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Aug. 9, 2024 - This Past Weekend - Theo Von

01:46:47

E523 Georges St-Pierre

Georges St. Pierre is a retired mixed martial artist who became a double champion in the UFC, holding belts in both the welterweight and middleweight divisions. He is widely considered to be one of the best fighters in MMA history. Theo joins Georges St-Pierre in Montreal to chat about his disdain for fight day, coming back from adversity, his love of dinosaurs, and how he’s keeping his competitive spirit alive. Georges St. Pierre: https://www.instagram.com/georgesstpierre/ ------------------------------------------------ Tour Dates! https://theovon.com/tour New Merch: https://www.theovonstore.com ------------------------------------------------- Sponsored By: Morgan & Morgan: If you’re ever injured, visit https://forthepeople.com/thispastweekend or dial Pound LAW (#529). Their fee is free unless they win. Valor Recovery: To learn more about Valor Recovery please visit them at https://valorrecoverycoaching.com/ or email them at admin@valorrecoverycoaching.com Blue Cube: Follow @BlueCubeBaths on Instagram for a chance to win your own cold plunge this Summer! They will announce the giveaway soon… 50 Fires: Go to link.pscrb.fm/theovon-2307812 to listen to the 50 Fires Podcast. ------------------------------------------------- Music: “Shine” by Bishop Gunn https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3A_coTcUek ------------------------------------------------ Submit your funny videos, TikToks, questions and topics you'd like to hear on the podcast to: tpwproducer@gmail.com Hit the Hotline: 985-664-9503 Video Hotline for Theo Upload here: https://www.theovon.com/fan-upload Send mail to: This Past Weekend 1906 Glen Echo Rd PO Box #159359 Nashville, TN 37215 ------------------------------------------------ Find Theo: Website: https://theovon.com Instagram: https://instagram.com/theovon Facebook: https://facebook.com/theovon Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/thispastweekend Twitter: https://twitter.com/theovon YouTube: https://youtube.com/theovon Clips Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/TheoVonClips Shorts Channel: https://bit.ly/3ClUj8z ------------------------------------------------ Producer: Zach https://www.instagram.com/zachdpowers Producer: Nick https://www.instagram.com/realnickdavis/ Producer: Colin https://instagram.com/colin_reiner Producer: Cam https://www.instagram.com/cam__george/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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	Sitting down today to talk about dinosaurs and fears with one of the greatest mixed martial artists of our time, of any time.
	He won UFC belts in two different weight classes, and you can't even talk about the sport without mentioning him.
	I'm really honored to be in his presence today, and I mean that.
	Today's guest is Mr. George St. Pierre.
	Shine that light on me I'll sit and tell you my stories Shine on me And I will find a song I've been singing just before Shine on me This is your country, man.
	Yes, sir.
	And so what it's um yeah, because it's French-Canadian.
	So which one is the real one?
	Or which, you know what I'm saying?
	Like, who's really the boss or whatever?
	Well, there's no really, I mean, who's the boss?
	I don't know if there's really a boss.
	Like, if you had to pick one, you get to pick one or every day it's the same.
	Yeah.
	You mean the boss?
	Talk about the leader.
	Yeah.
	Most people will tend to say, oh, it's the, you know, the political leader of Canada or the Prime Minister or the president.
	But I think, I mean, you can call me conspirationist thinking that, but I don't think he's the one that really control everything.
	I think there's people behind that.
	Maybe.
	I mean, that's what I believe.
	I could be wrong, but that's what I think.
	That's what I think, too.
	Yeah, I think that the president is the face.
	It's a face.
	It's the puppet.
	But like our prime minister is the face, but I think there's people behind that there's certain things that he cannot do.
	That's what I believe.
	Did you always believe that you think or that you think that's grown over the years?
	It's a good question.
	I think it's grown over the years.
	Especially because there's a lot of sometimes sometimes there's a lot of conspiracy that turns out to be true.
	And there's so much stuff on internet nowadays that you can try to search anything and they will give you something to read about a certain subject, even if it's completely preposterous.
	So it's hard to know what is real and what is not.
	But maybe that's the reason why, because of that, it makes me realize that, oh, what I'm seeing is maybe not really what it is.
	Oh, yeah.
	Yeah.
	Oh, I think it's fascinating because, yeah, say if like a lot of media was like kind of all controlled, right?
	Then of course they're going to not want you to know some things.
	Yeah.
	And eventually people are going to kind of figure those things out.
	People figure things out.
	I think it's always about money and power.
	I know.
	People that has money and power, what they want is they want more money and more power.
	I tend to believe that most of people are mostly in the middle.
	And like if you look at politics, you have the extreme right, extreme left.
	But most people are, I think, mostly in the middle, you know, that they're not too one side or the other.
	And then the way it's portrayed is that you have to pick one side or the other side.
	And you're like, shit, I don't know what to do.
	You know what I mean?
	Because I'm, you know, I'm stuck in the middle.
	Yeah.
	I think stuck in the middle is probably the best spot, you know?
	And I think most people are probably pretty logical, you would think.
	But then maybe sometimes I start to wonder, do I give people too much credit?
	You know, like, are a lot of people just bat shit crazy, you know?
	And then I wonder sometimes, am I just bat shit crazy?
	You know?
	Yeah, it's true.
	We have to look at ourselves in the mirror sometimes.
	It's hard.
	Yeah, but I've wondered sometimes, like, yeah, I'm amazed, I guess, that power and money drive so many people.
	Like, I get it being like an influence, you know?
	But I think there's a part of me, I guess I'm shocked that it has that much control.
	What do you think?
	I mean, you're kind of one-on-one, George.
	You've had such a, I mean, you got to almost have kind of a perfect career in a lot of ways.
	You know, I made tons of mistake looking at it, and I wish I could do better because I'm very critics, critic, criticism, critics about myself.
	But yeah, I'm happy with what I have accomplished.
	And do you think, was it power, success driving you?
	Like, what was kind of your driving force, do you feel like?
	I'll be honest with you, 100%.
	I never liked to fight.
	I love the sport.
	I love the science of it.
	I like the camera dream that I have with my friend, you know, before like a training camp.
	You know, it's like you're going to war.
	I despise fight day.
	It's unbearable for me.
	I'm extremely uncomfortable and not knowing if I will be hurt or humiliated or winning the ultimate prize is unbearable for me.
	It's very hard to deal with.
	But it's the price that you have to pay if you want to achieve freedom.
	Like for me, I first started doing it because I had a certain natural talent, I would say.
	You know, if I would be born with an antsy cap, I wouldn't probably not be able to do what I did.
	So I was a gifted athlete.
	And I also work really hard, but I also consider myself extremely lucky.
	The stars were all aligned because there's guys that I've met through my journey that were probably more talented than I was.
	There's guys that I met that probably worked harder than I did.
	But I think what made the difference is the fact that I met the right people at the right time.
	Sometimes life gave me certain opportunity that I did not shy away.
	I was always willing to get out of my comfort zone in order to improve, which is not the case from a lot of athletes.
	And not only athletes, like entrepreneur, humans, for a human, for all of us, it's hard to get out of our comfort zone.
	But sometimes it's necessary.
	It's a necessary evil in order to improve.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, well, I think like what you said, like, because you can control how much you, how hard you work.
	You can control, those are a lot of control factors.
	Yes.
	But that is, that's a risk.
	When you get out there and you get on a fight day, some of it's out of your control.
	I remember.
	Did it feel like that?
	Is that what it felt like, kind of?
	It's always a question of risk and reward.
	It's calculated risk.
	I remember if I go back more than like almost 30 years ago, I couldn't really speak English very well.
	I learned it at school, but I grew up in a French environment.
	So my English was really bad.
	It's hard.
	Yeah.
	And the first time I remember I was already a black belt in Karate and I wanted to go to the Gracie Academy in New York because that's where the best jiu-jitsu athlete were training at the time.
	So I knew that I needed to go there in order to train with the best, to learn from the best.
	So I'm about, at that time, I'm about like 16, 17 years old.
	And I'm planning to go there with two of my friends, two of professional that are professional athletes at the time.
	And one of them, only one of them speak perfect English.
	So he's the...
	There were not like ways.
	So we had to go on map quests and it was a pain in the butt to find your way.
	So I'm driving.
	I got a shitty Ford tempo with a hole in.
	I remember where I used to put the brake pedal.
	So people used to make fun of me.
	It was like the flintstone, you know.
	I could almost put my foot on the floor.
	So the plan was to go in New York to go there and we share the hotel together.
	So we save money and we share the gas and everything.
	But the day before the trip, one of them called me and it's the one that speaks English.
	He's like, hey, George, I cannot make it.
	I'm like, are you kidding me?
	And I'm talking to the other one who's supposed to come with me.
	He's like, oh, if he's not going, I'm not going either.
	I'm like, man.
	But you know what?
	I said to my son, F it.
	I'm going by myself and that's it.
	So I went there and I remember, man, I got my ass whooped by a guy who weighs maybe 30 pounds lighter than me.
	Wow.
	I got tapped out like in jitsu when you're stuck in an umbar or a choke.
	You have to tap.
	Otherwise your arms break or you get choked out.
	So, and I remember at the time, I was like, man, I was getting mulled.
	I was a black belt in Karaite.
	I was a good striker, but in grappling, I didn't have a lot of knowledge.
	And I knew I needed to learn it in order to become a mixed martial art fighter.
	But man, I got beat up so bad.
	And I remember driving back.
	I was that close to give up.
	And I told myself, I said, you know what?
	I need to go back out there and learn.
	And every time I was going back there, it was tough for me because guys, a lot of them were trying to bully me.
	A few of them were very nice to me, but it was a constant grind.
	And I remember the two guys that were supposed to come with me, they asked me, hey, how was it?
	I'm like, man, I got my ass kicked so bad.
	Man, they never came back with me.
	They were like, they wanted to stay in their comfort zone.
	So that's the difference.
	You know, if you want to succeed, sometimes it's a necessary evil.
	You're going to go through pain.
	You're going to might be humiliated.
	You're going to, you're going to fail.
	But then have to go through that, man, in order to improve.
	You know, and that's, that's what I was ready to do, which is probably the case of other guys.
	So that the reason why I was successful, it's not because I think I was more gifted or, you know, I work harder.
	It's just because I was ready to do that sacrifice, you know?
	What do you think kind of made you in that space to take that sacrifice?
	Because I guess it's like.
	Yeah, I mean, it's well, giving up is easy.
	Yeah.
	I think saying something is better, saying something's too hard.
	It's kind of easy.
	You know, I think unless you're different, I think some people look at that as a challenge and some people look at it as just a reality.
	Yeah, I think if you want to be the best at something, I'm not talking being good.
	I'm talking about you want to be the best at something.
	And in every field, I think you need to be a little bit obsessed.
	I was never diagnosed.
	I never saw a psychologist for it, but I think I'm obsessive compulsive.
	Like, what kind of things did you see like you would do?
	Well, one thing I would do that is completely crazy.
	It's very stupid, but I used to do like when I walk on the sidewalk.
	For example, I remember in New York going to train, I walk on the sidewalk and there is a line on the sidewalk and I notice that I step over one line with my right foot, but I have to step over with the left to make an equal number.
