Knowledge Fight Interactive Search Tool

All Episodes

Previous Next

Oct. 27, 2013 - No Agenda

02:59:18

560: Hornet's Nest

Large

Audio Only |

Scroll

Time	Text
	Hey, you want a cyber?
	Is that what you want?
	Adam Curry, John C. Dvorak.
	It's Sunday, October 27th, 2013.
	Time for your Gitmo Nation media assassination episode 560.
	This is No Agenda.
	Celebrating six years of substance abuse from the Travis Heights high down in the capital of the Grown Star State, a very wet Austin Tejas in the morning, everybody.
	I'm Adam Curry.
	And from Northern Silicon Valley, where I'm happy celebrating the sixth anniversary of the show, I'm John C. Borak.
	That's right.
	And before we start, John, I have to bring something to the table, a huge problem.
	Okay.
	You know how I, well, you have this too, but it's been since the summer.
	Last summer, I've had this problem where songs get stuck in my head.
	Oh, good.
	Well, not so good because all the songs have been replaced and I can't stop it.
	I can't stop doing...
	Hey, kids!
	It's Freddy the Firewall!
	Come on over!
	We have to practice it, so you might as well practice it in your head.
	But it's really...
	But it comes out of my mouth.
	This is the problem.
	Oh, you actually like doing the voice.
	Yeah.
	But this might be your ticket out.
	My ticket out of this hellhole.
	It's time to have some dinner!
	I hope you didn't murder!
	Someone pointed out to me that this is very similar to Towley from South Park.
	I wasn't familiar with Towley until someone showed the video to me.
	Towley, yeah.
	Yeah, and then I was like, oh, I'm not that unique.
	Yeah.
	Well, that type of voice is not unique at all.
	I mean, it's a variation of a lot of them.
	I mean, it sounds...
	Somebody said it sounded a little like Spongebob, but it's not quite as high-pitched.
	No, it's...
	In fact, the cadence is exactly like Towelie.
	And I've only seen...
	I think Towelie is on one episode or something going, Don't forget your towel!
	Want to watch porn?
	Oh, right.
	The Towelie kid.
	Yeah.
	No, it's not even a kid.
	It's just a towel.
	Oh, okay.
	It's a towel.
	My mom would be so proud.
	I'm plagiarizing an imitation of a towel.
	That's right.
	You're not plagiarizing anything.
	Plagiarizing refers to stealing the material, not the voice.
	That's true.
	People have voices.
	That's true.
	You sound like Bing Crosby.
	You're not plagiarizing Bing Crosby.
	Okay.
	Good point.
	Thank you for your courage in that.
	You're welcome.
	And thank you for your courage for doing the Talley voice.
	Thank you for six years of the No Agenda Show, John, the best podcast in the universe.
	Any thoughts?
	Yeah, it's been a long six years.
	I was thinking about, I think I actually verbalized this to Miss Mickey the other day.
	What a strange relationship you and I have.
	Okay.
	Have you ever considered how weird it really is?
	No.
	No?
	Not really.
	Well, I don't think a lot of people realize that the only time we talk is during this show.
	And we're not, we don't hang out.
	Well, we talk, yeah, I know, because if you're talking to some guy for six hours a week, you really don't need to see him much longer than that.
	If we didn't do the show, we'd probably conversate once in a while.
	Not for six hours.
	No, that's what I'm saying.
	Ever.
	No.
	You know, I don't conversate six hours with anybody.
	That's my point.
	Isn't that a weird relationship?
	We don't...
	I mean, when the show is over and when it's done during the week, do you ever think of me?
	No, never.
	Exactly.
	I never think of you.
	Unless I come up with some gem and I think of myself with some kind of...
	As I kind of wring my hands and have people laugh, I say, Adam won't have this one.
	No.
	Got him.
	The bastard.
	Exactly.
	We're in constant competition.
	Except for that moment, which only happens rarely.
	It does happen once in a while.
	I know he's never heard of this.
	Here's my favorite.
	When I get an email with some spectacular analysis or a fantastic link, I'm like, oh, this is great.
	And then I'm like, oh, crappy copy John on it.
	Shit.
	Because then I know that you've seen it.
	Yeah, well, luckily the stuff sent to you is copied to me, but they do the same thing to me.
	Although once in a while, because since I control the, I am the bottleneck when it comes to some of the email addresses.
	Occasionally someone will just send it to the No Agenda show, which goes to my box.
	Right.
	And so then I get the exclusive rights.
	Yeah, exactly.
	But don't you have that moment where you're looking at the emails like, oh crap, he's copied.
	I always check that right away.
	It's not unique.
	I hope so.
	I think that the longer you've been in media, when I first started out, arguably I started when I was 15, I was all cute and pirate radio and stuff, but I started getting paid for it when I was 19.
	And in the beginning, you really care what people say about your performance or your show.
	I can hear you chuckling already.
	As you go along...
	Oh, they don't like me!
	What am I going to do?
	Or, you know, everyone has something to say about it.
	And, of course, it's so easy to do a show.
	It's the easiest thing.
	It's just two guys.
	All we've got to do is get out of bed and yap at each other.
	Nothing else goes on.
	That's what we do, yeah.
	That's all it takes.
	I recommend everybody try it.
	Right.
	And so, of course, we make it look easy.
	But, you know, I've done performances, literally, for most of my life.
	Certainly all of my professional life.
	And as you get older, you know, and now I've been doing this for a while, there's very few people left whose opinion about your show you care about.
	And honestly, John, I can count mine on one hand.
	You're one of them.
	And so I think that's kind of what's still magical.
	And this is the only time that we have private conversations after the show.
	We never have a private conversation before the show.
	We're always streaming, so we roll right into it.
	But there's always...
	There's a conversation at the end of the show.
	Why did you do that?
	You changed the direction of the show.
	We literally have 45 seconds of review.
	And here's usually how it goes.
	Don't ever say that again.
	We're very direct, which I learned from you, which I quite enjoy, actually.
	Well, that's because it keeps the conversation short.
	Yeah, it does.
	And I've learned so much from you in that regard.
	Well, you know, let me...
	Instead of beating around the bush...
	Yeah, let's just say it.
	Let's just get it out.
	Let's say it.
	I have to say it when somebody does that to you, but it's the same time you get over it.
	It's...
	Yeah, no, you get over...
	Well, it took me a little while, John, I have to say.
	The first...
	Somewhere in the first hundred episodes or so, you went off on me, I don't remember what, after the show.
	And you have your moods, you know, like everybody.
	And sometimes I just roll my eyes.
	Other times, like, yeah, he's got a real point there.
	But once I've figured out that it is so much easier, if you don't take offense to something and just take the information...
	It really works.
	We should write a book about that, actually.
	Your wife.
	Honey, you stink.
	Use deodorant.
	Well, I don't quite do it with everybody.
	And this is one particular topic.
	This is one particular thing that only you and I do.
	But I like it.
	I like it.
	But above all...
	You don't do it that much, so it's not a big deal anyway.
	No, it's true.
	The show's so damn good.
	I'm always impressed occasionally.
	Well, I'm not always impressed, but once in a while I go, jeez, you know, I tend to learn something from the show.
	I think the audience gets a kick out of it.
	They like listening to our rapport.
	And it makes you really...
	I understand what people say.
	Wow, I can't watch the news the same way anymore.
	It says we have to be tuned into it 24-7.
	I can see how you can't watch the news that way anymore once you start getting a clue about what bull crap is being propagated by the corporate media.
	It's ridiculous.
	It's kind of a nice loop.
	I don't want to be uppity about it.
	Oh, we're so much better than them.
	But it's just like, can't they try a little harder?
	Mm-hmm.
	And it's kind of a loop that we get into because we're aware of everything 24-7.
	It irritates all the time, but then we have this lovely opportunity to get it off our chest.
	After the show, I'm done complaining.
	I'm okay.
	I don't know about you, but...
	Complaining.
	It's not the same thing that happens to me.
	I have probably never been done complaining.
	I'm just a complainer.
	No, but...
	I don't get an aptitude test once.
	I don't get into it with people that much anymore.
	Oh, well, yeah.
	I just can't, you know.
	I'm the same way.
	I back off on a lot of situations because we already know where it's headed if an argument breaks out.
	Yeah.
	And it's not pleasant.
	And we're not getting paid.
	Yeah.
	Exactly.
	Hey, pay me and I'll talk to you.
	It's like we don't get any.
	There's no compensation at all for getting into a random argument with somebody.
	No, it has to be someone I care about.
	Why am I wasting my time with this person arguing when they don't have the no-agenda background?
	Well, but sometimes...
	The show and disagreed, and then I'm game.
	Yes, and sometimes you want to get some information out of someone.
	You can prod them along.
	It kind of helps.
	But I agree in general.
	That happened at Halcyon yesterday.
	Sir Gene was there.
	Of course, I went along.
	Miss Mickey's still not 100%, so she's still at home.
	So I'm still running the house, kind of.
	Which isn't saying much.
	So after the farmer's market, I had a little sit-down, and then one of the guys who's there, I'd met him once before, and Sir Gene and I were talking about ham radio, of course.
	And this guy's like, Well, the NSA's listening to everything anyway.
	Who cares?
	You know, and I'm like...
	And I was like, and I kind of got into, do you think it's possible that maybe this isn't just like a single whistleblower, that maybe there's more behind this?
	Perhaps there's other agencies that don't like the NSA, and maybe there's internal stuff going on, and they have the goods on other people and politicians.
	And then I just caught myself like, are you crazy?
	Stop this.
	I gotta go.
	I gotta go.
	Anyway, all I'd like to say on this sixth anniversary, John, is thank you for being my partner in this show.
	Thank you for putting up sometimes with my irrational behavior.
	You have Tourette's.
	And above all, thank you for allowing me to consistently and constantly go down into rabbit holes without prejudice Of course, you will mock and analyze once I've come out, but you've never stopped me from...
	In fact, you've encouraged me to go down many crazy rabbit holes, and there's not a lot of people who understand how important that is, to me at least.
	Well, I have discouraged on occasion...
	I don't think so.
	Yeah.
	When you jumped down the wrong hole, I tried to find a better one.
	Yeah, but you've never stopped me from jumping down a hole.
	No, you dig a lot of stuff up.
	You're a burrower.
	I was trying to think, is there like a family name for rabbits?
	Yeah, there is Lapidus, Lapidus, something like that.
	Yeah, I found that word, but I couldn't pronounce it, so I skipped it.
	Is it Lapidore?
	Lapidore?
	I don't know.
	It's a rabbit.
	Genus.
	Genus?
	Is that the...
	Genus.
	The genus.
	It's not a mammal.
	Is it a marsupial?
	No, it's a rodent, I think.
	I am a rodent of truth.
	Here's one.
	Here's an interesting name for...
	Let me get this thing to come up.
	Rabbits?
	No, yeah, there's mammals, obviously.
	There's small, so is a rat.
	There's small mammals in the family Leporidae, in the order of Lagomorpha, found in several parts of the world.
	There are eight different genera, I think that's the correct pronunciation, classified as rabbits, including the European rabbit, Oryctolagus cunnilingus.
	No, no, no.
	Cuniculous.
	Cuniculous.
	Sorry, I got that wrong.
	Uh-huh.
	Cotton-tail rabbits.
	Genus Sylvia.
	It's somebody who's a rabbit guy who knows how to pronounce these things.
	He's going, this, Devorah can't pronounce Jones.
	Just take the compliment and let's move on.
	Who cares about the rabbits anymore?
	And I would like to thank the producers of this program.
	Did you know that the female rabbit is a doe?
	No, I didn't know that.
	The female rabbits are usually tasty.
	And a young rabbit is a kitten.
	Aww.
	And the male is a buck.
	Hell yeah.
	Okay, anyway, I'm sorry.
	Yeah, I want to thank the producers of this show, who caught on very early after we kind of decided, hey, this is real work and we need to be paid to do it.
	And the producers are you, the person who is listening to this program, who has contributed financially or with information or both.
	We have quite an interesting array of cast of characters who surround the program.
	Certainly the chat room have been influential over the years.
	Man, we've had a lot of...
	Just think of the cast of characters and the talents that they bring to the table that have been a part of the show.
	I think it's pretty amazing.
	Well, it is part of the show.
	In fact, they are the producers.
	And I give you credit for making sure that we call them that.
	Because they contribute to the show besides just monetarily.
	A lot of them don't have any money.
	But they also contribute ideas and thoughts and also observations and real facts.
	Occasionally one of them is an insider.
	Occasionally we've got a lot of insiders in all industries.
	And we essentially have put together a network of intelligence agents.
	We are the Rubicon.
	We are the Rubicon.
	We're developing information that is valuable for our listeners and producers and supporters.
	Should we roll right into our execs and then move on with the show?
	Yeah, we have a lot of...
	Obviously, this is an anniversary show, so it's not going to be as dense with information as it will be with thank yous.
	But let's thank our executive producers for this show, which is 560.
	And starting right off with our buddy down there, our 4K... What's the name of his company?
	4K TVs?
	He didn't put it in his note.
	I'll get it.
	Dig it up.
	Duke of Silicon Valley, David Foley, who came in with apparently a 555 membership, plus a 666.66, celebrating six years of the best podcasting in the universe, he writes.
	4kspecial.com.
	Yes, 4kspecial.com, wishing you a continued success and hopefully another six years of no agenda.
	And he came in with $1,225.66, which was very generous in his part.
	Wow.
	And what was it?
	Oh, this is a 559 membership and a huge sack of sixes.
	So he also is...
	Oh, my goodness.
	We got one, two, three, four, five huge sacks of sixes, including James Pyre at Escondido, California, 666.66.
	Thanks for the best podcast in the universe.
	Long-time listener, first-time contributor on my way to nighthood.
	Please de-douchebag...
	Oh no, please douchebag the NSA and give karma to Sinclair, Ed, and Chris.
	Okay, NSA? Douchebag!
	And here's the karma.
	You've got karma.
	Keep up the fantastic work.
	We need more like you that don't just drink the Kool-Aid we are given.
	Blow in Russian hookers for all, as long as the carbon is taxed.
	Dennis Steffens, or Stevens, but it's probably Steffens.
	It's 6666 Parker, Colorado.
	Thank you both for your courage.
	It's been about a year since I donated, so I thought it'd be a great time to provide the best podcast in the universe of value for value.
	Dennis Stephens Parker, Colorado at Parker Tech Guy.
	This will take me over the $1,000 mark.
	I would like to be known as the Mile High Knight.
	Thanks for all you do.
	We need you now more than ever.
	Here's to at least six more good years.
	Have you a member of the Mile High Club?
	I wish.
	I am.
	Oh, good for you.
	Virgin Atlantic.
	Oh, yeah.
	Not in the bathroom, either.
	Oh!
	No.
	Virgin Atlantic.
	What?
	If you're not in the bathroom, it seems risky.
	No, no, no.
	You can't do it anymore.
	The purpose of the sixth anniversary show is not for you to brag.
	Okay.
	I'm sorry.
	Because you should be at the ready with a theme.
	With a theme?
	Yeah, a button.
	You push a button.
	Oh, you're right.
	I suck.
	Here we go.
	Ah, yes.
	I'm sorry, John.
	I was too occupied with my Mile High Club performance.
	Thoughts of the past.
	Yes.
	Thank you for reminding me.
	Please be outstanding for another donation from the Grand Duke, Ron Pelsmockers.
	Grand Duke Pelsmockers.
	666.66 in Belgium.
	ITM gentlemen, happy 6th anniversary.
	I hope this is a good omen.
	The 666 reference for you both.
	And for all knights and dames of the greatest podcast in the universe.
	Thank you for your courage.
	Yes, indeed.
	Thank you, Sir Grand Duke Stephen Pelsmokers of Belgium and France.
	Yes, he has Belgium and France.
	We can't overlook that fact.
	Barron Sir, Dr.
	Sharkey in Jackson, Tennessee, 6666.66.
	Sending a super stack of sixes on Sunday's spectacular sixth anniversary special.
	I suspect the show will be full of surprises, scandals, and sexy cynicism without a snippet of saccharine sentimentality.
	That's pretty good, actually.
	That took some time to put that together.
	Sincerely, Baron Sir Dr.
	Sharkey, please give karma to both your families for allowing us to listen to you.
	That's a good point.
	I think we should thank our families as well for putting up with us.
	You've got karma.
	Honey, trust me.
	Trust me.
	This show will pay the rent one day.
	David Julian, 33333 in Morgan Hill, California.
	Happy anniversary.
	Blue reflector.
	Fire hydrant.
	No agenda.
	I love this.
	David Julian, you're crazy.
	You are nuts, man.
	I love it.
	Somewhere there's some guy sitting in a shack with headphones on going...
	Yes.
	Third time blue reflector fire hydrant?
	Simon Boyd, 33333 in Perth.
	Which I've never been to.
	Congratulations, guys, on years of solid and relevant news deconstruction.
	Recently upped my game to 333.33 from 11-11 a month.
	If there's any boarding passes left, please put me down.
	Maybe they will have fridges that order milk and beer from there.
	Forgot to donate to show 420, so here's some value.
	Oh, one of those guys.
	I get it.
	So there's some value.
	In Perth, 420?
	Yeah.
	Huh.
	Some karma for all.
	Thanks.
	Simon Perth, West Oz, P.S. There's a new jingle suggestion.
	It could be good as a duo.
	With or out harmonica enhancements.
	Dvorak.org, insolvent slaves you must pay.
	I think we've got to work on it.
	Give him a karma.
	He needs one.
	Absolutely.
	You've got karma.
	Stick it to us.
	We have Gavin Bowden, Sydney 270 270.
	He'll be an associate executive producer.
	Happy anniversary, John and Adam.
	And thank you for your courage.
	It's been long since my last donation, so please can I have a de-douching?
	Yes, we'll do that in a moment.
