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Aug. 10, 2022 - Uncensored - Piers Morgan
45:40
20220810_piers-morgan-uncensored-the-fuel-crisis-nhs-tory-l
Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Britain's Transport Crisis 00:12:07
Tonight on Piers Morgan Uncensored with me, Jeremy Kyle, rail fails and pumped up petrol prices are causing complete misery for millions.
We'll ask what's fueling Britain's transport crisis and how we can fix it.
Record waiting lists and DIY dentistry, who will heal the National Health Service?
And as the race for number 10 enters what feels like its 70th year, we'll ask the Tory Party Deputy Chairman if it's time to cut short this ridiculous contest and fix our country.
Good evening, my friends.
A big welcome to Piers Morgan Uncensored.
I'm Jeremy Carl.
Now, all this week, I've been using my platform to talk about the cost of living crisis and Britain's summer of strife.
Tonight, we're going to be talking transport, and I want you to spot the words because this has been painstakingly put together.
Almost everyone's had plans derailed by the biggest train walkouts in 30 years.
That Mick Lynch has ideas above his station, doesn't he?
More strikes than a 10-pin bowler.
Three more are planned this month, and you can forget about London Underground.
They work less days than Santa Claus.
But my friends, at least there's one faithful engine we can always rely on.
That's right!
Thomas the tank engine, that faithful symbol of British railroad reliability and service with a smile.
But sadly, no more.
Thomas has tanked.
I took my kid to see him today.
There we are, lovely.
Sadly, we discovered on arrival that Thomas couldn't perform properly because it was too hot.
Apparently, sparks from his engine could cause fires in the hot weather, so he could only move 100 meters in and out of the station.
So there you have it, my friends.
Even Thomas has packed it in.
Now, there is, of course, a serious side to this.
So let's get back on track before I run out of steam and lose my train of thought.
Cost of living.
It's not just public transport facing crisis.
For many people, the cost of fuel is becoming a very serious problem.
Record prices mean just getting to work for many is becoming too expensive.
The cost of oil and gas, made worse by the war in Ukraine, is driving up prices and squeezing supply.
So much so that today we learned, this is just extraordinary, the UK is now expecting planned power cuts this winter.
Great.
Hold on.
Oh, done.
Oh, done.
Excuse me.
Hello.
Rob!
I need some money for the meter, mate.
We haven't got any cash left.
Brilliant.
I've got no cash.
Bingo!
Thank you very much.
Did you like that?
Oh, that was good.
Right, first tonight.
Those painful prices at the pumps, fuel costs have finally started to fall, but they're still near record highs.
The ROC today says the gap between forecourt prices and wholesale prices is the widest in almost a decade.
And at the start of the week, the average petrol price at Britain's biggest four supermarkets was $174 a litre, diesel at $186.
Now, we did some research.
The cheapest place to fill up is here, Dale Head Garage in Hawes in North Yorkshire.
Great for the good people of Hawes, but it's 250 miles away from this studio, so my little Fiat 500, in brackets, trying to sound like Rishi Sunak, close brackets, that's close to 100 squid round trip just to get there.
I wrote this.
So if you can't pop into Hawes, what can you do?
Joining me now, thank you.
Our financial expert, Gemma Godfrey, here every night, former top gear presenter and motoring legend Steve Berry, and my good old mate Howard Cox from the campaign group Fair Fuel UK.
I'm going to start with you, Howard.
A lot of people will talk about the difference between the four-court price and what it costs, you know, the supplier or whatever.
You're calling for a fuel duty cut of 25p per litre.
Quick question.
Can we afford that?
Absolutely.
In the last year, this government is wallowing in an extra 4 billion of VAT because of the high prices.
And don't forget, the VAT is on the duty as well.
It's a double taxation.
And fundamentally, as you mentioned earlier, the wholesale price, and let's get this right, June the 1st, for example, was 30p, or it's now 30p less than it was in June the 1st.
Why?
And yet the retail price has gone up 4p.
Why?
I mean, Steve, help me out.
Why aren't supermarkets lowering their prices more to almost save the motoring industry?
Because we are hearing real stories of people who might not be able to get their kids to school, people who might not be able to get to work.
I mean, I say it, and I've said it with Gemma every night this week.
You wake up in this country and you think, what is next?
People cannot afford petrol.
Why is something not being done?
But we're talking about it, and a lot of other people are starting to talk about it.
I think people are, I nearly said something I shouldn't.
I think people are getting angry, genuinely angry about this.
And I think that's why we're having this conversation.
And it's happening in homes and workplaces and businesses and in pubs all over the country.
People are starting to ask that question.
Why isn't it lower?
Why isn't the price been lowered?
And I think they're going to have to react.
And it's going to, some are reacting, and because the others have, they charge what they think they can get.
Yeah, but here's the interesting thing.
That research of the garage in Great Halls is people are queuing down the road to go to that garage.
So does that in a business way say to you that if garages take the decision to be competitive, they will do better.
But I don't understand, again, we're going to bring it, Gemma, back to the government.
You know, I watch these two people vying to get to number 10, promising this, promising that.
But yet again, nobody from the government front and centre saying, we know you're struggling in another way.
Polio today, that's something else.
But why?
Howard, to me, it makes so much sense to cut that and reduce some pain for people.
Well, we've got two askers.
