PBD - Patrick Bet-David - Dame Dash Heated Debate | Diddy Drama | Jay-Z Feud

April 12, 2024 - PBD - Patrick Bet-David

01:56:31

Dame Dash Heated Debate | Diddy Drama | Jay-Z Feud | PBD Podcast Ep. 395

Patrick Bet-David and Roc-A-Fella Records founder Dame Dash have a heated discussion about Diddy's sex trafficking allegations, Biggie and Tupac's murders, Donald Trump's 2024 presidential campaign & much more! Connect with Damon Dash on Minnect: https://bit.ly/3VVVbLV 00:00 - A special message from Patrick Bet-David. 02:01 - PBD Podcast Intro 02:27 - Patrick introduces Dame Dash. 05:28 - Dame Dash discusses his motivation for business and the keys to success. 09:39 - Where he got his inspiration and his biggest influence who taught him street. 17:13 - The unexpected death of his mother at 16-years-old and how he turned to the streets. 21:56 - How he got into the music business after getting off the streets of Harlem. 26:05 - Damon on recognizing the talent of Jay-Z. 29:53 - Damon on why he and Jay-Z founded Roc-A-Fella Records. 35:15 - West Coast vs East Coast feud in the early 90s. 39:37 - How Lyor Cohen being a culture vulture and stealing from hip-hop artists. 50:02 - The death of Aaliyah and her relationship with R. Kelly and Jay-Z. 1:01:51 - Is Donald Trump a good boss? 1:08:21 - History of Jaguar Wright 1:08:56 - Diddy raid and how the government isn't helping black youth. 1:16:09 - Is Hip-Hop A CIA Psyop? 1:20:38 - Does racism exist? 1:26:36 - Who killed Tupac and Biggie Smalls? 1:29:31 - The change of the Republican Party. 1:37:15 - AI's effect on the music industry. 1:42:08 - The Top 5 Rappers of all time. Purchase tickets to PBD Podcast LIVE! w/ Tulsi Gabbard on April 25th: https://bit.ly/3VmuaRm Connect one-on-one with the right expert for you on Minnect: https://bit.ly/3MC9IXE Connect with Patrick Bet-David on Minnect: https://bit.ly/3OoiGIC Connect with Damon Dash on Minnect: https://bit.ly/3VVVbLV Connect with Rob Garguilo on Minnect: https://bit.ly/426IG0R Purchase Patrick's new book "Choose Your Enemies Wisely": https://bit.ly/41bTtGD Register to win a Valuetainment Boss Set (valued at over $350): https://bit.ly/41PrSLW Get best-in-class business advice with Bet-David Consulting: https://bit.ly/40oUafz Visit VT.com for the latest news and insights from the world of politics, business and entertainment: https://bit.ly/472R3Mz Visit Valuetainment University for the best courses online for entrepreneurs: https://bit.ly/47gKVA0 Text “PODCAST” to 310-340-1132 to get the latest updates in real-time! Get PBD's Intro Song "Sweet Victory" by R-Mean: https://bit.ly/3T6HPdY SUBSCRIBE TO: @VALUETAINMENT @vtsoscast @ValuetainmentComedy @bizdocpodcast @theunusualsuspectspodcast Want to be clear on your next 5 business moves? https://bit.ly/3Qzrj3m Join the channel to get exclusive access to perks: https://bit.ly/3Q9rSQL Download the podcasts on all your favorite platforms https://bit.ly/3sFAW4N Patrick Bet-David is the founder and CEO of Valuetainment Media. He is the author of the #1 Wall Street Journal Bestseller “Your Next Five Moves” (Simon & Schuster) and a father of 2 boys and 2 girls. He currently resides in Ft. Lauderdale, Florida.

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	So if you like interviews I do that things get heated, this is going to be one of them because Dame Dash is probably going to be one of the biggest power players in the history of hip-hop having signed Kanye West's partner is Jay-Z that they started Rockefeller in 95, which is kind of weird because a year prior to that is when Tupac got shot up when he went to visit Biggie.
	And then next year 96, September 13 is when Tupac gets killed.
	And they started at that time were in 1995.
	The biggest rap songs that came out were some of the biggest rap songs ever.
	Dear Mama, you know, Coolio Gangster's Paradise.
	You know, I got five on it.
	I mean, you look at this list of stuff that came up in 95 that decided to compete.
	These guys did an interesting, he said some very interesting things saying that Diddy and Biggie wanted to be like him and Jay.
	And then he got upset.
	Some of the stuff got heated when I asked about Aaliyah and some of the allegations that Diddy's been going through lately.
	We even talked about, you know, Lior Cohen when he said on Breakfast Club, who's Dame Dash?
	And he really reacted to that in a passionate way.
	And we talked Trump.
	He kept bringing up Trump.
	Dame, you're going to watch this.
	You know what I'm talking about because we had a fun afterwards.
	But we laughed, we argued, we learned.
	And it's going to be a very, very entertaining and interesting scope range of topics that we talked about.
	And on top of that, Dame is now officially on Manect, which means you can ask Dame any question you want.
	He chooses how he answers you, but you can download the app Manect.
	And if you go to this QR code, you can literally text him, okay?
	Ask him the question, pay for it, and he'll respond back either in a text format, audio format, or video format.
	But he's now officially also on Manect answering questions that you may have.
	There will be parts where you're going to say, but you know, I want to know about this.
	How come he didn't say anything about this?
	And what about that?
	You'll get to ask him whatever questions you got on Manect.
	Having said that, enjoy this very entertaining and some moments very heated interview with the one and only Dane Dash.
	I'm the one.
	Okay, so in the hip-hop world, I'm a guy that came up from the West Coast side.
	I'm a Tupac.
	I'm purely more on the West Coast, but follow a lot of the East Coast, West Coast challenges that was taking place.
	I'm a class of 96 in high school when I graduated.
	And we all know what happened in 96 with Tupac.
	But you cannot mention the word hip-hop and talk about power players that directly, indirectly influenced the entire game without saying the name Dame Dash.
	You can't.
	And one of the hardest things to do in an industry like this, or any industry that's a lot of people are trying to fight for the power, is to try to manage three things.
	Try to stay loved, respected, and feared.
	It is very hard to do.
	And he is one of those that was able to do all three, love, feared, and respect.
	And, you know, of course, there's a lot of people that maybe he's going to create some enemies while he's doing that.
	But you're talking about Rockefeller founder, him and Jay-Z.
	You're talking about Rockaware that was doing, I think, at $1.700 million a year, almost a billion dollars a year.
	You're talking about working directly and signing Kanye.
	If you watch Kanye's documentary, you will see the scene where Dame is sitting up on the stage like this and he's saying, you can ask Kanye a question.
	And then he kind of gives us commentary and all the stuff that's going on.
	Again, we can go on with names left and right.
	And And obviously with all the issues that's taking place right now, recently within hip-hop, there's a lot of names that are coming up.
	No.
	A lot of the raids.
	I don't know if you know this.
	One guy named Diddy was raided at his house in L.A. and in Miami.
	And now names are being dropped with Jay-Z and a lot of other names are coming up.
	And if anybody wanted to make a list of names of people, top 10 that can speak on those topics, that know a lot that maybe others wouldn't want them to talk about and stay quiet, I think, Dame, you're probably on that top 10 list of people that can comment on a lot of this stuff, specifically a part of history and involvement.
	With that being said, thanks for being on the podcast, man.
	Thank you.
	That was a hell of an intro.
	How you doing?
	How you feeling?
	I'm good.
	I'm a little tired.
	You know, y'all definitely shoot early.
	Yes.
	So we had to pull up pretty, we're on our way to Gary from here.
	So, yeah.
	And I was up last night at our studio.
	But I'm good, though.
	I'm pretty good.
	I feel secure.
	You feel secure?
	Yeah.
	I find that.
	What do you mean by secure?
	You know, I could go to sleep at night and not have to worry about things.
	You know, and I think that's the most important kind of wealth is to be guilty-free, you know, never compromised.
	Now, let me ask you for, I mean, obviously there's a lot of things I want to go through here with the time that we have together.
	Lots of stuff that I want to talk to you about.
	For a guy like you who we've watched you from the other side, right?
	We've watched you in interviews, in Rockefeller, in stories, in your fire, in your interview with Breakfast Club, boss, entrepreneurship, business, hustle, the fight, the grind of coming up.
	Do you still have the same fire as a startup, entrepreneur, survival?
	Do you still have that fire today at this phase of your life?
	It's a different kind of fire, but definitely the fire is way iller, you know, just based on being confident of success.
	So once I complete a dream, I dream bigger.
	So, and the fight that I've been having is just kind of remaining sucker-free.
	You know, again, being in a position where someone wants me to do something that I feel might compromise my morals or my integrity, I always had the wherewithal to say, get the fuck out of here.
	You know, don't ever ask me no shit like that.
	And then also be able to be like, yo, did y'all hear what they just said?
	And then I've been able to actually see people look the other way.
	So in my world, it's making my dreams come true.
	And unfortunately, unless you're savvy enough or have someone around you that knows how to raise you money and knows how to do those kind of things, you got to do it yourself.
	And you have to sometimes create your own industry if you don't want to fit into somebody else's because the people that are running that industry, again, have a different kind of moral compass.
	So my fight has always been to do things fairly and to do things without robbing creatives and fighting those that are robbing creatives and then to continue to dream for myself while I'm dreaming for other people.
	So everything I do as a startup from my new television network, America New, from these glasses I have on, CEO glasses, the sneakers, to the books.
	I'm on my way to, you know, go do schools with my girl, to read books, you know, go talk to the mayor of Gary, who I, you know, Eddie Milton, who I was a big part of his election and a man that taught me how to pass laws.
	And then I'm bouncing over to a jail in Chicago, a kid's jail is shut it down because, you know, if you could really understand how they're torturing our kids when we're not looking, why that recitative rate is at 99% is because most of these kids can't read.
	They're torturing them.
	They're making them live in moldy jails.
	And I'm not going to say any names right now.
	I'm on my way to Chicago, but if they don't shut that jail down or fix what's wrong with it, I'm going at everybody, you know?
	So that's been me, the guy that protects people that can't protect themselves, as well as having to make my own dreams come true without dealing with people that would make me compromise my morals.
	And at the same time, because I have so many ideas and so many different things to make things work, you know, I have to do it myself out my own pocket.
	You know what I mean?
	When you're dreaming in verticals, which I am, you know, I do the octopus thing and there's always 10 different things that I'm working on at one time.
	And, you know, I'm not raising any breads.
	A dollar come here, it goes into something else.
	A dollar come there, it goes into something else.
	So the original question you asked me, do I have that fire more than ever?
	Because I'm not using other people's money.
	I know who to stay away from, who I got to stay away from so I can sleep well at night.
	And I'm trying to help the world, you know.
	So again, I'm also down with this OSG, which is the principles, you know, hundreds of principals from economically challenged places.
	And I go into the schools.
	I talk to the principals.
	I talk to the teachers.
	You know, we have a syllabus from the womb to three years old.
	And like I said, this OSG is hundreds of principals from economically challenged places.
	And what I do know and what I'm conscious of are the real problems, the things that make the cycles continue to happen, where it doesn't behoove us, but it behooves somebody else.
	And now I know the problems, but I know how to actually bring the answers.
	And I can do that through entertainment.
	I could do that through, you know, education.
	I could do that through anything.
	Any language you speak, I can speak to you through that language.
	So yeah, the drive is there more because I know how to fix the things that are wrong.
	Very cool.
	And Dame, for you, where did you get your mindset from?
	Because I've had a lot of Italian.
	From Harlem.
	Harlem.
	Did you see Pain in Fool?
	Yeah.
	Movie Pain in Full?
	But what I'm talking about is like, you know, I have Italy.
	New York was also filled with a lot of Italian mobsters, right?
	And they ran it in a certain way.
	And you're coming up from Harlem and you're doing what you're doing.
	Was there any inspiration that came from how the Italian mob family built what they built or not at all?
	Definitely.
	Big influence was the Godfather.
	So I read the book when I was younger because I wanted to know what he was thinking as opposed to what he was saying.
	And the ideals that came with being the godfather.
	But also a big influence was, you know, the people that I grew up around, you know, like, you know, my family.
	Honor and integrity look so cool.
	You know, the godfather and the way he carried things, it just was cool to do things in a way that, you know, because honorable's not always convenient.
	It's never convenient.
	There's always a test that comes with it to see if you're going to do what's the right thing or do what's easy or what appears to be.
	And, yeah, the God, all those movies, I'm young, Scarface.
	Was it direct contact with any of them or not at all?
	What you mean?
	So, for example, I've had Sammy DeBola.
	Oh, did I know anything?
	Yeah.
	Well, I had a barbershop on 112th Street, and this dude named Chill sold it to me.
	And we used to sell weed in the back and had the barbershops in the front.
	And apparently he had bought it from some Italians in 116th and Pleasant.
	And, you know, they were trying to take the shot, but he sold it to me.
	So I had to go down to Pleasant with him.
	And they were like, hey, Chill, you got a lot of nerve coming down.
	And also, I went to school across the street from Rails.
	So I went to Manhattan Center.
	So, I mean, yeah, we had interaction.
	And then, you know, there'd be funerals I would go to for people in my family, like my grandmother and all that.
	And the whole mob used to be there.
	So, yeah.
	Really?
	But I can't really talk about that.
	Who had the biggest influence?
	I know you talk about.
	So many different people, man.
	And I guess what I'm asking is, who toughened you up?
	Who taught you street to know how to take that mindset up street of the word you said sucker-free, right?
	Because a lot of times, as the saying goes, when a man with money meets a man with experience, the man with money leaves with the experience.
	The man with the experience leaves with the money.
	Okay.
	So how do you go from that world to in the business world?
	And then, hey, you know, $19 million, you book Jay-Z on a tour and then boom, you're doing deals with all these bigger guys.
	How did you know you could handle sitting across the table from these guys and negotiate with them?
	So if you saw Paid in Full, that was a story that really happened.
	And I'm about to do the TV show on my own network or collaborative with another.
	But when you're in survival mode, you know, and the people around you bring you up a certain way.
	Like I was born into an honor code.
	I never knew anything different.
	And there was always accountability.
	So if I did something that would be against the grain, it would be like having a business and a board that would just be very, like you did.
	Like I wasn't allowed to have a tattoo while I was in the street.
	You know, I was taught that.
	Like I was taught how to do everything.
	Like, unless to me, the only way, and to me, a successful criminal, if there is such a word, is one that never goes to jail.
	And the only way you can do that is if you're advised by an OG or other criminals that have done it before.
	So I got a formula of how to survive, and it was just being thorough and acting a certain way.
	And it's nothing that is innate.
	It's people teach.
	That's why we need men in our lives.
	Men need to be raised by men, or at least someone that can give them, you know, a little more testosterone than estrogen.
	And again, if you do some clown shit, I got a whole team that's going to be on my head, you know?
	And then when you become at a position of a leader, you have to lead by example because what you do, your crew will do.
