Joe Rogan and callers dissect the tension between faith, physics, and UFO claims, citing Bob Lazar's Area 51 reverse engineering, the Tic Tac craft's inertia-defying flight, and whistleblower accounts from Stargate. While guests like Bon argue advanced interstellar travel violates known laws yet remain skeptical of government lies regarding JFK and Epstein, Rogan counters that belief in aliens often isolates individuals from reality. Ultimately, the discussion pivots from cosmic mysteries to earthly solutions, urging listeners to combat loneliness through community building rather than escaping into unproven extraterrestrial narratives. [Automatically generated summary]
Transcriber: CohereLabs/cohere-transcribe-03-2026, WAV2VEC2_ASR_BASE_960H, sat-12l-sm, script v26.04.01, and large-v3-turbo
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Area 51 and Aliens00:07:42
Hello, friends, neighbors, colleagues, co reasoners.
Hello, everybody.
I hope you're doing well.
Hope you're having a great day.
Hoping you're having a good life with its ups and downs.
Life, life, life.
I am, of course, overjoyed, thrilled, and happy to take your questions.
And let's start right off with Bon.
Bon, put you two together, and it's once on the lips, forever on the hips.
Bon, Bon, if you want to mute, I'm all ears.
Oh, hey, thanks for accepting my request.
You're welcome.
Go ahead.
Okay.
Yeah, I was looking at this alien stuff, and I think I've come into Christianity on my own just because life's taken me there.
And now all this stuff coming out about aliens.
I've watched a lot of alien videos.
I've probably had like a thousand hours of documentary watching and eyewitness testimony and congressional hearings and stuff like that.
Just to give you an idea of how much I've studied this alien stuff.
And I just can't reconcile the two.
And I don't know.
I just don't know how to think about it.
That's all I have to say.
If you have any thoughts on that, I'd love to hear it.
Sir, when you say can't reconcile the two, Which two?
Do you mean God and aliens?
Yeah, like angels and demons versus extraterrestrials or some type of AIs that visit us or something.
Okay.
So tell me a little bit about what you've learned from your thousand hours about aliens.
Okay.
Okay.
Well, there's a whole bunch of different theories, but they definitely appear over nuclear weapons facilities like all the time.
Robert Hastings has a book that documents all the 167 different cases where, you know, the most steady and trustworthy and mentally stable people are running those nuclear missile tests.
So we can trust their testimony, you know, I guess.
And then all the Bob Lazar stuff and the documentaries about him and how, even though there were some shady things like how he only told Jacques Valet that he was meant to drink a.
A memory blocking potion or some type of roofy thing.
And there's some other shady stuff about his past, but all the other stuff about his testimony seems to be true.
So they're definitely.
And I'm sorry, I don't know really what you're talking about.
So, testimony about what seems to be true?
Oh, sorry.
Assume I know nothing.
Yeah, just assume I know nothing.
So go ahead.
Yeah, well, he worked at Area S4 and they were reverse engineering the UFO craft.
There.
Hang on.
So, sorry to be annoying, but as a communicator, when I say, assume I know nothing, and then you say, well, he worked at S4, what the hell do I know about S4?
Assume I know nothing.
You're right.
No problem.
You're right.
Okay.
So, this was before Area 51 was even known by the public as a thing that existed.
And he was being solicited by Area S4, which is an even more secret part of Area 51.
It's just south of it.
And this is.
Okay, so you're assuming I know much about Area 51 now.
Area S4, I don't know much about that.
Well, it's part of Area 51.
As far as I know, Area 51 is where the United States government is supposed to have taken and kept space alien technology and bodies.
Is that right?
No.
They usually go to air bases.
They just fly on the air bases and keep them.
Okay, then you'll have to explain to me what Area 51 is because I don't think I know.
Oh, well, yeah, eventually they do end up at Area 51, but it's been known now that they've.
Official high end aircraft have come out of Area 51 and it's like a secret testing base, and you can't get anywhere near it or they'll shoot you, even if you're a citizen.
It's just crazy there.
So, hang on, hang on, hang on.
So, what is when I said Area 51 is where they keep space alien technology and bodies, that's not correct or that is correct?
It is correct.
But most of them go to airbase.
It's not like they all just get sent to Area 51.
They go to the nearest airbase and then there's a bunch of whistleblower.
Um, videos I watch Jesse Michaels primarily, and he talks about subterranean basements containing much more advanced technology requiring way higher clearances, and that most people working don't even know about that it's there.
Okay, so there are people who say they've seen these alien bodies and technologies, but there is no, and this is just a comment I don't mean that this proves or disproves anything, but there is no independent scientific publication or cells or anything like that.
It's mostly just reported.
And again, I'm not trying to say that that means it's definitely not true, but that's my understanding of it.
Totally, 100%.
The way that it's been explained to me is that they just get killed or they get blackmailed in the most horrible ways.
Like if you're just going in for some cool aerospace tech job and you're like a tech guy and you're just a normal God fearing individual that wants to help people and do well, if you get brought into one of these companies, if you want to get explicit information, you have to get compromised as well.
It's not exactly like the Jeffrey Epstein stuff, but they know everything about you and they'll just hurt you.
And that's why people.
It's very easy to keep people quiet.
They silenced an entire town in Brazil, the Virginia case in Brazil, which is an alien crash landing.
And it was seen by the whole town.
And that's a whole other story.
But they silenced a whole town just by threatening each individual person, men in black suits.
There's documentaries about this.
They come to the town of Virginia in 19.
Or 1986, I forget.
But in Varginha, Brazil, they silenced an entire town by, and it worked.
When the documentary crew came down there, all the people didn't want to, they were actually hostile towards the documentary crew.
They're like, no, we're not going to tell you anything because it's putting our family in jeopardy.
And they do the exact same thing with the engineers.
That's how it's been put together.
Sorry, but silence them about what?
Oh, about whatever they saw.
Which eventually.
How do we know what they saw if they're all silenced, right?
Well, that's the part of the documentary getting to know these people and building a relationship with the witnesses and then eventually cracking them and getting information that's.
Oh, so sorry to interrupt.
So some of them weren't silenced?
Yes, yes.
Some of them eventually talked, I guess.
Okay.
And how long has the government been in receipt of this?
Trusting the Government00:03:53
Biology and technology?
Well, it seems to be.
They've been visiting us.
Diana Walsh Pasalka studies a religious.
She studies religion and she's written books on purgatory and biblical stuff.
And she's documented that we've been visited by them throughout history all the time, constantly.
But she hasn't, hang on, she hasn't documented that because she can't, right?
But she's theorized that.
Yes, yes, that's true.
But in her book, Encounters, or sorry, American Cosmic, the one before that, She talks about, she composites like eyewitnesses from like people that don't want to be discovered or not to have any ulterior motives.
And also, Preston Dennett on YouTube.
And this is a tangent, but Preston Dennett on YouTube is a guy that documents all these open source cases.
And there's so many similarities between them that eventually they have to, there's got to be some truth to it because there's so many similarities.
Okay, so let me ask you this.
Sorry, let me ask you this.
And I just ask this from a.
Epistemological standpoint or a sort of truth falsehood standpoint, how would you know if this was not true?
Or to put it another way, what standard of disproof do you have for space aliens?
And I'm not trying to lead you anywhere.
I'm just curious.
I'm always excited to hear about new thoughts and new ideas, and I think that's great.
But how would you know if this stuff wasn't true or what evidence or lack of evidence would you accept?
Right.
Well, I don't think, well, I can't.
Prove to you that anything's true.
But what I do know is that humans are not true.
No, that's not true.
I mean, you're talking to a philosophy guy, so you can certainly prove that some things are true.
Go ahead.
That's fine.
Okay, hold on.
Let me just compile my thoughts here.
Okay.
Well, the way I learn specifically is through stories and listening to other human beings' stories.
That's the only way I learn.
It's not like I'm doing the calculus and the math and stuff or writing the computer code.
I have to trust people that they know what they're doing and know what they're saying.
So I can only really get to know people and then listen to their stories.
That's how human beings learn.
That's how I learn.
Did you trust the government?
Sorry to interrupt.
Did you trust the government over COVID?
Did you trust your government teachers?
No, definitely not.
Okay.
But they have their stories and they have their perspective and so on.
So it's not just that you trust people and stories because there are some that you do trust and some that you don't, which is interesting.
So help me understand how you differentiate these.
True.
Okay, totally.
