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Sept. 10, 2024 - The Leo Zagami Show
01:47:38
NEW WORLD ORDER BRAINWASHING AND MIND CONTROL
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I think that in this book it was very important for me also to explain how not only we are controlled by the Illuminati, the Freemasons, but also how they control their own, their own members, how these initiations, these symbols, these initiation rites, the way they at times even humiliate,
Demand from him absolute obedience.
I mean, as you know, I was a member of it.
So I was actually often the guy who carried on these initiations.
And I tried to do always this initiation with respect to the human being.
Okay.
I always said to the people, are you really sure you want to go there?
Because there is no way back after you go in.
Okay.
And so I tried to always be very respectful.
Hey everybody, thanks for joining us again.
As promised, I'm really delighted tonight.
We had Ryan Velie on the show last night and I was telling you that tonight we've got Leo Zagami back on the show.
LeoZagami.com.
Leo, thanks so much for joining me again.
Always a pleasure, Jason, to be with our friend and also to debate and discuss the latest book, which is already number one in experimental psychology.
And experimental psychology, it's of course a topic that is very interesting, as well as a topic that we don't generally discuss.
But when it comes to the field of mind control, of course, that forms of persuasion, that's where it's all going.
This is the book, for those who are interested.
The old ones?
You can actually, those are the old ones, of course, but this new one, I'm actually, I'm putting it on sale from Labor Day onwards, and so it's, you can get it with like 15, 16 pounds.
I mean, it's very cheap.
I wanted to make it affordable for the majority of people.
And it's also a book, a very contemporary book.
In fact, here on the cover, you see, you have Thomas Crooks, who attempted to assassinate Donald J. Trump, as well as Lee Harvey Oswald, as well as Sun Tzu, and Alan Dews, the first civilian director of the Central Intelligence Agency.
It's a book based on facts and documents.
As you know, I don't base my books on speculations or conspiracy theories.
So I think people will actually be able to finally distinguish facts from fiction.
Because when it comes, for example, to topics of mind control, especially MK ULTRA, you know, people tend to Hulk without really a distinction between fact and fiction, because M.K.Ultra became in the Internet era almost a sort of urban legend, and then it has filled up a variety of movies, TV series, documentaries, and so on.
But every time there is an event, people tend to say, oh, this guy's an MKUltra, or this other guy is being psyoped.
So we tend to forget MKUltra itself, of course.
lasted for a limited time span between 1953 and 1973.
But then of course, the results of it are still felt to this day, as well as other forms of mind control, much more sophisticated that followed.
Of course, when it comes to MKUltra, it was the product of what happened after the Second World War, there was really a big scare in regards to the fact that sinister forces might brainwash the Americans.
You know, the Americans suddenly, I mean, today in 2024, When we are actually all being brainwashed left, right and center, nobody seems to complain.
At that time, instead, there was a lot of alarmism in regards because it's like probably our parents, our grandparents, when they saw what happened during the Second World War, when they saw what Hitler did to millions of individuals, what Nazism did to millions, they were completely brainwashed by an evil ideology, that was pretty hard.
I mean, and people tend to forget it, of course, now the new generations, they don't have a clue even, they don't even have a clue about the Cold War.
And the Cold War was really when mind control started to be researched in new ways.
And these new ways, of course, out of the ethics and morals.
I mean, it's like there was a liquidation of the U.S.
moral values in favor of defending America at whatever cost.
And America is the only country that from 1948 had a law, a specific law, protecting from psychological operations.
So, while Great Britain, Germany, France, Italy, still to this day don't have a law and can be brainwashed.
Americans couldn't.
Now, things changed a little bit with the Smith-Moulton Reformation Act in 2012, under Obama, because nowadays, you know, it's a little difficult to block psyops that are addressed towards foreign audiences when you have the internet, which is some immediately in the homes of everybody regardless of where they are.
So things have changed a little bit.
But like I said, in theory, here in America, we have actually a law that protects us from 1948.
The one instead, this didn't happen in the rest of NATO, which came into existence in 1949.
So The year after they made this law, they put together this alliance which, as you know, is still very much alive.
And it's also a very controversial alliance, to tell you the truth.
However, the subject of brainwashing came up.
The term, let's say, one of the loudest voices was this journalist called Edward Hunter, who worked for the OSS in World War II as a propaganda specialist.
And then he thought that the term that the Chinese were using, which was xīnǎo, which means achieving change by washing or cleansing the heart through retreat from world and meditation, it's an ancient Chinese term, could actually be substituted by a more catchy brainwashing.
And this new world, like philosopher Wittgenstein said, there was a new world like a fresh seed sown on the ground of discussion.
Because then from that moment onwards, everybody wanted to know, what is this brainwashing?
And they were all terrified about the communist strategy of combining misapplied psychology, because that's what it is.
I mean, it's when you think of psychotherapy.
Psychotherapy is something we use to heal people.
My father was a psychotherapist, a psychiatrist.
But then you have aggressive forms of psychiatrism, of psychotherapy that are no longer psychotherapy.
They are psychological attacks, psychological warfare.
And you see, according to Hunter, initially, This fear was due to the fact that a lot of POWs have been subject to mock executions, starvation, sleep deprivation, and all this, of course, then gave birth a few years later, actually, nine years after the establishment of MKUltra, after Project Artishock and Project Bloober.
to the movie The Manchurian Candidate with Frank Sinatra and, of course, a movie which is based on those fears that they had at the time.
The Chinese deprived prisoners of everything and then offered them something.
It was like they were following a pattern that was Pavlovian.
And what does it mean Pavlovian?
And I want to explain this to your viewers in chapter one of my professions.
I introduced the subject of mind control, in particular brainwashing, because we have to distinguish.
Mind control can be addressed to a vast mass of people without direct brainwashing, which is a self-exercise on the singular person.
And Pavlov, Ivan Pavlov, was this Russian scientist.
who started to experiment on conditioning.
His work is regarded as a pioneer work on psychology and conditioning.
Pavlov's dogs, right?
That guy, yes.
Pavlov's dogs.
In fact, he initially started to work with dogs, but then when Vladimir Lenin told him to work for the Soviet Union.
At that point, he made him work also freely in his clinics with men, with people, so no longer with dogs.
And so those various forms of conditioning, which are from the environment, from also his, you know, what he was doing with dogs, with dogs, what he was doing, he was simply connecting, for example, food with this ringing the bells and all that.
And so, Pavlov's work was the initial stage of something, but of course, in the years after Pavlov went on with his experiments.
Even after the death of Lenin, he continued to work for the Soviet Union.
These experiments started to influence also the experiments of scientists here in the Western world that started to mimic his experiments.
And at the same time, the Chinese were very interested in them.
In fact, that journalist I mentioned just a moment ago, Edward Hunter, he called this psychological warfare that the Chinese intellectuals were working on, a form like he called this psychological warfare that the Chinese intellectuals a form like he said they were bringing the Pavlovian aspect to the next level
let's say because they wanted to create with all this deprivation sleep deprivation drugs and what not they wanted to create something that they described as re-education camps with these doctors and professors as the mystic Pavlovians of high communism
And they were conducting, of course, what was described as the Great Pavlovian War.
So, Pavlov was very influential in his work.
The brainwashing, of course, that Pablo was exercising, this new method, the coercive methods, were, though, only at the beginning.
And later on, they started to be experimented further by the Nazis, also.
The Nazis, which even used, as we know, sadly, the concentration camps during the Holocaust.
What the Americans discovered when they arrived in Europe and then they entered the concentration camp that these experiments have been conducted.
And so they didn't want to be left behind.
As you know, the Americans then embraced a lot of those scientists from Nazi Germany and invited them to work here.
Then at that point we had the OSS that was followed by the CIA, and they felt the need to carry on these experiments, initially on volunteers, and Lee Harvey Oswald, who ended up killing JFK, is apparently one of those volunteers, when he was actually stationed in Japan as a Marine.
and then went to Russia.
Sorry Leo, I have to jump in, I'm not jumping in because I love listening to you talk.
Just put a hold on that absolute thing you were going to say there, please don't forget, I don't want to spoil it.
But I just want to say two things, like I want to ask you, Harvey Oswald, he probably didn't even pull any triggers whatsoever, right?
And the other thing is... I'll tell you one thing, you see, when you are talking about Mind control.
There is a possibility that it was used.
However, we always have, in the case of Lee Harvey Oswald, in the case, of course, of all the people that followed in the various assassinations of Martin Luther King, Bob Kennedy, and so on, we always have the usual narrative of the lone gunman.
They always say there is never a second shooter.
It's something they always dismiss.
But still, to this day, the families of both JFK and Bob Kennedy, including JFK Jr., and, of course, the family of Martin Luther King, they all think there was a second shooter.
Well, you could see he had his head blown, blown, you know, in the car.