	So if you were goofy, you're going to have a goofy crew.
	If you're late, your crew's going to be late.
	You know, I would never send anybody in my crew on the front line to do something that I wouldn't do myself.
	So, you know, being a boss means caring a little more about your crew than yourself.
	So, and I don't have any disrespect.
	I don't get into the politics thing too much.
	You know, no matter who's in charge, I'm going to do my thing.
	But, you know, I lean a certain way.
	But, you know, I would talk to Kanye a lot about Trump.
	And he'd be like, yo, he's a winner.
	And he just keeps winning.
	This was a cat back in the day.
	And I'm like, well, to me, his whole crew is in jail.
	So if I'm out and Kanye went to jail and Jay went to jail and people died on my watch and everybody is doing bad and I'm doing good, then I gauge that as an unsuccessful boss.
	And that means that they're not winning, they're losing.
	A real boss cares more about the people that he works with before himself, almost like how a parent cares about their family, you know.
	And again, a lot of what I was taught wasn't to stay in one place.
	It was to evolve.
	If I got one block, I need two.
	If I was able to get one bird, I flip.
	I make another.
	What the street taught me was how to be independent.
	And when you're dealing with people that if you don't play the game right, we'll kill you or you will go to jail, pivoting into a place where people, the recourse isn't jail.
	Well, I didn't think it was back then, you know what I'm saying?
	Or jail or death or murder is very easy.
	There's no fear there, you know.
	And, you know, I made a movie about what made me pivot.
	It was paid in full.
	So people that I looked up to got killed and their brothers got kidnapped.
	And I'm like, you know, if that could happen to them, it can happen to me.
	So I just took the arrogance and the confidence of the survival of Harlem when crack first came out, the glory days, you know, when, you know, I've been lucky enough to know in Harlem, damn near every person in my generation that people talk about, like people that people put in raps, I hustle with, or, you know, I was friends with, or still am.
	And then go into the rap business.
	And, you know, for the last like since 2000, let's say 96, well, I started in, you know, like 96, 94.
	And it's 2024.
	And, you know, up till last week, people are still saying my name's in raps.
	From Biggie Smalls to Future.
	Future is talking about my past in the present.
	You know, so that's the impact that I've had and knocking the world down.
	But again, it was my survival skills and the Harlem, the accountability of people, and then being scared of going to jail because that was fair for me.
	I did not want to go to jail.
	That's why I knew I wasn't cut out to be a criminal.
	Because unless jail is all right with being on your resume, actually, you know, it's 85 to 90% chance at some point you got to go.
	And you have to be all right with that.
	And you won't be able to get yourself out by, you know, if you're honorable by telling on the people that you did the work with that you actually care about.
	If you're not willing to kill, then you got to stop.
	You got to pivot.
	So at a certain age, I'm like, yo, I'm not willing to do all this shit, especially time.
	How old were you when you made that decision?
	18.
	Okay.
	You know, actually at 16, I put myself in boarding school, South Kent.
	Right after mom passed?
	When my mother died, I went to the street hard, heavy.
	I was hustling hard.
	You know, I was 142nd in Linux with the lynch mob.
	Even I wasn't down with the lynch mob.
	I was on the same block as the lynch mob.
	And those are my boys.
	And, you know, what happened was when I was 15, because I was spoiled my whole life.
	My mother made sure I had everything.
	And, you know, I grew up in 1199, which, you know, if you're from New York, it's like, you know, it was like day camp.
	It was gyms.
	It was like the suburbs in the hood.
	You know what I mean?
	It was that kind of thing.
	How did mom make money?
	She was, well, she did everything.
	She was an entrepreneur.
	So she was always, she would sell clothes.
	She would sell anything.
	She was an entrepreneur.
	She had to get a job.
	She got a job.
	But I went on vacation.
	She was like, knew how to buy things wholesale.
	So I always have sneakers, 10 pairs of sneakers.
	I had the pinball machine.
	I was a spoiled kid.
	And my mother died when I was 16.
	But what happened was when I was 15, because I was spoiled, I'm like, mom, these Suzuki Jeeps had come out.
	They were only 10 grand.
	And I'm like, mom, can you buy me a Suzuki?
	She's like, man, you can't even drive a car.
	You're 16.
	You can't get in New York.
	You can't get a license to 18.
	So I got kicked out of every private school that you could get kicked out of.
	And they put me in Manhattan Center, the one that's across the street from Rayo's.
	And I grew up with legends like Carlton Hines.
	It was an ill time over there.
	That's where I learned the game.
	And, you know, my mother died.
	Well, I started to hustle there.
	And then when my mother died when I was 16, you know, my homeboys, they started to do things that I wasn't ready to do.
	They was my age.
	They started catching bodies.
	And I had the opportunity to have a scholarship years before because I used to box at the boys' clubs.
	But I went and got homesick.
	And they were like, if you ever want to go, go.
	So when my mother died, that year, I hustled hard.
	My boy started to get a little crazy.
	And I put myself back in.
	I just put myself in boarding school.
	Independently.
	I didn't want to have to kill anybody.
	So who was guaranteed?
	The way you were going with the friends that were taking people out?
	No way, I wasn't.
	So it was like everyone had bodies.
	Like everyone had a body.
	And we were teenagers.
	We were young.
	Did somebody check you?
	Meaning, like, was there a man?
	Because you know how you get to check.
	No, you couldn't check me.
	Nobody could check me.
	Not even like an uncle or a coach or a father.
	You got to think about getting more money than anyone older than you.
	And the only people that were around me that had more money than me got it from hustling.
	So that's all I knew at that point.
	Could they check?
	Was there anybody that's like, damn, you got to leave this life?
	And well, it wasn't leave this.
	Okay.
	So, you know, I'm telling you.
	The dynamics of my family, you know, they kind of found out I was in the street in certain blocks.
	And I remember I had my cousin with me.
	And he was like, and they were like, yo, you can't have both of y'all out there.
	We can't watch both of you.
	And I was like, I didn't know y'all was watching me at all.
	You know, because I was doing my own thing.
	And, you know, I wouldn't say super check.
	Like, you know, you know, Malik Yilbert, like, I grew up with them as well.
	Those guys were older than me.
	And, you know, I hustled on the west side.
	And, you know, I'm from the East.
	And most cats from the East Side couldn't really do that, go to the West side and scramble.
	And so, you know, those guys were older than me.
	They were like kind of RB dudes, you know, and they used to do things I didn't.
	But they were like older and they kind of raised me up to that point.
	And they always used to be like, because they never hustled.
	They'd be like, you know, they would give me a hard time.
	But.
	But there was no man that you feared that kind of puts you in your place and said, Dame, leave this life.
	No, no.
	Nobody like that.
	Nah, nah.
	There were men that I, I don't say feared.
	Like, I had, there would be things that my crew would be doing or people that I looked up to and I'd be ready to go.
	Like, I'll throw on my black right now.
	Let's go.
	And they would be like, nah, you stay here.
	And I used to wonder why.
	But years later, if you look at the network, I was able to make a movie about it called Honor Up.
	And I was able to put my real OG, the person that hit me with my first pack in a movie and have him act as my OG.
	And, you know, when I was able to ask him on the set, like, why you would, why y'all, you know, he was like, yo, it wasn't for you, man.
	You know, we knew that you had a better life.
	And we bet right.
	So, you know, OG's job is to make sure that someone doesn't hurt themselves if they're a real OG.
	And there's been plenty of times I've had to have that conversation with people like, yo, you killing, man?
	Like, you know, that's not sustainable.
	And I'd tell them, like, it ain't no girls in jail.
	But as far as for me, it wasn't no one that could scare me out of hustling other than the street itself.
	So the situation that happened with Paid and Full, Rich Porter, and all that, that's what scared me.
	And that's when I pivoted out the street and I went into music.
	But then getting into the music business, I was like, man, this is crazy.
	I'm out of here.
	And that's what made me pivot into fashion and doing all the other things that I did.
	So 89, you're 18 years old because you're born in 71, right?
	So 89, you're 18, you leave it, you go into music, bless you.
	You go into music.
	What do you do between 89 and 95 before you start Rockefeller?
	Like, what were you doing then to make money?
	So I had got a record deal at 19 with Atlantic with Kevin Woodley.
	He was in there.
	Well, I'm not going to say Kevin Woodley, Clark Kent.
	So what happened was my cousin, Darian, Stacey Dash's brother, he always was doing some trickery with some brilliant, you know, he always had like a scam going or a scheme, but intelligent is out.
	And he was like, yo, you get money, we should get in the music business.
	And I'm like, I'm not getting that right now.
	I didn't have too much of an interest in it, you know.
	And, you know, when things got hot, as far as with the paid and full situation, then I entertained it.
	And he went to college.
	And his stepfather, Cecil Holmes, he was the president of Casablanca Records and a big AR.
	And his AR or intern was Kevin Woodley, who now worked at Warner or Atlantic.
	So they sent me over there.
	Well, I was going over there or, you know, Cecil hooked it up so that we could go and meet this, you know, dude, Kevin Woodley, who's AR at Atlantic.
	And he had me shopping these two groups over there.
	And I kept going over there.
	You know, I'm 19, I'm 18.
	I'm going back and forth.
	They curving me, keeping me in the lobby.
	And I just couldn't take it anymore.
	And I ran into Clark Kent in the lobby.
	And, you know, he had just got there.
	And he basically signed my first acts with East West and with Atlantic.
	But I had Original Flavor and The Future Sound.
	But when we got signed, Dawes Effects got signed.
	And I remember Clark let me hear the demo.
	I'm like, those dudes are ill.
	You know, and I actually stole the demo.
	I stole it, but he left it in my car and I made a copy of it.
	And I was playing it for everybody.
	But, you know, when they came out, they did so well that Original Flavor and The Future Sound got left behind completely.
	And then I had to learn how to do it myself.
	So Clark Kent introduced me to Jay-Z.
	He introduced me to Ski from Original Flavor.
	Got it.
	He brought me all around the country because he was a DJ and he was like just showing me the game.
	So I would go with him.
	And we had this thing that when he would sign an artist, I'd give him 10 grand.
	And he'd go buy Pelis.
	And I was like, in the music business, there was always some type of skim going on some way, shape, or form.
	With every transaction, someone got paid a little on the side.
	See, that's the problem with the music business because the things that were going on back then, I just don't think they'd be legal now.
	In hindsight, that's it.
	So that wouldn't be legal today to do.
	He worked for Atlantic and he's giving me.
	Oh, I got it.
	I got it.
	It makes sense.
	Totally get it.
	So a lot of times with people.
	Selling away.
	A lot of suckers, like what a lot of people do is they have access to somebody famous or somebody that people think that, you know, can get them to plug.
	They'll make you like, yo, if you want to have a meeting with such and such, they'll make you pay them.
	And they won't tell the boss.
	They actually just got some money to let this person come in and meet you and not breaking bread with you.
	Purely for an introduction.
	You're getting paid.
	And it's on you to close or sell or do whatever you do.
	Yeah, but you know, but you don't let the person that's doing that know.
	Got it.
	So again, it's like the government, man.
	You know, it's people that don't use their own money that pay a lot of people.
	They pay who they want to pay.
	What I'm coming to find out is they usually pay the person that they're physically entangled with, whether it's male or female.
	You know what I mean?
	And, you know, that's the way it moves around like that.
	So it was like friends keep the money and they pass it off to other friends, whatever connection they have.
	And that's the way you got to get a deal and everyone gets paid.
	So even in, like, again, the government, you think, you know, you're outsourcing everything to the private sector.
	So, you know, you don't think anyone's ever getting some kind of everyone gets a kickback.
	That's all it is.
	Sure.
	I mean, that's how the whole lobbyists make their money.
	It's another form of lobbying is what you're saying.
	Just like raising money.
	You know, you raise money, you get a promote or whatever.
	It's the same thing, bro.
	So Clark Kim from Atlantic is giving you these guys, and he's a DJ.
	You give him 10 grand.
	And, you know, that's so, so then through him, you meet Jay.
	At this point, before you met him, did you know, have you heard about?
	Not at all.
	Nothing.
	When did you know there was he had a special talent with Jay?
	I knew he could rap because he could rap really fast.
	But him and I were just real cool because, you know, we were, at that time, I was, you know, I started getting back in the street a little bit.
	You know, I had to plug.
	Right.
	So, you know, I passed him the plug.
	You know what I mean?
	Because, you know, he was hustling different.
	He was still copping from the hill.
	So I had to, you know, introduce him to his man, somebody he's still with to this day, you know, and also another, you know, I just, what I usually do is come to a block and be like, you're not hustling right.
	You know what I'm saying?
	And I'm like, get him out of here.
	Cut the middle man out.
	And that's what I kind of did.
	Like, I didn't even want to.
	I mean, I don't even get to that story.
	But, you know, it was like, yeah, we just started to kick it and do things in the street and, or not the street street, but, you know, elevate whatever game that he had, as well as us being on the road and him rapping with original flavor.
	And, you know, for a long time, you know, I shopped Jade to every single record company.
	They all said no.
	Kevin Lyle said no.
	Lior said no.
	Lior said no.
	Yeah, Kevin Lyles worked for Lior.
	And they all said no, bro.
	Every single one of them.
	No one.
	That's why I didn't do it myself.
	I tried to get him signed, but I couldn't.
	What were they saying?
	What's the, when they said no?
	Too old, rap too fast.
	Jazz had, he was with jazz and jazz wasn't so successful.
	So it's just his look.
	He didn't.
	So what happened was he's from Brooklyn.
	And again, what you'll see a lot of time is they're always saying, I'm talking about him.
	But if you're asking me questions about my story, you know, he's part of it.
	So I don't like to really talk about him so much.
	But, you know, he was a Brooklyn cat and he dressed like a Brooklyn cat.
	He didn't, you know, he didn't have it all together the way.
	So my guys used to tease him all day, all day, all day.
	Every little thing he did, they thought was corny.
	And we just kind of hollanded him up, you know what I mean?
	But initially, we thought he was cool.
	I thought he was cool because he was wearing night gares and most dudes at the time from Brooklyn didn't wear night gears.
	And so that's why I kind of thought he was cool.
	But I knew he could rap.
	And then we got to know each other in a different way, pause.
	You know, we were doing certain things like passing the plug and we became brothers.
	And then, you know, we started Rockefeller just because no one else would sign us.
	You know?
	That's it.
	That's it.
	So let me ask you, so was there, you know how sometimes we tried it the easy way and it didn't work out.
	And again, if I'm a thorough person that comes from a certain cloth, if I walk in a room full of people that are completely different, raise different, different value systems, and they're asking me to do certain things.
	Like the day we did the deal with Def Jam as a co-vector, Leo asked me to go fight another black man for him.
	And I'm like, are you fighting any of my battles?
	He tried me.
	It was like immediately he tried me to make me fight his battles in a culture that wasn't.
	And I just knew how to say no.
	Like I just, what I can do clearly is it doesn't make me, because I'm a businessman.
