May 22, 2021 - Rubin Report - Dave Rubin
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| Hey guys, this is a quick public service announcement before my interview with David Horowitz. | ||
| You know, David Horowitz actually said a couple lines that we are being forced to censor because of the YouTube rules. | ||
| We have never done something like this before. | ||
| And as far as I know, David Horowitz is a free citizen. | ||
| in the free country of the United States who is entitled to free speech. | ||
| That being said, I can't risk having this channel deleted from YouTube, and that basically is what would happen if we went ahead and aired it unedited. | ||
| So you will hear some bleeps in this interview. | ||
| If you would like to hear what David Horowitz, a free man in a free country, actually said, you can check out the full video at rubenreport.locals.com. | ||
| And quick shout out to Susan Wojcicki over at YouTube. | ||
| People go along with the crowd. | ||
| It's survival. | ||
| It's very... When I was 35 and left the left, I lost every friend that I had in life. | ||
| And I had to start all over again. | ||
| And when that happened, it seemed impossible. | ||
| But I've had a good life afterwards, so it's possible. | ||
| But I think most people are just afraid of losing their friends. | ||
| That's pretty much... And that's why the left is so vicious. | ||
| in the way it characterizes its opponents. | ||
| And because of that, it keeps everybody in line. | ||
| They don't wanna be called racist and white supremacist and all that. | ||
|
unidentified
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(upbeat music) | |
| I'm Dave Rubin and joining me is the original "Why I Left the Left Guy" | ||
| as well as the author of around 20 books. | ||
| I couldn't even figure out how many, including his most recent, | ||
| "The Enemy Within, How a Totalitarian Movement is Destroying America." | ||
| David Horowitz, welcome back to The Rubin Report. | ||
| Thanks for having me, Dave. | ||
| I'm glad to have you back on. | ||
| So first off, you've written at least 20 books. | ||
| I mean, do you even know at this point? | ||
| No, I actually don't. | ||
| But it's like that. | ||
| I've written like four in the last two years. | ||
| Yeah, you are a prolific writer. | ||
| I have many of your books on my shelf. | ||
| But let's quickly, before we get into the new book, and you've predicted, I mean, you really have been right about so much. | ||
| And I wonder if that makes you feel good or depressed. | ||
| But before I do anything else, you sort of are the original why I left The Left Guy. | ||
| For people that haven't seen our original interview, we'll link to it down below. | ||
| But you sort of 30 years before me made that move I suspect you feel pretty good about it after coming from a family that was communist and socialist and being a lefty, and then finally Reagan broke you, and here you are. | ||
| It's hard to feel good about being right about such terrible things that have happened to our country. | ||
| Yeah, I was raised by communists. | ||
| I was the editor of the largest magazine of the new left. | ||
| And I left the left when I realized, as you did eventually, Um, that is not about peace and justice. | ||
| It's a hate America left. | ||
| These people are, they're totalitarians. | ||
| They want to control every aspect of your life down to the pronouns. | ||
| Um, and that makes them very, very dangerous. | ||
| It's a, it's a crypto religion, as I said, for a long time, uh, they believe in a redemption, but they think the redeemers can be politicians. | ||
| Please. | ||
| There can never be a world that's just because it's made up of people who are the problem. | ||
| That's the perception of Janet. | ||
| Our whole saga, as told in Genesis in the Bible, had paradise. | ||
| It was better than the Green New Deal. | ||
| But there was only one thing you had to do to stay in paradise, and that was not to want to do evil. | ||
| And it's mind-boggling to me because of the You have all these live television, these television shows about murders, about how terrible people are. | ||
| If they just showed you the cruelty to animals that people are capable of, you could never believe in a world redeemed by radical assortment. | ||
| Yeah, well, I suspect that the mortals on the cover of this book are not the mortals that you think are going to get us to redemption. | ||
| I mean, this is pretty much all of the bad guys right here. | ||
| That's the favorite part of my contribution to the book. | ||
| I designed that cover. | ||
| There you go, you design the cover with the headshots, with the headshots of some radicals. | ||
| Do you believe, is it your position, that they all are equally radical? | ||
| Like, is the Ilhan Omar, say, AOC, Ayanna Pressley thing, or Rashida Tlaib thing, is that as, is that more radical than, say, Pelosi, Schumer, Biden, or is it all just the same thing at this point? | ||
