The Megyn Kelly Show - 20231201_santos-expelled-and-desantis-vs-newsom-with-newt-g

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Dec. 1, 2023 - The Megyn Kelly Show

01:38:05

20231201_santos-expelled-and-desantis-vs-newsom-with-newt-g

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FIKEN Accounting Program 00:03:39
	FIKEN presents a super-enkelt regnskaps-program for all the regnskaps-greines to your company.
	That was very simple.
	FIKEN, a super-enkelt regnskaps-program.
	We've got two guests for you that they've spent time, both of them with Snookie.
	Remember Snookie from Jersey Shore?
	We've got quite a pairing for you to end out the week.
	Former Speaker of the House, Newt Gingrich, did you not know about his hanging out with Snookie?
	We'll get you up to speed.
	Followed by Mike the Situation Sorantino.
	He was one of the stars of MTV's Jersey Shore fame.
	And you may be wondering, why on earth did she book Mike the Situation Sorrentino?
	And when my team first said, Do you want to talk to Mike the Situation? I said, No.
	Why would I?
	What?
	And then they started giving me the pitch.
	And the more I learned about this guy, the more I was like, I actually can't wait to talk to him.
	So we'll do it together in just a little bit.
	And I think you're going to wind up as fascinated by this guy as I became.
	He's going to talk about his new book.
	Boy, oh boy, his life took some big pitfalls after he rose to the top of reality TV royalty.
	He's turned things around.
	We'll talk to him all about it.
	But we start today with former Speaker Newt Gingrich with a preview of next week's critical GOP debate and what each candidate needs to do as they look to make their final statements before Iowa.
	Plus, Representative George Santos has just been expelled from the House.
	Newt is also the author of the recently released book, March to the Majority, the real story of the Republican Revolution.
	Ukens annonsør er Alente.
	Ok, sommeren er fantastisk, men la oss være ærlige, det er ikke bare sol og idyll hele tiden.
	Noen dager regner helt bort, og ungene våkner grytidlig, og andre ganger trenger du bare litt ro og en god serie å koble med.
	Da kan jeg tipse om Alente Stream Flex 2.
	For bare 79 kroner i måneden får du da 12 TV-kanaler, TV2 Play basis med reklame, via Play film og serier, og to ekstra streamingtjenester som du velger helt selv.
	HBO Max, Prime Video, Sky Showtime, you name it.
	You get to the whole family, and it works over all the way.
	On the phone, on the phone, on the phone, on the phone, on the phone, on the phone, on the phone, on the phone and on the phone.
	Alente works in the whole EU and EUS.
	All you need is net, and Alente.
	Three months, 79 kroner per month, no binding, just TV and streaming, just like you would have it.
	Go to alente.no and test it in summer.
	Tilbudsprisen på 79 kroner får du i tre måneder, deretter gjelder normalpris på 499 kroner per måned.
	How are you doing?
	If you can see this or not, this is my screensaver.
	No, it is not.
	It is Snooky, Colosta, and me, and it was taken by Jay Leno.
California Politics Debate 00:15:36
	So you can see why I keep it.
	We actually, my crack team went back and found something about you all on the tonight show together back in 2012.
	Here it is, thought one.
	Snooky and Jay Wow.
	It's, you know, it's pretty much about us as best friends.
	It's not the aspect of like drinking on Jersey Shore gone crazy, but more like our relationships, my pregnancy, and just us as best friends.
	You'd be getting good reviews.
	Yeah.
	Maybe Newt could guest star on the show.
	That'd be fun.
	Drop in.
	That'd be awesome.
	That'd be great.
	You could like drink round language and stuff.
	Just hang out.
	Do you drink, by the way?
	Sometimes.
	Yeah.
	Good for you.
	When was the last time you just got wasted?
	Was there a time you just thinking about coming on the show?
	Thinking about coming on the show.
	Well done.
	All your rules are cutting.
	I have to tell you, Callista sent Snookie copies of Callista's Ellis the Elephant books for children.
	And Snookie actually read them on Jersey Shore.
	So it was a fun moment.
	And as I said, I still have, as a screensaver, Snookie's right there with me all the time.
	I'll bet you didn't.
	No, I really didn't.
	In fact, I was like, tell him no offense that we booked him the same day as the situation.
	And they're like, no, he said no offense taken.
	With all due respect to Mike.
	Okay, so let's get into it.
	There's so much to go over.
	It's a great day to have you.
	What does it mean that George Santos has been expelled?
	Because my information was nobody in the history of the House has ever been expelled until they've been convicted of a crime and he hasn't been convicted of one, but they've been doing all sorts of internal investigations into him.
	Well, I actually think there have been one or two cases where they were expelled where the evidence was overwhelming.
	Look, from everything that any normal person could get, this guy is a liar, a crook, totally arrogant, totally untrustworthy.
	And I think, frankly, he just eventually offended so many of his colleagues.
	Now, if you're a partisan Democrat and you have a chance to throw out a Republican, that's an easy vote.
	But, you know, he had basically a majority of the House Republicans voted to expel him.
	And the speaker had made it an open vote and said, look, vote your conscience.
	Now, I think it's always dangerous to do because under our system, you are elected by the people of your district.
	And unless you've done something extraordinary, which is really inappropriate for the other members to render judgment.
	But I think in Santos' case, and he kind of said that himself.
	I mean, I was amazed.
	He was on Fox and Friends this morning, basically saying, yeah, I know they're going to kick me out, but I'm really a lot nicer guy than that.
	And I thought, this guy doesn't get it.
	And I think we once expelled a member from the conference, not from the House, Judge Kelly of Florida, who had been involved in the ABSCAM scandal where the FBI had a bunch of guys pretending to be Arabs bribing congressmen.
	Kelly's defense was they did have $20,000 in cash in the glove compartment of his pickup truck, but that's because he was eventually going to take it to the FBI.
	And none of us found that believable.
	And so, you know, so he's gone.
	So what happens now?
	DeSantos, to his seat.
	Like, what do we do about that seat now?
	Because the Republicans can't.
	Well, there's a lot of them.
	There'll be a special election.
	The difference between the Senate and the House is all House seats represent the people of the district, and you can only fill them by special election.
	In the Senate, because it represents a state, the governor can appoint an interim senator until the next election.
	But in the House, you have to have a special.
	And so I suspect I think probably in April, there'll be a special election for him.
	And given the size of the recent Republican majorities in Long Island, there's a very real likelihood we'll elect another Republican, one who's more conservative and more honest than Santos.
	Okay.
	All right.
	So the other big news of the day so far is this debate between Ron DeSantis and Gavin Newsom on Hannity's show last night.
	I confess to you, I watched a little bit of this and then found it unstomachable.
	I just, I, Gavin Newsom is so annoying to me.
	He's just, he kept interrupting.
	He was dying to show that he was a tough guy, which is, of course, like a note to all men.
	If your instincts are show how tough I am, don't do it.
	Don't do it.
	You're about to do something that will communicate the exact opposite of toughness.
	That's how he seemed to me.
	DeSantis was measured.
	He was scoring a lot of points.
	But I wound up thinking like anybody would win against this guy, Newsom, because he's so annoying and unlikable.
	What did you think?
	Well, first of all, Clist and I watched almost all of it until Hannity talked him into adding an extra 20 minutes.
	And then we couldn't do any more.
	But it was interesting to me at a couple of levels, partially because it was actually held in my old district now, Feretta, and I'm very, very close to Sean.
	But also, I thought the contrast of the two states, when you look at the record of Florida, the record of California, and then, and I want to pick up a second on what you said about toughness.
	The truth is, Ron DeSantis was the captain of the Yale baseball team, served in the U.S. Navy, and I have no doubt that in terms of pure toughness, he is tougher than Newsom.
	He's probably not as mean as Newsom, but he's tougher.
	But it was clear as the evening went on, Newsom and his consultants had decided that he would basically audition to be Joe Biden's best friend, and that his job was to attack DeSantis personally.
	And frankly, he lied so often.
	I mean, I watched Newsome and I thought, and he wants us to believe, I'm talking to you from Florida.
	He wants us to believe that Florida with no income tax is somehow a higher tax state than California, and that the California price of gasoline, which is $3 a gallon more than Florida, somehow is really good for working people.
	And you go down the list and you just think to yourself, this is a guy who can say anything with a straight face and count on you to not be prepared to take him head on.
	But I thought that DeSantis was better than he had been in the presidential campaign.
	And I thought that, like you, I found Newsome sort of so off-putting just as a personality that it was hard to actually take his argument seriously.
	Yeah, he had no dignity.
	That's what I was missing.
	There was no dignity.
	It just looked like a man desperate for attention.
	And whenever DeSantis was scoring points on him, he would interrupt over and over to try to talk over the points as just a, you know, that's like a middle school debate tactic, which is pathetic and not effective.
	Here's a little bit of how he sounded with the personal attacks.
	Rather than really going after Florida or Ron DeSantis' leadership, he tried to get to him being down in the polls, which he is.
	That's a whole other thing.
	But here's how Newsom sounded in SOT 8.
	I'm the only guy here.
	It's a border state governor.
	You're trolling folks and trying to find migrants to play political games to try to get some news and tension so you can out Trump Trump.
	And by the way, how's that going for you, Ron?
	You're down 41 points in your own home state.
	So that's how he sounded most of the night, whereas DeSantis was he had clearly done his homework on the many, many problems in California.
	The moment that there are a couple of them, but two of the moments that people are talking about more than any other are this one.
