Russell Brand and Dr. Jeremiah J. Johnston examine historical evidence for Christ, citing artifacts like Roman crucifixion nails, the ossuary of James, and physicist Paolo De Lazaro's analysis of the Shroud of Turin's 34 billion-watt energy signature. They contrast global entities like the WEF with biblical calls to forgive enemies while discussing the resurrection as a physical reality confirmed by John 20 and Daniel 7's "Son of Man" title. Ultimately, this evidence-based faith promises listeners a future resurrection characterized by deathlessness and worship in spirit and truth, transcending current sensory limits. [Automatically generated summary]
Transcriber: CohereLabs/cohere-transcribe-03-2026, WAV2VEC2_ASR_BASE_960H, sat-12l-sm, script v26.04.01, and large-v3-turbo
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Leaving the Company Behind00:06:46
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I can't take any more today because as you can see and hear, I'm on the very precipice.
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With me and Laura Brand is on Rumble and wherever else you receive your content.
And I hope the kind of content you are viewing and consuming is edifying and uplifting.
Because me, when I'm scrolling downwards, I suppose that's upwards, isn't it?
But in any way, in any event, it feels sometimes like a terrible, terrible descent.
And that's why I'm particularly grateful and encouraged to be introducing my guest.
And let me make sure I say his name correctly because I've already been chided and chastised twice.
Dr. But don't call him Dr. Jeremiah.
J. Johnston, whose new book, The Jesus Discoveries, is out now.
And I'm reading it, and you'll be able to tell that from the questions that I'm asking Jeremiah or JJ, as he has insisted on being called Jeremiah Johnston.
Thank you so much for joining us today.
Russell, I love you, brother, my brother in Christ.
And all I can think about is April 28, 2024, your baptism in the Thames.
And my wife, Audrey, and I praying for you in that moment.
What a rebirth.
So it's surreal for me to be talking to you now because that was such an inspirational moment.
Thanks.
And thanks for being so encouraging because as a result of some of the press that I've done for this book, of which I am most proud, I've had people question my Christianity and its, I suppose, veracity, its authenticity.
And I suppose, though, in a way, I've always been questioned whether it's, you know, oh, you're not really a West Ham United fan or you're.
Not a natural blonde, or I've had all sorts of accusations thrown at me, gosh, and some of them pretty serious, as a matter of fact.
But it was, I didn't like it.
I didn't like people saying you're not a real Christian.
So I'm very encouraged by you saying that to me just then, Jeremiah.
Although, actually, one of my friends said, What does that even mean, not a real Christian?
What does that mean, the term Christian?
Like, it's, yeah, so thanks for your encouragement.
But tell me, how are you?
But Russell, you're in great company, though.
Remember, they hated Paul.
They hated the Apostle Paul.
They didn't think that he was a real Christian because he had so much adversity.
They literally hated him.
And so you're in phenomenal company.
Read 2 Corinthians.
Remember, the Apostle Paul, St. Paul, he's called the Job of the New Testament for a reason.
And that's why he said, I bear on my body the marks of Jesus Christ.
And they were constantly questioning his conversion because they hated him so much.
So keep staying strong, post and ghost, and keep living your life for Christ, brother.
Thank you.
So, post and ghost.
What do you mean?
You just put stuff out there and then you depart.
Yeah, you depart.
You let the Holy Spirit deal with them.
Yeah, thank you.
Thank you very much.
Now, like one of the things that this is, I guess, at the forefront of my inquiry when it comes to your work is because when you accept Christ, you're taking on board so much that there is an author and authority in this world that He incarnated, He came here.
He performed miracles, that good and evil are real, that he encountered the devil.
So much is being taken.
The angels, demons, there's so much sort of packed into it.
I find myself often, often actually, like I think the last time was last night, I was reading C.S. Lewis' Miracles as I was sort of falling asleep.
And something hit me again of like, oh man, I'm not sure I can believe in this.
I'm not sure I can believe in this.
Like I feel doubt.
I do feel doubt.
So, and yet though, with your work where you're dealing with, you know, artifacts, I'm talking about your Jesus discoveries, and I've read the first.
Bit about the Shroud of Turin.
I'm reading the second thing about that cup, you know.
Yes, it's a Jesus cup.
Yeah, I'm really enjoying it.
I'm really enjoying it.
But what do you think is the value of trying to substantiate and authenticate the historical Christ?
Because sooner or later, you're going to hit the point where only faith, but that's true in neurology, that's true in quantum physics, that's true in biology.
Every discipline, even materialist ones, in the end, you've Buttress up against this point of the inconceivable, the unknowable.
In the end, faith intervenes.
So, what is it that this phase of your work is driving it, and what is the value of historical authentication, full stop, really, when it comes to Jesus?
You know, I've interviewed with the best of the best, and why is it that you ask me the best questions I've ever been asked?
So, thank you for asking such a great thinker's question.
You're not alone when you ask about.
Like last night, you find yourself reading miracles.
And do I really believe this?
And Russell, what I'm talking to you this whole time, John the Baptist had the same experience.
He's in Machiris.
Have you been to Israel, by the way, Russell?
Have you ever been to the land of Israel?
No, I really want to go, but it's so sort of politically intense.
Oh, I know.
Well, I'll take you because he's in a dungeon called Machiris where he will give his head.
Herod Antipas will kill him.
And he's having doubts, Russell, maybe like you did last night.
And he's saying, Did I get it right?
Remember, John the Baptist quotes Isaiah 40 and he says, The Lamb of God who taketh away the sin of the world.
I think I'm quoting the King James.
But he's literally getting ready to give his head for his faith.
And he's wondering, Did I get it right?
And so Luke 7 22, I've got my Bible right here.
I hope you have your scriptures with you.
