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March 13, 2025 - Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux
53:03
Izzy Corrects Stef on Twitter!
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Time Text
Alright, so, questions.
It's been a while since we did a show.
Yes.
Because you've been selfishly busy with other things such as social life and schoolwork.
Yep.
It's rude.
It's been kind of crazy the last few months.
It really has been, right?
So, how is it?
March 10th, what the heck?
Yeah, yeah.
So, would you like to have a look at the first page of this question?
The first page of this.
And then this is the second page of this question.
But it doesn't do the whole third page of the question.
Maybe that's because your font is like the size of an elephant.
Look, it's old guy font.
You have like seven glasses.
I have seven glasses, but sometimes I like to walk outside or walk around and not have to wear my glasses.
Oh.
All right, are you ready?
Yeah.
Dear Izzy, what should we call this guy?
Yapper McBlabbyhead.
Yapper McBlabbyhead.
All right.
Boaty McBoatface.
Dear Izzy, what are your thoughts on your father Steph's reasoning for not returning to Twitter?
I'm sure you're aware Steph has said he does not want to go back to Twitter because he does not go back to formerly abusive relationships without an apology.
And Twitter, when they banned me, they accused me of platform manipulation.
So that's when you buy bots or whatever it is, right?
Now, that's not...
I never bought a single bot.
I like any of that kind of stuff, right?
The only thing I can think of that they were thinking of was that...
Do you remember Mike?
Yes.
Yes, of course.
So Mike was running my Twitter account.
I had my own account that I would occasionally like the posts, right?
So there were two of us in the company and there were two people liking posts.
That's entirely valid.
That's not platform manipulation, right?
I feel like that is very a normal thing.
Yeah, that's a normal thing.
I'm on like Instagram or whatever and my friends and I all have multiple accounts and if we make it...
Oh, I'm telling.
Oh, I'm telling.
Oh no, I'm going to get banned by four followers of my friends.
No, I'm kidding.
But if I have like a few different accounts and the accounts follow each other and the accounts, I don't know, if I see it pop up, I usually just like everything that comes onto my feed.
If it's from my friends or an account, I follow them, whatever.
So to my mind, it's not like a formal thing, but to my mind, they were accusing me of a kind of fraud.
Yeah.
Of buying followers or buying likes or anything like that.
I don't think, you know, with the amount of followers and likes and interactions you were getting, one extra like from a side account is not the make or break of whether it shows up on someone's feed.
Well, and if I had been running the account, then Mike would have had a Twitter account and he would have liked it.
Yeah.
Anyway, I had almost half a million, 450,000 followers, one extra like.
And they banned me without warnings.
They're supposed to give you a timeout or whatever, right?
Yeah, it's supposed to be like strikes and stuff.
Yeah, strikes and that.
So, what are your thoughts on the reasoning for not returning to Twitter or X? Honestly, I feel like it's valid.
Oh, I feel a strong countercurrent.
I would have just gone back on.
You would have just gone back on?
It's a new owner.
Forgive and forget.
Well, hang on then.
Why didn't you let me back on Instagram?
Well, here's the thing, though.
So since I'm a teenager and my entire personality is pointing out hypocrisy, he was like, oh, Instagram unbanned me.
No, no.
Maybe they let me back on.
Yeah, maybe Instagram would let you back on.
And I'm like, how are you going to explain to your viewers why it was okay to do Instagram that never even got taken over by cool people or whatever?
You can't do Twitter, who you're a big fan of the owner.
I like how your moral reasoning is not whether it's right or wrong, but can it be explained?
Can you talk your way out of it is your foundational.
I was pretty much like, yeah, how are you going to explain it?
I don't really have morals and stuff.
Well, you know, hopefully that will come around at some point.
Maybe the next generation.
It's like twins.
It skips a generation.
Are you trying to say that if I had been able to find some way to explain it to my listeners, it would have been fine?
Yeah.
Well, the thing is, you can, like, argue anything, so you probably could have done it.
Apparently, yeah, okay.
Now, should we just keep going with this?
Sure.
All right.
Now, I know Steph has been a very peaceful parent and a wonderful father, so it may be tempting for you to feel compelled to accept your father's reasoning behind his position as a result.
So, as you can see, this question is actually a dual layer.
Oh, this guy wants me to argue for him.
He disagrees with it.
He wants me to do it.
Well, that's, you know, and if you do...
If you do agree with it, then that's fine.
So, the second part of the question is, can you, Izzy, take a fully objective opinion on a subject whilst disagreeing with your father rather than following your pro-step bias that you may understandably have?
I do not have a pro-step bias.
I'm a teenager.
Nothing is biased towards my parents, only against.
Yeah.
So, do you think this guy has ever raised a teenager?
I don't think this guy has ever interacted with...
I think when he was in high school, he, like, hid from everyone, like, sat in the corner.
Ah, children!
No, we won't give any names.
Oh my god, that guy!
What's your description of him?
Wait, which guy?
The guy who's like, he's a 60-year-old guy trapped in a teenager's body.
We were talking about him just...
Oh, yeah, he's like, why are you an adult already?
Well, no, more than an adult.
It's the kind of guy you expect him to show up with a bad knee just from aging.
Yeah, yeah, he's one of these guys I know.
He's nice, I like him.
I don't think he's ever done something where it's, like, you sound like a six-year-old, like, judge in a courtroom.
Like, you know what?
You can use brain rot terms.
It's not going to, like, ruin your moral status.
It's okay.
Yeah, so, um, he may hit this question or may have been cryogenically frozen over the course of teenage...
I don't know, this guy sounds so passive.
Go on.
I don't know.
He's kind of passive.
I'm just saying.
What voice should I use to read the remainder?
No, no.
Just normal.
Just normal.
Okay.
Oh, that's your normal voice?
Oh, God, no.
Actually, that is my normal voice.
I put on the rest of it.
Yeah, he tries so hard.
You guys should hear him when he's not recording.
He turns on the recorder.
Oh, well, hello.
Hello.
You see, what this question is ultimately about is if you feel you can totally and completely remove any bias you may have towards your most loyal allies in order to pursue purely objective reasoning.
For the purpose of pursuing the ultimate philosophical critique of the truth of pure reason.
Why are we on page 1 of 2.5 and he's saying this question is ultimately and it's a two and a half page question?
So what does it mean?
I don't know what this exactly means to totally and completely remove any bias.
It just means don't have, like, dissociate your emotions from your reasoning.
