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June 7, 2022 - Dennis Prager Show
01:10:13
Is There Any Hope?
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Hi everybody!
Welcome to Dennis and Julie.
Being traditional believers in gender-based names, I'm Dennis, and that's Julie.
Hello.
Dennis Prager, Julie Hartman.
And how long?
What is this now?
Our eighth?
What is it?
Two months now?
I think we're over 10. Really?
Yeah, I think we're 12 or 13. Number 13. Holy crow.
There you go.
No, that's serious.
And we get together every week to talk about life and about ourselves.
Not because we're narcissists, but because the personal makes this stuff much more real.
We're not just here to philosophize about life, though we certainly do that.
I've never had a broadcast, I've never had a podcast with any partner in my 40 years of radio.
40 years in a month.
So you can only imagine how highly I think of Julie.
I was going to ask you, Julie, I didn't even tell you I'd ask you because we really do like to keep this spontaneous.
So, I'm going to venture into the realm of the H-bomb for a moment.
And for those of you who don't know, H-bomb is the way kids who attend Harvard refer to saying they're at Harvard.
It immediately sort of changes conversations, or at least the way people are viewed.
When they drop, so on, and where do you go, Harvard?
And so it's called the H-bomb, and it's properly so.
However, this is my question, you're not a Harvard student anymore.
No, I'm not.
I'm an alum.
Yes, but there's a big difference.
Because people don't say, where did you go?
They do say, where are you going?
That's interesting.
Yeah, you're right.
I haven't thought about that before.
Oh, that may keep you up at night.
It may.
Well, it doesn't take much to keep you up at night.
That's true.
I can never sleep.
But no, isn't that, no, that's really, that's phenomenally important.
Oh, you're at college?
Oh, where?
What college?
It's the most logical question.
But the moment you're out of college, no one ever asks, where did you go?
That's true.
Yeah, I hadn't thought about it that way before.
I guess I remember when I was in high school and I was getting into the realm of applying to college, I did start asking people where they went because that was my world and I was very interested.
But besides that, you're right, I never really cared and now I don't really care.
That's what I wanted to know.
I don't care at all anymore.
Isn't it?
So it's a real change in your life from Harvard student to not Harvard student.
You know, it's funny.
I had a dream last night that graduation was next week.
And I was in my dorm room again with my roommates and we were getting ready for graduation.
And then I wake up and I'm thinking to myself, oh my gosh, I'm here.
It was a week and a half ago.
So psychologically, I don't think I've processed it.
That's right.
That's why I asked it to you.
I didn't know how you processed it.
The fact that you didn't...
Realize what I had said.
Nobody's going to ask you anymore.
I know.
Oh, no.
Well, that's the question.
No, you know I don't care.
I know that.
I know.
God, do I know.
And obviously, I don't.
But I was happy that you were there.
I was.
In other words, I was happy that I could say to a liberal, I didn't care to a conservative.
Oh, well, yeah, she's at Harvard.
Because they worship that stuff.
They do.
You know, I was talking the other day with one of my family members who's very conservative, and he said to me, you know, I think your going to Harvard will hurt you.
Oh, that's funny.
Because people may think that you're just one of them.
And I thought about it for a moment, and I just, you know, growing up, you just could never fathom that going to Harvard would harm you in some kind of way.
But maybe he's right.
I tend to see it a little bit differently because...
I mean, if I do say so myself, I think that I stand out as someone who's particularly courageous for having gone to one of these institutions and speaking out.
Just in case any of you don't know how true that is, I do want to tell you.
No, there's proof.
She wrote a piece for the Wall Street Journal in the middle of the COVID lockdown saying that essentially her fellow students at Harvard were sheep.
I want to comment on that because this is a very...
It's funny that I already had a comment and this fits into it.
What triggered my original thought was your roommates.
And you'll see how I'm tying it in.
So here is a student at Harvard writing that her fellow students are sheep-like.
So I was going to ask you earlier...
Or even comment on the fact that you were close to your six roommates.
Very, very close.
Who were a variety of viewpoints and backgrounds and so on.
So you have done something which is not common.
You have spoken your mind as an outlier and been liked.
Yes.
I'm very lucky.
It's rare.
And we mentioned this.
During our last podcast, but I was expecting to come to campus and really be a social priya, and I wasn't, Dennis.
In fact, I think a lot of people were drawn to what I did.
Of course, there were some people who were bad to me.
But in general, I really thought you'd get flack for the Wall Street Journal article.
I thought I would, too.
You know, just a small correction.
You said it was during the COVID lockdown.
It was in February, just a few months ago, when school had these draconian measures.
Oh, yeah, the draconian measures.
Correct.
Thank you.
That's correct.
We were masked, and I mean, you had to wear masks in the classroom, and you had to wear masks in the gym.
It was actually crazy.
In the dining hall, you had to wear a mask to get your food from the buffet, but then once you sat down, you could take it off.
They had these bizarre rules.
You couldn't have an indoor gathering of over 10 people.
And the thing that stunned me, and it continues to stun me, no longer really about COVID, but just about so many of these other issues that we discuss, is the zombie-like acquiescence of the people around me.
I remember I was in a restaurant with my roommates.
We were celebrating one of their birthdays in January or February.
And we walk into the restaurant.
We're wearing a mask.
You go up to the front.
You know, you say the name that the reservation's under, and then you go to the table and you take off the mask.
And I was just looking around, and everyone is just blindly doing it.
And it's so dystopian.
And I thought to myself, does it not occur to anyone that this is weird?
And you know what, Dennis, the response that I got when I published that article was, well, you know, Julie, you may be right.
You may be right that it's ridiculous to wear a mask on a treadmill, or it's ridiculous to...
Get your food, wearing a mask, and then take it off.
But is it really that big of a deal?
It doesn't really matter that much.
It's just a mask.
And I don't understand why that's their response.
I remember you said this to me once.
Wearing a shower cap outside isn't technically a big deal, but it's completely irrational and weird.
Well, I have a more serious reason for...
The foolishness for assessing the foolishness of that argument.
Oh, it's just a mask.
So is the veil on Muslim women, is that just a veil?
Right.
That's an excellent response.
Yes, I don't understand.
I've always considered it dehumanizing.
I think the veil is an immoral act.
Immoral.
To have a woman hide her face.
Men aren't.
I mean, if that's not...