	I'll just let it speak for itself in SOT 4.
	So I was talking to a fella who had made the move from California to Florida.
	And he was telling me that Florida is much better governed, safer, better budget, lower taxes, all this stuff.
	And he's really happy with the quality of life.
	And then he paused and he said, and oh, by the way, I'm Gavin Newsom's father-in-law.
	I mean, that was pretty good.
	I thought that was close to a home run.
	Right?
	You're the king of debating.
	That was a good one.
	That was very good.
	So, yeah, there was no real answer for that.
	And actually, Newsom wasn't able to answer it.
	Then DeSantis brought up the disgusting, filthy streets of San Francisco, which we've been covering in the news now for a year, unless you're President Xi from China, in which case they'll clean it right up for you.
	But this was quite a moment with what people are now referring to as the poop map in SOT 3.
	An app where they plot the human feces that are found on the streets of San Francisco.
	And you see how almost the whole thing is covered because that is what has happened in one of the previous greatest cities this country's ever had.
	Human feces is now a fact of life, except when a communist dictator comes to town.
	Then they cleaned up the streets.
	They lined the streets with Chinese flags.
	They didn't put American flags there.
	They cleaned everything up.
	So they're willing to do it for a communist dictator, but they're not willing to do it for their own causes.
	I want to get in with the limited time we have left.
	I want to get there.
	So that's the defense.
	It's such nonsense, is it?
	Well, look, I mean, I think that at a fact basis, and this is what really puzzles me about California, at a fact basis, politicians like Newsome and the California Assembly have crippled what's arguably the greatest state we have.
	And it's a beautiful state.
	And Ron DeSantis was able to say things he liked about California when it was Newsom's turn.
	He didn't even try.
	I mean, you know, he couldn't say that.
	Because just to clarify, they were asked to say something nice about each other's state, and Ron DeSantis did it, and Newsom didn't.
	That's right.
	It was amazing.
	And then DeSantis was actually very generous in his comments about California as a community, as a beautiful place, et cetera.
	And I thought in that sense that DeSantis clearly was better than Newsom in terms of the whole evening and the effect he had.
	And I thought it was good for him.
	I don't think it particularly helps you in the presidential race, which is a different kind of problem.
	But I did think that he did well.
	And I can tell you from the view down here, he's a very, very good governor.
	And he's a much better governor than he has been as a presidential candidate.
	Well, the thing is, what was interesting to me is there are real questions about whether Joe Biden can see this through.
	And, you know, whether it's his age, his health, or he just gets pushed out as the nominee.
	And who do they have in waiting?
	There's an article out today saying there's no plan B. Democrats are in a panic, according to Reuters, because there is no plan B. That's a quote from a senior Democrat.
	If Biden were, quote, suddenly not to run, however that happens, everyone you know would run, says this person.
	The vice president scares no one.
	And he said he believes that Newsom is all over the place, partially to remind Democratic voters that he is out there as an option.
	And that's what other Dems want to do.
	Like we're still here.
	We're good backups.
	But let me ask you, Newt, are they?
	Are they good backups?
	I look at things like, I'll play this in SOT 5 and I think this is not good for Gavin Newsom for us to be reminded of his policies in that crazy state that he's ruining.
	SOT 5, take a listen.
	But let me just say something about parents' rights because he says California respects parents' rights.
	This is rich.
	He's been telling a lot of whoppers tonight, this may be the biggest.
	In California, if you're a parent in Iowa or New Hampshire or South Carolina, your minor child can go to California without your knowledge or without your consent and get hormone therapy, puberty blockers, and a sex change operation, all without you knowing or consenting.
	How in the heck is that honoring parents' rights when you're bringing people from out of state to go around their parents' backs and getting life-altering surgeries?
	That is radical.
	That is an assault on parents' rights.
	You know what?
	Ron, not for you to decide.
	It's for the parents to decide.
	I mean, you tell me because that's as clear as it comes when it comes to policy and distinction.
	Sure.
	And if you remember, over and over again, Newsom would fall back into: if you question this, you're homophobic.
	You know, so you weren't allowed to question the books that they have for elementary school in California, many of which are overtly sexual and overtly in favor of either transgenderism or certainly gay and lesbian behavior.
	And this is in first, second, third, fourth grade.
	And you have, I thought it was fascinating.
	And I would give DeSantis and his team credit.
	They were very well prepared.
	They had props, as you pointed out on the poop map as an example, but they had a series of these props that were real.
	And that Newsom had to attack DeSantis personally because he couldn't defend California policies.
	And I think in a national campaign, if the choice was the radicalism of California, which people are physically fleeing, or where, or the alternative, I think that Newsom would get beaten very badly.
	Here's another example of Newsom just trying to hurl dirt in an effort to score a point, as opposed to defending his state and showing what is it that's wrong with Florida again and the way Ron DeSantis governs it, sat six.
	Why the kids were locked out of school for so long?
	Joe Biden is in the pocket of the teachers union, and so is Kamala Harris.
	That's why they fought school opening when he came in there.
	They have that in Ron.
	It's come into office and he brought in the teacher union to be able to do all these different things.
	What did you make of that?
	I mean, truly, you're the expert of debate performances.
	So what do you make of that moment?
	Well, I mean, first of all, my general principle was to be quiet until there was an opening and then to be very decisive and very explicit.
	And I think that Newsom lowers himself.
	I think my only advice to DeSantis would have been that he would have been better off at times to have stopped and said, okay, I'm going to yield to you to finish your statement, and then I expect you to allow me to finish mine.
	I think had he done that two or three times, he would have psychologically taken control of the stage because Newsom just couldn't, you know, Newsom's entire goal a little bit reminds me of a squid, which uses black ink to hide from predators as it goes away.
	He was throwing up the black ink of personality attacks.
	And, you know, I mean, I don't know how you pronounce Kamala Harris's name.
	And frankly, she's such a bad vice president.
	I'm not sure I'm willing to spend a lot of time learning.
	She's, I think, by the way, the most likely Democratic nominee if Biden steps down.
Republican Primary Race 00:15:41
	I mean, people shouldn't kid themselves.
	The idea inside the Democratic Party that you are going to reject a black female vice president without having a total rebellion in the black women is the ultimate base of the Democratic Party right now.
	And I think that it'll be very hard for them to push her to one side.
	And she represents the same San Francisco mafia that the Alvin Newsome does.
	They're both from San Francisco.
	They both represent the same power structure.
	That's a very good point.
	You know, you're right about the way DeSantis should have handled that.
	He did do that at one of the debates when he said, we're all adults there.
	We're not going to raise our hands.
	If you want us to answer a question, we'll do it.
	And he kind of put the Fox News moderators in their place.
	And it was a strong moment for him, you know.
	And you're right.
	I hadn't even considered that.
	The candidates watching this right now, Mr. Speaker, and I've been told that they're all watching in advance of the Wednesday debate to figure out if they can glean any clues on the questions.
	You should do that.
	Don't make me be the traffic cop.
	You be your own traffic cop.
	Tell the other person to shut up until you're done or seed the floor so that they look like the rude interrupter they are.
	And then you can have the floor back.
	But you're right.
	Why leave it all up to the moderator?
	Why not you take control?
	Well, and frankly, you reduce your stature.
	I mean, you're talking here about the presidency of the United States.
	People, and this is a weakness both for Trump because at times he shoots himself in the foot, and it's a weakness for Biden because there are periods where he looks like he doesn't know what he's doing.
	And both of those are less than what we want in a president.
	We want confidence, calmness, a sense of domination.
	You want a president to be strong because the world is dangerous and the problems are hard.
	And when you get sucked into seventh grade, and I thought you had it exactly right earlier, you get sucked into seventh grade debates yelling at each other, you just shrink.
	You don't look like an alternative president.
	You look like some person out here who doesn't know what they're doing.
	So what did it all amount to?
	It was interesting, you know, mildly in terms of the differences between the way you govern California versus the way DeSantis is governing Florida.
	But DeSantis, I mean, there's a latest poll out today.
	It's the Messenger, which is a new news service/slash Harris poll and conducted online, 4,000 registered voters.
	Trump is at 68.
	DeSantis is at nine, 68 to 9.
	Haley's at seven.
	Ramaswamy's at four.
	That's, I mean, like, how does somebody overcome that kind of a deficit?
	I don't know if it's debating Gavin Newsom on Hannity.
	I think it was a clever thing to do.
	And in the long run, evolution of Ron DeSantis, not this presidential race, but just in the long run, it was a good thing to do.
	I personally think the more we can draw a contrast between the blue states that are losing population and the red states that are gaining and recognize that it's actually policy differences and that between taxes and crime and a bad education system, these huge states that were historically dominant are all just hemorrhaging people who are leaving.
	I mean, they're voting with their feet.
	But I think also, my personal view is when you talk, if you're only talking about the nomination, that barring some enormous health problem, Trump is the nominee, period.
	It's over.
	And that the poll today is a little stronger than he was a week ago, partly, I suspect, because DeSantis is weaker, but also because on the Republican side, and with at least half of the independents, there's a belief that Trump is not actually a candidate.
	Trump is the leader of a movement.
	And the emotional bond between the leader of a movement and their supporters is very different than the bond of a candidate.
	And with each passing month, I think Trump has gained confidence.
	I think he's gotten better, frankly.
	And I think that when you watch, you know, the other day, I mean, Nikki Haley's having a nice little boomlet, which in the end won't amount to much, but it will increase her market value after the campaign.
