Matt Walsh and the Daily Wire dissect "Am I Racist?", debating whether deceptive tactics like disguises constitute righteous war against subversive ideas or unjustified grifting. The discussion highlights Glenn Youngkin's Virginia victory over Tim Walz, attributing it to Walsh's advocacy for anti-transition bills, while critiquing evangelical leaders for promoting Critical Race Theory and fighting dead dragons instead of living communist threats. Ultimately, the episode argues that true conservative influence requires early, courageous intervention through groups like the New Founding Guys rather than waiting for mainstream acceptance or engaging in purity spirals. [Automatically generated summary]
Transcriber: CohereLabs/cohere-transcribe-03-2026, WAV2VEC2_ASR_BASE_960H, sat-12l-sm, script v26.04.01, and large-v3-turbo
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Live Discussion on Racism00:02:47
Good afternoon, gentlemen.
GA.
GA.
GA to everyone joining us in the chat as well.
Good to be here for another live discussion.
We're going to be talking about Am I Racist?
Went ahead, we saw it last night.
Really great movie, really enjoyed it.
We'll talk about some key tenants of the film.
But it sparked a really interesting discussion that we'll lead off with.
Maybe you're seeing it tonight, don't want any spoilers.
That'll come a little bit later in the episode.
But it opens the can of worms of this idea of righteous deception.
And this is not an idea that's novel.
This is not the first time as Christians, as Protestants, we've had to think about.
Well, what is the place for lying and deception?
Do they have a place?
What about in different scenarios like war?
And there were two individuals specifically, really impactful, Denny Burke and then Andrew T. Walker.
And they had really liked the movie, but they came out and they said, But what about the way you deceived these people?
The way you set up these workshops, the way you set up these interviews, the way you talked to them.
You wore a disguise, after all.
You did all of this, and it was kind of deceptive, right?
Matt Walsh would claim to be a conservative Christian, certainly conservative.
Catholic, but he's claiming to be a Christian and then putting on a wig.
He even created for the movie a fake web page.
They had a whole information page, build themselves as something totally different to be able to get in, to do these interviews, to complete this movie.
And so some Christians took, I wouldn't say maybe offense would be the right word, to demonstrate.
Let's go ahead and just read this tweet.
This is from Andrew T. Walker, and I think this is a good encapsulation of the argument against it.
So he says this.
I just saw Matt Walsh's Am I Racist entertaining and definitely illuminating on the absurd ideological struggle sessions our culture has gone through in our overcorrection on race.
Still, much of the film was accomplished through deception.
I'm not a fan of that tactic.
Outside of legally declared war, take note of that, we'll get back to it in a minute.
Outside of legally declared war, deception is enormously difficult to justify, especially deceptions that do not involve immediate questions of life and death or deceptions willfully brought about and not occurring as a result of somebody else's actions.
Walsh is right to capture and name the absurdity.
The method to do so is highly questionable.
I'm going to quote you, Joel.
I think it was a couple of years ago.
Here's the difference.
You're at a picnic, you're sitting there with friends, you're having a meal and sharing it together, and you stand up and you pull out a rifle and you take a shot.
Everyone at the picnic would say, What are you doing?
Why would you do that?
We're trying to eat a lunch together.
That's totally out of place.
Here's the difference if you truly are at a picnic or if you're being attacked.
When you're at war, that's what justifies that action to stand up, to do something violent, to employ different means.
Questionable Methods at Picnic00:07:17
Are you actually at war?
Is there actually stakes being had?
Or are we truly at peace?
That's really what it seems like the confusion, the difficulty, the back and forth about this is.
Yeah, this is why the right never wins.
And I hope by the grace of God that that won't always be the case.
Christ wins, and because I'm post millennial in my eschatology, I believe that Christ will win not just despite a weak and losing dying church in the bottom of the ninth, but I think Christ will win gradually and progressively throughout real human history in this gospel age, not despite a losing church, but actually through and with a victorious church.
But that doesn't mean that conservatives and Christians win in our lifetime.
That could be the long game.
Now, we are working that we might, by God's grace, experience victory in our lifetimes, not so much for ourselves, but for the good of our children and our children's children, so that our children actually have an opportunity and a chance to experience blessing and security and prosperity in a reasonably free country like we did when we grew up.
And so we're working towards all those things.
We'll see what God and His mercy and sovereignty chooses to do.
But the point remains, and the point is this we are most certainly at war.
We're absolutely at war.
And the reason why conservatives historically have lost, and I went through that whole disclaimer to say, you know, they don't always have to lose.
That doesn't have to be our fate in perpetuity.
But the reason why historically conservatives have lost and why right now it doesn't look too great for the tide to change, it looks like we're going to, you know, we're dead set on continuing to lose, at least in the short term, is because conservatives don't really want to win.
Conservatives do not, they don't seize power.
If they ever trip and fall accidentally into power, they still forego any rights of actually wielding said power.
Conservatives are remarkable in their ability to snatch victory, you know, or to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, yes, time and time again.
And so, I like Andrew T. Walker, I think he's.
He's a good enough guy and he's done some good things on the public stage.
He actually does have some influence.
He's not just LARPing.
And so we do need institutions.
And he's kind of a company man, he's an institutional man, he's a Christian man, he's a Baptist man.
And so I'm grateful for all those things that he has connections, he has some institutional power maybe not a ton, but he has some institutional power.
And he's certainly an evangelical Baptist Christian.
And he's, I mean, to even mention him in the same sentence as someone like David French or Russell Moore would be absolutely, you know, talk about deception.
That would be unfair.
So he's.
Friend enemy distinction is so helpful here.
We just want to be, yeah.
So that's what I'm doing right now is what Wes just said.
Let the record state that Andrew Walker, I think, should rightfully fall into the friend category.
So we consider him, not that he's a personal friend.
I've never spoken to him.
And so we've.
You know, we have adjacent, you know, friends and allies who cross paths.
He's one of the good guys.
So, all that being said, there's the bona fides, there's the disclaimer.
That said, in this instance, Andrew T. Walker is NGMI.
Dude's not going to make it.
What are you talking about?
I like the film, but I don't like the tactics.
You don't get the film without the tactics.
And the tactics are 100% justified.
They're chopping off the penises.
Of boys and murdering babies.
We are at war.
Seize power and crush your enemies.
Nobody was made to say anything that they don't believe and that they have not garnered over the last four years hundreds of thousands of dollars for themselves by peddling to the poorest of the poor and the most vulnerable and guilt ridden members of all of society.
Crush them for the good of your children, for the glory of God.
Crush them.
Them.
It is absolutely justified.
And we just don't have time for loser conservatives.
We don't have time for them.
And furthermore, while I agree with you 100%, Joel, that's kind of the overarching issue.
It was justified.
There are biblical categories for justified deception and even lying, right?
And so he said legally declared war, I think.
That doesn't cover all the biblical examples because it doesn't cover the midwives in Egypt.
You know, there was no legal declaration of war, right?
So, they certainly were at a type of war.
They were being slaughtered.
I would agree with that.
And that's the point.
Exactly.
Exactly.
So, if you're asking for babies were being killed, there was no legal declaration of war on Egypt's part, but babies were being slaughtered.
Yes.
And in God's purview, that justified these midwives.
Correct.
Okay.
So, my point is Do we have babies being slaughtered?
The addition of the word legally declared war.
I think, or officially, legally, I think is what he said, seems to be an extra biblical category, right?
Like the tweet could have been fine on its own, but without that legally, then he can't say that what Walsh was doing is not justified.
Furthermore, though, I mean, there's a difference between someone in that film saying to the producers, is this a Daily Wire production and will it make the left look dumb?
And then the producers saying, no, it is not.
Hey, we're doing this documentary.
We're going to be paying people to come in and do these workshops.
You know, you want to sign up?
Great.
Maybe they don't know what it is altogether.
That is not the same thing.
And I would be surprised if any producer said an outright lie to them.
Like they ask a direct question and then they lie to their face about it.
That's not how it works.
You sign waivers, you go in, you film, and then the footage gets used.
And a lot of times when this happens, you get.
Background actors or stand ins or things like that.
Like, they don't, they have no control over what that footage gets used for ever.
Ever, right?
You make an agreement to be paid for the footage, and then the movie maker, the producer, the studio takes that footage and they make the movie.
Right.
And this has happened the other way, too.
Like, sometimes people come out and they say that the movie was made poorly and it reflected badly on me as an actor.
Well, tough bananas, guy.
Like, you signed the waiver.
Yeah.
That's, this is what documentaries do all the time.
Deception Behind the Waivers00:05:07
And so, yeah, sure.
They didn't think that it was going to be used.
In a mockumentary that's literally mocking them, although they are completely deserving of that mockery.
But you're right, that is the procedure.
I mean, and you saw they put the price tag of, you know, we pay, we're paying this person $50,000, we're paying that person $15,000, and this person $30,000.
And so everybody's getting paid their usual fee, which is outrageous, and then signing a waiver and giving permission for.
That footage, and nobody is being told.
They're not being told what they have to say.
They're not being forced.
Nobody's at gunpoint.
Nobody's having their arm twisted.
They're simply saying what they have been saying for four years.
But now it's just getting shown to the public.
That's all it is, and exposed for how ridiculous it actually is.
There was a comment up there by, I think it was Peter Sawyer, but he basically said I'm paraphrasing because the chat has kind of moved on a little bit.
Peter Sawyer said, What about missionaries who go to a foreign country where the US and that country neither has declared legally war on the other?
And so you're not at war.
Maybe it's the Sudan or maybe whatever.
But you come in and you're granted, because now this will be tough for some of our American here.
So, real countries, every country in the world except for ours, actually have standards if you want to come into them.
So, this is tough.
Like when missionaries go in, they leave America and they go into every other country on the planet except for ours.
They have to have a reason to be there and they have to be granted access in order to stay there and how long they can stay there and what they're allowed to be doing while they're there.
Those kinds of things, that's how real countries operate.
We currently don't live in one, but that's just to remind everybody you can't just hop on a plane and fly somewhere undocumented and be given a check for $150,000 in the state of California for your down payment of a house as an illegal immigrant and then also get a driver's license and vote in national presidential elections while eating cats and dogs.
So that's not something that the rest of the world does, only a wicked nation that hates its own people like America.
That being established.
When what Peter Sawyer was saying is that when missionaries from America go into another nation, they have to actually give a reason and get approval for being there.
And often their main purpose as a missionary is to evangelize and share the gospel and to help towards church planting efforts and maybe even to function as a pastor and preaching on the Lord's day.
And that's the primary focus.
And even to bring Bibles with them and different resources.
But they get in under a pretense.
And I think pretense is a fair word here a pretense of being perhaps starting a school or being a teacher.
Right?
I mean, Michael, you yourself have done that.
And the teaching, it's not that it's illegitimate.
It was a legitimate school.
And that in itself was a ministry of sorts.
But it wasn't the only reason you were doing it.
Or even the primary reason.
Do you want to share just real quick?
Like, obviously, not your life story.
We don't have time for that.
Well, it's a little different there because I lived in Taiwan for six years.
And Taiwan is not opposed to preaching the gospel.
