Aug. 16, 2025 - Rubin Report - Dave Rubin
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| Speaker | Time | Text |
|---|---|---|
| And we moved from what I would say was the Jordan era to, hey, your identity is going to define you in some way. | ||
| This is where my book opens. | ||
| Leah Thomas winning the women's 500-meter NCAA championship to me in March of 22 was the absolute apex, the high tide, as it were, of woke sports. | ||
| I also think this is where the dishonesty of social media had so much to do with it. | ||
| You're making tens of millions of dollars as an athlete. | ||
| You've got a team that's pretty much advising you on what you put up on Instagram or what you put up. | ||
| And they were saying, Hey, you don't want to get in crosswise with the trans community, or you don't want to seem like you are speaking out against BLM. | ||
| That's the actual attack to me on sports: everyone is amoral if the talent is good enough. | ||
| That's where you can really like, hey, is this the right message? | ||
| My new book called Balls, and it's how Trump Young Men and Sports Fans Saved America in the 2024 election. | ||
| What do you make of generally like the economics around sports these days? | ||
| that it is just so freaking expensive to go to any game with the family. | ||
| All right, guys, as you know, it's August, so I am off the grid, but I did not want to leave you without content because content is king, and you people need to watch us talk all the time. | ||
| So I brought on another talker, Mr. Clay Travis, the breast man in all of sports media. | ||
| How are you, my friend? | ||
| I'm doing great. | ||
| Where is the how many different destinations do you have for August Bland? | ||
| I don't want to reveal all of the secrets, but we'll be out and about, just not in places where people can find me. | ||
| How about that? | ||
| That sounds fun. | ||
| I'm actually always been envious of Banishing for August. | ||
| So, you know, you can do it too, my friend. | ||
| You've built businesses, you've sold businesses, you run your operations. | ||
| It's all a matter of will. | ||
| But you know, whenever I miss on radio with Buck, it's a huge deal because people expect us to be there. | ||
| YouTube, where you have built your universe, I think is actually the future. | ||
| And I'm kicking myself for being, you know, a little bit behind the curb in a substantial way. | ||
| But you were like, like on the front edge of this throughout. | ||
| And I saw a stat the other day. | ||
| I was reading over the weekend. | ||
| More people watch podcasts now than listen to them, which if you had told me that five years ago, I would have said, you're a total moron. | ||
| There's no way that's going to happen. | ||
| But guess where my boys spend all their time? | ||
| YouTube and TikTok. | ||
| That's it. | ||
| That's where they are. | ||
| That's actually very interesting. | ||
| And it's kind of where I wanted to start. | ||
| Because obviously, I kind of want to just talk a little bit about everything, a little bit more about life and career rather than just the usual minutia that we do with politics and everything else. | ||
| But you started Outkik in 2011. | ||
| I started a Rubin Report in 2013, and you just mentioned the audio podcast thing. | ||
| And I always see these audio podcast lists ranking all of us in sports and politics. | ||
| And I always think that. | ||
| I'm like, wait a minute, I don't really care where I'm at in audio because I'm a video show. | ||
| And that's where people are. | ||
| Yeah, people focus on that. | ||
| But let's go back to 2011. | ||
| What was young Clay Travis? | ||
| How old was Clay Travis in 2011? | ||
| We're about to start. | ||
| 30 years. | ||
| 32. | ||
| Is that the right map? | ||
| Basically, yeah, 31-ish. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| What was Clay Travis thinking back in 2011 when he thought, boy, I'll build my own thing instead of going the mainstream route? | ||
| Because that was early on. | ||
| That was early on. | ||
| Yeah, it was, I was ahead of the curve then. | ||
| And I was terrified. | ||
| I had a three-year-old and I had a four-month-old in January of 2011. | ||
| And you may remember this site. | ||
| Some people may remember it called fanhouse.com. | ||
| It was basically the front page of sports on AOL.com, which was still a very popular place to start the internet even back in 2011. | ||
| People don't remember. | ||
| You have to sign up for AOL. | ||
| You get that freaking CD, sign up for that. | ||
| Well, they'd send you a new CD every day, but if you got one, you could get on AOL, it was basically the portal to the internet. | ||
| I mean, it's making us sound old, but it is what it is. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| And by the way, yahoo.com is still a place where tons of people start. | ||
| Like it is their homepage when they get on the internet Every day. | ||
| AOL still makes, I think, several hundred million dollars off of AOL, like the dial. | ||
| Like, yes, I think so. | ||
| I look up, have your team look up the, it's still a revenue producing. | ||
| Some people think they have to pay to keep their email addresses, right? | ||
| Like if you're older, you're like, hey, I've been at AOL.com forever. | ||
