Aug. 21, 2021 - The Political Cesspool - James Edwards
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You're listening to the Liberty News Radio Network, and this is the Political Cesspool.
The Political Cesspool, known across the South and worldwide as the South's foremost populist conservative radio program.
And here to guide you through the murky waters of the Political Cesspool is your host, James Edwards.
Ladies and gentlemen, in this now our 17th year of broadcasting, I want you to think of all the guests you've ever heard interviewed on this show, all the different people we've brought to this platform.
Who do you think was the one that I met first?
I'll give you a hit.
I met this lady in the winter of 1999, 2000 at a meeting of the Tennessee Reform Party as we were getting together to organize what would be the nascent Buchanan for president campaign of 2000.
And little did I know then that some four years later, I would start a talk radio program that would define my life in many ways.
And certainly did I not know at the time that this dear lady who I was meeting for the first time at that meeting, I would still be in touch with now 21 years later.
She is, of course, Dr. Virginia Abernathy.
Virginia Dean Abernathy is Emeritus Professor of Psychiatry and Anthropology at Vanderbilt University School of Medicine.
She has an MBA from Vanderbilt and a PhD from Harvard University.
And she's back on the program tonight to discuss the vanishing American Dream.
And if that, all of that wasn't enough, the very first show we ever did that had archive capacity, the very first shows we didn't have archives, the very first show we ever did archive was an interview with Virginia Abernathy.
Virginia, surely back in 99, 2000, you probably foresaw all of this, did you not?
Well, what I saw in you, James, is a handsome young man with a beautiful fiancé, or maybe she was your wife by then.
That was a great pleasure to me.
We were not quite married by then, but it wouldn't be too much longer.
And thank you, thank you, thank you for the kind words.
I'm either blushing or it's just so hot in the studio during these dog days of summer.
I can't tell.
But nonetheless, I do appreciate it.
And it is great sincerely, all kidding aside, great to still be in touch two decades on.
It's a great pleasure, Virginia.
Mine too.
Mine too.
And I'm glad you're still out of, James.
You're keeping the fibers alive.
Well, I can certainly say the same things about you.
And you've been doing it a lot longer than me and in many ways, more prominently than me, certainly with your credentials and the work you've done with your published books.
And we've offered population politics as an incentive on a fundraising drive last year.
And it was very well received by the audience, as you always are when you appear.
But you actually spoke at one of our conferences back in 2017.
And there was a line out the door to buy copies of your book, The Vanishing American Dream.
I think you sold out of every box you brought that day.
And you gave a great speech that was well received by the in-person audience of that particular conference.
But that's what we're talking about tonight.
The Vanishing American Dream.
This is your most recent book, and it's published by Transaction Publishers.
Tell us about it, Virginia.
It's a collection of articles I've published in the last, let's say, 20 years.
I finished population politics in 1993 and published.
And since then, so much accumulated that supports my views of why people marry young or wait till they're much older and why people decide to have more or fewer children, which is very important in terms of where our country is going.
And a lot of data accumulated.
It was published in newspapers, accounts of different countries and what people did and why in terms of planning a family and having a family, that I have over time put a great deal of material in articles.
And this, The Vanishing American Dream, seemed a way to draw all of that together to republish some of my published articles, a few of them, and not only about population and immigration and family formation, some other topics that have interested me over the years.
Virginia, this is Keith Alexander.
Good to have you on the show.
Let me ask you this.
What do you think is the primary or the foremost cause of the population decline in America?
Well, if you're talking about people who support our way of life and our way of thinking, but we don't have a population decline altogether in this country, unfortunately, we have very, very rapid population growth.
In this last census, I said that white people have declined as a, you know, there's been a decline from the last census until this census for the first time since 1790.
I think Virginia inferred your question correctly.
It's not that the overall population is declining, it's that the founding stock population is declining.
Right, exactly.
And what would you say is the primary reason for that?
Well, they are people, they are marrying much later than they used to, and they are planning fewer children and having fewer children.
In fact, if you look at the white population, according to the Census Bureau, it's been more than 40 years since each woman had two children on average.
And if a woman doesn't have two children or a little bit more to account for early child mortality, 2.1 children specifically, if a woman, if the average woman in our population has fewer than 2.1 children, she's not replacing herself and her husband.