He was, he was smashed to smithereens.
I mean, there was, there were shooters.
It was, it was, it was unbelievable.
But that is part of the narrative.
Yeah.
The whole damn thing is part of the narrative.
In fact, Though it's not essential, it's more important, though, I think, to focus also on the implant that apparently was given to the... Lee Harvey Oswald was subject to an operation and received an implant.
Now, here, I didn't want to take you off track, I'm sorry, but go on.
No, no, no, I mean, but you're completely right.
I mean, when I discuss in my book Thomas Brooks, I say there is a lot of talk about a second shooter.
And that, of course, might be a possibility.
You know, they talk about that water tank.
But regardless of the second shooter,
There is other things that are equally, if not more important, the fact that he was looking at his phone and chatting on apps a few minutes before he attempted to kill Donald J. Trump, the fact that his body was cremated 10 days later, and so any evidence was liquidated, eliminated, and that the fact he was cremated on the 23, which is a number often used by the Illuminati, is very indicative, especially because
Like I explain in my book, at the end of my book I show, this is the invite for the cremation of Cherub this year at the Bohemian Grove that took place on the 13th of July, right in that moment, you know?
So there were people like Nancy Pelosi's husband, all of the military industrial complexes that were coincidentally all there in this grow in this nice place where they always go every year, the members of the Bohemian Club.
And so definitely that is at least a weird synchronicity, but I don't think it is a synchronicity.
The fact here is that the week before the attempted assassination of Donald J. Trump, a institute in South Korea announced the new discovery
of experiments conducted on mice that finally map the whole brain and know exactly now, thanks to the AI and all the other technology, now they can literally, with nanomind technology, create not only an assassin, but literally a robot, because they can make it do... That is scary, to say the least.
Because, you see, during the 20 years of experiments of NK-ULTRA, They based their experiments on what they had at the time.
So yes, there was some initial forms of implants that were initially experimented in Russia and the Americans wanted to mimic, who might have been able to create some reactions in the subject, but always at a very limited level, because you have to understand the technology was still very limited compared to what we have now.
Sorry, Leo.
On a very basic level, people forget on a very basic level, they could instill a thought into you under hypnosis and then at any time triggered it with a sound or something like that, you know.
They do what you want them to.
I mean, it's so simple, isn't it?
I mean, my book is actually number one in the hypnosis section of Amazon, actually because it is very much also talking about the subject of hypnosis, of course.
But you have to understand, hypnosis is something that doesn't work with every subject.
The fact that they wanted it to work 100% meant they had to use it with the drugs.
The drugs together with hypnosis is a way of brainwashing the subject even further, because with only hypnosis you are still... I mean, apart from the fact that the Illuminati and the orders like the O.T.O.
prohibit hypnosis.
to their members.
They actually say it.
In my book I show it.
Say that again.
I didn't hear what you said.
To their members.
You said something to their members?
I said probably.
When he wrote the rituals of the O.T.O., he said specifically that you, once you are initiated in the first degree of the O.T.O., you cannot accept being hypnotized by anybody.
It's kind of like a directive.
And then you also cannot take certain drugs.
Though we know that Crowley did vast use of drugs, he did it within what he regarded as a controlled environment.
You see, a lot of people seem to not understand that Crowley was directly connected with the Tavistock Clinic, that then later on after the war, because of the NHS transformation of the clinic, became the Tavistock Institute.
And people like Adolf Saxley, that he initiated personally, that then went on later on, to become the trade union between the Tavistock experiments and the future MKUltra experiments.
But what happened in the early 1920s in the hobby of Telema was actually not only an occult, you know, everybody focuses, oh, they were doing black magic and all that, blah, blah, blah, blah.
But Crowley was also working for the espionage, the intelligence community, and what he was doing, he was very methodical in reporting all his experiments on all his adepts.
That is clear also when you go into the high degrees of the OTO and you access to the archives, you see that, you know, this guy took one He's like very methodical.
So the Abbey of Telema became like a mind control camp in which he himself was forbidden to say I. The ego had to be killed.
It was an experiment.
So when he went back, I remember I met the son of a guy who was at the Abbey of Telema in London many years ago.
And he told me that his father told him that Crowley was filled with cats, because every time he said, I, he had to cut himself.
So he was filled with cats.
But that was to give an example to also the rest of his community, that was basically indulging in occult activities, but at the same time, those activities were Coercive and persuading activities that resemble, of course, modern forms of mind control.
So, it was a mind control experiment in itself.
That's probably one of the reasons, the secret reason, why Mussolini eventually kicked him out.
Of course, he ended up in the tabloids.
The death of Raoul Abdel, drinking the blood of the cat and all that, and it became a big scandal in England, everybody was outraged.
But you have to understand that Crowley had helped over and over again the military-industrial complex of Great Britain, of the United Kingdom, in various ways.
What year did he die, Leo?
In 1947.
He died after the Second World War.
have ended, and he died in Leamington Spa.
No, no, actually, he was born in Leamington Spa.
He died, no, sorry, in a place on the coast, a coastal place that it's in England.
But he died of drugs himself, so he actually fell prey to his own bad habits.
When today the followers of Crowley describe him, they omit to say that under his bed was found a syringe of heroin.
So, you know, that is a thing that they conveniently omit because they don't want to be associated with a guy who, of course, ended up like that.
He was born in a wealthy family in Leamington Spa.
I don't know if you have been in Leamington Spa.
It's a lovely town.
I used to work there in a club for a number of years.
So I know very well that it's a town in, I think it's called Worcestershire or something like that.
You were a stripper there, I remember, yeah.
I was a DJ!
Sorry man, I couldn't resist you!
It was actually a bit of a surprise because when I ended up there, I ended up by pure chance, invited by the brother of a friend of mine who was this famous DJ I was working with all the time.
He had his brother who was a DJ and had just opened a club there in Leamington Spa.
I can't believe you were doing DJing so much.
You were big on that, weren't you?
Yeah, very big.
I mean, I DJed everywhere.
I DJed at the Ministry of Sound.
I DJed in all kinds of clubs in London in the 90s and early 2000s.
Yeah, I mean, it was part of my, it was my work.
So I did it, I did it with passion.
I like music.
And you have to understand that music is also a form of, if used together with hypnosis, it's the most powerful form of mind control.
Well, listen, one quick thing before you carry on and you'll know this very well.
My father was a guitarist and he used to say to me,
used to say it's amazing you can manipulate people with the music he said you're like a puppeteer he said you couldn't play one thing and they jump up and start dancing you do another thing and they move slowly so you know that from being a dj on the very basic level you couldn't you couldn't you couldn't mind control people with music you know no you you can do a lot of things with music i mean you have to understand when it comes to even black masses or voodoo rituals they are characterized by the drumming
piece that are fairly hypnotic and that kind of conduce you and I write in fact in this I describe, because of the work of a psychologist called Stefano Benemello, who is also a Satanist, by the way, who has been working on mind control since the end of the 60s in Italy and has coined his own form of, he calls it hypnosi dinamica, dynamic hypnosis.
He has a center in Milan.
And he understood that, I mean, in my book I actually include his description of the first Black Mass he participated in, and he understood from his first experience that those
Those words recited in Latin in a certain way, that drumming that went on until the satanic master sat down on his throne and started the whole, you know, giving a bath to the black mass and everybody was kind of like hypnotized by this whole thing.
He understood that Because he also was very much like my father into this thing they call analog sciences, that the power of the symbol is an hypnotic power.
When you are in an esoteric initiation, you are often revealed secret symbols.
that are finally revealed to you, like in Freemason, you know, they give you the explanation of this.
But those symbols are themselves hypnotic.
We are currently in our daily life driven by symbols more than in the past, because now we have computers that use symbols.
When we go on our computer, on our desktop, we don't go and see, oh, where is, I don't know, I make an example, Google Chrome, or where is Safari, or where is this app or this other app?
We see the icon, which is the symbol.
So the symbol itself now, in the age of the internet, has reacquired a lot more significance.
And also, when I look at the F for Facebook, so I often go there looking at motorbikes and stuff, and also to, you know, so it's a dopamine fix as well.
As soon as you see that, it's a pill you take, you know, just like a drug.
Absolutely, Leo.
Yeah, absolutely.
And you see, Easy to mind control.
Yeah, talking about Alistair Crowley, this guy was very skilled in mind control.
In fact he... Wait, wait, and Michael Aquino, I want you to mention him after.
Yeah, Michael Aquino of course I talked about because I also, for many years we used to be pen friends and we actually used to chat with each other.
And is he still alive, Leo?
No, he's not alive.
Okay.
Though it's quite incredible what happened after his death, because they... Did he come and say hello to you?
Did he say hello to you after he died?
No, it's just that, like, journalists try to understand when he died and all that, and they have to go through a whole A top secret, kind of.