| And so they're worried and they keep paying, even though they don't use like the dial-up internet anymore. | ||
| But so January of 2011, Sporting News, another site that basically doesn't exist, bought all of the site traffic that Fanhouse was using and they fired all of us. | ||
| Like the whole group, I don't know, there were probably a couple of hundred of us. | ||
| I loved that job. | ||
| I was traveling all over the country. | ||
| And I decided then and there with my three-year-old and my four-month-old, I didn't want anybody else to ever control whether I could make a living online. | ||
| So I started Outkick and did every ad sale, wrote every article. | ||
| Like any small business that anyone starts, you had to wear a bunch of different hats. | ||
| And we grew and, you know, 2011, the world hadn't gone insane. | ||
| This is what my book that's coming out in November is a little bit about. | ||
| When did sports start going insane? | ||
| I pegged right around 2015. | ||
| 2016 was when like the wheels came off. | ||
| For several years, we just did fun. | ||
| Hey, sports are awesome. | ||
| Let's do drinking games for big games. | ||
| Let's like make people laugh. | ||
| And then sports suddenly turned into the most serious thing on the planet. | ||
| And I wasn't willing to basically get in line and say, oh, you know, the NFL is racist. | ||
| And man, the worst thing that could ever happen to somebody is they can play in the NBA. | ||
| You know, I kind of like the idea of being a pro athlete. | ||
| And I don't think they're being unfairly treated or that America is an awful, fundamentally racist place. | ||
| And that put me in a corner of not very many supporters. | ||
| Edgy stuff, man. | ||
| Edgy stuff. | ||
| And I was not racist, Edgy. | ||
| Do you look back on? | ||
| I want to talk about that 2015, 2016 sports going crazy. | ||
| Because obviously that's kind of when politics went crazy too, because that's original Trump, you know, 45. | ||
| That's right. | ||
| But do you look back on those days of the grind? | ||
| So you lose your job, you have young kids, you're doing all, you said you're wearing all those hats, all those. | ||
| Do you look back on them as the good old days? | ||
| Like, obviously, you're a huge success now, financial success. | ||
| You sold out, kick, you're doing all, you're on a, the, I think, is it the number one talk radio show in the country? | ||
| Like, you're doing all this great stuff. | ||
| But do you look back on that crazy moment as like, man, those, those were the good old days? | ||
| Because I look at my days like that and I'm so much happier now. | ||
| I have so much more, but they still feel like the good old days. | ||
| Well, I think it's the way to think about it is, and I think there's a sports analogy. | ||
| I think a lot of coaches feel this way. | ||
| A lot of times it's more fun to build than maintain. | ||
| You've got a big audience now. | ||
| I've got a big audience now, but you're maintaining the audience that you've already built as opposed to kind of being out in the open and fighting to kind of make your voice heard. | ||
| And the highs and the lows, I would say for anybody out there that, you know, when we would get a new advertiser back in the day, you know, I'd run through the house like wanting to do cartwheels, jumping around like, hey, the mortgage is covered for the next several months. | ||
| Like my family's not going to go hungry. | ||
| The stakes felt more substantial. | ||
| And I would say this too. | ||
| In the wake of Trump winning, the stakes in the 2024 election felt big. | ||
| I think when you're in the outside and you're looking in the whole Biden era, COVID, everything else, I felt like we were on the outside trying to get to the inside. | ||
| And then I felt a tremendous sense of relief when Trump won in late November because I just thought, okay, we got four years. | ||
| I can breathe a little bit. | ||
| I don't think it's going to be an unmitigated disaster. | ||
| But I do think that challenge of maintaining versus building is something I think about a lot. | ||
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| Do you, uh, did you like doing all the stuff, like learning how to become a businessman and all that? | ||
| I never thought I was going to have to do all this. | ||
| But then I suddenly realized when I was doing it, even though there's a lot of pain points and rejections and all that shit, like I suddenly was like, boy, I do like building. | ||
| And it also, I think it made me better as a pundit because I had more real world experience on the I knew how to pay people. | ||
| I knew how to balance books, et cetera, et cetera. | ||
| Yeah, like I saw it. | ||
| I bet you would feel this. | ||
| Skip Bayless came out recently and said, Hey, in order to be great at my profession, I had to decide that I couldn't have kids. | ||
| And I don't think I would have been a Centilla as successful as I am if I hadn't had kids, right? | ||
| It was the drive, I think, to provide and the drive to have success. | ||
| And yeah, I loved all of it. | ||
| I liked the fact of marketing. | ||
| I liked ad sales. | ||
| I, you know, there was one point where I was making $45,000 a year doing local sports talk radio in Nashville three hours a day. | ||