	I have enclosed 666 for both of you and a double 6969, one for me and one for all the other supporters.
	I've heard that NA Karma works, and I need all the love life help I can get at the moment, so please fire some love life girlfriend karma my way.
	Anyway, gents, keep up the awesome work and keep being phenomenal.
	For all our sakes.
	Wow.
	I don't know what I can do with those.
	These compliments are pretty hardcore.
	You've been deduced.
	Let me see.
	Where did I leave the...
	Somewhere I have the girlfriend karma.
	Ah, yes.
	Here it is.
	You've got karma.
	There it is.
	Love Life Girlfriend Karma.
	Anthony Garlinger in Downers Grove, Illinois.
	210.
	Heil, Guardians of Reality, and Freddy the Firewall, thank you for your courage.
	Say hi again.
	Hi, Anthony!
	That one broke up.
	As promised, there's a little tribute courtesy of my recent wedding.
	Please note the amount to 10, which is 21 times 10.
	The 21, a winning score in a game of cornhole, a.k.a.
	bags, bagel, etc.
	And the 10, well, that just puts in the associate producer range.
	If there are no objections, I would like to dub this the cornhole donation and request to hear the cornhole recipe for success jingle.
	What?
	Whenever someone donates this amount.
	Oh, he's trying to set up.
	Ah, he's setting it up.
	I get it.
	So anyone who donates 210, they want you to play that idiotic clip that I... It's the cornhole recipe for success.
	Ah.
	Yeah, if you can find it.
	Yeah, nice reminder that Adam's getting some gigs outside of the No Agenda show.
	Keep up the great work.
	Yes, I'm going to combine that, I think, with the karma.
	Someone's getting cornholed today.
	Sounds like a recipe for success to me.
	You've got karma.
	Yeah.
	That's not you.
	I don't know who is.
	Diana Holt.
	Why don't you say, that sounds like a recipe for success to me.
	Just say it.
	That sounds like a recipe for success to me.
	It's the same guy.
	Someone's getting cornholed today.
	Sounds like a recipe for success to me.
	Wow.
	And finally, Diane Holst, $200.33.
	She's in FEMA Region 7.
	All right.
	Also Iowa.
	And I do have a note from her.
	Is this one of these women who are just shocked about the sexism on this show?
	No, most of the women aren't shocked about the sexism on the show.
	There's only newbies that come along with it.
	Noobs.
	Noobs.
	Some noobs coming.
	What do you expect?
	Just because they've never heard a freewheeling show where you can just say whatever you...
	We are the freewheelers.
	There you go.
	We don't have people taking our advertising money away because we say something that may appear to be sexist when it's mostly observant.
	Yes, I've been exposed.
	I thought I was a casual listener, but when it was pointed out to me that I knew the NA jingles and inside jokes, there was nowhere to hide.
	Please accept this donation and my apologies.
	So she, I don't know what the subtext is, but apparently she...
	Sounds like her man or something.
	No, it sounds like she had to admit this to herself.
	Oh, okay.
	She's like probably grousing about this show and then says, oh, what am I thinking?
	I'm getting it all wrong.
	And then so she donated and became an associate executive producer for show 560.
	Fantastic.
	We do have a show coming up on Thursday, and we want to continue.
	We'll continue the celebration on Thursday if enough people are interested or didn't get in on time, and I think some people missed the deadline.
	So go to noagendashow.com, noagendanation.com, but mainly dvorak.org slash na and channeldvorak.com slash na.
	Jump on the donation bandwagon.
	Let's keep this going.
	For another six years at least.
	We've got two quick PR mentions, which is kind of fun on this show.
	We got an email from B. Hey Adam, after a year at my publishing company, I've finally wormed my way into the office with The Deciders.
	Oh, I need some echo for that.
	The Deciders!
	I have convinced them to launch a Beer S.I.P. Are you familiar with this term, with the acronym SIP? SIP? Yeah.
	Standard Internet Protocol?
	Special Interest Publication.
	Oh, it's like SIG. What's that?
	Special Interest Group.
	There you go.
	Well, though we're relatively small, we have expansive distribution.
	A.K.A. Walmart, etc.
	So we will be able to do something of value that people will actually get to see.
	Here's the opportunity.
	No one around here knows spit about suds.
	If you could reach out to our No Agenda Brewer squad, I can infiltrate the magazine with No Agenda freelance writers provided they are willing to be underpaid, underappreciated, but with the opportunity to subtly slip in hits to the mouth to a national audience.
	I would also like to be in touch with these guys, if there's nothing else, to pick their brains about what they would like to see in a beer magazine.
	So send me an email.
	I'll forward it on to our SIP publisher.
	I think that's kind of cool as a promotional opportunity.
	Yeah, we tried to do stuff with the beers before and it just didn't work out.
	It was one of these dead ends.
	We do this occasionally.
	We come up with some idea and then we got a bunch of beer in the mail and with all kinds of crazy instructions, you got to put the beer aside for...
	Two months and three hours.
	You got something I didn't get.
	I didn't receive any of that.
	I got one beer in a box that was so complicated that we just couldn't deal with it.
	The instructions aren't just open-top consumed?
	No, no.
	You gotta let it age.
	Oh, no.
	You gotta drink it at night.
	On the 30th of the month.
	Check the barometric pressure.
	The 30th of the month.
	Not before midnight.
	It's Satan's brew.
	So I do want to make good on our buddy in Reykjavik, Reykjavik I.O., because Reykjavik I.O. wanted a karma.
	I want to give him a karma.
	Oh, okay.
	This is from Thursday's show, something we messed up?
	Well, yeah.
	This is a long, complicated note.
	Okay, is this the make good?
	Just like, it was a long, complicated note, but we're just going to give him a karma.
	Is that it?
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	Good.
	You've got karma.
	And then...
	It's the most important thing.
	Yes.
	And then somewhere in the...
	It's going on and on about Reykjavik, I.O. and the whole thing, and then talking about my stories about...
	Reykjavik, about the women.
	About the women in Reykjavik.
	And then there's one more link in the PR show notes, which I think might come up later during the donation segment, but just in case.
	The brand new Noagendroid app for Android.
	Oh yeah, right, right, right.
	That's in the Play Store, which apparently has quite a lot going on.
	With show notes and everything is in there.
	Yeah, apparently you get the show notes across this app and the whole thing, which would be kind of interesting.
	We encourage this sort of thing.
	We do indeed.
	And of course, thank you again everyone there in the chat room at NoAgendaStream.com, NoAgendaChat.net.
	Thank you very much to our artists who have been here along for the ride.
	Really probably most appreciated but maybe not always accredited.
	We started crediting them properly a couple hundred episodes ago.
	You can see all of the artwork at noagendaartgenerator.com.
	Thank you, Tice Brawers, for a beautiful piece of art with threaded firewall for episode 559.
	Really, Tice is one of those professional artists who, you know, sometimes he just, he hits it so squarely in the mouth.
	It's just like, wow, and it's always beautiful what he makes, always.
	So we look forward to what we get for a 56046th anniversary special.
	Again, noartgenerator.com.
	And, of course, we always appreciate it when you go out there and continue to propagate our formula.
	Our formula is this.
	We go out, we hit people in the mouth.
	You.
	What?
	Order.
	Shut up, Slade.
	Shut up, Slade!
	Yay.
	All right.
	So, you got anything?
	Yeah, I got a number of things, actually.
	Well, you're the one that went and watched that crazy thing where...
	The only thing I got was this one clip from this douchebag from, I think...
	This is the healthcare...
	The four hours of healthcare.gov testimony.
	Yeah, I got the monkey court thing.
	Yeah.
	Which is worth playing.
	Okay, I didn't even clip that one, but yeah.
	Well, here, just play, because I think we should start with that.
	Monkey court congressman.
	And then I think that sets the stage for your deeper analysis.
	Yeah, so this, just to reiterate this, this was taking place during Thursday's show.
	There was a...
	A congressional hearing about the botched launch of healthcare.gov, the signature legislation doorway, the doorway to the signature legislation of this administration, which is just not working, and so they had the consultants up there in the witness box, and everyone was grilling them, and...
	So once again, here we have my Republican colleagues trying to scare everybody.
	Will the gentleman yield?
	No, I will not yield to this monkey court or whatever this thing is.
	This is not a monkey court.
	Do whatever you want.
	I'm not yielding.
	Who was this?
	It was a guy from Illinois, and unfortunately I wrote his name down on the back of a...
	Let me just say something.
	Because I've seen this clip on television.
	I've heard it for the first time.
	I'm like, this guy is so gay.
	Oh, you think?
	I didn't.
	Oh, I didn't.
	Not until now.
	Let me just hear this again.
	Let me just hear this again about this monkey cart.
	So once again.
	Once again, this is good.
	My God, he's bitching it.
	And here we have our Republican colleagues.
	Republicans who hate gays.
	They hate the gays.
	Trying to scare everybody.
	Scare everybody.
	No, I will not yield to this monkey court or whatever this thing is.
	This is not a monkey court.
	I think it's Banana Republic or...
	Monkey Court.
	I've never heard the term Monkey Court.
	This is like such...
	What is he confused with?
	He's confused with Banana Republic.
	Kangaroo Court.
	Kangaroo Court.
	Monkey Court.
	Or whatever they say in Australia.
	Where the surfers are really hot looking.
	Wow.
	Yeah, that was a low point.
	I thought that...
	Absolute low, low, low point.
	Yeah, that's what everyone clipped.
	So I was actually going to take you in a different direction, but now I'll stick with this because I dropped into a whole different thing.
	Once I hit the C-SPAN and was surfing around, you know, on C-SPAN, c-spanvideo.org, I think, or even on the regular C-SPAN, you can make clips of pieces of the legislation.
	And I'm so proud of some of our producers who are just sending me links.
	And if they pre-clip it, you can put a description in there.
	It's actually, it's really quite a good little piece of functionality they've got there for an otherwise...
	Horrific experience of online video, because c-span.org really is shit when it comes to the video itself.
	It restarts, it does all kinds of stuff, but the searching on the transcript, it really is a great resource.
	I'm very, very pleased that the cable industry does that for us, because we're probably the only people using it.
	I'm sure.
	We're close to being the only ones.
	So I'll take you down that other hole in a second as I get the...
	I found a couple of things.
	I was kind of all over the map.
	The first thing that you may or may not have seen was just a separate bit of Kathleen Sebelius who got berated for saying the following.
	No one has been fired.
	My goal is to actually get the website up and running.
	What is your response to...
	Well, the majority of people calling for me to resign, I would say, are people who I don't work for.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, that's just not a good thing to say.
	That's going to come back and haunt her for a long time.
	Yeah, that's like using you people.
	I don't work for these people.
	I don't work for the public.
	You work for the people, lady.
	Okay, so I'll roll you into this with kind of an obvious statement.
	This is one of the witnesses.
	His name is Slavitt.
	He's from one of the consulting companies.
	It really doesn't matter who has what piece, but he's from QSSI. And he did an end-to-end test.
	Part of the government website.
	And Ms.
	Slava, did you personally try and get onto the system?
	Yes, I did.
	And for what state?
	I think I put it in Texas.
	Is that where you're from?
	I'm not, but I was just testing the system.
	Did it work?
	Well, I logged on to create an account, was able to do so.
	I just never received a confirmation email.
	So it didn't work?
	It didn't work.
	I was thinking about that.
	I don't know if these guys have any idea what it takes to even get that piece of a process right.
	Confirmation emails?
	With the way email is run these days, did they have an agreement with Hotmail and with Gmail and with Yahoo Mail to let all their stuff through and not throw it into promotion tabs?
	Doubtful.
	Doubtful.
	Okay, so this comes down to one issue.
	Four hours of testimony.
	It really comes down to one thing that took place, one thing that happened.
	Already it has been picked up.
	As a political move and is being used against the administration.
	I'm not too sure, but it certainly smells a lot like smoke coming out of the gun.
	And this has to do, when you have a big project like this, the main thing everyone's on the lookout for is a change order.
	And you can have a change order which should be simple across the board that says, okay, the style has changed.
	We have a different background.
	You can have a change order that can be, you know, if it goes into direct functionality, it can affect a lot.
	And change orders are written into these contracts, you know, hey, if you give us a change order within X amount of time before the due date, then all bets are off, risk is yours, and you'll probably wind up, you know, paying by the hour for us to fix anything that doesn't work at the last minute.
	Would you agree that's kind of how it works, John, on these big integration projects?
	I think that sounds right to me.
	So, apparently, some change orders came in.
	...to make this program function efficiently and effectively, and I urge my colleagues to work with us, and let's work with these witnesses to get it right.
	Thank you.
	I'm sorry, I should have clipped that out.
	Here we go.
	Thank you.
	Thank you for being here today.
	I have a series of quick questions.
	It would be fun if one of them said thank you for your courage, but never.
	I'd like to get to...
	Ms.
	Campbell, how many change orders have you received by estimate, either formally or informally, leading up to the launch, in what function that they wanted you to perform?
	We've received approximately eight change orders.
	Eight change orders.
	When was the most recent?
	I believe as recent as August of this year.
	Okay, that's good.
	Mr.
	Slavitt?
	I don't know the answer to that, but I think it was a low number, if any.
	I don't know the answer.
	Okay.
	Are you both making changes now with code in order to fix any of the so-called glitches or non-performance issues?
	Ms.
	Gamble, yes or no?
	That would be yes.
	Mr.
	Slavitt?
	Yes, we make modifications along the way, sure.
	Great.
	And how many organizational boundaries between the piece of information traveling from the United States government to the web portal How many boundaries, how many organizational boundaries, including the states and their access to information, does that piece of information cross?
	I'd have to get back to you with that answer.
	So I'm not quite sure about this guy at Rogers, I think, who was asking the questions, but he was very good and he knew exactly what he was driving towards and knew exactly what to ask next because the most important change order that took place Was the change from allowing someone to come into healthcare.gov and browse around...
	And look at different plans, anonymously, as they say, or let's just call it window shopping without registering, there was a last-minute change order that forced everyone to register.
	Now, in some pieces of this implementation, which is large across multiple systems, it's a very small change, but of course, when it comes to load, And, you know, just general stress on the systems on the back end, that is, of course, a massive change.
	And that came at the very last moment, and there is some speculation as to why that happened.
	Did the White House ever order your company, for political reasons, to mask the sticker shock of Obamacare by disabling this anonymous shopper function?
	So let me answer two things.
	One, I don't believe that members of CGI actually made those statements direct in that manner.
	I think they may have been taken out of context, but I think I'd have to get back to you with confirmation of that.
	And to my knowledge, no, the White House has not given us direct instructions.
	There you go.
	So this is what happened.
	And I think I have a clip where they both say, oh, I have no idea.
	To make this program...
	This one here.
	Before you go on...
	There was...
	Somebody did manage to get to that page that they're talking about trying to get people to avoid looking at, and I have a copy of it somewhere.
	Well, I have a copy of the spreadsheet.
	Yeah, the spreadsheet that shows all these crazy prices?
	Yeah, yeah.
	Holy mackerel!
	Well, so there's a lot of things happening in the insurance world.
	CBS, I have to say, is actually reporting pretty forthright about the not just...
	The website, but also what's taking place with the Affordable Care Act itself and existing insurances.
	Have a listen.
	The Affordable Care Act was signed by the president in 2010, and since then he has repeated one reassuring phrase.
	If you like your insurance plan, you will keep it.
	No one will be able to take that away from you.
	But it is happening.
	The president's health care law raises the standards for insurance policies, which many consider to be a good thing.
	But hundreds of thousands of Americans whose policies don't meet the new standards are being told that their health plans are being canceled.
	Before I had a plan that I had a $1500 deductible.
	I paid $199 a month.
	The most similar plan that I would have available to me would be $278 a month.
	My deductible would be $6500 and all of my care after that point would only be covered 70%.
	So now I'm being forced to choose from a bunch of new plans that I don't want to choose from that are all more expensive.
	So what's happening is a lot of the existing plans are being canceled, and this is happening under the fine print in any insurance policy that says, well, you know, if government says it has to be something else, we'll cancel and then we'll create a new plan.
	And it's funny because I had to pick up some meds for, and I hate saying that, I don't know why I said it, medication for Miss Mickey.
	And I went to the People's Pharmacy, and the insurance that I have had been changed.
	I got new cards on September 30th.
	And actually, it's the same number, but it's a new card.
	And so all of a sudden, I was like, yeah, that'll be $90.
	I said, well, doesn't insurance pay for it?
	No, no, your insurance has been canceled.
	And, of course, I knew it was just an administrative issue, and it took me about 45 minutes to figure it out.
	But the ease with which it was said to me told me that this is happening a lot.
	Like it's the most normal, oh, no, no, your insurance got canceled.
	It's the most normal thing in the world, the way this is thrown out.
	So I think it is taking place.
	I think that ironically, where a lot of people have been trying to bring down this White House, they've really brought wrath upon themselves with this...
	Idiocy.
	And here's the piece of testimony where we find out that no one really quite knows where this last change order came from at the very last minute, which indeed changed the anonymous browsing of prices and plans to a registered process, and in fact not just registered to browse them, but a lot more to it.
	But no one really knows who gave the order, except there seems to have been some kind of meeting at the White House.
	Chairman from Pennsylvania, Dr.
	Murphy.
	Ms.
	Campbell, when healthcare.gov went live on October 1st, it was not possible to browse the site in order to see the prices you had to register.
	Who made that decision?
	CMS made that decision.
	Who within CMS? I don't have the exact name of the person.
	I would say Henry Chow.
	From CMS. And are you aware of any White House involvement in that decision process?
	I am not.
	Okay.
	So what challenges arise when you switch a website where individuals can browse to one, just browse, versus one where you first have to register?
	Does this require a substantial amount of work?
	Well, it definitely puts an additional burden on the system.
	Do you have to write a new code to make that happen?