He didn't disclose it publicly.
His death was not disclosed publicly, in an open way.
They went through even a FOIA, which is a way to require information that is kept secret, to actually know if he was dead or not, and they couldn't access the information.
It was completely crazy.
And it's typical of Michael Aquino.
I mean, he wanted, you know, he said in the last edition of his Mind War, I remember, I'm only passing through this earth, you know, like, you know, as an experience and going then somewhere else.
In this book, I don't focus on his satanic practices.
I did that in other books where I discuss his rituals in Wettelsburg in Germany and other more occult aspects of his work.
In this work, I focus on the mind control innovation aspects, which actually became part of the current psychological operations, because he had written, in 1980, a very important book with another guy called Ballelli, which basically
Colonel Paul Ibalelli, which now it's like he used to be, at least until not so long ago, he used to appear on Fox as an opinion, you know, he was a former military, went on Fox, but I mean, he's actually a psychological warfare expert.
So you tend to find these kinds of people out there in the news, because every news outlet in America is controlled by psychological operations.
So he had written With Michael Aquino, at the time Major, he then retired with the rank of Lieutenant Colonel, he made him in charge of his psyop research analysis, and he then published in 1980 this forum, Psyop to Mind War, the Psychology of Victory.
Now that essay was then republished in 2003 after The start, you know, after the Americans had at that point started, the American troops started to use his psychology of victory during the Iraqi war, especially when they entered Iraq.
And he himself actually said in the 2003 edition of it, he says, well, I'm glad to see that now.
You know, I just retired because he had just retired.
And he said, I'm very proud of seeing they're using now my techniques, you know.
But what were his techniques?
Now, Michael Aquino is often misunderstood by people who don't know him, because professionally, it's very difficult to understand this kind of subject if you're not in it.
We can understand Michael Aquino had some problems with pedophilia.
He somehow got out of it in the Presidio case in the 1980s.
was probably, you know, absorbed of all his sins and eventual crimes while he was in San Francisco, because he also was a very big asset to the psychological warfare, especially his headquarters that at the time were in San Francisco, which were the headquarters of the seven psychological operation groups which he belonged to.
And Michael was very skilled in the fact that he could find people, right?
He was gifted, and he had learned it as well, that he could come and find someone and affect them, right?
And the only reason I know about this kind of thing is because I've studied shamanism, and I've actually been attacked from a distance by somebody, Leo, some years ago, and I didn't believe it was possible at the time.
I won't go into it here.
But it was very frightening.
They came and, actually, I felt them in the room.
They'd come from a distance, many, many miles away.
They came, I felt them in the room, their presence, their consciousness, and their presence, and they attacked me, yeah?
And they gave me pain.
But I'm pretty sure that Michael Aquino could go and find people.
That's why they... Now, look and see what happened with this.
Okay, Michael Aquino, I met Antoine Lévesque in 1968 when Rosemary's Baby was first screened in San Francisco.
That's the kind of setup, you know, for the friendship.
From that moment onwards, he actually worked with Antoine Lévesque in the middle of the 70s, when then he created his own schismatic body, which was the Temple of Seth.
You see, one thing about LaVey is that LaVey was different from Aquino because LaVey actually cooperated with MKUltra.
Michael Aquino disliked MKUltra.
Paradox.
This is a paradox, because a lot of people, when they talk about Michael Aquino, say, oh, Project Mar, Michael Aquino, MKUltra, and they make a great mix of nonsense.
No, Michael Aquino disliked MKUltra, MKSearch.
He disliked the fact that they were too invasive, that they actually, you know, created physical problems in subjects that they were experimenting on.
He was for more subtle forms of mind control.
That doesn't mean that the guy wasn't evil, that the guy wasn't creepy, just so people were watching me.
No, no.
It means that he wanted to affect an even much bigger number of people with his forms of mind control, which included also electromagnetic fields, and stuff which is only actually being discussed today.
So he was actually giving the future of mind-controlled food technology that wasn't even in existence at the time.
Just quickly Leo, back to Iraq, apparently they were giving the Iraqi army, apparently 2,000 of them, more than that, surrendered because they were sent in waves of suggestions towards them, right?
And by the way, I just... No, but there was also a funny thing that people don't know.
Okay, there was this PSYOP, especially the 4th PSYOP group, the 4th Battalion, that was broadcasting the voice of the Gulf Radio Programme and there was all that stuff.
But there was also, for the first time, on the side of the Iraqis, the attempt from Saddam Hussein and his own army to do Psyops on the Americans.
But they failed completely, as described in this book, because they started to discuss things that were completely, I mean, they basically said, they sent out things in which they were complete, they were not believable.
They would say to the American troops, well, while you are here in Iraq, Brad Pitt is screwing your wife.
That's pretty unbelievable.
But the more unbelievable thing was, like, when they said that Bart Simpson was screwing their wife.
Because we might laugh, and of course it's very funny, but the thing was that They didn't understand American culture.
So when they tried to influence the soldiers, the U.S.
soldiers, informing them of how their wives left their own in the distant homeland were consoling themselves with bar sings on a Brad Pitt, it was completely laughable.
But they thought it actually could work because they didn't have an idea of the American culture.
They thought that people would believe, oh, what is being Wow, what should I do now, you know?
And so it was ridiculous, the fact that they thought the whites were approached by movie stars and even cartoon characters that were like Pat Simpson as a potential seducer.
I don't think anybody can even think of that for a second.
But that was a huge mistake by the Iraqi that damaged immediately the credibility of their silos.
It was like, the American stuff, if you listen to this stuff, What is this?
This is a joke!
So, instead, the techniques of Michael Aquino that were first used in the Iraqi war, those were techniques that actually worked out.
You have Baghdad Betty that carried out similar radio broadcasts and decision techniques towards the coalition forces, of course, by the Iraqis, but their goal was never achieved.
Instead, the Americans managed to disseminate behind Iraqi lines a lot of propaganda that was actually more credible.
And then you had also other things that happened during that war.
Like, for example, you had those prisoners of war that were paraded in front of the T.V.s.
You remember?
The capture of several pilots, they were parading them through the streets.
They didn't understand that by doing that, they were actually disgusting the West.
Angering and infuriating, yeah.
They were not actually, oh wow, now we should leave Iraq because they're so dangerous.
It was having the opposite effect.
I think that they completely failed and And so that is the whole thing.
In regards to the psyops that Aquino in particular have in mind, and that of course, Aquino, you see, they go for introduce a new concept of how to use technology and forms, let's say, of multimedia communication.
We were not yet at the height of the internet, which had just been introduced.
So we're not yet at that level.
But you had, Michael Aquino basically was very pleased, like I said, about it in his own words.
He said, while in the 1980s I had no reason to think that his paper that he published in 1980 would have an effect on the US side of doctrine.
within or beyond the army, it was quite fascinating, he said, that I saw specific prescriptions of my essay, this is Aquino, in the Gulf War, during the 2003 invasion of Iraq, because finally they understood that it was important to have embedded in those
It was important to have the PSYOP units working hand in hand with CNN out of Iraq to show the reality of what they wanted.
If you think about it, from the very first bombing of Iraq back in the early 90s to 2003 and the invasion, we really have a presence of CNN in Iraq before everybody else.
And it became like the official mouthpiece And the reality was filtered through them.
And so, what Aquino had extracted and explained through his work was actually put into practice, the fact that you didn't have to, you know, like, You didn't have to capture a bunch of Iraqi soldiers and with coercive methods brainwash them, make them take drugs or whatever.
That wasn't really what Michael Aguino, like I said, was about.
It was more subtle, but also subliminal mind control was used.
Subliminal mind control was used through the media.
through the media that started to broadcast also into Iraq.
I think that the whole use of magic and other things, of course, you know, magic has a lot of similarities with mind control, especially that Madame Blavatsky said that hypnotism was the most powerful form of black magic.
And I think that Everybody within the occult, even Isaac Rowley, he said, you know, he described hypnotism as the ultimate form of control.
So these people knew that it was, but then when you are actually in a campaign to to work on a mass of millions of people that you can't hypnotize each one of them.
You have to use techniques which, in the case of Mind War, use a series of outlets.
It can be, of course, The TV, the radio, nowadays, of course, the Internet.
There is actually a branch of cognitive warfare that is active here in America on behalf of NATO that nobody really knows about.
And actually, it's a very powerful group.
And the guy in charge is a former French military officer called François de Cluzel.
And he has published the book.
I don't know how you remember all this stuff, man.
Listen, I feel like I've got, I'm like, I've been, I got a, I'm a, I put my dunce hat on.
You remembered all these words and names, Leo.
I just don't know how you do it.
You're like an encyclopedia, for goodness sake.
I just have to put the air conditioning in a second, bro.