| One thing in the left in that is that there are very few serious people. | ||
| We're living on so much misinformation and ignorance. | ||
| So I think, you know, people go along with the crowd. | ||
| It's survival. | ||
| It's very, when I was 35 and left the left, I lost every friend that I had in life. | ||
| And I had to start all over again. | ||
| And when that happened, it seemed impossible. | ||
| But I've had a good life afterwards. | ||
| So it's possible. | ||
| But I think most people, I'm just afraid of losing their friends. | ||
| That's pretty much. | ||
| And that's why the left is so vicious in the way it characterizes its opponents. | ||
| And, you know, because of that, it keeps everybody in line. | ||
| They don't want to be called racist and white supremacist and all that. | ||
| I think we're the sad reality is that we're in the early stages of a fascist state. | ||
| And I use that word advisedly. | ||
| If you think of the... I just lost a friend of 70 years, Ron Radosh, who wrote a story about it. | ||
| Because I questioned the election results in 2020, I lose a friend of 70 years, when there's all these irregularities that are obvious and when nobody has done an audit of the election. | ||
| And when the Democrats have challenged every Republican presidential victory, Since 2000, 2000, 2004, of course, the Trump election. | ||
| And then if you look what happened on January 6th, this is the great crime of conservatives. | ||
| First of all, Trump's speech, basically, not basically, literally, in so many words, he said, I want you to protest peacefully and patriotically. | ||
| I want you to stiffen the spines of weak Republicans who are afraid to challenge this election result. | ||
| And if you fail, he said, then what you must do is go home and primary them. | ||
| You can't imagine a more democratic, peaceful statement than that. | ||
| Okay, so those people went and for whatever reason, some of them got out of control. | ||
| And the crime they've been charged, actually charged with, is trespassing. | ||
| There are people who are still in jail. | ||
| It's now five months without bail for trespassing. | ||
| And what was the Democrats' reaction? | ||
| They called it an armed insurrection, even though there was not a single armed confiscator. | ||
| Zero. | ||
| Zero. | ||
| It was actually a fairly peaceful protest when you think about everything that happened all summer with Democrat support. | ||
| They didn't take the Capitol. | ||
| They didn't destroy a lot of things. | ||
| And the only person who was murdered or was killed was a Trump supporter. | ||
| And her murderer is protected by Pelosi. | ||
| We still don't know his name, and there are not going to be any charges. | ||
| And it was videoed by a journalist who's showing that she was completely non-threatening. | ||
| She was unarmed, she's small, and she was threatening nobody when she was killed. | ||
| That journalist, a Hispanic, is in jail for being there and being a journalist. | ||
| If this isn't fascism, I don't know what is, but it's worse than that. | ||
| Because Pelosi, remember she said Republicans are enemies of the state? | ||
| Remember the Democrats, the far left in the Democratic, which is a pretty dominant caucus in the Democrat party. | ||
| Call for the expulsion, actually, of 100 Republicans from the House for questioning the election. | ||
| Josh Hawley and Ted Cruz were singled out by the Democrat leadership to be removed from the Senate because they questioned an election, when the Democrats have done this every election in recent memory. | ||
| Hillary Clinton still has a tweet up right now about the illegitimate presidency of Donald Trump. | ||
| Yeah, exactly. | ||
| They never accepted Trump yet. | ||
| This is supposed to be a threat to our democracy that you raise, and anybody who's looked at the evidence knows that there were humongous irregularities, to put a nice term on it, during the election. | ||
| But then Nancy Pelosi orders 25,000 troops into the Capitol at a cost of half a billion dollars for a non-existent, non-specified threat. | ||
| What is that but to send a message to conservatives That they're gunning for us. | ||
| Then the head of the military orders a two-month stand-down to conduct a witch-hunt of so-called extremists in the military, then in the Capitol Police, then in Homeland Security. | ||
| Then the Justice Department announces they're going to allocate $89 million to investigate extremists, meaning conservatives, all over the country. | ||
| It's so reminiscent of the Reichstag fire. | ||
| Hitler was elected in a democracy, the Weimar Republic. | ||
| He was elected chancellor. | ||
| He gets into power, and the first thing the Nazis do is they burn down their own capital, called the Reichstag, blame it on a Dutch communist, and pass the Reichstag Fire Act to criminalize dissent, which is what the Democrats have been doing ever since Donald Trump was elected. | ||
| criminalize dissent, and establish the Third Reich. | ||