But I know personally missionaries who did the same thing in China and have been kicked out or have had to basically flee.
And some of them, it was.
As cordial as the police showing up and say, You have a week to be out of the country, or it's going to be a different conversation.
And some of it, it was mission agencies getting a contact and saying, Your missionaries need to get out now because they're going to be arrested next week, sort of deal.
But all of those missionaries were there starting a tea growing company or as a university consultant or some sort of cover.
And yes, they did devote time to that.
Like the cover had to hold up.
If someone showed up, they had to see that they were teaching at a school or something like that.
But obviously, not their main purpose for being there.
Right.
And so.
Technically, they didn't lie.
They didn't say, I'm going to teach and then never teach.
They did teach, but it was a pretense.
It was a front.
It was a deception of sorts where that wasn't the main reason that they were going to be there.
Right.
Yeah.
And thinking categorically, so you going to Taiwan where it's not illegal to do so, there wasn't a need to lie.
It was not, I think of Paul that says, like, we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities and powers.
So that's a spiritual war.
So lying for the purpose of getting to the front lines and fighting spiritual war justified.
A culture war in the same way, lying to individuals that are bringing subversive ideas in.
Also justified, but then to give a category, an example in the marriage, a husband and a wife are not at war, and deception and lying are not allowed.
A husband can't deceive his wife because he is not at war with her.
Now, even that, say she's trying to take his kids to California and change their gender, then you could actually say, Oh, I'm just picking him up at school and bringing him right back, maybe, but that's because a relationship has completely changed.
Spiritual War and Lying00:11:03
But you have to say, Okay, if I'm in war, Hebrew midwives, even Jacob, we talked about Jacob and Rebecca, the way they deceive Isaac.
Jacob is spoken very highly of in Scripture.
So in Hebrews, when it talks about Esau selling him his birthright, it doesn't talk about Jacob deceiving him.
Jacob is actually called blameless.
It's described as a blameless man, a just man.
And that's in comparison against Esau, who sells his birthright.
It's an interpretation of that word hunter that could kind of mean savage.
He's a savage.
He's a barbarian.
And so there's this promise made to Rebekah when she has both twins in the womb that Isaac, the father, her husband would have known about, that the younger would rule over the older.
And that was a prophecy made by God.
Yep.
So God tells Rebekah listen, you've got two children in here, and the younger one of them is going to serve the older.
But Isaac.
Disregards, we don't have any insight into why he does.
He's old, he's maybe going senile, and he disregards it.
Yeah, God said that, but I really like Esau.
He's a great cook.
So you've got Jacob and Rebekah, and they see, okay, God made this promise, but I can see Isaac not following through with it.
I see Esau ready to take on the covenant blessings, and they go in and they deceive him for the purpose of furthering God's promise, for the purpose of, I don't want to say taking what was promised to them, but really in that sense.
God made a promise.
He says, This is what's going to happen.
They didn't just sit back and say, Well, we'll see what happens, man.
Esau's going in to bless.
They get to work, and neither of them in the biblical narrative are spoken of wrongly for it.
It's recognized, Hey, wickedness was being done.
You were being robbed, and you employed a level of righteous deception that was not malicious in order to do what was right.
Right.
It's the same as, who's it, Judah and Tamar, the black widow.
Right.
You know, so, I mean, Judah has, at this point, you know, it's.
Comes down to his third son, and he's like, Nah, too many sons have died.
I'm not giving you a third.
And so, you know, the first son, the Lord kills because he was wicked.
We don't know exactly why, but he did evil on the side of the Lord.
And the second son is supposed to fulfill his older brother, the first son's lineage and line.
He has a brotherly duty to produce offspring for his older brother so that his name wouldn't be blotted out from the earth.
And he refuses to do that.
So we have the sin of Onanism in this case.
And the Lord sees that as wicked.
And so he puts him to death, Onan.
Was his name.
So the first brother dies, second brother, Onan dies, and now there's a third son.
Tamar is not, Judah withholds him from Tamar, and it would have been her right to have that third son now as her husband, but instead he puts her away.
She has no way to provide for herself.
Nobody else is likely going to marry her for a number of cultural reasons.
And so she's on her own for all intents and purposes, and she's been shunned and put out by Judah, and yet she.
She comes up with a plan, and in this plan, she covers her face, like basically, you know, like a full burqa, right?
And covers her face, disguises her identity, and imposes as a prostitute, and gets Judah to have sex with her, and then keeps his staff and seal as collateral, and you know, until she can, you know, basically he can pay for her, and then.
And then later on, she puts that away, and the implication is that some time goes by.
Later on, she begins to show that she's pregnant, and Judah calls publicly for her execution that she, I think, burned at the stake, I think is the particular death sentence that he pronounces on her.
And then she says, Well, before you put me to death, could you just identify, just so you know who the man is involved in this?
Because it wasn't just me.
This is not like a Mary situation, it took two to tangle.
You know, this child was not conceived by the Holy Spirit.
There's a father involved.
And just so that we know who he is, he gave me this staff and the seal as collateral.
Do you recognize this, Judah?
And it's his.
She's sharp, sharp gal.
And so, anyways, he then says, She is more righteous than I.
And she's absolved.
And I don't think just in absolved in terms of moral culpability in the eyes of Judah, but more importantly, in the eyes of God, that she's justified in doing so.
And here's the point one of the major things that justifies her is not just that, well, Judah was worse.
And so, therefore, You committing a sin and being able to point to someone else committing a worse sin doesn't absolve you of your moral responsibility with the sin that you committed simply because somebody else did something that's worse.
What's absolving her of moral guilt is that she knows that she has been entitled.
This is my interpretation, and it's not unique to me because if it was, then it'd probably be wrong.
But several other biblical scholars and theologians would adhere to this as well.
She somehow has received word.
And it's not even that mysterious how.
She knows that there would be a leader, a lion, the lion of the tribe of Judah, who would come through Judah's line, that the Messiah would come.
How does she know?
Because Jacob actually prophesies this over all of his sons before he dies.
He gathers all his sons in Egypt.
He's finally been carried to Egypt, reunites with Joseph, gives these last dying prophecies, and pulls his feet up into bed and breathes his last and goes to be with his fathers.
And so he gives all these prophecies, but when he gets to the fourth son, Judah, because the first three had disqualified themselves, Judah gets the messianic promise.
So there are really great promises for all of these children, but Judah gets the unique messianic promise that you are going to father through your lineage, will come the Messiah, who ultimately is going to be the Savior of all people.
So the seed, singular, that was promised previously to Abraham, now is portrayed not merely as.
With Adam and Eve, it's a serpent crusher.
With Abraham, it's a seed who, through him, all the nations of the world would be blessed.
And then when you get to Jacob, it's a lion, it's a leader, and there's a scepter.
The scepter is given to Judas.
So there's a civil, kingly aspect to it, not just Savior, meek and mild, or Lamb of God, but Lion, ruler, King, Messiah, the deliverer of Israel.
And like what was already said to Abraham, a seed who would bless beyond Israel all the nations of the world, true Israel.
And so, all that being said, Of course, Tamar knew this, right?
You're not even talking that many generations down the line.
It's from Jacob spoken out loud to all his sons, Judah being one of them.
Judah would have said this to his sons, and Tamar's been married already to two of them.
So, of course, she knows the promise.
So, then what is Tamar doing?
What absolves her of her guilt?
Well, she pretended, you know, was deceptive and pretended to be a prostitute and committed sexual immorality, but Judah was even worse.
And so, therefore, she's absolved.
No, what she knows, the reason she wants that third son is because she knows and believes in her heart of heart, and I think she's right.
That God had providentially chosen her to be the mother of the Messiah.
That she has been given a promise that she would be the mother of this messianic lineage through Judah.
And Judah's trying to cut her out of that messianic promise, that messianic heritage.
And so she says, no.
And that's the same thing.
My point is that's the same thing that Rachel is doing with, well, Rachel does that also with her father Laban.
My mistake, Rebecca does with Isaac.
Rebecca had word, as Wes said earlier.
She had word from the Lord.
The Lord gave her a prophetic word that the older shall serve the younger.
And then Paul later on in Romans 9 fleshes that out Jacob I love, but Esau I hated.
Romans 9 13.
So she has this word.
She knows that there's a messianic promise.
The promise of the seed to Abraham is now going to go through Isaac.
And the Lord has determined before the two twins had ever even been born that the older shall serve the younger, that the messianic lineage would be carried through Jacob and not.
Esau and she knows this.
The Lord spoke to her, and the obvious assumption is that Isaac knows this.
He doesn't care.
Isaac is playing favorites.
He just likes Esau because Esau makes meals for him and hunts wild game and is a little bit more manly.
And so he's looking over with preference and partiality, a sinful form of partiality, looking over Jacob when he has a word from God Almighty.
Isaac is in sin.
And Jim Jordan even talks about this that Isaac's, he's at that point, Jacob's able to deceive him because Isaac is physically going blind.
And so he puts goat skin, animal skin, attaches it to his arms to appear as though he's hairy like Esau.
But the physical blindness that is intensifying on Isaac is indicative, it's symbolic, prophetically, of Isaac's spiritual blindness.
That Isaac, as he's growing old, his heart, much like Solomon in many ways, Isaac's not the hero of the story, is my point.
His heart is slowly turning from Yahweh.
He is actually forsaking the prophecies and the promises, messianic promises that matter, and going towards his own preference and his own comfort to where he's completely blind.
And it's Rebekah, not even Jacob, but it's actually Rebekah, his wife, Jacob's mom.
Honor thy father and mother, fifth commandment.
Jacob's still in the home.
He has not, for this reason, a man leaves his father's house.
He's not yet married.
He's a single young man.
He's still in the home.
And his mother is commanding him.
With prophetic messianic prophetic force and saying, This is your prophecy, the Messiah is on the line.
Isaac knows better, he's choosing to be blind, he's as spiritually hardened and blind as he is physically blind.
And I am giving you instructions as your mother, and you need to obey me.
My mother knows best.
And uh, and Jacob says, Yes, ma'am, there is no guile, there is no sin.
Uh, so whether it's Tamar, or whether it's Jacob, or whether it's Rebecca, or whether it's Matt Walsh, not the same level, not the same level.
But there's a lot on the line.
There's a lot on the line.
And there are times where it's okay to.
Rahab would be another case.
The midwives in Egypt.
There's case after case after case.
Funding a Local Pastor Ministry00:09:08
And it is permissible.
Yep.
In times of war to righteous ends.
To be the point.
Deception, righteous deception, in times of war to ends that God has ordained.
Either given, in that case of Rebecca, literally told, literally prophetically.
But for us, the scriptures, how God has spoken.
This is an end.
This is good.
Expose the unfruitful works of darkness.
And you can utilize.
Deception in times like that.
All right.
Well, let's go to our first commercial break and then we'll come back.
We'll talk a little bit more about this subject.
There's more to say.
There might be more to say.
But then we also have some announcements.
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We're going to talk about the film a little bit too.
Yeah.
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Response Ministry shop and some things that are going on.
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Not that we didn't make these things happen, but we're not in charge.
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This is not my full time job, my full time job is as a local pastor.