I'm hardly in the sexist camp, but that's as pure an example of sexism as it exists on Earth.
Oh, it's not dehumanizing.
Okay, why don't you wear one?
Of course, the face is whom we are.
I'm sorry.
For better or for worse, that's who we are.
We're not our legs.
I mean, it's just the way it is.
We know people by their face.
We read them.
We feel we understand them.
We relate to it.
It's everything.
And you hide it?
And, oh, it's just a mask?
Oh, please.
And, you know, I'm sorry to pull this line, but these are Harvard students saying this nonsense.
I know.
There is no correlation between brains and wisdom.
None.
Zero, zero, zero.
And this is another example of it.
Well, I also had a debate recently with one of my friends, and we were talking about – actually, I say it was recently.
It was about a year ago.
Don't you ever do that when you say, oh, the other day I was having – and then it was 10 years old.
Don't start me.
So it was a little bit...
It was a few months ago.
And it was right when...
Do you remember during the Black Lives Matter campaign, all the newspapers started capitalizing B and Black?
That's right.
It totally changed.
And I remember, I thought that was so odd.
And you actually, Dennis, wrote a fabulous column on this.
because this summer when I worked for you, I would sometimes read and edit your columns on why that just makes no sense to capitalize the B in black and not capitalize the W in white.
And I think the New York Times, I want to get this right.
So Sean, please fact check me and let me know if I'm right about this.
I think one of the reasons that the New York Times said that they don't capitalize the W is because it's white supremacists to do so.
And again, I was having a debate about this with one of my peers, and she said, okay, well, what does it matter?
It's a letter.
Who cares if it's capitalized or not?
And my response to her was, well, if it doesn't matter, then why don't you do it my way?
It clearly does matter to you if you're insisting on it.
It's the perfect analogy.
This is an almost consistent response from folks on the left.
What are you making a big deal?
So they'll have tampons in men's rooms.
Men's rooms.
What are you making a big deal?
Everything is...
So if it's not a big deal, why are you doing it?
Exactly.
They do it, and then when we say, don't do it, why is it a big deal?
Clearly it is a big deal if you're insisting that we do it your way.
Well, that's my argument for the guys who say to women after dating them for six years...
And they go, so I go, why don't you marry?
Oh, marry, it's just a piece of paper.
So if it's just a piece of paper, what's the big deal?
You're right.
It's a phony argument.
Women give it too.
Well, oh, I don't know.
Why do I care if I get married?
It's just a piece of paper.
Oh, really?
Then why not do it?
They don't believe it's just a piece of paper.
Exactly.
And they don't believe that the mask is insignificant.
And they don't believe that it's insignificant that we're putting a tampon...
I don't know, machines in men's rooms, or capitalizing B in black.
By the way, I don't know if you know this, about that first column, so I'm syndicated by Creator Syndicate, my column each week.
So I wrote black, and I see it on the internet that night after I submitted it, and black is capitalized.
Oh, God.
They edited it.
Because that is the new rule.
So did you insist?
Oh, it is never again capitalized.
By the way, they are starting to capitalize white.
Oh, they are?
I don't know if the New York Times is, but I am seeing it more and more often.
That's right.
By the way, just forgive me.
I'm just curious, since they say that Asians are yellow, the yellow race, the red race, it's basically yellow, red.
Do they say that?
Black, brown.
I thought so.
Well, what do they say Asians are?
Well, I was always taught in school that...
Yellow is wrong?
It's wrong.
Okay, so drop yellow.
So red.
Is red right for the American Indian?
No, I haven't heard that either.
So what about brown?
Brown is fine.
So will they capitalize brown?
That's all I'm asking.
I'm curious.
Right.
I don't know.
I've never seen it capitalized.
I've never...
I've seen BIPOC. I've seen black, capitalized...
BIPOC is...
Black indigenous people of color.
So I think brown fits into that category.
I have no idea.
The thing that I can't understand is why can't these people see...
Okay, maybe, you know...
Maybe capitalizing one letter isn't a big deal.
I mean, of course, I think it is.
But can't they see that these seemingly small things indicate huge, huge irrationality?
And doesn't that somehow register with them?
You know, Dennis, another thing I wonder is I'm having these debates with people my age, and often I say to them, you know, it's very in vogue for you to support these ideas now.
But what if you went to school and your kids had to wear a mask or your kids were being taught these?
Radical gender theories.
How would you feel?
But I don't know.
I mean, we see a lot of parents who are completely fine with it, so maybe that's not the best observation.
That is correct.
If enough parents opposed it, it wouldn't happen.
But why are you sabotaging your own children?
That's so sick to me.
Well, the sick part, that is sick, but there's a sicker part even to me.
And I know you've heard me say this.
I think you've heard me.
Actually, I hope you didn't.
Until, I don't know, the last few years, all of my life, I associated women with protection of children's innocence.
I thought that was built in to females.
I now learn I may have romanticized female nature.
I don't tend to romanticize either men or women.
But I now realize it may not be.
Or it is, and the left is so powerful, or better, society is so powerful, it knocked out one of the most basic instincts of women to protect children's innocence.
The left's gender ideology has seeped into children's classrooms.
Medical terminology and into our everyday life.
It's producing a generation of psychologically infantile and confused young people.
This radical ideology is trying to erase the people who brought us all into this world.
Women.
Now Matt Walsh of the Daily Wire is taking matters into his own hands.
He recently embarked on a journey around the world to ask one simple question.
What is a woman?
And you'll be surprised not only how few are capable of answering, but also how many have a completely twisted idea of what a woman really is.
Thankfully, he got the whole experience on film, the documentary they don't want you to see, What is a Woman?
You can check it out today at dailywire.com slash Prager.
Radical gender ideologies have a not-so-secret agenda, and this film exposes them all.
Watch What is a Woman at dailywire.com slash Prager.
It's interesting that you say that, because recently I was having a conversation with one of my male friends at Harvard, and he said to me, and it's such a good observation, and I wholeheartedly agree with it, and he's conservative, when he sits down in the dining hall with a group of women, he's really got to watch what he says.
But when he sits down in the dining hall with a group of men...
He said, I don't know whether they're liberal or conservative or lefty, but it doesn't really matter because most of the time I can say anything and it doesn't make a bit of a difference.
And I hate saying that.
I'm a woman myself.
I wish it were different, but we've got to talk about these things.