Why do you think this is, why do you think couples are choosing not to have children like their parents and grandparents did?
I think it's because they don't see a very prosperous future.
They see enormous costs in raising children, and they don't see how they can afford one or two children and maintain their standard of living and how they can afford to have one or two and educate those children to the level that they would like to do.
Well, that's one of the things that I used to talk about regarding the pernicious effect of Brown versus Board of Education in that decision, which basically removed the option of public school as the option for educating your children.
You're going to, in places like Memphis, for example, you're going to have to send your children to private school to get an education like the one that you had.
And so, as you say, Keith, you could only have the number of kids you could comfortably afford to send to private school.
Would you agree with that, Dr. Abernathy?
Yes, yes, because whatever standard you think the family thinks is appropriate, it doesn't have to be a high standard, but it has to be the standard they think is appropriate.
That is going to be more and more costly and less affordable for most people.
And so they do live in family side.
Hold on right there, Virginia.
We are going to take our first break of the hour.
Thankfully, ladies and gentlemen, we have her with us for the entire third and final hour talking about her book, The Vanishing American Dream.
Stay tuned.
You know where the solution can be found, Mr. President?
In churches, in wedding chapels, in maternity wards across the country and around the world.
More babies will mean forward-looking adults, the sort we need to tackle long-term, large-scale problems.
American babies, in particular, are likely going to be wealthier, better educated, and more conservation-minded than children raised in still industrializing countries.
As economist Tyler Cowan recently wrote, quote, by having more children, you're making your nation more populous, thus boosting its capacity to solve climate change.
The planet does not need for us to think globally and act locally so much as it needs us to think family and act personally.
The solution to so many of our problems at all times and in all places is to fall in love, get married, and have some kids.
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When it comes to smoking, are you sending mixed signals?
But when you teach someone a certain way to do things and you go back on that certain way, it sends mixed signals to the person that they're trying to teach.
The parents need to be a good example.
Smoking.
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A public service message from this station and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
To get on the show and speak with James and the gang, call us toll-free at 1-866-986-6397.
And now, back to tonight's show.
Ladies and gentlemen, our featured guest of the evening, Dr. Virginia Abernathy, a lady I have known longer than anyone who has ever appeared on this program.
I've known her even longer than my longtime co-host, Keith Alexander.
That's how far we go back.
And it's always a date that I circle on the calendar when she makes her appearances on this program.
She appears at least annually, if not sometimes more frequently than that.
And we're always grateful to have her.
We're talking about her book, which is in a way a greatest hits compilation, The Vanishing American Dream.
I'm just actually going to read a little bit about the book to further inform you about what we're talking about.
And this is what the back cover reads.
I actually have it in my hands.
I was thinking about Virginia earlier this week, and I pulled it off the shelf and got in touch with her to see if she could come on the show, brought it into the studio tonight.
The United States has gone off track, allowing domestic and foreign aid policies to be co-opted by a government abetted by mass media that serves special interests rather than the greater national good.
Americans' tendencies to trust, play fair, and help have been abused and require replacement by a realistic outlook.
That is so true.
This book, The Vanishing American Dream, posits solutions to get America back on the right track.
Abernathy sees population growth driven by mass immigration as a major cause of economic and cultural changes that have been detrimental to most Americans.
The environment has been degraded by overcrowding and increasing demands on natural resources.
Work is cheapened by explosive growth in the labor force, creating a buyer's market.
One salary or wage no longer supports a family and educates children.
Women working outside the home is a necessity, not a choice, for most American families.
Furthermore, feminism, aimed originally at balanced gender roles, has been turned viciously against males of all ages and ultimately against females through degrading their natural, or rather their traditional and valuable contributions.
Abernathy proposes that Americans need time to regroup, untroubled by a continuing influx of foreign peoples.
The family, small business, and responsive local government are centers around which a solvent and confident citizenry can prosper again.
Ladies and gentlemen, I think one of the people who reviewed this book could say it better than I and certainly did.
Abernathy has taken a herd of sacred cows and led them to the intellectual slaughterhouse, forcing the reader to think anew about disconcerting realities and tangible alternatives.
After reading Abernathy's work, I too will have to rethink my position.
Highly recommend it.
This is the book we're talking about tonight, The Vanishing American Dream.
Virginia, where would you like to go from there?
Which direction?