But we cannot put out the level of quality of content we do and the sheer amount of content that we do without paying some workers.
And so, our main guy, who the only guy who's full time at this point that has a family, a wife, and children, and we need to give a full time wage to and not cheat just in the name of ministry.
Because let's be honest, that's what ministries do all the time they cheat Christians out of a livable wage and say, Well, you're serving the kingdom of God.
So, Nathan Elam is full time as our tech director.
He's doing all the video editing, he's doing all the administration and things on the back end, and emails, and setting up our conference, and working with speakers, and coordinating this, and coordinating that.
And so, We need to be able to pay him.
We need to be able to rent our studio space.
There's equipment that we need to have.
Unfortunately, I wish this wasn't the case, but life involves money.
And even when you're trying to do Christian life and Christian ministry, it involves money.
And what I'm trying to say is that we do the sponsors because we're trying all of Christ for all of life.
We're trying to expand the kingdom of God.
At the end of the day, though, it's a drop in the bucket in terms of meeting our budget.
We really only meet our budget.
We have some Patreon guys.
We're so grateful for you.
We're so grateful for you, but that doesn't really pay the bills either.
Our Patreon is not our bread and butter.
The sponsors and revenue that we get for ads is not our bread and butter.
And then, even with YouTube, I've said this before, but we could get more in terms of monetizing our videos through YouTube, but we monetize the YouTube ads, not our own, but YouTube ads.
We monetize less than half of our videos because we know if we monetize them, it puts them in the crosshairs of YouTube exponentially more, and YouTube will be all the more likely to cancel our channel.
And we want our channel not to be canceled on YouTube because it gets out to 10 times as many people on YouTube than it will on Rumble.
I understand.
Praise God for Gab.
Praise God for Rumble.
I'm casting no shade on some of these alternative social media platforms.
I think that's great.
Do it all.
But here's the reality let's just be frank.
We will not have the same reach.
We won't.
We won't.
I know Andrew Torba.
Andrew Torba is a friend.
And Andrew Torba would take no offense in me saying, Andrew Torba himself posts on Twitter all the time.
Why not just post on Gab?
Because he's not an idiot.
He's the CEO of Gap, but he knows like reach matters, influence matters.
So it matters being on something like YouTube.
But for us to stay on YouTube, being as conservative and far right wing extremists that we are by today's standards, aka we believe what everybody believed 100 years ago, but to have that kind of conservative, faithful content and to be on YouTube, the only way we even stand a chance at survival on YouTube is by just.
Compromising and settling and just accepting that, okay, we're going to take in a third of the YouTube ad revenue that other people will be able to take in.
Right?
So, like, when do we turn on the ad revenue?
When I'm talking about fairies.
That's right.
Right?
So, here's a giant video, right?
Here's a Nephilim video, you know, and YouTube revenue on because Nancy Pelosi, you know, she doesn't care about fairies and Nephilim, but they care about this stuff we're talking about today.
So, this is where, you know, we don't.
Put on the YouTube ad revenue and we lose money.
So, the point is, sponsors, we just don't get a lot of money for our own commercials.
We miss out on a lot of YouTube revenue.
Patreon, we keep it affordable and cheap and we're grateful for you guys, but it doesn't pay the bills.
So, here's the pitch I'm not going to do this all the time, but we need to do it occasionally.
We need for some of you to be willing to donate.
We are a non profit ministry, it is tax deductible.
And if you are able and willing, you're a Christian and you would like to support biblically faithful content like ours, Then we humbly request, and we're incredibly grateful if you do, you go to rightresponse ministries.com forward slash donate.
Again, that's rightresponseministries.com.
Donate.
And any kind of donation that you're able to make, please don't ever do this at the expense of tithing to your local church, first and foremost.
The Pitch for Donations00:08:34
But as an offering above and beyond, if you're able to do so, we greatly, greatly appreciate it.
All right.
Yeah.
All right.
So let's get into movie review.
This is one of the first ones we do.
Maybe if you guys really enjoy it, let us know in the comments.
We'll do more.
But we all saw the movie last night.
I just want to start off with the premise and the title of the movie.
So, Matt Walsh's documentary movie, Am I Racist?
This term, if I was to go to my great grandfather, let's say in the 40s or the 50s, and I say, Great grandpa, I saw a movie last night.
Oh, what was the movie called?
Am I racist?
He actually probably wouldn't know what I'm referring to.
Nate, you can show a chart here.
We showed this a couple weeks ago.
This is a Google Ngram.
And a Google Ngram shows the percentage of a certain word in a given year among all the corpus of the writings that are cataloged by Google.
Everything printed or on the internet.
So you're not just seeing the raw numbers.
You're not seeing a word used 200 times one year, five years later is being used 1,000 because more books are being published.
You're seeing it as a percentage.
And it's a very helpful way to track how ideas can ebb and flow.
So what you see on the screen here in the blue line is racism, and then the red line is racist.
And this is the use of this term dating back to 1800 in English.
I can briefly mention the French and some of the German origins of the word.
But what you'll notice, and especially for anyone that's listening, this word was not used almost.
Anytime was not used prior to 1938 and was not used at all in any meaningful sense until 1960.
Racism and racist as terms, words, ideas, concepts did not exist 100 years ago.
Wow.
Did not exist.
My great grandfather would say, What word is that?
You're telling me that for the first time.
You're telling me this got made up?
And the origin, so it's a little bit in some French revolutionary literature in the late 1800s, but it's really in the 1930s.
And it's actually incredible when you connect the dots.
Magnus Hirschfeld.
Writes, this is the man who did some of the first transgender surgeries.
He actually had an institute for research into all this perverse stuff in Germany.
He writes a book titled Racism and its publication in 1938 in the US, it is one of the first English uses of that word.
The revolutionary communist Leon Trotsky uses it in the 30s as well.
It's tough to tell exactly what first use of a term really brings it into consciousness.
But the origins of this term, they're not Christian, they're not conservative, they're not ancient.
It is a very, very newfangled term.
There's little, we've gotten to this in another episode, but we don't have to do it.
But the premise of the film, am I racist, is mostly dealing with an imaginary, recent, made up term, often used to denigrate and make people, very specific people, white people, feel bad.
So Matt Walsh goes undercover and asks that question, a little duplicitously, am I racist?
So he goes to black activists and educators, to people that have written books on this topic and said, Am I racist?
How do I undo my racism?
And they make fools of themselves.
We've got into it.
You'll have to see the movie.
I thought it was well done.
I think he could have gone into some of the history and the second half of What is a Woman.
He does some of that.
He meets with some people that are really knowledgeable and they walk through the origins of the term.
I would like to see a little bit more of that, but it does an incredible job of pointing out just how foolish this whole thing is.
And remember, and this last thing I'll say, you're conservative, often reformed pastors.
They were selling you these books, Robin D'Angelo's White Fragility.
They were selling, hawking, Yeah, I'm telling these books to you.
Six years ago.
All the way up until 2018.
And then I left because Acts 29 was woke and hates white people.
And I mean, Matt Chandler, I mean, this document, Matt Chandler straight up said, I will bend over backwards to hire a less qualified black man as a pastor than a white man.
Right.
Just because.
Right.
So, yeah, so we left Acts 29 in 2018, but we were there for about four years.
And I remember Racecraft, Leonce Crump was recommending from the stage in front of a thousand pastors and their wives, recommending you should read Racecraft.
And White Fragility was also recommended.
Um, and at Acts 29 conferences, um, they like they uh, it wasn't like oh, well, they were it's it's funny because people think you know of evangelicalism and think, well, you know, some of these guys like in the SBC or this, that, and the other, they were like soft, woke.
Um, Acts 20, I don't know about the SBC, I can't speak to that.
You know, John Harris could do more, William Wolf could do more, uh, Jeff Wright, you know, Dusty Devers, those guys, you know, are in the SBC.
I've never been an SBC guy, um, but I can speak for Acts 29, there was nothing soft.
About the wokeness in Acts 29.
I mean, Eric Mason was on the international board and like personal friends, you know, like one of the best friends of Matt Chandler, who was the president.
And he didn't just recommend a book, he literally wrote the book, Woke Church, that even talked about having black and white spaces, distinct black and white spaces on the Lord's day at the Lord's table.
So, yeah, so this stuff was, if you think like, well, yeah, Robin D'Angelo, you know, yeah, like the unbeliever.
Right, yeah, critical race theory, you know.
People in the world, we're talking about progressive liberals who murder babies and this and that.
We're also talking about Acts 29.
And while we're on the topic of murdering babies, let's just be fair and say a lot of these pastors are on board for that too.
They'll say they're not.
They'll say they're not.
But I remember, what's his name?
Ron something.
His real name.
But his made up name is Thabidi Anabuile.
Anabuile.
Yeah.
And so.
His real name is Ron Burns.
I believe.
Is that seriously?
I don't remember it.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's it.
But again, made up name is Thabiti and Abuile.
But I remember him making arguments.
This was back in 2015.
Wow.
Back in 2015.
So we're not talking about like Trump versus Kami Harris.
But I'm talking like eight years ago in 2015.
He made this exact argument with Matt Chandler.
Matt Chandler didn't make the argument with him, but it was on a podcast with Matt Chandler where he said, You know what?
The enemy we know is better than the one that we don't.
And we know the Clinton roadmap because we've had Bill, her husband, in the past and blah, blah, blah.
And he literally just carved out an argument.
He wasn't just saying, Well, we can't vote for Trump for these reasons.
So this election, you need to vote third party or abstain from voting.
No, he straight up was saying, Cast your vote for Hillary.
And at this time, like there was a sizable difference on the sanctity of life and policies between Trump in 2015 and Hillary.
I mean, this was, I'll vote for Trump today, given the alternative.
But this was, you know, when you talk about good Trump, this was a golden escalator.
This was like, this was high Trump days, right?
This was the best Trump days.
You know, this was the Trump that we want, where he was like, Unprovoked, you know, being asked and just shooting from the hip and saying what he really believed.
And they're like, Well, what do you, don't you think, do you think that a woman should get a penalization if she has an abortion?
He's like, Well, yeah, of course.
You know, I'm smart enough to know that's consistent.
It's like, well, yeah, I know that's consistent.
The answer has to be yes.
Like, God bless him, he hadn't been ruined yet.
He hadn't turned into a politician.
He was still thinking logically and justly and these kinds of things.
And so we're talking about the best of Trump, the most pro life that he ever was, marching at the pro life march or march for life and ready to appoint his three supreme justices to get Roe.
The most pro life Trump, which was more pro life than Bush and more pro life than Romney.
And if you voted for those guys, Then on the life issue, Trump was better than both of those guys back in 2015.
And you got Ron Burns, the BDN of Bouillet, straight up saying, not only don't vote for Trump, but vote for Hillary.
And Hillary was.
He published a gospel coalition article that said, Evangelical, or sorry, another pastor from his church, Evangelical leaders tell us to vote for Clinton.
Right.
Saying, Evangelical leaders, you need to go out there, tell your congregants this because it's so important.
Exposing Political Grifts00:07:28
Absolutely horrible.
Just race hustlers.
So.
Up until.
So going.
No, you're right.
So I know that was a long way of saying, going back to the film, Matt Walsh and Am I Racist?