	And sometimes these things are so stupid, but they drive you nuts.
	When I drill techniques in jiu-jitsu, I have to do this or wrestling or any combat sport.
	I have to do the same amount on each side.
	Even though in a fight, I will most likely do one side, my best side, but I have to do the other side.
	And I think these things, as crazy as it sounds, are probably some of the things that made me perform well, you know?
	Right, because you need things to be even.
	You need things to be calculated maybe.
	Or even the fact that you're even calculating things is kind of, it sounds crazy.
	It sounds obsessive, but it also is kind of magnificent in a way, because to be great at something, you're going to have to be someone who's calculating things, even when you're not, even in your subconscious.
	Also, I think it's good for an athlete for performance, but you need to learn how to let go.
	You need to learn to punch, punch in and punch out.
	And sometimes it's hard.
	I see in the news, sometimes some fighters, they can't do it.
	You know, they go crazy.
	They keep going.
	Yeah.
	Like Tony Ferguson, he keeps going.
	Do you think it's a tough space that he's in?
	Because it's weird.
	People love watching him fight, right?
	And it feels like he loves giving himself to the people.
	He like, it almost like he shows up just because he knows we're going to love him so much.
	Yeah, but you start to think that it's painful for him.
	I mean, he's had a tough run recently.
	Yeah, I love to see him fight.
	It's just unfortunate because the Tony Ferguson that you see nowadays, it's not the Tony Ferguson that he was when he was in his prime.
	And it depends what he's trying to accomplish.
	I prioritize my health first, and that's my priority.
	But some guys, they have a kick of it.
	They don't care.
	They prioritize having, I don't know, some of them, they love to fight.
	For them, it's an adrenaline.
	They love it.
	I never liked it.
	I mean, I did it because I wanted to have the freedom, you know, the life that I have.
	So I used that to propel myself where I wanted to be in life.
	But some guys, they just love to fight.
	And it's funny because when I was young, I was looking around and I never felt I was at the right place.
	I remember I seek the help of sports psychologists and a lot of them, they told me, you know, like they were trying to brainwash me.
	They were like, oh, George, stop saying you're afraid.
	You're not afraid.
	You're excited.
	I'm like, bro, I'm excited if I, I don't know, if I say a beautiful woman or, you know, like, like, or if, you know what I mean?
	I'm not, I'm not excited to go fight in a cage.
	You know what I mean?
	So I'm afraid.
	Then I realized that you should not be afraid.
	I should not be afraid to admit that I'm afraid.
	You know, there's no courage without fear.
	And when I made peace with it, I knew it was a normal thing and I learned how to control it.
	But that's why there's some guys I think they fake it so hard and they don't make peace with it.
	And when the light is on and it's time to perform, they crumble.
	You see that very often in combat sport.
	Guys that are very good in the gym, but then when it's time to go, they don't perform as well.
	You're like, what's going on?
	That's why, because they don't know how to deal with, they don't know how to domesticate their fear.
	They don't know how to, they don't know how to manage their fear.
	They don't know how to manage it.
	They don't know how to control their stress.
	I remember, I think it's Kasomoto, the Mike Tyson coach, he says, fear is like fire.
	It can help you cook your food, but it can also burn you if you don't know how to control it.
	And one of my psychologists used to, the sports psychologists used to say to me, he's like, you have butterflies.
	You have to make them fly in formation.
	That's one thing he used to tell me all the time.
	I'm like, that was a good analogy.
	That's crazy.
	And I'm sure for you, it's the same thing.
	I mean, when you do a show, I mean, I don't know.
	Are you afraid to mess up and be humiliated?
	Did it ever happen to you that you screwed up?
	You're like, shit, this thing doesn't work the way I want.
	I mean, I'm sure it happened.
	Like it happened to me.
	I get hit or, you know what I mean?
	I lose a fight.
	Yeah, it wasn't my plan and my strategy.
	Yeah, I didn't.
	I ran out of bullets.
	I ran out of like moves.
	I tried some jokes.
	It didn't work.
	Oh, the beginning, you almost go out there because you just want, I think you know it's going to fucking hurt, you know?
	And you just want to, I think a lot of comics kind of hate themselves a little bit, to be honest.
	And so they go out there because they know the feeling that the embarrassment, the pain, the embarrassment and pain they're going to feel, finally, it'll match how they feel on the inside.
	So there's a little weirdness in that that like some things are going to feel a little even in a way.
	And also a lot of comedians hate themselves so much that the people could never hate them as much as they fucking hate themselves.
	Or they've talked so badly about themselves, like in their own head, you know?
	You mean you need to be willing to make fun of yourself if you want to do that.
	Yeah, I think that helps because then certainly at that point, it's like you're using all the tools.
	You already.
	You make fun of others, but you make fun of, you need to be ready to make fun of yourself as well, right?
	Yeah, yeah.
	And in your head, like, I think a lot of comedians are like, you know, they have a lot of fear.
	They have a lot of inferiority.
	And so when they're growing up, they probably talk badly to themselves in their head.
	And so then when they're able to joke about themselves, it's almost a way of releasing some of that.
	It's like they're making fun of themselves, but it's in a way that is making, bringing joy to people.
	So it almost kind of like alleviates some of that, if that makes any sense.
	Over the year, that feeling of...
	It goes away for you, yeah?
	Yeah, that was my gut.
	Really?
	Yeah, it got worse because every fight is bigger than that.
	So the fight itself.
	So the training and all of that.
	Now training makes me nervous.
	No, I'm nervous before training because when you train for a fight, you want to perform.
	When you're in between fight, offseason, now you want to have fun.
	That's when training is fun.
	But when you're training for a fight, it's about performance.
	It's not that fun.
	It's not fun.
	Winning is fun, but you know, like, like one of the fights.
	The fight day would be tough.
	I'm sorry?
	The fight day would be the toughest?
	It's terrible.
	Well, to give you an example, fight day, it's every fight day is the worst day of my life.
	you wake up after a shitty night of sleep.
	And when you wake up, you're like, because you don't sleep well because you make, If you do this, I'm going to do this.
	And try to cover every possible scenario that can happen.
	And sometimes you close your eyes, you try to be positive, but sometimes you don't see yourself winning.
	Sometimes there's certain imagery that pops up in your head that you see yourself losing.
	But I develop a trick.
	I'm a firm believer of the power of thinking, you know, of the power of the mind.
	Visualization?
	Yes.
	So when you have a negative imagery that pops up in your head, it's a sign of intelligence.
	You know, it's normal.
	It will happen.
	Because you're smart.
	You can foresee certain bad outcomes.
	So you need to be prepared.
	So it forces you to, you don't want to finish your visualization on a negative note because it will leave a scar up here.
	So I always force myself when I see myself getting dropped by a punch, then I don't let go.
	I just force myself.
	Okay, I'm going to scramble back up and get back in control of the fight.
	And then I can go on with my life, do whatever I need to do.
	So I think if you only finish on the negative, it could leave a scar.
	That's one of the things that over the year I tried to do and it helped me a lot.
	It's powerful.
	It reminds me of the fight, the first Sarah fight, I think.
	And I know you didn't get the outcome that you wanted, but you stayed alive.
	I mean, you know, that was a...
	It was like, geez, I felt like we were getting hit at home.
	I remember.
	And Matsaro really surprised me because going into that fight, it was my first title defense.
	Matzaro was known for his grappling prowess.
	You know, he was one of the most decorated Jiu-Jitsu athlete at the time.
	And I was more worried about his ground game than his stand-up.
	But he worked a lot on his stand-up game and he caught me with a punch that I never saw coming on behind the hair.
	And when he caught me, I remember I got emotional because I wanted to give it back to him right away.
	You know, like this was not supposed to happen.
	The odds were favoring me, like something like 10 to 1 or something crazy.
	So I wanted to give it back to him right away.
	And like an idiot, I fall into a slugfest.
	And when you're stunned, you're not accurate because you're dizzy.
	He was accurate and he hits very hard.
	So I got like a, I don't, I can't remember how many punches I got hit.
	He was still alive, though.
	Oh, I, I, but you know what I did?
	So because I didn't know where I was, I was so dizzy, I tapped out and I got a lot of critics because, oh, he's a quitter.
	He tapped out on strike and everything.
	And it affected me at the time because I was like, man, you know, like, maybe I'm not as good as I think.
	And a lot of people were like, oh, he's maybe not as good as people think.
	And I needed to build myself mentally from that.
	And it was very, very hard because I lost the confidence.
	And confidence for a fire is the most important thing because you can have all the skills in the world.
	But if you don't have the confidence, if I can make an analogy, it's like someone who has a lot of money in his bank account, but no way of accessing it.
	So I needed to build myself back up.
	And it was a tough time.
	I remember.
	It's funny you see it that way because I saw it as wow.
	I cannot believe how I think for me, it goes back to what you were saying that like to envisual, like if you visualize yourself getting hit to then finish on a visualization of yourself, you know, returning back to form and like still being in the bout.
	Cause that's what it seemed like to me.
	I mean, I know we got the victory on that one, but I tapped out on strike and I'm not ashamed to say it.
	A lot of guys that will say, because there's this thing in our sport that, oh, I tapped out on strike, you quit.
	But man, it's a sport.
	We're not in a war.
	And I rather save myself for another day.
	All right.
	Well, you always seem like that guy.
	You always seem like this.
	You're always a perfect strategist.
	I'm never going to give up until it's finished, but that fight was finished.
	I was gone.
	It was a matter of time that I was probably going to fall unconscious.
	So I decided to tap and to save some of my brain cells and come back another day.
	And you did.
	And yeah.
	And I think there's no shame about it.
	When that happened at the time, I was ashamed a little bit.
	And I didn't want to talk about it.
	But, you know, I'm glad I did it.
	I'm glad I did it.
	Well, I think it's easier probably to look back in the past and see the long, you know, to see the whole, like all the work, you know?
	Yeah.
	To see it as a whole, as like a whole piece there.
	Yeah, what was kind of one of the toughest times you felt like in your career?
	Was that probably it, you think?
	Because you had just gotten the title.
	It's your first title defense.
	That was bad mentally.
	The first loss before that, I lost to Matt Hughes.
	It was more of a learning experience.
	This was different because it really brought my confidence down.
	And I remember at the time, I had a sports psychologist.
	He's awesome.
	I shout out to Brian Kane.
	Brian or Ryan?
	Brian Kane.
	He was amazing.
	And he's deceased?
	No, no, no, no, no, no.
	He's still around.
	He works with pro athlete.
	And he says to me, because after that fight, immediately, the only thing I was thinking about is to get back out there and get my revenge, you know, because I was not proud of my performance.
	I was like, man, I'm better than this.
	I'm better than this guy.
	I want to go back out there and show the world.
	And, you know, my ego wanted to show the world that I'm better than this.
	But the fight that I had was not against Sarah.
	I needed to build, like to have a few more wins before to return for a title shot.
	So I was not focusing on the right thing.
	I was focusing on Matt Sarah instead of focusing on my next opponent.
	And that could have been very bad.