| One thing that my book, The Enemy Within, does is I document, if you look at the Democrats' agenda, it's not about getting rid of Trump. | ||
| It's not about winning an election. | ||
| It's about establishing a one-party state. | ||
| Stack the Supreme Court. | ||
| That's to abolish the independent judiciary. | ||
| Abolish the Electoral College, which was designed to force presidential candidates to compete in battleground states where they didn't have a majority, thus force them to compromise. | ||
| Our whole system is built on compromise. | ||
| That's why we've only had one civil war and no successful coup d'etats. | ||
| The Democrat program is a fascist program. | ||
| The only Republicans who are legitimate are those like Liz Cheney. | ||
| Right, they love Liz Cheney now because she's a pet. | ||
| So you lay all of this out in the book. | ||
| It's quite extraordinary, actually. | ||
| And as I said, you've been right about a lot of stuff way before a lot of people. | ||
| So what do you think the average conservative, and I now use that term in a broad sense, if you believe America is good, You're a conservative, as far as I'm concerned. | ||
| What do you think the average conservative can do to fight this? | ||
| Because it feels like the deck is completely stacked against us. | ||
| Well, Republican conservatives have been asleep for 50 years while the Democrats have taken over our culture. | ||
| I wrote five books on the universities. | ||
| One of them people paid a little attention to, but the Republican Party organized academic freedom campaigns And I got no real support out of the Republican Party. | ||
| But between Obama and, I call him the Alzheimer puppet, and Biden, one of the nastiest human beings on the planet, I don't know how he gets his reputation for being a nice guy. | ||
| They've begun to wake people up. | ||
| And Donald Trump has given Our country and patriots a great gift. | ||
| And that is he has created the first mass conservative movement in our history. | ||
| When I came into the right in the mid 80s, 40 years ago now, looked around and said, where's the ground army? | ||
| They were all my ex comrades on the left or they had 100 organizations or 200 to harass and threaten and defame Politicians, until they got into their program, and corporations. | ||
| Corporations are basically cowards. | ||
| They don't want to lose customers. | ||
| That's their bottom line. | ||
| But if you harass them enough, they will respond. | ||
| And it's interesting, already the backlash has caused them. | ||
| Disney just pulled back its racist program. | ||
| I long to see people get in the face of teachers, of principals, of superintendents, of schools, of school boards, who are indoctrinating their children and hate America, garbage. | ||
| And you know, we're so backward. | ||
| I was watching Fox, and they're talking about the 1619 Project, and they're talking about the 20 slaves. | ||
| They weren't slaves. | ||
| I mean, I've read Nell Painter, who was a black leftist Princeton historian, on the subject. | ||
| They were indentured servants. | ||
| And slavery was actually outlawed in Virginia in 1619. | ||
| And Virginia wasn't America in 1619. | ||
| It was a British colony. | ||
| This is supposed to be our founding, according to these liars. | ||
| And yet, You know, if you look at Fox, they're not saying anything. | ||
| They don't know the facts! | ||
| Right, to be clear, we were not a nation until about 150 years later. | ||
| So the idea that the nation was founded on something that happened 150 years before, when everyone was dead, seemed a little odd. | ||
| Exactly, it's just terrible. | ||
| So what does the future... I want to see a sit-in at the headquarters of Twitter, denouncing their censorship, embarrassing them, That's what's really needed, and I see the stirrings of it all over the place. | ||
| There are people organized, particularly in the schools, and that gives me hope. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Do you think, though, that since you brought up Twitter, that the big tech part of this is the part that makes the asymmetry so out of whack? | ||
| It would be one thing if it was slightly out of whack, but now the way we get information is so tilted that people can't coordinate properly or can't even get the information properly or agree on what's true. | ||
| Change is coming. | ||
| The one thing about tech is it's always changing. | ||
| And what's it called? | ||
| Substack already is a media outlet. | ||
| It has a lot of people who are second thoughters like you on it. | ||
| People with impeccable leftist credentials who are really upset about the cancel culture. | ||
| And just the terms we use. | ||
| Cancel culture. | ||
| It's book burning. | ||
| It's what the Nazis did in the 30s. | ||
| You can't just burn books today because you got a digital universe that you can't. | ||
| But that's what it is. | ||
| I would like to see people. | ||
| I mean, I know that I'm not making myself popular by referring to the Biden administration as fascist, but technically that's what it is. | ||