It's true.
Women are incredibly emotional and sensitive, especially when it comes to these political issues in a way that men aren't.
However, men, I think, don't stick up anymore.
They see these changes being implemented, I agree with you, probably largely done by women.
But then the men just throw their hands in the air.
Men have been weakened.
Everyone's been weakened.
Right, except for the outliers, two of whom are sitting here, and it's not a brag, it's just a fact.
Even people who can't stand our reviews would acknowledge we're outliers.
We are.
It's lonely being an outlier.
Well, okay, so here I got an answer to that.
It can be.
It can be.
You're right.
I know what you're going to say.
Well, I know you know what I'm going to say because it happened to you.
Yes.
I tell the story in speeches about you, how you went to two weeks of hell after coming on my show and then basically went to heaven and it's because you met so many wonderful people.
In America at this time, this is not like being an outlier in a communist or Nazi country where you're doomed.
Of course.
Right in America, you're an outlier.
You just make new wonderful friends.
Case in point.
Case in point.
Yes, that's right.
God, is that ever true?
Talking about that, I don't know if people know.
I assume I said it the first time that you had sent me an email hoping that I'd respond.
Which was lucky because I don't see most of my mail.
Oh, I know.
As you well know.
By the way, you made, I want to get back to that in a moment, but you made such a telling point.
I loved it.
So Julie read for a few weeks, I would say, all of my mail.
And there's a lot.
Every day.
And you then made the point, if I'm a white supremacist, Why haven't I gotten one email from a fellow white supremacist?
Not one!
And of course, you know, of course sometimes you get crazy emails.
Yeah, but even the crazy emails are not racist or white supremacists.
I guess they didn't get my dog whistle.
I know.
I remember someone said to me right before I started working for you, he said, well, you know, you've got to call out those Prager dog whistles that he gives on the show.
I thought to myself, first of all, that's so idiotic.
What do they even mean by dog whistles?
Well, I'll tell you what they mean.
Since he truly never says anything...
Oh, by the way, it was a she.
Did I say he?
It was she.
Okay.
Since I never said anything in my life remotely racist, because it...
And it takes no effort because I don't have any inclination toward it.
So what they do, and not just to me, but to any of us conservatives, is, ah, it's true.
It's dog whistles.
Which, ironically, only the left hears.
Exactly.
But the proof is in your email, or the proof is not in your email.
Yeah, why aren't they all sending me fan club mails?
I know.
Notice we're opening up a white supremacist group in Birmingham, Alabama.
Could you be our speaker?
Never once did I see anything like that.
I really never saw any bigoted emails.
So she sent me this email.
One of my favorite parts, aside from the great luck that I found it.
For reasons that I have no knowledge of.
You said you sent emails to every Dennis Prager?
I did.
I perused the internet and found all...
I think there are seven or eight Dennis Pragers in the country.
Oh, I feel for them.
I feel for them, too.
Can you imagine being named Ben Shapiro, too?
And not being the Ben Shapiro, or Candace Owens, or really any...
Well, that's right.
You're right.
I think, though...
There are a lot more Ben Shapiros than Dennis Prager.
Yes.
I know one.
I know a Ben Shapiro.
Yeah, exactly.
Candace Owens.
Yeah, that one stick out.
That one, yeah.
But I did email many Dennis Prager's or just however many emails I found.
Did anybody respond?
And one of them wrote back in all caps.
I should show it to you.
It's so funny.
I am not the Dennis Prager.
You want 30 exclamation points.
I can't tell you.
And I'm not being cute at all.
My heart breaks for the guy.
I'm sure he's a leftist.
And he must feel cursed.
It must suck.
Yeah.
Hello, Dennis Prager, if you're listening.
He's not listening.
He's definitely not.
Right, yes, but that's a burden.
It's like, in a far, far more serious genre, if you will, people who have the same names as a mass murderer.
Right.
Oh, there was a...
Oh, God, somebody just told me.
What was Epstein's first name?
Jeffrey.
Jeffrey Epstein.
Somebody told me.
A brilliant guy who I interviewed on the air said, I can't tell you how, his name is Epstein.
Thank God my first name's not Jeffrey.
Oh my gosh, can you imagine?
It's not an uncommon name.
I know people in college who have the last name's Epstein, and even, I think one of them, well, I don't know if I should expose her, but I think one of them gave a speech at either commencement or class day or one of our many events.
And even people in the audience, when they, It's not that uncommon a name.
Madoff would be worse.
Or Manson, maybe.
Manson, oh my god.
Who is, God, maybe she's on a soccer team, or I've played a lot of sports in my life.
One of my teams, and her last name was Oswald.
And I don't know if you know about this, or know this about me, Dennis.
I know a lot about the JFK assassination.
I'm sort of, that's like my one event in history that really captivates me.
So let me, we'll get to Oswald in a second.
I just, do you believe there was a lone shooter?
I'm not going to tell you what I think.
I do.
I think there was a lone shooter.
I do too.
I'll finish with this and then I'll say one thing that I do wonder about.
I do think Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone.
I think that people...
Search for conspiracy theories because it's hard for them to process that one person can do so much damage.
Can so radically change the course of history.
That's exactly my theory.
However, Dennis...
And the fact that he was killed by Jack Ruby, that's what adds a lot to the conspiracy theory.
That, I have to say, gives me pause.
The only quote-unquote conspiracy theory that I have found to be compelling is that the mob did it.
Because...
JFK was sleeping with the mob boss's wife or girlfriend, and I believe that there's evidence that the mob helped him get elected in 1960. And then his brother, RFK, his attorney general, during JFK's presidency, went after the mob.
So the mob was probably like, hey, what the heck?
We helped you out in your...
You know, you're not treating us well.
And that shooting, I mean, first Lee Harvey Oswald shot him in the neck.
And then you see the video and JFK leans over and grabs his neck.
And then he shoots him in the head.
I mean, it's just the most gory, awful video.
That's a mob hit.
Or that at least seems like a mob hit.
The mob, when they kill people, it's so...
They really want it to be a spectacle.
They want people to see it and have it be very gory.
I don't know.
That's one of the...
That's one of the conspiracy theories that I thought may have some validity.
But still, I don't know.
I still think Harvey Oswald acted alone.
I think he acted alone.
I'm not certain, but I think so.
There are people who say the CIA did it.
You think the mob did it?
What?