	See, creators, it's hard for them to say no.
	They're non-confrontational.
	They speak through their art.
	And you can push a creative to do things in the moment because they don't know how to verbally defend themselves.
	With me, I have no problem being honest and telling you the truth.
	I don't have a problem asking for my money or saying how much am I getting paid or how much are we getting paid?
	How are we breaking?
	I don't, those questions that make people, especially creators, awkward, don't make me feel awkward.
	You know?
	So that was always my job.
	What a great combo, though.
	Yeah.
	What a great combo.
	It's a one-two punch.
	Right.
	That was fantastic.
	So let me ask you, you know how when I was 21 years old, I'm broke.
	I got nothing going on.
	There's this Denny's we would go to and I would sit with one of my friends, Sarah, who's upstairs right now.
	And it was me, him, and another guy.
	And we would dream, hey, one day we're going to do this and we're going to take over the world and blah, Here's what we're going to be doing.
	Did you and Jay have that moment and then you said, you know what?
	Screwed.
	We're going to call it Rockefeller.
	And is it, you know, called after Rockefeller because we're going to become tycoons and moguls?
	Was there a moment between the two of you?
	It wasn't between the two of us.
	It was a crew of us.
	But I used to sit and write and plot all day, and I still do.
	So if you ask my crew now, the first thing I do when I get up in the morning is we get around the table, get the colored papers and the markers, and we talk about how we're going to eat.
	It's always been that plot and plan, always.
	And it was more like a moment that we were in St. Thomas, me, him, and Biggs, and we were like, fuck it.
	Let's just do it ourselves, you know?
	But we always knew we had to do it ourselves.
	It kind of felt like, at least I did, just based on the way the system was set up.
	Like no one in that business listens to you unless they have to.
	You understand what I mean?
	Like a lot of times people that are in a position of power in the music business are in a position of power because again, they're willing to compromise and do things that the average man would not do.
	And again, I wouldn't do that.
	So then at the end, you get people that have funny ways in those positions that only look out for people that they have things on.
	And they only listen because they don't like a person that will compromise everything to get to the top.
	But once they get to the top, that person that they didn't like and disrespected before, that might got sent to the store or sent to drive someone's car, all of a sudden they're your boss.
	And you hate that person, but you have to listen to them because they're going to be now the person in position of your destiny.
	Even in the music business, like I'll know a PD, like a program director or someone that does the videos and or works in a position where they can help an artist.
	And when they walk in the room, every artist and everybody kisses their ass.
	The minute they lose that job, no one talks to them no more.
	You know, because they don't have to.
	So I don't talk to people unless I want to, which may not be the best business accrement.
	But based on the temperature right now, I'm really happy I stuck to my gun.
	By the way, I just Googled right now 95 top 40 hip-hop songs of 95.
	Okay, so this is when you guys start Rockefeller.
	Here's who's on this list.
	Number one, Dear Mama, Tupac.
	Okay.
	Then they have Mob Deep, Shook Ones, Part Two.
	Then it's KRS1, MCs Act Like They Don't Know, right?
	Then you have Looney's, I got five on it, which was a big hit.
	Method Man, I'll be there for you.
	You're all I need to get by, you know, featuring Mary J. Blige.
	You got Old Dirty Bastard, Shimi Shimi, you know, so that was a big kid.
	GZA Liquid Swords.
	Then you have Run In, then you have Ice Cream featuring Method Man, Ghostface, then you got Dre keep Their Heads ringing.
	Tupac, so many tears.
	See the competition.
	This is insane.
	So I'm the first of the month, Bone Thugs and Harmony.
	That was an incredible album.
	You got Ice Cube Friday.
	This is 95.
	We're talking about all the survival the fittest.
	You got to remember back then there was no internet.
	So you only a select few were getting heard.
	And in order to get her, you know, you had to be like super.
	And that was what we had to break into.
	Guys like that that had record deals or people, you know, majors backing them.
	So, you know, that's what was like kind of incredible.
	But, you know, in hindsight, you got to remember when I was doing all those things, I was 21, 22.
	I retired from Rockefeller at 35.
	You know, so those things I was doing were self-taught and no one gave me no nepotism.
	Did it ourselves and was making more money than mostly every single person that I had met in my life in my family, my teachers, my principals, everyone that I thought was rich.
	I had more money than by the time I was 22 or 23.
	In business, I had a bigger first generation business.
	You know what I mean?
	Like sometimes I'm around people that are like, you know, first, second, third generation.
	And it's a different life when you don't have to worry about nothing ever since the day you opened your eyes.
	It might not be less stressful because everyone has the same amount of problems no matter money you raise or whatever, but it's just different first generation.
	So when I'm around people that got money and they got it from their family, I don't care how much money they got as far as the character because I'm first generation.
	I'm out here fighting.
	I'm that person's father or grandfather.
	You know what I mean?
	So, and in school, it was like that.
	When I went to boarding school, anywhere I go, I always took pride in the fact that I could break a social class at such a young age on my own without any help from anybody that was related to me.
	And by the way, while you're saying, I mean, obviously, I relate to that.
	I relate to what it is to be.
	My dad was a cashier at a 99 cent store yesterday, 99 cent store, shut down all their stores.
	He was a cashier at Englewood, California, right next to Great Western Forum.
	By the way, Gangster's Paradise also came out that same year.
	But let me continue with this here.
	94.
	We hit like a 96.
	I know, but what I'm going here is 94, November 30th, 94, is when Tupac gets shot, right?
	He's in the studio, Chris, you know, Biggie, the whole controversy, what happened there.
	Then he comes out, then he gets shot the second time, 9696.
	913 is when he dies.
	He writes, hit him up, 6496.
	So you're starting 95.
	You said you were in St. Thomas.
	You guys are talking about Rockefeller with Biggie and Jay-Z.
	What's East Coast West?
	Biggs, Biggs.
	Oh, Biggs.
	I'm sorry.
	They said, okay, so what's East Coast, West Coast looking like at this time?
	How hot are things right now?
	I mean, they were briefing with Biggie.
	So, you know, we were like the only ones that would stand next to Biggie at the time.
	So if you notice, we made records.
	Brooklyn Finance, which I produced with Clark Kent, was made.
	And, you know, he was in our videos, Ain't No Nigga, and all that.
	Biggie was the only person that I used to smoke with.
	I didn't smoke before at all.
	I used to drink.
	And, you know, supposedly Jay and Big went to school together, but Jay didn't know him, you know.
	And our thing was because we were doing the stuff like going in and getting the money and doing the popping the bottles and all that.
	In that moment, we had always felt that Biggie and Puff were copying us.
	Always.
	They were always like, they'd see us in the club and it seemed like the next day a record would be made.
	You thought Biggie and Puff were copying you guys.
	No, they were.
	No, no, no.
	Who's we?
	It's you and Jay?
	Yeah, my whole crew.
	Rock up.
	So we was really getting money.
	You know what I mean?
	So, you know, no disrespect to Biggie, but it was a different hustle.
	We weren't like on the street pitching work.
	You know what I mean?
	We was a connects, connects, connect.
	So it was a different kind of thing.
	But that lifestyle of hustler and all that, that was us.
	That was them copying us, for sure.
	For sure.
	And, you know, so we kind of had problems.
	So I would like run up sometimes.
	And, you know, I was confrontational with Biggie and him at first.
	And but when we finally got cool and he came to our video, because again, this one, no one would mess with him.
	And he came through.
	And again, we were strategic.
	So every time we did a video, we'd have a meeting about what would be the most big willie shit we could do.
	So what we came up with, we go to BBQs and have a whole meeting about it.
	I'm down with a crew called the Best Out in Harlem.
	And, you know, it's a lot of, it was a lot of hood structure to it.
	You know what I mean?
	Like we had board meetings certain places and shit like that.
	But we came up with, what we came up with was using real money, play Monopoly with real money, and just had Chris Stale all over the table.
	So, you know, a lot of heavyweights were there, and he pulls in and we start kicking it.
	And I'm like, man, we get into a drinking contest.
	And, you know, he's 300 pounds.
	And I just got too drunk this night.
	He got too drunk.
	We both got drunk.
	And the next day, Biggs and Jay hit me.
	And they're like, you know, you was no good last night.
	Or Jay really did.
	And that was like the first time he'd ever said anything like that.
	And I called Biggs.
	I said, what happened?
	He's like, man, you was telling him he's your favorite rapper.
	You guys, you were all trying to get in his car.
	Like, I was like, what?
	So then, you know, I got mad or whatever.
	We went down to daddy's house, Paul's, and we booked him to open up for Jay in New Orleans so that Jay could perform in front of him.
	And then we got real cool.
	And then from there, for Biggie to open up in front of Jay?
	No, for so we're booking Biggie.
	He could perform.
	A lot of people come see Biggie.
	Right.
	And Jay would open for him.
	Jay-Z would open for Biggie.
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	That's what we booked.
	Right.
	We did.
	Yeah.
	And at this point, who is bigger?
	Biggie.
	Biggie.
	Biggie had a deal with Puff.
	See, Biggie always wanted to act at that point.
	Biggie was going to, what was supposed to happen was he was going to do, he did that double album.
	He was going to do a triple album.
	Then he was going to come to Rockefeller with us.
	Commission.
	The commission?
	The commission.
	So he was going to do the commission with you guys.
	Yeah.
	I was trying to get all, so I tried, again, bitch-ass thiefs out.
	I tried to sign the firm.
	So I was trying to get the firm that that record in reasonable doubt that AZ now was supposed to show up for that record, but he didn't.
	But I was trying to give the firm a deal.
	I was trying to get the whole, that's why I assigned Clue.
	But, you know, again, I tell my ideas and Steve Stout, you know, being the bitch that he is, he would go around my back and do the deals, you know.
	And, you know, these are the guys that the problem in that business is a lot of non-creative people take advantage of creative people and they steal the creative people's ideas and then go and sell them to the devil.
	The devil's money.
	You know what I mean?
	And that's what I didn't use.
	I never used to use the devil's money and I still won't.
	Who's the devil's money?
	Whoever's not creative that's exploiting an artist.
	Like a Lior Cohen type of guy?
	He's a culture vulture.
	I made the term up just for him.
	You know what I mean?
	Did you hear what he said about you on Charlemagne?
	Years ago?
	Yeah, I've been punishing him for that.
	You know, I benched him.
	He used to be in the music business.
	So now, you know, he has to sit down.
	You're talking about this one here?
	Yeah, where he...
	He says, who's Dame Dash?
	I don't know who you mean.
	So usually what happens algorithmically, another culture always tries to erase another culture that they're trying to empower is history so that all their leaders they make don't exist.
	So that's exactly what they do.
	They try to erase our history.
	But the thing that where he had the gall was that he did it on one of what's supposedly our platform in front of our people.
	And he did it so recklessly that he was unconscious that we were all watching.
	So to sit there and say, Damon, I don't know him.
	What are you saying when he's not around?
	You're trying to act like he doesn't exist because you want to take credit for everything that he did.
	And that's what Steve Stout did.
	And that's what Lior does.
	If I'm a person that won't let you rob an artist and your business model is robbing artists, of course you're going to try to paint the picture of me doing things I'm not being difficult because I'm difficult for you.
	I don't let you rob the artist.
	Can you play the second half of that?
	Just press play real quick.
	I'm trying to trigger me.
	No, not at all.
	You've already addressed it.
	But I think it helped change the course of the crack epidemic.
	Oh, this is him saying.
	I don't know what's this opioid thing, man.
	That he got into the middle of the day.
	The crackhead wasn't cool.
	Now they seem like they're making it cool to be drinking lean and syrup.
	It's the most dangerous thing that's facing our society.
	So why sign an artist that would promote that?
	Because I already answered that question.
	You weren't the talking function.
	I already answered that question.
	He asked me talent or issues.
	And I said talent.
	But I have to, I can't give up on people.
	You know what I'm saying?
	That's hypocritical, though.
	You're saying it's opportunistic.
	Yeah, I got people to feed with proud.
	I got a business to run.
	You're going to make Dame Dash take this clip and call you a culture vulture.
	Who's Dame Dash?
	The one that calls you a culture virtually?
	I don't even know him.
	I don't even know him.
	How many times have you brought meetings with him?
	I don't even know him.
	How many times have you sat with him for him to say something like that?
	That's why it's ridiculous and everyone laughed at him.
	I couldn't even count the times how many times he sat with me.
	You know what I mean?
	I was his boss.
	That's how I looked at it.
	You know what I mean?
	I was representing my company.
	He was representing someone else's.
	So he needed you because you were bringing opportunities to him.
	Well, he needed volume for his company.
	Makes sense.
	That's what they needed.
	But it wasn't his company.
	It was Universals.
	They had got bought.
	Got it.
	And what I never liked about that situation is how did he keep a job and Russell didn't?
	You know what I mean?
	And then they got Russell sitting in the lobby trying to get a deal.
	I'm like, yeah, I can't do that to Russell.
	It's what Russell's doing.
	And that's what usually happens, right?
	The person that starts it, like a Russell, ends up not getting completely the credit for it down the line.
	So he's going to take credit for Dev Jam too.
	In a minute, he's going to say he don't know Russell.
	You know what I mean?
	That's what they do.
	And The thing that was problematic about that is I didn't like when Charlemagne said you're going to make Damon call you a culture vulture.
	Why didn't he just call him a culture vulture and check him right there?
	And that's the problem I'd be having with people from our culture.
	When they got that culture vulture on the show, like a Noriega or whatever, they never ask them the real questions, but they'll ask me everything under the sun.
	See, I say things in public because I'm cool with the accountability.
	Challenge me.
	Show me where I'm wrong.
	Show me a tape or a video with some receipts that prove me wrong.
	And I'll have a conversation with Lior, Jay, Steve Stout, any one of those people that have been painting a picture of me being a certain way so that other people won't work with me.
	I would challenge each one of them.
	And we could, let's see how many people are mad that you've robbed and see how many people are mad that I made rich.
	You understand what I'm saying?
	And when you hear this, I'm difficult yelling.
	I've been working with principals.
	If you personally have had an experience with me that's been pleasant, why would you listen to someone say that they've had an unpleasant experience?
	And the person that's saying they've had an unpleasant experience is usually someone that has way more pleasant experiences robbing artists.
	I'm just the guy that checks you for robbing artists.
	You know what he does now?
	Yeah, he works at YouTube.
	He's just customer service.
	Can you pull it up?
	See, he's the global head of music for YouTube.
	Right.
	So that's the reason why they're suppressing CPMs and they don't give you the full benefit of it.
	And they're not, YouTube is knocking.
	You're on YouTube, right?
	Yeah, of course.
	You know your CPM?
	Yeah.
	What is it?
	It varies depending on what it is and what companies advertise on.
	No, no, no.
	It's programmatic.
	The CPMs is what the money you get from the commercials that you don't get.
	55% if that's what you're saying.
	No, no, no, not from YouTube.
	You do not get 55%.
	That's impossible.
	You wouldn't even be able to get accounting from YouTube.