	Well, for us, to turn it off, it was just putting a flag in our system to not allow for anonymous shopping.
	And how much more time does this then take, then, to test a system like that once you've made those kind of decisions?
	It became part of the normal testing process.
	But you never tested the whole system, right?
	CGI did not.
	Okay.
	Now, to Mr.
	Slavitt, when were you made aware of the decision that the website would not allow browsing and would require registration first?
	We weren't made aware of this until the final days prior to the launch.
	The final day being what date?
	I believe it was within 10 days.
	Do you know who made that decision?
	I don't know.
	We don't know who made the decision.
	We don't know when the decision was made, and we don't know why the decision was made.
	And are you aware, but it was someone from CMS, HMS, the administration, the White House, do you have any idea?
	We don't know.
	Yeah, we don't know.
	Okay.
	So now I think it's Daryl Issa.
	Who is, of course, digging down as deep as possible.
	And I think it's plausible.
	I think it's very plausible.
	Having looked at that spreadsheet and having heard what's taking place, it appears to me, John, and maybe you have a different feeling, but the insurance industry, of course, which is the financial industry, insurance is finance.
	Warren Buffett, big insurer.
	The money guys are all in insurance.
	This is where big, big money goes.
	So it's not just...
	That Obama's number one group of contributors was the insurance company.
	This is what I'm about to say.
	Which is why he didn't go single-payer when he had this House.
	I don't think when he got elected president he expected to have the House and the Senate with a supermajority in the U.S. Senate where he could have ramrodded anything through because he had the...
	In 2008 when he was elected, the public was way behind him and he could have said we're going to do single-payer socialized medicine...
	Vote, yes, let's do it, and they would have passed it, but no, he stalled.
	He didn't want to do that because he doesn't want that.
	He wants the insurance companies.
	He needs to pay them back.
	And I think that he, or it's not fair to say he, I think that the president and his Chicago cabal, including Valerie Jarrett and all the scum.
	Yeah, he represents the grotto.
	That they did not expect the insurance company to fuck them.
	I'm telling you.
	I'm sure you might be right.
	They probably had a great song and dance.
	Go with this.
	It's going to be great.
	Your name's going to be attached to it.
	It's Obamacare.
	Exactly.
	And then they turn around and they shove it to him.
	They really are.
	I mean, they're really, really screwing him and, of course, the American public at the same time.
	Yeah, well, this woman who said she had the $199 a month plan that gave her all these benefits and now it's $270 and she doesn't have any of the benefits.
	She's got higher deductible.
	Everything's going to cost a lot more.
	My son's fiancee, Jessie, had insurance and then she's working at a cheese making operation and she lost her insurance because she went to go do something else and so she had to take in, you've heard of Cobra.
	Yes.
	Which is an extremely expensive kind of a bridge.
	Yeah.
	Was it for 60 days or 90 days, I think?
	90 days of COBRA, and you can extend it, but it's extremely expensive.
	So if you have some healthcare provider and you're working for a company, they offer you COBRA, which keeps it going, because there's something about that way you can kind of...
	It's all bull crap, because that way you can kind of stretch it.
	It's like you're still getting insurance, then you can get a different plan, and it's all kosher.
	It's a bogus situation.
	It's the Consolidated Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act.
	Yes, and it's extremely expensive.
	She got Cobra and then she looked at the Obamacare.
	It was $30 less than Cobra, which is the most overpriced thing in the world.
	She was just aghast at the cost.
	She can't afford it.
	No.
	No, and the deductibles are up to $5,000.
	It's quite insane.
	And a part of this, and this is why this Zeintz guy, and we have one of our producers, Steck, who's in the Chicago area.
	He goes down a rabbit hole and comes out in Australia and goes, where's the rabbit?
	But the stuff that he digs up and passes along is quite refreshing.
	He sent me a link to a story from July 2010, and there we see, all smiling, we have Jeffrey Zients.
	He's the guy who's been brought in to fix it.
	He was the chief performance officer of the U.S. government, remember?
	Oh, yeah.
	Along with Vivek Kundra, chief information officer, and Anish Chopra, assistant to the president and chief technology officer.
	These were the guys who put the dashboard, the IT dashboard in place, who were all about, all about healthcare and automating it and the data.
	And this is Todd Park, who was our current Chief Technology Officer, who somehow is not mentioned anywhere, who came from Health and Human Services.
	In his role at Health and Human Services, he served as a change agent, an entrepreneur in residence, helping HHS harness the power of data, technology, and innovation to improve the health of the nation.
	This is on the whitehouse.gov biography page.
	He, by the way, is the founder of Athena Healthcare.
	Oh, I did not know that.
	Yes, and check this out.
	So, remember last year or the year before they had the Healthcare Datapalooza?
	Yeah, vaguely.
	Remember?
	And it was like everyone's excited.
	This is essentially a place for these consultants and insurance companies and anyone who's associated with, what is it, the ABC Co?
	What is it, the, hold on, the, what is the name of that drinking club we talk about?
	American Business, whatever it is.
	The thing that...
	Yeah, yeah, those guys are in.
	Science is a part of, yeah.
	So, you know, that's like, it's a big consultant meeting, and Park, of course, is speaking at it.
	And I go look at the page, and there's a 2014 conference coming up.
	Hold on a second, I'll bring up the link here.
	Health Datapalooza.
	Number one sponsor?
	Athena Health.
	The guy's own company is sponsoring this crap.
	So this guy's the CTO. He was a, apparently, he's been in the government as a CTO since 2009.
	He feathered this guy.
	He's first a CTO of the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services before he became the Chief Technology Officer of the United States.
	How come this guy's not being grilled?
	I don't know.
	Shouldn't he have something to do with this?
	Should I tell you why I think?
	I think this guy has power.
	That's a possibility, but the other thing is, this job is bullcrap.
	It's a waste of the taxpayers' money.
	He doesn't do anything.
	He's got no job at all.
	This is just a payoff.
	What did Nish Chopra ever do?
	He went around from place to place and gave speeches.
	No, this is a disaster, this whole thing.
	I want to hear what ICE has to say.
	Oh, no, ISA wasn't there.
	I don't have ISA. Oh, I thought ISA was there.
	No, no, no.
	ISA is taking meetings with these consultants, digging in, and everyone knows it, but no one knows.
	That's why they're asking these consultants, well, what did you find out?
	What does ISA know that we don't know?
	Did this order come from the White House?
	Now, we have a lot of really smart people who listen to the show, and I got some analysis that I went, oh, well, of course.
	So now we have, so Zients is brought in.
	Now this guy has been in before.
	I believe that these guys were all in.
	They knew this was coming, of course, in 2010.
	So we had the Indian Cabal, as we've called them.
	They set everything up.
	They set up their outside guys, including, yeah, the Advisory Board Corporation.
	Now the Advisory Board Corporation, what they do is they are consultants to the healthcare industry.
	And they were getting the...
	In fact, I have a little clip here from...
	Let me see if I can find the...
	The title of the clip is, Is Your Company, Insurance Company, Ready for the Patient Tsunami?
	So they were preparing everybody because they saw this as a huge...
	Boondoggle!
	Big, big, big money coming 24 million people are going to burst through your front door Will you be ready for them?
	Insurance companies are already competing Just to be listed on the exchanges And their plans are going to be ranked To make comparison shopping easier Shit See, they knew it was going to be great.
	When the exchanges go live, it can net the insurance company's 24 million new customers who will then become your new patients.
	And these patients may be young, have a limited education, or speak a language other than English.
	They may even have unmanaged or undiagnosed chronic conditions and minimal experience with preventive and elective care.
	Pretty interesting what they were preparing.
	This is for the health care providers, I guess, what they were preparing them for.
	Not the people you're seeing standing next to the president, apparently, on television, but for immigrants who don't speak English who are sick.
	Very interesting what this advisory board corporation is doing.
	So all these guys set everything up, ready for the big bonanza.
	They got out and they went to companies where they can go, you know, make money off their stock options or whatever.
	And then, oh crap, someone effed it up.
	Now they're coming back in and trying to fix stuff, but here's the analysis I got.
	We have this deadline now, November 30th.
	It's going to work, right?
	Which is one of those things, rule number one in management of these projects, never ever do that.
	Don't say it's going to be done by a certain date.
	It's dumb.
	That's what you do.
	Soft launch.
	Beta.
	Public beta.
	There's a million ways we mask this stuff.
	You don't say, it'll work!
	I'm going to presume that, and if this is not the case, then I would be not just highly surprised it would be flabbergasted.
	I'm going to presume that across the board, before this change order came in, when things were working 10 days before, perhaps the White House said, oh my goodness, we can't have people just seeing all these prices.
	We have to have registration and slow down the process and get them in before we show them anything.
	I would be surprised if none of these companies were using a versioning system.
	So it should be very easy to say, guess what?
	Let's all roll back to 10 days before the rollout and deploy.
	It should work.
	That's how software is built in the big boy world.
	Yeah, well, I got a clip here.
	I wasn't going to play it, but now I want to play it, which is that we're not dealing with what you and I and most of our listeners kind of understand.
	Clay Johnson was a member of the Obama administration, and he...
	He's a developer that put together the original 2008, before he became a member of government, and then I guess got ousted.
	In 2008, he put together the Obama websites.
	Ah, right.
	And he is talking on Democracy Now!
	about the situation.
	Hmm.
	Well, government doesn't have a lot of people to choose from when they're looking for contractors to build this stuff.
	And I think part of the problem is that the same people that are building drones are building websites.
	When government is building a website like this, they have to use a system called procurement, which is about 1,800 pages worth of regulation that all but ensures that the people who are building this stuff are the people with the best lawyers, not the people with the best programmers.
	And so, you know, you have this sort of fundamental lack of talent amongst the contractor ecosystem that's building the stuff that it's bound to be bad work.
	That combined with the fact that in 1996, Congress lobotomized itself by getting rid of its technology think tank called the Technology Assessment Office.
	So when they're writing bills, they don't understand the technology that they're requiring in their laws.
	This is what you get when you have a Congress that is basically brainless on technology and government who can only pick from a few old stodgy contractors.
	You're bound to have this result.
	And in fact, the standings group came out earlier this week and pointed out that for all procurements over $10 million, 94% of them fail.
	Yeah, I'm still not buying a no-versioning system implementation.
	That seems very unlikely to me.
	It seems like this should be able to be rolled back to when it was working.
	Yeah, I am on the opposite side of this argument.
	I'm with this guy.
	Really?
	There is no versioning.
	They would have done that.
	Really?
	You're telling me there's no versioning?
	Yeah, that's what I'm telling you.
	How come there's four hours of testimony?
	How come there's not one single, single representative of our government who represent you in the People's Republic of California or me in the great nation of Texas?
	Because we're our own nation.
	They can ask this simple question.
	Well, I think now that you brought it up, you can play Clay Johnson Part 2.
	What about CGI, the main contractor here?
	Have you had any experience with their track record in the past?
	I've never worked with them directly, but I can tell you from watching the hearing yesterday that from a technologist's point of view, both the questions from Congress were sort of absurd and not particularly helpful, and the answers from the contractors were also just demonstrably ignorant of the technology that they were managing.
	And so you have these bizarre exchanges where a member of Congress is asking the Vice President of CGI Federal about code inside of the website that isn't even being displayed.
	And isn't even relevant to the user.
	And the VP of CGI Federal not even recognizing that it's not displayed and not even relevant to the user is this really baffling set of exchanges.
	It's like watching my one-year-old argue with my cat.
	Yeah, no, I'm with him on that, too.
	I'm on his side.
	Yeah, these are managers.
	Yeah, it's very typical.
	It's very, very typical of a project like this.
	But I'd just like to know, can someone who gets out of the house, which would not be you or I, because we just armchair it, could someone please ask this simple question?
	Is there not a versioning system?
	And hopefully...
	I mean, listen, GitHub.
	Hello?
	Hello?
	GitHub would be great.
	It's free!
	I would put money on them not using GitHub.
	GitHub was developed by Linus Torvalds as the de facto versioning system for all modern software developing.
	And a lot of what they would need is actually in this.
	I mean, there's lots of different versioning systems you can use, and I'm sure they would never use a public system like GitHub.
	They would use any other number of systems.
	It may be still something from the mainframe world.
	I don't know.
	But that's how you do it.
	That is basic.
	Even I know this.
	So if they can't roll it back to pre-the change orders, then forget about it.
	Then November 30th is not going to happen either.
	And what I'm hearing, interestingly enough, There's a lot of noise out of Washington, D.C. saying that this is all going to drive single-payer health care.
	Have you heard this at all?
	Yeah, this is a subtext.
	In fact, even Sean Hannity on one of his shows...
	Yeah, this is why I'm suspicious, because I'm thinking that this is wishful thinking or something.
	Well, he's not advocating it.
	No, no.
	He was just saying it, and yeah...
	I don't know what your suspicions, where they stem or where you think they're headed, but yes, the right wing is talking about this.
	I haven't heard Rush Limbaugh say anything.
	Yes, no, no, he's also saying it apparently.
	Okay, that wouldn't surprise me.
	Now explain why, explain just so we understand what is the difference between what is being shown now and single payer, and why would the right wing be against it?
	Well, the right wing, why would they be against it is the interesting question.
	Or why would they be, maybe they're not, maybe they're propagating it for a reason.
	No, I don't think so, because single payer is essentially, I'll explain for people who don't know, most people I think do, but single payer is essentially the model of Medicare.
	It is government healthcare.
	Essentially, you go to the doctor or you go to a hospital and you show your Medicare card and then the single payer is the government.
	And so everything is based on a fee schedule.
	So you can't You can't take the price of some pill and then triple the price because you know the insurance companies are going to pay it because they will, and that's what's been going on with the health care going up is because the big pharma is just gouging.
	Right, but arguably Medicaid or Medicare is doing the same thing.
	Medicare.
	But Medicare is paying those prices too.
	No, no, Medicare is paying...
	Medicare is paying some of it.
	Medicare, though, if you ever get the pure single...
	That's because they're fighting against the...
	There's a big fight going on because you can't have this mixed system with kind of single-payer on the one hand and then open warfare on the other with all these insurance companies.
	So what would happen once single-payer went in place, which means some people call it Medicare for everybody.
	Some people just simply call it single-payer, which means it's all coming from one pot.
	When it's all coming from one pot, the government can say, wait a minute, why are you doubling the price of this product out of the blue?
	I get it.
	Now I know why.
	The Republicans are using this as leverage.
	They're floating this to probably to get money out of the insurance companies to say, oh, you know, this is such a debacle.
	You know, we could push towards single payer, but you're not going to like that.
	Maybe you should be financing my 2014 re-election, Ron.
	That's a cynical approach.
	I think you're probably right.
	I think you may have nailed it.
	Gee, why am I cynical?
	Yeah, exactly.
	That would explain a lot of it because the way single-payer is being dropped into...
	There was a woman on...
	There's a couple of organizations that are promoting single-payer.
	And single-payer was the thing that...
	Obama, like I said a few minutes ago, could have pushed through right away and it would have been over.
	The whole fight would have been done because everybody would have been on Medicare.
	Quick question.
	In the single-payer system, how is the money to pay for this extracted from the citizenry?
	Taxes?
	Just pure taxes?
	Well, now it's a combination of taxes and a fee.
	So if you're a Medicare recipient, you have to pay in, it's very little money.
	It's like a couple hundred bucks, which amounts to a tax, an additional tax for you because you're outstanding.
	This is essentially the British.
	Right now, you can't take Medicare out of the general funds because it's only applicable to a few people in the population.
	If it becomes applicable to everybody, in other words, it would be called Medicare for all, then there wouldn't be anything.
	It would become straight out of the tax pot.
	So it's very similar.
	So a single-payer, full-on system would be like the British health system.
	Or Canada.
	Canada's a better example.
	Right, because the Netherlands is off it now.
	The Netherlands now effectively has Obamacare.
	They actually rolled it out successfully Right, but we know that the Netherlands, as you've said over and over again, are the closest thing to more corrupt in terms of...
	Oh, it's horrible.
	Oh, no, it's horrible.
	So for the Dutch to go off of single pair to this kind of thing, which is a gouge system, it's unconscionable.
	And we saw it happen.
	We saw it happen when we were...
	Remember, Miss Mickey was stuck in exile...
	The changeover date was January 1st, 2013, and we saw all the ads, and it was slick, man.
	It was really, really slick, but they had the IT part worked.
	Of course, that was done, you know, every...
	I mean, the Dutch government, I think, is just a bunch of guys who sit there in Parliament.
	Everything is commercial.
	Everything...
	The Dutch people have no idea...
	And they went, oh, okay.
	And now everyone's paying more.
	Their services are less.
	Doctors are leaving the profession.
	It's exactly what Obamacare is.
	Exactly the same, except the Dutch are just silent.
	Let's argue about Black Pete's.
	You morons.
	Okay.
	All right.
	So this is very interesting because I know you noticed it, and I noticed.
	I'm like, hey, wait a minute.
	This is going towards single-payer.
	Everyone's kind of talking about it.
	So this must be the leverage, and it's possible...
	I'm not quite sure where the leverage is or who has it.
	Well, I can say this.
	Single-payer has been talked about for 20 years.
	Right.
	And it's used, and now that you mention it, I think it's always been used.
	And I think maybe Obama got a lot of that millions and millions of dollars from the insurance companies by hint because he was a single-payer guy.
	Right.
	And so why would all of us, if he's for single-payer, why do all these insurance companies, why are they coughing up all this money?
	Right.
	Because they're out of business with what single-payer goes through.
	They would be absorbed.
	It would be a pass-through.
	It would take a while.
	It wouldn't be overnight.
	They'd be shut down.
	But they're doomed.
	Right.
	So why would Obama, who ran essentially on a single-payer message, why would he get so much money from insurance companies and then not execute single-payer?
	This is not...
	You know, he obviously...