I'm just putting a thing because I have to go and put the air conditioning for a second because I tended to think I could I'm melting when I'm talking to you.
I have to go.
Sorry, yes.
I love that.
I love that laugh.
It's like a magic trick.
Listen, listen, Leo.
Let me say something.
Everyone's hypnotized.
If you just look at Covid, OK, the so-called Covid thing, look how people have been hypnotized.
People casting a spell on people.
It was unbelievable.
The biggest spell in the last 30 years was either the 9-11 or either the pandemic.
These are the two big spells that were, you know, they were psychological operations because apart from the way they accomplished it, the result of it Here in America after 9-11 we lost a lot of our freedoms.
And you know that.
Also in other parts of the Western world.
Suddenly we couldn't buy just a...
a phone.
We had to register our number because it was important that, you know, the phone number didn't fall in the hands of a perilous or you could be traced simply because on the phone you said the key word that would trigger, you know, the control centers.
Nowadays, things are different.
I mean, the advent of cognitive warfare, which is the ultimate form now of You know, psychological warfare now seems to merge with what they call cognitive warfare.
And this cognitive warfare is about hacking the individual's mind.
And so you have the centrality, of course, of the human brain, but you have also today cyber psychology, which is played by the equipment that we use every day, the social networks we might participate in, or anything else on the internet.
We have neuroscience and technology.
We have the direct weaponization of neuros.
I mean, we have things that were science fiction, even A few years ago were considered science fiction.
So when we know that NATO has here in America, an incredible thing is based here in America, a command called the Allied Command Transformation.
What do they want to transform?
Then also you have to understand one thing.
Back in the Iraqi war days, they still had, because of the Smith-Mount law of 1948, they couldn't use this propaganda on us.
So what happened was that Michael Aquino The vice of this mind war that was more subtle, but it was all-encompassing because he wanted to bypass those restrictions on propaganda inflicted on Americans by creating this mind war outlet that was different in the way it operated, in a more subtle way.
And at the same time, our minds, of course, nowadays, As members of NATO, we think we're all equal, but that's complete rubbish, because like I explain in my book, from 1948 onwards until 2012, because then with Obama, he tried to
We were the only nation that, for example, when we needed to have a Psyop inflicted, we would simply call on one of our allies and inflict it on us.
So when in 2001 they needed desperately evidence that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction, they didn't do it from America.
If you remember, they did it thanks to information that came from the Italian military intelligence that conveniently after the Bush era was dismantled.
They brought evidence that was completely fake.
There was no weapons of mass destruction.
But if you remember You have people like Colin Powell going in front of the whole world, you know, saying that's weapons of mass destruction, you know.
He even had a little foil of talcum powder, do you remember?
And everybody was like, ooh, we have to... Get him, get him, you know.
But it was a site, but because it was a site that was infected also on the American public, they had to do it from Italy, because then they will have plausible vulnerability, you understand?
From the beginning of the 50s, when they started MKUltra, it was always about plausible deniability.
Blaming it on somebody else.
So they could never be directly traced to the government source that was actually conducting that evil experiment.
Just imagine what's happening in Canada.
Canada is one of the most brainwashed countries in the planet, in the planet to this day.
And I'm not joking here.
It's not just saying, oh, but you, this in Canada?
No, I'm talking about facts.
They have Cameron, not to be confused with David Cameron, of course.
He actually is also mentioned in my book.
And I will tell you in a moment why.
Has to do with the Burlington club rather than, you know, A more clockwork orange kind of scenario.
But when it comes to Canada, Canada was first of all the center of a series of experiments, terrible experiments, diabolical experiments that were conducted with no ethics and morals by a Scottish doctor who arrived there in Canada and wanted to conduct these experiments even on unwilling patients.
But he didn't find the funds.
He went around, he couldn't find it.
And in the end, you know, he knocked on the door of the CA here in America.
They said, well, that could be cool.
Let's do those experiments that maybe are a little bit too much in Canadian territory so we don't suffer any legal consequences.
And that was the beginning of a nightmare for a lot of Canadians.
who unfortunately ended up being subject to this.
And there was actually, until recently, they conducted MKUltra class actions lawsuits against, but
They never managed to get much because in the end Canada had shielded the system and these laws couldn't be, you know, they couldn't use retroactive laws to condemn a foreign, and of course it was conducted by an entity that was working for a foreign entity.
I mean, it was a foreign actor, the United States.
Even when they attempted the class action, they didn't really manage to go too far.
Some people got probably a little bit of money, but not much.
And a lot of people were, you know, maybe participating to these experiments, not knowing
how much they will end up suffering, you know, the fact that they will be inflicted sleep deprivation, electrocombustion, lights, attempts to literally create mental diseases in them by these external acts that were pretty evil.
And they were done, like I said, without any restriction because it wasn't like, you know, a simple academic conducting his experiments in a university and supervised by me.
No, the way that it was, these experiments were conducted in Canada or Canada was very, very different.
And on top of that, and that is something that, so Canada became part of MPULTRA Britain also was included.
It's not that great Britain wasn't included.
If today we don't have any evidence is, first of all, because all the documents of foreign experiments were destroyed immediately.
While some documents survived the purge of 1973, when the director of the CIA decided to destroy all the documents, but still today we still see every now and then, oh, this is an MKUltra document.
So some documents survive, but you never ever have documents of MKO3 in France, MKO3 in Norway, MKO that was conducted in Lobisenberg Hospital, where they even tried to lock me up when I went against the OTO in Norway.
The Tavistock, of course, never released their own experiments that were conducted in collaboration with this.
So, it's been covered.
It's been definitely covered, this whole thing.
And even when they declassify today, they can only declassify past, because it was a great excuse in 1973, they had at the time, the CIA had a great excuse.
Oh, we have the Watergate scandal, we have to destroy everything.
It was the perfect excuse at the time.
Yeah, yeah.
Leo, listen, the thing is I can't believe we've only got half an hour left or less, right?
But I just want to ask you about what's happening in England at the moment, right?
Because we're talking about mind control, you talk about it in your book, in your new book.
In England there is actually a lot of talk about this.
What's happening at the moment, they're arresting people, they're chucking them in prison.
There's a lady Sarah, is it Wilkinson?
She was posting stuff about Palestine, she was involved, and next minute they've come and they got her out of her house with balaclavas, these people, she doesn't know who they are, right?
And they took it away, now they've taken her passport, they took money.
But what I'm saying is that...
Let me tell you about some facts, something really important that happened this year in England.
He's the Gestapo.
The Tavistock Institute established in 1989, what was closed only this year, the Gender Identity Development Service, which was based with a clinic, a gender identity clinic for children and young people, that was closed down only this year.
Do you know a little bit about that?
A little bit, yeah, go on, tell us.
I mean, it's like this gender clinic was closed down because in the end they demonstrated that they forced literally children into changing their own sexual identity.
I mean, we always talk about the fact that here in America there is a big debate about, gender and about children that might go and request a change even without the permission of their parents and all that.
But when it comes to what was going on in England, there is evidence that was found that basically these freaks from the Tavistock Institute had convinced kids that they had to change their there is evidence that was found that basically these freaks from convince kids that they have to change their sex.
And that is outrageous.
And that's why in the end, they closed down this clinic.
I mean, and it wasn't closed down a million years ago.
We're talking about a recent event that only touched England very recently, as well as other forms of mind control that were exercised, for example, in Narcon, NarcoCon, the, you know, the organization of Scientology that claims to recover people from drug use.
Well, that was another scandal that touches you very close because it involves Great Britain.
It was actually in Great Britain that this Narcocon Center, Narcocon UK, they had a big scandal there.
They were using mind control techniques.
I mean, look, Keir Starmer, I mean, it's all different cheeks on the same arse, we know that.
Whoever gets in, because it's the same cabal, we know that.
But this guy let Saville off.
I mean, the police knew about Saville.
This is long before Epstein and all that.
And he let them off, this man.
But this guy seems to be bringing in a very draconian, a very, very fear-based, if you do that we'll punish you, we'll put you in prison.
And more and more people now, I can see on my posts, Leo, more and more people now are scared to even like anything, scared to do anything, because they know that employees might watch, an employer might watch it, or a future employer might watch it, or the government's watching.
Okay, let's say this.
It's coercive persuasion.
It's what they have experimented for years in rehab centers like Narco, where they persuade people to act in a certain way, otherwise they would be punished.
There would be, you know, things that would be happening to you.
There would be a retaliation.
That is, I think, what's happening with people in Great Britain.
Punishment and reward, always the same tools used.
Very basic, very simple.
If you stay silent, you might have a comfortable life.
If you don't stay silent, we will Put you through hell.
That's it.
Let's not forget that Great Britain is the place where we had that great television series called The Prisoner, which was mind control techniques.
