Jeremy Boring's March 18th ouster from The Daily Wire signals the collapse of alternative media institutions as audiences shift loyalty to individual personalities like Candace Owens and Ben Shapiro. While figures such as Matt Walsh and Michael Knowles debate heritage-based identity against "Woke Wars" ideologies, the network faces financial implosion after losing its last profitable show. Speakers argue that authenticity now outweighs institutional backing, yet controversial claims regarding white supremacy, Christian nationalism, and globalist threats to Western civilization persist, suggesting a cultural fracture where legacy gatekeepers fail while new, divisive narratives emerge. [Automatically generated summary]
Transcriber: CohereLabs/cohere-transcribe-03-2026, WAV2VEC2_ASR_BASE_960H, sat-12l-sm, script v26.04.01, and large-v3-turbo
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Why We Left Google00:01:17
Leave us a five star review on your favorite podcast platform.
I get it.
It's annoying.
Everybody asks, but I'm going to tell you why.
When you give us a positive review, what that does is it triggers the algorithm so that our podcast shows up on more people's news feeds.
You and I both know that this ministry is willing to talk about things that most ministries aren't.
We need this content for the glory of God to reach more people's ears.
The Daily Wire was founded in 2015 and grew astronomically in its first few years.
By 2018, they were by far the most popular right wing publisher on all of Facebook.
And by 2021, their stories received more social media attention than any other news publisher, according to NPR.
They made their headlines over the years from uncanceling conservatives that had been unjustly fired or hitting back at woke companies like Harry's Razors and Hershey's Chocolate.
But as of yesterday, March 18th, co CEO and co founder Jeremy Boring is stepping down as CEO.
Now, whether this was willingly or unwillingly doesn't really matter.
It's a huge shakeup for someone who's as visible as Jeremy.
The Rise and Fall of Cable TV00:04:56
And behind the scenes, quite honestly, things are not looking good.
Two of their biggest stars, Candace Owens and Brett Cooper, have departed to considerable success elsewhere.
Their daily content, streaming services, and film endeavors aren't making the impact that they used to.
Now, it would be tempting to chalk this up to misstep.
Management and internal drama.
But underneath, there's a bigger theme.
Daily Wire was the disruption to legacy media.
Young, informed millennials and Gen X have largely stopped watching cable TV and now consume their news via the internet.
Daily Wire leapt on that trend right as it took off.
But eventually, the disruptors often become the establishment, prone to being disrupted themselves.
And now, a mere 10 years from its founding, Daily Wire is finding out.
That it is what Fox News was in 2015 an aging legacy establishment that couldn't take the next step to keep up with the rapidly changing culture and the shifting Overton window.
This episode is brought to you by our premier sponsors, Armored Republic and Reese Fund, as well as our Patreon members and our faithful donors.
You can join our Patreon by going to patreon.com forward slash right response ministries.
Or you can donate by going to rightresponse ministries.com forward slash donate.
So today we are going to talk about the rise and fall of the Daily Wire, the coming decline of alternative media, and where new personalities are quickly filling the void.
Welcome back.
Welcome back.
Wednesday, White Pill.
It's good to be with you guys.
Jeremy Boring is out.
Patriots in control.
No, just kidding.
No, so big news yesterday.
Not the JFK files, as big as that was.
80,000 pages.
I haven't read all of it yet.
That's going to take time.
Getting to the end.
It's going to take time for people to sift through.
Like you're already seeing people report certain things.
Like Israeli intelligence was one of the things that came out.
But that one's going to take time for people to really glean something useful.
A lot of it, too, is Xerox or scanned in pages, too.
There's no just Control F and search for whatever term or term.
Even AI has a hard time reading through that sometimes.
But now, did we get that to distract from the fact we never got Epstein?
Because that kind of the.
We didn't give you what we promised.
Who knows?
We'll give you this.
I did see that JFK wrote a nice letter to Biden back when Biden was just a lowly senator.
Did you guys see that?
I just saw the headline there.
They just had a snippet of it and it was a letter from JFK to Biden that said, You know, you're Biden, I know you're a traitor or something like that.
And then it was cut off at that point.
Wow.
Yeah, he's been in trouble for a while, even back as a senator.
Not great.
But that's not the topic of conversation today.
Someday, maybe, Lord willing, we'll get all into it.
But we're talking today about The Daily Wire.
And just to rewind, why The Daily Wire and why is it important that Jeremy Boring stepped down in the larger macro trend?
At the end of the day, news media outlets, they rise and they fall.
So why spend the time, right?
Why spend some time talking about this?
And I think it's interesting because it'll be alluded to in the cold opening.
This isn't just a single one off example.
You guys have to understand that The Daily Wire has been.
For better or for worse, the most successful conservative, and we'll put some air quotes around that one conservative, but a conservative right wing media, they've been the biggest one by the numbers that has emerged in the modern 2010s era.
If you kind of rewind back, television was the big thing that changed the way Americans consumed media.
And you can throw up graph number one here, but cable TV, I mean, it was in everyone's home, and everyone wasn't just watching, you know, like there were 600 shows to choose from, they had like three.
And you can see here that cable TV, in many ways, is the number of households that it occupied, that it peaked right around 2012, 2013.
And the real decline from about 100 million homes, it's in about 100 million American homes, cable TV subscribers, where that decline starts is 2015.
And that's the year that the Daily Wire starts.
And that was a real important point where the turning happened.
And people began more and more, they certainly were starting to, but they got less of their information from television, less of their information from legacy media.
I mean, 2015, in many ways, that's when Trump was on.
He was getting ready to run the primary.
Early 2016, that's when the primaries happened.
That was the time that he was saying, hey, these legacy media institutions, this media TV, cable TV, CNN, all of them, they're a bunch of liars.
Luther's Monopoly on Truth00:15:34
They've been established.
I get that.
They've been around.
Your grandparents, your parents, this is where they got all their news from.
Dumb, bunk.
And from 2015 to 2018, Daily Wire absolutely exploded.
And so Jeremy Boring, Ben Shapiro, there's one other guy that helped to found it.
They really took over and they didn't just take over with the long march to the institutions.
They didn't spend 20 years putting together a team and raising funds and slowly expanding.
In a matter of three years.
And I think a big part of that, and Christians need to know this to be able to think tactically.
What happened?
What changed?
Technology changed.
Technology changed and people began consuming from their phones, which now have the ability to listen to things, to download things in a way an iPod Nano couldn't.
They changed to using their phones to get information and people started getting information from podcasts and Daily Wire was right there.
And it was a lot harder.
I mean, now, you know, podcasts are like children.
They're too easy to make, and there's too many people that have them that shouldn't have them.
I'm just kidding.
But it's a lot easier to start a podcast today than it was in 2016, 2017, 2018.
But their opportunistic bent is what propelled them so quickly to being so influential.
Yeah, they were on the cutting edge of the technology at the time.
I've been thinking for a while, it's kind of interesting the providence of God that you're looking at half a millennia almost exactly from Luther.
And so you think of like God oftentimes, he seems to sync up technological innovation with theological reformation.
God in his providence.
Has this pattern, it seems as though a pattern of syncing up providentially technological innovation with theological reformation.
So you think of Luther, it's like it's not just that Luther was, you know, a titan intellectually and rhetorically, that he was gifted and intelligent and a persuasive speaker.
But Luther probably would not have the impact that he had.
We may not even, you know, he may have been lost to history.
We may not even have knowledge of Luther if it wasn't for the timing providentially of.
Him coming right on the heels.
Well, Jan Hus had tried something similar, not too much before that.
Tyndale and Hus.
There were many who tried, and probably maybe better character, more self controlled than Luther.
Right.
Yep.
So the Gutenberg printing press opened up a whole new realm of opportunity.
And it's also likened to our current moment in the sense that, you know, the Roman Catholic Church at that time was at the height of its corruption, right?
Because people always, you know, like a lot of times they're like, what, you know, you're Fan of the Crusades, how dare you?
You know, not a single Crusader, they're all in hell.
Right.
And it's like, what do you mean?
Like, because they were violent?
No, because they didn't hold to the solace.
Like, something, you know, hold the tulip.
Like, I mean, that is some people, it's sad, but like some Protestants, that really is their view of church history.
It's no different than Mormons, right?
It's like there's the first century church and they were faithful and then all fidelity, you know, Christian fidelity was lost.
But then it picked back up, you know, like 1800 years later with, you know, Joseph Smith, you know, or Or, you know, charismatics, you know, not all of them, but some of them can have that same kind of mindset that, you know, first century is faithful and then it was utterly lost.
You know, the spirit and fidelity and faithfulness was utterly lost until 1906, Azusa Street.
And reformers, you know, Protestants in a general sense, especially reformed Protestants, can, you know, give into that same inclination that says, like, first century was faithful and then there was not one faithful Christian, you know, for 1400 years until, you know, Luther.
And so, anyways, but the point is, you know, that, that, uh, You know, there were many who were, you know, they were Roman Catholic, you know, certainly lowercase c Catholic, all Christians in that capacity.
But then some, you know, when we're distinctly Roman Catholic and that we're a part of the Crusades, and some of them were not great and some of them were wonderful and we should seek to emulate our lives.
But by the time of Luther, I don't think there can be any argument, even like Roman Catholics today will say, like, yeah, that was unfortunate.
You know, we kind of overplayed our hand, you know, and that, you know, like selling indulgences.
To get your loved ones out of purgatory, you know, and exploiting the poor.
Like, even still to this day, people are like, well, Protestants, you know, they meet in an old Pizza Hut building, you know, and they don't care anything for, you know, architecture.
Meanwhile, us, you know, Roman Catholics, we have this beautiful, these beautiful cathedrals, and it's like, well, my friend, you know, you know the saying about old money?
Well, like, when you have 500 year old money that you made off of widows and orphans and peasants by exploiting them, telling them, can you hear the screams, Tetzel?
You know, like, every time a coin in the coffer clings, a soul from purgatory screams.
Springs?
Can you hear the screams of your loved ones in hell?
Give your, you know, you wanted to eat today.
Well, too bad.
Give your tiny little copper coins, you know, so that your dead grandma, you know, isn't being tortured in purgatory any longer.
Like, when that's your financial system and strategy, and you do that 500 years ago, and then you build on the interest, you know, and the, you know, like being able to invest that for half a millennia, then yeah, you can afford cathedrals, okay?
Like, okay, so you have nicer buildings, and we would like to, like, it doesn't mean it doesn't matter.
Architecture does matter.
Vaulted ceilings speak to the transcendence of God, all these things.
We're working on it.
Give us some time.
So, all that being said, the point is, You had a monopoly.
This is what I'm getting at.
You had a monopoly of power and a collection, centralized power with a monopoly on truth.
So the Latin Vulgate, they had changed certain.
It's not just that it was in Latin and that the common person was illiterate.
And even if they could maybe read a little bit, they certainly couldn't read Latin.
And not just that they couldn't read it, all the services were in Latin.
People would literally go, like the term hocus pocus, like a wizard casting some kind of spell.
Ooh, hocus pocus.
That phrase, hocus pocus, being associated with like some kind of mystical magic, comes from the liturgy, the Latin liturgy in Roman Catholic Mass at this time.
That when they did, you know, when they were performing the ceremony and ministering the Eucharist, that hocus pocus was kind of like a slight revision from some of the Latin that they would use in the liturgy when it came to transubstantiation and the bread actually turning into the body of Christ and the wine turning into the blood of Christ.
This is a time when you have, you know, intinction, like that.
They weren't even serving the full supper because those peasants and paupers, you know, they can't be, they'll spill the wine, you know, and it's the literal blood of Christ.
We can't be spilling Christ's blood on the floor, you know, and so we're just gonna give them a bread, you know, and they only get half the supper.
And this is from Catholics that, like, literally believe that this sacrament is, it's not imputed righteousness by faith that Protestants believe, but they literally believe that righteousness, grace was infused and that the sacrament of the Eucharist, that the whole Eucharist, not just the bread, but also the wine, was paramount to people's salvation.
And yet they were like, you only get half of it, and if you go to hell, Well, you won't go to hell, you'll go to purgatory, and then we'll make more money.
Good news, there's a way out of purgatory.
Right, so then we'll pick the pockets of your children and your grandchildren.
And so, terrible time, not a great time.
That said, that's not every Catholic who ever lived.
We are not of the persuasion that there was no faithful gospel witness for 1,400 years.
We are not that kind of Protestant, which I believe is a fairly insufferable type of Protestant.
We like King Alfred, we like Duke Gregory, we think that they were great men.
During that time, that God has always preserved a faithful remnant throughout all of Christian history.
And we believe that the Dark Ages were probably just the fact that secular modernists call them Dark Ages means they were probably a fairly decent time to be alive.
So, all that being said, here's the point you have centralized power, that power is corrupt, that power has gained a monopoly on truth.
Truth is not accessible to the common man.
They can't even read the Bible, it's the Vulgate, it's in Latin.
Not only was it only in Latin, they can't read and they can't even understand Latin when it's spoken.
But then, even the Latin translation of the Bible, they had changed certain verses where the Bible would say, and repentance, and the Latin Vulgate would say, do penance.
And so you have all this going on.
And it's basically all organized, it's all centralized, it's all underneath one system with a clear hierarchy.
And hierarchy is not inherently bad.
It's a good thing, it's God's design, it's His order, but it can be corrupted.
So imagine like the old adage finding a needle in a haystack.
Well, at this time, you don't have a haystack, you have a nice sheath of hay.
It's orderly.
It's all put together.
It's pristine, but there's no needle whatsoever.
There's no needle.
It can't be found.
And then, what the Reformation gives you is a giant pile of hay, and it's disorderly and it's chaotic, and it's Methodists, Episcopalians, Anglicans.