	They leveraged the insurance company and said, look, here's what we're going to do, but wait, maybe we can put this off.
	We could use some money in the campaign coffers.
	It wouldn't hurt anybody.
	Worst case scenario, it doesn't work out for you, but good chance that it might.
	Interesting.
	I personally think it would be better to have a single-payer system.
	I've always felt that way.
	It's funny because there are certain things in America that I'll call capitalistic socialism.
	The other day, the only one in all of Texas, as far as I know, is the Wheatsville Food Co-op.
	And I don't know if people are familiar with the concept of a co-op.
	But I like it.
	Am I nuts to like this?
	Am I some kind of commie now that I like this co-op thing?
	Well, you've always been something of a commie, but that's because you're from Holland.
	Although they don't seem to be holding up their end of the deal.
	Let me explain.
	The co-ops are very popular in California, and they get very popular during the...
	Depression.
	Depression.
	Now, in France, for example, co-ops are part of the culture.
	They're built into everything.
	In fact, if you go to a wine-growing area...
	There will generally be one or two, or sometimes even more, co-ops.
	And in famous wine-growing areas, as a matter of fact, you go to Saint-Emilion, there's this...
	Number of co-ops.
	And the co-ops are for the very small growers who eke out a living.
	They bring all their grapes into the co-op and they can either bottle it under their own label at the co-op with free help from the consultants and all the rest of it.
	Or they can put it into a blend of other grapes.
	Everybody, a whole bunch of these, and then they all share in the profits from some regional wine.
	And this has been a way of doing business forever.
	In France, it's extremely co-op oriented.
	We come in and out of it because people...
	How can you compete with that?
	It's unfair to small businesses.
	This is a small business.
	That's what I like.
	Let me explain for people who don't know what we're talking about.
	So this Wheatsville Co-op, they have two stores in Austin.
	It's a grocery store.
	And it's kind of a mix between...
	What we call H-E-B here, which is just like a Ralph's in L.A., kind of like a regular convenience store, and a Whole Foods.
	But the prices are, in some cases, interestingly enough, cheaper than the market where the same products are sold by the producers.
	So, for instance, the pickles that I get and the rattlesnake oil.
	It's 80 cents cheaper at this store than the actual people who make it, who sell it at the Austin Farmers Market.
	Now, this, of course, has reason because of bulk, etc.
	And the way it works is you can walk into the store and just buy whatever you want.
	And you don't have to be a member or anything, or an owner, as they call it.
	But if you become an owner, then you have a vote.
	And one owner, one vote.
	You vote on the board members, and you vote on what is done with the profits.
	And it's a very simple majority...
	No representative stuff or anything like that.
	You own one share, and you get one vote, and the majority vote wins.
	And it's really nice because you do feel like you have some kind of influence, and the prices are good, and it typically has the products you want.
	And everyone's nice to me!
	That's my favorite part.
	Hello!
	That's weird.
	Hello, are you an owner?
	Why, yes I am.
	Here's my owner card.
	Oh, so nice.
	And I say, how are you doing today, Rachel?
	Why, thanks, owner.
	And, you know, so they're not in it for profit.
	They're in it for growth, certainly, but not for insane growth.
	And I have to say, I think it's a very nice system.
	And I don't think it's...
	Well, anti-American.
	This is funny.
	I can't think of the name of this operation called Vinium or some crazy thing like that.
	And they just had a meeting.
	They have this meeting where it's a co-op-like organization.
	It's actually done out of France.
	And it's a co-op for making wine from everyone contributes a certain amount of grapes.
	But it's making one or two barrels of wine.
	And the people that are in the co-op are all billionaires.
	And the whole reason for the co-op is so they can have their own label, their own wine that they can claim that they blended.
	Well, of course, this is the opposite of what the whole purpose is.
	Right, right.
	Well, then there's that.
	Yeah, then there's that.
	Well, anyway, so I think I'm, at heart, I'm kind of a single-payer guy.
	All I know is it's messed up.
	I know that all I see...
	Anything's better than this.
	Yes, and all I see happening is general practitioners leaving, just leaving, leaving the practice of medicine because they're being replaced by your healthcare provider.
	Which is pretty much a registered nurse.
	Nothing against registered nurses.
	They're great.
	But a registered nurse who is applying the Band-Aid.
	And for this you have to go see a specialist.
	And the specialists are going to start making out like bandits.
	But the whole thing is, it's very, it's wrong.
	Everything is wrong about this.
	And meanwhile, just to move it along a little bit, here's John Kerry, our Secretary of State, pontificating about how awesome we really are.
	I've often said that America is not exceptional Because we talk about ourselves as being exceptional and beat our chest and stand up and say we're exceptional.
	It's not because we say we are.
	It's because we do exceptional things.
	And we've always done that.
	We're the nation that defeated the axis of powers and then invested billions of dollars in their recovery and we never asked to be paid back.
	Alright, so I'm playing this for a reason to say...
	We have lots of asking to be paid back things going on.
	We always ask to be paid back.
	I know.
	I'm playing this to say, you know, our government is lame.
	Not our system, but the execution.
	I'm sorry, and now I'll get down to the hole I was in.
	So example right here is this healthcare thing which is just very typical of our exceptionalism.
	We exceptionally suck in a lot of things that we've allowed our government to take over.
	And this is a great example.
	Now the other thing is this whole NSA spying business.
	And this is kind of what I fell on.
	While looking at the healthcare stuff.
	I don't know if you saw this, but the Emperor, Herr Kaiser Alexander, did an interviewer with a Department of Defense blogger.
	Did you see this?
	Oh, I'm so happy.
	Yes, no, no.
	He did an interview with the Department of Defense blogger.
	Now, let me explain a few things.
	When you do an interview where you control the interviewer, it's called propaganda.
	It's not called journalism or an interview or anything like that.
	Now, the I Spy No Lie is the title of the blog post, and this was done by Jessica Tozer, who blogs for the Department of Defense.
	And it gets even better because this 30-minute interview, which of course was edited, consists of Herr Kaiser Alexander sitting on a chair in a corner of his command center, Her questions are not heard.
	There's title cards.
	She's just sitting in the chair.
	You don't even hear her ask a single question.
	And throughout the entire thing, they've put some Star Trek space music in the background.
	Like, this is going to ease me listening to his answers.
	And at the end of this interview, and I actually went back and found another clip from him, I am going to tell you that not only is...
	Kaiser Alexander, a maniacal, megalomaniac, insane, bubbling, moronic idiot.
	I don't think he has any of the capabilities that are being leaked.
	I think he is playing in a sandbox.
	I think he is afraid of other people in government, which I can pretty much prove.
	And he is just an overgrown douchebag Who I think is probably lying about what he can do at all.
	The man is not well in his head.
	He has a funny look about him.
	I made really short clips in general all about 40 seconds.
	But I do have a couple, because this was a 30-minute interview, and I was astounded.
	Instead of pulling clips, I recorded the whole thing and had to cut it up, because it's just too much this guy is saying that proves he is not right in his head.
	Because America, the United States, runs on cyber.
	You know, we do our banking online.
	Everybody has iPhones.
	You have iPads.
	You have computers, computer networks.
	The finance industry runs on computer networks.
	You hear this music?
	What's the point of that?
	It sounds like some sort of a cheap...
	It has a funny, eerie quality.
	Very eerie.
	It's like some sort of a...
	Yeah, propaganda.
	This is like that thing you did one time, the propaganda bit.
	You mean the Hague thing?
	Yeah.
	Protect their freedom?
	Yeah, this reminds me of that.
	Intelligence work takes place within a strong legal framework.
	We operate under the rule of law and are accountable for it.
	In some countries, secret intelligence is used to control their people.
	In ours, it only exists to protect their freedoms.
	So, he's talking about cyber.
	Cyber as if this is some kind of thing.
	Now, cyber, where I come from, means cyber sex, but okay.
	And that probably means...
	Let's say if you say, hey, want to go cyber to some girl online, or boy.
	Hey, you want to cyber, babe?
	You want to cyber, huh?
	Yeah.
	Hold on a minute.
	I'm going to write that down.
	Hey, you want to cyber?
	Is that what you want?
	All right, go on.
	Somehow when you say it, it's super creepy.
	Yeah, well, that's because I'm doing my super creepy voice.
	We have the power runs off of data systems.
	Just about everything in our lives runs on computer networks.
	And most of those are not as secure as they need to be.
	And we are seeing, and if you look at over the past year and three months, about over 350 distributed denial of service attacks.
	Ooh!
	350 distributed denial of service attacks.
	What?
	Remember, this is...
	There's like 350 a day.
	And how much money is this guy getting for his department for this?
	I mean, he literally is talking, this is the level he's talking about.
	And to me, as we go through these clips, it is so insulting on so many levels.
	Yes, I understand a lot of people don't necessarily understand how the internet works, but a hell of a lot of people do.
	On Wall Street.
	And we've seen destructive attacks against Saudi Aramco in August of 2012.
	Yeah, who cares?
	Are you protecting Saudi Aramco now?
	And we saw destructive attacks against Rosgas.
	Are we protecting Rosgas now?
	That's not our companies.
	In 2012, August, the one against Saudi Aramco wiped the data and destroyed the content of the data on over 30,000 computer systems.
	Now, I don't know if he believes what he's saying, John.
	But the story, as I read it and as I understand it, is there was a virus and there were 30,000 desktops that were infected.
	He's equating Windows workstation desktops to 30,000 data systems.
	You know, it's called IT management.
	You know, you've got to have some protection.
	So yeah, your computer...
	I mean, you're telling me that important data is stored on individual workstations?
	You don't have a backup?
	And lost forever.
	Forever, and it's gone, and you don't have a backup?
	This is fear-mongering and bull crap.
	Okay, keep playing.
	It's good.
	And then a similar impact on South Korea in March and again in June.
	Remember South Korea where all of a sudden the TV network flickered?
	Remember that bullcrap report?
	He's just propagating lies.
	2013.
	So we see distributed denial of service attacks going on.
	We see a lot of exploitation of intellectual property.
	Exploitation of intellectual property?
	Theft of intellectual property.
	Theft!
	Theft of your...
	Visa, MasterCard type data, your social security numbers, all of this.
	And you see disruptive and destructive attacks.
	Okay, so that's kind of his setup for why the NSA exists at all.
	I didn't hear a single thing about terrorism, or it's all about protecting our freedoms, essentially.
	So now we have to bring it all together.
	This is the Kaiser talking about iPhone, Cyber Command, and the NSA. An iPhone.
	Okay, so they're great, right?
	And you get to do neat things on it, and you've probably got all these apps that you can do.
	The problem with the iPhones and all the current phones is they're not as secure as your landline system.
	What does that mean?
	They're not as secure as my land...
	The iPhone is not as secure as my landline system.
	What does that mean?
	I don't know.
	What does it mean?
	I don't know.
	But we would like to use those for iWallet, right?
	And for...
	And he has this annoying Silicon Valley thing where he goes right at the end to...
	Oh, yeah, right.
	So you don't question what he's saying.
	Banking and for all these other things.
	So we've got to secure that infrastructure.
	So there are things...
	No, no.
	It's not your job to secure that infrastructure.
	I'm sorry.
	It is not your job to make the iPhone secure.
	It's not.
	What we have to do to fix the phones, and the vendors are going to work that.
	There are things that we have...
	Oh, did you just hear that?
	The vendors are going to work that?
	This guy is insane.
	What we have to do to fix our infrastructure, and we all have to work that.
	And then there are things that the adversary is going to try to do to steal intellectual property.
	We have to defend against that.
	And then to disrupt our communications or destroy our communications infrastructure.
	It's in those last two.
	It's actually across that spectrum where NSA and Cyber Command come together.
	NSA, think of that as the indications in warning and situational awareness for cyberspace.
	They're the ones that can see it.
	Just like we do terrorist communications, you can see malicious software out there.
	And Cyber Command is the one who would respond to it.
	That's the platform for defending the DOD networks, defending the nation.
	And responding, as policymakers would ask us to do, if someone were to attack us.
	I think, John, he actually believes this bullcrap.
	He really is saying it like he believes it.
	Like this protection of our communications infrastructure, which the adversaries are trying to bring down all the time.
	And it makes no sense.
	Which adversary?
	Al-Qaeda?
	Taliban?
	They want to cripple our communications infrastructure?
	Really?
	Of course, all of this that he is doing, it's all okay because all the oversight of the entire US government all has its eyes on him.
	The oversight and compliance on these programs is greater than any other program in our government.
	It's from within NSA by the General Counsel, the Inspector General, the Oversight and Compliance Directorate, from the DNI's General Counsel and Inspector General, and Civil Liberties and Privacy Officer, by DOD's Inspector General and General Counsel, by Department of Justice, by the White House, and by Congress, both committees.
	And so when you look at that...
	It sounds like a bunch of secret bullshit artists to me.
	A whole bunch of people analyzing this in secret, including the FISA court.
	These are ones who apply oversight and can see what we're doing.
	It is not a program in secret.
	It's one that Congress, the administration...
	And the courts have all approved.
	And the court is the final one in this.
	So from my perspective, we have convinced all three of those that this is necessary.
	Now, very interesting words.
	From my perspective, he says, we've convinced them this is very necessary.
	Not proven.
	Not based upon the evidence that we have, based upon fact.
	No, no.
	The right word would be shown.
	Yes, but he said...
	From my perspective, we've shown that this is important.
	We've convinced them.
	Truth always comes out.
	There it is.
	Yeah, in other words, convincing business is not to say...
	Tricked.
	You could also say tricked.
	Yeah, they should have used tricked.
	You might as well just get it.
	Cut to the chase.
	All right, so now we're about halfway through this interview, and now he starts to go off the deep end, and he has to explain to these stupid human resources of America who clearly don't understand that he is Superman protecting the world from cyber.
	He's going to give you some metaphors.
	And so the question is...
	It has been successful.
	Can somebody come up with a better way of doing it?
	That's the issue.
	We've not been able to come up with one, so we've been working with Congress and the courts.
	But that's the best we can do right now.
	We protect civil liberties and privacy.
	No content in the metadata program.
	And I think that's the right way to run it.
	You see, nobody's come forward with a better.
	It's like saying, we know how...
	It's like when you were younger.
	Well, this is for boys.
	When you're younger, you say, I don't want to take a bath.
	I say, no, I'd never take a bath.
	Why do you want to take a bath?
	Well, you've got to take a bath.
	You say, but isn't there a better way?
	Well, we don't, so we had to take baths, right, or showers.
	How about a shower?
	What about here?
	What's the better way to stop terrorists?
	And apparently only boys hate taking baths.
	And he goes, take a bath, da-di-da-di-da.
	What?
	This is not a guy I want running cyber.
	Da-di-da-di-da.
	Well, let's do another analogy.
	I liken this to holding a hornet's nest.
	Ah, thank you.
	Okay, so here we are.
	We're holding this hornet's nest.
	Now, I would like to give it to somebody else and say, you protect the nation with this data set.
	He's literally going, oh, yeah?
	Can you do it better?
	I don't think so.
	Here, you hold the hornet's nest.
	Everybody's looking around saying, I don't want to hold that.
	You hold it.
	But somebody's got to hold it.
	For the good of the nation.
	And remember, the oversight and compliance we have here is better than any other program ensuring our civil liberties and privacy and that of our allies.
	We do it better than anybody else.
	Oh, yeah?
	So, despite what the papers say in here, we do it better than anyone.
	We do it better than anybody!
	I need one more analogy.
	Saying it just doesn't make it so.
	What is this guy?
	I need one more analogy.
	Let's see.
	We've had taking a bath.
	We've had a hornet's nest.
	What else can we do?
	These programs were started to defend this country.
	If you have a better way, put it on the table.
	Again, this with the defensive.
	Oh, yeah?
	Can you show me a better way?
	You don't have a better way.
	You got some better ideas.
	Put it on the table.
	If you don't, let's discuss it.
	But don't stop...
	It's like saying, well, we're not sure seatbelts protect people anymore.
	Nobody has to wear seatbelts.
	Right?
	Right.
	What would you say to your children?
	Yeah.
	So if they said, okay, just put them in the back, you wouldn't do it, would you?
	You wouldn't go back, but you see, we've learned that lesson on how we take care of our people.
	Oh, won't somebody please think of the children?
	So he brings that meme in.
	So when did the NSA get into business?
	What year was it?
	It was right after the Truman administration, wasn't it?
	I don't know.
	It was part of the security system.
	They kept it a secret for a long time.
	What did they do with this fantastic mechanism to protect us from the 9-11 episode with the buildings and the planes?
	Apparently, this is all just lessons learned.
	It's been going on.
	They were just doing the same business that they could.
	This is the great job that they're doing.
	No, you see, it wasn't until Kaiser Alexander came in because the NSA sucked so bad during 9-11, you see.
	You know, it's lessons that we learned after 9-11.
	When you look at the 9-11 Commission, it faulted the intelligence community for not connecting the dots.
	We didn't have the tools.
	These are tools that help us connect the dots.
	So we can take them away.
	What crap is the same old tools?
	It's new tools.
	He has new tools, John.
	There's no such thing as new tools.
	He has new tools.
	What helps him connect the dots?
	He has new tools.
	I'm asking you.
	What helps him connect the dots?
	Full information dominance.
	That is his word, information dominance.
	Look it up.
	This is the word he uses, information dominance.
	But this guy's insane.
	And, by the way, whistleblowing kills.
	The problem is, is the bad guys are amongst us.
	They will figure it out.
	This happened in 1998, after the East Africa embassy bombings.
	Somebody revealed...
	Publicly, that the way we tracked bin Laden was through SATCOM communications.
	Within two days, we never saw bin Laden in communications again.
	Alright, so, just to translate, someone, I guess he doesn't even know who, leaked...
	Yeah, they got so much information.
	Who was this someone?
	Leaked this incredible information that they were tracking Osama bin Laden through satellite phone technology, which, of course...