Yes, the government was telling a story, but it was a bad story and it was just full of lies and old people that were decrepit and looked awful and unhealthy and you wouldn't want to be them or have them counsel you and all their histories are all horrible.
So why would they not still be doing horrible things?
Sorry, sorry, hang on, hang on.
I mean, I'm sure you don't mean that if somebody looks bad, you don't believe them.
I'm saying that's a huge component of it for sure.
Obviously, I would believe.
Someone, if they were more attractive than if it was an ugly guy talking to me, right?
But not really.
I mean, otherwise, that's saying that people who are not attractive are excluded from the realm of human discourse and truth and philosophy and morality.
Yeah.
I mean, that's not an ideal standard of truth, right?
Which is like, I'm sorry, you kind of cross side, I don't believe anything you say, or you're bold, or you've got a funny nose, so you're off the list of philosophy.
The New York Times Article00:15:32
I mean, Tell me a little bit more.
I'm sure that's not your real standard.
What do you mean?
Not exactly that.
I just, I guess I just mean like old.
Oh, you mean like health?
Like you don't take diet advice from fat people and the people who were talking to you about COVID all look like on death's door or something like that?
Yeah, yeah.
Like, I wouldn't even consider Peter Dinklage to be ugly.
Never mind.
Whatever.
Okay.
Let's move on.
Hey, don't get short with me.
I'm just kidding.
All right.
So, what would be your standard of disproof?
How would you, what would lead you to thinking that this might not be the case?
Okay.
Well, it would be like a reality shattering thing for me because these are all people that I've built a long connection with.
Like, someone's laughing in the chat.
Okay.
Joe Rogan.
Oh, yeah.
Don't worry about the chat.
Don't worry about it.
We'll just talk you and I. Go ahead.
Okay.
I've been listening to Joe Rogan for, let's say, you know, 500, 750 hours, more than that.
And then Jesse Michaels and all these people, they're like, kind of, it's a parasocial relationship for sure.
But it's a relationship nonetheless.
And if they were all to be being lied to or their curation of information was subpar and it would just be a misjudge of character on my part.
But I couldn't really.
I couldn't pinpoint an exact thing that would prove or disprove because there's a lot of propaganda and there's a lot of intentional disinformation.
Like the swamp gas thing, J. Allen Hynek, like they've been, they've made the term UFO sound crazy.
Like if you have a UFO, I don't know what the swamp gas thing is.
Again, assume I know nothing.
Oh, right.
Sorry.
Okay.
So we were being visited in the 40s and 50s by craft and there were sightings over and over again.
And it all kicked off after the first detonation.
Test of the atomic bomb, the Trinity detonation site.
And then exactly 30 days later, an egg shaped craft landed at the Trinity site, two kilometers from where the bomb was detonated.
Jacques Villet talks about this.
It's in his book, and he told Jesse on his podcast.
Anyways, where's it going with this?
Okay, okay.
So the J. Allen Hynek thing, he was basically hired by, I guess, deep state tech aerospace guys, whatever.
To be a disinformation agent, or I guess I should say, from the intelligence agency, a disinformation agent on the subject of UFOs.
And then one of his stories was so ridiculous.
It was like the couple, if you read the testimony, they clearly described like a craft in the sky that was glowing and it was moving at ridiculous speeds.
And then he said, Oh, yeah, it's a trick of the light.
It's swamp gas.
It's because your property is next to this methane filled swamp gas and it ignited to admit something.
It looked like a craft.
Total bullshit.
Anyways, why are we talking about.
Oh, I was asking you what your standard of disproof was.
Oh, okay.
No, and I get it.
So I think I understand that.
I mean, you're heavily invested, and we're all heavily invested in our worldviews.
So I have no problem with that whatsoever.
Do you mind if I ask you some more personal questions?
Okay, yeah.
Are you a space alien?
No, I'm just kidding.
I mean, you could be.
I don't know.
But tell me a little bit about your childhood.
It was a really good childhood.
My parents are German immigrants.
And they just were great.
My dad was a business guy.
My mom was a stay at home mom.
And it was a great, normal childhood.
It was just when video games were coming out.
So I was playing a lot of video games.
Wait, you can't be that old.
Well, I mean, the good video games.
When the good video games start coming out, that's when I was growing up as well.
And what decade of life are you in?
The past, the before the third starts, before the third decade starts.
Okay, mid late 20s.
Okay.
Now, do you have siblings?
Yeah.
And when did you first become interested in UFOs?
Probably three or five years ago.
Did you realize the personal line of questioning was a total dead end in Bourne?
You want to talk about UFOs again?
No, no.
I'm still curious.
So, about three to five years ago, and what is it that first sparked your interest?
Yes.
Okay.
So, well, I listened to a lot of Joe Rogan, and then he got me kind of thinking about the UFO stuff, but not really.
I didn't care.
But then the New York Times article in 2017, it was like such a slap in the face to everyone that was being called crazy for the last 30, 40 years, because I used to be the guy that was like, Aliens, are you crazy?
Like, you're a weirdo.
Why would I even listen to you?
You're an insane person without even realizing why I had that bias because it was programmed into me without me even knowing it, you know, since living in this culture.
And then all of a sudden, after being called crazy for forever, all these people, the most official journalist place ever, New York Times, prints this article in 2017 called The Tic Tac.
And it's a big, long article about an official Pentagon report, official Pentagon debriefing.
Like, yeah, Tic Tac is real.
Here's the.
Video, we don't know what it is.
Sorry, what is what is what is tic tac?
The tic tac, it's just they're describing the UFO craft that, um, that they saw that was debuted in this New York Times article.
Okay, that who saw?
I again assume I know nothing.
Okay, okay.
So in 2017, uh, the Pentagon intentionally declassified and told the New York Times to publish this article, and the article was about, um, uh, a 2006 site or 2008 sighting.
Where Commander David Fraber off the coast of San Diego witnessed this craft with his teammates, and they have full instrumental coverage on this thing.
They have the FLIR radar detection system, they have eyes on it.
It's moving around, and it starts to play with them, it starts to follow them when they try to circle it.
And then it rockets off, and they have all the video and audio, this high quality data.
So they just published it, and they said, okay, it's real.
And here's all the information that we have more, but this is what we're showing you right now.
So that's okay.
So, sorry, I'm a little confused because I thought they killed people who revealed this information and then they just handed over to the New York Times.
Well, that's why it's so confusing.
There seems to be a.
Oh, good.
I'm glad it's not just me who's confused.
Sorry, go ahead.
Oh, man.
I mean, yeah, this has been a crazy trip.
Like, it started off with me wondering about the technology behind the UFOs, like, the anti gravity stuff could be really useful for us, right?
And then it gets spiritual and weird so fast, like right away.
But yeah, the Tic Tac stuff is pretty shocking.
Okay, so by the anti gravity stuff, you mean that their craft appear to be immune to the laws of inertia and momentum.
They can turn on a dime at high speed, and we assume that the aliens don't go splat on the inside like you throw an egg against a wall or something.
Right.
Okay, so first of all, the New York Times is absolute trash and garbage and evil, but that's a whole different story.
Right, their propaganda arm.
Oh, yeah, for sure.
Okay, so Joe Rogan talks about space aliens.
Get interested in that, and then there's something in the New York Times.
And why do you think it sparked your interest?
And again, your interest is no problem.
I mean, I've put 40,000 hours into philosophy, so I've got no problem with people's crazy focused interest.
But what do you think got you so interested?
Well, I'm interested in what's going on here.
Isn't that what we're all interested in?
And I assume that if there's something because the universe is so big, and if there's something out there, it's probably really smart because it's just by the fact that it's old and it's lasted this long.
It's survived entropy this long.
It's got to be smart.
So it's smart and it's old, and it can probably tell us more about what's going on here in our existence.
Like, what is going on?
Like, I don't know.
Just the bigger questions, not just the day to day.
Bigger questions like the meaning of life or good and evil or things like that, whether there's a God.
Do you mean things like that?
Exactly.
And the nature of experience and like what this is all about.
Okay.
So the space aliens could answer.
Philosophical questions for us.
Is that, or theological questions as well, right?
Yeah, I guess so.
Well, no, I'm not trying to tell you what you think.
I'm just curious why you're so interested.
And the fact that I'm asking why you're interested again is no disrespect to your beliefs, but I'm curious why you're so interested in space aliens.
Oh, okay.
Okay.
So it's like if I go far enough out into space, I find it was within me.
No, no, no.
I'm not trying to disprove your perspective.
I'm kidding.