| And I went on the ad sales and one of our advertisers who was selling like bald men hair stroked a check for $50,000 for six months of ads that I was going to do. | ||
| And I remember sitting there thinking, that check is more than I'm going to make for a whole year from one advertiser. | ||
| So I think when you learn the business, look at that hair, man. | ||
| I still got it here. | ||
| But when you learn the business, it makes you better at figuring out how to be better. | ||
| And I think one thing I was a little bit unique of is I would just look at the data and I would say, if I'm going to be busting my ass, I want to bust my ass with topics that people care about, topics that are going to resonate. | ||
| And I think that doing all of that, I'm still kind of amazed how many people have no idea how to make money at their for-profit job or how that impacts their own ability. | ||
| And remember, I mean, I think when you have young kids and you got a mortgage to pay and you are just grinding, that motivation to learn is actually immediately usable, right? | ||
| You got all these guys sitting around getting MBAs that have way more knowledge about how to use an Excel spreadsheet than me, but they don't understand how to make money to actually run a profitable business because it's all philosophy to them. | ||
| And they make 200K to work at some business and their success or failure is really hard to peg to the company. | ||
| When you do everything, you take all the ownership on your shoulders. | ||
| And I think there's a great deal of freedom in that because you can't turn to somebody else and be like, you screwed this up, buddy. | ||
| It's all on you. | ||
| And I liked it. | ||
| And not only is it all on you, but if it falls apart, dude, that's your, like you're, at least you were wise enough to call it outkick.com. | ||
| I put Ruben right in there. | ||
| There was no way. | ||
| There was no way I could have scrolled out of that. | ||
| What year did you sell Outkick? | ||
| That's got to be 21. | ||
| Okay. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| So my deal as a part of the acquisition ends basically at the end of this calendar year. | ||
| So I'm kind of sitting around like, hey, what is the world going to look like there? | ||
| You don't get everything right. | ||
| I was mentioning YouTube earlier. | ||
| I think I probably overemphasized Twitter video and I should have been way more. | ||
| I could go back in time to myself and be like, hey, in 2018, you should have been like Twitter videos fine, Periscope, all that stuff. | ||
| Go all in on YouTube. | ||
| I think we would have done better. | ||
| You know, hindsight, you learn a lot. | ||
| But, you know, like in general, I think if you stack up that every day when you run a business, you have to make 20 decisions. | ||
| I think I probably made 15 pretty good ones, three or four bad ones. | ||
| And my one big gamble that was right is, again, sports analogy, I figured name on the back of the jersey is going to matter more than name on the front. | ||
| So I didn't feel compelled to work at CBS or ESPN or any of those. | ||
| I saw that the social media era was going to favor, I think, and I still think it largely does individuals over big brands, Even if those are big successful brands. | ||
| No, and that's absolutely true. | ||
| We can look at everything that's happened at ESPN. | ||
| You know, Skip, who you mentioned, might be a bit of an exception in that he ended up going for an organization, but the idea that he felt he had to give up kids to become a successful sports broadcaster. | ||
| Boy, that is dark. | ||
| Yeah, it is. | ||
| It is kind of dark. | ||
| So tell, so you sell out kick. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I assume that was the first time you probably had like real money, like real serious money, right? | ||
| How did that change you or not change you? | ||
| Or how did that embolden you to do more of what you do or whatever? | ||
| It was a great feeling. | ||
| Like we signed the papers late at night. | ||
| And, you know, my wife Laura, who you know, it's like 2:30 in the morning, and I got to get up and do my radio show, which the time was early in the morning. | ||
| And I'll talk about that in a sec. | ||
| But I turned to her and I was like, hey, you know, we just paid for every kid or grandkid, and you're probably going to live long enough to see great grandkids to be able to go to any college they want to go to, to be able to pursue any education, any dream that they want to. | ||
| That's a pretty amazing feeling. | ||
| For me personally, I slept for a couple of hours. | ||
| I woke up and I went and I did my sports talk radio show. | ||
| We weren't announcing it yet. | ||
| And I think the ultimate sign that you're living life the right way is if you are fortunate enough to feel like you won the lottery. | ||
| Everybody sits around and thinks, boy, what would I do if that scratch off lottery ticket? | ||
| What if I won the mega ball or the powerball, whatever the millions are? | ||
| I wanted to do the exact same thing that I was already doing. | ||
| And so that's when I felt like, hey, I really kind of won. | ||
| Now, sometimes I think I work too much and like you're going away for August. | ||
| I think, you know, I took the kids to Australia. | ||