Okay, let me ask you this.
If your close friends were in trouble, would you be able to remove any bias in the moment?
That's a tough question because it depends.
Okay, maybe I've made a misjudgment in their moral, whatever.
They may not be the ones on the right.
Right.
Now, my particular feeling is I leap to the defense of friends and figure it out later.
See, I would do that.
I like a lot of my friends.
I like a lot of my friends.
Category is also friends I don't like.
No, what I mean is, honestly, I think they're great people, but I feel like I tend to view things through a very, I want to say third-person lens or whatever.
There have been times when we've been in arguments, not me, but my friend group and other people or whatever have been in arguments, and I will argue against my friends.
Well, no, but that's...
Even when it's not, like, playful, even when it's more kind of serious, if I don't agree with them, I'll absolutely do that.
So I don't know, obviously, if they were in trouble, that would be a different situation.
Right.
But that's the only kind of comparison I can think of.
I may not...
Like, I'm pretty loyal.
Yeah.
I would definitely say that.
Yeah, I think that's true, yeah.
But I'm also very, quote-unquote, objective, and I think before I take sides, I have to know what I'm getting into.
Okay, so let me ask you this.
Let's say that friends of yours, there was a pushing match with guys.
Now, I'm not saying you necessarily get in and start dusting it up with fists and chompings.
Chompings.
Chompings.
But would you think, well, maybe they started it.
Absolutely.
Yeah, you think your friends should have started it?
Oh, absolutely.
Go on.
You think they're kind of mouthy that way?
Oh, yeah.
Okay.
Oh, some of them, some of them.
But I would not intervene at all until I knew what happened.
Really?
I don't think so, no.
Interesting.
So, yes, I think that you can remove more bias.
That's good.
I would probably, if I said anything, I would probably say, like, I'd try and stop the fight if possible, but I don't think I'd get involved or do anything.
Even if it was just, like, non-physical and verbal or whatever, I don't think I'd really get involved.
But, I don't know.
Interesting.
All right.
Izzy, now, if you do have a pro-staff bias, Steph has understandably earned that pro-staff bias in your mind.
And I don't blame you for having that bias.
Okay, I'm so glad you don't blame me.
I was really worried about that.
In some contexts, a bias is not necessarily a bad thing.
However, not always.
Izzy, are you able to separate an opinion for the purposes of a purely objective analysis?
I think so.
And critique of pure reason from your own unbiased objective perspective?
I mean, as to the best that you can, I think I can do that.
Well, I'll say this.
I think you've been in some competitions and so on lately, and I think, and I've, of course, gone to watch them.
I think that you have a good objective judgment as to how well or poorly people are doing, even when it's a fairly subjective evaluation.
Yeah, like, I'll make an example.
There's just something that happened recently.
We were on teams or whatever.
There was a girl I really, really disliked.
Something about her, she just really annoys me.
And when she finished what she was doing in the competition, I was, like, really tempted to say, wow, she did a horrible job.
And I think I... First, I did actually say, I don't think she did that well.
And then I re-updated that statement to you guys.
And I was like, you know what?
I take it back.
I just really don't like her.
Do you remember that?
I was like, she did actually admittedly do a good job.
There was something that maybe she shouldn't have done.
And I think I over-focused on that.
But I went back and I was like...
So you caught your bias and viewed it more objectively, right?
I think I do that because something I really dislike is hypocrisy and bias and stuff like that.
I think we kind of established that a little bit earlier in the show.
But, yeah, something I really dislike is hypocrisy, and I find it hypocritical to be biased.
Right.
Because it's like, why are you only treating one side good and not the other?
I feel like that's a form of hypocrisy.
I don't know.
That's the thing for me.
But I feel like I'm also pretty objective with myself.
Something that I thought was a pretty common personality trait until, most recently, this competition, same thing I mentioned earlier, everyone was like, we did amazing!
And I'm like, you?
No, no, we didn't.
We definitely did not.
I'm not going to get into any more details, but it was pretty objective.
I think I was objective, you were objective from an outside view of things, but everyone thinks they did amazing, when in reality, I think we quite clearly lost.
Right, right, right.
Well, in reality, but certainly in the opinion of the judges, yeah.
Yeah.
And, oh gosh, what was that?
There was something that just popped into my mind.
We were reading a book a while ago.
And I was pointing out about how I thought I had a bigger influence on the world than seemed evident.
And then we were talking about a character, and I was making fun of the fact that the character thought the world revolved around her, and you said, but I have a bigger influence than as a parent.
So anyway, that was pretty fun.
All right.
Hey, Apple, I'm thinking about...
Wait, did we finish even?
Oh, so there was...
Because I don't even know what he's even asking.
Yeah, okay.
For example, in regards to the question at hand presently, I think that's, let's go back.
Oh, no, please, I can't go back.
No, that's Twitter on app.
Okay.
Do you think that commentators who say, well, Twitter didn't treat you bad, Steph, sorry, well, Twitter did treat you bad, Steph, but that's irrelevant because it's owned by Elon Musk now.
I think this argument is a pretty strong argument.
So do you...
Think so also, Izzy.
You know what?
I can see it.
Yeah, I can see it too.
I think if you get, like, let's say you have, I don't know, some crime, some criminal or whatever, right?
He dies.
All of his quote-unquote sins and bad stuff does not get transferred to his kids.
And his kids do not then have to start apologizing to everyone and say, oh, I'm so sorry for what my parents did or whatever, right?
Unless it's white people and slavery, then it's a whole different matter.
Yeah, apparently, right?
Or men and women for the end of time.
Right.
But no, I'm just saying, I think that's a pretty valid argument because, I mean, he could apologize for what other people in Twitter did, but that's really not on him.
Right.
No, and absolutely, Elon did not do me wrong.
Yeah, and he fired like 99% of the people who did, who were involved with that at least.
That's true.
Yes, that's true.
So I can certainly see that argument.
And he says, is he...
Steph has principles, as you know, but sometimes two principles collide with each other, for example, such as not going back to an abusive relationship without an apology compared to demanding an apology when the person who inflicted the harm is gone.
At that point, Izzy, would it not be actually immoral to demand an apology from someone who played no part in the original harm that was done?
I honestly don't really care if it's moral or not.
I care if it's hypocritical.
I'm not kidding.
No, I get that.
Honestly, I think it's down to personal opinion.
If he doesn't want to go back on, he does not have to go back on and he can give his reasons.