He's exposing these guys, but exposing Robin D'Angelo, like, I mean, is there any, like, if it was a spectrum and dots, you know, along a line, would there be any space visible apart from a microscope between Jamar Tisby and Robin D'Angelo?
And hasn't Jamar Tisby been.
Been platformed even at Southern Seminary, I think.
Yep.
Less so recently, but when he came out earlier, they were singing his praises.
Yep.
And to be the great.
And praises from being sung also by Lig Duncan.
Lig Duncan, yep.
Who wrote the foreword to Eric Mason's Woke Church book.
Right.
Like, it's a shame.
Let me just, I'll just say this.
It is a shame because I'll just be frank.
The Daily Wire is like, I remember when I used to think the Daily Wire was conservative.
I'll say it like that.
Right.
You know, like when the Daily Wire does something, you know, like, you know, conservative, I'm like, that's cute, you know.
But here's the deal I'm super grateful for them.
I, from time to time, I will pipe into Michael Knowles and Matt Walsh.
I think they're the best of the Daily Wire.
And I'll just leave it at that.
But here's the deal they're not that conservative.
The movie, Am I Rich?
It was not that conservative.
It's not.
It's not.
And I think Matt Walsh would even admit that.
It's just like, this is like milquetoast.
This is like what everyone in the 90s, this is what a Democrat would have believed in the 90s.
It's not that conservative.
This is not like he didn't go into like MLK was funded by Jews, you know, and a Marxist, and like none of that.
This is like your milquetoast, just don't be woke conservatism.
Not that conservative, in other words.
But I'm grateful for these guys.
Here's my point grateful for these guys and the Daily Wire because you talk about conservatives wanting to win and doing something and building an institution, having capital.
Cash and garnering power and then wielding it to make changes in real scenarios.
Like, I mean, you could argue that the reason why Glenn Youngkin was elected in Virginia a couple years ago instead of the other guy who, like Tim Walz, was down for killing babies after birth.
If the woman decides she didn't want it, then they would leave it on a stainless steel tray to just sit there.
They want it.
They want to kill it, like give the death blow, but they would, as Trump said in the debate, he was fact checked, aka lie checked by ABC.
But what he said is, he said essentially, or they would essentially or basically execute it, not literally, but by abandoning the baby, you have effectively, for all intents and purposes, handed it over to its death.
It cannot live if you abandon it.
And Tim Walsh, I think it's six or eight babies that have happened since he signed a bill that allows for that.
So this is death after birth, death of babies legalized after birth.
And the governor in Virginia before Glenn Youngkin, same thing.
And you can make an ironclad case for the only reason that baby killing governor is out.
And Glenn Youngkin, who has his own faults but is far, better, is in because of Matt Walsh.
He helped author an anti childhood transition bill as well in Tennessee that I believe passed.
He was championing it, he was promoting it, he was working with legislators.
They have done some good work on the ground.
Observation from the movie is that it was clear that the tack that they took was to expose the grift.
Yeah.
Right?
Like they decided, obviously, the way we're going to roll this back or move the Overton window is not by going into the history.
Like you said, Wes, they went harder with the What is a Woman?
Right?
They really got under.
Like it was funny in some ways, but it was disturbing also.
Yeah.
This one was more of a comedy, and the tack was expose the grift.
We're going to push the Overton window back towards sanity.
By exposing the fact that all of these people are just race hustlers and grifters, right?
But that's an interesting observation to me because what does it say about a society?
Every society has swear words, every time period has swear words.
We live in a postmodern time where the worst thing that you can do is say something that would challenge how somebody feels, right?
And so to call someone a racist is really all it does is it makes you feel bad.
Right?
It's not even objectively, like as Wes pointed out, it's not even objectively a thing.
But what it does is it shames you to the group and it makes you feel like a deplorable, worthless person.
And so it's interesting to me that the approach from Matt Walsh was we're going to move the window by exposing the grift and not by going after kind of the seedy underbelly as much.
And it's interesting to me that that shows how much of a control and power this idea of racism has on our culture.
Yeah.
Right.
Like moving the window, what Matt Walsh's movie did was good.
But since the 30s, 40s, and 60s, this has become the cardinal sin.
You cannot recover.
You cannot recover from this.
You can recover from an affair.
You can recover from a hit and run, a DUI.
You can recover from having your dogs doing dog fighting as an NFL quarterback.
Michael Vick.
What's that?
No, not you.
Michael Vick had the dog fighting thing and he recovered.
Like, you cannot recover from this.
That tells me that, and so I think it's when you watch the movie, there are parts of the movie that are downright pagan, right?
Where they have these rituals, these trances, these meditation sessions before they talk about their racism.
And I think, I don't know, I haven't done the research yet, but it would be very interesting to find if there's any sort of pagan connection between this push to label everyone as a racist because it's so spiritual.
It was so quickly a religion, right?
Anti racism is a religion.
It solves ultimate problems.
It answers ultimate questions.
It identifies original sin.
It either does or does not provide absolution to people.
It is a religious system.
And in the movie, we saw people meditating and contemplating, even getting emotional crying and ceremonies, as it were.
I can't think of a religion that's developed faster.
1960s to now, 65 years, something like that.
It's incredible.
It's incredible.
So I think all that to say, I think it's interesting that the tack was to expose the grift.
And I bet Matt Welsh would say there's a lot more work to do here.
Yep, I agree.
Quick question just to poll the chat because we're live right now, so you guys are able to interact with us, and we'd love to get to some of your questions if you have any.
Rapid Growth of Religion00:14:22
But if you guys could help me out now, if you've been following the channel for a while, you know our thoughts on democracy.
You know, maybe some pros and cons, primarily cons.
You know, a wise, I believe he's an imam within a Within the Muslim religion.
But I think he was wise on this point.
He once said that democracy is government for the people, by the people, of the people.
But the people are retarded.
So democracy is actually government for the retarded, by the retarded, and of the retarded.
And I think he nailed it.
But despite all the faults of democracy, and certainly our founders were no fans of a raw democracy, which is.
Why they didn't set one up.
They set up a republic instead.
Despite those things, I'm willing to make an exception this once.
For those of you who are in the chat, if you would like for us to forever ban American WASP with Dieter McBusiness, if you would like us to ban him from the channel, what we'll need from you is I will need to see, let's see, in the comment section, let's see if we get.
Uh, 10 people, Nathan will be counting it on the side.
If 10 people say ban him, ban uh, American WASP with Dieter McBusiness, uh, then we will go ahead and ban him.
And if you guys don't want to ban him, then just don't say anything.
And I, you know, we'll let you have your head in a true Caesar fashion.
You know, I'll look to you, the people, and he can either live or die.
Okay, I'm a merciful.
Caesar.
And so we'll give him a chance.
I don't mind it because it really does just help the algorithm.
But if it's distracting for you guys who are trying to participate in the chat and you like him out, then let us know.
Okay.
So if 10 of you come out in the comments and say ban him, so I see a few so far say ban him.
So if you guys want to ban, let me know.
And if not, then yeah, that's fine.
Let's go ahead and he'll keep helping us out on the algorithm.
And that's great.
How many bands do we have so far?
I think we're getting 10 pretty quick here.
One, two.
We got six.
All right.
So we've got six.
But we do have a couple guys saying, hey, don't have thin skin and leave them.
For the record, it's not for me.
It doesn't bother me because I can literally just turn my head problem solved.
And if we have one troll live, in the comments after the fact, they multiply by 100.
So I'm fine with the trolls.
The other thing that I was going to say go ahead if you have questions, type in some questions.
We'll try to get to them.
And then there was something else.
What else was I going to say?
Oh, there was a, I thought there was a really good comment, Nathan.
Can you scroll up to Michael?
Yep, that's him.
So there's Michael.
And then let's keep going higher.
He's been fairly active.
So he's got a few comments.
We'll have to sift.
I know the one you're talking about.
Go down.
Go down.
That was, yep, right there, right there, right there, right there.
Nailed it.
Okay, so a couple of you guys in the chat, not just Michael, there was someone else who said this too.
I think too legit to quit, commented on this, and you guys are all saying the same thing and agreeing with each other.
And I just want to be clear.
Well, I just want to encourage you guys.
First, thanks for following our ministry.
Some of you guys, we see your name again and again, and you're just, it does matter.
Like, believe it or not, it does matter.
You know, when you get death threats and just negative hate mail all the time, I've had protesters, you know, at my house and at our church.
And so, you guys who are actually supportive, it means the world.
And if you could, please pray.
Pray for my family for their safety.
Pray for the ministry that God would use it for his glory.
And pray for me that we win it back down and that he would help us to be wise, to be faithful, to be truthful, to be courageous, and to not compromise and give in.
So, that's first and foremost.
Thank you, guys, Michael and Too Legit to Quit and other guys Peter Sawyer, a lot of guys who are just very encouraging.
Thank you.
So now, reading Michael's comment, a lot of you guys have agreed, made this same kind of point.
And you're right.
I just want to encourage you, one, for following the channel and supporting us.
But two, I want to encourage you, I think you're right on the money.
So this is what Michael said Conservative Inc., right?
Big con.
Conservative Inc., and that is a thing.
You're right, Michael.
So you're already right.
Will only push back on issues that have been settled for at least five years as mainstream thought.
And you're right.
And I don't think that we, for the record, We've already said it.
I'll say it once more.
Praise God for Matt Walsh.
So, we're not here.
This episode is not to disparage him.
Grateful for Matt Walsh and what he did.
But you are right.
And a number of you have been saying this, this same kind of sentiment and agreeing with each other.
And I just want you to know I agree with you too.
You guys, some of you, you worded it like this.
You said, notice that a movie like this did not come out in 2020 in the summer of love when we really, really needed it.
You're right.
And you're absolutely right.
And the reason it didn't come out is because the Daily Wire didn't have the courage to do it in 2020.
And also, you and I didn't have the courage to go to the movie theater and see it in 2020.
I think I would have, but a lot of people wanted it.
It would have been a flop.
It would not.
And so here's the reality you are absolutely right.
Big Con is going to come in and profit.
Conservative Inc. is going to come in, I mean, quite literally, financially, profit on battles that still need to be fought.
It's not pointless.
Okay.
I'll get to one other group.
Spoiler alert Evangelical Church.
That's absolutely worthless.
Okay.
But first, like talking about the guys who are cowardly.
And late, but still, the dragon still has some life in him.
He's still breathing some fire.
He's still wreaking some havoc.
And it's worth having the reinforcements, the troops come in to go ahead and finish the job.
Big Con, I categorize Big Con like that.
So five years too late.
That's true.
Once, you know, like I remember when I was pastoring in San Diego, all the Marines would wear shirts.
They said, Marines, making things safe for the Army.
You know, and it's like, so, you know, so Big Con is like the army, you know, for all you guys who serve in the army.
Thank you for your service.
I'm sorry, but it's just, it's a funny joke.
I don't actually feel this way about the army.
But the point is, the Marines, you know, they would, you know, they would poke fun at the army and say, like, we go in first, right?
On, you know, guerrilla warfare, you know, on the ground, you know, and make things and safe.