| I think I'm more cognizant as the kids have gotten older of the fact that we don't have a ton of time with them, meaning they're going to have their own girlfriends. | ||
| They're going to have their own lives, college. | ||
| And so I want to like kind of fill in as many things as we can. | ||
| So I, you know, that was probably the biggest change is like, hey, we can afford to take an unbelievable two-week trip to Australia. | ||
| And I want to go on a safari and I want to do a lot of cool travel things. | ||
| And we built a couple of awesome houses and that's great. | ||
| But, you know, the practical matter of it is I feel like I've got the best jobs in the country and I just want to keep doing what I do. | ||
| And I think that's the ultimate sign of maybe living right in some way is wanting to continue to do more of what you've already done. | ||
| When you were in Australia, did they tell you about the koalas who all have gonorrhea? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I didn't realize that those koalas were so horny. | ||
| We all got our picture taken with them. | ||
| And actually, we saw a koala actually in the wild, which I don't know if it's incredibly common. | ||
| My kids were all terrified of saltwater crocodiles, of course. | ||
| And you'll appreciate this. | ||
| I probably, if you want to, there are many flaws that I have. | ||
| One of them, and it could be good or bad, as most attributes are, I am not very fearful. | ||
| So everybody was like, they have these jellyfish that, you know, that everybody's supposed to be afraid of. | ||
| And they tell you to put on a wetsuit. | ||
| And if you get stung, you might die. | ||
| And I was like, to hell with this. | ||
| Like, I mean, my kids weren't at it, but they were like, you're not putting the jellyfish suit on. | ||
| And I was like, ah, jellyfish. | ||
| That's a COVID of the ocean. | ||
| If they get me, I'll be fine. | ||
| COVID of the ocean. | ||
| And my kids loved it because I called it the COVID of the ocean. | ||
| And so literally, we're on like snorkeling on the Great Barrier Reef. | ||
| Everyone on the entire boat is like, you know, head to toe in these wildly uncomfortable, you know, like suits, which I don't even know how effective they are. | ||
| And I'm just out there and, you know, don't even have flippers on, just in a bathing suit, nothing else, looking at, you know, pretty majestic sites. | ||
| So I am not somebody who sits around probably why I started a company and thinks, oh my goodness, this is going to go awful. | ||
| I'm just going to bust my ass and work as hard as I can. | ||
| And when my time's up, tap me on the shoulder. | ||
| I'm good to go. | ||
| So let's jump back to that 2015-16 thing that you mentioned because I think most people view that as the beginning of when politics obviously changed and everything kind of went on steroids and Trump derangement and all that. | ||
| And everyone understands the political version of that and then COVID, blah, blah, blah. | ||
| The sports version in retrospect now fully makes sense to me why it went crazy at the exact same time. | ||
| Does it make sense to you as to why those Things were lined up that way. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| So, my new book that's coming out in November is called Balls, B-A-L-L-S, and it's how Trump, Young Men, and Sports Fans Saved America in the 2024 election. | ||
| So, my thesis, and now I think you kind of get a little bit of a historic window to look at it. | ||
| Um, is to me, sports started to go crazy about 2015, and it was pre-Trump. | ||
| And I'm curious if you remember this. | ||
| Uh, what I saw was suddenly identity politics took over instead of merit. | ||
| And the way that I would see it is instead of saying, like, hey, I think this guy is going to be a good quarterback or not, somebody would be like, Oh, you're saying that because he's black. | ||
| And I'm like, What? | ||
| Yeah, like every quarterback gets examined to the nth degree because it's a hard job to do, and they're paying tens of millions of dollars. | ||
| And suddenly, they're like, you know, the NFL combines like a slave auction. | ||
| That's what Colin Kaepernick said on YouTube. | ||
| I mean, sorry, on Netflix. | ||
| And I'm looking around like, did slaves get multi-million dollar guaranteed contracts? | ||
| You know, and so I think it started in retrospect now, actually with Michael Sam, because he is the first player that wasn't actually that good that I remember got covered entirely because of his identity because he was gay. | ||
| He wasn't. | ||
| He couldn't even remember. | ||
| Yeah, he was gay. | ||
| He was the first round draft pick and gay. | ||
| Okay, let's talk about it a little bit. | ||
| But most sports fans just care about, for better or worse, how good of a player you are. | ||
| They'll give away, look, you can kill somebody in a car accident. | ||
| You can murder someone. | ||
| But if you're really good, they'll make excuses and they'll be like, hey, you should be able to play. | ||
| And then it went to Caitlin Jenner and they gave SPs, ESPN did, back-to-back years only for identity, not for something that someone had done outside of the identity. | ||
| Wait, so Michael Sam won one, two. | ||
| I don't even remember. | ||
| Did he ever play in the NFL even? | ||
| Never played in an NFL game. | ||