Whether they're right or wrong, that's really up to him because it's his thing.
It's not like he's affecting a company with like 500 people or whatever and they're going to lose their jobs.
Or it's not like I'm talking about kicking off a balcony or something like this.
Yeah, it's not like it's harming someone else.
Although you could say that lack of spreading the word is not as good because it...
Yeah, yeah.
No, I actually thought of going on Twitter, just posting the link to peacefulparenting.com and then going back off again.
You could totally do that.
That would be kind of funny.
But then again, a lot of the audience would be like, but you said like...
Yeah, yeah.
So the general argument is that a corporation is not a person, obviously.
So when you buy, when Elon Musk bought the corporation, he bought all of its assets and liabilities.
Like if you buy a corporation...
You don't get to erase its debts.
You'd have to go through bankruptcy for that, which he didn't do.
So he gets all of the assets, all the computers, all of the code, all of the buildings, everything, the employees.
So he gets all of the assets and he gets all of the liabilities.
So it's not the individual.
It's the corporation that owes me an apology, if that makes sense.
Now, I was going to say one thing.
Would you say that since the corporation has greatly changed to become, like, all the code, or not all the code, but, like, the suppression and stuff like that, There's less.
There's a lot less.
I think he really tried to get rid of all of that.
Again, he did fire the majority of the people that were doing that.
Would you say that, since you're an empiricist, that the actions matter more than the apology?
Would you say those are actions of saying, we're not going to ban you again?
So, when you say, I'm an empiricist, that's a judo move.
It is kind of a judo move, but I was saying, I know I am saying, but I'm saying, like, with this mindset or whatever, So as an empiricist, then I would judge the actions of the new Twitter rather than the liabilities of the old Twitter?
Or the words.
You say the corporation didn't apologize, but they've changed to the point where it could be considered an implicit apology.
That's a good argument.
I should have been a lawyer.
Yeah, you know, I hadn't thought of that implicit.
It's sort of like, if somebody doesn't apologize to you, let's say that somebody does you wrong, they don't directly apologize to you, but they go to therapy, they, you know, really change as a whole, and so on.
And they do let you back on, right?
They did let me back on, yeah, yeah.
It's not like they did unban, quote-unquote, but they never sent an email like, I'm sorry.
Right.
So that the action is the apology.
As an empiricist, well, I mean, sorry, there's only really one response to that.
Uh, what?
Parental authority?
Oh, cut the recording, right.
No, no, no.
No, I'm kidding, I'm kidding.
It's much more elegant than that.
I'd just like to announce to the world and to you as a whole that I'm no longer an empiricist.
Just so you know, that's gone, baby.
Woo!
You know, it was 43 years since I got into philosophy.
I've really been an empiricist.
I mean, this is really your fault.
Like, you raised me to think like this, so I don't really...
No, it's not raising you to think like this.
It's just raising you to think at all.
That's the problem.
Oh, right, right.
No, that is really...
That is the implicit apology of change.
And as you point out, like, the people who did it are mostly gone.
Didn't he fire like...
He fired like 80% of the people.
And I think the Trust and Safety Committee, which was like the Orwellian...
All those women who'd be like, a day in my life as someone who works at Twitter.
First we wake up and I take a long shower and then I do my makeup.
Here's my favorite products.
So, then I made my way down to work.
Oh, I get a latte at the cafe.
Yes, then I made my way down to work, and I started off the day checking in, and then I got a latte from one of our lovely espresso dispensers.
It's all self-serve.
It's really nice.
Completely complimentary.
Don't they go on the roof at some point?
Yeah, and then after a quick little meeting, we had lunch on the roof.
Today, they were serving Asian-style cuisine.
Oh, no.
Oh, I've got to ad-lib some of these.
Holy crap.
I haven't watched those in ages, but they were, like, burned into my brain.
They have all those fun little fonts and stuff.
It's like, I want to work there.
So, let me ask you this then.
If we take the empiricism of the implicit apology, is that enough, do you think?
Should I go back?
I don't know if you should go back.
There's a lot of other stuff to consider.
But just based on that argument.
Yeah.
Take your time.
Hmm.
Whiteboard it.
Whiteboard it.
I'm going to pull up my calculator.
Bring out your dragons.
I've got to think about this with numbers.
Right.
So you think I should, right?
Well, I don't know if you should.
No, just based on that argument.
There are other considerations or whatever, but based on that argument is the request for an apology.
In other words, because you can have the apology without the change in behavior.
Would you rather have the change in behavior without the apology or the apology without the change in behavior?
I'd rather have the change in behavior without the apology.
Yeah, because I know if we ever get into an argument or something and I say sorry, and you're like, you know what, I appreciate that, but I'm going to see change or whatever, like that kind of thing before.
Or mine, too.
Like, when I was grumpy and all of that, and you were like, be less grumpy.
And I was like, what do you mean, be less grumpy?
And so, you know, I have to change the behavior, right?
Yeah, yeah.
But I really should hold out the perfection of both.
I just felt like this guy's trap.
He was doing this whole thing, like, you argue the point.
And he's like, can you really be biased?
I mean, I will never fall into a trap.
What?
No, he's played us both.
He played us both.
Oh, well done.
You should just take over the show at this point.
All right, so that's a tricky one, so we can move on.
Yeah, I guess it's going to be a bit shorter show, but I'm just going to ignore that.
It might be a whole shorter show in terms of all the shows, so I'll just go back on Twitter.
Right.
All right, so, hey, you see, I'm thinking about homeschooling my future kids, but the concern I have is the socialization part that is kind of deficient compared to going to school.
How are you pleased with your experience in that aspect, and what would your guidelines be?
Did you have a desire to go to school, and how did you and your parents handle that?
And at the end, did you remember the explanation that you got, if you ever asked why you were being homeschooled?
Yeah, why?
You wanted to be homeschooled very, very much.
Yes, extremely much.
Very much.
Yes, I was in school grade one and two.
And it wasn't like a school school.
It was like some...
It had like weird teaching methods.
It was like one of those stupid...
Yeah, Montessori.
Montessori, yeah, yeah.
It was like...
It was really bad.
It was bad because they had a parent come in one day, one of those days, and the teacher incorrectly scored my math questions.
It was like grade two math.
Grade two math.
I actually still remember.
I think it was, like, simple multiplication where you put the numbers over each other and stuff.
And, like, I got two wrong out of four and she marked all four correct because I think she wanted me to look good in front of you.