| And I tell you, if we don't stop them, they will put us in re-education camps. | ||
| They've already telegraphed that. | ||
| The conservatives are Yahoo racists who have to be reprogrammed. | ||
| Do we get to share a gulag as the Why I Left the Left guys? | ||
| That would be nice. | ||
| That's very probable. | ||
| Very probable, great. | ||
| Gulag Archipelago. | ||
| That book really moved me at the time. | ||
| Yeah, well, you know I toured with Jordan Peterson and he often brought up the Gulag Archipelago for the same reason. | ||
| Thank my lucky stars for Jordan Peterson, otherwise I'd be feeling guilty about all the things I wasn't writing. | ||
| One part I would like to mention is the chapters on the blacklist. | ||
| It's very, very serious. | ||
| I'm not going to name the outlet, but I wrote this article about how Ron Radosh had Joined the fascists and slipped a knife between my ribs. | ||
| I've got the piece right here. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I tried to place it with a very prominent conservative media site, but they're also on Facebook. | ||
| You know, if you're a big media site, you've got to be on all the platforms. | ||
| And they said that Facebook would shut or just close it down if it appeared there. | ||
| People have to understand we are in the early stages of a fascist state. | ||
| We do not. | ||
| America is no longer a free country. | ||
| Its freedom is hard won by courageous people like yourself, who are willing to stand up and take the slings and arrows. | ||
| So what do we do then? | ||
| I mean, okay, so we can sit in at Twitter. | ||
| I mean, I know you're a fighter. | ||
| You've been doing this for a long time. | ||
| I mean, what do we really do? | ||
| So is Trump the only thing that can save us? | ||
| Do we need the return of Trump to lead the Republicans? | ||
| Like, it ain't gonna be Liz Cheney. | ||
| Here's what I think about Trump. | ||
| You know, people are talking about Ron DeSantis, whom I admire, and in my blacklist story, I tell how they used first, You know, they call me a notorious racist, and because he spoke at my events, they use that. | ||
| And when I say they, I'm talking about the so-called liberal media, New York Magazine, Washington Post, use that to try to taint him and destroy him. | ||
| And he has a delivery, which a lot of people think is, you know, more user-friendly, shall we say, than Trump's. | ||
| And I hope he's on the ticket, actually. | ||
| But the reason that I believe that Trump is bound to be the leader is... He got 75 million votes despite four years of unbelievable slander and lies directed at him and no credit for what he had done. | ||
| But I think ordinary Americans, patriotic Americans, see this guy as someone, here he was, a billionaire, living the life, and he put himself and his family through all this to save the country, basically. | ||
| And I mean, those credentials are golden. | ||
| You really can't beat them. | ||
| And I think his aggression is necessary. | ||
| The reason the Democrats hate him is because he called them out. | ||
| You know, call them out as racists for their control of the inner cities. | ||
| Call them out for their betrayal. | ||
| You know, I will say as somebody who's been in politics 50, 60 years, I had no idea that they were selling us out in trade deals the way they were. | ||
| I mean, it's Bush. | ||
| It's Bush, Clinton, Obama. | ||
| Either they were too lazy To cut decent deals for Americans, or they just didn't care about fleecing our country for Chinese communists. | ||
| They're genocidal! | ||
| Dictators were crying out tears. | ||
| Well, do you think that that's what it really is? | ||
| That in many ways, just we've gone through several generations at this point, or at least several decades of just leadership and an institutional elite that has sold us out at every level. | ||
| So there almost isn't enough of what is American left to defend the documents that freed all of us. | ||
| Yeah, well, we have to have a leader who fights and that's Trump. | ||
| Yeah, what American would blow up the southern border in the middle of a global pandemic with new viruses, variations, variants, as they call them, appearing all the time? | ||
| Biden has just led 100,000 COVID carriers into the country, which shows what a liar he is every time he's accused Trump of killing coronavirus patients. | ||
| He's killing them. | ||
| He's killing Americans. | ||
| The child abuse is epic on the border. | ||
| It's just unreal. | ||
| And the denial of reality. | ||
| You know, this is the norm. | ||
| It's not the norm. | ||
| It's like 20 times whatever. | ||
| I forget the actual statistics. | ||
| But they're humongous in terms of the deterioration. | ||
| of the country, the amount of criminals who are being let in, the amount of people who have not pledged allegiance to our society. | ||
| America's unique. | ||
| You know, it's our culture. | ||