It's a big, mucky pile of hay.
And Luther knew this.
They literally, I believe it was the Council of Trent that they said, if you do this, talking about translating the Bible into the vulgar, not vulgate, but the vulgar tongue, meaning the common tongue where people could read it in German and this and that and the other, if you do this, you will open up a floodgate of iniquity.
And furthermore, what they were saying is that there's going to be 3,000 different denominations.
And Luther didn't argue.
He didn't say, nah, that's not going to happen.
Luther says, so be it.
And not because he thinks that it's good, but Luther was saying, better to have 3,000 or 30,000 different denominations.
Better to have a chaotic, messy pile of hay where there's at least a few needles of truth that could actually be found than to have a nice, organized sheath, but there's no needle at all.
And so you have centralized power, the power becomes corrupt.
They have a monopoly on truth, and then God, in his providence, doesn't just use theological reformation, Luther, but technological innovation, the Gutenberg printing press, to disrupt it.
The monopoly gets broken apart.
The centralized and now corrupt power and gatekeepers get disrupted and fractured.
And it's not just because some guy read his Bible and knew theology, it's also in the providence of God.
It's because some other guy.
Invented the printing press.
And so now, 500 years later, that would be 2017.
It's so funny because you were showing the chart.
It's literally 500 years to the date.
When you look at like the Daily Wire in 2015 to 2018, like right exactly 500 years, half a millennia later, like, well, what do you have?
Well, Al Gore invented the internet.
We all know that.
Thank God for Al Gore.
Yeah, that's a gospel truth.
There's no disputing that.
But you have not just the invention of the internet, but then on the heels of that, you have social media, and then you have all these things.
And part of the reason Daily Wire rose to power, because I remember those days.
Now, I wasn't ready to be doing, you know, to take advantage of it in the way that they did.
So that window closed and a lot of us missed it.
But the whole algorithmic system of Facebook in particular was radically different.
At that time, all the way up until about 2018, and you see that's when the decline, like Daily Wire was dominating specifically on that social media platform, Facebook.
And the reason why was.
Every single person who followed your page who became a fan, every single person who followed your page, if you had 50,000 followers, you post something and it will be seen by 50,000 people.
Later on, it's like you could have 500,000 followers and you could legitimately today, you could have 500 followers on Facebook and you could post something.
And if the algorithm doesn't like it, it might be seen by 70, not 1,000, 70 people.
And Facebook makes you pay.
For your own to get your own content to your own fans that you've gathered, you have to now.
How do you think we're getting to a two trillion dollar market cap here, chief?
That's right, that's right.
Um, it's like indulgences in the old days, you had indulgences for the Catholic Church.
Facebook said, Hang on a second, right?
Hang on a minute, there is something there.
So, the point is, like, so did we do you see the similarities, right?
So, so centralized power, institutional power that becomes corrupt and has a monopoly on truth, it can't be nobody else has access to it.
Uh, Roman Catholicism at the time in the 1500s.
Okay, then think 500 years later legacy media, the regime, the bourgeoisie, the political and cultural elites, right?
Same kind of thing, monopoly on truth.
Somebody has a story, it doesn't matter.
You got three news stations on cable television, and if they don't like it, if they get the call, shut it down, then that story's not, nobody's gonna see it.
But then the internet and social media breaks it up.
And in the wild, wild west days, when it's still a little bit more organic and it's new and people are making the switch and Facebook hasn't yet quite been as corrupted as it is now, then you actually, if you're doing well on Facebook, you're not.
You're not penalized.
Your stuff is actually doing well.
It's actually getting out there.
And then Facebook, you know, now they get the call, right?
They're the big dogs in town.
And now they're getting reined in.
And now they, you know, like, and all this is proven.
Like, Zuckerberg literally was contacted by the White House and, you know, during the Biden administration and leading up to it, where, like, you must censor the Hunter Biden laptop story.
And Zuckerberg, you know, was like, absolutely.
You know, and then he shoots a video of him, you know, wakeboarding behind a boat with an American flag, like, hey, you know, I know I'm a traitor to the country, but will you like me now?
You know, like, and so.
Anyway, so all that being said, the point is just that there's some stark similarities.
But what's happening now is that even within the social media realm, it's like everybody is trying to start a podcast.
One, there's just an incredible amount of competition that there wasn't just five years ago.
Two, not only is there more creators and therefore more competition, but all the algorithms have become far less favorable than they used to be, especially Facebook.
And then, four, the Overton window, or three, I think I said two things.
Three, the Overton window is literally shifting at the speed of light.
And so, when I think of like the Daily Wire, for instance, it makes perfect sense that 2015 to 2018 would be like their rocket ship to the moon because a couple things.
One, legacy media already was massively discrediting itself and not running, you know, there's just a ton of things that they wouldn't touch with a 10 foot pole.
And then you think of Republicans, this is your like, The heyday, you know, in many ways of still the neocons, you know, are in control and he's just your Jeb Bushes and your Mitt Romney's and all that kind of stuff.
And so, like Ben Shapiro at that time, I know this sounds crazy, you know, now, but believe it or not, Ben Shapiro was actually, people would consider him a conservative.
Like he's on the right, you know, like he's not everyone, but some he's at the, you know, to the right of Jeb Bush and, you know, to the right of Mitt Romney.
And they were early on, especially to transgenderism.
They made that their issue and they dug in.
And credit to Matt Walsh.
What put Ben on the map was that interview with that quote unquote lady that grabbed him by the back of the neck.
Ben Shapiro vs. The Trend00:12:49
Yep.
You know, and that really was that and the Piers Morgan interview, but that one in particular, just that went viral in a time when viral was brand new.
Right.
Viral was authentic, it was organic.
And if you struck gold, you actually got to keep the gold.
But then the last thing I was going to say is, ironically, people don't think of this, but ironically, 2020 was devastating.
For the Daily Wire.
And what I mean by that is, all of a sudden, it became the political and cultural landscape became kind of like the Wild Wild West again.
It became, you know, a brave new world.
And all of a sudden, the number one currency, and I think we're still in this moment, and I think we're going to be here for another five, 10 years.
And we'll get to that, like why it may not be the best time to have formal alliances and why, you know, like why it's probably smarter to do guerrilla warfare and travel light, you know, and be, you know, remain independent so that you can be flexible and all these kinds of things.
But when 2020 hit, This brave new world.
At that point, the 2015 to 2018, the Daily Wire, what they had in their sales was Ben Shapiro.
He really is sharp and he's a good communicator.
Those things are absolutely true, right?
You can't disparage him on those merits.
He really is sharp, and the dude can talk fast.
And then you also had the algorithm being favorable with Facebook and very few headwinds, mostly tailwinds.
And they took advantage of the tech and that landscape.
But then once you got into 2020, for the last five years, this is what you just have to realize Ben Shapiro, who is still known as a conservative, he has taken.
The non conservative position on every issue for the last five years, right?
The dude pushed the vaccine almost as hard as any liberal did.
I mean, like, he didn't take a stand on covet, he didn't take a stand on vaccines, he didn't really take a stand on mass not until months and months and months after the fact.
Election fraud, yeah, he wasn't going to war, yep, right?
Election fraud, like, like Ben Steven Crowder was.
I remember, yeah, Daily Wire, yeah, they're like, oh, we're not going to do this, I'm not going to say that the election was rigged, I don't think so, you know.
And then George Floyd, MAGA, like even with our most recent election, Daily Wire was 100% shilling for Ron DeSantis.
And don't get us wrong, we like Ron DeSantis.
We think he's an excellent governor.
Maybe he'll, no, I'm just going to say it.
And I don't mean this negatively.
If Ron DeSantis ever heard this, I think he's an excellent governor.
I'm incredibly grateful for him.
And I think he's, from everything that I've heard and everything that I see, I think he's a brother in Christ and a Christian man.
Super grateful for that.
I don't believe that man will ever be president.
I just don't think, because it's more than just your positions, right?
So, like, well, my facts don't care about your feelings.
Well, also, the populace, their feelings don't care about your facts if it's coming from a guy who stands in front of the camera.
As a personality of a brown paper bag.
Right.
So, it's just not going to happen.
But here's the thing Daily Wire threw in everybody had a choice.
Like, which horse am I going to bet on?
They bet on the wrong horse on COVID, they bet on the wrong horse with vaccines.
Bred on the wrong horse with the election being rigged in 2020.
And then this most recent election, bet on Ron DeSantis as the wrong horse.
And they came out favorably like, yeah, Trump's great, but Trump still was not their first pick.
They clearly publicly distinguished themselves from MAGA, which is a massive.
So, yeah, so they're kind of on the decline.
And the guys who threw their hat in Trump's ring, like Dan Bongino, what is he now?
Oh, deputy director of the FBI, Pete Hegseth.
Who wrote a book, same thing, like was influential, a talk show host.
Where is he?
Oh, head of the Department of Defense.
Yeah.
Yep.
If you have anything to add, Michael, I had one more thought.
Well, only just that one of the lessons here, like we're, the reason we're talking about this is we're trying to just help Christians and help conservatives think carefully about where we are in our nation's history and even the cultural moment and how to react.
But part of the reality is simply, The Daily Wire threw their hat in the ring.
I'm just thinking of MAGA and DeSantis with the wrong guy.
And there's just consequences for that.
That wasn't even necessarily like the vaccine thing.
That to me was not just a tactical error, that was an ideological mistake.
Like they were on the wrong side of that, not just because they read the tea leaves wrong, but because they had a wrong perspective on the right of government and the vaccine and all of that thing.
But with MAGA, sometimes you.
You throw your hat in the ring, and sometimes you just, whoop, that was not.
Sometimes you lose.
That was just not the right one.
And it doesn't even mean that you're a bad person or anything like that.
Like Ron DeSantis is a great guy.
I get why they made that choice.
Steve Dace did the same thing.
And Steve Dace lost some followers over it.
He bet on Ron DeSantis.
He said no to MAGA.
And Steve Dace would tell you, he said it publicly on his show several times like, yeah, they paid a cost.
They lost some followers.
But Steve Dace is similar to the Daily Wire in the sense that there are, I think, clearly some distinctions between them, but similar in the sense that when it became clear, like Trump won the primaries, Steve Dace was like, all right, we're voting for Trump.
And then he worked really hard.
And In terms of numerically, it hurt him because he lost on both sides of the equation.
So he lost a lot of MAGA guys when he supported DeSantis.
And then once it was clear that Trump was the only runner, Dace did the right thing.
He did the right thing.
He said, guys, okay, well, like Kamala has to lose, and Trump is not a terrible guy.
We do support Trump.
We just thought DeSantis was better.
So now we're getting behind Trump.
And then all your never Trumpers who liked DeSantis were like, how could you possibly say anything positive about Trump?
And so then he lost the MAGA guys when he went for DeSantis.
Then he lost the DeSantis guys when he, you know, Just did the practical, logical thing once DeSantis didn't have the path to victory and it was over.
And so, yeah, so there's all like all those kinds of things.
Back to COVID and vaccines, just real quick.
I think, you know, Ben Shapiro being one of the primary faces of the Daily Wire, you know, and co founding it with Jeremy Boring before, like Matt Walsh, you know, grew to stardom quickly.
But there were some significant things, you know, projects along the way, like what is a woman, you know, these kinds of things.
And so for a while, it was like Matt Walsh was an afterthought, you know, compared to Ben Shapiro.
Right.
Like I remember when Ben Shapiro had 3 million, you know, People on YouTube and Matt Walsh had like 400,000, you know, and it wasn't even close.
Whereas now, you know, like a lot of people would probably side with Matt Walsh over Ben Shapiro, myself included.
I think Matt Walsh and Michael Knowles, for that matter, I think both of them, it's probably going to be like Tucker Carlson and Fox.
Like, I think it's not if, it's just a matter of when.
It could be, you know, two months.
I wouldn't be shocked if it's two months, or it could be two years where all of a sudden they're going to set out and they're going to do the very thing we'll be talking about a little bit more later in terms of strategy and like they're going to fly independently.
They're going to do their own thing.
Same as Candace, same as Tucker.
I think that's inevitable.
But, real quick with the vaccines, with Ben Shapiro, it's like he took this position that was very favorable of the vaccines.
Like, you know, like he admitted, he gave himself a couple caveats and said, like, yeah, if you're a perfectly healthy, you know, 25 year old.
Are you talking about COVID specifically?
Mm hmm.
So I'm talking about vaccines in general, where he said, he said, the state cannot go into your house and force a needle into your kid's arm.
But if you expect your kid to be participating in public with other kids, then.
That's, you know, you must comply.
Same concept.
And on the COVID vaccine, tweeted out, get the vaccine, you dopes.
Yeah, literally tweeted that out.
And so he would say, like, yeah, if you're healthy.
But then he would immediately follow it up by saying, yeah, but, you know, my parents are elderly and they're a regular part of our lives.
And so that's why me and my wife, you know, we got the vaccine, all this stuff.
But my point is that, like, I think part of that for Shapiro, if I had to guess, this is speculation, but I think it's, you know, it's reasonable speculation, but his wife is a doctor.
You know, and so it's like, I think, you know, she mentioned that at all on his show.
How would you know that?
That's like groundbreaking.
Yeah, you were researching groundbreaking numbers.
You all just got in the US.
But you have, you know, you have a wife who is a doctor and a female doctor nonetheless.
And like, if you're a woman who's a doctor in the medical field, statistically speaking, I'm not saying every single one of them, but statistically, you're a lib.
Right?
I mean, a few exemptions, but is that a fair.
I think that's a fair assessment.
If you're a woman who is a doctor in the medical field, you're probably on that spectrum of conservative to liberal.