	You do have to get an email and then they have two more get to you.
	So what happens is, and you're a genius, right?
	You're smart.
	You've done business, but you're letting them rob you and you don't even know how they're robbing.
	And that's how they take advantage.
	Do you get the benefit of your data?
	No, not from YouTube or any other social media third party that you deal with.
	You don't.
	You don't have the ad tech.
	You don't understand it.
	Most people do not, right?
	Because I have a television network and I had to figure out how to do it.
	I know what programmatic is.
	I know what it is with ad tech is to have servers and ad tags and ad stacks and waterfalls and all that.
	I get it now.
	So what I do know is this.
	If you're getting a $22 CPM, let's say they're going to try to figure it out now, right?
	Yeah, I am.
	So if they're, let's say, generally speaking, if you look at YouTube, they'll be like, you get two, three, three dollars CPM, right?
	But you don't know how much they're getting.
	So they could be getting $23 and they're only giving you three, no accounting.
	And again, they're selling your data to advertisers and you don't get the benefit of it.
	So how smart are you?
	So that's how they're taking advantage of us.
	So that's what I have to figure out early.
	And then I make every let everyone, even including yourself and everyone else that's in the game and doesn't know how to get paid in the language they speak and don't understand that you're trusting Lior with your CPMs and he's taking full advantage of you.
	So that's why I had to build my own because I don't care how much money I make.
	I want to know how much money you make off me and how you get it.
	So if you're giving me $10, you must be making $100.
	And I'm not going to do all the work, walk on and be a Johnny and be a sucker and then have to compromise my integrity to get just 10% of what I usually.
	So you got to look back at my past.
	I'm the guy that was saying, yo, you should own your masters.
	You know, if you go back to the other Breakfast Club interview, you know, in 2000, whatever, whatever it was, and I'm like, yo, calling Charlamagne a chatty patty and I'm telling everybody, I'm not saying quit your job.
	I'm saying, why you have a job?
	Invest in your dream.
	Or you're a sucker because you're working for somebody else's dream.
	And I know you got to pay the bills, but there's eight hours, there's 24 hours in a day, eight.
	You're working.
	You got 16 to do other things.
	It's interesting to me that this guy goes from there to not being YouTube global head of music.
	Yeah, because he knew how to rob music.
	He invented the 360.
	So now he knows how to rob.
	Digital is a whole new world.
	It is.
	I mean, AI.
	So think about this.
	Like, you know, like I said, I do this thing with the principals.
	A teacher and a principal right now did not get taught about AI, CPM, Web3, or any of the futuristic things that are happening now in school.
	So how are they going to teach a student?
	How could the student be smarter than the teacher right now?
	And that's what's happening.
	But that's the case, though.
	I know.
	So then how are they still teaching?
	So he understood the game enough.
	The reason why the 360 deal was made was he was so mad that they couldn't get no money from Rockaware because I named it Rockerware, not Rockefeller, so they couldn't benefit from the name.
	But people still knew the symbolism.
	They knew what it was.
	So it wasn't owned by Rockefeller.
	It's two separate companies.
	Yeah.
	Separate entities?
	Fuck yeah.
	And then you had the structure with Jay-Z as the same structure as like, was it a 50-50 type of deal?
	Yeah, between me and him.
	And then whoever was.
	See, the thing is, if I would have known better back then, I would have just licensed it.
	I wouldn't have split the brand.
	But you know, you got to learn.
	You live and you learn.
	But also, you didn't mention I put Rachel Roy on, which is high fashion.
	I put Kevin Hart on.
	I put Lee Daniels on.
	In every vertical, it's not just a music.
	I put people on in every vertical.
	So the biggest comedian right now, even though he's the shortest, would be Kevin Hart and he won't help.
	And, you know, look who's running in music, you know.
	And in TV, Lee Daniels.
	You know what I mean?
	In fashion, Rachel Roy.
	You know, I've been done.
	I've made $100 million companies in every vertical.
	But the problem is.
	What's your network today?
	Zero.
	Zero zip.
	It's all in the street.
	Zip.
	Period.
	When you say zip, you mean everything is in paper right now?
	Every single thing I got is in my dreams.
	I don't hold no money.
	There is no net worth.
	Yeah, look.
	I mean, if Rockerware was doing $700 million a year, if you combine all your companies right now, what would you say the revenue is today?
	That's gross.
	That's not net.
	No, I know.
	That's the gross.
	Billions.
	Today?
	Oh, now I don't know what Rockware is doing.
	We sold it.
	And again, I don't know.
	Oh, no.
	What I'm asking is, where are you at today?
	Like all these things that you have going on right now.
	Right now, the volume of America New, zero.
	Not zero.
	We have 50,000 downloads in a couple of, but without raising money.
	Right now, I'm investing in my verticals.
	So I have eight verticals in eight companies.
	How would I evaluate it?
	Well, if I were to say that America New has 50,000 downloads and I would say the extra strategy would be $100 per download or a person that downloads it.
	That's what I would evaluate.
	Everyone has a different evaluation.
	Not $5 million, it would be $50 million, $100 times $50,000.
	$50,000 times $100.
	Yeah.
	$50,000 times $100 is $5 million.
	Oh, so then that would be worth $5 million.
	So whatever.
	So then if you look at with the book sold, you know, it's first, and this is year one, like, you know, year, you know, six months in, three months in.
	Book first year, 60,000 books.
	But there's a whole franchise, you know, the catalog that I have, all of those things.
	So let's, let's go back to it.
	Let's go back to 95.
	So at this point, you have Biggie open up for Jay open up for Biggie.
	Okay.
	But so you're in between.
	You guys are doing what you're doing with Rockefeller.
	You got Diddy's doing what he's doing over there with Bad Boy.
	You got, you know, Pac, all the guys on the West Coast doing what they're doing with Sug.
	But you're saying they're trying to be us.
	Not there.
	I just said Biggie.
	At that point, Biggie and I'm going to say Biggie, but Puff, they were copying us.
	You know what I'm saying?
	Okay, I can't see that because Puff is known for copying.
	So his model is a form of copying.
	But, you know, again, in this moment, we never did.
	Yeah.
	We always had this kind of thing no matter what.
	He don't knock me.
	I don't knock him in public.
	We deal with our things in private and pause.
	And that was, again, the honor system that code that I abide by.
	So I don't sit here, especially now.
	I mean, I can't even know, you know, I don't know who's right, who's wrong.
	I just think whoever's lying should get punished, period.
	Whoever's lying should get punished.
	He come out with the whole rating and everything that he's going through.
	Yeah.
	So whoever is lying should get punished.
	So if Puff's lying, then he got to, you know, it is what it is.
	And if these people are lying on him, then it is what it is.
	And the truth will come out, period.
	But just because how was your relationship?
	Do you guys have a relationship till today or no?
	Just as we all know each other, you know, but I was a guy that back then, I'm not an RB.
	Like, you remember Stacks Records in Motown?
	I would look at Bad Boy like Motown, and we were like Stacks Records.
	We were more like the gangsters and shit.
	Not to say like on some tough shit, but just that's what we were about.
	More aggressive living.
	And they were more like RB cats, cats that would be with pants and barefooted and shit like that.
	So I wasn't doing none of that.
	So we always had a clear line.
	There was a respect, but it was always a competition.
	You know what I mean?
	So I'm from Harlem, Harlem.
	He was from Espinaj, so it's different, you know.
	But again, I'm not going to do that and knock them just because of respect for the brotherhood of hip-hop.
	Let me, let me, maybe let me ask the question since we're on this, because again, you're, this is like 1962 and a half, two and a half.
	That's when Target, Walmart, Kmart all got started with these super saving centers, right?
	That was the year.
	Like what year came up?
	Walmart, Kmart, Target, 1962 and a half.
	Hey, what is the era of the American sports car?
	Late 50s, early 50s, Corvette, Mustang, da-da-da-da-da, right?
	1995, 96.
	Like this is the era, right?
	Do you know how long ago that was?
	I know.
	But you can't really expect me to remember every emotion.
	Well, no, you're not.
	I'm not putting them all up.
	But I think for a guy like you, the thing is, the shit I be doing now occupies my brain more than my thoughts.
	I totally get it.
	And to me, it's more impactful.
	So, like, you know, there's also DD 172.
	Did you know about DD 12?
	I did.
	I saw DD 172.
	And I can show you, like, to me, that was more impactful than Rockefeller.
	It's just that you know about Rockefeller, but the things that I did, the way it helped and sculptured the DNA now, but I'm listening to you.
	So can I share with you maybe where my interest is?
	Okay.
	And I'll give you where my interest with this is.
	So what you're doing is while you're interviewing me, you're Googling shit.
	No, no, no, I'm not doing it.
	Rob is doing it.
	I know.
	It's pretty good.
	What's your network?
	Because you went to my network.
	Yeah.
	Again, I think saving money.
	I didn't do that.
	I think saving money is.
	What he does is he is anything you're saying, even when you said the movie, he just pulls it up so you can see it.
	No, he's not fact-checking.
	He's pulling it up for you to see.
	He should.
	But I want to ask you this question.
	I want to ask you this question.
	Did you pull up DD-172?
	Yeah, he did.
	It's right there, top left.
	DD-172 is a media collective founded by American entrepreneur Damon Dash.
	Yeah, he did.
	I like that.
	You guys are prepared.
	So the question for you is: So what is a, I don't know, what's the most painful moment in your life?
	When Aaliyah died.
	Okay.
	So when that happened, I think we were all shocked.
	I was broken.
	I know you were nobody more than you because you guys.
	Her mother and father were, but they didn't move on at all ever.
	You can't.
	But yeah, it was very painful there.
	Do you still listen to any of her music or no?
	Nah.
	It hurts so much.
	Like on her birthday, one day I was listening to it.
	I forgot with Nicolette and this girl, Big Doosa, because she's an Aaliyah fan.
	And I was trying to write for a movie.
	And this shit had me crying.
	I was crying.
	I didn't like the way I felt.
	You know, that's something it's a feeling that you have to learn to live with.
	But I was, you know, I was really in love with her.
	And she died tragically.
	Dame, did that event ever want you to find out exactly who was behind it and what happened?
	Or did you block all the theories that people were presenting behind it?
	Or was it like, I'm going to get to the bottom of it and find out exactly what happened?
	I mean, I knew what happened.
	So I didn't have to get to the bottom of it.
	Does what the media and the market write about what happened matters?
	If I know what happens, why would I give a fuck about what the media says?
	That's like saying I'm writing about my girl and I'm with her every day.
	You understand what I mean?
	Yeah.
	So I don't do the media so much.
	You know what I mean?
	Like, of course, I've heard they said I'm like, everyone, to me, gets their turn at some conspiracy.
	So again, when you know what people write about you personally, it's hard to believe everything that you agree.
	So, no, I don't, to me, it's an oxymoron to be famous or be known and care about what people think.
	That's the dumbest shit in the world.
	And to let that dictate what you do, that's weakness.
	And, you know, I'm not driven by insecurity.
	It's unsustainable.
	It's that.
	And that's why a lot of people go nuts because they're so scared about people that they don't know that aren't participating in the art they are.
	That's a great point.
	And they're worried about what these people think.
	And that's insecurity.
	I'm not that guy.
	I've never presented myself as that guy.
	You're on May 3rd, right?
	Yeah, I don't usually care what people think other than if I respect exactly what you've done and you've done something that I need to do or I'm trying to do.
	But other than that, unless you're my family and shit, I don't care what nobody think.
	I'm not going to listen to a conspiracy theory if I know the truth.
	But I'm not going to tell you what the truth is in this moment.
	We in public.
	Okay.
	There's a lot of truths that I know that because I'm just not a sucker and I don't feel like dealing with certain things, that I'm not going to come out publicly because a lot of things I've been saying and exposing years ago, no one said shit up until just now.
	So if you remember, I was beefing with Harvey Weinstein.
	I'm beefing with Leo.
	I'm beefing with Steve Stout.
	Most of the people that I'm beefing with, and I'm saying beefing because they're conspiring together, having meetings about how to put me out of business and stop my cash flow.
	That's actually happening.
	Do you believe in accountability?
	Of course.
	That's what's happening.
	So wouldn't you want to hold people accountable for what they did to Aaliyah?
	Yeah.
	So can I – Wait, wait, wait.
	What happened to Aaliyah that I don't know?
	What are you talking about?
	Can I give you what I've heard?
	But don't tell me what you heard on TikTok.
	No, not TikTok.
	No, okay.
	It's not TikTok.
	Because you're smarter than you.
	No, no, it's not TikTok.
	So I always listen to the man asking me the question.
	Right.
	And I know the nature of the question by the intelligence of the man and what their intention is.
	So just be selective about that question.
	Yeah, I mean, listen.
	And what I respect about you is, Dame, you can simply say, don't want to comment, don't want to say anything.
	No problem.
	We'll move on to the next thing.
	I'll just say that.
	What I'm going to want to know is why.
	Right.
	No problem.
	And then there'll be accountability.
	For me, I got four kids, you know, and when you see somebody like this who had an incredible voice and she was in that one movie with Judge.
	What did you hear, though?
	What did you hear?
	What did you hear?
	My question is, why are you saying a conspiracy?
	No, it's not a conspiracy.
	So what I heard is she's coming up in the whole challenge where she used to be married to R. Kelly.
	She's 15.
	She wasn't married.
	15 years old.
	She didn't marry 15 to a grown-ass man.
	I know, but then why would you still listen to him knowing that they said he married a 15-year-old?
	That was the issue.
	That you knew it was illegal to be married to a 15-year-old and a dude could actually put out a fucking album that says AJ nothing but another.
	That's right.
	And y'all are going to listen to it and not say a word.
	That's where people should come to themselves.
	I'm with you.
	I agree.
	But what's the conspiracy?
	So then it's not even the conspiracy.
	So then, you know, R. Kelly and her, then, you know.
	You don't know the conspiracy to do it too.
	Then Jay.
	Is he looking for a conspiracy?
	Then Jay.
	No, not at all.
	Not at all.
	Rob, matter of fact, you may want to stop Googling.
	Just stop Googling me because he's thinking I'm looking at what you're putting up.
	What's the conspiracy that you're asking me about?
	So then Jay, and then later on with you, she starts being with you for years.
	You said, don't you want to find out what happened?
	And I want to know what you heard.
	I'm asking you what you heard happen.
	Why she got in a plane crash.
	If Lenny, did Lenny Kravitz offer his plan?
	Because Hype did some bullshit.
	So why wouldn't that?
	Why would Hype say no for?
	Because Hype's a sucker for that.
	And I'm never going to forgive him for that.
	So period.
	We know it ain't no conspiracy.
	I've been told y'all that.
	So you asking me, did I find out the conspiracy if I'm curious?
	I told you I already know.
	So I'm asking you what you know that I don't.
	So if you know something I don't, let me know so I can go deal with it.
	I don't think.
	If you don't, why are we talking about it?
	Yeah.
	So I don't think it's whether I know or you don't know.
