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Sept. 21, 2023 - On Brand

02:00:20

OB #21 - Debunking Brand's Defenders

First half of this episode is an update as to the state of Russell Brand's existence, and the second half is debunking Brand's defenders and what they use to defend him. We hope it's useful for when you encounter these people in the wild, because you will. Support us on Patreon! - patreon.com/OnBrand

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	This is On Brand, a podcast where we discuss the ideas and antics of one Russell Brand.
	I'm Al Worth, and each week I go through an episode of Brand's Show with my co-host Lauren B. Hi, I'm Lauren B. I can't wait to be lightly traumatized again!
	Let's go!
	About something I don't know yet, but we'll find out.
	I have an inkling!
	There's gonna be a bit more of that.
	Before we get to the good thing before the bad thing, I did want to say that Lauren and I were very much going back and forth as to what kind of episode to put out, or whether to put one out at all, in light of it being quite soon after all of what's happened.
	There was much concern of making sure we were being respectful and not being tone deaf.
	I wanted to cover an interview that I was preparing before the allegations came out, particularly as the subject of paedophilia is brought up with Russell and his guest, as is the subject of how beautiful his daughters are.
	Repeatedly.
	This immediately off the back of the news of Russell Brand having groomed and sexually assaulted a 16-year-old girl when he was a 30-year-old semi-famous adult.
	We do need to get into that, but it's going to have to come next week.
	Particularly as in providing an update on what's happening with Russell Brand, I managed to write half an episode.
	And there are more things beyond that which absolutely need addressing.
	So I'm going to give an update on the state of Russell Brand's current existence in just a minute.
	But first, Lauren, what is your good thing before the bad thing this week?
	I think we need to bolster ourselves this time, huh?
	Well, I'm gonna have to stretch.
	Because I'm also stressed because I have to deal with all these events and stuff that are coming up in a few days.
	Timing hasn't gone great.
	For those of you watching, I feel like a bad sign for Lauren's mental state is when she has a pile of hair on her head and looks very tired.
	It's either extremely hot, or I'm a fucking wreck, and I'm trying to work.
	I didn't even realize when we stopped today, I had to stop carving these little... Oh, Jesus Christ.
	See, I'm a wreck.
	These little dudes.
	I stopped carving as soon as you're like, okay, I think we're ready to go.
	I stopped and I was like, I didn't know how much my hands hurt.
	And then I was like, Oh no!
	I just had like shooting pains in my hands.
	Hang on, hang on.
	This is the good thing before the bad thing, not the bad thing before the bad thing.
	I don't really have a good thing!
	I don't know!
	I don't know!
	Oh, only murders in the building!
	That's literally, that's been the thing that's like...
	Fixed.
	Like, yeah, the past couple days have fucking sucked.
	A lot.
	I'm aware of that show.
	It's shady.
	I know.
	Yeah, right.
	I've heard it's good.
	It's really good.
	And this season, I think it's season three, March Short is especially bitchy in a way that like, I just, it makes my heart sing.
	It's like very self-aware.
	It's just real.
	It's a great show.
	And it's a nice escape.
	From all this fucking nightmare fuel.
	So, it has been quite, it's been a respite that like, because it is, it's like very real, but super absurd.
	And so it's just a nice, just take you out of it completely thing.
	So that's, told you I had a stretch.
	Fucking TV show.
	I don't know man.
	Hey, no, there's media that can pull you out of reality, that's really important.
	TV, a good book, video game, whatever, especially in the subjects that we normally deal with, let alone what we're having to deal with now.
	Yeah!
	Funny how I thought I felt bad before!
	Yeah, like, I feel bad having to look at, like, the usual shit that Russell says, let alone the shit that Russell does.
	Yes.
	But yeah, so anyway, that's good.
	Oh, and Meryl Streep's in this season.
	It's incredible.
	She's so, oh my god.
	And it's like, they know.
	Anyway, oh my god, that's all, that's it.
	My hands stop hurting, that's all so good.
	What is your, before we get into this bad thing, What's your good thing?
	I am going to take the slightly cowardly way out, and I'm going to say that the response to the last episode has been... Oh!
	Ha!
	Ha-ha!
	Cheater!
	Yeah, a hundred percent, but I don't care.
	The response to the last episode has been... You can do literally whatever you want!
	We've had to deal with so much bullshit!
	No, I know that you're just upset that you didn't think of it first.
	I talked myself out of it, as a matter of fact.
	Good.
	I also announced out loud last night that I had to say the show.
	I made a tacit agreement in my own home, and I'm going to honor that verbal contract.
	Okay.
	So you go right ahead.
	I also agree.
	I'm going to sign on to yours as well.
	Yeah, the response, because it was tough going.
	It was tough going to research, and that kind of occupied a full 48 hours of my existence.
	Yeah, it was a lot.
	It was a lot for us.
	It was a lot for us as a podcast, a lot for us as people to go through, and the response has been overwhelmingly positive.
	A few shitheads have come out of the woodwork, and people have shouted them down.
	Thank you for that, and well done.
	Also, feel free to keep at it.
	Please do.
	This is next.
	This is a whole other thing.
	And I'm not.
	I have very little patience for her.
	No, me either.
	I mostly haven't responded to a lot of the people because I'm just like, grand scheme of things, you know.
	But it's nice to know that our audience have our back.
	That's great.
	And yeah, just The overwhelmingly positive response to having to deal with such a fucking serious subject.
	That's been really nice.
	It's been a little bit of light in what is an incredibly dark moment.
	So that's good.
	There's a community of people out there who are Pleasant and, you know, have morals.
	Who care?
	Yeah, and who care?
	Who care?
	Yeah, it's a lot.
	So thank you, everyone, for that.
	It means a lot.
	It really does.
	Yeah, we know you don't have to.
	Your time and energy is precious.
	But, man, we appreciate it.
	Like, a lot.
	We really do.
	And we appreciate you.
	And also, sorry for kind of hurting your feelings.
	We're all in it together.
	Yeah, we are all in it together.
	It's crappy little boat.
	All right.
	We have a show to get to, but first we should thank some new patrons.
	I'm...
	I'm going to be honest, I'm not 100% sure where we left off in the list, so if I've done one more than once, congrats!
	Equally, if I miss any, please email us at theombrandpod at gmail.com.
	I don't think I will have, because I'd rather just name someone twice than miss anyone, but you never know.
	And Patreon can be hard to keep track of.
	So first we have Cécile Choplin.
	Either way, you are now an awakening wonder.
	You are indeed an awakening wonder.
	Thank you very much.
	Thank you!
	It is deeply, deeply appreciated.
	Right, okay.
	We have a name here with a capital N.
	So I'm gonna, I'm gonna say Jussi Puranthakanen, I think.
	That kind of milieu.
	It's Jussi Puranthakanen, Finnish names are a doozy, you are now an awakening wonder.
	You are indeed an awakening wonder.
	Yes indeed they are.
	Please, please let me know if I got that right.
	Magnus the Great Dane.
	Thank you to Finland, yay!
	Thank you Finland.
	Magnus the Great Dane, you are now an awakening wonder.
	You are indeed an awakening wonder.
	Excellent.
	That means thank you.
	That could be our first dog patron, possibly.
	I'm trying to think.
	I know we had Scorpion the bird.
	That was a bird.
	I remember that.
	A bird called Scorpion.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	I'm not sure.
	That's a Twitter buddy.
	I think Magnus might be our first dog.
	So hey, Magnus.
	Well done.
	Good boy.
	Good boy.
	I can't wait for more dog patrons.
	That's great.
	That's great.
	Yeah, I love being able to call our patrons a good boy!
	Trudes, you are now an Awakening wonder.
	You are indeed an Awakening wonder.
	Thank you very much.
	Thank you so much!
	Kimberley Lilly, you are now an Awakening Wonder.
	You are indeed an Awakening Wonder.
	Thank you, Kimberley.
	Thank you, Kimberley!
	Deeply appreciated.
	And Jared McKinnon, you are now an Awakening Wonder.
	You are indeed an Awakening Wonder.
	Thank you, Jared.
	Thanks, Jared!
	We have also had a couple of people up their donations.
	So, Keith Egan slash Egan, we never did clarify that, you are still an Awakening Wonder.
	You are indeed an awakening wonder.
	Thank you, Keith.
	How much is Egon?
	Egon?
	Yeah, well, it's E-G-A-N.
	I'll fudge it for a Ghostbusters reference, is what I'm saying.
	With your permission, Keith, of course.
	I'm just throwing it out there.
	In case it hadn't become obvious, we are big on consent in this podcast, so Keith, if you consent to it, we'll do it.
	If not, we won't.
	And finally, Awakening Wonk, you are still an Awakening wonder.
	You are indeed an Awakening wonder.
	Thank you.
	Thank you so much!
	That's adorable.
	I forgot about that.
	That's great.
	That is great.
	It's a great little combo.
	Yeah.
	If anyone wants to support us on what we do, become an Awakening Wanderer, join the Invisible Hand, or donate on an elevated tier, head to patreon.com slash onbrand and you will have our eternal gratitude.
	It's this which allows us to be editorially independent and ad-free, and we also don't monetize our YouTube videos either.
	Because it's a barrier to entry, even if it's a small one.
	As a patron, you will also get a shout-out on the show and access to our patron-only show, Off-Brand, where we talk about pretty much anything but Russell Brand.
	And please note that while you can easily listen to our audio version anywhere you can find podcasts, you can also watch us on YouTube, or if you listen in the Spotify app, the video should come up there too.
	Oh, and before I forget, we have a bunch of new listeners and subscribers, and I wanted to say hi!
	You found this podcast for most likely the worst reasons imaginable.
	Yeah, that's exactly what I was thinking!
	I think I'm sorry!
	No, exactly.
	It's certainly not the way that Lauren and I wanted to find any level of exposure.
	So far down the list of, oh, it's a bummer!
	It really is.
	Welcome!
	Yeah, welcome, and we're glad you're here.
	We really are.
	Yeah!
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	Now then, as of right now, here's the developments since Russell Brand was outed as a rapist and sexual assaulter.
	Because he is one, by the way.
	Firstly, since the allegations, his YouTube subscriber count has gone up by 45,000.
	Fuck off!
	No.
	That's, that's my, that's my, and I had a feeling in the back of my mind when we were covering this.
	If you remember Saksgate, all that happened after that was, you know, he was fucking Comedian of the Year or whatever, got awards, got fucking movie deals and everything else.
	Anytime he has ever done anything wrong, he has only ever been rewarded for it.
	And there's at least an element of that happening now in that respect.
	Yeah.
	So yeah, 45,000 more people.
	Great.
	Well, they didn't know.
	They didn't know that he was so pro-rape.
	Yeah, it's true.
	They found out, and then they acted on that information.
	An advocate for sexual assaulting, and they found him.
	So the night that the Dispatches documentary was aired, Russell performed at the Troubadour-Wembley Park Theatre to 2,000 people in a sold-out show.
	He came on stage an hour late to rapturous applause and stood there soaking it up for a while saying, thank you.
	I love you.
	I appreciate you.
	He said, sorry I was late.
	It was actually because of a fucking traffic jam and said, I've got a lot to talk to you about.