To clarify, I don't think the mob did it.
Oh, I see.
Okay, fine.
Yeah, I want to make that clear.
So you need to visit...
The Texas School Depository.
Oh, Dennis, I have.
Are you not shocked at how close it is?
I was stunned.
Oh, my gosh.
It is so close.
And when you look at pictures...
By the way, let's explain.
Close to where the cars went by.
It was not a hard shot for Lee Harvey Oswald to have.
No, I could have done it.
So this shows you what a history nerd I am, Dennis.
In high school, my junior year...
Back when, you know, all the schools now, this is another topic of conversation, all of the schools in Los Angeles have gotten really woke and they have lowered their standards at my high school.
Now, homework doesn't count for anything.
Participation doesn't count for anything.
You can retake tests.
Anyway, when I went to my high school, that was not the case.
It was really academically rigorous.
Honestly, I think way past the point of being healthy.
So it was a really hard year.
My mom said to me, you know, Julie, why don't we do something fun this Christmas break?
You've had such a hard year.
What would you like to do?
And you know what my idea of a fun...
Dallas.
Dallas.
I said, please take me to the Texas...
How did your mother react?
Well, Dennis, I actually got this fascination from my mother.
My mother has...
There's a William Manchester book called Death of a President.
I think it was the leading book that came out a few years after the assassination and he interviewed the Kennedy family.
And she gave me that book when I was in ninth grade.
Does she think he acted alone?
Yes.
As some of you may know, just about two weeks ago I graduated from Harvard and I'm very proud of that accomplishment.
But I want to tell you about another great college, the King's College in New York City.
The King's College is a Christian liberal arts school in New York City's financial district, providing a disciplined curriculum with a Christian worldview, both in person and online.
Every program is rooted in a politics, philosophy, and economics core curriculum, which provides students with a framework for understanding the way the world works and how it's influenced.
Because of this, King's graduates are well-rounded, critical thinkers.
I had a Zoom call with some of King's faculty and the president of their college and they told me that King's faculty pride themselves in not sharing their opinions on topics but instead teaching the historical context that roots the issues of the day.
They like to say that students come to King's to earn their opinion.
They don't teach them what to think but how to think.
If you want to find out how you can attend King's College today, go online at tkc.edu.
Don't just go to college, go to King's.
I'll tell you one fishy thing.
That they have not yet released the Warren report.
Correct?
Really?
Is that true?
I don't know.
I don't think the entire thing has been released.
And let's put it this way.
If that's true...
All it does is engender conspiracy theories on this.
This, by the way, is not a left-right issue.
This is one of the few issues that is not a left-right issue.
I think just as many people in both camps think it was alone and just as many people think it was, they may think it was a different group that conspired.
But anyway, this all began with Oswald at Harvard.
Not at Harvard.
It did be...
God, I can't remember what we were talking about.
There was an Oswald...
Oh, yes, we were talking about names.
We were talking about names, and there was a girl who I played sports with, and her last name was Oswald.
So my mom one time was driving me to school, and she's like, you have to figure out if she's related to Lee Harvey Oswald.
And I said, Mom, I'm not going to do that to her.
How are you going to do that?
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah, what am I going to do?
Go up to her and go, oh, hey.
But it just shows you what a fascination we have with this event.
So let me tell you.
So obviously...
For you, this is ancient history.
For me, I was a very young kid, but I vividly recall, vividly recall it happening.
And I want to tell you one interesting reaction I had.
So how old was I? Let me think.
1963. So I was 12. So I... No, no, no, excuse me, 14. That's not true.
I was 14. I was not that young.
I was young.
But the thing that sticks out the most with me, that was a Friday that I recall very well.
So Sunday, I lived in Brooklyn, New York, and I lived a 15-minute walk from the subway station, which was elevated where I was.
And I walked there all the time, you know, if I wanted to.
Get a drink or go to the candy store and get a newspaper.
It's where newspapers were sold.
Candy stores.
Anyway, I'm walking there Sunday morning and I see the subway train go by and I remember what I thought.
The President of the United States was just killed and the trains are running like nothing happened?
And it was a jolt that life goes on no matter what happens.
I have had those thoughts before when something either in my life or in the world happens.
It's just mind-blowing.
And you go, people are just carrying on like everything's fine.
Well, it's my mother, may she rest in peace, was not a philosopher, but she had some good lines.
And she would say regularly, and it sounds like it's trite, but it's not.
Life is for the living.
It's a very intelligent observation.
Yes.
Look, 100 million people were murdered.
I'm not talking about war.
Civilians in the last century.
People just move on.
You know, I think about the war in Ukraine.
I think about the weaker massacre.
I think about, you know, someone was watching the news the other day, and someone got stabbed.
I actually, this is crazy, I was driving over to see my sister, who lives in a group home in Inglewood, and we were driving down one of the streets at 11 a.m., and there was this place that was roped off in front of a hotel, and I looked outside, and all the police were standing around a pool of blood.
Someone had been stabbed.
And again, I just thought to myself, you know, here I am in the car and I look out and someone has just been murdered.
And I just drive right by and continue on with my day.
But what else do you do?
Well, that's why my mother's saying is so accurate.
Life is for the living.
So I think of that when you just said the police were there and there was a pool of blood.
So that engendered another theme in my brain.
It's hard for me to imagine that police in general have the same view of the world that the rest of us have.
All they see is bad.
It's their job.
Nobody else in the world has that job.
Doctors see sick people.
You don't go to your doctor if you're healthy, generally speaking.
So they have also a somewhat jaundiced view of the world, doctors.
They see it through the prism of illness.
But they see a lot more healthy people than cops see nice people.
Right.
So it's interesting because, you know, I'm debating this week, I'm debating the issue of are people innately good, which I think is...
An indefensibly foolish belief that human nature is innately good.
But I'll tell you, there's one group that does not believe that.
Cops.
Well, I was going to say when you were just talking about how all they see is bad, it's not a coincidence that many of them are religious people.
Is that true?
Yes.
Many cops are religious.
I didn't know that.
And it's because you have to have a framework of understanding the world and when you see all of that evil.
You need shock absorbers.
I wonder, I mean, I was thinking the other day about, and this is an especially gory thought, can you imagine being a diver who recovers bodies that drown in the ocean or drown in lakes?
I mean, there are so many jobs.
Well, yeah.