	So what my sport psychologist did to me, he said, said, George, you're carrying a lot of brick.
	And I didn't know what it means at the time.
	So he made me carry a brick.
	And he made me write the name of Sarah with clay on it.
	And he made me carry that brick in my training bag.
	And every day I was going to train with that freaking brick.
	And then Tri-Star, you had to go up the stairs.
	And it's not a pleasant walk to go to the gym.
	It's kind of a training of itself.
	And at one point, like after a week, I call him like, hey, can I get rid of that brick?
	He's like, nope, you keep it.
	You keep it.
	I'm like, man, this guy is completely insane.
	You know, like, he was, you know, I thought that he was crazy.
	He probably need a psychologist himself.
	So I kept carrying, carrying the brick, carrying.
	And right the week before my, my fight with, with, I think it was Josh Koschek, that I was trying to get back to a title shot.
	I was like, man, I can't deal with this shit anymore.
	Can I throw that brick out?
	He's like, okay, I'm coming.
	Wait.
	So I went to where the Selaran River is.
	I threw it.
	I grabbed it and I threw it in the water.
	And I know it sounds cuckoo to say, but it was something physical that I did that had a profound change on my mental.
	It kind of freed me from that needs to prove to the world that I want to beat him again, you know?
	So I was able to focus on the immediate task ahead.
	Right.
	Yeah, because sometimes that desire, I just, it's a blind desire almost like I need to prove, and it's not, it's powerful, but it's not effective because it's not calculated.
	Yeah.
	You know, and it can be even more dangerous sometimes than anything.
	Yeah.
	So, so, so I was not, I was going in a dangerous path because I was not focusing on the, on the, on the most important thing.
	That was my, the, the, the fight.
	Like I was focusing on the other fight after, but yeah, I was about to, to, to screw it up bad.
	I know whenever you retired, Hendrix, what was your, oh no, your last fight was Bisping.
	Bisping was my last fight.
	Hendrix is after I took a, I took a break after Hendrix, yeah.
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	Yeah, whenever you took a break after Hendrik, you talked about like you were going through a tough time or something.
	What was that about?
	Was it stuff you couldn't talk about before?
	Yeah, I had a lot of issue.
	I had a lot of family issue and problem.
	And the thing is, I was a very active fighter.
	When you say active, what do you mean?
	Fighting often?
	Yeah, fighting often.
	And also, you have to consider that you do a lot of promotion tours and stuff.
	It takes a lot out of you.
	And also the stress on always, you always have someone that is threatening you.
	Because when you're the contender, you don't have as much stress because you have one target.
	You want to be champion.
	You want to go there.
	That's the benchmark, you know?
	That's the best, isn't it?
	Yes.
	It's hard to become champion, but it's even harder to stay champion.
	There's not a lot of guys that stay champion for a long time.
	It's very hard.
	Because when you're champion, you're the target.
	When you're the contender, you have one guy is targeting.
	Nobody really targets you, but if you get to the title shot, you have only one guy that targets you.
	When you're the champion, everyone targets you.
	So you're the target.
	And you don't have much time to prepare for your opponent.
	And your opponent has been looking at you for years because he's climbing the rank and he's studying you.
	He's trying to find a chic in your armor.
	And every time they interview any of those guys, they all call your name because you're the guy.
	Of course.
	So that's why it is much different.
	It's much more difficult to stay champion than becoming champion.
	And when you're a champion, it's hard because your life changed.
	You have more responsibility and more, there's a lot of more requests and stuff.
	And that's what happened to me at the time.
	I was doing it for so long and I had so much pressure for so long.
	And I remember at that time, I was shy to talk about it because I was like, if I talk about it before the fight and I was fighting against, they used to have big problem with performance enhancing drug in mixed martial art.
	It was a big, big problem.
	Oh, they got big problems with those at a damn 7-Eleven, dude.
	People are shooting up everywhere now.
	I never wanted to accuse one individual, but I wanted to change the system.
	And the UF said that time didn't really add my back.
	They didn't really help me on that.
	And I was fighting against that behind closed door.
	You were saying some of these guys could be using, we have to test strong.
	Oh, 100%.
	That's why I did the test when I fought Hendrix.
	When I fought also BJPN, we did the test because I wanted to implement this.
	It's crazy because you play basketball, you play soccer, play football, but you don't play fighting.
	You can lose your brain cells out there.
	It's different.
	And it makes some people like, yeah, but it doesn't make that small bullshit.
	It makes such a huge difference.
	It's a tons of difference, man.
	I've trained with guys that are openly, like they're saying to me, like when they are on cycle, it's not even the same person.
	No.
	Yeah, guys, it changes you, not only stamina, strength, recovery, but also your brain, your reaction time.
	You're more creative.
	There is things that you would do when you're on it that you would not maybe do when you're not.
	So, oh, you'll start fucking the air when you're on test 700 or whatever, dude.
	I saw a guy one time just, he just, he had so, you know, he just, he turned into an animal.
	Yeah, 100%.
	100%.
	So, so in fighting.
	So that's a risk then because you're at the top.
	Obviously, everybody's focused on you.
	And if you don't know if some of the, if you're staying clean and you don't know if some of the, some of the testing is up to your, what you believe is a fair code.
	Yeah.
	And fuck, that would be really scary.
	Well, the, the martial art, I think one of the things in martial art is the respect and being just, being fair.
	And I mean, these are the traditional value of martial art.
	And I always try to carry that with me.
	And I felt like I was in some way, you know, not betrayed, but I felt a little bit let go.
	And I was just fed up.
	I was just, I just needed to take a time off.
	You know, I was, that's why I left for more than four years, you know, and I'm glad I did it because maybe I should have done it.
	Maybe a fight one fight before.
	You can burn out, man.
	Yeah.
	It's so much.
	People don't, I don't think, realize that.
	I can't even imagine the responsibilities.
	And then, yeah, especially while the sport is still building so much at that time.
	Like that was a huge building period for UFC.
	And so like to have so just to have like interview requests.
	I want you to be here and you want to do all the things you can do, you know, because you feel like you're physically capable.
	But yeah, part of you starts to get burned down.
	It's like a, I don't know, it's almost like when you light a candle and there's nothing left in it.
	Yeah.
	That's how I feel sometimes.
	I remember you just finish a fight and immediately after there's another guy calling calling you out.
	And I'm sort of a obsessive, compulsive guy.
	So as soon as another guy calling me out, I'm starting to make scenario in my mind.
	I'm like, okay, I'm like, it drives you nuts.
	It drives you.
	And when you're the contender, you're on your way up.
	You don't have that problem.
	Yeah.
	You know, yeah, of course, when maybe you get to the top five, you know, but before that, nobody noticed you.
	Nobody care about you.
	You care about them, but they don't care about you.
	It's so funny.
	So when you're on top, now you're the target.
	Everybody talks shit about you.
	They disrespect you.
	And if you want it or not, it touches you.
	Yeah.
	You know, because you say, oh, you don't bother watching this thing, but you know, it touches you.
	And you see, sometimes things get bad.
	You see that people, they insult each other.
	And people always ask me sometimes, oh, do you think they went too far?
	I mean, this is the fight game, man.
	You can die out there.
	Or you can have certain damage that will make you die in the near future.
	Oh, yeah.
	So they're sharing or whatever.
	The art of war, man, they're going to try everything to try to make you lose your mind.
	And we saw many, many fights that guys lose their mind.
	And that's one of the reasons why, like, everybody knows Conor McGregor.
	Yeah.
	His first title fight against Jose Aldo.
	He knocked him out in like something like seven seconds.
	He pissed off Jose Aldo so much.
	Jose Aldo lost his mind.
	He went out of his game plan and tried to rush to him to give it to him.
	Conor McGregor is an incredible counter-puncher.
	He just slipped.
	Boom.
	That was it.
	That was a, I mean, it was very smart from his part to he taunt Jose Aldo.
	It was, it was emotional.
	It was, I believe it was prepared.
	I believe he put Jose Aldo exactly where you want him to be.
	He set it up by all the interview, all the things he said, all the thing he done.
	Right.
	He started the fight months before in a way.
	Yeah.
	So when you're in that fight game, another thing that people don't talk about, you'd never want to show your private life.
	Right.
	Because people will use that against you.
	Talk about people.
	Me, I can put a shield.
	If you can insult me, you can say whatever you want.
	I'm very good at putting a shield and it's not going to bother me.
	But you talk about someone I love, someone I care about, now it's going to get me, you know?
	So, and we saw that another time with Connor and Khabib Normagamenov, the famous fight after that.
	That was crazy.
	Yes.
	So that's the reason why it went crazy after because they crossed the line.
	But it's the fight game.
	That's a fight game.
	I don't think it's right, but a lot of guys will do that to make you the real.
	Do you respect guys just as much that do that?
	I mean, it's just, it's another facet to war in a way, right?
	It's the art of war, man.
	It's combat sport, man.
	It's kill or be killed, man.
	They're going to do it.
	Do you think it's evolved more since like in the past 15 years?
	Have you noticed it evolved more over time?
	Like that it's more of a strategy now?
	Or do you think more people see it coming now?
	Like, what do you think the evolution of that's been of trash talking?
	It's a good question.
	I think what changes is the fact that now we have social media and we're in touch with the world.
	I can be at home in Montreal and insulting you when you're in Tennessee in two seconds and you will notice it in real time.
	Boom.
	Before that, that was not really the case.
	We didn't have that power, you know?
	Now you can say something, the whole world sees it.
	And oh, did you heard what he said?
	So that's, I think, what makes the difference.
	It's different now.
	Yes.
	Do you feel like the testing has gotten better over time in the sport?
	Well, now I think it got a little bit worse because one company quit, right?
	One company got laid off.
	USADA.
	Right.
	And I interrupted you.
	I interrupted you.
	Sorry, George.
	No, no, no, no.
	Please, it's true.
	What happened is they didn't have any testing first.
	Then they hire, I think, USADA.
	So it got much better.
	But they test beef and stuff, don't they?
	Is it the same group?
	USADA, I don't think it's my guy.
	Well, if the same person testing my pork chops is testing Mike Perry, then I think we got to fucking figure something out.
	I mean, I think both of them are clean, but I'm just saying.
	But you saw what I, when, when USADA just arrived on the scene, a lot of the champion have failed, you know, and they made a, they lost a lot of money.
	But I give them props because they took the lead.
	They had to do it.
	They had to clear up.
	And I'm happy they did.
	And that's one of the reasons I came back and I fought Bispain because if they would not have made drug tests, I would never have come back.
	Wow.
	I was like, no way.
	I don't like that.
	But now I think.
	Because it just wasn't fair.
	It just wasn't.
	It's not fair.
	It was insane.
	It was like sanctioned.
	I'm never going to say, hey, this guy, this guy, but when you're in the industry, you know who's who, you know who do what.
	It's a small world.
	We all know.
	Oh, it's like when you're in ninth grade and some kid shows up like that with pimples everywhere.
	You know what's going on.
	You know what Ricky's been doing.
	You know what I'm saying?
	You just know.
	But sometimes it's not even...
	There is stuff that people talks, you know who's who.
	And I mean, it was just at the time it wasn't signed.