You're probably a little bit on the lowest.
Your peer group is going to be a lot of individuals that are lean, much more liberal from the American Medical Association, from the conferences they go to.
So, at the very least, we could say an individual that's not sympathetic that way is fighting against the trend.
And I would imagine that my point is I would imagine that if this is my wife, I'm probably leaning on her, deferring to her and her medical expertise in this area in 2020.
And that I don't think that that worked out for him.
Well, we say all that about technology to say something is happening.
I think of the same caliber.
Right now, so we talked about how hard it would be, for example, to start a show and to start a podcast in 2015.
I remember 2009, 2010, editing video in like Adobe After Effects.
Yeah, the things that are possible right now.
One of the reasons all these creators are exploding, and there's just tons more of them.
There's more videos, there's more content coming out, more all this out of the other is all the tools, and especially powered by AI, are changing the game again.
So, again, before 2017, 2018, 2019, if you wanted to have a studio and you wanted to look semi good, you wanted to have cuts, you wanted to make clips of it and pull them out.
That was hours and hours and hours of work, and a single individual couldn't do it.
But now there are single solo dudes.
It's just them.
They don't have a team.
They don't have even all that much expertise and all of that.
And they're able to pump out content.
And they're not able to just pump out content and hope someday they get monetized.
They're able to then start a Patreon account and then they teach logic classes.
And so if you're thinking about this, you're like, man, that sucks.
I missed the boat.
2015, 2016, Daily Wire jumped on it.
I mean, they're worth, we'll get into how much they may actually be worth, but they've made their millions in their time.
And it's like, see, there it is.
You know, us plebeians, we missed the boat again and again.
The game is rigged.
No, the same thing is happening right now.
There's tons of investment, there's tons of economic headwinds from Trump, and AI is taking a ton of tasks.
And AI is scary.
There are some ethical considerations that come along with it.
But there are tons of different things that would be too time consuming for you to do just five years ago.
Just five years ago, if you had something to say and you wanted to get it out, it would be too time consuming to do.
And that's all changed.
And there are tools now to make it look better, to make it easier.
There's tools out there now to auto clip and auto pull shorts that you can be pumping out on platforms like TikTok and Instagram.
And you can bemoan that it's like this, that it feels like, ah, that takes time.
And that feels like clickbaity.
Like, do we want to win or not?
Like, Daily Wire didn't sit there and go, ah, podcast, who's going to pull up their phone and use that?
Or, are we really going to do a show every single day of the week and put it on Facebook?
They didn't sit there and think about that and go, well, we'll stay reserved.
They bet the house, they went all in, and it got them their millions, at least in time, and a lot, a lot, a lot of influence, especially on an issue, again, transgenderism, that they had a very positive impact on, on Matt Walsh and others that fell down to legislation, movies, successful documentaries.
In Virginia.
All of that.
It actually swayed real politics on the ground with, what's his name, Youngkin.
Yeah, Youngkin.
And in Tennessee with the Vanderbilt, the transgender surgery, what was going on at the university there.
I mean, like, to some degree, I think that a lot of us, and I, you know, I have not been, well, I think that we could at least agree on the idea that we wish the Daily Wire weren't having the troubles that it's having for the reasons it's happened, that it's happened, that they're having these troubles.
Because if they weren't having these troubles, it would mean that they're kind of still being honest and abreast of the cultural issues.
Woke Jesus and Christian Nationalists00:09:43
Like they did some good work.
They really did.
And I wish that they were.
Doing the authentic, cutting edge, good work that they did back in 2015, 16.
That's true.
I just, I would maybe add to that my take on it.
I think, you know, at least this is part of it.
It may, maybe all of it, but at least a part of it.
I think they're doing a lot of the same good work that they did from the start.
But, um, but America as a whole has moved past that.
That's what I'm saying.
You know, like, yeah.
So it's not even so much just like, hey, when did you guys become sellouts or when did you quit?
Um, no, it's, I think Americans have just been waking up faster than, uh, than the Daily Wire or anybody else in that sphere ever predicted.
Like, like at the time, it's like, again, you got, you know, if it's, if it's, The Bushes, you know, and your Romneys and that, and like this, you know, Mitch McConnell, and these are your conservatives.
Then, in that landscape, on that backdrop, and Ben Shapiro's looking, you know, he's looking fairly courageous, he's looking fairly conservative, and he's, again, he's thoughtful or at least well informed, and he's a good communicator.
But then, like, if, if, you know, your average guy, your average guy gets pushed all the way to where, like, no, it's not just being conservative, but no, I want, I want my children's children to be able to have gainful employment in America and own a home and this and that.
America first.
Well, Ben Shapiro can't give you America first.
Ben Shapiro is the Israel first.
We can give you Dave Rubin and Jordan Peterson.
Right.
Right.
Well, it's like somebody in the comments.
There's been a couple good comments.
One, Defiant Baptist, he had a great comment.
He said, If you don't hit the like button on this video, you're a female doctor.
And I think that that's profound.
And I think that's true.
It's like, well, I'm not a female doctor.
You will literally become.
Like a hocus pocus transubstantiation, a female doctor, right now, if you don't hit that like button.
So take care of that.
You want to, you know, self preservation, look out for yourself a little bit there.
But then somebody else had a comment and said, you know, I hope that one day Ben Shapiro confesses Christ, and I hope the same for Jordan Peterson.
And so do we.
We hope and pray that both of them would repent of their sin and believe upon the Lord Jesus Christ, the exclusivity of Christ, and that they would be saved.
But I couldn't help but think as I read that comment, you know, particularly not even so much Shapiro, but as it pertains to Jordan Peterson, like I hope that Jordan Peterson would.
Profess Christ, he's so close, you know.
And, you know, but if Jordan Peterson was here, you know, it'd be like the meme, you know, with the pawn shop owner.
And it's like, best I can do is partner with the ADL and work to penalize Christians.
Like, that's the conservative, right?
With conservatives like this, you know, who needs liberals?
And Dave Rubin, again, like openly gay and him and his husband bragging about a doctrine of twin boys.
Like, here's your conservatives, conservatives, drink up.
Unless we forget, you know, I don't want to be too harsh, but this is true and it matters and people need to be aware.
Like Ben Zysloff is a friend.
He works for the Sentinel.
The Sentinel is doing good work.
We've got friends over there.
But the reason he works for the Sentinel is because he used to work for the Daily Wire and he lost his job.
And why did he lose his job?
Back to our thumbnail and part of our focus on today's episode.
He lost it specifically because of Jeremy Boring.
Ben Shapiro ran an article.
He's a great.
Ben Zysloff.
I'm sorry.
Ben Zysloff.
He's a zoomer.
He's young, but incredibly gifted, sharp, competent, and a great writer.
And he can just, you know, some guys are machines, you know, in terms of their just their capacity.
He can just pump out articles.
And so he wrote, you know, was right there at the speed of light with a story that dropped with The Chosen, the TV show.
You know, and The Chosen, you know, there were pictures where, you know, right there on the set, just kind of just barely out of the camera shot, there were gay pride flags.
It's like, here's this Christian show about Jesus.
And there already had been plenty of debate by this point with a lot of Christians saying, this isn't.
I mean, what they're doing with the scripture and the license that they're taking.
And like, this is now, I mean, for us, we're like, yeah, we're not chosen respecters.
The whole thing is a second, you know, commandment violation.
Like we, you know, none of us even considered it to begin with.
But some Christians who liked it at first, maybe season one or something, were starting to wise up and say, I don't know how Christian this really is.
Like, this is like a woke Jesus.
He's like, you know, an inclusivity, you know, diversity Jesus.
This is a woke leftist Jesus.
So people, there was already this debate going back and forth about whether the chosen was good or whether it was bad, if it's conservative or if it's woke, if it's biblically faithful or if it's taking too much license and actually perverting, you know, the message of scripture.
And then this story drops where there were pictures on social media that were publicly sourced where people who work for The Chosen, like maybe it was a cameraman or whatever, but people on the set had taken pictures.
And you see these rainbow flags, and they're clearly pride flags.
And so Ben ran with a story saying, yeah, The Chosen, that's supposed to be a Christian TV show, supports gay pride, or at least their staff does, or they allow some of their staff.
To have their pride flags on the set.
And a lot of people got upset because there's a lot of fake normie professing Christians and conservatives that are like, we love the Chosen.
How dare you?
And that's your same audience.
Let's just be honest.
If that's a Venn diagram, then that bad boy is a circle of guys who like the Daily Wire and guys who like the Chosen.
And Jeremy's a businessman.
He knows that.
So he started getting a lot of flack why did the Daily Wire run a story against the Chosen?
The chosen is the embodiment of Christ.
The Venn diagram is a circle.
And the Daily Wire is what true conservatism is all about.
And you got to do something about this.
And so Jeremy Boring, without even giving it a second thought, he wasted no time and publicly threw Ben's eyeslot, fired him, and said, I'm ashamed that we, I can't believe they ran it.
This is a disgusting piece.
This is a disgusting piece.
And I'm ashamed that we ran it.
And like, well, here's the thing like, that's fine if you're CNN or whatever.
And Jerry Bourne claims to be a Christian.
Even if you're Fox, he's not a Christian.
He's a Christian.
He's a conservative.
He claims to be a Christian and an evangelical Christian.
That's his claim.
And he's been saying that for years.
And so you're an evangelical Christian and you just fired a young 20 something year old Christian man for doing his job.
He didn't make it up.
It wasn't fake news.
It was a real story.
There's a Christian TV show with a huge Christian following that really is suspect and what it's promulgating.
And then here's some of the evidence because we have now.
Camera photos behind the scenes with gay pride flags, you know, flying in the wind.
And a Christian employee runs that true story that Christians should be aware of.
If you're going to watch The Chosen, you should be aware that at least some portion of their staff is gay.
Like you should probably know that.
And generally, so, openly so.
Like, like campaigning, there's the flag on the set as we're shooting the show.
I'm shooting Jesus over here, and I've got my gay pride flag over there.
This is not hyperbole.
This is what's up.
Ben runs that show, Ben Zeisloff runs that story.
And Jeremy Boring, the evangelical Christian, fires him and publicly humiliates him.
And so, anyway, so my point is that, like, in today's landscape, things are moving at the speed of light.
And a lot of people, I think, are just wising up and they're like, is the Daily Wire that conservative?
Right.
A lot of people still appreciate Matt Walsh.
And honestly, in my opinion, I'll say this, and people will give me some grief, but in my opinion, the most based guy with the Daily Wire, we'll say the closest to being, you know, as close as you can be to being based while being with the Daily Wire, is actually not Matt Walsh.
I appreciate him.
I recognize that, you know, that he's my doppelganger or I'm his or whatever.
So people probably think just by the way that we both look that I'm, you know, eternally bound to, you know, to defend him at all costs.
I appreciate Matt Walsh.
I'm a Matt Walsh respecter.
Does he dye his beard?
I don't know.
I don't.
That's the difference I think I see with the two of you.
Yeah.
People, people, people say I dye my beard, which it's like you can literally see the, yeah, whatever.
My girls all the time, they're like, Dad, you're getting old.
So whatever.
But, anyways, the point is, I think Michael Knowles is actually to the right of Matt Walsh.
People don't give him credit for that because he's, he's probably, he hasn't had some of the big projects like what is a woman, some of those things.
And also just his personality.
Like Matt has that kind of like that almost English dry humor, you know, that's like very sarcastic and, And Michael Knowles, he's clean shaven.
And so there's a lot of aesthetic reasons why people maybe don't categorize him, you know, being more conservative than Matt Walsh.
But Michael Knowles has, it's really ironic.
So Neil Shenvey would be, this is funny, but Neil Shenvey, you know, was freaking out about the woke right, you know, the woke right, the woke right.
And one of the examples when they're like, well, what's the woke right?
And what are you talking about?
And he's like, well, they're using critical race theory.
It's exactly the same as the woke left, except on the right, you know, and it's this Christian, you know, ethnocentric, you know, nationalism.
And they're praising Franco.
Private Family Banking Secrets00:03:21
Right.
And saying, we need a Protestant Franco.
Like, here's the irony Michael Knowles was publicly talking about all the redeeming characteristics and virtues of Franco like three, four years ago.
Yep.
Before any of the Christian nationalists that we're associated with started talking about it.
Michael Knowles, we have to admit, he beat us to the punch on that one.
Michael Knowles has been talking about Christendom.
He's been talking about hierarchy.
He's been talking about, you know, Columbus is great.
Franco is great.
All these things consistently for a long time.
So, you know, a lot of the focus gets put on Matt Walsh, but I wouldn't be surprised if Knowles maybe drops out even, you know, before Walsh.
So, yep.
Let's hit our first commercial break and we'll get back.
We'll talk more about Jeremy, the supposed God King.
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Jeremy Boring's Departure Details00:06:56
Well, I did want to get into some of the actual details about Jeremy Boring leaving as co CEO because it's what the topic is about.
And I think it's instructive, especially for men that look to start businesses or to start media.
Jeremy Boring, I think, is in many ways an example of what not to do.
So Candace Owens had a good episode on this yesterday, but she gave a lot of details.
She obviously knows him personally.
She worked at the Daily Wire from 2020 to 2024.
But Jeremy Boring is unique in that he's always typically been a publicly facing CEO, a publicly facing CEO.
Executive.
A lot of executives prefer to not be as publicly facing, not comment as much because they carry the weight of the brand with them.
But Jeremy has always had, in many ways, and you could say this would be his downfall, he's had a big ego.
He wanted to make it in acting, he wanted to make it in Hollywood, he's always wanted to make movies.
And Daily Wire was, as we kind of tied it to with the technology, the changing trends, it was his kind of, you know, I don't know if you call it like rod in the fire, iron in the fire that he struck lightning with and he was successful.