One is to cut fuel duty.
Germany have done it by 25p.
France have done it by 20p.
Spain have done it by 20p and Ireland 17p.
We did it by 5p in March at the spring statement and it didn't touch the sides.
We didn't see it either.
But I remember that.
It was two quid a litre and he said, oh, this massive thing, you've taken 5p off.
And I remember that exact day, Gemma, right?
Because, and I think we talked on the radio, it was 195.
It came down to 190.
By the time I parked the car about 100 yards down the road, that one had gone to two quid.
It's not fair, is it?
It's not fair.
And what we're seeing is prices, they're increasing prices very quickly.
So it's not the case that actually, oh, changes take a lot of time to implement.
Very quick to increase prices, but they haven't decreased the prices as much as they should do.
And it's real people, people are playing now.
It's a post-code lottery of where you live to be able to get cheaper petrol.
Tips?
Well, okay, so in terms of tips, again, we've seen such a huge increase in petrol prices that, you know, everybody is struggling.
But it's the simple things like, I mean, you're not going to like this one, but you know, don't accelerate so hard.
Empty your body.
Why is he not going to like that?
Well, you know, if you like driving fast, you know, accelerating hard is going to increase your fuel consumption.
An extra 25 kilograms in your boot is going to increase your fuel consumption by a percentage.
In this hot weather, oh, here's a tough one.
If you put on air conditioning, that will also increase your fuel consumption.
But if you decrease it and open your windows, that can increase the drag.
Piers Morgan sent me a text earlier.
Could I ask, when you're talking about turning down the AC, what about his new car with the cold seats and the hot and cold thing for his coffee?
What's he supposed to do about that?
Very, very tough.
And if he's got the roof down as well, that could create a drag as well.
Horrible.
Must be difficult in LA.
Moving on.
Could I just feel for Piers Morgan a second?
Anyway, moving on.
Steve, the motoring industry.
Is there more that the motoring industry can do?
Not really.
It's too short term.
This has happened very recently, hasn't it?
And these are the dying days of dead tree juice.
I mean, the electric future is going to happen before we know it.
There is one advantage to this panic over fuel prices, though.
You can buy some very tasty mortars very cheaply.
A pal of mine just bought a Porsche Cayenne S with a full service history, about 11 years old, very nice order, 2,000 of your English pounds.
Again, I got offered a Mercedes coupe the other day, five litre V8.
So when you say that to people now, they're like, oh my God, the only thing that won't pass is a petrol station.
The car was a thousand pounds.
Nobody wants those big old barges.
So if you ever lusted after one, now is the time.
Electric motors?
Look how much the cars cost in the first place.
Yes, you're saving money by plugging it in, and people are very smug about all that, and they think they're saving the planet.
But the initial purchase price is so high.
Cradle to grave.
If you compare cradle to grave for an electric vehicle with internal combustion engine, there's hardly any difference in terms of saving the planet in terms of CO2 emissions.
Do you know what the greenest vehicle, and they were green, so there's a clue that was ever made was because of cradle to grave.
What?
The World War II Jeep.
Because it's how long they keep going for.
And people, one of the things that motorists can do is not chop and change the car so much.
I mean, the old days of thinking, oh, it's going to be all worn out at 100,000 miles.
A good, you know, drive it into the ground.
Just keep it until it does.
And then, if you've got a big motor these days, you're getting 500 quid for scrap for a bigger.
Howard, Fairfield UK campaign has done such a lot of good.
You always tell me that politicians are listening.
You know, we've heard then France has done it, Germany's done it.
What do we need?
Do the companies need pressure bought on them by our political leaders?
Because there's no government in sight.
I mean, that's why I said to you at the beginning, I would have thought that one of those two leadership candidates would have thought, oh, this is a really good opportunity.
Maybe they will.
I don't know.
Are you getting through to the politicians with your message to think?
Well, I've met with both of them individually.
Have you?
In the last week.
Who's going to win?
Liz is going to win with me.
Of course.
And simply, the reason is the tax cutting issue is the big one, of course.
But I'm afraid Rishi is actually, it was found by Bloomberg, who actually published that he wants to put a green taxes on diesel and petrol.
We're already paying the highest taxes in the world.
We're already paying the highest petrol in the world.
And here's the thing, Jeremy.
It's very important to understand.
Our second ask is, well, we've got off-gem, off-com, off-what.
Why haven't we got something for Pumpwatch?
There are 37 million drivers in this country, and they don't have any price protection whatsoever.
Do you believe them both?
Well, Liz will when we all know that.
Do you believe her when she says she'll get a grip of this?
Yes or no?
I think, yes, she will.
I'm more convinced.
I was a fan of Penny Morden, that's who I was going for, because she immediately came out and said she's going to cut fuel duty.
Obviously, that's my campaign.
I worry about the promises that they make.
I'm going to throw something out.
Watch Steve Berry's face.
I don't want to upset cyclists, but I have absolutely no idea why cyclists, who seem to dominate our roads nowadays and don't have to pay anything in petrol, don't have to pay road tax themselves or get insured.
One has to move about five feet out the way you get abused.
They take pictures of you.
Why aren't they taking some responsibility?
Well, what do you want me to say?
Do you agree with every single syllable?
You just, and they shave their legs to go faster, which does my heading, but it's true, isn't it?
