many are still alive?
Trump, Biden, Obama, Clinton, Carter, five.
Yes.
And Carter's now in his late 90s.
Extraordinary man, actually.
Biden, I thought, should have been given a more prominent position today.
I thought it was a pity that our most important ally wasn't perhaps given a slightly better seat.
I think he was down somewhere near the dignitaries.
The top man from Andorra, I think, was near him.
Narrow Coffins And Historic Clamour00:06:52
But, you know, that's the democracy of a church service.
And what a lot of fantastic scene there was.
Yes.
The hymn singing, I thought the chorus was fantastic.
As I wasn't sure about some of the music in the Abbey, the Macmillan piece didn't really do it.
Did you get emotional, Sharon, watching?
Very.
Did you?
Yeah.
What was the moment through the whole day where you were most affected, do you think?
It was just one of those days where you really just wanted to concentrate on watching every minute of it.
I didn't want to talk to anyone.
I just wanted to watch it all because, as I said to you earlier, it's history.
The moment for me, actually, was when right at the end, when her coffin started to be lowered.
Oh.
I found that very, very affecting on me.
Because I thought, well, that really is the end.
That's it.
That's going to be the last time.
I thought this is it.
She's now with her husband.
Yes, well, that's the uplifting part of the day, isn't it?
At the very start, there was at the Abbey, there was the ringing, the tolling, 96 times of the tenor bell back to the Abbey.
And you'll have been to English country church funerals.
Very much so.
They do the same thing.
They ring the bell.
They don't ring it 96 times, of course.
But the single bell summoning the faithful to prayer and the mourners to prayer.
And I thought that was a funny thing.
And they said, of course, everybody.
Because at the heart of this was, it was a state occasion, but it's also an Anglican funeral.
And the commendation when the Archbishop of Canterbury, I haven't always been his greatest fan, Justin.
I imagine many people are.
But, well, he did it very well.
The commendation at the end, where he said, go forth, O Christian soul.
It's very touching.
This was a narrow coffin there.
Narrow coffin.
Did you notice how narrow it was?
And there, that was the focus on it was on the coffin.
Thank you very much.
Sharon, we're going to love you and leave you.
Thank you very much, Lee.
You've been replaced by one of the world's great historians.
I'm sure you won't mind.
There he is, waiting in the wind, Anthony Selden.
Fascinating to see what he thinks about this from a historical perspective.
There he is.
Well, tonight, Queen Elizabeth II has been laid to rest with her husband, Prince Philip, at a private ceremony.
Earlier she arrived at St. George's Chapel in Windsor for an intimate committal service and one last public goodbye.
She was separated from her crown, orb and scepter for the final time.
Well, as I said, joining me now is historian Sir Anthony Selden, and I'm still with the time, this pretty cool sketch writer's Quentin Letts and talk to the contributor Esther Krakow.
What a day.
I mean, from a historian point of view, what were you thinking as you watched all this unfurl today?
Magical, extraordinary.
Can any other country on earth do it like that?
Why are a quarter of the world's population, is it more or less about that, listening to this?
What are they thinking?
What do they think of these extraordinary buildings and traditions?
And is this going to be the final moment?
Is this the end of the long Second World War and now there'll be just a long recessional for Britain as it goes forward?
Or can we reinvent ourselves post-Brexit and with a new monarch and find a new identity and sense of purpose?
What's the answer?
Well, I think we absolutely can.
I think the monarch's going to be really important in that.
I think we all misunderstand the monarch.
The monarch is like the chair of a company.
The monarch keeps the tradition, the history, as a long-term mission.
Absolutely.
I mean, look, 15 prime ministers for Elizabeth, they come and go.
They strut on the stage.
They signify not very much.
Very few of them make any difference.
The monarchy holds Britain in its arms and carries it forward.
It cares about the physical fabric, the culture, the traditions.
It cares about the deep education.
So I think the monarchy, yeah, I mean, I think Charles was ahead of his time in so many ways.
What I felt today was, certainly quite strongly at various points, was after all the chaos of our government, the Boris Johnson administration, party gate, all that kind of stuff.
Reminded, of course, of the picture of the Queen at Philip's funeral on her own in a mask, obeying the rules because she thought that was her duty.
And it turned out half of Downing Street were on the lash inside the building the night before and so on.
You know, all that sort of disrespect and undignified conduct in the highest echelons of our establishment.
This was a reminder, actually, of the very, very best of our conduct as a country and dignity and establishment.
World-class servant leadership.
We loved her because it was never about me, her publicity, her money.
She was dignified.
She cared for people.
She knew how to behave at all times.
I wonder how those leaders in the Abbey today and those watching who wish they were there think, who lead often brutal, arrogant, selfish extravagant lives.