And they did a couple different things.
So I remember Gina Carano, for example, was fired from Daily Wire Plus from Disney Plus.
From Disney Plus.
Yep.
From Disney Plus.
Yep.
Which she probably said something as, like, you're not a monster if you vote for Trump or something like that.
Like something very mild.
It was a tweet where it was about transgenderism again.
And that's kind of, that's been their MO.
And they've done well on that issue.
And so she said something about, like, my pronouns are beep, boop, beep, boop.
Like, it was that mild?
It was just making fun of, like, a transgender droid because she was in Star Wars.
The men were in.
So they picked up her for a movie, which, to be honest, nobody really remembered.
They made a couple other movies Shut In, Run, Fight, Hide.
They also just bought the rights to one movie and released it.
One of them they didn't make.
They just.
Well, and all those.
What do they have in common, right?
So Run, Hide, Fight, or the one with Gina Carrata.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's always.
We're conservative.
We're the Daily Wire.
We're conservative.
We've had enough with transgenderism.
And so we're going to make a movie with fighters and the lead protagonist is going to be a chick.
Yep.
It's like, are you that conservative?
That's where those movies were.
They ran a number of anti cancellation campaigns too.
So, Harry's Razors canceled Michael Knowles for being based.
They were a sponsor and they canceled him.
And so, Jeremy came out and said, Well, this is our great opportunity to launch our own brand of razors.
And he put out a very risque video.
I remember a lot of Christians at the time commented, Why is a professing Christian putting out a video where he's surrounded by lingerie models?
So, same thing with Hershey's.
So, Hershey's, they did something with a transgender man on National Women's Day.
And they're like, No, no, no.
Instead of woke chocolate, You get non-woke chocolate.
And so they launched their own chocolate company.
So, they've always been trying these different things to latch on and do it.
But what it really appears there in Nashville, where the headquarters is, is that Jeremy is very controlling.
This is a number of people inside who have said this, and that the Daily Wire, a lot of people are unhappy with it.
So, Candace Owens, for example, was fired.
It was a year ago, practically, to yesterday.
Right around the time that the first Christ is King controversy was spiraling.
Yep.
The first Christ is King controversy.
And she was one of their biggest stars.
Yeah, she was.
But ego, the platform, the business, the institution, they couldn't have that.
Same thing, we don't know all the details of it, but Brett Cooper was one of their biggest stars.
And she left, and in a weird kind of way, Jeremy almost blamed the Daily Wire viewership.
They plugged in someone else who had helped co host Brett's show, said, No, we'll just plug this in.
It'll be just like the same, which you ultimately don't get to do.
That doesn't happen.
Like they literally thought, the show will go on.
Right.
Like the show will go on.
It'll get all just loose.
They replace her with some other chick.
But then what we're finding, and this gets into a good point of like our larger conversation, but what we're finding is that audiences are actually a little bit more loyal.
Than someone like Jeremy Boren suspected.
They didn't just stick around like, oh, it's the same time slot, it's the same show.
No, the audience is real people who really did appreciate Brett Cooper.
And when they got rid of Brett Cooper, whatever was going on there, and it doesn't seem like it was entirely amicable, when Brett Cooper was pushed out, which is what it looked like, then guess what?
The audience did not side with the institution, with the machine, with the company.
They sided with the person.
They followed Brett Cooper.
Yep.
Same with Candace.
I was about to say, through Candace, through Ben's Islaw, through Brett Cooper.
The theme that emerges again and again from people inside the Daily Wire is that he really, as a CEO, co CEO, he co CEOs with someone else, was taking the company in a bad direction.
There's been a number of movies, so they're supposed to do a Snow White movie with Brett Cooper.
Right.
Doesn't look like that'll be happening.
Something north of $50 million is being spent to fund Jeremy's dream of a Pendragon Cycle series.
Is that the title of it, Michael?
Yeah.
Pendragon Cycle.
It was supposed to release last year because they have a streaming service, the Daily Wire Plus.
It's now millions of dollars over budget.
It's over a year late.
And his supposed departure from CEO was to focus his creativity there.
Now, everything about it, and we don't have to get into the details of it, but whether it's things that Ben said, the new incoming full time CEO said, nothing about this appears to be voluntary.
That Jeremy himself came forward and said, you know, things are going great.
And I love the direction things are going.
And I want to step off and do some of the things that I've really wanted to do for a while.
Much about this seems as if we're to understand the reports that are correct, even that Pendragon series is being moved off site because Jeremy Boring is not being let back into the company.
And so, as soon as it happens, well, I even heard you know, this is I hear this word allegedly.
Okay, so but I've heard from some sources behind the scenes that like it's like, oh, well, it's amicable.
He's just taking a new position at the Daily Wire, he's just no longer going to be the CEO.
But then I've heard from other sources offline that, um, at least for a hot minute there, he wasn't permitted inside the building.
So we're at the 10 year mark, 2015 to 2025.
And by the time Matt Walsh and Michael Knowles leave, which, like we said earlier, it seems to be a matter of if, not when, that will be the end of Daily Wire as we know it.
There are not people streaming in by the millions.
Do you have any Daily Plus memberships left?
But the whole Avengers team is going to break up.
And honestly, this kind of gets into part of our conversation, but like it's.
Like a lot of people, you know, like I remember coming out of 2020, now it's 2021, 2022, and it's like, you should join the CREC, you know, or you should join this organization or this group, or you know, like let's make a collective here, let's do this there.
And a lot of those I gave some serious consideration to, a lot of them I did not consider at all.
Potential America Is Not Done00:07:57
But part of it was like, I just had this sense that I couldn't shake.
Like this, pit my stomach, like that.
I knew, like, it's not just 2020 was the um, the once and and final, you know, the once and for all test, you know, that that's going to separate the wheat from the chaff, you know, and this is the test.
And you know, half of us passed it and half of us failed, you know, and and but now we know who our real allies are.
That's not what's going on.
If you think that's what's going on, I don't know where you've been.
It's been five years.
Um, no, it's like every six months, the Lord gives us another test in his providence, another test, another test, and.
People continue like partnerships continue to break apart.
Uh, people continue to go separate ways and fall on separate sides of this issue or that issue.
So it's like 2020 and COVID and uh woke wars won.
And like you've got you're looking around, you've got a lot of allies, you know.
You got James Lindsay, for goodness sake.
I mean, you got Michael O'Fallon together, yeah.
The whole the old the old gang, you know, we're all together.
Um, and then you know, Michael O'Fallon, James Lindsay, you know, um, even even Neil Shinvey, I mean, his pastor's woke, you know, and I can't really square that peg with JD Greer, you know.
Neil Shenvee, he's definitely not woke.
He's been doing the reading.
Even though he faithfully supports his woke pastor, who literally almost single handedly smuggled wokeness into the SBC.
But Neil Shenvee's not woke.
He's based, and you've got James Lindsay, he's based, and that's 2020.
That's 2015, 16, 17 for some of the early guys.
And then 18, 19, 20, that's Woke Wars 1.
We're not there anymore.
Then it became, it was more than just.
A meritocracy, you know, like may the best man win.
A lot of the backlash that you saw against H 1B, for instance, over the Christmas holidays and all that, you know, piling on with Vivek, who is not America first, you know, that was not Woke Wars One, that would have been enough.
Vivek was thinking in the Woke Wars One mindset.
He's like, look, just may the best man win.
And you know what?
It's not my fault, you know, but Americans are lazy.
They're not really that smart.
And all that, we all know that the future Einsteins, you know, they're all in India.
You know, we need the genius of the Indian people if America is going to be successful.
And, you know, who, you know, just beat them.
If you want to beat them, if you want a job, then you just, all I'm saying, my fellow Americans, hello, my fellow Americans.
Let me finish worshiping, you know, three million Hindu gods, but hello, my fellow Americans.
I'm just like you.
My name's Vivek.
And I'm not replacing you.
All I'm saying is that if you want a job, it's just going to be a fair meritocracy.
And you just need to compete with, you know, like 7.5 billion other people in every other country of the world.
And guess what?
That dog won't hunt.
Not in 2025, today.
No, we're done with that.
Well, for guys, you know, with Woke Wars One, the guys who is like, that's as far as they wanted to go, just a raw meritocracy.
Like for your James Lindsay's and those kinds of guys, your Neil Shenvee's, they're like, well, I don't understand.
What's the problem with that?
Like, you mean America First means that you're going to prefer heritage Americans?
Americans?
I thought America First just meant like the sports team, like that America's a sports team.
And anybody from anywhere in the world, right?
Well, we all know that what it means to be an American is just to be someone with American citizenship.
And so, therefore, what is India other than 1.3 billion potential Americans?
They just need to get here?
They're just like, there actually are no other nations.
There's just America and potential America.
And that's the whole world.
And the idea that we would say, no, no, no, no.
We don't have animus, racial animus or national animus towards anybody else.
I don't hate anybody else, but I love my people more.
I have a preference, and it's not inherently evil.
I believe it's actually mandated.
It would be wrong not to.
I have a preference for my people, my countrymen.
And certainly my children and my grandchildren.
And I don't want my grandchildren to have to compete for their inheritance with the rest of the world that their ancestors, their fathers didn't own it.
The founders were very clear.
What are we doing all this for?
For us and our posterity.
They weren't doing it for 1.3 billion potential Americans, aka India.
And so that's where we are now is that the discourse is continuing to progress, it's continuing to develop.
Now, a lot of these guys with Woke Wars I, who actually were on our side, Well, it turns out at the end of the day, they're just 1980s Democrats.
Like they're no further to the right than Bill Clinton.
Like they're not actually conservative.
They're not paleoconservatives.
They hate Buchanan.
And so now, as the discourse is moving forward and we're starting to have these conversations about Heritage America and what does it actually mean?
We had what is a woman?
We need a documentary of what is an American?
What is an American?
Is it just anybody from anywhere who attains American citizenship?
Or does it actually mean something?
Does it speak to heritage?
Does it speak to home?
Does it speak to legacy and lineage and all these different things?
And so a lot of guys, they weren't on board for that.
They were your conservatives who are like, we just want, we don't like BLM.
And part of it was like, let's just be honest, part of it is money.
Part of it is like, we don't like BLM because it's kind of disrupting, you know, the GDP must go up.
Right.
Part of the reason why they actually, they're not global, they'll speak against globalism in the sense that, like, they're not supportive of the, you know, the WEC, the World Economic Forum, or they don't want to, you know, they aren't particularly fond of China, you know, so everybody who, you know, who's to the right of them, they think is a, you know, a Chinese, you know, spy or whatever.
But part of their incentive, it's pretty clear, is they actually, they're not that concerned.
They still want cheap labor.
They want to be able to outsource outside of the United States, make widgets for, you know, a fraction, you know, of pennies on the dollar.
And have the GDP go up.
Whereas we're like, no, if the stock market is going down, which it currently is, and we have to suffer a little bit because we've been eating off the silver spoon of globalism for decades and decades and decades, if things have to get momentarily worse in the short run so they can be better in the long run for our children, we'll actually pay that cost.
That mindset is completely foreign to an entire generation known as boomers.
Wait, you're saying that we would temporarily suffer.
My generation would, Joel, you're telling me you would be content for you and your wife's generation to suffer.
So, that your children's generation could have it better than you?
That's been the story since the beginning.
It's like, well, that's every generation of Americans until the boomers.
And so, anyway, so the point is, it's like, well, join the CRAC or join this or join that.
You're on the same side of COVID.
We'll see.
Like four years later, though, I'm being called revoiced for Nazis.
That one didn't take long.
And so, here's the deal.
What I've realized is this this is just a general piece of counsel, do with it what you will.
But you don't have to anathematize people.
You don't have to hate people to your left.
You don't have to hate people to your right.
But I would strongly urge be slow when it comes to forming, especially formal alliances.
Be slow because this was not a one size fits all, once and for all test that the Lord gave us in 2020.
No, we've been off the rails for decades, and you don't get back on the rails.
If you've taken a detour for 70 years, you don't fix that in seven months.
Which means there are a ton of issues.
Slow Down on Formal Alliances00:02:49
And I believe there are still plenty ahead of us that we haven't even begun to talk about.
That'll be the controversy of 2026 and the controversy of 2027.
If you think we're done, then you're being naive.
The cement hasn't dried.
And until the cement dries, and my prediction, and I could be wrong, but my prediction is it's going to be at least a decade, which means we're at the halfway point.
We're in year five.
I think we're looking at a decade.
I think we easily have five, six more years because we got way off the rails.
And I think it's going to take at least a decade to get to the issues and have the conversations and do the thinking.
And for the academics, you know, like Stephen Wolf, to write the dissertations and the papers and Amref to publish the articles and all, like, and for these things to happen, and everybody, you know, everybody's a piece on the chessboard.
Everybody has a role.
You've got Stephen Wolf, you know, who's going to write a 400 page book.
And then you've got Ady Robles and Joel Webbin, who are just going to go hard in the paint on, you know, on a podcast.
And the difference between Ady Robles and Joel Webbin, Is aside from him being the reasonable Puerto Rican, who for the record, I'm going to say it publicly, I know I'll get dragged, but as king of Christian nationalism, I declare that Adi Robles gets to stay.
Sovereign is he who decides the exception.
I'm sorry, but I'm making that edict right now.
Adi Robles gets to stay.
But the difference, besides him being the reasonable Puerto Rican and me not being, it's funny, at the 20 minute mark of Joel Webbins' podcast and Adi Robles' podcast, it's like the meme where they're grasping hands, 20 minute mark.
And AD is saying, I hope you found this video helpful.
Joe Webbin is saying, All right, let's get started.