Luke 7 22 goes right to Jesus.
And here's what Jesus does for you in that moment you had wrestled in your bajillions of followers.
We all have those moments.
Can God really heal?
Does he really mean what he says?
Look at Luke 7 22.
Jesus does not respond by shaming John the Baptist.
Believing in Gold and God00:02:26
He sharpens him.
He says, Tell John, the deaf hear.
I'm going to try not to cry.
The lame walk.
The blind see.
And he says, The dead, and let me say it to you in the Greek, are nekrosigairo, the dead stand up.
And so he responds to John the Baptist in his moment of greatest uncertainty.
He doesn't respond with feeling wrestle.
He responds with truth and he responds with evidence.
And that's exactly why I wrote Jesus Discoveries.
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In that moment.
Yeah, but I've got to go.
I need more.
Obviously, always.
I'm an addict.
I always need more.
Like, see, in that moment there, I like that because I've seen it when it was dramatized in Chosen.
The way that they used it dramatically is as if it was functioning, and it seems like that you're approaching it in the same way, is it functioned as a kind of verification, like a code, like it was a password.
Unlocking Isaiah Sixty-One00:03:08
It's like John the Baptist, like I fucking need, excuse my language, I need verification here.
But like at that point, but at that point, right, has our like, you know, I just mean chronologically, and how much would we lean into that?
We've not had Lazarus yet.
Do you so is he talking about when he says the dead are raised and uh.
You know, the lame walk, etc.
Like, how, what is our Lord saying there?
Is he saying, oh, he raised his widow's son, right?
In this one, yeah, he went to large towns, he approached.
So, yeah, that's what, like, these are the signs, these are the indicators, these are the hallmarks and the signatures that the Messiah has come.
So, that's such a great question.
This is why the Old Testament interprets the New Testament.
And when I do my tours across the country and hopefully the UK, I actually have the great Isaiah scroll.
Remember, John the Baptist is quoting Isaiah 40 when he says, This is the Messiah.
Remember, Jesus gives his programmatic sermon in Luke 4 in his own synagogue, and we can all relate with this.
He quotes Isaiah 61, 1 and 2, Russell.
And do you remember what his own people wanted to do?
They called him bastard.
They wanted to kill him.
And he said, This is what the Messiah will do.
He will set people free, he will heal the lame, he will let literally the dead rise.
And so, John knows this in his heart, but again, he's experiencing a horrible experience that we all have.
He has no peace.
Even though he knows he has pointed out the Messiah, he's getting ready to give his head to Herod Antipas.
He was an enemy for speaking up to power like you've done, Russell.
You've spoken truth to power.
And John the Baptizer is like, I need a reminder.
And as soon as Jesus says that, it unlocks for him in his mind Isaiah.
Oh, that's right.
Isaiah 61.
Oh, yep.
That's right.
Isaiah 40.
Oh, yes.
Isaiah 6.
That's right.
Jesus knew what he was doing.
And of course, he had already raised with the widow of Nain's son, Luke 7.
You could even add Mark 5, Jairus' daughter probably would have been raised at that point.
Does that help?
Yeah.
Yeah, it does help.
It does help.
And it also, even as when you first embarked on this answer, and I can see this is going to be one of those kind of conversations, you said that you referenced that John the Baptist is in a moment of crisis.
You don't see, I think since I stopped wanting to be Jesus, which was when I accepted Jesus was real and that I'm not him, because before that I had the kind of Luciferian self idolatry that, that, like, we are our own God.
Yeah, that, and I see now that that's precisely the function of the culture.
Indeed, like my church the other day, the pastor did a good sermon on Romans 13, but I say that the, Government almost in its entirety now exists in that margin that is that calls us to disobey.
Governments as False Idols00:04:57
Like that, the government and state are operating as a kind of a false idol, primarily as a false idol.
That they want control of your ideology, they want control of your body, they want to control how you think.
Yes, consciousness itself, consciousness itself, attention and thought itself.
They want control of consciousness and thought itself, and they can do that through via food, via medicine.
It all one scarcely dare imagine the nefarious.
Nefarious ways that the frequency of neurology could be disrupted and likely already is.
Can I share with you something, Russell?
What, yes, to your point, do you mind?
I don't want to interrupt.
Forgive me.
No, I don't know if you're aware.
I spoke at the World Economic Forum.
I'm not sure if you're aware of this.
No, I didn't know.
So I was there to present the resurrection of Jesus Christ and what I believe is the event horizon of free enterprise.
Jillian Tett, you may remember her name from the Financial Times.
She's provost of King's College, Cambridge, interviewed me.
And I'm working with people who I believe will work with the Antichrist someday, Russell.
I say that without flinching or blinking.
And do you know what I realized?
This is to your point to add fire to it.
It's not even the governments in the margins, these global companies now run the world.
Not governments, the companies run the world.
And I'm there presenting the gospel.
And you can look this up on YouTube.
I'm not exaggerating.
And I'm reminding them have you heard of this term of Forgiving debts, loving your enemies, praying for those who persecute you.
That comes from one event horizon and one alone.
It doesn't come from socialism, Marxism, or Socrates.
It comes from the physical bodily resurrection of Jesus.
And they were looking at me cross eyed, Russell.
I've never had more spiritual demonic warfare in all my life than in January this year when I was speaking at Davos.
And I've been invited back to speak again.
So we'll see how it goes.
I need you there with me in January.
If I'm a free man in January, I'll come.
Please.
But do you see what I mean?
The governments, not even governments, companies are running the world now.
Look, remember, I came to Christ after having lived a long time in, like, my own Saul of Tarsus dedication and devoutness to the law comes from being a member of the priest class of the establishment.
The Pharisees these days are not in the Roman Catholic Church or in the Protestant Church or in any denomination.