Cyclists that.
Do you not think they should be taxed?
Yes, they should absolutely, and they should have the an MOT on their motorbike and they should have some sort of identification.
And don't say you can't do it, because they already do it in Denmark.
They're paying for petrol.
You've got everything you want on the roads and you don't pay any money, Jem what?
No, I also think that they're doing what they need to, for their health as well.
They're getting out, they're doing exercise, I don't know.
I think that we want to encourage people to be doing more, because I think during the pandemic I get that, I get that, but should they not shoulder some of the burden?
Because motorists are shouldering a risk.
Can they please use the cycle reins?
That would be nice.
Okay, okay, I see that.
Are you a cyclist?
I'm not a cyclist.
I just feel like, you know.
What?
Well, there's a place for people.
There is a place, but they're taking over our roads.
The Velodrome.
That's a place for it.
The Velodrome.
Strained Health Services 00:02:38
Yeah.
So you hope this message, this cut that you want in fuel duty of 25p, you're hopeful that Liz Truss will listen.
You're hopeful that the next Prime Minister, we believe it will be her, will do this.
Because if it doesn't happen very briefly from all three of you, what happens?
Well, we're in dire straits.
It's impacting on the economy.
As you made the point, people are really suffering.
People can't even afford to fill their car to go to medical points, to hospitals.
There's that issue that's happening.
They're not going to the supermarket once a week.
They're going once a month now.
So it's impacting on the high street.
The whole thing is costing a problem.
I'm backed by the Road Haulage Association.
Something like 50% of a trucker's costs is fuel.
Unbelievable, Steve.
Briefly.
The economy's got to get back from the pandemic.
People have got to get back to work.
If they can't afford to drive to the place that they do their work, how are we going to do that?
Brilliant, guys.
Thank you so much.
Gemma back tomorrow night.
We're talking finances.
Brilliant.
It is yet another problem for us in the United Kingdom.
And next and uncensored, more problems.
Record waiting lists, DIY dentistry, and a possible nurses strike to come.
The big question: is the NHS facing its biggest ever emergency?
Cheery stuff tonight.
Don't go away.
We're coming back in three.
See ya.
It can sometimes feel like the NHS is always in crisis, never more so than just before an election.
But the truth is that national health care is complicated.
It's expensive and it matters.
And put simply for many, this is life and death stuff.
And the NHS itself has arguably never been in greater need of emergency care.
The pandemic and the costs crisis have withered a health service that was already under serious strain.
And all those performance metrics and missed targets and dire warnings are suddenly becoming very real, very, very painful stories of suffering.
Now, NHS staff are suffering too.
How could they not be?
First, the pandemic, now all of this.
This week we heard the Royal College of Nursing is telling its 465,000 members to vote to strike overpay.
That would be the first time ever in England and Wales and it could bring hospitals to their knees.
Some of them are already there.
Waiting lists for routine hospitals have hit unbelievable records of 6.6 million people.
And for some, and this is personal to me, waiting is deadly.
10,000 people have been waiting longer than 104 days to start cancer treatment.
That is double last year.
It's appalling.
Add in waiting times for ambulances, add accident emergency problems as well.
Deadly Waiting Lists 00:11:38
And England's health watchdog says that people are pulling out their own rotten teeth and using super glue to stick in home-made replacements.
This is why, my friends.
Nine, yes, out of every 10 NHS dental practices are now not accepting new adult patients.
The message is simple: go private or just carry on in agony.
Remember, all of this then is before the expected winter chaos of flu and COVID.
Here's a shocking real-life story that should, in this day and age, be unthinkable.
Billy Taylor removed a tooth with pliers like these.
Now, he's about to join me.
For more squeamish viewers, look away.
Billy, for everybody watching thinking this is the United Kingdom in 2022, tell me exactly what happened.
Hi, Jeremy.
Yeah, so we went into lockdown and within about a few weeks, I started getting a bit of a problem with my tooth.
Had a bit of work on it done before, and I started producing an abscess on the side of my face, and it got bigger and bigger.
It was excruciating pain.
So, I phoned up the dentist and basically said, told him exactly that.
And they said, unless I can't breathe, like I literally can't breathe at all, then you can't come in, they can't do anything about it.
I know there's a delay.
Sorry, can we just recap?
The dentist, who we are told we can't name for legal reasons, said, unless you can't breathe, don't bother coming in.
Yeah, they said they can't do anything at all.
If you couldn't breathe, you wouldn't be able to do it.
So you do this, you mean you literally decided to take this tooth out yourself.
So bad.
Oh, God.
So bad was the agony.
I'm told you had to drink some whiskey.
How painful was it, pal?
Yeah, I mean, you know, if you've had toothache before, you'll know how it can kind of affect you.
It's, you know, it's excruciating pain.
And yeah, just had to do it, really.
I mean, had a bit of whiskey and then thought, let's go for it.
Just give them a best shot, to be honest.
But yeah, I mean, the abscess could have got a lot worse.
Could have had an infection which could, you know, could go to your brain.
So it's quite serious stuff we're dealing with.
When it finished the pandemic, did you get treatment in the end?
Did you go and tell this dentist or another dentist you'd done that?
Well, no, I mean, I did.
Well, I took it out, the next day it started healing and it had a full recovery within about three days.