Because you cover, as I just mentioned, so many important topics in one epic title.
Well, I can expand a little bit more on the one we're talking about.
The proof of what I have proposed, which is that perception of economic prospects determines whether people will have more children or try to limit their family size.
I actually predicted that certain economic develops in a country change in the fertility rate, the number of children per woman.
And I predicted this once for the United States when there was a particular economic downturn here, a recession, and I predicted that two years later, it takes about that time to decide to have a kid and then to have the baby, and then to collect the data on the results.
I predicted that we would see a decline in fertility rate, and we did.
So that was one prediction that worked out.
And I predicted the same thing in about 1997 when there was a tremendous economic catastrophe that swept much of Asia.
Countries that were called the nine Asian tigers.
And to give you an example, the Thai economy lost 30 or 40 percent of its value within a space of a few months.
And I predicted that the fertility rate in Thailand would begin to decline and decline below the trend line, which was declining already.
But I predicted a much faster decline in the fertility rate.
And that too panned out.
And so when a person makes predictions and then they're born out in real time begins to constitute confidence.
I won't say proof because scientists don't like to say they've proved anything quite.
There's always a chance that it's going to go up in smoke.
But it was beginning, I was beginning to be very confident that I was right.
There's the perception of things getting better or worse economically, that other people will have more or fewer children.
That made me quite happy about my book.
Dr. Abernathy, this is Keith Alexander again.
I have an alternative theory that I would like to try out on you.
And that is that every left-wing movement that has occurred during my lifetime, I'm 70 years old, in that period of time, there's one common thread that goes through each one of them.
Each one of these liberal initiatives, feminism, the No Fault Divorce Initiative, homosexual marriage, homosexual rights, just about everything that you can name has this one common thread running through it, and that is that it is work to reduce white birth rates.
Responding to the city.
You're right.
It has.
You're right.
All of those things are associated, correlated with lower fertility rates.
But I'm not sure which is the cause and which is the effect.
For example, take this business of more homosexuality and confused gender or sex roles.
I think that the public accepts of this, and whether you and I accept it or not, does not alter the fact that there is a lot more public acceptance of it than there used to be.
I think that that could be an effect of people no longer valuing large families or wanting large families.
It's not necessarily the cause of that.
It could be an effect of people devaluing large families and deciding for themselves that they didn't want them.
Also be the promotion of homosexuality and the normalizing of homosexuality has made converts of some people that may have been on the edge.
And of course, homosexual issues.
I think that's true, too.
Yes, there's no question.
I think that's also true.
But the general public acceptance, the situation is quite fluid.
And I do think there's a question of what's the cause and what's the effect.
Well, one thing I've said on this show before many times, Dr. Abernathy, is that every left-wing movement portrays itself as being benevolent when it's actually the opposite.
And let me just go through some of them.
For example, the civil rights movement wasn't pro-black as much as it was anti-white.
The feminist movement wasn't pro-woman so much as it was anti-male.
The homosexual rights movement wasn't so much pro-homosexual as anti-heterosexual.
Am I wrong?
Or at the very least, this is how they all played out when taken to the last full measure.
And it may have been that that was the true reason from the very beginning.
I don't know, but it's at least a possible reason.
Well, I don't know.
We're together.
I don't know either.
I think mainly the people that start some of these ideological movements are interested in power.
And quite frequently, they have little means of gaining national attention and power except by proposing something new and then pushing it.
Ladies and gentlemen, we're joined right now by the very esteemed Emeritus Professor of Psychiatry and Anthropology from Vanderbilt University School of Medicine, Dr. Virginia Dean Abernathy.
She'll be back with us right after this.
Stay tuned, everybody.
You're listening to Liberty News Radio.
USA Radio News with Dan Narocki.
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And you're listening to USA Radio News.
Welcome back.
To get on the show, call us on James's Dime at 1-866-986-6397.
Just want to read through this amazing bio one more time, ladies and gentlemen, to remind you the degree to which our guest is most certainly esteemed.
Virginia Abernathy, Professor Emeritus of Psychiatry, Anthropology at Vanderbilt University School of Medicine, holds a PhD from Harvard, an MBA from Vanderbilt, and a BA from Wellesley College.
Dr. Abernathy taught at Harvard before joining the Vanderbilt University Medical School faculty in 1975.