They are the proselytizers of the culture as king.
Now, like, I would posit that we're, and so the idea that there's a nexus of power that's extra governmental to me is an idea that I've lived with long before coming to the Lord.
My own training and my own preparation has given me deep experience in that dialectic.
I've got insight when it comes to Hollywood power and insight when it comes to governmental power, and I understand how media operates because I've been operating inside media for a long, long time.
Discourse around power outside of Christianity is that there are sets of global bureaucracies, one of them being the WEF, the WHO, the International Monetary Fund.
These bureaucracies pose as neutral, indeed, as a scholar of the world.
They fund the greatest evil in the world.
You'll be able to help me, though.
My point is that the etymology of the word sin, in addition to the Mr. Mark component, has that sort of metastasizing neutrality component.
Now, bureaucracy is ex Presenting itself as neutral.
I've experienced it.
I'm experiencing it a lot.
But it is the forum and frame in which the demonic can thrive in a kind of a parasitic way.
In a parasitic way.
That pose of neutrality that you get from the WHO, WEF, IMF is where that secondary, ulterior, near invisible power is executed through it.
So, yes, I'm aware that corporations.
And global entities are much more powerful than any national government.
Indeed, we are living right now through the kind of collapse of that new priapism, like that sort of excited engorgement of when Trump became president, of like, oh, wow, man, we've got a bull in the china shop.
We've got this guy who's willing to stand up.
And, you know, and of course, now it seems because of certain geopolitical events that there is a different power that whether you're Kamala Harris or Donald Trump, it doesn't matter who you are.
And, like, you know, like I, I think maybe I might even be quoting you back to you that everything is downstream from spiritual warfare.
Spiritual Warfare in Modern Life00:07:49
I know that.
I know that.
But what I want to say to you is John the Baptist, he's the last great prophet before our Lord.
St. Paul, the sort of first independent teacher and evangelist.
But I'm trying to sort of hold on to these forces the wildness of the prophet in the wilderness, the academic excellence and communicative brilliance of St. Paul.
I'm wondering what you think our evangelism is going to look like in 2026, 2027, this wave of apostleship or this wave of prophecy.
I wonder what you feel like it's going to look like.
And again, what the importance is of being able to historically authenticate Christ.
I know I've asked a lot there, but I'll show up for as long as you want.
It's the greatest question you could ask because we have here's what I want to say, Russell, to you we have an evidence based faith.
No other religion can claim that.
Christianity is the only religion in the world that says, test us in this.
If Jesus died by Roman crucifixion on April 3rd, AD 33, and if he rose from the grave April 5th, AD 33, then everything he said is true.
It validates his teaching, it validates the biblical worldview.
And if it doesn't, people should feel sorry for us.
That's 1 Corinthians 15, 19.
But 1 Corinthians 15, 20, Paul says, but he has been risen from the dead.
And so, what does the evangelical framework look like?
Russell, all I care about, do you know why I'm doing all this?
Like, this book last week went number one on the New York Times bestseller, To God Be the Glory.
I don't care about any of that.
Can I tell you all I care about?
I care about Lily, Justin, Abel, Ryder, and Jackson.
Everything I'm doing right now is about making sure my kids have faith in Christ.
And do you know what gets their attention?
Because they're smart, amazing kids, is when I show them evidences.
Like a crucifixion nail, or like these Bethlehem thorns you did a YouTube on or an Instagram about, or when I show them coins that are like, you know, the social media of the first century, they realize that their faith is real, that when dad and mom are gone, they can hold on to something that's real.
So, what is going to reach our kids?
And yet, that's all I care about.
I'll buy museums, which I have, I'll travel the world, I'll speak at WEF.
All of it is a mirage for me to pass on faith to my five kids.
And that's all I care about.
We have to reach the next generation.
And we've got to do it in nine second increments.
And this is why your show has never been more important, Russell.
You've got to stay strong and bold for Christ.
You've got to post and ghost.
You've got to ignore these antichrists who come after you because God has blessed you with a voice that is reaching the next generation.
My son last night was blown away.
He said, Dad, can I pray for you to go on wrestle?
My son Justin thought I was cool that I was going to be talking to you.
He's 14.
So you have a voice with this next generation.
Don't take it for granted.
But here's what I would just say, okay?
I'm tired of the touchy feely Christianity.
Again, there's a place for feelings, but my feelings wrestle, they betray me all the time.
There are many days I wake up.
Do I feel forgiven of all my sins?
Absolutely not.
But guess what?
Faith is not what I feel, faith is what I believe.
And faith is not certainty, faith is trusting God through the uncertainty.
And that's when I wrap myself in truth and evidence.
So we have a faith.
We have an evidence based faith.
And here's where I appreciate you having me on.
We are living in the golden age of Christianity, Russell.
I mean, just what I have on the table, I don't know if we'll get to it or not, proves the resurrection of Jesus Christ scientifically.
Okay?
But beyond that, we have the dumbest Christians of all time, the most biblically illiterate.
They go to Google or ChatGTP instead of God's word, and we have to change that, Russell.
And guess who's going to change it?
Guys like you, not pastors.
I've given up on pastors.
They no longer preach the truth.
They're weak.
I've given up on Bible scholars a long time ago.
It's going to be voices like yours that bring revival.
Talk me, thank you.
Talk me through, I receive it.
Talk me through them artifacts then, please.
Well, I prayed for you, Russell, because you told me I was perving on the resurrection.
I don't know if you remember that.
Do you remember?
Yeah, I do.
But this is not just you.
This is like my mate.
Joe, right, who's one of the two men that stood either side of me baptizing me.
It all came from you, Russell.
A lot of, let me tell you, a lot of my, like, let's call them hard Christians, like military men that have done jail.
I noticed this thing, they go, like, they do this.