Well, that's true for, you know, folks who do autopsies.
It's true for coroners.
Yeah.
I just...
I can't imagine if they're...
They have to have a...
But you can dissociate with dead bodies.
I don't think cops could dissociate.
Right.
When they just see evil and not to mention there are people who want to kill them.
Especially now.
Whenever I walk down the street and I see a cop or I'm driving, I go out of my way to pull over or to walk up to them and say thank you and please know that there are more people out there who are with you.
I think they know that.
I hope they know that.
Because I do it, you do it, I suspect vast numbers of people are doing it.
But you know, every time, I'm interested to hear, Dennis, if this is your experience too, whenever you speak with a cop.
The response that I almost always get is, thank you, it's really hard right now.
And I actually had a conversation with a cop a few days ago, and he said there are so many people retiring, and the people that we are recruiting into the police force are not high-quality people in the way that they used to be.
It's terrifying.
I had a thought the other day about life.
I don't know how eloquently I'm going to say this.
Bear with me.
People think that when you have a problem, you just have that problem.
But what I have seen in my experience is that if you have one problem, it opens the door up to 50 other things.
And I think about that in a similar way with the defund the police movement.
It has opened this can of worms, this Pandora's box.
It's not just that they are cutting funding from police departments, which has its own set of issues.
It's that now a lot of cops are retiring.
They're not coming into the police force.
They've lost their morale.
It's just, I wish that people saw how wide and far-reaching the effects are.
So it's funny that you should say this, because on my show I just was talking about...
The moment you ask what are the consequences, you become a conservative.
Yes.
That is the question that makes you conservative.
What price is paid?
So I gave the example back to cops.
So in Chicago and now Washington State, unless you have reason to believe that the driver is a murderer, rapist, some violent criminal, You do not go on a chase.
Police are not to chase.
So Chicago just recently had the following story.
The police did not chase a guy who had committed, who had actually, they knew it was a robbed car, and they didn't chase him.
Just a robbery, after all, right?
Right.
And he went on, within, I don't know, an hour or so, he went on to another mugging, He shot the guy twice in the back, once in the head.
The man has had part of his leg amputated.
Oh, God.
Oh, this is the worst part.
He has lost his voice.
His voice box was shattered.
He will speak only through a machine the rest of his life.
Oh, because he was shot there.
Yes.
Because the police didn't chase the guy.
So everybody knows, well, there's a danger that if the police chase, they may hit a civilian.
The car they're chasing may crash into another car.
It's entirely accurate.
I know the price paid for chasing, but the anti-chase crowd never ask the question, what is the price paid for cops not chasing?
You know, this is an observation I have of the left in general.
They will never admit, you know, my mom actually told me the other day, she gave me this advice, she said, never say always and never.
And what's funny about that statement is she started off by saying never.
Anyways, I digress.
What was I saying?
Oh, yes.
The left, they will never admit that any of their policies or positions have bad outcomes to them.
Ever.
That's right.
Well, that's why I said if you ask what is the price, you're a conservative.
Exactly.
I even see this with abortion.
You know, we had a conversation a few podcasts ago about abortion.
It's something that I go back and forth on.
I'm very conflicted.
But I'm able to see the harm of both the pro-life and the pro-choice position.
People who are pro-choice, they will never admit that there are any downsides to their position.
Same thing with illegal immigration.
They will never admit that there's any downside.
I debated a guy on abortion about 30 years ago.
And I... It made such an impact on me.
I remember this.
And I said, you folks seem to regard the unborn as a pimple.
And finally, the guy looked at me and said, that is correct.
I regard the human fetus as a pimple.
And I said, okay, there's no need for a debate.
The debate is over.
If it's a pimple...
Then, of course, you can excise it.
Right.
Up to nine months.
Right?
It's a nine-month-old pimple.
Oh my gosh.
You know, sometimes I... I think I talked to you about this on the phone recently, and I'm glad I'm bringing it up here because it's something I talk to a lot of my conservative friends about.
Do you have any hope for the future?
Maybe I just sound so pessimistic, but I look at the damage that's been done, and the thing that really scares me is not only that this damage is continuing, but what people don't get is that once you've enacted these measures, you can't reverse them.
Even look what I was just talking about in my high school a few minutes ago.
Homework doesn't count.
Participation doesn't count.
You can retake tests.
How, now that they've put these things into place, how can they just go, just kidding, that didn't work out, we're repealing them.
Do you have any hope, Dennis?
Okay, so you've opened up my all-time favorite line.
It's like, you'll understand why in a moment.
So you asked me, is there any hope?
So I want to tell you a story about that question.
When I was your age, in my 20s, I went to Israel every year.
And I had a dear friend, a man considerably older than me, and I stayed at his home.
He was a rabbi, and he was sort of a mentor.
And I loved the guy, and he loved me.
Anyway, and I remember where he told me the story.
So, of course, I rent a car anywhere I go, including Israel.
So I was driving him around, and went to a gas station.
And I don't know how it arose, but he told me the following story.
Israel started out as a socialist country, not communist, socialist.
And so, for example, all communications things, like telephones, televisions, whatever it was, it was all nationalized.
It's not now, but it was then.
So he went to the Ministry of Communications, I'm translating from the Hebrew, He went to the Ministry of Communications and he said, so when will my phone be delivered?
And he said, the man said to me, the clerk said to me, six months.
And I said to the clerk, sir, is there any hope that I will get it sooner?
And the man looked at me and said, sir, there's always hope.
There's no chance.
You told me that once.
I'm remembering it now.
You do remember it?
Yes.
So whenever anybody asks me, is there any hope?
I have this horrible line, there is always hope, there's no chance.
I was about to say, is that supposed to be encouraging?
No, no, not in the least.
It's a totally dark story.
It's a totally dark response to you, but it's funny, so it's worth it.
I think there's hope, and I think there's a chance, okay?
However...
I never really ask myself that question.
I only ask, what do I have to do to reverse the decline that the left has induced in Western life generally and America specifically?
That is all I ask myself.
What do I have to do?
Analogy is always to the guys who stormed Normandy Beach on D-Day.
Did they walk on thinking, is there hope?
Is there a chance?
They walked on saying, this is what I have to do, and I may well be ripped apart by Nazi machine guns.
They knew it.
So, I know this...
The West can decline and we enter an age of barbarity all over the world.
Specifically America.