Yeah, yeah.
Oh, yeah.
And then when they gave us your evaluation, they were typos.
Oh, my gosh, really?
I forgot about that.
That was not ideal.
Anyway, so you very much wanted to be homeschooled.
I said to everyone at the end of the year, I'm like, there's a 99.9% chance I'm coming.
Sorry.
There's a 99.9% chance you will see me again next year.
I don't think I'm going to get homeschooled.
I remember clearly saying that to everyone, and then I never showed up again.
You mounted a real campaign.
I've heard about homeschooling, and I just went at it.
Like, get me out!
I'm really, really glad you did, of course.
Yeah.
So I would say, from my experience at least, Elementary school, definitely not.
Kids at that age, I don't honestly think...
Definitely not what?
Definitely not school, sorry.
Definitely don't do school in elementary, at least from my experience.
Maybe it would be different in a different school.
We had a very small selection.
I think my entire class had 15 kids, and that was from grade 1 to 4. And then there was like a tiny middle school kids with like 7 kids.
It was a tiny school, like middle of nowhere.
So maybe at a school with more kids, more options, more possible friends.
But really, since there were only, like, five grade ones or whatever out of the 15, 18 kids, then it was, like, you really had so few people that it was really hard to find, like, if I didn't like those kids, who was I going to be friends with?
And it just happened to be I didn't like those kids.
So we were friends, but, like, it just was not good friendships, that kind of thing.
So I would say maybe if you can find a school with more kids, it could be doable for the social life.
I definitely found socializing in like teenage high school years.
We joined a homeschooling group that was amazing for that.
Very good.
But without that homeschooling group, honestly, I think I would have been really depressed and lonely.
Yeah.
Because at that age, especially, I'd say age 10 onwards, social life becomes a whole lot more important for kids.
It's different maybe if you have siblings.
But even then, I could see wanting to get away from your siblings and meet other people.
You want to differentiate and have your own thing.
And also, you want to get out of the sibling hierarchy.
Yeah, definitely.
Oldest, youngest, that kind of thing.
So, I would say...
Definitely when they're younger, homeschool.
If you can find a homeschooling group or find clubs, maybe get them involved in sports.
I personally hated sports with a burning passion.
I still kind of do.
So I never really got involved in sports.
But you do enjoy arguing about the rules with your friends.
Yeah, pretty much.
Actually, wait, no, I misunderstood what you said.
Oh my gosh.
What?
I'm going on a tangent.
There's this one guy.
There's this one guy.
We will play pickleball.
We have, like, a little sports center or whatever that we have access to and we invite our friends over, like, once a week.
And it's usually, like, dads and sons.
But I, you know, I'm friends with them, so I go play as well.
And these guys, they spend more time arguing about the rules than playing the game.
And it's not all of them.
It's, like, one of them, but the others do not have enough self-knowledge or restraint or a mix of both to understand.
And not get drawn into the argument.
The first guy, when it was his first time playing, and he kept missing a few shots.
Obviously, because this is his first time playing, and no one was making fun of him.
Well, we were joking.
We were like, ooh, you suck.
It was a joke, obviously.
And that's pretty common in the friend group.
We are very insulting towards one another.
And like, oh my gosh, he went over to the people on the other court, because we had bright red balls, and they had yellow ones.
And he went over, and he literally took it.
I was like, can I see if the bounce is different?
Because he said it was a different weight and that's why he was missing the shots.
He was hitting them, they just weren't going in the right...
Do you think he's the kind of guy who would blame the lag on his video game performance?
Yes, and he has.
He has.
When we played games a while back, he was like, I'm lagging!
And I'm like, no you aren't, you just can't hit.
And I'm not saying that from a point of like, I'm better, because I couldn't hit either.
We were up against skilled teammates, but like...
We're not lagging.
This guy drives me insane.
These were the guys when I was your age or younger.
It was the...
Something's wrong with my joystick.
I pushed the button.
Something's wrong with the joystick.
You know, I can see that.
I've had a controller breakdown on me before.
But yeah, no, it's true.
But not continually and intermittently.
And then he created this rule at the end and we ended up playing to like 16, 17 because you had to win four consecutive rounds in a row to win.
And like, obviously that wasn't going to happen because it was a very well-matched team.
Drive me insane.
It's okay.
So you see, socialization can drive you insane.
Yeah, so basically you should go live in the cabin in the middle of nowhere because you may argue over sports.
No, but seriously, I would say have your kids get involved in sports.
Meet people.
If you go to church, definitely youth groups are going to be a good way to do that.
I've been to youth groups in hopes of meeting people.
Sadly, I did not find the friendships I was looking for, but it was still a cool experience.
Yeah, definitely.
Sports, youth groups, absolutely fine homeschooling groups.
They are getting a whole lot more popular nowadays, especially if you have younger kids.
I've been struggling to find teenage homeschooling groups, but everything for, like, younger kids, do it early.
Get involved early.
I think that parents are reasonably enough.
Now, we were also fortunate in that our neighbor was a teacher, and you enjoyed learning with, what was it, Ginger Snaps?
Did I have that, right?
Yes, we would have, it would be like a little two-hour thing, like twice a week.
And she was an ex-teacher.
She was really sweet.
Oh, lovely girl.
Yeah, I love her.
And we would have, I think in the winters, we would have a little cup of tea halfway through the lesson with a ginger snap cookie or two and a little bit of honey.
That's right.
And then in the summers, if I would ever go over to her house...
I would have, she had like those little mini popsicles from the freezer and sometimes I would have one.
That's right.
I never remembered what my favorite flavor was, but I always picked the white one because it was different.
All the other ones were colored.
I always went for the white one because it was like the only one that wasn't dyed.
Right.
And yeah.
Yeah, she was like a grandmother, honestly.
She really was lovely.
They both are very nice.
Yeah.
And absolutely loved you.
So yeah, if you can get sort of a mix of people, definitely when the kids are single digits, I think parents are mostly enough.
I would honestly still say get the friendships.
Get friends for sure, but it becomes less important than it is now.
If it starts young, you can become friends with the families and it stays.
It's pretty constant.
Even if you guys are apart for a while, if you've been friends since young, if you don't see each other for a couple of years and you meet again, it'll be like you never left.
That's what I've noticed, at least from friends and stuff.
That's true.
And you don't have to have a synchronicity of beliefs.
There obviously has to be an overlap in generally how people are parents and so on.
It doesn't have to be exact.
