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April 10, 2007 - Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux
36:44
703 Digital Guttenberg Part 3

How the internet can't change totally everything

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Good afternoon, everybody.
Hope you're doing well, Steph. It's 6 o'clock on April 10th.
Hey, it's my mother's birthday tomorrow of 2007.
She will be 666 years old.
Seems quite appropriate. She's been that age for quite a while.
So I wanted to finish off part three of the Digital Gutenberg.
Because I wanted to sort of just go over what I think the sequence is based on what I understand about historical patterns like this, where information opens up and the middleman is eliminated from the conversation.
There is always the capacity to have conformity when you have complete control of the information.
So if we look back at the pre-Reformation, Then the Catholic priests had complete control of the message and there was some infighting and this and that, but largely they could present a united front to their parishioners, their constituents, their mental, physical, emotional, and spiritual slaves.
When people began to get a hold of the actual text itself, the biblical texts itself, then they began to realize that there was not a lot of truth, or at least things weren't nearly as consistent and obvious and clear as they had been led to believe.
And this control of the middleman, and Thomas Sowell has a great article on The abuse of the middleman minorities throughout the world, the Jews and so on, those who are the final sellers of goods to a consumer, can have the taxes raised at the head of the government and then Nobody gets mad at the head of the government because they don't really see the connection as viscerally as when the price of onions doubles and you need your onions.
Then you get mad at this middleman minority, right?
The minorities who are the people who are right in front of the consumer, where all of the economic abuses of those in power get played out at, right?
I mean, how many times do we feel irritated at the gas station owner because gas prices have gone up?
Well, that's the example of the middleman.
It's a sort of tangible and clear way.
It's a human shield for the abuses of power.
The middleman in the realm of the intelligentsia, though, is something that the state and those in power pay an enormous amount of attention to.
They do this not so much when it is possible to rule the citizenry, the population, openly through force.
There's a very important distinction between a dictatorship, the Cuban dictatorship, even the Allende dictatorship, the Stalinist Mao type of dictatorship.
the population is so cowed and beaten down and so indoctrinated and so brutalized that you can openly shoot people in a courtyard and no one's going to really raise much of a fuss.
This is the final escalation of the abuse of power before it ends up self-destructing and taking everyone with it.
Where it is possible to rule people openly through the use of force, then you get overt, overt propaganda, control of information, the Pravda kind of approach where all articles that are the Pravda kind of approach where all articles that are in a newspaper must be officially vetted by the local Politburo chief, the local Mandarin, and so on.
And anybody who disagrees or gets out of line or is caught handing summer's duts around, the sort of underground printed works, is shot.
And not nearly anyone says boo to it because the population is so cowed and so on.
But said population is not economically productive, right?
So there's a big problem if you're a ruler.
Your sheep may be compliant, but they get too depressed to eat.
So you don't have to build any fences, but they starve to death.
And this is the problem with managing human livestock from a state perspective.
If you give them freedom, then they think for themselves, and they're productive, and you can tax them more.
If you tax them more, you begin to restrict that freedom, they begin to produce less, and the Laffer curve kicks in, and so on.
That as you increase taxes, you decrease productivity and end up with fewer take-home in terms of taxes.
But of course, there's no real rationality in how the state rules people at this point in our cycle.
It's just a feeding frenzy in the shock or biting whatever moves and even each other themselves and so on.
So there's not a whole lot of rationality in that.
But I think it's important to understand that we are in a society where the open ruling of people by force is not permissible.
Is not going to work.
You take a bunch of Canadians out and shoot them in a courtyard and there will be some very strong letters to the editor, let me tell you.
Some mumblings at the seat of power.
But it would be not accepted.
There would be a visceral emotional revolt against that because there's this illusion of freedom.
There's an illusion of freedom, which the Soviet empire and other types of Khmer Rouge dictatorships did not even attempt to ship you.
They just drove everyone out of the cities to starve to death in the countrysides because country living was just so much more wholesome.
And, of course, it was anti-intellectual, anti-rational, anti-mind, all of this sort of parasitical, mystical virus that attacks the species over and over and over again because people just won't think rationally to save their lives sometimes.
So you can directly control and bully and shoot and throw into gulags the intellectuals when you can rule by naked force, when you have a population that wouldn't stand for that, and this is generally the population that has access to weaponry of some kind or another, as we mentioned last time. Then you have to control people in a much more subtle manner.