It was a very interesting point, wasn't it, Quentin, by the Archbishop of Canterbury when he made this speech about why the Queen was so beloved, because she gave herself to service to others.
And she's, you know, unlike he said, those who cling to power and privilege.
And you were looking around the room thinking, well, there's quite a few here that might have blanched out.
And he was pointing straight down the South Transit, which is where all the world leaders were sitting.
So well done, Welby, on that front.
Yeah.
I think I just go back to this idea of this event today, but also the last 10 days, has been about a revival of peacefulness.
And that has been why the Queen was, one of the reasons was that she was so dearly loved, was that she was this idea of silence against all the to-do and clamour of the political world.
Now, we're inevitably going to return to some of that clamour, but maybe it can just be a little bit.
Do you know what's frantic?
Do you know what?
I wish you were right.
I've got a horrible feeling.
I've got a horrible feeling quickly.
Probably tomorrow morning, we're all going to get stuck back into.
Even just hearing you, Piers, talking about Partygate there, it suddenly felt terribly old.
No, no, I'm not talking about Partygate.
No, no, no, but I know what you mean.
Church England And Deep Moments00:02:43
The idea of all that.
I'm more concerned about the actual reality of the cost of living crisis.
Yes, that would be much more horrible of the war in Europe and so on.
So there's lots of massive, massive things for a rookie prime minister and a rookie monarch to have to come to terms with.
I want to bring in Douglas Murray, who I think you're in New York, Douglas.
I am.
What's it been like to be in New York watching all this as a Brit from afar?
Well, of course, it's very painful in many ways because there's nothing that makes you feel so homesick as seeing everything at home so incredibly well and dignifiedly performed, seeing the real depths we have in Britain, the extraordinary rich traditions we have.
It's very painful to see it and not to be a part of it, but I'm sure that many millions of people around the world have felt that.
For me, the extraordinary thing about the day was not just, again, the opportunity to reflect on the legacy of Elizabeth II, and indeed to think forward as so many people have, but to reflect on one of the things that the Queen said several times in her Christmas messages, which was to remind us not to throw out things just because newfangled ideas come in.
And today we saw a number of British institutions, perhaps all of them, at their very best.
And Britain and Britishness has been undergoing a very strange business in the last 20 years, forever questioning itself, forever saying, what are we?
Who are we?
And really the answer was there today.
Britain is a set of institutions which reciprocates the public.
It mirrors the public.
The public are the institutions.
The institutions are the public.
The institution gains its legitimacy not by force of arms, but by honoring the public and the public then honour them back.
The reciprocity of institutions was there today, of the House of Commons, the House of Lords, and of course the Church of England.
And that's one of the most interesting ones, of course, today, because we saw the proper traditional rights of the Church of England, both in Westminster Abbey and in St. George's Windsor.
The Church of England over recent decades, for a long time now, has been throwing out its great liturgy, has been throwing away the great musical tradition that it has, one of the richest musical traditions in the world.
But we saw it again today, and we heard it again today, and we saw that this is what is appropriate to deep moments like this.
So I would like to think that after today, among many other things, we might reflect on the fact that we have great inheritances in Britain, which it is our task to sustain because they are things of great value.
Silver Lines And Personal Loss00:03:29
I completely concur with every single word you just said.
Beautifully put.
I want to bring in broadcaster and campaigner, Dame Esther Ransom, now.
Dame Esther, I knew you were coming on tonight.
I was thrilled to hear you were coming on.
And as I've been waiting to speak to you, it's just been confirmed the Queen has now been buried beside her husband, Prince Philip.
You, of course, had famously a wonderful marriage and sadly lost your husband.
I felt the Queen went quite downhill quite fast after she lost Philip.
What did you feel looking at that from afar?
Yes, possibly.
Obviously, that love, that partnership sustained her.
She said so, didn't she?
My stay and my rock.
And those of us who've had partners who have been supportive, not uncritical, you know, not doormats, but certainly there when you need them.
It makes a huge difference.
And I was very mindful of the number of people.
I mean, Desi died in the year 2000, so I've had 22 years to get used to it.
But I know a lot of the callers to the silver line, you know, when people live, the great, the price you pay for old age is that you lose your closest relatives, your closest friends sometimes.
And so I was talking to people on the Silverline helpline.
I think we should pay tribute to all the people in all the charities who were working today, because they knew that they would be people that needed them.
And that was true both of Childline and of the Silver Line.
But one of the callers today said, I'm at home dressed in black.
I've got flowers and I prepared my lunch.
So I'm ready to watch the funeral.
The Queen's death has brought back memories of when my sister died.