If America weakens, barbarity takes over.
In America and everywhere else.
So I know that, but I have to fight it.
I was given this great place.
It is selfish of me not to fight.
That's why people tell me, you know, a guy called me on the radio.
It was amazing.
He said, Dennis, I've got to tell you, I've been listening to you for 30 years and I stopped.
Obviously, he didn't stop that day.
He called me.
He said, I can't handle all the bad news.
And I said, that's selfish.
Right.
You can't retire from this battle, my friend.
Yeah, I'm sure they were tired of whizzing bullets.
Yes.
You're right.
In a way, it's kind of a useless question because for both of us, it won't at all impact whether or not we fight.
That's right.
You know, I think about this a lot.
I don't fear that leftism will fail.
I do fear...
You mean that America will fail?
Well, that leftism...
I actually would say leftism.
In America.
Wait, you don't fear that leftism will fail?
Or you don't fear that leftism will succeed?
Oh, I'm sorry.
Yes, that it will succeed.
Sorry.
Yes.
I don't fear that leftism will succeed.
I do fear the damage that it will do in the meantime.
That's right.
That's what I fear.
Yes, no, that's entirely accurate.
That's why when people say, oh, in the end, evil always loses.
Yeah, in the end.
But until the end came, how many people suffered?
Hitler lost, but 50 million people died as a result of him.
I do think that people one day will wake up and see it because leftism just doesn't work.
These ideas that they're implementing just simply do not work.
But I fear that it will be way, way, way too late until people realize it.
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The moment you ask, will it work?
You're no longer on the left.
Right.
That was our point.
That's our point.
Exactly.
You know, I think about this too with social media in the same way I... I don't think leftism will succeed.
I don't think social media will really succeed in the way that we think it will.
I don't think it will continue.
I really, really believe that there will be a backlash to it because it's just taken over.
Okay, so when you say social media, you mean Facebook?
Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, TikTok.
What about Twitter?
All of them.
All of these social media platforms.
So you don't mean the internet as such because we're internet.
Right.
Obviously.
You mean specifically social media?
Yes.
In the same way that I think leftism eventually will fail, but it will cause a lot of damage in the meantime, I sort of think the same thing about social media.
Because it just sucks your soul.
That's actually one of the things I wanted to talk to you about today.
Because the other day I was having a conversation with a very trusted, wise adult in my life.
And he said to me, don't underestimate.
The power right now of just developing a few really good, strong habits.
That will serve you very well eventually in your life.
And so back to our social media topic.
This is a conservative, right?
Yes.
Clearly.
I'll tell you why I know that.
Go ahead.
Back to the social media topic.
One of the habits that I've been trying to break is my social media use.
I have an Instagram account.
I do have a Facebook, but I never, ever use it.
I actually got it when I got into college because there was a...
College Facebook group and I wanted to join it, but otherwise I've never used it.
But I've been having a really difficult time, Dennis, getting off of Instagram.
And I was thinking the other day, if I'm having a difficult time getting off of Instagram, dear Lord.
So tell me what...
This is an actual question.
It's the one I'm the least familiar with.
Okay.
Which is not...
I'm not bragging about it.
I'm not even happy about it.
I'm just being honest.
I just, what is the appeal?
Well, that is a question that I have difficulty answering.
It's something I've been asking myself a lot.
What is the appeal?
I think a lot of it is just for show, if I'm being really honest.
Meaning what?
Meaning it's, you know, if you like a guy and he follows you on Instagram and you look cute, you can post a photo of yourself and you can, you know, post a photo of yourself looking good or post a photo of yourself out.
All right, so why is that bad?
Well, I think that it sucks the life out of you.
I mean, the amount of time that I spend on that app is unbelievable, and I think that it makes you care about the wrong things.
What I'm really trying to do right now is to focus on my internal life.
I'm trying to find religion.
I'm really trying to make myself internally strong and have a rich internal life.
Instagram and all of these social media platforms facilitate the very opposite.
They make you care only about the external, only about how other people are perceiving you.
You know, even when I went to Israel a few months ago, I noticed, and again, I'm pretty damn good compared to a lot of people my age as far as posting and the time that I spend on these things.
But I even noticed that I had this instinct, this habit, this impulse to post pictures of where I was.
Everywhere we went, I had this thing where I needed to have a photo.
And that was on Instagram?
Yes, on Instagram.
Not on Twitter and not on Facebook?
No, I don't use Twitter or Facebook.
I think I have an account on Facebook, but I never use it.
What is the limitation on words in an Instagram message?
I don't believe...
Well, actually, I think there is a limitation.
I've posted or I've seen people who've posted really long captions.
Oh, I didn't know that.
It's photos.
You can post up to nine photos on...
They post.
And unlimited, they have this story feature and you can post unlimited stories.
But I just...
And why is that more...
I truly have no idea.
Why is that more tempting than Facebook?
Facebook seems a bit antiquated to me.
Facebook is very much like posting...
Sort of like long paragraphs, life updates, I just moved here, I just got married, my brother died.
Instagram is more like short and out.
So Facebook is deeper than Instagram.
But I think people use Instagram more than Facebook nowadays.
Wait, they use Instagram more?
Yes, than Facebook.
So that's actually a sad commentary.
Because theoretically, it's more superficial than Facebook.
Yeah, it is.
And that's the thing that I'm really trying to rid myself of now.
And it's difficult.
Wow, it is?
That's fascinating.
It's difficult, Dennis, and I'm having a hard time admitting it.
No, it's to your credit.
So let me say something about this guy, why I said he's a conservative.
Okay.
This is a real big theme in my life, and I'm not sure.
sure I think you're familiar with it the a good person in the left view is the one that is fighting America's bad aspect Racism, sexism, homophobia, etc., etc.
Among conservatives, the good person is the one who fights the bad parts of themselves.
That's right.
The left externalizes everything.
We conservatives look inward.
Yeah.
So I'm trying to look inward.
And you know...
I remember thinking to myself, why do just private moments not matter anymore?
Why can't we just go on trips and not post photos of where we are?
This is a radical thought.
Not even take the photo.
Not even take the damn photo.
I mean, of course, when I went to Israel, I wanted to take a photo in front of the Western Wall because I want to show my kids one day.
Here I was at 22 in front of this great site.
Sometimes I think how much more I would get out of that experience if I just threw the camera away and experienced it.