	But Trump goes to South Carolina, goes out on the field at the Clemson University of South Carolina game.
	People are standing, cheering, screaming Trump.
	And 81 Republican leaders in South Carolina endorse him, most of whom have been for Tim Scott.
	And now they're for Donald Trump.
	Well, he's already ahead of her, I think, by 43 points in South Carolina.
	As Newsom pointed out, he's ahead of DeSantis in Florida by 41 points.
	From the people I talk to in Iowa, Trump's almost certainly going to win the caucus by a huge margin.
	There'll be some effort to stop him in New Hampshire, but I doubt if it'll work.
	And in a sense, what you're seeing as a debate next week is who gets to be the alternative to Trump.
	And unfortunately for Ron DeSantis, who, as I said, is a very, very good governor.
	His campaign was so badly put together early on, and the Trump people were so smart at just taking him apart that the major money class that had been backing him have all given up now.
	And so they're all shifting over to Haley.
	Nikki will have a surge of resources.
	And so she'll look very, very good.
	But remember, there are two races here.
	There's the race for the Donald Trump 55 to 70%.
	And then there's the race among the whoever's left.
	And if you're at 6% or 8% or 9%, and we're not talking about, as you know very well, we're not talking about very far away.
	I think it's about six weeks to the Iowa caucus.
	And I don't see any evidence right now that anybody's going to break through in Iowa.
	And if Trump wins Iowa by the kind of margin he's capable of and then pivots and wins New Hampshire, basically the nomination's over.
	And that'll still be in January.
	And now you'll be in a general election and Trump will focus entirely on beating Biden.
	So, I mean, do you obviously these candidates are showing up next week because they think they still have a chance?
	Do you think they're thinking they still have a chance the traditional way?
	You know, I've been calling it the inside straight way where something happens.
	You know, Bob Vanderplatz, the family leader, he's endorsed DeSantis.
	He said Iowa's going to rise up against Trump.
	He thinks he's always backed the winner since 2008 in Iowa.
	He's always been able to pick the one who nobody else saw coming.
	So what if he's right?
	And somehow, let's say DeSantis wins Iowa.
	And then I don't know what happens.
	The money people in New Hampshire, maybe they still stick with Nikki, but then you get down to South Carolina, Trump has some sort of health issue.
	And before you know it, DeSantis is winning the old-fashioned way.
	Do you think they're thinking about that?
	Or do you think they're all just thinking Trump's probably going to jail?
	Something devastating is going to happen to Trump.
	And I need to be the shiny, beautiful alternative over here.
	And I got to fight the rest of these people to make sure I'm that person.
	Well, I think two things happen to you.
	I mean, first of all, you're in the campaign.
	You have to believe you have a chance.
	Otherwise, how do you get up in the morning and go stand at the factory gate or go stand at the local coffee shop?
	So at some level, they all have this mythical sense.
	And the only two that it makes any sense for are Nikki Haley and Braun DeSantis.
	The others clearly have no chance of any kind.
	Second, you kind of think, well, maybe lightning will strike.
	So, you know, as you said, a major health problem for Trump or something.
	Some of their consultants may think that getting convicted would matter.
	I personally don't think it would matter in the primaries.
	It might matter in the general, but a majority of Republicans have said to the pollsters over and over again, they will vote for Trump, even if he's convicted, because they don't believe in the process.
	They all think it's a lie.
	They all think it's political.
	So they're all far left for the most part.
	They're going to be all far left.
	That's right, I mean.
	You have a hard left judge in Washington, D.C., in a constituency where Trump got 5%.
	Now, does anybody seriously believe you can get justice before your peers in that environment?
	So, but there's another thing that's human.
	How do they get out?
	You know, I mean, it's one thing if you're down at zero and you have no money, but if you're Ron DeSantis, do you really want to just quit?
	I mean, isn't it almost better to get beaten than to just step out?
	And so they also get caught up.
	I mean, I thought Tim Smith, or rather Tim Scott, was very smart and showed great maturity in saying, you know, I'm not moving the needle and there's no point in my doing this.
	And so he dropped out with dignity.
	But I think the amount of ego and intensity that both Haley and DeSantis have in this thing, it'd be very hard for them to drop out before they lose.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	And you know what?
	Their voters have the right to pull the lever for them and say, I don't care that Trump's the favorite.
	You know, this is a moral issue for me, whatever it is.
	So it's not over till it's over.
	But what do you think?
	You know, if you're in their position, I agree with you.
	Vivek, I don't know, he's in it at this point for other reasons.
	He has zero chance, according to these polls, at least.
	Same for Bergham, same for, I mean, what's his name is still in it?
	Asa Hutchinson has not yet dropped out.
	They have zero percent, but okay, they're not ready to go.
	That's up to them.
	I think they have there are different patterns here.
	Bergum is a billionaire.
	He's been governor and doesn't cost him much.
	And frankly, if he drops out, he's going to be back in North Dakota.
	I think Ramaswamy is very clever.
	I've done three podcasts at Newts World with him.
	And he's created two companies that are worth over a billion dollars each.
	I think he's very, very intelligent.
	But I think he really underestimated sort of having a second act.
	And so he was interesting the first debate, and then he became boring, and then he became irritating.
	And I think he actually hurts himself now by staying in.
	I think he'd be much better off.
	You know, he's gotten his name out there.
	People sort of know who he is.
	And he ought to start thinking about what's his next dance, not hanging on to this dance, because not only is it not going to work for him, but the more he is irritating and the more he is too much of a sort of, he reminds me of the seventh grade chemistry major who's a know-it-all and everybody else in the class can't stand him.
	And he comes across that way.
	And so what was interesting the first couple of times becomes increasingly irritating and I think actually weakens him.
	I think he's running to be the Trump alternative that's the most Trumpy.
	That's where he's landed.
	That's not who he was two years ago, but that's what he's decided to do, thinking, I think, this is my guess, and I don't know, that he's not going to do the inside straight.
	But if something happens to Trump, you want to be just the most like Trump, you know, just the closest thing we could have to Trump.
	And Trump's thrown enough baggage at DeSantis and Haley that the MAGA base doesn't love them anymore.
	So there's Vivek as like a wannabe.
	Does that make any sense?
	Yeah, it makes a lot of sense.
	I don't think it works for him because, you know, and you know this because you've been in this business a long time and you know it's easy to think of something and hard to do it.
	So in theory, he could fit that box.
	But in practice, frankly, if Trump were to disappear, I think DeSantis would come closer to picking up the Trump base than anybody else.
	And I think DeSantis's policies fit that.
	But you also at that point would have chaos.
	I mean, who knows how many candidates would emerge, except for a point I always read Mark Halperin every day and his wide world of news and find it extraordinarily educational.
	And Halperin keeps making the point: there is an objective calendar and you can't get on the ballot.
	So somebody decided, you know, he was talking about this in terms of Young, governor of Virginia.
	Somebody who tried right now to get into the game, they wouldn't be able to get in the first half of all the primaries because they're already closed.
	Yeah.
	And so, you know, if something did happen, it may well be that the only two realistic alternatives would be Nikki and DeSantis.
	And that would kind of, I mean, that would be kind of an interesting fight to see the two of them go down the stretch arguing over the future of the country.
	But we forgot about Christy, too.
	We forgot about Christy.
	He's also running for Christmas.
	I think Christie is, okay, I'm biased.
	I think he is so dislikable that his ceiling is 6 or 7%.
	Just because you watch him on stage and you just think, you know, he has all the worst characteristics of Newsom and none of his charm.
	Well, you can't, you know, he's very much opposed to Trump and the party belongs to Trump right now.
	For better or for worse, it's Trump's party.
	So it's a very hard position to be in.
	All right, I've got to ask you this before I let you go.
	So if you're DeSantis and/or Haley and Vivek, those are the three we know are going to make the debate.
	Christy, we don't think so, but he could.
	They're tracking a couple polls where that might make the door or might open the door.
	What do you do?
	I mean, I believe you must do something different.
	You must do something else because whatever they've been doing, I realize Nikki Haley's in the middle of a boomlin, as you said.
	Her poll numbers have gone up a little.
	She's gotten more money backing very late in the contest.
	So I'm going to guess she's probably not going to do too much.
	You know, she's not going to exchange her old behavior for new.
	But what about DeSantis?
	What about Vivek?
	What would you advise them to do?
	Well, I think they have three different challenges.
	I mean, my advice to Vivek would be discipline yourself to speak at half your current speed.
	Say fewer words and actually make sense because he talks way too fast and he babbles.
	So my advice, he's got to come across as much more mature than he currently is.
	My advice to Nikki would be emphasize national security and foreign policy right now.
	You've got a war in Gaza.
	You've got Iran.
	You've got, and by the way, you may have noticed that the U.S. House voted in a veto override majority to freeze all of the $6 billion in Iranian money so that even if Biden vetoes it, which he probably will, they'll override the veto.
Reality Check Show 00:10:28
	I thought that was a significant bipartisan shift.
	So she's in a good position to say, look, I've been at the United Nations.
	I've been in the middle of all this.
	This is how seriously we have to take the world.
	And to be sort of the, if you're worried about being safe, she's the right person.
	I think in DeSantis' case, he was on to something last night, and he ought to go back to it.
	We've proven in Florida that we can have the best education program in the country through choice, that we can have great, a great environment, a great economy, that parents can have the right to know what's going on with their children, that we can control crime, and that we actually can have streets with no feces.
	Now, if you would like America to resemble Florida, then I'm your candidate.
	And I think he would be better off.
