July 30, 2021 - Timcast IRL - Tim Pool
02:04:38
Participants
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| Speaker | Time | Text |
|---|---|---|
|
unidentified
|
Hey Ian! | |
| Yes, Tim. | ||
| How would you define martial law? | ||
| When the military authority overrides civil authority. | ||
| What does that mean? | ||
| What does that mean? | ||
| Basically, the generals start calling the shots. | ||
| The generals start calling the shots? | ||
| Or the commander, the president, yeah. | ||
| Where do you get the definition from? | ||
| That was just off the top of my head, based on what I've known through video games and history. | ||
| What if the military gets deployed to enforce special non-civilian law? | ||
| Is that martial law? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Ooh, wow. | |
| Sounds like it. | ||
| So let's say they suspend civilian law, impose special laws, and then the military comes to enforce those special laws. | ||
| Yeah, that sounds exactly like it. | ||
| You think it's martial law? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| According to at least one report that I was reading from the U.S. | ||
| government, we cited on TimCast.com, martial law requires a military commander to assume authority to create or execute laws. | ||
| And so what's happening in Australia doesn't officially count as martial law. | ||
| Though many people are saying it is because the military has been deployed in Sydney To enforce the lockdowns, and that's one way of putting it. | ||
| The other way to put it is Australia has called in the military to suppress protests against the lockdowns. | ||
| It's getting hot, to say the least. | ||
| We've got a bunch of other news, too. | ||
| I mean, on top of that, in the United States, there's talk of vaccine mandates for federal employees. | ||
| Now, I believe the firefighters union is saying no to this. | ||
| The postal workers union is saying no to this. | ||
| There's talk about maybe a national mandate in general, and now the White House is pushing back saying, no, no, no, we're not going to do that. | ||
| It's not going to happen. | ||
| The New York Times has come out with a story saying vaccinated people can spread the Delta variant just as easily as unvaccinated people, which has sparked a major controversy as the White House and other officials are claiming the New York Times is fake news and they're publishing misinformation. | ||
| And then the Washington Post published something similar, so... Hey, YouTube! | ||
| I don't know what's true anymore, so I'll just say whatever YouTube says in their official rules is the truth, and talk to your doctor. | ||
| Well, we'll talk about this. | ||
| And we'll talk about what's happening in the political landscape, what's going on with this and these other countries. | ||
| And we are being joined by a professor of political science, Wilford Reilly. | ||
| Great to be here, Gus. | ||
| Will the beast. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Woof. | |
| Do you want to just briefly introduce yourself? | ||
| Yeah, I'm Wilfred Reilly. | ||
| I'm an associate professor of political science at Kentucky State University. | ||
| I'm probably a bit better known as the author of the books Hate, Crime, Hoax, and Taboo. | ||
| And I'm glad to be here live with you guys tonight. | ||
| Right on. | ||
| I'm pretty sure I've cited your book and some of your writings before on, you know, talking about hate crime hoaxes and things like that. | ||
| So. | ||
| A good logical move. | ||
| Yeah, absolutely. | ||
| Absolutely. | ||
| That's why you're here. | ||
| And we'll talk about a lot of what's going on. | ||
| Of course. | ||
| I just asked Ian a question. | ||
| He's sitting here. | ||
| That was exciting. | ||
| That was exciting. | ||
| That intro there? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| How would you define martial law? | ||
| Um, I think that the simplest definition, because you're going back in political science over different sorts of civilization, would be the military taking over day-to-day administration, deciding whether or not you get to do regular, ordinary things. | ||
| I mean, definitely some of the COVID policy in, for example, Australia, I mean, is approaching that level where you see, I mean, you know, tanks moving around in the streets to prevent people from coming outside and that sort of thing. | ||
| So it's a flexible definition. | ||
| I could get into some really eye-glazing wonkery here. | ||
| It depends on the legal code in each one of those countries. | ||
| But in essence, the law that governs the military, what's in that fat green book they give you in the army, governs the civilians. | ||
| The army's running the country. | ||
| There is, though, in the U.S., they say, civilians will not be tried in military tribunals or military courts. | ||
| So it's basically just, at least as the U.S. | ||
| defines it, or has in the past, commander takes over, asserts nearly supreme authority, and civilian law is suspended. | ||
| Well, we'll get into all that stuff. | ||
| Ian, welcome. | ||
| Oh, yeah, yeah. | ||
| Well, hello. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Thank you. | |
| Lady's pressing all the buttons. | ||
| I am also here in the corner. | ||
| I'm very excited for tonight's guest. | ||
| He's exceedingly eloquent, and I'm really looking forward to what he has to say. | ||
| So, welcome, everyone. | ||
| Professor. | ||
| Yeah, I'm excited. | ||
| Before we get started, head over to TimCast.com. | ||
| Excited to meet you, too. | ||
| Before we get started, head over to TimCast.com, become a member, and you'll get access to exclusive members-only segments of the TimCast IRL podcast, as well as an advertisement-free experience on the website. | ||
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| That helps support our work and keeps the lights on and keeps more and more journalists coming in. | ||
| Let's talk about this first story we got here. | ||
| Oh, wait, wait, wait. | ||
| I'm sorry. | ||
| Smash that like button. | ||
| Subscribe to this channel. | ||
| Share the show with your friends. | ||
| There we go. | ||
|
unidentified
|
There we go. | |
| Yeah. | ||
| All right. | ||
| Here's the first story we got from TimCast.com. | ||
| Australia sends their military to enforce coronavirus lockdowns in Sydney. | ||
| NPR reports the military's help is needed to enforce the restrictions because a small minority of people thought the rules didn't apply to them. | ||
| New South Wales Police Minister David Elliott told Australia's Channel 9. | ||
| Australian Prime Minister Scott Morrison has come in for heavy criticism in recent weeks over the slow pace of vaccinations in Australia, where about 14% have been fully dosed. | ||
| One of the poorest records among any member country of the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development. | ||
| So when they say a small minority thinks the rules don't apply to them, did they mean by that 86%? | ||
| Because that doesn't sound like a small minority to me. | ||
| Now here's the fascinating part. | ||
| Of course they're bringing in the military. | ||
| Morrison said, if you get vaccinated, there will be special rules that apply to you. | ||
| Why? | ||
| Because if you're vaccinated, you present less of a public health risk. | ||
| You are less likely to get the virus. | ||
| You are less likely to transmit it, the Prime Minister told reporters on Friday, according to the Sydney Morning Herald. | ||
| Well, now, according to the New York Times and the Washington Post and the Daily Mail and many other outlets, You are not less likely to transmit it. | ||
| So I don't know. | ||
| That's what they said. | ||
| I'm not gonna say they're right. | ||
| I don't know what YouTube's rules are. | ||
| They're all crazy. | ||
| I will point this out though. | ||
| You may have noticed in the past week there were crazy protests. | ||
| Do you see these? | ||
| There's crazy protests all over Sydney. | ||
| Thousands of people were in the streets in Sydney and like London. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Um, this is not about a small minority of people that are defying. | ||
| This is about thousands of people in the streets. | ||
| Chaos erupts in Sydney as anti-lockdown protesters clash with police. | ||
| There was another story that said basically the same thing. | ||
| Chaos in Sydney because regular people were going on with their lives as though there was no lockdown. | ||
| So what did they do? | ||
| Chaotic, huh? | ||
| People just continue to do their thing. | ||
| So what did they do? | ||
| Deployed the military. | ||
| Yeah, I mean, so first of all, I think there's a lot of competition in this race, in these lanes, but Australia seems to have had one of the craziest reactions to COVID-19 of any major state. | ||
| I mean, I don't ever want to give incorrect figures, but the day-over-day rolling death average there is, it's below nine, I know that. | ||
| It's an extremely extraordinary... I think it's way lower. | ||
| Yeah, it could be. | ||
| That's the most liberal estimate I've ever heard sort of past year. | ||
| The vaccine is available. | ||
| The thing with COVID-19 is that not everyone is at equal risk from COVID-19. | ||
| I mean, that's mundane as hell, but it bears repeating. | ||
| I mean, Tim, you pointed this out to me before the show. | ||
| I mean, the total number of people under 40 that have died from COVID, 9,000 or something like that? | ||
| It's like 9,700 and something. | ||
| I don't have the full numbers, but it's in the 9,000s. | ||
| Yeah, the total number of individuals under 18, at least in the USA, because we keep hearing about the children that have died from or with COVID-19, is under 600. | ||
| It's 331. | ||
| Yeah, that's a population of 75 million. | ||
| So, I mean, the question with Australia is, have they gotten most of their seniors and their very vulnerable people vaccinated? | ||
| I happen to know they have. | ||
| I mean, that's where they targeted that first chunk of vaccine that got up to around 15% | ||
| of the population. | ||
| So the question is, can you keep healthy, younger people that are mostly at very low | ||
| risk of death, frankly, from COVID-19 or even hospitalization at home for months and years | ||
| at a time to prevent nine deaths a week or whatever? | ||
| I guess max that number per day in a country the size of California, Texas. | ||
| I would say no. | ||
| I mean, that seems utterly bizarre in terms of how we look at liberty. | ||
| There's a, well, do they have any there? | ||
| A lot of people are making the joke that's like, ah, former penal colony. | ||
| Ha ha. | ||
| Okay, well, you know. | ||
| Perhaps, I guess? | ||
| You know, I was thinking about this, and maybe there is something to that. | ||
| We, as Americans, fought for our independence to win it. | ||
| People in Australia, it was part of, you know, I don't know the full history of Australia, but you know, penal colony. | ||
| I don't know their full, the numbers for Australia, I can only really speak to the U.S., but I will say that there was this viral video that was, I just put it, crazy and hilarious, I suppose? | ||
| It's a news report of Australia, where they're like, one person has been infected! | ||
|
unidentified
|
Oh yeah. | |
| We'll be locking down for the next month! | ||
| And it's like, wait, what? | ||
| It's like, wow, people have gone really over the top with this stuff. | ||
| I tell you, I see some of these stories, and I'm like, if there was anything... If I was trying to advise any of these people to, like, discourage vaccination, I'd be like, keep doing what you're doing, this is a great... No, they're trying to get people to get the vaccine. | ||
| But they're just doing basically the opposite. | ||
| You think when you have 14% of your population getting vaccinated, sending in the military is going to make them think you have their best interest at heart? | ||
| Nah, the opposite. | ||
| Because you go this route, there's no turning back. | ||
| Now you have dedicated yourself to authoritarianism, you have sacrificed your trust and credibility, where can you go after that? | ||
| Well, I mean, you can go some ugly places, but actually, this is to me by far the most disturbing thing about COVID-19. | ||
| I mean, the things that the citizenry has allowed to be kind of placed on the table. | ||
| Um, so even before the vaccination, I mean, in, in the USA, something like 2.8 to 3.1 million people die every year. | ||
| I mean, that's, that's damn close to 10,000 a day. | ||
| It's eight or 9,000. | ||
| So even at the peak of COVID-19, I had no objection at that time to wearing a mask. | ||
| I actually got one that works, which most people didn't, but you're not seeing a devastating world ending plague. | ||
| Like, even at the peak of COVID-19, there's no evidence, really, if you look at the Western European studies, the major pieces that were actually published in journals, that lockdowns worked better than sort of well-done NPI. | ||
| You know, stay home if you feel sick, quarantine the sick, clean your body, that kind of thing. | ||
| But now with the vaccine out, and in most of these countries, including Australia, the truly vulnerable vaccinated, you're seeing these utterly bizarre moves. | ||
| Like, what you described is a factual situation. | ||
| There was one infection, and correct me if I'm wrong, but that wasn't a death. | ||
| That wasn't a hospitalization. | ||
| I don't know the full news story they were talking about, just like some viral video where they mentioned a guy got infected. | ||
| Someone got sick, and I think he was hospitalized, but they're not dead and they're not going to be. | ||
| And so they locked down 900,000 people. | ||
| That's New South Wales. | ||
| I mean, that's a region that's roughly comparable to one of the Dakotas. | ||
| It's a huge state, decent number of people in it. | ||
| I think if this is possible in reaction to that level of risk, like one, let's say, death means 900,000 incarcerations for three months, it would be very, very difficult for these Western societies to do anything functional going forward. | ||
| Not even the stereotypical war with China, but what are we going to do about climate change? | ||
| Like, this stuff's not off the table. | ||
| Like, I foresee climate lockdowns being a very real possibility. | ||
| They've already talked about it. | ||
| Masks next flu season. | ||
| And at some point, people are just going to have to say, no, I'm going to vote for the conservative party or even the libertarians or whatever is necessary to... Crazy stuff. | ||
| Whatever is necessary to kind of get this... You should not stop living your life because someone else might die. | ||
| That way lies a society with no cars, you know, so on down the line. | ||
| Some people do think this is the climate lockdown. | ||
| We saw very early on, after a couple weeks of the lockdown, the New York Times posted that story saying the Earth is healing. | ||
| And people started talking, a bunch of articles emerged about pollution and everything clearing up. | ||
| And then a lot of people said they're probably exploiting the crisis because they have the climate change agenda. | ||
| But then, you know, I wonder... First, you know, I'll say this. | ||
| I don't trust the powerful political establishment and elite. | ||
| They claim climate change is a disaster, but they buy beachfront property and things like that. | ||
| So, part of me wonders, though... We talked about this the other night with the windshield phenomenon. | ||
| Have you ever heard of that? | ||
| Uh, no, no, I haven't, frankly. | ||
| frankly. People have started to notice that when they drive their cars, there's | ||
| less insects than there used to be. | ||
| And so it's called the windshield phenomenon. | ||
| And they've done studies where they found like an 80 percent reduction in over | ||
| over from 2017 to 2021. | ||
| I think that's what those are the dates. | ||
| Yeah. They found a reduction of 80 percent in insect populations hitting | ||
| windshields. And a lot of people think that what you can get grants for in | ||
| science, by the way, is absolutely amazing. | ||
| Bro, I mean, that's got to be at least a million dollar project. | ||
| Well, sure, sure. | ||
| A waste of money. | ||
| And not a waste of money in terms of doing the study, though. | ||
| But you know they wasted money when they did the study. | ||
| It's like, how much money do you need to drive the car back and forth for four years? | ||
| A million dollars. | ||
| Because we're going to hire someone to drive... | ||
| We're going to do this driving in Barbados, home of the next American, you know, etymological association conference. | ||
| Right, right, right. | ||
| Yeah, but but isn't there something that's scary to that? | ||
| And, you know, that's what I'm worried about. | ||
| What if what if there is an ecological collapse? | ||
| And that's why they're they're actually locking everything down. | ||
| I mean, would we want to just. | ||
| You know, eat and fart ourselves to death like yeast in a bottle? | ||
| Or would we need some collective action to stave something off? | ||
| Or at the worst, are there ideologues who believe a doomsday scenario who have seized the reins of power and are imposing their cult-like ideology over everybody else? | ||
| That's a fascinating, a bit of a leading question there, something we're both skeptical about in our leadership around the world. | ||
| But in reality, so there are a couple of different elements to this. | ||
| First of all, I am not a conspiracy theorist because I think most people are stupid. | ||
| I mean, we're both from Chicago, I believe both from that South Side area. | ||
| Oh yeah, where by? | ||
| I was born in the Bridgeport area of the city. | ||
| Oh, okay. | ||
| I moved north to Wicker Park pre-gentrification. | ||
| I went to St. | ||
| Mary's. | ||
| Oh, wow. | ||
| Midway. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| Yeah, yeah. | ||
| And I lived in Bridgeport for a little bit. | ||
| By Comiskey, right? | ||
| Or by U.S. | ||
| Cellular Field? | ||
| Yeah, that's right down there. | ||
| That's all that. | ||
| That's White Sox country. | ||
| That's right. | ||
| I have family in that whole, like, Chatham, Bronzeville, that whole area sort of black and Irish and south side of Chicago. | ||
| That's right. | ||
| Now I, like I said, I personally claim the north side. | ||
| I went to, I was in Wicker since I was like a little kid. | ||
| I moved to, I still have a house in East Aurora, like the traditional sort of Latino and Eastern European area of that city. | ||
| So another blue collar area right nearby, an hour away now, but. | ||
| And what were you saying? | ||
| You think people are dumb? | ||
| Yeah, well, that's the point. | ||
| Hey, what are you saying about Chicago? | ||
| No, but that's the point, though. | ||
| I mean, like, even watching people I knew in high school try to sell coke in Little Italy or East Aurora or something, I mean, the percentage of those guys who went to jail is like 65. | ||
| I don't think that there are actually functional behind-the-scenes cabals where you have one Arab guy, one Nigerian guy, one French guy, two Americans and a Brit that are secretly trying to control The economy of the world or something like that. | ||
| I do think you have groups. | ||
| I mean many of the things that people say in sort of conspiratorial conversations like Skull and Bones at Yale or Bilderberg group actually exist. | ||
| You have groups of rich people that clash with one another and pursue different agendas just like you have groups of upper middle class people that do this or media individuals. | ||