And in some ways, much more productive.
I mean, the people who rule in America make a lot more money than the guy, crazy Kim Jong-il, who rules in North Korea.
So, they have a much more pleasant life.
They get much better medical care.
They can go and play golf.
They have a much better time of it.
Of course, it's escalating to the point where it's not going to work for very long, but that's the...
That's the difference.
So, when you are unable to rule directly through brute force, then you are heavily reliant upon the intellectual middleman to shape the message that people need to hear.
And... This reliance on the middleman intellectual to shape the message for the population is why so many intellectuals get bought and paid for by the state.
When you can't rule openly, when you've got to put the gun in a velvet bag, then the people who make the velvet bags can make rather a lot of money.
When you can use the gun openly, the first people you shoot are those damn idiots who have the velvet bag who charged you so much.
So the intellectuals who sell their souls to the state now may not last as long as they would like in terms of freedom.
But this is why the Internet is such a revolution.
This is why this conversation is, and other conversations, of course, out there on the Internet that rely on science and reason, is such a revolution.
It's such an incredible revolution.
Because the dissemination of information is no longer dependent upon the middleman intellectual who is bought and paid for by the state to cover up the crimes that are daily occurring.
to talk about anything but the essentials, and everything but the essentials.
Because we can speak without having to pay for speaking.
Okay.
We can converse through this, through the Sunday call-in shows, through the message boards, through email.
And the only thing we invest is time.
And I invest money and others invest donations.
But it's not much money.
You know, Free Domain Radio has cost me $5,000 to $10,000, probably all told.
Top to bottom, end to end.
So it's really not like starting a television station with millions of dollars.
I can self-fund that and of course I haven't had to to some degree because of some very generous donators.
More of them later.
So we can engage in a direct and widespread communication without relying on Large amounts of money and federal regulations and FCC licenses and all of the other apparatus that is designed to coil slowly and gently around the neck of the voice that speaks any kind of truth.
It chokes it off. Chokes it off.
So, this is amazing.
And what it does is it fragments.
It fragments. It powder kegs.
The central message. And of course, a lot of people who are putting forth alternative messages are crazy, bang, nutso-jobbies.
But that's fine, too.
That's fine, too.
I think that's just great. Because there is the relatively rare person like myself and others, and maybe you're one of them, Who takes a serious and rational and bottom-up approach to truth.
Which, I mean, I could never have any venue in the mainstream media for speaking about this kind of stuff.
People's heads just explode.
Because the state also pays for professional offense groups, people who are professionally offended at anything that anybody says that has any kind of truth value in it.
So if you talk about welfare being evil, then the welfare groups which are paid for by the state...
I mean, the state takes money from taxpayers to pay lobbyists to lobby for the state to take more money from taxpayers.
And what is generally called social opinion is just the caterwauling of paid chorus girls.
So the professional offense groups would rise up and organize boycotts and protest and everybody would be, oh my god, what is he saying?
Because, you know, when you can't think, as people are explicitly trained not to think about philosophy, when you can't think, then you can only react to how other people react.
So, if you can't think, and I say welfare is based on coercion and it's morally evil, Well, you can't evaluate that without a lot of conversations and training and thinking and so on.
It's painful emotionally and almost physically when you start.
So because people can't really evaluate that, what happens is it becomes enormously productive for paid offense groups to scream and shout and cry and scream and roll on the ground and so on about the hellish evil that is occurring out of the mouth of person X, Steph maybe, And most people don't take the time or trouble to reason through it all themselves, because you can't.
You can't reason through everything.
Nobody sort of sits there and says, hmm, slavery, let's reopen the case, at least in the West.
So the professional offense groups, the trigger-happy screeches from hell, they get all angry and upset and are offended and hurt, right?
Hurt. This is what the women say.
The men say they're angry. The women say, I just, I find it very hurtful.
I find it very hurtful what this person is doing.
Very insensitive and very hurtful.
And it's just, it's not appropriate.
It's just not appropriate.
And they get sort of choked up.
And so most people say, well, I don't know what the hell's going on, but it must be offensive, because sure as hell, some people are offended.
But of course, these people, it's the same as a good actor, right?
I mean... You don't become an astronaut by putting a suit on.
And you don't gain moral credibility by becoming offended.
And so what happens is everything fragments because the central message can no longer be controlled.