| Was a seventh round draft pick. | ||
| He was seen as kind of the classic, not big enough to play defensive in, not fast enough to play linebacker. | ||
| He was a very successful player at the University of Missouri, and he did not make it in the NFL. | ||
| And so he got the SV for courage in 15. | ||
| Caitlin Jenner got, or sorry, 14, I think. | ||
| Caitlin Jenner got the SV for courage in 15. | ||
| And from there, then Colin Kaepernick takes a knee in 16. | ||
| And it was like all that mattered was identity politics. | ||
| And we moved from what I would say was the Jordan era of, hey, Republicans, vice sneakers, to everybody loves great athletes to, hey, your identity is going to define you in some way, whether it's Megan Rapino, Steve Kerr, Greg Popovich, LeBron James, they all kind of started to slice and dice what had been a universal sports audience. | ||
| And I would say, this is where my book opens. | ||
| Leah Thomas winning the women's 500-meter NCAA championship, to me, in March of 22, was the absolute apex, the high tide, as it were, of woke sports. | ||
| And that was the moment when it finally went too far. | ||
| And the pushback now has been intense and I think has wrapped up with sports fans, young men, Trump, all of people just saying we're over this. | ||
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| You know, I don't know if the book's actually been published yet. | ||
| Maybe you have a little window you could work with here, but my director Connor has a theory that Leah Thomas was keeping the penis as a propeller. | ||
| Do you think that that's at all possible? | ||
| It's funny that you mentioned the propeller angle. | ||
| I deleted a tweet. | ||
| This is in the book where when Leah Thomas won the title, I said Leah Thomas wins women's 500-meter title, pulls dick out, swings it like a propeller to sell him. | ||
| You stole that from Clay. | ||
| I said, well, I used to talk about helicopter dicks back in the day and Terrell's dick like a helicopter. | ||
| And I deleted it because I was like, well, I don't want to, we actually did really good work that is adult-like on Outkick covering this. | ||
| And I was like, well, I don't want to step all over my guys that are covering this as a real news story, but I did put it in the book. | ||
| And look, I think Trump is actually more of a symptom of the crazy than the cause of it. | ||
| I think he kind of just stepped into it and started looking around a little bit like you and me. | ||
| And remember, we met when they tried to cancel me because I said the First Amendment and boobs on CNN eight years ago now. | ||
| And that was when they really kind of came for me and said, we're going to end this guy. | ||
| They failed. | ||
| And since then, it's kind of continued to grow, I would say, the audience. | ||
| So even though we both kind of agree that, okay, 2015, 2016, you can see how sports and politics, it was on the same track going together. | ||
| Do you find it weird that somehow the athletes themselves didn't have a better defense against it? | ||
| Like political people, they all move in herds and everyone's got their whatever. | ||
| But sports is the ultimate, is the ultimate negation of what should be of what we think of as identity politics. | ||
| You don't care when you're on the court. | ||
| So it's one thing that the corporations were pushing BLM and all the garbage on us, but you would have thought maybe, or maybe this is just fantasy land, that the athletes themselves would have done a better job. | ||
| But I guess at the end of the day, everyone's getting a check. | ||
| Yeah, everybody's getting a check. | ||
| I also think this is where the dishonesty of social media had so much to do with it is you're making tens of millions of dollars as an athlete. | ||
| You've got a team that's pretty much advising you on what you put up on Instagram or what you put up. | ||
| And they were saying, hey, you don't want to get in crosswise with the trans community or you don't want to seem like you are speaking out against BLM. | ||
| And so you would like to think that these guys would be not be cowards, but the Aaron Rodgers of the world were actually a rarity. | ||
| And what I would say is, I think this is where the teams kind of often have these players by the balls. | ||
| A lot of these guys don't make very much money. | ||
| And so they don't want to rock the boat, most of them, because the guaranteed contract $50 million a year guy is actually the extreme exception. | ||
| And so a lot of the guys, I think, were making a decision. | ||
| Hey, you know, in the NFL in particular, average career is like three and a half years. | ||
| I'm 23. | ||
| Do I want to lose my job because I say that Michael Sam's not a hero or that Rhea Thomas, you know, shouldn't be winning a championship while he still had a dick and women swimming? | ||
| No, I'm just going to pretend that doesn't exist. | ||
| And then I think the algorithms were so rigged that a lot of these executives who knew this was all bullshit were cowards. | ||
| And now you're seeing them do what they know they should have done years ago. | ||
| And they're basically using Trump as the protective shield to allow them to do what they know they should have been doing for years. | ||
| Right. | ||