Yeah, it doesn't have to be exact because...
Yeah, and so I think that certainly for you, I mean, you got to leave home in a year or two and you got to be out there and know how to socialize.
Yeah.
And if you don't know how to socialize, it's really awkward trying to get out there with people who have good skills already.
Yeah, I have changed so much over the last two years since having this friend group and the homeschooling group.
Obviously, I mean, I was good at socializing when I first started, but I definitely was different.
I knew that, and I feel like I've definitely conformed more to, like, the teenage standard of socializing, but I think that's a good thing I've tried to, because I didn't want to always be, like, talking as though, again, like a 60-year-old with, like, a 10-year-old's body or whatever, because there's definitely some kids who do that, and they're very fun, and they're nice, and they're smart, but it's also, like, why?
Like, just be normal.
And have some fun, and don't be too serious about things, especially as a teenager.
Yeah, don't be the guy who's going to be like...
I'm sorry, I can't party on New Year's Eve.
I have an essay due tomorrow.
It's like, okay.
Right, right.
Have fun.
All right, so good.
What aspects of life are most mysterious to you?
Which subjects, academic or personal, most pique your curiosity?
Oh, I was scared for a second.
Okay, so let's start with what aspects of life are most mysterious to you?
I don't know.
Having wrinkles.
Not unknown.
Actually, looking 16?
I look like I'm 12. You have a rather youthful look.
We walked past a buffet today and it said 10 and under and I was like, man, if I didn't wear makeup, I could get in.
Yeah.
I literally, I gotta be honest, I would not wear makeup if it wasn't for the fact that when I didn't wear makeup and I had my job last spring, everyone thought I was 12. Yes, that was odd.
Because I am short, I have a small frame, and I have...
Like, especially last year, I had still a lot more of, like, baby cheeks and stuff like that.
Unfortunately, that's gone away a bit.
You have a baby face, a little bit.
I have a baby face, and I still had really crooked teeth.
Fortunately, going through Invisalign, actually not fortunately, it sucks, but it will get, it'll fix that, so I still had crooked teeth, so everyone was like, oh, she's like, are you, like, 12, 13?
And what, because they do actually have people there who'd worked who were 12 or 13. Which I'm really not sure is allowed, but you know what?
Money's money.
Do you want to give people your height and weight so they know exactly what we're talking about here?
Yes.
I am 5'3", maybe.
I think I'm 5'3 and a half.
I think I've grown a bit since then.
I'm on my way to 5'4".
Just, you know, do what I do, round up a little.
Yeah.
Okay, 5'4", 105. So, I have, like...
I look like a 12-year-old.
Genuinely, I look like a 12-year-old.
It's not even funny at this point.
I was talking...
At the said homeschooling group, I met a senior who I'd never seen before, and we were chatting.
He seemed nice enough.
And...
He's like, how old are you?
And I'm like, oh, I'm 16. He's like, what?
And I'm like, what?
And he's like, oh, I thought I'd never seen you because you went to middle school events.
Well, and you are the queen of middle school-aged boys.
That's true.
So they see you as one of their own.
Oh my gosh, in the musical that I'm in, it happens to be that for my song, my entire ensemble is middle school boys.
I don't know, they think I'm all in middle school or something because I think every single one of them has asked me to dance at the school dances.
They're nice, but it's also like, three years younger, never going to happen.
Come on, guys, please.
There's so many nice middle school girls, please.
Right.
You are the queen.
Right.
All right.
Which subjects, academic or personal, most pique your curiosity?
I really like English for writing, but I hate that it's subjective.
Oh, you mean in the valuation?
Yes.
So, I mean, okay, here's the thing.
I find grammar really annoying.
Which is the only part of English that isn't really subjective.
Even then, there's a little bit like, should you put a comma there?
Yeah, yeah.
It depends how the character is saying it.
I don't know.
When I'm writing dialogue, I know if there should be a comma there, but I want them to say it flat and monotone, and if there's a comma, there's pause and a breath.
I don't want a breath.
I want it to be one line.
It's like, ugh.
Anyways, I feel like there's writing styles, but I like English.
I very much enjoy writing, but I sadly have...
The English courses I'm taking online, they're just like, they kill my love of English.
Obviously, I still write and stuff, but it's just like, oh, analyze this book about a culture you don't care about, and about people you don't like, and about problems that don't concern you, and have a very strong opinion about it.
And, oh, but the opinion has to align with this particular, and it's like, okay, you know what?
It's just not fun.
Or it's like, I like reading, but a lot of the books I've had to read lately for school.
I would say I definitely really much like English.
It's just that I don't like the way it gets taught.
I would say I also really like biology.
I missed my science last year, so I'm taking two this year and one next year to make up for three.
Because you have to do three through high school, or at least you're supposed to.
I'm currently on biology.
It's actually really interesting.
All I see is world building.
Like, if I'm making a world, it's like, ah, yes, this creature would have this function because of this and like that.
So, who knows, maybe I should write sci-fi or fantasy with, like, advanced.
Like, that's something I liked about the series Dune, is that, obviously, okay, the giant sandworms, you know what, they're giant sandworms.
You sometimes have to do stuff for the audience.
But he definitely tried his best to explain it.
Like, they're like the whales who sift through the sand and that kind of thing.
I like series that really focus on how everything has to make sense, and I really like biology because it explains that everything has to make sense.
So I have a very high-grade biology.
I'm very proud of that.
My English grade last year was abysmal, at least for my standards, but my biology is going okay.
Right, right.
And also, culinary arts is in your interest.
Oh, yeah.
I was originally thinking I may go get a business degree, but I feel like I already have a really good mindset for business.
Every time when I went to work, I was always like, this needs to be fixed, this needs to be fixed, this needs to be fixed.
We've been talking about business since you were little.
Yes, but the one thing, I have a lot of good ideas, and I think I have a natural talent with cooking, but I do not have the techniques, and there's a lot I don't know, and I feel like a culinary course could be very much useful if I ever go down pursuing that path of restaurant and culinary, because it's something I find very interesting, so I would like to do that.
To which I say, hold up!
Let her cook.
Yeah.
All right.
All right.
So that's interesting.
Do you have concerns about being able to afford to be a stay-at-home mom?
Finding a man in his early 20s who has the means to be a sole income provider and is on board with peaceful parenting will be quite challenging.
What are your expectations around this?
I would say yes, a little bit.
I don't know.
I don't have a huge pool of guys that I'm able to see now, if that makes sense.