It had fully sort of healed over.
The next time I saw the dentist, which was just a routine check-up, they had a look and they asked me who took it out.
I told them I did it, and they're sort of a bit shocked.
But I said, well, I couldn't see a dentist.
Two questions.
Was that the same dentist who told you you couldn't breathe, or did you change surgeries?
Yeah, no, I couldn't change surgery.
There's nowhere else I could go to, really.
They all sort of had massive waiting lists.
So tonight, when you finished, you're launch on British television, right?
You get toothache.
The big question, Billy Taylor, would you go to a dentist or would you do it yourself?
Well, there we go.
I'd go to a dentist if I could see a dentist, but at the moment, they don't seem to be able to get a hold of them, can you, really?
That's the truth of it.
Billy, thank you so much indeed.
Stay there.
Dr. Rona Iskander in a second, Dr. Philippa Kaye.
I know when you walked in, you said, oh, I'm going to get a hard time.
No, listen, Rona, I want to try and understand.
When you see that.
Yeah.
You're a dentist.
Correct.
You trained.
What in the name of the Lord do you think when you see that in 2022?
A colleague of yours saying, if you can't breathe, don't bother ringing us.
Ridiculous.
I think it's totally unacceptable, and I think it really affirms that NHS dentistry is at its all-time crisis.
This story, unfortunately, is something that I heard a lot during the pandemic.
So it's not a one-off?
No, not a one-off.
And unfortunately, when national lockdown hit, I was actually spending most of my days on the phone dealing with patients, my own patients, or even patients that weren't my own, and trying to give them advice over the phone.
Physically couldn't open up my dental practice.
We were shut for the first three months.
We couldn't see them.
I think I spoke to Philippa as well, who also told me that a lot of dental patients were calling up the doctors and saying, I have abscesses, I have this.
And dentists felt really, really powerless.
Why are there so?
Why are we in the grip as we sit here?
And we'll move to Philippa in a second about doctors' appointments.
You know, 6.6 million people on waiting lists.
Why are people unable to find a dentist?
Presumably that means there aren't enough dentists.
And you know what I'm going to say to you?
You trained as an NHS dentist.
We, the taxpayer, paid for that.
And then you've gone private because you told my team there's too much stress.
So why are we investing in you if you're allowed to then disappear?
It's a nutter contract.
Well, this is the thing and I think that NHS dentistry, the problem really is the system.
I went in with a lot of love and passion for my career.
Dentistry has the highest suicide rate of lots of professions.
The BDA have affirmed that as well.
When I went in there, I was given targets and quotas by my practice.
These are set out by the NHS.
You have to do X amount of work.
That meant that sometimes I was doing checkups in six minutes, seven minutes.
That is not the care that I want to give my patients.
I was burning out and I wasn't giving the quality that they really deserved.
Why are people, listen, the way you explain it, I can understand why more people aren't getting into the profession.
Certainly, it's yet another thing that seems to have crept up on us and is causing massive problems.
Are they finding it difficult to find dentists?
Is that the reason because of the industry?
Well, I think this is a great question because actually dental schools take about 70 dental students on average in a year.
This hasn't increased.
There were 70 10 years ago when I qualified and there's 70 now.
The crisis is getting worse.
Why aren't they taking on more students?
Again, it's a funding problem.
And actually, you make such a salient point.
I'll bring in Dr. Philippa.
Philippa, this is not just dentists.
This is doctors.
This is nurses.
We heard about the Royal College of Nursing saying strike.
I mean, that's never happened before.
How bad is it on the front line for you?
It's difficult.
And I think that we need to remember that we don't want to frighten people and we don't want people to not go to hospital when they need to.
You know, if you are having symptoms of a heart attack or a stroke, you need to go.
And we saw at the beginning of lockdown that people weren't going when they had cancer symptoms.
They were concerned.
If you are in need, the NHS is open.
It has always been open and it is open for you.
But we are six, seven thousand GP shorts.
We are tens of thousands of hospital doctors and nurses and midwives.
Why is it as Rona said?
And I totally get your point, you know, that you go in there with such expectations a bit, you know, it's something that you want to do, you want to give, and the pressure's unbearable.
And of course, you're going to go private.
I completely get there.
People who send their kids to private education say, why would I not if I can afford it?
Because the system's not great.
What for you as a GP?
I mean, 6.6 million people waiting.
I mean, it's okay and quite proper to say don't panic because, you know, my old man died a year ago and the NHS were absolutely unbelievable.
But you go out into the waiting room and there's thousands of people waiting and it's not fair on anybody, is it?
It's a combination of things.
And I think it's also important to remember that when patients are complaining and complaining about lack of access, that actually you need to be complaining to your MP as much as you might be complaining to your GP.
There is a lack of training and there is a but even if we opened up the medical schools right now, I'm still 10 years away from having more GPs on the desk next to me and we need to be able to retain our staff.
There are issues about pension rules and doctors, senior doctors leaving early or leaving at different times.
I mean I'm doing this the other day on the radio.
Some doctors or GPs want to work three days a week because they don't, they can't, a bit like you, Rona, the pressure and the stress.
The message that would come across, and I'm not criticising either of you because you do a fantastic job, it seems to me that the very people that keep this country going are being let down by this country.
And that, for all of us, has really, really bad ramifications, doesn't it?