I'm going to do an impression of it now.
They go, do you realize that when, like, this Joe does this all day long, my mate, and he's my most beloved brother, huh?
He goes, right, you know, like, that thing they whipped him with, and he'll tell you all the details, and he'll really get into it.
Now, like, I can't.
I sort of, on one level, I don't like hearing about the passion in gory DL.
And I sort of wonder what it is that people are getting off on and into when talking about that.
Like, maybe I need it.
Maybe I'm resisting it.
But I feel like there's a sort of a machismo in it, a kind of machismo.
Like, for me, like my experience of Christ was so.
I'm an intellectual person, huh?
But my experience, when he came to me in my guts, it was not intellectual.
It was a We like you know, your point about feeling, and believe me, I feel a lot of doubt, I feel a lot of attack, I feel a lot of fear.
But when he came, it was very, it was not like, hang on a minute, Jesus must be real because of XYZ.
It was like all of a sudden, I didn't, I hadn't even got no new information.
It's just suddenly in my guts, it's like, oh God, he's real.
It was just that.
It was a feeling of a cross in the belly.
It was a cross in the belly, right?
And then from that, it was like.
Is that why the cover of your book looks like that?
Yeah.
I'm just wondering.
It was like iron magnetic filings.
It was my, this is fly.
I love that.
Because of the C.S. Lewis.
Thanks, man.
Like, because of the C.S. Lewis.
Quote I changed it to flies, and I thought it was cool.
Then I heard about Beyond the Laws of the Flies, but really, it was like the feeling was iron filings in the gut.
And then I just started.
So that's an image of your redemption, that cover.
Yeah, it is.
It is.
It's the image of my redemption.
But then after that, I suppose in my own way, Jeremiah, I did then start reading scripture.
Now, the first thing that really hit me after that was Acts in the message, Eugene Peterson's.
I was reading Acts on my way to go see Tucker actually for the First interview I did after all the allegations and stuff, and I was reading Acts, and there was something about them, you know, just men, you know, I'm like, oh man, this happened.
And I'm reading Acts again right now at the moment, and I'm getting the same feeling of their kind of craziness, their passion, their brokenness, like that, like, you know, they're wielding this unbelievable power all of a sudden, like all of a sudden, there's something very familiar and real about it.
Personal experience, I did go about authenticating it.
So, but the thing I did, you know, the video is because perving on the resurrection is because it's so corporal, I suppose, because it's so corporal, because it is so much about the flesh and the punishment and the masochism and the sadism of the brutality.
Gambling with Faith and Dice00:08:35
Like, you know, so yeah, but, you know, I hope I didn't offend you.
I can see I didn't because you're on here and you're cool about it, but you can tell me more.
I immediately prayed for you because I know your heart.
And then, secondly, I messaged you according to Matthew 18 and said, I hope we can talk someday.
Can I just push back a little bit?
Can I have your permission to do that on your platform?
And here's what I can't get over.
Okay, I want to read a passage to you.
I've got my Bible here.
1 Corinthians 2, verse 2.
For I determined not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified.
Now, you know, Paul wrote that.
And Russell, what I want to share with you is Paul mentions the crucifixion 66 times.
He gives us 32,000 words of the Greek New Testament.
There's only 138,000 words in the Greek New Testament.
Only Luke gives us more with his Luke Acts.
So he's the second most prolific writer of the New Testament, and he cannot get over what Jesus did for him.
And Russell, can I just share why I've accumulated these, which I'd love to talk about if we have time, these artifacts?
There are many times that I wonder if God really loves me.
I have the degrees, which I don't want to talk about.
I've lived in Oxford three years.
All of that's one thing.
But I wake up sometimes and I wonder, does God really love me?
And Romans 5 8 takes my breath away.
Can you turn there with me to Romans 5 8?
Do you mind?
I want to encourage our audience to do this.
Go to the book of Romans, chapter 5, verse 8.
Because I saw something I've never seen before.
And this is how the Holy Spirit guides us into truth.
And isn't this awesome?
We're doing Bible study together, Russell.
I love it.
Romans 5 8.
Now, again, I read it in the Greek, but I'm going to read it in English.
It says, but God demonstrates his own love towards us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.
And Russell, that verse, I don't want to geek out for a minute, but it's the one of only two verses in the entire New Testament, which is in the continuous.
You're a Hollywood star.
God is saying through Paul in the book of Romans, this is a movie that is on a loop that never ends.
God is constantly.
God is constantly showing us how much He loves us when we look at the cross.
When you think, I've sinned for the 7,000th time, I've screwed up again.
What does God want you to do, Russell?
He wants you to look at this and He wants you to say, But God demonstrated His love and that when you were at His worst, He sent His best for you.
It should have been my head, Russell, in this.
Yes, as you said in your Instagram about me, these are Bethlehem thorns, they're three inches long.
They hurt.
And you know what?
Remember thorns and thistles, Genesis 3.
Remember all of the idiomatic language that's used now that you've read the scripture.
And yes, in Genesis it says he will stomp the serpent with his heel.
And yet it should have been your head and my head in this crown of thorns.
But Jesus said, No, Jeremiah, no, Russell.
I'm sending my best for you.
Russell, I have four sons.
I wouldn't give them for anyone.
And yet God gave them for me.
And so.
Am I perving on the resurrection?
No, not necessarily.
What I can't get over is God's love for me.
I cannot understand it.
It is an undying love, and that is the word grace.
And I'm sure you have a CPA like I do.
It doesn't make sense, and that's how you know it's too good to be true.
That's why I'm trying to explain.
I feel like I have dice in my hand.
Can you see these, Russell?
Can you see these on the camera?
These are first century Roman dice.
Now, I'm not saying they were the ones used at the crucifixion, but here's where I want to caution you as a pastor and as a brother in Christ.