| I think behind the scenes, especially now, these guys are all applauding Trump across the board because they can get back to what the core competency is. | ||
| But what do you make of like when Kaepernick really was going crazy with all this stuff and then BLM and all this stuff that he couldn't get on a team and he went to a couple tryouts. | ||
| He couldn't get on a team. | ||
| And my position kept being, well, first off, he was aging out a little bit, but he was still basically okay. | ||
| But what I kept saying about it was even if he was basically okay enough to get on a team or maybe even a little better than okay, teams just won't pick him up because they just don't want the headache. | ||
| Like that the headache was actually bigger than the whatever return they thought they were going to get with his arm. | ||
| Look, what I always say, and I think this is a good life lesson, no matter what you do, if you're a roofer, if you're a mechanic, if you're a YouTube host, if you are a star athlete, as long as your talent exceeds your problems, people will employ you, right? | ||
| But then when you go off the crazy train like Keith Oberman did, or you start losing $40 million a year like Stephen Colbert did, you can sometimes be arrogant enough to think that your talent exceeds your problems. | ||
| And what you will find is the market will tell you. | ||
| And I think the market told Colin Kaepernick, look, I've said it for a long time. | ||
| People used to get mad at me. | ||
| Back in the day, if Aaron Rodgers had taken a knee because he thought America was too mean to ISIS, somebody would have signed him to play in the NFL, right? | ||
| Aaron Rodgers could have been like, hey, I'm taking a knee during the anthem because ISIS, we're killing too many terrorists. | ||
| And somebody would have been like, eh, you know, I don't really agree. | ||
| But man, he's a better quarterback. | ||
| He's the MVP. | ||
| He's better than anybody else. | ||
| You can get away with a lot. | ||
| I don't think it's coincidental that Aaron Rodgers, like, screw you guys. | ||
| I'm not taking the COVID shot. | ||
| Most receivers who are making $600,000 a year are like, you know, I'm way more in danger from football than COVID. | ||
| You can give me 50 shots. | ||
| I don't care. | ||
| You guys are warriors, right? | ||
| And so I think the number of players whose talent truly exceeds their problems is actually very low. | ||
| And I think that's true across the board. | ||
| And so I think most teams looked at Colin Kaepernick and said, we don't see him as a top 10 quarterback in this league. | ||
| Why do we want to bring in the distraction to our team for a backup quarterback? | ||
| Again, if he had been Patrick Mahomes, Patrick Mahomes could take any political stance he wants on the planet right now. | ||
| Josh Allen could. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Heck. | |
| Deshaun Watson got accused of, when they still thought he was good, sexually assaulting like 30 women, and the Cleveland Browns gave him the biggest contract in the history of sports. | ||
| Now, they're not happy with it now, but it's because he's not very good, not because of what he did off the field. | ||
| Right. | ||
| That's the actual attack to me on sports: everyone is amoral if the talent is good enough. | ||
| That's where you can like, hey, is this the right message? | ||
| Ray Rice knocks his girlfriend out. | ||
| We're going to not fire him until we realize he only averaged 3.9 yards a carry and we can actually find somebody better. | ||
| It's not because he knocked his girlfriend out. | ||
| It's because he knocked his girlfriend out and he wasn't averaging six yards a carry. | ||
| That's a real criticism of sports that all that matters is your talent. | ||
| But most people went to race, they went to identity, and I think they'd missed the mark on that. | ||
| Right. | ||
| In general, it tells you something about power. | ||
| I mean, there's plenty of people that were partying with Harvey Weinstein for years, plenty of people that were partying with P. Diddy for years, plenty of people that were partying with both of them for years. | ||
| But maybe at Epstein, right? | ||
| Yeah, like until somebody actually faces, even if you, even, and you can't tell me, some of those guys weren't like, boy, you know, some of these Harvey scores are a little bit, a little bit, they sound a little odd. | ||
| And they even made jokes about, right? | ||
| Like, you go, look, everybody was joking, boy, Harvey's always banging some new Hollywood star. | ||
| Like, really? | ||
| Why are they doing that? | ||
| You know, Tom, Tom Cruise in Tropic Thunder basically plays Harvey Weinstein. | ||
| That's right. | ||
| And it's pretty obvious what he was. | ||
| Anyway, by the way, Tropic Thunder, great movie. | ||
| Great movie. | ||
| Great movie. | ||
| Never go full retard, bro. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| Robert Downey Jr. played a story. | ||
| I was talking about played a black guy. | ||
| Tom Bruce played Harvey Weinstein. | ||
| Great humor. | ||
| I think you and I have talked about it. | ||
| You know, I'm hopeful that good comedies can come back because for about a decade, Hollywood's been so afraid of offending anybody that they really haven't made a great comedy in about it, and you know, since 2012-ish, probably. | ||