| But I do think like First, there was a weird sort of climate porn that you saw in the mainstream media for a while, where you'd see these headlines like, whales have been spotted in such and such a canal. | ||
| It's like, that's because there aren't any goddamn people. | ||
| But they've taken all the ships out of the normal shipping lanes. | ||
| People are on lockdown. | ||
| That's not a positive. | ||
| The best of these articles, either from COVID or within the couple of years before, was The Guardian, why Genghis Khan was good for the environment. | ||
| Because he killed so many people, you see that the smoke from the Cook Fire stopped the planet cold. | ||
| Are there some other people they would like to make those claims about? | ||
| I don't think so. | ||
| Well, I think that today, I don't think there's a conscious attempt to usher in a climate lockdown because of COVID, but last sentence, kind of getting to the point here on my end, I think that the bigger issue is that the people that are running a lot of American discourse have the same solutions to everything. | ||
| This is, so if you notice the climate solutions, like we need to pursue a more socialist, generous policy of XYZ, are the same as the COVID solutions, and the same as the proposed solutions to our race crisis. | ||
| So I don't think the issue is so much what the key that opens the door is, it's kind of what comes through. | ||
| Like, all of these things are being used by people that want the same agenda, to a certain extent. | ||
| It's a standalone complex, we often say. | ||
| It's not a conspiracy. | ||
| It's a bunch of people of similar ideology working in a similar direction because they believe similar things. | ||
| Maybe. | ||
| But when you look at the Pareto distribution of, you know, basically almost everything in existence, you get the extremes at the very top and at the very bottom, but these extreme Wealth of file. | ||
| Powerful people. | ||
| Maybe this is see, I don't have any data to back this up, except that, you know, you look at sociologically. | ||
| There are times when the very, very few will will coagulate at the top. | ||
| And I wonder if there are a small group of people that have been organizing this since. | ||
| I mean, you look at the way the Federal Reserve was built by like eight guys at Jekyll Island. | ||
| That was crazy. | ||
| Creepy story. | ||
| True, but I think the issue of the creature from Jekyll Island. | ||
| Right. | ||
| I think the issue with that, though, is that at the simplest level in political science, about half of the rich disagree with the other half. | ||
| I mean, that's why there's this extraordinary kind of back and forth of like, well, you're funded by the Koch brothers. | ||
| Well, you're funded by George Soros and the sciences. | ||
| I mean, you have the Chinese billionaires that unexpectedly are kind of coming in often on the right side of things, politically. | ||
| I mean, on the other hand, you have the moon men, these tech bros that are currently flying around in space. | ||
| So I don't think there's one unified position that people are advancing across, say, great wealth to try to move the world forward. | ||
| I think that there are some positions that are more influential than others because one group of sort of coastal, upper middle class, urban, big city, mostly leftist happens to control the media, social media, and academia in the USA and Britain in particular. | ||
| So there are ideas you see more often than you see other ideas and I think that that is The climate panic is one of those, but I don't think in practice a Governor DeSantis or somebody is necessarily going to back that actually happening, or the billionaires in that state are going to. | ||
| You're familiar with the journo lists? | ||
| Have you ever heard of those? | ||
| Not journalist, a journo. | ||
| Like, journ-o-list. | ||
| It was a list, it was a web list of journalists that all communicate with each other. | ||
| Oh yeah, yeah, this is... This is a good example of, I guess, I don't know, it borders on conspiracy in a sense, in that they would all share stories and then agree on them because they were all in the same chat, and then all of these outlets would publish the same stories. | ||
| Well, to clarify, I don't think conspiracies don't exist. | ||
| Actually, to talk to kind of the audience for a second, if you don't think there are wealthy, powerful people behind the scenes that sometimes collab together to do things that would get you arrested, you're a fool. | ||
| I mean, even at my little level, I'm a member of the lower, upper class, and I'm often contacted by friends from the U of I Law, for example, or Freedom Fest, which I just attended. | ||
| Great event, but pretty high-level stuff. | ||
| Media figures. | ||
| Do you want to work on this? | ||
| Let's keep this low-key for now. | ||
| We're going to trip them from behind with this one. | ||
| And I would only imagine what Prince Harry's inbox looks like. | ||
| So of course there are conspiracies in that sense. | ||
| The question I guess really is just when it crosses the line to the crazy scenarios a lot of the left and the hard right seem to believe in. | ||
| So like for example my email list right now is I think 8,000 people. | ||
| Nothing crazy but 8,000. | ||
| Most of them are journalists of some kind. | ||
| They're mostly on the center right. | ||
| I'm pretty sure I could create a story if I happen to find out some piece of information about a crooked politician. | ||
| The The only reason that's annoying when you look at the journal lists or a lot of the, I mean, there are a whole, like jobs that are left is still up on Google where they advertise all these left-leaning activist jobs. | ||
| And it's one network of people, many of whom don't admit they're left-leaning activists. | ||
| So the issue with that, I think is the pretense of neutrality, right? | ||
| So if there's anybody from say CNN or NPR on, on the message, the listserv that that's very ethically problematic. | ||
| I think both you and I would say, like, I'm heterodox, maybe center-center-right politically. | ||
| I think the government's a bunch of scumbags. | ||
| Like, I have a set group of opinions. | ||
| I'm pretty open about them. | ||
| If you say I'm a neutral reporter for NBC and you are taking talking points from, you know, a junior operative at the DNC that you're sleeping with who's the person ahead of you on the journo list... Oh my. | ||
| No, but I mean... Are you talking about a real person there? | ||
| Uh, no, of course not. | ||
| A gentleman would not say such a thing. | ||
| But I mean, like if you, and that actually is, I have someone in mind, but they don't work at NBC and it's not particularly relevant. | ||
| I know who you're talking about. | ||
| Maybe. | ||
| But anyway, but anyway, like the, the point of all this is that if you go on the air and you're saying this BS, this goes for the right as well. | ||
| Like all these guys talking about chastity until marriage is critically important. | ||
| Lock the door, Javier. | ||
| You know, like, if you're doing that, there's a significant ethical issue with that. | ||
| I think that's really the only point. | ||
| There are many conspiracies behind the scenes. | ||
| Journalists have opinions. | ||
| And, you know, I used to think that we would try to have journalists keep their opinions to themselves so they could just do the job and not cause strife. | ||
| But I think that that era is long since passed. | ||
| You know, because the difference in opinions now is fundamental worldview. | ||
| Where someone's opinion is literally them saying, I support the Constitution. | ||
| And someone else's opinion saying, I oppose it. | ||
| And I'm like, well, hold on there a minute. | ||
| Like, we've got a very, very distinct difference of worldview on this. | ||
| It used to be a journalist could say something, well, of course I support the United States and the Constitution. | ||
| That was not controversial. | ||
| Now it is. | ||
| So now, if you came out and said, I believe America should enforce its immigration laws, you're right-wing. | ||
| That's one of the ways they've tried accusing me of being a conservative, is that they're like, Tim Pool has defended conservative claims about immigration in the United States. | ||
| I'm like, what does that mean? | ||
| Bernie Sanders was pro-border barrier in 2008, and in 2015 he said no open borders. | ||
| Just because he went farther left doesn't mean I moved. | ||
| But that's where we're at. | ||
| I mean, you can literally just say something innocuous and it's literally conservative because the left has become so extreme and revolutionary, I suppose. | ||
| Yeah, and I also think this moves in cycles. | ||
| I mean, like, I'm a hip-hop kid, and I remember the moral majority in the 1980s, although Tipper Gore was part of this, but, like, chasing rappers and hard rockers through the halls of Congress, you know, asking two live crew what a coochie was. | ||
| Like, just this ridiculous, embarrassing crap. | ||
| I mean, just... | ||
| You know, and so that sort of thing, like, had they gotten their way, we wouldn't be talking about parental warning labels on rap or rock CDs. | ||
| We'd be talking, or, I mean, imagine EDM, Cruella, and all that. | ||
| You'd be talking about that not being available on the market, like, Get It Wet would be available only as, like, a download from some pirate site, same with a DMX or Jay-Z album. | ||
| So that was the right overextending, and I think we've definitely seen the pendulum swing back into complete lunacy. | ||
| This is one of the things that I noticed a lot when I wrote Taboo specifically, | ||
| because some of it was intended to be edgy, like, oh, let's take on the alt-right, let's take on BLM. | ||
| But like the immigration chapter, I thought was just completely neutral. | ||
| Like at one point, I think my description was, we should let in | ||
| sane, reasonably able-bodied, non-criminal immigrants capable of getting jobs, | ||
| which might involve some kind of basic IQ or aptitude test. | ||
| It's like, well, wouldn't it? | ||
| And people started describing this as sort of a far-right proposal. | ||
| Like during an interview, someone asked me if I would let in disabled women with AIDS. | ||
| And I said, I mean, I kind of danced around the question, but it was just sort of, | ||
| I wouldn't prioritize that as an immigration policy, Like, there's an element of amoral common sense that you kind of need to exist as a healthy adult, and I think to some extent we need to get back to | ||
| Let's say morally rational shared common sense, like the country's flawed, but if you openly fight against it, we're not going to say that you're the highest form of patriot. | ||
| This is one of the biggest problems we have right now. | ||
| A far right, in the colloquial sense, opinion on immigration would be shut down. | ||
| Actually, I think it's repatriated. | ||
| Repatriation, is that the right word? | ||
| So you actually see these opinions on the internet where people who are very- All the time. | ||
| Yeah, they're like, send them back. | ||
| Like, but they live here. | ||
| It's like, don't care. | ||
| It's like, okay, that is weird. | ||
| Like, they moved here. | ||
| They got citizenship. | ||
| And you're like, nope. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Cut him off. | |
| All right. | ||
| Then you've got a right wing opinion of we should, you know, a further right, we should lock down the borders. | ||
| No more immigration. | ||
| Then you've got the right, we should have sound immigration policy, and then you have | ||
| like a center right where it's like, well, we're okay with refugees and asylees. | ||
| Then you have the center where it's like a similar position. | ||
| You start moving to the left and they're like, open up the borders, increase the numbers. | ||
| If you entertain the centrist position of, like my position literally where they claim | ||
| it's conservative is, I think we should allow legal asylees, refugees to come into this | ||
| country and we should help them. | ||
| There should obviously be some limits so we don't get exploited, like people who might come from Africa to Brazil and then try and come here. | ||
| That's a lot of questions. | ||
| I've got questions about that. | ||
| But Cuba and Mexico, like, yeah, by all means, let's figure this one out. | ||
| That's conservative. | ||
| Well, I mean, I do think you need to get into some of the technical definitions. | ||
| I don't necessarily think, without mocking your position, that you'd be an asylum seeker from Mexico in any kind of real political sense. | ||
| This was one of the things that struck me, because I took some time off from standard academic writing while I was working on the books, and coming back into this debate, people were starting to use the term asylum seeker for Economic migrant. | ||
| Yeah, but people coming from countries like, in terms of a lot of the groups in Chicago, Mexico, Poland, Guatemala. | ||
| Guatemala actually would be one of the Central American countries that we're supposed to feel the most sort of heart-rend for. | ||
| Honduras, Brazil, Costa Rica. | ||
| Costa Rica is a pleasant country. | ||
| It's amazing. | ||
| It's a great place. | ||
| Pura Vida. | ||
| It's where they filmed Jurassic Park. | ||
| Great food. | ||
| I mean, it's just, but the idea that someone who's a Tico from Costa Rica is a Refugee is absurd. | ||
| I mean, right, right, right. | ||
| But so I mean, it's just, but that's what I mean. | ||
| Like, I'm talking about, let's say there's somebody who lives in a border city in Mexico, and they run afoul of some gangs or something. | ||
| And then they're like, what do I do? | ||
| And so they jump, you know, they go to the border, they go and say, they're coming for me, what do I do? | ||
| OK, well, that person, we don't want to die. | ||
| I mean, it'd be if someone came in my house screaming and panting and threatened to help call the police, I'd call the police. | ||
| But that's that's that's not the majority. | ||
| So it's like what you said. | ||
| The left has started calling all of them asylees, refugees. | ||
| AOC, did it legal? | ||
| Asylees have broken no law. | ||
| And then Homan was like, yeah, they did. | ||
| They violated this law. | ||
| And he reads it off. | ||
| Yeah, so there are certain circumstances where I can absolutely understand. | ||
| Like, if a guy's being chased and he runs through the river or whatever to escape, it's like, all right, well, you know, I don't know what to say to that guy. | ||
| Like, get safe, you know what I mean? | ||
| But what we're seeing is people from Africa flying to Brazil, traveling up through South America to the U.S. | ||
| border. | ||
| We're seeing people from these South American countries moving up, coming to America. | ||
| I'm like, dude, they're economic migrants. | ||
| They get turned away. | ||
| Well, I mean, I think... Not anymore, actually, not anymore. | ||
| The first question in response to even kind of the moral component of that would be, like, if I grew up in Baltimore, do I have the right to seek asylum in Japan? | ||
| That's what I'm talking about. | ||
| No! | ||
| Yeah, I mean, there's an element of... So, like, looking at this point by point as a political scientist, like, if you're in Mexico... First of all, if you're in Mexico and you're engaged in a violent gunfight with the cartels, you're very unlikely to be a taxpayer. | ||
| I mean, like the old American mafia, there are some brutal abuses of women and so on in Coyote roles, but it's very unlikely that the cartels and, say, a group of policemen are, without any negotiations, going to challenge each other to the kind of fighting that requires one of the policemen to flee here. | ||
| If that happens, sure. | ||
| I mean, the border cities of Mexico are extremely violent. | ||
| They're shooting us all the time. | ||
| Yeah, well, I mean, there are shootouts in American cities, too, actually. | ||
| I mean, like, Baltimore has a higher crime rate than most of the cities on the border. | ||
| I guess what I'm saying is most of those shootouts involve the equivalent of gang violence. | ||
| Right. | ||
| But, I mean, so, at risk of being, like, thought cold, there are a bunch of solutions here. | ||
| Like, first, you can move, but then Mexico. | ||
| Mexico actually has funds that are dedicated to helping people get away from gang and cartel warfare, as we do, by the way. | ||
| I mean, we have massive witness relocation programs and so on. | ||
| So, I mean, I think that would be my first step if I were a Mexican citizen and patriot that was having this problem. | ||
| I mean, at another level, like we could let people into the country that could document this. | ||
| I mean, I guess improved version of a polygraph test, like there'd have to be something almost unpleasant to go through. | ||
| But there'd have to be a period during which you could stay in the country. | ||
| You could have, for example, a one-year protective visa if you're not a traditional refugee. | ||
| People forget this, by the way. | ||
| Refugees and TPS recipients are supposed to go back when the crisis is over. | ||
| So I think a lot of this stuff on the left becomes the endless extension of compassion, | ||
| where you see people that were displaced by, for example, that awful earthquake in Haiti, | ||
| which is a legitimately terrible thing, but 15 years later are still in the USA and are | ||
| not oppressed. | ||
| I mean, many of the, not necessarily Haiti, but many of like the black Caribbean states | ||
| are island paradises. | ||
| I mean, Bermuda, Bahamas, Barbados, they have incomes on par with the USA. | ||
| So guys would be here running stores and things of that nature. | ||
| I appreciate anyone's desire to hustle and get a better life, but that's the same explanation | ||
| people give for selling weed. | ||
| If you come here from Mexico or Bahamas, in 99% of cases, you're not an asylee. | ||
| That's a far right opinion though. | ||
| Yeah, I mean, well, okay. | ||
| I'm far right on this issue. | ||
| Like, almost everyone in the country. | ||
| I mean, I mean, like, media-wise. | ||
| Like, I'm not literally going around saying, like, simply having a position where you're like, hey, how does this make sense? | ||
| I think it has a lot to do with, I guess, tribal psychosis. | ||
| That people are so desperate to climb their, claw their way to the top of the social order on the left, that they're constantly one-upping their opinions and accusing the other people of being impure. | ||
| So you get some person who, like, ten years ago was on the left and was like, I agree with Bernie Sanders. | ||
| Well, by that standard today, you are a far right, you know, individual. | ||
| You're a nationalist. | ||
| You're evil. | ||
| All the really awful words they'll use for you. | ||
| How are we supposed to have a functioning political ecosystem if one side has no moral system or framework or principles? | ||
| And it's just, I'm going to say the most extreme thing possible that moves me further and further in one direction. | ||
| One of the things that I think actually is that there are almost no people that actually believe this stuff. | ||
| I think you see the massive influence of, again, the lower-upper class, coastal, urban, very specific, mostly white, liberal block on sites like Twitter and Insta. | ||
| I mean, so, obviously that famous piece came out, I think, Wired, that found out that, what was it, 15% of Americans are on Twitter at all? | ||
| Yeah, I think it's 22% of Americans are on Twitter at all. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| And it's like a smaller percentage. | ||