But from the guys I know, I'm not really sure.
Any of them would be fitting in their 20s or 30s or whatever.
At least for what I'm looking for.
But, you know, I'm sure that'll be different.
One of the reasons I do plan to go on to secondary education.
Secondary, that's the word?
Post-second.
Well, it would be, let's do university.
I guess, yeah, university or whatever.
Is because it would be to meet a guy.
I'm going to get my Mrs. Degree.
MRS Degree.
Okay.
MRS Degree.
But...
I think, yes, it might be a bit difficult.
I think peaceful parenting is a huge popularity rise.
Nowadays, I see so many videos of like, oh, here's things my toxic parents do that I will do.
Like, they're literally over my feet.
I don't look for them.
They just show up.
No matter what I do, they just show up.
Like, people are definitely...
Wait a minute.
Why are you looking at videos about things your toxic parents do?
Oh, I'm not looking at them.
I'm making them.
No, it's just like...
It just shows up my feet.
Or like those skits where they'll play both sides, both characters or whatever, right?
They're everywhere.
So I don't think finding a guy who is at least not on board or very easy to convince or exposed to it will be difficult at all.
The only problem is I think finding a guy who matches my vibe.
I know that's such a phrase, but like...
It's a real thing.
Yeah, I find personally humor is the most important thing.
I don't think I could ever date a guy who doesn't have my sense of humor.
Or just a good sense of humor in general?
Good sense of humor.
I feel like I have a good sense of humor, so it would really be that because, you know, I'm perfect.
No, I'm kidding.
But I think, yeah, for me at least, sense of humor is probably top most important in terms of compatible personalities.
Obviously, there's other stuff non-personality related, but yeah.
So I think it will be hard.
To find the right guy.
To find the right guy.
But yeah, we'll see.
Well, the other thing is, if I remember our conversation about this, Eagerly looking forward to being broke.
Oh my gosh, yeah, I'm really excited.
I cannot wait to go.
I want to cover as many financial stuff as possible when I move out and go to university or college or whatever.
I'm currently saving up.
Well, it's not really like a saving up thing.
I don't spend money.
I hate spending money.
Well, not only do you hate spending money.
I hate spending other people's money.
But heaven forbid your parents want to buy something.
It has to be extracted from your flesh.
Yeah.
You know what's kind of sad?
Not sad, but I was kind of noticing it.
I will go out sometimes, or not sometimes, actually, recently, because I have a lot of schoolwork.
I find it helpful to just be out of the house and, like, focused on something.
So I will go to a cafe for, like, a few hours, usually.
And I was, like, looking, I'm like, well, should I get this or should I get this?
And one was a sandwich, one was a soup.
And the soup was cheaper by, like, 50 cents.
So I went for the soup.
There is nothing about the nutritional value.
Will it be satisfying?
Which one do I find tastier?
No, that 50 cents, it's the make or break.
It's right, too.
I don't know why.
I've always been like this.
I just hate...
Well, I think the reason I'm very money conscious, and it's not like I'll never spend money.
You know what?
There was a dance a while back that I was going to, and I needed a dress, so I spent like $100 on a dress.
It's not the kind of thing, because it's the kind of thing that I'm going to have for years and years.
I will continue to wear.
It's high-quality material.
That kind of thing.
You want to be able to look back when you get older and say, wow, look at that dress.
I remember that evening and so on.
Honestly, I will spend money.
It's just that I'm very conscious about it.
I think that's because when I was younger, if I wanted to buy stuff that wasn't, not like clothing or food, but if I wanted to buy, I don't know.
I think you guys would have wanted me to buy clothing.
Like a toy or something.
A toy you didn't really need.
A toy or like markers and stuff if I already had them and that kind of thing.
You guys would be like, okay, you pay for it.
Or if you thought it was like an okay purchase, then you'd be like, let's split it.
And I got like $10 a month for doing all my chores and that kind of thing.
And I actually cut that off self-sufficiently.
It's like, you know what?
I'll do my chores.
You don't have to pay me.
I don't know why I did that.
And when I told my friends, they were like, what?
But yeah, I was always money conscious from then onwards because it actually had value.
And I see kids.
I used to do babysitting a lot more.
And there were kids, their parents just buy them anything.
They have no regard for money.
They don't really understand it.
That birthday party we went to was just mountains of toys.
And you just know that the kid's never going to play with them all.
Yeah, so it was like those kind of things.
If their parents, oh, I want this.
Yes, sweetie, of course, sweetie.
Then I don't think you're ever...
And I think that's what creates a lot of spenders and people who do gambling and stuff because they just don't have a value in money.
Also, you know, we very much wanted to...
When you're very little, of course, you buy what you want.
And we buy what you want for the most part.
But we didn't want you to be like, the way I get things is to cajole my parents or really want them and manipulate and beg.
And it's like, no, no, no.
You make the decision.
You have some money.
If you want to buy it, go for it.
If it's a reasonable purchase or we think it's reasonable, but it's not really needed, we'll do half and half.
And that way, you are the ones who decide whether you want it with your resources rather than...
Anyway, so.
All right.
Yeah, I was saying, when I was broke, it's a blast.
Being broke is actually quite a blast, and I didn't mind it at all.
I feel like it'll be exciting.
I always like to save money, and it's like, if I see something at the grocery store, I'm like, ooh, I've seen that cheaper somewhere else.
I go online.
Okay, maybe I spent 20 minutes finding the cheaper one, but I saved $10.
Right.
Do your peers read at all?
I don't think they've ever seen anything with a YouTube short in the last year.
They read gamertags.
Yeah, they read gamertags.
Right, right.
So no, not really.
No, they don't.
I think the last time...
Oh yeah, so this was about two years ago.
I met someone.
I thought he was nice.
And there was like a whole...
We were...
I don't even remember.
The question was asked.
Oh yeah, there's a book club.
And I asked him, like, do you read?
And he's like, oh yeah, I read Pet Sematary a few months ago.
I'm like, oh, that's cool.
What do you think of it?
I thought, okay, maybe he's into books.
That's cool.
I was not so much into books at the time, but I knew it was like a good quality to look for.
And yeah, so I've known him for about two and a half years now.
That's still the last book he's read.
I asked him just the other day, I'm like, do you still read anything?
And he's like, I read Pet Sematary a while back.
I'm like, you said that when I met you.
And he's like, when did we meet?
I'm like, two years ago.