And I caution myself, by the way, as well.
We can get so desensitized to what Jesus did for us.
You've heard the gospel a thousand times.
These are dice.
I'm sitting here, I'm doing it just like you would.
And remember, all four gospels record that the Romans who crucified Jesus were gambling.
Remember this?
You've read the gospels, they were gambling for his clothes.
The author of life is dying before them for their sins, and all they can focus on is gambling.
And so, may it never be said of me that I was desensitized to the cross.
And that's why I can't get over how much God loves me.
And if people make fun of me for it, so be it.
I want to know nothing but Christ and Him crucified.
Ephesians 1 and 2 tell us, Russell, we are all going to go into graduate school in heaven someday.
To really understand what it took to redeem us.
And that should encourage all of us.
Does that help a little bit of why I show these things?
I'm not trying to elicit an emotional response.
I'm trying to bring the reality of had you been there that day, you would never doubt how much God loves you.
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What I'm trying to reconcile and be truthful about is one of the things that I find most hard is to accept the love.
I find that hard.
I find it hard.
I find, in fact, that I almost need a reverse inoculation.
Like a reverse weaning, like the same way that, you know, like milk instead of food type stuff.
Because I find the acceptance of love, I'm afraid to get overwhelmed.
I'm afraid to get overwhelmed by love.
There's something unfamiliar about it that I find very, very difficult.
Also, from a more, for that's emotional and one might say psychological using sort of a modern analytic.
But also from an intellectual perspective, I feel that if we're like that, I don't want to use materialism, individualism, and sort of post enlightenment rationalism in order to access what is the mysterium tremendum.
You know, that's something that is not actually can't be contained in human consciousness, like by definition.
Words fail.
Words fail.
One of the things I get from Mark, hey, is that Christ is like the bit where he goes, let's go over to the other side.
Finding Peace Through Christ00:15:55
Like, is that.
Jesus is continually saying to those in his orbit, those chosen, that I sometimes think he could have just closed his eyes and pointed to anybody.
And, like, you know, how am I going to put this that you're going to understand it?
He's grappling with the gap between the mind of God and the mind of man.
And however much must be lost between Greek and English, nothing compared, surely, to even though we are his image and we bear his image.
Nothing compared to what can't be contained.
So that's the other thing.
Like, I'm enjoying reading your book.
I'm enjoying trying to get my head around what the Shroud of Turin might be.
But I also don't like the kind of wishful thinking.
Like, aha!
Now, finally, we've now got this thing.
Now, shut up and believe.
Because it's, you know, I know that it's about faith.
I know that there's never good, like, the one of the things I get from the miracles is, you know, on Monday, you know, water's turned into wine.
On Tuesday, he's walking on water.
Wednesday is feeding the 5,000, and by Thursday they've gone back fishing.
You know, I need a miracle every 15 minutes myself.
Me too.
So, you know, yeah, so that's part of it.
Did you get those two points?
Yeah.
Again, thank you for just simply being so transparent.
Thank you for saying what all of us say.
But here's what I want to tell you this is what I had to learn about faith that is so interesting.
Faith is not defined by faith.
We don't have faith in faith, we have faith in evidence.
And I want to make this very clear you're not doing anything wrong when you say, okay, it just clicked, so now I can believe.
You're not giving in to any postmodernism there.
I want to make this very clear, very, very clear.
There would not be a shred, Russell, of the New Testament written.
Had they not had, you're reading Acts, remember Acts 1 3?
Jesus showed himself to be alive by many convincing proofs.
Had those proofs not been so tangible, had Peter not seen Jesus on the Sea of Galilee, which, Russell, I truly hope to take you to Israel, to the very spot where he says, Do you love me?
Do you love me?
And he said, Lord, you know I love you.
And he redeems him.
Had not Thomas said, unless I see his, you know what, his scars on his side and his, his, his, literally, I have a six inch crucifixion nail.
I'm not saying this is the one used by Jesus, but this was used to crucify criminals of Rome and Judea.
It's six inches long.
It's bent, Russell, because they would often, they would actually move the nail to maximize torment, but minimize movement in the crucified victim.
We have 21 victims of crucifixion under the Roman Empire.
Pilate was very, very brutal.
And Thomas comes along and he's known now as doubting Thomas, but I love him because he says, Hey, unless I see the nail prints, unless I see the wound in the side, I won't believe.
And Jesus does not shame him or say, You don't have enough faith.
He says, Bro, check out my side, check out my wrist.
And he says in Greek, my Lord and my God.
My favorite appearance, though, which I talk about in the Jesus Discoveries in my book, is his appearance to his brother.
Do you have any brothers, Russell, by chance?
Not birth, but now, yeah.
Okay, yes.
I mean, like physical brothers, biological brothers.
So I have four sons, okay?
I adjudicate civil war every day in my home between these four boys, okay?
They love and hate each other all at the same time.
If you were to ask my sons, Russell, what would it take for you to believe that Justin was the son of God?
They would all begin to laugh.
And John 7, verse 5 says that not even his brothers believed on him.
Mark 3 says his family thought he was out of his mind.
Mark 6 says they want to do an intervention on Jesus.
He's literally, they think he's gone crazy, they think he's the Messiah.
And think about it, Jesus is experiencing this.
And St. Paul comes along in 1 Corinthians 15, verse 7, and he says, And he appeared to James.
And Russell, James goes from believing his brother was nuts.
And I hope we can time travel in heaven someday, Russell.
I hope you and I can go back to the moment where James, the brother of Jesus, is working in the stone shop.
He's humiliated.
Brother Jesus has just been crucified.
He's just trying to keep the family business going.
And Jesus appears and says, Bro, here I am.
Here I am, brother.