Yeah.
All about.
Yeah.
I mean, I think it was the genius of Patrick McGowan's, you know, work that really showed us and it was pretty scary because my wife, She was living here in America when she was a kid.
She never saw The Prisoner.
But people like me and you, grown up with The Prisoner on TV, especially when I was in London, in England, or I was visiting my relatives in Suffolk, I always watched The Prisoner.
And it was scary.
It was just... Yeah.
Creepy as... It was scary.
Now, Leo, listen, I'm just very aware of the time, so I've got a couple of questions I want to ask you, yeah?
I was on with Ryan Velie last night, and great guy.
Please go back and look at the show, everybody.
And Ryan was enthusing about how he appreciates your work.
I just want to say that, and how he's appreciated all the things you've come out with, you know?
Let's remind who he is for the people who don't know him.
Ryanvelli.com.
So, he's a fantastic guy.
He speaks out, he does slideshows telling you all about the mind control and the AI that's coming down the pipeline that's going to control everybody and is already here.
It's not something that's coming, it's already here.
And it's taken away all your rights.
And Apple has already done all these things now.
They're bringing in all these things where you've got to do that or you don't get that.
If you don't do that, you can't do a show, etc.
But he shows documents telling you what they said, not what he said.
But he's a very versatile man.
He's a very spiritual man.
He talks about many things and Ryanvelli.com and Natural Intelligence is his website.
I tell everyone to go and see.
So Ryan, I got talking with Ryan and he was saying about your great knowledge earlier, but because we haven't got a lot of time left, there's a few things I want, there's a few people have asked me to ask you.
The elites.
Taking orders from extra-dimensionals.
That's the first one I'm going to tick that off, and I'll sit back and ask you that.
I know that's a huge subject, but there's two more... Well, I mean, I can just address them in a way that they can maybe then further study it in my books.
I mean, I touched this argument, as you know... Sorry, sorry, sorry.
I might as well say the whole lot.
So, are the elites taking orders from extra-dimensionals?
What's your opinions on ETs and who is really in control?
Who's really given, who's really in control and giving the orders to governments, okay?
Your opinions on ETs, extraterrestrial My opinions, as you know, are being given in the book Invisible Master, which goes very much into explaining how it works.
Now, when we focus on today's show, I told you, for example, David Cameron, I told you about the fact that He was involved with the Burlington Club and we know that Boris Johnson was involved with this club.
But we also know that David Cameron is part of a bloodline.
Bloodlines are always connected with these entities from ancient times, kind of like they carry a legacy within their DNA almost.
That is one of the things we can say.
I mean, when it comes to specific rituals that can be employed to open an extra or interdimensional door, this is, of course, a very complex matter that will require probably hours here of your show, and so we can't really go.
But I will advise people to to take the chance to read The Invisible Master, or maybe if they want to also understand how this connects with Cyber-Satan, the Artificial Intelligence, they can go on Volume 7 and Volume 9 of my confession.
Because Cyber-Satan, that's, as you know, the nickname I gave to Artificial Intelligence a long time ago when I started the trilogy of Cyber-Satan, which started with 6.66, a book which we've been discussing many times, volume 6.66, and then I carried on with volume 7 and terminated with volume 9, the actual subject of Cyber
Satan is linked to those entities, to those entities we call aliens, between brackets, that somehow we have connected with and whose technology we have reverse engineered since the 1950s, which that somehow we have connected with and whose technology we have reverse engineered since the 1950s,
technology and digital prison that we have built around us, including the expanding threat of the AI.
It's not just a threat that comes out of nowhere.
We discussed that, I think, I don't know if it was the last time we were discussing the Islamic Freemason, the Islamic stuff.
Algorithm is a name that comes from, of course, from somebody from the Muslim world.
We use the Arabic numbers, but once the algorithms have been built and they gave birth to this artificial intelligence, that's a little bit like bringing the genie out of the bottle.
It's very difficult to then bring it back in.
Yes, we as humans have an elite that is completely connected to this demonic world in one way or another.
Just a quick thing, sorry to jump in Leo, hold up a thought.
Are they being controlled by them unbeknownst quite often?
being controlled by those dark beings, even if they don't know it.
And some of them do know it, and they're connected and conversely with them.
There are those who are aware, and often they mingle within the awkward world, they are more acquainted with magic, but then you have those who reject any form of spirituality or occultism, but they still are basically subject to the control of these beings, because when, you know, it's a popular saying, when you don't believe in the devil, that's the greatest trick he played on mankind.
He basically, you are, you say, no, I'm not gonna believe in that occult stuff, but then you end up having a lot of what Of course, the mental health psychology of today would say that those are problems to do with this or that, and there is very in-depth descriptions of why you might have this problem or this other problem.
Let's not forget that Sigmund Freud gave a series of lectures at the Tavistock Clinic that became historically important, but I don't regard Personally, myself, Sigmund Freud, as a man, I want to look to as a great human being.
The guy was a pervert, the guy was a cocaine addict who was fixated with his mother and problems, you know, everything depends on the sexuality and it's all this bullshit.
You know, at that point, I prefer Carl Gustav Jung, because at least Carl Gustav Jung was some... you were mentioning two ways, no?
There is those who know their controller, and those who don't know.
Now, Carl Gustav Jung knew, and that's why He had written that book, Seven Sermons to the Dead, and he didn't publish it during his lifetime with his own name because he feared the reaction of the academics to something that wasn't so academic, let's say.
If you understand what I mean.
I have it here, the Seven Sermons to the Dead, somewhere in my collection of books.
And it's a book, I repeat, that during Carl Gustav Jung's lifetime, even the Red Book of Jung, the family didn't want it published, and in the end, after many years, I think, it was not so long ago, 15, 20, it came to light and finally it was published.
It was like Jung was very much into Gnosticism, very much into The Magic of Abramelin that Crowley, of course, was very much into.
In fact, he practiced it.
It was very much about opening portals with these entities and digging deep into the unknown.
When he said, Freud will dismiss the whole thing as hocus-pocus and tell you, ah, no, that's baloney.
But one of the reasons why is because he didn't experience it.
So let's remember everybody, I always like to say this, a lot of the books and a lot of the teachings of the theology, they're the intellectual overlay, they're words.
Real, real, real, it's experiential.
You can only really know something if you feel it.
And I want to remind people that they don't know about you.
This man, Leo Zagami, he's done, he's got so many things.
I mean, you were an exorcist for crying out loud.
So you've had For example, this man used to exercise demonic entities of people, so you've actually experienced the demonic forces at work, right?
No, absolutely, absolutely.
And so, I mean, I don't feel like most people will want to experience that kind of thing, because it is scary.
And you really need to know what you're doing when you're dealing with that kind of thing.
I was both in the exercise seat, meaning I was exercised, as well as I carried on an exercise.
So I witnessed both things.
And they are, of course, they're very scary.
But it's also about initiating yourself to something.
Through pain and struggle, you have what Joseph Campbell defined as the hero's journey.
The hero's journey is basically a pattern that, in a way, makes you understand things.
And so I think that in this book, it was very important for me also to explain how Not only we are controlled by the Illuminati, the Freemasons, but also how they control their own, their own members, how these initiations, these symbols, these initiation rites, the way they at times even humiliate,
The man from him, absolute obedience.
I mean, as you know, I was a member of it.
So I was actually often the guy who carried on these initiations.
And I tried to do always this initiation with respect to the human being.
Okay.
I always said to the people, are you really sure you want to go there?
Because there is no way back after you go in.
Okay.
And so I tried to always be very respectful of that.
me and my wife once experienced in London, when we came to London, one of those times we came to London together, me and my wife.
Was that when I did the conference with you, Invisible Masters?
Yes, actually it was.
I spoke at Leo's conference, Invisible Masters, it was the launch of your book, London, right?
I came up, yeah.
And it was, I think, the day before at the conference, I was in a lodge, or actually I don't know if it was that time or maybe another time, but It was one of those times we met, and I think it was that time, and we witnessed basically a worship of master of an irregular lodge.
Doing something that usually is never done in Freemasonry.
Tricking somebody who was a member of some kind of martial arts class, telling him to come to a place without telling him he would be initiated, and then forcing him into being initiated into this irregular lodge.
And the guy was, at the end, he left.
Fortunately, when he understood that, you know, because the guy in charge of the logic was actually a mind control expert who was studying mesmerism and studying neurolinguistics, he was kind of like really into, not into, because, you know, Usually in England you have hundreds, thousands of lodges made up, you know, on top of a pub.
It's a social event.
They go through their rituals.
Most of the time they just do it as, you know.
It's just like being in a Rotary Club or Alliance Club.
My grandfather was in the Masons in Bari, South Wales.
Apparently, they've still got his bag with the stuff in.
I was invited myself.
My father was invited.