She's the author of Population Politics, which so many of you received through the mail in a recent fundraising drive a few quarters back.
And also The Vanishing American Dream, which we're talking about right now, and which so many of you received in person when Dr. Abernathy spoke at our 2017 conference.
And I got to tell you another personal story.
I had the opportunity to visit with Virginia at her home.
We had a wonderful lunch together.
And just to show you what kind of a lady this woman is, she donated so many of those books.
She donated all the books we were able to move of population politics.
She autographed all of them.
I would have had writer's cramp.
She sat there at that table and autographed all of these copies and she gave them to us gratis.
So to help the work of this radio program, I want to thank her for that.
And that day we spent together at your home, Virginia, I'll remember for the next 21 years.
It was a great day.
Beautiful place.
Really enjoyed it.
James, hello.
Yes.
Yes, I'm here.
Well, I want to make a point before we leave this subject completely of how immigration, immigration itself makes Americans feel poorer.
And as I've said, when they feel poor and don't have good prospects, they have fewer children.
So immigration makes people feel poor many ways.
One is they actually are a huge burden on local and state tax communities, local communities in the state, and they cause taxes, therefore, to rise.
But it was 20 years ago when a good study came out showing that immigration was costing over $100 billion a year in additional welfare and other costs.
The principal costs were education and the police and judicial systems and a certain burden on the infrastructure.
So those put together cost an enormous amount of money, which redounds on the taxpayer.
And then another way in which immigration makes Americans feel poorer is that they take jobs.
If a lot of people come into this country who are specialists in, let's say, information technology, they're IT workers, that has a very bad effect on our own people trained in coding and information technology.
In fact, I've spoken personally to a number of Americans who lost their jobs because of a replacement coming from a foreign country.
They've even been forced to train the replacements in order to get a good payout when they were let go from their existing job.
So those are two ways that immigration directly impacts the bottom line for an American family.
And as I said, if you do not have good economic prospects, if you think they're deteriorating, you're much less likely to marry, marry young, and have children.
Well, Dr. Immigration helps us.
Look, this is Keith Alexander again.
No, that's all right.
I just wanted to say this.
There has been a concerted war against white people and their prosperity.
And what is happening, too, is, for example, my father worked at a plant and had a supervisory position.
It was a plant that was run by a large, well-known national company.
They decided in the mid-60s that they wanted to replace white supervisors that did not have college degrees with a new cadre of black supervisors that did.
So that was a way that he was displaced, not by an immigrant, but by someone here locally.
But now it seems like the left has decided there aren't enough people out there in the American population to displace white people.
So they are recruiting people from overseas to come in and do the same thing.
Am I wrong to draw that conclusion?
Well, it's true that American education has dumbed down our children so much that I think that they have become somewhat less capable of doing jobs that were routinely done by the older generation, people who are now retiring.
And that is a problem.
But nevertheless, it's a chicken and egg problem.
If one is going to continue to import immigrants to do jobs, Americans are not going to have the incentive to train themselves for those particular jobs.
One reason is that the wage scale will have been competed down.
You increase the supply of labor and the value of that labor, the pay for that labor will go down to the jobs become less attractive.
And it is a terrible problem, but we must make the jobs, let the jobs stay attractive, and then Americans will train for those jobs and do them.
They always have.
And let me also say, in states that received less immigration, and I'm thinking of states like Wyoming, Montana, Idaho, and all of those until recently, all the jobs get done.
And they're not done by immigrants.
They're done by Americans.
And Americans will do the jobs.
Yes, your motel is going to be a lot more expensive when you get into Wyoming than when you are in, let's say, Colorado.
And that's because the jobs are being done by Americans.
And the jobs pay better.
and the family has a living wage so I guess that's right Well, one thing that I've noticed here in Memphis, there is a college that has a college of engineering.
And those engineers, those engineering graduates, can't find jobs at suitable wages.
And that's because they're importing all these engineers from overseas.
That's exactly the point I want you to.
I'm glad you made that point.
Yes, that's exactly right.
And so then the word gets around and there's less incentive for Americans to go through the engineering curriculum, which is a demanding curriculum.
And there's less incentive for them to work and to pay the school tuition and so forth.
And we wind up saying, oh, we don't have any American engineers.
It's a chicken and egg problem, don't you think so?