It's such a sad day.
You know, I think for a lot of people, it wasn't only an opportunity to watch these magnificent funerals, both in the Abbey and in Windsor, which was so moving, wasn't it?
The smaller funeral too.
But it was also a moment to try perhaps and come to terms with one's own loss.
Or maybe if there's someone in our own lives or in our friendship group that may be having grief stirred up by memories, maybe we should bring them up and say.
Or actually loneliness.
There was a wonderfully evocative cartoon in the Times today.
I don't know if you saw it by Morton Moreland, which went viral online today.
And just, you know, the cartoon speaks for itself.
It's an elderly man on his own with an empty chair next to him, clearly his partner, who we presume has died, watching the funeral on his own.
And it really resonated with people because that's really about loneliness.
One of the many things, of course, that Silverline tackles so well with our elderly in this country.
But loneliness can be very difficult for people, particularly at times like this, which are unifying times.
And people do like to watch them with their partners or wives or husbands or families, whatever it may be.
If you have no one to watch it with, it can almost exacerbate the feelings of loneliness and grief that you may have.
I think that's absolutely right, Piers.
Welcoming The New King James00:12:20
I totally agree with you.
I think when I wrote about my feelings of loneliness, I had the most touching letter from a gentleman I got to know well called Bob, who died just before his 100th birthday.
And he said that it was at that time 65 years since he married his beloved Catherine, recently died of Alzheimer's.
But he said, more to the point, 72 years since we first kissed.
And she waited for me throughout the war and I for her.
Loneliness, tell me about it.
And I think an awful lot of people of the Queen's generation, but not only of the Queen's generation, will be missing desperately the shoulder that they used to lean on, the hand they used to hold.
Yes.
Day Mester, thank you very much indeed for joining me.
Greatly appreciate it on this very historic day for the country.
Anthony Selden, we've got to look now to the new king, the future.
Lord Dannett earlier talking about the need to be positive as a country.
We've got a lot of difficult issues to deal with.
How important is this monarch going to be in positioning that positivity for the country, do you think?
Well, he's in a slight trap, isn't he?
Because if he does talk out about the issues he cares about, he will get slaughtered.
The media and critics have held off attacking the Queen.
She was simply unassailable.
And now there's a lot of pent-up rage and they're just looking for Charles to make a slip.
And yet, if he doesn't assert himself as the long-term voice on the custodian monarchy, we talk about the welfare monarchy.
We need to talk about the custodian monarchy.
Nobody else can care for this country and its long-term vitality and interests better than the monarch.
The prime minister, they're elected on a slender majority.
You're right.
Monarchies are in decline.
Those that are left, Japan does well.
Very few.
No one, I don't think, does it as well as Britain, underpinning democracy, finding that way forward with Liz Truss and with her successors to somehow get the best out of the British people, make it work again.
So we're not looking back.
We're looking forward.
And Britain has a unique role in the world, not just because of its language and its culture and its history, where there's so much to be proud of.
Esther, it's a big challenge for these two rookies.
Yeah.
Definitely.
The rookie monarch, albeit incredibly well qualified, and the rookie prime minister, who, you know, came, two weeks ago, I came back from a break and there was the new prime minister.
And then the next day she met the Queen, and then two days later, the Queen was dead, and we have a new king, and then we have this today.
This is an extraordinary baptism of fire for a prime minister already facing myriad difficult challenges.
Absolutely.
And you know what's funny?
I hear that the Queen's favourite prime minister was actually Churchill, right?
Because she was in awe of him.
Well, he was her first prime minister.
And I think probably in terms of character, the most that she would have mostly epitomised resilience and determination and stoicism.
And his thing was keep buggering on KBO.
Hers was just get on with it.
You know, similar kind of attitude.
Yeah, and I'm really hoping that Liz Truss has that same attitude because we know that she's facing a myriad of problems.
I actually really do not envy her because I wouldn't want to be in her position.
But I also, you know, I actually feel for Charles as well because this is kind of his first roll of the dice in that way.
And he's really stepping into this huge role.
The future of the monarchy effectively rests on his shoulders.
Well, it's not an easy thing.
We've got a few minutes left, Quentin.
Sum up this day and what it means and how history will judge this day, do you think?
Well, this day will, I think, be bigger than the effect, will have a bigger effect than the funeral of poor Diana.
After Diana's death, the country changed.
I think we can all remember that.
And the country became better at gushing and being more emotional and more relaxed about life.
And I suspect there may be a little bit of a tilt of the other wing now after this, because I think I suspect that what Douglas was saying is correct and that in our wider culture and in our poets and our writers and our painters and our musicians will perhaps reconnect with the idea that the old and the traditional had some value.
