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June 27, 2024 - Stew Peters Show
01:05:44
LIVE: Pride Before FALL: Pastor Makes Biblical Case For DEATH Penalty Punishment For Homosexuality
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I'm on a very specific mission.
We have to identify who the real enemy is.
We have to know where does this infiltration come from.
The American people need a warrior that's unafraid to point out the real enemy.
The American people are deserving of truth, exposure, and extreme accountability for the crimes against humanity that are being committed.
We're on the brink of the complete collapse of America, while at the same time at the precipice of an amazing victory.
If we want to prevent our children from facing a future bloodbath, I mean, I'm talking mass amounts of bloodshed, we need to step up and fight this war and we need to fight it now.
Uncensored.
I refuse to be silenced or muzzled.
Unafraid.
No man will intimidate me.
unstoppable Our enemies have a plan Our enemy's leader has a plan.
We all have one common enemy.
His name is Satan and right now his minions are trying to run this country.
We're going to expose all the lies around the COVID bioweapons.
We're going to expose all the lies around our fake and stolen rig elections.
We're gonna put the sexual depravity of our fake leaders on full display.
And then, when the truth is known to the entire world, we are going to have extreme accountability.
We will be the plan.
We are never going to give up.
Go to TheExtremeEvent.com.
Again, TheExtremeEvent.com.
That is happening on the 4th and 5th of October in beautiful Sarasota, Florida at the Sarasota Fairgrounds.
Who doesn't want to be in Sarasota rather than New Jersey on the 4th of October or anywhere else that you might be in America?
America has deteriorated in many different ways.
And no segment of American life or of the American experience has remained untouched.
Our economy is in shambles.
Our infrastructure is decaying.
Our education system is a complete train wreck.
The list goes on and on.
But by far, by far, the most depraved and disturbing and really the most anti-human attack on the United States of America has been the massive flood of homosexuality and transgenderism and all of the degeneracy and perversion that goes along with it, including pedophilia.
It's only been about 10 years since the Supreme Court legalized gay marriage nationwide.
Now, at that time, many people warned that the ruling was the beginning of a so-called slippery slope, and that if the court could redefine marriage, it could redefine normalcy, and that eventually things could spiral so far out of control that the Supreme Court could be ruling in favor of chopping kids' genitals off and giving them deadly drugs to stop them from entering puberty.
And now that's exactly where we are.
Multiple courts in this country have blocked state-level laws protecting children from transgender mutilation, barring doctors and parents and other sick freaks from turning them into Dr. Frankenstein's monster.
And now the Supreme Court is going to weigh in and decide once again if it's going to thrust the country into degenerative chaos by expanding government-backed perversion and pedophilia, just like it did with the gay marriage ruling.
But you know...
This issue goes way beyond politics.
It goes way beyond court battles and rulings because homosexuality, LGBTism, whatever you want to call it, this isn't just some political movement.
No, it's a religious movement.
It's a demonic, satanic, anti-human, religious movement.
It's directly positioned against Christianity.
And it wants to see Christianity destroyed all over the world and replaced with a disgusting Talmudic lifestyle of infinite genders and child sacrifice and pedophilia.
And right now, as we speak, the United States is being subjected to a constant barrage of sexually charged spiritual warfare.
Children's souls, their spirits, are under attack by perverts.
Kids go to school, they get off that bus, they're handed books or classroom curriculum telling them how great it is to be a homosexual.
How great it is to be groomed and sodomized by an adult and sometimes they even throw illustrations into these books demonstrating all of it.
But that, of course, as hideous as it is, is just the tip of the iceberg.
It gets worse, and it's going to continue getting worse as long as perversion and degeneracy are celebrated in this country.
We have men using little girls' bathrooms in America's public schools, in supermarkets, big box stores all over the country.
There's been multiple rapes by these freaks, reported ones.
There's been multiple instances of perverted men claiming to be trans so that they can go expose themselves in the women's locker room, but we're supposed to spend the entire month of June celebrating these sick f***s.
And again, this all circles back to children.
Homosexuals, transgenders, they love gaining access to children and influencing them and manipulating them and raping them, both physically and spiritually.
There's kids in this country who are going to school and being transitioned without the knowledge of their parents.
Their parents don't even know.
These kids go to school.
They're socially transitioned by some teacher who tells them they'd be better off as the opposite sex.
The school nurse and the school guidance counselor get brought in on it.
The administration gets brought in on it.
They all work together to stop the news from getting to the parents.
And if it does, the parents don't go along with it.
In places like California, they can lose their child or face jail time.
Their child can be just snatched up by perverted, known trafficking organizations like CPS and sent to live with trans-affirming pedophiles.
Sounds like the plot of a horror movie about some dystopian perverted future.
But no, it's not.
This is the world that we live in.
And again, it always comes back to children.
Because homosexuality goes hand in hand with pedophilia.
It goes hand in hand with a disgusting, depraved, morally and spiritually bankrupt lifestyle full of disease and despair and disgust.
Pastor Joel Webin subbed this up best during a recent interview where he held nothing back when he explained why America must reject homosexuality and transgenderism and all of the other perversions that are subverting our culture.
Watch.
When you think of the LGBT community, it's like, well, they're marked by compassion or they're marked by artistic expression or they're marked by...
Well, don't forget the key characteristic.
The key characteristic of the gay community is butt sex.
That's the key characteristic.
It's feces.
That's the key characteristic.
It's AIDS. It's disease.
And it needs to be said because nobody has said it for a very long time because we're all scared.
I don't particularly want to put my neck out there.
You know, right wing watch is probably going to have a field day with this.
You know what?
He's right.
And the numbers don't lie.