The reason why that doesn't matter anymore is because you have to have some kind of internal life for it to matter.
And that's why, as I said a few minutes ago, I'm so focused on my internal life.
And another problem is that when you, people my age who are so obsessed with social media, they're also surrounded with people who have that same pathology or that same obsession.
So you don't see a lot of role models.
And, you know, I think about this, Dennis, and I'm interested to hear what your advice is.
I thought about deleting my personal Instagram account because...
Why do I really need it?
It's sucking up so much of my time.
I'm mindlessly scrolling.
I don't even realize that I'm doing it.
I could be reading a book.
I could be talking with people.
But I'm about to enter this conservative media space, and the power of social media is so enormous.
Look at PragerU.
Look at my senior speech that PragerU posted, 200,000 views.
That's thanks to social media.
Unlike you, I read the comments.
I don't read the comments.
I read when people email me on my website, but I don't read comments on YouTube or on Instagram of videos of me.
I'm going to talk about that in a moment.
I think it's actually a very important theme.
Very important, believe it or not.
But I just want to say, why can't you have the perfect middle road of use Instagram for getting your messages out, and this is part of your message, our podcast, obviously.
And otherwise, ignore it.
It's really hard to do that.
Okay.
It's like a little heroin.
It is.
You know, there was a documentary somewhere.
I can't remember what platform it was on.
And I watched it about a year ago.
And it showed you how they make these algorithms.
And they design these accounts to evoke the same kind of...
I'm not very good at science.
I'm sorry if I'm getting these science terms.
Terms wrong.
Same like transmitters in your brain that fire off when you do drugs or when you eat candy.
And even just the act of seeing how many people liked your post.
Or just the variety of every time you go on there, there's a new post right in front of you.
And even though...
It's someone who you went to high school with posting a picture of their dog.
Just the idea that you're seeing something new pop up sort of bring something out in you.
And I have found, again, that it's really, really hard for me to go off of it.
So I'm trying to find that middle ground.
Right.
It's like the person who's addicted, I guess, to, forget drugs even, just, you know, to a ton of food.
Too much food.
Or too much sweets.
Or whatever it might be.
Too much junk food.
And say, you know, limit yourself to one little package of potato chips a day.
Forgot about it.
Most can't do that.
But you wouldn't believe, Dennis, how, again, I'm pretty good, but how superficial these social media accounts are.
I see girls, this is another interesting thing, I don't really see guys doing this as much as girls.
Girls will retake...
Candid photos because they don't think that they look good in them or they'll try to create a candid photo or, you know, let's act like we're touching the wall here at the Western Wall and put our heads, you know, to the...
I saw people redoing those kinds of photos and then they didn't like how they looked so they went back and did it again.
It's just unbelievable.
And every time people go out to restaurants...
That was Marshall McLuhan's great line.
The medium is the message.
He said that in the 1960s.
Oh, that is a great line.
Did you ever hear it?
No.
It's my first time hearing it.
Look it up.
Marshall McLuhan.
He was an observer of the scene.
An intelligent man.
Isn't that a great line?
Yes.
That's what we're living.
He was a prophet with that line.
The medium is the message.
Nothing anymore is about what it really is.
It's how it should be made to be seen to be.
Yes.
It's entirely accurate.
Now let me tell you why I read comments.
Yes.
I actually think it's an important thing.
I'm not pushing you to do it.
I'm just telling you why I think it's important.
I read comments on every...
I publish a column a week.
I read the comments.
I can't read every one, but I skim them for either the attacks, the love.
It doesn't matter.
I want to...
When they debate among themselves, I don't read it.
But if they're reacting to what I actually wrote, then I do.
I do it as well on articles that others write.
So there are two separate issues.
With regard to myself, you'll find this of interest.
I, even in the emails of hate, I read them, believe it or not, since it so doesn't bother me.
You should drop dead or you're a schmuck or you're, I don't know, whatever they write.
It has no effect on me.
But I want to know what I said that triggered that.
And then I ask myself, A, is there even 1% of validity to why they're upset with me?
Right.
Or is it 0%?
And I will modify my message to be more effective.
I want to be more effective.
So that's one reason that I do it.
The reason I read comments on other articles is it gives me a true insight.
For example, in the New York Times or Washington Post, you can't comment unless you're a subscriber.
So what is the average New York Times or Washington Post subscriber?
And it's not cheap.
What do they think?
And I gotta tell you, it's illuminating.
I bet it is.
I understand the left through comments on articles as well as I do or better than from the articles by the left themselves.
This is the left without any self-censorship.
This is what we really believe.
And I did an entire column and a whole show on one where a...
A woman writer for the New York Times wrote another piece about, oh, why should we have kids?
Because the world is going to be destroyed because of global warming.
By the way, a lot of people my age say no.
I know that.
I know.
That's something we need to talk about.
We really do.
So it was illuminating in the extreme the number of people who wrote in saying, Ah, that's exactly what my daughter thinks.
And I won't be a grandparent.
I still wanted to be a grandparent, but my daughter or my son is not having children because of climate change.
And as much as I ache for a grandchild, I support them.
And I'm thinking, holy crow.
You are supportive of your child's decision not to have a child?
Which proves the power of the media is literally unlimited.
And it's going against biology.
It's going against our biological instincts.
Every instinct.
Their emotions.
How does that happen?
I know.
That's the thing.
And that's what I was saying earlier in this episode.
People are sabotaging their own children.
We're talking about these biological...
I was going to say...
Millennia long, but even longer than that is instincts that are in us.
And it's just unbelievable to me that these ideas have the power to unravel them.
To celebrate your child's desire not to give you a grandchild?
I know.
Because of global warming?
Oh my God.
It proves...
They have to read Apocalypse Never.
Well, that was exactly what I was going to say.
It proves that...
There is virtually no one on the left, in other words, no one among New York Times subscribers reads anything other than what the left says.
We read them, study under them, see them, and hear them.
They don't hear us, see us, study under us, or read us.
Never.
You know, I was reading a biography of Margaret Thatcher recently, and she had an advisor, I believe his name was John O'Sullivan.
Oh yes, he was with National Review.
Yes, he was a prominent conservative columnist.
And he had this theory that you have to actively, vigorously...
Try to pursue conservative ideas and expose yourself to conservatism because the drift of society is always pushing you towards the left.
And that is something that I really try to adopt, and I'm already conservative.