And so I think there may be some of that.
I wouldn't go.
You were talking earlier about the tremendous challenges facing the Prime Minister and the King.
I think you're loading too much onto those two people.
And they're the figureheads, right?
Events take their course.
Electoral politics will happen, whatever happens.
And that will probably go wrong for somebody.
That's always happens.
Well, Kier Starmer's going to play the national anthem for the first time in our Labour Party conference.
We haven't heard that for a while.
The king himself, I think the ideal for me would be a king who is just there, who is alongside us, who is a sympathetic ear, who is not trying to look after our morale.
Let's look after our own morale.
Douglas, have we got to stop apologising as a country for our past?
Would that be a good way to move positively forward?
A good way to move forward isn't just to stop apologising, but to actually know about it.
There was a time, maybe a couple of hundred years ago, where anyone saying anything negative about Britain might have had a bit of a problem domestically.
Today, it's the exact reverse of that, the inverse of it.
Unless you bash Britain, people think you're doing something wrong.
Look at all the people who've come out of the woodwork in the last couple of weeks with their rancid opinions about our history and our culture.
I would say that the job of us now is to retain and explain.
That's something people use in museum terminology.
We retain our culture and we explain it to people.
Many people around the world will have watched today's events and been wondering, what's that about?
Who's that?
What's the symbolism of that?
But they'll have learned some of it.
And, you know, we have seen an extraordinary period.
And as Anthony Seldon and others just mentioned, we've seen a transition of a monarch and a prime minister within days of each other.
And what other country in the world would be able to carry out a peaceful transition like that, but our own country.
Other countries, including America, can't manage it.
Imagine if we'd been undergoing a presidential election and a prime ministerial election.
The point is that Britain continues.
The monarchy continues.
Our institutions continue, but they don't continue merely like oxygen.
They continue because the people who are committed to them sustain them.
And so I would like to think that people remember after a day like today, that the job of any generation isn't just to sustain what is good, but to keep it going, to pass it on.
And that is something that I think many people will have been inspired to do from today.
And to remember, as Quentin just said, that we had other values that aren't so bad.
It's not so good to let everything out.
It's not so good to be me, me, me, me time.
It's good to live a life of service to your nation, to your circle around you, to your loved ones, and to the things that matter.
And if we ever saw somebody who epitomized that, it was Elizabeth II.
Absolutely right.
Douglas Murray, thank you very much indeed for joining me.
Sir, Anthony Selden, thank you.
Quentin Letts, Esther Kraku.
Well, that brings an end to our two-hour special.
We could have done probably 22 hours, frankly, on what happened today.
It was just a unique, extraordinary, wondrous day in so many ways.
This country at its absolute greatest.
The greatest for pomp, for pageantry, for monarchy, but also the greatest for the values that this monarch represented.
And I've talked about this a few times in the last 10 days.
I want to end by reminding people what those values are so that we can all try and learn and take from those values.
Stoicism, resilience, dignity, humility, strength of character, not playing the victim.
Don't complain all the time.
Don't explain too much.
Be careful what you say.
And when you say it, mean it.
And stand by your own principles.
Don't get blown in the wind by whatever the next headline is.
If you're like that, you will be more like our queen.
And that will make us all better people.
So thank you, Your Majesty, again for everything that you taught us.
And that leads us to our final farewell to Britain's greatest ever monarch.
It's goodbye to Queen Elizabeth II and our heartfelt gratitude.
We come to this house of God, where Queen Elizabeth was married and crowned.
We gather from across the nation, from the Commonwealth, and from the nations of the world to mourn our loss.
He that hath seen me hath seen the Father.
Thanks be to God.
All who follow the Queen's example and inspiration of trust and faith in God can with her say, We will meet again.
Evening and welcome I'm James Well.
With me is Rupert Bell, Talk Radio and Talk Television's, I nearly said political, of course it would have been wrong, but royal correspondent.
But of course, the monarchy in this country does have a political point because it is above politics.
It actually keeps politics safe and sober to me.
We would like at this particular time in the evening, first of all, to invite your thoughts, because I have had all the pundits I can really be bothered with, all the so-called journalists, we are not, that I can be bothered with.
I would like to hear from you guys what you thought about it.
Monarchy Above Politics00:00:26
The number on the screen on Talk Television and on Talk Radio, if you're listening to us, is 0344 4991000.
This is, Rupert, the end of a moment in history that people of our age and people of many ages will never see again.
Never.
And you just think this two weeks has been bonkers.
Yeah.
In every sense.
And I'm not trying to be trite there, but just seismic.
From the moment Liz Truss is announced, I mean I don't know whether you were working that Monday night, but you may