All right, let's dive on.
That's a big difference.
But, anyways, but my point is everybody's got a different part that they're playing, right?
Some people are a bishop, and yes, the bishop, that is what it's called on the chessboard.
Even that's become a controversy.
Some are a rook, some are a knight, some are a pawn, some are a queen, some are a king.
And so there's different pieces on the chessboard, and not everybody's going to be doing the same thing.
But I think in God's providence, of course, he's standing above it all sovereignly.
And I don't think, in order to work together, I don't think that you have to institutionalize.
Not yet.
We need, don't get me wrong, we need institutions.
Society can't function without institutions.
Each individual person can't always go to Grok or WebMD and every single time their kid is sick and try to all of a sudden learn overnight what it takes to be a medical doctor because they can't trust any medical professional.
We need experts.
The problem is that all of our experts are corrupt.
They've all discredited themselves.
And so trust is at an all time low.
But we do need medical institutions, media institutions.
We need the church institute, right?
Institutions Are Still Necessary00:02:39
And so I'm grateful for like William Wolfe right now, you know, today pictures of him in the White House, in the Oval Office, praying with some other faith advisors, some of them, you know, not great.
But I'm glad William's there, you know, praying for them.
Can't believe the ERLC didn't get the call.
But that's right.
So William is like, look, it can't just be William.
I need some kind of institution.
So he worked really hard to build, you know, Baptist conservative leaders.
And, you know, to replace.
Center for Baptist Leadership.
Center for Baptist Leadership.
Thank you.
CBL.
Center for Baptist Leadership.
To replace Brent Leatherwood and the ERLC that's teamed up with Russell Moore.
They're not conservative at all, they are enemies.
Absolute opponents of anything that has to do with.
Literally, like, put their reputation on the line to kill a bill that would stop the murder of children in Louisiana.
To kill an abolitionist.
That's what they did.
They also were, Brent Leatherwood was integral in keeping the manifesto from the transgender shooter under wraps.
Which is a national story.
Right.
And he was like, that can't get out because then people might make the connection that maybe hopping up a teenager on hormones might lead to a steroid.
That their body is not tuned to.
Right.
So estrogen versus testosterone.
Right.
It's literally like the.
Could have negative effects.
What was his name?
I always forget.
The comedian, he died recently.
Norm MacDonald.
Norm MacDonald.
It's literally doing the Norm MacDonald bit where he's like, he's like, you know, the thing that scares me the most is that there might be, you know, an Islamic terrorist attack that kills one or even two million Americans.
And could you imagine the anti Islamic sentiment that people might have afterwards?
And he's doing it for Muslims.
I think he did it on like The View or something like that.
And he does it the way he does comedy with a serious face.
And they're like, oh, yeah, that would be terrible.
Could you imagine how many people would think negatively of Muslims?
And his point, you know, he's being sarcastic, but his point is people are more concerned about that than what he just said one to two million Americans killed.
Killed.
And so, but that's Brent Leatherwood.
That is like, he is literally the Norm MacDonald joke.
He's like, we can't get this manifesto out there.
Could you imagine that, you know, Christians might have a negative view of transgenderism?
And what he's not thinking is can you imagine that children were just mowed down with an assault weapon by a deranged.
Person who was out of their mind and hopped up on chemicals.
So, anyways, let's show that graph.
Actually, this is cool because, Nate, this is actually graph three, graph two.
Daily Wire and their work, this is how you can kind of see that things are changing.
So, you had the big upswing, and then Daily Wire 2018, 2019, 2020 really pushed against it.
Lessons from the Left's Overreach00:10:17
So, each one of these metrics, I know some of them look like they're increasing, and it's like, oh, is that support?
If you read carefully, so the support for requiring individuals to compete on the sports team that matches who they are, male or female.
Increased across Republicans and Democrats.
This is 2022 to 2025.
Making it illegal to provide minors with care for gender transition.
Support for that increased across all categories.
2022 to 2025.
Requiring to use public bathrooms that match how they were born.
Making it illegal for public school districts to teach about gender identity.
Support for that increased.
Support for that increased.
Support for protecting them from discrimination, jobs, housing, public spaces, restaurants, stores decreased.
10% decrease.
For Democrats, 10% less said, I don't know that we need to protect them.
Decreased 2022 to 2025.
Requiring health insurance companies to cover medical care for gender transitions decreased on all counts.
Every single one of these counts, the decrease is, as we would view it, positive.
And that was the fight, but it was only a fight maybe for eight years.
That was one of the tests.
But as you're saying, there's more tests.
Will it be America first or will it be America the sports team?
So just to put some flesh on the bones of this was a real fight, and we've actually, by God's grace, We've won it.
I don't think tomorrow, tomorrow people are not going to wake up.
99% of them be like, you know what?
We are not doing enough.
Like this battle has legitimately be won, and it was movies.
Like, what is a woman?
And it was Matt Walsh's hard stance against it that contributed in part along with other things that legislators and other people that were influential did.
But we won that fight.
But guys, there's so many more fights to be had.
I heard today, it was a really great comment.
Someone said, you know, we may have won the battle on the question of what is a woman.
But the question that's now being asked that the more neocons can't handle is we're asking what's the role of a woman?
Why is a woman?
Nathan, can you go to our chat?
Somebody posted it and maybe you can look.
Not the chat, the live chat, but somebody posted it in our signal chat.
One of many.
You know which one I'm talking about.
But it's a picture.
It's like on one side is Matt Walsh saying, What is a woman?
And then on the other side is me.
And it looks very similar saying, Why is a woman?
Exactly.
And just for the record, it's comical, but I'm not saying, Why is a woman?
Like, why do you know, like, Why do we have to have women?
But I'm saying that what is the telos?
Yeah, exactly.
Like, what is the purpose?
In the same way, the question needs to be asked, like, what is the purpose of a man?
Right.
But that is kind of where the discourse is.
We've moved from, you know, what is a woman to, okay, why is a woman?
Am I a racist?
What is a racist?
What is a racist?
Yeah.
Like, what is an American?
What is an American?
Yeah, we've moved from what was the founding of America to what is an American?
You know, like, so, and that, you have to see this, guys.
This is good.
Right.
Like, I understand that, like, it's uncomfortable at times.
And there are some guys who, you know, will be, you know, a mile to your right.
And you're like, oh my gosh, I can't believe he said that.
And I definitely disagree with that.
And I think that's, but the overall discourse, and we're not condoning any individual guy.
We're not saying that, yeah, this guy, everything he says, it's wonderful.
We're so glad.
But what we are saying is that the ball is moving and it is moving in the right direction.
It's like, why?
So, like, just so long as the Overton window is moving to the right, you're just going to say that that's inherently.
Virtuous and a good thing that Christians should be rejoicing in?
Yes.
Yes.
Not forever.
I'm not saying that it can never move too far right, but we're not even close.
Guys, we have to repeal the entire 19th century.
20th century.
Like 20th for sure, you know, but a good, maybe half of the 19th.
Yeah.
There we go.
You're right.
I'm thinking 1900s.
You're right.
20th century, but probably part of the 19th century as well.
But we're talking about a century.
Arguably a century and a half that where all this ideology that set the stage for anti racism and set the stage for globalism and set the stage for feminism and set the stage for society.
In 1904, there were three million men that gathered in Madison Square Garden, I think it was.
It was called the Men's Forward Movement.
And you read their concerns, exact same as today women leaving the home, churches being feminized, men not stepping up, men not teaching their sons.
In 1904, three million of them got together to rally and say, we need to get men back in the churches, we need to get men working.
We need women caring and being keepers at home, like the Bible says.
Like, this is not something that happened five years ago.
Why did we go off the rails in 2015?
Right.
My brother in Christ.
Yeah, exactly.
So, the whole everything's racist and GDP must go up and every nation is interchangeable, globalism, you know, and not having borders.
But then the feminism issue, but then like this kind of gets into half of the 19th century Zionism, you know, like there's a lot of things.
And that's, if you think in one year, in the year of our Lord, 2020.
That we took, you know, arguably 150 years of misdirection, getting off course, and fixed it in one year, then you're just being silly.
That's just silly.
So, could you go too far?
Sure.
We are nowhere in danger of that.
I'm not saying no individual person and his, you know, what he's saying on X or what he says on his podcast, I'm not saying no one has gone too far.
No one has said something that, you know, that's to the right that I would actually, To my right, that I would disagree with.
But what I am saying is that when you look at the overall Overton window, it's moving and we're encouraged by that.
But if you think, man, I think we might be, you know, but let's temper ourselves.
We're altering the last part.
Let's temper ourselves.
Let's be a little careful.
We might be overdoing it.
No, we are not even close to overdoing it.
Well, that's why, and this is what happens with institutions they pot their stake.
But like Daily Wire, I just confirmed, it has right now up Jordan Peterson and Dave Rubin talking about the pitfalls of gay parenting.
So, if we're going back, not just, well, we took it too far, we started transitioning children.
Maybe we can't even transition adults.
Okay, what ideology laid the foundation for transgenderism to rest on top of?
And it was the approval of gay marriage.
So now we've got to repeal that.
But how could Daily Wire do that when tons of their hosts, Andrew Clavin, someone's mentioning this, fully approves of his gay son and his lifestyle?
Yes, sir, Clavin.
Daily Wire can't do it.
They've made their, they've set the line.
And Clavin, they've published their content.
And he'll carve out, like, kind of, A nuanced position and say, well, yes, this isn't normative.
And, you know, everybody would love to be grandparents.
And, you know, so like, yeah, there's a sense in which, you know, I wish, you know, blah, blah, blah.
And certainly it wouldn't be good if it was everyone.
That'd be the end of the human race.
It's, you know, it's not normative, you know, but in isolated exceptions, you know, for some people who are actually born this way to be true to themselves, like my son, Spencer Clavin, he's a Christian.
He loves Jesus and God made him this way.
And he's being true to himself.
And it took a lot of courage for him in conservative spaces, you know, to be publicly gay and I support him.
Yeah, it's like, I mean, these are all the things I'm not embellishing, these are like, this is his position, and I'm just saying, like, if that's with conservatives like these, you know, they're conserving the exactly that they are conserving the victories of the left, and but that's all conservatives have done forever is just the left gets a new victory, and then conservatives come in, you know,
five years later and secure that victory and say, no, no, this is the right position, the thing that we were arguing with you about five years ago, but the thing that you beat us at because we always lose.
Yeah, like, well, let's just not go any further.
So, that same kind of mentality that the left has had for decades and decades, that's how we have to think.
The left wasn't thinking, okay, we don't want to go too far.
No, the left has just been pushing, without any restraint for decades.
And that's where we have to be.
Now, as Christians, we need to do that with scripture.
We need to do that with integrity.
We need to do that with virtue.
But no, like, we're not even close.
We have to get way back.
Way, way back.
We're not trying to just get back to the 90s.
There is a lesson, though, to learn from the left.
And I'm 100% agreeing with everything you just said.
But one of the reasons the left has lost is they did go way off the rails too far to the left.
That's true.
So I'm not saying we're there yet.
But there is something to just keep in the back of our minds.
That's true.
Yeah, there's a sense in which 2020, the left overplayed its hand.
It tried to push too fast, and people woke up.
The one, and that's a good point, the one categorical difference, though, that I would point out.
Is it in our case as we're pushing to the right, we're pushing back towards God's established natural order, right?
Um, so for the left, part of the reason why they could only push so hard so fast was because it required, as we found out with USAID and all these, it required billions and billions of dollars for indoctrination and it required manipulation and psyops with you know movie after movie after movie brainwashing the people to think this, it required taking capturing all the.
Schools from kindergarten all the way through higher education, universities.
It takes a lot of effort, and you can only move so fast.
It takes a lot of effort and it has to be calculated.
It can't be too fast and it can't be too far an inch at a time.
When you're trying, when your end goal is to convince people that the sky isn't blue and the grass isn't green and a boy's not a girl, you know, or a boy is a girl and a girl is a boy and, you know, and the baby in a woman's womb is just a clump of sails.
That is an endeavor where you can't go too fast, too far because you're literally trying to convince people of make believe.
Building Loyalty Through Authenticity00:14:50
And one of your greatest enemies that you're having to battle is nature, reality, and reason.
So, yeah.
But for us, we're on the side of nature, reality, and reason, and most importantly, Scripture, God.
And so we actually can push, I think, in many ways, a lot faster, a lot harder, because we're actually appealing to men's consciences and saying, you know that this is true.
You know that this is true.
It's all right.
We'll head our second commercial break and come back with some closing thoughts.
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All right.
So we alluded to it a little bit, but the key takeaway.
All right.
So Jeremy Boring's out and the Daily Wire.
Just to even share a statistic, I pulled 12, a basic, basically a list in order of 12 recent videos from Ben Shapiro and Candace Owens.
So Ben Shapiro has about 8 million YouTube subscribers.
Candace Owens, I want to say she's up to three, but she could be as low as one.
So I pulled a snippet to say how much attention, how many views are they getting?
Obviously, Ben Shapiro is still with Daily Wire.
Candace Owens left just a year ago.
The average number of views that she received on her video was 1.2 million with a low of 460,000.
So close to right response numbers, not quite there.
Ben Shapiro, on the other hand, who, I mean, this is, guys, this is Ben Shapiro.
This is a well known commentator for a long time.
Average views was like 331 with a low of 61,000 views on one video.
So, we're not talking like, well, it's been a busy month, a lot of cool news that she's talking about.
She just edged him out by like 10,000.
Someone just said, Philip Schneider, Candace Owens has four million.
Okay, so did you happen to look at do they have like podcast download numbers?
That's probably not public.
Fortunately, they're not public, which for a while Ben Shapiro was like the number one downloaded podcast.