| 10% are responsible for something like 80% of the viral tweets. | ||
| So you've got, let's say 2.2, 2.3% of the population that's driving this discourse. | ||
| And a lot of it, it's very disproportionately, first of all, until pretty recently, it was also very disproportionately annoying alt-right. | ||
| Pepe's and Gruyper's and so on. | ||
| Although they cut out some of them. | ||
| But they haven't cut out their opponents. | ||
| So I mean, extremely SJW heavy, a lot of TRAs, a lot of trans rights activists, so on. | ||
| A lot of positions that almost don't exist in mainstream America. | ||
| And I think it's important to keep that distinction up. | ||
| Like, these people influence the discourse that goes into kind of Yeah, mid-level journalism. | ||
| Like, if you're on Twitter and you have more than 10,000 followers, you're very likely to also contribute articles from time to time to, say, Jezebel or something like that. | ||
| No particular hate for them. | ||
| So you have a lot of this seen in, like, urban youth life, and it seems like it's very prevalent. | ||
| But if you ask people, like, should immigrants be able to read or something like that, like, you'd see a massive, massive yes versus no in America. | ||
| Let's say you've got a hundred cities with a hundred people in each city. | ||
| In each city is one socialist. | ||
| Whenever there's an election, the Socialists vote Socialists, and it accounts for 1% of the vote, and everyone ignores it. | ||
| Then along comes the Internet. | ||
| And now you have a city-sized Socialist community online, because the one Socialist from each of the 100 cities now forms a massive community on Twitter, where it seems like, wow, look at all of these people! | ||
| It's like the size of New York! | ||
| It's the size of a city! | ||
| And then you're like, oh, it's just one person in their bedroom in these different places. | ||
| The problem is, it really does have an impact. | ||
| These big brands will get harassed by this community, and then they'll issue a public statement on TV to tens of millions of people about how they now agree with this fringe belief, and they apologize for not seeing it sooner. | ||
| And the problem is, it is true, very few people use Twitter. | ||
| But Twitter does have influence, hilariously, it's stupid, and regular people don't speak up. | ||
| So you'll be ruled by that 2%? | ||
| Well, unless we start speaking up. | ||
| I mean, and what you see, like, I mean, your platform obviously is on par. | ||
| Like, I looked at the ratings for most of the major primetime cable news shows on MSNBC and CNN the other day, actually posted this to Twitter, and most of them get less engagement than I do on Twitter. | ||
| I think Don Lemon was at 570,000 engagements either per day or per week. | ||
| It must be per day. | ||
| It must be. | ||
| But I mean, And scrolling up all the way up to Tucker Carlson was like three million a day. | ||
| But the simple reality is that most of the Temcast interviews I've looked at have a million, a million and a half views. | ||
| I think that when people start talking and saying things that are obviously true, that kind of break the gaslight, you'll find that the other 98% of people want to listen to them. | ||
| And that's why there's this fanatical attempt to do two things. | ||
| One is to label people in the most ridiculous way possible, like Joe Rogan or Jimmy Dore as Nazis. | ||
| And in reality, these are cats that are all across the spectrum. | ||
| Matt Taibbi and I actually, one of the first times I was on Twitter, we were arguing about BS for a while because he's, I don't even know if he remembers, but he's significantly on the left. | ||
| Absolutely. | ||
| Glenn Greenwald, yeah, they're great journalists, but I mean, it's Barry Weiss, who was the editor of the New York Times like a week ago. | ||
| I mean, but the first argument is like, Barry Weiss, Glenn Greenwald, what the hell do they know about journalism? | ||
| Just a bunch of alt-right Nazis. | ||
| It's this attempt to kind of just shuffle foot off the stage and pretend nothing happened. | ||
| But the second and more troubling aspect of this is the attempt by conventional media to take the actual internet kids off of social media. | ||
| And replace them with kind of AAA versions of conventional media shows. | ||
| That's very definitely something happening. | ||
| When I look at YouTube, you see suggestions from CNN on the sidebar. | ||
| So this is what I was going to bring up. | ||
| I can pull up the ratings Thursday for all these different cable channels. | ||
| And in the key demographic, 25 to 54, CNN loses easily to Timcast IRL. | ||
| However, when you take into account all of their viewers, you've got 8PM Anderson Cooper | ||
| with 774,000, you've got Cuomo with 861,000, Don Lemon with 716,000. | ||
| And so they're doing really well among a lot older people, which says a lot about what | ||
| will happen with shows like this moving forward. | ||
| Perhaps people will age out and, you know, then CNN will become less and less relevant and more people watch shows like this. | ||
| But the one thing you need to understand is that I can sit here and say, look how great this show is, look how many viewers we get. | ||
| Because their TV ratings are in the gutter. | ||
| And then YouTube puts CNN on the front page. | ||
| They put MSNBC on the front page. | ||
| And CNN gets something like 150 million views per month, relative to our 20. | ||
| So we may be beating them on TV, but YouTube is mandating viewership of their trash. | ||
| And it's funny, when you see their videos, all thumbs down. | ||
| Everybody hates it. | ||
| It doesn't work for the platform. | ||
| It doesn't work for what YouTube is. | ||
| You can't put TV on YouTube and think it'll work. | ||
| Yeah, no, but I think that this is kind of like the old Russian division between Pravda and Samizdat. | ||
| I mean, so there are 150 million views of CNN, perhaps on a daily basis, if you're counting YouTube's Front's piece, and I'm sure perhaps airport lounges and so on. | ||
| But how many of those people are actually watching CNN and absorbing political content from them and taking it seriously? | ||
| I'll stop real quick. | ||
| Sorry. | ||
| 98 million. | ||
| So CNN's down substantially. | ||
| That's like half from where they were a few months ago. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Okay. | |
| All right. | ||
| Well, that's a monthly basis figure. | ||
| Yeah, 98 million views for the CNN YouTube in the past month. | ||
| Not to mention, CNN does have network channels as well, so all the peripheral YouTube channels, you know, they get their views as well. | ||
| They gain 100,000 subscribers per month. | ||
| I mean, we get like 10,000. | ||
| My Twitter and YouTube engagement last month, it was, if I recall correctly, 34 million. | ||
| That was mostly due to RTs from larger accounts, but I mean, I don't mean to mock at all. | ||
| I'm loving the undisclosed location. | ||
| Great group of guys to talk to. | ||
| But I mean, we're both kind of guys with computers. | ||
| So I mean, when you say like, okay, well, CNN is 10, you know, 10% in the lead over | ||
| me and 80% in the lead over you, Riley, like both of us can just go home and make another | ||
| video on our laptops. | ||
| Like they're spending millions of dollars to produce this crap that barely beats out. | ||
| And there's so many other people in that, in that space. | ||
| I mean, from Ben Shapiro to Clara Lehman or Brett Weinstein on the other side of that | ||
| to, but, um, uh, reaction from leads to one of those, but I mean, to obviously Joe Rogan, | ||
| you know, Adam Carolla, I mean that all these, all these people aren't the same Larry Elder | ||
| on kind of the black, right. | ||
| But many of these content producers are outpacing the major shows on network news. | ||
| And all you have to do is go upstairs and talk into your computer. | ||
| I mean, one of my most watched videos, again, my mind in general, aren't at that alone, | ||
| I mean, so anyone now can become, given any reasonable amount of training and honor, but can become a journalistic resource. | ||
| So that's what the mass media is terrified of. | ||
| Last comment here, they're not taking quote-unquote conservatives offline because you and Jimmy Doran aren't conservatives in the first place. | ||
| They're taking threats offline. | ||
| So like the one time, I'm center-right personally, but I tried to look at this honestly once, and like that month the majority of the people deplatformed. | ||
| Like Chapo Trap House, You Owe Blacks Trillions, like the funny reparations page, Cop Block, one of the oldest libertarian party accounts. | ||
| That's on YouTube or what? | ||
| This was I believe on Twitter. | ||
| It was on Twitter, Reddit, and in most cases YouTube. | ||
| That's when they took Chapo Trap off Reddit. | ||
| But I mean like Chapo Trap House is to say the least not a conservative site. | ||
| Right, right, right. | ||
| But it was becoming a threat to the media, the dirtbag left brand and the dirtbag left | ||
| hoodies and the jokes and the comments about the CIA probably didn't help out. | ||
| So they ain't there anymore. | ||
| But it's not just a conservative liberal thing. | ||
| It's a threats thing. | ||
| Yeah, I mean, the Chabot still exists. | ||
| They're the number two most subscribed to Patreon account. | ||
| Great, I'm glad to hear that. | ||
| Yeah, so they're still, you know, prominent. | ||
| I don't know what their... It's interesting, there's like a weird... | ||
| The podcast ecosystem, it's hard to actually track. | ||
| It's very different from TV. | ||
| With TV, we look at the ratings, we know what's going on. | ||
| With podcasting, I mean, our biggest platform is YouTube. | ||
| We get a decent amount, we get 80, 70 or 80% of our podcast views or listens or whatever on YouTube. | ||
| And then we do decently well on iTunes and Spotify. | ||
| I think We are a top 250 on iTunes. | ||
| There was a period where, like, my main show was actually really high up, because I was working every single day. | ||
| We took that down. | ||
| But you can't actually track who's successful. | ||
| Like, I don't even know where Chopwood Trap House registers on this. | ||
| I know they have a lot of diehard fans. | ||
| But they might have 36,000 people who are paying to get their special content. | ||
| But that might be the Everyone who watches their show. | ||
| Or it could be substantially more. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| When you look at TV, nobody pays for that for the most part. | ||
| I mean, some people might pay for a cable package, but CNN is effectively given to you like they make you watch it. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| Like you mentioned airports. | ||
| Yeah, it's state media. | ||
| It's literally the media program that runs in the airports that are funded by branches of the government. | ||
| They canceled that. | ||
| They canceled that. | ||
| The CNN airport is gone? | ||
| Gone. | ||
| Gone. | ||
| But probably still hotel lobbies, I guess. | ||
| Are we going to see, like, Fox Airport? | ||
| It would actually be really funny to see Newsmax Airport. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah, they should go for it. | |
| Not really any more or less reliable than MSNBC, but, like, I'd like to see it for a couple months. | ||
| Try it out. | ||
| That's my favorite thing about the media. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Let me tell you about Biden! | |
| This guy's screaming. | ||
| I love it when they're like, OAN is a conspiracy site. | ||
| And it's like, bro, did you do you watch your own channel? | ||
| Like, have you seen the things you've said about Russia? | ||
| Nah, these people, uh... They're something special. | ||
| Actually, I wanna pull this up. | ||
| I wanna pull up, uh... No, not this one. | ||
| Where's the other one? | ||
| Okay, we're gonna pull up this one. | ||
| We're gonna start with this story here. | ||
| I gotta do this. | ||
| I got a special disdain for big tech social media, so this is something that's been going viral for a while. | ||
| There is a link to the CDC.gov. | ||
| It is the CDC's website. | ||
| If you post this link, Facebook will flag it as fake news. | ||
| Facebook, because they've given the ability to third-party fact-checkers who are crackpot wingnut conspiracy theorists, have labeled the CDC as fake news. | ||
| Here it is. | ||
| Look at this. | ||
| This is a post from Facebook that I posted. | ||
| The website is cdc.gov slash ccellsdlslocs20217212022 labalertchangescdcrtpcrsarscovid2testing1.html. | ||
| There you go. | ||
| There's some other stuff in there if you want to actually get the link. | ||
| The link is just them saying they're encouraging sites to update their PCR tests to better tests. | ||
| A third-party fact-checker flagged it as fake news. | ||
| And so a bunch of people have done this. | ||
| And it shows you the extent to which the media is broken. | ||
| Who in their right mind was given the authority to flag the CDC as fake news? | ||
| What am I supposed to say on YouTube? | ||
| Oh, YouTube, don't ban me. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| Facebook flagged me. | ||
| This is what happens when you have a crackpot broken media. | ||
| That people just keep saying, I trust the science, I believe the media. | ||
| They just believe whatever they're told until it just goes full psycho. | ||
| Now we're in this really crazy space, where the news is changing so rapidly, because there's so much contradictory information coming up, and coexisting at the same time, that people are writing contradictory stories at the same time. | ||
| So, the example I gave the other day. | ||
| Let's say Fauci comes out and says, you gotta wear two masks! | ||
| And the next day he says, no I didn't mean it, you don't gotta wear two masks. | ||
| That information... Changes in the viral environment have prompted a very necessary revision of policy by the leaders at the CDC. | ||
| Well, so here's what happens with these two nearly concurrent contradictory statements. | ||
| MSNBC might see the statement, you gotta wear two masks. | ||
| An hour later, Fauci says, no, no, I was mistaken. | ||
| I mean, the real story is like a day later. | ||
| But let's say an hour later, he says, no. | ||
| Fox News then publishes, Fauci says, not to wear two masks. | ||
| MSNBC and Fox could publish those stories at the exact same time. | ||
| And then the leftist will see MSNBC, the conservative will see Fox News, and then they'll both be at a bar and be like, why are you wearing two masks? | ||
| Why aren't you wearing two masks? | ||
| My story says, my story says, information overload. | ||
| It's too quick and people can't figure out what's the latest and newest information. | ||
| Now it's come to the White House where we have the story from the New York Times. | ||
| Check this out. | ||
| The New York Times says, breaking news, the Delta variant is as contagious as chickenpox and may be spread by vaccinated people as easily as the unvaccinated, an internal CDC report said. | ||
| But then we get this guy, Ben Wakana, in all caps, Vaccinated people do not transmit the virus at the same rate as unvaccinated people. | ||
| And if you fail to include that context, you're doing it wrong. | ||
| And then people are like, who do I trust? | ||
| The government or the New York Times? | ||
| Well, now someone could write an article citing Ben saying the claim is not true. | ||
| Then someone could write something claiming the New York Times, this is true. | ||
| And now we have political factions choosing which one they think makes more sense instead of knowing who to trust. | ||
| Yeah, I think that's absolutely correct. | ||
| The one piece of advice I will give to an intelligent young audience would be go check for yourself. | ||
| I mean, you can go to the CDC website and see what their data actually is and whether the Times reported on it, honestly. | ||
| Nobody does that. | ||
| Yeah, everybody should. | ||
| For a lot of the things I report, like The national crime rate, for example, where there's this huge argument, which I've never understood, but a big back and forth on the internet between, like, black guys, working class white guys, Arab guys who might be suspected of terrorism, so on. | ||
| Like, who commits the most crime? | ||
| You can find out. | ||
| Like, the government publishes the crime stats every year. | ||
| Ah, well, if you tweet those crime stats, you'll be banned. | ||
| Not really, actually. | ||
| I've done it a bunch of times. | ||
| It's not something I've ever seen flagged anywhere. | ||
| Oh, yeah, um, there was, uh, who was it? | ||
| Was it Tommy Robinson, I think, in the UK? | ||
| Oh, okay, that makes sense. | ||
| They don't have any rights. | ||
| Well, yeah, but this is Twitter banning him. | ||
| Twitter banned Tommy Robinson, I believe it was Tommy Robinson, and Majid Nawaz, who is, like, not a fan of Tommy, defended him, saying he published factual data from, you know, crime statistics. | ||
| Twitter does not care. | ||
| It's a disparaging comment. | ||
| I've seen that happen once or twice. | ||
| I mean, for example, Andy Ngo pointed out at one point that there was no epidemic of violence against transgender women. | ||
| Of color. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| The rate of violence against transgender people, I actually wrote an article about this for Quill at once, because one, if there actually is a hate crime epidemic, you want to stop it. | ||
| But two, I strongly suspected that most shooting or stabbing victims would be young working class men, about 50% people of color, because we know that, because that's the crime data. | ||
| But anyway, so I looked at this and actually found the rate of violence against transgender women is lower than the rate of violence against just men, along with a bunch of other groups. | ||
| Blacks, poor whites, so on down the line. | ||
| But Andy said that. | ||
| I think he cited the article and he said, and if you're a trans woman of color, the person most likely to kill you is black. | ||
| It's not going to be a white supremacist. | ||
| It's going to be a jilted lover or something like that. | ||
| And he was banned for a couple of days. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Right. | |
| But those are the only two cases I've ever seen. | ||
| I mean, in general, if you cite the BJS crime report, like in academic Twitter, that it's extremely widely known that men have a higher crime rate than women. | ||
| African-Americans, at least before you adjust for age and social class, have a higher crime rate. | ||
| When you tweet the racial component, tons of people get banned for this all the time. | ||
| It's the way you frame it. | ||
| In the past, if you saw that 60% of the crimes were committed by black men, it doesn't mean that you're more likely to have that happen in the future, just because that was the rate of the past. | ||
| Doesn't mean that that's the likelihood of the future. | ||
| So that, I could see, could be looked at as like, he phrased it wrong, he incited... Right, right, right. | ||
| But it's just... I get it. | ||
| I don't want to have a semantic argument. | ||
| In terms of what's going on with the censorship, a better example is Dave Rubin. | ||
| Did you see what happened with Dave? | ||
| Yesterday, yeah. | ||
| Or two days ago. | ||
| And what did Dave say? | ||
| No idea, honestly. | ||
| He got a suspension from Twitter. | ||
| He got suspended. | ||
| Not to interrupt you, but I think this is more on topic. | ||
| It's all on topic. | ||
| Dave tweeted that, in his opinion, the vaccines aren't doing what they were promised and now they're talking about booster shots. | ||