The sort of three television stations all saying the same thing, tuning into Fox.
It's true, I think, that older people tend to get into these mental grooves, and the average age of the listener is probably like, older people?
Dude, look in the mirror.
That's quite a dome you've got going there.
Even, even, dare you think it in Jurassic terms, even older than me.
Me, older than me.
But young people retain some sense of curiosity, plus they're closer to the corruptions of their families and they're closer to the brain-mincing boredom of the public school brain gulags.
So when you say something is fundamentally wrong with society, children, teenagers and so on, they're in a position to believe it.
To believe it. When people get free of it, or the taxes are deducted at source, and they've got a nice house, and they've got a job, and blah, blah, blah, it's harder, right?
It's harder to say something's fundamentally wrong.
But the teenagers, or the younger people, totally get it.
Totally get it. It's easy to forget this kind of trauma.
So, the barrier, I think, the barrier that remains is obviously, I think, it's hard to To raise a clear voice above the catawalling of the professional offense groups of the crazy van nutty jobs who are out there and the scorn and indifference of the mainstream media.
It's not the easiest thing to raise a flag in the middle of this inferno.
But I don't think that that's the major barrier and I think that the success of this conversation It speaks for itself, or speaks to that, in that we've hit nearly a quarter million podcast downloads and video views over the last month, and I was away for a week of that, so obviously I wasn't producing any new podcasts, so I think we might have been over a quarter mil if I'd done that, but no fear, perhaps this month.
So I think that the quality sort of speaks for itself, and of course all I can do is try and produce the highest quality, fastest moving podcast in the world, most Volvo enclosed verbal ramblings, and just hope that the quality shines through, that the beacon shines above the Merc.
Excuse me. And I think that that's working out very well, and it's certainly...
I still have visions of mad, asymptotic spikes in podcast downloads, and I still absolutely have a vision which I've had since I was a kid of speaking in front of crowds of thousands and so on, and leading them all in stirring bouts of shiny-headed line dancing.
All of the things that we dream of when we're young.
So I think that that's working okay.
I think that the major problem which is going to occur which the internet can't solve.
The internet can solve the problem of uniformity of message.
The internet cannot solve the problem which I'll go into just now.
Perhaps you've got a good solution other than what it is we've been talking about here and you can let me know.
I certainly would be happy to hear it.
Excuse me one sec, I just need a drink of water.
Somebody is going to actually send me an email, I'm sure, counting the number of seconds...
My hands are off the wheel. Oh, there's another one.
My ear was itchy. It's okay, this drives like an arrow.
If my drive was straight, I could actually not touch the wheel.
And it won't be long now, my brothers and sisters.
It won't be long now before I can do the high-quality, research-enabled podcast from home.
The problem is involved in a wonderful story that I remember hearing as a kid during a seemingly interminable flight from England to Africa when the seats actually seemed large enough.
I was only six years old.
And that, of course, is The Emperor's New Clothing.
And for those who haven't heard it, and I'll just mention it very briefly, The Empress New Clothing is a story which goes something like this.
A king has a great deal of vanity and likes to look his best, and he hears tales of wondrous tailors who can create the most beautiful gown in the world.
So he summons these tailors to his court, and the tailors say, oh, absolutely, we can create the most beautiful gown in the world for you.
And he says, well, maybe you can get to work right away.
And they say, well, sure, and they start pulling out their stuff, But their thread, he can't see it.
He can't see the thread. And he says, I'm sorry, I can't really see the thread.
And they're like, yes, yes, no, we understand that.
This thread is so fine that it can't be seen by the naked eye.
But when we put it together, it's going to create the most beautiful cloak in the world.
And it's actually kind of a magical thread.
This is a cool story. We got this from an old guy who used to teach Ralph Macchio.
And he said that this cloak is the most beautiful cloak in the world.
The only trick being that it is invisible to those who are unfit for their position, those who are not suited for their position, those who are above their station and are lying to people about it.
They can't see the cloak, but everyone else can see the cloak.
So they stitch this thing together, miming the whole thing, and every time they hold up a supposedly finished piece of work, the king can't see a thing, but he remembers, of course, that if he says he can't see it, he's openly admitting that he is not fit for his station and should be deposed as the king.