And James becomes one of the pillars of the church.
And we know this from Josephus, evidence now.
He dies in AD 62.
Stoned to death believing his brother was the resurrected Messiah.
That's why I have a whole chapter dedicated to James.
We've discovered his ossuary.
His bone box is right there.
It was discovered in 2002.
And in that bone box, unlike any other ossuary, and you're talking to someone who's seen more bone boxes than anyone in the world.
They're called ossuaries for second burial.
It says, son of Joseph, brother of Jesus.
No other bone boxes in Jerusalem or Israel, for that matter, say who their brother was except this very one.
And so that tells us, again, Josephus isn't the Bible.
We don't know this.
This is why I date the book of Acts before 62, by the way, since you're studying it.
James dies believing his brother.
So don't think that your faith is less than because you need evidence.
We had to have it.
Jesus showed himself by many infallible proofs.
And remember, we're all in that tension of Mark 9, the dad in Mark 9, Russell, who right after Jesus is transfigured, I believe his body was still glistening, and yet his son is possessed.
He's demonized.
He doesn't see Jesus.
Literally, likely still glistening.
And he said, Lord, I believe, help my unbelief.
And that was enough faith to activate Jesus.
So, my prayer right now for you and for everyone watching us right now is if you're willing to have that amount of faith, which is precious little, Lord, I believe, help my unbelief, that's enough for Jesus to change your life right now.
Even though he never shamed them in their resurrected Christ, many times throughout all four gospels, he's like, Oh, man, you idiots, you have little faith.
That's one of the things I like, actually, is the How often he tries and chastises them for it.
Where is your faith?
He asks.
Again and again and again, he says it to them.
See that around John 17, the prayer in Gethsemane, and I think in John it's just before the arrest, where it's him, I in them, you in me, them in us.
I think somewhere in there he says, like those that are coming down the line, those that are coming down the pipe, they're not going to see all of this stuff.
They're going to have to have faith.
So there's something around that, and I think it's in Paul as well, that idea.
So I wonder though, About the value of faith that isn't verified, both theologically, I'm asking that question, but also personally, because what I feel like I'm being called to do a lot is, you know, I'm under a lot of pressure, man.
I'm dealing with a lot of pressure.
Like, you know, I'm not claiming, I'm not trying to appear in some league table of who's having the hardest time.
I'm aware there's monumental suffering going on everywhere.
But what I'm saying is, sometimes in my prayer, I'm saying, God, I want something I can hold on to right now.
I'm not asking for.
Double down on the old faith, and while things progressively get worse and harder on the outside, I want some material bam shazam stuff, too, right?
Because, like, you know, that's what I'm asking for a lot of the time.
And but, like, you know, where am I in the line, you know, when there's when there's Gaza, when there's war, when you know, where do I stand in that line?
Um, and I'm aware of that, you know, my kids in hospital a bunch, and like, so whenever you're in a kid's hospital, you're seeing so much that it just immediately just switches your bullshit off.
Um, but my other.
My other point, right?
So it's like, you know, the value of faith that doesn't receive material verification is faith indeed.
And is that scripturally undergirded by that John 17 stuff?
That's a legit question to you because I might be not remembering it correctly.
And then the other thing is, can you help me with the resurrected body?
Like, how come he can walk all the way along to, is it a fishery or wherever they're walking that day?
Why are they not recognizing him?
Why, when he's on the shore, aren't they recognizing it?
What, what, What is the new body that it's both, oh my God, that's him, but also they're not recognizing him?
Absolutely.
First off, I'm so sorry that you've experienced having your child in the hospital.
I don't want to reveal anything personal, but I've been there as well.
And my book is dedicated to my son Abel.
And can I just encourage you for a minute?
I haven't shared this on any audience, but it says for Abel, our firstborn triplet, and my dear son, we experienced a physical healing of my son Abel's scoliosis two weeks ago.
And You can't tell me it's a coincidence that this book hit the New York Times number one list on the day that we found out my son was healed.
Because last May, you can pull this up on social media, his spine had a 16 degree curve.
He's had to wear, I haven't shared this on any other show, Russell.
I feel I can be transparent with you.
He wears a body cast for 12 hours a day, and he does it with such a great attitude.
And you're right.
When you go to Scottish Wright Hospital in Dallas, it takes all the bullshit away.
You don't, you know, you have no problems when you look at some of these families.
And we go there two weeks ago, and his, I'll use this nail from the Rome, his spine is this straight.
It has basically zero curve.
And they told him, You don't have to wear a cast anymore, Abel.
God literally healed him.
And so I pray that for your child with whatever your child is dealing with.
We serve a God who heals, we serve a God who works miracles.
They told us at Scottish Ride, this is one of the best children's orthopedic hospitals in the world.
This cast will not help him get better.
It's just to keep him from having rods put in his spine.
And that's why I dedicated the book to him last May during one of the most challenging seasons of my life.
And I know you're going through a crucible right now.
And I just want to encourage you we serve a God who heals, period.
Now I can't even remember the question you were asking me because I just want to encourage you with that with your child.
The first bit was about faith without, thank you.
The first bit was about faith without verification.
And the second part was about his new body and the resurrection going on.
Well, But I've come on this show to minister to you.
So I just want to minister to you and just tell you we serve a God who does heal.
And God bless you for being there with your sweet wife.
So faith is always defined by its object.
Here's the amazing thing about faith we have to know very little to become a Christian.
Remember the gospel, 1 Corinthians 15 3.
Christ died for our sins according to the scripture, he was buried.
And on the third day, he rose from the grave.
That is the gospel.
That is all you have to believe to become a Christian.
That's it.
That's it.
Literally, that is it.
That's why Jesus said, come to me with the faith of a child.
And so when it comes to faith, it's always defined by its object.