	He has to do just well enough to come in second in Iowa.
	But what will be the end for him is if Nikki comes in second in Iowa, and at that point, DeSantis will be gone as a candidate.
	Yeah, and she is, she's surging.
	She's at least tied in a couple of the polls.
	It wasn't much of a race between them in Iowa, and now it is at just the wrong time, though there's still about five weeks to go, five or six, until the caucuses begin.
	What a pleasure.
	Speaker Newt Gingrich, it's always great talking to you.
	Thank you so much for coming on.
	Well, that's great.
	And thank you for letting me show you my screen.
	I've never shown it to anybody else.
	I love this screen.
	And I just want to share it one last time.
	There's Callista and right in the middle, straight from Jersey Shore.
	And then, of course, it was taken by Jay Leno, which is why I have to keep Snookie, Calista, and Jay Leno is about all I can get in lunch.
	That one's good.
	He was such a gem.
	Thank you.
	I miss Jay Leno.
	Yeah, Mike, the pleasure is all mine.
	It was a scoop I never expected to get.
	All the best.
	Let's talk soon.
	All righty.
	Take care.
	All right.
	We will be right back with Mike the Situation, Sorantino.
	Just stick around.
	Trust me.
	Jim, Jim, Tanny, and Laundry.
	You're welcome to come with us.
	Jim Tannin Laundry?
	No.
	You driving me, driver.
	Let's go.
	These kids are robots.
	Jim Tanny Laundry.
	Every day since I got here, that's what they do every morning.
	Jim Tanny Laundry.
	You know, that's how they like make the Guidos.
	You know, I like to look very fresh and mint when I go out.
	So, you know, everything goes into it.
	You know, you got to go to the gym the whole week.
	You know, you have to have a little color if you didn't go to the beach.
	And then the last thing that you need to take care of is the outfit.
	Okay.
	Now, if the outfit is not looking good, then the whole package is off.
	And if you feel off, you're not going to have a good night.
	So how do you get the best results?
	GTL, baby.
	Jim Tan Laundry.
	Because if everything's put together and you feel great, you look great, awesome night.
	It's amazing.
	Welcome back to the Megan Kelly Show.
	It's almost the weekend, and that means it's time to get our fist pump on.
	Mike the Situation Sorrentino joins me now.
	Cannot wait to talk to him.
	You may know him as the hit star of the show Jersey Shore, which just completely dominated our culture for like three, four years.
	He's got quite a life story, which he recounts in his new memoir out later this month.
	It's called Reality Check, Making the Best of the Situation.
	Nicely done.
	How I Overcame Addiction, Loss, and Prison.
	It's available for pre-order right now.
	What a fun Christmas gift this would be.
	Consider this right now, Reality Check.
	It's fascinating.
	We're going to get into it all.
	Mike, welcome to the show.
	Thanks for having me, guys.
	Definitely feels like the first time every time on air for sure.
	That was an amazing little mashup of GTL, which is one of the things you're known for.
	Jim Tan Laundry, this was your thing long before Jersey Shore.
	Yes, it was definitely my lifestyle before Jersey Shore.
	And I'm sure it's probably the reason why they casted me in 2008.
	Okay.
	And we got to get into, first of all, that's a lot of gym.
	That explains all those muscles because it's not just your abs that you're favorite for, the APAC that you're famous for.
	It's the muscles are everywhere, Mike.
	They're all over.
	And as I understand it, you can only get those at the gym.
	But the tanning, sir, what about in today's day and age with skin cancer?
	Yeah, I'll be honest with you.
	I've just hit 41 and I do still go tanning, but I do not tan the face.
	Okay.
	So I don't know if that, I mean, it still puts me at risk probably for some skin cancer, but I do not tan the face.
	I spray tan most of the time.
	Yeah.
	You know what?
	When you're Italian like you are, it's less of a risk.
	I'm I'm part Italian, but I'm mostly Irish.
	And that's so I got to be different about it than you are.
	Yeah, my wife says I don't even have to tan.
	She said you normally have, you know, olive hollowed skin, but, you know, sometimes I just like to go for, you know, the routine of it all.
	So I can't believe your life.
	As I was saying when I was teasing the fact that you were coming on, I was like, I don't, I don't know anything about the situation.
	I wasn't a huge Jersey Shore watcher, but the show got so big, it bled out into contemporary society in a way you could not avoid.
	Everybody's heard of Jersey Shore, of the situation of Snookie, Speaker Gingrich included.
	Yeah, I saw that.
	But then I heard about your life.
	It's like the drugs and the prison and the possible mob and like a lot of stuff in there.
	Your life has been very colorful, my friend, by any average standard.
	Would you agree?
	Yes, I feel like I have lived 100 lives.
	I'm very grateful to be here today telling you my story.
	And I feel that anybody that is watching this show right now is definitely going to be in for a treat.
	So now you didn't start off your life in Jersey.
	You wound up there even before Jersey Shore.
	Didn't you come?
	You were originally in Staten Island?
	Yeah, I was born in Staten Island and I moved to New Jersey when I was seven years old.
	Okay.
	And did you notice any difference whatsoever?
	Because in my mind, those are exactly the same place.
	They're definitely very similar places.
	Usually people that are, you know, born in Staten Island, they eventually migrate to the Garden State and naturally what me and my family did as well.
	Okay.
	So you write in the book that there may or may not, you can't confirm or deny, have been a mob connection at the parental level.
	Like your dad, what business was he officially in?
	He was an electrical engineer and he had his own business.
	But if you lived in Staten Island in the 80s, I mean, there was really no way of escaping it.
	I mean, it was a part of the culture.
	It was all over the news.
	Like I said, I'd have to say that directly or indirectly, there definitely was a tie there.
	And, you know, in our home, there definitely was a love affair at all times with the mafia.
	And I'm sure that shaped the way that I grew up.
	And maybe the way you thought about prison, where you would, you would do your own.
	Yes.
	100%.
	That's definitely how I handled prison, how I handled some of the deals that were presented to me by the government.
	You know, if you read the book, early on, I was presented with ratting out my brother for a lighter sentence, which was just blasphemy to me.
	And we eventually knew that it was going to have to take this to the end of the line.
	All right.
	We're going to get to all that later.
	And you're one of your best friends in prison, who that was, because that's a fun part of your story, too.
	All right.
	But before all that, you're a young guy.
	You're grown up now in Jersey.
	You've left Staten Island.
	The fam's in Jersey.
	And this is important to me personally because when I married my husband Doug, he was in, he lived in Philly.
	He grew up in Philly.
	And the Jersey Shore is a big enclave for Philadelphia people.
	So, you know, Mike, I grew up running through my parents' sprinkler in the backyard.
	I had no shore place.
	Once a year, though, we'd go to the Jersey Shore and we'd go to Seaside Heights.
	That's the place.
	That's where you guys were.
	It was the highlight of my life.
	I mean, the Wildwood or the Seaside Heights fringe shirt in the 80s.
	That was like considered the peak of style.
	You went to Seaside if you were in junior prom or your senior prom.
	So that was the norm, you know, until we came along and we brought a little bit of the older crowd, the college kids.
	But it's a thing around here.
	If you're from the Garden State or anywhere in the area, when the seasons change and it becomes summertime, you go down to the shore.
	Right.
	You go down the shore.
	So that's what Doug's family did all his life.
	And the next thing I knew, he was taking me down the shore.
	And now we spend our summers down the shore.
	And we always talk about the show Jersey Shore because people are like, oh, Jersey.
	I mean, like, everyone in New York goes to the Hampton.
	It's all Jersey, which is fine by me because we don't want them coming.
	But you would be the first to say most of the Jersey Shore is not what was represented on the show, Jersey Shore.
	I mean, listen, it's definitely a subculture of Italians that was displayed on TV.
	I mean, obviously we don't represent everyone, but it was definitely a really microscope look at the subculture that was, you know, in your 20s, going out and MTV aired it and it became a juggernaut.
	You know, it has the ratings for the biggest show ever on MTV.
	It transcends generations.
	The kids dress up as us for Halloween still to this day.
	And we turned 15 minutes of fame into 15 years as the show is still on and still number one on MTV on Thursdays, 8-7 Central on MTV.
	Is that right to this day?
	To this day, it is still number one on Thursdays.
	We call it Jerse Days.
	8 p.m.
	It's the number one for MTV and sometimes on cable on Thursday night at 8 p.m.
	That's amazing.
Jersey Shore Fame 00:05:08
	All right.
	So you love Seaside Heights.
	You're in Jersey.
	You're getting a little older.
	And you, before you were on cast to be on the show, you had some other forays into what professional life might look like.
	One in particular was kind of controversial and you tried to keep it a secret from your parents or at least your mother.
	And tell us what that was.
	Are we talking about the stripping endeavor?
	That's the one.
	Yes.
	You know what?
	I was in college at the time and I also was a waiter.
	I was trying to be a fitness model.
	And my first introduction to going in that direction was stripping.
	And I was just in amazing shape.
	Women loved me.
	And I thought that it would be a good idea to make some spare cash and also get out for the night.
	Eventually, my mom, she found out that I was stripping because one of her girlfriends was at the venue that I was stripping.
	And she actually was the birthday girl.
	So I was the new young stripper coming out and you put the birthday chair out for the birthday girl.
	And, you know, you're sort of grinding up on this lucky woman.
	And then next thing you know, I come home and my mom has an umbrella in her hand.
	And back when I, when you're in the 80s, you know, mom could have had an umbrella, maybe a wooden spoon or something.