So he says, oh my god, it's beautiful, it shimmers, it's like the wings of a butterfly coming down a waterfall along the back of a salmon, blah blah blah, it's just wonderful, oh my god, breath, I must sit down.
And so the king, of course, brings other people in and says, this magical cloak can only be seen by those who are fit for their station.
Don't you think, don't you see how it shimmers?
Like the back of a blue bottle.
Vibrant, coruscating, gorgeous beauty.
The light runs up and down it.
Like silver quick marathoners of photon-feated torpedoes.
And everyone's like, yeah, it's fantastic.
I've never seen anything more beautiful.
And of course, no one can see it because there's no cloak there, but everyone's sort of imagining it.
And to cut a long story short, the king is out parading around buck naked.
Buck naked.
And everyone is saying, oh, the most beautiful cloak, because nobody wants to be thought of as unfit for their position.
But of course a child, and it's not unimportant that it is a child, a child finally says, the king is naked!
And everyone's like, yeah, okay, I guess the king is naked.
And it goes around quickly, everyone checks with their neighbor, turns out nobody can see the cloak.
And that's the end of the story.
And as I said, it's not inconsequential that a child...
It's the one who makes this clear.
The child has the least to lose.
How can a child be unfit for his station, right?
The truth can only be told by those with nothing to lose, or with little to lose.
So, the chattering classes, the intelligentsia classes, Spend an enormous amount of energy and ink and kill an enormous amount of trees and consume an enormous amount of radio equipment and television equipment talking about society,
talking about, talking about, talking about, talking about society and that democracy is compromised and that public education is a virtue but the system needs to be improved and welfare is achieving some of its aims but not all and needs to be tweaked and that if there's problems with the government you should really as a citizen take effect That the price of not participating in politics is to be ruled by your inferiors and blah, blah, blah, blah. Blah-da-chatter, blah-da-chatter, blah, blah, blah, blah.
On and on it goes. It's a real running in their heads.
They don't even have to think about it anymore.
People just open up their mouths and out comes this verbal diarrhea.
Actually, diarrhea is the wrong one.
It's just gas. Actually, even that's wrong.
Gas and diarrhea indicate that you had a solid meal at some point.
This is not even that. And the reason that the children, and by that I mean sort of those in their teens, I'm still pondering about how best to do the free-domain radio for the totlets, but we'll leave that for another time.
There is a reason that the Internet can't solve the problem Of the Emperor's New Clothing.
And the problem with the Emperor's New Clothing is simply this.
An enormous number of people talk an enormous and interminable length about society as a whole.
Talky, talky, talky, talky, talky, talky, talky, talky, talky, talky, talky.
You've got chattering heads going on about it all the time.
And they're talking about it in terms of morality.
They're not talking about, you know, I went fishing yesterday and then I had me some ham.
Right? They're actually talking about, you know, this is right, this is wrong, this is good, this is bad.
The British sailors were taken by the Iranians, because the Americans or the British took some Iranians, and it's just a payback from two hit gangs, but everyone has to posture and preen around as the most moral thing since, I don't know, Socrates on steroids.
So they're talking about society, they're talking about morality, and they're against violence.
Obviously, nobody comes out and says, I think we should just go around shooting people.
And the Emperor's New Clothes, of course, is the most simple fact that our society runs on coercion.
And runs in the very loosest sense of the word.
Everything that is around us, from the power lines I'm driving past to the road that I'm driving on, to the lights that light up the highway, to the gasoline that's in the bowels of my car, I'm going to get overly technical here, To the speed limit that I'm following, to everything is involved with coercion.
And nobody talks about it.
It's the great unsaid.
It's the great unsaid.
And many a business organization has been decimated by this sort of problem.
that there is a great unsaid.
And the reason that it takes a younger person to be able to see this clearly is that there is a growing horror over time when you begin to realize that everyone is lying.
Thank you.
And they don't even seem to know that they're lying.
The only way that you find out if they're lying, or that they know that they're lying, is when you say, but wait a second, the government runs on force.
Public education is a bloodbath.
It's just a silent bloodbath of conformity.
The prisoners who didn't try and escape from the gulag often didn't get shot.
It didn't mean that they were there by choice.
A lack of overt violence is not the same as freedom.
As I've said before, a husband may beat his wife only one night a month, but that does not mean that she is 97% free.
She lives in terror of that one monthly beating, especially since it's randomized.
We live in terror of the government and of taxes and something or other, running afoul of some damn thing or another.