| They are talking about booster shots. | ||
| Dave then, when he came back, he cited the source. | ||
| And then there's a story from the Washington Post where they say the viral load among people who are vaccinated, it's comparable to those who aren't. | ||
| And that was Surprising to people. | ||
| Essentially confirming what Dave said. | ||
| He got suspended on Twitter for saying, and one of the problems is, this is why I showed this post from, I want to pull this up again, from Facebook where they flagged the CDC as fake news. | ||
| The reason the CDC got flagged as fake news is because the data changes so rapidly. | ||
| And so this story comes out, and then people start citing it, and then some other people cite it in probably incorrect ways, and so they say, all right, this link is now off limits. | ||
| But you know what's crazy? | ||
| The video of Fauci saying not to wear masks from last March, from March of 2020, still up. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Hmm. | |
| Yeah, I think so. | ||
| Actually, I think that there's a broader problem here that's being illustrated. | ||
| So when I say, you know, tons of academics cite this and there's no, there's no risk of removal. | ||
| And you say, well, I know a bunch of people, some academics, some pundits that have been removed. | ||
| A bigger issue is the total unreliable unreliability and BS nature. | ||
| of all of these social media policies. What accounts for the difference? Probably which | ||
| single guy at the director level at highest was looking at that post from Riley or Poole or Rubin | ||
| or whatever at that day? Because when people say things like Taiwan is... It's not a director. | ||
| Well, it's a junior staffer then. No, no. These are... | ||
| These are outsourced to tracking farms in India. | ||
| These are people who sometimes don't even speak English. | ||
| A stronger version of the same argument. | ||
| I've actually talked with people who have done this work with Google and Facebook and things like that and they say That there will be someone, you know, in, say, India, who's going through the rules and trying to figure out what's bannable and what isn't, and that's why they have so many mistakes. | ||
| Yeah, no, I've had actually this same conversation. | ||
| I'm fully prepared to accept that it's true, by the way, just an enhancement of the same thing. | ||
| When I started teaching CyberSec back in, like, 2016-17, we had people that were execs in the tech world talk to either me or the students, to at least some extent, and their comment then was it's generally, like, post-college, junior staffer types, If something is really controversial, like a discussion of child pornography, the manager in the room might come take a look at it. | ||
| But one of the things with- Like right now. | ||
| Like you just said it, so now someone at YouTube probably got a notification. | ||
| Maybe. | ||
| I mean, well, I think we're- It's true. | ||
| They have a kiosk. | ||
| Mm-hmm. | ||
| where they, so this is what, I'm not gonna name which company does this or did this, | ||
| but there were more than one, they showed me this. | ||
| Live streams are very dangerous for any one of these companies, | ||
| because with a video that gets uploaded, algorithms can search them to make sure | ||
| there's not specific kind of content within that video. | ||
| So they check for language, you could demonetize, it might get instantly banned. | ||
| With live streams, they never know what's coming next. | ||
| So what a couple of companies have done is they have terminals showing hundreds of live streams | ||
| at any one moment, and they have people watching them. | ||
| Flicker, yeah. | ||
| And they look for key phrases to be said or words to be said, and then when they see it, | ||
| they pull them over to the side, line them up, and then they get the boss to come in. | ||
| We've had our chat suspended before. | ||
| One thing I do want to say about this, though, you have had some of these things happen because you're extremely well known in the internet space. | ||
| Big data is a lot stupider than most people think it is. | ||
| I mean, when people say things like, if you're on a pirate site and you click on a file, they can figure out your IP address. | ||
| I mean, my IP address is the Starbucks in Frankfort, Kentucky, if hypothetically I would ever commit such an evil sin. | ||
| Yeah, but your MAC address too. | ||
| No, but generally MAC stops at the router. | ||
| You use Tor. | ||
| MAC stops at almost every router. | ||
| The router is Starbucks. | ||
| So it's actually very easy. | ||
| We're both pretty familiar with computers. | ||
| It's not hard to spoof this crap at all. | ||
| I actually don't think we're disagreeing here. | ||
| One, I think Big Data's real. | ||
| Like, obviously, first of all, there are probably multi-flagged personalities like Nero back in the day on Twitter that these boys would love to take down. | ||
| So I'm pretty sure that like Poole, Rogan, maybe five or six others might be on a board with people that are at that higher level just looking for mistakes. | ||
| Like, for example, I would be very careful to say transgender women during the show. | ||
| That's actually what I would say during polite conversation anyway, but I mean, it's just, if I were to say something else, who knows? | ||
| And we actually, as I have with all large-scale media, Tucker Carlson, we had this conversation before the show. | ||
| But I don't think in the majority of cases, big data is all that good. | ||
| I mean, you have someone speaking their second language in Bajalapur. | ||
| Looking at, what would it be per person? | ||
| 35,000 accounts on a daily basis or something? | ||
| So in general, you have a contradiction where there's a mass amount of all of the content we could describe. | ||
| I mean, including actual accounts for jihadist groups all over social media. | ||
| But there are also people that constantly get sanctioned and punished and so on. | ||
| It's the same way the cops know who the bad kids in town are or whatever. | ||
| But the key point is that, last sentence, nobody knows what the hell the rules mean. | ||
| It's almost impossible to get in touch with these companies. | ||
| I actually once got so irritated with Twitter, I was trying to fix some problem with my account, that I asked on my Twitter, does anyone know the actual address from their initial IPO, the emails and so on they had to list? | ||
| It's a good way to get this stuff, by the way. | ||
| And I got it. | ||
| I worked in that Salesforce trading floor space for a while. | ||
| We use these tricks all the time. | ||
| But nobody knows who to talk to. | ||
| Nobody knows what the rules are. | ||
| It's a problem. | ||
| We are entering a new kind of... What's the right word? | ||
| It's neo-feudalistic in a sense. | ||
| There's a noble class. | ||
| There's the modern landed gentry. | ||
| And that is to say a few things. | ||
| We were just talking about, you know, you can't call YouTube. | ||
| You can't call Twitter. | ||
| You can't call Google. | ||
| Okay. | ||
| Well, I can. | ||
| Because this is the way the society is starting to function, that you have followers, you have notoriety, then all of a sudden you find out that people are calling you and you have email addresses and they're here for you all of a sudden. | ||
| You find out that if you get bad service on an airline and you've got 10,000 followers, well you might get a response, but what's that? | ||
| You got 100,000 followers? | ||
| Oh, now you're flying first class and they're apologizing. | ||
| You get a million followers and now you're on that global concierge list. | ||
| This is where we're going. | ||
| So for me, actually for other people, I get messages from people and they say, hey, yo, Tim, I had a video get demonetized. | ||
| Do you have any idea what I can do to get it fixed? | ||
| And I'm like, honestly, I don't. | ||
| You can try tweeting at Team YouTube. | ||
| They try to get things sorted. | ||
| And it's fairly effective for a lot of people, interestingly. | ||
| Social media is an easy way to connect. | ||
| So now we know their handle and we can send them a message and they can see it. | ||
| And some of these channels are moderately large. | ||
| When I get demonetized, I hit up Google. | ||
| I send an email right away and they say, sorry about that, no problem, you got your sorter right away. | ||
| Sometimes they go like, we're not giving you this one for this or that reason. | ||
| When the Alex Jones episode got taken down... So here's the first thing. | ||
| I hit up Google and I said, are there any people that we have that are outright no-nos for YouTube, like you would ban us for simply having? | ||
| He said, no. | ||
| And I was like, so here are the people we would like to have on the show. | ||
| And they're like, absolutely no problem. | ||
| And then I said, okay. | ||
| And then they take the episode down. | ||
| And I ask them why, and they say, we won't tell you. | ||
| So I'm like, so I have no idea why they're taking it down. | ||
| So it's not- This is what I'm talking about, by the way. | ||
| Right. | ||
| But I'm actually talking to them on the phone. | ||
| I'm on the phone saying, you can't even tell me what we did. | ||
| And they're like, we don't know. | ||
| Because the people who chose this were higher up than we are. | ||
| So it's almost like this neo-feudalist thing where They are creating classes of people. | ||
| The average person you can have your account maybe will ban you. | ||
| A lot of the accounts that are getting banned and getting censored are small, and this is why you don't see it in the media. | ||
| The left likes to say cancel culture isn't real because these celebrities still are rich or something. | ||
| But what they don't realize is that 90% of those who got suspended and deleted for a political opinion were someone with 50 followers or 100 followers. | ||
| And now they're IP banned, they can't get back on the service, and they're like, okay, whatever, I guess. | ||
| So the lower class individuals, in terms of the social hierarchy, the social credit score, whatever they're building, will have no access to Facebook, will have no one to message, will simply say, please, and they'll say, bug off, we don't care, and then the people who have prominence are given access. | ||
| It's a combination of, they'll look for you to make sure they're worried about your social influence, but also, when it comes to Facebook, I know people. | ||
| Like, I know people in the news industry and they say, here's the email you need, Tim. | ||
| Don't worry about it. | ||
| Regular people don't have that. | ||
| So now we're seeing this weird world where people are desperate to have followers because it makes them feel like they can finally get access to systems and be treated fairly. | ||
| Yeah, I will say also, when I mentioned coming from the sales or trading floor space, there are a whole variety of platforms. | ||
| I mean, back in the day, it was Manta, Lead411, so on, Instant Checkmate works well now, where you can pull up the contacts for the executives at most companies, including some of the social companies. | ||
| Like when we got genuinely irritated at Twitter, we started, I mean, I started doing that. | ||
| So, I mean, you can look at IPO filings, you can look at who the listed executives online | ||
| are. | ||
| I mean, it's possible to contact, at one point I called Mark Cuban during a job at the company | ||
| Marcus Evans, like all that stuff's easily available. | ||
| Like you can, if you do get one number, you can call into the company and just sort of | ||
| dial off. | ||
| Seven's the mail room. | ||
| You know, I had this number on a corporate reference for Jack Dorsey. | ||
| Look, I don't have a lot of time to waste here. | ||
| Can you tell me what his number is? | ||
| Don't need to sell a secretary's fine. | ||
| Whatever. | ||
| And it works. | ||
| Most of the people I've known that have a similar financial background haven't had a lot of issues with these companies. | ||
| But of course, I mean, to some extent, this is just saying what you're saying. | ||
| Like, yeah, you're a stockbroker for 10 years. | ||
| You probably get in touch with them, too. | ||
| Again, there are two levels here. | ||
| One, it's generally not that hard to break the rules of the law and not get caught. | ||
| At the most basic level, like if you're IP banned, I mean, which is a real thing, like you can just download Tor and your IP will be Fiji. | ||
| If you have 50 followers on Twitter, it wouldn't be hard to get back on Twitter and be a troll. | ||
| Frankly. | ||
| But again, the question is, should you have to do that? | ||
| I'd prefer to see, when we talk about politicians potentially regulating these brands or sparring back and forth with them, one thing that I would like to see is just a common sense demand that these rules be illustrated. | ||
| What does this mean? | ||
| What is hate speech? | ||
| What do you mean you can't tell me who my prohibited guests are? | ||
| This happens all the time. | ||
| Well, there's no prohibited guests, but they won't tell me what was said that got the video flagged again. | ||
| We can only make assumptions about what we think was actually said. | ||
| And so when I said to them, listen, we'll make clips from the show and we'll remove whatever you said was against the rules, and they said, we won't tell you. | ||
| And I'm like, well, what do you want me to do? | ||
| You got to keep in mind, they all have the ability to ban anyone at any time, as per their terms. | ||
| Every social media site has that in their terms. | ||
| That's got to change. | ||
| It's time for some... Will Chamberlain's got it. | ||
| He's a smart fella. | ||
| He knows. | ||
| When Dave got suspended, he said Dave should go into a courtroom, get an injunction, get his account turned back right on. | ||
| Turned right on. | ||
| I think you're going to see people starting to do that. | ||
| It's the same thing. | ||
| There was an entire genre of legal cases in the 80s and 90s, as you guys probably know, where people started talking about non-traditional property, like the right to receive welfare benefits if welfare happened to be legal in their state. | ||
| And it's the same thing here. | ||
| Do you have some right not to have, what is Dave at, three, four million followers and your financial livelihood taken away on a whim? | ||
| I'd be interested in seeing what a judge says about that. | ||
| I mean, there, there has to be some element of contracting there. | ||
| I mean, has he entered into an advertising deal with YouTube or Twitter? | ||
| Has he ever made them a dollar? | ||
| Because then, I mean, you have, what is it, offer acceptance consideration? | ||
| Dave, Dave just launched a book and they suspended him. | ||
| I believe it was when his book, around the same time his book is coming out. | ||
| Okay. | ||
| I'll say straight up, if this was the day his book was coming out, they suspended his | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| account, that he should take the first hour of sales, as soon as he was able to promote | ||
| on Twitter, calculate his losses based on the 12 hours, and then say those are the damages. | ||
| Because he would have been able to say, hey, my pre-order's available now, here's my new | ||
| book, tweet. | ||
| They suspended him, and he didn't violate any rules. | ||
| They claimed he did. | ||
| And not only that, I think Dave should file a defamation suit because they claimed that he put out medical misinformation, but Dave was citing the Washington Post and I think it was Click Orlando. | ||
| I'm not sure what the other site he meant. | ||
| CNN. | ||
| It was CNN and Washington Post. | ||
| And he's like, what did I, I posted these, these articles. | ||
| Like it was, it was a statement based on this. | ||
| They claimed it was misinformation, in which case that's a false statement of fact. | ||
| So he should at least try to sue, and the damages are that his new book is coming out and they're shutting down his means for promotion. | ||
| This is a platform where people pay to get access to share information. | ||
| So if Dave has built up that access, which creates the content which drives advertisement to the platform, I think it's time people start firing off these lawsuits saying, you can't do this. | ||
| But they're allowed to ban anyone at any time. | ||
| He signed that terms of service when he made an account. | ||
| Right, but what you don't understand is I'm arguing that That has to change, and it changes with suing. | ||
| So precedent will be set, for instance, Twitter defamed Dave Rubin. | ||
| See, one of the problems they have is that they could have just said, no reason, we banned him for fun. | ||
| And they may start. | ||
| They didn't. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Maybe they should. | |
| They've done it to other people. | ||
| They've suspended people and put no reason at all. | ||
| It's just like, you've been suspended for blank. | ||
| With Dave, it was misinformation. | ||
| I believe it was, you know, I don't wanna get sued either, but I believe it was misinformation, I could be wrong. | ||
| And Dave could say that's just factually not true. | ||
| James O'Keefe is suing, specifically because they claim- That's good, I'm not surprised by that. | ||
| Right, he was- I mean, he's the master of it. | ||
| They said he was operating multiple accounts, so he said, that's fake, that's a lie, it's a false statement of fact, and I'm gonna sue you. | ||
| And that was a big mistake, because now he can go for discovery and get internal communications on what they've said about him and his organization. | ||
| So, Dave should sue. | ||
| Yeah, the one question, by the way, in terms of your point, I think it's a good one when you say, well, they're saying that they can get rid of you for the legal language would be any reason or no reason at all. | ||
| So even if you sue and you prove that you were defamed, you might get some money damages, but they can still likely keep you off the site. | ||
| I think the issue there is, is that what's called an unethical adhesion contract? | ||
| Like, can you sign a deal with a company that is going to give you the chance to make tens of millions of dollars where they can take all of your money and all of your followers away at any time? | ||
| I don't, I mean, law school was a while ago, but I would have some real questions about whether you can. | ||
| I would have some real questions about, now that these sites are growing into serious businesses, whether you can do some of this junior varsity crap. | ||
| Like, for no reason given, remove someone from your platform permanently and take their entire follower count away. | ||
| That sounds very questionable. | ||
| I mean, that's going back to the early days of Facebook, when people had a hundred friends. | ||
| Not only that, but there's an expectation based on the rules they set. | ||
| So of course they say you can be terminated for any reason. | ||
| We reserve that right. | ||
| But there is still an expectation that these are the rules you have to follow. | ||
| And so long as you follow them, you are within bounds of being on the platform. | ||
| Dave broke no rules. | ||
| Yeah, but you don't need to break rules to get booted off those. | ||
| They can just ban you at any moment. | ||
| Right, so the issue is, is it an unfair contract? | ||
| Definitely. | ||
| If I said to you, Ian, you can come here and do all this work, and then have a great opportunity, and so long as you don't say a naughty word, you're fine. | ||