Look, if you said, you know, the first time I saw someone play violin, I then put 10,000 hours into learning violin, I'd say, oh, well, what was so interesting to you at the beginning?
Or it's just a getting to know you kind of question.
It's not a disproved question.
Right.
The technology seems so okay.
Well, for the last 60 years, definitely for the amount of time that I've been alive, there's been no improvements in the physical reality of technology.
Like, A little bit, but it's been mostly with computers.
That's the big innovation sector area, right?
We've never made a big progress with physics.
And even the progress, quote unquote, that's been happening in the universities the last 80 years has been like completely fruitless.
It's called string theory, right?
And it's done nothing for anyone.
And it's no, no, no.
Are you kidding me?
It's gotten people hundreds of billions of dollars or hundreds of millions of dollars in funding.
I remember reading about.
I remember reading about string theory back in the 80s, and I gave up on it after a couple of years because I'm like, this isn't going to, I don't want to say, well, this isn't going to lead anywhere.
Like I knew, I just got a real sense of the futility of it all.
And now it is, you know, 40 plus years later, and it's all still largely nonsense and theoretical and unproven and unreproducible.
And of course, there's been these huge replication crises in government science and all of that, where, you know, sometimes a third, sometimes a half, sometimes more of, Experiments can't even be reproduced.
It's absolutely appalling how much and how brutally and in what a sociopathic manner they have stolen massive amounts of money from the taxpayers and appear to have zero fucking conscience about it at all.
Yeah.
And it's basically a child sacrificing factory where you go in and get mind raped and then you leave or something.
Yeah.
Your kids can't have a future because you're like dinking around and summoning demons with a fucking electrode, electron collider.
So, okay.
So, how's your life going as a whole?
Work.
And love the two big things in general.
Okay.
Yeah.
Can I just finish with the one more thing with the physics thing?
Mm hmm.
Okay.
The other part that it's interesting is that, uh, so we haven't had, uh, advancements in physics and we have had no reproducible experiments with the string theory bullshit.
But on Jesse Michaels' program, he interviewed the guy, a guy.
This guy was the head of electrostatics at NASA currently.
Um, and he talked to him for three hours and he got him, uh, to cross interview Bob Lazar in another episode, which is crazy.
And they get really into the physics and stuff.
But, um, in, uh, But in this episode, Jesse reveals that I forget his name, but he's the head of electrostatics at NASA.
He's done 2,000 experiments of varying configurations to test this electrogravitic technology.
And it's already like a real thing.
Like Joe Rogan had two CEOs on about this stuff, but CEOs of companies that are implementing like the Casimir effect and I don't know.
I don't know.
Again, you're assuming I know things that you don't.
So, people who are trying to raise investment or sell a product went on Joe Rogan and said the product worked.
Have you never heard of Theranos?
Right, right.
I guess so.
I guess so.
It's just that it could be all considered.
Oh, well, I guess if.
Well, imagine if these companies engineered like some type of UFO propaganda thing.
They'd make so much money.
But it's too big to engineer.
Hang on.
So, listen, I'm interrupting you.
I apologize to you.
But let me sort of understand this as a whole.
So they're not from this solar system, right?
Because it seems unlikely that any other planet on the solar system would be able to develop intelligent life.
Is that fair to say?
Well, this is, it gets weird immediately because, yes, they seem to be using these anti gravity crafts and inertia changing engines in the atmosphere, and they're doing 5,000 G turns, but that still doesn't explain how you travel further and what type of effects that has when you're.
When you're moving at those speeds, like what happens to everything else around you?
Because you can't, even if you're stuck.
Okay, hang on, hang on, hang on, hang on.
What was my question?
Oh, wait, sorry.
We got to do this thing where we listen to each other, right?
Otherwise, it's not much of a compound.
Yeah, yeah, sorry, sorry, sorry, my bad.
What was the question?
What's interesting about the physics?
Oh, okay, if they're coming from our solar system, our solar system.
There you go.
Yeah.
Okay, well, there are a bunch of.
Eyewitness accounts from Press and Dennett, where there have been cases where the aliens tell them they're from Venus or they're from Mars, and they basically seem to be living in all the planets.
No, no, but sorry, did they evolve?
They didn't evolve in our solar system.
Is that fair to say?
I mean, Venus has acid for air, and Mars is very far from the sun and has a very thin atmosphere.
And of course, we photographed a lot of Mars.
There's no cities, no roads, no nothing like that, right?
So, where are they coming from?
Are they coming from our solar system or another solar system?
Where they originally began, that's really like panspermia or something like that.
I don't know.
But I'm sorry, what was that word?
Panspermia?
Panspermia?
Panspermia.
Physics Without Magic00:06:56
I don't know what that is.
Did you know I was saying that right?
I don't know.
I don't even know what the word means, so I can't tell you if I'm pronouncing it right.
It's the origin of all life on Earth being seed from like an asteroid at the conception of like Earth's crust or something.
That asteroid hit with like an amoeba.
Okay, but we're talking about space aliens, not from our world.
So, I'm asking.
Yeah, yeah.
Is the general belief that they are from another planet in the solar system, or are they from another solar system in the galaxy?
Well, if you're on level one of alien, you would say, yeah, they're coming from other planets and other star systems.
But level two is that, like, they're kind of.
I don't know what these levels mean, bro.
You've got to cut it down for me.
I don't know what level one and level two mean.
Well, I just made up the levels as well.
But let's say you're in your first.
Okay, I'm not asking.
What do you think?
Oh, okay, well.
Again, we don't even know what this is that we're in right now.
Like this three-dimension stuff, like, I don't know.
What?
Okay, what is three-dimension stuff?
Well, you know, this reality that we inhabit, I don't even know what.
You're not trolling me, are you?
You're not trolling me?
You might be trolling me, right?
I mean, it's a pretty simple question.
Do you think space aliens have evolved in our solar system or have come from another solar system?
Okay.
I don't know.
Okay.
It seems extremely unlikely that they have evolved in our solar system.
We're the only planet that is in the Goldilocks zone, right?
Not too warm, not too cold.
We've got water.
We have a breathable atmosphere, which isn't full of acid, and so on, right?
And of course, we've been to a whole bunch of the other planets on the solar system.
Venus, and we've landed on Mars, we've flown past Jupiter and the moons, and Uranus and Neptune, and so on.
So, it's, I consider it functionally impossible that a highly advanced civilization has evolved in our solar system and we've just completely missed it somehow.
Which means that they have to have come from another star system.
Now, what are the barriers to traveling between the stars?
What are the challenges?
Without magic, like you can't just introduce Wormholes or warp drives or faster than light, like the actual physical challenges of all the physics that we know, which of course is not all physics.
But what are the challenges of traveling between star systems?
Okay, well, I gotta say something.
Okay, no, no, I would really like it if you would answer the question, if you don't mind.
Okay, then you can have your thing, but at least don't have me ask a question, then go off on a tangent, right?
And if you could answer the question, then we can do the other topic.
Yeah, yeah, I wanna say something.
That was a setup to, I'm really gonna answer that question hard right now.
Sure.
Okay.
So it's like Eric Weinstein says, and this is what he said.
It's not Eric Weinstein is a physicist and he's really smart and he goes on Joe Rogan a lot and he talks about physics and he's got his own theory of everything, whatever.
So Eric Weinstein says that you shouldn't be making, like to leave Earth, you shouldn't be making rocket ships, you should be getting whiteboards.
So you said, What are the physical constraints to travel from another star system to get here?
And we just don't even know physics.
Like, we just discovered physics when we woke up 500, 600 years ago or something, you know?
Like, we need to probably be advancing physics.
And that's probably, you know, the three body problem and what's been going on with string theory.
That's probably some intention towards that, like some type of control mechanism to prevent us from chimping out, so to speak, on a human scale, you know, with this technology that's extremely overpowered.
And we should not be able to wield if we're still like barbarians.
So, okay, so what are the physical challenges based on current knowledge of physics of traveling between the stars?
You said you were going to lead me into that question.
Oh, sorry.
Oh, yeah.
Okay.
So please, please try and remain true to your word.
Go on.
Got it.
Got it.
So, current challenges, I guess, well, I don't know anything about space or nothing, but I'd probably say distance and like radiation.
And, oh, yeah, radiation for sure.
Like everything would just die like a human being.
Yeah.
So, I mean, just off the top of my head, I'm not much of an expert either, but the distances are almost beyond comprehension.
So, the fastest human beings have gone is like 8,000 miles an hour.
At that rate, it takes 75,000 years to get to the closest star system.