	There are obviously some things I absolutely cannot talk about and I appreciate that you will understand.
	I love you lot already.
	I'm going to give you everything I've got.
	Let's go.
	And it didn't take him long to make a joke about everything.
	He was pointing at a long-haired audience member and he quipped that the man looked a lot like him and was a body double.
	That might come in handy, he said to another rapturous round of applause.
	He also later said, uh, since I've been married, I don't have sex anymore.
	I've changed my life.
	I'm now a vegan and don't look at pornography.
	I think we get a pretty immediate look as to how he's going to spin all of this.
	If he ever does decide to address it with any kind of admission.
	Um, if he, if he ever does, I'm not convinced he will.
	Um, I mean, the smart money is on not doing that.
	The smart money is on ignoring it.
	Right.
	I think it'll be, he'll come back with his show and he'll say, oh, they're making a lot of noise out there, but we're going to carry on doing what we do in here, which is critiquing the media and, you know, the military industrial complex and everything else.
	I think that's what's going to happen.
	And papier-mâché aliens.
	Yeah.
	Yes.
	The pressing news of papier-mâché aliens.
	Yeah, there is that.
	As a crafty maker of bullshit, it offends me specifically.
	I just, listen.
	It should.
	I've made papier-mâché aliens, okay?
	And they were better than that one!
	It was on the fun side, but come on.
	That was still high school papier-mâché level.
	I'm desperately fighting it, I'm sorry!
	You're fighting anything to talk about that's not this?
	I know, I hate it!
	I need to fight that urge, I know.
	The UFO subreddit was all over that one, by the way.
	They were like, oh my god, Mexico, they're revealing everything!
	Sure.
	All over it is a way to say that, I guess.
	One of his fans on that night is reported as having said, quote, he's in the right.
	He'll be on the right side of history, unquote.
	Another said, quote, the authorities are out to get him.
	We believe him totally.
	Unquote.
	Mercifully, the rest of the tour has been postponed, mostly due to theatres and promoters pulling out, so that's positive.
	That's an effect that we can have as individuals.
	Pressure on companies like that, on sponsors, on venues, that still works.
	Yep.
	Yep.
	Yeah, and I've seen some colossally bad takes revolving around this, like, oh, does he deserve to have his life taken away?
	Oh, no, we're not even, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
	Okay.
	No, no, no.
	Okay.
	No.
	Brand was dropped by his literary agency and his book deal with his The publisher is now postponed, though not cancelled, though this only occurred after the article came out, leading people to believe that they were both most certainly part of the system providing cover for brand until this point.
	It was basically, oh dear, now that things are happening, we are being forced to drop this person.
	I'll take it.
	I'll take it.
	Yeah, yeah.
	Russell's dad, Ron, has weighed in.
	Do you remember Ron?
	Ron, who used to shove his child of 7 or 8 in front of a bunch of porn while he screwed women in the next room.
	The guy who bought Russell his first prostitute at 17 while grabbing a couple for himself and them having had sex in the same room.
	That's been confirmed, by the way!
	It was a twin room that they stayed in, beds neighboring each other.
	So that's confirmed, that's definitely... Russell wrote it in his book.
	Right, right, right, right, right.
	Well, I mean... Same room, neighboring beds.
	Apparently he kept getting distracted because the sex over there was too noisy.
	I'D BE DISTRACTED TOO!
	I wouldn't be there!
	There would be a measured hole in that wall.
	I would be gone.
	Oh my god.
	Oh my god.
	Even in complete pitch black, the idea of... No, just no.
	I'm not going to go into detail.
	Just no.
	Hey guys!
	Don't fuck in a room that your dad's fucking in!
	Is it that difficult?
	Don't fuck in a room that your son is fucking in either!
	What the You're absolutely right!
	Yeah!
	Ron, you were the adult in that scenario.
	What the fuck, Ron?
	Anyway, that Ron, that Ron Brand is outraged at this turn of events, I tell you.
	Oh, I bet.
	I fucking bet he is.
	We may have never seen a moral outrage quite like it.
	I'll quote directly from Ron.
	Quote, is this seriously the most important thing that's happening in this world?
	Immigrants, cost of living, tens of thousands killed in Ukraine.
	Who is prioritizing at BBC News?
	Who is really driving this fantasy?
	Put him in a cannon!
	Shoot him into space!
	This is crazy!
	With many struggling to pay bills, the unproven accusations of 15 years ago take lead on BBC News.
	Unquote.
	Okay, buddy.
	I mean, yes.
	The short answer?
	Yes.
	It does.
	Buddy, your son's a rapist and you're probably a good chunk of the reason why, so whatever helps you sleep at night.
	Russell was quoted, by the way, as saying about that trip to Thailand, quote, During the rest of that holiday I fucked loads more prostitutes and never wore a condom.
	It had hardened me.
	My sexuality had morphed forever from bewildered innocence into something more complex and rapacious.
	Unquote.
	If that's not a fucking, like, pivot point, I don't know what is.
	He's written it himself!
	Cheers, Ron!
	Green sick emoji.
	I don't know.
	Thanks, Ron.
	I mean, but for real.
	Great job.
	Sir?
	Dad?
	Are you sure you want to poke your fucking head up?
	Really?
	I'd keep schtum if I were also probably one of the reasons that this behavior was so ingrained in my son.
	Yeah, yeah, because I mean, also, you know, just putting your child who was in primary school, right, which is up to the age of 11, who's in primary school in front of pornography while you go in the other room to have sex with women.
	Unreal.
	Like, the effect that that's going to have on a child, on a person developing is astonishing.
	I mean, yeah, he's a criminal.
	He's a sex criminal towards his son.
	Like, seriously.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	And at the very least, you know, there's neglect to an extreme degree in so many ways.
	Yeah.
	Fuck you, Ron.
	I hope he catches the fucking charge too, Jesus Christ.
	London Hughes, comedian London Hughes has come out and said that at the time of her signing to a comedy agency, the same one as Russell Brands at the time, she was quote, told unprovoked that I shouldn't sleep with him under any circumstances as he likes to pursue women and have sex with them.
	but as soon as he had sex with them they'd make him feel sick and he didn't want to be around
	them anymore so he would have them fired or dropped from the agency. It had happened several
	times in the past." Okay, London is now catching a hell of a lot of shit on social media from
	brand supporters of course.
	Poor woman.
	Okay, I need to be very clear.
	Anyone that is going to be commenting even once on the side of Russell is a nasty little fucking pig.
	I cannot.
	I can't.
	I can't.
	I can't with it.
	Like, what?
	Why?
	Well, especially... What a little pack of gremlins.
	It's disgusting.
	I will say, if there's a part of you anywhere deep down, if you're watching or listening to this, if there's a part of you anywhere that is considering being on the side of Russell in this, just wait until the end of the episode, because I've got some shit to go through, okay?
	Just wait until then and see if you feel the same.
	I'm confused how you got here.
	Yeah, hi.
	We do get a few.
	They are coming out, which is fine.
	Okay, come on in.
	Enjoy the show.
	Probably going to find it a struggle, but hey, stick around.
	Russell also quit two businesses he was involved in.
	So one was One Arm Bandit that apparently supports activities to performing arts with assets of £111,000 and the other was Mayfair Film Partnership Limited which is in film processing and has assets of £1.9 million.
	John Knoll, Brand's former manager, is a company director of both.
	Brand and his wife also struck off their joint company, Brand New Collective Limited, on September 12th, according to Companies House.
	So just after he was notified of the documentary's release, Very curious, that one.
	What do you mean by struck off?
	As in dissolved, gotten rid of.
	Oh, okay, so it's just they dissolve the company, okay.
	Yeah, that's what that means.
	The UK Charity Commission is examining Bran's role at his addiction foundation, the Stay Free Foundation, following the revelations.
	However, the Stay Free Foundation is a newly formed charity, and he did have a different one before, and I wonder whether there's probably more going on in the older one than the newer one, but we shall see.
	So the older one also still is extant?
	Yeah, I'm not sure.
	I couldn't find it anywhere attached to Russell's name, so I'm not sure if he's gotten rid of that one and set up this new one.
	The Stay Free Foundation.
	Fuck off.
	There has also been an investigation into a temporary security fence being erected around Brown's pub in Piss Hill, which has been done without planning permission.
	Yeah, this is the kind of shit that I know you love.
	Why do they always do this?
	Why do they always do this shit?
	This is the shit I know you love.
	So basically, they're massive metal fences covered in hessian, so no one can see through them, right?
	Oxfordshire-based planning consultant Mark Duders, or Dudes, it could be Mark Dudes, in which case, Dudes.
	Uh, said that, uh, quote, in this case, the public house is a grade two listed building.
	Consequently, the means of enclosure is unlikely to be permitted under the general permitted development order, as it would likely involve development within the curtilage of a listed building.
	If the fence has damaged any historic fabric, such as by connecting it to the pub itself unsympathetically, it could be seen as a criminal offence."
	To justify the fence, Brand now needs to show that it was needed in the first place, or submit a full planning permission with consultants and everything else.
	And if he does not do this, he could be prosecuted with an unlimited fine if the case is escalated to a Crown Court.
	See?
	In America!
	Oh man.
	It's a crapshoot how that's going to go, but I don't think, from what I understand, in the UK people are a little more strict with building codes, especially historical.
	If it's a great two listed building, you need to have your shit together.
	In other news, man steps on rake and is shocked when it hits him in the face.
	That's what's happened here.
	Leopards got me again!
	Oh, dude!
	I keep voting for the leopards eat my face party, and they keep eating my face!
	It's a mystery.
	Yeah, no, he's potentially in some hot water there, which is really funny to me.
	He should opt for a seawall.
	Yeah, right.
	It's such a seemingly minor thing that could actually really fuck him, especially if he doesn't address it.
	Okay, but also, if the punishment is worse for that than all the rapes, I have a problem.
	I'm not okay with that either!
	Well, the distinction would be that there isn't a legal case pending with With the sexual assault and the rape, but there could be one for this.
	Fuck it, I'll take what I can get.
	If you have to get Al Capone on text, it's you, right?
	Exactly!
	Right, right, right.
	It's the situation that it is.
	So, the BBC have removed any and all content... I can't!
	I know.
	Okay, okay, okay.
	The BBC have removed any and all content from their platform involving Russell Brand, stating that it had been, quote, assessed that it now falls below public expectations, unquote.
	Which I think for the BBC is kind of a sick burn, actually.
	I quite liked that.
	I just thought it was so British.
	It's such a low-grade rumble.
	It now falls below public expectations.
	Okay.
	I just keep taking notes now of like fun, like, oh, if the fence wins, that's the merch I'm going to make.
	I'm going to make fence merch.
	Fence t-shirts.
	Yeah.
	You should see it as well.
	I'll find a picture for it.
	I'll make a little fence just to put in front.
	Yep.
	I'll find a picture of it for Off-Brand, because it is hilariously pathetic looking as well, and yet it could bring him down in some way.
	The fucking rules.
	The fucking rules.
	That's great.
	So, Channel 4 have followed the same suit as the BBC and erased everything from his old Big Brother content to his episode of Celebrity Bake Off.
	Paramount Plus have pulled one of his comedy specials live in New York from their service also.