	And she asked me where I was.
	And I told her, oh, I was just picked up an extra shift at the restaurant.
	And, but she knew because she got the call from her girlfriend.
	And she was quite upset.
	And my father was in the corner smirking because, you know, usually he was the enforcer.
	He was the person doing the enforcing, whatever.
	Yeah.
	So was that hard for you?
	Like, I mean, most guys aren't confident enough in their dancing at a minimum to accept a job as a stripper.
	Forget the confidence in the bod.
	So had you taken dancing?
	Like, how does one become a stripper?
	I mean, when you are an introduction to a stripper, they usually give the new guys the jobs of the birthdays.
	And the birthdays are really easy because you're really just sort of grinding on stage on a chair.
	So that's kind of your introduction to gaining experience and gaining comfort on stage in front of a stage of ladies, pretty much.
	And they were easy to please.
	It's like, honestly, we don't, we know most guys don't have those moves.
	You know what?
	It was easy as a stripper.
	I was unbelievably shredded.
	I mean, you looked at my abs and you thought they were implants.
	Partly the reason why I got, you know, casted and I was world famous.
	But even before I was famous, women were definitely throwing themselves at me.
	All right.
	We're going to need to know how exactly they got so shredded because they really were shredded.
	It was a true eight-pack.
	Was there an unusual routine?
	Like, what, what does it take to have that?
	I think it was just genetics, but also I love to be in the gym.
	So, you know, I would go to the gym for probably 90 minutes to two hours, at least five times a week, sometimes two days.
	I would eat good.
	I would eat meals every two hours.
	And I was just, I was young.
	I was unbelievably shredded.
	And people always used to come up to me and they used to be like, listen, man, you should have done something with those abs.
	And I was like 25 years old and like I was over the hill or something.
	I'm like, what do you mean I should have done something?
	And that eventually pushed me to send photos in for modeling and try to go for TV.
	All right.
	That's a good place to leave it.
	Quick break back with the situation right after this.
	Was that the end of the stripping after mom found out and got you with the umbrella or did it continue?
	Yeah, no, no.
	Once mom came at me with the umbrella, I was like, ah, you know what?
	That was the end of my stripping days and I retired.
	My producers want me to ask, how did the mother who clearly recognized you of, or you know, the friend of your mother who clearly recognized you, how did she allow you to give her a lap dance, for God's sake?
	I was really good looking.
	She couldn't resist.
	She was only human.
	Yeah, no.
	I mean, I mean, I don't know if you've ever went to a male review before, but the women in there, they really let loose.
	Okay, they're raucous.
	Believe it or not, I've never seen male strippers.
	I've seen female strippers.
	It was one of those things when I was young.
	I got it kind of dragged along with the guys I worked with.
	And all I kept wanting to do was an intervention on all the young women.
	Like, sweetheart, you don't have to make your money this way.
	I could help you.
	I was such a drag.
	Okay.
Drug Dealing Confession 00:10:21
	So, so the other thing you were confused about, like what you did that was controversial when you were young, is you got into the sale of drugs.
	As I understand it, before you actually took any, you were kind of dealing them while you weren't taking them.
	Is that, do I have my facts right?
	Yes, I was ironically a really good hustler.
	Maybe I turned to that from my upbringing and the love affair I've, you know, in the 80s with Mafia.
	But I eventually turned to drug dealing probably around 19.
	And that's where it all started.
	How does that happen, right?
	Like, how does a normal, nice kid living in Jersey wind up dealing drugs?
	Is it hard to get the drugs?
	Who do you sell the drugs to?
	How do you let people know that you're a drug dealer?
	Well, I've had various connects over my lifetime as a young man.
	Sometimes it was cousins that lived in Brooklyn or Staten Island, and I was in New Jersey.
	And if you had that connect, it was very sought after.
	And so that would be the, you know, you would drive over to the bridge in Brooklyn because you were family on consignment.
	They would give you the drugs.
	Let's just say 30 pounds of marijuana, which would be valued at close to close to $100,000.
	You would have seven days to pay back, you know, said debt.
	And then you would go and you would slowly come back to Jersey.
	There would obviously be a process of transportation to make sure that you were successful transporting $100,000 worth of drugs that was given to you on consignment.
	So we had a little bit of a system going because we know that it was a very valued package.
	So we would put, we would have three cars.
	The first car would be the lead car and that would be sandwiched in between the product with the car with the product with the $100,000 worth of product in it.
	And then you had the follow vehicle.
	And we did that because if there was any police presence, we thought to ourselves that if the follow vehicle started to become erratic, they would swerve, they would go out of the way.
	They would just get a parking ticket because we didn't want to get caught in a drug charge.
	So that was the thought process on that.
	And then we'd come back to Jersey.
	We'd whack it up with the crew.
	Maybe you would have 10 guys under you.
	They all would take, you know, five pounds here, six pounds there, seven pounds.
	It all would add up.
	And then everybody would have seven days to get that $100,000 up.
	Wow.
	And then, like, how does, how do you figure out who the buyers are?
	How do you find buyers?
	Well, that wouldn't be my responsibility.
	I, you know, it's like a hierarchy of a tree.
	So if I had, let's just say, 10 guys under me, my job would be to find those guys, to take the five pounds, to take the seven that would take up to the 30 or 40 pounds, whatever I was getting.
	If they were trustworthy enough and they had a track record of producing and earning, I wouldn't question them because underneath them would be people that were taking maybe one pound, a quarter pound, a half a pound.
	And they might have had 10 guys underneath them.
	And we were running this business for quite some time.
	These all seem like possible avenues for cops to come in.
	You know, like someone's going to get caught.
	Someone's going to knock out the person above them.
	So wasn't that scary?
	You know, you'd previously been a legitimate law-abiding kid and now suddenly you're dealing drugs.
	Like this, this is the kind of stuff that could get in jail for decades.
	Yes, it was a very tempting lifestyle for a college kid.
	I was just a very risky, carefree young man.
	And I would, you know, if you told me not to do something, I would do it twice and take pictures.
	That was the type of kid I was.
	So there was a particular time period where I was doing this business for months and months, maybe a year and a half.
	And I got tipped off by a family member that said, yeah, you were one of the biggest distributors at the time in central Jersey and that they were gunning to take you down.
	And once I heard that, I definitely cooled it off and, you know, cooled it off means you stopped for a little bit.
	And was it just marijuana or was it other drugs too?
	It was marijuana for a while.
	And I really didn't have any issues, you know, thank God.
	But eventually, once I started to move into cocaine, and then once I started to move into prescription pills, that's when the problem started to happen.
	How do you resolve that morally, right?
	Like it's, it's, if it's grown people doing it, it's their exactly right.
	Yeah.
	That's how you resolve it morally.
	Yes.
	The first one was it's grown naturally.
	It's not hurting anybody.
	I'm a college kid.
	I'm in I'm in suburban America.
	I have cousins that are Italian that are giving me this on consignment.
	I'm doing it well.
	I'm a great earner.
	People, they like me.
	I'm not hurting anybody.
	That's how you resolve it.
	Do you do you still think the same way about it?
	What?
	If my son was to do something like that?
	Yeah.
	Or just even about, you know, your own, you look back at that year and a half.
	I don't know how long you think it was.
	I was back at that year and a half and I was a very risky young man.
	I'm lucky to be standing here today talking about my story.
	I think I've been spared by the almighty above to share my story and my light to others that might be suffering from either the disease of addiction or just bad decisions.
	Yeah, you immerse yourself in that kind of culture.
	It's very tempting.
	It can lead to bad places.
	And for you, ultimately, it was prescription drugs that you got addicted to.
	Yes, early on, once I started selling the weed, then it moved to cocaine, then it moved to prescription pills.
	Once I got to the prescription pills, I had a little bit of a taste of it.
	And they say, never get high on your own supply definitely held a lot of weight because as soon as I had that first taste of an opioid, to be honest with you, truthfully, I loved it.
	And the love affair with the devil had started.
	It's such a slippery slope.
	My God.
	Can I just ask you quickly?
	What do you think of where things have gone today?
	Because I know you write in the book about taking a Percocet and how you enjoyed that.
	Today, you could take a Percocet you get from a drug dealer and you could die, right?
	It's laced with fentanyl.
	That's my friend Eric Bowling's charity.
	One pill can kill.
	That's what happened to his son because they're getting laced with this stuff.
	Yeah, it's really bad right now.
	You know, all the drugs, the cocaine, the pills, even a pill that's not even an opiate, it could be a benzo.
	Sometimes they're laced with fentanyl and people are just dying.
	So it's a really, really bad time.
	I know the rates for addiction are through the roof right now and have been since COVID.
	One of the most powerful interviews I ever did when I was on NBC was of a mom, just so people know.
	And my son actually just recently repeated the story at a school parent-child thing on drugs and addiction and peer pressure.
	So it's sinking in.
	And I want the other parents to hear this because you can tell your kids the same.
	The mom came on.
	Her two teenage sons came home from college at this point.
	I think they were 18 and 20 about.
	And they went out to a party.
	She waited up until they got home, like most parents would do, and she went to bed.
	They were home.
	They were safe.
	And the next morning, they needed to leave.
	So she went down to the one son's bedroom and he was passed out, she thought.
	Ultimately, she realized he had died and she ran to the other son's bedroom to try to get his help with the first son.
	And it was the same.
	He also had died.
	Both of her sons.
	And it was because of this, Mike.