And so the battle's not done, but, you know, but, but a lot of it kind of, you know, like, we've now got a chance and we've already, you know, we've already, Captured an HQ and set up this, and now it's safe for the army to come in.
There's still a fight to be fought.
And we do really need the reinforcements to actually chop off the head of that dragon.
But the dragon is, we've already chopped off half of one of its wings and we've already defamed one of its claws and we've already, you know, and the dragon is going, you know, a lot slower than it was moving, you know, a little bit earlier because we stabbed it in the side a few times with a couple swords.
And now, you know, now that the Marines have done that, the army comes in.
Same thing with, you know, the army in this analogy would be likened to Big Con, Conservative Inc.
And again, I know this is a little shameless.
I don't do this often.
For you guys who follow the channel, you know, as God is my witness and you can bear witness as well, I'm not trying to constantly, um, Sing our own praises or plug our own stuff.
But one of the reasons why ministries like ours matter is because we're like the Marines.
We go in three, four, five years before Daily Wire says it and start pushing the ball.
And the Overton window, it's like, wow, the Overton window is moving so fast, not by itself.
Right.
Like, I mean, guys, let's just be honest for a second.
I feel like the Apostle Paul would say, I must be out of my mind to speak like this.
But indulge a little fool's talk.
I've been shipwrecked three times, this many death threats, and this, like, And guys, like, and we're not the only ones by far, and we're not even the earliest, but we definitely showed up before Big Con.
But that said, like, guys like Eddie Robles, guys like John Harris, guys like the last few years.
I listened to you in 2019, I remember you preaching through 1 Timothy.
It's funny you even said, like, critical race theory means if you're a black woman, you'll pretty much be president of the United States.
This is five years ago.
I said, I remember you in 2019.
Hey, be aware, this is what's coming into our church.
And I lost a third of my church.
Right.
Yep.
And arguably, what happened in 2019 by losing a third of my church is what set the stage.
Right.
For a division that eventually happened with my elders, which by God's grace we've reconciled, and I love those men.
But the point is, I'm actually going to go and preach this weekend, and I'm so excited to see them.
But a lot of pain came out of a season of losing almost half our church.
And why?
Because I was saying, and you can go back and watch, it was tame.
This was not like, oh, Joel's unhinged, but everybody thought it was.
And I got accused by people who left the church as being quarrelsome and being harsh and not qualified to be an elder and all this.
And I was saying stuff that was so tame.
And those same people are probably now watching Am I Racist in Theaters with Matt Walsh, my doppelganger, just so happens, and God's comical providence, and laughing and thinking, oh, it's perfectly acceptable to say these things.
Now, and all I'd like to say is you're welcome.
You're welcome.
If it wasn't for not only me, but guys like us, guys like John Harris, Guys like AD Robles, like if it wasn't for these guys, the Overton window is shifting rapidly, but it's not shifting by itself.
Somebody has to push it.
And a few brave individuals will get even outside of the Overton window where you're constantly being firebombed.
You've got knives sticking out of your back because someone's pushing from the inside.
They're getting criticism, but on the outside, you're getting blasted.
But you know what really moves the Overton window?
When you got.
Half the team pushing from the inside, and you got the Marines, that's the Army, on the inside.
Then you got the Marines on the outside pulling it.
You can move the Overton pretty quick if you push.
You can move it really quick if you pull.
And a few guys have been willing to do that.
That's what sets the stage for five years later, as Michael was saying in the comics, for Big Con to come, like the Army, after the Marines have made it safe and then finish the job.
And then the last organization that I hinted at earlier, kind of a little foreshadowing, the final institution that comes into the fray, Big Con comes five years late.
And the Evangelical Church of America comes 15 years too late.
15, I would argue, 15 to 50 years too late.
Once the dragon is not only weakened, but it's dead, rotted, and decaying, and all that's left is a little bit of carcass and mainly bones.
And then they take plastic swords and they cosplay and pretend to rattle down the bones of the rib cage.
We're fighting the dragon.
Meanwhile, the next living, breathing dragon, right?
We're fighting the fascists, which don't exist.
You mean the 14 follower Anon accounts?
What about communists who are actually Congress members?
Or, I don't know, like the communist who's currently running for president of the United States.
So there are living dragons with real institutional power.
You're not fighting those, but you'll fight the dragons that have already been slain.
And it is.
I must be out of my mind to speak like this, but in humor and entertain, a little fool's talk here from a guy who lost a third of his church for taking some of these risks back in 2019, before it was cool.
You don't get change unless Big Con, the Army, comes in and gives the death blow once the Marines have already made it safe.
And Big Con doesn't come in unless John Harris and Ady Robles and Joel Webb and other guys like that, five years prior, were willing to lose, not make a profit in the theater for a theatrical release, but lose jobs, lose churches, lose influence, lose friends before.
Anybody was fighting the dragon, standing there, three little dudes by themselves, fighting like a giant mountain dragon with no one else.
That's how this thing happens.
And then again, the evangelical church comes 15 to 50 years late.
And actually, not only is it embarrassing, but it's actually, it's sadly far worse than that.
It's sinister and malicious and intentional because what they do is they actually will fight the dragon late and they only even start fighting the dragon late once the new dragon that's alive and a threat appears.
And they only fight the dead dragon late.
To distract others from fighting the living dragon because they're actually in the coffers, in the back pockets of the living dragon, profiting off of it, like Fabidi and Abuya, like Russell Moore, like David French, like Francis Collins.
And there you have it.
So it's courageous men, then Big Con, then way later, the evangelical church.
So, Michael, you could not possibly be more right in your comment.
Anything you guys want to add before we go to our last commercial break?
Then we'll come back, we'll take questions, and we'll talk about apology and Jeff Durbin, the conference.
I'll just add we talked about being at war and deception.
You can say, well, why does this matter as much?
Like, I get gender theory.
What is a woman?
I see the destruction there.
But racism, like, okay, people get branded with this word.
It's not true of them.
Can't you just shrug it off?
And if you watch the movie, and this was sad, one of the workshops, a facilitator, she said, What comes to mind when you hear the word white?
And there were people there that were white, and they said, James White.
Not James White in this case.
Not white comes to my mind, but in the movie.
So she said, What comes to mind when I say the word white?
So it would be like a black workshop facilitator.
There's white people that would be like, I cringe.
Apology and Gender Theory00:17:49
I'm ashamed.
I want to get rid of my whiteness.
And white as an identity is a little too broad.
I would prefer European, Anglo, Protestant, Christian, Western.
But those are people, white kind of serves as a catch all bucket.
They're ashamed of their heritage.
There's one commandment that's associated with blessing, and it's honor to father and to mother that it may go well with you.
And these are people not honoring their fathers.
They have benefited.
The jobs they have, the affluence, the comfortable lives, those all came from the hard work of the fathers, the early settlers.
My goodness, the amount they endured.
There was a famine, a harsh winter in Johnstown, I think, Jamestown.
500, 600 people living at the start of it.
61 were left by spring.
So, they endured tremendous hardship.
And now we're 200 years later, and there's white people that are like, Yeah, I'm ashamed when I hear the word white.
I cringe.
I don't like it.
And when you inoculate 80% of a population, like in a nation like ours, to feel shame, to hate their heritage, to want nothing to do with it, then you get how bad things are.
So, why does it matter?
What do you mean we're at war?
Even if it is a fake sin, who cares?
No, it matters because you're poisoning people against the thing they are to love and to honor, to have affection and fidelity towards.
And you can't do that.
You cannot have people.
Hate their father, and then have a functioning, high trust, commodious, economically prosperous society.
If you despise your fathers, despise the wisdom they have, you will be destroyed.
So that's the war, and that's why it matters.
That's why we'll have an episode like this and talk about it, because these are real people and real ideas that have real consequences.
Yeah, that's right.
Good.
Well said, Wes.
Here's our last commercial break for the day.
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All right, we are back.
So let's start with the conference.
Okay, so if you're not registered already, we'd love for you to join us.
Write response.com.
Conference, don't do right response ministries in this case.
Type in right response conference.com.
Right response conference.com.
Real quick, Nate, do we have a promo code?
I'm just feeling, I'm just, you know, like Caesar, you know, live or die with the banning thing, the thumbs up that we did earlier.
And I'm feeling generous.
Do we have a promo that we can give?
Anything already on the books?
We don't have to make one up.
We could use DACE when I went on Steve Dace's show last month.
If that's still active, Christ is King is a $10 discount.
So, yeah, so go to rightresponseconference.com and then in the promo code, type in Christ is King as one word, as one word.
And it could be all caps or it could be all lowercase.
Christ is King.
And go ahead and get $10 off.
And we may do a deeper discount in the future at random.
Usually those get announced, though.
If you just follow us on YouTube, you might miss them because sometimes we'll do like a super deep discount for like 24 hours on Twitter, you know, in the spirit of.
It the timeliness matters because it's usually correlated with someone just said something stupid and they need to be made to feel strong.
And you put exactly, you put their name as the promo code because they said something stupid and they need to be, and by the grace of God, made to feel stupid.
And so, you do that.
And so, if you want the best discounts imaginable, just you need to be spending 14 hours a day on Twitter and hoping that Big Eva or Mid Eva says something stupid because that's going to get you your best chance of.
Of Joel being real generous and using their name as a promo code.
So, all that being said, so with Jeff Durbin.
So, Jeff emailed me.
He wrote up an email.
He sent it to Christine, who's his assistant at Apologia, and she sent it up to me.
And he was very encouraging.
So, I have nothing negative to say about Jeff Durbin.
And let me just be frank if I did have something negative to say about Jeff Durbin, I wouldn't say it.
Jeff Durbin would have to.
If he spent the next 18 months, like just publicly counter signaling Right Response Ministries and my friends, you know, like John Harris and Eddie Robles and Dusty Deavers and Brian Sauvay and Eric Conn, like then eventually, yeah, I would probably push back.
You know, I try to push back privately first, but then eventually I would publicly push back.
And eventually I would have something negative to say because that matters.
If you're publicly going against my friends, And not just because of my friends, but I'm friends with them because I think they're righteous men doing good work, doing the Lord's work.
But that's not the case.
Okay.
So let me make that clear.
That's not the case, at least as of now.
I do not put Jeff Durbin, and I don't think you should either.
Right.
I'm trying to.
Some young men follow me, and I'm not going to sit here and disparage you.
You've already received enough of that.
So that's why you follow me.
So I'm not going to disparage you.
But I'm also not going to disparage Jeff.
And so I am going to encourage you, not disparage you in a demeaning way.
Wait, because when I say young men, we're talking about a lot of these guys.
They're 30 years old.
They have a wife and four children and own a small business.
It's really, it is, it angers me when I see it on Twitter.
Pastors saying, You young bucks who don't like, so you're talking to fathers and husbands and business owners who go to confessional churches every Lord's Day, taking, like, I understand you don't like their rhetoric and their methodology in terms of tactics and tone on Twitter, but.
You don't get to talk to them as though they're nine years old.
You just don't because they're not nine years old.
These are grown men.
So, you grown men who follow this ministry, I'm not going to disparage you.
Thank you for your support.
You get enough disparagement.
But I'm also not going to disparage Jeff Durbin.