	The sand bunnies are too dumb to know, but oh no, someone leaked the information!
	Now the man in the cave knows we're tracking his satellite phone!
	Oh my goodness, he couldn't have figured that out for himself!
	Dick!
	My concern is the revealing of these programs allow terrorists to know the best weapons that we have against them, It will cause irreversible and significant damage.
	And it means that terrorists now have an upper edge in conducting attacks, probably in Europe and potentially in the United States.
	Just like that.
	Stop them is reduced.
	And so when people die, those that are responsible for leaking it are the ones that should be held accountable.
	Hang him.
	Hang him.
	Hey, Glenn Greenwald.
	You are going to die.
	You're going to die.
	You're going to be hung by the yardarm.
	You're going to be hung.
	He takes it further.
	That's what he's saying.
	What the subtext is, is that our systems are so weak.
	And we're so borderline incompetent that one little piece of information gets out.
	Like the fact that we're spying.
	It all falls apart because the thing is not sturdy.
	It's not rugged.
	Well, the proof is in the pudding.
	Boston Marathon bombing, the proof is right there.
	Doesn't work.
	Doesn't work.
	They didn't know.
	No one picked it up.
	No one knew anything.
	These guys...
	I'm just telling you the official story.
	These guys were over there in former Russian states and getting information and mosques and everything.
	It didn't work.
	You're full of shit, Kaiser.
	But you know what?
	We've got to stop the press.
	Well, the other part is I think it's wrong that newspaper reporters have all these documents, 50,000 or whatever they have, and are selling them and giving them out As if these, you know, it just doesn't make sense.
	We ought to come up with a way of stopping it.
	I don't know how to do that.
	That's more of the courts and the policy makers.
	But from my perspective, it's wrong.
	And to allow this to go on is wrong.
	Yeah, we can't allow it to go on.
	We have to stop them.
	Yeah, no, this guy is an anti-American douchebag.
	You're right.
	Let me play, but...
	Let me just let you know.
	I wonder if he considers himself a patriot.
	Ah!
	Thank you for asking.
	All of these things are running together.
	I think it's absolutely superb.
	And by bringing that together, our nation, Team Cyber, is better protected than it would ever be.
	Great people doing a great job.
	They're the heroes.
	It should never be a question in anyone's mind.
	This leaker is not a hero.
	He will have caused lives.
	I think that's irresponsible and significant damage to this nation.
	Irreversible and significant damage.
	And that will come out eventually.
	But the people who are protecting us, those people of NSA and Cyber Command, they're the heroes.
	And they're the ones that deserve the kudos from the American people.
	Kudos!
	Kudos for what have they done?
	Spying, and they haven't stopped.
	Well, okay, so now I started to look around.
	Now you're the one that brought up the big 54 number.
	The 54 number is the 54 incidents that the NSA has apparently stopped Big 54 and I didn't pull the old clip from the...
	Who was the guy that we played the clip from, John?
	Yeah, he was briefing a bunch of staffers.
	Right.
	I can't remember his name.
	Oh, right, right.
	The big staffer day.
	It was a staffer day and he went through the whole thing.
	He said there was none.
	There was no...
	There was bad...
	Pretty much nothing.
	Too bad you can't find that clip because there's actually a funny bit in there where they even made claims that weren't true.
	Like the jury found there was no jury kind of thing.
	I could probably find that pretty quick.
	You'd be amazed.
	Let me see.
	I'll just go for 54.
	Let's see.
	I might make it lucky.
	So I went back and I found...
	I guess both of us missed this.
	Kaiser Alexander on October 2nd was being grilled by Leahy.
	Leahy.
	And I think Leahy...
	Somehow this guy...
	Oh, no.
	I don't think we missed it.
	I know exactly what this clip is because I think we had this clip.
	This is where Leahy calls him out on the 54.
	I don't remember this.
	Yes, we had the clip and we played it.
	And what do you recall him saying about the 54?
	He says it was bull crap.
	Right.
	Play it again.
	The 54, it turns out it was really only maybe 13 and not all of them were...
	They were dubious.
	And it was mostly about money transfer.
	There was no real terrorist plots being stopped.
	But the thing that I heard, and this is about a minute and a half, listen to Kaiser Alexander melt into this little timid boy.
	Because I think, A, he knows that he's really running an empty shop.
	B, I think Leahy has something on him.
	Yeah, I got that same impression.
	There's something up with this.
	Something's going on with this.
	That you're going to play.
	He lays into him so hard.
	Right, there's something going on.
	54 terrorist plots were thwarted by the use of Section 215 and or Section 702 authorities.
	That's plainly wrong.
	But we still get it in letters to members of Congress.
	We get it in statements.
	These weren't all plots and they weren't all thwarted.
	The American people are getting left with an inaccurate impression of the effectiveness of NSA programs.
	Would you agree that the 54 cases that keep getting cited by the administration were not all plots, and other 54, only 13, had some nexus to the U.S.? Would you agree with that, yes or no?
	Yes.
	Okay.
	In our last hearing, Deputy Director Inglis' testimony stated that there's only really one example of a case where but for the use of sections.
	I'd like to just, yes.
	Yes.
	Yes, done.
	Yes.
	And now he tries to crawl back a little bit by saying, well, you know, but only 13 were in the U.S. And Leahy's going to shut his ass down.
	Listen.
	215 bulk phone records collection.
	Terrorist activity was stopped.
	Is Mr.
	English right?
	He's right.
	I believe he said two, Chairman.
	I may have that wrong, but I think he said two.
	And I would like to point out that it could only have applied in 13 of the cases because of the 54 terrorist plots or events, only 13 occurred in the U.S. Business record FISA was only used in 12.
	I understand that, but what I worry about is that some of the statements that all is well...
	And we have these overstatements of what's going on.
	We're talking about massive, massive, massive collection.
	And we're told we have to do that to protect us.
	And then statistics are rolled out.
	If they're not accurate, it doesn't help with the credibility here in the Congress.
	It doesn't help with the credibility with us.
	And I'm not even hearing Leahy being on our side of this argument.
	I'm hearing him like, hey, listen, you little twerp.
	Shape up your statistics, you moron.
	Yeah, you're making us look bad.
	Yeah, you're making us look bad.
	You're slipping.
	So I am of the opinion, after listening, and if you see this interview, of course, in the show notes, 560.nashownotes.com, with the creepy music going on the whole time, it is unnerving, and I do not believe the NSA is capable of anything, except after the fact...
	They are essentially a big data storage and the FBI and other agencies can subpoena.
	Well, the IRS is already using them.
	Right.
	So they can subpoena information.
	And the FBI is using them.
	This is just a sweep.
	It's a drag net.
	Exactly.
	And there's other aspects involved.
	And only Dennis Kucinich, the only guy so far that I've heard who says this, and I have the clip here, only Dennis would say this.
	Here he goes.
	Of surveillance that's occurring of world leaders.
	But there's another issue here, too.
	And I know we don't have a lot of time, but keep this in mind.
	We don't look at Germany as being a threat.
	There's not some terrorism issue here, but there is an economic issue.
	And we've got to start asking questions.
	Is this spying being done to advantage certain corporate interests in the United States against other corporate interests globally?
	Because terrorism isn't an issue here.
	That's a very good point.
	We need to know.
	We need to find out.
	Yeah, Al Jazeera America had a very good piece on this, and this does kind of flow into where I think a lot of this is headed.
	Yesterday, there was supposed to be a big demonstration in Washington called Stop Watching Us.
	Was this an EFF thing?
	Because if you go to the website, it doesn't really say who's behind this.
	Whoever did this and they had professional signs, they really sucked.
	I'm all for the protesting.
	I think it's good.
	I did see some homemade signs, so I think some people are really getting into protesting.
	Stop watching us.
	The celebrities they had were Will Wheaton, Maggie Jaggenhall, Daniel Ellsberg, And I think they had one senator.
	Now, if Will Wheaton had gone to D.C., and he may have, but I certainly didn't see him.
	They had no celebratis.
	They had no one piping up, no one there for the big show.
	And so here's how NBC portrayed the demonstration.
	Show me what democracy looks like!
	Hundreds of demonstrators marched on Capitol Hill today protesting NSA surveillance.
	The whistleblowers!
	And cheering a fresh message from their hero in Moscow, fugitive ex-NSA contractor Edward Snowden.
	Do you hear how this is being positioned?
	Isn't that interesting?
	Their hero in Moscow, the moron!
	Tea Party?
	This is mind-boggling that this is George Stephanopoulos, a Clinton operative, a Democratic Party operative.
	This is Stephanopoulos?
	Yes.
	This is ABC. Oh, maybe ABC. I'm sorry.
	Why did I say NBC? Maybe it's not him.
	It doesn't matter.
	It's NBC. Whatever it is, it's anti-right-wing.
	It's pro-Obama administration.
	Yeah, it sounds like in a hundred protesters, I mean, why even cover it?
	But it's not.
	You get to throw in Snowdens in Moscow.
	Opened America's eyes to what the NSA is doing.
	Are you grateful that he's done what he did?
	We wouldn't have the reforms to the NSA if not for what he did.
	The rally comes amid yet more fallout overseas from the Snowden disclosures.
	Okay, so we have to talk...
	What reforms?
	There's no reforms.
	It's not reforms.
	What is he talking about?
	Another vapid, vacuous cipher.
	The German magazine Der Spiegel, which has gotten access to some Snowden documents, reported today the NSA had actually targeted German Chancellor Angela Merkel's cell phone since 2002.
	By the way, it's Angela, not Angela.
	While she was still an opposition leader.
	This just days after President Obama was forced to personally apologize to Merkel over earlier disclosures of NSA snooping, as well as a presidential pledge to Mexican President Enrique Peña Nieto to investigate reports the NSA hacked into his computer.
	But one world leader did rally to the NSA's defense.
	Who could that be?
	Who would be rallying to our defense?
	Let me see.
	Somebody we have a special relationship with?
	British Prime Minister David Cameron.
	The point is what Snowden is doing, and to an extent what the newspapers are doing in helping him doing what he's doing.
	Okay.
	To the extent the newspapers are helping doing what he's doing to the thing he was doing while I was doing this and doing that, it's not good.
	What the newspapers are doing in helping him doing what he's doing...
	Who wrote that?
	Who wrote that?
	Fire that guy.
	...is frankly signaling to people who mean to do us harm how to evade and avoid intelligence.
	Wow!
	Wow!
	Crap.
	Was he butt-fucking Kaiser Alexander?
	I'm sorry.
	That was my Tourette's.
	I'm angry about this.
	This is so insulting.
	This is so insulting.
	How these people are propagating this message.
	And the news media is not calling anyone on this.
	What are they talking about?
	It's simply not true.
	We just went through a half hour of listening to all this fantastic stuff that the NSA does, which is normal.
	Like, you know, wow, gee, what a surprise.
	We sniff packets or whatever.
	We listen to phone calls.
	But because the terrorists now know this, oh my God, we're all going to die.
	And this is being propagated by world leaders.
	CBS! Oh man, they have no shame.
	Protesters in America?
	Don't look at that.
	I've always been convinced, and you know this, even though you think ABC, I have always believed CBS is at the forefront of this.
	The Western edition of the broadcast.
	Some of the strongest allies of the United States are among its most vocal critics tonight, amid revelations that the NSA eavesdropped on world leaders.
	Several hundred demonstrators rallied near the U.S. Capitol this afternoon, criticizing the practice of electronic surveillance.
	And that's enough about that.
	But as Kelly Cobiella tells us, it is the anger far from Washington that's top priority.
	That's actually better.
	By all accounts, the leaders of Germany...
	All right, so then we have...
	I think this Kelly woman, now she had it right, and this is where we're going to kind of...
	Wait, before I get to that, let me play you a little bit of Touré.
	Toure, who probably right now is on MSNBC saying, oh, Lou Reed died.
	Wow, that's horrible.
	Which he did, by the way.
	Lou Reed died.
	Yes, I know he died.
	It was tweeted.
	Yes.
	Oh, so horrible.
	Because Toure is a music journalist or a music aficionado or whatever.
	So how does he...
	As a, as a, as a prostitute, how does he defend what this administration is doing to the American citizenry?
	Once when I was a kid, I did something really bad, and my dad took me to my grandmother's house, and he told her what I did, and she pulled me aside, and she said, it's not bad that you did it, it's bad that you got caught.
	And I think that's what we have going on here, that it's really bad that we got caught, and my damage...
	Wait, Grandma told you that?
	Oh, absolutely.
	She's...
	I love her, God rest her soul.
	But, you know, it's going to damage some relationships.
	But if we weren't doing intel spying on people like this, Angela Merkel, Kim Jong, anybody, then we would be derelict in our duty.
	Of course we should be spying on these folks.
	We have to have the information.
	That's why we have a CIA. Look, Germany in particular is shoring the euro.
	We have to know that what they're telling us publicly is what they actually believe privately so we can have confidence in what's going on in the eurozone.
	I can't believe he's saying this.
	Hold on.
	You did this to me a couple of times.
	I'm doing it to you.
	I don't want to hear another clip from that idiot ever again.
	But he's so entertaining.
	He is an idiot.
	Okay.
	All right.
	You have every right in the world.
	I will not play another clip from him ever.
	No matter how good it is.
	They're not good.
	None of them are good.
	It's just a guy who shouldn't even...
	This guy should not be on the air.
	He's just an idiot.
	He's going on and on with this kind of bull crap.
	Now, that said, I do have a clip from France 20, like Van Kat on spying.
	And this was, they have these little round tables.
	And they put together a little team.
	They had a guy from Huffington Post.
	But the guy that they first started talking to is a French guy, even though he has a weird English accent.
	I don't know where he learned his English.
	But he talks, and I think, and this is the meme that's been, you've been complaining about it.
	I've been complaining about it.
	This guy exhibits the same meme from a French perspective, and I think it's unacceptable.
	Business is business, and the business of intelligent snooping, and snooping on each other is part of the game.
	It is expected.
	It always has been so, from the World War II, ever, ever.
	So I think what is shocking to the French and the Europeans is not the spying by itself.
	It's the extent and the systematic character of the spying, which they did not suspect.
	But perhaps, I mean, that's the senior correspondent in you spying.
	You know how the world works.
	But as a private individual, do you care?
	In any way, shape, or form, that perhaps your SMSs sent to your family or to your businesses may have been intercepted and read.
	You see, a British colleague of mine wrote a long piece on that.
	What I remember is that I could not avoid the conclusion.
	He said, unless you want to go back to the caves, there is no way you can avoid it.
	So if you can't beat them, just accept it then.
	Can you imagine?
	Buddy the Firewall says if you can't beat them kids, just accept it!
	Sniffing packets in the alleyway!
	Now, we take this back and let's go back to what's really going on here.
	Blackmail, insider trading, espionage, industrial espionage, which we were always trained was a bad idea and a bad thing that has to be stopped.
	That's what we're doing.
	And I think it's been proven, I think Kucinich nailed it.
	There is no terrorism plot coming from Merkel's phone.
	She's not going to be talking about, let's bomb something.
	So why is she being monitored?
	Because she has information that leads to somebody making a profit.
	Yes, in the Eurozone.
	And by the way, she would say, let's bummed.
	Kaiser Alexander, actually, I'll go back to this, he explained the French example, and in his explanation, he admits, we have recorded, or I don't know if you want to call it recorded, but we have a copy of the content.
	This is what's so funny about his answer, which, again, no one will talk about, no one will analyze this.
	And I think what's happened is the papers convolute these stories and they immediately say 70 million, you know, think of, we got one today, about 70 million phone calls being intercepted in Paris over a one-month time period.
	Think about that.
	70 million phone calls.
	Now, I don't know how many phone calls you get a day.
	Let's say 30.
	But let's say they're in a foreign language, because most French people speak French.
	Just putting that on the table.
	It's not a hard thing to follow.
	It's not complicated.
	It's not complicated.
	How patronizing can you be, a-hole?
	So you'd need French linguists.
	And if you did 2 million French phone calls a day, Listened to them and tried to write them down.
	How many people would that take?
	Few more than two.
	Yeah, few more than two.
	Few more than two.
	So, you know, the average analyst might be able to do one every 15 minutes, four an hour times eight.
	That's interesting information.
	Our average analyst only does it 15 minutes.
	He's giving away the fact that they do this.
	So, you know, their average...
	By the way, that's a breach.
	That's a security breach right there.
	Of course it is.
	Of course it is.
	The guy, his name is Kaiser Breach Alexander.
	You might be able to do one every 15 minutes.
	Four an hour times eight is 32.
	Divide 32 into there.
	You're going to need about...
	You know, a little bit less than 100,000 people.
	Just for France.
	And France is an ally.
	It's absurd.
	They get it wrong.
	It actually has nothing to do with collecting on France.
	But the reporters who got this see this data and quickly run to the wrong conclusion.
	The conclusion is, you can't even do it.
	Well, the wrong conclusion is obvious.
	It's about industrial espionage.
	It's about blackmail.
	It's about insider trading.
	So the wrong conclusion is that they're spying on the French.
	There is no conclusion.
	The mainstream media, except for Kucinich, who's not in the media, has never brought this possibility up.
	All they talk about is the terrorist threat.
	Now I'm going to get to a place with some help from one of our producers.
	First, back to CBS, who of course called the real potential issue that is being discussed now at the EU summit.
	The U.S. seemed just as surprised to find another secret was out, thanks once again to NSA leaker Edward Snowden.
	Now senior White House officials tell CBS News that they're warning their allies about what Snowden might release next.
	Interesting, right?
	So this is very interesting what's taking place here, and I think there's something behind it that flips.
	Can we stop?
	Before you go on, can I ask something here?
	Yeah, of course.
	Didn't Snowden release all this stuff already to be doled out?
	Well, when people say that, what they're really saying is Glenn Greenwald or Laura Poitras or...
	Snowden's out of the loop.