| And then one day, after you've been working here for a long time, I just kick you out the door. | ||
| And you're like, but I didn't break any rules. | ||
| Eh, it doesn't matter, it's my house. | ||
| like a right what is a right to work state what i mean is it there are certain contracts that are | ||
| unenforceable right so uh non-competes in many states i don't know if you went to law school | ||
| you said yes i did yeah like non-competes are unenforceable and out of states right | ||
| that's my understanding yeah so the there are contractual terms that are generally not enforceable | ||
| An open non-compete clause extending beyond a certain short period of time often is. | ||
| I'd have to look at the case law. | ||
| But the issue here I think would be more what's called an adhesion contract, where if you sign a contract with a player like your camera company, when you look at the back of the box of a piece of tech equipment, the terms and conditions go on for 16 printed out pages in a couple situations I've seen, and at the end you check your X and you submit. | ||
| If that contract were to include something like, if this piece of equipment breaks, you owe us $1,000, or something completely ridiculous, that wouldn't be enforceable, because it would be understood that that's nonsense that the person with more power put into the text of the deal. | ||
| Like, that would be disputed as very unsympathetic. | ||
| And I think, I don't know, I actually think your point's a really good point, but I think social media, My actual reaction is, come on bro it can't work that way. | ||
| Like, even with me at like 40,000 plus maybe like 20,000 on different other platforms, like... | ||
| That's, I've been, my books have made bestseller lists. | ||
| Like it, if you were just to say, okay, we're going to take these 60,000 people away and we're going to set up some kind of permanent ban so that you, I mean, I could, or you could easily, but the average citizen couldn't get back on the platform. | ||
| That's just total BS. | ||
| Like it's, it's you having the power position in the contract doing something that's probably illegal. | ||
| So like, I couldn't sign a contract with you. | ||
| Like Tim couldn't sign a contract that says, if you want to work here and be say a video engineer, I get to punch you in the face twice a day. | ||
| Because it would be a manipulative use of power position. | ||
| I got a better example. | ||
| I couldn't say, Ian, you can come work on the show, and to work on the show you obviously have to be in the house, and I can evict you from the property without notice at any time. | ||
| That's actually against the law. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| When it comes, it literally is. | ||
| It is because there's a, there's a separate law that regulates eviction | ||
| in every state, not to jump in. | ||
| I, that, that's actually a solid point. | ||
| And that actually kind of gets to the point here. | ||
| Like, are there other laws, for example, that protect, protect against say, | ||
| undo deprivation of income is a claim you might be able to bring. | ||
| Like if a company just says. | ||
| Like any company could do this. | ||
| Like, I just got a fairly new vehicle. | ||
| Could Mercedes or BMW say something like, if you miss one payment on your car loan, or better yet, if you miss one maintenance trip for your vehicle, we take the vehicle back? | ||
| Can you just say any kind of ridiculous thing in a contract when you're selling a product someone else really needs? | ||
| Often, no. | ||
| Not only that, but typically repossessions are forfeiture. | ||
| So if you have a car and you don't pay your loan payment for two months, they may say, we're going to move to repossess the car because you're delinquent. | ||
| Typically, it's not usually two months. | ||
| You can actually just tell the repo guy, it's my car. | ||
| You can't take it. | ||
| I'm challenging this as a civil dispute. | ||
| And they can't take it. | ||
| A lot of people don't know that. | ||
| So the repo guy shows up and they go, OK. | ||
| And the repo guy says, you got it. | ||
| And that's the game they play. | ||
| In fact, you can just call the police and say, I'm in a civil dispute, you can't take my property. | ||
| And they'll say, that's right, you can't. | ||
| So in this instance, I wonder if, you know, you mentioned about undue deprivation of income. | ||
| I think the eviction thing is an interesting point. | ||
| There may be laws that people haven't looked at or realized that you're entering into an agreement that grants you some kind of access to a system. | ||
| So it's almost like, at the very least, We created laws to protect tenants for a reason. | ||
| And maybe we can view social media accounts as us as tenants on a platform. | ||
| We are using it to run a business. | ||
| Considering a lot of the economy is now digital, especially with the way YouTube does superchats and the way people run their business on these digital platforms, we are effectively tenants of these platforms, and we have a contractual agreement. | ||
| But they can evict us without notice immediately? | ||
| Hey man, when you have a business or a house you at least get 30 days and you can file a suit to argue why they can't do this to you, Now, Dave Rubin can be on this platform, creating entertaining content and informative content that builds up an audience on the platform that makes them money, providing a service to them, and then without notice, without due process, they kick him off for a false reason, and defame him in the process. | ||
| Imagine if your landlord came to your house, and you had a pizza shop, and they put up a big sign saying, this pizza shop puts Dookie in their pizza, and then called the cops and the cops came and kicked you out. | ||
| We got to remove defamation just for the argument's sake because they can remove you for no reason. | ||
| So I think that's worse. | ||
| I'm saying specifically in the case of Dave Rubin equate it to if Dave was running his business in a physical location, he'd have legal protection. | ||
| One day they just evicted him without notice. | ||
| One day Dave walks to his pizza shop and he shows up and the building's empty and all of his stuff is out in the street, soaking wet in the rain. | ||
| Or they would keep the stuff. | ||
| I mean, the stuff you make at that, in their job, is YouTube's content. | ||
| I mean, as far as I know, this is YouTube's video right now, right? | ||
| Better yet, better yet. | ||
| Dave walks one day to his pizza place to open up, but, you know, he's got to get there at 9 a.m. | ||
| because they open up for the early lunch, and all of his equipment has been crushed and mutilated and destroyed, and it's a permanent destruction of everything he's built and everything of value, because Twitter followers and accounts do have a market value. | ||
| It's been calculated by companies. | ||
| Companies pay money for the equivalent of reach. | ||
| And they say to him, the least said we can do whatever we want. | ||
| We have laws saying you can't do that for obvious reasons. | ||
| Because this would, it's disruptive to the economy. | ||
| As we're moving into a digital economy, how can we have that people build their business on YouTube? | ||
| Mumkey Jones deserves a shout out whenever this happens. | ||
| Mumkey broke no rules. | ||
| Mumkey made, Mumkey Jones had a channel. | ||
| He had 300 and something thousand subscribers. | ||
| It was his business. | ||
| It was his life. | ||
| He dedicated years to building that business and he broke no rules. | ||
| He was given no warning and everything was destroyed overnight. | ||
| At the very least, I understand the argument. | ||
| They say in their contract they can do it. | ||
| Well, certainly there should be a law saying they can't because it's undue deprivation and it's eviction without notice. | ||
| I think we need a monkey broke no rules shirt. | ||
| That's a great phrase. | ||
| Monkey broke no rules. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I don't know anything about this guy, though. | |
| He made a lot of really edgy content, and he pushed the envelope in a way, but he didn't break the rules. | ||
| Those people are tough. | ||
| As an admin, those people are tough to deal with. | ||
| When they get around the rules, that's why we put in clauses at mines anyway, we can remove anything at any time, because people would be so snaky with the rules to get the most disgusting stuff in front of people, in front of kids, it's crazy. | ||
| So I will say that it's arguable that the content he made was distasteful to a lot of people, but how about they just say, hey guy, this one video you made, we're gonna take it down. | ||
| But then he did it over and over and over. | ||
| No, they didn't do that. | ||
| They banned him without even giving a single strike. | ||
| One day, all of a sudden, his channel was just gone, and they banned his second channel, which was, like, anime reviews or something. | ||
| It was brutal. | ||
| It was brutal. | ||
| I understand the strike system. | ||
| I understand the warning system. | ||
| And if you see three-plus strikes at once, you ban the account upright. | ||
| Instantly. | ||
| Because they got three strikes all at the same time. | ||
| Isn't this guy back on a bunch of edge social media as Simmy and Jimmy and doing better? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah, yeah, yeah. | |
| Okay. | ||
| Probably. | ||
| Yeah, Monkey Jones aka Simeon Jimmy. | ||
| The first hit is his wikitubia fandom. | ||
| People are loving this guy. | ||
| From bass to erased, my story is Monkey Jones. | ||
| Monkey Jones, IMDB. | ||
| So he had... If Kong loses, I'm going to, let's say, end it all. | ||
| OK, I see the issues here. | ||
| Finally leaking all of my DMs. | ||
| OK, so he was making edgy content about an individual I'm not going to name, who is a despicable individual. | ||
| And it didn't break any of their specified rules. | ||
| And they didn't even just like, how about this? | ||
| Here's an email. | ||
| Hey, look, we understand, you know, this is the content you produce. | ||
| Here are the terms we set forward. | ||
| we're asking you right now, don't do these things, otherwise we'll have to ban you." | ||
| And he would have said yes. | ||
| The same thing with Carl Benjamin. | ||
| I said this when Patreon banned him. | ||
| I was like, Patreon banned Carl without warning overnight because of something he said on | ||
| a livestream like a year prior. | ||
| And if they had just gone to him and said, hey, we saw that you were on a stream and | ||
| you said these things, it causes problems for us because we're getting a lot of bad | ||
| We'd appreciate it if you would, if you wouldn't do this. | ||
| Carl would have been like, all right, I don't want to lose my Patreon. | ||
| So, you know, no problem. | ||
| But they didn't, they just nuke his income instantly. | ||
| What do you think about small websites? | ||
| Like if you started a website that people could sign into and it had like 500 users that, that you would retain the right to ban anyone at any time. | ||
| People who are not using the platform to run a business. | ||
| You don't know why, but it's like a small social media site. | ||
| So this is the difference between Twitter being a convention center that's contracting you to set up a kiosk and a pizza place having a chair where someone can sit down to enjoy your pizza. | ||
| So if I have a website with users, and I do, hey, go to TimCast.com, become a member. | ||
| That's more akin to like me having a pizza shop and I come in the morning, I open the door and someone comes and sits down in the diner, in the dining room section. | ||
| So, yeah, I can throw them out, because we don't have a contractual agreement other than it's a public accommodation for them to come. | ||
| Now, to be fair, there is still, for websites where you pay membership, there is a bit of an agreement. | ||
| Like, you'd have to actually have a civil dispute over the currency if someone was paying to be a member, and then you kicked them out when they were still active members. | ||
| So if you're like a country club, you can get into a dispute if someone's like, I pay to be here, and they throw them out anyway, and they say, well, you broke the rules. | ||
| You can still get into those conflicts. | ||
| But I'll say Twitter's more like McCormick Place. | ||
| You know McCormick Place, right? | ||
| Yeah, of course. | ||
| The massive Chicago Convention Center. | ||
| It's public, right? | ||
| That's why I'm pretty sure it's public. | ||
| Is that the Merchandise Smart? | ||
| Yeah, well, anyone can book that entire area. | ||
| I mean, if you want to hold an event there, it's giant. | ||
| Massive! | ||
| What is it, like 100,000, 200,000 square feet or something? | ||
| Yeah, it's the biggest of its kind in the Midwest. | ||
| I think there's an equivalent in New York, maybe. | ||
| It's amazing how massive. | ||
| Is it Merchandise Smart? | ||
| No, no, no, McCormick Place. | ||
| Oh, McCormick Place. | ||
| Yeah, it's on the lake. | ||
| There's actually two. | ||
| You can go in a tunnel. | ||
| But they do a bunch of events there and car shows. | ||
| If they said, you can come in and set up your kiosk here to display your product during this big convention, and then you go in, and then this generates ticket sales for the greater event, or you pay, you know, or something, or even if they let you in for free, you're spending time, energy, and money to be there. | ||
| For them to just come and just tear down and destroy what you've set up, it costs you money. | ||
| Dave's account. | ||
| It costs him money to operate. | ||
| I understand it's not as much as, like, running an actual brick-and-mortar shop. | ||
| But a lot of people, their Twitter accounts are based on labor they actually do. | ||
| There have been people, journalists, who have been banned, and they actually go on the ground and they film things. | ||
| There have been activist accounts that have paid to go on the ground and livestream and film, and they've been banned for this. | ||
| So these are people who invested hard currency to be on a platform who were banned for no reason. | ||
| There were Occupy Wall Street activists, people who do not like me, who I defended, They were banned and they broke no rules. | ||
| We can't operate a system like this. | ||
| The problem is the Democrats will absolutely never, never push forward a law like this because they're ideologically in a strong position with their ideology controlling these things and Republicans won't do it because Republicans are worthless morons. | ||
| I'm very like laissez-faire about this kind of stuff. | ||
| I don't like the government imposing laws on the corporations about how they have to run their business. | ||
| But I'm also very against monopolies. | ||
| And I think they've kind of monopolized the social media. | ||
| I wonder what you think about this idea that once a social network gets large enough, we free their software code via law. | ||
| you know, we break up the monopoly of their code. | ||
| So other people can spin up like another YouTube that can co-interoperate with other YouTube. | ||
| So you can subscribe to YouTube on their main users on the main account, | ||
| but you can create your own terms of service on your site. | ||
| So it will create a marketplace of ideas for terms of service. | ||
| Basically, it'll create, the market will be not who has the best technology, it'll be who has the best terms. | ||
| Ian, that's like saying if the city comes and destroys your business with a wrecking ball, you can just go and build another building somewhere else. | ||
| It's very different than physical property. | ||
| Can you afford to do it? | ||
| It doesn't cost anything. | ||
| I mean, it doesn't really cost, you don't have to build things. | ||
| Just to like chip in, because I mean, you guys are both making excellent points, but in terms of what you said, I think the solution there is probably a little off. | ||
| Yeah, but it's nowhere near as effective as Facebook. | ||
| source code so anyone can know how to, for example, build these kind of sites. | ||
| I mean, I think most of the table is competent enough with tech to at least retain someone | ||
| to do that. | ||
| I mean, you had Parler, for example. | ||
| Yeah, but it's nowhere near as effective as Facebook. | ||
| If you look at their site functionality, they have like Marketplace, they have like dating | ||
| sites, they have an amazing messenger app, incredible algorithms. | ||
| But I mean, Parler's direct competitor is Twitter. | ||
| I'd say Parler is about 90% as good and they were a lot freer. | ||
| I mean, Twitter only has one like or respond function still to this date on tweets. | ||
| You can't edit tweets. | ||
| The issue with Parler wasn't that their tech code was a little bit worse, it was that they were destroyed by corporate monopolists. | ||
| I mean, after they were falsely accused of being responsible for the Capitol rioting... And it was lies from the media. | ||
| All lies. | ||
| Yeah, we now know that explicitly. | ||
| That was coordinated primarily through Facebook, which was a more boomer piece of tech in the first place. | ||
| I'm not surprised by that at all. | ||
| But I mean, Parler was immediately the scapegoat. | ||
| Like, it can't be the big two. | ||
| It can't be the big two. | ||
| I think some messaging went out. | ||
| And so, I mean, you saw this incredible stuff, like, what is it, Amazon Online, whatever their... AWS, yeah. | ||
| Amazon Web Services, Amazon Web Services servers, yeah. | ||
| But, I mean, their actual ability to run a website at the basic level of working with the server, working with the provider at the top level, was taken away. | ||
| I mean, they were taken off the app stores, and it turns out there are only two or three of those. | ||
| Two, in fact. | ||
| So, I mean, that's what destroyed Parler. | ||
| And I think that gets back to a bigger issue here, which is, I totally respect your point. | ||
| I'm very libertarian on a lot of issues. | ||
| When you say, I don't like the government interfering with big tech, sure. | ||
| The issue comes up when you're dealing with businesses that are nearly as powerful as the government. | ||
| I mean, and this is true even outside of tech. | ||
| If you ask someone whether they wanted to be the CEO of Disney or the governor of Montana, no power-seeking person would say, I would want to be the governor of Montana. | ||
| These Fortune 500 companies are extraordinarily powerful players. | ||
| And when you get into tech, when you get into the literal control of speech, I mean, you see that Facebook, Twitter, these kind of Google, have more control over speech, what we see and now what we can say, than really anyone else in the game. | ||
| Certainly, They have more influence than most state-level governments in the USA. | ||
| So kind of getting to the point, I mean, like, if we say we don't want the government to regulate the tech boys, and there are only four or five people that are actually in charge of these tech companies, and they're racing each other to Mars and home-built rockets, these guys are not going to just decide to regulate their business. | ||
| The state, at some level... I like legislation to be as simple as possible, but for the state to come in and say, Due to the fact that this probably violates other well-known laws against, for example, adhesion, you can't simply terminate accounts for any reason or no reason at all, just as you can't fire people because of their race, for example. | ||
| There are caveats like this all throughout the law. | ||
| I wouldn't have a problem with that. | ||
| I think for right now, though, legally, you might be correct. | ||