We haven't gone in.
But no, they don't know anything down there.
But there are lodges that are specific and they are controlled instead by people who have that kind of knowledge, where those lodges can become a mind control trap.
can become very dangerous, and you have even hazing that is done on people and practices that... I remember in France, in Montpellier, in one of these lodges, and I describe this in my book, there was the candidate who was brought into the center of the lodge and given a boiling cup of coffee, literally boiling, and then he was said,
And he had to stop with the boiling cup in his hand, the pain that of course was visible in his eyes, but he couldn't move until the master would say move.
Wow!
Wow, wow, wow, wow.
And at this point, I know we haven't got much time left, but I've got to ask you at this point what everyone's going to be saying.
Ask him!
Because people, you know, a lot of people would have read your books, but... I mean, I understand the questions that you made have to do more with the metaphysical and, of course, the otherworldly control over Freemason and other organizations.
But when it comes to Freemasonry, there's very few people that have a spiritual mystic experience, if they're not within a specific Masonic rite that has those tendencies.
Like, for example, or certain degrees, the high degrees, maybe of the Scottish Rite, or maybe the Memphis Mithrim, that is really a rite in which there is certain practices in which They tend to have that relationship with those entities that people call aliens, but of course they're not that alien if they've always been here.
They're aliens to those who don't know them.
But what I was going to say, Leo, because people have been asking me now, and this is not the question I just asked you.
We've got a little bit of time, not much left.
I want to ask you before we go, what they're going to say.
You didn't ask him properly.
Who is really in control and giving the orders?
That is something you've got to try and address.
But before then, people are going to say, my God, I didn't know Leo Zoghami was in a mason going to the lodges, because you introduced me to some of the members there.
in the church that night, I remember, and they were really nice people.
One of my friends here, he's quite a high degree Mason, so for people who are going to be wondering, he's a Mason, he must be a terrible man.
At the moment I'm no longer active, because simply since I moved here into the United States, I didn't find that I was in line with
the local masons, I found, I was a bit discouraged by the fact that they left opulence in their lodges, that here in California the former Grand Master had openly criticized Donald J. Trump, and so they politically had a tendency to be a little bit on the left spectrum, when politics should be forbidden, informationally, as well as They were letting a lot of Muslims in.
I even found a drag queen.
So, I mean, that was it for me.
After that, I said, okay, I'm no longer going to associate.
For the moment, at least, I had, of course, friends from other states, like Arizona, who are always reading my books and begging me to go to their lodges.
I, at the moment, I'm off with that kind of thing.
I'm not active in any way, shape or form.
Having said that, I never hide anything.
As you know, I always wrote everything in my books.
If people want to know more about it, they simply go and read the books.
Yeah, and of course, so there's two more things I want to ask you.
That is the thing, because people are saying, who's controlling Trump?
But that's the main question people always ask me.
Who is really in control and giving the orders on this planet?
What they're asking is, who's the chief entity in living bodily form?
I will not say that at the moment.
Above the government?
No, at the moment we don't yet have The ultimate Antichrist, we might suspect who the ultimate Antichrist might be, you know, Obama, Prince William.
We have some suspicions, but we don't have any certainties.
Regarding the group of people, I always said the pyramid on top is Jesuits and Sabbatean Francists, which are part of the of the Jewish world, but they are an heretical part of the Jewish world, not to be mixed up with the rest of the Jewish world.
That's why I have a severe criticism for those who tend to generalize, and especially today with everything that went on, that is going on in the Middle East today and went on in Gaza until today.
It's obvious that there is a lot of growing antisemitism that is completely out of order and that is becoming also a danger for...
Because when we are encouraging more and more Islam and condemning Israel and the Jewish people in their camp, we have to understand it.
No Jewish person has ever blowed himself up in a church or destroyed their lives in acts of terrorism in the underground.
Unfortunately, that happened with Islam.
And Islam, as you know, has a lot of problems and I addressed in volume 10 of my confessions.
I'm not saying here that, you know, everybody has to be in line with what I say because it's a personal point of view and you know also born out of personal suffering.
Because I lost my only son to Islamists, so that is also a personal stand.
But in regards to the pyramid, the Sabbatean Franks, the Jesuits, and then of course themselves, they control various orders, think tanks and stuff, and then The pyramid goes down, then you have of course Freemasonry, but Freemasonry, we said, I mean, out of 300,000 members, you might have 50 members who know who is in charge and who is really pulling the strings.
The rest of them are people who simply participate to a social organization that has done also many positive things.
So it's not all to be condemned.
Organizations like the Ordo Tempio Orientis, for example, can be intense and even dangerous in certain degrees.
I remember there is a degree, the OTO, where the candidate gets put in a sack and kicked through the lodge.
Imagine, a guy gets put in a sack and then on the pavement of the lodge, kicked around the lodge.
I mean, that is pretty hardcore to me.
At what level have you got to spit on the Bible?
I think that the concept is not about spitting on the Bible, it's actually about spitting on the cross.
Sorry, the cross, yeah, yeah.
Yes, but it is something that is introduced either on the 30th degree, which is by the way not really practiced by all jurisdictions, and in certain, in the cabbage degree of the OTO, They spit because they don't believe that Jesus was crucified and they embrace the Gnostic belief that Jesus was spared before being sent on the cross.
And at the same time, of course, there is the rejection, remember, So, those who claim to have some kind of lineage connecting them to the Nice Temples, either within Freemasonry and the Masonic Rites or outside of Freemasonry, in the various Templar orders that seem to flourish, Neo-Templar orders that flourish today,
They are basically taking the standard, the papacy, at least certain orders, because either they want to re-embrace the Catholic Church and they want to stand with the Pope, or they instead say the Pope is the guy who has sent our last Grand Master together with the King of France to the stake, Jacques de Molay, so it's like a national revenge.
The Templars were themselves very much inclined in forms of mind control that they learned from the Ashashins, and so their initiations, just like the initiations of Freemasonry, I mean, you can take the initiation of Freemasonry just for the symbolic value, but in reality there is also a lot of elements that can be very scary, and that's why after the P2 scandal, the United
made a little writing in the initiation booklet, which says, this is all symbolic, don't take it, you know, it's like, because of what happened, this is symbolic.
When instead, before it was, you know, cut your throat, tear up your finger, slit this and that, and all torn to pieces if you betray the order, but now they They conveniently said the United Kingdom.
Oh, don't worry, it's all symbolic.
The guy ended up on the Black Friars Bridge, but it's all symbolic.
So that is, I think, it was a way of avoiding a lot of criticism because, of course, but within the initiation, for example, you are hooded, you know, you are blindfolded.
You are blindfolded, you have people who are hooded in front of you and you're going to Depending on the various traditions, if it's continental, if it's British, you get brought around the lodge blindfolded, and you don't know what's happening.
You hear noises, you hear things, depending on, like, I mean, there's various initiation rituals, but it is meant to be scary.
You know, it shouldn't be.
This voice, this talk, everybody reciting their part, swords, the clapping thing.
At one point, like I write in my book, there was a lodge in New York that ended up killing somebody because during the initiation, when they were making noise, one guy took out the gun and instead of shooting up in the air, he shot the candidate.
That was a big scandal that brought to the closure of the lodge.
But it is those voices, those things.
In the case of initiation, I remember even with my wife, who wanted to be initiated to have this experience, they use mirrors and stuff and lights and sounds.
It is about trying to psychologically bring you to the stage in which you then will become obedient.
That's why it's called Masonic obedience.
And that's a term that is used pretty much in continental Freemasonry and now it's started to be used also in Anglo-Saxon-influenced Freemasonry.
So it's about bringing the obedience.
Yeah, and it's got, you've got to use this, I don't think, I bet you don't get parking tickets and things like that, you know?
If you're in the Masons, I bet you can get off parking tickets.
Eh, Johnny?
Well, I must say that when I arrived here in the United States, I got off with the sheriff stopping me in the middle of nowhere.
And, you know, I was actually, I thought that it would be a good idea to have my pen and my 33 degree ring because you are in the middle of nowhere.
I was traveling through across the whole United States and suddenly I had gone 35 miles an hour instead of 25.
And the sheriff arrives in the middle of nowhere like, With the guy, you know, serious like you see in the movies.
He arrives and my wife says, oh god, I'm not even gonna rest, you know.
You know, I would be like, say, calm, tranquil, no worries, I'm gonna use my, eh?
And the guy arrived.
He saw me.
He saw my ring.
He saw my pin.
I made a move.
I made a special gesture.
And the guy was like, well, just a little bit slower next time.
Take it easy.
Have a safe trip.
And he left.
have a safe trip and invest.
And it was like, what happened?
I said, this is a big one.
So there is, it can happen.
Once I was in London.
I get lots of secret handshakes in my shop.