	Russell has been demonetized on YouTube, where he was earning an estimated £1 million a year, though other estimates run as high as £2.9 million.
	He now can't do that, which is great.
	That's where some of the hot takes about, oh, should he be out of a job are coming in, and there was someone who said something along the lines of, You know, just because of an allegation, should someone be fired from their job?
	And it's like, well, he's not employed by YouTube.
	Yes!
	Also, yeah.
	Also, maybe yes.
	Happens all the time.
	And also, he's not employed by YouTube.
	They're a private company, they can do whatever the fuck they want.
	If you right-wing fuckheads want to have a conversation about, like, you know, making YouTube a public domain kind of thing, then we can have that conversation, but I don't think that's what you want to do, is it?
	So obviously Rumble will still have him, and while the finances there are somewhat opaque, apparently his top video could have netted him between £12,000 and £80,000.
	That's how opaque they are, it's very difficult to fucking tell.
	Yeah, well that's on purpose.
	That's on purpose.
	Yeah, no it is.
	Shitload of money, and throw in that he puts at least one video up daily weekdays, usually multiple because he breaks them down into clips or segments, and his earnings are pretty damn solid.
	There are no reports yet of advertisers on his show or marketing affiliates breaking ties with him, and he's still selling tickets to Community Festival 2024.
	He is also still up on Spotify, and his last special is still on Netflix.
	And this says nothing of potential income from more nefarious sources in return for favorable propaganda, but that is just speculation on my part.
	But Spotify and Netflix can be shamed.
	Potentially.
	Yes, they can.
	Yes, they can.
	And Spotify, you know, the earnings are fuck all there, but I imagine he's getting something out of it.
	Yeah, but we don't know.
	We don't know.
	And also, just shouldn't fucking be up there in the first place.
	Not least of which, because he does a fucking propaganda podcast.
	Spotify said that they're not going to remove it because they're only going to remove stuff that goes against their kind of terms of use and terms and conditions and all that so I am going to have a very kind of deep dive into those at some point in the very near future to check whether he is breaking any of the rules because a lot of the times the podcast that he kind of releases that's not in the video format We'll be the full hour.
	It'll be the full thing.
	So the shit that he's saying that's only on Rumble is also available on fucking Apple Podcasts or whatever.
	Yeah.
	So I am going to look into that because that could be a way of getting rid of him.
	And that would be tremendous.
	Limiting his reach in this bullshit would be awesome.
	Yeah.
	So yeah, we'll see.
	We'll see.
	Well, I'm pinning that.
	I have a lot of feelings.
	We'll get to it, we'll get to it.
	Perhaps most importantly, more victims of Russell Brand have come forward.
	The Met Police is apparently investigating a report of sexual assault from 2003 and several women have come forward with their stories of abuse from Brand in a more general sense.
	Lisa has come forward and said that she met Brand in 2008 and her and a friend went back to Brands and had a threesome.
	What is that noise?
	Me?
	On my side?
	Crickets.
	Crickets?
	Or cicadas.
	Bugs.
	Fuck me, they're loud.
	Okay.
	Oh yeah.
	Okay.
	Yeah.
	Oh, oh.
	That's crazy.
	Okay.
	Remember the rats?
	Everything's crazy here.
	It's awful.
	That's true.
	Rats, giant crickets.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
	Yeah, so her and a friend went back to Brands and had a threesome.
	Perfectly fine, right?
	Less fine is that Lisa alleges that because their real names sounded similar to Holly and Jessica, Brand began talking about killer and paedophile Ian Huntley, who murdered two ten-year-olds in 2002.
	What?
	Lisa claims that during sex, Brand even made up a song about the killer, singing it during the act.
	After leaving his house.
	Okay.
	That is also, it is awful and weird.
	Weird and horrendous.
	Um, pedophile and murderer of two 10 year olds and you're there singing, because their names are similar to the two victims, you're singing a song while having sex with these two.
	I, um, after leaving his house.
	I need the bell again.
	I'm, I'm like noticing I'm not reply, I'm all face, no sound.
	Damn it.
	Jeezy Pete, that's fucking weird!
	Like, it's a lot of levels of weird.
	It's a layer cake of weird, and that's just one weird story.
	But also like, the other stories were like, okay, all right listeners, everybody, we are identifying patterns, and we are identifying escalation.
	That is what we need to use to understand the story holistically.
	And that's, there was weird shit in the other stories too.
	Oh my God.
	After leaving his house, she kept in touch with Brand by phone and says he offered to give her an endorsement quote for a book that she was writing.
	She arrived at his home to finalize the quote with Brand, but when she arrived, she found another woman she had never met before was also present.
	Lisa said, quote, it was clear I was there to have a threesome with him and this woman I'd never met, unquote, and claims that Brand became furious when she refused before telling her she could not use any quote for her book.
	Sounds in line with what we've heard so far.
	Also, she could just lie.
	Jordan Peterson does.
	True.
	Around... I guess people with credibility don't want to do that.
	Just make up quotes.
	Weird.
	Around the same time... If only!
	If only she knew!
	Around the same time in 2008, Esme met Brand at a party.
	He offered her a lift home in his chauffeured car.
	Her and Brand kissed, and he asked if she wanted to go back to his place.
	She refused the offer, and yet for some reason when she got out of the car, she realized that the driver had gone to Brand's place anyway.
	She went inside briefly before going home.
	Esme met up with Brand on a separate occasion and alleges he became threatening and verbally abusive when she refused to have sex with him.
	As she added, Brand told her, quote, Well, what the fuck are you doing here then?
	Unquote.
	Lovely, charming guy.
	I find it very distressing that the driver went to his house anyway, despite her saying no.
	Well, wait, wasn't there a chauffeur that came forward as a witness?
	That was in like 2006 or whatever for Alice's story and yeah, we will get into that in a minute.
	It would have been a different driver, especially as I'm not sure which country this one was in actually, to be honest.
	But yeah, either way, great.
	Definitely fits with the pattern.
	A former model has also come forward, speaking of an incident in 2005.
	She said she met Brand at a bar in London where he accompanied her as she left.
	The woman claims that she repeatedly told Bran she was leaving and going home, but as she began the 30-minute walk, he began to follow her.
	She said, quote, he was walking about five paces behind me.
	He was slurring his words and saying things along the lines of, let's go and fuck.
	I told him I wasn't interested and he said, let's just fuck right here.
	And what year was that?
	felt that in his head this was all a bit of fun but it wasn't I was so rattled by
	it that I started to run I ran as fast as I could to get away from him unquote
	and what year was that 2005 so he's supposed to be sober yeah yeah I I find
	the slurring of the words thing interesting you know I I again
	I again, I still don't have any evidence to suggest that Brand has broken sobriety at
	any point since 2002.
	And you know, he could have been slurring his words for any reason, to be fair.
	And also witness account, you know, what you kind of hear in the moment.
	Absolutely.
	I'm just, it was just a lot.
	Yeah, no, no, no.
	I thought I thought that as well.
	It's worth mentioning that these stories won't have been through the same vetting process as the women who came forward for the documentary, as in it won't have been as extensive, and so perhaps need to be taken with a small grain of salt, but I do think it's fair to say that all of these separate accounts are painting a very similar picture of the man, which in their totality completely add up.
	Yeah, I'm not, you know, I do find it weird how they're all kind of lining up and painting very much the same picture of the guy.
	It is funny.
	Multiple different sources and experiences.
	Yeah.
	Am I funny?
	I mean, horrible.
	I don't mean funny.
	Is that Russell Brand's dad made a point To say things happened 15 years ago, and oh, yeah, it's as important 15 years ago because there is a consistent pattern over those 15 plus years that are why you should be concerned.
	Like, you just pointed out- The last one that we covered was 10 years ago, not 15.
	One of them was in 2013.
	Well then maybe he's fucking telling on himself.
	I don't know.
	Here's the thing, Dollars to Donuts was happening 15 years ago in some form.
	This is the first story, and I said this before we started recording, and I want to make this clear because I'm not speculating about his behavior as an individual, as just one person.
	What we do know about violent criminals and about violent predators There is a process of escalation that, you know, if they keep getting away with things, then they are allowed to escalate their behavior.
	And the Alice story from 2006, the 16-year-old, that is There were a lot of things in place that he had already practiced very well.
	That was not the first time he did any of that stuff.
	There's a sophisticated, like, network, even in his own mind, of how you groom and how you control.
	That was not his first rodeo, by any stretch.
	And so we need to, like, you have to understand how that kind of behavior develops in someone.
	Yeah, yeah.
	Because to claim that it just came out of nowhere in 2006.
	Well, the patterns that we understand about humans do not bear that out.
	Like, you don't get that good at it just off the bat, right?
	Exactly.
	It's not an immediate thing.
	Yeah.
	And hey, hopefully more will come out.
	Who knows?
	The BBC Director General Tim Davey told staff that he had now launched a full investigation into Brand's time working for the corporation between 2006 and 2008.
	When the comedian presented shows on Six Music and Radio 2.
	They have also pledged to investigate whether Russell Brand used the broadcaster's taxis to pick up Alice, the 16-year-old girl, from school.
	So that's interesting.
	Daily told staff on Tuesday afternoon that he hoped to conclude the investigation within weeks.
	Quote, we'll look at any complaints made about Russell Brand's conduct during his time, what was known at the time, what was done.
	The review will also look at the position regarding any cars used by the BBC at that time, unquote.
	So you never know, if he was dumb enough to use a company car to go and get Alice, that could come out.
	A science point too.
	He's dumb enough.
	I would say brazen enough.
	I don't think it's dumb.
	I think it's just arrogant.
	Serial killers that don't get caught, they start getting more and more cocky.
	Or even just like other dudes like this.
	What incentive would he have to stop?
	There is no consequences.
	He gets rewarded.
	He gets to crime up.
	He gets to assault up.
	And these are crimes.
	These are violent crimes that we are learning about.
	And I will tell you, Friday me from last week did not expect What Monday me was having to feel about all of this shit!
	Like, I did not think we were gonna get a laundry list of violent crimes!
	No, I did not think that that was going to happen!
	And anyone who did that doesn't know him personally or isn't like in that fucking WhatsApp group or whatever of comedians, like, I find it... I don't know, maybe... I question where you're coming from, if you're like, oh yeah, I expected this!
	I mean, come on!
	If anyone expected the severity of this, then what the fuck?
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	I didn't, and I know Russell Brand pretty fucking well at this point.
	Unfortunately, yeah.
	Not personally, thankfully.
	Familiar with his content.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
	And the thing is, people are also pointing to his comedy bits, and we cannot You can't take a rapper to jail and you can't take a rapper to court and convict them based on their lyrics.
	That is a free speech issue.
	That is not the only proof.
	That is not enough.
	No, no, exactly.
	It's not enough.
	That's not a smoking gun.
	We need to not prosecute people based on notions or even their own creative content.
	That's not enough.
	I do think he was definitely telling us what he was doing, but equally it cannot serve as evidence because of the nature of it.
	And all that's happening with that Is that his base are using it as, oh, they're just dragging up his comedy bits from, you know, 15 years ago or whatever.
	It's like, no, no.
	Oh, no, no, no.
	I will say the most effective thing in the documentary that is a horror, like, Chilled me.
	Well, my bones were already pretty chilly.