The object of our faith is the facts of the gospel in the person of Jesus.
That's it.
Now, faith will grow tremendously from there.
Remember when Jesus says to the centurion who said, Hey, man, I know you're powerful.
I lead a legion.
You can heal long distance.
You just say the word.
And he said, I haven't seen faith like this in all of Israel.
Faith will grow through these evidences.
And that's what my prayer is that my faith keeps growing.
But remember, faith is always only as strong as its object.
So as long as your faith is directionally, if you're using walking faith, even if you don't feel it, which we don't feel it half the time, so often we're like, Lord, I believe, help my unbelief.
Even if you don't feel it, if that faith is Jesus centric, that's all you need.
That's enough.
And so evidence comes along and it encourages us, though, in those moments of doubt, those moments when we're really going through a crucible of adversity like, God, do you really have this?
I have in my Bible, the Bible I'm using right now.
I don't know if you know this, but I went through a horrible period of anxiety, Russell, where God was blessing me with great success, but nobody would have doubted it or guessed this from the outside.
And I couldn't even go into Costco.
Do you know what Costco is here in America?
It's a big old thing, it stressed me out.
And I had to learn what the word shalom means.
There are 614 occurrences of the word shalom in the Bible.
And so I wrote a study Bible where every single occurrence, I wrote a devotion to myself.
Because I had to wrap myself in the peace of God.
I learned that the peace of God, the shalom of God, it's not a spiritual talent.
It's not a special gift for Delta Force Christians like Russell Brand.
It's for every believer in Jesus Christ who wants to have the peace of God that passes all understanding.
And I had to learn that the peace of God was a discipline, that Paul goes from 2 Corinthians 2 13 to have an anxiety attack.
And then he goes all the way to Philippians 4 and he gives us the greatest anti anxiety passage in all of the Bible.
Which is here's what you have to think about, and you have to keep thinking about it day after day after day.
And so, Russell, I pray God shalom on you in Jesus' name, I pray His peace on you in Jesus' name.
It is a peace that remember Judges 6 when all seemed lost.
Gideon built a temple to the Lord, or excuse me, an altar to the Lord, and he said, Yahweh, shalom, my God is peace.
Now, he still had to go fight His battles like you and I have to do, but He did it in the peace of God.
And so, that's what faith looks like faith.
Literally, in its object is enough.
You don't have to know all this.
Now, it's fun to know these things.
It brings the Bible to life, it helps us know Jesus better.
But faith in those really great moments, I love there's 651 prayers in the Bible, by the way.
Most of them are very short.
It's like, God, help me.
And what I like about how you pray, Russell, we all pray way too religiously.
We need to pray like Habakkuk.
There are 56 verses in the book of Habakkuk.
God, are you dead?
Are you dead, God?
Where are you, God, in my life?
I wish you would show up in my life when I feel like it's in your best interest.
To show up.
So I just pray that over you.
I'm on this program to speak to you now.
I'm happy to speak to your massive audience, but the Lord told me to speak to you, and you need God's peace all over you right now, as we all do.
So lean into his shalom right now.
Lean into his peace over your life.
Lean into the fact that you can pray going into the worst situation, the prayer of Gideon, my God is peace, and then you can go slay all the Midianites before you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
My God is peace.
My God is peace.
Victory Over Addiction00:10:30
Will you tell me what you think about the reincarnated body that manages to encapsulate identification but also a kind of obscurity?
What do you think that is?
And also, do you think that any personification of God in the Old Testament is Christ?
Say, like the fourth person in the furnace, and Daniel sees, and what Ezekiel sees, and the burning bush.
What do you think?
Think about that.
Tell me what you think about the new body.
So, back to everything, I'm an exegete, so everything goes back to the Bible.
69 times in Matthew, Mark, and Luke, Jesus refers to himself as Son of Man.
And if you read Daniel 7, and I watched you read the book of Daniel on Tucker's show, which you did amazingly, by the way.
You were reading a few chapters later, but in Daniel 7, the Son of Man is the Messiah who will sit at the right hand of the throne of God.
In heaven.
And so, Jesus, when these morons, when these apostate Bible scholars who are true apostates say Jesus never claimed to be God, he referred to himself as Son of Man 69 times.
If anyone who had read the book of Daniel, that would be like saying, Yes, I am the Messiah.
I am King of Kings.
I am Lord of Lords.
When he quotes Isaiah 6 2, what I love about Jesus is he takes all these Old Testament passages, he messianizes them, and he applies them to himself.
Hosea 6 2, on the second day, you will revive us.
On the third day, you will raise us up that you may live before him.
Jesus messianizes that in his messianic predictions, Mark 8, 31, Mark 9, 31, Mark 10, 33, and 34, that the Son of Man must die.
And then on the third day, he will be risen from the dead.
And make no mistake, Russell, this was a physical body.
This was no phantom.
This was no ghost.
This was no apparition.
And I used to be the biggest skeptic of the Shroud of Turn, and I was conditioned in Oxford at Keeble College to be that way, that we don't believe in the miraculous.
And Russell, I don't mean this with any pride.
I had published 300,000 words on the resurrection, even Body of Proof, which I love that book.
I never mentioned the shroud.
I didn't believe it until I actually bothered to look at the evidence.
And I actually read the fact that 102 academic disciplines have looked into what you brought up the shroud of Turin, which think of it like a sheet that covers the body of Jesus.
Remember, Joseph of Arimathea and Nicodemus do something powerful.
They ask Pilate for the body of Jesus, they have to bury him quickly.
He's dead at three o'clock.
By Jewish burial traditions, he must be buried before nightfall at 6 p.m.
They hurry him to a tomb 200 feet nearby.
If you come to Israel with me, I'll show you how close the crucifixion in Arimathea's tomb is.