	What's the conspiracy that you're talking about?
	No, no, it's not even a conspiracy is if that was the event.
	So I guess what was the event?
	Then what the public knows and what you know is the same thing.
	So what's the conspiracy?
	Where's the gray area?
	But where I'm going with that is the frustration with the fact that, you know.
	Oh, that my partner did a fucking album and did a tour with him.
	That was the frustration.
	That's the frustration.
	Yeah.
	What's the frustration?
	Why y'all didn't say nothing about it.
	That's what my point was.
	How was nobody saying nothing about it?
	Like this raping girls they know that it was a girl.
	He said he married a 15 year old and everybody at that point, until it became common, or like it became the end thing, to do what nobody disrespected, R Kelly everybody was still going to his shows.
	Until it became popular opinion, people weren't looking the other way.
	So what I was was disappointed in every fan that didn't care that this dude was raping a little girl and actually, you know, tried to.
	You can't sugarcoat, you cannot marry a 15 year old period in America.
	You understand what i'm saying.
	But she died.
	She died in the plane crash.
	There ain't no conspiracy there.
	Yeah, there is no conspiracy.
	The problem was and again, a lot of things happened behind the scenes to get up to that point.
	But that's the stuff that people don't know and I don't feel like talking about all that because it opened up a whole can of worms.
	Yeah, so you know again, and I I appreciate you for uh, even sharing what you just shared.
	I know it's a sensitive topic.
	This didn't tell me the conspiracy yet.
	No, it's not for me it's, it's more like okay, for example, i'm just holding you accountable for your question.
	You said accountability.
	I'm said, do you go with the conspiracies that you hear?
	And i'm saying, which one did you hear that I didn't know about?
	Like, would I be looking for august 25th of 01?
	I was 21 years old applying for a job, 22 years old applying for a job at Morgan Stanley, DEAN WOOD, or my first day was 910 2001.
	So at this point i'm thinking about whether i'm going to go back into the army and stay in the marketplace and no one knows what's going on with the story.
	We're reading about it and we know what happened till later on.
	Our second story was in the plane.
	Oh that no, we all knew what was going on.
	He mentioned about it.
	You're in the world.
	No, it was common knowledge that he was married to a leader, or he painted that picture of him being sexually with her at 15.
	Yeah, that was publicized.
	There wasn't no conspiracy, everybody know.
	The question is why you're in the army.
	Why didn't you think that was weird?
	Oh for sure I thought it was.
	So did you still listen to him?
	Listen to R Kelly at that time?
	Yeah, i'm sure I did, knowing that he is having sex with a 15 year old.
	As a grown man, I mean, are you kidding me?
	The stuff that we heard with Michael Jackson, everybody's trying to verify.
	That's impossible.
	The reason why i'm asking you this is, you know the DNA and the problems I have to deal with.
	Even though a smart man like yourself knows something is wrong, you're still going through it.
	So you don't know something's wrong.
	So it's kind of, you do know, wait a second wait wait wait, wait.
	You're telling me that if your little sister was 15 and a grown man married her, or said he married her, you would know something's wrong.
	There's no question about and that was not a hidden thing is what i'm telling you.
	But but it was not hidden, but you're in the world, though it's, for example, it's kind of like i'm asking the public.
	Did you're asking?
	Did you believe Trump was dealing with Russia?
	Did you believe it?
	Did you think he was, because I know you're not a you know, maybe you're not supportive of him.
	Did you think he was colluding with Russia?
	It was with the gray areas.
	I don't really give a okay, but he's your president.
	He would be your president.
	Right, he's your president.
	He was like to me.
	My president is me.
	See, I don't depend on public assistance and no disrespect to anybody that does right, but whoever is the president, Only thing that's going to be affected with me is taxes.
	But either way, I'm going to do what I'm going to do.
	So I find Donald Trump.
	Did you think he was colluding with Russia?
	I was curious.
	Okay.
	So I think with Donald Trump, there's always a great.
	I think with Donald Trump, no matter what, it's a gray area.
	So were you surprised later on to find out that Hillary Clinton paid for that fake Russia collusion that I'm not even, again, that's the politics that I think people use to distract us from paying attention to ourselves.
	But what I'm saying, what I'm saying is, I didn't give it that much thought.
	Right.
	And I wasn't listening to it.
	But it affects your taxes, though, right?
	And taxes is.
	Let me tell you something, right?
	Raping a little girl is way different.
	There's three things in the street you don't fuck with no matter what.
	Snitches, pedophiles, and rapists.
	I'm with you.
	So I don't give a fuck about politics.
	If I hear that someone is raping a little girl, I'm no longer supporting them, period.
	And just because everyone else isn't looking the other way doesn't mean that you shouldn't.
	So you, as a common person, that was not to say common, but a person that you said was in the audience.
	I'm curious to know.
	I'm curious to know how could you know that somebody was raping a little girl just because it was put in a different sentence structure and you still think it's okay until the rest of the world says so?
	Then I got a question for you, so you said you don't want to comment on Diddy, right?
	And I said I want to comment on it.
	I said there's certain things.
	But wait a minute though.
	Then it's a double standard because with Diddy I'm proven that what he's done with young, you know he didn't go to relationship with young boys and all these other things that come you think the market needs to know about.
	But I know him personally, right?
	You don't know Paul's Puff, so I know him.
	I don't know Our Kelly personally, you do, right.
	So why would I jump on conclusion if I don't know the guy personally?
	What I'm saying is, if you hear a guy raped a 15 year old right, are you interviewing him?
	He's got an open imitation.
	I wouldn't.
	I know you wouldn't.
	Yeah, that's what we, that's what we differ.
	So I guess what I'm saying is what I was asking.
	And again, I'm not saying I still with Puff at all, I'm not saying I ever did.
	It's just.
	It's not for me to knock anyone down while they're down, unless I had a personal problem with them.
	But I'm not doesn't mean I'm gonna fuck with him.
	It's just I'm not gonna do that, but just because I know him, but I'm not gonna be a fan honestly, as it relates to Michael Jackson.
	I still listen to Michael Jackson.
	I do as well, and I went to Never Neverland when he wasn't there with Kadana, you know, out of curiosity.
	Yeah well, I wasn't a kid.
	You know you would have got knocked out.
	You know what I mean, but I didn't.
	I wasn't jacking that, though I wasn't cool with it.
	So I'm just saying I'm, I wasn't a fan of him.
	How could you be a fan of a person that you know?
	And the reason I was using you is because what do you think the average person is doing?
	They see things that are immoral.
	They look past it until it's public opinion, and I'm a person that can't look past things until it's public opinion.
	So so put it like this, if I had a problem with Puff and I may or may not it didn't just start after everyone started having a problem with him.
	I was never at none of those parties.
	You never seen me in no real pictures with him other than the last 20 years, and I was at his party once at the Hamptons with Aaliyah, Jennifer Lopez and the Tony, but that's it and we left Early, but just because I don't fuck with someone publicly or privately, it don't mean I'm going to diss them publicly.
	But if you diss me publicly, I'm getting at you if I know you.
	So then let me go.
	I was just trying to say the temperature.
	Like, we're in a world that people look the other way because when you, again, what I said about Trump, is it all right that his whole crew went to jail?
	Just answer that.
	I think.
	Is that a good boss?
	I think no one is being.
	I didn't ask you that.
	I'm asking you, is it all right that his whole crew went to jail?
	I don't think anybody is being more demonized and caring.
	You're going to be stories.
	I want you to answer my question.
	I'm an independent.
	I'm a registered independent who liked voting for Clinton.
	I did.
	And I voted for that.
	I'm just asking you a question from an independent.
	If somebody's whole crew went to jail, are they a good boss?
	Yes or no?
	It's a yes or no.
	But I don't know.
	But I don't know.
	Yes or no.
	No, but you're also not giving the right answers.
	Yes, I am.
	No, you're not.
	Because you're a part of, Dame, respectfully.
	Respectfully, I respect what you've done to the space you've been a part of.
	It is very hard to make it to the highest level.
	I got a lot of respect for you.
	It depends on what you consider the highest level.
	Well, where you have influence and you're able to sit down with bullies, you said you like to bully the bully.
	You know, it's one of the affirmations I teach my kids?
	Yeah, would you have to?
	Bully the bully.
	I tell my kids.
	Our new record is punch you in your face.
	That's our anti-bully record.
	But the point is, a lot of the things you talk about with raising boys, family, those things, we may be on the same page.
	In a situation right now when I'm bringing up Diddy, the only reason I'm bringing up Diddy is because— You can bring him up.
	Yeah, the last two months, every day something new is coming up about.
	You can't bring him up.
	Listen, he's the topic of conversation.
	You can't, unless you don't bring him up, you're not going to spend it.
	So you got to bring him up.
	Let me ask this other question.
	Are you familiar with Jaguar Wright?
	I'm not friendly with her, but I remember her when we did the unplugged.
	The MTV Unplugged The Heart of the City.
	I think she was doing the.
	She just sang background, but that's the only time I remember really interacting with her much.
	I always remember us being cool.
	There's now some rumors circulating, and you can shut it down the second I say it, that there was a tie with Jay-Z had some stuff to do with Diddy, and they're kind of both being, you know, aligned and quiet about it.
	They're in a lot of pictures together.
	So, yeah.
	What about it?
	I don't know.
	I haven't been around him in the last 10, 15 years.
	Got it.
	Okay.
	You know what's great?
	I don't know about certain things because I haven't been around.
	That's the reason why.
	That's fair.
	The reason why I pivoted because the gray area thing, I don't play those games at all.
	So whatever was going on, I just never even engaged, indulged, or anything.
	Not even look the other way.
	It doesn't look at all.
	I just left.
	You don't see me in none of them pictures.
	Has the Fed at all reached out to you for information or no?
	I haven't been around him like that.
	I'm not around him like that.
	Just because we're black don't mean shit.
	No, that's not it.
	But you guys were partners.
	Like that's a partner.
	Oh, me and Jay?
	At one point.
	Oh, why would they reach out to me for what?
	I don't know if they want to say, hey, is there anything you want to talk to us about?
	You know, with what happened?
	They've never reached out to you.
	Nah.
	Because they're reaching out to a lot of weird people right now.
	I'm not weird.
	Okay.
	They're not going to talk to me.
	I'm not weird.
	All right.
	So let me ask this other question.
	Well, maybe within this context.
	I hope they don't either.
	They better not come knocking at my door with that bullshit.
	I ain't got shit to do with none of that.
	So let me ask this other question.
	See, I'm out of there.
	For me, Class of 96.
	See, I'm the only one that can still talk.
	I'm the one that can come outside.
	I'm not hiding because I ain't got nothing to hide.
	And that's what I mean.
	I can sleep at night.
	Well, that's what I'm saying.
	I think you would be the one that they wouldn't want to talk.
	They would be worrying about you knowing stuff.
	You got to remember, like, people that are committing crimes only tend to commit crimes around other criminals.
	I'm not a criminal like that.
	I'm not going to, they're not going to do things on my watch that I'm not going to be all right because they know I'm going to say something.
	So if I see anything that's unsavory or someone tries me, I'm not keeping that a secret because I'm not scared of the recourse.
	I have no fear of any of those people.
	That's why I could say no because there was no fear.
	You can't even ask me certain questions because you know you're going to get embarrassed.
	That's what's going to happen.
	You know what I mean?
	And if I lose that fight, I'll lose it, but I'm fighting it and everyone's going to know what I'm fighting about.
	And I'm not going to be scared of not being able to get a check from somebody because I'll go earn my own.
	Or like you said, or like I said.
	Because I'm not worried about what people perceive as a win.
	I'm worried about being creative and love is my currency.
	I care about being able to walk in here with my family and be able to work with my family, do books with my family, go to schools, go help close down jails.
	Like, you know, I think there's way better stuff that I'm doing.
	And that's what I noticed.
	What they don't talk about, when no one makes a big deal until it's too late, is, damn, I'm going into schools three or four times a week and talking to kids and teaching them how to dream.
	And I'm going into jails trying to get the recidive rate down.
	That's the shit that matters.
	None of this bullshit matters.
	What's happening with the government, no matter who's president, them kids in Chicago are still sitting in a warehouse with no fucking outdoor space and with a fourth grade reading education.
	And they still foaming at the mouth because they're giving them drugs to get out of jail called the cut program.
	And they're breathing mold in the air.
	And we forgot about the kids.
	We got bigger issues.
	I'm not worried about other people's problems.
	I'm worried about my culture, the people I love and how they're being oppressed and the cycles that need to stop and the people that are enabling us.
	And that's who I'd be going at.
	Success for me ain't how much money I make.
	It's how I move the needle for my culture.
	And I'm not talking about black, white.
	I'm talking about creative thinking.
	I think politics are dumb.
	If we're both fighting for America, how are we going to fight each other to fight for one thing?
	If I'm trying to save a block and you're trying to save my block, I'm not going to fight you to save the block.
	We're going to fight together.
	So instead of worrying about the bullshit, we need to worry about what's going on with these kids, why they can't read.
	Why do they build a jail cell for every time a kid can't read past the fourth grade?
	That's the problem.
	Is why is all this independent sector, the government with these big budgets, paying people to do things for the people, but they're not looking at where they're spending the money or how they're spending the money?
	How could a jail, a kid's jail be a million, 1.2 a bed for a child and they don't even let him, they don't even let him buy a real toothbrush?
	That's the problems that I'm dealing with in this moment is education and teaching my culture.
	Half the people that give a fuck about Trump or Biden, they probably don't even know how to get a law passed.
	They don't know how to lobby.
	They don't even know how to change things.
	You understand what I'm saying?
	Like to make a law or to make change in America is a unilateral decision.
	A lot of people got to agree.
	So that should be what we should be doing is trying to work on how to stick together instead of what makes us separate as a social class.
	It's not about black or white.
	It's about 99% of the world that got to work for the 1%.
	And the way they make the 99% fight each other so that we continue to separate and work for the 1%.
	So either way, all these people that care about the president are paying for a billionaire, but both of them.
	I'm not jacking none of that, Paul's, because I don't know what's going on.
	They're all gray areas.
	I can just control what I see and know.
	I'm not depending on the government to pay for my hospital bills.
	I'm not depending on the government to pay for where I live.
	I'm not knocking anyone that does, but I'm in the, unless it's capital gains, the 40 to 50% bracket.
	And I always owe taxes.
	So when you owe $12 million of taxes, how do you pay that back without making $24 million?
	But they snatching your money every day.
	They fucking with your working capital.
	You know what they don't teach you in school?
	How to have money, how to keep money.
	You know why my network is, I don't know how to keep it.
	I never went to school.
	Nobody taught me how to keep money and when to pay taxes, what capital gains is, what's a trust.
	You know, no one taught none of that shit.
	So that's what we do.
	We talk about people that don't matter, shit that doesn't affect our personal life.
	And we're worried about what other people do and what they could do for us when we should be worried about focusing on how to do for ourselves and understanding the money is man-made.
	I don't give a fuck about money.