	They had bought, I think it was something, you know, ostensibly mild, like a Percocet or forgive me, my memory doesn't.
	Anyway, it could be pot.
	It could be Percocet.
	I thought it was a pill, but it had been laced.
	And both kids had a dealer come, give them the pill at the house.
	They took it.
	I mean, in their own home, and they were dead by morning.
	It really is true.
	One pill can kill.
	Yeah, it's so sad.
	And that's how I kind of got started too, just really by experimenting.
	You know, I really didn't have a bad childhood or anything like that.
	I was a young kid, you know, living in suburban America and I was just curious.
	That's it.
	That's terrifying, right?
	It's terrifying because we tell ourselves, oh, you know, if your kid's happy, if you're a loving parent, they won't start.
	They wouldn't do something like this.
	But you're telling us that's not true.
	No, no, it was pure out of curiosity.
	And it definitely wasn't out of peer pressure.
	When I was in college, I was more of a leader than a follower.
	You know, I was always a popular kid.
	I wanted to always push the limits of what I couldn't do and what I could do.
	Well, so you got hooked on opioids, and that is a very tough addiction to beat.
	So about how old are you now at this point?
	The first time around, I was probably around 26.
	This was right before I was discovered for TV.
Rehab and Recovery 00:07:24
	Okay.
	And did you go to rehab before Jersey Shore?
	I think you had, right?
	You went to rehab.
	Go ahead.
	Yeah, no, right before Jersey Shore, about a year and a half prior, I had went to rehab for the first time.
	And that was the same reason why me and my college sweetheart, who is now my wife, had broken up.
	We were going out for four years.
	Eventually, that addiction had taken over my life and my life was unmanageable.
	So me and my then-girlfriend broke up and then I had to go to rehab.
	And that is where my journey started.
	All right.
	So you get out of rehab and now you need to make money legitimately.
	You know, you have to, you have to pay the bills and so on.
	And you saw a flyer, a casting call flyer for Jersey Shore.
	Is that your first?
	Yeah.
	You know what?
	As soon as I got out of rehab, I really wanted to get back with my ex-girlfriend who we just flashed on the screen.
	She was like the love of my life and she inspired me.
	And I really didn't want her to be the one that got away.
	And she started to continue her schooling.
	She went to fashion school and it kind of sparked me to go for my dreams.
	And so I started to send photos into New York City at the top fitness and underwear modeling agencies because I was just in really, really good shape.
	And then eventually, I eventually was signed to a fitness and underwear agency.
	And then I saw that flyer that you just spoke of.
	And what did the flyer say?
	Like, do you remember what it was advertising that spoke to you?
	It said the hottest Guidos and Guidettes in the tri-state area come to Harris in Atlantic City.
	Yes.
	And it was a collection of the hottest Guidos and Guidets in Jersey.
	Oh, for sure.
	Everybody in that venue at Harris, Atlantic City, were the hottest Guidos and Guidets in the area.
	Everybody had a six-pack.
	All the girls were good looking.
	All the guys were good looking.
	And I had just come off a high from getting signed from a fitness and underwear agency.
	And I was really excited that maybe I was on the right track in life and I wasn't drug dealing and stripping anymore.
	Right.
	So you did you, I assume you had to be interviewed.
	What, how did that go?
	I was interviewed and they loved me at the time.
	This was 2008.
	And it was supposed to be a VH1 show.
	Viacom owns MTV and VH1.
	But at first, VH1 had it.
	I was definitely told that I was the number one pick, the first guy casted, and they wanted to shoot what's called a sizzle tape, which is almost like a little preview of the idea for the show that they wanted to do.
	Okay.
	So you wind up getting cast and then you get together with the other cast mates, all of whom would go on to become literally household names.
	Again, Snookie is the former house speaker's screensaver.
	Do you know how many famous people and world leaders he has met?
	And she is the screensaver.
	I mean, that tells you everything you need to know about the success of this show.
	So we have a clip from, I think this is from the first episode when the cast first arrives in Seaside Heights, New Jersey and meets for the first time.
	Here's a bit of that.
	Somebody in there?
	Hello, party's here.
	The party's here.
	How are you?
	Nice to meet you.
	I'm like, wow.
	She was like a little miniature Chihuahua painted with some spray paint black.
	Yeah.
	You guys drinking or what?
	Yeah, we just came here.
	Wow.
	Give me a shot.
	Honestly, bro, it doesn't get any better than that, though.
	Unless we had a stripper pole like right in the middle of the room.
	Don't bring home any wangsters, girls.
	So what was that?
	What did you make of your fellow castmates?
	I was on, you know, such a high because it had taken a year to sell that show and I was a part of it from the conception.
	So I went in thinking like, you know, had all this confidence.
	But when I got there, it was an amazing experience, you know, and I wanted to make the most of it.
	I never thought that, you know, that 15 minutes of fame would turn into 15 years.
	But I remember leaving that show or the last day of filming.
	And I was like, you know, once America sees this, I really feel that this is going to change things.
	And sure enough, once the show aired, it was like lightning in a bottle, record ratings.
	A year later, they would give us like a million dollar raise, the first kids to really get that type of money.
	And we were like, you know, changing the culture.
	How so?
	How do you think you changed the culture?
	I mean, it was everywhere.
	I mean, you know, we were on every channel, all the newses.
	I mean, I mean, every radio station, everybody was talking about Jersey Show.
	We were getting 9 million.
	9 million was the ratings that we were getting, which is like Game of Thrones numbers.
	And nobody had ever done that before.
	I was the GQ man of the year or the sensation of the year, which is one of, they actually, they pick many people.
	I think there's like five or six of them, but in 2010.
	So we were breaking the mold because in the beginning, nobody wanted to think of reality stars as anything other than, you know, something that they didn't want to watch.
	What was it, do you think, about Jersey Shore that people found so compelling, so must-see?
	I think that it was just so raw and just so unfiltered.
	Everybody, including myself, was their authentic selves.
	And then all of a sudden it's like, hairbone.
	What'd you say?
	And it was, you know, a once in a generation type of show.
	Even to this day, all the high school kids every year, they go back and they watch that, the first Jersey Shore franchise.
	And they all dress up as Snookie and the situation for Halloween.
	It's really extremely flattering.
	It's wild.
	Now, did you get along with the other castmates?
	I mean, the first one I wasn't really using.
	So yeah, the first one to a certain extent, you know, I did get along.
	At the end of the day, you know, if you're in a house with, you know, eight people, life's going to happen on life's terms.
	And you're not always going to get along with everyone, but that's what makes good TV, though.
Suitcase Drug Scandal 00:02:50
	So then there comes a time, then you did start using again.
	And there comes a time in the series where you went over to Italy for one of the seasons and you had a problem because you were a drug addict and you couldn't exactly pack all your drugs in a suitcase and do the carry-on.
	So what did you do?
	Every season, including starting in season two to Miami to all the way to season five to Italy, was literally like Mission Impossible, trying to sneak the drugs into different states, different countries, past security, past TSA.
	It was insanity.
	And if we're speaking about Italy, I had to think long and hard how I was going to get by that one because, you know, we're traveling across the world here.
	So I thought to myself that some of the other ways that I had used in previous other seasons were not going to work.
	So I tried a different method traveling to Italy.
	I disassembled my shoe and I put two Altoid cases in each shoe.
	Each shoe had 200 pills.
	So obviously one pair of shoe would have 400 rockets.
	If you know what a rocko set is, it is a 30 milligram oxycodone, which technically is three Percocet 10s.
	It's a very powerful, you know, painkiller.
	And I put that pair of shoes along with 20 other shoes in a suitcase so that it would be hard to distinguish that I was actually smuggling upwards of 400 oxycodone pills in a pair of shoes across country lines.
	And then once I got over to Italy and I got past, I guess, maybe TSA or maybe past immigration, then I had to get past the producers and security protocols of MTV.
	And they were gunning for me since season two, and rightfully so.
	You know, I was really doing the right thing.
	And once MTV started to frisk and go through all of my belongings, which they had a protocol, that's when they finally got to maybe my seventh suitcase, which they were already fatigued.
	And then I said, oh, those are my favorite shoes right there.
	The black feelers.
	Let me grab those and put those on now.
Rock Bottom Moment 00:08:29
	So then I would take them out of the equation.
	And that's how that's how that caper was.
	Oh my gosh.
	Were you sweating it out?
	I'm sure I was stressed.
	But you're looking at somebody who is doing these type of risky behaviors year after year, season after season.
	I'm getting paid millions on the number one show or the number one reality show in the country.
	So it's almost like I kept getting away with it.
	Obviously, we kind of know where the story progresses.
	Eventually, Uncle Sam would be the one to straighten me out, but it would take a few years before we got there.
	And I'm going to get back to what happened in Italy.
	But in the meantime, as you point out, you're a star.
	I mean, you are like the situation no longer just means the situation in America.
	It conjures an individual, you.
	And so that's the level of fame you guys hit.
	So you're doing things like we just talked about Jay Leno with Newt Gingrich and how Snookie was on it.
	You also went on Jay Leno.
	And as I understand it, Jay and others pulled you aside at various courses in your public appearances to say, Mike, what's going on?
	Can you talk about that?
	I mean, yeah.
	I mean, listen, if, for instance, your show, you know, if we were doing it in person, you'd see me enter your show and, you know, backstage and I got the glasses on, they're, you know, tipped.
	My pupils are pinpointed.
	You can tell from a mile away when somebody is that high.
	And I was always high.