| Something leftists never understand. | ||
| Culture determines things. | ||
| How is it that Japan, which has no natural resources, is a first world country? | ||
| Mexico, which has oil, which has had its independence for a hundred years or whatever, you know, is flooding refugees into America. | ||
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unidentified
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What's the difference between Japan and Mexico? | |
| It's all about culture. | ||
| And America had a great culture, which is being systematically dismantled by the Democrats. | ||
| So as someone that gets this, and as I said, you've been right on so much of this way earlier, but you're still now, you're losing friends that you've had for 70 years. | ||
| People always ask me this, maybe you have a better answer than I have. | ||
| If someone's kind of wavering right now and they're kind of waking up to some of this stuff, because I think a lot of people are. | ||
| I think people are shocked at how horrific the Biden administration has been and how out of control wokeism is. | ||
| What's the move that you've made to really help people wake up beyond just handing them facts? | ||
| I mean, we know that that doesn't always work. | ||
| Yeah, I mean, this book has a lot about the race issue and the way they deploy racism and sexism as weapons I think the biggest thing is if somebody is truly in transition, it means they're reading and thinking or listening and thinking. | ||
| When I, you know, my friend, our former friend Radosh, it's been three years, I could not ever get him. | ||
| I would write an email and we had all kinds of ground rules to protect our egos or what have you. | ||
| Couldn't get him to consider a single argument. | ||
| I said in my book on Trump blitz, I said in the manuscript of this book, The Enemy Within, | ||
| and in the article that he and Stern wrote for the New Republic, | ||
| there's not a single argument that I give that's engaged. | ||
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unidentified
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You're really trying to get me booted from YouTube, huh? | |
| (laughing) | ||
| You know, I try to think about those things. | ||
| I try never to get people into situations that they can't handle, but I know that you can handle it. | ||
|
unidentified
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Thanks, David. | |
| I can't clip my wings. | ||
| Fair enough. | ||
| I don't bring you on to clip your wings. | ||
| I'll deal with those guys. | ||
| Everything rests I'm creating or energizing this mass movement and directing it to protest this, taking back the Congress, dealing with the tech companies. | ||
| You know, I mean, Trump was in power for four years. | ||
| It's like Republicans there for a decade. | ||
| They said they're going to repeal and replace Obamacare, and they never did. | ||
| That's the huge problem. | ||
| You know, conservatives are always complaining about the media, which is fair. | ||
| It's a lying Disgusting media, racist, you know, CNN, they're just filled with liars and racists, and not to mention MSNBC. | ||
| But the real problem is the politeness of conservatives. | ||
| You know, conservatives are being called white supremacists, white nationalists, traitors, enemies of the state, insurrectionists, actually. | ||
| And what do Republicans call Democrats? | ||
| Liberals. | ||
| You can't win that war. | ||
| We're the only liberals. | ||
| The only people in this country who want to hear two sides to a conversation are conservatives. | ||
| And you know that. | ||
| All you have to do is turn on Fox or Newsmax, the conservative media. | ||
| They're always entertaining the other side because I think conservatives are confident we can win the arguments. | ||
| We're not afraid of them. | ||
| And if we're wrong, we're capable of changing our views on a subject. | ||
| David, defending my liberal beliefs has become a conservative position. | ||
| Listen, it's always a pleasure talking to you because I love the fact that people did this before me and people will do this after me, and I appreciate all the fight. | ||
| You fled California, so you left me here. | ||
| So I hope to see you one of these days, but I'm guessing it's not because you're coming back here. | ||
| No, you'll be on your way to Florida or some other place. | ||
| And you can stop on the way and visit me. | ||
| The book is Enemy Within. | ||
| Thank you so much, David. | ||
| We'll see each other again on your podcast, because I got another book coming out in the fall. | ||
| Naturally. | ||
| I will gladly have you on. | ||
| Thank you, my friend. | ||
| If you're looking for more honest and thoughtful conversations about politics instead of nonstop yelling, check out our politics playlist. | ||
| And if you want to watch full interviews on a variety of topics, watch our full episode playlist all right over here. |
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