	There's no goal behind it.
	It's all a Ponzi scheme.
	I care about love as my currency.
	How much time I spend with my child.
	What's my net worth?
	I'm a dad.
	Did I pick my kid up from school and I bring him to school?
	I could bring him to work.
	Then I could bring him to a jail.
	I could bring him to a school and he's going to watch his daddy be a superhero.
	That's all that matters to me.
	So when you look at all these so-called moguls, you don't see their family life.
	You see contrived pictures of something that doesn't even matter on a red carpet and their children aren't with them.
	I'm at home with my kids and then I'm being creative and I'm creating my own.
	Like I direct my own movies.
	I get them funded or funded myself.
	I put them out, distributed myself, and then I put them on my own streaming service.
	That's amazing.
	To be able to write a book and sell 60,000 books by myself and you don't know it, that's amazing.
	That's impressive.
	To have my own sneakers, to have my own, all that shit is amazing.
	To me, I'm not worried about that bubblegum shit.
	That's why I left it.
	You understand what I mean?
	But I'm not going to be grouped up never.
	And the feds don't need to call me because if they're watching or listening, they're like, yo, this motherfucker just living a nice, pleasant, boring life.
	The only lawsuit you're going to get from me is I yelled at you.
	That's it.
	You're not going to get none of that old funny shit because that's not what I do.
	There is no gray area with Dame Dash.
	And the receipts are there.
	Period.
	I tape everything.
	So yeah.
	That was great.
	By the way, why do you think crime is so high in Chicago?
	Because it's such a big state.
	You think because it's a big state?
	Yeah, it's like 16.
	There's plenty of big states, but why is Chicago so high?
	Go Google it.
	The reason why they say the crime rate is relative to how many people there.
	So so many people get killed because so many people are in one spot.
	You understand what I'm saying?
	It's just a big spot.
	That's why it is.
	But I would say the reason why is because the government enables the kids.
	They're not doing anything to stop it.
	It's happening worldwide.
	They're getting kids used to going to jail.
	What happened?
	Policies.
	I just think that if you put a kid in a situation where he has enemies and then take him away to go to jail and come back and put him back in the same situation, he's going back to jail.
	I think if you don't educate a child and you disenfranchise his family, you're going to jail.
	Rob, could you pull up the clip?
	Could you pull up the clip by Ice Cube?
	I'm curious.
	And I still have one last question within that context that I go back to, but I want to play this clip for you.
	Here's Cube with Bill Maher.
	Okay.
	And I kind of want you to hear this and tell me if you agree with him.
	Go for it.
	Okay, let's take rap music.
	Let's take same people who own the labels on the prisons.
	True.
	So literally the same people?
	Literally the same people who own the labels on private prisons.
	So, so, you know, it seems really kind of suspicious, if you want to say that word, that.
	It seems obvious.
	You know, the records that come out are really geared to push people towards their prison industry.
	But they didn't make you write those lyrics.
	It's not about making, it's not about making somebody write the lyrics.
	It's about Being there as guardrails to make sure certain songs make it through and certain songs don't.
	Certain flavors are exposed on the record.
	You know, some records are made by committee.
	Meaning record company guys sit around and tell the artists, this is hot.
	Say that.
	Do this.
	We're going to have this guy write the lyrics.
	We're going to have that.
	So the narrative is really kind of, you know, structured and really made into what the record company want the record to be.
	And what the, you know, a lot of artists are frustrated with this kind of music making.
	You know, a lot of people, you know, feel like they're being controlled by the label.
	You can't stop how they do it.
	What are your thoughts?
	Thoughts on what he's saying here?
	It's true.
	It's obvious.
	You never told me if a boss is a good boss if his whole crew goes to jail.
	Not Trump, just in general.
	If a whole, if a boss...
	If this whole crew goes to jail, he's around the mob.
	Right.
	Right.
	If his whole crew goes to jail, is he a good boss?
	You ever been to jail?
	Can you answer my question?
	I don't judge it that way.
	I'm asking you a question.
	I wouldn't judge it that way.
	Okay.
	So you don't judge a boss by how good his family rolls?
	Well, let me ask you a question.
	Let me ask you a different question.
	But I'm asking you a question.
	How about I ask you a different question?
	Here's a question for you.
	I'm asking you what.
	How do you judge a boss if 47 people around them are killed?
	I didn't ask you that.
	Oh, it depends.
	It depends.
	If it was 4,000 people, only 47 got killed, then I'll say that's not the bad odd.
	Got it.
	So then it depends would be the answer.
	I asked you if his whole crew goes to jail.
	Yeah.
	Is he a good boss?
	I thought you were trying to unify.
	Now you're trashing a president.
	I mean, what kind of a unifier are you?
	What happened?
	Wait, Choose a position.
	No, don't, you can't tell me what to do.
	Tell me.
	Listen, listen.
	You're not listening.
	I'm not saying that about Trump.
	I'm saying that in general.
	Forget Trump.
	If you're a boss and your man right there and everyone that's in here goes to jail but you, are you a good boss?
	So was Sugar good boss?
	You're not going to answer my question, huh?
	Because it depends.
	It's the same.
	How much are you getting?
	I'm not talking about another man.
	I would tell you it depends.
	Okay.
	So it's a, it's a.
	In what way could your whole crew go to jail and you're a good boss?
	But in what way can 47 associates close to you get killed?
	What does that have to do with what I'm talking about?
	I'm asking a question for me.
	But you're not answering mine.
	You're not answering my question.
	Because I'm giving you the same answer you're giving me.
	I didn't give you a question.
	Wait, I'm asking you a question.
	No, I'm asking you, all I said was, I didn't say it depends.
	I said if a boss goes, if his whole crew goes to jail and he does not, is he a good boss?
	I'm not talking about Trump.
	You are talking about.
	No, I'm not.
	You know how many motherfuckers I know whose whole crew went to jail?
	That's just a shoe fit to wearing.
	I don't have no beef with this.
	Let me get it clear.
	Tell me.
	I'm not in here to be Trump bashing or Biden bashing or any of that.
	I'm just asking you a question of logic, not about politics.
	Dame, do you think racism exists?
	So you're not going to answer my question.
	I gave it to you.
	I said it depends.
	That's not an answer.
	You know that.
	Do you think racism exists?
	Of course it does.
	It does.
	Yeah.
	I'm racist as fuck.
	So funny about that.
	You said you're racist yourself?
	Yeah.
	Why are you?
	I'm against bitch-ass niggas.
	Okay.
	So, but is that skin color or could that be white, black, Asian, anything?
	White, black, Asian.
	Anything.
	Okay, so let me specify.
	Do you think racism towards a skin color or nationality ethnicity exists?
	There's definitely things that I assume because of color.
	If you want to call that racism, yeah, just because of natural experience.
	What do you think about when you see a white guy executive of a major label?
	What do you think about?
	Of a major label, like music label.
	Let's just say.
	Let me finish.
	A major black label.
	If a white guy's running a black label, that's problematic for me.
	If a white guy's running a black label, how about a black guy running a white label?
	It doesn't happen, but it doesn't matter.
	I think there's no such thing as a white label.
	That's what's funny, right?
	When you go into music, black music, but there's no white music.
	They don't have a white music division.
	It's just a black music division.
	Why is that?
	Is that racist?
	I'm asking you, is that racist?
	Can you be, I'm not in the space, so I don't know.
	So be specific.
	Like, who has a black every music?
	Do they say black or do they say hip-hop?
	Because Eminem is white and he sold more records.
	I'm not sugarcoating shit.
	I said it's called black music.
	Head of black music.
	I'm not black and I listen to hip-hop.
	You're not answering any of my questions, bro.
	Yeah.
	I said, is it racist?
	Reside me on your podcast.
	I'll answer your questions.
	All right, come on.
	Come to America, New.
	No, you owe me that.
	I'm with you.
	That's my thing.
	I'm gang.
	I'm with you.
	I'm with you.
	What I'm saying is there is a black music division in every label.
	There is.
	Okay.
	And there isn't a white music division in every label.
	So I'm asking you, is that racist?
	But you're not going to answer.
	It's going to depend.
	I know.
	No, no, I don't know the facts.
	I gave you the facts.
	You do know the facts now.
	No, no, I don't know.
	I'm telling you the facts.
	Why are you doing that?
	I would say a net worth.
	A hip-hop.
	What's your net worth?
	What's your net worth?
	I got a couple dollars here.
	So you asked me, and I'm asking you, what's your net worth?
	Put it between $300 to $500.
	$300 or $500 million?
	No, since something over.
	Since I'm what?
	Since something over.
	When you say net worth, that means you're looking at half a billion cash?
	Yes.
	Do you pay taxes on it?
	Cash, I would say shy of 200 cash.
	Oh, yeah.
	Since I'm over, man.
	Yeah.
	I'm at an auction.
	I'm about to sell my interest of Reasonable Doubt, Rockefeller Inc.
	Okay.
	You want to buy it?
	What's it going for?
	It's at auction.
	At auction?
	Yeah.
	Tell me.
	Send me an information.
	I'll look into it.
	I'm telling you.
	Send it to me if it's an auction.
	I'm talking.
	I'm going to be able to bid.
	No, you said auction.
	It's an auction.
	You said how much is it?
	It says at auction, but you know, I have a judgment.
	So once you're in the business.
	I have that feeling our dinner would be 10 times better than this podcast.
	You paying for it?
	I don't have a problem paying for it.
	There's no question.
	Can I ask you this?
	Well, how do you look at a half a billion?
	I would blow all of that shit.
	How did you save it?
	You save it?
	You just look at it?
	Who do you look at?
	How do you look at your money?
	Well, you ask it.
	How often do you look at your bank account?
	Like, say, once a quarter I meet with my guy.
	You meet your guy?
	Yeah.
	Once a quarter.
	We meet with the whole team.
	It's too hard.
	Saving money is so hard.
	I mean, I'm saying saving it.
	Like when money's sitting, there's so many laws that come with it.
	And unless you're savvy about how to hold it, you're going to lose it, man.
	But you know what it is?
	It's so hard.
	Pause that.
	Well, listen, I lost everything at 23, 24, 25.
	The first time I made money.
	23 years old.
	No, we get it.
	I lose everything every year.
	But let me tell you, when I hit rock bottom at 25, my entire mindset changed.
	What's rock bottom, Jail?
	No, I didn't go to jail.
	What was rock bottom?
	No, rock bottom is lost financially.
	I'm about to file bankruptcy.
	I don't have a penny to my name.
	That's not rock bottom.
	All my credit cards are maxed out.
	Relationships are gone.
	Girlfriend, fiancé, and I'm about to go back into the military.
	To me, at 24, 25, that was rock bottom for me.
	You're spoiled.
	You're so funny.
	Let me tell you something.
	Rock bottom is when you don't have a place to live and you're a drug addict and you don't have your health.
	No, that's not mentally stable.
	Financially rock bottom.
	Financially rock bottom.
	25.
	Everyone's financially rock bottom.
	Yeah, well, these are the dudes.
	But what it did do, you know what I did learn?
	Kids usually are in college coming out of college with fucking debt, right?
	You know who you are.
	You know Warren Buffett, obviously.
	And you know Charlie Munger.
	Charlie Munger is his partner that passed away.
	There's a book he wrote called The Poor Charlie's Almanac.
	It's a very good book for you to have in the house.
	Just kind of look through.
	They interviewed his kids and they said, what did Charlie talk about during dinner with you guys?
	He said, that's the book right there, by the way.
	He said, dad always talked about people he knew that could have been rock stars that totally ruined their lives because of bad decisions.
	He taught more how to make bad decisions and avoid them than how to make good decisions.
	A lot of times when we get money or fame or success, sometimes you don't know how to handle the limelight.
	Sometimes you don't know how to do it.
	Again, how does somebody coming from a social class of 99% understand day one how to deal with zero?
	I'm with you.
	No, I'm not going to be able to do that.
	For sure.
	But I'm saying at 24, you say you're broke.
	It's hilarious.
	Everyone at 24 is broke right now.
	Just asking Gen Z.
	But I was a worker and I was a sales guy.
	I was a guy that actually worked.
	What I'm saying is I think it was way worse at the time than you thought.
	In hindsight, now.
	The worst point of my life, the worst point of my life was living in Iran, going through a war till 10 years old, and we got bombed 167 times.
	That's real stuff that we have.
	Where did that happen?
	Iran.
	Oh, you're from Iran?
	I'm from Iran.
	Yeah, I was born in 78.
	We left Iran at 89.
	So I lived in Iran for almost 11 years.
	But going back, selfish question.
	Selfish question.
	Dame, say whatever you want to this answer, okay?
	Just want to see what you're going to say.
	You do know I'm always going to say whatever I want.
	I know you are.
	I know you're not.
	You never have to premise it with me.
	I don't need the permission.
	You don't need any, no one's permission.
	I know, selfishly.
	Selfishly for you.
	That's the question.
	Okay, Dame.
	Come on, historian.
	Here's selfish issues.
	I'm not a historian.
	I'm high a lot.
	I'm very cloudy.
	Well, at this point, after spending an hour and a half with you, I'm probably high as well because I've been smelling you for an hour and a half.
	Well, I ain't been smoking it, but if I could, I will light up.
	Yeah, so but here's my power.
	Here's a question for you.
	Do you know yourself?
	You don't have to say it.
	Do you know for a fact yourself who killed Tupac and who killed Biggie?
	I've heard.
	You don't know.
	I don't know.
	Okay, got it.
	I mean, all I know is what I saw on the documentary there, but I don't know if I believe any of that shit.
	Got it.
	Got it.
	So the thing about algorithms is, and what I see, especially with social media things that pop up on your phone, they just push certain things every day to where it becomes like if some, if you see something seven times or someone tell you something seven times, you memorize it no matter what.
	Like a song.
	If you hear a song you hate seven times straight because your kid likes it, you're going to know the song.
	So there's things that I don't want to know about all day, but because they're putting it, put like this puff situation.
	Every day, all day, conspiracy be about puff, conspiracy about Jay, conspiracy about this one, conspiracy about that one, all day long.
	I'm just happy that I'm not clear if it's true or not because I wasn't around those guys for the last 10 years.
	And I made the choice for certain reasons.
	So that should tell you enough.
	What was your reason?
	I didn't want to get caught up in the gray area.
	You have to be like, see, when Nancy Reagan did that slogan, just say no, I took it to heart.
	Just say no.
	You have to know how to say no.
	Be careful with that.
	She was a Republican.
	Be very careful.
	See, what you're doing is trying to divide us.
	And I never said that I'm for or not for.
	I didn't say that.
	All I did was bring, there's things about Joe Biden that I'll bring up that I'll say, boop, boop, boop, you know what I mean?
	But in one instance, just because I want someone to validate and I want to know what their morals are like.
	So listen to me.
	If I ask somebody, and this is not a question I ask about Trump.
	This is because I want to know the nature of the person.
	If you're doing well and the rest of your crew is not, are you a good boss?
	Now, there are people that will say yes.