Gays are a tiny portion of the population, but they account for over two-thirds of all AIDS cases.
They account for one-third of all molesting pedophiles, and nearly 80% of them are infected with a sexually transmitted disease at any given time.
Remember when they were developing monkey lesions on their face from bathing in each other's piss?
These people are absolutely disgusting.
But remember, this is what's celebrated in this country.
This is what's celebrated in America and all across the Western world.
You know, a number of African countries have the right idea on this whole situation.
While America and the West are expanding homosexuality, Africa is banning it.
They're making it illegal in places like Uganda.
And if you're a gay pedophile who molests a kid, they won't even bother sending you to prison anymore.
They just kill you.
Which is exactly what needs to happen.
For more discussion on this, we're now joined by Pastor Joel Webbin himself.
Pastor Joel, thank you so much for coming.
We appreciate having you.
Thanks for having me on.
Appreciate it.
Of course.
Do you agree that if we don't stop this, that they're never going to stop?
That these people have to be stopped?
Yes.
Yeah, it's just going—that's how sin works.
Sin is a progression.
It's just like, you know, a bad root bears bad fruit on the tree.
The idea that you can isolate one branch and say, oh, you know, this apple tree is just one branch that's going to be devoted to poisonous fruit that'll kill you.
Everything else will be healthy.
That's a fantasy.
That doesn't exist.
That's not the nature of humanity and how God made us, and it's not the nature of sin.
It is a progression.
The Bible talks about sin beginning in the heart or desire, evil, perverted desires, That would be the seed form, give birth to sin, and then sin, when fully grown, it leads to death.
So there's a progression of sin, and the end of sin is death.
And I don't think it's just a metaphor.
I think that many sins, not all, but many sins actually lead to physical death, not just of individuals, but whole societies.
Yeah.
I said in one of the speeches that I gave in Las Vegas, Nevada, that, you know, accountability is God's job, but that it's our job as well.
Do you agree with that, that we need to hold these people accountable?
Yes.
So, that's not a popular opinion, but I'll say it because this is something I determined early on in my ministry, is that I was not going to be embarrassed about any single verse in the Bible.
That the whole thing is God's Word, And that it's all not only morally right, but God is not capricious.
He's not arbitrary.
That which God determines is morally right is also beneficial and good.
The right thing is the good thing.
And so, I love the Word of God.
And one thing that's important for us to understand is categories, theological categories.
There are sins.
In the scripture, and there are also crimes.
And if you think of a Venn diagram, there's a lot of overlap, but it's not just one circle.
There are two distinct circles with a lot of overlap, but not everything overlaps.
So coveting, right?
If you think of the moral commands of God, the Decalogue, Exodus chapter 20, 10 commandments.
The 10th commandment is thou shall not covet.
Now, I don't want to have the coveting police, right?
Like Tom Cruise, Minority Report, you know, where they're trying to, you know, they're trying to do that, sift into your thoughts.
And yeah, Neuralink in the brain.
So I don't think that the Bible says that coveting is a crime, but it is a sin.
And apart from saving grace, which is found in Jesus Christ alone, just coveting alone will send you to hell, if not repented of, and if not forgiven, through the grace that we have in Christ by faith alone.
So that being said, coveting is a sin.
Sin's a big deal, but it shouldn't be a crime.
Sodomy, for Israel, was not only viewed as a sin, but it was viewed as a crime.
And the common trope that, you know, they parade around and around again and again is, you know, what two individuals do in the privacy of their own bedroom is their business, not yours.
But the problem is that it doesn't stay in the bedroom.
And that whole concept is not a biblical concept, nor is it a logical concept.
Some Russian scientist could be making a nuclear bomb in his bedroom, but it's everybody's business.
What you're doing in the bedroom, if it has the potent potential for destroying entire cultures and societies and nations, then it absolutely is everybody's business.
Sodomy was treated as a crime in Israel.
And here's the thing that people don't realize.
It was a crime in England and many other nations in Europe, in America, and on the books in states like Texas and Oklahoma, all the way up until just a few decades ago.
So we're not just talking about the old covenant for Israel.
And that's something that God did way back then with this particular group at this particular time.
No, God's law is timeless.
It's good for all peoples and all places at all times.
Sodomy is not merely a sin.
It is a crime because it destroys people in a physical, literal sense.
And we're talking Israel of the Bible, not Israel, the 1948 secular created nation-state, correct?
That is correct.
Which, by the way, I'm happy to talk about.
I'm a partial preterist.
Preterist means past or fulfilled.
I read Romans chapter 11 that all Israel will be saved as something that God's promises don't return void.
That's a promise he made, and he did fulfill it.
And it was in the future of Paul's writing, which I would date Romans, that book, at about AD 55.
But it's actually 19 and a half centuries in our past.
That AD 70, the destruction of Jerusalem, Some of the greatest prophecies of Jesus Christ ever fulfilled.
Matthew 24, the Olivet Discourse.
Jesus says, not one stone.
He says, all these things will come to pass in this generation.
And they did come to pass.
And the very people who cried out, crucify him, actually saw within 40 years, which in Jewish terms was one generation, they saw a spiritual parousia.
That is a second coming of Christ in a spiritual sense.
There's even...
I documented accounts of seeing like silhouettes of chariots on the smoke and the clouds from the desolation and everything that was happening, the destruction.
And I believe that many ethnic Jews at that time, Israelites, actually realized that Jesus was the Messiah, that they crucified the Son of God, that they repented of their sins and came to saving faith.
In other words, the land physical promises, that's been done.
The spiritual futuristic revival promises, that's been done.
What's left to us in the future?
Nothing.
The church is Israel.