People come in regularly, guys, and I'll go like that.
No, no, no bullshit.
I'll say, what was that?
And there'll be some kind of strange handshake.
And I know it must be the Masonic handshake.
Yeah, of course.
But what happened was this, in London, of course, now we don't have much time.
So this must be the last anecdote for today.
And I was going to meet a guy from the O.T.O.
in Trafalgar Square, I think.
And by mistake, by mistake, I went out in Piccadilly Circus, I think.
And there was the escalator going all the way up.
And I had a joint with me, I had the rope, because I want to smoke a joint with this guy with the O.T.O.
usually, you know, they smoke a joint, it was like, So I see the police with the dog at the end of the escalator, and I couldn't go down because once you're on an escalator, you are done.
So I arrive at the end of the escalator.
It sounds a bit like life.
Once you get on, there's no getting off, man.
So the dog comes after me, the police too, and I say, okay, this is the joint.
That's it.
They verified my name.
Okay, we're gonna keep this.
Maybe your brothers in the lodge shouldn't know about it.
Wow, wow!
Bye!
And that was it!
And it was in the center of London.
Wow, wow.
That's it.
I'm joining.
Everybody listen.
I'm in.
I'm in the gang, man.
I've been invited.
I've been invited.
I haven't gone.
But listen, one final thing before we go, Leo.
A lot of people are in a lot of anxiety now.
I get a lot of people coming in.
This is the final thing, okay?
They come in my gallery.
They say, I'm feeling anxious, Jason.
Something's changing.
I can feel something universally changing.
I can feel there's a frequency.
I'm feeling anxious.
I feel intense.
I'm like there's some kind of anticipation.
Something's going on.
I don't feel right.
For those people who are in that situation, Leo, can you give them just a little bit of advice or guidance?
Maybe how to just tap into a higher power possibly or tap into a power within themselves and come back towards themselves.
Some little thing they can do.
The only thing I can advise them is to get closer to God and to understand that ultimately we can't comply.
We can't comply because they want compliance.
That's what they want.
And if we continue to comply, we will end up as slaves.
We saw what happened during the pandemic.
People became like sheep, doing all kinds of things that were completely unimaginable.
In Italy, in the center of Rome, there was the police, the traffic police making people walk in one direction.
Walk!
I'm not talking about the cars, but walk in one direction or the other.
Are you insane?
Or writing where you have to go, you have your home.
What is this?
So I think it's about compliance and God doesn't want us to comply.
God wants us to believe and he wants us with our heart pure.
So I think that the most important thing is to keep our freedom of thought.
That's how I ended up with this book.
You see, in the Bible, it makes it clear that the devil can't read our thoughts.
But with the technology they have today, if they put a BCI, a brain computer interface, or a chip inside you, you will no longer have that option.
And they will read your minds.
And at that point, you will be a slave.
And it will be of your own doing.
So don't comply and do everything possible and imaginable to not comply, otherwise you will end up like those poor Canadians that in 2020 were subject to mind control from their own army that bypassed the state and started to experiment on the Canadian masses that became the most brave.
I mean, not only they were subject to Anki Uta, now they were also subject to an immense psyop that made them really very weak.
So it's about compliance.
And I suggested, in fact, in my book, to watch a movie, Compliance, which is a movie which describes what happens when a person who works in, and this actually happened, it's based on a true story, who was working in a fast food, receives a call from somebody saying he's a policeman, and starts to comply with all the requests.
And these requests become more and more outrageous.
Naked, this, that, and all kinds of... We don't have to comply.
We have to keep our freedom of thought, our will, And we have to, of course, believe that God will save us and will take care of everything in the end.
But if we comply, that's not going to be possible.
Well said, Leo.
Well said.
If you comply with one little thing, they will take the whole army.
You know, if you don't comply with one little thing, they will take the whole army.
Well said, Leo.
And I'll just add to that before we close the show.
I'll just add to that.
Remember also that there's that deep-seated fear that if you don't comply, you'll be punished or criticized.
That was with the COVID thing.
Fear of punishment, fear of criticism, fear of being locked up, fear of all these things.
But I want to remind everyone of what you've just said.
I'll put a nutshell on it.
If you don't, if you do comply and you do go along with everything and you don't tap into that spirit of freedom within yourself, you will die inside.
Your spirit will die inside.
And I believe, Leo, that's why most people are feeling empty and desperate and sad because they're dying inside through a lack of that.
And this is what happens if you don't comply.
There, this kind of thing happens if you don't comply, right?
This is the Guardian newspaper, right?
So I got attacked by George Monbiot and actually he showed himself to be a vile little man.
But what I'm saying is that you will get attacked if you don't comply, but actually you're better off getting attacked for standing up for what you believe in and feeling alive than dying inside, all right?
Don't die inside.
I close down the book by saying One important thing, you know, Satan's power has its limits and reading our minds is beyond this ability and we must keep it that way.
Say that again.
It's very important because this is a passage in which I close the book after citing a specific passage in the Bible.
In just a second I will give it to you again.
Here we are.
I ask first of all, you know, to the readers, I say, can Satan or his demons read our minds?
And the answer is no.
First Kings 8.39 says that God alone knows every human heart.
I say Satan's power has its limits, and reading our minds is beyond its ability.
And we must keep it that way, because we are at a crossroads now, technologically speaking, in which we have already had, in the last few years, the presentiment every time we go on Facebook or on another social network, they say, Things start to appear on the side, like, you know, oh, but I wanted, I was talking about that a moment ago, it appears on the screen.
Yeah, because they're listening to you.
And they're also calculating you.
And they're starting to use algorithms to analyze you 24 hours a day, so they can offer you products, they can offer you goods, this and that.
Well, we need to give an end to that, stop it up because it's going too far.
And it's going to be a moment in which they're going to enter in their head.
And that's not my head for sure, because I don't authorize Satan and his followers to enter into my head.
I leave that to God, and I believe in my heart that he will save us in the end from all this.
Well said, Leo.
And I'll have a little rant about your books when I say goodbye now, but just to say before you go, thanks, Leo.
Thanks for being you.
Thanks for being Leo Zagami.
You're very well respected by a lot of people.
I love your work.
I've got all your books.
It's fantastic what you're doing, and thank you.
That's a good one, that's a good one, yeah?
And there's people who haven't been born yet who will have a better life because of what you're doing, even though we might go through a bit of a rocky road.
Thank you, Leo, so much.
LeoZagami.com.
Really love you, man, and God bless you.
Thank you.
God bless you.
Take care, Leo.
Thank you so much.
There he goes, Leo Zagami.
Amazing.
Like I said, I saw Leo up in London.
It was great to do the conference with Leo.
The Invisible Masters Conference.
That's going back a few years now.
And we did it in this big church there in London.
I drove up and Leo was promoting his new book, Invisible Masters, which I would advise you to get.
Get Leo's work.
We couldn't go into the belly of what Leo talks about there, but Leo's very, very, very learned.
about these kinds of things and about all the institutions and the people that are pulling the strings, you know.
And my gosh, it can be hard reading.
And I've only got a slight whiff of it compared to someone like Leo.
But Leo's been there.
You've got to remember that.
Leo's been there.
And Leo was an exorcist.
You think about that.
Ripping the entities of somebody when they're possessed.
I'll tell you what, that's brave work, very brave work.
I do shamanic work, and I've done healing with people, and I've cut the cord to things with people.
I don't do it now.
It's a big responsibility, but I do miss it, I'll be honest with you, because you just become a hollow bone, and some beautiful thing can work through you, and change things, and really change things.
It's very, very interesting, very, very interesting.
A lady once came to me, and I'm not saying this to show off, but just to tell you that it's amazing, you know.
This is one tiny thing, and before she came, I didn't know anything about her.
And I thought, you know, what can I tell this lady?
And there was, I had a picture, like a video in front of me, of a man twisting her hand behind her back, her left arm I think it was, and literally snapping it with her screaming.
And when she came, I said, wow, I said, did anyone ever twist you?
And she couldn't believe it.
She rolled up her sleeve and there was all those plates in her arm and someone had actually done that.
So what I'm saying to you, which is what Ryan Verley was saying last night, I'll say this before we go.
We often can't tap into these beautiful gifts, not only gifts, information and help.
And it's about accessing those higher places of knowledge and experience, and by the experiential feeling and information that you will get back if you tune in, which we all can do, we're all gifted magicians and shamans, That's proof.
You don't get the proof so much in reading stuff.
That's the intellectual overlay.
That's the books.
That's the writings.
Yes, they're great roadmaps that can point you in the right direction and whereby you can go and have experiences through that.
But real experiences are when you get downloads like that.
And I'll regularly be sat somewhere and I'll feel someone like that around me.
Someone who's passed away from their bodies, you know, and who've come to say hello.