	And then I say, I'm not fucking with that.
	No, I don't agree with that.
	That's what I'm saying.
	So that's the nature.
	So for me, again, I look at how people look at things to know how much business I want to do with them.
	So if you're a guy that says, yo, if my whole crew goes to jail, that means you're going to sell your crew under the bus, that usually means you're a rat.
	And it usually means that you're getting people to do the work that you should be doing yourself.
	But I don't want anyone to ever walk away from having an experience with me.
	Look, even though maybe some of the people that I put on aren't having the best lives, but when Jay's not with me, he's a bayonet.
	Kanye, when he chooses to be, is a bayonet there.
	Kev Hart, Lee Daniels, Rachel Roy.
	People don't walk away from me going to jail.
	They walk away from me going to a bank.
	Now, is that a good boss?
	That's a builder.
	That's a builder leader.
	Is that a good boss?
	I don't know if I define it as a boss.
	What do you define a ball?
	So we might have two definitions.
	Leader.
	A boss isn't a leader?
	Not necessarily.
	No.
	Not necessarily.
	To me, I think.
	You're not going to like that you said that.
	You have to lead by example when you're the boss.
	I agree.
	So how is he not the leader?
	No, some people, when it comes on.
	Then that's not a real boss.
	Listen, if a boss, if a company can't run without the boss, we're probably saying the same thing.
	If a company can't run.
	That's a good definition for me.
	If a company can't, maybe the words are different.
	That's what it is.
	We're saying the same thing.
	But if a company can't run without the boss, you're not a good boss.
	Well, when I was 28 years old, I'll tell you this.
	Everybody, listen to me.
	I made a record because I'm also in a rock band called The Black Guns, and I have a record out coming out with.
	Can he Google it or not?
	Yeah, yeah.
	365.
	I wasn't mad.
	You think because I bring something up?
	I'm having fun with you.
	I'm having way more fun with you.
	I'm having way more fun with you.
	But I don't want you to have a bunch of Republicans on my door.
	You know what I'm saying?
	Like, I don't want that.
	I'm not here for that.
	You know what I'm saying?
	So stop that shit and that marriage.
	I'm going to be lobbying damn tasks.
	I knew once I saw the American flag, I said, oh, it's going to.
	We love America.
	So you're like one of the things.
	I would rather have an Iranian.
	I don't even care about that.
	Are you one of those obsessed kind of guys with this guy?
	Which guy?
	Trump.
	No, I love America.
	But motherfuckers are.
	I didn't ask you that.
	You know what I noticed that I can't get a direct question out of people that love that guy?
	No, nothing.
	What do you want to know about that?
	I didn't ask you your relationship.
	I said, are you obsessed with him?
	Because this is an obsession.
	No, I'm obsessed with my family.
	My dreams are vision.
	Let me speak.
	What I see that.
	We're about to get into a big argument.
	No, we're not.
	Don't do this.
	It's not an argument.
	We're doing good.
	That's not an argument.
	It won't be good unless there's an argument.
	What I see are people obsessed with him living precariously through him from a certain social class.
	Sure.
	And it's either they're really broke without teeth in their mouth and usually not the brightest and probably never voted until they had to do this.
	And then I see people that sometimes have a lot of money that want their taxes cut.
	And for me, the reason why I can't get involved, because there are certain things that I can't look away from.
	So I don't get involved because, yeah, it might be in my best interest from the tax bracket I'm in when I have money to be a Republican.
	But I come from the 99%.
	But now I'm seeing a lot of the 99% of Republicans and the whole Republican Party is completely different than it was before.
	You know, none of the ones wearing a suit at the Republican Party anymore.
	A lot of people don't even take showers.
	You know, there's no disrespect, but I don't want to say it like that, but sometimes you see him.
	I want to make sure, you know, I took a shower this morning.
	I look harder than the Penn Party.
	But there's, but it'd be people that be like, no teeth in their mouth that are just obsessed with this man.
	And then, so I'm not mad at him because he hasn't never really said nothing bad about me.
	And I was around him and his family, you know, and I ain't going to, again, it's like when you know people, you can't just diss them.
	I can't do that.
	You know, even if there's a problem with the rest of the public perception, if we were cool at one point, we're going to be cool.
	But I just see that people are fanatical about him.
	That's all.
	And that is probably to me, fanatic.
	I think you're making a good argument.
	Fanatical is problematic to me because whenever there's fanatical, I think.
	Wait, wait, whenever there's fanatical, there's always some bullshit that comes with it.
	It's a gray area.
	I think the same could be said about Obama.
	Obama, people were fanatical about him.
	That was dramatically fanatical.
	Like, he was black Jesus for a lot of people.
	No, no, no, no.
	You know, there were a lot of people.
	Let me ask you a question.
	If there was ever a president of America from Iran, do you know what that would mean for the people of Iran?
	Meaning that are from there to know that someone from Iran could actually be a president.
	Even he was a bad and good president.
	For us as black people, we never saw a black president.
	It didn't matter if he was a good advocate.
	Well, I agree.
	You're taking it as a negative.
	I'm not saying that as a negative.
	I was saying, I'm saying that guy was a hero.
	I was saying that the fanatical part is, I don't see the fanatical part you're saying.
	And if you can compare the two, that would be a little sucky.
	Oh, that's exactly.
	I mean, what you got from the Dungeons.
	Let nobody wear hats and doing all this violence and rushing the motherfucking ticket.
	Well, come on, bro.
	He actually turned white people into black people.
	That shit was funny as hell.
	He had motherfuckers breaking shit and running into stuff.
	That was a proper riot.
	But not only, and again, I'm not dissing the man, but I'm just looking at the circumstance.
	Not only did his whole crew.
	What do you have against him?
	What did he do to you?
	I don't have anything against him.
	Why does he trigger you?
	Why do you get upset about Trump?
	Why do you think I'm upset about Trump?
	You're trying to make that.
	Because you keep coming back five times.
	You brought it up.
	Nigga, you just brought up.
	That's to me, Trump is his.
	Tell me how I brought it up.
	Listen, Trump is white Diddy.
	Trump is white Diddy?
	People talk about Trump all day long because not a lot.
	What's being linked to Diddy is young boys.
	There's nothing about that with Trump is beautiful woman.
	Young boys with.
	You're not hearing.
	See, you're not letting me.
	Diddy is young boys.
	Listen to what I'm saying.
	These are concerning stuff.
	For black people, everyone is going to be talking about Diddy for Puff right now.
	For white people, everyone's going to be talking about Trump.
	So Trump has the most charges out right now.
	So people are going to ask about him and talk about him.
	Diddy, Puff, has the most charges.
	Oh, that's what you're saying.
	Yeah, I got to say that.
	That's why I'm asking you.
	You're asking me about it.
	Yeah, but there's a difference.
	No, it's not different.
	You're asking me 30 questions about Puff and me asking you two questions about Trump.
	Maybe the question is what you got against Puff?
	Why do you keep asking me about him?
	Because I think he was behind Tupac's murder.
	But why you keep asking me?
	Because if you really want to know, I'm talking about that.
	Why are you asking me about him?
	Because you're in the space.
	I'm not in that space.
	Now, that's racist.
	That's racist.
	Are you kidding me?
	What 95?
	What's 96?
	What year is it now?
	It was 2025.
	Tupac.19.
	That was 25 years.
	That was 25 years ago.
	And that's who I'm talking to.
	The most qualified guy from that era.
	I am not the most qualified guy from that era.
	Come on.
	I'm just black in that era.
	Dame, I'm asking it.
	I'm from the East Coast.
	Brother, so you're talking 94, November 25th.
	I'm talking 2024, Trump.
	I know.
	What I'm asking you.
	You're talking 2020, 2096.
	1996, Puff?
	95.
	You guys started freaking Rockefeller 96.
	I've been rolling for 30, 40 years.
	Do you know who Greg Kading is?
	No.
	Greg Kading is the detective who was on the Big E case on the Tupac case.
	I'll be back to that.
	Okay.
	Is that trending or some shit?
	I'm telling you, look, listen, if you want to know who I've interviewed everybody I can get my hands on with the JFK assassination.
	I'm curious, guy.
	I'm not the guy.
	I don't know.
	I understand that.
	And now I know that you're not the guy.
	I never said I was the guy.
	I'm heartbroken.
	You're not broken.
	I can't tell you about Puff.
	No, no, because I was hoping to get more into it.
	Yo, can you send me, you want to do an investment or something?
	You got 300 million.
	Let's talk some business.
	I don't want to talk no gossip.
	I want to get some money.
	What are we doing?
	What are we doing?
	You let me know.
	Send something over.
	I'll flip it.
	Pause.
	Send some over.
	What are we doing?
	Let's see what we got here.
	Give me a second here.
	Okay.
	All right.
	I got a couple last questions for you before we wrap up.
	Let me see what you're going to say about this.
	See if we can even get an answer here.
	I'm hoping we can.
	From you, if I ask you a question, I ain't getting no answer.
	Dame, question for you.
	I'm not even going to ask you one.
	AI, how do you think AI is going to affect hip-hop?
	Hip-hop.
	Like, you know, ChatGPT, people are sitting there.
	You know what I'm saying?
	I'm trying to process.
	I think that ChatGPT as it relates to lyrics, I don't know that that will help, but, you know, it's cheating.
	But I think that if an artist wants to be a boss and put his own stuff out, chat GBT can organize a lot of business for them, like make decks and, you know. that kind of thing.
	If you know how to use ChatGPT, it can help a boss cut a lot of costs.
	If you're dependent on people to give you a job, it might take your job.
	It depends on how you look at it.
	There's a yin and a yin of everything.
	There's a dark and the good of everything.
	You know what I'm saying?
	So if Dame today is 22 years old, how would you leverage AI today in hip-hop?
	If it's a 22-year-old dame.
	It would be no assistance.
	You know what I mean?
	I'd be writing my own decks.
	How much notes, you know, even down to like Zoom and AI while you do Zoom and all just the things that the little things, a lot of little things, and also organizing my thoughts.
	So like if I have a treatment and I want to, I wouldn't have to hire someone to write a treatment.
	I could have it write it for.
	There's a lot of things that if you know what AI does as a boss, you can eliminate costs.
	So if I look at AI, my perspective is how much cost can I eliminate by using AI?
	So this time, instead of paying a lawyer to write a legal letter, I just go to AI.
	You know what I mean?
	If there's some facts I need to know, you have to be smart to know how to use AI.
	Like if you're good at movies, you can make scripts with it.
	It doesn't mean it's writing it for you.
	It just organizes it for you.
	If you know how to, if you're in the movie business, you can, instead of hiring a line producer to break a script down, you could just have it break a script down.
	So it takes a lot of the little jobs away that cost $1,200 here, $1,500 here, just to take notes or just to organize or just to break things down.
	It does a lot of that for you.
	So on the creative side, you don't think it's going to do anything on the creative side?
	Or do you think it can have an impact?
	I think that it's going to, like there's vinyl, then there's digital.
	So there's going to be a place for vinyl.
	AI is going to be, or digital, AI.
	There's going to be a place for vinyl, which will be real.
	I don't think you'll ever be able to replace the show with AI because people want to see and see people sweat.
	You know, anything that's physical, a physical thing, like, you know, the music business, the way you make your money is through the show.
	Contrary to what anybody thinks, it's through your show and your mercs.
	So if, you know, you might have AI design your merch, but, you know, you physically have to still get it made.
	And, you know, there's these holograms, but I don't think people are going to pay to see a hologram.
	You're going to have to be on stage.
	So no matter what's fundamentally in the music business, you have to know how to route a tour.
	You have to know how to build your brand.
	You have to make your activus with your seven legs.
	And you have to be able to take advantage of the music being a commercial to stimulate maybe eight other things.
	That's important.
	Now, again, I'm not sitting with 500 million in the bank, but I think I have more fun than you.
	I don't know about that.
	100%.
	I don't know about that.
	100%.
	You think you have more fun than me?
	Come on, bro.
	Dame, I'm telling y'all.
	You got more fun than me.
	There's no way you have.
	You think so?
	Are you creative?
	I am very creative.
	What do you do?
	Creative, let me see.
	Creatively?
	Yeah, let's go video for video, movie for movie.
	No, no, not for art.
	No, no, I'm not.
	I'm not a professional.
	Wait, wait, wait.
	I'm not a professional singer.
	No, but you are.
	I'm a professional.
	Like you said, I'm a brand builder, but I'm saying on a creative level, what do you do for creativity?
	For creativity, it's for fun.
	What do you do for creativity?
	Are you kidding me?
	Like everything we do here.
	I'll show you afterwards what we do up there.
	Can you tell me?
	Yeah, we run it.
	So your name is Mr. No Direct Answer.
	We run AI.
	But direct questions, but no direct answer.
	You should be a comedian, Dan.
	Well, you know, I discovered you.
	I'm your father.
	I know.
	I remember you saying that.
	But you know, I discovered Kevin Hart.
	Tell me.
	What do you mean?
	I took him off the stage and put him in his first director of his first movie.
	See, you don't even know.
	Paper soldiers, get on the Google.
	Come on, get it.
	Get it, get it, get it.
	There you go.
	What do you think about him?
	I mean, I don't, I'm mad at him because he won't post my shit on Instagram because I caught him wearing Uggs one day and I'm funnier than him when we snap.
	So he's my little man, and I just wish that the guys that I did help without having to, you don't have to do anything, but if it doesn't cost you money, the support would be good.
	But, you know, hopefully he didn't do no funny shit.
	There's Paper Soldiers.
	There's Kevin Hart.
	Boom, bang, bang, boom.
	Respect.
	That's in his book.
	Respect.
	You didn't even know that.
	Look, blew your mind again.
	I don't know this.
	This I didn't.
	You know, I put a heart on.
	I had Kevin Hart perform at one of our events six years ago.
	Five years ago.
	He didn't even tell you about it, right?
	I'm the guy that put him on, discovered him next day, put him in the movie.
	First two or three.
	And by the way, he's killing it, and he's going to be a billionaire.
	Well, it's just that when you say you should be a comedian, I hit you with some mega bullshit and say, bong, I just discovered the best you're doing.
	You're funny, though, Dame.
	You got a very interesting sense of humor with a three-second delay.
	I got to, it takes me three seconds to.
	Okay, let me ask you a question here.
	Rap.
	Top five, greatest all time.
	Instead of saying you can't say it, let's see.
	I don't have, bro, I've been in rap my whole life.
	So who's your top five?
	My top five rapper?
	Ever, all time.
	You'd be surprised.
	The ones I like.
	I don't think I'll be surprised.
	Like OC, Chubb Rock.
	I think Buster Rond is off the hook.
	Oh, shit.
	Yeah.
	Buster Rond could rap.
	Most death.
	It's too many.
	That's what I'm saying.
	It's like a lot of people that I like for different reasons, for different, as far as rap goes.
	You know, Biggie, but you know, the thing about it is, you know, Biggie only had a couple of years.
	So I was curious.
	Like, I look at the whole, the whole career.