I will encourage you.
I don't want you to put Jeff Durbin in the NGMI category.
If you would be willing, this is my request to you, right response followers.
If you would be willing, As Trump once said, you know, stand down and stand by.
Twitter boys, you know, Anon boys, stand down and stand by.
If the time comes, then the time comes.
But I don't think we're there yet.
And some of you, I saw some of you in the comments saying, AD Robles, it's Joel's conference, and AD seems more upset than Joel.
Well, one, AD is on our board.
And so, you know, he cares.
He's involved.
He's not paid.
He doesn't have like some financial interest.
But he just, AD is a faithful board member.
He loves our ministry and he's a friend.
But that's just, this is the difference between, you know, the Latino guy and, And the fuddy duddy white dude over here, you know, like, yeah.
So, AD is a little bit more zealous and passionate about it.
Yeah, that makes sense.
You know, that's kind of that's AD's MO.
I get zealous.
You guys know I get passionate too.
So, I don't want to pretend like I don't because, for the record, he is the Latino guy, but he is publicly known as the reasonable, the reasonable Latino.
But, anyways, yeah, AD is he's been active on Twitter.
He's been talking about it a little bit on YouTube.
And he's maybe taken a little bit more forceful, but not that much.
Not really.
He's pretty reasonable, you know, but a little bit more forceful.
Than me.
But as it pertains to me, Joel speaks for Joel.
That's all I have the authority to speak for.
But for me, if you would do me a favor, I just would say stand down and stand by.
We'll see.
But stand down and stand by and let's just give it a month.
And you know what?
Give it three months and maybe six.
And maybe, like I said earlier, maybe even a year and a half.
Here's the deal I want to win.
But when we win, by the grace of God, when, not just if, but when we win, I would like to be able to look to my left and my right and see that I still have a couple friends left.
Yeah.
Like, guys, seriously, like, okay, like a year and a half ago, the G3 CN wars.
Right.
And by God's grace, you know, I talked to Virgil Walker this week because he reached out to me to give him the credit that he deserves.
Because you know why he reached out to me?
Because he's kind, because he's a good man.
And I profoundly disagree with him on Christian nationalism.
He doesn't think that the first table of the law should be legislated by the civil magistrate.
I disagree with him.
The Westminster Confession of Faith disagrees with him.
And John Gill, a 1689 Baptist, also disagrees with him.
But you know what else I think?
I think he's a godly, kind, and courageous man.
I love Virgil Walker.
I love him.
And you know what?
I don't want to fight with Josh Beiss or Scott Annual either.
I don't know them as well as Virgil, but I love those men too.
Can we just admit that maybe we've lost enough friends?
Right.
I feel like it's one thing when God is supernaturally in his providence, and let's be fair, everything that this all is is providence, so I'm aware.
I'm a card carrying Calvinist, but hear me out.
I think you get the sense of what I mean.
It's one thing when God supernaturally is whittling down the army of Gideon.
Right, where it's like, okay, you got too many guys, let's whittle it down to this, and like, oh, you still got too many guys, let's whittle it down to that, and then all of a sudden you're left with 300.
Uh, it's one thing when it's the Lord's doing, and God's doing it so that He might garner for Himself the greatest degree of glory possible, so that it would be clear that you know it's not by might nor by power, but by my spirit, says the Lord, that the battle is the Lord's and that He's the one who brought about the victory.
That's one thing when God does it, um, and if God's doing it.
Then fine.
God does frustrate alliances at times.
And God does, in his providence, part even brothers like Saul or Paul at this point, Paul and Barnabas, right?
And Paul didn't go around saying Barnabas is a heretic and he's going to hell.
He's like, no, of course Barnabas is a Christian, but we can't partner.
Right.
Because you still have to make a decision.
John Mark is coming or he's not.
It's not an issue of heresy.
Right.
It's not heresy.
Right.
But you still got to make a decision.
It's still worth dividing over.
And so, you know, so they both bless each other to work in separate portions of the Lord's vineyard, neither one anathematizing the other, but still dividing.
And so sometimes God does that.
But man, if God's going to do it, He doesn't need our help, I guess is what I'm saying.
If God's going to whittle us down to 300 and then to 200 and 100 and down to 50 and down to let God do it, but let it be something that's done by the Lord.
And not done by you and me being dumbasses.
Like, honestly, like, I don't have that many friends to begin with.
I feel like Doc Holiday with Wyatt Earp, you know, he's like, why would you do this?
Why would you go, like, in my defense to save my life, you know?
And Doc Holiday says, because you're my friend.
And Wyatt Earp says, yeah, but I got lots of friends.
And I feel like Doc Holiday is saying, I don't.
Yeah.
I had lots of friends back in 2015, you know?
But like Wes, you know, Said, you know, bringing back up the historic record, I've lost a lot of friends.
And I reckon, since we're going with a Western tombstone theme, I reckon you have too.
Friendship is precious and it should not be thrown away lightly.
And I love James White.
I see the way that he's engaging and I do not appreciate it.
I don't think that it's right.
I disagree.
I disagree with James White and the way that he's handling himself.
I disagree on the substance of certain things like the Crusades, but I also disagree with the method.
I also disagree with a lot of the guys who are taking James White off right now.
I feel like James White is being angry, shaking his newspaper on the front porch.
But I feel like also the neighborhood kids are pestering the old man and putting dog poop in bags and lighting it on fire.
And neither one is helpful.
It's just not helpful.
So I'm just asking you guys again.
I'm not going to disparage you.
You're grown men.
And you guys who follow our channel and follow me on Twitter, you're not just grown men.
You're good men.
And everybody tells you that you're crap.
Everybody tells you you're racist.
Everybody tells you you're Nazi.
And I'm just not going to do it.
I'm not going to join that team.
I think you're good men.
I'm grateful for you.
I'm grateful for your support.
I wish some of you were older and had your businesses a little longer and were a little bit more successful so you could actually.
Donate more than $10 to our ministry.
It does kind of suck that my following happens to be the following that's just getting started financially.
But the boomers have money and the boomers aren't huge fans of Right Response Ministries.
But the point is this I'm not going to disparage you, but I am asking you, respectfully asking you, let's hold off, especially with Jeff Durbin.
James White might be a little bit different because he's kind of entered the fray and some of you already have too.
Even with that, I would still say, If we can, let's dial it back.
Let's dial it back and honor James White.
We owe him a great debt of gratitude.
I owe him.
I owe James White.
And you do too.
So let's honor him and maybe dial it back there, but especially with Jeff.
Jeff is not on Twitter.
He's not disparaging young guys four times a day or what.
So I just don't think it's fair.
So, all that being said, you guys in the chat, I see you're like, oh, what's the reason?
What's the reason?
He emailed me, and I don't want to read the email because it was personal.
And so I don't want to quote his exact words and betray any trust.
But the gist of it was he said that he just is unwilling to share the stage with Stephen Wolf.
And I am unwilling to disinvite Stephen Wolf because I love Stephen Wolf.
Stephen Wolf is a friend.
And not with everything, I would have some disagreements.
But when it comes to about 95% of things, it's not just Stephen Wolf is a friend, he's also right.
Oops.
Like he's just right.
He's right, you know, he's just right.
And I think that's part of the reason why, you know, certain individuals don't necessarily want to talk.
To him, and I'm not saying Jeff Durbin falls into this category, but others I think don't want to necessarily have conversations with Stephen Wolf, and he's been asking for a long time because I think they kind of have a sneaking suspicion that he's right, also.
I know he's right, and I can say it publicly, you know, because I haven't really picked a fight with him.
I don't have anything to prove.
But others, if they say Stephen Wolf is right, then that's like suicide for them because they've spent the last year and a half saying he's wrong, you know, and so.
Partnerships with Stephen Wolf00:15:39
So, anyways, that's the reason that Jeff gave us.
And I think there are other reasons to be fair.
And again, I don't want to speculate and I'm not going to betray his trust and read, you know, a private email that he sent.
But he did allude to like, there are maybe some other reasons.
Like, I just, over the last few years, I just, you guys, if you follow this ministry, you've seen it.
I'm slowly but surely, you know, continuing.
I'm not done pushing the Overton.
I kind of like some guys kind of, you know, 2020, they came out anti woke, you know, and they pushed the Overton in 2020 and 2020.
And then, you know, around 2022, this end, and here we are, and we're going to build, you know, plant the flag.
Yeah, exactly.
We're going to build a nice little hobbit hole in the Shire here and live here the rest of our lives.
And I still, you know, feel like we've got to go further.
I think we have to go further.
And so I'm still pushing because I don't want to just get back to the 1990s.
You know, I like, I want to go way back, way back.
And so there's a lot of people that need to go back.
Historically, theologically, also nationally, you know, mass deportations.
A lot of people got to go back.
And so, in every sense of the term.
So, you guys have been following the ministry.
You've been seeing.
Yeah, I'm still kind of pushing.
And I think that's what Jeff was maybe alluding to, Pastor Jeff.
Is, you know, number one, the main reason is he just doesn't feel comfortable sharing the stage with Stephen Wolf.
And to be honest, I don't think it's because Jeff is scared or Jeff wouldn't have the talk.
Maybe he would be the one guy who would have the talk.
The main reason that Jeff isn't going to share the stage with Stephen Wolf.
Is because Stephen Wolfe and James White have been going at it like cats and dogs for a couple months now, publicly on X.
And friend enemy distinction, we all follow it.
I'm not advocating for it.
I'm not prescribing it.
I'm describing it.
I'm just describing a reality that exists.
We all abide by the friend enemy distinction.
Well, guess who one of Jeff Durbin's friends is?
Right.
It's not like, oh, this is inside information.
Guess who one of Jeff Durbin's friends is?
Right.
James White.
The elder at, other elder at, his co pastor.
Of course it is.
And that's right.
Yeah.
That's appropriate.
Jeff Durbin, it's appropriate that he would say, Yeah, I now I wish he still would come and hash it out.
We even offered, I emailed back Christine and we offered and said, We'll pay for James White to come also.
So let's get Jeff and James White to come, and I will set up in private.
We could do it, but also, what I advocated for is I would set up publicly in one of our panels a debate, and we could make it formal and time it, or we could do it informal, and I would moderate.
It would be between two on one Stephen Wolf versus Jeff Durbin and James White.
And I'll give it a little bit more time.
Maybe they will take us on that offer.
I don't want to make the decision for them.
I would say probably they won't.
But who knows?
Maybe they will.
But the point is this: we love Apologia, we love Jeff Durbin, and we love James White, and we respect him.
I wish he was handling things a little bit differently online.
And for the record, I'm sure James White thinks the same about me.
Yes, I'm sure he was.
I wish Joel Webbin was handling things a little bit differently.
But, and Stephen Wolf, love Stephen Wolf.
I'm not going to disinvite Stephen Wolf.
I think he's right about a bunch of stuff, and he's one of my friends.
And for me, call me old-fashioned, but I.
Yes, be yes, no, be no.
I'm one of those kind of guys, you know.
So I said yes to Stephen Wolf, and so I'm going to keep saying yes.
And so I'm not going to disinvite him.
But I can see it from Jeff's perspective.
I don't think I would do the same thing.