And of course, as you accelerate faster and faster, more and more of the energy you use to accelerate gets turned into mass.
So you can't get close to the speed of light.
Even, of course, the speed of light is over four years to the closest star, but you can't get to the speed of light.
The problem, of course, is the radiation that is out there in the miss space is extraordinary because they don't have the Van Allen belt or whatever it is that shields us from that radiation on Earth.
And if you were to build.
A strong enough hull to shield human beings from the radiation, then you have a spaceship that's so big that the moment you start picking up any particular speed, then every bit of matter out there in interstellar space acts as a bullet and cuts right through your ship.
So travel between the stars without magic, without magic.
And magic is not an answer to things.
Now we can say, ah, yes, but the people in the 15th century could not imagine.
An airplane.
It's like, sure, they could, because an airplane is not magic, right?
So you would be able to explain to them an airplane, and the airplane would fall into the general purvey of the physics that they know.
And so airplanes aren't magic, they don't disappear and reappear like wormholes or warp speed or faster than light travel and so on.
And so nothing that we build on in physics can deny the existing physics that we have.
So, Einsteinian physics does not deny or overturn Newtonian physics.
It just refines it in the edge cases of extremely fast speed and so on.
And they've verified Einsteinian physics.
They've had an airplane with an atomic clock go around really, really fast.
And they've, in fact, lost a tiny slice of a second and so on.
So, travel between the stars is according to all the understanding that we have of physics.
Telepathy and Society00:15:16
Now, new.
Understandings of physics cannot overturn what we already know to be true.
So, you can't have a theory of gravity that says gravity doesn't exist, right?
You can't have a theory of in order for an object to go from A to B, it has to traverse the intermediate distance.
You can't just have something wink out from one area and wink into another area because that would be movement without crossing an intervening space.
And so, it's a fun sort of magic idea, and everyone who writes science fiction has to come up with magic.
In order to make that science fiction acceptable or believable.
So then the question is, how did they get here?
Well, it will be, you know, at least I would imagine, you know, thousands of years of travel to get here.
And the other thing, too, is that how would they develop the technology to get here if they weren't a free market society?
Because it is a free market that develops this kind of technology.
Now, if it's a free market society, then they would come here and they would see us.
Groaning under the authority and power of giant coercive governments.
And out of moral sympathy, they would free us, I think, from all of this sort of stuff.
In the same way that if we went to some other planet and we saw a bunch of slaves being controlled, and of course we would be anti slavery because slavery is immoral, we would probably do something to help that out.
So, what we wouldn't do is we wouldn't go and collude only with the slave owners, right?
Some of the most corrupt and immoral people on the planet, which would be people at the top of.
Sorry, why is this funny?
I'm not sure why you keep laughing.
No, you're totally right.
I mean, it's incredible that they would.
Like, all these stories that you're giving seem incredulous because that's like what we're supposed to believe.
But I think.
Okay, sorry, continue.
Can I say something?
Go ahead.
Okay.
But I think the reality of the situation is like way stranger than is even going to be known.
Like, This soft disclosure stuff that Trump just did today is going to be like a small trickle.
It's going to be a trickle for everybody.
Sorry, I mean, just saying this stuff is going to be strange.
This is not an argument, right?
I'm trying to lay out a case here that I think is helpful.
So you only get the kind of incredibly advanced technology that would be required to travel between the stars from a free market society.
And a free market society would not collude with governments.
An anarcho capitalist society, which again is the only society that's ever having a chance to develop these things, they would never collude with oligarchical hierarchies in the same way that when the Europeans came across the Aztecs who were cutting the living hearts out of children to sacrifice to their god, they didn't collude with the Aztec leadership.
In fact, they, together with the surrounding tribes, destroyed the Aztec leadership.
So, they would not collude with evil.
If they are space aliens, they're here because they have a moral society, a free society, and they're not just going to collude with evildoers at the top levels of government.
Now, if they have the kind of technology that allows them to go between the stars, which is functionally impossible, right?
By all known laws of physics, it is functionally impossible to go between the stars unless you want to spend 10,000 years.
Now, you say, well, what about?
Cybersleep or cryosleep or something like that.
Okay, well, I mean, what happens when you don't use your muscles for 10,000 years?
You just turn into soup, right?
So, I mean, although they could do electrical stimulus and blah, blah, blah.
And it's like, yeah, well, then you're stimulating the muscles, which means they're subject to time, which means they're going to wither and die as the cells reproduce.
So, anyway, I mean, there's just a whole bunch of, and who's going to want to go for 10,000 years to some other star system?
You wouldn't even know if there'd be a world when you came back.
I mean, people just in general.
Wouldn't do that as a whole.
So I'm just saying that the odds of there being space aliens that come from other planets, include with governments, is zero.
Absolutely zero.
Now, the other thing, last thing I'll say is that either they want to be seen or they don't want to be seen, right?
Those are really the only two possibilities.
Now, if they have such astounding technology, then they would have the technology to not be seen.
Like you wouldn't have the technology to travel, you know, a dozen light years or 50 light years or whatever it is, because it's unlikely that.
Intelligent life would arise in the closest star system.
It could happen, but it's unlikely.
So, they would have the most astounding technology.
And it's a little confusing because if they want to be seen, then they would just land in front of TV cameras and interact with everyone and so on, right?
Which they're not doing.
So, the idea is that they don't want to be seen.
Well, if they don't want to be seen, then how come 100,000 people around the world claim to have seen them?
And almost all of those people are in the United States.
By the way, why would they only focus on the United States?
If you've seen those maps of UFO sightings, it's almost all in the United States.
So, if they want to be seen, they're doing a bad job.
It would be very easy for them to be seen.
And if they don't want to be seen, they're also doing a bad job because people are able to see them.
And the last thing that I'll say, because I got kind of into UFOs when I was in the 70s.
I know that sounds like your great grandfather's age, back in the dawn of human existence, when the Stanley Kubrick apes were throwing things around.
But sort of back in the day, there was this belief that there were potentially these space aliens and spaceships and all of that spacecraft floating around.
Kind of came out with Close Encounters was a movie from back then.
And I remember thinking at the time, man, you know, the only way this question is going to be answered is if everyone somehow ends up with high definition cameras on them at all times.
And lo and behold, you know, for the last 10, 15, you know, depending on how you count it, let's say 15 years, just about everyone on the planet, well, a lot of people on the planet, you know, billions of people on the planet have high definition cameras.
In their pockets.
And I know that there's some blurry footage and there's some shaky can stuff here and there.
But if they end up being seen, even against their will, then the problem is, of course, why aren't a thousand people all videoing, which they all would?
I mean, people video their freaking food.
They would certainly video space aliens rocketing by.
Then why don't we have an example of.
You know, a hundred, ten, a hundred, a thousand cell phone footage, which we could then use to reconstruct in perfect 3D.
And, you know, AI would not be really an issue with that because there would be so many different angles and you could really check the light reflections and all of that.
So, why is it that we don't have that kind of stuff that would be kind of proof beyond a reasonable doubt, even though there are billions of people with high definition cameras who, you know, can, if you've ever seen a woman whip out a camera for an appropriate selfie, it's like watching.
Dark holiday in a fast draw competition in the Wild West.
You know, they got their selfie up and all that recording goes.
So I think it is not true.
And, you know, I'm not saying I know for sure.
I mean, but to me, it's in the kind of, well, yeah, I guess anything's possible.
But on the base of things, given that you can't travel between stars, given that they're not going to collude with human governments, given that they didn't arise in our solar system and all the other issues, I don't think it's true.
I'm just making my case.
Obviously, You know, everybody has to come to their own decisions, but that would be my thoughts.
Okay.
Well, I would say that was okay.
Thank you for laying both those things out.
Why aren't they coming here and why are they coded with the craziest people?
But I think in this case, that's a totally that would be the institutional, like, um, uh, orthodox take.
Like, that's tradition.
That's the traditional take.
Um, okay.
So don't, don't start off with an insult, bro.
I haven't, have I insulted you?
Oh, sorry.
Institutional orthodox normie NPC.
Blah, blah, blah.
Come on.
I mean, yeah, you basically don't start it.
No, no, no, no, don't, don't, don't start it.
Don't start off with an insult.
That's, that's not reasonable.
I've not insulted anything to do with you.
I've been very, very respectful, haven't I?
So, why are you calling them boring institutional blah, blah, blah, right?
I mean, just deal with the arguments, just deal with the arguments rather than insulting them because that's bad faith debating, right?