| It's up in the air between us. | ||
| It's positioned, the ball's probably somewhere between what we're saying. | ||
| Can you do that? | ||
| I think his point is just you shouldn't be able to. | ||
| If people are going to pressure Congress, that's the thing. | ||
| Right, my argument is that we need to make laws to enforce this. | ||
| We need to make laws to definitively state it. | ||
| However, there's also a path towards filing lawsuits and making the correct arguments. | ||
| So one of the problems is, I hear from conservatives all the time that you can't sue for X, you can't sue for Y, and I'm like, you can, you just need to make a good argument, Yes. | ||
| and then get it before a judge and then see if they agree with you | ||
| because like the reality is i've seen judges have really awful rulings | ||
| i've seen judges have ruling where like all of legal twitter was like what was | ||
| he thinking this ruling but the judge said it | ||
| so here's what you do there's gotta be some i've i've seen some lawsuits | ||
| pertaining to like defamation and bannings and i'm like what were these | ||
| lawyers thinking These lawyers don't know anything about the platform, and they don't know how to make an argument to a judge about this. | ||
| This is the issue. | ||
| I don't want to say something as simple as boomers don't get tech, but I assume all of you, I assume you guys, given interest range, watched the set of hearings on the internet probably four or five years back where people were saying things like, it's a series of tubes. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Oh yeah, of course. | |
| Yeah, you got that information packed into them pipes there. | ||
| The cloud. | ||
| I'll tell you my favorite thing I've ever heard. | ||
| When I was working in live streaming, I was developing mobile apps, and I was at a conference with a bunch of well-off individuals, and I was talking about how we're trying to build an app where we can do these photos, we do live streaming, and the woman goes, the cloud! | ||
| And I was like, yes? | ||
| And she goes, the cloud! | ||
| And I was like, sure, what about it? | ||
| And she goes, why don't you use the cloud? | ||
| And I was like, I'm not sure I understand what you mean. | ||
| She's like, use the cloud. | ||
| It's like, have you considered that? | ||
| And I'm like, are you saying that we should have servers? | ||
| Like, do you know what the cloud means? | ||
| She didn't. | ||
| It was a buzz. | ||
| Something might be hosted remotely. | ||
| I mean, it's novel stuff. | ||
| We're gonna have a data center. | ||
| I'm like, what? | ||
| And she thought she had this profound idea about what the cloud, I'm like, the cloud isn't a new thing. | ||
| It's a, it's like a buzz term. | ||
| It's like a branding word. | ||
| Just means like hosting your site, like a data center. | ||
| We're going to build gaseous servers that are like you spray chemicals into the air and that's going to host your data. | ||
| And then you'll fire lasers through it to access the data. | ||
| And it'll actually be cloud data. | ||
| Because lasers can solidify gas. | ||
| You can then pack that data into the tubes and you can get it To the internet. | ||
| To Mars and back. | ||
| It's really, it's good stuff. | ||
| I mean, but yeah, this, this is all funny, but actually this ties into something that we really do look at in political science, which is the extremely advanced age being polite for the medium of politicians. | ||
| So like when people are talking about a situation like the 78 year old Joe Biden, if I have that correct, running against like the 74 year old Trump, and people are saying things like Trump is five years younger. | ||
| He's much more vigorous. | ||
| He's ready to go. | ||
| He was spry. | ||
| That's true. | ||
| I mean, you know, I'm pretty sure that if you're running for president of the United States, there are people, you know, following you around, spritzing you with virgin blood and grinding up five Adderall into your banana smoothie, hypothetically. | ||
| But I mean, like, so, my only comment with this is, the issue with a lot of this is that the typical, what is it, circuit court level, maybe district court level, federal judge, doesn't know a whole hell of a lot about the complexities of the internet. | ||
| So people tend to resort to heuristics in times like that. | ||
| Like, yep, I don't like messing with a man's private business. | ||
| But the reality is that if we want to prevent something like... There's no reason Twitter couldn't shut down the Republican Party. | ||
| Oh they could. | ||
| They took an active sitting president of the United States. | ||
| People forget how crazy this is. | ||
| Because we're focusing so much on the media, which leans 93% left, or left and left leaning moderates, focus on like 1-6. | ||
| Immediately following what was an embarrassing graphic series of incidents, social media Worked together to ban the sitting president from every major social media platform. | ||
| He's not on Facebook. | ||
| He's not on Twitter. | ||
| I think YouTube may have restored some content. | ||
| But I mean, like, I was actually talking to a female friend of mine, and she was like, I was at, what's the expensive bike peloton? | ||
| I was at the Peloton gym, and you can't search Trump on Peloton. | ||
| Like, if you're messaging the other women in the gym, there are words you can't use, like MAGA, you know, CAG, I'm not gonna get into some of the other stuff about the election, but you can't refer to Trump on Twitter, and like, the Ivanka and Melania accounts on Peloton. | ||
| I have not verified this myself, but we're gone. | ||
| Like, these aren't things you can see on the social portion of Peloton. | ||
| I assume that's true, but I mean, I know it's true for Pinterest, for example. | ||
| The man vanished. | ||
| He was non-personed. | ||
| And anyone can be non-personed in this fashion. | ||
| There's nothing to prevent a conservative billionaire, assuming they're already in this field, from taking down the Democrats or certainly the Greens, and there's nothing to prevent the more prevalent Leftist tech bros from saying the Republican Party is responsible for three incidents of vaguely defined hate speech. | ||
| They're gone. | ||
| The question is whether they should be able to do that. | ||
| And I think the consensus here, we're having an interesting moral and almost semantic debate, but I think the consensus kind of has to be no. | ||
| Well, my question, though, is how would you let the government dictate what corporations have to make their terms of service? | ||
| Like, would you let the government write the terms of service? | ||
| Oh, hell no, because they don't know what they're doing. | ||
| Actually, I think that started it all. | ||
| But finish, please. | ||
| I don't want to bust in there. | ||
| And then I guess you answered that. | ||
| But the follow up would be like, at what level do you command that a social network is allowed to ban people and that has to stop banning people for what? | ||
| And how do you define what hate speech means? | ||
| How does it go down? | ||
| Just crime. | ||
| I wouldn't get into any of that, actually. | ||
| I think, Tim, you and I might be on the same page. | ||
| Just quickly, from my end, one, I think law works best when it's extremely short and clear. | ||
| So I would simply say that adhesion contracts are illegal in the context of social media. | ||
| Boom. | ||
| Solved 70% of it. | ||
| And then I would say, like, For example, actually, I teach a con law class at KSU, and there already are exceptions to the rule of free speech. | ||
| You guys might correct me if I miss one, but there's obviously pornography involving inappropriately young people or non-human subjects. | ||
| Keeping it virtuous for social media. | ||
| No, uh, no sheep or boys. | ||
| I mean, that's an exception generally, although we're, for whatever reason, relaxing on sheep here in the USA. | ||
| Um, but no open fraud, no lies for more than $500 or whatever it is, state by state, ever. | ||
| No libel, no slander. | ||
| That's actually your point about- Well, that's civil tort, right? | ||
| Yeah, that's civil tort, but okay, yeah. | ||
| Not criminally banned but still enforced. | ||
| I think it would be reasonable to put that level of civil tort in it. | ||
| We're talking about the same sort of thing. | ||
| And then direct incitement to serious violence. | ||
| Those would be the exceptions to free speech, three criminal, one civil. | ||
| I would have no problem with saying social media can block that content but nothing else. | ||
| Well what about spam? | ||
| I mean, how do you define it? | ||
| Exactly, how do you define it? | ||
| You block people you don't like. | ||
| Yeah, but you can destroy networks if you keep spamming them. | ||
| A DDoS attack is different from just spam. | ||
| But you can still destroy networks. | ||
| And you can make an argument about something's disorderly conduct, harassment, or assault. | ||
| Actually, a DDoS attack would be illegal in the majority of US states, right? | ||
| That's getting into the actual sort of hacking. | ||
| Hacking is a term I hate, but it's getting into that space, like cyber war. | ||
| Yeah, cyber attack. | ||
| If somebody keeps posting the same message, it would be akin to if someone kept mailing you a letter every single day. | ||
| You'd go to your postal carrier and say, stop delivering these to me, throw them in the trash. | ||
| Put them in a new account, and then you get a bunch of accounts to do it. | ||
| If they can't preemptively ban those, then you have harassment. | ||
| If harassment is actually no one person spamming you and then they spam will and they spam me and they spam Lydia We all block them that keeps spanning new people. | ||
| That's when the site will step in and ban those people So a lot of legal love scribe. | ||
| Oh, that's legal to know it is I can I can it's right on the line guys actually as some of the legal background it points on both sides, but I mean I think okay add that to the terms like I really do think as a Yeah, I'm an aggressive and somewhat amoral leader in practical life. | ||
| If it comes to, like, what's KSU's recruitment plan going to be for this year or not, that would be my decision. | ||
| Or, like, how am I going to run my business, which I do do pretty successfully. | ||
| I mean, I think a lot of this stuff can be settled. | ||
| Like, you get the tech guys and you get four or five congressmen in the north talking about it in the back room and you say, okay, these six things, you can ban at will and we'll allow you spam. | ||
| What about porn? | ||
| That actually... I would personally allow legal porn, but I think that, to some extent, it wouldn't be very difficult to do this. | ||
| Like, I understand what you're asking. | ||
| Like, there's some technical on-the-fence questions. | ||
| But, I mean, what you would simply say is, one, no adhesion contracts where people can be banned for no reason. | ||
| This is your major point. | ||
| Right now there's an adhesion contract where people can be banned for no reason. | ||
| And then you would say, Social media providers are... I don't know if they're gonna adopt these rules, but social media providers are allowed to ban all content that is civilly or criminally against the law. | ||
| Oh, and here's how porn would work. | ||
| Or that is civilly or criminally... that it is civilly or criminally legal to restrict for an audience of people under 18 or under 21 since those individuals use social media sites. | ||
| What about violence? | ||
| Violence is fine. | ||
| It doesn't fall in any of those categories. | ||
| But it's like R-rated, so it's 7, 18 and older. | ||
| Then you can say the same thing. | ||
| Parents' responsibility. | ||
| Can they ban someone for putting a video up of a bully fight? | ||
| Do they let 13-year-olds wander by themselves downtown in the city? | ||
| This isn't about that. | ||
| This is about internet video I'm talking about. | ||
| And who dictates what they can and can't put on there? | ||
| Yes, my point is we wouldn't let 13-year-olds walk into an adult video store. | ||
| They're not allowed. | ||
| Yeah, I think that there are also a couple of different questions here. | ||
| One of the deepest ones, since we're all getting to that dad range, is like, should 13-year-olds be on Twitter? | ||
| I mean, there's some very practical things that you could do to take away... I mean, most young men, including me, I read recently, start consuming porn in the USA at like 11 or 12. | ||
| And it actually does... No, but it has a really... | ||
| I mean, I had a normal high school sex life. | ||
| Like you, you definitely hook up with real people in life, but the exposure to like extreme edgy spit in my mouth content if you're worse than 12 and your girlfriend's 13 is not going to give you a lot of tips about how to act in real life. | ||
| So kids to some extent need to be moved away from a lot of that. | ||
| Um, but the practical question, I think this is something that would be negotiated among intelligent people, presumably intelligent people. | ||
| If this were ever to happen, but I think what you could say is absolutely no adhesion contracts as a baseline, and I may be technically off on that legal term, but no unfair contracts of this kind, then we expect social media to ban content that is against the law as a violation of free speech. | ||
| But then you got to decide what state law are you working out of? | ||
| Depends on where the corporation was founded. | ||
| A lot of this is federal criminal law, though. | ||
| I mean, like a ban on, you know, underage or non-human pornography would be fairly easy to enforce in the USA. | ||
| And this is what you want to be at, right? | ||
| You want a few things explicitly banned, like terror content. | ||
| I don't like the federal government doing it because if you want to do a video on how to grow weed, it's legal in California, but not legal federally. | ||
| So you could bust up a corporation for that. | ||
| And the feds can come into California and arrest you. | ||
| I co-founded Mines. | ||
| Are you familiar with Mines.com? | ||
| I've definitely heard that now. | ||
| Honestly, I don't spit a lot. | ||
| We built it from the ground up, basically. | ||
| And this is my life for the last decade, is figuring out how to equitably create terms. | ||
| And I can't figure it out. | ||
| I don't think the government should do it for us. | ||
| And I don't think people should be forced into a mold. | ||
| This is why I go with the free software, free the code. | ||
| That doesn't do anything, though. | ||
| You say that all the time, but you never explain. | ||
| No, it doesn't. | ||
| What do you mean? | ||
| If you give me the plans to build a house, I can't build a house, bro. | ||
| I don't know how to... Well, if you get the people together that can help you build it, How do I do that? | ||
| How do I pay them? | ||
| I gave you the... I don't care about that. | ||
| I gave you the blueprint. | ||
| I actually... I'm very intelligent, but I'm kind of with Tim on this one. | ||
| I mean like when you say like the parlor thing, we can argue about whether the setup code, the basic structure of the website, someone was worse or better than Twitter. | ||
| The fact is it wasn't allowed to exist. | ||
| And I think that this will happen to this. | ||
| See, this is the thing when we take these morally, I suppose, the extent I think about moral questions. | ||
| I agree with you. | ||
| But the question is, if you say corporations are allowed to handle their own business and do whatever they want, produce whatever content they want, as long as it's legal, they could knock you off for any reason or no reason at all. | ||
| The issue arises when they knock off the sitting president of the United States, or when a competitor arises that probably would have been good enough for Trump and those guys to jump back on immediately removed. | ||
| Or when Laura Loomer runs for office and they give her rival an account, which is free access to advertising and promotion, and deny her one as a candidate. | ||
| I think I agree about Amazon. | ||
| They have a monopoly that's very dangerous on servers right now. | ||
| But when you look at what, about the parlor, Twitter, like what's better tech. | ||
| Okay. | ||
| That's a decent argument, but nothing compares to YouTube and Facebook. | ||
| They are completely out of the ballpark. | ||
| Phenomenal technology packages. | ||
| Dude, nothing is better than YouTube. | ||
| So you're actually making a monopoly argument though. | ||
| You're saying that between tech and control. | ||
| So a lot of these things have to have definitions. | ||
| Like, do you agree the government should break up extreme monopolies? | ||
| Well, you look at what happened to Standard Oil, Rockefeller's company, and what they did was break it into six oil companies. | ||
| Correct. | ||
| Rockefeller took stock in all six and became more wealthy and powerful after the breakup. | ||
| But we now prohibit that from the departing senior executive or the previous senior executive. | ||
| Like, there was a response to that. | ||
| But like, so for example, one thing you could do is take Facebook and break... Facebook is itself an agglomeration of different companies. | ||
| But if you broke off Facebook Messenger into a new company, they still know how to build it because they still have the code so they can rebuild it. | ||
| No, but that's what I'm saying. | ||
| Like at the most basic level, I actually want something more intense than this that would involve some element of government regulation. | ||
| We can debate that because we're free citizens. | ||
| But at the most basic level, Facebook is about five or six companies. | ||
| I mean, like, whatever their ads platform is called, Instagram, Messenger... Facebook's ad system? | ||
| So what all of these companies do, Facebook and Google specifically, is that Google, obviously, is a handful of companies. | ||
| YouTube is not only a video hosting platform, It is a video distribution platform, it is a marketing platform, and it is an ad sales platform. | ||
| All of these things, or I should say they integrate the ad sales into, you know, all of these things operate this way. | ||
| Google, I should say YouTube specifically is an ad sales. | ||
| It's ad delivery, content delivery, content storage, all of these things in one. | ||
| If you broke that up, YouTube wouldn't exist. | ||
| It needs those components to work together. | ||
| YouTube, however, is not the best. | ||
| That's an absurd statement. | ||
| There are many other sites that have come forward with newer technology that's better, and there's a really interesting phenomenon that happens in technology. | ||
| Why is it that the United States has really crappy cell networks? | ||
| Because we invented it first. | ||
| So for, I think, what was the first network? | ||
| IDEN? | ||
| IDEN network? | ||
| So we created this really crappy cell network, but at the time it was revolutionary! | ||
| Well, Korea didn't do cell networks. | ||
| Not even then, not even for 10 years. | ||
| Then we invented a few different things. | ||
| We ultimately end up with the CDMA standard and the GSM standard. | ||
| CDMA was kind of bad, but it was really good compared to where we were before. | ||
| GSM comes out, it's a global, you know, it became like a global standard. | ||
| And then Korea decides we're going to build a cell network. | ||
| Because they were building it for the first time, they built a really good one. | ||
| Because the United States was just improving the existing one, it was always lagging behind. | ||
| It's happening in Africa. | ||