I really don't.
I think I would just still go and be like, yeah, so let's talk about it.
Jeff is not willing to do that.
My guess is it probably has to do with this whole fifth commandment thing.
The spiritual and ecclesiastical application of it being, I think Jeff is trying to honor one of his premier fathers, James White.
And James White, I think, has been unfair to Stephen.
But honestly, as much as I love Stephen, I want to be unbiased.
Stephen has been a bit of a jerk to James White.
He has.
I mean, Stephen doesn't care.
Oh my gosh, it's so funny.
Stephen will literally just get on X and he'll just be like, you know, other people are like, Brian Sylvain is much more careful.
I mean, Brian will, unless he's tweeting about modesty, you know, and then he'll get.
30 million trolls in the comments.
But when he's interacting with someone, Brian's more careful.
I try to be more careful.
Steven is not careful.
I don't think it's necessarily sinful.
Sometimes it might be.
But Steven, for instance, just for those of you guys who aren't on X, God bless you, maybe you're doing something productive with your life.
But for those of you who aren't on X, I could basically recap it like this Steven will literally respond to James White, and he'll basically say something like, I do not respect you.
Your degrees are fake.
You're a joke.
Sacralism doesn't exist.
Yeah, sacralism doesn't exist.
You know, debate me.
Like, I mean, that's just how Stephen Wolf talks to people.
And I'm not even saying it's right.
But I'm just saying if that's how Stephen Wolf has spoken to James White on more than one occasion, and James White could have handled it in my assessment better, but he was upset.
And I can see why you would be upset when someone's talking to you like that.
And then you get in it over sacralism with Stephen Wolfe and crusades with a bunch of Anon accounts with the laser eyes, which we love.
We love the Anon accounts with the laser eyes.
You're our people.
We love you.
But you got all that going on.
And James White is just, you know, he's just angry.
He's shaking his newspaper, you know, on the front step, you know, of his porch.
And the kids are snickering, you know, as they light another bag full of dog poop, you know, and throw it at him, which is not appropriate and shouldn't be happening.
That's the scene, that's the context.
And then, if you have a spiritual son in the faith, like a Paul and Timothy situation, aka James White and Jeff Durbin, then yeah, like, he, Jeff Durbin's maybe going to back out of your conference.
And that's just the way it goes.
So, I, no animosity towards Jeff Durbin, no animosity towards James White, no animosity towards Stephen Wolf.
I, I know it's crazy because you guys all think I'm extreme, but every now and then there's a few guys who get it.
I'll see every now and then in the comment section, people, there's a few guys who have watched long enough.
God bless you guys.
I appreciate that at least.
You know, three people in the history of the internet have taken notice, but a few of you, you'll chime in, you'll say, Joel's one of the most ecumenical guys in the reformed camp.
And it's a little self serving, but I'd like to think that's true.
And so, anyways, apology is still warmly invited, but I understand that as of now, the answer is no.
And so, where are we going to go from there?
That's the final question.
Where are we going to go from here?
We've got some, I think, pretty exciting ideas.
There's a few different ways to slice it.
But there's some cool ideas.
Yeah.
I don't know.
I have not made a decision because I don't know.
I'm hesitant even how much I should say, but I kind of want feedback.
What do you guys think?
Should we get like a little bit of feedback?
I wouldn't say anything is definitive, but just giving kind of a.
You're going to do it anyway.
Yeah.
Unless Nathan says no, Nathan.
Nathan stops me a second.
Nathan is the shadow elder.
Yeah.
He's the guy who says no.
But he's a deacon.
So that's.
Kind of what you know, Deacon, some somewhat our shadow.
I see that gleam in your eye, it's coming out, yeah.
So, I okay, so we just um, I've just got I think some good ideas.
Um, one is um, and and none of these guys have said yes, so I'm not even trying to put them on the spot.
I'm not, I'm really, none of them have been asked.
That's true, not all these guys have even been asked, but the ones that I'll mention right now have it.
Um, so so one idea is I was thinking about getting the new founding guys out, so I've reached out to them and we're going to schedule a call and talk, and they may want to do it, they may not want to do it.
I may continue to rack my brain.
I may end up not wanting to do it, but I love those guys either way, whether we go with them or not.
They're friends.
They're F R E N friends.
But that would be Nate Fisher.
And I would get that would be kind of cool.
So you lose Jeff, but in this scenario, we'd get the whole team because for the price of Jeff, just being frank, part of this is not, and this is what we offered.
Jeff didn't demand, he wasn't like, my fee is such.
And Jeff didn't do any of that.
But we just offered him a pretty generous honorarium.
And also, he's further and would need to fly and do a hotel and all this kind of stuff.
Whereas these guys are two and a half hours away from us, they're in DFW.
So, in this scenario, I would try to get Nate Fisher, Josh Abatoy, Timone Klein, and I'd also try to get Santiago Pliego.
So, I'd go for the four horsemen.
The four horsemen.
Just get the whole package.
And so, bring all four of them out, and I'd get them.
We're going to be able to have like three or four panels.
So, I'd have all four of them utilize all four of them in a panel.
I would get one or two of them, at least one, but one or two of them, depending on you, audience, and who you guys would like to do a main session to take Jeff's spot there.
And then I would also maybe even make it worth their while and see if they might support us a little bit with Right Response and help us with the conference.
I might even throw in like a sponsored lunch.
Because here's the deal can you grab that book real quick?
Everybody knows.
But for those of you who don't, so.
I literally wrote the book.
I'm not even saying it's a good book, but it is the book, and I wrote it.
So, I don't write many books, but I literally wrote the book, Fight by Flight, all about conservatives and Christians relocating, geographically relocating, going to places that are more winnable, not just retreating, but in advance to the rear, right?
Fighting another battle, one that we can win.
And the new founding guys have projects, like Ridge Runner and things like that, where they're literally starting whole towns that are conservative and Christian.
And I think the timing is.
I went up and visited Nate recently, and if memory serves me, I think the timing of our conference and them kind of unveiling another pop project that I'm not at Privy and I don't even have the details to say where it would be and when it would be.
But the timing would be in that general ballpark to where we're having a conference and they're about to put some new opportunities for relocating to a conservative Christian town out to the public.
And so we could do like a sponsored lunch where we fit the bill, everybody who's interested gets a free lunch, and we could.
I imagine you guys coming to the conference.
Half of the people at the conference would go to that lunch.
You could have a thousand plus people at the conference, 500 of them go to the lunch, and then just have Nate Fisher and Josh Abitoy present for two hours and take QA and stuff about here's our project and here's the cost.
And so that's one option is the new founding thing.
I think that could be a really good partnership with, they're very like minded.
So, like Harris and like Ady Robles and like Stephen Wolf and like Ogden.
I would say our closest allies are probably the Ogden boys.
They're the guys that I make up random excuses to fly to Ogden to go visit them like multiple times a year.
So they're probably the closest allies, but Newfoundland would be, you know, very closely aligned and they're doing great stuff.
And so that's one option.
And then, like, kind of like almost opposite option is maybe we go super normie, you know, and like we've already got, you know, you've already got the Ogden guys, you've got Isker, you've got Dusty Devers, the Christian Prince, you know, just like throwing bills on tables to completely abolish porn and abortion.
And even sexting with inappropriate pictures with someone you're not married to.
God bless them, the Christian Prince, Dusty Deaver.
So you've got your certainly not normie speakers at the conference.
You've got the Ogden Boys, you've got Stephen Wolf, for goodness sake, right?
That's not normie.
That's the real deal.
And so maybe we can afford to go a little bit back to the whole conversation with Michael in the chat.
We can go to Big Con, Conservative Inc.
And so I had, you know, I'm not good at keeping secrets.
This is where Michael was getting up.
But like, so I had a talk with Charlie Kirk, his previous executive assistant.
And here's one of the things so I understand Charlie Kirk is big con.
But I will say this some of you guys, if you know who Charlie Kirk is, Turning Point USA, if you follow him at all, one, I appreciate him.
I don't agree with everything, I would be to Charlie Kirk's right.
I think probably a good bit to his right, you know.
I'm to Matt Walsh's right, you know, as well.
But same thing.
We went and watched the movie, happy to give some money to someone other than degenerate Hollywood, you know.
And so grateful for Matt Walsh, grateful for Charlie Kirk in a general sense.
I do believe he's a brother in Christ and a Christian.
I, you know, maybe not the best theology.
I'm pretty sure he's dyspe and pre mill.
I don't think he's reformed.
But I believe he's a brother in Christ.
He has a Christian profession of faith.
And politically, he does really good work.
He really does.
He's a fighter.
So, I had a talk with a guy that I have a relationship with who was his.
He's since been, he's still with Turning Point, but holds a different position, but executive assistant to Charlie Kirk.
So, you know, friends with him and sees him on a daily basis.
And didn't get a yes.
Charlie's in, it's game time.
It's game time right now with the election and stuff.
So, I won't get to talk to Charlie, you know, or get an answer about that for a while.
But that's like, so maybe we go the normie route.
And what I was going to say about Charlie is one, appreciate him.
But two, I don't know about you guys listening, but.
I have a sneaking suspicion.
I could be, I keep getting disappointed.
You know, like we're constantly, it feels like every day we get disappointed by somebody who like comes out and is like, oh, that's an L, you know.
But I feel like I've seen some W's from Charlie lately and a little bit of moving, moving right.
Yeah.
I feel like he's moving with the Overton and moving faster, I think, than the Daily Wire and a lot of other kind of big con groups.
For instance, we did our MLK, Michael.
Martin Luther King episode, Jr.
And it's like, yeah, he's funded by Jews and he's a Marxist and not a Christian for sure.
Not a Christian.
He's in hell.
He was a heretic and was having an orgy, you know, a night before he died.
So, yeah, not a hero.
Not a hero.
And set the country back was not helpful.
But you know who else did an episode pretty much exactly like ours?
Charlie Kirk.
Charlie Kirk did that episode on MLK.
Like a year ago, it was like everybody else quoting him.
Purity Spiraling into Hatred00:12:42
Like, I just want to get back to Martin Luther King Jr., where it's about the content of the character of the heart and not the color of your skin, you know.
And then in one year, Charlie Kirk just like just red pills into infinity and is like MLK is an op, you know.
And so I've got some hope.
So, anyway, so those are two just big, you know, you could go newfound and you could go, you know, there are different options.
Lots of guys that we love.
But, you know, one option that's still on the table, just want to publicly say, is apology.
It could still come.
So that door is still open.
And if they shut it, which it seems like they have, they shut the door, but we won't lock it from the inside.
We'll leave that door open.
And so, Pastor Jeff and Pastor James, we love you.
You know, we love you.
And if you decide that you want to come back through the door, there will always be a spot.
Even if we get Charlie Kirk, you know, we'll cancel Charlie.
Even if he did say yes, we'll say, I'm sorry, Charlie.
We can't have you.
We don't have room for you.
We've got James White and Jeff Durbin.
Now, I'll just cancel my own session and let them take it.
So, anyways, love you guys.
Thanks for tuning in.
Thanks for following us.
You know, for those of you, there's not a lot of you, but some of you are super faithful and you are supporting us financially.