The church of Jesus Christ, we are God's elect, and...
That's it.
And the idea that there's this special adjacent, like there's Christian and then there's Christian adjacent, that is a theological category that does not exist.
Does Judeo-Christian mean anything to you?
It means the same thing as intelligent liberal or jumbo shrimp or any other oxymoron.
Or safe and effective.
Right.
Yeah.
No, Judeo-Christian is a psyop, and a lot of this, I think it's helpful to get the theological underpinnings.
You invited a pastor on the show, so that's, you know, that's obviously, that's my opinion.
But I think, you know, as you're trying to talk people, right, when you're trying to talk your grandma who sends, you know, a portion of her fixed income to Israel because she's been taught her whole life by John Hagee or whoever, you know, those who bless Israel will be blessed, one— Approach your grandma with some respect and kindness,
but two, if you're going to persuade someone, it's difficult, but to persuade them that this is not what the Bible's talking about, this modern nation state and the idea that, you know, this is just, this is not true.
I think you start with a theology, you start with dispensationalism, and I'm sure I'm sure you're probably familiar with this, Stu, but that's a 150-year-old doctrine.
It's very novel, very recent.
It is not covenant theology.
It is not the doctrines held by all of church history, but until, again, very briefly, it's Darby.
It's Schofield.
The Schofield Study Bible was a household item.
Everyone in America had a copy of it and these things in Great degree were funded by Zionist Jews because it laid some of the theology.
Think of it like this.
If you're struggling, if you're nomadic or you feel, you know, dispossessed, refugee, whatever word you want to use, and you're looking for sympathies or you're looking to somehow get to, you know, a place in the world, one of the things to consider is who is holding power at that particular time in the world?
Well, it was Christendom.
It was Christians.
The Christendom was this unstoppable force that brought, not oppression, but incredible freedom and liberty and prosperity and blessing to the world.
Going into India and saying, I'm sorry, you can't bury living women with their dead husbands anymore.
Sorry for the oppression.
Sorry to colonize.
No, we're going to do things according to the Word of God, and it was largely benevolent.
Now, we're talking about sinners.
Christians are still sinners, so it's not perfect, but it was an incredible improvement to paganism and all these other world religions.
So, all of a sudden, Christians in Europe, in America, that's the center of power for the whole world, and they have a holy text, a sacred book, the Bible, and to be able to read yourself into that— And say, well, there's this one particular group, and we're not going to join your group.
We're not going to be Christians with you and share in the prosperity by also worshiping the Lord Jesus Christ and being blessed through obedience to His law.
We're not going to do that because we hate Christ, we reject Christ, but is there some kind of third category?
There's the non-Christian, then there's the Christian, but can there be, while still rejecting Christ and rejecting the Messiah, a Christian-adjacent And that's, here comes Darby, here comes Schofield, here comes, there sure is, dispensationalism, premillennial dispensationalism.
Jesus will return probably next Thursday.
And really, God's big story is something he's been doing with Israel.
He put it on a parenthetical thread.
Pause to do something with the Gentiles for 2,000 years, but he's going to pick back up his true passion, his true story.
And for us as Gentiles, the best that we can do is that our revival and our life from the dead— This spiritual blessing that will come from the Lord, it's happening, but it'll really happen.
The catalyst and the equation that will really kickstart it will be when Israel gets saved, when the Jews get saved.
So the best thing that I can do for Brazil or for China, for Russia, for all these other people, uh, unbelievers in all these Gentile nations is, is somehow make sure one that Israel isn't blown off the face of the map.
So we need to physically literally sustain them.
And then number two, uh, we need to see them get saved.
And so we're going to pour a lot of money, a lot of time, a lot of effort, uh, because if they're blessed, then, then we'll get the scraps, right?
That if we can see to it that God's true biological children are blessed, then the stepchild might get a piece of the pie.
And that's dispensationalism in a nutshell.
Now, I'm using, you know, strong language, but that is the outworkings, the fruit of a dispensational theology, which again is a very modern, novel idea, but it swept America by storm.
That If you're wondering, what is dispensationalism?
It's like two fish swimming by each other in the water, and one says to the other, the water sure is nice today, and the other fish says, what's water?
You're a dispensational in America.
You're dispensational before you're even a Christian, right?
In the same way, you know, it's like I was a Baptist from birth, and I became a Christian when I was seven.
You know, like, you're a Baptist by default, you know, and you're...
Pre-millennial dispensational, you know, Left Behind series, the secret rapture, that is American theology.
So there are guys who don't even attend church, but it's in their bloodstream, and all that was very intentional, and it is very biblically wrong.
It is not actually what the Bible teaches.
So, explain to me then, if Pastor Joel Webbin understands this, and Stu Peters understands this, and as I see on X, millions and millions of other people are seeing this in my email all over the place, it's in the comments, on Rumble, it's everywhere.
People are seeing this, they call it noticing.
People are noticing all of this trickery that has been occurring, right?
And it all comes from one group of people, but even prior to that, Prior to the founding of this nation-state, Israel, 1948, May 14th, there was 1930s Weimar-controlled Germany.
Millions of people supported the rise of the National Socialists.
They promised a return to normalcy.
And the degeneracy that I was talking about in the monologue that we began our segment speaking of is what they burned.
They killed it with fire.
So why is it so hard for people to understand that, especially pastors that go to Bible school People like Pastor Greg Locke, who stands there with the star of REM fan behind him and loudly proclaims that Gaza needs to be turned to a parking lot.
Right.
Well, to be clear, and I think you would agree with this, I am not, I feel like the Lord of the Rings.
I think of the Ents, the March of the Ents, you know, the tree people.