And they lay his naked body, his brutalized body, on this shroud.
And again, the shroud is mentioned in all four gospels.
And remember, Russell, there's only 89 chapters in the gospels, and we only have parts of 26 days of the life of Jesus in the gospels.
There is an economy.
We have only four chapters on Christmas, and the world makes the biggest deal about Christmas.
One third of the Gospels is what happened on April 5th, AD 33.
And so they wrap his body.
Women are coming to the tomb on Sunday morning.
And stay with me, please.
Why?
They're going to do what Jewish burial traditions do they're going to sit Shiva for seven days.
They're going to continue to spice and clean the body.
Why?
Because, I mean, Nicodemus and Arimathea were probably in their early 70s.
I mean, can you imagine?
Just the heroism of these two old guys to get it's not like the wrong, there was no Uber you could call to help you get a guy off the cross.
I mean, these can you imagine?
And these guys, they're literally carrying our Lord and Savior's brutalized, unrecognizable body to the tomb.
They get him there.
Well, the women are coming that first Sunday morning.
We know from the Jet Propulsion Lab, sunrise is 5 43 a.m., April 5th, AD 33.
So they're coming very early and they are astonished.
The tomb is empty.
But when you read John chapter 20, this shocked me.
And I'm going to go to John 20 in my Bible.
You know, you read the Bible a thousand times, and the Holy Spirit always reveals new truth.
When you read the chronology of it, I love this.
It says, When they go in, they saw the shroud, the linen cloth lying there, and the sudarium that had been around his head, not lying with the linen cloths, but folded together in a place by itself.
Then the other disciple, that's John, who came to the tomb first, he went in also.
And Russell, this is my prayer for you on this broadcast.
He saw and he believed.
Now, John had believed before.
He was the only disciple that stayed at the cross.
But let me tell you, he believed more when he saw the shroud.
The shroud is the only burial garment we have from antiquity that is the image of a crucified man that matches with one to one correspondence the brutality that Jesus experienced on the cross.
Does it sound too good to be true?
I thought so myself until I went around the world.
Like you, I'm a thinker.
Interviewing the skeptics, interviewing the scientists.
And what's fun about my book is I have pictures.
I have paid off all these archaeologists.
You know what it's like as an author to get permission to get pictures.
But I'm meeting with a physicist, Russell, by the name of Paolo De Lazaro in Turin, Italy.
And he has the most powerful laser on earth.
And the image in the shroud is so amazing because it's superficial.
It's 0.02 microns.
If you were to take one strand of your hair and divide it up one fifth, That's how thin the image is.
So the blood absorbs all the way through the shroud, but the image is superficial.
And Paulo de Lazaro took five years.
He's a physicist.
He's not a preacher.
He's not a theologian.
He doesn't have a theological dog in the hunt.
And he tells me, Jeremiah, and he's published this academically 34 billion watts of energy.
But here's the kicker, Russell traveling at 140th of a billionth of a second to leave an image on the shroud.
That's four times the amount of power we have on earth.
Think about this from a New Testament perspective.
Every time Jesus manifests himself, he manifests himself as brilliant like Mark 9, the transfiguration.
Acts 26, Paul sees Jesus and he says it's brighter than the noonday sun.
Think of Revelation 22.
We'll have no need for the sun and the new heaven and new earth because Jesus will give light to all.
And so, what I am postulating right here in my book is that we have actual scientific residue of the resurrection of Jesus.
And here's the application for it, okay?
Every time I go out to eat, I have a family of seven.
So here in America, we get charged automatic gratuity if you have more than a party of six.
So we always get charged full amount plus gratuity just because I have a big family.
I'm blessed with five kids.
And I always ask for the itemized receipt.
When you look at the Shroud of Turin, Russell, it is an itemized receipt of how much Jesus loves you.
You see the brutality that he went through, but then you see the victory of his resurrection, which shows we can get over any addiction.
We can be a champion in Christ.
We can overcome any adversity that we're facing.
And that's why when John sees this amazing shroud, he believes.
So then his body has new capabilities to answer your question.
I don't want you to think it's like Lazarus.
It took me a while to understand this because in John 11, you know, Lazarus, remember, Jesus raises him up and he's like, hey, take his grave clothes off.
No, Jesus' body emanates through the shroud.
I sent you a video on text about this.
His body literally emanates through the shroud.
His body has new capabilities where he doesn't need to use doors.
He can appear and disappear in rooms.
And I coined this term in my book.
Every shred of evidence for Jesus' resurrection, Russell, is evidence for your and my resurrection.
This is probably why this may be the most important conversation you've ever had on your channel, not because of me, but because of the application of it.
John 14, 19, Jesus says, Because I live, you will live also.
1 Corinthians 15 says, Your body will have deathlessness.
Unable to die, unable to decay.
Here's the great thing unable to sin.
Can you imagine that?
The glory of not having to deal with sin anymore, to be able to worship our Savior in spirit and in truth without any sin, to be able to love and forgive our brothers, to wipe every tear from our eyes.
That is the promise that took the Roman Empire by storm.
And it's why the Christian movement is now the greatest force for good on planet Earth.
Yes, I like the new light, the light by which all light is seen.
That it is in fact a new creation, almost like a new Big Bang.
That the resurrection of that singular body is like a second molecular compound, an instantiation of a new physical reality, almost extra electromagnetic.
Like at the edges of the light range that's visible, ultraviolet and infrared, there are presumed new hieroglyphs of light, new photons that belong to an alphabet of light.
Inaccessible to the limitations of our sensory instruments.
And maybe then I'm thinking of in heaven, there is no man, no woman, and like you said, no sin.
I'm thinking, I felt during that that the transcendent, the martyr fuel that was disseminated through that event is the feeling of inspired.