Absolutely.
I think you hit the nail on the head with that analogy.
And when she hits the nail on the head, what does she do, Keith?
drives it straight and hopes not to hit her finger anyway we have we have a big problem with mass immigration And of course, there are people who want it.
Unfortunately, it's a lot of people that you would expect to know better, but they want the cheaper labor who often will work harder because they have come from circumstances where they learned to work very hard.
I mean, watch.
Go ahead.
I was going to say, one of the problems is that we have an elite that doesn't seem to have any sense of civic responsibility to the rest of us here in America as fellow American citizens.
I think that's right.
It's hard to understand, but I think you're right.
And I don't know how we bring back that sense of responsibility.
Well, now take the situation, for example, of Liz Cheney.
That would be Vice President Cheney's daughter.
And she is a representative to the Congress from the state of Wyoming.
I've just come from Wyoming.
And the people that I spoke with in Sheridan, which is a beautiful town part of the state, the people there want very much to replace Liz Cheney.
They are almost unanimous that they want to replace Liz Cheney, but they don't think they're going to be able to do it.
And it's a rather complicated problem having to do with the laws governing the primary election to select a candidate for Congresswoman.
Very interesting.
Perhaps we can learn a little bit more about that in our next segment, which will be our last of the evening.
And Virginia Aberdefi will be back with us to take us to the wall, take us to the house, as we say.
Stay tuned, everybody.
That I would have a huge slumber party with all the girls there.
Play with me more often.
My mom's so busy with the board meeting.
To spend more time together as a family.
Do more out-of-the-house activities.
This is a tough one.
My parents, they do everything they love me.
If it wasn't for them, I would have a roof over my head.
They don't need to show it to me.
They just know they love my work.
Well, not yelling at me very much.
What do you wish?
What do you wish?
Raise my allowance.
To not argue together.
I'll have my dad be home more for dinner and stuff so that it could be even closer.
Family, isn't it about time?
Buy me an ice cream and kiss me to love me.
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When she goes home, it's no place.
She's got scars, she's got face.
Well, Keith Alexander had the epiphany just before we came back live.
Hey, why don't we dedicate She's a Lady by Tom Jones to our guest tonight.
And I said, you know what, Keith, that's a great idea because she's certainly a lady and more.
She's someone who had something to lose for telling the truth.
Like Dr. Kevin McDonald, Virginia Aberdanthe could have lived a life of relative ease based upon her credentials and her hard work and her scholarship and everything she's accomplished in life.
But she served the professional calling, but something even higher than that.
I think she dedicated her life to a service of truth.
And that's what her book is dedicated to.
I'm reading the dedication of this book, The Vanishing American Dream.
And she writes, this book is dedicated to young Americans who reach for responsibility and liberty.
And Virginia, thank you for setting an example on how we can do that.
Well, thank you.
That's all, that's very nice, James.
And I try to live out to it.
But also, I'm one of those people who gets bored if she's not working.
I think most people find the greatest satisfaction in life out of work.
And it's unfortunate that work has been devalued in this country when actually work is so important.
It makes people feel so good about themselves.
So I'm all for work.
And go on.
Well, I was going to say thank you for the work you have produced.
I mean, doing work is one thing.
What is idle hands or the devil's playthings?
Devil's Workshop.
That's right.
But listen, this is a book we've been talking about tonight.
Obviously, we've been talking about fertility and birth rates and things like that.
But population politics, carrying capacity, population-environment balance, this is really, to me, your signature calling cards.
And The Vanishing American Dream, this book we've been profiling all hour, touches on these topics as well.
What do those terms mean and why are they important?
Well, carrying capacity is maybe one of the most important terms.
That means how many people can be sustained in an area of firm.
And if you exceed the carrying capacity, you end up degrading the environment so that in the future, even fewer people will be able to live there sustainably.
And I'll give you an example.
When people first went out to Iowa and started to till that rich farmland, the topsoil they found was sometimes to a depth of 12 feet, imagine 12 feet.
But it has been plowed and the humus is gone.
And sometimes windstorms have swept away the dry soil.
Sometimes it will rain, the heavy rain has washed it away.
And in places now, the topsoil is less than one foot, even six inches.
So that's what I mean by degrading the environment.