	You've watched the whole thing now, right?
	Yes.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	I have.
	And also, I need to say publicly to everyone within the sound of my voice, Al did an amazing job.
	They did an amazing job at something awful.
	Like, did an amazing job clip... Oh, you're gonna hate it because I'm complimenting you.
	I do.
	I'm uncomfortable and I don't know what to do.
	Well, fucking suck it up!
	I'm gonna sit here and drink.
	So, I did not realize until after our last No, I didn't realize either.
	was going to be so inaccessible.
	Like all this information was going to be so, I know it's kind of fucked up in and of itself,
	but like, it's so inaccessible in America.
	And like, yeah, if you have a VPN and like, if you are like, oh my God, it's the VPN, it was so easy.
	I found it like two seconds.
	Good for you.
	Not everybody has that level of- Most people won't.
	Most people won't.
	You probably don't think that you're tech-savvy even, but you are, and most people aren't.
	And so, Al had to send me a link, and then we just watched the recorded version.
	Um, on a lighter note, oh my god, your commercial breaks are so short.
	Jesus Christ.
	This is insane.
	It's unreal.
	When do you guys pee?
	It's crazy!
	We got like two and a half, three minutes.
	That's enough.
	That's sufficient.
	Total!
	They were so short!
	Oh my god.
	I hate it here.
	Anyway, so, see?
	I'm still avoiding.
	I'm avoiding.
	But yeah, we watched the whole thing and it was, I mean, and I am.
	I mean, it was obviously horrible, but I'm so impressed and I'm proud and everyone else should be too.
	You did a really great job of translating the core narrative that we can still talk about and is accessible outside of the UK.
	I think, honestly, the video is what seals the deal, because those accounts, I think it's easy for people, especially anybody that's gonna be defending Brand, probably not the biggest readers, but a video of these witnesses' accounts and these victims' accounts, it is so palpable, and it is so, it's scary.
	And you hear it.
	It's incredibly bleak, and it was awful, but also I'm so glad that I got to see the whole thing.
	I forgot the thing I was going to mention now, but I need to make it known and make it loud that you did a really great job, and we had no idea there was going to be such a A lack of coverage and information that we have made available.
	Yeah.
	I was really surprised about that, because I thought, because I did look it up separately prior to us recording, because there were a couple of people that we knew that wanted to see it who were in the States, and I looked it up and I thought that, oh, as long as you register an account, then you'll be fine.
	But no.
	Yeah, I found that myself.
	Yeah, in the States you can't watch it.
	So, yeah.
	I'm glad that the clips are available and they're under fair use.
	We're currently undergoing a copyright claim in the UK, weirdly, from Channel 4.
	I've disputed it.
	We'll see what happens.
	But still fine everywhere else, so I guess that's a weird kind of blessing.
	Yeah, I feel like it could be a lot worse.
	For sure.
	Hopefully it doesn't get worse.
	But I just don't, and I've tried my damnedest to share this on all of our socials, share our main content, and then I also made a frustrated video yesterday.
	Because what's frustrating is the lack of exposure.
	And when I said in the video, part of what I said in the video was like, we aren't having this collective, if If that documentary had come out same time, same content, everything on Netflix, like internationally, this entire conversation would be completely different.
	Completely different.
	Yeah.
	Because it's so shocking.
	If it was internationally available, and this is one of the things I wrote in the dispute that, you know, Channel 4 need to get their shit together and make this available everywhere.
	Yeah, they really do.
	And pin in that, there's a lot.
	Yeah, there's a lot.
	But we're not having that collective Tiger King moment.
	That we know that we can still, I know we're not a monoculture, but we can still have that because even if you haven't watched the documentary, if it's likely that someone else in your life has, they're going to comment on your social media or they're going to stop, you know, they're going to stop you whenever you're having conversations.
	It was like, oh, we knew he was a creep.
	Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
	No, he was a violent, serial rapist.
	and assaulter. Like, he was a violent predator. He's not a dude who stares at you too long
	on the bus.
	No, and this is why I am so insistent on using the word rape and rapist, because
	there's a tendency, especially in social media, in media in general,
	to describe that same thing as sexual assault.
	And the problem is, sexual assault has a very broad kind of thing.
	It encompasses a lot.
	When I think of sexual assault, I think, I don't know, groping someone's boob without consent, right?
	That's sexual assault.
	Raping someone, however, is rape.
	Yes, exactly.
	There are degrees, and I'm not about minimizing what this man has done.
	I do want to say, I am incredibly frustrated by this reality, but I'm editing our social posts so that they don't violate Terms of Service.
	I'm not thrilled about having to, you know, use a grape emoji or whatever, but I know it's absurd.
	I know it's absurd, but I also want, like, I want the information that we have made available.
	I did not realize this until after it happened, but, like, The video portion is so compelling and is so much harder to ignore than any article.
	I don't care how perfect and how thorough and convincing and well-researched that article is, Hearing a victim tell their story is incredibly powerful.
	There is a show called I Survived because people want to watch the show and they like it because they want to hear from survivors.
	Straight up, I don't give a holy flying fuck of a shit about our numbers.
	Please share it if you can.
	They're posted all over.
	I posted a roundup in the subreddit, and I have the video that I made that is explaining why it's important to be sharing the video.
	It's because people outside of the UK do not understand the gravity of the situation.
	And this conversation is making it very fucking clear that folks are not clued in.
	If you're in the States, and most of our listeners are, please do share the video specifically if you can.
	Or the Spotify link, obviously the video is included there as well.
	And encourage people to actually just watch the segments, even if they fucking skip through everything that we say, just get them to at least have a look at the clips.
	To engage with the reality of the situation.
	Well, you also fill in with the- I know, I do add more details.
	Investigation also.
	There is more detail that I add as well, but even if people- I mean, if you want to mainline it, go ahead.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	Pretty terrible!
	Even if people do just watch the clips, that's still going to be a big, big step in the right direction.
	So yeah, just And, like, I just, I cannot- Americans, share it.
	Yeah, like, I- We've gone off on quite a tangent here.
	I hadn't quite finished my update yet.
	Sorry.
	I was gonna co-opt a later part of the show, I apologize.
	It's fine.
	Deal with it.
	Yeah, back to updates!
	I was saying about how Tim Davey was doing a review at the BBC and including any cars that were used by these people.
	Right, right, right.
	Channel 4 are undergoing their own internal investigation into the handling of Russell Brand within their organisation, which is positive.
	The final thing that I wanted to add was about Laura, Russell's wife.
	She's not said anything, and her sister, who initially supported Brand, has since deleted her post where she did so.
	She's a Sky News presenter, by the way, so no one tiny.
	Kirstie Gallagher, I think it is, reposted his video with a love heart emoji.
	That's now been deleted.
	She deleted it!
	Hey!
	I guess that's something.
	I think mostly because she was getting a lot of shit for it.
	Laura has seemingly deleted her Instagram, which fair enough.
	She's reportedly devastated and struggling emotionally with it all, particularly as she's pregnant and her hormones are already going fucking berserk.
	I have no reason really to take aim at Laura for anything that I'm aware of, at least not yet.
	But obviously the tabloids are reporting quite a bit, and tidbits of backstory made their way to the front page every now and then.
	One of which caught my ear.
	It's a direct quote from Laura herself, detailing how her and Brand re-encountered each other.
	So they first dated in 2007, and Laura broke it off because her father, who's a golfer I think, begged her to break it off.
	Which is a story in of itself, and she was just 18 at the time.
	And yeah, in 2015 this happened.
	Quote, my ex had literally moved out of our flat that day and I was heartbroken with mascara running down my face.
	A friend dragged me out on a walk to the canal in East London where I'd never been in my life and as we came onto the footpath Russell was standing there like he'd organized it.
	Unquote.
	No, this is almost certainly coincidence, given what we know about Russell's enjoyment of seeing a woman's mascara run.
	But it did hit my ear just a little bit strangely.
	And as for being organized, given the pattern of behavior so far, It really wouldn't surprise me.
	But that is also speculation on my part, so who knows.
	Hey, waterproof mascara.
	Mm hmm.
	Yeah.
	Let's get on the bandwagon, guys.
	Yeah, I think the other kind needs to... Nobody should make it anymore.
	I mean, that's victim blaming technically, but let's be proactive about it, you know?
	I blame the makeup companies.
	Listen, that's a different show.
	Makeup companies?
	Different show.
	I don't like those either, but different show.
	I am poorly qualified to speak on the subject.
	The main thing I wanted to deal with today is the defense of Russell Brand.
	So, plenty of people have come out the woodwork in the comments section of our video alone and said spurious shit based on conjecture.
	Well done again for shouting these people down, audience.
	Don't take the bullshit.
	If it's happening right now, have a look at it.
	Yeah, yeah, please do.
	Please do.
	Let them have it.
	I can see you.
	There is a concentrated effort in social media platforms to decry the allegations against Brand as being made up, false-doctored, or whatever else, simply because Russell Brand is supposedly too dangerous to the mainstream media.
	In something of a moment of cognitive dissonance, even the members of the mainstream media like Beverly Turner are supporting Russell Brand.
	Bear in mind, she's a news presenter for the right-wing GB News, but she is obsessed with COVID nonsense, however.
	The mental gymnastics she is having to do in her support of Russell Brand is really funny.
	And then you've got the, like, her co-host is the consultant editor for the Daily Mail, and he's the one saying, no, no, Russell's a piece of shit.
	And I'm like, what world do I live in?
	You know, the Daily Mail of all fucking right-wing rags.
	God.
	Well, let's also never forget that class recognizes class.
	Class solidarity, class consciousness has a lot to do with this.
	And never underestimate, like, I promise you, the most vile defenders are gonna be women.
	I'm sorry.
	I'm sorry that's true, but the comments that we were looking at, my partner Mike, our little detective, is the stuff that's like, oh, what is from women?
	Women with healthy shopping habits at Cost Plus World Market.
	A lot of Pier 1 imports.
	With Russell Brand especially, his audience is a lot more women than is normal for his kind of shit.
	Which was one of the first things we talked about before we were talking about this project.
	I was like, women are especially vulnerable.
	Having a person of my experience Little did we know!
	Little did we know how vulnerable.
	Yeah, I thought he'd just be selling yoga mats!
	Yeah, right?
	So there are a slew of things here to deal with, but the first one that I want to tackle that is bandied about fairly often, pretty much everywhere, is that the timing is suspicious.
	Specifically because Brand speaks out against legacy media, the timing of this is somehow suspicious.
	If you ask anyone what they actually mean by that, however, it becomes abundantly clear that they don't mean, oh, it was during his stand-up tour, so therefore, you know, interfering with him economically, or, oh, he's got a big interview or takedown coming up, you know, of the media or the military-industrial complex or whatever else.
	No, no, no, it's not that.
	What they mean is that they don't understand why these women took so long to come forward.
	To them, the very idea that the women came forward many years later about abuse, sexual assault, and rape is a mystery that can only be solved by it being some concerted conspiracy to take Russell Brand down.
	And of course, because in Brand's preemptive response, he called it a coordinated attack.
	So what I'm going to do, I'm going to play a brief clip from Talk TV, Piers Morgan's current home, of an interview with James Coney, who is the Special Investigations Editor for the Sunday Times.