And there's this one, you know, scene in the movie, it's also in the book, you know, where, you know, there's the orcs, and then there's, you know, the kingdom of men and elves and all these different things.
And Treebeard, one of the Ents, he says, I am on no one's side, because no one is on my side.
Right.
So, as a white, heterosexual, Christian young man in America, nobody's on my side.
So, I'm not on Israel's side.
But I'm certainly also not on Sodomites for Palestine side, either.
I don't really have a dog in the fight.
I would like to see, here's a crazy thought, I would like to see America first.
I would like to see my country love its own people, build a wall, Stop the great replacement of Heritage America.
Care about America and stop sending billions to Ukraine, also to Israel.
But to answer your question, there was one little piece where you said, how come pastors who have gone to seminary don't get this?
And I think there's your answer.
They went to seminary.
And that's where the Schofield Bible was like pounded into their head.
Yeah, this is the reigning dogma.
I'm asking you because I think I knew that, and I'm pretty sure I knew that, but there are a lot of people who are just waking up to this, and so I'm asking the question because I'm seeking your explanation.
You're a pastor.
Yeah, I think that is what's being taught.
Now, there's a few different positions here.
So there's dispensationalism.
That's what I was talking about first.
In a nutshell, that's the idea that in our future, not just at the time of the writing of the Bible, Old or New Testament, which was, of course, spread out with 40 different authors, 66 books of the Bible, 1,500 years.
But the dispensationalism is the idea that in our future, not just the author's future, but in our future still, in the year of our Lord, 2024, that there's still both land, physical promises for Israel, and also spiritual promises for Israel in our future.
That's dispensationalism.
The idea that, you know, the nation-state of Israel has a divine right to the land.
Whereas I would say, just for the record, to be fair, I don't think any nation has a divine right, including America.
And what I mean by that is I'm not saying there's no right.
I think that our country is legitimate.
It's like, oh, well, you took it from people.
Yeah, Native Americans who took it from other Native Americans who took it from—all land is taken.
That's how it works.
Conquest, and that can be done ethically, or it can be done horribly.
You know, there's all that.
But what I mean by a divine right is we don't have an inevitable, in perpetuity, this unending divine right that it's written in the stars, that God has, you know, ordained that this soil will belong to us.
In that same way, people think, under the banner of dispensationalism, that Israel does have a divine right to the land.
And they would see, you know, 1940s and putting the nation-state of Israel back on the map, they would see that as this great fulfillment to biblical prophecy.
And I would say, no, this was...
I know you see it that way, but this was concocted.
Now, that said, I'm a Calvinist, you know, full disclosure.
So I believe that everything that happens, even sin, even bad things, does still happen within the providence of God's sovereign will.
And so I think God allowed that to happen.
Not because it's a fulfillment to prophecy, not because Israel is always going to be there, not because of the divine right to the land, but all things that happen, happen within the banner of God's will.
So that's dispensationalism is, there's going to be this physical promise, and it's more than just God's sovereignty, but it actually is an eternal divine right to that land, and they're going to say the spiritual promise that there'll be a mass revival among the Jewish people.
Dispensationalism holds to both.
Physical, land promises, spiritual, revival.
Then there's the Reformed covenantal perspective that most of the Reformers held.
Guys like Calvin, guys like Zwingli, and then there's, you know, the Puritans.
Most of the Puritans held to this as well.
Winthrop.
You know, different Puritan writers, John Owen, this idea that, no, the land promises are done.
Because if you look at the very end of the book of Joshua, this was so helpful for me as a pastor, because I preached through Joshua, and I stumbled upon this, and it was like, whoa, the light bulb just went off.
But it says at the end of Joshua, the whole book is about conquest of Canaan.
You know, they're removing all these pagan tribes, and a lot of them are inbred tribes.
And I'm not just speaking about ethnically, but I'm saying that...
It gets a little weird, but they're Nephilim.
They're the descendants of fallen angels that saw the daughters of men, that they were lovely, and took them as wives and produced this fallen angel hybrid monster.
That's what we see in the book of Numbers.
They look at Jericho and see that they're like grasshoppers in their sight, or the book of Amos says that they were as tall as the cedars.
And you think Goliath, like Goliath was pretty tall, probably about, you know, nine, 10 feet.
But Goliath is generations down the line.
He's actually small.
But in the line of Anak, going back to the giants and at the time of Joshua, because David is way later than Joshua, you're talking about monsters roaming the earth.
And so God is not, God's not being harsh.
Again, I'm putting these things out to show whether it's sodomy being a crime or all these.
I'm trying to help people see that the law of God is not just morally right, but it's good.
So God commands Joshua and Israel, expel all these pagans, people from the land.
And at the end of the book of Joshua, it happens.
And the Bible literally says, it says that everything that was prophesied through the prophet Moses of all the lands from this border to this river to this to that, it all came to pass.
So here's the deal.
God didn't change his mind.
God's not schizophrenic.
He's not bipolar.
And God certainly isn't a liar.
God made promises to Israel.
And it's not that he didn't keep his promises.
He did fulfill the promises.
So the land promise, it was fulfilled at the end of the book of Joshua.
Here's what happened though.
God kept up his end of the deal.
And then Israel gave themselves to idolatry, to pagan practices, to Molech, to sacrificing children, to all these different things.
And they were spewed out of the land.
It's not that God didn't fulfill His promise.
He did, but then Israel forfeited that promise due to their unbelief and sin.
So the Lamb promises were fulfilled, but they've been done away with.
Then lastly, it's the spiritual promises within the Reformed tradition Not all, but many of the Reformers, they would say the spiritual ones are still in our future.