	And I'm glad that UFC did this.
	I didn't want to bring UFC down.
	That was not my intent when I did this.
	I wanted to elevate the sport.
	And I'm glad they did it.
	I think it elevate the sport.
	And now, yeah, they're not with USADA anymore, but I think they hire another organization to do the tests.
	But I do believe that if you want to avoid corruption, it needs to be a separated entity that do the tests than the organization itself.
	And is that what they have now?
	Right now?
	I am not sure.
	But if the organization has power in order, like in the testing, it's corrupted.
	It cannot be corrupted.
	It needs to be a different entity where the organization does not have any power.
	Right.
	Right.
	Because they just be able to control and say, hey, let's make this okay and this is.
	Of course, imagine you have a big fight coming up and the two guys that line the cars, like one of them tests positive.
	He just screwed up the card, you know, and they lose a lot of money.
	So they have an interest in this.
	Yeah, this says Drug Free Sport International will be in charge of the collection process under the new program that begins in January when UFC's deal with USADA ends.
	This was last year.
	Former FBI Special Agent George Pierrot, best known for interrogating former Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein, will be in charge of the new program.
	That's interesting.
	You identify people and entities in the space that can make something that is already working well and you make them better.
	UFC Vice President Jeff Nowitzki said.
	You learn that USADA is not the only player in the space and that a combination of other entities and individuals can actually make your program stronger and better.
	And that's exactly what's happening right now with our program.
	It's unfortunate.
	I believe they want clean guys fighting in there, no doubt.
	I believe they want money.
	I think that's what they believe.
	I think that their number one interest is the money, which is normal.
	They run a business.
	Their business.
	And after, yeah, the security of the factor.
	But it's not to bash them.
	And I think it's every company want to make money.
	That's the goal.
	That's the number one priority.
	And after, if we can make it fair and clean, okay, but money, I think, is always the number one.
	I think.
	And I think that's business.
	And you know what?
	Business.
	And business, sometimes business inherently has some evil edges to it.
	Or not evil, but it's like business gets kind of dirty sometimes.
	I'm not saying this, but I remember like I went and saw Poirier's last fight and I remember waiting outside.
	The people came and took him in there to test him.
	Are those tests, are they able to keep those tests like legitimate?
	Are they like- this time to this time, at this place.
	Oh, next week I'm in Florida.
	But let's say you really want to cheat, for example.
	You just tell them you're going to, I don't know, freaking Antarctica or somewhere where they're not going to spend money to send an investigator to test you.
	Oh, yeah.
	But you go there, you get your stuff, and then you know how long it stays in your system.
	And then after you got the, you serve on the on it for weeks, you know what I mean?
	So, so.
	Oh, I see.
	So you could use it to enhance you and then be clean when it's time for show.
	For another thing that guys do, they have a sponsors.
	Okay.
	So they prepare their excuse.
	So let's say I'm sponsored by a certain food supplement company.
	Okay.
	And I'm taking, for example, a certain substance that is illegal.
	I know that the food supplement, that the protein company that sponsor me is tainted by that certain substance.
	So I'm sponsored by them.
	So when I get cut as, oh, it's not my fault.
	It's the company that sponsors me.
	So that's another way.
	So you prepare your, your, your, your, you know, that, that's, that's one of the way I would think they would do.
	Yeah.
	No, I think that makes sense.
	Did you feel like most of the fights you fought, people, your opponent was clean?
	I don't have the evidence.
	And it's, uh, it's, uh, it's wrong to accuse someone if you don't have the evidence.
	But I know for a fact that there was a lot of guys, a lot, a lot of guys that were using performance enhancing drug.
	And it was, it was a big problem.
	Yeah.
	And the same thing in the Olympic, where you have money, you will always have corruption.
	It's impossible to catch everyone because the technology to cheat will always be one step ahead of the technology to catch the action.
	It's crazy.
	That's like a cat and a mouse.
	Yeah.
	Well, you were fortunate, man.
	You got in and you kind of got out at the time where you wanted.
	I mean, you'd achieved everything you wanted.
	I mean, you're one of the rare people that it's like, it's almost like if you look at your career and stuff, you're like, dang, man, he made all the right moves.
	You know?
	You were strategic about it.
	I was strategic, but I have the chance to have real friends.
	A lot of the people I hang out with, that I'm friend with, they were friend with me in the beginning.
	And for me, it's very important because they don't tell me what I want to hear.
	They tell me the truth.
	What you need.
	And even when I wanted to come back and fight Michael Bisping, a lot of my good friends, they were like, George, you're 36 years old, man.
	Your best years are maybe behind you.
	What are you trying to prove?
	And my argument was like, man, I don't want to live with regret.
	I just want to do one more or, you know, depend how it's going to go, you know, and if I fail, I fail and I leave.
	And if I keep going, I keep going.
	But at least give me one shot.
	And if I succeed, we'll see after, you know what I mean?
	And I didn't want to leave with regret, you know, because let's say I would not have done it.
	I will have grown up.
	Now I'm 43. It's too late.
	I passed my prime.
	I would live with regrets.
	Say, oh, I should have done it.
	And now I would regret it.
	So I always believe that you never want to live with regrets.
	That's the worst thing.
	Has there been moments since then where you're just on the couch or something?
	You've had a couple of beers and you're like, I'm fucking getting back in there tomorrow.
	And it's just like, you're just kind of fired up.
	After when I retired, I retired because I had when I won the title, but people don't know this, but I was very ill.
	Like I had ulcer colitis because I was trying to gain weight.
	Colitis.
	I was trying to gain weight because I was fighting in an avion.
	Yes.
	Okay.
	I was trying to put on weight.
	It's not Crohn's disease.
	You have Crohn's disease?
	No, no, it's ulcer colitis.
	It's not Crohn.
	Crohn's different.
	But very often, ulcer colitis transform into Crohn and Crohn transform into cancer.
	A lot of time, you know, you see that progression.
	So when that, like when I, when I had those crazy cramp, it was during my training camp with bisping and I didn't know what it was because it was blood when I was going to bathroom.
	And I told myself, I said, whatever it is, I'm going to do the fight and I'm going to have, because no, no, but to know what it is, you need to do what they call a colonoscopy.
	So they go with a camera.
	You need to go in there.
	Yeah, you need to take Laxatsive and all that.
	Like it MTU.
	And I was trying to put on weight.
	So you know what I mean?
	I couldn't do it.
	It was a few weeks before.
	And I said, you know what, whatever it is, I'll do the fight and I'll deal with it after.
	And after the fight, I went to do the test and I got diagnosed with ulcer colitis and I was on heavy medication like for anti-inflammatory.
	And I relinquished the title i could have kept the title for one year and like parade with the sponsorship and but i didn't want to do that because of the for the respect you know so i i relinquished it because i didn't know what was going to happen i i as a man i i don't know what's gonna happen you know so i tried to get better and after a few few weeks it it didn't really work and i discovered fasting and what happened is pretty incredible i i met a doctor dr jason feng in
	in uh toronto jason feng f-u-n-g yes he's uh japanese huh yeah nephro nephrologist he's uh i think it's chinese or the canadian chinese yeah okay that's him exactly he gave me a fasting program he treat a patient that has certain type of diabetes and he gave me certain program of fasting and what happened after the next few weeks i all my symptoms disappeared wow and i i diminished the dose of my medication
	until i no longer need it and what type of fasting what exactly were you doing i did two types i did uh what we call a time restricted eating where you eat in a certain you eat all your calorie in a certain window okay like an intermittent fasting yeah like you eat your calorie in in eight hour and you you fast on like you only drink water in the 16 hour and i do also prolonged fasting so what i do when i do prolonged fasting i do four days only water and when i train i take salt in my in my hand
	i put a little bit and and i lick and pervert okay or pervert but but you take salt because you don't want to deplete your mineral when you and this over time because ulcer colitis you're supposed to be stuck with that for life wow it's a condition you have for life when you got it you finish you know you got it and all my symptoms are gone now i can drink i can eat whatever i want and i'm i mean i i realize that you know we talk about conspiracy and stuff the reason why you don't hear about
	fasting is because nobody makes money with it it's not no pills yeah but it's really worth investigating of course ask your doctor but man it changes my life and i just wish i would have known this before really it really did so you used it in other facets too that you know when you need it it works for everything like sometimes you have an injury like say tendonitis and tendonitis often it's related to inflammation you know all inflammation disease when you fast it take away the inflammation and and
	and if all the stuff that i that i had regarding inflammation like a toe one of my toes i had a problem with one of my toes it was hurting me for years when i started doing my fasting it kind of disappeared yeah yeah we don't think about that we always think more more more like a more medicine more anything more more of this diet i thought the same thing before i was like oh protein shake this because i was trying to gain weight when i fought bisping and and i realized man i was doing the everything wrong and and we always think about the punch in we don't think about
	the punch out like you were saying we don't think about the inverse of it it's insane and and i remember i i had a chance to go to uh kenya uh tanzania at masai maru i met a tribe of uh of uh hunter-getterer oh yeah those brothers can jump huh yeah but but these guys man sometimes they they spend three four days without eating and it's normal they're used to it and if you see their old people compared to
	our old people they're much more health healthier they look much more much better and the reason why people people will tell me now oh yeah but they have a shorter life expect expectancy than us yes it's because of the a lot of the child uh die before the age of adulthood so the numbers die when they're young yeah child child child uh how do you say in english the starvation or neglect no no no no they get they got like disease or the hospital is too far away you have to you have to drive like five hour you know that right there if once
	they pass a certain point if you look at their their old people and our old people they're they much they look much better oh our old people look like a lot of them to be honest but a lot of them you know i've had a couple of grandparents and they were mid i thought but uh but what makes us live that long it's not because of our healthy lifestyles because of our technology for most of us right that's true that's what's saving us most of the time it's not us doing anything yeah when i was a kid for example i had like uh uh it's
	called in french convulsion fébrille it's a when you're a baby you're you have a rise of temperature so what your body does it shut shut itself down and it go into a coma like this and that happened to me when i was young my mom told me if i would not have technology i was brought back brought to the hospital and they put me on an artificial coma and everything on plugs and and if i would not have have that technology i would have not been here with you today so i'm i'm i'm alive today because of our technology but
	how you treat the life you have is up to you as well if you don't have technology maybe 50 of us would be there dude i'd be out probably a lot of my family would be gone um oh yeah like infant mortality rates that's your infant monter because they have a hunter-gatherer tribe in in in uh in africa they have a much higher infant mortality rate than than us yeah that's what lowered their their life expectancy you know um when you look at some of the fights did you watch the bilal fight the other night do you watch the fights
	i did yeah man you think it was fair to make them fight at that hour in the morning over there or is that just fighting well yeah it's fair it's it's it's it's fair or unfair for both of them equally if it's equal it's equal you know like like i don't care you know if you have to make them cross the desert before or swim uh or doing a trial if they both do it they have to do it it's fair uh it's not the best condition in terms of performance but if both guys do it it's a fair it was 6 a.m there when they when they started that main
	event but man i was i was surprised he he he performed very well i'm friend with uh leon edwards and oh he's so he's a such a nice guy i when i went to england uh a few like a like a year and a half ago i remember i went i went out with him and uh you signed both we had a great time he's such an he's such a nice guy i i really like him he's he's he's great at it but he's got a great great personality too and man i'm sure he's gonna come back and
	it'd be interesting to see i think it's it really sets up for a nice surprise.