| They're putting solar panels on houses and bypassing central electric grids. | ||
| There's a lot of developing tech in the stable African states that I think a lot of people are sleeping on, especially given Chinese colonization. | ||
| That Chinese-Nigerian complex in West Africa is going to be a rival to the West in 30 years. | ||
| And so I'll stress this right now, Rumble is better than YouTube. | ||
| I only started recently publishing to Rumble. | ||
| YouTube has the audience. | ||
| You've also got the algorithms. | ||
| Search algorithms are incredible. | ||
| Relevant that's the marketing issue of it. | ||
| That's so the issue here is we're talking about technology and freeing the code. | ||
| It's pointless We use YouTube because it is a massive McCormick Center conference room that I know there's a billion people hanging out in location location location We use rumble for a variety of other things because it's a better service better technology better bandwidth Customization it's better across the board even Vimeo is better and YouTube is good because there's a massive room in this broken down, ridiculous building, and the security guards are dicks, and it's like, yeah, but they'll put up a sign with an arrow pointing to my building and there's a billion people here. | ||
| Well, they've got the partner program, they've got... Rumble does all that too. | ||
| YouTube Studios, incredible, dude. | ||
| It's pretty good. | ||
| It's amazing. | ||
| I've never seen anything remotely even close to YouTube Studio. | ||
| The ability for a user to go in and have their analytics and their database... What are you talking about? | ||
| There's tons of sites that have all that stuff. | ||
| You can show me that Rumble is actually better than that or even holds a candle. | ||
| I mean, that company's been pouring billions into that for years, for like a decade, and they've got like 50,000 people working on it. | ||
| I will concede YouTube has pretty good analytics. | ||
| But everything has an analytics system. | ||
| It's a big, big, big production to create stuff like that. | ||
| So then we're getting more than into the marketing space of things. | ||
| If we're talking about just video hosting, I... No, it's the whole package. | ||
| You can't compete with YouTube, a user that wants to create a job on the internet with their videos. | ||
| But it's nothing to do with that, dude. | ||
| It has to do with the fact that YouTube controls the audience. | ||
| It's the monopoly on the content. | ||
| It's the monopoly on the code, is what I'm saying. | ||
| This seems to be like Twitter versus Parler again. | ||
| No, it isn't. | ||
| It's the monopoly on the network. | ||
| People don't use Twitter because Twitter is good. | ||
| Yeah, that Twitter is good. | ||
| Mine is way better than Twitter. | ||
| And there's a reason why less people use it than Twitter. | ||
| It's because everyone's on Twitter. | ||
| That's a difficult thing to overcome. | ||
| It's not the only reason. | ||
| Twitter's awesome. | ||
| Twitter's fantastic. | ||
| I've never had a bug on Twitter. | ||
| Have you? | ||
| Yes. | ||
| I've had frequent bugs on Twitter. | ||
| Also, you can't edit tweets. | ||
| I mean, in terms of some of the most basic elements of that interface, like, I'm not mocking Twitter. | ||
| Twitter's okay. | ||
| But I don't think that the reason that Twitter is so utterly dominant in that space is the brilliant quality of its tech. | ||
| I don't think if you took 15 guys from MIT, they'd have much trouble designing something roughly equivalent or better. | ||
| They're different elements. | ||
| Like, if your site completely sucks, if your code sucks, if your engineering guys suck, obviously people aren't going to use that product. | ||
| But also, like, the Rumble YouTube debate... | ||
| You could go either way. | ||
| The reality is that they're what? | ||
| How many millions of people are there on YouTube right now posting video content, using it? | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| Billions of hours a day or something. | ||
| I don't know what it is. | ||
| It's like a billion one. | ||
| I don't know if that's users or videos. | ||
| Per month, a billion users per month. | ||
| Yeah, a billion one per month. | ||
| That's why YouTube has that. | ||
| It's got to be more than a billion because if CNN is getting 100 and Fox is getting 200 and then you've got big YouTubers, it's got to be in the tens of billions per month. | ||
| Maybe. | ||
| You know, there's probably unique users. | ||
| Uploads. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| There's so many unique users versus views or something. | ||
| But a lot of this is, we're discussing a lot of technical detail intelligently, but at some level, like, I mean, the point that YouTube is viewed as better than Rumble because there are a billion people using it, you know, quantity has a quality all its own. | ||
| I don't think anyone would dispute that. | ||
| The real one root question here that we're chopping around is, should a company that has a billion users that has allowed you, quote unquote, to get to four million | ||
| users, be able to terminate your account at will? I think no, but I also think that's | ||
| probably going to require some new legislation. | ||
| That actually, by the way, for the center right or the tech sector or whatever you want to call it, | ||
| that is a legitimate goal. Not congressmen sitting around mumbling in their ancient way, | ||
| trying to describe the internet, but will you add some basic clause to the law strengthening the | ||
| rules against adhesion contracts or going back perhaps to more traditional monopoly law? | ||
| And again, we're kind of fantasizing here, but I don't see any reason that wouldn't happen. | ||
| You know, there's obviously a reason. | ||
| I'm also concerned about the market itself. | ||
| Like you said, they have a billion users or something. | ||
| Like, how do you break that up? | ||
| That's exactly- You can't. | ||
| You gotta give the code away. | ||
| It's the only way. | ||
| That doesn't make any sense. | ||
| Well, then I can build a YouTube that interoperates so those billion can see my content. | ||
| Then why don't you use Rumble? | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| I don't need it. | ||
| Why not? | ||
| Because I have YouTube. | ||
| Because YouTube gets you more views. | ||
| This is kind of the Ouroboros here. | ||
| The tech is great, but there's a reason people use Twitter instead of Parler. | ||
| That's probably the weakest of the examples. | ||
| There's a reason people use YouTube instead of Rumble. | ||
| And when people started using Parler, they shut Parler down. | ||
| Parler was facing critical mass. | ||
| It was exploding in users. | ||
| Parler is the number six app across both app stores. | ||
| Parler was actually outperforming either Twitter or Facebook, I forget which, immediately. | ||
| Like the day before it was shut down. | ||
| And we've seen this, by the way, this is an important point I do want to make here. | ||
| We've seen the steel fist come out of the velvet glove a few times recently. | ||
| Like large competitive countries do have a ruling class that knows it's a ruling class. | ||
| However many conspiracies are real and all this sort of thing. | ||
| So I mean, like, for example, with the Robin Hood stuff, where people started playing the short sellers in the stock market, which I was a part of, I think many people were. | ||
|
unidentified
|
They shut it down. | |
| Yeah, they immediately shut it down. | ||
| They came up with some BS reason like, we're running out of money here, boys, and immediately halted trading on the stocks that were being affected in a way that was hurting powerful rich people. | ||
| You can call that a coincidence, but you have to combine that with the same coincidence where a parlor Beats FB one day and the next day it's like, well, that's how the Capitol riot was coordinated. | ||
| It wasn't Facebook, which is used by far more older demographic individuals. | ||
| We need to get these boys out of here. | ||
| And so Parler shuts down. | ||
| I think Parler's back now, but their moment was broken. | ||
| Well, let's take Super Chats and see what the Super Chats have to say. | ||
| If you haven't already, give that like button a little tap. | ||
| Become a member at TimCast.com. | ||
| We don't do bonus segments on Fridays, but we do have a vlog coming up tomorrow, and we made Lutherburgers. | ||
| And, uh, I... You know the Lutherburger? | ||
|
unidentified
|
No. | |
| You weren't here for... Oh, it's right. | ||
| What is it? | ||
| Andreas, it's a double bacon cheeseburger with two glazed donuts instead of buns. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Whoa! | |
| Mustard on it, and we were like... That's the thing that took it over the line. | ||
| The mustard. | ||
| Yeah, but I had a small one with no sauce. | ||
| It was just the cheeseburger, no bacon, and just the donut. | ||
| We did one donut. | ||
| It's good. | ||
| Yeah, I imagine they are good. | ||
| So that's the vlog tomorrow. | ||
| It'll be up at like 9 a.m. | ||
| or whatever. | ||
| YouTube.com slash castcastle. | ||
| Let's take these super chats. | ||
| Anime Audio Commentary says, did you guys hear about what Chris Chan did? | ||
| I heard the leaked audio and it left me speechless. | ||
|
unidentified
|
No. | |
| I have no idea what this meme is supposed to be, but isn't Chris Chan that skateboarder who's really good? | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| He's got a YouTube video? | ||
| What are they talking about? | ||
| Never heard of the guy. | ||
| Sorry. | ||
| Alright, but there's like a meme or something about what he do and everyone's like, oh I'm so shocked, but there's like nothing really happening. | ||
| Questionable content says, Ian, chiropractors are a scam. | ||
| It is illegal to call yourself a doctor in Europe if you are just a chiropractor without any additional medical degree. | ||
| Yeah, when you get your back cracked, it's up to you to continue to hold your new posture. | ||
| They're not going to fix you and then you go home and go back to your old lazy posture. | ||
| You need to change your own posture, so you end up doing 99% of the work. | ||
| The other thing with chiropractic, I mean like I've gone to a chiropractor, they are great with the human back. | ||
| I mean it's a very advanced level of sort of muscular, I don't know, it felt like a very intense massage is a good way to remove some of that technical jargon. | ||
| But they definitely, they know their way around the spine. | ||
| My understanding is the problem with chiropractic is that they claim that working on the spine can cure almost everything. | ||
| If you read the original manuals for the field, it's sort of like, this is how to relax depression via spine pressure. | ||
| So you get into that same weird, maybe medical zone that you do with acupuncture, I think. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| Skeleton King 322 says, and this is interesting. | ||
| That fit right in there. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I can't share this podcast on Facebook at all. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Excuse me. | |
| Maybe the title? | ||
| Our work here is done. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| Maybe, maybe... Put it on Parler. | ||
| Well, no. | ||
| Maybe it's just you, Skeleton King. | ||
| Maybe everybody should try sharing this podcast on Facebook right now to see if Skeleton King is incorrect. | ||
| So, who knows? | ||
| I mean, you'll have to take the URL and then paste it onto Facebook and press enter. | ||
| That's right. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Who knows? | |
| Oh, yeah. | ||
| Strongly encourage people to share this as widely as possible. | ||
| If you want to tag me on it, On Twitter, I'm at Will underscore duh underscore B-E-A-S-T 6-3-0. | ||
| So let's see if it works. | ||
| Right on. | ||
| Pierce Worsig says, Hey Tim, update from my grocery store. | ||
| All employees are required to wear masks starting Monday. | ||
| School just mandated student wear masks even after requiring vaccination. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| The New York Times had an article saying that I think it's, um, what was it? | ||
| Broadway is going to require vaccines and masks. | ||
| Did you say at the beginning of the show that these articles are saying that people with the vaccine are not less contagious? | ||
| The New York Times said vaccinated people have the same likeliness to spread COVID as people who are unvaccinated. | ||
| However, however... | ||
| The context they left out that's making everyone angry is that they're less likely to catch COVID. | ||
| Meaning they're less likely to show symptoms? | ||
| They're 94% less likely to get COVID. | ||
| I mean, that's a good summary, but that's the issue. | ||
| Like, 89 to 94. | ||
| Except the problem with that data is in Massachusetts, there was an outbreak where 75% of those who got sick were vaccinated. | ||
| And the vaccination rate in Massachusetts is 63.9, meaning it was disproportionately those who were vaccinated who got sick. | ||
| I don't have explanations for this, nor am I asserting anything other than we need to figure out why that happened. | ||
| So, look. | ||
| The New York Times said you are less likely to get it, but if you do, you are equally likely to spread it. | ||
| The one thing I would say here is, and I am also not asserting or making any medical claims, But the one thing that I would say here is, like, most of the research on the vaccine, that's a fascinating story. | ||
| I don't know if that's an outlier situation. | ||
| Like, you would find outliers in any pool of, you know, 200 million. | ||
| I do think that's important to note. | ||
| But all of the stuff, the CDC, Israeli, et cetera, research on the vaccine kind of puts the efficacy at between 89 and 94 percent that I have personally read. | ||
| It may be a little less for Delta, say, you know, one in 10, but to have a breakthrough | ||
| infection that's transmissible, you do need to have a breakthrough infection. | ||
| So a lot of this just seems like panicking once again, like we've got seniors reasonably | ||
| well protected. | ||
| The average COVID victim in the USA was 81, as I recall. | ||
| They want lockdowns. | ||
| That's correct. | ||
| There's, or I don't know if there's a unified they there, but it's easy just if you're in | ||
| a position of political leadership and you're a bit weak minded, it's easy to just say not | ||
| one life. | ||
| We're going with the most extreme thing we tried before. | ||
| Here it goes again, in my opinion. | ||
| So the question, last one sentence question here, but the question is, okay, you've been vaccinated, say you're 85% less likely to get COVID, which puts your risk of getting and transmitting fatal COVID about on par with the flu. | ||
| The only people you could give this to at the normal preexisting risk would be unvaccinated people, mostly younger, who've chosen not to get the shot for personal health reasons. | ||
| So I don't see any moral liability here. | ||
| I don't think it's the vaccinated that are filling up the hospitals to the extent anyone is. | ||
| I haven't seen any data showing that hospitals are overloaded for quite a while on this. | ||
| So it seems like the same arguments keep coming up, like just, you know, 15 months to flatten the curve kind of stuff. | ||
| All right. | ||
| Zenobia says, Tim, even though civvies can't be charged using the UCMJ, they're already calling the others extremists. | ||
| Once done. | ||
| Well, I will never forget when Obama had a U.S. | ||
| citizen executed by drone. | ||
| Zenobia, what do you mean a U.S. | ||
| citizen? | ||
| Wasn't it four? | ||
| I can at least cite Anwar al-Awlaki and Abdulrahman al-Awlaki, and I'm pretty sure there were a couple others, but I could be wrong. | ||
| All right. | ||
| Jared the Lifeguard says, listen to the podcast while digging up my potato plants by hand, barefoot in the garden. | ||
| It feels great to get filthy and intimate with mother nature. | ||
| So we had, uh, so our garden is basically, we're done with it. | ||
| We're, we're just waiting now on the sunflower seeds, but everything else basically has been harvested and we're over it. | ||
| But, uh, the chickens went in, because we have a, um, we have one long, I guess we call it, like, planter, I guess you'd call it. | ||
| And we had the jalapenos have been picked, the plants are all done, the chilies are gone. | ||
| We, uh, we had basil, basil bushes, though, which are amazing. | ||
| Like, each and every one of those leaves is, mm, basil, amazing. | ||
| The chickens, they found it. | ||
| And they started uprooting the plants and like, you know, doing the dirt baths. | ||
| So we had to, we took the basil out. | ||
| We, we, we potted it and moved it and then we planted some more tomatoes. | ||
| And now we're going to do like a separate, smaller, individual potted garden. | ||
| And then we're going to, we're actually cementing over and we're | ||
| going to move the garden over. | ||
| But yeah, it's good fun. | ||
| The chickens have decided they're going to destroy everything. | ||
| As they do. | ||
| And they yell while they're doing it. | ||
| All right. | ||
| Arch, Arch Smith says, Republics function as the battle between oligarchs. | ||
| Less the Roman Republic, more the Renaissance Republics of Italy. | ||
| Shoutout to Ian, read up on the Medici and others like him. | ||
| There you go. | ||
| Maris McMullen says, I'm a woodturner and make cremation urns. | ||
| I've found less than five companies that do the same in the U.S. | ||
| It hurts me that so many are willing to buy such a sentimental item made with slave labor instead of American hands. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| What does America even make anymore? | ||
| We've offshored everything, you know, even our cremation urns. | ||
| We still make weapons, Hoss. | ||
|
unidentified
|
That's true. | |
| Matthew Houck says Australia lost a war with birds. | ||
| Expectation they could even remotely fight their nearly disarmed masses is laughable. | ||
| When are you going to have Thomas Sowell on? | ||
| I would love to. | ||
| Yeah, whenever he wants. | ||
| Love to. | ||
| Yeah, Larry Elder too, that'd be fantastic. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| All right, let's see. | ||
| 2020 Madness says, I'm currently moving to West Virginia. | ||
| I just decided to get in my car and head that way. | ||
| No real plan. | ||
| If y'all know anybody looking for a welder, please shout them out. | ||
| I own my own machine. | ||
| Cool. | ||
| Very cool. | ||
| West Virginia is fantastic. | ||
| I love the wineberries, man. | ||
| We had wineberry season. | ||
| They're gone now. | ||
| They're all withered. | ||
| But man, for that month or two, where there was just red berries everywhere, and we just took them all, and it was great. | ||
| We made ice cream and cake with it. | ||
| That's awesome. | ||
| You walk in the backyard and there's just hundreds. | ||
| Pawpaw is coming up though. | ||
| We're gonna make some pawpaw cake. | ||
| That's how I'm excited for that. | ||
| Hillbilly banana. | ||
| West Virginia, man. | ||
| That's what I'm talking about. | ||
| All right, let's see. | ||
| Jonathan Duger says, of the 98 million monthly views that CNN got, how many of them are people dumping all over them? | ||
|
unidentified
|
80%. | |
| It's like 80%. | ||
| Do they measure it where at 7 o'clock they measure 700,000 views and at 8 o'clock they measure 800,000 views, but it's the 700 of the same people? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And then they'll be like, there was 15,000 views! | ||