	The first allegation that we had about Russell Grand came in 2019, which is to Rosamund Irwin, who's a reporter at the Sunday Times.
	Obviously that's a substantial time ago, and long before Russell Grand was Started this kind of current rhetoric on on YouTube with allegations like, you know, and then with stories like this, allegations come in.
	And that was the first one of substance that we had.
	And lots of other things happen in between with investigations like this.
	And so we then had another allegation of substance in about 2021, which is really then when the investigation starts to kind of get into full swing.
	With investigations like this, they're very, very complicated.
	They involve talking to lots and lots of different people.
	We've spoken to close to about 500 people, I think, in total in the course of this investigation.
	And while you have to deal sensitively with people who make allegations like this, you also have to be rigorous and check everything that they're saying.
	And so therefore, it takes a long time to do that.
	They're also very, very, very legally complicated.
	So when people say, why now this?
	I mean, there's some, you know, I mean, it's no doubt at all that Russell Brand has gone down that sort of conspiracy theory.
	I agree with him on some things, disagree with him on others.
	You don't have to say that.
	You're saying, look, we've been looking into this for a long time.
	The why now is this is the point at which we were able to pull it together and be legally safe to actually put these allegations into the public mainstream.
	Yes, and it's also about the women.
	The women that we've spoken to have been through an awful lot and gaining their trust and getting them to a position where they were willing to speak out has been enormously complicated.
	Yeah!
	You don't have to give it up to the Somali Pirates, Julia Hartley Brewer, you really don't.
	So the first accusation came to the Times in 2019.
	As we've demonstrated in our Russell Brand Primer episode, episode 16 for anyone wondering, he only really started getting on this whole anti-establishment tip once COVID kicked in and he realised it did wonders for his numbers.
	If you take a look at his Subscribe account, it's only post-2020 where it really starts to explode because of this narrative he began to spin, pandering to the alt-right.
	So this- Well, he's been anti-establishment for a long time.
	Not in this way.
	But in this particular way.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	Not in this way whatsoever.
	Okay, I just wanted to clarify.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	This alone disproves the theory that it's because Russell Brand is too dangerous, as at the time the first allegation was made, he was just an actor and comedian with a YouTube channel talking shit about wellness and doling out relationship advice.
	It was milquetoast stuff at that point, which I was fine with.
	And of course, because it's an enormously complicated investigation, speaking to over 500 people, as James Coney just said, of course it took a long time to verify and substantiate that what was being said is verifiable.
	It was obviously a gigantic, complicated investigation.
	Well, I mean, that's that's that's, you know, four years in total in the making.
	And through COVID, which slows everything down.
	Yeah, very true.
	Very true.
	I do want to speak briefly about the legal responsibility put on the media in this country.
	So the press in the UK are regulated by IPSO, the Independent Press Standards Organization.
	IPSO have a detailed and rigorous editor's code of practice, which ensures that stories printed in the newspapers are accurate, ethically sound, and sufficiently in the public interest in cases where someone's privacy has been breached.
	If Ipso decides, following a standards investigation, that a publisher has not upheld the expected standards, it can require a member to publish an adjudication, which may include a requirement to address the concerns raised, impose a fine on the member of up to a million pounds, ...require the member to pay the reasonable costs of the investigation, and terminate the member's membership of IPSO, which would essentially shut them down.
	Because they would no longer be a reputable thing in any sense.
	Right.
	That's your regulatory body.
	It's basically being... Gone.
	Yeah, it's your licensing body.
	Yeah.
	You would be done.
	That would take down the Sunday Times.
	That would take down the Times if that happened.
	So, needless to say, when an investigation like this happens, when a newspaper regulated by Ipso comes along with a story, if they don't follow procedure properly in verifying the veracity of someone's claims, they can be royally, royally fucked.
	Accordingly, standard practice in all investigations is to have what's called an audit trail, so the information can be properly tracked and traced throughout the investigation, so it's crystal clear whether anything is made up or misinformed.
	To my knowledge, there has been no complaint to Ipso regarding this piece from Brand, his representatives, or anyone else.
	And you'd think, if it was all made up, that would be your first port of call, right?
	That would be your first, ah, I'll report this!
	You know?
	Curious.
	Very curious.
	Very curious.
	And here's the thing, maybe they're getting their ducks in a row legally as well, but- He's known about this for more than a week before it aired, right?
	He's had plenty of time to get his ducks in a row.
	I mean, but, or they, I don't know.
	To just submit a complaint to Ipso is a form, it's a web form.
	I could do one now, and I'm almost tempted to do it, To make sure that they go through it and then go, oh yes, this is perfectly fine.
	Just because it would shut some of these people up.
	But, you know, who knows?
	Who knows?
	Yeah, if we weren't dealing with the copyright strike right now, I'd say, hell yeah, but I'm not trying to make anybody mad right now.
	Even though we are well within our legal rights.
	Under fair use.
	We all know that that's, listen, that only matters so much when it comes to social media sites.
	Yeah, no, for sure.
	It is what it is.
	They're going to protect themselves.
	If talk TV want to come for us, then I'll fight that as well, because fuck them.
	So the second clip I want to play is regarding the anonymity of the victims.
	Even though a lot of them are anonymous.
	A lot of people are getting in touch saying this morning, why did these women go to the media?
	Why didn't they go to the police?
	And why didn't they go to the police at the time?
	What have they said to you about that?
	If you look at the story that we've written, they are, say for example, the woman who we call Nadia, who's based in Los Angeles, she went to a rape crisis counselling centre on the day that the attack happened.
	And that was reported to the police.
	And the interview that Charlotte Weiss has got in the Times today speaks to how she was intimidated by him.
	You know, this was a very, very, very famous man at the time.
	And as we've also got a piece in the paper today from the former Victims Commissioner of the Police in London, talking about how hard it is for women still to this day to have the confidence in a police investigation.
	They last years and years.
	They can be incredibly intimidating.
	And so therefore, if you're dealing with somebody who's very, very famous, And you're in a vulnerable situation.
	It's enormously difficult to go to the police.
	And we know that most women in this situation, whether it's a TV movie star or just, you know, the bloke next door, they tend not to go to the police.
	In this country, an estimated 16% of victims of sexual assault go to the police.
	The numbers are probably considerably lower than that in reality.
	We spoke about it briefly in our last episode, but I do want to come back to how an anonymous source to a regulated journalistic institution is entirely different to an anonymous source from someone chatting shit on the internet.
	I will say, firstly, there are legal protections in place in the UK for victims of sexual assault, where they cannot be named by anyone legally.
	Not just the media, right?
	So if someone came to me and told me of a sexual assault that they experienced, and I outed them on social media, I could be fined and go to prison for it.
	Yeah.
	That's one of those legal regulations, and I mentioned this in the last episode as well, That are just different in different countries, which is why it's so useful to have both of our perspectives.
	Because, you know, not even just America.
	A whole lot of the world, unfortunately, would be very America-centric, and shit's just different other places.
	There's a reason you protect victims.
	That's entirely logical.
	Yeah, okay.
	This is according to the Sexual Offences Act amended in 1992, for anyone wondering or wanting to look that up.
	It is also written into the IPSO Editor's Code, of course, so even if the newspapers wanted to publish these women's names, they're unable to, which is a very necessary protection for victims of sexual assault.
	So the women must legally remain anonymous unless they decide to come forward themselves.
	But of course, the people involved in the investigation know who they are.
	James Coney knows who they are and their real names.
	That's how they're able to verify the information.
	They're just legally sworn to secrecy on the subject.
	So it's not like, oh, no one knows who these women are, because the journalists do.
	And yet again, I must reiterate, The reason that these women don't want to be named in public is because can you imagine the harassment they'd be receiving right now from the brand defenders of the world?
	Like, first, they'd have to deal with the regular, more respectful press.
	Then the tabloids, who would absolutely go so far as going through the victims' trash cans or recording them illegally.
	I'm looking at you, Piers Morgan.
	And then they'd have to deal with the more abusive and troll-like side of Brown's defenders, who just comment in constant bullshit.
	And beyond that, there's a very real possibility of them being doxxed and put in literal physical danger by these people.
	And then, the same defenders of brand have the balls to say, oh, it's all fake and made up and the people are actors.
	If it was real, why wouldn't they come forward?
	And it's like, well, because of you, you shitheads!
	Because you're a rabid dog!
	Yes, because of you!
	That's why they're not coming forward!
	You're frothing in the fucking mouth!
	Yeah, that's why.
	I thought they'd be a decent human being and maybe they will come forward.
	Oh my god, the environment these women would be walking into is physically, emotionally,
	and mentally dangerous and none of them deserve to have to deal with that.
	They have been through enough.
	Like, oh my god.
	It gives me the creeps.
	But it's also, it's just people not understanding basic journalistic ethics.
	Or even just journalistic imperative.
	Imperative.
	Like, what they legally can and can't do.
	There's not understanding, and there's also having been misled by people like Russell Brand.
	Oh, yeah!
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	Because that's a lot of the kind of alt-right's bread and butter, is anti-media.
	In the next clip, the presenter has a question about trial by media.
	But there is a concern about trial by media, isn't there?
	There is a concern that anyone and everyone can make accusations.
	People go, no smoke without fire and someone's career is over.
	How do you feel about that responsibility?
	We take it very, very seriously.
	I mean, the legal bar for trying to publish a story like we did is incredibly high.
	Yes.
	I would also say this, that your assertion works on the assumption that the justice system and the police system works absolutely perfectly.
	Fair point.
	We have to have a robust Free media that is able to investigate and hold authorities to account so that people who don't feel listened to can come forward and tell their stories and try to hold these organizations to account.
	And I think that's how that's how strongly I feel about it.
	Again, beyond regulations, The Times, Sunday Times and Channel 4 could absolutely be sued for libel and defamation if Brand felt he had a strong enough case.
	Again, very curious, there's nothing in the works.
	He had a good week and a half now to say how he's going to fight this in court.
	He could at least say, oh yeah, I'll fight this.
	But, um, curious silence instead.
	Also, there is an angle I hadn't fully considered before, but all of the people saying, oh the media shouldn't be doing this, trial by media, trial by media, and that is a lot of the comments by the way, what they're actually asking for is to restrict the freedom of the press It's at such odds with Russell Brand's message of stay free, my head damn near spun round like an owl.
	What these people are advocating, and what Russell is advocating for, is restricting what the press are able to report on, which is the very first step towards tyranny in my view.
	That's exactly what they do all the time.
	On top of that, it's hypocrisy to an alarming degree.
	God, I wish it mattered.
	I wish any hypocrisy mattered.
	But here's the thing.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	She said, you know, there's murmurs of smoke without fire, and before you know it, someone's lost their career.
	Who?
	Who has lost their career over a spurious claim that was not actually true?
	Who is that?
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	Who big fucking famous person?
	Yeah.
	I don't know.
	I can't think of anything.
	Julia Hartley Brewer, in this interview, I think she does a decent job.
	I don't know much about her, to be perfectly honest.
	Yeah, no, and my beef is not with her.
	It's very neutral.
	They're good questions to be answered.
	I don't mind that.
	The thing is, talk TV is, like, fucking skewed to the right, you know.
	Oh, really?