	Like, you didn't, I don't think a lot of people expected it.
	What were the odds on it, Nick?
	Leon was minus 300.
	Yeah, so I think a lot of people didn't expect it.
	So I think it adds just, yeah, it adds to the sport, you know, it makes it exciting.
	I was very surprised by Bilal, like his transition, the way, because he doesn't fight like that all the time.
	Sometimes he just is mostly a striker or, you know what I mean?
	For that great mix.
	Man, he was on point.
	Like for that fight, he was like really on point.
	It was like, wow.
	It was, yeah, I thought it was super impressive.
	It was really cool to watch.
	It made me just kind of realize even, yeah, I didn't expect that much diversity from him.
	Is this what he said?
	Bilal wants to be greater than GSP for his legacy?
	He definitely can.
	If he, you know, if you keep working hard.
	And, you know, all records are made to be broken.
	Do you look back at the times when you like the era, or it's not really an era?
	I mean, it wasn't that long ago, but when you look at the time when you were fighting, right?
	Would you rather be fighting in this era?
	Do you love the era you were fighting in?
	Do you ever think about it in spaces like that?
	I think I was extremely lucky to fight in my era.
	It could have been better.
	If I would have fought today, I would have made maybe more money because of the social media and all that.
	But it could have been way worse.
	If I look at like in the time of Hoyes Gracie, Dan Severn, Mark Coleman, Don Frye, these guys were the real guys.
	They were fighting two, three times a night.
	No rules, no weight class.
	Man, that was insane.
	Ken Shamrock.
	For me, I respect these guys a lot because they paved the way for all of us.
	And they didn't make money, man.
	It's sad.
	They didn't make money, man.
	They were tough as hell.
	Is there a like a union or something that pays for stuff for the pioneers of it?
	No, there's not.
	Wow.
	I think it's a question of time.
	I mean, yeah, because when you say that, a question of time.
	Some guys, they try to do it.
	It got close, but then they're always fighting for power.
	They want to be in control.
	Certain group want to be in control and others wants to take more power.
	I mean, we all want the same thing.
	We all want the same thing, you know, at the end of the day.
	And I think it's like every sport in hockey, baseball, it's a matter of time.
	Things were the same.
	If you look at other sports, they were the same.
	Guys were underpaid.
	Their condition were not good.
	They didn't have any assurance, nothing like that.
	And, you know, over time, it got better.
	I think it's only a matter of time.
	The only difference is in mixed martial art, UFC has the monopoly.
	It's a monopoly.
	Right, there's one show, really.
	Well, they have PB.
	Well, yeah, but it's the most PFL.
	Yeah, PFL is there.
	It's growing.
	Which is very good.
	PFL is good because it's a competition to UFC, but UFC is the most prestigious organization.
	And PFL start to gain a lot of momentum, which is good for fighters because it gives them the ability to negotiate.
	But when you have only one organization that has all the monopole, all the control, it's hard for fighters, you know?
	Understood.
	Is pornography causing a problem in your life?
	That's a good question.
	It's a real question.
	It has in mind.
	It has at certain periods in my life, watching porno and everything and watching porno was making me, it was ruining my life.
	It was ruining my life, man.
	Made me feel just so much shame.
	That's what it did.
	Well, watching pornography has become commonplace today.
	And oftentimes men will use porno to numb the pain of loneliness, boredom, anxiety, and depression.
	That's why I want to introduce you to my friend, Stephen Walt.
	Steve is the founder of Valor Recovery.
	He is a dear friend of mine.
	He is a dear friend of mine.
	And Valor Recovery is a program to help men overcome porn abuse and sexual compulsivity.
	That's right.
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	There is zero commitment if you reach out to them.
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	To learn more about Valor Recovery, please visit them at valorrecoverycoaching.com or email them at admin at valorrecoverycoaching.com.
	The links will be on the YouTube.
	And again, there's no commitment when you reach out to them.
	But I promise you, only something positive will come from you reaching out and figuring out what type of help, if any, could benefit you.
	Thank you.
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	Was there ever another fight?
	That's so great that you and Bisping got to fight.
	That must have been Bisping's a fun dude, huh?
	Yeah, he's crazy.
	He's crazy, dude.
	He's such a good villain.
	He is.
	Because he knows what he's doing.
	It's like he's really kind of, he seems to be a guy that's enjoyed it along the way.
	Yeah, he's got a mouth that can decimate all his opponents.
	Yeah, that's a lot of fun.
	I was like, man, I'm not going to get into a trash dog battle with this guy.
	He's an Englishman.
	We speak English perfectly.
	I'm like, my English suck.
	I'm like, what am I going to do with this?
	I'm just also not good at, you know, like insulting.
	But also knowing that that's not your strength, I think was one of your strengths, you know, knowing where to like, I don't know, you always really had kind of a precision, it seemed like, for the choices you made.
	Did you, you looked at it as a business?
	I've heard you talk about it before.
	You know, you looked at it really as a business, especially if it wasn't something that you even enjoyed on the fight nights.
	Were you able to pull any like real joy out of it over time?
	Like, or was it all when you finally got done?
	Was it just like, oh, thank God?
	It was a release when I got done, but I had great moment, a great memory of it.
	Like, it was a lot of fun.
	When you win, when you win a fight, man, you look back at it and you're thinking like, man, everything is worth it.
	You know, it was all worth it.
	But when you lose, man, oh, God, it's, oh, it's a crazy downfall.
	That's what makes it so hard.
	It's the risk.
	Bigger the risk, bigger the reward, right?
	Were you a perfectionist, do you think, then, Kana?
	Yeah, I was crazy.
	I was obsessed.
	Everything I did was always oriented to trying to make me the best fighter.
	Everything.
	Everything I did.
	It was...
	The best fighter or the best person or the best, like...
	Person, I just, you know, like, I was not trying to being a character.
	I was like some guy, they try to be sort of some sort of a character, you know?
	Like some good guy tried to be a bad guy.
	You see that very often.
	Or some, you know, some bad guy sort of tried to be nice in front of the camera.
	But when the camera doesn't roll, they become some douchebag.
	You see that a lot when you meet celebrities.
	But I always try to be true to myself and focus on performance, you know, because at the end of the day, I never had any personal beef with any of my opponent.
	He's not a human being.
	And when I look across the octagon before a fight, I sort of feel like I look to myself in the mirror because that guy maybe did a similar sacrifice that I did.
	So if I disrespect him, it's sort of in the same, in a way, it's like I'm disrespecting myself.
	So for me, it was just, I was just extremely lucky.
	Even the guy was talking a lot of trash and stuff.
	I was lucky to have sort of that moment to shine and, you know, that people were aware and I make money with it.
	And, you know, for me, after when it's finished, it's finished.
	It's not personal.
	And there is none of the guy, the guy that I thought that if they would be in trouble today, I would not hesitate one second to help them.
	Like if they are at my reach, I would not hesitate one second to help any of them.
	And I mean it.
	That's fascinating to look at your opponent and think, what if they made the same sacrifices as I did?
	Then what else can I even do?
	Dude, that's such an intense way to look at the other side of the other person across from you.
	Well, but it's not only like they make the same sacrifice, but maybe they didn't have the same opportunities that opens to them.
	Maybe they were not as lucky as I was.
	I think the stars need to be aligned.
	I think life sometimes opens certain opportunities to you that if you wait too much, the door will close and it's gone forever.
	Yeah, I think it's something that's true.
	I mean, you look at the Diaz brothers.
	I mean, if you look, you know, Nick took a time off of fighting for years.
	Well, they made him quit, though, didn't they?
	Make him.
	Yeah, he got suspended for and he refused to pay the fine and couldn't fight for five years.
	Exactly.
	Yeah, and that's one of the, what a waste.
	He was in his prime.
	I think he could have maybe be champion.
	Like, when I retire, I was telling people, I was like, man, if he doesn't, he should push on the gas right now and go, man.
	That's his time.
	He should do it.
	Was there a time when is there been a fighter or something since then you looking like, man, it would have been fun to fight them?
	Or do you have like moments like that?
	There's a lot of guys that I wish we would have fight, you know, and that would be big fight.
	It would have made a story.
	But, you know, like it takes three entities to make a fight.
	It takes one fighter, the other fighter.
	It takes the promoter as well.
	And very often the promoter didn't reach our demands.
	You know what I mean?
	And everything needs to be aligned for the three entities.
	Yeah, I know people always talk about you and Khabib fighting.
	Did that interest you, Kana?
	So it was the fight that I would have come back for at the time.
	Not now, now time has passed, but after I retire, there was one fight I would have, you know, I would have had to go.
	It would have been Khabib.
	What was the most, what challenge, what excited you about that the most?
	I mean, obviously he was undefeated.
	But he's undefeated.
	He's got a perfect career.
	He's the competitor, the competitor inside of me would have done, would have taken the fight, you know?
	You know, and that's one of the fights I would have done it, you know, like, but, but it needed to be at the right time.
	And when it was time to do it, UFC didn't want to do it.
	Yeah.
	So they wait a few years after when we were both retired and the train was was passed.
	Yeah.
	The moment was gone.
	And when they asked, when Dana called me, I said, I thought it was weird.
	I was like, are you like, is Kabib want to fight?
	Wanna fight?
	He said, because he said no in all interviews.
	I said, no, no, he's down.
	He's down.
	I'm like, okay, let me think about it.
	I'll get back to you.
	And I thought it was weird.
	So I called his manager, Ali Abdelaziz, and Ali said, Hey, man, the timing is not good.
	It's bullshit.
	It's not true.
	And after I, I, I've said, I've told the media what happened.
	And then I went, I don't do three people calls when I and I thought it was hilarious, but because he's right.
	You know, he's not going to call a guy and say, hey, no, the other guy doesn't want to.
	No, that's not business.
	He's exactly.
	He's a promoter.
	He's going to say, hey, this guy said this, this, this about you.
	Do you want to fight him?
	And you want to take, you want to use the emotions to make you tune in.
	It's like playing your mom against your dad.
	It's like, hey, dad, mom said I can do this.
	And then you go to, hey, mom, dad said I can do this.
	Neither one of them said they could, but now you're outside playing.
	Exactly.
	It's all a game.
	It's all a freaking game.
	it's a lot of pressure I think on Dana probably I bet it's a lot of pressure because not only is he the promoter but he's also And he's in a business.
	He's in control of a business.
	It's not up to him.
	If someone sign a contract that sucks, he's not going to say, hey, you're worth more money.
	You should have, you know what I mean?
	Hey, man, he's a businessman.
	He's going to take it and take advantage of you.
	So it's not because what I'm saying is it's not.
	Eden is a good guy.
	I've met him and when you- Met him many times, but I met him while I was competing.
	So when I was competing and Dana called me, I was before I hang up the phone, I was like, shit.
	Take a hit here.