But it's such a scary book, you'd be too traumatized to read anymore.
I know.
All right.
Helping your dad navigate the consistency in his principles in social media is impressive.
I'm referring to when you said the same argument.
He made about Twitter as relevant Instagram, and I was wondering if you...
Hey, we just doubled up on that.
If you have a chance to discuss the new development and what your thoughts are.
Mark Zuckerberg, the owner of Facebook, of course, admitted on Joe Rogan that he caved to government entities, but the jury is still out on his true alliance of truth and transparency.
What, if any, advice would you give your dad about Facebook?
Now, my personal...
I never got banned by Facebook, but I think I'm pretty heavily suppressed.
I think so, yeah.
Yeah.
I search up on my account.
I'll search you up.
I remember we did this a while back because I was trying to add you on a game or something.
It took forever to find you.
Scroll, scroll.
Exact used your name and they've showed up other people.
Right, right.
So, I feel the suppression stuff, you know, and I don't really spend any time on it.
Facebook's for a bunch of old people.
I'm sorry, guys.
Yeah, it's not a big platform for me.
It's a bunch of old ladies who think AI images are real and Minions is the peak humor, so.
I'm sorry.
Like, it's really not worth it.
Maybe she does have six fingers.
Come on, man.
No, or they'll say, like, it's like, starving African child made an entire water trolley, and it's like, there's literally, like, deformed, like, heads in the background and stuff, and it's like, just images for clicks, and all the women are like, oh, praying for him, he gets fed.
It's like, you know what?
He has, like, ten hands.
Right, right.
I'm sorry.
Like, I get it, but it's just...
They're not very bright.
I'm sorry.
It's not worth it.
Yeah, so they didn't insult me.
Somebody writes, my son is 17, and he's become apathetic and has turned to marijuana.
It happens to the best of us.
He lies and deceives, making discussions difficult at best.
He has one friend, and that friend is much more popular than him.
I suspect he was shunned or ridiculed by kids at high school, but he won't talk about it.
He likes video games.
But he even cheats on those, so he really doesn't want to be challenged in any way.
Do you have any advice on what I can do?
Dude, at the age of 17, like, this is the kind of guy, if you were to say, like, you have to fix yourself or I'm going to cut you off financially.
I know that's like, I'm jumping to the extreme, but I assume he's tried a lot of other stuff and you kind of have to do that at some point.
It's one thing if he was like 13 or 14, but 17 is cusp of adulthood.
You've got to be decisive.
I'm 17 this year, and like...
I know, the face.
I'm just saying, like, I don't really see my personality or values and stuff changing that much onwards from here.
No.
So, honestly, at that point, I feel like you have to be kind of extreme.
So I would say, like, even if you were to cut him off financially, yeah, even if you were to kick him out or whatever, he will just get involved.
He may go to prison.
He may, there's like, I'm sorry, I'm going to be completely honest.
I'm not really sure what there is to do.
Why is this a question for me?
Okay, no.
So, the likelihood of him going to prison is virtual.
I'm not saying he would.
I'm just saying, like, it wouldn't be.
I don't think he'd be good.
He'd probably crash on friends' house and stuff.
Let's pretend that you could just be completely frank because, you know, obviously we're not telling people what to do.
Yeah.
If you could just be completely frank, what do you think the best course of action would be if faced with someone like this as a parent?
You would honestly, like...
I don't know.
You raised him.
Like, what even happened?
Right.
Okay, let's say that you inherit someone like this.
Oh, I think he didn't get good.
I don't think he really had friends in high school.
Why didn't you know?
You're the parent.
I don't know at this point.
It's not really something that, oh, well, I guess he's 17 now.
Maybe I made a mistake.
Yeah.
So how do you fix it, though?
I mean...
Rewind.
Go back and start again.
Yeah, have another kid.
Like, I'm sorry.
I don't...
I don't think you can fix people.
I would say...
So, most parents, when you have an under-functioning child, the desire is to coddle and to cross your fingers.
It doesn't really work.
No, but the thing is, at this point, if he was 14, you could fix him, because you could put standards up and be like, oh, you have to get a job, you have to do X, Y, and Z, or whatever.
At 17, if he turns, you know, it's early in the year, it's likely he wasn't fresh 17. He's going to turn 18 soon.
Like, he could do whatever the heck he wants.
You can't say, like, oh, you have to do X, Y, or Z, or I don't know, I'm going to take away your PC, because you can't.
He's 17. Well, no, you can if he's in your house.
Well, he's in your house, but then he'll go to someone else's house.
At that age, if he's very much into getting his own way of scheming and stuff like that, and plotting by hacking or whatever, right?
He'll just find a way around things.
Yeah, I would certainly say, at the first step, just say you have to get a job.
Yeah, that's number one.
You have to get up, you have to get out of the house.
You have to get a job.
Face real-world consequences.
Real-world consequences and have people who you don't have manipulative control and history with.
Yeah.
The great thing with a job is it's a clean slate.
Yeah, completely new people.
So you have to get a job.
And if he doesn't get a job, then obviously you don't give him any money, not a penny.
Yeah.
I would...
I would cut off his Wi-Fi.
Maybe.
No, I would, unless he was using...
I mean, I have tried.
I cannot find online websites that'll get you jobs.
Most places that hire like McDonald's or whatever, maybe McDonald's, but like a lot of the places, we don't really have a lot of fast food chains near where we live.
And a lot of the places that hire, like that ice cream parlor, they're not going to be putting ads up online.
They need two workers.
So it's like, if you're looking for- Or you just drop him at the library and he can use the Wi-Fi there to look for work or something like that.
Yeah, something like that.
But I'm just saying I would cut off his Wi-Fi.
And I would also say, if you want to be under our roof, you cannot do drugs.
Yeah, absolutely.
If you do drugs, you have to go and find your own place to live.
Yeah.
Because, yeah, you just can't support that kind of stuff, but it's really tough.
Again, at this age, I don't really know what you can do.
Obviously, try that stuff, but I feel like that's the kind of thing that had to be done earlier.
Right, right.
I'm not sure this one's too relevant.
Let me know what you think.
How do you navigate drama between women at your age?
Advice for women making friends.
I mean, I've just, honestly, for the longest time, I really only had male friends.
I will be completely honest, when we were at events or whatever, the girls in the friend group would just sit and not really talk to each other.
Talk a bit, but not really.
You want to get up and do things.
I cannot just sit there in silence watching everyone have fun for two hours because I'm too scared to go up and hit a ball around.