So, no divine right to the land, no land promises, but there is a spiritual revival still in our future.
And then this last position is what I would hold.
I would say, no, even the spiritual promises, Joshua shows us land promises fulfilled, and also after exile, they're re-fulfilled.
Later on, Nehemiah, also in Ezra, But then lastly, I would say that even the spiritual promises of a revival, Romans 11, this Romans 11 that the natural branches were cut off so that the Gentiles could be grafted in as a wild olive shoot, but don't get haughty, don't get arrogant.
If God did not spare the natural branches, He won't spare you either.
And then there's this promise from God that the natural branches actually will be re-grafted back in.
And so I'm sympathetic to those who see that as we're still waiting for that, but But actually, I believe what happened is that in AD 70 and the years leading up to AD 70, that God's judgment was so severe on Israel that through his judgment, there was a silver lining of mercy and that it was a fulfillment of everything that Jesus said.
People realized, oh my goodness, we killed the Messiah.
That really was, truly, this was the Son of God, just like the Roman centurion took him, you know, about Truly, this was the Son of God when He pierces His side, the water and blood.
And, you know, it took the Jews 40 years, took the Roman guy one day, but they still got it.
Eventually, they came around, and I think a great many of them actually did.
The natural branches actually were restored, but then you just have, that's it.
You don't have any biblical writing further in terms of chronological order.
The Talmud doesn't come into play until centuries later.
So then the question is, What happened?
And I think what happened is what we see in the book of Acts, what we see elsewhere in the New Testament, that the Jewish people, many of them became Christians, and then they intermarried and dispersed.
And now, if you're looking for, well, who has the blood of Abraham, you know, flowing through their veins— Well, Christians in Palestine do, and some people in Europe do, and some people all over the world.
The ethnic line has been broken in God's sovereignty.
The covenantal line has been fulfilled in God's sovereignty.
The land promises and physical promises has been fulfilled in God's sovereignty.
We need to quit reading Like unhinged sci-fi Christians, the Bible, and saying, oh, what's going to happen with the end times?
No, that is done.
What we're doing now is just our marching orders of the knowledge of the glory of God spreading across the earth like the waters cover the sea.
And we should think about Israel.
That doesn't mean we have to have a malice, but we should think about the modern state of Israel.
Number one, this is not the same as Old Covenant Israel in our Old Testament.
It's not.
Number two, it is a legitimate nation state.
I'm not saying the way that it was started was legitimate.
But all things, whether right or wrong.
So Joe Biden, I think he stole the election.
But there is a certain point where even if a king comes in wrongfully, there is a certain point where...
He's been there long enough.
He is king.
It is a legitimate kingdom, or it's a legitimate nation.
So my point in saying that is, Israel, I think that the founding was one of the biggest mistakes in history that just gave birth to unceasing wars, and it's never going to stop.
But that said, it is a legitimate nation.
A nation state.
And so I think the Christians should view it not as a special carved out people, but the same way we view any other nation, China or Brazil, we should view it as these are people made in the image of God.
They need to get saved.
There's not any special divine land right for them.
There's not a special promise of revival for them.
We send missionaries just like we would anywhere else with only one exception.
Not that they're special, but there is one exception.
There are certain cults and groups that are incredibly hostile towards Christ, but in terms of major world religions, Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, there is no major world religion With a more hostile view towards the person and work of Jesus Christ, our Savior and Lord, than Talmudic Judaism.
Heartbreak.
I have to stop down.
Heartbreak.
Fascinating conversation.
We'll be right back with more Pastor Joel Levin.
This is amazing stuff.
right back.
Oh, oh, oh, oh. oh.
Oh, oh, oh. oh.
This is getting out of control.
Our government is sinking a trillion dollars in debt every 100 days.
That's right, a trillion dollars every 100 days.
Do you want to bail the government out of debt?
Yeah, no, I don't think so.
You see, when people worry about the national debt, they often turn to safe haven assets.
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As modern Americans, we've been spoon-fed this dumbed-down, cartoonish, simplified version of history.
It's all fake.
It's all bullshit.
Everything that we have been taught is part of a self-serving narrative written by the people who will say and do anything to keep us on a leash.
Now, this version of history, some big-name corrupt families like the Rockefellers and the Rothschilds and their many associates are credited over and over and over again with propelling human development.
Throughout the late 18 and early 1900s, almost every major American city was burnt to the ground.
What if we really are quite literally living atop the ashes of an advanced civilization that's been hidden from us?
for our entire lives. - Man, absolutely amazing conversation And this is like, you invite pastors on because you want to be able to understand from a viewpoint.
I'm not a biblical scholar.
I'm going to be the first person to admit that.
Have I read the Bible?
Yes, absolutely.
And when I read the Bible, I don't know if I'm like you.
I don't know if you're like me.
I read something once.
I interpret it one way.
I read it another.
It's something completely different to me all of a sudden.
Pastor Joel Webben is back with us.
Has it ever happened to you, by the way?
I mean, do you ever go back and read a verse and you're like, whoa, that's not exactly what I thought it was?
Absolutely.
So much of theological maturity and growing, it's as much unlearning as it is learning.
I think that's what it is.
You have a certain grid, and you see the Scripture in a certain light, because you were born in that tradition, or you went to that particular school, or you had those particular parents, or that particular vacation Bible school, or whatever.
And yeah, it takes time to, okay, but what does the Scripture really mean?
I want to talk about accountability, because we're big here on that.
Before we went to break, you were talking about what needs to be done with Israel.
These people need to be saved.
They need to find Jesus Christ.
They need to lovingly accept the gospel.
They need to call out His name.
They need to declare Him their Lord and Savior.