You can also wipe out worldwide about 50, there are 17 principal fisheries worldwide, and about 15 of those fisheries are degraded to the point that the fish stuck in them, for example, have fallen to a number below which they are not replacing themselves.
Now, that's what I mean by degrading the environment.
And when you have more people depending on a resource than the resource can renew itself to accommodate, then you degrade it.
We're in that position now in the United States.
Ecologists have figured that we can sustainably support in this country 150 million to 200 million people.
You know, the current population is at least 330 million people.
We have way exceeded the carrying capacity of the United States.
And people will, well, we already are paying for it.
Droughts, the aquifer, the underground water that took millennia to accumulate is being drained faster than it is renewed so people can no longer irrigate in some parts of the country.
For example, California, which has been such the Central Valley, been such a very rich agricultural region.
But to drive through there now and see acres and acres of fruit trees that are withering because they can't get the water to them.
The aquifer is no longer sufficient, and the reservoirs are no longer sufficient to irrigate that land.
It's just extremely sad.
But water is one of the first things that is obviously in short supply in this country in certain areas, which are agricultural areas.
So we are in deep trouble because we have too many people relying on the resources, the natural resources of this country.
We've exceeded the carrying capacity.
So that's one term you suggested, I explain.
And by the way, look up the organization carryingcapacity.org, which will tell you a great deal more.
And then you mentioned fertility.
Well, when demographers talk about fertility, they mean the number of children that the average woman will have in her lifetime.
That's a different meaning for fertility than is used in medicine.
In medicine, it means the capacity to actually have a child or in the man's case, to fertilize the egg.
That would be fertility in the medical sense.
But in the demographer's sense, it's the number of children per woman on average.
And I don't know if there were other terms you wanted me to talk about.
I'd be happy to do it.
Well, the only other thing I had, and I know Keith Alexander wants to have a final shot with you as well.
This has been a fast hour.
Always great to host you.
I just want to say that again.
But population environment balance, I think we basically probably covered it with that.
I mean, obviously, the environment is going to be degraded if you have a population that exceeds sustainable levels.
Keith, let me add this and ask you about this.
It would seem that our elites don't want to learn any lesson about the sustainability of what they're doing.
Rather, they should be discouraging immigration based on the fact that we have 330 million people for a nation that ought to be sustaining maybe at the maximum 200,000.
200 million.
Right, 200 million.
Why are you thinking of doing this?
I think it's power.
I think there's a certain sense that somehow this country has got a sense of you've got to grow, baby, grow, baby, grow or die.
That's wrong.
That's absolutely wrong.
If we keep growing, we're going to kill ourselves.
We have to stabilize population, have a sustainable number on the resources.
A very rich land we have, but it's not.
And trying to squeeze out any part of the population, in particular, like white people.
Oh, I'm not ready to go there.
I think that they've gone crazy with supporting some sectors.
And of course, it is a zero-sum game also.
So supporting some sectors has an effect on the sector that we represent.
And I guess it's a negative effect.
But I'm not so sure that all of them exactly understand what they're doing.
Some of them do.
But I don't think it's some of them do.
And I believe they think it makes them more popular because it's the thing to be right now at a time when crazy things like critical race theory, for example.
But there's so many crazy theories out there like new monetary theory, just also crazy.
There seems to be a lack of common sense.
And you tell me where that comes from.
Well, my father used to say back in the 60s to explain his becoming a Republican, he said, I didn't leave the Democratic Party.
The Democratic Party left me.
The Democrats in particular seem to have abandoned any semblance of representing white people.
They want to represent the coalition of the others.
And the Republicans are putting up no resistance to it.
And that basically white people voting for Republicans are voting for people that will not defend their interests at all.
And all of it, and immigration is a perfect example.
They just did not have enough black people or Native American people to displace it.
So they decided to bring in people from the third world to do it.
Well, Keith, you set the stage for what would have been a fantastic fourth hour if only we had one.
But we do in a way.
Scoop Stanton's coming up next with Walter Yerku.
Stay tuned for that.
For Virginia Abernathy, Gene Andrews, Keith Alexander, I'm James Edwards.
Dr. Abernathy, thank you so much for being with us tonight.
I'm going to give you a call tomorrow.
We've got some other things to talk about.
You know what they are.
And I'll talk to you then.
Thank you for tonight.
I know the audience enjoys it, enjoyed it as they always do.