You have to remember that GPs who may be working three full days are likely to be working over 40 hours within those three full days.
And that GPs, lots of us, will also be appraisers of other GPs, which we have to do every year.
Or we'll be teaching medical students.
Or we'll be doing other things that have to, or research, that have to be done.
So it's not that if you're a portfolio GP and you work three or four days a week, it's not that people aren't working, they're working.
And also in any job, people have the right to work part-time if that's what they want to do.
And that's how you might retain your staff better.
Interesting.
And of course, the private sector would be more preferable for people, not just the money, but the work things that you've talked about, hours and flexibility.
Rona, we're not looking after, in my mind, dentists, doctors, the very people who are supposed to look after us.
How do we fix this?
What's your answer?
I think that this is a great question.
And I've been two great questions.
I know, literally.
Quite proud of myself.
Well done, Jess.
I think the thing is, really, as I said, you've got to take up more dental students.
We've got to provide the funding.
More dentists need to go through.
We need to also prepare them for a better work environment.
The other thing is, is that 2,000 dentists left the NHS this year.
2,000, right?
And why?
This isn't necessarily to go private.
They're leaving the profession as a whole.
They cannot handle the stress of running a practice with fulfilling these quotas.
They're finding themselves incredibly short staffed.
We're not having the support system anymore.
You know, nurses, receptionists, et cetera, they're shortages across the board.
So we really need to provide an environment that's conducive to providing optimal health care.
Billy, I think it's really, really, Philippa, sorry, in terms of the way you look at this whole thing, I guess as a medical professional, you think people are on at us the whole time.
We care, we want to do our best.
To sum up, really, as Rona said, what's your message to people if they are in pain, can't get a GP's appointment, they can't get a dentistry, they're sitting at home, they can't put pets in their car, they can't afford this.
It's a nightmare.
Healthcare, I would have thought, to this country is one of the most important things.
It's going to get worse, as we said in the winter.
What's your message, Philippa?
First thing is to do is to look after yourself.
That means you take up your COVID vaccine, your flu vaccine if it's offered to you, and all of those things.
You attend your cervical screening and your breast screening because catching things early or prevention is better than cure.
And from a financial point of view, it costs less to the NHS as well, never mind the huge personal cost.
So there are definitely things that you can do.
You also need to use the NHS wisely.
And that might mean that you talk to your pharmacist first.
Pharmacists are often a really underused resource.
But you use your walk-in centre and your local minor injuries clinic and your GP and not just go to AE straight away.
So we have to use it carefully.
But if you have chest pain, if you have stroke, if you have symptoms related to cancer, then you need to ring your GP.
And yes, you might be talking to a receptionist first, but you need to say, this is what I'm concerned about.
And you will be put forward because we are triaging.
That means that we are dealing with the people in most need first.
Do you both think that there are some dentists and doctors who are having it too easy when the country looks on and is suffering?
No, I think my colleagues are working incredibly, incredibly hard under a time of immense pressure on the background of two years of a pandemic.
They work amazingly.
I had to be in hospital some months ago and the response was incredible.
And I think that we have to balance it.
I think we do have to balance it because the people who do that job.
Rising Energy Bills 00:15:31
But you wouldn't advocate that, would you?
No, definitely, definitely not.
And I think the thing is as well, just to echo what Philippa says, is that, you know, I sometimes speak to dentists that are newly qualified, have been two years into practice, and they call me up in tears because they simply cannot cope.
And the restrictions that we had to work in afterwards, you know, we had to allow surgeries to air for an hour between patients so we couldn't see enough patients.
The PPE, I mean, literally looked like the Michelin man, you know, it was so uncomfortable.
And, you know, these just weren't great conditions.
And we are here to provide health.
You know, we care about our patients.
I really, really appreciate it.
Billy and Devon as well.
Thank you very much indeed.
I think it's really easy, as I said, to criticise and say this isn't good enough.
And it isn't, but I think it's also really important to say that the service that people like you do is so important.
Thank you for joining us tonight.
Can I have an appointment tomorrow morning at nine o'clock?
I've got a toothache.
Got one for you, John.
Private or NHS?
Anything for you?
There we go.
Still to come and uncensored.
It's the dog days of the Tory leadership race.
But there's still, my friends, another four weeks to go.
My feeling is, as so many other people agree, shouldn't they just put us out of our misery, put Liz Trust into 10 Downing Street and get on with running this country?
Tory Party Deputy Chairman Matt Vicker's been in the job three weeks.
Live after this break.
I'm coming right back.
Right, last night Talk TV hosted the Tory leadership hustings in Darlington, a veritable cornerstone in the former Red Wall.
Liz Truss and Ruchi Sunak traded barbs on tax, on levelling up, and the cost crisis.
But it was Presenter Tom Newton Dunn's comments at the end of his interview with Liz Truss that stole the headlines.
The Foreign Secretary was caught on mic apologising to our Tom for criticising the media.
Tom rightly called her out and said it's cheap.
Have a look.
It's cheap.
Meanwhile, Rishi Sunak, worth 730 million quid, by the way, tried to find common ground with his northern audience.
Dishyrishi told them when he's eating out to help out, he quite enjoys a palmo.
For the uninitiated here, a palmo is a Tyneside takeaway favourite involving a giant slab of breaded chicken covered in white sauce and cheese.