Yep.
Sorry.
Yeah, I think in this case, so why aren't they coming from other star systems?
Well, maybe a little bit of magic is actually the orthodox take.
Like, it's the logical thing to assume because.
If, okay, let's say we had science for 500 years, look where it's gotten us.
Just take us, you know, and move it along a thousand, three thousand years and find out where we'll be.
That's magic.
And that is like built into the function of science.
Like science is a type of religion that we discovered to make magic like kind of come down to earth or something.
So we have this magic built in.
And it's, you know, Carl Jung says all of reality was once fantasy, which I think is interesting in this case.
And, Okay.
So for the next part, you said, why are they colluding with the craziest people?
And why would they respect our laws?
And why would they abduct certain people and then not abduct others and then be here, but like in a fleeting kind of failed way?
Like they're hinting at us or something.
I think we're probably.
If you've ever seen the Telepathy Tapes, which is a podcast that came out, and Joe Rogan talked about it a lot, Jesse Michaels had the Telepathy Tapes producer.
Kate something, no, Kai Dickens.
She made telepathy tapes and it's about children who are telepathic.
Nonverbal autistic children, specifically, have this possibility.
They're more likely to have this telepathic thing, but they communicate perfectly.
They have a perfect 100% conscious connection with their mother.
It's a 10 part series on YouTube.
It was the number one podcast in the world, I think, beating Joe Rogan for a couple of months.
This was like groundbreaking, shocking information.
And then, you know, all this stuff about Stargate.
Programs like it's there.
So, what I'm saying is, here's the point the Stargate program, you know, remote viewing, if we are not able to see them, we're probably not worth interacting.
Because, hang on, hang on, sorry.
I mean, the telepathy is bullshit.
And I'm sorry, I'm just sorry to tell you.
And we know telepathy is bullshit because it is the transfer of information without any intermediate.
Movement of matter or energy.
And so telepathy is bullshit.
And the other thing, too, is that if human beings had the ability to read minds, that would be so positively selected for in evolution that it would immediately, like within a generation or two, would have driven out all other forms of communication.
Because you can imagine an army that can talk telepathically to each other or hunters that could be telepathic with each other.
So telepathy absolutely violates all the known laws of physics.
And we know it's not true because it would have.
Been the dominant form of human communication in the moment that it evolved.
Yes, and I'm not insulting you.
Don't take this as an insult.
Disclaimer, red alert, this is not an insult.
But that would be the traditional orthodox take that's.
Yeah, but you don't just get to wave off arguments by calling them traditional and orthodox.
No, no, no.
I'm not done.
Okay.
No, no, but you can't start, again, you're not listening.
You can't start with insults and then go from there because it's called poisoning the well.
Right.
So it's saying, well, you're wrong and you're closed minded and you're traditional and you're orthodox.
And it's all just these insults.
Right.
And it tells me that you don't believe your own arguments.
Because if you believed your own arguments, you wouldn't need to insult me.
Now, I did say telepathy was bullshit.
I didn't say you were an idiot.
I was saying telepathy is bullshit.
And I gave you sort of the reasons for it.
And there was a guy who had a million dollar prize, the Amazing Randy had a million dollar prize for decades.
Nobody was able to claim it.
With any kind of telepathy.
So it's not true.
It's fun.
It's a fun idea.
It's an interesting and cool idea.
And we have very deep instincts for understanding people.
You know, if you've ever had bad dreams about someone who turns out to be a bad person when you didn't think they were a bad person, we have very deep instincts for these kinds of things.
But we cannot exchange thoughts without any intermediate movement of matter and energy.
That would be instantaneous transfer of consciousness with no matter and energy transfer.
That's not something that.
That is real or can happen according to all the known laws of physics.
And the last thing I'll say is we can't just say that in the future, physics will be the opposite of physics.
Like all physics builds upon direct sense experience, direct sense data.
We can't say that in the future, down the road, the exact opposite of physics will be physics.
That makes no sense because we also know that physics has to be absolutely stable and the properties of matter and energy have to be absolutely stable because if they weren't, life could never have evolved.
Over the last four billion years.
So, the absolute stability of matter and energy is the foundation of physics, and you can't just say, well, in the future, we'll be able to violate those at will.
That's just not how these things work.
Sorry, go ahead.
Yeah.
Again, sorry, I didn't mean about the orthodoxy.
I was just saying that you would say telepathy would be selected for by evolution, where we don't even know if that's exactly where it came from or if we were genetically tweaked.
But, you know, I'll give it to you 100%.
Telepathy.
Could be bullshit, except for the fact that they did have that Stargate program, and that certainly was not the whole iceberg.
I would say it was maybe the top little portion of the iceberg, maybe the tip of the iceberg, because they used it to remote view Russian remote viewers, and they were having like this psychic war, apparently.
Psychic Warriors Program00:02:34
I'm sorry, and is the government telling you this?
No, I just picked up from podcasts.
No, no, but they have to have gotten their information from somewhere, right?
They didn't just make it up.
At least I hope not.
Yeah.
So they got this stuff from the government?
It was a government program to do this remote viewing stuff with the Russians.
Is that right?
Yes.
Yes.
The front facing Stargate one.
Yeah.
That's a public note.
Okay.
So the government has told people that they have an army of psychic warriors battling the Russians.
Not the government saying psychic warriors.
The psychic warriors part, I picked that up from podcasts, but.
The no, no, but the podcasts get their information from somewhere, right?
So, there was a secret government program, according to the government, there was a secret government program of psychic warriors battling the Russians, yeah.
Probably from whistleblowers, um, from the government, but not officially.
What the government officially said is that the Stargate program was a real thing and they taught their CIA officers how to prevent alien abduction.
It's called halotropic breathing, it's like a thing you do that will prevent aliens coming to also.
You can say, you know, you know, that people in power and authority are pathological liars, right?
You've got the witch doctor who says, Oh, give me 10,000 bucks a month and I'll do a rain dance for you and make sure you get good rain for your crops.
We have people who are religious authorities who claim that there are all of these kinds of miracles and so on.
And every leader tells their people, God is on our side.
You're the best.
Everyone else is bad.
I mean, the people in power are pathological liars.
And we know, of course, that the CIA was on a staggered basis releasing information about the JFK assassination.
In order to waste people's time and to get all of these people stampeding into this field where nothing was really going to change, and they manipulate the public by releasing information in a strategic way to waste people's time and to take people's energy away from actual change in the world, to keep running off a cliff in pursuit of things that can never be proven.
So, governments are very good at lying and manipulating and controlling people.
They've been doing it for, you know, authority has been doing it for hundreds of thousands of years.
They're very well tuned into this kind of stuff.
So, any information that comes from the government that goes counter to reason and evidence, I'm not sure why you would believe it, but I certainly wouldn't.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Media Downsides and Upsides00:05:56
Didn't answer how the rest of your life is going.
Love and work.
Right, right.
Because I want to make a case after this, but I want to get some information first.
Yes, my life is hard, and that's why I like aliens.
It's my escape.
Are you happy?
Is that what you came for, Steve?
So, you don't want to answer that, right?
Oh, sure.
Yeah, you know, it's tough.
I live in, well, let's say some place that communism is about to start, okay?
And it's bad here.
Well, it's tough to narrow that down.
Yeah, exactly.
What's going on?
Where do I even go?
Like, where can I even escape to?
I don't know.
But yeah, the job situation is like tough.
Food is extremely expensive.
Everyone has like, I don't know what the laughter is coming from.
I mean, you're talking about some pretty negative situations, right?
I guess so.
The only time I've ever heard negative information that has come packaged to me is through humorous sitcoms.
Maybe I'm damaged somehow.
I'm sorry.
I'll knock that off.
Okay.
What's your dating history like?
Sparse.
When did you last have a girlfriend?
Last summer.
For how long?
Like.
Four or five months, the whole summer.
All right.
And how many girlfriends have you had?
Like 12 or uppers of 12, yeah.
And what's the longest relationship?
Two years or a year and a half.
Okay.
And are you currently employed?
Yes.
I'm a concrete restoration man.
Okay.
And do you have job and career prospects that could lead you towards supporting a family?
No, no.
And do you want to get married and have kids?
Not particularly.
Why do you think?
That's not the default setting for humanity, right?
Why do you think you don't?
Probably some generational long anti natalism campaign that's been thrown upon me.
Well, I mean, if you can cut through all of the propaganda about UFOs to get to the truth, then you can certainly.