| But it was like, dude, just because you divided the show into two one-hour segments doesn't mean that those 800,000 people watched it twice. | ||
| Well, it depends on for the, uh, the advertisers. | ||
| So it would count as two. | ||
| That's a weird way to count metrics. | ||
| This is the same thing with tech brands using page views, right? | ||
| Which is why you scroll through these 15 and 20 page lists of celebrities. | ||
| Like if you're even mildly unscrupulous with views, like every one of those is a person clicking on a unique page of your site. | ||
| I mean, so that's, does that mean you have 15 unique observers of that poll? | ||
| No. | ||
| Yeah, so I can mention that live viewership on this show is not displayed on YouTube. | ||
| They only display what's called VOD viewership. | ||
| And so our live viewership tends to be a couple hundred thousand views every night. | ||
| It was a lot higher during election season. | ||
| Views are way down for everybody, not just CNN. | ||
| I mean, it's down for us too, but we're doing all right. | ||
| And that's not displayed. | ||
| If I wanted to play, you know, number games, my show, both my shows across the board, it's easily like two million views per day. | ||
| You know, and then I can look at CNN and be like, what is Don Lemon getting, 170? | ||
| I mean, in reality, he's really getting that low. | ||
| Now, it's hard to actually do a cross between like, okay, so I put up how many videos per day? | ||
| It's kind of a lot. | ||
| You know, we have like five, four segments on Timcast IRL from the previous show, plus the show. | ||
| Then we've got three from Timcast, plus we've got the Timcast.com stuff. | ||
| They're different people, but not all people watch every single part of it. | ||
| But I will say, yeah, we are crushing CNN in terms of that kind of viewership. | ||
| And another thing about CNN is, when you look at their videos on YouTube, it's all thumbs down. | ||
| People are forced to watch it, and they hate it. | ||
| All right, let's see. | ||
| AskDummy says, one last try. | ||
| Internet attention addiction, for all it's good, now main threat. | ||
| COVID lockdowns, riots cancel culture. | ||
| Sedentary life are consequences of this consciousness redefining drug web. | ||
| Please have Nicholas Carr to talk neuroscience of internet addiction. | ||
| That would be interesting, yes? | ||
| Thomas Williams says, I'm a rural American 50-50 city now. | ||
| Bet 50 bucks you don't care about what us norms think. | ||
| I'll come on your show. | ||
| I'm no one. | ||
| I'm just some guy who is pissed off that I care about politics now. | ||
| We're trying to figure out how to do a show like that. | ||
| The challenge is legal liability for bringing out lots of people to a non-public space. | ||
| This is what we run into. | ||
| We're trying to do events. | ||
| We're trying to do public events. | ||
| But there's questions about inviting large groups of people on ticket sales to a private residence. | ||
| We gotta figure it out. | ||
| We gotta figure it out. | ||
| I think we're gonna figure it out, and I think we're getting really close to actually having the events, and I apologize to everybody who's been waiting, but it's like, we're just, we hit roadblocks. | ||
| You can't just do things. | ||
| The government regulates, you know what I mean? | ||
| All right, Steven Marina Degrosa says, New Yorker stuck here in communist Australia. | ||
| The problem is less the government and more the sad Aussie citizens calling the police on their neighbors. | ||
| I can't wait to come home and move to Houston, Texas. | ||
| It's a good place, man. | ||
| It's a good place. | ||
| All right. | ||
| Let's see what we got. | ||
| MRM says, Tim, heard from family friends that my Catholic church diocese is requiring priests to get the jab. | ||
| And if they don't comply, they are to retire. | ||
| Wow. | ||
| Leave it to, uh, leave it to then? | ||
| Oh, leave it to Ethan. | ||
| Haha. | ||
| Anyone else get called an idiot by multiple doctors and nurses for wearing a mask in January, March, just to watch them all change and mask up? | ||
| Hashtag trust. | ||
| That is a very difficult situation, man. | ||
| All right, let's see. | ||
|
unidentified
|
What do we got here? | |
| Gotta be careful. | ||
| There's a lot of super chats where people are getting kind of angry. | ||
| So I'm going to be careful. | ||
| So I'm going to keep reading. | ||
| Oh, I definitely have to read this. | ||
| The Laughing Man says, I thought what I'd do was I'd pretend I was one of those deaf mutes. | ||
| Anybody get that reference? | ||
|
unidentified
|
No. | |
| You don't know The Laughing Man? | ||
| No. | ||
| And you teach cybersecurity? | ||
| I mean... You gotta watch Ghost in the Shell Standalone Complex. | ||
| I'll check it out. | ||
| It's great. | ||
| The Laughing Man was a hacker who, in Ghost in the Shell, people have cyberized brains, like nanites, and he actually could hack people's eyes, their brains, in real time, so they only saw this, like, icon of, like, this, like, very rudimentary baseball hat, and there were words from Catcher in the Rye. | ||
| I thought what I'd do, I would pretend I was one of those death mutes rotating around it. | ||
| Yeah, super cool. | ||
| We're more focused on the reality, but the movie sounds cool. | ||
| I'll check it out. | ||
| It's a TV show. | ||
| There's a movie, and then they made an anime series, but it's really cool. | ||
| All right, let's see. | ||
| TrekGod says, regarding 230, how about this? | ||
| If a private company gets special public protections rights, then said company should be held to public, not private standards. | ||
| Government cannot curtail free speech as a public standard. | ||
| I mean, that's interesting. | ||
| They're getting special legal protections from the government, then they should also have in turn special legal guarantees to the public. | ||
| It's a fine line of when the government takes over and starts to control that business. | ||
| That's very dangerous too. | ||
| I agree with that, but I will say there's actually a very specific point here that I'm sure both of you guys have seen in online debates, which is the publisher platform debate, which is becoming more sophisticated. | ||
| So, I mean, generally the idea is you can't regulate a platform. | ||
| You can't punish the phone company because people discuss drugs on T-Mobile's lines or something like that. | ||
| But if you're a publisher, if you remove or edit more than X percent of the content posted to your site, you can be regulated pretty intensely. | ||
| And, I mean, any of those provisions focusing on adhesion and so on would become more potent. | ||
| So, I mean, I think at the most basic one-sentence level, it's pretty obvious to say Facebook is a publisher. | ||
| Yeah, when they do like site wide notifications or when they say this is fake news content, when they put like qualifications on content, that's Facebook editorializing. | ||
| And even a good point. | ||
| And even be even before the CDC thing, which is wild. | ||
| I mean, one of the one of the entities that was flagged as being very unreliable on covid was the official Science Academy of Sweden, because Sweden never shut down and did better than many, if not most other major countries. | ||
| They they did. | ||
| How dare they? | ||
| But I mean, I think that they did the things that you would really want to focus on. | ||
| I mean, attempting to protect seniors, avoiding large events. | ||
| I mean, they're very specific. | ||
| It's like open now. | ||
| There's like videos coming out. | ||
| People are just walking around. | ||
| It's fine. | ||
| And they never, I mean, they had a lower death per capita rate than we did. | ||
| It was just always the elephant in the room that was just universally ignored. | ||
| But part of that was Facebook not letting their scientific agencies communicate information on the platform. | ||
| All right, Xander Klein says, the fact you used a pizza restaurant instead of a sandwich shop for Dave Rubin, for shame! | ||
| More puns. | ||
| That's a really good idea. | ||
| Dave, let's open a restaurant called Rubin's Rubins. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yes. | |
| I love Rubin's. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I do too. | |
| Yeah, they're good. | ||
| Good Rubin. | ||
| Rubin's Rubins. | ||
| Dave, what are you doing? | ||
| All right, all right. | ||
| Enough jokes. | ||
| All right, let's see what we got. | ||
| Phobos says, Competition and decentralization is the answer to big tech censorship. | ||
| Increased state involvement will not turn out the way people think it will. | ||
| But the problem I see with a lot of libertarians is they don't understand negative rights versus positive rights. | ||
| We're not saying the government has to go in and enforce that a company does something. | ||
| We're saying a company can't do a thing. | ||
| So maybe that's not a good enough distinction in that, I suppose. | ||
| Because then you're arguing they do have to allow certain content to exist, which is still them doing something, I guess? | ||
| No, I don't know. | ||
| Look, I think you look at what happens with privately owned public spaces. | ||
| They say it's owned by a private business, but they gain some tax benefit. | ||
| There's, so there's like instances where they say, if you want to have this building, you have to dedicate X amount of space to the public, so it'll be privately owned, but the public gets to use it. | ||
| Because they let the public use it, they now have one that they have to guarantee First Amendment. | ||
| So, I don't see why there's any difference with, with social media. | ||
| All right, what's this? | ||
| Cole Will says, Newsvoice got nuked this week. | ||
| I don't know what that is. | ||
| There's no news on it, ironically. | ||
| Whois lookup states the domain status is prohibited from transferring to another registrar. | ||
| Keep up the good work. | ||
| I'm not familiar with Newsvoice. | ||
| Alright, we're gonna get the big jump in Super Chats. | ||
| Zenobia X's second super chat for the day. | ||
| Ian, check out the YouTube channel Science and Futurism with Isaac Arthur. | ||
| He goes over stuff like space colonization using current tech and graphene, etc. | ||
| P.S. | ||
| I got chickens because of you, Tim. | ||
|
unidentified
|
LOL. | |
| Chickens are amazing. | ||
| In the new vlog, it's like we put a camera on the ground and the chickens walk up to investigate it. | ||
| Oh, I love them. | ||
| And it's really fun. | ||
| It's just like making weird noises. | ||
| Yeah, it's great. | ||
| Chickens are hilarious. | ||
| Thanks for sending me that, Science of Futurism. | ||
| Thank you. | ||
| All right, let's see. | ||
| Lord Hypno says, Tim, you mentioned both your brother and Rusty Cage in yesterday's podcast and Monkey Jones tonight. | ||
| You should just go ahead and shout out the Trash Rats podcast. | ||
| They do all three together. | ||
| Shout out to the Trash Rats podcast. | ||
| I've not actually listened to it, but obviously I know who these gentlemen are, as they are prolific individuals. | ||
| They're of great production and edginess. | ||
| All right, let's see. | ||
| Wait, what is this? | ||
| This wheel fish says, you can share the link, but it does not go to the top of the news feed. | ||
| It's more than 20 posts down, but at the top of my profile page. | ||
| Interesting. | ||
| Weird. | ||
| Well, we have to have this experiment. | ||
| Everybody just share the link to the show to see if what this wheel fish is saying is true. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Hmm. | |
| That's a good example. | ||
| I like that. | ||
| Well, then that's a federal offense. | ||
| Let's see. | ||
| Skelly- Skellywagswagger says, Ian doesn't seem to understand how open source code works. | ||
| Linux, for example, only ever worked because the original source was well documented. | ||
| Big Tech isn't going to document if forced to go open. | ||
| Well, then that's a federal offense. | ||
| You're saying that they were forced to hire people to archive and document? | ||
| Yeah, if they released code but they obfuscated the release, that would- | ||
| He's saying that they were documenting Linux. | ||
| You're saying that Facebook would be forced to hire an archivist to like... Yeah, welcome to the 21st century. | ||
| We need to understand that code inside and out. | ||
| You were saying you don't want the government to get involved, and now you're saying you're forcing companies... Well, I want them to break up monopolies. | ||
| That's what I like to use the government for. | ||
| That's my biggest... Whoa. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Okay. | |
| That's actually what we were all kind of arguing about earlier. | ||
| Yeah, just how to do it is the... | ||
| Iceman says, have you thought about inviting Aaron Lewis on the show? | ||
| I mean... Aaron Lewis? | ||
| Rock star? | ||
| Celebrity? | ||
| Of course I'd love to have someone like Aaron Lewis on the show. | ||
| We've never thought about it, because I don't know. | ||
| Maybe we should try and reach out to some of these people? | ||
| There have been some famous musicians that we've been in communication with, but I'd love to have Aaron Lewis on the show. | ||
| That'd be fantastic. | ||
| Alright, Lost Cause says, Tim, a local place does a grilled cheeseburger where the top and bottom bun is a grilled cheeseburger. | ||
| We gotta do that! | ||
| Dude, we're legit doing that tomorrow. | ||
| Two grilled cheeses with cheeseburger in the middle? | ||
| So good, but not healthy, but good. | ||
| No, no, no. | ||
| Not only are we gonna do a grilled cheese cheeseburger, but you know what the biggest mistake people make when they make grilled cheese? | ||
| They take the bread, they put the cheese in the middle, they butter both sides, and they grill on both sides. | ||
| No, no, no, no, no. | ||
| You butter the bread, grill it, then you take it off and put the cheese on the grilled side, then close it, then butter it, grill both sides of the bread! | ||
| Oh, hotness. | ||
| Oh, snap. | ||
| Dude, I think we will do that tomorrow. | ||
| That sounds amazing. | ||
| We'll have to go to the store and buy some stuff. | ||
| Have fun with that. | ||
| Sounds healthy. | ||
| That'll be very, very funny. | ||
| Alright, we'll just do a couple more here. | ||
| XRunner55 says, one of your best guests. | ||
| This engineer worked with plenty of political scientists in government and not of this caliber. | ||
| He knows his stuff. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Thanks guys. | ||
| This has been really great, actually. | ||
| I hope you come back. | ||
| This was really fun. | ||
| I'm done. | ||
| You got the knowledge, man. | ||
| That's true. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| This is sort of my, uh, my short form visit here. | ||
| Actually, uh, today I'd be, I'd be down to come back. | ||
| I know how to make a grilled cheese. | ||
| I'm a pretty cool guy. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Ryan Schroeder says, I own a Papa John's in East Aurora, Illinois. | ||
| What a special week to have both Mr. Riley and Mr. Schnatter on the show. | ||
| Thanks, TimCast crew, for all you do. | ||
| Next time you are in town, Mr. Riley, pizza on me. | ||
| Papa John's. | ||
| E-E-E-A. | ||
| That's cool. | ||
| Next time I'm back, I'll definitely check out some of the local cuisine. | ||
| Papa John's in East Aurora, man. | ||
| Gotta be an interesting job running a pizza place in East Aurora, unless the place is dramatically gentrified. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Christopher Noll says, Ian, tech and culture are downstream from environment and perception. | ||
| Also, Will's unintentional mic wire mustache was the best drinking game. | ||
| Thanks. | ||
|
unidentified
|
What? | |
| Well, because the wire right there, I guess people can see the camera. | ||
| I don't know what that means. | ||
| Like, when do you drink? | ||
| Probably when I have a mustache. | ||
| It's like the ironic hipster mustache that guys tattoo on their thumbs. | ||
| Love it. | ||
| Love it. | ||
| Alright. | ||
| Joe Darman says, Tim, you need to watch Babylon 5. | ||
| If you liked DS9, you would love it. | ||
| Ian is like Gakar if Gakar did a ton of drugs. | ||
| Nice. | ||
| It has some eerie parallels. | ||
| Okay. | ||
| I love that character. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Alright, alright. | |
| Let's just grab one more. | ||
| Larry Funk says, they lied about Dave for the sake of making themselves look like the good guys, which is of value to them. | ||
| They gained that value at his expense. | ||
| But I think the problem is... | ||
| It's getting to the point where the narrative is destabilizing, you know? | ||
| How do they keep maintaining this lie that people broke the rules when you have someone like Dave Rubin, nearly a million followers, you know? | ||
| He's a prominent guy. | ||
| They're flying too close to the sun, and I think the narrative is crumbling. | ||
| But my friends, thank you all so much for hanging out on this wonderful Friday night. | ||
| Check out that vlog tomorrow at youtube.com slash castcastle. | ||
| And you can follow this show at TimCast IRL on Facebook and Instagram, and at TimCast underscore IRL if you're on TikTok for some reason. | ||
| We're there too, and you can follow me personally at TimCast. | ||
| Go to TimCast.com, become a member. | ||
| Don't forget, we have tons of articles that go up all the time, and your membership supports those articles, gets you ad-free, and our whole library of members-only podcasts. | ||
| My friends, you can go to the site now. | ||
| You can search, type in a name, and see the episodes we had with these individuals, so it's very easy to navigate now and you can see the whole library of content if you're a member. | ||
| Do you want to shout anything out, Wilfred? | ||
| Shout out to Kentucky State University. | ||
| Shout out to those listening to me. | ||
| If any of you want to hear any more of my drivel going forward, I'm just Wilfred Riley. | ||
| W-I-L-F-R-E-D-R-E-I-L-L-Y. | ||
| Check me out. | ||
| You'll find my Facebook, Twitter, websites with my content, etc. | ||
| And shout out to you guys for having me on the show. | ||
| Enjoyed it. | ||
| Absolutely, dude. | ||
| Thanks for coming. | ||
| That was really great, man. | ||
| You guys can follow me at iancrossland.net and at iancrossland. | ||
| If you wondered what this shirt is that I'm wearing, check it out. | ||
| This is Exertus. | ||
| That's Andreas. | ||
| He's actually in the vlog. | ||
| You know Andreas. | ||
| He eats the Luther burger. | ||
| Yeah, he's the wild one. | ||
| And you can pick this shirt up. | ||
| Unfortunately, I didn't ask him where beforehand. | ||
| Do you know where he's selling these shirts? | ||
|
unidentified
|
No. | |
| I'll let you know next week and you can pick one up of your own. | ||
| It's a cool shirt though. | ||
| At Exertus. | ||
| Very exciting. | ||
| You guys are more than welcome to follow me on Twitter at Sour Patch Kids as I attempt to gain more followers in Sour Patch Kids. | ||
| It's a lofty goal but I think I can make it because I'm introducing my little cat tomorrow. | ||
| I'm adopting him officially tomorrow. | ||
| His name is Dip. | ||
| I'm buying the Dip. | ||
| He's a little crackhead. | ||
| Super excited. | ||
| He's gonna be great. | ||
| I'm stoked. | ||
| So join me over on Twitter. | ||
| We will see you all tomorrow at 9am at youtube.com slash castcastle. |
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