They need to be baptized in His name.
They need to seek out the Church of Christ.
God tells you a pretty specific formula, which is also very simple, on how to have eternal life and salvation through Jesus Christ, the Lord and Savior.
What about...
I mean, do you believe that we're a nation under judgment by God right now?
Oh, yeah.
Yes, sir.
Yeah.
And so what is the accountability for us?
What is the resolution there?
I mean, obviously, I've always said repentance and that this country is in need of a spiritual cleansing.
What are your thoughts on our way to handle this judgment?
Great question.
Yeah, so I had the privilege with a few other pastors who are friends of mine.
Guys, there's not many, but a few pastors that I've been able to find who, like the sons of Issachar, know what time it is.
And we together crafted a statement.
We called it the Statement on Christian Nationalism and the Gospel.
And in that, we sought to define what we believe Christian nationalism actually means, because obviously it's a massively wide spectrum from, you know, Taylor, different politicians all the way to different pastors, to this, to that, to the other, and so a lot of different ideas.
So we tried to etch out and say, this is what we believe it means, and in that, containing a roadmap of repentance, what it would look like for the judgment of God to cease and for us to receive His mercy instead, which you don't get God's mercy apart from repentance.
It is conditional.
R.C. Sproul, he once said, quit saying that the love of God is unconditional.
If it's unconditional, why does he set the condition Of repentance.
There is a condition.
Now, I believe, as someone within the Reformed tradition, that God meets this condition by actually granting repentance.
That God actually, that it's not just conjured up by the work of man or the will of man, but repentance is a gift, and it has to be given by God.
Judas, you know, or Esau would be an even better example.
It says he sought the blessing, right, when it went to Jacob.
Instead, he sought it with tears, but it says, but he could not repent.
It's not just that he didn't.
He couldn't.
He was not He wasn't chosen by God, and I know that's a hard thing to hear.
But all that being said, my point is we must repent.
God will grant repentance to His people, and I pray by God's grace that He would grant it to us as a nation.
Now, that doesn't mean each and every individual of the 330 million American citizens become regenerate Christians, that they all are born again, that they're all Christians in the true spiritual sense.
But you absolutely can have a Christian nation without all the people being Christians.
And for the record...
This is another Issachar, you know, understanding the times.
What time is it?
You don't even have to have 50% plus one, right?
So the sodomites took less than 3% of the population and in 40 years, which is relatively short, replaced the American flag with a rainbow.
It's impressive.
You know, you've got to give honor where honor is due.
But Christians don't think like this.
We think we've got to have a grassroots revival and we've got to, you know, there's got to be preaching.
And I'm a preacher, so don't get me wrong.
I'm all about preaching.
But we think that we've got to have tent revivals and preaching and we've got to get, you know, over half of the country saved before we can have Christian laws.
That's not true.
That's not the way power works.
Evangelicals have to stop viewing power as icky.
Biblically speaking and historically, the last 2,000 years of history, both biblically and historically, bottom-up revival is not what God does.
I'm not saying He can't do it.
I think we should pray for it.
But if we're talking about not what God can do or what He will do, What has God done?
Statistically speaking, God has done top-down revival, right?
So Josiah comes in as king, and he says, I'm sorry, but the pagan sacrifices will stop.
By force.
They're done.
You're done, right?
That's, you know, you have bad king, bad king.
And here's the deal.
The people, it's not that the people, if we can just get enough people to be morally better and be saved, then we can elect a good king.
No, the people follow the kings.
It's so important for, I think, for Christians to read books on like elite theory, for instance, or to understand.
No, it's not in the 1950s, for instance.
It's not that a bunch of housewives got together and they were watching TV and they thought, you know what, man, we like some of the television shows, Leave it to Beaver, things like this, but what we really wish is that there was just a little bit more butt sex.
And then, you know, Hollywood said, well, man, we didn't want to do that.
You know, you're really pushing us here.
But, you know, we're capitalists, you know, and if that's what the market wants, then I guess we'll go ahead and oblige.
You think that's what happened?
No, it was the leaders leading.
That's what leaders do.
They were pushing the public.
So it's not the masses...
We're so quick to say that, you know, that politics is downstream of culture.
But think about that.
There is a truth there.
Politics is downstream of culture.
But it's not just a stream.
It's a two-way street, is how to think about it.
Culture is also downstream of politics.
So you get bad culture from Hollywood and all these different things, and that gets you, in 2015, a Bergefell.
Right?
Political ruling.
But then what happens after Berger fell?
The culture goes exponentially more perverse.
So what I'm saying is that we can get...
So all that back to the Christian nationalism.
What do we do?
We repent.
But repentance, it can't just be in word.
It must be in deed.
To say, I'm sorry, you know, you hugged the porcelain, you know, thrown as you over drank the night before, you're throwing up, I'm sorry God, I promise I'll never do it again.
Well, but you gotta put that into action.
You need to put hands and feet on your repentance, otherwise it's not actually genuine.
And so, all that being said, with Christian nationalism, What we advocated for is that we need to be unapologetically, distinctly Christian as a nation.
We should—I like the Constitution.
It's not working, but I like the Constitution.
I wish we could have the Constitution.
But we need to adopt a distinctly Christian preamble to the Constitution— I would throw my hat in the ring for the Apostles' Creed.
Something that's creedal, a pan-Protestant idea.
So it's creedal, not confessional.
So not like something like a distinctly Baptist or Presbyterian or Anglican confession.
I don't want to see Presbyterians locked up or Baptists flogged.
A pan-Protestant, true to our founding and true to the Scripture, pan-Protestant.