| That's also in, I think, with this era. | ||
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| Well, we're taping this end of July, so you know what came out on August 1st, which is going to be, I just have no problem saying it's going to be an absolute disaster, but they're re-remaking Naked Gun, and it has nothing to do with the original Naked Gun guys. | ||
| They kicked out David Zucker, who's a good friend of mine who I had on the show, going to be a nightmare. | ||
| But anyway, what do you make of generally like the economics around sports these days? | ||
| That it is just so freaking expensive to go to any game with a family. | ||
| And then people see the salaries, they see all the other stuff. | ||
| And that in a world of this freaking thing, like people have distractions. | ||
| They don't need it the way they used to, where it was, you know, basically the only game in town, no pun intended. | ||
| Yeah, look, when I was a kid, we didn't have a lot of money, got to go to games occasionally, and we were experts at watching to see who the ushers were that weren't doing a very good job. | ||
| And you'd be like, okay, we got two options. | ||
| We can risk it and hope that people aren't coming late. | ||
| Or, you know, and then you keep scooting over and you're always looking over your shoulder, like, oh, no, is this person going to tell us that we're in their seat, right? | ||
| Is the usher going to come kick us out? | ||
| Or you would sometimes wait till like the fourth or fifth inning, and then you'd try to sneak in to get closer. | ||
| I am blown away by what it costs to be a dad taking a couple of kids to a game now. | ||
| And I feel fortunate, like we can get good seats now. | ||
| Like my kids have a good, have a good life. | ||
| But I do, as a guy who grew up knowing how important it was to go to a game, the fact that players just sit out, right? | ||
| That load management exists. | ||
| You know, every time that you got to go, I got to watch Michael Jordan in an exhibition. | ||
| He didn't have to play. | ||
| He played because he wanted to put on a show for kids like me that might have never gotten to see him in person. | ||
| Otherwise, he didn't want to be a poor representation. | ||
| I think Charles Barkley's got it right. | ||
| He said, look, if you sit out and you're healthy, you should have to sit on the concourse and sign autographs and post one photo for the whole game, right? | ||
| You know, and I don't think that's bad advice. | ||
| I think about this all the time. | ||
| You know, you get Christmas and your dad got you tickets, mom got you tickets for one game, and then it's your favorite player and you go, and I'm not talking about being injured. | ||
| I'm talking about they just decide they're not willing to play. | ||
| It's like, man, that sucks. | ||
| And I think the cost and the, and to your point, the ability and ease of watching high-level, a lot of times, my kids, look, they can find any game on the internet without having to have a cable subscription or without having to pay for anything. | ||
| I think they're going to have to figure this out. | ||
| And I think continuing to charge more, which has been the solution so far, eventually you get to a price point where people just say, that's too much for me. | ||
| Do you see any solution to that on the horizon? | ||
| Because also the tech is obviously getting so much better that you will consistently feel more and more like you're at the game to the point that, I mean, they're already starting this. | ||
| You'll wear a meta and someone else will have the camera on the floor of the Lakers game and you're going to be right there with them. | ||
| So I think my boy is probably not a surprise because of what I do. | ||
| We watch a lot of sports. | ||
| When I talk to my friends who have young kids and I'm talking about, you know, like teenage kids on down, they're like, man, they never sit and watch a whole game anymore. | ||
| They get on Instagram and they see like a two-minute highlight reel. | ||
| That's interesting. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| And so I think one of the challenges you have, and I give credit to baseball, for instance, in saying, hey, we're going to try to make all our games about two hours long. | ||
| I think some of the stuff you're going to have to, the NFL maybe is safe because they only have one game a week where you have to watch and college football too. | ||
| But I think when you're trying to get 162 games or you're trying to get 82 hockey games or 82 NBA games, look, when I was a kid, we didn't have a lot of great options for entertainment. | ||
| You know, like nowadays, every kid expects that everything that has ever existed in the history of entertainment should be immediately findable at like one click on their phone or on their iPad, their tablet, whatever it is. | ||
| And I do think that Reed Hastings is, he's got a great take on this. | ||
| The guy at Netflix said, look, we're not really competing with anybody at this point other than sleep. | ||
| There is only so many hours a day that people can consume content. | ||
| And I think about this now when everybody's going to have their own streaming service and when everybody's going to have all of this different competition rolling in, there are only so many hours. | ||