	Man.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	But, you know, it seems like what she's mostly trying to address is, this is what our listeners are saying.
	That's what I got, too.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	So what are your answers to that?
	The kind of, the brief moments where she does interject her personal opinion, she seems to mostly just be agreeing with James Coney.
	So, yeah, I don't take personal issue with her, but yeah, it is telling that those are the issues being brought up by the audience.
	Yeah, trial by media is a triggering phrase for me at this point.
	Right, right, I've seen it so much.
	It's trial by years of investigation and supported evidence.
	That's what it is.
	Yeah.
	That's, it's not just trial by, but seriously, I fucking want to know someone that's been accused and has lost their whole career.
	Like they were on, they were in movies and now they have to sell hot dogs, you know, at, at Wrigley Field or whatever.
	Like they have to work at McDonald's.
	I want to know who that is.
	Someone who was someone who that has happened to where there was nothing to any of the claims.
	You know, show me that person.
	Completely.
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	Someone made an accusation and it was completely false and they lost their whole career.
	I want to know!
	I'm trying to think off the top of my head.
	I think the closest example I think someone on the other side could name is probably Kevin Spacey because he's technically, legally, he won the legal case, didn't he?
	Well, that does not pass muster for my qualifications.
	It doesn't with me either.
	It doesn't with me either.
	And we did speak about this at length in one of our Off-Brand episodes.
	Yes, we did!
	It starts at a buck and you can hear all about it.
	We actually have a lot of kind of...
	Discussion and background if you're curious.
	Because that kind of came and went in the news cycle quickly.
	Really quick.
	That's crazy.
	Like I said, I still have odds on within the next few years seeing a fucking A-list movie with Kevin Spacey in it.
	In the back of my mind, that's still there.
	I'm waiting on it.
	I'm waiting on it.
	I agree and I hate it.
	[laughter]
	But yeah, yeah, yeah.
	Seriously.
	Fucking knock it off.
	Knock it off news. Stupid.
	The next thing I want to address is the notion that the text messages used in the article and the documentary were
	a cut and paste job and were doctored and faked.
	The clip I'm going to play is from a video that I found in the wild from an anonymous YouTuber called ThatUmbrellaGuy who has around 400,000 subscribers.
	This investigation is what a lot of brand defenders are pointing to as proof of something.
	So this is an absolute bombshell that proves that at least one piece of quote-unquote proof against Russell Brand was either faked outright or was manipulated and that was never disclosed by the Time and the Sunday Times.
	Now, you'll notice a couple of red line edits.
	Those are mine.
	But the rest of this, this was presented as one solid piece of texting.
	Well, you'll notice here that there's cut and paste jobs.
	In fact, there's a few of them here.
	You have dates missing and more.
	And on top of that, they present this in a way that it's not framed.
	It's not saying what they say, it's saying so.
	You have problems here with the story.
	You have problems with what they present.
	You and I, we're going to talk about all of that today.
	And this, this really is crazy times.
	This is crazy times indeed.
	I have a real issue with this guy.
	He's just such a fucking smarmy, like, I don't know, there's something to his tone that just, it's so obnoxious, it really rubs me the wrong way.
	It's not your fault how your voice sounds.
	No, it's in his presenter voice.
	I agree.
	I also hate him.
	If he was talking normally, I'd be fine with him, but being this fucking obnoxious about a subject of this gravity?
	This guy can get fucked!
	I know!
	That voice, if we were talking about our favorite kinds of pie?
	Oh, I'm here for that!
	Fine.
	You want to talk down to me about how cherry pie is not that great?
	You go for it, buddy.
	That's fine.
	But don't fucking talk to me about this, right?
	So, the red line edits in question.
	For listeners, this is just where he's put a red line through certain words.
	And the The words he's removed are rape, shit, condom, and sex.
	And he says it's because of YouTube algorithms that would work against him if he left them in.
	But it does have an effect of decidedly lessening the impact of the texts in question, because he does read them out in full as well.
	He later asserts that, ah, this isn't proof of rape or sexual assault, it's just a conversation about whether Brand used a condom.
	Like, it's got nothing to do with rape or sexual assault.
	And I've got to say, I have news for the guy, even if that were the case and it was consensual sex but Brand didn't use a condom when asked, that would still be sexual assault and is illegal.
	As it is.
	Okay.
	As it is.
	So like, that argument's already fucking stupid.
	I said, oh, to the illegal thing, which I'm not sure.
	State by state is different.
	And also it's here.
	So fucking anybody's guess.
	As it is, that's not the case.
	And these are texts regarding Brand having raped this woman.
	Because also, if it were just the condom thing, why would she be saying that he scared the shit out of her and how scary he is when that glazed look comes over him?
	You know, it doesn't make sense.
	Anyway, a few points about these texts.
	So, the dates missing thing is nonsense.
	There isn't a date stamp above one of the texts, because on an iPhone, if two messages are sent in fairly quick succession to one another, they don't include a date and time stamp.
	Which, for anyone listening, We're looking at a picture of a, like a long picture of a text message, and I can see a date on the first text, and then there's her reply, and then his reply to her reply, and that's a different date.
	Which would have been an immediate response.
	Yeah.
	Or even, could have been a couple of minutes, but on the same day, it's gonna be like, you know how you gotta pull it one way or the other to see the actual time, and then after that, there's a date, there's a timestamp underneath that.
	Exactly.
	So this guy's an idiot.
	So the information is available in the Messages app, but you have to drag it across.
	It wouldn't show up in a screenshot, right?
	As for it being a cut-and-paste job, as this fucking guy puts it, do you notice anything about the height of the screenshot provided?
	It's much longer than a phone, right?
	Because most likely the images were stitched together either by Nadia, the rape victim, or the Times or Sunday Times in order to make it into one image that is easier to read and makes sense.
	Yes.
	It's providing more context, not less.
	Either way, the journalists involved in this will have seen the actual text messages on the actual phone, and have verified that they came from Russell Brand's US number, and they've verified that with multiple sources.
	If this image is fake, then the Times and Sunday Times are going to get completely fucking destroyed by Ipso, or sued for libel.
	But again, there's nothing pending, and I don't think there's going to be.
	That was a part of the documentary that was really powerful, was like, we verified that these are the texts.
	Yeah, like, as in, they, as in, cell phone service providers cooperated and corroborated this information.
	This isn't just a screenshot that somebody sent via DM.
	There are also numerous sites that allow you to fake text messages in a seamless fashion, and so it's not even remotely credible that a journalistic institution of this size doing an expose of this magnitude would do such a shitty job of making something up if that's what they were gonna do.
	No shit!
	If that were their aim, they could have done better than Microsoft Paint, you know?
	I'm sure they have a Photoshop subscription somewhere at the times.
	This is the kind of shit that always tells on people.
	Just because you send fake texts to fuck with people doesn't mean other people do that.
	And also, yeah, you and your little friends, or maybe you terrorize your wife with this shit.
	Oh my god, I cannot imagine, like, only after thinking about it and talking it out, and this whole week, would it even occur to me, oh yeah, you can go and verify that texts are from a specific number that is registered, definitely registered to a person, because if you have the investigative power of a major, like, publication...
	Then you can do real research!
	That is the most thorough possible investigation possible!
	Not even just that, right?
	He said they spoke to around 500 people, right?
	No shit!
	Oh my god!
	A good number of those will have had Russell Brand's US number.
	So you just ask them, what is Russell Brand's US number?
	What's the phone number that you've got on record for Russell Brand?
	Is it this one?
	Okay, good.
	That's the same one he used to text this woman about the rape he did.
	Yeah, well like AT&T's got a paper trail.
	You know what I mean?
	This little, this goofy little display, it's just like, oh my god, I'm sorry that you have such a profound misunderstanding of how the world works.
	Yeah, I, I, yeah.
	Oh, the reasoning is so motivated, it's crazy.
	I have to include this stuff because this is… No, I'm glad you did!
	It's obviously bullshit.
	It is obvious from the off, but this is the stuff that brands' followers are pointing to and saying, oh, there's something, and there's nothing.
	Obviously, the right-wing freedom fighter, crunchy-to-alt-right pipeline commentators are all coming out in defense of Brand, and one of them that came across my radar was JP Reacts, Moron Extraordinaire.
	So, the clip I'm going to play is him reacting... No!
	Oh, no!
	No!
	It's not him reacting to the documentary, because holy shit, no, I'm not going to do that.
	No, it's him reacting to a woman who's come out and said, I was contacted by the Times but my story wasn't included.
	I actually know who this is about.
	And I have the receipts.
	I was contacted in June by a journalist regarding a video I made about a certain celebrity and a weekend that we shared together.
	The video is kind of viral.
	It's on my page somewhere if you want to go see it.
	And that certain somebody was, as most of you will be aware, Mr Brand.
	They weren't going to use my story because it didn't fit the narrative.
	So we want to talk to you for the story we're doing about Russell Brand, but you didn't tell us what we want, so we're not going to include any of your experience with him in our story.
	Okay, first of all, dude, soundproofing something, audio treating, you sound like you're recording in a fucking canyon.
	So, firstly, we mentioned this in one of our Trump episodes somewhere, I can't remember exactly where, but what these people and Russell Brand seem to want is a weird accounting for all the times that someone didn't commit crimes, rather than, you know, the times where they did in fact commit the crimes.
	It's fantastically stupid for a myriad of reasons, but needless to say, oh, Brand might be a rapist, but he didn't rape me is not an argument I find convincing.
	Also, let me just scroll back on the video so that we can see the text that she was showing to the screen here.
	There it is.
	There it is.
	So, I'm gonna read the whole thing in full.
	So it goes, quote, Hi Cara, I hope you don't mind me contacting you here.
	My name is blank, and I'm a journalist at the Times newspaper.
	We're currently working on a project in collaboration with Channel 4, and having seen a post on your TikTok from a few months ago, had wondered if it was something you might be able to help us with.
	It's fairly sensitive, so if you had a few minutes, it would be great to have a quick chat on the phone to explain in more detail.
	This would be strictly for research purposes only, nothing at all for publication.
	Please let me know if this could work.
	All the best.
	Blank.
	So they contacted her for background, made it clear that nothing she said would be included in the documentary or in the article, and yet she's pissed her story wasn't included?
	Like, to me, this reeks of someone glomming on to relevance for their 15 minutes in the spotlight while presenting this as a big bombshell.
	Oh yeah.
	I hope she sells a lot of drop-shipped lipstick.
	Good job, girl.
	Slay.
	Slay, queen.
	Gaslight gatekeep girl boss.
	Okay, here's the thing.
	In the documentary, in no uncertain terms, he was fucking five women a day.
	For years that he was on TV, maybe just weekdays, But like, five women a day.
	Some of them had to have had a lovely time.
	I imagine most.
	If everyone consented to spit, I bet they had a blast.
	Oh yeah.
	Like, sure.
	Okay.
	It's a numbers game at this point.
	I imagine there are probably hundreds of women that he has had perfectly fine consensual sex with.
	And count yourself lucky, girl!
	Yeah, that's not...
	We don't have a problem with that bit.
	No!
	Nor do we need to present.
	It was Donald Trump having boxes in his fucking thing, wasn't it?
	That's what the conversation was, I remember now.