	You know what I mean?
	So, like, you know, I'm curious to know what Jimi Hendrix would have looked like past 27.
	You know what I mean?
	30, 40 or Janice Joplin or all these rock stars.
	So, you know, it's easy to be cool when you're young.
	It's hard.
	Not for me.
	But when you're really cool, when you're 50, I'm 53.
	I've been rolling since I'm like 19, 18.
	I've been in the public eye.
	I'm still relevant now.
	Why?
	I haven't had to hit anything in a while.
	You know what I mean?
	I've been just focusing.
	My retirement now has been just learning how to love and healing.
	You know, I have a lot of unrecognized trauma.
	So, you know, things that I thought were normal are not.
	Like, imagine this life that every, like, you know, how you're talking to me, this shit was normal to me.
	It was normal to walk away.
	It was normal to tell people that things weren't right and people not listen.
	You know what I mean?
	You know, like I said, I think I'm the only ones that's just not compromised.
	There is no funny little tapes on me.
	There is no conspiracy of people.
	And when they are like.
	That's tough to do.
	Good for you.
	It's not.
	It's not.
	It's tough if you're not a space.
	And that's space stealth.
	If you're thorough.
	Like, again, like, you know, I'm a real, not to say like, I don't want to say anyone else isn't, but I'm just a guy that was never scared to say no and was never scared to say, yo, you're not going to compromise.
	See, what happens is once somebody got something on you, they control you.
	So what they do is they get people in a compromising situation.
	And now they've shared a crime.
	And one could always tell on you.
	Well, that's what they say about Diddy, the fact that he had cameras in every single room and recorded and had so much info on him.
	They're calling him the Epstein of hip-hop industry.
	That's crazy.
	It is crazy.
	Yeah.
	And if it's true, he deserves what he gets.
	If it's not true, then he doesn't deserve it.
	For sure, innocent until proven guilty.
	Exactly.
	But I'm not, but I'm not leaning toward anything.
	I know, again, I just know that there was certain energy I stood away from.
	And, you know, you could tell by the pictures which energy that was.
	Good for you.
	Last question, we wrap up.
	I'm going to give you five rappers.
	See if you can rank them.
	Okay.
	I don't rank rappers.
	Just, dude, help me.
	Help me with this seeing which one of these guys you think are better.
	Okay.
	You got Nas, you got Andre 3000.
	You got M, you got Tupac.
	You got Biggie.
	Biggie and Pac died early.
	Andre 3000 doesn't do shows, but he could rap.
	Who else?
	Nas and an Eminem.
	Nas, what about him?
	Eminem is white, and he could rap really well.
	He could really rap, but he's still white.
	And what's uh.
	What does that mean?
	He's still white.
	If you were to ask about hip-hop, out of 10 white people that came in here, would any of them be specialists?
	If they were from that era, probably not.
	Other minimum.
	If you were to ask 10 black people from that era like myself about hip-hop, they would know because in that moment, hip-hop was a black sport created by black people.
	So it's hard for a black man to say a white man is the best at anything that's supposed to be a black sport.
	You're not going to get that from me.
	Interesting.
	Yeah, I'm racist.
	At least you're consistent.
	I don't call it racist, but racist is when you judge a man for his color to me.
	I don't judge a person because of the color of their skin.
	I judge them because of the color of their soul.
	I'm racist in that way.
	But also, I also rock out with the culture when I say I look for the overall the biggest impact.
	I don't consider success what most people consider success.
	And I don't want anyone on here to anti, I'm not saying anything about, again, when I know people, I'm not, like, even though I don't agree with a person, it don't mean I'm a diss them in public.
	If we have an issue, if I disagree with you out of respect for the relationship, we'll take care of it behind closed doors.
	So you're asking about questions about people that I might run into and be like, yo, why are you talking about me on this?
	You know what I mean?
	You don't have to worry about that.
	So I'm not doing that because we've had, like, Puppet and I have had those interactions where it's like, yo, we don't, why are you calling me out on the radio?
	We have, you know, we don't do that with each other.
	You know what I'm saying?
	So it's just regardless of what's going on, I just still respect certain morals because just because someone ain't right don't mean I'm going to not be right.
	And I just consider it chatty, like girly to talk about people when they're not there unless they've done something to me personally that I need to rectify as it relates to narrative.
	You know, so there's a narrative about me that there's things that, you know, I'm difficult, blah, blah, blah.
	And that's coming from people that have conspired against me so that they could get the money that they're trying to get.
	And, you know, they want to use my business model or they want to get with one of my artists or artists I work with and become their, you know, source of business accriment.
	You know what I'm saying?
	As opposed to me doing it.
	Like, you can't get no money with him if I'm around.
	You know what I mean?
	You can't jerk that man, Paul's, if I'm around.
	I'm not going to let this man do something corny.
	I'm not talking about Jay.
	I'm talking about in general.
	I'm the guy that's always protected the artist.
	I'm the guy that protects the culture.
	I'm the guy that's the least less, I'm the least toxic.
	So in business, what's toxic to you?
	Something that if you buy it, you could get a lawsuit.
	That's toxic.
	The only lawsuit you're going to get out of me is I yelled at somebody.
	There's no gray areas.
	And I've been through it.
	So I've had lawyers because being accused of something is part of the game and not true.
	So I've had, I've been accused of sexual assault and went through full trials.
	And that person be straight lying.
	You know, I just went through one.
	Straight lying.
	And they'll put it in the newspaper when they accuse you of it, but they never put you in a newspaper when you.
	Innocent.
	So I won.
	This girl, Monique, tried to say that, you know, I, because I, because I got sued for defamation, but allegedly I said I caught her stealing because I had, you know, I said the words wrong.
	And, you know, she came out and said that, you know, I sexually assaulted her and all this other shit.
	And it was so far from the truth.
	Not even a gray area.
	So I took it to trial and beat it.
	But it was all over the New York Times, all over the news.
	When I won, not a word.
	Same lawyer, Paul, his name, Chris Brown.
	See, what they've been doing is this hustle.
	Like, I'll say allegedly, just so this bastard can't sue me because that's what he always does.
	So I'll do a movie with somebody or something, and we'll have an agreement.
	You know, you promote it, we promote it, blah, blah, blah.
	I go promote it.
	They take the copyright.
	They take the asset.
	They go copyrighted behind my back and then say I violated the copyright and priest on the copyright.
	So as if I hurt the business.
	It's like a setup.
	So they've done this like three, four times.
	This dude, Chris Brown, pause, allegedly.
	I'm going to just keep saying allegedly no matter what, because they keep suing me.
	Not the good clothing, bread.
	Not the singer.
	Yeah, it should be.
	That's good.
	So you choose a clothing brand?
	I'm overdoing it, allegedly.
	Allegedly.
	Allegedly not.
	So did you make that suit?
	You got tailored?
	Nah, this is Tom Ford.
	Wait, wait.
	Wait, wait.
	You have a couple hundred million in the bank and you buying off the rack?
	No, no.
	This is Tom Ford's 007 suit I got on.
	This is a Tomo Ritchie shirt.
	So did you buy that out of a store or was it tailored up or what happened?
	This is tailored up.
	This is.
	So wait, wait, you went to a thing and they tailored it up for Tom Brown?
	I'm really curious to know where you're going with this.
	I'm just curious to know.
	You want to get into suit business?
	Is that what you want to do?
	I make suits.
	I was trained in Savo Row.
	I make all my suits and my shirts and everything.
	Really?
	So I was going to make sure there's no glue in there.
	I was like, yo, I want to make sure you.
	So you said that's a Tom Brown or Tom Ford?
	Tom Ford.
	You know Tom Ford?
	Yeah.
	You know Tom Ford.
	Not like, you know, we run into each other in fashion.
	Not personally, I say what's up.
	I don't like the fact that he said that he could bone any man, Paul.
	I didn't like that.
	So you got to be careful when you wear someone's brand.
	You represent exactly what I got.
	So what do you not wear at all?
	I'm not wearing Tom Ford.
	What else do you not wear?
	I usually wear my own brand.
	So like my man Willie Esco made this.
	My man Barter made these.
	I wear my own sneakers.
	These are my own glasses.
	It's nothing like nothing I won't wear.
	But if I know a person, and so what happens when you buy a brand, you're buying what they represent.
	So no disrespect to being gay or anything.
	It's not gay.
	So if a gay man, and that's what he's projecting, like he's been and said, like, yo, every man could get boned.
	This is what he said.
	You know what I'm saying?
	I saw it on thing.
	So I'm like, I'm not wearing none of that shit because that's the lifestyle that it represents.
	So he's gay?
	Tom Ford is gay?
	Yeah, allegedly.
	You know that?
	Allegedly brand.
	See, what do you keep going back to?
	Nah, I just want to get sued.
	Listen, I mean, it doesn't matter, but yeah, Tom Ford.
	You wear that gear.
	Wait, wait, Tom Ford is like proud of it, bro.
	What are you talking about?
	Let me see here.
	You better watch what you wear, bro.
	You don't really know what you're saying.
	I'm serious.
	Like, motherfuckers, we were like, if you look at a brand and it's about saying this, but shit, and you wear that.
	I had no idea.
	I had no idea.
	Because, you know, Tom Ford, like, at $300, $400 million in a bank, you should be doing Law of Piano.
	Little what?
	Law of Piano.
	You know what that?
	No.
	Let me tell you what I like.
	Let me get you right.
	You want me to make you a suit?
	How much does that suit cost?
	I'm going to make you a suit.
	Let me tell you what I like.
	If you got that kick.
	I like.
	If you're going to do a suit, you got to do it today.
	Are you familiar with Stefano Ricci?
	Sounds familiar.
	That's what I like.
	Stefano Ricci is who?
	Stefano Ricci.
	He designed.
	It's just a distraight designer.
	Stefano Ricci is the man.
	I mean, that's it.
	Let me see Stefano Ricci.
	Go to Stefano Ricci.
	I think I see.
	Stefano Ricci is what I like, purely from Italy.
	Everything they do is they make.
	See, I like British suits.
	You do?
	I don't like Italian suits, too.
	Yeah.
	I like a British, like, you know, I'm Savo Roll.
	That's why I really got trained in Savo Roll.
	But go ahead.
	What are you saying?
	No, no.
	Just saying this is what I wear.
	Well, that's not, but that's Tom Brown.
	This is Tom Ford.
	Tom Ford, rather.
	But you just taught me something about Tom Ford.
	This is what happens when you hang with Dame.
	Well, I'm very, I break down everything.
	You know what I mean?
	So I'll be like, so I wear Ralph Lorraine because he kind of, you know, he's a guy.
	His name is Ralph Lipschitz, right?
	I like the way he built his brand and ties.
	You got to deal with Blooming Deals.
	And then he expanded his categories, blah, blah, blah.
	But he's from the Bronx.
	You know what I mean?
	Ralph Lipschitz.
	So I know what he represents.
	Like, to me, when you wear a brand, you have to understand the DNA of the brand because you put it on your clothes.
	That's why the name of my brand is CEO.
	Is this why you respect Kanye when it comes down to fashion?
	Because you said he took fashion to a whole different level.
	You said I'm in it, but he took it to a whole different level.
	Yeah, I mean, he cracked the French code.
	The French never fucked with black people before.
	He cracked it.
	I wasn't impressed with nothing he did until he bought me that Louis Vuitton sneaker.
	And I was like, yo, you got the French to fuck with you?
	You ever hire somebody from France?
	You can't fire them.
	Well, if you're in France, they think they can't get fired.
	So, you know, at one time when I was starting Rachel Roy, you know, I crewed up.
	I went and got like the president of Givenchy of France.
	But when she got to America, she didn't know shit about anything in America.
	And she just thought I couldn't fire her because you can't fire nobody in France.
	When are you guys leaving?
	You leaving right now, right after this?
	Yeah, okay.
	Next time you're in town, we got to do dinner at the house.
	All right.
	Next time you're in town, well, actually, you have to come through now.
	You owe me an interview.
	No problem.
	So I'm in Winter Haven.
	I'm two hours away.
	You know, just come on up, take your helicopter.
	You got a jet?
	But Rob, this is going to continue like this for a long time to come.
	I can't wait to break bread.
	Really bread talk.
	Anyways, this was a blast.
	Dame, brother, appreciate you for coming out.
	This was great.
	Folks, just so you know, Dame is also on Manect.
	If you got any questions, you can Manect with Dame.
	That's the QR code right there.
	You started Manect.
	Manect.
	Is that trick thing?
	Yeah.
	Manect is download the app to ask any questions you want.
	Any questions you want, you can ask him on Manek.
	We talked about a lot of different things.
	Manect, the one and only Dame Dash.
	Did you build that or did you like it?
	Do you know the story of it?
	No, no, no.
	Eight years ago, I have a call with a lawyer.
	Seven-minute call, he bills me for 30 minutes.
	I call him back.
	I said, why are you billing me for 30 minutes?
	He says, because minutes roll up.
	Yo, lawyers ain't shit.
	Yo, I'm going to arbitration with a lawyer.
	What do you do when you tell your lawyer?
	Like, I tell my lawyer to do something when I pay him.
	He's going to do it.
	And then he tries to bill me from shit I didn't ask him to do.
	And I'm like, I'm not paying for that.
	And now we're in fucking court.
	I hate lawyers, bro.
	I hate them.
	Well, that's exactly why I created this.
	Fucking hate lawyers.
	So I went to the lawyer and I said, I want to pay you by the minute.
	He says, no lawyer charges by the minute.
	I said, I'm going to build an app one day where I get to pay people by the minute.
	So this is, do you have a minute to connect?
	Yes.
	Let's Manect.
	It's like Cameo.
	It's like Cameo.
	The difference is Cameo, you ask people for their birthdays.
	Here, you have a conversation with them.
	And every time you ask them any questions, you pay for it.
	95% of the time people get back to you here.
	Less than 5% of the time people get back to you on Twitter, Instagram, and LinkedIn.
	You'll see here.
	You're going to follow up with this app.
	Anyways, how much am I charging?
	How much you charge?
	You put your price.
	How much you charge?
	I'm my text because I respond 100% in audio.
	I do $100.
	Then I think I'm $300.
	Then my 15-minute call is $9,000.
	Wait a second, wait a second, wait a second.
	Now, what we need to talk about is after a man has a couple hundred million in the bank, and he's still texting motherfuckers, that's a different kind of savvy.
	There's the only difference, though.
	You ready for this?
	Because I don't answer anything else anywhere else but on Manect.
	I'm just saying that you're still hustling.
	Oh, there's no question about it, brother.
	Honestly, the way that all that work, I'd be like, damn, this nigga might be broke.
	Yeah.
	You know what I mean?
	That's what I'm saying.
	Oh, you got your man?
	Okay.
	Yeah, you got a few guys on there they can ask questions with.
	I ain't going to be able to be up there.
	Okay.
	All right.
	Sounds good.
	Okay.
	Dame, thank you.
	Gang, take care, everybody.
	Bye-bye.
	Bye-bye.

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