| And so developing diehard fans is important. | ||
| And I don't know that sports is doing that with 10, 12, 15 year old kids. | ||
| What do you think the next evolution of all of this is? | ||
| The sports stuff, the politics stuff. | ||
| You mentioned the audio side. | ||
| There's the YouTube side, just All of these. | ||
| You mentioned a contract ending. | ||
| I mean, where do you see it going for all of us, for you, et cetera? | ||
| I think everything's becoming one. | ||
| When I started, I would dream of getting on an ESPN or Fox or CBS on television. | ||
| I'm done that now. | ||
| I would rather have a powerful YouTube channel of my own than be on any television network in America at this point. | ||
| And I think what's interesting is you're now seeing the TV people. | ||
| And I was a little bit on the front edge of this, but they're taking the people from the internet and giving them television shows and sometimes not even producing it. | ||
| They're just like, hey, we're taking this and we're going to put it on television. | ||
| And so I think what you're seeing is everything's coming together. | ||
| And I think ultimately being smart, original, funny, authentic, you got to be at least one of those four. | ||
| If you hit all four, your audience gets bigger. | ||
| I think audiences for the big shows are going to get bigger. | ||
| I think there's going to be like a hollowing out where there is either you're huge or you don't matter. | ||
| And I think the battle to be huge is going to be colossal because like you and I, we had to build audiences on the internet. | ||
| I like to use the analogy where like Bane, you know, like we were born in the darkness. | ||
| We were born in it. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| You, you know, I didn't even see the light, whatever that phrase is. | ||
| You know, when you're on television or you're in a newspaper or these other media companies, you only have to beat like two or three people, right? | ||
| If you're on Fox News, you just have to beat the moron on MSNBC at CNN. | ||
| When you're on the internet, you have to be better than like a thousand people. | ||
| And so the quality of content on the internet to me, because competition makes everybody better, has to be way better in general than what you would find on newspapers or websites back in the day or certainly on television. | ||
| So I think we're going to have a huge battle royale. | ||
| And I think you're already starting to see it. | ||
| Big media companies are going to try to go buy the guys and gals who already have audiences because they're aware that they don't create stars anymore. | ||
| And it used to be like you could snap your fingers. | ||
| Hey, the friends kids are all going to, everybody's going to, there's that great story where it's like they go out to dinner in Vegas and they're like, your show is about to start. | ||
| This is the last time you're all going to be able to be together and be anonymous. | ||
| Netflix front page, Fox News, maybe. | ||
| I think they're like the last two places that can actually still make stars. | ||
| Otherwise, you've got to fight it out in the mud of the internet and over time produce good content and create an audience. | ||
| Right. | ||
| It's so interesting. | ||
| The chair itself used to mean something. | ||
| That's right. | ||
| They could just put you in the chair and it would mean something. | ||
| That's why I always, you know, this Abby Phillips on CNN, she strikes me as so dim and untalented and not bright or anything. | ||
| And I'm like, lady, they just put you in a chair and one day they're just going to move you out of that chair. | ||
| It's as simple as that. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| And look, these executives. | ||
| Or Cole Bear even who you said. | ||
| Yeah, no, it took a lot of money to dance around with the vaccine. | ||
| And by the way, not just those guys. | ||
| It's the executives used to make a lot of money to decide who's the best. | ||
| Now I think the internet, the public at large decides. | ||
| It used to be top down. | ||
| We're going to make you famous. | ||
| Now I think it's bottom up. | ||
| And I think all that's coming together. | ||
| Well, Clay Travis, I have a feeling we'll do this again, but I'm off staring at nothing right now, probably. | ||
| And you're still working. | ||
| So who's really winning here? | ||
| You know, you're winning. | ||
| You're winning. | ||
| At some point, I'm going to take, I kid my wife. | ||
| I'm going to take my phone. | ||
| I'm going to throw it as far into the ocean as I can. | ||
| I'm going to vanish for like six months, just travel. | ||
| Nobody's going to know where I am. | ||
| I don't know what it's going to be, but it's going to happen. | ||
| You know, I think I saw some of the plans for one of those houses you're building, and I think you'll be okay. | ||
| I think we're doing okay. | ||
| Good to see you, my man. | ||
| Good to see you as well. | ||
| If you're tired of the mainstream media circus and want more honest conversations, go check out our media playlist. | ||
| And if you want to watch full interviews on a wide variety of topics, watch our full episode playlist all right over here. |
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