	Try to think of what is the possible thing that he's going to ask me because you need to be quick when he calls you.
	You don't want to say something.
	Or you just, you don't, you don't answer or you, you're like, you're always like, because this is a game.
	It's a chess game, man, not a fight game.
	Everything you say, everything you do is going to have an outcome.
	So you're like, okay, what he's going to say, this is it.
	Then you prepare.
	If you're ready, you take the call.
	If you're not ready, you let, okay, I'm going to prepare myself.
	Let me take a breath.
	Let me call Mike Brown.
	Let me get somebody to massage me during the off-rounds.
	But the thing with Dana is my relation has changed over the years because now it's more friendly.
	He calls me, I'm not even going to hesitate to say, hey, Dana, what's up?
	Like, whatever.
	I'm ready for anything.
	But when I was fighting, it's normal to have that reaction because he's the boss.
	And you know, whatever he's going to ask you, whatever you say, it's going to be the whole world going to know.
	Retract what you said.
	So when he calls you, when I was fighting, I was like, sometimes I saw a certain instance.
	I was like, man, I'm not taking the call right now.
	Or I'm going to call him back, think about what it is.
	A little strategy.
	Yes, yeah, exactly.
	It's almost like when your boss says, what are you up to this weekend, right?
	Now, if your boss, but your boss, they want you to work at 4.30 on Saturday, right?
	And you do not want to.
	But if you tell them that you're, oh, nothing much, then you're halfway to working, right?
	Yeah.
	So, yeah, it's interesting when you're the owner, it's also hard to be, I bet at times it's probably, maybe it's not, I'm not putting words in his mouth or anything, but I bet it's tough for him to also be a person.
	Yeah.
	You know, and maybe it's easier after the fact because running a business is totally different than being a human being sometimes.
	He takes a lot of heat sometime and he does a lot of stuff that he needs to do for the best of the business, best of the UFC interest.
	And it's normal that he's running a business.
	And it's worked out because look at the UFC has created opportunities for so many guys.
	I had a lot of clash with Dana when I was I didn't even know that.
	No, no, we did we did add a lot of clash clashes when I was fighting because I attained a certain level of power that he couldn't control me as much.
	Some of the guys he could say, you do this.
	Oh, yeah, yes, sir.
	Like me, I was like, no, it's not going to work because I was making him a lot of profit, a lot of money.
	So when you, you know, there's a lot of things that they asked me and I said, hell no, I'm not doing because it's not for the best of my interest.
	So when the same thing, when you get negotiated for a fight, my thing was like, if I'm negotiated for a big fight, why am I going to do all the interviews, all the promotion if I don't touch a piece of the pie?
	You know what I mean?
	So give me a piece of the pie.
	So it will encourage me to do more promotion.
	Because if you don't touch any piece of the pie, if you don't have nothing, why am I going to do this?
	I'm just going to waste my time.
	Well, I'm supposed to train and rest.
	I'm going to do interviews.
	And your time has become more valuable because you're the champion.
	Yeah, I think it's interesting when you get to a certain level how the negotiations kind of change.
	It has to wait.
	It's very fascinating.
	You have to be to look at it in that way.
	And were you able to get like pay-per-view points and stuff back then in your fights?
	Yeah, I'm very like.
	Congratulations, man.
	Yeah, thank you.
	But the thing is, there's a lot of guys in the business in this industry that are not well managed.
	They don't ask for what they're worth and they're kind of afraid or, you know, they don't take right decision.
	And it's not Dana's job to say, hey, I think you should ask for a raise.
	It's normal.
	He's not going to do that.
	He's the boss.
	He's on the other side of the...
	This should be your manager's fight.
	You have someone that look for the best of your interests.
	And that's one fight.
	And the other fight isn't the octagon.
	Yeah.
	Well, it's fascinating.
	You know, I think that a lot of that happens with art.
	When art or talent turns into business, there's this other element that comes on, you know?
	And sometimes you have to trust your instincts and sometimes they're right and sometimes they're wrong.
	But that's how you hone your instincts to be sharper too, is by using them, you know?
	And yeah, I bet it's tricky probably for Dana because I bet there's a lot of guys that he super cares about and and but he also has to run a business, you know, so I can't imagine that's got to be, it's got to be tricky, you know?
	And I think also you hear the nicest stuff like you'll hear like all the stuff he does from his employees or places that he tries to help out.
	During COVID, he didn't lay off nobody.
	It's amazing.
	Oh, he's helped.
	I called him the other day asking him for some help with something, you know, I know that.
	So you know he's a great guy.
	I think he's also a great business guy.
	100%.
	He's a great person.
	He's a great guy.
	And fighters, like, I mean, guys that are listening to us now, when they're in the middle of a competition, you know, like when they're competing, they might not have that relationship with Dana because Dana is on the other side.
	So it's always like a fight relationship.
	But once they're going to retire, they're going to see a total different person.
	Same thing with the Fertza brother.
	These guys, they're all great guys, you know, and every time I meet them, it's, hey, what's up?
	Big hug.
	Dana, the Fertza brother, all these guys.
	Yeah, we're well, friend here.
	Everything we did, the clashes that we had, it was because we were fighting for the best of our interests.
	And it's normal.
	It's just business.
	And I think if you want to be successful, especially as an athlete in mixed martial arts, you need to build a team.
	You can't do all that by yourself because you don't have all the credential to do all the jobs.
	You need to have lawyers.
	You need to find a team of people that you can trust and people that have competence.
	Because sometimes people, they hire people who trust, but they turn out to be incompetent.
	It's bad because it's going to make you do like, how do you say like airbike, you know, they're not going to, you're going to be, you're not going to go forward.
	You're going to extra work.
	Yeah.
	And if you have someone who's competent, but someone that you cannot trust, maybe he's going to, he's going to, he's going to screw you down the road.
	It's tough, man.
	Starting to run a bit or work with people, it's hard.
	But then you also like, I mean, one thing is like people criticize Dana and the UFC, but no other promotion has been able to sustain itself and establish itself and make it go that, you know, and flourish.
	So I think it's fascinating.
	And I think it is probably, I think he'll be studied one day in the sense by business people.
	I mean, I can't even imagine because you have so many guys that are really putting their lives on the line.
	And then you have, you know, I just can't imagine it.
	It's got to be a lot, you know.
	What keeps you busy these days?
	Do you still get those dinosaur updates?
	Remember, you were always, yeah, I love paleontology.
	Yeah.
	What is it about it you think that you love?
	I was thinking about this the other day.
	When I was young, I was always fascinated by dinosaurs.
	And actually, when I took my time off after my fight with Johnny Andrix, I spent four years like I was always training, but I spent time, I went on different sites.
	No way.
	Yeah, I'm very lucky because a lot of the, it turns out that a lot of the big paleontologists that I've met, they're a fan of mixed martial arts.
	Really?
	Yeah.
	So I was able to have special access on different probably mostly of John Bones Jones, you would think, you know?
	I'm just guessing.
	No, it was incredible.
	I traveled across the world.
	I went on different sites, but I realized also something.
	As much as I love paleontology, I realized that I would never be able to do this because I thought that if I would not be a fighter, I would have maybe be a paleontologist.
	And no, that's not true.
	I would never be able to be on that big site for hours.
	Meticulous.
	It ain't me.
	No, I can't.
	I love to acquire the knowledge, but I would not have the patience to go out there.
	I saw some incredible sights.
	I went and, man, I went in a place, in an area in Argentina, in Pantagonia.
	It was in the morning.
	The sun rises and I could see, I'm not kidding you, like thousands of dinosaurs eggshelled.
	They were eggshelled of titanosaurus, the long-necked dinosaurs.
	Oh, yeah.
	Man, it was insane.
	And you had to watch to not step on it, like fossilized eggshells.
	Some of them were broken.
	So that means the animal was about to get out.
	It was insane.
	Like, I saw some of the craziest sights.
	And that was a dig that they were doing?
	Yeah, yeah, they were digging.
	They were in scavating, like eggshell.
	I went on a place, and I think it was in Dakota.
	It was with a Professor, I think it was Professor Pearson.
	They don't know what it was, but they found a sort of a graveyard of Triceratops.
	South Dakota?
	I think it was South Dakota or Wyoming.
	Yeah, Triceratops.
	It was from the late Cretaceous, and you could see that some of the leg bone of Triceratops that were sliced because of Tyrannosaurus Rex.
	Yeah.
	So they found Tyrannosaurus Rex teeth there.
	It was just insane.
	So you were a promoter, really.
	When he goes back to the paleontological ages, dude, you were a damn promoter, bro.
	You to put some of those things in the ring, bro.
	I think.
	Man, maybe one day we'll be able to, I think they want to resurrect the mammoth now, I think, to put it back in Siberia.
	Yeah, didn't they say they can recreate a willy mammoth?
	Did I read that somewhere?
	I think they're going to use Asian elephant to just do a wig or whatever.
	Put a mammoth inside and try to recreate it.
	Yeah, put it in Siberia.
	What weight class is that going to be?
	Wow, there's different species of mammoth.
	There's Woolly Mammoth, Colombian mammoth.
	So it depends which species they want to.
	I guess it's a woolly mammoth they want to bring back.
	Let me see.
	A biotech company that hopes to resurrect extinct species said Wednesday that it has reached an important milestone, the creation of a long-sought kind of stem cell for the closest living relative of the woolly mammoth.
	And now the company says scientists have for the first time created induced pluripotent stem cells for the mammoth's closest living relative, Asian elephants.
	Oh, damn.
	It says scientists can now try to use cloning techniques and gene editing to manipulate the cells in hopes of someday creating elephants with key traits of mammoths.
	Wow.
	So kind of like a bit of a remix, kind of, such as their heavy coats and their layers of fat that enable them to survive in cold climates.
	Dude, that's what the zoo needs.
	Because honestly, dude, the zoo, some of the animals are fucking not.
	Even in America, some of the animals are smoking.
	They don't even care.
	It's sad when you don't see them in their natural environment.
	In a way, they do it, of course, because it's not accessible to everyone.
	For example, if you want to see a lion, you go to Africa.
	It costs a lot of money.
	But to see, you know, I've been in zoos before and I like to see animals in their natural environment.
	Do you think you're going to take any animals?
	Are there any animals you think you could take?
	Man, we're so weak, man, and nature.
	It's crazy.
	Apparently, they say that even a chimp would kill you.
	Yeah, that's what they say.
	Can just pull your fucking balls off.
	Yeah, pull your ball, break your fingers, and rip your face.
	You know that.
	When they go on crime scenes where chimps turns against the human, that's what happened.
	It's crazy.
	I would hate that.
	Because you cannot reproduce, you cannot climb away, and they take away your identity.
	I went in Rwanda.
	I had the chance to do a gorilla tricking.
	And you see them like I'm seeing you.
	Nuh-uh, this close.
	Yeah, yeah, that close.
	So when you go there, it's like in Rwanda.
	Yeah, in Rwanda, in Africa, it's in East Africa.
	And you take a car.
	It's about two hours away from Kigali, which is, I think, the capital.
	You go there and they give you a course.
	They tell you, don't eat.
	If the gorilla look at you, don't look him in the eyes.