Cut through the antenatalist stuff, right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, you can't believe in space aliens but not believe in the future of human reproduction for yourself, right?
Yeah, yeah.
Well, it is interesting because the aliens that we do see, Michael Masters says that, and this is why the alien thing is so interesting to me because, you know, it's just like how you said at the beginning.
I guess it does kind of reflect, you know, what I'm interested in.
But the aliens do all seem to be, you know, lacking pigmentation.
They have all the exaggerated features that humans have to apes.
Like the domestication process still continues from where we are.
So our heads continue to get bigger, our arms longer, fingers longer, skinnier and weaker.
And there's all these stories about the deals made with that President Eisenhower.
Are you going to do that thing again where you ask me what the question was again?
Am I doing that thing again?
Well, what was my question?
Fuck, I forgot.
Do you spend a lot of time on social media?
No, Twitter, I guess, a little bit.
Well, that's social media.
Yeah, because I mean, this is sort of a, I hate to be annoying, older guy.
This is kind of a young person thing where y'all tend to receive information or conversation as a chance to go off on tangents rather than actually have a conversation and answer questions.
But I don't want to nag you.
About that.
Okay, let me ask you this as a final question.
And listen, I really appreciate the conversation.
It's really interesting to look into this world, and I appreciate you bringing it to my attention and the attention of the listeners.
Now, if someone were to come up to me and say, Steph, what are the downsides to philosophy?
And it's funny, you don't know my history with Joe Rogan.
I was on his show three times, and the third time, he totally cucked out, bitched out, and backstabbed me with an ambush.
So, you know, I'm not a fan.
He was a total bitch about me.
Okay, so that's fine.
You wouldn't know that.
There's no reason.
And it, It's long ago now.
It doesn't matter now.
But if somebody were to say to me, What are the downsides of philosophy?
I won't do this whole speech now because you want to make it into your 40s without still listening to me, at least in one go.
But I would say that the downsides of philosophy are you spread virtue, you spread truth, you spread reason, you spread evidence, and you come full into collision with people who make their money from lying and propaganda.
They hate your guts and will try to destroy you.
And there's been a lot of that over the course of sort of the 40 plus years I've been involved in philosophy.
So I would say, look, there's some upsides.
I mean, great upsides.
I have a wonderful marriage.
I have a great relationship with family and friends.
And I certainly have no doubt about the meaning and value of what it is that I'm doing in the world.
So there's lots of really good, juicy, positive plus, plus, plus.
But there's some downsides as well.
Now, you find UFOs fun and interesting, fascinating, I would say.
You've got a thousand hours plus and all of that.
Now, what are the downsides of believing in this?
What are the negatives?
Well, I can tell you some of them.
Other Continents and Life00:02:19
People just don't want to talk to you anymore.
Yeah, because it's so important to you and it's not important to them at all.
Like, they don't even see why it would be interesting to you.
And I'm like, it's kind of like the, it's one of the questions.
Like, it's got to be up there with the top two or three of the top ultimate questions, you know?
You mean, is there life in the universe other than human?
Right.
And what happens?
Well, there absolutely is.
Listen, space aliens absolutely exist.
100 billion stars in 100 billion galaxies, there's no way we're the only life.
There's absolutely no chance we are the only life whatsoever.
But to me, it's kind of like in the dark ages, you know, when they only had little, little boats and all of that.
And it's like, is, could there be other continents with other life?
Well, sure, but we can't get there because we got little rowboats and shit, right?
We can't row across the Atlantic or the Pacific.
Like we can't get there until the 16th century vessels, the Santa Maria and so on.
Until the bigger vessels came along, there was just, and also you needed to actually need to invent the math that allowed people to have insurance because you had to have insurance for these vessels.
So, Or, you know, I don't know exactly when you would go back.
You could go back to, like, I don't know, prehistoric times.
You could go back to Neolithic times, or, you know, you could be some Neanderthal or whatever, right?
And are there other continents with other life forms?
Well, yeah, but we can't get there.
We can theorize, but we can't get there.
And the same is true with other star systems.
We can theorize, we know for sure.
I mean, just mathematically, there's zero chance.
We can see other MCAS class planets.
Through our telescopes, we know that there are other planets out there in the solar system, out there in the universe, that are in the Goldilocks zone.
And maybe they're a little bigger than Earth and, you know, whatever it is, right?
But we know that there are planets big enough to hang onto an atmosphere, that they're in the Goldilocks zone.
We can detect traces, I think, of ammonia and water.
I don't think that they've got quite the carbon signatures that they would like, obviously, like to find for life.
But there's no question whatsoever that even if it was one in a million, There are billions of other life forms out there in the universe.
So, you and I, I'm sure, are on the same page as far as that goes.
Mysticism vs Reason00:03:04
Have they come here and kind of half appeared and not appeared and only appeared to governments and only worked with governments and only colluded with governments, but there's no evidence, even though people have all of these cell phone videos and even though it's physically impossible to get here?
Well, that I don't believe.
I don't accept.
So, the downside, people don't want to talk to you.
What else?
It takes.
It distracts you from your earthly life, like the things that you could be doing to better yourself, like getting fit or trying to become more useful to people in order to make more money.
And the answer is beyond your capacity to penetrate.
You can't figure out the truth.
Yeah.
And that's why I asked earlier, and I say this with great sympathy and no disrespect at all, but.
That's why I asked earlier, what would be your standard of disproof?
You cannot, you cannot prove or disprove this.
You have to rely on what other people say.
And I personally, I really, really like to stay away from things I have to believe or not believe based upon what other people say.
Other people are crazy.
Other people hallucinate.
Other people have psychotic episodes.
Other people have hallucinations.
Other people have epileptic seizures that give them visions.
Other people are professional liars who want to sell books or who want to sell magazines or who want to sell.
I actually have like one of my study upstairs.
I have a big monitor, and on the base of it is a UFO magazine underneath that someone gave me many years ago at some libertarian conference.
And at least I can use it to make sure that my monitor doesn't scratch my desk or whatever, right?
So it has some value.
But I don't want to rely on people because people generally lie as a whole.
And when there's self motivation and money and prestige and status, and when people have set up their whole career to talk about this kind of stuff, And they don't get hit with the hard questions and they have magic as their answer, it's not worth it to me.
And my concern is that this is a form of mysticism.
It's mysticism with a scientific veneer, but it is a form of mysticism that space aliens are just another kind of angels and devils.
And the problem with mysticism is it isolates you.
It means you're alone with your ideas, or you can only be around other people who already agree with you, which is also kind of isolating because we need the resistance.
We need chafing against our ideas and arguments in order to get closer to the truth, which is a very hard thing for the human mind to get a hold of.
We were born out of fantasy.
We were born out of delusion.
We were born out of madness, really, and fighting our way to.
Sanity, reason, evidence, which is, we can only meet in reality.
We can only connect in what is true and what is real.
And a fantasy and mysticism and the unproven and the speculative that is accepted as true isolates you because you can only really connect with people who already agree with you.
Epstein Files and Truth00:07:54
And that's not particularly healthy.
Plus, if you ever do want to get married and have kids, and I hope you do, because obviously you're a very thoughtful and intelligent young man, UFO land.
Is a total sausage fest.
Mind how many chicks are around?
Like, seriously, it's like some sterility mechanism, you know?
You might as well join the logging union.
Look for babes.
All right, listen, I appreciate the call.
I've got a bunch of callers.
I really do appreciate the call.
And let us move on to.
Let's go to somebody new.
Lorraine.
Lorraine.
If you want to turn.
Thank you for your patience.
If you want to unmute, I'm all yours.
I agree with you.
I think we're all born out of this like cauldron of fire.
We are just on this earth.
I'm a mother of three, by the way.
And with this, just it's.
All right.
Are we still with this?
I'm sorry.
I'm sorry about that.
I touched the phone with my ear, but I'm a mother of three.
Three boys.
And I believe that that was my job on earth to bring these children forth.
That's my job.
I'm sorry, Emma, a little confused.
Your job is to bring children?
Did I get that?
Yeah, I'm a female.
I brought three boys.
I brought three boys into this earth.
And that was my job.
Even if I brought a female as well, that's my job.
Plus, I'm a being as well.
Okay, sorry.
Do you have a question or a comment?
Because I'm not sure how to participate in this conversation as yet.
Okay, let me finish talking.
I'm not sure how to participate in this conversation as yet.
So, if you could give me a question or a comment, I could participate in it.
I would appreciate that.
Yeah, my question is what do you think of the Trump disclosure about UFO?