	Yes.
	No, he's given everything.
	Apparently, this is all just being handled by Pierre Umgiar at eBay now.
	So this report is basically inaccurate from the get-go.
	Well, yes and no.
	Just let me follow through on this.
	Okay, I was just going to say, I just want people to realize that this is dramatizing bullcrap.
	Well, this is the same as WikiLeaks.
	WikiLeaks was not releasing anything.
	WikiLeaks had given information for analysis to the Times, to Spiegel, to the Guardian.
	It's the same thing.
	It is...
	Press.
	And who controls press?
	Who controls media?
	Corporate entities and governments control that.
	So this is something on a bigger scale that has nothing to do with little whistleblowers, and I would also say has nothing to do with little greenwalds.
	I think they're just peons in a bigger game, and part of the game is coming to play here in this report.
	There is a better understanding of what Snowden has, but there is no way of knowing the next shoe to drop.
	German leader Angela Merkel said her trust in the U.S. has been severely shaken after allegations this week that the NSA tapped her private cell phone.
	Snowden's latest batch of leaked documents delivered to a newspaper also alleged that the NSA accessed tens of thousands of French phone records and tapped the phones of 35 world leaders.
	State Department spokeswoman Jen Psaki said spying tactics were under review.
	We want to ensure we're collecting information because we need it and not just because we can.
	Germany and France are demanding to know why the National Security Agency threw such a wide spying net.
	They were caught up in it.
	They want the U.S. to sign up to a code of conduct like the no spying deal the U.S. has with Canada, Britain, Australia, and New Zealand.
	Five eyes.
	And there's talk of multi-million dollar fines for U.S. companies who don't protect the privacy of their European customers.
	And here it comes.
	There's a lot at stake, including a massive free trade deal with Europe.
	The European Union and the German Intelligence Service are both sending teams to the U.S. next week to meet with government officials about spying.
	But as one former French foreign minister put it, let's be honest, we eavesdrop too.
	Okay, now I got an email from one of our producers, and she, I believe, is in the military.
	I did not talk to her about...
	I'm not going to mention, I'm not going to give a name, but I do want to read this note because it got me thinking that maybe we're seeing this thing completely wrong and that maybe it's not just the individual pieces, but there might be a coordinated attack taking place.
	Adam, thank you and John for your courage.
	So I'm listening to the show and you're talking about Frau Merkel being so pissed.
	I'd like to draw your attention to something I believe is one angle.
	Remember the BRICS. Everything ties together nicely when you stop thinking in terms of Putin and Russia and see everything as the BRICS. That's Brazil, Russia, India, China, and South Africa.
	Who would love to make A, a competing bank to the IMF and the World Bank.
	Now go back to the Snowden League.
	The countries named were Brazil, India, China, and the EU and Germany.
	Outside of Germany, everything falls into place except for Germany, but you can't do a massive takeover of the banking industry without the EU and, more importantly, Germany behind you.
	Brazil, as we know, refused to come to a state dinner.
	Next thing that happened is Brazil's calling for an immediate meeting of the Latin American countries, followed by a protest at the UN meeting.
	Where does Greenwald live?
	Brazil Where is Snowden right now?
	Russia.
	China is calling for a less Americanized world.
	Snowed and landed first in Hong Kong, then moved on to Moscow.
	Now we have France and Frau Merkel furious.
	Germany signed a huge trade deal with China a year or two ago.
	Where is Laura Poitras?
	Germany.
	Keep an eye on trade deals with the BRIC countries or larger trade deals in South America.
	Also watch Germany's energy problems.
	Russia, I think, will swoop in and save Germany's energy problems soon.
	Russia just passed the anti-Hollywood laws just in time for China to build a new movie studio.
	Again, I think the BRICS have been overlooked and are not taken seriously.
	Imagine what the world would look like if, say, a few Latin American countries other than Brazil, Germany, and the African countries, and China leave the IMF and World Bank and join a new BRICS bank.
	I don't think this will happen tomorrow, but it could be a power play in motion.
	John's Saudi theory makes sense, even more so if you take the BRICS into account.
	The Saudis are furious over Syria.
	Kerry testified before Congress that the, quote, Arabs were willing to pay for everything.
	Obama not invading, as Bush would have done, is probably the final straw.
	They could be pissed about Houston's involvement, the Clintons, and Leviathan.
	The Saudi royals cannot be happy about how much oil and gas Israel has their hands on now.
	So this goes on for a little bit.
	But when you think about this, and this kind of got me into a new view of all of it, it is very possible that the United States is under a coordinated attack from Brazil,
	Russia, India not so sure where they fit in, but you gotta watch them, China, And what is being used is the so-called Snowden, who we really don't know all that much about.
	We've seen a video of a guy, one video, you know, we got a lot of talk from people coming from the EU, specifically from Germany, specifically Glenn Greenwald from Brazil.
	Maybe we're under attack, John.
	And the credibility is the first thing that's going.
	We need to kill this TTIP deal so Russia maintains dominance over their largest customer, which is the EU. And maybe there's something going on, a picture so big we're not even seeing it.
	I could imagine.
	I mean, I would also assume the Russians had something to do with it.
	Well, they're part of the BRICS. At least that part of it, not the Saudi part, which would be China.
	But the Chinese maybe have something to do with the whole thing.
	We don't know.
	But our bankers, which are really international, I don't know.
	This is...
	I would side with a couple of things I want to back up on.
	One is the industrial espionage angle of the NSA. I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing for Americans, except for the fact that the Americans are not benefiting.
	We have this ridiculous unemployment rate.
	If you look at shadow stats, it's pushing 25%.
	percent uh there's a bunch of rich dudes that are really benefiting from this and it's not being redistributed to the public at large and so they're you have a problem on their hands which is the public relations aspect of all this no one's going to be sympathetic to industrial espionage it doesn't benefit everybody and it's and it doesn't so it's just bullcrap uh if anybody can come out of this winning though i i really i always can't
	i just can't imagine us being beaten at our own game.
	Oh It's really hard for me to, because that's all we do.
	I was with somebody recently, and it was like we're discussing, they were from New Zealand or someplace.
	Let me just back up.
	You said all we do is industrial espionage, cheat and lie and spy on people for financial gain?
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	That's our game.
	And we're good at it, dammit!
	No, we're really good at it.
	And I was at a luncheon, and there was this woman from New Zealand, and another American was sitting, and we were talking across the New Zealand woman.
	I'm just loving how we're just like, yeah, that's what we do.
	And we're exceptional.
	And so all of a sudden we just started talking about stock market.
	And I turned to the woman from New Zealand and I said, yeah, by the way, you're witnessing what Americans, it's all we do, is we just talk about money, making money somehow, whatever methodology we need to employ.
	Welcome to America.
	That's what we do.
	We think about this constantly.
	Would you like your seat at the table?
	In business in America, I've learned the whole game is how can I screw that guy out of his money before he screws me out of my money?
	There is that element.
	That's kind of what we do.
	We're honed like a fine weapon.
	Yeah.
	If anybody thinks that, I mean, you're right, Kaiser Alexander is exhibiting bonehead characteristics.
	He is not the guy for the job.
	They've got to get rid of him.
	But if anybody thinks that the Russians or the Europeans or any of these old-fashioned, stodgy characters, and I include the Chinese in this, who have all kinds of cultural issues, can beat us at our own game, that's crazy talk.
	Yeah, let's play it out, let's see what happens, and then we'll, you know...
	Okay, so, right.
	Let's follow with this logic for a moment.
	Here's the problem.
	And, wow, this is very, very deep, and as someone who really has always loved his country, it's very hard to say, because I love people in the universe and I want rainbows and unicorns, but it appears that in order to maintain that stance, maintain that we are good at Spying and cheating and stealing and whatever it takes.
	Maybe it's not even that.
	Whatever it takes to get a foot up, a leg up, an advantage.
	But we always have had this big backstop where we'd say, oh, and by the way, if you don't like it, I'm going to kill you.
	And this administration has been whooshy.
	Not only have they not said we'll kill you, They've taken it down to some dumb level of, like, drone strikes.
	You know, there's no big, grand threat anymore.
	And I think that if we take your...
	Well, your letter, the letter writer pointed this out, that the Saudis might be irked by the fact that we weren't, like, trigger happy.
	Yeah.
	When it came to Syria, and that would, you know, even though I personally think that all these idiotic wars in the Middle East are useless, but I can see where somebody would think, well, you know, the Americans, they'll go in there and they'll go crazy.
	And we didn't.
	Because that's what we're known for.
	And we piss on dead bodies and stuff.
	Yeah, no, we're completely...
	Exactly.
	Meanwhile...
	You should pay attention to that.
	Yeah.
	Yes.
	Meanwhile, China...
	And this follows on your revelations on Thursday, is very close to a deal with Turkey for their missiles over NATO-supplied stuff.
	And people are freaking out.
	And is Turkey insane?
	Erdogan is...
	I believe that the Turks have watched this crap going on and they know that the Islamists have taken over Turkey.
	They haven't gone all the way yet, but they're headed that way to Sharia and all the rest of it.
	And they know what they see the rubble.
	Next door, they're looking, they're saying, you know, these Americans are not really, yeah, they talk a big game.
	They don't clean up their room.
	They don't clean up their rooms, they're making a mess, and we're next.
	Yeah.
	So they're positioning.
	And by the way, if you buy a missile, I don't think this is publicized, and I can't prove it, and I don't know it's true, but if you buy a missile from Raytheon, That missile will not hit an American target.
	No.
	It's programmed not to.
	You have beacons.
	Yeah.
	It's programmed.
	Of course it's not going to hit an American target.
	No.
	We got little beacons that beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep.
	Don't hit me.
	And it's like that tape.
	You can buy that glows.
	It's infrared tape that you put on top of your helmet and you won't get droned.
	Oh, yeah.
	Yeah.
	I hear that's really effective.
	Yeah.
	$4 billion deal.
	For the Chinese to supply missile weaponry to Turkey.
	This is really, really, this is big.
	Yeah, that's bad.
	It's not good.
	But then again, it could all be sabotaged for all you know.
	And part of this, you know, so part of what's going on here I think is also has to deal with the so-called internet freedom.
	I think that this will come into play very quickly.
	That the United States is abusing internet freedom?
	You can just see it happening.
	I really have a feeling, John, that we are on the losing end of the stick here.
	And I'm just saying the collective we.
	That the United States, it just seems like every single day.
	Boy, you guys are bullying dickheads.
	Or am I misreading the message?
	No, I disagree with your final conclusion.
	No, I'm saying this is what...
	But I know what you're saying.
	The evidence keeps...
	And I think it's one of those deals where you're down and you're out for a moment.
	You're in a wrestling match or you're in a boxing match and then you're knocked down to the ground and you look around and you see who's still rooting for you and who's taking the other guy's side.
	You have to do that once in a while.
	Because there's a bunch of turncoats out there that will, you know, they're your best buddy.
	Then the next thing you know, they're not your best buddy, it turns out.
	Well, you know, when you go back to the top of the heap, these guys pay the price.
	I think we may be in the process of taking names.
	Just wait until we decide not to give the next Batman movie to you, Europe.
	That could be part of it.
	Well, I find that...
	The Russians don't seem to want to watch our Batman movies.
	No.
	Well, they do.
	They just want to get paid extra for it.
	The whole thing I find is fascinating, but my conclusion really is along the lines with yours.
	We're not good at spying.
	We don't really have any capability.
	We are good at sucking stuff up and storing it.
	Even that apparently seems to be an issue since the data center keeps exploding or whatever the report is.
	Yeah.
	But when it boils down to it, I think there's no capability.
	I think it's a bunch of empty suits.
	The NSA. Well, not just the NSA, but everything.
	They're all just empty.
	They talk a really big game, and we're great at show business and PR and propaganda.
	But really, there's not a lot to show for it.
	And there's just not.
	It's like our cars.
	You know what I mean?
	All hat, no cattle.
	Well, there's that element.
	The American cars have never been top drawer.
	But isn't that just kind of par for everything?
	Well, I do like the new Cadillac.
	Really?
	There's one Cadillac that I think is really well designed.
	It's probably still a GM junker.
	It's a new one?
	I'll show you a picture of it.
	It's just a real slick looking car.
	There's a couple of them.
	Well, on that note...
	Anyway, I did just want to wind up by saying that I'd like to know if the EFF, the Electronic Frontier Foundation, was behind the...
	The huge demonstration of almost 100 people?
	Well, the EFF on their website says that it was a couple thousand people.
	But if they were behind it, they need some help.
	Because it was not well executed, and all it did is just functioned as a little bit of B-roll to talk about Angela Merkel.
	Nothing about the actual mission.
	Maybe that was the point.
	Well, this is what I'm worried about.
	I mean, this is an outfit that got $8 million in 2012.
	For their donations.
	I pulled their Form 990 just kind of as a lark to see.
	They got like a million dollars in executive salaries.
	They have three million in other salaries.
	Most of them, only a million bucks or so comes from donations.
	The rest all comes from corporate, even lawsuits, like $250,000 they won with litigation.
	It's kind of becoming a little bit of like a weird lobbying thing, and it's just not to be trusted in my mind.
	I hate to say it.
	I'd like to trust them, but I can't.
	I can't.
	When you fail so miserably, If indeed they were behind this stop watching us, you've got to figure out better ways to use your $8 million.
	Yeah, well, they're not experts at this sort of thing.
	That's the problem.
	All right.
	I do have a couple of offbeat clips that we can play, or we can...
	Why don't we, should we go thank some people?
	Yeah, I think it's a good idea.
	I'm going to show myself the mood by donating to No Agenda.
	Imagine all the people who could do that.
	Oh yeah, that'd be fab.
	Is it the SRX crossover that you like?
	No.
	Because it's a dog.
	I don't like it.
	No, I'm just trying to figure out which car you would like.
	Cross doors themselves, to me, is like a weird element.
	You like the ATS sedan, maybe?
	There's one that's a two-door, and it's a very futuristic look.
	Oh, the CTS Coupe?
	Maybe.
	Well, that's the little sports car, I think.
	Yeah, that's two-door.
	Yeah, it's true.
	Anyway, I'm not buying a car, if that's what you're wondering.
	No, I was curious.
	I think Cadillacs are very ugly.
	No, there's a good-looking...
	There's two good-looking ones.
	I like that little sports car, and there's another one that looks great.
	They're ugly.
	Well, it's ugly to you.
	You're in Texas.
	You should be seeing these things commonly.
	Hello, I'm in Austin.
	Oh, yeah, right.
	Everything's a BMW. Gerald, I want to thank a few people who helped us out to celebrate 6th anniversary.
	Gerald Gionet in London, Canada.
	177.77.
	Thanks for six great years.
	A bag of six.
	A little stripper rain.
	Wishing karma on the two of you.
	Thank you.
	Oh, that's nice.
	So he gave us the 1-11-11, which is making it rain, and a sack of sixes.
	Very nice.
	Yeah, it was very creative.
	Thank you.
	Imad Ullad in Landgroff, 134.40.
	Congratulations on six.
	What he did was clean out his PayPal cash.
	Yeah, we love that.
	It's a great idea.
	Which is what people should do.
	We have Zachary Wilson, Wildemar, California, 111.11.
	Andrew Lemansini, who has been consistently...
	Lemansini.
	Lemansini.
	111.11, Colorado Springs, making it rain.
	Jacob Scherer in Crystal, Minnesota Nuts.
	Making it rain, 111.11.
	John Richard in New Orleans, 100.
	It says beaver time, not sure what that means.
	Crocutta Computer Services in Pacifica, California, over here, $100.
	Adam Smith in Calgary, Alberta, where all the money is, $100.
	Charlie Brown, 78.
	I have a note.
	All righty.
	A handwritten note came in.
	Charlie Brown, what do you say?
	ITM, thanks for your courage.
	I have a set amount of money.
	I donate to charities throughout the year.
	I've been pondering how I might redistribute those donations this year and make room for a real charity case, the No Agenda Show.
	Yay!
	You'll be happy to know that I figured it out.
	My boss, David, has been a real bully to me recently, making threats that he's going to call me out as a boner on the show for not donating.
	We like these companies where the boss is a listener.
	Coincidence?
	Evidently, our employer has just begun their annual charitable contribution drive this week.
	Since you are not on my employer's list of potential donation recipients, I'm sending you my donation directly, $78, which is $3 per paycheck.
	It seemed like the logical way to respond to the cloud of crisis.
	You can do your part in bully prevention now by de-douching me.
	Well, hell yeah.
	Here we go.
	You've been de-douched.
	Absolutely.
	And he actually calls K7HYK. Yes.
	Kayla Fox 5, Shirley, but remember.
	Exactly.
	We had a gathering of the No Agenda Hams Friday night.
	Yeah?
	How'd it go?
	Yeah, it was great.
	Random dudes talking away.
	That's what they do.
	That's what hams do.
	Until there's an emergency, then they talk to the rescue.
	Then we will save the universe.
	No, it's not true.
	It's not true.
	Maybe a little bit true, but...
	Justin Fish, 7777 in Cloquette, Minnesota Nuts.
	He thought a 666 donation would be supporting my competition, and he's been receiving through airtime in the past few hours my donations, blah, blah, blah.
	Alright, perfect.
	Okay, here we go.
	69!
	69, dude!
	Karsten Nielsen in Denmark.
	69, 69.
	Brian Brown in Orange, California.
	And Maxwell Fry in Brooklyn, New York.
	And Edward Hines in Jacksonville, Florida.
	69!
	69, dudes!
	Now we get our full-on list of sacks of sixes, which is highly appreciated.
	Oh, wait.
	No, you're right.
	You're right.
	You're right.
	Norristown, Pennsylvania, decided to jump the line.
	Uh-huh.
	And they donated 66-67.
	Not so sure what to make of that.
	He's there.
	Okay, here we go.
	66 Sack of Sixes.
	Jay Zuckel in Los Angeles, California.