Now, I'm not utterly convinced that's really your dish, Rish.
Great.
Tom also asked both candidates if they'd be prepared to work together to solve Britain's cost crisis.
Trust sniped that Sunak's plans were, quote, Gordon Brown economics.
I'd say a bit like that, although I don't agree with this.
It all got quite tasty.
I'm delighted though to be joined now by Deputy Conservative Party Chairman and MP for Stockton, good friend of mine, Matt Vickers.
Good evening, Matt.
How are you?
Good evening, Jeremy.
I'm fantastic.
It's coming at you loud and clear from Costa Del Stockton.
It's been glorious of you today.
We've been out on the doorsteps.
It's fantastic.
I'm upbeat.
I'm happy.
Let's start with the Palmo because I've read something very interesting.
Matt Vickers sent a letter to the parliamentary catering team last year asking to include the traditional Teesside delicacy on its list of culinary options.
In Tuesday's hustings, Rishi Sunak praised you for putting the Palmo on the menu in Parliament.
And he said, We won't just be serving them in Parliament, we'll be serving them off the cabinet table in Downing Street.
I mean, celebrity chef Matt Vickers, what's going on, man?
Have you had a Palmo yet, Jeremy?
It's absolutely fantastic.
Basically, I went down there to Westminster and noticed that when you see this fantastic menu with all these wonderful culinary dishes from all over the world there for MPs, parliamentarians, and peers to eat.
And I decided, why not a dish from Teesside?
The Parmo, wonderful stuff.
And actually, my mission down there was getting the Palmo on their menu and getting Teesside on their menu as well so they can spend some cash up here and get some of my issues dealt with.
Right, let's get serious, my friend.
I'm going to put to you, the Deputy Conservative Party chairman.
I know you've only been in the job a week.
You were very supportive of Boris Johnson.
You haven't come out to declare for either Liz Truss or Rishi Sunak, although you were involved in his election in his Richmond constituency.
To a lot of people in this country, and this is what I want a direct answer to: we're watching an elongated mess that is, I don't know, they trade barbs every day.
They both seem to make promises that none of us can quite work out whether those are attainable.
Do you not think the British people right now need a government to be active, to be available, to be out there telling us that these horrendous things-be it the cost of living at petrol, food, polio today?
Do you not think our government needs to govern, put this to bed, and get on with doing what we, the British people, need, Matt?
I think democracy is a really important thing, and I actually think it's right that those two people who will be in down one of whom will be in Downing Street running this country is travelling the length and breadth of this country, talking to Conservative Party members, being asked the questions that matter to the people in Stockton, in Darlington last night.
I think that's a healthy thing.
I think that's a good thing.
And I think they should be stress tested.
That we should be put on the spot and questioned about the issues that affect the people around here.
And I think that's entirely the right thing to do.
Do I think there are lots of issues going on in the country?
Exactly, and that's why it's so important that we get the right person.
But of course, government hasn't when it comes to the cost of...
I get that, Matt, but you might have heard the last section on.
Let me put this in real terms for you.
I'm speaking to, before the break, a dentist so stressed by the conditions of being an NHS dentist, she quit.
A doctor who is part of a workforce that's shrinking that's got a 6.6 million long waiting list.
And a man who, unable to see a dentist, took his own teeth out with pliers.
I'm not being against democracy.
Our government has, in many people's eyes, disappeared and needs to be more on the front foot, helping us at this moment.
That's what I'm saying to you.
And I think, whatever your policies and whatever side wins, actually, the British people are getting fed up because they think we're being left in the mire on our own, Matt.
That's the point.
In real terms, our waiting lists are through the roof.
We had a pandemic where people couldn't get elected surgery, couldn't have access to things that they might have.
The NHS under massive pressure.
Our amazing NHS, by the way, that delivers fantastic services.
Those amazing men and women who work at my local hospital and deliver unbelievable quality of care.
And actually, you know what?
There are almost, I think we're on 12,000, 11,800 more nurses in those hospitals than there were a year ago.
There are 4,300 more doctors in those hospitals than there were just a year ago.
The NHS is getting the biggest cash boost in its entire history.
And you know what we're debating last night on how that money should get spent?
How we make it go further.
Matt, I know there's a delay.
I understand when you work in government about sandbites.
What I'm asking is, does the Tory government right now understand the depths of concern, the depth of fear?
Fear that people will not be able to heat their homes, fear that they won't be able to fill their cars to get to work, fear that they'll have to, what, take their own teeth out, fear that there will be blackouts.
We've read that today.
What I'm saying is I'm not trying to over-dramatise it.
I'm trying to say that a majority of people in this country are looking at what's going on and going, whether it's Rushi Sunak or Liz Truss, I want my government to tell me how the hell I'm going to pay my electricity bill come January.
That's what I'm saying, mate.
Yeah?
Yeah, you couldn't over-dramatise the impact of the cost of living to me.
Every day, today, I was out on the doorsteps hearing from people in my part of the world, seeing the bills that are landing on those doormats that are through the roof.
This isn't a UK problem.
This is a global problem.
We all know all the causes of it, whether it be the war in Ukraine, whether it be the unlock from COVID, all of the zero COVID policies of China.
All those things have had a massive impact.
It's affecting the globe, these prices.
And what is the government doing?