Nonsense.
That's my thing.
Nonsense.
Well, I don't know.
I mean, I think that governments have taken a lot of credibility blows lately.
And looking at the, we're all in the shadow of the Epstein files.
And I think it's really hard to overestimate just what an impact that has had, particularly on the young.
When I was younger, I thought government was, you know, bad or incompetent or, you know, they were kind of power hungry.
Or maybe at the most, I thought that the people who have a lot of political power, maybe they're kind of evil.
They go into debt, they lie to people, they propagandize, they start wars and lie.
And it's like, okay, but to me, that's just sort of ordinary, run of the mill human evil writ large.
Like evil plus evil plus bad things, and but but with the Epstein stuff, there is a satanic undercurrent of predation and destruction.
Not for the sake of okay, hang on, hang on, hang on.
You're gonna let me finish my thoughts.
You asked me a question, let me finish my thoughts.
I'm sorry, just don't blurt out.
Epstein, don't blurt out.
Yeah, wasn't on Epstein.
So, in the past, I thought, and I think a lot of people thought because I've talked to a lot of people about politics over the years.
In the past, I thought that people wanted power because they wanted money, they wanted security, they wanted to dominate people and so on.
But I think with the Epstein stuff, which I've been tracking for, I mean, 10 years plus now, I've done interviews with people in the past, like 2015, 2016, about this kind of stuff.
So with the Epstein files coming out, I think what people are understanding is that people, a lot of people want power.
For the sake of destroying souls, for the sake of assaulting innocent children in the worst conceivable ways and ways which the normal human mind can't even comprehend, just how evil it all is.
So it's not just for money and it's not just for power and it's not just for dominance and it's not just for control.
These things would be in the normal realm of human desires, but gone really bad.
Like all human beings want to have a sense of power and control and authority and And so on, and maybe even dominance or whatever.
If you're in a sport, you want to win, you want to dominate the other player, and so on.
So, I always thought that, hang on, I always thought that political power was normal human desires rendered pathological by the addition of coercion of government power and lack of responsibility and lack of limits, right?
You can type whatever you want into your own bank account, that kind of stuff.
So, I thought it was greed.
I mean, I don't know why you can't listen.
Let me finish.
I thought it was.
No, I don't.
I don't think it was.
I'll mute you.
I'll just.
I don't know.
How do we do this?
When I ask you to let me finish my thoughts, when I ask you to let me finish my thoughts, and you don't.
I don't even.
I don't know.
It's bizarre to me.
Anyway, I will have to.
I don't think it's a good word.
Yeah, I don't know why it is that.
Again, this is sort of back to how people have a conversation.
She asked me a question.
I'm trying to provide an answer.
She keeps barking in my ear.
So, sorry.
Just don't do that.
I mean, just as a whole.
Unless I'm getting something egregiously wrong, then of course you're welcome to interrupt me and set me straight.
If I say two and two make five, or if I misrepresent your position, absolutely interrupt me.
I don't want to get things wrong.
So, to finish my point, I think a lot of people, myself included, thought that the corruption of power was taking, in a sense, relatively normal and healthy human desires and then rendering them pathological or cancerous through the addition of near infinite political power.
The way that it is.
And the Epstein Files, I think, has revealed that to people as a whole.
The Epstein Files have revealed that there's a class of predatory elites that have power in order to destroy human beings.
And not just through war, which is awful, but a different category from this sort of child assault of sexuality or whatever you want to call it, that there is.
A pimping over class, that there are, you know, what really could only be described as pathologically satanic evildoers, and that the purpose of political power is to destroy the souls of children, not just to have power and security and all of that sort of stuff.
And so, because governments have taken a lot of hits lately, they are looking to put out a lot of distractions.
And I think a lot of it has to do with that.
If you wanted to give me your thoughts, I'd be happy to hear.
Oh, hi, Stefan.
Well, one area where I do disagree with you on would be telepathy.
I would say it's definitely real, and there is an intermediary between people through telepathic abilities, and it is documented on a quantum level.
They've done studies where they've taken certain rodents, they've killed one of them while the other one was in a submarine many miles away, and they detected a difference in heartbeat when that happened.
And, um,.
Quantum Telepathy Debated00:02:18
Besides that study, the intermediary through which said information travels through is called God.
And that's essentially the binding all of our entire existence.
Okay, so people ask questions of God, God gets the answer and then gives them back to people.
People are entirely made out of God.
I mean, that's a proposition that is very interesting because I think that people are made out of human cells.
Are you saying?
I mean, on the lowest level, everything is made out as God.
Yeah, I don't know what that means philosophically speaking.
That's just a made out.
Maybe you could say anything about anything, right?
So, what is it that you're trying to say from a philosophical standpoint, from an empirical standpoint?
All right, so we live inside this being known as the demiurge that imprisons all of humanity.
So, the demiurge, also known as the self generated, time travels to create itself.
So it's also known as the self willed.
You're just trolling me at this point.
No, Dude, dude, dude.
All right.
I mean, it's good trolling.
Don't get me wrong.
I will admit that.
Listen, I don't think we live inside the demiurge.
I think we live inside the triple urge because demiurge is only two.
Half, really.
Why not go for nine urge or infinity urge?
That's much more urge.
Because then we'd be falling into different universes and existence and then we wouldn't coherently exist.
Yeah, yeah, no, that's definitely.
That's definitely bizarre.
No, I appreciate that.
Yeah, I know.
Thanks, James.
I recognize his voice from before.
I think that's great.
All right.
I think Noah Head wants to come back.
If you want to unmute yourself, give it another try.
Come on, bring some reason.
And for the people who wanted to know, listen, philosophy, let's say that you really disagree with the space alien caller and you think that there's no space aliens, it's all crazy.
Well, I mean, if you are someone like me who likes to reason with people and so on, Then there's very few people that I won't reason with.
You know, let's say, I'm not saying this is true, but let's say, well, he's just crazy.
You can't reason with him.
Finding Kindred Spirits00:14:13
But that's like being a doctor and saying, well, this person is too unwell.
I can't possibly treat them.
It's like, well, it's just a different kind of doctoring, isn't it?
And we have a good friend, Richard, I think is back.
Are you going to bring me some sweet, sweet reason, or are we going to go in hot pursuit of telekinesis?
Hey, Stefan.
Hello.
How are you doing tonight?
I'm well, thanks.
How are you doing?
Yeah, I'm great.
Thanks.
Yeah.
Thanks for asking.
Yeah, for sure.
Actually, I just wanted to make a comment on the podcast I listened to today, 41 and All Alone.
And sorry, what was it?
41 and what?
41 and All Alone.
Oh, yes, the interview, the call in show.
Yeah, sorry.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And I just want to say, like, to the guy who called in, you know, a great shout out to you for taking the courage to call in.
When you hit rock bottom.
And I think I just want to say to him, you know, you're not all alone, okay?
You know, you actually have other people out there in the world who do care.
And you, you know, you, I, he, he uttered this sort of recognition late in the podcast in the last few minutes when he kind of said to you, like, oh, wow, like, it's the first time I've felt like someone else cared for me.
And yeah, and I think, you know what?
Like, yeah, there are people out there on the planet that do care.
I know there may be few and far between, but don't give up, okay?
This is a call out to that guy.
And, you know, don't give up, okay?
Because there are people out there who care.
And don't give up.
Go forward, you know, take a good look in the mirror and take a look at yourself and then say, look, you know what?
You know, you can care for yourself.
You don't have to rely on other people to care.
That's the starting point.
Start with the caring for yourself, and then you will reach other people who can care for you too.
And then you, and more importantly, you will find people that you can care for in a real way.
Okay.
So that my message, my message for him was just like, please, please do not give up.
And we've all hit rock bottom, right?
You know, you, you, you, you've spoken about you hitting rock bottom.
I've hit rock bottom as well.
And, That's not the end.
You know, we can emerge out of that and find a better life.
And, you know, please, please, please don't give up because there is better stuff out there for you.
And you can find better people out there and then you can have a better life.
I think that's very nobly and beautifully put.
And thank you for that message.
You know, there's some cliches that have so much truth in them that they're worth meditating on.
And there's an old cliche, which is.
If you want to have a friend, be a friend.
Most people are out there in the world looking for things that can feed them, things that can make them feel better.
Oh, I'm lonely, so I want someone to care for me.
Oh, I'm sad, I want someone to cheer me up.
And that's fine.
That's fine.
But what about the reciprocal responsibilities?
There are sad people around you.