So creedal, meaning the Apostles' Creed is something that every single Christian can get behind, whether you're Presbyterian, you're Baptist, you're Episcopalian, whatever.
So adopt a distinctly Christian preamble, and then all the Ten Commandments must be legislated.
What we've done is we've thought the second table of the law, so second table meaning commandments five through ten, the commandments of God that pertain to our horizontal relationship with our neighbor, like don't steal, don't murder, these kinds of things, we think that should be legislated by the civil magistrate, but the first table of the law, not that.
But that's not true.
And I'm not just talking about Old Covenant Israel and the Old Testament.
You look at King Alfred.
You look at Constantine.
You look at Richard the Lionheart.
You look at Duke Godfrey, who chopped a Turk in half diagonally with one swing of the sword.
These guys, they legislated both tables of the law.
That's where all the prosperity comes from because you can't hang in midair these second table commandments of don't steal from your neighbor apart from I have no other gods before me.
Idolatry is the fountainhead of the stream.
You cannot have an idolatrous people and yet somehow have a moral people.
Do you believe that right now we have an idolatrous people?
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Explain that.
Even among Christians.
So we definitely have idolatrous people in the sense that whether it's material or money or these kinds of things, there's an idolatry there, of course.
But beyond that, there's an idolatry of sexual pleasure, an idolatry of self, an idolatry of your own inward identity.
But even for Christians, there's, well, there's some unorthodox idols that you wouldn't expect.
But one, this might get me in trouble, but I think that the evangelical church currently has an idolatry when it comes to missions and even evangelism.
You can idolize anything.
These are things that are wonderful things.
We want to spread the gospel of Jesus Christ.
But we did it, and then all of our kids grew up to be gay, you know, with purple hair.
We, all these overseas missions, all this evangelism, all these different things, but at the cost of our children.
Because liberals don't have kids.
Conservative Christians have kids, but they didn't raise them.
They put them in public school to be trained by an atheistic Darwinian...
Because the whole homosexuality thing, it makes perfect sense within a Darwinian framework.
And so we handed over our kids.
Votie Bauckham says...
You can't hand your kids to Caesar and be surprised when they come back as Romans.
And so that's what we did at the cost of our own children's future.
That's the boomer mentality.
Boomers sold the future of their posterity down the river for a few extra bucks.
And then the good boomers, the evangelical Christian boomers, they did it for the sake of missions.
Apathy and complacency played a really big part in that as well.
Yes, sir.
I only have about five minutes left here, and I wish I had five hours with you.
I think we're good to go.
And you have a pastor who's preaching these things.
If you have a leader like, oh, I don't know, Hennepin Avenue, United Methodist Church, Minneapolis, growing up there.
David Scotes later went to the Crystal Cathedral, of course, for all kinds of money and big million-dollar deals, all the way to Father Durham in Prescott, Wisconsin, to this Mike Montgomery in Red Wing, Minnesota.
And now we watch like Pastor Greg Locke and all of these people that are just...
I mean, they are just so sold out to the Schofield Bible.
I've got people in my family that are older, boomers, that they're just so bought in to this, Joel, that they cannot hear anything.
So if there's somebody that does hear this today and they're like, wow, this guy really makes a lot of sense, what he said.
You know, I really want to go and try, I mean, what do they do?
What do you think logistically, if they've been going there and they have a pastor who's saying all these things, you know, just take Israel, for example, or the Jews or whatever, and they're saying these things and they're misleading, really, their flock, likely knowingly at this point, as many people that are noticing this, I think Greg Locke knows, I can't say that for certain, that's between him and God, but I mean...
As a faith leader, he's going to be held to an extra level of accountability when he faces that judgment.
But what do you think somebody does if they're going to a church where they have a faith leader that's preaching these things and they just know that it's inherently wrong?
Right.
Well, if you can, I think you should leave.
Now, that said, there's so many displaced—because I'm a pastor, I get emails, probably the most common email I get right now are from churchless Christians, right?
Because the church so discredited itself right along every other institution, whether it be— Yeah, the church sucks in a lot of cases.
I know.
And so, and that's been ongoing for quite a while, but it became really, really, the veil was lifted in 2020 and, you know, these last four years.
So whether it was, you know, capitulating on COVID or the Summer of Love BLM or whatever, all these issues, you know, wokeness and COVID and everything else.
And so a lot of churches discredited themselves.
Now, here's the problem, though.
Like, all the anons on Twitter, you know, were like, yeah, you know, Jules are champion, you know, like...
I'm like, guys, I love you.
Appreciate the support.
I think you got the right position, but get your butt in church.
And here's the deal.
You're not going to find a perfect one.
So I think part of it is determining what are the deal breakers, right?
What can I settle for?
Because you're going to have to settle for something.
People come to my church, for instance.
I'm a Calvinist, like I said earlier.
I've got guys who they know what time it is.
On multiple issues, whether it be Israel or whether it be, you know, sodomy or whether it be COVID. And they came to the church just because we didn't mask, you know, or because they were worried about shedding with their kids.
And they knew that, like, you know, they're like, probably nobody here has been vaccinated, you know, or very few.
And so they picked the church because of that.
And then, you know, now it's been a few years, you know, since 2020.
And there's been some of those pastoral discussions where it's like, ah, like, I love your stance on COVID, but you're a Calvinist?
God chooses people.
I hate that.
And then I have to have a conversation with them and say, I get it.
I could be wrong.
You could be wrong.
But I'm still pastor, at least for now.
So the question is, can you tolerate it?
And if you can't, before you just leave, you better have a backup plan.
And backup plan can't just be watching YouTube constantly.
Sermons.
Part of what we need is brick and mortar, flesh and blood.