Well, it's focusing, you know what?
The government doesn't grow money on trees.
It has the money that you pay in tax, that I pay in tax, and that everyone else at home pays in tax.
So when we give it to somebody to support them, we take it from somebody else.
And those are fine balancing acts.
What we are doing is ensuring that those most vulnerable in society get as much as £1,600 extra in the pocket.
And that's entirely the right thing to do.
That money hasn't all reached everybody yet.
There is money that will appear in October for pensioners, whether that be, you know, there's an increase of £300 a winter fuel allowance.
Matt, is it, final question, a good look for the Tory party?
The party that's supposed to tax and spend prudently.
The party that's supposed to care.
What I find astonishing, and I'm going to stick up for Rushi Sunak here.
He stands up and he talks about prudence in terms of tax and inflation.
Almost Thatcherite.
It seems from what we read that the Tory faithful have turned against that.
I fear that the Tory Party, if they continue to rip themselves to shreds, and whether they say they care about the British people, they are perceived to not have their eyes on the game.
I fear that that will affect them long term.
And I'm asking you as the deputy chair, does your party and does your government understand the depth, the depth of misery, suffering and concern right now, not just in Darlington, but across the country, Matt Vickers?
That's the question.
I think we're very well aware.
We're out on the streets every day hearing the challenges that people are facing.
And that's exactly why those candidates are travelling around the country, hearing the pressures, hearing the challenges that people face in different parts of this country and how very tough these times are.
But you know what?
We got through that pandemic.
We've got the doors open on the economy again.
We've got people still in work.
During that pandemic, we paid 13.5 million people's wages.
That has to be paid down somehow.
And now we're getting to the other end.
We're dealing with the problems, the impact that's had on our hospitals, the impact it's had on our kids in school, and the impact it's had on our economy.
Big challenges.
We got through the Brexit thing.
We got through the pandemic.
And now we're dealing with recovering from that pandemic and getting this country moving again.
And you know what?
We're going to be optimistic and we're going to get on with the job with whichever one of those fantastic candidates we select to be the next Prime Minister of this country.
Right.
Actually, I've got two more very quickly.
And it's the one-word answer.
Who wins?
Rishi Sunak or Liz Truss?
Oh, that's a convenient.
You know what?
I'm entirely neutral.
I'm not allowed.
Okay.
I'm not allowed.
Otherwise, I'm sure they're both great candidates.
Do you know what?
The Labour Party would love to have a female leader.
We might have one third.
I'd love to have a leader.
You've got 30 seconds to promote something that I think is fantastic.
Tell us about your campaign for posthumous awards for World War I soldiers.
And fair play to you.
30 seconds.
Go, Matt Vickers.
It's the most important campaign I probably ever ran.
I know about a guy from Stockton called George Hunter.
He had an industrial...
He worked at a foundry up in Port Clarence.
He suffered from an industrial accident, still put himself forward to go into World War I, was sent off to France, leaving his wife and children behind.
He was shot at dawn because his behaviour as a result of this industrial action made them seem as a trouble causer.
He was pardoned.
We pardoned him.
People looked at the evidence and said that was completely wrong.
And now he deserves those medals and I'm going to do everything I can to get him those medals.
Good man.
Matt, thank you for that.
Take your palmo with you and coming up next, Jez's Journos are fired up and ready to fulvinate and fume all over today's debates.
The legend that is Kevin O'Sullivan and Afia Hagan next on Uncensored.
See you in a minute.
Welcome back to Uncensored with me, Jay Carr, and joined now by my fabulous Jezz Journos tonight, Talk TV legendary presenter Kevin O'Sullivan and talk TV contributor Afia Hagan or Mrs. H as I love to call her.
Welcome, how are you?
I'm good, how are you?
I'm good, nice to see you, Kev.
So the big question, extraordinary to think, in 2022, are we going to see blackouts at Christmas this year?
Probably, yes.
Really?
Yes.
I think the government preparing people, preparing, saying, you know, perhaps we might have problems with power of power.
We only have a sixth of the power that we need.
I think, yes, the government should be preparing people.
Growing up in Scotland, I remember there was a winter where we did have blackouts for about two months.
I'm not really sure why.
I asked my mum, she couldn't remember why either.
But we had to deal with that.
And Scotland, it was really, really freezing.
Kev.
Oh, dude.
Oh, God.
Oh, dear.
Honestly, I do apologise.
Rob, then you put money.
Hold on a minute.
Hold on.
Where's the button?
Say the name of the meeting.
Oh, there he is.
Kev O'Sullivan, as I never saw him before.
Rob, put the money in the meter, man.
Haven't you?
Well, you get paid enough.
Right, listen.
Sick of that guy.
Kev, honestly, 2022.
Places running out of water, petrol we can't afford to put in our cars, blackouts.
What is this?
1940.
Why has all of this seemingly just come and jumped at us?
Was there no forward planning?
What's going on, Patrick?
We've had it incoherent energy policies for a long, long time.
We've got a perfect storm.
Ukraine, Russia cutting off the gas, our green policies, which have left us rather susceptible to fluctuating global situations and the economy.
And therefore, what's going to happen is hospitals and food outlets, food manufacturers have already been told, get your generators ready, because we are going to almost certainly have to impose strategic blackouts on the country.