	And I went on Jay Leno's show a lot, probably close to a dozen times and during that time period.
	And I remember always Jay pulling me aside and you could just see the concern that he knew I was just going down this path.
	And that path only led to destruction.
	Everybody knows.
	I mean, if I bunked into somebody like myself today, I would pull myself aside and be like, hey, wait a second, kid, are you okay?
	You know, are you making the right decisions?
	This may not last forever.
	Are you saving your money?
	Like, there are certain things that, you know, people like Jay Leno, whoopie Goldberg always used to pull me aside on the view.
	I remember another person was, and I'm such a big fan of him.
	Robert Downey Jr. has a similar story to mine with addiction.
	I saw him on the Today show, and you're always rubbing elbows with these A-listers.
	And you saw me and you just knew I wasn't doing the right thing.
	Do you think like Robert Downey Jr. recognized that you were drug addled?
	1 million percent.
	I mean, when I see people today, I can spot it a mile away, you know, that they're not doing the right thing.
	And people don't look you in the eye and they're quick and they're shifty and they're, you know, you can just, you see all the red flags.
	And I had to put it in the book.
	The people that I rubbed elbows with that didn't have to pull me aside, you know?
	And they did anyway.
	Can you go on about how you recognize this?
	Because I will tell you, this is an Achilles heel of mine.
	I never know when someone's on drugs.
	I'll just be like, what a weird dude.
	And my husband will be like, honey, he was on drugs.
	Like, he was?
	How do you know?
	Oh, my God.
	What are the signs?
	Shifty.
	You said that's one.
	They're shifty in there.
	I mean, if somebody doesn't look you in the eyes for more than a second, they're trying to hide something, obviously.
	Obviously, if you look at their eyes, a lot of the times, if the pupil is pinpoint, that's opiates.
	And then if they are very large, that's a possibility that it could be cocaine or an upper or maybe it could be an Adderall or some sort of speed.
	You know, sometimes if that attitude and that dismissiveness and that it's too loud, you know, that also can be a sign where somebody is just got a, I don't want to say douchebag on 1000 attitude, but I'm going to say it.
	Okay, that's helpful to know.
	All right.
	So back to Italy.
	You had packed, you thought, adequately for your lengthy stint over there to shoot this season, but it turned out your drugs ran out.
	You had not packed adequately.
	I guess you were going through them pretty fast.
	And then a famous thing happened on the show where you had a confrontation with a fellow castmate.
	You were, you write in the book about how you would run out of the pills.
	And so you were, you know, detoxing in an unsafe way, essentially.
	Yes.
	And this is what happened.
	You had a fight with Ronnie.
	And here's what happened.
	It's SOT 23.
	You want to hit me?
	You want to hit me?
	You want to throw it?
	Yeah, you got to throw my finger.
	You want to finger.
	Oh, God.
	For the listening audience, he head-butted the wall hard.
	And there was absolutely no give.
	Committed.
	Yes.
	Yes.
	In that moment, I was going through withdrawals and I wasn't feeling good.
	We had just come from the club.
	And to try to lessen those withdrawals, I had drank copious amounts of alcohol, which really didn't work.
	And then me and Ronnie, who really didn't get along over the years, he definitely probably saw me in a vulnerable state.
	I was like, today's the day it's going down.
	And sure enough, that's what happened right there.
	I went into the wall, which wasn't sheetrock.
	It was probably, you know, 4,000-year-old cement from the time of Caesar.
	And I got a sprained neck and a sprained concussion and then eventually rushed to the hospital in Italy, where ironically, they had to give me an opiate against MTV's advice because I remember MTV didn't want that, but they had to.
	Oh, gosh.
	I mean, was that rock bottom for you?
	Was that your aha moment or no?
	That was one of the rock bottom moments.
	The rock bottom moment came a few years later in 2015, but this was like the start of it.
	You know, I still had millions and millions of dollars.
	The show was so huge.
	I had endorsement after endorsement, my own ab cream and laundry bags and lollipops and bobbleheads.
	I even got my own Christmas ornament that I still have to this day.
	It's probably on that tree behind me.
	Would you please send me one?
	I want one of those.
	Yeah, it's really cool.
	Yeah.
	But yeah, rock bottom would come a little later, but this was definitely a sign that it was the shooting star was definitely starting to go in the other direction.
	Okay.
	Let's hold it there.
	Another quick break and more with rock bottom and God bless redemption coming up next.
	Also, we'll get to Donald Trump and his role in the situation's life.
	Believe it or not, he's got a couple connections to him.
	We'll get there.
	Hey, everyone.
	It's me, Megan Kelly.
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Presidential Debate Prep 00:15:38
	Where did the situation come from?
	I got that name probably a couple months before my first casting call with VH1.
	At the time, my nickname was Mikey Abs in college.
	But once I got signed to a fitness and modeling agency in New York City, I went out to celebrate down at the shore over in Seaside.
	And I, you know, I was so shredded that, you know, my abs looked like they were implants.
	And I was down at the shore.
	I had no shirt on.
	I was with the fellas.
	And I was walking down the street and a couple that were holding hands, they walked by me.
	And the female was like, oh my God, honey, look at his abs.
	And my boy's like, oh, my God, damn, that's a situation.
	I'm like, yeah, you know what?
	I'm the situation.
	And then next thing you know, it a week or two later, when I had an interview with MTV, they asked me if I had a nickname.
	I told them the situation.
	They said, oh, my God, that's brilliant.
	Do you have a trademark?
	I didn't have it trademarked at the time, but as soon as I left their office, I eventually got my first lawyer and trademarked it.
	It is brilliant.
	By the way, when you got the job, when you were cast, we didn't tell the audience what happened with Lauren at the time.
	She was not too pleased about you getting this role and actually gave you an ultimatum.
	And you tell me whether you made the right choice.
	Yeah, we definitely made the right choice.
	At the time, my main priority was to get back with Lauren.
	But I eventually landed the job of my life, which was I was offered the contract by MTV to be in the first season of Jersey Shore.
	I was so excited that possibly my dreams were coming true.
	And I was so proud of myself for throwing this Hell Mary and it being completed.
	But then I also wanted to take that news back to my ex-girlfriend and get her back.
	And I told her, I said, listen, I got to go on this reality show.
	And we were about to get back together.
	And she said, listen, if you're going to go on this show, I don't think it's a good idea.
	I don't think we're going to last.
	I don't want to be that girlfriend that is home and having her boyfriend on a reality show cheating on her and me crying at home.
	And she was 100% right.
	It was the right girl at the wrong time.
	Eventually, we would reconnect a couple years later in 2013 and we would never look back.
	So one of the things that you were asked to do, you talked about the number of talk shows that you went on and the magazine covers you were on.
	One of the weirdest things I think that came your way was you were asked to participate in one of the Comedy Central roasts.
	You know, they had those roasts where they bring in celebs to roast another celeb.
	And you were chosen to roast, tell them who.
	Donald Trump.
	This is back in what, 2000, what, nine?
	2011.
	2011.
	Okay, 11.
	So long before, you know, he became a presidential candidate and all that.
	And how did it go?
	I mean, he paid me extremely well.
	I got six figures just to show up for the day.
	Probably, you know, a very amazing paycheck.
	They flew me out in one of Trump's jets and they were extremely nice to me.
	But when I got there, I was so high that I really didn't have good tone and good delivery on stage.
	I mean, I said the lines, but it wasn't good tone and delivery for comedy.
	And I eventually would get booed.
	I mean, everyone still loved me and I took photos with everyone and I made a ton of money.
	But technically, that would be definitely a learned lesson to read the material and know what you're doing before you do it.
	Oh, here is a little bit of you in that performance 2011 SOT 22.
	People are hating on him because Trump is always firing people, but it's kind of okay because he completely let himself go anyway.
	Donald, I'll say this though.
	Your wife is hot.
	The best part is she married you for love.
	Yep.
	She loves money.
	Oh, hey, what are you going to do?
	Hey, come on, let him do his thing.
	Come on.
	Yeah.
	Jim Ross came on stage to try to save me, but I was so high.
	I mean, I could probably look at myself right there and say that I was definitely on a good six to eight rocket sets at that particular time.
	I did not look at the material that they gave it to me.
	And if they would have gave me the material today, I probably would have read it and said some of it was good, some of it was bad.
	And I obviously would have practiced my material, my tone, and my degree.
	But it was a learned lesson early on in my career.
	Did you and Trump keep in touch at all?
	Like once he became president?
	Did you ever call him up or?
	No, I was thinking about, I think around the time that he was president, I was in prison and I was thinking about contacting.
	I remember telling my team that we should probably contact President Trump for a pardon when they sent me to prison.
	And I never did know.
	And now the next time that he's going to probably be president, he'll be the one in prison.
	So it's going to be like full circle.
	Actually be president and be in prison.
	Those two things could happen at once.
	You could give him some pointers.
	And so tell us how you did wind up in prison.
	That was post the end of Jersey Shore.
	What happened?
	Yes.
	Well, I mean, if you read the book on the first page of the book, I'm at Christmas Eve dinner.
	It's 2010.
	I just made $5 million about.
	I have endorsement after endorsement.
	There's a Ferrari and a Bentley outside.
	Mom's making clams oreganata and linguine for the seven fishes for Christmas.
	The black sheep of the family was now world famous.
	And my brother came up to me and said, hey, it's time to file the taxes.
	And it was sort of like, oh, man, really?
	Because the year before, I didn't make enough money to even file taxes.
	I was a young kid.