	If he comes towards you, don't run away.
	Just get out of the way and put your knee on the floor in a submissive pose.
	Don't talk loud.
	Don't ever touch the female and the kid.
	And when I went there, it was amazing.
	Oh, yeah.
	Is this it, Nick?
	Yeah, that's what it is.
	Yeah, yeah.
	Oh, my God.
	Yeah, yeah.
	Okay, so this guy, let me tell you about this.
	Why'd you dress for a funeral?
	Listen to, guys, guys, this is very interesting.
	So you see what happened?
	Okay.
	So during one instant during my adventure there, I was with different people that were older than me.
	And I don't know what happened.
	At one point, the gorilla, because what happened is you hang out with the kids and the female and the young.
	And once every 20 or 15 minutes, the big silver bag comes and you make a noise.
	And the guy that is with you, every day he sees the same family.
	So he's used to see the same guy.
	But the tourists change.
	So the guide always answers back to tell, hey, we're here.
	So he comes and sometimes you look around to see if everything is okay.
	And then he goes back in the FRS every 10 minutes approximately.
	But once he came and he looked at me.
	Do you have your belt with you?
	No, no, but man, he looked at me.
	And when he looked at me, I look at him just very fast and he start walking towards me like he was pissed.
	Man, I got out of the way and I put my knees down.
	And I'm not a religious guy at all, but I became religious at that.
	I was like, please, please, please, please.
	And then I open my eyes.
	He's not in front of me.
	I look behind.
	I see his back.
	He put his backs against me.
	He explained to me the reason why the guerrilla turned his back to me is because he wanted to show me how much I'm not of a threat for him.
	Wow.
	To show you, like, he turned his back and he looked underneath his arm.
	So when I looked back, I was like, man, I saw his back.
	It was just a threat, a test.
	I was like, man, he would have, even with all my years of training, he would have ripped me apart, man.
	Did you feel like you stood any chance?
	You think he could have got it to two rounds or no?
	I read a document.
	Apparently, it's a report in, I think it's in Uganda.
	I read, there's a military guy that a guerrilla grab and he rip his head off like this.
	Like it straight up from a horror movie.
	He grab him and it's that strong.
	So there's nothing you can do, man.
	But what would you have done, you think?
	I think I would have tried to play it there.
	There's nothing you can do.
	If he wants to kill you, the guy has two guys with him, with the AK-47.
	So they help.
	No, no, but you know, he told me it's not because of the gorilla.
	It's in case we see an elephant or a Cape Buffalo.
	Apparently, it's so dense.
	I don't understand that.
	Apparently, sometimes you could run through a Cape Buffalo, and they're extremely territorial.
	Was that scarier than beating the cage?
	Well, it happens so fast.
	It's very different because it happens so fast that you don't have time to prepare.
	So you just go with the flow.
	So I didn't even have time to be scared that much.
	I was just, I was trying, I was like, man, please, please, please.
	Then I look, shit, he's in the back.
	And I see his back.
	And I could see the muscle through the fur.
	I was like, man, it's so massive.
	It's insane.
	Keith Peterson's just standing there.
	That'd be crazy.
	Man.
	It was one of the most incredible adventure of my life.
	I recommend it to everyone.
	And the money that you pay for that adventure is given to the gorilla.
	And now the gorilla in Rwanda and that part of the world are flourishing again.
	Oh, it's beautiful.
	So it's a beautiful thing.
	Yeah.
	It is awesome to take care of our planet and to give back to it, you know?
	Because it's funny because somebody probably saw a gorilla one day and even thought about getting in shape for the first time.
	You know what I'm saying?
	You just don't know what we learn from animals, you know?
	What keeps you busy these days, man?
	Well, I'm involved with, I have a home fitness equipment brand called Base Block Pro.
	It's all kinds of apparel that you can use and train at home.
	Is it in Canada or US as well?
	Kinesthetics.
	All around the world.
	I need to get something for home.
	It's light.
	Some of them are outdoor friendly, so you can put it in your backyard.
	Some I recommend.
	It's more for backyard to put outside.
	And some are more for inside, for home.
	And yeah, it's great.
	I don't lift.
	I never lift weight really much.
	And I'm a big fan of kinesthetics.
	I used to when I was younger to lift weight, but I realized that it's more efficient to train kinesthetics, especially.
	Kinesthetics is what?
	Yeah, gymnastics.
	Your own body weight.
	Yes, exactly.
	So you have less risk of injuries.
	And I think it's more efficient.
	Base blocks.
	Yes.
	Oh, sweet, man.
	I got to get something else for my helmet.
	I'm just getting a treadmill.
	So I got to have something else for when I can't go down to the gym.
	I'll send you some.
	I'll tell my guy I'll hook you.
	I'll be awesome to have tell me which one you like.
	I recommend you the big bar pro.
	This one, you put if you have a backyard, put it in your backyard, it's it's outdoor friendly.
	And if you want like for your legs, this one is very good.
	You is for Amstring.
	Oh, I don't care about the legs, homie.
	I'm up top only.
	No, I'll send you some stuff.
	I'll tell the tell the guy to send you some, so he'll be more than happy.
	Um, are there some fighters right now that you love to watch that you kind of cheer on?
	Do you find yourself being a fan of MMA still?
	I mean, I mean, I know it's obviously been such a huge part of your life.
	I don't know if it's something you just kind of close or if it's something that's always in you kind of.
	One thing that has changed, and now there's so many fights, there's almost every weekend.
	So I can't watch it all.
	I can't watch all the shows, but I love to watch some of the guys that I can learn from.
	I like to watch Tom Aspinall.
	Oh, yeah, he's fun.
	The fight of last weekend, Balal Mohamed, Leon Edwards, I watch it.
	I like Kamaruzman, Desanya, Wakanovsky, Makachev.
	I like to watch the best so I can learn from them.
	Is it weird to look at them and be like, that was me?
	Because I think even as a comedian, I'll watch comedy sometimes and I'll be like, it doesn't seem like, I know it's a different person, but it doesn't even seem like that's my job.
	Has that ever happened to you?
	Do you ever have like this Clark Kent feeling when you're walking down the street that you're also Superman?
	I mean, no, I think what made me good is because I possess certain set of skills that made me unique.
	But some of the guys that are competing now, they have their own set of skills.
	And I think I can learn from them, you know, by watching them.
	I'm learning from them.
	And, you know, of course, maybe they can learn from me.
	So it's impossible to be completely 100% well-rounded.
	You always have certain things that you do better than others.
	And that's why I like the sport so much.
	Some guys are better at, for example, at grapplings.
	One guy is strength might be his gran and pound.
	One guy might be his submission skills.
	One guy might be his, you know, like Pereira.
	He's got an incredible left hook.
	We all know he's got a left hook, but nobody, they all know the left hook is coming, but they don't know how to stop it.
	It's crazy.
	And left hook is one of the most fundamental punch that you learn in day one.
	And it works.
	It's one of the most basic weapon, but he does it so well.
	He hides it.
	He hides it so well.
	And the way he does it, even though it's so basic, nobody can stop it.
	It's crazy.
	That's fascinating almost, isn't it?
	How something simple can be and so obvious in a way can be so surprising.
	You use different diversion, different distraction to get it on.
	It's crazy.
	And that's what I like about the sport.
	It's like a chess game, you know?
	Oh, it's fascinating too.
	I think as, you know, I've been a fan now, like a big fan for probably maybe almost six or seven years now.
	And you get to know the fighters more a little bit too on a personal, you know, like because there's so much social media, you get to know more about them and kind of cheer from in different ways and stuff.
	But there's all types.
	There are guys who are outspoken.
	There's guys who are kind of reserved.
	There's guys who are playing cat and mouse.
	And there's guys who are just about getting in the ring.
	Have you gotten into anything else competitive?
	Is there something else that you do?
	I used to, when I was young, I used to play chess.
	Did you really?
	Yeah.
	Growing up, I was more of a nerd at school.
	And I was a victim of bullying at school.
	So that's why I started martial art.
	I started karate at a young age as a self-defense.
	Then later on, it developed into a passion, passion transform into a way I make a living.
	You should pull up on those guys, right?
	Awesome, dude.
	But I used to, I remember in order to miss school, I was enrolling into chess, chess tradition, because I was representing my school.
	And then once you win the school, you go to the regional.
	And then once I go to regional, you go to Montreal, where it's the provincial.
	And I never made it past that.
	I won the school, I won the regional.
	But when I went to Montreal, I never even won a match in the provincial.
	Because these guys that they, that's what they do.
	Me, I was just doing that for fun.
	And I was a kid back then, so it was fun.
	Yeah, well, you found other ways to win, man.
	Oh, yeah, the Olympics are going on.
	Oh, that's a, yeah, the Olympic, man.
	It's crazy.
	Like, people, like, now they talk about what happened in the controversy.
	With the woman fighter, you mean?
	Yeah, no, they talk about the ceremony, the opening ceremony.
	Oh, yeah, they thought it was anti-Catholic.
	Yes, I was in Miami when that happened, and I saw on the news, I was like, man, I'm going to try to watch it.
	But now they took it out of YouTube.
	So I don't think you can't see it anymore.
	That's crazy.
	So I tried to find a way, but I just saw some part of it and I speak French.
	I was like, God damn.
	Yeah.
	I mean, it's weird.
	I try to not be politic, but there are certain things that, man, you're at home, you know, like you don't have to show the world.
	You know, I don't care who you sleep with, what you do.
	I mean, I like you as a person, you know what I mean?
	Yeah, this seems a little crazy for the Olympics, I think.
	Yeah, yeah, it changes.
	That's one thing that changed over the year.
	Like, we didn't have that before.
	This is kind of, it seems crazy.
	Like, maybe the world is so crazy that I don't even know the world anymore.
	That's what I start to wonder, too, sometimes.
	Yeah.
	But yeah, this stuff seems like, what do we do?
	What sport is this?
	Yeah, it's what I don't know.
	It's just what sport is it?
	But I mean, I probably, you know, I don't know.
	It's a different time.
	I mean, I don't know what to make of it.
	I mean, it's dark forces at play, it feels like sometimes.
	I am not.
	You like going down the conspiracy rabbit holes, though.
	It's fun.
	And also, the crazy part about the conspiracies is, remember, during like pandemic, like they said all these things and half of them were true.
	And it was like, well, fucking.
	I was very angry about what was going on in Canada.
	I didn't like the way it was run during the pandemic.
	I was very pissed off.
	I didn't like it.
	I think it was an attack on our freedom.
	We had curfew and this.
	And this, I'm not afraid.
	Some people like, oh, you shouldn't become a political.
	This is not right.
	I think it's about freedom.
	I was not happy about the decision that were made.
	I think it was an attack on the freedom.
	And I think everybody should have had the decision of choosing the right to make the decision.
	Do I want to be vaccinated or not?
	But if you're not vaccinated, you're not allowed to do this, do this.
	Like, man, this was wrong.
	I don't agree with that decision.
	Yeah, it started to feel like privatized communism to me in a way.
	It's like, you know, it's like the bait of the government, but really it's like private entities doing it.
	And I wish I'd spoken up more.