So my advancements in the female friend group are very recent because they've gotten a lot more activity recently.
They've gotten a lot more active recently.
They'll do fun stuff.
So, I would definitely say that is a more new thing.
But, yeah, I would say it can be kind of difficult.
Really, like, the girls that are, like, the typical nice girls are girls that just don't have any standards, so they'll be friends with anyone.
I think, honestly, it comes out of a need of desperation and fear that, like, you won't be accepted if you have standards.
That's what I've noticed trying to join female friend groups.
The other kind is the mean girl where you have to have been friends your entire life, otherwise you're not going to get in the group.
Or you have to conform to such a point where you're not even yourself around them anymore.
And then there's a secret third kind.
That's the kind of the group I have where it's like, we're nice, we'll let you in, but we're not going to be super, super accepting.
If you just come up and hang around, we'll chat with you, we'll be friendly, but that doesn't mean you're immediately going to get invited out to the birthday party.
Yeah, you kind of auditioned.
And that's kind of how I got into the friend group.
It took a little while, but I kept hanging around, kept making jokes, kept being funny and nice, and soon enough I get invited to places.
I would say drama between female friends, I have no idea.
I have not really had situations with drama between female friends when I've been friends with them.
I've had drama with girls, but not friends.
Honestly, you shouldn't not really be having drama with your friends.
That's kind of my standard.
No, absolutely not.
Having my first friends all be kind of guys, there was no real drama.
If there was an argument, it was over within the hour.
Right, right, right.
What are some of the best...
I think it's the last question.
What are some of the best ways your parents have prepared you for impending adulthood, if you want to speak to that?
Which you don't have to, of course, if you don't want to.
No!
No, I'm kidding.
I don't know.
I feel like raising me as a whole, just kind of.
Like, I'm not sure there's one specific thing.
Yeah, yeah.
Okay.
What are you most looking forward to in the next couple of years?
College.
Moving out.
Starting my life.
Yes, you are chomping at the bit, right?
I've wanted to start my life since I was, like, 13. I'm not even going to lie.
Yeah.
Very true.
Very true.
Yes, you're very much looking forward to launching out, right?
I miss playing UT 2003 with you guys for Izzy.
Oh, that was so fun!
What do you feel about the video games out now, and what would you want to see game developers focus on making in the future?
I really like thought-provoking games.
I miss games like Bioshock.
I really like Little Nightmares.
You like worlds in particular, worlds with lore and background that you could really absorb into?
Yeah, again, I like thought-provoking games.
There have been some games out recently.
Usually small companies, like small developers.
can make amazing games that just are really unknown because they like again i'll make an example among us was one that was made by a completely unknown company yeah well not completely but mostly unknown company that just got huge um i think that started with little nightmares as well it was pretty unknown but they happened to get partnered with a more known company got huge um i'm just using those few examples
i have a lot of other games i like too but i would say games that start off by very small companies usually are more thought-provoking than mass-produced shooter not mass-produced like shooter games with a budget of 200 million dollars like GTA 6. You know the game's not going to be good because there's too many people working.
I would say Baldur's Gate was quite good.
That is one of the exceptions to that kind of big company thing.
But I never got hugely into that.
I enjoyed it.
I played through it a few times to learn more about D&D and the game mechanics and that kind of thing.
But I never got super, super into it.
Right, right.
I would say I'll make...
The only one that's coming to mind right now is...
What was I going to say?
Oh my gosh.
I like old style games.
Games with not amazing graphics.
Because I feel like it leaves more for the imagination to fill in.
I know that sounds so silly or cliche, but I feel like it's actually true.
If I see games, I'll make an example, mouthwashing.
It has very bad graphics.
But...
What?
I've completely forgotten about that game.
Yeah, yeah.
If I see games like that with very bad graphics, it leaves so much more for the imagination to fill in.
It's funny, I see people like fan art of the game and stuff, or animations or whatever.
Everyone looks, everyone draws them the same way, even though their faces are so, like, geometric.
Yeah, yeah.
If that makes sense, because you get such a strong sense from the characters that it fills it in in your mind.
Right.
I know that sounds so, like, I sound like some, like, article.
But, like, I feel like that's actually kind of true.
That's how I feel about it.
Right.
Holy cow, I disappeared for a while and she turned 16. Ask her, who do you think you are growing up so quick like that?
Oh, but seriously, are you prepared to find out how wrong your dad is when you leave the house?
It is a common experience and you will eventually find things in his blind spot that he will not admit he is wrong in until well after you prove it.
I don't think that's quite true.
I've certainly had blind spots, of course, on all of that.
Yeah, I feel like I'm pretty objective, as mentioned earlier.
Yeah, I would say that I was lagging a little bit because I very much, of course, enjoyed the stuff when you were younger and your sort of more independence focusing on peers.
I was lagging a bit, catching up.
We talked about this before.
I was like, I need to be catching up with that.
It was so funny.
You gave her, you were saying like, I think it was when you were maybe 14 or 15 or so.
I'm like, maybe 14. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And that became, it wasn't like a, it was like kind of a, oh, I feel like it was end of 14, beginning of 15. Yeah, yeah.
But it was a whole joke.
You're like, wait, I'm saying it wrong and I was just saying it's earlier.
Yeah, yeah.
I made a mistake.
Remember the rest of the day, you'd say something, I'm like, oh, 13. Yeah, yeah.
Steph, are you ready for Issy to step into adulthood and take her first steps away from you and the healthy people?
He's not.
I'm kidding.
No, see, the problem is that you've been such a blast to spend time with.
I mean, it is, you and Mom, of course, the absolute most central, most important relationships in my life.
And I do miss some of the stuff we did when you were younger, but I enjoy the stuff that we do now, too.
It would obviously be selfish to hang on.
And the last thing I'd want is for you to stick around at the expense of you getting out.
I would not do that.
Yeah, at the expense of you going out and launching your life.
But it does, you know, it's not like I have a great relationship with mom so she can leave me.
Do you know what I mean?
And so, you know, every phase of parenthood has had its real pleasures and delights.
It's going to be tough, of course, when you move out.
And go on with your life.
But, of course, that's going to be a thrilling and exciting thing to see as well.
And I get to travel.
So that's good.
Yes.
All right.
Any other last questions, comments?
Not from you, I guess, right?
No, I just yapped for like an hour.
All right.
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Thanks, everyone.
We'll see you.
Bye.
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