And it means the world.
You guys on Patreon, that every little bit helps.
That means the world.
We really appreciate it.
But especially you guys who have actually made donations.
You've gone to writeresponseministries.com forward slash donate.
And some of you, like even a couple weeks ago, somebody donated.
$2,000.
And that literally makes the difference.
It just makes the difference of whether or not we can pay Nathan that month.
Like, that's, I mean, that's, it's tight.
It's tight.
And guys dropping your conference doesn't help, to be completely honest.
Again, no hard feelings, but money is tight because we're the guys, we're the Marines making things safe for the Army.
We're the guys who are, like, I could, we could be huge.
You know, all I would have to do is all the opinions I hold today, just wait and say them five years later, like every other coward.
That's what everybody else does, and you reward all those other guys with your money.
And so, if you could, maybe share a little bit with us so that we can stay in business, so that we can go in and make things safe.
Because honestly, if you don't support ministries like Conversations That Matter with John Harris and A.D. Robles and Joel Webbin and Stephen Wolfe and Ogden Utah, Kings Hall, and if you don't support these ministries, big con, conservative, they don't come in five years later.
They only come in five years later because we came in first and made it safe.
And we can do it, and we're willing to do it, happy to do it, honored to do it for a fraction, a sliver of the amount of money you give to the Daily Wire.
But we need at least a sliver because Nathan has to feed his kids.
We can't do it for free.
So that's all I got.
You guys, I know I talked a lot because it was kind of like home based.
It was like personal kind of.
That's right.
And it needed to come from me and Jeff and the conference.
Yep.
So I know I talked a lot this one.
You guys have any other thoughts?
We can keep going.
Can you give like one word answers to the questions that people have?
Did we actually get questions?
I'm so sorry.
Okay.
Let's see.
Brothers, let me read the very top one the super chat.
This is super chat.
Connor, super generous.
They just donate.
Okay.
Okay.
Still, but let's shout them out.
They deserve some praise.
This is super sticker from Connor Sue.
Sue sent the sticker with money.
I'm so sorry.
He sent a sticker.
Gosh, I'm an idiot.
Okay.
This is why I have it.
I used to fly solo, and now I got Michael and Wes.
It's like, because I'm like Alex Jones.
It's like, I'm a little retarded.
So, Connor Suba.
He gave $10.
He gave $10 and just said thank you.
And the only reason we're mentioning it is because $10 means something.
So, Connor Suba, thank you.
In Biden's economy?
Oh, my gosh.
$10 in Biden's economy.
That's like a million bucks.
Thank you, Connor.
Very kind.
Okay.
We did Michael's.
Michael's.
Brothers who constantly purity spy out and counter signal, what do we do about them?
What do you do with them?
This is what you do.
Right?
So, if you're talking about the abolitionists, maybe.
Does he mean like in his personal life or are we talking on Twitter?
Probably.
I think it's probably brothers in Christ, broader sphere.
In the local church, I'm sure, but then also the broader sphere.
This is what I'm doing.
Okay.
So, who was that?
Let's name him.
Let's give him credit.
Seth Evans.
Seth Evans.
It's a good question, Seth.
Thanks.
Thanks for writing it in.
This is my opinion.
Everybody's taking different approaches, right?
So, like, William Wolf is uh, William Wolf is just he's decided he's taking the tactic of uh, ain't nobody got time for that, and he's just he's just dunking on abolitionists right now, left and right.
You know, like, I mean, he's he is not being kind, he's not being charitable, he's just like, we've got an election to win, you guys are idiots.
I, you know, uh, how much is Kamala paying you, you know, and you know, and that that's about that.
Um, that's not my approach.
I love William, by the way, and I understand his tactic.
I'm not saying he's wrong, uh, but that's not the tactic that I've taken.
Um, Dusty Devers is a personal friend, he's coming to our next conference, he came to our last one.
And Dusty gave me a call last week.
And he just called me of his own free will.
I didn't set it up or initiate and said, Hey, Joel, I just wanted to thank you because I've watched you and the way that you're, again, people don't.
You should mention he's an abolitionist.
That's what you're about to say.
So Dusty Devers is an abolitionist.
And he said, Joel, a lot of guys are just going balls to the wall against the abolitionists because of the Trump thing.
And you're not.
And like you're actually being kind.
Like, I did a debate with Ben Zeisloff, and me and Ben are still texting privately, just me and Ben.
And even just today, he shot me a text message about something.
And I think it was White Boy Summer related.
But the point is, I love Ben Zaisloff.
And here's the deal.
Eventually, the election will pass.
And two months from now, you know who I'd like to still be friends with?
Ben Zaisloff.
Right.
Like, C point A, go back to the whole point of this freaking episode have we not lost enough friends already?
Like, I'm tired of losing friends.
Now, there comes a point where it's like your friends, they lose you, and there's nothing you can do about it.
And then there comes a certain point where they're sabotaging your chances of victory, and you've got to call them out.
And that happens, and I've done that.
Um, but man, I want I just don't want to publicly ridicule and cancel another friend every other day.
I'm just tired of it.
So, I like Ben Zaislaw, I think he's wrong about voting for Trump.
And I think if he just wasn't doing it personally, that'd be one thing.
But he's encouraging and seeking to persuade other Christians to not vote for Trump in his state, which is a swing state, arguably the most important one, Pennsylvania.
I think that that is idiotic.
I think he is, I literally think, I don't think he's being paid, but I think it would be worth Kamala's treasure chest, her war chest, to pay Ben's ice off right now.
You have fewer allies who are serving you better than the abolitionists right now if you're Kamala Harris.
I mean, like, that's how I feel about it.
That is how profoundly I disagree.
Here's the deal, though Ben loves the Lord Jesus Christ.
He's my brother, he's my friend, and he's tired of babies being murdered.
And he's tired of just choosing the lesser of two evils.
And I get it.
I disagree, but he's not crazy.
He's not crazy.
And I'm not going to cancel another friendship.
I hope when this election's over that me and Ben will still be friends.
You know, so Dusty and me are friends.
And so I'm so back to the question, Seth Evans.
It's a great question.
Thanks for writing it in.
But what do you do with the guys who are purity spiraling?
I don't know, man.
I think you just try your best to be patient and try to honestly evaluate and say, like, are they purity spiraling?
Maybe I'm compromised, Spiran.
Maybe, I don't know.
Maybe they're right.
You know, like really work it out.
And if at the end, and I did that with the abolitionist issue.
And I got all the way there, all the tenets of abolitionism and their position, except for voting in a general presidential federal election.
That's literally the only thing we disagree on.
And I got blasted by them for disagreeing on that one point.
And I blasted a couple of them, and then I pulled back.
And I said, you know what?
I'm just not going to do it anymore.
I'm not going to blast all of them.
Like Russell Hunter, I'll blast him because we were never friends and he's perfectly comfortable slandering anyone.
So I'll blast him.
But Ben Zaisloff is honorable.
James Silberman is honorable.
Dusty Devers is honorable.
I'm not going to.
So I think what do you do with the purity spiralist?
I think what I'm getting at is pan out.
So they're purity spiraling according to what you perceive.
So first, you could be wrong.
Second, even if you're right, they're purity spiraling in one instance.
Pan out, get the 30,000 foot view.
And who is this?
Like, who are we talking about?
Are we talking about a bulldog who just everything is a bone and he'll never let go?
And that's all he's ever done in every issue of his entire life and every relationship.
He has like a just a rich 15 year long track record of burning every single relationship he's ever had, and everyone agrees it's his fault.
Right.
Because there's a couple abolitionists that fit that bill.
Or is it Dusty Devers, James Silverman, Ben Size?
That's not them.
It's not fair to put them in that category.
So, if that's your purity spiral, then I think you remain friends and you just agree to disagree on that issue and you push through it.
So, you guys want to say anything?
Patience or ignore.
You truly can ignore it.
Yeah, you can ignore.
Perfectly valid.
All right.
What do you think?
Got to end it or is there any other question here someone asked?
Maybe even asked it twice.
Apologies to those that we didn't get to on questions.
This is Baptist 702.
As a black man, I'm only asking if you believe it would be a good thing if my white brethren and congregations should have qualified black ministers.
A little bit of a strange question.
I'm asking if you think.
I think he means, like, if it's not a seven versus a nine or a seven versus an eight, if a white congregation can have a black minister.
Yep, certainly can.
It's permissible.
Yep.
But a good thing, I read that as he said, if my white brethren, so I'm reading that as a church that the demographic is predominantly white.
And if it would be good for that predominantly white church to have a black pastor.
Is that how you read it?
Right.
Yeah.
So I read good in that instance as advantageous.
Advantageous.
So good as far as biblical, permissible, absolutely.
Good in terms of it's an added benefit, no.
Let me give an example.
It's a close family member, so I won't say who or the church.
But he came in and he's pastored a church for a little while, and it's a more insular farming community.
That really like they grew up with each other.
So, this church has been around for 40 years.
He started pastoring in 2020.
And one of the difficulties that has come up is that there just isn't that shared frame of reference.
My dad's not a farmer, he was actually in the military.
This is more pacifist.
It is my father, yeah.
Like Joel, I can't keep secrets.
But it's a community where there's not as much shared, and it's made it difficult.
This is not even about skin color.
And it's not even, right, exactly.
It's just sharing things.
And so, he's come in, he's done a good job of pastoring, but it is difficult, he's realized, to come into people that have 40 years worth of relationship and a certain vocation and lived a certain place that he hasn't.
To come in and minister just because there's not a common frame of reference.
And so, with that, like, well, is it black?
Is it advantageous?
No, it's not.
And actually, being different culturally, it could be a negative.
Not because the skin color is the problem, but because people from different cultures, it can be tough to minister and pastor with people that you don't have a common shared particularity with.
But if you've got a guy that grows up in a church and the church knows him and he goes to seminary and he comes back and he becomes a pastor of that church and he and his family spent their whole life there, like, that's a totally different issue.
Right.
Yeah, we had a few guys in the chat say racist bells are ringing.
I'm sure they are, libtard.
Love Everybody Regardless00:01:20
Shut up.
All right.
What did we decide, Nate?
Did we get 10 guys saying that we should ban the troll?
What do you think?
Okay, it's an even split.
Here we go.
Here's Caesar's decision for the day.
He lives.
Ah.
He lives.
So, troll.
What was his name, Nate?
American wasp.
Dedrick McBusiness.
American wasp.
Dedrick McBusiness.
You live to see another week.
All right.
So, as James White would say, come at me.
Come at me another week.
All right, guys.
We love Apologia.
We love Stephen Wolfe.
We love Ogden.
We love Isker.
We love the abolitionists with Dusty Devers and Ben Zaisloff.
Just a lot of love this week with Right Response Ministries.
Sure would love to see a little bit of that love returned.
It would be great if it was mutual.
So, everybody, love everybody.
I feel like Will Ferrell.
What movie was that?
Semi pro, where he's like, he points to the sign on the bus because people are arguing in the back.
He's like, ELE, read the sign.
ELE, everybody love everybody.
I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.
Like, I'm mixing movies now.
But man, seriously, we cannot afford to shoot our friends every other day to where, in the end, we're all alone.