	Having his boxes in Mar-a-Lago, because he was saying, "Oh, what about all the times that Trump didn't, you know,
	did all these other good things?"
	and it's like, well, that doesn't fix the bad thing.
	That's how this works.
	That is so dumb I did not retain it.
	I do not remember that.
	Because it's like too stupid!
	It just flies out of my brain.
	I'm like, no, too dumb!
	Where do I put that?
	Too stupid!
	It seems to be a consistent thing brought up by these people.
	It's like, oh, you're just trying to build a narrative.
	Yes, of crimes that have been committed.
	You know, it's not just, oh, I'm trying to take this person down.
	No, I'm trying to document the crimes that they've done.
	The things that aren't the crimes, I'm less concerned about, because they're not crimes, right?
	I'm focused on the criming part.
	Right, so the final clip that I want to play is another one from JP Reacts, giving his summary.
	Obviously there is a huge mainstream media blitz and launch on this Russell Brand accusations.
	Is it coordinated or is it actually expressing truth?
	Where I sit right now, I say it looks like a coordinated character assassination.
	It's not impossible that the accusations are true, yet for me to believe that someone like Russell Brand would do something like this, I have to see evidence.
	But when I see accusations in the media, untrustworthy media, untrustworthy media that has a tendency to band together and propagate the same stories, the same lies that we've seen them do over and over and over the past few years, Including character assassinations.
	That to me is not evidence.
	That to me actually raises suspicion.
	He's probably a better guy than I thought.
	Oh!
	If the media is so keen on taking him down.
	Yeah!
	Lauren is brandishing a hammer.
	No words!
	I said to someone in the comments section on our Reddit, burn it all down.
	Burn it all fucking down.
	This is my emotional support hammer.
	A varmint hammer, if you will.
	I have no intention of hurting... No, that was a shovel!
	It's different, and I missed!
	That was a shovel.
	Yeah, okay.
	So, that clip kind of tells you all you need to know about the mindset that these people are in, right?
	So, credible journalistic institutions who are well-regulated legally are all untrustworthy media that has a tendency to band together and propagate the same stories and lies.
	He was of course referencing COVID there.
	In reality, most of the media will cover the same stories because, for a start, only so
	much news happens in a day, and secondly, only a certain portion of that will be interesting
	enough to the general public for them to bother buying the newspaper or clicking on the article.
	It really is that simple.
	It's not some bizarre conspiracy just because you say it is.
	But because these alt-right people have been so radicalised against the legacy media, or
	basically anyone with an editorial staff who actually verify and check things, when the
	media is reporting something as bad, they all think, "Ah, so it must be good."
	And I really wish that perspective wasn't that childish or reductive, but very genuinely, if you look at the responses Russell Brand has had about the Inflation Reduction Act, the Hawaii wildfires, Obama's legacy, COVID, the Russo-Ukraine war, anything, he will go the exact opposite of what he considers the mainstream media to be doing.
	There's a degree of contrarianism there, but it's not just disagreeing for the sake of it, like a lot of people think.
	It's doing so for profit and to keep people in their alternative media ecosystem, which serves to further radicalize and isolate their audience to the point where suddenly a huge portion of the Western world is no longer living in the same reality as the rest of us.
	It does, quite frankly, sicken me that commentators like JPReacts are using this case of rape and sexual assault specifically to drag people further down the misinformation pipeline.
	It's disgusting, it's crass, it's self-serving, and fucking transparent.
	It's this guy's stock and trade though.
	Yeah, no, no, for sure.
	For sure.
	A fly is somewhere trying to kill Lauren.
	Take a drink.
	I think we're doing okay.
	Yeah, just absolutely atrocious.
	No, that's this guy's fucking M.O.
	Yeah.
	I already knew by him.
	I know about that one.
	He is a prick.
	Just because when he's got his hair down, he looks like a fucking hippie.
	I hate this guy.
	Aesthetics are out the window.
	But yeah, right.
	So that's the thing that like, We were talking about not our previous episode with the ugliness, but before that, they have to create this reality that only fits.
	Those puzzle pieces only fit in that one little puzzle.
	They're not getting building blocks that you can build on from different sources.
	And guess what?
	That's exactly what an emotional manipulative predator also does.
	They construct a world for you that you cannot escape.
	It is how they break down your Defenses?
	Your self-esteem so you become dependent on them.
	The fact that he has, like, he's broadcasting the exact same behaviors that he displays in the absolutely real text messages and accounts given by witnesses and victims It's the same shit!
	And that's what's so fucking dangerous!
	And just because it's extremely common for a lot of people to be some degree of emotionally manipulative does not make any of it right!
	And any of it okay!
	Nope.
	Oh my god!
	I'm so mad!
	It's shocker, right?
	I've obviously, you know, I've had the pleasure of being the one to look at all this shit and, you know, cut the clip.
	So I'm more at the point of back to staring into middle distance, kind of, you know, just that.
	We've been trading off a little bit too.
	I had some very aggressive texts that I'm like, I'm gonna send these to you because you know how I'm feeling.
	And then you're like, yep, and then I'll field it.
	We're all in this together.
	Very much have the bleak look on my face that I'm sure pretty much every listener had after listening to our last episode.
	Okay.
	And now life has changed forever.
	I am not thrilled with any of these defenses, but thankfully they're all bullshit, so that's something, I guess.
	I hope that our audience, if you come across these things in the wild, because you will, you can at least level some of this shit at them.
	By all means, if someone needs to be taken to task on it, Point them to this episode.
	They're not going to like it, but point it to them anyway.
	Any of the content, or tag us in if you need it, or find something.
	We're so happy to help.
	And that's what we were talking about a little bit before we started recording, is like, well, we still have to... It's not that we have... Yeah, we do.
	We're still doing this podcast after this.
	We're figuring it out.
	Um, but this has changed everything and like, it doesn't feel great and I don't have a plan and I feel a little overwhelmed and ill-equipped, but we definitely have to keep doing it now.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, because I feel like his power in this particular sphere is only growing from this.
	That's honestly what I feel like is happening.
	And so yet again, because he's made this pivot, he is only going to be rewarded for these horrible things that he has done.
	Well, and what that looks like.
	And to people that, especially like, you know, to your average viewer, there will be people that will see this on the periphery, potentially a lot of them, that will see, especially if they're confronted with the documentary, they'll be like, I don't know.
	And you know, like Homer sinking into the bushes, right?
	That will, I think, to a degree, there will be some exit, right?
	But, From Russell's sphere.
	From Russell's sphere, but these are the exact type of events, and it's not like we can't not prosecute.
	It's not like we can't not try to undo some of the damage that's been done.
	So there's really no like solution for it, but this kind of like negative press
	and this kind of bad news does take that core of people that are really committed
	and just cement that, that core even tighter.
	And they will believe even more as, as, uh, Joan Cusack said.
	In high fidelity, you're making a little unit, like they're going to make a unit
	because there's pressure from the outside.
	So you are going to have people that are going to leave and then you're going to
	have people that are going to double down and support each other in that and
	bolster each other.
	And people who are new, as well.
	Also that, yeah, for sure.
	45,000 new subscribers, and there'll be a segment of Andrew Tait's audience going over, there'll be a segment- Yeah!
	He just put the call out for Predators!
	Yeah.
	Yeah, I have I have all these followers that are that are lapping my bullshit up with a spoon.
	So you can definitely like in the periphery, you can certainly pick on him to pick them off.
	Have at, because these people have already been groomed because that's what Russell is doing, that's what Russell has been doing, is he's grooming his audience.
	That's another word for creating that kind of like, that alternative sphere.
	You are creating an alternative reality.
	And then constantly reinforcing that alternative reality and causing a cognitive dissonance that will make someone cling to the person that's making them feel good and feel the best, or not even just a person, cling to ideas that make them feel okay, and then push even harder at ideas that don't feel okay and do make them feel dissonant and do make them question things that they held to be true, and again, Remember, you cannot decide what you believe.
	Humans do not get to make, like, you can try as hard as you want, you can work very hard on yourself, and you can be very critical of information, and you can do your absolute best to stay informed, but at the end of the day, we do not get to decide our beliefs.
	And they can be very deeply ingrained.
	And I'm going to stress that Keith Raniere and Warren Jeffs, fucking monsters, are still benefiting from and operating their cults with hundreds of people while they are in jail.
	Yep.
	And even Alex Jones getting demonetized on all these platforms and getting removed and getting banned, he's still going.
	InfoWars is still trucking along.
	There's no way that Russell's gonna stop.
	He will possibly... I mean, he'll stop broadcasting when he's in prison, but until that point, not a chance.
	For a start, his ego demands it, but beyond that, you know, financial side of it and everything else... His legal team's gonna demand it to him.
	Yeah, I bet they are earning their keep this week.
	I do feel like, like I said, my money is on him coming back in a week, in a month, whenever.
	And he's just going to pick up where he left off because also I know for a fact that he's got a few interviews in the bank as well.
	There have been a few that he's done that are going to be released and that I'm curious about.
	What's that like?
	Getting a bank episode?
	Crazy!
	We don't have that luxury.
	I'm curious whether he's still going to release those interviews or whether, because I mean, technically he would still, I think, be allowed to?
	I don't think, you know.
	But whether the people that he was interviewing are still fine with being on the show is a different matter, because I know for a fact one of them is Crystal Ball.
	Oh, what a motherfucker that would be!
	If you, like, go to an interview and then you see it come out after that?
	After they've been outed as a racist and sexual assaulter!
	And Crystal Ball, I'm not the biggest fan of, as I've mentioned before.
	From what I know about her content, I don't think she would go down that road.
	I think that's a bit rich for her blood.
	That's a guess.
	Last I checked, she's not said anything denouncing Brad.
	Last I checked.
	I don't think she's mentioned it.
	I'm not sure.
	I will recheck that.
	Well, what I'm honestly really worried about Is that because there's a couple of ways you can launder your image after like a pretty big problem and I am I feel like.
	His drug treatment was kind of like, whatever.
	Yeah, that's just part of his story.
	But he talks about sex in his books a lot, I guess.
	There's way more clips from his book in the documentary.
	They're all damning.
	It's terrifying.
	Well, because it's also a pretty great insight into his mental process.
	But anyway, the way that he It seemed like, maybe just because he was famouser, but the show of him going into treatment for sex addiction in 2006, I believe?
	2005, I think.
	2005, yeah.
	Yeah, so making a big show of it, that does buy you a lot of goodwill with audiences.
	I personally think that that sex addiction treatment facility owes someone a fucking refund.
	Just saying.
	To say the least.
	Somebody needs to get their fucking money back, but... I know.
	Listen, I gotta make jokes.
	What am I gonna do?
	But, um, the... I'm very, very worried that if shit really hits the fan for him...
	And he wants to get a big giant wad of sympathy from everybody all at once, then throwing himself on the sword.
	You know, I mean, it's like a classic politician move is just like crying and talking about like legitimately throw your dad under the bus.
	Like dad is primed to be like blamed.
	I mean, I mean, I mean, let him fight in a way, but yeah.
	Now I'm thinking about that, oh jeez.
	Did I tell you about that?
	There was a boxing match between- Drew under a bus?
	What?
	What?
	No, no, no.
	What are we talking about?