Now, the last time this happened, I'm young enough, old enough, old enough.
I was only a little kid, but I do remember Ted Heath.
He had to do the same back in the 1970s.
And once a politician, a government has to impose turning the lights out, that government is out.
If we have blackouts, the government will lose the next election.
Well, I think this is the end of the game for the tourists.
This has happened.
I mean, civil unrest.
I'm not sure.
I'm just being honest.
I mean, if you lay it out, people can't pay their bills.
They're not going to have electricity.
I mean, where does it end, briefly?
And this is the thing is that, Kevin, you're absolutely right.
This is the end of this government.
And actually, people need to realize they need to stop voting for the Tory Party.
Stop voting for the border.
But what's the observative?
I had this argument last night.
It's a very good point.
But you're right.
Civil unrest is not too far down the road.
If people can't pay their bills, if they can't put food on the table, they can't heat their homes, they can't feed their children, where else do they go?
And they can only, you know, make their voices heard by going to the ballot box.
And that's not for another couple of years.
Well, we said it, yes.
We've said it, haven't we?
I said it to you this morning, this rudderless government.
I don't believe that anybody should get into number 10 down the street without a mandate from the people.
People will disagree.
We've got fuel prices.
We were talking about this today.
We've got, I mean, I did this graphic last night.
You know, electricity and gas from like 1,277 quid, a year later, 4,200 quid.
What do you think will happen to the people of this country?
Well, the problem is they're talking about civil disobedience.
It will be enforced civil disobedience because it's not a question of people saying these bills are too high.
We refuse to pay them.
This is a protest.
They will refuse to pay them because they simply can't pay them.
Unprecedented Economic Abyss 00:03:43
The abyss we are staring into is unprecedented.
I'm not sure this government's got a handle on it.
But I also don't think that the answer is to vote Labour.
It certainly isn't that.
Well, the answer is not to vote, keep voting Conservatives.
And also, I don't understand what they're doing.
But that's not the answer.
The Labour Party should be straight to hell.
I say that.
They should be.
They should be taking advantage of this opportunity.
But they used to use it.
Well, yes, because Kiostarma is useless.
Absolutely.
Agreed.
You know, and there's lots of people who are politically homeless because the Labour Party, they couldn't organise a party in a brewery.
What are they doing?
They should be using this as an Well, they organised a party in a brewery and he got away with it.
Very quickly.
Not really.
Well, there we go.
Tom Daly's new documentary about homophobia in the Commonwealth.
Just 30 seconds briefly.
Is he right?
Is he wrong?
He's right and he's wrong.
A lot of homophobia in lots of those countries that he talked about, 30-something countries, was actually already there before colonialism, before the empire.
And you're from Ghana and that's one of the countries involved.
Absolutely, which is really shameful.
But a lot of these things were culturally unacceptable and then the empire came and put them into law.
And I think that's what he means when he was talking about the empire didn't make it easy or no, they kind of, in a way...
No, it's not Britain's fault.
He tried to blame Britain.
There are 56 countries in the Commonwealth.
But a lot of the laws came from.
35 of them ban homosexuality.
14 of them are under direct British law.
And in all of those colonies, the directly ruled British colonies, homosexuality is legal.
So to blame Britain for other countries' laws is just ludicrous.
All right, Kev, you had a heated discussion with a climate activist today.
Can we just watch this clip?
This is brilliant.
It's what is known, Dylan, as a nice, sunny summer day.
It is not a prelude to the end of the world.
Do you get that?
It is a nice day.
It's not the end of the world.
No, no, listen to me.
Listen to me, William.
Will you?
Just don't talk over me.
Oh, God, you people, you're supposed to be a movie.
You are telling us to enjoy the weather.
Yes, I am.
Can you believe that?
Do you enjoy the weather?
Yeah, I mean, these people are doomsday cultists.
They hate the whole idea of joy, of people enjoying anything.
It's sunny.
It's the end of the world.
No, it's not.
And hot days, even those very hot days we had a couple of weeks ago, certainly do not prove that climate change has reached a critical point, if at all.
That's the problem, Kevin, because they actually do that.
That's rubbish.
Prove it.
Prove it.
97% of climate scientists agree that global warming is caused by humans.
You can, but that would be a problem.
Why not?
So nothing.
So certitude is not warranted here, isn't it?
The thing is, Kevin, it's factual that the Earth is warming.
And that's proven by the warmer technology.
It's not necessarily at all.
It's not necessarily at all.
Can I jump in?
Because I'd love to talk to you too forever.
Maybe we'll go down the pub.
But listen, on a serious note, you know, I get the whole idea we should be concerned about the climate.
And I'm not just siding with my mate.
I think there are more pressing problems right now to get dealt with rather than worrying.
And I think that Green Levy, I love you, Mrs. H, but I got to go.
Please come back, won't you?
Afia Hagen, thank you very much.
The legend that is Kev O'Sullivan back tomorrow morning, 10 o'clock on Talk TV.
Almost five tonight.
So we're standing by for the talk, which will be on after nine o'clock.
That's it from me.
What a day it was from Thomas the Tank Engine to Kev O'Sullivan all in 16 hours.
Wherever you are tonight, keep it uncensored.
Have yourselves a great Wednesday.
We'll see you back here tomorrow night at 8 o'clock.
Surah.
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