If you haven't experienced it and you don't believe in those things, it will just sound absurd.
But what I'm saying to you is that when it happens and you do get those experiences and those words and those messages that come through, You can't imagine that.
How can you imagine things like that?
So, that's experiential, and that's real religion.
The word religion comes from the word religare, which means to religament, to re-tie back to what we've lost.
Okay?
So, don't get stuck.
I'll leave you all with this.
Let me just draw a diagram for you, okay?
I love the bicycle wheel thing.
It's like Many of us through our whole lifetime get stuck on different spokes on the wheel.
You'll believe in this, or you'll believe in Christianity, then you will do this, then you'll do that.
It's very easy for us to grab one thing and hold on to it.
These religions can be a great roadmap to get us back towards ourselves, but it's the inner core you want to get to, which is beyond those religious books.
Don't get stuck in the map, that's what I'm saying to you.
Use the map, move through the map, but don't get stuck in that revolving door.
Keep moving forward and keep accessing higher states within yourself.
Like Ryan O'Reilly said last night, If you cleanse yourself, and you're in a good space, and you're in a good vibration, and you've got a clear mind, that's the biggest thing.
I talk a lot about finding peace within our minds, and accessing information can come to you then, because there's nothing to block it.
There's an old saying, the usefulness of a pot is in its emptiness.
You can't get downloads, and you can't get these brilliant intuitions, and these amazing feelings of, you know, what to do next, if you like, if your mind's full of noise and rubbish and you're in a state of agitation and anxiety.
Anxiety, agitation and fear choke off our metamorphic glands.
I've said it many times, I know, but it's got to be said every time on the show.
Fear, anxiety and control and manipulation of a person chokes off your metamorphic glands.
So you can't blossom as a human being if you're in a state of fear.
And most of us are in a state of fear continually.
Fear of paying bills, fear of being punished, fear of doing the right thing, saying the right thing, you know, not saying something.
So be bold, be brave, be yourself, but most of all work on your mind so you've got nothing in it.
You'll still do things.
I am going to pick up this microphone now and I'm going to move it over there.
Yeah?
Yeah.
But that's not a thought for me.
It's not a thought.
It's just the emptiness where you know what to do next without the clutter of irritating, what's the word?
Irritating, repetitious thoughts, which are a nightmare for most people.
And most people don't get taught that in schools.
We're taught that we've got to fill our minds with stuff Or you're stupid.
Now I've got lots of information but they're in filing systems somewhere and I can grab one if I want.
They're not all in my mind driving me mad, all these noises and these voices.
Go for that emptiness.
Find the emptiness and you'll create an access into another deeper place within yourself and within a higher realm of reality.
Because there's lots to learn and we've got to really tap back into that now and that's why my book is called the emergency transformation of human beings as the solution to the world's problems because the greatest threat to our mind that's the greatest threat to humanity and the greatest problem on the planet is the most the less obvious one it's our minds Our minds are creating misery and havoc in the world.
Wars, madness, problems, bills, debts, systems which aren't in a symbiotic, there's not a symbiosis.
It's parasitic.
Our system's parasitic.
It's parasitising, if that's the right word, on people, on the population, and manipulating them.
Debts, fear, bills, debts, fears, bills.
It could be a lot better than this, but what we've got to do first is find that peace within ourselves.
If you find that peace within oneself, that can go out to other people.
It's like a light, you switch a light on.
And we can feed on each other in a good way with that.
Spread the light.
Spread joy.
Spread happiness.
Be nice to people.
Treat other people like you like to be treated.
And if we all did that, we'd have a paradise on the planet in no time.
Or a virtual paradise.
At the moment it's a virtual global mental asylum.
It's crazy, you know?
How many people smile, you know?
When I'm in my shop, I say, hello, how are you doing?
And people are really suspicious, you know?
So be nice to everybody.
Let's make that the norm.
Be kind and gentle and nice to everybody.
Excuse me.
I've had this cough.
It's horrible.
Okay, so we've got... Who have we got coming up on the show?
Oh, we've got... Gosh, I've forgotten your name, yeah?
We've got a lady coming on the show who was addicted to ketamine.
And we're doing more shows like that now, about finding peace and about finding health and about finding, like, coming, finding our way back home to ourselves, you know.
Because often we go, it's like a bungee jump, we do all these things that take us away from ourselves, you know.
And ideally we want to be coming back towards ourselves, you know.
There's a little stanza that says, Away, toward, away, away, toward, back towards.
That was by a beautiful mentor of mine called Charles Museus.
And he went by other pen names.
He worked with Joseph Campbell, actually.
And Leo mentioned Joseph Campbell.
It's been a long show.
I'm sorry, I won't rattle on a lot.
Just to say one more thing, which is To get the Roots products.
If you want to cleanse your body, get all the heavy metals out of your body and put some good in your body.
We're an affiliate for the company.
It won't cost you any more by getting the products with the link under the show.
And you'll be helping the show because we get a small commission if you if you order the Roots products like that.
And they've been very kind to us.
And I know many people that are getting tremendous, literally tremendous benefits from that.
Also, the light wave patches you can get.
Go on the link under the show, Lightwave, and you can look at the website.
They're fascinating.
People are getting tremendous results there.
What else have we got?
Clive De Carl.
I still sell Clive's stuff.
Go to Clive De Carl.
The link is under the show.
All the nutraceuticals there.
If you want to talk about goals, go to Andy.
He's under the show there.
And I would affiliate for them and all sorts of things going on.
And it's great to be with you all again.
It's fantastic to have Leo Zegami on the show.
I hope he answered a few questions for people.
And what an amazing man.
A wealth of knowledge, that man.
And look at my show with Ryan Velie last night.
Natural Intelligence.
An amazing man.
Two back-to-back great people doing great work.
I'm very dedicated to a better world for humanity and bringing in peace and getting rid of this madness before it kills us.
It's unbelievable.
And stopping this AI takeover, which is going to be controlling us more and more and more.
And the thing about this control, it's not so bad if it lets you alone and says, you can do it that way if you want to.
Well, you can if you go and buy a field.
We're going to get farms and start new communities.
That's what we're doing.
NaturalEarthEcoliving.com.
If you want to find out more, please send me an email.
And if you want to be a part of a new community coming together outside this system, which is going to be so controlling that you won't be able to say no to anything, or you won't be able to function there.
So we're looking to make new templates and spread them globally.
And very, very inspiring communities where people can step out and say, I'm not going down that road of that control.
We're going to live a different way.
And I know most people want that.
It's just that they can barely believe it's possible.
But it is possible because we're initiating it.
So that's it, I think.
And also NaturalEarthEcoClothing.com.
That's my wife's clothing company.
She makes organic clothing.
Organic and ethically sourced clothing.
And she's a great designer.
A clothes designer.
So that's it, I think.
Is that it?
Yeah.
All right.
Let me just press the stop button now.
Thanks again, Leo.
Love you, man.
What a great guy.
I've met him in person.
He's a genuine man.
Very good man.
Very, very good man.
And I love you all.
Love each other.
Love yourselves.
Be gentle with yourselves.
Don't beat yourself up for your past.
Change, yes.
Don't make the same mistakes recurring again and again.
But forgive yourself for your past, yeah?
We've all done the best we can with the circumstances we had at the time, the money we had at the time, and the choices we had at the time.
We've all made choices which we wouldn't make now, previously.
Of course, they create consequences and feedback loops and repercussions and outcomes for us, that's the thing, which are often very painful if you make just slightly the wrong choice, you know.
And it's not really forgiving, this system.
And there's no safety nets for people.
I know people who are homeless, who haven't got any money, who've gone to food banks.
There should be safety nets and places people can go to get help.
Oh, we've also been doing some filming.
We've been filming some very inspirational people.
Last week we were at the Twelve Tribes in Honiton.
It's a community of people living outside the box, I suppose you could say, but living very much inside the box when it comes to having that connection with themselves.
And so that's very interesting.
I'm going to make a little documentary about a few of the people that we're visiting.
Inspirational people growing their own food and living a different way and stepping outside the system of control.
So very inspiring things going on and we can change things.
Never feel helpless.
You can change things with the tiniest, tiniest thing, you know, the tiniest thing.
You can change things.
You can have a better life.
You can change yourself and your circumstances and your thoughts.
Never give up on yourself.
I've been in some terrible situations in my life.
I've been shot at in Cape Town.
I've been homeless in Cape Town.
I've been homeless in Florida.
I've gone in bins for food.
I've lived in car parks and tents and old damp boats.
Things are a lot nicer for me now.
I've had some awful experiences, but never think you haven't got the strength to pull through.
You're a magnificent creator.
You really are.
Start right now.
Get out of the misery.
Get into that place of strength within yourself.
It's there all the time.
It's never gone.
It's there all the time.
I love you.
Take care.
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