	No, with Russell Brand and his dad, I forget whether I mentioned that.
	WHAT?!
	So there was... do you remember that 2002 thing with Nazi Boy?
	That show that he did?
	Oh yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah!
	That's in the primer, guys!
	I played the clip of the BNP guy.
	So that same show, which is the same show where he...
	masturbated another man to completion in a in a in a Toilet stall in a public toilets to test whether he was gay or not turns out he wasn't Yeah, they're in in a different episode there is there is him having a boxing match with his dad to kind of Sort of air their kind of grievances and whatever else in in that episode Okay.
	In light of kind of everything, I don't know, I might go back and have a look at that because, you know, it features, you know, obviously his dad is in it being interviewed and they're having a conversation and everything else.
	I mean, the thing is, is like, you know, like Mel Gibson's dad was like all over like right wing, like Looney Tune media.
	Fucking Nazi, yeah.
	It's like a whole thing.
	It's a whole thing.
	It's not unreasonable to see the living source, because obviously, you know, generations of people have these issues and they pass them down, you know, it's a cycle.
	And so that person, I think, might be worth Looking into a little bit.
	I tried.
	I cheated.
	I cheated a while ago and I tried to find more about Russell Brand's dad and I couldn't find anything because he's a photographer and I'm like, what are you taking pictures of?
	Yeah.
	I just, I was a little, you know what I mean?
	I'm like, I hope it's flowers.
	Or trees.
	I hope it's trees.
	I don't think so.
	I don't think that's the kind of photography that Ron Brand engages in.
	That's just my estimation.
	What we do need to do at some point is actually, we need to read his books.
	I know we've said we're going to do Revolution, you know, when we get to a certain patron goal.
	I super don't want to!
	I mean, Revolution, that'll all just be politics and bullshit, you know, and that's ten hours of that nonsense, but... It is important, though, yeah.
	He's got my bookie work and my bookie work, too, that are autobiographical, and given what we've had to cover here, I do think possibly going through them with a fine tooth comb would actually be worth the effort, so I might add those in as possibly separate patron stretch goals, I think.
	Cause I don't want to do with them now, that's for sure.
	I'm not in the right headspace for that.
	No, no, no, no, no, no.
	But right.
	Anyway, I, yeah, I just, I don't know.
	What I'm worried about is him doing, like, this big, you know, like, falling on yourself, you know.
	Yeah, yeah.
	Saul of Tarsus falling in the scales, rolling from his eyes, and, oh, where is me, kind of like.
	Basically committing seppuku, you know, that kind of switch.
	Because if anybody can do it, he absolutely can.
	He absolutely has it in his wheelhouse.
	Being an actor, emotionally manipulating, all of that shit.
	He would nail it, I'm sure.
	Well, he does it individually.
	He was weeping at these women for apologies and was love bombing.
	That's the nature of this kind of person.
	Absolutely.
	The quote that I read at the end of the last episode was he cried and whatever else to remove this girl's underwear.
	Yeah.
	What I would say about that is, yes, definitely possible, but it requires him to acknowledge wrongdoing, and I don't think that's the legal advice he's getting at the moment.
	Well, that's what I'm saying, is I think that it would have to come to a point where he's confronted.
	Because that's whenever politicians have to, it's like, that rubber has to hit the road before they admit anything.
	I like how Lauren Boebert claims she wasn't vaping until, like, there were cameras everywhere, and she's like, well, I don't believe I was vaping, but the evidence shows that I was.
	Did you see the response?
	There was a question of, like, oh, so what did you learn from that experience?
	She's too eccentric?
	No, no, no.
	That wasn't the thing I was on about.
	No, she said, oh, well, I learned I need to check party affiliations before I go on a date with someone.
	The issue was that I was making out with a Democrat.
	That was the problem.
	I was trying to fuck a Democrat.
	Don't get your titties honked and give somebody a heej in a fucking kids-friendly play, you creep!
	That's a creep!
	That's a creep!
	She's a creep!
	Has she said anything about Russell Brand?
	I feel like she must have.
	Oh, no, no, no, no.
	She doesn't know that there are, she barely knows that there are states other than Colorado.
	She definitely doesn't know that the UK exists.
	There's no fucking way.
	I'd give her a million dollars to pick it on a map.
	No, no, no.
	She's no, she's incredible.
	But I mean, look at that rack.
	She doesn't got to know stuff.
	God bless America!
	Them's the rules.
	Obviously.
	I would agree with you if she wasn't, you know, U.S.
	Representative Lauren Boebert.
	Literally everything's wrong.
	Every single thing about that is wrong.
	But it is at least hilarious.
	That's true.
	That's true.
	There is comedy.
	It's the dumber version of Sarah Palin and I can't believe that that's a conversation that That we're having these days.
	That's the thing!
	Yeah, man.
	I mean, it's also not funny.
	It's not funny.
	The situation, if you look at it, is like, oh, this is horrible for our whole country.
	Incredibly tragic and problematic.
	This is terrible.
	Yeah.
	The whole situation itself, awful.
	What a vile creature.
	How can you be so thoroughly vile?
	Like, from the legitimately morally bankrupt, reprehensible parts of the things that she did, which are myriad.
	Also, flash photography.
	That is the thing that Mike has been beside himself.
	That someone was using flash photography in a theatre production?
	Oh!
	He clutched so many pearls!
	Of all the issues to take, Mike.
	He's just been... inconsolable.
	Out of the list, picking that as your hill to die on, you know?
	And she was singing out loud at the music, like it was... Yeah, it's not great.
	I understand the impulse as a vocalist, but don't do it.
	Yeah, fucking knock it off!
	Oh my god.
	Stop it.
	Nobody's paying to listen to you.
	Yup!
	Yeah, it's like she was a PSA for how to not behave in public.
	It was like there was a list to hit the points.
	At the very least, thank you Lauren Bobert for providing some comic relief at the end of this episode.
	Definitely, the well is deep there.
	If you want to support us and what we do, please find us on Patreon.com slash OnBrand.
	I would be very, very grateful.
	Also, oh my god, this is taking so much time and work.
	Yeah, for sure.
	It's really hard and stressful.
	I mean, our normal show's bad enough.
	If you want to email us, it's theonbrandpod at gmail.com.
	We'd love to hear from you.
	That'd be cool.
	There is a subreddit that is dedicated to us.
	It's not run by us, but we are the subject.
	It's onbrand underscore pod.
	And we are there.
	We have some cool conversations with some really nice people over there.
	Yes.
	And I do want to plug specifically, we are tracking... Well, there is a thread that somebody started tracking other celebrities that have come out in favor and support of Russell Brand.
	It's a bit of an accountability project, so if you would like to contribute to that in some way, I'm very interested about just that little science experiment.
	Yeah, it's curious.
	I'm quite interested.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	Please find the thread, and if you've got any names, add them to the list.
	Yeah, on socials, we're at the on-brand pod in most places, and our personal socials, I'm at our worth official, and Lauren is at me.by.lauren.b.
	And that is our show.
	And plugs.
	We're going to do plugs, because- Oh yeah, you got plugs?
	Well, it's the same, but we have a bunch of new listeners, and so if you're new, hi, I make stuff, and sometimes I show up in real life and then sell the stuff, or just- And you are based in Chicago, correct?
	Based in Chicago.
	Oh yes, thank you.
	Thank you.
	Based in Chicago, you can see some of this stuff behind me that I make.
	It's also on my socials, and the worst website you'll ever see in your whole life.
	That's a whole other thing.
	Welcome to the real saga.
	That's the saga.
	Yeah, that's my personal...
	Horcrux.
	Yeah, so this coming weekend, so Saturday, September 23rd, the Beverly Art Walk is happening on the South Side from 12 to 5.
	I will not be at Made Artisan Collective, but I am bringing the big guns and putting a whole new selection of art and stuff in there because I'm double booked the same day at Jackalope Coffee from 11 to 6 again on Saturday.
	They're having their anniversary party and it was a blast and a half last year and actually and it's free.
	And P. Lander Z is headlining.
	So if you want to come see P. Lander Z, check it out.
	And October 6th, first Fridays at Charles Adams Projects in Lubbock, Texas.
	So not Chicago, but Lubbock, Texas.
	UFOs over Lubbock.
	It's like one of the coolest events that we do every year.
	And so we have We'll have a night of I think it's in the evening it's like five to nine I think.
	Again October 6th and I'm still soliciting any recommendations you have for Roswell because we will be going to Roswell for fun and I like y'all's opinions because I'm pretty sure you're like also smart fun people so I'm open to any suggestions that you have which can be emailed to us.
	Yes.
	So those are it.
	And I'm a hugger with permission, and I would really love to meet listeners and say hello.
	In the same vein, I will be at QEDCon this weekend.
	Yes, yes, yes!
	That is happening.
	I will be there from Friday to the Sunday.
	I will be at the Mixer event on Friday.
	I think I'll be there from like Friday evening-ish.
	So, yeah, come and say hi.
	If you're an Awakening wonder or if you're a listener or whatever else, come and say hello, because I will know pretty much nobody there.
	So that's going to be interesting.
	So, yeah.
	Yeah!
	Go say hi to Al!
	It's gonna be a super cool weekend.
	The schedule looks amazing.
	I'm so jealous.
	I could just explode, but I'm also really excited that you get to go.
	That's cool.
	I'll try and, if I can, take some funny videos that we can include in this podcast, or in an off-brand or something, because that would be enjoyable.
	If I don't get even one stupid FaceTime, I'll be... Oh yeah, for sure.
	Yeah, I imagine when we see Thomas and everything.
	There'll be something.
	Here's the thing, as a person that does events also, sometimes you just forget that you have a phone for a couple days.
	That's true.
	Okay, you deserve a break today!
	You also don't have to deal with your phone like at all.
	So if anybody wants to say, hey, absolutely do it.
	But also maybe if you see on their phone too much, just be like, hey.
	MG Well, the thing is, I will be thinking of you because, you know, it's one of those events where I- CMH Because you'll feel how jealous I am!
	MG Yeah, you will enjoy it, obviously.
	CMH From miles and miles away!
	MG You should be there!
	Not just as co-host of this podcast, but an enjoyer of everything that QEDcon would provide, you know?
	CMH Well, they do a great job of putting out everything, you know, they do a great job of putting out their content after the fact too, so.
	I'm not that worried about it.
	And if it'll happen someday, then that's great.
	And it's okay, because guess what?
	I'm going to be so stressed on Saturday.
	Basically, as soon as we're done recording until Saturday at 11, I'm going to be losing my gourd.
	So it's all right.
	It'll be all right.
	It's okay.
	It's okay.
	Making stuff is hard, but it's my lot in life.
	It's what we do.
	It's all right.
	100%.
	100%.
	Okay, well, that's our show, everybody.
	We're gonna head off-brand.
	This off-brand might still be about Russell Brand in this one case, because there's a lot going on.
	There's a lot going on.
	Yeah, there's saltiness Yeah, we love you very much.
	Thank you for listening.
	We love you very much.
	As ever, look after yourselves, all right?
	Yes!
	Put yourself first.
	Yeah, take it easy, everyone.
	Absolutely.
	Take care.
	Yeah, Russell Brand is a rapist.
	Bye!
	Bye!
	You're right, he is.

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