You need to touch grass with the saints of God, as David says, the excellent ones in all the earth, and gather.
Worship is warfare.
When we worship and we ascend Mount Zion, the holy hill, we do so in the name of Jesus with faith and his promises.
Things happen.
Things happen, and that doesn't happen by just podcasting.
Yeah, that's the church meeting together.
That's the whole thing that we said with COVID. No, the church has to physically meet together because it matters.
So my point is this.
Yeah, you probably should leave.
If your church is gay-affirming, get out of there immediately.
If you're part of the United Methodist with the vote, they just get out of there.
Don't even take a second look back, like Lot's wife, you know, and turn to a pillar of salt.
But if it's on Israel, If it's John Hagee and it's just a Jewish shill, you know, just with zero abandon, then you probably should leave.
But if it's an older boomer pastor who doesn't know any better and he's not arguing, like if he's not arguing for billions of dollars being sent to Israel, he's not arguing about land rights and physical promises, but he does still in his theology think that there's a future...
Spiritual revival for Israel and that that would be life from the dead, blessing for more salvations among the Gentiles.
I think there are problems there, but I would not resolve to be homeless.
I had a pastor, a guy who calls himself a pastor, pull up to my home.
I was walking out with my kids.
Actually, my kids were like, oh, Pastor Mike is waiting outside.
I'm like, what?
And I guess he'd been sitting out there for like 15 minutes.
I walk out with my kids and no BS, Joel, he gets out of his, no, he didn't get out of his car.
Let me tell this accurately.
I walked out of my house, little daughter in my arms, my son's walking by me, and he rolls down the window of his vehicle and he starts just screaming at me.
Don't ever tell anybody that you're a Christian ever again over your stance on Israel.
You're going to hell.
That's not tolerable.
That would be an example of a pastor that you don't want to tolerate.
Well, that's exactly, that's when you got to leave.
But my point is, all these guys, like Luther, Martin Luther, you know, like he was a reformer, he was a Calvinist.
He also, you know, he has his book called The Jews and Their Lies, which is obviously controversial, and a lot of reformers didn't like him for it, but that was his position.
He saw some of those things in his day.
But Luther, here's the deal.
Luther didn't just leave the Catholic Church.
He tried to stay.
He wanted to stay.
And there was a death warrant out for it.
They were trying to literally kill him, and he's still trying to stay.
He was saying, well, selling indulgences to get loved ones out of purgatory for cash is probably a bad idea.
I'll stick around, and I'll endure this, and I'll endure that.
But could you change some of these things that are just absolutely sinister?
I think, here's my point.
I think we should be like Luther, Martin Luther.
We should have that mindset like, okay, there are some things that make the church a synagogue of Satan.
At that point, it's not leaving a church.
The church has ceased to be a church.
I can't stay.
But there are other things where...
Man, it just, it takes time.
Dispensationalism is a hell of a drug.
We've been under the spell for, you know, 150 years.
It is lifting.
I'm encouraged.
I bet you're encouraged.
I see it lifting.
The spell is lifting.
And here's the deal.
It might, that spell might lift even with your local pastor.
And it'd be a shame.
To run out on him, you know what I mean?
And then two years later, he's on the Stu Peters show, you know, talking about these things.
You're like, oh man, he came around, you know?
And so I think having some patience, but again, within reason, sometimes you got to go.
Pastor Joel Webb, an amazing conversation before we go, and I'm going to run over time, but I don't care.
Will you take us out in prayer?
Yes, sir.
Father, we thank you for Jesus Christ, that he's the root, this olive tree that has union with the root.
And that's where all the life and the flourishing and the fruit comes from.
That root was not Abraham, not in the truest sense.
It wasn't King David.
It wasn't the old covenant and the nation of Israel.
But the root, not seeds, plural, but singular, the seed of Abraham, that root was Christ.
And the only way to have union with Him is by grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone.
And that is available to all peoples, in all times, in all places.
And Lord, we pray that people would put their faith in Jesus, that they would trust that he is enough, that we are Israel in the truest, eternal, ultimate sense, that we are not, Christians are not stepchildren sitting at the far end of the table, hoping for some attention Christians are not stepchildren sitting at the far end of the table, hoping for But we are beloved, adopted children, and that this goes for all nations, including the modern state of Israel.
It's not the Old Testament.
It's not the Old Testament nation state, but it is still a people created in the image of God.
This promise is for them as well, if it comes with a condition.
They repent of their sins and trust in Jesus.
And Lord, we pray that that would be the case.
I pray that Israel would repent of their sins, of certain war crimes, of perversion, of influencing with transgenderism and sodomy and these kinds of things.
I know it's not everyone in Israel.
But there are some key leaders, many, that have done this in multiple cultures.
And Lord, we pray for the sake of our children and their protection that there would be repentance all the way around, for Americans, for Jews, for Brazilians, all the way around, that we would trust in Jesus and be rooted in Him.
He's the fountainhead from which all blessings come from, not some nation on the other side of the world.
Help us to believe this and be blessed by it.
it Jesus name Amen as a child you would wait and watch from far away
But you always knew that you'd be the one that work while they all play And you, you'd lay awake at night and scheme Of all the things that you would change But it was just a dream
Here we are, don't turn away now We are the warriors that built this town Here we are, don't turn away now
We are the warriors that built this town From dust
We are the warriors that built this town We will be the one that built this town
Here we are, don't turn away now
We are the warriors that built this town Of all the things that you would change But it was just a dream Here we are, don't turn away now We are the warriors that built this town Here we are, don't turn away now We are the warriors that built this town From dust Here we are, don't turn away now We are the warriors that built this town Here we are, don't turn away now We are the warriors that built this town
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