Maybe you can cheer them up.
There are lonely people around you.
Maybe you can make them feel less lonely.
So if you go through life as a whole wanting to receive, Then you end up receiving less and less and less because that tends to be the personality of somebody who turns out to be a bit of a taker.
Like, I want, I want, I want, I need, I need, I need.
And I'm sure we've all been around unstable people who are kind of bottomless holes that can't be filled.
Like, you're just constantly propping them up.
This is a bit more true, I think, from men to women that the woman is, you know, maybe highly anxious or depressed or whatever.
And you can spend your whole life trying to prop someone up.
And it's just like if you've ever had a tent that keeps falling down in the middle of a windstorm, it's sort of like your whole life is never.
Using the tent, just trying to get it to stay up.
And it's the same thing with relationships sometimes.
But so give and look for reciprocity.
Sometimes the best way to feed your emptiness is to fill up others.
But at the same time, it's an Aristotelian mean.
You don't want to be exploited by those others.
So it is very easy to go through life wanting other people to fix your problems.
I would love it if the world had been more sane and rational when I came along.
And I can wait for other people to do it, or I can do my very best to bring more reason and evidence to the world and hopefully leave it better.
Thereby.
And again, with this amazing technology that we have, which I literally drop my jaw in in gratitude and wonder every single day, I'm like, I can't believe that I get to carve my thoughts into the fabric of the universe from here to eternity with no gatekeepers.
This is the most astounding development in the history of thought that has ever occurred.
And I talked about this like over 20 years ago in a show about the Gutenberg Press, that the internet was the new Gutenberg Press, but much more instantaneous and much more widespread.
And now with AI, you can.
Get on the fly translations of podcasts into any language that you want sometimes.
And you can, you know, I've got AIs that I've developed for donors and others.
Peacefulparenting.com is one that's available for free, where you can ask questions of peaceful parenting in any one of 70 languages.
It's absolutely astounding, which means that the excuses that people have for not being reasonable or rational have extraordinarily diminished, right?
Yeah, yeah, 100%.
Yeah, so, you know, we have this incredible technology.
We have the capacity to set meetups up.
Like, if you're interested in a topic, just be a leader.
Set a meetup up.
There's meetup.com, there's tons of other places.
We used to use these for free domain meetups before things got too dangerous politically.
But get things going, you know, get communities going, get to know your neighbors, talk to people, be a social glue that brings people together.
Don't wait for solutions to come to you.
That is a depressed state that often arises out of neglected and Abused child, your life better.
Nobody really cares about you just for you.
That was your parents' job when you were a baby and a toddler.
It is nobody's job when you're an adult.
Go out and bring, you know, it's another cliche that's really be the change you want to see in the world.
I want the world to be more rational.
I will bring that to the world and try to build communities.
Try to bring what you find lacking in your life to others and you can have some beautiful stuff.
And you also will have some negative stuff.
Yeah, that if you're out there providing resources, some people will try to exploit you.
That's why I say don't go out into the world and try and make it better without a healthy access to your anger and the ability to express it because you're going to need that to protect yourself from exploiters.
But don't be an exploiter either.
Yeah, nobody, you know, it's a funny thing, you know, when you just see people around, you know, you're on the subway or the bus or whatever, and you just see people, you know, they've got this moat around them.
Some people, this loneliness, you know, that that's especially when they're older, they're just kind of isolated, they got nothing going on, and and I had that sense when my daughter and my wife were away for a while, and I was alone in the place.
And of course, I know that there are people who care about me in the world, obviously, right?
But I could really get that sense man, you can just disappear from the world, like especially these days where you don't even have to go out to get food anymore.
Like you could just disappear up your own ass in isolation and really wink out of existence and all of that.
But we're designed to be social animals.
So try and fight that urge and, you know, that old saying that.
One of the best ways to cure depression is to force yourself to go out of the house at every conceivable opportunity and talk to people and, you know, go and try and start communities.
If you care about paintings, then go start a watercolor painting community.
If you care about books, go get a book club going.
You care about train spotting, don't go do it alone.
Find someone to go train spotting with and just try and get that kind of connection.
And it's really hard to have a bad life when you're surrounded by good people, but it takes effort.
And it also takes you and me and others being good people to create all of that.
So I think it's a great message to remind people of.
Yeah, yeah, 100%.
And, you know, the point you made during that podcast was like, you know, we are social beings, social creatures.
Right, and that's a beauty, like I see that as a beautiful thing.
And now, with all the like you just said, what you know, this interconnectedness, you know, there's so much more opportunity for us to seek out other like minded people, you know, even if even if we're not in the same exact location or proximity, yeah, we can nevertheless, you know, I'm talking to you right now, and you've made such a profound difference in my life.
And I'm only a recent, you know, like a recent listener over the last six or seven months, but we, you know, you.
The conversations we've had and the help that you provided by listening and enabling me to reach out, and it's been profound.
And I just want to say out to everybody out there like, reach out and don't give up.
And there are other like minded people out there, and it's easy now.
It's not like back in the day when you had pen pals or this kind of stuff.
Like, no, it's right out there.
And please, for anyone out there who's feeling this.
You know, isolation or they're lost in aloneness.
No, that's not the case.
There are other people out there who can care for you, you can care for, and you can find like mindedness.
And yeah, you can find it, right?
And just, you know, like get up and, you know, go outside and reach out and you'll find that.
You'll find that.
And you'll have, yeah, and have important conversations.
You know, there was a study that came out that people who attend church regularly tend to be happier.
Now, it's always tough to tease out cause and effect.
Maybe people who are happier.
Tend to go to church more, right?
I mean, so it's always hard to tease out cause and effect.
But what I will say is that one of the things that is important about church is that you're talking about something other than immediate material or romantic or sexual or business or financial problems.
You're talking about, you know, meaning and virtue and truth and goodness and a larger view of your life than the everyday.
It is really important in your life to zoom out rather than.
Deal with the inevitable hobgoblins of the everyday.
Oh, my water boiler is leaking.
Oh, and my car needs new brakes.
Oh, and, you know, my back is hurting today.
And you could just have this endless little conveyor belt of tiny gremlins that snatch up every higher thought you could possibly have.
And it's important to zoom out in life and to really make sure that you're seeing a larger picture, a deeper picture, a more virtuous and valued picture.
And religion provides that.
But it's not only religion that can provide that.
Have Important conversations.
When was the last time you asked a friend what he thought the meaning of his life was, or the meaning of life as a whole, or the purpose of life?
Or have you ever talked to a friend of yours about his biggest moral battle, his biggest moral triumph, maybe his biggest moral failing, right?
I mean, talk about things that matter, talk about things that are important, talk about things that are meaningful.
Because that's where the true humanity is, and that's where we can really connect with others.
Yeah.
And, you know, from my experience, it's like if you do ask those kind of questions to somebody, the shock of surprise on their face and delight is incredible, you know, because they say, like, oh, wow, you know, like, you're interested in what I think?
And I go, yeah.
And they kind of go, wow, you know, and it opens up such opportunity.
And the joy that comes as a result of that is, you know, incalculable, right?
You can't get to know anyone if you don't know their deepest thoughts.
And we all have deepest thoughts, and our deepest thoughts tend to be isolating unless we're sharing them with others.
And to tie sort of the beginning and the end of the show together, remember it's very important to have a social life, especially when you're out in the world.
If you're walking alone, particularly in farmers' fields, if you're alone, you are far more likely to be abducted by space aliens.
We don't want that for these listeners because if they take you off planet, if they take you off planet, You cannot get to freedomain.com/slash/donate, which is where you need to get to.
Yeah.
To help keep this show free and accessible and commercial-free and all of that.
Freedomain.com/slash/donate.
So avoid abductions.
Yeah.
Have a good community.
They never take people from the middle of church and they never take people from the middle of a philosophical meetup.
Yeah.
Super important.
Yeah.
Yeah.
100%.
I mean, like, that's so beautiful.
Yeah.
It's almost like it goes without saying, but it was worth saying.
Yeah.
All right, everyone.
Well, thank you, Richard.
I appreciate the conversation tonight and thank you.
Everyone, if you meet people with unusual ideas or ideas that you really disagree with, be curious.
Yeah.
And you're not likely to change people's minds right away, but sometimes you plant a seed and it grows over time and so on.
So, but be positive, be pleasant, be helpful with your thoughts.
And I really do appreciate everyone's support.
Free domain dot com slash donate to help out.
And we will talk to you Sunday morning for our philosophy show.