And we pay. We pay them off.
We pay them off because we're scared.
Not because we're patriotic. We pay them off because we're scared.
Because, of course, this is the fundamental paradox at the heart of statist philosophy.
Everyone says, well, people don't pay taxes because they're afraid.
They pay taxes because they support the system.
Which is like the rapist saying, well, she'd have sex with me voluntarily.
She is having sex with me voluntarily.
Well, why is there a knife to her throat?
Oh, that doesn't matter. She'd have sex with me anyway.
The knife is just, you know, it's there for funsies.
It doesn't mean anything. Oh, well then put the knife down.
No, no, no, no, no. I can't put the knife down.
Oh, so the knife is essential in the execution of your rape then.
No, no, no, no. She's having sex with me voluntarily.
Oh, so then you should put the knife down.
No, no, no, no. I can't put the knife down.
Why can't you put the knife down?
Right? I mean, you just go round and round in this circle.
People support the societies they live in voluntarily.
They pay their taxes because they like to pay their taxes.
Well, not like to, but they accept the need to pay their taxes.
Great! Then we don't need the IRS. We don't need tax laws any more than I go run around grabbing money from people for Free Domain Radio.
I don't even have a price on these damn things.
You just give what you want.
Everybody loves, in a sickly kind of way, to paint coercion as voluntarism.
So they say, well, the government doesn't need to force you to do things because these are things that people would want to do anyway.
That's why they vote for the government, that's why they mostly obey, and so on.
Yeah, there are a few bad apples, but blah blah blah, right?
And then you say, okay, well then, what percentage bad apples are there?
Oh, 1%, 2%, who knows, right?
Well, why should 98% of people be enslaved at the point of a gun for the sake of 1% or 2% of bad apples, which might be there only because of the gun to begin with?
And of course, nobody ever thinks the bad apples are the state representative, the thugs in blue and green, who keep their lasers squarely on your forehead.
So, as you sort of progress in your life, and you realize that nobody talks about the basics, nobody talks about anything to do with any real morality, any real moral choices, but they just make any real moral choices, but they just make up all of this bullshit to excuse the system and then call themselves brave and moral.
Nobody says, oh yeah, it's a brutal, violent dictatorship of taxation and regulation, but I kind of want to come home to my kids, so I just pay the bastards off.
People don't say, you never hear that on television, right?
You never hear that on radio.
Oh, taxes are too high and the welfare state has become...
The social safety net is a bit of a safety news, and we should change things, and public schools are terrible, and you can complain all you want.
You just can't question the fundamentals.
I think that the stolen money should go over here, I think you should rape her more gently, I think that you should rape this person and not that person, but you're never allowed to question the morality of rape and murder and so on.
Violence. Incarceration.
The state. And the family.
So there's a growing horror for this.
It's similar to there was a law against educating black people in the South when they were slaves.
There was a law against it, right?
And somebody said, well, why is there a law against it?
Somebody else said, well, you can't educate Negroes anyway.
And it's like, well, if you can't educate...
Our black brothers, then why is there a law against it?
There's no law against teaching magpies how to read or teaching fish how to fly.
There's no law against it because it's impossible.
So if it's impossible, you don't need a law.
N'est-ce pas? People violently don't want to pay taxes.
People violently don't support the welfare state.
People violently don't support public education.
The government is exactly what people don't want.
In the same way that when a guy has a knife to a woman's throat and he's having sex with her, you know that it's rape.
Why? Because there's a knife.
And you know that the degree of violence that the man is committing against the woman is the degree to which she absolutely, resolutely, and vehemently does not want to have sex with him.
If he says, aw, come on, honey, and she's like, okay, then obviously she didn't not want to have sex with him very much.
If he's got to hold her down and she's kicking and screaming and he's got to have 16 guns pointed at her chest and 9 people around standing with knives and her kids held hostage, then you know, sure as hell, that she really doesn't want to.
How much does she not want to have sex with him?
19 guns, 9 guys around with knives, kids held hostage.
That's how much... She doesn't want to have sex with them.
How much does the citizenry not want public schools?
Well, it doesn't want public schools to the tune that they have to be pillaged and raped for $5,000 or $10,000 per student per year.
And it has to be extracted from them through force.
And if you don't pay off the government, you lose your house.
That's how much people don't want public schools.