But at least as far as YouTube goes, which is a big platform and a good metric.
I mean, these creators that have left are enjoying considerable success.
And it looks like, by all accounts, especially if what's being said internally is true, that the Daily Wire could possibly be going bankrupt, that they've lost, that Brett Cooper was probably one of the last profitable shows that they had.
They were seeing the implosion of it.
And in a short timeframe, what does someone say?
Ben Shapiro has 7.2.
So Candace Owens already has over half.
And I'm sure she had some of those, you know, even when she was at the Daily Wire.
But the point that Wes is making is absolutely true in the sense that.
Yeah, like anybody thought, like, oh, well, if you leave the Daily Wire, you're going to suffer.
Right.
Everybody who's left the Daily Wire has been rewarded.
Yes.
And so, what people are becoming loyal to now, we talked about a little bit before, in many ways, for better or for worse, this is just an observation of how it is, is there's becoming a loyalty to the personalities rather than the organization.
Right.
That in a time like ours, with a lot of suppression and a lot of information that's out there, like you could spend, I mean, you could read the JFK files, 80,000 pages.
It would take you probably a couple of years to get through all of them.
There's tons of information, tons of different things that you could listen to.
What people's loyalties are going to be brought to, especially as everything is shifting.
Is they're going to latch on not to an organization like, well, I just love everything that Fox News puts out or OAN or even Daily Wire, but they're going to latch on to people and they're going to say, this person, I don't watch all their stuff, right?
Joe Rogan, we were talking about before the show, I don't listen to Joe Rogan hardly at all, except when he has something interesting on.
So there's tons of people, I don't agree with them on vaccines.
I don't agree with them on Israel.
I don't agree with them on this, that, or the other.
But at the end of the day, they're going to shoot me straight and they're going to be honest.
Ringo5 just said on Apple Podcasts, Ben Shapiro's show is ranked number 28 and Candace's show is now ranked. 33.
So she's creeping up on Apple podcasts as well.
But Wes is absolutely right.
What we're seeing is not loyalty to institutions, not loyalty to organizations.
Because here's the deal like we all know this instinctively, if you've been alive in the last five years, if you're older than five years old, then you've been through this, you've lived through it, and you're aware.
There's no loyalty to institutions because there was no loyalty of institutions to us.
They all betrayed us.
They all lied to us.
They all discredited themselves in real time on national television.
Anyone with, you know, Two cents could pick up on it and observe it.
We were lied to about COVID.
We were lied to about BLM.
We were lied to about Russia and Ukraine.
We were lied to about all these things ad nauseum.
And so people are not loyal to institutions.
People are loyal to people.
They're loyal to the content creator, the personality.
Like Tucker.
That's right.
Exactly.
It's like, well, if he loses Fox News, you know, like, no, no, no.
Tucker's doing just fine.
And, you know, and, and, Everybody having more fun doing it, having a lot more fun doing it, getting to talk about what he wants to talk about, far less censorship, you know, far less control.
Um, and so people are following the individual, not the institution.
And then that begs the question, what is it?
And you got into this, Wes, but just to put a fine point on it, what is it about the individual that's most compelling right now in this climate for the last five years, you know, even before 2020, but especially started with 2020, and that I think will continue in this 10 year cycle, I think it's going to be a 10 year cycle, at least a decade of trying to.
To get the train back on the rails.
So, I think we're barely at the halfway point right now.
So, what is the primary currency that would why some individuals will rise to the top and other individuals will fade into obscurity?
I think it's two things authenticity and courage.
Yep.
Authenticity and courage.
You had some thoughts, Michael, too.
There are some guys who've been rewarded for precisely that courage.
They were courageous and they gained a following, but they did not continue being courageous.
And so they have lost some of that following.
So it's not enough to just have some claim to fame, some historic moment where, well, I was courageous on this issue during this time.
No, the people who will continue to build an audience and have loyalty is going to be the people who continue to be courageous on the next thing.
Remember what I said it wasn't a once and for all test of COVID and BLM in 2020.
But the Lord has providentially given us test after test after test.
They just keep coming.
They just keep coming, keep coming.
And so, what people are looking for is okay, will he be on the right side of this issue and the next issue and the next issue?
Or will he say, no, I've gone this far and I will go no further?
Or will he just try to memory hole and just avoid it altogether?
There's some big issue that's happening right now, it's going on and it's just crickets.
And, you know, he's talking about something else that's safer, that's more comfortable.
No, the guys who are being rewarded today are being rewarded for the same things for why guys were rewarded in 2020.
That they were right there on the cusp of the thing that everybody was talking about, the thing that everybody was asking about.
Like for us, people like to say, well, you're Nazis and you're this and you're that.
But we have been, now hear me, there's not just reward.
You get both.
You get rewarded and you get hammered.
So you get a lot of flack.
But part of the reason why people have trusted us is when everybody was talking about the Jews, we were willing.
To talk about that instead of leaning away and like, oh, we just, you know, we like, I can't see it.
I won't go there.
Like, instead of that, you know, we got Andrew Isker into the studio and not only did we address it, we leaned in.
We're like, this is a big conversation.
People want to know what's true.
How should Christians think about this?
And so instead of just, you know, ignoring it or leaning back, we leaned in and we're like, we're going to talk about it even more.
We're going to do a nine part series, we're going to clip that up.
Those clips are still running.
And we're going to do a deep dive on this issue.
And it's the same phenomenon that you see with Joe Rogan, it's a huge show, but it's not like every episode he does goes viral, right?
But the Ian Carroll one, that one did.
Martyr May.
The Martyr May, Daryl Cooper one, that one did.
Daryl Cooper on Tucker Carlson, that one did.
Because people want to talk about it.
So it's courage and authenticity are the two primary forms of currency.
People are not following institutions, they're following individuals.
Which individuals, the ones who have courage, And authenticity and not courage of yesteryear, and not that they were authentic once upon a time.
That's why people love Jordan Peterson.
He was authentic and courageous, right?
Canada, you know, and the ADL was a part of this and saying, well, this is hate speech that, you know, you won't use the people's preferred pronouns when you're speaking to them and that you won't play along and you're sitting here saying the emperor has no clothes and just in an authentic way and in a courageous way, he sat there on national television being interviewed and said, no.
I will not play the game.
And then five years later, the same man is now joining the ADL to censor people with Christ as King.
No, you don't get.
There was a time where you could achieve institutional success and credibility, and then you could go on autopilot and you just had it.
That time has ended.
If Jordan Peterson doesn't continue to be authentic and courageous, then he will not continue to be relevant.
Um, and and I think you've seen that to where I was about to say that's what's already happened, but in 2020, Jordan Peterson was filling stadiums and he was a phenomenon.
Um, and five years later, Candace Owens with one podcast can take down Jordan Peterson, it's incredible.
Elon Musk and Generational Limits00:16:05
So as the oldest guy on the panel, the only, I guess, devil's advocate or pushback that I would give to this is the man who, because of conscience, says, well, like this issue is too far either to the right or just I disagree with this issue, who then says, I'm still going to stand up to all the people who are pushing this issue,
even though it's the less popular issue on the right right now, is not necessarily cowardice.
That's true.
Right.
That is still a courageous, principled stand, so long as it is for the sake of conscience and biblical conviction.
And in some ways, it is admirably courageous because he's standing up to people that had been on his side rather than to the left or something like that.
So there is a sense where, now I'm not saying that's the daily wire, but there can be a virtue in saying, I can't go that step further and I'm still going to stick to my convictions.
Like, Part of what we're saying here is the farther right the Overton window goes is inherently better.
And people who, like, people who maybe can't go, or the.
So, Joel, you and I talked the other day about change theory, right?
And some people just cannot change as quickly as the Overton window is going to go.
Even with years of the internet and the short attention spans, like, there are just change limitations and how much change people can handle.
And it's not a good thing for a society.
To undergo as much change as we have in the last 70 years and then snap back.
Like, that's a violent thing.
It's not inherently a good thing to have that much change.
And so, there are going to be some guys who, just for things like change theory, can't change as quickly and say, you know what, I don't agree with this.
I think that we need to be careful not to call them cowards necessarily or to say they're not standing on conviction and principle.
Like, we would have disagreements with them for sure.
But it's not just only the courageous who will go.
To the right, as the overturned window goes right.
That's true.
And I think some of it is also generational.
It's like one generation can only go so far.
Like, I mean, even when you think of Israel wandering in the wilderness, and it's the next generation, their children that actually enter into the promised land are able to go further than they did.
Like, to change every wrong and fix every way that we've.
You know, that we've derailed and decoupled from what is true and good and beautiful to do all that in a single generation is probably unlikely.
And so there are individuals, older individuals, that were willing to be blacklisted and hated and stood against the tide in their time, in their place, in their generation as it was happening and have pushed.
And now the Overton is shifting back and they were the black sheep.
And now it's shifted back to where they're actually now.
Within the Overton window and viewed as reasonable and even a moderate in many ways.
And that'll be pretty much all they do.
That's their legacy.
That's their legacy.
The only bit of counsel that I would give, my two cents advice on that is if it's like, well, I'm at the end of my legacy, I'm at the end of my life and the end of my work and all these kinds of things, and I'm not going to bite off a massive, huge endeavor.
Like I have my body of work.
You know, for 40 years, I, you know, I publicly, you know, wrote and spoke and did this and did that.
I understand that and I'm sympathetic towards that.
We are all products of place and time and the providence of God.
I'm 38 years old.
I was born in a different generation in a different time, and all this change is happening towards the earlier, towards the sun is rising in my case, whereas the sun is setting in the case of others.
And so I want to be understanding and sympathetic towards that.
And the only bit of counsel that I would give to someone in that situation.
Is it may be permissible for you to say, This is my leg of the race.
I'm passing the baton.
And so I'm not going to keep running because I'm 75 years old or whatever.
But I stood when everyone was against us, when we were in the middle of American dark ages, when wokeness was at its height, and when globalism was at its height and feminism at its height.
And I stood there and I stood there faithfully and I pushed back on all of it.
And I can't go with you.
Just like Moses couldn't go with Joshua, I can't go with you, but I'm going to pass to you the baton.
I think that that's permissible.
I think that's understandable.
But Moses would be a lot less respectable if he said, I can't go with you.
And then, as Joshua said, I'll go for you.
And then, as Joshua turned around to go, Moses picked up an AR and shot Joshua in the back.
That's what's hard to respect.
I think that's where people lose respect it's one thing to say, this was my task.
And I did it faithfully.
And I'm going to stand here and I'm going to continue because these things still aren't gone away.
Yes, the Overton's wind pushing, you know, it's moving, but there's still plenty of enemies on the left to be, you know, that are still, you know, everything that I've been talking about is still plenty relevant.
And I'm going to continue to bang this drum that I've been banging for 40 years because it still needs to be hurt.
That I think is perfectly fine, but I think there's a way of doing that faithfully without having to necessarily turn around and shoot everybody on the right.
And that's not to, You know, to your right.
And that's not to say, you know, just to be clear, it's not to say that, you know, that just simply being to the right of someone makes every single one of your, you know, that simply because I'm to the right of someone, everything I've ever tweeted, everything I've ever said, everything, you know, is just inherently true.
Right.
And that I can do no wrong.
No, like there are, you can err on the right.
Not everybody just by virtue of being based, you know, Means that everything you're saying is correct or helpful or true.
You can sin on both sides of the aisle.
So then I think it comes down to priority.
It comes down to frequency.
It comes down to emphasis of, okay, so like there may be guys who are going further than you went, and some of them are not just going further and you can't go there because you're a product of place and time and your generation.
But no, they're actually going further, but they're saying specific things that are objectively.
Wrong.
And there really is, like, not just it offends my personal sensibilities, but it's definitively sinful.
Okay.
If that be the case, then I think what people are going to be looking at on the sidelines is your emphasis, your priority, how much attention, right?
Because if all of a sudden, in terms of the number of blogs that you write and podcasts that you do and messages that you say, if it's now starting to feel like, okay, yeah, there are some guys to your right who have done some things that are objectively wrong, but you're giving more focus and more attention to that, to attacking the guys on the right,
than you are with the legacy that you built and all the things that you were attacking on the left.
That's where, again, you start to lose credibility.
And it's like, I don't understand.
It's one thing to levy some good faith criticisms.
I say, guys, be careful of this or watch out for that.
Or this one guy who's way off in left field, that's unhelpful.
To do that from time to time is perfectly permissible and appropriate.
But if that becomes commonplace, where like this is now, at that point, the sad thing is you're actually.
You know, at first you were saying, This is my legacy, and this is where I stop and pass the baton.
Well, now you're actually, because you're not dead yet, you're still talking and you're still writing and you're still communicating, you're actually writing now a new legacy.
And your new legacy is, sadly, if you're not careful, that will be the new legacy that you're remembered by.
And instead of fighting the left, your new legacy will be a legacy of fighting millennials and Gen Z and everybody younger than you.
We'll look at Matt Walsh and Michael Knowles, who are not as far to the right as us, but I've never seen them once decide to fire up the old computer and say, Time to go on a screed and sign a crisis team report.
Right.
And I'm sure they see it and they're like, Ooh.
Yeah, they see it.
And they have their disagreements.
They take a blind eye and they go, At least for now.
That is such a good point.
So your Tucker Carlson's or even Matt Walsh or Michael Knowles, it's not like they don't see it.
And it's not like they would never say anything.
I've seen Matt Walsh enter the fray a couple of times and say, Whoa, there.
You know, like, Whoa, that's.
That's a little bit ridiculous.
I've seen that, but it's not an obsession.
It's not every podcast.
It's not every blog.
It's not every tweet.
And it's not because they're blind.
It's not because they're not aware.