	Scott Henkel in Sunland, California.
	Bulldog PC in Athens, Georgia.
	Christian Schroeder in Coal Valley, Illinois.
	Joseph Gall in Raritan, New Jersey.
	Jason Becker in Austin, Texas.
	Right up the street from you.
	Robert Evans, San Jose, California.
	Right down the street from me.
	Aaron Kramer in Sewickley, Pennsylvania.
	Sam Leung in Toronto.
	He's in on everything.
	Sir Sam to you.
	Sir Sam to me.
	Brian Morton, Casper, Wyoming, Baronetess, Janice Kang in Milpitas, Omar Munoz in Mexico City, Barry Kroger in Greeley, Colorado, Charles Eves in Lake Zurich, Illinois, Maura Carlos in Hong Kong, Paul J. Sanowski in Winooski, Vermont.
	I think Sankowski.
	Sankowski, I'm sorry.
	It's exactly right.
	Sankowski.
	Rick Barkhouse in Smith Falls, Ontario.
	Robert Johnston in Phoenix, Arizona.
	Michael Miller in Tiburon, California.
	Christopher Dechter in Richland, Washington.
	Chris Cowan right up the street from you in Austin, Texas, 6666.
	Sir Chris Jacob, San Rafael, California.
	Robert Mueller.
	Robert Mueller!
	In Virginia.
	In Chesapeake, Virginia.
	The former FBI director.
	Hey, Robert!
	Sir Brian Barrow in Wooten Bassett in the UK. Lawrence Schell in Lancaster, California.
	Chris Terhart in Abbotsford, BC. Sam Harrelson in Columbia, South Carolina.
	Daniel Rudin in Cedar Rapids, Iowa.
	Michael Roberts in Milwaukee, Oregon.
	Brielle Garling in Shoreline, Washington.
	Christopher Yaggy in Kanata, Ontario, Canada.
	Brielle, by the way, of course, is Limoncello's sister, I think.
	Ah.
	Yes.
	Daniel Votower in Scarborough, Ontario, Canada.
	Sam Menor in Box Hill South, Victoria, Australia.
	Jeffrey...
	Go ahead.
	Jeffrey Lentes.
	Lentes.
	Lentes in Helvetosloos.
	Helvetosloos.
	Helvetosloos.
	Slaus.
	I'll get that.
	Eventually, I'll have one of these down.
	Kurt Winklemuller in Kerwin, Australia.
	Robert Kane in Columbiana, Alabama.
	Hmm.
	Martin Oosterhout in Albany, New York.
	Drew Veneman in Genoa, Illinois.
	Sir Dean Bertram in Bibbre Lake, Washington.
	Marinus van Opzeeland.
	Marinus van Opzeeland in Apeldoorn.
	I like Apple Doom better, though.
	That's great.
	I know, but believe me, if you've ever been to Apple Dorn, Apple Doom is pretty good.
	I'll take that in on advice.
	Willie Thunison.
	Thunison.
	Thunison in Grave.
	Grave.
	Grave.
	Francine Hardaway.
	Name Francine for us.
	By the way, John, when I give you the Dutch pronunciation, pronouncing it like a Nazi is not necessary.
	I'm just telling you, the Dutch are a little sensitive.
	Dame Francine Hardaway.
	Yes.
	Yes, and half-boot-baked.
	Cody Holberton.
	Copperopolis, California, which is a cool little place.
	Baroness Von Stealth Mode.
	James Murray in Huntington Beach, California.
	Cutting-edge solutions in Glasgow, Scotland.
	Chris Berger.
	We had a lot of people who came in.
	Yeah.
	Alice, Wisconsin.
	Marseille.
	Marcelli.
	Joden in Houston, B.C. Richard McCutcheon in Odenton, Maryland.
	Nathan Goldsmith in Tucson, Arizona.
	Kevin Lacombe in Port Orchard, Washington.
	Another cool little area.
	Sir Mitch Bidron in Long Beach, California.
	Martin Volprecht in Berlin, Deutschland.
	Arthur Gobitz in Zandam.
	Again, again with the Nazi thing.
	I said Nazi.
	Well, believe me, with a sensitive Dutch ear, you know.
	Really?
	Yeah, a little bit.
	Huh.
	Yeah.
	It's okay.
	I've said it so people understand it's not intentional.
	I'll try to do it in a more Swedish sound.
	Oh, that's worse.
	Jason Schap or Tap in Canmore, Alberta.
	Matthew Schauer in Beverly Hills, California.
	Nice.
	Thank you for your courage, he says.
	Sir James Mann in Ringgold, Louisiana.
	Daniel Turelio has got a birthday coming, or somebody does, in Charleston, South Carolina.
	I just want to thank Jim, Kittle Fox 5, Yankee Alpha Echo.
	Stepanov Viktor in Russia.
	We get so...
	Don't say my name.
	He says, please call me Mr.
	Snow.
	Well, I guess that didn't work out, did it?
	He says he's worried that Freddie the Firewall will stop this donation.
	Let's go.
	Well, no, it didn't.
	Freddy the Firewall never stops a donation!
	Karsten Ove Schwartz Nielsen in Denmark.
	Thomas Bissell in Reno, Nevada.
	Or Nevada, as I stupidly say it once in a while.
	Maurice Tate in Sacra Tomato, California.
	Andre Rodriguez in Portugal.
	I don't know where he is in Portugal.
	I can't.
	Yeah, the Egyptian government later.
	Alexander Solzberger in Deutschland.
	And...
	Oh, this is interesting.
	Oh, this is our friend from Ghana, West Africa.
	He's a knight.
	Eric Asnes in Lawndale, California.
	Kurt Anderson in New Hope, Minnesota.
	Bashir Osman in Middlesex, UK. Royce Kokami in Aiea, Hawaii.
	Sir J.D. in Santa Jose, California.
	Bogdan LeCendro in Irvine, Texas.
	Tricia Peterson in St.
	Louis, Missouri.
	And that concludes our discussion.
	Thank you for our donors for this part of the show.
	We still have some donors to mention, but these are the people who gave us 66-66, and we thank them profusely.
	And everyone else who was leading up to today has handed us sacks of sixes.
	It's really nice.
	Thank you.
	That's all I can say.
	Thank you.
	Thank you.
	That's value for value.
	I feel good about it.
	And Tricia did send in a handwritten note, I should mention, I guess.
	She says, in the morning, I'm writing a donation to my husband's name, and he's got a birthday coming up.
	My husband, we like notes from women who tell us how they got to listen to the show, because there's a strong belief that women hate us.
	Yeah, we're going to talk about that in a moment, by the way.
	My husband hit me in the mouth a few months ago, and I have been passing this forward.
	Hopefully I was successful in doing this with my daughter's high school history teacher, even though I received a highly dramatic teenage eye roll and outburst from the daughter, I guess, quote, Everyone is going to think you're a freak.
	Must you be so embarrassing?
	Yeah.
	What did she do?
	To which I replied, absolutely.
	Oh, God, that's what my mom used to say.
	Parenting worthwhile.
	My mom used to say that, too.
	Why else should I be a parent if I can't embarrass you?
	Yeah, I think that's common amongst a lot of moms.
	Have you ever said that?
	No, I've never said it, but Mimi has.
	Oh, wow.
	She gets a kick at it.
	And Jay, our daughter, is so easily embarrassed.
	Like, we stop at a crosswalk, and I got the window down, and I'll say to her, she'll be sitting there, and I'll say, that guy looks like the biggest idiot I've ever seen.
	Look at the way he's walking.
	And she'll go, oh, shh, shh, shh, he's going to hear you.
	He's not going to hear me.
	There's no way he's going to hear me.
	He's going to hear you.
	And so then, you know, it's just...
	That's funny.
	That's funny.
	You know, that is, that's interesting.
	Bookmarking for another time.
	Yes.
	She has never listened to your show, so don't take it that personally.
	Thanks for all the effort you guys put into the show.
	It's really enlightening, enjoyable.
	Take care, and happy anniversary.
	Thank you.
	And job karma for her husband would be so great, she says.
	Why don't you do that for her?
	Um, okay.
	Hold on a second.
	Yeah, or we have special job karma.
	And we have a lot of karma for...
	Yeah, well, let's do the job karma for everyone who needs it, by the way.
	Jobs, jobs, jobs, and jobs.
	Let's vote for jobs!
	You got it.
	There you go.
	Some job karma.
	Anyone who needs it.
	There's some five people left over.
	Joseph Gaz in Wilmington, Delaware.
	She came in with $66.
	Jason Murrell in Augusta, Georgia.
	$60.
	And then $50 from Peter Totes.
	Parts Unknown.
	Shad Rich in Seattle.
	And Marcus...
	I have a note from Marcus, actually.
	I have a note.
	Okay.
	I get to read a note.
	My name is Marcus Kazmarek and wife Raylene.
	We've decided that we do not want to be boners anymore.
	So we decided to become a knight with a $50 a month donation.
	We also then donated another single $16.66 for the total of this month's payment to be a sack of sixes for your six years and start my knighthood.
	And for those that don't support the show, I say push the button now.
	It's worth it.
	Could use a karma call-out for getting cars fixed and a MILF call-out for the wonderful mother of my 15-year-old homeschooled daughter.
	Sometimes you just gotta pull a note out of the big pile there.
	So a MILF and a karma.
	MILF! That's one, mother.
	I like that.
	You've got karma.
	And karma and gratitude for everyone else who wants to remain anonymous below the $50 level.
	Our boarding pass, mothership boarding pass, 33s, our 1111, our 1212s, our 5s, our 4s, the straggling 2s, it's all...
	Highly, highly...
	The straggling, too.
	It's highly appreciated.
	And I'll tell you, I'm ready to go.
	I'll do another six.
	I'll do another 60 years.
	I'm down.
	This makes me feel good.
	You haven't really mentioned at all about how you feel about the show.
	I love it.
	I think this is one of the best shows we've ever done.
	It's the only show we've ever done.
	No, it's true.
	We've never done any other show.
	But, I mean, just in general, isn't this just...
	I think we did a promo or something once.
	But isn't this just...
	Well, what's good about it, it seems to me, and I don't want to sound like some sort of a...
	We want to hear what you got.
	This is real support.
	This is people saying, okay, you guys are doing this work and you're coming up with this kind of stuff, which really explains a lot to me because it explains a lot to us, by the way, because the two of us, we don't talk and we find things out from each other.
	Yeah.
	And it's just a better way to go.
	I mean, the PBS, the media models, all the rest of them are crap.
	If you can produce a product that people like and they will support with their hard-earned money to keep it going, then you know you're doing the right thing.
	You're doing the right thing if somebody says, here, keep doing this.
	And that's what they did today.
	Yes.
	And we just don't often stop and think.
	Today actually started last night or yesterday.
	Of course, our actual anniversary was yesterday.
	I just can't help but think, what a fantastic thing is taking place here.
	It's like a co-op.
	It is.
	It's very much like a co-op.
	It really is.
	It's like a co-op.
	And I count my lucky stars every single day.
	It's like the best pension plan in the world.
	As long as I can get up in the morning...
	And do this, and I can keep doing it.
	Get up in the morning, watch C-SPAN for two or three hours.
	As long as we can keep each other alive.
	And you apparently listen to Touré's show.
	No, I don't.
	Which I believe is worth $100 or $200 from anyone to put up with that guy.
	This is...
	A lot of people help.
	I think the most work for me goes into...
	I'm pretty meticulous with the emails.
	I read every single email that comes in.
	I just can't reply to all of them.
	And some of them just don't warrant a reply.
	I have a clip for your email.
	Stick to it in this.
	Play the Oh My Goodness after...
	Oh My Goodness.
	Okay.
	What is this?
	Uh-oh.
	Oh, somehow that got stuck.
	After all that, I'm sorry.
	Something weird happening.
	Oh my goodness!
	Really?
	Now that is what I think of when you go on about your email.
	Well, no, but it's the amount of...
	If you give...
	If you are willing to feed back...
	And this is really a lot of what I do.
	So we got the...
	What I do.
	I'd love to hear a little bit more about what you do because I think it's very mysterious.
	And if you have no intention of telling us, fine.
	It's mysterious.
	But I'm always looking at the emails.
	I'm not a zero inbox guy.
	I look at my emails.
	No, no.
	But I'm just telling you how I prepare for the show.
	That people send me stuff and I will go down the hole for them when they send me these.
	I do.
	Save that for some other time, my friend.
	I go down the hole for my listeners.
	I do.
	And sometimes it's very, very rewarding.
	Sometimes it's really shite.
	And sometimes people think that it's okay that we can have an ongoing dialogue on email, which is not.
	And the No Agenda News Network contributors.
	All of that stuff.
	It really works.
	I'm afraid to talk too much about it because someone else will figure it out.
	Hey, we should do what those guys are doing.
	Yeah, well, people keep trying to do what these guys are doing, but the problem is you have to have a mindset.
	Oddly, the two of us working together have the mindset that accumulatively the two of us as a combination is highly unusual.
	It just happens to work because we think in a certain way.
	But I don't want to go on about this.
	Now it's about us.
	We have too much material here.
	You're absolutely right.
	Okay, so thank you again, everybody.
	Really appreciate it.
	That's my weird way of saying thank you, but it comes from the heart.
	I really mean it.
	And we continue.
	Episode 561 will be on Thursday.
	Thursday, we continue to need your support to continue what we do.
	Dvorak.org.
	Slash N.A.
	It's your birthday, birthday.
	Oh, no, I'm champion.
	Always happy to congratulate our producers.
	Jacob Scherer celebrates on the 28th tomorrow, as does Gavin Bowd.
	Trisha Peterson, we just heard her note that says happy birthday to her husband, Alan Peterson, on the 3rd of November.
	Royce Kokami, happy birthday to Chris Hernandez, celebrated yesterday, and Danielle Torello.
	Daniel's son, Ethan Jorge, celebrates tomorrow and will be one year old.
	A brand new human resource.
	Happy birthday from the entire staff and management here at the No Agenda Show!
	It's your birthday, yeah!
	And let me see.
	We have a controversy with the Knights.
	Okay.
	Well, Jennifer, and I don't...
	Eric sent a note in.
	I was just about to look.
	Don't mention her last name yet, because I don't know.
	No, I'm not mentioning her last name at all.
	That's why I said Jennifer.
	She had donated.
	She would be a dame today, but she had donated in the past.
	In 2011, I think.
	2011.
	We keep tabs on everybody, so we know what you're up to.
	We try, by the way.
	We try.
	We're not great, by any means.
	We actually stink.
	We don't have, like, congressional staff or anything.
	But Eric did notice that in 2011 she wanted to be anonymous.
	Now, years later she may not want to be anonymous anymore, but we have to get her permission to use her last name, even though I blew an anonymous donation earlier today that nobody seemed to have noticed.
	But that's an accident.
	This is not an accident, so we know that she will be knighted.
	Hold on, I'm looking at the message right here, and she wants to remain anonymous.
	Still?
	Yep.
	Okay, then she'll be just Dame Jennifer.
	Dame Jennifer.
	Okay.
	There you go.
	600 episodes.
	I mean, 600.
	Six years of episodes.
	We're moving on 600.
	And my sword is still sharp as ever.
	How about yours?
	No.
	It's dull.
	It's dull sword.
	All right.
	Whoa.
	Whoa.
	Let's try that again.
	There we go.
	Dennis Steffens and Jennifer, please step forward.
	Both of you have contributed to the best podcast in the university, amount of $1,000 or more, and our gratitude could not be any huger.
	And because of that, you both joined the Elite Roundtable, so I hereby pronounce the Dame Jennifer and Sir Dennis, the Mile High Knights.
	For you, we have opium and warm orange juice, hookers and blow, three geishas and a bucket of fried chicken, rent boys and chardonnay, hot pants and booze, wenches and beer, or maybe just some simple mutton and mead.
	It's all here for you at the roundtable.
	Thank you, and go to noagendanation.com slash rings.
	We still have some in various sizes, and you are well deserving of that.
	The only other thing I wanted to mention briefly about, now that we're on a six...
	Sixth anniversary.
	We have never won an award for this show.
	Not that we're looking for one per se.
	It would be nice because awards is how you get out in the public eye.
	The podcast awards are coming up.
	I would like to be nominated in the comedy category this year, if possible.
	I think we deserve to be in the comedy category.
	Well, we're as funny as any of those comedy shows.
	Thank you.
	I think we really deserve it.
	We should be in the comedy category.
	My goodness.
	Yeah, exactly.
	Oh my goodness.
	What is that from?
	That's kind of creepy.
	Just a little bit creepy.
	It's from a clip, if you want to hear the clip.
	No.
	It's the Pinterest clip where they're using Pinterest.
	I just thought, I've only made this clip because it was like such an obvious plug for Pinterest.
	Ugh.
	They're putting dogs in one of the peninsula cities.
	The missing dogs are now being posted on Pinterest, and I thought it sounds like a commercial for Pinterest, but this woman got a little puppy, and she goes, oh my goodness, a little cute little puppy, and that's where that comes from.
	More Silicon Valley cities are using high-tech tools to reunite people with their stolen or lost property, and that includes pets.
	NBC Bay Area's Marion Favreau shows us how.
	We don't know the name of this sweet dog, but our owner does.
	And the city of Sunnyvale is using Pinterest to try and reunite them.
	Oh, okay.
	I got you.
	There's something we didn't talk about on Thursday.
	It was my fault.
	Because we've been noticing for a while this war on men.
	Yeah.
	And I watched the documentary, the Sharon Stone documentary, Femme.
	Oh yeah, yeah, yeah!
	I didn't want to watch it, that's the key.
	And you did.
	Yes, I watched it with Miss Mickey.
	Did she stab you?
	I'm still here.
	I'm still breathing.
	That doesn't mean you weren't stabbed.
	No, I'm still breathing.
	Okay.