You mean read leftism?
No, he's saying that you have to actively, vigorously pursue, read conservative books and conservative articles.
Oh, you mean because everything, all you get is it, right.
They need the opposite advice.
They need the, well.
In other words, they only pursue what they agree with.
Right.
But he, O'Sullivan was.
Well, they need the advice of, they only.
They need to pursue conservatism.
Yes, that's right.
Yes.
By opposite, I meant the other side.
Yes, I know what you mean.
Yes, yes.
We live the other side.
Exactly.
If you watch a movie, you hear leftism.
Well, I was thinking, as I'm starting this job in a few months, I mean, this is a job now, but when I'm starting, taking on more responsibilities with Salem, I thought to myself, One of the benefits of being at Harvard, even though it was lonely, was that all day I was exposed to left-wing ideas and it just made me better and stronger because I was constantly having to defend myself.
Well, this is what...
Okay, go on.
No, I was just going to say, and then I had this thought, you know, when I'm...
In the conservative media sphere and I'm working at Salem, I'm going to be surrounded with people who are only conservative.
And I thought, how am I going to maintain the other side?
And then I thought, Julie, what a stupid idea.
Yeah, right.
You get it in the air, you breathe.
Well, you're going to go into a cave?
Exactly.
There was a liberal writer, not a leftist, but a liberal who wrote a piece, I don't remember where it was published, said, you don't know how we're hurting our side by having them at college only hear our side.
We are damaging them.
Really?
This is a left-wing writer.
Well, a liberal.
I don't know.
Oh, a liberal.
Yeah, that's right.
And he had real liberal bona fides.
I mean, the guy was not moderate even.
But that's true for every group.
I'm a religious Jew, and I don't want religious Jews only to read.
Of course not.
Or Orthodox stuff.
They have to read the other stuff.
It becomes so insular, you don't grow.
That's how you grow, is to confront the other.
Well, I can't believe how little people know about these huge things that we read about and you talk on your show about.
I gave, as you know, when we talked about on this podcast, I gave this senior speech, and one of...
In one of the paragraphs in the speech, I mentioned these super woke things that have happened to society.
The New York Times winning a Pulitzer Prize for the 1619 Project.
The Oregon Department of Education saying that showing your answer in math is white supremacist.
The American Medical Association Removing Gender from Birth Certificates.
And part of the reason why I did that is because I knew that most of the people in the audience would probably have never heard those examples, which is crazy to me because sometimes I'm debating with my friends.
That's right.
And I'll bring up these things that are just so obvious to us.
They have no idea.
They have no idea.
That's correct.
And that's partly why, you know, sometimes honestly.
And I'm a very empathetic person, as I know you are.
Sometimes I think we're a little bit too nice to the left in the sense that we give them a pass.
But in the sense that we, you know, they're influenced by their peers and they're in this echo chamber of the media that they consume.
But it is really valid.
I do see a lot of people at my school who, I mean, they really, they've just never have read any of this before.
They're not even curious.
They're not, right.
They're not even curious.
Well, they're taught not to be curious.
They're taught that conservatives are racists, as one example.
So are you sitting down to read Ku Klux Klan literature?
No.
That's how they view us.
Right.
Why read evil?
Well, it's an intellectual shortcut, I believe, for them to think of us this way.
Of course it is, exactly.
You know, one of the things—we were just talking a few minutes ago about cops and how they just encounter such evil all the time.
You know, you all day and I all day read about how America is declining, and yet we are so happy.
And that's one of the things I really admire about you.
You, I mean, we talk a lot about how America's in decline, but you have such a rich, happy life.
And in a weird way, I think understanding the tragedy of life allows you to have a happy life.
And part of the reason why I think so many of my peers and people on the left are unhappy is because they do have such a simple, narrow-minded view of the world.
They do take these intellectual shortcuts, and they think that it's just easier to do so, but not understand.
Understanding the fullness of life, I think, they think that they're saving themselves, or subconsciously they're saving themselves from a kind of pain, but they're not.
I smiled when you said it.
I saw that.
I have a chapter in my happiness book on the tragedy of life, or really the tragic view of life, and it's actually one of my chapters that argues for X or Y or Z as contributing to your happiness.
My tragic view of life contributes immensely to my happiness.
Well, you asked me on the podcast, I think one of our first or second episodes, am I happier as a conservative?
And I said yes, because now I feel like I fully understand the tragic nature of life.
Because I've been exposed to religion and many of these ideas that you talk about.
And again, in a weird way, that has made me happier.
Because I just, I'm no longer ignorant.
And you appreciate things more.
Totally.
Since life is tragic.
Wow!
Another day without a tragedy in my life.
Am I lucky?
That's how I look at it.
I know you do.
And I've really adopted that view as well.
We have a...
Hey, Sean, why don't you play it for the podcast?
If nothing's horrific.
I came up with this great line years ago and one of my listeners put it to music.
Do we have it?
If nothing's horrific, then life is terrific.
If nothing's horrific, then life is terrific.
Okay.
It's really charming.
I just muttered to Dennis that I couldn't hear it because he had his earphones on.
But then I actually could because it's so loud.
I could hear it through your earphones.
That's funny.
Julie doesn't want to wear earphones.
No, I have beautiful earrings on.
Why would I do that?
That's right.
And I left my earrings at home.
That's right.
That's exactly right.
Well, this has been great.
You know, Dennis, I was thinking halfway through the podcast.
I went, oh my gosh, I've totally forgotten that I have a microphone here and this is being recorded because it's so natural.
That is right.
I agree with you.
Sean just said it to my earphones.
Okay.
Okay?
I completely understand what that means.
Unfortunately, Sean does not speak Hebrew, but I do.
He wants you to tell people how to get in touch with you.
Julie-Hartman.com And I've been getting a lot of lovely, lovely emails.
And just...
Everyone is so kind.
And you know what, Dennis?
I haven't gotten a racist email.
I'm sure that some people on the left would think that I would be a racist.
Your dog whistles are not loud enough.
I know.
Damn it.
That is the issue.
Yeah, I've got to work on those dog whistles.
I know I do.
Maybe I can learn some from you.
Oh, of course.
You know I can't whistle.
I've tried.
I'm not even going to try now.
Everybody, tell everybody about Dennis and Julie.
Yes, please do.
I think this is really good, especially for young people.
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