	I think there were times for me, you know, I just felt like kind of scared or I didn't feel brave or I didn't know some things.
	They would have canceled you.
	But that's crazy.
	They would have canceled you.
	That's the thing.
	That's the thing about it.
	I mean, it depends in Nashville.
	I don't know.
	Nashville, Tennessee, right?
	Yeah, they can't really cancel you that much there.
	Yeah, but in Canada, it's different.
	Like people, people don't understand, but it was different.
	We had a curfew.
	It was crazy.
	Like, man, I couldn't get out of the country.
	I had business to do.
	My business is international.
	I had to travel.
	So I had no choice.
	I did it.
	But I think I was not agree with the decision.
	And it is my right to say so.
	But if I would have said it at the time, maybe they would have put down my Instagram, put down all my stuff.
	I know that's what's it.
	It really feels like big tech is kind of the government now, you know?
	But man, it's just an honor to sit down with such a champion these days and just get to have a chance to spend time with you, George.
	And do you, you know, they have the thing in the Olympics right now.
	They have a boxer who they who has like, oh, yeah.
	It's a female boxer, right?
	And, but she, um, she was born a female and is a female.
	Let me say her name, Iman Khalif.
	Yeah, Algeria.
	Yeah, from Algeria.
	And, um, and she's crushing it, and she hasn't won all of her fights.
	And, um, but there's people, it's been a huge uproar online because I guess she had higher testosterone levels and she wasn't allowed to compete in the World Boxing Championships.
	Do you think at some point, because this just appears to be something that kind of happens more where there's some gray area in between gender, right?
	Yeah.
	Do you think they should just have a new division?
	Well, this, I don't know enough information about that particular situation to give an opinion on it because I might have absolutely.
	But one thing I can tell you, when a man is born, when you're born as a man and then you change your sex and then after you go compete as a woman, this I think is disgusting.
	This, I'm not afraid to say it and stand up for that because I love women and I think they need to be protected, especially in combat sport.
	This I'm not agree with.
	I agree.
	I want everybody to have the equal right.
	But when you have someone who's born as a man who changes sex as a woman and then compete, I think he should have his own category.
	That would be fair because otherwise it's unfair.
	We're different.
	Like, I mean, why?
	Okay, I'm going to change my sex and go compete in the UFC and make a comeback in the woman division.
	What do you think can happen?
	You know what I mean?
	It's not fair.
	Maybe some of them will kick my ass, but I think I will do pretty well.
	There's a couple ladies out there that would give you a run.
	Yeah, but I agree.
	And they should solve it.
	I think it's not fair also if people are dealing with this, their own sexual identity and they don't know.
	Create a new division so that they can be there and be the pioneers of a new division.
	Then that way it's like they're getting to be a part of something new.
	They're getting to fight against like-minded people.
	I don't know, but I agree.
	I agree.
	They should have their own division.
	I think if you're born in a different gender, because man, it's really not fair.
	People have no idea the difference, but man, it's huge difference.
	I mean, it's a huge difference.
	Oh, God.
	We've seen in tennis, you know, like I think it's Serena Williams.
	She played tennis against.
	Oh, yeah, she got it.
	And it was done in boxing, too.
	A few times with the feet.
	She's a Dutch champion in kickboxing.
	She fought a man in boxing.
	In tennis, it's different because it's a game.
	Basketball, it's a game.
	when it's combat sport I think we should protect protect protect our females the women And the men should speak up for that, you know?
	The men should speak up for that.
	that problem sometimes when you speak up to that, you get point by the finger and this is unfair, but that's the media But here is, there's a fight in BJJ, actually, in, is it this ADC?
	Craig Jones Invitational, he's doing his tournament the same weekend as ADCC, and the main event is going to be him versus Gabby Garcia.
	Oh, so now this, though, they're both agreeing that they want to do it.
	I'm sorry for my ignorance.
	Is Gabby Garcia is- she's a female, female, like she's, it's not like a, Okay, okay, okay.
	But lots of help.
	Yeah, yeah, of course.
	A lot of enhancement.
	Okay, wow.
	But is it like a novelty fight, sort of, or more like a...
	He's doing it the same weekend.
	It's interesting.
	Yeah, because Craig Jones is one of the best grapplers of the planet.
	Yeah, for sure.
	I wanted, so he's probably gonna, I don't know enough about Gabby.
	Yeah, I heard about that event, that it was like a million-dollar event in the same time As the Abu Debi event, but I don't know all the detail on it.
	Wow.
	Oh my God.
	Okay, that's her.
	That is her.
	My gosh, boy.
	I am.
	She's bigger than him, right?
	I got to get to the gym.
	Oh, but Craig Jones is one of the best.
	Yeah, one of the best.
	It should be interesting.
	What about just in jujitsu?
	Can women compete as well in there if there's not striking?
	Well, they can compete woman against woman, but against man, it's still the strength.
	The strength is different.
	And there's a lot of factor too.
	I mean, I'm not a specialist in that, but the bone density, there's a lot of factors.
	I mean, there's things.
	First, I think women are better than men.
	They can give birth and there's we couldn't we couldn't endure that like women are better than men, you know?
	Yeah, dude.
	This is what I believe.
	But there's one thing that we have better than women.
	Normally, we're more physically stronger.
	Yeah.
	And we have certain advantage.
	And that's why there's different category.
	There's man and woman.
	And that's why, you know, to make it fair.
	But it just was the same thing.
	Of course, if you take a woman, for example, who has a lot of experience, make her fight a man who does not have any experience, the woman can kick his ass.
	100%.
	But if you go to the elite level, it will be pretty unlikely.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	It'd be interesting, though.
	Yeah.
	Now, that kind of stuff, I think, is a little bit more, you know, it's like we're both agreeing to do this thing, you know?
	Rush, man.
	Thanks so much, dude.
	Thank you, man.
	So cool.
	Thank you for having me, man.
	I'm happy.
	It's really awesome and just really cool to be in the presence of somebody that's achieved such greatness in their life, that God in and got out.
	And yeah, do you have any other big goals in your life right now?
	Do you feel like?
	Well, I feel pretty content or does that evolve?
	Does a person that's a perfectionist kind of, I'm kind of a perfectionist too, I think.
	Do you ever get content?
	Do you feel like?
	I'm never satisfied.
	Now I'm more of an entrepreneur now.
	And that's my goal.
	I'm very lucky I was able to transfer that hunger that I had in mixed martial art.
	I wanted to be the best, be the champion.
	Now I transfer it into a business or into my person.
	I wanted to be a better person.
	And I'm happy.
	If things go well for me, I have enough to live for the rest of my life.
	And if I don't go crazy and try to be happy.
	I think the ultimate goal, right, for everyone is to be happy.
	Oh, for sure.
	There's different ways that you can use to attain that feeling, but it's to be happy.
	And right now I'm very happy.
	I'm healthy.
	I'm happy.
	Are your parents pretty proud of you?
	Yeah, they're very happy.
	My parents, in the beginning, they didn't want me to fight.
	And I understand them.
	It's not something that you want.
	It's not a life that you wish for or someone you love.
	Those kids, you tell them not to fight.
	Man, I'm going to tell you something that happened to me all the time.
	There is parents that comes to me with their kids and they're like, hey, George, this is the future world champion.
	And then I go, oh, hi, how old are you?
	He's like, he's 12 years old.
	Oh, yeah.
	You trained martial arts.
	He's like, yes, it's good.
	But remember something, stay at school, man.
	And you need to be educated.
	That's your number one priority.
	And the problem that a lot of athletes, and not only in the MMA, in everything, Canada, we have a lot of that example in hockey, but it could be basketball, football.
	A lot of athletes, they put their eggs all in the same basket.
	Oh, yeah.
	So they all want, they all dream to be a professional athlete, but something happened.
	They get hit by a car.
	Boom.
	Or they get an injury, like they break their ACL or their knees or something happened.
	Now their career is gone.
	They're never going to come back the same.
	And what happened if that incident happened when you're like in your late 20s?
	There's nothing that you can fall back into if you don't have school.
	There's nothing.
	So it's an assurance.
	I quit school when I was fighting Matt Hughes, before my fight with Matt Hughes.
	So my parents forced me to stay at school to stay educated.
	And it was one of the best thing they did.
	Did you quit college then?
	Oh, I wanted to quit everything.
	But I was studying in kinesiology.
	But I didn't like what I was doing at the time.
	I didn't know I was changing all the time.
	One time I tried to be a fireman.
	I had many jobs.
	One time I was working in nightclubs as a security.
	To pay my university fee, I was a garbage man for seven months.
	Really?
	Yeah, I collect the garbage, man.
	That's what I did.
	And I did it.
	But I was always forced, my parents always forced me to stay educated.
	And when I tell the kids, I say, man, train, you know, but I wish you the best, but the odds of success are very low.
	You know, and even you're so talented and you work really hard, that does not mean you're going to make it because that chances of success are so low.
	Make sure you stay educated.
	And if something goes wrong and you cannot achieve it, at least you have something to fall back into.
	And maybe you're going to change your mind.
	You know what I mean?
	You're not the same person at 15 that you will be at 20. And at 25, things changes.
	I didn't know what I wanted to become when I was young.
	And I'm sure the same for you.
	Like I wanted to be a policy cops at one point.
	Then I wanted to be a fireman.
	Then I'm like, oh, I wanted to do a therapist.
	Then a paleontologist.
	Then I'm like, ah, I'm going to be a fighter.
	You know what I mean?
	But the fighter was always in my mind since the beginning, but I needed to have a backup plan.
	I didn't know what to do.
	I realized when I had my first title shot that it was an opportunity of a lifetime.
	And that's when I had a talk with my parent.
	I told my parents, I said, listen, I'm going to quit the next session because I'm going to train full-time because I have a title shot.
	If that doesn't work.
	I can always go back next season to school, but the title shot might never come present.
	The chance for the title might not ever present itself again.
	So I'm going to take a chance and I'm going to go full out.
	And I went full out.
	I lost my first title shot, but I rebound immediately and then I end up winning the title.
	And that's how everything started for me in the UFC.
	Did they come to your fights to your folks?
	I'm sorry?
	Did they come to your fights?
	They came to my fight.
	My parents, when it was local, but my mom came to my fight when I fought for the title in Sacramento when I won the title.
	But my dad doesn't like to fly.
	He's afraid of airplane.
	It's crazy.
	He's afraid of airplanes.
	You're afraid of nothing, which is kind of ironic.
	Well, no, no, I'm afraid of a lot of things, but I'm willing to do it.
	That's the difference.
	Willing to commit it.
	Thank you so much.
	George Saint-Pierre, I appreciate your time.
	And yeah, just helping us learn more about fighting and more about the mentality of being a champion and the ups and downs of it, you know, that not everything's perfect, but that we keep moving forward and challenging ourselves.
	I appreciate it so much, man.
	All right.
	Thank you, man.
	Thank you for the opportunity.
	I appreciate it.
	Cheers, brother.
	Now, I'm just floating on the breeze, and I feel I'm falling like these leaves.
	I must be cornerstone.
	Oh, but when I reach that ground, I'll share this peace of mind I found.
	I can feel it in my bones.

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