	And she agrees with me.
	Because I really wanted this to be good.
	I wanted this to be a great documentary.
	Wow, this was like someone's high school Final Cut Pro project.
	It was such a piece of shit.
	It was so poorly done.
	I mean, literally, John, you know the Star Wars credits where it says, once upon a time in a galaxy far, far away, and the credits are going off into infinity?
	Yeah, which is a mockery of early serials.
	They use that same credit.
	Yes!
	I don't believe you.
	Nobody's that lame to do that.
	Yes, and it would go from section to section, and so they kind of have a question or a statement, and Why would they do that?
	That was done as a satire.
	Oh, John, it was so bad.
	Now, here's what happened.
	So, they essentially interviewed, they say hundreds, but maybe the only, I think probably 20 women.
	You know, a lot of them well-known.
	Some of them extremely interesting.
	And then they filled up the rest of this thing with B-roll of the craziest things.
	Like, you know, like old...
	Public domain footage of slaves and slavery.
	It was so dumb.
	And it was kind of three parts.
	I'll break it up into three parts.
	So the first one was some kind of history lesson that at one point in history there was a matriarchal society and women ruled the world, apparently.
	And they show some statues of women and Cleopatra and that's proof.
	It's all Cleopatra.
	Yeah, and Venus, the Milo, and some other things.
	Venus?
	When does she rule the world?
	I don't know.
	And then they move on to how when men stoke women, remember we played that little clip from the trailer, that women really become great.
	And then at the end, it all kind of revolves back to Men and women, when they work together, form a perfect union that is more powerful than anything in the universe.
	A little spiritual there.
	New age, new age, new age alert.
	It was very new agey.
	There were a couple of women in there who just were fascinating to listen to and nothing I wanted to pull any clips from.
	But it was interesting because a lot of these same women, and seriously it was about men and women together.
	And that was the takeaway.
	Men and women, when they work together in perfect unison, then that's how the universe was meant to be.
	And it wasn't even about men serving women or women being better, but equal.
	Okay.
	But it was the same...
	That's reasonable.
	Yes, but then it's the same people who are advocating for same-sex marriages and LGBTQQ. Well, that makes no logical sense is what you're saying.
	It doesn't fit into...
	So somewhere it has to give.
	And actually, you know, I've had some arguments over this, but I said, you know, so if it truly is the female energy and the male energy that create this perfect unison together, okay, but, you know, I think it's people, not just, I don't see it as male-female, because I think, you know, two gay people, gay or lesbian or whatever, they can also create, look at us, John, I mean, here we are, we're bi-curious and whatever you are.
	No, we're not.
	Yeah.
	I am.
	I'm questioning.
	I'm the Q in questioning.
	You're the Q. To me, this really failed, but I've now been keeping my eye open on things for this clearly Agenda 21-driven objective.
	And the BBC propagated the formula with some bogative study...
	The headline, Women Better at Multitasking Than Men.
	That's interesting because that may or may not be true.
	I'm assuming it's bullcrap, but whatever the case is, the latest studies are showing that multitasking is not good to accomplish anything.
	Right.
	I'm a great multitasker.
	I get nothing done.
	Then there was this IWMF, the International Women's Media Foundation, and to prove a point, they rigged an ATM. There's a video of this, but there's no sound that makes any sense.
	It happened, I think, in Sweden or maybe Norway.
	Let me see.
	Here's Equal Pay for a Day.
	Where was it?
	Switzerland.
	And whenever a man came up to the ATM, let's say he wanted 100 euros, they'd give him 80 euros, and then the guy would be standing there for like five minutes, tapping the screen, trying to figure out why he only got 80 euros, and then the receipt would pop out and it would say, women are regularly paid 20% less than equally skilled men in comparable positions.
	How does it feel?
	This is equal pay day.
	Is this Alan Funt?
	No.
	This is a serious...
	The IWMF, International Women's Media Foundation, is a serious not-for-profit...
	Yeah, I know, but what's the point of this trick?
	Well, to make men feel bad, apparently.
	And I'm just seeing more and more of this, and I have...
	Here's another one.
	Another test.
	Scarcity of college men leads women to choose briefcase over baby.
	So they did a study at UT in San Antonio, University of Minnesota, and they told women on campuses, whether it was true or not, they said, well, there's a scarcity of men in this college, and these women, during this test, excelled and put family and relationship aside and became career professionals.
	When they told another group of women that there's an abundance of men, they chose family and relationships.
	Somehow this proves something, apparently.
	Sounds like it wasn't done properly.
	Well, it sounds to me like it's kill men is what it says to me.
	Kill men.
	Kill men and then you can excel.
	Kill all men.
	Right.
	But here's the only thing, and we're just going to keep our eye on this, but I would like to say one thing to, and then I'll get off my soapbox for a while on this, women.
	Particularly this conversation that is happening in our world now about equality in pay, equality in the workplace.
	Certainly when it comes...
	A lot of people listen to the show or other podcasts about women in technology and women on boards of companies.
	It has to be equal.
	Let me...
	If you really want to equalize women with men in this modern world, stop complaining about Facebook and Twitter and even General Electric or boards or whatever it is, and please go after the top three Evil, male-dominated, women-discriminating organizations in the world.
	If you start with the top three who discriminate women historically for hundreds of years and on a consistent basis, you might change something.
	And they are bigger than Twitter and Facebook and GE. And the top three are the Catholic Church, the Jewish Temple, and the Muslim synagogue, a mosque.
	Mosque.
	Just go look.
	Catholic Church?
	Screw women.
	Jewish Temple?
	Oh yes, women, you're allowed, but you have to sit up in the attic.
	And the Muslims?
	Do I really have to tell you how women are treated?
	Well, there you have it.
	I think you've nailed it.
	If that is accomplished, then you'll be a happy camper.
	It's never going to happen.
	Here's what's more likely to happen.
	Can I just say something, John?
	I'm giving this information to our listeners because the next time...
	Someone goes off about women are not treated equally.
	All you have to say is, hey, you really want to change the world?
	Start with those three groups.
	You change those guys?
	I think we all got that.
	And it's very good information.
	And I will use it too.
	I like it.
	I was wondering what it was going to be.
	I thought maybe General Electric.
	But I'm American and I think business.
	I think stocks.
	I think insider trading.
	I think NSA spying on people.
	Industrial.
	I didn't even in a million years think you were going to drop three religions on me.
	You know what the worst thing is?
	Remember when Sinead O'Connor...
	What about the Buddhists, by the way?
	I think they're the same thing.
	Remember when Sinead O'Connor was on Saturday Night Live and she ripped up the picture of the Pope?
	Yeah.
	And at the time, I was not awakened and I didn't quite understand.
	And I thought she was an idiot.
	I was like, what a dick!
	And now I'm like, oh my God, she was so right.
	She was ahead of her time.
	Way ahead of her time.
	With the haircut, too, I might add.
	Yeah, absolutely.
	Now, this is football season.
	This relates to what you just said, because this is the way women are used in college athletics.
	I kind of was aware of this, but I wasn't totally aware of it.
	This is a report.
	A new book came out, and I know you don't like sports or football, and this is college football season, but you've got to like this story.
	Apparently, the colleges are essentially using hookers...
	To get people to join their various football programs.
	They're called hostesses.
	And here is the football hostesses program.
	Wait a minute.
	We've evolved from sex with little boys to hookers?
	What an advancement.
	This is more common, I believe.
	What an advancement.
	There's a lot of case studies here, and many of the recruiting scandals rise out of recruiting.
	Absolutely.
	One of the ones you're talking about is the so-called hostesses, and it's a case at the University of Tennessee.
	Now, that's one that you don't see when you're watching Saturday the day.
	Absolutely.
	What are hostesses?
	Well, hostesses are essentially the first face.
	That a college recruit, a high school recruit will see coming on campus.
	They're vivacious.
	They're flirtatious.
	They know the program inside and out.
	They have been trained to act as really the out front face of the program.
	What Jeff and I document, and on the record through a young woman named Lacey Pearl Earps at Tennessee, was her experience as known as the closer.
	She was the top hostess there.
	What happens is, is there are sexual relationships that go on between the college girls and the high school athletes coming in.
	Not in Lacey's case, but there's a tremendous amount of flirtation and intimation that the possibility of a relationship exists.
	And that's a powerful allure.
	Think about it.
	A high school boy, 17 or 18 year old, on essentially a weekend date with a 21 or 22 year old girl, it's a very powerful, it's kind of like a secret weapon that these schools have.
	And it's under the, well, it's known by the authorities in this case, right?
	Oh, absolutely.
	The schools, you know, the hostess programs are integral parts of the athletic departments in many ways.
	And certainly in the media guides, they're treated as these sort of inert but outgoing aspects of the program.
	When in fact, particularly in conferences that are so competitive, like the SEC, they are crucial to getting these recruits to commit.
	One of the popular schools, apparently, is Moorhead State.
	Wow.
	It's a joke.
	It's a joke.
	I'm sorry.
	You're just so baffled by the whole clip.
	I was thinking to myself, wow.
	You weren't thinking of the joke.
	You were going, huh?
	Yeah, I'm like, wow.
	I missed out on so much.
	I could have been a basketball player.
	You're tall enough to be in your era, yeah.
	I could have been a good center.
	At least a center.
	No, no, no.
	Center.
	No?
	No, even back in the day, you wouldn't be a center.
	Maybe a forward.
	Wow.
	You're too short.
	So where does this leave us?
	Will something change in this outrage?
	No!
	Will women...
	Who wants to change anything?
	Well, the girls are having a good time.
	Yeah.
	Wow.
	So I got another clip here I want to get out of the way.
	Right on.
	This was an interesting thing.
	This is not reported at all by anybody except one of these crazy news outlets, the Euronews.
	And I think it's a very interesting piece of news.
	Clowns in Mexico.
	Mexico City has been invaded by peace-loving clowns.
	Coming from all over Latin America, they were in town for the 18th annual Clown Convention.
	Though their business may be laughs, they had a serious message.
	They wanted to spread their message of peace in the country which has seen 600,000 deaths due to drug-related violence in the last seven years.
	We want peace since there's so much violence in Mexico.
	We know how the situation is right now.
	We want a little bit of peace.
	We spread happiness, laughter, smiles.
	That's why we're clowns.
	Clowns are an integral part of life in Mexico.
	They can often be seen performing in the streets to earn a living, but it's a tough life.
	The convention will see a series of workshops to help them hone their craft.
	One clown explains the importance of getting together every year.
	To train ourselves better so there'll be work.
	Fortunately, us clowns that are trained are not worried about that.
	We don't suffer a lot like the majority of society.
	We will start dying from hunger when there are no children left.
	Clowns in Mexico.
	I, uh, I am not a fan of clowns.
	Are you one of those little kids that were scared of clowns?
	No, no, I've just never thought they were funny, never thought they were interesting.
	I never got the joke.
	I didn't.
	I think the world can be split up into two groups.
	People who are all in and people who are not all in on the clown thing.
	Yeah.
	There's a lot of people that hate clowns.
	I don't hate them.
	They're called clown haters.
	That's you, Adam Curry.
	Where are you on the clown thing?
	I find clowns to be amusing.
	They fall down and they do crazy things.
	They usually drive around in a little car and a whole bunch of them get in it.
	And they run around and they got funny feet and they got crazy makeup jobs.
	They're unbelievable.
	Alright, one more clip and then I'm going to let you slide.
	Will you let me go after one more?
	Coach, this is a story that needs more publicity.
	This is a disgusting story.
	Coach seats on American.
	Did you feel the squeeze flying coach on a consumer watch tonight?
	Julie Watts explains, there's a good reason for that.
	Airlines are shrinking their seats.
	According to the Wall Street Journal, first they slim lined them.
	Now big carriers like American, Air Canada, and Air France are adding an extra seat to each row and coach.
	There will now be 10 seats across, shrinking the seat width to just 17 inches.
	Take a look at how that compares to the 21-inch first-class seat.
	And even those look tiny compared to your average movie theater seat.
	To really put it in perspective, the new long-haul coach seats are significantly smaller than even Amtrak seats and stadium seats.
	Yeah, that's great news.
	We've booked a flight to Amsterdam in November for a week, because Miss Mickey's expo has been extended there, so she'd do some press and sell some stuff.
	And you're going to have to fly coach?
	Yeah, of course.
	Yeah.
	What do you mean?
	Is it going to be one of these idiotic...
	I think so.
	We have to put a website together with the seat widths and the leg rooms on every airline, and you should not fly on these airlines.
	Hey, John, that's a great idea.
	Another fantastic...
	We can't even get our own show website looking anything decent after six years.
	We have a one-page...
	Well, somebody out there should do it.
	We have a one-page website, and I like it that way.
	I know people are starting to condemn us for that.
	No, no one's condemning us.
	They do on the Twitch show.
	No, they're not condemning us.
	Please.
	Okay, I got one trailer.
	Listen to this.
	This is a good one.
	This is what we should have played earlier in the show.
	This is a movie trailer for a movie that's such a piece of crap that nobody would take the movie except the National Geographic channel.
	It's called Blackout.
	You know that we've played this, right?
	Is it the same clip?
	I know we played it, but I don't know if it's the same clip.
	Yeah, I think so.
	We are in the midst of what appears to be a colossal and history-making blackout.
	Where is everybody?
	We're stuck.
	We gotta get some water.
	Wait your turn!
	The current blackout is the result of a cyber attack.
	American Blackout, a premiere movie event, tomorrow at 9 on the National Geographic Channel.
	Is that tonight or is that last night?
	It would be tonight when they're showing the movie.
	Oh, we've got to watch.
	Isn't the actual drill taking place this week as well, the cyber attack grid blackout drill?
	I don't know if that's true, but there's another drill going on all over the Bay Area.
	And I have a clip.
	The Urban Shield drill.
	They actually, it seems to me, scare these kids.
	because you can hear little girls screaming their heads off as though something bad is happening.
	ABC News reporter Cornell Bernard has the story.
	Terrified students run from this Castro Valley Elementary School after a gunman fires shots on campus.
	What you're watching is not real.
	It's only a drill.
	But the realistic situation being created here, a vital exercise for first responders.
	We try to replicate what happens in these situations.
	We purposely try to make it chaotic.
	And we purposely try to make it a mess.
	So that when and if, and hopefully not, this ever happens, teams will be ready.
	Rob, so moving down there.
	This training session, one of many across the Bay Area this weekend, part of Urban Shield, the largest real-life drill for police and fire in the country.
	Yeah, I feel real safe.
	I really do.
	I'm telling you, those screams weren't like, say, scream.
	Because drills, you know, they have drills.
	They just have fire drills in school.
	They frighten the kids.
	Did you see the video?
	Were the kids screaming?
	Yeah, there's a bunch of kids running and waving their arms, running up the thing.
	Come on, kids, come on, come on.
	They probably had some clown walking around.
	Alright, I got my last two for you.
	This is the US version of the report, and then we'll play the BBC version right after that.
	Demolition now underway at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Connecticut, the site of that horrific shooting in Newtown.
	Contractors reportedly told to erase every inch of the school.
	The job is expected to take several weeks.
	The students displaced after the mass shooting last year have been going to school in a neighboring town, and a new school is set to open in Newtown in 2016.
	So these are the contractors that have to sign non-disclosures and they have to destroy every single inch.
	Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Connecticut, where 26 people were killed in a mass shooting last December, is to be demolished.
	A task force voted unanimously to tear down the school and build a new one in its place.
	Every part of the building will be destroyed to make sure that pieces of it are not kept as souvenirs.
	Oh, okay.
	That makes sense.
	Souvenirs.
	Okay, it's the souvenir hunters that we have to stop.
	Really?
	Seems unlikely.
	Yeah.
	Alright, I'm following some Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation stuff, which I'm going to save for Thursday, but it's pretty fun.
	Okay.
	In general, just more eugenic stuff, which I'm kind of loving all that.
	As well as the whole Silk Road Bitcoin thing is very bothersome still how that's being reported.
	So we'll check in on that.
	Some news from Africa.
	And some more emails.
	So working on stuff.
	Just working it.
	Working for you.
	Here at your service.
	Doing the best we can.
	How about you?
	I've got a couple of things.
	There's still a couple of things on here.
	I could run one last little shorty.
	Oh, okay.
	Before we leave, last one then.
	Yeah, the touching the belly clip is kind of like a baffler that is like, geez, does this make sense?
	But okay.
	A new law makes it illegal to touch pregnant women's tummies.
	Pennsylvania passed the law this week after a stranger kept touching a woman's belly against her will.
	What?
	Stop touching my belly.
	Wow.
	Against her will.
	What?
	Would they tie her down?
	I don't know.
	Well, there is...
	I have seen this.
	There is an annoying thing where people walk up to pregnant women and say, Can I touch your belly?
	I have seen it.
	I've seen it too, but what is the point?
	It's a fascination.
	Why do you want to touch a pregnant woman?
	I mean, I've touched a pregnant woman's belly, but I don't know that I'm compelled to.
	It's a fascination with life, and it's a beautiful thing that's happening, and it makes you feel human.
	And you can't do that, slave!
	Stop touching bellies!
	It's against the law, in Pennsylvania anyway.
	That's it for six years.
	Yeah, six years.
	We're starting year seven on Thursday, which will be 561.
	561.
	Six plus one is seven.
	And so we have that coming up.
	And...
	We'll be loaded for bear because there doesn't seem to be...
	By the way, this should be the week where there is an incident.
	That's right.
	Six-week cycle starts.
	Six-week cycle, so that we're going to give it until the next show, which will be Sunday, the next Sunday show, for something this week to happen.
	We'll see.
	Coming to you from Austin, Texas.
	In the morning, I'm Adam Curry.
	And from Northern Silicon Valley, I'm John C. DeVore.
	We will talk to you again on Thursday, right here.
	On no agenda.
	Shut up, slave.
	Adios, mofo.

▲