	I didn't make enough money to now fast forward to the $5 million the next year, pretty much.
	It's a big difference.
	And I remember my brother saying, oh, maybe you can get him next year.
	As soon as he said that, I'm like, yeah, let's get him next year.
	And that one decision on the first page of the book would end up haunting me for a good 10 to 15 years.
	So is tax evasion.
	And how long were you sentenced to jail for?
	I was sentenced for eight months in federal prison.
	But even before that, I didn't even think that they were going to give me prison time, to be honest with you.
	The plea bargain that I accepted was in the zone for probation and community service, and I had zero priors.
	So eventually, when they gave me all of the above, I had to be accountable and handled it with grace and class.
	But it was definitely unexpected because I was the first person, I believe, in the state of New Jersey to be in that zone and get prison time.
	So they made an example at me.
	I had to just accept it.
	Were you terrified going off to prison?
	I'll be honest with you.
	I wasn't.
	I wasn't.
	Addiction was so much worse.
	Addiction was staring in the face of the.
	You were not clean.
	You were not clean when you went off.
	No, no, I was clean.
	So what I'm saying is by the time I went off, I had faced the devil.
	I had faced addiction and I was championing addiction.
	So when I finally had to go to prison, I was already doing the right thing.
	I was already on the right track.
	I used that fresh pain as fuel to continue to do the right thing and use this to turn my L's into lessons.
	And that's exactly what I did.
	Well, I like that.
	So out of nowhere and weirdly, one of your closest pals in prison would be somebody connected to Trump.
	Tell us who.
	Oh, Michael Cohen.
	Yeah, Michael Cohen.
	He was a chicken you really wanted from what I read in the book.
	You wanted his chicken.
	He didn't eat chicken.
	What happened there?
	Yes.
	Yes.
	In prison, Chicken Thursdays was a very coveted day.
	That was the day that you really got fed well and food is king in prison.
	And when Michael Cohen first came into prison, along with the helicopters and such overhead, I heard a little story that he had a chicken as a pet as a child and that he didn't even eat chicken.
	So I'm like, all right, I might as well go up to him and persuade him to smuggle his chicken to me so I had more protein and it could help me in my journey to being my best self and losing some weight and come out looking like Rambo.
	So I approached him.
	And did he give you the chicken?
	He said he was going to give me the chicken.
	He's like, no problem, Mike, anything for you.
	But then when it came time to actually give me the chicken, he was actually nowhere to be found.
	And then when I found him later on, I'm like, Mike, where's my chicken?
	And he's like, oh, man, they're on to us, man.
	They know I was going to smuggle chicken for you.
	He's like, they would have thrown me in the shoe, which is a special housing unit if you do anything wrong.
	So I'm like, all right, Mike, no problem.
	It wasn't.
	I just thought that was a hilarious story, though.
	It's an amazing story.
	So like Trump, you were also betrayed by Michael Cohen.
	There's a long list in his path.
	Okay, so you get out of prison.
	Good for you.
	You served your time.
	You get out of prison.
	And then amazingly, you really turn things around.
	As I understand it, you get back together with Lauren and you get back on TV too.
	Yes.
	Yep.
	Yep.
	You know, we were, we got back on TV.
	MTV was documenting my prison release, my court case.
	And then I got a chance to really prove myself.
	I remained sober.
	I lost the weight.
	I became a better man in prison.
	And then, you know, I got to, you know, a chance to start my own family in 2018 and continue when I got out of prison in 2019.
	All right.
	So the show that you were on on MTV, the new show, is Jersey Shore Family Vacation.
	And on this show, you're back with Lauren, the love of your life.
	She's been there through the peaks and valleys.
	And you decided you wanted to marry her and that you would, you asked them if they would put it on TV, like the moment.
	And it was one of the most emotional moments, as I'm told, by the cat for the cast, for the crew.
	We've got a little bit of it.
	Here it is.
	You're my best friend, my college sweetheart, my better half.
	Oh, come on.
	Look at them.
	You make me a better person.
	Please make me the happiest man on earth.
	Will you please marry me?
	Oh my God, dude.
	He's doing it.
	Goodbye, baby.
	Congratulations, guys.
	Aw, now that woman must really love you.
	She must really love you.
	Yes.
	So how's that going?
	It's good.
	Me and Lauren just celebrated five years of a happy, healthy marriage.
	I'm eight years clean and sober today.
	I just put on social media.
	We have two babies and another one on the way that's due in March.
	That's amazing.
	Congratulations.
	Good for you.
	So now is that show still on?
	Like, how do you pay the bills present day?
	Yes.
	We are on Thursdays.
	It's Jersey Shore Family Vacation.
	It is the number one show on MTV on Thursday and sometimes on cable.
	And as of right now, we have our salary has increased back up to six figures per episode.
	That's how many episodes do you do in a season?
	We usually do about 30 a year.
	That's amazing.
	Yeah.
	I mean, talk about a comeback.
	That's so great, Mike.
	And is the whole cast there in the American?
	Yeah, most recently, Sam came back, who she was absent for 10 years.
	Ron is back now.
	Again, the world has grown up with us.
	And now we're in our 30s.
	I'm now 41.
	We have families.
	It's a lifestyle show.
	There's babies, baptisms, weddings, who's getting divorced and different businesses.
	And now what you see now, I'm releasing a book.
	My new nickname is the publication.
	The publication.
	I mean, it wasn't all smooth sailing.
	As I understand it, I think it was when you got out of prison, but you considered, as I think you put it in the book, breaking the emergency glass and doing something else to earn money with respect to a sex tape?
	Is that yes?
	That was right around the time when I, obviously before I went to prison, and that was probably in 2013 or 14.
	This, obviously, there was, it was a monster court case, United States versus the situation.
	It literally said on the paperwork, on the court documents, the situation had costed me about $1 million for lawyers to defend that case for a few years.
	The one that you were convicted on.
	Is that the one we're talking about?
	Yeah, yeah, the one I was convicted on, yes.
	And then eventually I was bleeding money around this time period and more money was coming out than it was going in.
	And I had always had this sex tape.
	And I know it sounds so crazy.
	even kind of sounds comical that the backup plan, the emergency plan was that I had a sex tape.
	It was a very wild sex tape with at least three participants.
	And at the time, I had to sit down my team and be like, okay, I have something in my safe and it was only in case of emergencies.
	I'm thinking about breaking it out.
	And then I told my team in the same room, my wife or my then girlfriend was there and my mother.
	Obviously, they didn't approve of it.
	Your mother.
	My mother, my mother worked for my company at the time.
	Yes.
	They were in the same room, but they obviously didn't approve of it.
	You know, obviously everyone has wide eyes.
	And then I said it was an option.
	As we went down the journey of selling said sex tape, you find out a lot of stuff.
Crazy Life Story 00:02:46
	You find out what you got to do, what you shouldn't do.
	And then I just didn't feel that.
	I mean, it sounds graphic, but the juice wasn't worth the squeeze.
	You say there were at least three participants.
	Do we know the number of participants?
	Yes, it was at least three.
	Yes.
	It was three and me.
	Yes.
	Oh, three in addition to you.
	Yes, and me.
	Yeah.
	So is it still in the safe?
	I cannot confirm or deny.
	I'd like to leave that part of my life in the past.
	But I, like I said, we're now reminiscing about some of the contents of this crazy book.
	And it's really a page turner.
	And I had to, you know, be full disclosures and I had to be raw and unfiltered and say at one particular time when I was bleeding money, I had the emergency sex tape in the safe and I actually thought about revealing it.
	And it's like I said, it's kind of makes you chuckle a little bit to think like what person has an emergency sex tape and is going to reveal it.
	Kardashian, Paris Melton.
	It worked out fine for them.
	I understand why your mind went there.
	So in the time we have left, now that the book is done, it's about to come out.
	What did you learn about yourself?
	You look back at this crazy ride you've had over the past 15.
	I mean, it's a crazy ride.
	I mean, I think that I've lived a man of 100 lives.
	I'm very grateful to be here right now telling you my story.
	I think this book is a page turner.
	It's going to entertain.
	It's going to shock people.
	And it's also going to inspire people because inside, I detail how I recovered from a debilitating addiction.
	And I think it's going to save millions of lives.
	And it's going to eventually be a movie one day.
	Yeah, you don't seem in any way bitter, angry, down.
	And I realize your life is great right now, but it just seems like you're somebody who's got a naturally good attitude, notwithstanding the many challenges that you've kind of brought on yourself, but you manage them.
	And look at you.
	Yes.
	Back on top.
	All the best of you with it.
	Yeah, thank you.
	I'm definitely an example of the comeback is greater than the setback.
	And it's not about, you know, what happens to you in life.
	It's more about, you know, how you react to what happens to you in life.
	So that's exactly right.
	Get back up.
	Either you get back up or you don't.
	Mike, thank you.
	The book is reality check.
	You can pre-order it now at mikethesituationbook.com.
	Have a great weekend.
	Back Tuesday from Alabama.
	Thanks for listening to the Megan Kelly Show.
	No BS, no agenda, and no

Chapters

00:00:00 FIKEN Accounting Program
00:03:40 California Politics Debate
00:19:17 Republican Primary Race
00:34:58 Reality Check Show
00:45:26 Jersey Shore Fame
00:50:34 Drug Dealing Confession
01:00:56 Rehab and Recovery
01:08:21 Suitcase Drug Scandal
01:11:11 Rock Bottom Moment
01:19:41 Presidential Debate Prep
01:35:19 Crazy Life Story