Michael Knowles, I have no doubt, is perfectly aware that there are guys to his right that are taking things in a direction that he's like, yeah, I'm not with you.
But they have continued to keep their emphasis of, no, we want to defeat the left woke mind virus.
That's our focus.
Like, even like somebody like Elon Musk, who's like, by any objective metric, the dude's not a conservative.
He literally just found out in 2022 that Democrats weren't the party of kindness and compassion by his own admission.
He literally tweeted that.
He said, I, it's 2022, and he's just now realizing that Democrats aren't kind and compassionate.
So, like, the dude is not a conservative by any stretch of the imagination.
But even he realized he had his red pill moment, you know, in 2022, and he was like, Yeah, the woke.
Leftist mind virus must be destroyed, or all of humanity is going to end.
And so, all of a sudden, at great cost to his share price, at great cost to his company, at great cost to his image, and all those kinds of things.
I mean, like, leftists are literally setting Tesla factories on fire as we speak.
So, at great personal cost, he was like, But I've got to do something about this because leftism is a virus and it's going to destroy humanity.
I will have no one to sell cars to if the birth rate continues to decline because everybody's a gay furry and nobody has kids.
This has to stop.
So, it's worth me losing half of my share price.
It's worth even my factories being set on fire.
It's worth all this because we have a legitimate crisis on our hands.
So, my point is the dude's not even that conservative.
He red pilled 15 minutes ago.
He was willing, at great cost to himself, to attack the left.
And he is perfectly aware that he owns X guys.
He is aware of the anals.
He's aware of all the anonymous accounts, you know, that.
That are, you know, everybody's got to go back.
Clarence Thomas has to go back, you know, like, like Clarence, like, go back where, you know, like, he's aware of the guys who are a little bit further, you know, and that he would vehemently disagree with.
But you know what he's not doing?
He hasn't lost focus.
He knows that he's not firing them either.
He's saying rehire them.
He's rehiring them.
He won't allow, you know, some young guy who goes too far for his entire life to be ruined.
He's, Elon Musk is rehiring that guy.
What he's not doing is saying, well, we admit that no injustice has been done if he has to drive a FedEx truck the rest of his life.
You know, like, no, someone asked about Netter.
Like, that's Netter in action.
No enemies to the right.
I love Netter personally.
And that's it in action.
What's the priority?
Yep.
What's the energy?
What's the power?
So he recognizes, yes, there are guys that Elon Musk would disagree with that he does not want to win to his right and who are saying things that are unsavory, things that he believes are objectively wrong.
But here's the deal he understands power.
This is what some guys just don't understand.
He understands power.
He understands that a Groyper272 account with 14 followers on X is not our primary concern.
But the left, having successfully taken over every meaningful institution and millions, not just millions, but billions of dollars through USAID funding going to teach Pakistani children about transgender rights, he understands, whoa, that.
Is where I'm going to set my sights.
I'm going.
So if I ever give a good faith criticism or even a rebuke, it can be a rebuke.
I'm rebuking someone to my right.
I think that's objectively sinful.
For every one of those, he's going to give a thousand times his firepower to the actual enemy, the gay race communists that are destroying the world.
But if you don't do that, So, so Michael's, I say all that to say Michael's absolutely right.
It is appropriate for some guys to say, I'm sorry, that's not the call that God has given me.
Not everybody has to do everything.
You can be who God's called you to be, and not everybody is going to be called to cross the Jordan River and to go into it.
It's okay to say, I fought the good fight, I was faithful and defended the hills that the Lord and His providence gave to my generation in my time.
I set the stage.
For the next generation that's taking it now, that is perfectly permissible.
And if that's who you are, any young guy within the sound of my voice right now should not be disparaging that older man.
You shouldn't.
But in the same breath, if that older man spends the last 10 years of his life and changes the turret and shifts it over to all the young men to the right of him and sprays 10 bullets, To the right in this direction for every one bullet he does, and to his left, where the actual enemy and institutional power is.
I'm not saying there aren't people wrong to your right, but I'm saying there are people who are really wrong to your left and have billions of dollars behind them.
And if you take the last 10 years of your life, no matter how much good you did, and you really did do it, but then now it's your priority, it's your emphasis, and it's a 10 to 1 ratio of criticisms to the right as it is to the left, then you are literally undoing your legacy.
And it's a sad thing to behold.
So, take a lesson out of Elon Musk, God forbid, out of all people.
JD Vance Sees What's Coming00:04:13
Take a lesson out of his book.
Take a lesson out of JD Vance.
Like Trump, yeah.
Or Trump, like he has managed to do it.
All these guys are aware.
They're aware.
JD Vance is online.
The dude is online.
Yeah.
He is, seriously, like he is watching and reading the articles coming out of AMREF.
He is watching and seeing the Groypers and the Anon accounts, you know, and all like, He's aware.
It's not that these guys are not aware and you just happen to be aware.
And so that's why you're dealing with it.
No, he's aware, but he understands what it takes to win.
He understands that the threat of gay race communism with billions of dollars supporting it, that has had a stranglehold on America for the last 70 years, that thing is still not dead.
That battle is still not over.
And that is the formidable threat.
And what we're seeing on the right is.
It pales in comparison.
It does.
Yep.
Any further thoughts?
I think we had a couple comments.
You want to deal with the chat?
Yeah.
Okay.
Let's go to the chat.
We'll try to take some questions.
Super chat.
Wes, go ahead.
All right.
Johnny Johnsonston?
Johnsonston.
He said $10.
Thanks, Johnny.
Really appreciate it.
What would be too far right?
You can't be too true or too ordered right.
Do we just want a little bit of chaos, lies, and evolution?
I'll take this because I started that.
What I'm thinking of is.
The guy who red pills on patriarchy and then goes home and starts saying to his wife, like, there's going to be, you know, dinner promptly at five o'clock p.m.
Like, there can be a corporal punishment of wives, things like that.
There are literally some guys who talk about this.
And historically, that has been practiced.
But again, the ODs on the red pills come in and just say, we're going to do this.
Or some movements to the right of localism really diminish the need for a national government or an army or.
Can bend in towards anarchy.
The reason I said too far to the right is because right and left is a political arrangement, more than even a social arrangement.
And so some of the pushes that I hear towards localism and focusing on your state and your city I think are good.
But I think in the world that we live in, we have to be honest about the fact that there are global issues that we need some sort of representative body.
Even if the US were to break up into multiple different countries or nations, there still has to be some sort of outward focus.
Even though I am all in favor of a great deal of non-interventionism, it's a little bit too head in the sand to say, well, we're just going to close off our eyes to what's out there entirely because we're going to prefer our own nation and our own people.
Yeah, well, but that means you have to see what's coming.
You have to see what the enemy's over the horizon.
So I do see, when I say a little bit too far to the right, like some of the things that we're talking about can, in those senses, can go too far, I guess is what I would say.
Good point.
I was just going to say, too, you can have a good thing like rule of law, for instance, but in England, it was called the rule of blood for a long time.
Right.
And it authorized the death penalty for up to pickpocketing.
Right.
Huge problem with pickpocketing and theft.
And I get that.
And maybe even in that time, I'm not going to pretend to look back and be like they should have.
But if here today someone came into power and they said, we need rule of law, and I'm not just talking like enforcement, I'm talking death penalty for minor offenses that the Bible doesn't do, that would be a good thing, rule of law, but taken to an authoritarian, extreme level that we would reject.
Nate, go to the main chat real quick.
There's a comment that I want to respond to down at the bottom from Patrick.
There it is.
This is Patrick C. He's arguing in the chat with some of the guys.
Saying that I've gone too far.
Yeah, he's a good guy.
I've met him personally, and he loves the Lord.
He's like, I just don't understand some of the things that Joel has said over the last year or two.
Parasitic Ideologies in Religion00:13:36
So he said, Sir, the man, Mr. Webbin, has literally called Jews parasites and said that he wouldn't go to a black doctor and he obsesses over Anglo Saxon Christianity.
So there are three charges.
I'll respond to them briefly.
In terms of the first, Jews, Parasites.
What he's referring to is a comment that I fleshed out and it was taken out of context, of course, and all of my opponents had a field day.
But what I was talking about is the ideology of Judaism.
I was talking, I was comparing it to Islam because people were basically, you know, one of the conversations that continues to happen is like, okay, well, you know, some guys are getting J-pilled, you know, on Israel and stuff like that.
You got Ian Carroll on Joe Rogan, you know, and Martyr Maid, you know, on Tucker Carlson.
These things are happening.
And so a bunch of people are talking about this.
Candace Owens is doing content on Israel, all these kinds of things.
Uh, but um, but you know, Islam is a way bigger problem, and um, and so you know, so I was addressing that sentiment, um, that concept.
Um, Islam has been, I said this even just uh, in our Monday episode.
Islam, anybody who's saying you know, Islam's not really a problem, it's just the Jews, well, then you've you know, you've lost the thread and you're not familiar with um, with church history or just human history for that matter.
Islam has been a formidable enemy of the church for centuries and centuries and centuries, and right now, even in Syria, you have you know.
You have Muslims who are killing Syrian Christians.
You have all the crusades, all the bloodshed.
So, Islam, yeah, there is no scenario where Christians should be partnering with Muslims and saying, you know what, we have a common enemy and it's a bigger threat than either of us.
No, Islam is a massive threat.
The reason why I use the word parasitic, I believe, is the way that I phrased it, is what I was saying is that Islam is an overt enemy.
It's an enemy that is a physical, immediate threat.
It's an obvious threat, a physical threat.
It uses the sword, it uses violence, seeks to subdue.
Whether it's war with Iran, that's the kind of threat that it is.
And Islam, in the terms of the threat that it poses, in terms of its strategy, it's overt.
It's trying to beat other nations in war, in dominance, and to.
beat the world ultimately into submission.
That's what Islam is.
It's about submission, all the world submitting to Islam.
Whereas Judaism as an ideology and as a religion, Judaism, the threat I believe is Islam is overt.
Judaism, I believe, is subvert.
It's more subversive in its tactics.
That what Judaism, I think, has done as an ideology in many ways has been to cling on to Whether it be nations or peoples or institutions.
Well, they had to.
They had no nation for most of their history.
Exactly, because they were less powerful, right?
So, you think of like, I'll probably get in trouble for this, I don't mean it in a bad way, but like, it's a stupid analogy.
But Voldemort, right?
When he loses his physical form, you know, and he has to like, and he's like slinking away in the shadows, and he, you know, has to, you know, take over somebody else, you know, because he doesn't have enough strength to be, you know, independent on his own, to stand on his own two feet.
Um, that historically, that has been a lot of what Judaism has had to do, they've had to.
Strike deals with Christians in order to protect them from Muslims.
That's like, that's a lot of what it is.
That's what's happening right now.
That's literally what's been happening for decades is, you know, since 1948, with the modern Jewish state of Israel, it's smack dab in the middle.
It's an island in the middle of a bunch of Muslim countries in the Middle East.
And so there's been a constant plea for help, which is understandable.
I'm not like everybody wants, you know, self preservation.
Nobody wants to be wiped off the face of the The map and people want to survive.
That's natural to all peoples.
But it's Christian nations, it's European, traditionally, historically Christian nations, the West, that has in many ways sustained the modern Jewish state of Israel and Judaism as an ideology.
Judaism attached itself to Christianity in this Judeo Christian.
Oxymoron.
Judeo Christian is like jumbo shrimp.
It doesn't make sense.
There's nothing, I'll take the Christian, but hold the Judeo.
Yes and amen.
No, we don't need, Christians do not need Judaism.
Israel is not our greatest ally.
That has been a one way, predominantly one way relationship for decades.
It is not a mutually beneficial relationship.
And so that was my point in saying parasitic, that Judaism, I believe that.
The point that I was making is that Islam, I think it's wrong.
If you're a Muslim and you do not repent and believe the gospel and trust in the Lord Jesus Christ and in Him alone, the exclusivity of Jesus Christ as the God man, that Christ is King and Christ is divine, He is God, the only begotten Son of God, then you will spend eternity in hell.
Islam will send you to hell.
It is a false religion and it is a religion that is not a coincidence.
I'm not saying every Muslim is violent.
But it is not a coincidence, statistically, the amount of violence that that ideology and religion produces.
It is natural to the tenets of Islam.
But it's overt.
And here's my point as bad as it is, it'll send you to hell.
It's a false religion, all those things.
There's violence that's in the equation, all these different things.
But Islam is sustainable.
That's the point that I was trying to make, and what Patrick is picking up, and it went viral, and I was cut out.
Islam is sustainable.
This is what I mean by that.
It agrees with the tenets of God's natural order.
It hates Christ.
And therefore, in the eternal sense, it is not sustainable.
It's damnable.
But in the temporal, earthly sense, Islam believes that boys are boys and girls are girls.
Islam, you know who's having babies?
It's not Jews.
And it's not Christians, to be fair.
Not in these modern times, sadly.
It's Muslims.
Muslims, that the tenets of Islam are false, but they accord with nature.
They accord with nature.
So eternally, it's going to damn you to hell.
But temporally, in the earthly sense, Muslims have hierarchy, patriarchy, male headship.
Now, of course, there are abuses.
Again, I'm not a Muslim.
I'm not a fan of Islam.
So, do they take it too far in the way that they treat women?
I'm just not sure.
There's an example of a right wing view with that framework.
What?
I said, there's an example of a two right wing view with that framework.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Like, is it a view that you would say is too far right wing that you would disagree with?
Yes, Islam.
There we go.
Islam.
And to be fair, they're not even, that's why left right is not helpful.
There's a way to frame right that isn't, Islam is not right wing at all.
And there's a way to frame that it is.
So if you frame that it is, that's how you could say it.