They don't want public schools $5,000 to $10,000 worth a year.
They don't want a welfare state to a similar tune.
How much do people not want an aggressive foreign policy?
Well, they don't want an aggressive foreign policy to the exact degree that taxes are required to pay for the military.
If the people really wanted it, they'd pay for the military voluntarily.
See, the government is exactly what people don't want.
It's exactly what they violently resist, even if it's just in their hearts, even if it's just at odd moments.
The government does not reflect the will of the people.
The government reflects the violation of the will of the people.
The will of the people is the free market.
It's what people do when they're not being coerced.
The government has nothing to do with the will of the people other than violating it.
Every time you say, well, people want this government program, it's like, well, then we don't need force and we don't need a government.
People want iPods.
You don't need a department of iPodding cranking these things out and shooting people who don't want them.
Because people want them already.
Just go out and buy them. It's simple.
That reflects the will of the people.
The free market reflects the free choice of individuals.
The government is the exact opposite of what people want.
So, you can have a government, you can support a government, but you can't say it's what people want.
Then you're exactly in the same boat.
As some woman who's fighting desperately to avoid being raped, you're saying, well, she wants to be raped.
In fact, it's not even rape.
She wants its lovemaking, love play.
It's love play.
So the growing horror that occurs for people and often reveals itself in a kind of midlife crisis or depression, the growing horror that occurs for people is sort of along the lines of this.
Nobody is pointing out that the emperor has no clothes.
Even as it's becoming increasingly clear that the emperor has no clothes.
The question then becomes, why is everyone avoiding this topic?
I'm sure you know the answer.
There's not much point me trying to point anything out.
I'm sure you know the answer to this.
But people avoid that...
Question, right? The child has to look at the emperor and say, oh, he's got no clothes.
If you've spent 10 years pretending to wash the emperor's laundry and get paid for it, are you likely to say the emperor has no clothes?
No. The financial and emotional motive for that is clear.
Profit and survival.
But it's cloaked in morality.
It's always, always, always cloaked in morality.
And that's pretty horrifying.
That's a pretty horrifying thing when you sit and think about it that everybody is just lying to you.
Because they're scared and greedy and angry, but they come across as pompous and virtuous and self-satisfied and self-aggrandizing.
That's pretty gross.
That's kind of very sick.
Now, the Internet can't solve that problem.
And people shy away from that problem because fundamentally your parents, and I've said this before, might as well mention it again, your parents say, we are good.
We are good people and we taught you right from wrong.
And we knew, we know, we knew, we knew right from wrong.
We are good and we knew and know right from wrong and that's what we told you when you were children.
You should do this because it's good, you shouldn't do that because it's bad.
Now, when you're a kid and you're still under the thumb, a teenager, you're still under the thumb of your parents, it's easier to accept that your parents don't know smack about smackism.
They know nothing about right and wrong.
All they do is use whatever words will cause you to obey.
If your parents don't know anything about right and wrong, all they're going to do is just make up whatever words they can that are going to cow you and bow you down and make you conform and obey and make you feel guilty and blah, blah, blah.
It's the same thing as religion. Same thing as the state.
What, you want the poor to starve in the streets?
No, the poor are starving in the streets.
The poor are poor because of the state.
Welfare can't help them. They don't make it worse.
So, teenagers can sort of understand this much more clearly.
But as you continue on in your life, it becomes that much harder.
When people say, well, I love you, you're a good person, or you're a good person who has bad traits, and they claim all this knowledge of morality, and you begin to question them about morality, and you find out that they don't know anything about morality.
Then the real question is, why were they talking so much about morality?
And the answer for that, of course, is contained in earlier podcasts.
We don't have to get into it here.
It's bullying and control.
So people are using the greatest power for good, which is morality, to control and bully people, and only those people who care about morality, which is the sickest inversal of values.
It is exactly like becoming a doctor in order to inflict painful torture and not even kill.
So, I hope that this makes sense.
This is sort of the third part. I wanted to sort of go into the fragmentation, the value, the good stuff, but the bad stuff, or the stuff that's still going to be tough.
The internet is not going to solve our problems, right?
It opens a way through the mountains, but it's not going to get us over the mountains.
So that's part of the struggle that you and I have to do one-on-one with those around us.
And I hope that this podcast helps, and I hope that you're doing fantastically.
I look forward to your donations, and I will talk to you soon.
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