Right.
So there are abuses.
You can be too patriarchal where you're literally beating women.
And I think that that is reprehensible.
I think that that is immoral, that that is wrong.
But my point is, they are not boss babe feminist.
Right.
And not being boss babe feminist and understanding male headshaw.
Understanding heterosexual relationships, not all, they have polygamy in some cases, but many monogamous heterosexual relationships where the man is the head of the home and the wife is his helpmeet, and they view children as not a burden but a blessing and are seeking to have families with five, six, seven, eight, ten children.
That ideology, that foundational framework and way of thinking is sustainable, meaning it's a, this was the whole point.
I said, there are hosts.
And there's only a few of them.
There are host ideologies or host communities, religions, nations, peoples, and there are parasitical ones.
A parasite, what makes something a parasite is that it's not a host.
It cannot live independently on its own, it is not viable in and of itself.
It must latch on to something else that is a host, that is sustainable in order for its vitality, its existence.
And so, my point is, and I'm not saying just for the record that Judaism is the only parasitical example that could be given.
Wokeness is parasitical.
Wokeness only was able to achieve the optic, the veneer of viability, because it was attached itself to the neck of Christendom.
It is only because of the foundation, the host of Christian Western tradition, that wokeness seemed to be viable and it wasn't viable very long.
And so, that was my point I think that there are only a few.
Host ideologies.
I'll give you three of them Christianity.
Christianity can live independently on its own.
And Christianity is the only one that can give life temporally and life eternally.
It's the only truth.
The only salvation is found in Christ and Christ alone.
Christ is King.
But Islam, temporally, not eternally, but temporally, because it agrees with God's natural order in the temporal, earthly sense, Islam can live.
With some degree of prosperity and vitality for a thousand years, two thousand years.
It has.
And it has, without being dependent on the West.
We need billions of dollars from America.
No, you can have an Islamic nation that has vitality and sustainability for a thousand years without having to latch on to a Christian nation.
They're all going to hell if they don't repent of their sins and believe in Jesus, but in the earthly, temporal way.
So, Christianity is an example of a host ideology, religion, and civilizations.
Islam.
And here's another one, might surprise you paganism.
I would classify paganism also as a host religion.
For thousands of years, paganism reigned supreme.
Paganism, also like Islam, and in some ways worse, I would argue, but was violent, would R-A-P-E and pillage other nations, Vikings and Norse, worshiping Norse gods and, you know, and the pantheon of, you know, all these different things.
It was not monotheistic, but paganism still held to the tenets of husband, wife, male, female, children, good.
So, for crops, reap a harvest.
Like, just these natural, it lived according to the law.
Early Germanic tribes had, like, you read, like, the Romans that took them over there, like, the women were committed.
There was, like, adultery was non existent.
Children raised to be strong and hardy.
Like, pagans, totally, not Christian, but.
Sustainable.
Sustainable.
So those are three.
Obviously, this is a thought experiment that you could, it's not exhaustive.
Maybe there are more.
I'm sure there are.
But Christianity, Islam, and Paganism.
When I think of long lasting enemies of the church, I think of Paganism and Islam because they're actually host ideologies that can live on their own.
Wokeness, I would say liberalism, liberalism only works on the back of Christendom.
Wokeness only works, and wokeness, let's be honest, it's really a subcategory.
It's just the heights.
The pinnacle of liberalism.
That's what it is.
It only works with a host.
It's parasitic.
I would say the same thing about wokeness, same thing about liberalism.
I literally believe the 20th century post war liberalism is parasitic.
It only appears to work temporarily when it's sitting on the mountain of the inheritance that has been accrued by Christendom.
I think communism also.
And communism would be another example, and Judaism.
I really believe that Judaism is a parasitic ideology that has only fared.
As well as it has by ultimately creeping in and making alliances and benefiting off of predominantly Christian nations.
That does not mean that every Jewish person is a parasite.
That does not mean that every, and it certainly doesn't mean that this inherently that I have this universal animus.
DEI Consequences for Black Doctors00:07:39
I don't.
I don't.
I love Jews and I wish them all a pleasant conversion to Christianity.
I want to see them repent of their sin.
I want to see them saved.
I want to see them love the Lord Jesus Christ.
And I also want to see them begin to employ Christian principles that agree with God's natural order so that they can be sustainable on their own and where America doesn't constantly have to be propping them up.
And I don't want to be sending billions and billions of dollars to any foreign country.
Not just Israel, but any foreign country.
I want to be America first.
So that was the first one.
The second one is he said that Joel wouldn't go to a black doctor.
I was talking about the tragedy of DEI and what it's done in the mind of every reasonable thinking person.
Ben Carson, I would go and see Ben Carson.
So I'm not saying that a black person can't actually be a doctor.
What I'm saying is that because of DEI practices, because of wokeness, now, whenever there is a black doctor, if I know him, right, if this is a man who's a black man, he's a member of my church, I know where he went to medical school, I have a friendship with him, I know that he's highly competent, he's highly skilled, then sure, that's different.
What I'm saying is if I have a choice between a white doctor and a black doctor, and I don't know either of them from Adam, I don't know either of them, I just have to trust on its face.
Their credentials, then because of what, and this is a tragedy, I wish this wasn't the case, but because of what DEI has done, is I know, and it's like, oh, so you're saying they made, that's not true.
You know, everybody has to pass a certain level of proficiency when it comes to, you know, the medical field.
No, no, we have the receipts of schools that allowed for lower test scores, lower metrics, if you were black than if you were white, and if you were Asian, for that matter.
I would just for the record, I'd pick the Asian doctor over the black doctor in the year of our Lord 2025.
Maybe it won't always be this way, and it certainly wasn't always this way in the past, but it is today.
This is what godless woke ideology does, it has consequences, and I'm sorry for those consequences because I have no doubt that there are probably several black doctors who are competent, who worked hard, who are more than qualified for their vocation.
And and hear this from me I am sorry for you that wokeness and DEI, um, has now uh.
Cast a general cloud of doubt in the mind of many Americans, not just me.
I said it out loud, but I represent many Americans who are thinking with common sense and saying, Yeah, like if I get on an airplane, I prefer for the pilots to be two colors you want to see.
I got this from Virgil Walker, who's black, for the record, it shouldn't matter, but because of wokeness, you know, like, so there's the credential.
Virgil Walker's black.
And he said this he said, My two favorite colors when I'm getting on an airplane, when I look in the cockpit, The cockpit is white and gray.
I want to see that it's an old white man, gray hair, white skin, white and gray.
Virgil Walker said that, but he's allowed to say that because he's black.
Well, I'm going to say it too because it's true.
Vody said that one of the reasons he went and did his PhD at Oxford was because he did not want to be saddled with, well, you only got your PhD in America because you were black and were let in more easily.
Amen.
And I think that's probably the right decision.
And Vody has done an admirable job of speaking out against wokeness and DEI and all these kinds of things.
And so is Virgil Walker, for that matter.
And so that was the point when I said, I was talking about we moved to Texas.
I didn't have my old doctor.
I needed to find a new doctor.
We didn't know anybody here.
We were fresh in this area.
I grew up in Texas, but not in this area.
And so we're in a new area.
And everybody's a stranger.
And so I don't know any of these guys from Adam.
And my wife showed me, here's.
This is who our insurance, you know, who will take our insurance.
This is who's available to us.
Here are your choices.
Do you want this guy, this guy, this guy, or this guy?
And I said, well, yeah, I think I'm going to go with this white guy because he could be terrible.
I don't know.
But I'm talking about statistically speaking.
The black doctor could be fantastic.
But this is what I know statistically speaking, there's far less likelihood that that white guy had lower standards for his test scores.
Than the black guy.
So that was not to say that a black man can't be a doctor.
It was to say that currently, in our current landscape, because of DEI, if anybody was able to slip through, then it would have been the black guy more likely than the white guy.
And the last thing I'll say on it is this.
It's like, well, because some people say, well, I still don't believe that there were lower standards for test scores or this or that or anything else.
I think that's malarkey.
Maybe in some fields, DEI might, but not in the medical field.
In the medical field, everybody had to be proficient.
Okay, well, here would be my final point.
Okay, so then let's say there's a minimum bar, must be this tall to ride the ride.
And that the medical establishment is just absolutely credible, right?
I mean, they didn't lie to us about COVID.
They've been just forthright and above reproach every step of the way.
And we can trust that they didn't adhere to DI standards and this, that, and the other.
Okay, fine.
Even if that's the case, then that means that all their doctors, and I don't believe it is the case, but even if that was the case, that would mean every single doctor has met a minimum standard.
But then, Beyond that minimum standard, we can agree, I think we should be able to agree, that just because an organization or a certain vocation, a field, has a minimum standard, doesn't mean that there aren't still disparities within it, right?
So, like, you got to be at least this good to fly a plane.
Does that mean that all pilots are exactly equal in their ability to fly a plane, or are there some that are exceptional, some that are still better than others?
And if you get to choose, last time I checked, it's still America.
I'm allowed to choose.
Who is my doctor?
If you get to choose, even if you have three choices and all three of them are proficient, are they all equally proficient?
And if you have a choice, would you not choose the one who might be the very best?
And then going back to my DEI argument, so all right, let's say that DEI did not infect the medical field so profusely that there are guys who are incompetent.
Okay, but let's say they all met the minimum bottom standard or they wouldn't be there because the medical institution, they really held the line on wokeness.
I'm not convinced that's the case.
But if that was the case, could we still at least say that, okay, so everybody met the minimum standard, but can we still at least say that everyone who met the minimum standard is still not equally proficient, equally qualified, that some are more qualified than others?
And if anybody currently, currently with our political and cultural landscape, might have had a harder time than somebody else, it would have been the white guy?
Like, all this is documented.
Read Jeremy Carl's book.
The what is it?
The undisputed class.
The unprotected class.
He documents all this from every major institution, every field, every vocation.
The War on White People00:05:39
And he talks about how white people for years now have been disparaged.
They've been discriminated against on the books for universities, for different institutions, for different companies, all these things.
This is a proven fact.
And so if I'm looking and I see, okay, well, everybody met the bottom line minimum standard, but I know that this guy, he had.
He had headwinds because of wokeness, just the general milieu of wokeness over the last 10, 15, 20 years.
He probably had to be extra exceptional because right now we live in a country that at every level has discriminated on the books verifiably against white people.
That was the argument.
And then the last thing he said, and he obsesses over Anglo Saxon Christianity.
No, I. Make no apology for being a respecter of the great Western tradition and Christendom.
And God made that decision, Patrick, not me.
God, in His providence, for whatever reason, it pleased Him in His sovereignty over the last thousand years to move among every tribe, tongue, and nation, saving from among all peoples, but to move particularly, uniquely, in incredible ways, not just with salvation, but with philosophy and art and innovation.
God has moved, not exclusively, but predominantly in Western society, in European peoples over the last thousand years, in a way that He has not in South Africa.
In a way that he has not in Asia, in a way that he has not in South America.
And that's just the reality.
And I happen to be a descendant of that, that, that work of God, that sovereign, merciful work of God that he did through my ancestors over the last thousand years.
And right now, that's the very point of attack.
That's the very thing that the world hates, including white people.
Nancy Pelosi and Joe Biden, like the very thing that the world right now is trying to destroy is Christianity, first and foremost, but also Western civilization.
They hate Christians, yes, but if you think that the world wants to completely eradicate and replace Ethiopia, there are Christian nations, guys, in South America, Christian nations.
In North Africa, Christian nations in other parts of the world, but they are not the targets of the unbridled, putrid animosity and pure hatred that America is, that England is.
There is a war on Christ in Christianity, but there is also a war on white people.
There is.
And these two circles, like a Venn diagram, I will be the first to tell you that there's plenty of overlap there.
There's a lot of overlap.
But I am convinced that there is not just one war on Christianity and by proxy, whiteness.
I believe that it's important whether you're white or not, because if you're a Christian brother, you should care what's happening to your other Christian brothers, whether they're the same race or not.
And I think that it is paramount, it is vital for people to wake up and recognize that there are two wars, not one, two distinct wars.
There is a war on Western, predominantly white.
Nations to take them over to flood them with third world foreigners or Muslim nations to replace them at every single level and for them to become quickly the minority in their own historic nation.
There is a war on white people and there is a war on Christianity.
It's not one war, it's two.
There's a lot of overlap, absolutely, but there are two wars.
The country of Ethiopia is not hated.
It is not hated in the way that America is hated, in the way that England is hated.
And it's not just because of Christianity.
If it was just Christianity, there are plenty of other Christian nations that are not predominantly white that would be hated just as much as England.
But they're not.
They're not.
White people are uniquely hated.
They're uniquely hated.
And that, if there were any peoples on the earth, like we've talked about Christians in Syria because they're our brothers in Christ, it needs to be talked about.
If there's any peoples on earth that right now the world seems to be joined together to eradicate and replace, then as Christians, we should talk about that.
And it just so happens that right now, Western Europeans, white people, are absolutely being replaced and are hated.
And as a Christian minister, that seems like a relevant topic to discuss.
Plus, my kids are white.
So, yeah, I have a personal interest in the war against white people not being successful because I have white children and I want them to have a future.
Protecting White Children's Future00:00:35
So, I don't know what to tell you, Patrick.
Love you.
I know that I met you in person.
You seem like a great guy.
I know you're a brother in Christ.
But if you want to buy the propaganda and all the enemies and right wing watch and people who clip me out of context, if you want to agree with leftists, then fine.
You can do that.
It's your prerogative.
But I'm not the monster that you think I am.
Okay.
Any other thoughts for today?
Nope.
Okay.
That's it.
Thank you guys for tuning in, and we'll see you again next Friday.